1 00:00:15,316 --> 00:00:24,196 Speaker 1: Pushkin. Beer is deep. It's as old as civilization, older 2 00:00:24,236 --> 00:00:28,596 Speaker 1: than writing or money. Beer is ritual, Beer is delicious. 3 00:00:28,956 --> 00:00:31,956 Speaker 1: Beer is a way to get drunk. So here's a question. 4 00:00:32,516 --> 00:00:35,396 Speaker 1: Can you keep all the ritual and deliciousness of beer 5 00:00:35,716 --> 00:00:41,276 Speaker 1: and get rid of the getting drunk part. I'm Jacob 6 00:00:41,316 --> 00:00:43,876 Speaker 1: Goldstein and this is What's Your Problem, the show where 7 00:00:43,996 --> 00:00:46,436 Speaker 1: entrepreneurs and engineers talk about how they're going to change 8 00:00:46,436 --> 00:00:49,276 Speaker 1: the world once they solve a few problems. My guest 9 00:00:49,316 --> 00:00:53,516 Speaker 1: today is Bill Schufeld, founder and CEO of Athletic Brewing Company, 10 00:00:53,636 --> 00:00:57,756 Speaker 1: which brews craft non alcoholic beer. Bill's problem is this, 11 00:00:58,316 --> 00:01:01,636 Speaker 1: how do you turn non alcoholic beer from a punchline 12 00:01:01,996 --> 00:01:07,036 Speaker 1: into a normal thing? People drink all the time. When 13 00:01:07,076 --> 00:01:09,796 Speaker 1: Bill worked in finance in his twenties, he drank at 14 00:01:09,836 --> 00:01:12,716 Speaker 1: social events several nights a week. He was also really 15 00:01:12,756 --> 00:01:15,596 Speaker 1: into sports and working out, and around the time he 16 00:01:15,636 --> 00:01:18,636 Speaker 1: turned thirty, he found that drinking was slowing him down, 17 00:01:18,756 --> 00:01:22,036 Speaker 1: so he stopped drinking, and that, he told me, made 18 00:01:22,076 --> 00:01:25,276 Speaker 1: his social life much harder. Everywhere I was going after 19 00:01:25,316 --> 00:01:28,596 Speaker 1: I stopped drinking. When I tried to order a non 20 00:01:28,596 --> 00:01:31,116 Speaker 1: alcoholic beer in a loud bar, restaurant. It seemed like 21 00:01:31,156 --> 00:01:33,876 Speaker 1: the music would stop and fifty people would look at 22 00:01:33,876 --> 00:01:37,476 Speaker 1: me and be like, Oh, my goodness, is this guy okay? 23 00:01:37,556 --> 00:01:40,476 Speaker 1: Can he be trusted? Something has happened here, Like, let's 24 00:01:40,476 --> 00:01:42,036 Speaker 1: try to get to the bottom of it before the 25 00:01:42,156 --> 00:01:44,676 Speaker 1: night goes on. Everywhere I was going these days, there 26 00:01:44,676 --> 00:01:47,556 Speaker 1: were just no options on any menu. There were stigmas 27 00:01:47,556 --> 00:01:50,156 Speaker 1: around any choice he would choose at a group setting, 28 00:01:50,156 --> 00:01:54,116 Speaker 1: out of social setting. And it just blew my mind 29 00:01:54,236 --> 00:01:59,676 Speaker 1: that the adult beverage industry hadn't evolved the sophistication of 30 00:01:59,756 --> 00:02:02,476 Speaker 1: a glass of wine or a nice craft beer or 31 00:02:02,516 --> 00:02:05,876 Speaker 1: a very well crafted cocktail, and there was just no 32 00:02:05,956 --> 00:02:10,436 Speaker 1: replacing that. The options were super bleak. Even five years 33 00:02:10,436 --> 00:02:13,516 Speaker 1: ago there had been while the whole grocery store had 34 00:02:13,516 --> 00:02:16,596 Speaker 1: evolved and the whole bar menu had evolved. There's this 35 00:02:16,636 --> 00:02:20,476 Speaker 1: one dusty corner of everything that hadn't changed in really 36 00:02:20,636 --> 00:02:24,076 Speaker 1: thirty five fifty years. It had the same case of 37 00:02:24,076 --> 00:02:27,516 Speaker 1: o'duels that had been sitting there for thirty years. Basically, Yeah, 38 00:02:27,636 --> 00:02:31,676 Speaker 1: these products somehow survived prohibition and survived right through to 39 00:02:31,716 --> 00:02:36,556 Speaker 1: the two thousands. Okay, so go on, So what happens next? Yeah, 40 00:02:36,596 --> 00:02:41,236 Speaker 1: I guess the moment where I had the actual realization. 41 00:02:41,396 --> 00:02:43,116 Speaker 1: Me and my wife were walking to dinner and I 42 00:02:43,156 --> 00:02:47,676 Speaker 1: was yet again complaining, and I just exclaimed, I can't 43 00:02:47,716 --> 00:02:50,316 Speaker 1: believe that no one has tackled this yet, that someone 44 00:02:50,356 --> 00:02:54,356 Speaker 1: should make amazing craft non alcoholic beer that is as 45 00:02:54,356 --> 00:02:57,596 Speaker 1: good as any alcoholic option out there, both in experience 46 00:02:57,636 --> 00:03:02,036 Speaker 1: and quality. And when I said that, she just grabbed 47 00:03:02,076 --> 00:03:05,396 Speaker 1: my shoulder and said, that's an amazing idea, And she 48 00:03:05,436 --> 00:03:07,316 Speaker 1: had never said that before. We had known each other 49 00:03:07,356 --> 00:03:11,076 Speaker 1: for fifteen years at that point, first amazing idea you'd 50 00:03:11,116 --> 00:03:17,116 Speaker 1: had in her eyes? Yeah, And we immediately the wheels 51 00:03:17,236 --> 00:03:19,476 Speaker 1: got turning, and we talked about it the hole dinner. 52 00:03:19,636 --> 00:03:21,996 Speaker 1: We started researching on our laptops when we got back, 53 00:03:22,116 --> 00:03:24,436 Speaker 1: and every data point we pulled up, we were like, Wow, 54 00:03:24,516 --> 00:03:27,956 Speaker 1: this is just a huge opportunity. Or I didn't realize 55 00:03:27,956 --> 00:03:32,356 Speaker 1: this many people don't drink, and like I didn't realize 56 00:03:32,356 --> 00:03:35,476 Speaker 1: how everywhere else except the US, that non alcohol adult 57 00:03:35,516 --> 00:03:39,796 Speaker 1: beverages are an enormous market. I found myself working on 58 00:03:39,836 --> 00:03:42,396 Speaker 1: it on nights and weekends and drawing up a business 59 00:03:42,396 --> 00:03:45,436 Speaker 1: plan and running surveys and calling people in Germany to 60 00:03:45,436 --> 00:03:50,036 Speaker 1: ask about technology, and it just snowballed for two years straight. 