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Speaker 1: Part of citizenship and part of gathering with a small

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Speaker 1: g is that all of us, whether we're guests or hosts,

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Speaker 1: are participating, one beat at a time, in whatever might

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Speaker 1: be happening. And all I'm saying is, wake up and

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Speaker 1: decide what you want to attend and what you don't

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Speaker 1: want to attend. And when you're thinking about being a host,

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Speaker 1: think very deeply about what it is you're bringing together,

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Speaker 1: because whatever you're doing will spread. Welcome to How to

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Speaker 1: Citizen with Baritune Day, a podcast that reimagine citizen as

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Speaker 1: a verb, not a legal status. This season is all

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Speaker 1: about how we practice democracy, what can we get rid of,

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Speaker 1: what can we invent, and how do we change the

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Speaker 1: culture of democracy itself. We're leaving the theoretical clouds and

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Speaker 1: hit in the ground with inspiring examples of people and

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Speaker 1: institutions that are showing us new ways to govern ourselves.

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Speaker 1: Over the years, I've attended several Democratic National conventions I'm

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Speaker 1: talking Boston, North Carolina, Philadelphia, and Denver. But the best one,

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Speaker 1: and really one of the most memorable political gatherings I've attended,

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Speaker 1: it happened online during the COVID lockdown of twenty twenty now,

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Speaker 1: at every major political convention, there's this ceremonial counting of

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Speaker 1: the delegates where people from different states stand up with

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Speaker 1: their little flags on the floor of the convention hall

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Speaker 1: and say something like, the people of the Great State

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Speaker 1: of Hawaii nominate YadA, YadA, YadA YadA. But we obviously

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Speaker 1: couldn't do that in twenty twenty. Instead of cutting it, though,

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Speaker 1: the organizers asked people to film themselves doing the roll

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Speaker 1: call in front of something iconic that represented their home.

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Speaker 1: It's time to begin our virtual trip around America. Alaska,

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Speaker 1: we must elect the president who respect our voices, protect

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Speaker 1: our waters, and address climate changed. Alaska cast seven voices

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Speaker 1: Bernie Sanders and troll voices for the next President Joe Biden.

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Speaker 1: North Carolina. I've been doing this for a long time,

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Speaker 1: so let me just be playing black people, especially black women,

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Speaker 1: on the backbone of this party. And if we don't

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Speaker 1: show up, Democrats don't get elected. North Carolina cast thirty

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Speaker 1: nine votes for Bernie Sanders and eighty three votes for

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Speaker 1: the next President of the United States, Joe Biden. Maine

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Speaker 1: My American Dream. I'm living in a twenty five acre

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Speaker 1: organic farm on the lake, a roadside farm stand and

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Speaker 1: a bedding breakfast. My husband and our aren corporate tycoons.

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Speaker 1: We just want to make an honestly the US Virgin Islands.

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Speaker 1: We bring in a greatance from the Virgin Islands of

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Speaker 1: the United to six. We were young, Alexander was raised,

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Speaker 1: were Castle A thirteen voots for Joseph our Biden. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this digital parade of delegates was a beautiful reflection of

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Speaker 1: who we are because we got to see each other

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Speaker 1: in our context. And I remember saying to anyone who

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Speaker 1: would listen, that is the mirror of America. I want

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Speaker 1: to see that looks like us. It felt like true storytelling,

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Speaker 1: not just political pandering. Of course, there's always going to

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Speaker 1: be some political pandering, but I think they produced the

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Speaker 1: hell out of that gathering, which had the potential feel disconnected, awkward,

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Speaker 1: and useless, and instead left me emotional and motivated. I

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Speaker 1: think a really fundamental premise of our democracy is that

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Speaker 1: we come together to figure things out, and we do

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Speaker 1: it in a way that's non violent, that serves as

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Speaker 1: many people as possible as best as possible, so we

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Speaker 1: can all move forward. And I think it's pretty non

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Speaker 1: controversial to say we're not doing great at that in

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Speaker 1: many levels of our society, the way Congress operates is whack.

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Speaker 1: Local school board meetings they're violent or nearly violent, and

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Speaker 1: online discourse. I mean, I don't even have to explain

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Speaker 1: that one do I from the political to the petty,

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Speaker 1: which is sometimes the same thing. We have proven that

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Speaker 1: we're out of practice at coming together meaningfully, effectively, or

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Speaker 1: at all, and it's weakening our ability to self governor

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Speaker 1: when we don't know how to listen or have a

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Speaker 1: shared purpose when we gather, when we don't know how

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Speaker 1: to interact with each other, it shows up everywhere. Think

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Speaker 1: of it like this. If we don't know how to

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Speaker 1: host a meaningful birthday party, how are we going to

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Speaker 1: handle a council meeting. Look, we have a gathering crisis,

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Speaker 1: and my friend Prea Parker, she's dedicated her life to

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Speaker 1: addressing it. In her book The Art of Gathering, How

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Speaker 1: We Meet and Why It Matters, Prea sharees practical guidance

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Speaker 1: for creating relevance, meaning, and connection when we come together.

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Speaker 1: Rethinking and reimagining the ways we spend time together. It's

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Speaker 1: essential to improving the way we practice democracy and to

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Speaker 1: the way we citizen and while our previous guest, Tim Phillips,

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Speaker 1: gave us a sense of how dangerous they're growing political

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Speaker 1: divide is in our country. Priya is giving us the

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Speaker 1: tools to start addressing that tension and disconnection in our

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Speaker 1: own communities. She's a facilitator and strategic advisor and liked him.

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Speaker 1: She's trained in the field of conflict resolution. She has

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Speaker 1: been the last twenty years guiding leaders and groups through

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Speaker 1: complicated conversations about community identity and vision in moments of transition.

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Speaker 1: I first met Priya and her husband, the writer An

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Speaker 1: and girded us before they were husband and wife. Back

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Speaker 1: in Paris over a decade ago, Annan was speaking at

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Speaker 1: a museum and I was there as part of a

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Speaker 1: delegation of young civic minded Americans touring through Europe. Anna

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Speaker 1: Impriya were the only other young people in the room,

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Speaker 1: so we were all like yo Americans, young people, brown people, Yeah. Hey.

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Speaker 1: It was super exciting and a sea of really old

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Speaker 1: art loving white French faces. They ended up joining our tour.

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Speaker 1: The three of us traveled together a lot more from there,

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Speaker 1: and we quickly realized we had a lot in common.

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Speaker 1: During that time, I had the opportunity to attend many

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Speaker 1: of their gatherings from neighborhood walking tours. Preya became known

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Speaker 1: for to their wedding in India, where by the way,

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Speaker 1: I did a great stand up comedy set. It was

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Speaker 1: super funny. There's no tapes. You're just gonna have to

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Speaker 1: trust me anyway. I can't count the number of times

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Speaker 1: I've had dinner at their place, met fascinating folks, and

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Speaker 1: left feeling full both intellectually and gastro Intestinally, so Priya

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Speaker 1: has been practicing what she preaches even before most of

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Speaker 1: us knew she was preaching it. As I think on

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Speaker 1: this entire season, Priya is answering a question posed by

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Speaker 1: an earlier guest, John Alexander, who asked, how do we

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Speaker 1: invoke citizenship as practice? And I think Priya answers with

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Speaker 1: some really valuable tangible tools for us to get out

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Speaker 1: of our rut and try new things and challenge old

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Speaker 1: assumptions about how we show up citizen Together. After the Break,

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Speaker 1: Priya Parker on how gatherings are about people, not logistics.

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Speaker 1: Pria Parker is a facilitator, acclaimed author of the Art

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Speaker 1: of Gathering, How We Meet and Why It Matters, and

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Speaker 1: executive producer and host of the New York Times podcast

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Speaker 1: Together Apart, we have been a part of each other's

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Speaker 1: lives for over a decade, and I got to see

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Speaker 1: her becoming the queen of gathering through a small series

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Speaker 1: of intimate friend events that she did in New York

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Speaker 1: City called I Am Here Day. And this was an

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Speaker 1: intentional exploration of a neighborhood all day long and was

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Speaker 1: mind blowing. It really changed my relationship with other people

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Speaker 1: that I knew, It changed my relationship with New York City.

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Speaker 1: She's had a huge positive impact on my life professionally

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Speaker 1: and personally, and it is a thrill to have her here.

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Speaker 1: Welcome Priya Parker, Thank you there today. What a treat,

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Speaker 1: What a thrill. You are the master of many things,

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Speaker 1: but one of them is openings and introductions, and I

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Speaker 1: feel really touched. I'm so happy to be with you. Yes,

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Speaker 1: so so Pa. Look, you're somebody who really knows how

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Speaker 1: to host. Let me know if you have notes for

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Speaker 1: me later, taking copious notes. But your work has moved

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Speaker 1: help people move away from this idea of gatherings as

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Speaker 1: exercises in logistics, things to coordinate, to putting the focus

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Speaker 1: on relationships. Can you just talk about that important shift

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Speaker 1: from the logistics focus to the relationship focus. I, as

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Speaker 1: you know, am a group conflict resolution facilitator. That's my training,

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Speaker 1: that's still my day job. And so much of what

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Speaker 1: I learned with my peers as we were young Green

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Speaker 1: facilitators is we were trained to basically think about how

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Speaker 1: to bring a group of people around specific need and

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Speaker 1: kind of get them off their scripts. Figure out how

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Speaker 1: do you help people meaningfully connect without all having to

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Speaker 1: be the same. How do you help people meaningfully connect

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Speaker 1: despite sometimes because of their differences. Yeah, and so much

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Speaker 1: of what I was trained to do very kind of

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Speaker 1: minute by minute. How do you actually set up questions?

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Speaker 1: How do you set up the space so that people

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Speaker 1: feel protected, not so overwhelmed by a space, but also

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Speaker 1: not excluded. Had very little to do with what we're

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Speaker 1: taught in popular culture about what makes for example, a

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Speaker 1: good dinner party or a good baby shower, or basically

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Speaker 1: nice like silverware. Yeah, paint the onesies and then the

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Speaker 1: baby will come, you know, whatever, whatever, whatever. But this

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Speaker 1: very deep focus on stuff like I often say, if

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Speaker 1: you go to a bookstore, you walk into a library

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Speaker 1: and you look for a kind of like the gathering section.

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Speaker 1: You'll go and you read a lot of cookbooks, right,

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Speaker 1: or flower shaping skills. And it's not that those things

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Speaker 1: don't matter. They absolutely do their incredible skills on their own.

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Speaker 1: But over time we've conflated the shaping of things with

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Speaker 1: the shaping of people. And I love food as much

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Speaker 1: as the next person. I love a beautiful space as

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Speaker 1: much as the next person. But how do you basically

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Speaker 1: put people back at the center of our interactions and

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Speaker 1: how do you think about designing interactions that help people

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Speaker 1: feel like they belong but they also aren't disappearing. You

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Speaker 1: mentioned the goal of getting people off their scripts. Why that?

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Speaker 1: What is the danger or the risk of letting people

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Speaker 1: stay attached to their script and what does it mean

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Speaker 1: to knock them off of that routine? Scripts serve us

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Speaker 1: in certain ways, like we are taught how to professionally

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Speaker 1: introduce ourselves or we're taught and different cultures have different scripts.

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Speaker 1: I went to the University of Virginia, and I learned

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Speaker 1: very quickly that one of the first things people ask

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Speaker 1: you is what are you? And I had to learn

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Speaker 1: very quickly my answer to that question. Right, So all

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Speaker 1: of that to say is in so many of our

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Speaker 1: modern life where we're meeting people we don't necessarily know

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Speaker 1: this kind of corporate culture or like entrepreneurship culture of

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Speaker 1: like the pitch has infiltrated, friendship has infiltrated, community has

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Speaker 1: infiltrated dinner parties, like if you go to My husband

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Speaker 1: grew up in Europe. For some part of his life,

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Speaker 1: I lived in different countries because of my parents work.

