Speaker 1: Hi. Hi a Mohammed Faruk, a producer with the Bloomberg
Speaker 1: Trypto podcast team. We're taking a post for the holiday
Speaker 1: and sharing some of our in house favorites as we
Speaker 1: get ready for the new year. Today's replay, He's an
Speaker 1: episode that keeps resonating in my mind while seeing all
Speaker 1: the crypto dramas unfolding everywhere. It relates to one of
Speaker 1: Trypto's magic icons. In my mind, I've always seen a
Speaker 1: crypto die hard sitting somewhere on his computer, watching the
Speaker 1: Trypto prices drag dramatically up and down between mountaintops and
Speaker 1: rock bottoms, and thinking to himself, Yeah, why not. Maybe
Speaker 1: maybe I can seize the right moment and harness the
Speaker 1: riches of Tripto, ruminating over and over about one thing
Speaker 1: in Lambeau. When Lambeau to you, my friend, I give
Speaker 1: you this episode, and I hope you are okay. There's
Speaker 1: a scene in the two thousand and six film The
Speaker 1: Pursuit of Happiness in which actor Will Smith, who plays
Speaker 1: a single father who's broke, homeless looking for a fresh start,
Speaker 1: comes across the stranger stepping out of a red Ferrari.
Speaker 1: Smith says, I just have two questions for you. What
Speaker 1: do you do and how do you do it? The guy,
Speaker 1: super well dressed as you might imagine, replies with a
Speaker 1: confident smile. I'm a stockbroker. If this movie were made,
Speaker 1: say two, that stockbroker would probably be a crypto brow
Speaker 1: and that Ferrari would be a Lamborghini. For years, some
Speaker 1: crypto investors have been consumed by a single persistent question
Speaker 1: when Lambeau. On this episode, we're going to tackle that
Speaker 1: very question. Bloomberger Potsa Hannah Miller actually interviewed an n
Speaker 1: FP artist who blew up a Lamborghini in protests and
Speaker 1: Peter Saddington, a crypto venture capitalist. Crypto is really fast.
Speaker 1: Cars are really fast, and sort a lot of ways
Speaker 1: crypto cars. It just makes a lot of sense. Will
Speaker 1: join me now to take on this burning question about
Speaker 1: one of the most visible status symbols in all of crypto.
Speaker 1: Hanna Pizza, so delighted you can join us today, Pizza,
Speaker 1: I feel obliged to start with you, and I'm going
Speaker 1: to specifically say, please describe the space you are standing
Speaker 1: in right now, the space well, first and foremost, thank
Speaker 1: you so much for this opportunity to hang out with
Speaker 1: you guys, and maybe tell a little bit about my story.
Speaker 1: Speaking a story, This garage was actually created in my
Speaker 1: mind years before I even built the garage, and so
Speaker 1: this was truly my dream to have two screens, building code, writing,
Speaker 1: writing software, building companies, and then when I'm done with
Speaker 1: all of that, I can turn it all off and
Speaker 1: put my hands to building race cars and go carts.
Speaker 1: So I'm living the dream, baby, I'm living it. So
Speaker 1: do you pizza have a Lamborghini? Yes, there's a picture.
Speaker 1: There's a picture of of my the bitcoin Lambeau behind me.
Speaker 1: So this is the famous bitcoin lambou that was purchased
Speaker 1: with bitcoin in two and how much would that bitcoin Lambeau, Like,
Speaker 1: what's the what's the price that that would have sold for? Now?
Speaker 1: What current bitcoin rates? So you could pretty much multiply
Speaker 1: it by four times. And so I bought this bitcoin
Speaker 1: lambo for forty five bitcoin when bitcoin was about five
Speaker 1: thousand dollars, and so we're sitting about four x that
Speaker 1: right now. So if you're looking at a two hundred
Speaker 1: thousand dollar Lambo, you're looking at really maybe at eight
Speaker 1: thousand dollar Lambo. But in my defense, the smiles per
Speaker 1: gallon that I got out of my God, that is
Speaker 1: the wind. I'm not convinced that SMG is a real metric. Oh,
Speaker 1: come on, SMG. It's totally something that the car guys
Speaker 1: know all about, right, guys, bucked me up? Uh huh? Well,
Speaker 1: how do you wrote a story that is all about
Speaker 1: the culture that Pizza is so clearly an enthusiastic participant in,
Speaker 1: which is you know, crypto mostly dudes, not exclusively dudes
Speaker 1: and fast cars, and so please tell us a little
Speaker 1: bit more about your reporting and how you found Peter
Speaker 1: in the first place. Yeah. Well, the inspiration behind this
Speaker 1: story was one of my favorite crypto memes, which is
Speaker 1: when Lambeau and it refers to you know, you're becoming
Speaker 1: so successful with crypto trading, your assets have sword and value,
Speaker 1: you're super wealthy, and you can purchase a luxury sports
Speaker 1: car like that's the signal that you've made it. Um.
