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Speaker 1: Yes, who of course I would suck Elon Musk for

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Speaker 1: the right amount of money, which is what six million

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Speaker 1: dollars or more? Miles, what number did you just throw out.

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Speaker 1: I'm not gonna lie about what I said. I'll say

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Speaker 1: it again. I'll call bucks. Wow. No, definitely not. You

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Speaker 1: know why, because I'll turn it into a story. I'll

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Speaker 1: make money, Like on the back of that. I'm just

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Speaker 1: launching on the I Heart radio network in April. I

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Speaker 1: fucked Elon Musk. No money, A lot of money in

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Speaker 1: the world space x X Miles Gray and Elon Musk

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Speaker 1: a match made in hell. You really cornered me. See

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Speaker 1: you have me on the show just to get me

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Speaker 1: to say some ship like that as wild? Anyway, I

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Speaker 1: do it for It was not difficult, That's all I

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Speaker 1: got to say. I think I would throw out ten

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Speaker 1: million first, but I would go as low as six.

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Speaker 1: That's good, I think. I don't tell us tell him that, No,

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Speaker 1: I don't mean. I don't mean to like, you know,

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Speaker 1: cheap in it. I would realistically, I think for it

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Speaker 1: to really work for me, I'll probably do it for

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Speaker 1: like six fifty wow, Jesus, so like two car payments? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: or at least like a PS five and no that

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Speaker 1: is good. Yeah, PS five would be nice. Yeah if

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Speaker 1: he just what if he just shows up at your

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Speaker 1: house with a PS five and controller, Well then you

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Speaker 1: know what I'm telling Alexa to put on some smooth jazz.

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Speaker 1: There we go, smooth jazz that should move with with

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Speaker 1: Elon Musk. Oh, yeah it's me and uh you know,

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Speaker 1: uh David Sanborn. You see, I think I would try

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Speaker 1: because I'm younger than him, so it's probably he can't

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Speaker 1: tell the difference between me and a teenager. Um. I

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Speaker 1: would put on like like Austrian yodeling albums and try

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Speaker 1: to convince him it's what like the kids were into

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Speaker 1: these days. It's like everybody on Reddit loves these yodeling

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Speaker 1: albums Elon, and then try to see even get him

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Speaker 1: to tweet about like his favorite yodelers. I bet we

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Speaker 1: could do it like just running. So you want to

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Speaker 1: run an OP on him? Okay, I want to get

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Speaker 1: paid first, like payment payment is first, and then fucking

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Speaker 1: with him a little bit. Well, you gotta we have

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Speaker 1: to run an op on someone to show like the

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Speaker 1: veracity of our claims, like there's strength to the business model,

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Speaker 1: you know, where you can be like, this is actually

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Speaker 1: how our marketing works, Like we run ops on celebrities

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Speaker 1: and they unwittingly support your products. Yeah, so big yodeling,

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Speaker 1: get at me right if you want to get it

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Speaker 1: on the ground floor. If you're representing a yodeler, uh

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Speaker 1: and you want Elon Musk to tweet about them, I

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Speaker 1: probably can't make that happen. But I like really famous

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Speaker 1: like child who yodeled in Walmart. Like I feel like

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Speaker 1: Elon Musk would be like doubt, Oh yeah that kids

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Speaker 1: all that kids like forty three now and he's all

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Speaker 1: like his yodeling is all sucked up because his voice

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Speaker 1: change because oh yeah, because he went like he went

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Speaker 1: like hard right too. I think he's he's he's a

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Speaker 1: proud right now. Yeah. So what you're saying is Elon Musk,

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Speaker 1: we love him, I'm sure. Um. Well, welcome to Behind

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Speaker 1: the Bastards, the podcast that is three and a half

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Speaker 1: minutes in. Um we talk about bad people. This week

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Speaker 1: we're talking about Clarence Thomas. Um so, boy, how do

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Speaker 1: how do we get from there to hear um good stuff?

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Speaker 1: So in nineteen seventy one, Clarence Thomas enters Yale Law School. Um.

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Speaker 1: You know, he graduates from that that school he goes

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Speaker 1: to and fucking Wooster right. Um, and he's a pretty

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Speaker 1: for those years he's in Wooster, he's a pretty hardcore

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Speaker 1: like black nationalist activist. Um. But in nineteen seventy one

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Speaker 1: he enters Yale. He is one of twelve black students

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Speaker 1: on the entire campus, thanks to an affirmative action program

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Speaker 1: recently instituted in the school that mandated ten percent of

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Speaker 1: the class not be white kids. You will remember but

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Speaker 1: that it was in the nineteen sixties when Yale removed

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Speaker 1: their secret caps on Jewish students. So like Yale is

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Speaker 1: so I always say a little bit behind the curve

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Speaker 1: on integration. So yeah, this program helps him get into Yale. UM,

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Speaker 1: but it also makes clear the fact that he had

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Speaker 1: gotten into Yale through an affirmative action program makes him

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Speaker 1: feel as if he has a target on his back. Uh. Quote,

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Speaker 1: you had to prove yourself every day because the presumption

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Speaker 1: was that you were dumb and didn't deserve to be there.

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Speaker 1: He later added. As much as it had stung to

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Speaker 1: be told I'd done well in high school despite my race,

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Speaker 1: it was far worse to feel that I was now

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Speaker 1: at Yale because of it, um, Which yeah, man, that's

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Speaker 1: that's that's the whole thing. But also like, it wasn't

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Speaker 1: your lack of ability that would have kept you out

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Speaker 1: of Yale earlier. It was that somebody had to force

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Speaker 1: Yale admissions to accept people who weren't like right, Like,

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Speaker 1: that is the thing. It's not that you couldn't do Yale.

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Speaker 1: It's that Yale had to be forced to do. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but yeah. Anyway, Thomas has always been and a pretty

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Speaker 1: conservative guy by personality. Even when he was a radical,

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Speaker 1: it was kind of rooted in very traditional ideas he

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Speaker 1: had about the family and about gender roles. Um. He

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Speaker 1: remained religious as hell even after he left the Cemitary Seminary,

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Speaker 1: the Bill Gates Semen School. Uh. He felt discipline and

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Speaker 1: an authoritarian upbringing were important for kids to have. But

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Speaker 1: he was also a registered Democrat because his family was,

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Speaker 1: and because he supported the civil rights movement, because you know,

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Speaker 1: there weren't like that's what you did, right, Like, that's

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Speaker 1: what his family did. Like that was the only reasonable

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Speaker 1: option as he saw it. For a very long time. Um,

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Speaker 1: it was at Yale then that Clarence finally starts moving

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Speaker 1: away from politically aligning himself with liberals. He's never really

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Speaker 1: been a liberal, right, but he votes with them, and

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Speaker 1: like yeah, um, he starts to make that actual move

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Speaker 1: towards a conservative political party, uh, and towards conservative more

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Speaker 1: like more of an open embraced conservative ideology. While he's

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Speaker 1: at Yale, and I'm gonna quote again from the New Yorker.

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Speaker 1: Here at Yale, Thomas developed an understanding of racism that

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Speaker 1: he would never shake. Whites, Southern and northern, liberal and conservative,

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Speaker 1: rural and urban are racists. Racism, Thomas would tell students

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Speaker 1: at Mercer University in nineteen ninety three, has has complex

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Speaker 1: into a certain degree undiscoverable roots. Not knowing its beginning,

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Speaker 1: we can't know its end. The most that can be

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Speaker 1: hoped for is that whites be honest about it. Honesty

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Speaker 1: is demonstrated through crude statements of personal animus or intellectual

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Speaker 1: suggestions of racial inequality. Dishonesty is demonstrated through denial of

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Speaker 1: one's racism and sympathetic extensions of help. Dishonesty lulls black

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Speaker 1: people into a false sense of security, assuring them that

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Speaker 1: they are safe when they are not. One of Thomas's

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Speaker 1: favorite songs is the nineteen seventy one hit Smiling Faces,

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Speaker 1: sometimes by the Undisputed Truth. It's classic lyric Smiling Faces.

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Speaker 1: Smiling Faces tell lies resonates with his experience of northern

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Speaker 1: white liberals. Among the virtues of the Reagan administration, he

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Speaker 1: has said, was the fact that no one there was

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Speaker 1: smiling in your face. So wow, if we're taking Thomas's

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Speaker 1: experience on this, like what the way he describes it

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Speaker 1: is that he goes to seminary everyone there is super

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Speaker 1: racist and like conservative, and he hates that. But then

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Speaker 1: he goes to like fancy northern liberal towns and schools,

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Speaker 1: and everyone there is just as racist but pretends not

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Speaker 1: to be. And he decides, well, I guess I prefer

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Speaker 1: the unabashed racists. I mean this, there's no point there, right, Uh,

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Speaker 1: there's not no point there, no, not at all to

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Speaker 1: what he's saying. Yeah, absolutely, yeah, they're I mean, look

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Speaker 1: at just what we what we saw in with people

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Speaker 1: donning kenta cloth and taking a knee and for what

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Speaker 1: just to always come back and like, well, you know,

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Speaker 1: qualified immunity, let's not go too far anything. And you're like, well,

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Speaker 1: what was that? And again to his point a false

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Speaker 1: sense of security. Uh uh and we and we are

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Speaker 1: not we are, in facting the opposite of that. And

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Speaker 1: then on the other side of it, he's like, man,

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Speaker 1: these people, you know where the funk they're at. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know where all the Reagans people are coming from

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Speaker 1: because they are racist to ship. Yeah, and they don't

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Speaker 1: say ship because they they're racist and they know it,

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Speaker 1: they know the rules of racism. Yeah. Um. So in

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Speaker 1: the end, Yale winds up leaving a pretty harsh taste

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Speaker 1: in his mouth. His grades are We don't really know

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Speaker 1: exactly what his grades are, right, He has remained like

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Speaker 1: people will say that he was kind of a a

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Speaker 1: middle of the road student. We don't really know, because

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Speaker 1: his academic records remain sealed at his urging. Uh. Journalists

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Speaker 1: who spoke to his professors repeat the same story. He

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Speaker 1: was a pretty average student. Upon leaving Yale, he applied

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Speaker 1: to a number of high end law firms, but he

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Speaker 1: was not hired by any of them. Um. And this

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Speaker 1: is probably less a factor of his grades than the

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Speaker 1: fact that he was middle class and black. Right, he

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Speaker 1: doesn't have connections to these big money law firms that

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Speaker 1: he's trying to get jobs with, which is ultimately why

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Speaker 1: Yale people get hired. It's not just that they went

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Speaker 1: to Yale, and it's certainly not their grades. It's that

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Speaker 1: their dad is somebody who's connected to people who run

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Speaker 1: the law firm, or they make friends or whatever. Right Um.

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Speaker 1: Years later, Thomas would tell a law school class quote,

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Speaker 1: since my reason for going to law school in the

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Speaker 1: first place was to return to Savannah to assist in

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Speaker 1: righting the wrongs which I felt existed there throughout my childhood.

