1 00:00:01,680 --> 00:00:04,680 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. 2 00:00:04,960 --> 00:00:08,200 Speaker 2: Catch us live weekdays at noon Eastern on Applecarplay and 3 00:00:08,200 --> 00:00:11,399 Speaker 2: then Brounoo with the Bloomberg Business App. Listen on demand 4 00:00:11,440 --> 00:00:17,280 Speaker 2: wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube. 5 00:00:17,600 --> 00:00:19,920 Speaker 3: Welcome to the Wednesday edition of Balance of Power here 6 00:00:19,960 --> 00:00:23,360 Speaker 3: on Bloomberg Radio, on the satellite, and on YouTube. If 7 00:00:23,360 --> 00:00:25,880 Speaker 3: you want to find us on YouTube, search Bloomberg Global News. 8 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:29,040 Speaker 3: The live stream is underway right now. The cameras are lit, 9 00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:32,239 Speaker 3: and we'd love to meet you in the studio as 10 00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:35,639 Speaker 3: we have a little story time today, story Time from Washington, 11 00:00:35,840 --> 00:00:39,240 Speaker 3: another late night on Capitol Hill. And in this story book, 12 00:00:40,080 --> 00:00:42,080 Speaker 3: this is like a scene at a house of cards. 13 00:00:42,479 --> 00:00:44,640 Speaker 3: The headline on the terminal from our own Billy House 14 00:00:44,680 --> 00:00:48,280 Speaker 3: Congressman left hospital bed to head off majorcis impeachment. 15 00:00:49,159 --> 00:00:50,400 Speaker 1: Imagine the optics here. 16 00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:54,320 Speaker 3: This is the impeachment, of course of Alejandro Majorcis, the 17 00:00:54,360 --> 00:00:57,240 Speaker 3: Secretary of Homeland Defense, said to be a done deal, 18 00:00:57,560 --> 00:01:00,600 Speaker 3: speaker Johnson speaking confidently throughout the day, even oh, apparently 19 00:01:01,200 --> 00:01:04,080 Speaker 3: they didn't do a lot of whipping on this because 20 00:01:04,160 --> 00:01:08,080 Speaker 3: it did not pass in great drama in the process, 21 00:01:08,920 --> 00:01:11,919 Speaker 3: as they read here on the terminal from Billy Green, 22 00:01:12,400 --> 00:01:16,080 Speaker 3: a Texas Democrat, had been recovering from emergency surgery, entered 23 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:19,200 Speaker 3: the House chamber in a wheelchair. Imagine the doors bursting open, 24 00:01:20,080 --> 00:01:24,479 Speaker 3: wearing scrubs. Just as it looked like Republican Speaker Johnson 25 00:01:24,520 --> 00:01:27,000 Speaker 3: had barely enough votes to get the two articles of 26 00:01:27,040 --> 00:01:30,360 Speaker 3: impeachment approve that brought us to a tie two fifteen 27 00:01:30,400 --> 00:01:34,400 Speaker 3: two fifteen. Republicans then were forced to flip one vote 28 00:01:35,240 --> 00:01:38,600 Speaker 3: so it would fail, allowing them to come back another 29 00:01:38,680 --> 00:01:42,040 Speaker 3: day with the motion to consider to reconsider, I should say, 30 00:01:42,480 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 3: and the Speaker this morning said they will do this 31 00:01:44,600 --> 00:01:48,640 Speaker 3: and it will pass on the next round. We'll see 32 00:01:48,640 --> 00:01:50,480 Speaker 3: if Al Green will be at that vote. He's with 33 00:01:50,600 --> 00:01:53,560 Speaker 3: us right now by telephone from his hospital bed, the 34 00:01:53,600 --> 00:01:58,240 Speaker 3: congressman from Texas ninth District. Congressman Green, I hope you're 35 00:01:58,240 --> 00:02:00,440 Speaker 3: feeling well, and I appreciate your joining us today. I 36 00:02:00,440 --> 00:02:02,520 Speaker 3: guess you were well enough to leave your bed last night. 37 00:02:02,920 --> 00:02:04,520 Speaker 3: Did you know at the time that you were going 38 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:05,680 Speaker 3: to be the deciding vote? 39 00:02:07,360 --> 00:02:11,160 Speaker 4: Well, hello, mister Matthew, thank you for being so kind 40 00:02:11,320 --> 00:02:16,239 Speaker 4: with your intro. I did not know. I quite candidly 41 00:02:16,240 --> 00:02:20,640 Speaker 4: thought that the vote would pass, but I knew that 42 00:02:20,760 --> 00:02:23,880 Speaker 4: I had to do my job. I knew that I 43 00:02:23,919 --> 00:02:27,600 Speaker 4: wanted my vote to be counted because I know Secretary 44 00:02:27,639 --> 00:02:30,799 Speaker 4: of Majorcus. I know the good things that he's done. 45 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:33,560 Speaker 4: I had an experience with him that I'll recount for 46 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:37,239 Speaker 4: you quickly. I had a young man, very young, who 47 00:02:37,320 --> 00:02:41,000 Speaker 4: was a patient at Texas Children's Hospital. The hospital called 48 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:43,840 Speaker 4: my office and said, this young man has been picked 49 00:02:43,919 --> 00:02:47,120 Speaker 4: up along the border with his mother. They were both undocumented. 50 00:02:47,160 --> 00:02:50,680 Speaker 4: He came out of his own volition and they placed 51 00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:54,320 Speaker 4: him in a place where he had no support system. 52 00:02:55,040 --> 00:02:58,640 Speaker 4: And this child was a dialysis patient and he needed 53 00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:04,240 Speaker 4: to get back. So we contacted the Secretary's office and 54 00:03:04,320 --> 00:03:07,760 Speaker 4: he made it possible through what's called parole, for this 55 00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:12,839 Speaker 4: child's life to be spared. I've sincerely believed this. When 56 00:03:12,840 --> 00:03:16,560 Speaker 4: we arrived there, there was a team of doctors waiting 57 00:03:16,639 --> 00:03:19,239 Speaker 4: it was around two am in the morning to take 58 00:03:19,280 --> 00:03:23,520 Speaker 4: this child in. This parole has worked to save lives. 59 00:03:23,919 --> 00:03:27,440 Speaker 4: It's not just an open gate for people to walk through. 60 00:03:28,280 --> 00:03:33,680 Speaker 4: Secretary in Mayocas is a responsible person. He's not a rootless, reckless, 61 00:03:34,520 --> 00:03:39,000 Speaker 4: lawless demagogue. He's a responsible person who tries to treat 62 00:03:39,320 --> 00:03:42,600 Speaker 4: people fairly, so thank you well. 63 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:45,600 Speaker 3: Certainly your Republican colleagues think he's a big part of 64 00:03:45,640 --> 00:03:49,000 Speaker 3: the problem, while Democrats say he's simply carrying out the 65 00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:52,880 Speaker 3: policies of Joe Biden. You've been working in Congress for 66 00:03:52,920 --> 00:03:55,600 Speaker 3: a couple of minutes, Representative, what do you make of 67 00:03:55,640 --> 00:03:58,280 Speaker 3: the current state of affairs here with this Republican conference? 68 00:03:58,640 --> 00:04:00,840 Speaker 3: You got pretty used to Nancy p l never bringing 69 00:04:00,840 --> 00:04:02,800 Speaker 3: a bill to the floor, as they say, without knowing 70 00:04:02,840 --> 00:04:05,360 Speaker 3: it would pass. What we saw last night was the 71 00:04:05,400 --> 00:04:06,920 Speaker 3: definition of chaos. 72 00:04:06,520 --> 00:04:06,880 Speaker 5: Wasn't it. 73 00:04:08,520 --> 00:04:13,040 Speaker 4: Well, you're right, imminently correct to Speaker Pelosi had a 74 00:04:13,120 --> 00:04:16,200 Speaker 4: ducts in a role as they say, all in order. 75 00:04:16,920 --> 00:04:19,960 Speaker 4: I am amazed that it did not pass. To be 76 00:04:20,040 --> 00:04:23,560 Speaker 4: quite candid, I thought that it would. So I can 77 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:29,360 Speaker 4: only say that this is a time of giving people, 78 00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:34,080 Speaker 4: as suppose, the opportunity to understand that this business sometimes 79 00:04:34,080 --> 00:04:37,960 Speaker 4: requires that you have to negotiate as opposed to require 80 00:04:38,080 --> 00:04:44,000 Speaker 4: persons to capitulate. We've entered an era wherein dictation as 81 00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:49,080 Speaker 4: opposed to negotiation is the order of the day, it seems, 82 00:04:49,640 --> 00:04:51,440 Speaker 4: and this is not going to work. It's not going 83 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:54,960 Speaker 4: to work for Democrats. Andy won't work for Republicans. We 84 00:04:55,400 --> 00:04:58,400 Speaker 4: are going to have to work together on many of 85 00:04:58,440 --> 00:05:01,719 Speaker 4: these issues, the big ones get them done. They have 86 00:05:01,839 --> 00:05:05,920 Speaker 4: to be issues that we care about enough to make concessions. 87 00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:11,479 Speaker 4: On an issue of paramountic coursing in the Senate, our 88 00:05:11,520 --> 00:05:17,040 Speaker 4: colleagues in the Senate, Republican colleagues demanded certain things. There 89 00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:21,560 Speaker 4: was literally capitulation. When they got what they wanted, they 90 00:05:21,760 --> 00:05:25,039 Speaker 4: retennicked on their own deal, the deal that they brought 91 00:05:25,080 --> 00:05:28,480 Speaker 4: to the table. They have now decided it's not worth 92 00:05:28,520 --> 00:05:31,600 Speaker 4: voting off. At some point, we have to realize that 93 00:05:31,640 --> 00:05:36,000 Speaker 4: for some, not all, but for some people, the crisis 94 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:39,920 Speaker 4: at the border is a great political tool for the 95 00:05:40,080 --> 00:05:43,200 Speaker 4: upcoming election. Unfortunate but true. 96 00:05:43,880 --> 00:05:46,560 Speaker 3: I have to ask you, Congressman, what you see going 97 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:49,159 Speaker 3: forward here, because it does appear, according to the Speaker, 98 00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:52,000 Speaker 3: there will be another round to impeach Alejandro Majorcis. He 99 00:05:52,000 --> 00:05:56,120 Speaker 3: says it will pass. We also know that the Senate's 100 00:05:56,160 --> 00:06:00,400 Speaker 3: working up a standalone bill on Ukraine, Israel, Taiwan doesn't 101 00:06:00,400 --> 00:06:03,119 Speaker 3: have the border, and I wonder if you see either, 102 00:06:03,160 --> 00:06:05,520 Speaker 3: if not both, of those passing in the House. 