WEBVTT - Was Slavery Bad? 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:02.800 Native Lampod is a production of iHeartRadio in partnership with 0:00:02.840 --> 0:00:04.000 Resent Choice Media. 0:00:04.080 --> 0:00:07.560 Welcome Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome. 0:00:06.920 --> 0:00:09.960 Welcome home, y'all's Episode ninety three of Native Lamb Pod. 0:00:10.240 --> 0:00:14.480 I am your host, uh here with my co host y'all. 0:00:14.520 --> 0:00:17.240 Like when I say that, people I know, I'd. 0:00:17.079 --> 0:00:20.680 Be like, I am your host here with my subjects. 0:00:20.120 --> 0:00:21.919 And ain't nobody coming to see you? 0:00:21.960 --> 0:00:24.960 Otis we're just gonna talk to you. 0:00:25.360 --> 0:00:27.200 Mean to say it like that, we are your three 0:00:27.240 --> 0:00:28.840 co hosts. That's probably a better way to say it. 0:00:28.880 --> 0:00:31.480 We are your three co hosts, Tiffany Cross, Angela Rii, 0:00:31.600 --> 0:00:33.639 and Andrew Gillham. I also feel like we always put 0:00:33.680 --> 0:00:34.040 you last. 0:00:34.040 --> 0:00:34.320 Andrew. 0:00:34.320 --> 0:00:37.280 I don't mean to come mind men, you know boys, Okay, 0:00:37.400 --> 0:00:42.920 all right, me and here chivalry fivlry exactly. Okay. We 0:00:43.000 --> 0:00:44.479 had a lot to get to. What's a lot happening? 0:00:44.520 --> 0:00:45.920 So what are we talking about? 0:00:47.040 --> 0:00:50.000 Well, one, we got a spectacular guest today who I 0:00:50.040 --> 0:00:52.479 am very very excited that we'll get a chance to 0:00:52.520 --> 0:00:56.280 talk to. She is really all knowing, all being everywhere 0:00:56.400 --> 0:01:00.560 on all things. And that's that's you. 0:01:00.640 --> 0:01:03.720 Yeah, No, I said, I'm talking about you. 0:01:03.720 --> 0:01:08.919 Said, all being all knowing, I'm like, everywhere I hear that. Okay, 0:01:10.760 --> 0:01:14.080 what you got, Angela, I got the same. I got 0:01:14.120 --> 0:01:16.240 democracy on the line, and I want to talk about it. 0:01:16.280 --> 0:01:19.880 We also are talking about uh, Donald Trump even going 0:01:19.920 --> 0:01:22.080 at the museums. We've heard about this for some time. 0:01:22.959 --> 0:01:25.200 He's saying, you know why we all got to focus 0:01:25.240 --> 0:01:27.880 on slavery, and sadly there was a black show with 0:01:27.920 --> 0:01:30.800 a black show host that allowed a guest to challenge 0:01:30.840 --> 0:01:32.440 this very same thing. So we're gonna get into all 0:01:32.440 --> 0:01:33.880 that today. What slavery bad? 0:01:35.560 --> 0:01:40.080 We are unfiltered on Native Lampard and I'm honestly chomping 0:01:40.120 --> 0:01:43.280 at the bit to get into all of this. So 0:01:43.360 --> 0:01:47.960 let's get into it. I'm so excited to bring on 0:01:48.000 --> 0:01:51.000 this next guest. Angelo texted our group chat last night 0:01:51.080 --> 0:01:53.760 that she had texted Madame Chryln Eiffel to join us, 0:01:53.800 --> 0:01:56.320 and I was so thrilled that she was available to 0:01:56.400 --> 0:01:58.200 join us. So let me tell you a little bit. 0:01:58.240 --> 0:01:59.920 If you've been living under a rock and don't know. 0:02:00.720 --> 0:02:04.760 Miss CHERYLN. Eifel is a civil rights lawyer, a founding 0:02:04.800 --> 0:02:08.200 director of the Fourteenth Amendment Center for Law and Democracy 0:02:08.280 --> 0:02:11.200 at the Howard University School of Law. She most recently 0:02:11.240 --> 0:02:14.560 before that position set at the helm of the NAACP 0:02:14.880 --> 0:02:18.520 LDF and has a long list of accolades that we 0:02:18.560 --> 0:02:22.360 could exhaust the airwaves with. But I'm just thrilled to 0:02:22.360 --> 0:02:24.800 have her here. I was honored to be there actually 0:02:24.800 --> 0:02:27.920 when she commenced the opening of the Fourteenth Amendment for 0:02:27.960 --> 0:02:31.240 the Center of Law and Democracy at HU. For all 0:02:31.320 --> 0:02:34.480 you Howard people out there listening, so very thrilled to 0:02:34.520 --> 0:02:36.920 welcome you to Native Lampa. Welcome home. 0:02:37.880 --> 0:02:40.280 Thank you so much. I'm really thrilled to be with 0:02:40.320 --> 0:02:42.399 you all in Tiffany. I don't feel like I had 0:02:42.400 --> 0:02:44.320 the chance to really thank you for being there. Meant 0:02:44.360 --> 0:02:47.200 a lot to me that you were there for the 0:02:47.240 --> 0:02:50.919 opening of the new Fourteenth Amendment Center at Howard Law School. 0:02:52.040 --> 0:02:53.640 I was thrilled to be there and thank you for 0:02:53.680 --> 0:02:56.560 the invite. I came all the way to see you, 0:02:56.680 --> 0:02:59.240 and I was double booked. I had a business dinner 0:02:59.280 --> 0:03:01.600 back down town. So I was there and I was 0:03:01.639 --> 0:03:04.600 trying to slip out, and as I was walking down 0:03:04.680 --> 0:03:08.560 the stairs, you started talking about Elaine Arkansas, and I 0:03:08.639 --> 0:03:10.800 turned around and took those stairs too at a time 0:03:10.880 --> 0:03:12.720 because I did not want to miss what you had 0:03:12.760 --> 0:03:16.440 to say about the slaughter that happened to black folks there, 0:03:16.480 --> 0:03:19.320 which is very on theme with what we're talking about. 0:03:19.680 --> 0:03:23.160 I told these guys, I told Angela and Andrew. I don't 0:03:23.160 --> 0:03:25.880 remember what you were talking about, but you were saying 0:03:25.960 --> 0:03:30.360 something about a precedent that you had not been taught 0:03:30.840 --> 0:03:33.600 in law school. And you said, I mean, it's a 0:03:33.600 --> 0:03:36.040 lot of lawyers here where any of you guys taught this. 0:03:36.120 --> 0:03:39.440 And this huge section of people started clapping and you 0:03:39.480 --> 0:03:41.560 started laughing, and you said, those are all of my 0:03:41.680 --> 0:03:45.000 students because they had learned this important precedent from you. 0:03:45.120 --> 0:03:47.000 So it just speaks to the leader that you have 0:03:47.160 --> 0:03:50.080 always been. So we're thrilled to have you. And we 0:03:50.080 --> 0:03:51.880 were talking in our group chat. I want to let 0:03:51.920 --> 0:03:54.880 you know I didn't know I'm an attorney too. Angela's 0:03:54.880 --> 0:03:58.240 our resident attorney. But our friend Aaron Haynes said, listen, 0:03:58.360 --> 0:04:01.280 if you watch Law and Order, then you have a 0:04:01.280 --> 0:04:04.200 fair amount of wisdom. So I'm going to call myself 0:04:04.200 --> 0:04:06.600 an attorney, but I will lay three. 0:04:06.480 --> 0:04:09.200 Years of school years of service. 0:04:09.280 --> 0:04:12.080 They actually have something. They have something for this. It's 0:04:12.120 --> 0:04:14.960 called the unauthorized practice of the law, and I think that. 0:04:19.279 --> 0:04:23.400 I yield the florid to the actual attorney Alo and 0:04:23.480 --> 0:04:24.640 I will listen and learn. 0:04:25.320 --> 0:04:28.840 Oh Man, well, you know how much we love you, Shrilyn. 0:04:28.960 --> 0:04:31.400 I was sharing with the team earlier. We have a 0:04:31.440 --> 0:04:34.880 gazillion stories about moments with you where you have set 0:04:34.920 --> 0:04:37.159 the tone and have been very clear. And I was 0:04:37.200 --> 0:04:40.039 reflecting on our time in Baltimore for the State of 0:04:40.040 --> 0:04:43.360 the People National Assembly, where you really were giving us 0:04:43.360 --> 0:04:46.320 a very clear indication of where we are as a democracy. 0:04:46.680 --> 0:04:48.760 And I would love for you to talk about where 0:04:48.760 --> 0:04:51.719 you think we are now. We're seeing the Smithsonian takeover, 0:04:51.880 --> 0:04:55.320 We're seeing the National Guard coming in from other states 0:04:55.360 --> 0:04:58.919 into d C to harass our children. We're of course 0:04:58.920 --> 0:05:03.520 seeing this crazy situation unfold in Texas with redistricting. I'd 0:05:03.600 --> 0:05:06.320 love to know if you were giving democracy a grade 0:05:06.400 --> 0:05:08.320 right now in the United States, what would it be. 0:05:09.520 --> 0:05:11.920 Oh, We're at a D, for sure, We're at a D. 0:05:12.800 --> 0:05:13.400 We are. 0:05:14.960 --> 0:05:19.119 Really right now fighting over the remnants. We're fighting over 0:05:20.000 --> 0:05:23.280 maintaining the found enough of the foundations that we could 0:05:23.320 --> 0:05:25.520 build something new on. I mean, I mean those of 0:05:25.560 --> 0:05:28.720 us who care about democracy, who want a different country. 0:05:29.080 --> 0:05:32.120 I have one of the reasons I wanted to start 0:05:32.120 --> 0:05:34.400 this Fourteenth Amendment Center was because I want to be 0:05:34.480 --> 0:05:38.560 in the twenty four to seven work of thinking through, strategizing, 0:05:38.640 --> 0:05:43.159 and preparing for the building of a new American democracy. 0:05:43.920 --> 0:05:48.160 And but but to build it, I recognize you need 0:05:48.240 --> 0:05:50.800 some of the stuff. You need some things in the 0:05:50.800 --> 0:05:56.599 foundation that you can build on. And we're getting perilously 0:05:56.640 --> 0:06:00.520 low on the on the integrity of the foundations that 0:06:00.560 --> 0:06:03.520 we would rebuild on. If we were to have a 0:06:03.600 --> 0:06:07.719 chance to rebuild. Will we have a chance to rebuild? 0:06:08.720 --> 0:06:11.760 There's no guarantees there, and it's a ways off. And 0:06:11.800 --> 0:06:14.159 so the process that we're in right now has to 0:06:14.200 --> 0:06:17.240 be one in which we are ever thinking towards the 0:06:17.279 --> 0:06:21.560 future and we're also thinking about our survival. A key 0:06:21.640 --> 0:06:24.680 piece is how do we survive this period with our 0:06:24.680 --> 0:06:31.040 integrity intact, our dignity intact, our families intact, and our 0:06:31.080 --> 0:06:37.000 communities intact, because that's who we are on this continent 0:06:37.080 --> 0:06:38.840 we are We're always trying to figure out how we 0:06:38.880 --> 0:06:41.200 survived this thing and make it to the next thing. Now, 0:06:41.360 --> 0:06:44.440 we want to thrive, for sure, but I want to 0:06:44.480 --> 0:06:49.719 be very clear that the opportunities for that will be 0:06:49.920 --> 0:06:53.839 very narrow in the coming years for a broad set 0:06:53.880 --> 0:06:58.880 of people. And that means it is incumbent on those 0:06:58.920 --> 0:07:04.120 of us who have been beneficiaries of the sacrifices that 0:07:04.120 --> 0:07:09.360 were made early on among our ancestors, to take up 0:07:10.480 --> 0:07:14.280 our obligation to do the same for those that come 0:07:14.320 --> 0:07:18.040 after us. But right now, you know, democracies are made 0:07:18.080 --> 0:07:22.560 up of citizens of people, but also critically made up 0:07:22.560 --> 0:07:27.760 of institutions that hold democracy together. And the worst of 0:07:27.800 --> 0:07:31.600 this moment, it's not that forty percent, maybe forty five 0:07:31.640 --> 0:07:39.440 percent of Americans are fully okay with an authoritarian takeover 0:07:39.520 --> 0:07:43.040 of our country, and maybe another ten percent are prepared 0:07:43.120 --> 0:07:47.720 to just watch an authoritarian takeover of our country. That's bad. 0:07:48.680 --> 0:07:53.920 But what will make this democracy completely crumble if it does, 0:07:55.080 --> 0:08:03.240 is the absolute collapse of democratic institute. What are democratic institutions, Well, 0:08:04.080 --> 0:08:06.200 there's no healthy democracy you can point to in the 0:08:06.240 --> 0:08:09.880 world that doesn't have a strong and free and independent media, 0:08:11.000 --> 0:08:15.680 that doesn't have a strong, free and independent civil service, 0:08:16.560 --> 0:08:20.600 that doesn't have a strong, free and independent university system, 0:08:21.520 --> 0:08:26.640 that doesn't have a strong business community that functions with integrity, 0:08:27.880 --> 0:08:33.920 that doesn't have a legal system that upholds the rule 0:08:33.960 --> 0:08:37.080 of law, and in which legal professionals are held to 0:08:38.160 --> 0:08:42.000 a high standard of performance. There's no healthy democracy in 0:08:42.040 --> 0:08:44.959 the world that doesn't have a strong and independent court system. 0:08:46.200 --> 0:08:48.320 And if you tick off those lists for all of 0:08:48.400 --> 0:08:53.120 us right now, every single one of the core institutions 0:08:53.160 --> 0:08:57.520 of democracy in this country has failed. And that, more 0:08:57.559 --> 0:09:01.520 than anything else, is why we are where we are today. 0:09:02.720 --> 0:09:05.640 Systems of government are not just about who gets elected 0:09:05.679 --> 0:09:09.400 in one election. It's a system. It sustains itself over 0:09:09.480 --> 0:09:15.040 multiple elections. And no one person, no one person, especially 0:09:15.080 --> 0:09:19.360 a person of Donald Trump's caliber, who, for all his bluster, 0:09:19.520 --> 0:09:22.880 didn't know shit from Shinola about politics before twenty sixteen. 0:09:24.080 --> 0:09:27.880 He knew about manipulation, he knew about narrative, he knew 0:09:27.880 --> 0:09:31.720 about image making, he knew about white supremacy and how 0:09:31.760 --> 0:09:34.120 to appeal to it, but he did know shit from 0:09:34.120 --> 0:09:39.800 Shinola about politics and government. No one person with that 0:09:42.360 --> 0:09:47.600 diminished knowledge can come in and hijack the most powerful 0:09:47.640 --> 0:09:51.880 and wealthy democracy in the world unless it is already 0:09:52.080 --> 0:09:55.920 in trouble. And that's writing this book now called Is 0:09:55.960 --> 0:09:57.760 This America? And that's what the book is about. It's 0:09:57.760 --> 0:10:01.960 about why we were already in trouble. And you all 0:10:02.000 --> 0:10:03.960 know this, you know, because it's all the people who 0:10:03.960 --> 0:10:06.920 think the world was perfect when Obama was president or 0:10:06.920 --> 0:10:11.200 Clinton was president or Biden was president, you know. And 0:10:11.240 --> 0:10:13.280 I've been a civil rights lawyer for thirty five years, 0:10:13.320 --> 0:10:16.760 never been out of work. It has not been perfect, 0:10:18.200 --> 0:10:21.120 but we had institutions attempting to hold the line. And 0:10:21.160 --> 0:10:24.640 now we have seen the biggest and most wealthy law 0:10:24.640 --> 0:10:27.440 firms in the world collapse. We've seen the biggest and 0:10:27.559 --> 0:10:34.320 most revered universities collapse. We've seen the media just utterly 0:10:34.520 --> 0:10:39.920 freaking collapse. And you can't save a democracy, and you 0:10:39.960 --> 0:10:44.120 can't have democracy unless you have an institutional structure to 0:10:44.200 --> 0:10:44.680 uphold it. 0:10:45.559 --> 0:10:47.280 All right, guys, don't go anywhere. We got to pay 0:10:47.320 --> 0:10:49.280 some bills. But on the other side of this break, 0:10:49.640 --> 0:10:54.160 we're getting right back to it. 0:11:04.280 --> 0:11:07.719 That's powerful. That's extremely powerful and sobering. 