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Speaker 1: You're listening to the Sportsman's Nation podcast network, brought to

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Speaker 1: you by Interstate Batteries. Interstate Batteries has been a proud

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Speaker 1: you need to go on with your life. Interstate Batteries

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Speaker 1: outrageously dependable. My name is Clay Nukeleman. I'm the host

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Speaker 1: of the Bear Hunting Magazine podcast. I'll also be your

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Speaker 1: host into the world of hunting the icon of the

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Speaker 1: North American wilderness. Prepare. We'll talk about tactics, gear conservation.

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Speaker 1: We will also bring you into some of the wildest

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Speaker 1: drink on the planet, chasing back. This week we have

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Speaker 1: Josh Kwood, James Brandenburg, the back Country Hunters and Anglers.

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Speaker 1: We talked about that organization. We even dig a little

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Speaker 1: bit into the nitty gritty fun conversation with these guys.

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Speaker 1: You're gonna enjoy it. Our partners W Hunting Supply, they're

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Speaker 1: to dog related stuff. It's getting to be wintertime and

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Speaker 1: that's when a lot of hound related dog related activities

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Speaker 1: are taking place. Like us, we're about to start squirrel

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Speaker 1: hunting and coon hunting a lot. W they're one of

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Speaker 1: W Hunting Supply. There's still several muzzloader seasons going on

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Speaker 1: need the tool to remove. You're in the field, you

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Speaker 1: need to check and see if you're guns loaded you're

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Speaker 1: in the field and you need to reload, maybe you

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Speaker 1: feel like your powder got wet. That happened to me

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Speaker 1: the other day. I was in a torrential downpour for

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Speaker 1: several hours with the muzzloader. The next time I hunted,

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Speaker 1: I was fearful that the powder would be wet, so

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Speaker 1: I removed the breech plug by hand in the field.

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Speaker 1: Turns out the powder was not wet. It was perfectly dry.

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Speaker 1: The gun would have fired perfectly, but it gave me

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Speaker 1: peace of mind to know that the powder was drying

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Speaker 1: c v A. They have an incredible guarantee on all

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Speaker 1: their guns. Check them out north Woods Bear Products. If

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Speaker 1: most of the bear baiting seasons are over right now,

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Speaker 1: even though I have one time baited bears in November

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Speaker 1: here in Arkansas. But if you're getting ready for spring,

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Speaker 1: whatever you're doing, north Woods Bear Products. They make the

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Speaker 1: could use. Makes your sense extremely potent, makes your baits loud,

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Speaker 1: and it draws in more bears than they natural food could.

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Speaker 1: Check out our buddies at north Woods Bear Products. Josh Kwood.

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Speaker 1: We've got Josh Kwood here to my uh my, northeast.

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Speaker 1: Here you can get out of my compass. James Brandenburg

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Speaker 1: here to my right. Um, what do you guys doing, James,

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Speaker 1: why are you at the global headquarters? Oh? We wanted

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Speaker 1: to mess up your deer hunting for the day. You

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Speaker 1: you did that? No, he Josh is with you work

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Speaker 1: full time for back Country Hunters and Anglers, sir. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and then James, you're the Arkansas Chapter chair, Arkansas Chapter

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Speaker 1: Chair of the back Country Hunters and Anglers. So yeah.

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Speaker 1: So I just want to Josh, this is a unique

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Speaker 1: situation of the podcast because I hardly know you at all,

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Speaker 1: and we were standing outside the door and I was like,

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Speaker 1: don't tell me anything about yourself, don't tell me where

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Speaker 1: you're from, don't tell me because I wanted to do

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Speaker 1: it here. So this is a good This is a

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Speaker 1: good way to to get to know who you are

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Speaker 1: because you work full time for back Country hundred Anglers. Sir. So,

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Speaker 1: I'm the Southeast Chapter coordinator for back Country Hunters and English.

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Speaker 1: So I cover Arkansas, Tennessee, Georgia, UM, North Carolina, South Carolina,

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Speaker 1: and then what's left of the Southeast chapter now, which

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Speaker 1: is Mississippi, Alabama. In Louisiana. So before I ask you,

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Speaker 1: like what you do, give just a general overview of

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Speaker 1: back country hunters and anglers. Yeah. The way I like

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Speaker 1: to think about it is we are, uh, we're nonprofit

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Speaker 1: focused on preserving public landing access for sportsmen and sports women.

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Speaker 1: So we want to make sure that folks have a

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Speaker 1: place to go hunting fish and that there's ample habitat

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Speaker 1: to support the game and fish that they're pursuing. So

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Speaker 1: so access access is huge. That's that's your main that's

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Speaker 1: your main focus, main focus. Yeah, that's gonna come up

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Speaker 1: later in our conversation. I have a feeling because all

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Speaker 1: these big national groups have focuses. Yep, there's in all

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Speaker 1: of them are so important and critical for this big

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Speaker 1: picture that we're really all trying to achieve, which I

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Speaker 1: think is long term high quality hunting and fishing access

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Speaker 1: for generations to come. I mean sustainable long term. That's

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Speaker 1: what I think. That's what Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation wants.

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Speaker 1: I think that's what b wants. I think that's what

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Speaker 1: s c I wants. I think that's what Boone and

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Speaker 1: Crockett wants, that's what National Trick Your Federation wants. Absolutely

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Speaker 1: everybody's got their own place. Hold that thought in your mind,

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Speaker 1: because we're gonna come back to that, got it. Yep.

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Speaker 1: But so how long have you been working for b

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Speaker 1: h A About three years now. So yeah, I was

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Speaker 1: the chapter chair and one of the original founding members

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Speaker 1: of the Southeast chapter and the time came up to

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Speaker 1: jump on board and said, yeah, I'd love to be

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Speaker 1: the chater, the chapter coordinator. So the job just came

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Speaker 1: available on the b h A dot com. Yeah that's

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Speaker 1: not there, it's but yeah, I mean, you know, so

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Speaker 1: I we'll toss double field send an email out saying

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Speaker 1: that they were looking for working for a full time position. Yep,

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Speaker 1: and I apply just random, but I just became obsessed

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Speaker 1: with the mission. Um, and I was working in healthcare

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Speaker 1: and said, you know what, maybe I could make a switch.

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Speaker 1: That was gonna be my next question. What were you

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Speaker 1: doing before that? Yeah, so I was in UH. I

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Speaker 1: was at a like a healthcare consulting group that kind

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Speaker 1: of did a large population market research, so kind of

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Speaker 1: like impacts on sounds thrilling. It was actually super interesting,

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Speaker 1: but it wasn't as cool as what I'm doing. It

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Speaker 1: actually does sound interesting if you like to study stuff,

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Speaker 1: you know, I guess it would be interesting, like the

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Speaker 1: hunting fish. Maybe not. So where did you? Where do

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Speaker 1: you live now? I live in Chattanooga, Tennessee. Is that

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Speaker 1: where you're from. No, I'm from like just outside of Atlanta, Georgia,

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Speaker 1: and I've kind of like a I'm kind of a

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Speaker 1: mud of the South. So I've lived in West Tennessee,

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Speaker 1: I've lived in uh kind of North Georgia, Mississippi, So

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Speaker 1: I'm kind of all over the What took you all

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Speaker 1: those different places? Just jobs, you know, just moving around

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Speaker 1: for different different things here and there, and just falling

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Speaker 1: in love with the South and specifically for what I

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Speaker 1: would consider the Deep South. Yeah, so what uh? Why

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Speaker 1: did you have to move to Chattanooga? Job? You needed

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Speaker 1: to be right there. I got recruited to help start

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Speaker 1: a healthcare technology coming. Okay, So b h A didn't

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Speaker 1: move you to Chad No. No, so I got recruited.

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Speaker 1: So you were just there and you were able to

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Speaker 1: stay there? Yes, sir, Yeah, I love it. Okay, it's

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Speaker 1: pretty good hunting and fishing there around Chattanooga. Uh. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: there's a tremendous amount of public land all around. We

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Speaker 1: got Cherokee National Forest, Chattahote National Forest and hala um

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Speaker 1: I live. My backyard basically backs up to a big

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Speaker 1: state force twenty four thousand acres. What country song has

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Speaker 1: made Chattanooga like an iconic southern city it's it's ringing him.

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Speaker 1: I think it's a I think it's an old like

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Speaker 1: Jazza on the Chattanooga Chi Chi or kind of like okay,

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Speaker 1: that's yeah, yeah, okay, just just trying to clear this

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Speaker 1: up in my mind. That's all I could think about,

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Speaker 1: which is totally irrelevant, but okay, so um so what

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Speaker 1: kind of what kind of hunting do you do? My

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Speaker 1: main thing is waterfowl hunting? So um I picked that

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Speaker 1: up in Mississippi and not basically spend December and January Mississippi. Uh,

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Speaker 1: Mississippi the Delta so kind of northwest Mississippi. And you

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Speaker 1: said you you're you you love the Deep South? Yes, okay.

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Speaker 1: People that meet me that are from like anywhere north

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Speaker 1: of here, I think that I live in the Deep South,

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Speaker 1: right I do not, I mean, and I do take

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Speaker 1: I mean, I do enjoy being from the South, and

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Speaker 1: like take pride in that I live in the South

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Speaker 1: because we do, don't we James Um, but we don't

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Speaker 1: live in the Deep South. This this is this is

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Speaker 1: uh uplands Southern culture. That would be the technical description

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Speaker 1: of the Ozarks, the Appalachians, wash Stalls, highlands. Southern culture

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Speaker 1: is very different than what I think you're talking about

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Speaker 1: Deep South, because Deep South stuff would be it's like

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Speaker 1: cultural shift and it would all have to do with

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Speaker 1: the geographic features of the regions. I mean, like in Arkansas,

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Speaker 1: there would be a very very distinct divide. I mean

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Speaker 1: like you could like your your seven year old could

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Speaker 1: be like, Okay, now we're in the Deep South. You

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Speaker 1: can tell it. You can tell the moment you drive

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Speaker 1: down it basically a hill. Ye, your your stomach drops out,

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Speaker 1: and then you are in the Deep South. Yeah, and

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Speaker 1: and everything changes. It would be categorized by agriculture, flatlands,

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Speaker 1: uh lowland country, big rivers, Mississippi Delta and there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of the big rivers inside of the Mississippi. But

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Speaker 1: what do you what do you? What draws you? You

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Speaker 1: said you lie that what is is it? The waterfowl hunting,

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Speaker 1: It's the waterfowl hunting, is the culture, is the food,

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Speaker 1: It's the community, It's the slower pace of life. It's

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Speaker 1: all those things. I mean, being an obsessive water fowler

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Speaker 1: doesn't hurt to fall in love with that. But um

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Speaker 1: and I and listen, I love the South I'll live in.

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Speaker 1: Would would basically be considered Appalachians now or Appalachians, you know.

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Speaker 1: People get mad about how people say that, but I'm

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Speaker 1: still undecided, Yeah, on what I'm comfortable with saying, if

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Speaker 1: saying Appalachian, because when I was over there, I had

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Speaker 1: a couple of guys that should know tell me to

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Speaker 1: say Appalachian, but then I they I heard them say it,

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Speaker 1: and they didn't say it like that. So anyway, it's

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Speaker 1: it's a point of controversy, it is. But yeah, man,

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Speaker 1: I do and I would say, like you, you definitely

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Speaker 1: have the deep South here in Arkansas, right, and that

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Speaker 1: probably starts somewhere in the delta. I mean, I think

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Speaker 1: Little Rock would be definitely like a harp harps you know,

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Speaker 1: starting yeah, yeah, Well, Arkansas would be like if if

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Speaker 1: Arkansas were a square, it would you know, if you

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Speaker 1: drew a line from the northeast corner to the southwest

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Speaker 1: corner of that square, for the most part, everything in

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Speaker 1: the southeast side of Arkansas would be in the southeast

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Speaker 1: section of that square would be heavily influenced by Mississippi River,

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Speaker 1: Delta stuff, agriculture, you know, timber, which would be vastly

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Speaker 1: different than where we're at right here in the Ozarks.