103 00:06:08,160 --> 00:06:15,479 Speaker 4: My belief is that mister Majorkus will be impeached. That's 104 00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:18,039 Speaker 4: not my desire, and I will do all that I 105 00:06:18,080 --> 00:06:21,159 Speaker 4: can to prevent it. But the numbers are there, if 106 00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:26,040 Speaker 4: they're all aligned properly. With reference to the bill that 107 00:06:26,440 --> 00:06:32,080 Speaker 4: might come our way that deals with Taiwan, hopefully and 108 00:06:32,279 --> 00:06:38,560 Speaker 4: some other aid for the Palestinians, I would hope that 109 00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:42,920 Speaker 4: Israel would be in there, of course, and of course Ukraine. 110 00:06:43,480 --> 00:06:48,440 Speaker 4: Those are important issues. I'm very much concerned about all 111 00:06:48,480 --> 00:06:50,919 Speaker 4: of them. But I will be very candid with you, 112 00:06:50,960 --> 00:06:56,720 Speaker 4: dear Sir. I have great, great concern for what's happening 113 00:06:57,200 --> 00:07:05,640 Speaker 4: in Gaza. People living almost in condition conditions unfit for animals, 114 00:07:06,279 --> 00:07:09,960 Speaker 4: and we're not doing enough to circumvent the killing of 115 00:07:10,120 --> 00:07:16,320 Speaker 4: innocent babies. You can, in the name of justice, create 116 00:07:16,440 --> 00:07:20,160 Speaker 4: an injustice, it won't make it justice because you did 117 00:07:20,160 --> 00:07:23,160 Speaker 4: it in the name of justice. So I'm concerned and 118 00:07:23,160 --> 00:07:28,000 Speaker 4: to make sure that we have meaningful help for those babies, 119 00:07:28,440 --> 00:07:34,440 Speaker 4: those people who've had their schools demolished, infrastructure destroyed, homes obliterated. 120 00:07:35,040 --> 00:07:37,360 Speaker 4: I want to see justice for them. 121 00:07:37,760 --> 00:07:41,880 Speaker 3: Did you vote for that Israel funding bill last evening, Congressman. 122 00:07:43,160 --> 00:07:47,240 Speaker 4: That I got there so that I could cast one 123 00:07:47,320 --> 00:07:50,440 Speaker 4: vote at the end and another vote at the beginning, 124 00:07:50,840 --> 00:07:54,160 Speaker 4: and I left. But I voted against the bill because 125 00:07:54,160 --> 00:07:57,760 Speaker 4: there's nothing in there for the Palestinians, the people who 126 00:07:57,800 --> 00:08:02,240 Speaker 4: are suffering too what Hamas it is deplorable, horrible, and 127 00:08:02,440 --> 00:08:05,760 Speaker 4: I would never associate myself with them. I've signed on 128 00:08:05,800 --> 00:08:10,800 Speaker 4: the resolutions of denouncing Hamas, demanding the return of people 129 00:08:10,800 --> 00:08:13,200 Speaker 4: who have been taken as captives, and I'm going to 130 00:08:13,320 --> 00:08:15,520 Speaker 4: stand by that to the ends of the earth, until 131 00:08:15,560 --> 00:08:19,880 Speaker 4: my last breath. But I also know this. I can't 132 00:08:20,160 --> 00:08:24,440 Speaker 4: condemn the killing of Israeli babies and then condone the 133 00:08:24,520 --> 00:08:28,680 Speaker 4: killing of Palestinian babies. I can't do that. Now, there 134 00:08:28,680 --> 00:08:32,040 Speaker 4: are some who do it, I don't. I'm not casting 135 00:08:32,120 --> 00:08:34,880 Speaker 4: expersions on them. I'm saying to you that, as a 136 00:08:34,880 --> 00:08:39,520 Speaker 4: matter of conscience and as a moral imperative, I've got 137 00:08:39,520 --> 00:08:43,000 Speaker 4: to see something for those people. Because I voted for 138 00:08:43,000 --> 00:08:46,760 Speaker 4: over fifty billion dollars in aid to Israel since I've 139 00:08:46,760 --> 00:08:50,680 Speaker 4: been in Congress, and I don't regret my votes. But 140 00:08:50,760 --> 00:08:54,480 Speaker 4: here's what I do regret. I regret that the bombs 141 00:08:54,480 --> 00:08:58,720 Speaker 4: that have been used, some of that artillery, those munitions, 142 00:08:59,240 --> 00:09:05,840 Speaker 4: they were used because we provided funding to the Israelis, 143 00:09:06,040 --> 00:09:09,000 Speaker 4: and they have taken that and I don't think it 144 00:09:09,080 --> 00:09:13,040 Speaker 4: was used judiciously. So I'm concerned about those babies. 145 00:09:13,480 --> 00:09:15,120 Speaker 3: Well, it does appear we're going to be providing quite 146 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:17,960 Speaker 3: a bit more. Congressman Al Green is joining us live 147 00:09:18,000 --> 00:09:21,640 Speaker 3: from his hospital bed right now, after making that surprise 148 00:09:21,679 --> 00:09:25,239 Speaker 3: appearance last evening during the impeachment vote in the House. Congressman, 149 00:09:26,160 --> 00:09:29,680 Speaker 3: I'm wondering before you leave us if your doctors okayed that, 150 00:09:29,760 --> 00:09:31,200 Speaker 3: if they thought it was a good idea for you 151 00:09:31,240 --> 00:09:34,319 Speaker 3: to leave, because you know, Republicans like Marjorie Taylor Green 152 00:09:34,360 --> 00:09:37,280 Speaker 3: are claiming that they were hiding you and that the 153 00:09:37,400 --> 00:09:39,320 Speaker 3: Democrats somehow pulled a fast one at. 154 00:09:39,240 --> 00:09:39,880 Speaker 1: The last minute. 155 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:45,720 Speaker 4: Thank you for addressing the issue. There was no trickery involved. 156 00:09:46,400 --> 00:09:49,560 Speaker 4: I spoke to my physicians here when I saw on 157 00:09:49,640 --> 00:09:52,360 Speaker 4: television I'm lying here in the hospital bed and I 158 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:54,720 Speaker 4: see that they're going to bring up this vote. So 159 00:09:54,840 --> 00:09:57,360 Speaker 4: I talked to the staff here at the hospital. I 160 00:09:57,480 --> 00:10:01,080 Speaker 4: talked to the physicians, my search team. I talked to 161 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:04,800 Speaker 4: the administration, and I had to negotiate with them. I 162 00:10:04,800 --> 00:10:08,559 Speaker 4: had to sign a document explaining to me the possible 163 00:10:09,040 --> 00:10:13,640 Speaker 4: harm that could befall me. I did it, and I 164 00:10:13,679 --> 00:10:16,920 Speaker 4: called Speaker Jeffreys. Yes, they were reluctant to do it. 165 00:10:16,960 --> 00:10:19,320 Speaker 4: I would be candidates because they were concerned about me, 166 00:10:19,559 --> 00:10:22,120 Speaker 4: and I loved them for being concerned. But I had 167 00:10:22,120 --> 00:10:24,839 Speaker 4: to cast this vote. This is my job. So I 168 00:10:24,920 --> 00:10:29,080 Speaker 4: talked to Speaker Jeffreys. I called him and I explained 169 00:10:29,080 --> 00:10:31,360 Speaker 4: to him that I was about to take an uber. 170 00:10:31,840 --> 00:10:34,000 Speaker 4: My staff was trying to get an uber so that 171 00:10:34,080 --> 00:10:37,559 Speaker 4: I could get to the Capitol. And he's first of all, 172 00:10:37,640 --> 00:10:40,360 Speaker 4: said all your health is the first thing that you 173 00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:43,040 Speaker 4: have to consider. And after I convinced him that I 174 00:10:43,080 --> 00:10:46,559 Speaker 4: was going to come, he said, well, look we'll provide transportation. 175 00:10:47,160 --> 00:10:49,600 Speaker 4: And that's the extent of his involvement. He did not 176 00:10:49,720 --> 00:10:52,880 Speaker 4: demand that I come. He did not request did I come. 177 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:56,000 Speaker 4: He did not be seechd, he didn't pull. He said, 178 00:10:56,360 --> 00:10:59,280 Speaker 4: if you're coming, we'll give you transportation. I guess as 179 00:10:59,280 --> 00:11:02,440 Speaker 4: a leader embarrassed one of his members coming from a 180 00:11:02,440 --> 00:11:05,400 Speaker 4: hospital and an uber to vote. So when I get there, 181 00:11:05,960 --> 00:11:10,600 Speaker 4: I go into the attending physicians area and they had 182 00:11:10,600 --> 00:11:13,120 Speaker 4: a bed for me. So I went to bed. I 183 00:11:13,200 --> 00:11:16,120 Speaker 4: was reclined. I was in bed and they had checking 184 00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:20,319 Speaker 4: my heart. They were checking my my pulse rates as 185 00:11:20,360 --> 00:11:23,560 Speaker 4: you will, checking to make sure my blood pressure was 186 00:11:23,600 --> 00:11:26,520 Speaker 4: in order. I had two nurses attending me while I 187 00:11:26,640 --> 00:11:30,400 Speaker 4: was there, and I was waiting on the My Yorkers vote, 188 00:11:30,520 --> 00:11:33,200 Speaker 4: and I'm sorry if they were thrown off because I 189 00:11:33,200 --> 00:11:35,600 Speaker 4: didn't come up for another vote. But I didn't come 190 00:11:35,640 --> 00:11:38,040 Speaker 4: for that vote, and I didn't want to make a 191 00:11:38,080 --> 00:11:41,600 Speaker 4: spectacle by going out there and sitting in a wheelchair 192 00:11:42,000 --> 00:11:43,880 Speaker 4: in the midst of all of those people who were 193 00:11:43,880 --> 00:11:49,840 Speaker 4: gathered and having it become more about mine sitting there 194 00:11:49,880 --> 00:11:52,520 Speaker 4: in a wheelchair than the purpose for my being there. 195 00:11:53,000 --> 00:11:55,680 Speaker 4: So when I got there, they pushed me in. I 196 00:11:55,840 --> 00:11:59,040 Speaker 4: took my card and I put my card in that 197 00:11:59,240 --> 00:12:02,360 Speaker 4: terminal my self. There are people who are saying that 198 00:12:02,440 --> 00:12:05,720 Speaker 4: I didn't really vote. I did. I put the card 199 00:12:05,760 --> 00:12:09,360 Speaker 4: in the terminal and I voted. And after I voted, 200 00:12:09,960 --> 00:12:12,319 Speaker 4: David Scott, who was seated right near me, said, al, 201 00:12:13,040 --> 00:12:17,560 Speaker 4: you just tied the vote. They can't impeach him. I didn't. 202 00:12:17,800 --> 00:12:19,680 Speaker 4: I had no idea when I put the card in 203 00:12:19,720 --> 00:12:23,760 Speaker 4: that that would happen. And after that was said to me, 204 00:12:24,640 --> 00:12:28,199 Speaker 4: I was waiting on the next vote I voted, which 205 00:12:28,240 --> 00:12:30,480 Speaker 4: had happened right after it not right because they were 206 00:12:30,520 --> 00:12:33,320 Speaker 4: looking for me or something, I'm told. So I put 207 00:12:33,360 --> 00:12:36,679 Speaker 4: the card in, I voted the second time, and I left. 208 00:12:37,240 --> 00:12:41,080 Speaker 4: But I was not pulled to the hill. I didn't 209 00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:44,800 Speaker 4: have a leadership demanding that I come. In fact, I 210 00:12:44,840 --> 00:12:48,400 Speaker 4: saw Speaker Pelosi. She will always be Speaker Pelosi to me. 211 00:12:49,000 --> 00:12:51,320 Speaker 4: I saw Speaker Pelosi as I was going into the 212 00:12:51,360 --> 00:12:55,560 Speaker 4: attended physician's office, Doctor Monaghan. He arranged for me to 213 00:12:55,600 --> 00:12:58,040 Speaker 4: have it. This was a part of my deal so 214 00:12:58,160 --> 00:13:00,679 Speaker 4: that I could get to the hill. Was taken care 215 00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:05,440 Speaker 4: of there with great professional hands, and was taken care 216 00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:09,000 Speaker 4: of here, And it was all done to get me 217 00:13:09,160 --> 00:13:13,600 Speaker 4: there to cast my vote. And here's why, because I 218 00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:21,280 Speaker 4: know this secretary baby at Texas Children's Hospital that needed help. 219 00:13:21,840 --> 00:13:24,880 Speaker 4: The hospital got in touch with me and said this 220 00:13:25,080 --> 00:13:28,480 Speaker 4: child had been taken across the border, he was not 221 00:13:28,559 --> 00:13:32,560 Speaker 4: a citizen in an area with his mom where he 222 00:13:32,600 --> 00:13:35,559 Speaker 4: had no support system, and they needed to have him 223 00:13:35,600 --> 00:13:39,640 Speaker 4: back because he was a dialysis patient. I contacted his secretary. 