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Speaker 1: Hey, welcome in. I'm Doug Golli. This is all ball.

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Speaker 1: You're you're gonna love this pod a little different than others. Uh,

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Speaker 1: My good friend Ben Jacobsen is the guest. How Ben

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Speaker 1: was was your college coach? Um? You'll find out several

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Speaker 1: junior colleges. He played at Lamar for Mike Dean and

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Speaker 1: then he finished up at Tennessee Tech paying for Mike Sutton.

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Speaker 1: And we'll talk about his journey from Omaha, Nebraska two

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Speaker 1: Lamar to junior college to Tennessee Tech to coaching. But

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Speaker 1: the big part of the story is this Ben Jacobson

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Speaker 1: in two thousand sixteen got into a car accident that

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Speaker 1: he could have died from. But because of that car accident,

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Speaker 1: which not only was he okay, they actually found that

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Speaker 1: he had a brain tumor. If not for a head

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Speaker 1: on collision that he could have died from, he would

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Speaker 1: have died from cancer. It's crazy story, right, Great, So, UM,

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Speaker 1: I do have some hoop thoughts for you, but I

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Speaker 1: I I'm excited to get for you to get to

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Speaker 1: this interview. But it's it's a little bit long, and

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Speaker 1: you'll appreciate kind of the journey that that it takes

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Speaker 1: you there. Let me start with the weekend in college hoops,

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Speaker 1: which is wild, right, what six top ten teams lose

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Speaker 1: on the road. Obviously, Duke beat Syracuse. You could have

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Speaker 1: put Duke is the number one. I don't know that

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Speaker 1: it matters, um, but what I'm what I wanna do

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Speaker 1: is point out things that if you're listening to this pod,

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Speaker 1: you're a ball person, right like you love hoop usually

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Speaker 1: or sports at a different level. I thought the coaching

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Speaker 1: job that Randy Bennett did against Gonzaga for St. Mary's

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Speaker 1: was masterful. Obviously, they want to keep the pace slower.

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Speaker 1: You gotta shorten the number of possessions. It changes everything

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Speaker 1: with how Gonzaga plays to how they get you on

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Speaker 1: your heels. But it also points out some of the

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Speaker 1: weaknesses with Gonzaga, right, I mean, look, they don't have

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Speaker 1: much of a bench, and you can't play the bench.

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Speaker 1: That's all young kids in that game, which was a

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Speaker 1: grown man game, just was And it also points out

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Speaker 1: one of the things we're gonna see this March, which

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Speaker 1: is so many of these twenty four year old dudes.

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Speaker 1: Look at Texas text lineup. I know they lost on Saturday,

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Speaker 1: but those are grown men, and it's hard to conceive

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Speaker 1: that teams that depend on freshman can compete at the

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Speaker 1: highest level against guys that are, in some cases six

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Speaker 1: years older than them. Six years that's a real thing. Um,

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Speaker 1: So that's the challenge. Mean, Kentucky is not young like

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Speaker 1: they normally are, but tie, tie is all right, But still,

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Speaker 1: how does Tai Tai look when he's playing against twenty

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Speaker 1: four year old dudes in the n A Tournament. That's

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Speaker 1: gonna be interesting. I still like Kentucky. I thought the comeback,

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Speaker 1: they're starting to figure out. Remember you're playing with two

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Speaker 1: guards and those guys they're gonna get healthy and it's

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Speaker 1: allowed others to take on bigger roles. I like this

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Speaker 1: Kentucky team. I think Kansas, you know, getting Remy Martin

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Speaker 1: back helps him. They're they're gonna need another perimeter score.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I still think they're probably a post away

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Speaker 1: from being able to compete for a national championship. But

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Speaker 1: they're gonna need Remy to play well because I just

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Speaker 1: don't think that they have the scoring pop needed. Now,

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Speaker 1: he may win your game in the n c A Tournament,

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Speaker 1: he may lose you one, but I think the fact

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Speaker 1: that he hasn't been a thirty five minute a game.

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Speaker 1: Guy helps build self and Bill can read whether it's

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Speaker 1: a game he's gonna win him or gonna lose him.

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Speaker 1: You know, if he gets in one of those Remy

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Speaker 1: modes where he takes bad shots and misses him and

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Speaker 1: doesn't play defense and turns them all over, well then

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Speaker 1: he can just pull him. So I'm interested in Kansas.

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Speaker 1: UM produced this weird team. Right. Normally we think of

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Speaker 1: produce defense, toughness, rebounding, and yet when you spread him

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Speaker 1: out this year, they don't really guard, even though Ivy

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Speaker 1: is an amazing defensive player, They're all flawed. Gonzaga doesn't

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Speaker 1: have much depth, and Chat is kind of a bag

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Speaker 1: of bones. And so if you're allowed to be physical

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Speaker 1: with them like St. Mary's was, you're gonna be physical

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Speaker 1: with them. And I'm I still don't believe that their

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Speaker 1: half court defense can take you out of what you

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Speaker 1: want to do offensively. Like that's where I think Duke

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Speaker 1: has always separated themselves. UM with a couple of exceptions

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Speaker 1: based upon personnel. They're gonna take you out what what

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Speaker 1: you want to do. It allows you to compete at

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Speaker 1: the highest level. UM. I even think that. I think

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Speaker 1: Texas Tech has that. I don't know about Wisconsin. They

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Speaker 1: do have that because they're so uh there's show uh

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Speaker 1: they load to the ball so well. But it's it's

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Speaker 1: a flaw there with Wisconsin. They continue to win because

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Speaker 1: they got Johnny Davis and I think they're a really

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Speaker 1: good team. But that's my thing against Gonzaga is can

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Speaker 1: they take you out of what you want to do

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Speaker 1: when you're in there with their half or defense? And

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Speaker 1: the answer is not really, not really. They're good, but

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Speaker 1: not great. Offensively, they're great, but they made a lot

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Speaker 1: better when the game is played up and down, how

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Speaker 1: the game is officiating, the n C a term and

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Speaker 1: probably determines who we have as a national champion. All Right,

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Speaker 1: more of these intelligent wisdom gems to come. I have

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Speaker 1: some thoughts on the Lakers and Lebron and that mess

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Speaker 1: as we talk hoop. But let's catch up with Ben Jacobsen,

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Speaker 1: who um was a young star player in the city

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Speaker 1: of Omaha before he went and played college basketball. And

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Speaker 1: the meat of this amazing story is what happened when

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Speaker 1: he got into a car crash? Was that six years ago?

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Speaker 1: Here's my conversation with Ben Okay, I want to get

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Speaker 1: to where you are now in a second. But you

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Speaker 1: grew up where playing hoop Omaha, Nebraska. What area of Oma? Well,

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Speaker 1: I'd say central o Maha, so like like the Dundee

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Speaker 1: area of like near Nebraska Omaha which is now a

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Speaker 1: Division one conference Memorial Park which is a historic uh

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Speaker 1: park there. I had a great grow upbringing there right

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Speaker 1: there in the Dundee neighborhood, and um, you know that

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Speaker 1: that was kind of a real nice environment for me

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Speaker 1: because it was a real central environment of Omaha. And

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Speaker 1: in fact, um you know, pun intended a lot of

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Speaker 1: those kids in that area went to Omaha Central High

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Speaker 1: School and that's kind of you know where I went

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Speaker 1: to high school. Um as furthermore, kind of getting it

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Speaker 1: more in depth with the community moving more out west

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Speaker 1: to West Omaha my ninth grade years, but still committing

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Speaker 1: to that you know, Omaha Central background and having a

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Speaker 1: great you know time and success with that career as well.

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Speaker 1: There were you varsity as a freshman? Yes, so I

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Speaker 1: mean were you? I mean that that means you had

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Speaker 1: to be a pretty early bloomer. Like how big were

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Speaker 1: you your freshman year? Great question, Doug, Um, Yeah, it's

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Speaker 1: about six four my eighth grade year summer, I was

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Speaker 1: about six to and about May junih coming out of

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Speaker 1: eighth grade, and then I grew about two inches after

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Speaker 1: that summer. Um, okay, so you're freshman year. How much

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Speaker 1: did you play? So yeah, I kind of unsuspectedly was

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Speaker 1: on a good team with eleven other seniors and I

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Speaker 1: was the only freshman. So I went you know, the

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Speaker 1: roster book when you got it went twelve, twelve, twelve,

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Speaker 1: and then nine. So needless to say, I got a

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Speaker 1: good uh you know, and and as you know, we

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Speaker 1: will dug a lot of good as kicks that freshman

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Speaker 1: year for these guys. So the software yere by software,

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Speaker 1: you're the team's best player or yeah, so I kind

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Speaker 1: of inherited the rain and you know it as a

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Speaker 1: sophomore stepping into that, Uh, it was unique. But we

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Speaker 1: had some transfers in and we really struggle and and Doug,

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Speaker 1: we we went five and fourteen and it was hell

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Speaker 1: for me, Well, what was your dad like? What was

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Speaker 1: how was he as he as a player? Like, what

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Speaker 1: was what was he like? To you? He was you

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Speaker 1: know my dad, God bless him. Uh, you know, Doug

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Speaker 1: and God bless your father, who was great for me

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Speaker 1: and I think was a great human, you know, bug,

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Speaker 1: you know it was a great coach. But I like

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Speaker 1: honestly running into him as a blessing. But um, you know,

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Speaker 1: he he played high school basketball and did like I

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Speaker 1: guess the freshman thing in Iowa is what he had

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Speaker 1: told me. Now, I don't know. You know, my dad embellished,

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Speaker 1: but he was a wonderful man. But like you know,

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Speaker 1: he didn't have a great experience there in which in

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Speaker 1: Nebraska and really studied, you know, had a great career

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Speaker 1: there and studied law, and you know it was a

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Speaker 1: big time Husker fan those heyday years of football success

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Speaker 1: and all that stuff. And you know, uh, but what

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Speaker 1: was he always he liked with you? Was he on

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Speaker 1: your ass? Was he super supportive? I think it was

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Speaker 1: for him, Doug. I think it was new to him

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Speaker 1: where there wasn't. Maybe you needed that rear kicking like

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Speaker 1: where I probably if in a bigger city where I

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Speaker 1: probably would have got it from your dad at the

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Speaker 1: right age. Maybe ranch wedge program and I get a

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Speaker 1: program structured like gladiators was good, but then there was

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Speaker 1: no like feeder programs. I don't think that really existed

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Speaker 1: per se at the time. No, But I mean, like

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Speaker 1: what I'm saying is you're struggling to learn how to

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Speaker 1: be a leader in h So like I'll give you

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Speaker 1: my my my stories, you know, my I remember my

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Speaker 1: freshman year. So I turned six team a freshman year

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Speaker 1: because I stayed back, and so my dad came and

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Speaker 1: we played Corona del Mang. I forget my birthday. And

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Speaker 1: I had gotten out of school to get my driver's license.

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Speaker 1: And I got my driver's license, and you know, it's

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Speaker 1: like a paper license for every past the test. So

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Speaker 1: I came back to school and I went, I'm playing

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Speaker 1: Corona mar and it was you know, now we're like,

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Speaker 1: it's January of your freshman year. And I played varsity

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Speaker 1: the whole what was called preseason, right, which is November

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Speaker 1: and December, and you're playing j V. And I'm sure

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Speaker 1: he just did not like my attitude. I was just

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Speaker 1: I don't think I was acting like I was too

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Speaker 1: I didn't feel like I was acting like I was

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Speaker 1: too good for JV. But I was definitely like trying

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Speaker 1: to be cock of the walk when I was on JV.

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Speaker 1: So I'm playing in a JV game and I think

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Speaker 1: I drove in. I probably thought I got fouled and

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Speaker 1: I said something to the ref and I got a

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Speaker 1: technical foul. And I remember this clear as day, like

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Speaker 1: I had the varsity. So the way it worked was,

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Speaker 1: I believe the rules you can only play you play

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Speaker 1: four quarters, right, So like for j V, if it

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Speaker 1: was a good game, close game, you play like three quarters,

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Speaker 1: and then that allowed you to play one quarter of

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Speaker 1: the varsity game. And the JV game was like, let's

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Speaker 1: say five or five. I think it was like five thirty,

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Speaker 1: and the varsity games at seven. So you know, you

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Speaker 1: get down, you talked to your coach, you either you know,

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Speaker 1: you change uniforms difference, you change uniforms and you go out,

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Speaker 1: you warm up with the varsity and then you just

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Speaker 1: kind of get in and I remember like the game

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Speaker 1: was for a little bit early, and I was the

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Speaker 1: way our gym was was there was like you'd walk

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Speaker 1: outside in the coach's office next door and there's people's

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Speaker 1: You pull up your car kind of right next to

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Speaker 1: the gym, behind the gym between the football stay and

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Speaker 1: my dad was like, hey, yes, second here He's like, um, hey,

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Speaker 1: where's that license that you got? Eli today, Like, oh,

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Speaker 1: it's right here. He's like, you can act like an asshole.

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Speaker 1: You don't need to drive a car when you get

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Speaker 1: technical foul, you know. And I was like what And

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Speaker 1: I was like all I could think of was like,

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Speaker 1: oh my god, I'm going to play in the varsity

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Speaker 1: game on my birthday and this jerk, you know, tore

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Speaker 1: up my license. But he's probably right. I was acting

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Speaker 1: like a dick. Um, so you know he was. He

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Speaker 1: was on me pretty hard. Um, but he was also

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Speaker 1: like he supported me and he you know, he would

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Speaker 1: I mean when push came to shove, like he would

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Speaker 1: support me with the coaches. But again, like he comes

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Speaker 1: from a coaching background, he kind of out he knew

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Speaker 1: more than everybody else. I'm just wonder what your dad

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Speaker 1: was like. Okay, uh so yeah he he um with

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Speaker 1: his basketball background, Um, he got me really involved. It

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Speaker 1: was kind of nice, uh to have the elements of

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Speaker 1: basketball love kind of endured to me with his love

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Speaker 1: and passion. Like and how that was done was his dedication,

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Speaker 1: with all the hard work he was doing by taking

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Speaker 1: me to those two games and a hundred and fifty

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Speaker 1: thousand practices. And I can tell you, um not to

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Speaker 1: you know, get say my dad like he did, Like

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Speaker 1: it was great to hear the story of Bob like

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Speaker 1: in your coach Goli because honestly, some of the stories

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Speaker 1: I have, uh that sing and ball playing, well, I mean,

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Speaker 1: I guess we'll get to that future. But uh, for

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Speaker 1: my father, you know, it was kind of a good

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Speaker 1: for me playing with older guys, Like he had me

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Speaker 1: playing with his friends, uh league in their leagues and such.

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Speaker 1: And I was playing with thirty five forty five year

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Speaker 1: old minute twelve years old, eleven years old. I loved it,

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Speaker 1: Like I just wanted the competition. I'm sure you were,

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Speaker 1: you know, just kind of knowing how you're wired, even

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Speaker 1: probably you know, obviously you were very much talented player.

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Speaker 1: But you know, he had me going. And you know,

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Speaker 1: one time I can recall, um, you know, I got

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Speaker 1: a technical foul for slamming a ball down in a

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Speaker 1: youth game before you know, and in the eighth grade,

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Speaker 1: and you know, he he got me in the car

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Speaker 1: and he scared the live he pulled me out of

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Speaker 1: the game and then you know, he pulled me into

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Speaker 1: the car and we left. It was in grand On, Nebraska,

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Speaker 1: and I mean we drove home. It was like, you're

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Speaker 1: not gonna act like that public. You gotta understand what's happened,

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Speaker 1: like pulled me out. I get it. I get it,

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Speaker 1: and it's it's interesting and I've said it's twelve and um,

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Speaker 1: you know, like his bombs, like you know, he's just

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Speaker 1: so hard on him, Like I'm not hard on about

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Speaker 1: missing shots. You know, how you how hard you play,

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Speaker 1: how you act, Are you a good teammate? You know?

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Speaker 1: And the things that we work with you on, you know,

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Speaker 1: are you doing those things. I can't make you bigger, faster, stronger,

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Speaker 1: I can't make the ball go in the basket, you know,

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Speaker 1: but if you're not doing the other little things. Fox

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Speaker 1: Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in the nation.

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Speaker 1: Catch all of our shows at Fox sports Radio dot

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Speaker 1: com and within the I Heart Radio app. Search f

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Speaker 1: s R to listen live. So you're coming into your

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Speaker 1: senior year, sure being recruited? What what's what's the recruiting process?

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Speaker 1: Like recruiting wise, coming into my senior year, I probably

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Speaker 1: had some D two's D ones um as far as

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Speaker 1: offers go, UM, it was kind of slow, but I

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Speaker 1: got injured, um with an ankle injury after a Mr.

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Speaker 1: Basketball tournament, which I think kind of affected some things. Therefore, whatever,

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Speaker 1: but I I either or was not quite the pedigree

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Speaker 1: of what you might be looking for, either the six

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Speaker 1: seven white kid from Omahaw because like stretched the four

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Speaker 1: a little bit. Like what is he? I don't know,

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Speaker 1: he pay six seven white kid that can stressed the

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Speaker 1: floor is a kind of a valuable thing, you know.

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Speaker 1: So why did you go to junior college? Okay? So

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Speaker 1: I ended up going to Lamar, committing to Mike Dean,

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Speaker 1: who was a great um so so Dino, here's what

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Speaker 1: you don't know. Okay, Dino recruited me to Marquette hard

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Speaker 1: and I nearly went to play for him. Okay, And

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Speaker 1: so I'm sure we gotta do some Mike Dean stories. Okay,

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Speaker 1: let's just be honest. Mike Dean's favorite word in the

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Speaker 1: English dictionary is what be honest? What's his favorite word?

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Speaker 1: How vulgar can we get on this show? It's a podcast,

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Speaker 1: you can say wherever you want. What's his favorite word?

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Speaker 1: You first, cocksucker? He loves the word cocksucker. That's his

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Speaker 1: favorite word. All day cock that was it was, It

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Speaker 1: was non stop, It was non stop. So here's my

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Speaker 1: let's let's do I gotta have Dino on this pod

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Speaker 1: because he's the best. So when I so do not,

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Speaker 1: he will destroy me. I was a buffoon at this time. Um,

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Speaker 1: but you know we all were like that's the whole

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Speaker 1: thing with these podcasts, Like we were all like when

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Speaker 1: I was I said this, I went, I went to

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Speaker 1: the Duke game. Um, two weeks ago. I've never been

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Speaker 1: to camera, and they're like, you know, like, did you

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Speaker 1: grow up a Duke fan? I was like, let me

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Speaker 1: tell you how big a Duke fan I was. When

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Speaker 1: I was a junior going to be a senior in

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Speaker 1: high school, I'm staying at the Las Vegas u c

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Speaker 1: l A, which was my brother and sister went there.

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Speaker 1: My my dad had season tickets there. You know, he

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Speaker 1: was promised ten times over being assistant coach at u

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Speaker 1: c l A. Right, my friends that played there, My

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Speaker 1: sister was a cheerleader there, which anybody would think, that's

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Speaker 1: like your dream school. Jim Harrick asked, offered me a scholarship,

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Speaker 1: and he's like, Dougie, you know you always want to

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Speaker 1: be a Bruin And I said, and this is like

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Speaker 1: eighteen year old me, Well, actually, coach I really always

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Speaker 1: want to go to Duke, but they took Wojo last

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Speaker 1: year and he's only gonna be a freshman, and then

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Speaker 1: I can take another point guard this year. So I mean,

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Speaker 1: I just I always want to go to Duke. Like

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Speaker 1: who says that to Jim Herrick? Like I just don't like, yes, coach,

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Speaker 1: I always want to be a Bruin. Let me think

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Speaker 1: about it, you know. So the point is we were

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Speaker 1: all assholes on some level. Um So, Mike Dean, I'm

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Speaker 1: I transfer out it of of Notre Dame and Dina

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Speaker 1: starts to recruit me. And my infatuation with Marquette was

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Speaker 1: a couple of different things. One was that they played

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Speaker 1: Notre Dame every year and for whatever reason, like Notre

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Speaker 1: Dame did nothing wrong in me leaving, but I want

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Speaker 1: to kick Notre names ass, you know. I just I

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Speaker 1: wanted to kick their ass. So that's I think that's

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Speaker 1: natural most guys leaking. You want to just give me one.

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Speaker 1: I just want one shot, you know, so I would

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Speaker 1: have gotten I would have had three shots. So um

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Speaker 1: So that was one thing. And then Dino was like, look,

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Speaker 1: we play an NBA area, NBA City, and I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: play like an NBA point guard. And he came to

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Speaker 1: my house and he gave me four He gave me

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Speaker 1: a basically a notebook with all play sets that he

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Speaker 1: was gonna run for me. And he had another little

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Speaker 1: guard who was only five ten who was a shooter,

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Speaker 1: and um, he's like, look, I run all this ship

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Speaker 1: for him. He brought me a tape of when he

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Speaker 1: was at Sienna. He had a guy named uh something

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Speaker 1: brennaman uh derimas I think Darius Brenneman, who is a

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Speaker 1: fucking baller, Like I'm watching this kind of like this

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Speaker 1: is the best player I've ever seen in my life anyway.

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Speaker 1: And then I went on a visit air and um,

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Speaker 1: Chris Crawford was one of my hosts nicknamed Woody, played

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Speaker 1: in the NBA bunch, He and uh and Piper and

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Speaker 1: and this was right after Mike Dean had had gotten

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Speaker 1: that he got thrown thrown out I think against Providence

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Speaker 1: in the n c A tournament. And I mean he

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Speaker 1: was one of those like all timers, like what did

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Speaker 1: he say? What was the matter? So it was like

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Speaker 1: a bad call. And as you know, Mike Dean has

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Speaker 1: an eye, he has some eye disease and when he

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Speaker 1: starts yelling that fucking I starts going like, geck, go

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Speaker 1: in the other direction. Right. So he wears and he

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Speaker 1: played for him for how many years? One year? You

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Speaker 1: played for him? Two years? Okay. So he wears like

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Speaker 1: tinted glasses so he can't see it. So if you

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Speaker 1: watch in the n c A tournament game, he takes

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Speaker 1: off his glasses and he points to his fucking lazy

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Speaker 1: eye and goes, hey, fucker, I got one fucking eye

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Speaker 1: and I could see that. So he got deed and

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Speaker 1: he was gonna be suspended it the next time they

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Speaker 1: played the n c A tournament, Right, So this is

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Speaker 1: the lunatic that I'm going to like take a visit

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Speaker 1: to so I never forget. I get there and Piper

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Speaker 1: and Crawford. I got walk into their their apartment on

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Speaker 1: campus at Marquette, and there was like ten beers stacked

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Speaker 1: there and empty beer cans. And I was like, I'm

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Speaker 1: just thinking to myself, like, you guys gonna clean this

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Speaker 1: ship up. There's like ten beer cans here. So I

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Speaker 1: sit down there like, Gottlie, yes you drink beer? Yes?

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Speaker 1: Do you drink beer like we drink in Milwaukee? I

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Speaker 1: was like, what does that mean? He goes, well in Milwaukee,

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Speaker 1: that's the beginning of a beautiful pyramid. You want to

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Speaker 1: play at Marquette, that better be a fucking pyramid by

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Speaker 1: the time you walk out of here. And like that

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Speaker 1: was the weekend. We just drank the whole fucking weekend.

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Speaker 1: We went to a Brewers game, we drank, We went

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Speaker 1: to the gym and who we came home and drank.

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Speaker 1: We went to a bus game and we drank. Like

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Speaker 1: we just drank. It was amazing. Anyway, the stories about

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Speaker 1: my deem and they're like, as crazy as Mike Dean is. Okay,

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Speaker 1: he replaced um uh, what's his name? God, hold on,

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Speaker 1: I gotta think of it at this part. So Kevin O'Neill,

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Speaker 1: Kevin O'Neill, and they're like Kevin O'Neill ten times casey.

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Speaker 1: You're like, no fucking way. They're like, oh, Mike Dean,

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Speaker 1: all he does is calling you a cocksucker, right, but

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Speaker 1: Kevin O'Neill is a fucking lunatic. Like wait, I was like,

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Speaker 1: no way anyway. So Mike would write me letters a

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Speaker 1: couple of days a week, like legit, like long letters,

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Speaker 1: like almost you look back You're like, I'm not sure

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Speaker 1: that was all that healthy, and um, so you have yours.

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Speaker 1: I have a five page one that that I there

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Speaker 1: is a reason why I signed with them. Yeah. Mine

397
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Speaker 1: was that there was a four page letter. It was

398
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Speaker 1: the hardest it was. It was so incredibly thoughtful and meaningful.

399
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Speaker 1: I have it in my house. I should have it

400
00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:04,800
Speaker 1: for this I haven't. My mom has it, and I

401
00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:06,200
Speaker 1: was like, this is And so when I had to

402
00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:07,560
Speaker 1: call him and tell him like, hey, I'm going to

403
00:22:07,600 --> 00:22:11,320
Speaker 1: Oakland State, he was like, okay, well you still want

404
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Speaker 1: to work camp. I was like, really, yeah, come work

405
00:22:16,240 --> 00:22:19,960
Speaker 1: camp fucking good time. You got a drink. It's like okay.

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Speaker 1: So I go to camp and um, you know there's

407
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Speaker 1: a actually Nicki Collin, who is now the head coach

408
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Speaker 1: at Baylor. We kind of dated. We dated for a

409
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Speaker 1: little while after that, like that's where I I bet

410
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Speaker 1: her on my visit and then we started hanging out

411
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Speaker 1: then and um, so I had signed at a school

412
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Speaker 1: not named Marquette, and not only did he have me

413
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Speaker 1: work camp with have you a camp? I came back

414
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Speaker 1: I think the next year in work camp and he

415
00:22:52,359 --> 00:22:54,280
Speaker 1: worked with me on my free throw shooting and then

416
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Speaker 1: we played them my junior year and at halftime it's

417
00:22:58,640 --> 00:23:01,119
Speaker 1: like a close game. They weren't. They were just, Okay,

418
00:23:01,320 --> 00:23:03,280
Speaker 1: we're in Hawaii, we're not playing that well. And we

419
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Speaker 1: come in and he and I got to do the

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Speaker 1: scatter report because coach knew. I knew all those guys

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Speaker 1: from playing camp with them. But but he was you

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Speaker 1: cock sucker, motherfucker, you know. And they were like, you

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Speaker 1: wanted to play for him? He's fucking crazy. I was like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: he's kind of crazy but kind of fun. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: That ship doesn't bother me, you know. So there's my

426
00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:28,679
Speaker 1: there's my Dino Mike Dean story. Who I um, he's nuts,

427
00:23:29,119 --> 00:23:30,880
Speaker 1: but he's one of those and he's your friend. He's

428
00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:34,000
Speaker 1: your friend. He's nuts. And as you said, you were

429
00:23:34,040 --> 00:23:36,959
Speaker 1: a funk up to right, so you signed it Lamar.

