1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:06,760 Speaker 1: M episode start Begin now, Robert Evans, Behind the Bastards 2 00:00:06,840 --> 00:00:12,160 Speaker 1: Podcast Part two, John Ronald Brown, Sophia, Alexandra Guest, private 3 00:00:12,160 --> 00:00:16,800 Speaker 1: parts unknown, introduction bad, How are you doing, Sophia good? 4 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:24,920 Speaker 1: Just you can mention my other podcast work with mild Gray. 5 00:00:24,920 --> 00:00:29,720 Speaker 1: It's I forgot to include of the actual words necessary 6 00:00:29,760 --> 00:00:32,000 Speaker 1: to make that salad not gibberish. So of course I 7 00:00:32,040 --> 00:00:36,440 Speaker 1: forgot your second podcast too. That was a disaster. A disaster, um. 8 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:39,120 Speaker 1: I think you will keep having a disaster until you 9 00:00:39,159 --> 00:00:41,920 Speaker 1: commit to going back to the old ways what I 10 00:00:42,000 --> 00:00:47,120 Speaker 1: have my wise, I have committed to getting fired and 11 00:00:47,159 --> 00:00:50,080 Speaker 1: then becoming a corrupt small time cop. I think that's 12 00:00:50,120 --> 00:00:52,279 Speaker 1: the path I want to go with. Did you if 13 00:00:52,280 --> 00:00:56,520 Speaker 1: you watch Jaws recently, there's a scene in the second 14 00:00:56,600 --> 00:01:01,320 Speaker 1: Jaws movie where Sheriff Brody gets at oh man, it's great. 15 00:01:01,680 --> 00:01:03,720 Speaker 1: There's a scene in the second Jaws movie where Sheriff 16 00:01:03,720 --> 00:01:06,680 Speaker 1: Brody gets out of his police car and is preceded 17 00:01:06,720 --> 00:01:09,520 Speaker 1: by forty or fifty beer cans tumbling out onto the 18 00:01:09,560 --> 00:01:15,479 Speaker 1: ground around him, and like, that's exactly what I want 19 00:01:15,480 --> 00:01:17,800 Speaker 1: to do for a living, just rolling around in a 20 00:01:17,840 --> 00:01:21,039 Speaker 1: police car, drunk as ship with a gun. No accountability 21 00:01:21,120 --> 00:01:24,160 Speaker 1: on some beach town in the middle of nowhere. I'm 22 00:01:24,200 --> 00:01:26,119 Speaker 1: glad that you're going to be a corrupt small town 23 00:01:26,240 --> 00:01:28,959 Speaker 1: cop because, as as we discussed in the previous episode, 24 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:32,880 Speaker 1: I will be performing unauthorized surgeries and at that point 25 00:01:33,040 --> 00:01:39,160 Speaker 1: I'm gonna need a friend in the police department. Friend, Yeah, 26 00:01:39,200 --> 00:01:41,640 Speaker 1: this is the plan. Hey, would you like to be 27 00:01:42,280 --> 00:01:47,760 Speaker 1: the non doctor con man veterinarians doctor Spence to my 28 00:01:48,080 --> 00:01:58,760 Speaker 1: doctor Ronald und Yeah, no not, you're the cop. You 29 00:01:58,800 --> 00:02:01,680 Speaker 1: already have a role to play. Would you so feel 30 00:02:01,720 --> 00:02:04,120 Speaker 1: with you on anything? My friend? Perfect? We got a 31 00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:07,360 Speaker 1: clinic going, Robert, keep us out of the papers, all right, 32 00:02:07,560 --> 00:02:12,680 Speaker 1: Well that's good, you know, Sophie, it's complicated. I feel 33 00:02:12,720 --> 00:02:15,040 Speaker 1: like I want to know more about Spence because this 34 00:02:15,120 --> 00:02:17,440 Speaker 1: is not just a simple man pretending to be a doctor. 35 00:02:17,639 --> 00:02:19,960 Speaker 1: This is a man pretending to be a veterinarian who 36 00:02:20,040 --> 00:02:21,960 Speaker 1: pretends to be a doctor. And that's like a whole 37 00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:25,680 Speaker 1: different layer of scamminess. And oh, it's hilarious that he 38 00:02:25,760 --> 00:02:29,120 Speaker 1: needed to first fool himself to step one. He's like, no, 39 00:02:29,280 --> 00:02:31,520 Speaker 1: pretending to be a doctor. He's like, I can't do that, 40 00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:34,480 Speaker 1: that's too much lying. First, I'm gonna pretend to be 41 00:02:34,600 --> 00:02:36,919 Speaker 1: a vet and out of there pretending to be a doctor. 42 00:02:36,960 --> 00:02:40,200 Speaker 1: That's not that far. I can do that. Yeah, it's amazing, 43 00:02:40,440 --> 00:02:42,840 Speaker 1: It's really amazing. Can we put up a picture of 44 00:02:42,919 --> 00:02:49,160 Speaker 1: him too, because I'd like to, But the faces of 45 00:02:49,200 --> 00:02:53,600 Speaker 1: that firm were not for doctors clinic. He died in 46 00:02:53,639 --> 00:02:57,200 Speaker 1: a ditch like that is my assumption that he died 47 00:02:57,200 --> 00:03:01,280 Speaker 1: in a ditch overdosing on something horrible. If the world 48 00:03:01,320 --> 00:03:04,120 Speaker 1: it isn't any way, just in which it's not, he 49 00:03:04,160 --> 00:03:12,200 Speaker 1: would have died in a dish. So let's start part two. Um. Now, 50 00:03:12,200 --> 00:03:15,240 Speaker 1: As I mentioned in the first episode, John Ronald Brown 51 00:03:15,919 --> 00:03:19,440 Speaker 1: didn't only have sad stories in terms of his patients. 52 00:03:19,440 --> 00:03:22,680 Speaker 1: He had some happy customers. One of them was Patrese Baxter. 53 00:03:23,360 --> 00:03:25,600 Speaker 1: She was a longtime client and she calls him one 54 00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:27,880 Speaker 1: of the best surgeons in the United States, even though 55 00:03:27,919 --> 00:03:29,520 Speaker 1: by the time she met him, he was no longer 56 00:03:29,639 --> 00:03:33,200 Speaker 1: legally allowed to practice surgery in the United States. Still, 57 00:03:33,320 --> 00:03:36,120 Speaker 1: Dr Brown illegally gave Patrise a tummy tuck, a facelift, 58 00:03:36,160 --> 00:03:38,760 Speaker 1: and breast implants. She was so happy with the results 59 00:03:38,800 --> 00:03:41,960 Speaker 1: that she had him cut into her granddaughter's ears. Quote 60 00:03:42,360 --> 00:03:44,200 Speaker 1: they stuck out. The kids on her track team called 61 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:46,480 Speaker 1: her dumbo, why don't you just fly? He did her 62 00:03:46,480 --> 00:03:49,400 Speaker 1: nose too. Patrese claims the surgery went well enough that 63 00:03:49,400 --> 00:03:51,360 Speaker 1: her granddaughter went on to work as a model, So 64 00:03:51,400 --> 00:03:54,360 Speaker 1: she clearly admired the man, But even Dr Brown's number 65 00:03:54,400 --> 00:03:57,480 Speaker 1: one fan acknowledged that he had some faults. She's also 66 00:03:57,560 --> 00:04:02,840 Speaker 1: not a good person if she's getting years of fucking granddaughter. Cut. 67 00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:05,640 Speaker 1: We haven't even gotten into what a bad person she 68 00:04:05,760 --> 00:04:11,160 Speaker 1: is right away. So she said he was brilliant, but 69 00:04:11,200 --> 00:04:13,280 Speaker 1: he had no common sense. He would walk through plate 70 00:04:13,280 --> 00:04:20,640 Speaker 1: glass doors. He couldn't balance his checkbook through a screen 71 00:04:20,680 --> 00:04:27,320 Speaker 1: door before. That is embarrassing and shameful. Um, now, just 72 00:04:27,360 --> 00:04:32,880 Speaker 1: t whis bring me to and it's very cute. Tut tusk, 73 00:04:33,160 --> 00:04:36,479 Speaker 1: tut tut tusk tusk who says that no one she 74 00:04:36,520 --> 00:04:40,200 Speaker 1: acknowledged that his bedside manner was not exactly great. Uh. 75 00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:43,839 Speaker 1: Sometimes he would grab a magazine mid conversation and start reading. 76 00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:47,320 Speaker 1: He mumbled frequently, and he never held his patient's hands. Still, 77 00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:49,799 Speaker 1: Patrese insists he was more of a hero than a villain. 78 00:04:50,320 --> 00:04:53,320 Speaker 1: He only charged for a sex change, and half the 79 00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:56,960 Speaker 1: time they didn't even pay. Now, before you take Pat 80 00:04:56,960 --> 00:04:59,719 Speaker 1: Baxter's commentary too seriously, you should know that she wasn't 81 00:04:59,760 --> 00:05:04,120 Speaker 1: just satisfied customer. She was also a surgical entrepreneur, which 82 00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:06,320 Speaker 1: is one of the most terrified phrases I've ever heard. 83 00:05:06,720 --> 00:05:09,000 Speaker 1: I lived in San Diego and ran a shady as 84 00:05:09,160 --> 00:05:12,560 Speaker 1: clinic in Mexico. She and John Brown became business partners 85 00:05:12,560 --> 00:05:15,400 Speaker 1: and worked together for years. She urged John to expand 86 00:05:15,440 --> 00:05:19,479 Speaker 1: his repertoire beyond basic plastic surgery and gender reassignment. There was, 87 00:05:19,600 --> 00:05:22,320 Speaker 1: she told him, a vast untapped market in men who 88 00:05:22,360 --> 00:05:27,600 Speaker 1: wanted bigger dicks. Oh man, I'm kind of excited about 89 00:05:27,600 --> 00:05:29,520 Speaker 1: where this is going. Oh yeah, yeah, I know this 90 00:05:29,560 --> 00:05:33,560 Speaker 1: is going in a fun direction. And it's one of 91 00:05:33,560 --> 00:05:35,560 Speaker 1: those things we've just been talking about the most vulnerable 92 00:05:35,560 --> 00:05:37,640 Speaker 1: people in the world been getting screwed over by this guy. 93 00:05:41,120 --> 00:05:48,960 Speaker 1: Yeah about this, Yeah, I mean, I'm societal of this. Yeah, okay, yeah. 94 00:05:49,000 --> 00:05:51,599 Speaker 1: So Dr Brown got into the penix extension business in 95 00:05:52,600 --> 00:05:55,520 Speaker 1: Penthouse Forum sent a writer to to Wanta to investigate 96 00:05:55,560 --> 00:05:59,200 Speaker 1: Brown's practice. Now, the good not a doctor had started 97 00:05:59,200 --> 00:06:01,080 Speaker 1: claiming an advertise spence that he could add one to 98 00:06:01,080 --> 00:06:03,679 Speaker 1: two inches to a dick by cutting the suspenser ligament 99 00:06:03,720 --> 00:06:06,400 Speaker 1: that held the penis root to the pubic bone, which 100 00:06:06,440 --> 00:06:08,600 Speaker 1: I wrote as public bone, which is not a thing, 101 00:06:08,680 --> 00:06:12,360 Speaker 1: but I found funny. Um. The article, titled The Incredible 102 00:06:12,440 --> 00:06:16,679 Speaker 1: Dick Doctor, portrayed Dr Brown actively as a horrible driver 103 00:06:16,800 --> 00:06:19,880 Speaker 1: who frequently backed into other cars. It pointed out that 104 00:06:19,920 --> 00:06:22,760 Speaker 1: his pants fell down once in the o R at one. 105 00:06:25,640 --> 00:06:31,080 Speaker 1: Oh my god, that's like a cartoon. That's imagine, right 106 00:06:31,120 --> 00:06:34,720 Speaker 1: before doctor starts cutting into you, his pants fall down. 107 00:06:34,839 --> 00:06:38,800 Speaker 1: You're like, Okay, I have to cancel the surgery if 108 00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:44,600 Speaker 1: you know aeal. Next, I am fucking telling everyone an 109 00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:50,280 Speaker 1: anvil just falls on his head. That's ridiculous, dude. At 110 00:06:50,320 --> 00:06:53,240 Speaker 1: one point in the article, he accidentally cut a patient's 111 00:06:53,279 --> 00:06:56,680 Speaker 1: penile shaft, sending blood spurting all over the room. His 112 00:06:56,760 --> 00:06:59,400 Speaker 1: quoted response to this funk up was I made a 113 00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:02,839 Speaker 1: boo boo. I was gonna guess it was oops. But 114 00:07:03,000 --> 00:07:07,160 Speaker 1: this is worse. Yeah, that's definitely worse than oops. So 115 00:07:07,320 --> 00:07:10,000 Speaker 1: someone from Inside Edition must have been reading Penthouse for 116 00:07:10,040 --> 00:07:12,400 Speaker 1: the articles, because three years later they sent a team 117 00:07:12,440 --> 00:07:15,960 Speaker 1: to investigate Dr Brown. The resulting documentary, The Worst Doctor 118 00:07:16,000 --> 00:07:19,920 Speaker 1: in America, was filmed with Brown's oblivious consent. At one point, 119 00:07:19,920 --> 00:07:22,800 Speaker 1: it showed him performing scalp surgery on a transwoman who 120 00:07:22,840 --> 00:07:25,840 Speaker 1: was supposed to be sedated, but the sedation didn't take 121 00:07:25,880 --> 00:07:28,320 Speaker 1: and the patient screamed and cried while the team recorded. 