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Speaker 1: What is up, guys, Welcome back to Post Run High.

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Speaker 1: Today I'm here with Jason Kelly. He's the chief correspondent

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Speaker 1: at Bloomberg Originals and co host of The Deal with

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Speaker 1: Alex Rodriguez, also known as a Rod. This podcast is

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Speaker 1: all about movement. It's about learning how our guests move

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Speaker 1: through the world, how they build momentum in their work,

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Speaker 1: stay grounded in their personal lives, and keep growing through

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Speaker 1: every season of life. Every guest we bring on has

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Speaker 1: an inspiring story that we can learn from in a

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Speaker 1: real way, and Jason is a perfect example of that.

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Speaker 1: Jason has built his career by following his curiosity, from

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Speaker 1: covering Wall Street to Silicon Valley to the growing business

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Speaker 1: of sports. He's reported from all over the world. He's

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Speaker 1: interviewed some of the most influential names in finance and culture,

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Speaker 1: and now he's bringing us a front row seat into

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Speaker 1: major deals with some of the world's most accomplished athletes, coaches,

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Speaker 1: and more. Jason is not just telling stories, He's helping

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Speaker 1: people understand the four versus shaping our world, and today

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Speaker 1: we get to learn about him before we get into it.

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Speaker 1: I just want to say thank you so much for

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Speaker 1: tuning in. Your support means the world to us, and

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Speaker 1: if you're enjoying Post Run High, please do us a

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Speaker 1: favor and rate and review the show. Your support helps

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Speaker 1: us keep bringing you inspiring conversations week after week. All right,

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Speaker 1: let's get our Post Run High going. Jason Kelly, welcome

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Speaker 1: to Post Run High.

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Speaker 2: I'm so happy to be here. Great run, great run.

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Speaker 3: I am so excited for you to be here with me.

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Speaker 1: So for context, guys, Jason and I just ran a

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Speaker 1: little bit over two miles through Brooklyn.

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Speaker 3: I loved finding out that you're a runner.

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Speaker 1: When I asked you to be on the show, I

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Speaker 1: had no idea that you had such a running background.

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Speaker 2: I love running so much.

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Speaker 3: Let's talk about it.

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Speaker 4: I sort of fell into it, I guess, as many

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Speaker 4: people do, as a bit of an alternative.

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Speaker 2: I was a kid.

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Speaker 4: I was going to high school in Texas, which I

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Speaker 4: spent my growing up year sort of between Atlanta and Houston.

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Speaker 4: I was going to high school in Houston, Texas the

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Speaker 4: same time as high school, and you know, the natural

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Speaker 4: thing is like you're going out for the football team.

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Speaker 4: My dad had played high school football, you know, back

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Speaker 4: in Atlanta, and I went I spent two weeks doing it,

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Speaker 4: and I hated it, but I also knew, just sort

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Speaker 4: of the way I was raised, like you should do

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Speaker 4: a sport, and the only other sport it was available

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Speaker 4: was cross country, and so I did it, and that

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Speaker 4: really started my love affair with running, and I ran

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Speaker 4: all through high school, ran cross country and track, and

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Speaker 4: I was fine. And then I went to college and

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Speaker 4: sort of like did the opposite of running. I was

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Speaker 4: basically sitting and working at the newspaper. And then I

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Speaker 4: got out of college and one of my very best

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Speaker 4: friends to this day, guy named Billy Robbins, ran a

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Speaker 4: marathon my wife and I went to watch him with

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Speaker 4: his wife, and I was like, I could do that,

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Speaker 4: Like I could run a marathon, And literally like six

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Speaker 4: months later, he and I ran a marathon together, and

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Speaker 4: I went on to run probably a dozen marathons, and

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Speaker 4: it really became part of my identity, I think, especially

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Speaker 4: when I was in my twenties and thirties. It just

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Speaker 4: it was really something I identified myself as. And I

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Speaker 4: loved the community of it.

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Speaker 2: I loved the ability.

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Speaker 4: I mean, you have a whole show based on this,

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Speaker 4: the way you can get to know someone on a

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Speaker 4: run in a way that you you don't if you're

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Speaker 4: having a meal or having a drink or in a meeting.

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Speaker 4: It's just it's a very there's an intimacy to it,

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Speaker 4: and I think you can't sort of help but be authentic.

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Speaker 4: It's sort of like, I have two kids who are

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Speaker 4: college age, and I'm the millionth parent to say this,

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Speaker 4: but the best conversations you have with your kids is

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Speaker 4: when you're driving in the car, because you're not looking

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Speaker 4: each other, you're sort of looking ahead. And that's sort

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Speaker 4: of like with a run. I've sort of said things

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Speaker 4: and heard things on a run that I don't think

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Speaker 4: I would necessarily say face to face.

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Speaker 1: It's amazing how you can foster such good conversation through

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Speaker 1: shared activity. And it's funny that you said the car

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Speaker 1: reference because one of the initial inspose for the running

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Speaker 1: Interview show that we just did was carpool karaoke. H

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Speaker 1: and I always loved watching that growing up, and when

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Speaker 1: we had the idea for the running Interview show, I

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Speaker 1: was like, there's kind of some synergy here between carpool

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Speaker 1: karaoke and not being face to face but kind of

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Speaker 1: running side by side or sitting side by side.

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Speaker 4: Well, can I tell you another thing that interviewer and

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Speaker 4: interviewer one of our little tricks that we use, especially

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Speaker 4: when we make our documentaries. In Bloomber Originals, I host

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Speaker 4: a show called power Players in addition to the Deal,

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Speaker 4: and almost always we try and get someone in a

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Speaker 4: car and we get them to drive. And actually, the

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Speaker 4: very first time I met not the first time I

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Speaker 4: met him, but the first really meaningful thing that I

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Speaker 4: did with Alex Rodriguez was an episode of this series

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Speaker 4: we did called Athlete Empire, And one of the things

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Speaker 4: we did is we drove from his house to his

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Speaker 4: high school, and we put cameras in the car and Mike,

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Speaker 4: we're both miked up, and he told me just some

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Speaker 4: incredible stories about what it felt like to be drafted.

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Speaker 4: He talked about his suspension, you know, he talked about

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Speaker 4: like real stuff. And I'm convinced it's because when you're

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Speaker 4: doing something else, you're your guard's a little bit down,

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Speaker 4: and so.

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Speaker 2: You're a little more you're a little more willing to kind.

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Speaker 1: Of go there, especially when you're doing such a familiar activity. Yes,

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Speaker 1: Like there's something about running, especially if you were a

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Speaker 1: cross country runner growing up, that almost brings you back

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Speaker 1: in a way to those years where you know you're

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Speaker 1: running with a group of friends and you know you're

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Speaker 1: becoming friends with people that maybe you weren't friends with

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Speaker 1: outside of the cross country team, and just like connects

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Speaker 1: you in a whole new way.

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Speaker 2: Totally.

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Speaker 4: I love it, I mean, and it's really it's a

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Speaker 4: way to really get.

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Speaker 2: To know someone well.

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Speaker 3: Running you through Brooklyn was so fun.

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Speaker 1: I just have to say, you have such an impressive

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Speaker 1: career and when I found out that you were down

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Speaker 1: to do the show, I was so excited. I found

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Speaker 1: out about you through watching your Paul Rabel episode on

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Speaker 1: the Deal with a Rod, and ever since watching that episode,

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Speaker 1: I found myself going down a wormhole and just being

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Speaker 1: so fascinated by your work and everything you do, especially

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Speaker 1: in relation to business and sports business. Before we get

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Speaker 1: into everything you're up to now, I want us to

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Speaker 1: rewind and just for everybody to learn your journey and

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Speaker 1: hear how all of this came to be.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, I've thought a lot about how I

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Speaker 4: ended up being where I am, and the person I

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Speaker 4: give the most credit to is my mom. When I

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Speaker 4: was five years old, she signed me up for a

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Speaker 4: creative writing class, and I don't think I could probably

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Speaker 4: barely write, but I could think about stories. And that's

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Speaker 4: when I decided I wanted to be a writer. I

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Speaker 4: didn't know what that exactly was going to entail. I

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Speaker 4: was a bit of a corporate brat growing up. My

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Speaker 4: dad had a bunch of different jobs and he went

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Speaker 4: to work for Procter and Gamble right out of undergrad.

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Speaker 2: I was born. My parents were really young, and so

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Speaker 2: I sort of like grew up with them in a

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Speaker 2: lot of ways.

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Speaker 3: How old were you when they had you?

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Speaker 4: My dad was twenty and my mom was nineteen, and

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Speaker 4: they were high school sweethearts, and so here I was.

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Speaker 4: And it was a really it was a really fun

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Speaker 4: childhood because I like my dad finished college while I

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Speaker 4: was a kid. He went to Georgia Tech, and then

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Speaker 4: he went to work for Procter and Gamble in a

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Speaker 4: little town called Jackson, Tennessee, and my brother was born there.

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Speaker 4: And then my dad had this really interesting moment in

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Speaker 4: his own life and career where he had been trained

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Speaker 4: as an engineer and he got into got interested in business,

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Speaker 4: and he applied to two business schools, University of Memphis,

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Speaker 4: which was half an hour away, in Harvard Business School,

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Speaker 4: and he got into both and he the way he

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Speaker 4: tells the start, I shouldn't tell his story, but I

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Speaker 4: will because it's sort of our story. His dad, his

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Speaker 4: late dad, said to him, He's like, whatever you whatever

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Speaker 4: you need to do. However, we can't help you with money,

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Speaker 4: but we'll help you however we can. You need to

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Speaker 4: go to Boston, and that like obviously changed the trajectory

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Speaker 4: of his career. And so we lived in We lived

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Speaker 4: in Boston for a couple of years, my parents, my brother,

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Speaker 4: and I. My mom, who's very southern, would tell you

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Speaker 4: we were poor as church miss And then we moved

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Speaker 4: back to Atlanta. My dad went to work for Coca Cola,

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Speaker 4: and so I sort of grew up in that millieu.

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Speaker 4: And I do think watching him through his career made

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Speaker 4: me interested in business. You know, I sort of had

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Speaker 4: this front row seat to one of the most dynamic

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Speaker 4: companies in the world, and you know, being the kid

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Speaker 4: of an executive there, and but you know, all the

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Speaker 4: time I was thinking, I'm going to be a writer.

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Speaker 4: I'm going to be a journalist. And I worked in

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Speaker 4: the high school newspaper. I went to Georgie, I worked

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Speaker 4: for one of the newspapers on campus there, and I

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Speaker 4: really thought I was going to be a political reporter.

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Speaker 4: And then I got a chance to go back to

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Speaker 4: Atlanta after college to cover the Olympics, and I wanted

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Speaker 4: to be I was so excited to be home. My

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Speaker 4: now wife, who I had met in college, was going

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Speaker 4: to business school down there, and I got a job

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Speaker 4: at the business newspaper in Atlanta, and I realized politics

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Speaker 4: was interesting, business was more interesting, and there were just

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Speaker 4: these big personalities and that as I looked around, and

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Speaker 4: this has been a theme through my career. Every story

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Speaker 4: is a business story, you know, whether we're talking about running,

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Speaker 4: or we're talking about Wall Street, or we're talking about

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Speaker 4: potato chips, like it's all everything comes back to business.

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Speaker 1: I think that's what's so fascinating about your podcast, The

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Speaker 1: Deal as you're talking to these incredible athletes and coaches

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Speaker 1: and people in the world of sports, Yeah, and it

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Speaker 1: does all fall back to business. And I think that's

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Speaker 1: one of the most interesting things about Bloomberg and the

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Speaker 1: work that you guys do, And through the context of

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Speaker 1: all these different industries that you cover, what would you

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Speaker 1: say are the components that make a great journalist.

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Speaker 4: Curiosity is absolutely the first. I think being interested in

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Speaker 4: other people in wanting to understand their stories, and I

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Speaker 4: think being willing and eager to be a translator and

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Speaker 4: to be an explainer. You know, one of the things

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Speaker 4: that attracted me to business journalism specifically was it felt

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Speaker 4: like there was a barrier to entry in terms of

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Speaker 4: it's like, ah, this is complicated and it's business and

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Speaker 4: its numbers and things like that. I was an English

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Speaker 4: major and a theology minor, Like, I have no business

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Speaker 4: training whatsoever. I've gotten a ton of training at Bloomberg

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Speaker 4: and Bloomberg when I joined in two thousand and two,

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Speaker 4: Like we literally had a month long boot camp where

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Speaker 4: I learned all about balance sheets and income statements and

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Speaker 4: the Bloomberg terminal and all of those great things. But

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Speaker 4: being able to distill those issues down in a way

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Speaker 4: that you know lots of people can understand is I mean,

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Speaker 4: what an amazing opportunity to be able to do that.

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Speaker 4: And I think it's a it's a language that you know,

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Speaker 4: we can we can help other people speak and uh,

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Speaker 4: and so I think that's so that's one component of

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Speaker 4: being a journalist. And you know that the curiosity pieces

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Speaker 4: I think obvious. I also think, as much as I

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Speaker 4: am currently talking, I think one of the greatest skills

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Speaker 4: is a journalist is to listen, and I think as

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Speaker 4: an interviewer, and you're so excellent at it.

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Speaker 2: Part of what.

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Speaker 4: Is a very powerful thing that I've just got as

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Speaker 4: I've tried to become a better and better interviewer is

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Speaker 4: listening to what the person is saying and maybe even

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Speaker 4: some of what they're not saying, and to think about,

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Speaker 4: if you're the audience, what would you want to know next,

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Speaker 4: and just to sort of go with that. And oftentimes,

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Speaker 4: and Alex and I talk about this a lot and

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Speaker 4: are when we're prepping for our podcast, which do a

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Speaker 4: lot of prep, but so much of it is about

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Speaker 4: just knowing the information but being willing to just.