430
00:23:37,119 --> 00:23:40,400
Speaker 1: Now again, I've actually played at Lamar. My dad had

431
00:23:40,440 --> 00:23:45,959
Speaker 1: a tour team. We played you and you had you

432
00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:53,199
Speaker 1: had Edmund Saunders and you guys were good. Listen. That

433
00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:56,680
Speaker 1: was my first game against you, Doug, And honestly it

434
00:23:56,760 --> 00:23:59,680
Speaker 1: was kind of great, honestly to play that opportunity to

435
00:23:59,680 --> 00:24:02,760
Speaker 1: play if you number one, but also that team you

436
00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:04,720
Speaker 1: guys have a pretty freaking good but like the up

437
00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:08,600
Speaker 1: and down pace, the first two strides was like, what

438
00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:11,640
Speaker 1: the like? And then you kind of just re engage

439
00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:13,840
Speaker 1: into it because I started like that was that was

440
00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:18,560
Speaker 1: kind of my role. I blew it as a freshman. Obviously,

441
00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:23,719
Speaker 1: what was your my starting role? I blew that opportunity

442
00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:29,200
Speaker 1: right away after shortly after freshman and we're like years

443
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:31,879
Speaker 1: old and we just we have no ramifications. We just

444
00:24:31,920 --> 00:24:36,120
Speaker 1: go ahead and hoop, you know, and were good, well, yeah,

445
00:24:36,160 --> 00:24:38,199
Speaker 1: I mean, like again, by the time we by the

446
00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:41,600
Speaker 1: time I played that thing, you know, I had played

447
00:24:43,280 --> 00:24:47,320
Speaker 1: games in the USB L I played, I was in

448
00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:50,159
Speaker 1: I was in Italy, in training camp. I was in

449
00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:52,240
Speaker 1: c b A to training camp, right like you're playing

450
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:54,720
Speaker 1: such so when you get back to playing like college ball,

451
00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:57,480
Speaker 1: you're like, this is fucking stupid, so easy, you know,

452
00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:01,800
Speaker 1: and like, yeah, my dad yelled guys. But by that time,

453
00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:06,719
Speaker 1: you could do so much more than even even understood, right,

454
00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:09,359
Speaker 1: everybody's level of understanding, and we had and that was

455
00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:11,720
Speaker 1: early I think in the tour, I wrote, we beat you, guys,

456
00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:15,040
Speaker 1: but so you're you're so he writes you a five

457
00:25:15,080 --> 00:25:19,360
Speaker 1: page letter and you decided to go to Beaumont, Texas. Well.

458
00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:22,320
Speaker 1: I first I first committed to Loyal in Chicago, to

459
00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:26,840
Speaker 1: Larry Farmer. But another great Now that's a great guy.

460
00:25:27,040 --> 00:25:30,440
Speaker 1: He's like a saint. First of all, that man made

461
00:25:30,480 --> 00:25:33,240
Speaker 1: me feel like a million dollars, and I think I

462
00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:37,560
Speaker 1: didn't think I could uphold the He said, you're a

463
00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:40,200
Speaker 1: great rebounder. We're gonna expect you to grab a lot

464
00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:43,240
Speaker 1: of rebounds for your freshman year. Like oh okay, Jim

465
00:25:43,280 --> 00:25:45,399
Speaker 1: Herrick Jr. Is popping me, picking me up on the

466
00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:49,200
Speaker 1: visit and land Serving is a terrific individual at those times.

467
00:25:49,720 --> 00:25:52,879
Speaker 1: Great coaches and quality staff. And I had a good visit.

468
00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:57,280
Speaker 1: But and this can go into my best Mike Dean story.

469
00:25:57,440 --> 00:26:01,600
Speaker 1: Um we uh we we we we just get destroyed

470
00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:06,120
Speaker 1: and they're good at the time, And um, did they

471
00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:08,600
Speaker 1: have that little what was that guy who had short

472
00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:11,560
Speaker 1: arms but kind of like that Georgetown big at the

473
00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:19,159
Speaker 1: Sweetney Mike Harris, Mike Harris god and Willis Wilson is

474
00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:24,480
Speaker 1: again wonderful gentleman. What was their coach? And Mike Harris

475
00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:26,560
Speaker 1: is listed at six. He end up playing the NBA

476
00:26:26,960 --> 00:26:28,679
Speaker 1: and now he would have played even more because he

477
00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:32,280
Speaker 1: was like an undersized big They beat two guys ninety

478
00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:37,600
Speaker 1: one to seventy two. It was awful. I was I

479
00:26:37,640 --> 00:26:42,720
Speaker 1: was kind of uncharacteristically again, um, you know, I still

480
00:26:42,760 --> 00:26:46,639
Speaker 1: feel like leadership, Doug. I had not got the bug

481
00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:50,400
Speaker 1: of what that truly was, to not maybe feel myself

482
00:26:50,440 --> 00:26:53,000
Speaker 1: as much as a player and understand kind of role

483
00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:55,760
Speaker 1: definition more when I got to play for Jim Morris

484
00:26:55,760 --> 00:26:58,200
Speaker 1: and Iowa Western, but even't though with Mike Dean, I

485
00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:01,439
Speaker 1: learned tons but I think he over inflated. Maybe I

486
00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:05,160
Speaker 1: don't know either way, I'll get to the story. So

487
00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:08,560
Speaker 1: coach Leonard Drake, who's at Central Michigan, who was a

488
00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:11,000
Speaker 1: great player at Central Michigan, was on that staff and

489
00:27:11,040 --> 00:27:14,080
Speaker 1: a big reason why I committed there. Uh, comes up

490
00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:16,919
Speaker 1: to me after the game, just like you know, I

491
00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:18,960
Speaker 1: don't know, like I was a leading score with nine

492
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:21,640
Speaker 1: points and six rebounds. I don't know. You could look maybe,

493
00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:24,960
Speaker 1: but either way, it was a terrible game. That just

494
00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:27,800
Speaker 1: shows you how bad. And so coach Drake brings me

495
00:27:27,840 --> 00:27:29,800
Speaker 1: in the next trade before I go at practice and

496
00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:34,239
Speaker 1: had this rally voice and being you was off on

497
00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:38,920
Speaker 1: defense yesterday and I just don't think you should start anymore.

498
00:27:39,080 --> 00:27:41,280
Speaker 1: And I'm a freshman, you know, and coach Drake and

499
00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:44,240
Speaker 1: I'm brutally destroyed his voice, rest his soul because he

500
00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:48,080
Speaker 1: was a wonderful man. Uh. I took it terribly and

501
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:50,760
Speaker 1: I just was like like it was just like at

502
00:27:50,760 --> 00:27:52,760
Speaker 1: that age, like I just really you know, we want

503
00:27:52,760 --> 00:27:55,440
Speaker 1: to talk about emotional feelings today, Doug, Like I really

504
00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:58,280
Speaker 1: am in death with that more than ever. But I

505
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:01,040
Speaker 1: could say that at that time I wasn't prepared to

506
00:28:01,040 --> 00:28:03,959
Speaker 1: deal with that. And I went right into practice and

507
00:28:04,359 --> 00:28:07,280
Speaker 1: you know, about twenty minutes in and you know, like

508
00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:10,680
Speaker 1: I'm thinking and sports and rebounded what else, like I'm

509
00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:16,280
Speaker 1: not naive um and probably plus minus out the window

510
00:28:16,359 --> 00:28:20,800
Speaker 1: with me because of Mike Harris. But then so there's

511
00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:24,080
Speaker 1: like we're doing a drill and and any who, Mike

512
00:28:24,119 --> 00:28:27,720
Speaker 1: starts yelling at me and I'm shooting it, you know,

513
00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:29,560
Speaker 1: our free throw in this opposite And you know, we

514
00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:32,040
Speaker 1: had a nice gym at that Montane Center, Doug, I'm

515
00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:36,560
Speaker 1: sure you don't. YEA, yeah, it was but ten thousand,

516
00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:41,760
Speaker 1: but we're we're bringing out quality about But it had

517
00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:44,280
Speaker 1: a rich history though, and there's some really is a

518
00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:46,200
Speaker 1: lot of no in the eighties, they went to the

519
00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:48,360
Speaker 1: let me give me, I'll give it. Here's here's the

520
00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:53,000
Speaker 1: thing about Lamar. Okay, it's kind of looks it's a

521
00:28:53,040 --> 00:28:57,080
Speaker 1: weird campus. I don't remember there being a campus. Here's

522
00:28:57,080 --> 00:28:58,880
Speaker 1: here's my memories of it. Okay. You drive in like

523
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:03,760
Speaker 1: from Houston, and there's like or refineries everywhere, and there's

524
00:29:03,800 --> 00:29:06,560
Speaker 1: the arena, and then there's some buildings that look like

525
00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:12,240
Speaker 1: classroom buildings, and that's kind of about it. And I'm just, yeah, like,

526
00:29:13,480 --> 00:29:19,600
Speaker 1: what was that place? Like? Oh so Mike was that

527
00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:22,560
Speaker 1: good of a recruiter with that letter man that he

528
00:29:22,800 --> 00:29:24,880
Speaker 1: was able to get me to go away from Chicago

529
00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:27,920
Speaker 1: to Beaumont, Texas fan of coach right there. You know,

530
00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:30,600
Speaker 1: I will say this, Doug. All that being said, there's

531
00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:35,600
Speaker 1: great people down there. I really did enjoy some of those.

532
00:29:35,640 --> 00:29:38,120
Speaker 1: Looking back at the time, even my teammates, you kind

533
00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:40,720
Speaker 1: of swallow a lot of those maybe edges you might

534
00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:42,560
Speaker 1: have had. I think as a coaches, you know, I

535
00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:45,320
Speaker 1: coached for ten years where I had you know, the

536
00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:47,720
Speaker 1: things like that, where you had good experiences and bad.

537
00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:49,320
Speaker 1: You know, it was my first team. You know, I

538
00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:52,080
Speaker 1: was kind of a basketball nomad, but I really like

539
00:29:52,240 --> 00:29:56,560
Speaker 1: there's some of those guys are really talented and anyho Uh,

540
00:29:56,880 --> 00:29:58,920
Speaker 1: Mike yells at me about stuffing, and I kind of

541
00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:04,000
Speaker 1: like Doug decision of my life after Leonard saidbody said

542
00:30:04,040 --> 00:30:07,000
Speaker 1: to me, I lifted my like you know, I just

543
00:30:07,040 --> 00:30:10,280
Speaker 1: did this shrug my shoulders at Mike. I shrugged my

544
00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:13,280
Speaker 1: shoulders and Mike, by the way, Kevin O'Neill, I feel

545
00:30:13,320 --> 00:30:16,440
Speaker 1: like I don't even know who he could be the

546
00:30:16,480 --> 00:30:20,520
Speaker 1: way Mike has has has spoken about this gentleman as well. Um,

547
00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:24,360
Speaker 1: but yeah, so he all of a sudden, I shoot

548
00:30:24,360 --> 00:30:26,560
Speaker 1: my free throw and one of my teammates is looking

549
00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:30,360
Speaker 1: behind me, like with utter fear of like you have

550
00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:34,560
Speaker 1: no idea what kind of black glasses man? You know,

551
00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:38,880
Speaker 1: only us, only me or you can or anyone. Obviously

552
00:30:38,920 --> 00:30:41,200
Speaker 1: the great history of Mike and all the great people

553
00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:45,040
Speaker 1: played from no the glasses. But he I was suddenly

554
00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:48,680
Speaker 1: looked behind me and Mike is spitting in my face calling,

555
00:30:48,800 --> 00:30:54,360
Speaker 1: I mean cox sucking, Like I literally cock sucker. I

556
00:30:54,400 --> 00:30:57,400
Speaker 1: think a favorite was I should have been swallowed. Uh

557
00:30:57,680 --> 00:31:00,840
Speaker 1: that was just kidding me, Like what I could take it?

558
00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:04,400
Speaker 1: I could take I know what, you know what whatever

559
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:06,480
Speaker 1: we could take we could take it like I was

560
00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:09,880
Speaker 1: built for that honestly with my like high school like

561
00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:13,880
Speaker 1: what was going on? And so anyhow that happened, and

562
00:31:13,880 --> 00:31:16,000
Speaker 1: then we get going with the last line and I

563
00:31:16,040 --> 00:31:18,880
Speaker 1: turned to the sports table and I just slammed my

564
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:21,800
Speaker 1: hand into the rubber part and I break my hand.

565
00:31:22,720 --> 00:31:25,920
Speaker 1: And this is like, you know again like a freshman,

566
00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:28,240
Speaker 1: you know, this is what I have a broken hand.

567
00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:31,440
Speaker 1: And now it's just like the most reality of realities

568
00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 1: first hit me in my life of like you're just

569
00:31:35,240 --> 00:31:38,120
Speaker 1: you might just have lost your life here, like you know,

570
00:31:38,160 --> 00:31:40,720
Speaker 1: who knows what happens, and so because I mean, you

571
00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:43,680
Speaker 1: feel so responsible for this as a leader on that

572
00:31:43,720 --> 00:31:46,800
Speaker 1: team as well. And I got back in line and

573
00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:48,920
Speaker 1: like the next possession, the ball comes to me and

574
00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:50,600
Speaker 1: I think it bounces off my hand, and I said,

575
00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:55,120
Speaker 1: and then bless stop surprise, like go look at the market.

576
00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:57,560
Speaker 1: Mark's like looking at my hand, and he's befudd because

577
00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:02,600
Speaker 1: there's a bone to coach. His hands broke, and like

578
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:05,400
Speaker 1: they rushed me out of practice and into the locker

579
00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:09,160
Speaker 1: room and I'm just sitting there, Doug with utter despair

580
00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:11,360
Speaker 1: of what's about to happen in my life, you know,

581
00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:16,640
Speaker 1: and so your Yeah, what are despair about what Mike's

582
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:19,320
Speaker 1: going to do to me? I mean I felt my

583
00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:22,040
Speaker 1: teammate because he was he was motherfucking you and then

584
00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:25,320
Speaker 1: you got kicked out of practice. Oh Doug, I broke

585
00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:27,600
Speaker 1: my hand and my bone was sticking out. He didn't

586
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:29,760
Speaker 1: see that part. I got, how did you? How did

587
00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:31,840
Speaker 1: you break your hand? I hit the side of the

588
00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:36,760
Speaker 1: scores table because yeah, just you know, after a loose

589
00:32:36,800 --> 00:32:39,800
Speaker 1: bar or something like that, and I just so you

590
00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:42,600
Speaker 1: punch something, your hands fucked up, your bones popping out.

591
00:32:42,840 --> 00:32:46,120
Speaker 1: Mike comes in and says, what so well, Coach Drake

592
00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:52,840
Speaker 1: was the first one to gentlemen, the unbelievable coach. Obviously,

593
00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:55,960
Speaker 1: I I alluded to earlier. It comes in first, like man,

594
00:32:56,440 --> 00:32:58,680
Speaker 1: because I I told Mike I had taken a chart.

595
00:32:58,760 --> 00:33:02,520
Speaker 1: I said, I said, I blurbed something about a charge

596
00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:06,200
Speaker 1: and uh and then he goes Mike just getting the

597
00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:07,800
Speaker 1: hell out of here. You know what Mike does, and

598
00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:10,960
Speaker 1: just like like they just waved me along and uh.

599
00:33:11,080 --> 00:33:13,120
Speaker 1: I get in the locker room and he got, I've

600
00:33:13,120 --> 00:33:16,120
Speaker 1: seen you do that, dumbass ship and I just said,

601
00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:18,840
Speaker 1: but then he looked at me kind of more like

602
00:33:19,040 --> 00:33:22,440
Speaker 1: with what I mentor at that time would look like

603
00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:24,800
Speaker 1: in a nineteen year old player that I deserved, like

604
00:33:24,840 --> 00:33:27,520
Speaker 1: I felt like helped me just was like, you're you're

605
00:33:27,520 --> 00:33:29,760
Speaker 1: gonna be okay. You know, we're gonna get through this,

606
00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:31,840
Speaker 1: and went to that right after that and saw me

607
00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:34,400
Speaker 1: kind of in that moment but hit me with some

608
00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:36,960
Speaker 1: real stuff. But like then Mike was in there shortly after,

609
00:33:37,800 --> 00:33:42,680
Speaker 1: and um, Doug, what I can say was honorable about him,

610
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:46,240
Speaker 1: like your story which you shared, which I'd like to

611
00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:49,720
Speaker 1: share about Mike, which would be interesting to hear others. Uh,

612
00:33:50,000 --> 00:33:53,240
Speaker 1: he was more kind and so is his wife Paula

613
00:33:53,320 --> 00:33:55,560
Speaker 1: to welcome me into the like help you know, help

614
00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:59,720
Speaker 1: me back to really just awesome. He was incredibly kind

615
00:33:59,720 --> 00:34:03,440
Speaker 1: of like he like surprisingly kind to the point of

616
00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:07,200
Speaker 1: like like he realized, you know, the emotional extent of

617
00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:11,040
Speaker 1: it outweighed the anything else, and so did his wife.

618
00:34:11,360 --> 00:34:13,040
Speaker 1: And I think they kind of had that with not

619
00:34:13,160 --> 00:34:16,359
Speaker 1: maybe having children at the time maybe and their their

620
00:34:16,440 --> 00:34:19,440
Speaker 1: long stem relationship just they were They were pretty good

621
00:34:19,440 --> 00:34:22,120
Speaker 1: guardians too. I mean, what what what you amount to

622
00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:24,040
Speaker 1: what it is today? I don't I don't know. We

623
00:34:24,120 --> 00:34:26,440
Speaker 1: had a decent staff and we once a game and

624
00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:29,080
Speaker 1: had some good players, but uh, that kind of threw

625
00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:31,439
Speaker 1: a lot of wrench into things for me that that year.

626
00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:33,440
Speaker 1: Doug and we kind of had a good year, but

627
00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:35,960
Speaker 1: you know, lost to Murray State, and I was kind

628
00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:38,640
Speaker 1: of one foot in and out the door. And and

629
00:34:38,640 --> 00:34:41,279
Speaker 1: and you know, with Mike, if he sees that at

630
00:34:41,320 --> 00:34:43,600
Speaker 1: that point, and I kind of alluded to him, I

631
00:34:43,640 --> 00:34:47,000
Speaker 1: wanted to transfer, and um, and that's where kind of

632
00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:49,239
Speaker 1: looking at options, you know, where I had to say

633
00:34:49,239 --> 00:34:52,399
Speaker 1: to myself, like you had with Notre Dame, I'm sure

634
00:34:52,960 --> 00:34:55,879
Speaker 1: well way higher level. I would love to hear more

635
00:34:55,880 --> 00:35:00,000
Speaker 1: about what you those those teams as well. But um,

636
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:02,560
Speaker 1: with Notre Dame, where you transferred and had to make

637
00:35:02,600 --> 00:35:05,239
Speaker 1: that decision and bet on yourself, And that's a tough

638
00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:07,319
Speaker 1: thing to do with the young man, especially when I

639
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:10,080
Speaker 1: couldn't go back though I was, I was thinking about transferring,

640
00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:14,000
Speaker 1: and you know, nobody knew that I had taken credit cards.

641
00:35:14,640 --> 00:35:18,640
Speaker 1: And what happened was I got home and my brother

642
00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:21,000
Speaker 1: came out at the end of my freshman year to

643
00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:26,640
Speaker 1: drive back with me, and uh so we drove back

644
00:35:26,920 --> 00:35:29,799
Speaker 1: and when we got back, Coach McLoud called and he's

645
00:35:29,840 --> 00:35:32,120
Speaker 1: like DOUGGI heard, you know, you think about talking people

646
00:35:32,120 --> 00:35:36,080
Speaker 1: about transferring, and I was like, well, you know, I

647
00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:38,200
Speaker 1: don't know, coach, I just I need to kind of

648
00:35:38,200 --> 00:35:40,600
Speaker 1: figure it out, you know, like I a lot of

649
00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:42,200
Speaker 1: parts I liked, a lot of parts I didn't like,

650
00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:45,320
Speaker 1: and we talked through some things. So he said basically

651
00:35:45,360 --> 00:35:46,520
Speaker 1: said like, hey, i'll call you in a week. You

652
00:35:46,560 --> 00:35:49,839
Speaker 1: got a week because we're gonna there's a kid named

653
00:35:49,880 --> 00:35:52,400
Speaker 1: Jimmy Dillon, and we're gonna have to we need a

654
00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:56,640
Speaker 1: point guard. If you don't remember those times, yeah, we

655
00:35:56,640 --> 00:35:58,720
Speaker 1: gotta add more. We gotta add more. White was my backup.

656
00:35:59,120 --> 00:36:01,520
Speaker 1: I beat out and add more as a great duty

657
00:36:01,600 --> 00:36:03,640
Speaker 1: started some before I got there. He started the first

658
00:36:03,680 --> 00:36:06,200
Speaker 1: four games and he's like, you know, we're we're okay,

659
00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:09,120
Speaker 1: but we'll get Jimmy Dillon, and but we can't take

660
00:36:09,200 --> 00:36:11,040
Speaker 1: him unless you know, you you decide, if you decide

661
00:36:11,040 --> 00:36:12,839
Speaker 1: you're gonna leave, you know, we don't want you to leave.

662
00:36:13,560 --> 00:36:16,120
Speaker 1: And he started talking anyway, and then like three days

663
00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:17,680
Speaker 1: later it wasn't a week and I was like, fun,

664
00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:20,160
Speaker 1: why is he calling? And he that He's like, you know,

665
00:36:20,160 --> 00:36:24,120
Speaker 1: there's some accusations here, so you know, so then I

666
00:36:24,160 --> 00:36:27,000
Speaker 1: had a basically like a week to like figure out.

667
00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:29,239
Speaker 1: And I called him back a week later. I was like, coach, look,

668
00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:32,640
Speaker 1: i'll come back. I'll be suspended, I'll do whatever. I

669
00:36:32,719 --> 00:36:34,839
Speaker 1: just want to make it right. And he was like,

670
00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:37,120
Speaker 1: you know, this is kind of above my pay grade.

671
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:39,359
Speaker 1: I you know what, here's what we're gonna say. We're

672
00:36:39,360 --> 00:36:43,440
Speaker 1: gonna say you're homesick. So then I spent that summer

673
00:36:43,760 --> 00:36:47,040
Speaker 1: I played in junior college events and I had you know,

674
00:36:47,080 --> 00:36:50,719
Speaker 1: Cincinnati and Alabama and Marquette and some others. They wanted

675
00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:53,080
Speaker 1: me to come and and red shirt and sit out

676
00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:56,360
Speaker 1: and they didn't know about it was it was like

677
00:36:56,400 --> 00:36:59,359
Speaker 1: agreed to. I wouldn't talk about it about Notre Dame.

678
00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:02,960
Speaker 1: It was read to with Notre Dame. And so I just,

679
00:37:03,800 --> 00:37:05,600
Speaker 1: you know, I what I wanted to do was because

680
00:37:05,640 --> 00:37:08,719
Speaker 1: I had signed I committed to Notre Dame in like

681
00:37:09,480 --> 00:37:13,239
Speaker 1: October of my senior year, and I remember it was

682
00:37:13,320 --> 00:37:17,280
Speaker 1: December of my senior year old up. So the December

683
00:37:17,360 --> 00:37:22,160
Speaker 1: my senior year is they play the Loyal Merrymount which

684
00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:27,160
Speaker 1: is Mounts and it was a good close game. L

685
00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:31,400
Speaker 1: m U at the time was pretty good and um

686
00:37:31,560 --> 00:37:35,000
Speaker 1: he did something which I had never seen done before.

687
00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:37,840
Speaker 1: It's like an NBA move where it was a tie

688
00:37:37,960 --> 00:37:41,640
Speaker 1: game and they were on defense and he foiled intentionally.

689
00:37:41,640 --> 00:37:44,120
Speaker 1: There were streets or shooter to get the ball back

690
00:37:44,320 --> 00:37:46,799
Speaker 1: to win the game, and it worked. I think they

691
00:37:46,840 --> 00:37:50,040
Speaker 1: beat at the Merrymount, maybe an overtime or something. I've

692
00:37:50,080 --> 00:37:52,440
Speaker 1: never seen that before. And my dad was like, I

693
00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:54,840
Speaker 1: think he just failed to get the ball to have

694
00:37:54,920 --> 00:37:56,680
Speaker 1: the ball to win the game, whereas they could run

695
00:37:56,719 --> 00:38:01,000
Speaker 1: out the clock and taking the last shot. So two

696
00:38:01,080 --> 00:38:03,520
Speaker 1: nights later they played the University of San Diego. It

697
00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:07,319
Speaker 1: was not very good, and I mean they were they were,

698
00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:09,400
Speaker 1: you know, the two West Coast Conference teams. LMU was

699
00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:13,000
Speaker 1: a little bit better, and they were down thirty one

700
00:38:13,000 --> 00:38:16,279
Speaker 1: points and a half. And I remember turning my dad

701
00:38:16,320 --> 00:38:18,680
Speaker 1: and I was like, what do we do? He's like,

702
00:38:18,719 --> 00:38:21,600
Speaker 1: what do you mean? I go, what what did we do? I?

703
00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:24,600
Speaker 1: I you you advised me. We signed I signed it

704
00:38:24,640 --> 00:38:27,319
Speaker 1: to school and they sucked. It's like you know that

705
00:38:27,320 --> 00:38:29,640
Speaker 1: that he relaxed to be okay, And I was like,

706
00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:33,239
Speaker 1: you know, you're just looking and you're like like, we're

707
00:38:33,239 --> 00:38:35,160
Speaker 1: gonna go to the Big East. But that ship, you know,

708
00:38:36,160 --> 00:38:38,600
Speaker 1: and you could kind of see it. You're like, well,

709
00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:39,880
Speaker 1: you know, you put me in there, and you have

710
00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:42,480
Speaker 1: Pat Garrett, you got Ryan Hoover, like it's better, but

711
00:38:42,760 --> 00:38:45,759
Speaker 1: like they're down thirty one points to the University of

712
00:38:45,800 --> 00:38:49,360
Speaker 1: San Diego. Um. So my point is when you fast

713
00:38:49,400 --> 00:38:52,239
Speaker 1: forward a year and a half, you realize how much

714
00:38:52,320 --> 00:38:55,680
Speaker 1: things change during that one year where you would be

715
00:38:55,719 --> 00:38:59,440
Speaker 1: sitting out. Coaches leave, assistance leave, players leave, like why

716
00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:02,439
Speaker 1: would I why would I go commit? And then I'm

717
00:39:02,480 --> 00:39:05,480
Speaker 1: stuck there. But and this before you get grab transfer,

718
00:39:06,000 --> 00:39:08,719
Speaker 1: like just sit out and wait. And so I sat

719
00:39:08,760 --> 00:39:12,280
Speaker 1: and waited and went through a whole recruiting process, recruiting cycle.

720
00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:15,520
Speaker 1: So you decide what was it. Did you go in

721
00:39:15,560 --> 00:39:17,200
Speaker 1: person to see him to tell me you you want to leave?

722
00:39:17,239 --> 00:39:18,719
Speaker 1: Did you do it on the phone when you got home?

723
00:39:18,760 --> 00:39:21,640
Speaker 1: Like how did you decide to leave? Well? I wish

724
00:39:21,680 --> 00:39:24,000
Speaker 1: I could ask you more follow up questions, but you

725
00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:27,239
Speaker 1: can ask what you want. Well, well, you have your

726
00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:29,279
Speaker 1: follow up, so I'll answer to that and then ask

727
00:39:29,320 --> 00:39:31,359
Speaker 1: you your follow up. But when I wanted to leave

728
00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:34,759
Speaker 1: was kind of after the broken hand. Honestly, Doug, I

729
00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:39,560
Speaker 1: felt like I let my team down tremendously and Beaumont

730
00:39:39,560 --> 00:39:42,440
Speaker 1: as you know, it was strange, you know, as you excribe, right,

731
00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:44,600
Speaker 1: I would never want to. It's an area, you know,

732
00:39:44,640 --> 00:39:46,520
Speaker 1: it's one of the first industrial as a lot of

733
00:39:46,520 --> 00:39:50,480
Speaker 1: people know as a smell. But but but there's a

734
00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:52,719
Speaker 1: lot of talent. Kendrick goes in and and like, I mean,

735
00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:55,720
Speaker 1: Stephen Jackson, you have a port Arthur, that Golden Triangle

736
00:39:55,840 --> 00:39:57,720
Speaker 1: U g K is one of my favorite rap groups,

737
00:39:57,760 --> 00:40:00,200
Speaker 1: car Fish. I mean, that whole area is really got

738
00:40:00,239 --> 00:40:05,200
Speaker 1: a lot of quality. Bump bum um bump bump bump, bump, bump, bump, bump, bump,

739
00:40:05,239 --> 00:40:08,280
Speaker 1: bump bump. But that was that's that's that's Houston. That's

740
00:40:08,280 --> 00:40:11,560
Speaker 1: not really part of You caught Doug living down there,

741
00:40:12,040 --> 00:40:15,920
Speaker 1: the Golden Triangle. I don't want to comment on it

742
00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:18,480
Speaker 1: because Steve like those guys that's there, you know, so

743
00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:22,640
Speaker 1: but um but in either way, I had quality players

744
00:40:22,680 --> 00:40:26,200
Speaker 1: I've coached from there. So you okay, So so so

745
00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:28,680
Speaker 1: you break your hand? How much did you play that year? Oh?