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Speaker 1: You know, have you your most exposure would have been

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Speaker 1: hunting with over in Brinkley with Jonathan And have you

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Speaker 1: ever spent a time down there? Not really. I mean

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Speaker 1: I've driven through there a few times, but I haven't

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Speaker 1: spent a lot of time over there. So um. People

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Speaker 1: that I've gotten to know from from that side of

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Speaker 1: the state, though, I just I just love their passion

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Speaker 1: for where they live. It's just like up here, like

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Speaker 1: we're all proud to live in the mountains, and they're

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Speaker 1: all proud to live in the Delta, And I think, uh,

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Speaker 1: people have pride and where they live, they take care

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Speaker 1: of it, they fight for it. Um, And I'm I'm

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Speaker 1: really looking forward to spending more time over there in

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Speaker 1: this role with b h a that I have, and

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Speaker 1: just getting to know more about how things work over

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Speaker 1: there and you know, all that kind of stuff. So

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Speaker 1: I bought waiters, like actual duck waiters for this year,

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Speaker 1: So like last year, I was just duck hunting in

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Speaker 1: my fishing waiters. This year, I've actually got real duck,

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Speaker 1: real duck waiters. Yeah. That's that's a big move. That's

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Speaker 1: a big step, man. I know, I know, I'm not

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Speaker 1: sure if I'm ready for it. Um, Josh, you married,

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Speaker 1: I am have children or anything? Yes, sir, I got

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Speaker 1: a I got a year and a half year old daughter,

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Speaker 1: and then I got a boy on the way. Okay,

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Speaker 1: yep cool. Yeah. In fact, he mentioned that your dog's

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Speaker 1: name is Timber, and I'm thinking about naming my son Timber. Okay,

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Speaker 1: well scratch that in the podcast, so his wife doesn't

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Speaker 1: hear that my son's name is Bear. And like of

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Speaker 1: the people that I meet that don't know me, they're like, man,

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Speaker 1: I had a dog named Bear. I'm like, thanks, man.

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Speaker 1: It turns out I actually had a dog named Bear

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Speaker 1: too when I was young. I don't tell people that though.

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Speaker 1: Did you tell mist that? No? I know that ever,

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Speaker 1: honestly don't know that ever did, because it was such

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Speaker 1: a It's a dog that I think I remember through

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Speaker 1: my father, because I think I was too young to

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Speaker 1: actually remember the dog. I think there's pictures of the dog,

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Speaker 1: so I don't really think I have real memories a bear,

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Speaker 1: the dog, so that doesn't count. That's why it's not

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Speaker 1: in my like real functional memory. You get a pass.

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Speaker 1: Yeah uh so I was trying to get a little

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Speaker 1: background there too. Tell me what you do on like

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Speaker 1: a day to day basis with bh A. Yeah. My

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Speaker 1: IB is basically to facilitate, um, anything that any of

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Speaker 1: my chapter boards are working on. So that could be

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Speaker 1: kind of punching out an email for them so that

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Speaker 1: they can send that out to their chapter two working

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Speaker 1: on various issues at like a state or federal level

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Speaker 1: with the state legislator. Yeah, uh us legislator. So how

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Speaker 1: many chapters are there in the Southeast that you kind

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Speaker 1: of manage? I managed seven? Seven? Where are they at? Georgia, Florida, UM, Tennessee,

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Speaker 1: North Carolina, South Carolina, Arkansas? And then the Southeast chapter

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Speaker 1: would be uh, Mississippi, Alabama, and Louisiana. Okay, yep. Cool.

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Speaker 1: So that's that's a lot of work. Huh. That's good

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Speaker 1: to be started off as a cush job. I was

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Speaker 1: able to go hunting and fishing whenever I wanted, and

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Speaker 1: now I'm sitting in Arkansas instead of my dear Belinde.

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Speaker 1: We keep picking fights for him to help us out with. Well,

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Speaker 1: so when I first became familiar with B. H A

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Speaker 1: and and and James as well. You know, one thing

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Speaker 1: I think James and I've talked about it sometimes in

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Speaker 1: the in this part of the world, there seems to

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Speaker 1: be less public land issues, or there there would seem

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Speaker 1: to be on the surface anyway, because some of the

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Speaker 1: stuff out west is really kind of headline dominating in

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Speaker 1: your face, big moves, you know, like some state wanting

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Speaker 1: to sell off a couple hundred thousand acres public land

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Speaker 1: or something, or some senators saying they're gonna do this

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Speaker 1: or that we don't have as much of that here.

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Speaker 1: So tell me some of the issues going on it.

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Speaker 1: I guess in the southeast that would be a good

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Speaker 1: that would be a good starting point, or even why

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Speaker 1: you're here today. So um, I'll end on why I'm

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Speaker 1: here today. But I guess one big thing would be

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Speaker 1: like in Louisiana, Um, you're seeing kind of a a

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Speaker 1: access to the water being taken away from the public um,

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Speaker 1: specifically the marsh and the coast there. And there's all

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Speaker 1: sorts of tricky reasons as to why that's happening. But

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Speaker 1: that's you know, a really really massive amount of kind

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Speaker 1: of what do you mean by that? That like literally

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Speaker 1: like like you cannot drive the boat. You cannot you

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Speaker 1: cannot drive a boat on what would in all intensive

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Speaker 1: purposes at this point be considered the ocean because you

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Speaker 1: are on somebody's property. Because the water, the water bottom

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Speaker 1: um most most of the times on the coast, you

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Speaker 1: would you would like an oil company would own the bottom. Well,

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Speaker 1: the mineral rights are attached to the surface in Louisiana,

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Speaker 1: so surface rights, and that is there for a variety

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Speaker 1: of reasons. But um, the big problem with that is

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Speaker 1: we're losing a tremendous amount of the marsh and Louisiana's

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Speaker 1: like you know, the statistic is like a football field

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Speaker 1: every now any minutes of marshland and so that are

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Speaker 1: being lost to access. No that that that that marsh

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Speaker 1: grass is disappearing, So we're talking about an environmental issue.

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Speaker 1: And then that is now just water. So so what

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Speaker 1: used to be kind of dry ground at one point

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Speaker 1: is now water and you theoretically would not be able

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Speaker 1: to drive a boat over that water because it's still

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Speaker 1: technically private, right, good like up here, like when they

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Speaker 1: flooded the land to make Beaver Lake. It's like the

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Speaker 1: guy who used to own the bottom of the river.

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Speaker 1: They're coming back and saying, hey, you can't drive your

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Speaker 1: bass boat over this because I owned the bold looking

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Speaker 1: at your Onyx maps and seeing the property line in

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Speaker 1: the water being here, but the water is encroach I

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Speaker 1: mean it's it's it's completely taken over. I mean that

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Speaker 1: land has disappeared, and so and then so the property

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Speaker 1: owners are saying, hey, we own out you know, a

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Speaker 1: hundred yards, it's out into that body of water. Oh no,

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Speaker 1: they're like ten miles. Oh wow, to a point where

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Speaker 1: you could take Yeah, you could take like a you know,

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Speaker 1: a center console with two on the back of it

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Speaker 1: and drive as fast as you can for an hour

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Speaker 1: and be on on private land. So at one point

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Speaker 1: in memorable history, that would have been dry ground last year.

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Speaker 1: So what's happening with that? Just sea level rise. It's

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Speaker 1: a variety of things. So one would argue that sea

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Speaker 1: level rises is contributing to that other problems you have

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Speaker 1: subside and said the land itself is actually sinking. Okay,

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Speaker 1: I was about to make a joke, and I wasn't

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Speaker 1: gonna do it. Yeah, it's not a joke. And then um,

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Speaker 1: they dug oil canals are not oil canals, but canals

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Speaker 1: to get the oil container ships into port more effectively,

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Speaker 1: and they dug those in a straight line. And so

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Speaker 1: all these hurricanes you're seeing, well, the arm surge pushes

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Speaker 1: that water down those canals and it just kills that

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Speaker 1: marsh grass, floods it, and that marsh grass doesn't have

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Speaker 1: the time or the ability to grow back. They don't

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Speaker 1: have the ability to grow back because we took the

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Speaker 1: Mississippi River and we levied it off. Before we leve

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Speaker 1: it off, that river, it used to be like you

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Speaker 1: let up garden hosts loosen. It would just kind of

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Speaker 1: shift and spray all over the place and take all

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Speaker 1: that sediment from basically Canada all the way down and

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Speaker 1: it would disperse it into the Gulf of Mexico there.

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Speaker 1: And that's what kept that marsh grass alive. We don't

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Speaker 1: have that anymore because now we've contained the river so

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Speaker 1: tight it doesn't do its natural flood stage and stuff.

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Speaker 1: And you know, if you think about like the levying

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Speaker 1: of the Mississippi River, it seems like, oh, well that's happened,

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Speaker 1: that's been going on for forever. But it's been going

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Speaker 1: on for maybe a hundred years, which when you think

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Speaker 1: about geologic time, not too long. I mean that's like

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Speaker 1: a a milliseconds of time, and so you think about

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Speaker 1: the equal I never I was not aware of these issues.

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Speaker 1: So what's b h A dealing with stuff like that?

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Speaker 1: We are trying to find a solution that fits all

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Speaker 1: the parties, like so that you can still go fishing

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Speaker 1: up on the bank. Yeah yeah, I mean I mean,

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Speaker 1: like drive a boat yet so you can go out

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Speaker 1: there and duck hunts, so you can fish, and I

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Speaker 1: mean there's all sorts of people that have interests. But

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Speaker 1: you know, we don't want people to lose their rights

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Speaker 1: to their minerals. Obviously it's a big oil producing part

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Speaker 1: of the country and other things as well. Um, but

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Speaker 1: it's uh, you know, it's incredibly controversial in the state,

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Speaker 1: and we're just trying to help. We're trying to play

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Speaker 1: a facilitator role to bring all those different parties together

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Speaker 1: to find a solution that works and so that the

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Speaker 1: common guy can still take a sun fishing there you go.

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Speaker 1: So what other what other issues would there be? And

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Speaker 1: that's a that's a great example of that I would

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Speaker 1: not have really been aware of. That shows the kind

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Speaker 1: of stuff that you guys are working in. Yeah. Mean,

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Speaker 1: we we're doing things in Florida. Um. We've commented on

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Speaker 1: trying to get uh uh the hunting up black bear

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Speaker 1: in Florida, you know back um so our chapter down

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Speaker 1: there's kind of slowly poking around on that and beginning

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Speaker 1: to build the right relationships and hopefully that's something we'll

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Speaker 1: see here in the near term future. Um uh. And

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Speaker 1: then most recently here I'm in Arkansas working on this

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Speaker 1: pine tree research station issue, and uh it's a been

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Speaker 1: a very exciting project for us, and it's really helped

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Speaker 1: out the Arkansas chapter here. Yeah. So we did a

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Speaker 1: whole podcast James and I did on that. But give

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Speaker 1: me like a like a twenty five second uh synopsis

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Speaker 1: for someone who hadn't heard about that. At the University

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Speaker 1: of Arkansas owns eight hundred fifty acres over in eastern Arkansas.

