WEBVTT - Panasonic to Today

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to tex Stuff, a production from I Heart Radio.

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<v Speaker 1>Hey there, and welcome to tech Stuff. I'm your host,

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<v Speaker 1>Jonathan Strickland. I'm an executive producer with I Heart Radio

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<v Speaker 1>and I love all things tech. And welcome to the

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<v Speaker 1>third and and final, at least for now episode in

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<v Speaker 1>our series about the history of Pana Sonic a k a.

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<v Speaker 1>The Mattsushida Electrical Industrial Company. At the end of our

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<v Speaker 1>last episode, I talked about how Konosuke Matsushida, who founded

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<v Speaker 1>the company in nineteen eighteen, retired as chairman of the

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<v Speaker 1>company in nineteen seventy three. He stepped into a more

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<v Speaker 1>informal executive advisory role at that time. Now, I say that,

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<v Speaker 1>but executive advisors in Japan can exert and any formous

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<v Speaker 1>amount of control over companies even after they have officially

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<v Speaker 1>stepped out of leadership roles. More on that as we

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<v Speaker 1>go on. We also heard about allegations that Panasonic, along

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<v Speaker 1>with several other major electronics companies in Japan, had practiced

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<v Speaker 1>price fixing, both in Japan domestically, where the companies would

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<v Speaker 1>sell products at a premium, and in the US market,

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<v Speaker 1>where these same companies would sell products at a loss

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<v Speaker 1>in order to undercut American electronics companies and kind of

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<v Speaker 1>gain the market in the US. So while the company

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<v Speaker 1>history has a lot of positive elements, there are at

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<v Speaker 1>least a few smudges that warrant investigation. We'll talk about

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<v Speaker 1>a few more of those in this episode, but we

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<v Speaker 1>pick up in ninety three. Masaharu Matsushida, Kanasuke's son in law,

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<v Speaker 1>is still the president of the company at that time,

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<v Speaker 1>and uh Arataro Takahashi is chairman. Takahashi had played an

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<v Speaker 1>important role in establishing matsushi It's relationship with the Dutch

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<v Speaker 1>electronics company Phillips, and Phillips had really helped the Japanese

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<v Speaker 1>company get up to speed on the consumer electronics industry. Essentially,

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<v Speaker 1>Phillips was providing the technical know how and Matsushida was

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<v Speaker 1>providing the access to the Japanese market, and it was

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<v Speaker 1>a beneficial relationship. Phillips had retained a nearly thirty five

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<v Speaker 1>percent stake in the company as a result. Uh and

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<v Speaker 1>Takahashi was instrumental in getting that to happen. It's interesting

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<v Speaker 1>to see that he became the chairman while Masaharu remained president,

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<v Speaker 1>because typically it wouldn't work that way. So we need

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<v Speaker 1>to consider how Japanese businesses typically handle succession, and this

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<v Speaker 1>will become even more important as we go on in

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<v Speaker 1>this episode. Now, it's not that different from the way

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<v Speaker 1>many other companies handle succession, particularly those that tend to

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<v Speaker 1>look within the company itself as opposed to bringing in

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<v Speaker 1>a leader from some other company. In Japanese companies, it's

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<v Speaker 1>typical for a president to move to a chairman position

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<v Speaker 1>when the previous chairman retires, and it's not unusual for

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<v Speaker 1>a chairman to take on one of those informal executive

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<v Speaker 1>advisor roles on the board, so even when they're gone,

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<v Speaker 1>they aren't really gone, or as Red Letter Media likes

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<v Speaker 1>to say, nobody has ever really gone. Normally, one of

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<v Speaker 1>the most senior level executive vice presidents of the company

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<v Speaker 1>will then assume the role of president, and so seniority

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<v Speaker 1>plays a massively important part in succession in Japanese businesses,

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<v Speaker 1>as well as in wages. Typically, though, we learned there's

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<v Speaker 1>also a tendency for control of a company to remain

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<v Speaker 1>within a family, which could be another way that an

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<v Speaker 1>outgoing executive keeps one hand on the steering wheel even

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<v Speaker 1>after they've officially retired. Takahashi certainly had been around a

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<v Speaker 1>long time. He had worked at the company since the

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<v Speaker 1>nineteen thirties, and he played such an important role in

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<v Speaker 1>getting that relationship with Phillips established, But in this case

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<v Speaker 1>he sort of leap frogg massa Haru. I couldn't find

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<v Speaker 1>much information on what was going on at the executive

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<v Speaker 1>level at this time, but my assumption is that Konasuke

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<v Speaker 1>felt that Massaharu was best left in the president position

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<v Speaker 1>for a little while longer, and that he would move

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<v Speaker 1>up to chairman in the future. And perhaps there wasn't

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<v Speaker 1>someone that impressed Konosuke enough to step into the role

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<v Speaker 1>of president, so he won Masaharu to remain there. Because again,

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<v Speaker 1>while he was officially retired, Konosuke was still very much

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<v Speaker 1>involved with the operations of the company that he had

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<v Speaker 1>founded way back in nineteen eighteen. One of Kanasuke's directives

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<v Speaker 1>was having a profound impact upon the company and really

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<v Speaker 1>on the electronics industry in Japan in general, and that

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<v Speaker 1>was his goal of getting wages in Japan close sor

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<v Speaker 1>to what US companies paid their employees over here. And

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<v Speaker 1>this wasn't just an altruistic desire to reward employees, but

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<v Speaker 1>to encourage productivity and to be more competitive for skilled

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<v Speaker 1>and educated workers in an increasingly competitive industry. But it

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<v Speaker 1>also meant things had to change. From a production standpoint.

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<v Speaker 1>Raising wages would mean increasing the cost of doing business,

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<v Speaker 1>which would impact profits. So one of the things the

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<v Speaker 1>company focused on was streamlining processes as much as possible,

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<v Speaker 1>making them more efficient and economic. This included automating processes

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<v Speaker 1>whenever it made sense to do so, and the end

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<v Speaker 1>result was that by the nineteen seventies, Matsushido was one of,

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<v Speaker 1>if not the most efficient large company in Japan, even

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<v Speaker 1>over companies like Toyota. By nineteen seventy one, wages at

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<v Speaker 1>Matsushida were comparable to those in West Germany, and you know,

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<v Speaker 1>if you're young, you might not know that there used

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<v Speaker 1>to be an East and a West Germany. By nineteen

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<v Speaker 1>seventy two, just before Kanasuke would retire, the wages were

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<v Speaker 1>actually pretty close to what employees were doing in comparable

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<v Speaker 1>jobs in the United States. While this was happening, an

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<v Speaker 1>external crisis made things more complicated for the company. In

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<v Speaker 1>the autumn of nineteen seventy three, when a coalition of

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<v Speaker 1>Arabic forces launched a surprise attack on Israeli forces. It

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<v Speaker 1>created the yam Kapoor War. It took place during Yom Kippur,

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<v Speaker 1>a Jewish holiday, and sometimes it's called the yam Kappur War.

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<v Speaker 1>Sometimes it's called the Ramadan War. It was also coinciding

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<v Speaker 1>with the Muslim holy month of Ramadan. And this war

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<v Speaker 1>only lasted a few weeks, but the world was drawn

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<v Speaker 1>into it because of various alliances, including the Soviet Union

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<v Speaker 1>on one side in the United States on the other side.

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<v Speaker 1>And the complexities of that conflict are well beyond the

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<v Speaker 1>scope of this show, but the effects on industry are

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<v Speaker 1>what I hope to focus on. It does play a

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<v Speaker 1>part in techno oology. At the end of the war,

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<v Speaker 1>a coalition of Arab countries decided upon an oil embargo

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<v Speaker 1>against the US and other nations, and this led to

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<v Speaker 1>a global energy crisis. As oil production slowed down. Japan

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<v Speaker 1>was not immune to this crisis. The cost of raw

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<v Speaker 1>materials increased, as did the cost of shipping stuff from

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<v Speaker 1>one place to another. I mean that oil embargo was

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<v Speaker 1>going to have an impact on fuel prices, which would

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<v Speaker 1>make it more expensive to ship things, which meant that

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<v Speaker 1>you had to charge more for your products, and you

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<v Speaker 1>see how this becomes a ripple effect, and Mattsushida was

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<v Speaker 1>trying to be as strategic as it could be to

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<v Speaker 1>limit the effect that the crisis would have on sales figures.

