1 00:00:04,960 --> 00:00:08,879 Speaker 1: On this episode of Nuts World. Rob Reiner first came 2 00:00:08,920 --> 00:00:11,440 Speaker 1: to fame as a two time Emmy Award winning actor 3 00:00:11,880 --> 00:00:15,600 Speaker 1: on the Landmark television series All in the Family. He 4 00:00:15,680 --> 00:00:18,680 Speaker 1: went on to become an acclaimed director of some of 5 00:00:18,680 --> 00:00:22,960 Speaker 1: the most popular and influential motion pictures. His work ranges 6 00:00:23,000 --> 00:00:26,119 Speaker 1: from satire This Is Spinal Tap, which is one of 7 00:00:26,160 --> 00:00:30,159 Speaker 1: my favorites, to dramas like stand By Me, Misery, A 8 00:00:30,200 --> 00:00:34,240 Speaker 1: Few Good Men and Ghost of Mississippi, to romantic comedies 9 00:00:34,320 --> 00:00:38,239 Speaker 1: like When Harry Met Sally and the American President, to 10 00:00:38,320 --> 00:00:42,640 Speaker 1: the enduring classic The Princess Bride. His now twenty films 11 00:00:42,640 --> 00:00:47,040 Speaker 1: also include The Bucket List, Flipped, LBJ starring Woody Harrelson, 12 00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:51,080 Speaker 1: and most recently Shock and Awe, which exposed the lies 13 00:00:51,080 --> 00:00:52,879 Speaker 1: that led to the US invasion of Iraq. 14 00:00:53,560 --> 00:00:54,360 Speaker 2: Rob, along with his. 15 00:00:54,320 --> 00:00:58,280 Speaker 1: Wife Michelle and Matthew George, continue to run Castle Rock 16 00:00:58,440 --> 00:01:03,720 Speaker 1: Entertainment and film production company. He's joining me today to 17 00:01:03,800 --> 00:01:08,960 Speaker 1: discuss his new ten part podcast entitled Who Killed JFK 18 00:01:09,560 --> 00:01:13,080 Speaker 1: In commemoration of the sixtieth anniversary of President John F. 19 00:01:13,160 --> 00:01:19,959 Speaker 1: Kennedy's tragic assassination. Reiner and journalist Soledad O'Brien interview CIA officials, 20 00:01:20,360 --> 00:01:25,560 Speaker 1: medical experts, Pulitzer Prize winning journalists, eyewitnesses, and a former 21 00:01:25,680 --> 00:01:29,479 Speaker 1: Secret Service agent who in twenty twenty three came forward 22 00:01:29,600 --> 00:01:33,560 Speaker 1: with groundbreaking new evidence. They also discussed their own theories 23 00:01:33,760 --> 00:01:37,280 Speaker 1: of who killed JFK, how that question has shaped America, 24 00:01:37,680 --> 00:01:41,360 Speaker 1: and why it matters that sixty years later we're still 25 00:01:41,400 --> 00:01:57,200 Speaker 1: asking the question. Rob. Welcome and thank you for joining 26 00:01:57,240 --> 00:01:58,000 Speaker 1: me on Newtsworld. 27 00:01:58,120 --> 00:01:59,240 Speaker 2: Thanks for having me Newton. 28 00:01:59,280 --> 00:02:01,720 Speaker 1: This is great and I have to say when I 29 00:02:01,800 --> 00:02:04,800 Speaker 1: learned that, I think it's correct that when Harry met Sally, 30 00:02:05,480 --> 00:02:08,080 Speaker 1: the woman in the background who says I'll take whichever 31 00:02:08,160 --> 00:02:09,600 Speaker 1: she has is I think your mother. 32 00:02:09,960 --> 00:02:13,120 Speaker 2: Yes, yes, my mother, and she took her place in 33 00:02:13,160 --> 00:02:17,080 Speaker 2: the pantheon of most quoted lines in movies. 34 00:02:17,639 --> 00:02:20,280 Speaker 1: It's an amazing scene and anybody who hasn't seen it 35 00:02:20,320 --> 00:02:21,880 Speaker 1: now you've got to go see it to see what 36 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:24,720 Speaker 1: we're talking about. Let me start with you grew up 37 00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:28,000 Speaker 1: with one of the great comedians of all time, a 38 00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:31,600 Speaker 1: man who, in someone has invented much of television comedy, 39 00:02:31,639 --> 00:02:34,680 Speaker 1: and that's Carl Reiner. He did one hundred and fifty 40 00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:37,519 Speaker 1: eight episodes of The Dick Van Dyke Show, so from 41 00:02:37,520 --> 00:02:39,440 Speaker 1: your own background. I mean, were you just sort of 42 00:02:39,880 --> 00:02:42,120 Speaker 1: automatically in the entertainment business. 43 00:02:42,480 --> 00:02:44,920 Speaker 2: You know, it seems like I was, because that was 44 00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:47,680 Speaker 2: what I was surrounded by my whole life growing up. 45 00:02:47,760 --> 00:02:51,160 Speaker 2: I mean, mel Brooks was around, and Norman Lear and 46 00:02:51,600 --> 00:02:55,160 Speaker 2: all of these, you know, great comedians and comic writers. 47 00:02:55,639 --> 00:03:00,200 Speaker 2: And I've often said that if you look at anything 48 00:03:00,240 --> 00:03:03,200 Speaker 2: that you laughed at in the second half of the 49 00:03:03,240 --> 00:03:07,440 Speaker 2: twentieth century, it came from my father in the Sid 50 00:03:07,480 --> 00:03:10,639 Speaker 2: Caesar Show. You had Neil Simon, and like I said, 51 00:03:10,720 --> 00:03:14,560 Speaker 2: mel Brooks and Woody Allen and Larry Gelbart, all these 52 00:03:14,600 --> 00:03:18,040 Speaker 2: great writers writing some of the funniest things you ever 53 00:03:18,080 --> 00:03:21,400 Speaker 2: can imagine. And that's the atmosphere that I grew up in. 54 00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:23,960 Speaker 1: And then when you're superty young, you go to the 55 00:03:24,000 --> 00:03:27,919 Speaker 1: Bucks County Playhouse, which was a fairly famous local playhouse 56 00:03:27,919 --> 00:03:31,040 Speaker 1: in NewHope, Pennsylvania, and again you're working with people who 57 00:03:31,040 --> 00:03:31,760 Speaker 1: become famous. 58 00:03:32,080 --> 00:03:35,240 Speaker 2: Yeah. I was an apprentice, you know, I was building scenery, 59 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:38,400 Speaker 2: painting sets and things like that. I wasn't anybody in 60 00:03:38,400 --> 00:03:41,360 Speaker 2: those days. But yeah, I mean, you know, merv Griffin 61 00:03:41,440 --> 00:03:44,960 Speaker 2: came and did a show, and Alan Ald and Shelley Berman. 62 00:03:45,080 --> 00:03:47,720 Speaker 2: All these people came through and it was a great 63 00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:50,680 Speaker 2: exposure and a great way. It was my first job. 64 00:03:50,760 --> 00:03:53,080 Speaker 2: I guess you would say didn't get paid for it, 65 00:03:53,160 --> 00:03:55,040 Speaker 2: but it was my first job in show business. 66 00:03:55,240 --> 00:03:58,080 Speaker 1: Well, and I didn't realize that your writing career starts 67 00:03:58,080 --> 00:04:01,560 Speaker 1: with his mother's brother's Comedy Hour, and your writing partner 68 00:04:01,600 --> 00:04:03,920 Speaker 1: is one of the great comedians of our time, Steve Martin. 69 00:04:04,000 --> 00:04:06,840 Speaker 1: I mean, what was it like to interact regularly with Steve? 70 00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:09,840 Speaker 2: Well, we were the two youngest. I was twenty one, 71 00:04:09,920 --> 00:04:11,800 Speaker 2: Steve was twenty three, So I think they threw us 72 00:04:11,800 --> 00:04:14,440 Speaker 2: together because we were the youngest ones. And we wrote 73 00:04:14,480 --> 00:04:17,839 Speaker 2: a couple of great sketches and it was fun. Because 74 00:04:18,279 --> 00:04:21,520 Speaker 2: we were young. We didn't know Tommy Smothers was always 75 00:04:21,520 --> 00:04:23,599 Speaker 2: fighting with the censors. I mean, we were at a 76 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:26,239 Speaker 2: time when there was a lot going on in the world. 77 00:04:26,279 --> 00:04:28,920 Speaker 2: We had the Vietnam War, we had the civil rights 78 00:04:28,960 --> 00:04:32,520 Speaker 2: movement heating up, and the women's movement, and we wrote 79 00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:35,760 Speaker 2: some very cutting edge things, and Tommy always had a 80 00:04:35,800 --> 00:04:38,640 Speaker 2: fight with the censors. He was always fighting, and I 81 00:04:38,680 --> 00:04:41,320 Speaker 2: didn't understand, why can't we just put this on you know, 82 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:43,640 Speaker 2: why can't we just do this because you're a young kid, 83 00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:45,640 Speaker 2: you don't know any different. But Tommy was, and he 84 00:04:45,760 --> 00:04:48,720 Speaker 2: just passed away recently too, and you know, I miss 85 00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:51,520 Speaker 2: him and Norman Lee or my dad. I was talking 86 00:04:51,520 --> 00:04:54,360 Speaker 2: to my friend Albert Brooks and I said, all these 87 00:04:54,400 --> 00:04:57,440 Speaker 2: people are dying around me and he said, well. 88 00:04:57,279 --> 00:05:03,440 Speaker 1: Move well, you know, and it's fascinating because you are 89 00:05:03,520 --> 00:05:05,840 Speaker 1: part of a generation of comedians that years ago, I 90 00:05:05,880 --> 00:05:08,720 Speaker 1: read Steve Allen's book The Funny Man, and there's this 91 00:05:08,760 --> 00:05:12,160 Speaker 1: whole pattern of comedy and people learning from each other 92 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:16,919 Speaker 1: and sort of grows on itself and it evolves, it does. 93 00:05:17,000 --> 00:05:19,360 Speaker 2: I mean, you take from each other. I mean, you know, 94 00:05:19,440 --> 00:05:23,280 Speaker 2: you can't help but be influenced. I mean I was very, 95 00:05:23,400 --> 00:05:26,760 Speaker 2: very lucky in that I had two men in my life, 96 00:05:27,160 --> 00:05:31,279 Speaker 2: my father obviously and Norman Lear, who were great role models, 97 00:05:31,320 --> 00:05:34,000 Speaker 2: and I looked up to them. People always ask me, well, 98 00:05:34,000 --> 00:05:36,559 Speaker 2: did they give you advice? And so on. They don't 99 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:39,440 Speaker 2: sit you down and give you advice. The advice they 100 00:05:39,560 --> 00:05:43,960 Speaker 2: give is you observe how they live, and that's the 101 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:47,640 Speaker 2: best advice you can get. Is they model how to 102 00:05:47,680 --> 00:05:50,880 Speaker 2: be with other people, how to create, how to do 103 00:05:50,960 --> 00:05:53,360 Speaker 2: what they do. And that's what I took from both 104 00:05:53,400 --> 00:05:55,920 Speaker 2: of them. I