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Speaker 1: Welcome to the solid verbal Hell for.

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Speaker 2: Me, I'm a man, I'm for I've heard so many

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Speaker 2: players say, I want to be happy. You want to

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Speaker 2: be happy for Dake Edith Steak is that woo woom?

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Speaker 1: And Tom this is your captain tie He'll don't brand

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Speaker 1: that fine gentleman over there as always the first mate,

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Speaker 1: Dan Rubinstein. Look, it's the off season, Dan, Yeah, and

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Speaker 1: we were thinking here this morning. Why not now, why

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Speaker 1: not take another ride on the two's cruise in the

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Speaker 1: middle of February on President's Day? Sir, how are you good?

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Speaker 2: It's icy out here. I'm not gonna lie. I'm glad

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Speaker 2: I brought my college football scarf of choice. It's uh,

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Speaker 2: it's chili. There's a little bit of a breeze. I

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Speaker 2: don't love the fact that we're out here on the

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Speaker 2: stern bow sure, starboard side port. But I always love

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Speaker 2: getting aauticle with these episodes, And because the off season,

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Speaker 2: especially early on in the off season, is a time

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Speaker 2: in which there is so much change and there is

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Speaker 2: so much to sort out. And it'll happen again right

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Speaker 2: with the portal season happening after and during spring practice

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Speaker 2: there will be more to sort out. But I think

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Speaker 2: what becomes very in vogue, very popular, is to look

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Speaker 2: at like winners and losers of the portal, winners and

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Speaker 2: losers of like the coaching higher sees. Jonathan Smith is

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Speaker 2: an A. Jeff Levy's a B minus. Okay, cool, congratulating.

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Speaker 2: We went we went back and we.

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Speaker 1: Looked at we won't name names, but some other rankings

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Speaker 1: that had been given, some other grades that had been

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Speaker 1: given not just for this round but for many of

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Speaker 1: the previous rounds on the coaching cam cell. And they're

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Speaker 1: almost always wrong, very wrong. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Look, and this is all to say if we were

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Speaker 2: to give grades, they'd be equally wrong.

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Speaker 1: Correct, right, correct.

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Speaker 2: But it is like that trope where you're like, okay,

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Speaker 2: I'm giving Kaylin de Boor at Washington in twenty twenty one.

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Speaker 1: A C plus.

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Speaker 2: Okay, why But like it's one of those things where

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Speaker 2: it's arbitrary, it's random, and it means very little because

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Speaker 2: it's one person's sort of abstract opinion. A lot of

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Speaker 2: it has to do with name recognition, like Jonathan Smith

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Speaker 2: and Michigan State isn't a because look at what he

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Speaker 2: did with less in Oregon State. He'll have more resources,

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Speaker 2: like Okay, maybe maybe what I want to talk about today, though,

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Speaker 2: in the vein of our two's cruise universe, is not

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Speaker 2: as much the like as an authority giving a grade,

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Speaker 2: giving a number, giving a whatever with a you know,

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Speaker 2: kaylen to Born, Alabama with Manny Diaz to do what

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Speaker 2: have you? I want to look at some ripples, some reverberations,

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Speaker 2: some waves, some vacuums than tack. You can multipurpose that

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Speaker 2: sound yeah, of course Fran Brown at Syracuse right, like

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Speaker 2: that has happened. Okay, So instead of deciding on something

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Speaker 2: that we have almost no data about, you can look

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Speaker 2: at like early portal and recruiting returns and coaching hires.

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Speaker 2: But doesn't really mean that much. But what does it

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Speaker 2: mean that Syracuse moved on from Dino Babers? What does

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Speaker 2: it mean for the teams that Syracuse recruits against Syracuse

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Speaker 2: plays against? What does it mean for the ACC in

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Speaker 2: terms of watchability? What is you know? Holistically? What do

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Speaker 2: these moves mean? More in a more indirect way to me,

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Speaker 2: is almost as if not more interesting than slapping a

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Speaker 2: B minus next to France.

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Speaker 1: Right, So so case in point, yeah, case in point here,

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Speaker 1: just as I think think the most relevant example, this

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Speaker 1: is the one that you and I discussed in slack

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Speaker 1: before we hit go. Nick Saban retires. Yeah, Nick Saban retires.

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Speaker 1: We've talked a lot about the power vacuum that that

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Speaker 1: creates in college football in the SEC, among the teams

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Speaker 1: in the old SEC West. Clearly, him exiting means a

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Speaker 1: lot for all the other teams that have driven themselves

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Speaker 1: batty trying to compete with Alabama all these years. Certainly

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Speaker 1: that is an indirect benefit, let's say, consequence in some way,

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Speaker 1: shape or form for other teams outside of Alabama. Yes,

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Speaker 1: this is what we're going forward.

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Speaker 2: So let's start there. Let's start at the top. Okay,

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Speaker 2: let's start with the waves, the ripples, the indirect happenings

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Speaker 2: based on they're being not just a new coach at Alabama,

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Speaker 2: but Nick Saban not being a college football coach in

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Speaker 2: the SEC and at all.

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Speaker 1: Well, I mean, the most obvious thing I think is

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Speaker 1: we have grown accustomed to making Alabama. I mean I

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Speaker 1: certainly have. It was part of why I picked him

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Speaker 1: in the playoff, right. We have grown very accustomed to

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Speaker 1: penciling Alabama in as the winner of game against X. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: they're the standard They have been the standard bearer in

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Speaker 1: college football for you know, almost the entire duration that

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Speaker 1: Saban's been there. The fact that he has gone, I

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Speaker 1: think for us as fans, and we can talk about

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Speaker 1: programs and recruiting and all that, but just for us

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Speaker 1: as fans, it means that we can't do that penciling

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Speaker 1: in anymore. I think Kaylen de Boor is a great coach,

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Speaker 1: but to your point from earlier, I don't know if

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Speaker 1: we can. It feels like an a. It doesn't feel

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Speaker 1: like they were going to do a whole lot better

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Speaker 1: than Kaylen de Bor. It's hard to go up from Saban.

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Speaker 1: So is Kaylen de Bor a good higher shore It

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Speaker 1: makes sense. I understand why they'd want to hire him.

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Speaker 1: I do think though Nick Saban comes around once in

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Speaker 1: a generation. There's the reason he's the greatest of all time.

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Speaker 1: We're not going to be able to pencil in Alabama

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Speaker 1: the way that we could before, and that I think

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Speaker 1: is actually something in that is real consequence for you

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Speaker 1: and I for college football fans as a whole, especially

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Speaker 1: with so much else changing around college football. We have

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Speaker 1: grown so accustomed to Alabama just kind of being it

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Speaker 1: all the time. The fact that they are not there

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Speaker 1: right now creates a huge void, a huge void, and

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Speaker 1: also indirectly makes Alabama, I think, more interesting, right, because

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Speaker 1: how many times have you and I hit record on

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Speaker 1: this show and gotten feedback from folks who are kind

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Speaker 1: of tired of talking about Alabama. You know, if you're

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Speaker 1: an Alabama fan, that's probably not the case. But if

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Speaker 1: you're a fan of anybody else, it did sort of

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Speaker 1: become old hat. They were just always good. They still,

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Speaker 1: I'm sure will be fine, but as a result, indirectly,

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Speaker 1: Alabama becomes more interesting this fall. Right, I don't think

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Speaker 1: there's any two ways about it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, in a couple of Okay, so you can think

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Speaker 2: about it in a couple of different ways. Like Alabama

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Speaker 2: became more and more interesting the more they won, not

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Speaker 2: just not because of the results, but because what Nick

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Speaker 2: Saban did was unprecedented. So they they became more interesting.

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Speaker 2: Not in the like, oh what do they look like

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Speaker 2: in January? Are they winning another national championship? But you're like,

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Speaker 2: how the hell did Nick Saban do this? How does

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Speaker 2: he keep it going, how does he keep the energy up?

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Speaker 2: How does he keep hiring new guys to fill out

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Speaker 2: his coaching staff, How does he keep the energy up

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Speaker 2: on the recruiting trail, Like that's a fascinating thing. Sure,

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Speaker 2: but it might be more fascinating to people like you

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Speaker 2: and I than somebody at Tennessee who hates the adulation

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Speaker 2: that Alabama continually gets because of Nick saban in that

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Speaker 2: program's you know, prolonged excellence. And so, yes, the reverberations

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Speaker 2: are you know, the obvious recruiting ones that you know,

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Speaker 2: the rich are going to continue to get, possibly even

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Speaker 2: by tiny little margins richer Georgia, Ohio State, Texas, Texas,

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Speaker 2: A and m you know LSU schools who are already

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Speaker 2: recruiting at a super high level. And maybe you know

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Speaker 2: there are more national recruits than regional recruits. That you know,

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Speaker 2: a kid from the South might go to Notre Dame,

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Speaker 2: might go to Michigan, might go to Oregon, might go

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Speaker 2: to USC when he had previously wanted to he was

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Speaker 2: only going to stay in the South if he got

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Speaker 2: that Alabama off or something like that. Florida States, Florida.

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Speaker 2: So yes, the rich are going to get on the margins,

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Speaker 2: maybe perhaps a little richer, but I think you'll still

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Speaker 2: see a little bit of trickle on the recruiting trail

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Speaker 2: that maybe a tier beneath you know, the top ten,

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Speaker 2: top fifteen that you know, we'll see recruits spread around

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Speaker 2: a little more, just based on the crazy consistent success

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Speaker 2: that Alabama has had acquiring talent, both now in the

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Speaker 2: portal and both excuse me, on the high school level

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Speaker 2: and the portal level. So there's that we talked about,

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Speaker 2: like there are hump teams here that, like Lane Kiffin

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Speaker 2: couldn't get over the Alabama hump. And now it's a

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Speaker 2: twelve team playoff era and a ten and two Ole

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Speaker 2: Miss will seemingly get into a twelve team playoff. But

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Speaker 2: that road, at least in the short term while we

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Speaker 2: wait for Kaylin de Boor to fully build that roster

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Speaker 2: and coaching staff and build that program to where he

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Speaker 2: wants it to be, that the hump becomes less pronounced

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Speaker 2: the Alabama hump.

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Speaker 1: Right, I think so?

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Speaker 2: And so that's which teams fit that to you, Tennessee

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Speaker 2: Probably Auburn, Yeah, yeah, LSU Frank Kelly one in year one.

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Speaker 2: But over time it has not been necessarily a back

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Speaker 2: and forth. I would argue that the new entrance to

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Speaker 2: the SEC that the ongoing storyline and narrative with Texas

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Speaker 2: and Oklahoma is like, well, yeah, you can win in

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Speaker 2: the Big Twelve, but the SEC is a different story.