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Speaker 1: It's a research station they bought from the Forest Service

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Speaker 1: back in the sixties. It's uh been managed. It's supposed

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Speaker 1: to remain open for public use. Um. The land is

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Speaker 1: supposed to be supposed to remain used for the public.

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Speaker 1: They've allowed hunting and fishing on that for a long time,

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Speaker 1: like seventy years. It's not not seventy years, but along

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Speaker 1: quite a long time. And um, they have a contract

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Speaker 1: in place to sell that land to a private entity

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Speaker 1: some of it that would then that portion would cease

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Speaker 1: to be in public use, which is a violation of

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Speaker 1: the deed, the original deed. Ye and so um, I

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Speaker 1: mean what we're working on on that is trying to

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Speaker 1: find a solution that keeps that land public. Like we've

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Speaker 1: talked about, if the university needs to sell that land

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Speaker 1: to fund other priorities, let's find another way to make

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Speaker 1: that happen that keeps that land public. It was it

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Speaker 1: was purchased by the federal government during the depression in

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Speaker 1: order to conserve the land to rehabilitate farmland that had

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Speaker 1: been degraded, just because it was marginal to start off with.

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Speaker 1: And it's now great wildlife habitat and we want to

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Speaker 1: see it stay that way and available to the public

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Speaker 1: as it has been public land now for close to

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Speaker 1: ninety years, you know, eighty five years it's been land,

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Speaker 1: so we wanted to stay there. So you guys are

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Speaker 1: advocating for a solution can not sell that land or

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Speaker 1: someone buy it that stays public, that it stays public. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so that's what puts me in the seat today. But

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Speaker 1: so you're in Arkansas dealing with some of that stuff. Yep, good,

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Speaker 1: excited to be here? Good? Well great? Anybody that's been

411
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Speaker 1: paying much atten into b h A. It blew my mind.

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Speaker 1: When I first started hearing about b h A, I

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Speaker 1: went and joined the organization, got involved with them, and

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Speaker 1: then all of a sudden, I started getting private messages

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Speaker 1: from a few people saying, hey, don't you know that

416
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Speaker 1: b h A is? And I mean, I'm just gonna

417
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Speaker 1: say it because it's on the internet, so we might

418
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Speaker 1: as well say it because we're gonna talk about why.

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Speaker 1: I mean, to me, it's just a ridiculous kind of

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Speaker 1: conspiracy theory. And I've got some data, because I promise

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Speaker 1: you I have scrutinized this organization and I have tried

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Speaker 1: to find somebody that could actually tell me why these

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00:25:41,160 --> 00:25:43,480
Speaker 1: terrible things were true. But I mean, people saying that

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Speaker 1: b h A was what was it? A green decoy?

425
00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:49,480
Speaker 1: So a green decoy for someone who wouldn't understand the analogy.

426
00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:54,240
Speaker 1: A green decoy would be a left wing environmental group

427
00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:58,639
Speaker 1: that would that would cloak itself as a hunter a

428
00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:03,240
Speaker 1: sportsman lad group that would try to like woo all

429
00:26:03,280 --> 00:26:06,320
Speaker 1: these sportsmen and come in a's like the hunter kid,

430
00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:10,199
Speaker 1: and then turn the table at some point or in

431
00:26:10,240 --> 00:26:15,439
Speaker 1: the back room begin to navigate legislation and stuff in

432
00:26:15,480 --> 00:26:21,040
Speaker 1: the favor of anti hunting sentiment. I mean, it's not

433
00:26:21,080 --> 00:26:23,879
Speaker 1: like we're trying to hide that people say that people

434
00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:29,959
Speaker 1: do and it's in in UM. Do you guys have

435
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:33,080
Speaker 1: any ideas on where or why some of this would

436
00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:36,680
Speaker 1: have come up? Well, I mean we've made enemies, We've

437
00:26:36,800 --> 00:26:40,840
Speaker 1: we've made people mad and and and those some of

438
00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:44,639
Speaker 1: those folks have a vested interest to um creating a

439
00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:48,840
Speaker 1: narrative to to weaken us. And that you know, there's

440
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:53,200
Speaker 1: public relation groups that have you know, been commissioned to

441
00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:56,440
Speaker 1: write those articles about us and create that narrative. UM.

442
00:26:56,520 --> 00:27:00,679
Speaker 1: And that's you know, I think somewhat pub like pretty

443
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:03,760
Speaker 1: public knowledge to like the b h A like hardcore dudes.

444
00:27:03,920 --> 00:27:07,040
Speaker 1: So we know that some of that has happened, that

445
00:27:07,080 --> 00:27:11,720
Speaker 1: actually took place, uh maybe like five years ago before

446
00:27:11,760 --> 00:27:14,040
Speaker 1: I came onto b h A. That that whole kind

447
00:27:14,040 --> 00:27:16,400
Speaker 1: of narrative creation thing. But we've been dealing with it

448
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:18,280
Speaker 1: ever since. It's one of those things that kind of

449
00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:20,399
Speaker 1: lives on the internet. In fact, when I when I

450
00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:23,680
Speaker 1: told my dad I was moving my career to b

451
00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:26,320
Speaker 1: h A, he like googled and found that. He was like, well,

452
00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:28,600
Speaker 1: I think they're a bunch of liberal, anti anti hunting,

453
00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 1: you know. And I was like, no, no, no, I

454
00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:35,480
Speaker 1: don't think so, man. I mean, yeah, you just hang

455
00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:36,919
Speaker 1: out with some of these guys. I mean to hang

456
00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 1: out with the guys that work at b h A.

457
00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:41,440
Speaker 1: And I mean, you know, to Stupplefield, I think kills

458
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:44,040
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff, you know, And and one of

459
00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:48,199
Speaker 1: our main initiatives and our three program, which is we

460
00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:52,119
Speaker 1: want to create more hunters. Yeah, see that being too

461
00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:57,159
Speaker 1: you know, anti hunting friendly. Yeah. Well, I mean I

462
00:27:57,240 --> 00:27:59,960
Speaker 1: went to I went to the b h A round

463
00:28:00,000 --> 00:28:04,600
Speaker 1: off you woo three years ago. And I mean if

464
00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:06,520
Speaker 1: you could go to that rendezvous and say that this

465
00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:09,199
Speaker 1: was an anti hunting group, you you, I don't know,

466
00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:11,560
Speaker 1: you'd have to you have to have a pretty strong

467
00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:15,879
Speaker 1: warp on what you're seeing. Um. I think b h

468
00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:19,600
Speaker 1: A has done things different. I mean, like, for instance,

469
00:28:19,680 --> 00:28:21,399
Speaker 1: at that b h and it's a great thing to

470
00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:23,359
Speaker 1: bring up. Obviously, this is all public knowledge. They had

471
00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:30,919
Speaker 1: Van speaking there. Man, When I saw the founder of Patagonia,

472
00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:37,760
Speaker 1: a multibillion dollar, massive global player in the outdoor industry,

473
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:43,640
Speaker 1: setting in front of fift hundred hunters saying that he

474
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:47,120
Speaker 1: was on our side, I was like, this is good.

475
00:28:48,400 --> 00:28:50,160
Speaker 1: This is the guy you want on your team. I

476
00:28:50,200 --> 00:28:53,120
Speaker 1: came back from that rendezvous after I made a video

477
00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:58,360
Speaker 1: about it, and I had people email me and say, Clay,

478
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:03,480
Speaker 1: you are the representative of bear hunters across this country.

479
00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:07,440
Speaker 1: I cannot believe that you would put your stamp of

480
00:29:07,480 --> 00:29:11,920
Speaker 1: approval on Van Sinnard. He said, do you not know?

481
00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:13,520
Speaker 1: I mean this is almost word for word. I mean,

482
00:29:13,560 --> 00:29:15,480
Speaker 1: it's like Brandon in my mind what this guy said.

483
00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:20,280
Speaker 1: He said, do you not know that Ivan Shbardard is

484
00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:27,880
Speaker 1: UH is not for delisting yellstone grizzlies. It doesn't surprise

485
00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:32,560
Speaker 1: me that doesn't want I mean, he is not. He

486
00:29:32,680 --> 00:29:36,160
Speaker 1: is not totally on our page. Right, We're not totally

487
00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:39,000
Speaker 1: on his page. But we've b h A has a good,

488
00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:42,720
Speaker 1: a good way of coming together to work with people

489
00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:46,360
Speaker 1: that we do have some common ground with, and that

490
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:52,560
Speaker 1: spooks people that are of a mindset of polarization like

491
00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:55,360
Speaker 1: them and us and and I and I could be

492
00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:57,760
Speaker 1: in that camp in certain places. I'm not saying that.

493
00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:00,160
Speaker 1: I mean there's some places you you can't compromise us.

494
00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:04,680
Speaker 1: Like so, I'm not saying that we need to make

495
00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:08,160
Speaker 1: friends with you know, somebody that's gonna hurt us. But

496
00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:12,600
Speaker 1: that's that. This guy just was like, Clay, You're you're

497
00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:17,480
Speaker 1: betraying predator hunting by saying that Ivan Schinnard is a

498
00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:21,560
Speaker 1: friend of ours. And I just fundamentally disagree with that. Yeah. No, listen,

499
00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:24,280
Speaker 1: I did too. And I know a few of the

500
00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:26,680
Speaker 1: folks inside of Patagonia. I've done some stuff with them.

501
00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:31,760
Speaker 1: The main guy for all the retail stores in the East.

502
00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:35,480
Speaker 1: He is then next moose hunting god in Maine. I mean,

503
00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:39,880
Speaker 1: so like inside of Patagonia, there's disagreements, right, but you

504
00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:43,600
Speaker 1: know we can we can um, we can agree on

505
00:30:44,400 --> 00:30:48,280
Speaker 1: disagree if we can advance you know, public land public

506
00:30:48,360 --> 00:30:51,960
Speaker 1: land hunting, like I'm I'm willing to take that risk. Yeah,

507
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:56,960
Speaker 1: I mean, that's that's a big thing. Um I heard. Uh. So,

508
00:30:57,160 --> 00:31:00,440
Speaker 1: there was a there was a a podcast, a well

509
00:31:00,480 --> 00:31:03,800
Speaker 1: known podcast, and the host had a guy on that

510
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:07,480
Speaker 1: was like kind of a b h A guy. They

511
00:31:07,560 --> 00:31:10,000
Speaker 1: had a lot of background in y b h A

512
00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:13,320
Speaker 1: was like this anti hunting group. When I heard that

513
00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:16,560
Speaker 1: this was happening, I went to that podcast and was like, great,

514
00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:19,400
Speaker 1: here we go. Now I'm gonna be able to call

515
00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:23,560
Speaker 1: James and say I told you, James, get me out

516
00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:26,760
Speaker 1: of here. And I listen to that podcast and I

517
00:31:26,800 --> 00:31:30,720
Speaker 1: did not. I mean everything that was said was speculative.

