1 00:00:06,360 --> 00:00:09,240 Speaker 1: Hey, Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind. It is Saturday. 2 00:00:09,320 --> 00:00:10,960 Speaker 1: Let's go into the vault. This is going to be 3 00:00:11,800 --> 00:00:16,200 Speaker 1: an interview episode. I talked to Kevin John Davies about 4 00:00:16,239 --> 00:00:19,960 Speaker 1: his book The Mind of Douglas Adams. So for all 5 00:00:20,000 --> 00:00:23,080 Speaker 1: of you Douglas Adams fans out there, you know you 6 00:00:23,160 --> 00:00:26,079 Speaker 1: enjoy The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy in any format 7 00:00:26,400 --> 00:00:28,640 Speaker 1: that it has been brought to life, then this is 8 00:00:28,680 --> 00:00:30,520 Speaker 1: a really fun chat. We also get into some other 9 00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:34,960 Speaker 1: discussions of popular science fiction. So I really enjoyed this 10 00:00:35,240 --> 00:00:37,800 Speaker 1: interview back in the day, and I hope you enjoy 11 00:00:37,840 --> 00:00:39,919 Speaker 1: it here for the first time or revisiting it. It 12 00:00:39,920 --> 00:00:43,080 Speaker 1: originally published eight thirty one, twenty twenty three. 13 00:00:43,440 --> 00:00:49,559 Speaker 2: Enjoy Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production 14 00:00:49,600 --> 00:00:51,520 Speaker 2: of iHeartRadio. 15 00:00:57,280 --> 00:00:59,480 Speaker 3: Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind. My name 16 00:00:59,520 --> 00:01:02,760 Speaker 3: is Robert. On today's show, I'll be talking with author 17 00:01:03,080 --> 00:01:06,399 Speaker 3: Kevin John Davies about his new book forty two The 18 00:01:06,560 --> 00:01:11,760 Speaker 3: Wildly Improbable Ideas of Douglas Adams. This book will be 19 00:01:11,840 --> 00:01:15,959 Speaker 3: available as a physical book on the nineteenth of September. 20 00:01:16,520 --> 00:01:20,760 Speaker 3: It's already available as an ebook, so one way or 21 00:01:20,760 --> 00:01:23,160 Speaker 3: another you can get your hands on this book. It's 22 00:01:23,200 --> 00:01:27,080 Speaker 3: a beautiful volume, so I highly recommend it now in 23 00:01:27,120 --> 00:01:29,800 Speaker 3: the event that you're not familiar with the man himself. 24 00:01:29,840 --> 00:01:35,119 Speaker 3: Douglas Adams born nineteen fifty two was a groundbreaking English author, humorist, 25 00:01:35,160 --> 00:01:39,520 Speaker 3: and screenwriter, best known for The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, 26 00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:43,440 Speaker 3: a work originally conceived for radio, but it would also 27 00:01:43,640 --> 00:01:46,680 Speaker 3: take on new life as a novel in nineteen seventy nine, 28 00:01:47,200 --> 00:01:51,880 Speaker 3: stage shows, a comic book, TV series, video game, and 29 00:01:52,040 --> 00:01:54,400 Speaker 3: a two thousand and five feature film that many of 30 00:01:54,400 --> 00:01:57,200 Speaker 3: you may be familiar with. His other works include the 31 00:01:57,280 --> 00:02:00,880 Speaker 3: Dirk gently books, and he served as screen writer on 32 00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:03,840 Speaker 3: thirteen episodes of Doctor Who in the late seventies and 33 00:02:03,920 --> 00:02:06,920 Speaker 3: early eighties. He died in two thousand and one, but 34 00:02:07,000 --> 00:02:10,680 Speaker 3: his influence continues to be felt in humor and science 35 00:02:10,720 --> 00:02:13,560 Speaker 3: fiction and beyond. So with some of the basics out 36 00:02:13,560 --> 00:02:17,240 Speaker 3: of the way, let's jump right into the interview with 37 00:02:17,400 --> 00:02:21,520 Speaker 3: author Kevin John Davies. Hi, Kevin, thanks for coming on 38 00:02:21,560 --> 00:02:21,880 Speaker 3: the show. 39 00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:24,480 Speaker 2: Hello there, Rob, nice to be invited. Thank you. 40 00:02:24,919 --> 00:02:28,720 Speaker 3: So the book is forty two the wildly improbable Ideas 41 00:02:28,720 --> 00:02:32,200 Speaker 3: of Douglas Adams. Many of our listeners are well acquainted 42 00:02:32,240 --> 00:02:35,360 Speaker 3: with Adam's work, and I included a short overview at 43 00:02:35,360 --> 00:02:38,320 Speaker 3: the top of this episode for everyone, But as someone 44 00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:40,720 Speaker 3: who worked with him and has chronicled his ideas in 45 00:02:40,760 --> 00:02:43,400 Speaker 3: his work, what do you think is the most essential 46 00:02:43,440 --> 00:02:47,040 Speaker 3: thing for our listeners to recognize about the man, especially 47 00:02:47,280 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 3: they're just not that familiar with him in his work. 48 00:02:50,280 --> 00:02:52,760 Speaker 2: I think what you have to realize is that Douglas 49 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:57,360 Speaker 2: never set out to be a science fiction author. You know, 50 00:02:57,440 --> 00:03:01,800 Speaker 2: he's primary focused ever since his college days, you know, 51 00:03:01,880 --> 00:03:06,600 Speaker 2: at university and Cambridge, he just wanted to be a writer, performer. 52 00:03:07,160 --> 00:03:09,560 Speaker 2: He wanted to be John Clees until he realized that 53 00:03:09,639 --> 00:03:12,359 Speaker 2: job was taken. But he certainly got to meet a 54 00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:15,960 Speaker 2: few of his heroes. So his favorite kind of reading 55 00:03:16,120 --> 00:03:20,320 Speaker 2: material were things like PG. Woodhouse. So he saw himself 56 00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:25,560 Speaker 2: as a comedy writer, a satirist primarily. But he said 57 00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:27,760 Speaker 2: that he rather ruefully, he said to me once when 58 00:03:27,800 --> 00:03:30,800 Speaker 2: I interviewed him several times over the years. But he said, 59 00:03:32,639 --> 00:03:35,280 Speaker 2: the trouble is everything I write seems to involve robots 60 00:03:35,320 --> 00:03:40,480 Speaker 2: and spaceships. So I think he appeals across the board, 61 00:03:40,480 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 2: you know, he appeals to people who like science fiction 62 00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:46,800 Speaker 2: because he seems to be playing with the usual tropes 63 00:03:47,280 --> 00:03:50,960 Speaker 2: of science fiction, and he appeals to people who don't 64 00:03:51,080 --> 00:03:54,400 Speaker 2: like robots and spaceships because he seems to be sending 65 00:03:54,400 --> 00:03:58,840 Speaker 2: it up. So it kind of works across the board. 66 00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:01,840 Speaker 2: You know, you don't have to be a big science 67 00:04:01,880 --> 00:04:05,080 Speaker 2: fiction fan to get The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy. 68 00:04:05,120 --> 00:04:09,240 Speaker 2: It works on that kind of satirical level, and it's 69 00:04:09,280 --> 00:04:12,640 Speaker 2: just beautiful writing. So I hope new people will give 70 00:04:12,680 --> 00:04:15,560 Speaker 2: it a go. They might discover something new that they 71 00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:16,080 Speaker 2: really love. 72 00:04:16,720 --> 00:04:19,040 Speaker 3: Can you tell us how you came to first work 73 00:04:19,080 --> 00:04:22,320 Speaker 3: with Douglas Adams and where he was in his career 74 00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:22,960 Speaker 3: at that time. 75 00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:27,400 Speaker 2: Sure, well, I mean within the first few years of 76 00:04:27,480 --> 00:04:31,279 Speaker 2: knowing him, he suddenly became very rich and famous. But 77 00:04:31,360 --> 00:04:35,159 Speaker 2: when I first met him, I'd seen his first Doctor Who, 78 00:04:35,200 --> 00:04:37,760 Speaker 2: which was called The Pirate Planet, and that had been 79 00:04:37,800 --> 00:04:40,440 Speaker 2: a four part serial on television starr In Tom Baker, 80 00:04:41,760 --> 00:04:45,240 Speaker 2: and then I'd heard The Hitchhiker's Guide on its second 81 00:04:45,279 --> 00:04:48,440 Speaker 2: repeat within the first year. It was quite unusual for 82 00:04:48,480 --> 00:04:51,240 Speaker 2: a radio show to get repeated quite so quickly, but 83 00:04:51,320 --> 00:04:54,720 Speaker 2: it was popular demand, and he very soon realized he 84 00:04:54,760 --> 00:04:57,440 Speaker 2: had a hit on his hands. I was invited to 85 00:04:57,520 --> 00:05:00,279 Speaker 2: bring my new tape recorder. I was seventeen years old 86 00:05:00,279 --> 00:05:02,520 Speaker 2: and I just had a new tape recording for my birthday, 87 00:05:02,760 --> 00:05:06,719 Speaker 2: remember those cassettes, And I brought it along to interview 88 00:05:06,800 --> 00:05:10,839 Speaker 2: him for a fan magazine for Doctor Who, primarily, but 89 00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:13,560 Speaker 2: my friends and I kept asking him questions about Hitchhiker's 90 00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:15,920 Speaker 2: Guide because that was all new and exciting, and he said, 91 00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:17,520 Speaker 2: I thought this was going to be an interview about 92 00:05:17,560 --> 00:05:21,520 Speaker 2: Doctor Who. He'd just taken a day job, that was it, 93 00:05:21,600 --> 00:05:25,080 Speaker 2: because he needed regular income, had he had a few 94 00:05:25,120 --> 00:05:28,440 Speaker 2: tough years, and so the idea of a year long 95 00:05:28,480 --> 00:05:34,240 Speaker 2: contract at the BBC marshaling scripts for Doctor Who was 96 00:05:34,320 --> 00:05:36,799 Speaker 2: something that he badly and sorely needed at the time. 97 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:41,440 Speaker 2: So I just met this very tall