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Speaker 2: Wait until you have week in, week out, Bama, LSU,

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Speaker 2: you know all miss but and now that list becomes

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Speaker 2: a little less daunting when you're like, wait until you

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Speaker 2: have Caylin de boor Alabama. Right, It's it's different. It

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Speaker 2: is for those types of teams. It is the other

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Speaker 2: element to Nick Saban, if I may is I think

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Speaker 2: it hurts college football because college football has a sort

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Speaker 2: of name issue, name image, like this issue I suppose

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Speaker 2: in that if you primarily like the NBA, if you're like,

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Speaker 2: I'm a huge Raptors fan, but I like sports, and

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Speaker 2: you realize that the National Championship or the playoff is happening,

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Speaker 2: and you're like, well who's playing, and you're like, oh,

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Speaker 2: that's Alabama, Michigan and the Rose Bawl. Cool. I'm gonna

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Speaker 2: roote for Michigan because you know, screw Nick Saban and

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Speaker 2: you know he's the evil Empire. I'm gonna roote for

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Speaker 2: Like Nick Saban was a great villain for this sport

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Speaker 2: that Kirby Small isn't. Dabbo isn't just because of like

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Speaker 2: the mainstream name recognition that Nick Saban has and that

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Speaker 2: nobody else in the sport on that level as a

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Speaker 2: villain to root against, to just generate mainstream interests. Like

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Speaker 2: not having Nick Saban I think hurts the sport. So

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Speaker 2: the sport indirectly or directly is a loser. On his retirement,

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Speaker 2: I think game day is a winner. I think he'll

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Speaker 2: be good on game Day. I think like Julian Edelman's

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Speaker 2: podcast might be a winner, Like Nick Saban's just gonna

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Speaker 2: start appearing on a bunch of podcasts, right, Nick Saban's

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Speaker 2: gonna like sit uncomfortably on Julian Edelman or Travis Kelcey's

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Speaker 2: couch now, right, that's probably gonna happen more often than not. So,

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Speaker 2: you know, good for everybody who has like an awkward

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Speaker 2: Nick Saban on their couch, maybe including us. We'll see,

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Speaker 2: I've got a couch straight to my left eye. I

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Speaker 2: can make something work there. Yeah, and yeah, I guess

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Speaker 2: good for Alabama boosters who wanted more power because they

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Speaker 2: weren't necessarily having their voices heard in the Nick Saban era, because.

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Speaker 1: Why would they.

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Speaker 2: Any other indirect winners or losers.

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Speaker 1: You know. The big one that comes to mind is

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Speaker 1: obviously teams that were accustomed to playing against Saban. The

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Speaker 1: fact that they don't have to do that now, I

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Speaker 1: think opens things up. And whether you're playing against Alabama

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Speaker 1: because you want to win or you're watching because you

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Speaker 1: just want to see something interesting, I think everybody. Everybody

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Speaker 1: benefits from that. I agree with you. I think I

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Speaker 1: think one of the knock on effects from Saban retiring

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Speaker 1: is that game day also becomes a little bit more interesting. Right,

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Speaker 1: You've got the greatest of all time now who is

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Speaker 1: good on camera, who will be on your television sets

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Speaker 1: every Saturday morning in a capacity that allows him to

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Speaker 1: speak freely, which he did a little bit previously, but

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Speaker 1: we'll do a lot more of now. So I think

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Speaker 1: we all win in that aspect. Beyond that, though, you know,

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Speaker 1: I think it's I don't know, just like you said it,

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Speaker 1: losing the villain on the college football front definitely is

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Speaker 1: a new dynamic that we're going to have to get

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Speaker 1: used to.

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Speaker 2: Yea, this sport was Belichick in the NFL, Saban in college.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, the sport works well. When you've got someone are

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Speaker 1: root against my hunches. That'll shift to like Dabbo or

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Speaker 1: Kirby Smart or Ryan Day, like the college football is

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Speaker 1: never short on villains. We will find it was also

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Speaker 1: Harbaugh too, I think Harball. Yeah, I mean, should we

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Speaker 1: talk about Harbaugh next?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm trying to think that there was the other,

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Speaker 2: only other thing about the Saban reverberations. A big winner

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Speaker 2: will be the long term fiscal prospects of the Debor family.

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Speaker 2: I mean, the lake houses, the retirement plans, the realtors,

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Speaker 2: like so many people are going to because look it's

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Speaker 2: if it works out, he's going to be super rich.

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Speaker 2: If it doesn't work out, he's probably going to be

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Speaker 2: super rich. So a big indirect or, I guess more

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Speaker 2: direct results is going to be the life altering generational

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Speaker 2: wealth of the Deboor.

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Speaker 1: Crest before we get to Harball. Actually, this is one

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Speaker 1: other one that I think is worth mentioning. It is

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Speaker 1: clearly not as high impact, all right as Nick Saban

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Speaker 1: walking away from college football. Jeff Hafley walking away from

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Speaker 1: Boston College to go to the NFL. Okay has had

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Speaker 1: extreme knock on effects that we did not see in

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Speaker 1: the moment, right. What happened when Hathley left, When Halfley left.

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Speaker 1: It was amid this ongoing conversation, this trend, this assumption

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Speaker 1: that many folks in college football media and just college

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Speaker 1: football fans made, And that assumption was because the sport

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Speaker 1: is changing, because nil and the transfer portal, and because

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Speaker 1: things are getting complicated, especially for a school like a

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Speaker 1: BC or a PIT or a NC State. I don't know,

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Speaker 1: coaches are going to walk away, Coaches are going to

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Speaker 1: play the too old for this card.

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Speaker 2: They're going to walk away they or they're going to reevalu.

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Speaker 1: What a lateral evaluate quotes, So Halfley leaves. That was

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Speaker 1: all everybody talked about. What we didn't see in that moment.

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Speaker 1: Bill O'Brien walked away from being the offensive coordinator and

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Speaker 1: Dominohia State right walked away. He's going back to his

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Speaker 1: hometown in Boston. He's excited to coach here. Did you

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Speaker 1: see that? That the It was a social media post

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Speaker 1: of like all the white guys with gray hair watching

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Speaker 1: Bill O'Brien give his like introductor. They were all the

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Speaker 1: same guy. Yeah, but everybody's excited for Bill O'Brien coming

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Speaker 1: back home. Okay, that's the first thing. The second thing

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Speaker 1: is all right, now there's a vacancy at Ohio State.

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Speaker 1: Ohio State fills that vacancy with Chip freaking Kelly, which

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Speaker 1: I think is a huge upgrade. Yeah over Bill O'Brien.

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Speaker 1: Bill O'Brien's fine. I think, given the personnel on hand,

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Speaker 1: that is a huge benefit to Ohio State to go

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Speaker 1: to Chip Kelly. And then as a further knock on effect,

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Speaker 1: there is a vacancy at UCLA. They wanted to get

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Speaker 1: rid of Chip anyway, there was no love loss there,

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Speaker 1: I presume. The only reason they didn't because they don't

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Speaker 1: want pay the buyout money and they instead now bring

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Speaker 1: to Sean Foster, back former UCLA player did a good

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Speaker 1: job with the running backs, was headed to the NFL.

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Speaker 1: They bring him back now to be the head coach

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Speaker 1: of the UCLA Brewins starting this season. So one small move,

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Speaker 1: Jeff Hathley leaving at Boston College means Bill O'Brien goes

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Speaker 1: to BC, means Chip Kelly goes to Ohio State, means

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Speaker 1: that Sean Foster goes back to the college ranks and

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Speaker 1: ends up with the UCLA Bruins. Now, to what end

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Speaker 1: are any of these going to be great moves? We

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Speaker 1: know that Bruce was enamored with the Bill O'Brien move.

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Speaker 1: Maybe I'm putting that a little too strongly. Bruce Fellman,

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Speaker 1: who he had on the show, but he's intrigued by

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Speaker 1: Bill O'Brien going back into the Boston market and trying

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Speaker 1: to build that program up. We know it's something Bill

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Speaker 1: Brian's talked about extensively now that that's at least an

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Speaker 1: intriguing move to bring him back. Chip Kelly obviously is

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Speaker 1: going to be the headliner amid this series of dominoes,

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Speaker 1: just because of, you know, Chip Kelly's pedigree as an

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Speaker 1: offensive minding coach, reuniting with Ryan day guy that he

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Speaker 1: knows pretty well. The Sean Foster will wait and see.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure that there are some UCLA fans who are

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Speaker 1: excited to bring to Sean Foster back. I don't necessarily

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Speaker 1: think that's an upgrade over Chip Kelly, but my hunch

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Speaker 1: is that some folks in the UCLA community who had

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Speaker 1: worn thin on Chip are just excited now to have

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Speaker 1: some new blood in there. What the all this looks

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Speaker 1: like when the rubber meets the road in the twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty four season, you know, will we will have time

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Speaker 1: to dissect that once we have more specifics on who's

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Speaker 1: playing where. But in terms of things with direct and

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Speaker 1: indirect waves, this is a pretty big one and it's

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Speaker 1: late in the cycle.

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Speaker 2: It's late in the cycle. So look, Boston College finishes

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Speaker 2: three and five last year in the ACC, just ahead

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Speaker 2: of Syracuse, Pitt Virginia and Wake who were Wake finished

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Speaker 2: one and seven in the ACC. And so if you

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Speaker 2: assume there are going to be more AC see wins

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Speaker 2: to be had by Boston College having to make this

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Speaker 2: move so late in the process and scrambling. And I

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Speaker 2: don't have the transfer numbers at the moment, but it's

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Speaker 2: going to be a new system. It's going to take time.

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Speaker 2: By the way, did you see the September schedule of

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Speaker 2: Boston College features a road game at Florida State and

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Speaker 2: a road game at Missoo two of the first three

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Speaker 2: weeks of the season. So an indirect result will be

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Speaker 2: maybe some feisty Bill O'Brien pressers early off. Yes in

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Speaker 2: the season. Syracuse of course making their own move to

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Speaker 2: fran Brown, and so there are reverberations lower middle tier

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Speaker 2: of the ACC. If you look at where the power

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Speaker 2: structure was last season, it is Bill O'Brien's first taste

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Speaker 2: of not being in the VIP section in quite some time, right, NFL,

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Speaker 2: Penn State, Alabama, back to NFL and now lower mid

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Speaker 2: tier acc and so it's different. It's definitely different. And

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Speaker 2: he was obviously NFL before Penn State, and so that's

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Speaker 2: an indirect result. Is going to be a taste of

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Speaker 2: what Dabble calls it the rest of y'all bus like, right,

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Speaker 2: that's going to be something new. Bill O'Brien was used

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Speaker 2: to a certain he was accustomed to a certain lifestyle,

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Speaker 2: and so the reverberation is going to be Bill O'Brien.