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Speaker 1: If you go to most other is changing, but most

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Speaker 1: of their countries. If you have dinner, multigenerational dinner and

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Speaker 1: anyone's home, you can leave after twelve hours and you

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Speaker 1: have no idea what anyone does for a living, right,

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Speaker 1: it's a deeply yes. I had a direct experience of

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Speaker 1: that in Europe, this summer bonding connecting, no idea what

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Speaker 1: people do for work. Whereas a brunch recently in California,

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Speaker 1: I felt like the person assumed I was an investor,

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Speaker 1: you know, and we're just like in this my growth

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Speaker 1: turnets and look and we opened up these many locations

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Speaker 1: and I'm like, Hi, what's your name again? Yes, it's

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Speaker 1: like the self launch, right, Yeah, And so part of

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Speaker 1: a script is scripts help people know how to navigate

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Speaker 1: an uncertain situation. They're not bad necessarily, but part of

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Speaker 1: what we were taught in conflict resolution was that often

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Speaker 1: moments of authenticity and connection happened when people got off

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Speaker 1: their scripts, when they say the thing they weren't planning

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Speaker 1: on saying, when they're not representing their institution, when they

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Speaker 1: give their sprout speeches rather than their stump speeches. Those

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Speaker 1: were the moments in which all of a sudden, again,

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Speaker 1: as a dialogue facilitator that's trying to shift the relationship

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Speaker 1: in the room, those were the moments of light. Those

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Speaker 1: were the moments where people stop being a monolith. I

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Speaker 1: think you have developed many kind of shorthands and quick

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Speaker 1: rules for anyone to think about in terms of any

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Speaker 1: gathering that they're considering. You know, a birthday party, which

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Speaker 1: should be pretty simple. Can you quickly give us some

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Speaker 1: of pre as hacks on like the questions we should

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Speaker 1: be asking how you might prepare your own absolutely the

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Speaker 1: down on dirty everyone can just like fast forward to

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Speaker 1: this part of the podcast. Step number one. So the

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Speaker 1: first is the biggest mistake we make when we gather

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Speaker 1: is we assume that the purpose is obvious and shared. Oh,

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Speaker 1: I know what a birthday party is? Oh, I know

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Speaker 1: what a staff meeting is. Yeah. And also in so doing,

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Speaker 1: we skip actually asking what is the purpose, and we

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Speaker 1: get too quickly to perfecting form, which is almost the

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Speaker 1: same as focusing on the stuff. It's over the people exactly.

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Speaker 1: And so the first thing to become a more artful gatherer,

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Speaker 1: and I think a more artful citizen seek yes, is

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Speaker 1: to determine and to actually ask what is the need here? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: what is the need in this community at this moment?

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Speaker 1: What is the need when I'm thirty two versus forty

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Speaker 1: two versus eighty two? And who are the people in

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Speaker 1: my life that might be able to address that need

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Speaker 1: this year? And then figure out the form. Don't start

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Speaker 1: with logistics, And instead of asking should I throw a party? First?

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Speaker 1: Ask am I lonely? Am I board? Do I need

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Speaker 1: to shake things up a bit? Am? I kind of

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Speaker 1: disillusioned with my normal friend gang? Like, what is actually

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Speaker 1: it's actually the art of paying attention what is happening here?

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Speaker 1: And gatherings are kind of these excuses to make us

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Speaker 1: make decisions about how we spend our time and with whom.

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Speaker 1: So I'll give a simple example. Years ago, I had

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Speaker 1: a friend who turned fifty, and he said to me,

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Speaker 1: you know, most I'm not really a birthday person, like

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Speaker 1: positively or negatively. You know, it doesn't I've never worried

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Speaker 1: about aging. It's not a huge deal to me. But

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Speaker 1: fifties feeling a lot, and I want to do something.

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Speaker 1: And he kind of, he said, his wife kind of

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Speaker 1: helped him think about it. Why are you why are

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Speaker 1: you so anxious about this age turning the stage? And

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Speaker 1: he thought about it, and he said, I think a

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Speaker 1: lot of people in my life I've watched as they

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Speaker 1: turned fifty, many people basically start contracting. They take less risks,

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Speaker 1: they take, they don't move to the same cities that

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Speaker 1: they would have. And I'm kind of terrified by that.

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Speaker 1: And yet there are some people I know who, even

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Speaker 1: when they turned fifty or sixty or seventy, continued to expand.

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Speaker 1: What if I threw a weekend or a dinner where

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Speaker 1: I invited the people in my life who have always

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Speaker 1: represented expansion, right, So what he did, first of all,

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Speaker 1: he paused first and didn't say what form should this

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Speaker 1: birthday be? And he just paused, like the first step

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Speaker 1: of actually artful gathering is looking in. Yeah, then the

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Speaker 1: second thing is He then found a specific, disputable need.

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Speaker 1: It's really specific and disputed. You're only going to invite

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Speaker 1: the people who expand in your life, like what are

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Speaker 1: you going to say the people who contracts like sorry, yeah,

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Speaker 1: especially if you're married. Well, in part I said this earlier,

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Speaker 1: gatherings often force us to face ourselves. This is why

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Speaker 1: weddings are often sites of conflict. This is why funerals

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Speaker 1: are sites of conflict, because gathering is an act of

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Speaker 1: line drawing. What is this about? Who is this for?

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Speaker 1: And who should be here? And who should not be

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Speaker 1: and who should not be here? And I'll just say

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Speaker 1: the third tip is artful gatherers, as hosts or guests,

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Speaker 1: are really good at meaning making and meaning making often

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Speaker 1: at the beginning of an event or a gathering in

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Speaker 1: the invitation, but also when they arrive. So, just to

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Speaker 1: close the story, at the beginning of this birthday weekend,

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Speaker 1: it's birthday dinner. He dung his glass as he recalled

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Speaker 1: it to me, and he said, I realized I was

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Speaker 1: terrified turning fifty, and I realized what I just told

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Speaker 1: you earlier. And each of you sitting around this table

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Speaker 1: to me have been examples and beacons of adventure and

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Speaker 1: expansion and people who I always look to when I

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Speaker 1: think about the decisions I want to make. What would

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Speaker 1: they do? Yeah, as I turn fifty, I want to

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Speaker 1: thank you for showing me that there's many ways to

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Speaker 1: do this, and I want to ask you to keep

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Speaker 1: me honest in those moments where I want to contract. Yeah, wow,

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Speaker 1: welcome thirty seconds. Yeah, he's changed the whole thing. He

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Speaker 1: switched here. I feel changed just hearing it, because there

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Speaker 1: it's not just that he had a purpose. He made

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Speaker 1: it clear to them and then they feel a sense

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Speaker 1: of ownership of and honoring and you feel, yeah, like

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Speaker 1: you chose me not just to be at your party, yes,

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Speaker 1: but for this thing that I do for you, which

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Speaker 1: is its own gift, the acknowledgement of the gifts of others.

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Speaker 1: He moved. He moved it from the category that many

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Speaker 1: of us can fall into of using them. Yeah. Right,

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Speaker 1: gatherings can also be kind of transactional. I have an

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Speaker 1: art museum launched get bodies in the room, right, like

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Speaker 1: we gotta get and who's got a lot of followers.

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Speaker 1: So he moved from using them. It's a very subtle

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Speaker 1: shift to making them of use in the deepest sense

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Speaker 1: of that word. I often say gathering as culture making.

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Speaker 1: They are going to remember that for the rest of

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Speaker 1: their lives. They are going to remember, Wow, that's the

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Speaker 1: way he thinks of me when they start thinking about decisions.

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Speaker 1: Am I contracting or am I expanding? Do I choose? Right?

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Speaker 1: This is like the way we gather reflects our norms,

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Speaker 1: our beliefs, and so often positive or negative. Like Trump

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Speaker 1: rallies are great gatherings. They are full of purpose and

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Speaker 1: specificity and boundary and emotion and ritual and symbol and

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Speaker 1: their lines like watching shows like the Circus and watching

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Speaker 1: the lines outside of a Trump rally versus outside of

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Speaker 1: a Democratic contender rally, like there is a fundamentally different

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Speaker 1: ritualistic experience going on. Gatherings are morally neutral, yeah, and

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Speaker 1: they spread values. Whatever the values are, they're spreading them.

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Speaker 1: How does that work if the gathering itself has kind

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Speaker 1: of harm associated with it, or if if it can

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Speaker 1: lead to harm. Can you just clarify where morality sits

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Speaker 1: in terms of not all gatherings are made equal in

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Speaker 1: terms of the impact they can have on folks. The

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Speaker 1: tool is morally neutral and it can be good used

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Speaker 1: for generative health, and it can be used for deep harm.

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Speaker 1: Hitler is one of the greatest gatherers in history. M Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so it's a technology, technology and sense too. And I'm

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Speaker 1: saying this in part because people often associate like, oh,

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Speaker 1: gathering sweets, Oh gatherings fun, Oh gatherings word, and in

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Speaker 1: part because it's like, don't be fooled, right, don't be

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Speaker 1: fooled by the rocks that I got, Enny, And this

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Speaker 1: is exactly it's like when you can see we're actually friends,

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Speaker 1: my terrible terrible, like you know, nineteen ninety three. References

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Speaker 1: are coming out so often either we under value what

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Speaker 1: this is, Oh, it's just a baby shower. Well, because

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Speaker 1: somebody thought it was a sweet idea at some point,

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Speaker 1: and they're trying to literally figure out what to do

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Speaker 1: in terms of the activity. Decided it could be fun

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Speaker 1: to focus on the moment of gender revelation. Literally, if

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Speaker 1: you look at this history of this new phenomenon, it

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Speaker 1: was like, how do I feel this time? Yeah, where

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Speaker 1: is there an unexpected outcome? What would be interesting to

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Speaker 1: this group? And then over time, in some places it's

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Speaker 1: been co opted or has become problematic to assume or

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Speaker 1: even to think like, why is all of the things

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Speaker 1: that we're doing over the course of these two hours

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Speaker 1: focusing on revealing their gender. Yeah, And if I look

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Speaker 1: at that example, you're celebrating a life, You're welcoming someone

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Speaker 1: into the family, Like is your primary purpose really the

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Speaker 1: information of communicating the gender of the child? Rarely starts

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Speaker 1: like that. That did not start on a need based

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Speaker 1: analysis exactly, and it became focused on the form. It

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Speaker 1: became colors and all this other distress. And so often

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Speaker 1: I love the example of a baby shower in part

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Speaker 1: because it's that kind of Trojan horse where it's like, oh,

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Speaker 1: the sweet little thing, and actually, like these are moments

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Speaker 1: of norm formation and so slightly shifting that, you know.

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Speaker 1: I have a friend who, for her she and her

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Speaker 1: partner did not want to have a baby shower, traditionally minded,

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Speaker 1: but she realized she did have a need. And as

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Speaker 1: she paused, she thought, Okay, I have these two needs.

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Speaker 1: One I'm terrified of labor, and two, neither me or

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Speaker 1: my partner want to raise our children mostly how we

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Speaker 1: saw our parents raise us. What do we do? And

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Speaker 1: so they ended up having two gatherings. One was she

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Speaker 1: gathered six female friends had been through the process of birth,

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Speaker 1: and they created a little ritual. She asked one of

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Speaker 1: our friends to do it, and the friend invited all

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Speaker 1: of us to bring a quality and a story of

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Speaker 1: our friend that we believed would also serve her in labor. Yeah, courage, resilience, humor,

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Speaker 1: remember this time when we were blah blah blah, and

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Speaker 1: you like, I give to you humor. And then the

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Speaker 1: second thing they did is they invited who are we inviting? Right?

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Speaker 1: What is it a political act? Why are women the

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Speaker 1: only people invited to baby showers? If we're expecting and

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Speaker 1: asking for men to also co parent, where do the

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Speaker 1: roles start from the very beginning, before the kid's even here?

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Speaker 1: Who actually needs this knowledge? So they invited both men

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Speaker 1: and women to share a story from their life of

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Speaker 1: one way that they were raised that they loved and

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Speaker 1: one thing in their own life that they would want

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Speaker 1: to let go of. And they had this beautiful dinner

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Speaker 1: and everyone understood the purpose and they could choose if

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Speaker 1: they wanted to come and share that kind of thing

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Speaker 1: or not. You can totally not come. But again, it's

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Speaker 1: like movings to being used to being of use, and

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Speaker 1: every other person at that dinner table. I promise you

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Speaker 1: was listening very closely. Huh, how might I want to

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Speaker 1: raise my kids? What are the norms? What are they expect?

