1 00:00:02,720 --> 00:00:10,600 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. You're listening to the 2 00:00:10,600 --> 00:00:14,600 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast. Catch us live weekdays at ten am 3 00:00:14,640 --> 00:00:18,560 Speaker 1: Eastern on Applecarplay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. 4 00:00:18,640 --> 00:00:21,920 Speaker 1: Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch 5 00:00:21,960 --> 00:00:23,120 Speaker 1: us live on YouTube. 6 00:00:23,520 --> 00:00:25,439 Speaker 2: The other news of the day, of course, is that 7 00:00:25,520 --> 00:00:29,640 Speaker 2: the House passes the big beautiful bill. Now it heads 8 00:00:29,680 --> 00:00:32,879 Speaker 2: to the Senate. Joining us now for more details on 9 00:00:32,920 --> 00:00:36,479 Speaker 2: that is Michael Shepherd, Bloomberg Senior editor in Washington. All Right, 10 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:39,360 Speaker 2: what are the sticking points for the Republicans in the 11 00:00:39,360 --> 00:00:39,960 Speaker 2: Senate now? 12 00:00:41,040 --> 00:00:43,640 Speaker 3: Well, what they're looking at are really the same sticking 13 00:00:43,680 --> 00:00:47,519 Speaker 3: points that had really caused such a fight in the House. 14 00:00:48,000 --> 00:00:51,520 Speaker 3: And the first is reservations about the overall long term 15 00:00:51,520 --> 00:00:55,320 Speaker 3: fiscal impact of the bill. There is a concern that 16 00:00:55,360 --> 00:00:59,600 Speaker 3: this will add significantly to deficits the Congressional Budget Office 17 00:00:59,640 --> 00:01:02,560 Speaker 3: founder would add as much as two point three trillion 18 00:01:02,640 --> 00:01:05,880 Speaker 3: dollars to deficits over the next ten years, and that 19 00:01:05,959 --> 00:01:09,039 Speaker 3: of course risks exacerbating what we've been seeing in the 20 00:01:09,080 --> 00:01:12,240 Speaker 3: bomb market, and that namely is concerned about ballooning US debt. 21 00:01:12,480 --> 00:01:16,560 Speaker 3: And that was all highlighted by Moody's decision last week 22 00:01:16,640 --> 00:01:19,880 Speaker 3: to downgrade the US government's credit rating. And the other 23 00:01:19,920 --> 00:01:22,399 Speaker 3: big concern, of course is Medicaid, and we've heard this 24 00:01:22,520 --> 00:01:26,399 Speaker 3: come up from some House members, and there was a 25 00:01:26,400 --> 00:01:28,760 Speaker 3: bit of a split. There were a handful of Conservatives 26 00:01:28,760 --> 00:01:31,720 Speaker 3: who really wanted significant cuts to the program that helps 27 00:01:32,040 --> 00:01:36,080 Speaker 3: the poor receive access to medical care with government support. 28 00:01:36,280 --> 00:01:38,600 Speaker 3: But there are others who were concerned about the impact 29 00:01:38,600 --> 00:01:41,640 Speaker 3: in their districts and their states, and the political fallout 30 00:01:41,760 --> 00:01:45,319 Speaker 3: in the Senate, concerns about the impact politically and on 31 00:01:45,440 --> 00:01:48,040 Speaker 3: healthcare in their states has been more vocal. We saw 32 00:01:48,160 --> 00:01:52,800 Speaker 3: Josh Wally, a key Republican who represents a more populous 33 00:01:52,880 --> 00:01:57,520 Speaker 3: wing of the party, expressing grave worries about what would 34 00:01:57,560 --> 00:02:00,200 Speaker 3: happen to Medicaid, especially in his state of Missouri. We're 35 00:02:00,200 --> 00:02:02,680 Speaker 3: going to be watching those two themes, both on the 36 00:02:02,680 --> 00:02:05,360 Speaker 3: fiscal side, but then also on what happens to that 37 00:02:05,480 --> 00:02:07,880 Speaker 3: key title program of Medicaid outs. 38 00:02:08,560 --> 00:02:10,560 Speaker 4: Michael, what's the timing here for the Senate? 39 00:02:10,560 --> 00:02:12,000 Speaker 5: We know the Speaker of the House said, hey, we're 40 00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:14,079 Speaker 5: going to get something done by Memorial Day. 41 00:02:14,240 --> 00:02:17,080 Speaker 4: He did that. How about the Senate, what's their timetable? 42 00:02:17,800 --> 00:02:21,680 Speaker 3: Well, Mike Johnson delivered with a big assist from Donald Trump, 43 00:02:21,720 --> 00:02:26,919 Speaker 3: who really drove lawmakers hard. He met with the Republican 44 00:02:27,040 --> 00:02:31,040 Speaker 3: Conference earlier in the week to say basically that anyone 45 00:02:31,080 --> 00:02:33,800 Speaker 3: who voted against the bill or failed to support it 46 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:37,480 Speaker 3: and stood in its way, it would be guilty of 47 00:02:37,520 --> 00:02:40,640 Speaker 3: the ultimate betrayal and would pay the price in the 48 00:02:40,680 --> 00:02:44,600 Speaker 3: next congressional elections. In the Senate, it's a little bit 49 00:02:44,639 --> 00:02:48,840 Speaker 3: of a different ballgame. It's unclear that the leadership there 50 00:02:49,280 --> 00:02:53,200 Speaker 3: is as enthusiastic about the bill with that same sense 51 00:02:53,240 --> 00:02:57,720 Speaker 3: of timing. The Treasury Sectory, Scott Besson and the President 52 00:02:57,760 --> 00:03:00,520 Speaker 3: really would like this done by July fourth. That may 53 00:03:00,600 --> 00:03:02,840 Speaker 3: be a big ask. We're really a little bit more 54 00:03:02,880 --> 00:03:05,440 Speaker 3: than a month away. Wlawmakers are going out on Memorial 55 00:03:05,520 --> 00:03:08,560 Speaker 3: Day recess, and the Senate does want to make some changes. 56 00:03:08,840 --> 00:03:11,440 Speaker 3: They do face the deadline, though, Paul and Alex and 57 00:03:11,480 --> 00:03:14,640 Speaker 3: that is on the debt limit. The bill does contain 58 00:03:14,680 --> 00:03:16,960 Speaker 3: a measure that would raise the US borrowing limit and 59 00:03:17,040 --> 00:03:21,480 Speaker 3: help us avert that thing that we fear of a 60 00:03:21,639 --> 00:03:25,239 Speaker 3: US default. We're seeing an X state somewhere in August, 61 00:03:25,280 --> 00:03:28,200 Speaker 3: at least according to the Treasury Secretary so that gives 62 00:03:28,240 --> 00:03:31,520 Speaker 3: them a target to work for before their August recess. 63 00:03:31,560 --> 00:03:33,680 Speaker 3: But they do have a lot to get through, and 64 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:36,360 Speaker 3: the President may have to do some arm twisting in 65 00:03:36,400 --> 00:03:38,600 Speaker 3: the Senate as well, just as he did in the House. 