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<v Speaker 1>But even so, the company posted a decrease in profits

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<v Speaker 1>in nineteen seventy four compared to nineteen seventy three. It

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<v Speaker 1>also had more sales during that time, but it wasn't

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<v Speaker 1>profiting as much. Even though it was selling more, it

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<v Speaker 1>was making less money, and both sales and profit would

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<v Speaker 1>be on the decline in nineteen seventy five. One product

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<v Speaker 1>the company introduced in nineteen would fail to get traction

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<v Speaker 1>in the market at all. So in the nineteen seventies

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<v Speaker 1>a few companies were battling it out to create the

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<v Speaker 1>definitive home entertainment media playback device, and this took a

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<v Speaker 1>lot of different forms, all of which were in some

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<v Speaker 1>level of competition against each other. Some of them were

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<v Speaker 1>playback only devices, like you would have to go out

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<v Speaker 1>and purchase a movie or TV show or rent one

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<v Speaker 1>and play it on a device. So the Capacitance Electronic disc,

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<v Speaker 1>which was made by our c A, was one of

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<v Speaker 1>those types of devices. I actually have one of those

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<v Speaker 1>literally at my feet right now, an old CD player,

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<v Speaker 1>the laser disc player from m C. A Disco vision

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<v Speaker 1>would also be another one, But I want to talk

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<v Speaker 1>about VCRs. So VCRs, or video cassette recorders, are one

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<v Speaker 1>of those technologies that had a huge impact on how

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<v Speaker 1>we consume entertainment, and I might do an episode of

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<v Speaker 1>out that in the near future about how the development

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<v Speaker 1>of the VCR changed entertainment itself. And there were a

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<v Speaker 1>few formats that all did the same general thing, but

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<v Speaker 1>with different approaches. Generally speaking, these machines used magnetic storage,

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<v Speaker 1>much as audio tape had. In order to store video

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<v Speaker 1>and audio information, a VCR has at the very least

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<v Speaker 1>an electro magnet that acts as a reading head, and

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<v Speaker 1>as tape moves below this reading head, the tape induces

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<v Speaker 1>a current to flow through that electro magnet because of

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<v Speaker 1>the magnetic particles that are in the tape, and that

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<v Speaker 1>flows through the VCR, and that current is a signal

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<v Speaker 1>it's meaningful, it can be decoded, and that decoded information

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<v Speaker 1>can be sent to a television and potentially an additional

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<v Speaker 1>sound system as well, and that will play the media

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<v Speaker 1>that is stored on the tape. Most VCRs also had

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<v Speaker 1>the capability to write to a blank tape or record

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<v Speaker 1>over an unprotected tape, and that meant this whole process

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<v Speaker 1>could be reversed and the electro magnet would generate a

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<v Speaker 1>magnetic field, and the magnetic field would be recorded onto

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<v Speaker 1>the plastic tape that passes by during the recording process.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm sure most of you have heard about the format

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<v Speaker 1>war that raged between Sony's Beta max format and j

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<v Speaker 1>v C S VHS format. But while those two would

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<v Speaker 1>be the primary candidates for home theater systems, there were

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<v Speaker 1>other formats that entered the fray, including one from Matt

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<v Speaker 1>Sushida slash Pana Sonic, and that format was called v X.

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<v Speaker 1>Matt Sushida only introduced a couple of models of VCR

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<v Speaker 1>that used the v X format. The version released in

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<v Speaker 1>North America was called the Quasar VR one thousand, also

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<v Speaker 1>known as the Great Time Machine. The v X format

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<v Speaker 1>used tapes that were kind of in a cassette form factor.

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<v Speaker 1>They were larger than VHS tapes twice as thick really,

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<v Speaker 1>and they would slide into the player lenkwise rather than widthwise,

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<v Speaker 1>the way a typical VCR works, and it was marketed

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<v Speaker 1>as the great time machine because you could set a

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<v Speaker 1>timer on the VCR and tape content off the television

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<v Speaker 1>and then watch it whenever you wanted to. So this

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<v Speaker 1>is an early example of time shifting. I've watched videos

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<v Speaker 1>of this technology and action, and it's pretty clunky stuff.

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<v Speaker 1>The tapes take up a lot of space. Uh. And

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<v Speaker 1>ultimately the format just didn't take off, and Matt Sushida

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<v Speaker 1>slash Panasonic discontinued the players a couple of years later.

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<v Speaker 1>It was clear that either Beta Max or VHS was

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<v Speaker 1>going to win out in that war. Now here's a

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<v Speaker 1>kind of crazy part of this story. I mean, sure,

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<v Speaker 1>a company introduces a new format and it doesn't pan out.

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<v Speaker 1>That's not unusual. We've seen it in other formats like

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<v Speaker 1>HD DVD versus Blu Ray. But what is unusual in

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<v Speaker 1>this case is that Matt Soshida slash Pana Sonic had

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<v Speaker 1>a majority stake in the Victor Company of Japan also

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<v Speaker 1>known as j v C, also known as the company

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<v Speaker 1>behind the VHS format, which actually won the format war.

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<v Speaker 1>So JVC started off as a Japanese subsidiary to the

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<v Speaker 1>Victor Talking Machine company that was a US based company

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<v Speaker 1>that manufactured phonographs and later became a record label. For

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<v Speaker 1>a while, j v C was actually part of our

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<v Speaker 1>c A, which had purchased Victor and that came along

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<v Speaker 1>with it. But during World War Two, the Japanese part

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<v Speaker 1>of the company split away from the rest of Victor

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<v Speaker 1>and it became its own entity. In nineteen fifty three,

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<v Speaker 1>Matt Sushida purchased a majority stake in that company, and

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<v Speaker 1>so JVC was effectively a subsidiary of Matt Sushida. Now

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<v Speaker 1>this means that the parent company, Matt Sushida, was putting

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<v Speaker 1>forward a competing product against one from a company that

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<v Speaker 1>Matt Sushida also owned, and also that format lost because

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<v Speaker 1>ultimately the VHS format would win over VX and more

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<v Speaker 1>noteworthy opponents like Sony's Betamax. JVC would remain part of

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<v Speaker 1>the Matsushida slash Panasonic empire until the two thousand's. As

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<v Speaker 1>for the VHS style of VCR, Panasonic would develop and

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<v Speaker 1>sell those to great effect. The VX system not so much,

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<v Speaker 1>but VHS that one worked like a treat. In nineteen

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<v Speaker 1>seventy seven, the company released a brand of VCRs called

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<v Speaker 1>mac Lord Masaharu Matsushida, who had traveled to the US

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<v Speaker 1>and form agreements with various consumer electronics companies for VCR components.

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<v Speaker 1>And this was the dawn of the home theater era,

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<v Speaker 1>and so many things would change because of that, including

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<v Speaker 1>the entertainment industry and the rise of the video rental business.

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<v Speaker 1>But more than a format failure, the tumultuous events and

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<v Speaker 1>the global consequences were likely a big burden for the

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<v Speaker 1>executive team at Matsoshida. So perhaps it's not a huge

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<v Speaker 1>surprise that in nineteen seventy seven, just four years after

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<v Speaker 1>becoming chairman, Takaha she announced his retirement. And this is

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<v Speaker 1>where we get another exception to the typical Japanese success plan. Konosuke,

0:14:07.200 --> 0:14:10.360
<v Speaker 1>in his eighties and technically retired but still very much

0:14:10.440 --> 0:14:13.560
<v Speaker 1>calling high level shots, decided that his son in law

0:14:13.600 --> 0:14:17.160
<v Speaker 1>would become the new chairman, but an unlikely candidate would

0:14:17.200 --> 0:14:21.480
<v Speaker 1>become the next president of the company. That candidate was

0:14:21.720 --> 0:14:27.520
<v Speaker 1>Toshihiko Yamashita. He had been part of Matsushida's air conditioning division,

0:14:27.880 --> 0:14:31.960
<v Speaker 1>so he was a cool guy, I'm sorry before he

0:14:32.160 --> 0:14:35.760
<v Speaker 1>came into that role. The division, the air conditioning division

0:14:36.000 --> 0:14:39.360
<v Speaker 1>was struggling, but under Yamashita, it turned around and it

0:14:39.400 --> 0:14:43.240
<v Speaker 1>became the number one brand in the market in Japan. Now,

0:14:43.280 --> 0:14:47.240
<v Speaker 1>out of the twenty six director level executives at Matt

0:14:47.240 --> 0:14:51.040
<v Speaker 1>Sushida at the time, he was number twenty five in seniority.

0:14:51.080 --> 0:14:54.040
<v Speaker 1>There was only one other director who was more junior

0:14:54.080 --> 0:14:57.960
<v Speaker 1>than he. In other words, while he showed initiative and leadership,

0:14:58.080 --> 0:15:00.760
<v Speaker 1>typically you would not expect him to be a candidate

0:15:00.840 --> 0:15:04.000
<v Speaker 1>for the president of the company. That role would usually

0:15:04.000 --> 0:15:07.600
<v Speaker 1>go to someone who had much more seniority than he did.

0:15:08.000 --> 0:15:13.080
<v Speaker 1>But on January tenth, nineteen seventy seven, Konosuke Matsushita called

0:15:13.200 --> 0:15:16.560
<v Speaker 1>Yamashita into his office. Kona Suke was eighty two years

0:15:16.600 --> 0:15:19.400
<v Speaker 1>old at this point and he had been retired from

0:15:19.440 --> 0:15:22.680
<v Speaker 1>Matt Sushida for four years, but he was clearly still

0:15:23.040 --> 0:15:25.840
<v Speaker 1>calling or at least influencing, the shots at the company.

0:15:26.160 --> 0:15:29.240
<v Speaker 1>Yamashita wrote in his autobiography that he had no idea

0:15:29.320 --> 0:15:30.880
<v Speaker 1>what the meeting was going to be about. He was

0:15:30.880 --> 0:15:33.400
<v Speaker 1>actually really nervous about it, and he says that when

0:15:33.480 --> 0:15:37.080
<v Speaker 1>Kona Suke offered him the position of president, no one

0:15:37.280 --> 0:15:41.560
<v Speaker 1>was more surprised than Yamashita himself. But is that true.

0:15:42.080 --> 0:15:45.520
<v Speaker 1>We'll find out when we come back after these brief messages.

0:15:53.320 --> 0:15:56.120
<v Speaker 1>So that last bit that I mentioned before the break,

0:15:56.160 --> 0:15:59.120
<v Speaker 1>that Yamashita was the most surprised when it came to

0:15:59.240 --> 0:16:01.600
<v Speaker 1>the fact that Kona Suke had decided to offer him

0:16:01.640 --> 0:16:04.840
<v Speaker 1>the position of president of the company, that's actually debatable.