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Speaker 1: What language are we using to talk about this? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: And part of what I part of citizenship and part

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Speaker 1: of gathering with a small G, is that all of us,

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Speaker 1: whether we're guests or hosts, are participating, one beat at

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Speaker 1: a time in whatever might be happening. And all I'm

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Speaker 1: saying is wake up and decide what you want to

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Speaker 1: attend and what you don't want to attend, and show

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Speaker 1: up in the ways you want to. When you're a guest,

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Speaker 1: and when you're thinking about being a host, think very

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Speaker 1: deeply about what it is you're bringing together, because whatever

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Speaker 1: you're doing will spread. Wake up. I'm fully awake, and

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Speaker 1: I'm remembering. I mean, I have a big fandom for you,

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Speaker 1: as well as for Chris to Tippett and on being

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Speaker 1: and I remember hearing your conversation with her, and you

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Speaker 1: said something very close to the following that gathering is

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Speaker 1: a political act with a small P. I like how

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Speaker 1: you lowercase the letters, and that anytime we're bringing together

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Speaker 1: three or more people, even works with groups of two,

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Speaker 1: there are these power dynamics that exist in those relationships

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Speaker 1: and in those groups. And that's not necessarily a bad thing,

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Speaker 1: but it's an opportunity for generous authority, right to use

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Speaker 1: your power as the host for the good of the

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Speaker 1: group to achieve its purpose. And coming back to first principles,

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Speaker 1: when I say that gathering is a political act, small

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Speaker 1: p what I mean about that is it is a

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Speaker 1: context in which power is up for contestation. And this

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Speaker 1: is true any time people come together, but particularly I

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Speaker 1: define a gathering as any time three or more people

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Speaker 1: come together for a purpose with a beginning, middle, and end. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so take something super simple a book club. A book

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Speaker 1: club is a wonderful example of these core questions. What

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Speaker 1: is this for? Is it to see each other and

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Speaker 1: have an excuse to come together and like the book's

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Speaker 1: kind of on the side, and like I really like

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Speaker 1: having kombucha or t Or is this fundamentally to make

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Speaker 1: us more informed environmentalists? Or is this fundament mentally to

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Speaker 1: shift the patterns away from hanging out at the bar

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Speaker 1: and substituted for something else. The second thing is book clubs.

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Speaker 1: When I say decision making, oh, it is one person

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Speaker 1: facilitating conversation is it a free for all? Are we

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Speaker 1: going to talk about chapter one, two, three, four or five? Six?

430
00:25:15,960 --> 00:25:17,879
Speaker 1: And you can kind of see. I mean, I love

431
00:25:17,920 --> 00:25:21,800
Speaker 1: book clubs as cultural examples because they sound really like

432
00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:27,240
Speaker 1: sweet and book clubs are full of drama, like how

433
00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:30,520
Speaker 1: long you know? So and so always talks over everyone else? Well,

434
00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:32,200
Speaker 1: how come they come they haven't read the entire book?

435
00:25:32,240 --> 00:25:33,720
Speaker 1: Well are you actually reading the book? How come she

436
00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:35,399
Speaker 1: always gets to choose the one? How come they always

437
00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:37,800
Speaker 1: get to decide whether this fiction or nonfiction? We're reading

438
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:39,720
Speaker 1: too much? Right, And so I use it in part

439
00:25:39,720 --> 00:25:42,879
Speaker 1: because we don't have They're not loaded and baggaged contexts,

440
00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:46,040
Speaker 1: but they're wonderful examples of in any group, a group

441
00:25:46,119 --> 00:25:48,840
Speaker 1: or a gathering has to decide or fall into how

442
00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:51,879
Speaker 1: do we actually share time? And every time people come together,

443
00:25:52,040 --> 00:25:55,280
Speaker 1: you're kind of deciding who has airtime? What are we

444
00:25:55,280 --> 00:25:58,160
Speaker 1: actually talking about? And that's a question of power. It's

445
00:25:58,160 --> 00:26:01,480
Speaker 1: shorthand for power in a gathering context is decision making,

446
00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:05,800
Speaker 1: what's the agenda, who's at the table every single time

447
00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:11,639
Speaker 1: we come together. It's actually a navigation between people about

448
00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:13,639
Speaker 1: how you're going to spend their time. And it's the

449
00:26:13,760 --> 00:26:16,520
Speaker 1: role of the host to basically enforce the reasons that

450
00:26:16,520 --> 00:26:18,600
Speaker 1: we're there. And there's lots of ways to do it,

451
00:26:18,640 --> 00:26:21,800
Speaker 1: but gathering is a political, small p political act, which

452
00:26:21,840 --> 00:26:24,119
Speaker 1: is people have to coordinate how to be and then

453
00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:25,719
Speaker 1: when they go off the rails, how are you going

454
00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:27,960
Speaker 1: to reinforce and get people back on track? For me,

455
00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:31,680
Speaker 1: that's a great transition to a different type of gathering

456
00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:37,760
Speaker 1: of democracy, this vaguely defined project for many of us.

457
00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:40,520
Speaker 1: But follow me on this, on this train, and it

458
00:26:40,560 --> 00:26:43,879
Speaker 1: starts again with something you've written that what makes a

459
00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:48,280
Speaker 1: gathering successful is put in place beforehand. And when I

460
00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:52,000
Speaker 1: think about some of our rituals around practicing democracy, preparation

461
00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:55,240
Speaker 1: is required going into the voting booth prepared much more

462
00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:57,560
Speaker 1: helpful than just showing up cold trying to figure it out.

463
00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:00,400
Speaker 1: And when we define citizen as a verb here, it's

464
00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:04,720
Speaker 1: like understanding your power, investing in relationship, showing up and participating,

465
00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:09,400
Speaker 1: valuing the collective. That all has some preparation baked into it.

466
00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:13,439
Speaker 1: How do we apply this guidance, this preparatory guidance around

467
00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:16,800
Speaker 1: gathering to approach the ways we come together for more

468
00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:21,840
Speaker 1: explicitly civic purposes. So past baby showers, and birthday parties.

469
00:27:22,600 --> 00:27:26,000
Speaker 1: We need gatherings for our democracy to literally function, and

470
00:27:26,119 --> 00:27:29,119
Speaker 1: I'm thinking about school board meetings, some of which have

471
00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:32,640
Speaker 1: gone way off the rails in so many of our experiences.

472
00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:36,399
Speaker 1: What can we take from your experience and knowledge of

473
00:27:36,440 --> 00:27:41,680
Speaker 1: gathering to apply to these critical infrastructure functions of our

474
00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:45,320
Speaker 1: sometimes flailing democracy. I mean, the first thing is, I

475
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:48,320
Speaker 1: don't think of this as a binary. That there are

476
00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:53,920
Speaker 1: civic gatherings and non civic gatherings and so often part

477
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:57,120
Speaker 1: of civic life, like all get to school boards, but

478
00:27:57,280 --> 00:27:59,800
Speaker 1: the school board, when I say, it's not binary. Part

479
00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:03,000
Speaker 1: of the reason these school boards are falling apart is

480
00:28:03,040 --> 00:28:06,560
Speaker 1: in part because wealth, a lot of different reasons, but

481
00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:09,760
Speaker 1: in part because we have fundamentally different norms and values

482
00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:13,400
Speaker 1: and understandings of what's actually happening in our culture and

483
00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:17,720
Speaker 1: more and more in our baby showers, in our birthday parties.

484
00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:23,760
Speaker 1: We are lacking bridging infrastructure. So sociologically, there's groups that

485
00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:26,560
Speaker 1: have bridging meaning, like you have a Republican and a Democrat,

486
00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:28,399
Speaker 1: you have a Yankees fan in a Red Sox. We

487
00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:30,640
Speaker 1: will go to dinner together. It's okay, We'll put our

488
00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:33,960
Speaker 1: baseball politics aside and then there's bonding, which is sort

489
00:28:33,960 --> 00:28:36,200
Speaker 1: of like and like, And basically, over the last fifty

490
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:40,320
Speaker 1: years in the US, at least, our bridging infrastructure has collapsed,

491
00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:43,160
Speaker 1: and it's in part because our social and public infrastructure

492
00:28:43,160 --> 00:28:46,480
Speaker 1: has collapsed. The privatization of everything has also led us

493
00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:50,280
Speaker 1: to having more inequality and also having less civic shared

494
00:28:50,360 --> 00:28:53,280
Speaker 1: spaces in which people who have difference spend time together.

495
00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:57,240
Speaker 1: And so the first thing I would say is when

496
00:28:57,280 --> 00:29:00,560
Speaker 1: we think about our civic life, one of the underlying

497
00:29:00,600 --> 00:29:04,640
Speaker 1: purposes or needs and perhaps all of your gatherings is

498
00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:07,520
Speaker 1: to really think about this larger project, which is who

499
00:29:07,560 --> 00:29:10,760
Speaker 1: am I inviting and how do I make space for

500
00:29:10,800 --> 00:29:15,920
Speaker 1: people who aren't exactly like me? And in conflict resolution,

501
00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:18,600
Speaker 1: one of my mentors is a man named Harold Saunders,

502
00:29:18,840 --> 00:29:22,560
Speaker 1: and he trained my peers and I in this very

503
00:29:22,600 --> 00:29:25,880
Speaker 1: specific process called sustained dialogue. You bring people together, you

504
00:29:25,920 --> 00:29:28,720
Speaker 1: talk very explicitly about your backgrounds. But he would say

505
00:29:28,840 --> 00:29:34,800
Speaker 1: to us, always, don't become sustained dialogues salespeople. So often

506
00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:38,160
Speaker 1: what we actually need is shared experiences where we're literally

507
00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:43,720
Speaker 1: talking less. Dialogue is one form of communication, and sometimes

508
00:29:43,720 --> 00:29:47,760
Speaker 1: it's incredibly helpful and sometimes there are so many landmines

509
00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:50,480
Speaker 1: that actually, what you need to remember is that there's

510
00:29:50,520 --> 00:29:53,560
Speaker 1: other ways to be. I'll give one more example. A

511
00:29:53,600 --> 00:29:57,440
Speaker 1: woman wrote to me recently about her church and as

512
00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:01,480
Speaker 1: a small church in North Carolina, and she basically wrote

513
00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:03,600
Speaker 1: to me and she said, like many churches in this country,

514
00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:05,640
Speaker 1: we've been doing a lot of missing of each other.

515
00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:08,920
Speaker 1: We haven't actually gathered to congregate in over two years

516
00:30:08,920 --> 00:30:12,000
Speaker 1: in person, so we've literally missed each other. And then

517
00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:15,880
Speaker 1: the racial uprising has revealed fishers within our church that

518
00:30:15,960 --> 00:30:18,920
Speaker 1: we didn't know we're there. And it is fundamentally getting

519
00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:22,560
Speaker 1: down to like our core beliefs about the Bible, our

520
00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:24,800
Speaker 1: core beliefs about how we come to know what we know,

521
00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:27,560
Speaker 1: like it is as existential as it can get. What

522
00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:29,920
Speaker 1: do we do? And I said, well, what do you

523
00:30:29,960 --> 00:30:34,080
Speaker 1: think is the first deepest need in this community right now?

524
00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:37,080
Speaker 1: And she said, people are so deeply in their camps

525
00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:40,760
Speaker 1: and there's so much distrust that I think we need

526
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:44,480
Speaker 1: to remember why we enjoyed each other in the first place.

527
00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:49,120
Speaker 1: We kind of need to grow the love. And so

528
00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:52,560
Speaker 1: she threw a parking lot party and she convinced her

529
00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:55,800
Speaker 1: board to rent a dunk tank and the core of

530
00:30:55,840 --> 00:31:01,960
Speaker 1: the parking lot party was dunk the deacon. Yes, right,

531
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:04,800
Speaker 1: and we can all come together around that like throw

532
00:31:05,000 --> 00:31:08,280
Speaker 1: that ball. And I love this example so much in

533
00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:11,440
Speaker 1: part because again it's like even then you think, like, okay,

534
00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:14,040
Speaker 1: the preconceived form of a church that's in conflict because

535
00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:16,280
Speaker 1: we need to come together and stare at each other

536
00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:20,400
Speaker 1: and talk about the most important parts of Christian theology. Right,

537
00:31:20,800 --> 00:31:26,240
Speaker 1: it's so easy to get into we have a problem.

538
00:31:26,240 --> 00:31:28,320
Speaker 1: We should come and talk about a problem. Yes, and

539
00:31:28,440 --> 00:31:31,840
Speaker 1: sometimes yeah, And sometimes that's why it's like, look, part

540
00:31:31,840 --> 00:31:33,680
Speaker 1: of what this woman is doing is she was paying

541
00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:36,520
Speaker 1: attention and really looking at It's almost like reading a

542
00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:39,800
Speaker 1: body and trying to figure out, like where is this unhealthy?

543
00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:42,680
Speaker 1: And part of what I love about this was she

544
00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:44,440
Speaker 1: then you know, I taught how to go and she

545
00:31:44,480 --> 00:31:46,640
Speaker 1: said it was so fun and people kind of came

546
00:31:46,680 --> 00:31:48,560
Speaker 1: and their arms were kind of across. Not everyone came,

547
00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:51,880
Speaker 1: but there was like the band did cover songs and

548
00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:54,120
Speaker 1: people there was a baked It gave people something to do.