66 00:03:38,960 --> 00:03:41,600 Speaker 2: So talking my book here, I was really interested that 67 00:03:41,640 --> 00:03:44,680 Speaker 2: they push forward the rollback for some of the clean 68 00:03:44,760 --> 00:03:47,840 Speaker 2: energy tax credits. So the Renewable Investment Tax Credit and 69 00:03:47,840 --> 00:03:50,200 Speaker 2: production tax credit is now going to be done in 70 00:03:50,320 --> 00:03:53,480 Speaker 2: twenty twenty eight rather than twenty twenty nine and twenty 71 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:56,680 Speaker 2: thirty Yeah, twenty thirty one. And there are other parts 72 00:03:56,680 --> 00:03:58,840 Speaker 2: of that as well that have really put pressure on 73 00:03:58,880 --> 00:04:01,240 Speaker 2: the clean energy guys. A lot of the clean energy 74 00:04:01,280 --> 00:04:04,680 Speaker 2: projects are in red states, So how are Republican senators 75 00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:05,320 Speaker 2: going to manage that? 76 00:04:06,360 --> 00:04:08,680 Speaker 3: Well, that's a great question, Alex, and it is something 77 00:04:08,680 --> 00:04:11,200 Speaker 3: that really divided the caucus in way because they do 78 00:04:11,360 --> 00:04:13,040 Speaker 3: like getting that money, and it's sort of the same 79 00:04:13,080 --> 00:04:17,240 Speaker 3: tension that we've seen in Republican and opposition from the 80 00:04:17,240 --> 00:04:19,800 Speaker 3: President himself to the Chips Act and some of that 81 00:04:20,480 --> 00:04:23,159 Speaker 3: funding and some of those subsidies. They like having the 82 00:04:23,200 --> 00:04:25,880 Speaker 3: projects in their state. Yet when they look at ways 83 00:04:25,920 --> 00:04:29,719 Speaker 3: to find savings for this pretty expensive tax bill. They 84 00:04:29,880 --> 00:04:33,159 Speaker 3: start looking for everything, and it's not only medicaid, but 85 00:04:33,279 --> 00:04:38,200 Speaker 3: as you mentioned, it is those clean energy projects and programs. 86 00:04:38,400 --> 00:04:41,400 Speaker 3: They're trying to say that, look, we're going to accelerate 87 00:04:41,640 --> 00:04:45,279 Speaker 3: the timeline, but not eliminate them entirely. 88 00:04:45,320 --> 00:04:47,520 Speaker 4: There, Michael, thank you so much for joining us. 89 00:04:47,520 --> 00:04:50,480 Speaker 5: Michael Shepherd, Senior editor, Bloomberg News, joining us from Washington, DC, 90 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:53,440 Speaker 5: talking about some tax legislation, big big move forward today, 91 00:04:53,800 --> 00:04:56,039 Speaker 5: our President Trump in the House. 92 00:04:57,720 --> 00:05:01,440 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence Pod. Catch us live 93 00:05:01,520 --> 00:05:04,880 Speaker 1: weekdays at ten am Eastern on Applecarplay and Android Auto 94 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:08,080 Speaker 1: with the Bloomberg Business App. Listen on demand wherever you 95 00:05:08,120 --> 00:05:11,520 Speaker 1: get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube. 96 00:05:11,560 --> 00:05:14,000 Speaker 5: Alextel Paul Swiney live here in on our Bloomberg Interactive 97 00:05:14,560 --> 00:05:17,080 Speaker 5: Studio streaming live on YouTube as well, and also on 98 00:05:17,120 --> 00:05:20,279 Speaker 5: that connected TV stuff think Roku and Samsung TV. If 99 00:05:20,320 --> 00:05:21,719 Speaker 5: you got that kind of stuff, you can get us. 100 00:05:21,920 --> 00:05:26,480 Speaker 5: Bloomberg Originals is kind of where you go find us there. Again, 101 00:05:26,600 --> 00:05:30,279 Speaker 5: the Justice Department is probing whether Alphabet's Google violated antitrust 102 00:05:30,360 --> 00:05:33,920 Speaker 5: law with an agreement to use the artificial intelligence technology 103 00:05:33,920 --> 00:05:36,800 Speaker 5: of a popular chat maker. According to people familiar with 104 00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:39,479 Speaker 5: than knowledge of the matter. It's not that they're probing 105 00:05:39,520 --> 00:05:40,880 Speaker 5: an acquisition. 106 00:05:40,440 --> 00:05:43,839 Speaker 4: That they want to make. It's using somebody's technology. I 107 00:05:43,839 --> 00:05:44,159 Speaker 4: don't know. 108 00:05:44,320 --> 00:05:46,200 Speaker 5: Stocks up three percent on news, It doesn't seem like 109 00:05:46,240 --> 00:05:48,839 Speaker 5: the market's that word. Man Deep seeing Hill, tell us 110 00:05:48,880 --> 00:05:50,799 Speaker 5: what's going on here? He covers all the technology stuff 111 00:05:50,800 --> 00:05:52,640 Speaker 5: for Bloomberg Intelligence mandeep. 112 00:05:52,760 --> 00:05:56,800 Speaker 4: I mean usually the DJ comes in when you make 113 00:05:56,800 --> 00:05:58,480 Speaker 4: an acquisition and says who whoaahah. 114 00:05:58,880 --> 00:06:01,680 Speaker 5: But this is just looking at a deal or a 115 00:06:01,720 --> 00:06:03,640 Speaker 5: contract they made with some AI provider. 116 00:06:04,040 --> 00:06:07,000 Speaker 6: Yeah. I mean, in fact, all three of them, Google, 117 00:06:07,200 --> 00:06:12,360 Speaker 6: Microsoft and Amazon did this AQUI hires of these startups 118 00:06:12,560 --> 00:06:15,479 Speaker 6: back in twenty twenty four, So these were three different companies. 119 00:06:15,880 --> 00:06:21,320 Speaker 6: Google did that for Character AI. Microsoft had the same 120 00:06:21,440 --> 00:06:25,520 Speaker 6: sort of setup for Inflection, and then Amazon did it 121 00:06:25,560 --> 00:06:29,680 Speaker 6: for Adept, which is another small AI company. And if 122 00:06:29,680 --> 00:06:33,960 Speaker 6: you remember back at that time, Lena Khan was the force, 123 00:06:34,400 --> 00:06:37,919 Speaker 6: and you know, everyone was reluctant when it comes to 124 00:06:38,040 --> 00:06:43,279 Speaker 6: making these acquisitions. So this was their way of licensing 125 00:06:43,320 --> 00:06:47,520 Speaker 6: the technology. They were effectively paying a license fee and 126 00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:51,120 Speaker 6: in most cases it was non exclusive, but it ended 127 00:06:51,200 --> 00:06:56,040 Speaker 6: up basically bringing those employees to work for you know, 128 00:06:56,640 --> 00:07:00,000 Speaker 6: Google in a way where it wasn't an outright acquisition. 129 00:07:00,240 --> 00:07:04,719 Speaker 6: It was an independent company still, but they paid the 130 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:08,919 Speaker 6: current shareholders of those companies a licensing fee which pretty 131 00:07:08,960 --> 00:07:10,640 Speaker 6: much was like sixty. 