1 00:00:05,040 --> 00:00:08,400 Speaker 1: On this episode of News World. Cam Gufferium is the 2 00:00:08,480 --> 00:00:13,520 Speaker 1: visionary space and energy entrepreneur behind several companies dedicated to 3 00:00:13,600 --> 00:00:18,720 Speaker 1: furthering human civilization, including Axiom Space. After co founding Axiom 4 00:00:18,720 --> 00:00:22,680 Speaker 1: Space in twenty sixteen to unlock space's potential for renovation 5 00:00:23,040 --> 00:00:26,520 Speaker 1: through commercialization, he serves as executive chairman of the board 6 00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:29,880 Speaker 1: and a key strategic advisor on the development of the 7 00:00:29,920 --> 00:00:33,880 Speaker 1: space economy. Camp started his entrepreneur career in nineteen ninety 8 00:00:33,920 --> 00:00:39,919 Speaker 1: four by founding Stinger Gafferian Technology Zinc. SGT became NASA's 9 00:00:39,960 --> 00:00:45,120 Speaker 1: second largest engineering services contractor, providing operations for the International 10 00:00:45,120 --> 00:00:49,400 Speaker 1: Space Station and astronaut training support. Driven by his omission 11 00:00:49,760 --> 00:00:53,080 Speaker 1: to advance the state of humanity and human knowledge, Cam 12 00:00:53,080 --> 00:00:57,520 Speaker 1: has created organizations transforming the space and energy sectors. In 13 00:00:57,560 --> 00:01:01,280 Speaker 1: addition to co founding Axiom Space, his other companies include 14 00:01:01,560 --> 00:01:06,360 Speaker 1: Intuitive Machines, X Energy, and IBX. Cam is also an 15 00:01:06,360 --> 00:01:10,160 Speaker 1: active philanthropist and founder of a nonprofit focused on scientific 16 00:01:10,240 --> 00:01:13,759 Speaker 1: research and enabling interstellar travel. I should say, by the way, 17 00:01:13,760 --> 00:01:15,759 Speaker 1: he's also a neighbor of mine, a very good friend 18 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:30,680 Speaker 1: and a remarkable person. Cam, welcome and thank you for 19 00:01:30,760 --> 00:01:31,960 Speaker 1: joining me the News world. 20 00:01:32,280 --> 00:01:34,800 Speaker 2: Thank you so much, mister speaker. It's such a pleasure 21 00:01:34,840 --> 00:01:35,919 Speaker 2: to be with you. 22 00:01:35,920 --> 00:01:38,160 Speaker 1: You're just great and you're always fun. You have an 23 00:01:38,160 --> 00:01:40,840 Speaker 1: amazing number of ideas every week. But let's start at 24 00:01:40,880 --> 00:01:44,160 Speaker 1: the beginning, because I think your background is fascinating and 25 00:01:44,160 --> 00:01:46,880 Speaker 1: a good example of why America is unique. You were 26 00:01:46,880 --> 00:01:48,640 Speaker 1: born in Iran and then what happened? 27 00:01:49,400 --> 00:01:53,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, I was born at around back. From very early age, 28 00:01:53,560 --> 00:01:55,560 Speaker 2: like when I was six years old, I was just 29 00:01:55,640 --> 00:02:01,320 Speaker 2: sort of mesmerized with space and stars and explorations and 30 00:02:02,040 --> 00:02:05,640 Speaker 2: would often ask myself is it possible that there are 31 00:02:05,680 --> 00:02:09,200 Speaker 2: other people living in other stars? And when I was 32 00:02:09,240 --> 00:02:13,519 Speaker 2: eleven years old, I saw Neil Armstrong landing on a 33 00:02:13,560 --> 00:02:17,440 Speaker 2: surface to Moon from my neighbors black and white television, 34 00:02:17,520 --> 00:02:21,000 Speaker 2: and that was just like solidified for me that that's 35 00:02:21,040 --> 00:02:23,600 Speaker 2: the journey that I want to be in. And with 36 00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:28,600 Speaker 2: just incredible love of America, I almost age eighteen, migrated 37 00:02:28,639 --> 00:02:31,239 Speaker 2: to United State. I've been here ever since. 38 00:02:31,760 --> 00:02:36,559 Speaker 1: You went to school here and really developed a remarkable 39 00:02:36,600 --> 00:02:40,600 Speaker 1: capacity in engineering and mathematics. But can you sort of 40 00:02:40,800 --> 00:02:43,840 Speaker 1: walk us through your journey personally, because you all only 41 00:02:44,360 --> 00:02:46,360 Speaker 1: go through a bunch of companies and ended up an 42 00:02:46,400 --> 00:02:48,680 Speaker 1: amazing entrepreneur. How did that happen? 43 00:02:49,160 --> 00:02:51,920 Speaker 2: I went to actually school in Washington, d C. The 44 00:02:51,960 --> 00:02:55,799 Speaker 2: first school that I attended was Catholic University of America, 45 00:02:56,560 --> 00:02:59,920 Speaker 2: and I was the first generation that graduated in computer 46 00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:04,320 Speaker 2: science engineering degree in the United States. And with love 47 00:03:04,360 --> 00:03:08,240 Speaker 2: of space exploration, I worked for a computer company called 48 00:03:08,240 --> 00:03:11,240 Speaker 2: Perkin Elmer. I was able to get a job at 49 00:03:11,320 --> 00:03:15,639 Speaker 2: Garter Space Flight Center supporting Lockheed, and you know, I 50 00:03:15,760 --> 00:03:20,680 Speaker 2: just loved space exploration and that sort of continued. I 51 00:03:20,720 --> 00:03:25,000 Speaker 2: guess I had this itch for entrepreneurship. And in nineteen 52 00:03:25,120 --> 00:03:28,919 Speaker 2: ninety four, mister speaker, I got a mortgage on my 53 00:03:29,040 --> 00:03:32,240 Speaker 2: house for two hundred and fifty thousand dollars and I 54 00:03:32,320 --> 00:03:34,920 Speaker 2: went all in and literally all in, so if I 55 00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:39,200 Speaker 2: was not successful, I would be bankrupt. And started SGKE 56 00:03:39,520 --> 00:03:45,240 Speaker 2: Stinger Gafarian Technologies with this other incredible African American pastor 57 00:03:45,240 --> 00:03:48,800 Speaker 2: who's also an engineer, Harold Stinger. He literally came to 58 00:03:48,880 --> 00:03:52,920 Speaker 2: my basement, we moved some boxes around. Most companies started 59 00:03:52,960 --> 00:03:57,000 Speaker 2: in the garage. We started in the basement and upgrade 60 00:03:57,040 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 2: the garage later. That's how we got that first come. 61 00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:03,600 Speaker 2: When you started in nineteen ninety four, and it was 62 00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:08,480 Speaker 2: a resounding success. We grew like sixty x in ten years. 63 00:04:08,920 --> 00:04:12,960 Speaker 2: In two thousand and nine, you know, I started X Energy, 64 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:16,080 Speaker 2: and you know, it was really because I wanted to 65 00:04:16,200 --> 00:04:19,360 Speaker 2: change the world for the better. Initially I was thinking 66 00:04:19,360 --> 00:04:23,479 Speaker 2: about actually creating a hydrogen economy and that led me 67 00:04:23,600 --> 00:04:27,719 Speaker 2: to a nuclear and that's how X Energy was formed. 