Speaker 1: Really. I go into a lot of meetings with my
Speaker 1: staff and they've got lots of ideas, and I don't
Speaker 1: like most of them until like two weeks later I
Speaker 1: decide I do because I learn new things, new information.
Speaker 1: I reserve the right to change my mind. I am
Speaker 1: not a stubborn I try not to be anyway, a
Speaker 1: stubborn leader. Where my way is the highway. I think
Speaker 1: our growth is indicative of my listening to smarter people
Speaker 1: about their specific niches, and I try to find people
Speaker 1: who are uniquely qualified.
Speaker 2: That's Ryan Sirhand, CEO of Sir Hand the real estate brokerage,
Speaker 2: as well as my fellow Today's show guest, and someone
Speaker 2: who's built a business by staying open, adaptable, and relentlessly
Speaker 2: forward looking. You probably know Ryan from Million Dollar listing
Speaker 2: or from his massive social following, but in this conversation
Speaker 2: we get to see the strategists behind the showmen. Ryan
Speaker 2: and I have known each other four years, and this
Speaker 2: felt more like catching up than conducting an interview. We
Speaker 2: talk about how he leads a team of over one
Speaker 2: hundred and sixty employees, what he's learned from launching a
Speaker 2: company in the middle of a pandemic, and how Ai
Speaker 2: is transforming real estate from the inside out. And yeah,
Speaker 2: we talk about hand modeling because of course we do.
Speaker 2: I'm furnished to Rabi and this is leading by Example
Speaker 2: executives making an impact. Ryan, Sir Hant, welcome to Leading
Speaker 2: by Example. My friend.
Speaker 1: Excited to be back with you.
Speaker 2: I know, we go way back and actually, fun fact, audience,
Speaker 2: Ryan and I are speaking virtually, but we actually saw
Speaker 2: each other in person this morning, because that's how much
Speaker 2: the universe wants us to hang out.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I walked into the dressing room at the
Speaker 1: Today Show and you were like, wait, you're not Sarah
Speaker 1: Jessica Parker. It's like, no, I'm not.
Speaker 2: She was there though, but you were cooler. You're actually
Speaker 2: going to be in just like that again in the
Speaker 2: new season. Congrats on that.
Speaker 1: Thanks playing the role of Ransore hand. Someone had to
Speaker 1: do it.
Speaker 2: Someone had to do it.
Speaker 3: Well.
Speaker 2: You know, as you and I were chatting in the
Speaker 2: Today Show, my producer she's like, what's going on there?
Speaker 2: I said, Oh, I'm interviewing Ryan later for Leading by Example,
Speaker 2: and you know he's got an incredible story. Did you
Speaker 2: know he used to be a hand model. And she's like,
Speaker 2: I'm sorry what I'm sure you love this story. But
Speaker 2: let's go back to your hand modeling days, because if
Speaker 2: we're going to get into it.
Speaker 1: Sure why not. Yeah, I definitely hand modeled in New
Speaker 1: York City to pay my rent. That is a true story.
Speaker 1: You can google it. Those images are there forever the
Speaker 1: Internet is written in permanent inc. I think, though, today,
Speaker 1: that's a job that probably doesn't exist much anymore. Why
Speaker 1: would you pay me one thousand dollars for my hand
Speaker 1: when AI can just do it. That's where things get
Speaker 1: a little bit tricky now. So you know I was
Speaker 1: probably a hand model at the top of the profession
Speaker 1: and then realize I couldn't do hands forever.
Speaker 2: No, you did act, and then of course real estate
Speaker 2: and later I do want to revisit artificial intelligence and
Speaker 2: how you see it impact real estate. But let's stick
Speaker 2: with the pass for a second here and talk a
Speaker 2: little bit about your pivot from acting to real estate.
Speaker 2: Would you say that getting into reality TV was like
Speaker 2: the pivot?
Speaker 1: Yeah, Well, I got into real estate at the end
Speaker 1: of two thousand and eight and basically put theater and
Speaker 1: acting to the side so I could just make money.
Speaker 2: In two thousand and eight. By the way, that was
Speaker 2: quite the time to jump into real estate.
Speaker 1: Yes, and it was hard, but I didn't know anything different,
Speaker 1: so I just assumed it was always this hard. But
Speaker 1: for me, I was coming from the bottom, so it's
Speaker 1: not like I had a stock portfolio, so it didn't
Speaker 1: really affect me the way like two weeks ago the
Speaker 1: market correcting did. That's the market I learned in was
Speaker 1: a really, really tough New York City market. Put acting
Speaker 1: to the side. And then there was a casting call
Speaker 1: in twenty ten around this time, fifteen years ago for
Speaker 1: the New York franchise of the show Million Dollar Listing,
Speaker 1: which was set in la and I went to an
Speaker 1: open casting call with a couple thousand other real estate
Speaker 1: agents and there's a long process after that, but the
Speaker 1: rest is relatively history.
Speaker 2: So you're a bravolebrity and you're building your real estate career.
Speaker 2: At what point did you realize I want to expand
Speaker 2: always in all ways, which is your mantra? What was
Speaker 2: that a byproduct of?