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Speaker 1: I can't say this was a high point. If anything,

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Speaker 1: I was steeped in frustration. And this is definitely a

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Speaker 1: thing where he's like lying, like hell, because over the

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Speaker 1: last couple of decades, since his emergence is a public figure,

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Speaker 1: Thomas has made a big deal about how he got

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Speaker 1: into law because he wanted to join the crusade for

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Speaker 1: civil rights and again like right wrongs that he'd seen

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Speaker 1: as a kid. This was a big part of the

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Speaker 1: pitch he made his grandfather Um. And this is again

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Speaker 1: very untrue because the one job Thomas was actually offered

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Speaker 1: right out of Yale was at a Savannah law term firm,

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Speaker 1: and he had spent the summer interning at this firm,

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Speaker 1: and they did a lot of that kind of work,

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Speaker 1: and he turns the job down because it doesn't pay enough. Um. Now,

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Speaker 1: Clarence was ultimately willing to take a job that paid poorly,

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Speaker 1: but not one that would let him serve his community

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Speaker 1: in Savannah. Instead, he takes a low paid job with

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Speaker 1: Jack dan Forth, the Republican Attorney General of Missouri. Now

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Speaker 1: dan Fourth, he's this kind of thing that doesn't exist anymore.

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Speaker 1: He was like a liberal Republican and he was on

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Speaker 1: his own concerned with the fact that again he's the

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Speaker 1: Attorney General of Missouri. On his own, he's like, Wow,

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Speaker 1: this staff is too fucking white. We need to have

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Speaker 1: some people who are not white guys around here. So

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Speaker 1: he hires Clarence Thomas because he's like, I think, as

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Speaker 1: the a G we need to have like black lawyers

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Speaker 1: representing people too. Because it's probe Missouri, um, which is good. UM.

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Speaker 1: Thomas does not like this because it's smacks of affirmative action,

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Speaker 1: which he deeply resented, and because again he wants a

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Speaker 1: high paid legal career and this is not that um.

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Speaker 1: And you know, he is initially not really super enthused

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Speaker 1: by this offer, I either, but he eventually decides to

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Speaker 1: take it, and his friend Clarence Martin later told Jane

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Speaker 1: Mayer quote, by the time he went to Missouri, he

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Speaker 1: was very disillusioned. He didn't want the attorney general's job.

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Speaker 1: He never wanted to be part of the government, and

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Speaker 1: in fact, he resented it. He wanted to be this

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Speaker 1: great trial lawyer in private practice, but he lost his

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Speaker 1: self confidence after all the Atlanta firms turned him down.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, that's uh, that's the call that he makes

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Speaker 1: is to get his start in Republican politics with this

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Speaker 1: guy Dan Forth. Um. Now, because it's Missouri, he has

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Speaker 1: to pass the state bar to do it, which is like,

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Speaker 1: you know, you got to do an exam in every

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Speaker 1: state to be able to do law ship there, um

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Speaker 1: because lawyers. Yeah, yeah, it's a whole thing. Um. So

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Speaker 1: while he countered what you might hear on TikTok, apparently

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Speaker 1: that's not true. But now I know, you know, you

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Speaker 1: can't just do it in once. Yeah, you can't just

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Speaker 1: do it in one state. Miles your your state of

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Speaker 1: of of the District of Columbia law certificate that you

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Speaker 1: have printed out above your desk, um c O. M

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Speaker 1: b I A. Um, so yeah, he's got to spend

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Speaker 1: the summer like cramming to pass the bar exam in Missouri.

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Speaker 1: So he winds up crashing at the house of a St.

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Speaker 1: Louis in Double, a CP chairperson, while he crams all

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Speaker 1: summer for the exam. Um. At the end of the summer,

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Speaker 1: he tries to pay her and she told tells him

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Speaker 1: to quote, help someone who is in your position in

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Speaker 1: the future. Um, basically pay it forward. Yeah. So Thomas

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Speaker 1: joins the Dan fourth administration as a Conservative Democrat, but

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Speaker 1: in short order he starts to see how this low paid,

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Speaker 1: entry level position with the Republican Party might lead him

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Speaker 1: to the kind of clout and wealth that he sought.

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Speaker 1: The key would be remaking himself as a political conservative.

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Speaker 1: Cindy Faddis, who knew him when he worked for Dan fourth,

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Speaker 1: recalled he said that he thought he'd have an advantage

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Speaker 1: as a Republican. Thomas is said to have stated, if

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Speaker 1: I belonged to the Republican Party, I could go farther.

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Speaker 1: After that, the change was rather sudden and jarring, as

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Speaker 1: this quote from the book Strange Justice makes clear. Clarence Martin,

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Speaker 1: who visited Thomas and Missouri found the Transformation, and his

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Speaker 1: formerly liberal friend with whom he had worked only the

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Speaker 1: summer before, to be quite remarkable. Gone was Thomas's college

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Speaker 1: dorm room poster of Malcolm X, replaced by an oversized

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Speaker 1: poster of a Rules Royce. No longer dwelling on being

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Speaker 1: shut out of private practice, Thomas now had a new

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Speaker 1: avenue for his ambitions as a Republican. He told Martin

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Speaker 1: he planned a big future in politics. I remember him

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Speaker 1: sitting with his feet up on the desk smoking a cigar,

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Speaker 1: said Martin. I saw a change in Clarence. Then he said,

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Speaker 1: the Republicans are going places in the next ten years,

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Speaker 1: and I'm going to attach my wagon to their star.

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Speaker 1: Martin forgave Thomas's apparent ideological expedients. In many ways. He

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Speaker 1: was already conservative and his social views, Martin noted. And

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Speaker 1: he really admired dan Forth. I'd ask him, how can

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Speaker 1: you become a Republican? And he'd say, blacks need to

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Speaker 1: be on both sides, and these people are in power.

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Speaker 1: It was a matter of practicality, all right. So we've

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Speaker 1: got to the part where he became Darth Vader. He's

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Speaker 1: doing that he's going. And it's interesting because Dan fourth

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Speaker 1: is you could draw a line between Dan fourth and

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Speaker 1: his current position because Dan fourth is very anti abortion. UM.

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Speaker 1: But Dan fourth is also again a liberal Republican and

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Speaker 1: one of the weirdest things that we really don't have anymore,

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Speaker 1: he's ideologically consistent. So he is also an anti death

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Speaker 1: penalty crusader. So he's a Republican who is like really

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Speaker 1: violently against the death penalty and against a portion um,

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Speaker 1: which at least suggests that he's yeah, being consistent in

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Speaker 1: the things that he's claiming. UM. But yeah, this is like,

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Speaker 1: this is where Thomas gets his start in politics. Um. Now.

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Speaker 1: One of his colleagues at the Savannah law firm where

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Speaker 1: he had done his interning, a guy named Fletcher Farrington,

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Speaker 1: who later supported his nomination to the Supreme Court, insists

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Speaker 1: that Thomas was not a quote complete opportunist, but that

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Speaker 1: quote to some extent, his politics were shaped by his ratunities.

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Speaker 1: At the core of everything, then, is the fact that

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Speaker 1: Thomas's real goal, more than anything, was to attain a

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Speaker 1: position that gave him wealth and prestige. As Farrington put it,

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Speaker 1: his ambition was not to make a particular change in society,

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Speaker 1: but to go as far as he could go. And

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Speaker 1: I think that is something, you know, despite the fact

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Speaker 1: that his grandfather winds up disappointed in him for not

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Speaker 1: helping his community. Um, that's something that's very consistent with

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Speaker 1: the upbringing he has. Right, All that matters is the work.

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Speaker 1: All that matters is like getting the best position you

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Speaker 1: can and right, you need to move further than I

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Speaker 1: was able to write. Yeah, I mean he definitely is

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Speaker 1: his grandfather's son. Um. All right, you know what, now

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Speaker 1: I'm rooting for him again. Now you're back on board.

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Speaker 1: You're back on board, alright, c C. Well, we are

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Speaker 1: about to get to the Reagan administration, which I know

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Speaker 1: is your favorite period in American politics. My dad's explanation

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Speaker 1: why they were unhoused people when I asked him as

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Speaker 1: a four year old, Oh good, was he because Reagan

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Speaker 1: closed the institutions? Guy? I was like, I remember being

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Speaker 1: a bum like four year old person and like, you know,

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Speaker 1: we're like giving food to like someone house people. Was like,

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Speaker 1: why did some people have to live there? And my

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Speaker 1: dad's because of Ronald Reagan? And I'm like what I'm for,

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Speaker 1: I don't know what that means. And I remember saying

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Speaker 1: that ship in like first grade, and like my teachers like,

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Speaker 1: who the funk are you? That's amazing? That's good stuff.

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Speaker 1: You know what else is good, miles? Capitalism, which is

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Speaker 1: the real reason why all people aren't able to live

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Speaker 1: indoors um Capitalism, Miles, sweet lady, capitalism. Have you ever

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Speaker 1: felt like the world's not getting hot enough fast enough

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Speaker 1: in England? And going forty degrees celsius? That's not that high?

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Speaker 1: Forties a low number. Well is crypto. All of these

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Speaker 1: products and services will help keep those numbers high. Put

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Speaker 1: them on the board. Maybe put him on the board.

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Speaker 1: How are you doing, Sylphie? Is that good? It made

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Speaker 1: you smile? So I'm look, I can go back to

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Speaker 1: come anytime. That's that's always an option that's on the table,

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Speaker 1: on the table. We can bring Dr Kellogg right back

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Speaker 1: into it. Yeah, yeah, let's take Kellogg back. America's great

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Speaker 1: come doctor. Speaking of America's great come doctor, try these

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Speaker 1: products and services. Oh we're back. Clarence Thomas was good

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Speaker 1: at his first job in government, by which I mean

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Speaker 1: he pleased all of the people he needed to get

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Speaker 1: another job in government that was better. Uh. It is

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Speaker 1: worth noting that at one point, while he is working,

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Speaker 1: as you know, a lawyer in the AG's office in

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Speaker 1: the state of his era, Rovie Wade comes up his boss. Obviously,

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Speaker 1: dan Forth opposes the ruling and he challenges it in

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Speaker 1: a court case dan Fourth v. Planned Parenthood. It was

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Speaker 1: later noted by colleagues that Clarence Thomas expressed no particular

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Speaker 1: interest in this case. So at least at this point

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Speaker 1: to work with him when there's like a big fight

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Speaker 1: over planned parenthood in their office, are like, yeah, he

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Speaker 1: didn't really give a ship. Um. Now, this is not

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Speaker 1: to say that Thomas didn't talk about abortion during this

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Speaker 1: period in his life. His mother recalled him saying that

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Speaker 1: he opposed abortion on demand because if she'd had one,

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Speaker 1: he wouldn't exist. Um. Now, that said that said at

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Speaker 1: another point, his sister has an abortion because the doctor's

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Speaker 1: already had several kids, and a doctor warns her she

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Speaker 1: might die if she carries this fetus to terms that

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Speaker 1: she had some kind of health condition. Right. Um, And

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Speaker 1: Clarence is said to be understanding of this. Um. So again,

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Speaker 1: if you're looking for kind of like a very clear

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Speaker 1: like line between the guy who ends Roe v. Wade

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Speaker 1: and this dude, it's not in his actual opinions on

