1 00:00:00,320 --> 00:00:03,760 Speaker 1: Here's to the great American settlers. The millions of you 2 00:00:03,840 --> 00:00:07,320 Speaker 1: have settled for unsatisfying jobs because they pay the bills. 3 00:00:07,840 --> 00:00:10,440 Speaker 1: Of course, there is something else you could do. If 4 00:00:10,440 --> 00:00:14,280 Speaker 1: you've got something to say. Start a podcast with Spreaker 5 00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:17,919 Speaker 1: from my Heart and unleash your creative freedom, maybe even 6 00:00:17,960 --> 00:00:20,959 Speaker 1: earn enough money to one day tell your old bus hey, 7 00:00:21,040 --> 00:00:26,560 Speaker 1: I'm no settler, I'm an explorer. Spreaker dot com, spr 8 00:00:26,800 --> 00:00:32,199 Speaker 1: e a k E R A salon over Today executive 9 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:36,280 Speaker 1: producer Harris Hilton brings back the hit podcast How Men Think, 10 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:39,199 Speaker 1: and that's good news for anyone that is confused by men, 11 00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:43,600 Speaker 1: which is basically everyone. It's real talk, straight from the source. 12 00:00:43,880 --> 00:00:46,680 Speaker 1: How Men Think podcast is exactly what we need to 13 00:00:46,680 --> 00:00:49,360 Speaker 1: figure them out. It's going to be fun and formative 14 00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:53,000 Speaker 1: and probably a bit scary at times because we're literally 15 00:00:53,040 --> 00:00:56,000 Speaker 1: going inside the minds of men. Listen to How Men 16 00:00:56,080 --> 00:00:59,200 Speaker 1: Think on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or 17 00:00:59,240 --> 00:01:03,840 Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts. When I was eighteen years old, 18 00:01:04,160 --> 00:01:07,800 Speaker 1: a nun at my high school was brutally murdered. Getting 19 00:01:07,800 --> 00:01:10,840 Speaker 1: to the Truth has opened to Pandora's box of secrets, 20 00:01:10,880 --> 00:01:14,479 Speaker 1: exposing abuse of power and a World of Lies at 21 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:19,039 Speaker 1: one Miami monastery. I mean, the worm will stabbed by 22 00:01:19,120 --> 00:01:23,039 Speaker 1: plus times. There's got to be something else going on here. 23 00:01:25,240 --> 00:01:27,800 Speaker 1: Listen to Sacred Scandal on the I Heart Radio app, 24 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:34,920 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to 25 00:01:35,000 --> 00:01:41,800 Speaker 1: Behind the Police, a production of I Heart Radio. Welcome 26 00:01:41,840 --> 00:01:45,880 Speaker 1: back to Behind the Police, Behind the Bastard's special mini 27 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:50,400 Speaker 1: series about you know, the police in America. Uh, some 28 00:01:50,520 --> 00:01:53,840 Speaker 1: of the most persistent bastards in our nation's long and 29 00:01:53,880 --> 00:01:58,960 Speaker 1: bastardful history. I'm Robert Evans Uh, the host and the 30 00:01:59,160 --> 00:02:02,960 Speaker 1: researcher and writer, and my guest today is Jason Petty, 31 00:02:03,160 --> 00:02:06,440 Speaker 1: better known as hip hop artist Propaganda prop How are 32 00:02:06,440 --> 00:02:09,400 Speaker 1: you doing today? What Up? What Up? What up? Socially 33 00:02:09,440 --> 00:02:13,480 Speaker 1: and emotionally prepared for this train? Did you like how 34 00:02:13,520 --> 00:02:16,840 Speaker 1: professional my introduction was? That was some NPR ship. Here's 35 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:20,639 Speaker 1: the thing, bro, like you're you are unmatched in intros 36 00:02:20,760 --> 00:02:24,919 Speaker 1: and transitions. There's nothing like this. I want to be 37 00:02:25,360 --> 00:02:30,280 Speaker 1: the voice. I want to retrain yourself talk voice and 38 00:02:30,360 --> 00:02:34,880 Speaker 1: just continue to say you nailed it even when you didn't, 39 00:02:35,040 --> 00:02:39,200 Speaker 1: just even when I didn't, beautiful. I will continue to 40 00:02:39,200 --> 00:02:42,040 Speaker 1: point out when you suck it up and praise you 41 00:02:42,080 --> 00:02:45,240 Speaker 1: when you don't like now, wonderful intro, Robert, very professional, 42 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:47,480 Speaker 1: thank you, thank you, way better than that time I 43 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:51,640 Speaker 1: just shouted Hitler. That was that was a train wreck. Yeah, 44 00:02:51,680 --> 00:02:55,080 Speaker 1: I don't know what to do with that one. Have 45 00:02:55,160 --> 00:02:58,840 Speaker 1: you ever walked by like a wall of chords and 46 00:02:58,919 --> 00:03:02,799 Speaker 1: just felt then like I'm going, especially like that stage 47 00:03:02,840 --> 00:03:08,480 Speaker 1: somewhere in festivals, Yes, no, or like I'm gonna yank 48 00:03:08,520 --> 00:03:10,760 Speaker 1: them all out. It's gonna happen, and it's like I'm 49 00:03:10,840 --> 00:03:14,720 Speaker 1: holding my hand away, like I I can't be backstage. 50 00:03:14,720 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 1: I'm ann yank one of these out. I feel like 51 00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:17,960 Speaker 1: that was like you and like the Hitler thing to 52 00:03:17,960 --> 00:03:20,200 Speaker 1: where you're just like, yeah, don't say it, don't say it, 53 00:03:20,240 --> 00:03:22,359 Speaker 1: don't say it. Oh my god, I want to say. Yeah. 54 00:03:22,600 --> 00:03:25,000 Speaker 1: You can't script an introduction, right, like that's the first 55 00:03:25,080 --> 00:03:27,960 Speaker 1: rule of of of broadcast as you can never script 56 00:03:27,960 --> 00:03:32,480 Speaker 1: inn intro, So we're left with me winging it. So Propaly, 57 00:03:32,560 --> 00:03:35,720 Speaker 1: yesterday we talked about the origins of American policing with 58 00:03:35,760 --> 00:03:37,800 Speaker 1: a focus on like the slave patrols, and that is 59 00:03:37,840 --> 00:03:40,960 Speaker 1: the thing like online since kind of this whole uprising 60 00:03:40,960 --> 00:03:42,960 Speaker 1: against the police began. That's the thing everyone's been focusing 61 00:03:43,000 --> 00:03:44,840 Speaker 1: on that, like police came out of slave patrols, and 62 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:47,960 Speaker 1: that is very true for a huge chunk of American policing. 63 00:03:48,160 --> 00:03:50,040 Speaker 1: Today we're going to talk about the other chunk, because 64 00:03:50,040 --> 00:03:53,360 Speaker 1: it was not just slave patrols, Because a sizeable chunk 65 00:03:53,400 --> 00:03:56,560 Speaker 1: of American policing came out of a desire to suppress 66 00:03:56,960 --> 00:03:59,000 Speaker 1: folks number one that we today would call white, but 67 00:03:59,040 --> 00:04:01,560 Speaker 1: at the time of the people with money didn't really 68 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:04,240 Speaker 1: consider to be white. Um. But also more than anything, 69 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:06,480 Speaker 1: it came out of a desire to police labor, like 70 00:04:06,520 --> 00:04:09,080 Speaker 1: the working class. So today we're going to kind of 71 00:04:09,160 --> 00:04:13,040 Speaker 1: hit that other side of the of the where cops 72 00:04:13,080 --> 00:04:19,119 Speaker 1: come from, uh divide. Um. Yeah, there's a lesson in intersectionality, guys, 73 00:04:20,040 --> 00:04:23,080 Speaker 1: it is right now. Yeah. And and like all good 74 00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:27,159 Speaker 1: lessons and intersectionality it comes from it includes uh, people 75 00:04:27,200 --> 00:04:31,480 Speaker 1: being racist when that's directly in the opposition to their 76 00:04:31,839 --> 00:04:37,960 Speaker 1: needs and an actual benefit. Yeah, a deep seated oppression, yeah, 77 00:04:38,279 --> 00:04:40,920 Speaker 1: and an oppression that's taken advantage of by the ruling 78 00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:45,320 Speaker 1: class in order to continue to Yeah. Yeah, yeah, and 79 00:04:45,360 --> 00:04:47,200 Speaker 1: we're going up and off to you know, they free 80 00:04:47,279 --> 00:04:52,320 Speaker 1: up there. You know yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, the North, 81 00:04:52,440 --> 00:04:55,840 Speaker 1: the North. I mean it was better than the Confederacy. 82 00:04:55,920 --> 00:04:59,560 Speaker 1: But that's like saying, yeah, like vomiting in the toilet 83 00:04:59,680 --> 00:05:03,360 Speaker 1: is better than vomiting on your friends floor, which like, yes, 84 00:05:04,279 --> 00:05:09,760 Speaker 1: but it's both are non ideal. Straight. Yeah. So, um, 85 00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:12,440 Speaker 1: you may not know this, but President John Fitzgerald Kennedy 86 00:05:12,480 --> 00:05:16,200 Speaker 1: designated the week of May fifteen to be National Police Week. 87 00:05:16,279 --> 00:05:18,400 Speaker 1: I don't think we celebrated it this year. Yeah. I 88 00:05:18,440 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 1: was like, I've never heard that. Yeah, it must have 89 00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:23,920 Speaker 1: missed that one. Um. During his speech announcing this, he 90 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:26,960 Speaker 1: stated that police officers had been protecting Americans since the 91 00:05:27,080 --> 00:05:30,200 Speaker 1: birth of the United States. Now, we of course know 92 00:05:30,279 --> 00:05:32,800 Speaker 1: that this is untrue. The first formal police department was 93 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:34,919 Speaker 1: started in Boston in eighteen thirty eight. And you know, 94 00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:39,680 Speaker 1: slave patrols existed earlier, but they share weren't protecting people. Now. 95 00:05:39,880 --> 00:05:42,159 Speaker 1: One of the inciting incidents that led to the creation 96 00:05:42,200 --> 00:05:44,560 Speaker 1: of the Boston Police. Um. Who AGAINA, that's the first 