everyone remarks on that, 98 00:05:41,600 --> 00:05:46,560 Speaker 2: and he's good foot taller than me, very smiley, witty, 99 00:05:47,760 --> 00:05:53,480 Speaker 2: very friendly, immediately friendly, an amazing guy. Immediately you're sort 100 00:05:53,480 --> 00:05:55,839 Speaker 2: of you're taken to him, you know. That was that 101 00:05:56,000 --> 00:05:58,200 Speaker 2: was the flavor of it. And it was about another 102 00:05:58,279 --> 00:06:03,640 Speaker 2: eighteen months later after that interview that I by pure chance, 103 00:06:03,960 --> 00:06:06,400 Speaker 2: ended up working on the hit Tracker's Guide to the 104 00:06:06,400 --> 00:06:10,520 Speaker 2: Galaxy TV series, and that was my first year in 105 00:06:10,560 --> 00:06:13,839 Speaker 2: the business, having left Art College. So it was a 106 00:06:13,839 --> 00:06:17,520 Speaker 2: glorious year for me and one that I treasured to 107 00:06:17,560 --> 00:06:20,600 Speaker 2: this day and remember vividly despite it being all those 108 00:06:20,680 --> 00:06:23,680 Speaker 2: years ago. And I was an animator working on the 109 00:06:23,720 --> 00:06:28,280 Speaker 2: BBC television version, So yeah, it was a very strange hit. 110 00:06:28,320 --> 00:06:31,000 Speaker 2: Trackers is odd that it began on radio, then it 111 00:06:31,000 --> 00:06:36,560 Speaker 2: became a stage play, several stage plays, then finally a novel, 112 00:06:38,040 --> 00:06:41,880 Speaker 2: a vinyl LP, and then I found myself working on 113 00:06:41,920 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 2: the TV version, and yeah, that was it, and that's 114 00:06:45,920 --> 00:06:48,680 Speaker 2: when I really got to know Douglas properly in nineteen eighty. 115 00:06:49,000 --> 00:06:51,640 Speaker 3: Now, prior to this interview, I think my only full 116 00:06:52,279 --> 00:06:56,160 Speaker 3: experience with his work was the film adaptation of Hitchaker's 117 00:06:56,200 --> 00:06:59,600 Speaker 3: Guide to the Galaxy. But I listened to the Stephen 118 00:06:59,680 --> 00:07:04,160 Speaker 3: Fryer narrated audiobook version in preparation for this interview, and 119 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:06,480 Speaker 3: you know, I was just really kind of taken aback 120 00:07:06,960 --> 00:07:09,240 Speaker 3: just how good it is and how you know, it 121 00:07:09,320 --> 00:07:12,880 Speaker 3: still feels so distinct and original, which isn't always the 122 00:07:12,920 --> 00:07:16,680 Speaker 3: case with works of great popularity and influence. So I 123 00:07:16,760 --> 00:07:19,400 Speaker 3: was wondering, like, why do you feel that this book 124 00:07:19,400 --> 00:07:22,160 Speaker 3: in particular is still speaking to us forty four years 125 00:07:22,200 --> 00:07:23,680 Speaker 3: after its initial publication. 126 00:07:24,280 --> 00:07:26,960 Speaker 2: I think it's the sheer amount of work that Douglas 127 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:32,520 Speaker 2: put into the writing. He's a great friend of his. 128 00:07:33,280 --> 00:07:36,160 Speaker 2: Nick Webb, who I got to know as well, also 129 00:07:36,440 --> 00:07:41,480 Speaker 2: has passed now, but he became Douglas's official biographer, and 130 00:07:41,920 --> 00:07:44,160 Speaker 2: I've interviewed him too in the past, and he said 131 00:07:45,880 --> 00:07:49,560 Speaker 2: that Douglas Douglas could hear the music, and what he 132 00:07:49,600 --> 00:07:52,000 Speaker 2: meant by that was as a writer, he could hear 133 00:07:52,040 --> 00:07:55,280 Speaker 2: the rhythm and flow of a sentence. And I think 134 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:57,920 Speaker 2: you you know, if you adapt any of Douglas's work, 135 00:07:57,960 --> 00:08:01,520 Speaker 2: you messed with that at your peril. And I think 136 00:08:01,560 --> 00:08:06,040 Speaker 2: the movie took some liberties with the actual flow of 137 00:08:06,160 --> 00:08:10,440 Speaker 2: his very carefully chosen sentences. You know, he would do 138 00:08:10,680 --> 00:08:14,680 Speaker 2: very long sentences with lots of subclauses and parentheses, and 139 00:08:15,640 --> 00:08:18,920 Speaker 2: then on the last word of something, he would rip 140 00:08:18,960 --> 00:08:21,520 Speaker 2: the rug from under you and make you laugh. And 141 00:08:21,600 --> 00:08:23,720 Speaker 2: he had thought about it, and I think it came 142 00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:27,160 Speaker 2: from his days in sketch comedy. So you know, the 143 00:08:27,280 --> 00:08:31,120 Speaker 2: radio series of Hit Choker and the television version are 144 00:08:31,200 --> 00:08:38,360 Speaker 2: born out of that kind of footlight Cambridge footlights, sketch 145 00:08:38,440 --> 00:08:44,400 Speaker 2: comedy performing background. That's it, you know, famously, Monty Python, 146 00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:47,120 Speaker 2: they all came out of the same stable, and so 147 00:08:47,240 --> 00:08:49,160 Speaker 2: I think when they came to the movie, it's a 148 00:08:49,240 --> 00:08:52,760 Speaker 2: slightly different style of acting. Actually, you know, Martin Freeman 149 00:08:52,840 --> 00:08:56,559 Speaker 2: has a much more realistic style to his. I think 150 00:08:56,600 --> 00:08:58,880 Speaker 2: he was quite good actually his after Dead. But it 151 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:03,520 Speaker 2: is a different way of performing, you know, it's more traditional, 152 00:09:04,240 --> 00:09:07,720 Speaker 2: you know, Hollywood movie style. And they obviously they grafted 153 00:09:07,800 --> 00:09:10,880 Speaker 2: in more of a love interest with Trillion between the 154 00:09:10,880 --> 00:09:14,760 Speaker 2: two main characters, Arthur and at Trillion, and you know, 155 00:09:14,800 --> 00:09:18,240 Speaker 2: it tried to fit that thing that Douglas tried all 156 00:09:18,320 --> 00:09:20,800 Speaker 2: his life and for twenty odd years he tried to 157 00:09:20,800 --> 00:09:22,920 Speaker 2: get a movie made of Hitcherck and sadly it didn't 158 00:09:22,920 --> 00:09:27,400 Speaker 2: come along into the few years after he died. And 159 00:09:27,559 --> 00:09:29,080 Speaker 2: so I think some of the fans, some of the 160 00:09:29,080 --> 00:09:33,120 Speaker 2: purest fans, don't really rate the movie as much. I 161 00:09:33,160 --> 00:09:35,599 Speaker 2: think it looks beautiful, and I did go along to 162 00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:39,200 Speaker 2: the set and I met the filmmakers, and they certainly 163 00:09:39,240 --> 00:09:44,679 Speaker 2: had Douglas's best interests at heart, but they were music 164 00:09:44,760 --> 00:09:49,040 Speaker 2: video producer director pair that made it, and I think 165 00:09:49,080 --> 00:09:51,360 Speaker 2: they thought much much more about the visuals than they 166 00:09:51,400 --> 00:09:55,280 Speaker 2: did about the script, and I think Disney had quite 167 00:09:55,400 --> 00:09:59,360 Speaker 2: strong studio control on the script, so you know, it's 168 00:09:59,400 --> 00:10:03,400 Speaker 2: a difficult thing to pull off. The later radio adaptations 169 00:10:04,160 --> 00:10:09,959 Speaker 2: by Dirt Maggs, he adapted and directed them for BBC Radio, 170 00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:14,560 Speaker 2: and they kept the flavor. They he got the style, 171 00:10:14,920 --> 00:10:18,079 Speaker 2: he understood it, and he knew that Douglas had chosen 172 00:10:18,200 --> 00:10:22,280 Speaker 2: Dirk as the successor to Jeffrey Perkins, the main producer 173 00:10:22,760 --> 00:10:26,760 Speaker 2: of the original series. And sadly, you know, those shows 174 00:10:26,760 --> 00:10:29,640 Speaker 2: didn't come along until after Douglas had passed, but certainly 175 00:10:29,679 --> 00:10:33,320 Speaker 2: they kept the flavor. So I recommend, you know, try 176 00:10:33,320 --> 00:10:37,440 Speaker 2: the radio shows, try the books. The books are pure Douglas. 177 00:10:37,679 --> 00:10:40,880 Speaker 2: It's him playing with the language, and that's why they 178 00:10:41,480 --> 00:10:44,760 Speaker 2: survive and why they still work now because the sheer 179 00:10:44,800 --> 00:10:46,880 Speaker 2: effort that he put into them. Yeah. 180 00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:50,240 Speaker 3: Now, I want to come back to Doctor Who for 181 00:10:50,320 --> 00:10:52,920 Speaker 3: just a second. As you mentioned, he wrote for the 182 00:10:52,920 --> 00:10:55,560 Speaker 3: TV show during with the late seventies and early eighties. 183 00:10:56,520 --> 00:10:59,680 Speaker 3: In what key ways do you think Doctor Who influenced 184 00:10:59,679 --> 00:11:02,840 Speaker 3: Douglas Adams and what sort of lasting influence did he 185 00:11:03,000 --> 00:11:04,079 Speaker 3: leave on the franchise. 