1 00:00:01,320 --> 00:00:04,240 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:12,600 Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio Happy Friday. 3 00:00:12,680 --> 00:00:13,319 Speaker 2: I'm Tracy V. 4 00:00:13,440 --> 00:00:15,080 Speaker 1: Wilson and I'm Holly Frye. 5 00:00:15,320 --> 00:00:15,880 Speaker 2: This week we. 6 00:00:15,840 --> 00:00:19,720 Speaker 3: Talked about Skyline Drive and Shenandoah National Park and the. 7 00:00:19,680 --> 00:00:20,680 Speaker 2: Blue Ridge Parkway. 8 00:00:21,000 --> 00:00:22,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, all of those things. 9 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:27,400 Speaker 3: So I grew up in northwest North Carolina. I consequently 10 00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:29,760 Speaker 3: have spent a lot of time on the Parkway in 11 00:00:29,840 --> 00:00:34,400 Speaker 3: my life. I would say I have probably driven the 12 00:00:34,440 --> 00:00:39,480 Speaker 3: whole of the North Carolina section some of the Virginia section. 13 00:00:39,880 --> 00:00:41,160 Speaker 2: I lived in an. 14 00:00:41,040 --> 00:00:45,040 Speaker 3: Area where you could drive approximately north by a couple 15 00:00:45,080 --> 00:00:49,479 Speaker 3: of different routes and get to the Parkway in Virginia, 16 00:00:50,120 --> 00:00:52,680 Speaker 3: even though I grew up in North Carolina, and so 17 00:00:52,760 --> 00:00:54,200 Speaker 3: that was kind of a thing to do. And then 18 00:00:54,480 --> 00:00:57,480 Speaker 3: at various points I have lived in western North Carolina 19 00:00:57,640 --> 00:00:59,440 Speaker 3: spent a lot of time on the Parkway. I think 20 00:00:59,480 --> 00:01:04,960 Speaker 3: I have owned been on Skyline Drive once on a 21 00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:08,119 Speaker 3: trip to Virginia some years ago. 22 00:01:08,720 --> 00:01:09,280 Speaker 2: I think I have. 23 00:01:09,280 --> 00:01:11,880 Speaker 1: Only been on a tiny part of the parkway when 24 00:01:11,959 --> 00:01:16,039 Speaker 1: we were driving to your wedding. Oh really, yeah, I 25 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:17,200 Speaker 1: haven't been on either of these. 26 00:01:18,800 --> 00:01:21,600 Speaker 3: I'm imagining which way you would have gone that would 27 00:01:21,600 --> 00:01:24,360 Speaker 3: have taken you onto the parkway, but that's just like 28 00:01:24,440 --> 00:01:25,360 Speaker 3: my mental mess. 29 00:01:25,440 --> 00:01:27,440 Speaker 1: Well, I will say, I don't know if you remember, 30 00:01:27,480 --> 00:01:30,200 Speaker 1: and I don't even remember if we told you oh no, 31 00:01:31,120 --> 00:01:34,000 Speaker 1: well it wasn't important, but I didn't want to fret 32 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:37,000 Speaker 1: you in any way. As we were driving, I can't 33 00:01:37,000 --> 00:01:40,200 Speaker 1: remember who it was. As we were driving there or back, 34 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:43,600 Speaker 1: we took a weird detour because we were following a 35 00:01:43,640 --> 00:01:47,200 Speaker 1: dog okay, and we like would lose track of it 36 00:01:47,240 --> 00:01:49,400 Speaker 1: and try to find it again, and eventually we just 37 00:01:49,440 --> 00:01:53,120 Speaker 1: lost track of the dog completely. It must have been 38 00:01:53,120 --> 00:01:54,800 Speaker 1: on the way home, because I can't imagine I would 39 00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:58,480 Speaker 1: have been like, especially because we were driving your wedding 40 00:01:58,600 --> 00:02:01,600 Speaker 1: dress to you, have been like, let's keep following this 41 00:02:01,720 --> 00:02:04,080 Speaker 1: dog wherever it may lead. Does we got to I mean, 42 00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:07,120 Speaker 1: I would want to rescue the dog. So I don't remember, 43 00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:09,160 Speaker 1: but I do remember being in a weird place and 44 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:11,880 Speaker 1: being like, uh, oh, we went a long way trying 45 00:02:11,919 --> 00:02:14,760 Speaker 1: to Oh wow, So I think that was what happened 46 00:02:14,800 --> 00:02:15,040 Speaker 1: with that. 47 00:02:15,320 --> 00:02:17,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I think, But. 48 00:02:17,639 --> 00:02:20,200 Speaker 1: I remember having a moment of oh, we're on the thing. 