WEBVTT - Joice Heth 0:00:00.680 --> 0:00:04.120 You are listening to Hoax, a production of iHeart Podcasts. 0:00:06.160 --> 0:00:08.320 Folks, it's a hug. 0:00:09.560 --> 0:00:24.720 No one I haven't seen when us to see. 0:00:15.280 --> 0:00:23.279 The Welcome to Hoax, a podcast about the lies we 0:00:23.360 --> 0:00:24.280 wish were true. 0:00:24.079 --> 0:00:25.800 And the truths that sound like lies. 0:00:26.360 --> 0:00:30.319 I'm the ghost of no Danish Warts and I'm the 0:00:30.320 --> 0:00:31.640 evil twin of Lizzie Logan. 0:00:32.040 --> 0:00:34.760 Welcome to the show. We don't have the script in 0:00:34.760 --> 0:00:36.479 front of us. This episode. We were seeing if we 0:00:36.479 --> 0:00:37.199 could just go at it. 0:00:37.200 --> 0:00:40.120 But I thought we had memorized it and we mostly did. 0:00:40.479 --> 0:00:43.360 Yeah, maybe a new a new podcast, I think new 0:00:43.400 --> 0:00:44.680 iHeart podcast. 0:00:44.680 --> 0:00:46.440 That was never part of it now, I mean that 0:00:46.520 --> 0:00:48.560 was pretty close. I think we just forgot when the 0:00:48.720 --> 0:00:49.920 like hand off happened. 0:00:49.960 --> 0:00:52.600 Well, Lousey Logan, I have some very very exciting news. 0:00:52.960 --> 0:00:54.800 Oh my god, what's your very very exciting news. 0:00:54.840 --> 0:00:59.920 It's finally time, Oh my god for what for? Finally 0:01:00.120 --> 0:01:04.000 an episode focused on P. T. Barnum himself. Oh, amazing 0:01:04.200 --> 0:01:08.600 great Hoaxter, the Hoaxter of all Hoaxter, Hoaxer of all Hoasters. 0:01:08.680 --> 0:01:11.000 Have you seen My real question is have you seen 0:01:11.040 --> 0:01:13.319 the movie The Greatest Showman? I have? And what are 0:01:13.360 --> 0:01:14.640 your thoughts about the Greatest Showman. 0:01:14.840 --> 0:01:17.640 Well, okay, so I've seen the Greatest Showman and I've 0:01:17.680 --> 0:01:22.040 also seen Jenny Nicholson's review of the Greatest Showman on YouTube, 0:01:22.040 --> 0:01:24.000 so i know that it's not accurate. 0:01:24.080 --> 0:01:24.920 It is not accurate. 0:01:25.280 --> 0:01:29.320 I mean, listen, what what what are my thoughts about 0:01:29.360 --> 0:01:33.880 that film? It's fun to watch people dance mine, It's 0:01:33.920 --> 0:01:36.280 fun to watch people have fun at the circus. 0:01:36.520 --> 0:01:38.240 Yeah, and like that. 0:01:38.520 --> 0:01:41.000 I'm not the biggest Basic and Paul fans, so that's yeah. 0:01:41.000 --> 0:01:42.959 I don't know that one was one where like it 0:01:43.040 --> 0:01:44.880 seemed like it would be right up my alley. But 0:01:44.920 --> 0:01:47.480 I think I already knew too much about P. T. 0:01:47.600 --> 0:01:50.960 Barnum that I couldn't, like do the suspension of disbelief. 0:01:51.720 --> 0:01:54.120 I think I'm not I love when things aren't. I'm like, 0:01:54.320 --> 0:01:55.920 if you're making a movie, it doesn't have to be 0:01:56.040 --> 0:01:59.320 historically accurate. I'm just saying it affected my enjoyment. 0:01:59.680 --> 0:02:04.200 Dan is a defender of the as of now upcoming 0:02:04.400 --> 0:02:05.640 Wuthering Heights adaptation. 0:02:05.920 --> 0:02:08.640 I am without even seeing it. I'm gonna say I 0:02:08.680 --> 0:02:14.639 think an adaptation is someone's visceral experience and adapting it 0:02:14.680 --> 0:02:17.280 to their artistic vision. And I think that's great. 0:02:17.760 --> 0:02:21.680 I will hear. Okay, when I saw The Greatest Showman, 0:02:22.360 --> 0:02:26.760 I walked out thinking that did nothing for me. But 0:02:26.840 --> 0:02:29.679 I think if I'd seen it when I was twelve, yeah, 0:02:29.840 --> 0:02:32.079 it would have really hit, Like it would have hit 0:02:32.080 --> 0:02:34.120 the way like the movie of Rent really hit when 0:02:34.160 --> 0:02:36.320 now you go back and watch it and you're like, well, 0:02:36.520 --> 0:02:40.840 that's weird, that's all the choices. But I was like, no, 0:02:40.919 --> 0:02:44.440 if I were twelve, I would have that soundtrack on repeat. 