0:16:05.320 --> 0:16:08.920
<v Speaker 1>When news broke that Yamashita would become president and Masa

0:16:09.080 --> 0:16:13.200
<v Speaker 1>Haru would become the next chairman, the press pounced on

0:16:13.400 --> 0:16:16.760
<v Speaker 1>this and they called it the Yamashita Leap, which was

0:16:16.840 --> 0:16:21.240
<v Speaker 1>a sly reference to a different Yamashita. Haru Hiu Yamashita.

0:16:21.280 --> 0:16:23.400
<v Speaker 1>He was a gymnast who won a gold medal in

0:16:23.480 --> 0:16:27.560
<v Speaker 1>the nineteen sixty four Olympics. More than a few analysts

0:16:27.720 --> 0:16:30.640
<v Speaker 1>predicted that this would turn out to be a bad move,

0:16:30.760 --> 0:16:34.400
<v Speaker 1>that Yamashita was not senior level enough to really be

0:16:34.600 --> 0:16:37.960
<v Speaker 1>the proper leader. As Barakona Suke, he saw that the

0:16:38.000 --> 0:16:42.600
<v Speaker 1>company he founded had grown into a really enormous organization,

0:16:43.080 --> 0:16:46.000
<v Speaker 1>and he had also seen that other companies that went

0:16:46.080 --> 0:16:49.760
<v Speaker 1>through this process often struggled or they would even collapse

0:16:49.920 --> 0:16:52.760
<v Speaker 1>under their own weight. Even companies in the United States

0:16:52.960 --> 0:16:56.200
<v Speaker 1>where he had been so impressed during his tours, he

0:16:56.320 --> 0:16:58.800
<v Speaker 1>wanted to learn from the mistakes of others and avoid

0:16:58.840 --> 0:17:02.560
<v Speaker 1>the problems that often come along with explosive growth. Together,

0:17:02.880 --> 0:17:05.440
<v Speaker 1>he and Yamasheeta identified that the company had really just

0:17:05.640 --> 0:17:09.359
<v Speaker 1>grown too complacent. That while the electronics market in Japan

0:17:09.720 --> 0:17:13.280
<v Speaker 1>was different than years past, the lagging sales could not

0:17:13.560 --> 0:17:19.360
<v Speaker 1>all be blamed on market saturation or maturity, or economic recession. Rather,

0:17:19.440 --> 0:17:22.880
<v Speaker 1>they concluded that the company itself just wasn't innovating enough

0:17:23.040 --> 0:17:26.560
<v Speaker 1>or listening to customers as much as it should. Yamasheeta

0:17:26.760 --> 0:17:30.760
<v Speaker 1>definitely shook things up. He felt that the managerial levels

0:17:30.800 --> 0:17:33.159
<v Speaker 1>in the company were overlapping too much, and so he

0:17:33.200 --> 0:17:38.680
<v Speaker 1>actually eliminated an entire management level in order to remove redundancy.

0:17:39.119 --> 0:17:42.720
<v Speaker 1>He also encouraged employees who felt stagnant to switch to

0:17:42.840 --> 0:17:46.560
<v Speaker 1>a different division and thus bring new perspectives and approaches

0:17:46.640 --> 0:17:50.320
<v Speaker 1>to their new coworkers. He also gained a reputation for

0:17:50.400 --> 0:17:54.320
<v Speaker 1>trusting the divisional business decisions to the executive management teams

0:17:54.440 --> 0:17:57.719
<v Speaker 1>at the head of each division. He would only occasionally

0:17:57.840 --> 0:18:01.040
<v Speaker 1>step in himself and direct things, and when you did

0:18:01.160 --> 0:18:04.520
<v Speaker 1>step in, it could be more than a little disruptive. So,

0:18:04.600 --> 0:18:08.560
<v Speaker 1>for example, there was a time when Yamashita essentially made

0:18:08.600 --> 0:18:11.480
<v Speaker 1>a promise to our c A that Panasonic would create

0:18:11.600 --> 0:18:15.359
<v Speaker 1>a four hour long VHS tape, and at the time,

0:18:15.520 --> 0:18:19.040
<v Speaker 1>the internal teams at Matsushida had not yet even made

0:18:19.160 --> 0:18:22.240
<v Speaker 1>a two hour tape. But a promise is a promise,

0:18:22.440 --> 0:18:26.280
<v Speaker 1>and so their teams got to work feverishly tackling engineering

0:18:26.400 --> 0:18:29.639
<v Speaker 1>challenges and ultimately producing the four hour tape, and that

0:18:29.720 --> 0:18:31.800
<v Speaker 1>would go on to be one of the big successes

0:18:31.880 --> 0:18:35.359
<v Speaker 1>for the company at this time because customers loved having

0:18:35.440 --> 0:18:38.840
<v Speaker 1>that much tape to be able to record stuff. While

0:18:38.880 --> 0:18:42.320
<v Speaker 1>matt Sushida slash Panasonic was briefly in the business of

0:18:42.400 --> 0:18:46.720
<v Speaker 1>designing mainframe computers in the nineteen sixties, that environment was

0:18:46.800 --> 0:18:49.399
<v Speaker 1>a little too competitive and Kona Suke had decided to

0:18:49.520 --> 0:18:53.480
<v Speaker 1>withdraw from the computer industry. Yamasheeda took another look at

0:18:53.480 --> 0:18:55.879
<v Speaker 1>the field and decided that the main frame business was

0:18:55.960 --> 0:18:58.760
<v Speaker 1>still too competitive and it was also starting to peter out.

0:18:58.800 --> 0:19:02.000
<v Speaker 1>There was a transition moving toward many computers and then

0:19:02.080 --> 0:19:05.520
<v Speaker 1>micro computers, and so he decided that the company should

0:19:05.600 --> 0:19:08.720
<v Speaker 1>still be in the business, but not in mainframes. He

0:19:08.760 --> 0:19:12.480
<v Speaker 1>wanted to get into the semiconductor business. One of the

0:19:12.560 --> 0:19:16.760
<v Speaker 1>big procedural changes that happened under Yamashida's leadership was in

0:19:16.840 --> 0:19:20.360
<v Speaker 1>the way that the company would lay out its plans.

0:19:21.200 --> 0:19:25.280
<v Speaker 1>Had been creating year long plans for the company, but

0:19:25.560 --> 0:19:28.760
<v Speaker 1>they were finding that the volatility and markets, and the

0:19:28.920 --> 0:19:33.239
<v Speaker 1>various challenges and trade agreements for international trade, as well

0:19:33.320 --> 0:19:38.240
<v Speaker 1>as the fluctuations and currency value often meant that a

0:19:38.359 --> 0:19:42.800
<v Speaker 1>year long plan could easily be disruptive by a few changes.

0:19:43.040 --> 0:19:45.680
<v Speaker 1>It just was too hard to stay on track. He

0:19:45.720 --> 0:19:49.560
<v Speaker 1>gets sidetracked too quickly. So instead, Yamashida and his team

0:19:49.960 --> 0:19:53.119
<v Speaker 1>laid out a three year plan, and that gave them

0:19:53.240 --> 0:19:56.159
<v Speaker 1>enough room to allow for some volatility. Things could go

0:19:56.200 --> 0:19:59.600
<v Speaker 1>a little you know, Las Vegas crazy style for a while.

0:20:00.160 --> 0:20:02.800
<v Speaker 1>Then they could settle down. And if you have three

0:20:02.960 --> 0:20:05.720
<v Speaker 1>years to achieve a goal, even if it's a more

0:20:05.760 --> 0:20:09.480
<v Speaker 1>ambitious goal than a year long goal, and it gave

0:20:09.560 --> 0:20:12.200
<v Speaker 1>you more of a chance for success. This was all

0:20:12.359 --> 0:20:16.119
<v Speaker 1>in an attempt to be more proactive rather than reactive.

0:20:16.520 --> 0:20:18.359
<v Speaker 1>And the reason I bring this up is that we

0:20:18.440 --> 0:20:23.399
<v Speaker 1>often see tech companies, and honestly companies in all industries

0:20:23.920 --> 0:20:29.560
<v Speaker 1>give a fanatical dedication toward short term gains, and sometimes

0:20:29.800 --> 0:20:33.280
<v Speaker 1>that's at the cost of long term success. You could argue,

0:20:33.640 --> 0:20:36.760
<v Speaker 1>and I certainly have argued, that this is kind of

0:20:36.880 --> 0:20:40.280
<v Speaker 1>tied with the business strategy of catering all your decisions

0:20:40.320 --> 0:20:44.680
<v Speaker 1>in some way around returning value to shareholders, which is

0:20:44.720 --> 0:20:47.480
<v Speaker 1>a strategy I'm not terribly fond of because it frequently

0:20:48.000 --> 0:20:51.280
<v Speaker 1>isn't great for anyone in the long term, and it

0:20:51.400 --> 0:20:55.480
<v Speaker 1>really feeds into stuff like speculation, which is not generally

0:20:55.520 --> 0:20:59.399
<v Speaker 1>a good thing. In two, Panasonic was one of the

0:20:59.600 --> 0:21:03.159
<v Speaker 1>first companies to develop a compact disc player. Now, the

0:21:03.280 --> 0:21:05.520
<v Speaker 1>history of the CD actually dates all the way back

0:21:05.520 --> 0:21:08.560
<v Speaker 1>to the nineteen sixties, and mostly in the nineteen seventies.

0:21:09.000 --> 0:21:13.080
<v Speaker 1>Sony and Phillips were both independently developing this technology in

0:21:13.240 --> 0:21:17.240
<v Speaker 1>the seventies, but then ultimately they would join forces Vultron

0:21:17.440 --> 0:21:20.600
<v Speaker 1>style in order to further refine the technology and to

0:21:20.800 --> 0:21:23.920
<v Speaker 1>establish standards. That would be important as it would help

0:21:24.000 --> 0:21:28.359
<v Speaker 1>sidestep the issue of competing and incompatible formats on the market.