learned from my dad how to handle 105 00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:59,479 Speaker 2: being famous and you know, dealing with the world. And 106 00:05:59,560 --> 00:06:02,400 Speaker 2: I learned from Norman that you can take your fame, 107 00:06:02,480 --> 00:06:06,160 Speaker 2: your celebrity and whatever, and you can create things, and 108 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:09,160 Speaker 2: you can also use them for good. You know, if 109 00:06:09,160 --> 00:06:12,480 Speaker 2: there's issues that you care about, you can promote them 110 00:06:12,880 --> 00:06:15,840 Speaker 2: through your celebrity, and I've fortunately been able to do 111 00:06:15,880 --> 00:06:16,560 Speaker 2: that as well. 112 00:06:16,760 --> 00:06:20,719 Speaker 1: The great breakthrough in your career, which leads to everything else, 113 00:06:21,200 --> 00:06:24,800 Speaker 1: is when you play Meathead on All in the Family, 114 00:06:24,880 --> 00:06:28,720 Speaker 1: which was a huge hit and you won two Primetime 115 00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:31,640 Speaker 1: Emmy Awards. It's a great role, and of course it's 116 00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:33,880 Speaker 1: part of the reason that it's an honor for me 117 00:06:33,920 --> 00:06:36,159 Speaker 1: to be interviewing you, because you are so much a 118 00:06:36,200 --> 00:06:38,440 Speaker 1: part of my life. How did you end up with 119 00:06:38,520 --> 00:06:38,960 Speaker 1: that role? 120 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:43,160 Speaker 2: Well, you know, it's interesting because normally did two pilots 121 00:06:43,200 --> 00:06:48,279 Speaker 2: with ABC and they didn't sell. And I auditioned for 122 00:06:48,480 --> 00:06:50,400 Speaker 2: one of those pilots and I didn't get the part. 123 00:06:50,960 --> 00:06:53,880 Speaker 2: But then I guess I matured a little bit, I 124 00:06:53,920 --> 00:06:55,840 Speaker 2: got a little better as an actor, and he saw 125 00:06:55,880 --> 00:06:57,919 Speaker 2: me in some things that I did, and then I 126 00:06:57,960 --> 00:07:01,520 Speaker 2: went and auditioned a second time, and this time I 127 00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:04,719 Speaker 2: got the part, and oddly enough I auditioned with my 128 00:07:05,480 --> 00:07:08,600 Speaker 2: soon to be wife, Penny Marshall, who passed away a 129 00:07:08,640 --> 00:07:11,680 Speaker 2: little while ago, and Penny didn't get the part. Sally 130 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:14,480 Speaker 2: Struthers did and the rest, as they say, is history. 131 00:07:14,920 --> 00:07:17,240 Speaker 1: Well, and you had Carol O'Connor and Jeans Stable. To me, 132 00:07:17,320 --> 00:07:20,240 Speaker 1: the four of you made such a great troop, if 133 00:07:20,280 --> 00:07:22,679 Speaker 1: you will, the chemistry seemed amazing. 134 00:07:23,280 --> 00:07:26,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, the chemistry was incredible, And you know, when you're 135 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:28,640 Speaker 2: making a show like that, and we did eight seasons, 136 00:07:28,640 --> 00:07:32,880 Speaker 2: We did over two hundred episodes, and you know, you 137 00:07:32,920 --> 00:07:37,960 Speaker 2: spend more time with those people in your TV family 138 00:07:38,000 --> 00:07:39,960 Speaker 2: than you do it with your real family, because you're 139 00:07:39,960 --> 00:07:43,800 Speaker 2: there for you know, ten, twelve, sometimes fourteen hours a day, 140 00:07:44,160 --> 00:07:47,000 Speaker 2: and so it becomes a family. And we wore a family. 141 00:07:47,360 --> 00:07:49,640 Speaker 2: We loved each other and we supported each other and 142 00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:51,520 Speaker 2: it was an incredible experience. 143 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:53,880 Speaker 1: How much of the chemistry was Norman Lear? 144 00:07:54,600 --> 00:07:57,920 Speaker 2: Oh, a lot, a lot. Recently, I was on the 145 00:07:58,040 --> 00:08:02,040 Speaker 2: Emmy Awards show program and Sally Struthers and I introduced 146 00:08:02,120 --> 00:08:05,800 Speaker 2: the clip package that was about immemoriam the people who 147 00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:09,560 Speaker 2: had passed away in the last year, and it started 148 00:08:09,560 --> 00:08:12,000 Speaker 2: with Norman Lear. And one thing I said about Norman, 149 00:08:12,040 --> 00:08:15,960 Speaker 2: aside from all the great things he did and the 150 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:18,960 Speaker 2: culture he changed by the work he did, was that 151 00:08:19,040 --> 00:08:21,600 Speaker 2: I called him it's a Yiddish phrase. I called him 152 00:08:21,840 --> 00:08:25,120 Speaker 2: a cook level. It's a Yiddish phrase that means ladle. 153 00:08:25,240 --> 00:08:28,920 Speaker 2: It's something that stirs the pot. And that's what Norman did. 154 00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:32,120 Speaker 2: He stirred the pot. He always tried to get the 155 00:08:32,160 --> 00:08:35,880 Speaker 2: best out of you, and he said, dig into your cls, 156 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:38,440 Speaker 2: find out what you feel and what you believe, and 157 00:08:38,520 --> 00:08:41,160 Speaker 2: we'll get that into the scripts. And so he did that. 158 00:08:41,440 --> 00:08:45,200 Speaker 2: He was a tremendous catalyst for all the success of 159 00:08:45,280 --> 00:08:47,800 Speaker 2: not just All in the Family, but the Jeffersons and 160 00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:50,200 Speaker 2: Maud and Good Times and one day at a time, 161 00:08:50,200 --> 00:08:52,480 Speaker 2: all the shows that he had. I think he had 162 00:08:52,520 --> 00:08:57,559 Speaker 2: like eight primetime shows on at one time, which is astounding. 163 00:08:57,880 --> 00:09:00,520 Speaker 1: It was remarkable. Now you took all that experience, in 164 00:09:00,600 --> 00:09:04,160 Speaker 1: that knowledge, and you become a director, starting with a 165 00:09:04,200 --> 00:09:08,000 Speaker 1: film I've always liked, which is the heavy metal mockumentary 166 00:09:08,400 --> 00:09:10,640 Speaker 1: this is Spinal Tap. First of all, what inspired you 167 00:09:10,679 --> 00:09:13,600 Speaker 1: to become a director, And second why that show is 168 00:09:13,600 --> 00:09:14,480 Speaker 1: your launch point? 169 00:09:15,160 --> 00:09:18,200 Speaker 2: Well, I always wanted to direct, even before I did 170 00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:21,200 Speaker 2: All the Family. When I was nineteen, I was at 171 00:09:21,320 --> 00:09:26,040 Speaker 2: UCLA and I formed an improvisational group and was called 172 00:09:26,080 --> 00:09:29,240 Speaker 2: The Session, and I directed it and acted in it, 173 00:09:29,360 --> 00:09:31,920 Speaker 2: and we got a theater on Sunset, and I did 174 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:35,400 Speaker 2: that for a while. I directed plays and Los Angeles, 175 00:09:35,640 --> 00:09:38,440 Speaker 2: and so when I got All the Family, it basically 176 00:09:38,720 --> 00:09:41,920 Speaker 2: was kind of interrupting in a weird way my directing career, 177 00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:44,360 Speaker 2: which is what I always wanted to do. So that 178 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:46,960 Speaker 2: was something I wanted to do from the get go. Now, 179 00:09:47,240 --> 00:09:51,440 Speaker 2: Spinal Tap came to be because I was talking to 180 00:09:51,520 --> 00:09:55,480 Speaker 2: Harry Sheer, who plays Derek Small's in the film, and 181 00:09:55,520 --> 00:09:59,360 Speaker 2: we had an idea to do a film called Roadie 182 00:09:59,559 --> 00:10:01,800 Speaker 2: and it was all about the road managers and the 183 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:05,360 Speaker 2: behind the scenes for rock and Roll. Now. In nineteen 184 00:10:05,400 --> 00:10:09,480 Speaker 2: seventy eight, Harry and myself and Chris Guest who plays Nigel, 185 00:10:09,559 --> 00:10:13,040 Speaker 2: and Michael McKean who plays David sat humans. We did 186 00:10:13,040 --> 00:10:16,079 Speaker 2: a TV show called The TV Show of All Things, 187 00:10:16,280 --> 00:10:19,280 Speaker 2: and it was a satire of various things on television, 188 00:10:19,400 --> 00:10:23,640 Speaker 2: sitcoms and commercials and telethons, all kinds of stuff. And 189 00:10:23,679 --> 00:10:25,440 Speaker 2: one of the things we did to take off was 190 00:10:25,840 --> 00:10:29,040 Speaker 2: Saturday night. It was called Midnight Special and it was 191 00:10:29,080 --> 00:10:32,000 Speaker 2: a rock and roll program that came on Saturday night 192 00:10:32,200 --> 00:10:34,480 Speaker 2: and I played wolf Man Jack and we had this 193 00:10:34,600 --> 00:10:37,079 Speaker 2: band called Spinal Tap, and this is the first time 194 00:10:37,080 --> 00:10:39,200 Speaker 2: they ever appeared, and they did a song called rock 195 00:10:39,240 --> 00:10:42,040 Speaker 2: and Roll Nightmare. And during the time we were working 196 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:45,720 Speaker 2: on it, between takes, Harry and Michael and Chris started 197 00:10:45,760 --> 00:10:48,640 Speaker 2: ad libbing, you know, as these British rock and roll guys, 198 00:10:48,920 --> 00:10:50,640 Speaker 2: and so down the Road we said, hey, you know, 199 00:10:50,720 --> 00:10:52,720 Speaker 2: maybe we could do something with these guys. We'll do 200 00:10:53,160 --> 00:10:56,200 Speaker 2: a movie about them. And so that eventually Down the 201 00:10:56,240 --> 00:10:58,720 Speaker 2: Road became the basis for Spinal Tap. 202 00:10:58,600 --> 00:11:01,520 Speaker 1: In a sense, because Spinal Tap was humor and that 203 00:11:01,600 --> 00:11:03,880 Speaker 1: kind of goes out of a lot of your background experience. 204 00:11:04,160 --> 00:11:07,200 Speaker 1: But when I think about, for example, A Few Good Men, 205 00:11:07,840 --> 00:11:11,480 Speaker 1: that is a long way from humor. That's very different. 206 00:11:12,280 --> 00:11:16,199 Speaker 2: Yeah, there's some comedy in it, but basically it's a drama. 