0:02:44.520 --> 0:02:46.919 Phantom of the Opera also really hit for me when 0:02:46.919 --> 0:02:49.359 I was when that movie came out. Whenever that was. 0:02:49.600 --> 0:02:52.840 Yeah, Phantom of the Opera, I will say, holds up 0:02:53.000 --> 0:02:54.560 and is a rip Roar and ride. 0:02:54.639 --> 0:02:57.760 I think we both defend Gerard Butler phantomas. 0:02:57.440 --> 0:02:59.400 Ye oh, absolutely absolutely well. 0:02:59.240 --> 0:03:01.560 The thing that The Greatest Showman does not. And okay, 0:03:01.600 --> 0:03:05.200 so before we start, a few like disclaimers. If you 0:03:05.360 --> 0:03:07.760 like The Greatest Showman, that's great. It's a work of fiction, 0:03:08.000 --> 0:03:10.760 enjoy a musical. I think that's great. I'm not someone 0:03:10.760 --> 0:03:13.680 who's like and it shouldn't exist. I'm a defender of 0:03:13.800 --> 0:03:17.720 anachronisms and having fun that the movies. Okay, A more 0:03:17.760 --> 0:03:21.280 serious disclaimer is this episode is going to feature a 0:03:21.320 --> 0:03:26.560 lot of historical racism and very uncomfortable racism sometimes, and 0:03:26.600 --> 0:03:30.760 I will be quoting from some antebellum texts that are 0:03:30.960 --> 0:03:34.440 frankly like disgusting and disconcerting. And if that's just something 0:03:34.480 --> 0:03:36.360 you don't want to deal with right now, I get it, 0:03:36.440 --> 0:03:39.040 fair enough, that's this episode's going to involve that. 0:03:39.960 --> 0:03:43.200 Yeah, and he and he wasn't nice to people with 0:03:43.320 --> 0:03:46.200 like deformities and differences, right. 0:03:46.520 --> 0:03:48.560 Yeah, I mean this episode we're not even going to 0:03:48.680 --> 0:03:50.800 like fully get into that because he did a lot 0:03:50.840 --> 0:03:53.120 and focus just on one specific hoax. 0:03:53.200 --> 0:03:54.880 Oh okay, so this is not an overview. 0:03:55.000 --> 0:03:57.840 It's not an overview. It's his first, very first hoax. 0:03:58.480 --> 0:04:02.720 It's sort of like a prequel, but just it is 0:04:04.120 --> 0:04:04.920 racism heavy. 0:04:05.360 --> 0:04:05.880 Bring it on. 0:04:06.760 --> 0:04:09.800 If I say the name Joyce Hath, does that mean 0:04:09.840 --> 0:04:10.600 anything to you? 0:04:10.640 --> 0:04:11.400 Not one single thing? 0:04:11.480 --> 0:04:14.960 Okay, Well what about Pt. Barnum? Yes, I know about him, 0:04:15.480 --> 0:04:18.040 So we are going to go back in time, okay 0:04:18.400 --> 0:04:20.640 to eighteen thirty five. 0:04:21.000 --> 0:04:21.279 Great. 0:04:21.680 --> 0:04:21.920 PT. 0:04:22.080 --> 0:04:26.119 Barnum is just a twenty five year old nobody. He 0:04:26.200 --> 0:04:29.360 has moved to New York City. He's worked as a shopkeeper. 0:04:29.520 --> 0:04:32.120 He's tried to start a newspaper as a newspaper editor, 0:04:32.560 --> 0:04:35.839 worked as a lottery manager, worked at a boarding house. 0:04:36.120 --> 0:04:39.440 He's had a lot of just jobs great. He wants 0:04:39.480 --> 0:04:42.400 to get rich quick. It's I think the reason that 0:04:42.440 --> 0:04:45.479 the Pt. Barnum story resonates with so many people is 0:04:45.520 --> 0:04:48.200 he he is someone who was born with nothing and 0:04:48.240 --> 0:04:50.760 became wildly rich and famous in his lifetime. 0:04:50.880 --> 0:04:51.719 He was a dreamer. 0:04:51.800 --> 0:04:54.320 He was a dreamer and he really was. He really 0:04:54.360 --> 0:04:59.279 like embodies the idea of like this is a bootstraps 0:04:59.640 --> 0:05:03.400 situation that he built out of thin air he dreamed 0:05:03.440 --> 0:05:06.880 himself into. I'm going to say greatness in like the 0:05:07.480 --> 0:05:09.840 you know in the Harry Potter when he's like greatness, 0:05:09.960 --> 0:05:12.880 He's not good great like I say greatness without any 0:05:12.920 --> 0:05:13.560 moral judgment. 