518
00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:34,400
Speaker 1: I mean there was nothing. I was shocked that there

519
00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:39,800
Speaker 1: was nothing of in my opinion, of deep substance. And

520
00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:42,440
Speaker 1: there's all this stuff about funding. I mean, I I

521
00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:44,959
Speaker 1: could nerd out about it all. People can do their

522
00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 1: own research. But you know, there's there's this thing that

523
00:31:48,200 --> 00:31:50,680
Speaker 1: you know they get money from the Wilberforce Foundation. Well,

524
00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:52,480
Speaker 1: i'll tell you what. You can go look up Wilberforce

525
00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:54,920
Speaker 1: Foundation and you'll find that they give money to a

526
00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:57,560
Speaker 1: whole bunch of people. They give money to a bunch

527
00:31:57,560 --> 00:31:59,560
Speaker 1: of people that we probably don't agree with at all,

528
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:01,800
Speaker 1: but they also give a bunch of money to people

529
00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:04,280
Speaker 1: that we do agree with. And b h A is

530
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:08,320
Speaker 1: not entirely funded by the Wilberforce Foundation. And I mean

531
00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:12,280
Speaker 1: pretty much that was the main thing. As they were saying,

532
00:32:12,560 --> 00:32:15,240
Speaker 1: follow the money. These guys are getting money from anti

533
00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:18,440
Speaker 1: hunting groups, and you go and look, you can there's

534
00:32:18,560 --> 00:32:21,280
Speaker 1: you can do research and find out all the money

535
00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:26,120
Speaker 1: that Wilberforce dishes out. There's a bunch of other hunting

536
00:32:26,320 --> 00:32:30,080
Speaker 1: conservation groups that get money from them. If they called

537
00:32:30,120 --> 00:32:32,920
Speaker 1: me tomorrow and said, Clay, we want to give Bare

538
00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:37,680
Speaker 1: Hunting magazine some money, uh, I would listen to them.

539
00:32:37,720 --> 00:32:40,480
Speaker 1: I mean, you know what I mean. It's like, well,

540
00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:43,600
Speaker 1: you ask them what like what kind of strings are

541
00:32:43,600 --> 00:32:47,320
Speaker 1: attached to it, and and then you go from there.

542
00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:53,360
Speaker 1: I mean, I just this whole the polarization thing is

543
00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:56,640
Speaker 1: what just blows me away. It's like we all gotta

544
00:32:57,160 --> 00:33:02,000
Speaker 1: lock arms and march together, all agreeing on every single thing.

545
00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:07,280
Speaker 1: And that's not the way the world works. I mean, Clay,

546
00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:10,160
Speaker 1: that the twelve Disciples could not all agree on everything.

547
00:33:11,000 --> 00:33:15,920
Speaker 1: I mean, we we need diversity of opinions, we need

548
00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:20,880
Speaker 1: diversity of funding, we need diversity of goals. This is

549
00:33:20,920 --> 00:33:25,560
Speaker 1: what makes us America. Um. I would really I'm just

550
00:33:25,680 --> 00:33:28,000
Speaker 1: kind of curious. I would like to hear somebody say

551
00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:30,880
Speaker 1: what their motivations are for trying to tear b h

552
00:33:30,960 --> 00:33:35,120
Speaker 1: A down right. Oh yeah, there's motivations for sure. I

553
00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:38,280
Speaker 1: don't want to like speculate on that, but the speculations

554
00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:41,080
Speaker 1: aren't hard to make. Um. And I'm a huge fan

555
00:33:41,120 --> 00:33:43,120
Speaker 1: of that podcast and I run all that dudes gear

556
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:48,320
Speaker 1: um so like I uh, like I said earlier, like

557
00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:51,600
Speaker 1: if we're an anti hunting organization, we're doing it wrong. Hey,

558
00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:54,960
Speaker 1: well he and he's my friend to Yeah, he he

559
00:33:55,040 --> 00:34:00,520
Speaker 1: had land and Ryan on Ryan uh Or who had

560
00:34:00,600 --> 00:34:05,160
Speaker 1: lant Yeah right, busy on that from Kimber And he

561
00:34:05,240 --> 00:34:07,200
Speaker 1: used to be our chair. He's no no longer the

562
00:34:07,280 --> 00:34:10,640
Speaker 1: chair of our North American board. But I appreciated that

563
00:34:10,680 --> 00:34:13,920
Speaker 1: he did that because because he had a podcast about

564
00:34:14,600 --> 00:34:19,000
Speaker 1: you know, all the you know, all the alternative ideas

565
00:34:19,040 --> 00:34:22,040
Speaker 1: about b h A, and then he had these guys on.

566
00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:25,080
Speaker 1: He did a great job. Yeah, so I commend him

567
00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:28,760
Speaker 1: for that. Um. To me, this is really important because

568
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:31,360
Speaker 1: you know, like somebody isn't familiar to the b h

569
00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:34,319
Speaker 1: A and they hear this, it all sounds great, and

570
00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:36,400
Speaker 1: then the first time they get a whiff of something,

571
00:34:36,600 --> 00:34:38,440
Speaker 1: it kind of spooks him. That's the way it's happened

572
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:40,920
Speaker 1: with some of my friends and uh and that's what

573
00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:43,120
Speaker 1: would have happened with me if I hadn't doug a

574
00:34:43,160 --> 00:34:47,200
Speaker 1: little bit deeper. And I want to give a Okay,

575
00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:50,000
Speaker 1: here's the other thing that specifically people have talked to

576
00:34:50,040 --> 00:34:54,080
Speaker 1: me about because of my my background in history, is

577
00:34:54,120 --> 00:34:59,040
Speaker 1: people have said their anti predator hunting. Okay, that's what

578
00:34:59,080 --> 00:35:01,760
Speaker 1: they've said to me. B h A is anti predator hunting.

579
00:35:02,360 --> 00:35:07,759
Speaker 1: Well many things. I have seen multiple places where b

580
00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:10,759
Speaker 1: h A has advocated for bear hunting. I mean you

581
00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:13,000
Speaker 1: just brought it up a minute ago. The chapter in Florida.

582
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:17,000
Speaker 1: They were the guys that contacted me and got me

583
00:35:17,120 --> 00:35:20,920
Speaker 1: on a podcast down in Florida. B h A guys

584
00:35:20,960 --> 00:35:26,600
Speaker 1: hooked me up with some legitimate pod Florida Wide Fishing

585
00:35:26,680 --> 00:35:31,000
Speaker 1: Hunting podcast, got me on that b h A is. Uh. Now,

586
00:35:31,080 --> 00:35:34,080
Speaker 1: I know there's lots of great groups sci Sportsman's Alliance

587
00:35:34,120 --> 00:35:35,919
Speaker 1: that are working on this New Jersey thing too. Since

588
00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:39,000
Speaker 1: I'm not saying that b h is the only one word,

589
00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:43,400
Speaker 1: but b h A has a They wrote an article,

590
00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:48,520
Speaker 1: had a petition, uh, you know, standing against this governor

591
00:35:48,600 --> 00:35:50,560
Speaker 1: that has said he's gonna shut down bear hunting in

592
00:35:50,600 --> 00:35:53,680
Speaker 1: New Jersey, going against science, going against all the data

593
00:35:53,719 --> 00:35:56,520
Speaker 1: going against all the biologists and uh you know b

594
00:35:56,719 --> 00:35:58,840
Speaker 1: h A standing there saying, hey, we're fighting for a

595
00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:02,520
Speaker 1: bear hunt. Um, and uh you know I had people.

596
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:05,560
Speaker 1: Uh well, let let me get to my personal story.

597
00:36:05,800 --> 00:36:08,879
Speaker 1: So during the time when I was still and I'm

598
00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:11,919
Speaker 1: just gonna be real open here because I got nothing

599
00:36:11,960 --> 00:36:14,520
Speaker 1: to nothing to hide about it. When I was I

600
00:36:14,640 --> 00:36:16,560
Speaker 1: wasn't on the fence at all about b h A.

601
00:36:17,000 --> 00:36:22,600
Speaker 1: But I met Hal Herring Yah, and uh, I honestly

602
00:36:22,640 --> 00:36:25,040
Speaker 1: going to meet how. I went to spend a couple

603
00:36:25,080 --> 00:36:27,760
Speaker 1: of days with him, and I knew very little about him.

604
00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:29,239
Speaker 1: I just knew he worked for b h A and

605
00:36:29,280 --> 00:36:31,000
Speaker 1: did their podcast. It was kind of like a pretty

606
00:36:31,000 --> 00:36:33,680
Speaker 1: big voice for b h A. I didn't go over

607
00:36:33,680 --> 00:36:36,520
Speaker 1: there to be on his podcast like that. That was

608
00:36:37,080 --> 00:36:41,240
Speaker 1: not I mean, that wasn't the only reason that I went. Um.

609
00:36:41,280 --> 00:36:47,600
Speaker 1: But when I when I went there, I mean, I'm

610
00:36:47,640 --> 00:36:49,279
Speaker 1: I run. I don't know if you ever heard of it,

611
00:36:49,320 --> 00:36:52,479
Speaker 1: but I published a magazine called Bare Hunting Magazine. I've

612
00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:55,000
Speaker 1: heard of it, and and I so I am pro

613
00:36:55,160 --> 00:36:59,080
Speaker 1: predator hunting, pro mountain lion hunting, you know, all within

614
00:36:59,080 --> 00:37:02,880
Speaker 1: the bounds of science and such. And uh, Hal Harry

615
00:37:03,040 --> 00:37:05,239
Speaker 1: told me. He said that he talked to some of

616
00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:07,680
Speaker 1: the head leaders at b h A and told him

617
00:37:07,719 --> 00:37:09,759
Speaker 1: he was going to be in camp with me, and

618
00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:14,680
Speaker 1: they said, get Clay on the podcast. Yeah, that's what

619
00:37:14,760 --> 00:37:16,600
Speaker 1: he told me. What I mean, but it was to

620
00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:18,400
Speaker 1: get you on the podcast and get you in a

621
00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:21,680
Speaker 1: gotcha moment, right. They were trying to trap you, trying

622
00:37:21,719 --> 00:37:25,000
Speaker 1: to decoy decoy you in Yeah. Yeah, So all I

623
00:37:25,080 --> 00:37:28,719
Speaker 1: was saying, if they're an anti hunting, anti predator group,

624
00:37:28,760 --> 00:37:33,760
Speaker 1: they're doing a bad job because they they but okay,

625
00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:36,439
Speaker 1: here's here's the thing, though, they're doing a bad job

626
00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:40,160
Speaker 1: with that because they're they're they're doing so much I think,

627
00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:43,600
Speaker 1: I mean, pro all these things we're talking about. But

628
00:37:43,760 --> 00:37:45,879
Speaker 1: here's the here's the thing is that when I made

629
00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:48,640
Speaker 1: a post the other day about b h A in

630
00:37:48,680 --> 00:37:52,160
Speaker 1: the New Jersey petition, there was a guy on there

631
00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:55,640
Speaker 1: and you said something to him, James that said, well,

632
00:37:55,960 --> 00:37:59,320
Speaker 1: I wonder why the National b h A isn't saying

633
00:37:59,360 --> 00:38:04,279
Speaker 1: something up and he he was clearly saying that, you know,

634
00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:07,840
Speaker 1: there was some there was some reason why the National

635
00:38:08,000 --> 00:38:11,080
Speaker 1: wasn't getting on and it was And I got on

636
00:38:11,120 --> 00:38:14,600
Speaker 1: there and said, man, all these different groups have different lanes.

637
00:38:15,200 --> 00:38:18,560
Speaker 1: I said, you know, b h A primarily does access

638
00:38:19,239 --> 00:38:23,399
Speaker 1: land access. That's the main thing b h A is not.

639
00:38:24,360 --> 00:38:26,600
Speaker 1: We're also small, right, so it's hard for us to

640
00:38:28,239 --> 00:38:30,920
Speaker 1: get outside of that lane and be effective. And and

641
00:38:31,320 --> 00:38:33,040
Speaker 1: when we do get out of side of our lane,

642
00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:36,719
Speaker 1: that can bog us down to detract from our main mission. Right.