97 00:05:44,600 --> 00:05:47,839 Speaker 1: police department was the Broad Street Riot. And the basic 98 00:05:47,880 --> 00:05:50,120 Speaker 1: story of the Broad Street Riot is that a funeral 99 00:05:50,160 --> 00:05:53,720 Speaker 1: procession of Irish immigrants in eighteen thirty seven ran into 100 00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:57,320 Speaker 1: a volunteer firefighting company of US born Protestants who are 101 00:05:57,320 --> 00:05:59,640 Speaker 1: on their way back from fighting a fire. And obviously 102 00:06:00,160 --> 00:06:03,159 Speaker 1: now I think most people just like, oh, you know, 103 00:06:03,160 --> 00:06:05,279 Speaker 1: Protestants and Catholics, they're all just sort of like, you know, 104 00:06:05,400 --> 00:06:08,320 Speaker 1: relatively mainstream Christian denominations. But yeah, it was like it 105 00:06:08,360 --> 00:06:10,520 Speaker 1: was like a huge deal when JFK became the first 106 00:06:10,560 --> 00:06:14,040 Speaker 1: Catholic president. People were like, is he gonna sorry, yeah, 107 00:06:14,040 --> 00:06:15,960 Speaker 1: I was gonna say, yeah, that's how like open to 108 00:06:16,279 --> 00:06:19,440 Speaker 1: diversity and melting pot we are as a country that 109 00:06:19,600 --> 00:06:21,880 Speaker 1: like it was a scandal that this fool was at 110 00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:28,040 Speaker 1: Catholic Yeah. I got like, yo, that's the that's just 111 00:06:28,120 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 1: the other room for the same house. Yeah. Yeah, if 112 00:06:32,320 --> 00:06:34,000 Speaker 1: you really want an idea of like how funked up 113 00:06:34,040 --> 00:06:36,960 Speaker 1: America has been about diversity, Like people were like not 114 00:06:37,040 --> 00:06:38,680 Speaker 1: even a decade away from putting a man on the 115 00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:42,560 Speaker 1: damn moon and JFK came to power and people were like, 116 00:06:42,640 --> 00:06:47,760 Speaker 1: is he going to take secret pope orders? Oh yeah, 117 00:06:47,760 --> 00:06:50,640 Speaker 1: And the news flash to every Protestant was like, you know, 118 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:54,560 Speaker 1: we was all Catholic until five years ago. I don't know, 119 00:06:54,640 --> 00:06:59,040 Speaker 1: you know that, but it was all Catholic. Yeah, uh 120 00:06:59,160 --> 00:07:03,120 Speaker 1: it was it's one so yeah, Um, Catholics and Protestants 121 00:07:03,120 --> 00:07:05,960 Speaker 1: back then had some real issues with one another. So this, 122 00:07:06,120 --> 00:07:09,120 Speaker 1: this Irish funeral procession like runs into the middle of 123 00:07:09,120 --> 00:07:12,000 Speaker 1: this Catholic or a Protestant firefighting company, and the two 124 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:13,800 Speaker 1: just start beating the ship out of each other, and 125 00:07:13,840 --> 00:07:15,880 Speaker 1: all of this spills out into a riot that eventually 126 00:07:15,920 --> 00:07:19,160 Speaker 1: involves one fifth of Boston's population, which is like fifteen 127 00:07:19,160 --> 00:07:23,080 Speaker 1: thousand people, which is still a pretty good sized riot today. Um. Yeah, 128 00:07:23,360 --> 00:07:25,960 Speaker 1: so ethnic tensions being what they were, the riot quickly 129 00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:29,320 Speaker 1: turned into erase riot, and Protestants burned and looted the 130 00:07:29,480 --> 00:07:33,400 Speaker 1: entirety of the heavily Irish Broad Street neighborhood, just like 131 00:07:33,520 --> 00:07:37,320 Speaker 1: Jesus would call him. Yes, he was a big fan 132 00:07:37,400 --> 00:07:40,080 Speaker 1: of burning and looting, just burning, you know, you turned 133 00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:42,360 Speaker 1: that he was like, hey, he flipped over the tables. 134 00:07:42,400 --> 00:07:44,920 Speaker 1: He flipped over the Tipple tables, but those weren't like 135 00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:47,640 Speaker 1: his homies tables anyway. Yeah, and what he didn't he say, 136 00:07:47,640 --> 00:07:49,720 Speaker 1: burned the other cheeks something like that, So I may 137 00:07:49,720 --> 00:07:54,720 Speaker 1: be missing yeah yeah, so yeah, very very taking their 138 00:07:54,760 --> 00:07:58,320 Speaker 1: religion seriously here. Um. So in decades prior um to 139 00:07:58,440 --> 00:08:01,400 Speaker 1: the Broad street riot. Richants had been forced to finance 140 00:08:01,440 --> 00:08:04,040 Speaker 1: their own guards to secure the transportation of their goods. 141 00:08:04,280 --> 00:08:07,080 Speaker 1: Establishing police, which were paid more by the commonwealth shifted 142 00:08:07,080 --> 00:08:10,080 Speaker 1: the burden for protecting capital off of capitalists and onto 143 00:08:10,080 --> 00:08:12,480 Speaker 1: the community. But even prior to the establishment of the 144 00:08:12,520 --> 00:08:15,600 Speaker 1: first police departments, law and order in the United States 145 00:08:15,640 --> 00:08:18,440 Speaker 1: was primarily a for profit endeavor and not a manner 146 00:08:18,480 --> 00:08:21,360 Speaker 1: of public safety. Um, the broad street right was kind 147 00:08:21,360 --> 00:08:23,000 Speaker 1: of used as an excuse for, like, why we need 148 00:08:23,040 --> 00:08:26,040 Speaker 1: a police force. But the tensions had been building, and 149 00:08:26,040 --> 00:08:28,360 Speaker 1: like frustration had been building, like, oh, we gotta pay 150 00:08:28,360 --> 00:08:30,240 Speaker 1: to take care of our own ship from you know, 151 00:08:30,280 --> 00:08:32,160 Speaker 1: the merchant class. So this was kind of an opportunity 152 00:08:32,200 --> 00:08:35,319 Speaker 1: for them to get people on board. Now, as we 153 00:08:35,440 --> 00:08:37,720 Speaker 1: covered in the first episode, most policing in the English 154 00:08:37,720 --> 00:08:40,160 Speaker 1: speaking world prior to the eighteen hundreds was primarily a 155 00:08:40,160 --> 00:08:43,160 Speaker 1: community affair. Enforcement of the law was done by members 156 00:08:43,200 --> 00:08:45,920 Speaker 1: of the community who tended to rotate through shifts keeping 157 00:08:46,040 --> 00:08:49,880 Speaker 1: order in their own towns. Public spirit is generally the 158 00:08:49,960 --> 00:08:51,960 Speaker 1: term used as what was like the primary method of 159 00:08:52,000 --> 00:08:55,800 Speaker 1: social control in those days, rather than centralized authority, And 160 00:08:55,840 --> 00:08:58,079 Speaker 1: that is kind of the thing that like I was 161 00:08:58,120 --> 00:08:59,920 Speaker 1: just in the Seattle Autonomous Ze whatever you want to 162 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:02,240 Speaker 1: hall it, you know, may not be really an autonomous zone. 163 00:09:02,240 --> 00:09:05,199 Speaker 1: I don't think they've actually kind of firmly decided yet 164 00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:08,160 Speaker 1: because the police got back in briefly. But like, public 165 00:09:08,200 --> 00:09:10,600 Speaker 1: spirit is the primary manner of social control there. There's 166 00:09:10,600 --> 00:09:14,120 Speaker 1: no centralized organization, there's no like even mass kind of 167 00:09:14,200 --> 00:09:16,959 Speaker 1: votes because people are so distributed there, but there is 168 00:09:17,040 --> 00:09:18,960 Speaker 1: kind of a broad public spirit of like what if 169 00:09:19,000 --> 00:09:21,400 Speaker 1: we don't have cops here? Right, that's kind of the 170 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:24,600 Speaker 1: ideal idea. Um And that was kind of the way 171 00:09:24,640 --> 00:09:27,280 Speaker 1: that it worked for a very long time, um in 172 00:09:26,920 --> 00:09:31,679 Speaker 1: in particularly like English speaking chunks of the of the world. UM. 173 00:09:32,040 --> 00:09:35,079 Speaker 1: But but not just that. Um. So, yeah, this system 174 00:09:35,080 --> 00:09:37,920 Speaker 1: began to fade out as like, you know, as the 175 00:09:38,080 --> 00:09:41,920 Speaker 1: kind of industrial age dawn, and distinct communities that had 176 00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:44,920 Speaker 1: been like more or less like somewhat isolated at least 177 00:09:45,360 --> 00:09:48,760 Speaker 1: homogenized into cities and sprawling urban areas like now you know, 178 00:09:48,800 --> 00:09:50,440 Speaker 1: we say London, but back in the day it was 179 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:53,040 Speaker 1: like a bunch of towns and then a much smaller London. 180 00:09:53,080 --> 00:09:54,760 Speaker 1: And then as they all turned into like this big 181 00:09:54,800 --> 00:09:59,680 Speaker 1: fucking metropolitan area. Um, this public spirit fades. So historian 182 00:09:59,720 --> 00:10:02,640 Speaker 1: hind Pringle writes that by the seventeen hundreds, the legal 183 00:10:02,679 --> 00:10:05,880 Speaker 1: system had formalized enough that it's architects were quote confident 184 00:10:05,960 --> 00:10:08,520 Speaker 1: that they could by a system of incentives and deterrence, 185 00:10:08,720 --> 00:10:12,320 Speaker 1: rewards and punishments, bribes and threats so exploit human greed 186 00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:14,040 Speaker 1: and fear that there would be no need to look 187 00:10:14,080 --> 00:10:17,520 Speaker 1: for anything so nebulous and unrealistic as humans or as 188 00:10:17,600 --> 00:10:21,480 Speaker 1: public spirit. So that's kind of like the real dawn 189 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:24,800 Speaker 1: of of formalized law enforcement is is things get big 190 00:10:24,880 --> 00:10:26,560 Speaker 1: enough and these people are like public spirit, you can't 191 00:10:26,559 --> 00:10:28,240 Speaker 1: really rely on it to do what I want it 192 00:10:28,320 --> 00:10:30,440 Speaker 1: to do. And I'm the guy with the money, So 193 00:10:30,480 --> 00:10:34,760 Speaker 1: we need to build a system of deterrence and rewards. Yea, yeah, 194 00:10:34,880 --> 00:10:39,880 Speaker 1: it's scans. Yeah, yeah, it's