68 00:04:28,120 --> 00:04:31,880 Speaker 2: In two thousand and nine and twenty thirteen, I co 69 00:04:32,000 --> 00:04:36,560 Speaker 2: founded Intuitive Machines, which is today a public fustrated company 70 00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:39,200 Speaker 2: and first company in the history a human kind that 71 00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:44,200 Speaker 2: successfully landed and surfaced the Moon two years ago. Twenty 72 00:04:44,279 --> 00:04:49,120 Speaker 2: sixteen X Energy, Axiom Space, which we're building the first 73 00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:54,479 Speaker 2: private commercial space station to replace International Space Station, and 74 00:04:54,560 --> 00:04:59,760 Speaker 2: twenty twenty one I co founded Quantum Space. Were heavily 75 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:03,840 Speaker 2: in to defense technology and actually today heavily involved in 76 00:05:03,880 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 2: the golden technologies. 77 00:05:05,640 --> 00:05:07,560 Speaker 1: I mean, you've really had this amazing range. I have 78 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:11,800 Speaker 1: to say, from my perspective watching what you're doing, I 79 00:05:11,839 --> 00:05:15,200 Speaker 1: think it may be that the most powerful of your 80 00:05:15,279 --> 00:05:19,920 Speaker 1: innovations is going to be the modular nuclear at X Energy, 81 00:05:20,000 --> 00:05:23,000 Speaker 1: and the degree to which people don't realize, but artificial 82 00:05:23,000 --> 00:05:27,000 Speaker 1: intelligence relies on the huge amount of computing power and 83 00:05:27,080 --> 00:05:30,440 Speaker 1: computing power relies on energy. If you don't have the 84 00:05:30,480 --> 00:05:34,120 Speaker 1: electricity for the computers, you don't get artificial intelligence. And 85 00:05:34,440 --> 00:05:37,440 Speaker 1: if we stayed with our traditional systems, we would never 86 00:05:37,520 --> 00:05:40,719 Speaker 1: be able to build enough infrastructure for the volume of 87 00:05:41,000 --> 00:05:43,400 Speaker 1: computing power we're going to need. But talk to just 88 00:05:43,440 --> 00:05:46,640 Speaker 1: from man or two about the potential impact of modular 89 00:05:46,720 --> 00:05:49,600 Speaker 1: nuclear because I think this may be your biggest single 90 00:05:49,920 --> 00:05:51,360 Speaker 1: breakthrough in helping people. 91 00:05:52,320 --> 00:05:57,320 Speaker 2: Thank you, mister speaker. You're absolutely correct. I strongly believe 92 00:05:57,520 --> 00:06:02,880 Speaker 2: that whoever controls the AI will dominate the world. And 93 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:08,120 Speaker 2: if United States wants to be an AI leader, the 94 00:06:08,160 --> 00:06:11,360 Speaker 2: AI revolution is not going to happen if you don't 95 00:06:11,360 --> 00:06:15,160 Speaker 2: have a power source to empower it, right, And the 96 00:06:15,200 --> 00:06:18,080 Speaker 2: wind and solar is not going to work right. So 97 00:06:18,520 --> 00:06:21,480 Speaker 2: the only way that this is going to happen is 98 00:06:21,520 --> 00:06:24,880 Speaker 2: true nuclear power, and I would add nuclear power more 99 00:06:24,960 --> 00:06:30,120 Speaker 2: specifically small modular reactors. That's what ex Energy is all about. 100 00:06:30,760 --> 00:06:33,640 Speaker 2: And this is a company. I found it singularly in 101 00:06:33,720 --> 00:06:37,200 Speaker 2: two thousand and nine. Today we are world leader in 102 00:06:38,160 --> 00:06:42,440 Speaker 2: SMR technologies and in fact, we were really fortunate that 103 00:06:42,800 --> 00:06:48,440 Speaker 2: Amazon Aws selected us as the company to provide power 104 00:06:48,480 --> 00:06:53,200 Speaker 2: for their AI data centers and currently they are on 105 00:06:53,240 --> 00:06:56,600 Speaker 2: our board and leader on our last round. In addition 106 00:06:56,640 --> 00:07:00,640 Speaker 2: to that, we're building the first plant for that chemical 107 00:07:00,880 --> 00:07:04,200 Speaker 2: in c diri Iff, Texas. And also we are the 108 00:07:04,320 --> 00:07:10,200 Speaker 2: recipient of a multi billion dollar private public partnership grant 109 00:07:10,760 --> 00:07:14,360 Speaker 2: from Department of Energy which we were very honored to 110 00:07:14,480 --> 00:07:19,120 Speaker 2: receive during the first Trump administration. And we're really doing 111 00:07:19,200 --> 00:07:21,920 Speaker 2: remarkable things in order to be able to do that. 112 00:07:21,960 --> 00:07:26,560 Speaker 2: But from the AI policy perspective, you're absolutely right, we 113 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:31,400 Speaker 2: need the nuclear power in order for AI to be successful. 114 00:07:31,240 --> 00:07:34,760 Speaker 1: And I just think your visionary leadership on that was remarkable. 115 00:07:34,760 --> 00:07:39,480 Speaker 1: But you also have a visionary sense at Action Space. 116 00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:42,760 Speaker 1: What is the gap that you saw in the space 117 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:44,400 Speaker 1: industry when you founded Axiom. 118 00:07:45,080 --> 00:07:50,520 Speaker 2: Prior to founding Action Space, we were basically operating the 119 00:07:50,600 --> 00:07:54,480 Speaker 2: International Space Station my previous company twenty four x seven. 120 00:07:55,080 --> 00:07:59,280 Speaker 2: We had two contracts totaling two point six billion dollars 121 00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:03,880 Speaker 2: where we were managing the operation of ISS all the 122 00:08:03,920 --> 00:08:09,320 Speaker 2: time and the engineering support behind it. And so me 123 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:13,440 Speaker 2: and my co founder, who also was the program manager 124 00:08:13,520 --> 00:08:17,760 Speaker 2: for International Space Station for NASA, knew that ISS is 125 00:08:17,760 --> 00:08:19,920 Speaker 2: going to go away by the end of the decade. 126 00:08:20,240 --> 00:08:23,880 Speaker 2: Right by the end of twenty thirty and so we 127 00:08:23,960 --> 00:08:27,640 Speaker 2: decided to get on this journey of building the first 128 00:08:27,880 --> 00:08:34,520 Speaker 2: private commercial space station that replaces International Space Station. And 129 00:08:34,679 --> 00:08:39,400 Speaker 2: we've done just then incredible job since two thousand and sixteen, 130 00:08:39,720 --> 00:08:45,199 Speaker 2: almost ten years developing this technology on our own master speaker, 131 00:08:45,320 --> 00:08:49,360 Speaker 2: on our own we have raised eight hundred million dollars 132 00:08:49,400 --> 00:08:53,679 Speaker 2: developing this hardware. And our first module is going to 133 00:08:53,720 --> 00:08:57,640 Speaker 2: be delivered later on this year in our facility in Houston, Texas, 134 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:00,840 Speaker 2: and we're going to go through the integration and launch 135 00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:05,200 Speaker 2: this the first module, which we call PPTM, which is Power, 136 00:09:05,280 --> 00:09:09,040 Speaker 2: Payload and Thermal module, and we're