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Speaker 2: I had direct one.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I am very curious in the Bill O'Brien

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Speaker 1: front what this version of him now as a head

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Speaker 1: coach looks like, because I remember when he was coaching

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Speaker 1: at Penn State, he had established himself, at least among

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Speaker 1: the media as kind of like a no nonsense guy,

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Speaker 1: and there was always this sentiment out there that Bill

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Speaker 1: O'Brien probably would be better in the NFL. He doesn't

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Speaker 1: have to recruit in the NFL, he doesn't have to

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Speaker 1: worry about the glad handing and the politics that you

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Speaker 1: need to do when you're interacting with boosters as he

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Speaker 1: did at Penn State. Now that's not to say it's

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Speaker 1: the same situation at Boston College as it is at

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Speaker 1: Penn State. But he always felt to me, as a

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Speaker 1: result of some of those conversations that I had with

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Speaker 1: Penn State media folks at the time, like he would

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Speaker 1: be better suitor for the NFL. The NFL didn't really

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Speaker 1: work out as a pro coach. He got plenty a

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Speaker 1: run in Houston, but that was rocky the way it ended.

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Speaker 1: I think as a coordinator, he's obviously established himself as

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Speaker 1: a pretty smart guy. So I get the allure of

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Speaker 1: Bill O'Brien as somebody running your offense, be it at

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Speaker 1: the college or pro level. I'm just curious to see

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Speaker 1: how he functions in this role on the rest of

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Speaker 1: y'all's bus and as somebody who is in charge of

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Speaker 1: a program. Now, I'm sure he will get a rather

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Speaker 1: long leash, given he's from the area and he's got

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Speaker 1: the name recognition, and you know, I mean, he's somebody

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Speaker 1: who I think is coming in at a good time

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Speaker 1: for Boston College because they were probably gonna part ways

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Speaker 1: with Jeff Hafley before long. Just given the trajectory of

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Speaker 1: that program. So it's a move that makes a lot

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Speaker 1: of sense. Curious to see how it works out. A

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Speaker 1: lot of folks have graded this one like an A

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Speaker 1: and a minus. I get why you do that. I'm

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Speaker 1: just not entirely sure that's gonna work out long term.

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Speaker 2: You get an indirect because of Jeff Hafley leaving and

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Speaker 2: the moves that came from it. You get in the

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Speaker 2: narrative of Chip Kelly and oughtson stadium as offensive coordinator,

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Speaker 2: just in the other booth than where it was last year.

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Speaker 2: Because Ohio State will be visiting Eugene this year. I

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Speaker 2: think traffic to Pasadena will be significantly improved this year

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Speaker 2: based on what I think UCLA is probably going to

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Speaker 2: look like. UCLA finishes the year I think at USC

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Speaker 2: in terms of conference games, but then they tacked on

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Speaker 2: that Fresno game thereafter. If UCLA is bad, there might

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Speaker 2: be thirty eight hundred people in that stadium for the

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Speaker 2: Fresno State game. There might be thirty eight hundred people

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Speaker 2: in that stadium. We could get an all time ugly

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Speaker 2: Ucla Iowa game in the Rose Bowl. I just don't

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Speaker 2: think UCLA is going to be much this year with

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Speaker 2: that schedule, with the late shift, it's going to be tough.

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Speaker 2: I think it frees up the schedule like the New

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Speaker 2: Year's ish schedule of UCLA fans, Like, maybe you'll be

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Speaker 2: able to see some long lost friends or family for

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Speaker 2: the first time in a while. You know your team

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Speaker 2: not going bowling, You're not going to be off the road,

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Speaker 2: something like that. Ty No, No, Otherwise, where are we

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Speaker 2: going next? You want to go?

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Speaker 1: Well, I mean a point of intersect here is Jim Harbaugh. Yes,

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Speaker 1: So Harbaugh finally makes the move. Harbaugh is going to

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Speaker 1: be coaching the Chargers. Harbaugh has taken some of his

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Speaker 1: staff members with him, notably Ben Herbert, strength coach, notably

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Speaker 1: Jesse Minter. Defensive coordinator Sharon Moore has inherited that post

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Speaker 1: for the Michigan Wolverines. He's still making some staff moves

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Speaker 1: here and there, but by and large that that system

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Speaker 1: is set up. Michigan had I think a league high

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Speaker 1: eighteen players invited to the combine. Saw that Michigan will

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Speaker 1: be a very different program next season. A lot of

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Speaker 1: talent still in place. The FENNI National champion tends to

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Speaker 1: have that. However, there will be a lot of turnover.

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Speaker 1: Sharon Moore's work will be cut out for him, and

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Speaker 1: I think by and large it's tougher schedule. Right. We

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Speaker 1: talked about that before. Ohio State is doing everything it

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Speaker 1: possibly can to try and load up. So let's talk

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Speaker 1: about the indirect as a result of Jim Harball walking away.

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Speaker 1: What is the benefit around college football? What is the

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Speaker 1: consequence around college football?

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Speaker 2: The benefit that college football has. I mean, there's gonna

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Speaker 2: be more Big Ten teams who are going to not

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Speaker 2: necessarily win more games, but perhaps recruiting becomes a little

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Speaker 2: bit easier. Not that Michigan was a recruiting power, but

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Speaker 2: they recruited nationally. They went to the West coast, they

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Speaker 2: went to the East coast, they went to the South,

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Speaker 2: they did the whole Howard thing. So recruiting might become

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Speaker 2: a little bit more interesting. Certainly the Big Ten becomes

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Speaker 2: less interesting without Jim Harbaugh, Like Paul Finebaum's gonna need

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Speaker 2: something new to talk about, you know, in the middle

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Speaker 2: of summer.

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Speaker 1: You think it makes them less interesting? The Big Ten?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, without Jim Harbaugh. Yeah yeah, Why would the Big

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Speaker 2: Ten become more interesting without Jim Harbaugh?

430
00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:27,840
Speaker 1: My point, I guess is that, after what three years

431
00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:31,800
Speaker 1: of having a bit of a stranglehold on the Big Ten,

432
00:24:33,200 --> 00:24:37,359
Speaker 1: now suddenly it is a bit of a void. And

433
00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:41,200
Speaker 1: I think maybe it's something that is of more interest

434
00:24:41,280 --> 00:24:43,280
Speaker 1: to us, perhaps than the people who listen to us.

435
00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:49,879
Speaker 1: But this version of Michigan now without Harbaugh, with all

436
00:24:49,920 --> 00:24:52,960
Speaker 1: those guys walking out the door, I mean, is it

437
00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:57,640
Speaker 1: not a circumstance where we've got a vacuum up north

438
00:24:57,720 --> 00:24:59,560
Speaker 1: like we do down south? Like I kind of think

439
00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:02,120
Speaker 1: it makes the SEC more interesting that Saban has gone.

440
00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:03,760
Speaker 1: I kind of think it makes the Big Ten more

441
00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:06,680
Speaker 1: interesting that Harball's gone. I don't think so.

442
00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:10,000
Speaker 2: I think when you have a championship caliber program, it's

443
00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:12,879
Speaker 2: always better when you have a big personality coaching a

444
00:25:12,960 --> 00:25:17,560
Speaker 2: championship caliber program. I think the idea of Jim Harbaugh

445
00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:21,000
Speaker 2: going oh for whatever against Ohio State and then not

446
00:25:21,119 --> 00:25:23,080
Speaker 2: only getting over the top, but doing it with a

447
00:25:23,320 --> 00:25:28,840
Speaker 2: punctuated national championship, having like just a total weirdo a

448
00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:31,479
Speaker 2: top a giant program is going to be much more

449
00:25:31,560 --> 00:25:35,840
Speaker 2: interesting than Sharon Moore running Michigan and hiring Wink Martindale

450
00:25:35,920 --> 00:25:40,280
Speaker 2: or whatever, like it was peak interesting college football. We

451
00:25:40,359 --> 00:25:43,399
Speaker 2: had a scandal and might still have a scandal. Who

452
00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:47,679
Speaker 2: even knows, like it makes that scandal way less interesting, right,

453
00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:50,960
Speaker 2: The Connor Stallions thing is way less interesting now that

454
00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:53,560
Speaker 2: the coach has bolted for no pun intended the Los

455
00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:57,760
Speaker 2: Angeles Chargers. So no, I think the Big Ten is

456
00:25:58,160 --> 00:26:01,040
Speaker 2: less interesting. You know, Ohio State has a better chance,

457
00:26:01,160 --> 00:26:04,240
Speaker 2: Oregon has a better chance, Penn State has a better chance.

458
00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:07,840
Speaker 2: But I don't know, having Jim Harbaugh as like the

459
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:11,200
Speaker 2: north star of a conference or Nick Saban being the

460
00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:15,480
Speaker 2: north star of a conference, like Michigan losing with Jim

461
00:26:15,560 --> 00:26:18,760
Speaker 2: Harbaugh is more interesting than Michigan losing with Sharon Moore.

462
00:26:18,880 --> 00:26:21,800
Speaker 2: Nick Saban losing at Alabama is more interesting to me

463
00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:25,120
Speaker 2: than Klein de Borr losing at Alabama because we didn't

464
00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:29,320
Speaker 2: see it all that often recently. And so yeah, I

465
00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:32,760
Speaker 2: think when you lose weirdos in a sport, you lose

466
00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:37,560
Speaker 2: something beautiful, and you know, having you know, media members

467
00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:41,320
Speaker 2: breathlessly report on Jim Harbaugh's milk or Khaki's or feelings

468
00:26:41,359 --> 00:26:44,320
Speaker 2: on chicken. That's fine, I can do without that, But

469
00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:48,840
Speaker 2: like he did, he generated so much weirdness himself that

470
00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:52,720
Speaker 2: I'm gonna miss it. I'm absolutely gonna miss talking about

471
00:26:52,760 --> 00:26:53,760
Speaker 2: Jim Harbaugh in this sport.

472
00:26:54,400 --> 00:27:00,119
Speaker 1: I think I think for me personally, Harbaugh had this

473
00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:03,840
Speaker 1: identity is kind of weirdo, as he said, yeah, and

474
00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:07,280
Speaker 1: there was a point for me, And I don't know

475
00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:09,119
Speaker 1: if it was this season. I feel like it was

476
00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:14,480
Speaker 1: at some point early last when the weirdness stopped being

477
00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:17,800
Speaker 1: kind of a punchline and something that we could hang

478
00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:19,920
Speaker 1: our hat on and get a get a cheap laugh

479
00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:23,560
Speaker 1: out of and started being something that was extremely relatable.

480
00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:27,240
Speaker 1: It kind of made me like the guy a whole

481
00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:27,959
Speaker 1: hell of a lot more.

482
00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:30,760
Speaker 2: Well, he just had he just had like this undeniable

483
00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:35,080
Speaker 2: dad energy where he's just like he's he's not committing

484
00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:36,360
Speaker 2: to the bit. He is the bit.