scans. So gradually the yeah, 195 00:10:40,200 --> 00:10:41,839 Speaker 1: it keeps scans. And I was also going to say, 196 00:10:41,880 --> 00:10:49,360 Speaker 1: as a side note, the and I hate I hate 197 00:10:49,360 --> 00:10:53,400 Speaker 1: the very principle of what I'm about to say. Sure, 198 00:10:53,840 --> 00:10:57,280 Speaker 1: but at the old folks in the charts would say 199 00:10:57,320 --> 00:11:06,520 Speaker 1: it's true anyhow. Uh, I absolutely love like the Irish 200 00:11:06,840 --> 00:11:12,880 Speaker 1: like culture just because it's just so irreverent and like 201 00:11:13,400 --> 00:11:18,440 Speaker 1: they just don't take themselves serious. Everything is sarcastic, Yeah, 202 00:11:18,800 --> 00:11:22,360 Speaker 1: drinking and going to sing at parties. And I'm just like, 203 00:11:23,400 --> 00:11:27,160 Speaker 1: it's just it's just your normal slang, like a ball back, 204 00:11:27,240 --> 00:11:29,880 Speaker 1: how you doing, Like you call your homeboy a ball bag. 205 00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:32,800 Speaker 1: That's a scrotum, fam and that's what you refer to 206 00:11:32,840 --> 00:11:35,480 Speaker 1: your friends as you throw to your friends and scrotums 207 00:11:35,800 --> 00:11:39,360 Speaker 1: all ball back And it's like, look, I respect that 208 00:11:40,480 --> 00:11:44,240 Speaker 1: so much. I just so I respect him. They're just 209 00:11:44,280 --> 00:11:47,240 Speaker 1: ready to fight at any moment. Yeah, drink a lot, 210 00:11:47,559 --> 00:11:49,040 Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. And then when you got 211 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:51,800 Speaker 1: to America, you created your own hood, like just the 212 00:11:52,000 --> 00:11:57,640 Speaker 1: South Boston, just southy Irish pissy, don't even don't even 213 00:11:57,640 --> 00:12:00,280 Speaker 1: mess with your like your grandmother ready to scrap. Like 214 00:12:00,480 --> 00:12:05,679 Speaker 1: I respect that so much. Yeah, I love this is 215 00:12:05,720 --> 00:12:09,080 Speaker 1: my favorite place to visit Ireland. I love the like 216 00:12:09,080 --> 00:12:10,880 Speaker 1: what you're talking about, like this idea that even with 217 00:12:10,920 --> 00:12:12,640 Speaker 1: like your elected leaders, like you should kind of be 218 00:12:12,679 --> 00:12:14,599 Speaker 1: able to shout at him, right, That's yeah, there's a 219 00:12:14,600 --> 00:12:16,480 Speaker 1: bit of that in England too, Like this idea that 220 00:12:16,559 --> 00:12:19,200 Speaker 1: like we had a thing here and it happened in 221 00:12:19,240 --> 00:12:21,960 Speaker 1: Minneapolis with Mayor Fray where like he had to go 222 00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:24,040 Speaker 1: out to this crowd and like when he said something 223 00:12:24,080 --> 00:12:26,000 Speaker 1: didn't like this crowd of thousands like told him to 224 00:12:26,000 --> 00:12:28,120 Speaker 1: go the funk home. And we had that in Portland 225 00:12:28,160 --> 00:12:29,760 Speaker 1: with our mayor. Like he showed up in the middle 226 00:12:29,760 --> 00:12:32,320 Speaker 1: of this crowd to take questions and everyone just told him, like, 227 00:12:32,720 --> 00:12:34,600 Speaker 1: you had the cops shoot at us a bunch, and 228 00:12:34,600 --> 00:12:36,400 Speaker 1: we don't like that, and you're a bad mayor. And 229 00:12:36,440 --> 00:12:38,640 Speaker 1: everyone just got to like yell at the mayor. And 230 00:12:38,760 --> 00:12:41,040 Speaker 1: that's how it ought to be with all elected officials. 231 00:12:41,040 --> 00:12:42,400 Speaker 1: They should have to stand in the middle of a 232 00:12:42,400 --> 00:12:45,080 Speaker 1: crowd of their voters and get heckled when they funk up. 233 00:12:45,080 --> 00:12:48,440 Speaker 1: It's it's like, yes, every elected official should have to 234 00:12:48,520 --> 00:12:52,040 Speaker 1: do some sort of like open mic like stand up, 235 00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:56,240 Speaker 1: just dive bar where you have to feel that he dude. 236 00:12:56,440 --> 00:13:00,320 Speaker 1: My first few years of touring, like the he of 237 00:13:00,400 --> 00:13:05,400 Speaker 1: being like, okay, listen, it's it's almost it's it's eight 238 00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:08,680 Speaker 1: fift you know what I'm saying. Everybody's just pregame in 239 00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:11,960 Speaker 1: trying to figure out who they're gonna hit on later, 240 00:13:12,080 --> 00:13:14,080 Speaker 1: and I have to go up and wrap for fifteen 241 00:13:14,080 --> 00:13:16,880 Speaker 1: minutes and try to convince this room to pay attention 242 00:13:16,920 --> 00:13:20,360 Speaker 1: to me for I got ten minutes. Often commissions like 243 00:13:20,679 --> 00:13:23,880 Speaker 1: that is the best school of hard knocks as like 244 00:13:23,920 --> 00:13:27,120 Speaker 1: a live performer that anyone could ever. I feel like 245 00:13:27,240 --> 00:13:31,120 Speaker 1: every mayor should have to do that. Yeah, absolutely, absolutely, 246 00:13:31,160 --> 00:13:34,040 Speaker 1: like this the public the whole public spirit thing. Obviously 247 00:13:34,320 --> 00:13:36,040 Speaker 1: there's a lot of more people now where there's a 248 00:13:36,120 --> 00:13:39,600 Speaker 1: more complexity you need, you need more than just public spirit. 249 00:13:39,679 --> 00:13:41,680 Speaker 1: But this idea that like if everyone just kind of 250 00:13:41,720 --> 00:13:44,199 Speaker 1: hates this dude, like he should have to stand in 251 00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:46,240 Speaker 1: the middle of them and I try to convince them 252 00:13:46,280 --> 00:13:48,720 Speaker 1: that they're wrong or at least just take the fucking 253 00:13:48,760 --> 00:13:51,120 Speaker 1: fire for all right, if you could take that fire 254 00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:53,600 Speaker 1: and or win some of us over, I would be like, 255 00:13:53,640 --> 00:13:55,800 Speaker 1: you know what, Okay, maybe I was wrong, but maybe 256 00:13:55,840 --> 00:13:58,720 Speaker 1: I was wrong about this dude. Yeah yeah, anyway, anyway 257 00:13:58,720 --> 00:14:02,680 Speaker 1: back to the fucking cop so um. Gradually, the profit 258 00:14:02,760 --> 00:14:06,040 Speaker 1: motive became the central motivating force behind law enforcement. So 259 00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:08,920 Speaker 1: kind of public spirit moves aside for we just pay 260 00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:11,880 Speaker 1: people to do this ship um. And the change started 261 00:14:11,920 --> 00:14:15,040 Speaker 1: at the level of the constable. Traditionally, constables had been 262 00:14:15,120 --> 00:14:17,920 Speaker 1: unpaid members of the community who took turns at the job. 263 00:14:18,240 --> 00:14:21,400 Speaker 1: But most citizens came to dislike taking their turn as constable, 264 00:14:21,600 --> 00:14:24,480 Speaker 1: especially since each turn involved a one year, unpaid period 265 00:14:24,520 --> 00:14:27,120 Speaker 1: of working to enforce laws that were often very inpopular 266 00:14:27,280 --> 00:14:31,160 Speaker 1: because there was like centralized state authority. It just there 267 00:14:31,240 --> 00:14:33,960 Speaker 1: wasn't like super organized law enforcements like the king or 268 00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:35,880 Speaker 1: whoever would make like a law that people didn't like, 269 00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:37,680 Speaker 1: and then you would take your turn, and you have 270 00:14:37,720 --> 00:14:40,720 Speaker 1: to enforce that law, and that doesn't make you popular, um, 271 00:14:40,760 --> 00:14:43,600 Speaker 1: which was an issue with the system who was making 272 00:14:43,600 --> 00:14:46,680 Speaker 1: the laws. So over time, deputies began to realize that 273 00:14:46,720 --> 00:14:49,520 Speaker 1: the power of their office held other opportunities for profit. 274 00:14:49,760 --> 00:14:52,280 Speaker 1: According to a paper on the development of private police 275 00:14:52,320 --> 00:14:55,560 Speaker 1: by Stephen Spitzer of Northern Iowa University and Andrew School 276 00:14:55,600 --> 00:14:58,640 Speaker 1: of the University of Pennsylvania, quote once in office, the 277 00:14:58,640 --> 00:15:00,920 Speaker 1: deputies soon found that prof it could be gained from 278 00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:04,600 Speaker 1: selling protective and investigative services or demanding rewards and fees 279 00:15:04,640 --> 00:15:07,640 Speaker 1: in return for recovered goods. Deputies often made such a 280 00:15:07,680 --> 00:15:09,960 Speaker 1: profitable trade of their offices that many were prepared to 281 00:15:10,000 --> 00:15:12,760 Speaker 1: serve for nothing. So this goes from like this ugly 282 00:15:12,880 --> 00:15:14,680 Speaker 1: job that you take because you have to to a 283 00:15:14,800 --> 00:15:16,800 Speaker 1: job that you know because you kind of find a 284 00:15:16,840 --> 00:15:18,600 Speaker 1: way to you kind of find you kind of find 285 00:15:18,880 --> 00:15:22,000 Speaker 1: side hustles in your position allows you to exploit and 286 00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:24,160 Speaker 1: then it it becomes really profitable even though there's not 287 00:15:24,200 --> 00:15:27,120 Speaker 1: a salary for the gig, and so you kind of 288 00:15:27,120 --> 00:15:29,640 Speaker 1: freelance police at this point, right like that's the gig. 289 00:15:30,200 --> 00:15:33,040 Speaker 1: So this suited early local governments in England and her 290 00:15:33,080 --> 00:15:36,280 Speaker 1: colonies pretty well because these these governments and these people's 291 00:15:36,320 --> 00:15:38,680 Speaker 1: like just because of an aspect of the culture, felt 292 00:15:38,680 --> 00:15:40,840 Speaker 1: a deep resistance to the idea of paying for a 293 00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:44,360 Speaker 1: salary and police force. Individual constables who were successful in 294 00:15:44,400 --> 00:15:46,840 Speaker 1: their jobs could sell their services to the highest bidder, 295 00:15:47,000 --> 00:15:50,640 Speaker 1: augmenting their official duties with what was essentially private security work. 296 00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:53,400 Speaker 1: The system made it over to the North American colonies 297 00:15:53,640 --> 00:15:55,880 Speaker 1: during the first decades of the eighteen hundreds. New York 298 00:15:55,920 --> 00:15:59,080 Speaker 1: City police officers were noted as being more quote private 299 00:15:59,200 --> 00:16:02,760 Speaker 1: entrepreneurs in public servants. The same was true in Boston 300 00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:05,640 Speaker 1: before and after the formal establishment of their police department 301 00:16:05,800 --> 00:16:08,440 Speaker 1: Spitzer in school rite quote. Since the main concern of 302 00:16:08,480 --> 00:16:12,160 Speaker 1: the victim was restitution. They function then as personal injury 303 00:16:12,240 --> 00:16:15,520 Speaker 1: lawyers operate today on a contingency basis hoping to get 304 00:16:15,520 --> 00:16:18,440 Speaker 1: a large part, perhaps half of the proceeds. So cops 305 00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:20,880 Speaker 1: would kind of hang around like a like a bad lawyer. 