Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Kristin Davis, and I want to know, are
Speaker 1: you a Charlotte? You guys everyone listening, thank you for
Speaker 1: joining us. We are here, and are you a Charlotte
Speaker 1: With incredible Ran van Holt.
Speaker 2: I am so excited to.
Speaker 1: Have him here.
Speaker 3: I am so excited to be here. Thank you, thank you,
Speaker 3: thank you. It's very pleasure.
Speaker 1: It's such a great episode. And plus I just love
Speaker 1: to see you.
Speaker 3: I love to see you too.
Speaker 4: I have such great memories of that period and that
Speaker 4: that moment in our lives and that whole experience, and
Speaker 4: you know a lot of it, you know, had to
Speaker 4: do with you, and you know you just you're one
Speaker 4: of a kind and you're so I'm just so.
Speaker 3: Happy to thank you.
Speaker 1: Let's talk about that time, because I remember that time
Speaker 1: as being that summer. It would have been two thousand,
Speaker 1: right or nineteen ninety nine. Are we still in nineteen.
Speaker 3: Ninety nine, We're in the nineties. We're dating.
Speaker 1: I don't even know if I should say, but like
Speaker 1: I remember talking about nineteen ninety nine. This episode is
Speaker 1: called The Cast System and it aired on August eighth,
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety nine, so we had filmed it like in
Speaker 1: the spring you know, I think right like not too
Speaker 1: far in advance, and I remember like it was kind
Speaker 1: of a glorious year.
Speaker 3: It was the second It was a glorious year. And
Speaker 3: to be in New York in the nineties it was
Speaker 3: special in and of itself.
Speaker 4: And I was in my twenties and being in your
Speaker 4: twenties and in the nineties in New York City, you know,
Speaker 4: beginning and trying to make it as an actor as
Speaker 4: an artist was an incredible an incredible time to be alive.
Speaker 3: I have the fondest, the best memories.
Speaker 4: I have. One of my favorite moments of my not
Speaker 4: just my career but my life was was that time
Speaker 4: in New York time.
Speaker 1: Right, But we had no idea really, you know, I guess,
Speaker 1: which is always true. You don't really know what the time,
Speaker 1: how special it is, no, And I remember right in
Speaker 1: it right to my.
Speaker 4: Parents, my dad, you know, you know say that all
Speaker 4: the time or said that all the time.
Speaker 3: You just don't know.
Speaker 4: How how good we have it or had it until
Speaker 4: it's gone or just yeah, it just it's hard, you know,
Speaker 4: it's it was, yeah, it was, it was. It'sant looking back,
Speaker 4: it was, uh, you know, people don't get it the
Speaker 4: younger generation.
Speaker 3: I tried to.
Speaker 4: Explain to him, I mean, this is before green cell
Speaker 4: phones just came out. I didn't have I mean I
Speaker 4: probably just got a cell phone when we were shooting
Speaker 4: your little flip.
Speaker 2: I get it out as an episode to remember.
Speaker 3: I had, you know, we're going to jump all over
Speaker 3: the place.
Speaker 4: I had a page or so when I when I
Speaker 4: I didn't want to move move back to l A.
Speaker 4: I thought it was gonna be temporary. But I got
Speaker 4: a storage in it and in Manhattan because I thought
Speaker 4: it was going to come back, right, And when I
Speaker 4: went back to finally clean it out not that long ago,
Speaker 4: by the way.
Speaker 2: What.
Speaker 3: I'm like, I'm like, what do I still I'm still
Speaker 3: paying Manhattan or whatever?
Speaker 5: No way, and I got what the hell do I
Speaker 5: have in here? It was like I had, first of
Speaker 5: all two pages, those two pages.
Speaker 4: Poems that I had written and taken back from like
Speaker 4: ex girlfriends and like weird just stuff that notes journals
Speaker 4: and bad furniture.
Speaker 2: Amazing.
Speaker 4: But the pagers, yeah, we were you know, it was
Speaker 4: a different time, meaning we didn't have social media, we
Speaker 4: didn't have cell phone. Cell phone cameras probably just came out,
Speaker 4: but it was more of an innocent free.
Speaker 1: So free you could kind of do anything you wanted
Speaker 1: and no one knew.
Speaker 3: I missed those days.
Speaker 1: Let me ask you what was going on, because this
Speaker 1: is the kind of thing we're like at the time.
Speaker 2: I remember being so excited that we got you.
Speaker 1: I don't know exactly, like we were in the middle
Speaker 1: of the season, and as you know, we would shoot
Speaker 1: really late, and you know, I was really tired, But
Speaker 1: I don't remember, like, what was going on in your career?
Speaker 2: How did did you go to auditions? Did we just
Speaker 2: call you?
Speaker 4: I'm so glad that she asked it, because I was
Speaker 4: trying to remember how that came about. Because the show,
Speaker 4: first of all, to be on your show was such
Speaker 4: a he was such a big deal.
Speaker 3: Everybody wanted to be on it. It is the second season.
Speaker 4: It just you know, obviously everybody knows what happened first
Speaker 4: season right out of the gates. It just as a
Speaker 4: juggernaut cultural like pioneering is very important in amazing show,
Speaker 4: and so it was very competitive within our I'm sure
Speaker 4: across the country, but especially in New York. It's a
Speaker 4: you know, this smaller group of just just a smaller
Speaker 4: group of actors and smaller business in general, but it
Speaker 4: was very competitive to be on your show, and it
Speaker 4: was a big deal get it to to be on
Speaker 4: And I think I had auditioned a couple of.