224 00:13:40,679 --> 00:13:43,920 Speaker 4: This process of parole is what got that child back 225 00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:44,920 Speaker 4: and saved his life. 226 00:13:44,960 --> 00:13:47,240 Speaker 6: In my opinion, yeah, I understand. 227 00:13:47,880 --> 00:13:51,359 Speaker 4: And for people to say that parole is being abused, 228 00:13:51,800 --> 00:13:54,280 Speaker 4: and it's just not a keat to let the world in. 229 00:13:54,880 --> 00:13:57,880 Speaker 4: It's a need by which people who genuinely need some 230 00:13:57,960 --> 00:13:58,719 Speaker 4: help can get it. 231 00:13:59,080 --> 00:14:01,880 Speaker 3: And look like the President's going to still have that 232 00:14:01,960 --> 00:14:06,040 Speaker 3: authority unless something very important here changes. Congressman, We've got 233 00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:09,040 Speaker 3: the rules that we have on the books. We only 234 00:14:09,080 --> 00:14:11,360 Speaker 3: have a minute left. Al Green, do you know when 235 00:14:11,360 --> 00:14:12,920 Speaker 3: you're going to be released from the hospital? 236 00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:13,520 Speaker 1: Just quickly. 237 00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:16,320 Speaker 4: I do not know when I be released. I'm in 238 00:14:16,400 --> 00:14:20,240 Speaker 4: great hands. These are professionals, and when they say I 239 00:14:20,280 --> 00:14:22,680 Speaker 4: can go, howie, well. 240 00:14:22,680 --> 00:14:25,880 Speaker 3: I appreciate your joining us from the hospital bed, my goodness, 241 00:14:25,880 --> 00:14:28,600 Speaker 3: and I hope that your recovery continues successfully as al 242 00:14:28,640 --> 00:14:33,240 Speaker 3: Green is treated for emergency surgery, recovering, i should say, 243 00:14:33,240 --> 00:14:37,160 Speaker 3: from emergency surgery. Leaving his bed last night to cast 244 00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:39,760 Speaker 3: what turned out to be the deciding vote in the 245 00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:45,040 Speaker 3: at least first impeachment vote for Alejandro Majorcis, the speaker 246 00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:46,960 Speaker 3: says there will be another and it will pass. Al 247 00:14:47,000 --> 00:14:47,960 Speaker 3: Greene agreed with that. 248 00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:54,520 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast Ken 249 00:14:54,720 --> 00:14:58,080 Speaker 1: Just Live weekdays at noon Eastern on Apocarplay and nroyd 250 00:14:58,080 --> 00:14:59,640 Speaker 1: Oo with the Bloomberg. 251 00:14:59,160 --> 00:15:02,360 Speaker 5: Business and you can also listen live on Amazon Alexa 252 00:15:02,440 --> 00:15:05,720 Speaker 5: from our flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play 253 00:15:05,800 --> 00:15:08,440 Speaker 5: Bloomberg eleven thirty. 254 00:15:09,280 --> 00:15:11,880 Speaker 3: It's the moment of truth for the Border Deal. Welcome 255 00:15:11,920 --> 00:15:14,560 Speaker 3: to the fastest show in politics, as the Senate prepares 256 00:15:14,600 --> 00:15:16,920 Speaker 3: to vote now on a deal said to be dead 257 00:15:16,960 --> 00:15:21,280 Speaker 3: on arrival in both chambers with funding for Ukraine and 258 00:15:21,440 --> 00:15:23,520 Speaker 3: Israel attached. We're going to have a live report from 259 00:15:23,520 --> 00:15:26,360 Speaker 3: Capitol Hill in just a moment, as Kaylee Lions joins 260 00:15:26,440 --> 00:15:29,920 Speaker 3: us live from Washington here on Bloomberg TV and Radio Kailey, 261 00:15:30,000 --> 00:15:32,360 Speaker 3: this is going to be an interesting exercise, yeah, because 262 00:15:32,360 --> 00:15:34,600 Speaker 3: we seem to know that this vote is going to fail, 263 00:15:35,080 --> 00:15:38,520 Speaker 3: but there will be a second vote that could pass potentially. 264 00:15:38,560 --> 00:15:41,000 Speaker 7: The second vote, of course, would not include anything related 265 00:15:41,040 --> 00:15:43,760 Speaker 7: to border security, despite what we had heard for months 266 00:15:43,960 --> 00:15:46,240 Speaker 7: was a demand from Republicans in the Senate that border 267 00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:49,320 Speaker 7: security be included to pass anything for Israel and Ukraine. 268 00:15:49,360 --> 00:15:51,640 Speaker 7: It might turn out that Israel and Ukraine A does 269 00:15:51,640 --> 00:15:54,960 Speaker 7: indeed pass, along with some other supplemental funding requests that 270 00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:58,080 Speaker 7: have been made, and border security goes nowhere. 271 00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:00,400 Speaker 3: So it's pretty amazing to think after all all that, 272 00:16:00,920 --> 00:16:04,440 Speaker 3: the teeth gnashing, the handwringing, the endless debating, the behind 273 00:16:04,480 --> 00:16:07,960 Speaker 3: closed doors conversations, the name calling. They could have just 274 00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:10,000 Speaker 3: passed Ukraine funding from the start. 275 00:16:10,320 --> 00:16:12,800 Speaker 7: Yeah, but even if it passes in the Senate, has 276 00:16:12,840 --> 00:16:14,480 Speaker 7: anything actually changed in. 277 00:16:14,480 --> 00:16:16,280 Speaker 6: The House where great question. 278 00:16:16,360 --> 00:16:19,480 Speaker 7: It was pretty clear very early on that if Speaker 279 00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:22,160 Speaker 7: Mike Johnson put something with Ukraine eate on the floor, 280 00:16:22,200 --> 00:16:24,520 Speaker 7: then he might not be Speaker Mike Johnson for much longer. 281 00:16:24,560 --> 00:16:25,000 Speaker 5: That's right. 282 00:16:25,760 --> 00:16:27,720 Speaker 3: He did say today though, speaking with reporters, that he 283 00:16:27,760 --> 00:16:30,440 Speaker 3: was going to wait to see what the Senate sent over. Yeah, 284 00:16:30,520 --> 00:16:33,440 Speaker 3: so you're saying there's a chance. Let's bring in Jonathan 285 00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:36,520 Speaker 3: Samari Bloomberg, Government reporting live from Capitol Hill right now. 286 00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:39,640 Speaker 3: He's in the Russell at Rotunda where things are buzzing 287 00:16:39,680 --> 00:16:42,600 Speaker 3: with a lot of uncertainty today. Jonathan, thanks for joining 288 00:16:42,680 --> 00:16:45,120 Speaker 3: us here. When do we get this vote? How do 289 00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:46,480 Speaker 3: you think it plays out in the Senate? 290 00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:49,400 Speaker 8: So it could be within the next few hours here, 291 00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:52,080 Speaker 8: they're supposed to start right about now. In fact, this 292 00:16:52,240 --> 00:16:55,960 Speaker 8: first vote on the compromise that used you just described 293 00:16:56,000 --> 00:16:59,320 Speaker 8: the compromise that's going nowhere, the combination of border security 294 00:16:59,680 --> 00:17:03,120 Speaker 8: and foreign aid that is we know is going to fail. 295 00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:06,360 Speaker 8: And pretty soon after that, Chuck Schumer wants to move 296 00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:09,320 Speaker 8: to a foreign aid only package, and that's kind of 297 00:17:09,320 --> 00:17:12,159 Speaker 8: where the big question is, can that pass? It seems 298 00:17:12,200 --> 00:17:14,800 Speaker 8: like there's enough Republican support for it. I think a 299 00:17:14,840 --> 00:17:17,560 Speaker 8: big question will be how much support and how big 300 00:17:17,680 --> 00:17:19,880 Speaker 8: if it does advance. Obviously this is just the first 301 00:17:19,880 --> 00:17:23,000 Speaker 8: procedural step. But if it advances, how big a vote 302 00:17:23,000 --> 00:17:24,719 Speaker 8: is there for that? And does that send a signal 303 00:17:24,720 --> 00:17:26,960 Speaker 8: of the level of support over to the House. 304 00:17:29,240 --> 00:17:32,119 Speaker 7: Well, yeah, it becomes a question now of what House 305 00:17:32,240 --> 00:17:35,600 Speaker 7: leadership is potentially going to do. But it feels like 306 00:17:35,680 --> 00:17:38,119 Speaker 7: we're having leadership questions not just in the House, but 307 00:17:38,200 --> 00:17:40,720 Speaker 7: in the Senate as well. What is the buzz on 308 00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:46,200 Speaker 7: Capitol Hill this morning about Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell Jonathan, Yeah. 309 00:17:46,240 --> 00:17:48,320 Speaker 8: I mean, there's a lot of questions about his grip 310 00:17:48,440 --> 00:17:51,720 Speaker 8: on power in the Republican conference, and that's not something 311 00:17:51,760 --> 00:17:56,040 Speaker 8: that's been said very often about Mitch McConnell. But he 312 00:17:56,160 --> 00:17:59,800 Speaker 8: has been a staunch advocate for supporting Ukraine first on 313 00:17:59,840 --> 00:18:03,280 Speaker 8: its own, then as part of a border package, and 314 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:06,320 Speaker 8: both of those ideas have been blocked by his conference, 315 00:18:06,359 --> 00:18:08,480 Speaker 8: and so there is a question of how much he 316 00:18:08,600 --> 00:18:11,919 Speaker 8: can steer it. And it's just one sign of how 317 00:18:12,000 --> 00:18:14,600 Speaker 8: much the Republican Party has shifted away from kind of 318 00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:17,240 Speaker 8: the old guard, from Mitch McConnell, from the Wall Street 319 00:18:17,280 --> 00:18:19,800 Speaker 8: Journal editorial board, from the Chamber of Commerce, all of 320 00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:24,639 Speaker 8: whom supported this compromise, towards Donald Trump, who opposed it, 321 00:18:24,680 --> 00:18:27,879 Speaker 8: and who managed to sway a significant number of Republican 322 00:18:27,920 --> 00:18:30,280 Speaker 8: Senators to side with him. 323 00:18:31,119 --> 00:18:35,560 Speaker 3: Pretty amazing stuff here. If indeed this standalone bill passes 324 00:18:36,160 --> 00:18:38,880 Speaker 3: the Senate, will it truly be entertained in the House, Jonathan, 325 00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:40,480 Speaker 3: or is it just too early to tell? I know 326 00:18:40,520 --> 00:18:42,800 Speaker 3: this idea emerged a short time ago. The White House 327 00:18:42,840 --> 00:18:45,800 Speaker 3: says that it's behind this, but it's going to be 328 00:18:45,840 --> 00:18:46,960 Speaker 3: up to the speaker, right. 