122 00:07:28,600 --> 00:07:32,240 Speaker 1: Brown called this nothing unusual. There's a special segment of 123 00:07:32,280 --> 00:07:34,520 Speaker 1: one interview that I think is worth me reading in 124 00:07:34,600 --> 00:07:38,800 Speaker 1: full inside edition. This is them narrating. But to Brown, 125 00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:41,120 Speaker 1: failure is no reason to proceed with caution, and he 126 00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:44,800 Speaker 1: continues to experiment on humans whenever he develops a new procedure. 127 00:07:45,240 --> 00:07:48,280 Speaker 1: And this is Brown talking back in the developmental stage. 128 00:07:48,280 --> 00:07:50,800 Speaker 1: I remember several times asking myself, is it really right 129 00:07:50,840 --> 00:07:53,000 Speaker 1: for me to be doing what amounts to experiments on 130 00:07:53,040 --> 00:07:55,200 Speaker 1: some of these people? After thinking it all through, these 131 00:07:55,200 --> 00:07:56,840 Speaker 1: people knew what I was doing, They knew I wasn't 132 00:07:56,840 --> 00:08:00,200 Speaker 1: It wasn't a proven experiment. They were all willing. So 133 00:08:00,560 --> 00:08:03,880 Speaker 1: He's like, I thought about whether I have any morrible responsibility, 134 00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:07,640 Speaker 1: and I decided no, No am I a SOULI school? Yeah. 135 00:08:10,800 --> 00:08:15,160 Speaker 1: Um so, Cherry, the young woman who's uh sister got 136 00:08:15,160 --> 00:08:17,760 Speaker 1: a sex change with Dr Brown, definitely considered him to 137 00:08:17,760 --> 00:08:20,400 Speaker 1: be a dangerous kook, but acknowledged he gives you a 138 00:08:20,440 --> 00:08:24,480 Speaker 1: vagina at a fair price. Competent doctor's charged twelve thousand 139 00:08:24,560 --> 00:08:26,920 Speaker 1: to twenty tho dollars for a vagina. At the time, 140 00:08:27,320 --> 00:08:30,080 Speaker 1: Brown's fees were reasonable enough that hundreds of women chose 141 00:08:30,120 --> 00:08:31,880 Speaker 1: to gamble on him, in spite of the fact that 142 00:08:31,920 --> 00:08:35,320 Speaker 1: his new nickname, Butcher Brown was by far the worst 143 00:08:35,400 --> 00:08:38,480 Speaker 1: yet not as good as tabletop Brown. Not as good 144 00:08:38,480 --> 00:08:42,040 Speaker 1: as tabletop Brown. Now, during my research, I came across 145 00:08:42,080 --> 00:08:46,520 Speaker 1: a tremendous resource called the Digital Transgender Archive. This wonderful 146 00:08:46,559 --> 00:08:49,600 Speaker 1: site includes pictures, articles, and scans of entire issues of 147 00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:53,040 Speaker 1: various znes and newsletters distributed by the trans community, going 148 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:56,160 Speaker 1: you know, back like decades, and I came across one 149 00:08:56,240 --> 00:08:59,760 Speaker 1: from nine called twenty Minutes and a few pages in 150 00:08:59,800 --> 00:09:03,360 Speaker 1: it featured a cartoon drawn by someone named Radia. Uh 151 00:09:03,360 --> 00:09:06,640 Speaker 1: and Sophie. You want to show her the political cartoon 152 00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:14,960 Speaker 1: of Dr Brown. It's a little small, so creep on it. 153 00:09:18,280 --> 00:09:21,240 Speaker 1: Yeah that chucks out. Yeah, it's just it's it's pretty 154 00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:25,040 Speaker 1: much just a portrait. Yeah, he's dressed as like Jason 155 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:27,560 Speaker 1: from the Friday the Thirteenth movies, with a hockey mask 156 00:09:27,640 --> 00:09:30,040 Speaker 1: covered in blood and a chainsaw of a patient on 157 00:09:30,120 --> 00:09:36,280 Speaker 1: its back. Yeah. Um now. That cartoon was followed by 158 00:09:36,320 --> 00:09:39,600 Speaker 1: a furious article about Dr Brown titled Mac the Knife 159 00:09:40,040 --> 00:09:42,640 Speaker 1: and I'm going to quote from it now a patient 160 00:09:42,840 --> 00:09:45,120 Speaker 1: no more like a victim of the nefarious Dr Brown 161 00:09:45,200 --> 00:09:47,200 Speaker 1: presented herself with the aid of a companion at the 162 00:09:47,200 --> 00:09:50,600 Speaker 1: emergency room of San Francisco General Hospital today November four, 163 00:09:51,559 --> 00:09:54,760 Speaker 1: for life saving medical assistance. Just a week earlier, in Mexico, 164 00:09:54,840 --> 00:09:56,800 Speaker 1: she had the misfortune to fall into the not so 165 00:09:56,920 --> 00:09:59,520 Speaker 1: tender clutches of Dr Brown. By the time she arrived 166 00:09:59,559 --> 00:10:01,480 Speaker 1: at s F General, she'd lost more than four pints 167 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:03,040 Speaker 1: of blood and was well down the road to being 168 00:10:03,040 --> 00:10:05,959 Speaker 1: another and not so fortunate statistic of the infamous meat cutter. 169 00:10:06,240 --> 00:10:09,040 Speaker 1: From information available, she's but one of ten recent victims 170 00:10:09,040 --> 00:10:11,720 Speaker 1: of Brown's. For those of you contemplating surgery, don't go 171 00:10:11,760 --> 00:10:14,480 Speaker 1: to Mexico for it, and above all, don't let Dr 172 00:10:14,520 --> 00:10:17,360 Speaker 1: Brown do it. Admittedly, his price of three thousand dollars 173 00:10:17,440 --> 00:10:20,800 Speaker 1: is attractive, but the pain, anguish, and post surgical complications 174 00:10:20,800 --> 00:10:24,480 Speaker 1: are not worth the trivial amount of money saved. So 175 00:10:25,040 --> 00:10:27,640 Speaker 1: twenty Minutes had written warnings about Dr Brown before, and 176 00:10:27,679 --> 00:10:29,960 Speaker 1: he'd actually had someone from his office respond to them. 177 00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:32,599 Speaker 1: Since his potential clients read this magazine, and since he 178 00:10:32,640 --> 00:10:34,120 Speaker 1: knew no one from the a m A. Or law 179 00:10:34,160 --> 00:10:37,640 Speaker 1: enforcement was reading trans community newsletters, he felt secure in 180 00:10:37,720 --> 00:10:40,040 Speaker 1: just lying shamefully to these people to try to convince 181 00:10:40,080 --> 00:10:42,480 Speaker 1: more of them to let him commit surgery on their groins. 182 00:10:43,240 --> 00:10:46,440 Speaker 1: And here's his representatives response. Many of you have heard 183 00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:49,320 Speaker 1: about doctor John Ronald Brown, m D, some of it positive, 184 00:10:49,400 --> 00:10:51,760 Speaker 1: some negative. This letter is intended to set the record 185 00:10:51,840 --> 00:10:55,240 Speaker 1: straight and to inform those interested in his work. It 186 00:10:55,320 --> 00:10:57,920 Speaker 1: goes on to account Dr Brown's educational history all the 187 00:10:57,960 --> 00:11:00,640 Speaker 1: different hospitals he worked at, notably leaving out his repeated 188 00:11:00,640 --> 00:11:03,960 Speaker 1: failures to actually pass his surgical exams. Then it gives 189 00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:06,280 Speaker 1: this justification for the fact that his clinic had to 190 00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:09,560 Speaker 1: be in Mexico rather than the United States. Due to 191 00:11:09,600 --> 00:11:12,840 Speaker 1: the temporary rivocation of his license to practice in California. 192 00:11:12,880 --> 00:11:15,440 Speaker 1: His clinic has been moved to Plus, Mexico. He's currently 193 00:11:15,440 --> 00:11:18,719 Speaker 1: preparing for reinstatement of his California license, but states that 194 00:11:18,760 --> 00:11:21,680 Speaker 1: even when he is eventually vindicated, his practice will probably 195 00:11:21,720 --> 00:11:24,920 Speaker 1: remain in Mexico for various reasons, especially the reduced problems 196 00:11:24,920 --> 00:11:29,000 Speaker 1: of doing transsexual surgery, the reduced problems, meaning like the 197 00:11:29,040 --> 00:11:32,480 Speaker 1: reduced laws governing what you can do to people you're 198 00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:36,760 Speaker 1: performing surgery on now. In that letter, Dr Brown's representative 199 00:11:36,760 --> 00:11:40,040 Speaker 1: also brags about a revolutionary new technique he developed, taking 200 00:11:40,080 --> 00:11:42,920 Speaker 1: bowel tissue to make the new vaginal canal for his patients. 201 00:11:42,960 --> 00:11:46,720 Speaker 1: That's ensuring them a self lubricating vagina. Twenty Minutes notes 202 00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:48,760 Speaker 1: that as a result of his failure to actually do 203 00:11:48,840 --> 00:11:52,040 Speaker 1: this competently, more than seventy of his patients had received 204 00:11:52,080 --> 00:11:55,080 Speaker 1: permanent colostomies, and I found a quote from writer Dallas 205 00:11:55,080 --> 00:11:57,760 Speaker 1: and Aenny on all this. In the nineteen nineties, Brown 206 00:11:57,840 --> 00:12:00,200 Speaker 1: came to favor invasive surgery, in which you would aft 207 00:12:00,200 --> 00:12:02,719 Speaker 1: the neo vagina to a section of resected colon. His 208 00:12:02,840 --> 00:12:05,080 Speaker 1: results had never been good. The growing area of a 209 00:12:05,080 --> 00:12:07,280 Speaker 1: Brown patient typically looked as if the penis had been 210 00:12:07,320 --> 00:12:09,720 Speaker 1: split lengthwise and sutured to the growing with a simple 211 00:12:09,720 --> 00:12:13,080 Speaker 1: hole between the split halves. Patients often wound up with colostomies. 