49 00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:22,679 Speaker 1: Not for very long, I mean like for a very 50 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:26,480 Speaker 1: short period of time. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I don't remember 51 00:02:26,600 --> 00:02:29,239 Speaker 1: much of it. I haven't driven to that area very much. 52 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:33,800 Speaker 1: When I was living in the Atlanta area. There was 53 00:02:33,840 --> 00:02:37,760 Speaker 1: one time that I had gone on a little like vacation, 54 00:02:38,600 --> 00:02:41,720 Speaker 1: long weekend kind of thing to Ashville, and I just 55 00:02:41,760 --> 00:02:45,519 Speaker 1: didn't want to go home yet when it was time 56 00:02:45,560 --> 00:02:48,840 Speaker 1: to go home, and so I made the drive home 57 00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:53,560 Speaker 1: be just a very long out of their way route 58 00:02:53,560 --> 00:02:56,000 Speaker 1: where I was on the parkway for a really long 59 00:02:56,040 --> 00:02:59,119 Speaker 1: time and then dropped off of it and like went 60 00:02:59,160 --> 00:03:03,680 Speaker 1: through the back roads through northern like North Georgia to 61 00:03:03,720 --> 00:03:08,560 Speaker 1: get back home, stopped it everywhere that was selling local honey, 62 00:03:08,960 --> 00:03:13,040 Speaker 1: got a collection of unusual honeys by the time I 63 00:03:13,080 --> 00:03:16,960 Speaker 1: got home. I have a great fondness for the Blue 64 00:03:17,000 --> 00:03:19,960 Speaker 1: Ridge Parkway, and I have also had mixed feelings about 65 00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:23,280 Speaker 1: it since my childhood, like from going up there with 66 00:03:23,320 --> 00:03:26,560 Speaker 1: my mom kind of being like, this is a beautiful drive, 67 00:03:27,160 --> 00:03:28,200 Speaker 1: this is really pretty. 68 00:03:29,040 --> 00:03:31,959 Speaker 3: Why is there a road here? Did we build a 69 00:03:32,080 --> 00:03:35,960 Speaker 3: road here just to drive on? Basically yes, yeah, And 70 00:03:36,400 --> 00:03:39,400 Speaker 3: I would say that my various layers of mixed feelings 71 00:03:39,480 --> 00:03:43,760 Speaker 3: about all of these things just got more complex, more 72 00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:48,280 Speaker 3: layers of mixed feelings because it is beautiful the whole 73 00:03:48,320 --> 00:03:51,000 Speaker 3: area around the Parkway is beautiful. A lot of it 74 00:03:51,040 --> 00:03:56,360 Speaker 3: is currently hurricane devastated, but still beautiful. Something that I've 75 00:03:56,400 --> 00:03:59,600 Speaker 3: sort of come to appreciate more recently is that I 76 00:03:59,680 --> 00:04:03,440 Speaker 3: like the idea of everyone having access to nature, and 77 00:04:03,480 --> 00:04:07,480 Speaker 3: I think that like beautiful mountain views should not be 78 00:04:07,600 --> 00:04:11,480 Speaker 3: reserved only for people that have the ability to hike 79 00:04:11,560 --> 00:04:16,080 Speaker 3: long distances, right, that kind of stuff. So I read 80 00:04:16,080 --> 00:04:19,400 Speaker 3: a lot of stuff for these episodes. One of the 81 00:04:19,440 --> 00:04:23,520 Speaker 3: things that I read was the proceedings of a conference 82 00:04:23,600 --> 00:04:26,840 Speaker 3: that had been held for the fiftieth anniversary of the Parkway. 