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Speaker 1: Roe v. Wade because more than anything, he barely seems

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Speaker 1: to have one right. Um. So, one interesting thing about

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Speaker 1: Thomas's career is that for a Supreme Court judge, he

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Speaker 1: basically doesn't spend any time in court arguing cases. Um,

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Speaker 1: that is not his job. He wants to be a

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Speaker 1: great trial lawyer, right, he wants because like that's where

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Speaker 1: the fucking money is. Um, But he doesn't ever really

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Speaker 1: do that the time he's been he's in he's works

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Speaker 1: for dan Forth for about two and a half years,

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Speaker 1: and this is the only time in his entire career

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Speaker 1: as a judge where he is litigating anything, or his

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Speaker 1: entire career in law where he litigates anything at all. Right,

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Speaker 1: so these are not interesting cases. His first major victory

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Speaker 1: was an argument restricting the use of vanity license plates

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Speaker 1: by rich people. Uh. He was noted, right, like, if

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Speaker 1: that's not really a big deal, you know. Um. He

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Speaker 1: was noted by some as being the office clown, though,

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Speaker 1: which is consistent with a number of recollections of people

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Speaker 1: who worked with him over the years. Now, depending on

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Speaker 1: who you ask, you might also consider him an office bully. However,

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Speaker 1: the person that he spent the time bullying in the

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Speaker 1: office was John Ashcroft, So I'm not going to say

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Speaker 1: that this goes in the bastard column for him. I

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Speaker 1: think it's completely fine to bully John. Yeah, alright, alright,

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Speaker 1: maybe you got a point here come back that gets

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Speaker 1: that gets you one year out of hell if we're

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Speaker 1: going by Catholic rules. Yeah. Um so obviously John Ashcroft,

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Speaker 1: if you don't know, was a religious weirdo who was

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Speaker 1: like a man built entirely out of hang ups. Um

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Speaker 1: and Clarence Thomas, as we are we will discuss, loves

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Speaker 1: to make extremely sexual jokes and comments to his coworkers.

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Speaker 1: So a big part of what he do is deliberately

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Speaker 1: try to flush fluster John Ashcroft by bringing up things

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Speaker 1: that are inappropriate. Um. Now again, Fuck. I will be

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Speaker 1: honest here. I am a little bit drawing a line there,

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Speaker 1: because all the writing on his time with Ashcroft said

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Speaker 1: was that he attempted to like deliberately try to fluster him. Um.

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Speaker 1: But I'm bringing up the sex stuff because one of

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Speaker 1: the most important things to know about working with Clarence

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Speaker 1: Thomas is that the man loves Miles, loves pornography. Absolutely

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Speaker 1: huge porn guy. I don't think you're ready for what

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Speaker 1: a porn guy Clarence Thomas is? What I mean? What

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Speaker 1: what would I even I'm trying to even think of

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Speaker 1: what I would describe if you said, what's a porn

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Speaker 1: guy to you? Yeah, somebody who has like a couple

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Speaker 1: like who subscribes to some magazines that we're going like

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Speaker 1: old school physical media days and has like you know,

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Speaker 1: like like a shelf of tapes. Okay, this is interesting,

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Speaker 1: This is interesting, miles. Um. I'm going to describe to

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Speaker 1: you what Clarence Thomas does about porn later and you

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Speaker 1: tell me if you think porn guy is the right

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Speaker 1: thing to call him. But okay, that's fine. And look,

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Speaker 1: you know I'm not you know, do you? But yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm this guy. Okay, we'll talk about that in a

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Speaker 1: minute now. Thomas's relationship with his mother was strained for

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Speaker 1: completely understandable reasons. He grows up in a primarily male environment,

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Speaker 1: and he seems to have gone from awkward around women

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Speaker 1: to sometimes hostile around women when he was a black

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Speaker 1: civil rights activist. He came from the camp who saw

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Speaker 1: sexual equality as not a worthy battle, like it's about

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Speaker 1: racial equality. We're not here to fight for sexual equality.

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Speaker 1: That's a bad idea, um for for here for liberation

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Speaker 1: kind of yeah, exactly again, this is every It's like

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Speaker 1: the suffragettes in the twenties being like women need to vote,

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Speaker 1: well just white women really like you or you or

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Speaker 1: you certainly not you, but um not that was all

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Speaker 1: of them, just like not that but anyway, like this

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Speaker 1: is this is it's never perfect, yes, move It turns

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Speaker 1: out movements that make meaningful achievements are often filled with

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Speaker 1: people who still believe shitty things. Um so yeah, when

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Speaker 1: when he starts going to Yale and he starts to

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Speaker 1: turn away from those activists beliefs, he keeps the chauvinism.

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Speaker 1: One female CLASSMATEE later recalled, at that time, I didn't

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Speaker 1: know the word male chauvinist, But now looking back, I

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Speaker 1: can say he defined the term. He barely spoke to women.

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Speaker 1: He was so condescending and accustomed to them being subservient

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Speaker 1: that when I'd offer an opinion in a conversation it

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Speaker 1: irritated him. When I talked, he'd just ignored me. He'd

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Speaker 1: only talked to the men. He thought women belonged in

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Speaker 1: the kitchen. So he does marry a woman Cathy ambush Um,

424
00:23:18,600 --> 00:23:21,959
Speaker 1: which is a funny name to have ambush Uh, and

425
00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:24,840
Speaker 1: they stayed together for something like a decade. She is

426
00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:28,920
Speaker 1: very traditional, which suits him. She's super Catholic, but Catholics

427
00:23:28,920 --> 00:23:33,160
Speaker 1: are liberal right traditionally in American politics, so she's also

428
00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:35,720
Speaker 1: she's very traditional. She is kind of the I'm gonna

429
00:23:35,720 --> 00:23:38,959
Speaker 1: stay at home and like be a homemaker type wife,

430
00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:42,560
Speaker 1: but also she's deeply committed to being a political liberal

431
00:23:42,560 --> 00:23:45,239
Speaker 1: and this becomes a huge source of tension for them. Now,

432
00:23:45,280 --> 00:23:48,320
Speaker 1: as I've said before, Thomas is loudly conservative in his

433
00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:52,159
Speaker 1: social values. He rails against premarital sex. He had He

434
00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:54,920
Speaker 1: apparently told enough friends that it got out to reporters

435
00:23:54,960 --> 00:23:57,040
Speaker 1: that he would leave his wife if she cheated on

436
00:23:57,119 --> 00:23:59,760
Speaker 1: him immediately. Um, Like this is just the thing he

437
00:23:59,760 --> 00:24:03,080
Speaker 1: taught about people. Um. At the same time, he has

438
00:24:03,119 --> 00:24:08,600
Speaker 1: a somewhat unhinged obsession with pornography and more of the point, Miles,

439
00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:10,840
Speaker 1: he has a little bit of a habit of sharing

440
00:24:10,880 --> 00:24:14,160
Speaker 1: it with his coworkers. And I'm gonna quote now from

441
00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:17,840
Speaker 1: Strange Justice. Well, Thomas argued against premarital sex and adultery,

442
00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:19,560
Speaker 1: telling one friend that he would leave a wife on

443
00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:21,800
Speaker 1: the spot if she was unfaithful to him. He also

444
00:24:21,800 --> 00:24:24,560
Speaker 1: showed an unusual interest in talking about sex and gross

445
00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:28,560
Speaker 1: and explicitly anatomical language, according to several college classmates. By

446
00:24:28,560 --> 00:24:31,080
Speaker 1: the time he reached Yale Law School, Thomas was known

447
00:24:31,119 --> 00:24:34,119
Speaker 1: not only for the extreme crudity of his sexual banter,

448
00:24:34,480 --> 00:24:38,760
Speaker 1: but also for avidly watching pornographic films and reading pornographic magazines,

449
00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:42,160
Speaker 1: which he would describe to friends in lurid detail. An

450
00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:45,720
Speaker 1: interest in pornography might ordinarily be considered a private matter,

451
00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:48,960
Speaker 1: but colleagues recalled that Thomas was notable for the unusually

452
00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:53,720
Speaker 1: public nature of his enthusiasm for pornographic materials. His detailed

453
00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:56,440
Speaker 1: descriptions of the movies and magazines he had seen were

454
00:24:56,440 --> 00:24:59,240
Speaker 1: an open form of socializing during these years that seemed

455
00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:02,200
Speaker 1: funny to some, offensive to others, and odd to many.

456
00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:10,160
Speaker 1: Oh oh boy, So it's been a rough road so far,

457
00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:12,840
Speaker 1: but we finally got to the funny part where it's

458
00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:16,800
Speaker 1: not funny. Play by play of these pornos he's watching. Look,

459
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:20,000
Speaker 1: this ends obviously in sexual harassment and a woman getting

460
00:25:20,080 --> 00:25:22,600
Speaker 1: attacked on a national stage, and that is not funny.

461
00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:25,240
Speaker 1: But the fact that he is in college, like showing

462
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:27,040
Speaker 1: up at parties and being like, you guys got to

463
00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:29,639
Speaker 1: hear about this fucking porno. I just watched to like

464
00:25:29,760 --> 00:25:32,679
Speaker 1: mixed groups of people who are like, what the fuck, dude.

465
00:25:32,920 --> 00:25:36,000
Speaker 1: So honestly, I'm and I'm thinking with the vanity plates,

466
00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:40,600
Speaker 1: it just feels unnecessary and it's a it's a smack

467
00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:43,920
Speaker 1: in the face of the proper bureaucracy we're trying to want. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

468
00:25:43,920 --> 00:25:46,159
Speaker 1: hold on, hold on, hold on. Do you guys know

469
00:25:46,200 --> 00:25:51,200
Speaker 1: what gape? Uh? Never mind, all right, it's butth hole stuff.

470
00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:55,920
Speaker 1: You ever seen a facial? Man, I'm telling us on

471
00:25:56,040 --> 00:25:58,760
Speaker 1: this one. I don't know what I was looking at

472
00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:02,000
Speaker 1: the video. I don't know what I was looking at.

473
00:26:02,080 --> 00:26:04,480
Speaker 1: I was like, is that a wind sock? I don't know.

474
00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:07,119
Speaker 1: Colleagues spills some coffee on his shirt and he's like,

475
00:26:07,160 --> 00:26:09,560
Speaker 1: so I was watching some German stuff the other night.

476
00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:12,719
Speaker 1: Let me tell you. I mean now that you mention it.

477
00:26:13,440 --> 00:26:15,920
Speaker 1: I didn't mention anything. I said, I'm sorry I spilled

478
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:20,040
Speaker 1: something on you. Um god, yeah it is. This is

479
00:26:20,160 --> 00:26:23,679
Speaker 1: part of a broad and a really weird and unsettling

480
00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:27,159
Speaker 1: pattern for Thomas friends and co workers. And again this

481
00:26:27,280 --> 00:26:28,760
Speaker 1: is a lot of this comes from the book Strange

482
00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:31,159
Speaker 1: Justice by Jane Mayer, and I think Jill Abramson is

483
00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:33,960
Speaker 1: her name. UM. Two reporters. Jane, we've talked about a lot.