Speaker 1: So I had heard about Peter um with his Lamborghini
Speaker 1: purchase that he didn't bitcoin. I knew about him. I
Speaker 1: also know his twin, so it was a happy connection.
Speaker 1: Um and I figured you'd be the perfect person to
Speaker 1: talk about this because he kind of led the charge
Speaker 1: in terms of buying Lamborghini's in bitcoin. You know. So
Speaker 1: your story was about this culture, but it was also
Speaker 1: about the fact that in the current crypto winter, where
Speaker 1: not everyone currently has, say, the discretionary income to spend
Speaker 1: bitcoin on a on a Lamborghini, there are still people
Speaker 1: who are making it work. Yeah. I was curious to
Speaker 1: see how crypto winter affected demand for Lamborghinis, if it
Speaker 1: affected it at all. Um So I set out. I
Speaker 1: spoke to a bunch of luxury car dealers. I talked
Speaker 1: to people in the crypto car community. Uh, and I
Speaker 1: tried gathering is as much evidence as possible to to
Speaker 1: write this story. And it was really interesting what I
Speaker 1: came across. When I talked to Peter, for example, he
Speaker 1: mentioned that, you know, he was still all in, and
Speaker 1: that his friends weren't really hurting, that they're all really
Speaker 1: smart investors. They've made, you know, their gains in crypto,
Speaker 1: they've planned wisely, and that he didn't know of anyone
Speaker 1: selling their cars. And then I spoke to a crypto
Speaker 1: specific auto dealer called auto coin Cars, and they said
Speaker 1: they actually saw a lot of people buying Lamborghinis at
Speaker 1: this time because they wanted to switch from crypto to
Speaker 1: an asset that actually appreciates and value that Lamborghinis there there,
Speaker 1: they hold their value really well. They can go up
Speaker 1: in price, and you know, so they wanted to kind
Speaker 1: of escape the volatility of crypto by purchasing these luxury cars. Okay,
Speaker 1: there's a part of me that is like, you're switching
Speaker 1: out of a riskier asset class into fast cars in
Speaker 1: order to make wiser investment decisions. I have several falls
Speaker 1: up questions about the Rationalee, Peter, I'll turn to you,
Speaker 1: Is it in fact true that these are cars that
Speaker 1: hold their value once you drive them off the lots?
Speaker 1: The real answer is it depends. And for all of
Speaker 1: the Porsche fans out there, you'll love hearing me say
Speaker 1: that Porsche's, especially some of the real expend some ones
Speaker 1: really hold their value well and generally they're in my opinion, overinflated. However,
Speaker 1: when it comes to Lamborghini's, we found, especially for some
Speaker 1: of the older generations and the older models, they do
Speaker 1: hold their value and they do rise in price. And
Speaker 1: so what what Hannah has found is not wrong. It
Speaker 1: really depends on the type of car and the type
Speaker 1: of make and model. And what we found, especially with
Speaker 1: the network in the community that I have in the
Speaker 1: crypto and car space. These are savvy investors and so
Speaker 1: for them to purchase some random Lamborghini is rarely the case.
Speaker 1: It's usually a well thought out process of how can
Speaker 1: I dump this, how can I dump this this token
Speaker 1: into this car that I assume that this car is
Speaker 1: gonna go up and appreciate in this particular car market,
Speaker 1: and I'll get a great six months out of it,
Speaker 1: you know, smiles, broke allen and maybe convert it back
Speaker 1: into crypto. What has been really intriguing for me being
Speaker 1: behind closed doors and Telegram groups and we chat groups
Speaker 1: and discord groups around crypto and cars is that there's
Speaker 1: a lot of interperson trading from crypto two cars. That is,
Speaker 1: let's just say, crypto allows for the transaction to move
Speaker 1: quite smoothly, and so we're seeing this really popular market
Speaker 1: of you know, individuals essentially being being able to say, well,
Speaker 1: why should I go to a dealership, why should I
Speaker 1: have it on consignment when you're willing to give me
Speaker 1: bitcoin and I'm willing to give you the title, right,
Speaker 1: So it's like an OTC market for cars in crypto.
Speaker 1: It these types of markets emerge indeed they do. They
Speaker 1: also emerge and shall we say shady or circumstances. So
Speaker 1: you know, some some of the reporting that's been out
Speaker 1: there is the fact that some of these cars are
Speaker 1: so custom so unique, that they make easy targets for
Speaker 1: when the driver or the owners are you know, come
Speaker 1: under say, regulatory scrutiny, criminal scrutiny. It's almost like in
Speaker 1: the same way that in the very early days of
Speaker 1: UM Russia and Russian individuals being sanctioned. The first one
Speaker 1: of the first things that people are going afterwards, like
Speaker 1: the yachts. They're like, oh, that yachts. Definitely that guy's yachts.