0:05:14.080 --> 0:05:17.240 It's like great, just like important friend power. 0:05:17.839 --> 0:05:19.760 What we're going to be talking about is his very 0:05:19.920 --> 0:05:25.480 first showman job in the show show Business, his first entertainment, 0:05:25.520 --> 0:05:28.400 his first entertainment, his first I mean hoax. Okay, really 0:05:29.000 --> 0:05:31.200 spoiler alert, it is a hoax, but that's what this 0:05:31.279 --> 0:05:33.400 show is and that's kind of what he did. So 0:05:33.720 --> 0:05:36.560 he hears from this man named Coleie Bartram. I think, 0:05:36.640 --> 0:05:40.520 just like an acquaintance who suggests that Barnum traveled to 0:05:40.560 --> 0:05:44.400 Philadelphia to meet this other showman named R. W. Lindsay 0:05:44.760 --> 0:05:48.159 who has a show going, and the word on the street, 0:05:48.200 --> 0:05:52.520 according to Barnum's friend Colie Bartram, is that this Lindsay 0:05:52.520 --> 0:05:54.840 fellow wants to get out of the biz and go 0:05:54.920 --> 0:05:57.760 back to Kentucky because he's not really making a profit. 0:05:58.320 --> 0:06:04.160 And what Lindsay's show is a very old woman that 0:06:04.200 --> 0:06:07.240 he claims is the one hundred and sixty one year 0:06:07.279 --> 0:06:10.880 old former nurse of George Washington. 0:06:11.120 --> 0:06:15.680 You mentioned this in a previous episode. Yeah, I assume 0:06:15.760 --> 0:06:17.839 this isn't like a show that plays every night at eight. 0:06:17.880 --> 0:06:21.120 It's more like a standing exhibit. Like, how is that 0:06:21.200 --> 0:06:22.560 a show? How does a person a show? 0:06:22.600 --> 0:06:25.040 It is a show, You buy tickets, you go see her, 0:06:26.000 --> 0:06:28.880 she tells tales, she exactly, she goes on. I mean 0:06:28.920 --> 0:06:32.520 she is on stage, and Barnum, on this suggestion of 0:06:32.520 --> 0:06:35.599 this acquaintance, travels to Philadelphia to see this show, and 0:06:35.640 --> 0:06:38.960 the show is a very old, semi paralyzed woman on 0:06:39.040 --> 0:06:43.280 stage singing hymns that she had sang to George Washington 0:06:43.760 --> 0:06:45.760 one hundred and fifty years ago, one hundred and fifty 0:06:45.800 --> 0:06:50.279 years ago, telling tales of her dear quote, dear little Georgie, 0:06:50.560 --> 0:06:55.720 dear little George, and just sort of talking about him 0:06:55.760 --> 0:07:00.320 growing up. The popular story of George Washington and the 0:07:00.400 --> 0:07:06.039 Cherry Tree, which is not true, is sort of already 0:07:06.080 --> 0:07:08.440 a story in the zeitgeist that someone had written about 0:07:08.440 --> 0:07:11.280 in a book. She's going to reiterate that story. People 0:07:11.320 --> 0:07:12.760 are going to talk about it, and people just want 0:07:12.760 --> 0:07:17.040 to like see her both as like a relic of 0:07:17.080 --> 0:07:20.880 that bygun Era founding Fathers, but also because she's a 0:07:20.920 --> 0:07:25.440 specimen in and of herself, Okay, in like a freak show. Way, Yeah, 0:07:25.520 --> 0:07:28.280 this is a woman that they're claiming to be one 0:07:28.360 --> 0:07:30.280 hundred and sixty one years old. 0:07:30.680 --> 0:07:31.040 Okay. 0:07:31.200 --> 0:07:34.440 So Barnum goes to Philadelphia, sees the show, and then 0:07:34.520 --> 0:07:38.200 meets with her backstage in the Masonic Hall where the 0:07:38.240 --> 0:07:41.239 show had happened, and quote finds her to be quote 0:07:41.360 --> 0:07:44.920 very garrulous when speaking of her protege, dear little George, 0:07:45.800 --> 0:07:47.680 and he describes what she looks like. 0:07:47.760 --> 0:07:48.960 You know what does mean? 0:07:49.800 --> 0:07:52.320 I think like that she has like energy even for 0:07:52.640 --> 0:07:53.760 a very very old woman. 