485
00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:38,879
Speaker 1: He is the bit. He is the bit. And and

486
00:27:38,960 --> 00:27:41,159
Speaker 1: the more I've seen, like the Excel interview that we

487
00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:44,040
Speaker 1: talked about, yeah at nauseum that he did with I

488
00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:49,000
Speaker 1: think PMT and UH talking about how he uses Excel

489
00:27:49,119 --> 00:27:51,640
Speaker 1: for everything, Like, there are some aspects of Jim Harbad

490
00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:54,440
Speaker 1: that are so weird that they're intimately relatable.

491
00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:57,400
Speaker 2: And look, there are there are great reasons to root

492
00:27:57,440 --> 00:28:00,640
Speaker 2: against him. There are great reasons to root again Jim

493
00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:03,600
Speaker 2: Harbaugh and to everybody who loved it. Being if you

494
00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:06,880
Speaker 2: were a Penn State fan, Ohio State fan, whoever, it's

495
00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:10,520
Speaker 2: less interesting, Right, You'd much rather beat Michigan with Jim

496
00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:12,920
Speaker 2: Harbaugh looking sat on the sideline than Sharon Moore.

497
00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:14,959
Speaker 1: Right, if you're an Ohio State fan, you'll beat him.

498
00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:16,439
Speaker 1: However you can't. Doesn't matter who the coaches.

499
00:28:16,760 --> 00:28:20,240
Speaker 2: I understand, but I'm saying there's a degree of satisfaction

500
00:28:20,359 --> 00:28:23,359
Speaker 2: that comes with there is, you know, Jim Harbaugh Michigan losing,

501
00:28:23,760 --> 00:28:26,760
Speaker 2: and so losing that has to be a you know,

502
00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:29,480
Speaker 2: Ohio State wants to beat Michigan with Jim harbod on

503
00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:30,000
Speaker 2: the sideline.

504
00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:37,359
Speaker 1: I think the indirect beneficiary of the Harball move is

505
00:28:37,720 --> 00:28:41,600
Speaker 1: probably a school like a Kansas. You know, we had

506
00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:45,120
Speaker 1: Bruce on maybe two times ago. He referenced this a

507
00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:48,800
Speaker 1: little bit, but had this occurred earlier in the cycle.

508
00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:51,720
Speaker 1: And I understand given the college football playoff in the

509
00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:54,560
Speaker 1: way that the college calendar works versus the NFL calendar,

510
00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:56,840
Speaker 1: a way that that works. If Harball was going to

511
00:28:56,880 --> 00:28:58,240
Speaker 1: go back to the NFL, was always going to be

512
00:28:58,320 --> 00:29:02,080
Speaker 1: late in the cycle. But clearly a school like a

513
00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:05,680
Speaker 1: Kansas that has an obvious target like a lance Lipepold.

514
00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:11,440
Speaker 1: They are probably jumping for joy and thrilled at the

515
00:29:11,520 --> 00:29:14,960
Speaker 1: fact that the calendar worked out such that it just

516
00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:18,320
Speaker 1: made much more sense to hire from within with Sharon

517
00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:21,320
Speaker 1: Moore is very capable and proved himself as such the season,

518
00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:25,280
Speaker 1: as opposed to conducting a national search, as opposed to

519
00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:27,560
Speaker 1: trying to go and get the best of the rest.

520
00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:29,880
Speaker 1: Because I got to believe Lancelipold would have been in

521
00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:32,840
Speaker 1: that conversation. Oh yeah, it made a ton more sense

522
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:35,360
Speaker 1: to hire from within, and so they bring Sharon Moore in.

523
00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:38,000
Speaker 1: I think it'll be a continuation. I think it'll be

524
00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:39,720
Speaker 1: fine at least in the short term. We'll see what

525
00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:41,640
Speaker 1: we can do long term. If you're a school like

526
00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:43,480
Speaker 1: a Kansas to your school with really any up and

527
00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:47,000
Speaker 1: coming coach or an up and cooming name brand, lancelip

528
00:29:47,040 --> 00:29:50,320
Speaker 1: Pole has been around a while, you feel I think

529
00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:52,920
Speaker 1: pretty fortunate that it just sort of worked out the

530
00:29:52,960 --> 00:29:53,320
Speaker 1: way it did.

531
00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:56,760
Speaker 2: Competitively, You're right about where the Big ten is, Like,

532
00:29:56,840 --> 00:30:01,560
Speaker 2: it becomes more interesting that it's it seems that Michigan

533
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:04,280
Speaker 2: won't be in that conversation in year one, given not

534
00:30:04,480 --> 00:30:07,560
Speaker 2: just Jim Harbaugh leaving, but the losses on that roster,

535
00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:14,840
Speaker 2: especially on offense. But yeah, I look, if you asked

536
00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:17,560
Speaker 2: Tony Patiti, would he rather have Jim Harbaugh there or not?

537
00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:19,400
Speaker 1: For Oregon?

538
00:30:19,680 --> 00:30:23,400
Speaker 2: Washington, USC UCLA joining up Ohio State bringing back all

539
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:26,680
Speaker 2: these dudes Penn State, you know, still looking like they're

540
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:28,320
Speaker 2: going to be a very good team making the changes

541
00:30:28,360 --> 00:30:31,000
Speaker 2: they made on offense, Like yeah, I think it makes

542
00:30:31,080 --> 00:30:35,000
Speaker 2: the top of the Big ten, Like take a step back,

543
00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:40,360
Speaker 2: take two steps back? What else, Dan, in terms of reverberations,

544
00:30:40,400 --> 00:30:41,480
Speaker 2: in terms of moves.

545
00:30:41,240 --> 00:30:46,680
Speaker 1: In terms of moves of reverberations indirect direct, I.

546
00:30:46,720 --> 00:30:49,920
Speaker 2: Think Kaylin de Boor leaving for Alabama and the void

547
00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:53,800
Speaker 2: he left at Washington and the roster depletion that happened

548
00:30:53,840 --> 00:30:54,360
Speaker 2: in Seattle.

549
00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:56,080
Speaker 1: We're playing this one a little bit in reverse. Right,

550
00:30:56,120 --> 00:30:58,360
Speaker 1: we talked about Saban earlier into Borr coming in.

551
00:30:58,520 --> 00:31:02,480
Speaker 2: But right, yeah, this isn't I'm not connecting Domino's specifically

552
00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:05,760
Speaker 2: with this, but this, this specific move had a ton

553
00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:12,040
Speaker 2: of reverberations just because of teams able to add top

554
00:31:12,160 --> 00:31:14,560
Speaker 2: tier Washington players, you know, Ole Miss I think had

555
00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:18,640
Speaker 2: a couple. Oregon added Jabar Mohammad, like we had Will Rogers,

556
00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:20,239
Speaker 2: leave and then come back. So we had a lot

557
00:31:20,280 --> 00:31:23,320
Speaker 2: of you know what, offensive line guys, the receivers who

558
00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:26,200
Speaker 2: are almost always going to leave for the NFL decided,

559
00:31:26,280 --> 00:31:29,720
Speaker 2: you know, definitely we're going to leave. We saw offensive

560
00:31:29,760 --> 00:31:32,960
Speaker 2: skill talent, we saw guys on defense. Look, Dan Lanning

561
00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:37,360
Speaker 2: has what zero to three against Kaylen de Bar, huge winner. Now,

562
00:31:37,760 --> 00:31:39,640
Speaker 2: the roster was always going to take a pretty deep

563
00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:42,520
Speaker 2: step back without Michael Pennix and those receivers and losing

564
00:31:42,560 --> 00:31:46,760
Speaker 2: the offensive line talent, some key defensive players. But Kaylen

565
00:31:46,800 --> 00:31:49,320
Speaker 2: de Bor with time to add guys in the portal.

566
00:31:49,400 --> 00:31:52,560
Speaker 2: I think they added what Jeremiah Hunter from cal to

567
00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:55,640
Speaker 2: be a new top tier receiver in that system. Like

568
00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:59,640
Speaker 2: they still would have been pretty dangerous with Will Rogers

569
00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:01,920
Speaker 2: running Kaylen de Bor's system. I don't know what that if.

570
00:32:01,960 --> 00:32:04,200
Speaker 2: That's nine and three dangerous, eight and four dangerous, whatever.

571
00:32:04,520 --> 00:32:07,040
Speaker 2: But those wins were going to come at the expense

572
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:10,840
Speaker 2: of some good teams, even if Washington himself wasn't a

573
00:32:10,840 --> 00:32:14,760
Speaker 2: playoff caliber team, and so Oregon is a huge beneficiary.

574
00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:17,440
Speaker 2: Like Kaylan de Bor being out of Dan Lanning's life

575
00:32:17,440 --> 00:32:21,280
Speaker 2: in the Pacific Northwest, Yeah, that's incredible, and adding his

576
00:32:21,640 --> 00:32:25,000
Speaker 2: best defensive player arguing and Jabarmahammad. I mean, Braylen Trice

577
00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:28,400
Speaker 2: was incredible too, but is certainly the best player in

578
00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:32,600
Speaker 2: that secondary to an Oregon secondary that had been beat

579
00:32:32,680 --> 00:32:34,960
Speaker 2: up and kind of the reason they lost those Washington

580
00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:38,560
Speaker 2: games with Michael Pennix picking them apart, Like a huge,

581
00:32:38,680 --> 00:32:44,840
Speaker 2: huge beneficiary of Klen de Bor leaving. Also, you know,

582
00:32:44,920 --> 00:32:47,640
Speaker 2: the reverberations with Arizona and losing their coach to become

583
00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:50,720
Speaker 2: the new head coach, Brent Brennan and Kenya Modalolo, those

584
00:32:50,720 --> 00:32:53,880
Speaker 2: are all your direct ripples, your direct you know, the

585
00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:57,720
Speaker 2: wakes of those ships leaving in the middle of the night.

586
00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:03,360
Speaker 2: I think the Big Ten move from Washington becomes less

587
00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:06,840
Speaker 2: interesting without Kalen de Boor, like as good as Jedfish

588
00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:11,360
Speaker 2: made Arizona in three years, Like Washington coming off of

589
00:33:11,400 --> 00:33:14,520
Speaker 2: a playoff appearance, a four team playoff appearance, and going

590
00:33:14,600 --> 00:33:17,640
Speaker 2: into a new conference and having to completely start over.

