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Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Savor production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: I'm Annie Reese and I'm Lauren Vogelbaum, and today we

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Speaker 2: have a classic episode for you about kale.

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Speaker 1: Oh yes, one of my very favorite foods still. Yeah, yeah, yes,

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Speaker 1: this food I have become People know me so well that,

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Speaker 1: especially in our time of like resolutions of January, people

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Speaker 1: contact me and ask me how they can use kale.

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Speaker 1: One are my favorite kale recipes, and it just cracks

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Speaker 1: me up that I've become so associated with it in

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Speaker 1: their minds. And I did recently really make someone's day

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Speaker 1: when I told them the fact we talked about in

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Speaker 1: this episode that at one point Pizza Hut was the

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Speaker 1: largest purchaser of kale. She her whole world changed. It's

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Speaker 1: a good fact. It's a good fact.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yes, oh yeah, well I was I was asking

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Speaker 3: because this episode came out in March of twenty eighteen,

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Speaker 3: which is three forevers ago at least.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, but I'm glad that it's still a large

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Speaker 2: part of your life. It's delicious, Yeah it is.

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Speaker 1: It's so good. Yes, I did stop. I haven't had

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Speaker 1: as much as I was having when we recorded this

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Speaker 1: because I feel like I had like my top ten

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Speaker 1: favorite foods, and I think we've done all of them,

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Speaker 1: at least most of them, and kale was early on

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Speaker 1: the list. But I live alone, and I had such

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Speaker 1: an issue with fruit flies or some kind of fly

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Speaker 1: that I didn't like having fresh products because they would

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Speaker 1: just get me live alone, so I don't generate a

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Speaker 1: lot of trash, so it would just so I have

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Speaker 1: had as much as I like. And then a friend

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Speaker 1: was asking me about frozen kale and my thoughts about that.

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Speaker 1: But yes, I still like it, I just don't eat

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Speaker 1: it as often as I did when we recorded this.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, m hmm, Well, okay, all right, I wish

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Speaker 2: you uh as much kale as you want in this

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Speaker 2: our coming year. I was indeed thinking about this classic

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Speaker 2: because it is the beginning of the year. Kale has

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Speaker 2: been labeled as very healthy for you, in fact a

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Speaker 2: super food, which we go into in the episode, and

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Speaker 2: uh yeah, so I was like, yeah, why not? Why not?

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Speaker 2: Although also as I was listening, a thing that you

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Speaker 2: briefly mentioned in the episode is some kind of like

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Speaker 2: German kale tradition, yes, and you did not elaborate and

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Speaker 2: so and so I was like, okay, quick google see

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Speaker 2: what that's about, because I googled just kale in general

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Speaker 2: and nothing particularly fascinating had come up. But German kale tradition. Okay,

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Speaker 2: let us let us do a slight expansion on that

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Speaker 2: before we get into this. Okay. So, up in the

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Speaker 2: north of Germany, there is this tradition of kale hikes

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Speaker 2: every like late fall through midwinter to celebrate the local

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Speaker 2: kale harvest. It works like this, every year of whichever

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Speaker 2: you know, any number of groups will crown a king

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Speaker 2: and queen who are then tasked with planning the root

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Speaker 2: of this kale hike, like a few rambling miles meant

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Speaker 2: to take a few hours, ending at a local restaurant

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Speaker 2: or other events space, and along the way the king

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Speaker 2: and queen plan and layout like games and drinks and

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Speaker 2: snacks all set up beforehand, and then waiting for the

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Speaker 2: revelers at the end is a kale centric feast featuring

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Speaker 2: this local variety of often like kind of bitter, tough

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Speaker 2: kale that's been stewed down with pork fat and then

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Speaker 2: is served up with sausages and potatoes. Yeah, it culminates.

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Speaker 2: The whole dinner culminates with the crowning of next year's

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Speaker 2: king and queen, and similar festivities can be found like

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Speaker 2: up through Denmark and parts of Scandinavia. And this all

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Speaker 2: sounds so amazing. I mean, like like a long, maybe

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Speaker 2: not brisk walk but but you know, but but but

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Speaker 2: warming with the friends and schnaps and uh and snacks

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Speaker 2: and games uh and then yeah, like a kale feast.