212 00:12:13,200 --> 00:12:16,120 Speaker 1: Several of Brown's girls dance topless, using scarves to conceal 213 00:12:16,200 --> 00:12:18,760 Speaker 1: the bags attached to their sides. When he started going 214 00:12:18,760 --> 00:12:21,959 Speaker 1: into the peritoneum. Things got really scary. Patients would return 215 00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:24,600 Speaker 1: home smelling of rotting flesh. Often they would return to Brown, 216 00:12:24,679 --> 00:12:27,200 Speaker 1: going again and again for revision, each time paying large 217 00:12:27,200 --> 00:12:30,040 Speaker 1: sums of money. Many eventually wound up in emergency rooms, 218 00:12:30,080 --> 00:12:33,839 Speaker 1: and I dare say some ended up dead. Now it's 219 00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:36,800 Speaker 1: hard to imagine just how fucking horrifying receiving surgery under 220 00:12:36,840 --> 00:12:39,000 Speaker 1: these conditions would have been. And there are very few 221 00:12:39,040 --> 00:12:41,440 Speaker 1: first person accounts from Dr Brown's victims, and none that 222 00:12:41,480 --> 00:12:44,040 Speaker 1: go into a tremendous amount of detail. I did find 223 00:12:44,040 --> 00:12:47,080 Speaker 1: the experiences of one transwoman, Canary Cohn, who received her 224 00:12:47,080 --> 00:12:49,720 Speaker 1: gender assignment surgery in Tijuana, and she went with a 225 00:12:49,760 --> 00:12:52,040 Speaker 1: better doctor than Dr Brown, one of the better doctors 226 00:12:52,040 --> 00:12:54,520 Speaker 1: in the area. So as I read this story, I 227 00:12:54,559 --> 00:12:56,920 Speaker 1: want you to remember that what Brown patients would have 228 00:12:56,920 --> 00:13:00,160 Speaker 1: woken up with was actually worse than this um. So 229 00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:02,959 Speaker 1: this is like a better case scenario than Dr Brown, 230 00:13:03,040 --> 00:13:07,800 Speaker 1: and it's still pretty fucking horrifying. Somebody, please please come here. 231 00:13:07,880 --> 00:13:09,680 Speaker 1: I cried and reached for the button, keeping it in 232 00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:12,600 Speaker 1: my hand. A peculiar wet feeling was gathering around my legs. 233 00:13:12,640 --> 00:13:14,840 Speaker 1: At first, I was too frightened to peer under the sheets, 234 00:13:14,840 --> 00:13:16,760 Speaker 1: but as the chill increased, I reached for the chain 235 00:13:16,840 --> 00:13:19,320 Speaker 1: over my head. With the light on, I lifted the sheets. 236 00:13:19,400 --> 00:13:21,319 Speaker 1: Then I panicked. The sheet under me was a pool 237 00:13:21,320 --> 00:13:23,640 Speaker 1: of blood, and more was flowing from between my legs. 238 00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:25,840 Speaker 1: I pressed the button again and again and began to 239 00:13:25,840 --> 00:13:28,480 Speaker 1: scream for help, thinking about detaching myself from the bed, 240 00:13:28,520 --> 00:13:30,640 Speaker 1: I propped myself on one arm, but then fainted and 241 00:13:30,679 --> 00:13:32,880 Speaker 1: fell back. When I woke up some ten or fifteen 242 00:13:32,880 --> 00:13:34,880 Speaker 1: minutes later, the blood had made its way down one 243 00:13:34,920 --> 00:13:36,880 Speaker 1: side of the bed to the floor. I was weaker 244 00:13:36,880 --> 00:13:39,920 Speaker 1: now and the pain didn't matter. I was bleeding to death. Sobbing, 245 00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:41,920 Speaker 1: I began to pray aloud. Then I screamed again and 246 00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:44,720 Speaker 1: again until my voice faded into hoarseness. Grabbing a book 247 00:13:44,720 --> 00:13:46,520 Speaker 1: from the table, I tried to throw it through the window, 248 00:13:46,520 --> 00:13:48,600 Speaker 1: but it fell from my fingers into the pool of blood. 249 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:51,160 Speaker 1: The chills had changed to small convulsions as I tried 250 00:13:51,200 --> 00:13:53,520 Speaker 1: to calm myself. Bending my head, I looked once more 251 00:13:53,559 --> 00:13:55,080 Speaker 1: at the side of the bed, half covered with my 252 00:13:55,120 --> 00:13:57,880 Speaker 1: life's liquid. It looked pretty, somehow, red on white. I 253 00:13:57,880 --> 00:13:59,800 Speaker 1: couldn't help thinking how ironic it was that I had 254 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:01,560 Speaker 1: we con saved all this time to pay for my 255 00:14:01,640 --> 00:14:05,160 Speaker 1: own death. I would be my own executioner. And again, 256 00:14:05,480 --> 00:14:08,080 Speaker 1: this is someone waking up in a clinic. So this 257 00:14:08,160 --> 00:14:11,200 Speaker 1: is someone getting surgery from one of these doctors who 258 00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:15,920 Speaker 1: actually does provide doctor aftercare. Dr Brown's patients typically woke 259 00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:19,800 Speaker 1: up in hotels or cars undergoing the same thing, not 260 00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:23,200 Speaker 1: attached to a bed, not in like obviously Canary eventually 261 00:14:23,240 --> 00:14:25,000 Speaker 1: did get medical help, but just took a while for 262 00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:28,440 Speaker 1: I think the clinic to realize what was going on. 263 00:14:28,600 --> 00:14:30,720 Speaker 1: But what a nightmare. You're bleeding to death and you 264 00:14:30,760 --> 00:14:32,800 Speaker 1: know it, and you paid for your surgery and it's 265 00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:36,320 Speaker 1: just like sober, yeah, yeah. And in the case of 266 00:14:36,400 --> 00:14:38,720 Speaker 1: Dr Brown's patients, this is happening like the back of 267 00:14:38,760 --> 00:14:44,080 Speaker 1: a Ford Fiesta. Um, it's it's hard to imagine. So 268 00:14:45,040 --> 00:14:47,360 Speaker 1: despite the fact that he had moved his practice to Mexico, 269 00:14:47,400 --> 00:14:49,880 Speaker 1: presumably because he couldn't legally perform surgery in the US, 270 00:14:50,240 --> 00:14:53,600 Speaker 1: Dr Brown still repeatedly performed surgeries in the United States 271 00:14:53,640 --> 00:14:56,760 Speaker 1: throughout the nineteen eighties. In nineteen four, he was arrested 272 00:14:56,880 --> 00:15:00,000 Speaker 1: for giving a presentation where he offered penile lengthening surgery 273 00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:02,480 Speaker 1: to a group of men in San Diego. He only 274 00:15:02,520 --> 00:15:04,600 Speaker 1: received a slap on the wrist for this and continued 275 00:15:04,640 --> 00:15:09,720 Speaker 1: traveling around California to perform minor surgery. Cherry recalled He'd 276 00:15:09,720 --> 00:15:12,440 Speaker 1: shoot silicone anywhere you wanted it for two hundred dollars. 277 00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:15,040 Speaker 1: He do breast surgery for five d He'd do cheeks, breasts, 278 00:15:15,080 --> 00:15:17,480 Speaker 1: and hips. After injections, you had to lie flat on 279 00:15:17,520 --> 00:15:19,960 Speaker 1: your back for three days so the silicone wouldn't go anywhere. 280 00:15:20,160 --> 00:15:23,160 Speaker 1: He plugged the holes with crazy glue. He's a big 281 00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:25,560 Speaker 1: fan of crazy glue. Yeah, I was saying, these are 282 00:15:25,600 --> 00:15:27,960 Speaker 1: like the people that have been busted for doing this stuff. 283 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:33,400 Speaker 1: In Los Angeles County, one patient filed to complaint against 284 00:15:33,480 --> 00:15:36,280 Speaker 1: Dr Brown for a breast enlargement procedure he had performed 285 00:15:36,320 --> 00:15:38,840 Speaker 1: on her. It turns out that rather than performing any 286 00:15:38,920 --> 00:15:41,320 Speaker 1: kind of surgery, he just shoved a needle into her 287 00:15:41,360 --> 00:15:44,320 Speaker 1: breasts and injected them with raw silicone. He then closed 288 00:15:44,320 --> 00:15:47,440 Speaker 1: the holes with crazy glue. Another patient, a genetic female 289 00:15:47,520 --> 00:15:50,560 Speaker 1: named Mona, complained that after Dr Brown gave her a facelift, 290 00:15:50,680 --> 00:15:53,440 Speaker 1: face peel, eye job, and breast implants, he did not 291 00:15:53,560 --> 00:15:56,200 Speaker 1: do a good job. During the facelift, he severed a 292 00:15:56,280 --> 00:15:58,480 Speaker 1: nerve in her face, leaving her with a permanent crooked 293 00:15:58,520 --> 00:16:01,760 Speaker 1: smile her implants face, which caused the breasts to rot 294 00:16:01,760 --> 00:16:04,160 Speaker 1: and leak a fluid her boyfriend described as smelling like 295 00:16:04,240 --> 00:16:07,960 Speaker 1: cat piss. Then they fell off. To his credit, Dr 296 00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:10,880 Speaker 1: Brown performed some aftercare for Mona. She recalled that at 297 00:16:10,920 --> 00:16:12,680 Speaker 1: some one point he showed up to inject her with 298 00:16:12,720 --> 00:16:18,040 Speaker 1: painkillers wearing only one shoe. Oh my god, Wow, what 299 00:16:18,120 --> 00:16:21,040 Speaker 1: a good sign to not let someone doctor on you 300 00:16:21,200 --> 00:16:25,000 Speaker 1: when they're wearing just one shoe, Like you're going to 301 00:16:25,080 --> 00:16:28,080 Speaker 1: inject someone with medicine and you couldn't get your shoe 302 00:16:28,080 --> 00:16:30,720 Speaker 1: game on point for the day. Let's just go ahead 303 00:16:30,720 --> 00:16:33,400 Speaker 1: and extend it to the whole outfit. If you're missing 304 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:36,960 Speaker 1: anything from the outfit, you're you're you're on a time 305 00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:39,480 Speaker 1: out for doctoring for the moment. It's like a guy 306 00:16:39,560 --> 00:16:42,280 Speaker 1: trying to shoot you up with insulin while wearing board shorts. 307 00:16:42,320 --> 00:16:47,360 Speaker 1: Like no, no, I'm gonna go ahead and pass. Yeah. Now. 308 00:16:47,400 --> 00:16:50,120 Speaker 1: Despite all this horror, it was the Inside Edition episode 309 00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:53,600 Speaker 1: that finally drew some serious legal attention to John Ronald Brown. 310 00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:57,040 Speaker 1: The FBI went after him, confiscated his money, shut down 311 00:16:57,120 --> 00:17:00,000 Speaker 1: his clinic and charged him with practicing medicine without a license. 312 00:17:00,680 --> 00:17:03,800 Speaker 1: He had previously been convicted for prescribing narcotics with revoked 313 00:17:03,800 --> 00:17:06,280 Speaker 1: license and practicing under a false name. With all of 314 00:17:06,320 --> 00:17:08,720 Speaker 1: that on his record, you might expect him to serve 315 00:17:08,800 --> 00:17:12,520 Speaker 1: some serious time. That seems like a significant crime, right, 316 00:17:12,920 --> 00:17:16,080 Speaker 1: m hm. He was sentenced to three years in prison 317 00:17:16,160 --> 00:17:22,440 Speaker 1: and served nineteen months. Oh my god, yeah, nineteen months. Um. So, 318 00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:24,000 Speaker 1: for a brief period of time, about a year, he 319 00:17:24,040 --> 00:17:26,840 Speaker 1: worked as a cab driver on Coronado Island, which is 320 00:17:26,880 --> 00:17:29,040 Speaker 1: possibly the only job he ever did that he might 321 00:17:29,080 --> 00:17:32,119 Speaker 1: have been qualified for. He remember, they said that he 322 00:17:32,160 --> 00:17:35,600 Speaker 1: got a constantly rearended people and got into car accidents. 