83 00:04:27,200 --> 00:04:28,640 Speaker 2: To be clear, the parkway was. 84 00:04:28,640 --> 00:04:33,040 Speaker 3: Not done yet when they had this fiftieth anniversary conference, 85 00:04:33,920 --> 00:04:36,800 Speaker 3: because it was starting with like when it was authorized, 86 00:04:36,839 --> 00:04:39,480 Speaker 3: and it took more than fifty years to get done. 87 00:04:40,320 --> 00:04:43,440 Speaker 3: So there was a paper that was by James F. 88 00:04:43,560 --> 00:04:51,400 Speaker 3: Shephard called Land Use Attitudes of Rural Residents And here's 89 00:04:51,400 --> 00:04:55,839 Speaker 3: a quote quote. To obtain the attitudes of rural residents 90 00:04:55,880 --> 00:05:00,520 Speaker 3: regarding land use, I have conducted ethnographic interviews. All the 91 00:05:00,520 --> 00:05:03,840 Speaker 3: interviews were tape recorded. Five basic groups of residents were 92 00:05:03,880 --> 00:05:07,800 Speaker 3: found in Grayson County. First, the residents were divided into 93 00:05:07,920 --> 00:05:11,240 Speaker 3: Native or non native categories. I will take a moment 94 00:05:11,279 --> 00:05:13,359 Speaker 3: to say, I think native or non native in this 95 00:05:13,920 --> 00:05:16,600 Speaker 3: context is the people who were born and grew up 96 00:05:16,680 --> 00:05:19,760 Speaker 3: grew up there versus people who moved into the area. 97 00:05:20,120 --> 00:05:23,440 Speaker 1: I got youa not suggesting indigenous. 98 00:05:23,560 --> 00:05:26,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't think this means indigenous or non indigenous. 99 00:05:27,160 --> 00:05:30,080 Speaker 3: From these two categories, residents could fall into one of 100 00:05:30,160 --> 00:05:39,400 Speaker 3: three subcategories one retirees or summer home resident, two counter culturalist, 101 00:05:39,720 --> 00:05:45,600 Speaker 3: three movers and shakers. And I was like, wow, I 102 00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:48,839 Speaker 3: had never really thought about what three categories? Could I 103 00:05:49,040 --> 00:05:54,679 Speaker 3: sort people into? Four areas like the Blue Ridge Mountains 104 00:05:54,720 --> 00:05:58,480 Speaker 3: around the Parkway, But boy, does that really make. 105 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:01,840 Speaker 2: Sense to me, these three broad categories. 106 00:06:03,200 --> 00:06:07,760 Speaker 3: I also read a couple of very deeply frustrating articles 107 00:06:08,040 --> 00:06:12,520 Speaker 3: about the process of removing people from their land for 108 00:06:12,640 --> 00:06:18,600 Speaker 3: Shenandoah National Park's establishment, because they made it sound like 109 00:06:18,640 --> 00:06:24,440 Speaker 3: this was an unprecedented thing in the region, and I'm like, Okay, 110 00:06:26,200 --> 00:06:30,320 Speaker 3: we're talking about a place that is named Shenandoah, which 111 00:06:30,360 --> 00:06:34,400 Speaker 3: is generally agreed as coming from an indigenous language, but 112 00:06:34,480 --> 00:06:37,479 Speaker 3: we're not actually sure which language or which specific word 113 00:06:37,520 --> 00:06:41,480 Speaker 3: it's a reference to. Because of all the forced removal 114 00:06:41,520 --> 00:06:44,920 Speaker 3: and displacement in genocide that had already happened in earlier 115 00:06:44,960 --> 00:06:50,400 Speaker 3: eras before people were again forcibly removed from Shenandoah for 116 00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:50,760 Speaker 3: the park. 117 00:06:51,480 --> 00:06:52,800 Speaker 2: I found that very frustrating. 118 00:06:53,200 --> 00:06:56,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, I fixated on something very silly. 119 00:06:56,000 --> 00:06:59,240 Speaker 3: And in this second episode, I'm going to let you 120 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:01,080 Speaker 3: tell everybody because he told me, and I was like, 121 00:07:01,240 --> 00:07:02,680 Speaker 3: I thought it was funny. Oh, it's the same thing 122 00:07:02,680 --> 00:07:03,840 Speaker 3: that we talked about. I don't know what the se 123 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:07,279 Speaker 3: tell me, No, tell me what you fixated on the 124 00:07:07,320 --> 00:07:10,600 Speaker 3: guy talking about taking a knife to the Mona Lisa. Okay, 125 