Speaker 1: Well, the honest answer is I had to come up
Speaker 1: with that tagline because in season one of Million Dollar Listing,
Speaker 1: the producer said, you need a tagline. I said, I
Speaker 1: don't know what taglines did realtors have, Like everything I
Speaker 1: touched turns to sold. No, I can't use that. And
Speaker 1: I was just kind of thinking about the structure of
Speaker 1: my life and how it was always about growth, and
Speaker 1: I was leaning in on something that was like, if
Speaker 1: you're not growing, you're dying. But I didn't want to
Speaker 1: have the word dying being my tagline, and so that
Speaker 1: it just came my mottos to grow. My modos expansion.
Speaker 1: You always have to be building, You have to be
Speaker 1: doing a little bit more than you were doing before,
Speaker 1: and how are you going to do that? To do it?
Speaker 1: Always in always, oh my gosh.
Speaker 2: There you go. Winner is that you think specific to
Speaker 2: real estate? Are all industries? Can you apply that? Or
Speaker 2: how does it work in real estate? Not everyone goes
Speaker 2: in with that ambition. They want to expand, maybe always
Speaker 2: in a zip code or in a particular state. But
Speaker 2: this morning you said you're opening up, sir hand in Atlanta.
Speaker 2: You're expanding. Why is it so important in real estate
Speaker 2: to always be growing in all ways?
Speaker 1: Well, in sales, it's a volume business. You want to
Speaker 1: be able to serve as many customers as you can.
Speaker 1: And I do it in part so that you can
Speaker 1: weather downturns. The market's been pretty rough in the United
Speaker 1: States the past three years. Inflation, interest rates spiked, low
Speaker 1: inventory at a national level has been tough. But we
Speaker 1: have great volume, and we're in a lot of different markets,
Speaker 1: and we're always expanding, and so even if one market
Speaker 1: is slow, another market might be strong. I do the
Speaker 1: same thing in our businesses. If real estate brokerage is slow,
Speaker 1: real estate education will be strong. If real estate education
Speaker 1: will be having a hard time, real estate technology will
Speaker 1: be strong. If everything is having a hard time, content
Speaker 1: the TV shows, people will turn to media, right, That's
Speaker 1: what we saw happen in twenty twenty. Everything kind of
Speaker 1: went down, but then people turned into our content. Our
Speaker 1: content drove commerce. We built a massive audience for what
Speaker 1: we sell. We have obviously a clear niche, and then
Speaker 1: education came back, and then brokerage came back. So that
Speaker 1: expansion is also to kind of generate the strongest wheel
Speaker 1: that I can to continue propelling the machine so that
Speaker 1: we can sell as much as we possibly can to
Speaker 1: the largest group of customers all around the world.
Speaker 2: Diversification, well, why don't you just kind of go through
Speaker 2: the portfolio and the breakdown of Sir Hand, your real
Speaker 2: estate empire. You started this in the middle of a
Speaker 2: global pandemic, No big deal, since you also got started
Speaker 2: during the financial recession, so you're no stranger to adversity
Speaker 2: and challenges. You've come even quite a long way since
Speaker 2: over the last five years. You've mentioned a few of
Speaker 2: the things that you're doing education, obviously real estate sales.
Speaker 2: But tell us sort of about the anatomy of sir Hand.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I got into the business in two thousand
Speaker 1: and eight. I built a sales team, so I knew
Speaker 1: how to sell real estate. I knew how to manage people.
Speaker 1: We knew how to provide great customer service the buyside,
Speaker 1: seal side, and development side. I had a large group
Speaker 1: of people underneath me, about sixty five people through twenty
Speaker 1: nineteen and into the early days of twenty twenty. I
Speaker 1: then blew all that up started my own company. We
Speaker 1: set up a holding company called Surhand Technologies, and underneath
Speaker 1: it sits real estate brokerage, sales training which is sell
Speaker 1: it dot Com, our production studio which is called Studios.
Speaker 1: So we have our show on Netflix. We have obviously
Speaker 1: all of our social content. We do across platforms, and
Speaker 1: then we have an AI service i'll call it, which
Speaker 1: is called Simple. So we have those four verticals as
Speaker 1: of now that operate kind of in the entire family.
Speaker 2: What made you want to also add like media company
Speaker 2: to this. That requires a lot of you, right, And
Speaker 2: I think one of the challenges of sometimes when your
Speaker 2: name is on the company, you don't want to to
Speaker 2: be all about sort of your brand, right, but really
Speaker 2: about the brand of the business.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we thought about and we workshopped a lot of
Speaker 1: different company names so that I could have some autonomy,
Speaker 1: you know, especially if anything ever happened to me. I
Speaker 1: wanted to make sure that the company was protected. But
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, when you're starting your
Speaker 1: own thing, one getting copyrights to normal words is hard,
Speaker 1: and my name is unique. There's only so many surhants
Speaker 1: out there, and it's what people know the most, and
Speaker 1: so it's the biggest driver of business for us. So
Speaker 1: any other name that I could have come up with
Speaker 1: for our company was going to actually be less beneficial
Speaker 1: to lead generation and to the growth of our businesses
Speaker 1: than if I just named it after myself and then
Speaker 1: we just put a period at the end of it.