0:07:53.840 --> 0:07:54.200 Okay. 0:07:54.480 --> 0:07:57.760 He describes her as having one fixed arm stuck. So 0:07:57.800 --> 0:08:02.600 she's half paralyzed. He'd describe her as totally blind, no teeth, 0:08:03.000 --> 0:08:06.840 a head of thick, bushy gray hair, and nails four 0:08:06.880 --> 0:08:09.920 inches long and toenails a quarter inch thick. 0:08:10.840 --> 0:08:12.600 And as she does, sound really old. 0:08:12.960 --> 0:08:15.640 I think something that I just want to flag here 0:08:16.080 --> 0:08:19.520 is a lot of these descriptions of her, both from 0:08:19.560 --> 0:08:21.680 Barnum and also from the press at the time and 0:08:21.720 --> 0:08:27.320 also from people who come to see her, are grotesque. 0:08:27.440 --> 0:08:30.840 And they are going to describe her in this way 0:08:30.880 --> 0:08:34.440 that is, I mean, like a creature of some sort. 0:08:34.520 --> 0:08:37.560 It's very othering. I should say, this is a black woman. 0:08:38.200 --> 0:08:40.199 See I didn't know that one yep, and she had 0:08:40.200 --> 0:08:42.040 been I assume a slave then not. 0:08:42.080 --> 0:08:44.840 Only had been a slave, well she still. 0:08:44.679 --> 0:08:48.160 Isn't because they're in Philly, which is part of the North. Right. 0:08:48.200 --> 0:08:50.080 Well, this is an interesting He wants to go back. 0:08:49.920 --> 0:08:52.440 To Kentucky because he wants to go be in the 0:08:52.480 --> 0:08:53.440 Handabellum South. 0:08:54.040 --> 0:09:00.200 This is indeed a situation that we'll have to get into. Okay, okay, okay, 0:09:00.200 --> 0:09:01.920 So I'm just going to walk through the way that 0:09:02.000 --> 0:09:05.640 pet Barnum would have experienced this. He meets this woman 0:09:06.440 --> 0:09:10.040 they you know, Lindsay's show that he's not really making 0:09:10.080 --> 0:09:12.600 money on is saying that she's George Washington. Was George 0:09:12.640 --> 0:09:17.880 Washington's nurse. It is eighteen thirty five. George Washington was 0:09:17.920 --> 0:09:21.199 born in seventeen thirty two. So I'm not going to 0:09:21.240 --> 0:09:23.440 make anyone listening do the math. I did the math. 0:09:23.760 --> 0:09:27.640 If she was fifteen when she was his nurse, that 0:09:27.720 --> 0:09:31.319 means she would be one hundred and eighteen now, okay, 0:09:31.320 --> 0:09:34.240 But also they're claiming that she's one hundred and sixty 0:09:34.320 --> 0:09:38.000 one because Lindsay as like quote unquote proof of the 0:09:38.040 --> 0:09:42.240 fact that she was George Washington's nurse, offers a bill 0:09:42.320 --> 0:09:46.880 of sale dated from February fifth, seventeen twenty seven from 0:09:47.040 --> 0:09:51.400 Augustine Washington, who is George Washington's father, saying that he 0:09:52.600 --> 0:09:56.000 sold this woman, Joyce Heth, when she was fifty four 0:09:56.120 --> 0:10:00.160 years old to their friend and neighbor Elizabeth Attwood, and 0:10:00.200 --> 0:10:03.600 then Lindsay claims that Joyce was present at the birth 0:10:03.679 --> 0:10:08.120 of George Washington, even clothed the newborn infant, and then 0:10:08.400 --> 0:10:12.880 would later claim that he that she suckled yeah him, 0:10:13.360 --> 0:10:16.000 that she was a wet nurse. Sorry he suckled her. 0:10:16.800 --> 0:10:21.079 Nurse him nursed him, thank you. But even given that age, 0:10:21.520 --> 0:10:26.120 if she had been fifty four in seventeen twenty seven 0:10:26.200 --> 0:10:29.240 and he wasn't born for another five years, she wasn't 0:10:29.280 --> 0:10:31.800 going to be his wet nurse at fifty nine years old. 0:10:33.000 --> 0:10:35.760 I mean, this is a woman who apparently just defies 0:10:35.840 --> 0:10:40.079 all you know, known biology. Yeah, of course, I guess 0:10:40.120 --> 0:10:41.880 if you're going to make it to one hundred and sixty, 0:10:42.400 --> 0:10:44.160 you're not going to go through menopause for a while 0:10:44.200 --> 0:10:46.520 because you have a long ass life span ahead of you. 0:10:46.640 --> 0:10:49.360 But I do understand what you're saying that this is 0:10:49.480 --> 0:10:50.800 even by. 0:10:50.679 --> 0:10:53.720 The lie, it's not really plausible. 