going to launch this, 137 00:09:09,360 --> 00:09:11,959 Speaker 2: I would say by end of twenty twenty six maybe 138 00:09:11,960 --> 00:09:16,439 Speaker 2: first quarter twenty twenty eight, and this module is going 139 00:09:16,480 --> 00:09:20,080 Speaker 2: to be launched and connect to the current ISS. And 140 00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:23,439 Speaker 2: I would add we are the only company, this sole 141 00:09:23,559 --> 00:09:27,719 Speaker 2: company that has a contract with NASA to connect with ISS. 142 00:09:27,720 --> 00:09:31,040 Speaker 2: No one else has this contract. This contract was awarded 143 00:09:31,080 --> 00:09:34,680 Speaker 2: to Ask competitively. So we will be launching that module 144 00:09:35,200 --> 00:09:38,400 Speaker 2: and then later on we will be adding our habitation 145 00:09:38,600 --> 00:09:42,320 Speaker 2: Module one and two and also a module where we 146 00:09:42,360 --> 00:09:46,959 Speaker 2: can do manufacturing in space. And long term vision is 147 00:09:47,400 --> 00:09:50,560 Speaker 2: to really have you know, in my view, long term 148 00:09:50,760 --> 00:09:55,360 Speaker 2: space city where people live and work and you know, 149 00:09:55,440 --> 00:09:59,400 Speaker 2: maybe you have artificial gravity and you know, do all 150 00:09:59,440 --> 00:10:03,040 Speaker 2: kinds of many ffacturing and create this new economy. I 151 00:10:03,160 --> 00:10:06,200 Speaker 2: call it the Leo economy, a new economy that can 152 00:10:06,240 --> 00:10:11,200 Speaker 2: be created to do things in space like pharmaceuticals or 153 00:10:11,200 --> 00:10:16,000 Speaker 2: semiconductors or orbital data centers, things that we can do 154 00:10:16,120 --> 00:10:19,480 Speaker 2: in microgravity that you cannot do on Earth. 155 00:10:19,920 --> 00:10:22,640 Speaker 1: That's been a vision for a long time. Why do 156 00:10:22,679 --> 00:10:26,520 Speaker 1: you think it has taken so long to develop manufacturing 157 00:10:26,559 --> 00:10:29,920 Speaker 1: and space because it does seem to have unique characteristics. 158 00:10:30,120 --> 00:10:32,760 Speaker 1: I've been writing about it since nineteen eighty four. 159 00:10:33,280 --> 00:10:37,040 Speaker 2: You're absolutely right, mister speaker, and I think the reason 160 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:39,920 Speaker 2: is the current ISS was developed by the government, and 161 00:10:40,000 --> 00:10:44,160 Speaker 2: government is not in the business of commercial right, and 162 00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:47,120 Speaker 2: I think you need commercial industries to come in and 163 00:10:47,200 --> 00:10:51,280 Speaker 2: be able to get other industries to be engaged. In fact, 164 00:10:51,520 --> 00:10:55,920 Speaker 2: one of my investors and partners is the largest pharmaceutical 165 00:10:56,440 --> 00:11:02,480 Speaker 2: company in South Korea who's partner with us. However, these technologies, 166 00:11:02,520 --> 00:11:06,640 Speaker 2: as we talk about, has been developed and tested within 167 00:11:06,760 --> 00:11:11,400 Speaker 2: International Space Station, so it's really ripe for commercializing it 168 00:11:11,440 --> 00:11:41,520 Speaker 2: and create this new economy. 169 00:11:28,960 --> 00:11:31,400 Speaker 1: You recently had. I thought it kind of a milestone 170 00:11:31,640 --> 00:11:34,679 Speaker 1: you had the AX four mission when you and I 171 00:11:34,720 --> 00:11:37,760 Speaker 1: chat about earlier. It was I thought a remarkable achievement 172 00:11:37,960 --> 00:11:41,480 Speaker 1: in showing how space can actually bring countries together. 173 00:11:42,000 --> 00:11:45,520 Speaker 2: I'm so glad you asked this. This is our fourth mission, 174 00:11:46,080 --> 00:11:48,600 Speaker 2: but let me just take very briefly about first, second 175 00:11:48,600 --> 00:11:52,920 Speaker 2: and the first mission. We took one private astronaut from Canada, 176 00:11:53,320 --> 00:11:57,040 Speaker 2: one from the United States, and one from Israel. It 177 00:11:57,120 --> 00:12:01,960 Speaker 2: was incredibly successful. The second mission we took two astronauts 178 00:12:02,000 --> 00:12:06,360 Speaker 2: from Saudi Arabia and first female from the Arab world, 179 00:12:06,360 --> 00:12:11,280 Speaker 2: which was incredible, and one American astronaut. The turred mission, 180 00:12:11,679 --> 00:12:15,880 Speaker 2: it was all with European countries with basically ISA, which 181 00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:19,800 Speaker 2: is the European Space Agency, and we had one astronaut 182 00:12:19,800 --> 00:12:24,079 Speaker 2: from Turkie which was their nil armstrong moment. It was 183 00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:28,640 Speaker 2: first astnaut ever from that country, one from Italy and 184 00:12:28,679 --> 00:12:33,080 Speaker 2: one from Sweden. And this fourth mission, which I'm really 185 00:12:33,120 --> 00:12:35,440 Speaker 2: proud of, for the first time, we were able to 186 00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:40,480 Speaker 2: take an astronaut from India and one from Poland and 187 00:12:40,559 --> 00:12:44,400 Speaker 2: one from a country of Hungary. Again for each of 188 00:12:44,440 --> 00:12:48,320 Speaker 2: these countries it was their nil Armstrong moment and their 189 00:12:48,400 --> 00:12:52,800 Speaker 2: astronaut who successfully came back are really heroes in that country. 190 00:12:53,320 --> 00:12:56,920 Speaker 2: In India, Okay, there's one point four billion people in 191 00:12:56,920 --> 00:13:00,320 Speaker 2: India who are tuning into this mission. There are three 192 00:13:00,360 --> 00:13:03,960 Speaker 2: hundred and fifty million people who are under ages sixteen 193 00:13:04,080 --> 00:13:06,400 Speaker 2: who are tuning this mission. So we were able to 194 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:10,120 Speaker 2: bring these countries together and take them to International Space 195 00:13:10,160 --> 00:13:14,480 Speaker 2: Station for almost twenty days and successfully bring them back. 196 00:13:15,080 --> 00:13:18,840 Speaker 2: And just imagine each of these astronauts were able from 197 00:13:19,160 --> 00:13:22,439 Speaker 2: International Space Station to talk to the students in the 198 00:13:22,440 --> 00:13:27,120 Speaker 2: respective countries and really inspire them to be able to 199 00:13:27,160 --> 00:13:30,239 Speaker 2: grow the space economy and people get in the engineering, 200 00:13:30,320 --> 00:13:33,359 Speaker 2: science and math. So it was pretty remarkable. 201 00:13:34,160 --> 00:13:37,560 Speaker 1: It's astonishing to me, and of course you think about 202 00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:41,599 Speaker 1: for these countries what a great breakthrough it is. And 203 00:13:41,720 --> 00:13:43,960 Speaker 1: now I have somebody they can be proud of who 204 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:46,720 Speaker 1: has been involved. And I think as you developed the 205 00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:50,760 Speaker 1: commercial Space Station, you're going to have many opportunities to 206 00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:54,520 Speaker 1: integrate other countries and to be involved in very different 207 00:13:54,520 --> 00:13:57,600 Speaker 1: than the International Space Station, which is essentially political, but 208 00:13:57,679 --> 00:14:01,360 Speaker 1: this will actually be classically a bit business kind of arrangement. 