549
00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:56,120
Speaker 1: It was in the parking lot. Also very interesting the

550
00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:58,880
Speaker 1: location of gathering matters. It wasn't an inside the church,

551
00:31:59,360 --> 00:32:01,480
Speaker 1: but it also wasn't at some fancy venue where people

552
00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:03,640
Speaker 1: could be like, this is what we're spending our money on. Right,

553
00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:05,720
Speaker 1: She defended the purpose of the dunk tank and the

554
00:32:05,760 --> 00:32:07,640
Speaker 1: purchase of it or the rental of it, and then

555
00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:09,640
Speaker 1: she said later, she said, you know so many people

556
00:32:09,840 --> 00:32:14,240
Speaker 1: the ways their bodies looked after from where literally their

557
00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:17,520
Speaker 1: body language. Yeah, as they left, it was like there

558
00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:20,440
Speaker 1: was some relief. And so I can't tell you how

559
00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:27,480
Speaker 1: many people told me, wow, I needed this. So needs discovered,

560
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:32,160
Speaker 1: needs found, and also needs met. It's a nonlinear approach

561
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:35,040
Speaker 1: to some of the challenges we're facing into and maybe

562
00:32:35,040 --> 00:32:38,800
Speaker 1: the best gathering isn't a debate or a dialogue, but

563
00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:43,000
Speaker 1: it's a dunk tank. I experienced this with the America

564
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:46,560
Speaker 1: Outdoor show I made, which allowed me to experience the

565
00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:50,320
Speaker 1: country and all this difference on literally different terms, different ground.

566
00:32:50,720 --> 00:32:54,880
Speaker 1: Oh we're kayaking together. We're in the same boat, very

567
00:32:54,960 --> 00:32:58,200
Speaker 1: different from being on the same dais completely with a

568
00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:00,520
Speaker 1: card in front of me labeling me this and labeling

569
00:33:00,560 --> 00:33:04,600
Speaker 1: me that. The idea that shared experiences can be the

570
00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:10,000
Speaker 1: foundation on which we build more productive dialogue. It's a precursor, right,

571
00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:13,040
Speaker 1: So the prerequisite and that you can shift the energy

572
00:33:13,120 --> 00:33:16,440
Speaker 1: between people again by uniting them in dunking their deacon

573
00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:21,360
Speaker 1: and creating just like having different staring at a zoom

574
00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:27,080
Speaker 1: screen right right experience, and that that energy shift. It

575
00:33:27,240 --> 00:33:29,840
Speaker 1: is a democratic process as well. So many of us

576
00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:33,120
Speaker 1: are educated in like a formality it involves a town

577
00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:36,160
Speaker 1: hall and involves a speaker and a box and a podium,

578
00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:38,480
Speaker 1: and you say, oh, it could involve a dunk tank

579
00:33:38,520 --> 00:33:41,600
Speaker 1: and you can grow the love that way. Election day?

580
00:33:41,840 --> 00:33:46,600
Speaker 1: Is this explicitly democratic ritual that we have that is

581
00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:49,400
Speaker 1: a bit tortured for for a lot of us. Is

582
00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:52,880
Speaker 1: there something you would do to change about our ritual

583
00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:57,400
Speaker 1: gatherings and events in these moments of election days themselves?

584
00:33:57,480 --> 00:34:00,880
Speaker 1: How could you reimagine a reapproach that I think your

585
00:34:00,920 --> 00:34:04,040
Speaker 1: question is really interesting to kind of to zoom out slightly,

586
00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:06,520
Speaker 1: which is like, which are the national civic rituals that

587
00:34:06,560 --> 00:34:11,000
Speaker 1: we should actually rap meaning around and which should be

588
00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:15,799
Speaker 1: so like just the facts, ma'am, and so much of

589
00:34:15,840 --> 00:34:19,040
Speaker 1: what's in this moment of democratic crisis of what's under's threat,

590
00:34:19,040 --> 00:34:21,840
Speaker 1: Like if you think about the January sixth co attempt,

591
00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:27,080
Speaker 1: what did they specifically try to attack? What was the

592
00:34:27,160 --> 00:34:32,480
Speaker 1: boring democratic moment that they were trying to interrupt the certification,

593
00:34:32,800 --> 00:34:35,880
Speaker 1: which for like one hundred and fifty years most citizens

594
00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:38,239
Speaker 1: didn't even know what it was. Right, it was a certification.

595
00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:41,839
Speaker 1: It was a ritual in which different states read out

596
00:34:41,920 --> 00:34:45,400
Speaker 1: their ballot count and the vice president certifies the election.

597
00:34:46,160 --> 00:34:51,760
Speaker 1: It was a very strategic, tactical, surgical attack on before

598
00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:55,880
Speaker 1: what was actually a mundane civic ritual that had a

599
00:34:55,920 --> 00:34:59,840
Speaker 1: functional and a ritualistic power, but all of a sudden

600
00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:05,160
Speaker 1: that has become loaded and baggaged and so versus. Like

601
00:35:05,239 --> 00:35:07,839
Speaker 1: I was so moved at the beginning of that kind

602
00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:10,280
Speaker 1: of May June, April, May, June July, of the pandemic,

603
00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:13,600
Speaker 1: when we finally got our first vaccine. To me, those

604
00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:19,160
Speaker 1: moments standing in line watching I went in Brooklyn. The

605
00:35:19,280 --> 00:35:21,759
Speaker 1: place I went was operated by the National Guard. It

606
00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:26,600
Speaker 1: was safe, it was orderly, it was full of volunteers.

607
00:35:26,719 --> 00:35:28,920
Speaker 1: It was this like I was weepy. It was this

608
00:35:29,280 --> 00:35:35,840
Speaker 1: beautiful national civic ritual of walking in sitting side by side,

609
00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:39,440
Speaker 1: six feet apart from other citizens or non citizens, but

610
00:35:39,520 --> 00:35:43,520
Speaker 1: other human beings in that moment to all get the

611
00:35:43,719 --> 00:35:47,280
Speaker 1: shot in our arm. And to me, like, those moments

612
00:35:47,320 --> 00:35:51,000
Speaker 1: are moments to actually up the civic celebration. Right if

613
00:35:51,080 --> 00:35:54,520
Speaker 1: you walk outside and everyone starts clapping, like these moments

614
00:35:54,680 --> 00:35:57,879
Speaker 1: where you actually see this is what government is. Right.

615
00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:01,520
Speaker 1: Government isn't just that election once a year. This is government. Yeah, right,

616
00:36:01,640 --> 00:36:03,279
Speaker 1: when we do it at the Apple store, you know,

617
00:36:03,280 --> 00:36:05,239
Speaker 1: when they launch a new product and people line up

618
00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:07,400
Speaker 1: and they clap congrats. You spend too much money on

619
00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:09,000
Speaker 1: a device, you're gonna have to replace it a year.

620
00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:11,719
Speaker 1: And we absolutely we could do it for first Like

621
00:36:11,719 --> 00:36:14,160
Speaker 1: if you think about schools, you know, looking at schools

622
00:36:14,160 --> 00:36:16,440
Speaker 1: as these educated places. The difference between schools that on

623
00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:18,200
Speaker 1: the first day of school, like everyone just runs in

624
00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:22,040
Speaker 1: the door, versus schools in which these are all real examples,

625
00:36:22,239 --> 00:36:26,360
Speaker 1: a principle stands outside the door and greets every student

626
00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:30,480
Speaker 1: by name. Yeah. Another school in Connecticut where trying to

627
00:36:30,520 --> 00:36:36,080
Speaker 1: stop particularly black student attrition, black fathers would stand in

628
00:36:36,200 --> 00:36:42,160
Speaker 1: their professional uniforms from where every bus opened the door

629
00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:46,520
Speaker 1: to the door and would clap as their children entered

630
00:36:46,560 --> 00:36:52,719
Speaker 1: the room. Yeah, that's great, and that's sparking. Where do

631
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:55,600
Speaker 1: we invest where do we add meeting, as you said,

632
00:36:55,880 --> 00:36:58,720
Speaker 1: and what's worth celebrating in terms of our civic college apart,

633
00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:00,759
Speaker 1: I can I just tak one thing part of like

634
00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:05,120
Speaker 1: when I said earlier, gatherers are meaning makers, Like there

635
00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:07,560
Speaker 1: is a lot of our civic life, in our democratic

636
00:37:07,600 --> 00:37:11,439
Speaker 1: life that actually still works. And sometimes it's actually trying

637
00:37:11,440 --> 00:37:13,040
Speaker 1: to figure out where to put the spotlight and saying

638
00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:16,160
Speaker 1: this is something to celebrate. It was resonantly rereading their

639
00:37:16,200 --> 00:37:20,480
Speaker 1: eyes were watching God by Zoraneil Hurston. And there's this

640
00:37:20,600 --> 00:37:23,840
Speaker 1: moment in the book where basically the man she marries

641
00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:26,720
Speaker 1: is in this new town and he becomes mayor, and

642
00:37:26,800 --> 00:37:29,600
Speaker 1: one of the things he agitates for is getting electricity

643
00:37:29,600 --> 00:37:35,000
Speaker 1: into the town. And the first street light arrives and

644
00:37:35,120 --> 00:37:38,160
Speaker 1: the narrator basically says something like I just thought we'd

645
00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:40,680
Speaker 1: like stick it in the ground. But what I didn't

646
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:44,160
Speaker 1: understand about my husband was that he was a man

647
00:37:44,520 --> 00:37:49,120
Speaker 1: of ceremony. And he got the entire town cooking for

648
00:37:49,200 --> 00:37:52,680
Speaker 1: three days, and we began to get everyone excited, and

649
00:37:52,719 --> 00:37:56,359
Speaker 1: then we gathered around and then the first moment when

650
00:37:56,400 --> 00:38:00,840
Speaker 1: there was literally light, the entire town was gathered, everyone clapped.

651
00:38:02,360 --> 00:38:06,640
Speaker 1: He understood what and how to make meaning around certain

652
00:38:06,680 --> 00:38:09,319
Speaker 1: moments of civic life. And the leaders we mean now

653
00:38:09,360 --> 00:38:12,200
Speaker 1: and the citizens are moments to know what to celebrate

654
00:38:12,200 --> 00:38:14,359
Speaker 1: and to grow. It's like parenting, like grow the good

655
00:38:15,040 --> 00:38:17,920
Speaker 1: and to also I mean like the media I think

656
00:38:18,000 --> 00:38:19,759
Speaker 1: is doing a slightly better job at this now than

657
00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:22,200
Speaker 1: they were four years ago. It's also like what to

658
00:38:22,200 --> 00:38:27,360
Speaker 1: not pay attention to? Yeah, what should remain boring? Just boring?

659
00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:32,360
Speaker 1: Don't don't grow agitation, don't grow hate speech, don't grow.

660
00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:38,520
Speaker 1: Don't retweet whatever you know so and so might say.

661
00:38:42,560 --> 00:38:45,759
Speaker 1: After the break, Preya Parker on how we can reimagine

662
00:38:45,800 --> 00:38:50,520
Speaker 1: the ways we gather for democracy. I want to bring

663
00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:54,240
Speaker 1: us back to kind of neighborhood's, families, workplaces, these places

664
00:38:54,239 --> 00:38:56,000
Speaker 1: where we gather the most. And we got this question

665
00:38:56,040 --> 00:39:00,239
Speaker 1: in advance from a listener, Sarah Takehara, who row, some

666
00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:03,160
Speaker 1: of us are eager to gather and build community, but

667
00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:06,719
Speaker 1: we've been hurt in past community offerings. How do those

668
00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:08,560
Speaker 1: of us who are worried about feeling safe and at

669
00:39:08,600 --> 00:39:11,560
Speaker 1: home in community move forward? How do we honor our

670
00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:15,200
Speaker 1: need to self protect while still actively looking to participate

671
00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:20,120
Speaker 1: in the richness of a community gathering? Welcome to being alive?

672
00:39:21,239 --> 00:39:24,040
Speaker 1: Do I love again? Do I decide to open my

673
00:39:24,120 --> 00:39:27,239
Speaker 1: heart to a friend again? Do I decide to try

674
00:39:27,239 --> 00:39:30,680
Speaker 1: something new. What I would say to dear listener is like,

675
00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:33,920
Speaker 1: what is your deepest need? Like which community? Whose community?

676
00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:35,400
Speaker 1: What are you trying to build a community, trying to

677
00:39:35,480 --> 00:39:37,440
Speaker 1: join a community? Are you trying to be in community

678
00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:39,120
Speaker 1: with people who have hurt you and you're trying to

679
00:39:39,120 --> 00:39:41,880
Speaker 1: create some repair? Are you trying to new people and

680
00:39:41,880 --> 00:39:44,000
Speaker 1: you're just feeling a little tender from the where you

681
00:39:44,040 --> 00:39:47,080
Speaker 1: were before. And I know I sound like a broken record,

682
00:39:47,080 --> 00:39:49,400
Speaker 1: but it's coming back to basics, which is really asking

683
00:39:49,400 --> 00:39:51,799
Speaker 1: and pausing, what is the need here? What is my need?