323 00:17:35,960 --> 00:17:38,960 Speaker 1: He actually went into the only other profession he could 324 00:17:39,000 --> 00:17:46,639 Speaker 1: kill people. Like, that's not okay, that's not okay. You're 325 00:17:46,720 --> 00:17:49,520 Speaker 1: absolutely right, Like he picked the one other job that 326 00:17:49,560 --> 00:17:53,680 Speaker 1: he was dangerously bad at. I mean, we really could 327 00:17:53,720 --> 00:17:56,280 Speaker 1: he We have gotten him to be like a Walmart Greater, 328 00:17:57,119 --> 00:18:01,920 Speaker 1: just something where you're just harmless, you know. I feel 329 00:18:01,960 --> 00:18:04,359 Speaker 1: like as a Walmart Greater, he would have gotten people 330 00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:09,840 Speaker 1: killed just directing them to the wrong aisles, just throwing 331 00:18:09,920 --> 00:18:16,320 Speaker 1: peanuts at kids with allergies. So Paulciati interviewed John about 332 00:18:16,320 --> 00:18:19,040 Speaker 1: this period in his life, and Dr Brown insisted that 333 00:18:19,119 --> 00:18:21,720 Speaker 1: the time in jail didn't deter him from his chosen calling. 334 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:24,320 Speaker 1: In the least. He said that he decided long ago 335 00:18:24,400 --> 00:18:28,080 Speaker 1: to rebel against what he saw as the unjust medical establishment. 336 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:31,080 Speaker 1: I didn't like some of the things that organized doctors 337 00:18:31,080 --> 00:18:33,480 Speaker 1: were doing, so I rebelled. Later, I didn't like what 338 00:18:33,520 --> 00:18:36,320 Speaker 1: the government was doing in support of the medical organizations, 339 00:18:36,520 --> 00:18:40,680 Speaker 1: so I rebelled. I chose to ignore the laws. He's 340 00:18:40,720 --> 00:18:46,560 Speaker 1: a hero. He's a hero, Sophia. After a year, John 341 00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:48,679 Speaker 1: was able to put together enough money to reopen his 342 00:18:48,680 --> 00:18:51,520 Speaker 1: surgical practice in Tijuana. For a couple of years, he 343 00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:55,440 Speaker 1: continued chopping into whoever would pay, primarily servicing the trans community, 344 00:18:55,640 --> 00:18:58,040 Speaker 1: if you can call what he did a service. By night, 345 00:18:58,840 --> 00:19:02,680 Speaker 1: he had carried out an estimated six hundred gender reassignment surgeries. 346 00:19:03,520 --> 00:19:08,359 Speaker 1: That is the year he met Greg Firth. Now Greg 347 00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:14,800 Speaker 1: was a psychlo No Greg with two gs three. Actually 348 00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:19,040 Speaker 1: this is even worse than the regular Greg. There are 349 00:19:19,080 --> 00:19:21,640 Speaker 1: five letters in Greg's first name, and three of them 350 00:19:21,640 --> 00:19:24,760 Speaker 1: are G. It's a it's a disaster, It's gonna not end. Well, 351 00:19:25,480 --> 00:19:28,960 Speaker 1: it does not now. Greg was a psychoanalyst from New 352 00:19:29,040 --> 00:19:31,520 Speaker 1: York City. In addition to being a well respected mental 353 00:19:31,520 --> 00:19:35,120 Speaker 1: health expert, Firth also suffered from a rare condition known 354 00:19:35,160 --> 00:19:40,600 Speaker 1: as a potemnophilia. Have you ever heard of epotemnophilia? The 355 00:19:40,720 --> 00:19:43,800 Speaker 1: person who coined that term in ninety seven, John Money, 356 00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:47,720 Speaker 1: described it as an extreme sexual fetish wherein victims desire 357 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:50,880 Speaker 1: to sever their own limbs so they can have better orgasms. 358 00:19:51,600 --> 00:19:55,440 Speaker 1: What yeah, wait, why DoD, Why do the limbs get 359 00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:58,520 Speaker 1: in the way of a good orgasm? That's a great question. 360 00:19:58,640 --> 00:20:01,240 Speaker 1: And we're gonna talk about appet nephelia a little bit 361 00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:03,800 Speaker 1: more in a minute. But you know what won't sever 362 00:20:03,880 --> 00:20:07,040 Speaker 1: your limbs to give you better orgasm? Sofia the following 363 00:20:07,080 --> 00:20:10,719 Speaker 1: goods and services. That's exactly right. That is the guarantee 364 00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:12,840 Speaker 1: we make is that none of these products will sever 365 00:20:12,920 --> 00:20:21,080 Speaker 1: your limbs in the pursuit of an orgasm. We're back 366 00:20:21,359 --> 00:20:23,240 Speaker 1: and we're talking about how there should be a legal 367 00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:25,400 Speaker 1: limit on the number of g's allowed in a name. 368 00:20:25,680 --> 00:20:27,879 Speaker 1: And I'm going to put it. I'm gonna say zero. 369 00:20:31,800 --> 00:20:39,680 Speaker 1: All rights are just ad That's what I'm saying. They're 370 00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:46,560 Speaker 1: just raised now yeah exactly name yeah, just reth deal 371 00:20:46,640 --> 00:20:50,840 Speaker 1: with it. So um Apa tem nephelia is usually described 372 00:20:50,840 --> 00:20:53,040 Speaker 1: as an extreme sexual fetish about, you know, wanting to 373 00:20:53,080 --> 00:20:56,159 Speaker 1: sever your own limb for a better orgasm. That is 374 00:20:56,200 --> 00:21:01,520 Speaker 1: not how many sufferers of describe it. What are they say? Yeah? 375 00:21:01,720 --> 00:21:04,160 Speaker 1: Firth and a lot of other people with it argue 376 00:21:04,200 --> 00:21:07,200 Speaker 1: that the sexual angle is either minor or non existent 377 00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:09,800 Speaker 1: in a lot of cases. Um Greg doesn't even like 378 00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:14,119 Speaker 1: the term appotem nephelia. He prefers body identity transfer. Um 379 00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:17,040 Speaker 1: One sufferer I found interviewed in Salon described the way 380 00:21:17,040 --> 00:21:20,439 Speaker 1: her condition made her feel in this way quote, For me, 381 00:21:20,560 --> 00:21:23,320 Speaker 1: sexuality is being comfortable with my body inside. I feel 382 00:21:23,400 --> 00:21:25,960 Speaker 1: my legs don't belong to me and they shouldn't be there. 383 00:21:26,280 --> 00:21:29,120 Speaker 1: There's just an overwhelming sense of despair. Sometimes I don't 384 00:21:29,160 --> 00:21:30,960 Speaker 1: want to die, but there are times I don't want 385 00:21:30,960 --> 00:21:33,639 Speaker 1: to keep living in a body that doesn't feel like mine. 386 00:21:34,400 --> 00:21:36,400 Speaker 1: Now First seems to agree with this more or less, 387 00:21:36,480 --> 00:21:39,280 Speaker 1: insisting in interviews it's not about sex, it's not about 388 00:21:39,280 --> 00:21:42,240 Speaker 1: getting off with someone. This is about becoming able bodied. 389 00:21:42,800 --> 00:21:45,720 Speaker 1: So these the people suffering this will claim that like 390 00:21:45,800 --> 00:21:47,520 Speaker 1: it's not I don't want to get it removed because 391 00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:49,520 Speaker 1: I think it's hot to have to lose a limb. 392 00:21:49,920 --> 00:21:52,359 Speaker 1: I feel like, this isn't my body part and I 393 00:21:52,400 --> 00:21:54,800 Speaker 1: can't be comfortable in my own body while I have 394 00:21:54,920 --> 00:21:57,919 Speaker 1: this armor leg because they're not an alien limb. But 395 00:21:57,960 --> 00:22:00,560 Speaker 1: they're not capable of realizing that that's like good disorder, 396 00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:03,440 Speaker 1: or are they. I think they are, But I think 397 00:22:03,480 --> 00:22:05,240 Speaker 1: a lot of them would say that the treatment for 398 00:22:05,280 --> 00:22:09,399 Speaker 1: the disorders to have the fucking leg removed or whatever. Um, 399 00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:10,919 Speaker 1: I'm not going to come down on this one way 400 00:22:11,000 --> 00:22:14,040 Speaker 1: or the other. This is just what they will say. Yeah, 401 00:22:14,119 --> 00:22:17,919 Speaker 1: I mean I think before, but I'm like, yeah, And 402 00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:20,280 Speaker 1: there are some people who definitely like there are amputation 403 00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:24,639 Speaker 1: fetishists and stuff too. It's complicated, I think the I 404 00:22:24,680 --> 00:22:26,720 Speaker 1: think some people will argue that folks like Greg just 405 00:22:26,800 --> 00:22:29,879 Speaker 1: have an amputation fetish, and I think some sufferers of 406 00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:33,720 Speaker 1: apotemnophelia will say it's not a fetish, it's like a 407 00:22:33,760 --> 00:22:36,920 Speaker 1: body Dysmorpheus sort of thing. This is not my limb 408 00:22:36,920 --> 00:22:39,520 Speaker 1: and I need it removed. And there are people who 409 00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:41,000 Speaker 1: will be like, you're just saying that so you can 410 00:22:41,000 --> 00:22:43,240 Speaker 1: try to get surgery because you think gets hot, Like, 411 00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:45,680 Speaker 1: I really don't know. I'm not a fucking expert on anything. 