746
00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:31,080
Speaker 1: I came back, like you know, Doug, feeling as bad

747
00:40:31,080 --> 00:40:32,759
Speaker 1: as I did. I was like, how do I have to?

748
00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:34,839
Speaker 1: So I have a plate in five screws in here,

749
00:40:35,440 --> 00:40:40,640
Speaker 1: and somehow you know, they put that together and you know,

750
00:40:40,760 --> 00:40:42,960
Speaker 1: got back in three weeks and played with the pad

751
00:40:43,160 --> 00:40:46,040
Speaker 1: and a hand on my shooting hand for the rest

752
00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:48,920
Speaker 1: of the season. Not to make an excuse for myself

753
00:40:48,960 --> 00:40:51,240
Speaker 1: because it's all my doing, but I shot a terrible

754
00:40:51,280 --> 00:40:54,840
Speaker 1: percentage UM and from the field and and from the

755
00:40:54,880 --> 00:40:57,799
Speaker 1: free throw line, and it just I probably didn't help

756
00:40:57,880 --> 00:41:00,879
Speaker 1: myself with my teammates with doing something like that at

757
00:41:00,880 --> 00:41:03,920
Speaker 1: that time either. And um, I kind of made it

758
00:41:03,960 --> 00:41:07,160
Speaker 1: be known the year before. But honestly, I'd love to

759
00:41:07,160 --> 00:41:09,600
Speaker 1: talk about the Maccabi games, but well, I guess touch

760
00:41:09,640 --> 00:41:13,800
Speaker 1: on that whenever you want. Um. But uh, that spring

761
00:41:13,880 --> 00:41:15,520
Speaker 1: I kind of opened things up and it was like,

762
00:41:15,560 --> 00:41:18,400
Speaker 1: well I could go to like other like low do

763
00:41:18,400 --> 00:41:23,320
Speaker 1: you no, I'm not dealing with Doug Gottlie McDonald's all American. Uh,

764
00:41:23,400 --> 00:41:26,040
Speaker 1: you know, your visits must have been nice, but uh,

765
00:41:26,480 --> 00:41:29,400
Speaker 1: my visits were good. But you know, I had Montana

766
00:41:29,440 --> 00:41:31,560
Speaker 1: State and you know, maybe some schools like that, but

767
00:41:32,560 --> 00:41:35,960
Speaker 1: the best option I had got advised from my core nucleus,

768
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:39,040
Speaker 1: which was kind of your dad went away and some

769
00:41:39,200 --> 00:41:41,360
Speaker 1: other people just like junior college and I went to

770
00:41:41,400 --> 00:41:45,880
Speaker 1: Iowa Western or San Jacino Southeastern Illinois. I was thinking

771
00:41:45,920 --> 00:41:49,719
Speaker 1: about Marshalltown. I was thinking about you know, I was

772
00:41:49,800 --> 00:41:52,120
Speaker 1: mainly focused on where it's kind of focused on now,

773
00:41:52,280 --> 00:41:54,880
Speaker 1: Hutch and some of those and I Western with Galen

774
00:41:55,040 --> 00:41:57,560
Speaker 1: is just all that sold me. And Jim Morris called

775
00:41:57,600 --> 00:41:59,719
Speaker 1: me and said, we'd love to have you. And you know,

776
00:42:00,040 --> 00:42:03,000
Speaker 1: thankfully they had already established a great program with Galen

777
00:42:03,040 --> 00:42:05,080
Speaker 1: and Will Perkins, who you might have played with again

778
00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:08,360
Speaker 1: played against Doug again at Washington. If you ever played

779
00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:12,239
Speaker 1: against Washington, Uh, he would have been against around your

780
00:42:12,239 --> 00:42:16,480
Speaker 1: time as well. Um. But that next year at Western

781
00:42:17,400 --> 00:42:20,240
Speaker 1: was the Jerry Mullen showcase and kind of getting exposed

782
00:42:20,280 --> 00:42:24,080
Speaker 1: to that. But um, I I really stepped in to

783
00:42:24,160 --> 00:42:27,759
Speaker 1: where I kinda was nutcutting time, and you know, I

784
00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:30,759
Speaker 1: kind of built for that. I feel like I might

785
00:42:31,000 --> 00:42:33,400
Speaker 1: people know my story is just kind of my upbringing

786
00:42:33,440 --> 00:42:36,400
Speaker 1: and by that time in my life, you know, overcoming

787
00:42:36,440 --> 00:42:38,799
Speaker 1: the broken hand and so forth. Junior cause was just

788
00:42:38,840 --> 00:42:42,360
Speaker 1: another obstacle to get back to Division one, UM to

789
00:42:42,520 --> 00:42:45,120
Speaker 1: a program that I would still wanna, you know, hopefully

790
00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:47,720
Speaker 1: compete at. And I was really playing at my highest

791
00:42:47,800 --> 00:42:51,040
Speaker 1: level at the time probably and uh, I had a

792
00:42:51,080 --> 00:42:54,120
Speaker 1: great season at Iowa Western and played with some great players.

793
00:42:54,640 --> 00:42:57,160
Speaker 1: Uh that we I believe we had nine Division one

794
00:42:57,200 --> 00:43:02,279
Speaker 1: players on that team and U and that league had

795
00:43:02,360 --> 00:43:07,040
Speaker 1: Southeastern Iowa which had Ivan Almonte I think the following

796
00:43:07,080 --> 00:43:09,440
Speaker 1: season led the n c A and rebounding at Florida

797
00:43:09,480 --> 00:43:14,120
Speaker 1: International and Philiberto Rivera, who was a tremendous basketball player.

798
00:43:15,160 --> 00:43:18,960
Speaker 1: Rivera Uta was yeah, and then Jake Sido, so it's

799
00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:22,800
Speaker 1: a good shooter. And then like Doug Thomas, who's freaking

800
00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:28,320
Speaker 1: I mean, l a, you know Doug Thomas maybe uh okay,

801
00:43:28,680 --> 00:43:31,719
Speaker 1: uh but either way, our our junior college Doug is

802
00:43:31,800 --> 00:43:34,239
Speaker 1: well versed as you are well known at that time.

803
00:43:34,400 --> 00:43:37,160
Speaker 1: That's Corey Height. Tower just left Indian Hills and he

804
00:43:37,239 --> 00:43:40,640
Speaker 1: got drafted the year prior with Corey Height with uh,

805
00:43:40,880 --> 00:43:43,080
Speaker 1: I think in the first round, and so did another

806
00:43:43,200 --> 00:43:47,759
Speaker 1: six Ernest Jones, who's a seven footer. Um, and it

807
00:43:47,880 --> 00:43:50,880
Speaker 1: was like, okay, you I can do that, you know

808
00:43:51,120 --> 00:43:56,920
Speaker 1: you I'm retarding my my myself of uh, like I

809
00:43:57,000 --> 00:44:00,879
Speaker 1: don't know, I'm just not believing knowing quite of who

810
00:44:01,000 --> 00:44:04,680
Speaker 1: I quite was as a player. But Jim Morris and

811
00:44:04,719 --> 00:44:07,360
Speaker 1: I Western taught me a lot of quality things that

812
00:44:07,440 --> 00:44:10,960
Speaker 1: I needed Doug. And uh, that also was nice for

813
00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:12,719
Speaker 1: me to live in Omaha and live with a couple

814
00:44:12,760 --> 00:44:15,479
Speaker 1: buddies of mine that played football at UNO at the time.

815
00:44:15,960 --> 00:44:21,839
Speaker 1: They made life kind of comfortable. Yeah, maybe help some things. So, uh,

816
00:44:22,160 --> 00:44:24,120
Speaker 1: what was Mike Sutton like to play play for a

817
00:44:24,239 --> 00:44:31,240
Speaker 1: tech Tennessee Tech the polar opposite of of of Mike Deane.

818
00:44:31,640 --> 00:44:38,759
Speaker 1: Um And yeah, in unique ways, they both very much

819
00:44:38,840 --> 00:44:41,680
Speaker 1: helped me along in my life. UM and I and

820
00:44:41,800 --> 00:44:43,879
Speaker 1: I think both of them, honestly, if I could take

821
00:44:43,920 --> 00:44:46,520
Speaker 1: back to those times, and I think that we've seen

822
00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:48,800
Speaker 1: so much and some of the horror stories that you

823
00:44:48,920 --> 00:44:50,920
Speaker 1: see out there that you're almost kind of thankful for

824
00:44:51,000 --> 00:44:53,560
Speaker 1: some of the things and some of those guys and

825
00:44:53,680 --> 00:44:57,080
Speaker 1: some of their guidance. But Sutton was you know, he

826
00:44:57,239 --> 00:44:59,839
Speaker 1: was a good coach for us. You know, he had

827
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:03,520
Speaker 1: coach with Tubby Smith for about eighteen years as an

828
00:45:03,560 --> 00:45:08,160
Speaker 1: assistant from Tulsa and fold him onto Kentucky. UM. One

829
00:45:08,200 --> 00:45:09,880
Speaker 1: of the reasons why I fell in love with that

830
00:45:10,000 --> 00:45:14,880
Speaker 1: program was just Cookeville, Tennessee. UM. The area in Nashville.

831
00:45:14,960 --> 00:45:19,000
Speaker 1: If you've been to that area and of it's beautiful. Uh,

832
00:45:19,280 --> 00:45:22,560
Speaker 1: you know you're talking about Gatlinburg is forty five minutes

833
00:45:22,560 --> 00:45:27,400
Speaker 1: from Cookville, where Tennessee Tech is located. UM and Tennessee. I.

834
00:45:27,560 --> 00:45:29,680
Speaker 1: I really didn't know much about it until the visit,

835
00:45:29,719 --> 00:45:33,280
Speaker 1: and I was pursued heavily by uh their head recruiter,

836
00:45:33,719 --> 00:45:38,040
Speaker 1: Steve Payne. And you know, they did the they went overboard,

837
00:45:38,120 --> 00:45:40,320
Speaker 1: you know, I mean they didn't go I was no

838
00:45:40,480 --> 00:45:43,120
Speaker 1: Ricky Road blue chip like you, Doug. But you know,

839
00:45:43,520 --> 00:45:46,840
Speaker 1: I got to have, uh, get to have some great

840
00:45:47,080 --> 00:45:49,959
Speaker 1: you know Nashville you know, fun, and and then head

841
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:53,560
Speaker 1: on and to uh, you know, Cookville and get a

842
00:45:53,600 --> 00:45:55,719
Speaker 1: good experience of what the people were like there where.

843
00:45:55,760 --> 00:46:00,600
Speaker 1: I made a great decision because um furthermore having a

844
00:46:00,680 --> 00:46:04,879
Speaker 1: great college life, which I think was important for me. Uh.

845
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:09,120
Speaker 1: We won the conference championship my senior year as a

846
00:46:09,280 --> 00:46:12,640
Speaker 1: captain on that team with alongside a great friend of

847
00:46:12,719 --> 00:46:16,200
Speaker 1: mine who's kind of just different backgrounds, but Willie Jenkins,

848
00:46:16,239 --> 00:46:18,000
Speaker 1: who grew up in the inner cities in Memphis. But

849
00:46:18,800 --> 00:46:21,480
Speaker 1: we were the only seniors on that team of mostly

850
00:46:21,600 --> 00:46:24,000
Speaker 1: freshman which is kind of ironic if you think about

851
00:46:24,040 --> 00:46:27,680
Speaker 1: the bi polarness of how I came into basketball. Guy

852
00:46:27,800 --> 00:46:30,360
Speaker 1: wanted to guide these young men along, and we we

853
00:46:30,520 --> 00:46:35,200
Speaker 1: had really talented freshman Doug. And I was smart enough

854
00:46:35,280 --> 00:46:38,440
Speaker 1: to realize how to utilize some of like utilize my

855
00:46:38,640 --> 00:46:42,279
Speaker 1: role to the the best of what it looked like,

856
00:46:42,480 --> 00:46:45,399
Speaker 1: because that mattered to me most. I wanted to win.

857
00:46:45,960 --> 00:46:49,440
Speaker 1: And uh, Mattie Mackenzie, it was a great player as

858
00:46:49,480 --> 00:46:54,240
Speaker 1: a freshman. Plays still uh maybe still playing overseason. France

859
00:46:54,320 --> 00:46:57,480
Speaker 1: was a freshman on that team. Anthony Fishers played overseas

860
00:46:57,560 --> 00:47:01,040
Speaker 1: for ten eleven years in top leagues and his real um,

861
00:47:01,560 --> 00:47:05,560
Speaker 1: Derek Stribling was a transfer end from Tennessee Belton Rivers

862
00:47:05,760 --> 00:47:08,719
Speaker 1: was a transferring from East Carolina that started there. And

863
00:47:08,880 --> 00:47:11,759
Speaker 1: we had size, and we had like just town and

864
00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:14,759
Speaker 1: athletes and Doug. I'm sure you will know OVC is

865
00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:17,440
Speaker 1: very talented. And I love you know, Murray State and

866
00:47:17,520 --> 00:47:20,319
Speaker 1: Kevin Brown, and I love the OBC Conference in terms

867
00:47:20,400 --> 00:47:23,239
Speaker 1: of athletic durability. But we won our league as a

868
00:47:23,360 --> 00:47:25,640
Speaker 1: senior and I worked hard and I loved my college

869
00:47:25,680 --> 00:47:29,320
Speaker 1: experience in Cookeville and Tennessee Tech, and you know, my

870
00:47:29,520 --> 00:47:33,719
Speaker 1: journey was my journey and I don't regret it. Um.

871
00:47:34,640 --> 00:47:38,200
Speaker 1: So the Maccabi Games, what what what should people know

872
00:47:38,239 --> 00:47:44,920
Speaker 1: about the Maccabi our Baccabi games together Philadelphia, where I

873
00:47:45,000 --> 00:47:47,920
Speaker 1: was born. And oh no, so it must have been

874
00:47:47,960 --> 00:47:49,520
Speaker 1: funny for you guys to see me. Well, i'd like

875
00:47:49,640 --> 00:47:52,120
Speaker 1: to see the reaction, Like, what was it like seeing

876
00:47:52,160 --> 00:47:56,000
Speaker 1: me walk in like to that environment? Well, I mean

877
00:47:56,120 --> 00:47:57,880
Speaker 1: part of it is if you remember I walked in

878
00:47:58,040 --> 00:48:00,719
Speaker 1: late so yeah, but I wasn't there. I don't think

879
00:48:00,760 --> 00:48:03,680
Speaker 1: I stayed the whole time. So so, so here's what

880
00:48:03,719 --> 00:48:07,520
Speaker 1: people you know. So, um, mccaby games are the like

881
00:48:07,640 --> 00:48:12,239
Speaker 1: the Jewish Olympics. Um, I played them on them in

882
00:48:12,320 --> 00:48:17,880
Speaker 1: nineties seven, and um we lost in the Semis and

883
00:48:17,960 --> 00:48:20,040
Speaker 1: then Israel lost in the Semis. We had to play

884
00:48:20,080 --> 00:48:22,439
Speaker 1: them for the silver medal. We lost. Her team we'd

885
00:48:22,440 --> 00:48:31,080
Speaker 1: beat by sixty how I mean, fuck it right, coach,

886
00:48:31,160 --> 00:48:33,600
Speaker 1: I'll tell you what happened with us. I mean her

887
00:48:33,760 --> 00:48:37,719
Speaker 1: her Brown was our coach. I disappointed her. Huh. I

888
00:48:37,840 --> 00:48:41,359
Speaker 1: disappointed her in my second time around, Doug, so her

889
00:48:41,400 --> 00:48:46,000
Speaker 1: Brown was our coach and first they were they were

890
00:48:46,080 --> 00:48:49,440
Speaker 1: total dicks to me in tryouts and my brother and

891
00:48:49,520 --> 00:48:51,920
Speaker 1: I don't know if I had a reputation reever it was.

892
00:48:53,120 --> 00:48:56,080
Speaker 1: It was nineties seven, right, so I was it was

893
00:48:56,160 --> 00:48:58,360
Speaker 1: the year that I was sitting out, and I was

894
00:48:58,440 --> 00:49:01,840
Speaker 1: in incredible shape because I was working with Marvinovich and

895
00:49:01,880 --> 00:49:04,080
Speaker 1: I was playing all the time. I played with my

896
00:49:04,120 --> 00:49:06,520
Speaker 1: junior college, Golden West, but I didn't play in the games.

897
00:49:06,560 --> 00:49:08,840
Speaker 1: I just helped coach in the games. So I maintained

898
00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:11,480
Speaker 1: that year of eligibility. And I remember going to the

899
00:49:11,560 --> 00:49:14,680
Speaker 1: West Side Jewish Center in l A for tryouts and

900
00:49:14,719 --> 00:49:17,880
Speaker 1: they were just on on my ass the whole time,

901
00:49:18,719 --> 00:49:20,279
Speaker 1: and like, I think they were just testing me to

902
00:49:20,320 --> 00:49:24,640
Speaker 1: see if Ronnie Ronnie Gantlin whatever his name was, he

903
00:49:24,760 --> 00:49:27,040
Speaker 1: was at un LB with Tart for a while, like

904
00:49:27,160 --> 00:49:28,840
Speaker 1: he was just they were just dicks to me. I

905
00:49:28,960 --> 00:49:31,839
Speaker 1: was like, what the fun? So they cut my brother too,

906
00:49:31,880 --> 00:49:35,840
Speaker 1: who was good like that team. But we had a

907
00:49:35,880 --> 00:49:42,799
Speaker 1: good team. We had. We had Ryan Huh, We had

908
00:49:42,880 --> 00:49:44,919
Speaker 1: briant In Kelvich, but he didn't get to play because

909
00:49:44,960 --> 00:49:47,480
Speaker 1: he had a heart. He like passed out and he

910
00:49:47,560 --> 00:49:49,719
Speaker 1: had like a heart problem, so they didn't let him

911
00:49:49,719 --> 00:49:51,880
Speaker 1: play in the games. And that he was like our leader.

912
00:49:52,640 --> 00:49:56,600
Speaker 1: He was he was a tremendous passer, hell of a player.

913
00:49:57,239 --> 00:50:00,520
Speaker 1: So he didn't play. Why their Draymond the White, he

914
00:50:00,680 --> 00:50:02,960
Speaker 1: was the white. He was the white Jewish Draymond, no question,

915
00:50:03,520 --> 00:50:11,080
Speaker 1: like brilliant basketball mind, um, incredible passer, you know, heavy

916
00:50:11,360 --> 00:50:13,680
Speaker 1: but knew how to use his body, could guard anybody.

917
00:50:14,800 --> 00:50:18,120
Speaker 1: He was great. But he and he was like a ringleader.

918
00:50:18,719 --> 00:50:20,520
Speaker 1: And then we get he had a he had like

919
00:50:20,600 --> 00:50:23,120
Speaker 1: an episode where he I don't know if he got

920
00:50:23,160 --> 00:50:25,279
Speaker 1: hot or something, but he passed out and they did

921
00:50:25,320 --> 00:50:26,799
Speaker 1: all the hard tests on him. They're like, he can't

922
00:50:26,840 --> 00:50:32,240
Speaker 1: didn't get to play. So we beat Canada by sixty

923
00:50:32,840 --> 00:50:37,640
Speaker 1: in the pool play and we play him And I

924
00:50:37,760 --> 00:50:39,480
Speaker 1: don't think I went I didn't go out the night

925
00:50:39,520 --> 00:50:41,680
Speaker 1: before like I was. I was a hooper. I didn't

926
00:50:41,680 --> 00:50:44,520
Speaker 1: go out, but I know no clue. I didn't know

927
00:50:44,600 --> 00:50:47,680
Speaker 1: you at the time, and the way around I went

928
00:50:47,680 --> 00:50:50,160
Speaker 1: out when it was I didn't didn't matter. But that

929
00:50:50,280 --> 00:50:53,680
Speaker 1: time I didn't go out. And David Bluestenthal Blue was

930
00:50:54,200 --> 00:50:58,680
Speaker 1: only seventeen. I don't think he went out then, but

931
00:50:58,760 --> 00:51:00,400
Speaker 1: a lot of the other guys were grown. They went

932
00:51:00,440 --> 00:51:07,520
Speaker 1: out whatever. And I think because her, because we won

933
00:51:07,600 --> 00:51:10,279
Speaker 1: by sixty, like he was. He played everybody in the

934
00:51:10,320 --> 00:51:12,839
Speaker 1: first half and they had a guy that just caught

935
00:51:12,880 --> 00:51:17,360
Speaker 1: a heater and was throwing it in from everywhere and

936
00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:21,640
Speaker 1: you know, now everybody's asshole gets tight and we just

937
00:51:21,880 --> 00:51:26,239
Speaker 1: lost by like two point. It was devastating. So I'm like,

938
00:51:27,239 --> 00:51:30,439
Speaker 1: I had a great time. The basketball wasn't very good. Yeah,

939
00:51:30,920 --> 00:51:33,480
Speaker 1: how like within that game, I want to hear the

940
00:51:33,560 --> 00:51:36,520
Speaker 1: dynamics of like you beat a team by because like

941
00:51:36,560 --> 00:51:39,479
Speaker 1: when you guys told me that story on that team,

942
00:51:39,520 --> 00:51:41,879
Speaker 1: I was on, like it was awesome to have you guys,

943
00:51:41,880 --> 00:51:45,759
Speaker 1: because like Lecture and Yank came to training camp and

944
00:51:45,920 --> 00:51:48,000
Speaker 1: gay Frank and by the way, that was incredible to

945
00:51:48,080 --> 00:51:49,840
Speaker 1: have her and some of you guys like kind of

946
00:51:49,920 --> 00:51:52,640
Speaker 1: tell us those stories. But like when you have said

947
00:51:52,680 --> 00:51:57,000
Speaker 1: that like sixty and then lost, like that's crazy, it's crazy.

948
00:51:57,400 --> 00:51:59,719
Speaker 1: It was. It was like they were they were just

949
00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:03,080
Speaker 1: a bunch of guys, right, grown men, but they had

950
00:52:03,239 --> 00:52:07,120
Speaker 1: one or two hoopers. Did they bring professional euro that

951
00:52:07,320 --> 00:52:10,120
Speaker 1: That happened to me multiple times, yes, So so that's

952
00:52:10,120 --> 00:52:12,560
Speaker 1: what happened. So that's what happened. Is the rules are

953
00:52:13,640 --> 00:52:16,480
Speaker 1: Israel and the US you have to be all Jewish.

954
00:52:17,000 --> 00:52:19,239
Speaker 1: The other program other other countries you can have two

955
00:52:19,280 --> 00:52:21,600
Speaker 1: non Jews. So I don't know if this like in hindsight,

956
00:52:21,640 --> 00:52:22,920
Speaker 1: I don't know this dude was Jewish, but he was

957
00:52:23,000 --> 00:52:27,960
Speaker 1: sucking hooping and and they're playing like a zone and

958
00:52:28,080 --> 00:52:30,600
Speaker 1: our zone offense remember herb had been in the NBA

959
00:52:30,719 --> 00:52:32,960
Speaker 1: forever and back then the NBA didn't have zones, and

960
00:52:32,960 --> 00:52:37,160
Speaker 1: I remember, our zone offense is terrible, and like all

961
00:52:37,200 --> 00:52:40,080
Speaker 1: we should have just done was press and just you know,

962
00:52:40,800 --> 00:52:42,960
Speaker 1: trap them and move it. But they were old men.

963
00:52:43,000 --> 00:52:45,960
Speaker 1: They passed that thing around, hitting shots, and then and

964
00:52:46,000 --> 00:52:50,480
Speaker 1: then again he's playing guys. It's like, you know, you

965
00:52:50,520 --> 00:52:53,160
Speaker 1: get down the first half, like should I barely fucking played?

966
00:52:54,280 --> 00:52:59,040
Speaker 1: And um, you know the second half we I don't

967
00:52:59,120 --> 00:53:01,319
Speaker 1: remember it, like I think I've deleted that. I didn't

968
00:53:01,360 --> 00:53:04,680
Speaker 1: remember like every game ever, remember play calls and everything.

969
00:53:04,800 --> 00:53:07,160
Speaker 1: That one I kind of deleted from the memory bank. Really,

970
00:53:07,440 --> 00:53:09,280
Speaker 1: I just remember that we beat a team by sixty

971
00:53:09,600 --> 00:53:11,879
Speaker 1: and then he's fucking around, subbing in the first half

972
00:53:12,200 --> 00:53:14,319
Speaker 1: and even in the second half, and we got dudes

973
00:53:14,400 --> 00:53:17,320
Speaker 1: that are chitty, and then you know, like I was

974
00:53:17,440 --> 00:53:19,960
Speaker 1: just okay. I mean I didn't feel like I played

975
00:53:20,360 --> 00:53:22,120
Speaker 1: by the time I like got we got in a rhythm,

976
00:53:22,719 --> 00:53:25,560
Speaker 1: like me and Jimmy Kaisermer were hoping, but nobody else's helping.

977
00:53:26,040 --> 00:53:29,759
Speaker 1: And then we didn't have and we didn't have Yeah,

978
00:53:29,880 --> 00:53:33,279
Speaker 1: we didn't have yet Brian yanke Ellovitch. So fast forward

979
00:53:33,360 --> 00:53:36,560
Speaker 1: four years later, I'm done playing in college. I'd had

980
00:53:36,600 --> 00:53:41,840
Speaker 1: a bad experience in Israel um the year before because

981
00:53:42,600 --> 00:53:45,760
Speaker 1: I was supposed to get Israeli citizenship. I flew to Israel.

982
00:53:45,800 --> 00:53:47,640
Speaker 1: I was playing in a team that was practicing in Italy,

983
00:53:48,560 --> 00:53:50,480
Speaker 1: and my agent didn't tell me I had that. I

984
00:53:50,600 --> 00:53:53,239
Speaker 1: didn't give me like an Israeli address. So when they

985
00:53:53,280 --> 00:53:55,719
Speaker 1: asked me where, like would you live, I was like,

986
00:53:55,840 --> 00:53:59,320
Speaker 1: I live in Italy. Like oh, you cannot get in Italy.

987
00:54:00,520 --> 00:54:02,320
Speaker 1: We mean you can't get Alia and I'm sucking Jewish.

988
00:54:02,360 --> 00:54:04,719
Speaker 1: I can get you know, you show up, you get

989
00:54:04,719 --> 00:54:11,399
Speaker 1: Aliya Like no, you must live in Israel for one year. Huh.

990
00:54:12,440 --> 00:54:16,480
Speaker 1: So I said yeah, so I said, So I walked

991
00:54:16,520 --> 00:54:20,080
Speaker 1: outside my agents, like the Israeli agents like where is

992
00:54:20,120 --> 00:54:21,920
Speaker 1: your papers? I was like, bro, you gotta give me

993
00:54:21,920 --> 00:54:23,759
Speaker 1: an Israeli address. I just bucked the whole thing up.