0:11:07.880 --> 0:11:12.439 And I didn't expect anything otherwise from you, Sherilyn. Your 0:11:12.520 --> 0:11:17.080 comments drawed of mind two thoughts. One, how very very 0:11:17.120 --> 0:11:20.680 fragile democracies are. There's no wonder why so many societies 0:11:20.800 --> 0:11:26.440 choose autocrats, monarchies, a strong man as leaders, because for 0:11:26.480 --> 0:11:29.160 the average person is the easier route. They don't have 0:11:29.240 --> 0:11:32.679 to work to maintain it. It does rest on an individual, 0:11:32.880 --> 0:11:38.200 a set of individuals, a family, But in this case 0:11:38.720 --> 0:11:42.640 the fragility is like front and center. But the second 0:11:42.679 --> 0:11:45.080 thing you made me think about, which was actually the 0:11:45.080 --> 0:11:48.680 first thing, was something we all know well, which is 0:11:48.720 --> 0:11:51.720 you never let a good crisis go to waste. And 0:11:51.840 --> 0:11:56.320 when you began talking about envisioning and dreaming, me about 0:11:56.320 --> 0:11:59.720 what you build on top of when things are lost? 0:12:00.080 --> 0:12:02.880 All is lost in the slate is almost cleared. There 0:12:02.920 --> 0:12:07.520 are some founding and important building blocks. But when you 0:12:07.559 --> 0:12:10.120 start to stay think about what it looks like to 0:12:10.120 --> 0:12:13.360 scale this thing? Are there some imagineive thoughts that you 0:12:13.400 --> 0:12:16.880 feel prepared to share with us around Man, if this system. 0:12:16.559 --> 0:12:21.400 Is leveled, what do we build back? Or what never existed? 0:12:22.000 --> 0:12:25.720 Do we now make some allowance to exist so that 0:12:25.760 --> 0:12:27.240 we can all be on the way to thriving. 0:12:27.520 --> 0:12:29.679 Any thoughts come to mind to you? For I know 0:12:29.760 --> 0:12:30.840 the answer is yes. 0:12:30.760 --> 0:12:33.360 No, Yeah, thoughts are I think about. I'm sorry I 0:12:33.360 --> 0:12:35.199 shouldn't be talking over you. I'm thinking about a lot 0:12:35.200 --> 0:12:37.200 of things. And first of all, Andrew's just wonderful to 0:12:37.200 --> 0:12:39.040 see you again, and I so wish you with the 0:12:39.040 --> 0:12:45.400 Governor of Florida. But amen, But uh, you know, I 0:12:45.440 --> 0:12:48.400 was just writing the first chapter of my book, which 0:12:48.400 --> 0:12:53.160 is about something we lost and that we lost as 0:12:53.200 --> 0:12:55.880 a result. Most of most of the things that we 0:12:56.000 --> 0:12:58.800 lose in this country that are essential to democracy, we 0:12:58.920 --> 0:13:04.480 begin to lose because because of white supremacist ideology. And 0:13:04.880 --> 0:13:08.440 one of the things we lost is our commitment to 0:13:08.679 --> 0:13:11.600 an investment in you know, what we call public goods. 0:13:12.800 --> 0:13:19.480 Public goods are those things and those places that a society, 0:13:19.600 --> 0:13:25.120 a government ensures are in place that the public engages 0:13:25.200 --> 0:13:30.040 with and can enjoy and can access together. And these 0:13:30.080 --> 0:13:36.199 public goods play an incredibly powerful role in helping unify 0:13:36.840 --> 0:13:39.360 people in a democracy and helping them feel they're part 0:13:39.360 --> 0:13:42.199 of the same project, if you know what I mean. So, 0:13:42.280 --> 0:13:45.440 for example, I love the post office. I know that's 0:13:45.520 --> 0:13:49.640 old school, but bear with me. You know, the post 0:13:49.640 --> 0:13:53.000 office is a fundamentally democratic institution. 0:13:53.400 --> 0:13:53.600 Right. 0:13:54.280 --> 0:13:56.679 You put that one stamp on your envelope, and it 0:13:56.720 --> 0:14:00.200 goes to California, it goes to Florida, it goes to 0:14:00.240 --> 0:14:03.320 New York. I put on the same stamp you put on. 0:14:04.040 --> 0:14:06.360 You put on the same stamp Tiffany puts on. Tiffany 0:14:06.360 --> 0:14:09.080 puts on the same stamp Angela puts on, and we 0:14:09.200 --> 0:14:12.840 all can communicate with each other using this service that 0:14:12.960 --> 0:14:15.640 is provided by the government. When you walk into a 0:14:15.679 --> 0:14:20.080 neighbor neighborhood and you see the postal truck park there right, 0:14:20.160 --> 0:14:22.360 you know that's a neighborhood. In fact, we don't even 0:14:22.680 --> 0:14:25.440 see it anymore. It's like air, but it is a 0:14:26.040 --> 0:14:29.160 It's a symbol of something important. It's a symbol that 0:14:29.200 --> 0:14:32.400 the government is there is servicing that area. One of 0:14:32.400 --> 0:14:34.000 the reasons when people say, oh, it all needs to 0:14:34.000 --> 0:14:36.320 be privatized, one of the reasons the post office is 0:14:36.320 --> 0:14:41.040 so important is because even services like FedEx still use 0:14:41.120 --> 0:14:43.440 the post office for what we called the last mile. 0:14:43.560 --> 0:14:46.320 FedEx is not coming up that mountain to deliver nothing. 0:14:47.480 --> 0:14:50.240 What they do is they deliver it to the closest place, 0:14:51.120 --> 0:14:54.880 and the United States Postal Service, which is required to 0:14:55.000 --> 0:14:59.880 serve every home right and every edifice, takes that package 0:15:00.200 --> 0:15:04.160 the last mile. So that means people in rural America 0:15:04.800 --> 0:15:07.080 know that they're going to get their Social Security checks. 0:15:07.360 --> 0:15:09.880 They know they can wait on that letter from their 0:15:10.040 --> 0:15:14.239 child or their grandchild. This is a powerful and important 0:15:14.440 --> 0:15:17.200 service and exists all over the world. If you've ever 0:15:17.200 --> 0:15:20.320 stood in the line several weeks prior to Christmas with 0:15:20.360 --> 0:15:22.920 your packages waiting to mail them out in the post office. 0:15:22.920 --> 0:15:25.360 And you think about the conversations that happen in that line, 0:15:25.480 --> 0:15:28.360 right and all the you know, when is it going 0:15:28.440 --> 0:15:31.000 to arrive, and where's it going and all that stuff. 0:15:31.560 --> 0:15:33.880 All of those are the things that knit us together. 0:15:34.960 --> 0:15:38.200 And the post office is just one example. And we 0:15:38.240 --> 0:15:41.240 should remember that the post office, which was created in 0:15:41.400 --> 0:15:45.200 the seventeen i want to say eighties. Ben Franklin was 0:15:45.200 --> 0:15:48.760 the first postmaster, was one of the earliest places after 0:15:48.960 --> 0:15:52.600 the Civil War where black people could get federal jobs. 0:15:53.920 --> 0:15:56.200 And it's one of the reasons why as there was 0:15:56.240 --> 0:16:00.120 the resistance to reconstruction and violence, postal workers would the 0:16:00.160 --> 0:16:04.440 ones very often attacked by remaining Confederates in the South. 0:16:05.160 --> 0:16:08.600 The post office symbolized the federal government. The postal worker 0:16:08.880 --> 0:16:12.000 symbolized the federal government, and to be a black postal 0:16:12.000 --> 0:16:14.600 worker said something incredibly powerful because it meant that the 0:16:14.680 --> 0:16:19.720 United States government trusted you with the money, the mail, 0:16:20.000 --> 0:16:22.400 all of this official business. You know how if you 0:16:22.520 --> 0:16:24.760 know you always see the lines that if you if 0:16:24.840 --> 0:16:27.360 you ruin mail, you know it's a federal offense. It 0:16:27.480 --> 0:16:31.800 is right that it's a job of importance because they 0:16:31.840 --> 0:16:37.640 speak for the government. They are part of the federal government. Well, 0:16:37.640 --> 0:16:42.760 what happened after Brown versus Board of Education is that slowly, 0:16:42.800 --> 0:16:46.280 but surely, and not even that slowly, they're developed a 0:16:46.360 --> 0:16:52.120 narrative about public goods. Prior to Brown, we had public 0:16:52.120 --> 0:16:55.040 goods and they were not controversial. White people loved them too. 0:16:55.440 --> 0:16:57.880 White people loved public housing. They are the ones who 0:16:57.960 --> 0:17:02.400 were public housing was originally built for. And they benefited 0:17:02.440 --> 0:17:06.199 amazingly from the New Deal programs that were imposed in 0:17:06.320 --> 0:17:09.919 order to address and deal with the Great Depression. So 0:17:10.280 --> 0:17:14.159 the Works Projects Association, the NLRB, which the Fifth Circuit 0:17:14.160 --> 0:17:17.920 has just said it's unconstitutional, the National Labor Relations Board, 0:17:18.560 --> 0:17:22.840 all of the things that came through the New Deal. 0:17:23.960 --> 0:17:27.919 But here's how they maintained white support for those public goods. 0:17:28.920 --> 0:17:33.000 They carved black people out of them. So Southern segregationists 0:17:33.040 --> 0:17:36.040 were very clear that in fact, the South was the 0:17:36.080 --> 0:17:40.080 greatest beneficiary of New Deal programs. But what they wanted 0:17:40.080 --> 0:17:43.320 to make sure was that their power structure remained unchanged. 0:17:43.720 --> 0:17:48.159 That's right, and Frederick Franklin Dellana Roosevelt was willing to 0:17:48.200 --> 0:17:51.439 cut those deals because he needed the southern segregationists in 0:17:51.520 --> 0:17:55.879 Congress to support the legislation to bring the New Deal forward. 0:17:56.760 --> 0:18:01.080 So that's why black people didn't have access to Social 0:18:01.119 --> 0:18:04.919 Security when the Social Security Act was passed in nineteen 0:18:04.960 --> 0:18:07.520 thirty four, because what they carved out of the Social 0:18:07.520 --> 0:18:13.960 Security Act were agricultural workers and domestic workers. Now in 0:18:14.040 --> 0:18:17.680 nineteen thirty four, what were most black people doing. Most 0:18:17.720 --> 0:18:21.560 black people were sharecropping or were working as domestics in 0:18:21.600 --> 0:18:26.680 the homes of white people in the South. So black 0:18:26.720 --> 0:18:31.400 people were carved out of Social Security and I think 0:18:31.520 --> 0:18:34.919 not actually added to it until nineteen fifty two. I 0:18:34.920 --> 0:18:39.440 want to say it was Eisenhower. And so public goods 0:18:39.480 --> 0:18:42.440 were fine so long as they were not being given 0:18:42.480 --> 0:18:44.879 on an equal basis with white people. 0:18:45.920 --> 0:18:46.120 Right. 0:18:46.840 --> 0:18:50.000 Segregated public housing, that was another when public housing was 0:18:50.000 --> 0:18:53.359 being built in the thirties and forties, it was you 0:18:53.359 --> 0:18:57.080 know FDR's aides who said, we have to acquiesce to 0:18:57.240 --> 0:19:01.080 Southerners who want public housing to be segregated, and that's 0:19:01.119 --> 0:19:04.560 why they were segregated public housing. All of the buildings 0:19:04.600 --> 0:19:08.480 that were built to work on New Deal projects were segregated, 0:19:08.600 --> 0:19:12.640 and the black housing was always substandard. So while there 0:19:12.760 --> 0:19:16.359 was that pat that understanding that if we have public goods, 0:19:16.440 --> 0:19:19.159 if we have public schools, black people are going to 0:19:19.160 --> 0:19:22.040 get the underfunded public schools and white people will get 0:19:22.080 --> 0:19:24.560 the state of the art schools. Right Central High School 0:19:24.600 --> 0:19:27.600 in Little Rock was seen as the high school. It 0:19:27.680 --> 0:19:30.680 was seen as you know, I've read accounts of white 0:19:30.680 --> 0:19:32.879 students know there was a fish pond at the bottom 0:19:32.920 --> 0:19:35.200 of the stairs. I mean it was. They were very 0:19:35.200 --> 0:19:37.880 proud of that school. The same thing with Central High 0:19:37.880 --> 0:19:40.920 School in Washington, d C. They were very proud of it. 0:19:42.119 --> 0:19:44.679 Well after Brown versus Board of Education, when the Supreme 0:19:44.720 --> 0:19:48.560 Court said first in terms of education, it has to 0:19:48.600 --> 0:19:50.399 be shared on an equal basis and there has to 0:19:50.400 --> 0:19:55.280 be integration, what was the first reaction and response? The 0:19:55.320 --> 0:20:00.879 first reaction and response was to withdraw from partiesipation in 0:20:00.960 --> 0:20:04.639 public goods keeping their kids home from school. You know, 0:20:05.720 --> 0:20:08.240 you know, you can decide which one is worse, the 0:20:08.320 --> 0:20:11.399 kids howling outside Central High School in Little Rock to 0:20:11.480 --> 0:20:15.919 keep nine black students out, or no kids being in 0:20:15.960 --> 0:20:18.520 school with Ruby Bridges in New Orleans so that she's 0:20:18.560 --> 0:20:23.040 in the whole school by herself. Or you can decide 0:20:23.040 --> 0:20:27.520 that it's Prince Williams County, Virginia closing the public schools 0:20:27.520 --> 0:20:33.000 for five years rather than integrate and building segregation academies 0:20:34.000 --> 0:20:36.280 to educate their kids. Now, you can pick from among 0:20:36.320 --> 0:20:38.359 those which one you think is the worst, but they 0:20:38.400 --> 0:20:41.480 all amount to the same thing, the withdrawal from what 0:20:41.680 --> 0:20:45.359 is the most important public good in any democracy, and 0:20:45.440 --> 0:20:48.879 that is public schools K through twelve. Why because that 0:20:49.040 --> 0:20:53.679 is where we inculcate the values of citizenship and what 0:20:53.720 --> 0:20:56.040 it means to live in this country. And we do it, 0:20:56.520 --> 0:20:59.159 we should be doing it together and they know that 0:20:59.240 --> 0:21:04.040 as well. So our whole relationship to public schools that 0:21:04.160 --> 0:21:09.000 changed came out of this, came out of Brown. And 0:21:09.040 --> 0:21:11.200 then when the Civil Rights Act of nineteen sixty four 0:21:11.320 --> 0:21:13.399 said that all public goods had to be shared on 0:21:13.440 --> 0:21:16.240 an equal basis, then we saw the withdrawal from all 0:21:16.240 --> 0:21:18.480 the other public goods. And by the time we got 0:21:18.480 --> 0:21:21.280 to the nineteen eighties with Ronald Reagan, it was an 0:21:21.520 --> 0:21:27.440 ordinary to exalt that which is private and to denigrate 0:21:27.480 --> 0:21:30.040 that which is public. If I say public transportation, the 0:21:30.119 --> 0:21:33.280 image in your mind has black people in it. If 0:21:33.320 --> 0:21:35.600 I say public schools, the image in your mind has 0:21:35.640 --> 0:21:39.439 black and brown people in it. This is when we 0:21:39.480 --> 0:21:42.000 get the gated community. This is when we get the 0:21:42.000 --> 0:21:45.600 backyard pool. All of our communities had pools. Baltimore had 0:21:45.600 --> 0:21:47.880 public pools. We all have public We have them again 0:21:47.920 --> 0:21:51.960 now thanks to Brandon Scott, but we all had public pools. 