0:21:28.840 --> 0:21:31.680
<v Speaker 1>That's something that tends to be a great frustration to

0:21:31.760 --> 0:21:35.160
<v Speaker 1>consumers because there's nothing like going out and buying something

0:21:35.280 --> 0:21:37.760
<v Speaker 1>that's going to run on some form of media player

0:21:38.280 --> 0:21:40.920
<v Speaker 1>and find out that, oh, the media player you have

0:21:41.560 --> 0:21:45.040
<v Speaker 1>isn't compatible with the media you bought. That's a terrible

0:21:45.160 --> 0:21:48.040
<v Speaker 1>feeling and it does happen, so they wanted to get

0:21:48.080 --> 0:21:51.520
<v Speaker 1>around that. So once again, Panasonic did not have a

0:21:51.680 --> 0:21:55.080
<v Speaker 1>leadership role in the development of this technology, but the

0:21:55.160 --> 0:21:58.000
<v Speaker 1>company was able to build out a CD player and

0:21:58.119 --> 0:22:01.120
<v Speaker 1>launch it in two when player has first started hitting

0:22:01.160 --> 0:22:05.040
<v Speaker 1>the market. However, this does mean I should probably talk

0:22:05.200 --> 0:22:08.440
<v Speaker 1>a bit about how compact discs work, since I've done

0:22:08.480 --> 0:22:11.639
<v Speaker 1>that for magnetic storage in this series. And if you

0:22:11.760 --> 0:22:16.760
<v Speaker 1>look at a standard one sided compact disc, you'll likely

0:22:16.880 --> 0:22:19.920
<v Speaker 1>see some sort of label on one side and the

0:22:20.000 --> 0:22:22.800
<v Speaker 1>other side will be really shiny, almost like a mirror,

0:22:23.440 --> 0:22:25.760
<v Speaker 1>and you put the disc in a player label side

0:22:25.840 --> 0:22:29.280
<v Speaker 1>up or a CD drive and then the magic happens.

0:22:29.359 --> 0:22:32.800
<v Speaker 1>But how is the data actually stored on the disk. Well,

0:22:32.840 --> 0:22:36.040
<v Speaker 1>in this case, this is not a magnetic system. It's

0:22:36.040 --> 0:22:39.320
<v Speaker 1>an optical system. That means that this is a system

0:22:39.359 --> 0:22:42.960
<v Speaker 1>that uses light and optics like mirrors and lenses to

0:22:43.280 --> 0:22:48.240
<v Speaker 1>encode and decode information. It's also a digital format, not

0:22:48.560 --> 0:22:52.359
<v Speaker 1>an analog format. So let's start by talking about a

0:22:52.400 --> 0:22:56.280
<v Speaker 1>blank CD as nothing stored on that glossy side. When

0:22:56.320 --> 0:22:59.680
<v Speaker 1>a machine writes to c D, it uses a powerful

0:22:59.760 --> 0:23:04.000
<v Speaker 1>lazy or to carve out tiny indentations in a spiral

0:23:04.359 --> 0:23:07.600
<v Speaker 1>on that c D. The spiral actually starts near the

0:23:07.760 --> 0:23:09.840
<v Speaker 1>center of the c D, So this is kind of

0:23:10.000 --> 0:23:12.800
<v Speaker 1>the opposite of how a vinyl record works, where you

0:23:12.840 --> 0:23:15.639
<v Speaker 1>would set a needle toward the outer edge of the

0:23:15.720 --> 0:23:19.400
<v Speaker 1>record and the needle would spiral inward. So what you're

0:23:19.480 --> 0:23:22.119
<v Speaker 1>left with are if you were to look at this

0:23:22.240 --> 0:23:26.840
<v Speaker 1>under a microscope, you'd see a series of reflective surfaces

0:23:27.040 --> 0:23:30.960
<v Speaker 1>on that CD as well as some little bumps, and

0:23:31.640 --> 0:23:35.680
<v Speaker 1>those represent ones and zeros, respectively. A reflective segment is

0:23:35.720 --> 0:23:39.200
<v Speaker 1>called a land that would be a one, and a

0:23:39.359 --> 0:23:42.040
<v Speaker 1>bump is called a pit that would be a zero.

0:23:42.119 --> 0:23:43.960
<v Speaker 1>So why is a bump called a pit? Well, it

0:23:44.000 --> 0:23:45.720
<v Speaker 1>all depends on how you're looking at the c D.

0:23:46.280 --> 0:23:48.879
<v Speaker 1>You look at the CD one way, you're looking at bumps.

0:23:49.240 --> 0:23:51.119
<v Speaker 1>You turn the c D and you look at it

0:23:51.160 --> 0:23:55.119
<v Speaker 1>a different way. You're looking at pits. And this is

0:23:55.240 --> 0:24:00.400
<v Speaker 1>binary information ones and zeros, So that's a binary unit.

0:24:01.000 --> 0:24:03.680
<v Speaker 1>You can think of this like a series of light switches,

0:24:03.760 --> 0:24:06.399
<v Speaker 1>where one is a switch in the on position. And

0:24:06.600 --> 0:24:10.399
<v Speaker 1>zeros in the switch in an off position. Using lots

0:24:10.480 --> 0:24:13.639
<v Speaker 1>of bits, like millions of them, you can describe all

0:24:13.680 --> 0:24:17.159
<v Speaker 1>sorts of stuff, including audio. So this brings us to

0:24:17.359 --> 0:24:21.720
<v Speaker 1>digital versus analog, and analog recording is a record of

0:24:21.800 --> 0:24:26.000
<v Speaker 1>a continuous input signal, but a digital recording is more

0:24:26.119 --> 0:24:30.320
<v Speaker 1>like a very detailed description of an original input. So

0:24:30.440 --> 0:24:32.440
<v Speaker 1>in a way, we can think of an analogy in

0:24:32.520 --> 0:24:36.680
<v Speaker 1>which an analog signal is a script from a play.

0:24:36.960 --> 0:24:40.080
<v Speaker 1>It's got all the stage directions in it, character and descriptions,

0:24:40.160 --> 0:24:43.879
<v Speaker 1>it's got all the dialogue in it. Everything's in the script,

0:24:44.480 --> 0:24:48.399
<v Speaker 1>But a digital signal is more like someone goes to

0:24:48.520 --> 0:24:52.000
<v Speaker 1>the play and takes very detailed notes of everything they

0:24:52.119 --> 0:24:55.560
<v Speaker 1>see and hear, and so they create as best a

0:24:55.640 --> 0:24:59.439
<v Speaker 1>description of the play as they possibly can. So digital

0:24:59.520 --> 0:25:04.119
<v Speaker 1>recording describe stuff like audio by breaking it down, So

0:25:04.320 --> 0:25:06.560
<v Speaker 1>they might break it down into things like pitch and

0:25:06.800 --> 0:25:12.160
<v Speaker 1>loudness and other values that can be expressed as bits. Moreover,

0:25:12.640 --> 0:25:15.200
<v Speaker 1>there's also a concert we have to talk about called

0:25:15.280 --> 0:25:19.879
<v Speaker 1>a sample rate. This describes how frequently every second the

0:25:19.960 --> 0:25:23.560
<v Speaker 1>system is analyzing this signal in an effort to describe it.

0:25:23.840 --> 0:25:27.080
<v Speaker 1>Higher sample rates require a lot more data, but they

0:25:27.160 --> 0:25:31.359
<v Speaker 1>also result in a more faithful representation of the original sound.

0:25:31.840 --> 0:25:34.480
<v Speaker 1>So to go back to our play analogy, let's say

0:25:34.480 --> 0:25:37.960
<v Speaker 1>we've got two digital like observers, so this is two

0:25:38.080 --> 0:25:41.800
<v Speaker 1>note takers. But our two note takers aren't able to

0:25:41.920 --> 0:25:44.480
<v Speaker 1>just sit in the theater the whole time. They actually

0:25:44.560 --> 0:25:47.040
<v Speaker 1>have to duck in and out. So one of the

0:25:47.200 --> 0:25:50.880
<v Speaker 1>two observers is allowed to jump in every thirty seconds

0:25:50.960 --> 0:25:52.800
<v Speaker 1>and they can stick around for a few seconds and

0:25:52.920 --> 0:25:54.440
<v Speaker 1>jot down all the notes, and then they have to

0:25:54.840 --> 0:25:57.560
<v Speaker 1>duck back out until the next thirty seconds comes around.

0:25:58.240 --> 0:26:01.560
<v Speaker 1>The other one can only go win every five minutes

0:26:02.000 --> 0:26:04.239
<v Speaker 1>for a few seconds at a time and take very

0:26:04.560 --> 0:26:06.400
<v Speaker 1>detailed notes, but then they have to leave and wait

0:26:06.480 --> 0:26:10.680
<v Speaker 1>another five minutes. At the end of this very strange experience,

0:26:11.080 --> 0:26:14.440
<v Speaker 1>the one who ducked in more frequently will probably have

0:26:14.680 --> 0:26:17.200
<v Speaker 1>a better understanding of what was going on in the

0:26:17.280 --> 0:26:20.119
<v Speaker 1>play from moment to moment. And that's kind of like

0:26:20.640 --> 0:26:24.720
<v Speaker 1>sample rates. The more frequently you sample, the more accurate

0:26:24.960 --> 0:26:29.800
<v Speaker 1>the copy is to the original, you know, performance. When

0:26:29.840 --> 0:26:32.840
<v Speaker 1>you put a CD into a player, the player uses

0:26:32.920 --> 0:26:35.680
<v Speaker 1>a laser to read the c D. This is not

0:26:35.880 --> 0:26:38.040
<v Speaker 1>as powerful a laser as the one that was used

0:26:38.080 --> 0:26:39.920
<v Speaker 1>to write to the c D in the first place.