132 00:07:11,400 --> 00:07:14,120 Speaker 4: Transaction lawyers working up at that. 133 00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:17,320 Speaker 2: But how different is this from what say, Microsoft is 134 00:07:17,360 --> 00:07:18,640 Speaker 2: doing with open ai. 135 00:07:19,080 --> 00:07:24,520 Speaker 6: Well, that's a forty nine percent stake one. And in 136 00:07:24,560 --> 00:07:27,280 Speaker 6: that case, in the case of Microsoft, you're right, I mean, 137 00:07:27,320 --> 00:07:30,520 Speaker 6: the comparison is app in the sense that OpenAI still 138 00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:34,920 Speaker 6: remains independent and they're launching their products. In this case, 139 00:07:35,040 --> 00:07:37,400 Speaker 6: a lot of the folks who were working at character 140 00:07:37,520 --> 00:07:43,440 Speaker 6: ai did end up working on Google's projects, and so 141 00:07:44,080 --> 00:07:47,640 Speaker 6: same thing with Microsoft. The folks at Inflection Ai did 142 00:07:47,800 --> 00:07:51,680 Speaker 6: end up working on Microsoft's projects. That didn't happen in 143 00:07:51,720 --> 00:07:55,040 Speaker 6: the case of open ai. Open ai still is kind 144 00:07:55,080 --> 00:07:57,200 Speaker 6: of doing its own thing when it comes to model 145 00:07:57,240 --> 00:08:02,000 Speaker 6: training and everything. Microsoft is licensing the technology. That's not 146 00:08:02,160 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 6: the case here in terms of character Ai, because character 147 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:08,960 Speaker 6: ai was a company with less than two hundred employees 148 00:08:09,600 --> 00:08:13,440 Speaker 6: and Google end up licensing that for almost two point 149 00:08:13,480 --> 00:08:16,720 Speaker 6: five billion. So think of, you know, a license fee 150 00:08:17,200 --> 00:08:19,080 Speaker 6: of two point five billion. 151 00:08:18,840 --> 00:08:22,160 Speaker 7: It feels yeah, yeah, And so. 152 00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:28,160 Speaker 6: I think there was that aspect which was kind of 153 00:08:28,240 --> 00:08:31,800 Speaker 6: in between in terms of how do you make an 154 00:08:31,840 --> 00:08:35,880 Speaker 6: acqua hire without an outright acquisition, and you know, the 155 00:08:35,920 --> 00:08:40,080 Speaker 6: amount was pretty big and everyone was surprised, but all 156 00:08:40,120 --> 00:08:43,600 Speaker 6: these three companies did that one after the other, so 157 00:08:43,679 --> 00:08:46,240 Speaker 6: they somehow got away and now we are seeing the 158 00:08:46,320 --> 00:08:47,520 Speaker 6: DJA is looking into it. 159 00:08:47,559 --> 00:08:48,520 Speaker 4: All right, if I'm. 160 00:08:48,400 --> 00:08:51,200 Speaker 5: On sand Hill Road in Silicon Valley where all the 161 00:08:51,240 --> 00:08:54,280 Speaker 5: smart money is, how do I view this administration here? 162 00:08:54,840 --> 00:08:56,840 Speaker 4: Are they pro tech or non pro tech? 163 00:08:57,960 --> 00:09:02,360 Speaker 6: I think so far they are looking to bring down 164 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:06,319 Speaker 6: the regulations. For sure. We have seen some pretty big 165 00:09:06,360 --> 00:09:09,480 Speaker 6: deals getting announced. I mean the Google's acquisition of wiz 166 00:09:09,559 --> 00:09:13,040 Speaker 6: that is a M and A thirty two billion dollars. Yes, 167 00:09:13,200 --> 00:09:15,679 Speaker 6: and so there has been a flurry of M and 168 00:09:15,760 --> 00:09:19,720 Speaker 6: A activities, so I would say they are pro deal making. 169 00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:23,079 Speaker 6: At the same time, I think with big tech, every 170 00:09:23,160 --> 00:09:26,079 Speaker 6: company is different in terms of you know, how the 171 00:09:26,160 --> 00:09:30,200 Speaker 6: administration views them, and you know, the DOJ and FTC 172 00:09:30,480 --> 00:09:35,000 Speaker 6: have been doing these investigations, so it doesn't surprise me 173 00:09:35,080 --> 00:09:37,680 Speaker 6: that they are looking into it. I doubt you know, 174 00:09:38,600 --> 00:09:41,120 Speaker 6: there will be a big fine, but probably you should 175 00:09:41,120 --> 00:09:44,240 Speaker 6: talk to genery or legal expert if yeah, what she 176 00:09:44,320 --> 00:09:44,959 Speaker 6: thinks about this. 177 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:46,600 Speaker 2: But you know, Paul pointing out that the stock is 178 00:09:46,679 --> 00:09:49,080 Speaker 2: up over three percent, how much of that is like 179 00:09:49,160 --> 00:09:52,240 Speaker 2: ignoring the headlines versus still going back to the AI 180 00:09:52,400 --> 00:09:56,080 Speaker 2: Developer Day for Google where they unveiled the whole suite 181 00:09:56,080 --> 00:09:56,680 Speaker 2: of products. 182 00:09:56,840 --> 00:09:59,720 Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean that was a great event, and overall, 183 00:09:59,760 --> 00:10:03,400 Speaker 6: I think the sentiment this week is still Google's models 184 00:10:03,440 --> 00:10:07,160 Speaker 6: are getting better, their execution is getting better, They're shipping 185 00:10:07,200 --> 00:10:11,560 Speaker 6: a lot more products, So this seems to be something 186 00:10:11,640 --> 00:10:15,280 Speaker 6: that yes they are involved with. At the worst cases, 187 00:10:15,360 --> 00:10:18,320 Speaker 6: they may have to pay a fine, but really nothing 188 00:10:18,400 --> 00:10:21,120 Speaker 6: changes as far as their AI development efforts. 189 00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:23,280 Speaker 5: When I started my career on the street in mid eighties, 190 00:10:23,440 --> 00:10:27,400 Speaker 5: it was all about Microsoft and their regulatory challenges they 191 00:10:27,400 --> 00:10:30,480 Speaker 5: were just starting to go through, primarily with European regulars, 192 00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:32,240 Speaker 5: and we were freaking out like every day, like oh 193 00:10:32,240 --> 00:10:34,720 Speaker 5: my god, it's gonna be And then we look back 194 00:10:34,720 --> 00:10:36,920 Speaker 5: on it ten years later, we're like, Eh, nothing happened. 