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Speaker 2: I love a kale feast right like? Oh especially, I

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Speaker 2: mean this sounds so much like a like a good

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Speaker 2: like like southern collared yes kind of situation. Yeah, I yes,

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Speaker 2: I want to go on a kale hike.

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Speaker 1: Oh I do as well. And I have many good

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Speaker 1: recipes for a kale stew, so you need them. I

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Speaker 1: have them. I do remember coveting the kale scepter, right yeah,

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Speaker 1: I yes, I still would like one. But yeah, this

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Speaker 1: is great again, listeners, if you've done this, pictures of this.

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Speaker 1: We do love these things, oh yes, oh yes, but this, yeah,

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Speaker 1: this does sound like a delightful, very niche specific thing

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Speaker 1: that we would love.

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Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, okay, but at any rate, former Annie and Lauren

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Speaker 2: have lots to say about kale, so let's let them

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Speaker 2: take it away.

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Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to food stuff. I'm Annie Reeve and I'm.

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Speaker 2: Lauren vocal Bam, and today we're tackling kale.

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Speaker 1: Yes and disclaimer or at the front. Kale is one

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Speaker 1: of my favorite foods and I eat it every week

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Speaker 1: at least.

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Speaker 2: Oh wow, yeah, I eat it frequently. I don't make

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Speaker 2: a point debating it every week, but certainly some kind

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Speaker 2: of of tough, leafy green vegetable collars are also popular

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Speaker 2: in my house. Yeah, turnip greens. I love turnip greens

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Speaker 2: and mustard greens, which are all which are all related.

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Speaker 1: They are. Oh and a quick note too, there is

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Speaker 1: food stuff for those of you who don't know. We

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Speaker 1: used to have like an earlier version where we were

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Speaker 1: trying to get this going and we had a video series.

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Speaker 1: And there is a food stuff video starring Kristin Konger

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Speaker 1: of Unladylike Now and Ben Bolan.

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Speaker 2: Co worker, produced by Annie, produced by Annie.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and it has a cameo by Barbie and doctor Kale. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: it was about kale and it was excellent.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, please do That's not just Annie saying

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Speaker 2: it because she worked on it. It was really beautiful.

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Speaker 2: Kristin and Ben were doing really good work and annie as. Yeah, so,

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Speaker 2: so go check that out. We'll see if we can

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Speaker 2: post it on Facebook.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's on YouTube. And also a fun note about

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Speaker 1: it is I went through this whole thing for a while.

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Speaker 1: I was producing video. That was my job, and I

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Speaker 1: was determined that every video be have captions.

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Speaker 2: Oh oh yeah yeah.

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Speaker 1: And to do that on YouTube, you have to you

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Speaker 1: play the video and then you type it in and

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Speaker 1: while you're typing, which is fine, but it's obviously very yeah. So,

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Speaker 1: but there is a feature for YouTube to do it automatically.

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Speaker 1: So I tested it on the Kale video and it

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Speaker 1: translated Kale as cocaine.

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Speaker 2: Oh my goodness, the whole video. That is certainly a

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Speaker 2: different episode.

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Speaker 1: It's like I love cocaine. I got to get more cocaine.

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Speaker 2: I ate cocaine at least once a week.

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Speaker 1: Yes, Like the beginning of the video has been showing

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Speaker 1: up with the backpack and he's like, I bought the cocaine.

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Speaker 1: It's really good. I mean, I thought it was hilarious,

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Speaker 1: but clearly I could not trust YouTube's auto transcribe. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Well anyway, yeah, so if you do check out the video,

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Speaker 2: then keep that in mind.

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Speaker 1: Yes, keep that in mind. But let's tackle our first question.

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Speaker 1: We always tackle what is it?

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Speaker 2: Kale?

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Speaker 1: Yes, what is kale?

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Speaker 2: It's a leafy green. It's a member of the Bisca

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Speaker 2: olaricia species, whose cultivars include cabbages and broccoli and cauliflower

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Speaker 2: and Brussels sprouts. Kale is a whole group of cultivars

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Speaker 2: called Aciphala, of which collared greens are also a member.