61 00:03:50,716 --> 00:03:57,196 Speaker 1: And so going into twenty seventeen, resigned from my resigned 62 00:03:57,236 --> 00:04:00,436 Speaker 1: from my job and went full time on it, which 63 00:04:00,516 --> 00:04:04,796 Speaker 1: was a pretty shocking moment, and especially to work on 64 00:04:04,876 --> 00:04:07,876 Speaker 1: non alcoholic beer. There was no market, there was no 65 00:04:07,956 --> 00:04:11,756 Speaker 1: facilities at the time making great non alcoholic beer. We 66 00:04:11,796 --> 00:04:14,756 Speaker 1: were going to be the first brewery and tap room 67 00:04:14,876 --> 00:04:18,276 Speaker 1: that did non alcoholic beer as a pure focus in 68 00:04:18,316 --> 00:04:21,876 Speaker 1: the country. Now you have this fundamentally a technical problem, right, 69 00:04:21,876 --> 00:04:25,796 Speaker 1: a kind of kind of an engineering problem, a brewing problem. 70 00:04:26,316 --> 00:04:31,036 Speaker 1: You want to make like very delicious, interesting beer that 71 00:04:31,076 --> 00:04:33,276 Speaker 1: doesn't have any alcohol in it, right, which is which 72 00:04:33,316 --> 00:04:34,916 Speaker 1: is a technical problem. How do you do it? How 73 00:04:34,916 --> 00:04:39,196 Speaker 1: do you solve that? Yeah? So I had overwhelming passion, 74 00:04:39,876 --> 00:04:44,916 Speaker 1: overwhelming delusional optimism, call it. And I thought starting a 75 00:04:44,956 --> 00:04:47,956 Speaker 1: business was going to be super easy, And here we God, 76 00:04:48,516 --> 00:04:51,716 Speaker 1: did you really I think I did? I thought I 77 00:04:51,756 --> 00:04:54,916 Speaker 1: would be often running and things scale nicely and their 78 00:04:54,996 --> 00:04:58,076 Speaker 1: vendors for everything, and here we go. And I have 79 00:04:58,236 --> 00:05:01,396 Speaker 1: such respect for anyone who has started any size business 80 00:05:01,476 --> 00:05:04,756 Speaker 1: out there. It is there isn't as anyone knows who's 81 00:05:04,796 --> 00:05:07,556 Speaker 1: built anything, There isn't a single easy step to anything 82 00:05:07,876 --> 00:05:11,236 Speaker 1: out there at any scale, Allen, It's amazing. How so, 83 00:05:11,316 --> 00:05:13,836 Speaker 1: I'd read every brewing textbook out there under the sun 84 00:05:13,996 --> 00:05:16,036 Speaker 1: before I quit my old job, but I'd never brewed 85 00:05:16,076 --> 00:05:20,396 Speaker 1: a beer period. Resigned from my job and started to 86 00:05:20,396 --> 00:05:25,236 Speaker 1: talk to potential brewers, starting to sourceburg equipment, contract brewers, everything, 87 00:05:25,676 --> 00:05:28,956 Speaker 1: and I couldn't believe how much no came at me 88 00:05:28,996 --> 00:05:33,436 Speaker 1: so fast, meaning everybody just said no every time he asked. Yeah. 89 00:05:33,476 --> 00:05:35,956 Speaker 1: I'd gone from a firm where I was a customer 90 00:05:35,996 --> 00:05:38,636 Speaker 1: of three to five hundred people. Everyone wanted to talk 91 00:05:38,676 --> 00:05:40,756 Speaker 1: to us any chance they could get sure you had 92 00:05:40,796 --> 00:05:43,316 Speaker 1: all the money, right, you were a buyer rather than 93 00:05:43,356 --> 00:05:46,596 Speaker 1: a seller in your old job, right, And like a 94 00:05:46,716 --> 00:05:49,916 Speaker 1: phone not being picked up was such a foreign concept 95 00:05:49,956 --> 00:05:54,076 Speaker 1: to me. And all of a sudden, it was unbelievable 96 00:05:54,076 --> 00:05:56,676 Speaker 1: how much outreach I did that just went utterly cold. 97 00:05:56,716 --> 00:05:59,756 Speaker 1: Then I was moving from to a sector that there 98 00:05:59,836 --> 00:06:02,796 Speaker 1: was literally no interest, and people thought, no retails, no 99 00:06:02,876 --> 00:06:05,716 Speaker 1: customers know anything, wanted anything to do with this. I 100 00:06:05,716 --> 00:06:09,516 Speaker 1: would go to brewing conferences, I was posting applications everywhere 101 00:06:09,516 --> 00:06:11,396 Speaker 1: I could, looking for our co founder and a broom 102 00:06:11,396 --> 00:06:14,756 Speaker 1: maaster and did not get one hint of interest. I 103 00:06:14,756 --> 00:06:18,436 Speaker 1: would walk into conferences with ten thousand burgers and tried 104 00:06:18,476 --> 00:06:22,196 Speaker 1: in network and grab people, and it was like a 105 00:06:22,236 --> 00:06:24,876 Speaker 1: middle school dance. I couldn't get anyone to talk to me, 106 00:06:25,316 --> 00:06:29,036 Speaker 1: and it was just like tons of nos, over and 107 00:06:29,076 --> 00:06:32,676 Speaker 1: over again. And so I eventually stopped talking about non alcoholic. 108 00:06:32,716 --> 00:06:36,076 Speaker 1: I just started talking about innovation and took non alcoholic 109 00:06:36,116 --> 00:06:40,116 Speaker 1: out of all the job descriptions. And that's interesting. Yeah, 110 00:06:40,196 --> 00:06:43,036 Speaker 1: And that's when John Walker, our co founder, reached out 111 00:06:43,076 --> 00:06:46,436 Speaker 1: to me. He was an extremely highly awarded boomaster in 112 00:06:46,476 --> 00:06:51,116 Speaker 1: Santa Fe, New Mexico, and our first conversation was, please 113 00:06:51,276 --> 00:06:53,476 Speaker 1: don't hang out. This is going to sound a little crazy, 114 00:06:53,476 --> 00:06:55,276 Speaker 1: but if you give me five to ten minutes and 115 00:06:55,396 --> 00:06:58,716 Speaker 1: don't say no for three days, like I'd love to 116 00:06:58,836 --> 00:07:02,356 Speaker 1: revisit this on Monday. And John did give me a 117 00:07:02,436 --> 00:07:05,476 Speaker 1: good half hour to talk through it. And it's so 118 00:07:05,516 --> 00:07:07,876 Speaker 1: funny looking back at our first emails. He was one 119 00:07:07,916 --> 00:07:10,636 Speaker 1: hundred percent going to say now. And then he's a 120 00:07:10,716 --> 00:07:14,236 Speaker 1: young father at the time, and he loved innovative challenges 121 00:07:14,276 --> 00:07:16,556 Speaker 1: and he was the one person who saw the potential 122 00:07:16,596 --> 00:07:18,916 Speaker 1: impact we were potentially going to have on the world, 123 00:07:19,436 --> 00:07:22,076 Speaker 1: and before I knew it, he was moving his family 124 00:07:22,316 --> 00:07:26,236 Speaker 1: across the country from Santa Fe, New Mexico to homebrew 125 00:07:26,396 --> 00:07:28,956 Speaker 1: in an empty warehouse with someone he didn't really know 126 00:07:29,036 --> 00:07:32,356 Speaker 1: at all, brewing non alcoholic beer and like with a 127 00:07:32,396 --> 00:07:34,876 Speaker 1: big hope for the future. So I know this is 128 00:07:34,876 --> 00:07:37,356 Speaker 1: more his domain than yours, But so just give me 129 00:07:37,676 --> 00:07:41,276 Speaker 1: very basic like how do you make non alcoholic beer? 130 00:07:42,036 --> 00:07:44,156 Speaker 1: And was it hard to figure out how to make 131 00:07:44,156 --> 00:07:50,876 Speaker 1: it good? Yes? So basically all non alcoholic beer from 132 00:07:51,876 --> 00:07:55,756 Speaker 1: nineteen thirties to this day, even ninety five ninety eight 133 00:07:55,756 --> 00:07:58,116 Speaker 1: percent of the non alcolck beer market is made using 134 00:07:58,156 --> 00:08:01,996 Speaker 1: the same two or three types of very simple technologies 135 00:08:01,996 --> 00:08:04,916 Speaker 1: that all don't have a ton of regard for the 136 00:08:05,076 --> 00:08:08,396 Speaker 1: nuance of fermentation and all the subtleties of like a 137 00:08:08,516 --> 00:08:11,876 Speaker 1: finally crowd to beverage. They all just basically blast it 138 00:08:11,996 --> 00:08:15,476 Speaker 1: through torch it rip out a lot of great things 139 00:08:15,516 --> 00:08:20,116 Speaker 1: to dealcoholize it. And what's the problem with those techniques? 140 00:08:20,116 --> 00:08:25,876 Speaker 1: Why are they bad? Ultimately they're just not soft enough 141 00:08:25,996 --> 00:08:29,156 Speaker 1: and careful enough to protect the nuance of a really 142 00:08:29,196 --> 00:08:32,876 Speaker 1: finely crafted beverage. So basically, you take, you take the 143 00:08:33,236 --> 00:08:36,236 Speaker 1: good flavor, the taste along with the alcohol when you 144 00:08:36,276 --> 00:08:38,436 Speaker 1: do it like that. Yeah, So instead of doing that, 145 00:08:38,596 --> 00:08:41,116 Speaker 1: is it right that what you do is you brew beer, 146 00:08:41,556 --> 00:08:43,556 Speaker 1: but you just sort of turn the dials in such 147 00:08:43,596 --> 00:08:45,436 Speaker 1: a way that at the end of the process, instead 148 00:08:45,476 --> 00:08:48,836 Speaker 1: of having whatever four percent alcohol, the beer has zero 149 00:08:48,876 --> 00:08:53,076 Speaker 1: point four percent Yep, exactly. Yeah. So in the fermentation seller, 150 00:08:53,116 --> 00:08:56,036 Speaker 1: for example, our beer never goes above zero point five percent. 151 00:08:56,636 --> 00:08:59,956 Speaker 1: In the conditioning tanks, it's refining a finished product that's 152 00:08:59,956 --> 00:09:03,356 Speaker 1: all under point five percent. And even to the most 153 00:09:03,396 --> 00:09:06,996 Speaker 1: experienced brewers, if you're walking around in our brewery, most 154 00:09:07,036 --> 00:09:09,876 Speaker 1: of it you wouldn't say is a harm all at all. 155 00:09:09,916 --> 00:09:12,956 Speaker 1: It's what we're doing in the tanks with our beers. 156 00:09:12,996 --> 00:09:17,636 Speaker 1: What's different? So do you have IP around your Do 157 00:09:17,636 --> 00:09:19,836 Speaker 1: you have intellectual property of patents on the way you 158 00:09:19,876 --> 00:09:22,996 Speaker 1: make beer? Is it a trade secret? So like the 159 00:09:23,036 --> 00:09:27,036 Speaker 1: Coca Cola formula, so more towards that. It is significant 160 00:09:27,076 --> 00:09:29,996 Speaker 1: IP for sure, and it is a trade secret, but 161 00:09:30,036 --> 00:09:32,836 Speaker 1: it is more in the Coca Cola category where if 162 00:09:32,876 --> 00:09:34,996 Speaker 1: you go for a patent, you have to publish out 163 00:09:35,036 --> 00:09:39,156 Speaker 1: there your patent for contestion and approval and everything. And 164 00:09:40,916 --> 00:09:43,356 Speaker 1: we knew with ten thousand birds in the country that 165 00:09:43,436 --> 00:09:45,716 Speaker 1: if we publish how we make our beer, then we're 166 00:09:45,716 --> 00:09:48,356 Speaker 1: in the business of policing our patent as well, and 167 00:09:48,476 --> 00:09:51,236 Speaker 1: we would much rather just have it be something that 168 00:09:51,276 --> 00:09:54,796 Speaker 1: we do proudly internally in our own berries, and we're 169 00:09:54,796 --> 00:09:58,516 Speaker 1: super focused on quality every step of it in house 170 00:09:58,596 --> 00:10:01,476 Speaker 1: at Athletic. I mean, the trade secret worked for Coke, 171 00:10:01,836 --> 00:10:06,756 Speaker 1: still working for Coke, seems to be for sure after 172 00:10:06,796 --> 00:10:08,436 Speaker 1: all that. I don't want to say that making the 173 00:10:08,476 --> 00:10:11,796 Speaker 1: beer was the easy part. Clearly it wasn't easy. But 174 00:10:11,876 --> 00:10:14,516 Speaker 1: the next thing that Bill had to do, and frankly 175 00:10:14,556 --> 00:10:17,836 Speaker 1: it's a problem he still has not entirely solved, was 176 00:10:18,116 --> 00:10:27,996 Speaker 1: much harder. That's after the break. Now back to the show. 177 00:10:29,156 --> 00:10:31,956 Speaker 1: Here's the hard problem Bill is still trying to solve. 