WEBVTT - Hating Your Body Is Solvable 0:00:15.076 --> 0:00:26.956 Pushkin, this is solvable. I'm Ronald Young Jr. So normally 0:00:26.956 --> 0:00:28.436 this is the part of the show where we hit 0:00:28.476 --> 0:00:30.636 you with the voice of our guests, and we do 0:00:30.716 --> 0:00:33.396 have a guest today, but before we hear from her, 0:00:33.636 --> 0:00:36.156 I wanted to note that last week's discussion with Michael 0:00:36.156 --> 0:00:39.356 Moss on food addiction and this week's topic are both 0:00:39.476 --> 0:00:42.316 personal ones for me. I've been on a weight loss 0:00:42.396 --> 0:00:46.516 journey since I graduated from college, but I've hated my 0:00:46.556 --> 0:00:50.396 body my entire life. I've always felt chubby and out 0:00:50.436 --> 0:00:52.596 of shape, even when I was at my smallest size. 0:00:53.236 --> 0:00:56.676 Even now, as I'm still trying to lose weight, I'm 0:00:56.716 --> 0:00:59.196 working to find a way to love my body, no 0:00:59.236 --> 0:01:02.996 matter what size it is. Our conversation today is with 0:01:03.076 --> 0:01:05.036 someone who's work I've turned to over the years for 0:01:05.156 --> 0:01:09.996 encouragement and now for solutions. The goal is to not 0:01:10.036 --> 0:01:11.916 hate yourself, right, and so there's also a term called 0:01:11.916 --> 0:01:15.556 body acceptance that embody neutrality that's becoming more popularized now. 0:01:15.556 --> 0:01:16.996 I think that a lot of us are striving for 0:01:17.356 --> 0:01:19.756 because it also feels unattainable for a lot of us 0:01:19.836 --> 0:01:22.956 to quote unquote love our bodies all the time. About 0:01:22.956 --> 0:01:26.636 two thirds of American adults are classified as overweight or obese, 0:01:27.476 --> 0:01:30.356 so it may be unsurprising that in twenty nineteen, the 0:01:30.436 --> 0:01:33.156 weight loss and diet control market was valued at around 0:01:33.236 --> 0:01:37.436 seventy eight billion dollars. Even as we work to change 0:01:37.436 --> 0:01:41.556 our bodies, many Americans like me are also fighting the 0:01:41.596 --> 0:01:45.516 stigma that comes with being classified as fat. It never 0:01:45.596 --> 0:01:50.876 really used the word to describe individuals who haven't already 0:01:50.956 --> 0:01:53.196 used that word to describe themselves, because I do think, 0:01:53.236 --> 0:01:54.836 of course, you have to be aware that it does 0:01:54.916 --> 0:01:58.356 come with, you know, people sensitivity, and people have different 0:01:58.356 --> 0:02:01.276 feelings about the word, so I do get that. Gabby Gregg, 0:02:01.476 --> 0:02:04.076 also known as Gabby Fresh, was my portal into the 0:02:04.116 --> 0:02:07.236 world of plus size fashion and body inclusivity. For the 0:02:07.276 --> 0:02:10.516 past decade, She's been an outsn advocate for looking and 0:02:10.516 --> 0:02:13.716 feeling dope in your clothes for folks of all sizes. 0:02:14.076 --> 0:02:17.076 She's been and continues to be a cheerleader for showing 0:02:17.116 --> 0:02:19.996 skin with confidence, even as a lot of our society 0:02:20.236 --> 0:02:23.716 tells us bigger folks to hide it. Her lingerie and 0:02:23.716 --> 0:02:26.516 bikini lines woke up the fashion industry at a time 0:02:26.516 --> 0:02:30.676 when most popular brands didn't manufacture clothing beyond the size eighteen. 