0:10:53.840 --> 0:10:55.320 Yeah. I mean, if I were trying to sell this, 0:10:55.360 --> 0:10:57.720 I would just say that she was one hundred and eighteen, 0:10:57.960 --> 0:11:00.720 because I mean, I don't know about back then, but 0:11:00.800 --> 0:11:03.120 like people live to one hundred and ten, you know 0:11:03.120 --> 0:11:04.640 what I mean, that's like a less of a stretch. 0:11:04.760 --> 0:11:07.280 But Lizzy, but this is someone you want to buy 0:11:07.280 --> 0:11:09.440 tickets to. Well, you want people to buy tickets to 0:11:09.440 --> 0:11:12.280 come see her. So part of the reason that the 0:11:12.400 --> 0:11:15.560 life is so outrageous is because you're like, oh my god, 0:11:15.679 --> 0:11:18.600 that's unbelievable. I have to see this for myself. 0:11:18.920 --> 0:11:24.280 Okay, Barnum is a liar, but yeah, nokidding, And so 0:11:24.360 --> 0:11:27.000 a lot of it is Lindsay, I'm assuming, yeah, But 0:11:27.040 --> 0:11:29.880 we don't have Lindsay's writing on this. We have Barnum's 0:11:29.920 --> 0:11:33.520 writing about his conversations with Lindsay. So a lot of 0:11:33.559 --> 0:11:38.040 our sources on this are Barnum's own writings, which changed 0:11:38.160 --> 0:11:42.040 multiple times throughout his life. His first time that he 0:11:42.080 --> 0:11:45.160 writes about this is a complete lie, and then he'll 0:11:45.160 --> 0:11:48.160 write about it decades later in his autobiography, and then 0:11:48.200 --> 0:11:51.720 in later editions we'll even revise it further. Great, So 0:11:51.920 --> 0:11:54.360 almost everything you have to take with a grain of salt. 0:11:54.480 --> 0:11:59.480 But what is kind of interesting is this almost historiography 0:11:59.720 --> 0:12:02.880 of where you get to see how Barnum presented the 0:12:02.920 --> 0:12:05.760 story and what that says about him at any given time. 0:12:06.360 --> 0:12:08.880 But this is the version that I think is closest 0:12:08.880 --> 0:12:14.520 to the truth that Lindsay from Kentucky had owned this woman, 0:12:15.200 --> 0:12:18.839 had decided that maybe he would make a profit displaying her, 0:12:19.559 --> 0:12:22.960 and didn't really make enough money, wanted to get out 0:12:23.000 --> 0:12:25.319 of the business, and sold her to P. T. 0:12:25.480 --> 0:12:29.200 Barnum. Slavery was already outlawed in New York City around 0:12:29.240 --> 0:12:33.440 this time Barnum is going to display her, he exploits 0:12:33.440 --> 0:12:37.800 a loophole and he quote leases Heath for a year 0:12:38.200 --> 0:12:41.920 at one thousand dollars. He goes into debt. He had 0:12:41.960 --> 0:12:44.240 to borrow five hundred. He didn't even have enough money. 0:12:45.440 --> 0:12:47.800 But to quote berth Lynn Force, who's a professor at 0:12:47.880 --> 0:12:51.120 u T Austin, Peter Barnhum quote began his career in 0:12:51.160 --> 0:12:53.880 show business by going into debt to buy a super 0:12:53.880 --> 0:12:56.520 annuated female slave who turned out to be a fraud, 0:12:57.720 --> 0:13:02.400 so she was still purchased. Yeah, the asking price that 0:13:02.840 --> 0:13:05.319 Lindsay wanted was three thousand dollars and he paid a 0:13:05.400 --> 0:13:08.040 thousand and it was like a lease on a person. 0:13:08.600 --> 0:13:10.120 Do we and maybe we're going to get to this, 0:13:10.840 --> 0:13:14.480 do we know if George Washington had a real nurse? 0:13:14.840 --> 0:13:18.760 Like is she pretending to be someone who actually existed? 0:13:18.800 --> 0:13:20.880 I mean I know that he owned slaves as an 0:13:20.880 --> 0:13:23.240 adult and like grew up on a plantation. 