Speaker 1: In our logo mark as kind of an end statement
Speaker 1: like that, is it when you want to choose who
Speaker 1: to work with, you choose period, And that's the level
Speaker 1: of service we try to bring to the table.
Speaker 2: Tell me a little bit about real estate today versus
Speaker 2: say twenty ten. The ubiquity of the Internet and all
Speaker 2: that it brings. For one thing, I mean, how would
Speaker 2: you characterize the buyer, the seller and the salesperson today
Speaker 2: and where do you see it going? I mean, it's
Speaker 2: a really tight market, as you said, So how has
Speaker 2: that influenced the relationship between buyer, seller, salesperson.
Speaker 1: Well, they're all far more connected now than ever before.
Speaker 1: It used to be that you would go to salespeople
Speaker 1: for information, but now you don't need to. You would
Speaker 1: go to the salesperson for access to the listings, access
Speaker 1: to buyers. You have no idea what's for sale in
Speaker 1: that building or on that neighborhood, you have to go
Speaker 1: to a real estate agent for it. When that changed,
Speaker 1: we went from information enabled to tech enabled. So okay,
Speaker 1: now your agent is enabled with the right listing software,
Speaker 1: with the right applications to be able to get the
Speaker 1: news out there about your property and to be able
Speaker 1: to put off markets in front of the right buyers
Speaker 1: to now being AI empowered kind of as your companion
Speaker 1: and to our agents. Anyway, we talk about it almost
Speaker 1: like fighter pilots, right, Like you're in the front seat
Speaker 1: and then you've got your copilot behind you. That's where
Speaker 1: AI comes in to enable you to fly faster, to
Speaker 1: win more deals, win more battles, etc. And I think
Speaker 1: that's how things have changed.
Speaker 2: Would you call this a housing crisis or an affordability crisis?
Speaker 2: What do you see as the real achilles heel right now?
Speaker 2: And if you had to add more supply to the market,
Speaker 2: what would you do?
Speaker 1: State and federally owned land tax incentives for private developers
Speaker 1: to build and to have affordability requirements. Same thing they
Speaker 1: do in New York City, except they got rid of
Speaker 1: tax debabits. For the most part, I think it's an
Speaker 1: affordability issue for sure. I think that's what happens when
Speaker 1: you pumpour trillion dollars into the system and then say
Speaker 1: figure it out. And that's the situation we're dealing with
Speaker 1: right now. We have clients who just cannot afford to
Speaker 1: sell because their rates are so low. So when you
Speaker 1: have a really really low interest rate environment for fifteen years,
Speaker 1: and then you just take it away from everybody. They're
Speaker 1: going to hold on to that for the longest time
Speaker 1: they possibly can, and we're coming into a new normal now.
Speaker 1: It's slowly happening, slowly but surely. You also have a
Speaker 1: big wealth trains for more money is being transferred to
Speaker 1: women by twenty thirty than ever before. I think it's
Speaker 1: in the trillions. We have more baby boomers buying real
Speaker 1: estate for millennials and gen zers than I've ever had
Speaker 1: in my career. So there's a wealth transfer into real
Speaker 1: estate that way. But I don't see a housing crisis.
Speaker 1: There's not enough houses. I think that there's an inventory
Speaker 1: crisis because people aren't selling and people aren't building because
Speaker 1: it's too expensive, especially now with everything that's going on today.
Speaker 1: If tariff stick and whatnot, it's going to cost you
Speaker 1: twenty five percent more to build a home potentially in
Speaker 1: twelve months from now than it does today. And today
Speaker 1: it costs you nearly double than what it costs you
Speaker 1: four years ago.
Speaker 2: So what does that tell you. Everyone's throwing out words
Speaker 2: like recession. I know you're not an economist, but what
Speaker 2: are your friends in the industry talking about in terms
Speaker 2: of worst case scenarios in twenty twenty five and beyond, what.
Speaker 1: It seems like we'll almost have is a series of
Speaker 1: corrections instead of one large recession or depression even And
Speaker 1: I think you see that starting to happen now, and
Speaker 1: there will be quick fixes, and then we'll go into
Speaker 1: another one. It'll be quick fixes, and I think maybe
Speaker 1: the exhaustion from those series of corrections. We'll see what happens,
Speaker 1: So we'll see if it kind of puts the brakes
Speaker 1: on the economy. It's like driving on a road that
Speaker 1: has tons of potholes, Like eventually you're just like, dude,
Speaker 1: I got to pull over. I need to figure out
Speaker 1: how I'm going to go down this road. People get nervous, right,
Speaker 1: they get afraid. It seems like there's a little bit
Speaker 1: of that going on, But I don't know. That's not
Speaker 1: my purview really, and I'm not as much of a
Speaker 1: global economic market prognosticator as I am someone who looks
Speaker 1: at real estate markets, which just need more inventory and
Speaker 1: need lower rates. Right, the housing market is defined by
Speaker 1: three things. Supply, demand, interest rates, Like that's it. If
Speaker 1: we have enough people who can afford the supply, and
Speaker 1: there's enough supply to handle the demand, and rates are
Speaker 1: reasonable at a pace where people can afford it based
Speaker 1: on income growth. Because you live in your monthly payment,
Speaker 1: you don't live in the purchase price. Then you have
Speaker 1: a liquid market. You don't have houses selling in one hour,
Speaker 1: but you also don't have them selling in a year.