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Speaker 2: Let it flow.

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Speaker 1: When you are a journalist, I think the thing that's

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Speaker 1: so interesting is you get to talk to so many

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Speaker 1: people and learn so much through them about what they do,

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Speaker 1: and you almost become like a subject matter expert through

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Speaker 1: just having conversation. And I love that you said curiosity

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Speaker 1: and on one of our recent episodes, as we were

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Speaker 1: talking about this before we started filming, but I sat

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Speaker 1: down with Alex Lieberman, who's the founder of Morning Brew,

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Speaker 1: and we were talking about curiosity, and he was explaining

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Speaker 1: to me how he thinks about curiosity as a muscle,

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Speaker 1: and he thinks that there's ways that you can work

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Speaker 1: the muscle of being curious.

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Speaker 2: Wow.

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Speaker 3: And so I'm curious about you.

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Speaker 1: Is there anything that you do that you think helps

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Speaker 1: you stay curious?

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Speaker 3: How do you work your muscle of curiosity?

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Speaker 2: Wow, that's a really good question.

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Speaker 1: I can give you an example of what he does,

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Speaker 1: and I thought it was so interesting. So he was

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Speaker 1: saying the way he works this muscle is he'll go

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Speaker 1: outside and he'll say, oh, there's a train.

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Speaker 3: How does that train work?

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Speaker 4: Who?

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Speaker 1: I wonder who's on the train right now. I wonder

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Speaker 1: what they do for work? Or this cup, like why

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Speaker 1: is it designed like this? You know, what was the

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Speaker 1: what's the importance of the swivels or you know. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: So he's just kind of like looking at all the

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Speaker 1: things around him and thinking to himself kind of how

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Speaker 1: everything works.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I like that.

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Speaker 4: I mean, I think, you know, I spend so much

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Speaker 4: of my time thinking about people, and I have a

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Speaker 4: I have a great editor I've worked with at Bloomberg

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Speaker 4: who who said to me as we were developing some

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Speaker 4: of our series a few years ago, especially around sports,

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Speaker 4: he said, I want you to create shows where you

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Speaker 4: understand what makes people tick, but never ever use the

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Speaker 4: term what makes people tick. And and I think a

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Speaker 4: lot about that. But I and I also think about

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Speaker 4: this notion of finding common ground with people, like being

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Speaker 4: curious about who they are and then looking for ways

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Speaker 4: that you can connect with them. And maybe it's you know,

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Speaker 4: you and I have a commonality around the sport of lacrosse,

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Speaker 4: you know, and so that like they're you know, your

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Speaker 4: brother's played, my son's played. I never played, and yet

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Speaker 4: I know a lot about it, and I'm.

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Speaker 2: Very curious that actually about lacrosse.

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Speaker 4: But but you know, when you find those things like

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Speaker 4: those are the those are the moments where candidly, when

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Speaker 4: you're in doing someone you need to get them to

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Speaker 4: trust you. And part of what I think we try

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Speaker 4: and do and the deal is to is to take

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Speaker 4: people into subject areas where they're comfortable but they haven't

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Speaker 4: thought about it as much. And so when we interviewed

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Speaker 4: Serena Williams, you know, I remember this this moment. If

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Speaker 4: I can be a little bit meta where we had

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Speaker 4: the benefit of like a ton of research. You know,

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Speaker 4: we have an incredible team who works with us. I

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Speaker 4: had done a lot of reading. I'd obviously followed Serena's

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Speaker 4: career very closely. Alex knows her really well. And we

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Speaker 4: were talking about her first deal, you know, we talk

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Speaker 4: about people's deals, and her first endorsement was with Puma,

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Speaker 4: and I had read in her book, in a book,

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Speaker 4: I believe, a book about her, her description of being

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Speaker 4: at the table, literally falling asleep at the table during

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Speaker 4: this this negotiation for her first deal, and I brought

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Speaker 4: it up and I said, you know, and I think

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Speaker 4: you fell asleep at the table. And she looked at

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Speaker 4: me and she goes, no, no, no, I passed out.

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Speaker 2: She's like, I was so tired. But there was this if.

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Speaker 4: You watch the show, there's a moment where I feel

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Speaker 4: like her body language changes and she looks at me

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Speaker 4: as if to say, oh, this guy did the work,

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Speaker 4: like he knows, like he knows what he's talking about.

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Speaker 4: Like I'm comfortable now, Like I'm gonna I'm gonna engage

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Speaker 4: in this conversation in a way that I might not

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Speaker 4: otherwise have because they're in it with me and I

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Speaker 4: think that and so that so the depth of curiosity

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Speaker 4: I think is interesting too, and your willingness to, you know,

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Speaker 4: really understand your subject matter as much as you can

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Speaker 4: and then be open to wherever they want to go.

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Speaker 1: And I feel like Serena Williams is such a good

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Speaker 1: example if somebody you're so naturally curious about, especially if

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Speaker 1: you're somebody that's followed her career, which I feel like

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Speaker 1: so many of us have, even if we haven't followed

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Speaker 1: it so closely.

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Speaker 4: And yet there's this whole element, you know, this whole

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Speaker 4: side of her that I feel like and this was

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Speaker 4: the huge opportunity that I feel like we had with

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Speaker 4: our show and we continue to have with our show,

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Speaker 4: which is, you know, people like Serena, people like Michael Strahan,

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Speaker 4: people like Magic Johnson, mean, they are unbelievable business people.

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Speaker 4: They have applied this playbook, this skill set that they

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Speaker 4: created as athletes to this whole other thing, to unbelievable success.

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Speaker 4: And so understanding how that translates is just is just

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Speaker 4: fascinating to me.

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Speaker 1: And it's fascinating to sit down with the people that

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Speaker 1: have translated it so well, because there's some people that don't, right,

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Speaker 1: And it's so cool to see how some of these

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Speaker 1: people have created incredible businesses and careers outside of the

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Speaker 1: sport that they know exceled at. When you think about Bloomberg,

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Speaker 1: you think about finance and data, and of course we've

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Speaker 1: said that business applies to so many different things. I

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Speaker 1: know you've been at Bloomberg since two thousand and two.

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Speaker 1: When did you make the transition to focusing on sports?

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Speaker 1: And I know you focus on a range of topics, yes,

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Speaker 1: but when did sports become something that you were really

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Speaker 1: passionate about?

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Speaker 4: I mean, I can I can track it back to

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Speaker 4: a very specific moment. It was the summer of twenty

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Speaker 4: twenty and recently, pretty recently, I had kept an eye

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Speaker 4: on sports sort of in my peripheral vision, in part

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Speaker 4: because I'd covered Wall Street for.

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Speaker 2: A long time.

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Speaker 4: And one of the things that I was seeing was

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Speaker 4: a lot of people that I had covered, private equity tycoons,

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Speaker 4: in particular buying sports teams and investing in sports. So

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Speaker 4: that was so that was sort of in my mind.

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Speaker 4: I had seen, you know, Josh Harris and Mark Lasry

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Speaker 4: and Tony Wrestler, you know, people that I had covered.

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Speaker 4: David Wlitzer, people who I had covered as just private

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Speaker 4: equity investors get into sports, and so you know that

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Speaker 4: the in the most basic way, business journalism is about

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Speaker 4: following the money. That's like at its core, like that's

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Speaker 4: what you do. And so that was on my mind.

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Speaker 4: But the really catalytic moment was I wrote a cover

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Speaker 4: story for a Bloomberg BusinessWeek and did a TV special

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Speaker 4: about Lebron James and Maverick Carter and their creation of

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Speaker 4: spring Hill, and it came at this unbelievably historic moment.

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Speaker 4: It the interview and the story just happened to be

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Speaker 4: the first time that Lebron had spoken publicly about the

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Speaker 4: murder of George Floyd, about Black Lives Matter, about COVID,

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Speaker 4: He talked in that interview about the death of Kobe Bryant,

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Speaker 4: you know, all these things that had happened, and at

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Speaker 4: the same time he talked about this incredible business ambition

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Speaker 4: that he and Maverick had and what they were building

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Speaker 4: at spring Hill, not just in the media company, you know,

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Speaker 4: his ambitions in business, and.

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Speaker 2: That just.

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Speaker 4: Hit me as there is something really interesting happening here.

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Speaker 4: Because Lebron James is the most famous athlete in the world,

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Speaker 4: or one of them and has this ambition, and he's

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Speaker 4: not alone, and he's following in the footsteps of Magic Johnson.

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Speaker 4: He's following the footsteps to some extent of Arod. And

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Speaker 4: so I had the great opportunity, with the backing of

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Speaker 4: some senior editors at Bloomberg, to just go and start

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Speaker 4: exploring what we describe as this intersection of business, sports

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Speaker 4: and culture. And I think the end culture piece was

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Speaker 4: a really critical bit of it, because there were in

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Speaker 4: our people who were covering sort of the transactions, and

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Speaker 4: we do some of that as well. But I think

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Speaker 4: what sports does, and I think you appreciate this as

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Speaker 4: much as anyone is, it just hits so far above

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Speaker 4: its weight in terms of cultural impact. If you think

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Speaker 4: about you know, we're we're taping this just you know,

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Speaker 4: a few days after the MIxS have like lost the

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Speaker 4: you know, lost in the playoffs. I mean, it was

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Speaker 4: a like moment in New York, you know, whenever there's

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Speaker 4: like a big victory or a big loss, you know,

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Speaker 4: when the Yankees win the World Series, which they have

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Speaker 4: not done in a long time, as Alex's Payton to

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Speaker 4: remind us, you know, these are moments, you know, and

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Speaker 4: even you know, watching my son play college lacrosse.

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Speaker 2: It's like all of the like sports just.

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Speaker 4: Hits different and it and and I think that appreciation

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Speaker 4: that something meaningful was happening both culturally, but then also

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Speaker 4: the economics have just you know, exploded, and we sort

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Speaker 4: of got lucky in the sense that it really took

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Speaker 4: off from there.

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Speaker 1: And I want to tap into the culture topic as

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Speaker 1: soon as we start talking about your podcast a little

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Speaker 1: bit more in depth, because I noticed through listening to

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Speaker 1: the deal that you guys do do with such a

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Speaker 1: beautiful job of tying that in too kind of each

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Speaker 1: of the athletes or people that you feature on the show.

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Speaker 1: There are so many things that you can cover in

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Speaker 1: the world of sports business. How do you decide as

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Speaker 1: a journalist what to cover?

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Speaker 4: I try and think a lot about what's new and

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Speaker 4: what's next. And we recently had Melody Hobson on our show.

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Speaker 4: It's an unbelievable investor, you know, Coco of Aerial Investments,

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Speaker 4: you know, has been on the just recently left the

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Speaker 4: board of Starbucks's on the board of JP Morgan.

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Speaker 2: She's icon in business and.

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Speaker 4: One of the things that she said, which is really

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Speaker 4: stuck with me, In fact, I mentioned to somebody today,

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Speaker 4: is this idea that she so she's created a fund

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Speaker 4: solely to invest in women's sports, and the way she's

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Speaker 4: framing it is women's sports is a growth stock. It's

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Speaker 4: a great you know, and that's how how they at

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Speaker 4: Ariel are viewing it. And so those are the ones

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Speaker 4: that are especially interesting to me. These you know, sort

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Speaker 4: of like high growth stories, a little bit of risk.

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Speaker 4: I mean, I think women's sports is an absolutely fascinating area.

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Speaker 4: We've we've been looking very closely at it for really

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Speaker 4: four or five years, and I do think anticipated, I

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Speaker 4: dare say, a lot of what has come in terms

439
00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:28,080
Speaker 4: of like the higher valuations and the big investments, the viewership,

440
00:23:28,320 --> 00:23:31,000
Speaker 4: the sponsorship, everything that's going on there. So those are

441
00:23:31,040 --> 00:23:33,840
Speaker 4: the stories that are super compelling to me. I think

442
00:23:33,880 --> 00:23:39,280
Speaker 4: the other the other stories are really and this is

443
00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:42,480
Speaker 4: what we try and do through the deal and other venues,

444
00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:47,240
Speaker 4: is understanding the why of you know, why this is

445
00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:53,040
Speaker 4: a big opportunity. You know, how a league came to be.

446
00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:55,720
Speaker 2: You know, we talked about Paul Rabil a little bit.

447
00:23:56,080 --> 00:24:00,200
Speaker 4: You know what a cool story he has of deciding

448
00:24:00,359 --> 00:24:02,959
Speaker 4: as a professional athlete that the best thing for his

449
00:24:03,040 --> 00:24:07,359
Speaker 4: sport is to create an entirely new league. What like,

450
00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:11,240
Speaker 4: how does that like, what's the what's the process of that?

451
00:24:11,400 --> 00:24:13,920
Speaker 1: Well? I even liked listening to Paul Raebel and hearing

452
00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:16,679
Speaker 1: him talk about how he's trying to make it a

453
00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:20,359
Speaker 1: sport that's more easily available for people even in like

454
00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:22,760
Speaker 1: the inner city, you know, it's making it like a

455
00:24:22,840 --> 00:24:25,960
Speaker 1: street basketball, like street lacrosse. Yes, I loved hearing that

456
00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:26,439
Speaker 1: part of it.