591
00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:20,680
Speaker 2: I think some of the shine is off Big ten

592
00:33:20,800 --> 00:33:23,480
Speaker 2: expansion with Klen de Boor leaving and treating Washington the

593
00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:26,760
Speaker 2: way that he did. I think that that just you know,

594
00:33:26,920 --> 00:33:29,960
Speaker 2: to me, is an obvious, you know, ripple effect of

595
00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:36,000
Speaker 2: all of this and coupling that with USC being down,

596
00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:39,640
Speaker 2: UCLA losing their coach, Like, I don't know, the expansion

597
00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:43,360
Speaker 2: doesn't seem as explosive anymore to me, all because of

598
00:33:43,440 --> 00:33:46,360
Speaker 2: Kaln de boor all because of Kaln de bor leaving, right,

599
00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:49,680
Speaker 2: Because this is the complaint that so many people have

600
00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:55,360
Speaker 2: with the sport, that the ability to move upward is

601
00:33:55,560 --> 00:33:59,360
Speaker 2: blocked by the small handful of teams who recruit so

602
00:33:59,520 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 2: well and in the portal recruits so well, and that

603
00:34:02,560 --> 00:34:04,760
Speaker 2: Washington making this move, and Washington had been to the

604
00:34:04,800 --> 00:34:08,400
Speaker 2: playoff before, but like as down as they were with

605
00:34:08,640 --> 00:34:11,880
Speaker 2: Jimmy Lake, like they were a really as much as

606
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:13,760
Speaker 2: it pains me to say, they were a feel good story.

607
00:34:14,200 --> 00:34:17,480
Speaker 2: They played exciting football that was fun to watch, They

608
00:34:17,560 --> 00:34:20,520
Speaker 2: pulled out close games, and they became kind of this

609
00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:27,040
Speaker 2: like new power, right, And that that can all go

610
00:34:27,160 --> 00:34:31,640
Speaker 2: away so quickly in this era is a real bummer

611
00:34:31,719 --> 00:34:36,239
Speaker 2: of an indirect result, I think, I think it's bad

612
00:34:36,280 --> 00:34:40,400
Speaker 2: for the sport that Washington could completely collapse the roster,

613
00:34:40,960 --> 00:34:43,719
Speaker 2: the program status can completely collapse the way that it

614
00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:45,239
Speaker 2: did in like a week and a half.

615
00:34:46,239 --> 00:34:48,440
Speaker 1: I don't I don't want to draw any kind of

616
00:34:48,840 --> 00:34:52,120
Speaker 1: assumptions here because I said this a couple episodes ago,

617
00:34:52,160 --> 00:34:54,440
Speaker 1: and I had people email about it and send me

618
00:34:54,480 --> 00:34:57,359
Speaker 1: tweets about it, and I get where they're coming from.

619
00:34:58,160 --> 00:35:02,640
Speaker 1: I am very leary about this Jedfish thing. I am

620
00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:06,239
Speaker 1: very I am very leary about Jetfish.

621
00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:06,840
Speaker 2: You know.

622
00:35:06,920 --> 00:35:08,719
Speaker 1: I think he went on ari show and he tried

623
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:12,200
Speaker 1: to kind of quell things a little bit, because there

624
00:35:12,320 --> 00:35:16,239
Speaker 1: is this sentiment out there that Jedfish is not long

625
00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:20,000
Speaker 1: for anywhere, and we spoke at length about it on

626
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:21,920
Speaker 1: an episode that we did when he was first hired.

627
00:35:23,800 --> 00:35:28,000
Speaker 1: If you've not been on social media lately, what's happening

628
00:35:29,120 --> 00:35:32,359
Speaker 1: is folks are looking for content, just as we are now,

629
00:35:33,480 --> 00:35:39,240
Speaker 1: and they are focused, perhaps on Florida's schedule this coming season.

630
00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:42,880
Speaker 1: Florida's schedule is murder. It's one of the hardest in

631
00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:45,160
Speaker 1: the country, maybe one of the hardest we've seen in

632
00:35:45,239 --> 00:35:47,960
Speaker 1: a while, given where Florida is at, and we know

633
00:35:48,120 --> 00:35:51,280
Speaker 1: that boosters, we know that Florida fans just as a result,

634
00:35:51,360 --> 00:35:55,319
Speaker 1: aren't aren't too enamored with Billy Napier at the moment.

635
00:35:55,680 --> 00:36:01,040
Speaker 1: Given Jedfish's connection to Florida. He went to school at Florida.

636
00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:03,600
Speaker 2: Specifically as a student job, specifically so.

637
00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:06,600
Speaker 1: He could work for Spurrier. He's a huge Florida fan.

638
00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:11,080
Speaker 1: Florida people have certainly in increasing numbers, had their eye

639
00:36:11,120 --> 00:36:13,439
Speaker 1: on Jedfish and what he was doing at Arizona even

640
00:36:13,480 --> 00:36:16,720
Speaker 1: before this move up to Washington. Right to your point

641
00:36:16,920 --> 00:36:21,560
Speaker 1: of Calen de Borr leaves creates a bit of a vacuum.

642
00:36:22,239 --> 00:36:24,960
Speaker 1: There's a lot of roster turnover that we're going to

643
00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:27,239
Speaker 1: see in twenty twenty four and how that how that

644
00:36:27,360 --> 00:36:31,440
Speaker 1: works out for Jetfish. I do wonder if one of

645
00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:36,120
Speaker 1: the indirect results of Klen de Borer leaving is not

646
00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:39,719
Speaker 1: just the roster and as things stand in twenty twenty

647
00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:43,600
Speaker 1: four for Washington, but where it could stand in the

648
00:36:43,640 --> 00:36:46,200
Speaker 1: wake of another departure and the.

649
00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:48,960
Speaker 2: Old Jedfish Washington got in bed with a serial lever.

650
00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:51,680
Speaker 2: They got in bed at a serial lever. All he

651
00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:53,440
Speaker 2: does is leave place they got bet like.

652
00:36:54,520 --> 00:36:57,640
Speaker 1: And again, I hate to draw that assumption because I've

653
00:36:57,760 --> 00:37:00,320
Speaker 1: I've heard public comments from Jedfish and I think you know,

654
00:37:00,680 --> 00:37:03,560
Speaker 1: at least what he said publicly has been fine. You know,

655
00:37:03,680 --> 00:37:06,680
Speaker 1: what's a guy I would say, I understand this is

656
00:37:06,760 --> 00:37:09,160
Speaker 1: the business, and this is the way things work. I

657
00:37:09,239 --> 00:37:10,879
Speaker 1: also understand that there is a bit of a track

658
00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:15,080
Speaker 1: record here, and so I just I wonder if one

659
00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:18,040
Speaker 1: of those things that we are talking about next year

660
00:37:18,239 --> 00:37:21,920
Speaker 1: is not, oh, hey, we'll get Washington's roster down in

661
00:37:21,960 --> 00:37:25,080
Speaker 1: the wake of one guy leaving, But how about I

662
00:37:25,160 --> 00:37:28,680
Speaker 1: reraise with two guys leaving in consecutive years. I could

663
00:37:28,760 --> 00:37:34,040
Speaker 1: see that happening, and you know, it wouldn't be great

664
00:37:34,080 --> 00:37:36,360
Speaker 1: for Big ten expansion, at least not on the Washington

665
00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:38,480
Speaker 1: side as they try to figure out who would be next.

666
00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:41,680
Speaker 1: This is all like six moves ahead, four dimensional chests.

667
00:37:41,719 --> 00:37:44,800
Speaker 1: I get it. But something that I've been thinking about

668
00:37:44,840 --> 00:37:48,680
Speaker 1: a lot is if Washington has to go through this

669
00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:53,640
Speaker 1: back to back years, or you know, a couple moves

670
00:37:53,680 --> 00:37:56,479
Speaker 1: in close succession. Oregon's had to deal with that. Sure,

671
00:37:56,719 --> 00:37:58,520
Speaker 1: you know, it takes a little bit to dig out

672
00:37:58,560 --> 00:38:01,279
Speaker 1: from that and kind of chart a new course. So

673
00:38:01,480 --> 00:38:05,080
Speaker 1: we'll see where things go. But that that move has

674
00:38:05,160 --> 00:38:10,720
Speaker 1: left Washington, and I think a bit of uncertainty at least.

675
00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:13,239
Speaker 2: Well, it certainly is left Arizona. When you look at

676
00:38:13,280 --> 00:38:17,640
Speaker 2: the reverberations them hiring Brent Brennan, you know the direct

677
00:38:17,719 --> 00:38:20,759
Speaker 2: result of the Brennan Hire and the Fish move is

678
00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:24,120
Speaker 2: you know, a show of loyalty from Noah Fafida and

679
00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:29,840
Speaker 2: t mac which I think was great. It's yeah, you

680
00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:32,640
Speaker 2: are looking forward eachess here, you're looking years in advance.

681
00:38:32,719 --> 00:38:35,400
Speaker 2: But the what has come to define this for right

682
00:38:35,440 --> 00:38:42,439
Speaker 2: now is chaos and instability and Jedfish represents that represents

683
00:38:42,560 --> 00:38:46,760
Speaker 2: the like job hopping, Like what is it that fans

684
00:38:46,880 --> 00:38:52,840
Speaker 2: crave right now? They crave dependability, they crave you know, loyalty,

685
00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:55,919
Speaker 2: they crave you know, going back to the good old

686
00:38:56,000 --> 00:38:59,279
Speaker 2: days some fans. I won't speak for all fans, but

687
00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:02,320
Speaker 2: like when you when you listen to people talk about

688
00:39:02,320 --> 00:39:04,480
Speaker 2: the sport, they talk about like, oh, we got to

689
00:39:04,520 --> 00:39:06,680
Speaker 2: get the portal under control, we got to get nil

690
00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:09,800
Speaker 2: under control. The coaches are saying the same thing. In

691
00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:13,759
Speaker 2: a sport where coaches leave, players leave, teams leave conferences,

692
00:39:14,360 --> 00:39:18,560
Speaker 2: right teams are left behind, Like it's a mess. There's

693
00:39:18,560 --> 00:39:20,440
Speaker 2: a lot about the sport that's a mess right now.

694
00:39:20,840 --> 00:39:24,520
Speaker 2: And so when you have coaches who are either you know,

695
00:39:24,760 --> 00:39:26,960
Speaker 2: staying loyal to their schools, you know, Mike Norvell at

696
00:39:26,960 --> 00:39:29,719
Speaker 2: Florida State or Sark at Texas, not taking that big

697
00:39:29,880 --> 00:39:33,759
Speaker 2: job I think the reverberation with their own fan base

698
00:39:33,840 --> 00:39:37,160
Speaker 2: is really good because obviously, and this is foolish, but

699
00:39:37,640 --> 00:39:40,279
Speaker 2: fans want coaches to like their school as much as

700
00:39:40,360 --> 00:39:43,080
Speaker 2: they like their school. They want them to like Austin

701
00:39:43,200 --> 00:39:46,800
Speaker 2: or Tallahassee or Eugene or whatever as much as you

702
00:39:46,920 --> 00:39:49,080
Speaker 2: know those fans like it. That's why you always see

703
00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:52,120
Speaker 2: in press conferences like how are you adjusting to Eugene?

704
00:39:52,200 --> 00:39:55,960
Speaker 2: Does your family like Eugene, does your family like Tallahassee? Whatever?