186 00:11:05,559 --> 00:11:10,480 Speaker 2: Well, he said that when he was at prep school, 187 00:11:11,440 --> 00:11:15,439 Speaker 2: he was writing sketches about Doctor Who with them the 188 00:11:15,559 --> 00:11:19,480 Speaker 2: Daleks being powered by rush Chrispies or something, just something 189 00:11:19,480 --> 00:11:21,360 Speaker 2: that he did as a thing with his friends on 190 00:11:21,480 --> 00:11:25,320 Speaker 2: audio tape. And so he'd always wanted to work for 191 00:11:25,400 --> 00:11:27,920 Speaker 2: Doctor Who, and we have in the book, in the 192 00:11:27,920 --> 00:11:31,840 Speaker 2: forty two book, there's a letter of rejection which must 193 00:11:31,840 --> 00:11:34,199 Speaker 2: have pained him deeply in nineteen seventy six when he 194 00:11:34,240 --> 00:11:37,679 Speaker 2: first got turned down by the then producer and the 195 00:11:37,760 --> 00:11:42,400 Speaker 2: script editor team. But two years later, you know, he 196 00:11:42,480 --> 00:11:45,400 Speaker 2: got the commissioned, and thank goodness he did, because he 197 00:11:45,520 --> 00:11:47,800 Speaker 2: was in a real pit at that time. And suddenly 198 00:11:47,880 --> 00:11:50,640 Speaker 2: he had the first series of Hit Shriker and the 199 00:11:50,679 --> 00:11:54,800 Speaker 2: first four episodes of Dr Who to write almost simultaneously, 200 00:11:55,880 --> 00:12:00,360 Speaker 2: and he retreated down to the West Country where his 201 00:12:01,200 --> 00:12:04,200 Speaker 2: mother lived, and the back to the family home and 202 00:12:04,320 --> 00:12:07,360 Speaker 2: slaved away over those scripts until he'd sort of run 203 00:12:07,400 --> 00:12:09,520 Speaker 2: out of words, as he put it, and he got 204 00:12:09,640 --> 00:12:12,320 Speaker 2: John Lloyd to help him with the last two episodes 205 00:12:12,400 --> 00:12:17,600 Speaker 2: of that first radio series of Hitchhiker, and it just 206 00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:21,839 Speaker 2: it was obvious when you watch that Doctor Who what 207 00:12:21,960 --> 00:12:27,880 Speaker 2: his take on it was. He has a peculiar turn 208 00:12:28,200 --> 00:12:33,200 Speaker 2: of phrase. The humor is there the ideas. It's all 209 00:12:33,240 --> 00:12:37,280 Speaker 2: about the ideas. Douglas had some extraordinary ideas, and in 210 00:12:37,360 --> 00:12:40,560 Speaker 2: later years he became fascinated with real science. So it 211 00:12:40,640 --> 00:12:43,200 Speaker 2: wasn't just making it up for Hitchhiker's sake, you know, 212 00:12:43,280 --> 00:12:45,880 Speaker 2: and for Doctor Who. But it was obviously there was 213 00:12:46,200 --> 00:12:49,439 Speaker 2: a strong talent there, and that's why he was offered 214 00:12:49,480 --> 00:12:52,640 Speaker 2: the role to join the show and be its script 215 00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:56,000 Speaker 2: editor for a whole year looking after other writers. Not 216 00:12:56,080 --> 00:12:58,600 Speaker 2: a job he was terribly well suited to because he 217 00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:03,079 Speaker 2: had trouble delivering two deadlines himself, so to get scripts 218 00:13:03,080 --> 00:13:05,320 Speaker 2: out of other writers. You know, he had been a 219 00:13:05,400 --> 00:13:09,400 Speaker 2: radio producer very briefly before he ran away to television. 220 00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:13,160 Speaker 2: From their point of view, so yeah, pulling scripts out 221 00:13:13,160 --> 00:13:17,600 Speaker 2: of other people, that's not really that wasn't really his forte. 222 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:21,040 Speaker 2: But luckily at that time Hitchhiker exploded and he then 223 00:13:21,120 --> 00:13:23,920 Speaker 2: had to go off and do other things and work on, 224 00:13:24,360 --> 00:13:28,959 Speaker 2: you know, milk this baby, to do sequels, and everyone 225 00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:31,559 Speaker 2: kept demanding more and more Hitchhikers until he was sick 226 00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:35,760 Speaker 2: of it. Really, But yeah, I think the legacy that 227 00:13:35,800 --> 00:13:39,800 Speaker 2: he left behind, and people have quoted this, like Steve 228 00:13:39,880 --> 00:13:42,800 Speaker 2: Moffett and Russell T. Davis. They cite one of his 229 00:13:42,920 --> 00:13:46,240 Speaker 2: particular stories, The City of Death, as their kind of 230 00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:49,000 Speaker 2: role model for how they'd like it to be. Don't 231 00:13:48,800 --> 00:13:51,200 Speaker 2: just When I interviewed him about it, he said that 232 00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:54,400 Speaker 2: he worried that when he put jokes into scripts, he 233 00:13:54,440 --> 00:13:57,840 Speaker 2: still wanted the drama to be played straight. But the 234 00:13:57,960 --> 00:14:01,160 Speaker 2: fear is that when you put comedy into a drama 235 00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:04,440 Speaker 2: script that people then start to ham it up and 236 00:14:04,480 --> 00:14:07,400 Speaker 2: play to the comedy more. And you know, he wanted 237 00:14:07,440 --> 00:14:09,560 Speaker 2: to use the light and shade of the drama and 238 00:14:09,600 --> 00:14:13,439 Speaker 2: the comedy. But City of Death, which he co wrote, 239 00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:16,920 Speaker 2: I mean the producer. It was an emergency script written 240 00:14:17,240 --> 00:14:21,240 Speaker 2: supposedly over a weekend, which is hard to imagine, but 241 00:14:21,360 --> 00:14:23,640 Speaker 2: that was the legacy left behind. I think it had 242 00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:27,240 Speaker 2: an effect on how the modern producers of Doctor Who 243 00:14:27,920 --> 00:14:30,080 Speaker 2: tackled it when they revived it in two thousand and 244 00:14:30,120 --> 00:14:33,640 Speaker 2: five onwards. 245 00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:44,280 Speaker 3: So the book is a beautiful memoir, using various documents 246 00:14:44,320 --> 00:14:48,680 Speaker 3: and photos from the dogals Adam's archive. Correct along with 247 00:14:48,800 --> 00:14:53,040 Speaker 3: these various words and letters from friends, you words of 248 00:14:53,120 --> 00:14:57,240 Speaker 3: fans collaborators tell us how this project came together and 249 00:14:57,320 --> 00:14:59,080 Speaker 3: what sort of challenges were involved. 250 00:15:00,280 --> 00:15:05,840 Speaker 2: Sure, the book was something that, strangely enough, I first 251 00:15:05,880 --> 00:15:09,160 Speaker 2: thought about. In twenty sixteen, I was asked by the 252 00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:14,840 Speaker 2: radio producer, an adaptor of Douglas's work Dirt Mags, to 253 00:15:14,880 --> 00:15:17,200 Speaker 2: go along to the archive, which I didn't really know 254 00:15:17,320 --> 00:15:20,400 Speaker 2: much about it. Before there had been a book another 255 00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:23,040 Speaker 2: guy had written a book which had had some appendices 256 00:15:23,120 --> 00:15:25,920 Speaker 2: of stuff from the archive, so we knew a little 257 00:15:25,920 --> 00:15:30,080 Speaker 2: bit about that, and that was Hitchhikery material. But Dirk said, 258 00:15:30,080 --> 00:15:32,760 Speaker 2: go and see if you can find anything that a 259 00:15:32,800 --> 00:15:37,160 Speaker 2: bit of pure Douglas magic, any titbits, odd phrases, lines, 260 00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:40,560 Speaker 2: you know, anything you can find that hasn't been used yet, 261 00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:43,680 Speaker 2: and we'll put it into this final radio series. The 262 00:15:43,720 --> 00:15:46,680 Speaker 2: final radio series is called the Hexagonal. Phase of hitch 263 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:51,440 Speaker 2: Hiker was based on a book by Owen Colfer, the 264 00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:56,160 Speaker 2: Irish writer who wrote Artem's Foul and other young young 265 00:15:56,520 --> 00:16:01,360 Speaker 2: adult readers. You know. He he felt that it needed 266 00:16:01,360 --> 00:16:03,360 Speaker 2: a bit more Douglasy magic. So I went and had 267 00:16:03,360 --> 00:16:05,440 Speaker 2: a look at the material. Then I spent about six 268 00:16:05,520 --> 00:16:08,280 Speaker 2: days there. For me, I live right at the top 269 00:16:08,320 --> 00:16:10,200 Speaker 2: of North London, so it was a drive up the 270 00:16:10,200 --> 00:16:14,040 Speaker 2: motorway to Cambridge, an ancient city of Cambridge, which is 271 00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:17,280 Speaker 2: full of colleges that all part of the Cambridge University. 272 00:16:17,760 --> 00:16:22,480 Speaker 2: And there is Saint John's College and the ancient library there. 273 00:16:22,520 --> 00:16:26,920 Speaker 2: I mean, the building's about four or five hundred years old. 274 00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:29,440 Speaker 2: The front of it is all beautifully remodeled and everything, 275 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:32,000 Speaker 2: but the back is almost like a church. It feels 276 00:16:32,040 --> 00:16:35,480 Speaker 2: like Hogwarts, you know, and the Harry Potter films, big 277 00:16:35,560 --> 00:16:39,880 Speaker 2: heavy old bookcases with giant leather bound sort of books 278 00:16:39,880 --> 00:16:43,680 Speaker 2: on the shelves, and they've got medieval manuscripts and they've 279 00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:48,400 Speaker 2: got all sorts there, and Douglas's material was lodged there 280 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:51,680 Speaker 2: by his family. Now, while I was going through this, 281 00:16:51,800 --> 00:16:54,640 Speaker 2: I realized that Douglas kind of argues with himself on 282 00:16:54,720 --> 00:16:56,560 Speaker 2: the page, and we've got some of this in the book. 283 00:16:57,040 --> 00:16:59,680 Speaker 2: He would be berating himself for forgetting an idea that 284 00:16:59,720 --> 00:17:02,640 Speaker 2: he's the night before, or he just wasn't in the 285 00:17:02,640 --> 00:17:04,680 Speaker 2: mood to write that day. Every now and again there's 286 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:06,480 Speaker 2: a nice little pep talk where he tells himself and 287 00:17:06,520 --> 00:17:08,760 Speaker 2: you can do quite well for yourself, you know. You know. 288 00:17:08,800 --> 00:17:11,719 Speaker 2: Once he was actually seeing the money rolling in. But 289 00:17:11,880 --> 00:17:15,520 Speaker 2: it was interesting to watch a writer at work looking 290 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:18,320 Speaker 2: at a man that I knew for twenty years. I'm 291 00:17:18,320 --> 00:17:21,800 Speaker 2: looking at his