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Speaker 2: But culturally speaking, we're going to have to do a

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Speaker 2: whole other episode on collars or like food culturally, not

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Speaker 2: hortic culturally anyway, Kale leaves are commonly deep green or

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Speaker 2: purple or a little bit of both, and sort of

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Speaker 2: ruffled or dimpled, and they grow loose off of kale's

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Speaker 2: stalks rather than like in a head like many cabbages

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Speaker 2: tend to do. Botanists think that kales are closer to

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Speaker 2: Brasco's wild cabbage roots than other cultivars because of this,

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Speaker 2: and they're so easy to garden, like, they don't need

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Speaker 2: to be heavily developed as some of these other things

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Speaker 2: have had to had done to them.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and yes, and actually that is kind of important

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Speaker 1: to cale's whole history, which you will be talking about.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, in general, if you have not had kale,

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Speaker 2: or if you need a reminder. Perhaps The flavor profile

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Speaker 2: of kale is sort of green, grassy, peppery, bitter, sweet, pungent,

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Speaker 2: and it tends to be sturdier and less tender than

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Speaker 2: lettuces and even many cabbages. But there are so many

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Speaker 2: kinds of kale yes, and depending on how you cook

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Speaker 2: the different kinds, it can be crisp, sort of chewy,

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Speaker 2: sort of tender, or even sort of silky, with varying

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Speaker 2: ratios of bitter to sweet.

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Speaker 1: Involved. Yeah, I have a friend and she likes to

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Speaker 1: fight me about my love of kale.

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Speaker 2: Uh huh, Okay.

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Speaker 1: She's convinced I'm just on some kind of trend and

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Speaker 1: that I'm not seeing things clearly. Oh goodness. She's always.

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Speaker 1: One of her arguments is always you could just eat

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Speaker 1: real maine.

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Speaker 2: It's totally different.

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Speaker 1: I can't where you're not connecting in this argument. No,

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Speaker 1: it's just missing each other. Yeah, she always does it

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Speaker 1: every time.

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Speaker 2: Okay, you can't cook romain lettuce it no, di tast

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Speaker 2: is completely different.

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Speaker 1: They do. Okay, I feel like I'm having the like

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Speaker 1: the emotion is rising as I'm thinking about it. When

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Speaker 1: it comes to variety. Kale does have you covered with

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Speaker 1: over fifty types.

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Speaker 2: So like, yeah, there's a kale for that. You've got

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Speaker 2: classic curly kale, great for cooking or even raw if

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Speaker 2: you rub it down with some salt and citrus juice.

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Speaker 2: Dinosaur kale, which is more tender and good for pretty

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Speaker 2: much everything. Red Russian, which is sweet and tender and

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Speaker 2: good for salads. Siberian, which is perfect for a saute.

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Speaker 2: In addition to purples and greens, kale comes in reds, whites,

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Speaker 2: and pinks. There are varieties used more for ornamentation than

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Speaker 2: for food, but which are still edible, like salad savoy,

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Speaker 2: which grows these bruise of pink or white leaves, and

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Speaker 2: red bore, which goes stunningly violet in cool weather, like

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Speaker 2: like you're turning violet, violet, violet.

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Speaker 1: It's the color cheeks. So how that works, I don't

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Speaker 1: remember anymore. I'm not sure. Dinosaur kale is my favorite

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Speaker 1: kale by the way, but I haven't tried a lot

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Speaker 1: of these, so there's a whole kale world though.

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Speaker 2: No. Yeah, I do love a dinosaur kale as well,

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Speaker 2: partially because it's called dinosaur kice, I know, and it

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Speaker 2: just makes me happy. And Okay, y'all, I have a

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Speaker 2: huge problem with the term superfood.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Usually it's just marketing, some kind of like wu involved

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Speaker 2: promised false promise that this one weird food will fix

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Speaker 2: all your problems. Yeah, and that's not how food works. Nope,

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Speaker 2: it's not how your body works. However, it is true.

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Speaker 2: Kale's pretty good for you.

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Speaker 1: Yep.