0:13:23.400 --> 0:13:26.360 She's not impersonating someone with a name that we know. 0:13:26.880 --> 0:13:31.840 But like George Washington absolutely has black slaves on his plantation. 0:13:32.000 --> 0:13:35.480 He owned slaves. That is a I was going to 0:13:35.520 --> 0:13:38.840 say plaus not only plausible thing, truthful thing, but the 0:13:38.920 --> 0:13:42.040 thing that p. T. Barnum has that Lindsay doesn't have 0:13:42.240 --> 0:13:47.520 is like showbiz pizaz. And starting on August tenth, eighteen 0:13:47.600 --> 0:13:49.560 thirty five, he books her a two and a half 0:13:49.640 --> 0:13:52.000 week stint at this theater in New York City called 0:13:52.120 --> 0:13:56.920 Nibblo's Garden advertised the Childhood Wet Nurse of George Washington 0:13:57.080 --> 0:14:00.640 eighteen thirty five as quote on the poster, the greatest 0:14:00.840 --> 0:14:05.200 natural and national curiosity in the world, which you know, 0:14:05.280 --> 0:14:05.640 why not? 0:14:05.920 --> 0:14:07.960 Yeah, I mean, if you're if you're gonna go in 0:14:08.040 --> 0:14:09.360 on a lie go all in, you know. 0:14:09.800 --> 0:14:13.000 They say that she quote was the first person who 0:14:13.080 --> 0:14:17.480 put clothes on the unconscious infant, who in after days 0:14:17.559 --> 0:14:25.480 led our heroic fathers onto glory, to victory and freedom. Ironic. Yeah, 0:14:25.520 --> 0:14:28.840 to use her own language, quote, she raised him. They 0:14:28.880 --> 0:14:32.000 say that she weighs but forty six pounds. 0:14:33.240 --> 0:14:35.000 Well, people were smaller than she. 0:14:35.000 --> 0:14:38.360 Did not weigh forty six pounds, And they say in 0:14:38.400 --> 0:14:42.520 the advertisement she retains her faculties in an unparalleled degree, 0:14:42.640 --> 0:14:47.280 converses free lease, sings numerous hymns, relates many interesting anecdotes 0:14:47.320 --> 0:14:50.680 of the boy Washington, and often laughs heartily at her 0:14:50.680 --> 0:14:52.760 own remarks or those of spectators. 0:14:53.640 --> 0:14:59.240 Okay, so okay. 0:14:59.360 --> 0:15:02.000 The thing that I want to point out here is 0:15:02.040 --> 0:15:06.480 that she is an object on display for two purposes. 0:15:07.240 --> 0:15:11.560 One just because, in a gay Barnum freak show way, 0:15:11.640 --> 0:15:14.800 this is a woman who is a toothless, semi paralyzed 0:15:14.840 --> 0:15:17.200 woman that they're saying is one hundred and sixty one 0:15:17.280 --> 0:15:21.960 years old. She is extraordinarily old looking, Okay, and later, 0:15:22.200 --> 0:15:25.800 even though it spoiler alert is a hoax, this woman 0:15:25.920 --> 0:15:28.960 was not one hundred and sixty one years old. Barnum, 0:15:29.120 --> 0:15:30.880 in his defense, will be like, well, no one who 0:15:30.960 --> 0:15:35.360 saw her whatever, that she was not that old, Okay, 0:15:35.520 --> 0:15:39.280 So like it was a freak show specimen to see. 0:15:39.960 --> 0:15:43.400 And also if you weren't, if it wasn't enticing enough 0:15:43.440 --> 0:15:45.520 for you to come see in one hundred and sixty 0:15:45.560 --> 0:15:50.960 one year old woman, this appeal to this national pride 0:15:51.200 --> 0:15:55.840 was also it gives it like an air of respectability almost. 0:15:55.240 --> 0:15:57.400 Yeah, like, oh, I'm not going to see how old 0:15:57.440 --> 0:16:00.440 she is. I'm going to learn about history. And that's 0:16:00.440 --> 0:16:02.800 why I bought my ticket, not because I'm you know, 0:16:03.360 --> 0:16:05.520 I just want to gaw at an old lady exactly. 0:16:05.560 --> 0:16:07.880 I'm not going to a freak show to gwet like 0:16:07.920 --> 0:16:12.440 a human specimen. I'm going to like honor our country 0:16:13.000 --> 0:16:16.960 and like pay homage to the patriotism of our country. Yeah, 0:16:17.080 --> 0:16:20.680 admission was twenty five cents children half priced less than 0:16:20.720 --> 0:16:23.200 ten dollars today. A bargain. 