457
00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:29,720
Speaker 4: Yeah, And so I think those the stories are most

458
00:24:29,720 --> 00:24:34,360
Speaker 4: compelling to me are the ones where people are pushing,

459
00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:38,040
Speaker 4: pushing a new idea or a new investment, or a

460
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:42,240
Speaker 4: new market, or a new a new geography, you know,

461
00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:44,960
Speaker 4: creating a new league, you know. League one volleyball is

462
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:46,960
Speaker 4: a really interesting one that we've that we've covered a

463
00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:50,280
Speaker 4: little bit. We covered on the Deal, you know, which

464
00:24:50,320 --> 00:24:55,359
Speaker 4: is one of the first leagues where there's they have

465
00:24:55,480 --> 00:24:57,760
Speaker 4: the youth all the way up to the professional within

466
00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:00,760
Speaker 4: this one league. So those, it's a story the most

467
00:25:00,760 --> 00:25:01,280
Speaker 4: compelling to me.

468
00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:14,520
Speaker 1: I've interviewed a lot of female athletes for the Running

469
00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:19,000
Speaker 1: Interview show, and from people from you know, Olympic runners

470
00:25:19,040 --> 00:25:23,040
Speaker 1: to soccer players, basketball players, and the one thing of

471
00:25:23,080 --> 00:25:26,720
Speaker 1: course that all these professional women athletes are so passionate

472
00:25:26,760 --> 00:25:29,640
Speaker 1: about is the future of women's sports. So I'm curious

473
00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:32,800
Speaker 1: as somebody that has been doing a lot of research

474
00:25:32,840 --> 00:25:35,240
Speaker 1: on it and kind of stays on the pulse of

475
00:25:35,240 --> 00:25:37,200
Speaker 1: what's going on within the business of sports.

476
00:25:37,240 --> 00:25:38,800
Speaker 3: Where do you think women's sports are heading?

477
00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:42,280
Speaker 4: It is one of the questions I think in sports

478
00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:47,520
Speaker 4: right now. The valuations are rising really fast. You know,

479
00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:51,000
Speaker 4: in the past year alone, you've had records just keep

480
00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:53,760
Speaker 4: getting set in terms of franchise valuations. So Angel City,

481
00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:57,960
Speaker 4: which is the women's soccer club in Los Angeles, you

482
00:25:58,000 --> 00:26:01,360
Speaker 4: know changed hands. Will Obey and Biger bought that at

483
00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:03,040
Speaker 4: evaluation two hundred and fifty million.

484
00:26:03,400 --> 00:26:04,320
Speaker 2: That was a record.

485
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:07,920
Speaker 4: Well then New York Liberty, which is owned by Claire

486
00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:11,639
Speaker 4: Wusai and Josi just raise money at a four hundred

487
00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:15,400
Speaker 4: and fifty million dollar valuation, So new record.

488
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:16,720
Speaker 3: Based on those valuations.

489
00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:21,000
Speaker 1: Do you think social media has shifted the way women's

490
00:26:21,359 --> 00:26:22,400
Speaker 1: loves are being marketed?

491
00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:22,920
Speaker 2: Totally?

492
00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:27,480
Speaker 4: I mean, I think that so much of what is

493
00:26:28,920 --> 00:26:32,920
Speaker 4: happening with women's sports is absolutely fueled by social media,

494
00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:35,400
Speaker 4: both in terms of the teams but also in terms

495
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:36,480
Speaker 4: of the individual athletes.

496
00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:37,840
Speaker 2: If you think about.

497
00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:41,400
Speaker 4: You know, obviously Caitlin Clark is sort of the uper

498
00:26:41,440 --> 00:26:44,280
Speaker 4: example of all this, but you think about Juju Watkins

499
00:26:44,440 --> 00:26:47,440
Speaker 4: at USC, you think about Hailey van Lyth, you think

500
00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:53,320
Speaker 4: about all of these athletes who have these massive social presences.

501
00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:57,320
Speaker 4: I mean, also, I think one thing we cannot overlook

502
00:26:57,520 --> 00:26:59,840
Speaker 4: when it comes to women's sports is the benefit that

503
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:01,800
Speaker 4: changes in name, image.

504
00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:02,960
Speaker 2: And likeness and IL have had.

505
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:07,959
Speaker 4: They I mean, obviously they've had a dramatic and profound

506
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:12,920
Speaker 4: effect on college football and men's college basketball, but they've

507
00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:17,679
Speaker 4: had a similarly similarly profound effect on women's college basketball,

508
00:27:17,920 --> 00:27:20,639
Speaker 4: especially you know, Paige Beckers, who just came into the

509
00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:25,439
Speaker 4: WNBA this season out of Yukon, you know, had a

510
00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:31,440
Speaker 4: thriving and like very profitable and IL portfolio. Azy Fudd,

511
00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:35,200
Speaker 4: her teammate who's still at Yukon, her former teamate who's

512
00:27:35,200 --> 00:27:39,440
Speaker 4: stillt Ukon, you know, has millions of dollars in ANIL.

513
00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:43,320
Speaker 4: So I think that exposure and then the other thing.

514
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:45,440
Speaker 2: I could go on and.

515
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:47,239
Speaker 1: On about this, but well I love that you can

516
00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:49,480
Speaker 1: go on and on about this, and I love knowing

517
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:52,399
Speaker 1: also that you only just started diving into sports in

518
00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:53,440
Speaker 1: twenty twenty.

519
00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:56,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, you you have such a I love this stuff,

520
00:27:56,560 --> 00:27:59,520
Speaker 3: so much knowledge on the on sports as a whole.

521
00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:03,639
Speaker 4: It's so I mean, and and I do think you know,

522
00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:08,439
Speaker 4: one of the things that is, you know, that is

523
00:28:08,440 --> 00:28:16,720
Speaker 4: certainly true about women's sports specifically, is the disruption across

524
00:28:16,760 --> 00:28:19,360
Speaker 4: the media landscape has made it so much more possible

525
00:28:19,480 --> 00:28:24,520
Speaker 4: for people to see things that they just didn't see before.

526
00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:26,320
Speaker 4: And one of the things that we've really seen when

527
00:28:26,320 --> 00:28:28,920
Speaker 4: it comes to women's sports, and there's there's a lot

528
00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:31,639
Speaker 4: of data around this as well. There's there's a great

529
00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:35,400
Speaker 4: group called Sports Innovation Lab out of Boston that's done

530
00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:39,560
Speaker 4: some great work about the fluid fan and specifically around

531
00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:44,000
Speaker 4: fans of women's sports. That it's demonstrated that when it

532
00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:46,320
Speaker 4: is put on air and we've seen this in the

533
00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:51,040
Speaker 4: Women's Final four, people watch it, you know. Yeah, I mean,

534
00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:55,840
Speaker 4: it is unbelievable, you know, And and that translates to

535
00:28:56,880 --> 00:29:01,400
Speaker 4: you know, women's basketball, College end Pro, the NWSL, which

536
00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:04,040
Speaker 4: is the professional woman soccer league you know, is seeing

537
00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:08,800
Speaker 4: just bigger and bigger numbers. And so what needs to

538
00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:12,720
Speaker 4: happen next, is it just those deals need to keep

539
00:29:12,760 --> 00:29:14,840
Speaker 4: happening so that people can see it and engage with

540
00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:15,280
Speaker 4: the content.

541
00:29:15,400 --> 00:29:17,560
Speaker 3: Do you feel like there's a ripple effect of the

542
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:20,480
Speaker 3: NIL that we haven't seen just yet.

543
00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:25,160
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean there is. We're at a really critical

544
00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 4: moment when it comes to NIL, I think because inevitably,

545
00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:33,360
Speaker 4: like if you were to google NIL and wild Wild West, like,

546
00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:36,120
Speaker 4: you would see a million searches come back, because that's

547
00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 4: what everybody says it is and it's not wrong. There

548
00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:42,880
Speaker 4: is a settlement, not to get too technical about it,

549
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:46,160
Speaker 4: there's a settlement coming between the NCAA and the House

550
00:29:46,160 --> 00:29:49,280
Speaker 4: of Representatives that is going to bring some measure of

551
00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:52,080
Speaker 4: order to how college athletes are going to get paid

552
00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:58,200
Speaker 4: and bring some guardrails to NIL. It does need to happen.

553
00:29:58,480 --> 00:30:02,520
Speaker 4: I think the question, I hope, showing my personal view

554
00:30:02,520 --> 00:30:05,880
Speaker 4: a little bit, I hope the question of whether we

555
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:08,320
Speaker 4: should pay college athletes has been asked and answered. I

556
00:30:08,320 --> 00:30:11,640
Speaker 4: think we all should agree that yes, they should get

557
00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:13,640
Speaker 4: paid they in some form or fashion.

558
00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:16,520
Speaker 2: A you know, the getting.

559
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:20,600
Speaker 4: Paid for the college education is a farce. And the

560
00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:25,760
Speaker 4: amount of money that's being generated, especially for college football

561
00:30:26,040 --> 00:30:29,440
Speaker 4: and college basketball, the amount of money that the schools,

562
00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:31,000
Speaker 4: the coaches, et cetera.

563
00:30:31,040 --> 00:30:32,560
Speaker 2: Are getting on the.

564
00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:37,320
Speaker 4: Backs of free labor, like that's that's patently unfair. I

565
00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:39,800
Speaker 4: do think there are more ripple effects. I don't know exactly.

566
00:30:40,080 --> 00:30:42,360
Speaker 4: I don't think anybody knows exactly where it's going to go.

567
00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:48,000
Speaker 4: I do think though, that we will continue paying college athletes,

568
00:30:48,040 --> 00:30:48,560
Speaker 4: and we should.

569
00:30:48,920 --> 00:30:49,360
Speaker 3: I agree.

570
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:51,480
Speaker 1: I mean, I feel so bad for the athletes that

571
00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:54,000
Speaker 1: made it to college on these big scholarships and then

572
00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:55,880
Speaker 1: get injured, and it's like they didn't even have the

573
00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:56,880
Speaker 1: opportunity to make a.

574
00:30:56,840 --> 00:30:58,960
Speaker 3: Little bit of change before not being able.

575
00:30:58,720 --> 00:30:59,760
Speaker 2: To go pro totally.

576
00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:04,440
Speaker 4: And the percentage of people who you know, really do

577
00:31:05,720 --> 00:31:10,600
Speaker 4: make it so small is infinitesimal.

578
00:31:10,960 --> 00:31:12,920
Speaker 2: It's so small, so small.

579
00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:17,680
Speaker 4: The reason that Livy Dunn and Paige Beckers and Juju

580
00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:21,120
Speaker 4: Watkins and so many of the other athletes female and

581
00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:28,040
Speaker 4: male are are getting paid is because they deliver, you know,

582
00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:31,000
Speaker 4: like people like, people listen to them, they buy the

583
00:31:31,000 --> 00:31:35,280
Speaker 4: products that they're selling, so you know that. I think

584
00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:39,960
Speaker 4: it's it's really important to note that, you know, State

585
00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:42,720
Speaker 4: Farm and Ally, I mean, those are two companies that

586
00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:45,840
Speaker 4: have invested heavily in women's sports. They're not doing it

587
00:31:45,920 --> 00:31:49,080
Speaker 4: that that's not charitable. They're doing it because they can

588
00:31:49,120 --> 00:31:51,880
Speaker 4: make money. And the big shift that's happened, really, I

589
00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:56,000
Speaker 4: think in the past three to five years is and

590
00:31:56,440 --> 00:31:59,200
Speaker 4: just about anyone who's deeply involved in women's sports will

591
00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:02,080
Speaker 4: tell you this, is that there was a massive shift

592
00:32:03,360 --> 00:32:07,640
Speaker 4: of team owners and investors who went from me like, oh,

593
00:32:07,760 --> 00:32:09,840
Speaker 4: this is really cool, like we're like supporting it, like

594
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:12,440
Speaker 4: go girls, like this is great, to like, I want

595
00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:15,080
Speaker 4: to make some money. And the fact of the matter is,

596
00:32:15,120 --> 00:32:18,479
Speaker 4: and this is like Bloomberg guy speaking like that, when

597
00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:21,360
Speaker 4: people make money, like more people are going to pile

598
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:23,320
Speaker 4: in because they want to make money. And that's how

599
00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:26,440
Speaker 4: businesses grow, and that's how women's sports is going to grow,

600
00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:27,520
Speaker 4: is people keep.

601
00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:27,960
Speaker 2: Investing in it.

602
00:32:28,120 --> 00:32:30,240
Speaker 1: When you first started out as a journalist at Bloomberg,

603
00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:32,880
Speaker 1: what did your role look like then and kind of

604
00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:33,760
Speaker 1: how has it evolved now.

605
00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:34,160
Speaker 2: I'm glad.

606
00:32:34,280 --> 00:32:37,640
Speaker 4: I'm glad you put it in that context because I

607
00:32:37,840 --> 00:32:40,960
Speaker 4: feel unbelievably fortunate to have had the career that I've

608
00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:43,520
Speaker 4: had it at Bloomberg. And you know, I came in

609
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:46,240
Speaker 4: in two thousand and two in the Atlanta bureau, like

610
00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:50,600
Speaker 4: covering big, big technology companies, you know, writing about earnings

611
00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:53,920
Speaker 4: and you know, writing off of press releases and trying

612
00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:57,040
Speaker 4: to break news about Intel and Motorola and Texas instruments

613
00:32:57,040 --> 00:33:01,360
Speaker 4: and things like that. And you know, I do feel

614
00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:07,720
Speaker 4: like my career at Bloomberg where I've been. I mean,

615
00:33:07,920 --> 00:33:12,240
Speaker 4: I make the joke that I've written everything from a

616
00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:13,200
Speaker 4: tweet to a book.

617
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:15,120
Speaker 2: You know.