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Speaker 2: It's nutrient dense. One cup contains more than your recommended

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Speaker 2: daily values of vitamin C, A, and K, plus a

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Speaker 2: whole bunch of others and a lot of minerals like

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Speaker 2: calcium and iron. It carries a little bit of oils

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Speaker 2: that are the good fats of Mega threes and about

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Speaker 2: two to three grams of protein. Its carbs are complex

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Speaker 2: and fibery. It won't spike your blood sugar, so if

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Speaker 2: you're trying to fill yourself up without resorting to starches

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Speaker 2: and for cheap, kale is great, especially for folks who

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Speaker 2: don't eat meat. Please do note that this all depends

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Speaker 2: on how you're cooking your care like, really oil heavy

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Speaker 2: things like kale chips, although delicious, do carry a heavy

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Speaker 2: chloric load from all that fat and should still be

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Speaker 2: considered treats. I mean, like, yes, they're better than French fries,

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Speaker 2: but they're not better than steaming or braising or sauteang

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Speaker 2: your kale. Right, and as always, friends, beware of claims

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Speaker 2: that a food will cure cancer or prevent heart disease

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Speaker 2: or anything huge like that, because our bodies are complicated. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: and preliminary studies have indicated that eating kale could help

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Speaker 2: lower your cholesterol and your risk for cataracts and some cancers,

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Speaker 2: but it can also interfere with blood thinning medications and

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Speaker 2: cause cloths. So don't treat it like a medicine without

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Speaker 2: supervision from a doctor. You know. If you like it,

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Speaker 2: incorporate it into your overall diet. Yeah, yeah, but don't

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Speaker 2: don't freak out about it. No, speaking of freakouts.

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Speaker 1: Yes, yes.

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Speaker 2: As of twenty sixteen, retail sales of kale in the

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Speaker 2: United States were worth more than one hundred and sixty

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Speaker 2: five million dollars and accounted for zero point three percent

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Speaker 2: of all produce sales, which sounds small.

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Speaker 1: But is it pretty substantial.

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Speaker 2: It's substantial for a single item, Yes, it is.

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Speaker 1: And we've got to talk about peak koe Oh goodness, yes,

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Speaker 1: we do. Yes, kale exploded with popularity in the two thousands.

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Speaker 1: It went from the sad, wilted garnish to the it

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Speaker 1: that Oh yeah. From two thousand and eight to twenty thirteen,

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Speaker 1: restaurant menus with some sort of kale eed an item

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Speaker 1: on them increased by four one hundred percent. What Yeah

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Speaker 1: bona petite magazine named twenty twelve the Year of cal

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Speaker 1: In twenty thirteen, kale gets its own National Kale Day

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Speaker 1: annually on October second. It kind of became this symbol

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Speaker 1: of hipsters of a healthy and eco friendly living. There

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Speaker 1: is a legal battle ongoing with the creator of those

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Speaker 1: eat more Kale shirts and chick fil ags.

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Speaker 2: Oh oh, eat more chicken, eat more kalee I See you.

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Speaker 1: Twenty thirteen Slash twenty fourteen was the height of peak kale,

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Speaker 1: fueled in part by a shortage in New York City

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Speaker 1: due to a blizzard. Oh yeah, and this, this and

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Speaker 1: a lot of things remind me of cauliflower. In our

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Speaker 1: Cauliflower episode, cauliflower also experienced a huge bump when there

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Speaker 1: was a shortage in New York City, specifically, so it

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Speaker 1: must be a thing.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: With all of this trending and rise of popularity is

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Speaker 1: come a see of kale products, some strangers than others,

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Speaker 1: and some non food ones Okay kale chips, kale salads,

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Speaker 1: kale smoothies, kale beauty products, gold dipped kale necklaces, what

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Speaker 1: kale cocktails, kale brownies, kale dips for your kale chips,

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Speaker 1: kale ice cream, kale soda, kel themed restaurants, shirts with

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Speaker 1: kale puns, kale everywhere.

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Speaker 2: The trend raised the demand for kale, and therefore the

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Speaker 2: price of kale has risen. It rose, for example, twenty

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Speaker 2: five percent between twenty eleven and twenty fourteen, and since

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Speaker 2: kale is fairly inexpensive to start with, that's really only

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Speaker 2: a twenty two cents per bunch increase eighty eight cents

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Speaker 2: to a buck ten. But it's certainly enough to make

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Speaker 2: kale less accessible to the people who were using it

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Speaker 2: for sustenance before the trend happened, especially low income families,

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Speaker 2: and occasional local shortages have doubled prices from time to time.