705
00:39:57,320 --> 00:40:00,920
Speaker 2: And so when you have a coach who surround and

706
00:40:01,040 --> 00:40:02,480
Speaker 2: you have a coach who takes a team to a

707
00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:08,440
Speaker 2: playoff and immediately leaves after two years and doesn't recruit it,

708
00:40:09,080 --> 00:40:11,080
Speaker 2: it has a I think a lasting effect on the

709
00:40:11,200 --> 00:40:14,080
Speaker 2: sport when like, how do you have enthusiasm right now?

710
00:40:14,080 --> 00:40:17,719
Speaker 2: If you're a Washington fan right Turning fans off after

711
00:40:17,760 --> 00:40:19,760
Speaker 2: their team went to the playoff is not a great

712
00:40:20,840 --> 00:40:23,120
Speaker 2: thing to do for the sport, No, And so I

713
00:40:23,160 --> 00:40:25,759
Speaker 2: think that's going to have like lasting ripple effects here.

714
00:40:25,880 --> 00:40:28,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I mean the criticism you get whenever you

715
00:40:28,160 --> 00:40:31,000
Speaker 1: try to play that four D chess as well. I've

716
00:40:31,040 --> 00:40:33,719
Speaker 1: gotten this before. You know, this is a huge platform

717
00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:37,200
Speaker 1: me of thousands of people who listen, and reckless speculation

718
00:40:37,560 --> 00:40:40,360
Speaker 1: is not gonna is not going to endear anyone to you.

719
00:40:40,520 --> 00:40:45,000
Speaker 1: I'm not saying Jedfish is leaving for Florida. I'm saying

720
00:40:45,040 --> 00:40:47,239
Speaker 1: there's plenty of rumors out there to suggest that he'd

721
00:40:47,280 --> 00:40:51,040
Speaker 1: at least listen after year one at Washington, and boy

722
00:40:51,120 --> 00:40:52,480
Speaker 1: would that put them in a bit of a pickle,

723
00:40:52,920 --> 00:40:55,799
Speaker 1: that's all. If it happened, If it came to that, Sure,

724
00:40:57,320 --> 00:41:02,000
Speaker 1: Mike Elko Dan, yes, the Mike Elko hire at A

725
00:41:02,160 --> 00:41:04,160
Speaker 1: and m I mean, I think there's all sorts of

726
00:41:04,200 --> 00:41:07,680
Speaker 1: repercussions for that move, both good and bad. You know,

727
00:41:07,800 --> 00:41:10,120
Speaker 1: if you're a Duke fan. I don't know how many

728
00:41:10,200 --> 00:41:12,520
Speaker 1: Duke fans are out there listening to this show right now,

729
00:41:12,680 --> 00:41:14,839
Speaker 1: but if you're a Duke fan, you hate to lose

730
00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:18,600
Speaker 1: Mike Elko. On that same note, Manny Diaz, I think

731
00:41:18,719 --> 00:41:21,400
Speaker 1: is a pretty good replacement. I also think Manny Diaz

732
00:41:21,440 --> 00:41:23,840
Speaker 1: being able to reel in Malik Murphy makes that program

733
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:27,400
Speaker 1: very interesting. And I liked Riley Leonard and I like

734
00:41:27,520 --> 00:41:30,840
Speaker 1: Duke under Mike Elko, but Malik Murphy I think is

735
00:41:30,920 --> 00:41:32,800
Speaker 1: sort of a I don't know, a horse of a

736
00:41:32,800 --> 00:41:35,160
Speaker 1: different color man, I mean, and I mean horse. That

737
00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:37,960
Speaker 1: is a big friggin' dude. Yep, that is a big

738
00:41:38,040 --> 00:41:41,320
Speaker 1: dude playing quarterback who I think makes the Duke Woodevil's

739
00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:44,520
Speaker 1: pretty damn interesting at least on offense. So that keeps

740
00:41:44,560 --> 00:41:47,360
Speaker 1: on rolling. If you're an A and M fan, things

741
00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:52,520
Speaker 1: clearly had gone sideways with Jimbo Fisher, and it really

742
00:41:52,600 --> 00:41:58,320
Speaker 1: felt like this is a guy who was unwilling to

743
00:41:58,680 --> 00:42:00,200
Speaker 1: make necessary change is.

744
00:42:00,560 --> 00:42:02,560
Speaker 2: In practice he would make them in name right, He

745
00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:06,680
Speaker 2: would make them in name the philosophy remained.

746
00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:09,719
Speaker 1: Right, and I feel like in the moments where he

747
00:42:09,840 --> 00:42:12,640
Speaker 1: did try to change, it was a little bit too little,

748
00:42:12,640 --> 00:42:14,719
Speaker 1: too late. So now to bring in a guy like

749
00:42:14,800 --> 00:42:18,800
Speaker 1: an Elco who seemingly is beloved by not just the

750
00:42:18,880 --> 00:42:24,279
Speaker 1: players but also those with the money, perhaps it can

751
00:42:24,440 --> 00:42:27,480
Speaker 1: have that some of that like unifying effect that you

752
00:42:27,560 --> 00:42:30,879
Speaker 1: discussed with Texas, you discussed with you know, some other

753
00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:35,839
Speaker 1: program of Florida State right coaches who are staying put

754
00:42:37,080 --> 00:42:39,200
Speaker 1: and giving the fan base a reason to cheer Mike

755
00:42:39,280 --> 00:42:42,160
Speaker 1: Elko coming back home so to speak to college station,

756
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:44,200
Speaker 1: I think is one of those things that can have

757
00:42:44,280 --> 00:42:45,280
Speaker 1: a unifying effect.

758
00:42:45,440 --> 00:42:47,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, so are we Are we approaching this from the

759
00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:52,000
Speaker 2: Elco leaving Duke or from the Elco arriving at Texas

760
00:42:52,040 --> 00:42:52,440
Speaker 2: A and M.

761
00:42:52,920 --> 00:42:54,640
Speaker 1: I mean, I think I think we have to look

762
00:42:54,680 --> 00:42:56,000
Speaker 1: at it on both fronts.

763
00:42:58,040 --> 00:42:58,200
Speaker 2: You know.

764
00:42:58,400 --> 00:43:00,840
Speaker 1: The easiest is probably to talk about it Elco arriving

765
00:43:00,880 --> 00:43:05,600
Speaker 1: at A and M and what that means around the SEC.

766
00:43:06,040 --> 00:43:10,040
Speaker 1: I mean, I think I think it makes A and

767
00:43:10,239 --> 00:43:17,000
Speaker 1: M more credible. Okay, in the short term, I think

768
00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:19,040
Speaker 1: we had started looking at Jimbo Fisher as a bit

769
00:43:19,080 --> 00:43:23,640
Speaker 1: of a punchline, of course because of the contract, right

770
00:43:23,800 --> 00:43:27,759
Speaker 1: because it was a seven and five team, because he

771
00:43:27,960 --> 00:43:30,880
Speaker 1: just could not get them over the hump. Elko stepping in,

772
00:43:31,120 --> 00:43:33,840
Speaker 1: given what he did in short order at Duke, I

773
00:43:33,880 --> 00:43:36,239
Speaker 1: think gives him a ton more credibility. It feels like

774
00:43:36,360 --> 00:43:38,040
Speaker 1: it's a more serious program. To me.

775
00:43:39,280 --> 00:43:43,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think on the face it, what does a

776
00:43:43,520 --> 00:43:46,480
Speaker 2: more stable Texas A and M look like? What does

777
00:43:46,520 --> 00:43:50,279
Speaker 2: the work with post someone post Jimbo? There is this

778
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:53,440
Speaker 2: idea that Texas A and M has a grown up

779
00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:55,879
Speaker 2: in a way that they haven't in quite some time.

780
00:43:56,239 --> 00:43:59,759
Speaker 2: In Mike Alco, who seems sort of universally liked as

781
00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:04,320
Speaker 2: a person universally liked as somebody who can develop a roster,

782
00:44:04,719 --> 00:44:09,400
Speaker 2: who can hire well, you know, bringing Holman Wiggins from Alabama,

783
00:44:09,520 --> 00:44:12,200
Speaker 2: Colin Klein from Kansas State, Ja Bateman I'm not super

784
00:44:12,280 --> 00:44:14,280
Speaker 2: high on. But it's going to be a Mike Elco defense.

785
00:44:16,239 --> 00:44:18,680
Speaker 2: So what does that mean? What is a more stable,

786
00:44:19,400 --> 00:44:24,520
Speaker 2: professionalized adult Texas A and M mean, Well, we know

787
00:44:24,640 --> 00:44:27,480
Speaker 2: that talent acquisition shouldn't be a problem. We know that

788
00:44:27,640 --> 00:44:31,600
Speaker 2: nil shouldn't be a problem. So the question is what

789
00:44:31,760 --> 00:44:34,560
Speaker 2: can he do on the recruiting front and the development

790
00:44:34,680 --> 00:44:39,880
Speaker 2: front to challenge who right now like Texas for recruits,

791
00:44:40,120 --> 00:44:44,239
Speaker 2: LSU for recruits, Alabama for recruits, Ole miss for recruits,

792
00:44:44,840 --> 00:44:47,600
Speaker 2: Like I think the roster will be there. So what

793
00:44:47,680 --> 00:44:49,400
Speaker 2: does it mean? If text A and M can go

794
00:44:49,560 --> 00:44:52,160
Speaker 2: from being an eight win program to a ten win

795
00:44:52,320 --> 00:44:57,359
Speaker 2: program consistently, the SEC becomes way more interesting. Like if

796
00:44:57,440 --> 00:45:00,360
Speaker 2: you have interesting, huge games at Kyle Field, that's a

797
00:45:00,480 --> 00:45:04,799
Speaker 2: huge win for the conference. That's an unbelievable environment. Weird, yes,

798
00:45:05,280 --> 00:45:09,560
Speaker 2: but still a great environment for the SEC. In SEC

799
00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:13,200
Speaker 2: that is sort of coming into a new era where

800
00:45:13,360 --> 00:45:17,160
Speaker 2: the standard goes from being Alabama and Georgia to just Georgia.

801
00:45:17,560 --> 00:45:23,000
Speaker 2: At the moment, I think the LSU quote unquote rivalry

802
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:26,319
Speaker 2: at the end of the season becomes can become spicier.

803
00:45:26,600 --> 00:45:29,480
Speaker 2: And that's weird to say, given the like seven overtime

804
00:45:29,560 --> 00:45:31,839
Speaker 2: game that ended in fisticuffs a couple of years ago.

805
00:45:33,239 --> 00:45:35,320
Speaker 2: But I think we could have an ongoing back and

806
00:45:35,440 --> 00:45:41,000
Speaker 2: forth there that's more interesting. And we get to see

807
00:45:41,120 --> 00:45:44,000
Speaker 2: if the promise of Texas A and M finally turning

808
00:45:44,040 --> 00:45:47,840
Speaker 2: a corner after one hundred and fifty years can finally happen.