209 00:14:01,840 --> 00:14:07,480 Speaker 1: But you also have done an extraordinary number of scientific 210 00:14:07,520 --> 00:14:12,560 Speaker 1: studies that have been carried out by Axiom Space, who 211 00:14:12,600 --> 00:14:13,240 Speaker 1: pays for all that. 212 00:14:14,360 --> 00:14:17,640 Speaker 2: One of the key things, mister speaker, that our country 213 00:14:17,720 --> 00:14:22,240 Speaker 2: has that we haven't really capitalized on is the capital markets, right, 214 00:14:22,720 --> 00:14:26,640 Speaker 2: and when NASA announced that we're not building another space station, 215 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:29,080 Speaker 2: we were able to go to capital markets and raise 216 00:14:29,240 --> 00:14:32,240 Speaker 2: enormous amount of money. And so when we are able 217 00:14:32,280 --> 00:14:36,360 Speaker 2: as a government to provide clear signals right as to 218 00:14:36,440 --> 00:14:40,400 Speaker 2: where we're going, that's our huge strength. So we paid 219 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:44,560 Speaker 2: for all of that. Now, remember we charge our astronauts 220 00:14:44,640 --> 00:14:46,920 Speaker 2: that we take to space. And now most of our 221 00:14:46,960 --> 00:14:50,560 Speaker 2: dealing is with the countries, right, and this is also 222 00:14:50,600 --> 00:14:53,840 Speaker 2: an incredible soft power thing, you know, by being able 223 00:14:53,880 --> 00:14:56,800 Speaker 2: to bring all these countries together and they go in 224 00:14:56,840 --> 00:15:00,480 Speaker 2: the future to our space station. But we're also working 225 00:15:00,520 --> 00:15:04,840 Speaker 2: with different organizations, like we've been working with Amazon on 226 00:15:05,080 --> 00:15:09,440 Speaker 2: orbital data centers. We're working with different pharmaceuticals on the 227 00:15:09,480 --> 00:15:13,400 Speaker 2: pharmaceutical activities, and we're going to be working with different 228 00:15:13,520 --> 00:15:19,440 Speaker 2: organization in semiconductors. Were also work with educational institutions, and 229 00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:23,200 Speaker 2: we have a very tight collaboration with government as well. 230 00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:28,800 Speaker 2: So we're bringing government, transportation, industry and different industries together 231 00:15:28,920 --> 00:15:33,560 Speaker 2: to create this incredible ecosystem, new economy that we're creating. 232 00:15:33,880 --> 00:15:35,520 Speaker 1: One of the things I thought was most interesting was 233 00:15:35,520 --> 00:15:39,400 Speaker 1: that Axiom has partnered with Oakley to design the visor 234 00:15:39,480 --> 00:15:43,240 Speaker 1: system for the extra vehicular mobility, which is the one 235 00:15:43,240 --> 00:15:46,240 Speaker 1: that'll run around on the surface of the Moon. Oakley, 236 00:15:46,280 --> 00:15:51,040 Speaker 1: of course, just at their fiftieth anniversary celebration and it's 237 00:15:51,080 --> 00:15:54,600 Speaker 1: sun lessons. It's a common commercial property. How do you 238 00:15:54,640 --> 00:15:56,520 Speaker 1: come to pick oaklim It's a very cool thing. 239 00:15:56,560 --> 00:16:01,120 Speaker 2: I think it's not as Oakley mister speaks. We also 240 00:16:01,200 --> 00:16:06,520 Speaker 2: have partnered with Product in Italy, which made a lot 241 00:16:06,560 --> 00:16:09,840 Speaker 2: of noise, and in fact, we took our spacesuit and 242 00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 2: not long ago in Milan and showed you that the galleria, 243 00:16:13,960 --> 00:16:17,360 Speaker 2: which made a lot of noise. We partnered with many 244 00:16:17,400 --> 00:16:21,760 Speaker 2: other organizations in addition to Oakley and Product. But you know, 245 00:16:22,040 --> 00:16:25,160 Speaker 2: this is the beauty of a commercial We're creating a 246 00:16:25,240 --> 00:16:29,400 Speaker 2: commercial space station, and I think by having these partners 247 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:33,000 Speaker 2: in like Oakley, so in addition to space station, let 248 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:35,960 Speaker 2: me just say that we're building the spacesuit. We're the 249 00:16:36,080 --> 00:16:40,680 Speaker 2: sole provider our spacesuit for our the Mis program, which 250 00:16:40,720 --> 00:16:44,760 Speaker 2: is this new set of organizations are countries that have 251 00:16:44,840 --> 00:16:48,640 Speaker 2: gotten together to go to the Moon and all of that. 252 00:16:49,360 --> 00:16:52,080 Speaker 2: So we're the single provider. And then what the thing 253 00:16:52,120 --> 00:16:56,120 Speaker 2: that we noticed is okay for the visors if you will, 254 00:16:56,160 --> 00:16:59,120 Speaker 2: for the spacesuit, there would be a natural place to 255 00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:03,040 Speaker 2: sort of partner with someone who's into doing glasses and 256 00:17:03,080 --> 00:17:06,240 Speaker 2: things like that. And I will tell you that Oakley 257 00:17:06,280 --> 00:17:09,439 Speaker 2: is interested even partnering with us on the space station piece. 258 00:17:10,000 --> 00:17:13,640 Speaker 2: In addition to this spacesuit. The material that we use 259 00:17:13,680 --> 00:17:17,520 Speaker 2: for spacesuit, this is what attracted product and in fact, 260 00:17:17,520 --> 00:17:19,879 Speaker 2: they're creating a new line of business that is the 261 00:17:19,920 --> 00:17:24,600 Speaker 2: space related And we have so many other organizations that 262 00:17:24,640 --> 00:17:27,439 Speaker 2: we have in mind to partner with. And this is 263 00:17:27,480 --> 00:17:31,800 Speaker 2: also offsets are cost by creating this partner, just imagine 264 00:17:31,800 --> 00:17:36,400 Speaker 2: how much advertisement product gets and Oakley gets and by 265 00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:40,440 Speaker 2: the way, an intuitive machine. We partner with Columbia Clothing 266 00:17:41,119 --> 00:17:44,600 Speaker 2: and they've created this new generation of clothing that is 267 00:17:45,040 --> 00:17:49,080 Speaker 2: space sort of related and they featured our moon landing 268 00:17:49,600 --> 00:17:52,760 Speaker 2: on the sphere in Vegas for three days. So I 269 00:17:52,800 --> 00:17:57,280 Speaker 2: think bringing these industries together not only is a successful business, 270 00:17:57,359 --> 00:18:00,679 Speaker 2: is also fun and so win win not only for 271 00:18:00,800 --> 00:18:01,880 Speaker 2: us but also for them. 272 00:18:02,320 --> 00:18:06,720 Speaker 1: The Texas Space Commission recently awarded Actioniom Space five and 273 00:18:06,760 --> 00:18:09,560 Speaker 1: a half million dollars to support the orbital data center. 