Speaker 1: And I've been in both markets. Twenty twenty one was
Speaker 1: I don't even need to put it on the market.
Speaker 1: I'm going to call a few people in this house.
Speaker 1: It's going to sell. That's not healthy. I've also been
Speaker 1: in twenty eighteen where the average days on market and
Speaker 1: most urban markets was over three hundred. Wow, that's also
Speaker 1: not a liquid market. And now like one hundred and
Speaker 1: fifty six cities in the United States have a starter
Speaker 1: home price of over a million dollars. So again, all
Speaker 1: of that brings me back towards affordability. And if there
Speaker 1: was one thing that I lean on in my business
Speaker 1: to the Trump campaign promise, whether it was a promise
Speaker 1: or not, who knows what happens now, was there was
Speaker 1: talk about creating incentive to turn federally owned and state
Speaker 1: and local municipality owned land and defunct buildings. You're seeing
Speaker 1: that now with a little bit of the doze stuff,
Speaker 1: and give it over to private real estate development to
Speaker 1: create affordable housing, to create market rate housing, just to
Speaker 1: create more opportunities for people to own their property. And
Speaker 1: we'll see if that happens. But if that happens, that's
Speaker 1: going to be across the swath of the Southwest, the
Speaker 1: little of the southeast and southwest, which is in part
Speaker 1: why I don't think I've said this to anybody yet,
Speaker 1: but you know I opened up and down the east
Speaker 1: coast for Sir HNT And on Wednesday this week I
Speaker 1: fly to open up Arizona.
Speaker 2: Wow, why did you like Arizona so much? Tell me again.
Speaker 1: It's the anchor of the Southwest. It's a big feeder
Speaker 1: market for money that's coming out of your Midwest and
Speaker 1: northwest quadrant. It's a good tax state, and it's a
Speaker 1: lot of people coming out of Los Angeles in southern California,
Speaker 1: and it's a good market. Scottsdale is just a good place.
Speaker 1: It's a good place to be a business owner. It's
Speaker 1: a good place to own and operate.
Speaker 2: A lot of boomers, so you got that wealth transfer.
Speaker 1: Yeah, a lot of boomers. My parents had a place there.
Speaker 1: They're the most boomers. But then someone knocked on their
Speaker 1: door during COVID and gave them a number to leave,
Speaker 1: and they took it. Oh, like crazy people.
Speaker 2: They didn't call you first though, Did you do that
Speaker 2: deal or no?
Speaker 1: I wasn't licensed in Arizona at the time. Man, I've
Speaker 1: dealt with my dad now on like two deals in
Speaker 1: Florida because they live in Florida now half of the year,
Speaker 1: in New Hampshire for the other half. And man, oh man,
Speaker 1: am I glad it's only two He hit me on commission.
Speaker 2: Oh my goodness.
Speaker 1: He was like, well, I don't know what your guys
Speaker 1: really did. I'm like, Dad, this is what we do.
Speaker 1: And he's like, wow, man, I mean you should start
Speaker 1: doing a better job because I'm not paying that. I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 1: what are you doing?
Speaker 2: I mean maybe you're kind of alike in some ways
Speaker 2: more than you. When we come back, Ryan opens up
Speaker 2: about the culture he's building at Sir Hand, including how
Speaker 2: he hires, who gets weeded out, and the interview tactic
Speaker 2: he swears by. Will also dip into his refreshingly holistic
Speaker 2: five year plan.
Speaker 1: Doing an assessment for every hire is really important because
Speaker 1: we want to see how people think critically. We also
Speaker 1: want to see how people handle negative feedback. So one
Speaker 1: of the most important things I've done is when they
Speaker 1: bring that homework, even if it's amazing and perfect, is
Speaker 1: to tell him it's awful and it's not the way
Speaker 1: we would have done it, and see how they respond
Speaker 1: stay with us.
Speaker 2: I want to talk more now about your leadership style
Speaker 2: and the culture that you've built at Sir hand. I
Speaker 2: got to ask, is there anyone that you have seen
Speaker 2: as inspiration leadership inspiration? You know, I want to emulate
Speaker 2: some of the culture that they've built at their company.
Speaker 2: Any North Stars for you.
Speaker 1: I wish it could be like my dad, that guy
Speaker 1: I ruled with an iron fist. I don't have the
Speaker 1: heart for that. I think maybe sometimes my life would
Speaker 1: be easier if I were that much tougher. I think
Speaker 1: there's a difference between being tough and being fair. I
Speaker 1: think I'm incredibly fair. So it doesn't mean we don't
Speaker 1: let people go. It doesn't mean we don't make tough decisions,
Speaker 1: but I try to be fair. I went to Hamilton
Speaker 1: College and I read that biography a long time ago.
Speaker 1: The big biography and then they turned it into the
Speaker 1: musical and all that stuff. And I don't know if
Speaker 1: I've learned as much about leadership from reading about Alexander
Speaker 1: Hamilton as much as I did about innovation. Like something
Speaker 1: that we say a lot here now now, especially because
Speaker 1: the real estate business and the broker's business is incredibly litigious,
Speaker 1: is we innovate, we don't litigate. I've only filed one
Speaker 1: lawsuit against somebody else and won it hand over fists
Speaker 1: because they were just terrible people and I had to
Speaker 1: set an example, which is annoying. Other than that, people
Speaker 1: have come after us and they've lost every single time.