809
00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:50,800
Speaker 2: That's this is all great. These are all great things

810
00:45:51,719 --> 00:45:54,560
Speaker 2: for the SEC and for Texas A and M if

811
00:45:54,640 --> 00:45:59,239
Speaker 2: it comes to pass. So yeah, I don't think it's

812
00:45:59,600 --> 00:46:02,759
Speaker 2: crazy pronounced. They've never had that problem recruiting, and so

813
00:46:02,800 --> 00:46:05,480
Speaker 2: I don't think somebody's gonna step in and take a

814
00:46:05,520 --> 00:46:07,520
Speaker 2: bunch of Texas A and M recruits or anything like that.

815
00:46:08,160 --> 00:46:12,279
Speaker 2: But I think just the idea of tuning into a

816
00:46:12,360 --> 00:46:16,000
Speaker 2: Texas A and M game and having a better idea

817
00:46:16,080 --> 00:46:18,799
Speaker 2: of what to expect, I think it's a It's a good.

818
00:46:18,719 --> 00:46:22,040
Speaker 1: Win for Week one, Week one against Notre Dame. Where

819
00:46:22,120 --> 00:46:23,520
Speaker 1: is that game college station?

820
00:46:24,120 --> 00:46:24,960
Speaker 2: It's in College Station.

821
00:46:25,200 --> 00:46:28,000
Speaker 1: Great, hell of It's like the game of Week one

822
00:46:30,120 --> 00:46:32,000
Speaker 1: not Name against Texas A and M great.

823
00:46:32,120 --> 00:46:33,640
Speaker 2: And it's in a college stadium even better.

824
00:46:33,800 --> 00:46:37,040
Speaker 1: And it's in a college stadium even better. The ramifications

825
00:46:37,080 --> 00:46:39,000
Speaker 1: I think on the on the duke side are interesting.

826
00:46:40,800 --> 00:46:43,640
Speaker 1: You know, losing Alco sucks if you're dude. I just

827
00:46:43,680 --> 00:46:45,720
Speaker 1: don't think you can ask for more than Mike Elco.

828
00:46:45,880 --> 00:46:47,560
Speaker 1: I don't think you can ask for more than Mike Elco.

829
00:46:48,000 --> 00:46:49,839
Speaker 1: And I think, you know, many Di has be fine

830
00:46:49,880 --> 00:46:51,839
Speaker 1: man and d as coach in the conference before Many

831
00:46:51,880 --> 00:46:54,239
Speaker 1: Das is able to prove and he's now able to

832
00:46:54,280 --> 00:46:56,879
Speaker 1: reel in a pretty big fish in the transfer portal. Yeah,

833
00:46:58,680 --> 00:47:00,480
Speaker 1: you know, the ACC is a whole was kind of

834
00:47:00,480 --> 00:47:02,960
Speaker 1: in a weird place. And I don't know if the

835
00:47:04,680 --> 00:47:08,480
Speaker 1: indirect result of Elco leaving means a whole lot for

836
00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:09,720
Speaker 1: the conference.

837
00:47:09,360 --> 00:47:11,280
Speaker 2: But I think it's good for Dabbo.

838
00:47:11,719 --> 00:47:12,800
Speaker 1: I think it's good for Dabo.

839
00:47:13,400 --> 00:47:16,320
Speaker 2: These are programs that have either beaten or put the

840
00:47:16,400 --> 00:47:19,160
Speaker 2: fear of life into the better or even the more

841
00:47:19,280 --> 00:47:23,040
Speaker 2: mediocre of Clemson programs. Duke, Boston College, Syracuse. All these

842
00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:27,400
Speaker 2: new coaches and all the changes and roster upheaval, Like again,

843
00:47:27,640 --> 00:47:31,719
Speaker 2: if stability is the new secret sauce Clemson certainly has

844
00:47:31,800 --> 00:47:35,840
Speaker 2: that in Dabo Sweeney and having those types of upstart

845
00:47:35,920 --> 00:47:39,359
Speaker 2: programs have to kind of start over. It probably means

846
00:47:39,480 --> 00:47:41,839
Speaker 2: fewer eight and four seasons still probably ten to two

847
00:47:42,040 --> 00:47:45,279
Speaker 2: for Clemson, but that's it's nicer for him. I think,

848
00:47:45,719 --> 00:47:46,360
Speaker 2: which are the.

849
00:47:46,800 --> 00:47:50,520
Speaker 1: ACC programs to you that have the most stability in

850
00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:54,600
Speaker 1: this new world order? I mean Florida State obviously, Yeah, Clemson,

851
00:47:55,560 --> 00:47:57,799
Speaker 1: Clemson has stability to some extent.

852
00:47:57,600 --> 00:47:58,319
Speaker 2: For better or worse.

853
00:47:58,400 --> 00:48:01,759
Speaker 1: Yeah, Louisville is building it. It's probably too early to

854
00:48:01,800 --> 00:48:05,000
Speaker 1: say that they have it, but it seems as if

855
00:48:05,080 --> 00:48:07,760
Speaker 1: Jeff Brom's doing a pretty good job building it quickly

856
00:48:07,920 --> 00:48:10,239
Speaker 1: via the portal, through and through other means.

857
00:48:10,280 --> 00:48:14,120
Speaker 2: I mean it's NC State is a stable program. Even

858
00:48:14,160 --> 00:48:17,439
Speaker 2: though quarterback up evil has been pretty pronounced these past

859
00:48:17,520 --> 00:48:21,479
Speaker 2: couple of years, but the baseline of you know, keeping

860
00:48:21,560 --> 00:48:27,120
Speaker 2: Tony Gibson around, having a at that worst interesting defense

861
00:48:27,200 --> 00:48:31,239
Speaker 2: at best pretty suffocating. I think NC State's a really

862
00:48:31,360 --> 00:48:37,719
Speaker 2: stable programs state stable. North Carolina is stable. Perhaps a

863
00:48:37,800 --> 00:48:40,200
Speaker 2: lot of changes recently, but yeah, but.

864
00:48:40,280 --> 00:48:42,600
Speaker 1: Otherwise they're just darn't a whole lot. So yeah, if

865
00:48:42,640 --> 00:48:47,480
Speaker 1: you're if you're another team, particularly like Clemson in the ACC, right,

866
00:48:48,239 --> 00:48:51,719
Speaker 1: losing some stability elsewhere in the conference benefits you.

867
00:48:52,719 --> 00:48:55,520
Speaker 2: I agree, right, Syracuse for better or I wouldn't say

868
00:48:55,520 --> 00:48:57,680
Speaker 2: they were stable because it was sort of like under

869
00:48:57,719 --> 00:49:00,480
Speaker 2: Dino Baber's it was, you know, one year, the offense

870
00:49:00,560 --> 00:49:03,440
Speaker 2: is really really interesting and good with Eric Dunge or whoever,

871
00:49:03,840 --> 00:49:05,600
Speaker 2: and then the next year it's the defense leading the

872
00:49:05,640 --> 00:49:08,759
Speaker 2: way with Tony White. So I wouldn't say stable, but

873
00:49:09,520 --> 00:49:12,000
Speaker 2: Dino Babers being there as long as he was cycling

874
00:49:12,040 --> 00:49:14,640
Speaker 2: in and out of offensive coordinators, it sort of became

875
00:49:15,160 --> 00:49:20,200
Speaker 2: the instability was the stability at Syracuse. But you know,

876
00:49:20,280 --> 00:49:22,840
Speaker 2: he would throw kitchen sinks at people and that's great.

877
00:49:23,200 --> 00:49:25,600
Speaker 2: And so now we get Syracuse starting over, Boston College

878
00:49:25,600 --> 00:49:29,000
Speaker 2: starting over, Duke starting over, and they were they represented

879
00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:31,520
Speaker 2: I think, the feisty middle class of the ACC for

880
00:49:31,600 --> 00:49:32,319
Speaker 2: a good long time.

881
00:49:33,960 --> 00:49:35,160
Speaker 1: Anything else Dan here.

882
00:49:36,880 --> 00:49:44,279
Speaker 2: In terms of coaching reverberations and power vacuums, Which other

883
00:49:44,360 --> 00:49:45,080
Speaker 2: new coaches do you have?

884
00:49:46,360 --> 00:49:49,279
Speaker 1: I mean, you've mentioned fran Brown a great deal. Yeah,

885
00:49:51,920 --> 00:49:53,800
Speaker 1: one name we haven't talked a whole lot about it.

886
00:49:53,920 --> 00:49:58,160
Speaker 1: Jonathan Smith we mentioned at the top, you know, like

887
00:49:58,280 --> 00:50:03,319
Speaker 1: obviously the one of the Oregon State gets a short

888
00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:05,360
Speaker 1: end of the stick, not just with this but with

889
00:50:06,000 --> 00:50:09,959
Speaker 1: very pretty much everything right. And that's a direct short

890
00:50:10,080 --> 00:50:11,479
Speaker 1: end of the stick. We don't have to beat around

891
00:50:11,520 --> 00:50:15,960
Speaker 1: the bush. Everyone understands that one. Jonathan Smith, though, come

892
00:50:16,000 --> 00:50:18,920
Speaker 1: in to East Lansing, of course, takes over from Mel Tucker.

893
00:50:19,600 --> 00:50:22,719
Speaker 1: That situation was a mess this season. He steps and

894
00:50:22,800 --> 00:50:28,560
Speaker 1: he brings pretty big name quarterback with him, and you know,

895
00:50:28,640 --> 00:50:31,080
Speaker 1: we haven't seen a whole lot of Aiden Child's like,

896
00:50:31,120 --> 00:50:32,880
Speaker 1: we don't know exactly what that's going to look like,

897
00:50:33,080 --> 00:50:37,680
Speaker 1: but certainly he's one of those names that is mover

898
00:50:37,800 --> 00:50:40,440
Speaker 1: and a shaker as it relates to other names in

899
00:50:40,480 --> 00:50:44,000
Speaker 1: the portal. So to bring him along to East Lansing

900
00:50:44,080 --> 00:50:48,440
Speaker 1: I think is significant. And I don't know what the

901
00:50:48,520 --> 00:50:52,360
Speaker 1: program looks like in the near term, but I know

902
00:50:52,440 --> 00:50:55,160
Speaker 1: that we've come to trust Jonathan Smith a fair amount.

903
00:50:55,960 --> 00:51:02,239
Speaker 1: So that to me, the reverberations from that move, I think,

904
00:51:02,440 --> 00:51:09,560
Speaker 1: coupled with Sharon Moore taking over at Michigan, the state

905
00:51:09,600 --> 00:51:12,480
Speaker 1: of Michigan college football right now is in a very

906
00:51:12,560 --> 00:51:15,160
Speaker 1: very interesting spot. You know, We've got one team that's

907
00:51:15,200 --> 00:51:17,239
Speaker 1: been there for a couple of years now, we've got

908
00:51:17,239 --> 00:51:18,879
Speaker 1: another that is trying to get back there.