0:02:31.236 --> 0:02:34.396 I'm Gabby Fresh. I'm a body positive digital content creator, 0:02:34.476 --> 0:02:40.596 and hating your body is a solvable problem. Why is 0:02:40.596 --> 0:02:45.076 it important for the plus sized community to be able 0:02:45.076 --> 0:02:47.996 to wear bikinis, to be able to wear lingerie that fits? 0:02:48.276 --> 0:02:51.476 Why is that important? Number one, we deserve the same 0:02:51.596 --> 0:02:54.316 access to the same trends and things as everyone else. 0:02:54.436 --> 0:02:58.556 So just baseline, we deserve beautiful bikinis and lingerie because 0:02:58.556 --> 0:03:01.076 everyone else has it, and why shouldn't we. But beyond that, 0:03:01.196 --> 0:03:05.356 I think the bigger mission is to help people feel 0:03:05.396 --> 0:03:08.956 good in their bodies. And we've been told historically as 0:03:09.316 --> 0:03:11.636 people that we should not feel good in our bodies, 0:03:11.636 --> 0:03:13.796 that we should not show our skin, that we should 0:03:13.836 --> 0:03:16.356 cover up and hide and be invisible. And so a 0:03:16.396 --> 0:03:19.916 two piece swimsuit is kind of the most skin you're 0:03:19.916 --> 0:03:21.836 ever probably going to be able to show in public, 0:03:22.116 --> 0:03:24.276 And so that has to be an experience where you 0:03:24.396 --> 0:03:28.836 feel like you should be seen and should be accepted 0:03:28.916 --> 0:03:31.116 and should feel good in your skin and so like, 0:03:31.756 --> 0:03:33.956 because it also feels unattainable for a lot of us 0:03:34.196 --> 0:03:36.476 to quote unquote love our bodies all the time, and 0:03:36.596 --> 0:03:39.116 even I I definitely don't love my body every single day. 0:03:39.156 --> 0:03:41.316 I'm not obsessed with it, but it's more about kind 0:03:41.356 --> 0:03:43.716 of overcoming this culture that tells us we have to 0:03:43.716 --> 0:03:46.276 hate ourselves and constantly be on a weight loss journey. 0:03:46.596 --> 0:03:48.756 That's kind of a body positivity and fat positivity is 0:03:48.756 --> 0:03:52.596 even more radical where and it's I say that ironically, 0:03:52.636 --> 0:03:54.636 like it shouldn't be radical, but the idea that you 0:03:54.716 --> 0:03:58.756 can accept and love your body even if it's fat, 0:03:58.796 --> 0:04:01.316 which in our culture, of course, the word fat has 0:04:01.316 --> 0:04:04.156 been so stigmatized and so associated with things like lazy 0:04:04.316 --> 0:04:07.436 or unhealthy or a million other things, and so it's 0:04:07.476 --> 0:04:09.476 really this idea. It says like, no, you can be 0:04:09.516 --> 0:04:11.556 fat and happy, you can be fat and beautiful. You 0:04:11.556 --> 0:04:14.436 can be fat and all of these other amazing things. 0:04:14.436 --> 0:04:16.756 And to really accept that and learn that, I think 0:04:16.876 --> 0:04:20.236 is kind of transformative idea and process to go through. 0:04:20.396 --> 0:04:24.436 Is it somebody who has lived that experience? So I 0:04:24.476 --> 0:04:27.276 grew up. I didn't grow up like I didn't get 0:04:27.316 --> 0:04:29.596 I didn't gain a lot of weight until after college. 0:04:29.676 --> 0:04:32.196 But I grew up being pretty average size I guess 0:04:32.236 --> 0:04:35.836 they would describe, But I remember the entire time always 0:04:35.876 --> 0:04:38.796 never being a big fan of by size or seeing 0:04:38.836 --> 0:04:40.716 other people that were in better shape, and I was 0:04:40.836 --> 0:04:42.676 just back when I was an average kid. And I'm 0:04:42.676 --> 0:04:44.436 also one of those people that looks back at pictures 0:04:44.436 --> 0:04:46.236 it says, I can't believe I thought I was fat 0:04:46.276 --> 0:04:49.556 then versus now. So can you talk a little bit 0:04:49.556 --> 0:04:52.436 about that. Look what that looked like for you growing 0:04:52.516 --> 0:04:55.076 up and kind of what set you what made this 0:04:55.156 --> 0:04:59.156 such a journey that was you were kind of drawn to. Sure, 0:04:59.356 --> 0:05:02.636 I was kind of average size until middle school. I 0:05:02.676 --> 0:05:05.756 started