handwriting. He's terrible handwriting, very scribbly at times, 292 00:17:22,200 --> 00:17:25,200 Speaker 2: and he's appalling typing with all sorts of liquid paper 293 00:17:25,280 --> 00:17:28,200 Speaker 2: or tip its blobs all over it and crossings out 294 00:17:28,280 --> 00:17:32,360 Speaker 2: and x x x through everything, and you know, it 295 00:17:32,400 --> 00:17:34,680 Speaker 2: was quite He wrote four books before he got into 296 00:17:34,760 --> 00:17:38,200 Speaker 2: using a word processor. So you know, if anyone thinks 297 00:17:38,200 --> 00:17:42,439 Speaker 2: that forty two was inspired by his knowledge of asking 298 00:17:42,520 --> 00:17:46,880 Speaker 2: or whether it's called a SC two, no, he knew 299 00:17:46,880 --> 00:17:49,919 Speaker 2: nothing about computers when he wrote it, Chuck. So anyway, 300 00:17:49,960 --> 00:17:51,399 Speaker 2: I looked at all this material and I thought, you 301 00:17:51,440 --> 00:17:54,200 Speaker 2: know what, there should be a book about this, something 302 00:17:54,240 --> 00:17:57,359 Speaker 2: along the lines of how Douglas Adams wrote. And I 303 00:17:57,359 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 2: didn't think about it anymore. I didn't even think necessary 304 00:18:00,400 --> 00:18:02,959 Speaker 2: that it would be me that would write the book 305 00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:08,960 Speaker 2: until the publisher came out of the blue in twenty twenty. Yeah, 306 00:18:09,000 --> 00:18:13,040 Speaker 2: at the end of twenty twenty they contacted me and said, 307 00:18:13,840 --> 00:18:18,840 Speaker 2: you've been suggested by the estate of Douglas, the family 308 00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:25,280 Speaker 2: and the agent who runs the estate to go and 309 00:18:25,320 --> 00:18:27,960 Speaker 2: do some more research in the archive and prepare this book. 310 00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:32,119 Speaker 2: And I said, well, isn't that strange. It's something I'd considered, 311 00:18:32,280 --> 00:18:34,439 Speaker 2: but I didn't think it would be me. So thank you, 312 00:18:34,760 --> 00:18:39,040 Speaker 2: and so off I went. Eventually, I mean the first 313 00:18:39,119 --> 00:18:42,520 Speaker 2: year of the business. It was the unbound to the publishers. 314 00:18:42,600 --> 00:18:48,399 Speaker 2: They begin each project with a Kickstarter to raise the 315 00:18:48,440 --> 00:18:51,919 Speaker 2: funds and to secure it, and that protects them as 316 00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:55,879 Speaker 2: a small publisher. It protects them from the risk involved 317 00:18:56,200 --> 00:18:59,680 Speaker 2: in an expensive book. And they'd already done a book 318 00:18:59,720 --> 00:19:06,760 Speaker 2: called what's it called Letters of Note, quite a big 319 00:19:06,800 --> 00:19:14,359 Speaker 2: coffee table book of famous people's correspondents and sometimes quite 320 00:19:14,359 --> 00:19:17,879 Speaker 2: old fashioned copper plate writing. You'd have on one page 321 00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:19,840 Speaker 2: you'd see the actual letter, and on the other page 322 00:19:19,880 --> 00:19:21,760 Speaker 2: you'd see it in a plain text to make it 323 00:19:21,800 --> 00:19:24,960 Speaker 2: easier to read. So that was their kind of model 324 00:19:25,000 --> 00:19:27,720 Speaker 2: that they wanted to make this book based upon. So 325 00:19:28,800 --> 00:19:31,240 Speaker 2: the first year was very difficult because the library was 326 00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:34,000 Speaker 2: in lockdown still and there was a member of staff 327 00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:37,960 Speaker 2: there who could be very badly affected by getting COVID. 328 00:19:38,320 --> 00:19:41,640 Speaker 2: She had quite severe asthma, so she was keeping it 329 00:19:42,040 --> 00:19:45,800 Speaker 2: strictly to live in students only, so that was a 330 00:19:45,800 --> 00:19:47,760 Speaker 2: bit of a delay. Then I got ill, then my 331 00:19:47,840 --> 00:19:49,879 Speaker 2: wife got ill. So the first year was a bit 332 00:19:49,920 --> 00:19:53,000 Speaker 2: of a writer. The second year twenty twenty two, I 333 00:19:53,119 --> 00:19:57,600 Speaker 2: went seventeen times in all to up to Cambridge. It's 334 00:19:57,600 --> 00:20:01,639 Speaker 2: about fifty miles each way, and I would spend the 335 00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:05,760 Speaker 2: day looking through the material, photographing it on my iPhone 336 00:20:05,760 --> 00:20:07,760 Speaker 2: because there wasn't enough time to sit and read it 337 00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:10,359 Speaker 2: on the day bringing it home. And I think for 338 00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:12,600 Speaker 2: every day I went, I spent at least a week 339 00:20:13,480 --> 00:20:17,399 Speaker 2: reading everything and logging it and creating my own database. 340 00:20:17,680 --> 00:20:21,120 Speaker 2: There is you can actually look at the Saint John's 341 00:20:21,160 --> 00:20:26,200 Speaker 2: College database of Douglas's material, but it really is only 342 00:20:26,320 --> 00:20:29,440 Speaker 2: very broad strokes, you know, It's like bullet points. Whereas 343 00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:31,000 Speaker 2: the only way to do it is to sit there 344 00:20:31,040 --> 00:20:33,600 Speaker 2: and look at the papers and go slowly through it all. 345 00:20:34,160 --> 00:20:36,840 Speaker 2: And it still belongs to the family. They still have 346 00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:38,960 Speaker 2: very much the control of it. You have to get 347 00:20:39,000 --> 00:20:42,399 Speaker 2: written permission to go and access this stuff. So I 348 00:20:42,440 --> 00:20:46,840 Speaker 2: felt very privileged. I also felt now in Douglas. I 349 00:20:46,920 --> 00:20:49,520 Speaker 2: don't think he wanted me or anyone to go and 350 00:20:49,560 --> 00:20:54,240 Speaker 2: look at his material in the unprepared state, and I 351 00:20:54,280 --> 00:20:56,919 Speaker 2: felt very much like I was prying, especially when you 352 00:20:56,920 --> 00:21:02,159 Speaker 2: look at things like his notebooks and his diaries. You know, 353 00:21:02,200 --> 00:21:04,320 Speaker 2: there's not a lot that didn't exactly pour his heart 354 00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:08,320 Speaker 2: out of his diaries, they're mostly just notes about meetings 355 00:21:08,400 --> 00:21:13,320 Speaker 2: and birthdays and party lots of parties. But in his 356 00:21:13,400 --> 00:21:16,880 Speaker 2: notebooks he was really much more personal. He would talk about, 357 00:21:17,000 --> 00:21:20,120 Speaker 2: you know, how he was feeling about working on this thing. 358 00:21:20,760 --> 00:21:24,119 Speaker 2: But it was lovely to see phrases that you know 359 00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:26,720 Speaker 2: and love if you're a Hitchhracker fan, you know, or 360 00:21:26,760 --> 00:21:28,800 Speaker 2: a Dot or two fan, you can see things. You 361 00:21:28,840 --> 00:21:31,199 Speaker 2: can see him working it out on the page, and 362 00:21:31,240 --> 00:21:35,240 Speaker 2: there it is in his own handwriting. So again, very privileged. 363 00:21:35,440 --> 00:21:38,119 Speaker 2: And I was walking in his footsteps literally because I 364 00:21:38,200 --> 00:21:42,159 Speaker 2: was going into the same you know college that he 365 00:21:42,240 --> 00:21:44,680 Speaker 2: studied in all those years ago in the early seventies. 366 00:21:44,720 --> 00:21:47,359 Speaker 2: I was going across the road at lunchtime in the 367 00:21:47,400 --> 00:21:50,960 Speaker 2: same pub that we know he frequented, and cafes around 368 00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:54,239 Speaker 2: the corner, you know, to break up the day they 369 00:21:54,280 --> 00:21:58,760 Speaker 2: always shut for lunch. Very British. And it was a 370 00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:02,600 Speaker 2: lovely job. It's something I thoroughly enjoyed doing. I then, 371 00:22:02,720 --> 00:22:05,479 Speaker 2: unfortunately I did get rather ill last year and I 372 00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:09,760 Speaker 2: had to take a slight back seat for a while. 373 00:22:10,760 --> 00:22:15,360 Speaker 2: A copy editor was assigned to look after the project, 374 00:22:15,400 --> 00:22:17,840 Speaker 2: to guide me through the whole business of the layout. 375 00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:21,800 Speaker 2: She worked with the designer, and you took a lot 376 00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:24,480 Speaker 2: of the load off me. When I was hospitalized for 377 00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:29,879 Speaker 2: a while. Anyway, the hospital they promised me they'd cure me, 378 00:22:29,920 --> 00:22:31,760 Speaker 2: and they did. I had six months of chemo and 379 00:22:31,800 --> 00:22:36,280 Speaker 2: I got better and I was able to finish the book. 380 00:22:36,320 --> 00:22:40,639 Speaker 2: The publishers were wonderful, they waited for me, and between 381 00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:44,080 Speaker 2: the whole team, we've put together something that I think 382 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:46,840 Speaker 2: the fans are going to cherish. And it's beautiful book, 383 00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:53,360 Speaker 2: beautifully printed. It's very heavy and very glossy, and I'm 384 00:22:53,400 --> 00:22:57,520 Speaker 2: delighted with the outcome. So now's the time to tell 385 00:22:57,560 --> 00:23:01,680 Speaker 2: everyone all about it rather excitedly. Is out in Britain now. 386 00:23:01,760 --> 00:23:05,920 Speaker 2: It was launched on Thursday last week here in the UK, 387 00:23:06,080 --> 00:23:08,400 Speaker 2: and it will be out in the middle of September 388 00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:11,000 Speaker 2: in America. Takes that long for the ship to get 389 00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:11,920 Speaker 2: across the Atlantic. 