Speaker 1: And there's been other opportunities for us to litigate, Like
Speaker 1: why spend time, money, and effort on litigating someone else
Speaker 1: who's just going to enjoy it. Why don't we take
Speaker 1: the same time, money, effort and just go innovate faster.
Speaker 1: Let's win through success. They're just going to lose anyway.
Speaker 2: Can you share what some of these lawsuits were about?
Speaker 2: Were these typical in the industry? Is it just cost
Speaker 2: a business sort of lawsuits?
Speaker 1: There's a mixture like the breaking of contracts, the stealing
Speaker 1: of clients. We get sued. If you go into a
Speaker 1: new market and a new agent comes over to you,
Speaker 1: you get sued by that firm for tortious interference, almost
Speaker 1: as a defense mechanism to show their other agents, Oh,
Speaker 1: you can't go over there, because I'm going to sue
Speaker 1: you too, And so it becomes this game of lawfare,
Speaker 1: which is weird, but it's pretty specific too, I guess
Speaker 1: our industry, but that's why we try to do as
Speaker 1: much as we can through innovation. That's why we have
Speaker 1: all the media that we have and the shows that
Speaker 1: we have and the technology that we have. And people
Speaker 1: can be angry. It's fine. If they weren't angry, maybe
Speaker 1: we'd be doing something wrong.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's interesting because I get what you're saying about
Speaker 2: the lawsuits becoming a game, and I want to talk
Speaker 2: about innovation in just a moment. But one question about culture,
Speaker 2: because I've had the opportunity to interact with many of
Speaker 2: your team members and that is not a coincidence that
Speaker 2: you assemble this team that I'm sure there along the
Speaker 2: way there have been some that didn't work out. But
Speaker 2: how do you hire? What's the process? What do you
Speaker 2: look for in a teammate, especially someone who's in a
Speaker 2: leadership position at surhand.
Speaker 1: So we hire agents and we hire employees for agents.
Speaker 1: There's kind of a pretty simple process. We bring on
Speaker 1: principal agents that fit the culture, fit the vibe to
Speaker 1: the right people. But the god who have been in
Speaker 1: the business typically for least five years. They have to
Speaker 1: carry a rolling annual sales volume and income. We've let
Speaker 1: some agents come in on the principal side, so meaning
Speaker 1: they do their own business who've been doing it for
Speaker 1: less than five years, but typically that's about our average.
Speaker 1: And then brand new agents they go through our programs,
Speaker 1: they go through sell it, they go through the books,
Speaker 1: all the courses, and they can join as an apprentice.
Speaker 1: And then I look for three things when hiring agents.
Speaker 1: They have to have good energy, they have to have
Speaker 1: good enthusiasm, and they have to have empathy. And that's
Speaker 1: always been my thing and I've never really found a
Speaker 1: better trifecta of ease to look for. The staff side
Speaker 1: is hard. I am not the best interviewer. I kind
Speaker 1: of like most people, and I just sort of assume
Speaker 1: that you're going to be awesome and not screwed up
Speaker 1: and work every single day the way I do, and
Speaker 1: just be really really great at what you do. And
Speaker 1: I've had a lot of people bullshit me, and I've
Speaker 1: made mistakes on a lot of key employees and staff.
Speaker 1: And you know, I'm a salesperson. I like it when
Speaker 1: people sell me. I'm like, oh, that was good, Yeah,
Speaker 1: you'd be great, And then they come over and two
Speaker 1: months later I'm like, oh, you suck. You know, there's
Speaker 1: a lot of tal out there.
Speaker 2: Well, in sales especially, yes, but.
Speaker 1: On the staff side, we hire across technology, operations, finance, management,
Speaker 1: now legal HR. I mean one hundred and sixty employees
Speaker 1: here now full time across markets, and so we found
Speaker 1: that homework. So doing an assessment for every hire is
Speaker 1: really important and making sure you don't use AI to
Speaker 1: do it unless that's the job is to figure out
Speaker 1: the most efficient way to solve a problem. Because we
Speaker 1: want to see how people think critically, we also want
Speaker 1: to see how people handle negative feedback. So one of
Speaker 1: the most important things I've done is when they bring
Speaker 1: that homework, even if it's amazing and perfect, is to
Speaker 1: tell them it's awful and it's not the way we
Speaker 1: would have done it and see how they respond, because
Speaker 1: if they cower and say no, problem. Then I know
Speaker 1: I'm hiring a yes man, and that person's going to
Speaker 1: bankrupt me if they get aggressive with emotion. Emotion equals ego,
Speaker 1: and I don't want that person in our room or
Speaker 1: in my pool. If they are passionate about their response
Speaker 1: and if they defend it and they're respectful about how
Speaker 1: I think, right and they're like, huh, that's a unique
Speaker 1: choice there, Ryan, and they lead with respect and professionalism
Speaker 1: while also listening to alternative ideas. Passion equals outcomes, So
Speaker 1: ego is emotion, passions is outcomes, and those people end
Speaker 1: up being some of the best hires we've ever had.