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Speaker 2: As Any was saying about New York stuff like that,

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Speaker 2: and this kind of falls in line with my problem

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Speaker 2: of labeling things super foods and has raised criticism also

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Speaker 2: from people who are not me. Yes, and oh man,

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Speaker 2: I want to do a whole episode on food trends

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Speaker 2: and superfoods and etc. Yeah, I'm giving us more homework. Now,

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Speaker 2: It's official, okay, perfect. I will say not to sound

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Speaker 2: too hipster about it. I was ahead of the trend.

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Speaker 1: I see something in the grocery store, and I go

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Speaker 1: to very basic grocery stores. I'm not going anywhere exciting.

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Speaker 1: If I see something I have never eaten before, I

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Speaker 1: get it.

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Speaker 2: Would try to figure out how to make yeah totally, which.

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Speaker 1: Is always fun because usually when I check out, they

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Speaker 1: don't know what it is either. Yeah. And that's how

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Speaker 1: I discovered kale is. I remember seeing it in store

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Speaker 1: and thinking, what we never had that when I was

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Speaker 1: growing up. And the rest is sister the kalees flows.

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Speaker 1: This explosion of kale popularity was fairly unique to the US.

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Speaker 1: Other countries were on the kale train long before us.

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Speaker 1: In Germany, there's a celebration centered entirely around eating cooked kale.

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Speaker 1: I love that. That's so great.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Germany get it.

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Speaker 1: In Scotland, to kale has long been a staple, important

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Speaker 1: enough one that in the local dialect the word kale

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Speaker 1: translates to food, and if you are off your kale,

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Speaker 1: you might be sick.

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Speaker 2: Ah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, which brings us to the question I have always

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Speaker 1: wondered personally, why was kale virtually non existent in the

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Speaker 1: US until the two thousands? At least I never ran

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Speaker 1: across it before then.

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Speaker 2: I don't think I did either.

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Speaker 1: Yes, well, we have the answer and more, but first

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Speaker 1: a quick break for a word from more sponsor.

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Speaker 2: And we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you.

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Speaker 1: Okay. Because kale is so easy to grow and a

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Speaker 1: true vegetable survivor, hanging on through harsh conditions and cold temperatures,

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Speaker 1: it was probably one of the first vegetables humans cultivated. Yes,

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Speaker 1: probably because we don't know for sure. Yeah, this heartiness,

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Speaker 1: like we alluded to earlier, would later lead to a

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Speaker 1: massive kale slump, But more on this later in the podcast. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Asia minor is most likely where kale got its start.

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Speaker 2: When good question.

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Speaker 1: Ah, we know it arrived in Europe thanks to groups

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Speaker 1: of Celtic wanderers by six hundred BCE. The history suffers

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Speaker 1: from what we hear a food stuff called calieflower syndrome. Ah, No,

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Speaker 1: we don't, but we should. Oh that is to say,

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Speaker 1: the word kale comes from the Scottish word coals or collis,

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Speaker 1: which the Greeks and Romans used to refer to all

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Speaker 1: the average like plants such as cauliflower, collars, and cabbage.

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Speaker 1: Upping the confusion, ancient Roman manuscripts might have used the

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Speaker 1: word brassica to mean all of those things too. Records

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Speaker 1: indicate that the ancient Greeks would boil down kale and

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Speaker 1: other leafy vegetables to eat as a way to cure drunkenness.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and that'll I mean, it'll give you some nutrients. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, depends on how drunk you are, I suppose, but

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Speaker 1: totally disc Varietes wrote in the first century that kale

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Speaker 1: was excellent for the bowels. Yeah. Yeah. The Romans brought

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Speaker 1: it to France and Britain if it wasn't there already

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Speaker 1: under the same coal wart or coal umbrella as cauliflower

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Speaker 1: was under, if you remember from our cauliflower episode. Kale

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Speaker 1: was common throughout Europe and Asia by the Middle Ages,

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Speaker 1: and all kinds of varieties of it too. The Middle

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Speaker 1: Ages was when the English or Scottish started using the

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Speaker 1: word kale to mean dinner. It was that frequent at