0:26:40.359 --> 0:26:43.000
<v Speaker 1>And you need a laser because you have to focus

0:26:43.560 --> 0:26:46.640
<v Speaker 1>a very fine beam of light to pick up these

0:26:46.800 --> 0:26:51.480
<v Speaker 1>pits and lands on the c D. A sensor registers

0:26:51.600 --> 0:26:54.600
<v Speaker 1>the zeros and ones, and the Dakota takes the information

0:26:54.720 --> 0:26:57.760
<v Speaker 1>and turns it into something meaningful that can be sent to,

0:26:58.280 --> 0:27:02.199
<v Speaker 1>you know, amplifiers and speakers. So CDs are very different

0:27:02.520 --> 0:27:05.760
<v Speaker 1>from stuff like magnetic tape. They also are not affected

0:27:05.840 --> 0:27:09.919
<v Speaker 1>by magnets, whereas you can wipe out recording on tape

0:27:10.000 --> 0:27:12.360
<v Speaker 1>if you bring that tape too close to a really

0:27:12.440 --> 0:27:17.400
<v Speaker 1>powerful magnet. However, because CDs rely on light, it means

0:27:17.520 --> 0:27:20.600
<v Speaker 1>that if you get any scratches or dirt or smudges

0:27:21.200 --> 0:27:24.040
<v Speaker 1>on the reflective side of a c D, it causes

0:27:24.119 --> 0:27:27.480
<v Speaker 1>problems because the laser won't be able to effectively read

0:27:27.560 --> 0:27:30.800
<v Speaker 1>those pits and lands on that side of the disk.

0:27:31.560 --> 0:27:33.480
<v Speaker 1>There's a lot more I could go into, such as

0:27:33.520 --> 0:27:37.000
<v Speaker 1>how rewrite herble CDs work, but we're gonna leave off

0:27:37.080 --> 0:27:39.000
<v Speaker 1>of this for now and carry on with our history.

0:27:39.680 --> 0:27:43.520
<v Speaker 1>CD players were really expensive when they first debuted. In fact,

0:27:43.640 --> 0:27:46.800
<v Speaker 1>I didn't get my first CD player until maybe the

0:27:46.960 --> 0:27:50.320
<v Speaker 1>early nineteen nineties, and even then it was a little

0:27:50.480 --> 0:27:54.920
<v Speaker 1>portable CD player unit. But eventually the CD would overtake

0:27:55.000 --> 0:27:59.040
<v Speaker 1>and largely replace other formats like cassette tapes and vinyl records,

0:27:59.440 --> 0:28:03.280
<v Speaker 1>and it all would launch endless arguments among audio files

0:28:03.359 --> 0:28:06.879
<v Speaker 1>about whether a digital recording can ever match the fidelity

0:28:07.000 --> 0:28:09.919
<v Speaker 1>of an analog recording, and I'll just back away from

0:28:09.960 --> 0:28:14.119
<v Speaker 1>that particular hornets nest. By the mid nineteen eighties, international

0:28:14.240 --> 0:28:18.439
<v Speaker 1>trade agreements were putting the squeeze on Japan. Yamashida agreed

0:28:18.480 --> 0:28:22.400
<v Speaker 1>to resign his position as president, becoming an executive advisor,

0:28:22.720 --> 0:28:24.760
<v Speaker 1>and the new president of the company was a man

0:28:24.840 --> 0:28:27.720
<v Speaker 1>who had played a fundamental part in the most recent

0:28:27.840 --> 0:28:32.280
<v Speaker 1>three year strategic planning phase. His name was Akio Tony.

0:28:33.040 --> 0:28:36.159
<v Speaker 1>Tani defined four areas that the company would focus on

0:28:36.400 --> 0:28:42.560
<v Speaker 1>semiconductors the next generation and audio visual electronics, automated manufacturing equipment,

0:28:42.880 --> 0:28:46.840
<v Speaker 1>and communications equipment like cell phones and stuff. He also

0:28:46.920 --> 0:28:51.040
<v Speaker 1>expanded the sales department and he specialized them, and in

0:28:51.880 --> 0:28:56.200
<v Speaker 1>seven he introduced a concept to the company called human Electronics,

0:28:56.680 --> 0:28:58.560
<v Speaker 1>which I thought at first met they were going to

0:28:58.680 --> 0:29:02.320
<v Speaker 1>make cyborgs, and I got really excited, but no. What

0:29:02.480 --> 0:29:05.400
<v Speaker 1>he meant by that was a product design process that

0:29:05.440 --> 0:29:08.280
<v Speaker 1>would pay more attention to what people needed and wanted

0:29:08.760 --> 0:29:11.720
<v Speaker 1>and less on being flashy or throwing in features just

0:29:11.960 --> 0:29:16.120
<v Speaker 1>to have them included in the product. In seven, the

0:29:16.200 --> 0:29:19.840
<v Speaker 1>company established its first manufacturing facility in China. The new

0:29:19.920 --> 0:29:23.720
<v Speaker 1>facility would make CRT s or cathode ray tubes. These

0:29:23.760 --> 0:29:26.520
<v Speaker 1>were used in television's at the time, though it wouldn't

0:29:26.560 --> 0:29:28.800
<v Speaker 1>be much longer before the industry would kind of move

0:29:28.840 --> 0:29:33.080
<v Speaker 1>away from CRT television's toward other options like l C

0:29:33.240 --> 0:29:37.160
<v Speaker 1>D s and plasma TVs. Also in night seven, Tani

0:29:37.240 --> 0:29:41.000
<v Speaker 1>announced that the Matt Sushida Electrical Industrial Company and the

0:29:41.040 --> 0:29:45.800
<v Speaker 1>Matt Sushida Electric Trading Company, which technically were two separate entities,

0:29:46.160 --> 0:29:48.880
<v Speaker 1>would consolidate in a merger. And this was all part

0:29:48.920 --> 0:29:51.840
<v Speaker 1>of the strategy to step up the international sales in

0:29:51.880 --> 0:29:54.000
<v Speaker 1>the company, and part of this was to try and

0:29:54.080 --> 0:29:58.959
<v Speaker 1>overcome increasingly challenging obstacles that came with intense trade disagreements

0:29:59.000 --> 0:30:03.320
<v Speaker 1>between Japan and other nations. Japanese companies, as a general rule,

0:30:03.680 --> 0:30:07.239
<v Speaker 1>we're finding it challenging to export goods, and so they

0:30:07.280 --> 0:30:10.840
<v Speaker 1>began to establish branches in other countries where they could

0:30:10.880 --> 0:30:14.560
<v Speaker 1>have manufacturing facilities and sales teams there who worked on

0:30:14.640 --> 0:30:17.040
<v Speaker 1>a more local level that would get around some of

0:30:17.080 --> 0:30:21.920
<v Speaker 1>those pesky trade obstacles. All right, we're gonna blast through

0:30:22.080 --> 0:30:25.680
<v Speaker 1>the rest of the history of this company very very shortly,

0:30:25.920 --> 0:30:38.440
<v Speaker 1>but first let's take another quick break. On April nine,

0:30:38.760 --> 0:30:43.920
<v Speaker 1>Kona Suke Matsushida, the founder of Matsushida slash Panasonic, passed

0:30:43.960 --> 0:30:47.720
<v Speaker 1>away at the age of ninety four. Even after his

0:30:47.840 --> 0:30:50.840
<v Speaker 1>retirement in the nineteen seventies, he had continued to play

0:30:50.920 --> 0:30:53.600
<v Speaker 1>an important role in directing the course of the company

0:30:53.680 --> 0:30:56.960
<v Speaker 1>he had founded. He had a rather lauded reputation in

0:30:57.040 --> 0:31:00.320
<v Speaker 1>the company and in Japan. Though we can't nor the

0:31:00.400 --> 0:31:02.640
<v Speaker 1>fact that his company also got involved in some fairly

0:31:02.760 --> 0:31:07.720
<v Speaker 1>questionable activities involving price fixing and unfair competitive practices. Still,

0:31:08.160 --> 0:31:13.160
<v Speaker 1>he legitimately established a global company from extremely humble beginnings,

0:31:13.320 --> 0:31:17.400
<v Speaker 1>so you can't ignore that in nineteen nine, matts Ashida

0:31:17.480 --> 0:31:21.760
<v Speaker 1>slash Panasonic made what in retrospect you could call a

0:31:22.000 --> 0:31:26.240
<v Speaker 1>bone headed mistake. The company, eager to keep up with

0:31:26.400 --> 0:31:30.040
<v Speaker 1>their major competitor, Sony sort of the Darth Vader, to

0:31:30.160 --> 0:31:35.160
<v Speaker 1>panasonicx Luke Skywalker decided to get into the content business

0:31:35.320 --> 0:31:40.800
<v Speaker 1>the entertainment industry. Sony had acquired Columbia Pictures Entertainment in

0:31:40.920 --> 0:31:44.720
<v Speaker 1>nine and fun fact, that company had previously been owned

0:31:44.920 --> 0:31:49.960
<v Speaker 1>by Coca Cola. Because companies are weird. The movie business

0:31:50.280 --> 0:31:53.840
<v Speaker 1>is super weird, and there was this crazy idea of

0:31:54.040 --> 0:31:59.320
<v Speaker 1>synergy that really made more sense and concept than an execution.