207 00:11:16,480 --> 00:11:19,360 Speaker 2: I mean, it's a serious drama and it's based on 208 00:11:19,400 --> 00:11:23,040 Speaker 2: a true story. Actually, Aaron Sorkin's sister was in the 209 00:11:23,160 --> 00:11:27,640 Speaker 2: jag Coars during this period, and there was a colonel 210 00:11:28,080 --> 00:11:32,320 Speaker 2: who was on this military base in Bontanamo, and he 211 00:11:32,920 --> 00:11:38,000 Speaker 2: did get court martialed because he illegally ordered a code 212 00:11:38,040 --> 00:11:42,679 Speaker 2: read done on a marine that was under his auspices. 213 00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:46,320 Speaker 2: And they had a trial and he eventually left the 214 00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:49,640 Speaker 2: Marine Corps, and you know, it was kind of uncomfortable, 215 00:11:49,920 --> 00:11:53,040 Speaker 2: and that became the basis for the play A Few 216 00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:56,320 Speaker 2: Good Men, which Aaron wrote and was on Broadway and 217 00:11:56,400 --> 00:11:58,320 Speaker 2: then we adapted it for the screen. 218 00:11:58,800 --> 00:12:01,160 Speaker 1: No, it's a very very power, powerful movie. 219 00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:02,000 Speaker 2: Thanks. Thanks. 220 00:12:02,080 --> 00:12:04,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, of all your films, and I have such a 221 00:12:04,440 --> 00:12:06,840 Speaker 1: broad range, is there anyone you look back and you 222 00:12:06,880 --> 00:12:08,640 Speaker 1: say that's my favorite. 223 00:12:08,400 --> 00:12:11,960 Speaker 2: Well, you know, Newt it's like all your children. We 224 00:12:12,040 --> 00:12:17,120 Speaker 2: love them all, even the ones who are rotten at times. 225 00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:19,640 Speaker 2: But no, I think I don't know if it's my 226 00:12:19,679 --> 00:12:21,720 Speaker 2: best film. But the one that means the most to 227 00:12:21,760 --> 00:12:24,680 Speaker 2: me is Stand by Me because it was the first 228 00:12:24,760 --> 00:12:28,400 Speaker 2: time in my life that I did a film that 229 00:12:28,600 --> 00:12:32,640 Speaker 2: really reflected my personality. You know, my father started doing 230 00:12:32,679 --> 00:12:35,320 Speaker 2: satire and you know, as you just pointed out, spinal 231 00:12:35,360 --> 00:12:37,720 Speaker 2: Tap was a satire. Then I did a small film 232 00:12:37,760 --> 00:12:40,640 Speaker 2: called The Sure Thing, which is a romantic comedy about 233 00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:43,400 Speaker 2: young people. And my dad had done a number of 234 00:12:43,480 --> 00:12:46,360 Speaker 2: romantic comedies. But stand By Me was the first time 235 00:12:46,400 --> 00:12:49,559 Speaker 2: I did something that had humor in it. It had nostalgia, 236 00:12:49,640 --> 00:12:52,480 Speaker 2: it had melancholy, it had all these elements, and it 237 00:12:52,600 --> 00:12:57,360 Speaker 2: was more reflective of my personality. And so when it 238 00:12:57,360 --> 00:13:01,240 Speaker 2: became successful, it validated the things I wanted to do, 239 00:13:01,280 --> 00:13:04,959 Speaker 2: and I've tried to marry drama and humor in most 240 00:13:04,960 --> 00:13:05,840 Speaker 2: of the things I do. 241 00:13:06,200 --> 00:13:08,040 Speaker 1: You had an amazing run there because you do stand 242 00:13:08,040 --> 00:13:10,520 Speaker 1: by Me in eighty six. You come back with an 243 00:13:10,679 --> 00:13:13,640 Speaker 1: iconic film, The Princess Bride in eighty seven, and I 244 00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:16,880 Speaker 1: would argue an equally iconic film when Harry met Sally 245 00:13:17,200 --> 00:13:19,160 Speaker 1: in eighty nine. I mean you were on a real 246 00:13:19,240 --> 00:13:20,360 Speaker 1: role at that point. 247 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:23,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And when Harry met Sally. There's a good 248 00:13:23,160 --> 00:13:25,680 Speaker 2: story about this, which is, not only did my mother 249 00:13:25,760 --> 00:13:28,720 Speaker 2: say that line, I'll have what she's having, but I 250 00:13:28,920 --> 00:13:31,640 Speaker 2: met my wife, who I will be married to for 251 00:13:31,720 --> 00:13:36,400 Speaker 2: thirty five years in May. I met her making that film, 252 00:13:36,600 --> 00:13:41,240 Speaker 2: and I changed the ending of the film because I 253 00:13:41,280 --> 00:13:43,280 Speaker 2: met her while we were making the film. I had 254 00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:46,600 Speaker 2: been single for ten years. After having been married for 255 00:13:46,640 --> 00:13:49,320 Speaker 2: ten years, I was now divorced and single. I was 256 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:52,520 Speaker 2: making a mess, a complete mess. Of my dating life. 257 00:13:52,800 --> 00:13:54,880 Speaker 2: You know, I was with this one. I broke up. 258 00:13:54,920 --> 00:13:56,920 Speaker 2: I couldn't make it work with this one. It was 259 00:13:56,960 --> 00:13:59,280 Speaker 2: all that kind of stuff, and that became the basis 260 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:02,480 Speaker 2: for when Harry met Sally. So I didn't see how 261 00:14:02,520 --> 00:14:05,600 Speaker 2: I was ever going to be with anybody. So that's 262 00:14:05,640 --> 00:14:08,800 Speaker 2: the way it ended initially that they didn't get together, 263 00:14:09,360 --> 00:14:12,080 Speaker 2: And when I met Michelle, I said, oh, I see 264 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:15,320 Speaker 2: I could be with somebody, and then then went and 265 00:14:15,400 --> 00:14:16,520 Speaker 2: changed the ending. 266 00:14:16,400 --> 00:14:17,840 Speaker 1: Which changes the whole movie. 267 00:14:18,000 --> 00:14:19,640 Speaker 2: It's the whole movie, and I think it would not 268 00:14:19,720 --> 00:14:22,080 Speaker 2: have been successful. I don't think if the two of 269 00:14:22,120 --> 00:14:23,880 Speaker 2: them hadn't gotten together at the end. 270 00:14:24,080 --> 00:14:43,880 Speaker 1: It's a remarkable film. You've done all these amazing things 271 00:14:43,880 --> 00:14:47,000 Speaker 1: as an actor, as a director, as a writer, and 272 00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:51,440 Speaker 1: then you turn your attention to JFK, which, of course, 273 00:14:51,520 --> 00:14:54,520 Speaker 1: for our generation, was one of the moments that shattered 274 00:14:54,560 --> 00:14:58,360 Speaker 1: our lives and forced us to confront that there's evil 275 00:14:58,400 --> 00:15:01,080 Speaker 1: in the world and that things can happen you can't control. 276 00:15:01,720 --> 00:15:04,960 Speaker 1: It's remarkably successful. Who Killed JFK has five and a 277 00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:08,360 Speaker 1: half million total downloads, spent weeks at number one on 278 00:15:08,400 --> 00:15:11,600 Speaker 1: Apple's Top podcast chart, has been the number one history 279 00:15:11,640 --> 00:15:14,080 Speaker 1: podcast for over two months. I mean, you're obviously hit 280 00:15:14,080 --> 00:15:16,600 Speaker 1: a home run here, but what led you into doing this? 281 00:15:17,000 --> 00:15:19,080 Speaker 1: Because it's a big project. 282 00:15:19,120 --> 00:15:22,640 Speaker 2: You'll appreciate it because if you were alive at that time, 283 00:15:23,960 --> 00:15:28,520 Speaker 2: you knew exactly where you were when you heard that news. 284 00:15:28,560 --> 00:15:32,600 Speaker 2: Nothing had ever happened like that in modern American history. 285 00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:36,240 Speaker 2: A president being gunned down in broad daylight on an 286 00:15:36,280 --> 00:15:40,720 Speaker 2: American street. It was just shocking. It was a national trauma. 287 00:15:41,080 --> 00:15:43,920 Speaker 2: And I remember I was sixteen at the time. I 288 00:15:44,040 --> 00:15:47,320 Speaker 2: was in physics class in high school and a kid 289 00:15:47,360 --> 00:15:50,320 Speaker 2: came in whispered in the teacher's ear, and future turned 290 00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:53,880 Speaker 2: to us and said, I have some terrible news, and 291 00:15:53,960 --> 00:15:56,720 Speaker 2: he told us what had happened, and we were all 292 00:15:56,760 --> 00:16:01,280 Speaker 2: sent home from school. And I sat there like everybody else, 293 00:16:01,280 --> 00:16:04,960 Speaker 2: and watched television and watched continuously to see what was 294 00:16:05,000 --> 00:16:08,800 Speaker 2: going on. And I actually saw, like many many people did. 295 00:16:09,520 --> 00:16:12,680 Speaker 2: I watched the man who was accused of killing the president, 296 00:16:12,760 --> 00:16:17,440 Speaker 2: Lee Harvey Oswald, shot and killed himself on live television, 297 00:16:17,920 --> 00:16:20,920 Speaker 2: and never seen anything like that before, so it was 298 00:16:20,960 --> 00:16:25,120 Speaker 2: like shocking. Again. I was only seventeen. I didn't really 299 00:16:25,200 --> 00:16:30,200 Speaker 2: understand what had happened, and it wasn't until after the 300 00:16:30,240 --> 00:16:34,120 Speaker 2: Warren Commission report came out. I read this book called 301 00:16:34,200 --> 00:16:37,760 Speaker 2: Rush to Judgment by Mark Lane, and he questioned the 302 00:16:37,760 --> 00:16:41,720 Speaker 2: Warren Commission report. He started talking about things that either 303 00:16:41,760 --> 00:16:45,000 Speaker 2: didn't make sense or warrant accurate and all of this, 304 00:16:45,080 --> 00:16:46,760 Speaker 2: and I started getting interested in it. 305 00:16:46,800 --> 00:16:46,960 Speaker 1: Then. 306 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:49,800 Speaker 2: I was about nineteen, I think at the time, and 307 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:51,800 Speaker 2: I was playing at the Hungry Eye up in San 308 00:16:51,840 --> 00:16:56,000 Speaker 2: Francisco with my friend Larry Bishop, and we opened for 309 00:16:56,080 --> 00:16:58,640 Speaker 2: Carmen McCrae. And in the smaller room there was a 310 00:16:58,680 --> 00:17:01,920 Speaker 2: little room and there was median Mort Sahl, who, for 311 00:17:01,960 --> 00:17:03,760 Speaker 2: those of you who don't know who that is, he 312 00:17:03,880 --> 00:17:07,080 Speaker 2: was a very famous political satirist. He used to do 313 00:17:07,119 --> 00:17:10,800 Speaker 2: political satires. He was a comedian. But this time he 314 00:17:10,960 --> 00:17:14,280 Speaker 2: was not talking about it at all. All he talked 315 00:17:14,280 --> 00:17:16,960 Speaker 2: about was the Warren Commission Report and that it was 316 00:17:17,000 --> 00:17:19,280 Speaker 2: something wrong with it and it didn't make sense and 317 00:17:19,320 --> 00:17:21,720 Speaker 2: all this stuff. And that got me even more interested. 