getting chubby around faither sixth grade, and I remember, 0:05:05.916 --> 0:05:09.596 specifically for me, I actually moved schools from like public, 0:05:10.076 --> 0:05:14.236 diverse school to a private, very white school, and that 0:05:14.356 --> 0:05:17.276 is where I became super self aware of not only 0:05:17.596 --> 0:05:21.756 my race and my class, but also my size. Like 0:05:21.756 --> 0:05:23.556 all three of those kind of converged at once for 0:05:23.556 --> 0:05:26.076 me because I was surrounded by like rich, thin white girls, 0:05:26.276 --> 0:05:30.076 and I had never felt so ostracized and so othered before. 0:05:30.516 --> 0:05:32.076 And again, just like you, though, I look back at 0:05:32.116 --> 0:05:33.916 those pictures now of me when I was like ten, eleven, 0:05:33.996 --> 0:05:35.676 twelve years old, and I'm like, I can't believe this 0:05:35.716 --> 0:05:39.076 little girl hated her body. In college, I had a 0:05:39.076 --> 0:05:41.676 live journal, which is kind of funny to say now, 0:05:41.716 --> 0:05:44.756 But at the time, they were basically these online forums 0:05:44.796 --> 0:05:47.436 and diaries where you shared your day with people, and 0:05:47.556 --> 0:05:49.676 I found different communities there, and one that I was 0:05:49.676 --> 0:05:54.836 introduced to was specifically for plus size fashion and politics, 0:05:54.876 --> 0:05:56.956 and that really opened my eyes for the first time 0:05:56.996 --> 0:05:59.396 to the fact that other people who looked like me 0:05:59.436 --> 0:06:03.076 and had my body type were happy and were kind 0:06:03.076 --> 0:06:05.596 of against diet culture in Okay with the bodies they 0:06:05.636 --> 0:06:08.196 lived in. And so from there, I decided to start 0:06:08.236 --> 0:06:11.316 a blog called Young and Fabulous and be a resource 0:06:11.396 --> 0:06:14.356 for not only my own outfits, but also just like 0:06:15.156 --> 0:06:17.876 a place where women could come and learn about what's trending, 0:06:17.956 --> 0:06:21.276 how where to shop, talk in the comments, and give 0:06:21.276 --> 0:06:23.756 each other advice and all of that, because one of 0:06:23.796 --> 0:06:25.676 the things back then there was nowhere to shop, so 0:06:25.756 --> 0:06:27.516 I kind of shared tips on like how to make 0:06:27.556 --> 0:06:29.556 things work for you even if they're not in your size, 0:06:29.596 --> 0:06:31.036 and so that's how I started my blog. It was 0:06:31.076 --> 0:06:32.756 one of the first of its kind back in two 0:06:32.756 --> 0:06:35.836 thousand and eight, and so because of that, MTV reached 0:06:35.836 --> 0:06:37.756 out and I credit you for kind of being my 0:06:37.836 --> 0:06:41.196 portal into the world of inclusivity when it comes to 0:06:41.276 --> 0:06:44.396 plus size bodies, especially because you were a Twitter, VJ. 0:06:44.676 --> 0:06:48.396 Was it twenty twelve, twenty eleven? Okay, and so now 0:06:48.436 --> 0:06:52.076 it's twenty twenty one obviously, and Instagram is filled with 0:06:52.076 --> 0:06:55.276 plus size influencers, lots of people speaking about body positivity. 0:06:55.556 --> 0:06:57.036 I remember you were the one, the first one to 0:06:57.076 --> 0:06:59.916 put out of the fat knie I remember, or the 0:06:59.956 --> 0:07:01.956 earliest one that I remember. A lot of that was 0:07:01.996 --> 0:07:03.836 all you were kind of the tip of the spear 0:07:04.196 --> 0:07:06.276 and a lot of those ways. How did you find 0:07:06.276 --> 0:07:10.036 yourself being in front when it came to making bus 0:07:10.076 --> 0:07:13.636 size bikinis, making plus size laundry? So after I left MTV, 0:07:13.716 --> 0:07:16.556 I actually was approached by in Style magazine to