643
00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:40,160
Speaker 1: So so it's just it's just it's business. It's it's

644
00:38:40,200 --> 00:38:45,440
Speaker 1: staying on mission and no go ahead. I think I

645
00:38:45,480 --> 00:38:49,240
Speaker 1: think you're you're on the right path. And and uh,

646
00:38:49,440 --> 00:38:50,960
Speaker 1: at the end of the day too, that one of

647
00:38:50,960 --> 00:38:54,360
Speaker 1: the reasons why you know, you might not see something

648
00:38:54,400 --> 00:38:58,520
Speaker 1: out of the North American Organization as a whole is

649
00:38:59,600 --> 00:39:02,680
Speaker 1: we our job is to back our chapters, right, so

650
00:39:02,719 --> 00:39:04,640
Speaker 1: we back the work that our chapters are doing. We're

651
00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:09,000
Speaker 1: a we're a lad from the ground up that we're

652
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:13,279
Speaker 1: not a top down organization. Our guys going pick the

653
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:18,959
Speaker 1: fights or girls and whenever they got something that they

654
00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:21,879
Speaker 1: want to engage in on something like you know, in

655
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:24,760
Speaker 1: in in Florida or New Jersey, which I'm not terribly

656
00:39:24,760 --> 00:39:28,080
Speaker 1: familiar with, I apologize, but you know, our job, my

657
00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:31,359
Speaker 1: job at that point is all right, let's make this happen,

658
00:39:31,440 --> 00:39:34,439
Speaker 1: let's put in the work, let's organized, and you guys

659
00:39:34,520 --> 00:39:37,960
Speaker 1: now have all of our resources. So and James, you

660
00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:40,520
Speaker 1: made a great point. What was that? Yeah? My point

661
00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:45,920
Speaker 1: is that as a chapter leader, that's amazingly empowering to

662
00:39:46,040 --> 00:39:50,840
Speaker 1: me to know that I'm here on the ground in

663
00:39:50,880 --> 00:39:56,279
Speaker 1: this state and our members here in this state, if

664
00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:59,799
Speaker 1: they have an issue that's important to them, it's important

665
00:40:00,040 --> 00:40:07,359
Speaker 1: in to our national organization. It's it's empowering in so

666
00:40:07,480 --> 00:40:10,960
Speaker 1: many ways, UM, as chapter leaders to be able to

667
00:40:11,000 --> 00:40:14,000
Speaker 1: pick those fights and not have it dictated to us,

668
00:40:14,960 --> 00:40:18,680
Speaker 1: UM that we need to get on board with this

669
00:40:18,760 --> 00:40:21,720
Speaker 1: or get on board with that. Are there national issues

670
00:40:21,840 --> 00:40:26,000
Speaker 1: that we all work together on, Yes, Great American Outdoors Act,

671
00:40:26,360 --> 00:40:29,879
Speaker 1: Land and Water Conservation Fund, these big national things yes.

672
00:40:30,800 --> 00:40:32,960
Speaker 1: Well and and and the point that you made to

673
00:40:33,040 --> 00:40:35,200
Speaker 1: me that was I thought was so strong into this

674
00:40:35,560 --> 00:40:39,600
Speaker 1: guy that made that comment was that local issues are

675
00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:43,560
Speaker 1: handled locally, national issues are handled nationally. So I mean

676
00:40:43,560 --> 00:40:46,520
Speaker 1: this was a statewide issue in New Jersey. And so

677
00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:51,600
Speaker 1: I mean like structurally the organization is not designed for

678
00:40:52,440 --> 00:40:55,399
Speaker 1: b H A national I mean just the way it's

679
00:40:55,440 --> 00:40:59,480
Speaker 1: just lined up. It's lined up so that the b

680
00:40:59,719 --> 00:41:03,000
Speaker 1: h A. New Jersey is fighting that fight, and obviously

681
00:41:03,200 --> 00:41:06,200
Speaker 1: that's been sent out nationally and and there's been support

682
00:41:06,280 --> 00:41:08,880
Speaker 1: coming in nationally from that. We'll do our best to

683
00:41:08,920 --> 00:41:11,759
Speaker 1: promote it, you know, that's that's our job. And so

684
00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:14,759
Speaker 1: it wasn't a conspiracy to actually make bear hunting go

685
00:41:14,760 --> 00:41:16,560
Speaker 1: away in New Jersey? Is that what you're telling me?

686
00:41:17,160 --> 00:41:22,279
Speaker 1: That was? That was my comment to the guy that

687
00:41:22,360 --> 00:41:24,560
Speaker 1: made the question. I said, it sounds to me like

688
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:27,680
Speaker 1: you're upset at b h A for taking a stance,

689
00:41:28,160 --> 00:41:32,879
Speaker 1: public stance against ending the bear hunt. Saying we're pro

690
00:41:32,960 --> 00:41:35,000
Speaker 1: bear hunting. Sounds to me like you're mad at them

691
00:41:35,000 --> 00:41:37,919
Speaker 1: for that, and thinking that mad at the method rather

692
00:41:37,960 --> 00:41:41,080
Speaker 1: than I mean, it didn't make sense anyway. I realized

693
00:41:41,160 --> 00:41:43,239
Speaker 1: I am going on and on about this, and that's

694
00:41:43,280 --> 00:41:45,480
Speaker 1: not y'all didn't come here to talk about this. But

695
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:47,879
Speaker 1: I think it's a major issue. I mean, I think

696
00:41:47,920 --> 00:41:51,239
Speaker 1: it's a fly in the ointment and and man, I'm

697
00:41:51,280 --> 00:41:56,960
Speaker 1: not sitting here saying that. I mean, I am equally

698
00:41:57,520 --> 00:42:01,520
Speaker 1: is I mean, I love Sportsman's Allion, I love s C.

699
00:42:01,719 --> 00:42:05,239
Speaker 1: I sure like there's a ton of groups that I'm

700
00:42:05,239 --> 00:42:08,520
Speaker 1: passionate about that if I had a good connection to

701
00:42:08,680 --> 00:42:12,040
Speaker 1: would probably be sitting here too, you know. Um So,

702
00:42:12,080 --> 00:42:14,359
Speaker 1: I mean it's not like you have to be like,

703
00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:16,839
Speaker 1: if you're a b h A guy, then that's all

704
00:42:16,880 --> 00:42:19,640
Speaker 1: you are. That's what people feel like, That's what I

705
00:42:19,680 --> 00:42:22,279
Speaker 1: feel like. People. If you identify yourself at all with

706
00:42:22,320 --> 00:42:25,480
Speaker 1: an organization, then then that's like, well, we can't get

707
00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:29,719
Speaker 1: our identities so wrapped up in each one of these

708
00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:33,080
Speaker 1: little groups. You know, people get so wrapped up in

709
00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:36,480
Speaker 1: whatever the label is that they want to put on themselves.

710
00:42:37,520 --> 00:42:40,319
Speaker 1: And I love b h A. I worked hard for

711
00:42:40,400 --> 00:42:44,719
Speaker 1: b h A. I love the diversity of opinions and

712
00:42:44,880 --> 00:42:49,120
Speaker 1: people and things that we can do that are focused.

713
00:42:49,480 --> 00:42:52,440
Speaker 1: I mean it's diverse, but it's focused in a specific lane.

714
00:42:53,719 --> 00:42:59,800
Speaker 1: And we were literally today amongst my board members talking

715
00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:03,480
Speaker 1: about how blessed we feel to have found each other

716
00:43:03,520 --> 00:43:07,400
Speaker 1: to work together with. I'm sure there's other organizations that

717
00:43:07,520 --> 00:43:11,240
Speaker 1: have those exact same things, but we weren't talking about,

718
00:43:12,160 --> 00:43:18,080
Speaker 1: you know, the how we were gonna take down hunting

719
00:43:18,080 --> 00:43:21,040
Speaker 1: and fishing. We were talking about we found people who

720
00:43:21,120 --> 00:43:27,360
Speaker 1: like to hunt fish, the means or the places, the

721
00:43:27,520 --> 00:43:31,759
Speaker 1: ideals that we all hold common, and we were so

722
00:43:31,840 --> 00:43:35,200
Speaker 1: happy to find a place where we could do that work.

723
00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:38,120
Speaker 1: You know, that's what we like to do. Man, if

724
00:43:38,160 --> 00:43:41,920
Speaker 1: you like to if your deal is cold water fishing

725
00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:48,360
Speaker 1: for wild and native trout, trout, unlimited, it, whatever it is.

726
00:43:50,360 --> 00:43:53,840
Speaker 1: But just because you're a member of that one group,

727
00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:57,399
Speaker 1: you don't have to throw rocks at all the other

728
00:43:57,480 --> 00:44:00,920
Speaker 1: ones either. And that's what that's I'm so glad that

729
00:44:01,960 --> 00:44:04,080
Speaker 1: I think it's just different amongst the people that I

730
00:44:04,200 --> 00:44:07,600
Speaker 1: work with in b h A. And and you know,

731
00:44:09,560 --> 00:44:12,839
Speaker 1: we can kind of get focused on these loud kind

732
00:44:12,840 --> 00:44:16,000
Speaker 1: of trolls, you know that are talking smack, but they're

733
00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:20,920
Speaker 1: they're a small percentage, right, I think most people out there. Yeah,

734
00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:24,120
Speaker 1: it's it's unfortunate that that this is like such a

735
00:44:25,080 --> 00:44:27,320
Speaker 1: in my in my mind anyway, it's a it's a

736
00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:29,520
Speaker 1: big thing because I just hear it and I'm sensitive

737
00:44:29,560 --> 00:44:31,399
Speaker 1: to it. But it's a big thing in the South, man.

738
00:44:31,560 --> 00:44:33,439
Speaker 1: I mean, we we've we've been dealing with it since

739
00:44:33,520 --> 00:44:36,080
Speaker 1: day one. Okay, here's here's the other thing I want

740
00:44:36,080 --> 00:44:40,000
Speaker 1: to like publicly acknowledge is that the other reason that

741
00:44:40,400 --> 00:44:45,399
Speaker 1: people think, or I could think that b h A

742
00:44:45,440 --> 00:44:49,800
Speaker 1: is some you know, you know, left wing anti hunting

743
00:44:49,840 --> 00:44:53,239
Speaker 1: group is b h a is and and I'm going

744
00:44:53,280 --> 00:44:55,920
Speaker 1: to say the E word. You'll know what the E

745
00:44:56,040 --> 00:45:03,200
Speaker 1: word is, environmental. Yeah, I mean, and that's what's bizarre

746
00:45:03,320 --> 00:45:07,279
Speaker 1: about the modern divides inside of politics that you know,

747
00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:10,279
Speaker 1: if you're a hunter and fisherman, you know, you're you're

748
00:45:11,360 --> 00:45:14,840
Speaker 1: just the way that the politics line up to be

749
00:45:16,000 --> 00:45:18,080
Speaker 1: on this side of the aisle means that you are

750
00:45:18,200 --> 00:45:22,879
Speaker 1: not an environmentalist, you know. And so it's like, but

751
00:45:23,040 --> 00:45:25,560
Speaker 1: we are hunters, and I mean like we we are

752
00:45:25,680 --> 00:45:29,360
Speaker 1: passion is wild places, going to those wild places and

753
00:45:29,400 --> 00:45:32,640
Speaker 1: enjoy in those wild places. Like we actually ought to

754
00:45:32,680 --> 00:45:36,960
Speaker 1: be the biggest advocates for wild places, which if we

755
00:45:37,000 --> 00:45:39,239
Speaker 1: could just call it that, advocates for wild places and

756
00:45:39,320 --> 00:45:43,040
Speaker 1: not environmentalists. You know, the marketing, the stigma that you know.