684
00:39:51,800 --> 00:39:53,400
Speaker 1: And what do I see the need in this community?

685
00:39:54,160 --> 00:39:58,200
Speaker 1: Who might share that need? And then are there boundaries

686
00:39:58,520 --> 00:40:00,839
Speaker 1: that you set up well ahead of time time to

687
00:40:00,840 --> 00:40:03,239
Speaker 1: create the gatherings you wish existed. I mean, one of

688
00:40:03,239 --> 00:40:05,000
Speaker 1: the things I thought was so interesting when I did

689
00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:07,239
Speaker 1: research for the Art of Gathering, So the Art of

690
00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:09,160
Speaker 1: Gathering as a book is yes, it's me as a

691
00:40:09,200 --> 00:40:11,799
Speaker 1: facilitator kind of giving you my lens, But I also

692
00:40:11,920 --> 00:40:16,000
Speaker 1: interviewed over one hundred different people, including you, Bartende, including

693
00:40:16,080 --> 00:40:19,359
Speaker 1: me and Elizabeth and Elizabeth Stuarts and my wife. Yeah,

694
00:40:19,760 --> 00:40:22,279
Speaker 1: and you're both great gatherers and one of the things

695
00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:25,320
Speaker 1: I found and I learned from so many people was many, many,

696
00:40:25,360 --> 00:40:27,840
Speaker 1: many of these gatherers. And I found these people in

697
00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:32,160
Speaker 1: part because these were people who other people consistently credit

698
00:40:32,320 --> 00:40:36,600
Speaker 1: with being great gatherers or creating meaningful experiences. One of

699
00:40:36,600 --> 00:40:38,520
Speaker 1: the things I found was, again and again and again,

700
00:40:38,640 --> 00:40:43,960
Speaker 1: many of these gatherers self identified as introverts, as often

701
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:48,080
Speaker 1: suffering from social anxiety, as people often on the outside

702
00:40:48,080 --> 00:40:50,640
Speaker 1: of things. And I it wasn't my frame of what

703
00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:53,440
Speaker 1: who we think of as like the magnetic host or

704
00:40:53,480 --> 00:40:54,680
Speaker 1: you know, like the person in the middle of the

705
00:40:54,719 --> 00:40:59,480
Speaker 1: room who can handle it staying. I hand me the

706
00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:02,120
Speaker 1: mic and I asked one person, I said, why do

707
00:41:02,160 --> 00:41:04,120
Speaker 1: you think this is? And this person said to me,

708
00:41:04,680 --> 00:41:09,000
Speaker 1: I create the gatherings I wish existed in the world. Yeah,

709
00:41:09,239 --> 00:41:13,040
Speaker 1: and I don't rely on the uniqueness of my personality.

710
00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:17,400
Speaker 1: I create just enough structure and just enough context to

711
00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:19,560
Speaker 1: allow people to really know if they want to enter.

712
00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:21,759
Speaker 1: And I make sure that there's someone kind of at

713
00:41:21,800 --> 00:41:24,839
Speaker 1: the steer of the ship so called, so that there's

714
00:41:24,840 --> 00:41:27,960
Speaker 1: a light hand pushing people through. They know what they're

715
00:41:27,960 --> 00:41:30,839
Speaker 1: signing up for. And I'm kind of creating just enough

716
00:41:30,880 --> 00:41:34,359
Speaker 1: guardrails that I wish I had when I walk into

717
00:41:34,360 --> 00:41:36,360
Speaker 1: a room and it's vague and diluted, or I'm getting

718
00:41:36,360 --> 00:41:38,279
Speaker 1: cornered by someone forever, but I don't know how to

719
00:41:38,320 --> 00:41:41,520
Speaker 1: politely sidestep, and so so often to go to even

720
00:41:41,600 --> 00:41:43,920
Speaker 1: to the how do you re engage in community? To

721
00:41:44,000 --> 00:41:46,000
Speaker 1: first pause and just ask what kind of community do

722
00:41:46,040 --> 00:41:48,720
Speaker 1: you want to create? Like it's not a ad water,

723
00:41:49,520 --> 00:41:54,680
Speaker 1: This is an organic and somewhat synthetic designed experience that

724
00:41:54,960 --> 00:41:58,520
Speaker 1: takes courage and is risk taking. But also to get

725
00:41:58,600 --> 00:42:01,759
Speaker 1: really clear on your intent, I think allows for some

726
00:42:01,840 --> 00:42:06,200
Speaker 1: of the courage to be built brave spaces, beautiful courage.

727
00:42:07,560 --> 00:42:12,120
Speaker 1: Thank you. This idea of planning gatherings for good controversy,

728
00:42:12,200 --> 00:42:15,520
Speaker 1: which is something you've also talked and written about, can

729
00:42:15,560 --> 00:42:19,279
Speaker 1: feel a little stressful, well nerve racking, like inviting controversy

730
00:42:19,320 --> 00:42:22,600
Speaker 1: maybe conflict, but especially if you're not a trained facilitator.

731
00:42:22,760 --> 00:42:25,239
Speaker 1: And you've just spoken about the types of hosts who

732
00:42:25,520 --> 00:42:28,440
Speaker 1: who aren't the extroverts, but they want to create something

733
00:42:28,480 --> 00:42:31,560
Speaker 1: that they saw missing in the world. You've also added

734
00:42:31,560 --> 00:42:35,560
Speaker 1: and said that human connection is as threatened by unhealthy

735
00:42:35,640 --> 00:42:40,360
Speaker 1: peace as unhealthy conflict. Break that apart for me, and

736
00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:43,640
Speaker 1: then I got to follow over me. So I come

737
00:42:43,760 --> 00:42:47,760
Speaker 1: from I'm a child of divorce. When my parents announced

738
00:42:47,800 --> 00:42:51,520
Speaker 1: their separation, I and everyone else was shocked because they

739
00:42:51,520 --> 00:42:56,680
Speaker 1: never fought. And I understood over many years that I

740
00:42:56,760 --> 00:42:59,480
Speaker 1: come on both sides, from my Indian side and from

741
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:03,440
Speaker 1: my white man coincide from my like three generation of ostriches,

742
00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:06,279
Speaker 1: people who just bury their heads. Just stick your head

743
00:43:06,280 --> 00:43:10,040
Speaker 1: in the sand, hope it passes. And I think, in part,

744
00:43:10,080 --> 00:43:13,040
Speaker 1: you know, I'm a conflict resolution facilitator who is conflict

745
00:43:13,080 --> 00:43:16,680
Speaker 1: a verse. Oh that's right. I like even now, it's

746
00:43:16,719 --> 00:43:18,680
Speaker 1: like start things start to heat up. This is my job.

747
00:43:18,800 --> 00:43:21,080
Speaker 1: Things start to heat up, my hands get sweaty, you know,

748
00:43:21,200 --> 00:43:25,480
Speaker 1: my heart starts beating. I've trained myself physiologically to like

749
00:43:25,680 --> 00:43:28,960
Speaker 1: stay in the game. But I also deep empathy for

750
00:43:28,960 --> 00:43:32,000
Speaker 1: those who are conflict of verse. I actually understand their

751
00:43:32,080 --> 00:43:35,279
Speaker 1: deep desire to just flee, because I'll want to do

752
00:43:35,360 --> 00:43:38,200
Speaker 1: the same. And I think there's some conflicts you just

753
00:43:38,239 --> 00:43:41,040
Speaker 1: exit it's actually not worth it or it's revealing. But

754
00:43:41,840 --> 00:43:46,000
Speaker 1: part of what I realized as a facilitator is heat

755
00:43:46,719 --> 00:43:52,560
Speaker 1: is relevance and whether it's a community trying to figure

756
00:43:52,560 --> 00:43:55,640
Speaker 1: out how to allocate its budget, or whether it's a

757
00:43:55,680 --> 00:43:59,080
Speaker 1: newspaper designing which six stories get on the front page.

758
00:43:59,600 --> 00:44:01,600
Speaker 1: Like it. It goes back to all gathering is political.

759
00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:04,520
Speaker 1: All systems kind of have to decide like what are

760
00:44:04,560 --> 00:44:07,239
Speaker 1: we about? And the juiciest of those conversations usually have

761
00:44:07,280 --> 00:44:10,400
Speaker 1: a lot of heat. So I'll give a simple example

762
00:44:10,760 --> 00:44:13,239
Speaker 1: someone I know who was running a team. She had

763
00:44:13,239 --> 00:44:15,360
Speaker 1: a weekly staff meeting and she was trying to figure

764
00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:19,160
Speaker 1: out basically how she wouldn't use this language, but how

765
00:44:19,200 --> 00:44:20,520
Speaker 1: to bring more heat to the room. She was like,

766
00:44:20,600 --> 00:44:22,960
Speaker 1: can tell they're not really they're holding back. I can

767
00:44:23,000 --> 00:44:25,279
Speaker 1: tell they're not really like saying what they think. I'm

768
00:44:25,320 --> 00:44:27,239
Speaker 1: not really sure why. And so I said, you know,

769
00:44:27,280 --> 00:44:29,600
Speaker 1: don't try to change everything. The way you open a

770
00:44:29,719 --> 00:44:32,640
Speaker 1: gathering matters. How are you opening your meetings? And she

771
00:44:32,680 --> 00:44:34,040
Speaker 1: told me, and I said, why don't you try this

772
00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:36,640
Speaker 1: for six weeks. You have sixteen minutes, spend the first

773
00:44:36,640 --> 00:44:39,120
Speaker 1: five to ten minutes doing a very simple technique called

774
00:44:39,200 --> 00:44:42,440
Speaker 1: rose and thorn. And it's something often from parenting circles.

775
00:44:42,440 --> 00:44:44,000
Speaker 1: You zip around, you say what's your best thing in

776
00:44:44,080 --> 00:44:45,839
Speaker 1: your week and what's the worst thing of the week.

777
00:44:46,040 --> 00:44:48,040
Speaker 1: And that's it, and people could decide if it was

778
00:44:48,080 --> 00:44:49,920
Speaker 1: work or if it was from their own life. And

779
00:44:50,040 --> 00:44:51,920
Speaker 1: I called her up later and I said what happened

780
00:44:51,920 --> 00:44:55,200
Speaker 1: and she said, well, first, since we did it regularly,

781
00:44:55,640 --> 00:44:58,960
Speaker 1: different people took different risks over time. Some people chose

782
00:44:59,000 --> 00:45:01,479
Speaker 1: to just keep it at work. Some people thought work

783
00:45:01,560 --> 00:45:03,680
Speaker 1: is more risky. I'm going to keep it, you know.

784
00:45:03,880 --> 00:45:05,920
Speaker 1: My two year old stubbed their toe, like, I'm going

785
00:45:05,960 --> 00:45:08,760
Speaker 1: to keep this low risk. But basically, over time people

786
00:45:08,840 --> 00:45:12,279
Speaker 1: started expanding their geographical conversation in terms of what they said.

787
00:45:12,680 --> 00:45:14,880
Speaker 1: But something else happened, which is she said, I this

788
00:45:14,960 --> 00:45:17,359
Speaker 1: is her language. I didn't realize that I was. I've

789
00:45:17,400 --> 00:45:20,439
Speaker 1: always been perceived as a cheerleader, somebody to like bring

790
00:45:20,520 --> 00:45:23,799
Speaker 1: things to and grow. I didn't realize that they didn't

791
00:45:23,840 --> 00:45:27,680
Speaker 1: want to bring me bad news. And by shifting, by

792
00:45:27,719 --> 00:45:30,319
Speaker 1: starting with a rose and thorn and giving them equal weight,

793
00:45:30,680 --> 00:45:35,680
Speaker 1: we culturally normalized thorns. It's okay to bring thorns into

794
00:45:35,680 --> 00:45:38,520
Speaker 1: this space. It's okay, and it's not even like even

795
00:45:38,520 --> 00:45:42,319
Speaker 1: more than okay. It's normal. And so part of like

796
00:45:42,600 --> 00:45:47,640
Speaker 1: really thinking about creating cultures for a healthy conflict. Often

797
00:45:47,680 --> 00:45:50,440
Speaker 1: it can be really sometimes you do need an external facilitator,

798
00:45:50,480 --> 00:45:51,880
Speaker 1: And like some of the things I would tell you

799
00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:53,319
Speaker 1: to do, I would say, don't try this at home.