Speaker 3: Times for other parts, for other parts, and I think
Speaker 3: it was Carrie or who was the casting Kerry Marry,
Speaker 3: Billy Hopkins.
Speaker 4: Yes, good, Yeah, for other parts on the show or
Speaker 4: some other shows. But I you know, it was when
Speaker 4: I first moved, When I moved to New York, that's
Speaker 4: when I really started to work as an actor.
Speaker 3: I can get a job here.
Speaker 2: Amazing, that's so weird.
Speaker 3: And I know I had had to move to New
Speaker 3: York to make it.
Speaker 1: Now, maybe you just look too good because like a
Speaker 1: lot of the good looking actors were here in LA
Speaker 1: it was.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I know I.
Speaker 4: Definitely probably looked a little different or stood out a
Speaker 4: little different than the New York.
Speaker 3: Yeah. But so I had just I didn't really.
Speaker 4: I mean, I had just finished the film with Independent
Speaker 4: Film opposite, you know, Amanda Pete, and I had done
Speaker 4: a few gigs like Homicide.
Speaker 3: I did all the New York.
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, amazing.
Speaker 1: I'd done Homicide was amazing, such a great show.
Speaker 4: I think that's part of that's that's I think that
Speaker 4: character in that role helped get me this job. I
Speaker 4: played the Andrew Kunan of Baltimore. Basically, I was a
Speaker 4: gay hustler killing rich gay men.
Speaker 3: I don't remember this.
Speaker 2: I've got to rewatch Homicide on the Street. Oh my gosh, Brian.
Speaker 4: Well, it's you're laughing too, because I've been so lucky
Speaker 4: and so fortunate to play these characters that have these
Speaker 4: incredible lines or dialogue, and then we'll talk about our phenomenon,
Speaker 4: which I still to this day I hear about it
Speaker 4: to this day.
Speaker 3: I had some great stories. I can't wait to share
Speaker 3: some stories with you.
Speaker 1: But you know, go ahead, go ahead whenever you want
Speaker 1: to stay.
Speaker 4: And we had so much to unpack. But so so anyway, yeah,
Speaker 4: I played that role helped. I think we sent them
Speaker 4: the VHS cassette real to the producer for your to
Speaker 4: your show. And I don't know if I got an offer,
Speaker 4: if I had to audition for this particular role, but
Speaker 4: I remember reading the script and and and and dying
Speaker 4: and going, oh my god.
Speaker 3: Do I really get to do this? Do I really
Speaker 3: get to play this guy? W forward? Yeah, which you
Speaker 3: know we can you probably know more about it than
Speaker 3: I do.
Speaker 1: But I don't. I don't.
Speaker 3: I don't do you. Did you guys have table reads
Speaker 3: back then?
Speaker 1: Yes, we had table reads. I don't remember our table read.
Speaker 3: Though we didn't have one. Okay, I mean the whole
Speaker 3: character and it's hysterical classic. We probably washed it up
Speaker 3: more than we actually talked.
Speaker 2: And the limits I'm sure we did. I have no doubt.
Speaker 1: My face was so redeek.
Speaker 3: That was so funny. Nice to meet you get.
Speaker 2: In the back of the limits, but it wasn't hard.
Speaker 2: It worked out.
Speaker 4: It was so kind by the way you were so
Speaker 4: gracious and welcoming, and to be honest, that was, you know,
Speaker 4: super nervous.
Speaker 3: Did you.
Speaker 2: I could not tell.
Speaker 1: I thought you were so perfectly cast because you were
Speaker 1: having to play a movie star, which is a very hard.
Speaker 3: Thing to do, perfect douchebag movie start.
Speaker 4: No, I am that's prevcate. It's not the apple doesn't
Speaker 4: fall far from the tree.
Speaker 2: That's not true. But you know, it's funny.
Speaker 1: And this is what's funny about rewatching In my mind, right,
Speaker 1: I hadn't remember.
Speaker 2: The douchebag part.
Speaker 3: Really, Yeah, I just.
Speaker 2: Remember that I loved you and you were great.
Speaker 1: I enjoyed kissing you, and it was fun because it
Speaker 1: was a departure from Charlotte's normal storylines, right, and at
Speaker 1: that point she is kind of all over the place
Speaker 1: in certain ways that I also am sometimes like, oh
Speaker 1: my god, I'm doing this and I'm doing that. I
Speaker 1: don't remember, but I remember you very clearly because it
Speaker 1: was so much fun and I thought it was so great.
Speaker 1: And it's really weird to rewatch and see Number one,
Speaker 1: you are such a jerk in the end, your character
Speaker 1: of course not you.
Speaker 2: Like, but I don't remember.
Speaker 1: So I was like, oh my god, I totally forgot
Speaker 1: this entire scene, That entire scene at the restaurant washed
Speaker 1: from my brain. Oh my god, just the happy art
Speaker 1: art scene and the car making and this.
Speaker 4: Gallery scene is hysterical, so great well written. I mean, yes,
Speaker 4: the whole episode in the show in general is it's
Speaker 4: so good.
Speaker 2: It's a good one.
Speaker 3: But I was, you know, yeah, I was really I was,
Speaker 3: you know, nervous.
Speaker 1: No, I just thought you were perfectly past because to me,
Speaker 1: you embody that kind of like really relaxed confidence. I mean,
Speaker 1: you're beautiful, obviously, you're tall and so good looking, but
Speaker 1: don't really.
Speaker 2: Know it and care.