757
00:45:43,560 --> 00:45:47,880
Speaker 1: And obviously, so some people are threatened by that. They're like,

758
00:45:47,920 --> 00:45:50,200
Speaker 1: this is this is a radical environmental group that's wanting

759
00:45:50,239 --> 00:45:53,279
Speaker 1: to shut down the whole place. I mean, and that's

760
00:45:53,280 --> 00:45:56,400
Speaker 1: not true. I mean, I mean there be from what

761
00:45:56,480 --> 00:45:59,520
Speaker 1: I've seen from national decisions that have been made, there

762
00:45:59,560 --> 00:46:03,360
Speaker 1: are some places where things should be shut down, like

763
00:46:03,400 --> 00:46:06,319
Speaker 1: the pebble mine up in the last Man shut it down.

764
00:46:06,800 --> 00:46:09,319
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure Trump said this, Well, I don't want

765
00:46:09,360 --> 00:46:13,000
Speaker 1: to get into that Donald Donald Trump Jr. Was against

766
00:46:13,000 --> 00:46:17,200
Speaker 1: the pebble mind. I know that. Uh, but there's other

767
00:46:17,239 --> 00:46:21,200
Speaker 1: places where b. H. A Would absolutely be Like I mean,

768
00:46:21,320 --> 00:46:23,440
Speaker 1: talking to Hal Herring, I mean he's one of the

769
00:46:23,480 --> 00:46:26,640
Speaker 1: most functional, like real guys who ever talked to. He

770
00:46:26,719 --> 00:46:30,520
Speaker 1: has his whole backgrounds in forestry. Yeah, and I mean

771
00:46:30,560 --> 00:46:33,480
Speaker 1: he's like, man, we gotta cut this timber. I mean, like,

772
00:46:33,840 --> 00:46:37,239
Speaker 1: you know, land use practices that are sustainable, that are

773
00:46:37,280 --> 00:46:39,640
Speaker 1: good for wildlife, that are good for the economy too.

774
00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:43,359
Speaker 1: So it's not just this blanket, you know, we're we're

775
00:46:43,440 --> 00:46:46,840
Speaker 1: the I think, if anything, Clay, it's a more holistic

776
00:46:46,880 --> 00:46:50,719
Speaker 1: approach that we have, Like we're not against resource extraction,

777
00:46:50,760 --> 00:46:54,720
Speaker 1: we're not against private land even we're not against burning

778
00:46:54,920 --> 00:46:58,560
Speaker 1: prescribe fire. I mean we're pro prescribe fire and parts

779
00:46:58,560 --> 00:47:02,160
Speaker 1: of the country and against prescribed fire and other parts

780
00:47:02,200 --> 00:47:04,760
Speaker 1: of the country, purely based on you know, the forest

781
00:47:04,760 --> 00:47:07,799
Speaker 1: management plans of science there that support it. And you know,

782
00:47:07,880 --> 00:47:10,160
Speaker 1: wherever wherever the science points us is where we want

783
00:47:10,160 --> 00:47:12,960
Speaker 1: to go. We want because that's what's going to be

784
00:47:13,040 --> 00:47:17,440
Speaker 1: the best for the wildlife in the habitat that's so

785
00:47:17,480 --> 00:47:19,960
Speaker 1: it's a real easy narrative for someone to just get

786
00:47:20,000 --> 00:47:22,560
Speaker 1: turned off of, like just like yep, b h A

787
00:47:22,680 --> 00:47:26,279
Speaker 1: is a left wing, radical environmental group, and it's just

788
00:47:26,880 --> 00:47:29,279
Speaker 1: I have looked and looked and looked, and I just

789
00:47:29,320 --> 00:47:31,319
Speaker 1: haven't seen that. Well. I wouldn't be working there if

790
00:47:31,480 --> 00:47:32,960
Speaker 1: it was that, I can promise you that well. And

791
00:47:33,000 --> 00:47:35,080
Speaker 1: I wouldn't have you guys here if it was. I

792
00:47:35,080 --> 00:47:40,000
Speaker 1: mean really, I I've scrutinized over this a lot. Uh

793
00:47:40,120 --> 00:47:41,759
Speaker 1: And you know, b h A is is one of

794
00:47:41,760 --> 00:47:46,520
Speaker 1: the fastest growing UH sports ports groups in the country.

795
00:47:46,800 --> 00:47:50,600
Speaker 1: I mean, it's become an influential group and uh. And

796
00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:52,520
Speaker 1: what I like about b h A is the type

797
00:47:52,520 --> 00:47:55,920
Speaker 1: of people that are being recruited or just the type

798
00:47:55,920 --> 00:47:57,360
Speaker 1: of people that I see that are b h A

799
00:47:57,480 --> 00:48:03,439
Speaker 1: guys are are they're they're they're motivated, They're they're guys

800
00:48:03,520 --> 00:48:05,520
Speaker 1: that are a lot of them are even new hunters.

801
00:48:06,440 --> 00:48:08,400
Speaker 1: A lot of them are veteran hunters, I mean, but

802
00:48:08,400 --> 00:48:11,279
Speaker 1: but some new hunters and uh, I don't know, it's

803
00:48:11,280 --> 00:48:15,520
Speaker 1: just an energetic, motivated, good group. And and there's there.

804
00:48:15,560 --> 00:48:19,279
Speaker 1: You know, all these big groups have great constituencies, you know,

805
00:48:19,320 --> 00:48:22,359
Speaker 1: absolutely national Wild Turkey Federation, Rocky Mountain. I mean, all

806
00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:24,920
Speaker 1: these guys have great groups. But yeah, and and you know,

807
00:48:25,280 --> 00:48:27,720
Speaker 1: just kind of touch I have a little bit of notes,

808
00:48:27,760 --> 00:48:33,360
Speaker 1: but I mean, yeah, we got forty thousand plus members

809
00:48:34,480 --> 00:48:41,080
Speaker 1: of that percent are independents, are Republicans, and six percent

810
00:48:41,080 --> 00:48:45,120
Speaker 1: are libertarians. Okay, we're let's break that down again. I

811
00:48:45,160 --> 00:48:52,400
Speaker 1: was listening for the uh so independent Republican, six percent

812
00:48:52,600 --> 00:48:58,799
Speaker 1: libertarian and uh I forgot to write the Democrat number. Whoops. Um,

813
00:48:59,040 --> 00:49:03,920
Speaker 1: But it's like the Democrat number was like like to so,

814
00:49:04,600 --> 00:49:06,560
Speaker 1: I mean, that's one of the cool things about our

815
00:49:06,560 --> 00:49:11,120
Speaker 1: membership is like, man, he forgot thet Well, that would

816
00:49:11,120 --> 00:49:13,560
Speaker 1: be a pro I would be on the side that.

817
00:49:13,719 --> 00:49:17,359
Speaker 1: Uh you just you just watched the whole our whole

818
00:49:17,360 --> 00:49:21,120
Speaker 1: conversation down the tubes by that. But it's it's that

819
00:49:21,239 --> 00:49:23,320
Speaker 1: is to me, like kind of the cool thing about

820
00:49:24,200 --> 00:49:28,440
Speaker 1: our makeup is like we are super super diverse in

821
00:49:28,480 --> 00:49:32,000
Speaker 1: our political makeup, and and we skew pretty young, you know,

822
00:49:32,280 --> 00:49:36,000
Speaker 1: like a massive percent we're forty and younger, which is

823
00:49:36,160 --> 00:49:39,880
Speaker 1: in the conservation world very rare. You know, I'm an

824
00:49:39,880 --> 00:49:43,040
Speaker 1: old guy for b h A at six starting to

825
00:49:43,040 --> 00:49:49,080
Speaker 1: feel my age you know. Yeah, so mm hmm. I

826
00:49:49,080 --> 00:49:50,840
Speaker 1: think we could kind of wrap this part of it

827
00:49:50,960 --> 00:49:53,960
Speaker 1: up just by describing our membership a little bit more.

828
00:49:54,080 --> 00:49:58,880
Speaker 1: It's people who are motivated to learn more about hunting

829
00:49:59,000 --> 00:50:02,560
Speaker 1: to share that it. Um. There's a lot of camaraderie

830
00:50:02,600 --> 00:50:04,560
Speaker 1: that comes with that. Yeah. I mean we take our

831
00:50:04,640 --> 00:50:07,759
Speaker 1: Knox for you know. Another thing that people say is,

832
00:50:07,840 --> 00:50:09,280
Speaker 1: you know, all they want to do is get together

833
00:50:09,280 --> 00:50:11,399
Speaker 1: and drink beer and slap each other on the back.

834
00:50:12,320 --> 00:50:17,400
Speaker 1: And I can tell you that, Um, there is definitely

835
00:50:17,600 --> 00:50:20,359
Speaker 1: occasion for that. But I have seen a lot of

836
00:50:20,440 --> 00:50:25,440
Speaker 1: just what I would what I would term uh fraternity

837
00:50:25,520 --> 00:50:29,640
Speaker 1: with a with a lower case F. Just camaraderie and

838
00:50:29,880 --> 00:50:34,440
Speaker 1: fellowship um, sharing of success and however you choose to

839
00:50:34,480 --> 00:50:38,600
Speaker 1: define what that success is. UM, it's it's not gonna

840
00:50:38,680 --> 00:50:44,319
Speaker 1: be the group for everybody, but it is. It is

841
00:50:44,360 --> 00:50:47,640
Speaker 1: a a group of people who are interested in action,

842
00:50:48,640 --> 00:50:54,360
Speaker 1: and we make it possible for people to operate fairly

843
00:50:54,480 --> 00:50:59,359
Speaker 1: independently but with support in their local area. So if

844
00:50:59,400 --> 00:51:03,880
Speaker 1: you live in Paris, Arkansas, and you want to do

845
00:51:03,960 --> 00:51:06,960
Speaker 1: a clean up in your area and and you're a

846
00:51:07,000 --> 00:51:10,960
Speaker 1: b h A member, man, we will help you out

847
00:51:11,000 --> 00:51:14,080
Speaker 1: with that. Like We will make connections for you, will

848
00:51:14,120 --> 00:51:18,200
Speaker 1: help you promote it. Um. If you need help with

849
00:51:18,239 --> 00:51:21,560
Speaker 1: an access issue in your area, we will help you

850
00:51:21,640 --> 00:51:27,360
Speaker 1: out with that. And that I think is is where

851
00:51:27,640 --> 00:51:29,600
Speaker 1: that's why I'm a part of it. It's because it's

852
00:51:29,600 --> 00:51:32,640
Speaker 1: people of action. Not to say that other groups aren't

853
00:51:33,040 --> 00:51:37,400
Speaker 1: also action oriented, but I think we we make that

854
00:51:37,480 --> 00:51:41,400
Speaker 1: accessible for for people who otherwise don't have access to

855
00:51:42,320 --> 00:51:45,840
Speaker 1: And I mean we're very much an entrepreneurial kind of organization.