994
00:54:25,120 --> 00:54:27,480
Speaker 1: So then I this is this is the this is

995
00:54:27,600 --> 00:54:30,000
Speaker 1: one of those I've only told to help people's story.

996
00:54:31,800 --> 00:54:36,360
Speaker 1: So I was practicing in Italy and the team was.

997
00:54:37,360 --> 00:54:39,239
Speaker 1: It was a weird year because they had come up

998
00:54:39,280 --> 00:54:42,040
Speaker 1: with this Bozeman A and Bozeman B rule. So if

999
00:54:42,040 --> 00:54:44,200
Speaker 1: I played in Israel, even though I'm Jewish and I

1000
00:54:44,239 --> 00:54:46,799
Speaker 1: could get Aliya, i would count as a Bozeman beat.

1001
00:54:46,840 --> 00:54:49,480
Speaker 1: So I'm going up against all the Yugoslavians, all the Russians,

1002
00:54:50,000 --> 00:54:52,400
Speaker 1: all the Croatians. You're not like, you don't get that,

1003
00:54:53,760 --> 00:54:55,839
Speaker 1: And a lot of people don't know that. I mean

1004
00:54:55,880 --> 00:54:59,919
Speaker 1: with how heavily talented the league was overseas was equal

1005
00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:02,080
Speaker 1: has had as much as high major basketball. I feel

1006
00:55:02,120 --> 00:55:05,280
Speaker 1: like that. Plus they they like look down on American

1007
00:55:05,360 --> 00:55:08,680
Speaker 1: basketball or when you're young, like there's some you know,

1008
00:55:08,719 --> 00:55:11,200
Speaker 1: it's a different style of basketball, like there's some secret

1009
00:55:11,280 --> 00:55:13,719
Speaker 1: that you only get from playing Israel like three four years.

1010
00:55:14,760 --> 00:55:20,440
Speaker 1: So um, So they take me to ash Dog to

1011
00:55:20,600 --> 00:55:22,879
Speaker 1: like work out, I don't know, tryout for the team,

1012
00:55:23,960 --> 00:55:28,600
Speaker 1: and I just remember, like I was, I had done

1013
00:55:28,680 --> 00:55:32,759
Speaker 1: the Lakers creation camp and I was like I got

1014
00:55:32,800 --> 00:55:35,680
Speaker 1: beat out by Mike Pemberton, who's a coach now with him,

1015
00:55:36,520 --> 00:55:38,800
Speaker 1: But I felt like, man, I was really close and

1016
00:55:38,880 --> 00:55:42,440
Speaker 1: I was hooping when I played against you guys and

1017
00:55:42,560 --> 00:55:47,480
Speaker 1: North Carolina, we'd be so I go to ash DoD

1018
00:55:48,040 --> 00:55:52,560
Speaker 1: and I've been I had literally flown back from Italy

1019
00:55:53,520 --> 00:55:55,360
Speaker 1: from from l A with the Lakers because I was

1020
00:55:55,400 --> 00:55:58,400
Speaker 1: in training camp. I did the USB L then in

1021
00:55:58,560 --> 00:56:02,320
Speaker 1: Summer League. Uh. Then I get married, and then I

1022
00:56:02,400 --> 00:56:04,520
Speaker 1: go to Italy and then I fly to l A

1023
00:56:05,000 --> 00:56:07,239
Speaker 1: and I fly back to Italy after they don't keep me,

1024
00:56:07,719 --> 00:56:10,640
Speaker 1: and I worked out for like two days and we

1025
00:56:10,719 --> 00:56:13,000
Speaker 1: had a we had a practice and then a scrimmage,

1026
00:56:13,000 --> 00:56:15,279
Speaker 1: a friendly game, and then I flew to Israel and

1027
00:56:15,360 --> 00:56:18,239
Speaker 1: I hadn't eaten, I hadn't slept. I'm like stinky, I'm

1028
00:56:18,280 --> 00:56:19,960
Speaker 1: piste off and I getting my you know, it's like

1029
00:56:20,040 --> 00:56:21,799
Speaker 1: one of those like worst days of your life ever.

1030
00:56:22,719 --> 00:56:26,719
Speaker 1: And so the Israeli agents like he's scrambling because my

1031
00:56:26,960 --> 00:56:30,719
Speaker 1: job in Italy. He is as an Israeli, not as

1032
00:56:30,760 --> 00:56:33,279
Speaker 1: an American. They already have Keith Jennings. Mr Jennings and

1033
00:56:33,320 --> 00:56:37,239
Speaker 1: played Tennessee's Tennessee State. I think, right, who is an

1034
00:56:37,360 --> 00:56:40,279
Speaker 1: NBA point guard? So like I'm his backup, and but

1035
00:56:40,360 --> 00:56:43,520
Speaker 1: I'm in Israeli. So he's like scrambling, like we gotta

1036
00:56:43,560 --> 00:56:46,560
Speaker 1: get you on an Israeli team. So he takes me

1037
00:56:46,640 --> 00:56:48,520
Speaker 1: to Ashdod and I was like, what can I make

1038
00:56:48,600 --> 00:56:52,480
Speaker 1: an ashed out there? Like, you know, twenty thousand dollars?

1039
00:56:52,560 --> 00:56:57,759
Speaker 1: I was like what the fuck? You know? So I

1040
00:56:57,920 --> 00:56:59,480
Speaker 1: was like all right, whatever, I just let me just

1041
00:56:59,560 --> 00:57:03,480
Speaker 1: go who And I was bad. I remember getting on

1042
00:57:03,600 --> 00:57:06,040
Speaker 1: the plane or remember driving back in the car and

1043
00:57:06,120 --> 00:57:08,040
Speaker 1: the guys, like the reel agents like talking to me,

1044
00:57:09,480 --> 00:57:11,160
Speaker 1: and I just I just want to turn them and

1045
00:57:11,160 --> 00:57:13,680
Speaker 1: go like, hey, dude, you know what, if you don't

1046
00:57:13,760 --> 00:57:18,480
Speaker 1: say one word to me, I would be much happier.

1047
00:57:18,600 --> 00:57:22,400
Speaker 1: Like I'm just not in a good headspace, like you know.

1048
00:57:22,480 --> 00:57:24,920
Speaker 1: I mean, like look I was at the time. I'm

1049
00:57:25,920 --> 00:57:30,800
Speaker 1: twenty four years old. You know, I had you know,

1050
00:57:30,840 --> 00:57:33,240
Speaker 1: it's like you're a whisker away from the final four

1051
00:57:33,840 --> 00:57:36,920
Speaker 1: and now you're it was that my last workout ever,

1052
00:57:37,080 --> 00:57:38,960
Speaker 1: Like I don't want to play for two thousand dollars

1053
00:57:38,960 --> 00:57:42,880
Speaker 1: a month in Ashdodd Like no thanks. And I got

1054
00:57:42,960 --> 00:57:49,520
Speaker 1: back to my hotel in Jerusalem and I just remember,

1055
00:57:49,640 --> 00:57:51,920
Speaker 1: like I don't even want to I was, you know,

1056
00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:54,320
Speaker 1: fairly newly married, and I just like didn't want to

1057
00:57:54,360 --> 00:57:58,080
Speaker 1: call home and explain everything, like I just was. I

1058
00:57:58,160 --> 00:58:02,560
Speaker 1: was a bad moment. So my point is that everyone

1059
00:58:02,720 --> 00:58:06,560
Speaker 1: knows that despair. Dude, Like I didn't know who I

1060
00:58:06,760 --> 00:58:09,800
Speaker 1: was because I think my wife couldn't believe at one time,

1061
00:58:09,880 --> 00:58:13,160
Speaker 1: she goes, you valued your life on your basketball, Like

1062
00:58:13,320 --> 00:58:14,680
Speaker 1: I was like, yeah, like if we had a good

1063
00:58:14,720 --> 00:58:19,280
Speaker 1: game for bad game, I leader hated myself for a

1064
00:58:19,320 --> 00:58:22,680
Speaker 1: long time. There it gets to a point where you

1065
00:58:22,800 --> 00:58:26,200
Speaker 1: kind of harness it in the right ways. But sorry, yeah, yeah,

1066
00:58:26,240 --> 00:58:28,920
Speaker 1: I mean I think or don't I would agree, but

1067
00:58:29,000 --> 00:58:31,360
Speaker 1: you do you beat yourself up. You see your plays

1068
00:58:31,440 --> 00:58:34,240
Speaker 1: now over and over again, like it's a really hard

1069
00:58:34,880 --> 00:58:37,840
Speaker 1: well what could have done different? I kept that I

1070
00:58:37,960 --> 00:58:40,520
Speaker 1: think honestly probably mattered too much. Like I I envy

1071
00:58:40,600 --> 00:58:42,440
Speaker 1: those guys that like just didn't give a fuck, Like

1072
00:58:42,560 --> 00:58:47,600
Speaker 1: I gave too many funks about everything, every shot, every possession. God,

1073
00:58:47,640 --> 00:58:49,160
Speaker 1: I why didn't I just take this? Why don't take

1074
00:58:49,160 --> 00:58:51,000
Speaker 1: a lay up there? Why don't I do this? Why

1075
00:58:51,240 --> 00:58:53,280
Speaker 1: you know I was coming out of the game anyway,

1076
00:58:53,280 --> 00:58:55,080
Speaker 1: Why didn't take a shot? You know? Those things so

1077
00:58:55,600 --> 00:58:57,520
Speaker 1: that who are good athlete to a lot of people

1078
00:58:57,560 --> 00:59:00,040
Speaker 1: didn't realize, Like, dude, yeah, Like I was shocked and

1079
00:59:00,120 --> 00:59:01,720
Speaker 1: joanning Cat when you went out with two and I

1080
00:59:01,800 --> 00:59:04,040
Speaker 1: was like Okay, yeah, I mean at that time in

1081
00:59:04,080 --> 00:59:06,440
Speaker 1: my life I was that was like peak athleticism. So

1082
00:59:07,840 --> 00:59:10,080
Speaker 1: so they asked me to like, hey, you want to

1083
00:59:10,120 --> 00:59:11,960
Speaker 1: come and play it? And the only thing I was like,

1084
00:59:12,520 --> 00:59:14,600
Speaker 1: can I just show up for the tournament part? Like

1085
00:59:14,640 --> 00:59:15,960
Speaker 1: I don't really want to do all that. I don't know,

1086
00:59:16,920 --> 00:59:20,960
Speaker 1: especially with like no, you can't, you gotta come, you

1087
00:59:21,040 --> 00:59:23,080
Speaker 1: gotta come to training camp. So I go to Philadelphia,

1088
00:59:23,880 --> 00:59:26,720
Speaker 1: and you know, Gabe Frank became one of my he

1089
00:59:26,840 --> 00:59:28,640
Speaker 1: became one of my best friends. And I played with

1090
00:59:28,680 --> 00:59:32,560
Speaker 1: those guys in the Pan Maccabi Games in Mexico and

1091
00:59:32,640 --> 00:59:36,120
Speaker 1: the Pan Maccabi Games again the same type of thing

1092
00:59:36,200 --> 00:59:37,520
Speaker 1: where most of the games are a joke and you

1093
00:59:37,520 --> 00:59:40,520
Speaker 1: get to the finals. It's a good team. And Sandy

1094
00:59:40,600 --> 00:59:42,480
Speaker 1: pion In was the head coach, and he was a

1095
00:59:42,560 --> 00:59:46,120
Speaker 1: famous AU coach from New Jersey and he would just

1096
00:59:46,280 --> 00:59:49,120
Speaker 1: yell and scream but not actually tell you what to do,

1097
00:59:50,080 --> 00:59:52,320
Speaker 1: and like he was just you know, he was just

1098
00:59:52,360 --> 00:59:54,320
Speaker 1: an AU coach where he was just like about playing

1099
00:59:54,400 --> 00:59:58,040
Speaker 1: hard and play harder, which is great, you know you're

1100
00:59:58,080 --> 01:00:01,080
Speaker 1: not playing hard. So finally I was just like I

1101
01:00:01,080 --> 01:00:03,360
Speaker 1: would take the pen. I would I basically I coached

1102
01:00:03,440 --> 01:00:05,400
Speaker 1: the team and he would argue with me and I

1103
01:00:05,400 --> 01:00:07,240
Speaker 1: would I was a dick. I was just like, you

1104
01:00:07,320 --> 01:00:09,840
Speaker 1: know what you're talking about? Do this? And well anyway,

1105
01:00:10,640 --> 01:00:16,480
Speaker 1: So if I was her was a strong personality and

1106
01:00:16,560 --> 01:00:19,800
Speaker 1: I respected her a great deal, even though I thought

1107
01:00:19,840 --> 01:00:23,400
Speaker 1: he funked up the Canada game four years before, and

1108
01:00:24,040 --> 01:00:26,680
Speaker 1: I just wanted to come back and win the gold bed.

1109
01:00:26,680 --> 01:00:29,880
Speaker 1: That's all I want to do. And it wasn't quite

1110
01:00:30,000 --> 01:00:33,720
Speaker 1: the same with the because when we went in nine,

1111
01:00:34,800 --> 01:00:36,640
Speaker 1: it wasn't just that we had Yank Ellovich and we

1112
01:00:36,680 --> 01:00:38,520
Speaker 1: had these older dudes and they were really good leaders.

1113
01:00:39,040 --> 01:00:41,280
Speaker 1: But also we went to Kutures, which is like a

1114
01:00:41,360 --> 01:00:44,600
Speaker 1: famous like Jewish summer camp, and we were there for

1115
01:00:44,680 --> 01:00:48,240
Speaker 1: like two weeks training. You know, I loved the super

1116
01:00:48,400 --> 01:00:51,560
Speaker 1: super close like those guys. It was crazy. We did

1117
01:00:51,600 --> 01:00:54,560
Speaker 1: all this and we did scrimmages and they brought in

1118
01:00:54,680 --> 01:00:57,800
Speaker 1: pros and it was like the amount of investment in

1119
01:00:57,840 --> 01:01:00,960
Speaker 1: the team that I coached the team was it five

1120
01:01:01,040 --> 01:01:04,440
Speaker 1: years ago, and like we had two practices at Fairfield

1121
01:01:04,520 --> 01:01:06,920
Speaker 1: University and then we flew in practice a bunch there

1122
01:01:06,960 --> 01:01:09,040
Speaker 1: and end up winning the thing. But he investments and

1123
01:01:09,080 --> 01:01:12,080
Speaker 1: then to lose in the semis after that much, I

1124
01:01:12,200 --> 01:01:15,600
Speaker 1: was just so pissed. So I was there for training camp,

1125
01:01:15,720 --> 01:01:18,000
Speaker 1: but I wasn't there because I was with the Lakers

1126
01:01:18,080 --> 01:01:20,360
Speaker 1: in Summer League, if you remember, I wasn't there for

1127
01:01:20,480 --> 01:01:25,400
Speaker 1: the touring. Oh you. I think we all realized, Doug.

1128
01:01:25,480 --> 01:01:28,280
Speaker 1: I mean, we did have Eric Gingele, who was a

1129
01:01:28,440 --> 01:01:35,160
Speaker 1: seven five behemoth Jewish, yes, and wonderful human being by

1130
01:01:35,200 --> 01:01:38,240
Speaker 1: the way, one of the night. Great, great dude. I

1131
01:01:38,280 --> 01:01:40,520
Speaker 1: forgot we had a seven five who was an amazing

1132
01:01:40,720 --> 01:01:44,640
Speaker 1: car accident and really I wish I could have valued

1133
01:01:45,000 --> 01:01:49,160
Speaker 1: his time more at the time, but it was shocking

1134
01:01:49,200 --> 01:01:51,040
Speaker 1: to me. I was like, Tamir Goodman and me are

1135
01:01:51,080 --> 01:01:54,640
Speaker 1: in the same deal, but I'm Jewish from Omahawk, Nebraska,

1136
01:01:54,800 --> 01:01:57,720
Speaker 1: Like yeah, so like I'm over here, Like well, I'm like,

1137
01:01:58,080 --> 01:02:01,280
Speaker 1: I feel like I'm better than him. I did, and

1138
01:02:01,320 --> 01:02:03,600
Speaker 1: then I went to camp and like when I went

1139
01:02:03,640 --> 01:02:07,560
Speaker 1: to camp in that fall for that Maccabi team, Larry

1140
01:02:07,720 --> 01:02:10,800
Speaker 1: Shott was the original coach, and I think you were

1141
01:02:10,920 --> 01:02:14,920
Speaker 1: just like good enough that John, just like you had

1142
01:02:15,000 --> 01:02:17,720
Speaker 1: like the free pass. You and David Blumenthal were like, yes,

1143
01:02:17,840 --> 01:02:20,480
Speaker 1: we're taking these guys. And then the rest of us

1144
01:02:20,520 --> 01:02:24,560
Speaker 1: had to try out, but but I would team. What

1145
01:02:25,080 --> 01:02:29,640
Speaker 1: did Samir not make the team? No, he didn't make

1146
01:02:29,680 --> 01:02:32,760
Speaker 1: the team. Now you know he didn't make the team.

1147
01:02:32,920 --> 01:02:35,320
Speaker 1: Now now I'll get to where kind of that you

1148
01:02:35,480 --> 01:02:37,640
Speaker 1: know as well? It was kind of weird. No, he

1149
01:02:37,720 --> 01:02:41,840
Speaker 1: didn't make the team. And honestly, I was at the camp,

1150
01:02:41,920 --> 01:02:44,160
Speaker 1: and anyone else was at the camp probably will tell

1151
01:02:44,160 --> 01:02:46,800
Speaker 1: you who the best player was. I'll say that David

1152
01:02:46,840 --> 01:02:49,760
Speaker 1: Blumenthal was there and we were told to tell I

1153
01:02:49,920 --> 01:02:52,080
Speaker 1: he was way better. I feel I mean, you know

1154
01:02:52,280 --> 01:02:54,480
Speaker 1: that Dave kind of showed up because you know how

1155
01:02:54,560 --> 01:02:58,280
Speaker 1: quality character he is. But I you know that I

1156
01:02:58,440 --> 01:03:00,640
Speaker 1: remember him. And there was that m kid who was

1157
01:03:00,680 --> 01:03:02,800
Speaker 1: at Harvard, but I got to meet a good friend

1158
01:03:02,840 --> 01:03:05,040
Speaker 1: of mine, Matt Mintoff at the time, was it yeah,

1159
01:03:06,320 --> 01:03:08,520
Speaker 1: But but there we we had a lot of talent.

1160
01:03:08,600 --> 01:03:11,480
Speaker 1: There was two Jewish kids there that were a lot

1161
01:03:11,600 --> 01:03:14,320
Speaker 1: more talented than I realized. But I I like that

1162
01:03:14,480 --> 01:03:16,760
Speaker 1: for tag guy was there. I feel like you said

1163
01:03:16,840 --> 01:03:20,680
Speaker 1: that name. And then Larry Shiatt was our coach and

1164
01:03:21,000 --> 01:03:24,840
Speaker 1: and so I made that first four roster with you, me,

1165
01:03:25,120 --> 01:03:30,320
Speaker 1: David Blumenthal, and then a guy from Penn Oh Dad, Yes,

1166
01:03:31,080 --> 01:03:33,160
Speaker 1: who was a good player, by the way, high level

1167
01:03:33,240 --> 01:03:37,720
Speaker 1: like you, uh basketball player. Um well, Josh Shackter was

1168
01:03:37,760 --> 01:03:41,080
Speaker 1: on that and that thing too. Yeah, well you know

1169
01:03:41,320 --> 01:03:44,120
Speaker 1: he didn't make that team though, but Jamir showed up

1170
01:03:44,240 --> 01:03:46,760
Speaker 1: with his orthodox rabbi behind and Doug And it was

1171
01:03:46,840 --> 01:03:49,600
Speaker 1: kind of crazy to see because you know, that article

1172
01:03:49,680 --> 01:03:52,600
Speaker 1: came out and here I am, this Jewish kid from Omaha.

1173
01:03:53,200 --> 01:03:56,439
Speaker 1: No one knows that there's Jews from omahaw Pass, New York.

1174
01:03:57,000 --> 01:03:59,240
Speaker 1: Well here's here's what here's what you find. And I

1175
01:03:59,360 --> 01:04:02,360
Speaker 1: think this is it's interesting, right, and this is what

1176
01:04:02,480 --> 01:04:06,680
Speaker 1: you find when you um, I think Tamir found out

1177
01:04:07,040 --> 01:04:11,920
Speaker 1: at that camp and then you find out as one

1178
01:04:11,960 --> 01:04:14,000
Speaker 1: of the reasons that a lot of guys that play

1179
01:04:14,120 --> 01:04:17,600
Speaker 1: high major basketball don't farewell in the minor leagues and

1180
01:04:17,720 --> 01:04:23,280
Speaker 1: don't felt farewell overseas is like I think everybody I've

1181
01:04:23,360 --> 01:04:24,920
Speaker 1: never played in the game that I didn't want to win.

1182
01:04:25,040 --> 01:04:27,120
Speaker 1: That wasn't kill the other dude to want to win,

1183
01:04:27,400 --> 01:04:32,680
Speaker 1: no doubt. But uh, like I remember going against Aubrey Rees,

1184
01:04:32,720 --> 01:04:35,440
Speaker 1: who's a Murray State guy in the CBS. I was

1185
01:04:35,480 --> 01:04:37,360
Speaker 1: in the c b A for the id Host Stampede

1186
01:04:38,360 --> 01:04:41,080
Speaker 1: and he was a very high he had a great

1187
01:04:41,120 --> 01:04:42,680
Speaker 1: senior He was a really good player, and he was

1188
01:04:42,680 --> 01:04:45,880
Speaker 1: actually drafted by the Stampede and we're like fighting for

1189
01:04:45,920 --> 01:04:48,720
Speaker 1: the same starting spot. And I remember like this dude

1190
01:04:48,760 --> 01:04:53,680
Speaker 1: fucking hated He like hated me. And and I've met

1191
01:04:53,720 --> 01:04:55,439
Speaker 1: and I've talked to him since and he was really cool.

1192
01:04:55,520 --> 01:04:58,480
Speaker 1: But he's like you were on TV all the time.

1193
01:04:59,000 --> 01:05:01,000
Speaker 1: We'd watch you on t BE and I was always like,

1194
01:05:01,360 --> 01:05:03,360
Speaker 1: I'm better than that motherfucker. I'm you know, I'm gonna

1195
01:05:03,400 --> 01:05:05,120
Speaker 1: if I ever did on the same court of him,

1196
01:05:05,280 --> 01:05:07,120
Speaker 1: I'm gonna suck him up. I'm gonna kill him. Were

1197
01:05:07,160 --> 01:05:10,640
Speaker 1: you scoring more in those Baltics in those leagues? Were

1198
01:05:11,040 --> 01:05:13,240
Speaker 1: you because I know, no, you were upheld to a

1199
01:05:13,400 --> 01:05:18,280
Speaker 1: level that was it was like three games and you

1200
01:05:18,360 --> 01:05:20,880
Speaker 1: were gone if you didn't get twenty. That's how they felt.

1201
01:05:21,160 --> 01:05:23,640
Speaker 1: And some of them that wasn't really help when I

1202
01:05:23,760 --> 01:05:25,480
Speaker 1: was because I went to Russia and we kind of

1203
01:05:25,560 --> 01:05:28,760
Speaker 1: had a team made to win a championship, and I

1204
01:05:29,560 --> 01:05:31,480
Speaker 1: had I scored more, it would have I would have

1205
01:05:31,560 --> 01:05:35,040
Speaker 1: stayed there longer. But they didn't. Really they just needed

1206
01:05:35,080 --> 01:05:38,200
Speaker 1: somebody to They just need a point guard. Really, they

1207
01:05:38,240 --> 01:05:39,920
Speaker 1: had they had. We had a ton of their scores

1208
01:05:40,920 --> 01:05:43,439
Speaker 1: and that was a really high level for my first job,

1209
01:05:43,960 --> 01:05:47,120
Speaker 1: to be honest with you. But anyway, and I kind

1210
01:05:47,160 --> 01:05:49,480
Speaker 1: of broken out of the not shooting thing playing for

1211
01:05:49,560 --> 01:05:52,120
Speaker 1: my dad in the exhibition deal. But I would get

1212
01:05:52,560 --> 01:05:55,200
Speaker 1: when I was on my own, he would facilitate better

1213
01:05:55,280 --> 01:05:58,440
Speaker 1: today with the downhill opening up, like I feel like,

1214
01:05:58,640 --> 01:06:00,600
Speaker 1: you know, I basically like and time I played in

1215
01:06:00,680 --> 01:06:03,360
Speaker 1: high school was threes and layups. I didn't I didn't

1216
01:06:03,360 --> 01:06:05,040
Speaker 1: have you know, you get to know when I get

1217
01:06:05,080 --> 01:06:06,160
Speaker 1: then other day and they were like you need to

1218
01:06:06,200 --> 01:06:07,760
Speaker 1: pull up jump shot. I don't need to pull up

1219
01:06:07,800 --> 01:06:15,040
Speaker 1: jumption anyway, curve with that. Yeah, So that my my

1220
01:06:15,200 --> 01:06:18,240
Speaker 1: memories of that were like I just all I want

1221
01:06:18,280 --> 01:06:20,640
Speaker 1: to do is go and play in the tournament. And

1222
01:06:20,720 --> 01:06:22,760
Speaker 1: I was and I love shy it, but it was

1223
01:06:22,800 --> 01:06:24,800
Speaker 1: when Herb was like, Hey, I'm gonna coach this thing.

1224
01:06:24,840 --> 01:06:27,720
Speaker 1: Sh I can't do it. You want to come, Yeah,

1225
01:06:27,800 --> 01:06:30,360
Speaker 1: but I'm I'm not going to all that touring stuff

1226
01:06:30,360 --> 01:06:32,600
Speaker 1: because I'm with the Lakers. And so I had one

1227
01:06:32,680 --> 01:06:37,439
Speaker 1: game left with the Lakers and they were like, look

1228
01:06:37,800 --> 01:06:42,400
Speaker 1: now who's on this roster. Doug of the Lakers Slava

1229
01:06:42,440 --> 01:06:49,520
Speaker 1: Medvedenko who is a great dude. Uh, Devin George who

1230
01:06:49,640 --> 01:06:56,120
Speaker 1: is a really super human being, Pemberthy and then Pemberthy

1231
01:06:56,160 --> 01:06:59,920
Speaker 1: beat me out again, and then um Joe Crispin who

1232
01:07:00,080 --> 01:07:03,320
Speaker 1: is like the world's nicest dude. And that's when I

1233
01:07:03,520 --> 01:07:05,880
Speaker 1: kind of really learned about your backcourt made on b

1234
01:07:06,160 --> 01:07:09,680
Speaker 1: w B A I believe huh was he your backcourt

1235
01:07:09,720 --> 01:07:12,480
Speaker 1: made on b w B A. No, No, Chris, Chris.

1236
01:07:12,600 --> 01:07:14,200
Speaker 1: I never got to like we would we would have

1237
01:07:14,320 --> 01:07:16,920
Speaker 1: killed dudes. It was me and him. He was he

1238
01:07:17,200 --> 01:07:21,000
Speaker 1: was really he was really good. He was really good. Um.

1239
01:07:22,440 --> 01:07:26,720
Speaker 1: So yeah, I mean, like they just told me, They're like, look,

1240
01:07:27,080 --> 01:07:28,800
Speaker 1: if you stay one game, you don't stay one game,

1241
01:07:28,800 --> 01:07:30,320
Speaker 1: it's not gonna We're still gonna vite you to bet

1242
01:07:30,400 --> 01:07:32,800
Speaker 1: many camp you know you're not. We're not giving you

1243
01:07:32,920 --> 01:07:35,640
Speaker 1: camping by yet. And so that's why I end up doing.