195 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:39,360 Speaker 5: And I think a whole generation of us have kind 196 00:10:39,360 --> 00:10:43,320 Speaker 5: of become conditioned to viewing big tech and regulation is 197 00:10:43,360 --> 00:10:45,840 Speaker 5: not that big a deal. Don't worry about it. At 198 00:10:45,880 --> 00:10:47,880 Speaker 5: the end, I wonder if we're getting too complacent, though, 199 00:10:48,040 --> 00:10:51,720 Speaker 5: will they ever say Amazon breakup, Google breakupper, you know, 200 00:10:51,760 --> 00:10:52,520 Speaker 5: one of those things. 201 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:57,160 Speaker 6: I mean, there's always a probability of that happening. I 202 00:10:57,200 --> 00:11:00,880 Speaker 6: still think it's a low probability event, given everyone wants 203 00:11:00,960 --> 00:11:05,080 Speaker 6: these companies to do better than the equivalent Chinese companies, 204 00:11:05,160 --> 00:11:09,240 Speaker 6: and so that aspect still remains. And look, the worst 205 00:11:09,280 --> 00:11:13,160 Speaker 6: case with these sort of investigations is these companies may 206 00:11:13,240 --> 00:11:15,200 Speaker 6: end up paying a fine. That's what we have seen 207 00:11:15,200 --> 00:11:17,480 Speaker 6: in the EU. Google has paid over you know, ten 208 00:11:17,520 --> 00:11:20,480 Speaker 6: billion dollars in fines and the stock will still be 209 00:11:20,520 --> 00:11:23,320 Speaker 6: okay because this is just one time. They make the 210 00:11:23,360 --> 00:11:26,920 Speaker 6: remedies and you move on. So I think that's the 211 00:11:26,960 --> 00:11:29,560 Speaker 6: worst case here in terms of a slap on the wrist, 212 00:11:29,640 --> 00:11:32,440 Speaker 6: and you know, you change the behavior. You're not gonna 213 00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:36,280 Speaker 6: do more aqua hires like that, you know, billion dollar aquahires. 214 00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:39,040 Speaker 6: But beyond that, it's hard to fathom. 215 00:11:39,120 --> 00:11:40,760 Speaker 5: All right, Bendep, thank you so much for appreciate a 216 00:11:40,800 --> 00:11:43,680 Speaker 5: man deep seeing senior tech analyst for Bloomberg Intelligence. 217 00:11:45,160 --> 00:11:48,840 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence podcast. Catch us live 218 00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:52,400 Speaker 1: weekdays at ten am Eastern on Applecarplay and Android Auto 219 00:11:52,440 --> 00:11:55,480 Speaker 1: with the Bloomberg Business App, Listen on demand wherever you 220 00:11:55,520 --> 00:11:58,520 Speaker 1: get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube. 221 00:11:59,280 --> 00:12:02,120 Speaker 2: All Right, Walter as President, chief investment officer and managing 222 00:12:02,160 --> 00:12:05,680 Speaker 2: director at Greenwood Capital. I got to say, the markets 223 00:12:05,679 --> 00:12:07,720 Speaker 2: are a little surprising to me. But just take a 224 00:12:07,720 --> 00:12:09,400 Speaker 2: look at the bond market for a second. Is the 225 00:12:09,440 --> 00:12:11,000 Speaker 2: long end getting yippie? 226 00:12:13,800 --> 00:12:17,640 Speaker 8: Yeah, that's a good that's a nice technical term for it. 227 00:12:17,679 --> 00:12:18,400 Speaker 4: Get a little. 228 00:12:18,200 --> 00:12:21,080 Speaker 8: Skintish maybe another way to describe it. You know, the 229 00:12:21,080 --> 00:12:24,520 Speaker 8: twenty year auction yesterday. You know, you definitely look at 230 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:27,040 Speaker 8: the intry day chart and saw the equities key off 231 00:12:27,040 --> 00:12:29,400 Speaker 8: of that twenty years, a little bit of an unusual maturity. 232 00:12:29,440 --> 00:12:32,600 Speaker 8: The FED owns a ton of that sleeve. So not 233 00:12:32,960 --> 00:12:35,960 Speaker 8: that surprising perhaps, but I know everybody's focused on that 234 00:12:35,960 --> 00:12:38,360 Speaker 8: thirty year behind rate, but it was really the ten year. 235 00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:40,040 Speaker 8: It's really the ten year that's key. I mean, that's 236 00:12:40,040 --> 00:12:41,880 Speaker 8: what a lot of assets are priced off of. So 237 00:12:42,240 --> 00:12:44,880 Speaker 8: that's a touch lower today, and you see equities kind 238 00:12:44,880 --> 00:12:45,920 Speaker 8: of key and off of that. 239 00:12:46,360 --> 00:12:48,880 Speaker 5: So those rates are pretty attractive here, Todd, are you 240 00:12:48,880 --> 00:12:53,120 Speaker 5: getting increased discussions with your clients about, hey, should I 241 00:12:53,120 --> 00:12:55,120 Speaker 5: be up in my allocation. 242 00:12:54,760 --> 00:12:55,760 Speaker 4: To fixed income. 243 00:12:55,800 --> 00:12:58,640 Speaker 5: If I can get a two year treasury at four percent, 244 00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:00,600 Speaker 5: I would take maybe a little bit more duration risk 245 00:13:00,640 --> 00:13:02,320 Speaker 5: and get you know, more than five percent on a 246 00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:02,960 Speaker 5: thirty year. 247 00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:07,680 Speaker 8: Not we're not going out of that far, but a 248 00:13:07,679 --> 00:13:09,640 Speaker 8: lot of our accounts are balanced accounts, so we do 249 00:13:09,679 --> 00:13:12,440 Speaker 8: have fixed income exposure within that. You know, our kind 250 00:13:12,440 --> 00:13:15,240 Speaker 8: of target maturity or duration is in that call it 251 00:13:15,280 --> 00:13:18,640 Speaker 8: three to four year range, but that's a bar bell. 252 00:13:18,800 --> 00:13:20,560 Speaker 8: So some you know, one and two year paper as 253 00:13:20,559 --> 00:13:22,640 Speaker 8: well as some you know, maybe five out to seven, 254 00:13:22,679 --> 00:13:25,240 Speaker 8: but nothing really longer than that. So you you know, 255 00:13:25,240 --> 00:13:27,079 Speaker 8: these are attractive vials, as you say, if you put 256 00:13:27,120 --> 00:13:29,040 Speaker 8: a corporate spread on top of that, which have come 257 00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:32,640 Speaker 8: in lately but still decent, you can lock in some 258 00:13:32,640 --> 00:13:34,880 Speaker 8: good rates for a multi year period, which we we 259 00:13:34,960 --> 00:13:38,520 Speaker 8: find attractive. Now, interestingly, you've got several corporate issuers that 260 00:13:38,559 --> 00:13:41,680 Speaker 8: are rated above the US government debt at this point, 261 00:13:41,800 --> 00:13:44,240 Speaker 8: JP Morgan being one of them, J and J another, 262 00:13:45,200 --> 00:13:48,280 Speaker 8: And the credit default swaps for the US government are 263 00:13:48,280 --> 00:13:50,520 Speaker 8: actually higher than they are for JP Morgan at the moment, 264 00:13:50,559 --> 00:13:52,680 Speaker 8: so there's a balancing act there between the two. 265 00:13:54,600 --> 00:13:57,679 Speaker 2: What do you if you kind of ignored the last 266 00:13:57,679 --> 00:14:00,400 Speaker 2: two months, you'd be kind of no worse off unless're 267 00:14:00,400 --> 00:14:02,080 Speaker 2: taling about the bond market or to the dollar than 268 00:14:02,120 --> 00:14:04,400 Speaker 2: you would have been before. So how do you then 269 00:14:04,600 --> 00:14:08,360 Speaker 2: understand equity market volatility going forward? 