329 00:18:47,640 --> 00:18:50,320 Speaker 8: It is, And to be clear that they can't pass 330 00:18:50,400 --> 00:18:53,040 Speaker 8: the bill today, they can start the procedure to pass it. 331 00:18:53,280 --> 00:18:54,960 Speaker 8: Republicans are going to want to have a chance to 332 00:18:55,040 --> 00:18:58,119 Speaker 8: vote on some amendments if it does eventually pass. I 333 00:18:58,119 --> 00:19:00,639 Speaker 8: think the big question is what Speaker Johnson does. He 334 00:19:00,760 --> 00:19:04,600 Speaker 8: has been steered significantly by the right wing of his party, 335 00:19:04,640 --> 00:19:07,560 Speaker 8: which is very skeptical of Ukraine AID. He has said 336 00:19:07,560 --> 00:19:09,800 Speaker 8: that he thinks it's important to support Ukraine, but he 337 00:19:09,840 --> 00:19:12,920 Speaker 8: has voted against AID in the past. So I think 338 00:19:13,000 --> 00:19:15,200 Speaker 8: it's a big mystery as to what he will do. 339 00:19:15,640 --> 00:19:18,000 Speaker 8: And I think even if this bill does pass the Senate, 340 00:19:18,040 --> 00:19:20,720 Speaker 8: we'll all be waiting to see what Donald Trump says, 341 00:19:20,760 --> 00:19:24,040 Speaker 8: because that seems to have significant way with Republicans here 342 00:19:24,040 --> 00:19:24,840 Speaker 8: on Capitol Hill. 343 00:19:26,480 --> 00:19:29,080 Speaker 7: Yeah, and certainly President Biden made many attempts to call 344 00:19:29,080 --> 00:19:31,520 Speaker 7: attention to his belief that Trump is the one calling 345 00:19:31,520 --> 00:19:33,840 Speaker 7: the shots here when he spoke from the White House 346 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:37,280 Speaker 7: yesterday in regard to what happens in the House going 347 00:19:37,320 --> 00:19:41,359 Speaker 7: forward from here. We have a lot of questions about 348 00:19:41,359 --> 00:19:45,000 Speaker 7: Speaker Johnson. But as Joe was just talking to our 349 00:19:45,080 --> 00:19:48,280 Speaker 7: political panel, Rick Davis and Jeanie Shanzano about this, where 350 00:19:48,359 --> 00:19:51,359 Speaker 7: is Tom Emler in this? Jonathan, he is the whip. 351 00:19:51,520 --> 00:19:53,560 Speaker 7: Isn't it his job to be counting the votes and 352 00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:55,960 Speaker 7: make sure things like yesterday the failure of an impeachment 353 00:19:56,040 --> 00:19:59,600 Speaker 7: vote for Alejandra maiorcis the Homeland Security Secretary, the failure 354 00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:02,760 Speaker 7: of the stand the lone Israel package doesn't happen. 355 00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:06,359 Speaker 8: Yeah, it is his job, and there's certainly some criticism 356 00:20:06,359 --> 00:20:09,280 Speaker 8: that's going from behind the scenes to some people actually 357 00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:11,520 Speaker 8: putting their names on it and being critical of the 358 00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:13,880 Speaker 8: job he has done. And obviously he's got a very 359 00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:17,800 Speaker 8: difficult job with such a closely divided conference. But these 360 00:20:17,800 --> 00:20:19,920 Speaker 8: are the kind of things that the House puts up 361 00:20:20,200 --> 00:20:22,720 Speaker 8: as a political message, as a message of what they're 362 00:20:22,760 --> 00:20:25,159 Speaker 8: trying to do as a counterweight to the Senate, and 363 00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:27,560 Speaker 8: when they can't get those things through the House, they 364 00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:29,879 Speaker 8: basically undercut all of their own leverage. And it is 365 00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:33,160 Speaker 8: a hugely embarrassing moment to fail on something that's supposed 366 00:20:33,200 --> 00:20:34,159 Speaker 8: to unite your party. 367 00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:38,800 Speaker 7: All right, Jonathan Tomari of Bloomberg Government, thank you so 368 00:20:38,880 --> 00:20:42,439 Speaker 7: much for joining us live from the rotunda on Capitol 369 00:20:42,520 --> 00:20:44,920 Speaker 7: Hill today. We appreciate it. Now, let's go someone to 370 00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:47,879 Speaker 7: someone who used to be in that rotunda quite often 371 00:20:47,920 --> 00:20:52,160 Speaker 7: now is objectively observing Congress from the outside. Former Congressman 372 00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:54,840 Speaker 7: Denver Rugleman is with us, the Republican from the state 373 00:20:54,880 --> 00:20:57,080 Speaker 7: of Virginia. Denver, it's always great to have you on 374 00:20:57,119 --> 00:20:59,840 Speaker 7: the show, especially in a week like this one. We're 375 00:20:59,880 --> 00:21:01,520 Speaker 7: just in the last few days we have seen the 376 00:21:01,560 --> 00:21:05,520 Speaker 7: release and subsequent absolute collapse of a border deal. We 377 00:21:05,600 --> 00:21:07,639 Speaker 7: have seen the failure not just of an attempt and 378 00:21:07,680 --> 00:21:10,640 Speaker 7: impeachment of a cabinet secretary, but also of the attempt 379 00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:14,760 Speaker 7: to pass more than seventeen billion dollars in need to Israel. 380 00:21:14,920 --> 00:21:17,440 Speaker 7: What exactly is happening here? 381 00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:21,040 Speaker 9: I think there's three things. I think it's a failure 382 00:21:21,040 --> 00:21:23,280 Speaker 9: of leadership. I think it's a failure of imagination. And 383 00:21:23,280 --> 00:21:25,720 Speaker 9: I think it's the unserious nature of Congress right now. 384 00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:28,760 Speaker 9: And you know, with twenty twenty four looming, you're looking 385 00:21:28,800 --> 00:21:32,240 Speaker 9: on the GOP side, you're seeing this absolute need to 386 00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:35,800 Speaker 9: satisfy mar A Lago and President Trump. When you're looking 387 00:21:35,840 --> 00:21:38,600 Speaker 9: at the impeachment and losing two sixteen to two fourteen, 388 00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:40,600 Speaker 9: you're seeing a lack of leadership on the GOP side. 389 00:21:40,640 --> 00:21:43,680 Speaker 9: That was something completely unserious and that should have never 390 00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:45,879 Speaker 9: happened to begin with. And we look at at Israel, 391 00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:48,440 Speaker 9: aid you're looking at two issues. You're looking at Democrats 392 00:21:48,560 --> 00:21:50,320 Speaker 9: and I'm trying to unpack a lot here, Kayley. So 393 00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:53,919 Speaker 9: you're looking at Democrats, right, they want a degaza and 394 00:21:53,960 --> 00:21:55,800 Speaker 9: on the right, you know they're looking for offsets for 395 00:21:55,800 --> 00:21:58,480 Speaker 9: any type of standalone funding bills. So right now, you 396 00:21:58,560 --> 00:22:02,399 Speaker 9: have complete chaos because of so much unserious legislation or 397 00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:06,240 Speaker 9: unserious I would say negotiations. You had the House, actually, 398 00:22:06,440 --> 00:22:09,480 Speaker 9: you know, undermine the Senate negotiation for the border bill. 399 00:22:09,720 --> 00:22:12,200 Speaker 9: You have the ridiculous impeachment without a border bill. They're 400 00:22:12,240 --> 00:22:14,440 Speaker 9: still impeaching even though they're the ones who stopped the 401 00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:16,720 Speaker 9: border bill, talking about the GOP. Then you have the 402 00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:19,359 Speaker 9: standalone aid package where the left and the right have 403 00:22:19,440 --> 00:22:21,399 Speaker 9: their own reasons for opposing it. So right now you 404 00:22:21,440 --> 00:22:24,080 Speaker 9: have chaos based on the twenty twenty four election year 405 00:22:24,160 --> 00:22:26,399 Speaker 9: and based on the lack of adults in the room. 406 00:22:27,119 --> 00:22:31,280 Speaker 3: I want to ask you about Mitch McConnell, congressman. Everybody 407 00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:34,159 Speaker 3: talks about Mike Johnson on the motion of VAK. The 408 00:22:34,200 --> 00:22:35,879 Speaker 3: fact of the matter is it doesn't look like anybody 409 00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:39,160 Speaker 3: wants that job right now, and who else would hold 410 00:22:39,240 --> 00:22:41,600 Speaker 3: the gavel? So let's just focus on the Senate for 411 00:22:41,680 --> 00:22:45,600 Speaker 3: one minute, because we're hearing some pretty tough talk from 412 00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:49,520 Speaker 3: some fairly senior senators about Mitch McConnell. Here, Ted Cruz 413 00:22:49,760 --> 00:22:52,960 Speaker 3: not a shock calling for him to step down. Mike Lee, 414 00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:55,840 Speaker 3: who called the border deal a betrayal, is demanding new 415 00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:59,119 Speaker 3: leadership in the Senate Josh