1244
01:07:35,680 --> 01:07:37,720
Speaker 1: So I left and I joined you guys, and we

1245
01:07:37,760 --> 01:07:39,800
Speaker 1: had a practice at like one practice like wind Gate,

1246
01:07:41,040 --> 01:07:44,040
Speaker 1: and then we played the tournament and we had a

1247
01:07:44,080 --> 01:07:46,600
Speaker 1: blast and we won and we beat Israel in the

1248
01:07:46,720 --> 01:07:50,520
Speaker 1: championship at Metro West and Sharon Drucker was the coach

1249
01:07:50,600 --> 01:07:53,360
Speaker 1: of the Israeli national team and he was my coach

1250
01:07:53,400 --> 01:07:56,160
Speaker 1: the next year. And I didn't like Sharon Drewker at

1251
01:07:56,200 --> 01:07:59,040
Speaker 1: the time because Miles Simon is my best friend. He

1252
01:07:59,160 --> 01:08:02,080
Speaker 1: played for Sharon and he hated playing for Sharon, like

1253
01:08:02,200 --> 01:08:08,240
Speaker 1: they butted heads, So don't keep my association is more common,

1254
01:08:08,320 --> 01:08:11,000
Speaker 1: I feel like in some of that. Yeah. Then then

1255
01:08:11,600 --> 01:08:14,840
Speaker 1: the next year, after Night eleven, guess who I played

1256
01:08:14,880 --> 01:08:20,479
Speaker 1: for Sharon Drewker with Maccabi Ranana. And what's amazing about

1257
01:08:20,560 --> 01:08:25,920
Speaker 1: it is they took so long they were they to

1258
01:08:26,320 --> 01:08:29,000
Speaker 1: get the money right. They kept bullshit with the money,

1259
01:08:29,240 --> 01:08:32,439
Speaker 1: like we're like ten thousand dollars off for a ten

1260
01:08:32,520 --> 01:08:35,040
Speaker 1: month contract, Like what We're really going to go back

1261
01:08:35,040 --> 01:08:37,920
Speaker 1: and forth like I'm not so finally we got the

1262
01:08:37,960 --> 01:08:41,160
Speaker 1: money right. But by the time they registered, he was

1263
01:08:41,160 --> 01:08:42,639
Speaker 1: like a day late in Israel, so I had missed

1264
01:08:42,640 --> 01:08:45,519
Speaker 1: the first four games I played in friendly. So Sharon

1265
01:08:45,640 --> 01:08:48,400
Speaker 1: was great, He's like, goodly, you come with us, you

1266
01:08:48,520 --> 01:08:52,120
Speaker 1: come to the coffee after games and we talk who

1267
01:08:52,200 --> 01:08:53,640
Speaker 1: come to coaches me? And it was like just like

1268
01:08:53,720 --> 01:08:55,320
Speaker 1: junior college again, where I was like a coach and

1269
01:08:55,400 --> 01:08:59,360
Speaker 1: a player, but he like would ask my opinion. I

1270
01:08:59,360 --> 01:09:02,840
Speaker 1: would give him my opinion, and then when I started playing,

1271
01:09:02,880 --> 01:09:06,160
Speaker 1: he would use it against me. It's like, oh, Mr Goodley, professor,

1272
01:09:06,320 --> 01:09:09,080
Speaker 1: you have the answer. It's like, dude, two weeks ago,

1273
01:09:09,160 --> 01:09:12,200
Speaker 1: we were having coffee at the Coffee Bean in Ranana

1274
01:09:12,720 --> 01:09:15,840
Speaker 1: and you asked for my opinion, Like what do you like?

1275
01:09:15,960 --> 01:09:18,560
Speaker 1: This doesn't make any sense to me. And then the

1276
01:09:18,640 --> 01:09:23,320
Speaker 1: other thing they would do, which is amazing spector Guy. Yeah,

1277
01:09:26,000 --> 01:09:28,000
Speaker 1: you know, they wanted Israeli on the court at all times.

1278
01:09:28,920 --> 01:09:31,000
Speaker 1: So the other the only Israeli that could really play

1279
01:09:31,120 --> 01:09:34,439
Speaker 1: at the time was Guy Contour, and Guy was like

1280
01:09:34,479 --> 01:09:37,000
Speaker 1: a combo guard. He was a good player. He did

1281
01:09:37,040 --> 01:09:39,559
Speaker 1: not like me because we're playing for the same spot.

1282
01:09:39,680 --> 01:09:43,160
Speaker 1: And remember I just come from the Lakers, and the

1283
01:09:43,280 --> 01:09:46,280
Speaker 1: Lakers like Pemberty is a great dude, Like all he

1284
01:09:46,320 --> 01:09:48,400
Speaker 1: wants to do is shoot jump shots and go play golf.

1285
01:09:49,040 --> 01:09:51,080
Speaker 1: She jumps out and talk about golf. That's it, right,

1286
01:09:51,400 --> 01:09:55,800
Speaker 1: And then Joe Crispin is very religious, loves ball and

1287
01:09:55,920 --> 01:09:58,240
Speaker 1: Christ and it is a nice human beings. So we're

1288
01:09:58,320 --> 01:10:00,880
Speaker 1: fighting for the same steak. But like he was like,

1289
01:10:01,040 --> 01:10:02,920
Speaker 1: you know, you're get in the game and you're cheering

1290
01:10:02,960 --> 01:10:05,400
Speaker 1: for each other, you know, like a guy contour. I

1291
01:10:05,479 --> 01:10:07,560
Speaker 1: played good in the first half, and we come in

1292
01:10:07,680 --> 01:10:09,200
Speaker 1: and everything was in English, and all of a sudden,

1293
01:10:09,880 --> 01:10:11,880
Speaker 1: he and Saroan would disappear and you'd see here and

1294
01:10:12,000 --> 01:10:15,120
Speaker 1: yelling at each other in Hebrew, and guys look at

1295
01:10:15,160 --> 01:10:17,559
Speaker 1: me like, oh, that's on now, dude, you're talking to Hebrew.

1296
01:10:17,880 --> 01:10:20,040
Speaker 1: You know they're talking about you. And we come out

1297
01:10:20,080 --> 01:10:21,519
Speaker 1: and I hardly played in the second half, Like what

1298
01:10:21,680 --> 01:10:28,280
Speaker 1: the fuck? I love it? So so you get done

1299
01:10:28,320 --> 01:10:31,519
Speaker 1: playing at Tennessee Tech. Why did you just when did

1300
01:10:31,600 --> 01:10:35,519
Speaker 1: you go into coach? Yeah? Great question. UM. I didn't

1301
01:10:35,680 --> 01:10:39,639
Speaker 1: know exactly what I wanted to do quite yet, UM,

1302
01:10:40,240 --> 01:10:42,760
Speaker 1: and Sarah, I was sitting there in two thousand and

1303
01:10:42,840 --> 01:10:46,360
Speaker 1: five and you know, obviously UM feeling good on that

1304
01:10:46,520 --> 01:10:52,000
Speaker 1: conference championship run. But UM, coach Sutton, Uh, you know,

1305
01:10:52,840 --> 01:10:57,120
Speaker 1: unfortunately fell down with Gilliam Barr Syndrum are rare disease

1306
01:10:57,200 --> 01:11:01,880
Speaker 1: watching Willie out at the what was the Plattsmouth flight

1307
01:11:02,200 --> 01:11:12,800
Speaker 1: flight platt Smith Fly Plymouth Platsmuth and no, what's the

1308
01:11:13,000 --> 01:11:14,840
Speaker 1: one of the first pro camp where all the good

1309
01:11:14,880 --> 01:11:20,200
Speaker 1: players used to go first Portsmouth And he fell ill

1310
01:11:20,320 --> 01:11:23,040
Speaker 1: there and you know, I worried about his sleep deprivation.

1311
01:11:23,160 --> 01:11:27,760
Speaker 1: Doug on he fell asleep on my visit on I

1312
01:11:27,880 --> 01:11:31,360
Speaker 1: could John Dungers was a good guy who was assistant

1313
01:11:31,400 --> 01:11:34,000
Speaker 1: at the Western Steps sit in the offer. Mike was

1314
01:11:34,080 --> 01:11:35,840
Speaker 1: talking to me and just kind of fell off. But

1315
01:11:35,960 --> 01:11:37,920
Speaker 1: like you know, at the time, I had been in

1316
01:11:38,000 --> 01:11:40,439
Speaker 1: basketball three years where I got where you know that

1317
01:11:41,120 --> 01:11:43,840
Speaker 1: that kind of energy came from where you could fall asleep,

1318
01:11:43,880 --> 01:11:47,680
Speaker 1: and maybe that was often times, but either way, I

1319
01:11:47,880 --> 01:11:50,360
Speaker 1: never quite registered at the health risk of what it

1320
01:11:50,560 --> 01:11:52,720
Speaker 1: was at. And that's not a laughing matter, but that

1321
01:11:52,840 --> 01:11:54,920
Speaker 1: was real serious and his life was on the line,

1322
01:11:55,600 --> 01:11:59,160
Speaker 1: and I didn't really have much. Uh. What I had,

1323
01:11:59,240 --> 01:12:02,479
Speaker 1: Doug was I'm gonna go play mccaby this two thousand

1324
01:12:02,600 --> 01:12:05,840
Speaker 1: five team, and since I had that great experience with

1325
01:12:05,960 --> 01:12:10,800
Speaker 1: you guys, which was amazing by the way, um lex

1326
01:12:10,880 --> 01:12:17,720
Speaker 1: Or you gave bet Fisher Matt men off even like

1327
01:12:18,000 --> 01:12:21,760
Speaker 1: some of those whose major mumbles. But good good player though.

1328
01:12:22,479 --> 01:12:26,519
Speaker 1: But either way, so uh, that experience with great experience

1329
01:12:26,560 --> 01:12:29,840
Speaker 1: winning that with you, I had that opportunity, you know, say, okay,

1330
01:12:29,840 --> 01:12:31,639
Speaker 1: am I gonna go overseas And so this is where

1331
01:12:31,680 --> 01:12:34,679
Speaker 1: I meet Zev Gross who reaches out to me before

1332
01:12:34,720 --> 01:12:38,080
Speaker 1: I go to training camp in Philly. And by the way,

1333
01:12:38,120 --> 01:12:41,799
Speaker 1: I love playing for her Brown and uh that first

1334
01:12:41,840 --> 01:12:44,760
Speaker 1: time with you guys, But I think your your your

1335
01:12:44,920 --> 01:12:49,599
Speaker 1: whole situation with Canada probably had us ready more ready

1336
01:12:49,640 --> 01:12:52,240
Speaker 1: than we were probably prepared for. Even I kind of

1337
01:12:52,320 --> 01:12:56,200
Speaker 1: made sense with how um urgent things were with everybody

1338
01:12:56,280 --> 01:13:00,479
Speaker 1: to win that that Maccaby games because oh five, it

1339
01:13:00,640 --> 01:13:02,360
Speaker 1: was kind of I won the goal with you guys,

1340
01:13:02,400 --> 01:13:05,320
Speaker 1: and that experience is amazing. Like you guys lost by

1341
01:13:05,360 --> 01:13:08,479
Speaker 1: the way you showed up and just like wanted you.

1342
01:13:08,640 --> 01:13:10,720
Speaker 1: You literally played is good enough to win the m

1343
01:13:10,800 --> 01:13:13,160
Speaker 1: v P. I will say this to you too. You

1344
01:13:13,240 --> 01:13:16,320
Speaker 1: were but you were good enough to win it? Yeah,

1345
01:13:16,360 --> 01:13:19,160
Speaker 1: but like your name okay, but you were gonna know

1346
01:13:19,320 --> 01:13:22,400
Speaker 1: you had like fourteen points and nine assist and were you?

1347
01:13:23,439 --> 01:13:25,479
Speaker 1: I think I love more than that. Well, I don't

1348
01:13:25,520 --> 01:13:30,040
Speaker 1: know either way. That Israel morning, okay, twenty one and nine.

1349
01:13:30,520 --> 01:13:33,240
Speaker 1: Let's look, you have the day? How can you? How

1350
01:13:33,320 --> 01:13:35,920
Speaker 1: can we? I don't think. I don't know. Is that accessible?

1351
01:13:37,240 --> 01:13:40,560
Speaker 1: The second spectrum around Lecture was amazing. Lecture was a

1352
01:13:40,600 --> 01:13:44,240
Speaker 1: really good player, uh and he was good that it

1353
01:13:44,400 --> 01:13:46,439
Speaker 1: was basically me and him and then gave it a

1354
01:13:46,479 --> 01:13:51,120
Speaker 1: bunch of threes as well. Yeah you know, okay, so

1355
01:13:51,400 --> 01:13:54,320
Speaker 1: you played ports Smith, play overseat, you played Israel. So

1356
01:13:54,720 --> 01:13:58,479
Speaker 1: Israel that second time around training camp Philly was brill

1357
01:13:58,600 --> 01:14:02,160
Speaker 1: I'm talking about when you got done playing, so you go, No,

1358
01:14:02,600 --> 01:14:06,200
Speaker 1: I never did. I I kind of left Israel. We

1359
01:14:06,320 --> 01:14:09,600
Speaker 1: got the bronze. That second team had great guys with

1360
01:14:09,640 --> 01:14:12,479
Speaker 1: Scott Green and Seth Halban, who I is a saint

1361
01:14:13,080 --> 01:14:15,719
Speaker 1: if you ever meet a great people on that team.

1362
01:14:15,760 --> 01:14:20,120
Speaker 1: But we just I I was one of the I

1363
01:14:20,240 --> 01:14:23,760
Speaker 1: hadn't quite realized. I wanted to test the boundaries and

1364
01:14:24,360 --> 01:14:26,760
Speaker 1: me and a teammate, uh we, we we have a

1365
01:14:26,840 --> 01:14:30,880
Speaker 1: similar story. Uh we. We played France and beat him

1366
01:14:30,880 --> 01:14:35,439
Speaker 1: by about thirty five previous and then the second time

1367
01:14:35,520 --> 01:14:38,960
Speaker 1: around in the semifinals they had a couple of ringers

1368
01:14:39,640 --> 01:14:41,720
Speaker 1: that weren't there the first they had some ringers. So

1369
01:14:41,760 --> 01:14:43,880
Speaker 1: when we played against him as a coach, they had

1370
01:14:43,880 --> 01:14:45,760
Speaker 1: a seven foot dude and they had this dude was

1371
01:14:45,880 --> 01:14:49,280
Speaker 1: seven foot yeah, and he was good and beat him,

1372
01:14:49,520 --> 01:14:51,360
Speaker 1: beat him both times, and we beat them two different

1373
01:14:51,360 --> 01:14:53,519
Speaker 1: ways to beat him playing small the first time. The

1374
01:14:53,600 --> 01:14:57,000
Speaker 1: second time we beat him playing big. Well, I wasn't

1375
01:14:57,080 --> 01:14:59,760
Speaker 1: alerted that how much the Israeli men, we're gonna hate

1376
01:14:59,760 --> 01:15:02,479
Speaker 1: me go into the bars and me and my teammate

1377
01:15:03,160 --> 01:15:06,120
Speaker 1: were at that kibbutz at the water park, and I

1378
01:15:06,280 --> 01:15:08,320
Speaker 1: was like, we went out to that beach the day

1379
01:15:08,400 --> 01:15:10,400
Speaker 1: before that, you know, like you know how beautiful the

1380
01:15:10,479 --> 01:15:13,080
Speaker 1: women are there. You know, obviously we don't know that.

1381
01:15:14,120 --> 01:15:17,040
Speaker 1: I love my wife obviously, but you know, just whatever.

1382
01:15:17,400 --> 01:15:22,559
Speaker 1: Uh but either way, we uh we we we had

1383
01:15:22,640 --> 01:15:24,640
Speaker 1: that experience and going out and hurt. So I don't know,

1384
01:15:24,720 --> 01:15:27,439
Speaker 1: downtown you that you had you lived that life, probably

1385
01:15:27,439 --> 01:15:29,400
Speaker 1: a little more than me. But it was also probably

1386
01:15:29,400 --> 01:15:32,240
Speaker 1: not the best time to be going out, and we

1387
01:15:32,400 --> 01:15:35,479
Speaker 1: really tested the boundaries either way. Uh. We didn't get

1388
01:15:35,520 --> 01:15:38,040
Speaker 1: back till late to that water park kibbutz, which, by

1389
01:15:38,080 --> 01:15:42,840
Speaker 1: the way, those people were amazing. Uh and you know

1390
01:15:42,960 --> 01:15:46,320
Speaker 1: we lost to them, you know, similar fashion by about

1391
01:15:46,360 --> 01:15:48,840
Speaker 1: thirty five and lost and a big reason I I

1392
01:15:49,400 --> 01:15:53,160
Speaker 1: missed the game time shot. And this, Doug probably one

1393
01:15:53,200 --> 01:15:56,080
Speaker 1: of the thing that haunts me. Two things. One thing,

1394
01:15:56,120 --> 01:15:58,519
Speaker 1: it's funny from her that I'll say, that's pretty funny

1395
01:15:58,560 --> 01:16:00,040
Speaker 1: that I just want to add. And then just a

1396
01:16:00,080 --> 01:16:02,000
Speaker 1: good thing I'll end with which I think all my

1397
01:16:02,080 --> 01:16:06,680
Speaker 1: teammates and all every Herb coach Brown player would appreciate.

1398
01:16:07,680 --> 01:16:10,840
Speaker 1: Was Herb said to me after I missed that three

1399
01:16:10,920 --> 01:16:13,240
Speaker 1: against France, which I'm sure he was well aware that

1400
01:16:13,320 --> 01:16:16,920
Speaker 1: we went out. I'm so disappointed in you right now.

1401
01:16:18,040 --> 01:16:20,360
Speaker 1: I'm more disappointed than you than I've ever been in

1402
01:16:20,439 --> 01:16:22,880
Speaker 1: my life, or something like that, like you know, pretty

1403
01:16:22,960 --> 01:16:26,800
Speaker 1: much like Darth Vader the Skywalk like, but I'm not

1404
01:16:27,080 --> 01:16:30,040
Speaker 1: in a minute realm of like how I look at

1405
01:16:30,080 --> 01:16:33,160
Speaker 1: the realm like I mean, I didn't feel like I

1406
01:16:33,240 --> 01:16:36,479
Speaker 1: could ever redeem myself to her Coach Brown, and so

1407
01:16:36,640 --> 01:16:40,559
Speaker 1: I looked down and either way, I know I loved him,

1408
01:16:40,600 --> 01:16:42,519
Speaker 1: and he loved me, and I think everyone you know

1409
01:16:42,720 --> 01:16:44,320
Speaker 1: I still love him to this day. There was a

1410
01:16:44,360 --> 01:16:46,560
Speaker 1: lot of good he brought. He he instilled in me,

1411
01:16:47,000 --> 01:16:49,800
Speaker 1: more he poured in more great than good than bad

1412
01:16:49,920 --> 01:16:52,680
Speaker 1: to me. But the second one would be at that

1413
01:16:52,840 --> 01:16:57,280
Speaker 1: shoot around this the following day, Uh, he goes on

1414
01:16:57,439 --> 01:17:02,840
Speaker 1: a tirade about not me, that guy's going out, I

1415
01:17:03,040 --> 01:17:05,120
Speaker 1: know about one of the other players that's I'll just

1416
01:17:05,240 --> 01:17:07,040
Speaker 1: not I'm not gonna throw that out there, but just

1417
01:17:07,240 --> 01:17:11,000
Speaker 1: just goes and says the work just and then and

1418
01:17:11,120 --> 01:17:15,280
Speaker 1: then he just it just coach Brown fashion and just

1419
01:17:15,479 --> 01:17:17,720
Speaker 1: like you know, just being done with this, just goes

1420
01:17:19,040 --> 01:17:23,519
Speaker 1: go shoot the basketballs. Just go shoot but I mean

1421
01:17:23,680 --> 01:17:29,200
Speaker 1: my terrible Eastern accent, go shoot the basketballs. Okay. So

1422
01:17:30,080 --> 01:17:36,920
Speaker 1: you get back from his drill and then so you know,

1423
01:17:37,400 --> 01:17:40,160
Speaker 1: we we we barreled through that bronze medal game and

1424
01:17:40,240 --> 01:17:45,120
Speaker 1: beat Australia. Who uh, you know, they're just fun guys,

1425
01:17:45,240 --> 01:17:48,600
Speaker 1: great guys. Those relationships, Doug, I know you remember some

1426
01:17:48,800 --> 01:17:50,920
Speaker 1: of them, probably in that nineties seven maybe where you

1427
01:17:51,000 --> 01:17:53,240
Speaker 1: got to experience it a little. I mean we have

1428
01:17:53,400 --> 01:17:56,679
Speaker 1: to hang out. I guess a fair amount uh back

1429
01:17:56,760 --> 01:17:58,720
Speaker 1: at the back then, but you were kind of more

1430
01:17:59,720 --> 01:18:02,559
Speaker 1: of line to where the league at that level, where

1431
01:18:02,640 --> 01:18:05,840
Speaker 1: we weren't quite I don't know. I guess Gingle was

1432
01:18:05,960 --> 01:18:08,479
Speaker 1: kind of there too with you, but no, I mean

1433
01:18:08,600 --> 01:18:11,480
Speaker 1: you were you actually had a shot. But so anyways,

1434
01:18:11,720 --> 01:18:16,400
Speaker 1: I get back, Uh, this is five years so Zev

1435
01:18:16,479 --> 01:18:20,680
Speaker 1: Gross has reached out to me. We've discussed it as

1436
01:18:20,720 --> 01:18:23,280
Speaker 1: an Israeli agent who's like, you know, we could get

1437
01:18:23,320 --> 01:18:27,680
Speaker 1: you do a citizen passport and you know playing and

1438
01:18:27,720 --> 01:18:31,720
Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, well how much Oh, I don't know,

1439
01:18:32,280 --> 01:18:36,240
Speaker 1: so I mean to be fat honestly, Doug, I probably,

1440
01:18:36,320 --> 01:18:38,760
Speaker 1: I don't know if I was the most sought after prospect.

1441
01:18:38,880 --> 01:18:40,559
Speaker 1: I don't know if I was as sought after as

1442
01:18:40,640 --> 01:18:44,840
Speaker 1: you were. And frankly, that's the vibe I was feeling

1443
01:18:45,000 --> 01:18:48,519
Speaker 1: so in that realm and the relationship I was in

1444
01:18:48,600 --> 01:18:51,720
Speaker 1: at the time and now and I talked about the

1445
01:18:51,920 --> 01:18:54,200
Speaker 1: you know, you mentioned that earlier, about that feeling of

1446
01:18:54,280 --> 01:18:57,120
Speaker 1: what it was like after your last season game. And

1447
01:18:57,160 --> 01:18:59,600
Speaker 1: I remember when we lost to Austin p in the

1448
01:18:59,680 --> 01:19:02,760
Speaker 1: Gay Center in Nashville in my senior year, and it

1449
01:19:02,920 --> 01:19:06,040
Speaker 1: was devastating. It it ripped me from my heart, like

1450
01:19:06,240 --> 01:19:10,920
Speaker 1: really dead. And because I don't know, I kind of

1451
01:19:11,040 --> 01:19:13,360
Speaker 1: came to terms with some things with me and myself

1452
01:19:13,400 --> 01:19:17,720
Speaker 1: as a player, even before Israel and the relationships I

1453
01:19:17,840 --> 01:19:22,080
Speaker 1: was in at the time. So grad school had its

1454
01:19:22,200 --> 01:19:26,600
Speaker 1: best alignment for me, especially since I love the Cookeville

1455
01:19:26,680 --> 01:19:31,720
Speaker 1: people in Southeast Tennessee and just the vibe there and

1456
01:19:31,960 --> 01:19:36,160
Speaker 1: and and I decided on that, Doug, and and from there,

1457
01:19:36,280 --> 01:19:39,080
Speaker 1: still coaching was still in there, but it was kind

1458
01:19:39,120 --> 01:19:41,200
Speaker 1: of like one ft in, one foot out the door.

1459
01:19:42,040 --> 01:19:44,280
Speaker 1: And a good friend of mine as I was going

1460
01:19:44,360 --> 01:19:47,360
Speaker 1: through grad school and enjoying my grad school years by

1461
01:19:47,600 --> 01:19:51,519
Speaker 1: you know, getting those you know, enjoying where I got

1462
01:19:51,560 --> 01:19:56,040
Speaker 1: it in educational leadership, which you know, to say whatever

1463
01:19:56,160 --> 01:19:58,960
Speaker 1: you may want about it, it, Uh, I worked at

1464
01:19:59,040 --> 01:20:02,560
Speaker 1: I believed in it, and I education does matter to me,

1465
01:20:02,680 --> 01:20:04,880
Speaker 1: and I grew up in a household of values with that.

1466
01:20:05,000 --> 01:20:08,240
Speaker 1: And so finally by that moment I did utilize that

1467
01:20:08,479 --> 01:20:12,679
Speaker 1: that master's degree program, but now quite maybe ready to coach.

1468
01:20:13,120 --> 01:20:16,479
Speaker 1: Maybe it was in education at some sector. I don't know,

1469
01:20:16,720 --> 01:20:19,760
Speaker 1: but uh, that's kind of what the route was. I'm

1470
01:20:19,800 --> 01:20:24,479
Speaker 1: sure if maybe Oklahoma's well you you were again professional work,

1471
01:20:24,560 --> 01:20:27,679
Speaker 1: teams were seeking you out. My opportunities were a little

1472
01:20:27,720 --> 01:20:32,920
Speaker 1: more limited. And so from there it was kind of

1473
01:20:32,960 --> 01:20:35,799
Speaker 1: after getting done with grad school, I kind of always

1474
01:20:35,840 --> 01:20:42,000
Speaker 1: wanted to live in the Bay and I had a

1475
01:20:42,080 --> 01:20:45,280
Speaker 1: good friend of mine who really reached out to me

1476
01:20:45,360 --> 01:20:47,240
Speaker 1: and said, hey, man, I'm getting a job at West

1477
01:20:47,360 --> 01:20:53,960
Speaker 1: Valley Junior College, you should come coach. Like, Okay, I

1478
01:20:54,040 --> 01:20:55,880
Speaker 1: want to live in the Bay area. It's like San

1479
01:20:55,960 --> 01:20:57,600
Speaker 1: Jose didn't know at the time was right next to

1480
01:20:57,680 --> 01:21:03,679
Speaker 1: Oakland and UM. After grad school, Uh, talking to Calm

1481
01:21:03,760 --> 01:21:06,519
Speaker 1: Foff and Ryan Madre, who were co head coaches at

1482
01:21:06,560 --> 01:21:10,760
Speaker 1: the time, who are both really young guys to be

1483
01:21:10,880 --> 01:21:13,720
Speaker 1: co head coaches and for my first experienced Doug as

1484
01:21:13,760 --> 01:21:16,080
Speaker 1: a coach as at college level, to have co head

1485
01:21:16,120 --> 01:21:18,479
Speaker 1: coaches at twenty five years old, Like not to say

1486
01:21:18,520 --> 01:21:20,680
Speaker 1: anything bad about these guys, because I think they were

1487
01:21:20,720 --> 01:21:24,040
Speaker 1: also really good, tremendous minds, because it's under that Bob

1488
01:21:24,120 --> 01:21:27,479
Speaker 1: Burton realm where these guys really work and that ethic

1489
01:21:27,600 --> 01:21:30,960
Speaker 1: I didn't have developed me yet, to be honest, and

1490
01:21:31,560 --> 01:21:34,080
Speaker 1: I did in development and how I wanted to coach

1491
01:21:34,200 --> 01:21:38,280
Speaker 1: players um to get the best out of their abilities.