412 00:22:45,760 --> 00:22:47,480 Speaker 1: I mean, it doesn't really matter though, but it makes 413 00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:49,560 Speaker 1: me think of like anorexi or something. It's like, you know, 414 00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:51,920 Speaker 1: you're looking in the mirror and you see something that, yeah, 415 00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:53,919 Speaker 1: it's not it's not right. So you're like, no, I 416 00:22:53,960 --> 00:22:56,080 Speaker 1: have to keep getting thinner. I'm not thin. It doesn't 417 00:22:56,080 --> 00:22:57,760 Speaker 1: look right, like I can't. I'm not going to feel 418 00:22:57,760 --> 00:23:01,000 Speaker 1: happy until them this then, But it's ultimately something that 419 00:23:01,119 --> 00:23:03,600 Speaker 1: you know you recover from if you work on it. 420 00:23:03,640 --> 00:23:06,120 Speaker 1: But I guess not. I don't know if it does 421 00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:10,960 Speaker 1: it work like that for this, I have no idea. Um, well, 422 00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:13,400 Speaker 1: well well I'll tell a little bit more and we'll 423 00:23:13,400 --> 00:23:16,119 Speaker 1: see how we feel. Definitely, Greg actually does seem to 424 00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:18,920 Speaker 1: have a bit of a recovery um. But yeah, we're 425 00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:22,880 Speaker 1: building to that. So for years, Greg Firth has sought 426 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:25,800 Speaker 1: to have his legs surgically amputated um and there are 427 00:23:25,880 --> 00:23:28,760 Speaker 1: some reputable surgeons who will do this for people with 428 00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:32,680 Speaker 1: appa tim nephelia. Unfortunately, the one first tried to contract 429 00:23:32,680 --> 00:23:34,919 Speaker 1: had to back out of doing the surgery after the 430 00:23:34,920 --> 00:23:37,600 Speaker 1: public hospital he worked at rescinded his privileges due to 431 00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:41,760 Speaker 1: bad publicity. They were actually protests in Scotland against voluntary 432 00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:45,200 Speaker 1: amputation being legal at all. Um. And when this all 433 00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:47,400 Speaker 1: blew up in the news, first doctor, the guy who 434 00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:50,760 Speaker 1: tried to go with, complained that banning safe voluntary amputations 435 00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:54,159 Speaker 1: and hospitals would only make the problem worse for his patients. Quote, 436 00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:56,200 Speaker 1: they may take the law into their own hands. They 437 00:23:56,200 --> 00:23:58,000 Speaker 1: may lie in a railway line and get run over 438 00:23:58,080 --> 00:24:01,160 Speaker 1: by a train. They may use shotguns and their limbs off. 439 00:24:01,240 --> 00:24:06,280 Speaker 1: They really are quite a desperate bunch, um. And the 440 00:24:06,320 --> 00:24:08,199 Speaker 1: doctor's kind of proven right in some of this that, 441 00:24:08,320 --> 00:24:12,159 Speaker 1: like you know, um, when someone has this kind of 442 00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:14,320 Speaker 1: and it's tough because like a lot of doctors will 443 00:24:14,359 --> 00:24:18,160 Speaker 1: say it's immoral fundamentally to do this because your job 444 00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:23,600 Speaker 1: isn't to remove healthy tissue. I think other doctors might 445 00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:26,159 Speaker 1: claim that, like, these people clearly aren't healthy, so you 446 00:24:26,200 --> 00:24:29,160 Speaker 1: are helping them by doing this. It's a very complicated 447 00:24:29,359 --> 00:24:32,720 Speaker 1: realm of medical ethics, um, or at least it seems 448 00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:35,200 Speaker 1: complicated to me. Let us know, if you're a doctor, 449 00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:40,119 Speaker 1: if you would remove someone's leg voluntarily, um, hit us 450 00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:43,720 Speaker 1: up now. Once his plans to remove his leg legitimately 451 00:24:43,760 --> 00:24:45,680 Speaker 1: with a real doctor in a real hospital fell through. 452 00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:48,359 Speaker 1: Greg Firth started searching around for other places where he 453 00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:52,520 Speaker 1: might have his alien leg removed. He read a story 454 00:24:52,560 --> 00:24:56,360 Speaker 1: about an underground surgeon based out of San Diego. Despite 455 00:24:56,400 --> 00:24:59,600 Speaker 1: the man's nickname Butcher Brown, that sounds good to me. 456 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:02,720 Speaker 1: That sounds good to me. That's what I'm looking for. Yeah. 457 00:25:02,760 --> 00:25:04,600 Speaker 1: Greg decided this guy was a good person to reach 458 00:25:04,640 --> 00:25:06,880 Speaker 1: out to, and Dr Brown was of course only too 459 00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:10,080 Speaker 1: happy to help. Stacy running the d A who prosecuted 460 00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:12,720 Speaker 1: Brown for what later happened, said he saw it is 461 00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:14,440 Speaker 1: all the same. You cut off a boob, you cut 462 00:25:14,480 --> 00:25:17,679 Speaker 1: off a penis, you cut off a leg. Sounds like 463 00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:22,840 Speaker 1: a quality doctor. No difference between any of those things. Now. 464 00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:25,800 Speaker 1: First negotiated with Dr Brown, and eventually they managed to 465 00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:28,879 Speaker 1: settle on a price. He flew down to Mexico to 466 00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:31,800 Speaker 1: finally lose his alien leg, but when he showed up 467 00:25:31,800 --> 00:25:34,480 Speaker 1: at Brown's makeshift o R, the Mexican doctor Brown had 468 00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:36,600 Speaker 1: hired to assist him realize that he was about to 469 00:25:36,640 --> 00:25:39,760 Speaker 1: help sever a healthy leg. First recalled. He kept saying, 470 00:25:39,880 --> 00:25:43,520 Speaker 1: this isn't right, you don't want this. Eventually, the Mexican 471 00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:46,000 Speaker 1: doctor left the building, and Brown was forced to cancel 472 00:25:46,080 --> 00:25:48,840 Speaker 1: the surgery, since it turns out amputating is a little 473 00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:52,200 Speaker 1: bit of a two man job, so Brown agrees. Firsth 474 00:25:52,240 --> 00:25:55,119 Speaker 1: flies down there and like, Brown gets an actual doctor 475 00:25:55,119 --> 00:25:57,199 Speaker 1: in Mexico to help, and that guy is like he 476 00:25:57,359 --> 00:26:00,000 Speaker 1: tricks him basically, and once he realizes what's happening, he's like, 477 00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:03,600 Speaker 1: I'm not going to do this. This is fucked up. Um, 478 00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:06,600 Speaker 1: so good on that doctor. Um. A year later, in 479 00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:10,679 Speaker 1: John Brown called Firth with what he's called good news 480 00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:13,760 Speaker 1: and bad news. The good news was he had yeah. 481 00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:17,120 Speaker 1: The good news was he'd found another doctor. The bad 482 00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:20,200 Speaker 1: news was it would now cost ten thous dollars. By 483 00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:22,560 Speaker 1: this point, Firth was less convinced that he even wanted 484 00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:24,720 Speaker 1: to commit to the surgery, but he decided to give 485 00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:27,800 Speaker 1: it a shot. His good friend and fellow alien leg sufferer, 486 00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:31,280 Speaker 1: Philip Bondy, scolded him for considering bailing on the opportunity, 487 00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:33,760 Speaker 1: telling him, you'll regret this the rest of your life. 488 00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:37,600 Speaker 1: How ironic, because you can't undo imputating your leg, but 489 00:26:37,760 --> 00:26:41,600 Speaker 1: you can always undo having your leg. These people are 490 00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:45,800 Speaker 1: not super rationally thinking about this problem. Um, I don't 491 00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:50,159 Speaker 1: feel uh not to appa, timnophelia shame them. But I 492 00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:52,720 Speaker 1: don't think you should do this, um, And I think 493 00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:55,879 Speaker 1: given what happens next time, right, So first travel to 494 00:26:55,920 --> 00:26:58,440 Speaker 1: San Diego and took a taxi to the clinic in Tijuana. 495 00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:01,399 Speaker 1: By the time he arrived, conclude that his compulsion to 496 00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:05,320 Speaker 1: have his leg removed was gone. He told Brown absolutely 497 00:27:05,359 --> 00:27:09,320 Speaker 1: not um, and this would kind of tend to suggest that, like, actually, yeah, 498 00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:11,080 Speaker 1: you shouldn't have your legs removed. If this is the 499 00:27:11,160 --> 00:27:13,159 Speaker 1: kind of thing that's seeing, how horrible the o R 500 00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:17,000 Speaker 1: can like remove you of your compulsion. Um. Anyway, here's 501 00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:19,720 Speaker 1: how l A Weekly sums up what happened next. Thinking 502 00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:22,680 Speaker 1: perhaps that Firth was merely nervous, Brown offered him a sedative, 503 00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:24,919 Speaker 1: but Firth testified he didn't want to be sedated. He 504 00:27:24,920 --> 00:27:27,760 Speaker 1: wanted out of there. Before leaving, however, he suggested that 505 00:27:27,800 --> 00:27:30,160 Speaker 1: what he thought would be a win win solution for everyone, 506 00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:32,560 Speaker 1: even though he no longer wanted the operation himself, he 507 00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:35,560 Speaker 1: knew someone else who did. Maybe we could switch it around, 508 00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:38,800 Speaker 1: said Firth, Philip could take my place. And it turned 509 00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:42,119 Speaker 1: out that Philip Bundy's apotem nephelia was much stronger than 510 00:27:42,119 --> 00:27:44,800 Speaker 1: the Firth's. He flew right to Mexico and on May ninth, 511 00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:49,800 Speaker 1: or John Brown severed his leg. Normally, surgery like this 512 00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:52,679 Speaker 1: would be an impatient procedure. You would, you would not 513 00:27:52,720 --> 00:27:56,840 Speaker 1: want to. But if you know John Ronald Brown, you 514 00:27:56,880 --> 00:28:02,159 Speaker 1: know he doesn't do inpatient procedures. Instead, he drove the 515 00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:06,240 Speaker 1: freshly amputated Philip Bondi fifteen miles into the desert, where 516 00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:08,639 Speaker 1: Dr Brown tossed his leg out of the car to 517 00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:14,960 Speaker 1: be eaten by coyotes. Oh my god, why was that 518 00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:20,440 Speaker 1: his first idea? How is the coyotes the first idea 519 00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:23,720 Speaker 1: you have for getting rid of a leg? Because he 520 00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:31,600 Speaker 1: has John Ronald fucking Brown. That is crazy. Nurse coyotes 521 00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:39,760 Speaker 1: will be assisting in the procedure. Oh my god. That crazy. 