800
00:45:54,080 --> 00:45:56,640
Speaker 1: But one of the things we can all do is

801
00:45:56,760 --> 00:45:59,200
Speaker 1: really think about what are in the first five minutes

802
00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:02,080
Speaker 1: of how you open something, What is the civic ritual,

803
00:46:02,080 --> 00:46:05,040
Speaker 1: even if it's on a zoom chat, of getting people

804
00:46:05,080 --> 00:46:09,840
Speaker 1: to practice that muscle in low risk ways. I also

805
00:46:10,040 --> 00:46:14,600
Speaker 1: just really appreciate you, the expert, the author, the ted speaker,

806
00:46:14,960 --> 00:46:18,560
Speaker 1: the conflict resolution specialist saying my hands field with clammy,

807
00:46:19,480 --> 00:46:23,440
Speaker 1: and that we've prized comfort so much in life. In

808
00:46:23,440 --> 00:46:26,960
Speaker 1: our economy, we create products to ease all kinds of discomfort,

809
00:46:27,120 --> 00:46:29,120
Speaker 1: and in our political and civic life too. So if

810
00:46:29,120 --> 00:46:31,680
Speaker 1: something makes us feel icky, we want to crush it

811
00:46:31,880 --> 00:46:34,400
Speaker 1: or avoid it, or know or flee from it. And

812
00:46:34,520 --> 00:46:38,320
Speaker 1: to see you practicing living with it and sharing stories

813
00:46:38,320 --> 00:46:42,040
Speaker 1: of people inviting it, normalizing like discomfort is also part

814
00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:45,000
Speaker 1: of the process. I think that's a really essential takeaway

815
00:46:45,040 --> 00:46:48,000
Speaker 1: from this. So much of gathering and the way we've

816
00:46:48,000 --> 00:46:50,600
Speaker 1: talked about it and the way I've i hear folks

817
00:46:50,600 --> 00:46:53,560
Speaker 1: talk about is focused on the hosting. How to host

818
00:46:53,600 --> 00:46:58,080
Speaker 1: any tips for guesting? How do we better attend and

819
00:46:58,320 --> 00:47:01,120
Speaker 1: guest so that our gatherings it takes, it takes both

820
00:47:01,400 --> 00:47:04,480
Speaker 1: those functions. This work is called the art of gathering,

821
00:47:05,200 --> 00:47:08,279
Speaker 1: not the art of hosting, in part because I think

822
00:47:08,320 --> 00:47:13,320
Speaker 1: guests have a lot of power. Guests absolutely shape a gathering.

823
00:47:13,320 --> 00:47:15,520
Speaker 1: If someone is in the room and they are checked out,

824
00:47:15,600 --> 00:47:18,839
Speaker 1: everyone can feel it, right, If someone's like texting under

825
00:47:18,880 --> 00:47:21,759
Speaker 1: the table, everyone can feel it. And most of us

826
00:47:21,760 --> 00:47:24,600
Speaker 1: are guests much more often than we're hosts. That's true

827
00:47:24,640 --> 00:47:28,799
Speaker 1: for me, certainly, and so often. To think about, first

828
00:47:28,840 --> 00:47:30,839
Speaker 1: of all, sort of stepping all the way back. If

829
00:47:30,840 --> 00:47:33,839
Speaker 1: a gathering starts before anyone enters the room, it starts

830
00:47:33,880 --> 00:47:36,480
Speaker 1: at the moment of the discovery. First of all, all

831
00:47:36,560 --> 00:47:40,640
Speaker 1: these invitations come in invitations. Are these like little vessels,

832
00:47:41,560 --> 00:47:44,480
Speaker 1: one gathering at a time to think about, to consider

833
00:47:45,160 --> 00:47:49,120
Speaker 1: how do you want to spend your time and with whom?

834
00:47:49,160 --> 00:47:53,120
Speaker 1: And to pause and to ask first to build what

835
00:47:53,160 --> 00:47:56,279
Speaker 1: I call discernment muscles, which is to pause like, how

836
00:47:56,360 --> 00:47:58,440
Speaker 1: is this invitation making me feel? Which ones are you

837
00:47:58,560 --> 00:48:00,279
Speaker 1: rolling your eyes at? Which ones make you a gree

838
00:48:00,440 --> 00:48:02,080
Speaker 1: Which ones are you like you know what? I'm going

839
00:48:02,120 --> 00:48:04,719
Speaker 1: to leave this company? This is so disrespectful, right, like

840
00:48:05,000 --> 00:48:07,480
Speaker 1: we react even if you're not paying attention. Which ones

841
00:48:07,520 --> 00:48:09,839
Speaker 1: are you so excited that you start clapping when you're

842
00:48:09,880 --> 00:48:13,040
Speaker 1: so excited you got invited to something? Just notice? Then

843
00:48:13,160 --> 00:48:15,680
Speaker 1: the second as a guest, really thinking about you know,

844
00:48:15,680 --> 00:48:18,719
Speaker 1: we talk about nutritional diets, right of a culture or

845
00:48:18,760 --> 00:48:20,560
Speaker 1: a community? What does a group of people eat? We

846
00:48:20,600 --> 00:48:23,799
Speaker 1: talk about informational diets, what do we read? What do

847
00:48:23,840 --> 00:48:27,520
Speaker 1: we doomscroll? When do we limit our doomscrolling? And I

848
00:48:27,560 --> 00:48:29,840
Speaker 1: want to introduce the sort of the idea of a

849
00:48:29,920 --> 00:48:35,360
Speaker 1: gathering diet, how many what type with home over? What

850
00:48:35,719 --> 00:48:40,200
Speaker 1: gatherings do you want to host or guest to maintain

851
00:48:40,280 --> 00:48:47,600
Speaker 1: relational health but also boundaried a boundaried life and what's

852
00:48:47,640 --> 00:48:49,839
Speaker 1: the right balance for you? And then the final thing

853
00:48:49,880 --> 00:48:51,839
Speaker 1: I'll say is in terms of an intentional guest. And

854
00:48:51,880 --> 00:48:55,080
Speaker 1: this is like, if you remember nothing else from from

855
00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:59,680
Speaker 1: our conversation, an invitation is like someone throwing you a ball,

856
00:49:00,160 --> 00:49:02,759
Speaker 1: And so often we think the only way to throw

857
00:49:02,800 --> 00:49:04,480
Speaker 1: a ball back is if you can go, is to

858
00:49:04,520 --> 00:49:08,799
Speaker 1: say yes. And when it comes to invitations, don't be

859
00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:12,919
Speaker 1: a maybe it's a delusion of everybody's energy. Well I go, Well,

860
00:49:12,920 --> 00:49:14,919
Speaker 1: I not go keeps this question open your head keeps

861
00:49:14,920 --> 00:49:17,319
Speaker 1: their question unless they're literally like, come on by, if

862
00:49:17,360 --> 00:49:19,439
Speaker 1: you want open house, no big deal, don't rus would

863
00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:22,439
Speaker 1: be great, go do that. But basically to practice either

864
00:49:22,760 --> 00:49:25,880
Speaker 1: an enthusiastic yes, yes I choose to go to this,

865
00:49:26,040 --> 00:49:28,920
Speaker 1: Yes I want to be there, or a connected no.

866
00:49:29,960 --> 00:49:32,600
Speaker 1: We often think saying no is actually not throwing the

867
00:49:32,640 --> 00:49:35,200
Speaker 1: ball back. Not responding is not throwing the ball back,

868
00:49:35,440 --> 00:49:37,360
Speaker 1: and actually by saying I thank you so much for

869
00:49:37,400 --> 00:49:39,160
Speaker 1: thinking of me, I won't be able to make it,

870
00:49:39,160 --> 00:49:43,439
Speaker 1: it's actually yeah, it's citizening. It's throwing this ball back.

871
00:49:43,440 --> 00:49:46,440
Speaker 1: And so so often, how we actually model these moments

872
00:49:46,440 --> 00:49:49,879
Speaker 1: of transaction affects so much about how we spend our time,

873
00:49:49,920 --> 00:49:52,520
Speaker 1: in part because then you are choosing what you want

874
00:49:52,520 --> 00:49:54,160
Speaker 1: to go to, and to be in a place you

875
00:49:54,200 --> 00:49:57,560
Speaker 1: want to be is a beautiful experience, and also you

876
00:49:57,600 --> 00:50:01,080
Speaker 1: show up differently, and then not being someplace is also like.

877
00:50:01,640 --> 00:50:04,040
Speaker 1: Our gatherings are affected by who's there and who's not there,

878
00:50:04,480 --> 00:50:07,280
Speaker 1: and people saying not to stuff is also data interesting,

879
00:50:07,280 --> 00:50:09,439
Speaker 1: why did they say no to this? Maybe we should

880
00:50:09,480 --> 00:50:11,640
Speaker 1: shift it? Interesting, No one's coming to our conferences here,

881
00:50:11,760 --> 00:50:13,839
Speaker 1: Maybe we need to figure out why are they saying no? Right.

882
00:50:13,880 --> 00:50:17,239
Speaker 1: It's an ongoing practice and conversation in communities, which is

883
00:50:17,280 --> 00:50:19,680
Speaker 1: like trying to figure out what is the need, how

884
00:50:19,719 --> 00:50:23,640
Speaker 1: should we gather and who decides? As you know, citizen

885
00:50:23,800 --> 00:50:26,040
Speaker 1: is a verb in the title of this show, right,

886
00:50:26,120 --> 00:50:28,120
Speaker 1: how to citizen? And so I'm going to ask you

887
00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:32,600
Speaker 1: what would be your definition of the word citizen if

888
00:50:32,600 --> 00:50:34,560
Speaker 1: you choose to interpret it as we do, as a

889
00:50:34,640 --> 00:50:39,640
Speaker 1: verb to pay attention to the needs around you, to

890
00:50:39,840 --> 00:50:44,319
Speaker 1: choose with discernment which ones you choose to address, to

891
00:50:45,239 --> 00:50:49,040
Speaker 1: galvanize the people with a shared need, and to do

892
00:50:49,080 --> 00:50:50,600
Speaker 1: it in a way where you don't all have to

893
00:50:50,600 --> 00:50:57,680
Speaker 1: be the same beautiful we are entering the community, ask questions.

894
00:50:57,960 --> 00:51:00,000
Speaker 1: This is a q anda. We like to do these

895
00:51:00,080 --> 00:51:02,920
Speaker 1: things live, and so if we have Cassandra or Cassandra,

896
00:51:03,160 --> 00:51:06,640
Speaker 1: you will tell us which it is and your question. Hi,

897
00:51:06,719 --> 00:51:09,919
Speaker 1: thank you so much Cassandra's staff. As what I say,

898
00:51:09,920 --> 00:51:13,239
Speaker 1: I respond to both. And I'm in San Jose, California.

899
00:51:13,320 --> 00:51:16,640
Speaker 1: This has been very interesting and inspiring. I am starting

900
00:51:16,640 --> 00:51:19,200
Speaker 1: a new job soon and I'm wondering if you have

901
00:51:19,239 --> 00:51:23,399
Speaker 1: any advice for gatherings to establish meaningful connections with about

902
00:51:23,440 --> 00:51:26,200
Speaker 1: one hundred people in my first ninety days on a

903
00:51:26,239 --> 00:51:31,200
Speaker 1: nonprofit budget, and you know, something like an alternative to

904
00:51:31,640 --> 00:51:34,680
Speaker 1: surveys and one on ones. So two questions, is it

905
00:51:34,760 --> 00:51:37,920
Speaker 1: online or in person or a mix mostly in person?

906
00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:42,840
Speaker 1: And do you have institutional authority? I will, you will. So,

907
00:51:43,320 --> 00:51:45,880
Speaker 1: first of all, the reason I ask about the institutional

908
00:51:45,880 --> 00:51:48,880
Speaker 1: authority is in a work context, like who is calling

909
00:51:48,880 --> 00:51:50,759
Speaker 1: the meeting? And your ability to call a meeting or

910
00:51:50,840 --> 00:51:52,880
Speaker 1: gathering really depends on what type of power and role

911
00:51:52,920 --> 00:51:56,239
Speaker 1: you have in an organization. And I mean I will

912
00:51:56,280 --> 00:51:58,600
Speaker 1: just I'll give a few examples of different forms that

913
00:51:58,640 --> 00:52:01,520
Speaker 1: I think have been effective for people. The first is

914
00:52:01,600 --> 00:52:04,640
Speaker 1: think about what are the types of gatherings that are

915
00:52:04,960 --> 00:52:08,200
Speaker 1: low pressure but high interest. So what I mean by

916
00:52:08,200 --> 00:52:11,240
Speaker 1: that is something like a brown bag lunch, right starting

917
00:52:11,239 --> 00:52:15,640
Speaker 1: a series speaker series that's a you know, local activists

918
00:52:15,640 --> 00:52:17,839
Speaker 1: in the San Jose area. I'm making this up right

919
00:52:18,040 --> 00:52:20,799
Speaker 1: where you come in and it's voluntary, but they're every

920
00:52:20,800 --> 00:52:23,200
Speaker 1: Tuesday at noon, there's a brown bag lunch. Right. It's

921
00:52:23,200 --> 00:52:25,640
Speaker 1: broadly informal, but you're also seeing kind of who's coming,

922
00:52:25,880 --> 00:52:28,080
Speaker 1: particularly if it's in person, like the before chat, the

923
00:52:28,120 --> 00:52:30,560
Speaker 1: after chat, like it's low stakes, but it's relevant to

924
00:52:30,560 --> 00:52:34,160
Speaker 1: the organization. One of my favorite books of the last

925
00:52:34,239 --> 00:52:38,160
Speaker 1: year is Oliver Berkman's four Thousand Weeks? Do you Know?