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Speaker 1: European meals. Wow. In Asia, caale was less popular when

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Speaker 1: compared to other vegetables in the cabbage family, but it

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Speaker 1: was eaten there. The Colonists bought kale with them to

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Speaker 1: North America in the sixteenth century, but they weren't as

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Speaker 1: excited about it as their European brethren. The first time

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Speaker 1: cale was mentioned in writing was in sixteen sixty nine

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Speaker 1: in North America, though they were most almost certainly kale

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Speaker 1: was almost certainly around before then. Around the same time,

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Speaker 1: Russian traders bought Russian kale to Canada, where it spread

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Speaker 1: into the US.

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Speaker 2: Thomas Jefferson, who uh huh, grew the Italian dinosaur kale

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Speaker 2: also called tuscan or Lassonato kale in his garden in Monticello.

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Speaker 1: Hmm. Caale hummed along until World War Two, when it

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Speaker 1: was included in the UK's Dig for Victory a campaign.

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Speaker 2: Ah, Dig for Victory.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, this was a campaign by the UK government to

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Speaker 1: encourage gardeners to grow certain things relevant to this episode kale.

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Speaker 1: Because of that heartiness you mentioned, kale was often grown

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Speaker 1: and eaten during tough times, whether on national levels or

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Speaker 1: on a personal level. For those struggling with poverty, and

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Speaker 1: this meant that after World War Two, folks were pretty

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Speaker 1: tired of kale. And on top of that, it had

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Speaker 1: an association with poor people, not just in the US

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Speaker 1: either in European countries. It was associated with the hunger

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Speaker 1: and deprivation of World War Two, and it never really

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Speaker 1: fully recovered.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, in France today, to the state, it's still just

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Speaker 2: like why would you eat tho?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? Why are Americans so excited about kale? Yeah, it's

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Speaker 1: kind of an I roll situation. Yeah, not true. In

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Speaker 1: the US, it took some time, though. It was relegated

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Speaker 1: to Garnish for a long time. You might be surprised

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Speaker 1: how long. The La Times published a poem sent in

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Speaker 1: by a reader about kale in nineteen ninety six. It

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Speaker 1: was called in Praise of Kale, and the author perhaps

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Speaker 1: foresaw the coming meteoric rise of the vegetable, although it

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Speaker 1: would take more than a decade and a lot of celebrity.

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Speaker 2: Juice juice Is that a pun for chuicing?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? Juice, Yes, thank you. According to a Blue Apron blog,

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Speaker 1: when kale appeared in some CSA boxes in two thousand

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Speaker 1: and seven, which is basically when you get boxes of

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Speaker 1: like locally grown, yeah, vegetable produced. Can it can include

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Speaker 1: meat and eggs and stuff, but you know, yeah, I

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Speaker 1: was part of one for a while and I loved it.

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Speaker 1: People didn't know what the kale was and these boxes

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Speaker 1: was or what the kale was.

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Speaker 2: I like that what the kale?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? Or what to do with it? That people were

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Speaker 1: posting online? What is this thing? How do I cook it?

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Speaker 1: The following year, A Whole Living gave kale that elusive

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Speaker 1: title of super food. In two thousand and nine, Martha

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Speaker 1: Stewart published a kale slaw recipe. The Vegetarian Times published

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Speaker 1: a recipe for something very similar to kale chips in

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Speaker 1: twenty ten, and that same year, The New York Times

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Speaker 1: published a recipe for a kale salad. And this brings

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Speaker 1: us to the big one, Yeah, kales, big break. In

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Speaker 1: twenty eleven, Gwyneth Paltrow made kale chips on Ellen and

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Speaker 1: history was made. The first thing is the kale chips,

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Speaker 1: which I just wanted to show you. There takes so

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Speaker 1: it's so quick, and kids, they turn into like potato chips,

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Speaker 1: but their kale, and your kids will eat them and

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Speaker 1: you will be so psyched it's very silly. It is,

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Speaker 1: I mean, quite silly delicious.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, useful, inexpensive.

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Speaker 1: Yep, silly, silly, quite silly.

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Speaker 2: The trend is silly, not kale, and kale is relatively neutral.

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Speaker 1: We weren't insulting kale.

