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Speaker 1: This is Nobel Meyer and you're listening to swimming upstream.

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Speaker 2: Swimming upstream back with you guys in a big way.

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Speaker 2: This is gonna be really fun Alex Carver, Isaaca Zude

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Speaker 2: and our guests. That needs no intro, but we're gonna

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Speaker 2: do it anyways, Marlin stopped pitching prospect and one of

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Speaker 2: the top pitching.

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Speaker 3: Prospects of baseball, mister Thomas White.

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Speaker 2: Gonna be really fun. Just absolutely dominant season from this kid.

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Speaker 2: It's been amazing to watch. Just rips through it. I mean,

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Speaker 2: no real flaw that we can see in the stats.

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Speaker 2: We're gonna get his thoughts about how his season has

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Speaker 2: gone so far from spring training where he came in

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Speaker 2: literally throwing one hundred like third day, I think it

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Speaker 2: was up until what's happened recently with the Pensacola Blue Wahoo.

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Speaker 2: So this is also again, Thomas, we really really appreciate

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Speaker 2: your time. Let's just get right through it, man. I mean,

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Speaker 2: like this season's been amazing. We can point to the stats.

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Speaker 2: You're at the top of the charts in many stack categories.

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Speaker 2: I'm sure you may or may not pay attention to stats,

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Speaker 2: but I'm sure you know what you're doing.

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Speaker 3: We're gonna get to it today with you, but I

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Speaker 3: appreciate you coming on.

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Speaker 4: How's it going? Yeah, of course been pretty good so far.

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Speaker 4: Appreciate you guys having.

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Speaker 3: Me up absolutely so. Yeah. I mean, look at the stats.

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Speaker 2: Two point two seventy RA, two point one three eighteen

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Speaker 2: thirty seven KBB currently on a stretch.

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Speaker 3: Of like twenty innings with a one point three three ERA.

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Speaker 4: It's insane.

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Speaker 3: But it all started very early for you that spring training,

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Speaker 3: so I want to start there.

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Speaker 2: Second professional spring training, you were up to, like I said,

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Speaker 2: like one hundred with the villa, pretty much like first

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Speaker 2: second third day.

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Speaker 4: How'd you feel coming in?

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Speaker 2: What was it like coming into your second full spring training? No,

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Speaker 2: things were different around camp. We'll gets that in a second.

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Speaker 2: But how'd you feel overall coming in and what was

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Speaker 2: that original output like for you?

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Speaker 4: Yeah?

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Speaker 5: I mean it felt good kind of knowing the schedule

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Speaker 5: and ride of spring training, but then again, it also

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Speaker 5: kind of felt like the first season against It's, uh,

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Speaker 5: we have so many new things going on in the ORG,

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Speaker 5: so it's exciting in that regard.

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Speaker 4: But it was good to have a baseline of what

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Speaker 4: to expect tom.

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Speaker 6: As you've been in the organization since twenty twenty three,

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Speaker 6: you've undergone a few different regimes.

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Speaker 4: I guess at baseball operation departments.

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Speaker 6: Could you sort of touch on some of the changes

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Speaker 6: that you noticed, whether analytically driven or just some of

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Speaker 6: the changes you noticed going to spring training this year or.

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Speaker 4: Throughout the regular season.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean it's a lot more analytically driven. I'd

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Speaker 5: say it's it's a little more in depth on a

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Speaker 5: lot of things, Like we get postgame reports now that

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Speaker 5: are more analytically driven, Like we get like pitching plus grades,

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Speaker 5: stuff plus grades.

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Speaker 4: We get all that kind of stuff.

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Speaker 5: I didn't know that in spring training obviously, but in

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Speaker 5: spring training we just like so much more energy more

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Speaker 5: than in ten different ways of doing things. It took

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Speaker 5: some getting used to, you know, with with the different

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Speaker 5: bullpen setups and facing hitters all the time. So just

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Speaker 5: I mean, I could literally point to anything like our

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Speaker 5: strength department is a lot different, and our pitching department

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Speaker 5: is a lot different.

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Speaker 4: I know, our hitters are experiencing a lot of different things, So.

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Speaker 5: It's kind of like a complete overhaul in a lot

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Speaker 5: of ways. Ash.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I definitely looked and felt different out there from

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Speaker 2: past spring trainings for sure, but end of spring training

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Speaker 2: we'll get there. We saw you participating and competing against

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Speaker 2: double A I think even some triple A hitters mostly.