178 00:10:32,276 --> 00:10:35,516 Speaker 1: How do you make non alcoholic beer normal? How do 179 00:10:35,516 --> 00:10:37,076 Speaker 1: you make it a thing you can drink without having 180 00:10:37,116 --> 00:10:39,956 Speaker 1: to explain yourself? How do you make ordering a non 181 00:10:40,036 --> 00:10:43,356 Speaker 1: alcoholic beer as easy as ordering a pilsner or an ipa? 182 00:10:43,436 --> 00:10:46,236 Speaker 1: And for Bill, all that really comes down to how 183 00:10:46,276 --> 00:10:48,956 Speaker 1: do you use marketing to change the culture of beer. 184 00:10:49,316 --> 00:10:51,676 Speaker 1: We knew the marketing side of this would be equally 185 00:10:51,676 --> 00:10:53,876 Speaker 1: as big as the product side, and both were going 186 00:10:53,916 --> 00:10:58,876 Speaker 1: to be enormous challenges on the marketing side. It started 187 00:10:58,876 --> 00:11:00,476 Speaker 1: with the name. We want to make it something that 188 00:11:00,556 --> 00:11:03,796 Speaker 1: was undeniably positive and say the name save the name 189 00:11:03,836 --> 00:11:08,556 Speaker 1: Athletic Growing. It's so awesomely on the nose, right, it's 190 00:11:08,596 --> 00:11:12,996 Speaker 1: so simply unsubtle of a name. We wanted it to 191 00:11:13,036 --> 00:11:18,036 Speaker 1: be undeniably positive, aspirational, not tied to any geography or 192 00:11:18,076 --> 00:11:20,436 Speaker 1: anything like that. We wanted to be an easy bar 193 00:11:20,556 --> 00:11:24,756 Speaker 1: call and then attract high performance people to the brand. 194 00:11:24,916 --> 00:11:30,556 Speaker 1: And our hypothesis was if we could make moderation cool 195 00:11:30,876 --> 00:11:34,156 Speaker 1: and in reach of people, our impact would be an 196 00:11:34,236 --> 00:11:36,676 Speaker 1: untold positive impact on the world. I don't know if 197 00:11:36,676 --> 00:11:38,996 Speaker 1: I would use the word moderation, right. I feel like 198 00:11:39,116 --> 00:11:42,396 Speaker 1: one beer is moderate, you know, one alcoholic beer, Like 199 00:11:42,436 --> 00:11:45,876 Speaker 1: it's not drinking right. Yeah. So previously non alcoholic beer 200 00:11:45,996 --> 00:11:49,716 Speaker 1: was for people who don't drink ever, Basically eighty percent 201 00:11:49,756 --> 00:11:52,836 Speaker 1: of our customers do drink, just drink non alcoholic beer 202 00:11:52,836 --> 00:11:55,636 Speaker 1: at other times. And was that did you know that 203 00:11:55,636 --> 00:11:58,036 Speaker 1: that's what you were going for? I wanted people to 204 00:11:58,036 --> 00:12:02,236 Speaker 1: be able to have great beer anytime, anywhere, and have 205 00:12:02,396 --> 00:12:04,796 Speaker 1: the choice to drink non alcoholic beer, like, I'm not 206 00:12:04,876 --> 00:12:07,876 Speaker 1: out to necessarily like kill the alcohol industry. I want 207 00:12:07,876 --> 00:12:10,876 Speaker 1: people to be able to make their own choices. We're 208 00:12:11,036 --> 00:12:14,156 Speaker 1: never standing on a soapbox and pointing the finger condemning people. 209 00:12:14,196 --> 00:12:17,916 Speaker 1: We just want the options for healthy choices to always 210 00:12:17,916 --> 00:12:22,516 Speaker 1: be there. And we've found that our customers, while they 211 00:12:22,516 --> 00:12:25,636 Speaker 1: do still drink alcohol sometimes for the most part, they 212 00:12:25,676 --> 00:12:28,796 Speaker 1: increasingly drink non alcoholic beer through all other days and 213 00:12:28,916 --> 00:12:32,796 Speaker 1: times and occasions and maybe are swapping in some non 214 00:12:32,836 --> 00:12:35,876 Speaker 1: alcoholic drinks as well. So you have this idea, you 215 00:12:35,916 --> 00:12:39,756 Speaker 1: want to create this aspirational non alcoholic beer as opposed 216 00:12:39,796 --> 00:12:43,476 Speaker 1: to some weird, stigmatized thing, which frankly I think non 217 00:12:43,476 --> 00:12:46,996 Speaker 1: alcoholic beer was before. And in a way this is 218 00:12:47,316 --> 00:12:50,156 Speaker 1: even harder than creating a new category, because you have 219 00:12:50,196 --> 00:12:54,236 Speaker 1: to take a category that has all these negative connotations 220 00:12:54,276 --> 00:12:57,836 Speaker 1: and kind of overcome that. And I know to that end, 221 00:12:58,076 --> 00:13:01,076 Speaker 1: part of the marketing you have done has been paying 222 00:13:01,436 --> 00:13:05,596 Speaker 1: college athletes. And paying college athletes is a new thing, right, 223 00:13:05,636 --> 00:13:08,436 Speaker 1: not just for you, but more generally because the rules 224 00:13:08,436 --> 00:13:11,396 Speaker 1: for paying college athletes have changed just in the past 225 00:13:11,436 --> 00:13:14,756 Speaker 1: few years so that companies can out basically hire them 226 00:13:14,796 --> 00:13:17,716 Speaker 1: as spokespeople. And so I'm curious tell me about your 227 00:13:17,716 --> 00:13:21,636 Speaker 1: work there. Yeah, so college athletes are really exciting because 228 00:13:22,276 --> 00:13:25,396 Speaker 1: we can talk to athletes of all ages. Really, we 229 00:13:25,516 --> 00:13:27,556 Speaker 1: talk to twenty one year old plus athletes for the 230 00:13:27,596 --> 00:13:30,756 Speaker 1: most part, to not confuse children that that is an 231 00:13:30,796 --> 00:13:33,756 Speaker 1: interesting question. Let's just let's just go there since you 232 00:13:33,796 --> 00:13:37,956 Speaker 1: mentioned it, Like, is it legal for anybody to drink 233 00:13:37,996 --> 00:13:40,516 Speaker 1: your beer? Are you making a choice just because you 234 00:13:40,556 --> 00:13:42,756 Speaker 1: don't want to be like the Gateway beer? Like, how 235 00:13:43,196 --> 00:13:46,036 Speaker 