390 00:23:12,520 --> 00:23:14,760 Speaker 3: Was the Thursday release date intentional? 391 00:23:15,280 --> 00:23:18,360 Speaker 2: I wonder it also it was also the twenty fourth 392 00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:21,239 Speaker 2: of August. That's forty two back. But I don't know. 393 00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:25,480 Speaker 2: You can read what you like into that and people will. 394 00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:28,399 Speaker 2: I mean the fans have delighted in making notes about 395 00:23:28,440 --> 00:23:34,440 Speaker 2: forty two ever since I've been a what do they 396 00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:38,600 Speaker 2: call it, an honorary member of zaid zed nine Plurals 397 00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:42,639 Speaker 2: had Alpha, which is the official Hitchhiker's Guide appreciation society 398 00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:47,040 Speaker 2: for over forty years now. And we even had the 399 00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:51,240 Speaker 2: letter to Douglas and replies from him in the book 400 00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:55,560 Speaker 2: from the fans. There's an old chapter about fan letters 401 00:23:55,600 --> 00:23:59,200 Speaker 2: and things, which I quite enjoyed putting together. So yeah, 402 00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:01,560 Speaker 2: it's been. It's mixture. It covers his whole life from 403 00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:05,680 Speaker 2: cradle to grave. You know, really shows early promise when 404 00:24:05,680 --> 00:24:09,680 Speaker 2: he was twelve years old. His poems are extraordinary, and 405 00:24:09,720 --> 00:24:13,480 Speaker 2: then there's you know, love lorm Student Verse, and then 406 00:24:13,520 --> 00:24:19,000 Speaker 2: the early sketch comedy material Doctor who Hitchhikers Dirt Gently, 407 00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:22,159 Speaker 2: Last Chance to See, right up to the digital village, 408 00:24:22,200 --> 00:24:26,720 Speaker 2: which was how he spent these later years doing new projects, 409 00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:29,520 Speaker 2: some of which didn't make it to fruition, and we've 410 00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:32,119 Speaker 2: got some pages of those as well, So it's the 411 00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:32,760 Speaker 2: whole shomac. 412 00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:45,480 Speaker 3: I was really intrigued by this whole world of eighties 413 00:24:45,560 --> 00:24:49,480 Speaker 3: video games that the book touches on. I have very 414 00:24:49,520 --> 00:24:54,080 Speaker 3: little personal experience with games of this genre in time period. 415 00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:58,000 Speaker 3: So what was the nineteen eighty four Hitchhiker's game? Like, 416 00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:00,600 Speaker 3: what what what was this? And what was Douglas Adam's 417 00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:01,159 Speaker 3: vrovement in it. 418 00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:04,200 Speaker 2: Well, I'm going to be I'm going to be quite 419 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:06,680 Speaker 2: honest here. It's not one that I got into at 420 00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:11,159 Speaker 2: the time. I've been working in animation and we were 421 00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:14,639 Speaker 2: looking at computer graphics from quite early on, and I 422 00:25:14,760 --> 00:25:16,560 Speaker 2: just looked at it and thought, well, this technology is 423 00:25:16,600 --> 00:25:19,679 Speaker 2: not ready yet. You know. Of course, Jurassic Park and 424 00:25:20,119 --> 00:25:22,280 Speaker 2: terminated too, and all that kind of stuff was a 425 00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:26,119 Speaker 2: long long way ahead in the future. Computers were quite 426 00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:28,840 Speaker 2: kind of raw, and it was all very rough at 427 00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:32,080 Speaker 2: that time. But those who loved tinkering with computers were 428 00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:34,760 Speaker 2: having a field day. And Douglas admitted he said, do 429 00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:36,679 Speaker 2: you know what, I really would quite like to have 430 00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:38,719 Speaker 2: been a software engineer. I don't know if he had 431 00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:41,000 Speaker 2: the discipline, To be honest, he was a quite chaotic 432 00:25:41,040 --> 00:25:43,520 Speaker 2: sort of person. To wonder that his archive exists, and 433 00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:46,960 Speaker 2: I've put that down to his battery of personal assistance 434 00:25:47,040 --> 00:25:48,880 Speaker 2: he had over the years who probably kept it all 435 00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:52,960 Speaker 2: in order. But yes, he really enjoyed the process. Of 436 00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:57,680 Speaker 2: writing that first game. It's a text adventure, so you're 437 00:25:57,760 --> 00:26:02,360 Speaker 2: interacting with the text in a way that he quite mischievously, 438 00:26:03,160 --> 00:26:07,080 Speaker 2: would get the computer to lie. He said, you know, 439 00:26:07,119 --> 00:26:11,360 Speaker 2: it's not artificial intelligence. It's actually artificially it's not user friendly. 440 00:26:11,560 --> 00:26:16,000 Speaker 2: It's artificially mendacious. I what you call it. It would 441 00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:19,080 Speaker 2: deliberately lie to you, and you the game, I believe 442 00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:22,960 Speaker 2: was quite frustrating. I only dabbled on it briefly. I 443 00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:27,240 Speaker 2: mean it was launched at a convention that we had 444 00:26:27,280 --> 00:26:30,160 Speaker 2: in the middle of nineteen eighty five. I remember them 445 00:26:30,200 --> 00:26:33,160 Speaker 2: doing quite a bit of publicity there for it, and 446 00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:35,320 Speaker 2: a TV show that covered it at the time, and 447 00:26:35,359 --> 00:26:36,960 Speaker 2: there was one guy who was quite good at it, 448 00:26:37,040 --> 00:26:40,119 Speaker 2: who was explaining how it worked, and I had to 449 00:26:40,200 --> 00:26:42,480 Speaker 2: dabble there, and I thought, ah, this is not for me. 450 00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:46,119 Speaker 2: I didn't, but I know that, you know, from my 451 00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:49,440 Speaker 2: interviews with Douglas, I knew that he loved the experience. 452 00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:52,399 Speaker 2: And then he went on to do Bureaucracy, which was 453 00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:54,679 Speaker 2: based on I mean, they wanted Hitchiker two, but he 454 00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:58,080 Speaker 2: was much more interested in doing something different, which I 455 00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:00,879 Speaker 2: think was true. Throughout his career. He kept trying to 456 00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:06,760 Speaker 2: escape from hitchhiker. But the bureaucracy game was about getting 457 00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:10,840 Speaker 2: a bank to register a change of address card because 458 00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:14,080 Speaker 2: he had personal experience of a bank. He just bought 459 00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:19,160 Speaker 2: a swanky new flat in fashionable Islington in London, and 460 00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:24,480 Speaker 2: the bank kept sending all his correspondence went to the 461 00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:27,479 Speaker 2: old address, and he kept saying to them, look, you know, 462 00:27:27,880 --> 00:27:31,560 Speaker 2: for heaven's sake, you're into this property for X thousands 463 00:27:31,600 --> 00:27:34,320 Speaker 2: of pounds. Surely you know where I am. And he said, 464 00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:36,760 Speaker 2: they wrote back to me and said wherever. So sorry, yes, 465 00:27:36,800 --> 00:27:39,639 Speaker 2: it's completely our fault. We will get it right in future. 466 00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:44,560 Speaker 2: And he said, guess where they sent that letter? So yeah, 467 00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:49,800 Speaker 2: So I mean famously in Hitchhikers the bureaucracy, the bureaucrats 468 00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:54,320 Speaker 2: are the vogons. And that's kind of become a byword 469 00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:58,920 Speaker 2: now for anybody that has a sort of stubborn bureaucratic streak, 470 00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:04,879 Speaker 2: you know, parking wardens and petty officials that liked to 471 00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:07,760 Speaker 2: wield their look a bit of power too heavily. I 472 00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:09,960 Speaker 2: think a lot of people call them bogons. 