618
00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:18,920
Speaker 4: I've had the opportunity to write magazine cover stories for

619
00:33:19,280 --> 00:33:24,680
Speaker 4: multiple magazines that we've had. I've hosted television shows, radio shows,

620
00:33:25,480 --> 00:33:28,960
Speaker 4: you know, original series. I was our New York peer chief.

621
00:33:29,640 --> 00:33:34,600
Speaker 4: I wrote two books. I ran our live events business.

622
00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:39,800
Speaker 4: I mean, it is a It is a company and

623
00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:44,880
Speaker 4: a news organization that is deeply invested in innovation, you know.

624
00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:48,240
Speaker 4: I mean this is a company that was founded in

625
00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:52,440
Speaker 4: nineteen eighty one by Mike Bloomberg because he saw an

626
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:57,040
Speaker 4: opportunity to bring transparency to the bond market. And so

627
00:33:57,200 --> 00:34:01,400
Speaker 4: that notion of like transparency but also so creating something

628
00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:06,880
Speaker 4: new like pervades everything that we do. And you know,

629
00:34:06,960 --> 00:34:10,239
Speaker 4: I think it favors and I would like to think

630
00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:14,319
Speaker 4: I'm an example of this. It favors people who want

631
00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:17,680
Speaker 4: to try new things. You know, I've been very fortunate

632
00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:19,600
Speaker 4: to be able to raise my hand and say I

633
00:34:19,600 --> 00:34:21,759
Speaker 4: want to try this, like I think there's something here,

634
00:34:22,040 --> 00:34:24,200
Speaker 4: even if it's like I want to write a story

635
00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:26,520
Speaker 4: or I want to go to this place and report

636
00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:28,319
Speaker 4: this out and see what's happening. I want to go

637
00:34:28,360 --> 00:34:31,200
Speaker 4: interview this person. One of the things we think about

638
00:34:31,239 --> 00:34:33,640
Speaker 4: and I think the Deal is a really interesting example

639
00:34:33,680 --> 00:34:37,839
Speaker 4: of this is that represents how we're thinking now, is

640
00:34:38,440 --> 00:34:41,760
Speaker 4: we need to meet people where they are in terms

641
00:34:41,880 --> 00:34:46,120
Speaker 4: of getting our good stuff to them. And so when

642
00:34:46,160 --> 00:34:50,439
Speaker 4: it comes to the Deal, it's one of the first

643
00:34:50,520 --> 00:34:53,319
Speaker 4: times we really can see something from the beginning as

644
00:34:54,280 --> 00:34:57,319
Speaker 4: it's a video show, it's a TV show, it's a podcast,

645
00:34:57,480 --> 00:35:02,360
Speaker 4: it's social, it's written, it's you know, distributed it however

646
00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:03,239
Speaker 4: you want to get it.

647
00:35:03,239 --> 00:35:05,399
Speaker 2: It's going to be there for you, whether you maybe

648
00:35:05,400 --> 00:35:08,520
Speaker 2: sometimes whether you want or not, but and listen it.

649
00:35:08,719 --> 00:35:10,360
Speaker 4: You know, it took a lot of people sort of

650
00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:13,320
Speaker 4: coming together to do that, but that was the idea

651
00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:18,080
Speaker 4: was and and we had never to my knowledge, done

652
00:35:18,760 --> 00:35:22,640
Speaker 4: a show where you know, we paired an external talent

653
00:35:22,719 --> 00:35:26,719
Speaker 4: with an internal talent I use that term loosely, you know,

654
00:35:26,800 --> 00:35:29,920
Speaker 4: a Bloomberg journalist and an outside expert to sort of

655
00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:33,759
Speaker 4: create a show, you know, like this and uh, and

656
00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:37,040
Speaker 4: so I think it speaks to our willingness to like,

657
00:35:37,239 --> 00:35:37,839
Speaker 4: let's try it.

658
00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:40,640
Speaker 1: What I'm really getting from that too, from you also

659
00:35:40,680 --> 00:35:43,839
Speaker 1: as an individual, is it's so cool knowing how as

660
00:35:43,880 --> 00:35:46,319
Speaker 1: a journalist you've been able to tap into all of

661
00:35:46,320 --> 00:35:49,840
Speaker 1: these different mediums of storytelling. You're not just a writer

662
00:35:50,040 --> 00:35:53,680
Speaker 1: like you're a host, You're you're a camera facing journalist.

663
00:35:53,719 --> 00:35:55,480
Speaker 1: Did you ever think, like when you were writing for

664
00:35:55,520 --> 00:35:58,000
Speaker 1: the newspaper back in college, your high school, that you'd

665
00:35:58,040 --> 00:36:01,120
Speaker 1: eventually be sitting next to a Rod hosting a show

666
00:36:01,160 --> 00:36:04,279
Speaker 1: with him on camera just speaks so much to being

667
00:36:04,280 --> 00:36:06,880
Speaker 1: a curious person and being open to trying new things.

668
00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:08,440
Speaker 2: Well, thank you. I did not.

669
00:36:09,440 --> 00:36:13,280
Speaker 4: I definitely did not, and I definitely have. I definitely

670
00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:16,080
Speaker 4: have had some moments. I was flying off to do

671
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:23,120
Speaker 4: some interview for the deal and my college ades sons.

672
00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:25,200
Speaker 4: You know, we have a family, like every like every

673
00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:27,880
Speaker 4: family should. We have a good family. Text text Chane

674
00:36:28,200 --> 00:36:29,839
Speaker 4: and I said, you know, boys, I'm not gonna be home.

675
00:36:29,880 --> 00:36:31,840
Speaker 2: I'm going to be doing this and they're like, what,

676
00:36:32,000 --> 00:36:32,920
Speaker 2: you know, who are you interviewing?

677
00:36:32,960 --> 00:36:35,480
Speaker 4: And I think it was like I think it was

678
00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:39,440
Speaker 4: actually season one and we were going to La and

679
00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:40,880
Speaker 4: I was interviewing. Uh.

680
00:36:41,480 --> 00:36:44,760
Speaker 2: We had in one day, we taped interviews with Maria

681
00:36:44,800 --> 00:36:45,920
Speaker 2: Shripov and Derek Jeter.

682
00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:48,560
Speaker 3: I just watched the Derek Jeter one.

683
00:36:48,600 --> 00:36:51,200
Speaker 4: It was great, which was amazing, and it was an

684
00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:53,560
Speaker 4: amazing conversation to see the two, you know, to see

685
00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:59,080
Speaker 4: Alex and Derek together. And and I I'm pretty sure

686
00:36:59,080 --> 00:37:01,719
Speaker 4: one of my sons that day texted back, this isn't

687
00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:02,160
Speaker 4: a job.

688
00:37:03,680 --> 00:37:07,040
Speaker 2: And I can see the point like it. It often

689
00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:07,960
Speaker 2: doesn't seem like it.

690
00:37:08,040 --> 00:37:11,479
Speaker 4: And it is really fun to get to talk to

691
00:37:11,600 --> 00:37:14,680
Speaker 4: people like that. And honestly, to you know, I feel

692
00:37:14,760 --> 00:37:17,240
Speaker 4: very fortunate to work alongside Alex. He's a great partner.

693
00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:22,680
Speaker 4: We you know, we've gotten very close, and I think

694
00:37:23,719 --> 00:37:27,200
Speaker 4: the best episodes are the ones where we really just

695
00:37:27,560 --> 00:37:28,439
Speaker 4: you know, we're in a flow.

696
00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:30,240
Speaker 2: We're teammates and we're partners.

697
00:37:30,280 --> 00:37:31,960
Speaker 1: First, I want to ask, you know, how did this

698
00:37:32,000 --> 00:37:35,000
Speaker 1: podcast come to be and what is it like working

699
00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:36,720
Speaker 1: alongside somebody like a Rod.

700
00:37:36,840 --> 00:37:38,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I had done.

701
00:37:40,360 --> 00:37:43,000
Speaker 4: I'd done this series called Athlete Empire as part of

702
00:37:43,000 --> 00:37:48,160
Speaker 4: Bloomberg Originals, and and I had interviewed Alex during COVID

703
00:37:48,560 --> 00:37:50,879
Speaker 4: for you know, you know, we're all remote, we're doing

704
00:37:50,880 --> 00:37:57,480
Speaker 4: these remote conferences, and he happened to be coming in

705
00:37:57,560 --> 00:37:59,080
Speaker 4: a few months later, he happened to be coming into

706
00:37:59,080 --> 00:38:01,960
Speaker 4: Bloomberg for an in person interview, not with me, just

707
00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:05,839
Speaker 4: for Bloomberg Television, and someone flagged that he was coming

708
00:38:05,840 --> 00:38:07,319
Speaker 4: in and I was like, oh, go, say hi, I've

709
00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:09,800
Speaker 4: never I don't remember. I think i'd met him once,

710
00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:14,120
Speaker 4: like we had shaken hands years before. And so I

711
00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:17,560
Speaker 4: went into the makeup room actually, and he's like getting

712
00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:18,120
Speaker 4: made up, and I.

713
00:38:18,080 --> 00:38:19,239
Speaker 2: Was like, hey, I'm Jason. You know.

714
00:38:19,280 --> 00:38:20,799
Speaker 4: We talked and he's like, hey, man, how you doing, Tore,

715
00:38:21,719 --> 00:38:25,480
Speaker 4: And I sort of just pitched him in that moment.

716
00:38:26,719 --> 00:38:30,279
Speaker 4: I said, I have this idea about a series on

717
00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:34,960
Speaker 4: athletes and their business ambitions. I really, you know, I

718
00:38:35,000 --> 00:38:38,480
Speaker 4: am intrigued by what you've done. I'd love to come

719
00:38:38,520 --> 00:38:40,359
Speaker 4: spend a couple of days with you in Miami if

720
00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:42,359
Speaker 4: you're a game for it. And he said, pretty much

721
00:38:42,400 --> 00:38:43,959
Speaker 4: on the spot, he said yeah, that would be great.

722
00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:45,960
Speaker 4: And he's like, and this is the way he is.

723
00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:47,799
Speaker 4: He's like he's thinking about it, like yeah, we could

724
00:38:47,840 --> 00:38:49,239
Speaker 4: do this, and I'll show you this thing and you

725
00:38:49,239 --> 00:38:50,880
Speaker 4: can come to the office and all these different things.

726
00:38:51,080 --> 00:38:54,239
Speaker 4: So we did that and then we just kept in touch.

727
00:38:55,320 --> 00:38:59,280
Speaker 4: He has an amazing chief business officer named Kelly Leferrier

728
00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:04,319
Speaker 4: and she lives up here in the Northeast, and so

729
00:39:04,480 --> 00:39:06,439
Speaker 4: she and I would get together, you know, like every

730
00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:12,000
Speaker 4: few months, just have lunch. And about three years ago

731
00:39:12,680 --> 00:39:14,560
Speaker 4: she called and said, you know, Alex and I have

732
00:39:14,600 --> 00:39:16,359
Speaker 4: some ideas about, you know, how you and he could

733
00:39:16,360 --> 00:39:19,399
Speaker 4: work together. You're going to be in Miami at all

734
00:39:19,600 --> 00:39:21,560
Speaker 4: and I happen to be going down for a speaking engagement,

735
00:39:21,560 --> 00:39:28,200
Speaker 4: and so we had lunch and we we started It

736
00:39:28,239 --> 00:39:31,640
Speaker 4: was it was as he was getting into his ownership,

737
00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:35,640
Speaker 4: his then minority ownership of the Minnesota timber Wolves.

738
00:39:35,440 --> 00:39:37,080
Speaker 2: And Lynx, and so we got into that.

739
00:39:37,200 --> 00:39:39,479
Speaker 4: We basically just like sit down and we're just like going,

740
00:39:39,560 --> 00:39:41,440
Speaker 4: We're just talking about like, oh and this thing, and

741
00:39:41,480 --> 00:39:44,120
Speaker 4: what do you think about this? And and he's asking

742
00:39:44,160 --> 00:39:46,280
Speaker 4: me like what have I seen with other ownership groups,

743
00:39:46,280 --> 00:39:51,440
Speaker 4: and we're just like rapping and he's like we should

744
00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:53,200
Speaker 4: work together, and I said, well, maybe we should. We

745
00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:55,080
Speaker 4: could do a show and we could do a podcast.

746
00:39:55,280 --> 00:39:59,360
Speaker 4: And he said, well, but what would the show be?

747
00:40:00,320 --> 00:40:01,799
Speaker 4: And I remember saying, I was like well, not to

748
00:40:01,840 --> 00:40:03,759
Speaker 4: be too like Seinfeld about it, but like this is

749
00:40:03,800 --> 00:40:04,160
Speaker 4: the show.

750
00:40:04,320 --> 00:40:05,120
Speaker 2: Like this is the show.

751
00:40:05,160 --> 00:40:08,000
Speaker 4: Like it's us talking and you know, we'd bring people

752
00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:11,880
Speaker 4: in that we know and talk to them about the

753
00:40:13,280 --> 00:40:16,239
Speaker 4: you know, sort of their business ambitions, like and you know,

754
00:40:16,320 --> 00:40:18,279
Speaker 4: and you would you know, be able to weigh in

755
00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:20,960
Speaker 4: with your experience and you know, I'm the journalist in

756
00:40:20,960 --> 00:40:25,000
Speaker 4: the room, et cetera. And he basically said, I love it.