1: does that work? Kids? In non alcoholic beer? It is 236 00:13:46,076 --> 00:13:48,916 Speaker 1: in most states totally fine for anyone of any age 237 00:13:48,956 --> 00:13:51,756 Speaker 1: to drink our beer. We do it is that candy 238 00:13:51,796 --> 00:13:54,836 Speaker 1: cigarettees Gateway argument though, Like, it's just a marketing hill 239 00:13:54,916 --> 00:13:58,476 Speaker 1: we don't want to die on. And so we generally 240 00:13:58,476 --> 00:14:02,276 Speaker 1: target athletes and people we market with of twenty one 241 00:14:02,316 --> 00:14:05,636 Speaker 1: plus and encourage marketing to twenty one plus and selling 242 00:14:05,716 --> 00:14:08,596 Speaker 1: to twenty one plus. But of course anyone in most 243 00:14:08,596 --> 00:14:12,716 Speaker 1: states can fire products. But we thought, if we get 244 00:14:12,716 --> 00:14:18,276 Speaker 1: the coolest high performance athletes on campus to be drinking 245 00:14:18,316 --> 00:14:20,956 Speaker 1: non alcoholic beer, like, there's really no one better to 246 00:14:20,996 --> 00:14:25,476 Speaker 1: reach twenty somethings than twenty somethings themselves. And so We've 247 00:14:25,476 --> 00:14:29,276 Speaker 1: had athletes like CJ. Strout, the Ohio State quarterback, Jean 248 00:14:29,396 --> 00:14:34,036 Speaker 1: Robinson running back at Texas, two women on the NCAA 249 00:14:34,916 --> 00:14:37,676 Speaker 1: South Carolina winning basketball team this year. We're drinking r 250 00:14:37,756 --> 00:14:40,836 Speaker 1: beer and so across a huge range of verticals in 251 00:14:40,876 --> 00:14:45,316 Speaker 1: the college sports atmosphere, I have people drinking athletic beer. 252 00:14:45,476 --> 00:14:48,796 Speaker 1: To be clear, that's that's marketing you're paying for. You're 253 00:14:48,796 --> 00:14:53,276 Speaker 1: paying them to be endorsers or spokespeople. Yep, exactly. And 254 00:14:53,276 --> 00:14:55,676 Speaker 1: then we have so we have a whole range from 255 00:14:55,716 --> 00:14:59,596 Speaker 1: amateur to paid athletes. We have an amazing ambassador program 256 00:14:59,676 --> 00:15:02,956 Speaker 1: that started with organic outreach and we have about fifteen 257 00:15:02,996 --> 00:15:06,636 Speaker 1: hundred amateur ambassadors across the country or just posting for 258 00:15:07,476 --> 00:15:10,516 Speaker 1: beer and merch and other reward, and then all the 259 00:15:10,556 --> 00:15:14,876 Speaker 1: way to paid athletes like JJ WATD and like super 260 00:15:14,916 --> 00:15:17,956 Speaker 1: elite athletes who have joined our midst over the years 261 00:15:17,996 --> 00:15:20,916 Speaker 1: as well. And there are much more like traditional marketing assets. 262 00:15:21,436 --> 00:15:24,796 Speaker 1: When you say traditional marketing assets, what do you mean? Yeah, 263 00:15:24,876 --> 00:15:28,356 Speaker 1: anything from social media to usage of name and pr 264 00:15:28,756 --> 00:15:32,596 Speaker 1: name image and likeness and autographs or and we are 265 00:15:32,636 --> 00:15:35,596 Speaker 1: starting to work up towards organized to TV campaigns and 266 00:15:35,676 --> 00:15:39,716 Speaker 1: media campaigns which is a lot of fun. Now, most 267 00:15:39,756 --> 00:15:42,956 Speaker 1: of our marketing efforts from day one were me behind 268 00:15:43,036 --> 00:15:46,396 Speaker 1: a ten at the finish of any race across the country. 269 00:15:46,676 --> 00:15:49,836 Speaker 1: I did say seventy finish lines the first year we're 270 00:15:49,836 --> 00:15:51,956 Speaker 1: in business, and then our sales team has continued to 271 00:15:51,996 --> 00:15:54,116 Speaker 1: do that. So you would just go to a race 272 00:15:54,196 --> 00:15:58,476 Speaker 1: with like trunk full of your non alcoholic beer and 273 00:15:58,516 --> 00:16:00,076 Speaker 1: put it in a cooler and stand there and hand 274 00:16:00,076 --> 00:16:02,076 Speaker 1: it to people when they finished a race, A ten 275 00:16:02,196 --> 00:16:06,196 Speaker 1: A or whatever, Yeah, ten table cooler, draft or anything 276 00:16:06,236 --> 00:16:08,076 Speaker 1: like that. Hand out. The goal is to hand out 277 00:16:08,076 --> 00:16:10,516 Speaker 1: thousands of beers every weekend to sweaty people with a 278 00:16:10,556 --> 00:16:13,196 Speaker 1: smile on their face who might be receptive to hearing 279 00:16:13,236 --> 00:16:17,156 Speaker 1: about nonlocock beer. And I'd usually hear a joke first, 280 00:16:17,556 --> 00:16:20,076 Speaker 1: and then I'd be like, you can make fun of 281 00:16:20,116 --> 00:16:22,436 Speaker 1: me all you want if you just try it. And 282 00:16:22,996 --> 00:16:25,716 Speaker 1: that's when the light bulb would go on. What was 283 00:16:25,756 --> 00:16:28,436 Speaker 1: the classic joke? What kind of jokes would people make 284 00:16:28,476 --> 00:16:30,956 Speaker 1: when you said it's none alcoholic beer, Like, what's the 285 00:16:31,076 --> 00:16:36,396 Speaker 1: point is this? Like decaf coffee? Yeah, tons of stuff 286 00:16:36,396 --> 00:16:38,476 Speaker 1: like that. You get tired of what's the point as 287 00:16:38,476 --> 00:16:42,116 Speaker 1: a question, Well, if the product wasn't so good, and 288 00:16:42,156 --> 00:16:44,436 Speaker 1: I didn't know I could win them, Like it would 289 00:16:44,476 --> 00:16:47,916 Speaker 1: be exhausting, for sure, But the amount of people I'd 290 00:16:47,956 --> 00:16:50,396 Speaker 1: talked to who are like rudely making fun of me 291 00:16:50,436 --> 00:16:52,956 Speaker 1: to my face ninety seconds before they were basically asking 292 00:16:52,956 --> 00:16:56,236 Speaker 1: where they can buy it, it was like a transition 293 00:16:56,356 --> 00:16:58,756 Speaker 1: that I could have done zillions of times and I did. 294 