318 00:17:22,080 --> 00:17:26,800 Speaker 2: So from that point on, for almost sixty years, anytime 319 00:17:26,920 --> 00:17:29,520 Speaker 2: a new thing would come out, it was a book 320 00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:33,160 Speaker 2: or a new bit of evidence, or something would emerge. 321 00:17:33,359 --> 00:17:36,280 Speaker 2: I was fascinated by it. And the reason I did 322 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:40,560 Speaker 2: the podcast is because if you're not following this closely, 323 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:43,960 Speaker 2: you know, something emerges and you go, well, that's interesting, 324 00:17:44,040 --> 00:17:46,560 Speaker 2: but what does that have to do with everything else? 325 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:50,120 Speaker 2: How do you put this together? And based on everything 326 00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:53,320 Speaker 2: I had read, all the forensics experts I had talked to, 327 00:17:53,920 --> 00:17:58,520 Speaker 2: visiting Dealey Plaza many times, going to the school book depository, 328 00:17:58,600 --> 00:18:01,680 Speaker 2: going up to the sixth floor, studying that, I started 329 00:18:01,720 --> 00:18:04,879 Speaker 2: piecing it together. I went to where Oswald boarding house 330 00:18:04,920 --> 00:18:07,560 Speaker 2: where he stayed, and I started piecing it all together 331 00:18:07,640 --> 00:18:10,359 Speaker 2: with all the information. I said, I'd like to put 332 00:18:10,400 --> 00:18:14,080 Speaker 2: together what I think happened and what I believe happened 333 00:18:14,080 --> 00:18:18,240 Speaker 2: on that fateful day and for people who have not 334 00:18:18,440 --> 00:18:22,439 Speaker 2: been following it. Intimately put the pieces together so that 335 00:18:22,560 --> 00:18:24,879 Speaker 2: people who don't know much about it will get a 336 00:18:24,960 --> 00:18:27,800 Speaker 2: sense of it, and people who have been researching it 337 00:18:27,840 --> 00:18:31,080 Speaker 2: and studying it for years will maybe learn a little 338 00:18:31,080 --> 00:18:33,840 Speaker 2: bit more and put it all together. So that's what 339 00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:36,359 Speaker 2: led me to do it. And you know, in the 340 00:18:36,440 --> 00:18:39,880 Speaker 2: last six seven years, I ran into a great researcher 341 00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:43,600 Speaker 2: named Dick Russell, who wrote a book called The Man 342 00:18:43,960 --> 00:18:45,920 Speaker 2: Who Knew Too Much was all about a guy named 343 00:18:46,000 --> 00:18:49,280 Speaker 2: Richard K. Snagel who was a CIA asset who worked 344 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:52,880 Speaker 2: for the military, who was a military intelligence guy, and 345 00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:56,680 Speaker 2: he knew Lee Harvey Oswald. And I started learning about 346 00:18:57,080 --> 00:19:01,080 Speaker 2: people who knew Lee Harvey Oswald, learned about the files 347 00:19:01,119 --> 00:19:03,679 Speaker 2: that the CIA kept on Lee RV. Oswell. They have 348 00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:06,840 Speaker 2: thousands and thousands of pages of files which have been 349 00:19:06,880 --> 00:19:10,119 Speaker 2: released over the years, but in the Warrant Commission report, 350 00:19:10,800 --> 00:19:13,479 Speaker 2: there's no mention. There's like saying, we don't really know 351 00:19:13,640 --> 00:19:16,439 Speaker 2: Lee Harvey Oswell, we don't know much about him. He 352 00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:20,200 Speaker 2: was alone assassin. And then you find out there's thousands 353 00:19:20,200 --> 00:19:24,760 Speaker 2: of pages of tracking Lee Harvey Oswald for years, for 354 00:19:24,840 --> 00:19:28,639 Speaker 2: four years prior to the assassination. So you start putting 355 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:31,600 Speaker 2: all these pieces together and you learn, You learn what 356 00:19:31,960 --> 00:19:33,879 Speaker 2: this one did and what that one did. And we 357 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:38,000 Speaker 2: have eyewitnesses, people who were there that day who will 358 00:19:38,200 --> 00:19:41,480 Speaker 2: say very specific things. Listen to the podcast. You're going 359 00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:43,800 Speaker 2: to get it all. You're going to hear what happened. 360 00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:47,800 Speaker 2: And we don't put anything out there that we can't substantiate. 361 00:19:47,880 --> 00:19:52,400 Speaker 2: I mean, we named four shooters. Now, exactly where they 362 00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:56,119 Speaker 2: were positioned, we don't know, but we do know, and 363 00:19:56,240 --> 00:19:58,480 Speaker 2: this is based on hard evidence. We know that there 364 00:19:58,480 --> 00:20:03,600 Speaker 2: were four assassins present in Dallas that day. And here's 365 00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:07,119 Speaker 2: something interesting. And I didn't talk about this on the podcast, 366 00:20:07,200 --> 00:20:10,520 Speaker 2: but and I don't think John Brennan will mind me 367 00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:15,080 Speaker 2: saying this. It's not classified in any way. But I've 368 00:20:15,240 --> 00:20:18,919 Speaker 2: become friends with John Brennan over the years, and I 369 00:20:19,000 --> 00:20:21,760 Speaker 2: was having dinner with him one night, and I was 370 00:20:21,920 --> 00:20:24,920 Speaker 2: dying to ask him what he knew. You know, I'm 371 00:20:24,960 --> 00:20:27,600 Speaker 2: so steeped in it, but I didn't. I didn't ask 372 00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:30,160 Speaker 2: him because you know, I just felt awkward. And then 373 00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:31,680 Speaker 2: you know, at the end of the meal, he said 374 00:20:31,720 --> 00:20:33,719 Speaker 2: to me, so, what are you working on these days? 375 00:20:33,760 --> 00:20:36,040 Speaker 2: You know, just a casual kind of thing. And I said, well, 376 00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:39,560 Speaker 2: you know, I'm working on this idea about the Kennedy assassination. 377 00:20:40,240 --> 00:20:42,560 Speaker 2: He says, what do you think about that? And I 378 00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:46,280 Speaker 2: started to tell him the things that I thought. And 379 00:20:46,600 --> 00:20:48,760 Speaker 2: at one point I said to him, what do you 380 00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:52,399 Speaker 2: know about a man named Richard case Nagel? And he 381 00:20:52,520 --> 00:20:54,800 Speaker 2: said to me, well, what do you know about Richard 382 00:20:54,880 --> 00:20:58,320 Speaker 2: case Nagel? Like that? And I tell him what I know. 383 00:20:58,560 --> 00:21:01,000 Speaker 2: You know, the things I knew, which your all documented. 384 00:21:01,040 --> 00:21:04,520 Speaker 2: I mean, there are newspaper reports for all this, and 385 00:21:04,560 --> 00:21:07,760 Speaker 2: then at one point his wife Cathy says, John, do 386 00:21:07,800 --> 00:21:10,760 Speaker 2: you think there's any reason why Rob should not pursue this? 387 00:21:11,720 --> 00:21:14,840 Speaker 2: And all he said at the time was no, I 388 00:21:14,880 --> 00:21:17,960 Speaker 2: think it's always a good idea to revisit history, That's 389 00:21:17,960 --> 00:21:21,480 Speaker 2: all he said. And then two weeks later I got 390 00:21:21,480 --> 00:21:25,080 Speaker 2: an email from him saying that there's a man that 391 00:21:25,160 --> 00:21:27,680 Speaker 2: he worked with in the CIA. And by the way, 392 00:21:27,720 --> 00:21:30,480 Speaker 2: this guy his name is Ralph Mowatt Larson, he's in 393 00:21:30,560 --> 00:21:33,840 Speaker 2: the podcast. We interview him for the podcast. This is 394 00:21:33,880 --> 00:21:35,879 Speaker 2: a man that John worked with for twenty years. He 395 00:21:35,880 --> 00:21:38,600 Speaker 2: had been a Moscow Bureau chief for a while, and 396 00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:41,760 Speaker 2: he said he has some similar thoughts to what you 397 00:21:41,800 --> 00:21:44,040 Speaker 2: are presenting. Would you like to meet him? So I 398 00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:46,920 Speaker 2: went to DC with my wife Michelle, and we met 399 00:21:47,080 --> 00:21:50,160 Speaker 2: sat down, had dinner with him, and he did lay 400 00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:55,280 Speaker 2: out a similar idea to what we had. Oddly enough, 401 00:21:55,359 --> 00:21:58,480 Speaker 2: he named one of the people that he believed was 402 00:21:58,520 --> 00:22:00,399 Speaker 2: one of the shooters, and it was one of the 403 00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:04,200 Speaker 2: shooters that we had already identified, a fellow named Jack Cannon, 404 00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:08,199 Speaker 2: who we talk about in the podcast. But essentially what 405 00:22:08,359 --> 00:22:11,680 Speaker 2: he said it had in his mind. It had all 406 00:22:11,720 --> 00:22:16,440 Speaker 2: the ear marks and the markings of a rogue CIA 407 00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:20,280 Speaker 2: operation and how it was done, and so you know, 408 00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:23,200 Speaker 2: it kind of corroborated the way in which I thought 409 00:22:23,200 --> 00:22:25,560 Speaker 2: about it. But you have to understand, this is not 410 00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:28,720 Speaker 2: a from the top bottom kind of thing. No paper 411 00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:31,000 Speaker 2: trail for this. You're not going to say, somebody's gonna 412 00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:32,800 Speaker 2: write down, well, we're going to kill a president today, 413 00:22:32,840 --> 00:22:35,280 Speaker 2: here's your job, here's your job. You know, it doesn't 414 00:22:35,320 --> 00:22:38,240 Speaker 2: work that way. It's done in very clandestine ways. And 415 00:22:38,280 --> 00:22:41,920 Speaker 2: we get into how this could happen and the allies 416 00:22:41,960 --> 00:22:44,720 Speaker 2: that they had, and we try to approach it like 417 00:22:44,920 --> 00:22:48,680 Speaker 2: a crime, and we call it the greatest murder mystery 418 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:51,320 Speaker 2: in American history, and we approach it the way you 419 00:22:51,359 --> 00:22:55,280 Speaker 2: would an investigation, which is, who are the suspects, who 420 00:22:55,400 --> 00:22:58,560 Speaker 2: had motive, what are the forensics, and then you start 421 00:22:58,560 --> 00:23:02,159 Speaker 2: to put it together. And it's obviously it's a circumstantial case, 422 00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:05,040 Speaker 2: but if you put the pieces together, you start to 423 00:23:05,119 --> 00:23:07,200 Speaker 2: form a picture that's fairly clear. 