274 00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:11,800 Speaker 1: What is an orbital data center? 275 00:18:12,280 --> 00:18:15,760 Speaker 2: Okay, so think about a data center on Earth, right, 276 00:18:15,880 --> 00:18:20,080 Speaker 2: like Amazon or Google, all of them, Ora Cale, they 277 00:18:20,080 --> 00:18:25,159 Speaker 2: have data centers, right. Sam Offman recently was on a 278 00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:28,679 Speaker 2: podcast and he said, the future data center is going 279 00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:32,560 Speaker 2: to be built in space, right, rather than build on Earth. 280 00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:36,000 Speaker 2: So we're sort of the pioneer. We're at the front 281 00:18:36,080 --> 00:18:40,119 Speaker 2: runner in creating this, and so we submitted a proposal 282 00:18:40,200 --> 00:18:43,960 Speaker 2: to Texas Commission. And so the idea is, create all 283 00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:48,120 Speaker 2: these nodes, if you will, that are network together and 284 00:18:48,480 --> 00:18:52,440 Speaker 2: create an environment where you have data centers that are 285 00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:55,879 Speaker 2: in space. Just think about it. When you have a 286 00:18:55,960 --> 00:18:58,520 Speaker 2: data center, what are the two most things that you 287 00:18:58,600 --> 00:19:02,199 Speaker 2: need other than the computing power? You need power obviously 288 00:19:02,960 --> 00:19:06,160 Speaker 2: to be able to power these AI chips and everything else, 289 00:19:06,280 --> 00:19:09,240 Speaker 2: but you also need to remove the heat. So one 290 00:19:09,280 --> 00:19:11,719 Speaker 2: of the things that space has is because the cooling 291 00:19:11,760 --> 00:19:15,800 Speaker 2: effect of it, you can dissipate the heat. And one 292 00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:18,480 Speaker 2: of the other things, mister speaker, you and I've discussed 293 00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:22,439 Speaker 2: is using the nuclear power. And so I'm working really 294 00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:27,040 Speaker 2: really hard to be able to build nuclear electric proportion. 295 00:19:27,240 --> 00:19:31,000 Speaker 2: We're also working on nuclear thermal propulsion, but with nuclear 296 00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:37,320 Speaker 2: electric proportion you will really enable incredible power in low orbit, 297 00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:40,840 Speaker 2: but also for the surface of the Moon or going 298 00:19:40,880 --> 00:19:43,679 Speaker 2: to Mars and all of that. When you're able to 299 00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:46,399 Speaker 2: do that, you have this orbital data center in space 300 00:19:46,840 --> 00:19:50,520 Speaker 2: where you can have incredible processing power. Think a bit 301 00:19:50,560 --> 00:19:54,160 Speaker 2: in the future. Right now, when we have assets in orbit, 302 00:19:54,720 --> 00:19:58,160 Speaker 2: were basically sending the data down to the ground, right. 303 00:19:58,240 --> 00:20:01,000 Speaker 2: The satellites areware to capture and we do all the 304 00:20:01,040 --> 00:20:04,840 Speaker 2: processing of a data on the ground. Right. But think 305 00:20:04,880 --> 00:20:06,800 Speaker 2: about in the future where we can all of that 306 00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:10,560 Speaker 2: in space, and so when you have compute power space, 307 00:20:10,640 --> 00:20:12,680 Speaker 2: you can do all of those things and just send 308 00:20:12,840 --> 00:20:16,800 Speaker 2: useful information to the ground. This also has huge implication 309 00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:19,199 Speaker 2: for the Golden Dome as we're thinking about it, to 310 00:20:19,280 --> 00:20:23,479 Speaker 2: have data centers that are not underground. From the defense perspective. 311 00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:42,960 Speaker 1: I've recently written a paper called Trump Time and Trump 312 00:20:43,040 --> 00:20:47,960 Speaker 1: Savings making this argument that there's private sector behavior that's 313 00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:54,160 Speaker 1: almost inherently more creative, faster, and less expensive than government bureaucracies, 314 00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:57,000 Speaker 1: which requires thinking about how you build a team, how 315 00:20:57,000 --> 00:20:59,480 Speaker 1: you recruit people. You have so many things going on 316 00:20:59,520 --> 00:21:04,080 Speaker 1: under radiove and creative, how do you go about building 317 00:21:04,080 --> 00:21:06,439 Speaker 1: your teams and thinking through who you want to recruit. 318 00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:11,160 Speaker 2: That's such a big deal, mister speaker, and you're absolutely right. 319 00:21:11,480 --> 00:21:14,640 Speaker 2: One of the things that I say is culture its 320 00:21:14,680 --> 00:21:19,359 Speaker 2: strategy for breakfast. And I think if I have one strength, 321 00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:23,679 Speaker 2: God's given me this ability to recognize talent. And I've 322 00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:27,880 Speaker 2: surrounded myself with people much smarter than myself. In fact, 323 00:21:27,920 --> 00:21:32,080 Speaker 2: they make me look good. But finding right people in 324 00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:37,159 Speaker 2: the organizations that are talented and have a source of 325 00:21:37,400 --> 00:21:41,800 Speaker 2: urgency and getting things done is really really important. I 326 00:21:41,800 --> 00:21:44,080 Speaker 2: would share this idea. There's one of the books that 327 00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:46,200 Speaker 2: I read long time ago. It's called Good to Great 328 00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:50,960 Speaker 2: and Good to Great uses this example of building a 329 00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:54,320 Speaker 2: successful company is like a bus going from one place 330 00:21:54,359 --> 00:21:58,040 Speaker 2: to another. So you want to find right people you 331 00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:02,400 Speaker 2: bring to the bus one number two, I find them 332 00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:06,280 Speaker 2: the right seats. That's really important because one person maybe 333 00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:08,199 Speaker 2: doing a good thing and one thing I may not 334 00:22:08,240 --> 00:22:10,400 Speaker 2: be able to good thing and other thing. And the 335 00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:14,840 Speaker 2: third piece, which is not happening within the government, is 336 00:22:14,880 --> 00:22:17,600 Speaker 2: to get the wrong people off the bus. So I 337 00:22:17,640 --> 00:22:20,760 Speaker 2: think these are the three things right, finding the right 338 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:23,320 Speaker 2: people in the bus, get them the right seat. And 339 00:22:23,359 --> 00:22:27,240 Speaker 2: then if you have right talent, you really can create miracles, 340 00:22:27,600 --> 00:22:30,120 Speaker 2: and if you have a wrong talent, you go backwards. 