484
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:37,560
Speaker 1: She's a huge reporter on the Koch Brothers. Um. They

485
00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:42,000
Speaker 1: find so many people with stories of Clarence talking in

486
00:26:42,240 --> 00:26:45,800
Speaker 1: explicit detail about porn that he watches. It is like

487
00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:49,240
Speaker 1: a normal thing in his life. Um, and friends and

488
00:26:49,280 --> 00:26:51,480
Speaker 1: co workers are called that. Most of the time. At work,

489
00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:55,879
Speaker 1: he's a quiet man. He's very polite, very respectful, very normal,

490
00:26:56,280 --> 00:26:59,199
Speaker 1: and then every now and then he just kind of

491
00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:03,040
Speaker 1: goes bug fuck in ways people around him don't really

492
00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:06,680
Speaker 1: know how to cope with. One friend told Jane Mayer quote,

493
00:27:07,080 --> 00:27:08,960
Speaker 1: one percent of the time he would go off the

494
00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:12,119
Speaker 1: deep end. He'd say stuff I can't possibly repeat, stuff

495
00:27:12,119 --> 00:27:14,159
Speaker 1: that would turn your ears red, things having to do

496
00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:17,280
Speaker 1: with a person's anatomy. He'd say things like suck out

497
00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:19,359
Speaker 1: of my ass with a straw all the time. But

498
00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:21,480
Speaker 1: this was different. It was a lot worse, And I

499
00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:24,760
Speaker 1: don't feel comfortable talking about Wait, wait, wait, this guy

500
00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:28,160
Speaker 1: just set the fucking floor as sucks out of my asshole.

501
00:27:28,280 --> 00:27:33,360
Speaker 1: That's the normal ship. Yeah, oh my god. I mean

502
00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:37,240
Speaker 1: even in my joking, I was still being like Coya

503
00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:41,920
Speaker 1: a little bit, but I mean it's the graphic detail

504
00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:45,080
Speaker 1: that mix. And he's also has like this, he occupies

505
00:27:45,119 --> 00:27:49,359
Speaker 1: this weird space of like a sexually repressed, like teenager

506
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:51,640
Speaker 1: kid and he's like, yeah, you know what, I kind

507
00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:54,240
Speaker 1: of nasty ship I watch. Yeah, let me tell you

508
00:27:54,280 --> 00:27:56,760
Speaker 1: about this weird ship I saw at the porn theater.

509
00:27:57,040 --> 00:27:59,280
Speaker 1: And I think that is like he is a connoisseur

510
00:27:59,359 --> 00:28:02,560
Speaker 1: of pornograph the There are people who like worked at

511
00:28:02,600 --> 00:28:04,760
Speaker 1: porn theaters in d C with stories of him coming

512
00:28:04,760 --> 00:28:08,320
Speaker 1: into written things like he goes in for the weird ship,

513
00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:11,760
Speaker 1: like he is an obsessive consumer of this. He finds

514
00:28:11,800 --> 00:28:14,479
Speaker 1: like baffling and bizarre porn and then he just like

515
00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:19,439
Speaker 1: talks about it at work in the government. Um, just

516
00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:23,120
Speaker 1: like and also like it's like a fucking weird character

517
00:28:23,320 --> 00:28:26,720
Speaker 1: from a fucking like comedy where it's like my boss

518
00:28:26,800 --> 00:28:30,200
Speaker 1: is really like time, like he's like this and then

519
00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:35,280
Speaker 1: he goes off the deep end. Yeah, yeah, it's bizarre. Um.

520
00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:38,040
Speaker 1: There are rumors that he was abusive in his first

521
00:28:38,520 --> 00:28:42,800
Speaker 1: marriage physically abuses abuse. If there are not allegations from

522
00:28:42,840 --> 00:28:45,480
Speaker 1: his ex wife that I am aware of. And it's

523
00:28:45,560 --> 00:28:48,000
Speaker 1: kind of to be honest, I from what I have seen,

524
00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:50,960
Speaker 1: at least, I don't think there's a lot there um,

525
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:54,400
Speaker 1: at least not that I ran into. Meyer and Abramson

526
00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:58,280
Speaker 1: note that like in there and again they're very critical biography.

527
00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:02,840
Speaker 1: He receives custody of their son after the divorce, um,

528
00:29:02,840 --> 00:29:05,760
Speaker 1: which is why they think that he there might not

529
00:29:05,800 --> 00:29:07,600
Speaker 1: have been anything to get like, these are just rumors

530
00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:09,960
Speaker 1: around him, as opposed to like somebody making an allegation.

531
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:12,600
Speaker 1: So they are out there, you can find them. I'm

532
00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:16,520
Speaker 1: not aware of like much solid there um he does.

533
00:29:16,760 --> 00:29:19,040
Speaker 1: This is actually kind of something we're really worth noting.

534
00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:22,520
Speaker 1: He's make sure to take custody of his son after

535
00:29:22,560 --> 00:29:26,440
Speaker 1: the divorce, which is him breaking this one cycle in

536
00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:29,800
Speaker 1: his family history, right right, He is the he is

537
00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:33,840
Speaker 1: the man, the father in his family line who does

538
00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:37,600
Speaker 1: not hand over his fucking kid, not his son. Not

539
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:40,080
Speaker 1: well exactly right, Yeah it doesn't. He doesn't have a daughter,

540
00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:44,040
Speaker 1: so yeah, we don't know about that. Yeah you're you

541
00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:48,240
Speaker 1: are right, Miles. It has not been completely tested. You lucky,

542
00:29:48,320 --> 00:29:54,280
Speaker 1: you must sign um now there are rumors. Oh sorry,

543
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:57,040
Speaker 1: Aeric said that now at any rate, Dan Fourth, the

544
00:29:57,040 --> 00:29:59,080
Speaker 1: guy he's been working for, becomes a U. S. Senator

545
00:29:59,120 --> 00:30:02,600
Speaker 1: in nineteen seven the seven, and Thomas leaves. His employee

546
00:30:02,640 --> 00:30:04,800
Speaker 1: has an opportunity to go with him. Did he see?

547
00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:07,920
Speaker 1: But he's like, that would be in his mind kind

548
00:30:07,960 --> 00:30:11,320
Speaker 1: of a lower prestige job than working for a state

549
00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:14,960
Speaker 1: attorney general. Um. And more to the point, Dan Fourth,

550
00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:17,560
Speaker 1: before he leaves, helps Thomas get a job in the

551
00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:20,480
Speaker 1: private sector. This is like the high paid lawyer job

552
00:30:20,480 --> 00:30:23,440
Speaker 1: he's been wanting all the time, as a lawyer representing

553
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:30,120
Speaker 1: them on Santo Chemical Corporation. Yeah, this is like the

554
00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:33,840
Speaker 1: one lawyer job he does other than like politics. Ship

555
00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:38,600
Speaker 1: and it's Monsanto. Hey, I mean that's what he wanted, right,

556
00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:43,239
Speaker 1: He wanted his big, cushy earth fucker jobs. Does he

557
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:48,480
Speaker 1: fox the ship out of the earth? Now? Obviously Monsanto

558
00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:51,120
Speaker 1: has done a number of questionable things. I don't really

559
00:30:51,760 --> 00:30:55,280
Speaker 1: see evidence that Clarence was super directly involved in it.

560
00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:57,880
Speaker 1: His job was much more um, his job was much

561
00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:01,760
Speaker 1: more like rudimentary, sort of like mechanic. His job was

562
00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:05,200
Speaker 1: much more mechanical. He was registering herbicides with the e

563
00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:07,440
Speaker 1: p A. Right, he was the guy who was like

564
00:31:07,440 --> 00:31:09,400
Speaker 1: like interfacing with the e p A in order to

565
00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:13,720
Speaker 1: handle the registration of product project products. Um, so he's

566
00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:16,520
Speaker 1: not like, he's not like the trigger man they send

567
00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:18,720
Speaker 1: out when they poison people, right, Like, he's the guy

568
00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:21,000
Speaker 1: who's who's like doing this very kind of like meat

569
00:31:21,040 --> 00:31:24,840
Speaker 1: and potatoes role exactly. He's like they're like, oh, wow,

570
00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:28,920
Speaker 1: mon Santo, you must do some yeah yeah, like with

571
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:33,760
Speaker 1: sate and stuff like that. Yeah, yeah, big stuff. He

572
00:31:33,880 --> 00:31:38,280
Speaker 1: just fucking registers him. He fucking filled out paperwork. Can't

573
00:31:38,280 --> 00:31:41,239
Speaker 1: even commit crimes, right, Oh my god, get away from

574
00:31:41,240 --> 00:31:44,239
Speaker 1: your such a fucking nerd. You don't even you just

575
00:31:44,360 --> 00:31:47,680
Speaker 1: register the fucking round up. Get out of here. So

576
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:50,160
Speaker 1: the main benefit of this job is that it doubles

577
00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:52,680
Speaker 1: his salary, which obviously allows him to live in much

578
00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:55,280
Speaker 1: more comfort while he waits for his next political break,

579
00:31:55,520 --> 00:31:58,400
Speaker 1: which comes near the end of nineteen seventy nine. Now

580
00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:00,600
Speaker 1: this was through Dan Fourth again, who taking a real

581
00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:03,720
Speaker 1: shine to Clarence Dance for Dan Fourth decided that he

582
00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:06,760
Speaker 1: wanted to integrate his Senate staff, and he asked Thomas

583
00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:09,840
Speaker 1: if he wanted a job as a legislative assistant. Clarence

584
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:12,600
Speaker 1: agreed on the condition that he worked on absolutely no

585
00:32:12,800 --> 00:32:15,640
Speaker 1: quote black issues, right, And this is a big part

586
00:32:15,680 --> 00:32:19,600
Speaker 1: of what he liked about Thomas. Thomas does not want

587
00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:23,040
Speaker 1: to work on black issues. He said, Okay, I'll okay. No,

588
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:26,520
Speaker 1: Dan Fourth is not saying that you want a job,

589
00:32:26,920 --> 00:32:28,560
Speaker 1: and Thomas is like, the only way I'll do that

590
00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:30,760
Speaker 1: is if I'm not doing black stuff. Right. This is

591
00:32:30,800 --> 00:32:33,120
Speaker 1: part of why he wants. He likes working from Ansanto

592
00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:37,160
Speaker 1: because he gets experienced in environmental and energy like law,

593
00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:39,200
Speaker 1: and he wants to do that because it's not, well,

594
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:42,080
Speaker 1: there's money, and it's also not at all associated with

595
00:32:42,120 --> 00:32:44,560
Speaker 1: like civil rights. It's nothing, has nothing to do in

596
00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:48,320
Speaker 1: people's So it's like it's like comfortable in that sense

597
00:32:48,400 --> 00:32:50,960
Speaker 1: that he doesn't have to that have to reckon in

598
00:32:51,040 --> 00:32:53,040
Speaker 1: his consciousness versus like, no, I think it's your right

599
00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:56,440
Speaker 1: to poison people. Yeah. And also I think he doesn't

600
00:32:56,440 --> 00:32:58,560
Speaker 1: want to get like pigeonholed, right, Like I don't want

601
00:32:58,560 --> 00:33:00,840
Speaker 1: to just be the like the black guy who does

602
00:33:01,320 --> 00:33:03,840
Speaker 1: black law stuff, right, Like if I'm going to be,

603
00:33:04,400 --> 00:33:09,000
Speaker 1: I don't want to. Also, Yeah, that's also what he's saying,

604
00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:11,680
Speaker 1: which is again directly the opposite of what he claimed

605
00:33:11,680 --> 00:33:14,880
Speaker 1: to his grandfather. He wanted to do as a lawyer anyway. Uh.