0:21:52.000 --> 0:21:55.239 We had public golf courses in all our cities. And 0:21:55.320 --> 0:22:00.000 when the Civil Rights Act of nineteen sixty four passed 0:22:00.160 --> 0:22:03.800 and was signed by President Johnson, this act included a 0:22:03.800 --> 0:22:08.000 provision called Title six, which says that federal funds cannot 0:22:08.000 --> 0:22:10.840 support state and local programs that engage in discrimination. It 0:22:10.880 --> 0:22:14.720 was actually created to force compliance with brown, to force 0:22:14.760 --> 0:22:18.240 schools to comply with brown. People like me were bussed 0:22:18.240 --> 0:22:21.640 to school in the immediate years after the Civil Rights 0:22:21.640 --> 0:22:24.720 Act of nineteen sixty four, because that's when northern school 0:22:24.720 --> 0:22:28.360 districts who had kind of stayed out of the immigration 0:22:28.400 --> 0:22:32.080 the integration conversation around school but who were also segregated, right, 0:22:32.240 --> 0:22:36.359 not segregated by statute but by custom, they started integrating 0:22:36.400 --> 0:22:39.280 their schools because they got nervous and afraid about the 0:22:39.280 --> 0:22:41.320 Civil Rights Act of nineteen sixty four. So when you 0:22:41.320 --> 0:22:44.200 hear about kids getting bussed, Black kids getting bussed to school, 0:22:44.480 --> 0:22:49.199 in the North Boston, Chicago, Denver, New York. It is 0:22:49.359 --> 0:22:52.679 usually after nineteen sixty four. Right, So I first went 0:22:52.720 --> 0:22:56.879 to school nineteen sixty eight. So now you have this 0:22:57.000 --> 0:22:58.920 rule that but it's not only schools, it's you can't 0:22:58.920 --> 0:23:02.760 get any federal funds if your parks department, right discriminates 0:23:02.800 --> 0:23:04.159 and keeps black kids out of the pool. 0:23:04.280 --> 0:23:04.440 Right. 0:23:04.760 --> 0:23:08.080 So now everything has to integrate. And that's when we 0:23:08.119 --> 0:23:10.440 see the full on white withdrawal. We see white flight, 0:23:10.520 --> 0:23:13.560 white people moving out of cities, right. We see the 0:23:13.560 --> 0:23:19.159 decimation of public goods like parks and swimming pools. We 0:23:19.200 --> 0:23:21.959 see white pull out of public schools and thus the 0:23:22.000 --> 0:23:25.439 defunding of public schools. We see all of that, and 0:23:25.520 --> 0:23:29.080 that is you cannot build a society that is multi 0:23:29.200 --> 0:23:33.600 racial as a democracy like that. And let me give 0:23:33.800 --> 0:23:35.840 the US a little bit of credit here for the 0:23:36.040 --> 0:23:39.840 for the you get points for the difficulty of the project. 0:23:40.400 --> 0:23:43.400 We're doing the most difficult project. There is no other 0:23:43.520 --> 0:23:46.080 country in the world that we're pointing to and saying, see, 0:23:46.119 --> 0:23:51.159 they got the multiracial democracy thing, right. It's just not 0:23:51.240 --> 0:23:51.520 a thing. 0:23:51.880 --> 0:23:52.080 Right. 0:23:52.119 --> 0:23:54.280 And that's why when people say, oh, but look at 0:23:54.280 --> 0:23:57.680 the criminal justice system in Norway right because they're all white. 0:23:58.280 --> 0:24:01.000 And when you have a in which people are not 0:24:01.080 --> 0:24:06.200 different from one another, there's built in trust, there's built 0:24:06.200 --> 0:24:10.520 in trust. We're fighting against a very different tide, the 0:24:10.640 --> 0:24:14.080 tide of a place of differences, which is part of 0:24:14.080 --> 0:24:17.200 what makes this country. If you want to say great, great, 0:24:17.560 --> 0:24:20.840 is that there's all this difference. But all that difference 0:24:20.960 --> 0:24:24.960 means the project of holding together that population in a 0:24:25.000 --> 0:24:30.200 democracy is extremely challenging. And so my even look like 0:24:30.240 --> 0:24:35.000 I'm answering Andrew's question, my recognition for the future is 0:24:35.560 --> 0:24:42.320 we have to be actually especially careful and intentional about 0:24:42.400 --> 0:24:47.399 creating public goods that force us together. We actually have 0:24:47.480 --> 0:24:50.920 to be thoughtful about that. I had this section my 0:24:50.920 --> 0:24:52.840 book where I talk about public parks because that's what 0:24:52.840 --> 0:24:56.000 we did as kids, you know, our family. There were 0:24:56.040 --> 0:24:57.440 ten kids in my family, so we did not go 0:24:57.520 --> 0:25:01.520 on vacations, but we did packed that hamper, you know, 0:25:01.640 --> 0:25:03.600 with the chicken and the sandwiches and whatever, and we 0:25:03.640 --> 0:25:05.720 went to every public park. We went to Bear Mountain, 0:25:05.760 --> 0:25:08.040 we went to Sunken Meadow, we went to Wildwood State Park. 0:25:08.359 --> 0:25:11.200 That's what we would do on Labor Day, on Memorial Day, 0:25:11.240 --> 0:25:14.719 on these holidays, and just the experience in a public 0:25:14.760 --> 0:25:17.280 park in a place like New York, right where you 0:25:17.320 --> 0:25:20.120 put your blanket, you know, nobody wants to be two 0:25:20.480 --> 0:25:24.320 up in somebody's Like you're learning these lessons about accommodation 0:25:25.480 --> 0:25:30.000 without actually learning a lesson like a school, right, And 0:25:30.080 --> 0:25:32.119 so you learn. And you're watching people, right, and the 0:25:32.160 --> 0:25:34.399 people next to you are making food that's very different 0:25:34.440 --> 0:25:38.360 than yours, right, and they're treating their kids differently than 0:25:38.400 --> 0:25:40.320 you treat yours. And something's on the grill over here 0:25:40.359 --> 0:25:42.480 that smells really good, and you want to go over 0:25:42.520 --> 0:25:44.000 there and look at it, and you're you know, your 0:25:44.640 --> 0:25:46.359 older sisters are saying, get out, go over here, get 0:25:46.480 --> 0:25:48.240 leave those people alone, but you want to see. You know, 0:25:48.280 --> 0:25:50.000 what's that meat they put on the grid? I've never 0:25:50.040 --> 0:25:52.600 seen that. But like, there's all this stuff that's happening 0:25:53.080 --> 0:25:58.040 in a public space, and you are just without having 0:25:58.080 --> 0:26:03.120 to have an explicit conversation up accommodating the differences around you. 0:26:03.119 --> 0:26:05.560 You get on the New York City subway. We don't 0:26:05.600 --> 0:26:10.880 talk about it, but there is an understanding. As you're 0:26:10.920 --> 0:26:15.840 holding the pole, right, people's hands are different places on 0:26:15.880 --> 0:26:18.159 the pole. You don't put your hand over somebody's you 0:26:18.200 --> 0:26:21.359 know what I mean. There is a whole accommodation that 0:26:21.520 --> 0:26:25.480 happens when we're together. It's very different you all sitting 0:26:25.520 --> 0:26:28.480 in four us, all sitting in four different studios right now, 0:26:29.359 --> 0:26:31.479 or if we were in an auditorium together and we 0:26:31.480 --> 0:26:33.680 were sitting next to each other, because we would very quietly, 0:26:33.720 --> 0:26:36.719 without even talking about it, decide whose arm went on, 0:26:36.760 --> 0:26:41.280 which armrest right, And we might say, oh, Andrew, you're 0:26:41.320 --> 0:26:42.560 the tallest, so you still on the end, so your 0:26:42.640 --> 0:26:43.119 leg could be. 0:26:43.440 --> 0:26:44.640 There's all kinds of things we. 0:26:44.640 --> 0:26:50.000 Do just in the process of being together. That's actually 0:26:50.040 --> 0:26:52.520 not about who did you vote for. It's actually not 0:26:52.560 --> 0:26:54.480 about race. It's actually it's not about any of that. 0:26:54.680 --> 0:26:55.520 And we just do it. 0:26:56.640 --> 0:27:01.480 Without those opportunities, without those experiences, it is very difficult 0:27:01.520 --> 0:27:03.800 to begin to knit together a population. I understand this 0:27:03.880 --> 0:27:07.240 is a small example, but it is. If you scale 0:27:07.280 --> 0:27:11.920 it up, it becomes university, right, it becomes public housing, 0:27:13.040 --> 0:27:18.040 it becomes all of those places where the stakes are high. 0:27:18.080 --> 0:27:22.760 And so when you see this effort, this unrelenting effort, 0:27:23.560 --> 0:27:28.360 since it started against affirmative action and now against DEI right, 0:27:28.800 --> 0:27:35.560 it is a deliberate counter to creating context that compel 0:27:35.680 --> 0:27:38.240 us to be together and to see one another, to 0:27:38.320 --> 0:27:43.680 see one another's humanity in an environment that asks all 0:27:43.720 --> 0:27:46.440 of us, as of all of us, the same thing, 0:27:47.080 --> 0:27:48.800 and where we have the opportunity to bring the same 0:27:48.800 --> 0:27:51.320 thing to the table. So one thing is thinking about 0:27:51.320 --> 0:27:54.200 how we would restructure and this is even architectural. That's 0:27:54.200 --> 0:27:57.800 why it's a multi disciplinary project. What do we want 0:27:57.800 --> 0:28:00.200 our cities to look like? What do we want our 0:28:00.240 --> 0:28:02.679 towns to look like? I believe the schools should be 0:28:02.720 --> 0:28:06.200 the center of the town, right, everything you know about 0:28:06.240 --> 0:28:09.560 a community you should know by visiting their elementary school, 0:28:09.640 --> 0:28:12.679 their high school. You should just know whether they value kids, 0:28:13.080 --> 0:28:16.520 whether they value sports, What did they believe about green space, 0:28:16.960 --> 0:28:20.719 What did they believe about food and access? What did 0:28:20.760 --> 0:28:22.960 they you know, all of that stuff should be So 0:28:23.040 --> 0:28:25.200 we were even thinking about, you know, we were getting 0:28:25.240 --> 0:28:27.719 infrastructure money. That's what I was thinking about. I mean 0:28:27.760 --> 0:28:31.280 I pushed very hard but with the Secretary of Education 0:28:31.280 --> 0:28:33.400 and the Biden administration as they were making their plans 0:28:33.760 --> 0:28:36.639 that we needed school infrastructure money. 0:28:36.680 --> 0:28:37.240 We needed to be. 0:28:37.240 --> 0:28:39.360 Able to build new schools so that we could see 0:28:39.360 --> 0:28:42.760 it differently and pull kids together differently, you know, So 0:28:42.840 --> 0:28:45.360 it requires that kind of thinking. Obviously, I have lots 0:28:45.400 --> 0:28:48.080 of thinking about law and my profession. I have lots 0:28:48.120 --> 0:28:51.200 of thinking about the Supreme Court, which is I'm no 0:28:51.280 --> 0:28:54.200 longer interested in the conversation about the personnel. I'm interested 0:28:54.240 --> 0:28:58.000 in a conversation about structuring a Supreme Court that could 0:28:58.040 --> 0:28:58.560 make sense. 0:29:00.520 --> 0:29:03.840 And obviously I'm glad you brought up the Supreme Court, 0:29:03.840 --> 0:29:07.880 where unfortunately our time is always so tight on this podcast, 0:29:07.880 --> 0:29:10.360 so we mainly have time for another one or two questions, 0:29:10.400 --> 0:29:11.720 so I just want to try to get one in. 0:29:12.600 --> 0:29:14.480 You said a lot there one you you gave a 0:29:14.480 --> 0:29:16.120 shout out to Brandon Scott. I just want to let 0:29:16.120 --> 0:29:19.040 our listeners and viewers across the country know that is 0:29:19.080 --> 0:29:22.320 the mayor of Baltimore, who you gave a shout out to. 0:29:22.720 --> 0:29:25.640 You also bringing up the courts, because I have a 0:29:25.640 --> 0:29:29.200 lot of lay persons questions about what we see happening here, 0:29:29.280 --> 0:29:31.280 and I want to take us to the very current 0:29:31.320 --> 0:29:34.680 situation of what's happening in Texas. And I was asking 0:29:35.480 --> 0:29:40.320 Angela earlier in the week about keeping the Cole Collier, who's, 0:29:40.320 --> 0:29:46.200 of course the state representative in Texas, who is and 0:29:46.280 --> 0:29:51.960 from my lay person's perspective is being held captive. 0:29:52.120 --> 0:29:52.520 She is. 0:29:52.560 --> 0:29:57.160 It looks like false imprisonment to me, and so Angela 0:29:57.280 --> 0:30:00.280 and our friend Brittany Packnet Cunningham were s to me, 0:30:00.480 --> 0:30:05.120 you know, language around the rules for their legislature, which 0:30:05.160 --> 0:30:07.400 they were trying to explain to me is essentially treated 0:30:07.480 --> 0:30:10.880 like the law. Sunny Hassen, another fellow lawyer, saying, this 0:30:10.920 --> 0:30:13.680 is what exists until a court says it doesn't. I 0:30:13.800 --> 0:30:16.800 keep saying, I do not believe the courts will hold 0:30:17.480 --> 0:30:19.920 I just and everything that you laid out from a 0:30:19.920 --> 0:30:25.280 capitulating media landscape that we see to the third co 0:30:25.400 --> 0:30:28.640 equal branch of government, I don't see the courts holding. 0:30:28.840 --> 0:30:31.080 So even if this case were to go before a 0:30:31.160 --> 0:30:34.000 court saying yes, you cannot lock this black woman up, 0:30:34.080 --> 0:30:37.080 what is wrong with you all? I don't. I think 0:30:37.120 --> 0:30:40.520 it can just escalate, perhaps all the way to the 0:30:40.520 --> 0:30:43.120 Supreme Court. So what And it sends a message, I think, 0:30:43.160 --> 0:30:46.840 to the country, to other potential Republican governors, that it 0:30:46.920 --> 0:30:50.680 is okay to we already see it's we've declared it's 0:30:50.720 --> 0:30:53.920 okay to kidnap people off the street without due process. 0:30:54.040 --> 0:30:56.240 Mass men can come and snatch any one of us 0:30:56.480 --> 0:30:59.360 we've already declared that. And so this is very scary 0:30:59.480 --> 0:31:03.400 to me that we're almost normalizing this, that we're talking 0:31:03.400 --> 0:31:05.400 about it. I see on cable news they present it 0:31:05.440 --> 0:31:07.880 like it's fodder, like well, what do you think about 0:31:07.920 --> 0:31:10.600 this instead of outrags like oh my god, where is 0:31:10.600 --> 0:31:12.560 the country going? I'm just curious your thoughts on that. 0:31:13.440 --> 0:31:15.560 And I know had another question, So I don't want 0:31:15.600 --> 0:31:17.960 you to take up to ms CI. I'll be able 0:31:17.960 --> 0:31:18.600 to get to her question. 