become 0:07:16.716 --> 0:07:19.236 their first plus size editor and launch a page on 0:07:19.276 --> 0:07:21.956 plus size fashion. There. One of the things I shared 0:07:22.076 --> 0:07:24.716 early on, I think, I believe in twenty ten or 0:07:24.716 --> 0:07:26.836 twenty eleven, when I was at MTV, we went to 0:07:26.916 --> 0:07:29.636 Las Vegas for an award show, and when I was 0:07:29.756 --> 0:07:31.596 at a Vegas pool, I shared a photo of me 0:07:31.676 --> 0:07:34.876 in a bikini, and that bikini was so hard to find. 0:07:34.956 --> 0:07:37.796 It was like I could had to search the internet 0:07:37.876 --> 0:07:40.156 high and low, and I was so excited to find 0:07:40.196 --> 0:07:42.996 it and I posted it and people freaked out because 0:07:42.996 --> 0:07:44.876 They were like, oh my god, bikinis exist for us. 0:07:44.876 --> 0:07:46.756 We didn't know that, Like where did you get this? 0:07:46.876 --> 0:07:48.676 And it was so hard to tell them like, actually, 0:07:48.676 --> 0:07:50.516 this only goes up to a size eighteen, but like, 0:07:50.556 --> 0:07:53.076 here's the place I got it. Not long after that, 0:07:53.156 --> 0:07:58.036 I was approached by an online retailer called Swimsuits for All, 0:07:58.076 --> 0:08:00.356 who asked if I'd be interested in doing a capsule 0:08:00.396 --> 0:08:03.036 collection with them. I said yes because there was so 0:08:03.196 --> 0:08:07.636 few kind of fashion forward and trendy swimsuit options for us, 0:08:07.756 --> 0:08:11.356 and so I was nervous. It was my first time designing, 0:08:11.356 --> 0:08:12.956 It was my first time putting out a product. I 0:08:12.956 --> 0:08:14.796 didn't know exactly how it would be received, but I 0:08:14.876 --> 0:08:17.116 did know that demand was there, and so when that 0:08:17.276 --> 0:08:20.836 launched in twenty twelve, it immediately went viral, kind of 0:08:20.836 --> 0:08:24.116 broke the Internet and broke their website. Actually their website crashed. 0:08:24.236 --> 0:08:28.156 It sold out immediately, and I think everyone was just like, Wow, 0:08:28.436 --> 0:08:31.236 this is a game changer, because I think even, you know, 0:08:31.316 --> 0:08:33.476 even the brand didn't realize how big of a demand 0:08:33.476 --> 0:08:35.796 there was, and I the market at large definitely didn't 0:08:35.836 --> 0:08:38.196 realize because there were none that existed, and they thought 0:08:38.196 --> 0:08:40.476 that anyone who was plus sized would not want to 0:08:40.476 --> 0:08:42.196 show skin, would not want to be in a bikini. 0:08:42.556 --> 0:08:45.116 So to see that kind of demand and reaction I 0:08:45.156 --> 0:08:48.316 think kind of really changed the marketplace. And since then, 0:08:48.676 --> 0:08:52.556 each year the plus size swim market has grown exponentially, 0:08:52.836 --> 0:09:06.116 and like, that's really exciting for me, Gabby. I personally 0:09:06.156 --> 0:09:10.516 feel that the limited availability of size fuels the self 0:09:10.596 --> 0:09:14.676 hatred many people experience around their bodies, Like, if you 0:09:14.716 --> 0:09:17.836 can't find your size, it's like society telling you you 0:09:17.836 --> 0:09:20.996 shouldn't exist. Recently, I went to buy a suit and 0:09:21.156 --> 0:09:22.876 I'm a big guy, but it's by no means I 0:09:22.956 --> 0:09:24.596 possible for me to find a suit on a rack 0:09:24.796 --> 0:09:27.596 at the store, and the experience was pretty upsetting. As 0:09:27.636 --> 0:09:30.596 I walked in the suit, guys typically do this thing 0:09:30.676 --> 0:09:33.036 where they're just like, well, I mean, I don't know, 0:09:33.076 --> 0:09:35.196 we might need to find some more material, and you know, 0:09:35.236 --> 