270 00:14:10,400 --> 00:14:13,120 Speaker 8: Yeah, Alex is a great question, and the equity market 271 00:14:13,240 --> 00:14:16,000 Speaker 8: volatility has been extreme over that. You know, if you've 272 00:14:16,120 --> 00:14:18,000 Speaker 8: gone under a rock, like you say, two months ago 273 00:14:18,040 --> 00:14:21,280 Speaker 8: and come out now, you're basically break even. I think 274 00:14:21,320 --> 00:14:23,520 Speaker 8: we're going to continue to see volatility, and I think 275 00:14:23,800 --> 00:14:26,160 Speaker 8: it's going to be keyed off some of these macro headlines, 276 00:14:26,200 --> 00:14:28,800 Speaker 8: whether that's you know, something affecting interest rates, whether it's 277 00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:30,480 Speaker 8: this bill that has now moved out of the House 278 00:14:30,520 --> 00:14:32,960 Speaker 8: into the Senate, which by the way, this is the 279 00:14:33,280 --> 00:14:34,880 Speaker 8: end of the beginning, now of the beginning of the 280 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:38,160 Speaker 8: end in my opinion, in this process. And then also 281 00:14:38,400 --> 00:14:41,600 Speaker 8: finally earnings, I mean we kind of forget about fundamentals 282 00:14:41,600 --> 00:14:44,240 Speaker 8: of individual companies. They actually came in a bit better 283 00:14:44,960 --> 00:14:47,680 Speaker 8: than expected in the first quarter, but revisions did come 284 00:14:47,720 --> 00:14:50,760 Speaker 8: down quite significantly for the second quarter. So I think 285 00:14:50,800 --> 00:14:52,840 Speaker 8: depending on the time of the year, the month we're in, 286 00:14:52,880 --> 00:14:54,800 Speaker 8: and where we're going to key off of macro headlines, 287 00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:58,160 Speaker 8: or fundamental headlines, and then we had the trade component 288 00:14:58,240 --> 00:15:00,800 Speaker 8: as well, So all of those things mixed together to 289 00:15:01,400 --> 00:15:04,720 Speaker 8: we think, continue some volatility, but you know, take advantage 290 00:15:04,760 --> 00:15:07,240 Speaker 8: of that where you have companies that you you know, 291 00:15:07,240 --> 00:15:09,160 Speaker 8: know and understand and feel like are going to weather 292 00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:09,640 Speaker 8: the storm. 293 00:15:10,480 --> 00:15:12,400 Speaker 4: Walter, what do you make of this the stock market? 294 00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:15,240 Speaker 5: It seemingly we've round tripped almost here off of the 295 00:15:15,440 --> 00:15:17,480 Speaker 5: twenty percent declines we had our earlier New Year when 296 00:15:17,480 --> 00:15:19,760 Speaker 5: people were really trying to get their handle around what 297 00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:23,520 Speaker 5: a world of tariffs means. Are we appropriately priced here? 298 00:15:23,560 --> 00:15:26,560 Speaker 5: Do you think the market's ahead of itself or is 299 00:15:26,600 --> 00:15:27,520 Speaker 5: there still upside here? 300 00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:27,880 Speaker 4: Do you think? 301 00:15:28,840 --> 00:15:31,720 Speaker 8: Yeah? I think I think in the near term the markets, 302 00:15:32,040 --> 00:15:33,480 Speaker 8: you know, come a long way in a very short 303 00:15:33,520 --> 00:15:35,800 Speaker 8: period of time and is probably as Jamie Dimond I 304 00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:39,440 Speaker 8: think use the term complacent to describe investors. We would 305 00:15:39,480 --> 00:15:42,160 Speaker 8: tend to agree with that. Where we are today, I 306 00:15:42,160 --> 00:15:44,360 Speaker 8: don't think we're pricing in a lot of risks. We're 307 00:15:44,360 --> 00:15:46,320 Speaker 8: pricing in a lot of deals that have been talked 308 00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:49,480 Speaker 8: about happening but haven't happened on the trade front yet. 309 00:15:49,560 --> 00:15:52,040 Speaker 8: So what we've been doing is just trying to stay 310 00:15:52,040 --> 00:15:55,280 Speaker 8: disciplined on our sizing within positions, so names that have 311 00:15:55,320 --> 00:15:57,480 Speaker 8: run significantly in the past five to six weeks. If 312 00:15:57,480 --> 00:15:58,960 Speaker 8: we have a target of two and a half percent 313 00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:01,960 Speaker 8: and that weights now well over three percent, we're running 314 00:16:02,000 --> 00:16:04,120 Speaker 8: that back to model as we call it for example. 315 00:16:04,840 --> 00:16:07,400 Speaker 8: So just trying to stay disciplined within the process and 316 00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:09,800 Speaker 8: you know, take advantage of the move that we've had 317 00:16:09,840 --> 00:16:13,000 Speaker 8: and look kind of reload for some more opportunities to 318 00:16:13,040 --> 00:16:14,680 Speaker 8: come if. 319 00:16:14,440 --> 00:16:16,800 Speaker 2: We do get this big, beautiful bill of passed, I mean, 320 00:16:16,800 --> 00:16:20,920 Speaker 2: get tax cuts or tax cuts extension if we wind 321 00:16:21,000 --> 00:16:25,360 Speaker 2: up getting deregulation and the Fed, as William said earlier today, 322 00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:27,920 Speaker 2: could cut in July. If tariffs come down to ten percent. 