306 00:16:20,920 --> 00:16:22,880 Speaker 1: They would wait to see, Oh, somebody just got robbed, 307 00:16:22,880 --> 00:16:25,240 Speaker 1: somebody just got beaten up, somebody's store got broken into, 308 00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:27,280 Speaker 1: and then they would show up and be like, hey, 309 00:16:27,560 --> 00:16:29,240 Speaker 1: if I get that stuff back and I have half 310 00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:31,480 Speaker 1: of it? Like that was Those were the first cops, 311 00:16:31,600 --> 00:16:33,840 Speaker 1: like in the North and stuff. Yeah, before there's like 312 00:16:33,880 --> 00:16:36,920 Speaker 1: really police departments, you know, so like okay, so when 313 00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:39,600 Speaker 1: you it's so crazy when you think of it in context, 314 00:16:39,680 --> 00:16:42,640 Speaker 1: which is like the best thing to do as somebody 315 00:16:42,640 --> 00:16:45,920 Speaker 1: that really wants to understand humans, it's like, can you 316 00:16:46,000 --> 00:16:49,520 Speaker 1: blame them for being like, you know, maybe maybe we 317 00:16:49,560 --> 00:16:52,600 Speaker 1: should centralize this what if Like yeah, kind of like 318 00:16:52,640 --> 00:16:54,520 Speaker 1: maybe we should come up with some sort of department 319 00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:59,440 Speaker 1: that maybe above this. Yeah that sucks, you know what 320 00:16:59,440 --> 00:17:02,600 Speaker 1: I'm saying. So you're like, it's it's maybe it's I 321 00:17:02,600 --> 00:17:04,840 Speaker 1: don't know, maybe it's a bad, bad idea of the 322 00:17:04,840 --> 00:17:08,040 Speaker 1: way we're doing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's definitely like you 323 00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:10,679 Speaker 1: you you kind of transition away for everybody taking turns 324 00:17:10,680 --> 00:17:13,639 Speaker 1: as the cops to like cops being basically mercenaries and 325 00:17:13,680 --> 00:17:17,480 Speaker 1: people are like mercenaries kind of suck. Got a fan 326 00:17:17,520 --> 00:17:21,440 Speaker 1: of this strike. Two guys like yeah, you know, yeah, 327 00:17:21,560 --> 00:17:24,040 Speaker 1: so it's yes, you're you're absolutely right, Like you can't 328 00:17:24,040 --> 00:17:26,040 Speaker 1: totally blame people for being like, well, what if we 329 00:17:26,080 --> 00:17:28,960 Speaker 1: tried to like make this a more official thing. Yeah, 330 00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:31,800 Speaker 1: like we can identify him and it's not just like 331 00:17:31,920 --> 00:17:34,280 Speaker 1: it's not just like my neighbor Dave down the street 332 00:17:34,359 --> 00:17:36,840 Speaker 1: that I just trust is full Like I don't trust Dave. 333 00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:38,399 Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying. Yeah, you know, it's a 334 00:17:38,440 --> 00:17:42,840 Speaker 1: shady son of a bit. It's kind of shady man. Yeah, yeah, 335 00:17:43,080 --> 00:17:45,560 Speaker 1: so yeah, yeah, this was Yeah. Most police in this 336 00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:49,240 Speaker 1: period worked as actually not even uniformed thugs, um, just 337 00:17:49,320 --> 00:17:52,200 Speaker 1: kind of thugs protecting the businesses and streets that paid them, 338 00:17:52,600 --> 00:17:55,199 Speaker 1: or as private detectives hunting down stolen goods or other 339 00:17:55,240 --> 00:17:58,480 Speaker 1: criminals on a contingency basis. The system provided no real 340 00:17:58,520 --> 00:18:01,399 Speaker 1: benefit for the average person and only marginal benefit for 341 00:18:01,440 --> 00:18:04,280 Speaker 1: the capitol holding class. See this was back before the 342 00:18:04,320 --> 00:18:07,000 Speaker 1: dawn of the industrial economy, and people weren't used to 343 00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:09,040 Speaker 1: the idea of just working all of the time because 344 00:18:09,040 --> 00:18:12,119 Speaker 1: that was their job. Farm labor was seasonal, and skilled 345 00:18:12,200 --> 00:18:14,639 Speaker 1: laborers usually didn't work more than they needed to in 346 00:18:14,720 --> 00:18:17,600 Speaker 1: order to live comfortably. Law enforcement officers kind of work 347 00:18:17,680 --> 00:18:19,520 Speaker 1: the same way. So these people would take enough jobs 348 00:18:19,520 --> 00:18:21,199 Speaker 1: to maintain a decent lifestyle, and then when they had 349 00:18:21,320 --> 00:18:24,000 Speaker 1: enough money, they'd stop working. So suddenly the constably were like, yeah, 350 00:18:24,040 --> 00:18:25,640 Speaker 1: I'm not gonna do anything for the next couple of months. 351 00:18:25,640 --> 00:18:27,760 Speaker 1: Like I'm good. I had a big case, like sorry, 352 00:18:27,800 --> 00:18:30,160 Speaker 1: you need help, but like why would I work right now? 353 00:18:30,160 --> 00:18:31,800 Speaker 1: I don't need to and I'm not gonna work if 354 00:18:31,800 --> 00:18:36,000 Speaker 1: I don't need to. Um. Yeah, So to make matters worse, 355 00:18:36,080 --> 00:18:39,080 Speaker 1: at least for the business owning class. Uh, the way 356 00:18:39,119 --> 00:18:43,400 Speaker 1: bounties were structured actually discouraged police from catching criminals. Historian 357 00:18:43,600 --> 00:18:45,960 Speaker 1: James F. Richardson Rights and his History of the New 358 00:18:46,040 --> 00:18:49,360 Speaker 1: York Police quote the police reports published in the newspapers 359 00:18:49,359 --> 00:18:51,359 Speaker 1: in these years are filled with accounts of instances in 360 00:18:51,400 --> 00:18:53,919 Speaker 1: which the property was returned with financial rewards for the 361 00:18:53,960 --> 00:18:56,720 Speaker 1: police officer, but in which the criminal was not brought 362 00:18:56,720 --> 00:18:59,760 Speaker 1: to justice. The officer received a larger fee or reward 363 00:18:59,800 --> 00:19:02,240 Speaker 1: for covering the stolen property then he would have received 364 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:05,359 Speaker 1: for bringing the criminal in Often the arrangement was consummated 365 00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:08,359 Speaker 1: even before the robbery or burglary took place. An officer 366 00:19:08,400 --> 00:19:10,480 Speaker 1: would be privy to a crime, and after its commission, 367 00:19:10,520 --> 00:19:12,960 Speaker 1: would endeavor to recover the stolen property in return for 368 00:19:13,000 --> 00:19:15,720 Speaker 1: a liberal reward. Part of the reward within go to 369 00:19:15,760 --> 00:19:22,000 Speaker 1: the thief. It's a share. She this is the shadows. 370 00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:25,000 Speaker 1: So like you you need to tell me, by design, 371 00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:28,760 Speaker 1: the cop was crooked, Like just it's just baked into 372 00:19:28,840 --> 00:19:31,840 Speaker 1: the I am instead of like listen to what listen 373 00:19:31,880 --> 00:19:34,760 Speaker 1: what Professor Evans just taught to you. You know what 374 00:19:34,760 --> 00:19:40,240 Speaker 1: I'm saying, I am incentivized to cheat. It is better 375 00:19:40,400 --> 00:19:44,320 Speaker 1: for all of us if I just cheat, and y'all think, 376 00:19:44,520 --> 00:19:47,480 Speaker 1: and that's what's crazy about. Like here's here's what like 377 00:19:47,560 --> 00:19:52,320 Speaker 1: with just just pure unchecked capitalism does to your brain, 378 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:56,080 Speaker 1: is you would think, oh, yeah, it's just it's just competition. 