926
00:52:38,360 --> 00:52:40,000
Speaker 1: Do you know what four thousand weeks is? So? Four

927
00:52:40,040 --> 00:52:43,200
Speaker 1: thousand weeks is the number of weeks one has in

928
00:52:43,239 --> 00:52:47,400
Speaker 1: their life should they be lucky enough to live till eighty.

929
00:52:48,320 --> 00:52:51,400
Speaker 1: So the subtitle of the book is time management for Mortals.

930
00:52:53,040 --> 00:52:55,200
Speaker 1: And the second half of the book is really interesting

931
00:52:55,360 --> 00:52:57,120
Speaker 1: for me and the people who are interested in kind

932
00:52:57,120 --> 00:53:00,040
Speaker 1: of gathering in collective life, because he talks about this

933
00:53:00,160 --> 00:53:05,320
Speaker 1: concept called the social regulation of time. And this idea

934
00:53:05,400 --> 00:53:09,040
Speaker 1: is basically that when we choose to come together at

935
00:53:09,040 --> 00:53:12,200
Speaker 1: the same time at the same place, by definition, we're

936
00:53:12,200 --> 00:53:15,440
Speaker 1: giving up some amount of individual freedom. Right can I

937
00:53:15,520 --> 00:53:17,520
Speaker 1: listen to the meeting whenever I want? Or do I

938
00:53:17,560 --> 00:53:18,960
Speaker 1: need to be there in person at the same time

939
00:53:19,000 --> 00:53:22,360
Speaker 1: at the same place. And he talks about this Swedish

940
00:53:22,360 --> 00:53:26,319
Speaker 1: tradition called the fika, and he says, in Sweden, in

941
00:53:26,360 --> 00:53:29,480
Speaker 1: many workplaces at around three o'clock, everybody gets up and

942
00:53:29,520 --> 00:53:32,120
Speaker 1: goes and has a coffee in the office. And this

943
00:53:32,160 --> 00:53:34,480
Speaker 1: is different than having like a cappuccino machine or coffee

944
00:53:34,480 --> 00:53:36,839
Speaker 1: machine you kind of go to whenever you want. This

945
00:53:36,880 --> 00:53:39,160
Speaker 1: is a social regulation of time. And one of the

946
00:53:39,200 --> 00:53:40,800
Speaker 1: managers in the book said, if I want to know

947
00:53:40,840 --> 00:53:43,319
Speaker 1: what's happening in my workplace, I attend the FIKA. And

948
00:53:43,360 --> 00:53:46,560
Speaker 1: he says it's not required, but you'd get a side eye,

949
00:53:46,560 --> 00:53:48,319
Speaker 1: you know, a Swedish side eye if you don't go.

950
00:53:48,719 --> 00:53:51,320
Speaker 1: And again I'm not saying like you should institute a FICA.

951
00:53:51,440 --> 00:53:53,680
Speaker 1: You have to figure out what is your cultural appropriate

952
00:53:53,719 --> 00:53:56,879
Speaker 1: way to have low stakes but high relevant scatherings. And

953
00:53:57,000 --> 00:53:58,920
Speaker 1: some of this is also running a bunch of experiments.

954
00:53:58,960 --> 00:54:01,440
Speaker 1: Who are these people? Are these people who are really

955
00:54:01,480 --> 00:54:04,560
Speaker 1: interested for novelty and saying, Wow, it's so amazing having

956
00:54:04,560 --> 00:54:07,400
Speaker 1: all these outside speakers or is this a culture? It's like,

957
00:54:07,600 --> 00:54:10,719
Speaker 1: why are they bringing in all these outsiders? Right, experiment?

958
00:54:10,920 --> 00:54:13,279
Speaker 1: But I would have specific and focused ways in the

959
00:54:13,320 --> 00:54:16,720
Speaker 1: first ninety days in which you are sharing your agenda,

960
00:54:16,760 --> 00:54:18,719
Speaker 1: you're letting them get to know you. And then I

961
00:54:18,719 --> 00:54:21,400
Speaker 1: would have ways in which it feels more low stakes

962
00:54:21,440 --> 00:54:24,920
Speaker 1: but still relevant to the organization. It's not gratuitous connection

963
00:54:25,000 --> 00:54:28,440
Speaker 1: for connection's sake, it's connection to the purpose of your organization.

964
00:54:28,760 --> 00:54:32,240
Speaker 1: Thank you, We're going to call on Katie Riley. Hello,

965
00:54:32,640 --> 00:54:40,799
Speaker 1: and oh what a treat. So I'm Katie. I'm an organizer.

966
00:54:40,920 --> 00:54:43,840
Speaker 1: I live in Queens, New York, and um, you know,

967
00:54:43,960 --> 00:54:47,839
Speaker 1: big fan of democracy and citizenship. So this is super cool. Um,

968
00:54:48,200 --> 00:54:50,640
Speaker 1: you know, as somebody who is very fond of the

969
00:54:50,680 --> 00:54:53,799
Speaker 1: harder gathering, of thinking about different ways to gather. Like,

970
00:54:54,080 --> 00:54:56,919
Speaker 1: where do you see the most untapped potential right now

971
00:54:57,160 --> 00:55:01,399
Speaker 1: in creating gatherings, particularly for organizers and people who really

972
00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:07,200
Speaker 1: care about protecting democracy? Beautiful question. The most untapped opportunity

973
00:55:07,280 --> 00:55:11,360
Speaker 1: right now is to create pockets and moments of deep joy.

974
00:55:12,160 --> 00:55:15,279
Speaker 1: We have models like during the pandemic, Saint James Joy,

975
00:55:15,520 --> 00:55:19,080
Speaker 1: this couple, as I understand it, who basically DJed off

976
00:55:19,120 --> 00:55:22,160
Speaker 1: their Brooklyn stoop and you know, and people would come

977
00:55:22,200 --> 00:55:23,920
Speaker 1: and dance and kind of get it out once particularly

978
00:55:23,960 --> 00:55:26,200
Speaker 1: we knew that it was safe to be outside together.

979
00:55:26,719 --> 00:55:29,360
Speaker 1: But I think so much of what's happening in this country,

980
00:55:29,600 --> 00:55:32,239
Speaker 1: there's so many underlying structural reasons as to why we

981
00:55:32,360 --> 00:55:39,359
Speaker 1: are a hot mess. To put it, sociologically scientific inequality,

982
00:55:40,000 --> 00:55:43,520
Speaker 1: the loss and confusion around roles in so many different ways.

983
00:55:43,760 --> 00:55:47,200
Speaker 1: And like when I look at kind of I talked

984
00:55:47,200 --> 00:55:50,000
Speaker 1: earlier about almost like metaphorically reading of bodies. I would

985
00:55:50,040 --> 00:55:52,760
Speaker 1: go back to that parking lot example, which is like many, many,

986
00:55:52,800 --> 00:55:57,439
Speaker 1: many people are lonely. Many many, many people aren't doing

987
00:55:57,480 --> 00:56:01,680
Speaker 1: this the basic steps of like getting outside and doing

988
00:56:01,719 --> 00:56:05,560
Speaker 1: something that's fun. We've been kind of like physiologically crouched

989
00:56:06,560 --> 00:56:07,960
Speaker 1: for two and a half years for a lot of

990
00:56:07,960 --> 00:56:12,239
Speaker 1: different reasons and having pockets of joy. And there's so

991
00:56:12,239 --> 00:56:14,680
Speaker 1: many examples, even during the BLM protests, of like the

992
00:56:14,680 --> 00:56:16,680
Speaker 1: Cupid shuffle in the middle of the street, right that

993
00:56:17,320 --> 00:56:19,960
Speaker 1: we don't not know how to do this. But I

994
00:56:20,000 --> 00:56:21,680
Speaker 1: think so often we think like we need to have

995
00:56:21,680 --> 00:56:24,960
Speaker 1: these intellectual discussions, and so often like we need the

996
00:56:25,000 --> 00:56:30,160
Speaker 1: medicine of joy, of relief, of laughter, of humor, and

997
00:56:30,280 --> 00:56:35,400
Speaker 1: ideally of experiencing some of that with strangers, and part

998
00:56:35,440 --> 00:56:39,560
Speaker 1: of creating spaces that you literally feel safe in public spaces.

999
00:56:39,960 --> 00:56:45,720
Speaker 1: It's not a lack of danger, it's a presence of beauty,

1000
00:56:45,840 --> 00:56:50,520
Speaker 1: of joy, of laughter, of release. And the second thing

1001
00:56:50,520 --> 00:56:52,800
Speaker 1: I would say is we've been through a traumatic period

1002
00:56:52,800 --> 00:56:55,440
Speaker 1: with the pandemic, and it's it's continued. We're still living

1003
00:56:55,440 --> 00:56:59,000
Speaker 1: a different phase of the pandemic. But for multiple years

1004
00:56:59,280 --> 00:57:04,480
Speaker 1: we were as a nation like in like deep fear.

1005
00:57:05,400 --> 00:57:08,640
Speaker 1: And I think that the second civic need is finding

1006
00:57:08,640 --> 00:57:14,800
Speaker 1: appropriate ways to grieve, beautiful answers. The thing that bridges

1007
00:57:14,840 --> 00:57:17,600
Speaker 1: this for me with Katie's question, your answer prea is

1008
00:57:17,640 --> 00:57:20,840
Speaker 1: the Lincoln Memorial. I recently was in Washington, d C.

1009
00:57:21,280 --> 00:57:24,360
Speaker 1: For a big civic event, popped over to the Lincoln

1010
00:57:24,360 --> 00:57:27,600
Speaker 1: Memorial with friends and at the foot of the Lincoln

1011
00:57:27,600 --> 00:57:32,480
Speaker 1: Memorial was a group of teenagers dancing. They had loudspeakers,

1012
00:57:32,840 --> 00:57:37,200
Speaker 1: they were choreographed. We thought, is this a music video?

1013
00:57:38,560 --> 00:57:41,080
Speaker 1: Is this a TikTok challenge? And I so I went

1014
00:57:41,160 --> 00:57:43,400
Speaker 1: up to two of these kids, Let's say, what is

1015
00:57:43,520 --> 00:57:46,600
Speaker 1: this beautiful thing? And they're like, oh, they had a

1016
00:57:46,720 --> 00:57:49,480
Speaker 1: name for it. They just know each other through Instagram,

1017
00:57:49,480 --> 00:57:51,280
Speaker 1: but they don't know each other like they know that

1018
00:57:51,320 --> 00:57:53,640
Speaker 1: they're connected to this thing. And it was a flash

1019
00:57:53,800 --> 00:57:58,200
Speaker 1: dance mob and they were so happy. The physical metaphor

1020
00:57:58,760 --> 00:58:00,600
Speaker 1: of one of them being in their body and expressing

1021
00:58:00,680 --> 00:58:03,640
Speaker 1: joy of being around strangers, of being in a public

1022
00:58:03,640 --> 00:58:07,919
Speaker 1: space between the Lincoln Memorial and the reflecting pool that

1023
00:58:08,000 --> 00:58:11,200
Speaker 1: was America, Like that was the best of citizening and

1024
00:58:11,320 --> 00:58:13,880
Speaker 1: gathering and joy and it's everything that Katie asked, and

1025
00:58:13,880 --> 00:58:17,800
Speaker 1: it's everything you answered. In an instance, they're breaking our

1026
00:58:17,920 --> 00:58:21,840
Speaker 1: idea of the form of what is supposed to look

1027
00:58:21,880 --> 00:58:26,360
Speaker 1: like honoring. Right. It was like silent, hollowed tones of

1028
00:58:26,440 --> 00:58:29,680
Speaker 1: going and that may be honoring in some places, right,

1029
00:58:29,760 --> 00:58:33,800
Speaker 1: but to reclaim we can do this right And it's

1030
00:58:33,880 --> 00:58:36,880
Speaker 1: and it's kind of controversial, like in certain cases, is

1031
00:58:37,000 --> 00:58:39,120
Speaker 1: what does it look like to honor? And so I

1032
00:58:39,200 --> 00:58:43,240
Speaker 1: love this example in part because it's actually bringing relevance

1033
00:58:43,680 --> 00:58:46,800
Speaker 1: to the most one of the most important physical symbols

1034
00:58:46,800 --> 00:58:51,360
Speaker 1: that we have in the country. I appreciate you Prea Parker,

1035
00:58:51,640 --> 00:58:55,200
Speaker 1: thank you for having me a total joy, it really is.