0:31:59.480 --> 0:32:03.720
<v Speaker 1>But to keep up with Sony, Panasonic went and acquired

0:32:03.800 --> 0:32:07.760
<v Speaker 1>a different entertainment company, m c A. M c A

0:32:08.240 --> 0:32:12.600
<v Speaker 1>and I mean the company, not the Beastie Boy started

0:32:12.640 --> 0:32:15.840
<v Speaker 1>out as the Music Corporation of America that had been

0:32:15.920 --> 0:32:20.400
<v Speaker 1>founded in nineteen twenty four. Over the years, uh it

0:32:20.640 --> 0:32:22.800
<v Speaker 1>changed a great deal. When it first started, it was

0:32:22.880 --> 0:32:26.360
<v Speaker 1>a talent agency, but by it had become a fully

0:32:26.440 --> 0:32:31.440
<v Speaker 1>fledged entertainment company complete with movie and music and television studios.

0:32:32.080 --> 0:32:35.120
<v Speaker 1>In fact, it was the owner of Universal Studios. The

0:32:35.280 --> 0:32:38.560
<v Speaker 1>deal amounted to somewhere between six point six and seven

0:32:38.640 --> 0:32:42.160
<v Speaker 1>point five billion dollars. It all depends on which source

0:32:42.240 --> 0:32:47.040
<v Speaker 1>you're looking at. The love affair between Matsushida and Hollywood

0:32:47.600 --> 0:32:50.760
<v Speaker 1>didn't last very long. In fact, you could cynically joke

0:32:50.880 --> 0:32:53.560
<v Speaker 1>that it was on par for Hollywood marriages in general.

0:32:54.040 --> 0:32:57.720
<v Speaker 1>Mattsshida would sell off eighty percent of its steak in

0:32:57.920 --> 0:33:01.360
<v Speaker 1>m c A just five years years after the acquisition.

0:33:03.400 --> 0:33:08.640
<v Speaker 1>And here's another crazy thing. Seagram was the buyer. Yeah, Seagram,

0:33:08.920 --> 0:33:12.880
<v Speaker 1>the whiskey company. Seagram would turn around in two thousand

0:33:13.160 --> 0:33:16.880
<v Speaker 1>and sell off its stake to Vivendi, and then Vivendi

0:33:16.920 --> 0:33:20.160
<v Speaker 1>would ultimately purchase the remaining interest in m c A

0:33:20.560 --> 0:33:23.920
<v Speaker 1>that was still held by Matt Sushida in two thousand six.

0:33:24.480 --> 0:33:28.200
<v Speaker 1>So ultimately two thousand six is when Matt Sushida completely

0:33:28.320 --> 0:33:31.880
<v Speaker 1>got out of the entertainment industry business. Now, the time

0:33:31.960 --> 0:33:35.640
<v Speaker 1>that Matt Sushida owned m c A was turbulent. There

0:33:35.680 --> 0:33:39.640
<v Speaker 1>were stories of executive level disputes, and the company struggled

0:33:39.680 --> 0:33:43.480
<v Speaker 1>with low profits. The movie business was far more volatile

0:33:43.720 --> 0:33:47.880
<v Speaker 1>than the electronics company had anticipated, and it certainly was

0:33:47.960 --> 0:33:50.640
<v Speaker 1>more volatile than they cared for, and it was a

0:33:50.720 --> 0:33:52.920
<v Speaker 1>really a bad fit from the start. It pointed to

0:33:53.000 --> 0:33:57.520
<v Speaker 1>the danger of diversifying your business without real strategy behind

0:33:57.680 --> 0:34:01.560
<v Speaker 1>the diversification. It's it's one thing to make sure you're

0:34:01.640 --> 0:34:05.840
<v Speaker 1>not completely dependent upon one business, but it's another to

0:34:05.960 --> 0:34:09.560
<v Speaker 1>just grab any business that happens to be nearby, and

0:34:09.880 --> 0:34:14.640
<v Speaker 1>ultimately Mattsoshida paid for this. Upon selling their steak, the

0:34:14.719 --> 0:34:19.319
<v Speaker 1>company brought in five five billion yen, but it had

0:34:19.400 --> 0:34:24.759
<v Speaker 1>purchased m c A for eight hundred fifty billion yen,

0:34:25.400 --> 0:34:27.799
<v Speaker 1>and the value of m c A actually went up

0:34:28.280 --> 0:34:31.080
<v Speaker 1>during its tenure as part of Matt Sushida if you

0:34:31.160 --> 0:34:34.240
<v Speaker 1>look at it from a dollar value, but the value

0:34:34.280 --> 0:34:37.279
<v Speaker 1>of the yen changed dramatically in that same span of time,

0:34:37.560 --> 0:34:41.880
<v Speaker 1>so overall it became a loss, but back to very quickly.

0:34:42.200 --> 0:34:46.080
<v Speaker 1>That's also when Panasonic released the panic Com Pro note

0:34:46.520 --> 0:34:50.319
<v Speaker 1>This was the first notebook computer Panasonic ever released. If

0:34:50.360 --> 0:34:51.919
<v Speaker 1>you look at a picture of the thing, it's really

0:34:52.080 --> 0:34:54.719
<v Speaker 1>chunky looking. It's one of those big laptops that you

0:34:54.760 --> 0:34:57.560
<v Speaker 1>probably wouldn't actually want to have on your lap. Panasonic

0:34:57.680 --> 0:35:00.200
<v Speaker 1>also introduced a cellular phone called the mo of a

0:35:00.360 --> 0:35:04.520
<v Speaker 1>P the following year, and a rewriteable optical disc recorder

0:35:04.800 --> 0:35:07.000
<v Speaker 1>that this was more of an industrial thing, not a

0:35:07.440 --> 0:35:13.000
<v Speaker 1>home electronics thing. That also came out in ninety three.

0:35:13.520 --> 0:35:17.719
<v Speaker 1>After many decades of partnership Matt Sushida and Phillips, the

0:35:17.840 --> 0:35:22.240
<v Speaker 1>Dutch electronics company called it quits. Panasonic purchased the stake

0:35:22.400 --> 0:35:27.120
<v Speaker 1>that Phillips owned in Mattsshida Electronics Corporation, which was again

0:35:27.320 --> 0:35:30.360
<v Speaker 1>about thirty five percent of the ownership of the company,

0:35:30.640 --> 0:35:33.440
<v Speaker 1>and they did it for a hundred eighty five billion yen.

0:35:33.960 --> 0:35:37.640
<v Speaker 1>The two companies did agree to a cross patent licensing deal,

0:35:38.160 --> 0:35:41.239
<v Speaker 1>so it's not like there were hard feelings. Also, this

0:35:41.400 --> 0:35:45.960
<v Speaker 1>gets into how Panasonic is more nebulous than as a

0:35:46.080 --> 0:35:49.279
<v Speaker 1>single entity. It's really a lot of different companies that

0:35:49.400 --> 0:35:52.800
<v Speaker 1>are all related to one another, some having ownership and

0:35:52.920 --> 0:35:55.600
<v Speaker 1>other companies in the group. But the more I looked

0:35:55.640 --> 0:35:58.040
<v Speaker 1>into it so I could try and explain it, though

0:35:58.160 --> 0:36:00.279
<v Speaker 1>more I was convinced that I'm just not had out

0:36:00.320 --> 0:36:03.320
<v Speaker 1>for that level of madness. It's why I really like

0:36:03.440 --> 0:36:07.799
<v Speaker 1>describing technology. Technology either works or it doesn't work. There's

0:36:07.800 --> 0:36:10.920
<v Speaker 1>not a lot of ambiguity there. Corporate structures and governance

0:36:11.000 --> 0:36:13.520
<v Speaker 1>though that stuff, I mean, you might as well call

0:36:13.560 --> 0:36:17.279
<v Speaker 1>it magic to me. Anyway. Japan was going through an

0:36:17.360 --> 0:36:21.640
<v Speaker 1>economic recession in ninety three and Panasonic was hurting. President

0:36:21.719 --> 0:36:27.080
<v Speaker 1>Audio Tani facing pressure with Panasonic's poor performance, particularly from

0:36:27.280 --> 0:36:31.200
<v Speaker 1>Chairman Masaharu Matsushida, who is still in charge of that point,

0:36:31.280 --> 0:36:34.640
<v Speaker 1>This is by the way uh Konoski's son in law,

0:36:35.560 --> 0:36:39.000
<v Speaker 1>so Tani would resign his position and his replacement was

0:36:39.120 --> 0:36:44.200
<v Speaker 1>Yoichi Morishita. And Morishida, unlike his predecessors, was not someone

0:36:44.640 --> 0:36:47.800
<v Speaker 1>that had studied under Konosuke. He he was not a

0:36:49.239 --> 0:36:52.239
<v Speaker 1>candidate that had been groomed by the founder. He would

0:36:52.280 --> 0:36:54.719
<v Speaker 1>go through the process of trying to shed some of

0:36:54.800 --> 0:36:59.240
<v Speaker 1>the bloat that the Matsushida Company had accumulated, including selling

0:36:59.320 --> 0:37:04.000
<v Speaker 1>off that stake in m C a in. During his tenure,

0:37:04.320 --> 0:37:07.200
<v Speaker 1>the company also got into the business of digital television

0:37:07.280 --> 0:37:12.399
<v Speaker 1>sets and DVD players, navigation systems, plasma TVs, which would

0:37:12.440 --> 0:37:14.880
<v Speaker 1>kind of come back to haunt them, and more. The

0:37:14.960 --> 0:37:18.120
<v Speaker 1>Panasonic brand became more popular in the US, though the