00:07:11,680 --> 00:07:14,920 Speaker 3: here's why that was funny to me. Okay, this conversation 126 00:07:15,080 --> 00:07:18,840 Speaker 3: was happening in the nineteen thirties. If it had happened 127 00:07:18,880 --> 00:07:21,800 Speaker 3: forty years earlier, no one would have referenced the Mona Lisa. 128 00:07:22,320 --> 00:07:25,520 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, because no one knew anything about it until 129 00:07:25,520 --> 00:07:28,280 Speaker 1: it got stolen in nineteen eleven. That's seat and it 130 00:07:28,440 --> 00:07:31,160 Speaker 1: just made me laugh so hard. Yeah, because you know, 131 00:07:31,280 --> 00:07:37,080 Speaker 1: even if you look at old news reports about the theft, 132 00:07:37,400 --> 00:07:40,040 Speaker 1: some of them feature the wrong piece of art, like 133 00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:44,920 Speaker 1: nobody wow what the Mona Lisa was? And so, because 134 00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:48,240 Speaker 1: I really like art history and that theft in particular, 135 00:07:48,320 --> 00:07:52,720 Speaker 1: is fascinating to me because of how it shaped global 136 00:07:52,920 --> 00:07:57,840 Speaker 1: views of art history. It's like, you see, in a 137 00:07:58,040 --> 00:08:02,040 Speaker 1: very short less than three decades, it had become such 138 00:08:02,160 --> 00:08:06,360 Speaker 1: an obvious touchstone to people that it was. It had 139 00:08:06,680 --> 00:08:12,080 Speaker 1: been elevated from completely unknown work to the apex of 140 00:08:12,240 --> 00:08:15,360 Speaker 1: art that you would never deface. And I'm fascinated by 141 00:08:15,360 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 1: that anyway, mentioned in Themisa, what was the thing that 142 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:20,120 Speaker 1: you thought? So? 143 00:08:20,160 --> 00:08:22,240 Speaker 3: I thought you were going to say something. So normally 144 00:08:22,320 --> 00:08:24,880 Speaker 3: when we do these behind the scenes episodes, we recorded 145 00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:27,080 Speaker 3: the episode and then we recorded the behind the scenes. 146 00:08:28,440 --> 00:08:32,800 Speaker 3: And since the Skyline Drive episode and the Blue Ridge 147 00:08:32,800 --> 00:08:37,559 Speaker 3: Parkway episode were sort of researched and written in tandem, we. 148 00:08:37,440 --> 00:08:38,880 Speaker 2: Record were We recorded the. 149 00:08:39,600 --> 00:08:42,640 Speaker 3: Skyline Drive one, which was finished, and then I finished 150 00:08:42,640 --> 00:08:44,960 Speaker 3: the Blue Ridge Parkway one and we recorded that the 151 00:08:44,960 --> 00:08:47,439 Speaker 3: next week, and now here we are recording the behind 152 00:08:47,480 --> 00:08:50,040 Speaker 3: the scenes for both of them together. But you and 153 00:08:50,080 --> 00:08:53,000 Speaker 3: I had a conversation after recording the Skyline Drive one 154 00:08:54,240 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 3: about statements that people were making about a proposed skyline 155 00:09:00,640 --> 00:09:03,800 Speaker 3: through Shenandoah that would be like an unparalleled scenic. 156 00:09:04,120 --> 00:09:11,480 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, and you found that hilarious, not that it's 157 00:09:11,520 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 1: not beautiful, but anytime people get real superlative about something 158 00:09:16,080 --> 00:09:18,600 Speaker 1: like that. I think I said something like, brother, have 159 00:09:18,640 --> 00:09:22,760 Speaker 1: you not been to Italy? Like when you when you 160 00:09:23,000 --> 00:09:27,960 Speaker 1: drive along Italy and you could see, you know, the 161 00:09:28,040 --> 00:09:32,000 Speaker 1: mountains where the Careerra Marble comes from. It's a pretty 162 00:09:32,200 --> 00:09:36,960 Speaker 1: astonishing view, right, And lots of places have views equally 163 00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:41,120 Speaker 1: astonishing and beautiful. So it's like when they're like unparalleled, 164 00:09:41,120 --> 00:09:43,680 Speaker 1: I'm like, I mean, yes, but like, are you sure 165 00:09:43,720 --> 00:09:45,559 Speaker 1: you want to go out on a limb like that? 166 00:09:46,360 --> 00:09:49,520 Speaker 3: I think some of the people who made statements like that, 167 00:09:49,800 --> 00:09:53,800 Speaker 3: like there was a context of specifically building a road 168 00:09:54,040 --> 00:09:58,240 Speaker 3: in order for it to be a scenic drive without 169 00:09:58,280 --> 00:10:02,240 Speaker 3: a lot of other purpose, And I was trying to 170 00:10:02,240 --> 00:10:05,800 Speaker 3: figure out if there were other Like, there are definitely 171 00:10:05,840 --> 00:10:07,840 Speaker 3: other There are plenty of other parkways in the world. 172 00:10:07,920 --> 00:10:10,960 Speaker 3: There are a ton of other parkways in the United States. 173 00:10:12,480 --> 00:10:15,920 Speaker 3: The Blue Ridge Parkway and Skyline Drive were built during 174 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:19,280 Speaker 3: an era of road building through and to connect to 175 00:10:19,320 --> 00:10:21,200 Speaker 3: the National Parks, and a lot of it had this 176 00:10:21,320 --> 00:10:26,880 Speaker 3: like very similar quote naturalistic design for the road and 177 00:10:26,920 --> 00:10:28,880 Speaker 3: like the road was supposed to be beautiful and the 178 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:32,600 Speaker 3: landscape the road was traveling through was supposed to be 179 00:10:32,600 --> 00:10:36,360 Speaker 3: beautiful and managed. Yeah, So some of the people at 180 00:10:36,400 --> 00:10:38,680 Speaker 3: the time who were riding about this kind of thing 181 00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:42,720 Speaker 3: made it sound like this was a completely new idea 182 00:10:42,880 --> 00:10:46,679 Speaker 3: for the entire world, that nowhere in the world had 183 00:10:46,720 --> 00:10:51,840 Speaker 3: anyone decided to just make a road in order to 184 00:10:51,880 --> 00:10:56,080 Speaker 3: be a scenic road, not just to have a road 185 00:10:56,120 --> 00:10:59,320 Speaker 3: that's a highway for travel that happens to be scenic. 186 00:11:00,720 --> 00:11:06,199 Speaker 3: And I don't actually know the answer to that whether 187 00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:11,040 Speaker 3: this really I would say probably not a completely unprecedented thing, 188 00:11:11,440 --> 00:11:13,640 Speaker 3: but some of the people who were writing about these 189 00:11:13,760 --> 00:11:17,240 Speaker 3: roads in the nineteen thirties made it sound like it was. 190 00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:20,319 Speaker 2: Totally new idea. 191 00:11:20,440 --> 00:11:22,559 Speaker 3: No one had ever thought to just build a scenic 192 00:11:22,679 --> 00:11:25,760 Speaker 3: road for its scenicness as the primary purpose before. 193 00:11:35,360 --> 00:11:39,719 Speaker 1: I also get in that like heady overthinking space of 194 00:11:39,760 --> 00:11:42,800 Speaker 1: building a scenic road for it to be scenic, but 195 00:11:42,920 --> 00:11:46,840 Speaker 1: also having to do maintenance on it. I'm like, is 196 00:11:46,880 --> 00:11:51,120 Speaker 1: that really scenic or is it curated? It's definitely curated, right, So, 197 00:11:51,280 --> 00:11:54,000 Speaker 1: like I don't know, Like I said, it gets way 198 00:11:54,040 --> 00:11:56,240 Speaker 1: too in my head and in the weeds about like 199 00:11:57,240 --> 00:11:57,760 Speaker 1: what is that? 200 00:11:57,800 --> 00:11:58,000 Speaker 2: Then? 201 00:11:58,080 --> 00:12:01,360 Speaker 1: What's a real scenic road? Is it very paved? Is it? 202 00:12:01,640 --> 00:12:02,520 Speaker 2: Yeah? 203 00:12:02,760 --> 00:12:08,280 Speaker 1: Because you'll never see the truly untouched version of it. Yeah, 204 00:12:08,360 --> 00:12:11,080 Speaker 1: unless you are a person this this goes back to 205 00:12:11,160 --> 00:12:14,640 Speaker 1: your discussion about how important it is that you know, 206 00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:19,040 Speaker 1: nature access be available to everyone, And clearly everyone could 207 00:12:19,080 --> 00:12:22,160 Speaker 1: not see those places if we did not put some 208 00:12:22,200 --> 00:12:23,520 Speaker 1: sort of roadway through there. 