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying, You've got that ease, you know,
Speaker 1: and like at that point, like when I look back
Speaker 1: on it, it seems almost like a Leonardo DiCaprio thing.
Speaker 1: But at the time in our minds, I think it
Speaker 1: was a George Clooney thing or a Brad Pitt thing.
Speaker 4: I think this is my character was loosely based on
Speaker 4: Leo and Toby in the.
Speaker 2: And Toby you can say anything you want.
Speaker 4: I don't even know if this is true. This is
Speaker 4: probably all rumored and hearsay, but pussy Posse you Oh,
Speaker 4: my character Wylie Ford was loosely based on the Pussy
Speaker 4: Posse Shenanigans.
Speaker 3: Okay, that's what I was told.
Speaker 2: Wow, they probably kept that from me so that I
Speaker 2: wouldn't judge it.
Speaker 4: Actually, I'm glad they did. I'm glad they did. But
Speaker 4: you know, I just, you know, I'm like, this is great.
Speaker 4: I get to channel my inner douchebag, and I just
Speaker 4: kind of embraced it. And it was you know, not
Speaker 4: only you know, fulfilling, you know, creatively, but it was
Speaker 4: also very.
Speaker 3: Therapeutic, was it.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, because you know that part of the business,
Speaker 4: you know, I had to really, I still struggle with
Speaker 4: the bit, you know, and especially when I get it, yeah,
Speaker 4: and especially being young. And you know, that's half the
Speaker 4: reason why I left La to move to New York.
Speaker 4: I love La and I love California. I'm a California kid.
Speaker 4: Just a business in New York was more, I think,
Speaker 4: more suited for what I was trying to do. And
Speaker 4: so I have a very strong opinion and judgment about
Speaker 4: certain Hollywood things, you know, and right people, So yeah,
Speaker 4: and so I enjoyed trying to go how can I'd
Speaker 4: be as douchey as possible.
Speaker 3: Something that I don't really care for?
Speaker 2: Definitely, and who would care for that? I mean, it
Speaker 2: is so ick.
Speaker 1: And that's so funny to me that I didn't remember
Speaker 1: that part. But I think I didn't remember that part
Speaker 1: because you're so not that way, right, So, like that
Speaker 1: part was the scene that we.
Speaker 2: Did and we had to be hope Yeah that No,
Speaker 2: you weren't that way in any way, shape or form.
Speaker 1: You were a joy, you know, And so I just
Speaker 1: remember the positives because you know, as an actor, you
Speaker 1: remember the experience of filming more so than the finished product.
Speaker 4: Right, yeah, exactly. You know, that's a good point. It's true. Yeah,
Speaker 4: but you know I did so.
Speaker 3: I did a lot of research for that, for that role,
Speaker 3: just to you know, how did that go? Did you
Speaker 3: learn new things?
Speaker 4: Oh?
Speaker 3: It came out with a few wounds. No, I know,
Speaker 3: I'm just kidding.
Speaker 1: I mean you look, you could have been doing all
Speaker 1: that stuff if you wanted to.
Speaker 2: I mean, seriously, you could have.
Speaker 1: I remember, you were very devoted. You were very devoted boyfriend.
Speaker 1: It was adorable, meaning like at the time, you know,
Speaker 1: you were you were very much not like a player
Speaker 1: or all the things that you were that your part was.
Speaker 2: You were not that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I respected that.
Speaker 2: It was impressive.
Speaker 3: Thank you, You're welcome. Yeah, I mean yeah, well if
Speaker 3: I weren't, I'm definitely a Charlene. I didn't Charlotte. I
Speaker 3: didn't remember that either. He's like, oh my god, he
Speaker 3: just keeps going.
Speaker 1: Me about my wrong name, and I'm just hanging in
Speaker 1: there and the other thing that I didn't remember. And
Speaker 1: then we'll get to the whole show. But like our
Speaker 1: storyline is, it's pretty funny. I have to say, he's
Speaker 1: pretty good and succinct, but so good, you know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying, Like so packed, Like when I call Carrie
Speaker 1: and she literally sits up in bed and says, get
Speaker 1: out of there right now.
Speaker 2: And I completely ignore her, like it is not even
Speaker 2: I'm just like blah blah, blah blah.
Speaker 3: And he's peeing in the alley.
Speaker 2: Isn't that funny?
Speaker 3: He's taking a luke.
Speaker 2: I'm like, it's not adorable.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's Charlotte, like if she taking drugs or
Speaker 1: like it's so interesting and that I had not even
Speaker 1: remembered that you blow pop smoke. And I at the
Speaker 1: same time was trying to navigate our business mostly in LA,
Speaker 1: because I do associate that kind of like weird behavior
Speaker 1: and kind of party vibe and all that with LA
Speaker 1: that was already sober, and I did have kind of
Speaker 1: similar experiences to this, where I'd be at.
Speaker 2: Like a dinner party set up with an actor.
Speaker 1: I could name, but I probably I don't know if
Speaker 1: I should, But like I think it had happened maybe
Speaker 1: the year before this.
Speaker 2: I'm watching it and I'm thinking, did I tell our
Speaker 2: writers this story?
Speaker 3: You know?
Speaker 1: Back then, like we would feel very paranoid, like if
Speaker 1: we talked to the writers that it might end up
Speaker 1: in the show, right, so true, we would try to
Speaker 1: be like, oh they're coming, be quiet, be quiet, if
Speaker 1: we were like talking to each other, you know, chairs.
Speaker 3: Right, that's a great point. It's exactly that does happen.