1492
01:21:38,360 --> 01:21:40,840
Speaker 1: I always did kind of feel that, and I kind

1493
01:21:40,840 --> 01:21:43,160
Speaker 1: of gained that my senior year, and so I took

1494
01:21:43,240 --> 01:21:45,720
Speaker 1: those elements and how I got better and trying to like,

1495
01:21:46,360 --> 01:21:49,880
Speaker 1: you know, there's I love Nick Nurse recommending this. Nick

1496
01:21:51,439 --> 01:21:54,320
Speaker 1: Wait wait, say hold on, you had co head coaches?

1497
01:21:54,360 --> 01:21:57,920
Speaker 1: How does that work? Who the guy Ryan Madre and

1498
01:21:58,040 --> 01:22:01,160
Speaker 1: calling Ryan Modred's at Santa clar are a great person.

1499
01:22:01,800 --> 01:22:05,000
Speaker 1: And Colin Foff, who I don't know where he's at,

1500
01:22:05,360 --> 01:22:10,080
Speaker 1: but but either or yeah, so that Doug again coaching

1501
01:22:10,240 --> 01:22:11,920
Speaker 1: was it like I'm living in the Bay. You know,

1502
01:22:12,160 --> 01:22:16,120
Speaker 1: it's freaking I love Souls of Mischief. I love like

1503
01:22:16,520 --> 01:22:19,320
Speaker 1: hip hop like Peanut Butter like I like independent hip hop,

1504
01:22:19,400 --> 01:22:21,920
Speaker 1: and like and charisma. One of my favorite rabbits were

1505
01:22:21,960 --> 01:22:23,680
Speaker 1: sat It was like, like I I didn't quite know

1506
01:22:23,760 --> 01:22:25,840
Speaker 1: what I wanted to do, Doug, Honestly, I was really

1507
01:22:27,600 --> 01:22:30,719
Speaker 1: but San Jose was a great area, and I also

1508
01:22:30,800 --> 01:22:33,200
Speaker 1: had some friends. I had a good friend from Santa

1509
01:22:33,560 --> 01:22:36,360
Speaker 1: from Tennessee Tech that lives in Santa Cruz. As you know,

1510
01:22:36,560 --> 01:22:40,519
Speaker 1: is right up to one on one UH to Santa Cruz,

1511
01:22:40,760 --> 01:22:44,439
Speaker 1: forty five minutes direction to San Francisco. You know, obviously

1512
01:22:44,479 --> 01:22:47,160
Speaker 1: a lot worse. Dry well, they're both pretty bad, but

1513
01:22:48,240 --> 01:22:50,519
Speaker 1: m beautiful areas. And I had those types of things

1514
01:22:50,640 --> 01:22:52,600
Speaker 1: kind of work it out. That's how it worked, and

1515
01:22:53,120 --> 01:22:55,200
Speaker 1: we we went through that year. But you know what

1516
01:22:55,360 --> 01:22:57,800
Speaker 1: I learned some things now looking back at again with

1517
01:22:57,920 --> 01:23:00,720
Speaker 1: the glass half forward, it's those guys taught me a

1518
01:23:00,840 --> 01:23:05,080
Speaker 1: lot about um, you know, watching the practice off the

1519
01:23:05,160 --> 01:23:09,719
Speaker 1: ball and really being about not being so personal about

1520
01:23:09,760 --> 01:23:12,320
Speaker 1: it but not quite learning quite yet. I think for

1521
01:23:12,439 --> 01:23:15,280
Speaker 1: many of our standpoints yet about giving ourselves up for

1522
01:23:16,400 --> 01:23:18,519
Speaker 1: you know, I don't know, but those guys, did I

1523
01:23:18,600 --> 01:23:21,960
Speaker 1: did learn something from that process. I volunteered completely and

1524
01:23:22,240 --> 01:23:27,439
Speaker 1: taught peuh through this rhythm and News program which kind

1525
01:23:27,520 --> 01:23:30,240
Speaker 1: of at the time, California just got rid of p

1526
01:23:30,520 --> 01:23:34,760
Speaker 1: and music, so they individual contractors would be hired out

1527
01:23:34,840 --> 01:23:38,679
Speaker 1: for public education programs there and I did this Rhythm

1528
01:23:38,720 --> 01:23:40,400
Speaker 1: and News which is a good program. And it was

1529
01:23:40,479 --> 01:23:42,479
Speaker 1: kind of set up, Doug, as you well know most

1530
01:23:42,520 --> 01:23:46,160
Speaker 1: of those jobs and Cali Juco will be and it

1531
01:23:46,320 --> 01:23:48,600
Speaker 1: was a good set up, you know. Danny Oceanmata was

1532
01:23:48,640 --> 01:23:51,879
Speaker 1: there right before calling that was the year the year previous,

1533
01:23:52,760 --> 01:23:57,680
Speaker 1: and um, they they they were a good program where

1534
01:23:57,720 --> 01:23:59,640
Speaker 1: you know, we we kind of just went in with

1535
01:23:59,800 --> 01:24:02,719
Speaker 1: just guns blazing and we we fought hard. We almost

1536
01:24:02,720 --> 01:24:05,040
Speaker 1: beat San Francisco City. I remember. That's all I really

1537
01:24:05,120 --> 01:24:07,160
Speaker 1: remember about that. But I remember we kind of just

1538
01:24:08,479 --> 01:24:11,320
Speaker 1: made it tick somehow and got through like fifteen and

1539
01:24:11,400 --> 01:24:14,360
Speaker 1: sixteen years. But I kind of figured out I enjoyed

1540
01:24:14,439 --> 01:24:18,080
Speaker 1: getting players better and I enjoyed and then I think, Doug,

1541
01:24:18,160 --> 01:24:20,400
Speaker 1: I think we both can agree, like as you as

1542
01:24:20,439 --> 01:24:22,720
Speaker 1: a great analyst and how you connected with winning the

1543
01:24:22,760 --> 01:24:24,800
Speaker 1: Maccaby Games as a coach, and see where that goes,

1544
01:24:24,920 --> 01:24:28,280
Speaker 1: like you know, you're connected to your team. It's a

1545
01:24:28,360 --> 01:24:30,840
Speaker 1: way of still still staying in that like that, and

1546
01:24:31,000 --> 01:24:34,200
Speaker 1: it's kind of, uh, you get that back again. And

1547
01:24:34,520 --> 01:24:36,640
Speaker 1: I got that back and I realized that this is

1548
01:24:36,720 --> 01:24:40,280
Speaker 1: something who knows. I mean, I obviously I made a

1549
01:24:40,360 --> 01:24:42,920
Speaker 1: lot of mistakes that year. I'm certain those guys. I

1550
01:24:42,960 --> 01:24:44,960
Speaker 1: mean I volunteered. So I mean either way, it was

1551
01:24:45,920 --> 01:24:48,720
Speaker 1: but but it was. It was a good experience. And

1552
01:24:48,960 --> 01:24:51,160
Speaker 1: and you know, as we as we look back on

1553
01:24:51,360 --> 01:24:55,200
Speaker 1: things and okay, so you're driving aware that you have

1554
01:24:55,320 --> 01:24:59,360
Speaker 1: his head on collision. Um so driving home from Kirkwood

1555
01:24:59,439 --> 01:25:02,439
Speaker 1: Cedar rap It's we lived in a town called Solan,

1556
01:25:02,479 --> 01:25:06,200
Speaker 1: which is a really nice town. Um that was about

1557
01:25:06,240 --> 01:25:09,439
Speaker 1: fifty minutes away. That it's more that element of a

1558
01:25:09,520 --> 01:25:14,400
Speaker 1: suburban town between Iowa City and um Sol and Chris

1559
01:25:14,520 --> 01:25:18,240
Speaker 1: Smart Street is around that area right over there too.

1560
01:25:18,400 --> 01:25:21,920
Speaker 1: Just a really nice I was it is a cool

1561
01:25:22,439 --> 01:25:25,960
Speaker 1: it's kind of a that's a whole other podcast. And

1562
01:25:26,120 --> 01:25:29,280
Speaker 1: I just tell me, what about the accident? So well,

1563
01:25:29,360 --> 01:25:32,200
Speaker 1: I mean, so I'm tired. You know, I'm driving my car.

1564
01:25:32,320 --> 01:25:35,880
Speaker 1: I get in and I, uh, what kind of car? Okay,

1565
01:25:36,400 --> 01:25:42,280
Speaker 1: what my description? Yeah, two thousand and five Lexus SUV

1566
01:25:42,520 --> 01:25:47,280
Speaker 1: at the time, and I would okay, get a little

1567
01:25:47,479 --> 01:25:50,559
Speaker 1: get a little extra safe car. What time of night

1568
01:25:51,760 --> 01:26:01,120
Speaker 1: we're talking five thirty, we're talking uh, October seventeen, five night, okay,

1569
01:26:01,280 --> 01:26:04,240
Speaker 1: and you're tired and you're on a two lane road,

1570
01:26:04,280 --> 01:26:07,920
Speaker 1: a four lane huh? Two lane back sol because that

1571
01:26:08,160 --> 01:26:11,120
Speaker 1: you know that we did back in through the cut

1572
01:26:11,280 --> 01:26:12,840
Speaker 1: to get back to I was a city and so on.

1573
01:26:13,000 --> 01:26:14,960
Speaker 1: So nobody knows what you're talking about. What the cut,

1574
01:26:15,080 --> 01:26:17,960
Speaker 1: but I got it to lane road? You did? You

1575
01:26:18,120 --> 01:26:20,360
Speaker 1: her over into their lane, they come into your your lane.

1576
01:26:20,720 --> 01:26:26,440
Speaker 1: You know that was never and a And I appreciate

1577
01:26:26,560 --> 01:26:30,000
Speaker 1: your detailed questions because it's this is therapeutic for me,

1578
01:26:30,080 --> 01:26:32,360
Speaker 1: and I thank you for that. Sorry, this is a

1579
01:26:32,400 --> 01:26:34,360
Speaker 1: bad thing, like you're gonna have nightmares a night. No,

1580
01:26:34,880 --> 01:26:37,559
Speaker 1: trust me, I am way more than overcoming to this, Doug.

1581
01:26:37,640 --> 01:26:39,800
Speaker 1: I weigh two and twenty pounds right now, and I

1582
01:26:39,880 --> 01:26:46,000
Speaker 1: feel healthy and I'm seriously bro Okay, So so you

1583
01:26:46,040 --> 01:26:49,759
Speaker 1: don't know what happened. No, so there was no ticket.

1584
01:26:50,320 --> 01:26:52,240
Speaker 1: There was a ticket, But what I know I was

1585
01:26:52,320 --> 01:26:55,160
Speaker 1: not inebriated or anything like that. So, I mean you

1586
01:26:55,280 --> 01:26:59,120
Speaker 1: were talking after the wreck in fact, I believe I

1587
01:26:59,320 --> 01:27:02,000
Speaker 1: yelled at in a man for trying to say something

1588
01:27:03,080 --> 01:27:06,040
Speaker 1: I don't know. Whatever, it was a bad deal. Everyone

1589
01:27:06,120 --> 01:27:08,880
Speaker 1: from the other vehicle, we're completely okay. My car was

1590
01:27:08,960 --> 01:27:11,799
Speaker 1: completely tore apart. So if it gives you any indication

1591
01:27:11,880 --> 01:27:14,479
Speaker 1: to get more details, sorry if I'm being so passive

1592
01:27:14,479 --> 01:27:19,280
Speaker 1: aggressive with this because of everything. But it's been a

1593
01:27:19,360 --> 01:27:22,760
Speaker 1: while and it kind of compete. Everything compounded at once

1594
01:27:22,840 --> 01:27:25,280
Speaker 1: after winning a national pilot to this. So all of

1595
01:27:25,280 --> 01:27:27,559
Speaker 1: a sudden you're driving an ambulance and I don't even

1596
01:27:27,600 --> 01:27:29,519
Speaker 1: know how they got ahold of my wife. They did,

1597
01:27:29,680 --> 01:27:32,960
Speaker 1: and she was working as a waitress and they called

1598
01:27:33,000 --> 01:27:36,880
Speaker 1: her and she she thankfully answered and right it was

1599
01:27:36,960 --> 01:27:39,120
Speaker 1: before she got into work to meet me at the

1600
01:27:39,160 --> 01:27:42,680
Speaker 1: emergency room. But she didn't get there until you know,

1601
01:27:43,000 --> 01:27:45,599
Speaker 1: I don't to a m and then by that time

1602
01:27:45,720 --> 01:27:53,040
Speaker 1: that is when I got the Pineapple news. So you're

1603
01:27:53,080 --> 01:27:57,000
Speaker 1: getting ahead on it. They do what they did a

1604
01:27:57,120 --> 01:27:59,240
Speaker 1: catch and well I got to make to make sure

1605
01:27:59,560 --> 01:28:07,400
Speaker 1: I got and you're like, yeah, how okay, So they

1606
01:28:07,479 --> 01:28:11,400
Speaker 1: tell you tumor. Did they know immediately that it was cancerous?

1607
01:28:12,120 --> 01:28:15,840
Speaker 1: And did they know immediately it was inoperable? Like how

1608
01:28:16,040 --> 01:28:25,040
Speaker 1: what's the what happened? So they did um immediately not know. Um.

1609
01:28:26,280 --> 01:28:29,040
Speaker 1: It was really brought up to me by a dude

1610
01:28:29,120 --> 01:28:31,120
Speaker 1: that I was just like we were sitting over there

1611
01:28:31,160 --> 01:28:35,960
Speaker 1: and me and my wife like just talking about like, Doug,

1612
01:28:36,320 --> 01:28:39,080
Speaker 1: I guess the best way in a light way to

1613
01:28:39,120 --> 01:28:42,679
Speaker 1: say is exhaustion. And just like wife shocked me, shock,

1614
01:28:42,760 --> 01:28:48,639
Speaker 1: cars destroyed, thankful for my So how was this accident?

1615
01:28:48,960 --> 01:28:52,080
Speaker 1: How about was this accident? My car is completely told Austin,

1616
01:28:52,360 --> 01:28:56,720
Speaker 1: how about are you I'm okay? Now you're okay? And

1617
01:28:56,760 --> 01:28:59,200
Speaker 1: then you're like I'm okay. They're like, oh no, no, no,

1618
01:28:59,439 --> 01:29:02,240
Speaker 1: I'm not a k as far as because as far

1619
01:29:02,320 --> 01:29:04,960
Speaker 1: as the accident was, like the ringing in my ears, Doug,

1620
01:29:05,040 --> 01:29:08,200
Speaker 1: I mean when the accident happened, my call rolled seven

1621
01:29:08,400 --> 01:29:11,599
Speaker 1: like ten times, like the fact there there if you'll

1622
01:29:11,640 --> 01:29:13,920
Speaker 1: see the thing like they're shocking the and my my

1623
01:29:14,040 --> 01:29:16,160
Speaker 1: head could have got ripped off ish in a lot

1624
01:29:16,280 --> 01:29:18,120
Speaker 1: of different ways. I mean you'll be able to see

1625
01:29:18,160 --> 01:29:21,880
Speaker 1: that too. But uh but but so I survived that

1626
01:29:22,040 --> 01:29:24,920
Speaker 1: and that's thankful to God. And you know you're just

1627
01:29:25,240 --> 01:29:27,599
Speaker 1: you're kind of just nuts, like that's its own thing.

1628
01:29:28,160 --> 01:29:29,800
Speaker 1: And then a guy comes and it's like, oh, yeah,

1629
01:29:29,880 --> 01:29:34,519
Speaker 1: you have brain tumor. Hold on, you have broken bones. No,

1630
01:29:35,360 --> 01:29:40,960
Speaker 1: you're like perfectly back off, but nothing other than and bloody,

1631
01:29:41,160 --> 01:29:46,320
Speaker 1: bloody scard not you know, bloody Uh. I didn't get

1632
01:29:46,400 --> 01:29:50,240
Speaker 1: one stitch from it. Okay, So you had like cuts

1633
01:29:50,280 --> 01:29:53,880
Speaker 1: and scrapes and you're back screwed up. Yes, and you're

1634
01:29:53,960 --> 01:29:55,960
Speaker 1: laying in the hospital and then who told you you

1635
01:29:56,040 --> 01:30:01,880
Speaker 1: had a brain tumor? They doctor? What what do you say? Said? Hey?

1636
01:30:02,040 --> 01:30:05,639
Speaker 1: He comes up and it's like, you know, sir, uh

1637
01:30:06,400 --> 01:30:10,000
Speaker 1: you know, to be frank, I might as well where

1638
01:30:10,040 --> 01:30:14,360
Speaker 1: we are things today? And I don't. He came up

1639
01:30:14,400 --> 01:30:16,800
Speaker 1: and he showed me and he said this, he said,

1640
01:30:16,840 --> 01:30:19,960
Speaker 1: in a business is approach possible, doug where I don't

1641
01:30:19,960 --> 01:30:24,120
Speaker 1: feel it's inappropriate at this time even addressing it. Just

1642
01:30:24,280 --> 01:30:26,360
Speaker 1: this is what you have. I'm thankful that they did,

1643
01:30:27,520 --> 01:30:31,360
Speaker 1: uh you know now to be addressing it. Um. So

1644
01:30:31,760 --> 01:30:36,120
Speaker 1: at the time, you you, I don't know, strange enough,

1645
01:30:36,240 --> 01:30:38,080
Speaker 1: like you're like so many things have gone on, you're

1646
01:30:38,080 --> 01:30:41,160
Speaker 1: getting the heart your your mind kind of you notice

1647
01:30:41,240 --> 01:30:44,719
Speaker 1: things the year prior, like you're almost kind of like whoa,

1648
01:30:45,200 --> 01:30:50,880
Speaker 1: that's kind of almost thankful said no, but not not,

1649
01:30:51,360 --> 01:30:54,400
Speaker 1: but like you're almost there's an explanation. Okay, now we

1650
01:30:54,479 --> 01:30:56,240
Speaker 1: can have a proven point of how we can maybe

1651
01:30:56,320 --> 01:31:02,320
Speaker 1: move forward. So there's something that's not you that's doing

1652
01:31:02,520 --> 01:31:04,679
Speaker 1: some of these things, or you know, something you created.

1653
01:31:04,720 --> 01:31:07,439
Speaker 1: I don't know. Tumors, sprain tumors, we don't know, so

1654
01:31:07,680 --> 01:31:11,440
Speaker 1: it's not a common the what what I was diagnosed

1655
01:31:11,520 --> 01:31:15,280
Speaker 1: with the level to ask side toma? They at least

1656
01:31:15,640 --> 01:31:17,680
Speaker 1: that first with the size of it, they thought it

1657
01:31:17,760 --> 01:31:22,240
Speaker 1: was a level four LEO when me and my wife said, uh,

1658
01:31:22,640 --> 01:31:25,439
Speaker 1: we want to know. You sure you want to know

1659
01:31:25,880 --> 01:31:30,400
Speaker 1: because this sometimes we don't but just estimation, you just

1660
01:31:30,560 --> 01:31:33,320
Speaker 1: have to like we couldn't go and that was I think,

1661
01:31:33,360 --> 01:31:35,479
Speaker 1: you know, I think that's the way a good doctor

1662
01:31:35,560 --> 01:31:39,960
Speaker 1: should and uh wait so so they potentially not never

1663
01:31:40,080 --> 01:31:44,240
Speaker 1: saying it was, but let me take me through this. Okay.

1664
01:31:44,400 --> 01:31:48,760
Speaker 1: So you're getting a head on car accident, you're laying

1665
01:31:48,760 --> 01:31:52,600
Speaker 1: their recovery. The doctor just brings you the film and

1666
01:31:52,840 --> 01:31:57,040
Speaker 1: shows you the size of this tumor, right, and then

1667
01:31:57,720 --> 01:32:00,960
Speaker 1: you immediately have tests and that's when you found out

1668
01:32:01,160 --> 01:32:04,519
Speaker 1: what kind of tumor was. Yeah, so you wake up.

1669
01:32:05,120 --> 01:32:08,080
Speaker 1: Now they take you to award on like this eighth

1670
01:32:08,200 --> 01:32:12,360
Speaker 1: level where it's neurosurgery, and God bless their little souls.

1671
01:32:12,439 --> 01:32:15,320
Speaker 1: You see the Uh just go by the little kids

1672
01:32:15,360 --> 01:32:19,160
Speaker 1: and God bless them man. And you're kind of saying

1673
01:32:19,240 --> 01:32:22,640
Speaker 1: yourself thankful for being here anyways, you know, kind of

1674
01:32:23,280 --> 01:32:27,360
Speaker 1: enlightening for anybody. Uh. They want to know that the

1675
01:32:27,520 --> 01:32:31,840
Speaker 1: kids that are out there battling it, but you get

1676
01:32:31,920 --> 01:32:34,240
Speaker 1: there too. They just put you there, and you know

1677
01:32:34,320 --> 01:32:40,439
Speaker 1: they were good Iowa University, Uh, how's it? Good resources nursing.

1678
01:32:40,720 --> 01:32:43,960
Speaker 1: I remember a nursing team that was just tremendous and

1679
01:32:44,720 --> 01:32:47,920
Speaker 1: you know, they easy through it and they talked to you.

1680
01:32:48,000 --> 01:32:49,920
Speaker 1: And a team comes around and wakes you up at

1681
01:32:49,960 --> 01:32:53,799
Speaker 1: six am. You know that's you know, it's a hospital.

1682
01:32:53,880 --> 01:32:58,880
Speaker 1: Research every Yeah, but it's a research hospital. It's commonplace.

1683
01:32:59,080 --> 01:33:00,960
Speaker 1: You know. This is you see abio. This is the

1684
01:33:01,040 --> 01:33:03,800
Speaker 1: one that's right now next to the football seam, right

1685
01:33:04,040 --> 01:33:06,600
Speaker 1: where they wave with the kids. Yeah. Yeah, okay, So

1686
01:33:06,720 --> 01:33:09,960
Speaker 1: you're up there on the sixth floor. Yes, say thing,

1687
01:33:10,200 --> 01:33:13,080
Speaker 1: you know I don't want to. Yeah, you're you're up

1688
01:33:13,120 --> 01:33:18,759
Speaker 1: there surgery and in neuro Okay. And so they didn't

1689
01:33:18,920 --> 01:33:20,720
Speaker 1: what what happened. First they told you what kind of

1690
01:33:20,800 --> 01:33:23,200
Speaker 1: tour was. First, they told you it was inoperable. First,

1691
01:33:23,800 --> 01:33:26,840
Speaker 1: so those when you wake up at six, they did

1692
01:33:26,960 --> 01:33:32,120
Speaker 1: a they're able to get at that point, Um no,

1693
01:33:32,439 --> 01:33:35,560
Speaker 1: not a biopsy they had I had brain surgery. But

1694
01:33:35,920 --> 01:33:41,960
Speaker 1: at that point it is a estimation. And with all

1695
01:33:42,080 --> 01:33:44,720
Speaker 1: these doctors that come in and all these and these

1696
01:33:44,760 --> 01:33:48,200
Speaker 1: are the best. I mean, these people are smart, but

1697
01:33:48,439 --> 01:33:53,040
Speaker 1: you know, obviously it's intense. It's but they're they're talking

1698
01:33:53,240 --> 01:33:56,080
Speaker 1: and you're kind of just taking it all in. And

1699
01:33:56,280 --> 01:33:59,920
Speaker 1: then they say, you know, we don't know. But then

1700
01:34:00,000 --> 01:34:01,680
Speaker 1: they'll be honest with you if you ask them. And

1701
01:34:01,880 --> 01:34:04,400
Speaker 1: and they start a word. They said glioblast on the

1702
01:34:04,479 --> 01:34:07,680
Speaker 1: three or four, and that's what it was. And so

1703
01:34:07,840 --> 01:34:09,600
Speaker 1: we had to live like that for a couple of

1704
01:34:09,680 --> 01:34:12,560
Speaker 1: days until we were getting the scheduled brain surgery to

1705
01:34:12,680 --> 01:34:15,960
Speaker 1: get to see what it would do. If it's inoperable,

1706
01:34:16,720 --> 01:34:19,800
Speaker 1: you just open it up. Your your chances are like

1707
01:34:19,920 --> 01:34:22,439
Speaker 1: I I basically you kind of go into stat you know,

1708
01:34:22,600 --> 01:34:25,479
Speaker 1: you break it down and then bringing your own life

1709
01:34:25,520 --> 01:34:29,120
Speaker 1: analytics and you're my wife, who I have you know,

1710
01:34:29,520 --> 01:34:33,840
Speaker 1: just who lost your father to cancer and her mother. Uh,

1711
01:34:34,640 --> 01:34:38,960
Speaker 1: was pretty amazing. With making things pretty real and and

1712
01:34:39,000 --> 01:34:41,280
Speaker 1: then a tough time because my dad was also dying

1713
01:34:41,360 --> 01:34:47,920
Speaker 1: at the same time. So it kind of just a

1714
01:34:48,000 --> 01:34:51,120
Speaker 1: lot of ship going on right there. Your your your

1715
01:34:51,160 --> 01:34:53,880
Speaker 1: wife had lost your parents, your dad's sick with what

1716
01:34:55,080 --> 01:35:00,479
Speaker 1: my dad my dad at the times, kidneys, the eassis

1717
01:35:00,720 --> 01:35:07,599
Speaker 1: was you know pretty much. And you know it's a Doug.

1718
01:35:08,760 --> 01:35:13,200
Speaker 1: It was a real for him. It was because he

1719
01:35:13,360 --> 01:35:19,720
Speaker 1: was diagnosed with the cancer multiple times. Um and you know,

1720
01:35:19,840 --> 01:35:23,920
Speaker 1: prostate cancer is something that um we'll say is what

1721
01:35:24,160 --> 01:35:30,720
Speaker 1: ended it because it really is and unhealthy eating and

1722
01:35:30,800 --> 01:35:33,120
Speaker 1: you know that kind of vibe like just not I

1723
01:35:33,200 --> 01:35:35,160
Speaker 1: don't know, but like, you know, he was just tremendous

1724
01:35:35,240 --> 01:35:37,680
Speaker 1: human being either way. But you know that's just kind

1725
01:35:37,680 --> 01:35:40,040
Speaker 1: of where it was where it was and and uh

1726
01:35:40,720 --> 01:35:45,559
Speaker 1: so so it's okay, so you're you you find out

1727
01:35:45,840 --> 01:35:49,080
Speaker 1: what's the kind of cancer it is. So so they're

1728
01:35:49,120 --> 01:35:50,960
Speaker 1: saying it's glio blast on the three or four. But

1729
01:35:51,040 --> 01:35:53,320
Speaker 1: we're gonna operate and see what we can do. You

1730
01:35:54,520 --> 01:35:56,800
Speaker 1: do your best talks going in. You do, Doug. You're

1731
01:35:56,800 --> 01:35:59,600
Speaker 1: sitting in the brain surgery line. I'll say this to you.

1732
01:35:59,800 --> 01:36:01,400
Speaker 1: The best part about it is like you're well, the

1733
01:36:01,479 --> 01:36:04,160
Speaker 1: best it is you sit there with your wife and

1734
01:36:04,200 --> 01:36:06,560
Speaker 1: it's just you and her in a room in the

1735
01:36:06,800 --> 01:36:09,280
Speaker 1: waiting room before you go in for brain surgery, and

1736
01:36:09,360 --> 01:36:13,080
Speaker 1: you're like, any, I've done pretty much. I mean, you

1737
01:36:13,640 --> 01:36:17,480
Speaker 1: ask a lot of friends of mine. I've had some experiences.