209 00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:24,360 Speaker 2: Right. 210 00:12:25,400 --> 00:12:27,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, just I end up in the I'm the snake 211 00:12:27,440 --> 00:12:29,839 Speaker 1: that bites its own tail. I can't kick it out 212 00:12:29,840 --> 00:12:30,719 Speaker 1: of the spiral. 213 00:12:31,880 --> 00:12:36,280 Speaker 3: All of these things are true, they are all interconnected together. 214 00:12:37,320 --> 00:12:40,480 Speaker 3: I said at the I think, I think I said 215 00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:45,720 Speaker 3: in the Shenandoah episode that a lot of people that 216 00:12:45,760 --> 00:12:48,080 Speaker 3: I talked to in and around the Nashville area were 217 00:12:49,280 --> 00:12:56,200 Speaker 3: incredibly anxious for tourism to come back to pre Helene levels. 218 00:12:57,120 --> 00:12:59,920 Speaker 3: I don't want to like minimize the fact that the 219 00:13:00,360 --> 00:13:04,920 Speaker 3: like this storm was horrifically destructive. There were a lot 220 00:13:04,960 --> 00:13:09,640 Speaker 3: of whole towns and villages that were basically wiped off 221 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:15,400 Speaker 3: the map, Like the entire the entire village just basically 222 00:13:15,520 --> 00:13:18,959 Speaker 3: swept off of its foundations by floodwaters and the debris 223 00:13:19,000 --> 00:13:22,240 Speaker 3: and the floodwaters. There are a lot of roads in 224 00:13:22,280 --> 00:13:26,920 Speaker 3: the area that are closed to everything but local traffic, 225 00:13:26,920 --> 00:13:29,520 Speaker 3: and in some cases, like you actually have to have 226 00:13:29,559 --> 00:13:32,960 Speaker 3: a permit saying yes, this is like I live here 227 00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:36,240 Speaker 3: to be able to go down that road. So I 228 00:13:36,320 --> 00:13:39,480 Speaker 3: intentionally did not try to get into any of those areas. 229 00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:43,640 Speaker 3: I intentionally stayed like in the areas that have said 230 00:13:44,880 --> 00:13:46,640 Speaker 3: we are open for business, please come. 231 00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:49,760 Speaker 2: And I don't know, I. 232 00:13:49,880 --> 00:13:52,880 Speaker 3: Have nothing else to say about that, really except that, like, 233 00:13:52,960 --> 00:13:55,280 Speaker 3: if you've been wondering, is it okay to go to 234 00:13:55,360 --> 00:13:59,200 Speaker 3: vacations on these places, the answer seems to be from 235 00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:02,280 Speaker 3: the local people, Yes, it's okay to go on vacation 236 00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:04,840 Speaker 3: to these places, but like, don't go try to bully 237 00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:12,120 Speaker 3: yourself into the areas that are still like lacking basic services, 238 00:14:12,520 --> 00:14:14,920 Speaker 3: like where the roads are still destroyed, that kind of stuff. 239 00:14:15,240 --> 00:14:18,559 Speaker 1: Yeah, and I'm very glad you did these episodes, because 240 00:14:18,600 --> 00:14:21,120 Speaker 1: all of this does speak to the fact that the 241 00:14:21,160 --> 00:14:23,640 Speaker 1: news cycle is so bananas that we can lose track 242 00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:26,920 Speaker 1: of the things that take a long time to recover from. Yeah, Like, 243 00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:31,240 Speaker 1: there's no coverage of Helene recovery going on right in 244 00:14:31,320 --> 00:14:34,240 Speaker 1: any major news outlets that I've seen in quite some time. 245 00:14:34,800 --> 00:14:37,120 Speaker 1: And it's easy, I think, for people that are not 246 00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:40,080 Speaker 1: immediately affected by it to forget that there are still 247 00:14:40,080 --> 00:14:44,600 Speaker 1: people really really struggling to try to get their feet 248 00:14:44,680 --> 00:14:48,800 Speaker 1: back unto them. I don't know how we fix this 249 00:14:49,440 --> 00:14:52,320 Speaker 1: problem because there is so much to take in constantly. 