00:16:59,036 --> 00:17:01,316 Speaker 1: And these same people who are making fun of me 295 00:17:01,556 --> 00:17:04,356 Speaker 1: just before all of a sudden drinking it will sit 296 00:17:04,436 --> 00:17:06,836 Speaker 1: there and you see the light go on and they're like, oh, like, 297 00:17:07,076 --> 00:17:10,276 Speaker 1: I could drink this with my night dinner. I could 298 00:17:10,316 --> 00:17:13,636 Speaker 1: drink this like, oh like while I'm golfing, or while 299 00:17:13,636 --> 00:17:16,356 Speaker 1: I'm at the beach with my kids, or you know, 300 00:17:16,476 --> 00:17:18,276 Speaker 1: maybe I could have two of these before I have 301 00:17:18,276 --> 00:17:21,036 Speaker 1: alcoholic drinks at night, and they would past me out. 302 00:17:21,076 --> 00:17:23,836 Speaker 1: And like, people just started rattling off occasions of when 303 00:17:23,876 --> 00:17:26,196 Speaker 1: they would consume non alcoholic beer and when it would 304 00:17:26,196 --> 00:17:28,596 Speaker 1: exist in their life, sort of answering the what's the 305 00:17:28,636 --> 00:17:32,116 Speaker 1: point question themselves in that setting. Yeah, and I know 306 00:17:32,196 --> 00:17:36,196 Speaker 1: you've mentioned that in Europe there has long been a big, 307 00:17:36,356 --> 00:17:42,196 Speaker 1: robust non alcoholic beer industry. It's a thing there. It's 308 00:17:42,236 --> 00:17:46,836 Speaker 1: just the European culture towards drinking, which my theory is 309 00:17:46,836 --> 00:17:50,076 Speaker 1: that they've never had prohibition and never had alcohol strictly 310 00:17:50,156 --> 00:17:54,236 Speaker 1: taken away, and so there's a relative indifference to drinking 311 00:17:54,316 --> 00:18:01,596 Speaker 1: or not drinking and societal norms of moderation or daytime 312 00:18:01,636 --> 00:18:04,756 Speaker 1: cafe culture drinking. So you have a theory that, like, 313 00:18:04,796 --> 00:18:07,796 Speaker 1: the culture of drinking in the US right now is 314 00:18:07,836 --> 00:18:11,516 Speaker 1: still weird basically different than it is in other parts 315 00:18:11,516 --> 00:18:16,356 Speaker 1: of the world because of prohibition. Yeah, prohibition, the romanticism 316 00:18:16,396 --> 00:18:20,876 Speaker 1: of turning twenty one, a number of factors where so 317 00:18:20,996 --> 00:18:25,156 Speaker 1: like drinking versus not drinking is a more kind of binary, 318 00:18:25,436 --> 00:18:27,876 Speaker 1: big deal choice here than it is elsewhere. Is that 319 00:18:27,916 --> 00:18:32,196 Speaker 1: the idea, that's how we frame it for sure? And yeah, 320 00:18:32,236 --> 00:18:35,396 Speaker 1: the European non beer market has been big, and it's 321 00:18:35,396 --> 00:18:38,036 Speaker 1: always been big, and it's growing fast with the same 322 00:18:38,076 --> 00:18:40,316 Speaker 1: health trends that are driving it in the US, but 323 00:18:40,356 --> 00:18:42,676 Speaker 1: it's starting off a much bigger base where the market's 324 00:18:42,716 --> 00:18:46,596 Speaker 1: about twenty five times the size and in quite a 325 00:18:46,596 --> 00:18:49,556 Speaker 1: few countries it's over ten percent of the overall beer market, 326 00:18:49,716 --> 00:18:53,316 Speaker 1: where in the US in twenty seventeen it was point 327 00:18:53,356 --> 00:18:56,996 Speaker 1: three percent of the overall beer market. Point zero point three. 328 00:18:57,116 --> 00:19:00,036 Speaker 1: And the thing is, people think of nonlock off beer 329 00:19:00,196 --> 00:19:05,236 Speaker 1: such a small specific market, and like, my secret thought is, 330 00:19:05,316 --> 00:19:07,356 Speaker 1: I think this is ultimately going to be way over 331 00:19:07,436 --> 00:19:10,956 Speaker 1: fifty percent of the market because alcohol makes so little 332 00:19:10,996 --> 00:19:14,236 Speaker 1: sense in so many times of life. So you mean that, 333 00:19:14,316 --> 00:19:17,796 Speaker 1: like regular beer is going to be the niche, and 334 00:19:17,916 --> 00:19:20,236 Speaker 1: like normal beer will be non alcoholic beer, and they'll 335 00:19:20,276 --> 00:19:22,436 Speaker 1: be like, oh, you're drinking alcoholic beer. You want to 336 00:19:22,436 --> 00:19:26,476 Speaker 1: explain that. I think eventually alcohol probably will. Well, alcohol 337 00:19:26,676 --> 00:19:30,956 Speaker 1: is a niche occasion, it's just that it's a big 338 00:19:31,076 --> 00:19:35,116 Speaker 1: niche right now. Basically a thousand years of history, alcohol 339 00:19:35,156 --> 00:19:39,276 Speaker 1: has been a very big niche, for sure, But I 340 00:19:39,316 --> 00:19:42,156 Speaker 1: think the modern life, there's so many more occasions that 341 00:19:42,276 --> 00:19:46,436 Speaker 1: make sense for non alcoholic beverages than alcoholic beverages. And 342 00:19:46,516 --> 00:19:49,116 Speaker 1: we can empower people and make people feel great and 343 00:19:49,196 --> 00:19:53,636 Speaker 1: relaxed and social and everything without that one ingredient that 344 00:19:53,796 --> 00:19:56,596 Speaker 1: I think it's going to explode. And I've been murdered 345 00:19:56,596 --> 00:19:58,916 Speaker 1: in the beer world for suggesting that non alcoholic beer 346 00:19:58,956 --> 00:20:01,276 Speaker 1: can even be twenty percent. I think it's going to 347 00:20:01,356 --> 00:20:07,116 Speaker 1: be fifty. Yeah, So you were creating a category more 348 00:20:07,196 --> 00:20:11,036 Speaker 1: or less trying to almost create a category. I had 349 00:20:11,076 --> 00:20:15,756 Speaker 1: not previously looked for your beer. But yesterday I was 350 00:20:15,796 --> 00:20:17,436 Speaker 1: at the grocery store and it was not a fancy 351 00:20:17,516 --> 00:20:20,276 Speaker 1: grocery store. It was not Whole Foods. It was foodtown. 