757
00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:27,719
Speaker 4: Go back to New York see what everybody thinks. And

758
00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:31,400
Speaker 4: I did, and like a few months later we were

759
00:40:31,480 --> 00:40:34,319
Speaker 4: off and running, which again like sort of speaks to

760
00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:36,960
Speaker 4: Bloomberg's you know, willingness to be like, yeah, this sounds

761
00:40:36,960 --> 00:40:40,040
Speaker 4: like a good idea, and we trust you and let's

762
00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:42,960
Speaker 4: see how it goes. That one of the funniest things was,

763
00:40:44,360 --> 00:40:46,480
Speaker 4: I think we literally went through like two hundred and

764
00:40:46,520 --> 00:40:49,040
Speaker 4: fifty names for this, like we just like we couldn't

765
00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:53,080
Speaker 4: come up with something for the show, and you know,

766
00:40:53,120 --> 00:40:56,239
Speaker 4: they're like bad puns related to baseball and you know,

767
00:40:56,280 --> 00:40:58,400
Speaker 4: and then stuff that just like didn't really capture it,

768
00:40:58,800 --> 00:41:00,799
Speaker 4: and we like, but we can sort of coming back

769
00:41:00,800 --> 00:41:04,400
Speaker 4: to this idea of the deal. And finally there was

770
00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:07,240
Speaker 4: a text exchange where I think it was Kelly said,

771
00:41:07,320 --> 00:41:10,120
Speaker 4: I'm here with Alex. He wants to know like what,

772
00:41:10,360 --> 00:41:13,080
Speaker 4: like what do you want and like what do you

773
00:41:13,160 --> 00:41:15,160
Speaker 4: like the most? And I said, I really like the

774
00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:16,919
Speaker 4: deal and he's like, I do too.

775
00:41:17,040 --> 00:41:17,279
Speaker 2: Done.

776
00:41:17,800 --> 00:41:21,160
Speaker 4: And what's funny about that is, I don't think we

777
00:41:21,320 --> 00:41:26,319
Speaker 4: realized at the time how much of a nice framework

778
00:41:26,400 --> 00:41:31,640
Speaker 4: the name gave us because, as you well know as

779
00:41:31,640 --> 00:41:33,880
Speaker 4: a fellow podcaster, a lot of podcasts out there, a

780
00:41:33,880 --> 00:41:37,479
Speaker 4: lot of deals and a lot of deals. But we

781
00:41:37,560 --> 00:41:41,440
Speaker 4: and we wanted something that would immediately say to people,

782
00:41:42,120 --> 00:41:45,279
Speaker 4: both the guests and the listeners and the viewers, this

783
00:41:45,320 --> 00:41:47,239
Speaker 4: is going to be a little bit different. Like we're like,

784
00:41:47,719 --> 00:41:51,000
Speaker 4: if we're talking to Michael Strahan, we're not talking about

785
00:41:51,320 --> 00:41:53,520
Speaker 4: we may talk a little bit about football, but we're

786
00:41:53,520 --> 00:41:55,960
Speaker 4: really going to talk about him as a businessman, you know.

787
00:41:56,040 --> 00:42:00,160
Speaker 4: And if we're talking to you know, Josh Harris, the

788
00:42:00,200 --> 00:42:03,239
Speaker 4: owner of the Washington Commanders in the Philadelphia Philadelphia seventy

789
00:42:03,280 --> 00:42:06,120
Speaker 4: six ers and more, but we're gonna talk about deals

790
00:42:06,120 --> 00:42:08,040
Speaker 4: like we're gonna talk and you know, and on that

791
00:42:08,120 --> 00:42:10,560
Speaker 4: episode we talked about the deal to you know, build

792
00:42:10,560 --> 00:42:13,279
Speaker 4: this unbelievable new stadium, in Washington and sort of what

793
00:42:13,360 --> 00:42:15,799
Speaker 4: it took to get that, and so it gives us

794
00:42:15,840 --> 00:42:22,879
Speaker 4: this kind of home base in a way to sort

795
00:42:22,880 --> 00:42:24,239
Speaker 4: of build the conversation around it.

796
00:42:24,400 --> 00:42:26,480
Speaker 1: That's how it feels when you're listening and you know

797
00:42:26,600 --> 00:42:30,760
Speaker 1: you're gonna learn about a very niche topic about this person,

798
00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:33,360
Speaker 1: that specific thing, yeah, that you really don't get to

799
00:42:33,400 --> 00:42:46,759
Speaker 1: hear about in other interviews. Out of all of the

800
00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:49,720
Speaker 1: athletes you guys have been able to interview on your show,

801
00:42:49,800 --> 00:42:51,840
Speaker 1: who would you say is the most business savvy?

802
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:57,080
Speaker 4: I mean, a Rod is definitely up there. I would

803
00:42:57,120 --> 00:43:00,000
Speaker 4: say it's hard. It's hard to choose.

804
00:43:02,040 --> 00:43:05,359
Speaker 2: Straighthan blew me away. I think his.

805
00:43:06,920 --> 00:43:11,640
Speaker 4: I think his approach it was interesting. So we essentially

806
00:43:11,640 --> 00:43:14,239
Speaker 4: did sort of back to back episodes around him or

807
00:43:14,280 --> 00:43:18,399
Speaker 4: sort of involving him, because we taped an episode with him.

808
00:43:18,400 --> 00:43:21,400
Speaker 4: And then he has a partner named Constance Schwartz Marini

809
00:43:22,200 --> 00:43:24,920
Speaker 4: who they created this company called Smack Together, and she

810
00:43:25,120 --> 00:43:28,239
Speaker 4: really had such a strong hand in making him who

811
00:43:28,280 --> 00:43:33,920
Speaker 4: he is. She's also the chief advisor to Coach Prime.

812
00:43:34,080 --> 00:43:36,160
Speaker 4: I mean, she's a force. And it's one of my

813
00:43:36,560 --> 00:43:38,839
Speaker 4: all time favorite episodes and it's actually one of our

814
00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:40,200
Speaker 4: best performing episodes as well.

815
00:43:40,960 --> 00:43:41,600
Speaker 2: Cons is.

816
00:43:44,200 --> 00:43:52,160
Speaker 4: Michael's ambition and his understanding of how he could use

817
00:43:53,440 --> 00:43:55,720
Speaker 4: the platform that he had not just as an athlete,

818
00:43:55,719 --> 00:43:58,680
Speaker 4: but as an athlete in New York. I think was

819
00:43:58,920 --> 00:44:04,959
Speaker 4: so smart and so compelling. And he is also such

820
00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:10,800
Speaker 4: a nice and genuine human being, and so I think

821
00:44:11,719 --> 00:44:17,200
Speaker 4: I really was impressed by his depth of understanding, his

822
00:44:19,239 --> 00:44:27,440
Speaker 4: willingness to work hard, you know, very holistically. So he

823
00:44:28,719 --> 00:44:33,759
Speaker 4: is definitely He's definitely someone that I hold in high

824
00:44:33,840 --> 00:44:34,480
Speaker 4: esteem on that.

825
00:44:34,680 --> 00:44:36,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I like that you said his ability to

826
00:44:36,600 --> 00:44:38,480
Speaker 1: work hard, because I feel like that's.

827
00:44:38,360 --> 00:44:40,600
Speaker 3: And I mean, you guys know more than anybody, but.

828
00:44:40,760 --> 00:44:44,640
Speaker 1: I feel like that grit level is such a common

829
00:44:44,760 --> 00:44:47,919
Speaker 1: thread that you hear about that athletes have. And even

830
00:44:47,960 --> 00:44:49,680
Speaker 1: when I was talking to John Gray, I was asking

831
00:44:49,760 --> 00:44:51,080
Speaker 1: him who do you guys look for in a new

832
00:44:51,160 --> 00:44:53,960
Speaker 1: hire at Blackstone, And one of the examples that he

833
00:44:54,040 --> 00:44:56,719
Speaker 1: gave is he said, you know, I love hiring.

834
00:44:56,400 --> 00:44:59,720
Speaker 3: Athletes because they do what it takes.

835
00:45:00,440 --> 00:45:02,480
Speaker 1: It's cool knowing that your sons are your sons a

836
00:45:02,520 --> 00:45:06,040
Speaker 1: college lacrosse player, because I know from experience with my brothers,

837
00:45:06,120 --> 00:45:08,800
Speaker 1: like it was such a good mark on the resume

838
00:45:08,920 --> 00:45:13,399
Speaker 1: to have that team experience, that background, because companies do

839
00:45:13,480 --> 00:45:14,640
Speaker 1: love hiring athletes.

840
00:45:14,680 --> 00:45:17,320
Speaker 4: And I will tell you the thing that I and

841
00:45:17,760 --> 00:45:20,920
Speaker 4: so I'll take the first question in a slightly different direction,

842
00:45:20,960 --> 00:45:28,120
Speaker 4: which is I think one attribute, the attribute even beyond

843
00:45:28,840 --> 00:45:33,040
Speaker 4: working hard, discipline, goal setting, all of that that I

844
00:45:33,120 --> 00:45:38,479
Speaker 4: admire and appreciate so much, and I appreciate it every

845
00:45:38,560 --> 00:45:40,680
Speaker 4: day with Alex is coachability.

846
00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:42,200
Speaker 2: And I think.

847
00:45:42,040 --> 00:45:53,560
Speaker 4: The the the ability to take feedback constructively is an

848
00:45:53,600 --> 00:45:56,960
Speaker 4: absolute superpower and I see it with my son and

849
00:45:57,239 --> 00:45:59,080
Speaker 4: in his teammates. And I do think one of the

850
00:45:59,120 --> 00:46:03,040
Speaker 4: reasons that you know there is a very high percentage

851
00:46:03,040 --> 00:46:06,600
Speaker 4: of athletes who get to the C suite is because

852
00:46:06,760 --> 00:46:08,759
Speaker 4: they have a lot of those skills, and I do

853
00:46:08,800 --> 00:46:12,560
Speaker 4: think feedback is one of them. And you think about it,

854
00:46:12,560 --> 00:46:15,720
Speaker 4: it totally makes sense in that. I mean, I've watched

855
00:46:15,760 --> 00:46:18,799
Speaker 4: my son do this where he's on the field, he

856
00:46:18,840 --> 00:46:21,960
Speaker 4: makes a mistake, he comes off, coach gets in his face,

857
00:46:22,120 --> 00:46:25,640
Speaker 4: says don't do this again. And then he can't go

858
00:46:25,719 --> 00:46:28,799
Speaker 4: sit on the bench and like cry, you know, he

859
00:46:29,040 --> 00:46:31,839
Speaker 4: like he's got to He literally has to go back

860
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:36,160
Speaker 4: out on the field and take that in and learn

861
00:46:36,200 --> 00:46:40,520
Speaker 4: from it immediately. And not and and then move on

862
00:46:40,760 --> 00:46:44,040
Speaker 4: and then and sort of internalize it and pack it

863
00:46:44,080 --> 00:46:46,480
Speaker 4: away and do it right the next time, you know,

864
00:46:46,600 --> 00:46:49,279
Speaker 4: if you think about you know, and Alex talks about

865
00:46:49,320 --> 00:46:51,480
Speaker 4: this all the time, like the number of times he's

866
00:46:51,520 --> 00:46:54,640
Speaker 4: struck out and then he's got and then you know,

867
00:46:54,760 --> 00:46:57,040
Speaker 4: probably twenty minutes later, he's got to go up and

868
00:46:57,040 --> 00:46:59,480
Speaker 4: do it again, and he's got to figure out, Okay,

869
00:47:00,560 --> 00:47:01,879
Speaker 4: what did the pitcher do last time?

870
00:47:01,960 --> 00:47:02,759
Speaker 2: What I learned from that?

871
00:47:03,000 --> 00:47:05,400
Speaker 4: What are my teammates telling me, What is my hitting

872
00:47:05,400 --> 00:47:08,400
Speaker 4: coach saying, what is my manager saying? You know, you

873
00:47:08,440 --> 00:47:11,680
Speaker 4: babble a ball like the next pitch is coming, like

874
00:47:11,719 --> 00:47:16,719
Speaker 4: you got to go? And that is an unbelievably valuable

875
00:47:16,760 --> 00:47:18,200
Speaker 4: skill in life.

876
00:47:18,640 --> 00:47:21,560
Speaker 3: Absolutely having that adaptability is so important.

877
00:47:21,600 --> 00:47:21,960
Speaker 2: Totally.

878
00:47:22,360 --> 00:47:25,280
Speaker 1: In your conversation with Serena, I found it so interesting

879
00:47:25,320 --> 00:47:27,879
Speaker 1: when she was saying that the advice her dad gave

880
00:47:27,880 --> 00:47:30,919
Speaker 1: her when she was younger was telling her that you're

881
00:47:31,360 --> 00:47:33,239
Speaker 1: not going to make the most of your money on

882
00:47:33,320 --> 00:47:34,960
Speaker 1: the court, You're going to make it off the court.

883
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:38,960
Speaker 1: And I loved hearing about her first deal with Puma

884
00:47:39,360 --> 00:47:41,960
Speaker 1: and how there was something about a cat suit and

885
00:47:42,160 --> 00:47:44,440
Speaker 1: this whole kind of cultural phenomenon of what she was

886
00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:47,520
Speaker 1: wearing on the court and how that catapulted her into

887
00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:51,160
Speaker 1: almost like a different stratosphere of a player. So on

888
00:47:51,200 --> 00:47:53,000
Speaker 1: that note, I would love it if we could dive

889
00:47:53,080 --> 00:47:56,760
Speaker 1: into cultural capital and its impact on business.