606
00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:17,320
Speaker 1: He seems to have been good at this job. Again,

607
00:33:17,360 --> 00:33:22,000
Speaker 1: not particularly noteworthy, although legislative assistants generally aren't. Uh. The

608
00:33:22,040 --> 00:33:24,840
Speaker 1: one thing that his colleagues really recognized in Clarence was

609
00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:28,760
Speaker 1: his remarkable ambition. Mayor and Abramson write quote, less than

610
00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:31,080
Speaker 1: a year after arriving in Washington, over lunch with the

611
00:33:31,120 --> 00:33:34,160
Speaker 1: reporter in the Washington bureau of the St. Louis Post Dispatch,

612
00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:36,520
Speaker 1: Thomas mentioned that he had his eye on a better job.

613
00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:40,200
Speaker 1: John Sawyer, now the papers Washington bureau chief, recalled being

614
00:33:40,240 --> 00:33:43,360
Speaker 1: astonished when Thomas, who was an affable but completely unknown

615
00:33:43,360 --> 00:33:46,080
Speaker 1: aid to a freshman senator, announced that the spot he

616
00:33:46,160 --> 00:33:48,520
Speaker 1: wanted was nothing less than a seat on the U. S.

617
00:33:48,520 --> 00:33:52,360
Speaker 1: Supreme Court. So he's he is gunning for the job

618
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:54,520
Speaker 1: that he gets pretty much from the beginning of his

619
00:33:54,600 --> 00:33:59,000
Speaker 1: time over here. Yeah, Yeah, he's he's he figures out

620
00:33:59,080 --> 00:34:00,760
Speaker 1: that this is like pas stable for him if he

621
00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:02,880
Speaker 1: kind of makes the right in roads with the Republican Party,

622
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:06,800
Speaker 1: and it's like a fucking laser from this point and

623
00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:12,560
Speaker 1: he's incentivized in the darkest fucking ways, and it's also

624
00:34:12,680 --> 00:34:16,920
Speaker 1: wild to think that the reason like he even gets

625
00:34:16,920 --> 00:34:19,440
Speaker 1: his head turned in this direction of like law or

626
00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:22,799
Speaker 1: politics is because you know, he got rejected by the

627
00:34:22,920 --> 00:34:25,719
Speaker 1: Vienna Academy of Fine Arts. I guess the form of

628
00:34:26,239 --> 00:34:30,000
Speaker 1: Atlanta private like like law firms and ship like guys

629
00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:34,239
Speaker 1: like oh really, yeah, really, okay, I've got something for you.

630
00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:39,560
Speaker 1: Then yeah, I got ideas. So Thomas makes his mind

631
00:34:39,640 --> 00:34:41,600
Speaker 1: up early on to play to the right in order

632
00:34:41,640 --> 00:34:44,560
Speaker 1: to secure himself a more prestigious career, but he also

633
00:34:44,640 --> 00:34:49,520
Speaker 1: finds himself increasingly in ideological step, not just with conservatives,

634
00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:52,879
Speaker 1: but with the extreme fringes of the right wing, which

635
00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:56,560
Speaker 1: we're actively moving in to take over from liberal Republicans. Again.

636
00:34:57,040 --> 00:35:00,520
Speaker 1: This is the last era against in which liberal Publicans

637
00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:02,759
Speaker 1: are influential. In other episodes we've talked I mean we're

638
00:35:02,760 --> 00:35:05,440
Speaker 1: talking about Dan Forth now, who was one liberal Republican.

639
00:35:05,840 --> 00:35:07,920
Speaker 1: We've talked a lot in the past about Henry Kissinger

640
00:35:07,960 --> 00:35:11,680
Speaker 1: appreciator Nelson Rockefeller, who was a Republican and also a

641
00:35:11,880 --> 00:35:16,440
Speaker 1: very like a liberal. UM. This is the period in

642
00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:20,080
Speaker 1: which those people are being like held underwater until the

643
00:35:20,120 --> 00:35:24,160
Speaker 1: bubble stop right Um and two of the people who

644
00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:27,239
Speaker 1: are big factors in this are two black conservatives, both

645
00:35:27,239 --> 00:35:30,319
Speaker 1: of whom have a huge influence on Clarence Thomas. Now,

646
00:35:30,360 --> 00:35:34,400
Speaker 1: one of these guys is Thomas Sowell, an an economist

647
00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:36,279
Speaker 1: and a writer who I was given a lot of

648
00:35:36,280 --> 00:35:39,279
Speaker 1: this guy's fucking books when I was a little kid. Um.

649
00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:42,480
Speaker 1: Sowell raised rage against raged against the double A c

650
00:35:42,640 --> 00:35:45,759
Speaker 1: P as a snobby click of elites. Uh. He called

651
00:35:45,800 --> 00:35:48,719
Speaker 1: out affirmative action because quote those who were already well

652
00:35:48,719 --> 00:35:52,359
Speaker 1: off were made even better off, while the ostensible beneficiaries

653
00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:56,040
Speaker 1: were either neglected or made worse off. And it's interesting

654
00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:58,480
Speaker 1: to me because, like so Well is kind of calling

655
00:35:58,480 --> 00:36:01,600
Speaker 1: out Clarence Thomas because clear he's he's a he's a

656
00:36:01,640 --> 00:36:03,600
Speaker 1: middle class kid who, because he's middle class, is able

657
00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:05,759
Speaker 1: to take advantage of some of these like affirmative action

658
00:36:05,800 --> 00:36:08,040
Speaker 1: programs because he's in a position to do so. That

659
00:36:08,200 --> 00:36:10,200
Speaker 1: is what that soul is. I don't think that's a

660
00:36:10,239 --> 00:36:13,080
Speaker 1: good reason not to support those programs, but that's what

661
00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:18,680
Speaker 1: Soul's arguing. And he's kind of talking directly about Clarence Thomas. Um.

662
00:36:18,719 --> 00:36:21,880
Speaker 1: Which is interesting. Now, Um, this does not seem to

663
00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:25,520
Speaker 1: have had any influence on Clarence Thomas, who loves Soul

664
00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:29,200
Speaker 1: and later said that encountering his ideas was like quote,

665
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:31,640
Speaker 1: pouring half a glass of water on the desert. I

666
00:36:31,719 --> 00:36:35,080
Speaker 1: just soaked it up. Now. One thing Soul love to

667
00:36:35,120 --> 00:36:37,399
Speaker 1: talk about was the fact that women made less than

668
00:36:37,440 --> 00:36:41,240
Speaker 1: men because that's what they wanted. They took easier jobs

669
00:36:41,239 --> 00:36:44,600
Speaker 1: so that they could have babies later. So it's fine,

670
00:36:44,719 --> 00:36:50,279
Speaker 1: it's all good, Miles, it's all good. They make that

671
00:36:50,440 --> 00:36:53,239
Speaker 1: choice for their babies that they're gonna have in the

672
00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:57,319
Speaker 1: future because they don't have other opic women, all right,

673
00:36:58,160 --> 00:37:01,200
Speaker 1: they want the easier jobs because they can't work so

674
00:37:01,280 --> 00:37:05,200
Speaker 1: hard when they make the babies. That's right. What a

675
00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:11,600
Speaker 1: hate patronizing. It is a really patronizing. I mean. And

676
00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:14,319
Speaker 1: the fact is, like that ship is that thinking still

677
00:37:14,480 --> 00:37:18,520
Speaker 1: is that is exists now in substantial way. We haven't

678
00:37:18,520 --> 00:37:22,560
Speaker 1: moved that far from fucking cis head. Dudes. Let me

679
00:37:22,640 --> 00:37:26,040
Speaker 1: tell you something about a woman's body that I have

680
00:37:26,239 --> 00:37:30,920
Speaker 1: no corporal experience with. Certain we're going to have that

681
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:34,800
Speaker 1: thinking used by Clarence Thomas in a terrible Supreme Court decision,

682
00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:37,400
Speaker 1: and like, I don't know, three months for he's like

683
00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:40,400
Speaker 1: I was watching Doctor Oz instead of vaginas like a

684
00:37:40,480 --> 00:37:43,480
Speaker 1: self cleaning oven. That's why they do not need a O. B. G.

685
00:37:43,760 --> 00:37:46,839
Speaker 1: Y in. That's a law and medical practice. Yeah, I'm

686
00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:52,000
Speaker 1: making it a crime to do medicine miles. You know

687
00:37:52,040 --> 00:37:56,080
Speaker 1: what else is a crime? How low the prices are

688
00:37:56,480 --> 00:38:00,680
Speaker 1: on our sponsors products? Literally illegal. If you buy any

689
00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:03,319
Speaker 1: of these products, the FBI will break down your door

690
00:38:03,360 --> 00:38:07,520
Speaker 1: and shoot your dog. And the SEC is coming after

691
00:38:07,560 --> 00:38:10,840
Speaker 1: you no matter what. You're fucked. You're fucked. They're on you.

692
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:13,640
Speaker 1: So is that? How is that? Is that the script

693
00:38:13,640 --> 00:38:15,920
Speaker 1: that the company sent us? Are we good the version

694
00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:18,720
Speaker 1: of it? I think I think Sophie stepped away napping

695
00:38:18,800 --> 00:38:21,520
Speaker 1: on the job. I'm just angrily shaking my head at

696
00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:35,560
Speaker 1: you because I have no fucking words. So products, thanks ah, products.

697
00:38:35,640 --> 00:38:38,839
Speaker 1: So the other black Republican who influenced Thomas in this

698
00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:41,760
Speaker 1: period was Jay Parker, a writer and a fire brand

699
00:38:41,760 --> 00:38:44,440
Speaker 1: who believed the government should end all state and local

700
00:38:44,480 --> 00:38:49,040
Speaker 1: aid for food, clothing, shelter, and everything else. Um now,

701
00:38:49,560 --> 00:38:52,279
Speaker 1: so Jay Parker not a great guy, right by that

702
00:38:52,320 --> 00:38:56,360
Speaker 1: little description. Here's what's cool. Jay Parker is, obviously, because

703
00:38:56,360 --> 00:38:58,600
Speaker 1: of everything we just said, very useful to Reagan Eric

704
00:38:58,640 --> 00:39:01,400
Speaker 1: conservatives who come to power shortly after Thomas gets to

705
00:39:01,480 --> 00:39:05,000
Speaker 1: d C. But Parker is also very useful to another

706
00:39:05,160 --> 00:39:09,760
Speaker 1: group of white conservatives, the apartheid government of South Africa.