522 00:28:40,280 --> 00:28:45,320 Speaker 1: Their medical coyotes, Oh my god. Those are probably the 523 00:28:45,320 --> 00:28:48,960 Speaker 1: only people that worked in this clinic that actually were there. Yes, 524 00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:53,880 Speaker 1: the most competent medical professionals. And you know what, the 525 00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:59,240 Speaker 1: coyotes did their job properly. They were the most ones. Yeah, 526 00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:04,640 Speaker 1: competent people. Yeah. Now, after throwing his patient's leg out 527 00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:09,240 Speaker 1: of a car window, John Brown drove his patient into 528 00:29:09,280 --> 00:29:12,200 Speaker 1: California to a holiday inn, gave him a ten minute 529 00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:14,800 Speaker 1: lesson in walking with crutches and drove off into the 530 00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:18,280 Speaker 1: sunset to count his money. Oh my god, oh god, 531 00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:21,600 Speaker 1: it's a nightmare. Two days later, Greg Firth went to 532 00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:23,479 Speaker 1: check up on his friend in the Holiday Inn and 533 00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:26,920 Speaker 1: found him dead. An autopsy revealed that gas Gang Green 534 00:29:27,000 --> 00:29:30,040 Speaker 1: from an improperly sterilized leg stump, had been the culprit. 535 00:29:30,560 --> 00:29:34,920 Speaker 1: Philip's death would have been an agonizing, almost unimaginably painful affair. 536 00:29:36,280 --> 00:29:38,920 Speaker 1: This was the case that finally made the law treat 537 00:29:39,040 --> 00:29:41,560 Speaker 1: Dr John Brown as the minister society that he so 538 00:29:41,640 --> 00:29:44,400 Speaker 1: clearly was. It's telling that he had to finally kill 539 00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:46,880 Speaker 1: a straight man before this happened. And I'm not just 540 00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:50,120 Speaker 1: saying that to score woke points. Um. After the police started, Yeah, 541 00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:53,040 Speaker 1: after the police started digging into Dr Brown, the detective 542 00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:54,720 Speaker 1: in charge of the case made a point of looking 543 00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:56,960 Speaker 1: into some of Brown's other patients. And I'm gonna quote 544 00:29:56,960 --> 00:30:00,440 Speaker 1: Pulciotti with The l A Weekly again. When d A 545 00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:03,600 Speaker 1: investigator Basinski, a tall, outgoing former cop with a shaved 546 00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:05,960 Speaker 1: head and a big gray mustache, began calling on the 547 00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:08,320 Speaker 1: people on Brown's patient lists, a lot of them just 548 00:30:08,400 --> 00:30:10,400 Speaker 1: hung up on him. Some more hookers, he said. Some 549 00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:12,640 Speaker 1: thought they were in trouble, some just didn't like the police. 550 00:30:12,880 --> 00:30:15,160 Speaker 1: I called one woman, and an older woman answered, why 551 00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:17,560 Speaker 1: do you want my son? She said. He committed suicide 552 00:30:17,560 --> 00:30:21,520 Speaker 1: two weeks ago. As Basinski later learned, Christina, formerly known 553 00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:23,480 Speaker 1: as Eddie, had mortgaged her house to pay for a 554 00:30:23,520 --> 00:30:25,960 Speaker 1: total of tin surgeries by Brown, but, according to legal 555 00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:28,600 Speaker 1: documents followed by running, the skin graphs that Brown used 556 00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:31,000 Speaker 1: to line Christina's vaginal walls were so thin that they 557 00:30:31,040 --> 00:30:34,480 Speaker 1: tore during intercourse. When Brown removed Christina's lower ribs to 558 00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:36,920 Speaker 1: give her a narrower and more feminine waiste, she subsequently 559 00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:40,160 Speaker 1: developed an abscess as big as a basketball. Christina's nose 560 00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:42,000 Speaker 1: job turned out so poorly that she ended up with 561 00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:44,480 Speaker 1: different sized nostrils, one of which turned up like that 562 00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:46,720 Speaker 1: of a pig. Christina complained to Brown that he'd made 563 00:30:46,720 --> 00:30:49,000 Speaker 1: her vaginal entrance too small, but when Brown enlarged it, 564 00:30:49,120 --> 00:30:52,360 Speaker 1: Christina felt he'd ruined her. Today, Brown says he feels 565 00:30:52,360 --> 00:30:54,760 Speaker 1: badly that he didn't better explain the procedure to Christina, 566 00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:56,440 Speaker 1: but when he called to tell her he was refunding 567 00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:58,400 Speaker 1: five hundred dollars her mother told him that her son 568 00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:01,360 Speaker 1: had just hanged himself in the garage. According to Running, 569 00:31:01,360 --> 00:31:04,280 Speaker 1: Brown took the news quite calmly, noting merely that transsexuals 570 00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:06,360 Speaker 1: had a high suicide rate. And I should note I'm 571 00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:10,560 Speaker 1: reading a quote from an article there Sciatti consistently correctly 572 00:31:11,240 --> 00:31:17,479 Speaker 1: genders Christina Christina's mother. Yeah, those are her quotes on 573 00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:24,840 Speaker 1: the matter though. Um, yeah, so the up it's also 574 00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:28,240 Speaker 1: super fucked up, also removing the ribs, like, yeah, that's 575 00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:30,920 Speaker 1: not okay, I mean, and it's kind of buried a 576 00:31:30,960 --> 00:31:32,600 Speaker 1: little bit. But the most fucked up thing there is 577 00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:34,760 Speaker 1: that when Dr Brown learns that one of his patients 578 00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:38,720 Speaker 1: has killed herself, doesn't care. He's just like a lot 579 00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:44,480 Speaker 1: of my patients killed themselves. Actually it happens constantly. Um, 580 00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:48,080 Speaker 1: it's amazingly terrible. Uh. And it it's it goes to 581 00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:50,080 Speaker 1: show that like John is usually shown as like having 582 00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:54,160 Speaker 1: killed one person Bundy, but he killed a lot of people. 583 00:31:54,560 --> 00:31:57,800 Speaker 1: They just the law didn't care about them. Um, and 584 00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:01,640 Speaker 1: oftentimes is that story shows their pair didn't either. And 585 00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:07,240 Speaker 1: also just like the fear of whoever, the fear of 586 00:32:07,320 --> 00:32:09,560 Speaker 1: whoever it is calling and checking on you means like 587 00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:14,760 Speaker 1: you're not really getting the full information anyway. Yeah yeah, 588 00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:17,560 Speaker 1: because like a lot of these patients were sex workers 589 00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:19,520 Speaker 1: and they're not going to talk to a fucking copy 590 00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:22,600 Speaker 1: even if the cop legitimately cares about what's being done 591 00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:26,800 Speaker 1: to them, Like it doesn't matter. Um So, Dr Brown 592 00:32:26,920 --> 00:32:29,760 Speaker 1: was arrested and police searched a Sandy Cedro apartment. They 593 00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:33,600 Speaker 1: found bloody shoes and pillows, used needles, vials of silicone, 594 00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:37,280 Speaker 1: dozens of empty tubes of crazy glue, bloody towel soaking 595 00:32:37,320 --> 00:32:40,560 Speaker 1: in bleach, and dozens of returned advertising brochures for his 596 00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:46,160 Speaker 1: horrible clinic. One of the brochures read as follows, Oh boys, 597 00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:49,280 Speaker 1: is going to be unpleasant to read. The prettiest pussies 598 00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:52,560 Speaker 1: are John Brown pussies. The happiest patients are John Brown 599 00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:56,719 Speaker 1: patients because number one each has a sensitive clit. Number 600 00:32:56,720 --> 00:33:01,680 Speaker 1: two all get orgasms. Number three careful skin draping gives 601 00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:05,280 Speaker 1: a natural appearance. Number four men love the pretty pussies 602 00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:12,840 Speaker 1: and the sexy response Yeah obviously not true. Yes, horrible 603 00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:16,440 Speaker 1: horrible eyes now also found in Dr Brown's apartment where 604 00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:19,920 Speaker 1: videotapes of the Bad Doctor's operations. These videos were given 605 00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:22,440 Speaker 1: names that reflect the level of professionalism I think we've 606 00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:26,920 Speaker 1: all come to expect from John Brown. I'm trying not 607 00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:30,040 Speaker 1: to laugh, but it's It's like one was titled Jack 608 00:33:30,120 --> 00:33:34,080 Speaker 1: has a new piss hole behind his balls. Um again, 609 00:33:35,400 --> 00:33:40,320 Speaker 1: this is how the doctor labeled his surgery tapes. Um yeah. 610 00:33:41,120 --> 00:33:44,080 Speaker 1: While bizarre, that video was not what hit prosecutors the 611 00:33:44,120 --> 00:33:47,440 Speaker 1: hardest in brown stash. That came across