890
00:47:57,120 --> 00:47:59,480
Speaker 4: I think if I had to, you know, if I

891
00:47:59,480 --> 00:48:01,080
Speaker 4: had to tell the are it, I mean, what I

892
00:48:01,120 --> 00:48:05,000
Speaker 4: would say is she knew that she was doing something

893
00:48:05,040 --> 00:48:07,040
Speaker 4: important when she wore the you know, I mean, if

894
00:48:07,280 --> 00:48:09,600
Speaker 4: you google Serena Williams and Katsu like, you'll see you'll

895
00:48:09,600 --> 00:48:12,239
Speaker 4: see a million pictures of it. I think what she

896
00:48:12,480 --> 00:48:19,400
Speaker 4: realized and what's such an amazing lesson is the cultural

897
00:48:19,480 --> 00:48:24,319
Speaker 4: impact that sports and our sports, our top athletes have

898
00:48:25,040 --> 00:48:29,759
Speaker 4: on the broader world and how much they influence what

899
00:48:29,800 --> 00:48:35,120
Speaker 4: we wear, what we buy, what we think. And so

900
00:48:35,800 --> 00:48:43,560
Speaker 4: that moment where she essentially was her authentic self, she

901
00:48:44,719 --> 00:48:48,920
Speaker 4: changed the narrative about not just who she was, but

902
00:48:49,239 --> 00:48:53,279
Speaker 4: what the sport could be. What sport could be, you know,

903
00:48:53,440 --> 00:48:56,360
Speaker 4: in the in the broader conversation, and just the profound

904
00:48:56,480 --> 00:49:00,960
Speaker 4: influence that you know, people can have by the by

905
00:49:01,000 --> 00:49:02,000
Speaker 4: the choices they make.

906
00:49:02,120 --> 00:49:04,640
Speaker 2: And you know.

907
00:49:04,600 --> 00:49:09,040
Speaker 4: I think we love sports for those reasons because it

908
00:49:09,200 --> 00:49:12,400
Speaker 4: does as I, as I was saying earlier, it just

909
00:49:13,080 --> 00:49:16,160
Speaker 4: it hits bigger, it hits different. There's a there's an

910
00:49:16,200 --> 00:49:20,920
Speaker 4: emotion to it. There's a connection that we have to

911
00:49:21,000 --> 00:49:24,080
Speaker 4: our teams. You know, I grew up down South, and

912
00:49:26,080 --> 00:49:31,799
Speaker 4: the the deep emotional connection that people have to their

913
00:49:31,840 --> 00:49:35,600
Speaker 4: college football teams, the only the only thing that I

914
00:49:35,640 --> 00:49:37,879
Speaker 4: think is comparable is.

915
00:49:39,400 --> 00:49:40,480
Speaker 2: English football.

916
00:49:40,560 --> 00:49:45,160
Speaker 4: You know that, like the tribalism, the deep generational connection

917
00:49:45,320 --> 00:49:49,839
Speaker 4: to these teams. This notion that your very being sort

918
00:49:49,880 --> 00:49:53,160
Speaker 4: of rises and falls on the performance of this of

919
00:49:53,239 --> 00:49:56,560
Speaker 4: this club or this team is just amazing. And some

920
00:49:56,640 --> 00:50:00,120
Speaker 4: of that is unhealthy at times, but it's also oh,

921
00:50:01,280 --> 00:50:04,000
Speaker 4: I mean, what an amazing connection to have is that,

922
00:50:04,120 --> 00:50:06,759
Speaker 4: you know, I went to Georgetown thirty years ago. I

923
00:50:06,880 --> 00:50:10,960
Speaker 4: still rise and fall on Georgetown basketball, fall mostly these days,

924
00:50:11,000 --> 00:50:15,240
Speaker 4: but sadly. But you know, I think about those iconic athletes.

925
00:50:15,280 --> 00:50:19,160
Speaker 4: I think about you know, again with that experience, you know,

926
00:50:19,200 --> 00:50:22,480
Speaker 4: I think about how culturally relevant I mean, think about

927
00:50:22,880 --> 00:50:27,040
Speaker 4: the impact that Alan Iverson had as a player on

928
00:50:27,080 --> 00:50:31,200
Speaker 4: the culture on fashion, Like Lebron James isn't Lebron James

929
00:50:31,239 --> 00:50:35,400
Speaker 4: without Alan Iverson, you know, and you know, even the

930
00:50:35,440 --> 00:50:37,520
Speaker 4: coaches that we see. Now, not to put too much

931
00:50:37,560 --> 00:50:40,200
Speaker 4: stock in my alma mater, but it's like John Thompson

932
00:50:40,280 --> 00:50:43,799
Speaker 4: like completely changed the narrative about like who a coach

933
00:50:43,800 --> 00:50:46,400
Speaker 4: should be, you know, how he should treat his players,

934
00:50:46,440 --> 00:50:48,719
Speaker 4: what players should expect, what a school should expect from

935
00:50:48,719 --> 00:50:51,759
Speaker 4: a coach. I mean, the sports is just I mean,

936
00:50:51,800 --> 00:50:54,200
Speaker 4: this is this is why I do feel so passionately

937
00:50:54,280 --> 00:50:58,600
Speaker 4: about what we do, is because sports allows us to

938
00:50:58,640 --> 00:51:00,839
Speaker 4: connect in a way that almost nothing else does.

939
00:51:01,000 --> 00:51:03,439
Speaker 1: Part of what you just said leads me to your book,

940
00:51:03,440 --> 00:51:06,560
Speaker 1: Sweat Equity. You wrote an entire book on the booming

941
00:51:06,600 --> 00:51:10,759
Speaker 1: fitness industry for recreational athletes. Yeah, can you talk to

942
00:51:10,880 --> 00:51:13,120
Speaker 1: us a little bit about what inspired the book?

943
00:51:13,280 --> 00:51:17,320
Speaker 2: Yeah? I mean, what's funny? Is it? Really? It?

944
00:51:17,320 --> 00:51:19,560
Speaker 4: It was encapsulated like in our Run Together, you know,

945
00:51:19,640 --> 00:51:22,520
Speaker 4: in that I mean that my inspiration for that book

946
00:51:22,760 --> 00:51:27,439
Speaker 4: was exactly what I was living in the exact sense

947
00:51:27,440 --> 00:51:29,200
Speaker 4: that you and I were running through Brooklyn. Of this

948
00:51:29,400 --> 00:51:34,920
Speaker 4: like this connection with another human being, this association with

949
00:51:36,360 --> 00:51:41,920
Speaker 4: being healthy and thinking about my mind and my body.

950
00:51:43,160 --> 00:51:46,000
Speaker 4: And then of course the business journalist kicks in and

951
00:51:46,040 --> 00:51:47,799
Speaker 4: then it's a question of like, oh, by the way,

952
00:51:47,840 --> 00:51:50,680
Speaker 4: I'm also spending a ton of money, like whether it's

953
00:51:50,719 --> 00:51:53,120
Speaker 4: like to go run a race, whether it's to go

954
00:51:53,120 --> 00:51:54,920
Speaker 4: to a peloton class, whether it's to go to Berry's

955
00:51:54,920 --> 00:51:58,719
Speaker 4: boot camp, whether it's to you know, Byron or Lululemon

956
00:51:59,239 --> 00:52:03,840
Speaker 4: or whatever that may be. And so the main conceit

957
00:52:03,920 --> 00:52:08,279
Speaker 4: of that book, which I think holds true, although I

958
00:52:08,280 --> 00:52:09,799
Speaker 4: would obviously you know, I.

959
00:52:09,800 --> 00:52:15,240
Speaker 3: Think true even more so it's becoming more and more.

960
00:52:15,040 --> 00:52:16,840
Speaker 4: Relevant, right, I mean, I would obviously write it with

961
00:52:16,880 --> 00:52:20,400
Speaker 4: different examples today or a few different examples. Although some

962
00:52:20,520 --> 00:52:24,359
Speaker 4: you know, like Lula Lemon has endured, obviously, Barrious boot

963
00:52:24,360 --> 00:52:27,920
Speaker 4: Camp has endured. You know, there's some things like color

964
00:52:28,000 --> 00:52:30,840
Speaker 4: Run that you know you're like, oh yeah, color Run, Okay,

965
00:52:30,880 --> 00:52:32,520
Speaker 4: tough mutter like that.

966
00:52:32,880 --> 00:52:35,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean people people do that in a way.

967
00:52:35,080 --> 00:52:36,200
Speaker 3: So those were such a moment.

968
00:52:36,520 --> 00:52:40,480
Speaker 1: I mean, those were like the beginning of fitness becoming

969
00:52:41,120 --> 00:52:44,360
Speaker 1: this thing that people identify with versus just being like

970
00:52:44,400 --> 00:52:45,800
Speaker 1: a part of their lifestyle exactly.

971
00:52:45,880 --> 00:52:46,120
Speaker 2: Yeah.

972
00:52:46,120 --> 00:52:48,480
Speaker 4: And that was and I do think and that was

973
00:52:48,600 --> 00:52:51,960
Speaker 4: really the like if if there's as they say in

974
00:52:52,000 --> 00:52:54,560
Speaker 4: the TV, like there was a log line that was it.

975
00:52:54,560 --> 00:52:58,239
Speaker 4: It was like how you know, exercise move from like

976
00:52:58,320 --> 00:53:01,160
Speaker 4: something we did to who we are, and part of

977
00:53:01,280 --> 00:53:03,600
Speaker 4: was even just the way we you know, the way

978
00:53:03,600 --> 00:53:06,840
Speaker 4: we dressed, the idea that you know, men and women

979
00:53:07,080 --> 00:53:10,680
Speaker 4: were you know, going grocery shopping in like the Lululemon

980
00:53:10,960 --> 00:53:14,680
Speaker 4: leggings or you know, showing up and talking about their

981
00:53:14,719 --> 00:53:18,480
Speaker 4: workouts and and all of those things. So it was

982
00:53:18,880 --> 00:53:21,759
Speaker 4: you know, what's funny is if I had to write that,

983
00:53:22,080 --> 00:53:23,480
Speaker 4: I've thought about this. If I had to write the

984
00:53:23,480 --> 00:53:26,840
Speaker 4: book over again today, I would have made it even

985
00:53:26,960 --> 00:53:31,200
Speaker 4: more experiential because I think so much of it was

986
00:53:31,239 --> 00:53:34,560
Speaker 4: about kind of what what I was seeing and living

987
00:53:34,640 --> 00:53:35,400
Speaker 4: and and.

988
00:53:35,120 --> 00:53:36,080
Speaker 2: And people that I knew.

989
00:53:36,080 --> 00:53:39,360
Speaker 4: And there was also this you know, really strong overlap

990
00:53:40,320 --> 00:53:44,360
Speaker 4: with the people who I was interacting with through my

991
00:53:44,760 --> 00:53:47,200
Speaker 4: work as a business journalist.

992
00:53:46,800 --> 00:53:50,200
Speaker 2: Because I mean, if you.

993
00:53:49,239 --> 00:53:52,600
Speaker 4: You know, there are a lot of former athletes who

994
00:53:52,680 --> 00:53:55,240
Speaker 4: work on Wall Street. There are a lot of also

995
00:53:55,400 --> 00:53:58,600
Speaker 4: like endurance athletes, you know, marathon ors, triathletes, et cetera.

996
00:54:00,040 --> 00:54:03,080
Speaker 4: There's a there's definitely a vent diagram that's almost a

997
00:54:03,080 --> 00:54:07,320
Speaker 4: circle of like high achievers who you know, run marathons

998
00:54:07,320 --> 00:54:09,160
Speaker 4: and do all the endurance stuff.

999
00:54:09,200 --> 00:54:12,600
Speaker 1: My parents were in the triathlon, like cruise when I

1000
00:54:12,680 --> 00:54:13,279
Speaker 1: was growing up.

1001
00:54:13,440 --> 00:54:13,960
Speaker 2: It's funny.

1002
00:54:14,000 --> 00:54:19,520
Speaker 4: I'm I'm in it a lot less now just but

1003
00:54:19,800 --> 00:54:22,600
Speaker 4: I mean maybe I'm a bit of a cliche. It's

1004
00:54:22,640 --> 00:54:25,080
Speaker 4: like I play more golf now more because I could

1005
00:54:25,080 --> 00:54:27,120
Speaker 4: play with my sons, and like it's a whole new thing.

1006
00:54:27,160 --> 00:54:28,480
Speaker 4: Like yeah, and part of it is like I was

1007
00:54:28,520 --> 00:54:30,680
Speaker 4: looking for a new challenge and I wanted to to

1008
00:54:30,719 --> 00:54:32,719
Speaker 4: do something and now I'm like that guy who's like

1009
00:54:32,760 --> 00:54:35,640
Speaker 4: talking about golf all the time, which maybe I don't love,

1010
00:54:35,880 --> 00:54:38,040
Speaker 4: but I do remember, you know, it's like my running

1011
00:54:38,080 --> 00:54:40,680
Speaker 4: group and my running team and you know, and the

1012
00:54:41,400 --> 00:54:43,040
Speaker 4: your your schedule.

1013
00:54:43,040 --> 00:54:44,600
Speaker 2: I mean I remember just getting up.

1014
00:54:44,719 --> 00:54:47,400
Speaker 4: I mean my wife would would would WinCE at this,

1015
00:54:47,640 --> 00:54:50,359
Speaker 4: like you know, getting up at like four forty five

1016
00:54:50,480 --> 00:54:52,760
Speaker 4: five in the morning to like get in ten miles

1017
00:54:52,800 --> 00:54:55,640
Speaker 4: before work because like I had.

1018
00:54:55,560 --> 00:54:58,400
Speaker 2: A marathon and like I really wanted to qualify.