Hawley. He says, it's not 416 00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:03,480 Speaker 3: James langford fault, it's Mitch McConnell's fault. And Ron Johnson 417 00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:06,560 Speaker 3: got our attention with a tweet or an X with 418 00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:09,159 Speaker 3: a meme mocking Mitch McConnell, which makes them look like 419 00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:11,920 Speaker 3: Charlie Brown just tried to kick the football. Kereston Cinema 420 00:23:12,000 --> 00:23:15,359 Speaker 3: is lucy in this case? What's about to happen to 421 00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:18,400 Speaker 3: Mitch McConnell, because it sure seems like the political world 422 00:23:18,440 --> 00:23:19,560 Speaker 3: has shifted under his feet. 423 00:23:20,720 --> 00:23:22,919 Speaker 9: Well, I think when you look at those four specifically, 424 00:23:22,960 --> 00:23:25,760 Speaker 9: you're looking at four, you know individuals who also bought 425 00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:28,280 Speaker 9: into Stop to Steal, so they deal in fantasy anyway, 426 00:23:28,520 --> 00:23:31,040 Speaker 9: that's pretty much their bread and butter. I think McConnell 427 00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:33,600 Speaker 9: is actually still pretty safe now. You never know, you know, 428 00:23:33,600 --> 00:23:35,280 Speaker 9: they could be trying to whip. There could be things 429 00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:38,040 Speaker 9: going on behind the scenes about Mitch specifically. 430 00:23:37,760 --> 00:23:38,840 Speaker 6: But he's pretty good at this. 431 00:23:39,000 --> 00:23:40,760 Speaker 9: And when you're looking at four, you know sort of 432 00:23:40,760 --> 00:23:44,560 Speaker 9: extreme figures like those individuals especially I mean right now, 433 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:45,960 Speaker 9: I mean they just really don't have a leg to 434 00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:48,679 Speaker 9: stand on, screaming betrayal and things of that nature. It 435 00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:50,520 Speaker 9: sounds like to me that again they're getting their marching 436 00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:53,600 Speaker 9: orders from mar Alago. These are Trump talking points. He 437 00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:55,840 Speaker 9: doesn't like McConnell anyway. You know what he talked about, 438 00:23:55,880 --> 00:23:58,560 Speaker 9: you know, his wife, those unfortunate remarks that were dang 439 00:23:58,600 --> 00:24:01,080 Speaker 9: close to racist. Think what you're seeing right now are 440 00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:04,160 Speaker 9: four individuals who already like to live on the fantasy edge, 441 00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:06,800 Speaker 9: looking at their polling and their fundraising, look at what's 442 00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:09,880 Speaker 9: happening in their states, looking at their own reelection campaigns 443 00:24:09,920 --> 00:24:12,480 Speaker 9: coming out in the future, and wanting to satisfy who 444 00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:14,000 Speaker 9: they think might be the next president of the United 445 00:24:14,040 --> 00:24:16,880 Speaker 9: States and Donald Trump. I think that's why they're screaming 446 00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:19,520 Speaker 9: like that. But I think McConnell right now is fairly 447 00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:21,879 Speaker 9: safe because you know, when you got the crazies in 448 00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:24,600 Speaker 9: the back of the elementary school room screaming, you don't 449 00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:26,240 Speaker 9: worry about it too much unless you have a full 450 00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:28,760 Speaker 9: on coup, which who knows what would happen in the 451 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:29,440 Speaker 9: Senate right now. 452 00:24:29,440 --> 00:24:31,960 Speaker 6: I just don't think mcconnald's in that much danger yet. 453 00:24:33,520 --> 00:24:36,160 Speaker 7: Well, you talk about some of the crazies in the body, 454 00:24:36,200 --> 00:24:38,120 Speaker 7: which I guess speaks to a wider question that could 455 00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:40,360 Speaker 7: be applicable to both the Senate and the House. Right now, 456 00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:44,280 Speaker 7: if the issue is of the body itself or of leadership, 457 00:24:44,320 --> 00:24:46,960 Speaker 7: that isn't actually the ones that are leading that body. 458 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:49,000 Speaker 7: If the one leading the body is, as you say, 459 00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:50,840 Speaker 7: the former president. 460 00:24:51,520 --> 00:24:52,760 Speaker 6: Yeah, it's listen. 461 00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:57,719 Speaker 9: Mike Johnson is in a hard position because he's been 462 00:24:57,760 --> 00:24:59,720 Speaker 9: hooked with marionette strings from mar A Lago. 463 00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:01,439 Speaker 6: He really can't get out of that lane. 464 00:25:01,520 --> 00:25:03,600 Speaker 9: I mean, he's he's going to do what he needs 465 00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:05,800 Speaker 9: to do in order to keep the former president happy 466 00:25:06,080 --> 00:25:07,920 Speaker 9: based on what they're singing all the districts right and 467 00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:10,560 Speaker 9: basically being the favorability ratings of Trump in many of 468 00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:13,080 Speaker 9: these far right districts and in many districts that you know, 469 00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:16,280 Speaker 9: you're talking about the Freedom Caucus. That's their bread and butter, 470 00:25:16,760 --> 00:25:19,080 Speaker 9: right as the Trump protection society that they have. So 471 00:25:19,600 --> 00:25:22,439 Speaker 9: Mike Johnson is this is this is beyond him on 472 00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:24,840 Speaker 9: a leadership level. If he can't step out and do 473 00:25:24,880 --> 00:25:27,600 Speaker 9: what's right for the country without having Donald Trump looking 474 00:25:27,640 --> 00:25:28,760 Speaker 9: over his shoulder, this. 475 00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:29,960 Speaker 6: Chaos is going to continue. 476 00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:32,960 Speaker 9: So there's there's a rot in the body of Congress 477 00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:34,720 Speaker 9: and all that comes from mar A Lago. 478 00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:35,960 Speaker 6: It's a Florida rot. 479 00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:39,680 Speaker 9: And you know, everybody right now looking at their reelection campaigns, 480 00:25:39,680 --> 00:25:41,600 Speaker 9: as you know for the House it's every two years, 481 00:25:41,880 --> 00:25:43,840 Speaker 9: they want to make sure that they're on the right 482 00:25:43,880 --> 00:25:46,280 Speaker 9: side of the favorability ratings for Trump in each district. 483 00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:48,640 Speaker 9: So they're going to scream and yell things that are unserious. 484 00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:50,840 Speaker 9: And you saw that today, right Andy Biggs coming out 485 00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:53,000 Speaker 9: and saying, the Democrats just played a better game than 486 00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:55,600 Speaker 9: us on the impeachment of my orcus. If they think 487 00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:58,639 Speaker 9: this is a game, this is really a disservice to 488 00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:01,360 Speaker 9: United States citizens. And I think it's I think we're 489 00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:03,400 Speaker 9: to a point now that if if we have sitting 490 00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:05,159 Speaker 9: congressmen saying it's just a game and they got the 491 00:26:05,160 --> 00:26:07,600 Speaker 9: better of us in this game, we're in real trouble 492 00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:09,240 Speaker 9: because they're not looking at the importance of this to 493 00:26:09,280 --> 00:26:11,520 Speaker 9: the United States. They're looking at the importance of Donald 494 00:26:11,560 --> 00:26:13,920 Speaker 9: Trump in their own re election campaigns, and that could 495 00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:14,760 Speaker 9: be very dangerous. 496 00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:16,400 Speaker 5: Wow. 497 00:26:16,480 --> 00:26:20,240 Speaker 3: Well, if this is a Florida rot, uh, that isn't 498 00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:23,280 Speaker 3: going to change any time soon. At Denver, I'm wondering 499 00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:25,520 Speaker 3: what will happen over the course of the next month. 500 00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:28,639 Speaker 3: Are we going to get a budget, Is the government 501 00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:30,960 Speaker 3: going to shut down? Does this Ukraine funding pass on 502 00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:33,760 Speaker 3: its own, or are we just incapable of doing anything. 