424 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:10,159 Speaker 1: Well, it's justly because you were so exhaustive about this, 425 00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:14,040 Speaker 1: and like you, that was one of the defining moments 426 00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:18,359 Speaker 1: of my life. But I have a similar passion about 427 00:23:18,359 --> 00:23:21,440 Speaker 1: what exactly happened and I'm pretty convinced that the War 428 00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:24,280 Speaker 1: and Commission was a cover up. You make the case 429 00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:28,280 Speaker 1: that Texas Governor John Connolly said for his whole life 430 00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:30,639 Speaker 1: that he was not hit by the same bullet. 431 00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:34,240 Speaker 2: No, no, he's always said that till the day died. 432 00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:38,000 Speaker 2: And we know that that's true because the Warrant Commission 433 00:23:38,080 --> 00:23:41,440 Speaker 2: had a real problem. They had a real problem, which 434 00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:45,240 Speaker 2: is they said there were only three shots that came 435 00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:49,040 Speaker 2: from the sixth floor of the book depository. Now, the 436 00:23:49,119 --> 00:23:54,360 Speaker 2: problem they had was that the first shot missed and 437 00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:57,639 Speaker 2: it hit a curb and a little piece of concrete 438 00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:01,520 Speaker 2: was flicked up, hit a bystander named James Tag in 439 00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:03,840 Speaker 2: the cheek and his cheeks started to bleed all of 440 00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:06,520 Speaker 2: a sudden. So now they're down to two shots. They 441 00:24:06,520 --> 00:24:09,440 Speaker 2: have only got two shots. We know a shot hit 442 00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:12,080 Speaker 2: President Kennedy in the head. You can see it on 443 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:15,960 Speaker 2: the Zappruter film. So that's one shot. So that leaves 444 00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:19,159 Speaker 2: one bullet left, and that one bullet has to do 445 00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:22,600 Speaker 2: a lot of stuff. First of all, the autopsy diagram 446 00:24:22,640 --> 00:24:26,439 Speaker 2: show that a bullet entered Kennedy's back about six to 447 00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:30,600 Speaker 2: eight inches below his neck. The one they're talking about, 448 00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:33,320 Speaker 2: which they call the single bullet theory, by the way, 449 00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:36,679 Speaker 2: was developed by Arlen Spector, who was a counsel to 450 00:24:36,720 --> 00:24:40,080 Speaker 2: the Warrant Commission at the time. The bullet goes into 451 00:24:40,160 --> 00:24:43,560 Speaker 2: Kennedy's back six to eight inches below his neck, then 452 00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:49,320 Speaker 2: travels up and comes out his throat, then makes a turn. 453 00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:53,359 Speaker 2: This would have had to what happened. Hits Connelly in 454 00:24:53,440 --> 00:24:57,080 Speaker 2: the armpit, in the ribs, and then makes another turn, 455 00:24:57,720 --> 00:25:01,320 Speaker 2: breaking some of his wristbones. That makes another turn and 456 00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:06,280 Speaker 2: goes into his thigh. It's ridiculous. It's absolutely ridiculous. It 457 00:25:06,320 --> 00:25:08,960 Speaker 2: makes no sense. And by the way, the bullet that 458 00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:13,080 Speaker 2: they said did that winds up as Evidence number three 459 00:25:13,240 --> 00:25:15,560 Speaker 2: ninety nine. You can see it. It's in the archives. 460 00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:18,880 Speaker 2: It's also in the Warrant Commission report. It's virtually a 461 00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:23,159 Speaker 2: pristine bullet. Has a little striations on the tip of it, 462 00:25:23,560 --> 00:25:26,040 Speaker 2: but other than that it is pristine. And they say 463 00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:30,480 Speaker 2: it wound up on the stretcher of Connolly. And so 464 00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:34,320 Speaker 2: this came out during the podcast while we're doing the podcast. 465 00:25:34,640 --> 00:25:36,879 Speaker 2: It came out this guy Paul Landis, who was a 466 00:25:36,920 --> 00:25:40,639 Speaker 2: Secret Service agent who was in the trail car behind 467 00:25:40,880 --> 00:25:44,760 Speaker 2: Kennedy's car, who's on the running board and witnessed the 468 00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:48,080 Speaker 2: whole thing. He said, the bullet that hit Kennedy in 469 00:25:48,119 --> 00:25:51,679 Speaker 2: the head, he said, brain matter and skull matter was 470 00:25:51,840 --> 00:25:55,320 Speaker 2: flying at him, flying in his direction, and he had 471 00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:57,240 Speaker 2: a duck to miss all this stuff that was coming 472 00:25:57,280 --> 00:26:00,840 Speaker 2: at him. Then when they arrived at Parkland Hospital, he 473 00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:04,320 Speaker 2: was in charge of helping missus Kennedy up. He helped 474 00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:07,000 Speaker 2: her up, They got the president out, getting him into 475 00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:10,600 Speaker 2: the hospital. When he helped her up, he noticed there 476 00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:13,399 Speaker 2: was a pool of blood in the backseat of the limo, 477 00:26:13,760 --> 00:26:16,919 Speaker 2: and then resting on the head part of the seat 478 00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:21,600 Speaker 2: was this bullet. This bullet that became the one that 479 00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:25,280 Speaker 2: was in the archives. And he didn't testify at all, 480 00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:28,080 Speaker 2: and the Warren Commission, by the way, never asked for it. 481 00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:32,080 Speaker 2: Not only his testimony, but no Secret Service testimony was 482 00:26:32,080 --> 00:26:35,199 Speaker 2: in the Warrant Commission. So years later he saw this 483 00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:38,160 Speaker 2: bullet and he said, Hey, that's my bullet. That's the bullet. 484 00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:40,840 Speaker 2: He picked it up because he thought, this is an 485 00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:43,720 Speaker 2: important piece of evidence. I don't want it somebody grab 486 00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:46,520 Speaker 2: it for a souvenir. He put it in his pocket 487 00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:50,080 Speaker 2: and he went into the emergency room and he took 488 00:26:50,119 --> 00:26:53,000 Speaker 2: the bullet and he put it by Kennedy's body, thinking that, 489 00:26:53,119 --> 00:26:55,840 Speaker 2: you know, they'd find it or whatever. But the point 490 00:26:56,000 --> 00:26:59,560 Speaker 2: is that's not a bullet that went through Connelly because 491 00:26:59,600 --> 00:27:02,119 Speaker 2: it's there in the backseat of the car. So the 492 00:27:02,160 --> 00:27:04,840 Speaker 2: whole thing, it just corroborates the whole idea of the 493 00:27:05,119 --> 00:27:07,760 Speaker 2: crazy single bullet theory. But they had to have that 494 00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:11,480 Speaker 2: theory otherwise they couldn't pin it all on Oswald. Now 495 00:27:11,560 --> 00:27:14,000 Speaker 2: we're not saying there wasn't a shooter up on the 496 00:27:14,040 --> 00:27:16,680 Speaker 2: sixth floor. There was. There was, and there were witnesses 497 00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:20,639 Speaker 2: who saw a shooter on the sixth floor, but that's 498 00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:24,560 Speaker 2: not the whole story. There were other shooters in other positions. 