341 00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:32,199 Speaker 2: So I think to be able to do that is 342 00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:34,320 Speaker 2: the key to have successful companies. 343 00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:36,440 Speaker 1: I don't know if you're the first person ever said, 344 00:22:36,440 --> 00:22:40,440 Speaker 1: but I just wrote down culture each strategy for Breakfast 345 00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:42,679 Speaker 1: because I think it's true and it's one of the 346 00:22:42,680 --> 00:22:45,439 Speaker 1: great weaknesses and stuff I do as I probably focus 347 00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:48,240 Speaker 1: too much on strategy and not enough on culture. It's 348 00:22:48,240 --> 00:22:50,160 Speaker 1: a brilliant concept on your part. 349 00:22:50,840 --> 00:22:53,560 Speaker 2: Thank you. And I really believe that the culture I 350 00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:56,879 Speaker 2: call it is like the foundation, mister speaker. So if 351 00:22:56,920 --> 00:22:59,200 Speaker 2: you're building a house, if you don't have a good foundation, 352 00:23:00,200 --> 00:23:03,080 Speaker 2: the house is not going to stay right. The culture 353 00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:06,240 Speaker 2: is like a foundation. You've got to have that strong 354 00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:09,800 Speaker 2: foundation you build and then you build your company on 355 00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:12,600 Speaker 2: top of that. And when we talk about culture, it's 356 00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:16,199 Speaker 2: not just culture of integrity and ethics, but culture of 357 00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:21,720 Speaker 2: being successful, cultural execution, culture of winning, culture of delivering, 358 00:23:22,200 --> 00:23:24,960 Speaker 2: culture of returning one to your investors. Things like that 359 00:23:25,080 --> 00:23:26,920 Speaker 2: I think are enormously important. 360 00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:31,000 Speaker 1: Back in January this year, in Space News you an 361 00:23:31,040 --> 00:23:35,680 Speaker 1: article you said we are shifting from government lead to 362 00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:40,359 Speaker 1: commercial lead activities of planet, which I agree with. Describe 363 00:23:40,480 --> 00:23:43,439 Speaker 1: what do you mean by that transition and why is 364 00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:44,120 Speaker 1: it important? 365 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:51,520 Speaker 2: In the past From the space perspective, NASA owned the rockets, moonlanders, 366 00:23:51,760 --> 00:23:55,720 Speaker 2: spacesuit everything else. And so one of the things that 367 00:23:55,960 --> 00:24:00,560 Speaker 2: I think was really clever that happened is by NASA's saying, well, 368 00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:05,840 Speaker 2: let's utilize commercial industry to sort as a force multiplier 369 00:24:05,920 --> 00:24:08,560 Speaker 2: to be able to do things. And I think that 370 00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:11,600 Speaker 2: was the beginning of the SpaceX, right, And that's how 371 00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:15,439 Speaker 2: SpaceX as a commercial space was developed. And it was 372 00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:18,440 Speaker 2: a breakthrough, right, I mean what SpaceX is done and 373 00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:22,480 Speaker 2: now Blue Origin is doing, and many other commercial space 374 00:24:22,560 --> 00:24:27,080 Speaker 2: company from the transportation perspective like rocket Lab, Firefly, so 375 00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:30,760 Speaker 2: on and so forth. And then NASA later on came 376 00:24:30,800 --> 00:24:33,359 Speaker 2: in and says, well, we no longer want to be 377 00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:36,480 Speaker 2: the tenant. Were no longer want to be the landlord. 378 00:24:36,520 --> 00:24:39,680 Speaker 2: We want to be the tenant. So that's how actually 379 00:24:39,720 --> 00:24:43,520 Speaker 2: the contract was awarded to this for the moonlander business, 380 00:24:44,320 --> 00:24:49,120 Speaker 2: and we were able newt to develop a moon Lander 381 00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:55,960 Speaker 2: in four years. We conceive, designed, build, operated, and landed 382 00:24:56,040 --> 00:24:58,959 Speaker 2: successfully on the surface of the Moon four hundred and 383 00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:03,439 Speaker 2: eighteen million dollars. So when you go to the commercial world, 384 00:25:03,600 --> 00:25:08,320 Speaker 2: you can really reduce the cost and scarcity is the 385 00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:11,080 Speaker 2: moderate innovation, and you come up with there is all 386 00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:15,040 Speaker 2: this really innovation how to do different things. And I 387 00:25:15,080 --> 00:25:19,400 Speaker 2: think that we are shifting from a government led sort 388 00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:23,800 Speaker 2: of space industry to more of a commercial space industry. 389 00:25:23,840 --> 00:25:26,480 Speaker 2: And I think that's a breath of fresh air and 390 00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:30,960 Speaker 2: it's going to grow rapidly and create an economic move But. 391 00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:35,400 Speaker 1: When you think about this, as you migrate from a 392 00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:39,760 Speaker 1: bureaucratically government dominant system to a commercial market or in 393 00:25:39,880 --> 00:25:43,800 Speaker 1: its system, seems to me there's a real danger that 394 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:49,520 Speaker 1: NASA doesn't quite understand how urgent it is if we're 395 00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:53,679 Speaker 1: going to keep people in space to get this commercial 396 00:25:53,720 --> 00:26:00,159 Speaker 1: station done before the International Station inevitably disappears. What do 397 00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:03,560 Speaker 1: you think of the key steps not just for NASA, 398 00:26:03,880 --> 00:26:09,000 Speaker 1: but for the Trump administration and acquiring the clarity that 399 00:26:09,080 --> 00:26:13,800 Speaker 1: will guarantee that the new replacement commercial space station is 400 00:26:13,880 --> 00:26:18,119 Speaker 1: ready before the end of the life of the International 401 00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:18,680 Speaker 1: Space Station. 