323 00:16:28,600 --> 00:16:31,960 Speaker 2: Is this like a complete then bull market? Like, can 324 00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:34,560 Speaker 2: we finally look towards discounting all that good news? 325 00:16:36,800 --> 00:16:37,880 Speaker 7: Yeah? This is last to me. 326 00:16:38,920 --> 00:16:41,400 Speaker 8: Yeah no, but I mean there's a long way from 327 00:16:41,400 --> 00:16:43,240 Speaker 8: here to there. I guess I would say, you know, 328 00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:46,920 Speaker 8: so as it relates to the FED, I think it's 329 00:16:46,920 --> 00:16:48,960 Speaker 8: a stretch to say that we go in July, because 330 00:16:49,320 --> 00:16:51,880 Speaker 8: you got to think about all this this bill includes, 331 00:16:52,280 --> 00:16:55,640 Speaker 8: you know, is kind of pro growth post stimulus that's 332 00:16:55,640 --> 00:16:57,920 Speaker 8: going to create upward pressure on prices. You would think 333 00:16:57,960 --> 00:17:00,560 Speaker 8: if if growth improves, so I think the Fed's going 334 00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:01,920 Speaker 8: to be on hold, so I don't think they're going 335 00:17:01,960 --> 00:17:05,720 Speaker 8: to come into the picture, probably till the fall. But yeah, no, listen, 336 00:17:05,760 --> 00:17:08,920 Speaker 8: if you incrementally get this bill passed, the debt ceiling increased, 337 00:17:08,960 --> 00:17:11,160 Speaker 8: if you get some trade deals, you know, we're gonna 338 00:17:11,240 --> 00:17:13,359 Speaker 8: run up on that ninety day first wind ninety day 339 00:17:13,400 --> 00:17:15,959 Speaker 8: window in early July. So we've got to see some 340 00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:18,439 Speaker 8: progress there. But yeah, it could create the catalyst to 341 00:17:18,840 --> 00:17:20,480 Speaker 8: for us to move up through those highs that we 342 00:17:20,560 --> 00:17:23,240 Speaker 8: hit in February and beyond. I just think between now 343 00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:26,640 Speaker 8: and then we could see some you know, some downside. 344 00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:28,119 Speaker 4: Walter, thanks so much for joining us. 345 00:17:28,119 --> 00:17:29,800 Speaker 5: Always appreciate getting a few minutes of your time. 346 00:17:29,840 --> 00:17:30,440 Speaker 4: Walter Todd. 347 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:33,199 Speaker 5: He's a president, chief estiment officer, and managing director at 348 00:17:33,240 --> 00:17:38,000 Speaker 5: Greenwood Capital, located in Greenwood, South Carolina, which I googled. 349 00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:41,200 Speaker 5: A little bit west of Columbia, South Carolina, a little 350 00:17:41,200 --> 00:17:43,920 Speaker 5: bit north of Augusta, Georgia, a little bit south of Greenwood, 351 00:17:44,480 --> 00:17:46,480 Speaker 5: a Greek Greenville, South Carolina's right back in. 352 00:17:46,480 --> 00:17:47,960 Speaker 4: The middle of the great. 353 00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:51,000 Speaker 5: State of South Carolina. Some good stuff down there. 354 00:17:51,680 --> 00:17:55,359 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast. Catch us live 355 00:17:55,440 --> 00:17:58,800 Speaker 1: weekdays at ten am Eastern on Applecarcklay and Android Auto 356 00:17:58,920 --> 00:18:03,000 Speaker 1: with the Bloombergs. Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, 357 00:18:03,280 --> 00:18:05,040 Speaker 1: or watch us live on YouTube. 358 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:08,119 Speaker 2: This is Bloomberg Intelligence Radio. We bring you all the 359 00:18:08,160 --> 00:18:10,400 Speaker 2: top news and business, economics and finance through our lens 360 00:18:10,440 --> 00:18:13,240 Speaker 2: of our Bloomberg Intelligence folks. We also cover all the 361 00:18:13,280 --> 00:18:16,800 Speaker 2: great news that comes out of Bloomberg and every day 362 00:18:16,960 --> 00:18:18,879 Speaker 2: we try and hit the big take story. It's a 363 00:18:18,920 --> 00:18:21,760 Speaker 2: deep dive into some of the pressing issues of our time, 364 00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:24,000 Speaker 2: and today is no different. We're joined now in the 365 00:18:24,040 --> 00:18:27,520 Speaker 2: studio by Max Abelson and Anni Massa from Bloomberg News. 366 00:18:27,560 --> 00:18:30,879 Speaker 2: They had an in depth piece about Trump's President Trump's 367 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:37,200 Speaker 2: families money making machine. What is the money making machine? 368 00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:37,520 Speaker 7: Max? 369 00:18:37,760 --> 00:18:39,720 Speaker 9: You know, if it were able, if we were able 370 00:18:39,760 --> 00:18:42,199 Speaker 9: to put it into one word or one line, we 371 00:18:42,359 --> 00:18:45,040 Speaker 9: really would have. Unfortunately, it does take like four thousand 372 00:18:45,119 --> 00:18:46,320 Speaker 9: words to describe. 373 00:18:46,240 --> 00:18:49,240 Speaker 7: Because the machine is really, really big. 374 00:18:49,359 --> 00:18:51,480 Speaker 9: I think the way what we ended up deciding is 375 00:18:51,480 --> 00:18:56,320 Speaker 9: that no modern American president has ever positioned his family 376 00:18:56,520 --> 00:18:59,640 Speaker 9: to make this much money while in the White House. 377 00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:04,080 Speaker 9: You can't you can't oversimplify it either as a supporter 378 00:19:04,240 --> 00:19:06,320 Speaker 9: or is a critic. You can't say, oh, what he's 379 00:19:06,320 --> 00:19:08,680 Speaker 9: doing is crypto, or oh, what he's doing is licensing 380 00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:10,720 Speaker 9: his name, or oh what he's doing is going overseas, 381 00:19:10,840 --> 00:19:14,760 Speaker 9: or what what the family is doing is making corporate connections. 382 00:19:15,000 --> 00:19:16,120 Speaker 7: That it really is. 383 00:19:16,200 --> 00:19:18,520 Speaker 9: We ended up thinking about this as basically an atlas, 384 00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:21,520 Speaker 9: an outlass to what the Trump family is doing. 385 00:19:22,720 --> 00:19:26,800 Speaker 7: You know, it's to take it seriously and to really 386 00:19:26,840 --> 00:19:27,880 Speaker 7: focus on. 387 00:19:27,880 --> 00:19:30,960 Speaker 9: The facts and on the numbers and on the places. 