0:31:18.800 --> 0:31:21.360 I'll do it real fast. I think you hit, you know, 0:31:21.400 --> 0:31:25.560 the nail on the head. It is true that you know, 0:31:25.600 --> 0:31:27.880 this stuff will be litigated and there'll be whatever a 0:31:28.040 --> 0:31:30.360 court says. It'll be first whatever the highest court in 0:31:30.400 --> 0:31:33.240 Texas says, uh, and then it'll be what the Supreme 0:31:33.280 --> 0:31:35.160 Court says. And I just think you hit the nail 0:31:35.200 --> 0:31:37.320 on the head. The reason this time is so scary 0:31:37.400 --> 0:31:40.320 is because the courts have not held. Now there are 0:31:40.360 --> 0:31:43.240 the courts, and the courts, the federal district courts have 0:31:43.320 --> 0:31:47.080 been amazing. And what has been shocking to see is 0:31:47.160 --> 0:31:51.080 how much the Supreme Court, the majority of conservative justices 0:31:51.120 --> 0:31:54.000 on that court, are so set on their agenda that 0:31:54.040 --> 0:32:03.160 they are willing to disparage and pull into disrespute, ill disrespute, irrepute, 0:32:03.280 --> 0:32:07.720 ill repute. The federal district court judges, right, who are 0:32:07.720 --> 0:32:11.080 deciding things they don't like. But the Federal district court 0:32:11.160 --> 0:32:12.880 judges are the ones who are like pulling out the 0:32:12.920 --> 0:32:18.160 facts and figuring out exactly what happened. And so I 0:32:18.200 --> 0:32:20.840 think you have every right to be alarmed by the 0:32:20.880 --> 0:32:23.640 fact that the courts may not hold. And that's why 0:32:23.640 --> 0:32:26.760 it was so important for people to understand the significance 0:32:26.800 --> 0:32:30.320 of the courts. It was important for advocates like me 0:32:30.520 --> 0:32:34.000 and others to make clear to our people why the 0:32:34.040 --> 0:32:41.480 courts were so significant, and to make it understood, and 0:32:41.520 --> 0:32:44.160 to make it understood in layman's terms, and to get 0:32:44.160 --> 0:32:47.840 out of the whole conversation, the insider conversation about the 0:32:47.880 --> 0:32:50.520 courts and the justices and who's an institutionalist and so 0:32:50.600 --> 0:32:53.600 on and so forth. I've watched every Supreme Court confirmation 0:32:53.640 --> 0:32:55.400 hearing since I was. 0:32:58.240 --> 0:32:58.480 Ten. 0:32:59.600 --> 0:33:02.640 It did right, I mean, this is this is my thing, 0:33:02.720 --> 0:33:05.240 you know, Like, I'm so clear about it. And I 0:33:07.600 --> 0:33:11.000 just think that we have now gotten ourselves in quite 0:33:11.000 --> 0:33:13.640 a pickle. And I don't think there's any easy way 0:33:13.640 --> 0:33:15.960 out of it. I think there's some things that John 0:33:16.160 --> 0:33:21.360 Roberts will will it pumped the brakes on, but never 0:33:21.760 --> 0:33:24.240 never about race. He's always been one of the leaders. 0:33:24.640 --> 0:33:27.440 He worked in the Break and Justice Department. He was 0:33:28.040 --> 0:33:30.960 vociferously opposed to the amendments to Section two where the 0:33:31.000 --> 0:33:35.240 Voting Rights Act. He has always been an anti civil 0:33:35.280 --> 0:33:38.880 rights person. So there may be other things that you know, 0:33:39.080 --> 0:33:43.760 on an executive power that he may you know, come 0:33:43.800 --> 0:33:46.720 around on. But it ain't going to be on is 0:33:46.800 --> 0:33:49.959 section to a violation of the fourteenth and fifteenth Amendments. 0:33:50.200 --> 0:33:53.960 It's not going to be I've become convinced it's not 0:33:54.000 --> 0:33:56.160 going to be on birthright citizenship, like it's not going 0:33:56.240 --> 0:34:02.560 to be anything that doesn't serve this current agenda. And 0:34:02.600 --> 0:34:05.760 the mistake I think that many of us got too late, 0:34:05.840 --> 0:34:08.800 myself included is while I knew that these I've always 0:34:08.800 --> 0:34:11.399 said they were right wing, I did not know they 0:34:11.400 --> 0:34:17.680 were a MAGA until the decision saying that the president 0:34:17.680 --> 0:34:20.480 has immunity for any acts he commits while he's president, 0:34:20.640 --> 0:34:23.880 as long as they can be deemed as official acts, 0:34:23.920 --> 0:34:28.440 including criminal acts. Was that the beginning of the unraveling? 0:34:28.560 --> 0:34:31.000 Was it that moment you know it. That was the 0:34:31.000 --> 0:34:35.799 for hostallization. That was the crystallization that they are. I 0:34:35.920 --> 0:34:40.200 thought so with the insurrection decision, the decision to basically 0:34:40.280 --> 0:34:42.440 kind of stand down section three of the fourteenth Amendment, 0:34:42.440 --> 0:34:45.120 which says, if you participated in insurrection, you can't be 0:34:45.200 --> 0:34:48.520 on the ballot. And Colorado had removed President Trump from 0:34:48.560 --> 0:34:52.480 the ballot in twenty twenty four, and the case went 0:34:52.480 --> 0:34:54.239 to the Supreme Court and they said a lot of 0:34:54.320 --> 0:34:56.480 things and in the end said, well, we would need 0:34:56.520 --> 0:34:58.760 an Act of Congress, even though you have it clearly 0:34:58.800 --> 0:35:00.520 set forth in the fourteenth Amendment. 0:35:01.200 --> 0:35:01.799 I thought so. 0:35:01.960 --> 0:35:07.760 Then because of the descent from Justices Soto, Mayor Jackson, 0:35:08.000 --> 0:35:11.040 and Kagan, I felt their dissent. The tone of it, 0:35:11.200 --> 0:35:14.160 the words they said was a flair. I thought they 0:35:14.160 --> 0:35:19.080 were warning us of what was happening with their colleagues. 0:35:19.360 --> 0:35:21.520 They weren't just saying that they were right wing. There 0:35:21.560 --> 0:35:24.360 was some language where they said, you know, you've taken 0:35:24.360 --> 0:35:29.799 a decision in order to insulate this president or any 0:35:29.880 --> 0:35:32.400 after him like that, in order to insulate him like 0:35:32.520 --> 0:35:35.520 just It really stuck out to me, and that's when 0:35:35.560 --> 0:35:38.520 I first thought, like, are they telling us that Wait 0:35:38.560 --> 0:35:43.520 a minute, right, And then we got the the immunity decision, 0:35:43.600 --> 0:35:46.799 and that has convinced me in ways I had not 0:35:46.880 --> 0:35:52.560 been convinced before. And it's frightening. It's very very frightening, 0:35:52.560 --> 0:35:54.600 and there's no easy way out of it at all. 0:35:55.360 --> 0:35:59.680 But I say all of that, oh, go ahead, go ahead, I. 0:36:00.400 --> 0:36:02.600 Just I don't say this too so that we are 0:36:02.800 --> 0:36:05.880 in despair and believe that there's no way out. Because, 0:36:07.719 --> 0:36:11.600 you know, civil rights advancement, it is like a cocktail 0:36:11.760 --> 0:36:14.920 of things. You know, we all know the different elements 0:36:14.920 --> 0:36:17.400 that we use. You know, it's there are boycotts, and 0:36:17.440 --> 0:36:20.200 there are stand downs, and there are general strikes, and 0:36:20.239 --> 0:36:24.640 there are there's litigation, and there's marching, and there's protesting, 0:36:24.719 --> 0:36:28.839 and there's shaming and there's educating and these are all 0:36:28.840 --> 0:36:30.960 the elements and then you shake them all up. But 0:36:31.000 --> 0:36:36.239 there's always something else that is completely unexpected that we 0:36:36.280 --> 0:36:39.480 don't have any control over, that also ends up in 0:36:39.480 --> 0:36:42.960 the mix, that moves things in ways that are unexpected. 0:36:43.560 --> 0:36:45.840 My concern always is like, have you put all the 0:36:45.880 --> 0:36:49.080 other stuff in the in the mix so that we're 0:36:49.120 --> 0:36:50.920 ready to go when the when the when the day 0:36:51.239 --> 0:36:54.400 x MACNA happens, When the when the secret sauce comes 0:36:54.400 --> 0:36:58.839 from the outside to move things forward. It's not all 0:36:58.880 --> 0:37:00.879 the secret sauce is not always great, by the way, 0:37:01.200 --> 0:37:03.879 it's sometimes very painful. In the civil rights movement, there's 0:37:03.960 --> 0:37:06.600 nothing that we got that didn't happen before. There was 0:37:06.640 --> 0:37:10.279 some horrifyingly violent attack. We don't care. 0:37:10.440 --> 0:37:14.839 Then you mentioned sorry, You mentioned that you didn't want 0:37:14.920 --> 0:37:18.520 us to be in despair. And in a special moment recently, 0:37:19.880 --> 0:37:21.799 we were wrestling with this question we've been doing on 0:37:21.840 --> 0:37:24.680 the podcast too, what is not under attack in this country? 0:37:25.120 --> 0:37:28.920 And you mentioned a really special conversation you had with 0:37:28.960 --> 0:37:33.080 Hank Sanders in Selma, and I would love for that 0:37:33.200 --> 0:37:35.440 to be our partying words, to give us a little. 0:37:35.160 --> 0:37:36.640 Bit of hope. And so I said, we don't have 0:37:36.680 --> 0:37:37.920 a silver lin anymore as glitter. 0:37:38.400 --> 0:37:41.200 And to be clear, I am always hopeful. I am 0:37:41.640 --> 0:37:44.680 when people ask me if I'm optimistic, I'm optimistic because 0:37:44.680 --> 0:37:47.399 I know what the end is going to be. I 0:37:47.520 --> 0:37:51.440 understand that the struggle to get there. In that struggle, 0:37:51.520 --> 0:37:55.239 many people will be heard. That's what infuriates me, empowers me. 0:37:55.360 --> 0:37:57.680 And we have the right to try to minimize those 0:37:57.719 --> 0:37:59.520 as much as possible. But I don't have any doubt, 0:38:00.160 --> 0:38:01.880 any doubt of where we're going to be because we 0:38:01.920 --> 0:38:05.000 don't fight with the same tools they fight with. 0:38:06.200 --> 0:38:06.880 We just don't. 0:38:07.480 --> 0:38:11.840 And Hank Sanders, whose civil rights activists and lawyer served 0:38:11.840 --> 0:38:14.759 in the State House in Alabama, always says to me 0:38:14.920 --> 0:38:18.080 that during the civil rights movement, they had all the 0:38:18.200 --> 0:38:22.080 law and all the guns and all the dogs, and 0:38:22.160 --> 0:38:27.719 we had our prayers, our songs, our feet, and our 0:38:28.160 --> 0:38:31.239 moral sense of what was right, and we were able 0:38:31.280 --> 0:38:34.879 to overcome them again and again. And so if we're 0:38:34.920 --> 0:38:37.839 counting up, you know what they have and what they got, 0:38:37.880 --> 0:38:39.719 all these Spreme Court justice they got, all this, they 0:38:39.760 --> 0:38:43.439 got all that. That's not really how it works. We're 0:38:43.440 --> 0:38:46.120 not going to work. We're not going to win using 0:38:46.280 --> 0:38:48.400 their tools. We're never going to have as much money. 0:38:48.920 --> 0:38:52.239 We're never going to have the weaponry or the willingness 0:38:52.239 --> 0:38:54.279 to use it. We're never going to have all the 0:38:54.320 --> 0:38:57.080 offices that they control. We're never going to have the 0:38:57.080 --> 0:39:00.319 same level of political power. We are fourteen percent of 0:39:00.360 --> 0:39:03.120 the population of the United States. We're not having it, 0:39:03.680 --> 0:39:06.480 but we punch above our weight. There's a reason that 0:39:06.520 --> 0:39:08.879 white people, when they do the Washington Post pole, think 0:39:08.920 --> 0:39:11.920 that we're fifty percent of the population because we are 0:39:12.000 --> 0:39:18.080 just so we saturate, because we control the culture, because 0:39:18.120 --> 0:39:21.680 we control the narrative, because they like to look at us. 0:39:22.400 --> 0:39:25.200 There's all kinds of little intangibles about who we are 0:39:25.200 --> 0:39:28.520 as black people in this country that gives us power. 0:39:29.000 --> 0:39:31.240 And when we show up in the space, when we speak, 0:39:32.000 --> 0:39:36.520 it ruptures something, It disturbs, it troubles the waters. And 0:39:36.600 --> 0:39:40.480 so we have to not think we are smaller than 0:39:40.480 --> 0:39:42.799 we are. We shouldn't think we're bigger than we are, 0:39:42.920 --> 0:39:46.480 for sure, but we should know that we fight with 0:39:46.640 --> 0:39:50.400 tools that maximize our size in ways that cannot be 0:39:50.520 --> 0:39:53.919 explained by math. You know, it's like feeding the five 0:39:54.000 --> 0:39:56.280 thousand with some you know, however, many. 0:39:56.120 --> 0:39:56.719 Loaves of breads. 0:39:56.840 --> 0:40:02.359 Right, it's not math, it's not ma Right. There is 0:40:02.520 --> 0:40:06.920 a spiritual power. And when we are activated and united 0:40:07.640 --> 0:40:10.400 and believe that we are going to walk towards what 0:40:10.640 --> 0:40:16.520 is right, it maximizes power and it disarms our opponent. 0:40:17.040 --> 0:40:19.400 That's what we have to go for. It's not that 0:40:19.440 --> 0:40:22.520 we want to fight them hand to hand and somehow 0:40:22.560 --> 0:40:26.759 we win in hand to hand combat. No, we want 0:40:26.800 --> 0:40:31.440 to take the knowledge, the numbers, the force, the moral force, 0:40:32.040 --> 0:40:36.480 the demand the strategic thinking that we have and disarm them. 0:40:36.640 --> 0:40:40.000 I'm trying to make them let their own arms down. 0:40:40.080 --> 0:40:43.360 I'm trying to make them stumble first and foremost. I 0:40:43.360 --> 0:40:45.959 don't want to fight them at full strength. I want 0:40:45.960 --> 0:40:48.800 them to trip and fall and then we can fight. 0:40:49.239 --> 0:40:53.680 I want them to forget something that's important. I want 0:40:53.719 --> 0:40:57.560 them to I want them weak. Yeah, and that's the 0:40:57.640 --> 0:41:01.360 power we have, is to disarm our enemies so that 0:41:01.440 --> 0:41:05.000 we are in a better position to overcome them. 0:41:05.320 --> 0:41:09.759 Thank you. I feel so inadequate calling you, Sherilyn. It 0:41:09.760 --> 0:41:11.799 feels so I don't know why. It feels so uncomfortable. 0:41:11.800 --> 0:41:16.520 I feel like I should be saying your honor, the honorable, Yes, 0:41:16.560 --> 0:41:18.080 her excellency, thank. 0:41:17.880 --> 0:41:23.799 You, profess Her excellency. 0:41:23.880 --> 0:41:24.960 The prophetes. 0:41:26.800 --> 0:41:29.440 May know this, you may know this already, but I 0:41:29.480 --> 0:41:33.040 am a very, very verbal and expressive like a man corner. 0:41:33.400 --> 0:41:35.680 And my colleagues warned me the muzzle so that I 0:41:35.640 --> 0:41:38.160 wouldn't mess with your audio. And I felt like I 0:41:38.200 --> 0:41:38.520 was going. 0:41:38.440 --> 0:41:40.920 To explode like a balloon all the. 0:41:40.840 --> 0:41:46.040 Way through this thing because bringing it as you always do. 0:41:46.880 --> 0:41:49.200 And so I've got to adopt some of my Grandmama's 0:41:49.440 --> 0:41:53.799 you know, church mannerisms where you know, she can't mean yeah, 0:41:54.800 --> 0:41:57.960 you know, but thank you. 0:41:58.640 --> 0:42:01.640 I was on mute. Amen. I literally have to be like, 0:42:02.360 --> 0:42:03.000 it's good. 0:42:04.400 --> 0:42:08.319 Overwhelming, and not just with the warnings and the forecasting 0:42:08.360 --> 0:42:10.520 because they told us we didn't believe and I want 0:42:10.520 --> 0:42:13.240 to hear I can't wait to read that in your book, 0:42:14.120 --> 0:42:20.520 but but also the resilience. You're reminder of our resilience, 0:42:21.239 --> 0:42:26.200 our punching above our weight, our endurance, and the fact 0:42:26.200 --> 0:42:28.080 that we do know what the end is going to be. 0:42:28.200 --> 0:42:30.759 Let's not pretend there's some things we do know and 0:42:30.840 --> 0:42:33.600 it's not in a book, but it's been assured, right, 0:42:33.880 --> 0:42:35.080 it's already been promised. 