Speaker 1: We know exactly where that yata is. We're going to
Speaker 1: take that yacht. Why do you think people, even people
Speaker 1: who should perhaps be better at hiding their tracks, find
Speaker 1: it so hard to resist the siren song of extremely
Speaker 1: distinctive and expensive cards. I think there's a human nous
Speaker 1: and a human need in all of us actually for nice,
Speaker 1: shiny things and new things. Let's be honest, don't we
Speaker 1: like new And so it's interesting with the rise of
Speaker 1: cryptocurrency and obviously this meme that I love, actually I
Speaker 1: love this meme because it brings a lot of public
Speaker 1: eye to the world of cryptoc currency, and they might say, oh,
Speaker 1: you're you're just buying luxury goods. Well, luxury goods are
Speaker 1: also great investments if you invest wisely and you purchase wisely.
Speaker 1: This is not investment advice. Is the investment advice for sure? Uh?
Speaker 1: And so why are why are these types of individuals
Speaker 1: attracted to it? You know what, crypto and cars goes
Speaker 1: hand in hand. If we think of the foundational element
Speaker 1: of crypto and cars, it's kind of speculative and it's
Speaker 1: kind of fun. Crypto is really fast, cars are really fast,
Speaker 1: and so in a lot of ways, crypto and cars
Speaker 1: it just makes a lot of sense. And we're seeing
Speaker 1: a huge rise in crypto and car meetups that are
Speaker 1: popping up all over the world. Right, So I suppose
Speaker 1: they're you know, they're kind of multiple sizes of this equation.
Speaker 1: But something that you said about crypto and cars going
Speaker 1: hand in hand. You know, if if anybody outside of
Speaker 1: I would say, like crypto insider universe recognize as a
Speaker 1: crypto person, it's probably gonna be sound back from Trade,
Speaker 1: who famously does not drive a Lambo. How come he
Speaker 1: seems to be the type of individual where fast cars
Speaker 1: and these types of things probably isn't his cup of tea,
Speaker 1: And that's okay too. What I love about crypto and
Speaker 1: cars is that if you've never heard about cryptocurrency, getting
Speaker 1: in being in the car community, crypto is moving its
Speaker 1: message through that, and so I love the fact that
Speaker 1: people are learning about it. Sam bang fan Freed. He
Speaker 1: serves a different market, he serves a different image, and
Speaker 1: good or bad. Some people call him the spokesperson of
Speaker 1: crypto now since he's all the way up on the hill,
Speaker 1: good or bad, he's getting the message out and for me,
Speaker 1: that's a big win. Yeah. So he might not have
Speaker 1: bought a Lambo for himself, but he actually bought one
Speaker 1: for a famous crypto Twitter personality who you know was
Speaker 1: celebrating him being this massive philanthropist giving away his money
Speaker 1: and said, hey, you're so rich, how about you buy anyone?
Speaker 1: And SPF came through and did buy him one. So
Speaker 1: it might not be for himself, but it might be
Speaker 1: for other people. Who is this person for whom he
Speaker 1: bought a lambo? His like user name is Greg. We'll
Speaker 1: be right back with more from Bloomberger post at Hannah
Speaker 1: Milla and from crypto venture capitalist Peter Saddington on Lambo's
Speaker 1: and crypto culture. You know, US politics is a complex place,
Speaker 1: and it certainly goes in terms of cycles of like
Speaker 1: populist backlash, and you know, people worried about consumption and
Speaker 1: over consumption, whether you're talking about the climates or environmental
Speaker 1: or other angles. And I suppose this is a question
Speaker 1: for you and Um Pizza both. Is there any fear
Speaker 1: that you know, being this luxury good forward increases the
Speaker 1: potential backlash from people who are like, I'm so glad
Speaker 1: you're buying Lambos, but I just lost all my money
Speaker 1: in a Celsius bankruptcy filing. Yeah. Well, it was really
Speaker 1: interesting that when Bloomberg interviewed the founders of three Hours Capital,
Speaker 1: they specifically distanced themselves from lambeau culture, and they said,
Speaker 1: we don't have Lambos, we don't have ferraris. You know,
Speaker 1: we bike to work. I think, yeah, okay, Um, and
Speaker 1: they It's very interesting that there are people who do
Speaker 1: try to distance themselves from this very flashy symbol of
Speaker 1: wealth and excess. And for the story, I actually interviewed
Speaker 1: an n FP artist who blew up a Lamborghini in
Speaker 1: protests of this consumerist culture within Crypto, this get rich
Speaker 1: quick ideal, and he ended up selling n f T
Speaker 1: s inspired by that detonation for two point two million dollars.