Speaker 2: It totally does happen.
Speaker 1: And because our writers were always trying to not write
Speaker 1: fictional things like someone I had to know someone or whatever,
Speaker 1: but usually it was their stories which gave us kind
Speaker 1: of the freedom to play them if they weren't our own, right.
Speaker 1: But like I had had an experience with a situation
Speaker 1: where I think a lawyer that I knew had said.
Speaker 2: Oh, should I just tell the story? I should just
Speaker 2: tell the story.
Speaker 1: So I had been set up by a really nice
Speaker 1: lawyer who I still know. He's not my lawyer, but
Speaker 1: he's a nice lawyer. And I've been set up with
Speaker 1: Matthew Perry. And this is like ninety eight, ninety nine,
Speaker 1: ninety seven. Maybe I feel like it was like between
Speaker 1: Melrose Place, which I did before the City, and.
Speaker 2: It was at a house, it was a dinner party.
Speaker 2: It was so low key. I thought.
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, it's so low key, And I
Speaker 1: remember I had taken a bunch of roses from my
Speaker 1: garden with me, like it's so weird. But I was like, whatever.
Speaker 2: So I go to this dinner party.
Speaker 3: I bring my little flowers.
Speaker 1: You know, it's a bunch of Hollywood people. I don't
Speaker 1: even know who I was there other than this lawyer
Speaker 1: at Matthew.
Speaker 2: I feel like, have I met Matthew briefly? You know
Speaker 2: how you would meet everyone out and about.
Speaker 1: But I wasn't drinking or doing drugs, so I wasn't
Speaker 1: really cool, you know, ever, right, which was fine, you know,
Speaker 1: And I was like, I hope I can still succeed
Speaker 1: without doing all this stuff. And it was not clear
Speaker 1: in the nineties if you could do me I do.
Speaker 1: It was a lot going on, a lot, right, Yes.
Speaker 2: So I go to this dinner party. Matthew's lovely. He
Speaker 2: sits next to me.
Speaker 1: And he's talking about how thrilled he is, how happy
Speaker 1: they are on the set at Friends, and he was
Speaker 1: doing a film with Oh my god, my god, my god,
Speaker 1: it's gonna come to me in a minute. Amazing actress,
Speaker 1: still functioning, great, great, great woman, good job.
Speaker 2: She's out in the desert.
Speaker 1: Right. So, like he would film at Friends and then
Speaker 1: they'd put him in a car and drive them out
Speaker 1: to the desert and they'd film all night.
Speaker 2: Then he'd drive back. It was very hard, right.
Speaker 1: I think it's kind of how some of his problems
Speaker 1: got like really aggravated and exacerbated.
Speaker 2: I was like, wow, he's so happy. And I had
Speaker 2: been around Melrose.
Speaker 1: And they it wasn't the happiest place in a way,
Speaker 1: you know, And it was like stressy. There were fifteen
Speaker 1: series regulars, you know, everyone had the feeling they might.
Speaker 2: Get cut or whatever. It was that competitive and stressy,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 1: So I was like, Wow, that's amazing, you're so happy.
Speaker 1: So cut to after dinner and all the pot comes out.
Speaker 1: They start just passing the pot around and I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: also me and pot. Very bad combination I had earlier
Speaker 1: found out before I was sober, Like I just get
Speaker 1: super paranoid and unhappy and time stops.
Speaker 2: Like it's a horrible, horrible experience.
Speaker 3: Right Yeah.
Speaker 1: So I'm like, well, I number one, I was really
Speaker 1: into my riet at that point because you kind of
Speaker 1: had to be in the middle.
Speaker 3: I did not know that. Yeah, and that's I'm proud.
Speaker 3: That amazing. I'm so lucky I was sober for a
Speaker 3: while right as well. Not that's good.
Speaker 4: I thought it was the best thing I ever did.
Speaker 4: I'm no longer, so I have to be honest. So
Speaker 4: but you can be honest no longer. Well, I like
Speaker 4: to lot. Sorry, no, but I'm there's a lot of
Speaker 4: people in our industry that are sober and uh doing
Speaker 4: extremely uh well. And I was fortunate enough to be
Speaker 4: part of certain men's at that time with a lot
Speaker 4: of our.
Speaker 2: I've heard about these.
Speaker 3: Yeah, never been to men group. There's one rule that
Speaker 3: you don't there's one rule.
Speaker 1: That I'm not going to work out, but I love
Speaker 1: to Whenever I do meet someone who has those experiences,
Speaker 1: I'm so happy because, as we're saying, in the nineties,
Speaker 1: it just seemed like to fit in and be foolish.
Speaker 3: It's so difficult.
Speaker 4: It's more, it's more acceptable now I know what you're
Speaker 4: what you're saying, You're absolutely right.
Speaker 3: It would have been extremely difficult.
Speaker 4: I couldn't have, you know, and I probably you know,
Speaker 4: tipped over to the you know, probably drank too much
Speaker 4: and had I really had a good time in New York,
Speaker 4: you know, which is great.
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm glad, and I just think you don't know,
Speaker 1: you know, till you know that it's too much.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, yeah, I hope Uh wow, that's
Speaker 4: you know bold. I didn't know that, and you know,
Speaker 4: I'm glad you didn't say anything, because then I probably
Speaker 4: would have been so timid to uh, you know, do
Speaker 4: the thing fake smoke, right, and you know, you know,
Speaker 4: even though it was like just the Reagano flavored I
Speaker 4: don't know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't even know what it was.