856
00:51:45,880 --> 00:51:47,319
Speaker 1: That's a cool thing about it. It's not just going

857
00:51:47,320 --> 00:51:50,120
Speaker 1: to a banquet, you know, sign it up and getting

858
00:51:50,160 --> 00:51:52,680
Speaker 1: a bunch of stuff at the auction, which I love

859
00:51:52,760 --> 00:51:56,160
Speaker 1: to do, you know, but um, it is you know,

860
00:51:56,560 --> 00:51:59,360
Speaker 1: signing up for a clean up. I mean, month of

861
00:51:59,360 --> 00:52:02,600
Speaker 1: September we put four thousand bags of trash out of

862
00:52:02,920 --> 00:52:09,080
Speaker 1: public land, um, just through people going out and organizing

863
00:52:09,080 --> 00:52:11,040
Speaker 1: people to go out and encouraging them to go out

864
00:52:11,320 --> 00:52:13,200
Speaker 1: to just pick up trash, whether it was in an

865
00:52:13,320 --> 00:52:17,080
Speaker 1: organized thing or by themselves. Four thousand bags, man, and

866
00:52:17,600 --> 00:52:20,319
Speaker 1: just like kind of like a little fun thing that

867
00:52:20,360 --> 00:52:26,200
Speaker 1: we did for a month. That's real work. Um. I mean,

868
00:52:26,320 --> 00:52:30,080
Speaker 1: all these different public access battles and all the different

869
00:52:30,080 --> 00:52:32,719
Speaker 1: states were in those things don't happen by themselves, and

870
00:52:32,760 --> 00:52:37,000
Speaker 1: it's almost all organized and driven by membership on the ground.

871
00:52:37,840 --> 00:52:39,480
Speaker 1: So if you want to like roll up your sleeves

872
00:52:39,480 --> 00:52:42,040
Speaker 1: and get dirty and fight for something, this is a

873
00:52:42,080 --> 00:52:45,640
Speaker 1: really fun organization to do it with. Um, and you're

874
00:52:45,640 --> 00:52:50,040
Speaker 1: gonna learn a lot about how to kind of fight

875
00:52:50,160 --> 00:52:52,719
Speaker 1: in those arenas, which I mean, I think James could

876
00:52:52,719 --> 00:52:56,480
Speaker 1: tell you all about. But it's it's a good time. Man.

877
00:52:56,560 --> 00:52:58,200
Speaker 1: We don't just drink beer, though we do drink a

878
00:52:58,239 --> 00:53:01,879
Speaker 1: lot of beer a lot. It happens. But but I've

879
00:53:01,920 --> 00:53:04,319
Speaker 1: also seen it be like, Okay, I guess we gotta

880
00:53:04,360 --> 00:53:06,719
Speaker 1: get the work done. You know, we we got to

881
00:53:06,760 --> 00:53:09,480
Speaker 1: go get this done. We're gonna hit it hard and

882
00:53:09,480 --> 00:53:13,360
Speaker 1: and um yeah, and just the sharing of information to

883
00:53:13,600 --> 00:53:18,480
Speaker 1: I mean, learning how to hunt, learning how to fish, um,

884
00:53:18,480 --> 00:53:24,799
Speaker 1: sharing of you. Sometimes it's sharing of spots. Sometimes it's

885
00:53:24,840 --> 00:53:27,080
Speaker 1: sharing of camp, Like come to my camp with me

886
00:53:27,120 --> 00:53:29,360
Speaker 1: and I'll help you learn how to do something, and

887
00:53:29,440 --> 00:53:32,680
Speaker 1: do not ask me for a spot, will not give

888
00:53:32,719 --> 00:53:37,799
Speaker 1: it to You'll be a public land knucklehead. No, no, no,

889
00:53:38,640 --> 00:53:41,680
Speaker 1: I know you gotta stay away from that. Somebody recorded

890
00:53:41,719 --> 00:53:44,200
Speaker 1: a podcast about that. And then and then it turned

891
00:53:44,239 --> 00:53:50,160
Speaker 1: into a book. Yeah, that's right, that's right. Yeah, now

892
00:53:50,360 --> 00:53:54,640
Speaker 1: that's that's a no b h Ay. They've got a

893
00:53:54,680 --> 00:53:58,560
Speaker 1: knack for organizing people to do work. Man. They kind

894
00:53:58,560 --> 00:53:59,960
Speaker 1: of like made it cool to go out and pick

895
00:54:00,080 --> 00:54:04,440
Speaker 1: up trash on on on w May's and on public

896
00:54:04,520 --> 00:54:07,640
Speaker 1: land and and obviously they're doing you're just doing so

897
00:54:07,719 --> 00:54:14,360
Speaker 1: much more than that. But yeah, that's great, that's great. Um, Josh,

898
00:54:14,400 --> 00:54:17,360
Speaker 1: you a white tail hunter A little bit. I wouldn't.

899
00:54:17,360 --> 00:54:22,680
Speaker 1: I wouldn't consider myself ah expert white tail hunter, but

900
00:54:23,120 --> 00:54:27,160
Speaker 1: I spent a lot of time in tree stands. Yeah. Yeah. Waterfowl.

901
00:54:27,560 --> 00:54:31,520
Speaker 1: Waterfowl is, yeah, something that I feel like. I called

902
00:54:31,520 --> 00:54:33,920
Speaker 1: myself a waterfowl hunter in the sense that I feel

903
00:54:33,920 --> 00:54:37,600
Speaker 1: like I confident when I go out that I know

904
00:54:37,640 --> 00:54:40,120
Speaker 1: what I'm doing to some extent, right, as much as

905
00:54:40,120 --> 00:54:44,040
Speaker 1: you can in hunting, right, nothing's ever easy, But that

906
00:54:44,239 --> 00:54:49,000
Speaker 1: is my passions. Duck, top end duck for you, I mean,

907
00:54:49,040 --> 00:54:54,640
Speaker 1: I'm a my favorite's probably teal. I don't early season

908
00:54:54,680 --> 00:54:59,040
Speaker 1: tel hunt as much as in the in the deeper South.

909
00:54:59,360 --> 00:55:02,440
Speaker 1: It's you know, you're just fighting off snakes and everything

910
00:55:02,520 --> 00:55:05,560
Speaker 1: and hunting. It's kind of sporadic. I'll see that duck

911
00:55:05,600 --> 00:55:08,680
Speaker 1: over there on the wall. Yeah, oh yeah, that's beautiful.

912
00:55:08,920 --> 00:55:15,240
Speaker 1: I'm big water feller. That's the only, the only Mallard

913
00:55:15,320 --> 00:55:19,319
Speaker 1: ducket I've ever killed. That's a beautiful representation of one

914
00:55:19,400 --> 00:55:22,920
Speaker 1: I mounted, the only Mallard duck I've ever killed, Clay,

915
00:55:22,960 --> 00:55:25,279
Speaker 1: I'm picking up the only duck I've ever killed in

916
00:55:25,320 --> 00:55:27,400
Speaker 1: my life. I had it mounted and we're picking it

917
00:55:27,480 --> 00:55:31,439
Speaker 1: up tomorrow. Yeah. Mine. You know what kind of duck

918
00:55:31,520 --> 00:55:33,480
Speaker 1: was that? Wood duck, which I know a lot of

919
00:55:33,480 --> 00:55:35,279
Speaker 1: people will be like, oh, wood duck whatever. It was

920
00:55:35,360 --> 00:55:41,279
Speaker 1: the first duck probably the most beautiful. Yeah, they really are. Yeah, man,

921
00:55:41,320 --> 00:55:44,120
Speaker 1: But I love uh, I love shooting into teal. I

922
00:55:44,160 --> 00:55:47,239
Speaker 1: mean this might be controversial, but my favorite thing to

923
00:55:47,239 --> 00:55:49,439
Speaker 1: do in the world to shoot ducks. I mean yeah,

924
00:55:49,520 --> 00:55:52,880
Speaker 1: And um, I feel like that's almost you're not supposed

925
00:55:52,880 --> 00:55:56,279
Speaker 1: to say that anymore some circles, but I don't. That's

926
00:55:56,480 --> 00:55:58,799
Speaker 1: I mean, really, what what's what makes are you? Are

927
00:55:58,840 --> 00:56:02,640
Speaker 1: you single handedly like collapsing the population? Are you doing

928
00:56:02,640 --> 00:56:06,759
Speaker 1: it illegally? You're following the rules, the rules, But I

929
00:56:06,800 --> 00:56:09,719
Speaker 1: mean I just love it, and um, but teal are

930
00:56:09,760 --> 00:56:11,640
Speaker 1: so much fun to shooting into and they just they

931
00:56:11,640 --> 00:56:15,200
Speaker 1: taste great. They're fast, They're fast, super fast, much faster

932
00:56:15,239 --> 00:56:17,560
Speaker 1: as a Teal than a Mallard. I don't want three times,

933
00:56:17,840 --> 00:56:21,000
Speaker 1: Is it really three times? I don't think that's actually true.

934
00:56:21,160 --> 00:56:23,320
Speaker 1: Just the way they come in, man, they're so close

935
00:56:23,360 --> 00:56:25,439
Speaker 1: to you when they come in right there a lot

936
00:56:25,640 --> 00:56:29,080
Speaker 1: there that buzz over you, and they're like they weren't there,

937
00:56:29,200 --> 00:56:31,279
Speaker 1: then they're there, and then they're gone. Mallard's kind of

938
00:56:31,360 --> 00:56:33,840
Speaker 1: lumber in their big ducks. They take their time getting

939
00:56:33,840 --> 00:56:36,800
Speaker 1: down teel like they're in and out, you know, and

940
00:56:36,840 --> 00:56:40,719
Speaker 1: they're just hauling m I've never tell hunted we have

941
00:56:40,800 --> 00:56:44,640
Speaker 1: to change that. Well, I'd like to try it sometime.

942
00:56:44,840 --> 00:56:47,400
Speaker 1: There you go, James, you kill the buck. Just the

943
00:56:47,400 --> 00:56:50,640
Speaker 1: other day I did with my bare Having a great year,

944
00:56:50,719 --> 00:56:53,959
Speaker 1: having a fantastic year. I feel amazingly blessed this year.

945
00:56:54,360 --> 00:56:58,399
Speaker 1: The freezer is full. That's awesome. Man. Yeah, I hadn't

946
00:56:58,560 --> 00:57:01,040
Speaker 1: really heard much of the story. I mean, well, I

947
00:57:01,080 --> 00:57:04,080
Speaker 1: was hunting last Saturday. Um, I just got out in

948
00:57:04,120 --> 00:57:09,839
Speaker 1: the stand before daybreak, had the usual series of mishaps

949
00:57:09,880 --> 00:57:13,480
Speaker 1: on my way in, got there late. Hall rope was

950
00:57:13,640 --> 00:57:16,040
Speaker 1: tangled up and I couldn't get my bow up. Something

951
00:57:16,120 --> 00:57:19,080
Speaker 1: was underneath my stand. You know, I couldn't see it.

952
00:57:19,080 --> 00:57:22,680
Speaker 1: It was still dark. Um. But I finally got settled,

953
00:57:22,720 --> 00:57:25,920
Speaker 1: and you know, I saw a dough and a fawn

954
00:57:26,280 --> 00:57:30,520
Speaker 1: moving across. This was in Missouri. It was on private

955
00:57:30,600 --> 00:57:33,240
Speaker 1: land in Missouri, my in law's place up there. So

956
00:57:33,240 --> 00:57:38,640
Speaker 1: it was bow season up there. And um, you know,

957
00:57:38,840 --> 00:57:41,240
Speaker 1: saw a dough and a fawn go across the field.

958
00:57:41,320 --> 00:57:45,280
Speaker 1: And and I was kind of thinking, I mean, I

959
00:57:45,320 --> 00:57:48,439
Speaker 1: was wanting meat, so I thought if they came my way,

960
00:57:48,480 --> 00:57:51,960
Speaker 1: And then I saw the buck behind him, and I lot, okay,

961
00:57:52,280 --> 00:57:54,920
Speaker 1: this could happen. And the dough and the fawn kind

962
00:57:54,920 --> 00:57:57,800
Speaker 1: of circled back behind me, and and and the buck

963
00:57:57,880 --> 00:58:00,720
Speaker 1: was right on him. I mean I saw, but the

964
00:58:00,720 --> 00:58:05,840
Speaker 1: buck was on them. I made a I made the

965
00:58:05,920 --> 00:58:09,920
Speaker 1: shot that I I made a bad shot. Um hit

966
00:58:09,960 --> 00:58:15,680
Speaker 1: it far back. I knew immediately I'd hit it far back. Um.