Speaker 2: So be emotionally regulated when you're in an interview with
Speaker 2: Ryan Sarahn. That's what I'm learning. That's a great strategy, actually, I.
Speaker 1: Think it's important. Otherwise there's like six hundred questions and
Speaker 1: what's your weakness and what's this that? Because listen, in
Speaker 1: real life, I go into a lot of meetings with
Speaker 1: my staff, okay, and they've got lots of ideas and
Speaker 1: I don't like most of them until like two weeks
Speaker 1: later I decide I do because I learn new things,
Speaker 1: new information. I reserve the right to change my mind. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I am not a stubborn I try not to be
Speaker 1: anyway a stubborn leader where my way is the highway.
Speaker 1: I think our growth is indicative of my listening to
Speaker 1: smarter people about their specific niches, and I try to
Speaker 1: find people who are unique qualified to do what they do.
Speaker 1: That's also been a learning lesson for me, thinking that
Speaker 1: I could mold somebody to be something they're not. Like,
Speaker 1: this isn't baseball. It's hard to do that. Yeah, Like,
Speaker 1: you've got to be uniquely qualified to carry this role
Speaker 1: and elevate us. Otherwise I'm just like a charity here
Speaker 1: trying to elevate you, and that is a waste of
Speaker 1: my time.
Speaker 2: Well, let's talk innovation now. And I've been saving maybe
Speaker 2: the best for last year because I do think that
Speaker 2: with AI here and not leaving and only growing faster,
Speaker 2: that we all could benefit from learning how you're thinking
Speaker 2: about it and how you're applying it to your business.
Speaker 2: And simple SMPL is a technology your team has created
Speaker 2: to basically facilitate your agents. If I'm correct, to marry
Speaker 2: kind of the human with the technology. Tell us about
Speaker 2: the thesis behind this and why you think it's really relevant.
Speaker 1: What it does is it combined SaaS automations with human
Speaker 1: expertise to really build what we would call like the
Speaker 1: first ever large action model for real estate designed to
Speaker 1: help salespeople and sales teams. So at a high level,
Speaker 1: that's what it does. It uses LMS from gros on it,
Speaker 1: GPT four to H and whisper to use function calling
Speaker 1: to map requests to anticipate what the salesperson is going
Speaker 1: to ask for next, whether it's a CMA or a
Speaker 1: listing presentation or showings whatnot. And then we have a
Speaker 1: very very large database which for us we call like
Speaker 1: our project vector that then pulls the information from that
Speaker 1: to then execute and do the work on the agent's bath.
Speaker 1: The agent never sees any of this. All of this
Speaker 1: is done on the back end, and it empowers support staff.
Speaker 1: So again I'm niche to real estate, but like, there's
Speaker 1: a huge real estate company out there on the public market. Okay,
Speaker 1: they've got thirty thousand real estate agents, thousands of support
Speaker 1: staff members supporting the salespeople, supporting the business, helping the
Speaker 1: business move. So that company, I guess would operate at
Speaker 1: like for every four to five salespeople, you would need
Speaker 1: one support staff with Simple, it's every hundred. So we
Speaker 1: try to really empower the support staff, who we call
Speaker 1: our Simple advisors, to run kind of a switchboard to
Speaker 1: automate all of the work that a salesperson needs to do.
Speaker 1: Now we have AI that does a lot of it automatically,
Speaker 1: so you don't need these advisors. I put out like
Speaker 1: a commercial two months ago where it's pulling properties addresses,
Speaker 1: running the broker price opinion, sending out emails, all that stuff,
Speaker 1: and we just built it to do that because that's
Speaker 1: what would make my life better. And then there's also
Speaker 1: a lot of custom requests that take a little bit
Speaker 1: of time. The same way if you were going to
Speaker 1: go on Amazon and order a house or a car,
Speaker 1: like it wouldn't show up in a box on Prime
Speaker 1: in an hour. That request might take a little bit
Speaker 1: of time, and so we do that too. But it's
Speaker 1: kind of going back to what I said before. From
Speaker 1: information empowered to tech empowered to AI empowered is really
Speaker 1: where the thesis is going to be drawn with salespeople
Speaker 1: over the next couple of years. We see it anyway,
Speaker 1: that's the bet we've made.
Speaker 2: It's exclusive to stor hint or do you see this
Speaker 2: as something you can scale and potentially sell as a
Speaker 2: product to other agencies.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Possibly. Right now, it's exclusive to Sirhin As we're
Speaker 1: building it. These are early days. We really started putting
Speaker 1: it out in September of last year. I think the
Speaker 1: app was accepted into the App Store on April seventeenth
Speaker 1: last week. I had a call with our Simple team
Speaker 1: about it this morning. So all good so far. But
Speaker 1: in markets that we're not in with agents and and
Speaker 1: also other industries is where I get excited. Whether it's
Speaker 1: financial services or legal, the ability to replace administrative work
Speaker 1: I think is sorely needed.
Speaker 2: How would you advise someone who wants to get into
Speaker 2: the real estate market today as an agent versus like
Speaker 2: five years ago? What are the steps? What are the
Speaker 2: new things they have to learn? The education that they
Speaker 2: need now that is more than ever.