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Speaker 2: I think that's what you did, competed against on you know,

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Speaker 2: the main fields. I guess I I would say it

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Speaker 2: back there against some of the more advanced competition.

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Speaker 3: But then the assignments come down.

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Speaker 2: Your back in Beloit to start at least, and now

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Speaker 2: of course now back to Pensacola, which we'll get to.

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Speaker 3: But with that initial assignment where you surprised? Were you

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Speaker 3: okay with it? What was your thought about going back

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Speaker 3: up to Wisconsin to start.

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Speaker 4: I was surprised.

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Speaker 5: I think most people, most people that I talk to,

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Speaker 5: we're pretty surprised about it.

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Speaker 4: A little disappointed maybe to begin, I'd hope to start there,

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Speaker 4: but first starting double A.

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Speaker 5: But at the same time, they gave me a reason.

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Speaker 5: You know, I was just trying to land my breaking

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Speaker 5: balls and we were tinkering at them kind of all

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Speaker 5: the spring training, and I never really got that great

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Speaker 5: of a feel for him, so sending me back there

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Speaker 5: to work on getting them in zone a little bit better,

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Speaker 5: and honestly, maybe they were trying to mentally challenge me like,

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Speaker 5: I don't know, I think it was actually really really

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Speaker 5: good for me in the end. I don't think it

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Speaker 5: slowed me down. I think it really just kind of realizing, like, hey,

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Speaker 5: let's let's be where our feet are.

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Speaker 4: You know, you'll get to the big leagues eventually, you

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Speaker 4: really don't need to rush it.

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Speaker 5: So be where your feet are, continue to adjust and

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Speaker 5: make improvements and then go over there.

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Speaker 6: And the words of a very mature young man, Well,

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Speaker 6: double a Pensacola double is considered one of the toughest

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Speaker 6: levels in the minor league, is probably the toughest. Just

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Speaker 6: curious how you would view that jump from Blloyd to

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Speaker 6: Pensacola and just maybe some of the help you've gotten,

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Speaker 6: especially with Jared Aikoff, just so over the transition to

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Speaker 6: double a ball.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, my first couple starts were a bit rough. They

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Speaker 5: the hitters here, they take a lot early, at least

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Speaker 5: the first couple of teams that we've faced, especially since

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Speaker 5: I was a new addition, they were taking early, making

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Speaker 5: me kind of come at them and you know, making

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Speaker 5: me making me go on the attack. You know, I'm

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Speaker 5: still working on trying to get in the zone a

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Speaker 5: little bit more, the stuff.

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Speaker 4: Is taking a pretty big jump compared to last year.

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Speaker 5: So now it's again trying to dial in lim with

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Speaker 5: the walks, get ahead of hitters, and I've been really

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Speaker 5: challenged to do that here, and I think my first

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Speaker 5: couple starts kind of showcase that with the line and Jared,

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Speaker 5: Jared's been probably the best pitching coach I've ever worked with,

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Speaker 5: to be honest, like he helps me simplify things. I

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Speaker 5: tend to overthink, try to make you know every adjustment

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Speaker 5: in the book, whereas like for me, it was as

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Speaker 5: simple as let's find one queue and let's change it

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Speaker 5: from okay, let's get in the zone and we're gonna

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Speaker 5: change it to okay, we're gonna attack every hitter and

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Speaker 5: we're gonna execute.

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Speaker 4: You need to pitch regardless of outcome.

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Speaker 5: Like if the intent is to go well too fastball

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Speaker 5: above the zones and I do that and the guy

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Speaker 5: doesn't swing, that's still an executed pitch and we're trying

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Speaker 5: to get a swing and mission. Just because he didn't

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Speaker 5: swing at it doesn't mean it was a bad pitch.

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Speaker 5: And kind of taking those little wins and stacking each

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Speaker 5: pitch together was was a really big thing.

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Speaker 4: So we found a good queue.

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Speaker 5: And my first attempt at that that mindset was in

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Speaker 5: Knoxville when I had fourteen strike GUIDs. So since then

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Speaker 5: just kind of stuck with it and continued to to

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Speaker 5: pitch well, I mean, just find the mindset and hold

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Speaker 5: that queue and keep going.