707
00:39:12,239 --> 00:39:15,920
Speaker 1: Why did why do these why did this group of

708
00:39:15,960 --> 00:39:20,120
Speaker 1: people enter the game? Yeah? If this is a cool story, Miles,

709
00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:22,200
Speaker 1: who may not be the right word. This is the

710
00:39:22,200 --> 00:39:27,280
Speaker 1: thing that happened. Starting in the Nixon administration, South Africa

711
00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:31,239
Speaker 1: launched a massive propaganda blitz aimed at shoring up their reputation.

712
00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:33,879
Speaker 1: They spent more than a hundred million dollars a year

713
00:39:33,880 --> 00:39:38,000
Speaker 1: targeting fast segments of the US population, and this included

714
00:39:38,239 --> 00:39:41,640
Speaker 1: in one of its odd chapters, reaching out to Black America.

715
00:39:42,400 --> 00:39:46,480
Speaker 1: The apartheid government of South Africa bought several prominent black

716
00:39:46,600 --> 00:39:51,359
Speaker 1: organizers to push their cause, generally without wide success. Jay

717
00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:54,000
Speaker 1: Parker was one of these guys. And I'm gonna quote

718
00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:58,000
Speaker 1: now from Rebecca Davis of Rhodes University. J Parker promoted

719
00:39:58,000 --> 00:40:00,840
Speaker 1: the entrance of the Transkay and ven To before taking

720
00:40:00,840 --> 00:40:03,640
Speaker 1: on the representation of the South African government, and in

721
00:40:03,680 --> 00:40:07,280
Speaker 1: two thousand nine wrote an unrepentant biography telling lye titled

722
00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:11,280
Speaker 1: Courage to Put My Country Above Color. William A. Keys,

723
00:40:11,360 --> 00:40:14,359
Speaker 1: a former policy advisor to Ronald Reagan was hired by

724
00:40:14,400 --> 00:40:17,439
Speaker 1: the South African Embassy to act as pratorious point man

725
00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:20,240
Speaker 1: to the U S Black community and was paid almost

726
00:40:20,239 --> 00:40:24,040
Speaker 1: four hundred thousand dollars for his services. So this is

727
00:40:24,120 --> 00:40:26,040
Speaker 1: number one a thing that a bunch of guys, a

728
00:40:26,040 --> 00:40:29,879
Speaker 1: bunch of particularly like black speakers and writers who are

729
00:40:30,280 --> 00:40:35,319
Speaker 1: associated with the Reagan administration, take apartheid money, and they

730
00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:38,680
Speaker 1: justified by saying, like, well, they're fighting against communism. That's

731
00:40:38,719 --> 00:40:43,160
Speaker 1: why j Parker calls his biography putting My Country above color, right, Like, yes,

732
00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:47,440
Speaker 1: they are a nightmare racist regime, but it's more important

733
00:40:47,480 --> 00:40:50,640
Speaker 1: to fight communism. I was protecting America. Wait, so with

734
00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:53,400
Speaker 1: the interest, yes, the interests of the country that enslaved

735
00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 1: people like me. I'm that's my priority actually to do

736
00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:01,879
Speaker 1: what's in the best interest of that entity more so

737
00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:04,520
Speaker 1: than the people that were oppressed. That's how do you

738
00:41:04,600 --> 00:41:06,440
Speaker 1: do you get where I'm going? That is literally the

739
00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:11,560
Speaker 1: title of Jay Parker's biography should be Yeah, I mean,

740
00:41:11,560 --> 00:41:19,960
Speaker 1: they have slaved us. But but but what sir? But communism? Oh? Yes, okay, yeah,

741
00:41:20,200 --> 00:41:22,040
Speaker 1: we will. I think at some point we might talk

742
00:41:22,040 --> 00:41:27,920
Speaker 1: about like the apartheid government of South Africa's American PR Company.

743
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:32,919
Speaker 1: And because it is a story. J Parker, this guy

744
00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:35,120
Speaker 1: who was a bought and paid for instrument of the

745
00:41:35,160 --> 00:41:38,200
Speaker 1: apartheid governor, I can't say that enough, is one of

746
00:41:38,239 --> 00:41:43,479
Speaker 1: Clarence Thomas's intellectual like icons UM and also a good

747
00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:48,120
Speaker 1: personal friend of his. UM. Thomas and Parker like work

748
00:41:48,239 --> 00:41:52,000
Speaker 1: together at the Reagan White House UM, and you know

749
00:41:52,120 --> 00:41:54,799
Speaker 1: the fact that he befriends Parker winds up being very

750
00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:57,279
Speaker 1: good for his career. Thomas gets put on a job,

751
00:41:57,360 --> 00:42:01,080
Speaker 1: gets a job on the incoming administration transition team with

752
00:42:01,120 --> 00:42:04,640
Speaker 1: the e e o C or Equal Employment Opportunity Commission.

753
00:42:05,040 --> 00:42:07,960
Speaker 1: And since the Reaganites didn't like the idea of equal anything,

754
00:42:08,360 --> 00:42:11,520
Speaker 1: this job was about gutting the organization, not running it right.

755
00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:14,240
Speaker 1: Like that's why they're they're putting them on there. Obviously

756
00:42:15,239 --> 00:42:18,719
Speaker 1: this is not really in line with Thomas's promise to

757
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:21,640
Speaker 1: his grandfather that he was gonna fight the good fight

758
00:42:21,640 --> 00:42:23,640
Speaker 1: in his own way, but it does bring him closer

759
00:42:23,680 --> 00:42:27,560
Speaker 1: to power. So, working as the transition lead for the

760
00:42:27,560 --> 00:42:31,520
Speaker 1: e o C, he begins what is unfortunately a continuing

761
00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:35,600
Speaker 1: negative trend. Taking his personal opinions on what struggling people

762
00:42:35,640 --> 00:42:39,319
Speaker 1: ought to do and forcing them into government policy. So

763
00:42:39,600 --> 00:42:42,240
Speaker 1: Thomas has a weird bug up his ass about class

764
00:42:42,239 --> 00:42:44,719
Speaker 1: action lawsuits, which had emerged in this period to become

765
00:42:44,719 --> 00:42:46,920
Speaker 1: the primary method by which people who are not rich

766
00:42:46,960 --> 00:42:50,600
Speaker 1: and powerful held corporations and the government accountable. One of

767
00:42:50,600 --> 00:42:52,239
Speaker 1: the first things he does at the e O C

768
00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:56,239
Speaker 1: is he sends out a memo suggesting that worker discrimination

769
00:42:56,560 --> 00:42:58,960
Speaker 1: suits should have to be proven on a case by

770
00:42:59,000 --> 00:43:01,879
Speaker 1: case basis, one by one, rather than being done via

771
00:43:01,960 --> 00:43:05,040
Speaker 1: class class action. He also co authors the report in

772
00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:08,600
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty that attacks the existing definition of sexual harassment.

773
00:43:09,040 --> 00:43:13,240
Speaker 1: The old definition had included unwelcome sexual attention, either verbal

774
00:43:13,320 --> 00:43:16,520
Speaker 1: or physical. Thomas argued this was too broad and that

775
00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:19,560
Speaker 1: including verbal comments would lead to a quote barrage of

776
00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:23,560
Speaker 1: trivial complaints. The report he helped author concluded that the

777
00:43:23,600 --> 00:43:27,799
Speaker 1: elimination of personal slights and sexual advances which contribute to

778
00:43:27,840 --> 00:43:31,320
Speaker 1: an intimidating, hostile, or offensive working environment is a goal

779
00:43:31,400 --> 00:43:34,359
Speaker 1: impossible to reach. And take it from me, the guy

780
00:43:34,440 --> 00:43:38,080
Speaker 1: who has to talk about porn NonStop, it's just gonna

781
00:43:38,080 --> 00:43:43,200
Speaker 1: be basically, it's gonna be a mess. Guys. Yeah, I

782
00:43:43,320 --> 00:43:45,560
Speaker 1: might as well wear a ball gap and a leather

783
00:43:45,760 --> 00:43:48,360
Speaker 1: mask and some restraints. I don't know. That might be

784
00:43:48,360 --> 00:43:49,880
Speaker 1: pretty hot, but I don't know. I was just watching

785
00:43:49,920 --> 00:43:53,200
Speaker 1: this video gotta thinking like what, First, let me tell

786
00:43:53,239 --> 00:43:56,920
Speaker 1: you about the com shots. So imagine there's likely a

787
00:43:57,000 --> 00:44:00,400
Speaker 1: tarantula made out of cock heading right towards your face.

788
00:44:00,920 --> 00:44:03,320
Speaker 1: And then when it goes off, you know those oreo

789
00:44:03,440 --> 00:44:05,759
Speaker 1: ads where you're mixing two of them together and there's

790
00:44:05,760 --> 00:44:14,040
Speaker 1: just that splash of the white foam, white foam. Oh no, yeah,

791
00:44:14,080 --> 00:44:16,799
Speaker 1: it's mad. It's frothy. It's one of those. It's one

792
00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:19,480
Speaker 1: of those frothy it's like the top of a what

793
00:44:19,480 --> 00:44:22,160
Speaker 1: what I imagine people drink in Seattle, one of those

794
00:44:22,200 --> 00:44:26,400
Speaker 1: foamy lattees exactly exactly. I don't drink those much, but

795
00:44:26,480 --> 00:44:30,360
Speaker 1: you know that kind of needs a mustache. He's it's again,

796
00:44:30,719 --> 00:44:33,760
Speaker 1: every single thing. It's like you're starting to make sense

797
00:44:33,800 --> 00:44:37,680
Speaker 1: of how he moves, Like, of course he sexual harassment

798
00:44:37,840 --> 00:44:41,719
Speaker 1: can't be real, because then anything he says is like

799
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:45,560
Speaker 1: gross and over the line and offensive. It's even one

800
00:44:45,600 --> 00:44:48,319
Speaker 1: of these is interesting, is they're like in that last line,

801
00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:52,400
Speaker 1: you see they're talking about personal slights and sexual advances

802
00:44:52,480 --> 00:44:55,920
Speaker 1: contribute to an intimidating, hostile or offencing work environment, offensive

803
00:44:55,920 --> 00:45:00,400
Speaker 1: work environment. But they're saying stopping that as impossible, so

804
00:45:00,440 --> 00:45:02,560
Speaker 1: why would we try all that hard? Right, Like that's

805
00:45:02,680 --> 00:45:06,720
Speaker 1: that's the conclusion, which is amazing, which is wild because

806
00:45:07,080 --> 00:45:10,600
Speaker 1: it but then the again, because there's no such thing

807
00:45:10,640 --> 00:45:12,719
Speaker 1: as hippo, but they're just they just do whatever they

808
00:45:12,800 --> 00:45:14,200
Speaker 1: want because on the other side, it's like, well, we

809
00:45:14,239 --> 00:45:17,799
Speaker 1: want to stop every single person from doing this thing though, Yeah,

810
00:45:17,840 --> 00:45:20,040
Speaker 1: but it's actually like there's no way, there's no way,

811
00:45:20,080 --> 00:45:21,960
Speaker 1: there's no way, you can't even anything, you can't even

812
00:45:22,040 --> 00:45:24,680
Speaker 1: do anything about it. Yeah, it's again, this is this