388 00:19:31,880 --> 00:19:33,919 Speaker 9: It was real work, and I was and I was actually, 389 00:19:34,080 --> 00:19:34,720 Speaker 9: dare I say. 390 00:19:34,520 --> 00:19:36,480 Speaker 7: Even fun to work with Anyon. I'm trying to figure 391 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:36,760 Speaker 7: it out. 392 00:19:36,760 --> 00:19:40,680 Speaker 5: Hey there, So Annie, I mean, is this I guess 393 00:19:40,800 --> 00:19:42,560 Speaker 5: part of the question is depending on Hey, you look 394 00:19:42,560 --> 00:19:42,760 Speaker 5: at it. 395 00:19:42,800 --> 00:19:46,320 Speaker 4: Is this legal? Is it ethical? What are the folks 396 00:19:46,320 --> 00:19:47,359 Speaker 4: in Washington saying? 397 00:19:48,200 --> 00:19:52,200 Speaker 10: Well, when when you look at the scale of what's happening. 398 00:19:52,280 --> 00:19:56,760 Speaker 10: Even just today, President Trump has announced that he's going 399 00:19:56,840 --> 00:20:00,240 Speaker 10: to allow the largest holders of his meme coin to 400 00:20:00,280 --> 00:20:03,320 Speaker 10: come to a special VIP event. So one of the 401 00:20:03,440 --> 00:20:07,080 Speaker 10: challenges of working on the story was that almost week 402 00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:11,800 Speaker 10: by week there would be new details to add. And 403 00:20:11,880 --> 00:20:13,879 Speaker 10: I think what Max and I found was that to 404 00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:19,080 Speaker 10: go through each of these different categories. We covered real estate, 405 00:20:19,280 --> 00:20:22,800 Speaker 10: we covered crypto, we covered this kind of grab bag 406 00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:26,600 Speaker 10: of other ventures that the Trump family has become involved in, 407 00:20:27,200 --> 00:20:30,800 Speaker 10: you have to go really deep into each one, and 408 00:20:31,600 --> 00:20:36,240 Speaker 10: there's a high velocity of new deals coming now. From 409 00:20:36,280 --> 00:20:41,080 Speaker 10: the ethical standpoint, what the Trump family has decided to 410 00:20:41,119 --> 00:20:45,320 Speaker 10: do is they've issued an ethics plan for Trump's second term, 411 00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:47,560 Speaker 10: as they did in his first term. The way that 412 00:20:47,560 --> 00:20:50,639 Speaker 10: they've handled it is by putting President Trump's assets in 413 00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:54,080 Speaker 10: a trust which is overseen by his son, Donald Trump Junior. 414 00:20:55,560 --> 00:20:57,960 Speaker 10: But there are some differences in the ethics plan of 415 00:20:58,160 --> 00:21:01,320 Speaker 10: Trump's first term and his second term this time around. 416 00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:02,400 Speaker 4: As we note in. 417 00:21:02,359 --> 00:21:08,080 Speaker 10: The story, the ban on new foreign deals that existed 418 00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:11,160 Speaker 10: last time is no longer in place, and you can 419 00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:14,480 Speaker 10: see the new deals popping up all the time. 420 00:21:14,640 --> 00:21:17,440 Speaker 9: I found it very liberating, actually, to in our work, 421 00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:20,200 Speaker 9: rather than putting ourselves in a position where we wanted 422 00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:23,240 Speaker 9: to say Trump is the most amazing president and everything 423 00:21:23,280 --> 00:21:25,720 Speaker 9: he does is amazing, or being in a position where 424 00:21:25,760 --> 00:21:27,320 Speaker 9: we have to say Trump is the worst president and 425 00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:29,600 Speaker 9: everything he does is illegal. What we tried to do 426 00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:31,960 Speaker 9: is just to understand peace by piece the way the 427 00:21:31,960 --> 00:21:35,439 Speaker 9: family is making money, and it was helpful to just 428 00:21:35,640 --> 00:21:38,760 Speaker 9: use Trump's own words and own plan. Last time around, 429 00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:42,120 Speaker 9: in the first administration, he was unwilling for the family to. 430 00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:44,159 Speaker 7: Do new deals around the world. 431 00:21:45,160 --> 00:21:49,760 Speaker 9: This time the family is embracing deals around the world, 432 00:21:49,840 --> 00:21:52,840 Speaker 9: and by their own account, what they're not allowing is 433 00:21:52,880 --> 00:21:55,560 Speaker 9: deals with foreign governments. And when Andy and I look closely, 434 00:21:55,800 --> 00:22:00,000 Speaker 9: what we found is that there are some deals, especially 435 00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:04,040 Speaker 9: in Oman especially and Cutter, that really test the. 436 00:22:04,119 --> 00:22:07,280 Speaker 7: Edge of that agreement. They are with arms of governments. 437 00:22:07,280 --> 00:22:09,520 Speaker 9: Now it may not necessarily be the Trump organization doing 438 00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:12,920 Speaker 9: these deals. Sometimes their entities kind of in between. There's 439 00:22:12,920 --> 00:22:16,000 Speaker 9: this one developer called dar Global. So what we're hoping 440 00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:18,359 Speaker 9: listeners out there will do is read our story because 441 00:22:18,359 --> 00:22:21,960 Speaker 9: we really tried to vary carefully and without kind of 442 00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:25,639 Speaker 9: without doing anything but the facts. Just really tried to 443 00:22:25,760 --> 00:22:28,280 Speaker 9: understand everything about this money making machine. 444 00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:33,160 Speaker 2: So how much of this money making machine are real 445 00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:36,440 Speaker 2: deals based on like properties and hotels, and how much 446 00:22:36,480 --> 00:22:40,560 Speaker 2: of it are like NFTs and capitalizing more on this 447 00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:43,080 Speaker 2: on the celebrity that is President Trump. 448 00:22:42,960 --> 00:22:44,920 Speaker 9: It would be so bad to pick one or the other. 449 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:46,800 Speaker 9: And he pointed out that is the mean coin dinner 450 00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:49,840 Speaker 9: literally tonight Chinese. Second, that's literally tonight. 