0:42:37.440 --> 0:42:41.200 Yeah, exactly. We have come back. We would really love 0:42:41.239 --> 0:42:42.920 to have you back, and I hope I get to 0:42:42.920 --> 0:42:45.560 see you in person again soon. Anytime you're doing something 0:42:45.560 --> 0:42:48.279 at Howard I would be honored to be there and 0:42:48.320 --> 0:42:50.520 show up. And we're so grateful to you for taking 0:42:50.600 --> 0:42:53.560 time to join the idea we should. 0:42:53.600 --> 0:42:57.000 Okay, we'll do a live pod with the Fourteenth Amendment 0:42:57.080 --> 0:42:58.640 Center to Howard Law. 0:42:58.719 --> 0:43:00.480 If we can do it, let's do it. 0:43:00.840 --> 0:43:03.400 Let's do we have the perfect in the Law library 0:43:03.480 --> 0:43:04.040 is beautiful. 0:43:07.200 --> 0:43:08.040 I'm with you. Sharylin. 0:43:08.200 --> 0:43:13.040 We death, yeah, in the center space itself. We should 0:43:13.080 --> 0:43:14.880 do the show. It would be amazing and the students 0:43:14.920 --> 0:43:17.040 would absolutely love it, and we owe it to them. 0:43:17.080 --> 0:43:18.000 This is tough for them. 0:43:18.080 --> 0:43:20.359 This is tough for them and our job right now. 0:43:20.400 --> 0:43:22.360 We have to unlock the doors they have. We have 0:43:22.400 --> 0:43:25.160 to give them a chance to understand how this fits 0:43:25.280 --> 0:43:27.960 in the whole thing. We have to help them. 0:43:27.880 --> 0:43:28.920 Understand that. 0:43:30.600 --> 0:43:32.200 Yourself. Until we see you. 0:43:32.280 --> 0:43:47.080 Yes, you doing good, Thank you, thank you Carolyn. Oh god, 0:43:47.400 --> 0:43:50.520 that was so great, you guys. I mean, honestly, she's 0:43:51.440 --> 0:43:54.640 so amazing. Something that I really take away from that 0:43:54.680 --> 0:43:58.319 I struggle with. I still question is what is Because 0:43:58.360 --> 0:44:00.920 she talked, she touched on this, and I appreciate her 0:44:00.920 --> 0:44:03.719 saying like we will get through this, Like she's not 0:44:03.760 --> 0:44:06.520 suggesting that we are in despair. I love what she 0:44:06.640 --> 0:44:11.640 shared from with the conversation with her and Hank Sanders. 0:44:11.680 --> 0:44:14.959 Oh my god, I think that's such a I would 0:44:14.960 --> 0:44:18.080 have loved to hear it from him saying this is 0:44:18.200 --> 0:44:22.880 all we had. It's just I feel overwhelmed. But the 0:44:22.960 --> 0:44:28.920 thing that I'm left with is what is our red line? 0:44:28.960 --> 0:44:31.200 And just quickly for the viewers, if you all are 0:44:31.280 --> 0:44:34.280 as struck as we are. Please please please spread the words, 0:44:34.360 --> 0:44:38.840 share this podcast, like subscribe, send it around because people 0:44:38.920 --> 0:44:41.920 like SCHERYLN. Eiffel join because we have an audience like you, 0:44:42.960 --> 0:44:44.920 like they literally come not to talk to us. They 0:44:44.920 --> 0:44:47.359 can talk to us anytime, they can text us, call us, 0:44:47.360 --> 0:44:49.439 see us, but they come to reach the people who 0:44:49.480 --> 0:44:52.720 tune in to us. So thank you to our regular viewers, 0:44:52.760 --> 0:44:55.200 our faithful viewers. But please do continue to spread the 0:44:55.239 --> 0:44:58.760 word about Native lampod because we are living in service 0:44:58.800 --> 0:45:02.120 to the liberation of of black folks and that liberates 0:45:02.160 --> 0:45:04.959 everybody everywhere. So I just think, what is that red 0:45:05.000 --> 0:45:07.759 line for a society at large? And we may have 0:45:07.800 --> 0:45:09.759 a viewer question or comment that speaks to that. I 0:45:09.760 --> 0:45:11.319 don't know because I didn't even get a chance to 0:45:11.360 --> 0:45:14.640 look at all of our viewer questions, but I feel 0:45:14.640 --> 0:45:17.440 like that red line has been crossed one hundred times. 0:45:18.320 --> 0:45:21.800 Hey, Andrew, Angela, and Tiffany, This is Monte from Maryland 0:45:21.880 --> 0:45:24.680 and wanted to discuss something that Andrew kind of alluded 0:45:24.719 --> 0:45:28.840 to a week or so ago. Trump was not able 0:45:28.880 --> 0:45:32.319 to steal the election due to Mike Pence saying, Hey, 0:45:32.480 --> 0:45:34.600 the Constitution will allowed allow me to do this, so 0:45:34.680 --> 0:45:37.640 I can't. But with somebody like jd Vance sitting in 0:45:37.719 --> 0:45:41.480 the vice presidency, what is the recourse should jd Vance 0:45:41.560 --> 0:45:44.200 just say I'm not going to certify the next election. 0:45:45.480 --> 0:45:47.719 I know there's nothing in the constitution about it because 0:45:47.960 --> 0:45:51.839 the founders never thought we'd be here, But is there 0:45:51.920 --> 0:45:55.960 any recourse that we have if jd Vance just following 0:45:56.000 --> 0:45:59.080 his servitude to Trump just said I'm not going to 0:45:59.120 --> 0:46:03.040 certify the election for blah blah blah reason. I know 0:46:03.120 --> 0:46:06.840 it'll go through the courts, but is there anything standing 0:46:06.920 --> 0:46:09.680 that says, no, this cannot happen, or no, he will 0:46:09.680 --> 0:46:12.520 not do this or cannot do this. Just so was 0:46:12.560 --> 0:46:15.040 anxious to get your thoughts on that. Again, thank you 0:46:15.040 --> 0:46:16.520 for all you do and welcome home. 0:46:17.000 --> 0:46:19.399 I love that from Manti, and I actually didn't think 0:46:19.400 --> 0:46:21.399 that was a strand that was going to get picked 0:46:21.480 --> 0:46:23.399 up on, because I think we do have to drive 0:46:23.440 --> 0:46:26.480 people to what the conclusion is. When we had on 0:46:26.520 --> 0:46:28.880 the episode a couple of weeks ago around why it 0:46:28.960 --> 0:46:31.239 is they're playing with the numbers in the House and 0:46:31.280 --> 0:46:34.799 who counts the electoral votes that come in from each 0:46:34.880 --> 0:46:39.560 states for certification. Part of that process requires that both 0:46:39.560 --> 0:46:42.160 the House and the Senate, except the results as they 0:46:42.200 --> 0:46:45.440 come in through their express vote. When it got to 0:46:45.480 --> 0:46:48.840 the Senate, the reason why JD. Vance's vote would matter, Actually, 0:46:48.880 --> 0:46:53.440 I'm sorry, the reason why Kamala Harris's vote mattered was 0:46:53.480 --> 0:46:56.600 because of this closeness. She was the tie breaker in 0:46:56.640 --> 0:46:59.560 a fifty to fifty Senate. In this case, there is 0:46:59.560 --> 0:47:02.120 not a fifth Senate. The Republicans have the majority, they 0:47:02.120 --> 0:47:04.839 don't need jdvents to break a tie, so the vice 0:47:04.880 --> 0:47:07.600 president will be less important. And that scenario unless you 0:47:07.640 --> 0:47:11.160 had Republicans who were actually going to say we are 0:47:11.200 --> 0:47:14.319 not going to do that, We're going to vote to. 0:47:14.000 --> 0:47:16.320 Accept the results from the election. 0:47:17.960 --> 0:47:22.640 The vice president undoubtedly plays an important role the courts. 0:47:23.280 --> 0:47:26.240 I think given the conversation we just had with Sherylyn 0:47:26.440 --> 0:47:29.200 and I think most of us probably agree, there is 0:47:29.200 --> 0:47:30.840 not a lot of hope when you look at the 0:47:30.880 --> 0:47:33.640 Supreme Court with the conservative majority, that they would do 0:47:33.719 --> 0:47:39.240 anything to offend a bridge wrangle the power of Donald Trump. 0:47:39.680 --> 0:47:43.160 So I'm not in that. I'm hoping that won't be 0:47:43.160 --> 0:47:46.600 a scenario. The best scenario is that we have folks 0:47:46.680 --> 0:47:50.239 with honesty and dignity who don't steal elections. But if 0:47:50.280 --> 0:47:52.399 they do, we've got to make sure that we got 0:47:52.520 --> 0:47:56.160 enough of a margin that it doesn't that it doesn't 0:47:56.200 --> 0:47:59.840 get close. And that's why this redishoting fight is so important. 0:48:00.280 --> 0:48:02.480 That if they take a few seats here, convert a 0:48:02.480 --> 0:48:05.319 few seats here, they throw us in a scenario that 0:48:05.400 --> 0:48:08.360 a majority of members of the Congress can vote to 0:48:08.440 --> 0:48:13.280 reject the electoral College votes that declare anybody else president 0:48:13.320 --> 0:48:14.280 other than Donald Trump. 0:48:15.320 --> 0:48:19.840 That's really good. That was so Sometimes on this podcast, 0:48:19.920 --> 0:48:22.440 I feel like I'm an audience member, like I'm just 0:48:22.560 --> 0:48:25.400 listening to Sometimes you guys say things so insightful. I'm like, 0:48:25.400 --> 0:48:27.080 oh wait, I'm on here, I should wagh in here. 0:48:27.160 --> 0:48:29.799 But that's really good, A good way to explain it. 0:48:29.840 --> 0:48:34.600 And look, that is a red line, you know, that 0:48:34.680 --> 0:48:36.479 was a red It should have been a red line 0:48:36.520 --> 0:48:39.880 then to highlight the Fishers in our democracy. 0:48:40.040 --> 0:48:41.640 So I'm Burgundy. 0:48:41.800 --> 0:48:44.200 And the thing though it flag, I would say, Andrew, 0:48:44.239 --> 0:48:46.680 to the point is we don't know what the makeup 0:48:46.920 --> 0:48:49.400 of the Senate will be after the twenty sixth election, 0:48:50.000 --> 0:48:52.359 and so you know, if that becomes the case where 0:48:52.400 --> 0:48:55.239 he is a trek tie breaking vote, what will he 0:48:55.360 --> 0:48:57.640 do and what will the tech bros allow him to do? 0:48:57.719 --> 0:49:00.160 That should also be a mini pot this tech Borough situation. 0:49:00.239 --> 0:49:02.080 It's nuts and Angela. 0:49:02.160 --> 0:49:04.680 If you, if you, if you follow the logic of 0:49:04.680 --> 0:49:06.319 the Court, and I know you do, it is that 0:49:06.400 --> 0:49:10.680 they will rest with the decision of that institution as 0:49:10.680 --> 0:49:13.440 a as a coequal branch of government. They've been willing 0:49:14.239 --> 0:49:16.560 to allow that institution to decide what it wants to 0:49:16.600 --> 0:49:17.480 do without checking it. 0:49:17.600 --> 0:49:18.320 So if they say J. D. 0:49:18.440 --> 0:49:21.239 Mans has a tiebreaking vote and he says reject the Constitution, 0:49:21.360 --> 0:49:26.080 the the ballots from the States, the Court is loath 0:49:26.320 --> 0:49:28.800 to do anything at this rate given their pattern. 0:49:29.280 --> 0:49:32.399 Yeah, so so on this we've been talking a lot 0:49:32.600 --> 0:49:35.560 about a red line today. What is at stake in 0:49:35.640 --> 0:49:38.800 terms of democracy. We had Sharylyn eifel On who's always 0:49:39.280 --> 0:49:42.160 a sage of a sage voice and gave a prolific 0:49:42.280 --> 0:49:45.640 history lesson which we may need to be relying upon 0:49:45.800 --> 0:49:48.960 more as times go by. Why because we've been talking 0:49:49.000 --> 0:49:52.720 about the Smithsonian is under attack. Lonnie Bunch just received 0:49:52.719 --> 0:49:55.920 a letter from Donald Trump last week saying all of 0:49:55.960 --> 0:49:58.000 the ways in which they're going to look at these museums. 0:49:58.040 --> 0:50:00.560 But before that, well, we have to be accountable for y'all. 0:50:00.719 --> 0:50:02.720 And by we in this moment, I mean all America. 0:50:02.800 --> 0:50:06.400 So really, maga, y'all, this is y'all. Is how you 0:50:06.440 --> 0:50:11.520 are talking about the institutions that framed and founded this country. 0:50:11.680 --> 0:50:15.080 So there's a conversation recently that was held on a 0:50:15.120 --> 0:50:19.200 CNN show, and I want to go ahead and run 0:50:19.320 --> 0:50:22.600 the clip that was uh that took place on that show. 0:50:23.280 --> 0:50:26.000 Have you looked at some of the things that slavery 0:50:26.080 --> 0:50:27.399 was about to talk about? 0:50:28.239 --> 0:50:30.880 Forget, he's not whitewashing slavery, so he's not. 0:50:30.920 --> 0:50:31.239 He's not. 0:50:31.400 --> 0:50:32.400 No, he's not. 0:50:33.000 --> 0:50:38.000 And you cannot tie imperialism and racism and slavery did 0:50:38.239 --> 0:50:40.920 just one race, which is pretty much what every single 0:50:40.960 --> 0:50:43.120 exhibit does. Well, let's talk about the fact. 0:50:42.880 --> 0:50:47.680 That when you slavery in America was only. 0:50:47.680 --> 0:50:50.239 Less than two percent of white Americans own slaves, but 0:50:50.280 --> 0:50:54.120 it was a system of slavery is thousands of years old. 0:50:55.719 --> 0:50:56.360 The first. 0:51:00.120 --> 0:51:04.360 You surprised, I'm really surprised. 0:51:04.640 --> 0:51:06.600 Do you realize, Jillian, I'm surprised that you're trying to 0:51:06.640 --> 0:51:11.160 litigate who was the beneficiary of slavery. 0:51:10.760 --> 0:51:13.000 And I'm not. What I'm trying to tell you is the. 0:51:12.960 --> 0:51:16.600 Context of American history. In the context of American history, 0:51:17.040 --> 0:51:20.399 what are you saying is incorrect by saying that white 0:51:20.440 --> 0:51:21.680 people oppressing. 0:51:21.480 --> 0:51:25.040 Every single thing? Is like, oh no, no, no, this is 0:51:25.080 --> 0:51:29.840 all because white people bad, and that's just not the truth. 0:51:30.000 --> 0:51:31.719 Like, for example, every. 0:51:31.600 --> 0:51:34.560 Single exhibit, I have a list of every single one, 0:51:34.920 --> 0:51:39.640 like people migrated from Cuba because white people bad, not 0:51:39.880 --> 0:51:42.680 because of pastory. Just know it's in there, That's what 0:51:42.680 --> 0:51:43.040 I'm saying. 0:51:43.040 --> 0:51:44.279 You don't actually know what's in there? 0:51:44.320 --> 0:51:45.759 Do you know that when you walk in the door, 0:51:46.040 --> 0:51:47.439 exactly first thing you have. 0:51:47.440 --> 0:51:51.400 Gay So we're not going to litigate those points because 0:51:51.400 --> 0:51:53.759 they're not litigatable. What we are going to do now 0:51:54.360 --> 0:52:00.399 is play Nicole to Nicole Hannah Jones response and we'll 0:52:00.440 --> 0:52:03.360 get to that shortly. Andrew Gilla, let's play her response. 0:52:04.160 --> 0:52:05.040 I do not usually do. 0:52:05.000 --> 0:52:07.520 These videos, but as a creator of the sixteen nineteen 0:52:07.560 --> 0:52:10.200 project and someone who has studied the history of slavery 0:52:10.280 --> 0:52:13.440 for three decades, I could not let the viral CNN 0:52:13.520 --> 0:52:16.719 clip of Jillian Michael's stand after first date that the 0:52:16.760 --> 0:52:19.239 times are far too serious and dangerous for us to 0:52:19.320 --> 0:52:23.840 lend our platforms to harmful nonsense. It's simply irresponsible with 0:52:23.960 --> 0:52:26.719 everything that's happening in this country to have someone as 0:52:26.760 --> 0:52:31.280 credentialists as Jillian Michaels on a major network show legitimizing 0:52:31.360 --> 0:52:32.600 the erasure of our history. 