0:09:36.716 I don't know, this is gonna be it's gonna be 0:09:36.756 --> 0:09:39.236 a struggle, and I feel like that's that's always hard. 0:09:39.676 --> 0:09:42.076 One thing that's always been inspirational to me is being 0:09:42.116 --> 0:09:45.356 able to see a lot of plus size influencers, primarily 0:09:45.356 --> 0:09:47.796 women that are like really in the space and looking 0:09:47.796 --> 0:09:50.556 beautiful and lots of clothes, and I see that fashion 0:09:50.636 --> 0:09:54.636 choices are beginning to Expand do you think that women's 0:09:54.676 --> 0:09:57.916 fashion when it comes to plus size clothing has outpaced 0:09:58.076 --> 0:10:01.036 men's fashion when it comes to plus size clothing, Because 0:10:01.036 --> 0:10:03.596 what I'm finding is that for men, it feels like 0:10:04.276 --> 0:10:06.916 trying to find that same fervor and those same options 0:10:07.196 --> 0:10:08.996 has still been a bit of a struggle for me, 0:10:09.356 --> 0:10:11.036 well for me personally, And I don't know if maybe 0:10:11.036 --> 0:10:13.316 I'm just not looking at the right places. I think 0:10:13.436 --> 0:10:16.316 the male fashion customer is just different than the female 0:10:16.356 --> 0:10:20.396 fashion customer, like generally speaking, and like often isn't looking 0:10:20.436 --> 0:10:23.876 for the same fashion items as the as women are. 0:10:23.916 --> 0:10:25.876 And so I think historically men have been fine with 0:10:25.916 --> 0:10:28.196 like a plane button down and some jeans or a 0:10:28.236 --> 0:10:31.316 T shirt, you know, And I think women a lot 0:10:31.396 --> 0:10:34.556 of us have really been pushing for like more statement pieces, 0:10:34.556 --> 0:10:37.876 more eye catching pieces. That being said, like I do 0:10:38.036 --> 0:10:40.316 know that there are I was so excited, for example, 0:10:40.316 --> 0:10:43.756 like when Aso's uh not only launched plus sizes for women, 0:10:43.756 --> 0:10:46.556 but like a few years ago finally launched plus sizes 0:10:46.596 --> 0:10:49.276 for men, And that made me so excited because I 0:10:49.316 --> 0:10:51.596 constantly am hearing from men and my dms, Like, I'm 0:10:51.676 --> 0:10:53.836 so excited for what you're doing, but like, do you 0:10:53.876 --> 0:10:55.676 know of any places for me to shop, because like 0:10:55.716 --> 0:10:58.236 Macy's or Ords, Drum or whatever may carry bigger sizes 0:10:58.276 --> 0:11:05.156 for men in general, just like among the get yeah, 0:11:05.156 --> 0:11:07.636 we did too. We still even now as much as 0:11:07.636 --> 0:11:10.476 you were saying, like women's plus size fashion has outpaced men, 0:11:10.556 --> 0:11:13.996 like I still almost exclusively shop online. We still don't 0:11:14.036 --> 0:11:17.516 have any instore options. We have like our typical Lane 0:11:17.516 --> 0:11:20.996 Bryant tour in which are like our two kind of 0:11:21.356 --> 0:11:25.436 biggest retailers, big box retailers, but like, we don't have 0:11:25.956 --> 0:11:28.116 a lot of in store options some again, some of 0:11:28.116 --> 0:11:32.356 the department stores have plus size sections, but they for 0:11:32.476 --> 0:11:37.316 the most part are pretty dire. They're pretty bad. We're 0:11:37.396 --> 0:11:39.756 kind of stuck in the corner on the top floor, 0:11:39.996 --> 0:11:42.196 in the back next to the dishes. You know you 0:11:42.236 --> 0:11:44.636 talked about ass like and a lot of these plus 0:11:44.636 --> 0:11:48.116 and extended sizes, they also have a limit, and I 0:11:48.196 --> 0:11:51.156 know that there's been some like I think even some 0:11:51.196 --> 0:11:53.956 of your lines to like eventually have a limit. YEA, 0:11:54.116 --> 0:11:55.596 how do we solve