Speaker 3: It wasn't it wasn't real weed, that's no.
Speaker 2: It definitely was really no.
Speaker 1: But it was so like when I watched itself in
Speaker 1: that scene, it wasn't necessarily hard.
Speaker 2: I did feel also because obviously we also.
Speaker 1: Drink a lot, and that had been my main thing, right,
Speaker 1: And it became difficult later on because I remember at
Speaker 1: one point they put the four of us on the
Speaker 1: cover of like either Newsweek or Time, I don't remember
Speaker 1: which one. I don't know if we were holding our
Speaker 1: cosmos in the picture, and they said something like, you know,
Speaker 1: it's sex and the city responsible for the drinking problem
Speaker 1: with the young people or whatever, and I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: you know, to try to walk both lines that I
Speaker 1: was sober in life, but obviously were.
Speaker 3: You public the sobriety I was.
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know how how I don't know
Speaker 1: how open or out front. I would put it in
Speaker 1: the beginning because it seemed weird, you know, a little
Speaker 1: bit right, And I didn't obviously know that the show
Speaker 1: was going to go on so long and be the
Speaker 1: humongest thing and all.
Speaker 3: Didn't I take it to Miladies after? Didn't we go
Speaker 3: to Miladi's after the show? Because I.
Speaker 4: Don't remember that you didn't drink. I don't remember remember
Speaker 4: meeting a bunch of people. Wait, no, it's in Princeton's.
Speaker 4: It's not there anymore. It's the neighborhood bar.
Speaker 5: Got it.
Speaker 3: I've been a great pool table in jukebox.
Speaker 2: But how adorable, my Prince. I was trying, Oh, Prince
Speaker 2: and Sullivan, how great. I remember that area. I was
Speaker 2: always trying to find a way to be social.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you were not. I remember you showed up hung
Speaker 4: out for it, and then you know, and then.
Speaker 2: I probably and also probably I was exhausted, and.
Speaker 3: You probably were.
Speaker 1: And I had a girlfriend, so I was probably trying
Speaker 1: to behave.
Speaker 3: I probably wasn't. So I.
Speaker 2: Feel like you were.
Speaker 1: I feel like you really really were. You talked so
Speaker 1: sweetly about her. I was very impressed. Two young, hot
Speaker 1: upcoming actors so loyal and adorable.
Speaker 2: It was very impressed.
Speaker 3: Oh it was the good old days.
Speaker 2: It was the good old days.
Speaker 1: But that moment when you do in that scene where
Speaker 1: you lean over and blow the pot in my face,
Speaker 1: when I'm watching myself, I have such an understanding that
Speaker 1: I'm pulling on these other exercises that it happened.
Speaker 3: Now I'm going to look at that, I'm going to
Speaker 3: watch that sceneing and I'm going to.
Speaker 1: Say just because it's not like it's horrible or anything,
Speaker 1: just like it's so familiar to the one.
Speaker 4: I mean, yeah, there's a lot going on, I know,
Speaker 4: I know. So I love about what we do. Those
Speaker 4: moments especially, like even though they're probably difficult. The first thing,
Speaker 4: you know, when I went to test, and I don't
Speaker 4: know who, if it was Carolyn or Chris or who,
Speaker 4: and I heard your podcast because there was there wasn't
Speaker 4: that many people in the room when you tested, but
Speaker 4: this was now HBO is a different monster, definitely, So
Speaker 4: there was like there were so many people.
Speaker 3: Yes, oh, no, terrifying, but you.
Speaker 4: Know, and they were they were kind enough not to
Speaker 4: say anything prior to me actually auditioning and going through
Speaker 4: my thing, but afterwards they were going. You know, they
Speaker 4: all mentioned Wiley Ford and how much they loved the show.
Speaker 3: They loved that episode. It was super sweet.
Speaker 4: That's good that we loved you in Sects and the
Speaker 4: city and we're just so happy that you know that
Speaker 4: our pastor crossing again.
Speaker 3: Good.
Speaker 2: I love to hear that.
Speaker 1: I mean, I do think it's interesting, and I'm not
Speaker 1: objective obviously, but rewatching the show and we can.
Speaker 2: We'll rewatch technically in a second. Everyone who's listening.
Speaker 1: You know, in my mind, like you started by saying, oh,
Speaker 1: is this thing that all the actors wanted, Like in
Speaker 1: my mind, it took till season three, till we were
Speaker 1: even like on the map, right, So it's super interesting
Speaker 1: for me to hear from people who were in New
Speaker 1: York and other actors like, oh, everyone wanted to be
Speaker 1: on that show was the thing, and it's gratifying, But
Speaker 1: like at the same time, when you're in it, you
Speaker 1: don't really know, you know what I'm saying. Like for us,
Speaker 1: we were still I remember times they say, like, you've
Speaker 1: got to get out there and get all the press
Speaker 1: we can get, like because issue didn't really have hits yet, right,
Speaker 1: because Sopranos was equal with us. We came on at
Speaker 1: the same time, and like we would just talk to
Speaker 1: anyone and everyone. Like I just found this really cute
Speaker 1: clip of an episode. I think it's the end of
Speaker 1: season two when we're on the rooftop.
Speaker 2: We haven't gotten to it yet, but I.
Speaker 1: Think entertainment tonight or e W, I don't know, entertainment.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 1: One of the you know, old fashioned entertainment shows comes
Speaker 1: to the set and Sarah talks to.
Speaker 2: Them at lank.
Speaker 4: You know what I mean.