379 00:19:56,160 --> 00:19:58,080 Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying, Like, hey, man, hey dude, 380 00:19:58,280 --> 00:20:01,040 Speaker 1: if you get my stuff back, I just want you 381 00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:02,520 Speaker 1: to know, like I'll pay you more if you get 382 00:20:02,520 --> 00:20:04,159 Speaker 1: my stuff back. You were good at your job. I'm 383 00:20:04,160 --> 00:20:05,720 Speaker 1: just gonna pay you more for it. It's like, well, 384 00:20:06,320 --> 00:20:08,080 Speaker 1: I don't know, man, maybe there's a way I can 385 00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:12,200 Speaker 1: get both. Yeah yeah, yeah, what if I just work 386 00:20:12,280 --> 00:20:14,199 Speaker 1: with the guy that's going to steal your stuff like that, 387 00:20:14,640 --> 00:20:17,879 Speaker 1: the stuff he wants money, Yeah, we all win and 388 00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:20,000 Speaker 1: that situate you got you stuff back. I mean it's money, 389 00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:23,040 Speaker 1: like it just yeah, yeah, yeah, it's great. It's like 390 00:20:23,080 --> 00:20:25,160 Speaker 1: a tax on rich people by I don't know, not 391 00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:28,480 Speaker 1: necessarily poor people. Well maybe the thieves were, but like, yeah, 392 00:20:28,560 --> 00:20:31,760 Speaker 1: that's whatever. So up until the mid eighteen hundreds, policing 393 00:20:31,760 --> 00:20:33,679 Speaker 1: in the cities of the American North had been a 394 00:20:33,720 --> 00:20:37,760 Speaker 1: fundamentally reactive endeavor. Officers went off in response to specific 395 00:20:37,800 --> 00:20:40,600 Speaker 1: criminal acts, rather than seeking to prevent set acts. You know, 396 00:20:40,640 --> 00:20:42,679 Speaker 1: there were some exceptions sometimes people will be like, well, 397 00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:45,080 Speaker 1: let's hire some officers to like watch this neighborhood where 398 00:20:45,119 --> 00:20:47,360 Speaker 1: we have a bunch of shops or whatever. But generally 399 00:20:47,400 --> 00:20:51,000 Speaker 1: it was pretty reactive. Um and as the first major 400 00:20:51,040 --> 00:20:54,280 Speaker 1: metropolitan police departments were established in the eighteen thirties and forties, 401 00:20:54,480 --> 00:20:57,520 Speaker 1: this started to change. These new police departments focused on 402 00:20:57,560 --> 00:21:02,120 Speaker 1: the dangerous classes. You remember here the first episode. Yeah, 403 00:21:02,640 --> 00:21:05,800 Speaker 1: dangerous classes were largely made up of poor immigrants who 404 00:21:05,800 --> 00:21:09,159 Speaker 1: were seen as being fundamentally criminal. The idea began to 405 00:21:09,200 --> 00:21:13,360 Speaker 1: spread that by patrolling, surveilling, and deploying force against these populations, 406 00:21:13,560 --> 00:21:17,480 Speaker 1: police could stop crime from occurring. Now, whether or not 407 00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:20,119 Speaker 1: someone counted as a member of a dangerous class had 408 00:21:20,160 --> 00:21:21,800 Speaker 1: an awful lot to do with whether or not that 409 00:21:21,880 --> 00:21:25,520 Speaker 1: person also counted as white. The full subject of what 410 00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:27,920 Speaker 1: whiteness meant in the North in this period of time 411 00:21:28,040 --> 00:21:30,280 Speaker 1: is much too complicated for series that's already going to 412 00:21:30,280 --> 00:21:32,439 Speaker 1: be complicated. What is important to understand is that a 413 00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:34,119 Speaker 1: lot of groups, again that we all lump in as 414 00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:37,240 Speaker 1: white today, weren't really white yet during the mid eighteen hundreds. 415 00:21:37,320 --> 00:21:40,919 Speaker 1: This included, at varying points, Germans, Italians, Jews of all 416 00:21:41,040 --> 00:21:45,919 Speaker 1: national origins, and of course the Irish. Now again, as 417 00:21:45,960 --> 00:21:48,040 Speaker 1: I noted in the last episode talking about this, is 418 00:21:48,040 --> 00:21:50,680 Speaker 1: is complicated to a fact that a lot of modern racists, 419 00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:53,119 Speaker 1: or at least kind of people who like to deny 420 00:21:53,240 --> 00:21:55,640 Speaker 1: the suffering of black people will claim that like, oh, 421 00:21:55,640 --> 00:21:57,280 Speaker 1: it was it just as bad for the Irish, And 422 00:21:57,320 --> 00:22:00,240 Speaker 1: it absolutely was not, but also anti Irish big treat 423 00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:02,439 Speaker 1: was still a motherfucker, Like there was a lot of 424 00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:05,000 Speaker 1: that going around. No one's yeah it's from from from 425 00:22:05,400 --> 00:22:07,359 Speaker 1: as someone from the black community. I'm like, okay, no 426 00:22:07,359 --> 00:22:12,960 Speaker 1: one's arguing that the Irish who are not not treated unfairly. 427 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:15,800 Speaker 1: It was they went through. It's not come on, it's 428 00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:20,199 Speaker 1: it was not the same. It's like, you know, I like, 429 00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:25,879 Speaker 1: I am ade, you know, sis gender heterosexual male. And 430 00:22:27,320 --> 00:22:32,000 Speaker 1: when my wife got pregnant, no part of me said 431 00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:36,960 Speaker 1: we're pregnant. Yeah, that's just like I can't stand when 432 00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:39,600 Speaker 1: husbands say that, yo, we're pregnant. I'm like, nigga, no, 433 00:22:39,800 --> 00:22:43,479 Speaker 1: we're not. You you understand what I'm saying. She is 434 00:22:43,520 --> 00:22:45,280 Speaker 1: doing it while I'm in there with her, and you 435 00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:50,240 Speaker 1: know you are not. I remember standing on the side 436 00:22:50,280 --> 00:22:52,800 Speaker 1: of the room when my wife was about to go 437 00:22:52,880 --> 00:23:00,840 Speaker 1: and labor, being like, women are magical superheroes because there 438 00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:03,480 Speaker 1: I don't know a single male on earth that could 439 00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:07,679 Speaker 1: do this. So I'm like, no, no, man, it is 440 00:23:07,720 --> 00:23:12,320 Speaker 1: not the same. Okay, it's not the math same. We 441 00:23:12,440 --> 00:23:15,840 Speaker 1: are not pregnant. Shut your mouth. All I gotta do 442 00:23:15,920 --> 00:23:20,840 Speaker 1: is go get weird ice cream and Dorito's. That's my job. 443 00:23:21,119 --> 00:23:24,600 Speaker 1: Go get somebody cream and Doritos. She is cooking a human. 444 00:23:25,080 --> 00:23:27,440 Speaker 1: We are not pregnant. So in the same way, I'm 445 00:23:27,480 --> 00:23:29,600 Speaker 1: like look okay, yeah, we're both going through this experience. 446 00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:32,040 Speaker 1: I'm tired too, I gotta get up and you know, 447 00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:34,160 Speaker 1: feed this child is three in the morning. I'm tired, 448 00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:39,240 Speaker 1: But I am not the child's food source. The milk 449 00:23:39,240 --> 00:23:41,320 Speaker 1: ain't coming out of my boob is coming out of 450 00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:44,760 Speaker 1: her boob. It is not the same. Just it's and 451 00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:48,000 Speaker 1: it's like, that's not a disk. I'm not It's just 452 00:23:48,040 --> 00:23:50,040 Speaker 1: it's just not the same. Like, let it not be 453 00:23:50,119 --> 00:23:53,080 Speaker 1: the same, you know. Yeah, it's okay that different groups 454 00:23:53,119 --> 00:23:56,360 Speaker 1: suffer in different ways. It's the same place that Yeah, 455 00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:58,880 Speaker 1: we we can, we can. We can explore the ways 456 00:23:58,880 --> 00:24:01,159 Speaker 1: in which you suffer. Ring is unique and also the 457 00:24:01,200 --> 00:24:04,399 Speaker 1: ways in which it has common roots of origin without 458 00:24:04,480 --> 00:24:07,080 Speaker 1: conflating thing. I'm not going to play the oppression Olympics. 459 00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:09,119 Speaker 1: Like that's what I'm not going to do, not playing 460 00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:12,800 Speaker 1: the opress anyway. Yeah. Um, we're talking a lot about 461 00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:15,119 Speaker 1: how police departments developed out of the desire for the 462 00:24:15,160 --> 00:24:17,800 Speaker 1: capital holding classes to publicly fund the protection of their ship, 463 00:24:18,119 --> 00:24:21,600 Speaker 1: but also the increasing populations and racial mixtures of American 464 00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:24,000 Speaker 1: cities had a big impact on it too. Race riots 465 00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:26,520 Speaker 1: became increasingly common in the eighteen thirties and forties as 466 00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:28,040 Speaker 1: long as well as other riots. There were just a 467 00:24:28,040 --> 00:24:30,240 Speaker 1: shipload of riots in this period of time, and all 468 00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:32,919 Speaker 1: this unrest helped sell the growing middle class on the 469 00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:36,840 Speaker 1: idea of police departments. Policing also opered offered an opportunity 470 00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:39,360 Speaker 1: for non white groups of white people like the Irish, 471 00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:43,119 Speaker 1: to gradually gain social acceptance. The first Irish policeman in 472 00:24:43,160 --> 00:24:46,479 Speaker 1: the United States is generally believed to be have been 473 00:24:46,520 --> 00:24:49,880 Speaker 1: a Bostonian dude named Barney mcginniskan, which is an incredibly 474 00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:55,439 Speaker 1: wow Barney mcginniskan cheese. It's like they made him in 475 00:24:55,440 --> 00:25:01,240 Speaker 1: a lab at it a cartoon. Yeah. So Barney mcginniskan 476 00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:03,760 Speaker 1: was hired in eighteen fifty one, and a local alderman 477 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:05,800 Speaker 1: was infuriated by this on the grounds that it would 478 00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:10,119 Speaker 1: create a dangerous precedent irishman. He continued commit most of 479 00:25:10,119 --> 00:25:13,440 Speaker 1: the city's crime and would receive special consideration from one 480 00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:18,119 Speaker 1: of their own wearing the blue Now. Mcginniskan's career lasted 481 00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:21,119 Speaker 1: only three years. When the nationalist, anti Catholic No Nothing 482 00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:24,720 Speaker 1: Party took over the Massachusetts legislature. The Irish would not 483 00:25:24,800 --> 00:25:28,120 Speaker 1: make major inroads into northern police departments until their population 484 00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:30,480 Speaker 1: grew large enough that the Democratic Party realized they could 485 00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:34,280 Speaker 1: guarantee Irish votes by giving irishman jobs on police departments. 