503 00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:37,720 Speaker 9: I had a great intelligence instructor, Joe, you know, he 504 00:26:37,760 --> 00:26:39,159 Speaker 9: told me one time, he said, the only way to 505 00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:41,960 Speaker 9: tell the future is to wait till it happens. And 506 00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:45,080 Speaker 9: trying to predict Congress is really ridiculous. You know, it's 507 00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:47,560 Speaker 9: a it's like, you know, it's trying to wrestle snakes, 508 00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:51,119 Speaker 9: you know, slimy, they're going to bite you. But I 509 00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:54,160 Speaker 9: think what you've got right now is maybe you might 510 00:26:54,200 --> 00:26:56,800 Speaker 9: get a cr maybe you might get you know, some 511 00:26:56,880 --> 00:26:59,040 Speaker 9: kind of ability to extend the budget right now. I 512 00:26:59,080 --> 00:27:01,520 Speaker 9: don't know how they're actually going to process that, but 513 00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:04,080 Speaker 9: their track record isn't very good. I think you're going 514 00:27:04,119 --> 00:27:05,760 Speaker 9: to have chaos in the next month, and I think 515 00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:07,440 Speaker 9: a lot of again is going to be the talking 516 00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:08,399 Speaker 9: points for Donald Trump. 517 00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:09,399 Speaker 6: It's just that simple. 518 00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:12,080 Speaker 9: On the GOP side, Democrats sizes count to roll with 519 00:27:12,119 --> 00:27:14,040 Speaker 9: it and try to do the best they can in 520 00:27:14,040 --> 00:27:17,000 Speaker 9: that circumstance. I mean, it's chaos right now, and it 521 00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:19,480 Speaker 9: is a function of the leadership. But also there is 522 00:27:19,520 --> 00:27:21,240 Speaker 9: some body rot in Congress. 523 00:27:20,880 --> 00:27:23,960 Speaker 7: Right now well, and then there's the question of a 524 00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:27,080 Speaker 7: potential leadership change as we talk about how right now 525 00:27:27,119 --> 00:27:29,120 Speaker 7: the Senate is going to be voting as to whether 526 00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:31,439 Speaker 7: or not to pass this bill that does not include 527 00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:34,240 Speaker 7: border security, just the other supplemental requests when it comes 528 00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:37,639 Speaker 7: to Israel and Ukrainey. Then if it does pass, Mike 529 00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:39,480 Speaker 7: Johnson's going to have a choice to make as to 530 00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:41,040 Speaker 7: whether he wants to put that on the floor and 531 00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:44,479 Speaker 7: potentially risk emotion to vacate in the process. Does anyone 532 00:27:44,560 --> 00:27:47,400 Speaker 7: come to mind to you Denver as to who would 533 00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:49,120 Speaker 7: replace him if that were to happen. 534 00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:54,040 Speaker 6: After all the votes with McCarthy, I don't know. 535 00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:55,200 Speaker 7: A few others have tried. 536 00:27:56,280 --> 00:27:58,399 Speaker 9: I might I have a better chance than a lot 537 00:27:58,400 --> 00:27:59,880 Speaker 9: of people to run for speaker right now? 538 00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:02,640 Speaker 6: I think, you know, I you. 539 00:28:02,600 --> 00:28:05,440 Speaker 9: Know, but I do believe you know, if you're looking 540 00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:08,680 Speaker 9: across leadership right now, if they had to go back 541 00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:10,960 Speaker 9: and do it over again, I think they would go 542 00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:14,199 Speaker 9: back to a Tom Emmer type per speaker. On the 543 00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:18,440 Speaker 9: House side, you might see Scalise roll back up. I 544 00:28:18,520 --> 00:28:21,320 Speaker 9: think if Scalise comes back, and I hope he does 545 00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:23,919 Speaker 9: right after his cancer treatment, I mean, nobody wishes that 546 00:28:24,000 --> 00:28:26,359 Speaker 9: on anybody. I think Steve Scalisee might be back in 547 00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:30,480 Speaker 9: play as speaker if he comes back, regardless of what 548 00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:33,000 Speaker 9: his prognosis or diagnosis is. I think he's really the 549 00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:37,000 Speaker 9: only one, him and maybe Emmer that can rally the 550 00:28:37,040 --> 00:28:39,720 Speaker 9: GOP to what they need to do. There's one problem, though, 551 00:28:40,120 --> 00:28:44,040 Speaker 9: It's Donald Trump, and he might want somebody else in there. 552 00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:46,800 Speaker 6: That's absolutely insane. He's not a big fan. 553 00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:48,760 Speaker 9: Of emer He's never been over the moon about scalise 554 00:28:48,800 --> 00:28:49,680 Speaker 9: I know this personally. 555 00:28:49,880 --> 00:28:52,120 Speaker 6: I just know that. So who would it be. Would 556 00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:53,840 Speaker 6: it be a Matt Gates type? Impossible? 557 00:28:54,280 --> 00:28:56,720 Speaker 9: It made too many enemies, too much of a charlatan. 558 00:28:57,000 --> 00:28:59,400 Speaker 9: So again, guys, again, I think the Emers scalize I 559 00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:01,600 Speaker 9: think you're going to se some retreads from the prior 560 00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:03,720 Speaker 9: vote that sort of come back out of the woodwork. 561 00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:08,320 Speaker 3: Spending time with former Republican Congressman Denver Riggleman of Virginia 562 00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:11,440 Speaker 3: here on Bloomberg's Balance of Power, Kaylee, I don't know 563 00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:15,920 Speaker 3: if you saw this quote from Mitt Romney, another fan 564 00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:18,880 Speaker 3: of mar A Lago Denver own to read this to you. 565 00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:22,360 Speaker 3: This is Mitt Romney talking about politics used to be 566 00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:25,760 Speaker 3: the art of the possible. Now, it is the art 567 00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:28,240 Speaker 3: of the impossible, he says. This is the former standard 568 00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:31,640 Speaker 3: bearer of the Republican Party, meaning let's put forward proposals 569 00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:33,760 Speaker 3: that cannot possibly pass so that we can say to 570 00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:37,480 Speaker 3: our respective basis, look how I'm fighting for you. He says. 571 00:29:37,480 --> 00:29:40,240 Speaker 3: We've gone from the sublime to the ridiculous. I don't 572 00:29:40,280 --> 00:29:42,600 Speaker 3: mean to get too abstract here at Denver, but how 573 00:29:42,600 --> 00:29:44,520 Speaker 3: do you make politics the art of the possible? 574 00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:44,800 Speaker 5: Again? 575 00:29:46,360 --> 00:29:49,400 Speaker 9: Well, first you got to stop the monkeys from throwing poo, right, 576 00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:52,640 Speaker 9: I mean, they have to actually be more serious about 577 00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:55,800 Speaker 9: their constituents as far as what's best for America, rather 578 00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:58,560 Speaker 9: than just being re elected or trying to satisfy a 579 00:29:58,640 --> 00:29:59,320 Speaker 9: rabid base. 580 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:00,280 Speaker 10: Right. 581 00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:02,960 Speaker 9: You know, Senator Romney's right, it is the art of 582 00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:05,320 Speaker 9: the impossible. Because right now again, and I've said this 583 00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:08,440 Speaker 9: over and over, if you don't have people who treat 584 00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:13,000 Speaker 9: America first as their actual I would say priority and 585 00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:16,880 Speaker 9: making sure that we're protected, that we make compromises or 586 00:30:16,920 --> 00:30:19,600 Speaker 9: we make decisions with integrity, we can't give back to 587 00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:22,400 Speaker 9: any semblance of the art of the possible. We can't 588 00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:24,240 Speaker 9: get back to the days of that type of compromise 589 00:30:24,680 --> 00:30:28,200 Speaker 9: because you have a charlatan, you have a demagogue, right, 590 00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:30,480 Speaker 9: who's pushing this type of messaging, and it's not based 591 00:30:30,520 --> 00:30:33,280 Speaker 9: on fact, it's not based on any type of reality. 592 00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:33,720 Speaker 4: Right. 593 00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:36,080 Speaker 9: This is a person who has, you know, Donald Trump, 594 00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:38,400 Speaker 9: who has a track record of believing in the fantastical. 595 00:30:38,440 --> 00:30:40,360 Speaker 9: I mean, he probably believes The Lord of the Rings 596 00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:43,120 Speaker 9: is a documentary. So I think I think that's the 597 00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:45,240 Speaker 9: kind of issues you have right now, as you've got 598 00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:47,040 Speaker 9: to stop the poof flinging and you've got to have 599 00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:50,200 Speaker 9: people who actually know the difference between reality and fantasy 600 00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:53,320 Speaker 9: and who put the American people first rather than their 601 00:30:53,480 --> 00:30:54,600 Speaker 9: own based desires. 