0:52:33.600 --> 0:52:33.759 Now. 0:52:33.760 --> 0:52:36.120 I know, there have been some viral efforts to debunk 0:52:36.160 --> 0:52:39.520 her claim that somehow slavery was a side institution in 0:52:39.560 --> 0:52:42.160 the United States because less than two percent of white 0:52:42.160 --> 0:52:46.040 people own slaves. But even those efforts, while valiant by 0:52:46.080 --> 0:52:49.760 embracing this right wing framing, they still aren't really getting 0:52:49.800 --> 0:52:52.400 to it. You see, this is how numbers and data, 0:52:52.480 --> 0:52:55.800 though technically true, can also be lies. And this is 0:52:55.840 --> 0:52:59.160 why we can't let bad faith actors set the parameters 0:52:59.160 --> 0:53:02.640 of the debate or of our collective understanding. So please 0:53:02.719 --> 0:53:06.560 bear with me, because this is a lot. Let's take 0:53:06.560 --> 0:53:08.960 the fewer than two percent of white people own slaves 0:53:09.000 --> 0:53:12.640 at face value, though we know that number is technically incorrect, 0:53:12.920 --> 0:53:16.400 and let's apply that standard to any other industry. What 0:53:16.560 --> 0:53:20.360 percentage of Americans own social media companies or technology companies 0:53:20.360 --> 0:53:23.240 such as Apple. It's a tiny percentage. 0:53:23.440 --> 0:53:24.720 I'm doubtful if it's. 0:53:24.560 --> 0:53:27.919 Even one percent of Americans, And yet no one would 0:53:27.960 --> 0:53:31.880 credibly argue that social media companies are not ubiquitous across 0:53:31.920 --> 0:53:35.480 American life, that they don't play a major influence on 0:53:35.520 --> 0:53:39.120 our political, social, and economic life in America. And in fact, 0:53:39.160 --> 0:53:41.640 what we know is that more than seventy percent of 0:53:41.680 --> 0:53:46.120 Americans use social media, though hardly any Americans own social 0:53:46.120 --> 0:53:49.320 media platform. There's a reason that the heads of Meta, 0:53:49.440 --> 0:53:52.120 Apple and Amazon, Google and x all took part in 0:53:52.160 --> 0:53:55.440 Trump's inauguration festivities, with several of them standing on the 0:53:55.560 --> 0:53:58.120 actual diies during Trump's inauguration. 0:53:59.120 --> 0:54:03.000 So, you know, I think this is important to do 0:54:03.120 --> 0:54:07.920 because this is Nicole Hannah Jones fact check five days 0:54:08.000 --> 0:54:10.920 after Jillian michaels is on the show, which gives ample 0:54:10.960 --> 0:54:15.520 time for any media outlet, really to respond, any media outlet. 0:54:16.200 --> 0:54:18.840 Maybe it's not just Abby's response, right, Like, maybe not, 0:54:18.960 --> 0:54:23.000 But after Nicole Hannah Jones' post, Abby Phillips had this 0:54:23.080 --> 0:54:24.879 to say on her show on Tuesday Night. 0:54:25.920 --> 0:54:29.120 Last week, on this show, a guest shocked the table 0:54:29.440 --> 0:54:32.440 by arguing, in part that slavery in America can't just 0:54:32.520 --> 0:54:35.839 be blamed on one race and that museums put too 0:54:35.880 --> 0:54:39.080 much focus on the role of white people who participated 0:54:39.080 --> 0:54:43.320 in that terrible institution. And now tonight that same argument 0:54:43.440 --> 0:54:45.880 is being pushed by the President of the United States, 0:54:46.440 --> 0:54:48.719 Donald Trump says that one of the reasons for his 0:54:48.840 --> 0:54:53.359 crackdown on Smithsonian museums is quote, everything discussed is how 0:54:53.400 --> 0:54:56.759 bad slavery was. What we try to do on this 0:54:56.840 --> 0:55:00.520 program is create a platform for discussion and debate, debate 0:55:00.880 --> 0:55:04.440 that reflects the very real differences that exist in this country. 0:55:04.920 --> 0:55:08.240 It's what echo chambers in our society fail to do. Frankly, 0:55:08.760 --> 0:55:12.880 but on this topic, it's important to say objectively slavery 0:55:13.440 --> 0:55:16.000 was indeed bad. 0:55:18.080 --> 0:55:18.920 I'm not frozen. 0:55:19.719 --> 0:55:20.400 Yeah, I'm either. 0:55:20.640 --> 0:55:23.160 I'm just pausing to allow you all to weigh in 0:55:23.520 --> 0:55:28.279 Andrew effect, do you want to answer whether or not 0:55:28.320 --> 0:55:30.960 you believe slavery was bad and whether or not at 0:55:30.960 --> 0:55:33.360 this in this day and age, that should be litigated. 0:55:33.640 --> 0:55:37.960 We had Donald Trump's social post from Abby's screen. We 0:55:38.000 --> 0:55:40.000 can also put that up if you all need to 0:55:40.040 --> 0:55:43.399 read it. But he's very concerned with the fact that 0:55:44.719 --> 0:55:48.840 we're spending a lot of time on wokeism, that the 0:55:48.840 --> 0:55:52.120 Smithsonian is out of control, where everything discussed is how 0:55:52.160 --> 0:55:55.680 horrible our country is, how bad slavery was. And I'd 0:55:55.719 --> 0:55:57.520 love to know if you all have a silver lining 0:55:57.600 --> 0:56:00.880 like Bill O'Reilly about how we were fed and slept well, 0:56:01.840 --> 0:56:02.040 And I. 0:56:02.160 --> 0:56:06.719 Honestly, I think it's such it's so beneath our dignity 0:56:07.040 --> 0:56:11.960 to even engage that I think to even debate it 0:56:12.040 --> 0:56:17.480 legitimizes their perspective, which is part of the danger. And listen, 0:56:17.600 --> 0:56:20.600 I feel very uncomfortable and awkward weighing in on this 0:56:20.680 --> 0:56:24.000 for a few reasons. One, I know Abby. I've known 0:56:24.040 --> 0:56:26.880 Abby for a long time and I like her personally, 0:56:27.360 --> 0:56:29.480 so I want to be and I know you do too. 0:56:30.960 --> 0:56:33.960 I want to be careful, like I'm not trying to 0:56:34.000 --> 0:56:37.440 say this is all you know, like what Abby should 0:56:37.440 --> 0:56:40.760 have done, Because I think this is a network issue. 0:56:40.880 --> 0:56:44.480 Her show is not the only person who platforms problematic people. 0:56:44.760 --> 0:56:48.279 The network itself does. And because y'all are listening to 0:56:48.320 --> 0:56:51.920 some free blacks, listen, I'm gonna give this truth. And 0:56:51.960 --> 0:56:53.799 you can invite me or not invite me on the 0:56:53.800 --> 0:56:58.680 network ever. Again, I think we it. It is not 0:56:58.920 --> 0:57:02.000 courage if there is not a sacrifice. It is not 0:57:02.400 --> 0:57:05.319 valor if you don't have skin in the game. So 0:57:05.520 --> 0:57:08.880 I think all three of us ain't never been scared 0:57:08.920 --> 0:57:11.879 to speak an honest truth. And let corporate media. Deal 0:57:11.920 --> 0:57:14.400 with it as you will, but we live in service 0:57:14.480 --> 0:57:18.560 to a higher truth and one that does not engage 0:57:18.640 --> 0:57:22.480 in debate with low life, half witted individuals who do 0:57:22.560 --> 0:57:25.520 nothing but regurgitate talking points from the White House. And 0:57:25.520 --> 0:57:29.720 that is what Gillian michaels the biggest loser is in 0:57:29.760 --> 0:57:33.600 this moment. I think it's incredibly frightening that she's raising 0:57:33.600 --> 0:57:36.760 a black child with that ignorant ass attitude. And I 0:57:36.840 --> 0:57:42.320 detest her. I detest people who look who share her viewpoints. 0:57:42.400 --> 0:57:47.440 I detest the people who voted for this administration. I 0:57:47.560 --> 0:57:51.960 find them to be I just I don't honor or 0:57:52.040 --> 0:57:55.400 respect their positions at all. And so to present some 0:57:55.440 --> 0:57:58.680 of these things as though it is a debate, to 0:57:58.800 --> 0:58:02.440 present this as though well, she says, you know that 0:58:02.560 --> 0:58:06.040 slavery wasn't that bad, and she says that slavery was 0:58:06.080 --> 0:58:08.200 really bad now you guys have at it. I think 0:58:08.240 --> 0:58:11.800 that is a danger. And when I had a platform 0:58:12.200 --> 0:58:15.400 on a major cable news network, I was willing to 0:58:15.560 --> 0:58:19.520 risk it all before I would dare ever let somebody 0:58:19.560 --> 0:58:22.360 sit on my set and say something that was one 0:58:22.400 --> 0:58:27.640 disrespectful to another guest or disrespectful to our history and 0:58:27.760 --> 0:58:30.320 our facts. That is the standard by which I hold myself. 0:58:30.480 --> 0:58:33.000 I'm not arrogant enough to say what choices somebody else 0:58:33.000 --> 0:58:35.800 should make. But I think to watch seeing in the 0:58:35.840 --> 0:58:39.240 place where I began my career, to watch them devolve 0:58:39.520 --> 0:58:43.240 into this Jerry Springer type atmosphere is disgusting. And then 0:58:43.280 --> 0:58:46.440 when we step back and look at journalism as an industry, 0:58:46.480 --> 0:58:49.200 how it has failed at the most important time, it 0:58:49.240 --> 0:58:52.360 has failed and continues to fail. We never want to 0:58:52.440 --> 0:58:55.920 acknowledge white supremacy. They talk about this immigration policy that 0:58:56.040 --> 0:58:59.720 is the brainchild of Stephen Miller, who is a white supremacist. 0:59:00.080 --> 0:59:03.720 An opinion is rooted in reporting by the Wall Street Journal. 0:59:03.760 --> 0:59:07.280 It is widely known you will never hear an anchor 0:59:07.320 --> 0:59:11.000 introduce or reference Steven Miller as a white supremacist. Why 0:59:11.240 --> 0:59:13.360 for the comfort of white folks? And so many of 0:59:13.400 --> 0:59:16.000 these discussions that I know what we talk about when 0:59:16.000 --> 0:59:18.040 the cameras aren't on, But when the cameras come on, 0:59:18.160 --> 0:59:20.320 people want to get polite, People want to both sides 0:59:20.320 --> 0:59:22.760 things I don't do that. It's almost only one version 0:59:22.800 --> 0:59:26.280 of Tiffany, and I can attest it's only one version 0:59:26.280 --> 0:59:29.200 of Angela. It's only one version of Andrew. What we speak, 0:59:29.480 --> 0:59:31.840 we mean, we walk it like we talk it, and 0:59:31.880 --> 0:59:36.120 so I just think we have to have a higher 0:59:36.160 --> 0:59:42.640 accountability of having those types of discussions in a way 0:59:43.080 --> 0:59:46.520 that presents a lie and equates it with a fact, 0:59:47.160 --> 0:59:51.520 that presents somebody with an opinion and equates them with 0:59:51.600 --> 0:59:54.200 an expert. I have said on that very show across 0:59:54.200 --> 0:59:57.320 from people who are neither my intellectual equal nor am 0:59:57.320 --> 1:00:02.760 my professional equal on any level, and I just you know, 1:00:03.080 --> 1:00:05.040 we talked about this before, angel and a lot of 1:00:05.040 --> 1:00:07.160 the comments, thank you guys for weighing in, and I 1:00:07.240 --> 1:00:10.280 so appreciate everybody's thoughts. A lot of the comments, they 1:00:10.320 --> 1:00:13.440 were pretty mixed Angela. And I am respecting your boundary, Angela, 1:00:13.480 --> 1:00:16.040 because you were clear on the last episode. I was 1:00:16.080 --> 1:00:18.560 trying to like politely push and Angela was like, just 1:00:18.600 --> 1:00:21.000 so I'm clear, So we don't have discuss this again. 1:00:21.080 --> 1:00:23.760 I am not going on that show unless all three 1:00:23.800 --> 1:00:27.240 of us go together. So I completely respect that boundary. 1:00:27.640 --> 1:00:31.680 Beyond respecting the boundary, I respect you for having that 1:00:31.720 --> 1:00:34.440 position in that boundary. There were people who are like Tiffany, 1:00:34.520 --> 1:00:36.680 I love that you go on there because if it's nonsense, 1:00:36.960 --> 1:00:39.520 at least you're somebody who's going to push back on that. 1:00:39.760 --> 1:00:42.280 I gotta say, I feel torn. I feel really torn. 1:00:42.600 --> 1:00:45.240 You reminded me, you said, because you said you would 1:00:45.280 --> 1:00:47.160 never do that show. You reminded me of that, and 1:00:47.320 --> 1:00:49.439 I remember getting so mad at you. I never told 1:00:49.440 --> 1:00:50.960 you this, but you dropped in our group chat. You 1:00:50.960 --> 1:00:53.160 guys Tiff is on it happy, and I was like, 1:00:53.160 --> 1:00:55.320 don't tell people I'm on the show. That's how I 1:00:55.360 --> 1:00:59.240 throw inside. Don't tell our friends I'm doing this show 1:01:00.160 --> 1:01:02.720 because I did have some shape. But I love I mean, 1:01:02.760 --> 1:01:05.160 I just I feel before Abby had this show, I 1:01:05.240 --> 1:01:07.400 was so proud of her. I just I love her voice, 1:01:07.520 --> 1:01:09.480 and I just think she's so beautiful and she has 1:01:09.520 --> 1:01:12.280 such a great spirit. And I'm cheering for her because 1:01:12.280 --> 1:01:15.000 we have too few black women on air, and I 1:01:15.040 --> 1:01:18.160 fear if Abby goes away, then who will take her? 1:01:18.240 --> 1:01:20.840 It'll be somebody worse, like do we want Scott Jennings 1:01:20.880 --> 1:01:21.440 in that chair? 1:01:21.640 --> 1:01:21.840 You know? 1:01:22.120 --> 1:01:24.960 So that's all my jumble thoughts. Sorry for going on 1:01:25.080 --> 1:01:28.760 so long about it, but I don't know. I really 1:01:28.840 --> 1:01:30.880 want to hear because. 1:01:30.600 --> 1:01:34.560 People, even when they comment clearly they are torn like 1:01:34.640 --> 1:01:37.200 I have. If I have to choose between you going 1:01:37.240 --> 1:01:41.000 on or Candice Owens, duh, right, yeah, I if but 1:01:41.160 --> 1:01:44.600 I think that we've entered if we've crossed the red line, 1:01:44.640 --> 1:01:46.600 and you said the red line has been crossed one 1:01:46.640 --> 1:01:49.160 hundred times, what is our boundary. I don't want to 1:01:49.200 --> 1:01:51.080 make this again about whether or not we go on 1:01:51.120 --> 1:01:53.600 the show. That is so besides the point. What I 1:01:53.640 --> 1:01:57.000 think is really an issue now is we have been 1:01:57.080 --> 1:02:03.160 reduced to the point of having a conversation about how slavery, 1:02:03.240 --> 1:02:06.200 the history of slavery will be will be told in 1:02:06.240 --> 1:02:09.800 our independent institutions, Some that we help, that we helped 1:02:09.840 --> 1:02:12.560 to fund, some that we helped to build. Machissic and 1:02:12.600 --> 1:02:16.160 mckissic was a key construction partner on the National Museum 1:02:16.240 --> 1:02:19.600 of African American History and Culture. We are now at 1:02:19.640 --> 1:02:23.040 the point where we are litigating the fact that white 1:02:23.040 --> 1:02:27.960 people are responsible for the institution of slavery, for the 1:02:28.040 --> 1:02:32.560 fact that white people are responsible for the Transatlantic slave trade. 1:02:32.640 --> 1:02:35.800 I don't care if they were able to pick off 1:02:35.840 --> 1:02:38.280 a few negroes. You all were able to do that 1:02:38.400 --> 1:02:41.480 in modern day times. That's how Clarence got on the 1:02:41.600 --> 1:02:42.880 Supreme Court. 1:02:43.520 --> 1:02:44.640 Who GI's are gonna do? Well? 1:02:44.640 --> 1:02:47.160 Who she's gonna do. We have talked about this, so 1:02:47.360 --> 1:02:50.040 we're fine. We understand that. What we're not fine with. 1:02:50.400 --> 1:02:54.320 What we don't understand is why we even give audience 1:02:54.440 --> 1:03:01.360 to someone who would be so blatantly in and gaslight 1:03:01.520 --> 1:03:06.400 us about the most traumatic incident in American history, the 1:03:06.400 --> 1:03:08.919 most traumatic first centuries. 