a recorded sex 612 00:33:47,520 --> 00:33:50,440 Speaker 1: change surgery which showed Brown using a scalpel so dull 613 00:33:50,520 --> 00:33:52,600 Speaker 1: he had to use it like a saw, jerking it 614 00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:58,320 Speaker 1: back and forth into the patient's flesh. Uh yeah. As 615 00:33:58,360 --> 00:34:01,240 Speaker 1: the media's chief expert on table top Brown, pal Ciolo 616 00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:03,080 Speaker 1: spent a lot of time talking to the detectives and 617 00:34:03,120 --> 00:34:06,080 Speaker 1: prosecutors trying to put Brown away. They showed him some 618 00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:08,920 Speaker 1: of these videos, and here's how he describes one. In 619 00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:11,480 Speaker 1: the video's opening shot, which is reminiscent of that famous 620 00:34:11,480 --> 00:34:14,160 Speaker 1: scene from The Crying Game, an attractive Asian girl and 621 00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:16,480 Speaker 1: the soon to be Las Vegas stripper is shown standing 622 00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:19,120 Speaker 1: naked from the waist up, quietly chatting with Brown, who 623 00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:22,080 Speaker 1: is off camera. She has nicely formed breasts and abundant 624 00:34:22,080 --> 00:34:24,920 Speaker 1: black hair that cascades down her shoulders. Then slowly, the 625 00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:27,279 Speaker 1: camera moves down her body and suddenly you realize she 626 00:34:27,320 --> 00:34:29,919 Speaker 1: has a penis. When the actual surgery starts, I find 627 00:34:29,920 --> 00:34:32,080 Speaker 1: it so unsettling that I have to turn off the tape. 628 00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:34,320 Speaker 1: All the men had the same reactions as running. The 629 00:34:34,400 --> 00:34:37,080 Speaker 1: judge asked, do I have to watch this video? I said, well, yes, 630 00:34:37,160 --> 00:34:45,759 Speaker 1: you do. You're the judge. Yeah, so yeah, I you know, 631 00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:48,880 Speaker 1: part of me is like I I kind of like 632 00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:52,840 Speaker 1: running here because he's like, yeah, you have to watch this. 633 00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:55,160 Speaker 1: You have to know what this guy did to properly 634 00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:59,520 Speaker 1: sentence him, and like just because it's gross, Uh, you 635 00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:01,520 Speaker 1: don't get to not look at it. You would look 636 00:35:01,520 --> 00:35:03,560 Speaker 1: at photos of a murder, and that's what this guy did. 637 00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:05,960 Speaker 1: So we're gonna watch the smoking videos. Like. I respect 638 00:35:06,040 --> 00:35:10,200 Speaker 1: that a lot. Um, you know what. I also respect 639 00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:14,960 Speaker 1: Sophia Goods and Services, the products and services that support 640 00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:25,920 Speaker 1: this show. We're back so um. Apparently Brown had intended 641 00:35:25,920 --> 00:35:27,320 Speaker 1: that tape and a lot of the other tapes to 642 00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:30,880 Speaker 1: be like advertising and training videos. Uh. The second scene 643 00:35:30,880 --> 00:35:33,319 Speaker 1: in that tape we just described shows the doctor sitting 644 00:35:33,360 --> 00:35:35,319 Speaker 1: in a chair wearing a white coat and explaining the 645 00:35:35,400 --> 00:35:38,520 Speaker 1: upcoming operation to the camera. Uh, he has a microphone 646 00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:40,520 Speaker 1: and his hand is kind of shaking, says running. You 647 00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:42,279 Speaker 1: see him reach up and grab his hand and this 648 00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:44,279 Speaker 1: is his dominant hand, the one he operates with. He 649 00:35:44,320 --> 00:35:47,000 Speaker 1: holds up crew drawings ripped out of a spiral notebook. 650 00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:49,040 Speaker 1: He says, this is the corporate of the corporate. He 651 00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:52,400 Speaker 1: stumped on the word. He finally says it the copora cavanosa, 652 00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:54,440 Speaker 1: the spongey tissue on the other side of the penis. 653 00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:56,399 Speaker 1: He goes off in this vein. You can see him 654 00:35:56,440 --> 00:35:58,840 Speaker 1: waving the cameraman off when he loses a thought. The 655 00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:01,239 Speaker 1: tape was so crude you could hear dogs barking during 656 00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:04,000 Speaker 1: the surgery and music playing. The scrotal skin was lying 657 00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:05,840 Speaker 1: on a board. It had pushpins in it. It was 658 00:36:05,880 --> 00:36:07,719 Speaker 1: so dirty and dried out it looked like it had 659 00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:13,359 Speaker 1: been run over by a tire. Yeah. The prosecution's chief 660 00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:15,799 Speaker 1: witness was a young trans woman named Camille. She was 661 00:36:15,800 --> 00:36:17,640 Speaker 1: one of the only victims of Dr Brown who was 662 00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:20,720 Speaker 1: willing to testify in court. Prior to her surgery, Camille 663 00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:23,840 Speaker 1: had been an insurance underwriter. She claims Dr Brown botched 664 00:36:23,840 --> 00:36:26,879 Speaker 1: her surgery so badly that she was basically unemployable now 665 00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:31,239 Speaker 1: her surgery went down in November n Quote, he gave 666 00:36:31,280 --> 00:36:33,440 Speaker 1: me an epidural. I woke up ten minutes prior to 667 00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:35,839 Speaker 1: the end of the operation. We started talking. Brown said, 668 00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:38,439 Speaker 1: we're almost done. I wasn't scared. I was happy as hell. 669 00:36:38,480 --> 00:36:40,279 Speaker 1: I was finally getting what I wanted. When you are 670 00:36:40,280 --> 00:36:42,600 Speaker 1: climbing Mount Everest, you don't worry about a little frostbite 671 00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:45,360 Speaker 1: on the top. But after the surgery was complete, Camille 672 00:36:45,360 --> 00:36:48,240 Speaker 1: started having difficulty with her recovery. She developed a recto 673 00:36:48,280 --> 00:36:51,600 Speaker 1: of vaginal fistula, which caused her feces to flow into 674 00:36:51,640 --> 00:36:54,239 Speaker 1: her new vagina. This was the result of Dr Brown 675 00:36:54,320 --> 00:36:56,919 Speaker 1: experimenting with his technique of using bowel tissue to create 676 00:36:57,000 --> 00:37:00,160 Speaker 1: vaginal walls. She said, quote, my bladder was block, my 677 00:37:00,239 --> 00:37:02,560 Speaker 1: limph glands swelled up, and my skin turned yellow. Black 678 00:37:02,600 --> 00:37:05,000 Speaker 1: stuff was pouring out of my lungs. All my systems 679 00:37:05,000 --> 00:37:07,200 Speaker 1: were shutting down. All he would have to do is 680 00:37:07,239 --> 00:37:10,480 Speaker 1: take one breath and let go. The fact that Camille 681 00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:13,320 Speaker 1: survived is almost miraculous, and her testimony helped to finally 682 00:37:13,360 --> 00:37:15,920 Speaker 1: put but Your Brown away for good. He was convicted 683 00:37:15,920 --> 00:37:19,200 Speaker 1: by unanimous decision and sentenced to fifteen years in prison. 684 00:37:19,640 --> 00:37:22,600 Speaker 1: He expressed no remorse or even real understanding that he 685 00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:25,239 Speaker 1: had committed horrific acts that had permanently disfigured and in 686 00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:28,120 Speaker 1: many cases, ruined, the lives of human beings. Pal Ciolo 687 00:37:28,160 --> 00:37:30,640 Speaker 1: talked to Brown several times in prison via collect call. 688 00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:34,120 Speaker 1: In their last conversations, Brown expressed that his entire career 689 00:37:34,160 --> 00:37:36,600 Speaker 1: was part of God's plan. He had called upon John 690 00:37:36,680 --> 00:37:40,319 Speaker 1: Ronald Brown to help the transgender community, and next, Brown 691 00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:43,440 Speaker 1: believed God had called upon him to invent a hyper 692 00:37:43,480 --> 00:37:47,400 Speaker 1: thermia chamber that would cure cancer, AIDS and genital herpes. 693 00:37:47,800 --> 00:37:56,160 Speaker 1: Brown described this as I'm sorry, like the other h 694 00:37:56,400 --> 00:38:00,640 Speaker 1: that seems telling, that seems like he had herpies. He's like, 695 00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:04,200 Speaker 1: the other two are for humanity, last ones for Papa. 696 00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:07,480 Speaker 1: This one's for Dr Brown. That's what it sounds like, 697 00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:11,640 Speaker 1: is you don't go cancer AIDS, harpies in the same 698 00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:18,920 Speaker 1: three equally serious. Seriously, that's amazing. Yeah. Now. Brown described 699 00:38:18,960 --> 00:38:21,239 Speaker 1: this as using a chamber with an ivy drip that 700 00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:23,480 Speaker 1: would spray a patient with hot water to cause a 701 00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:26,600 Speaker 1: healing fever. Uh. And in addition to this, Dr Brown 702 00:38:26,680 --> 00:38:29,880 Speaker 1: claimed to have developed a prototype asphalt removal machine, an 703 00:38:29,880 --> 00:38:32,520 Speaker 1: attachment for trailers that would make them more aerodynamic, in 704 00:38:32,520 --> 00:38:34,600 Speaker 1: a book that would provide a full explanation for the 705 00:38:34,600 --> 00:38:37,680 Speaker 1: movement of tectonic plates. He had a lot of book ideas, 706 00:38:37,760 --> 00:38:40,919 Speaker 1: including an autobiography about his medical career and a book 707 00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:45,840 Speaker 1: that would prove the existence of God. Tragically, John Ronald Brown, Yeah, 708 00:38:46,120 --> 00:38:48,319 Speaker 1: was taken away from us too soon to finish any 709 00:38:48,360 --> 00:38:51,080 Speaker 1: of these projects. In two thousand ten, just shot It 710 00:38:51,160 --> 00:38:54,520 Speaker 1: was eighty eight birthday. He died painfully of pneumonia in prison. 