1036
00:58:55,240 --> 00:58:59,240
Speaker 1: And I think there's something elemental in your interpretation of

1037
00:58:59,240 --> 00:59:02,760
Speaker 1: the of how to and the power of gathering that

1038
00:59:03,000 --> 00:59:06,640
Speaker 1: what we see reflected that feels ugly and unapproachable and

1039
00:59:06,680 --> 00:59:09,320
Speaker 1: even dangerous, and some elements of our politics and civic

1040
00:59:09,360 --> 00:59:12,920
Speaker 1: life could be addressed if we gather differently, and if

1041
00:59:12,920 --> 00:59:16,080
Speaker 1: we practiced differently, and even if we said no differently

1042
00:59:16,360 --> 00:59:19,680
Speaker 1: but said something and leaned into discomfort in someplace. But

1043
00:59:19,760 --> 00:59:23,120
Speaker 1: most essentially, if we acknowledge the need, if we discover

1044
00:59:23,640 --> 00:59:27,680
Speaker 1: that need and then with that clear discovery, find creative

1045
00:59:27,720 --> 00:59:31,000
Speaker 1: ways to meet them, and are always honest about needing

1046
00:59:31,000 --> 00:59:34,080
Speaker 1: to refresh that because some old ways we have may

1047
00:59:34,160 --> 00:59:37,560
Speaker 1: not be discovering or meeting our needs. And that's okay,

1048
00:59:38,000 --> 00:59:41,160
Speaker 1: let's do something different. So you've provoked and inspired. I

1049
00:59:41,200 --> 00:59:44,440
Speaker 1: appreciate you so much, Thank you so much, beautifully summarized.

1050
00:59:44,520 --> 00:59:47,200
Speaker 1: You are a beautiful host and you listen so deeply

1051
00:59:47,680 --> 00:59:50,040
Speaker 1: and I couldn't put it myself, so thank you for

1052
00:59:50,120 --> 00:59:51,880
Speaker 1: having me, and thank you for letting me part of

1053
00:59:51,920 --> 00:59:54,760
Speaker 1: your community. Thank you for being a part of ours,

1054
00:59:54,840 --> 00:59:56,760
Speaker 1: so so much, Thank you so much for having me.

1055
00:59:56,880 --> 01:00:03,080
Speaker 1: Love love, love thy 'all. Priya's instruction to stop and

1056
01:00:03,120 --> 01:00:07,120
Speaker 1: assess the purpose and need of these moments is a powerful,

1057
01:00:07,320 --> 01:00:10,200
Speaker 1: clear takeaway to help us make the time we spend

1058
01:00:10,200 --> 01:00:14,600
Speaker 1: together more meaningful and more relevant. Before this conversation, I'd

1059
01:00:14,640 --> 01:00:17,640
Speaker 1: never thought of the act of gathering as a technology,

1060
01:00:18,280 --> 01:00:23,200
Speaker 1: specifically in the context of morality. When Priya described Trump

1061
01:00:23,280 --> 01:00:27,840
Speaker 1: rallies those gatherings as morally neutral, that was kind of

1062
01:00:27,880 --> 01:00:30,959
Speaker 1: like a record scratch moment. But as someone with so

1063
01:00:31,000 --> 01:00:34,200
Speaker 1: many thoughts and feelings about what technology is and means,

1064
01:00:34,560 --> 01:00:38,479
Speaker 1: it made sense. Gatherings to me, are a real low

1065
01:00:38,560 --> 01:00:42,120
Speaker 1: tech technology. And we often think of technology as a

1066
01:00:42,360 --> 01:00:46,840
Speaker 1: hardware as software, and it can be represented in those modes.

1067
01:00:47,120 --> 01:00:50,840
Speaker 1: But technology is a reproducible practice. It's a way of

1068
01:00:50,880 --> 01:00:55,200
Speaker 1: coordinating our knowledge, and I think gatherings qualify in the

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01:00:55,240 --> 01:00:57,959
Speaker 1: same way that Ruha Benjamin, one of our earlier guests,

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01:00:58,040 --> 01:01:03,000
Speaker 1: talked about social technology. Gatherings are a social technology, and

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01:01:03,080 --> 01:01:05,320
Speaker 1: it's a technology that can help us get things done.

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01:01:05,360 --> 01:01:08,760
Speaker 1: Gatherings can help us see each other, hear new ideas,

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01:01:08,840 --> 01:01:13,520
Speaker 1: reach consensus, can help us citizen or they can help

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01:01:13,600 --> 01:01:18,200
Speaker 1: destroy the fabric of democracy. It all depends on how

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01:01:18,200 --> 01:01:21,600
Speaker 1: we use them, and like with all tech, gatherings need

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01:01:21,680 --> 01:01:24,760
Speaker 1: to be honestly assessed and reimagined when they no longer

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01:01:24,760 --> 01:01:28,520
Speaker 1: serve us. So follow me on this little journey. If

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01:01:28,600 --> 01:01:32,560
Speaker 1: we can get more creative, playful and purposeful and the

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01:01:32,600 --> 01:01:35,880
Speaker 1: ways we bring people together and show up, I think

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01:01:35,920 --> 01:01:38,920
Speaker 1: that can have a bubbling up effect where with time

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01:01:39,480 --> 01:01:42,120
Speaker 1: we can start to embody a different way of being

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01:01:42,120 --> 01:01:45,400
Speaker 1: together in our every day and I think that could

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01:01:45,480 --> 01:01:49,080
Speaker 1: change how we come together on very special days like

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01:01:49,200 --> 01:02:00,120
Speaker 1: election days. Gathering better can help us citizen better. Now

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01:02:00,360 --> 01:02:04,480
Speaker 1: it's time for some actions like we always do. Here

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01:02:04,520 --> 01:02:06,680
Speaker 1: are things you can do to practice what we've been hearing.

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01:02:07,080 --> 01:02:12,440
Speaker 1: We've organized these into three categories. The first category internal reflection,

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01:02:13,080 --> 01:02:16,320
Speaker 1: something you can do inside your own head. I want

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01:02:16,320 --> 01:02:19,440
Speaker 1: you to think about gatherings in your life. Try to

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01:02:19,480 --> 01:02:22,680
Speaker 1: think of a great one where you felt connected, fulfilled,

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01:02:23,000 --> 01:02:26,040
Speaker 1: and a sense of purpose. Now, try to think of

1092
01:02:26,080 --> 01:02:29,160
Speaker 1: a bad one where you felt the opposite of those things.

1093
01:02:29,720 --> 01:02:32,480
Speaker 1: Think about it. There's any gatherings that really surprised you

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01:02:32,640 --> 01:02:36,160
Speaker 1: versus what you expected of them. And as you reflect

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01:02:36,200 --> 01:02:40,760
Speaker 1: on these, can you identify what about the gathering made

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01:02:40,760 --> 01:02:43,440
Speaker 1: you feel the way you do about it now. The

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01:02:43,480 --> 01:02:46,920
Speaker 1: second recommendation is in the category of getting more informed.

1098
01:02:47,800 --> 01:02:51,360
Speaker 1: Check out Preya's conversation with Brene Brown on her Dare

1099
01:02:51,360 --> 01:02:54,160
Speaker 1: to Lead podcast. Will have it linked in the show notes.

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01:02:54,600 --> 01:02:57,240
Speaker 1: They go through an example of prey as gathering Makeover,

1101
01:02:57,600 --> 01:03:01,320
Speaker 1: which is focused on improving a weekly leadership. That may

1102
01:03:01,320 --> 01:03:04,000
Speaker 1: not sound like it has anything to do with practicing democracy,

1103
01:03:04,280 --> 01:03:08,800
Speaker 1: but it's got everything to do with literally practicing democracy.

1104
01:03:09,720 --> 01:03:13,000
Speaker 1: And our final recommendation is an action in the form

1105
01:03:13,080 --> 01:03:16,600
Speaker 1: of public participation. I want you to check out pre

1106
01:03:16,720 --> 01:03:19,560
Speaker 1: as brand new digital course on the art of gathering.

1107
01:03:19,880 --> 01:03:23,240
Speaker 1: It's specifically designed to help you plan an upcoming gathering,

1108
01:03:23,600 --> 01:03:26,520
Speaker 1: whether it's a wedding, a weekly meeting, or something in between.

1109
01:03:27,000 --> 01:03:30,760
Speaker 1: With purpose and with meaning. Head to course dot preaparker

1110
01:03:30,800 --> 01:03:33,960
Speaker 1: dot com and use the code baratun Day for fifteen

1111
01:03:34,000 --> 01:03:37,200
Speaker 1: percent off. I know right, I got a code. It's

1112
01:03:37,280 --> 01:03:47,720
Speaker 1: my name, so cool. If you take any of these actions,

1113
01:03:48,000 --> 01:03:51,439
Speaker 1: please brag about it online and use the hashtag how

1114
01:03:51,480 --> 01:03:55,560
Speaker 1: to Citizen. Also tag our Instagram how to Citizen, or

1115
01:03:55,640 --> 01:04:00,160
Speaker 1: you can email us comments at how to citizen dot com.

1116
01:04:00,200 --> 01:04:02,960
Speaker 1: I am always online and I really do see your messages,

1117
01:04:03,080 --> 01:04:06,040
Speaker 1: so send them. You can also visit our website, howard

1118
01:04:06,080 --> 01:04:08,720
Speaker 1: to citizen dot com, which has all of our shows,

1119
01:04:08,880 --> 01:04:14,000
Speaker 1: full transcripts, actions and more. Finally, see this episode show

1120
01:04:14,040 --> 01:04:19,560
Speaker 1: notes for resources, actions and more ways to connect. How

1121
01:04:19,600 --> 01:04:22,720
Speaker 1: to Citizen with barrettun Day is a production of iHeartRadio

1122
01:04:22,800 --> 01:04:27,040
Speaker 1: Podcasts and row Home Productions. Our executive producers are me

1123
01:04:27,400 --> 01:04:31,600
Speaker 1: barrettun Day, Thurston, and Elizabeth Stewart. Our lead producer is

1124
01:04:31,640 --> 01:04:36,640
Speaker 1: Ali Graham. Our associate producer is Donia Abdelhamide. Alex Lewis

1125
01:04:36,720 --> 01:04:40,280
Speaker 1: is our managing producer, and John Myers is our executive

1126
01:04:40,400 --> 01:04:44,280
Speaker 1: editor and mixed engineer. Original music by Andrew Eapen with

1127
01:04:44,360 --> 01:04:47,920
Speaker 1: additional music by Blue Dot Sessions. Special thanks to Joel

1128
01:04:48,000 --> 01:05:03,560
Speaker 1: Smith from iHeartRadio and lay Labina. Next, on how to Citizen,

1129
01:05:04,080 --> 01:05:06,400
Speaker 1: I think it's important if you're going to be involved

1130
01:05:06,440 --> 01:05:10,000
Speaker 1: in the community and involved in some kind of social

1131
01:05:10,080 --> 01:05:13,680
Speaker 1: change that you're looking for, find a passion, find something

1132
01:05:13,720 --> 01:05:16,760
Speaker 1: that you're particularly interested in, and focus on it and

1133
01:05:16,920 --> 01:05:20,000
Speaker 1: read about it and get to know your subject. For me,

1134
01:05:20,520 --> 01:05:23,440
Speaker 1: that topic is gun violence. I lost my dad to

1135
01:05:23,560 --> 01:05:26,360
Speaker 1: gun violence when I was eighteen years old, and so

1136
01:05:26,600 --> 01:05:31,400
Speaker 1: that issue is my passion. NBA Championship winning coach Steve

1137
01:05:31,480 --> 01:05:34,880
Speaker 1: Kerr talks teamwork and flexing our civic muscles on and

1138
01:05:34,960 --> 01:05:38,040
Speaker 1: off the court with leaders from the world of college athletics.

1139
01:05:38,600 --> 01:05:41,240
Speaker 1: We all belong to a team, so what can we

1140
01:05:41,360 --> 01:05:44,960
Speaker 1: learn from people who practice teamwork as their job. Yes,

1141
01:05:45,080 --> 01:05:47,640
Speaker 1: we're running hard with the sports metaphor, but it works.

1142
01:05:48,080 --> 01:06:01,480
Speaker 1: Find out how on the next episode, Row Home Productions