967
00:58:15,840 --> 00:58:19,600
Speaker 1: He trotted off about twenty yards, gave me a chance

968
00:58:19,680 --> 00:58:23,240
Speaker 1: to look at him through my binos, and he was

969
00:58:23,320 --> 00:58:25,960
Speaker 1: hunched up. Um. I knew I hit him in the guts.

970
00:58:25,960 --> 00:58:30,320
Speaker 1: And I was just hoping. And so I was very

971
00:58:30,400 --> 00:58:33,280
Speaker 1: confident that it was a mortal wound. I had no

972
00:58:33,360 --> 00:58:36,440
Speaker 1: idea how long it was gonna take. I contacted a

973
00:58:36,440 --> 00:58:42,880
Speaker 1: blood tracker immediately um and got some coaching on what

974
00:58:42,960 --> 00:58:46,439
Speaker 1: to do. I left it for eight hours. He got there,

975
00:58:47,840 --> 00:58:51,960
Speaker 1: we tracked it, UM found it, jumped it still alive,

976
00:58:52,080 --> 00:58:55,320
Speaker 1: but but in bad shape. And and I eventually, you know,

977
00:58:55,400 --> 00:58:56,880
Speaker 1: he had to back out with the dog, and I

978
00:58:56,920 --> 00:58:59,440
Speaker 1: had to go back in with the bow, and eventually

979
00:58:59,560 --> 00:59:03,280
Speaker 1: was able to finish it off. And it was, Oh

980
00:59:03,320 --> 00:59:05,760
Speaker 1: my gosh, Clay, it was a healthy deer. It was

981
00:59:06,160 --> 00:59:10,880
Speaker 1: big it it. I put over fifty pounds of meat away,

982
00:59:12,040 --> 00:59:14,760
Speaker 1: and the amount of fat that I cut off of

983
00:59:14,760 --> 00:59:20,320
Speaker 1: that thing, oh so much fat. I mean, as dry

984
00:59:20,360 --> 00:59:22,960
Speaker 1: as it has been around here. I was not expecting that.

985
00:59:23,040 --> 00:59:26,920
Speaker 1: But he was healthy, very healthy deer. So is that

986
00:59:26,960 --> 00:59:31,560
Speaker 1: your first bow kill buck? Yep? Nice, very nice, thank you. Yeah,

987
00:59:31,600 --> 00:59:34,040
Speaker 1: it looked like a big body, dear. It was. Yeah,

988
00:59:34,080 --> 00:59:35,920
Speaker 1: it was a good sized here. It's been dry this year.

989
00:59:36,360 --> 00:59:39,600
Speaker 1: It's all up up here, up here, right in this area.

990
00:59:39,760 --> 00:59:41,840
Speaker 1: You get just a little bit south and east of here,

991
00:59:42,080 --> 00:59:45,680
Speaker 1: and they've had way more rain than we have. Pastures

992
00:59:45,680 --> 00:59:47,680
Speaker 1: are burnt up up here. My in laws are talking

993
00:59:47,720 --> 00:59:51,000
Speaker 1: about having to buy hay and worrying about what kind

994
00:59:51,000 --> 00:59:54,160
Speaker 1: of water now here. The last this week it's been wet,

995
00:59:55,280 --> 00:59:59,640
Speaker 1: but before that, try, yeah, it's been in northwest Arkansas.

996
01:00:00,520 --> 01:00:04,080
Speaker 1: I can speak to the horn growth of these deer

997
01:00:04,440 --> 01:00:10,040
Speaker 1: is exceptional compared to the last ten years. That's my observation,

998
01:00:10,480 --> 01:00:14,280
Speaker 1: you know, from the deer that I'm seeing and even

999
01:00:14,360 --> 01:00:17,800
Speaker 1: hearing people talk about, Yeah, we had incredible horn growth,

1000
01:00:17,800 --> 01:00:22,560
Speaker 1: and that almost always is indicative of a good growing season,

1001
01:00:22,800 --> 01:00:26,880
Speaker 1: which I don't know that down here we've been as dry.

1002
01:00:27,120 --> 01:00:30,919
Speaker 1: But I think I'm an hour well not quite an hour,

1003
01:00:31,000 --> 01:00:34,000
Speaker 1: almost an hour south of you, though now you guys

1004
01:00:34,040 --> 01:00:35,680
Speaker 1: have had more rain down here than the things we have.

1005
01:00:35,920 --> 01:00:38,520
Speaker 1: I think we have. But the deer, the deer healthy.

1006
01:00:39,200 --> 01:00:42,200
Speaker 1: Ye're really healthy. You're saying just a minute ago that

1007
01:00:42,200 --> 01:00:46,280
Speaker 1: they're starting to move around. I'm starting to yeah. I've

1008
01:00:46,320 --> 01:00:48,680
Speaker 1: I've hunted. I've hunted quite a bit in the last

1009
01:00:49,520 --> 01:00:53,280
Speaker 1: nine ten days. And just two days ago I saw

1010
01:00:54,440 --> 01:00:57,800
Speaker 1: I saw my first buck, big buck chasing the do't

1011
01:00:57,840 --> 01:01:00,360
Speaker 1: now the little deer will mess around with those early

1012
01:01:00,440 --> 01:01:03,760
Speaker 1: and I mean heck even in early October. But I

1013
01:01:03,760 --> 01:01:06,600
Speaker 1: mean a big mature buck that had no business being

1014
01:01:06,640 --> 01:01:11,560
Speaker 1: on his feet unless that dough was serious. And yeah,

1015
01:01:11,600 --> 01:01:13,640
Speaker 1: so two days ago I saw a bucket three thirty

1016
01:01:13,640 --> 01:01:17,640
Speaker 1: in the afternoon with a dough um. And then yesterday,

1017
01:01:17,960 --> 01:01:21,960
Speaker 1: uh didn't didn't get to hunt, but was driving right

1018
01:01:22,040 --> 01:01:24,520
Speaker 1: through a place that I can hunt, and saw one

1019
01:01:24,560 --> 01:01:27,720
Speaker 1: of my target deer with a dough in a field

1020
01:01:28,120 --> 01:01:30,360
Speaker 1: you know, in pour and rain. I mean it was

1021
01:01:30,400 --> 01:01:33,520
Speaker 1: like a downpour and there he is standing in the

1022
01:01:33,560 --> 01:01:35,960
Speaker 1: field with his dough and they ran off and he

1023
01:01:36,120 --> 01:01:39,200
Speaker 1: lowered his head and just took after which, man, it's

1024
01:01:39,400 --> 01:01:42,120
Speaker 1: it's happening. Talked to another real good uh well I

1025
01:01:42,120 --> 01:01:45,280
Speaker 1: guy that's been on a podcast, Heat Martin. He told

1026
01:01:45,320 --> 01:01:51,320
Speaker 1: me that what he's seeing is more chasing and red

1027
01:01:51,360 --> 01:01:54,439
Speaker 1: activity for this time of year than than he's seen

1028
01:01:54,480 --> 01:01:56,480
Speaker 1: in a while. That's that's what I was telling you.

1029
01:01:56,520 --> 01:01:58,560
Speaker 1: I feel like it's just a little bit early to

1030
01:01:58,600 --> 01:02:00,960
Speaker 1: see the kind of chasing is. I had another I

1031
01:02:00,960 --> 01:02:05,120
Speaker 1: had a better deer, a better buck under my stand

1032
01:02:05,360 --> 01:02:07,760
Speaker 1: after I shot the one and I shot, Oh really,

1033
01:02:07,800 --> 01:02:11,800
Speaker 1: you had a bigger deer come through, not huge, but

1034
01:02:12,120 --> 01:02:15,480
Speaker 1: bigger than the one that I shot, and he was chasing,

1035
01:02:15,760 --> 01:02:18,400
Speaker 1: and I watched him chase that dough all over the field.

1036
01:02:18,480 --> 01:02:22,000
Speaker 1: Oh wow, so that was some legit activity. Yeah. So

1037
01:02:22,320 --> 01:02:25,080
Speaker 1: are you transitioning now to all day sits or I

1038
01:02:26,160 --> 01:02:30,800
Speaker 1: rarely really get the opportunity to sit all day just

1039
01:02:30,840 --> 01:02:34,040
Speaker 1: because I almost my work is pretty flexible, but I

1040
01:02:34,080 --> 01:02:37,360
Speaker 1: always have something I've got to do. So like tomorrow,

1041
01:02:38,760 --> 01:02:42,160
Speaker 1: if something doesn't come up, I'm gonna sit all day Tomorrow,

1042
01:02:42,880 --> 01:02:46,640
Speaker 1: um and uh. And then Saturday, we got some family stuff,

1043
01:02:46,640 --> 01:02:49,280
Speaker 1: but I'm gonna hut morning and evening, you know, in

1044
01:02:49,360 --> 01:02:52,960
Speaker 1: the middle of the day, do some family stuff. But yeah,

1045
01:02:53,040 --> 01:02:55,160
Speaker 1: it's time to sit all day if you're gonna sit.

1046
01:02:55,480 --> 01:03:00,640
Speaker 1: This weekend is youth season in Missouri, youth full season,

1047
01:03:01,120 --> 01:03:06,920
Speaker 1: and this October thirty one, November first time frame is

1048
01:03:07,440 --> 01:03:12,000
Speaker 1: has been a really good time. Yeah. Yeah, Zack's got

1049
01:03:12,000 --> 01:03:14,960
Speaker 1: some stuff going on during the day on Saturday, but

1050
01:03:15,000 --> 01:03:17,640
Speaker 1: as soon as he gets out of that, you know,

1051
01:03:17,720 --> 01:03:20,400
Speaker 1: I have on my list of things basically get everything

1052
01:03:20,480 --> 01:03:24,920
Speaker 1: ready to take off since he gets home and and uh,

1053
01:03:25,000 --> 01:03:27,320
Speaker 1: yeah we'll hunt Saturday night and he'll probably hunt all

1054
01:03:27,400 --> 01:03:33,160
Speaker 1: day Sunday. So good good well, Um, Josh, is there

1055
01:03:33,160 --> 01:03:35,680
Speaker 1: anything else that we've you know, we kind of just

1056
01:03:37,240 --> 01:03:40,680
Speaker 1: hit you know, some kind of random things inside of

1057
01:03:40,720 --> 01:03:43,520
Speaker 1: b H. Anything you'd like to say, or man, this

1058
01:03:43,640 --> 01:03:46,160
Speaker 1: was awesome. This is fun. I enjoyed. It's a great

1059
01:03:46,160 --> 01:03:48,600
Speaker 1: way to end the day. Great. Yeah, thank you for

1060
01:03:48,920 --> 01:03:52,960
Speaker 1: allowing us to come by. Yeah, man, James Man, I'm good.

1061
01:03:53,240 --> 01:03:57,240
Speaker 1: They're good, thank you. Okay, right on, Well keep the

1062
01:03:57,240 --> 01:04:00,000
Speaker 1: wild place as wild because that's where it bears. Absolutely,

1063
01:04:00,680 --> 01:04:03,720
Speaker 1: that's what pH as trying to dude, the wild, bless wild.

1064
01:04:04,720 --> 01:04:17,680
Speaker 1: They can't steal that tagline.