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Speaker 2: Fun to ask about a guy that you were teammates with,

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Speaker 2: I think earlier this year and that you were around

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Speaker 2: the spring training that you've described as a guy that

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Speaker 2: you really leaned on. He's with the Shrip now, but

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Speaker 2: you know you've described him as a guy that's been

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Speaker 2: helpful for you, I think personally on the verge of

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Speaker 2: a call up from the Marlins.

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Speaker 3: But we'll see what happens with that Robbie Snelling.

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Speaker 2: So just he meant for you and what you guys

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Speaker 2: have worked on, maybe some advice that he's given you

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Speaker 2: as an old guy, some things that you guys maybe

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Speaker 2: shared with each other.

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Speaker 3: What's the relationship with him?

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Speaker 4: Like, Yeah, honestly I didn't know him to what. Like

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Speaker 4: I'd met him.

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Speaker 5: Last year at the Futures Game and then saw him

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Speaker 5: again in scring training. We talked off and on just

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Speaker 5: because he was mostly with the trip, Like pishing as

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Speaker 5: triple guys. I was pishing aast to Double A guys,

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Speaker 5: so talk to him a little bit, but didn't get

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Speaker 5: that close to him. And then when I got up here,

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Speaker 5: while he was still here, him, dax Fulhman and I

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Speaker 5: were just it was like the three of us we

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Speaker 5: all talk about, you know, anything and everything. Whereas it's

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Speaker 5: pitch gris, mechanics, deel stuff, intense stuff, target stuff, Like honestly,

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Speaker 5: it was anything and everything that we had questions about.

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Speaker 5: The three of us would kind of just bounce ideas

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Speaker 5: off each other. And Robbie is exactly like I, you know,

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Speaker 5: high draft pick Lefty flew through the miners, you know,

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Speaker 5: and he was in double in his first season I think,

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Speaker 5: and had that insane al right. So he's doing exactly

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Speaker 5: what I'm doing, and he's done it before and he's

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Speaker 5: continuing to do.

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Speaker 4: It obviously now in Triple A. And he's super mature

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Speaker 4: for his age, and just like he feels like it

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Speaker 4: feels like.

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Speaker 5: He's been in the big leagues already, and I'm talking

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Speaker 5: to a big leaguer, Like he's got so much knowledge

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Speaker 5: and experience.

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Speaker 4: That even though he's only had I think one more

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Speaker 4: year in pro ball that I have.

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Speaker 5: It just feels like he's got a wealth of knowledge

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Speaker 5: that I can tap into anytime, and one of the

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Speaker 5: best dudes I've ever met.

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Speaker 6: He's someone who actually pitched with in the twenty twenty

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Speaker 6: four Futures Game. I wanted to ask you about this

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Speaker 6: year's game. Obviously, I don't think it went exactly the

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Speaker 6: way you would have liked, but still a tremendous honor

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Speaker 6: read a pitch in his game for the second time

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Speaker 6: in a row. Just your thoughts of the overall weekend,

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Speaker 6: the atmosphere, Just how was that that performance for you?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, Robbie said my tail the first time.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, and then honestly that both times that I that

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Speaker 5: I went to the Future's game, I was kind of

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Speaker 5: in like my worst spot physic like mechanically, just kind

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Speaker 5: of searching a little uncomfortable in the mound. So one

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Speaker 5: one kind of went through that again. Yeah, like you said,

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Speaker 5: didn't go the way I wanted, but just another way

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Speaker 5: to get around you know, Sherivan Jones is our manager

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Speaker 5: from my side, and like you know, it's just it's

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Speaker 5: an unreal experience. You get to be around Hall of

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Speaker 5: famers and your teammates are going to be future Big

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Speaker 5: leaguers and Hall of famers.

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Speaker 4: I was talking to Jonah Talan a little bit like

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Speaker 4: him and j al Richie.

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Speaker 5: We were bouncing ideas of each other, talking, getting to

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Speaker 5: know each other, so like, super cool to see that.

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Speaker 5: And now Jonah's going to make his debut against them allins,

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Speaker 5: I think, right yeah.

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Speaker 4: Tomorrow, Yeah, so pretty crazy, pretty cool experience.

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Speaker 5: And obviously being in a big league ballpark is you know,

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Speaker 5: next to not.

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Speaker 2: Maybe not where you wanted to be that day, but

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Speaker 2: as you said before, a day where you were at

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Speaker 2: your probably best. I would say, maybe you could tell

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Speaker 2: me your career best maybe even that was that July

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Speaker 2: twenty sixth game where you strike out fourteen batters in

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Speaker 2: five innings. It's literally historic performance. Just like, tell me

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Speaker 2: a little bit more about that day. What was working

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Speaker 2: so well for you? Do you think like everything showed

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Speaker 2: up at once for you that day?