1738
01:36:17,560 --> 01:36:21,639
Speaker 1: But it's like, okay, you know, you can't really give

1739
01:36:21,760 --> 01:36:28,559
Speaker 1: odds on life with loss of life necessarily a little

1740
01:36:28,960 --> 01:36:32,479
Speaker 1: more a little less percentage wise with this start with

1741
01:36:32,600 --> 01:36:36,320
Speaker 1: brain surgery. It's still incredibly not where you want. Cancer

1742
01:36:36,479 --> 01:36:40,240
Speaker 1: they'll say number one. But either way, I had a

1743
01:36:40,320 --> 01:36:50,800
Speaker 1: good surgeon and you know they of living at the time. Yeah, um, well,

1744
01:36:51,200 --> 01:36:55,680
Speaker 1: so first the surgery came back and thankfully after the biopsy,

1745
01:36:55,800 --> 01:36:58,800
Speaker 1: well the good there was good news bad news, which

1746
01:36:58,840 --> 01:37:02,599
Speaker 1: you're just like, and this is after the brain through

1747
01:37:02,760 --> 01:37:06,120
Speaker 1: something back in the room now you know, and it's

1748
01:37:06,200 --> 01:37:08,680
Speaker 1: like finally with here we have your results and it's

1749
01:37:08,760 --> 01:37:11,240
Speaker 1: just like, you know, good news, bad news first and

1750
01:37:11,720 --> 01:37:14,760
Speaker 1: I don't even remember, honestly, this is a random question.

1751
01:37:14,920 --> 01:37:19,479
Speaker 1: Just yeah, you understand, nerve surgery is it's own thing.

1752
01:37:19,560 --> 01:37:22,880
Speaker 1: I'm okay with that at that time, understand. So so

1753
01:37:23,080 --> 01:37:25,920
Speaker 1: like when you get an m R. I you don't

1754
01:37:25,960 --> 01:37:29,800
Speaker 1: necessarily get the results that day, right when you have

1755
01:37:29,920 --> 01:37:33,719
Speaker 1: brain surgery? How long between when you have brain surgery,

1756
01:37:33,840 --> 01:37:37,160
Speaker 1: have the surgery itself, and you come to and you're

1757
01:37:37,200 --> 01:37:40,160
Speaker 1: in that room and they discussed what they found from

1758
01:37:40,200 --> 01:37:46,559
Speaker 1: this tumor. It was a day. It was a day.

1759
01:37:48,160 --> 01:37:51,639
Speaker 1: So but do you wake up that after the brain surgery,

1760
01:37:51,760 --> 01:37:56,000
Speaker 1: like you wake up thankful to be alive, Doug, Right,

1761
01:37:56,040 --> 01:37:57,960
Speaker 1: So you wake up they but you don't know, you're

1762
01:37:57,960 --> 01:38:01,519
Speaker 1: just sitting there for a day, don't know, thankful to

1763
01:38:01,560 --> 01:38:05,240
Speaker 1: be alive. I was watching West Side Story over and over.

1764
01:38:05,800 --> 01:38:09,920
Speaker 1: I don't know why, connecting with your Jewish side. Yeah,

1765
01:38:09,960 --> 01:38:12,599
Speaker 1: I guess I love West Side Story. It was terrific.

1766
01:38:12,680 --> 01:38:16,120
Speaker 1: But I'm sure well I was thinking. I was thinking

1767
01:38:16,120 --> 01:38:19,000
Speaker 1: Fiddler Fiddlers Jewish Ship, you know, you know what as

1768
01:38:19,040 --> 01:38:21,759
Speaker 1: you would well know, he probably to like my movie background,

1769
01:38:21,800 --> 01:38:24,280
Speaker 1: you wouldn't consider me the West Side. But it was

1770
01:38:24,360 --> 01:38:26,040
Speaker 1: like kind of where that was. I mean, it was

1771
01:38:26,120 --> 01:38:29,759
Speaker 1: the hospital's vibe of what was going on them. Okay,

1772
01:38:29,800 --> 01:38:34,040
Speaker 1: so they come in they say good news and bad news. Yeah,

1773
01:38:34,920 --> 01:38:38,320
Speaker 1: what's the good news? We couldn't remove it because it's

1774
01:38:38,360 --> 01:38:41,840
Speaker 1: in too tough of an area where's the news bad news?

1775
01:38:42,040 --> 01:38:47,560
Speaker 1: I wanted it first? Sorry I should? I mean, what

1776
01:38:47,720 --> 01:38:53,080
Speaker 1: would do? What's that? I wonder? I think news moving

1777
01:38:53,200 --> 01:38:55,840
Speaker 1: good news is moving forward, Doug? You know? Okay, So

1778
01:38:56,280 --> 01:38:58,439
Speaker 1: so so you said I want the bad news first,

1779
01:38:58,560 --> 01:39:00,880
Speaker 1: and the bad news is we could we can't get

1780
01:39:01,240 --> 01:39:04,040
Speaker 1: can't get it, so right there, hold on right Then

1781
01:39:04,080 --> 01:39:06,400
Speaker 1: they said you have a tumor in your brain and

1782
01:39:06,520 --> 01:39:09,799
Speaker 1: we can't get so you had to be like, okay,

1783
01:39:09,880 --> 01:39:12,680
Speaker 1: so how is there possibly good news? What was the

1784
01:39:12,720 --> 01:39:19,880
Speaker 1: good news? But it's a level to astrocyte toma, and

1785
01:39:20,360 --> 01:39:25,040
Speaker 1: a level to astrocyte homa is a brain tumor that

1786
01:39:25,240 --> 01:39:30,720
Speaker 1: we don't have any information on. That's really it, other

1787
01:39:30,840 --> 01:39:37,240
Speaker 1: than it can mostly lead to a glioblast toma to

1788
01:39:37,479 --> 01:39:41,080
Speaker 1: SEV within a time period of tend Well, you know

1789
01:39:41,280 --> 01:39:44,960
Speaker 1: that there's odds with this with mine that I'm in

1790
01:39:45,040 --> 01:39:55,360
Speaker 1: a median What five years was people, I'm I'm I'm

1791
01:39:55,400 --> 01:39:57,679
Speaker 1: wondering for the ships to be here. I turned forty

1792
01:39:57,760 --> 01:40:02,160
Speaker 1: on March four, so five pretty amazing? Okay, still okay,

1793
01:40:02,200 --> 01:40:06,200
Speaker 1: so they tell you, okay, look, the bad news is

1794
01:40:06,320 --> 01:40:08,200
Speaker 1: we can't get it out. The good news is we

1795
01:40:08,280 --> 01:40:13,639
Speaker 1: all really shit about it, but yourge homeboys, and good

1796
01:40:13,680 --> 01:40:16,400
Speaker 1: connections with that like free like I got to like milk,

1797
01:40:16,479 --> 01:40:18,840
Speaker 1: like the Freeman's a duke, or like the top of

1798
01:40:18,920 --> 01:40:22,360
Speaker 1: brain surgery to try to get his second opinion, with

1799
01:40:22,520 --> 01:40:25,639
Speaker 1: good friends of mine, and unbelievable support within the community

1800
01:40:25,680 --> 01:40:30,280
Speaker 1: of my college and the you know jug the amazing

1801
01:40:30,439 --> 01:40:34,040
Speaker 1: support we got. I think I still is why I'm

1802
01:40:34,479 --> 01:40:36,880
Speaker 1: here today, is because that's there's a fuel with you know,

1803
01:40:37,080 --> 01:40:40,240
Speaker 1: the good nature of human beings and just how that

1804
01:40:40,439 --> 01:40:41,800
Speaker 1: was a hard time and there was a lot of

1805
01:40:41,840 --> 01:40:47,120
Speaker 1: people that were able to help, including the area college friends, coaches.

1806
01:40:47,360 --> 01:40:50,000
Speaker 1: I mean seriously the time, and that's difficult on both sides.

1807
01:40:50,040 --> 01:40:53,480
Speaker 1: And that's something that's I think empathy. I can empathize

1808
01:40:53,560 --> 01:40:56,000
Speaker 1: with now at this point, it's like, heck, you know,

1809
01:40:56,040 --> 01:40:57,639
Speaker 1: if I was on the other side, would be kind

1810
01:40:57,640 --> 01:41:01,720
Speaker 1: of trippy you to have a friend like that, you know. So, um,

1811
01:41:02,160 --> 01:41:06,720
Speaker 1: I am not ungrateful for anybody. If anyone feels no,

1812
01:41:06,800 --> 01:41:08,960
Speaker 1: I don't think any anybody you definitely don't come across

1813
01:41:09,000 --> 01:41:16,439
Speaker 1: sound great, okay, so so now what so so then

1814
01:41:16,520 --> 01:41:18,519
Speaker 1: you're just like you got your wife, it was just

1815
01:41:19,640 --> 01:41:21,960
Speaker 1: you know, she's just been through her battles man, and

1816
01:41:22,439 --> 01:41:24,760
Speaker 1: she's just like, we got this and and you know

1817
01:41:24,840 --> 01:41:28,320
Speaker 1: we're gonna And I turned to her, Actually, Doug, I said,

1818
01:41:28,360 --> 01:41:30,840
Speaker 1: we're gonna beat this. I said, I said that right away.

1819
01:41:31,920 --> 01:41:36,320
Speaker 1: I when I heard that, I said, dying, that's pretty

1820
01:41:36,320 --> 01:41:39,360
Speaker 1: good news. Y'all don't know much about it. And then

1821
01:41:39,760 --> 01:41:42,080
Speaker 1: you know, but then that was down further online obviously

1822
01:41:42,439 --> 01:41:45,560
Speaker 1: using some people who I couldn't use my insurance that

1823
01:41:45,640 --> 01:41:48,720
Speaker 1: I had a Kirkwood to use the Freedman's. So that

1824
01:41:48,960 --> 01:41:52,519
Speaker 1: was the issue of getting a second opinion with those guys.

1825
01:41:52,600 --> 01:41:56,120
Speaker 1: But anyways, Uh, those guys were great. They can they

1826
01:41:56,200 --> 01:41:59,400
Speaker 1: consulted with me either way, which I am more than

1827
01:41:59,479 --> 01:42:04,240
Speaker 1: thankful war and we're hilarious guys, but I mean the

1828
01:42:04,400 --> 01:42:07,320
Speaker 1: top of their craft of neurosurgery. And actually we're saying this,

1829
01:42:07,479 --> 01:42:10,040
Speaker 1: but I mean, you have these conversations these people and

1830
01:42:10,080 --> 01:42:13,160
Speaker 1: they're like, okay, we can touch it out. I don't know,

1831
01:42:13,320 --> 01:42:16,240
Speaker 1: like I don't know, maybe something like that. You know,

1832
01:42:16,360 --> 01:42:18,760
Speaker 1: that time period was nuts because at the same time

1833
01:42:19,360 --> 01:42:23,360
Speaker 1: you're now given what are your treatment options? Doug, So

1834
01:42:24,360 --> 01:42:27,519
Speaker 1: that was like you should do this PCV, which is

1835
01:42:27,720 --> 01:42:34,200
Speaker 1: uh for people to know it's chemotherapy and uh and

1836
01:42:34,520 --> 01:42:40,080
Speaker 1: uh radiation brain radiation. And if my wife had lost

1837
01:42:40,160 --> 01:42:42,240
Speaker 1: both her parents to cast her my dad's dying. And

1838
01:42:42,840 --> 01:42:46,560
Speaker 1: she's like, she wasn't She said, you, you know, it

1839
01:42:46,560 --> 01:42:49,439
Speaker 1: would be best that we we I think we should

1840
01:42:49,479 --> 01:42:52,559
Speaker 1: just do the radiation and and uh, we're gonna wait

1841
01:42:52,640 --> 01:42:55,519
Speaker 1: and see on this. It worked that way, and kind

1842
01:42:55,560 --> 01:42:58,200
Speaker 1: of a lot of research she did, which I think,

1843
01:42:58,240 --> 01:43:01,880
Speaker 1: I'm thankful to have that. And with all her losing,

1844
01:43:02,000 --> 01:43:03,960
Speaker 1: you know, she just lost her fire. She did a

1845
01:43:04,000 --> 01:43:07,519
Speaker 1: ton of research and and and she didn't. She stood up.

1846
01:43:07,600 --> 01:43:10,639
Speaker 1: It was like, you know, and and I honestly, maybe

1847
01:43:10,720 --> 01:43:12,840
Speaker 1: it's good, maybe it isn't. That to each his own.

1848
01:43:12,960 --> 01:43:15,320
Speaker 1: This is never an exact science, because I'm not saying

1849
01:43:15,320 --> 01:43:17,720
Speaker 1: that my thing works or doesn't. But I also I

1850
01:43:17,800 --> 01:43:20,639
Speaker 1: think health and how you carry yourself and eat those

1851
01:43:20,720 --> 01:43:24,640
Speaker 1: things matter, and um I I started focusing more on

1852
01:43:24,720 --> 01:43:29,920
Speaker 1: those things eventually. But anyways, we decided, I doug. She's said,

1853
01:43:30,479 --> 01:43:34,360
Speaker 1: my wife, God bless her soul, and I'm sure your

1854
01:43:34,360 --> 01:43:37,240
Speaker 1: wife does. She she said, you're going back to work

1855
01:43:37,400 --> 01:43:40,360
Speaker 1: two weeks. And that is the best thing that could

1856
01:43:40,360 --> 01:43:42,680
Speaker 1: have said, to be honestly, in a way of like

1857
01:43:43,640 --> 01:43:45,880
Speaker 1: me looking at it, getting back around the team, and

1858
01:43:45,960 --> 01:43:49,560
Speaker 1: those guys saved my life, like as much as I

1859
01:43:49,680 --> 01:43:55,040
Speaker 1: probably wasn't in Yeah, I went back to coaching two

1860
01:43:55,040 --> 01:43:59,280
Speaker 1: weeks later. Right, So so you go back and and

1861
01:43:59,360 --> 01:44:02,960
Speaker 1: here's so what did they tell you? You said they

1862
01:44:02,960 --> 01:44:05,680
Speaker 1: didn't know much about it? So yeah, so that's kind

1863
01:44:05,720 --> 01:44:09,360
Speaker 1: of where it's that and that and and then we

1864
01:44:09,520 --> 01:44:12,840
Speaker 1: decide on radiation and then basically that's the form of

1865
01:44:12,920 --> 01:44:16,200
Speaker 1: treatment for it. DOUG is like radiation and we'll see

1866
01:44:16,520 --> 01:44:21,000
Speaker 1: and then maybe if it grows bigger, more radiation or chemo.

1867
01:44:21,200 --> 01:44:23,479
Speaker 1: But the problem with chemo, DOUG is if you use

1868
01:44:23,560 --> 01:44:26,240
Speaker 1: it too early. It's like using your key too early

1869
01:44:26,320 --> 01:44:29,439
Speaker 1: for chemo, Like it's you you you want to save it,

1870
01:44:29,880 --> 01:44:32,640
Speaker 1: you know, from what we've what my wife did the

1871
01:44:32,680 --> 01:44:37,400
Speaker 1: research on. So I thankfully that's what we did. And

1872
01:44:37,479 --> 01:44:40,600
Speaker 1: I just did the Gamma knife, which is a I

1873
01:44:40,640 --> 01:44:42,200
Speaker 1: know what the gama if. Actually my dad had the

1874
01:44:42,200 --> 01:44:44,760
Speaker 1: gamina So the gama knife is like a little it's

1875
01:44:44,800 --> 01:44:48,000
Speaker 1: like a laser. Right. Well, I had like a night's mask,

1876
01:44:48,160 --> 01:44:51,240
Speaker 1: like I was like on my face and then they

1877
01:44:51,360 --> 01:44:56,160
Speaker 1: take this big old freaking you know deal and they

1878
01:44:56,240 --> 01:44:58,920
Speaker 1: just shoot you. But the ladies are the sweetest people

1879
01:44:58,960 --> 01:45:03,000
Speaker 1: you would. I mean, those people, they're there for a

1880
01:45:03,080 --> 01:45:07,040
Speaker 1: reason and it's incredible, you know. Okay, so when did

1881
01:45:07,160 --> 01:45:12,360
Speaker 1: you when did you know you were gonna make it? Like,

1882
01:45:12,400 --> 01:45:14,760
Speaker 1: when did you know you were gonna be Well, you know, Doug,

1883
01:45:14,840 --> 01:45:20,320
Speaker 1: you never do. So that's the thing about it. But

1884
01:45:21,760 --> 01:45:23,160
Speaker 1: like you're going for a check out and they're like,

1885
01:45:23,200 --> 01:45:25,479
Speaker 1: well a trunk and then yeah, you know so well

1886
01:45:25,680 --> 01:45:29,639
Speaker 1: current current status is right now, it's it is stable

1887
01:45:30,400 --> 01:45:33,120
Speaker 1: and the last check I lived now live in Oklahoma.

1888
01:45:33,200 --> 01:45:37,800
Speaker 1: Well this is fast forward four years later. But um,

1889
01:45:38,320 --> 01:45:42,200
Speaker 1: you know, I'll digress real quick first, but you know,

1890
01:45:42,280 --> 01:45:45,040
Speaker 1: all that stuff happens, and it was just the team

1891
01:45:45,120 --> 01:45:47,960
Speaker 1: and the radiation treatment get through that family. But my

1892
01:45:48,120 --> 01:45:54,800
Speaker 1: dad dies that following July fourth, and you know, I'll

1893
01:45:54,840 --> 01:45:57,640
Speaker 1: be as freak as you was. As the worst and

1894
01:45:57,800 --> 01:46:00,160
Speaker 1: best thing that a relatives told me, I'm not say

1895
01:46:00,200 --> 01:46:02,920
Speaker 1: it was like the hardest thing I had here is

1896
01:46:03,000 --> 01:46:04,880
Speaker 1: like these are the best thing I tell you to

1897
01:46:05,320 --> 01:46:09,000
Speaker 1: uh play the hands at your debt And just like

1898
01:46:09,240 --> 01:46:14,439
Speaker 1: at the time, delt like who's done? Like this is insane?

1899
01:46:14,520 --> 01:46:16,600
Speaker 1: Like how am I supposed to raise my family? Like

1900
01:46:17,280 --> 01:46:21,280
Speaker 1: my dad and my family's falling apart. It's crazy. Um,

1901
01:46:22,439 --> 01:46:26,639
Speaker 1: And then you just do then you figure it out

1902
01:46:26,720 --> 01:46:29,720
Speaker 1: like that past of all those good things and friendships

1903
01:46:29,760 --> 01:46:35,160
Speaker 1: and teammates and overcoming of everything. I just like in

1904
01:46:35,280 --> 01:46:38,439
Speaker 1: my family and my I Doug, you you're a warrior

1905
01:46:38,520 --> 01:46:42,240
Speaker 1: spirit or you know, everyone is their own in this thing.

1906
01:46:42,320 --> 01:46:44,880
Speaker 1: It's tough. There's no exact science to it. God bless

1907
01:46:44,920 --> 01:46:48,920
Speaker 1: anybody who hasn't because it's tough. Man. It's no there's

1908
01:46:48,960 --> 01:46:52,280
Speaker 1: there's no ifens or buts about it. Um. But where

1909
01:46:52,360 --> 01:46:55,719
Speaker 1: I am with it now, Doug, is I am content

1910
01:46:55,960 --> 01:46:58,840
Speaker 1: and I am in a situation where I am a

1911
01:46:58,920 --> 01:47:02,439
Speaker 1: healthy individual. Um. You know, I feel good of where

1912
01:47:02,439 --> 01:47:04,360
Speaker 1: I'm at in life. I feel like I'm gonna be

1913
01:47:04,439 --> 01:47:06,920
Speaker 1: living a long life. That's how I look at things,

1914
01:47:07,080 --> 01:47:11,120
Speaker 1: and it's stable and other than that cognitive and after

1915
01:47:11,240 --> 01:47:14,000
Speaker 1: Jude and all that, I'm a hundred, I'm actually in

1916
01:47:14,000 --> 01:47:20,439
Speaker 1: a better place than that ever should be. Frankly, that's crazy. Yeah,

1917
01:47:20,840 --> 01:47:23,559
Speaker 1: And it was insane because it just happened right before

1918
01:47:23,640 --> 01:47:27,840
Speaker 1: COVID too, so you have all that going on, and

1919
01:47:27,920 --> 01:47:31,000
Speaker 1: then everyone that was just had to deal with the

1920
01:47:31,120 --> 01:47:33,519
Speaker 1: loss and the terrible nous of all this now and

1921
01:47:33,800 --> 01:47:37,080
Speaker 1: and but but you're prepared a little more in some

1922
01:47:37,280 --> 01:47:42,600
Speaker 1: aspects that and and then holy job, like like the

1923
01:47:42,720 --> 01:47:46,439
Speaker 1: world's coming to your freaking just kind of just find

1924
01:47:46,560 --> 01:47:49,760
Speaker 1: some some light in the suffering with your loved ones,

1925
01:47:49,840 --> 01:47:54,960
Speaker 1: and and you're fine. I don't know, it's it's everybody,

1926
01:47:55,040 --> 01:47:57,240
Speaker 1: every I mean, we all have our things. Like your dad,

1927
01:47:58,800 --> 01:48:02,479
Speaker 1: you know, was My dad was in his thirties when

1928
01:48:02,520 --> 01:48:04,920
Speaker 1: he when he when he died, you know, when he

1929
01:48:05,000 --> 01:48:07,439
Speaker 1: got he had to answer and you know, so it's

1930
01:48:07,520 --> 01:48:13,360
Speaker 1: it's it's definitely yeah. So okay, um, when you when

1931
01:48:13,400 --> 01:48:15,599
Speaker 1: you get radiation, do you lose your hair? I don't

1932
01:48:15,680 --> 01:48:21,680
Speaker 1: you know, Yeah, you have a I have like the

1933
01:48:21,800 --> 01:48:23,759
Speaker 1: whole thing is stables. I have a ton of pictures

1934
01:48:23,800 --> 01:48:26,600
Speaker 1: I could share with you. But it's just like all that,

1935
01:48:27,560 --> 01:48:32,120
Speaker 1: right and that would you would you want to talk

1936
01:48:32,160 --> 01:48:36,000
Speaker 1: about it and talk about I don't mind right now?

1937
01:48:36,600 --> 01:48:41,280
Speaker 1: At the time, oh no, I I I was very

1938
01:48:41,400 --> 01:48:45,040
Speaker 1: open about it, but I also wasn't very understanding of

1939
01:48:45,200 --> 01:48:48,519
Speaker 1: what the circumstances quite where where I feel like my

1940
01:48:49,240 --> 01:48:56,320
Speaker 1: intellect was quite maybe where they should have been. But

1941
01:48:56,439 --> 01:48:59,400
Speaker 1: I I also was in the realm of discourage and

1942
01:48:59,520 --> 01:49:01,880
Speaker 1: just like trying to move forward and just like like okay,

1943
01:49:02,680 --> 01:49:05,160
Speaker 1: I just willing myself to survive kind of but just

1944
01:49:05,320 --> 01:49:10,320
Speaker 1: the same time on nine different medications that levels that

1945
01:49:10,400 --> 01:49:19,120
Speaker 1: you wouldn't even fathom. But I mean, so, now, what

1946
01:49:19,200 --> 01:49:22,519
Speaker 1: are you doing? I live in Oklahoma. I live in

1947
01:49:22,600 --> 01:49:27,400
Speaker 1: Open Oklahoma City. Newcastle, dude, I was. I was there

1948
01:49:27,439 --> 01:49:30,840
Speaker 1: a couple of weeks ago with my son's team. Where

1949
01:49:30,880 --> 01:49:33,559
Speaker 1: do you guys play? We played this place in Norman

1950
01:49:34,600 --> 01:49:36,360
Speaker 1: and we had a great time talking about the still

1951
01:49:36,400 --> 01:49:39,840
Speaker 1: Water from Bedlam and I played Norman and it was

1952
01:49:40,040 --> 01:49:43,559
Speaker 1: it was cool. I gotta bring him back, you guys, Uh,

1953
01:49:43,880 --> 01:49:47,400
Speaker 1: with your relationships. Just still Water is a dope, Like

1954
01:49:47,560 --> 01:49:49,479
Speaker 1: that's a really I was just there for one day.

1955
01:49:50,439 --> 01:49:53,000
Speaker 1: Uh since that we've been here, but just that town

1956
01:49:53,160 --> 01:49:56,560
Speaker 1: and that the college town vibe, it's really cool. I

1957
01:49:56,600 --> 01:49:58,800
Speaker 1: mean it's kind of that. It doesn't get to luck

1958
01:49:58,920 --> 01:50:01,800
Speaker 1: that but this is the port and what they deal

1959
01:50:01,920 --> 01:50:04,439
Speaker 1: with on a daily, like on a yearly basis, year

1960
01:50:04,479 --> 01:50:08,320
Speaker 1: in and year out. It's not easy. What so okay,

1961
01:50:08,320 --> 01:50:10,599
Speaker 1: so what are you doing now? So? I'm my goal

1962
01:50:10,720 --> 01:50:12,759
Speaker 1: is to be in the NBA work for an NBA

1963
01:50:13,200 --> 01:50:16,639
Speaker 1: team as a scout and I was wanting to get

1964
01:50:16,680 --> 01:50:18,559
Speaker 1: in as a coach. I feel that I could coach

1965
01:50:18,600 --> 01:50:20,920
Speaker 1: at this level. I want to give it my best

1966
01:50:21,000 --> 01:50:24,479
Speaker 1: effort and learn from these guys at the at any element.

1967
01:50:24,800 --> 01:50:28,960
Speaker 1: I've dedicated myself this past year and a half through

1968
01:50:29,040 --> 01:50:32,920
Speaker 1: different avenues to try to connect with guys in the

1969
01:50:33,040 --> 01:50:37,760
Speaker 1: league UM and put myself in situation now where I've

1970
01:50:37,800 --> 01:50:42,200
Speaker 1: evaluated players extensively where I feel confident in my work.

1971
01:50:42,280 --> 01:50:45,120
Speaker 1: But I mean, it's that's hard to explain. I don't

1972
01:50:45,160 --> 01:50:47,639
Speaker 1: know if there's a right answer for how anyone goes

1973
01:50:47,640 --> 01:50:49,400
Speaker 1: about anything. What do you do? What do you make?

1974
01:50:49,560 --> 01:50:54,080
Speaker 1: How do you make money? So I I have some

1975
01:50:55,080 --> 01:50:59,519
Speaker 1: residual income UM, and I also worked a few sales

1976
01:50:59,560 --> 01:51:04,519
Speaker 1: opportunities UM since I have gotten done from since I

1977
01:51:04,640 --> 01:51:08,160
Speaker 1: moved down here to Oklahoma. So I've worked in some

1978
01:51:08,360 --> 01:51:12,200
Speaker 1: sales jobs that you know as an account executive and

1979
01:51:12,439 --> 01:51:14,800
Speaker 1: and you know, people in the sales industry will always

1980
01:51:14,840 --> 01:51:17,439
Speaker 1: tell you just sending credit card machines, and you know,

1981
01:51:17,520 --> 01:51:19,519
Speaker 1: it's all the same and a lot of different elements

1982
01:51:19,560 --> 01:51:22,639
Speaker 1: at the levels I was at UM. But that's kind

1983
01:51:22,680 --> 01:51:26,800
Speaker 1: of UM, the realm UM with where I'm at and

1984
01:51:26,920 --> 01:51:32,280
Speaker 1: then UM communicating UM as an independent scout, just UM

1985
01:51:32,760 --> 01:51:36,200
Speaker 1: as trying to promote myself within to try to put

1986
01:51:36,280 --> 01:51:40,120
Speaker 1: myself in a position to try hopefully get a shot,

1987
01:51:40,280 --> 01:51:42,559
Speaker 1: just at least to try to work within a team.

1988
01:51:42,600 --> 01:51:47,960
Speaker 1: I think my life and my work ethic that towards this, Doug.