1019
00:54:58,000 --> 00:55:01,520
Speaker 4: For Boston, and it was just, you know, I cared

1020
00:55:01,560 --> 00:55:03,399
Speaker 4: so much about what I ate. I cared so much

1021
00:55:03,440 --> 00:55:07,920
Speaker 4: about like you know, alcohol and you know all of

1022
00:55:07,960 --> 00:55:10,520
Speaker 4: these things that were just it was so much of

1023
00:55:10,560 --> 00:55:13,600
Speaker 4: who I was, and I certainly wasn't alone.

1024
00:55:13,719 --> 00:55:16,560
Speaker 3: Were you able to pinpoint when the shift kind of happened?

1025
00:55:17,120 --> 00:55:20,799
Speaker 4: One of the big moments was I remember in the

1026
00:55:20,880 --> 00:55:25,640
Speaker 4: eighties was living in Atlanta and watching my mom like

1027
00:55:25,880 --> 00:55:30,120
Speaker 4: work out to the Jane Fonda, like the HS tapes,

1028
00:55:31,680 --> 00:55:35,759
Speaker 4: and so that was sort of the front end of it.

1029
00:55:36,040 --> 00:55:40,040
Speaker 4: And I think that as we got into the like

1030
00:55:40,480 --> 00:55:47,400
Speaker 4: mid to late nineties was really when when it started

1031
00:55:47,440 --> 00:55:50,239
Speaker 4: to it started to sort of become more and more

1032
00:55:50,239 --> 00:55:52,440
Speaker 4: of the lifestyle. I think baby boomers had something to

1033
00:55:52,480 --> 00:55:54,680
Speaker 4: do with it, But then you know, I'm gen X

1034
00:55:55,840 --> 00:55:59,719
Speaker 4: and I think it was my generation that you know,

1035
00:56:00,040 --> 00:56:04,160
Speaker 4: coming into the again late nineties early two thousands, like

1036
00:56:04,320 --> 00:56:08,440
Speaker 4: started to run more, and then and then the and

1037
00:56:08,480 --> 00:56:11,240
Speaker 4: then the next level up was really that boutique fitness

1038
00:56:11,280 --> 00:56:13,840
Speaker 4: craze and you know, soul Cycle was such a moment.

1039
00:56:14,080 --> 00:56:16,279
Speaker 4: And one of the things I write about in that

1040
00:56:16,320 --> 00:56:21,480
Speaker 4: book is that I took from uh investor friend of

1041
00:56:21,520 --> 00:56:24,440
Speaker 4: mine in Atlanta was this notion of like cheeseburgers and

1042
00:56:24,480 --> 00:56:29,759
Speaker 4: cupcakes and that neither of which is especially healthy, which

1043
00:56:29,920 --> 00:56:33,600
Speaker 4: makes it an even funny or fitness metaphor. But the

1044
00:56:33,719 --> 00:56:35,680
Speaker 4: like cup I mean remember when like cupcakes were all

1045
00:56:35,680 --> 00:56:38,560
Speaker 4: the crazy in New York stities like Magdellian sprinkles and

1046
00:56:38,600 --> 00:56:40,400
Speaker 4: all these different things, like cupcakes were sort of a

1047
00:56:40,440 --> 00:56:43,200
Speaker 4: fat like it was like cupcakes. My friend Alan Taylor,

1048
00:56:43,200 --> 00:56:45,160
Speaker 4: who came up with this, like he would tell you that,

1049
00:56:45,320 --> 00:56:50,040
Speaker 4: like with everything, like cheeseburgers are actually eternal. So like

1050
00:56:50,160 --> 00:56:53,880
Speaker 4: yoga is a cheeseburger. Like people have done yoga literally

1051
00:56:53,880 --> 00:56:55,600
Speaker 4: for thousands of years. It's sort of got big and

1052
00:56:55,680 --> 00:56:58,200
Speaker 4: you know, sixties and seventies and it's still like it's

1053
00:56:58,280 --> 00:57:02,360
Speaker 4: still you know, like deady State. Running is a cheeseburger.

1054
00:57:02,400 --> 00:57:03,680
Speaker 4: Cycling is a cheeseburger.

1055
00:57:04,560 --> 00:57:05,640
Speaker 3: I love this analogy.

1056
00:57:05,760 --> 00:57:06,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's good.

1057
00:57:06,520 --> 00:57:07,600
Speaker 3: Soul cycle cupcake.

1058
00:57:07,960 --> 00:57:09,040
Speaker 2: Soul cycles a cupcake.

1059
00:57:09,160 --> 00:57:14,200
Speaker 4: And like remember flywheel, you know, like you know.

1060
00:57:14,760 --> 00:57:16,600
Speaker 2: Bar I think is a little bit of a cupcake.

1061
00:57:17,520 --> 00:57:20,560
Speaker 4: Like you you can pretty easily like separate them out.

1062
00:57:22,880 --> 00:57:25,200
Speaker 4: And so so I like that. I mean that that

1063
00:57:25,400 --> 00:57:28,800
Speaker 4: idea feels that idea feels enduring to me. I mean Pelotons,

1064
00:57:28,880 --> 00:57:32,560
Speaker 4: I think a fascinating case study. I didn't write about

1065
00:57:32,560 --> 00:57:35,920
Speaker 4: it a lot in the book because and this is funny,

1066
00:57:35,920 --> 00:57:37,600
Speaker 4: I don't think I've ever really talked about this.

1067
00:57:39,520 --> 00:57:41,000
Speaker 2: So you got me, you got me on it.

1068
00:57:41,240 --> 00:57:47,640
Speaker 4: Yeah, I intentionally didn't write about pelotons. So that book

1069
00:57:47,680 --> 00:57:49,800
Speaker 4: came out in twenty sixteen. I intentionally didn't write about

1070
00:57:49,800 --> 00:57:51,919
Speaker 4: it because I was like, this is not going to work.

1071
00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:54,040
Speaker 4: I was like, this doesn't make sense. People aren't going

1072
00:57:54,080 --> 00:57:58,080
Speaker 4: to work out in their home, Like that's dumb. I

1073
00:57:58,160 --> 00:58:00,480
Speaker 4: was dead wrong, and then I was kind of right.

1074
00:58:00,960 --> 00:58:02,200
Speaker 4: I mean depending on how you.

1075
00:58:02,120 --> 00:58:03,800
Speaker 2: Look, like if you look at the it was like

1076
00:58:03,880 --> 00:58:04,400
Speaker 2: COVID and.

1077
00:58:04,720 --> 00:58:06,640
Speaker 4: Exactly if you look at the stock chart, I was

1078
00:58:06,680 --> 00:58:07,720
Speaker 4: dead wrong, and then I was right.

1079
00:58:07,800 --> 00:58:09,040
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1080
00:58:09,080 --> 00:58:11,880
Speaker 4: Having said that, I still have my peloton like in

1081
00:58:11,880 --> 00:58:16,600
Speaker 4: my basement, I am pretty you know, I'm pretty.

1082
00:58:16,320 --> 00:58:20,160
Speaker 2: Loyal to it. I use the exercise and things like that.

1083
00:58:20,240 --> 00:58:25,320
Speaker 4: So so I'm the jury is probably a little a little.

1084
00:58:25,080 --> 00:58:25,600
Speaker 2: Bit out on that.

1085
00:58:25,880 --> 00:58:27,440
Speaker 3: I am still curious about it. It's funny.

1086
00:58:27,480 --> 00:58:31,760
Speaker 1: I I love Peloton. I remember during COVID, I bought

1087
00:58:31,760 --> 00:58:33,200
Speaker 1: one of the bikes for my family. I spent like

1088
00:58:33,200 --> 00:58:34,480
Speaker 1: all my money on a bike because I was like,

1089
00:58:34,520 --> 00:58:36,760
Speaker 1: I'm going to be the chief like officer of working

1090
00:58:36,800 --> 00:58:38,680
Speaker 1: out in this house, and we are all going to

1091
00:58:38,760 --> 00:58:41,080
Speaker 1: be fit for stay and fit together as we're locked

1092
00:58:41,080 --> 00:58:43,560
Speaker 1: in the you know, locked in this house in Connecticut.

1093
00:58:54,360 --> 00:58:56,720
Speaker 1: I recently have leaned into at home workouts and I've

1094
00:58:56,800 --> 00:58:59,520
Speaker 1: been like loving apps and being able to like not

1095
00:58:59,560 --> 00:59:01,880
Speaker 1: waste my mind money on a boutique workout at at

1096
00:59:02,000 --> 00:59:03,960
Speaker 1: you know, like spending forty bucks on a class, and

1097
00:59:04,560 --> 00:59:05,520
Speaker 1: to have an app that.

1098
00:59:05,480 --> 00:59:06,000
Speaker 3: I can just do.

1099
00:59:06,120 --> 00:59:07,920
Speaker 1: I actually have been really enjoying, which is kind of

1100
00:59:07,920 --> 00:59:09,600
Speaker 1: interesting because I was never one of those people.

1101
00:59:09,760 --> 00:59:11,600
Speaker 4: And I do think sorry, just last thought on that,

1102
00:59:11,720 --> 00:59:16,600
Speaker 4: Like I think that's one area where I feel like

1103
00:59:18,040 --> 00:59:21,720
Speaker 4: AI may actually be helpful, something smart enough that this

1104
00:59:21,760 --> 00:59:23,840
Speaker 4: probably exists and somebody's going to like send it to

1105
00:59:23,920 --> 00:59:27,880
Speaker 4: us after this airs, but like something that like can

1106
00:59:27,920 --> 00:59:31,040
Speaker 4: take my data and be like okay, not just like

1107
00:59:31,200 --> 00:59:33,640
Speaker 4: oh take it a little easier today, but like do

1108
00:59:33,760 --> 00:59:36,560
Speaker 4: this workout, you know, and like based on like what

1109
00:59:36,600 --> 00:59:39,800
Speaker 4: you've done over the past five days, like maybe don't

1110
00:59:39,800 --> 00:59:42,320
Speaker 4: go for a run, maybe lift some weights.

1111
00:59:43,160 --> 00:59:44,640
Speaker 3: And I have hypertailored to you.

1112
00:59:44,920 --> 00:59:48,720
Speaker 4: Yes, yes, And I do think and I guess what

1113
00:59:48,880 --> 00:59:52,280
Speaker 4: I wrestle with when it comes to fitnesses and I did.

1114
00:59:52,600 --> 00:59:54,120
Speaker 4: I believed in it when I wrote the book, and

1115
00:59:54,160 --> 00:59:54,920
Speaker 4: I still believe in it.

1116
00:59:55,400 --> 00:59:55,560
Speaker 2: You know.

1117
00:59:55,720 --> 00:59:59,960
Speaker 4: Part of what makes people spend thirty five forty five

1118
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:02,160
Speaker 4: ffty bucks to go to classes like they want to

1119
01:00:02,200 --> 01:00:07,000
Speaker 4: be with other people who are like their people, you know,

1120
01:00:07,240 --> 01:00:11,080
Speaker 4: and millionth person to say that, you know, fitness boutiques

1121
01:00:11,080 --> 01:00:13,320
Speaker 4: are the new bars, but go where everybody knows your name.

1122
01:00:13,520 --> 01:00:15,920
Speaker 1: The workout classes that all do are most like I

1123
01:00:16,000 --> 01:00:18,200
Speaker 1: mostly do them to have a social experience with my friends,

1124
01:00:18,200 --> 01:00:20,000
Speaker 1: Like I have a Wednesday night class that we go

1125
01:00:20,080 --> 01:00:22,240
Speaker 1: to when we we have a group chat and if

1126
01:00:22,240 --> 01:00:25,120
Speaker 1: we're all down to go, we go. And it's awesome,

1127
01:00:25,160 --> 01:00:27,240
Speaker 1: good way to see your friends do something healthy.

1128
01:00:28,120 --> 01:00:30,520
Speaker 2: Exact experience protein shake afterwards.

1129
01:00:30,600 --> 01:00:32,480
Speaker 3: Yes, exactly, exactly.

1130
01:00:33,040 --> 01:00:37,240
Speaker 1: And I do think with AI our experiences even you know.

1131
01:00:37,440 --> 01:00:39,520
Speaker 1: I was talking about this again with Alex Leeberman the

1132
01:00:39,600 --> 01:00:41,680
Speaker 1: other day, who's the morning brew guy, And he was saying,

1133
01:00:41,680 --> 01:00:43,280
Speaker 1: what if you could get a newsletter kind of like

1134
01:00:43,320 --> 01:00:47,240
Speaker 1: the presidential briefing that was tailored to you every single morning,

1135
01:00:47,280 --> 01:00:49,240
Speaker 1: you know, sent right to your email. And now you're

1136
01:00:49,280 --> 01:00:51,800
Speaker 1: having this like hyper personalized experience. And I think we're

1137
01:00:51,840 --> 01:00:54,440
Speaker 1: going to get to that everything that we do. Well,

1138
01:00:54,440 --> 01:00:57,040
Speaker 1: You've had an incredible career. You have talked to so

1139
01:00:57,120 --> 01:01:01,000
Speaker 1: many fascinating people. I'm curious, what is one story that

1140
01:01:01,440 --> 01:01:03,240
Speaker 1: you know kind of lives rent free in your head

1141
01:01:03,400 --> 01:01:07,840
Speaker 1: that's your favorite interviewer story that you've ever told or covered.