473 00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:13,199 Speaker 3: Now, now, am I correct that? In this did he 474 00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:17,000 Speaker 3: also work on the nineteen eighty six Labyrinth the computer game. 475 00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:20,280 Speaker 2: Ah, there was a dabble. He did know Jim Henson, 476 00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:22,160 Speaker 2: and I know that he went to dinner with him, 477 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:24,359 Speaker 2: and I know he got involved in a discussion group. 478 00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:27,080 Speaker 2: There was an educational thing that he was going to 479 00:28:27,119 --> 00:28:30,520 Speaker 2: do with the Muppets. Quite how much involvement he had, 480 00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:34,560 Speaker 2: I don't know. It's not something that's terribly well documented. 481 00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:37,800 Speaker 2: And yeah, I can't really give you much on that, 482 00:28:37,920 --> 00:28:42,360 Speaker 2: but I know that, you know, he prized his friendship 483 00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:46,440 Speaker 2: with Jim Henson quite highly at the time. But who 484 00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:49,280 Speaker 2: knows what they would have created together that happened. It 485 00:28:49,280 --> 00:28:50,080 Speaker 2: would have been amazing. 486 00:28:50,200 --> 00:28:53,840 Speaker 3: Both such creative individuals that died far too early. 487 00:28:54,200 --> 00:28:57,960 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, I agree, Yeah, terribly missed both of them. 488 00:28:58,040 --> 00:29:02,080 Speaker 3: I agree. Now, speaking of technology and also you know 489 00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:05,960 Speaker 3: sci fi visions of technology, does Adams get enough credit 490 00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:08,600 Speaker 3: as a kind of futurist at least as far as 491 00:29:08,600 --> 00:29:10,000 Speaker 3: you know, technology is concerned. 492 00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:14,800 Speaker 2: I don't know how many people know about quite how 493 00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:18,200 Speaker 2: many conferences that he went to as a guest speaker. 494 00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:23,320 Speaker 2: The world of sort of you know, geeks, nerds, whatever, 495 00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:25,880 Speaker 2: you know, the computer and the high tech world, even 496 00:29:25,960 --> 00:29:29,720 Speaker 2: to mobile phones and things like that. They clamored to 497 00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:32,640 Speaker 2: have him there because he was a very entertaining speaker. 498 00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:37,200 Speaker 2: He essentially gave pretty much the same speech I think 499 00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:40,240 Speaker 2: at quite a few conferences, and we have his notes 500 00:29:40,360 --> 00:29:45,520 Speaker 2: from one of those speeches from right towards the end 501 00:29:45,560 --> 00:29:50,000 Speaker 2: of his tragically short life. But yes, he once told 502 00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:52,600 Speaker 2: me on an interview in ninety two and he said, oh, 503 00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:55,000 Speaker 2: I'm off to Japan next week or something. He said, 504 00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:59,480 Speaker 2: I'm giving a talk at this conference, and my audience 505 00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:03,280 Speaker 2: is going to include the head of Sony, Francis faul Coppola, 506 00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:07,800 Speaker 2: and George Lucas. He was certainly mixing with interesting company 507 00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:10,640 Speaker 2: and the high tech side of things. Yeah, he knew 508 00:30:10,640 --> 00:30:13,040 Speaker 2: some very powerful people. I found a note about Jeff 509 00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:16,400 Speaker 2: Bezos in one of his notebooks. He wasn't above just 510 00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:19,120 Speaker 2: picking up the phone and ringing these people, you know. 511 00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:22,800 Speaker 2: He he had ideas and he was communicating them quite 512 00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:25,560 Speaker 2: early on. He knew long before the most of us 513 00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:29,000 Speaker 2: mere mortals were really aware of the Internet. He was 514 00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:31,800 Speaker 2: way ahead, he knew. And an interview I did with 515 00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:35,600 Speaker 2: him further Sci Fi Channel in ninety five, he was saying, then, 516 00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:37,680 Speaker 2: I want to get this country wired up, you know, 517 00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:39,800 Speaker 2: I want us to have a fiber to every home, 518 00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:42,240 Speaker 2: and that was a long way before. I mean we 519 00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:44,920 Speaker 2: still don't have that now, but in ninety five he 520 00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:47,840 Speaker 2: was talking about that. So yes, he was very aware, 521 00:30:47,840 --> 00:30:49,560 Speaker 2: and he became more and more aware of it. He 522 00:30:49,600 --> 00:30:52,560 Speaker 2: was fascinated by real science and that was his preferred 523 00:30:52,560 --> 00:30:56,000 Speaker 2: reading matter in the latter stages of his life, and 524 00:30:56,600 --> 00:30:58,760 Speaker 2: we've kind of been robbed of something. I think that 525 00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:02,320 Speaker 2: he would have written some real science books. I mean, 526 00:31:02,320 --> 00:31:05,440 Speaker 2: his only factual book was his favorite, and that was 527 00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:08,720 Speaker 2: Last Chance to See But that was about endangered species, 528 00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:12,480 Speaker 2: which was another hot topic for him. He was asked 529 00:31:12,480 --> 00:31:15,320 Speaker 2: by a newspaper to go and be a sort of 530 00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:21,680 Speaker 2: untrained observer for a trip to Madagascar to go and 531 00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:24,560 Speaker 2: look for a rare species of lima called the AI. 532 00:31:25,600 --> 00:31:28,840 Speaker 2: And I interviewed him in eighty five just after he 533 00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:31,280 Speaker 2: got back, two weeks after he got back, and he said, 534 00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:34,240 Speaker 2: that was fascinating experience. We went off into the jungle 535 00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:36,920 Speaker 2: because the II is nocturnal, it means have ted torture. 536 00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:41,320 Speaker 2: He loved it so much. And they did get to 537 00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:43,880 Speaker 2: see the II, which is the most bizarre looking creature. 538 00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:47,680 Speaker 2: And you said that I really enjoyed that i'd like 539 00:31:47,760 --> 00:31:50,239 Speaker 2: I think I'd like to do more of that, And 540 00:31:50,280 --> 00:31:53,000 Speaker 2: within a couple of years he was taking an entire 541 00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:56,640 Speaker 2: year out to go around the world with Mark Card 542 00:31:57,120 --> 00:32:00,920 Speaker 2: the naturalist, and that they went to all sorts of 543 00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:04,920 Speaker 2: far flung places to look at endangered species and sort 544 00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:08,960 Speaker 2: of report upon them, mainly originally for a radio show, 545 00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:11,720 Speaker 2: but also with the idea that it would be a book. 546 00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:15,480 Speaker 2: And they were given a big old chunk of money 547 00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:18,240 Speaker 2: to go and do this and to make these trips, 548 00:32:18,960 --> 00:32:23,160 Speaker 2: and a series of different radio producer sound recordis went 549 00:32:23,240 --> 00:32:26,000 Speaker 2: with them to make the radio shows. The radio show 550 00:32:26,680 --> 00:32:30,680 Speaker 2: varies slightly from the book. The book is pure Douglas. 