1989
01:51:48,040 --> 01:51:50,800
Speaker 1: I feel finally good enough because like junior college, you

1990
01:51:50,960 --> 01:51:53,400
Speaker 1: really get caught in that realm, Doug. Like, you know,

1991
01:51:53,560 --> 01:51:55,200
Speaker 1: I think we know a lot of the same people

1992
01:51:55,240 --> 01:51:58,120
Speaker 1: at the high major levels, Like I can't like those

1993
01:51:58,160 --> 01:52:01,439
Speaker 1: relationships never really fruit. Bruit came to fruition to me

1994
01:52:01,560 --> 01:52:04,919
Speaker 1: because the element I was looking at wasn't the same recruits.

1995
01:52:05,000 --> 01:52:07,800
Speaker 1: But at the same time I was building relationships with

1996
01:52:07,920 --> 01:52:11,840
Speaker 1: guys that were the the that like Drill Oliver runs

1997
01:52:11,960 --> 01:52:15,040
Speaker 1: de Rose who also has a ton of junior college

1998
01:52:15,080 --> 01:52:19,080
Speaker 1: recruits and helps thousands of Chicago kids, but also helps

1999
01:52:19,080 --> 01:52:21,600
Speaker 1: a lot of high major kids, And so it just

2000
01:52:21,720 --> 01:52:24,800
Speaker 1: works out where I know that it's kind of an

2001
01:52:25,080 --> 01:52:28,080
Speaker 1: interesting relicant with that, but like I also feel that

2002
01:52:28,160 --> 01:52:31,000
Speaker 1: I can help develop guys and and you know, my

2003
01:52:31,200 --> 01:52:33,840
Speaker 1: life experience and I just want to learn, you know,

2004
01:52:34,120 --> 01:52:38,479
Speaker 1: basically I need to shut up and listen, Like my

2005
01:52:38,640 --> 01:52:44,679
Speaker 1: Kate Murphy book says, um, so your health is good,

2006
01:52:45,960 --> 01:52:49,880
Speaker 1: you live in Oklahoma, you're scouting, and when you're scouting

2007
01:52:50,000 --> 01:52:54,640
Speaker 1: scouting college players, you're scouting NBA teams. Well, Doug, the

2008
01:52:55,080 --> 01:52:58,479
Speaker 1: as you well know, I shouldn't. I I'll just say

2009
01:52:58,560 --> 01:53:01,720
Speaker 1: to the obviously the yours. There's basically obviously with that

2010
01:53:01,880 --> 01:53:04,599
Speaker 1: vand scouts and you who are going to scout other

2011
01:53:04,760 --> 01:53:07,080
Speaker 1: NBA teams and get your college scouts and you have

2012
01:53:07,120 --> 01:53:09,760
Speaker 1: your regional scouts, but you have your internal scouts as well.

2013
01:53:09,840 --> 01:53:14,240
Speaker 1: But I kind of wanted to the coaching, as you

2014
01:53:14,320 --> 01:53:16,800
Speaker 1: well know, like I don't have the badge of honor

2015
01:53:16,960 --> 01:53:19,960
Speaker 1: to really facilitate that role. And I feel like that

2016
01:53:20,040 --> 01:53:22,280
Speaker 1: it's something I've always kind of lived by and like

2017
01:53:22,520 --> 01:53:26,080
Speaker 1: I feel like I do, but you know, at the

2018
01:53:26,120 --> 01:53:28,960
Speaker 1: professional level, I don't, so like I don't and so

2019
01:53:29,200 --> 01:53:31,680
Speaker 1: I don't want to uh impede on that, but I

2020
01:53:31,760 --> 01:53:34,360
Speaker 1: do want to give my efforts towards something and I

2021
01:53:34,479 --> 01:53:36,280
Speaker 1: thought that this might be the best way. And I

2022
01:53:36,439 --> 01:53:39,200
Speaker 1: had a connections that I tried to utilize that have

2023
01:53:39,320 --> 01:53:41,400
Speaker 1: been trying to utilize to build on that and then

2024
01:53:41,439 --> 01:53:45,160
Speaker 1: also build on getting to know college basketball and I

2025
01:53:45,320 --> 01:53:49,800
Speaker 1: basically there is some how I did it is I

2026
01:53:49,960 --> 01:53:53,559
Speaker 1: dedicated myself to go into the NBA Summer League. Everyone

2027
01:53:53,640 --> 01:53:55,519
Speaker 1: was telling me all my friends that they're at the

2028
01:53:55,600 --> 01:53:57,599
Speaker 1: NBA LEB to like, you gotta go to summer league first,

2029
01:53:58,160 --> 01:53:59,880
Speaker 1: just to get an idea what the hell this is

2030
01:53:59,880 --> 01:54:04,479
Speaker 1: a about. And that's intense. This one was. I mean,

2031
01:54:04,560 --> 01:54:06,639
Speaker 1: like that was my first time. But at the same time, Doug,

2032
01:54:06,720 --> 01:54:09,000
Speaker 1: you take it all in and it's lovely because it's

2033
01:54:09,040 --> 01:54:12,120
Speaker 1: like this is a life to watch basketball for a career.

2034
01:54:13,479 --> 01:54:17,479
Speaker 1: I mean, that's lovely to me and so and it

2035
01:54:17,600 --> 01:54:19,560
Speaker 1: was great basketball by the way too. I mean it

2036
01:54:19,680 --> 01:54:22,080
Speaker 1: was such a great time and and I mean I'm

2037
01:54:22,120 --> 01:54:23,760
Speaker 1: sure a lot of people could share with you. The

2038
01:54:23,840 --> 01:54:27,680
Speaker 1: Vegas experience is great with especially the NBA players interacting

2039
01:54:27,720 --> 01:54:31,439
Speaker 1: and so forth. But um, I just tried to build

2040
01:54:31,479 --> 01:54:34,240
Speaker 1: a knowledge with that and I did this. I went

2041
01:54:34,320 --> 01:54:36,760
Speaker 1: in there with like I'm gonna build up like I was, Like,

2042
01:54:37,120 --> 01:54:39,240
Speaker 1: I went off like being like the dude Jonah Hill

2043
01:54:39,280 --> 01:54:42,400
Speaker 1: and Moneyball, like I'll do like forty eight guys is

2044
01:54:42,520 --> 01:54:44,480
Speaker 1: what I came up with of like who I like

2045
01:54:45,600 --> 01:54:47,720
Speaker 1: And I'm just gonna write this and try to get

2046
01:54:47,760 --> 01:54:51,920
Speaker 1: this out and that's how it started and the like,

2047
01:54:52,240 --> 01:54:54,720
Speaker 1: and I have the all that notes and all that stuff,

2048
01:54:54,720 --> 01:54:56,400
Speaker 1: and I tried to just like can you get this

2049
01:54:56,520 --> 01:54:59,320
Speaker 1: TVs guys? Like how do I know these guys? And

2050
01:54:59,440 --> 01:55:04,120
Speaker 1: it's really art. I don't know a lot of people. Yeah,

2051
01:55:05,160 --> 01:55:10,840
Speaker 1: who would you take number one overall? Yeah? Wow, Now

2052
01:55:11,000 --> 01:55:17,040
Speaker 1: let's have a conversation here, Paolo Monco or Jabari Smith

2053
01:55:17,600 --> 01:55:21,440
Speaker 1: and Chad Homegren? Why would you take kit? Paulo has

2054
01:55:21,480 --> 01:55:24,080
Speaker 1: got a better body. It's not close right now. I

2055
01:55:24,120 --> 01:55:28,240
Speaker 1: know he's older, you got a better body. Um, he

2056
01:55:28,640 --> 01:55:32,760
Speaker 1: obviously not as long as frequency as tall um and

2057
01:55:33,720 --> 01:55:38,080
Speaker 1: and you know, Jabari is a guy who is young,

2058
01:55:38,880 --> 01:55:43,080
Speaker 1: super skilled, Um not doesn't have the rim protecting ability,

2059
01:55:43,120 --> 01:55:44,880
Speaker 1: but I do think defends better out on the floor

2060
01:55:45,800 --> 01:55:49,000
Speaker 1: just from a player. I get that their their development

2061
01:55:49,040 --> 01:55:52,320
Speaker 1: program in in the Twin Cities. They're pumping out dudes, now,

2062
01:55:52,760 --> 01:55:56,760
Speaker 1: got it? Why would you take Chad Homegren over Jabari

2063
01:55:56,840 --> 01:56:00,880
Speaker 1: Smith or at power back? Carol Doug, you just said

2064
01:56:00,920 --> 01:56:03,800
Speaker 1: it pumping out dudes right now? Like like you know

2065
01:56:03,960 --> 01:56:07,760
Speaker 1: that influx. I'm sorry that what you said about Polo's

2066
01:56:07,920 --> 01:56:11,600
Speaker 1: right on and it. Pollo is an incredible talent. And Uh,

2067
01:56:11,840 --> 01:56:14,080
Speaker 1: I've been so impressed with what he played in the

2068
01:56:14,120 --> 01:56:17,760
Speaker 1: Gonzaga game way back. Uh, and and and when they're

2069
01:56:17,800 --> 01:56:20,120
Speaker 1: in their matchup, Yeah, I thought he was you know,

2070
01:56:20,240 --> 01:56:23,920
Speaker 1: I thought the window war was actually most efficient. But

2071
01:56:24,600 --> 01:56:26,920
Speaker 1: he he is incredible. He I think he'll play he

2072
01:56:27,480 --> 01:56:30,360
Speaker 1: was better than that. But I'm saying also, like teams

2073
01:56:30,400 --> 01:56:33,040
Speaker 1: are all different too, and how they work, like you know,

2074
01:56:33,240 --> 01:56:36,040
Speaker 1: you if you look at the advanced dynamics and how

2075
01:56:36,160 --> 01:56:39,160
Speaker 1: like how how Rudy Gobert works in with the Jazz

2076
01:56:39,240 --> 01:56:43,440
Speaker 1: compared to how like the Mitchell Robinson works with the Knicks,

2077
01:56:43,560 --> 01:56:46,240
Speaker 1: Like it's different. So like who I'm just saying, like

2078
01:56:46,400 --> 01:56:49,480
Speaker 1: not that those teams will be there, but just as

2079
01:56:49,560 --> 01:56:55,440
Speaker 1: it gets say like chet though his skill set, passing ability,

2080
01:56:55,560 --> 01:57:00,160
Speaker 1: I q uh efficient efficient finishing around the rim, off

2081
01:57:00,200 --> 01:57:05,200
Speaker 1: the dribble, and ambidextrous finishing ability. Uh, just keeping the

2082
01:57:05,240 --> 01:57:08,800
Speaker 1: ball high, good footwork, you know, running the lane, knowing

2083
01:57:08,920 --> 01:57:11,840
Speaker 1: how to play with high level talent, knowing to have

2084
01:57:11,960 --> 01:57:15,200
Speaker 1: the radar on him for a long time, seeing kind

2085
01:57:15,240 --> 01:57:18,000
Speaker 1: of his his brother kind of lead the way in

2086
01:57:18,120 --> 01:57:22,920
Speaker 1: some ways of Jalen. You know, Uh, there's there's a

2087
01:57:23,000 --> 01:57:25,560
Speaker 1: lot to that that I feel that I I stay

2088
01:57:25,560 --> 01:57:27,800
Speaker 1: a bible. I I think jug like, I'm not saying

2089
01:57:27,800 --> 01:57:30,040
Speaker 1: he's gonna set it on fire by any stress, but

2090
01:57:30,080 --> 01:57:32,680
Speaker 1: I still like he he could go across the board

2091
01:57:32,720 --> 01:57:36,360
Speaker 1: statistically for some games that it depending on how he

2092
01:57:36,440 --> 01:57:39,880
Speaker 1: works in conditionally and strength wise. I think, you know,

2093
01:57:40,720 --> 01:57:43,480
Speaker 1: as various as Zion, Like, I don't know, I haven't

2094
01:57:43,520 --> 01:57:46,400
Speaker 1: seen him, but like my son's Ion. His name Zion

2095
01:57:46,440 --> 01:57:51,440
Speaker 1: by the way, three months old. Um, but uh is

2096
01:57:51,720 --> 01:57:54,400
Speaker 1: vastly different and and there ways of like a player

2097
01:57:54,440 --> 01:57:57,760
Speaker 1: I like Louisiana Tech named Kenneth Lofton, who's a guy

2098
01:57:57,880 --> 01:58:00,040
Speaker 1: I think is incredibly efficient. Was best for you to

2099
01:58:00,120 --> 01:58:02,520
Speaker 1: say basketball? And sometimes I feel like the best thing

2100
01:58:02,560 --> 01:58:05,480
Speaker 1: you can get Doug is from peers and what peers

2101
01:58:05,520 --> 01:58:07,560
Speaker 1: will say and chat say Kenneth was the best player

2102
01:58:07,600 --> 01:58:13,120
Speaker 1: on that team. Yeah, the big kid. Yeah. Yeah. The

2103
01:58:13,200 --> 01:58:15,800
Speaker 1: question is, how do you know? How does that? What

2104
01:58:15,920 --> 01:58:17,160
Speaker 1: is he like when loses weight to play in the

2105
01:58:17,240 --> 01:58:18,680
Speaker 1: n b A. You know, it's just such a different

2106
01:58:18,840 --> 01:58:23,600
Speaker 1: and I totally get that such a such a different game. Okay,

2107
01:58:24,440 --> 01:58:28,440
Speaker 1: last thing you want to like, Coaches, listen to this, Scouts,

2108
01:58:28,560 --> 01:58:30,880
Speaker 1: listen to this. Give me you said, candle up, give

2109
01:58:30,920 --> 01:58:35,560
Speaker 1: me a guy who if you get, you get five

2110
01:58:35,640 --> 01:58:38,640
Speaker 1: minutes with. Whoever has is a first round draft pick,

2111
01:58:38,760 --> 01:58:41,240
Speaker 1: mid first round. Give me somebody who's not on my

2112
01:58:41,400 --> 01:58:56,520
Speaker 1: radar that you really like. Isaiah Mobli Todd seventeen. Really now,

2113
01:58:56,600 --> 01:58:59,880
Speaker 1: the difference in him and his brother, supposedly is he's

2114
01:58:59,880 --> 01:59:03,200
Speaker 1: always been a hooper. He's always been about it, whereas

2115
01:59:03,240 --> 01:59:07,240
Speaker 1: his brother is just good at it and skateboard a

2116
01:59:07,280 --> 01:59:09,760
Speaker 1: bunch of his kid, nicest kid in the world, and

2117
01:59:09,880 --> 01:59:11,920
Speaker 1: just kind of blessed into it and became more of

2118
01:59:12,000 --> 01:59:15,560
Speaker 1: a hooper as it went on, whereas Isaiah. But the

2119
01:59:15,640 --> 01:59:18,280
Speaker 1: reason Isaiah still in college is the perception that there's

2120
01:59:18,320 --> 01:59:22,000
Speaker 1: a drop off in talent. You don't think so, I

2121
01:59:22,080 --> 01:59:24,640
Speaker 1: think that's way off. I I actually liked him at

2122
01:59:24,720 --> 01:59:29,720
Speaker 1: the draft combine as much as I really was impressed

2123
01:59:29,760 --> 01:59:36,640
Speaker 1: with his range, his his shot making ability, his mobility. Laterally, uh,

2124
01:59:38,120 --> 01:59:42,160
Speaker 1: I mean his passing ability, his skill set naturally to

2125
01:59:42,720 --> 01:59:44,840
Speaker 1: push the ball in transition, to keep his head up

2126
01:59:44,880 --> 01:59:47,800
Speaker 1: and make right decisions, make a cross court pass like

2127
01:59:47,920 --> 01:59:51,240
Speaker 1: the NBA like for like. He makes i Q decisions

2128
01:59:51,280 --> 01:59:54,360
Speaker 1: like he's and he's making critical decisions late where I

2129
01:59:54,440 --> 01:59:57,200
Speaker 1: thought that game against like Oregon for instance, was a

2130
01:59:57,280 --> 01:59:59,720
Speaker 1: big saying game like that's tough to play in that environment.

2131
02:00:00,200 --> 02:00:02,560
Speaker 1: And I thought he made a major statement in that

2132
02:00:02,720 --> 02:00:06,320
Speaker 1: second half in that environment. I think there's things like

2133
02:00:06,440 --> 02:00:08,120
Speaker 1: that that I look for as a coach, and over

2134
02:00:08,240 --> 02:00:11,080
Speaker 1: my years and time, Doug of like how I work

2135
02:00:11,160 --> 02:00:13,280
Speaker 1: with things and how I value and I'm just like, okay,

2136
02:00:13,560 --> 02:00:15,839
Speaker 1: and I'm just looking at this three point shooting ability

2137
02:00:16,080 --> 02:00:18,520
Speaker 1: like two point one per game, And you know, I

2138
02:00:18,600 --> 02:00:21,640
Speaker 1: could pull up a status right here actually where I've researched,

2139
02:00:21,680 --> 02:00:22,960
Speaker 1: so I can give you a little bit more of

2140
02:00:23,000 --> 02:00:25,920
Speaker 1: a breakdown, so I can give you like how I

2141
02:00:26,040 --> 02:00:32,120
Speaker 1: really do this. Uh but yeah, no I mentioned you know,

2142
02:00:32,280 --> 02:00:36,160
Speaker 1: like obviously I watched the I watched him play multiple times,

2143
02:00:36,720 --> 02:00:38,880
Speaker 1: and I watched him play every time he plays. But

2144
02:00:39,040 --> 02:00:41,480
Speaker 1: you know, when I do this, I try to uh

2145
02:00:41,720 --> 02:00:44,800
Speaker 1: take in some things within learning from people like great

2146
02:00:44,880 --> 02:00:47,280
Speaker 1: scouts who I learned from, just through what data is

2147
02:00:47,280 --> 02:00:49,880
Speaker 1: that contents out there, and just through my own experiences

2148
02:00:50,280 --> 02:00:52,920
Speaker 1: and try to write down that how I could best

2149
02:00:53,600 --> 02:00:56,360
Speaker 1: you know, say this in the best way without being

2150
02:00:56,520 --> 02:01:00,360
Speaker 1: biased and and not hurting them. And but you know,

2151
02:01:00,440 --> 02:01:03,000
Speaker 1: I just say for his offensive AlSi say says his

2152
02:01:03,120 --> 02:01:06,440
Speaker 1: best three points, shooting big with translatable NBA attributes and

2153
02:01:06,480 --> 02:01:09,320
Speaker 1: college basketball. This season, he has slimmed down, looks more

2154
02:01:09,440 --> 02:01:12,720
Speaker 1: mobile than last year. His ability to shoot from the slot, wing,

2155
02:01:12,800 --> 02:01:15,200
Speaker 1: and corner given more opportunity to spread the floor for

2156
02:01:15,280 --> 02:01:17,880
Speaker 1: his team as a five man, along with his ability

2157
02:01:17,920 --> 02:01:21,080
Speaker 1: to pass out of the post, hitting quarters to cutters

2158
02:01:21,160 --> 02:01:23,720
Speaker 1: and stride or fanning into an open teammate for three

2159
02:01:24,240 --> 02:01:27,360
Speaker 1: is what's making it more multidimensional on his offensive package.

2160
02:01:27,840 --> 02:01:30,080
Speaker 1: He has also gotten better off the bounce, pushing to

2161
02:01:30,160 --> 02:01:33,760
Speaker 1: transition our defensive rebound, and having more counter finishes at

2162
02:01:33,840 --> 02:01:36,720
Speaker 1: traffic attacking from the midpost. He needs to get better

2163
02:01:36,960 --> 02:01:38,920
Speaker 1: very another free throw line, and although he's got better,

2164
02:01:39,000 --> 02:01:41,560
Speaker 1: it's finishing through contact. He has saw a lot old

2165
02:01:41,600 --> 02:01:43,920
Speaker 1: quickness which helps him evade other bigs on the perimeter.

2166
02:01:44,320 --> 02:01:46,240
Speaker 1: He still needs to prove his back to the basket,

2167
02:01:46,320 --> 02:01:49,120
Speaker 1: although I feel like that's truly improved handling double teams

2168
02:01:49,160 --> 02:01:52,600
Speaker 1: doug Um recently, I have a more updated scout I

2169
02:01:52,680 --> 02:01:55,440
Speaker 1: could share with you, but this is my first. He

2170
02:01:55,600 --> 02:01:58,120
Speaker 1: does an excellent job seeing the floor and facility in

2171
02:01:58,200 --> 02:02:00,680
Speaker 1: the offense with the ball's hands and free thro see,

2172
02:02:00,680 --> 02:02:03,400
Speaker 1: he needs to improve, but it's then that has um

2173
02:02:03,560 --> 02:02:06,880
Speaker 1: and then defense evaluation, which I think has improved tremendously.

2174
02:02:06,960 --> 02:02:10,000
Speaker 1: I feel like he's engaged in his urgency. Defensively is

2175
02:02:10,040 --> 02:02:14,560
Speaker 1: really improved, not necessarily in box score stasts necessarily, but

2176
02:02:14,680 --> 02:02:20,120
Speaker 1: just length and taking things away too awesome stuff. All right, listen,

2177
02:02:20,240 --> 02:02:22,960
Speaker 1: So here's here's your here's what I need from you.

2178
02:02:24,320 --> 02:02:27,879
Speaker 1: We're gonna as we get towards the n c A Tournament,

2179
02:02:28,160 --> 02:02:30,040
Speaker 1: i'll have you back on. You'll tell about some of

2180
02:02:30,080 --> 02:02:32,600
Speaker 1: these guys, and then we get towards the draft, we'll

2181
02:02:32,640 --> 02:02:34,600
Speaker 1: do the exact same thing. But the meantime, I just

2182
02:02:34,680 --> 02:02:37,640
Speaker 1: want to tell this story. Okay, here's the last thing.

2183
02:02:38,560 --> 02:02:41,000
Speaker 1: Somebody's listening to this and they just got diagnosed with

2184
02:02:41,080 --> 02:02:46,320
Speaker 1: cancer as a scary word. Okay, you have inoperable brain

2185
02:02:46,400 --> 02:02:52,520
Speaker 1: tumor and you're still here six years later, right, six

2186
02:02:52,640 --> 02:02:57,040
Speaker 1: years later? Well, Well, what would your what would your

2187
02:02:57,080 --> 02:03:02,160
Speaker 1: advice be to somebody who is who is going, who's

2188
02:03:02,440 --> 02:03:08,320
Speaker 1: who has any sort of similar diagnosis? That is a

2189
02:03:08,560 --> 02:03:11,160
Speaker 1: perfect question, and I thank you for asking it, Doug,

2190
02:03:11,200 --> 02:03:13,360
Speaker 1: and I just thank you so much for giving me

2191
02:03:13,480 --> 02:03:15,880
Speaker 1: this platform and this opportunity and I call your brother

2192
02:03:16,000 --> 02:03:20,320
Speaker 1: for doing it, thank you so much. Um. But I

2193
02:03:20,360 --> 02:03:26,000
Speaker 1: would say Jim Valvano, Stewart Scott's have got people fast,

2194
02:03:26,080 --> 02:03:29,920
Speaker 1: my dad, your dad, people that have we've lost. I'm

2195
02:03:30,000 --> 02:03:32,240
Speaker 1: thankful for being here. I'm thankful to be a father.

2196
02:03:32,360 --> 02:03:34,880
Speaker 1: I have a three month old son, Dion, I have

2197
02:03:35,640 --> 02:03:38,880
Speaker 1: a daughter's graduated high school ever so and it's eight.

2198
02:03:39,080 --> 02:03:42,240
Speaker 1: I have a lot of wife It's beautiful. And I

2199
02:03:42,320 --> 02:03:45,600
Speaker 1: turned forty on March fourth. And I think I think

2200
02:03:46,440 --> 02:03:49,680
Speaker 1: the hardest part, Doug is there's no game plan. And

2201
02:03:49,920 --> 02:03:52,440
Speaker 1: you know, as much as I could say Jim Valvano, Stewart,

2202
02:03:52,480 --> 02:03:56,800
Speaker 1: Scott and everything else, um, I wanna. I want to

2203
02:03:57,040 --> 02:04:00,240
Speaker 1: prepare to be an advocate for it. Um. I have,

2204
02:04:00,560 --> 02:04:02,560
Speaker 1: I have stuff on paper, but like you know, at

2205
02:04:02,600 --> 02:04:05,560
Speaker 1: the same time, I think you have there. There's a lot,

2206
02:04:05,800 --> 02:04:07,720
Speaker 1: there's a lot of layers to it and a lot

2207
02:04:07,760 --> 02:04:10,240
Speaker 1: of different things. But I think the biggest thing, Doug

2208
02:04:10,400 --> 02:04:14,120
Speaker 1: is just anything is just cling on to what what

2209
02:04:14,400 --> 02:04:16,840
Speaker 1: what you can with with loved ones that are there

2210
02:04:17,120 --> 02:04:20,400
Speaker 1: and and people that are there that uh it's hard

2211
02:04:20,480 --> 02:04:22,440
Speaker 1: to find in a dark place. But I feel like

2212
02:04:22,560 --> 02:04:25,760
Speaker 1: when you step out, when you least expect it. That's

2213
02:04:25,800 --> 02:04:28,800
Speaker 1: when the best things can happen to you. So I'm

2214
02:04:28,840 --> 02:04:33,400
Speaker 1: so glad we did this. Thank you. We should have

2215
02:04:33,440 --> 02:04:35,040
Speaker 1: done it a long time ago, and we should have

2216
02:04:35,120 --> 02:04:37,840
Speaker 1: caught up more in person. Hey man, let's call it

2217
02:04:37,920 --> 02:04:40,720
Speaker 1: a night. I appreciate you, I love you, and thanks

2218
02:04:40,760 --> 02:04:42,840
Speaker 1: so much doing this. Thank you so much, Thank you

2219
02:04:42,880 --> 02:04:44,520
Speaker 1: so much for having me, Doug. It's been a blessing.

2220
02:04:44,600 --> 02:04:49,720
Speaker 1: Thank you man. Wow. I mean it puts everything in

2221
02:04:49,840 --> 02:04:56,320
Speaker 1: perspective in comparison to um anything else in basketball in life.

2222
02:04:56,400 --> 02:04:59,800
Speaker 1: When here you are coaching, grinding, trying to find your way,

2223
02:05:00,240 --> 02:05:01,800
Speaker 1: you're a little bit of a physical mess, and then

2224
02:05:01,800 --> 02:05:05,280
Speaker 1: you find out you have cancer. And now, despite the

2225
02:05:05,280 --> 02:05:08,160
Speaker 1: fact he's not coaching, he feels like he's in a

2226
02:05:08,280 --> 02:05:12,800
Speaker 1: much better place physically, mentally, and hopefully in the NBA

2227
02:05:12,960 --> 02:05:15,640
Speaker 1: sometime very very soon. My thanks to Ben Jacobson for

2228
02:05:15,680 --> 02:05:17,200
Speaker 1: sharing a story with us. My thanks to you for

2229
02:05:17,280 --> 02:05:19,840
Speaker 1: downloading Remember the Doug Godling shows daily three to six

2230
02:05:19,920 --> 02:05:23,600
Speaker 1: Eastern twelve to three Pacific on Fox Sports Radio, the

2231
02:05:23,680 --> 02:05:25,480
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio app, or Fox Sports Trade dot com,

2232
02:05:25,520 --> 02:05:27,960
Speaker 1: where you can download wherever you downloaded this podcast. In

2233
02:05:28,040 --> 02:05:31,880
Speaker 1: the meantime, remember to download, subscribe rate, and write a review.

2234
02:05:32,360 --> 02:05:34,640
Speaker 1: My thanks to Ben Jacobson for sharing a story. I'm

2235
02:05:34,720 --> 02:05:36,440
Speaker 1: Doug Gottlieb. This is all ball