451 00:22:49,920 --> 00:22:51,760 Speaker 2: That's why your story came out see the newspag there. 452 00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:54,440 Speaker 9: But there's so many other things too. Annie was really 453 00:22:54,520 --> 00:22:56,919 Speaker 9: good in particular at finding like these new corporate connections. 454 00:22:57,440 --> 00:22:58,760 Speaker 7: Yeah. One thing. 455 00:22:59,119 --> 00:23:03,159 Speaker 10: So it's kind of a everyone kind of knows that 456 00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:07,159 Speaker 10: Trump real Estate Empire has in many ways moved for 457 00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:11,320 Speaker 10: a long time, been moving toward licensing the Trump brand 458 00:23:11,760 --> 00:23:14,880 Speaker 10: for hotels and developments. That's a big that's a big 459 00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:17,640 Speaker 10: part of what they do now. But what's new or 460 00:23:17,680 --> 00:23:20,800 Speaker 10: in the second term, is you see his sons, Eric 461 00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:25,359 Speaker 10: Trump and Donald Trump Junior joining the boards of companies 462 00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:30,280 Speaker 10: both private and public, and lending the name in a 463 00:23:30,320 --> 00:23:33,720 Speaker 10: way to those companies. And what tends to happen when 464 00:23:33,840 --> 00:23:38,359 Speaker 10: they join, either in an executive role or as advisors is, 465 00:23:38,400 --> 00:23:41,200 Speaker 10: at least in the case of public companies, sometimes the 466 00:23:41,640 --> 00:23:45,399 Speaker 10: share price of those companies will go flying. So it 467 00:23:45,560 --> 00:23:49,720 Speaker 10: shows the celebrity to your point and name that they 468 00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:52,040 Speaker 10: that they bring into the business world into all these 469 00:23:52,040 --> 00:23:56,560 Speaker 10: different ventures, including in crypto, but in other realms too, 470 00:23:56,680 --> 00:23:57,560 Speaker 10: like prediction markets. 471 00:23:57,880 --> 00:23:59,919 Speaker 9: And to be fair, what Donald Trump Junior will say. 472 00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:02,640 Speaker 9: And what he said to us is, I'm a private citizen. 473 00:24:02,880 --> 00:24:05,159 Speaker 9: I've been a businessman all my life. It's ridiculous to 474 00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:07,359 Speaker 9: expect me to stop doing what I do just because 475 00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:08,600 Speaker 9: my dad is president. 476 00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:09,960 Speaker 7: And then what Donald. 477 00:24:09,720 --> 00:24:12,480 Speaker 9: Trump will say, a White House Pokesverson said to us 478 00:24:12,560 --> 00:24:16,200 Speaker 9: is I'm transparent and I handed over this multi billion 479 00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:19,280 Speaker 9: dollar empire to serve our country. The White House described 480 00:24:19,320 --> 00:24:23,200 Speaker 9: at President Trump as making a great sacrifice. I think 481 00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:25,080 Speaker 9: it's really helpful, though, to just look at the numbers, 482 00:24:25,119 --> 00:24:27,000 Speaker 9: and I just want to quickly mention what we found 483 00:24:27,160 --> 00:24:30,000 Speaker 9: is that the Trump name is powering more than ten 484 00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:33,280 Speaker 9: billion dollars of real estate projects since the re election 485 00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:37,240 Speaker 9: campaign began. A multi billion dollar valuation for the social 486 00:24:37,240 --> 00:24:39,960 Speaker 9: media company, a money losing social media company that just 487 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:42,400 Speaker 9: went public. I mean, you forget it went public last year, 488 00:24:43,280 --> 00:24:46,080 Speaker 9: plus the money from crypto, plus the money from corporate connections. 489 00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:48,440 Speaker 9: I think it's worth taking the time to kind of 490 00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:50,280 Speaker 9: wrap your arms around it, because it really is sort 491 00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:52,439 Speaker 9: of I guess, unlike anything I've ever reported on. 492 00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:55,240 Speaker 5: Again, what I noticed is in this reporting that the 493 00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:58,080 Speaker 5: first overseas strict President Trump made in his second term 494 00:24:58,080 --> 00:24:59,560 Speaker 5: as to the Middle East and I'm just looking at 495 00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:02,280 Speaker 5: your reporting here, and when you talk about the real estate, 496 00:25:02,320 --> 00:25:08,639 Speaker 5: it's Riad, it's Jetta, it's Oman, it's. 497 00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:09,840 Speaker 4: You know, simi Isma, which I don't know where that is. 498 00:25:09,840 --> 00:25:11,720 Speaker 4: I think it's cutter cutter. So there I see the 499 00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:13,360 Speaker 4: you know, the connection. 500 00:25:13,720 --> 00:25:15,520 Speaker 5: You know, does it make sense that he this first 501 00:25:15,560 --> 00:25:17,400 Speaker 5: overseas trip would be to the Middle East? 502 00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:21,160 Speaker 4: So interesting? Any masset Max Abelson reporters Bloomberg News. 503 00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:24,119 Speaker 5: This is the big take story here today, the Trump's 504 00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:27,440 Speaker 5: family money making machine again as Max and and he 505 00:25:27,520 --> 00:25:31,160 Speaker 5: reported more than ten billion dollars of deals announced since 506 00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:34,680 Speaker 5: his re election got started. Here. 507 00:25:35,840 --> 00:25:40,520 Speaker 1: This is the Bloomberg Intelligence podcast, available on Apple, Spotify, 508 00:25:40,720 --> 00:25:44,200 Speaker 1: and anywhere else you get your podcasts. 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