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Speaker 5: I think a seat of half a season's work of

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Speaker 5: hard work and for me struggle. You know, the numbers

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Speaker 5: didn't really show them a boy, but it's kind of

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Speaker 5: in a nightmare season up until that point, where it

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Speaker 5: was like up and down, tweaking stuff, trying to fix things,

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Speaker 5: thinking about too much and outings, and then you know,

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Speaker 5: even though the line wasn't that bad, I was pretty

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Speaker 5: frustrated with where I was at and it just felt

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Speaker 5: like it just honestly felt like everything just kind of

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Speaker 5: went like this, like just kind of zeroed in, dialed in,

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Speaker 5: and yeah, I didn't even have everything working. Like my

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Speaker 5: changeup was really good, my fastball was solid, the sweeper

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Speaker 5: wasn't exactly where I wanted it to be, and the

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Speaker 5: cutter jyro thing was still work in progress, but it

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Speaker 5: was more like an execution based like I just computed

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Speaker 5: almost every pitch I feel like exactly where I.

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Speaker 4: Wanted to.

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Speaker 5: And yeah, like you know, my stuff plus great that

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Speaker 5: I got after that game was actually the worst that

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Speaker 5: had been all season, like one of my worst days

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Speaker 5: stuff plus wise. So that just you know, it shows that,

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Speaker 5: you know, even on my days where I don't have

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Speaker 5: my stuff, is that if I execute, I'm gonna go

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Speaker 5: out and then I'm gonna have a good day. Obviously,

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Speaker 5: you're not always gonna have your best stuff. So to

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Speaker 5: be able to execute days like that is is a

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Speaker 5: good feeling. And then I could hold that feeling and

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Speaker 5: that mentality and bring it into the next week, and

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Speaker 5: then you know Montgomery, where I hit like one hundred

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Speaker 5: and one or one hundred point seven or something like

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Speaker 5: that was a good stuff plus day and I was

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Speaker 5: more in the know.

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Speaker 4: So it's like, you're gonna have You're gonna have it

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Speaker 4: come together at some.

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Speaker 6: Time if you can't. What what did grade out poorly

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Speaker 6: in that fourteenth strikeout game?

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Speaker 4: You said you the great repoor wasn't great.

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Speaker 6: What exactly which pitches, if anything, were the ones that

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Speaker 6: created poorly?

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Speaker 5: Uh, the sweeper wasn't very good and a fastball wasn't

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Speaker 5: wasn't where I wanted it to be. I mean, it

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Speaker 5: still wasn't bad, but it's not it wasn't what I

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Speaker 5: was looking for at that point.

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Speaker 6: Fourteen of the fifteen outs recorded via strikeout, and he

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Speaker 6: wasn't all there.

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Speaker 4: It's pretty oppressive stuff. Well, we've been hearing raving.

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Speaker 6: Reviews about the guyro slider you've been throwing.

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Speaker 4: You've been tweaking it a little bit.

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Speaker 6: You can just sort of touch on that and what

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Speaker 6: your confidence is on that pitch and maybe any other

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Speaker 6: additions you've made to your arsenal this year.

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Speaker 4: Honestly, that pitch has been like.

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Speaker 5: Really love hate relationship with it. It was really good

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Speaker 5: early on, and then it really wasn't good, and then

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Speaker 5: it was kind of a non factor, and now I'm

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Speaker 5: starting to be able to figure it out again.

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Speaker 4: I think because I'm like an ultrapronator that I.

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Speaker 5: Really kind of struggle to throw breaking ball super hard.

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Speaker 5: And I'm trying to get that pitch to be like,

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Speaker 5: you know, ninety ninety two kind of like kind of

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Speaker 5: like scoobles like slutter cutter thinging. When I get it right,

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Speaker 5: it's really really good. It's just I'm not super consistent

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Speaker 5: with it yet. Recently we turned to a little bit

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Speaker 5: more of a cutter approach on it instead of thinking gyro.

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Speaker 5: We're kind of trying to think more cutter just to

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Speaker 5: see if that gets me to throw it a little harder.

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Speaker 5: And I was throwing it at like eighty seven to

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Speaker 5: eighty nine last week, So trying to build on it.