0:16:23.720 --> 0:16:25.760 I mean, when you don't have to pay the star 0:16:25.840 --> 0:16:27.920 of your show, I guess you can keep overhead there. 0:16:28.320 --> 0:16:32.720 Yeah, you know she's singing hymns told telling stories about 0:16:32.760 --> 0:16:36.360 little George. As I mentioned earlier, the story about the 0:16:36.520 --> 0:16:39.240 George Washington cutting down a cherry tree and then telling 0:16:39.280 --> 0:16:41.000 his father, I cannot tell a lie I cut down 0:16:41.040 --> 0:16:44.000 a cherry tree. That is a fully fictional story that 0:16:44.120 --> 0:16:48.040 was popularized in a in eighteen o nine book by 0:16:48.040 --> 0:16:50.560 a man named Mason Weim called Life of Washington. That 0:16:50.640 --> 0:16:53.520 was almost like an educational book, but it became like 0:16:53.560 --> 0:16:56.320 a very popular story, and so she would tell the 0:16:56.360 --> 0:17:00.520 story as if she had seen it. She looked in incredibly, 0:17:00.720 --> 0:17:05.080 incredibly old. One of the people who sees her writes, indeed, 0:17:05.080 --> 0:17:08.120 she is a mere skeleton covered with skin. Her whole 0:17:08.160 --> 0:17:11.359 appearance very much resembles a mummy of the days of 0:17:11.440 --> 0:17:15.160 the Pharaohs, taken entire from the Catacombs of Egypt. 0:17:15.560 --> 0:17:17.399 I feel so bad for this lady. I just want 0:17:17.440 --> 0:17:18.840 to like feed her jello. I know. 0:17:19.800 --> 0:17:24.040 The historian Eric Lott claims that Barnum was earning fifteen 0:17:24.119 --> 0:17:26.760 hundred dollars a week, which is the equivalent of forty 0:17:26.880 --> 0:17:28.440 six thousand dollars a week. 0:17:29.520 --> 0:17:31.880 That's so much money. And she was. 0:17:31.840 --> 0:17:34.840 Working unpaid ten to twelve hours a day. 0:17:35.000 --> 0:17:35.520 Yeah. 0:17:35.560 --> 0:17:39.560 And then starting this summer it's a month's long traveling 0:17:39.680 --> 0:17:44.760 exhibit for Barnum. They go to Providence, Boston, Lowell, Worcester, Springfield, Hartford, 0:17:44.880 --> 0:17:48.320 New Haven, Albany, and a few other places. What's kind 0:17:48.320 --> 0:17:51.720 of interesting is, as we were talking about, like that 0:17:51.840 --> 0:17:55.480 part of the appeal was just this like carnival sensibility 0:17:55.520 --> 0:17:57.920 of like, come see the very old woman who looks 0:17:57.920 --> 0:18:03.920 like a mummy. But the travel at different stops, he 0:18:04.440 --> 0:18:07.040 leans into different parts of the appeal of her. 0:18:07.240 --> 0:18:09.400 Oh sure, because the local flavor. 0:18:09.200 --> 0:18:12.640 The local flavor. Where at when abolitionists were upset about 0:18:12.640 --> 0:18:15.240 the show because it's like, here is an enslaved woman 0:18:15.280 --> 0:18:18.879 that you're putting on display like further exploiting, Barnham claims 0:18:18.880 --> 0:18:21.920 that the proceeds of the exhibit were going to freeing slaves. 0:18:22.640 --> 0:18:24.920 There's no evidence to think of a slave he could 0:18:24.960 --> 0:18:25.479 have freedom. 0:18:25.720 --> 0:18:31.520 That there, Yeah, and the appeal to the patriotism because again, 0:18:31.600 --> 0:18:35.719 she was not George Washington's nursemaid. There's no actual factual 0:18:35.760 --> 0:18:39.359 connection to George Washington. But there's this is a period 0:18:39.400 --> 0:18:42.480 of urbanization and upheaval in the country, and during a 0:18:42.520 --> 0:18:46.879 time of massive upheaval, people look towards stability, and so 0:18:46.920 --> 0:18:50.520 the veneration of the Founding Fathers becomes really popular in 0:18:50.560 --> 0:18:54.320 that time because it's like there's this rapid urbanization, anxieties 0:18:54.320 --> 0:18:57.560 about loss of traditions, especially going into the Civil War. 0:18:57.680 --> 0:19:01.200 There's a lot of chaos happening. There's