402 00:26:19,720 --> 00:26:21,919 Speaker 2: I'm so glad you asked that question, because that's a 403 00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:25,639 Speaker 2: critical question we need as a country to ask ourselves 404 00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:29,720 Speaker 2: this question, are we going to be a dominant space 405 00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:34,560 Speaker 2: country and a front runner or not? And we have 406 00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:38,800 Speaker 2: incredible competition from China. Let's just talk about space station 407 00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:43,080 Speaker 2: for a second. Chinese today have a space station in orbit. 408 00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:46,199 Speaker 2: Our space station is going to go away by the 409 00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:49,920 Speaker 2: end of the decade, in my opinion, if you want 410 00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:52,800 Speaker 2: to keep our dominance in space, and this is bigger 411 00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:56,120 Speaker 2: than just a space station. This is including the Moon, 412 00:26:56,280 --> 00:27:01,840 Speaker 2: including defense technology, all of that space defense technology. If 413 00:27:01,840 --> 00:27:03,520 Speaker 2: we're going to say that we're going to have that, 414 00:27:04,600 --> 00:27:07,560 Speaker 2: then we've got to do things differently than we've done before. 415 00:27:08,200 --> 00:27:11,240 Speaker 2: So space station is retiring by the end of the decade. 416 00:27:11,400 --> 00:27:14,480 Speaker 2: We need to figure out as a country, how do 417 00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:17,280 Speaker 2: we have a space station in orbit before the space 418 00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:21,760 Speaker 2: station retires and have a continuous human presence and space 419 00:27:21,800 --> 00:27:26,280 Speaker 2: operation and be a dominant force in this new economy 420 00:27:26,280 --> 00:27:29,800 Speaker 2: that I'm talking about. This economy could be a multi 421 00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:33,080 Speaker 2: billion dollars new economy in Lord orbit that I think 422 00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:37,520 Speaker 2: is a hidden gem that people don't quite realize. And 423 00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:40,199 Speaker 2: so I think we need to figure out by the 424 00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:42,920 Speaker 2: end of this decade how do we do that. And 425 00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:45,879 Speaker 2: I have tell you the only company who's to spend 426 00:27:45,880 --> 00:27:50,080 Speaker 2: eight hundred million dollars developing hardware and ready to make 427 00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:53,560 Speaker 2: this happen is my company, Axiom Space, and we're ready 428 00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:55,960 Speaker 2: to make this happen. I think we need to have 429 00:27:56,040 --> 00:28:00,200 Speaker 2: this sense of urgency from the governor perspective and say, 430 00:28:01,160 --> 00:28:06,399 Speaker 2: let's not lose our space dominance to Chinese. Let's figure 431 00:28:06,400 --> 00:28:09,359 Speaker 2: out whatever we need to do so that we have 432 00:28:09,440 --> 00:28:13,640 Speaker 2: a space station in orbit before ISS retires. 433 00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:17,320 Speaker 1: It seems to me that's this year problem, It's not 434 00:28:17,359 --> 00:28:18,840 Speaker 1: a twenty thirty problem. 435 00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:22,720 Speaker 2: Absolutely. I am really happy that we have an acting 436 00:28:22,760 --> 00:28:27,520 Speaker 2: administery Sean Duffy, that was making good decisions. I'm personally 437 00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:31,399 Speaker 2: willing to support the activity away from my companies, is 438 00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:35,600 Speaker 2: what's right for our country to push their space economy forward. 439 00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:39,040 Speaker 1: Yeah. I had a very good conversation with Secretary definitely 440 00:28:39,120 --> 00:28:42,040 Speaker 1: right after he had announced that we would put a 441 00:28:42,120 --> 00:28:46,200 Speaker 1: US reactor operationally on the Moon by twenty thirty, and 442 00:28:46,280 --> 00:28:49,880 Speaker 1: I was very impressed with his general approach, his understanding. 443 00:28:49,880 --> 00:28:52,360 Speaker 1: When you realize that he's running the Department of Transportation, 444 00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:57,080 Speaker 1: launching the rebuilding of the entire air traffic control system, 445 00:28:57,440 --> 00:29:00,600 Speaker 1: and temporarily in charge of NASA. His rasp of the 446 00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:03,400 Speaker 1: Nazi issues, I thought, and his willingness to cut through 447 00:29:03,400 --> 00:29:05,920 Speaker 1: the bureaucracy was very very encouraging. 448 00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:11,200 Speaker 2: I wholeheartedly agree. And I'm so glad you talk about 449 00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:14,880 Speaker 2: space nuclear, mister speaker, because if we're going to have 450 00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:18,040 Speaker 2: a colony on the Moon and we're going to have 451 00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:21,680 Speaker 2: a habitat on the surface the Moon, space nuclear and 452 00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:27,720 Speaker 2: fission surface power, which Secretary Duffy announced is critical. Look, 453 00:29:27,760 --> 00:29:30,560 Speaker 2: if we're going to have people living there, we need oxygen, 454 00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:33,840 Speaker 2: we need to power things, and you know, with the 455 00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:38,120 Speaker 2: temperatures going to minus two hundred civic degrees fahrenheit in 456 00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:41,800 Speaker 2: the moon lunaris, the only way that we're going to 457 00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:46,480 Speaker 2: have power to be able to create fuel, create habitat, 458 00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:49,640 Speaker 2: to have a presence on