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Speaker 2: Just now, yeah, not today anyway. No, and we have

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Speaker 2: a few science notes for you, but first we have

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Speaker 2: one more quick break for a word from our sponsor,

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Speaker 2: and we're back.

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Speaker 1: Thank you, sponsor, Yes.

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Speaker 2: Thank you. So there is some science behind getting the

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Speaker 2: most out of kale in your cooking. It's one of

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Speaker 2: those vegetables that will undergo some chemistry in your mouth

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Speaker 2: if you let it. A part of kale's characteristic bitter, sweet,

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Speaker 2: and and pungent flavor comes from these sulfur compounds called

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Speaker 2: isothiocyanates that do not exist in kale leaves when they're

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Speaker 2: just hanging out mind in their own kale business. It's

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Speaker 2: formed when you chop, chew, or massage kale, and yes,

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Speaker 2: kale massaging is a part of many recipes. It's that

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Speaker 2: rubbing with salt and citrus juice thing I often do.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, yeah, so when you chop or chew or

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Speaker 2: a massage, you disrupt the structure of kales cell walls

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Speaker 2: and let these two sprint compounds form up into those isothiocyanates.

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Speaker 2: That the two compounds being an enzyme and some some

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Speaker 2: sulfuric compounds. If you blanch kale leaves whole or even

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Speaker 2: to soak them in hot water, you will deactivate some

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Speaker 2: of that enzyme that's involved, so less of the isothiocyanates

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Speaker 2: will form and your kale will be less bitter. So

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Speaker 2: if you're not looking for that for that better kick,

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Speaker 2: then then do that that blanching or that hot water soak.

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00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:29,040
Speaker 1: Uh.

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00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:31,480
Speaker 2: But if you like it, then dump.

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00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:34,880
Speaker 1: Don't do as you will, do as you will.

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00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:39,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, she'll be the whole of the kale law. And

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00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:41,080
Speaker 2: if you're if you're dealing with a type of kale

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00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:44,719
Speaker 2: that calls for being massaged in order to make it

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00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:48,960
Speaker 2: tender enough to eat raw, but you still want it

438
00:25:49,000 --> 00:25:51,560
Speaker 2: to be on the mild or sweet end instead of bitter,

439
00:25:52,119 --> 00:25:53,320
Speaker 2: sprinse it after you chop it.

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00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:56,120
Speaker 1: Eh. Yeah, as simple as that.

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00:25:56,400 --> 00:26:00,199
Speaker 2: Yeah. Oh, and hey, if you're wondering why kale and

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00:26:00,280 --> 00:26:02,880
Speaker 2: other leafy greens shrink so much when you cook them

443
00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:05,040
Speaker 2: or wilt when you leave them, out on the counter.

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00:26:05,880 --> 00:26:09,560
Speaker 2: That's because of a loss of water in the plants cells.

445
00:26:10,119 --> 00:26:13,399
Speaker 2: When leafy vegetables are growing or kept in water or

446
00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:17,439
Speaker 2: kept cool enough, water will fill the plant cells and

447
00:26:17,480 --> 00:26:22,360
Speaker 2: the pressure inside will keep each cell taut. But when

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00:26:22,400 --> 00:26:25,000
Speaker 2: you cook greens, the cell walls break and the moisture escapes,

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00:26:25,000 --> 00:26:28,919
Speaker 2: and on the counter it will eventually evaporate out. No,

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00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:34,399
Speaker 2: that's why if you're looking for really crisp vegetable you can.

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00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:36,800
Speaker 2: You can stick it in like a vase of water,

452
00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:40,840
Speaker 2: as you would cut flowers before you serve it. Stick

453
00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:42,560
Speaker 2: it in the fridge in a vase of water. Oh,

454
00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:44,040
Speaker 2: it'll crisp right up.

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00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:48,040
Speaker 1: I'll keep that in mind. Yeah, little kale laws.

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00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:51,320
Speaker 2: Oh, and shout out to the excellent book Cooks Science

457
00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:54,240
Speaker 2: from the folks that Cooks Illustrated for some of those

458
00:26:54,280 --> 00:26:56,479
Speaker 2: science notes they do. They do really good stuff.