1:03:09.480 --> 1:03:11.280 It's like, what are we talking about? Right? 1:03:11.320 --> 1:03:13.680 So I think that really is it for me? And 1:03:13.760 --> 1:03:15.880 now you know it's started with him. I don't know 1:03:15.880 --> 1:03:18.280 if y'all remember when he ran in sixteen and Andrew. 1:03:18.360 --> 1:03:19.720 I think Andrew over there writing a sermon. 1:03:20.600 --> 1:03:21.320 I'm promised. 1:03:21.320 --> 1:03:28.640 I don't want to interrupt. 1:03:28.800 --> 1:03:31.560 No, no, I want to say I won't say this, 1:03:31.920 --> 1:03:36.160 but I'm just thinking he's running if you know, I 1:03:36.240 --> 1:03:36.880 really want to hear that. 1:03:37.840 --> 1:03:41.960 I'm just thinking, you know that we are in this 1:03:42.240 --> 1:03:46.720 time where we have an obligation to not just speak truth, 1:03:46.760 --> 1:03:49.240 but to speak truth to power, to call the thing 1:03:49.280 --> 1:03:52.280 a thing, to hold these institutions that we have been 1:03:52.320 --> 1:03:55.720 beholden to, that we have been dedicated consumers. 1:03:55.120 --> 1:03:56.680 Of, to account. 1:03:57.000 --> 1:03:59.480 We ain't had no protest on this, we ain't had 1:03:59.560 --> 1:04:02.920 no met we have meetings when people were just fired 1:04:03.000 --> 1:04:06.480 from the networks and wrote letters where's our meeting on 1:04:06.560 --> 1:04:09.720 the obligation of these people to hold like it's not 1:04:09.760 --> 1:04:10.720 a reality show. 1:04:11.520 --> 1:04:14.680 It is news. It's news, so let it be news. 1:04:14.720 --> 1:04:17.600 When Donald Trump was running the first time, y'all, and 1:04:17.640 --> 1:04:20.040 they were asked, I think they asked him about Harriet 1:04:20.080 --> 1:04:22.720 Tubman being on the twenty dollars bill, and he said 1:04:22.760 --> 1:04:26.000 maybe the two dollar bill or something. We don't have 1:04:26.120 --> 1:04:28.640 Harriet on the two or the twenty. And they took 1:04:28.640 --> 1:04:31.960 her off the National Park Service website. And they're making 1:04:32.000 --> 1:04:34.560 it more restrictive for us to get data from the census. 1:04:34.760 --> 1:04:36.760 And now they're wondering if they should do the census 1:04:36.760 --> 1:04:39.160 at all or if the Census should be private based 1:04:39.160 --> 1:04:42.840 on the conversation we just had with Sherilyn. Right here 1:04:42.960 --> 1:04:47.400 is where we are now. We are watching the erosion, 1:04:47.600 --> 1:04:50.640 the destruction, the blowing up of all of the institutions 1:04:50.840 --> 1:04:52.160 that we have built. 1:04:51.880 --> 1:04:57.520 With our blood soiled hands. This is not okay, we passed. 1:04:57.920 --> 1:05:00.680 It's a state of emergency. We're passed. This is co read. 1:05:00.920 --> 1:05:04.479 We're passed down the alarm. It isn't all out war. 1:05:04.560 --> 1:05:09.000 And that war is being like executed on our babies 1:05:09.040 --> 1:05:12.200 in DC right now. And that's the test ground. They 1:05:12.240 --> 1:05:15.280 are testing us, and y'all we are failing. She merely 1:05:15.320 --> 1:05:18.800 gave us a D, what's lord and a F? I 1:05:18.840 --> 1:05:21.120 guess we're We're not supposed to say that no more 1:05:21.120 --> 1:05:22.920 on the show, but I want to know they honestly 1:05:23.080 --> 1:05:25.360 can't say that there What other word can we use 1:05:25.400 --> 1:05:26.000 for right now? 1:05:26.880 --> 1:05:30.200 Get that be button ready because we're okay, Andrew, if 1:05:30.200 --> 1:05:32.360 you ain't got at least one your response, we don't 1:05:32.400 --> 1:05:32.800 want to hear. 1:05:33.240 --> 1:05:35.360 I don't have any. I don't have any to get. 1:05:35.400 --> 1:05:40.200 I want to hear. Fay, I'll just. 1:05:40.200 --> 1:05:43.120 Say this one. I have fewer pearls to clutch. 1:05:43.240 --> 1:05:45.280 As it relates to the corporate media and how the 1:05:45.320 --> 1:05:50.000 corporate media handles their business, it is not new. I've 1:05:50.040 --> 1:05:53.640 been watching Jerry Springer on CNN for a very long time, 1:05:54.560 --> 1:05:57.760 probably since I began consuming the news. I think to 1:05:57.840 --> 1:06:02.440 make Abby Phillips, the object of the issue is a 1:06:02.520 --> 1:06:06.200 misplacement of where we are to be putting our concern. 1:06:07.000 --> 1:06:09.960 First of all, I said, and I apologize for interrupting, 1:06:10.000 --> 1:06:12.600 but where did this woman license and get the license? 1:06:12.680 --> 1:06:16.000 Julie the Michael's woman? What she got from Byron Donald's 1:06:16.360 --> 1:06:19.560 a black man who sits in Congress, who is likely 1:06:19.640 --> 1:06:23.360 going to be the Republican nominee for governor of Florida 1:06:23.400 --> 1:06:27.800 with the endorsement of Donald Trump, who in blackface, got 1:06:27.840 --> 1:06:30.720 out there telling us how good slavery was. 1:06:30.760 --> 1:06:31.640 For black folks. 1:06:32.760 --> 1:06:36.120 The Minstrel Show, live in and effect, right in front 1:06:36.120 --> 1:06:42.080 of us, a black man, a grifter, telling us what 1:06:42.280 --> 1:06:44.920 was good for us because we were fed and housed 1:06:44.920 --> 1:06:48.440 and learned skills that we could then later apply to 1:06:48.600 --> 1:06:51.880 jobs that black people would eventually come to doing this country. 1:06:52.440 --> 1:06:54.280 So there's been a number. 1:06:54.840 --> 1:06:55.600 I appreciate it. 1:06:55.680 --> 1:06:58.880 I'd be saying, this show is intended to get out 1:06:58.920 --> 1:07:01.640 of the echo chamber. I never ever, ever want to 1:07:01.680 --> 1:07:04.880 be again surprised on election night that there was a 1:07:04.960 --> 1:07:07.840 whole half of the country that walked away with an 1:07:07.880 --> 1:07:11.320 impression set of feelings that I had never heard, never thought, 1:07:11.400 --> 1:07:15.120 didn't didn't didn't believe they would give credence to Abby, 1:07:15.160 --> 1:07:20.880 as a host responded to the obscenity of an insaneness 1:07:20.920 --> 1:07:23.880 of what this woman was was attempted to articulate. But 1:07:24.400 --> 1:07:30.800 across American networks, news channels, radio stations, platforms, uh you 1:07:30.840 --> 1:07:33.240 know that, on the Internet and otherwise, there are so 1:07:33.400 --> 1:07:36.200 many places where those comments would not have even been 1:07:36.320 --> 1:07:39.320 questioned because the listening audience from the hosts of the 1:07:39.320 --> 1:07:42.920 people who tune in believe it, hook line and sinker. 1:07:43.720 --> 1:07:47.400 There is a war on black people. That energy is 1:07:47.440 --> 1:07:52.320 coming from somewhere. There is an audience for exactly this 1:07:52.440 --> 1:07:55.480 kind of bullshit that that Michael spreads. 1:07:55.560 --> 1:07:57.000 But she's not the only one. 1:07:57.080 --> 1:08:01.080 We're getting it from black men and blackface who occupy 1:08:01.160 --> 1:08:04.840 only white spaces and who only intend to represent the 1:08:04.840 --> 1:08:08.320 interest the beliefs of white people who are at the 1:08:08.360 --> 1:08:11.960 apex of all of this simply offended and don't want 1:08:12.040 --> 1:08:15.880 their children to be offended by the history carried out 1:08:15.920 --> 1:08:20.280 by their ancestors. This is about ego, and since they're 1:08:20.320 --> 1:08:23.799 in position to check ego, they have they have every 1:08:23.800 --> 1:08:28.240 intent to check it everywhere it appears. What I appreciate 1:08:28.439 --> 1:08:33.480 is that now that we know that this narrative drives 1:08:33.720 --> 1:08:38.080 fuels maybe a whole half of the country, then we 1:08:38.120 --> 1:08:40.559 can be better prepared when we come into contact with 1:08:40.720 --> 1:08:43.120 them about how we need to move, how we need 1:08:43.160 --> 1:08:46.200 to flow, and what checking we need to do real, 1:08:46.520 --> 1:08:50.000 live and in person when we hear it, because they're 1:08:50.040 --> 1:08:52.839 not just whispering it amongst themselves. They're saying it directly 1:08:52.880 --> 1:08:56.080 to you, listener, How are you checking them? How are 1:08:56.080 --> 1:09:00.960 you setting the recordstraate Because the problem is a way 1:09:01.040 --> 1:09:04.040 too big for any one personality to be able to 1:09:04.080 --> 1:09:08.080 handle any one individual, and certainly a reluctant, if not 1:09:08.160 --> 1:09:13.160 cooperative network right in our harm. So we have to 1:09:13.200 --> 1:09:15.120 be the protectors of our harm. We have to be 1:09:15.120 --> 1:09:18.320 the protectors of our history. And as I have children maticulating, 1:09:18.400 --> 1:09:21.000 matriculating through the public school system and a state where 1:09:21.000 --> 1:09:23.439 the governor doesn't want anything in the books or taught 1:09:23.520 --> 1:09:26.439 verbally from the teachers that would bring offense to his children, 1:09:27.320 --> 1:09:30.240 I goddamn know Jay and I both that we will 1:09:30.280 --> 1:09:33.480 have an obligation to do all of the history lessons, 1:09:33.600 --> 1:09:37.360 or to at least supplement every era of history as 1:09:37.400 --> 1:09:40.360 my kids matriculate to it through it. Thank goodness, I 1:09:40.360 --> 1:09:43.559 was a political science and history person because I love 1:09:43.600 --> 1:09:45.760 it and I know it, and they're going to get it. 1:09:45.840 --> 1:09:47.880 But I'm also appreciative to groups like Jack and Jail 1:09:47.880 --> 1:09:50.960 who are taking it as part their responsibility amongst the 1:09:51.040 --> 1:09:54.759 kids who participate there to bring real black history directly 1:09:54.840 --> 1:09:57.080 to them if they're not getting it from the schools 1:09:57.240 --> 1:09:59.000 that they pay for them to attend, or that they 1:09:59.080 --> 1:10:02.520 attend publicly, and I think we've got to guard ourselves 1:10:02.640 --> 1:10:07.200 up people to fill that void, because if they're not 1:10:07.280 --> 1:10:09.080 doing it there and you ain't doing it at home, 1:10:09.479 --> 1:10:13.080 God help our children when it comes to knowing your history. 1:10:13.080 --> 1:10:14.200 So it doesn't get repeated. 1:10:15.200 --> 1:10:19.400 Andrew, I really appreciate you lifting up the point about 1:10:19.439 --> 1:10:24.719 this not being a responsibility that is solely at Abby's feed. 1:10:24.720 --> 1:10:25.760 I think that's important. 1:10:26.320 --> 1:10:29.040 Everybody on this show certainly supports her, but I think 1:10:29.080 --> 1:10:32.240 that we are growing exhausted of watching this happen to 1:10:32.360 --> 1:10:35.600 sister after sister, brother after brother, and it happens in 1:10:35.640 --> 1:10:38.360 different ways. It's may manifest in different ways, but we 1:10:38.479 --> 1:10:40.519 have to call the thing out. So I think the 1:10:40.600 --> 1:10:42.680 question I would have for the audience is what does 1:10:42.720 --> 1:10:45.240 it look like to support Abby in this moment and 1:10:45.280 --> 1:10:47.759 for the other Abby's that still find themselves on air, 1:10:47.920 --> 1:10:50.720 you know, in crosshairs to have to even go on 1:10:50.760 --> 1:10:52.840 a show to say, I just want to be clear 1:10:52.920 --> 1:10:56.479 for the record, slavery's bad. When Jillian Michaels is saying 1:10:56.680 --> 1:11:00.320 white people bad, well, some of you all are have 1:11:00.520 --> 1:11:02.160 up by virtue of the fact that you're on this 1:11:02.240 --> 1:11:05.920 show saying what you're saying, white people bad, especially you, right, 1:11:06.280 --> 1:11:09.120 so until you pass a different litmus test for what 1:11:09.200 --> 1:11:11.280 it means to stand in the gap for your black 1:11:11.400 --> 1:11:14.240 child or for your black friends, white people bad. And 1:11:14.280 --> 1:11:16.640 if y'all can't understand the distinction, I don't know what 1:11:16.720 --> 1:11:19.000 to tell you. Go to the Smithsonian before they change it. 1:11:19.040 --> 1:11:21.760 Perhaps with that, I guess we can go to Cast 1:11:21.800 --> 1:11:22.120 to Action. 1:11:22.439 --> 1:11:24.120 I just want to add to your request with just 1:11:24.160 --> 1:11:26.400 to say, not only do you how you stand in 1:11:26.439 --> 1:11:30.320 and support your folks, but also hold them accountable. That 1:11:30.439 --> 1:11:33.120 question needs to be extended to every network you watch, 1:11:33.240 --> 1:11:35.759 in every new station on that network that you watch, 1:11:36.000 --> 1:11:39.160 where the hosts don't even check their guests when they 1:11:39.160 --> 1:11:42.920 come out of left field, right field, middle of space 1:11:43.320 --> 1:11:45.960 with their ideas, they've got to be more accountable to 1:11:46.120 --> 1:11:50.280 us period. To Cherylyn's point about us out boxing our weight, 1:11:50.760 --> 1:11:53.759 we have the power within ourselves to not just hold 1:11:53.960 --> 1:11:56.720 folks who look like us accountable, but the networks we 1:11:56.840 --> 1:12:00.439 watch subscribe to give money to, they get out advertising 1:12:00.479 --> 1:12:02.840 dollars off of us. They ought to respect us enough 1:12:02.880 --> 1:12:05.200 not to do that bullshit either, and we would. 1:12:05.000 --> 1:12:07.479 Expect ourselves enough not to give them the And that's 1:12:07.479 --> 1:12:09.960 the part we do. I pray that we get to 1:12:10.000 --> 1:12:12.280 the point we're only it doesn't have to be all 1:12:12.320 --> 1:12:14.439 of us, but a small percentage of us do what 1:12:14.479 --> 1:12:17.639 we need to do to ensure the tide changes. They 1:12:17.680 --> 1:12:20.759 are not going to coward to us without a demand. 1:12:20.880 --> 1:12:21.320 We know that. 1:12:21.360 --> 1:12:24.080 Frederick Douglass told us that history lessons have told us 1:12:24.080 --> 1:12:24.639 that over and over. 1:12:24.720 --> 1:12:26.479 Sorry too, but what does that mean? 1:12:27.360 --> 1:12:29.200 Like what is our demand? 1:12:29.240 --> 1:12:29.479 You know? 1:12:29.680 --> 1:12:31.439 Like what are we asking people to do? Is it 1:12:31.680 --> 1:12:32.400 don't watch? 1:12:32.640 --> 1:12:32.920 Is it? 1:12:33.720 --> 1:12:33.920 You know? 1:12:33.960 --> 1:12:37.599 I know you say, don't go on there? Like as 1:12:37.600 --> 1:12:40.000 a cord cutting is at an all time high, particularly 1:12:40.040 --> 1:12:42.519 in black households, and black people consume a lot of 1:12:42.800 --> 1:12:46.680 media across all types of media, so we're already abandoning 1:12:46.720 --> 1:12:49.000 cable news streaming is like yanking them down, which I 1:12:49.000 --> 1:12:51.320 think is why we see some of these ridiculous tactics, 1:12:51.560 --> 1:12:55.760 some of these people who are espousing ridiculous thoughts during 1:12:55.800 --> 1:12:59.160 the you know, opinion hour at ten o'clock. You can 1:12:59.200 --> 1:13:01.720 see them on CNN's morning show. You can see them 1:13:01.720 --> 1:13:03.800 in the middle of the afternoon. So that that's why 1:13:03.840 --> 1:13:06.320 I just try to caution people like like we're saying 1:13:06.600 --> 1:13:09.920 this is not on ABBY, you know, like this is 1:13:09.960 --> 1:13:13.920 and it's not just on CNN either, this is also MSNBC. 