813
00:45:24,719 --> 00:45:26,840
Speaker 1: is a broader question. But like when we're talking about

814
00:45:26,880 --> 00:45:29,960
Speaker 1: dealing with conservatives and their attempts to funk people over,

815
00:45:30,600 --> 00:45:35,040
Speaker 1: there's no point in treating them like they are good

816
00:45:35,040 --> 00:45:38,400
Speaker 1: faith actors because their their goal is to restrict you

817
00:45:38,560 --> 00:45:41,360
Speaker 1: and do whatever the funk. They want to stop pretending

818
00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:44,640
Speaker 1: that that's the case to continue to be like, but

819
00:45:44,800 --> 00:45:48,600
Speaker 1: they just said this other thing about a parallel subject

820
00:45:48,800 --> 00:45:52,040
Speaker 1: like mother, that's not where they're at. They use the

821
00:45:52,239 --> 00:45:55,000
Speaker 1: like the skin of humans to be like it's all

822
00:45:55,040 --> 00:45:59,319
Speaker 1: about doing whatever we want to ever, Yeah, it's yeah again,

823
00:45:59,360 --> 00:46:01,520
Speaker 1: it's like Clarence Amas being like, I don't believe interracial

824
00:46:01,520 --> 00:46:03,359
Speaker 1: marriage is right. Oh, now I want to have one,

825
00:46:03,440 --> 00:46:08,000
Speaker 1: so now it's fine. Like though, yeah, like that, he's

826
00:46:08,080 --> 00:46:10,680
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter, like bringing it up to like again,

827
00:46:10,719 --> 00:46:12,960
Speaker 1: we're kind of acknowledging these things and a number of

828
00:46:13,040 --> 00:46:15,920
Speaker 1: hypocrisies because it's important to note it for history, but like,

829
00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:18,880
Speaker 1: none of this matters, and an argumentative standpoint, They're not

830
00:46:18,920 --> 00:46:21,040
Speaker 1: there to have a good faith conversation. They're there to

831
00:46:21,120 --> 00:46:25,080
Speaker 1: exercise power in ways that hurt people. It's not any

832
00:46:25,160 --> 00:46:28,960
Speaker 1: kind of consistency of fun. Yeah, it's just yeah, it's cool,

833
00:46:29,080 --> 00:46:32,080
Speaker 1: it's cool and good. It's like taking the apartheid South

834
00:46:32,120 --> 00:46:35,839
Speaker 1: African government's money, uh, in order to claim that you're

835
00:46:35,880 --> 00:46:38,600
Speaker 1: just such an anti communist, this has to be done.

836
00:46:39,520 --> 00:46:43,399
Speaker 1: Um So. While Thomas ingratiated himself to the Reagan administration,

837
00:46:43,480 --> 00:46:48,080
Speaker 1: he also began increasingly publicizing his existence as a black Conservative.

838
00:46:48,400 --> 00:46:51,400
Speaker 1: He joined an organization created by Thomas Sowell and started

839
00:46:51,400 --> 00:46:54,040
Speaker 1: giving interviews where he would talk about his hard scrabble

840
00:46:54,120 --> 00:46:57,120
Speaker 1: upbringing and how traditional right wing values had gotten him

841
00:46:57,120 --> 00:47:01,000
Speaker 1: through a tumultuous childhood of poverty. Now this is not

842
00:47:01,120 --> 00:47:05,080
Speaker 1: really true, right, Yeah, there's certainly a number of like

843
00:47:05,400 --> 00:47:08,480
Speaker 1: his hard scrabble aspects of his youth and especially his

844
00:47:08,520 --> 00:47:11,720
Speaker 1: grandpa's story. But like he comes into his grandpa's middle

845
00:47:11,760 --> 00:47:15,160
Speaker 1: class life and is is you know, taken care of

846
00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:20,640
Speaker 1: as a result of that hard core conservative values exactly,

847
00:47:21,080 --> 00:47:24,000
Speaker 1: And a lot of his recollections of his family later

848
00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:28,319
Speaker 1: to conservatives are deliberate lies or at least exaggerations that

849
00:47:28,360 --> 00:47:31,200
Speaker 1: he made to sell his image better. He told one

850
00:47:31,239 --> 00:47:34,200
Speaker 1: audience quote, where I grew up or when I grew up,

851
00:47:34,239 --> 00:47:36,759
Speaker 1: there was more a feeling of responsibility for kids that

852
00:47:36,800 --> 00:47:39,280
Speaker 1: you brought into the world. These were values you learned.

853
00:47:39,480 --> 00:47:41,640
Speaker 1: The government didn't have a damn thing to do about it.

854
00:47:41,680 --> 00:47:46,200
Speaker 1: And like that's the opposite of your childhood, Clarence. You

855
00:47:46,239 --> 00:47:49,360
Speaker 1: were like your whole family was like a bunch of dudes,

856
00:47:49,600 --> 00:47:51,600
Speaker 1: like being like, no, I'm not I ain't taken care

857
00:47:51,600 --> 00:47:54,759
Speaker 1: of that kid. Like that was not the values that

858
00:47:54,800 --> 00:47:58,680
Speaker 1: you learned from your family. Clarence. Tis I mean he's

859
00:47:59,480 --> 00:48:02,279
Speaker 1: I mean, I mean this, he's a fucking terminator. Yeah,

860
00:48:02,360 --> 00:48:03,960
Speaker 1: he didn't give a funk. He's got a figure it out.

861
00:48:04,000 --> 00:48:06,479
Speaker 1: It's like all the calculations are made like, lie about

862
00:48:06,480 --> 00:48:08,520
Speaker 1: this ship. Lie about this ship. They were looking for it.

863
00:48:08,840 --> 00:48:11,640
Speaker 1: The worst of it is when he lies about his sister,

864
00:48:11,760 --> 00:48:15,360
Speaker 1: because Clarence Thomas is super fine with throwing members of

865
00:48:15,400 --> 00:48:18,720
Speaker 1: his family under the bus for political clout. The book

866
00:48:18,800 --> 00:48:21,640
Speaker 1: Strange Justice covers a fateful interview that he had with

867
00:48:21,680 --> 00:48:24,520
Speaker 1: the reporter from the Washington Post. Quote. It was in

868
00:48:24,560 --> 00:48:28,080
Speaker 1: this interview that Thomas first publicly denounced his sister's reliance

869
00:48:28,080 --> 00:48:32,000
Speaker 1: on public assistance. She is so dependent, Thomas told the Post.

870
00:48:32,239 --> 00:48:34,560
Speaker 1: She gets mad when the mailman is late with her

871
00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:38,319
Speaker 1: welfare check. What's worse, he continued, is that now her

872
00:48:38,400 --> 00:48:41,000
Speaker 1: kids feel entitled to the check too. They have no

873
00:48:41,160 --> 00:48:45,400
Speaker 1: motivation for doing better or getting out of that situation. Now, Miles,

874
00:48:45,560 --> 00:48:47,600
Speaker 1: there's a number of ways this could be fucked up,

875
00:48:47,600 --> 00:48:49,799
Speaker 1: but I want to be perfectly clear here. All of

876
00:48:49,800 --> 00:48:53,480
Speaker 1: that was a vicious and calculated lie. His sister had

877
00:48:53,560 --> 00:48:57,160
Speaker 1: received government assistance at some point. She was not on

878
00:48:57,320 --> 00:49:00,399
Speaker 1: welfare when he made this statement, nor had she been

879
00:49:00,480 --> 00:49:04,000
Speaker 1: for a particularly expended extended period of time. The only

880
00:49:04,040 --> 00:49:06,360
Speaker 1: reason of her period of her life in which she

881
00:49:06,560 --> 00:49:09,920
Speaker 1: was on government assistance was so she had taken up

882
00:49:09,920 --> 00:49:12,560
Speaker 1: working double shifts for minimum ways in a nursing home

883
00:49:12,640 --> 00:49:15,480
Speaker 1: in order to not be on public assistance. Right in

884
00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:17,880
Speaker 1: the period when he makes these claims, the reason that

885
00:49:17,960 --> 00:49:20,000
Speaker 1: she had spent a brief period of time on welfare

886
00:49:20,239 --> 00:49:22,799
Speaker 1: was not that she was dependent. It was because she

887
00:49:22,840 --> 00:49:25,279
Speaker 1: had had to quit her job when their aunt got

888
00:49:25,320 --> 00:49:28,239
Speaker 1: sick and was dying, and she took her aunt in

889
00:49:28,320 --> 00:49:32,720
Speaker 1: and took care of her while Clarence Thomas did nothing. Yes,

890
00:49:33,760 --> 00:49:37,520
Speaker 1: that's why she was briefly on government assists, Like that

891
00:49:37,760 --> 00:49:46,640
Speaker 1: is a fucked up thing to say about goddamn, yeah,

892
00:49:46,920 --> 00:49:50,239
Speaker 1: you need help, you need Yeah, there's nothing wrong with

893
00:49:52,480 --> 00:49:55,400
Speaker 1: you want to then make up a lie to also

894
00:49:55,480 --> 00:49:58,800
Speaker 1: smear the smear your sister and also obscure the fact

895
00:49:58,800 --> 00:50:02,680
Speaker 1: that you're in eight ship nephew too, because what he's

896
00:50:02,680 --> 00:50:04,960
Speaker 1: saying is that, like, well, she's just been ruined by

897
00:50:05,040 --> 00:50:07,600
Speaker 1: welfare and now her kids are being ruined by it.

898
00:50:07,840 --> 00:50:10,879
Speaker 1: She's so dependent and the reality is like she is

899
00:50:11,040 --> 00:50:13,680
Speaker 1: making the health and well being of a loved one

900
00:50:13,760 --> 00:50:17,160
Speaker 1: her responsibility when you wouldn't. And that's why she briefly

901
00:50:17,480 --> 00:50:19,920
Speaker 1: had to go on welfare before taking double shifts for

902
00:50:20,000 --> 00:50:22,480
Speaker 1: minimum wage in order to get off of it. Like wow,

903
00:50:22,680 --> 00:50:26,479
Speaker 1: like Jesus Christ. It's just disgusting too, man, because again,

904
00:50:26,719 --> 00:50:31,200
Speaker 1: with his terminator like precision, he is willing at every

905
00:50:31,280 --> 00:50:36,680
Speaker 1: turn to co modify his blackness like and weaponize it

906
00:50:36,760 --> 00:50:40,560
Speaker 1: in service of further white supremacy. And but then we're

907
00:50:40,600 --> 00:50:43,680
Speaker 1: also hearing his fucked up story, this business person who

908
00:50:43,840 --> 00:50:47,600
Speaker 1: had never felt he belonged anywhere, and it's like he's

909
00:50:47,680 --> 00:50:51,560
Speaker 1: the it's like this like horrible fucking echo of like

910
00:50:51,640 --> 00:50:56,000
Speaker 1: American society that manifested back into the form of this

911
00:50:56,080 --> 00:50:59,160
Speaker 1: person who has been like, yeah, man, I've seen a

912
00:50:59,200 --> 00:51:02,200
Speaker 1: lot of fun because like, you know, fucking America. But

913
00:51:02,360 --> 00:51:07,760
Speaker 1: also now I'm here too, let's keep it going. Yeah,

914
00:51:07,840 --> 00:51:13,000
Speaker 1: it's freaky, man, It's yeah, he's bad. So the fact

915
00:51:13,040 --> 00:51:15,080
Speaker 1: that he was willing to throw his sister under the

916
00:51:15,120 --> 00:51:18,360
Speaker 1: bus in such a gross way for such mild cloud

917
00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:22,080
Speaker 1: was noted at the time by his colleagues is kind

918
00:51:22,080 --> 00:51:24,560
Speaker 1: of sucked up, and he felt defensive enough about it

919
00:51:24,600 --> 00:51:26,880
Speaker 1: that he lied to one of his aids and assured

920
00:51:26,960 --> 00:51:29,279
Speaker 1: him that the comments had been taken out of context,

921
00:51:29,520 --> 00:51:32,880
Speaker 1: and he'd been so upset when that journalist had meanly

922
00:51:32,960 --> 00:51:35,319
Speaker 1: quoted him that he had to drive through the night

923
00:51:35,360 --> 00:51:39,120
Speaker 1: to apologize to his sister. Now, when they heard this claim,

924
00:51:39,239 --> 00:51:42,239
Speaker 1: Jane Mayor and Jill Abramson went to his sister to

925
00:51:42,320 --> 00:51:44,759
Speaker 1: ask if he had driven through the night to apologize.