486 00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:36,159 Speaker 1: And that's why there's kind of a stereotype of the 487 00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:39,240 Speaker 1: Irish police officer today. Like the patty wagon went from 488 00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:41,680 Speaker 1: being a wagon that you throw Irish people onto on 489 00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:44,119 Speaker 1: their way to jail because they're all criminals to just 490 00:25:44,200 --> 00:25:46,320 Speaker 1: like a term for a cop car because all cops 491 00:25:46,320 --> 00:25:49,160 Speaker 1: are Irish like that. That that change happened over the course, 492 00:25:51,400 --> 00:25:53,959 Speaker 1: and it was kind of it wasn't the only thing 493 00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:55,200 Speaker 1: that had to do with this, but it was kind 494 00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:57,879 Speaker 1: of a part of Irish people sort of becoming white, 495 00:25:58,160 --> 00:26:00,600 Speaker 1: you know, as they kind of take up scitions helping 496 00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:02,879 Speaker 1: to enforce the social order and stop being kind of 497 00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:05,119 Speaker 1: on the fringes of it. Yeah, that's the thing that 498 00:26:05,280 --> 00:26:10,680 Speaker 1: says rebellion type stuff. Okay. Yeah, So one thing all 499 00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:13,119 Speaker 1: scholars seem to agree on is that these early police 500 00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:17,720 Speaker 1: departments were uniformly corrupt and violent. Local police party ward 501 00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:20,200 Speaker 1: leaders who were like local politicians in charge of the 502 00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:23,320 Speaker 1: neighborhoods and ship tended to appoint the police officers in 503 00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:26,320 Speaker 1: charge of their neighborhoods in society being what it was 504 00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:29,480 Speaker 1: back then, these ward leaders often also owned the local 505 00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:32,639 Speaker 1: cavern and ran the local gambling and prostitution rackets. So 506 00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:34,280 Speaker 1: if you were like, if you were like the equivalent 507 00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:37,040 Speaker 1: of like a local like senator or whatever, or an 508 00:26:37,040 --> 00:26:40,000 Speaker 1: alderman or some ship city council member, you would also 509 00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:42,840 Speaker 1: own the bar in your area, and you would run 510 00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:45,639 Speaker 1: like the prostitution and gambling rackets, and you would also 511 00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:48,639 Speaker 1: run the police. Like That's kind of how it worked, 512 00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:50,320 Speaker 1: and so everybody was it was just a bunch of 513 00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:55,240 Speaker 1: gang bosses. Yeah, gang yes, yeah, And that's you know, 514 00:26:55,320 --> 00:26:57,320 Speaker 1: that's not that different from the way the ancient rome 515 00:26:57,359 --> 00:27:01,800 Speaker 1: worked too, to be honest, like pretty similar. Yeah. Yeah. 516 00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:05,280 Speaker 1: So these ward leaders controlled both the police and the 517 00:27:05,359 --> 00:27:08,280 Speaker 1: gangs um and both the police and gangs mostly of 518 00:27:08,359 --> 00:27:11,639 Speaker 1: local youths who would help organize voter drives and would 519 00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:14,640 Speaker 1: intimidate people into making the right choices on voting day. 520 00:27:15,040 --> 00:27:17,560 Speaker 1: The first police departments then were just one of several 521 00:27:17,680 --> 00:27:20,840 Speaker 1: violent tools available to these early political bosses in the 522 00:27:20,880 --> 00:27:22,800 Speaker 1: big cities of the north and you know, kind of 523 00:27:22,800 --> 00:27:25,360 Speaker 1: the middle of the country. It wasn't really the middle. 524 00:27:25,359 --> 00:27:26,680 Speaker 1: It would have been like the fringe at that point, 525 00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:28,960 Speaker 1: but like whatever, you get what I'm saying, we get it. Yeah. 526 00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:32,360 Speaker 1: Police salaries were also augmented by bribes paid by the 527 00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:34,879 Speaker 1: owners of illegal businesses. And I'm gonna quote again from 528 00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:38,719 Speaker 1: Dr Gary Potter here, in this system of vice, organized violence, 529 00:27:38,760 --> 00:27:41,920 Speaker 1: and political corruption, it is inconceivable that the police could 530 00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:45,320 Speaker 1: be anything but corrupt. Police systematically took payoffs to allow 531 00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:49,600 Speaker 1: illegal drinking, gambling, and prostitution. Police organized professional criminals like 532 00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:53,439 Speaker 1: thieves and pickpockets, trading immunity for bribes or information. They 533 00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:57,040 Speaker 1: actively participated in vote buying and ballot box stuffing. Loyal 534 00:27:57,080 --> 00:28:01,280 Speaker 1: political operatives became police officers. They had no discernable qualifications 535 00:28:01,320 --> 00:28:04,840 Speaker 1: for policing and little if any training in policing. Promotions 536 00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:08,200 Speaker 1: within the police departments were sold, not earned, police drink 537 00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:11,359 Speaker 1: while on patrol. They protected their patrons vice operations, and 538 00:28:11,359 --> 00:28:16,600 Speaker 1: they were equipped to use peremptory force. Yeah yeah, yeah, 539 00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:20,960 Speaker 1: all scans. Yeah. What's funny to me is too is 540 00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:25,639 Speaker 1: like when you from the street level. Part of the 541 00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:32,640 Speaker 1: like outrage is when that cop all of a sudden, 542 00:28:32,760 --> 00:28:37,400 Speaker 1: just one day, decides tag like an upright citizen. Yeah, 543 00:28:37,560 --> 00:28:41,400 Speaker 1: you know, and and so if if you know, it's 544 00:28:41,400 --> 00:28:44,520 Speaker 1: like any other relationship to where it's like, Okay, you 545 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:47,680 Speaker 1: and your brother, your little sister, like you're all scumbags, 546 00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:50,120 Speaker 1: you're all stealing, you're all you're all sneaking out, and 547 00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:56,080 Speaker 1: then one day your brother goes, you know, mom, Robert's 548 00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:59,560 Speaker 1: been sneaking out all week. You're like, what the so 549 00:28:59,840 --> 00:29:03,440 Speaker 1: you serious? Yeah? You serious? Bro? Like what are you 550 00:29:03,520 --> 00:29:06,560 Speaker 1: talking about? You know why I snuck out to steal 551 00:29:06,600 --> 00:29:10,720 Speaker 1: you some weed? You know what I'm saying? So like yeah, anyway, 552 00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:12,600 Speaker 1: So it's like when you when you look at it 553 00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:15,720 Speaker 1: from that perspective, like why somebody would in turn being like, man, 554 00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:17,880 Speaker 1: you know what, I ain't got no time and I 555 00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:19,920 Speaker 1: got no mercy for y'all. I don't treat you no 556 00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:22,840 Speaker 1: different than anybody else, is because you don't act no 557 00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:28,520 Speaker 1: different than anybody else. Yeah, it's fucking uh yeah, it 558 00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:31,800 Speaker 1: is weird that like in this period to most people 559 00:29:31,840 --> 00:29:33,520 Speaker 1: would have looked at like a dude who was like 560 00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:36,760 Speaker 1: a fucking a pimp or uh yeah, like as the 561 00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:38,160 Speaker 1: same way they with a cop, like you guys are 562 00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:40,040 Speaker 1: two sides of the same fucking coin. Yes, And then 563 00:29:40,040 --> 00:29:43,000 Speaker 1: they yeah this and we'll talk in a later episode 564 00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:45,520 