1:13:14.080 --> 1:13:16.599 I don't even consider Fox, but you know this is 1:13:18.960 --> 1:13:23.080 MS that's stupid ass name. But yes, but across networks, 1:13:23.160 --> 1:13:25.800 not even just the cable news, but across networks. The 1:13:25.840 --> 1:13:29.160 way that we normalize white supremacy for the comfort of 1:13:29.200 --> 1:13:29.880 white people. 1:13:31.080 --> 1:13:43.479 Yeah, we can use that to transition into calls to action. 1:13:43.560 --> 1:13:45.800 And I'll say that my call to action first would 1:13:45.800 --> 1:13:49.439 be signed the petition to Protect the Integrity of the 1:13:49.520 --> 1:13:52.320 National Museum of African American History and Culture. There is 1:13:52.320 --> 1:13:54.840 a change dot org petition. We'll make sure that that's 1:13:54.880 --> 1:13:57.479 in our show notes. Please hear me. I'm having a 1:13:57.479 --> 1:14:02.320 broader conversation beyond cable news news, regular news, anybody news. 1:14:02.479 --> 1:14:04.439 I'm talking about all of the things that we need 1:14:04.479 --> 1:14:07.800 to do to hold these institutions accountable to properly serving us. 1:14:08.000 --> 1:14:10.559 Let's start with the Smithsonian petition. Then we need to 1:14:10.560 --> 1:14:13.080 be having meetings. There needs to be some folks who protest. 1:14:13.360 --> 1:14:15.080 We need to make sure that our folks, folks are 1:14:15.200 --> 1:14:17.720 very clear about the facts of their power and what 1:14:17.760 --> 1:14:19.160 these institutions owe us. 1:14:19.360 --> 1:14:21.479 But let's start with the Smithsonian. Then I'll yield. 1:14:22.439 --> 1:14:24.559 Did you tell just so, did you tell people how 1:14:24.600 --> 1:14:25.920 they can sign the petition? 1:14:26.240 --> 1:14:26.800 Yes, ma'am. 1:14:26.880 --> 1:14:28.840 While you were typing, I said that it will make 1:14:28.880 --> 1:14:30.280 sure we put it in the show notes. 1:14:30.720 --> 1:14:32.840 It's going to be in show notes. Okay, I have 1:14:32.920 --> 1:14:37.479 a right, okay, because I was just about to say 1:14:37.640 --> 1:14:39.920 change dot org. And I have a silly question like 1:14:39.920 --> 1:14:41.840 when we say we're putting something in the show notes. 1:14:43.640 --> 1:14:46.439 We want you if you, if you, if you look, 1:14:46.479 --> 1:14:48.679 if you actually ever listened to our show, folks at home, 1:14:49.439 --> 1:14:53.120 you're going to go into the podcast. You'll click on 1:14:53.160 --> 1:14:56.120 the podcast and there's a description, and the description is 1:14:56.120 --> 1:14:59.880 where we normally direct people to action oriented items and 1:15:00.000 --> 1:15:02.000 and that is also the case for YouTube, so on 1:15:02.040 --> 1:15:05.760 the iHeart podcast app or if you go into Apple Podcasts, 1:15:05.760 --> 1:15:08.559 in the description, you'll see any of our casts to action. 1:15:08.720 --> 1:15:11.759 There are things that you can do from home. Okay, sorry, 1:15:11.880 --> 1:15:14.000 that was first I was. 1:15:14.040 --> 1:15:16.519 I was simply going to just admonish our listeners and 1:15:16.560 --> 1:15:19.479 ourselves to just read just to quickly check back in 1:15:20.320 --> 1:15:27.040 with Project twenty twenty five as well as you know 1:15:27.840 --> 1:15:31.479 lessons around how to be an Autocrat because from the 1:15:31.520 --> 1:15:35.599 Smithsonian trailing back to the beginning of the Trump days 1:15:35.600 --> 1:15:36.360 in the White. 1:15:36.080 --> 1:15:42.120 House and the Smithsonian, I said, the Smithsonian does that. 1:15:43.760 --> 1:15:43.960 Bad? 1:15:44.080 --> 1:15:48.280 Well, you know, but but but from the Smithsonian, pulling 1:15:48.280 --> 1:15:50.480 all the way back to the beginning of this administration. 1:15:51.120 --> 1:15:54.040 One thing that they that we will never be able 1:15:54.080 --> 1:15:56.360 to accuse them of of not saying the plan out loud. 1:15:57.400 --> 1:16:00.240 Not only has it been said, it's been written, and 1:16:00.360 --> 1:16:05.679 there is no harm in reading it to know what 1:16:05.800 --> 1:16:09.559 is coming down the pike. As we said on the 1:16:09.560 --> 1:16:11.800 other show a couple of weeks ago, when if you 1:16:11.840 --> 1:16:13.640 stay ready, you don't have to get ready, and we 1:16:13.640 --> 1:16:15.600 were talking about that in relation to the cities that 1:16:15.640 --> 1:16:19.040 have already been name checked around an invasion from the 1:16:19.040 --> 1:16:22.840 federal government and their likely brothers sister states that want 1:16:22.880 --> 1:16:26.920 to go in using their law enforcement bodies to again 1:16:27.040 --> 1:16:30.519 harass and terrorize our people in our communities. I simply 1:16:30.560 --> 1:16:34.599 say to update ourselves so that we can then steady 1:16:34.720 --> 1:16:37.599 ourselves for it. We can steady ourselves for the fight. 1:16:37.640 --> 1:16:40.080 And when I say steady ourselves, I don't mean withstand it. 1:16:40.560 --> 1:16:43.559 I mean withstand it, yes, but also mean fight back, 1:16:44.120 --> 1:16:47.280 prepare to fight back, be ready so you don't have 1:16:47.320 --> 1:16:47.960 to get ready. 1:16:49.000 --> 1:16:52.960 Well, now, I'm ashamed of my CTA, but there's one 1:16:53.040 --> 1:16:54.880 I've given before and I feel the need to give 1:16:54.920 --> 1:16:57.000 it again because it's getting a bit outrageous, and that 1:16:57.080 --> 1:17:00.800 is speakerphones. I don't know if people didn't the first time, 1:17:01.000 --> 1:17:03.559 but people seem to think that, well, it's my kid, 1:17:03.920 --> 1:17:08.160 and my kid is playing with his iPad on the train. 1:17:09.520 --> 1:17:11.479 You know, I take the Asella all the time and 1:17:11.520 --> 1:17:14.120 so on amtrak these and I don't care if it's 1:17:14.160 --> 1:17:16.679 your kid. They need to have headphones on. We don't 1:17:16.720 --> 1:17:20.280 want to hear cartoons. And if we're sitting in the airport, 1:17:20.520 --> 1:17:22.400 get off speaker phone. I don't want to want you 1:17:22.479 --> 1:17:25.120 next to meek like, use your earphones. Nobody wants to 1:17:25.120 --> 1:17:27.600 hear that. I know these are serious times, but this 1:17:27.680 --> 1:17:30.120 is a serious annoyance and frustration. 1:17:29.760 --> 1:17:32.920 To mine, Yes to mine during these times, trying to. 1:17:32.880 --> 1:17:35.320 Be them listening to music, and I got just it's 1:17:35.360 --> 1:17:38.559 so obnoxious. Stop doing that. I felt bad that I 1:17:38.560 --> 1:17:39.960 I don't care that the kids. 1:17:40.080 --> 1:17:43.240 What tell me, you said, we don't want to hear cartoons. 1:17:43.280 --> 1:17:45.200 We want to hear. When the kids realized that we 1:17:45.240 --> 1:17:47.080 had the TVs in the car and that they could 1:17:47.120 --> 1:17:49.080 watch their shows wherever we were going to. 1:17:49.040 --> 1:17:50.240 School or on a long trip. 1:17:50.720 --> 1:17:53.160 Of course, our lives became about listening to cartoons and 1:17:53.240 --> 1:17:56.479 other nonsense. I broke the ones in my car and 1:17:56.520 --> 1:17:58.920 they have not worked since my kids. 1:17:58.760 --> 1:18:02.559 Were I don't know, very very young. And now when 1:18:02.600 --> 1:18:04.000 they're like, Daddy, can we listen to this? 1:18:04.080 --> 1:18:06.599 But no, that daddy's TV is don't work, I'm not mad. 1:18:06.760 --> 1:18:08.120 I tried to get all you to do the same, 1:18:08.160 --> 1:18:11.240 but because she's always complaining, I was like, I'm that person. 1:18:11.280 --> 1:18:13.320 I walked down there because I'm like, who is playing this? 1:18:13.400 --> 1:18:14.840 And I go and I don't care if his little 1:18:14.840 --> 1:18:16.600 family if like, oh, they don't have their headphones, Like, 1:18:16.640 --> 1:18:19.040 I'm sorry, but on the Amtrak you have to have 1:18:19.479 --> 1:18:27.200 devices that come with earphones. We got them read it 1:18:27.240 --> 1:18:29.160 was not the quiet car, because I shouldn't have to 1:18:29.240 --> 1:18:31.800 ride in the quiet car, because yes, you have to 1:18:31.800 --> 1:18:33.519 have it on answer you know. Of course I looked 1:18:33.520 --> 1:18:36.320 at the rules. I'm a lawyer, a TV lawyer. As 1:18:36.320 --> 1:18:40.000 we discussed, I looked at the rule you have to 1:18:40.280 --> 1:18:43.360 have an Amtrak Maybe you all should start making this 1:18:43.400 --> 1:18:44.960 a part of the announcement, so I don't have to 1:18:45.000 --> 1:18:46.240 because I don't work for Amtrak. 1:18:46.520 --> 1:18:48.280 Maybe you could start and you could be like, I'm 1:18:48.280 --> 1:18:50.679 not the conductor, but I'm about to conduct some business. 1:18:51.080 --> 1:18:53.759 And speaking of conducting business, I'm about this, I'm about 1:18:53.760 --> 1:18:56.680 to shame Nick real quick, you guys. So Trav is 1:18:56.720 --> 1:18:58.560 one of our is one of our new producers. And 1:18:58.640 --> 1:19:01.280 Trav said and that you got your excited with Andrew, 1:19:01.680 --> 1:19:04.400 and so Trash says, turn up Andrew, and the Knick's 1:19:04.439 --> 1:19:07.719 response was done. F YI, The in studio levels only 1:19:07.720 --> 1:19:12.080 affect the live conversation. The recording we get afterward is unaffected. 1:19:12.360 --> 1:19:14.759 And Trav was like, sorry, that was not an audio. 1:19:17.680 --> 1:19:18.320 I don't even know. 1:19:18.280 --> 1:19:19.200 Where this was going. 1:19:19.880 --> 1:19:23.439 That is hilarious. Wait cut that out. If you cut 1:19:23.439 --> 1:19:24.920 it out, we cutting you out and we. 1:19:24.960 --> 1:19:27.720 Leave this show. 1:19:28.280 --> 1:19:30.160 Well, that is hilarious. 1:19:30.280 --> 1:19:32.439 This is actually a perfect way in the show because 1:19:32.960 --> 1:19:37.000 learning ebonics and slang is a very important factor in 1:19:37.080 --> 1:19:40.519 terms of how we blend the democracy, tying it right 1:19:40.520 --> 1:19:44.360 back into Sherylyn, I gotta understand what we mean when 1:19:44.360 --> 1:19:46.040 we're talking that talk and talking. 1:19:46.560 --> 1:19:52.240 I don't like that, honestly, no, I do not. I 1:19:52.280 --> 1:19:53.840 don't mind if Andrew. 1:19:53.640 --> 1:19:55.519 Is going to be screaming in the show because there 1:19:55.560 --> 1:19:56.640 was a misunderstanding. 1:19:56.680 --> 1:19:57.840 So I just want to make sure. 1:19:57.960 --> 1:20:00.880 Because I like our the things that we say to 1:20:00.960 --> 1:20:04.840 each other that is understood. I don't I think there 1:20:04.920 --> 1:20:08.160 is fine. We'll let Nick, we'll Nick know about this. Well, 1:20:08.240 --> 1:20:10.160 this might be something to talk about on the mini pod. 1:20:10.600 --> 1:20:12.839 I don't think it is good. I don't want everybody 1:20:12.880 --> 1:20:15.559 to understand something. If I'm at Angela's house, I'm like, girl, 1:20:15.600 --> 1:20:17.439 you put your foot in these greens. I don't want 1:20:17.479 --> 1:20:21.600 to explain that everybody. Andrew Gellham, now, why don't you 1:20:21.640 --> 1:20:23.479 answer it on speaker so you can make my point? 1:20:23.840 --> 1:20:24.240 All right? 1:20:24.320 --> 1:20:28.280 And were welcome, all y'all welcome. 1:20:28.520 --> 1:20:31.479 Oh wait, I have to say, how many ridiculous days 1:20:31.520 --> 1:20:34.240 there are? I got a bunch of stuff, tells Sherilyn. 1:20:34.280 --> 1:20:35.840 Now, she would have got you together on that. 1:20:37.439 --> 1:20:38.160 That is a good question. 1:20:38.240 --> 1:20:38.880 That's a good question. 1:20:39.760 --> 1:20:42.120 We'll have her back when we get We'll have her 1:20:42.120 --> 1:20:44.080 back to talk about that. But there are four hundred 1:20:44.080 --> 1:20:47.280 and thirty nine days until midterm elections, and as always, 1:20:47.400 --> 1:20:49.160 we've reminded you a few times throughout the show, but 1:20:49.200 --> 1:20:52.240 it really does us a solid when you share, like, subscribe, 1:20:53.040 --> 1:20:55.599 do all the things because we come here every day 1:20:55.640 --> 1:20:57.120 living in service to you, so we want to make 1:20:57.160 --> 1:21:00.919 sure that you guys are spreading the word. We're available 1:21:00.960 --> 1:21:03.679 on all podcast platforms and YouTube, and if you're looking 1:21:03.680 --> 1:21:05.880 for more shows like ours, please check out other shows 1:21:05.920 --> 1:21:10.160 on Recent Choice media, including Politics with Jamel Hill. Ps. 1:21:10.200 --> 1:21:15.160 I'm super pissed off at ESPN hand the Colin Kaepernick documentary. Uh, 1:21:15.240 --> 1:21:17.560 but that's all I'll say about that. No time for 1:21:17.640 --> 1:21:20.719 my sports takes today. I'm off the Cup with se 1:21:20.720 --> 1:21:22.840 Cup and our newest edition, who you guys know because 1:21:22.840 --> 1:21:25.080 we had them on this show now you know, with 1:21:25.160 --> 1:21:30.120 thirteen year old Noah de Debarasso. And be sure to 1:21:30.160 --> 1:21:32.479 give all those shows a follow, and don't forget to 1:21:32.479 --> 1:21:35.559 follow us, of course on social media, and subscribe to 1:21:35.640 --> 1:21:40.080 our text or email list. For every fifth subscriber, I 1:21:40.080 --> 1:21:43.200 will give you Angela's personal cell phone. You can get 1:21:43.240 --> 1:21:51.240 that native lampod dot com. We are Angela Rii, Andrews 1:21:51.280 --> 1:21:54.160 Gillum and Tiffany Cross. Welcome home, y'all. 1:21:57.280 --> 1:22:00.000 Showing the Natives attention of what the info and on 1:22:00.040 --> 1:22:02.760 all of the latest rock Gulum and Cross connected to 1:22:02.800 --> 1:22:05.680 the statements that you leave on our socials. Thank you 1:22:05.800 --> 1:22:09.280 sincerely for the patients reason for your choice is cleared, so. 1:22:09.400 --> 1:22:11.599 Grateful it took to execute roads. 1:22:12.000 --> 1:22:14.400 Thank you for serve, defend and protect the truth, even 1:22:14.439 --> 1:22:16.799 if pat go walking home. To all of the natives, 1:22:16.840 --> 1:22:18.559 we thank you. 1:22:29.880 --> 1:22:32.519 Native Lampod is a production of iHeart Radio and partnership 1:22:32.560 --> 1:22:35.240 with Reason Choice Media. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, 1:22:35.320 --> 1:22:38.479 visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen 1:22:38.520 --> 1:22:39.400 to your favorite shows.