551 00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:33,160 Speaker 2: It's about the fun and games they had just getting 552 00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:36,480 Speaker 2: to the places. So it's almost like a travelogue thing 553 00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:39,760 Speaker 2: of what it's like to go to these tiny little 554 00:32:41,320 --> 00:32:45,160 Speaker 2: airstrips in the middle of Africa where corrupt officials would 555 00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:47,360 Speaker 2: want their palms greased if they were going to let 556 00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:51,520 Speaker 2: you have your baggages. You know, you couldn't get your 557 00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:56,320 Speaker 2: suitcases unless you you know, seen the right man sort. So, yeah, 558 00:32:56,320 --> 00:32:58,400 Speaker 2: he had some great stories to tell, and we've got 559 00:32:58,440 --> 00:33:00,000 Speaker 2: a couple of the stories that didn't make the book 560 00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:03,720 Speaker 2: book are in this book, There's there's one where he 561 00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:06,680 Speaker 2: went to see some fruit bats, and he was so 562 00:33:06,720 --> 00:33:09,520 Speaker 2: preoccupied with the fact that he'd been completely bitten all 563 00:33:09,560 --> 00:33:12,040 Speaker 2: over by mosquitos that he barely could look at the 564 00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:17,200 Speaker 2: fruit bats. But you know, he was an intrepid traveler. 565 00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:19,960 Speaker 2: He liked his home comfort. I mean, he really did 566 00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:22,920 Speaker 2: go all around the world and stay in some really 567 00:33:22,960 --> 00:33:27,920 Speaker 2: swanky hotels, but he wasn't above roughing it and being 568 00:33:28,240 --> 00:33:31,040 Speaker 2: you know, in the outback or in jungles or whatever 569 00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:36,440 Speaker 2: it took. And he became very passionately fond of endangered species, 570 00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:39,400 Speaker 2: and he would have written more. I'm sure he would have. 571 00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:43,280 Speaker 2: He was reading on evolution and evolutionary theory. He was 572 00:33:43,920 --> 00:33:46,320 Speaker 2: keeping up to date and abreast of all the modern 573 00:33:46,360 --> 00:33:49,560 Speaker 2: technological trends. What he would have thought of today's situation 574 00:33:49,640 --> 00:33:53,320 Speaker 2: with AI. You know who knows we've been robbed of 575 00:33:53,360 --> 00:33:58,280 Speaker 2: that sadly. And Jeffrey mcgiven, who played Full Prefect on 576 00:33:58,320 --> 00:34:01,200 Speaker 2: the radio, he said, one thing we've been robbed of 577 00:34:01,360 --> 00:34:05,760 Speaker 2: is Douglas's view on being the parent of a teenage girl, 578 00:34:05,800 --> 00:34:10,560 Speaker 2: because sadly, his little girl, Polly was only six when 579 00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:13,680 Speaker 2: he passed away. So you know, he would have had 580 00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:16,239 Speaker 2: a take on what it was like to deal with 581 00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:18,839 Speaker 2: a teenage girl, you know, and all that. There's all 582 00:34:18,880 --> 00:34:22,120 Speaker 2: sorts of things, and the family missing terribly. I know 583 00:34:22,239 --> 00:34:26,959 Speaker 2: his sisters and his brother and they champion him a lot. 584 00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:31,400 Speaker 2: They get involved in when we have memorial services or 585 00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:35,080 Speaker 2: we have there's an annual lecture science and comedy lecture 586 00:34:35,680 --> 00:34:39,680 Speaker 2: in his name and organized partly by the family and 587 00:34:39,680 --> 00:34:42,759 Speaker 2: partly by Save the Rhino International of which he was 588 00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:44,760 Speaker 2: a founder patron. 589 00:34:44,880 --> 00:34:47,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, there's some photos in the book with some sort 590 00:34:47,080 --> 00:34:48,720 Speaker 3: of a rhino costume, right. 591 00:34:48,840 --> 00:34:51,520 Speaker 2: That's fantastic costume. I think it was made originally for 592 00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:54,800 Speaker 2: a stage show. It's a caricature of a rhino really, 593 00:34:54,840 --> 00:34:58,799 Speaker 2: but it's quite familiar to Britain's for taking part in 594 00:34:59,640 --> 00:35:02,200 Speaker 2: marathon and you know, city marathons and things like that. 595 00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:06,279 Speaker 2: These rhinos with their low slung head hanging down in 596 00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:12,000 Speaker 2: front of the costumes fabulous designed by Gerald Scarf, Foone's cartoonist. 597 00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:16,080 Speaker 2: But yeah, Douglas took part in a trek. There was 598 00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:20,239 Speaker 2: a team that walked across part of Africa up to 599 00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:22,640 Speaker 2: the top of Manculum Manjara. I don't think Douglas made 600 00:35:22,680 --> 00:35:26,400 Speaker 2: it up the mountain, but he did part of the 601 00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:30,080 Speaker 2: sweltering in that costume in the African heat, and there 602 00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:32,719 Speaker 2: are pictures in the book of that and a very 603 00:35:32,760 --> 00:35:36,200 Speaker 2: nice portrait of him standing there holding the costume. Yeah. 604 00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:38,600 Speaker 2: So yeah, no, they was serious about that. And also 605 00:35:38,680 --> 00:35:42,440 Speaker 2: the Diane Fosse Guerrilla Fund. You know, he would he 606 00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:45,759 Speaker 2: would give to those charities and support them. 607 00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:49,640 Speaker 3: Tell us about Secret Empire and how this would have 608 00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:52,680 Speaker 3: fit into the creative output of Douglas Adams. I know 609 00:35:52,760 --> 00:35:55,480 Speaker 3: the book. In the book, it's compared in scope to 610 00:35:55,520 --> 00:35:59,959 Speaker 3: something ultimately like Asimov's Foundation series, So like, what would 611 00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:02,400 Speaker 3: tone and scope have been if this had come to 612 00:36:02,440 --> 00:36:04,680 Speaker 3: fruition and why didn't it come together? 613 00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:08,360 Speaker 2: I think it didn't come together primarily because the company 614 00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:12,400 Speaker 2: from which he was running that and proposing it was 615 00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:16,280 Speaker 2: the Digital Village, which he set up with several people, 616 00:36:16,320 --> 00:36:23,439 Speaker 2: including his friend Robbie Stamp, and it went to the wall. 617 00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:26,600 Speaker 2: Unfortunately in the dotcom bubble burst, you know, it was 618 00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:32,000 Speaker 2: not financed quite as strongly as they'd hoped, and so 619 00:36:33,200 --> 00:36:35,960 Speaker 2: I don't know, it would have been a very expensive series. 620 00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:39,640 Speaker 2: His ideas were quite extraordinary and it was very much 621 00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:43,480 Speaker 2: like we've now got foundation. Finally the technology is there 622 00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:47,160 Speaker 2: now to make something as awesome as a story with 623 00:36:47,239 --> 00:36:49,600 Speaker 2: that kind of scope. But that's what he was planning. 624 00:36:49,640 --> 00:36:53,640 Speaker 2: It was. The idea was called Secret Empire because the 625 00:36:53,719 --> 00:36:57,880 Speaker 2: notion was that we nearmmortals on Earth. We're not aware, 626 00:36:58,280 --> 00:37:03,560 Speaker 2: but there's an international conspiracy of scientists and top people 627 00:37:03,920 --> 00:37:06,960 Speaker 2: that are already out there exploring the Solar system more 628 00:37:07,000 --> 00:37:12,600 Speaker 2: than we know, and over the centuries, and each series 629 00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:16,239 Speaker 2: was going to be set another century later that we 630 00:37:16,280 --> 00:37:19,360 Speaker 2: would go off, you know, if in the hopeful idea 631 00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:21,439 Speaker 2: that there would be many series of this, we would 632 00:37:21,440 --> 00:37:25,640 Speaker 2: reach into the far flung future. And there were difference 633 00:37:25,640 --> 00:37:30,920 Speaker 2: engineers who were speculating using all kinds of theory about 634 00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:34,719 Speaker 2: how the human race might reach out further, and all 635 00:37:34,760 --> 00:37:40,360 Speaker 2: the implications politically, scientifically, you know, across across those millennia, 636 00:37:41,560 --> 00:37:43,799 Speaker 2: you know, where would we end up. So it was 637 00:37:43,880 --> 00:37:47,600 Speaker 2: quite far eaching grand scope of an idea. And I 638 00:37:47,600 --> 00:37:49,640 Speaker 2: remember him saying to me, he said, you'll be surprised, 639 00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:53,239 Speaker 2: I'm not doing science fiction. I am. I've thought up 640 00:37:53,239 --> 00:37:56,080 Speaker 2: another science fiction series, and I didn't know what it 641 00:37:56,120 --> 00:37:58,480 