that? How do we get to 0:11:55.636 --> 0:11:58.876 a place where there is a size for everyone and 0:11:59.196 --> 0:12:01.396 they're not being a limit that we can't reach. Because 0:12:01.436 --> 0:12:03.396 even when you were talking about not being unable to 0:12:03.396 --> 0:12:06.196 get the one bikini that was in size eighteen, Yes, 0:12:06.756 --> 0:12:08.476 and if they're one person came along and they were 0:12:08.476 --> 0:12:10.836 twenty and it's like, oh, that's it. That's it for me. 0:12:10.876 --> 0:12:13.516 And I've experienced that myself in different sizes as well. 0:12:13.836 --> 0:12:17.516 So how would you how do you solve for that? Yeah, 0:12:17.556 --> 0:12:19.636 that's a really tough one and a great question. It's 0:12:19.676 --> 0:12:23.596 something that's an ongoing conversation within the community because you know, 0:12:23.676 --> 0:12:27.436 inevitably wherever you kind of stop, whatever size you stop at, 0:12:27.476 --> 0:12:29.916 there's going to be someone larger than that size who 0:12:29.916 --> 0:12:33.436 feels excluded, when in reality, you're trying to be inclusive 0:12:33.436 --> 0:12:37.036 and you're trying to extend the sizes. And so I 0:12:37.076 --> 0:12:39.196 will be the first to say, like my swimsuit line 0:12:39.276 --> 0:12:42.596 and my laundry line both are not inclusive enough. Like 0:12:42.676 --> 0:12:45.356 we I really wish I had more control over the 0:12:45.396 --> 0:12:48.116 side range, but ultimately that's not my call. But the 0:12:48.156 --> 0:12:51.516 consensus I've seen is like, we wish all plus size 0:12:51.556 --> 0:12:55.156 brands went to at least a size thirty or thirty two. Unfortunately, 0:12:55.196 --> 0:12:58.076 like what we're facing in capitalism is like, of course, 0:12:58.076 --> 0:12:59.076 at the end of the day, you want to have 0:12:59.076 --> 0:13:04.276 the highest margins and the most profits, and and that 0:13:04.476 --> 0:13:08.156 is sometimes at conflict with what's needed in the community. 0:13:08.316 --> 0:13:11.436 Right It's like, ethically, what is the right thing to 0:13:11.476 --> 0:13:13.436 do versus what is going to make you the most money. 0:13:13.796 --> 0:13:18.836 And so I definitely hope to continue doing more swimwear 0:13:18.876 --> 0:13:21.796 and laundree and I hope that I'm able to extend 0:13:21.796 --> 0:13:24.036 the side is beyond a size twenty six because I 0:13:24.036 --> 0:13:27.276 think we need to. And it's it's definitely consistent feedback 0:13:27.276 --> 0:13:31.836 that I've heard. There was a trainer, Jillian Michaels, who 0:13:32.236 --> 0:13:35.116 got out, who came out and was she kind of 0:13:35.116 --> 0:13:38.756 went to battle with Lizzo, who is a great singer, 0:13:38.876 --> 0:13:42.676 pop star who is also plus size and very body inclusive, 0:13:42.796 --> 0:13:45.596 and Jillian Michaels looked at her and said that she's 0:13:45.996 --> 0:13:49.076 basically said she's unhealthy and she's promoting obesity. How do 0:13:49.116 --> 0:13:51.596 you feel about the critics that are saying things like 0:13:51.596 --> 0:13:56.756 that about this movement, that it is a promoting obesity. Yeah, 0:13:56.796 --> 0:13:58.596 I mean that's kind of the oldest response in the 0:13:58.596 --> 0:14:01.316 book that I've heard since I started over a decade ago, 0:14:01.356 --> 0:14:04.836 it's constantly like you're promoting obesity or like you're unhealthy, 0:14:05.436 --> 0:14:07.996 And I have so much to say about that, mostly 0:14:08.076 --> 0:14:11.356 because the truth is especially right now, I am unhealthy, 0:14:11.436 --> 0:14:13.316 mostly not because of my weight, but because I have 0:14:13.436 --> 0:14:16.516 chronic illness and lyme