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00:26:56,960 --> 00:27:00,960
Speaker 1: I like them. I wish I had rewatched the kale

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00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:03,760
Speaker 1: video we made before doing this, because I remember there's

461
00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:06,679
Speaker 1: a note in there about how if you something, if

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00:27:06,680 --> 00:27:12,359
Speaker 1: you cook kale with fat, it helps your body better.

463
00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:16,600
Speaker 1: And so Kristen and Benn's recommendation was to cook it

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00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:17,240
Speaker 1: with bacon.

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00:27:17,640 --> 00:27:20,320
Speaker 2: Oh, clearly, I mean, that's that's how we cook. That's

466
00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:22,320
Speaker 2: how we cook halee in my house. We like saw

467
00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:25,520
Speaker 2: taste and bacon and then use some of the bacon

468
00:27:25,560 --> 00:27:28,160
Speaker 2: fat to just put the kale right on top of Yeah,

469
00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:29,080
Speaker 2: cook it down.

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00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:32,720
Speaker 1: My goodness, I'm hungry. Oh, my goodness.

471
00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:35,720
Speaker 2: Add some mushrooms in there too, so delicious.

472
00:27:36,040 --> 00:27:40,639
Speaker 1: You gotta stop, Lauren, Okay, I think we need to

473
00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:42,159
Speaker 1: end this episode.

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00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:45,200
Speaker 2: Now, go go make some kale.

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00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:50,800
Speaker 1: Okay. And that brings us to the end of this

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00:27:50,840 --> 00:27:53,640
Speaker 1: classic episode. We hope that you enjoyed it as much

477
00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:56,919
Speaker 1: as we loved bringing it back to you doing it

478
00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:59,440
Speaker 1: in the first place. I have a lot of memories

479
00:27:59,480 --> 00:28:03,840
Speaker 1: associated with this that I shared in the episode, many

480
00:28:03,840 --> 00:28:07,400
Speaker 1: of them. But yes, we would love to hear if

481
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:09,199
Speaker 1: you have been to a kale festival, if you have

482
00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:12,600
Speaker 1: kale recipes, Thoughts on kale.

483
00:28:12,400 --> 00:28:16,840
Speaker 2: At all, Thoughts on pizza hut sure, I don't know.

484
00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:20,879
Speaker 1: Oh, Lauren, don't get me started. But apparently there's a

485
00:28:20,920 --> 00:28:24,320
Speaker 1: new trend where they're doing like retro classic pizza huts

486
00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:28,600
Speaker 1: and they're bringing back the pizza huts of like the nineties,

487
00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:33,720
Speaker 1: Like yes, and I'm somebody had a picture and it

488
00:28:33,920 --> 00:28:39,560
Speaker 1: had the kale all along. Oh yes, the little buffet thing.

489
00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:46,080
Speaker 2: Yeah all right, yeah, it's like the tastiest, greasiest cardboard

490
00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:48,040
Speaker 2: you can possibly eat. Maybe it's time for a Pizza

491
00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:48,920
Speaker 2: Hut episode, you know.

492
00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:53,360
Speaker 1: And then we could talk about how they gave away

493
00:28:53,400 --> 00:29:01,880
Speaker 1: the free PlayStation demos. Yes, all right, I'm in. You

494
00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:07,640
Speaker 1: didn't have to sell me that hard. Wow. In the meantime, listeners,

495
00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:11,000
Speaker 1: please contact us about any of these things we've discussed.

496
00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:15,800
Speaker 1: You can email us at hello, atsabrepod dot com. We're

497
00:29:15,840 --> 00:29:16,920
Speaker 1: also on social media.

498
00:29:17,000 --> 00:29:19,880
Speaker 2: You can find us on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram at

499
00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:21,840
Speaker 2: saber pod, and we do hope to hear from you.

500
00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:25,160
Speaker 2: Sabre is production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from my

501
00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:28,600
Speaker 2: Heart Radio, you can visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

502
00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:31,400
Speaker 2: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Thanks as

503
00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:34,320
Speaker 2: always to our super producers Dylan Fagan and Andrew Howard.

504
00:29:34,560 --> 00:29:36,280
Speaker 2: Thanks to you for listening, and we hope that lots

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00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:45,960
Speaker 2: more good things are coming your way.