Speaker 1: So it's it's it's a very interesting cycle. But yes,
Speaker 1: I do think there's this concern that this flash, these lambos,
Speaker 1: these ferraris could again draw greater scrutiny from the government
Speaker 1: and not help Crypto's overall image and pizza. If you
Speaker 1: let's say, you know, I'm we're talking, I don't know
Speaker 1: the cryptom was fast. It could be three months from now,
Speaker 1: it could be five years from now. But let's say
Speaker 1: people are no longer into these kinds of cars. What
Speaker 1: do you think would be the sort of the next
Speaker 1: niche and crypto where people are like, okay, but this
Speaker 1: is the new thing, this is the new states a
Speaker 1: symbol and everybody's excited about it. Well, I would have
Speaker 1: to say absolutely that fast sports cars will never go away.
Speaker 1: I think there's just too much of a primal desire
Speaker 1: in man to just go fast. Now, you do ask
Speaker 1: an interesting question about where we're gonna be putting money next. Well,
Speaker 1: we've seen Facebook, We've seen a lot of big companies.
Speaker 1: Meta is going into the web three auto space that
Speaker 1: defy space. And so certainly we've seen a rise in
Speaker 1: digital real estate and digital property. You guys have covered
Speaker 1: Snoop Dogg and talking about all the digital property and
Speaker 1: n f T s that he's selling, and so we
Speaker 1: have seen this growth in digital property continuing to grow,
Speaker 1: and I think that's going to be a gold mine
Speaker 1: for the right people, the right operators, and the right investors.
Speaker 1: Are you gonna have lambos in your metaborth? Oh? Absolutely absolutely.
Speaker 1: It has to be true to form. It has to
Speaker 1: be What color will they be? What color do you
Speaker 1: want it to be? I'm not going to drive one,
Speaker 1: so let's make it. Let's make it red. I think
Speaker 1: a red Lambeau makes a lot of sense. It red
Speaker 1: lambos and make it orange for bitcoin, orange for bitcoin.
Speaker 1: It's even more so Anna, as a person who also
Speaker 1: does not own a Lambo, I want to give you
Speaker 1: the last words. Yeah. Well, it's interesting that you guys
Speaker 1: are talking about the metaverse. I mean, one of the
Speaker 1: auto deal dealers I spoke with for the story, they're
Speaker 1: super high end, they're in Beverly Hills. Uh, they have
Speaker 1: not seen any impact on Lamborghini demand when it comes
Speaker 1: to Crypto Winter. They told me that there they totally
Speaker 1: have their eyes in the metaverse and they're actually looking
Speaker 1: into like pairing digital cars and digital driving experiences with
Speaker 1: these super high end vehicles that they sell. I can't
Speaker 1: wait to see how some entrepreneur tries to solve the
Speaker 1: problem of parking in in web three so fantastic. Sounds
Speaker 1: like a duel to me. I mean, shouldn't shouldn'ty just
Speaker 1: fight it out? Isn't that what they really want to do? No,
Speaker 1: I think they should race. That's obviously the solution to
Speaker 1: that one. I'll take that too, all right. Well, Pizza,
Speaker 1: thank you so much for joining us from your garage,
Speaker 1: and Hannah, thank you for dialing in from San Francisco.
Speaker 1: Is a real pleasure to talk to you both. Thank you,
Speaker 1: Thank you. You can find more of Hannah Miller's reporting
Speaker 1: on the Bloomberg Terminal on Bloomberg dot com or follow
Speaker 1: her on Twitter. She's at h G. Miller Twine. On
Speaker 1: the next episode of Bloomberg Crypto, would you go to
Speaker 1: a store for a blockchain? The people who opened a
Speaker 1: real life retail experience dedicated to the Salona blockchain call
Speaker 1: Salana Spaces are betting that you will. We send our
Speaker 1: reports Emmanuel John Milton to take a look. The supervising
Speaker 1: producer of Bloomberg Crypto is Vicky Very Galina. Our senior
Speaker 1: producer is Janet Babin. Our producers are Mohammed Ferup and
Speaker 1: Sharon Barriro. Our associate producers or Zanam Siddiki, Thie Butler
Speaker 1: and Moses and um Jsta wonder At is our engineer.
Speaker 1: Original music by Leo Sidrin. I'm Stacy Marie schmil We'll
Speaker 1: be back tomorrow. Correction. A previous version of this episode
Speaker 1: set the move The Pursuit of Happiness was set in
Speaker 1: New York. It was set in San Francisco. We regret
Speaker 1: the error.