disease. And so my big thing 0:14:16.596 --> 0:14:20.036 is like health should not be an indicator of value, right, 0:14:20.036 --> 0:14:21.916 Like it doesn't matter if someone is healthy or not. 0:14:21.956 --> 0:14:23.956 They should be respected as a human being and they 0:14:23.996 --> 0:14:27.636 still deserve to be seen and to be heard. And like, 0:14:28.076 --> 0:14:31.116 I don't care if someone is healthy or not. I want, 0:14:31.476 --> 0:14:34.516 of course, I want us as a society to care 0:14:34.556 --> 0:14:37.116 about our health. But like, at the same time, as 0:14:37.156 --> 0:14:40.276 individuals walking down the street, you can't tell me who's 0:14:40.316 --> 0:14:42.356 healthy and who's not just based on how they look, 0:14:42.396 --> 0:14:45.116 Like you don't know anyone's personal behaviors. There's a million 0:14:45.156 --> 0:14:47.956 reasons someone is thin, there's a million reasons someone is fat. 0:14:48.276 --> 0:14:51.556 And someone's health status should not be indicative of like 0:14:51.676 --> 0:14:54.316 how they deserve to be treated as a person. If 0:14:54.356 --> 0:14:57.996 someone struggling with their health, why are you telling them 0:14:58.036 --> 0:14:59.756 they shouldn't wear a bikini? Like how are those two 0:14:59.796 --> 0:15:02.636 things correlated? Like it's like one you don't really know 0:15:02.716 --> 0:15:05.596 someone's health status into even if they are unhealthy, that 0:15:05.636 --> 0:15:07.836 doesn't mean they can't enjoy their time on a beach 0:15:07.996 --> 0:15:10.636 looking cute. Like I don't I don't get why those 0:15:10.676 --> 0:15:13.516 two things are related to people. If you care so 0:15:13.596 --> 0:15:16.716 much about health, then do be on the front lines, 0:15:16.796 --> 0:15:21.316 like working to get people educated about nutrition, like get 0:15:21.196 --> 0:15:23.716 let's let's get better food options and food deserts, like 0:15:23.756 --> 0:15:27.316 let's work on that, versus you just telling someone they're 0:15:27.436 --> 0:15:33.476 ugly and they're gonna die. What do you hope to 0:15:33.476 --> 0:15:37.396 see in the fashion world as a result of your 0:15:37.396 --> 0:15:40.636 influence in the next five to ten years. I guess 0:15:40.956 --> 0:15:43.276 I could say we're still tokenized, right, Like it's still 0:15:43.316 --> 0:15:46.756 like a niche issue to be Oh, look at the 0:15:46.836 --> 0:15:49.396 body issue, or look at we look at this runway show. 0:15:49.396 --> 0:15:52.356 We included three plus size models. How amazing are we? 0:15:52.516 --> 0:15:54.556 You know? And so it's still kind of a talking 0:15:54.596 --> 0:15:58.476 point and a headline when a plus size model does something. 0:15:59.076 --> 0:16:01.756 And so I think when plus size models and when 0:16:01.756 --> 0:16:07.276 plus size black models are being included consistently in campaigns 0:16:07.356 --> 0:16:11.476 and in fashion editorials, and like when our sizes are 0:16:11.676 --> 0:16:13.796 being offered at every store and it's not the exception, 0:16:13.836 --> 0:16:16.116 but it is the rule. I think that's when it's 0:16:16.196 --> 0:16:18.316 truly going to feel like, you know, there has been 0:16:18.356 --> 0:16:21.796 a shift in the tide where we are just included, 0:16:21.916 --> 0:16:24.116 and it's kind of the exception for us to not 0:16:24.196 --> 0:16:29.676 be included versus to be included. Gabby, what can listeners 0:16:29.676 --> 0:16:32.156 who are struggling with self hatred and body image issues 0:16:32.236 --> 0:16:35.676 due to combat them? And what can listeners do to 0:16:35.796 --> 0:16:38.276 support people who are struggling with body image issues and 0:16:38.316 --> 