a writer named 0:19:01.200 --> 0:19:05.720 Henry Cole who writes to the Son complaining about this, 0:19:05.960 --> 0:19:08.480 about her being on display, not questioning whether or not 0:19:08.640 --> 0:19:12.199 she is Washington's nurse maid, but she says, why she 0:19:12.480 --> 0:19:15.560 who nursed the father of our country, the man to 0:19:15.600 --> 0:19:19.080 whom we owe our present, happy and prosperous condition, should 0:19:19.200 --> 0:19:22.440 at the close of her life be exhibited as our 0:19:22.640 --> 0:19:26.199 rarer monsters are. Is there not philanthropy enough in the 0:19:26.200 --> 0:19:29.480 American people to take care of her although her skin 0:19:29.560 --> 0:19:30.080 be black? 0:19:30.840 --> 0:19:35.120 Oh, how generous yeah. To me, this sort of I mean, 0:19:35.160 --> 0:19:37.480 this isn't like one to one at all because it's 0:19:37.480 --> 0:19:41.320 not on display. But I feel like the desire to 0:19:42.720 --> 0:19:46.359 sort of connect with like a previous quote unquote like 0:19:46.800 --> 0:19:50.520 to do it. I don't know exactly what the connection is, 0:19:50.520 --> 0:19:56.119 but what's reminding me of is every election. Yeah, we're like, 0:19:57.040 --> 0:19:59.400 I don't know, is there a Kennedy who can help? 0:19:59.560 --> 0:20:02.359 Like we went to the moon and did like civil 0:20:02.400 --> 0:20:05.280 rights and stuff, like just one of those guys around 0:20:05.440 --> 0:20:08.200 and like, we're gonna take whatever Kennedy we can get. 0:20:08.240 --> 0:20:11.320 Who who are around here? We met George Washington, here's 0:20:11.359 --> 0:20:13.480 the closest person we have to joy Like. 0:20:13.560 --> 0:20:16.720 Are you vaguely related to someone we've heard of that 0:20:16.800 --> 0:20:19.160 we know? We like, Okay, can you be in charge? 0:20:19.359 --> 0:20:22.000 Or can I can I just listen to you talk? Really? 0:20:22.040 --> 0:20:22.840 I know what to do. 0:20:23.080 --> 0:20:26.160 That's it. So it's like, not only would you understand 0:20:26.160 --> 0:20:29.040 why this was such a popular attraction, Not only did 0:20:29.080 --> 0:20:32.040 people you know they're bored. It's the eighteen thirties want 0:20:32.040 --> 0:20:34.120 to go to like quote a freak show to look 0:20:34.160 --> 0:20:36.960 at human oddity. It's why TLC is still a channel. 0:20:37.480 --> 0:20:39.640 But then they could also pat themselves on the back 0:20:39.720 --> 0:20:43.520 because they're like, ah, George Washington, Yeah, and we're going 0:20:43.600 --> 0:20:47.000 to get into this and to Barnum as a showman later. 0:20:47.200 --> 0:20:50.880 But to fast forward a little, the historian Benjamin Reese, 0:20:50.920 --> 0:20:54.080 I just want to shout him out, because he articulated 0:20:54.080 --> 0:20:56.919 this very well. I think where she indulged in quote 0:20:56.920 --> 0:21:01.560 the popular desire for images of white domination, because which 0:21:01.720 --> 0:21:03.680 is basically so not only do you get to look 0:21:03.680 --> 0:21:05.840 at like a I'm putting this in air quotes, but 0:21:05.880 --> 0:21:07.679 like a weird looking person, like a freak, like, oh, 0:21:07.800 --> 0:21:10.040 look at this old lady, and get to be like ah, 0:21:10.119 --> 0:21:12.720 George Washington. I get to think about our founding fathers. 0:21:13.119 --> 0:21:16.680 You also get to feel superior to a very very 0:21:16.800 --> 0:21:18.040 old black woman. 0:21:18.240 --> 0:21:21.040 And she's telling I mean, from what it sounds like, 0:21:21.119 --> 0:21:23.520 it sounds like she's telling a version of history in 0:21:23.560 --> 0:21:26.399 which she's very happy. Yes, And I am sure like 0:21:26.480 --> 0:21:31.280 if you have any anxiety around slavery, either because you 0:21:32.000 --> 0:21:33.719 own slaves and don't want to think of yourself as 0:21:33.720 --> 0:21:37.359