0:37:18.160 --> 0:37:21.480
<v Speaker 1>company had not yet launched a defining technology the way

0:37:21.560 --> 0:37:24.360
<v Speaker 1>Sony had done was say the Walkman. A lot of

0:37:24.640 --> 0:37:28.520
<v Speaker 1>Morishida's work was in course corrections and attempts to return

0:37:28.560 --> 0:37:32.440
<v Speaker 1>to profitability. In Japan, it was still a struggle. In

0:37:32.640 --> 0:37:37.680
<v Speaker 1>nineteen nine, for example, the company's operating profit fell eighteen percent,

0:37:37.840 --> 0:37:41.520
<v Speaker 1>which is not good. We get another big change in

0:37:41.680 --> 0:37:47.560
<v Speaker 1>leadership in two thousand, Chairman Masaharu Matsushida retired that essentially

0:37:47.800 --> 0:37:52.879
<v Speaker 1>ended the Matsoshida domination of the company. Yoichi Motorshita would

0:37:52.880 --> 0:37:55.320
<v Speaker 1>become the new chairman of the company, and there was

0:37:55.640 --> 0:38:00.360
<v Speaker 1>talk originally of Konosuke's grandson, Masayuki Matsushita takeing over the

0:38:00.360 --> 0:38:03.520
<v Speaker 1>position of president, but the board of directors had concerns

0:38:03.600 --> 0:38:07.320
<v Speaker 1>that perhaps Masayuki lacked the leadership qualities that they wanted,

0:38:07.960 --> 0:38:09.799
<v Speaker 1>and that maybe it was a better idea to move

0:38:09.840 --> 0:38:13.640
<v Speaker 1>away from the Matsushida dynasty, so instead they chose the

0:38:13.760 --> 0:38:18.759
<v Speaker 1>former CEO of Matsushida Electric Corporation of America, Kunio Nakamota.

0:38:19.440 --> 0:38:23.880
<v Speaker 1>Nakamotora had a huge challenge. At this point, Matsushida slash

0:38:23.920 --> 0:38:28.640
<v Speaker 1>Panasonic had become truly gargantuan in Japan alone. The company

0:38:28.719 --> 0:38:32.120
<v Speaker 1>had one hundred forty divisions, and like a lot of

0:38:32.200 --> 0:38:36.239
<v Speaker 1>bigger companies grown haphazardly, there was a lot of redundancy.

0:38:36.600 --> 0:38:40.120
<v Speaker 1>There was a lot of bureaucracy. It was becoming increasingly difficult,

0:38:40.200 --> 0:38:43.279
<v Speaker 1>if not impossible, to operate the company in a nimble way,

0:38:43.719 --> 0:38:46.400
<v Speaker 1>so he needed to simplify things quite a bit. He

0:38:46.520 --> 0:38:50.280
<v Speaker 1>also made some controversial decisions within the company. For example,

0:38:50.400 --> 0:38:53.800
<v Speaker 1>he pulled design decisions away from engineering teams and he

0:38:53.920 --> 0:38:56.400
<v Speaker 1>gave them to marketing teams. And the idea was that

0:38:56.600 --> 0:39:00.280
<v Speaker 1>engineers were reluctant to jump onto new things or apt

0:39:00.360 --> 0:39:03.600
<v Speaker 1>to current trends. They were more comfortable doing things the

0:39:03.640 --> 0:39:06.640
<v Speaker 1>way they had done them, whereas the marketing team knew

0:39:06.680 --> 0:39:09.719
<v Speaker 1>what customers were looking for. And I feel a little

0:39:09.800 --> 0:39:12.839
<v Speaker 1>conflicted about this because I've seen what can happen when

0:39:12.920 --> 0:39:16.560
<v Speaker 1>marketing teams have a lot of say and things that

0:39:16.719 --> 0:39:20.960
<v Speaker 1>does not always go well. But at the time, Matsushida

0:39:21.080 --> 0:39:24.279
<v Speaker 1>was really starting to lag behind other electronics companies, so

0:39:24.600 --> 0:39:29.000
<v Speaker 1>it was probably a needed change there. Under Nakamura, more

0:39:29.239 --> 0:39:34.439
<v Speaker 1>younger executives and more women executives got opportunities. Nakamura said

0:39:34.520 --> 0:39:37.359
<v Speaker 1>that he wanted to reward performance and hard work over

0:39:37.440 --> 0:39:40.759
<v Speaker 1>stuff like seniority or title. At the same time, he

0:39:40.920 --> 0:39:44.080
<v Speaker 1>made some pretty drastic cuts to the company. He oversaw

0:39:44.160 --> 0:39:47.399
<v Speaker 1>the closing of thirty factories in Japan, which was nearly

0:39:47.480 --> 0:39:50.680
<v Speaker 1>a quarter of all the company's production facilities there. He

0:39:50.920 --> 0:39:55.600
<v Speaker 1>oversaw layoffs, some thirteen thousand layoffs, and he sold off

0:39:55.640 --> 0:39:58.160
<v Speaker 1>a lot of company assets that he saw as being

0:39:58.520 --> 0:40:01.560
<v Speaker 1>kind of unnecessary and di acting and this was all

0:40:01.640 --> 0:40:05.560
<v Speaker 1>within his first year as president. The electronics market was

0:40:05.680 --> 0:40:08.400
<v Speaker 1>not doing so hot at the time, and even with

0:40:08.600 --> 0:40:11.640
<v Speaker 1>all those changes, Nakamura was kind of swimming against a

0:40:11.840 --> 0:40:14.719
<v Speaker 1>very strong current. He pushed the company to get into

0:40:14.800 --> 0:40:18.239
<v Speaker 1>more service industries kind of offset the declining demand for

0:40:18.440 --> 0:40:21.520
<v Speaker 1>physical products. But by two thousand two, the company had

0:40:21.520 --> 0:40:26.520
<v Speaker 1>posted its first actual loss, not just a fall in profits,

0:40:26.560 --> 0:40:30.319
<v Speaker 1>but I mean an actual loss, Like the company lost money,

0:40:30.360 --> 0:40:32.319
<v Speaker 1>and it was a doozy. It's not a little bit

0:40:32.360 --> 0:40:37.399
<v Speaker 1>of money. It was three point four billion dollars. Nakamura, however,

0:40:37.560 --> 0:40:40.520
<v Speaker 1>just kept making changes. He spun off five group companies

0:40:40.600 --> 0:40:44.800
<v Speaker 1>to become full subsidiaries. Panasonic would retain ownership of the companies,

0:40:44.880 --> 0:40:47.600
<v Speaker 1>but they would be able to operate much more independently.

0:40:48.080 --> 0:40:51.560
<v Speaker 1>By two thousand three, the extensive changes were starting to

0:40:51.640 --> 0:40:55.040
<v Speaker 1>show results, with Panasonic gaming the lead as the largest

0:40:55.160 --> 0:40:59.640
<v Speaker 1>consumer electronics company. Profits went from having a total loss

0:40:59.680 --> 0:41:04.080
<v Speaker 1>into thousand two to a seven hundred seventeen million dollar

0:41:04.200 --> 0:41:08.520
<v Speaker 1>profit in two thousand three. Several divisions became leaders in

0:41:08.640 --> 0:41:13.160
<v Speaker 1>the market, including Panasonic Thin Plasma Television's Boy. That was

0:41:14.560 --> 0:41:17.120
<v Speaker 1>a great victory for the time, but they would come

0:41:17.160 --> 0:41:19.440
<v Speaker 1>back to bite them. In two thousand six, we get

0:41:19.480 --> 0:41:22.680
<v Speaker 1>another change. Nakamura would become the chairman of the company,

0:41:23.080 --> 0:41:25.960
<v Speaker 1>you know, once again moving from president to chairman, and

0:41:26.200 --> 0:41:30.600
<v Speaker 1>Fumio Altsuba, former managing director, would become the new president

0:41:30.719 --> 0:41:34.759
<v Speaker 1>of the company. That same year, Matsushida planned to spin

0:41:34.840 --> 0:41:39.399
<v Speaker 1>off JVC. They sold it to Kinwood Corporation. That would

0:41:39.440 --> 0:41:42.279
<v Speaker 1>take about two years for it to complete, and the

0:41:42.360 --> 0:41:45.520
<v Speaker 1>company once again came under scrutiny along with several other

0:41:45.600 --> 0:41:49.520
<v Speaker 1>electronics companies, and not just in Japan, there were other

0:41:49.600 --> 0:41:51.959
<v Speaker 1>ones as well. But the charge was that a large

0:41:52.080 --> 0:41:55.080
<v Speaker 1>number of these companies, Panasonic included, we're part of a

0:41:55.200 --> 0:41:58.600
<v Speaker 1>cartel that was controlling the price of liquid crystal displays

0:41:58.680 --> 0:42:01.239
<v Speaker 1>or l c d s. So not that different from

0:42:01.520 --> 0:42:04.480
<v Speaker 1>previous charges that have been leveled against Panasonic back in

0:42:04.560 --> 0:42:09.440
<v Speaker 1>the nineteen sixties. The European Union would find Panasonic guilty

0:42:09.520 --> 0:42:13.320
<v Speaker 1>of this and along with five other firms, the companies

0:42:13.400 --> 0:42:16.240
<v Speaker 1>were ordered to pay a very large fine. The total

0:42:16.360 --> 0:42:21.120
<v Speaker 1>fine was around one point nine billion dollars, but Panasonics

0:42:21.360 --> 0:42:24.400
<v Speaker 1>share was a relatively small one fifty seven and a

0:42:24.520 --> 0:42:29.640
<v Speaker 1>half million euros. And in two thousand eight we finally

0:42:29.719 --> 0:42:32.920
<v Speaker 1>get to the moment where Matt Sushida officially changed its

0:42:33.040 --> 0:42:36.640
<v Speaker 1>name to Panasonic, and the company was no longer under

0:42:36.680 --> 0:42:39.160
<v Speaker 1>the direction of the Mattsshida family for the most part,

0:42:39.280 --> 0:42:41.800
<v Speaker 1>and the Panasonic brand was far better known in the

0:42:41.920 --> 0:42:45.360
<v Speaker 1>United States than Matt Sushida was, so it made sense.