0:16:41.476 self hatred? Yeah, so I think a couple things, But 0:16:41.596 --> 0:16:43.796 one thing I always start with is like, if you 0:16:43.836 --> 0:16:48.836 are struggling to accept your body, following influencers or just 0:16:48.996 --> 0:16:52.316 people who look like you is life changing. And I 0:16:52.396 --> 0:16:56.316 know it sounds kind of superficial or not that important, 0:16:56.316 --> 0:17:00.076 but I cannot emphasize enough how much representation matters and 0:17:00.156 --> 0:17:02.636 how much seeing someone who looks like you and who 0:17:02.716 --> 0:17:07.156 reflects your body and your experience is important. So, like, 0:17:07.196 --> 0:17:10.116 even if when you're following so incisitions in the beginning, 0:17:10.116 --> 0:17:11.756 you might even be judging them because a lot of 0:17:11.796 --> 0:17:14.596 us have that internalized shame and internalized fat phobia, So 0:17:14.596 --> 0:17:16.156 you might be like, oh, she should not be wearing that, 0:17:16.196 --> 0:17:18.196 Like why is she wearing a string bikini. You might 0:17:18.236 --> 0:17:21.156 have that initial gut reaction, and that's because you have 0:17:21.236 --> 0:17:24.236 been conditioned to feel that way, and so like it's 0:17:24.276 --> 0:17:27.276 even more important for you to follow those people. Over time, 0:17:27.316 --> 0:17:31.236 what you'll find is that, like, those reactions will dissipate 0:17:31.356 --> 0:17:33.756 because when you're seeing that on a day to day 0:17:33.796 --> 0:17:37.196 basis in your feed and you are normalizing that to 0:17:37.276 --> 0:17:40.876 yourself and realizing, like, oh wow, these women like themselves 0:17:40.876 --> 0:17:43.716 and are allowing themselves to express themselves through fashion or 0:17:43.716 --> 0:17:47.356 through creativity and like enjoying their lives. And like, when 0:17:47.396 --> 0:17:49.796 you're seeing a fat person do all the things you've 0:17:49.836 --> 0:17:52.036 been told they're not supposed to do, and you see 0:17:52.036 --> 0:17:54.916 that consistently over time, you give yourself that grace too, 0:17:54.916 --> 0:17:58.996 and that permission to live that way as well. Gabby, 0:17:59.076 --> 0:18:01.476 thank you so much for being with us. Of course, 0:18:01.476 --> 0:18:02.876 thank you so much for having me. This is a 0:18:02.876 --> 0:18:07.956 great conversation. Gabby Fresh is a body positive digital content 0:18:08.036 --> 0:18:11.636 creator Solvable listeners. I want to thank you so much 0:18:11.676 --> 0:18:14.036 for listening in on these last two episodes that were 0:18:14.436 --> 0:18:16.956 way more personal for me. It's been meaningful to get 0:18:16.956 --> 0:18:19.276 to talk with experts about how to solve these difficult 0:18:19.276 --> 0:18:22.036 problems and I'd love to hear more from you. What 0:18:22.116 --> 0:18:24.676 are the challenges that you're struggling with and what are 0:18:24.676 --> 0:18:26.836 some problems you'd like to hear us discuss on the show. 0:18:26.916 --> 0:18:29.756 What solutions do you need? You could tweet at us 0:18:29.876 --> 0:18:32.996 with the hashtag solvable. Could tweet at me at oh 0:18:33.076 --> 0:18:36.036 it's big Ron that's at O h I T S 0:18:36.316 --> 0:18:38.836 b I g R O N, or you could tweet 0:18:38.836 --> 0:18:42.436 at Pushkin at Pushkin pods that's at p U s 0:18:42.676 --> 0:18:46.516 h k I N p O d S. Solvable is 0:18:46.516 --> 0:18:51.036 produced by Jocelyn Frank, research by David Jah, booking by 0:18:51.076 --> 0:18:55.276 Lisa Dutton. Our managing producer is Sasha Matthias, and our 0:18:55.316 --> 0:19:00.316 executive producer is Mio Lobel. I'm Ronald Young Junior. Thanks 0:19:00.356 --> 0:19:00.876 for listening.