Speaker 1: we will get to sort of the media operation that 565 00:29:45,560 --> 00:29:48,880 Speaker 1: was kind of helped to form what are what up 566 00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:51,320 Speaker 1: until very recently, we're sort of the modern kind of 567 00:29:51,360 --> 00:29:54,680 Speaker 1: mainstream consensus on police officers as like upstanding members of 568 00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:57,560 Speaker 1: the community and ship yea um, but like yeah, for 569 00:29:57,600 --> 00:30:00,000 Speaker 1: a very long time, they were just seen as another 570 00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:04,840 Speaker 1: are kind of thug, Like yeah they're gay, Yeah, they're gay. Yeah. Now. 571 00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:07,280 Speaker 1: Samuel Walker, a professor and expert on the history of 572 00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:10,320 Speaker 1: police accountability, says that during this period, municipal police were 573 00:30:10,400 --> 00:30:14,280 Speaker 1: used as delegated vigilantes by the empowered classes of the 574 00:30:14,320 --> 00:30:18,120 Speaker 1: new United States. That's an interesting term. Now. They were 575 00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:21,280 Speaker 1: men entrusted with power by those in power to use 576 00:30:21,400 --> 00:30:24,600 Speaker 1: violence against again, the dangerous classes who were seen as 577 00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:28,720 Speaker 1: fundamentally criminal. Interestingly enough, Walker seems to believe this idea 578 00:30:28,800 --> 00:30:32,960 Speaker 1: of having delegated vigilantes grew into a central aspect of 579 00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:37,280 Speaker 1: American identity. Quote many of the worst abuses of official 580 00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:41,760 Speaker 1: criminal justice agencies represent a form of delegated vigilantism. The 581 00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:45,240 Speaker 1: public has tended to condone, if not encourage, police brutality 582 00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:48,640 Speaker 1: directed against the outcasts of society or the mistreatment of 583 00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:53,400 Speaker 1: inmates in penal institutions. So this thing that we all recognize. 584 00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:55,160 Speaker 1: I think I don't have to go into detail about 585 00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:57,480 Speaker 1: this idea that like we should have delegated vigilantes. It's 586 00:30:57,480 --> 00:30:59,920 Speaker 1: okay if we have people we all agree should be 587 00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:02,280 Speaker 1: sucked up that some people go fuck them up. Like 588 00:31:02,440 --> 00:31:06,520 Speaker 1: this really central aspect of American culture starts in this 589 00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:09,719 Speaker 1: period with this idea of like the police as delegated 590 00:31:09,800 --> 00:31:17,640 Speaker 1: vigilantes to damage the dangerous classes. Wow, yeah, you know. 591 00:31:18,280 --> 00:31:24,600 Speaker 1: And then yeah, it's the idea of like something built 592 00:31:25,120 --> 00:31:29,240 Speaker 1: in it's like in the very construction of the concept. 593 00:31:29,360 --> 00:31:32,120 Speaker 1: Like it's a lot of times I compare this too 594 00:31:32,520 --> 00:31:36,280 Speaker 1: when you try to tell somebody that, like, hey, your 595 00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:40,040 Speaker 1: story about like the founding of our nation wasn't It's 596 00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:42,720 Speaker 1: not as like pretty as you think it was. Just 597 00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:44,360 Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying, When you try to like start, 598 00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:49,400 Speaker 1: you're missing some paragraph. Guys, it's like how earth shattering, 599 00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:54,200 Speaker 1: and just like I have to reconstruct reality. So like 600 00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:56,720 Speaker 1: so when you so when you fast forward and we go, no, 601 00:31:57,000 --> 00:31:59,400 Speaker 1: most of your most of our founding fathers slave owners. 602 00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:02,000 Speaker 1: They they were not at all Christians. I don't know 603 00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:04,280 Speaker 1: where you get this founding on Christian thing from you 604 00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:06,760 Speaker 1: know what I'm saying, Like, that's earth shattering. So I 605 00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:09,920 Speaker 1: think like like this one, this this series is gonna 606 00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:11,840 Speaker 1: be that for people. When you're they're just like, well 607 00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:17,720 Speaker 1: then is the sky blue? Can I trust my eyes 608 00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:21,000 Speaker 1: with my hands? And like like the weird this is 609 00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:26,120 Speaker 1: multiverse level reality shattering for people. You know what I'm saying, 610 00:32:26,760 --> 00:32:29,200 Speaker 1: when you go back as far as you go on, yeah, yeah, 611 00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:31,880 Speaker 1: I hope. So, I mean it's it's pretty it's interesting. 612 00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:34,680 Speaker 1: It's interesting to me because like if you, if you, 613 00:32:34,800 --> 00:32:36,600 Speaker 1: if you really sort of like dig into this idea 614 00:32:36,680 --> 00:32:39,760 Speaker 1: of delegated vigilantism. Um, it's kind of a central thing 615 00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:44,440 Speaker 1: that Americans believe in. Um. You you You're You're led 616 00:32:44,480 --> 00:32:47,680 Speaker 1: to some uncomfortable kind of patterns or pathways of thought 617 00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:52,520 Speaker 1: because like so one of the most popular methods used 618 00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:54,960 Speaker 1: today even to justify the violence of the police is 619 00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:57,560 Speaker 1: the supposed criminality or deviance of the people that the 620 00:32:57,560 --> 00:33:00,880 Speaker 1: police are victimizing. UM. And I it's interesting to me 621 00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:03,360 Speaker 1: that you can draw you really can't draw a direct 622 00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:06,520 Speaker 1: line between the delegated vigilantism that started in the eighteen 623 00:33:06,600 --> 00:33:10,080 Speaker 1: hundreds fucking Batman and the right wing reaction to the 624 00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:13,120 Speaker 1: murder of Trayvon Martin. Yeah, like, who he's a hero. 625 00:33:13,360 --> 00:33:14,719 Speaker 1: I mean it was the guy shouldn't have been back 626 00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:20,880 Speaker 1: there anyway. Yeah, it's exactly. Oh my god, it's Batman's Batman. 627 00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:23,959 Speaker 1: I never thought of it because I'm always like, because 628 00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:26,080 Speaker 1: I'm more of the trailer, Like I'm the seventeen year 629 00:33:26,120 --> 00:33:28,600 Speaker 1: old kid with a bag of skittles cutting through a backyard, 630 00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:30,360 Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying, just trying to get home. 631 00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:32,400 Speaker 1: So my dad has been mad, you know what I'm saying. 632 00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:37,080 Speaker 1: And if some dude is like following me, my thought 633 00:33:37,240 --> 00:33:40,280 Speaker 1: is I better beat this fool to a pulp because 634 00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:42,320 Speaker 1: it's scary, because I just don't want to, you know 635 00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:44,600 Speaker 1: what I'm saying. So, like, I never thought of it 636 00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:49,360 Speaker 1: as like, oh, this fool thinks he's Batman. Damn, this 637 00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:52,880 Speaker 1: fool thinks he's the fucking he's the vigilante hero that 638 00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:57,440 Speaker 1: Oh my god, I'm gone the city from scumbcum shoes. 