250 00:14:52,800 --> 00:14:55,840 Speaker 1: But also if you think I did not run to 251 00:14:55,920 --> 00:15:00,520 Speaker 1: the Xerxes Society for Invertebrate Conservation, you're wrong. 252 00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:04,360 Speaker 2: So excited, I. 253 00:15:04,320 --> 00:15:08,880 Speaker 1: Have already been working a lot on my selection of 254 00:15:08,920 --> 00:15:12,000 Speaker 1: plants for the yard this year to make sure that 255 00:15:12,240 --> 00:15:15,560 Speaker 1: you know we're friendly to pollinators and other creatures. But 256 00:15:16,000 --> 00:15:20,040 Speaker 1: they're full of good information there. If anybody doesn't hasn't 257 00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:23,240 Speaker 1: been there yet and hadn't heard of it until our 258 00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:28,840 Speaker 1: listener mail this week that mentioned it specifically because it's cool. Yeah, yeah, 259 00:15:28,920 --> 00:15:32,640 Speaker 1: I got a flashback as you were reading that Listener 260 00:15:32,720 --> 00:15:35,880 Speaker 1: letter to the time I had a very sad breakdown 261 00:15:35,920 --> 00:15:39,280 Speaker 1: on a plane over a bee. It's just not that 262 00:15:39,320 --> 00:15:42,280 Speaker 1: long ago. There was a bee in a plane during boarding. 263 00:15:43,040 --> 00:15:44,920 Speaker 1: This is probably a year a year and a half ago, 264 00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:49,000 Speaker 1: and the people sitting near me lost their minds and 265 00:15:49,040 --> 00:15:53,280 Speaker 1: freaked out and had were like kill it, and I 266 00:15:53,360 --> 00:15:55,760 Speaker 1: was trying to like I wanted to collect it and 267 00:15:55,800 --> 00:15:59,240 Speaker 1: put it outside again. During boarding boarding door not closed 268 00:16:00,200 --> 00:16:02,600 Speaker 1: and going, and there was one woman that was just 269 00:16:02,760 --> 00:16:06,280 Speaker 1: like people are allergic. You could die, and I'm like, 270 00:16:06,320 --> 00:16:09,080 Speaker 1: are you allergic, and like it's a bee, it's fine, 271 00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:12,520 Speaker 1: and I just I literally ended up in tears because 272 00:16:12,520 --> 00:16:14,440 Speaker 1: I was the only person that cared about the bee. 273 00:16:14,720 --> 00:16:20,480 Speaker 1: Oh and it did not make it off of that plane. 274 00:16:20,520 --> 00:16:23,400 Speaker 1: I'm sad to say, because some dude had to show 275 00:16:23,400 --> 00:16:26,400 Speaker 1: what a protector he was. Anyway, Sorry, be it did 276 00:16:26,440 --> 00:16:30,320 Speaker 1: not do enough for you that day, anyway, What you 277 00:16:30,360 --> 00:16:32,840 Speaker 1: can't for your pollinators? We need them. Yeah, without them, 278 00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:36,640 Speaker 1: we're not gonna eat. Huh. 279 00:16:37,080 --> 00:16:39,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. I don't know. 280 00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:42,720 Speaker 3: If I have anything else to say about any of 281 00:16:42,760 --> 00:16:45,040 Speaker 3: these things, I will reiterate that I do love our 282 00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:50,479 Speaker 3: national parks. I do not love the fact that, especially 283 00:16:50,520 --> 00:16:51,560 Speaker 3: in the West, like. 284 00:16:53,160 --> 00:16:55,080 Speaker 2: The national parks. 