352 00:20:20,316 --> 00:20:23,116 Speaker 1: It was a food down in Brooklyn. And not only 353 00:20:23,676 --> 00:20:26,876 Speaker 1: did they have I don't know four kinds of athletic 354 00:20:27,116 --> 00:20:32,916 Speaker 1: Brewing Company beer, they had Stella zero and Heineken zero 355 00:20:33,076 --> 00:20:38,436 Speaker 1: and Budweiser zero. And Brooklyn Brewing Company also has a 356 00:20:38,516 --> 00:20:41,796 Speaker 1: non alcoholic beer, which I didn't even know existed. It 357 00:20:41,836 --> 00:20:46,516 Speaker 1: seems like this is becoming a category, and there is 358 00:20:46,596 --> 00:20:49,836 Speaker 1: this thing happening where you're like, you know, out in 359 00:20:49,916 --> 00:20:53,116 Speaker 1: front whatever, cutting the wind, whatever the sports metaphor is. 360 00:20:53,436 --> 00:20:56,756 Speaker 1: And if you're successful, I guess a draft on you 361 00:20:56,796 --> 00:20:58,796 Speaker 1: as a terrible pun to make in this context. But 362 00:20:58,876 --> 00:21:01,316 Speaker 1: if you're successful, all of these other companies are going 363 00:21:01,356 --> 00:21:02,916 Speaker 1: to come and start doing what you're doing. And in 364 00:21:02,956 --> 00:21:05,836 Speaker 1: the same way that suddenly there's a million craft beers 365 00:21:05,876 --> 00:21:08,196 Speaker 1: on the shelf. If you're successful, there's going to be 366 00:21:08,196 --> 00:21:12,316 Speaker 1: a million non alcoholic craft beer is all surrounding you 367 00:21:12,436 --> 00:21:14,836 Speaker 1: literally on the shelf, And I'm trying to figure out 368 00:21:14,956 --> 00:21:17,236 Speaker 1: is that good for you? Or is that bad for you? 369 00:21:18,236 --> 00:21:22,756 Speaker 1: It's great. So we see this as very much a 370 00:21:22,836 --> 00:21:25,676 Speaker 1: rising tide lifts all shifts. Yeah, like you just said, 371 00:21:25,756 --> 00:21:32,036 Speaker 1: humans have been drinking beer since I think thirty thousands 372 00:21:32,036 --> 00:21:36,556 Speaker 1: of years, but we're getting to like the exponential age 373 00:21:36,556 --> 00:21:40,076 Speaker 1: in human history where it needs a real reframing about 374 00:21:40,116 --> 00:21:42,716 Speaker 1: how people think about drinking, and we're trying to do 375 00:21:42,756 --> 00:21:47,076 Speaker 1: that and really modernized beer for the modern lifestyle. And 376 00:21:47,316 --> 00:21:50,596 Speaker 1: that's going to be an enormous step functioned switch in 377 00:21:50,596 --> 00:21:54,116 Speaker 1: this category. And if we do go to even ten 378 00:21:54,156 --> 00:21:56,836 Speaker 1: percent of the category, there's going to be so much 379 00:21:56,916 --> 00:21:59,476 Speaker 1: room for every other beer, and Athletic wouldn't possibly be 380 00:21:59,556 --> 00:22:03,476 Speaker 1: able to meet every occasion in store, and then we're 381 00:22:03,476 --> 00:22:06,076 Speaker 1: going to need a lot of help. So there's a 382 00:22:06,076 --> 00:22:08,116 Speaker 1: lot of opportunity for Everyone's the long and short, and 383 00:22:08,116 --> 00:22:10,756 Speaker 1: we're very thankful for the dedication of the category. We've 384 00:22:10,756 --> 00:22:14,116 Speaker 1: seen Heineken and has A Bosh, Brooklyn, Sam Adams and 385 00:22:14,596 --> 00:22:17,116 Speaker 1: many others have to the category for sure. I mean, 386 00:22:17,156 --> 00:22:20,036 Speaker 1: I guess if the big fundamental problem you have to 387 00:22:20,076 --> 00:22:23,756 Speaker 1: overcome for your business to succeed is the stigma, frankly 388 00:22:23,796 --> 00:22:27,196 Speaker 1: around non alcoholic beer, then the more nonalcoholic beers, and 389 00:22:27,316 --> 00:22:31,356 Speaker 1: the better quality non alcoholic beers, the better for you. Weirdly, 390 00:22:32,636 --> 00:22:36,396 Speaker 1: for sure, frankly, we wish we had more help, especially 391 00:22:36,396 --> 00:22:39,436 Speaker 1: on the marketing front. You want more competition. You want 392 00:22:39,436 --> 00:22:45,116 Speaker 1: Budweiser to be advertising Budweiser zero in football games. We do, 393 00:22:45,436 --> 00:22:48,356 Speaker 1: and they're starting to do it for sure, So you 394 00:22:48,476 --> 00:22:51,276 Speaker 1: want your rivals to be spending more on advertising. These 395 00:22:51,276 --> 00:22:53,436 Speaker 1: are companies that are competing against you and are right 396 00:22:53,476 --> 00:22:55,556 Speaker 1: next to you on the shelf. We would kill for it. 397 00:22:57,956 --> 00:23:00,796 Speaker 1: There is I think an interesting precedent for Bill's story, 398 00:23:01,076 --> 00:23:04,316 Speaker 1: and it goes back to the nineteen sixties. At the time, 399 00:23:04,356 --> 00:23:09,596 Speaker 1: a US brewer tried to sell this low calorie diet beer. Presently, 400 00:23:09,636 --> 00:23:11,996 Speaker 1: it was a flop. Nobody wanted to diet beer. It 401 00:23:12,156 --> 00:23:14,516 Speaker 1: was like what people always said to Bill about non 402 00:23:14,556 --> 00:23:18,156 Speaker 1: alcoholic beer, what's the point? Miller The Miller Brewing Company 403 00:23:18,196 --> 00:23:20,196 Speaker 1: wound up with the rights to the beer, and in 404 00:23:20,236 --> 00:23:23,116 Speaker 1: the nineteen seventies they launched it as Miller Lighte. They 405 00:23:23,116 --> 00:23:26,116 Speaker 1: had this famous ad campaign with athletes talking about how 406 00:23:26,156 --> 00:23:28,396 Speaker 1: they like to drink Miller Lighte when they're doing, you know, 407 00:23:28,516 --> 00:23:32,916 Speaker 1: manly active things, because it's less feeling than regular beer. Today, 408 00:23:33,396 --> 00:23:36,916 Speaker 1: Miller lighte is the third best selling beer in America 409 00:23:36,956 --> 00:23:39,676 Speaker 