499 00:27:24,880 --> 00:27:28,200 Speaker 2: Based on the forensics, we can pretty well place where 500 00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:29,120 Speaker 2: those shooters were. 501 00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:31,880 Speaker 1: And you think there were four of them. 502 00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:34,840 Speaker 2: Well, I think they're either four or five. We didn't 503 00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:39,280 Speaker 2: say five only because we couldn't identify five assassins in 504 00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:43,600 Speaker 2: Dallas that day. Most people think they were four to five. 505 00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:46,560 Speaker 2: There are some people think only two. But if you 506 00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:49,520 Speaker 2: look at the forensics and you study it, it couldn't 507 00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:52,879 Speaker 2: have been done in two positions. We say yes, the 508 00:27:53,119 --> 00:27:56,919 Speaker 2: school book depository, sixth floor what has become to be 509 00:27:57,000 --> 00:28:00,359 Speaker 2: known as the Grassy Knoll where some shots came from. 510 00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:04,160 Speaker 2: There's a building behind Houston Street called the dal Text Building, 511 00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:07,680 Speaker 2: which easily could have accounted for some of the wounds 512 00:28:07,800 --> 00:28:11,960 Speaker 2: from there. And then there's the Southknoll, the area and 513 00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:15,639 Speaker 2: the overpass and the Southknoll, and we have witnesses who 514 00:28:15,720 --> 00:28:18,640 Speaker 2: said shots game from there. This guy named Tosh Plumbley 515 00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:22,399 Speaker 2: who's in the documentary, who was a CIA asset whose 516 00:28:22,520 --> 00:28:26,240 Speaker 2: job that day was to fly Johnny Roselli and E 517 00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:30,240 Speaker 2: Howard Hunt to Dallas that day. We talked to E. 518 00:28:30,359 --> 00:28:35,159 Speaker 2: Howard Hunt's son, Saint John Hunt, and asked him, you know, 519 00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:38,200 Speaker 2: because his father told him that he was in Dallas 520 00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:40,920 Speaker 2: that day. And we asked Saint John, well, what was 521 00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:44,160 Speaker 2: your father doing. He was a CIA at the time. 522 00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:47,280 Speaker 2: People know E Howard Hunt from the Watergate plumbers and 523 00:28:47,320 --> 00:28:50,160 Speaker 2: the burglars at Watergate, but he was in the CIA 524 00:28:50,200 --> 00:28:51,640 Speaker 2: at the time. And I asked Saint John, I said, 525 00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:53,920 Speaker 2: what was your father doing there that day? And he 526 00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:56,360 Speaker 2: told me he was a benchwarmer And I said, well, 527 00:28:56,360 --> 00:29:00,280 Speaker 2: what's a benchwarmer? And he said, if anything went wrong, 528 00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:04,400 Speaker 2: he knew every single safe house in that area. He 529 00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:07,680 Speaker 2: could get people out of there safely away from it. 530 00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:11,080 Speaker 2: That's what his role was. But anyway, Tosh Plumbley flew 531 00:29:11,080 --> 00:29:13,760 Speaker 2: them in and he was on the South Knoll opposite 532 00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:16,200 Speaker 2: the Grassyn and he said, yeah, a shot came from there. 533 00:29:16,600 --> 00:29:18,719 Speaker 2: He said, he knows a shot came from there. And 534 00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:20,560 Speaker 2: when you look at all the forensics and you talk 535 00:29:20,600 --> 00:29:23,880 Speaker 2: to forensics experts, they'll tell you that one of the 536 00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:27,080 Speaker 2: head shots came from that area. And then a lot 537 00:29:27,080 --> 00:29:30,440 Speaker 2: of people believe there was also shot from the County 538 00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:34,240 Speaker 2: Records building, which was also across the street, across Houston Street, 539 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:37,120 Speaker 2: and that also makes sense to But we couldn't identify 540 00:29:37,240 --> 00:29:40,440 Speaker 2: five shooters, but we certainly know that the four that 541 00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:43,640 Speaker 2: we identified were in Dallas that day and they were 542 00:29:43,760 --> 00:29:47,240 Speaker 2: mob connected and they were connected also to the Cuban 543 00:29:47,320 --> 00:29:48,320 Speaker 2: exile community. 544 00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:52,800 Speaker 1: So two examples of things that were sort of slowed 545 00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:56,080 Speaker 1: down or cord up. The Zapruter film is not made 546 00:29:56,080 --> 00:29:58,400 Speaker 1: public until twelve years after the assassination. 547 00:29:59,240 --> 00:30:02,880 Speaker 2: Why was it kep hidden Well, for obvious reasons. You 548 00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:07,000 Speaker 2: can see shots coming from the front and which would 549 00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:11,960 Speaker 2: completely debunk the Warren Commission. But it was bought actually 550 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:16,640 Speaker 2: by Time magazine. They bought the rights to the Suppruder film, 551 00:30:17,120 --> 00:30:19,479 Speaker 2: and over the years they just released a couple of 552 00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:23,560 Speaker 2: still photographs, but nothing showing the film. It was not 553 00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:27,920 Speaker 2: like you're say, until over decade later that the guy, 554 00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:32,880 Speaker 2: a guy named Robert Grodin, was on the Geraldo Rivera 555 00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:36,680 Speaker 2: show with the comedian Dick Gregory and Groden worked in 556 00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:39,600 Speaker 2: a film lab where the film was sent to him. 557 00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:41,840 Speaker 2: They were asking if it could be blown up from 558 00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:45,960 Speaker 2: its original eight millimeter to thirty five millimeter and to 559 00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:49,160 Speaker 2: see if it would hold resolution. Well, he did something 560 00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:52,560 Speaker 2: he shouldn't have done, which is he sent the original 561 00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:55,400 Speaker 2: back plus the new blown up film, but he kept 562 00:30:55,400 --> 00:30:58,320 Speaker 2: a copy for himself and he looked at it and 563 00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:01,040 Speaker 2: he said, oh my god, there's a shot coming from 564 00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:04,280 Speaker 2: the front. That's ridiculous. And he went on the Viraldo 565 00:31:04,320 --> 00:31:06,800 Speaker 2: Show and for the first time they put it out there, 566 00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:09,160 Speaker 2: and we have that tape on the podcast as well. 567 00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:12,880 Speaker 2: So the public didn't know about that. And like I say, 568 00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:16,560 Speaker 2: if you look at the evidence that dropped over sixty years, 569 00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:19,840 Speaker 2: sometimes they're twenty and thirty years apart. So if you 570 00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:22,160 Speaker 2: listen to the War Commission, it came out in sixty four, 571 00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:26,760 Speaker 2: and over decade later you're saying, oh, that's the thing. 572 00:31:26,880 --> 00:31:29,560 Speaker 2: You don't put it all together. It's hard to piece 573 00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:32,720 Speaker 2: it all together. You're just thinking, oh, okay, well there's 574 00:31:32,720 --> 00:31:36,280 Speaker 2: a shot that hit Kennedy. People aren't sophisticated to say, oh, 575 00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:39,160 Speaker 2: I'm going to study the forensics on this and figure 576 00:31:39,200 --> 00:31:41,600 Speaker 2: it out. It was up to researchers to do all that. 577 00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:47,440 Speaker 1: Six decades later, there are still forty six hundred documents classified. 