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Speaker 5: Work in progress, you know, like you said, But I

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Speaker 5: think there's a lot of potential in that pitch to

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Speaker 5: be a true weapon, whereas right now it's more like

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Speaker 5: a two to oh. I can kind of flick it

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Speaker 5: in there and still strike just because I don't throw

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Speaker 5: it very often, whereas in the future, I think it

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Speaker 5: could hopefully turn out to be something like Crochet's cutter.

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Speaker 5: Maybe not that good, but like if I can use

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Speaker 5: it in a similar way, I think that's the end

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Speaker 5: goal for that pitch. I mean, obviously, every every single

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Speaker 5: has changed since, so there's a lot of different things

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Speaker 5: that still need a little more consistency, but the ceiling.

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Speaker 4: Has been pretty unreal on most of them.

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Speaker 5: So now it's about dialing in the movement and getting

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Speaker 5: those clusters to be a little closer.

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Speaker 2: I guess we can ask quickly about receivers that have

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Speaker 2: caught you this year. I mean, I know that he's

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Speaker 2: probably the injur now, and he maybe done for the year,

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Speaker 2: I think from what I heard. But with Ryan and

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Speaker 2: and and you know you throwing to him mostly this year,

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Speaker 2: I think is the guy that you've thrown to them?

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Speaker 2: How do you think that he handled your stuff and

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Speaker 2: helped you grow as a pitcher so far.

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Speaker 5: This year, I mean, he's got an absolute cannon. I

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Speaker 5: mean he's thrown out an absurd amount of runners. It's

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Speaker 5: literally it's when you watch him though, it's pretty unbelievable.

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Speaker 5: You just know, like as a pitcher if you're so

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Speaker 5: like one one point four seconds maybe to the play,

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Speaker 5: like he's he's gonna throw him out, So that that

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Speaker 5: aspect is pretty ridiculous.

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Speaker 4: And his catching has gotten so much better.

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Speaker 5: I mean, this is the year two of him catching consistently,

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Speaker 5: So the receiving has gotten a lot better.

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Speaker 4: You know, he continues to improve on that part.

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Speaker 5: I think he believes he still has more bred to

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Speaker 5: gain on that aspect, but he throws out an absurd

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Speaker 5: amount of runners.

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Speaker 4: It's pretty it's pretty insane.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, second, you're catching too, so I had to ask

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Speaker 2: about that. I think we only got a couple more.

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Speaker 2: I mean, this has been awesome so far, even though

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Speaker 2: we packed it into a pretty tight window.

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Speaker 3: But I guess the.

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Speaker 2: Second to last one that we can ask them aside

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Speaker 2: against anything else, it's about pitchcount.

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Speaker 3: They were pretty stringent with you early with pitchcount.

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Speaker 2: They were basically right at like eighty five eighty six

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Speaker 2: pitches per start, and then recently they they basically took

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Speaker 2: the rains off and said, Okay, let's let this guy throw.

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Speaker 4: A hundred start.

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Speaker 2: So just thoughts about the workload, how are you adjusting

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Speaker 2: to just throwing those extra pitches.

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Speaker 3: Were you always good to throw those extra pitches?

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Speaker 4: They were just taking it easy?

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Speaker 3: What was the deal with that?

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Speaker 1: Uh?

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Speaker 5: I think it was good for the first season to

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Speaker 5: have the rains on not doing too much. Obviously, in

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Speaker 5: the big leagues you don't really you don't have any rains.

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Speaker 5: You know, you don't have anybody holding you back. So

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Speaker 5: I do think it was good. I think it's good

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Speaker 5: to extend the pitch count get deeper into games, which

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Speaker 5: is the one thing I have most frustrated about is

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Speaker 5: I'm not super efficient not going deeper in the games

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Speaker 5: through in my opinion, so too many pitchers and two

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Speaker 5: little innings.

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Speaker 4: But I get a ton of swinging miss right now.

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Speaker 5: I'm striking a lot of guys out, So it's kind

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Speaker 5: of you know, how do I throw more strikes to

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Speaker 5: get matters out of there quicker and go deeper into

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Speaker 5: the games, because one hundred pitches should get you through

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Speaker 5: more than just five innings or four and two thirds.

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Speaker 5: So still working on that, but I think it's to

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Speaker 5: extend that. The body feels pretty good on feels great

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Speaker 5: right now. Yeah, I think I'm in a good spot

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Speaker 5: with that, and I think the next adjustment is going

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Speaker 5: to a five man rotation and not having that extra day.