1: and the two beers that outsell it are Bud Light 410 00:23:39,916 --> 00:23:43,196 Speaker 1: and Coarse Light. We'll be back in a minute with 411 00:23:43,276 --> 00:23:51,276 Speaker 1: the lightning round. Now, let's get back to the show. 412 00:23:52,196 --> 00:23:56,516 Speaker 1: Let's close with a lightning round. Fast questions you can 413 00:23:56,596 --> 00:24:01,596 Speaker 1: answer them fast. In what year will I see a 414 00:24:01,756 --> 00:24:05,836 Speaker 1: National Athletic Brewing ad in an NFL game? So we 415 00:24:05,996 --> 00:24:08,956 Speaker 1: did some March Madness ads for our new Athletic light 416 00:24:09,196 --> 00:24:12,516 Speaker 1: year this past March, but we our second half media 417 00:24:12,556 --> 00:24:15,836 Speaker 1: plan this year will be our first coordinated, like real 418 00:24:15,996 --> 00:24:19,956 Speaker 1: advertising campaign this year. If I'm watching whatever Tony Romo 419 00:24:19,996 --> 00:24:22,356 Speaker 1: calling a game, We'll break and we'll see an athletic ad. 420 00:24:22,356 --> 00:24:25,956 Speaker 1: It's going to happen, I hope. So yeah, what's the 421 00:24:25,996 --> 00:24:30,676 Speaker 1: farthest you've ever run in one day? I've done a 422 00:24:30,836 --> 00:24:35,676 Speaker 1: number of fifty K races if K for our American listeners. 423 00:24:35,836 --> 00:24:39,156 Speaker 1: That is, what about thirty thirty two miles or so? 424 00:24:39,756 --> 00:24:43,356 Speaker 1: Longer than a marathon? Seems really long? Slow and study 425 00:24:43,436 --> 00:24:45,956 Speaker 1: the whole way. I know you don't drink alcohol anymore, 426 00:24:46,276 --> 00:24:49,636 Speaker 1: but when you did, what was your favorite non non 427 00:24:49,676 --> 00:24:53,916 Speaker 1: alcoholic beer? I would say Sierra Nevada Palel is incredible. 428 00:24:54,076 --> 00:24:55,996 Speaker 1: Maybe it's just because I'm from California, but I feel 429 00:24:56,036 --> 00:24:58,196 Speaker 1: like Sierra Nevada was pretty early in the sort of 430 00:24:58,276 --> 00:25:03,156 Speaker 1: craft beer universe. Yeah, Ken Grossman was the pioneer who 431 00:25:03,236 --> 00:25:05,996 Speaker 1: set the road for everyone essentially in so many ways. 432 00:25:06,116 --> 00:25:10,036 Speaker 1: And Grossman is the Sierra Nevada person found. Yeah. Yeah, 433 00:25:10,036 --> 00:25:12,956 Speaker 1: you took it from homebrewing to an absolutely world class 434 00:25:13,036 --> 00:25:16,036 Speaker 1: company and everything they do and every beer they make 435 00:25:16,156 --> 00:25:19,516 Speaker 1: is super high quality. Do they make a non alcoholic beer? 436 00:25:19,876 --> 00:25:21,996 Speaker 1: Not yet. I know they're working on it yet though, 437 00:25:21,996 --> 00:25:23,596 Speaker 1: and that would be kind of a dream to have 438 00:25:23,636 --> 00:25:26,476 Speaker 1: them come into the category. Do you think the Athletic 439 00:25:26,476 --> 00:25:30,276 Speaker 1: Brewing Company is going to ever make anything other than 440 00:25:30,356 --> 00:25:33,796 Speaker 1: non alcoholic beer as a product. We do. So we 441 00:25:33,916 --> 00:25:37,796 Speaker 1: launched on our e commerce platform last year our daypack 442 00:25:38,676 --> 00:25:42,716 Speaker 1: hopped Sparkling Waters, and so that's going after a different 443 00:25:42,796 --> 00:25:47,956 Speaker 1: daytime occasion where so beer maybe, like beer isn't something 444 00:25:47,956 --> 00:25:50,956 Speaker 1: people have any day everywhere. We wanted something people can 445 00:25:51,076 --> 00:25:53,796 Speaker 1: drink all throughout the day, reach people in a different 446 00:25:53,836 --> 00:25:56,156 Speaker 1: aisle of the grocery store and the sparkling water aisle, 447 00:25:56,676 --> 00:26:00,236 Speaker 1: And so that's our first emerging brand on the Athletic 448 00:26:00,316 --> 00:26:04,996 Speaker 1: platform name essentially, so we sit sparkling water that tastes 449 00:26:05,036 --> 00:26:07,556 Speaker 1: a little bit like beer. I'm sorry that I haven't tried. 450 00:26:07,596 --> 00:26:10,396 Speaker 1: It sounds weird. Frankly, it's sounds weird. I'm gonna be honest, 451 00:26:10,436 --> 00:26:15,156 Speaker 1: but I'm interested. It's very lightly fruited, lightly hot, so 452 00:26:15,236 --> 00:26:17,516 Speaker 1: it almost has like a bit of like a juniper 453 00:26:17,596 --> 00:26:21,756 Speaker 1: overtone to like the light fruitiness. Do you think you're 454 00:26:21,796 --> 00:26:24,236 Speaker 1: gonna run Athletic forever or do you think you'll do 455 00:26:24,276 --> 00:26:26,636 Speaker 1: something else? At some point, I didn't have a ton 456 00:26:26,716 --> 00:26:29,236 Speaker 1: of ideas and chose one like this is my idea 457 00:26:29,276 --> 00:26:31,156 Speaker 1: and my mission and the impact I want to have, 458 00:26:31,356 --> 00:26:33,596 Speaker 1: and I can't see myself ever being able to turn 459 00:26:33,636 --> 00:26:39,236 Speaker 1: it off. Bill Shufelt is the founder and CEO of 460 00:26:39,276 --> 00:26:44,116 Speaker 1: Athletic Brewing. Today's show was produced by Edith Russolo, engineered 461 00:26:44,116 --> 00:26:47,836 Speaker 1: by Amanda kay Wong, and edited by Robert Smith. I'm 462 00:26:47,876 --> 00:26:50,476 Speaker 1: Jacob Goldstein, and I would love to know who else 463 00:26:50,516 --> 00:26:53,516 Speaker 1: you think we should book for the show. You can 464 00:26:53,556 --> 00:26:57,756 Speaker 1: email us at problem at pushkin dot fm. It's problem 465 00:26:57,836 --> 00:27:00,916 Speaker 1: at Pushkin dot fm, or you can find me on Twitter. 466 00:27:01,076 --> 00:27:04,076 Speaker 1: I'm at Jacob Goldstein. We'll be back next week with 467 00:27:04,156 --> 00:27:05,676 Speaker 1: another episode of What's Your Problem.