Speaker 1: Well, you need to learn how to build the tools.
Speaker 1: You need to learn how to use the tools and
Speaker 1: use the resources to be able to serve your client
Speaker 1: to the best their ability. When you're a brand new agent,
Speaker 1: I think the biggest mistake you can do is try
Speaker 1: to do it by yourself. You can't do that. You're
Speaker 1: not going to go to battle by yourself. You're not
Speaker 1: going to go and win a super Bowl by yourself.
Speaker 1: You need to be a part of a winning team.
Speaker 1: I think winning teams create winning players, and that's what
Speaker 1: we're trying to do here at this company and from
Speaker 1: the entire company winning to all of our individual sales teams.
Speaker 1: Winning new agents need to get their license. They need
Speaker 1: to join a team and learn from a team and
Speaker 1: treat it like an MBA two to three years. We're
Speaker 1: doing absolutely everything. You're working incredibly hard, and then you're
Speaker 1: taking that information and once you graduate out of that
Speaker 1: apprentice program or that MBA program or whatever you want
Speaker 1: to call it internally, you're then able to run incredibly fast.
Speaker 1: And I think you never can stop investing in yourself,
Speaker 1: learning and investing, learning and investing, because all you're doing
Speaker 1: is investing. It's not a cost right, it's an investment
Speaker 1: in the you of the future.
Speaker 2: Do you think, looking back five years ago, you are
Speaker 2: where you had predicted? Are you working faster than you thought?
Speaker 1: Probably not. I think I could always work a lot faster.
Speaker 1: You think, yeah, five years ago today? I think it
Speaker 1: was April twenty first, twenty twenty, my wife, my daughter,
Speaker 1: my mother in law, we drove back from New Hampshire
Speaker 1: where we were sheltering in place where we were quarantined
Speaker 1: and we just couldn't take it anymore. And we came
Speaker 1: back with masks and gloves, and it was like, I'm
Speaker 1: going to go start this business. I'm going to start
Speaker 1: it in an empty New York city. There's no better
Speaker 1: time to start something brand new than when the whole
Speaker 1: world is shut down. So let's go do that now.
Speaker 1: So I don't know. I think five years ago, I
Speaker 1: imagine maybe we'd be in more markets if we'd be
Speaker 1: bigger by now. But knowing what it takes now, I'm
Speaker 1: a lot farther than I thought I would be, knowing
Speaker 1: how much work went into the last couple of years.
Speaker 2: And so now where do you see yourself in five
Speaker 2: years and the brand and the company, knowing now what
Speaker 2: it takes, what it has taken, the advance of technology,
Speaker 2: where AI is taking you tell me the picture that
Speaker 2: you're seeing in five years.
Speaker 1: I want there to be sur hand listings in every
Speaker 1: market around the world in five years. That's a lot
Speaker 1: of work. I want the sirhamp brand to be synonymous
Speaker 1: with luxury and affordable luxury. I think we'll have more
Speaker 1: verticals outside of just real estate. I think Simple will
Speaker 1: be in more industries and it'll be a leading tool
Speaker 1: for sales, administrative work replacement. That's a lot. That's a
Speaker 1: good bag.
Speaker 2: And personally, your dad, your a husband. How do you
Speaker 2: prioritize where you're putting your energy? You get up very early,
Speaker 2: I know, that's for sure.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is definitely hard. My wife actually came and
Speaker 1: like shadowed me for the first time in fourteen years
Speaker 1: one day last week, and when we got home, she
Speaker 1: was just like, I get it.
Speaker 2: And why did that happen? Was it like just spontaneous
Speaker 2: or was there a reason for that.
Speaker 1: No, she's spending more more time with the company and people,
Speaker 1: and she's involved in cultural events and things, and it
Speaker 1: just sort of happened that way. I don't know. I
Speaker 1: would like to have more kids. I would like to
Speaker 1: if someone can help me with them, that would be awesome.
Speaker 1: I'd like to be healthy, that's for sure. You know.
Speaker 1: I just spent a day with a little girl from
Speaker 1: Make a Wish. Her wish was to come work with us,
Speaker 1: and we did that, and so that was definitely something
Speaker 1: to go through. We had a great time, but I mean,
Speaker 1: at the same time, it's never lost on you what
Speaker 1: brought this moment to the table, and how fragile life is,
Speaker 1: and how we take everything that we currently have for
Speaker 1: granted until we don't. And so I'd like to be
Speaker 1: healthy and happy, that's for sure, with great motivation.
Speaker 2: Well that's a beautiful place to end. Ryan Sirhan, thank
Speaker 2: you so much. I knew this was going to be
Speaker 2: a winning interview. We're so happy to have you on
Speaker 2: the podcast. I look forward to seeing you again running
Speaker 2: in person. Who knows next time I'm on the Today
Speaker 2: Show or maybe Good Morning America next I don't know.
Speaker 1: All right, sounds good, stay in touch.
Speaker 2: Thank you. We're now talking to another Ryan, my producer. Ryan.
Speaker 2: What'd you think of Ryan Sirhan?
Speaker 3: I mean, it's incredible to see his trajectory from just
Speaker 3: starting in reality TV, it's now building this reality He's
Speaker 3: really just an impressive person and an impressive leader, and
Speaker 3: I'm so glad we got him on the show.