the surface the Moon is 459 00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:53,160 Speaker 2: with nuclear power. That's sort of having a nuclear power 460 00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:56,280 Speaker 2: the surface the Moon that a Securary Duffy announced. But 461 00:29:56,320 --> 00:29:59,720 Speaker 2: also let's take this one step further. We can shorten 462 00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:03,880 Speaker 2: the extensive going to Mars by two thirds. If you 463 00:30:03,960 --> 00:30:08,200 Speaker 2: have nuclear thermal proportion, you have nuclear electric propultion. This 464 00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:11,640 Speaker 2: is a game changer. How we can really accelerate to 465 00:30:11,680 --> 00:30:14,920 Speaker 2: be able to do things and my dream is eventually 466 00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:18,200 Speaker 2: be able to use these technologies to go to other 467 00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:20,200 Speaker 2: stars outside of our Solar system. 468 00:30:20,480 --> 00:30:24,280 Speaker 1: That may be next generation, but frankly, if we could 469 00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:30,320 Speaker 1: get near Earth operating at its highest tempo with tourism, manufacturing, 470 00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:34,640 Speaker 1: scientific research, and then develop a real presence on the Moon, 471 00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:37,560 Speaker 1: not just a visit, but much like we do. A 472 00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:40,160 Speaker 1: friend of mine pointed out that we have huge impact 473 00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:43,440 Speaker 1: in Antarctica because every summer we put three thousand people 474 00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:47,040 Speaker 1: down there. So for ourn initial goal was fifty or 475 00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:50,000 Speaker 1: one hundred people on the Moon permanently, with rotating in 476 00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:52,800 Speaker 1: new people as the others come out, and then you 477 00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:55,640 Speaker 1: can be in to think about Mars and beyond that 478 00:30:55,720 --> 00:31:01,120 Speaker 1: about asteroid mining. Now you have a full first generation creating. 479 00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:03,160 Speaker 1: I like to think of it as creating a space 480 00:31:03,240 --> 00:31:07,280 Speaker 1: faring nation. We've been ceafaring for our history, and now 481 00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:09,960 Speaker 1: we're going to have being space faring. And it's important 482 00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:13,000 Speaker 1: because it seems to me it's important for freedom to 483 00:31:13,080 --> 00:31:14,200 Speaker 1: be the lead in space. 484 00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:19,160 Speaker 2: Absolutely, I could not agree with you more. And it 485 00:31:19,240 --> 00:31:23,240 Speaker 2: is so important is the next frontier is the final frontier, 486 00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:28,280 Speaker 2: and we need to have American dominance there. And I 487 00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:32,800 Speaker 2: believe that combining space with nuclear is the way to 488 00:31:32,840 --> 00:31:36,480 Speaker 2: get there in order for us to have permanent presence, 489 00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:39,760 Speaker 2: whether on the surface of the Moon or Mars, and 490 00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:42,600 Speaker 2: be able to also travel to other bodies in a 491 00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:44,520 Speaker 2: much shorter time that we're doing today. 492 00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:48,760 Speaker 1: I think you are one of the great pioneers who 493 00:31:48,800 --> 00:31:50,960 Speaker 1: is actually developing all of this. It's very exciting to 494 00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:53,680 Speaker 1: me and a real privilege to know you and to 495 00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:57,440 Speaker 1: watch your work and to realize that hell endlessly I 496 00:31:57,440 --> 00:32:00,920 Speaker 1: think here seven days a week of creativity so pretty remarkable. 497 00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:03,280 Speaker 1: I want to thank you for joining me. I want 498 00:32:03,280 --> 00:32:05,800 Speaker 1: to let our listeners know they can find out more 499 00:32:05,840 --> 00:32:10,080 Speaker 1: about axiom Space by visiting axiomspace dot com, which we 500 00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:11,440 Speaker 1: will have on our show page. 501 00:32:12,280 --> 00:32:15,160 Speaker 2: Thank you so much. It was such an honor to 502 00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:18,040 Speaker 2: be part of your program and for people to realize 503 00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:22,480 Speaker 2: that other than your incredible was an incredible politician and 504 00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:26,000 Speaker 2: Speaker of the House. You have such a keen intellectual 505 00:32:26,080 --> 00:32:28,960 Speaker 2: mind for things like space and nuclear and other things. 506 00:32:29,320 --> 00:32:31,280 Speaker 2: It's just such a pleasure. Thank you so much. 507 00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:39,000 Speaker 1: Thank you to my guest, Cam Gafarium. You can learn 508 00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:42,600 Speaker 1: more about axiom Space on our show page at newtsworld 509 00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:46,840 Speaker 1: dot com. Newtsworld is produced by Ganinglish, Sweet sixty and iHeartMedia. 510 00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:51,400 Speaker 1: Our executive producer is Guarnsey Sloan. Our researcher is Rachel Peterson. 511 00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:54,680 Speaker 1: The artwork for the show was created by Steve Penley. 512 00:32:55,200 --> 00:32:58,400 Speaker 1: Special thanks to the team at Ginglish Sweet sixty. If 513 00:32:58,440 --> 00:33:00,600 Speaker 1: you've been enjoying newts World, I hope you'll go to 514 00:33:00,640 --> 00:33:03,720 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts and both rate us with five stars and 515 00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:06,040 Speaker 1: give us a review so others can learn what it's 516 00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:09,400 Speaker 1: all about. Right now, listeners of newts World consigned for 517 00:33:09,520 --> 00:33:13,720 Speaker 1: my three free weekly columns at GINGRISHO sixty dot com 518 00:33:13,760 --> 00:33:17,360 Speaker 1: slash newsletter. I'm Newt Gingrich. This is Newtsworld.