Speaker 3: On the street.
Speaker 2: It's so interesting.
Speaker 1: I just remember that we would just talk to anybody
Speaker 1: and we would have to explain the show. She would
Speaker 1: be like, it's four women, and Charlotte's the hopeful one,
Speaker 1: and Miranda she's you know, she's very smart and kind
Speaker 1: of cynical, and then there's Samantha and you know, she
Speaker 1: just embraces her sexuality, like she's explaining from the beginning.
Speaker 1: And this is second season, the end of second season,
Speaker 1: Like for us, mentally, we felt like we were still
Speaker 1: trying to crell that help, you know.
Speaker 2: But I think in some ways.
Speaker 1: That's great, right because you're in it and you're just
Speaker 1: committed and you're just like we gotta we gotta make
Speaker 1: it great.
Speaker 2: We got to get out there and sell it. You
Speaker 2: know what I'm saying that that vibe I do.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's probably it's good that you didn't recognize the
Speaker 4: power and the success.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and you know what I mean, yet caught up
Speaker 3: in that.
Speaker 2: We so weren't because we didn't. Yeah, it is and
Speaker 2: it took a while.
Speaker 1: And I remember now because it's obviously eight hundred million
Speaker 1: years later and we've done the other show, and we've
Speaker 1: done the movies, and we've done all these different things,
Speaker 1: and this other show is ending, which brings me back
Speaker 1: in my mind at the time that the first show ended,
Speaker 1: which of course could have been the ending for the
Speaker 1: whole thing. I never believed that because I'm me right,
Speaker 1: and we had talked about doing a film, which ended
Speaker 1: up happening many years later as Chris and I for
Speaker 1: self BREKD and I discussed on the on the pod.
Speaker 2: But it's so interesting to think about.
Speaker 1: I remember at the time that we ended the first show,
Speaker 1: we would go places as a group, award shows are
Speaker 1: press or whatever, and people would say.
Speaker 2: Like it's iconic, and we'd be like, stop, stop, stop,
Speaker 2: don't say that.
Speaker 1: But it was so weird to hear that, you know,
Speaker 1: because it's not like we were that old. The show
Speaker 1: hadn't been on that long like it was, you know,
Speaker 1: And now I look back on it and I'm like.
Speaker 3: They were right pioneering man, absolutely right. It's a big deal.
Speaker 3: It is, but it's only just now really syncing in.
Speaker 4: I mean, it's like really, yeah, I'm like, God, it
Speaker 4: helped shape our our generation and our culture and still
Speaker 4: do which is bire, I know, but you still have
Speaker 4: that kind of uh, that that impact and that outreach
Speaker 4: to even today. My wife, Oh, she's ten years younger,
Speaker 4: but she and her friends still they have the DVD.
Speaker 3: Now, I can't believe we have, don't you watch dvd?
Speaker 3: But she does have the whole in the page. Yes, yes,
Speaker 3: I remember, we still having. We're never getting rid of it,
Speaker 3: even though it streams everything.
Speaker 4: But but even you know, in in you know, in
Speaker 4: the kids, I say, kids and young adults today go
Speaker 4: back and watch it and our huge fans.
Speaker 2: And it's so amazing, do you know what any mean? Like,
Speaker 2: I just don't know how I lucked out so much,
Speaker 2: you know, I.
Speaker 4: Feel you and I and I and I'm very fortunate.
Speaker 4: I looked out to be do one.
Speaker 3: Episode, impactful episode.
Speaker 4: So that one episode led to a lot of good
Speaker 4: things in my life.
Speaker 1: I put you in a small, small group of people
Speaker 1: where maybe you had worked and whatnot and been known
Speaker 1: like to a small group, but hadn't necessarily like broken
Speaker 1: out right, meaning like we thought you were amazing, and
Speaker 1: then you were amazing. Like Timothy Elephant, you know, we
Speaker 1: were like his first job right.
Speaker 2: Still, Yeah, I.
Speaker 4: Got a great so the whole so HBO Timothy Elephant,
Speaker 4: I don't know up because David Milch and Deadwood, I
Speaker 4: was a huge fan. I was almost undead with well
Speaker 4: for Timoth, for Timothy's no.
Speaker 3: Way, oh my god.
Speaker 4: And I couldn't do it or you know, even test
Speaker 4: for it or whatever because I was filming a film
Speaker 4: basic or something like that and then for six months,
Speaker 4: and so I missed that opportunity, and the John from
Speaker 4: Cincinnati opportunity almost didn't come up because there was some
Speaker 4: resistance because of my I. They felt that I passed
Speaker 4: on and there's not a chance there was one of
Speaker 4: my favorite shows and one of the best shows of
Speaker 4: all time.
Speaker 2: Wow, So you had to convince them they hadn't.
Speaker 4: Threatened when I when I sidetrack again massive, I possessed.
Speaker 2: Right in my wheelhouse, go for it.
Speaker 3: I was obsessed with Deadwood and David Milts.
Speaker 4: She incredible, yes, even from you know NYPD Blue Too,
Speaker 4: which is network television, and I just I'm his biggest fan.
Speaker 4: I thought, you know, it's amazing that he's like, you know,
Speaker 4: I have to work with this man. And I'm you know,
Speaker 4: I'm so upset that Deadwood didn't work out whatever.
Speaker 3: And then I was reading the.
Speaker 4: Newspaper when we used to read newspapers.
Speaker 3: And there was the article about the cancelation of Deadwood,
Speaker 3: and I was so upset.