Speaker 2: was at the time. He was keeping it quite his cards, 642 00:37:58,560 --> 00:38:01,879 Speaker 2: quite close to his chest. But I last saw him 643 00:38:01,920 --> 00:38:04,960 Speaker 2: in December of ninety eight when he was giving one 644 00:38:05,000 --> 00:38:08,560 Speaker 2: of his speeches, a variation on the usual speech, to 645 00:38:08,760 --> 00:38:12,080 Speaker 2: the public Awareness of Science Drama Awards, which is something 646 00:38:12,080 --> 00:38:14,920 Speaker 2: I'd been involved in since the year before. I'd been 647 00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:17,759 Speaker 2: a guest speaker there whilst I was directing episodes of 648 00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:24,080 Speaker 2: a science fiction series. And yeah, he was clearly, you know, 649 00:38:24,239 --> 00:38:26,960 Speaker 2: firing on all cylinders, and he had great ideas. And 650 00:38:27,000 --> 00:38:30,040 Speaker 2: then the following year ninety nine, he went and emigrated 651 00:38:30,360 --> 00:38:33,880 Speaker 2: to live in California to get the movie done. That 652 00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:36,960 Speaker 2: was the real reason for going. And sadly, two years later, 653 00:38:37,680 --> 00:38:41,640 Speaker 2: after a strenuous workout in the gym, he collapsed and 654 00:38:41,680 --> 00:38:44,080 Speaker 2: that was the end of him. I'm afraid. So I 655 00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:47,320 Speaker 2: think I think the Secret Project, I think that was 656 00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:51,600 Speaker 2: something that it's time passed. You know. It's a shame 657 00:38:51,640 --> 00:38:54,960 Speaker 2: it didn't happen when it was first proposed in the 658 00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:57,520 Speaker 2: mid nineties. But it's there in the book if you 659 00:38:57,520 --> 00:38:59,160 Speaker 2: want to have a look, there's a few pages from it. 660 00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:01,839 Speaker 2: It's not the whole thing. In fact, now I don't 661 00:39:01,840 --> 00:39:03,880 Speaker 2: think there's anything in the book which is the entire 662 00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:06,360 Speaker 2: thing it would be impossible. The book would be enormous. 663 00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:09,040 Speaker 2: So what I've tried to do is find really good 664 00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:14,280 Speaker 2: representative pages of everything, so you get a really broad 665 00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:18,920 Speaker 2: sweep of his life, his projects, the surprising things that 666 00:39:18,960 --> 00:39:23,200 Speaker 2: he did, you know, like working on cartoons for children, 667 00:39:23,280 --> 00:39:27,480 Speaker 2: and he did some sketch comedy for Pete Town's End 668 00:39:27,560 --> 00:39:31,200 Speaker 2: of the Who, And all sorts of snippets and tipbits 669 00:39:31,200 --> 00:39:35,560 Speaker 2: that I found, and yeah, I think you'll find something 670 00:39:35,600 --> 00:39:37,120 Speaker 2: in there. It's one of those books that you can 671 00:39:37,160 --> 00:39:39,120 Speaker 2: pick up and read a few pages and then come 672 00:39:39,160 --> 00:39:42,040 Speaker 2: back to another time, or if you want to work 673 00:39:42,080 --> 00:39:45,200 Speaker 2: your way through the whole thing. It is vaguely chronological. 674 00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:47,839 Speaker 2: Sometimes it's difficult to be sure because he didn't put 675 00:39:47,840 --> 00:39:51,880 Speaker 2: a lot of dates on things. You know. The diaries, 676 00:39:51,880 --> 00:39:54,960 Speaker 2: of course are dated, but they're not He wasn't using 677 00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:58,600 Speaker 2: them to pour his heart out. They were really disappointment diaries, 678 00:39:58,640 --> 00:40:02,920 Speaker 2: you know, which is a but his notebooks are frequently undated. 679 00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:06,080 Speaker 2: The other funny thing about his notebooks was he would 680 00:40:06,120 --> 00:40:09,960 Speaker 2: start a fresh notebook in a burst of enthusiasm, and 681 00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:12,440 Speaker 2: you'd see it on the page and he would declare, boldly, 682 00:40:12,600 --> 00:40:16,680 Speaker 2: I'm now going to write something new every day, all big, 683 00:40:16,760 --> 00:40:20,439 Speaker 2: bold statements and lots of optimism, and then after about 684 00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:23,480 Speaker 2: six or seven pages that sort of fizzles out and 685 00:40:23,520 --> 00:40:26,280 Speaker 2: the rest of the book blank. Then he starts another 686 00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:32,240 Speaker 2: notebook and it's just you know, he continues on another 687 00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:34,839 Speaker 2: fresh It's like a butterfly mind. He would flip from 688 00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:38,680 Speaker 2: thing to thing and try very hard to make it, 689 00:40:40,160 --> 00:40:42,279 Speaker 2: to make it work, and then if he would get 690 00:40:42,280 --> 00:40:44,920 Speaker 2: plunged into fits of despair. He was known to have 691 00:40:45,000 --> 00:40:48,520 Speaker 2: depression occasionally. I think maybe less and less as his 692 00:40:48,600 --> 00:40:51,719 Speaker 2: life went along, as he got more successful. I think 693 00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:58,320 Speaker 2: it helped. But yeah, he was a man of extraordinary enthusiasms, 694 00:40:58,400 --> 00:40:59,960 Speaker 2: and that comes across on the page. 695 00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:03,480 Speaker 3: Absolutely. Yeah. I haven't had a chance to look at 696 00:41:03,480 --> 00:41:05,600 Speaker 3: the physical book, but I had the digital book, and 697 00:41:05,640 --> 00:41:09,920 Speaker 3: you know, the layout is fabulous, and it provides so 698 00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:11,719 Speaker 3: much insight and you get, like you say, into these 699 00:41:11,719 --> 00:41:14,640 Speaker 3: different areas of his life. Is sort of pyramid of interest. 700 00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:19,279 Speaker 3: Really really a treat, A great introduction I think in 701 00:41:19,360 --> 00:41:21,520 Speaker 3: some respects to the man for people who aren't familiar 702 00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:22,880 Speaker 3: with him. But I could see this would be a 703 00:41:23,040 --> 00:41:26,520 Speaker 3: cherished volume for for Douglas Adams fans out there. 704 00:41:26,680 --> 00:41:29,200 Speaker 2: Well, I hope so, I mean, that's that was the intention. 705 00:41:29,480 --> 00:41:33,640 Speaker 2: So I hope we've fulfilled it. And I'm certainly delighted 706 00:41:33,680 --> 00:41:36,080 Speaker 2: with when the book arrived. I was quite surprised at 707 00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:39,040 Speaker 2: the at the quality of it. That's that stood out 708 00:41:39,080 --> 00:41:41,960 Speaker 2: to me. You know, it's something to be proud of. 709 00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:48,000 Speaker 2: And yeah, I hope people will enjoy four to two 710 00:41:48,120 --> 00:41:51,840 Speaker 2: The Wildly Improbable Ideas of Douglas Adams. And we do 711 00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:54,520 Speaker 2: explain forty two of the book. That's that's we've given it. 712 00:41:54,719 --> 00:41:56,080 Speaker 2: We've given it a little sub chapter. 713 00:41:56,680 --> 00:41:58,920 Speaker 3: Excellent. Well, thanks for coming on the show, Kevin. This 714 00:41:59,000 --> 00:41:59,600 Speaker 3: is a lot of fun. 715 00:41:59,719 --> 00:41:59,960 Speaker 2: Thank you. 716 00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:02,880 Speaker 3: Thanks again to Kevin for coming on the show. The 717 00:42:02,920 --> 00:42:06,799 Speaker 3: book again is forty two The Wildly Improbable Ideas of 718 00:42:06,840 --> 00:42:09,840 Speaker 3: Douglas Adams. It is going to be available as a 719 00:42:09,840 --> 00:42:14,040 Speaker 3: physical book to you shortly. It's already available as an ebook, 720 00:42:14,080 --> 00:42:16,080 Speaker 3: so go ahead and look it up an order or 721 00:42:16,120 --> 00:42:21,200 Speaker 3: pre order wherever you get your volumes. Thanks as always 722 00:42:21,280 --> 00:42:24,840 Speaker 3: to the excellent JJ Possway for producing the show. And 723 00:42:25,560 --> 00:42:27,279 Speaker 3: just a reminder that Stuff to Blow Your Mind is 724 00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:31,319 Speaker 3: primarily a science podcast, with core episodes on Tuesdays and Thursdays. 725 00:42:31,680 --> 00:42:35,160 Speaker 3: Listener mail episodes on Mondays. On Wednesdays we have a 726 00:42:35,200 --> 00:42:38,920 Speaker 3: short form monster fact or Artifact episode, and on Fridays 727 00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:41,640 Speaker 3: we set aside most serious concerns to just talk about 728 00:42:41,640 --> 00:42:45,400 Speaker 3: a weird film on Weird House Cinema. And if you 729 00:42:45,440 --> 00:42:47,120 Speaker 3: would like to reach out to us, well, you can 730 00:42:47,160 --> 00:42:49,640 Speaker 3: email us at contact at stuff to Blow your Mind 731 00:42:50,080 --> 00:42:59,560 Speaker 3: dot com. Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of 732 00:42:59,600 --> 00:43:00,360 Speaker 3: iHeart Radio. 733 00:43:00,680 --> 00:43:04,680 Speaker 2: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 734 00:43:04,760 --> 00:43:20,919 Speaker 2: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows