1
00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,240
Speaker 1: If you have your own story of being in a cult,

2
00:00:02,240 --> 00:00:03,760
Speaker 1: are a high control group.

3
00:00:03,600 --> 00:00:06,440
Speaker 2: Or if you've had experience with manipulation or abuse the

4
00:00:06,480 --> 00:00:07,760
Speaker 2: power that you'd like to share.

5
00:00:07,640 --> 00:00:10,040
Speaker 1: Leave us a message on our hotline number at three

6
00:00:10,039 --> 00:00:12,320
Speaker 1: four seven eight six trust.

7
00:00:12,160 --> 00:00:16,040
Speaker 2: That's three four seven eight six eight seven eight seven eight.

8
00:00:16,200 --> 00:00:18,480
Speaker 1: Or showed us an email at trust Me pod at

9
00:00:18,480 --> 00:00:19,880
Speaker 1: gmail dot com.

10
00:00:20,280 --> 00:00:23,239
Speaker 3: Trust me, Trust for trust Me.

11
00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:26,320
Speaker 1: I'm like a swat person I've never lived to you

12
00:00:27,600 --> 00:00:29,280
Speaker 1: never live if you think.

13
00:00:29,080 --> 00:00:33,199
Speaker 2: That one person has all the answers, don't welcome to

14
00:00:33,200 --> 00:00:36,600
Speaker 2: trust Me the podcast about colts, extreme belief and manipulation

15
00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:39,560
Speaker 2: from two Juice cleansers who've actually experienced it. I'm Lola

16
00:00:39,600 --> 00:00:42,520
Speaker 2: Blanc and I'm Megan Elizabeth. And today our guests are

17
00:00:42,880 --> 00:00:45,720
Speaker 2: journalist and Trust Me alumnus Jennings Brown and a woman

18
00:00:45,800 --> 00:00:48,080
Speaker 2: named Justice, who are here to talk to us about

19
00:00:48,280 --> 00:00:52,000
Speaker 2: new internet cult leader named Leanna Shanty, who uses wellness,

20
00:00:52,040 --> 00:00:56,440
Speaker 2: women's empowerment, bastardized psychology concepts, and the positioning of herself

21
00:00:56,440 --> 00:00:59,360
Speaker 2: as a fighter of abuse to draw women in online.

22
00:00:59,360 --> 00:01:01,840
Speaker 2: They'll walk us through what they've both learned about Leona's

23
00:01:01,840 --> 00:01:05,160
Speaker 2: wild conspiracy theories and grandiose claims about her magical powers,

24
00:01:05,200 --> 00:01:06,920
Speaker 2: and how the group of women in the closed off

25
00:01:06,959 --> 00:01:10,000
Speaker 2: online community she runs developed a pattern of changing their names,

26
00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:12,160
Speaker 2: taking their kids, and leaving the state and accusing their

27
00:01:12,160 --> 00:01:14,120
Speaker 2: family members of abuse without evidence.

28
00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:17,039
Speaker 1: We all discuss how Justices loved One fell down the

29
00:01:17,160 --> 00:01:20,679
Speaker 1: Leana rabbit hole, how the pandemic escalated the level of

30
00:01:20,720 --> 00:01:24,280
Speaker 1: paranoia and isolation, and the danger that the coffee en

31
00:01:24,280 --> 00:01:27,440
Speaker 1: Emma's and lengthy cleanses present to both the mothers and

32
00:01:27,480 --> 00:01:30,039
Speaker 1: their children. Plus a house in Florida where a group

33
00:01:30,080 --> 00:01:32,839
Speaker 1: of them have moved known as Destiny Manner, and where

34
00:01:32,840 --> 00:01:36,720
Speaker 1: things stand in terms of survivors banding together and getting justice.

35
00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:39,119
Speaker 2: It was a mouthful today, but there's so much. I mean,

36
00:01:39,160 --> 00:01:42,000
Speaker 2: there's so much we covered this. This woman is so

37
00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:44,080
Speaker 2: interesting and so messed up.

38
00:01:44,240 --> 00:01:47,000
Speaker 1: The Jennings Daily Beast article is one of the most

39
00:01:47,080 --> 00:01:49,320
Speaker 1: interesting things I've ever read in my entire life.

40
00:01:49,560 --> 00:01:51,680
Speaker 4: Uh, read it, immediately, Read it immediately.

41
00:01:51,760 --> 00:01:54,640
Speaker 2: The link is in the description before we dive in

42
00:01:54,680 --> 00:01:56,960
Speaker 2: with them. Megan, can you tell me your cultiest thing?

43
00:01:57,200 --> 00:01:57,400
Speaker 5: Yeah?

44
00:01:57,440 --> 00:01:58,000
Speaker 4: I sure can.

45
00:01:58,240 --> 00:02:00,600
Speaker 1: So there's a lot going on in the two by twos.

46
00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:03,440
Speaker 1: The religion in which I was raised in a lot

47
00:02:03,480 --> 00:02:07,120
Speaker 1: of sexual abuse coming to light, a lot of people

48
00:02:07,200 --> 00:02:11,040
Speaker 1: in power misusing their power. And there's a rule on

49
00:02:11,120 --> 00:02:14,079
Speaker 1: the West coast of the USA that if you get

50
00:02:14,240 --> 00:02:18,359
Speaker 1: married and divorced, you cannot take part and meeting anymore

51
00:02:18,720 --> 00:02:21,919
Speaker 1: because all we all take part, like there's no preacher

52
00:02:22,160 --> 00:02:24,760
Speaker 1: in the Sunday morning meetings or Wednesday night meetings. We speak,

53
00:02:24,840 --> 00:02:28,200
Speaker 1: but you can't speak anymore if you get divorced and remarried.

54
00:02:28,320 --> 00:02:30,720
Speaker 4: So you just have to be divorced, but you can't

55
00:02:30,840 --> 00:02:33,480
Speaker 4: go or you can't speak, you can't speak. Okay.

56
00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:37,160
Speaker 2: That's similar in Mormonism if you get excommunicated, Okay, wonderful.

57
00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:40,080
Speaker 1: Okay, if you get excommunicated, you can't.

58
00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:41,160
Speaker 4: Go right right, right right.

59
00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:43,880
Speaker 1: But this is so, this is on the West Coast.

60
00:02:44,360 --> 00:02:47,720
Speaker 1: You've gotten divorced, you got remarried, maybe you have four kids.

61
00:02:47,919 --> 00:02:49,760
Speaker 1: They're going to tell you you need to get a

62
00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:52,320
Speaker 1: divorce even though you have four kids with this new

63
00:02:52,360 --> 00:02:55,120
Speaker 1: husband to go to meeting and take part and people

64
00:02:55,160 --> 00:02:55,720
Speaker 1: will do it.

65
00:02:55,960 --> 00:02:58,760
Speaker 2: So you can speak if you're divorced, but just not

66
00:02:58,840 --> 00:02:59,680
Speaker 2: if you're remarried.

67
00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:02,320
Speaker 4: Okay. Very confusing, very strange.

68
00:03:02,480 --> 00:03:05,560
Speaker 1: So basically breaking up family is a very odd thing

69
00:03:05,600 --> 00:03:09,120
Speaker 1: to do. The East Coast has been more chill about it.

70
00:03:09,200 --> 00:03:11,200
Speaker 1: You can get remarried and still take part.

71
00:03:11,800 --> 00:03:15,760
Speaker 2: Sorry, there's so there's an entire like West Coast division

72
00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:17,600
Speaker 2: of the two by two yes, and an East Coast

73
00:03:17,600 --> 00:03:18,240
Speaker 2: division yes.

74
00:03:18,320 --> 00:03:21,760
Speaker 1: So every like groupings of states have a different overseer

75
00:03:21,840 --> 00:03:25,280
Speaker 1: with different rules and different whatever. Okay, and I'm learning

76
00:03:25,360 --> 00:03:27,320
Speaker 1: more about it. But the West Coast and the East

77
00:03:27,360 --> 00:03:32,000
Speaker 1: Coast has always had kind of this like gang really yeah,

78
00:03:32,040 --> 00:03:33,200
Speaker 1: they don't like each other.

79
00:03:33,440 --> 00:03:34,720
Speaker 4: Wow, you know whatever. Okay.

80
00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:38,440
Speaker 1: So as more of this stuff is coming to light

81
00:03:38,520 --> 00:03:43,520
Speaker 1: and spreading and really blowing up, they've decided to make

82
00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:47,640
Speaker 1: the divorce rule also take place on the East Coast.

83
00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:49,920
Speaker 1: This is kind of a rumor as of now, but

84
00:03:50,080 --> 00:03:52,800
Speaker 1: it sounds like one that's real. So why would you

85
00:03:52,880 --> 00:03:56,080
Speaker 1: double down on a rule that will probably make more

86
00:03:56,120 --> 00:03:57,080
Speaker 1: people leave?

87
00:03:57,760 --> 00:03:59,320
Speaker 4: Yeah, and I'm wondering.

88
00:03:59,400 --> 00:04:02,240
Speaker 1: Somebody posts in the two x two x group, which

89
00:04:02,320 --> 00:04:04,320
Speaker 1: if you're a next two by two please join us

90
00:04:04,320 --> 00:04:08,680
Speaker 1: on Facebook. They said, I recently read that those letters

91
00:04:08,720 --> 00:04:10,800
Speaker 1: that you get, those chain letters that are like, come,

92
00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:15,560
Speaker 1: I just got a million dollars in bars of gold.

93
00:04:15,720 --> 00:04:19,279
Speaker 1: I live in Africa and I'm a prince, Come like

94
00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:23,440
Speaker 1: join me on this whatever. So I read an article

95
00:04:23,480 --> 00:04:28,080
Speaker 1: somebody linked to about how they often purposefully misspell things

96
00:04:28,279 --> 00:04:32,000
Speaker 1: and those emails so that the people who respond are

97
00:04:32,120 --> 00:04:37,159
Speaker 1: already not the most discerning, right, are already primed interest

98
00:04:37,240 --> 00:04:41,839
Speaker 1: to be maybe a little bit more open mind, shall say,

99
00:04:42,200 --> 00:04:45,520
Speaker 1: to go deeper. So I'm thinking, are they just trying

100
00:04:45,600 --> 00:04:48,719
Speaker 1: to get everybody on the fence to say, fuck the shit,

101
00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:53,000
Speaker 1: I'm out while keeping the very devote people in?

102
00:04:53,400 --> 00:04:54,040
Speaker 4: Is the answer?

103
00:04:54,160 --> 00:04:57,400
Speaker 1: Like we want a smaller group of very devout people

104
00:04:57,960 --> 00:05:01,000
Speaker 1: instead of a slightly bigger group of people on the fence.

105
00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:02,120
Speaker 4: Wow, that is.

106
00:05:02,279 --> 00:05:07,240
Speaker 2: Super such an interesting concept in general that like you

107
00:05:07,279 --> 00:05:09,799
Speaker 2: want to make it, you want to filter out anyone

108
00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:13,800
Speaker 2: who's not the absolute most devoted and like or you know,

109
00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:18,039
Speaker 2: susceptible or whatever. Yeah, that's really interesting. I mean I

110
00:05:18,080 --> 00:05:21,919
Speaker 2: would be very curious to hear, like if anything comes

111
00:05:21,920 --> 00:05:25,000
Speaker 2: out about how that decision was made or if that's

112
00:05:25,080 --> 00:05:27,799
Speaker 2: like just like a couple of people's areas or something.

113
00:05:28,080 --> 00:05:31,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, lots to be explored, lots to come to fruition,

114
00:05:31,480 --> 00:05:33,560
Speaker 1: and maybe in a month that'll come out like no,

115
00:05:33,680 --> 00:05:35,680
Speaker 1: we're not doing that on the East coast because there's

116
00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:38,240
Speaker 1: a big pushback and my whole theory will be blown apart.

117
00:05:38,320 --> 00:05:43,640
Speaker 1: But the interesting thing about the misspellings and emails.

118
00:05:43,440 --> 00:05:44,520
Speaker 4: Really stuck out to me.

119
00:05:44,760 --> 00:05:47,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's I mean, I feel like maybe I heard

120
00:05:47,440 --> 00:05:49,159
Speaker 2: that before, but I completely did not have that in

121
00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:49,800
Speaker 2: my brain anymore.

122
00:05:49,839 --> 00:05:53,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, same, fascinating, Thank you. What about you? What's your

123
00:05:54,000 --> 00:05:54,680
Speaker 4: cultiest thing?

124
00:05:55,320 --> 00:06:01,200
Speaker 2: My cultiest thing is that I was away hearing back

125
00:06:01,240 --> 00:06:04,440
Speaker 2: about a film that I made, a short film, and

126
00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:07,520
Speaker 2: it had been taking I mean, I can't make any

127
00:06:07,520 --> 00:06:09,560
Speaker 2: announcements yet or anything, but whatever, I've been waiting for

128
00:06:09,640 --> 00:06:11,760
Speaker 2: news about it, and it had been taking longer than

129
00:06:11,800 --> 00:06:13,600
Speaker 2: I expected, and so I.

130
00:06:13,560 --> 00:06:14,960
Speaker 4: Was starting to feel really hopeless.

131
00:06:15,320 --> 00:06:18,200
Speaker 2: And I noticed something this week because I finally heard

132
00:06:18,240 --> 00:06:22,560
Speaker 2: the news and it's good news and I'm happy, but congratulations,

133
00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:25,600
Speaker 2: thank you, well whatever, I'm being very vague, but like

134
00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:30,680
Speaker 2: good news that I'm happy. Prior to this week where

135
00:06:30,720 --> 00:06:34,040
Speaker 2: that change happened, I'm like looking back on how I've

136
00:06:34,080 --> 00:06:36,080
Speaker 2: been feeling the past couple of months, and I'm like,

137
00:06:36,279 --> 00:06:40,480
Speaker 2: my obsessions were suddenly worse. I was buying all these

138
00:06:40,480 --> 00:06:42,919
Speaker 2: books on meaning because I was like, I feel like

139
00:06:42,960 --> 00:06:45,479
Speaker 2: I have no purpose. What is the meaning of this life.

140
00:06:45,520 --> 00:06:47,120
Speaker 2: I need to find some way to construct some meaning

141
00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:50,520
Speaker 2: for myself. I don't know what my identity is right now, Like,

142
00:06:50,640 --> 00:06:53,440
Speaker 2: am I really a filmmaker? Does anyone take me seriously?

143
00:06:53,839 --> 00:06:55,760
Speaker 2: You know, all of this stuff. And then the second

144
00:06:55,839 --> 00:06:58,000
Speaker 2: I get this news, I'm like, huh, I know how

145
00:06:58,000 --> 00:07:00,360
Speaker 2: the summer's going, and I know who I am I am,

146
00:07:00,440 --> 00:07:00,840
Speaker 2: and I.

147
00:07:00,760 --> 00:07:04,240
Speaker 1: Know suddenly OCD goes from it to like a four

148
00:07:04,480 --> 00:07:05,240
Speaker 1: yes yes.

149
00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:08,760
Speaker 2: And it's so it's just interesting to observe in myself

150
00:07:08,839 --> 00:07:12,360
Speaker 2: because I'm like, literally, nothing was wrong, nothing was wrong.

151
00:07:12,520 --> 00:07:15,560
Speaker 2: The only thing that was wrong was that I personally

152
00:07:15,920 --> 00:07:20,280
Speaker 2: was not feeling like strong in my identity or like

153
00:07:20,640 --> 00:07:22,080
Speaker 2: not knowing what my purpose was.

154
00:07:22,240 --> 00:07:25,560
Speaker 4: No certainty, yeah yet well it's always about certainty.

155
00:07:25,680 --> 00:07:29,920
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, no certainty, but also just like questioning

156
00:07:29,960 --> 00:07:33,280
Speaker 2: like my place in life. And it's so stupid hearing

157
00:07:33,280 --> 00:07:34,840
Speaker 2: myself say that, because I'm like, this is such a

158
00:07:34,840 --> 00:07:38,760
Speaker 2: fucking bullshit thing everyone experiences once I talk about it

159
00:07:38,800 --> 00:07:41,320
Speaker 2: for real, like it's so normal, it's literally so normal.

160
00:07:41,520 --> 00:07:43,760
Speaker 2: But it's also like I haven't made a feature yet

161
00:07:43,800 --> 00:07:44,400
Speaker 2: and whatever.

162
00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:47,640
Speaker 1: No, I mean, it's really interesting to notice though, when

163
00:07:47,640 --> 00:07:51,960
Speaker 1: you're not getting the feedback that your ego quote unquote

164
00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:57,160
Speaker 1: needs that our obsessions are like mental quote unquote disorders

165
00:07:57,400 --> 00:07:58,840
Speaker 1: will pick up the slack and.

166
00:07:58,760 --> 00:08:01,920
Speaker 4: Be like, I know how to I know how to help. Yeah.

167
00:08:02,000 --> 00:08:04,320
Speaker 2: Well, it's like there's this gap in my brain of like,

168
00:08:04,480 --> 00:08:06,000
Speaker 2: I don't know what's going on with this part of

169
00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:07,880
Speaker 2: my life that's the most important thing to me. So

170
00:08:07,920 --> 00:08:11,120
Speaker 2: it's like I'm gonna fill it up with questioning everything

171
00:08:11,200 --> 00:08:14,920
Speaker 2: and like obsessing about shit and and it just you know,

172
00:08:15,320 --> 00:08:17,880
Speaker 2: I was like, should I join like a secular church,

173
00:08:18,080 --> 00:08:20,480
Speaker 2: like and I think those things are great, but like,

174
00:08:20,520 --> 00:08:23,240
Speaker 2: it's so interesting noticing that that was happening during that

175
00:08:23,360 --> 00:08:26,360
Speaker 2: period where I was experiencing a lot of uncertainty about

176
00:08:26,360 --> 00:08:28,760
Speaker 2: my place in my art and in the world.

177
00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:29,360
Speaker 4: You know what.

178
00:08:29,400 --> 00:08:31,800
Speaker 1: Happens when I'm in that spot is I get like

179
00:08:31,920 --> 00:08:34,600
Speaker 1: super obsessive about getting in shape.

180
00:08:34,760 --> 00:08:35,040
Speaker 4: Really.

181
00:08:35,559 --> 00:08:38,079
Speaker 2: Yeah, so that's I mean that makes sense with your

182
00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:39,040
Speaker 2: eating disorder history.

183
00:08:40,480 --> 00:08:40,800
Speaker 4: Yeah.

184
00:08:40,840 --> 00:08:43,800
Speaker 2: For me, it's like suddenly I'm obsessing more when I

185
00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:46,000
Speaker 2: haven't been for a year, right, And.

186
00:08:46,000 --> 00:08:48,160
Speaker 1: I mean we all remember I got ninety seven steps

187
00:08:48,200 --> 00:08:50,520
Speaker 1: that we talked about in one episode, which is the

188
00:08:50,600 --> 00:08:52,560
Speaker 1: most emails I've ever gotten from people.

189
00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:55,679
Speaker 4: It's so interesting. Yeah, I guess it was resonating and

190
00:08:55,679 --> 00:08:57,920
Speaker 4: people beat up breast. No, people were like, you have

191
00:08:58,000 --> 00:08:58,880
Speaker 4: to take more steps?

192
00:08:59,040 --> 00:09:05,079
Speaker 2: Oh I thought it was like I'm sad too, I.

193
00:09:05,040 --> 00:09:10,160
Speaker 4: Don't know before more like get off your ass. No no, no, yeah,

194
00:09:10,400 --> 00:09:11,600
Speaker 4: that's hilarious. It was not good.

195
00:09:11,960 --> 00:09:15,120
Speaker 2: Yeah anyway, Yeah, it was like I literally have bought

196
00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:17,400
Speaker 2: three books about meaning in one week. You know what

197
00:09:17,440 --> 00:09:20,480
Speaker 2: I'm talking about. Like, I'm like, what is the purpose

198
00:09:20,520 --> 00:09:22,040
Speaker 2: of my life? And I'm like, oh, now I have

199
00:09:22,120 --> 00:09:23,240
Speaker 2: some purpose? Everything's good?

200
00:09:23,240 --> 00:09:23,560
Speaker 3: What was?

201
00:09:23,840 --> 00:09:25,440
Speaker 4: Why was I even freaking out right?

202
00:09:26,400 --> 00:09:29,040
Speaker 2: Would have been great for a cult to jump in

203
00:09:29,040 --> 00:09:33,120
Speaker 2: at that moment. Y'all really messed up by not jumping

204
00:09:33,160 --> 00:09:34,200
Speaker 2: on that opportunity.

205
00:09:34,280 --> 00:09:37,400
Speaker 1: Yep, we learned today that's called the cognitive open.

206
00:09:37,800 --> 00:09:43,280
Speaker 4: But we'll talk about that next weeek. Shall we talked

207
00:09:43,280 --> 00:09:51,600
Speaker 4: to Jennings and Justice Let's speak. Trust Me is brought

208
00:09:51,640 --> 00:09:54,440
Speaker 4: to you by Progressive Insurance. Most of you listening right

209
00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:56,120
Speaker 4: now are probably multitasking.

210
00:09:56,240 --> 00:09:56,440
Speaker 1: Yep.

211
00:09:56,480 --> 00:09:58,640
Speaker 2: While you're listening to us talk, you're probably also driving

212
00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:01,200
Speaker 2: and cleaning, exercising, or maybe even grocery shopping.

213
00:10:01,240 --> 00:10:03,640
Speaker 1: But if you're not in some kind of moving vehicle.

214
00:10:03,800 --> 00:10:06,079
Speaker 1: There's something else you can be doing right now, getting

215
00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:08,120
Speaker 1: an auto quote from Progressive Insurance.

216
00:10:08,320 --> 00:10:10,480
Speaker 2: It's easy and you could save money by doing it

217
00:10:10,679 --> 00:10:11,640
Speaker 2: right from your phone.

218
00:10:11,720 --> 00:10:15,200
Speaker 1: Drivers who save by switching to Progressive save nearly seven

219
00:10:15,400 --> 00:10:19,000
Speaker 1: hundred dollars on average, and auto customers qualify for an

220
00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:21,760
Speaker 1: average of seven discounts.

221
00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:24,520
Speaker 2: Discounts for having multiple vehicles on your policy, being a homeowner,

222
00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:25,479
Speaker 2: and more.

223
00:10:25,360 --> 00:10:28,320
Speaker 1: So, just like your favorite podcast, Progressive will be with

224
00:10:28,440 --> 00:10:31,320
Speaker 1: you twenty four to seven, three hundred and sixty five

225
00:10:31,400 --> 00:10:33,440
Speaker 1: days a year, so you're protected no matter what.

226
00:10:33,440 --> 00:10:36,520
Speaker 2: Multitask Right now, quote your car insurance at Progressive dot

227
00:10:36,520 --> 00:10:38,520
Speaker 2: com to join the over twenty nine million.

228
00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:39,600
Speaker 4: Drivers who trust Progressive.

229
00:10:39,640 --> 00:10:43,280
Speaker 2: Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates national average twelve month

230
00:10:43,320 --> 00:10:45,760
Speaker 2: savings of six hundred ninety eight dollars by New customer

231
00:10:45,840 --> 00:10:48,240
Speaker 2: survey who saved with Progressive between June twenty twenty one

232
00:10:48,280 --> 00:10:51,120
Speaker 2: and May twenty twenty two. Potential savings will vary. Discounts

233
00:10:51,160 --> 00:10:58,880
Speaker 2: not available in all states and situations.

234
00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:04,080
Speaker 4: Welcome Jennings, Brown and Justice to trust me.

235
00:11:04,240 --> 00:11:05,040
Speaker 3: Thanks for having us.

236
00:11:05,080 --> 00:11:06,440
Speaker 4: Thank you so much, Jennings.

237
00:11:06,440 --> 00:11:10,160
Speaker 2: Can you just give us a general outline of Leanna Shanti.

238
00:11:10,520 --> 00:11:16,120
Speaker 3: Yes, Leana Shanty. Yeah, Leana Shanty is a online spiritual guru.

239
00:11:16,320 --> 00:11:18,440
Speaker 3: There's a lot of mythology to it. You know, she's

240
00:11:18,480 --> 00:11:21,760
Speaker 3: the channel of Jesus. Some people, I think, believe she

241
00:11:21,760 --> 00:11:25,600
Speaker 3: actually is Jesus. She is a descendant from Lamaria, you know,

242
00:11:25,640 --> 00:11:29,079
Speaker 3: the ancient civilization, much like Atlantis. She can access the

243
00:11:29,120 --> 00:11:32,920
Speaker 3: Acocic records, which are stored in Wales, I think swimming

244
00:11:32,920 --> 00:11:35,640
Speaker 3: around Lamara. That's how she knows everything that's ever happened

245
00:11:35,679 --> 00:11:38,800
Speaker 3: and will happen, and can like psychically read things about

246
00:11:38,800 --> 00:11:41,480
Speaker 3: her followers that they themselves don't know, or their children.

247
00:11:41,600 --> 00:11:44,520
Speaker 3: But she operates entirely online and to my knowledge, none

248
00:11:44,520 --> 00:11:47,120
Speaker 3: of her followers have ever seen her. There are pictures,

249
00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:48,679
Speaker 3: a lot of pictures of on her line. She has

250
00:11:48,720 --> 00:11:52,120
Speaker 3: this large social media presence, but all these photos are

251
00:11:52,559 --> 00:11:56,160
Speaker 3: a very different version of It's sort of a fabrication

252
00:11:56,240 --> 00:11:58,040
Speaker 3: and there's a lot of Yeah, we can go deeper

253
00:11:58,040 --> 00:12:00,520
Speaker 3: into that. But because of all this, there's there's this

254
00:12:00,600 --> 00:12:03,240
Speaker 3: huge mystery about who is the person behind Leana that

255
00:12:03,520 --> 00:12:06,240
Speaker 3: is drawn in all of these followers from all over

256
00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:08,319
Speaker 3: the world and has gotten some of the followers to

257
00:12:08,360 --> 00:12:12,360
Speaker 3: do some pretty radical things like basically take their children

258
00:12:12,920 --> 00:12:15,880
Speaker 3: and flee in the middle of the night, last minute

259
00:12:15,880 --> 00:12:19,800
Speaker 3: notice to you know, crossing borders, crossing state lines. Many

260
00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:23,640
Speaker 3: of them are trying to get to Florida because Leanna

261
00:12:23,720 --> 00:12:26,080
Speaker 3: kind of instills this big fear that there is this

262
00:12:26,520 --> 00:12:30,160
Speaker 3: sort of these evil reptilian overlords that are going to

263
00:12:30,600 --> 00:12:33,120
Speaker 3: uh force you all into concentration camps and force you

264
00:12:33,160 --> 00:12:36,400
Speaker 3: to get the vaccine which will kill your soul. And

265
00:12:36,480 --> 00:12:39,760
Speaker 3: you know, even going near anybody can that's been vaccinated,

266
00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:41,920
Speaker 3: it can shed on you and hurt you. So there's

267
00:12:41,920 --> 00:12:43,760
Speaker 3: a lot of fear there. And you know, she said

268
00:12:43,760 --> 00:12:46,079
Speaker 3: the only place, one of the safest places, is Florida.

269
00:12:46,120 --> 00:12:48,600
Speaker 3: So there's a lot of followers that have fled to

270
00:12:48,640 --> 00:12:52,880
Speaker 3: Florida and some are living together. But yeah, it's it's there.

271
00:12:52,880 --> 00:12:55,679
Speaker 3: There's it's hard to really condense it. It's this this

272
00:12:55,800 --> 00:12:59,680
Speaker 3: sort of it's it's an entirely different kind of online

273
00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:04,240
Speaker 3: group spiritual community that I'd ever seen before. But I, yeah,

274
00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:07,400
Speaker 3: I only really found out about it because about a

275
00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:11,880
Speaker 3: year ago Justice here deemed me and suggested I look

276
00:13:11,960 --> 00:13:15,400
Speaker 3: into this weird thing going on, and.

277
00:13:15,480 --> 00:13:17,320
Speaker 4: Justice, why did you ask him to look into it.

278
00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:21,760
Speaker 5: So before sort of like getting involved through my own

279
00:13:21,840 --> 00:13:25,680
Speaker 5: family member, I had been already kind of fascinated with

280
00:13:25,840 --> 00:13:30,040
Speaker 5: cults in general and like the whole cult universe idea,

281
00:13:30,160 --> 00:13:32,760
Speaker 5: and I had already I had known about Jennings for

282
00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:35,120
Speaker 5: quite a while, Like I watched The Gateway and I

283
00:13:35,160 --> 00:13:38,280
Speaker 5: listened to all of his podcasts and revelations and all

284
00:13:38,320 --> 00:13:41,000
Speaker 5: of the work that he's done, and just was thoroughly

285
00:13:41,040 --> 00:13:44,640
Speaker 5: impressed by what he does and how he like integrates

286
00:13:44,720 --> 00:13:49,240
Speaker 5: himself into these groups to fully understand what's going on

287
00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:50,760
Speaker 5: and why they do what they do and all of

288
00:13:50,800 --> 00:13:53,960
Speaker 5: that stuff. So he kind of felt like with the

289
00:13:53,960 --> 00:13:56,640
Speaker 5: people that I was talking to, there wasn't enough attention

290
00:13:56,840 --> 00:14:00,199
Speaker 5: being brought to Leanna Shanty and what she was doing

291
00:14:00,200 --> 00:14:02,440
Speaker 5: and the damage she was causing all these families. So

292
00:14:02,480 --> 00:14:04,480
Speaker 5: it felt like it needed to be elevated to that

293
00:14:04,520 --> 00:14:08,640
Speaker 5: next level. Yeah, and thankfully when I reached out to Jennings,

294
00:14:08,679 --> 00:14:10,400
Speaker 5: I was like, there's no way on earth he's ever

295
00:14:10,440 --> 00:14:12,400
Speaker 5: going to respond to me. He's he probably gets a

296
00:14:12,440 --> 00:14:14,640
Speaker 5: million dms about like look at this person and look

297
00:14:14,640 --> 00:14:18,040
Speaker 5: into this person. And to my surprise, and I had

298
00:14:18,040 --> 00:14:20,080
Speaker 5: a bit of a freak out was like he responded

299
00:14:20,080 --> 00:14:22,760
Speaker 5: to me right away and said, gay, I'm listening because

300
00:14:22,800 --> 00:14:24,560
Speaker 5: you're not the only person that's reached out to me

301
00:14:24,600 --> 00:14:25,240
Speaker 5: about this woman.

302
00:14:25,600 --> 00:14:27,240
Speaker 3: First off, you're you're inflating me too much.

303
00:14:27,280 --> 00:14:29,240
Speaker 5: But no, no, no, no, not.

304
00:14:29,240 --> 00:14:32,720
Speaker 3: Enough, not enough, But yeah, I do. I get my

305
00:14:32,840 --> 00:14:36,560
Speaker 3: dms are just a garbage fire of weird spiritual trauma,

306
00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:39,280
Speaker 3: and I welcome. He's a blessing of curse. And I

307
00:14:39,800 --> 00:14:42,040
Speaker 3: highly recommend anybody who you know there's something you want

308
00:14:42,040 --> 00:14:44,160
Speaker 3: me to look into, feel free to DM me or

309
00:14:44,200 --> 00:14:46,760
Speaker 3: email me a tip. But yeah, I got flooded with

310
00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:49,360
Speaker 3: this is right after like the Deep Deep End came

311
00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:52,880
Speaker 3: out about Teal, which was inspired by The Gateway and

312
00:14:52,880 --> 00:14:55,880
Speaker 3: and my reporting in there, and I just got tons

313
00:14:55,920 --> 00:15:00,120
Speaker 3: of stuff, And this one seemed especially insidious and really

314
00:15:00,480 --> 00:15:03,360
Speaker 3: kind of indicative of all the things that have been

315
00:15:03,360 --> 00:15:06,240
Speaker 3: happening over the last three years, just with like the

316
00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:09,800
Speaker 3: COVID lockdowns and sort of mass fear and paranoia and

317
00:15:09,840 --> 00:15:14,360
Speaker 3: confusion and everybody becoming more tribal and more online and

318
00:15:14,600 --> 00:15:18,800
Speaker 3: distrust in mainstream institutions. So people finding you know, faith

319
00:15:18,840 --> 00:15:23,000
Speaker 3: and comfort in these sort of online gurus be it,

320
00:15:23,560 --> 00:15:27,480
Speaker 3: you know, Joe Rogan or Leona Shanty, you know, and

321
00:15:28,080 --> 00:15:30,800
Speaker 3: it just and and it's it's also just very cuan on.

322
00:15:31,040 --> 00:15:33,200
Speaker 3: I mean, you know, it's sort of been compared to like,

323
00:15:33,400 --> 00:15:35,240
Speaker 3: you know, wuing on or cue a mom, because it's

324
00:15:35,240 --> 00:15:37,760
Speaker 3: a lot of moms right that, you know, are just

325
00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:42,200
Speaker 3: blindly following this completely mysterious person that's largely a fabrication.

326
00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:46,160
Speaker 2: Let's actually start with your story, Justice, rewind a little

327
00:15:46,160 --> 00:15:47,960
Speaker 2: and tell us a little bit about how you found

328
00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:51,120
Speaker 2: out that your loved one had become interested in Leana Shanty.

329
00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:55,320
Speaker 5: Sure, so my connections started about five years ago, and

330
00:15:55,400 --> 00:15:57,960
Speaker 5: my loved one was sort of on a path in

331
00:15:58,040 --> 00:16:00,600
Speaker 5: life where like didn't quite know what they wanted to

332
00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:03,920
Speaker 5: do with their career, which there's no judgment, that's completely normal.

333
00:16:04,480 --> 00:16:08,840
Speaker 5: And she had mentioned in passing that she had found online.

334
00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:11,600
Speaker 5: She said, this woman was a lawyer, and she was

335
00:16:11,920 --> 00:16:15,440
Speaker 5: a millionaire lawyer in New York and now she's moved

336
00:16:15,440 --> 00:16:19,440
Speaker 5: to Hawaii and she's sort of teaching women about empowerment.

337
00:16:19,680 --> 00:16:22,680
Speaker 5: And she said, because at the time she was sort

338
00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:27,160
Speaker 5: of coaching women in self confidence, she felt like this woman,

339
00:16:27,480 --> 00:16:30,240
Speaker 5: whatever it was that she was preaching, was really speaking

340
00:16:30,240 --> 00:16:32,640
Speaker 5: to her. She said it was important to some of

341
00:16:32,640 --> 00:16:34,640
Speaker 5: her clients that she was working with that she had

342
00:16:34,680 --> 00:16:37,080
Speaker 5: some sort of certification to be doing what she was

343
00:16:37,120 --> 00:16:39,400
Speaker 5: doing and doing this coaching. So that's kind of how

344
00:16:39,400 --> 00:16:41,160
Speaker 5: she prefaced it to me, was that she was going

345
00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:45,160
Speaker 5: to do this certification because her clients were asking for it.

346
00:16:45,240 --> 00:16:48,800
Speaker 5: And when I asked what the certification was, she sent

347
00:16:48,880 --> 00:16:51,800
Speaker 5: me a link to it and it was called The

348
00:16:51,840 --> 00:16:55,280
Speaker 5: Making of a Medicine Woman and it was on Leannashanty

349
00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:58,680
Speaker 5: dot com. And the cost for this program, which was

350
00:16:58,720 --> 00:17:02,480
Speaker 5: all about learning like holist medicine and things like that,

351
00:17:02,640 --> 00:17:05,000
Speaker 5: the cost of it at the time was thirty nine

352
00:17:05,080 --> 00:17:09,240
Speaker 5: hundred dollars US. Yeah, to be and I know, coach

353
00:17:10,160 --> 00:17:13,600
Speaker 5: for other Yeah, okay, to coach other women in like

354
00:17:13,720 --> 00:17:16,720
Speaker 5: empowerment and self love. And that was sort of how

355
00:17:16,760 --> 00:17:19,800
Speaker 5: she prefaced it to me. But the actual title of

356
00:17:19,840 --> 00:17:22,000
Speaker 5: it was, yeah, the Making of a Medicine Woman.

357
00:17:22,359 --> 00:17:23,960
Speaker 3: And that's how you my understanding is that's how you

358
00:17:23,960 --> 00:17:26,919
Speaker 3: get into the Lamarian Mystery School buy in, and then

359
00:17:26,920 --> 00:17:31,720
Speaker 3: you have access to the Facebook group where uh, that's

360
00:17:31,720 --> 00:17:34,560
Speaker 3: that's like the main hub of her teachings and everybody's

361
00:17:34,560 --> 00:17:37,400
Speaker 3: posting on there. But they have to get approved, their

362
00:17:37,400 --> 00:17:41,160
Speaker 3: messages have to get approved in order to so anyway there, yeah,

363
00:17:41,200 --> 00:17:42,920
Speaker 3: it's but but yeah, so that's kind of the way

364
00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:46,040
Speaker 3: into the Lomarian Mystery School, which is the main hub

365
00:17:46,040 --> 00:17:46,800
Speaker 3: of her teachings.

366
00:17:46,920 --> 00:17:49,440
Speaker 2: When you go to or at least at the time,

367
00:17:49,480 --> 00:17:51,879
Speaker 2: when you were to go to Leana Shanti's like social

368
00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:54,400
Speaker 2: media or her website, what was it advertising?

369
00:17:54,400 --> 00:17:55,760
Speaker 4: What would you see? What kind of stuff was she

370
00:17:55,840 --> 00:17:56,919
Speaker 4: talking about it?

371
00:17:57,119 --> 00:18:00,199
Speaker 5: Right right off the bat for me and I I

372
00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:02,639
Speaker 5: just remember looking at it and it didn't make a

373
00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:05,560
Speaker 5: lot of sense to me. It was, you know, a

374
00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:09,119
Speaker 5: lot of I help you figure out what your path is,

375
00:18:10,320 --> 00:18:14,480
Speaker 5: your true calling on this earth so that you can

376
00:18:14,520 --> 00:18:19,560
Speaker 5: ascend to an outer worldly dimension. So right off the bat,

377
00:18:19,760 --> 00:18:23,960
Speaker 5: the vibes were very sketchy, Like I didn't I didn't

378
00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:26,159
Speaker 5: look at it and think, okay, this is legitimate, this

379
00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:29,399
Speaker 5: makes sense. I'm glad she's doing this. Immediately I was like,

380
00:18:29,640 --> 00:18:32,160
Speaker 5: how do you go to this website and read this

381
00:18:32,240 --> 00:18:34,679
Speaker 5: sort of like blurb about who this person is and

382
00:18:34,760 --> 00:18:36,800
Speaker 5: think this is this is right, this is great, this

383
00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:39,640
Speaker 5: is exactly what I need. And I remember my family

384
00:18:39,640 --> 00:18:42,359
Speaker 5: members saying to me when she's like When I first

385
00:18:42,400 --> 00:18:46,840
Speaker 5: read it, my initial feeling was I cried and felt like,

386
00:18:46,880 --> 00:18:49,040
Speaker 5: this is this is what I had been looking for

387
00:18:49,119 --> 00:18:51,920
Speaker 5: my entire life. So I immediately, for me, there was

388
00:18:51,960 --> 00:18:55,000
Speaker 5: a disconnect there because I just I didn't understand how

389
00:18:55,359 --> 00:18:57,760
Speaker 5: reading that what she said, which was like, you know,

390
00:18:57,920 --> 00:19:02,480
Speaker 5: ascension and light working and all of that stuff, how

391
00:19:02,520 --> 00:19:05,680
Speaker 5: you could connect that to Yeah, it just didn't make sense.

392
00:19:05,920 --> 00:19:06,840
Speaker 5: I didn't understand it.

393
00:19:06,880 --> 00:19:08,800
Speaker 4: Can I ask just the general age range of your

394
00:19:08,800 --> 00:19:09,480
Speaker 4: loved one.

395
00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:11,080
Speaker 5: Yeap mid thirties at the time.

396
00:19:11,200 --> 00:19:14,400
Speaker 1: Okay, it seems like the information is both very vague

397
00:19:14,440 --> 00:19:17,679
Speaker 1: and at the same time a just I don't know,

398
00:19:17,800 --> 00:19:22,360
Speaker 1: casse role of every religion and spiritual belief and concy

399
00:19:22,359 --> 00:19:24,280
Speaker 1: and conspiracy baked into one.

400
00:19:24,920 --> 00:19:27,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, we've got all the q Andon, greatest hits from QAnon,

401
00:19:27,880 --> 00:19:31,040
Speaker 2: great greatest hits from Christianity, maybe greatest hits from like

402
00:19:31,119 --> 00:19:32,400
Speaker 2: bastardized psychology.

403
00:19:32,480 --> 00:19:33,640
Speaker 4: It's kind of just and.

404
00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:36,679
Speaker 1: The spiritual stuff, you know, I like the records and

405
00:19:36,800 --> 00:19:39,120
Speaker 1: all that stuff. I didn't know it was kept in Wales,

406
00:19:39,240 --> 00:19:43,680
Speaker 1: But I can't believe you didn't know that. I think

407
00:19:43,680 --> 00:19:45,800
Speaker 1: that might be a twist she's come up with. But yeah,

408
00:19:45,840 --> 00:19:48,520
Speaker 1: that's it has a little bit of something for everyone.

409
00:19:48,680 --> 00:19:52,480
Speaker 1: So if you're called to any part of her teachings,

410
00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:56,520
Speaker 1: it makes sense because she has all of it in there.

411
00:19:56,680 --> 00:19:58,919
Speaker 3: I think it's important to know, Like, as you know,

412
00:19:59,000 --> 00:20:00,639
Speaker 3: it just kind of depends on where you are in

413
00:20:00,680 --> 00:20:03,159
Speaker 3: life when you find this and how it resonates with you.

414
00:20:03,440 --> 00:20:04,960
Speaker 3: I think if you're going into a blind trying to

415
00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:08,480
Speaker 3: figure out what why my my loved one joined this,

416
00:20:08,640 --> 00:20:10,960
Speaker 3: it can be a little jarring. But a lot of

417
00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:13,479
Speaker 3: women joined when they were, you know, dealing with cancer,

418
00:20:13,560 --> 00:20:16,600
Speaker 3: their dog just died, or like one person I interviewed

419
00:20:17,280 --> 00:20:21,399
Speaker 3: was having postpartum depression and series like health issues from that,

420
00:20:21,440 --> 00:20:25,240
Speaker 3: and doctors weren't taking her her seriously and she felt

421
00:20:25,320 --> 00:20:27,719
Speaker 3: kind of gas lit. So she started looking online and

422
00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:30,560
Speaker 3: found one of the entry points to Leona Shanti is

423
00:20:30,600 --> 00:20:33,560
Speaker 3: the Health Mastery Institute, which you know, it's just kind

424
00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:37,040
Speaker 3: of generic vegan teachings and the cleanses and and also

425
00:20:37,080 --> 00:20:39,680
Speaker 3: you join this Facebook community the Health master Institute, where

426
00:20:39,800 --> 00:20:41,879
Speaker 3: she was just she had the validation of all these

427
00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:44,320
Speaker 3: supportive women who were like, you know, just cut out

428
00:20:44,320 --> 00:20:48,040
Speaker 3: processed foods, you know, that will help your hormonal balance,

429
00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:50,240
Speaker 3: and it helped and it worked, and then they were like, Okay,

430
00:20:50,280 --> 00:20:53,199
Speaker 3: you know you've you've healed your your body, and now

431
00:20:53,240 --> 00:20:55,199
Speaker 3: it's time to focus on your mind and spirit. So

432
00:20:55,240 --> 00:20:56,760
Speaker 3: you need to kind of join go deeper into the

433
00:20:56,800 --> 00:21:00,359
Speaker 3: Lameria mystery school. And that's when you know, it's like

434
00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:03,080
Speaker 3: Leona started doing the psychic readings about you know, and

435
00:21:03,160 --> 00:21:06,280
Speaker 3: she'll say things like, well, if your kid is wetting

436
00:21:06,280 --> 00:21:08,160
Speaker 3: the bed, then that's a sign that they've been abused,

437
00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:10,679
Speaker 3: and so she asked them. They'll ask like, who's abusing

438
00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:13,159
Speaker 3: my kid? And you know, she'll read the acostic records

439
00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:14,879
Speaker 3: and so it's a slippery slope. And then you know,

440
00:21:14,920 --> 00:21:17,120
Speaker 3: you have the social validation of all these supportive women

441
00:21:17,240 --> 00:21:19,880
Speaker 3: who are also trying these getting into the more woo

442
00:21:19,880 --> 00:21:22,320
Speaker 3: woo stuff. So you try that on for size. So

443
00:21:23,240 --> 00:21:25,400
Speaker 3: you know, it's the it's the slow entry point.

444
00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:25,840
Speaker 4: Yeah.

445
00:21:25,880 --> 00:21:28,320
Speaker 2: I know so many women who struggle with health issues

446
00:21:28,400 --> 00:21:30,800
Speaker 2: that they don't have answers for from their doctors. They've

447
00:21:30,800 --> 00:21:33,080
Speaker 2: seen multiple doctors. They're trying to get help. They can't

448
00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:35,920
Speaker 2: get help, and so they go to Reddit or they

449
00:21:35,960 --> 00:21:38,280
Speaker 2: go online and like ask other women who are experiencing

450
00:21:38,320 --> 00:21:38,840
Speaker 2: the same thing.

451
00:21:39,119 --> 00:21:41,720
Speaker 4: It seems like very easy.

452
00:21:41,560 --> 00:21:45,080
Speaker 1: For that to a hydrate and a healthy vegan lifestyle

453
00:21:45,160 --> 00:21:49,080
Speaker 1: does work. It's like the purification protocol and scientology. It's

454
00:21:49,119 --> 00:21:52,720
Speaker 1: giving you something important that works and.

455
00:21:52,640 --> 00:21:55,960
Speaker 4: Then saying and also my other stuff, yeah work well.

456
00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:58,160
Speaker 2: And just having community and having people who are taking

457
00:21:58,200 --> 00:21:59,880
Speaker 2: you seriously and telling you you matter.

458
00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:11,880
Speaker 1: I was kind of talking about this with Justice before

459
00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:15,000
Speaker 1: you jumped on Jennings, but at the pandemic probably gave

460
00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:18,000
Speaker 1: a lot of people reason to need this community and

461
00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:21,439
Speaker 1: health and all of that. How did the group grow

462
00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:22,879
Speaker 1: a lot from the pandemic.

463
00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:26,359
Speaker 3: Absolutely, it was about I think like forty hardcore members.

464
00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:29,760
Speaker 3: So she has now like twenty three thousand Instagram followers.

465
00:22:29,920 --> 00:22:31,080
Speaker 3: I don't know how many of those are real. I

466
00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:33,199
Speaker 3: don't know how many of those people are like deeply in.

467
00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:36,280
Speaker 3: But the core, like Lomerian group at its peak, was

468
00:22:36,280 --> 00:22:38,520
Speaker 3: at one point eighty beginning of COVID at started, it

469
00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:41,880
Speaker 3: was like or I think around forty and yeah, that's

470
00:22:41,880 --> 00:22:44,600
Speaker 3: when at first it was very comforting. She was like, look,

471
00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:49,280
Speaker 3: don't buy into the panic, you know, just take vitamin C, like,

472
00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:51,800
Speaker 3: just take care of yourself. We'll get through this. And

473
00:22:51,840 --> 00:22:53,320
Speaker 3: there was some truth to that. There was a lot

474
00:22:53,320 --> 00:22:55,399
Speaker 3: of mania, you know, around COVID and the lockdowns and

475
00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:57,280
Speaker 3: things which happening so fast, and it was kind of

476
00:22:57,280 --> 00:23:00,199
Speaker 3: comforting to have this sort of motherly voice telling you

477
00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:03,440
Speaker 3: what to do and who to trust. But then it

478
00:23:04,000 --> 00:23:06,760
Speaker 3: really ramped up, and she really started to grow into

479
00:23:06,760 --> 00:23:09,440
Speaker 3: like one hundred and forty they core, hardcore followers who

480
00:23:09,520 --> 00:23:11,960
Speaker 3: would basically do anything, it seemed like, and that's when

481
00:23:12,000 --> 00:23:14,359
Speaker 3: she started saying, you know, like don't do zoom calls

482
00:23:14,440 --> 00:23:17,040
Speaker 3: because that's how they capture your soul, which cut off

483
00:23:17,119 --> 00:23:21,160
Speaker 3: kind of like a main way of getting community and support.

484
00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:24,200
Speaker 3: And then she said, don't have conversations outside this Facebook

485
00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:28,240
Speaker 3: group because I can't monitor the energy. And that's even

486
00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:31,000
Speaker 3: even amongst members. So they're only talking in this group

487
00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:34,480
Speaker 3: in a form where she has to approve every message yea.

488
00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:37,720
Speaker 3: And then it was like, don't go to national parks

489
00:23:37,800 --> 00:23:40,399
Speaker 3: or certain places because you might get abducted there and

490
00:23:40,440 --> 00:23:43,359
Speaker 3: I can't help you there. So we did, you know,

491
00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:45,600
Speaker 3: become very all of us kind of became more in

492
00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:48,920
Speaker 3: touch with like certain online communities and groups and text

493
00:23:48,920 --> 00:23:51,680
Speaker 3: threads during COVID, but she really seems to have weaponized

494
00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:54,560
Speaker 3: that where it was like slowly and it's like all

495
00:23:54,600 --> 00:23:56,480
Speaker 3: the things that are baked into a really good cult

496
00:23:56,560 --> 00:23:58,760
Speaker 3: that you like, you know that they have to build

497
00:23:58,800 --> 00:24:01,520
Speaker 3: over time, Like because of the nature of the Internet

498
00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:03,520
Speaker 3: and these online communities, you can do it really fast,

499
00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:08,360
Speaker 3: like information control us versus Then the tribalism her being

500
00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:11,680
Speaker 3: able to people are making taking making all these confessions

501
00:24:11,720 --> 00:24:14,520
Speaker 3: about their past things and trying to kind of like

502
00:24:15,040 --> 00:24:17,880
Speaker 3: win over support in the group. And then as soon

503
00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:19,919
Speaker 3: as Leona turns on them, she has all of these

504
00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:22,239
Speaker 3: things that these confessions that she can screenshot and then

505
00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:25,520
Speaker 3: post on Instagram and then tag their employers, which is

506
00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:27,280
Speaker 3: you know, a tactic that you know, a lot of

507
00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:30,000
Speaker 3: groups have to you know, have like fake therapists or whatever,

508
00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:33,159
Speaker 3: you know, to like get this sort of collateral and

509
00:24:33,240 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 3: intel on people. But she just gets it all, you.

510
00:24:35,560 --> 00:24:37,439
Speaker 1: Know, through the secrets you tell her are going to

511
00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:40,520
Speaker 1: be posted to her Instagram with your loved ones and

512
00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:42,360
Speaker 1: employees employers tagged.

513
00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:46,920
Speaker 2: If you leave her, Yeah, classic classic cult move. Make

514
00:24:46,960 --> 00:24:49,480
Speaker 2: everyone confess the things that they don't want anyone to

515
00:24:49,560 --> 00:24:52,000
Speaker 2: know to you, and then use it against them if

516
00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:55,160
Speaker 2: they ever threaten to leave in anywheverifying.

517
00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:58,160
Speaker 5: And it's not only when just if they threatened to leave.

518
00:24:58,200 --> 00:25:01,080
Speaker 5: It's also if they question her or they challenge what

519
00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:04,280
Speaker 5: it is that she's teaching and saying, it's the same result.

520
00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:06,720
Speaker 5: So if you don't just like follow along and do

521
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:10,399
Speaker 5: what she says and and you know, follow like a sheep,

522
00:25:10,560 --> 00:25:12,880
Speaker 5: then you're in trouble and she'll come after you.

523
00:25:12,960 --> 00:25:16,399
Speaker 2: So she's presenting herself as having special knowledge to this

524
00:25:16,520 --> 00:25:18,320
Speaker 2: sort of like mystical power.

525
00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:21,760
Speaker 4: She has psychic ability. She's Jesus, She's the main line

526
00:25:22,160 --> 00:25:22,560
Speaker 4: to God.

527
00:25:22,720 --> 00:25:23,120
Speaker 5: Yeah.

528
00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:25,800
Speaker 2: So can you talk about how within the group people

529
00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:30,399
Speaker 2: would start to ask her whether they were abused or

530
00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:32,160
Speaker 2: whether their children are being abused.

531
00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:34,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, that was the more that was the scarier thing.

532
00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:37,760
Speaker 3: I mean, it's something I've seen with Teal Teal Swan

533
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:40,280
Speaker 3: and like that's that was kind of people were kind

534
00:25:40,280 --> 00:25:41,480
Speaker 3: of calling her like Teal two point.

535
00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:41,639
Speaker 5: Oh.

536
00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:43,520
Speaker 3: It seems like she took a lot of similar playbooks

537
00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:47,280
Speaker 3: but really amplified some of the more insidious aspects.

538
00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:50,119
Speaker 1: It's really funny that that she hates till Swan just

539
00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:50,520
Speaker 1: a side.

540
00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:53,840
Speaker 3: Now, she does she does exactly, she does, she does.

541
00:25:54,400 --> 00:25:56,359
Speaker 4: Her rivalries are my face Yeah yeah, yeah.

542
00:25:56,400 --> 00:25:58,400
Speaker 3: So you listen to her recordings because it's all it's

543
00:25:58,400 --> 00:26:00,600
Speaker 3: all audio based. There's these classes that you pay like

544
00:26:00,720 --> 00:26:06,040
Speaker 3: thousands of dollars for mother wound, father wound, Narcisist like

545
00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:10,480
Speaker 3: a yeah, which is kind of about like your it's

546
00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:13,399
Speaker 3: more about your your spouse. But you listen to these

547
00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:15,399
Speaker 3: and you know, she says, listen to them over and

548
00:26:15,440 --> 00:26:19,880
Speaker 3: over multiple times a day, and they're very hypnotic and

549
00:26:19,880 --> 00:26:22,639
Speaker 3: and it just starts to kind of cast a shadow

550
00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:26,240
Speaker 3: over your family memories. You know, like it. I mean

551
00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:28,160
Speaker 3: I've listened to it. I'm like I get it. And

552
00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:30,320
Speaker 3: you know, there's uh in the in the article, we

553
00:26:30,400 --> 00:26:33,760
Speaker 3: talked about one one man who uh he you know,

554
00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:35,440
Speaker 3: he was trying to get just to understand what wife

555
00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:37,359
Speaker 3: was getting into and started listening to these and then

556
00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:39,760
Speaker 3: made him hate his mom and his dad. And then

557
00:26:40,119 --> 00:26:42,800
Speaker 3: his sister started listening to it to understand what's going on,

558
00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:44,679
Speaker 3: and then she got pulled into that and started and

559
00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:46,640
Speaker 3: tried to started trying to plot to take her kids

560
00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:50,760
Speaker 3: to Florida. So they're very convincing. And so that's my

561
00:26:50,840 --> 00:26:52,879
Speaker 3: warning before you like go in and dabble trying to

562
00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:55,800
Speaker 3: figure this out, right, But it's like, you know, it's

563
00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:57,960
Speaker 3: like it makes you think, like, well, you focus on

564
00:26:58,000 --> 00:26:59,399
Speaker 3: the memories of like the time that they left you

565
00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:01,119
Speaker 3: in the car and was too hot, and you know

566
00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:03,480
Speaker 3: how that was abusive and maybe like and he says

567
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:07,080
Speaker 3: like things like you know, kissing your forehead is like grooming,

568
00:27:07,320 --> 00:27:09,720
Speaker 3: and you know, like and then you focus those memories

569
00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:11,560
Speaker 3: and they become very real and I and I that

570
00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:13,159
Speaker 3: kind of happened to me when I was when I

571
00:27:13,240 --> 00:27:16,639
Speaker 3: tried teels completion process. But this happens, you know, just

572
00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:18,960
Speaker 3: when you're listening and you're like alone with your you know,

573
00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:20,520
Speaker 3: you're maybe you're a home in your family and you're

574
00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:22,600
Speaker 3: listening to these classes and they start to shape the

575
00:27:22,600 --> 00:27:25,159
Speaker 3: way you view your your your husband and your kids.

576
00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:28,080
Speaker 3: And so these things are coming up and so then

577
00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:30,880
Speaker 3: she has these private I think it was a start

578
00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:33,280
Speaker 3: at Facebook announce on signal, these private signal groups where

579
00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:36,679
Speaker 3: people ask questions about when they're trying to find more

580
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:39,119
Speaker 3: clarity and they're like, Leanna, like, I'm starting to come

581
00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:41,719
Speaker 3: into a memory of somebody in my church doing this

582
00:27:41,760 --> 00:27:44,200
Speaker 3: to me and who was it? And she always almost

583
00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:46,080
Speaker 3: this As far as I've seen, I mean, I've like

584
00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:48,199
Speaker 3: hundreds of these have been leaked to me. And she

585
00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:50,639
Speaker 3: always says with confidence, like it was your pastor it

586
00:27:50,760 --> 00:27:54,159
Speaker 3: was your uncle, like it was that your brother who

587
00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:57,320
Speaker 3: who abused your son, like it's always with And then

588
00:27:57,359 --> 00:27:59,320
Speaker 3: it's like, well, who the hell would say that was

589
00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:03,159
Speaker 3: such certainty unless they actually knew. And then you have

590
00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:04,840
Speaker 3: so many people in the group that are like, oh

591
00:28:04,840 --> 00:28:06,439
Speaker 3: my god, that makes so much sense, Thank you, Leana.

592
00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:08,760
Speaker 3: So then you know, if you don't buy into it initially,

593
00:28:08,800 --> 00:28:11,480
Speaker 3: like in time, you do, right, and then you maybe

594
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:13,280
Speaker 3: go to your spouse and you're like, hey, I think, like,

595
00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:16,640
Speaker 3: you know, somebody in our family is like abusing our son.

596
00:28:16,720 --> 00:28:19,120
Speaker 3: And then the spouse is like, why are you believing

597
00:28:19,160 --> 00:28:21,320
Speaker 3: this online person you've ever met? And then you know,

598
00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:23,440
Speaker 3: she'll go to and this is all sort of hypothetical,

599
00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:25,080
Speaker 3: but a case that I saw the situation I saw

600
00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:26,200
Speaker 3: and over and over and then but then they'll go

601
00:28:26,240 --> 00:28:28,919
Speaker 3: to Leanna and say like, my husband's doubting and it's like, well,

602
00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:32,000
Speaker 3: that's because your husband is abusing your kid too or something.

603
00:28:32,040 --> 00:28:33,359
Speaker 3: I mean, this is again, it's all hypthetical, but this

604
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:35,800
Speaker 3: is the sort of way it happens. And then these

605
00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:38,200
Speaker 3: things starts spiraling. And I interviewed one woman who said

606
00:28:38,280 --> 00:28:41,360
Speaker 3: she when Leanna revealed to her that that their son

607
00:28:41,480 --> 00:28:43,880
Speaker 3: was being abused, she sort of she said, I coached

608
00:28:44,120 --> 00:28:47,040
Speaker 3: my son to say that my dad, my then husband,

609
00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:51,320
Speaker 3: was abusing him and reported in child Protective Services. And

610
00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:53,239
Speaker 3: now that she's on the other end, she ended up

611
00:28:53,240 --> 00:28:56,440
Speaker 3: going to patient's psychiatric care and that sort of helped

612
00:28:56,440 --> 00:28:58,880
Speaker 3: the program. And she says, I could not have asked

613
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:01,440
Speaker 3: for a better huh father to my kids. But she's

614
00:29:01,520 --> 00:29:03,120
Speaker 3: in her words, I was like so brainwashed by the

615
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:06,760
Speaker 3: Leana teachings. I was convinced that he was abusive. I

616
00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:08,040
Speaker 3: do know. I mean, I've talked to a lot of

617
00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:11,040
Speaker 3: these dads who I mean, it's just like it's such

618
00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:13,680
Speaker 3: a Kafka esque nightmare kind of waking up after like

619
00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:16,520
Speaker 3: twenty years of marriage and all of a sudden, your

620
00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:19,920
Speaker 3: wife is, you know, doing these Candida cleanses and coffee

621
00:29:19,960 --> 00:29:23,080
Speaker 3: and Emma's and sometimes like they're doing them to the kids,

622
00:29:23,600 --> 00:29:25,760
Speaker 3: and you know, all these like wild conspiracy theories out

623
00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:28,200
Speaker 3: of nowhere, and then they just like up and leave.

624
00:29:28,600 --> 00:29:30,440
Speaker 3: And these dads, you know, and then they're in these

625
00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:34,720
Speaker 3: messy custody cases where they're being accused of abusing their kids.

626
00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:38,000
Speaker 3: And I'm certainly not here to like exonerate every dad

627
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:40,560
Speaker 3: that's been involved. I mean, I take false allegations. I'm

628
00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:44,680
Speaker 3: a certified sex and domestic abuse counselor, Like I don't

629
00:29:44,720 --> 00:29:49,400
Speaker 3: take that stuff lightly. But there is a pattern here

630
00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:54,160
Speaker 3: of like most women who join like leaving their husbands

631
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:58,920
Speaker 3: in these these new memories of abuse coming out, and

632
00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:01,320
Speaker 3: it's yeah, so it's just kind of it seems like

633
00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:03,400
Speaker 3: this this horrifying experience. Oh So I was saying, some

634
00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:05,040
Speaker 3: of these dads I talk to, I mean, they're in

635
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:08,120
Speaker 3: this nightmare situations and nobody really trusts them in the

636
00:30:08,120 --> 00:30:11,200
Speaker 3: court system. It's like you're telling me your wife joined

637
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:13,600
Speaker 3: this like online group, and you know, you see the

638
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:16,120
Speaker 3: pictures of that she posts online and it looks like

639
00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:18,719
Speaker 3: kind of absurd and almost cartoonish, and it's just like,

640
00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:21,120
Speaker 3: I think that's part of how it all works. But

641
00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:23,360
Speaker 3: so there are some dads that I think are very

642
00:30:23,440 --> 00:30:26,360
Speaker 3: depressed in a dark position. I really worry about them.

643
00:30:26,480 --> 00:30:30,160
Speaker 2: I mean, it's very satanic panic. We're talking about recovered memories,

644
00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:33,120
Speaker 2: and I say that in quotation marks recovered memories. There's

645
00:30:33,160 --> 00:30:36,800
Speaker 2: not good evidence for recovering memories that you just had

646
00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:41,160
Speaker 2: no idea existed. Memory is actually very very malleable and shapeable,

647
00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:43,120
Speaker 2: and that's one of the things that she's playing on here,

648
00:30:43,120 --> 00:30:46,000
Speaker 2: which is very very scary because as a follower, how

649
00:30:46,040 --> 00:30:47,959
Speaker 2: do you trust your own mind if you're like, well,

650
00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:50,600
Speaker 2: I don't think that happened, but she's saying it happens,

651
00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:53,000
Speaker 2: So now I'm going to find a way to discover

652
00:30:53,160 --> 00:30:54,560
Speaker 2: memories of that happening.

653
00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:57,160
Speaker 5: And the other part of that, too, is sorry to

654
00:30:57,240 --> 00:31:01,280
Speaker 5: jump in, is that she also lean says that all

655
00:31:01,320 --> 00:31:05,480
Speaker 5: of these memories, these suppressed memories, and the abuse that's

656
00:31:05,520 --> 00:31:09,480
Speaker 5: that's claimed happens at ages that you're not going to remember.

657
00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:12,680
Speaker 5: So we're talking like twelve months to let's say two

658
00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:15,360
Speaker 5: or three years. That's sort of the window the time

659
00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:18,960
Speaker 5: frame that all of this abuse took place. So therefore

660
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:20,720
Speaker 5: it's like, well, these memories are just coming up for

661
00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:23,600
Speaker 5: you now because you don't remember it happening. It's like

662
00:31:24,120 --> 00:31:26,840
Speaker 5: it's convenient that she's picking a time frame in most

663
00:31:26,880 --> 00:31:29,600
Speaker 5: people's lives that they're not going to recall that, you

664
00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:31,840
Speaker 5: know what I mean, Like, even if it did happen,

665
00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 5: I don't know. It's just very it's very sketchy but.

666
00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:38,040
Speaker 2: Then even for the some of the children, you know,

667
00:31:38,280 --> 00:31:40,760
Speaker 2: you were saying one of the women, her children weren't

668
00:31:40,760 --> 00:31:43,400
Speaker 2: giving her the correct answer, so she started coaching them

669
00:31:43,880 --> 00:31:46,200
Speaker 2: about what to say. And I can imagine, you know,

670
00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:49,560
Speaker 2: if you then grow up following lean Ashanti, that's going

671
00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:52,320
Speaker 2: to alter your memory of what your childhood was.

672
00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:55,080
Speaker 3: And they're now there are now children like because Leona

673
00:31:55,120 --> 00:31:56,280
Speaker 3: has been kind of I mean, she'd been doing this

674
00:31:56,280 --> 00:31:59,360
Speaker 3: since twenty twelve, but really intensely over the pandemic. So

675
00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:01,160
Speaker 3: there I think some parents that had kids, you know,

676
00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:03,480
Speaker 3: they were maybe in their early teens that are now

677
00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:05,800
Speaker 3: you know, getting like seventeen eighteen, that are like the

678
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:08,000
Speaker 3: true Leanna followers yep.

679
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:11,120
Speaker 5: So scary because they've grown up that way that they

680
00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:13,640
Speaker 5: don't know any different because their their mothers from the

681
00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:18,200
Speaker 5: very beginning were implementing all of her teachings onto them,

682
00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:19,320
Speaker 5: so they don't know any different.

683
00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:21,560
Speaker 3: I know, Justice talked a lot of a lot a

684
00:32:21,560 --> 00:32:24,760
Speaker 3: lot of family members and it's like some of these

685
00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:27,120
Speaker 3: dads have just totally lost their kids because the kids

686
00:32:27,160 --> 00:32:28,720
Speaker 3: now think they're demonic.

687
00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:33,840
Speaker 5: So grandparents like the amount of people, it's heartbreaking when

688
00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:36,440
Speaker 5: you listen to these people's stories where it's just one day,

689
00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:40,600
Speaker 5: out of the blue, they're being told, we don't want

690
00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:45,280
Speaker 5: any contact with you anymore. You're evil, you're you know,

691
00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:48,040
Speaker 5: you're an abuser, you're all of these things. You didn't

692
00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:51,320
Speaker 5: love me unconditionally. So out of the blue, they're just

693
00:32:51,600 --> 00:32:54,360
Speaker 5: told their child or their grandchild wants nothing to do

694
00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:54,840
Speaker 5: with them.

695
00:32:54,920 --> 00:32:55,800
Speaker 4: And they're taken away.

696
00:32:55,840 --> 00:32:57,600
Speaker 1: A lot of the times, like what are the states

697
00:32:57,600 --> 00:33:00,760
Speaker 1: that Leanna Schante says are okay for people to live in?

698
00:33:01,200 --> 00:33:05,200
Speaker 5: So it's Texas, Montana, and Florida.

699
00:33:05,800 --> 00:33:08,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, when you go to Leona Chante's website, the first

700
00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:10,680
Speaker 2: thing it says on the front page and very big letters,

701
00:33:10,720 --> 00:33:13,840
Speaker 2: is please click here to see my advocacy page exposing

702
00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:19,440
Speaker 2: family abuse. Oh that's nice, right, that's a leading the witness.

703
00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:23,440
Speaker 2: She's presenting herself as fighting abuse. Of course, you know,

704
00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:25,520
Speaker 2: this is very common. We see this with QAnon. Most

705
00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:27,840
Speaker 2: of these groups. They think that they're on the side

706
00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:30,600
Speaker 2: of justice. I guess, yes, but of course that is

707
00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:31,440
Speaker 2: it is actually.

708
00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:42,640
Speaker 4: Quite the opposite that's happening. So justice.

709
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:45,160
Speaker 2: Back to the story of your loved one, how quickly

710
00:33:45,400 --> 00:33:48,880
Speaker 2: did it kind of escalate into being you know, a

711
00:33:48,880 --> 00:33:50,560
Speaker 2: full blown indoctrination.

712
00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:54,600
Speaker 5: I would say, like the overall sort of shift took

713
00:33:54,600 --> 00:33:57,640
Speaker 5: a couple of years, but the last sort of like

714
00:33:57,800 --> 00:34:01,680
Speaker 5: year and a half was quite fast. So there was

715
00:34:01,680 --> 00:34:05,800
Speaker 5: a very obvious change in social media presence. So like

716
00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:10,399
Speaker 5: what they were talking about online was very different. There

717
00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:14,400
Speaker 5: was a big focus on Jesus, which you know was

718
00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:17,360
Speaker 5: not a thing before that, so that was also a

719
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:20,600
Speaker 5: bit of a red flag. And then the biggest thing

720
00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:25,399
Speaker 5: was the So there they always had like quite a

721
00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:29,520
Speaker 5: decent amount of followers, like they followed friend groups, Like

722
00:34:29,560 --> 00:34:32,640
Speaker 5: their friend group was quite large, and then I started

723
00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:34,840
Speaker 5: to pay attention and notice that that friend group started

724
00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:38,760
Speaker 5: dwindling quite quickly, and it seemed like it was confined

725
00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:42,239
Speaker 5: to like a small group of people that were all involved,

726
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:44,799
Speaker 5: like we're all followers of Leanna Shanty, all had the

727
00:34:44,800 --> 00:34:49,840
Speaker 5: same sort of interests newfound interests for for some of

728
00:34:49,880 --> 00:34:54,920
Speaker 5: them and then for me. So my family member actually

729
00:34:54,920 --> 00:34:58,800
Speaker 5: did flee and go to one of the safe safe states.

730
00:34:59,840 --> 00:35:02,319
Speaker 5: So so there I started to see there was like

731
00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:05,480
Speaker 5: selling off of all of their things, and so that

732
00:35:05,640 --> 00:35:09,080
Speaker 5: was a shift, a real Yeah, that was a real

733
00:35:09,080 --> 00:35:13,240
Speaker 5: eye opener for me. That was obvious, Like they're going somewhere,

734
00:35:13,360 --> 00:35:16,360
Speaker 5: I don't know where. And then fast forward through talking

735
00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:18,960
Speaker 5: to other family members, I found out that they did

736
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:21,560
Speaker 5: flee from Canada to the US.

737
00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:25,840
Speaker 2: And did you try to did you have conversations with

738
00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:28,160
Speaker 2: them about Leanna and how'd those go?

739
00:35:29,000 --> 00:35:32,160
Speaker 5: I did have a couple. They were fairly like close

740
00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:35,560
Speaker 5: lipped when it came to talking about her. I did

741
00:35:35,719 --> 00:35:39,719
Speaker 5: ask specifically about the coffee anemas because I just that

742
00:35:39,880 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 5: part to me. So, I don't know if you've probably

743
00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:45,399
Speaker 5: read about it, but like one of the you start

744
00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:49,040
Speaker 5: with the HMI, which is the sixty six day cleanse,

745
00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:51,960
Speaker 5: and you do the Candida cleanses and all these juice cleanses,

746
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:53,880
Speaker 5: and then a big part of that is coffee animas,

747
00:35:53,880 --> 00:35:58,279
Speaker 5: and the animas the focus is that they remove parasites

748
00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:02,320
Speaker 5: and any dark energy. So my loved one started posting

749
00:36:02,440 --> 00:36:06,640
Speaker 5: regularly that they were doing daily, multiple daily coffee anemas,

750
00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:09,480
Speaker 5: which I was just like, I don't understand, Like that

751
00:36:09,520 --> 00:36:12,160
Speaker 5: can't be good for your system. I don't understand. And

752
00:36:12,200 --> 00:36:15,680
Speaker 5: so I did actually just just ask about it. I said, like,

753
00:36:15,719 --> 00:36:18,719
Speaker 5: can you explain this to me? I don't get it.

754
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:21,880
Speaker 5: And so they told me the process and how it works,

755
00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:26,960
Speaker 5: which was it just floored me. So that was another

756
00:36:27,160 --> 00:36:30,200
Speaker 5: like big big red flag for me. It's like that's

757
00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:32,000
Speaker 5: that can't be good for you. But it was also

758
00:36:32,080 --> 00:36:35,480
Speaker 5: consistent with the patterns with the other family members that

759
00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:38,399
Speaker 5: I had talked to, like their family members that were

760
00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:40,800
Speaker 5: also involved. It was the same thing. It was the cleanses,

761
00:36:40,840 --> 00:36:43,960
Speaker 5: the enemas. That was a that was a regular occurrence.

762
00:36:44,440 --> 00:36:46,640
Speaker 3: And so if you're not getting you know, proper calories

763
00:36:46,800 --> 00:36:50,319
Speaker 3: and you're getting a hell of a caffeine rush like

764
00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:51,440
Speaker 3: twice a yeah, from.

765
00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:53,839
Speaker 5: You know, sometimes more than twice a day, but it's

766
00:36:53,840 --> 00:36:54,160
Speaker 5: a lot.

767
00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:57,600
Speaker 3: Yeah. I mean that obviously has kind of a you know,

768
00:36:57,920 --> 00:37:01,560
Speaker 3: a physiological effect that can make it harder to you know, uh,

769
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:05,520
Speaker 3: to keep up. You know, you're to be skeptical. I mean,

770
00:37:05,560 --> 00:37:08,000
Speaker 3: you know it just it And also just by controlling

771
00:37:08,000 --> 00:37:09,359
Speaker 3: I mean, you know, this is classic with a lot

772
00:37:09,360 --> 00:37:11,560
Speaker 3: of cult like groups. Is just controlling what you put

773
00:37:11,560 --> 00:37:13,880
Speaker 3: in your body is a way of taking away people's agencies.

774
00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:16,719
Speaker 3: And then it also is just affecting your ability to

775
00:37:17,239 --> 00:37:21,000
Speaker 3: function and think critically, you know, pretty faster.

776
00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:23,720
Speaker 1: And that's such a physical change that people can comment

777
00:37:23,760 --> 00:37:27,240
Speaker 1: on you look quote unquote great because they like stuff

778
00:37:27,280 --> 00:37:28,960
Speaker 1: like that, and then you're like, wow, I must be

779
00:37:29,400 --> 00:37:30,200
Speaker 1: really killing it.

780
00:37:30,280 --> 00:37:31,719
Speaker 4: This must be good for me.

781
00:37:32,680 --> 00:37:36,080
Speaker 5: And anyone thinks that when you start like losing weight

782
00:37:36,239 --> 00:37:38,640
Speaker 5: and you start to feel more energized because you're doing

783
00:37:38,719 --> 00:37:41,319
Speaker 5: juice cleanses every day, you're gonna feel great. And that's

784
00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:43,160
Speaker 5: like you said, people will feed off that and be

785
00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:46,120
Speaker 5: like you look great, I feel great. It must be working, right.

786
00:37:46,160 --> 00:37:48,080
Speaker 3: But yeah, some of the some of the photo you know,

787
00:37:48,080 --> 00:37:49,719
Speaker 3: I've seen some kind of before and after and they

788
00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:53,719
Speaker 3: are pretty jarring. Yeah, you know, because losing that much

789
00:37:53,760 --> 00:37:58,200
Speaker 3: weight that quickly is not can be unhealthy, and so

790
00:37:58,239 --> 00:38:02,719
Speaker 3: some of them look really you know gone. Then yeah, and.

791
00:38:03,040 --> 00:38:06,320
Speaker 2: A coffee how much do we know how much stronger

792
00:38:06,360 --> 00:38:08,440
Speaker 2: that is than drinking a cup of coffee, because that's

793
00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:09,600
Speaker 2: going to be absorbed, like.

794
00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:12,439
Speaker 3: Yeah, real fast. Talking to people who've left and who've

795
00:38:12,480 --> 00:38:15,200
Speaker 3: done it, yeah, they say it's a huge caffeine high

796
00:38:15,320 --> 00:38:18,560
Speaker 3: and then just clears you out, which can be kind

797
00:38:18,600 --> 00:38:23,040
Speaker 3: of a euphoric feeling of just a really good you know, Yeah, yeah,

798
00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:25,560
Speaker 3: I think it is. It is you guys are.

799
00:38:25,400 --> 00:38:28,479
Speaker 1: Talking me into it.

800
00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:31,160
Speaker 3: You know. Look, it's why some people do drugs up there,

801
00:38:31,440 --> 00:38:33,600
Speaker 3: but because it's like a quicker high, you know, quicker

802
00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:34,240
Speaker 3: and bigger.

803
00:38:34,480 --> 00:38:37,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, I remember stories about Steve NICKX and cocaine. Yeah,

804
00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:40,560
Speaker 2: I just can imagine that, Like it would be like

805
00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:43,719
Speaker 2: getting high if you're hungry and you're on that much

806
00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:47,440
Speaker 2: caffeine that quickly, that frequently, like like you're saying, Jenning's

807
00:38:47,440 --> 00:38:49,319
Speaker 2: like your critical thinking is just going to be turned off.

808
00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:52,439
Speaker 3: But the freaky thing is that, like I heard one

809
00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:56,879
Speaker 3: instance of a kid was a Follower's child had gone

810
00:38:56,880 --> 00:38:59,000
Speaker 3: to the grandparents who'd been vaccinated, and so when the

811
00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:02,239
Speaker 3: kid got back to Follower's house, she made the kid

812
00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:04,080
Speaker 3: do a coffee in a mo to like cleanse the

813
00:39:04,160 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 3: sort of vaccine out of them. And apparently this was

814
00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:10,040
Speaker 3: done like against the kids will. So I mean, it

815
00:39:10,080 --> 00:39:13,719
Speaker 3: is is I think even when reporting this, I had

816
00:39:13,760 --> 00:39:17,040
Speaker 3: to sort of compartmentalize the fact that there are I mean,

817
00:39:17,080 --> 00:39:19,960
Speaker 3: for every parent, there's one or multiple children that are

818
00:39:19,960 --> 00:39:23,120
Speaker 3: getting caught up in this and also being sort of

819
00:39:23,160 --> 00:39:26,880
Speaker 3: victimized by by these teachings. And that's I mean, that's

820
00:39:26,880 --> 00:39:29,239
Speaker 3: where it gets really dark and why I think, you know,

821
00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:31,719
Speaker 3: we need this story out and more exposure on this

822
00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:33,360
Speaker 3: is you know, as soon as possible.

823
00:39:33,400 --> 00:39:34,400
Speaker 5: Well, it's devastating.

824
00:39:34,480 --> 00:39:37,880
Speaker 1: TikTokers are just going to start, and anyone on Instagram

825
00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:40,200
Speaker 1: is going to start, you know, their own clothes. I

826
00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:43,040
Speaker 1: think we're looking at it like a new generation of stuff.

827
00:39:43,120 --> 00:39:45,479
Speaker 1: I think one of the big things that I learned

828
00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:48,400
Speaker 1: about from reading the Reddit threads is that you mentioned

829
00:39:48,400 --> 00:39:51,480
Speaker 1: it briefly, but the shedding from people with the vaccine,

830
00:39:51,560 --> 00:39:53,880
Speaker 1: that seems to be one of the huge ways she

831
00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:56,760
Speaker 1: separated people from their families and friends.

832
00:39:56,800 --> 00:39:58,759
Speaker 4: Can you say a little bit more about that.

833
00:39:58,920 --> 00:40:02,319
Speaker 3: Yeah, that it's you know, talking to ex members, they say,

834
00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:04,040
Speaker 3: you know, I just they got to a point where

835
00:40:04,040 --> 00:40:05,719
Speaker 3: they didn't want to there's such a fear of leaving

836
00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:08,080
Speaker 3: their house because you don't know who's been vaccinated, and so,

837
00:40:08,360 --> 00:40:10,520
Speaker 3: you know, and they and show they weren't going to hospitals.

838
00:40:10,640 --> 00:40:12,640
Speaker 3: You know, some people I think didn't get proper medical

839
00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:14,200
Speaker 3: attention because they were afraid to go in to hospital

840
00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:17,680
Speaker 3: with all these vaccinated people. Or you know, Leonne was saying,

841
00:40:17,680 --> 00:40:19,279
Speaker 3: don't go to funerals because you know it might be

842
00:40:19,760 --> 00:40:21,200
Speaker 3: you know, so if people are dying, you know, they're

843
00:40:21,239 --> 00:40:25,319
Speaker 3: they're disconnecting from their family. Yeah, I mean that that

844
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:27,480
Speaker 3: and then the kids I hear, like, you know, they

845
00:40:27,520 --> 00:40:29,080
Speaker 3: wouldn't want their kids to play with any of their

846
00:40:29,080 --> 00:40:31,680
Speaker 3: friends because you know they could have been vaccinated.

847
00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:33,120
Speaker 4: So the vaccine makes.

848
00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:36,840
Speaker 1: You like demonic, and then it ruins your DNA and

849
00:40:36,840 --> 00:40:39,400
Speaker 1: then if you're sitting next to somebody with the vaccine,

850
00:40:39,640 --> 00:40:41,200
Speaker 1: it's just going to shed.

851
00:40:41,000 --> 00:40:46,480
Speaker 2: Onto youtagious Now COVID. It's the contagiousness of COVID wasn't

852
00:40:46,480 --> 00:40:49,120
Speaker 2: the problem. It's the contagiousness of the vaccine. But that's

853
00:40:49,120 --> 00:40:52,000
Speaker 2: a classic conspiracy theory, and I wonder if you have

854
00:40:52,040 --> 00:40:54,920
Speaker 2: a sense of like, was that sort of just something

855
00:40:54,960 --> 00:40:57,800
Speaker 2: she pulled from the Internet knowing she could get people

856
00:40:57,880 --> 00:40:59,680
Speaker 2: in that way, or was it?

857
00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:01,080
Speaker 4: Yeah, which comes first?

858
00:41:01,160 --> 00:41:04,719
Speaker 1: It came from the whale Lola?

859
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:08,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I think a lot of it came

860
00:41:08,480 --> 00:41:10,279
Speaker 3: from you know, it was just where did all this

861
00:41:10,280 --> 00:41:11,839
Speaker 3: stuff come from? I mean, you know, you're you're, you're,

862
00:41:12,040 --> 00:41:13,680
Speaker 3: she's looking the same forms. There's a lot of like

863
00:41:13,760 --> 00:41:16,600
Speaker 3: QAnon you know, went on conspiratuality stuff.

864
00:41:17,120 --> 00:41:17,200
Speaker 5: Uh.

865
00:41:17,320 --> 00:41:19,520
Speaker 3: She I think spends a lot of time online just

866
00:41:19,800 --> 00:41:22,319
Speaker 3: you know, if you I mean her posts on Instagram

867
00:41:22,719 --> 00:41:26,840
Speaker 3: literally like one hundred times a day, Yeah, her stories

868
00:41:26,840 --> 00:41:29,080
Speaker 3: are constant, so she's clearly and she's always like grabbing

869
00:41:29,120 --> 00:41:33,560
Speaker 3: screenshots from like misinformation news articles and stuff and and

870
00:41:33,560 --> 00:41:36,640
Speaker 3: and so she's kind of really deep into that. But

871
00:41:36,680 --> 00:41:39,560
Speaker 3: she encouraged her followers don't don't listen for yourself. I'm

872
00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:42,560
Speaker 3: gonna be the sort of distiller of news. And that's

873
00:41:42,560 --> 00:41:45,200
Speaker 3: like one example of when somebody got kicked out, they're like, well,

874
00:41:45,239 --> 00:41:46,640
Speaker 3: can I listen to Joe Rogan? I thought you like

875
00:41:46,719 --> 00:41:50,120
Speaker 3: Joe Rogan, And Leonna was like, how dare you question me? Like,

876
00:41:50,160 --> 00:41:52,640
Speaker 3: I'll share Joe Rogan clips with you, you know what. And

877
00:41:52,680 --> 00:41:54,880
Speaker 3: then and then she kicked her out and started posting

878
00:41:55,040 --> 00:41:57,680
Speaker 3: her deepest dark of secrets you know that weren't entirely

879
00:41:57,680 --> 00:41:59,960
Speaker 3: true and taken out of context and then tagging people.

880
00:42:01,360 --> 00:42:03,399
Speaker 3: But yeah, I think she just pulls from the kind

881
00:42:03,400 --> 00:42:06,759
Speaker 3: of the z conspiracy zeitgeist of whatever's next, and she's

882
00:42:06,800 --> 00:42:10,880
Speaker 3: really good about kind of pulling like Boogeyman from the

883
00:42:10,880 --> 00:42:13,640
Speaker 3: headlines of the day, like now it's the you know,

884
00:42:13,680 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 3: East Palestine, like stay out of the Ohio region, and

885
00:42:16,320 --> 00:42:18,759
Speaker 3: you know that the trained derailment and that it's like

886
00:42:18,760 --> 00:42:22,319
Speaker 3: a government conspiracy to poison everything around it. So she's

887
00:42:22,320 --> 00:42:24,759
Speaker 3: really good at pulling from these things that there is

888
00:42:24,760 --> 00:42:27,880
Speaker 3: like a kernel of truth and then warping into something

889
00:42:28,000 --> 00:42:28,439
Speaker 3: very dark.

890
00:42:28,719 --> 00:42:32,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean the talk about core wounds, she's like,

891
00:42:33,320 --> 00:42:38,080
Speaker 2: you know, hijacking like psychology ideas, talking about narcissistic abuse,

892
00:42:38,440 --> 00:42:40,480
Speaker 2: things that many people I know are looking up on

893
00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:44,359
Speaker 2: the internet all the time. I mean, she's taking these

894
00:42:44,360 --> 00:42:47,200
Speaker 2: things that have there's like it's a legitimate thing to

895
00:42:47,320 --> 00:42:50,520
Speaker 2: want to know about, but then she's leonofying it.

896
00:42:50,600 --> 00:42:53,319
Speaker 3: I guess, yeah, you know, I mean I said this

897
00:42:53,440 --> 00:42:56,200
Speaker 3: with with Teal. I wish that these institutions would pull

898
00:42:56,280 --> 00:42:58,239
Speaker 3: more from you know, like can we why can can

899
00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:00,319
Speaker 3: we do something to make you know, how health care

900
00:43:00,360 --> 00:43:03,239
Speaker 3: a little more like comfortable and accessible and you know,

901
00:43:03,320 --> 00:43:05,520
Speaker 3: I so that you're not were not turning to these

902
00:43:05,640 --> 00:43:07,080
Speaker 3: mysterious online right.

903
00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:10,359
Speaker 4: Totally a really good point. So how many of her

904
00:43:10,360 --> 00:43:11,480
Speaker 4: followers are mothers?

905
00:43:11,520 --> 00:43:14,759
Speaker 2: Is there is there something specific with mothers that you

906
00:43:14,880 --> 00:43:16,120
Speaker 2: think is happening here or.

907
00:43:16,160 --> 00:43:18,320
Speaker 4: Is it just some of them happen to also be mothers.

908
00:43:18,360 --> 00:43:19,920
Speaker 3: It's a lot of moms, I mean there's also but

909
00:43:19,960 --> 00:43:24,200
Speaker 3: there's also like one, uh, I know one in particular,

910
00:43:24,239 --> 00:43:25,960
Speaker 3: this woman who joined right out of college and was

911
00:43:26,040 --> 00:43:28,880
Speaker 3: kind of questioning and then it just completely derailed her life.

912
00:43:29,440 --> 00:43:34,000
Speaker 3: She was top for class at a top UK university

913
00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:39,600
Speaker 3: and just got into the health stuff and it just, yeah,

914
00:43:39,840 --> 00:43:42,800
Speaker 3: got real dark. But it does seem to be a

915
00:43:42,840 --> 00:43:44,480
Speaker 3: lot of moms. I think her messaging teachers. I mean

916
00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:48,239
Speaker 3: it's all I mean, it's also just mostly I mean

917
00:43:48,239 --> 00:43:51,319
Speaker 3: it's it's like ninety nine percent women, and so you know,

918
00:43:51,360 --> 00:43:52,920
Speaker 3: good percentage of them are going to be moms.

919
00:43:53,000 --> 00:43:55,120
Speaker 1: It makes sense that somebody at the top of their

920
00:43:55,120 --> 00:43:58,960
Speaker 1: class out of university would join because Lehannas says, I

921
00:43:59,520 --> 00:44:02,359
Speaker 1: used to work on Wall Street. I was very successful.

922
00:44:03,239 --> 00:44:07,439
Speaker 1: Everything I touch turns to gold. So yeah, it makes

923
00:44:07,719 --> 00:44:08,680
Speaker 1: it makes complete sense.

924
00:44:08,719 --> 00:44:10,880
Speaker 2: It's a bit of you should be drawn Trump syndrome,

925
00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:13,520
Speaker 2: where it's like, oh, she's successful, she has a lot

926
00:44:13,560 --> 00:44:15,160
Speaker 2: of money, she did all this stuff.

927
00:44:15,680 --> 00:44:16,360
Speaker 4: I should listen.

928
00:44:16,440 --> 00:44:20,040
Speaker 2: You know, for some reason we trust people culturally who

929
00:44:20,960 --> 00:44:23,359
Speaker 2: have or claim to have a lot of money and

930
00:44:23,640 --> 00:44:25,280
Speaker 2: you know, financial success.

931
00:44:25,480 --> 00:44:28,640
Speaker 5: Yeah. And the interesting part about her claiming to be

932
00:44:28,680 --> 00:44:31,120
Speaker 5: a multi millionaire lawyer too, is like, in doing my

933
00:44:31,160 --> 00:44:33,439
Speaker 5: own research, when I sort of started finding out about

934
00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:36,680
Speaker 5: who this woman was, she really only practiced law for

935
00:44:36,840 --> 00:44:40,400
Speaker 5: just over a year and then her license was suspended.

936
00:44:40,520 --> 00:44:44,880
Speaker 5: Not entirely sure why, but so it's this whole facade

937
00:44:44,920 --> 00:44:47,279
Speaker 5: of look at how successful I was when it's only

938
00:44:47,440 --> 00:44:50,480
Speaker 5: like we were just talking about it's only a partial truth, right,

939
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:51,560
Speaker 5: it's not the whole truth.

940
00:44:51,680 --> 00:44:55,760
Speaker 3: Right. Yeah, she actually filed for bankruptcy in twenty eleven

941
00:44:55,760 --> 00:44:57,839
Speaker 3: and then like lied in that bankruptcy and so now

942
00:44:57,960 --> 00:45:03,280
Speaker 3: is serving obation for you know, felony bankruptcy fraud.

943
00:45:03,640 --> 00:45:04,279
Speaker 4: Wow.

944
00:45:04,960 --> 00:45:07,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like it's it's very a very different picture than

945
00:45:07,520 --> 00:45:08,719
Speaker 3: what she she paints herself as.

946
00:45:09,000 --> 00:45:10,640
Speaker 5: She's not going to tell her followers up.

947
00:45:12,040 --> 00:45:16,040
Speaker 3: Well she asked you now yes, maybe, I mean it's

948
00:45:16,800 --> 00:45:19,759
Speaker 3: so yeah, because of after the article came out, I

949
00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:23,239
Speaker 3: think her probation officer became aware because you know, she

950
00:45:23,840 --> 00:45:27,280
Speaker 3: under her current probation, she can't travel outside of Hawaii

951
00:45:27,280 --> 00:45:30,319
Speaker 3: without the order, without permission from the court. I think

952
00:45:30,440 --> 00:45:32,520
Speaker 3: her finances have to be very in order and buy

953
00:45:32,520 --> 00:45:35,120
Speaker 3: the book, and a probation offers the officer can access

954
00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:38,719
Speaker 3: all of her or banking information, and this article, I think, like,

955
00:45:38,800 --> 00:45:40,880
Speaker 3: and then all the accounts that came out after I

956
00:45:40,920 --> 00:45:44,560
Speaker 3: think kind of put up a flag that maybe all

957
00:45:44,719 --> 00:45:46,800
Speaker 3: was not as she was presenting it to a probation officer.

958
00:45:47,239 --> 00:45:51,240
Speaker 3: So she was ordered into court for a hearing last week,

959
00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:56,319
Speaker 3: and the in that the judge said, I think we

960
00:45:56,360 --> 00:45:58,880
Speaker 3: need to find a way to inform you have to.

961
00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:01,520
Speaker 3: I have to force you in some way to inform

962
00:46:01,560 --> 00:46:06,239
Speaker 3: your followers your clients that you as another alias. Because

963
00:46:06,280 --> 00:46:10,160
Speaker 3: her her birth name is Leane Wilson, Leanne Wilson kind

964
00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:13,480
Speaker 3: of created this alter ego or character of Leana Shanty.

965
00:46:13,920 --> 00:46:15,719
Speaker 3: So the judge said, I need you to find a

966
00:46:15,760 --> 00:46:19,280
Speaker 3: way to inform all your followers that you under Leoni

967
00:46:19,560 --> 00:46:25,520
Speaker 3: Leane Wilson are a convicted felon. And her lawyer so

968
00:46:25,680 --> 00:46:28,120
Speaker 3: she the judge proposed that she has to post on

969
00:46:28,120 --> 00:46:30,320
Speaker 3: her Instagram like twice a week and on her website

970
00:46:30,400 --> 00:46:36,800
Speaker 3: this this banner banner saying that, but she's she has like, uh,

971
00:46:36,960 --> 00:46:39,399
Speaker 3: the lawyer is coming up with other proposals for how

972
00:46:39,400 --> 00:46:41,160
Speaker 3: she could do that. But soon she will, I think,

973
00:46:41,160 --> 00:46:45,520
Speaker 3: be forced to inform her followers. And yeah, actually justice

974
00:46:45,600 --> 00:46:47,880
Speaker 3: was at if if if she can talk about I

975
00:46:47,920 --> 00:46:50,840
Speaker 3: mean she was at that hearing and saw he's the

976
00:46:50,880 --> 00:46:55,000
Speaker 3: only person I know that se Leana Shanty and God,

977
00:46:55,080 --> 00:46:56,359
Speaker 3: how hell is every.

978
00:46:58,120 --> 00:46:58,440
Speaker 2: Well?

979
00:46:58,560 --> 00:47:01,680
Speaker 5: I will say it was the most intense two hours

980
00:47:01,680 --> 00:47:06,120
Speaker 5: of my life. I'm pretty sure I did go to Honolulu.

981
00:47:06,480 --> 00:47:08,560
Speaker 5: I did go to the hearing because it was public,

982
00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:13,160
Speaker 5: so public was allowed there. It was very surreal, and

983
00:47:13,200 --> 00:47:15,040
Speaker 5: I've talked to Jennings a bit about it, but like

984
00:47:15,200 --> 00:47:19,239
Speaker 5: I basically I'll just give you like a synopsis. Come

985
00:47:19,320 --> 00:47:21,520
Speaker 5: up the elevator of the building. The door's open, and

986
00:47:21,560 --> 00:47:24,399
Speaker 5: she's sitting right there, and I immediately know it's her.

987
00:47:24,680 --> 00:47:27,920
Speaker 5: And it's like this crazy moment where because going into

988
00:47:28,000 --> 00:47:30,120
Speaker 5: it I had no idea what to expect. We kind of,

989
00:47:30,239 --> 00:47:32,560
Speaker 5: like I say, we as like a collective, but like

990
00:47:32,640 --> 00:47:35,000
Speaker 5: I kind of had an idea that she doesn't look

991
00:47:35,120 --> 00:47:39,640
Speaker 5: like this nymph like avatar that she posts online. And

992
00:47:39,680 --> 00:47:42,440
Speaker 5: then to see it with my own two eyes was

993
00:47:42,480 --> 00:47:45,520
Speaker 5: so gratifying but also terrifying at the same time. To

994
00:47:45,600 --> 00:47:48,920
Speaker 5: be in the same room as her, it was surreal.

995
00:47:49,840 --> 00:47:54,279
Speaker 5: And then she was there with her two kids, so

996
00:47:54,440 --> 00:47:59,040
Speaker 5: twenty one and sixteen, and then her husband, and they

997
00:47:59,040 --> 00:48:02,520
Speaker 5: also had a mass a black German shepherd dog which

998
00:48:02,680 --> 00:48:06,160
Speaker 5: she claimed was a service animal, which was a bit questionable.

999
00:48:07,280 --> 00:48:10,040
Speaker 5: And then her ex husband was also there. So it

1000
00:48:10,200 --> 00:48:13,480
Speaker 5: was also this bizarre moment for me because like I've

1001
00:48:13,719 --> 00:48:16,080
Speaker 5: I've done so much research on these people that I

1002
00:48:16,120 --> 00:48:18,920
Speaker 5: know who they are, I know a lot about them,

1003
00:48:19,400 --> 00:48:21,920
Speaker 5: and they're right in front of me and they don't

1004
00:48:21,960 --> 00:48:24,760
Speaker 5: necessarily know who I am. So it was very odd.

1005
00:48:24,880 --> 00:48:29,080
Speaker 5: But I can confirm she does not look anything like

1006
00:48:29,200 --> 00:48:32,400
Speaker 5: this version of herself that she is posting online.

1007
00:48:32,520 --> 00:48:34,440
Speaker 1: On a scale of one to ten, how much does

1008
00:48:34,520 --> 00:48:38,440
Speaker 1: Lelana Shanty not look like presents online?

1009
00:48:38,480 --> 00:48:41,279
Speaker 5: Like, like ten being she looks exactly like her, and

1010
00:48:41,360 --> 00:48:44,200
Speaker 5: one being I'd say I'd say a three.

1011
00:48:44,400 --> 00:48:48,120
Speaker 2: Okay, I mean I'm not surprised because her photos are

1012
00:48:48,239 --> 00:48:50,160
Speaker 2: like blurry, there's so of it.

1013
00:48:50,160 --> 00:48:52,720
Speaker 4: It's the filter of like it's completely different filter.

1014
00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:53,839
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah.

1015
00:48:54,640 --> 00:48:58,080
Speaker 5: Well and she it was like, yeah, so she, I'll

1016
00:48:58,120 --> 00:49:01,719
Speaker 5: just describe her. So she's she was wearing like kind

1017
00:49:01,760 --> 00:49:05,120
Speaker 5: of quite tight clothing and a bit of like a

1018
00:49:05,160 --> 00:49:07,319
Speaker 5: crop top, so I saw her mid drift a couple

1019
00:49:07,360 --> 00:49:10,319
Speaker 5: of times, which was a bit odd. She also had

1020
00:49:10,320 --> 00:49:12,160
Speaker 5: a very long wig on that was kind of like

1021
00:49:12,200 --> 00:49:16,000
Speaker 5: a white blonde like curled sort of mid back, and

1022
00:49:16,040 --> 00:49:19,560
Speaker 5: then it had these really like kind of gray ashy

1023
00:49:19,640 --> 00:49:24,400
Speaker 5: black roots her face was very heavily made up in makeup.

1024
00:49:24,600 --> 00:49:28,160
Speaker 5: She was tanned. But and I don't know, there's there

1025
00:49:28,200 --> 00:49:30,920
Speaker 5: was a video that I saw that went out online.

1026
00:49:31,680 --> 00:49:33,399
Speaker 5: I think it was probably over a month ago now,

1027
00:49:33,520 --> 00:49:36,839
Speaker 5: of her and it looked very much like she had

1028
00:49:36,880 --> 00:49:38,719
Speaker 5: had a lot of plastic surgery done, like there was

1029
00:49:38,760 --> 00:49:41,839
Speaker 5: a lot of changes to her face and none of

1030
00:49:41,880 --> 00:49:43,000
Speaker 5: that was present.

1031
00:49:43,320 --> 00:49:45,279
Speaker 3: I think that was also a very I mean now

1032
00:49:45,320 --> 00:49:47,800
Speaker 3: with AI and the filters. Well, yeah, the video was

1033
00:49:47,920 --> 00:49:50,759
Speaker 3: very a very filter video, right, but it did it

1034
00:49:50,800 --> 00:49:52,440
Speaker 3: was It did seem to be a response to like

1035
00:49:52,480 --> 00:49:55,719
Speaker 3: there was finally all this talk about the real her

1036
00:49:55,800 --> 00:49:57,880
Speaker 3: versus the online her. And then I think she posted

1037
00:49:57,880 --> 00:49:59,440
Speaker 3: that as sort of proof, like, look, here's a video,

1038
00:49:59,680 --> 00:50:02,480
Speaker 3: because everybody's wondering how come there's no videos of her

1039
00:50:02,480 --> 00:50:05,840
Speaker 3: exit that exists? Right, Yeah, And I think it's important

1040
00:50:05,880 --> 00:50:09,040
Speaker 3: to note, like it's not that a lot of influencers

1041
00:50:09,200 --> 00:50:11,239
Speaker 3: use a lot of filters. And I think if you know,

1042
00:50:11,320 --> 00:50:14,280
Speaker 3: if there was a male guru who was using filters

1043
00:50:14,280 --> 00:50:16,640
Speaker 3: and making him his pecks look you know, like look stronger,

1044
00:50:16,719 --> 00:50:19,640
Speaker 3: better abs or whatever, like, he would not be getting

1045
00:50:19,640 --> 00:50:22,160
Speaker 3: this sort of I think why this is important is

1046
00:50:22,719 --> 00:50:25,120
Speaker 3: so much of her selling point is she says, look,

1047
00:50:25,120 --> 00:50:26,280
Speaker 3: I'm a fifty three year old.

1048
00:50:26,200 --> 00:50:27,480
Speaker 4: Or fifty year old long beauty.

1049
00:50:27,640 --> 00:50:30,480
Speaker 3: I look at you. If you do my juice cleanses,

1050
00:50:30,600 --> 00:50:32,960
Speaker 3: it look like a twenty year old. That I think

1051
00:50:33,080 --> 00:50:35,480
Speaker 3: is it's where it gets into like deceptive selling.

1052
00:50:35,680 --> 00:50:37,760
Speaker 5: You know, it's a catfish. Yeah, it's a catfish.

1053
00:50:37,760 --> 00:50:38,920
Speaker 4: She's a master catfish.

1054
00:50:39,040 --> 00:50:42,160
Speaker 2: There was also you know, the leader of the Buddha

1055
00:50:42,200 --> 00:50:44,799
Speaker 2: field was a man who had had a ton of

1056
00:50:44,880 --> 00:50:47,920
Speaker 2: plastic surgery. That yeah, yeah, to me, it's just notable

1057
00:50:47,960 --> 00:50:49,920
Speaker 2: when they're haw so all a Hawaii.

1058
00:50:50,239 --> 00:50:51,240
Speaker 4: Yeah, when they're.

1059
00:50:52,600 --> 00:50:56,279
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're dramatically altering their appearance to kind of I mean,

1060
00:50:56,280 --> 00:50:59,200
Speaker 2: who knows if that's just general narcissism or if that's

1061
00:50:59,200 --> 00:51:01,720
Speaker 2: to convince people that the answer what. But it is interesting,

1062
00:51:01,760 --> 00:51:04,279
Speaker 2: it's notable to me when they are dramatically trying to

1063
00:51:04,320 --> 00:51:06,239
Speaker 2: look different than what they look like.

1064
00:51:06,440 --> 00:51:08,640
Speaker 5: And she's always boasting like, you know, I go out

1065
00:51:08,680 --> 00:51:10,799
Speaker 5: in public and people say to me, or are you

1066
00:51:10,960 --> 00:51:13,799
Speaker 5: She's like, people think I'm my daughter's sister rather than

1067
00:51:13,800 --> 00:51:16,759
Speaker 5: her mother. But then seeing her in person, I was like, well,

1068
00:51:16,800 --> 00:51:18,960
Speaker 5: that's also a lie, you know, like it's just it's

1069
00:51:19,080 --> 00:51:21,759
Speaker 5: very obvious that she's a fifty two year old a

1070
00:51:21,760 --> 00:51:25,600
Speaker 5: bit like, you know, just kind of evil woman in

1071
00:51:25,640 --> 00:51:28,319
Speaker 5: my opinion, like nothing special about her. She doesn't look

1072
00:51:28,400 --> 00:51:31,319
Speaker 5: like what she's posting online at all. So yeah, it

1073
00:51:31,360 --> 00:51:34,040
Speaker 5: was it was surreal. It was crazy.

1074
00:51:34,200 --> 00:51:38,279
Speaker 2: Does Leana benefit when women leave their families? Why is

1075
00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:40,160
Speaker 2: she asking people to do this?

1076
00:51:40,680 --> 00:51:43,239
Speaker 3: I think, I mean, who knows. I think it's I

1077
00:51:43,280 --> 00:51:45,799
Speaker 3: have my own theories, one of them being that she

1078
00:51:46,120 --> 00:51:48,160
Speaker 3: it's sort of like this video game, you know, like

1079
00:51:48,200 --> 00:51:50,880
Speaker 3: it's easier for people in the military to kill with

1080
00:51:50,880 --> 00:51:53,319
Speaker 3: a drone than you know, in person. It kind of

1081
00:51:53,320 --> 00:51:55,920
Speaker 3: it's the gamification of these and that's why the internet

1082
00:51:56,040 --> 00:51:59,680
Speaker 3: just makes it easier to be mean to people. And

1083
00:51:59,719 --> 00:52:02,520
Speaker 3: I think gets sort of she created this during the

1084
00:52:02,520 --> 00:52:04,279
Speaker 3: beginning COVID when things were locking down and that's when

1085
00:52:04,320 --> 00:52:07,359
Speaker 3: her probation began and she couldn't travel. She kind of

1086
00:52:07,400 --> 00:52:11,120
Speaker 3: created this online world where she was a goddess and

1087
00:52:11,719 --> 00:52:14,160
Speaker 3: she had to kind of keep everybody trapped inside. So

1088
00:52:14,200 --> 00:52:17,120
Speaker 3: that's my sort of, uh, you know, that's one theory.

1089
00:52:17,520 --> 00:52:19,919
Speaker 3: I think, like she does she makes a lot of money.

1090
00:52:19,920 --> 00:52:21,279
Speaker 3: I mean a lot of these people she's saying like

1091
00:52:21,880 --> 00:52:23,879
Speaker 3: you need to leave your job, it's not the right

1092
00:52:23,920 --> 00:52:26,600
Speaker 3: frequency or whatever, and you need to be a health coach.

1093
00:52:26,880 --> 00:52:28,719
Speaker 3: And you know, if you're going to be a health coach,

1094
00:52:28,760 --> 00:52:31,120
Speaker 3: you have to sell her health programs. So there is

1095
00:52:31,160 --> 00:52:34,240
Speaker 3: that kind of like MLM component. And then they're recruiting people,

1096
00:52:34,600 --> 00:52:36,680
Speaker 3: and I think just a way to get people totally

1097
00:52:36,760 --> 00:52:39,279
Speaker 3: isolated is to like move to a different state, you know.

1098
00:52:39,280 --> 00:52:41,000
Speaker 3: And there's also we haven't gone into like she she

1099
00:52:41,280 --> 00:52:43,120
Speaker 3: has a lot of them changed their names to these

1100
00:52:43,200 --> 00:52:46,759
Speaker 3: kind of Lamerian like Hawaiian sounding names, So that's big part.

1101
00:52:47,480 --> 00:52:50,840
Speaker 5: They're gifted. They're gifted to these women because Leanne claims

1102
00:52:50,840 --> 00:52:52,480
Speaker 5: they come from the Acosic.

1103
00:52:52,000 --> 00:52:54,279
Speaker 3: Records and you know, she says, don't talk to each

1104
00:52:54,280 --> 00:52:56,040
Speaker 3: other outside of the Facebook group and you need to

1105
00:52:56,040 --> 00:52:58,120
Speaker 3: travel to a different city, and you need to sell

1106
00:52:58,160 --> 00:53:01,279
Speaker 3: my programs. I think it's just like extreme isolation independency

1107
00:53:01,400 --> 00:53:04,120
Speaker 3: on her and the online community.

1108
00:53:04,239 --> 00:53:06,640
Speaker 2: Didn't you say in your article, I feel like you

1109
00:53:06,680 --> 00:53:10,360
Speaker 2: wrote something about how there's a course to help you

1110
00:53:10,480 --> 00:53:12,440
Speaker 2: leave your family or something like that.

1111
00:53:13,160 --> 00:53:15,400
Speaker 3: No, I mean, I think it's sort of in the

1112
00:53:15,680 --> 00:53:17,600
Speaker 3: Mother Wound, the Father Wound all that it's sort of

1113
00:53:17,600 --> 00:53:21,600
Speaker 3: in there, like it's all this sort of dog whistling

1114
00:53:21,800 --> 00:53:27,640
Speaker 3: or you know, dog hollering messaging like you have to Yeah,

1115
00:53:27,680 --> 00:53:31,239
Speaker 3: like everybody has childhood trauma and you cannot heal you're

1116
00:53:31,400 --> 00:53:35,560
Speaker 3: those wounds unless you leave these narcissistic abusive people. And

1117
00:53:35,640 --> 00:53:38,560
Speaker 3: I think she says something like, you know, ninety percent

1118
00:53:38,640 --> 00:53:40,960
Speaker 3: or nine ninety percent of people have abusive experience, so

1119
00:53:40,960 --> 00:53:43,120
Speaker 3: it's basically baked in, like everybody has to leave their families, like,

1120
00:53:43,160 --> 00:53:45,120
Speaker 3: come on, do it, why you should have done it yesterday.

1121
00:53:45,200 --> 00:53:47,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, And people will message in the group talking about

1122
00:53:47,960 --> 00:53:49,440
Speaker 2: what they've done or what they plan to do and

1123
00:53:49,480 --> 00:53:51,200
Speaker 2: get encouraged by her right directly.

1124
00:53:51,280 --> 00:53:54,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, she's I think she is very smart with lake

1125
00:53:54,560 --> 00:53:56,440
Speaker 3: a legal brain. You know, she was lawyer for a

1126
00:53:56,480 --> 00:53:58,560
Speaker 3: year and she was an incredible it sounds like she

1127
00:53:58,600 --> 00:54:02,280
Speaker 3: was incredible time share sales person. So that was the

1128
00:54:02,320 --> 00:54:05,120
Speaker 3: sort of path like start as lawyer and then at

1129
00:54:05,200 --> 00:54:07,560
Speaker 3: nine to eleven, I think she was eight months pregnant

1130
00:54:07,640 --> 00:54:09,359
Speaker 3: and that was I think a traumatic thing. So she

1131
00:54:09,440 --> 00:54:12,160
Speaker 3: like got the hell out of that situation and they

1132
00:54:12,239 --> 00:54:16,120
Speaker 3: ended up in Hawaii selling time shares and then it

1133
00:54:16,160 --> 00:54:19,840
Speaker 3: sounds like it was a pretty toxic work environment. It

1134
00:54:19,920 --> 00:54:22,799
Speaker 3: was really there are a lot of like discrimination and

1135
00:54:22,840 --> 00:54:25,120
Speaker 3: sexual abuse, and there was a class action lawsuit that

1136
00:54:25,200 --> 00:54:27,800
Speaker 3: she was a part of, uh because apparently she reported

1137
00:54:27,880 --> 00:54:31,480
Speaker 3: this this discrimination and stuff and then got fired and

1138
00:54:31,480 --> 00:54:33,239
Speaker 3: then there was a lawsuit. Anyway, then after that she

1139
00:54:33,480 --> 00:54:38,120
Speaker 3: sort of reinvented herself as this female empowerment spiritual guru,

1140
00:54:38,440 --> 00:54:39,680
Speaker 3: and so I don't know how much of that was

1141
00:54:39,680 --> 00:54:43,800
Speaker 3: informed by this bad experience. She is very clever about,

1142
00:54:44,080 --> 00:54:46,520
Speaker 3: you know, like showing some more of than what matches is,

1143
00:54:47,760 --> 00:54:50,920
Speaker 3: showing where the wood pile is, and like saying like

1144
00:54:51,120 --> 00:54:53,360
Speaker 3: I would do this, you know, giving you all the

1145
00:54:53,360 --> 00:54:54,960
Speaker 3: things to kind of burn your life down, but doesn't

1146
00:54:54,960 --> 00:54:57,040
Speaker 3: say like strike the match and throw it there, right.

1147
00:54:57,160 --> 00:55:01,000
Speaker 3: And as soon as people start posting like I am

1148
00:55:01,160 --> 00:55:03,480
Speaker 3: lying to the border control so that I can get

1149
00:55:03,560 --> 00:55:05,759
Speaker 3: across Canada, you know, as soon as they post like

1150
00:55:05,800 --> 00:55:09,040
Speaker 3: actual criminal activity in her Facebook group, she you know,

1151
00:55:09,080 --> 00:55:11,400
Speaker 3: and they're like Leana, I need a sign, and she's

1152
00:55:11,400 --> 00:55:15,839
Speaker 3: like noticeably quiet. I think she's clever there, but I

1153
00:55:15,880 --> 00:55:17,520
Speaker 3: point this out because I think it's something under in

1154
00:55:17,560 --> 00:55:19,480
Speaker 3: her approbation that says like she can't really be a

1155
00:55:19,480 --> 00:55:20,840
Speaker 3: part of any sort of like knowingly a part of

1156
00:55:20,840 --> 00:55:24,320
Speaker 3: any kind of criminal activity. And all these these followers

1157
00:55:24,320 --> 00:55:27,880
Speaker 3: are posting about the things they do to get to

1158
00:55:27,920 --> 00:55:30,080
Speaker 3: where they need to be because Leona told them, and

1159
00:55:30,080 --> 00:55:31,960
Speaker 3: they're posting about it. And Leona has to as far

1160
00:55:32,040 --> 00:55:34,520
Speaker 3: as I know, she has to approve every posts in

1161
00:55:34,560 --> 00:55:36,960
Speaker 3: her Facebook group, So shows that she is least aware

1162
00:55:37,200 --> 00:55:37,879
Speaker 3: that this is all.

1163
00:55:37,840 --> 00:55:42,959
Speaker 2: Right and justice. When did your loved one move?

1164
00:55:43,520 --> 00:55:45,359
Speaker 5: It was the very end of twenty twenty one.

1165
00:55:46,400 --> 00:55:50,240
Speaker 4: And are these mostly like Americans and Canadians? Is there anyone?

1166
00:55:50,840 --> 00:55:54,799
Speaker 3: This is global? It's I mean, India, Ireland. Yeah, I mean,

1167
00:55:54,840 --> 00:55:57,040
Speaker 3: it's it's all over. It's crazy. I mean, and she'll

1168
00:55:57,600 --> 00:55:59,160
Speaker 3: she chooses certain states and I think it was kind

1169
00:55:59,160 --> 00:56:02,759
Speaker 3: of based on which one stricter COVID restrictions, but like

1170
00:56:02,800 --> 00:56:05,400
Speaker 3: Australia and Canada or I think among the most evil.

1171
00:56:05,600 --> 00:56:08,080
Speaker 3: So she's like, you got to get out of those countries. Yeah,

1172
00:56:08,560 --> 00:56:10,800
Speaker 3: you know, I think, like Floridas amongst the safest place.

1173
00:56:11,320 --> 00:56:13,239
Speaker 3: But yeah, it's it's it's global. It's crazy. I mean,

1174
00:56:13,320 --> 00:56:17,320
Speaker 3: she's she's able to build this community from her phone

1175
00:56:17,360 --> 00:56:18,080
Speaker 3: in all of the world.

1176
00:56:18,239 --> 00:56:19,080
Speaker 4: It's so scary.

1177
00:56:19,360 --> 00:56:21,520
Speaker 1: Could could you tell us a little bit about I

1178
00:56:21,520 --> 00:56:23,440
Speaker 1: think I'm saying this right destiny manner.

1179
00:56:24,080 --> 00:56:28,480
Speaker 5: Yeah, so that is, as far as I know, that

1180
00:56:28,560 --> 00:56:32,279
Speaker 5: is where my loved one is. So it is a

1181
00:56:32,640 --> 00:56:37,480
Speaker 5: massive house in Jacksonville, Florida that one of the sort

1182
00:56:37,480 --> 00:56:42,160
Speaker 5: of higher up followers of Leanna purchased and there are

1183
00:56:43,080 --> 00:56:47,840
Speaker 5: multiple families living in that under one roof. And as

1184
00:56:48,040 --> 00:56:50,000
Speaker 5: as far as I know from what I've sort of

1185
00:56:50,040 --> 00:56:53,680
Speaker 5: researched and found out, all of the families are from Canada.

1186
00:56:54,000 --> 00:56:55,880
Speaker 3: At one point, they're like eleven children.

1187
00:56:56,239 --> 00:56:59,480
Speaker 5: Yeah, eleven children, I think, four women and one man.

1188
00:57:00,320 --> 00:57:02,839
Speaker 5: I think there has maybe been some movement since then,

1189
00:57:02,920 --> 00:57:05,000
Speaker 5: so there may be a couple less people. But at

1190
00:57:05,000 --> 00:57:06,680
Speaker 5: the beginning there was eleven children there.

1191
00:57:06,840 --> 00:57:09,080
Speaker 2: And was that man married to one of them and

1192
00:57:09,120 --> 00:57:10,319
Speaker 2: he just was a believer as well?

1193
00:57:10,920 --> 00:57:13,160
Speaker 3: Yes, I think, yeah, there are very few men, and

1194
00:57:13,200 --> 00:57:14,640
Speaker 3: some of those seemed like ones that were trying to

1195
00:57:14,840 --> 00:57:17,560
Speaker 3: really hard to keep their marriage. Ye are going and

1196
00:57:17,640 --> 00:57:21,240
Speaker 3: kind of bought in. And one ex member told me

1197
00:57:21,280 --> 00:57:23,360
Speaker 3: that was kind of when she started to check out,

1198
00:57:23,440 --> 00:57:26,000
Speaker 3: she was like, oh this is she said this, this

1199
00:57:26,240 --> 00:57:28,720
Speaker 3: reminds me of like Heaven's Gate territory when they're all

1200
00:57:29,040 --> 00:57:32,240
Speaker 3: moving in a mansion together. She's like, if something happens

1201
00:57:32,280 --> 00:57:34,520
Speaker 3: there and I'm connected to it, She's like that that's.

1202
00:57:35,840 --> 00:57:39,080
Speaker 2: You know, she's trying to typically prior to Destiny Manner,

1203
00:57:39,160 --> 00:57:41,320
Speaker 2: keeping people isolated even from each other, so they can

1204
00:57:41,360 --> 00:57:44,200
Speaker 2: only talk under her supervision. But she's not physically there

1205
00:57:44,400 --> 00:57:48,200
Speaker 2: in Florida, So do we know anything about what happens there?

1206
00:57:48,200 --> 00:57:50,400
Speaker 4: Has anyone come out of there yet or not really?

1207
00:57:50,840 --> 00:57:54,080
Speaker 3: Uh no noways come out yet? Yeah, it is interesting

1208
00:57:54,200 --> 00:57:56,240
Speaker 3: she I think somebody moved to Hawaii and she kind

1209
00:57:56,240 --> 00:57:59,080
Speaker 3: of signaled that that was not the right move. This

1210
00:57:59,160 --> 00:58:02,080
Speaker 3: is why is an evil play. But because she's on

1211
00:58:02,360 --> 00:58:05,080
Speaker 3: whatever frequency, she can live there alone because she doesn't.

1212
00:58:04,840 --> 00:58:06,120
Speaker 4: Want to pole to see her correct.

1213
00:58:06,440 --> 00:58:09,480
Speaker 5: That's what I think. That's my opinion, because if she did,

1214
00:58:09,520 --> 00:58:11,360
Speaker 5: then the jig is up right.

1215
00:58:11,480 --> 00:58:14,440
Speaker 3: It's far like it's like very select people. She's like,

1216
00:58:14,520 --> 00:58:16,960
Speaker 3: it wants them living amongst each other. A lot of people,

1217
00:58:17,000 --> 00:58:19,000
Speaker 3: She's like, you don't you shouldn't connect. So I don't

1218
00:58:19,000 --> 00:58:21,600
Speaker 3: know why the people in Destiny Manner were sort of

1219
00:58:21,640 --> 00:58:24,560
Speaker 3: given the green light to get this house together. I

1220
00:58:24,600 --> 00:58:26,640
Speaker 3: don't know if it's like an experiment or what. We

1221
00:58:26,680 --> 00:58:29,120
Speaker 3: don't have much insight into what's going on there. I

1222
00:58:29,160 --> 00:58:31,120
Speaker 3: think it's just kind of a you know, they're doing

1223
00:58:31,280 --> 00:58:34,840
Speaker 3: Leanna's teachings, and I think the kids are also being

1224
00:58:34,840 --> 00:58:41,560
Speaker 3: deeply indoctrinated into into what Leanna teaches. But yeah, it's

1225
00:58:41,640 --> 00:58:43,040
Speaker 3: it's it's still a bit of a mystery.

1226
00:58:43,200 --> 00:58:45,640
Speaker 4: Oh those poor kids. I feel so bad for those kids.

1227
00:58:45,920 --> 00:58:49,160
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, it sounds like they're being homeschooled there

1228
00:58:49,200 --> 00:58:49,680
Speaker 1: as well.

1229
00:58:49,880 --> 00:58:53,240
Speaker 3: That's yeah, like Leanna says, you know, you have to homeschool,

1230
00:58:53,320 --> 00:58:56,200
Speaker 3: and I mean some of these dads that that don't

1231
00:58:56,240 --> 00:58:57,919
Speaker 3: have custody and they do get every once in while

1232
00:58:57,960 --> 00:59:00,919
Speaker 3: like a FaceTime, it's heartbreaking because like my kid doesn't

1233
00:59:00,960 --> 00:59:03,320
Speaker 3: know how to read, or like one dad, you know,

1234
00:59:03,360 --> 00:59:05,160
Speaker 3: and it's in the article it was like, you know,

1235
00:59:05,200 --> 00:59:07,040
Speaker 3: like my son's teeth aren't growing because I don't think

1236
00:59:07,040 --> 00:59:09,840
Speaker 3: he's getting the proper nutrients. And then when they get

1237
00:59:09,840 --> 00:59:12,880
Speaker 3: custody back, you know, in some cases the dads have

1238
00:59:12,880 --> 00:59:16,200
Speaker 3: gotten custody and they're like, you know, they're at like

1239
00:59:16,880 --> 00:59:21,240
Speaker 3: three years of reading levels behind just because they weren't

1240
00:59:21,240 --> 00:59:22,080
Speaker 3: getting education.

1241
00:59:22,400 --> 00:59:24,439
Speaker 4: How has she responded to people who've left.

1242
00:59:24,720 --> 00:59:26,600
Speaker 3: It's, you know, it's that a lot of like dosing

1243
00:59:26,760 --> 00:59:29,280
Speaker 3: and you know, posting, like I said earlier, like the

1244
00:59:29,320 --> 00:59:32,480
Speaker 3: confessions that they've or the things they've you know, said like, oh,

1245
00:59:32,520 --> 00:59:34,520
Speaker 3: I was such an evil person before I met you.

1246
00:59:34,600 --> 00:59:37,040
Speaker 3: I was homophobic or you know, like you know, it's

1247
00:59:37,040 --> 00:59:39,000
Speaker 3: like trying to be like there's this big urge of

1248
00:59:39,040 --> 00:59:41,640
Speaker 3: like you're the savior, so these are all the ways

1249
00:59:41,640 --> 00:59:43,959
Speaker 3: you changed me. So they post all the like things

1250
00:59:44,000 --> 00:59:46,960
Speaker 3: they feel shame about in the past. And then so

1251
00:59:47,120 --> 00:59:49,200
Speaker 3: it's like, you know a lot of times these confessions

1252
00:59:49,200 --> 00:59:51,280
Speaker 3: where it's like one person, you know, I'm saying like,

1253
00:59:51,640 --> 00:59:53,760
Speaker 3: oh I used to you know, I was really I

1254
00:59:53,800 --> 00:59:56,040
Speaker 3: was raised in a homophobic household and I you know,

1255
00:59:56,040 --> 00:59:58,360
Speaker 3: I wasn't very accepting. And then it's like somebody's looking

1256
00:59:58,400 --> 01:00:01,160
Speaker 3: for a job and or is like you know, between

1257
01:00:01,240 --> 01:00:03,880
Speaker 3: jobs or something, and she's posting that and tagging past

1258
01:00:03,880 --> 01:00:06,400
Speaker 3: employers or whatever, and like also she makes a website

1259
01:00:06,680 --> 01:00:09,400
Speaker 3: where she puts a lot of this information, so you

1260
01:00:09,440 --> 01:00:11,960
Speaker 3: know it can be like searchable if you're googling people.

1261
01:00:13,160 --> 01:00:15,320
Speaker 3: But yeah, it's so that's kind of the signal, which

1262
01:00:15,440 --> 01:00:17,760
Speaker 3: and then she'll you know, post on her stories like

1263
01:00:17,800 --> 01:00:19,680
Speaker 3: this is an evil person, like they left and now

1264
01:00:19,720 --> 01:00:21,560
Speaker 3: they're you know, and so it's a signal to the

1265
01:00:22,280 --> 01:00:24,400
Speaker 3: to the followers, like don't leave because this is going

1266
01:00:24,440 --> 01:00:25,000
Speaker 3: to happen to you.

1267
01:00:25,360 --> 01:00:28,560
Speaker 5: It's like a fear tactic, I think, because everybody that

1268
01:00:28,760 --> 01:00:33,160
Speaker 5: leaves or has left is called, you know, an abuser

1269
01:00:34,240 --> 01:00:38,400
Speaker 5: or is you know, conspiring with abusers and pedophiles. And

1270
01:00:38,480 --> 01:00:43,160
Speaker 5: it's the same story. She just blasts these people online

1271
01:00:43,400 --> 01:00:48,040
Speaker 5: and has no regard at all for those people at all,

1272
01:00:48,120 --> 01:00:51,120
Speaker 5: and it's not true, like what's being said about them

1273
01:00:51,200 --> 01:00:54,240
Speaker 5: isn't true. But she just blasts it everywhere, and like

1274
01:00:54,320 --> 01:00:57,120
Speaker 5: Jennings said, it's her social media. So it's her Instagram,

1275
01:00:57,120 --> 01:01:01,720
Speaker 5: it's Twitter, it's the Exposing Family Abuse website. It's all

1276
01:01:01,760 --> 01:01:05,600
Speaker 5: of these different places that she's posting this information and

1277
01:01:05,640 --> 01:01:06,720
Speaker 5: it's incredibly hurtful.

1278
01:01:07,080 --> 01:01:12,000
Speaker 2: What are the legal developments, if any, aside from her

1279
01:01:12,120 --> 01:01:13,080
Speaker 2: probation situation.

1280
01:01:14,560 --> 01:01:17,000
Speaker 3: That's as far as I know. That's that's all, like

1281
01:01:17,040 --> 01:01:18,680
Speaker 3: I think it got. So she went to the judge

1282
01:01:18,680 --> 01:01:22,560
Speaker 3: and the judge said, like, it seems like there could

1283
01:01:22,600 --> 01:01:25,520
Speaker 3: be some probation violations here, you know, I said, there

1284
01:01:25,600 --> 01:01:28,720
Speaker 3: is a there is like a provision in the probation

1285
01:01:28,920 --> 01:01:32,720
Speaker 3: that she needs to it's it's like, if we find

1286
01:01:32,720 --> 01:01:35,280
Speaker 3: that you are a threat to society, you have to

1287
01:01:35,320 --> 01:01:39,840
Speaker 3: inform people that you are convicted fraud. So that's what

1288
01:01:39,840 --> 01:01:42,360
Speaker 3: they're addressing right now. But in that hearing, the judge said,

1289
01:01:42,880 --> 01:01:44,520
Speaker 3: you know, I got because justice was there. Then I

1290
01:01:44,520 --> 01:01:47,200
Speaker 3: got a court transcript, and it's it was a banana's

1291
01:01:47,280 --> 01:01:50,000
Speaker 3: hearing because Leona tries to defend herself at some point,

1292
01:01:50,200 --> 01:01:52,040
Speaker 3: Wheah just isn't having it. Wow.

1293
01:01:52,720 --> 01:01:55,480
Speaker 5: Yeah, she just dismissed her like it was kind of

1294
01:01:55,680 --> 01:01:57,640
Speaker 5: it was kind of incredible to watch. And I was

1295
01:01:57,680 --> 01:02:00,320
Speaker 5: telling Jennings, I took like fourteen pages of no and

1296
01:02:00,360 --> 01:02:02,400
Speaker 5: like there's certain parts in my notebook where I'm like,

1297
01:02:02,800 --> 01:02:05,160
Speaker 5: this is amazing. Oh my god. The judge is not

1298
01:02:05,200 --> 01:02:07,960
Speaker 5: buying her shit, Like it's just because you can tell

1299
01:02:07,960 --> 01:02:11,000
Speaker 5: like she's rambling and it's the same rhetoric that she

1300
01:02:11,080 --> 01:02:13,959
Speaker 5: said in person in the court room that she says

1301
01:02:14,000 --> 01:02:16,919
Speaker 5: online like I'm this and I'm an advocate, and I'm

1302
01:02:16,960 --> 01:02:19,200
Speaker 5: getting a PhD. And I'm all of these things and

1303
01:02:19,240 --> 01:02:21,360
Speaker 5: I'm doing all of these things and look how amazing

1304
01:02:21,400 --> 01:02:23,600
Speaker 5: I am. And the judge is sort of like sitting

1305
01:02:23,640 --> 01:02:25,840
Speaker 5: there looking at her, like Okay, well enough of that

1306
01:02:26,120 --> 01:02:28,400
Speaker 5: and let's get on to what we're actually here to

1307
01:02:28,440 --> 01:02:28,880
Speaker 5: talk about.

1308
01:02:28,960 --> 01:02:30,320
Speaker 3: You know what she was saying, you know, I have

1309
01:02:30,320 --> 01:02:32,240
Speaker 3: evidence that these men are abusing and she's like, what

1310
01:02:32,280 --> 01:02:34,560
Speaker 3: you have video evidence? Yeah, Like have you not gotten

1311
01:02:34,560 --> 01:02:36,760
Speaker 3: the cops involved? Just like, well, it's not video evidence

1312
01:02:36,800 --> 01:02:38,160
Speaker 3: of that. She's like, I thought you were a lawyer,

1313
01:02:38,520 --> 01:02:40,800
Speaker 3: like why would you? You got to be careful when

1314
01:02:40,840 --> 01:02:42,600
Speaker 3: you say you have evidence, and like you didn't report

1315
01:02:42,600 --> 01:02:44,280
Speaker 3: of the cops, Like what do you? Right? So it

1316
01:02:44,600 --> 01:02:47,800
Speaker 3: was very surreal, but in that hearing, the judge did say, like,

1317
01:02:47,840 --> 01:02:50,640
Speaker 3: you know because like at least I think twenty five

1318
01:02:50,680 --> 01:02:54,600
Speaker 3: people sent victim impact statements yeah, to the probation officer.

1319
01:02:54,680 --> 01:02:57,600
Speaker 3: So those were presented to the judge and she said,

1320
01:02:57,760 --> 01:02:59,720
Speaker 3: if you know these allegations are true, I think they're

1321
01:02:59,840 --> 01:03:03,320
Speaker 3: is you know, there could be criminal charges or something.

1322
01:03:03,960 --> 01:03:06,680
Speaker 3: So I don't know, but it seemed like she sort

1323
01:03:06,680 --> 01:03:10,360
Speaker 3: of alerted other agencies and authorities to start looking into

1324
01:03:10,360 --> 01:03:13,080
Speaker 3: this other stuff. So, you know, as you know, with

1325
01:03:13,240 --> 01:03:16,280
Speaker 3: especially like spiritual abuse and stuff, it's really hard for

1326
01:03:16,520 --> 01:03:18,840
Speaker 3: to take action and the wheels of justice with this

1327
01:03:18,840 --> 01:03:22,280
Speaker 3: are particularly difficult because you know, coercial control it looks

1328
01:03:22,320 --> 01:03:24,640
Speaker 3: like consent and we're finally I think, through neatium and

1329
01:03:24,680 --> 01:03:27,640
Speaker 3: stuff like justice system is finally starting to understand how

1330
01:03:27,640 --> 01:03:31,400
Speaker 3: this works. And you know, educator like educators like you

1331
01:03:31,440 --> 01:03:32,960
Speaker 3: and you know, people who are getting the word out

1332
01:03:32,960 --> 01:03:35,560
Speaker 3: and helping shift the conversation. I think, I mean, it

1333
01:03:35,560 --> 01:03:37,400
Speaker 3: does seem like there was a big shift with this,

1334
01:03:37,880 --> 01:03:41,320
Speaker 3: just seeing how the judge responded, yeah, and clearly knew

1335
01:03:41,360 --> 01:03:43,800
Speaker 3: what was happening, and how like we're going through another

1336
01:03:43,840 --> 01:03:45,920
Speaker 3: satanic panic. I mean, the judge brought up she was like, well,

1337
01:03:45,960 --> 01:03:48,760
Speaker 3: surely you know, like kids can be convinced of things,

1338
01:03:49,240 --> 01:03:51,000
Speaker 3: you know, she was like trying to tell Leanna, like

1339
01:03:51,240 --> 01:03:53,200
Speaker 3: just because you're saying these things doesn't mean they're true.

1340
01:03:53,240 --> 01:03:56,560
Speaker 3: I mean, kids can be easily you know, manipulated. And

1341
01:03:56,960 --> 01:03:58,520
Speaker 3: so it did give me a little hope as someone

1342
01:03:58,520 --> 01:04:01,480
Speaker 3: who's been reporting on this for a while and I

1343
01:04:01,800 --> 01:04:04,000
Speaker 3: and usually it's like you report a story and you're like, hey, no,

1344
01:04:04,000 --> 01:04:05,920
Speaker 3: nobody's gonna do anything with this because this, you know,

1345
01:04:05,960 --> 01:04:08,680
Speaker 3: it's happening on the internet, and you know, like it's

1346
01:04:08,680 --> 01:04:10,600
Speaker 3: hard to figure out like what Teal Swan is doing wrong.

1347
01:04:10,640 --> 01:04:12,320
Speaker 3: And I'm not saying you know tals should go to prison,

1348
01:04:12,360 --> 01:04:15,360
Speaker 3: but I'm you know, I'm a proponent of like transparency

1349
01:04:15,360 --> 01:04:17,600
Speaker 3: when it comes to like religions, especially religions that are

1350
01:04:17,680 --> 01:04:21,560
Speaker 3: using psychology, terminology and diagnosing people. Yeah, I think they

1351
01:04:21,560 --> 01:04:25,680
Speaker 3: should have similar regulations as you know, a therapist. But anyway,

1352
01:04:25,720 --> 01:04:28,480
Speaker 3: it seemed like she the judge is kind of like

1353
01:04:28,640 --> 01:04:31,080
Speaker 3: trying to do what she can within her because all

1354
01:04:31,120 --> 01:04:33,520
Speaker 3: she can do is like rule on her probation. But

1355
01:04:33,680 --> 01:04:35,840
Speaker 3: I think seems like she's aware that there could be

1356
01:04:35,880 --> 01:04:38,160
Speaker 3: more going on, So you know, I'm watching closely and

1357
01:04:38,600 --> 01:04:40,760
Speaker 3: if anything happens, I'll you know, be reporting it.

1358
01:04:40,960 --> 01:04:43,400
Speaker 5: Yeah, and I did get sorry to I did get

1359
01:04:43,400 --> 01:04:45,560
Speaker 5: that vibe when I was there in person, Like I

1360
01:04:45,600 --> 01:04:48,440
Speaker 5: did get the vibe that the judge understands the situation

1361
01:04:48,720 --> 01:04:51,600
Speaker 5: and like it's also the same I don't know if

1362
01:04:51,600 --> 01:04:53,360
Speaker 5: we can say this, but it's the same judge that

1363
01:04:53,880 --> 01:04:59,040
Speaker 5: oversaw Leanna's bankruptcy fraud, So she's fully versed in who

1364
01:04:59,160 --> 01:05:02,680
Speaker 5: Leanna is, what she's doing, Like she's she's up to speed.

1365
01:05:02,760 --> 01:05:05,919
Speaker 5: So being there in person, it was definitely the vibe

1366
01:05:05,920 --> 01:05:08,240
Speaker 5: by God that like people weren't buying what she was

1367
01:05:08,240 --> 01:05:09,280
Speaker 5: trying to sell that's great.

1368
01:05:09,720 --> 01:05:11,600
Speaker 3: I mean that's public information. That's why they brought because

1369
01:05:11,640 --> 01:05:13,520
Speaker 3: she was the same court that handled that and this

1370
01:05:13,600 --> 01:05:16,880
Speaker 3: was related to it. Yeah. Yeah, it just it like

1371
01:05:17,120 --> 01:05:19,520
Speaker 3: also just after a year of talking to people like

1372
01:05:19,720 --> 01:05:22,320
Speaker 3: Justice and so many like ex members and family members

1373
01:05:22,320 --> 01:05:24,240
Speaker 3: that are like felt like they were screaming too the

1374
01:05:24,280 --> 01:05:26,400
Speaker 3: void and nothing is happening, it just felt I think

1375
01:05:26,400 --> 01:05:29,400
Speaker 3: it was so monumental to have like someone in the

1376
01:05:29,440 --> 01:05:33,040
Speaker 3: real world say in some way like this is crazy

1377
01:05:33,200 --> 01:05:35,280
Speaker 3: and I and I've received all these messages in the

1378
01:05:35,320 --> 01:05:38,160
Speaker 3: same story, and so someone in the system is aware

1379
01:05:38,200 --> 01:05:39,680
Speaker 3: and trying to do something. And I think that was

1380
01:05:39,840 --> 01:05:43,200
Speaker 3: just gave everybody that's been in this struggle just up

1381
01:05:43,240 --> 01:05:46,280
Speaker 3: against this this guru who's you know, posting all the

1382
01:05:46,320 --> 01:05:49,400
Speaker 3: information and attacking them online and really good about controlling

1383
01:05:49,440 --> 01:05:51,560
Speaker 3: the narrative in a very Trumpian way. I think it

1384
01:05:51,640 --> 01:05:53,440
Speaker 3: just kind of gave a signal of hope. And it's

1385
01:05:53,480 --> 01:05:57,000
Speaker 3: been so after seeing so much darkness and sadness and

1386
01:05:57,160 --> 01:06:00,440
Speaker 3: kids being you know, affected, it's been one wonderful to

1387
01:06:00,440 --> 01:06:03,120
Speaker 3: see people like feel like they're finally heard and feeling

1388
01:06:03,160 --> 01:06:05,600
Speaker 3: more emboldened to speak out. And now some people who

1389
01:06:05,600 --> 01:06:07,480
Speaker 3: were kind of on the fence with me in the beginning,

1390
01:06:07,560 --> 01:06:09,959
Speaker 3: understandably because you know, you don't know what you're getting into,

1391
01:06:10,280 --> 01:06:13,320
Speaker 3: and nobody wants to be called a pedophile or pedophile

1392
01:06:13,440 --> 01:06:15,760
Speaker 3: enabler online, even if it's just like a you know,

1393
01:06:15,960 --> 01:06:20,560
Speaker 3: on someone's Instagram. It's scary. It's scary. And also it's

1394
01:06:20,600 --> 01:06:22,320
Speaker 3: like a matter of like, if you take the wrong step,

1395
01:06:22,360 --> 01:06:23,880
Speaker 3: you could lose custod of your kids. I mean, that

1396
01:06:23,960 --> 01:06:26,800
Speaker 3: is really scary. But people who were understandably on the

1397
01:06:26,840 --> 01:06:30,400
Speaker 3: fence about helping me with my reporting, now they're finally

1398
01:06:30,520 --> 01:06:32,800
Speaker 3: like in a position where they're ready to talk, and

1399
01:06:32,840 --> 01:06:34,840
Speaker 3: they it's like they feel like the curtain has been

1400
01:06:34,840 --> 01:06:37,080
Speaker 3: pulled on the Wizard and the Wizards still like cranking

1401
01:06:37,080 --> 01:06:39,720
Speaker 3: all the levers, but and like, pay no mind to

1402
01:06:39,840 --> 01:06:42,120
Speaker 3: don't read the article. It's the Beast. It's the evil Beast,

1403
01:06:42,160 --> 01:06:43,680
Speaker 3: you know, because it was published in the Daily Beast.

1404
01:06:43,720 --> 01:06:45,640
Speaker 3: So now she's I think I think they get a

1405
01:06:45,640 --> 01:06:47,200
Speaker 3: lot of that. They're like, this is just the sign

1406
01:06:47,280 --> 01:06:54,320
Speaker 3: of the Luciferian agenda. Weirdly, I mean, look, I have

1407
01:06:54,760 --> 01:06:56,520
Speaker 3: this is not my first rodeo with people who are

1408
01:06:56,520 --> 01:06:59,080
Speaker 3: little chaotic online. I've been called a lot of things

1409
01:06:59,120 --> 01:07:02,480
Speaker 3: and like a way of dismissing my reporting. She's weirdly

1410
01:07:02,560 --> 01:07:07,280
Speaker 3: like stayed away from me. I think because she doesn't

1411
01:07:07,560 --> 01:07:09,120
Speaker 3: I don't know, I don't know. I think maybe she

1412
01:07:09,120 --> 01:07:11,160
Speaker 3: doesn't want to actually read the article and engage, like

1413
01:07:11,200 --> 01:07:13,760
Speaker 3: to see because it's all pretty straightforward, just like you

1414
01:07:13,760 --> 01:07:16,760
Speaker 3: know about her felony and all that. But yeah, no,

1415
01:07:16,920 --> 01:07:20,200
Speaker 3: I think she's kind of, for whatever reasons, stayed away

1416
01:07:20,200 --> 01:07:20,440
Speaker 3: from me.

1417
01:07:20,960 --> 01:07:23,720
Speaker 5: She said about you, but not not too.

1418
01:07:23,840 --> 01:07:26,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, I am a I'm a low frequency bottom feeder.

1419
01:07:26,200 --> 01:07:30,160
Speaker 3: I just like the wall. Yeah, you know, I wrote

1420
01:07:30,200 --> 01:07:32,720
Speaker 3: something about till Swan years ago, and you know she

1421
01:07:32,840 --> 01:07:35,400
Speaker 3: engaged with me because she's also a low frequency bottom

1422
01:07:35,400 --> 01:07:38,640
Speaker 3: feeder and just but like Leanna's above that. So she

1423
01:07:38,680 --> 01:07:40,520
Speaker 3: didn't take my calls or my text because I was

1424
01:07:40,560 --> 01:07:43,040
Speaker 3: trying to get you know, comment or connect with her.

1425
01:07:44,000 --> 01:07:45,920
Speaker 3: But yeah, she she didn't respond.

1426
01:07:46,120 --> 01:07:48,200
Speaker 4: Is Leona's group growing or shrinking?

1427
01:07:48,880 --> 01:07:51,680
Speaker 3: It's hard to say. I mean, she's growing more followers.

1428
01:07:52,000 --> 01:07:53,240
Speaker 3: I don't know how much of that is organic, and

1429
01:07:53,280 --> 01:07:54,360
Speaker 3: I don't know how much of that is just people

1430
01:07:54,400 --> 01:07:56,480
Speaker 3: like that are kind of following along for the show.

1431
01:07:57,040 --> 01:07:58,680
Speaker 4: It is entertaining in a sick way.

1432
01:07:58,800 --> 01:08:02,360
Speaker 2: I'm not following though, Yeah, I don't know online cull

1433
01:08:02,400 --> 01:08:03,479
Speaker 2: leaders just for that reason.

1434
01:08:03,760 --> 01:08:06,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, I feel like just from because you can also

1435
01:08:06,600 --> 01:08:08,960
Speaker 3: see like she'll repost what her followers are saying, and

1436
01:08:08,960 --> 01:08:11,240
Speaker 3: I think it's I think it's becoming more devout and

1437
01:08:11,280 --> 01:08:14,760
Speaker 3: more radical. I don't know if it's growing or getting

1438
01:08:14,800 --> 01:08:16,800
Speaker 3: smaller staying the same, but I I just get the

1439
01:08:16,800 --> 01:08:18,200
Speaker 3: sense it's still kind of in like the one fifty

1440
01:08:18,240 --> 01:08:19,599
Speaker 3: one eighty, like the hardcore group.

1441
01:08:19,960 --> 01:08:22,080
Speaker 5: I will also say I am of the opinion that

1442
01:08:22,120 --> 01:08:24,439
Speaker 5: she is buying followers like you can buy box.

1443
01:08:24,520 --> 01:08:27,200
Speaker 4: I was, Yeah, that's.

1444
01:08:27,000 --> 01:08:29,280
Speaker 5: My opinion, because it seems like she's doing it like

1445
01:08:29,360 --> 01:08:32,200
Speaker 5: a couple hundred at a time, every like few weeks

1446
01:08:32,200 --> 01:08:34,639
Speaker 5: to make it look like, oh, this is natural. I'm

1447
01:08:34,640 --> 01:08:37,040
Speaker 5: gaining these followers just from word of mouth. But I

1448
01:08:37,080 --> 01:08:38,280
Speaker 5: think it's she's buying them.

1449
01:08:38,920 --> 01:08:41,960
Speaker 2: One thing that I think about with regards to like

1450
01:08:42,160 --> 01:08:45,720
Speaker 2: my cultader or whatever, is like, even if she's informing

1451
01:08:46,000 --> 01:08:49,040
Speaker 2: or my former self, you know, self proclaimedrofit, I did,

1452
01:08:49,479 --> 01:08:53,040
Speaker 2: if she's even if she tells everyone that she is

1453
01:08:53,160 --> 01:08:57,559
Speaker 2: a felon, there's always a reason or an explanation or

1454
01:08:57,600 --> 01:09:00,519
Speaker 2: like a you know, a way to mental gymnastic people

1455
01:09:00,560 --> 01:09:03,200
Speaker 2: out of that. So like, hopefully that will be helpful,

1456
01:09:03,200 --> 01:09:06,160
Speaker 2: but for people who are already indoctrinated, it seems likely

1457
01:09:06,200 --> 01:09:06,920
Speaker 2: to not be.

1458
01:09:07,760 --> 01:09:11,160
Speaker 3: It's I mean, it's a classic like with doomsday predictions,

1459
01:09:11,360 --> 01:09:13,160
Speaker 3: you know, and she does do a lot of doomsday stuff.

1460
01:09:13,200 --> 01:09:14,720
Speaker 3: I mean she said like they're going to round you

1461
01:09:14,800 --> 01:09:18,240
Speaker 3: up into concentration camps with the enforce the vaccine, and

1462
01:09:18,280 --> 01:09:21,360
Speaker 3: now that the mandates are kind of clearing up, I mean,

1463
01:09:21,479 --> 01:09:24,200
Speaker 3: what that didn't happen? You know what, That's a classic tactic.

1464
01:09:24,200 --> 01:09:27,479
Speaker 3: I mean it's like you're weeding off the people who

1465
01:09:27,960 --> 01:09:32,000
Speaker 3: are not you're basically making the people who are truly devoted.

1466
01:09:32,320 --> 01:09:35,680
Speaker 3: It's getting more and more radicalized and more insular. And

1467
01:09:35,720 --> 01:09:39,439
Speaker 3: that's where I think it gets really scary, because this

1468
01:09:39,520 --> 01:09:41,519
Speaker 3: is different than any group I'm aware of. I mean,

1469
01:09:41,520 --> 01:09:43,080
Speaker 3: a lot of groups, you they try to cut off

1470
01:09:43,160 --> 01:09:47,080
Speaker 3: family members and make it more insular, like that's classic,

1471
01:09:47,120 --> 01:09:50,439
Speaker 3: but this it's truly like it's almost like emotional terrorism.

1472
01:09:50,520 --> 01:09:52,439
Speaker 3: I mean you have people posting when they snuck in

1473
01:09:52,479 --> 01:09:56,000
Speaker 3: their their parents' house and tore up all the family photos,

1474
01:09:56,400 --> 01:09:59,360
Speaker 3: or like posting online of them lighting their wedding dress

1475
01:09:59,360 --> 01:09:59,719
Speaker 3: on fire.

1476
01:10:00,479 --> 01:10:01,120
Speaker 2: Wow.

1477
01:10:01,640 --> 01:10:02,760
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's devastating.

1478
01:10:03,080 --> 01:10:05,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, and it's just like freaky, you know, seeing that

1479
01:10:05,320 --> 01:10:07,600
Speaker 3: stuff online, You're like what this is? Yeah, it's like

1480
01:10:07,760 --> 01:10:10,000
Speaker 3: you really fear for like where they could go next?

1481
01:10:10,640 --> 01:10:12,320
Speaker 1: Is it for money? I mean, I know she has

1482
01:10:12,400 --> 01:10:15,519
Speaker 1: her new twelve D course. Is these one hundred and

1483
01:10:15,560 --> 01:10:18,439
Speaker 1: fifty people like she just keeps giving them new courses

1484
01:10:18,520 --> 01:10:21,000
Speaker 1: to buy and that's how she's keeping afloat, is.

1485
01:10:21,600 --> 01:10:24,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, anytimes she drops a new you know, she drops

1486
01:10:24,880 --> 01:10:26,840
Speaker 3: a new album, they have to you know, you have

1487
01:10:26,880 --> 01:10:29,400
Speaker 3: to to run to get it. And you know some

1488
01:10:29,479 --> 01:10:30,800
Speaker 3: will be like I listened to it so many times.

1489
01:10:30,840 --> 01:10:32,519
Speaker 3: I just bought it again because I felt like I

1490
01:10:32,560 --> 01:10:34,880
Speaker 3: needed to. And there's a real like they're all trying

1491
01:10:34,920 --> 01:10:36,719
Speaker 3: to outdo each other, you know, and it's like people

1492
01:10:36,760 --> 01:10:38,760
Speaker 3: do I did sixty six day? Claims? Oh well I

1493
01:10:38,800 --> 01:10:41,120
Speaker 3: did it for seventy seven days. You know, they're all

1494
01:10:41,200 --> 01:10:43,960
Speaker 3: kind of trying to show. So yeah, I think she

1495
01:10:44,000 --> 01:10:46,040
Speaker 3: has a pretty steady full of income. And every time, yeah,

1496
01:10:46,040 --> 01:10:48,559
Speaker 3: she drops like twelve D business school or a new course,

1497
01:10:48,680 --> 01:10:50,360
Speaker 3: they all race to get it. I just heard that

1498
01:10:50,400 --> 01:10:52,599
Speaker 3: there was kind of a big like I did it

1499
01:10:52,680 --> 01:10:54,160
Speaker 3: out doing each other. I don't know how many days,

1500
01:10:54,200 --> 01:10:56,200
Speaker 3: but yeah, I think people because she says sixty six

1501
01:10:56,200 --> 01:10:57,960
Speaker 3: and then some people. I think when even further.

1502
01:10:57,840 --> 01:11:00,679
Speaker 4: I yeah, I worry about the health of these people.

1503
01:11:00,720 --> 01:11:02,439
Speaker 4: That is, it's very dangerous.

1504
01:11:02,800 --> 01:11:05,679
Speaker 5: It's the biggest one of the biggest concerns. She also has.

1505
01:11:05,800 --> 01:11:08,080
Speaker 5: She's also an artist. I don't know if you knew

1506
01:11:08,080 --> 01:11:08,479
Speaker 5: that as well.

1507
01:11:10,200 --> 01:11:15,280
Speaker 1: See some paintings online, some paintings correct, Yeah.

1508
01:11:15,160 --> 01:11:18,160
Speaker 5: Yeah, thousands of dollars and people like put these up

1509
01:11:18,200 --> 01:11:19,519
Speaker 5: in their houses like shrines.

1510
01:11:19,680 --> 01:11:22,040
Speaker 2: Our producer just wrote in our notes Hitler was a painter.

1511
01:11:25,200 --> 01:11:28,080
Speaker 2: I want justice to happen, and I'm like, I wish

1512
01:11:28,120 --> 01:11:30,080
Speaker 2: these dads could if there was a way for them

1513
01:11:30,120 --> 01:11:33,120
Speaker 2: to kind of unite and do you know, class action

1514
01:11:33,240 --> 01:11:35,960
Speaker 2: lawsuit or whatever. There's got to be some way because

1515
01:11:36,000 --> 01:11:41,320
Speaker 2: clearly she's making illegal things happen, even if it's strategically

1516
01:11:41,320 --> 01:11:41,879
Speaker 2: and indirectly.

1517
01:11:41,960 --> 01:11:44,400
Speaker 3: I think it's getting there. I mean, as justice knows.

1518
01:11:44,439 --> 01:11:46,040
Speaker 3: I mean this, a lot of these family members are

1519
01:11:46,040 --> 01:11:51,040
Speaker 3: mobilizing and becoming more encouraged. She she does seem to.

1520
01:11:51,080 --> 01:11:54,360
Speaker 3: I mean, she'll she'll threaten lawsuits and try to silence people.

1521
01:11:54,479 --> 01:11:56,400
Speaker 3: Just I think it's a like, you know, she's a lawyer.

1522
01:11:56,439 --> 01:11:59,800
Speaker 3: Is the fear tactic. But I feel hopeful. I think

1523
01:11:59,840 --> 01:12:01,719
Speaker 3: that things are changing. I mean, none of the stuff

1524
01:12:01,760 --> 01:12:05,040
Speaker 3: ever happens as fast as you want it, but the

1525
01:12:05,080 --> 01:12:07,080
Speaker 3: rumblings I'm hearing and I just I get a sense

1526
01:12:07,120 --> 01:12:09,960
Speaker 3: that there will be some sense of justice. I'm hopeful.

1527
01:12:10,200 --> 01:12:13,439
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean largely thanks to YouTube. You know, like

1528
01:12:14,200 --> 01:12:17,280
Speaker 2: what is the beating, the sounding, the eating, the drum beating,

1529
01:12:17,320 --> 01:12:21,000
Speaker 2: the drum sounding, the bell sounding, the horn honking, the

1530
01:12:21,000 --> 01:12:24,559
Speaker 2: horn ringing, the bell making noise, making noise about it.

1531
01:12:24,600 --> 01:12:25,479
Speaker 2: You're doing great work.

1532
01:12:25,720 --> 01:12:28,280
Speaker 5: Thank you. I was also I was going to say,

1533
01:12:28,360 --> 01:12:31,120
Speaker 5: like for me, I found such a good sense of

1534
01:12:31,240 --> 01:12:35,719
Speaker 5: community in the Instagram group, so like the Leana Shanti

1535
01:12:35,800 --> 01:12:40,360
Speaker 5: Cult Recovery group and the reddit, like just just being

1536
01:12:40,400 --> 01:12:42,960
Speaker 5: able to talk to other people who have gone through

1537
01:12:43,120 --> 01:12:45,880
Speaker 5: and are going through the same things. It's it's been

1538
01:12:46,439 --> 01:12:49,800
Speaker 5: so helpful because otherwise, when you try to have conversations

1539
01:12:49,800 --> 01:12:52,320
Speaker 5: with people and explain to them this is what's happening

1540
01:12:52,320 --> 01:12:54,000
Speaker 5: and this is a situation, they look at you like

1541
01:12:54,040 --> 01:12:54,559
Speaker 5: you're crazy.

1542
01:12:54,680 --> 01:12:56,519
Speaker 4: Yeah, you have to because it's variening and.

1543
01:12:57,320 --> 01:13:00,280
Speaker 5: Right right, which would take like a week to fully

1544
01:13:00,320 --> 01:13:03,439
Speaker 5: explain it. But I will say, like it's been such

1545
01:13:03,439 --> 01:13:05,640
Speaker 5: a good support network to have these people that are

1546
01:13:05,680 --> 01:13:08,040
Speaker 5: going through the same thing at the same time, and

1547
01:13:08,080 --> 01:13:10,160
Speaker 5: we you know, you all kind of rally around each

1548
01:13:10,160 --> 01:13:13,559
Speaker 5: other and offer support wherever you can. So for anybody

1549
01:13:13,600 --> 01:13:16,439
Speaker 5: that's like not sure where to go or is unsure

1550
01:13:16,560 --> 01:13:20,080
Speaker 5: a little bit confused, just like reach out to them

1551
01:13:20,120 --> 01:13:23,120
Speaker 5: because it's been for me anyway personally, it's been such

1552
01:13:23,160 --> 01:13:26,200
Speaker 5: a such a blessing throughout this whole process.

1553
01:13:26,520 --> 01:13:28,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, so that's the what's that Instagram?

1554
01:13:29,240 --> 01:13:33,479
Speaker 5: It is Lee? I think it's Leanna Shanty Underscore Cult,

1555
01:13:33,680 --> 01:13:35,040
Speaker 5: Underscore Recovery.

1556
01:13:35,320 --> 01:13:38,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that shanty is l I A n A

1557
01:13:38,640 --> 01:13:41,080
Speaker 2: s h A n T I right, you got it.

1558
01:13:41,160 --> 01:13:43,439
Speaker 3: Yeah, Yeah, that's like, yeah, it's like a core group

1559
01:13:43,479 --> 01:13:44,840
Speaker 3: of of it's I mean, it's the closest thing to

1560
01:13:44,880 --> 01:13:46,639
Speaker 3: a support network. I mean it's kind of I've seen

1561
01:13:46,680 --> 01:13:51,400
Speaker 3: it sort of form over the last year where it's

1562
01:13:51,439 --> 01:13:54,280
Speaker 3: kind of like a ragtag team of investigators and now

1563
01:13:54,400 --> 01:13:57,960
Speaker 3: they're they're much more organized, and you know, and they

1564
01:13:58,080 --> 01:14:01,240
Speaker 3: they they that everybody as they come in to make

1565
01:14:01,280 --> 01:14:03,840
Speaker 3: sure it's not like a plant or something. But but

1566
01:14:03,880 --> 01:14:06,479
Speaker 3: they're really it's like, yeah, it's like the group that's

1567
01:14:06,560 --> 01:14:08,840
Speaker 3: I think doing kind of and and helped give me

1568
01:14:08,920 --> 01:14:10,519
Speaker 3: a lot of information and trying to understand what was

1569
01:14:10,560 --> 01:14:12,439
Speaker 3: going on and how to like condense it into a

1570
01:14:12,520 --> 01:14:16,360
Speaker 3: story that they could share that you know, it's such

1571
01:14:16,360 --> 01:14:18,360
Speaker 3: a wild thing. I think it's it's good to finally

1572
01:14:18,360 --> 01:14:20,120
Speaker 3: have like it all condenced to a story that like

1573
01:14:20,439 --> 01:14:22,920
Speaker 3: these people can present in court to show like, I

1574
01:14:22,960 --> 01:14:24,880
Speaker 3: know my story's crazy, but it's a part of a pattern.