Speaker 4: And my girlfriend at the time ex girlfriend and girlfriend
Speaker 4: at the time, She's like, just keep reading.
Speaker 3: And they canceled the show.
Speaker 4: But he's working on a new show about a dysfunctional
Speaker 4: surfing family and.
Speaker 3: Well, and it's you know, it's sort of loose.
Speaker 4: The vehicle, the family that was used as the vehicle
Speaker 4: to tell the story wasn't about their family.
Speaker 3: I knew very I grew up.
Speaker 2: I know, you mean, it's an actual, real family.
Speaker 4: It's loosely, it's not it's it's inaccurate. Yes, okay, incredible.
Speaker 4: The son the person that I in a sense played it.
Speaker 4: It's just a small role and it's crazy.
Speaker 3: How this stuff works.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 4: Yeah, he was a professional surfer, way better than I was.
Speaker 4: But you know, I'd surfer with him a few times.
Speaker 4: Knew the family very like, you know.
Speaker 2: That's amazing.
Speaker 3: It's crazy. But they didn't want to see me. They
Speaker 3: didn't know you.
Speaker 2: Had to push your way in. Well, good for you.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they they said no.
Speaker 4: My agents really at the time they were like, what
Speaker 4: they don't they don't want to see you, dude, I
Speaker 4: don't know something. If you don't get me an appointment
Speaker 4: or you know, an audition time, I will go there
Speaker 4: in person. I will break that door down and see
Speaker 4: I'm doing this. I'm not taking no for an answer.
Speaker 2: Amazing.
Speaker 3: I'm not that person. Yeah, but when I get, when
Speaker 3: I get, you know, when that was your show.
Speaker 2: You needed that that show. I mean, I do believe
Speaker 2: in that I was abassin, Like.
Speaker 1: Your part is your part, you know, but sometimes you
Speaker 1: do have to go through some obstacles to get that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I just like, but I love Timothy Offense too. Yes,
Speaker 3: So as you.
Speaker 1: Were saying yes, like Timothy, you Dan Futterman, who's also motion,
Speaker 1: we haven't checked in with him.
Speaker 2: It's next week.
Speaker 3: I can't wait.
Speaker 2: I can't wait.
Speaker 1: Like he's had such an interesting career that you know,
Speaker 1: he's a showrunner.
Speaker 3: Now I want to I'm gonna go look after. I
Speaker 3: want to look up dance. I know, I.
Speaker 2: Know he's behind the scenes, but he's incredible.
Speaker 1: But so many people I'm not even remembering everybody obviously,
Speaker 1: I'm just thinking of my guys right now.
Speaker 2: But I mean Tim wasn't my guy, but Tim Timothy.
Speaker 1: It was his first job, and he was so great.
Speaker 1: And that was our first season where it hadn't even
Speaker 1: been on the air, so no one knew anything about
Speaker 1: what we were doing. I remember he plays like Valley
Speaker 1: of the twenty something guys and he's talking about.
Speaker 2: His dream with his hands, and.
Speaker 3: I forgot yeh, he made that all up. I forgot that.
Speaker 2: Ye yep, yep.
Speaker 1: But I mean there's a hand all of you that
Speaker 1: I feel like, you know, our guys I think had
Speaker 1: great Our casting directors and our producers had great taste
Speaker 1: and talent, you know, And it's so nice to be
Speaker 1: able to have young actors on because obviously that show
Speaker 1: was that show and with the and just like that,
Speaker 1: we were able to have a different group of young
Speaker 1: actors playing our kids and whatnot. Right, bizarre to say,
Speaker 1: but you know, it's a fun thing to be in
Speaker 1: the business and be able to be part of that.
Speaker 1: Like I love that part of our business, finding talent,
Speaker 1: being able to support talent, discover talent, show tent.
Speaker 2: To the world.
Speaker 1: Yeah, create a safe environment for them.
Speaker 3: You did.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you definitely created a great environment to create. But
Speaker 4: I got to show this story. I don't know if
Speaker 4: you remember this too. This is another and they think
Speaker 4: this helped me get this next game. It was just
Speaker 4: a crazy week in my life. So this is while
Speaker 4: we're shooting our episode I Less Moonvez the head of CBS.
Speaker 4: The auditions are for so funny. The difference between going
Speaker 4: from doing your show playing Wiley Ford, uh, you know,
Speaker 4: the douchey douchebag of all the actors, to then sort
Speaker 4: of testing to being a character is testing for a
Speaker 4: sitcom loving money, which was like Susie Kurtz, David auguy Steis.
Speaker 3: There was like Rob Long and Dance David. It was
Speaker 3: the showrunners. It was like Judy Greer, Paget Brewster.
Speaker 4: I replaced my friend who wasn't my friend at the time.
Speaker 4: But I became friends with dash My Hawk, one of
Speaker 4: my favorite persons on the Slant, and they were it
Speaker 4: sucks because they wanted to replace him in the pilot
Speaker 4: and last minute I'm in the you know, lets wanted
Speaker 4: to I had whatever audition fortant that goes Less wants
Speaker 4: to meet you test and he's in New York for this.
Speaker 3: You in New York right now is going to fly
Speaker 3: back tonight like I'm filming. I'm working on I'm working
Speaker 3: on Sex and the City.
Speaker 2: You were hot, you were a hot commodity. I remember.
Speaker 3: I'm sure that didn't hurt. But you guys good.