578 00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:52,480 Speaker 2: Right, why, Well, that's a great question. Nobody knows why. 579 00:31:52,560 --> 00:31:55,360 Speaker 2: I mean, what we've seen released up till now, and 580 00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:58,320 Speaker 2: it's been drips and drabs. I mean, there was whatever 581 00:31:58,320 --> 00:32:01,280 Speaker 2: you want to say about Oliver Stone's film, They threw 582 00:32:01,320 --> 00:32:04,440 Speaker 2: out a whole lot of ideas. They didn't really connect 583 00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:09,120 Speaker 2: the dots, they didn't really posit a specific plan. But 584 00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:13,080 Speaker 2: what it did was it got people interested in the 585 00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:17,560 Speaker 2: Kennedy assassination again. And as a result, the JFK Records 586 00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:20,600 Speaker 2: Act was passed, which said that they had to release 587 00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:23,840 Speaker 2: to the public everything that was held back over a 588 00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:27,480 Speaker 2: period of many years, and the final date came up 589 00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:31,520 Speaker 2: a few times under Obama, under Donald Trump and also 590 00:32:31,640 --> 00:32:35,280 Speaker 2: under Biden, and they kept withholding, and so we don't 591 00:32:35,280 --> 00:32:38,360 Speaker 2: know why they're withholding it or what's being withheld. But 592 00:32:38,560 --> 00:32:42,400 Speaker 2: Jefferson Morley, who does a website called JFK Facts, he 593 00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:45,640 Speaker 2: was saying that in the last number of years, we've 594 00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:48,680 Speaker 2: got all this information about the connection between oswall and 595 00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:51,520 Speaker 2: the CIA. It's there, it's right there. You can read it, 596 00:32:51,560 --> 00:32:54,200 Speaker 2: you can read about it. He said. There's probably more 597 00:32:54,680 --> 00:32:57,800 Speaker 2: information than connecting the two. He said, but the problem 598 00:32:57,920 --> 00:33:02,480 Speaker 2: is by the time these things come out, people who 599 00:33:02,520 --> 00:33:06,800 Speaker 2: were involved names that they can figure out, they're dead already, 600 00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:10,120 Speaker 2: you know, you can't talk to them. So I have 601 00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:12,280 Speaker 2: no idea what's in there. My guess is that it's 602 00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:17,840 Speaker 2: probably more CIA connections to Oswalder to other entities. One 603 00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:20,479 Speaker 2: of the big revelations and the single to me, the 604 00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:24,720 Speaker 2: one biggest, most shocking revelation that came out was, as 605 00:33:24,760 --> 00:33:28,000 Speaker 2: you said, you felt that the Warren Commission report there 606 00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:30,160 Speaker 2: was a cover up, and we believe that as well, 607 00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:33,200 Speaker 2: because there's a reason why Alan Dalles, who was the 608 00:33:33,240 --> 00:33:36,800 Speaker 2: head of the CIA during Kennedy's time, who was fired 609 00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:40,240 Speaker 2: by Kennedy after the Bay of Pigs and was put 610 00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:43,280 Speaker 2: as being a liaison between the Warren Commission and the CIA, 611 00:33:43,520 --> 00:33:47,160 Speaker 2: and no information about the CIA came into that report. 612 00:33:47,560 --> 00:33:51,200 Speaker 2: He was a gatekeeper. This is the big revelation. Only 613 00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:54,160 Speaker 2: in studying it do you find out and we name it. 614 00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:57,840 Speaker 2: There's a fellow named George joan Edes. Nobody knows that name. 615 00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:01,560 Speaker 2: It doesn't mean anything to anybody, but George Joan Edes 616 00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:06,920 Speaker 2: was the liaison to the House Select Committee on Assassinations, 617 00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:10,200 Speaker 2: which was put together in the seventies. When There's a 618 00:34:10,239 --> 00:34:12,400 Speaker 2: Bruder film came out, there was a lot more interest 619 00:34:12,680 --> 00:34:15,840 Speaker 2: and they decided to re examine that. In the seventies, 620 00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:18,960 Speaker 2: George Joan Edes was the guy who was in charge 621 00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:21,839 Speaker 2: of being a liaison to the CIA. He was an 622 00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:26,960 Speaker 2: EXCIA agent. What they didn't know. We interviewed Robert Blakey, 623 00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:29,920 Speaker 2: who was the lead counsel for the House Select Committee, 624 00:34:30,360 --> 00:34:34,080 Speaker 2: is that George Joan Edes headed up a program based 625 00:34:34,120 --> 00:34:39,719 Speaker 2: in Miami that was a counterintelligence program that developed the 626 00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:44,839 Speaker 2: assets like Lee Harvey Oswald, including Lee Harvey Oswald. So 627 00:34:45,640 --> 00:34:48,000 Speaker 2: he was furious when he heard that. He said, if 628 00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:50,080 Speaker 2: I knew then what I know now, I would have 629 00:34:50,120 --> 00:34:52,440 Speaker 2: put that guy on the stand. He was the answer 630 00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:54,560 Speaker 2: to all the questions we had as to whether or 631 00:34:54,640 --> 00:35:17,400 Speaker 2: not there was any connection between Oswald and the CIA. 632 00:35:18,760 --> 00:35:22,120 Speaker 1: As you render a judgment here because you know vastly 633 00:35:22,200 --> 00:35:25,640 Speaker 1: more than almost anybody about this. What's Oswald's role is? 634 00:35:25,640 --> 00:35:27,800 Speaker 1: Is he a dupe? Was he the setup? 635 00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:31,160 Speaker 2: He said, I was just a patsy. He said that 636 00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:35,400 Speaker 2: a number of times during his incarceration in the Dallas 637 00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:40,280 Speaker 2: police station. They had a program that started when Oswald 638 00:35:40,360 --> 00:35:42,480 Speaker 2: was seventeen. He got into the Marines. He was stationed 639 00:35:42,520 --> 00:35:44,839 Speaker 2: in North Carolina for a while at a place called 640 00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:47,879 Speaker 2: Nag's Head. Tosh Plumley, who was the guy who flew 641 00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:50,840 Speaker 2: to Moselli and Hunt to Dallas that day, he knew 642 00:35:50,840 --> 00:35:53,440 Speaker 2: Oswald there. He was part of the same program. They 643 00:35:53,440 --> 00:35:56,520 Speaker 2: were developing wayward youth. They didn't know what they were 644 00:35:56,520 --> 00:35:58,440 Speaker 2: going to do with them. Maybe there'll be an asset 645 00:35:58,480 --> 00:36:01,920 Speaker 2: somewhere down the road. They don't know, developing people. Then 646 00:36:02,160 --> 00:36:06,960 Speaker 2: he goes to Atsugi Base in Japan. He's learning radar 647 00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:10,720 Speaker 2: skills for the U two spy planes. He's learned Russian 648 00:36:10,719 --> 00:36:13,600 Speaker 2: in the meantime, comes back to America and then eventually 649 00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:18,200 Speaker 2: goes to Russia as a defector. And that was the 650 00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:22,600 Speaker 2: beginnings of what they call sheep dipping somebody down the 651 00:36:22,680 --> 00:36:26,040 Speaker 2: road as an asset. James Angleton, who was the head 652 00:36:26,040 --> 00:36:29,200 Speaker 2: of counterintelligence for the CIA at the time, was very 653 00:36:29,280 --> 00:36:33,439 Speaker 2: concerned about moles infiltrating the CIA. This was the height 654 00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:37,440 Speaker 2: of the Cold War. People were scared. The phrase better 655 00:36:37,480 --> 00:36:40,240 Speaker 2: dead than Red was running around. People were scared about 656 00:36:40,360 --> 00:36:43,279 Speaker 2: creeping Communism and that they were going to take over krus. 657 00:36:43,360 --> 00:36:46,320 Speaker 2: Jefferry famously came to the UN banged his shoe on 658 00:36:46,400 --> 00:36:48,840 Speaker 2: a table and said, we will bury you. And that 659 00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:52,319 Speaker 2: was the big thing up until Reagan and when he 660 00:36:52,320 --> 00:36:55,080 Speaker 2: said tear down this wall. We had a serious Cold 661 00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:58,759 Speaker 2: War going on between Russian and the United States. Angleton 662 00:36:58,880 --> 00:37:03,239 Speaker 2: wanted to get some moles inside the KGB and that's 663 00:37:03,600 --> 00:37:06,440 Speaker 2: a program he had and Oswald was part of that. 664 00:37:06,640 --> 00:37:09,400 Speaker 2: I mean, it didn't work out, Soka, they didn't find anything. 665 00:37:09,760 --> 00:37:12,920 Speaker 2: But he came back to America. He was not debriefed, 666 00:37:13,320 --> 00:37:16,160 Speaker 2: he was given a job right away. He was connected 667 00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:20,880 Speaker 2: to assets of the CIA to help him reacclimate into America. 668 00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:24,680 Speaker 2: And so he was being developed and like I say, 669 00:37:25,040 --> 00:37:27,080 Speaker 2: at one point they're going to call him in or not, 670 00:37:27,719 --> 00:37:30,600 Speaker 2: you know, depending on what they decided to do, so, Yeah, 671 00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:31,960 Speaker 2: he was definitely a patsy. 672 00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:34,880 Speaker 1: So in that narrative, I mean, is Jack Ruby an asset? 673 00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:38,640 Speaker 1: Here's where Jackie Ruby plays the role. And by the way, 674 00:37:39,320 --> 00:37:43,200 Speaker 1: that's the nexus point of this whole thing. Jack Ruby, 675 00:37:43,400 --> 00:37:46,480 Speaker 1: this two bit nightclub owner that owns a place called 676 00:37:46,480 --> 00:37:51,239 Speaker 1: the Carousel Club in Dallas, walks into the police station and. 677 00:37:51,320 --> 00:37:56,000 Speaker 2: Kills Lee Harvey Oswald. Why it makes no sense. The 678 00:37:56,080 --> 00:37:58,600 Speaker 2: reason he gave at the time was he wanted to 679 00:37:58,640 --> 00:38:03,400 Speaker 2: spare Jackie Kennedy a trial. It's ridiculous. It's ridiculous on 680 00:38:03,440 --> 00:38:06,719 Speaker 2: its face. When we drilled down into it and I 681 00:38:06,880 --> 00:38:10,400 Speaker 2: interviewed a guy named John Currington, he's in the podcast. 