1575
01:14:25,840 --> 01:14:27,519
Speaker 3: But yeah, so I think, you know, anybody who wants

1576
01:14:27,520 --> 01:14:30,280
Speaker 3: to Several people have come to me and they're like,

1577
01:14:30,439 --> 01:14:32,200
Speaker 3: how do I get in touch with other people in

1578
01:14:32,240 --> 01:14:34,240
Speaker 3: my situation? And that's the close thing I know to

1579
01:14:34,280 --> 01:14:37,840
Speaker 3: a support group that Leona Shanti Cult Recovery Instagram. But

1580
01:14:37,880 --> 01:14:40,640
Speaker 3: if anybody wants to reach out to me, you know

1581
01:14:40,720 --> 01:14:44,720
Speaker 3: on Instagram or Twitter at t Jennings Brown or my

1582
01:14:45,080 --> 01:14:49,160
Speaker 3: email is Jennings Brown at ProtonMail dot com. I'm happy.

1583
01:14:49,160 --> 01:14:51,320
Speaker 3: You know. I'm gonna be reporting this as long as

1584
01:14:51,360 --> 01:14:54,600
Speaker 3: I need to and with updates, and I'll probably be

1585
01:14:54,600 --> 01:14:57,080
Speaker 3: posting stuff on Twitter's they if the things that evolve

1586
01:14:57,320 --> 01:15:01,160
Speaker 3: more quickly, but I I can kind of also connect

1587
01:15:01,200 --> 01:15:04,360
Speaker 3: people to this cult recovery group if they need to.

1588
01:15:04,560 --> 01:15:07,240
Speaker 3: But but yeah, it's a freaky thing and people keep

1589
01:15:07,240 --> 01:15:09,799
Speaker 3: coming out in the woodwork and the story keeps getting crazier.

1590
01:15:09,840 --> 01:15:11,720
Speaker 3: I mean, there's so much stuff that it's like you

1591
01:15:11,760 --> 01:15:13,519
Speaker 3: think you understand it and then more stuff comes out

1592
01:15:13,560 --> 01:15:15,040
Speaker 3: and like, what the fuck is going on?

1593
01:15:15,439 --> 01:15:17,400
Speaker 2: Justice, So, how long has it been since you've had

1594
01:15:17,479 --> 01:15:19,719
Speaker 2: contact with your Leana follower?

1595
01:15:19,800 --> 01:15:22,880
Speaker 5: It's been about two years, So like the rest of

1596
01:15:22,960 --> 01:15:25,439
Speaker 5: the family members, the other family members, I was also

1597
01:15:25,479 --> 01:15:29,880
Speaker 5: cut off because I and I don't pass judgment, but

1598
01:15:29,960 --> 01:15:32,000
Speaker 5: like I'm vaccinated, so I think that was part of it.

1599
01:15:32,800 --> 01:15:36,600
Speaker 5: And also just because I'm not in support obviously of

1600
01:15:37,360 --> 01:15:40,000
Speaker 5: Leanna Shanty and what she's doing. So yeah, it's been

1601
01:15:40,040 --> 01:15:40,760
Speaker 5: a couple of years.

1602
01:15:41,040 --> 01:15:43,559
Speaker 2: And is there anything that you wish you could say

1603
01:15:43,800 --> 01:15:46,679
Speaker 2: to her if if she were to hear this interview.

1604
01:15:47,439 --> 01:15:50,799
Speaker 5: I think from like doing my own research and figuring

1605
01:15:50,840 --> 01:15:54,639
Speaker 5: some things out, is like I do understand how people

1606
01:15:54,680 --> 01:15:57,519
Speaker 5: get involved in this. It's not like people don't go

1607
01:15:57,600 --> 01:16:01,240
Speaker 5: into these situations thinking I'm going to go into a cult.

1608
01:16:02,120 --> 01:16:05,680
Speaker 5: So I have some I have compassion and some understanding,

1609
01:16:05,760 --> 01:16:07,840
Speaker 5: but there's also a part of me. That's like, even

1610
01:16:07,840 --> 01:16:10,920
Speaker 5: though you're being manipulated and brainwashed, there still has to

1611
01:16:10,960 --> 01:16:14,439
Speaker 5: be some accountability for your actions. Like with the children,

1612
01:16:14,920 --> 01:16:17,040
Speaker 5: that's the hardest part for me is seeing these children

1613
01:16:17,080 --> 01:16:20,920
Speaker 5: be manipulated. So for the adults, it's like you kind

1614
01:16:21,000 --> 01:16:22,800
Speaker 5: of have a sense of what you're doing, and so

1615
01:16:22,840 --> 01:16:25,960
Speaker 5: there has to be some sense of accountability. So yeah,

1616
01:16:25,960 --> 01:16:27,760
Speaker 5: I think I would just tell her like I understand,

1617
01:16:28,439 --> 01:16:30,880
Speaker 5: and I would take her back with open arms if she,

1618
01:16:31,240 --> 01:16:33,479
Speaker 5: you know, one day, decides to leave. But there also

1619
01:16:33,520 --> 01:16:35,920
Speaker 5: has to be this for me anyway, this sense of

1620
01:16:35,920 --> 01:16:39,519
Speaker 5: accountability for what your part is in all of it.

1621
01:16:40,360 --> 01:16:44,200
Speaker 5: Leanne's the puppet master, but like you know, there's still

1622
01:16:44,240 --> 01:16:46,439
Speaker 5: there's still people that are that are doing things that

1623
01:16:46,479 --> 01:16:48,280
Speaker 5: are not right, and so there has to be some

1624
01:16:48,320 --> 01:16:49,360
Speaker 5: sense of accountability.

1625
01:16:49,439 --> 01:16:51,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I will say that the ex members I've

1626
01:16:51,720 --> 01:16:54,960
Speaker 3: spoken to, they all I think are trying, are working

1627
01:16:55,040 --> 01:16:57,439
Speaker 3: to fix things and take accountability. And I think that

1628
01:16:57,479 --> 01:17:00,600
Speaker 3: takes a lot of courage and self awareness, and it

1629
01:17:00,640 --> 01:17:02,760
Speaker 3: gives me hope for the women that are deep in

1630
01:17:02,800 --> 01:17:04,880
Speaker 3: it or the people who are deep in it. But yeah,

1631
01:17:04,880 --> 01:17:06,880
Speaker 3: the people I talked to, they're like, I did these

1632
01:17:06,920 --> 01:17:09,920
Speaker 3: things I hurt my family. I'm working to fix things,

1633
01:17:11,720 --> 01:17:13,519
Speaker 3: and I did it, but I would not have done

1634
01:17:13,560 --> 01:17:15,439
Speaker 3: it if if, like I hadn't gotten caught up in

1635
01:17:15,479 --> 01:17:18,439
Speaker 3: this web of this person who is like instigating this stuff.

1636
01:17:19,240 --> 01:17:22,000
Speaker 3: So I really respect that. But but yeah, so you know,

1637
01:17:22,040 --> 01:17:23,599
Speaker 3: that's kind of a glimmer of hope to people who

1638
01:17:23,600 --> 01:17:25,439
Speaker 3: are deep in it and wondering if they've completely lost

1639
01:17:25,439 --> 01:17:27,320
Speaker 3: their loved ones forever. I mean, I have seen people

1640
01:17:27,360 --> 01:17:30,080
Speaker 3: come to the other side even stronger, and you know,

1641
01:17:30,120 --> 01:17:32,120
Speaker 3: I think in some ways, you know, can there It's

1642
01:17:32,120 --> 01:17:35,320
Speaker 3: helped me, there's their family stronger, just that they have

1643
01:17:35,400 --> 01:17:36,800
Speaker 3: gone through a difficult time.

1644
01:17:38,520 --> 01:17:39,519
Speaker 4: We see a.

1645
01:17:39,479 --> 01:17:42,200
Speaker 2: Lot that people will struggle with leaving a cult because

1646
01:17:42,240 --> 01:17:44,720
Speaker 2: they don't know if they have any community left for

1647
01:17:44,800 --> 01:17:46,400
Speaker 2: them on the outside. They don't know if they'll be

1648
01:17:46,400 --> 01:17:49,519
Speaker 2: accepted because they have done things that they're ashamed of.

1649
01:17:49,600 --> 01:17:52,759
Speaker 2: But you're saying there is a community that would accept

1650
01:17:52,800 --> 01:17:55,680
Speaker 2: people who are willing to leave and take that responsibility.

1651
01:17:55,840 --> 01:17:57,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I feel like that's also changing with these

1652
01:17:57,920 --> 01:18:00,519
Speaker 3: podcasts and awareness, people are more understanding of link it

1653
01:18:00,520 --> 01:18:03,960
Speaker 3: can happen to anybody. Yeah, And but yeah, it is.

1654
01:18:04,000 --> 01:18:05,840
Speaker 3: It is hard when you change your name, Like, you know,

1655
01:18:05,920 --> 01:18:08,200
Speaker 3: I one person I spoke to, you know, she had

1656
01:18:08,200 --> 01:18:10,040
Speaker 3: to legally change her name, and now going back, I

1657
01:18:10,040 --> 01:18:11,880
Speaker 3: mean it was it's kind of there is a little

1658
01:18:11,920 --> 01:18:14,360
Speaker 3: embarrassment there of like wait, you change your name again

1659
01:18:14,400 --> 01:18:16,400
Speaker 3: after a year, Like you know, it's so it's like

1660
01:18:16,400 --> 01:18:18,360
Speaker 3: all those things that make it feel very real, and

1661
01:18:18,400 --> 01:18:20,120
Speaker 3: you know, you're committing to the cause, so it's harder

1662
01:18:20,120 --> 01:18:23,240
Speaker 3: to uncommit. But yeah, and that's my advice to I

1663
01:18:23,240 --> 01:18:26,320
Speaker 3: think what what Justice said, I hope more people, more

1664
01:18:26,360 --> 01:18:29,559
Speaker 3: people take that approach, like, look, you're not You're gonna

1665
01:18:29,560 --> 01:18:31,920
Speaker 3: have to like prove that you really are willing to

1666
01:18:32,360 --> 01:18:34,960
Speaker 3: fix things. But but you know, I hope you know

1667
01:18:35,479 --> 01:18:37,240
Speaker 3: there they'll still be welcome with open arms, and I

1668
01:18:37,240 --> 01:18:40,439
Speaker 3: imagine justice with your everything to help, you know, help

1669
01:18:40,479 --> 01:18:42,400
Speaker 3: that person get back to where they need to be.

1670
01:18:42,439 --> 01:18:44,240
Speaker 4: Thank you so much for shedding light on this.

1671
01:18:44,240 --> 01:18:49,720
Speaker 1: This is really really terrible and interesting all at the

1672
01:18:49,760 --> 01:18:50,240
Speaker 1: same time.

1673
01:18:50,479 --> 01:18:52,840
Speaker 2: I cannot wait for more to come out and more

1674
01:18:53,000 --> 01:18:55,680
Speaker 2: justice to hopefully be served at some point. And we're

1675
01:18:55,680 --> 01:18:58,520
Speaker 2: going to link to your article Jennings in the description.

1676
01:18:59,400 --> 01:19:03,880
Speaker 2: Are there any other accounts or can people find both

1677
01:19:03,920 --> 01:19:05,960
Speaker 2: of you individually on social media.

1678
01:19:05,600 --> 01:19:07,639
Speaker 3: You can follow it. Like I said before, T Jennings Brown,

1679
01:19:08,120 --> 01:19:10,720
Speaker 3: I'll be posting updates there or any new articles and

1680
01:19:10,760 --> 01:19:12,800
Speaker 3: if you have a tip, you know, follow it. H

1681
01:19:13,120 --> 01:19:17,200
Speaker 3: Jennings Brown at ProtonMail dot com. Also about to launch

1682
01:19:17,200 --> 01:19:19,799
Speaker 3: a substack where I'll be kind of posting other updates

1683
01:19:19,840 --> 01:19:21,760
Speaker 3: there that I can't get you know, I don't have

1684
01:19:21,760 --> 01:19:25,000
Speaker 3: time to get placed to a publication, right, So yeah,

1685
01:19:25,040 --> 01:19:28,320
Speaker 3: if you want to follow my weird adventures. But yeah,

1686
01:19:28,360 --> 01:19:31,960
Speaker 3: I think again, the the Leona Shanti Cult Recovery Instagram

1687
01:19:32,000 --> 01:19:33,720
Speaker 3: page is I think the best way to connect with

1688
01:19:33,720 --> 01:19:35,879
Speaker 3: other people, which.

1689
01:19:35,720 --> 01:19:40,360
Speaker 5: Again is at Leanna Shanty Underscore called Underscore Recovery cool.

1690
01:19:40,479 --> 01:19:40,919
Speaker 4: Perfect.

1691
01:19:40,960 --> 01:19:44,679
Speaker 2: Well, thank you both so much for joining us, and yeah,

1692
01:19:45,040 --> 01:19:46,080
Speaker 2: keep everyone updated.

1693
01:19:46,120 --> 01:19:49,920
Speaker 3: Thanks for helping shed light on this very weird thing. Yeah,

1694
01:19:49,960 --> 01:19:51,679
Speaker 3: thank you for all the other very weird things.

1695
01:19:52,880 --> 01:19:55,080
Speaker 5: I appreciate the time to tell a little bit of

1696
01:19:55,120 --> 01:19:56,719
Speaker 5: my story, so thank you so much.

1697
01:19:56,880 --> 01:20:00,000
Speaker 2: Okay, well that concludes that for now. We will hope

1698
01:20:00,120 --> 01:20:02,960
Speaker 2: we hear more from the story very soon and maybe

1699
01:20:02,960 --> 01:20:06,040
Speaker 2: even some additional guests, so stay tuned.

1700
01:20:06,479 --> 01:20:08,880
Speaker 4: Before before we wrap up here, Megan, I would love.

1701
01:20:08,800 --> 01:20:13,120
Speaker 2: To know would you join the Leana Schanti cult Online cult.

1702
01:20:13,320 --> 01:20:14,799
Speaker 4: Yep, tell me why.

1703
01:20:14,920 --> 01:20:16,600
Speaker 1: I mean, if you got in with me with a

1704
01:20:16,680 --> 01:20:18,920
Speaker 1: cleanse and I actually followed through and did it and

1705
01:20:18,960 --> 01:20:21,720
Speaker 1: started feeling really good. And then she she sends you

1706
01:20:22,439 --> 01:20:25,720
Speaker 1: all of these like sound things that you're supposed to

1707
01:20:25,760 --> 01:20:28,880
Speaker 1: listen to. I love a good homework assignment. I could

1708
01:20:28,960 --> 01:20:32,280
Speaker 1: really do with like checking that off my list every day.

1709
01:20:33,840 --> 01:20:36,680
Speaker 1: I've been known, you know, to be fair. This is

1710
01:20:36,920 --> 01:20:40,040
Speaker 1: pre podcast Megan that I'm speaking about. But I've been

1711
01:20:40,080 --> 01:20:46,599
Speaker 1: known to trust a psychics a little bit too much, So,

1712
01:20:47,360 --> 01:20:49,040
Speaker 1: you know, all put together.

1713
01:20:49,080 --> 01:20:50,880
Speaker 4: I could, you know, you know what.

1714
01:20:51,000 --> 01:20:54,559
Speaker 1: Also, I have a very doomsday part of me that

1715
01:20:54,880 --> 01:20:56,800
Speaker 1: I just read an article about a couple living in

1716
01:20:56,840 --> 01:20:59,519
Speaker 1: a bunker in the middle of nowhere, like underground, and

1717
01:20:59,880 --> 01:21:01,000
Speaker 1: I wanted to live there.

1718
01:21:01,160 --> 01:21:04,880
Speaker 2: Oh, I mean AI has made me, Yeah, I want

1719
01:21:04,920 --> 01:21:06,200
Speaker 2: to feel like I need to go to the woods

1720
01:21:06,200 --> 01:21:08,559
Speaker 2: and I want to live in a bunker under the ground.

1721
01:21:08,840 --> 01:21:11,559
Speaker 1: I was like, well, I could actually sleep soundly there.

1722
01:21:12,400 --> 01:21:15,679
Speaker 1: So her telling me to move to Florida to Destiny Manor,

1723
01:21:15,720 --> 01:21:18,000
Speaker 1: You'll be safe. It's just and then you get to

1724
01:21:18,040 --> 01:21:22,960
Speaker 1: live with other people who supposedly are supportive women and yeah,

1725
01:21:23,080 --> 01:21:24,960
Speaker 1: doing the hard work, and I guess one man, they

1726
01:21:24,960 --> 01:21:28,360
Speaker 1: said as well, But you know this is something that

1727
01:21:28,439 --> 01:21:30,200
Speaker 1: could probably sleeep in there.

1728
01:21:30,320 --> 01:21:32,720
Speaker 4: I could see it. I could see it. Not not

1729
01:21:33,120 --> 01:21:35,519
Speaker 4: my style. She is so crazy.

1730
01:21:35,680 --> 01:21:37,519
Speaker 1: She reminds me of Glory Gifford, which I was like,

1731
01:21:37,840 --> 01:21:40,639
Speaker 1: uh no, so I do think her personality would turn

1732
01:21:40,680 --> 01:21:41,599
Speaker 1: me off, but but.

1733
01:21:41,600 --> 01:21:43,479
Speaker 4: You never meet her in person, so I know.

1734
01:21:43,560 --> 01:21:46,000
Speaker 1: But the stuff she posts online is like crazy. It

1735
01:21:46,080 --> 01:21:48,719
Speaker 1: is as soon as she outed somebody's secret, I would

1736
01:21:48,720 --> 01:21:52,440
Speaker 1: be like, oh, you're a bad person. But without her narcissistic,

1737
01:21:52,800 --> 01:21:56,880
Speaker 1: like complete malignant outside, if she kept that at Bay,

1738
01:21:57,040 --> 01:21:57,800
Speaker 1: I could get in.

1739
01:21:58,720 --> 01:22:01,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, she's she's not my style, but she has

1740
01:22:01,960 --> 01:22:06,000
Speaker 2: enough of these like branches that I could see resonating that.

1741
01:22:06,040 --> 01:22:08,080
Speaker 2: If she just seemed like a little bit less crazy,

1742
01:22:09,000 --> 01:22:11,599
Speaker 2: I could see it for sure. Like like we talked

1743
01:22:11,600 --> 01:22:13,719
Speaker 2: about in the interview, and I know that I should

1744
01:22:13,720 --> 01:22:16,639
Speaker 2: make this brief more brief, but like we talked about

1745
01:22:16,640 --> 01:22:18,880
Speaker 2: in the interview, like you know, I've been online trying

1746
01:22:18,880 --> 01:22:20,400
Speaker 2: to figure out what the fuck is happening to my

1747
01:22:20,439 --> 01:22:23,439
Speaker 2: body before, and I've been online being like, how do

1748
01:22:23,479 --> 01:22:25,920
Speaker 2: you recover from a relationship with someone who made you

1749
01:22:26,000 --> 01:22:30,080
Speaker 2: question your reality? Like these things are very you know,

1750
01:22:30,320 --> 01:22:34,240
Speaker 2: legitimate paths on the internet that women go down. I

1751
01:22:34,240 --> 01:22:37,400
Speaker 2: mean people go down, but like the wrong person in

1752
01:22:37,479 --> 01:22:39,280
Speaker 2: there at the wrong time and be very easy to

1753
01:22:39,880 --> 01:22:40,720
Speaker 2: you know, get sucked in.

1754
01:22:40,960 --> 01:22:42,920
Speaker 4: Yep. How long do you think you could make it

1755
01:22:42,920 --> 01:22:45,400
Speaker 4: on a sixty six day juice cleanse if I if

1756
01:22:45,439 --> 01:22:49,479
Speaker 4: I resolved for it sixty six days, I cannot go

1757
01:22:49,560 --> 01:22:51,479
Speaker 4: more than four hours without eating.

1758
01:22:52,040 --> 01:22:55,200
Speaker 2: Yeah. Jack comments on it all the time. He doesn't

1759
01:22:55,240 --> 01:22:56,360
Speaker 2: understand what's wrong with me.

1760
01:22:57,000 --> 01:22:59,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, I did a ten day one once.

1761
01:22:59,640 --> 01:23:01,640
Speaker 4: That's that seems bonkers to me.

1762
01:23:02,240 --> 01:23:05,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is bonkers. I wouldn't do that now. Yeah,

1763
01:23:05,040 --> 01:23:06,000
Speaker 1: I don't think that's good.

1764
01:23:06,120 --> 01:23:07,919
Speaker 4: Yeah, it seems pretty unhealthy.

1765
01:23:09,520 --> 01:23:11,559
Speaker 2: I think I could make it like well, when I

1766
01:23:11,600 --> 01:23:14,000
Speaker 2: was a kid and we had to fast once a month,

1767
01:23:14,080 --> 01:23:14,720
Speaker 2: I could make it.

1768
01:23:14,720 --> 01:23:22,200
Speaker 4: Like twelve hours. Congratulations. Don't do these cleanses, you guys.

1769
01:23:22,479 --> 01:23:25,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, and especially don't do them for sixty six days.

1770
01:23:25,360 --> 01:23:27,120
Speaker 4: You might die. Okay, and that's it.

1771
01:23:27,200 --> 01:23:30,320
Speaker 1: Well, thanks so much for listening this week. As always,

1772
01:23:30,400 --> 01:23:31,560
Speaker 1: leave us a comment.

1773
01:23:31,439 --> 01:23:34,960
Speaker 4: Or five star reviewers and I have a great week.

1774
01:23:35,000 --> 01:23:36,880
Speaker 4: We can't wait to see you again next time.

1775
01:23:36,960 --> 01:23:39,880
Speaker 1: And as always, remember to follow your gut, watch out

1776
01:23:39,880 --> 01:23:42,280
Speaker 1: for red flags, and never ever.

1777
01:23:43,960 --> 01:23:51,360
Speaker 2: By trust Me is produced by Kirsten Woodward, Gabby Rapp

1778
01:23:51,439 --> 01:23:52,920
Speaker 2: and Steve Delemator.

1779
01:23:52,560 --> 01:23:55,160
Speaker 4: With special thanks to Stacy Para and our theme song

1780
01:23:55,240 --> 01:23:56,880
Speaker 4: was composed by Holly amber Church.

1781
01:23:57,040 --> 01:23:59,880
Speaker 1: You can find us on Instagram at trust Me Podcast,

1782
01:24:00,160 --> 01:24:03,439
Speaker 1: Twitter at trust Me Cult Pod, or on TikTok at

1783
01:24:03,520 --> 01:24:05,200
Speaker 1: trust Me Cult Podcast.

1784
01:24:05,360 --> 01:24:08,720
Speaker 4: I'm Ula Lola on Instagram and Ola Lola on Twitter.

1785
01:24:08,439 --> 01:24:12,000
Speaker 1: And I am Megan Elizabeth eleven on Instagram and Abraham

1786
01:24:12,200 --> 01:24:13,240
Speaker 1: Hicks on Twitter.

1787
01:24:13,400 --> 01:24:15,679
Speaker 4: Remember to rate and review and spread the word.