0:42:45.719 --> 0:42:50.200
<v Speaker 1>In two thousand nine, Panasonic acquired Sanyo Electric Company, turning

0:42:50.239 --> 0:42:52.680
<v Speaker 1>it into a subsidiary. And if you've been listening to

0:42:52.800 --> 0:42:56.080
<v Speaker 1>this series from the beginning, you might remember that Sanio

0:42:56.320 --> 0:43:00.719
<v Speaker 1>was actually founded by Konosuke Matsushida's brother in law, uh

0:43:01.040 --> 0:43:04.279
<v Speaker 1>He had worked for the Matsushida company, but then left

0:43:04.360 --> 0:43:07.440
<v Speaker 1>the company after the US government began to get involved

0:43:07.560 --> 0:43:11.840
<v Speaker 1>after World War Two. For decades, Sano had actually competed

0:43:12.040 --> 0:43:15.359
<v Speaker 1>in some of the same markets as Panasonic, but now

0:43:15.520 --> 0:43:19.719
<v Speaker 1>the two companies were coming together. While Panasonic built upon

0:43:19.840 --> 0:43:23.160
<v Speaker 1>its name recognition, it also was making big cuts. In

0:43:23.200 --> 0:43:25.880
<v Speaker 1>two thousand eleven, the company announced it would cut around

0:43:26.120 --> 0:43:31.160
<v Speaker 1>forty thousand jobs in an effort to eliminate redundancy, improve efficiency,

0:43:31.760 --> 0:43:34.120
<v Speaker 1>and to deal with some massive losses that were once

0:43:34.160 --> 0:43:37.880
<v Speaker 1>again mounting. In two thousand twelve, Otsubo stepped up to

0:43:38.040 --> 0:43:42.160
<v Speaker 1>the position of chairman and Nakamura would become an executive advisor,

0:43:42.480 --> 0:43:46.320
<v Speaker 1>and the new president of the company was Katsuhira Suga,

0:43:47.280 --> 0:43:49.720
<v Speaker 1>and he actually remains the president of the company today,

0:43:50.239 --> 0:43:53.840
<v Speaker 1>although Otsuba would not be chairman for very long in

0:43:54.800 --> 0:43:59.560
<v Speaker 1>he was replaced by Shusaku Naga, and Shusaku is still

0:44:00.080 --> 0:44:03.160
<v Speaker 1>and to this day. Panasonic has had to deal with

0:44:03.360 --> 0:44:06.920
<v Speaker 1>more than a few instances of allegations that the company

0:44:07.000 --> 0:44:11.520
<v Speaker 1>has been engaged in price fixing, collusion, and corruption over

0:44:11.560 --> 0:44:15.120
<v Speaker 1>the last few years. The avionics division has been under

0:44:15.160 --> 0:44:19.080
<v Speaker 1>scrutiny for that, the Automotive Systems Corporation with under scrutiny

0:44:19.160 --> 0:44:22.640
<v Speaker 1>for that, and the company has had a few cases

0:44:22.680 --> 0:44:25.560
<v Speaker 1>pop up that point to it attempting to fix the

0:44:25.719 --> 0:44:28.520
<v Speaker 1>game in one way or another. Whether or not that

0:44:28.920 --> 0:44:32.240
<v Speaker 1>was the knowledge of the top levels of the company

0:44:32.680 --> 0:44:35.560
<v Speaker 1>is another matter, but certainly divisions of the company have

0:44:35.760 --> 0:44:38.439
<v Speaker 1>come under suspicion a few times in the past few years.

0:44:38.760 --> 0:44:41.600
<v Speaker 1>In addition, the story that tends to go with each

0:44:41.719 --> 0:44:46.160
<v Speaker 1>incoming president is how that president is charged with saving

0:44:46.320 --> 0:44:50.120
<v Speaker 1>Pana Sonic. It's interesting to hear how each president comes

0:44:50.160 --> 0:44:52.360
<v Speaker 1>in and they're supposed to try and save the company

0:44:53.080 --> 0:44:55.880
<v Speaker 1>that's not a great narrative. You would prefer to build

0:44:56.000 --> 0:44:58.520
<v Speaker 1>on success rather than have to be known as someone

0:44:58.560 --> 0:45:00.920
<v Speaker 1>who's correcting the course of a compan the one of

0:45:01.000 --> 0:45:05.400
<v Speaker 1>Suga's priorities was getting Panasonic out of producing plasma televisions.

0:45:05.920 --> 0:45:08.040
<v Speaker 1>That was an example of him saving the company because

0:45:08.560 --> 0:45:10.880
<v Speaker 1>consumers had already moved on they were more interested in

0:45:11.080 --> 0:45:13.080
<v Speaker 1>l C D t vs, l E ED t vs.

0:45:13.600 --> 0:45:18.960
<v Speaker 1>But Panasonic had invested billions of dollars in producing plasma sets,

0:45:19.280 --> 0:45:21.719
<v Speaker 1>so this was not an easy decision. But it was

0:45:21.800 --> 0:45:24.520
<v Speaker 1>clear that trying to sell plasma sets in the world

0:45:24.560 --> 0:45:28.600
<v Speaker 1>that just wasn't interested in them was ultimately a losing proposition,

0:45:29.200 --> 0:45:32.120
<v Speaker 1>and Suga really did have a tough job ahead of him.

0:45:32.200 --> 0:45:35.200
<v Speaker 1>The year before he became president, Panasonic had posted a

0:45:35.440 --> 0:45:40.200
<v Speaker 1>monumental loss of nine point eight billion dollars. Now, to

0:45:40.320 --> 0:45:44.320
<v Speaker 1>be fair, Panasonic wasn't the only Japanese electronics company to

0:45:44.480 --> 0:45:48.120
<v Speaker 1>post massive losses around that time. Others were doing the same,

0:45:48.239 --> 0:45:51.959
<v Speaker 1>like Sony, and that has led to a conversation about

0:45:52.000 --> 0:45:55.920
<v Speaker 1>whether or not Japanese companies in general are too reliant

0:45:56.040 --> 0:46:01.200
<v Speaker 1>upon tradition and they're not capable of responding more quickly

0:46:01.520 --> 0:46:04.960
<v Speaker 1>to a changing market. But honestly, that's a discussion that

0:46:05.000 --> 0:46:09.200
<v Speaker 1>would require more investigation in a few future episode. Maybe

0:46:10.280 --> 0:46:13.239
<v Speaker 1>the thing to remember now is that Panasonic is a

0:46:13.400 --> 0:46:17.600
<v Speaker 1>truly huge company with lots of divisions, only a few

0:46:17.680 --> 0:46:21.239
<v Speaker 1>of which are related to consumer electronics. So people like

0:46:21.400 --> 0:46:24.120
<v Speaker 1>me who associate Panasonic with that we're only seeing a

0:46:24.160 --> 0:46:27.040
<v Speaker 1>small slice of the overall company. All of this grew

0:46:27.080 --> 0:46:30.359
<v Speaker 1>out of the work of a humble electrician who made

0:46:30.480 --> 0:46:35.200
<v Speaker 1>light sockets out of a little office that was in

0:46:35.760 --> 0:46:40.880
<v Speaker 1>a dirt floor building back in That to me is

0:46:40.960 --> 0:46:45.319
<v Speaker 1>truly phenomenal, and that wraps up the Panasonic story so far.

0:46:46.400 --> 0:46:48.200
<v Speaker 1>There are a lot of elements I didn't go into

0:46:48.280 --> 0:46:51.480
<v Speaker 1>deep detail about. Obviously, if I had, we would have

0:46:51.640 --> 0:46:54.919
<v Speaker 1>been stretching onto like seven or eight episodes. But I'll

0:46:55.000 --> 0:46:58.880
<v Speaker 1>probably have future episodes that look into stuff that relate

0:46:59.000 --> 0:47:03.160
<v Speaker 1>back to these, whether they're directly about Panasonic or Panasonic

0:47:03.480 --> 0:47:07.000
<v Speaker 1>plays a part in the story that remains to be seen.

0:47:07.640 --> 0:47:10.320
<v Speaker 1>But in the meantime, if you guys have suggestions for

0:47:10.440 --> 0:47:13.480
<v Speaker 1>future topics I should cover in tech stuff, whether it's

0:47:13.520 --> 0:47:17.720
<v Speaker 1>a technology, a trend in tech company, a person, whatever

0:47:17.800 --> 0:47:19.719
<v Speaker 1>it may be, if it's related to tech let me know.

0:47:20.320 --> 0:47:23.720
<v Speaker 1>Reach out on Twitter. The handle is tech stuff hs

0:47:23.920 --> 0:47:32.879
<v Speaker 1>W and I'll talk to you again really soon. Text

0:47:32.880 --> 0:47:36.319
<v Speaker 1>Stuff is an I Heart Radio production. For more podcasts

0:47:36.360 --> 0:47:39.120
<v Speaker 1>from my Heart Radio, visit the i Heart Radio app,

0:47:39.280 --> 0:47:42.400
<v Speaker 1>Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.