602 00:30:56,920 --> 00:30:59,720 Speaker 7: You talk about Donald Trump and some of his beliefs, 603 00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:02,800 Speaker 7: which include firmly that he won the twenty twenty election, 604 00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:06,160 Speaker 7: even though that's factually inaccurate. And just on that note, Denver, 605 00:31:06,280 --> 00:31:09,080 Speaker 7: keeping in mind you assisted the January sixth committee in 606 00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:14,080 Speaker 7: their work, there is now reportedly a chance that a 607 00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:17,320 Speaker 7: twenty twenty election denier from North Carolina could be atop 608 00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:19,920 Speaker 7: the RNC if Trump has his way and Ronald McDaniel 609 00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:24,000 Speaker 7: is reported does indeed step down as chair after South Carolina. 610 00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:25,560 Speaker 7: How concerning do you find that. 611 00:31:27,160 --> 00:31:30,200 Speaker 9: It means the party has been totally taken over by fantasists. 612 00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:33,760 Speaker 9: And again it also means the party is firmly in 613 00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:36,200 Speaker 9: control of Donald Trump in a way that we can't 614 00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:38,120 Speaker 9: even imagine at this point. I mean, if you have 615 00:31:38,160 --> 00:31:40,920 Speaker 9: an election denier that's the R and C chair, what 616 00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:44,080 Speaker 9: does that say about one whole parties and their ability 617 00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:46,600 Speaker 9: to grasp reality or to look at facts, or to 618 00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:49,480 Speaker 9: make facts based decisions right, to make sort of a 619 00:31:49,520 --> 00:31:53,880 Speaker 9: reality based strategies on which they should be doing as 620 00:31:53,920 --> 00:31:55,600 Speaker 9: a party or what they should be doing for the 621 00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:56,360 Speaker 9: United States. 622 00:31:57,240 --> 00:31:59,840 Speaker 6: I have no respect for anybody who. 623 00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:01,840 Speaker 9: Comes out as an election denier or they think the 624 00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:04,800 Speaker 9: date Jay Sixers were just you know, peaceful participants in 625 00:32:04,800 --> 00:32:09,280 Speaker 9: a rally. I mean it's it's absolutely it's almost like 626 00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:13,600 Speaker 9: they've been inhaling fumes and now they're believing the crazy themselves. 627 00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:15,680 Speaker 9: And I think that's that again should worry the American 628 00:32:15,720 --> 00:32:18,480 Speaker 9: people that are on the same side that you got 629 00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:21,240 Speaker 9: crazy coming to a head. Not only is the person 630 00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:24,160 Speaker 9: running for president the presumptive nominee for the GOP and 631 00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:26,720 Speaker 9: I was a Republican, but also you have a crazy 632 00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:28,520 Speaker 9: at the head of the party who might be even 633 00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:30,320 Speaker 9: you know, nuttier than Donald Trump. 634 00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:32,760 Speaker 1: This is why he makes bourbon. 635 00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:36,040 Speaker 3: Now in Virginia, Denver, Riggleman, It's great to see you, sir, 636 00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:39,479 Speaker 3: the former Republican congressman, with us trying to rationalize as 637 00:32:39,520 --> 00:32:42,200 Speaker 3: we all are, what's happening before our eyes here in 638 00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:42,840 Speaker 3: the Capitol. 639 00:32:45,840 --> 00:32:49,160 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast Ken 640 00:32:49,360 --> 00:32:51,920 Speaker 1: Just Live weekdays at noon Eastern on Apple. 641 00:32:51,680 --> 00:32:54,360 Speaker 2: Car Play and then royd Oro with the Bloomberg Business app. 642 00:32:54,520 --> 00:32:57,360 Speaker 5: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 643 00:32:57,360 --> 00:33:00,360 Speaker 5: flagship New York station, Just Say Alexa play. 644 00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:01,640 Speaker 1: Bloomberg eleven. 645 00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:06,040 Speaker 3: Really one of the biggest stories of the day yesterday 646 00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:09,520 Speaker 3: and another multi story day Kaylee was hearing from the 647 00:33:09,520 --> 00:33:12,440 Speaker 3: Appeals Court. Donald Trump can be prosecuted, but there are 648 00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:14,920 Speaker 3: just as many questions today, if not more, about what 649 00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:17,320 Speaker 3: that's going to mean for the cases against him, particularly 650 00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:19,160 Speaker 3: Jack Smith's case here in Washington. 651 00:33:19,320 --> 00:33:21,920 Speaker 7: Yeah, the case, the trial of which was supposed to 652 00:33:22,040 --> 00:33:25,080 Speaker 7: until last week stars start March forth until the judge 653 00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:27,760 Speaker 7: canceled that date because we were awaiting this immunity decision. 654 00:33:27,800 --> 00:33:30,000 Speaker 7: Now we have the immunity call from the appeals court, 655 00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:32,720 Speaker 7: but that doesn't mean this is all done and dusted. 656 00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:35,080 Speaker 7: He has until Monday to try to appeal it if 657 00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:38,200 Speaker 7: he so chooses, to the Supreme Court, and then the 658 00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:40,080 Speaker 7: Supreme Court will decide whether or not they want to 659 00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:40,960 Speaker 7: hear it. 660 00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:44,240 Speaker 3: Becomes a job telling all these cases apart. Yes, tomorrow 661 00:33:44,400 --> 00:33:47,400 Speaker 3: we're going to start looking at his eligibility or not 662 00:33:47,720 --> 00:33:50,280 Speaker 3: to be on the ballot, remembering this Fourteenth Amendment case, 663 00:33:50,280 --> 00:33:53,000 Speaker 3: it goes back to Colorado. This is going to be 664 00:33:53,080 --> 00:33:55,480 Speaker 3: an important ruling for his campaign too. 665 00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:59,240 Speaker 7: Yeah, and a lot of Supreme Court influence potentially on 666 00:33:59,280 --> 00:34:02,040 Speaker 7: the twenty twenty four election and its outcome. So on 667 00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:04,600 Speaker 7: that note, let's turn now to Jim Zyron, who is 668 00:34:04,640 --> 00:34:07,520 Speaker 7: a former assistant US Attorney for the Southern District of 669 00:34:07,520 --> 00:34:10,280 Speaker 7: New York, also the host of Conversations with Jim Zyron 670 00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:13,200 Speaker 7: on PBS. Jim, it's always great to have you on 671 00:34:13,239 --> 00:34:15,520 Speaker 7: the program. If we could just begin with the question 672 00:34:15,640 --> 00:34:18,640 Speaker 7: of immunity. Obviously, the Appeals Court yesterday said that Trump 673 00:34:18,680 --> 00:34:22,120 Speaker 7: is now citizen Trump, therefore he is not immune from prosecution. 674 00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:24,759 Speaker 7: How quickly do you expect that this question in its 675 00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:28,160 Speaker 7: entirety will be resolved if, as expected, he appeals this 676 00:34:28,480 --> 00:34:29,319 Speaker 7: to Scotus. 677 00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:34,560 Speaker 10: Well, it could be resolved Cayley next Monday or maybe 678 00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:37,759 Speaker 10: the day after, because the key thing is whether the 679 00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:41,640 Speaker 10: Supreme Court is going to stay the trial pending their 680 00:34:41,719 --> 00:34:46,480 Speaker 10: consideration of the case. They may take the case but 681 00:34:46,680 --> 00:34:50,759 Speaker 10: not put a stay an emergency stay in place, or 682 00:34:50,840 --> 00:34:57,840 Speaker 10: they may deny a stay and also deny cert discretionary review. 683 00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:01,799 Speaker 10: Or they may take the case and impose a stay. 684 00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:04,640 Speaker 10: If they impose a stay, the question is how soon 685 00:35:04,680 --> 00:35:06,400 Speaker 10: will they get to the merits that it would have 686 00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:09,080 Speaker 10: to be briefing and there would have to be our argument, 687 00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:11,560 Speaker 10: and then there's a serious question as to whether the 688 00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:15,120 Speaker 10: case could be tried before the election. I suspect that 689 00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:17,279 Speaker 10: the Supreme Court is going to allow the case to 690 00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:21,760 Speaker 10: be tried as soon as possible, because there's very little 691 00:35:21,760 --> 00:35:27,640 Speaker 10: precedent for an appellate court staying a trial once it's ruled, 692 00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:32,520 Speaker 10: and the DC Circuit opinion is so airtight and so 693 00:35:32,719 --> 00:35:39,799 Speaker 10: well framed and considered that I can't see anyway that 694 00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:42,960 Speaker 10: the Supreme Court is going to reverse the case. 695 00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:47,319 Speaker 3: You're not the first to describe the appeals court in 696 00:35:47,320 --> 00:35:50,080 Speaker 3: that fashion, Gym. So in that world does the Supreme 697 00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:53,080 Speaker 3: Court make a ruling to that effect, or just not 698 00:35:53,200 --> 00:35:53,879 Speaker 3: take up the case. 699 00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:55,200 Speaker 6: It depends. 