711 00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:58,760 Speaker 1: Oh well that's a silver lining painfully. Yeah, it's a story. Yeah, painfully. 712 00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:03,880 Speaker 1: It was a horrible death. Uh, he did not get 713 00:39:04,200 --> 00:39:11,120 Speaker 1: what he deserved. No, he absolutely did not. And on 714 00:39:11,239 --> 00:39:18,359 Speaker 1: that note, yeah, well, Sophia, what would you do if 715 00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:22,160 Speaker 1: you had a leg that you hated and desperately wanted 716 00:39:22,200 --> 00:39:25,439 Speaker 1: removed because you felt like it was an alien limb? Like, 717 00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:28,160 Speaker 1: what do you do? I think you go to therapy 718 00:39:28,280 --> 00:39:31,120 Speaker 1: and I don't know, try to work on it. I 719 00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:34,320 Speaker 1: don't really know. See, I was going to go with shotgun, 720 00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:38,359 Speaker 1: but yeah, therapy is probably better. I mean, I guess 721 00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:42,879 Speaker 1: I feel like depression in no way is the same 722 00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:46,319 Speaker 1: as this, but it's like depression makes sense. You know, 723 00:39:46,520 --> 00:39:49,480 Speaker 1: makes you want to kill yourself. And if someone was 724 00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:53,680 Speaker 1: just like, okay, here's a gun, I'd be like, oh, 725 00:39:53,719 --> 00:39:57,000 Speaker 1: that's not helping me. You know, probably just talked me 726 00:39:57,040 --> 00:40:01,439 Speaker 1: out of wanting to die. Yeah, that's yeah. I don't 727 00:40:01,440 --> 00:40:04,440 Speaker 1: know much about APATM nephelia, but it does sound like 728 00:40:04,480 --> 00:40:07,680 Speaker 1: a thing. I don't know, Like if that one guy changed, 729 00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:12,279 Speaker 1: then it's possible, right it is, but maybe he wasn't 730 00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:14,600 Speaker 1: as serious about it. I don't know, Like the doctor, 731 00:40:14,680 --> 00:40:18,640 Speaker 1: it's all the spectrum, right, you can probably be really 732 00:40:18,680 --> 00:40:20,880 Speaker 1: wanting your leg off and just a little bit wanting 733 00:40:20,880 --> 00:40:24,440 Speaker 1: it off. I don't know the doctor who, like the 734 00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:27,200 Speaker 1: legit doctor who had performed some of those surgeries and 735 00:40:27,200 --> 00:40:31,279 Speaker 1: then lost his operating privileges, Like there's a like he 736 00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:33,600 Speaker 1: he didn't make a bad point where he was like, look, 737 00:40:33,960 --> 00:40:36,319 Speaker 1: some people are going to do this, and as long 738 00:40:36,360 --> 00:40:39,480 Speaker 1: as you make sure you're only performing surgery on the 739 00:40:39,480 --> 00:40:41,480 Speaker 1: ones who are like otherwise going to go blow their 740 00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:43,719 Speaker 1: own legs off or lay down on a train track, like, 741 00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:47,319 Speaker 1: you're reducing harm. And I that's that There is an 742 00:40:47,360 --> 00:40:49,560 Speaker 1: argument to make, not that it's a bad argument, it's 743 00:40:49,640 --> 00:40:54,960 Speaker 1: just that, uh, you can try to guess who the 744 00:40:55,040 --> 00:40:58,239 Speaker 1: people are that are going to try it anyways, and 745 00:40:58,360 --> 00:41:01,279 Speaker 1: you can be wrong, and you know, there's really no 746 00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:04,359 Speaker 1: good answer. If you were wrong one way, people are 747 00:41:04,360 --> 00:41:06,960 Speaker 1: going to kill themselves or maim themselves on their own. 748 00:41:07,680 --> 00:41:09,880 Speaker 1: But if they come to you and you do it 749 00:41:09,920 --> 00:41:15,160 Speaker 1: every time, then there's no chance of them ever psychologically recovering. 750 00:41:15,360 --> 00:41:18,120 Speaker 1: So I don't know what the answer is there. Yeah, 751 00:41:18,239 --> 00:41:20,360 Speaker 1: I don't either, because it's one of those things where 752 00:41:21,040 --> 00:41:25,160 Speaker 1: clearly I think if Firth had been allowed to perform 753 00:41:25,520 --> 00:41:28,960 Speaker 1: or to to undergo the surgery, he clearly didn't really 754 00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:31,440 Speaker 1: want to lose his leg, and he probably would have 755 00:41:31,480 --> 00:41:36,120 Speaker 1: wound up regretting it. Um. I think. But the other guy, 756 00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:39,480 Speaker 1: the guy who died, Um, if he'd been able to 757 00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:41,920 Speaker 1: go to a real doctor in a safe o R 758 00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:45,359 Speaker 1: with a proper yeah, he'd still there's a good chance 759 00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:47,840 Speaker 1: he would have lived. Um. So it is it is. 760 00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:50,000 Speaker 1: There's not like an easy answer to this. I also 761 00:41:50,080 --> 00:41:52,160 Speaker 1: don't know anything about the disease, like does it spread, 762 00:41:52,200 --> 00:41:54,400 Speaker 1: Like after you get your one leg taken care of, 763 00:41:54,800 --> 00:41:56,640 Speaker 1: is it possible that you'll be like, oh, well, now 764 00:41:56,680 --> 00:41:58,319 Speaker 1: this leg is the alien and I need to get 765 00:41:58,320 --> 00:42:00,319 Speaker 1: this off and then you just keep going, how does 766 00:42:00,360 --> 00:42:02,640 Speaker 1: it work? Because you can get addicted to plastic surgery, 767 00:42:02,880 --> 00:42:05,319 Speaker 1: you can probably get addicted to this too, can't you? 768 00:42:05,760 --> 00:42:07,920 Speaker 1: Who know? You know, I assume, I assume you can. 769 00:42:08,280 --> 00:42:10,640 Speaker 1: I do think it's a bit different than that, just because, 770 00:42:10,640 --> 00:42:12,719 Speaker 1: like I think it's very focused. It tends to be 771 00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:15,200 Speaker 1: with these people like they're they're obsessed with this one 772 00:42:15,239 --> 00:42:20,360 Speaker 1: limb um. But you know, I'm not. Uh, I'm not 773 00:42:20,440 --> 00:42:26,040 Speaker 1: an expert on it. Um. It's certainly a pain a 774 00:42:26,080 --> 00:42:32,200 Speaker 1: complicated tail. Yes, as is the tale of John Brown. 775 00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:36,440 Speaker 1: What are you distracted by? What are you doing? The 776 00:42:36,480 --> 00:42:40,040 Speaker 1: bad John Brown? I'm trying to like, there's this screeching 777 00:42:40,120 --> 00:42:43,560 Speaker 1: noise coming over repeatedly the line, and I'm trying not 778 00:42:43,640 --> 00:42:46,359 Speaker 1: to be taken aback by it because it's horrible. Oh 779 00:42:46,400 --> 00:42:50,120 Speaker 1: that's my parent. I'm so sorry. I don't think so. 780 00:42:50,239 --> 00:42:59,239 Speaker 1: It sounds like somebody is like fucking an old television. Um. Yeah, okay, okay, um, 781 00:42:59,400 --> 00:43:05,799 Speaker 1: which are yeah? So it just sounds like you're there 782 00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:10,439 Speaker 1: is doctor John Ronald Brown. Um. It was a fun. 783 00:43:10,480 --> 00:43:12,600 Speaker 1: One of the interesting things about researching this was just 784 00:43:13,360 --> 00:43:14,600 Speaker 1: because I read. I had to read a lot of 785 00:43:14,640 --> 00:43:17,440 Speaker 1: old articles and documents dealing with the trans community is 786 00:43:17,480 --> 00:43:21,640 Speaker 1: like kind of experiencing the use of terminology and what's 787 00:43:21,680 --> 00:43:24,520 Speaker 1: okay evolve over the course of a couple of decades. 788 00:43:24,600 --> 00:43:27,759 Speaker 1: That was really interesting. UM, and I do recommend the 789 00:43:28,120 --> 00:43:32,680 Speaker 1: Digital Transgender Archive UM, which is like a really precious 790 00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:34,759 Speaker 1: source of You could kind of see it as an 791 00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:37,000 Speaker 1: attempt to make sure that like, no matter what happens, 792 00:43:37,040 --> 00:43:40,040 Speaker 1: what happens with the Magnus Hirschfeld's library doesn't happen again, 793 00:43:40,040 --> 00:43:44,120 Speaker 1: that these um, these historical documents of this community taking 794 00:43:44,120 --> 00:43:47,239 Speaker 1: care of itself and defending itself through the decades when 795 00:43:47,239 --> 00:43:49,359 Speaker 1: no one else gave a shit about them. UM, that 796 00:43:49,360 --> 00:43:53,280 Speaker 1: that doesn't get lost. It's a really um precious source 797 00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:56,520 Speaker 1: and uh, I found it fascinating, So I recommend given 798 00:43:56,560 --> 00:44:04,480 Speaker 1: that a ready read cool. Great yep, Well, Sophia, you 799 00:44:04,600 --> 00:44:07,799 Speaker 1: got any plug bubles you wanna you wanna drop down 800 00:44:07,800 --> 00:44:11,560 Speaker 1: in the old P zone? What's the P zone? That's 801 00:44:11,560 --> 00:44:16,200 Speaker 1: the plug zone, that's what it sounds like. All right, 802 00:44:16,600 --> 00:44:22,000 Speaker 1: my club, my plug holes are. You can find me 803 00:44:22,120 --> 00:44:26,320 Speaker 1: at this ifia on Twitter and Instagram. That's th h 804 00:44:26,440 --> 00:44:29,640 Speaker 1: E s O f I y A and you can 805 00:44:29,760 --> 00:44:33,120 Speaker 1: catch me with miles Gray on our podcast for twenty 806 00:44:33,160 --> 00:44:36,280 Speaker 1: Day Fiance Weekly. It's super fun. It's a game show 807 00:44:36,320 --> 00:44:39,640 Speaker 1: recap show of ninety d fiance and it's ridiculous and 808 00:44:39,719 --> 00:44:42,520 Speaker 1: we have sound effects. And you can catch me on 809 00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:44,520 Speaker 1: my other podcast Private Parts and known about love and 810 00:44:44,520 --> 00:44:49,200 Speaker 1: sex around the world. Well you can, you can. You 811 00:44:49,239 --> 00:44:52,759 Speaker 1: can do that. You can catch me on my other 812 00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:55,279 Speaker 1: podcast Worst Year Ever. You can catch me on this 813 00:44:55,360 --> 00:44:58,640 Speaker 1: podcast every Tuesday and Thursday, except for the Tuesdays and 814 00:44:58,640 --> 00:45:03,400 Speaker 1: Thursdays that I don't do this podcast. Um, and you 815 00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:08,320 Speaker 1: can find love in your heart, I hope. If not, sorry, 816 00:45:09,520 --> 00:45:21,760 Speaker 1: that's rough. That's the episode. M h m hm