909
00:51:19,080 --> 00:51:21,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, so what does it mean for Jonathan Smith to

910
00:51:21,920 --> 00:51:24,680
Speaker 2: be at Michigan State that he is not a huge

911
00:51:24,719 --> 00:51:28,360
Speaker 2: personality but just sort of puts his head down, develops

912
00:51:28,440 --> 00:51:33,600
Speaker 2: really strong interesting offenses, hires really well. Oregon State became

913
00:51:33,680 --> 00:51:36,880
Speaker 2: a really interesting transfer destination on the West coast, and

914
00:51:36,960 --> 00:51:40,680
Speaker 2: Michigan State has become that transfer destination. Mel Tucker had

915
00:51:40,719 --> 00:51:42,800
Speaker 2: turned it into that, but just without a ton of

916
00:51:42,840 --> 00:51:47,000
Speaker 2: success outside of the best transfer perhaps of the Portal

917
00:51:47,040 --> 00:51:54,520
Speaker 2: era in wake Forest what Kenneth Walker. So yeah, I

918
00:51:54,600 --> 00:51:56,680
Speaker 2: don't think a lot changes in that regard. I think

919
00:51:56,680 --> 00:51:58,880
Speaker 2: it's still there. Michigan State is still, at least for

920
00:51:58,960 --> 00:52:01,120
Speaker 2: these first couple of years, is going to heavily rely

921
00:52:01,520 --> 00:52:04,880
Speaker 2: on the Portal as Jonathan Smith and his staff is

922
00:52:05,640 --> 00:52:10,359
Speaker 2: introducing itself to the Midwest. So I don't think there's

923
00:52:10,360 --> 00:52:13,080
Speaker 2: a lot of reverberation there. I think there is that vacuum,

924
00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:16,440
Speaker 2: like you mentioned, with Michigan at least somewhat. I think

925
00:52:16,480 --> 00:52:19,680
Speaker 2: the Wolverines are still in a much more advantageous position

926
00:52:19,800 --> 00:52:22,000
Speaker 2: in the short term than Michigan State is, even though

927
00:52:22,080 --> 00:52:24,920
Speaker 2: Jonathan Smith has a lot more head coaching experience than

928
00:52:24,960 --> 00:52:30,680
Speaker 2: Sharon Moore. I honestly don't see a lot of reverberations

929
00:52:30,840 --> 00:52:34,200
Speaker 2: for Michigan State because of the way Oregon State was

930
00:52:34,280 --> 00:52:37,960
Speaker 2: left out in realignment that it almost left him no

931
00:52:38,200 --> 00:52:41,439
Speaker 2: choice but to look externally and look, you can say

932
00:52:41,520 --> 00:52:43,719
Speaker 2: he was, you know, looking at this job or looking

933
00:52:43,760 --> 00:52:46,000
Speaker 2: at you know, getting out before the season was over,

934
00:52:46,040 --> 00:52:50,640
Speaker 2: and that's why they lost to Oregon whatever. But the reverberation,

935
00:52:50,920 --> 00:52:54,120
Speaker 2: like it just wasn't fair to look at what he

936
00:52:54,160 --> 00:52:56,600
Speaker 2: had accomplished and where where his name was, where his

937
00:52:56,719 --> 00:52:59,480
Speaker 2: stock was, and say he should stick with Oregon State

938
00:53:00,560 --> 00:53:03,040
Speaker 2: as they go through this like that just I don't

939
00:53:03,040 --> 00:53:08,000
Speaker 2: know if that's that's necessarily based in reality. So Oregon State,

940
00:53:08,440 --> 00:53:11,600
Speaker 2: obviously their roster has collapsed, their best players have transferred

941
00:53:11,600 --> 00:53:14,560
Speaker 2: all over the place, most notably DJU to Florida State

942
00:53:14,640 --> 00:53:19,240
Speaker 2: if I remember correctly correct, But Michigan State and Jonathan

943
00:53:19,320 --> 00:53:23,560
Speaker 2: Smith will now have this reputation as an interesting, a

944
00:53:23,640 --> 00:53:27,719
Speaker 2: good destination, a stable destination, which I don't think has

945
00:53:27,800 --> 00:53:30,120
Speaker 2: been the case for Michigan State these Michigan State these

946
00:53:30,200 --> 00:53:34,080
Speaker 2: past few years. Despite the Killer twenty twenty was the

947
00:53:34,160 --> 00:53:39,320
Speaker 2: year Kenneth Walker season. So what does it mean for

948
00:53:39,400 --> 00:53:41,680
Speaker 2: the Big Ten to have a more stable Michigan State.

949
00:53:41,840 --> 00:53:44,560
Speaker 2: It can only be positivity, can only be positive. That's

950
00:53:44,600 --> 00:53:47,439
Speaker 2: good for the Big Ten, it's good for in state

951
00:53:47,560 --> 00:53:51,400
Speaker 2: Michigan talent, and you know, keeping in that it's a

952
00:53:51,440 --> 00:53:53,799
Speaker 2: pretty you know, with the Detroit metro area and cast Tech,

953
00:53:53,840 --> 00:53:56,800
Speaker 2: it's really good for you know, in state kids to

954
00:53:56,880 --> 00:54:04,000
Speaker 2: stay home. But I still don't think Michigan State really

955
00:54:04,080 --> 00:54:07,120
Speaker 2: elevates to a headliner within the conference in the short term.

956
00:54:07,320 --> 00:54:10,440
Speaker 2: So I don't think a lot changes. I don't, you know,

957
00:54:10,680 --> 00:54:12,680
Speaker 2: I think Michigan State is one of those jobs that

958
00:54:13,760 --> 00:54:16,000
Speaker 2: you're not going to be able to lift a profile

959
00:54:16,120 --> 00:54:20,719
Speaker 2: a ton unless you know, you do find that quarterback,

960
00:54:20,800 --> 00:54:25,480
Speaker 2: you do find you know, a dynamic offense in East Lansing.

961
00:54:25,600 --> 00:54:27,840
Speaker 2: So I'm not there with Michigan State in terms of

962
00:54:27,880 --> 00:54:31,359
Speaker 2: it having huge ripple effect within the sport and hiring

963
00:54:31,440 --> 00:54:33,600
Speaker 2: Jonathan Smith. But that just might be because of his

964
00:54:33,840 --> 00:54:37,920
Speaker 2: personality and that, you know, Corvallis is not exactly the

965
00:54:37,960 --> 00:54:38,840
Speaker 2: center of the universe.

966
00:54:39,960 --> 00:54:42,359
Speaker 1: All right, saliverbo Gmail dot com, right in, let us

967
00:54:42,400 --> 00:54:50,560
Speaker 1: know your thoughts, reverberations, ripples, ris, yeah, dominos after this

968
00:54:50,719 --> 00:54:53,239
Speaker 1: round on the coaching carousel, as we're out here in

969
00:54:53,320 --> 00:54:57,879
Speaker 1: the high seats, and you can also go on out

970
00:54:57,960 --> 00:55:00,680
Speaker 1: to a Verbaalers dot com v E r B A

971
00:55:00,880 --> 00:55:02,920
Speaker 1: L L e r s dot com. That's our Patreon

972
00:55:03,040 --> 00:55:07,239
Speaker 1: listen ad free, get bonus episodes, get access to a

973
00:55:07,320 --> 00:55:11,840
Speaker 1: whole variety of our off season perks. Also out in

974
00:55:11,880 --> 00:55:13,640
Speaker 1: social media, give us a holler, let us know your

975
00:55:13,760 --> 00:55:18,000
Speaker 1: thoughts on everything we discussed here today. Certainly would welcome

976
00:55:18,320 --> 00:55:22,759
Speaker 1: your feedback. Also, if you are a public listener, we

977
00:55:22,880 --> 00:55:25,320
Speaker 1: will be maybe on the next episode, given out a

978
00:55:25,560 --> 00:55:27,600
Speaker 1: URL for folks to take a little survey help us

979
00:55:27,640 --> 00:55:31,040
Speaker 1: out as we try to craft our off season agenda here, Dan.

980
00:55:31,560 --> 00:55:35,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, and actually this episode may have been more of

981
00:55:36,440 --> 00:55:41,719
Speaker 2: an example of what didn't happen, Like there won't be

982
00:55:41,760 --> 00:55:43,279
Speaker 2: a new coach at Oregon, there won't be a new

983
00:55:43,320 --> 00:55:45,400
Speaker 2: coach at Texas, there won't be a new coach at Kansas,

984
00:55:45,440 --> 00:55:47,840
Speaker 2: there won't be a new coach at Florida State. Like

985
00:55:49,600 --> 00:55:52,000
Speaker 2: it's kind of an example, like not a new coach

986
00:55:52,040 --> 00:55:54,719
Speaker 2: at Iowa, despite you know, perhaps a lot of people

987
00:55:54,840 --> 00:55:58,600
Speaker 2: thinking that it was time for a change in philosophy

988
00:55:58,719 --> 00:55:59,480
Speaker 2: and not one of them.

989
00:55:59,560 --> 00:56:00,120
Speaker 1: But sure.

990
00:56:01,960 --> 00:56:07,200
Speaker 2: That Florida, right, that coaches, not leaving for the Alabama job,

991
00:56:07,320 --> 00:56:09,680
Speaker 2: not leaving for the Michigan job, not leaving for the

992
00:56:09,800 --> 00:56:13,160
Speaker 2: Washington job, or whatever like. It almost is a study

993
00:56:13,360 --> 00:56:17,879
Speaker 2: in potential energy instead of kinetic energy, if I'm using

994
00:56:17,960 --> 00:56:22,680
Speaker 2: that correctly. That it was a the reverberations of all

995
00:56:22,760 --> 00:56:26,080
Speaker 2: of those schools keeping their coaches, I think brings a

996
00:56:26,120 --> 00:56:29,000
Speaker 2: ton of positive energy into the twenty twenty four season.

997
00:56:30,320 --> 00:56:33,440
Speaker 1: All right, you know how to find us, folks, Give

998
00:56:33,520 --> 00:56:36,440
Speaker 1: us a holler, let us know your thoughts on today's episode.

999
00:56:36,520 --> 00:56:38,759
Speaker 1: We'll be back a little later on in the week.

1000
00:56:39,239 --> 00:56:43,480
Speaker 1: In the meantime for my first mate, Dan Rubinstein, for myself,

1001
00:56:43,560 --> 00:56:46,440
Speaker 1: you're Captain Tye Hilda Brand. We will talk y'all soon.

1002
00:56:46,560 --> 00:56:48,240
Speaker 1: Stay solid, peace,