700 00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:58,239 Speaker 10: You know, the Supreme Court is up in the ethereal atmosphere. 701 00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:01,360 Speaker 10: So they could just say certain to not full stop. 702 00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:07,520 Speaker 10: They could say CERT granted, but not impose an emergency 703 00:36:07,640 --> 00:36:11,359 Speaker 10: stay so the trial pers could go forward, or they 704 00:36:11,360 --> 00:36:14,680 Speaker 10: could impose a stay and then set a timetable for 705 00:36:15,160 --> 00:36:19,160 Speaker 10: their consideration of the case. It only takes four justices 706 00:36:19,320 --> 00:36:24,279 Speaker 10: to grant CERT, and it takes five justices to grant 707 00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:28,520 Speaker 10: a stay. Often, as a courtesy, one of the judges 708 00:36:28,560 --> 00:36:31,799 Speaker 10: who's against CERT will vote to grant the stay so 709 00:36:31,840 --> 00:36:36,040 Speaker 10: that the status quo can be preserved for the four 710 00:36:36,120 --> 00:36:38,040 Speaker 10: who think the case should be reviewed. 711 00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:39,680 Speaker 4: Well. 712 00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:42,160 Speaker 7: Of course, all nine will be hearing the arguments in 713 00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:45,520 Speaker 7: the Fourteenth Amendment case tomorrow. Jim as Joe was talking 714 00:36:45,560 --> 00:36:48,120 Speaker 7: about the question of Colorado's decision to kick him off 715 00:36:48,160 --> 00:36:50,520 Speaker 7: the ballot in that state because they say he incited 716 00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:54,759 Speaker 7: insurrection at the capitol on January sixth. I know we've 717 00:36:54,800 --> 00:36:58,719 Speaker 7: discussed that fourteenth Amendment engaged in insurrection. You're right, and 718 00:36:58,719 --> 00:37:00,200 Speaker 7: that's the language and the fourteenth the mend and an 719 00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:04,000 Speaker 7: important distinction to make what is the strongest argument against 720 00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:08,360 Speaker 7: overturning Colorado's ruling that could be made tomorrow. 721 00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:14,280 Speaker 10: Well, the strongest argument against it is that the text 722 00:37:14,480 --> 00:37:18,759 Speaker 10: of the Fourteenth Amendment is very clear that anyone who 723 00:37:18,800 --> 00:37:22,840 Speaker 10: was engaged in an insurrection and who was an officer 724 00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:27,320 Speaker 10: of the United States and therefore has betrayed his oath 725 00:37:28,120 --> 00:37:34,760 Speaker 10: to the United States has disqualified from attaining further office. 726 00:37:35,120 --> 00:37:38,839 Speaker 10: So it was probably designed to keep Jefferson Davis off 727 00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:41,560 Speaker 10: the ballot because they were all afraid Jefferson Davis might 728 00:37:41,680 --> 00:37:47,879 Speaker 10: run for president. But it has vitality today. And there's 729 00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:53,120 Speaker 10: a brilliant brief by a conservative retired judge j. Michael Lootig, 730 00:37:53,640 --> 00:37:59,000 Speaker 10: in which he goes through all of the clauses of 731 00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:03,520 Speaker 10: the Fourteenth Amendment and addresses the conservative justices on the 732 00:38:03,560 --> 00:38:07,920 Speaker 10: Supreme Court in language that they've used in other cases 733 00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:12,040 Speaker 10: and shows how textualism and originalism leads you to the 734 00:38:12,080 --> 00:38:14,080 Speaker 10: conclusion that Trump should be disqualified. 735 00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:19,680 Speaker 3: Jim'sarn. We see a tweet here from the Senate Judiciary Committee, 736 00:38:20,080 --> 00:38:23,800 Speaker 3: Senator Durbin, of course, the chair, calling on Justice Clarence 737 00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:28,160 Speaker 3: Thomas to recuse himself in the upcoming Fourteenth Amendment case. 738 00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:28,960 Speaker 6: Do you agree? 739 00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:32,600 Speaker 1: I think he should. I doubt that he will. 740 00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:36,880 Speaker 10: I think he's going to be there, But I wonder 741 00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:43,000 Speaker 10: whether parents Thomas looks at some of the decisions he's 742 00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:45,960 Speaker 10: made in the past, and some of the language he's used, 743 00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:51,480 Speaker 10: particularly in Second Amendment gun cases, that as to how 744 00:38:51,560 --> 00:38:56,040 Speaker 10: the Constitution should be interpreted, whether he has any offline 745 00:38:56,800 --> 00:39:00,280 Speaker 10: to escape voting for the disqualification of Donald Trump. 746 00:39:02,560 --> 00:39:05,200 Speaker 7: There is an effort underway in Congress right now. It's 747 00:39:05,200 --> 00:39:08,320 Speaker 7: being led by the Republican congressman from Florida, Matt Gates, 748 00:39:08,360 --> 00:39:10,720 Speaker 7: to pass a resolution in the House that would declare 749 00:39:10,800 --> 00:39:14,560 Speaker 7: that Donald Trump did not engage an insurrection. If that 750 00:39:14,640 --> 00:39:17,640 Speaker 7: were to pass, and it's a big if here, would 751 00:39:17,680 --> 00:39:20,240 Speaker 7: that have any legal bearing in this case. 752 00:39:21,080 --> 00:39:23,520 Speaker 10: That's what Franklin Roosevelt used to call an Awfully if 753 00:39:23,600 --> 00:39:26,439 Speaker 10: he questioned, I don't think it will pass any more 754 00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:30,920 Speaker 10: than the impeachment of majorcas is going to fly. But 755 00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:32,920 Speaker 10: even if it were to pass, it would have no 756 00:39:33,040 --> 00:39:34,560 Speaker 10: legal significance whatsoever. 757 00:39:35,600 --> 00:39:36,200 Speaker 4: Remember, there was. 758 00:39:36,200 --> 00:39:40,560 Speaker 10: A five day hearing a trial in Colorado. Trump was 759 00:39:40,600 --> 00:39:45,160 Speaker 10: given every opportunity to present evidence. He didn't testify. The 760 00:39:45,200 --> 00:39:49,520 Speaker 10: evidence that came in was largely unobjected. To and consisted 761 00:39:49,560 --> 00:39:52,720 Speaker 10: of statements Trump made or videotape evidence. 762 00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:53,520 Speaker 1: We all saw it. 763 00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:56,440 Speaker 10: We all know what happened, and there's absolutely no question 764 00:39:56,600 --> 00:39:59,880 Speaker 10: that there was an insurrection, and there's really no question 765 00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:01,960 Speaker 10: that Trump engaged in it. 766 00:40:04,440 --> 00:40:08,160 Speaker 3: Boy, the level of uncertainty here is great. I realize 767 00:40:08,600 --> 00:40:10,279 Speaker 3: Jim's iron. But with all of this, what do you 768 00:40:10,280 --> 00:40:12,600 Speaker 3: think is the first trial to get underway? Will it 769 00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:13,880 Speaker 3: be complete before the election? 770 00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:17,440 Speaker 10: Well, there is an element of uncertainty. 771 00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:18,400 Speaker 1: Clearly. 772 00:40:18,680 --> 00:40:24,439 Speaker 10: If the Supreme Court denies an emergency stay, and that's 773 00:40:24,480 --> 00:40:27,960 Speaker 10: the real issue, there could be a trial before the election. 774 00:40:28,040 --> 00:40:31,359 Speaker 10: There could be a trial this summer. If, however, they 775 00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:35,480 Speaker 10: stay the matter and the trial date is uncertain, the 776 00:40:35,520 --> 00:40:39,200 Speaker 10: first trial will be Alvin Pragg's election interference case in 777 00:40:39,320 --> 00:40:44,320 Speaker 10: New York involving the payoff to the porn star Stormy Daniels. 778 00:40:45,640 --> 00:40:49,160 Speaker 3: Amazing considering what we've heard about that case. It's great 779 00:40:49,160 --> 00:40:51,760 Speaker 3: to see Jim's iron. Thank you for joining us here 780 00:40:51,920 --> 00:40:54,480 Speaker 3: once again on Bloomberg. Former Assistant US Attorney for the 781 00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:58,560 Speaker 3: Southern District of New York, Kayley, It's interesting when we 782 00:40:58,600 --> 00:41:02,560 Speaker 3: talk to voices of experience from the legal world like that, 783 00:41:02,600 --> 00:41:05,600 Speaker 3: they very frequently arrive at the same conclusions on timing 784 00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:07,040 Speaker 3: and potential outcome here. 785 00:41:07,080 --> 00:41:08,360 Speaker 6: It's going to be fascinating to watch on. 786 00:41:08,400 --> 00:41:10,239 Speaker 7: Fold well, and a lot of it will depend on 787 00:41:10,280 --> 00:41:12,520 Speaker 7: whether or not the Supreme Court decides to hear and 788 00:41:12,640 --> 00:41:17,360 Speaker 7: expeditiously so the former presidents appeal on the immunity decision, 789 00:41:17,400 --> 00:41:19,360 Speaker 7: so we'll of course continue to have that covered for you. 790 00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:20,719 Speaker 8: This is Clover. 791 00:41:22,840 --> 00:41:26,040 Speaker 3: Thanks for listening to the Balance of Power podcast. Make 792 00:41:26,080 --> 00:41:29,040 Speaker 3: sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, 793 00:41:29,120 --> 00:41:31,680 Speaker 3: or wherever you get your podcasts, and you can find 794 00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:35,000 Speaker 3: us live every weekday from Washington, DC at noontime Eastern 795 00:41:35,320 --> 00:41:36,720 Speaker 3: at Bloomberg dot com.