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Speaker 6: Well times before I ask you probably might final one

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Speaker 6: of the day. I want to ask you about your

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Speaker 6: high school career a little bit, just particular your junior

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Speaker 6: year where you just put up insane numbers.

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Speaker 4: A's zero point two to one, e er, your.

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Speaker 6: Name, Gatorade Player of the Year. Just how does a

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Speaker 6: season like that happen? You'd give up by some one

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Speaker 6: and run all year. Just take us through that season

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Speaker 6: if you can't be That's one of the most absurd

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Speaker 6: races I've ever seen.

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Speaker 5: Honestly, I had kind of struggled with command up until

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Speaker 5: that point. I made some changes in my delivery, which

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Speaker 5: I regret now, but it was good for back then,

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Speaker 5: and I really just I felt like I fill up

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Speaker 5: this own really well.

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Speaker 4: That year. I had a really good defense behind me.

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Speaker 5: Too, So I won't I won't say that because we

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Speaker 5: had a bunch of D one guys behind me and

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Speaker 5: behind the plate. I had a D one catcher, you know,

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Speaker 5: had a D one outfielder, D one shortstop.

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Speaker 4: Uh to bed a pretty good team.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, I don't remember much about that season

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Speaker 5: other than how fun it was.

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Speaker 4: But I think My goal was literally to just throw

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Speaker 4: as many strikes as possible and see what happened. And uh,

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Speaker 4: I was able to do that.

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Speaker 5: I think I would have had a better senior year,

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Speaker 5: but I got tagged in my last start by a

401
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Speaker 5: pretty ill so you got to give them credit there.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, well you you still want the Gatory Player of

403
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Speaker 6: the Year anyway, lucky despite that tagging. But last one

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Speaker 6: for me, just how what would be a successful end

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Speaker 6: of the regular season for you, Thomas, aside from the obvious,

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Speaker 6: you know, a potential call up, But I'm curious what

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Speaker 6: would be uh, what else would you like to accomplish

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Speaker 6: before the end of the year.

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Speaker 5: I think one end of year healthy as always, you know,

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Speaker 5: it's always everybody's goal. I'd like to hopefully get the

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Speaker 5: blue while who's in the playoffs and see if we

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Speaker 5: can finish out strong there.

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Speaker 4: And then honestly, just find.

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Speaker 5: Some consistency with a pitch movement in these last couple

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Speaker 5: of weeks and set up kind of in a good

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Speaker 5: offseason goal with all that kind of stuff. And yeah,

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Speaker 5: like you said, you know, I'd love to get a

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Speaker 5: starting triple A if possible, and maybe help them in

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Speaker 5: the playoffs.

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Speaker 4: But that part's out of my control.

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Speaker 5: So I'm gonna try and finish, finish as good as

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Speaker 5: I came here, stay on the winning track, and hopefully

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Speaker 5: we can get into the playoffs too.

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Speaker 3: Right. Wow, awesome stuff.

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Speaker 2: Like I said, quality here over quantity with a nine

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Speaker 2: team inte interview, some great stuff.

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Speaker 3: Just that standout moment.

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Speaker 2: Fourteen strikeouts and he didn't even have his best stuff.

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Speaker 2: That's Thomas White in a nutshell right there for you guys.

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Speaker 2: So Thomas, Man, appreciate your time. This was incredible. Next

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Speaker 2: start coming up soon, so wish you the best of

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Speaker 2: the lot.

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Speaker 3: Keep going, dude.

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Speaker 2: This has been amazing to follow your career so far

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Speaker 2: from both of us and all of us that fish

436
00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:19,320
Speaker 2: on first, appreciate your time today, Appreciate the waters for

437
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Speaker 2: putting on and again man, this is great.

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Speaker 4: Thank you again. Yeah, of course, thank you guys for

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Speaker 4: your time.

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Speaker 5: It's it's good to see you all again and hope

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Speaker 5: hopefully we ran to each other in person soon.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, there you go, guys, swimming upstream with top prospect

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Speaker 2: Thomas White.

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00:19:32,520 --> 00:19:33,560
Speaker 3: We'll be back on the next one.

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00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:34,160
Speaker 4: See you guys.

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00:19:34,200 --> 00:19:54,760
Speaker 3: Then go fish