926
00:51:44,920 --> 00:51:50,200
Speaker 1: No recollection of that apology, not from m m a um.

927
00:51:51,600 --> 00:51:55,360
Speaker 1: So that's cool, um, And obviously this is bad. You

928
00:51:55,400 --> 00:51:58,480
Speaker 1: shouldn't do this as a person, to your sister, to

929
00:51:58,560 --> 00:52:03,120
Speaker 1: anybody really, but goes over great in Ronald Reagan's Republican Party.

930
00:52:03,280 --> 00:52:05,520
Speaker 1: This is a really good way to make your career

931
00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:09,200
Speaker 1: as a Republican. UM. He gets offered two different jobs

932
00:52:09,200 --> 00:52:12,080
Speaker 1: with the administration. Now, one would have been working as

933
00:52:12,120 --> 00:52:14,160
Speaker 1: a low level policy aide, and his work would have

934
00:52:14,160 --> 00:52:16,280
Speaker 1: had nothing to do with race. He would be handling

935
00:52:16,360 --> 00:52:20,480
Speaker 1: environmental and energy issues. But that work was not glamorous

936
00:52:20,520 --> 00:52:23,240
Speaker 1: and it paid for shit. So he turns down the job.

937
00:52:23,920 --> 00:52:27,360
Speaker 1: The next gig they offer him is Assistant Secretary for

938
00:52:27,440 --> 00:52:32,880
Speaker 1: Civil Rights in the Department of Education. So Part three, Miles,

939
00:52:32,960 --> 00:52:35,440
Speaker 1: you and me are going to talk about his entrance

940
00:52:35,719 --> 00:52:40,080
Speaker 1: into a presidentially appointed job in the Reagan administration and

941
00:52:40,239 --> 00:52:43,359
Speaker 1: his road to the Supreme Court. But Miles, when don't

942
00:52:43,360 --> 00:52:46,120
Speaker 1: we talk about your own role road to the Supreme Court? Yeah,

943
00:52:46,239 --> 00:52:49,440
Speaker 1: let's do it. Um. This episode will be played at

944
00:52:49,480 --> 00:52:54,400
Speaker 1: my confirmation hearing more tribunals, so when the full takeover happens,

945
00:52:54,440 --> 00:52:57,319
Speaker 1: I don't know one of them. At Miles of Gray

946
00:52:57,360 --> 00:53:00,520
Speaker 1: on Twitter and Instagram and just podcast Daily That guys,

947
00:53:00,560 --> 00:53:03,080
Speaker 1: if you like news and politics every day for twenty

948
00:53:03,160 --> 00:53:06,200
Speaker 1: day fiance. Have you like weed in reality television? Or

949
00:53:06,520 --> 00:53:09,239
Speaker 1: Miles and Jack got mad boosties? If you like basketball?

950
00:53:09,360 --> 00:53:12,200
Speaker 1: Three places to see me. I do like the idea

951
00:53:12,520 --> 00:53:15,200
Speaker 1: of you standing before the Senate being confirmed as a

952
00:53:15,239 --> 00:53:18,719
Speaker 1: Supreme Court justice, and like Ted Cruz is like, now,

953
00:53:18,920 --> 00:53:22,400
Speaker 1: Mr Gray, is it true that you uh you you

954
00:53:22,400 --> 00:53:26,279
Speaker 1: you've you've ingested an illegal narcotic known as marijuana and

955
00:53:26,280 --> 00:53:28,879
Speaker 1: you just push play on an exerpt of this episode

956
00:53:29,040 --> 00:53:32,200
Speaker 1: where you're saying sun chips by come chips by sun

957
00:53:32,320 --> 00:53:37,799
Speaker 1: chips Yeah, Billy by Billy g Yeah exactly? Is it

958
00:53:37,880 --> 00:53:41,320
Speaker 1: true that you said I am a gross fuck turd

959
00:53:41,920 --> 00:53:44,520
Speaker 1: on an episode of The Daily Ze guist number four

960
00:53:44,560 --> 00:53:47,160
Speaker 1: four three three, Yeah it is. I would have I

961
00:53:47,160 --> 00:53:49,520
Speaker 1: would have been like which time? Yeah, I don't know

962
00:53:49,560 --> 00:53:51,640
Speaker 1: if I said that exactly? May I said? I may

963
00:53:51,640 --> 00:53:54,680
Speaker 1: have said sniffling fucked turd or something like that. I

964
00:53:54,680 --> 00:53:58,200
Speaker 1: don't know, but anyway, any other questions are we be good? Okay? Cool?

965
00:53:58,600 --> 00:54:00,960
Speaker 1: It would be fun to do, And I'm like, now,

966
00:54:01,000 --> 00:54:03,760
Speaker 1: can we get to the gladiator phase of the Supreme

967
00:54:03,800 --> 00:54:06,960
Speaker 1: Court confirmation hearing. I can't wait to fight the other

968
00:54:07,160 --> 00:54:10,560
Speaker 1: fucking nominees. It would be really it would be really

969
00:54:10,560 --> 00:54:13,160
Speaker 1: fun to get confirmed by the Senate because you would

970
00:54:13,200 --> 00:54:16,480
Speaker 1: get to repeatedly say to Ted Cruz, didn't didn't a

971
00:54:16,480 --> 00:54:18,640
Speaker 1: guy like call your wife ugly? And then you had

972
00:54:18,680 --> 00:54:21,520
Speaker 1: to pretend he was awesome for years? How do you

973
00:54:21,560 --> 00:54:24,200
Speaker 1: feel about that? How does your wife feel about that?

974
00:54:25,920 --> 00:54:30,640
Speaker 1: Are still together? Oh my god? Wow, dude, dude, I

975
00:54:30,719 --> 00:54:32,719
Speaker 1: read that thing where like your daughter was like, YO,

976
00:54:32,880 --> 00:54:36,520
Speaker 1: leave him mom. Yeah, that's really fucked up. I commend you,

977
00:54:36,520 --> 00:54:39,120
Speaker 1: bro for not letting that affect you in any way

978
00:54:39,239 --> 00:54:43,600
Speaker 1: visit being totally fine, being so chill with that. Alright, man,

979
00:54:43,680 --> 00:54:51,040
Speaker 1: cancoon on three. So Miles, that's our episode. Thank you everyone.

980
00:54:51,160 --> 00:54:57,440
Speaker 1: Check out Miles Fiance, the Daily Zeitgeist, and that basketball

981
00:54:57,480 --> 00:55:00,360
Speaker 1: podcast with Boosts in the name. I don't know Basketball's langs.

982
00:55:01,239 --> 00:55:03,759
Speaker 1: What does that mean? What does that mean? Man? You

983
00:55:03,760 --> 00:55:07,080
Speaker 1: can jump? You got vertical vertical takeoff ability. You got

984
00:55:07,080 --> 00:55:09,279
Speaker 1: mad boost ees. All right, well, I do have a

985
00:55:09,320 --> 00:55:11,719
Speaker 1: package from UPS, but I haven't picked it up from

986
00:55:12,000 --> 00:55:14,920
Speaker 1: the place yet. Oh my god, that was such a

987
00:55:14,920 --> 00:55:18,640
Speaker 1: boomer joke. Get the funk out you. Sorry, I can't

988
00:55:18,680 --> 00:55:21,279
Speaker 1: hear you, Sophie. My ear horn is in the other room.

989
00:55:22,880 --> 00:55:27,359
Speaker 1: My Eagles vinyl is about to arrive. Let me tell

990
00:55:27,400 --> 00:55:30,960
Speaker 1: you about the Eagles of all the bands. Don Henley,

991
00:55:32,040 --> 00:55:34,560
Speaker 1: that's it. That's the name of a guy from the Eagles.

992
00:55:35,600 --> 00:55:37,920
Speaker 1: No Miles for me. It's Creedence all the way baby.

993
00:55:38,120 --> 00:55:42,120
Speaker 1: Oh my god. But okay, Robert has a book called

994
00:55:42,200 --> 00:55:48,719
Speaker 1: After the Revolution. Can buy it ak bras cools on Media.

995
00:55:48,920 --> 00:55:57,160
Speaker 1: Okay that episodes sucking over that joke. Thank you, Hey everybody.

996
00:55:57,320 --> 00:55:59,719
Speaker 1: Robert Evans here, hosts of Behind the Basstreots in a

997
00:55:59,719 --> 00:56:02,000
Speaker 1: bunch of their podcasts. Here to let you know that

998
00:56:02,080 --> 00:56:05,799
Speaker 1: Cool Zone Media is going on break next week. This

999
00:56:05,880 --> 00:56:09,440
Speaker 1: isn't something we normally do, but as our producer Sophie

1000
00:56:09,520 --> 00:56:11,319
Speaker 1: is currently on the run from the a t F,

1001
00:56:11,760 --> 00:56:14,359
Speaker 1: it was the only option. So next week there will

1002
00:56:14,400 --> 00:56:16,680
Speaker 1: be no new episodes of Behind the Bastards, No new

1003
00:56:16,760 --> 00:56:19,839
Speaker 1: episodes of it could happen here? Uh no new episodes

1004
00:56:20,000 --> 00:56:23,920
Speaker 1: of Nothing. We will be back the next week after

1005
00:56:24,719 --> 00:56:29,520
Speaker 1: the week of the first UM, to continue providing you

1006
00:56:29,719 --> 00:56:33,520
Speaker 1: with far too many podcasts, So just chill out. Next week,

1007
00:56:33,719 --> 00:56:36,280
Speaker 1: that's what we will be doing, chilling out and hiding

1008
00:56:36,280 --> 00:56:39,399
Speaker 1: Sophie from the A t F. Love you all, see

1009
00:56:39,400 --> 00:56:39,759
Speaker 1: you soon.