682 00:38:10,719 --> 00:38:14,720 Speaker 2: He worked for hl Hunk, the big oilman in Dallas, 683 00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:18,120 Speaker 2: and when Oswald was arrested and taken to the Dallas 684 00:38:18,200 --> 00:38:21,080 Speaker 2: Police station. Crrington was like a right hand man to 685 00:38:21,160 --> 00:38:24,200 Speaker 2: Hunt for ten fifteen years. Hunt calls him up and says, 686 00:38:24,520 --> 00:38:27,440 Speaker 2: go to the Dallas Police station and find out what 687 00:38:27,600 --> 00:38:30,400 Speaker 2: kind of security they have. So he goes down there, 688 00:38:30,719 --> 00:38:32,719 Speaker 2: he comes back and reports to Hunt. He says, there's 689 00:38:32,760 --> 00:38:35,440 Speaker 2: no security. I walked in. I had a briefcase. They 690 00:38:35,480 --> 00:38:39,160 Speaker 2: never checked that. I walked around he said, Okay, get 691 00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:43,239 Speaker 2: me Josephllo. I want a meeting with Josevello. Josephllo was 692 00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:46,560 Speaker 2: the head of the mob in the Dallas area and 693 00:38:46,600 --> 00:38:50,480 Speaker 2: it was Joseivello that then arranged for Ruby to go 694 00:38:50,520 --> 00:38:53,200 Speaker 2: in there. And what's interesting the thing about Ruby is 695 00:38:53,880 --> 00:38:57,200 Speaker 2: when he arrived at the Dallas police station to kill Oswald, 696 00:38:57,200 --> 00:38:59,000 Speaker 2: that was in the first time he was there. He 697 00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:02,160 Speaker 2: was there two times prior to that. One time. We 698 00:39:02,239 --> 00:39:05,440 Speaker 2: have them on tape actually standing there in a press 699 00:39:05,480 --> 00:39:09,400 Speaker 2: gaggle when they're asking the DA and Oswald's right there. 700 00:39:09,719 --> 00:39:12,640 Speaker 2: Somebody asked him, was Oswald part of the Free Cuba 701 00:39:12,680 --> 00:39:15,839 Speaker 2: Committee or something like that, and there's Ruby right there 702 00:39:15,840 --> 00:39:17,840 Speaker 2: in the press gaggle. He says, no, no, it was 703 00:39:17,920 --> 00:39:21,600 Speaker 2: the Fair Play for Cuba committee. He actually corrects that. 704 00:39:22,040 --> 00:39:24,600 Speaker 2: I mean, it's crazy. It's crazy. By the way, all 705 00:39:24,680 --> 00:39:27,319 Speaker 2: the cops used to go to his club. They knew him, 706 00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:30,960 Speaker 2: and Oswald knew Ruby. I mean, we have hard evidence 707 00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:34,520 Speaker 2: of Oswald and Ruby spending time together. And that's another 708 00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:37,520 Speaker 2: thing though. Barn Commissioner said, Oswald, you know, and Ruby 709 00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:39,880 Speaker 2: never knew each other. It's not true. It's just not true. 710 00:39:40,120 --> 00:39:42,799 Speaker 1: I have to say given all the research you've done 711 00:39:42,840 --> 00:39:47,160 Speaker 1: and the remarkable penetration that your podcast is developing. At 712 00:39:47,200 --> 00:39:49,799 Speaker 1: a minimum, we ought to be able to get the 713 00:39:49,840 --> 00:39:52,080 Speaker 1: forty six hundred documents released. 714 00:39:52,440 --> 00:39:55,480 Speaker 2: You would think if you were in Congress right now, 715 00:39:56,120 --> 00:39:59,160 Speaker 2: you'd get that done, although I don't know that you 716 00:39:59,200 --> 00:40:01,960 Speaker 2: want to be in Congress these days. 717 00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:04,600 Speaker 1: Yeah. Look, I'm going to talk to some friends of 718 00:40:04,600 --> 00:40:08,960 Speaker 1: mine because I think you've done an extraordinary level of research. 719 00:40:09,160 --> 00:40:11,440 Speaker 2: Oh. Thanks. You know, I've been thinking about this, Like 720 00:40:11,480 --> 00:40:13,759 Speaker 2: I say, whenever anything new comes out, and I'm sure 721 00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:15,759 Speaker 2: some new stuff will come out if we can get 722 00:40:15,760 --> 00:40:17,960 Speaker 2: those I think it's forty eight hundred or whatever it is, 723 00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:20,439 Speaker 2: forty six to forty eight hundred, we'll get those, then 724 00:40:20,520 --> 00:40:22,319 Speaker 2: there'll be new stuff to pour over. 725 00:40:22,680 --> 00:40:25,799 Speaker 1: I was a graduate student at Tulane when the New 726 00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:28,560 Speaker 1: Orleans District Attorney decided he would solve it. 727 00:40:29,160 --> 00:40:32,560 Speaker 2: Yeah. Oh that was a mess. That thing was a mess. 728 00:40:32,880 --> 00:40:35,040 Speaker 1: So I've been in and out of this stuff for 729 00:40:35,160 --> 00:40:39,560 Speaker 1: my whole career. I think that what you've done is astonishing, 730 00:40:39,840 --> 00:40:42,960 Speaker 1: and I think who killed JFK is something that is 731 00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:46,040 Speaker 1: going to have a genuine long term impact, and it 732 00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:50,640 Speaker 1: also explains the faith we had in the system through 733 00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:55,080 Speaker 1: World War Two is shattered in nineteen sixty three, and 734 00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:57,920 Speaker 1: I think the Warren Commission is a further part of 735 00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:00,359 Speaker 1: shattering it. And we've never recovered. 736 00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:03,359 Speaker 2: One hundred percent. After the Second World War, we were 737 00:41:03,360 --> 00:41:07,000 Speaker 2: the good guys. We beat the Nazis, we were the victors, 738 00:41:07,440 --> 00:41:11,560 Speaker 2: and then this happened, and it was the beginning, and 739 00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:15,520 Speaker 2: then we get into the Vietnam War and the trust 740 00:41:15,520 --> 00:41:20,120 Speaker 2: in government starts to erode, and we're seeing it now 741 00:41:20,200 --> 00:41:23,560 Speaker 2: where trust in government is that it's lowest I think 742 00:41:23,640 --> 00:41:25,080 Speaker 2: in my lifetime, certainly. 743 00:41:25,600 --> 00:41:28,560 Speaker 1: And I think insisting on getting to the truth and 744 00:41:28,600 --> 00:41:31,000 Speaker 1: insisting on getting to the facts is part of how 745 00:41:31,040 --> 00:41:33,560 Speaker 1: you rebuild that. And I think what you've done here 746 00:41:33,640 --> 00:41:37,680 Speaker 1: is genuinely an important civic event. I'm very curious, Rob, 747 00:41:37,880 --> 00:41:40,759 Speaker 1: given that this has been amazingly successful five and a 748 00:41:40,800 --> 00:41:44,280 Speaker 1: half million downloads already and more coming, have you considered 749 00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:45,600 Speaker 1: turning it into a documentary? 750 00:41:46,080 --> 00:41:48,399 Speaker 2: Yes. As a matter of fact, I'm going to start 751 00:41:48,520 --> 00:41:51,759 Speaker 2: presenting this idea in the next week or so to 752 00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:54,560 Speaker 2: some of the streamers. Not only that, but we're in 753 00:41:54,640 --> 00:41:58,200 Speaker 2: talks of expanding this as a book, and we're going 754 00:41:58,239 --> 00:41:59,239 Speaker 2: to go out to publishers. 755 00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:01,960 Speaker 1: So yes, I could imagine this as a sex or 756 00:42:01,960 --> 00:42:05,359 Speaker 1: ten part series on Netflix or somewhere that would get 757 00:42:05,560 --> 00:42:06,480 Speaker 1: huge viewership. 758 00:42:06,560 --> 00:42:08,600 Speaker 2: I hope. So, I hope they think the same as you. 759 00:42:09,080 --> 00:42:10,400 Speaker 1: First of all, as I said to you at the 760 00:42:10,480 --> 00:42:14,200 Speaker 1: very beginning, just to be with you and the scale 761 00:42:14,200 --> 00:42:16,160 Speaker 1: of your talent and the impact you've had on all 762 00:42:16,200 --> 00:42:18,720 Speaker 1: of us. I mean, you have been in our lives 763 00:42:19,239 --> 00:42:22,040 Speaker 1: for most of my lifetime. Literally I could have talked 764 00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:23,680 Speaker 1: to you for hours and hours. But I want to 765 00:42:23,760 --> 00:42:27,320 Speaker 1: encourage all of our listeners to listen to Who Killed JFK, 766 00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:30,080 Speaker 1: which is part of iHeart Podcast. You can get it 767 00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:33,760 Speaker 1: on the iHeart app Ample podcast wherever you listen to podcasts. 768 00:42:33,760 --> 00:42:35,799 Speaker 1: And Rob, I want to thank you. This has been 769 00:42:36,200 --> 00:42:39,239 Speaker 1: one of the most exciting interviews I've done on my podcast. 770 00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:42,080 Speaker 2: Oh thanks Nude, I appreciate it. I had a great time. 771 00:42:42,120 --> 00:42:43,120 Speaker 2: It was great to talk to you. 772 00:42:46,960 --> 00:42:49,120 Speaker 1: Thank you to my guest, Rob Reiner. You can get 773 00:42:49,120 --> 00:42:51,760 Speaker 1: a link to listen to the Who Killed JFK Podcast 774 00:42:52,160 --> 00:42:55,640 Speaker 1: on our show page at newtsworld dot com. Newtsworld is 775 00:42:55,640 --> 00:42:59,800 Speaker 1: produced by Ginger three sixty and iHeartMedia. Our executive producer 776 00:42:59,840 --> 00:43:03,799 Speaker 1: is RG Sloan and our researcher is Rachel Peterson. The 777 00:43:03,880 --> 00:43:07,640 Speaker 1: artwork for the show was created by Steve Penley. Special 778 00:43:07,680 --> 00:43:10,680 Speaker 1: thanks to the team at Gingrish three sixty. If you've 779 00:43:10,680 --> 00:43:13,400 Speaker 1: been enjoying Newtsworld, I hope you'll go to Apple Podcast 780 00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:16,239 Speaker 1: and both rate us with five stars and give us 781 00:43:16,239 --> 00:43:18,720 Speaker 1: a review so others can learn what it's all about. 782 00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:21,840 Speaker 1: Right now, listeners of Newtsworld can sign up for my 783 00:43:21,960 --> 00:43:26,840 Speaker 1: three freeweekly columns at gingerishfree sixty dot com slash newsletter. 784 00:43:27,239 --> 00:43:29,520 Speaker 1: I'm Newt Gingrich. This is Newtsworld.