285 00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:59,120 Speaker 3: Exist because of displacement and genocide. And then in the 286 00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:05,040 Speaker 3: East also true, but like separated by more time that 287 00:17:05,160 --> 00:17:10,679 Speaker 3: had passed in the interim. Under the Biden administration, we 288 00:17:10,800 --> 00:17:14,280 Speaker 3: had an Indigenous Secretary of the Interior for the first time, 289 00:17:14,400 --> 00:17:17,000 Speaker 3: an Indigenous Director of the National Park Service for the 290 00:17:17,000 --> 00:17:21,320 Speaker 3: first time, and a lot of work was being done 291 00:17:21,520 --> 00:17:26,439 Speaker 3: to try to work out co management agreements with different 292 00:17:26,440 --> 00:17:31,119 Speaker 3: indigenous nations to co manage land that is their ancestral 293 00:17:31,160 --> 00:17:34,159 Speaker 3: homeland in some cases, to return land from the parks. 294 00:17:34,240 --> 00:17:37,359 Speaker 3: That didn't start with the Biden administration, but like that 295 00:17:37,480 --> 00:17:43,600 Speaker 3: had been like specific intentional thing that had been undertaken 296 00:17:43,680 --> 00:17:47,119 Speaker 3: under that administration. And I don't know what the status 297 00:17:47,160 --> 00:17:50,880 Speaker 3: of any of that is at this point, in part 298 00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:56,480 Speaker 3: because the fire hose of things about the national parks 299 00:17:56,520 --> 00:18:02,440 Speaker 3: in particular has been focused on other stuff like reductions 300 00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:07,320 Speaker 3: in force for the park workers and like opening up 301 00:18:07,400 --> 00:18:10,800 Speaker 3: national forests two more logging and that kind of stuff. 302 00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:14,359 Speaker 3: So my efforts to figure out, like what the Trump 303 00:18:14,400 --> 00:18:19,320 Speaker 3: administration's views are on that part, I did not go 304 00:18:19,400 --> 00:18:22,640 Speaker 3: read Project twenty twenty five or whatever to find out 305 00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:29,560 Speaker 3: if that said anything. But yeah, I hope, hope even 306 00:18:29,560 --> 00:18:31,720 Speaker 3: the right word that we don't make a bunch of 307 00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:33,040 Speaker 3: big step backwards and all of that. 308 00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:40,199 Speaker 1: Me too, fingers toes a little bee feet crossed, Yeah, 309 00:18:40,400 --> 00:18:41,200 Speaker 1: little bfeet. 310 00:18:42,720 --> 00:18:45,200 Speaker 3: If you would like to send us a note about 311 00:18:45,200 --> 00:18:47,639 Speaker 3: this or any other podcasts or history podcasts that I 312 00:18:47,680 --> 00:18:51,720 Speaker 3: heart radio dot com, we will be back tomorrow with 313 00:18:51,760 --> 00:18:56,000 Speaker 3: a Saturday classic something brand new on Monday. Whatever's happening 314 00:18:56,560 --> 00:19:01,359 Speaker 3: on your weekends. I hope it is as lovely as possible. 315 00:19:01,400 --> 00:19:04,600 Speaker 3: If you're able to get out into some nature, if 316 00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:07,359 Speaker 3: that's accessible to you, I hope you're able to do that. 317 00:19:07,359 --> 00:19:10,240 Speaker 3: That always helps me take a little bit deeper breath 318 00:19:10,320 --> 00:19:12,040 Speaker 3: than I can take when I am just in my 319 00:19:12,119 --> 00:19:15,320 Speaker 3: house all the time. So we'll be back with a 320 00:19:15,320 --> 00:19:23,679 Speaker 3: Saturday classic tomorrow. Is something brand new on Monday. Stuff 321 00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:26,480 Speaker 3: you Missed in History Class is a production of iHeartRadio. 322 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:31,440 Speaker 3: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 323 00:19:31,560 --> 00:19:33,560 Speaker 3: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.