1142
01:01:08,040 --> 01:01:11,600
Speaker 4: One that I remember, So same same series that I

1143
01:01:11,720 --> 01:01:14,840
Speaker 4: first met Alex and was Athlete Empire, and I did

1144
01:01:17,520 --> 01:01:21,520
Speaker 4: we did an episode about Steve Young, who I had

1145
01:01:21,560 --> 01:01:25,720
Speaker 4: met like very briefly, and you know obviously had like

1146
01:01:26,040 --> 01:01:29,280
Speaker 4: really admired as a kid growing up, and and had

1147
01:01:29,280 --> 01:01:31,680
Speaker 4: also followed the fact like he had like he's a

1148
01:01:31,880 --> 01:01:35,560
Speaker 4: legitimate private equity investor, like started a like real private

1149
01:01:35,560 --> 01:01:36,160
Speaker 4: equity firm.

1150
01:01:36,840 --> 01:01:37,520
Speaker 2: And so.

1151
01:01:39,160 --> 01:01:45,280
Speaker 4: There's this great moment that I'll never forget where again

1152
01:01:45,360 --> 01:01:47,000
Speaker 4: going back to the idea that we love to go

1153
01:01:47,040 --> 01:01:48,960
Speaker 4: for a drive with somebody, So we we set it

1154
01:01:49,040 --> 01:01:54,360
Speaker 4: up so that we we were at meeting in his

1155
01:01:54,400 --> 01:01:55,840
Speaker 4: office and then we were going to drive down to

1156
01:01:55,920 --> 01:01:57,880
Speaker 4: Levi's stadium where the forty nine Ers play and like

1157
01:01:57,920 --> 01:02:00,200
Speaker 4: walk on the field with him and his co lead

1158
01:02:00,280 --> 01:02:02,480
Speaker 4: Junior Bryant, who had played a notre dame and then

1159
01:02:02,520 --> 01:02:04,040
Speaker 4: played with him at the forty nine ers, And so

1160
01:02:04,120 --> 01:02:06,960
Speaker 4: we're going to talk about like you know this, you

1161
01:02:06,960 --> 01:02:14,880
Speaker 4: know this intersection of business and sports. And so we,

1162
01:02:16,880 --> 01:02:20,360
Speaker 4: unbeknownst to me, the crew went and like set up

1163
01:02:20,400 --> 01:02:22,120
Speaker 4: the car and we go out and so we were,

1164
01:02:22,160 --> 01:02:23,520
Speaker 4: you know, they're filming us. We walk out of the

1165
01:02:23,520 --> 01:02:27,640
Speaker 4: car and we go to Steve Young's minivan and like

1166
01:02:27,920 --> 01:02:30,280
Speaker 4: we get in the minivan and he looks at it,

1167
01:02:30,280 --> 01:02:31,320
Speaker 4: and I was like, this is it this.

1168
01:02:31,840 --> 01:02:33,080
Speaker 2: I was like, I love a minivan. This is a

1169
01:02:33,080 --> 01:02:33,480
Speaker 2: great ride.

1170
01:02:33,480 --> 01:02:35,360
Speaker 4: And he's like, listen, if you have a bunch of

1171
01:02:35,480 --> 01:02:38,600
Speaker 4: kids and you don't have a minivan, you're an idiot.

1172
01:02:38,720 --> 01:02:42,200
Speaker 4: And it was just like an amazing moment where I

1173
01:02:42,240 --> 01:02:44,320
Speaker 4: was like, oh my god, Steve, you like this is

1174
01:02:44,560 --> 01:02:46,400
Speaker 4: this is so cool, Like I don't know why that

1175
01:02:46,480 --> 01:02:48,240
Speaker 4: one just like lives with me.

1176
01:02:49,320 --> 01:02:50,000
Speaker 3: It's so real.

1177
01:02:50,280 --> 01:02:52,520
Speaker 2: It was so it was so real.

1178
01:02:53,800 --> 01:02:55,840
Speaker 4: And so that was one fun thing where I was

1179
01:02:55,880 --> 01:02:58,080
Speaker 4: like I can't believe, Like I can't believe Steve Young

1180
01:02:58,080 --> 01:02:59,320
Speaker 4: and I were talking about minivans.

1181
01:02:59,360 --> 01:02:59,760
Speaker 2: Anyway.

1182
01:03:00,080 --> 01:03:02,760
Speaker 1: I always joke, by the way, I always joke with Jeremy,

1183
01:03:03,280 --> 01:03:06,680
Speaker 1: my fiance, that a minivan is the Dexpex thing to.

1184
01:03:06,640 --> 01:03:07,400
Speaker 3: A black Suv.

1185
01:03:07,720 --> 01:03:11,320
Speaker 4: Oh, minivans are the best. Like I when we had

1186
01:03:11,320 --> 01:03:14,400
Speaker 4: to like our minivan just like died a couple a

1187
01:03:14,640 --> 01:03:18,560
Speaker 4: year or so ago, and we going back to one

1188
01:03:18,600 --> 01:03:24,080
Speaker 4: of our shared subjects, we took that to so many

1189
01:03:24,240 --> 01:03:27,320
Speaker 4: lacrosse tournaments over the years that we literally just called

1190
01:03:27,320 --> 01:03:32,840
Speaker 4: it the Laxmobile. And when my lacrosse player son, like

1191
01:03:32,880 --> 01:03:35,680
Speaker 4: when we had to retire it, he was like, rest

1192
01:03:35,680 --> 01:03:36,720
Speaker 4: in power, Laxmobile.

1193
01:03:36,840 --> 01:03:39,280
Speaker 2: I mean, it was just like it was so good

1194
01:03:39,360 --> 01:03:39,600
Speaker 2: to it.

1195
01:03:39,600 --> 01:03:42,040
Speaker 4: It's like a Honda Odyssey that had god knows how

1196
01:03:42,040 --> 01:03:46,040
Speaker 4: many miles on it and probably you know, is ended

1197
01:03:46,120 --> 01:03:49,200
Speaker 4: up in a Junkyard somewhere just based on like the

1198
01:03:49,280 --> 01:03:52,280
Speaker 4: lacrosse equipment in the back probably ruined it forever. But

1199
01:03:53,160 --> 01:03:57,200
Speaker 4: any case, so Minivans forever. I mean the deal story.

1200
01:03:57,880 --> 01:04:03,720
Speaker 4: There have been some really some really fun, fun moments

1201
01:04:03,760 --> 01:04:07,240
Speaker 4: on that show. I mean the Serena. The Serena one

1202
01:04:07,600 --> 01:04:10,440
Speaker 4: was I think just epic because it was just so

1203
01:04:11,640 --> 01:04:13,840
Speaker 4: it was just such a moment, and you know, sitting

1204
01:04:13,880 --> 01:04:15,720
Speaker 4: with the two of them, I think definitely was a

1205
01:04:15,720 --> 01:04:21,440
Speaker 4: pinch me moment. I do think sitting with you know,

1206
01:04:21,480 --> 01:04:26,320
Speaker 4: sitting with Alex and Derek Jeter and talking about their

1207
01:04:26,360 --> 01:04:29,600
Speaker 4: relationship and you know, having an open and honest conversation

1208
01:04:29,720 --> 01:04:34,480
Speaker 4: about their aspirations and their memories and their friendship over

1209
01:04:34,520 --> 01:04:41,320
Speaker 4: the years. You know, for a for a kid who

1210
01:04:41,360 --> 01:04:45,280
Speaker 4: loves baseball, you know, to sit with these these two

1211
01:04:45,320 --> 01:04:48,880
Speaker 4: sort of iconic guys and just kind of chop it up.

1212
01:04:49,960 --> 01:04:50,840
Speaker 2: Was pretty wild.

1213
01:04:51,400 --> 01:04:54,200
Speaker 1: Lastly, as we wrap it up, I want to ask you,

1214
01:04:54,360 --> 01:04:57,960
Speaker 1: after twenty plus years of reporting, what is something that

1215
01:04:58,000 --> 01:05:01,240
Speaker 1: you want everybody that listens to you, reads what you do,

1216
01:05:01,400 --> 01:05:03,720
Speaker 1: watches you to take away from your work.

1217
01:05:06,440 --> 01:05:09,520
Speaker 2: Wow, that's a really, really good question.

1218
01:05:10,400 --> 01:05:14,160
Speaker 4: I do think that I've been so fortunate in getting

1219
01:05:14,200 --> 01:05:16,320
Speaker 4: to do all of these different things, and especially doing

1220
01:05:16,360 --> 01:05:20,200
Speaker 4: what I'm doing now, It's like, I do appreciate that.

1221
01:05:22,560 --> 01:05:23,160
Speaker 2: This is fun.

1222
01:05:24,440 --> 01:05:29,520
Speaker 4: This is fun, and I think sometimes we overthink it

1223
01:05:31,800 --> 01:05:35,919
Speaker 4: and sometimes we don't stop and realize that what we're

1224
01:05:35,960 --> 01:05:38,880
Speaker 4: really trying to do, Like in the business, especially the

1225
01:05:38,880 --> 01:05:42,000
Speaker 4: business that I'm in right now, it really is about

1226
01:05:42,040 --> 01:05:46,000
Speaker 4: connecting with people, and connecting with people is meaningful, and

1227
01:05:47,880 --> 01:05:51,920
Speaker 4: we don't do it enough in this like hyper you know,

1228
01:05:52,240 --> 01:05:58,000
Speaker 4: hyper click day and age. And I do think that

1229
01:06:01,040 --> 01:06:07,200
Speaker 4: this notion of like, be kind, have fun, it's.

1230
01:06:07,040 --> 01:06:11,720
Speaker 2: Not always that serious. Enjoy what you're doing.

1231
01:06:11,920 --> 01:06:14,280
Speaker 4: Like I have the great benefit of enjoying what I

1232
01:06:14,320 --> 01:06:18,400
Speaker 4: do all the time. And so if I had to

1233
01:06:18,480 --> 01:06:20,360
Speaker 4: have somebody to take away it's like, yeah, he seems

1234
01:06:20,360 --> 01:06:24,320
Speaker 4: to be having a good time and and.

1235
01:06:23,240 --> 01:06:25,080
Speaker 2: I love that, Like I like.

1236
01:06:26,560 --> 01:06:29,479
Speaker 4: Some of my favorite moments on the on the Deal

1237
01:06:29,600 --> 01:06:32,720
Speaker 4: or when you know Alex and I are just like

1238
01:06:34,000 --> 01:06:34,520
Speaker 4: cutting up.

1239
01:06:34,760 --> 01:06:35,240
Speaker 3: I love that.

1240
01:06:35,280 --> 01:06:37,200
Speaker 1: And you can definitely tell how much fun you guys

1241
01:06:37,240 --> 01:06:41,080
Speaker 1: are happening through just watching you do your show. I

1242
01:06:41,120 --> 01:06:42,760
Speaker 1: was going to say, what would be your one piece

1243
01:06:42,800 --> 01:06:45,360
Speaker 1: of advice for me as an aspiring journalist, but I

1244
01:06:45,440 --> 01:06:47,360
Speaker 1: feel like you answered it. It really is just to

1245
01:06:47,400 --> 01:06:49,680
Speaker 1: have fun and be yourself yourself.

1246
01:06:50,000 --> 01:06:52,600
Speaker 4: I mean, it's funny, so I mean, again, this is

1247
01:06:52,600 --> 01:06:55,920
Speaker 4: a little bit of a meta story. But like I

1248
01:06:55,960 --> 01:06:57,720
Speaker 4: when I learned I was coming on the show, I

1249
01:06:57,720 --> 01:07:00,120
Speaker 4: did email my friend John Gray, who had been one

1250
01:07:00,440 --> 01:07:04,200
Speaker 4: who who who I trust implicitly, and I said, any advice,

1251
01:07:05,000 --> 01:07:09,120
Speaker 4: and he said, be yourself, have fun. And that's like,

1252
01:07:09,480 --> 01:07:15,919
Speaker 4: be yourself may be actually the most like distilled down thing,

1253
01:07:16,160 --> 01:07:18,560
Speaker 4: and I think we just don't do that enough, like

1254
01:07:18,720 --> 01:07:23,880
Speaker 4: be who you are like and it's a cliche, but

1255
01:07:23,920 --> 01:07:26,720
Speaker 4: it's a cliche for a reason, because if you're not

1256
01:07:26,800 --> 01:07:29,160
Speaker 4: who you are, like, everyone's gonna see.

1257
01:07:28,960 --> 01:07:32,640
Speaker 3: It, especially if you're on camera, especially if.

1258
01:07:32,520 --> 01:07:33,200
Speaker 2: You're on camera.

1259
01:07:33,680 --> 01:07:36,920
Speaker 4: And I do think that like one of the things

1260
01:07:36,960 --> 01:07:39,960
Speaker 4: that Alex and I try and do is like we

1261
01:07:40,000 --> 01:07:43,400
Speaker 4: are who we are, we know, we know who each

1262
01:07:43,440 --> 01:07:45,080
Speaker 4: other are, and we trust each other.

1263
01:07:45,920 --> 01:07:48,960
Speaker 2: But the most important thing is like we ourselves.

1264
01:07:49,240 --> 01:07:51,400
Speaker 1: Lastly, is there anything you want to shout out? Anything

1265
01:07:51,440 --> 01:07:53,080
Speaker 1: coming up that we can be on the lookout for,

1266
01:07:53,240 --> 01:07:54,000
Speaker 1: excited about.

1267
01:07:54,480 --> 01:07:57,920
Speaker 4: I mean, tune into the deal. You know, we're uh,

1268
01:07:58,480 --> 01:08:01,200
Speaker 4: We've got some episodes coming up.

1269
01:08:01,880 --> 01:08:02,800
Speaker 2: We have a great time.

1270
01:08:03,160 --> 01:08:06,520
Speaker 4: Wherever you get your podcasts, YouTube, Bloomberg dot com.

1271
01:08:07,000 --> 01:08:07,920
Speaker 2: You can't escape us.