Speaker 2: I mean, thinking about all the Bravo celebrities, if you will,
Speaker 2: a few come to mind that have really been able
Speaker 2: to separate themselves from that reality show world. Bethany Frankel
Speaker 2: comes to mind and Ryan Sarhant for sure, because what
Speaker 2: he's done that's remarkable is he leveraged that platform to
Speaker 2: I think lead him to a place where he could
Speaker 2: build Sir Hant and kind of hit the ground running
Speaker 2: a little bit. But what he's done with it and
Speaker 2: where he's taking it is just really a testament to
Speaker 2: his smarts, to his forward thinkingness. And he's just at
Speaker 2: the end of the day, like a really good salesman
Speaker 2: and a businessman, which we don't always associate with a
Speaker 2: reality TV show star.
Speaker 3: Right. I think you hit the nail right on the head.
Speaker 3: I think it's his forward looking nature and that's something
Speaker 3: that we see in common with folks like Bethany Frankel,
Speaker 3: like Ryan Sirhant, where they see the big picture. And
Speaker 3: I think that really came through in his conversation today,
Speaker 3: talking just holistically about how he approaches the industry, how
Speaker 3: he approaches partners, how he approaches people that work for him,
Speaker 3: and just always having that eye to the horizon of
Speaker 3: how can I use what's happening now five years from now.
Speaker 3: And I think that's why he's so cutting edge. And
Speaker 3: I loved him getting into Simple and their AI tool
Speaker 3: specifically about how they were looking forward to how can
Speaker 3: we solve the problem of admin work to free up
Speaker 3: our salespeople to do the responsibilities of the job that
Speaker 3: actually make them money.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's excited to see what he's building. I also
Speaker 2: really appreciated where he talked about you, I like everybody,
Speaker 2: so I should not be the person that's hiring, at
Speaker 2: least when it comes to the corporate level. And so
Speaker 2: while that could be cast as a strength, it is
Speaker 2: admirable that you like everybody, but it's probably not good
Speaker 2: business to be always in every room with that kind
Speaker 2: of purview.
Speaker 3: And now as we close this season, what's interesting what
Speaker 3: I saw as a through line is just that empathy.
Speaker 3: I take a statement like I like everyone, and I
Speaker 3: think back to Claude Silver, and I think back to
Speaker 3: other leaders who are able to look at the people
Speaker 3: that work for them and the teams that they're leading
Speaker 3: as the people that they are, to see them as
Speaker 3: more than just cogs in a machine. And that just
Speaker 3: bleeds through in everything he talks about in terms of
Speaker 3: his planning and his strategy. And while that might not
Speaker 3: be the best business approach to be everyone's friend, I
Speaker 3: think the core value of that is just finding that
Speaker 3: empathy to put yourself in the shoes of the people
Speaker 3: that work for you, and I think that's been a
Speaker 3: big part of his success for sure.
Speaker 2: Oh well, it's been really fun hosting all these interviews
Speaker 2: and having an opportunity to talk to you later about it.
Speaker 2: I already heard your big takeaway from the season is empathy.
Speaker 2: I think for me it's definitely empathy and also perhaps
Speaker 2: always looking forward, you know, thinking two, three, five years ahead.
Speaker 2: I've heard this from other leaders too. I heard it
Speaker 2: mostly echoed from the conversations this season about the importance
Speaker 2: of look, nothing's predictable, but the signs can be there.
Speaker 2: I think it was Navine Jane who talked about that
Speaker 2: where I asked him, you know, how is it possible
Speaker 2: to know? He goes, we have data. It's just a
Speaker 2: matter of getting the right experts in the room to
Speaker 2: assess the data. As a leader, you aren't actually the
Speaker 2: one making the forecasts in a vacuum, right, you have
Speaker 2: to bring in all the experts. You're not the expert,
Speaker 2: but have a vision is the starting place, and then
Speaker 2: from there, you know, assembling the right people around you
Speaker 2: to help you usher the mission.
Speaker 3: Absolutely I can't wait to hear next season as well.
Speaker 3: I feel like we're going to get even more advice
Speaker 3: and cool features and anecdotes from the leaders that are
Speaker 3: coming along.
Speaker 2: Yeah, especially with where the economy is going, it'll be
Speaker 2: an interesting uh, We're going to learn a lot interesting insights. Yeah. Well,
Speaker 2: thanks everyone for tuning into season one. We're really proud
Speaker 2: of everything that we've accomplished, the voices that we have shared.
Speaker 2: Thank you for listening and subscribing, and stay tuned. We're
Speaker 2: going to take a little bit of a hiatus. We're
Speaker 2: going to quickly be back at work, fielding conversations, getting
Speaker 2: our great guests, and opening up again season two. In
Speaker 2: the meantime, you can find me at Varnish Charabi on
Speaker 2: Instagram and I'm always on the So Money podcast. I'll
Speaker 2: see you next time. This podcast is a production of
Speaker 2: iHeartRadio's Ruby Studio. Our executive producer is Matt Stillo and
Speaker 2: our supervising producer is Nikiah Swinton. This podcast was edited
Speaker 2: by Sierra Spreen