Speaker 4: There was a you guys let me run up town
Speaker 4: to meet with Less, and you and I talked. I
Speaker 4: think you took a we're supposed to shoot all our
Speaker 4: stuff and it's changed up scenes so you could let
Speaker 4: me go, Yeah, go to go meet with Less. I
Speaker 4: remember taking the train up up to like where was
Speaker 4: CBS at the time, like sixty days uptown on the
Speaker 4: West Side, right.
Speaker 2: In one of the big buildings, like a big high rise.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and sweating. I went from wiley Ford to Amon
Speaker 4: McBride and hauld Ass back down to Soho or yeah,
Speaker 4: and uh and just you know, barely making it a time.
Speaker 4: And I remember you guys are being so kind to
Speaker 4: let me.
Speaker 3: And I got the gig, yay.
Speaker 1: I do remember talking about that, and I remember because
Speaker 1: I think Amanda was on another film, and so it
Speaker 1: was a big you were trying to decide, like, because
Speaker 1: those are decisions, you know, it.
Speaker 3: Was you have a great memory.
Speaker 4: It was she booked the show TV show, uh, Jack
Speaker 4: and Jill, Yes, oh my god, yes, she was moving
Speaker 4: to Los Angeles, right, and the she.
Speaker 2: I think she was on a film with Bruce wa.
Speaker 3: The whole nine yards, yes.
Speaker 1: Right, And all these things were happening at once for
Speaker 1: both of you, and I remember you just saying like
Speaker 1: this and that and trying to make the decisions and
Speaker 1: where was she going to be?
Speaker 4: And what?
Speaker 1: Yeah you do?
Speaker 2: And I thought it was so sweet.
Speaker 4: Oh that's funny. And I did not want to I
Speaker 4: did not want to leave New York. I always thought
Speaker 4: I would right come back. I thought you thought that
Speaker 4: the TV show it was temporary, as they mostly mostly are. Yeah, unfortunately, yeah, right,
Speaker 4: And so I was That's why I kept my I
Speaker 4: kept my apartment. I gave my sub least to sublet
Speaker 4: it to my buddy.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 3: But yeah, I was you know, I didn't want to
Speaker 3: I didn't want to leave. I didn't want you know.
Speaker 4: I thought I was gonna always come back. And part
Speaker 4: of the reason was, you know, you know that wasn't
Speaker 4: really looking to do uh sitcom right.
Speaker 2: Because back then there was a big separation.
Speaker 4: But the actors, I'm glad I did the writing on this.
Speaker 4: That show that I did was it was was incredible.
Speaker 3: And the actors and the talent.
Speaker 4: That's another show I was like way in over my
Speaker 4: head with you know, Brian.
Speaker 3: Doyle Murray played my dad.
Speaker 2: He's amazing.
Speaker 1: But that was that was a great It's a great
Speaker 1: I love to hear about what actors are kind of
Speaker 1: going through or went through, or the different choices that
Speaker 1: you have to make, because it does it's not easy,
Speaker 1: you know. And I feel like obviously getting parts at
Speaker 1: all is not easy, right They all know this technically,
Speaker 1: But then also you have to make these decisions and
Speaker 1: figure things out, and you never really know what's going
Speaker 1: to happen.
Speaker 2: There's so much unknown.
Speaker 4: Yeah, when you think you know it's going to happen,
Speaker 4: you know, just when it gets dangerous making assumptions and
Speaker 4: like yes, I'm going to spend this money because I'm
Speaker 4: going to be working forever.
Speaker 3: And I know on Cougartown, which I was, it was
Speaker 3: like the Lewis was to watch.
Speaker 4: Oh my god, it was fun to do what a
Speaker 4: great but that was another fun time. We got a
Speaker 4: lot of stories about that. I'm sure, but I remember
Speaker 4: I wasn't Josh and I would do these cleanses and
Speaker 4: not be able to you know, just to you know,
Speaker 4: stay healthy and cut off drinking. And we do the
Speaker 4: Master cleans of all things too.
Speaker 1: Oh I remember the days and everyone did the Master
Speaker 1: didn't you see back?
Speaker 2: Who's coming soon? She could tell you some Master cleans stories.
Speaker 2: It was the thing.
Speaker 1: It was the thing.
Speaker 3: It was hard.
Speaker 2: I couldn't do that.
Speaker 3: I did.
Speaker 4: We had bets, but it was impossible on our set
Speaker 4: because we would there would we would call.
Speaker 3: It the red tea. Yes, we would drink. We'd put
Speaker 3: red wine in a cup.
Speaker 4: And put a little tea string outside so it looked
Speaker 4: like you're drinking tea. It was really red wine. We
Speaker 4: were all wine. I was on the show that was
Speaker 4: That wasn't a thing like you were saying. Bill Lawrence
Speaker 4: would take stuff in our real life and put it
Speaker 4: in the show, and the wine things started pretty early on.
Speaker 4: We go along so well, we got to lunch on
Speaker 4: wine Wednesdays, and wow, we all liked our one good thing.
Speaker 2: I wasn't on that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I know I was.
Speaker 4: I know, I know that I thought about that. You
Speaker 4: were sharing with me about your sobriety. I was like, ah, thank.
Speaker 2: God, because I would have really not fit in.
Speaker 3: You would have fit in. I would have made I know,
Speaker 3: pretty much that whole cast.
Speaker 2: Yes, I think it would have been okay, but I
Speaker 2: would have been in my trailer.
Speaker 1: Okay, you guys, it's too much fun. You're talking to
Speaker 1: Brian ben Holt. We're going to come back for part two.
Speaker 1: Please join us later in the week.