639 00:33:57,520 --> 00:34:00,720 Speaker 1: It's the same. Oh my gosh. Yeah, it's white fucking 640 00:34:00,720 --> 00:34:03,880 Speaker 1: cops have punisher patches on their fucking cars, and it's 641 00:34:03,920 --> 00:34:06,360 Speaker 1: why every all sorts of people a fucking punished Like 642 00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:10,399 Speaker 1: it's it's this core, very core, even maybe even more 643 00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:13,239 Speaker 1: core than this, like nebulous love of freedom that we 644 00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:16,080 Speaker 1: have is like this. There should be people who beat 645 00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:18,040 Speaker 1: the funk out of people I think are bad, Like 646 00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:23,799 Speaker 1: it's just an origin story DNA strand. Okay, Uh want 647 00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:26,440 Speaker 1: to take an advert real quick? Yeah, you know who 648 00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:30,040 Speaker 1: won't beat the funk out of people who don't deserve 649 00:34:30,080 --> 00:34:36,000 Speaker 1: it and a misplaced desire for vigilante justice. These disembodied 650 00:34:36,880 --> 00:34:41,640 Speaker 1: products that are keeping the lights on kind of constitutionally 651 00:34:41,680 --> 00:34:47,080 Speaker 1: incapable of of violence as as products. Yes, on autonomously, 652 00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:50,320 Speaker 1: that's not the word I'm looking for. Ontologically, that's not 653 00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:52,960 Speaker 1: the word I'm I don't know. Okay, we're done. We're 654 00:34:53,040 --> 00:35:01,239 Speaker 1: rolling some ads. Yes. Gangs to Chronicles podcast is a 655 00:35:01,239 --> 00:35:04,960 Speaker 1: weekly conversation that revolves around the underworld and criminals and 656 00:35:05,040 --> 00:35:08,480 Speaker 1: entertainers to victims, crime and law enforcement. We cover all 657 00:35:08,560 --> 00:35:12,080 Speaker 1: facets of the game Gainst the Chronicles. Podcast doesn't glorify 658 00:35:12,239 --> 00:35:16,279 Speaker 1: for motilicit activities. We just discussed the ramifications and repercussions 659 00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:18,680 Speaker 1: of these activities because at the wall, if you played 660 00:35:18,680 --> 00:35:21,560 Speaker 1: gainst the games, you are ultimately rewarded with Gainster prizes. 661 00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:25,120 Speaker 1: Our Heart Radios number one for podcasts, but don't take 662 00:35:25,120 --> 00:35:28,000 Speaker 1: our word for it. Find Against the Chronicles podcast and 663 00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:30,640 Speaker 1: my Heart Radio app or wherever you get your podcast. 664 00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:37,160 Speaker 1: Here's to the great American settlers. The millions of you 665 00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:41,280 Speaker 1: have settled for unsatisfying jobs because they pay the bills, 666 00:35:41,400 --> 00:35:44,560 Speaker 1: and uh, you just kind of fell into it, and 667 00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:49,160 Speaker 1: you know, it's like totally fine, just another few decades 668 00:35:49,280 --> 00:35:53,000 Speaker 1: or so and then you can enjoy yourself. Of course, 669 00:35:53,080 --> 00:35:56,000 Speaker 1: there is something else you could do. If you've got 670 00:35:56,040 --> 00:35:59,759 Speaker 1: something to say. You could, I don't know, start up 671 00:35:59,760 --> 00:36:03,640 Speaker 1: by cast with Spreaker from my Heart and unleash your 672 00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:07,920 Speaker 1: creative freedom and spend all day researching and talking about 673 00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:11,600 Speaker 1: stuff you love and maybe even earn enough money to 674 00:36:11,719 --> 00:36:15,480 Speaker 1: one day tell your irritating boss as you quit and 675 00:36:15,520 --> 00:36:20,680 Speaker 1: walk off into the sunset. Hey I'm no settler, I'm 676 00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:27,040 Speaker 1: an explorer. Spreaker dot com. That's spr e a k 677 00:36:27,360 --> 00:36:35,399 Speaker 1: E R. Hustle on over today. This is Roxanne Gay, 678 00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:38,200 Speaker 1: host of the Roxanne Gay Agenda, The Bad Room and 679 00:36:38,280 --> 00:36:42,400 Speaker 1: this podcast of your Dreams. Now what is the Roxanne 680 00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:45,600 Speaker 1: Gay Agenda, you might ask? What? It's a podcast where 681 00:36:45,640 --> 00:36:48,720 Speaker 1: I'm going to speak my mind about what's on my mind, 682 00:36:48,800 --> 00:36:52,319 Speaker 1: and that could be anything. Every week I will be 683 00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:56,600 Speaker 1: in conversation with an interesting person who has something to say. 684 00:36:56,680 --> 00:36:59,960 Speaker 1: We're going to talk about feminism, race, writing in books, 685 00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:04,560 Speaker 1: an art, food, pop culture, and yes, politics. I started 686 00:37:04,680 --> 00:37:08,240 Speaker 1: show with a recommendation. Really, I'm just going to share 687 00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:11,040 Speaker 1: with you a movie or a book, or maybe some 688 00:37:11,160 --> 00:37:13,920 Speaker 1: music or a comedy set, something that I really want 689 00:37:13,960 --> 00:37:16,879 Speaker 1: you to be aware of and maybe engage with as well. 690 00:37:17,760 --> 00:37:21,640 Speaker 1: Listen to the Luminary original podcast, The Roxanne Gay Agenda, 691 00:37:22,120 --> 00:37:25,920 Speaker 1: The Bad Feminist podcast of Your Dreams every Tuesday on 692 00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:29,799 Speaker 1: the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you 693 00:37:29,880 --> 00:37:40,120 Speaker 1: get your podcasts. All right, and we are returned. So 694 00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:42,759 Speaker 1: the system of American policing would have its next major 695 00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:45,000 Speaker 1: evolution in the late eighteen hundreds as a result of 696 00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:48,200 Speaker 1: the growing like union movements, So obviously like the Lady, 697 00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:51,080 Speaker 1: teen hundreds is kind of the period in which Americans 698 00:37:51,080 --> 00:37:53,160 Speaker 1: really start to unionize. There had been unions in the 699 00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:55,720 Speaker 1: United States, I think the first one was seventeen seventy eight, 700 00:37:55,920 --> 00:37:58,319 Speaker 1: but their existence had been fairly scattered and a kind 701 00:37:58,360 --> 00:38:02,160 Speaker 1: of minimal consequence until eighteen sixty six, when the National 702 00:38:02,280 --> 00:38:05,200 Speaker 1: Labor Union formed to convince Congress to limit the work 703 00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:08,760 Speaker 1: day for federal workers to eight hours. B the eighteen eighties, 704 00:38:08,920 --> 00:38:11,759 Speaker 1: union membership had spread widely across the private sector, and 705 00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:14,880 Speaker 1: union strikes were constant across the big cities of the North. 706 00:38:15,239 --> 00:38:18,239 Speaker 1: From eighteen eighty to nineteen hundred, New York had more 707 00:38:18,239 --> 00:38:21,600 Speaker 1: than five thousand strikes involving more than a million workers. 708 00:38:21,840 --> 00:38:24,319 Speaker 1: Chicago had seventeen hundred and thirty seven, and I think 709 00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:27,320 Speaker 1: more than half a million workers. So I called these strikes, 710 00:38:27,360 --> 00:38:29,520 Speaker 1: and I think modern historians call these strikes, and modern 711 00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:33,080 Speaker 1: people would recognize them as strikes. But at the time, politicians, 712 00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:37,600 Speaker 1: business owners and like the wealthy classes called them riots. Uh, 713 00:38:37,600 --> 00:38:40,400 Speaker 1: And they turned. There's still fairly new police departments to 714 00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:44,680 Speaker 1: the task of breaking up these riots. They turn, Yeah, yeah, 715 00:38:44,760 --> 00:38:47,439 Speaker 1: that's the where riot police starts. Like all these people 716 00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:49,040 Speaker 1: don't want to work more than eight hours a day, 717 00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:54,600 Speaker 1: Better have the cops beat the ship, like yo, yeah, man, 718 00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:58,399 Speaker 1: I before I did music full time, like I taught 719 00:38:58,440 --> 00:39:01,680 Speaker 1: high school for a todd nine graators, you know, and uh, 720 00:39:02,880 --> 00:39:06,120 Speaker 1: I just knew instinctually, you know, I was a young teacher, 721 00:39:06,160 --> 00:39:09,279 Speaker 1: and you know, I'm like, before I thought neither, I 722 00:39:09,320 --> 00:39:11,840 Speaker 1: thought seniors. And I'm like, I'm four years older than you, 723 00:39:11,920 --> 00:39:14,120 Speaker 1: So I'm not gonna like, I'm not gonna send you 724 00:39:14,160 --> 00:39:16,520 Speaker 1: to the office, like that's stupid. Like I'm not gonna 725 00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:19,200 Speaker 1: try to act like some sort of boss here. I 726 00:39:19,280 --> 00:39:23,240 Speaker 1: just figured it was real simple. I performed better for teachers. 727 00:39:23,280 --> 00:39:28,919 Speaker 1: I liked, yeah, it's just simple. So I'm just like, yeah, 728 00:39:28,960 --> 00:39:31,040 Speaker 1: so I just felt like this, you know, my best 729 00:39:31,239 --> 00:39:35,239 Speaker 1: the best way to have classroom management is if these 730 00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:38,680 Speaker 1: kids like you. Yeah, it's the It's the thing that 731 00:39:38,719 --> 00:39:40,200 Speaker 1: I said that made so much sense when I was 732 00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:42,759 Speaker 1: in Rojava in northeast Syria, which is the idea that 733 00:39:42,840 --> 00:39:44,799 Speaker 1: like kind of the basic the stuff that we would 734 00:39:44,840 --> 00:39:46,759 Speaker 1: consider like the core of law enforcement, which is like 735 00:39:46,800 --> 00:39:49,520 Speaker 1: patrolling around a neighborhood making sure ship's fine, Like that's 736 00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:52,799 Speaker 1: often done by like local counsels heavily made up of 737 00:39:52,840 --> 00:39:56,480 Speaker 1: like old folks like fucking grandma and stuff, because like, yeah, 738 00:39:56,520 --> 00:39:57,759 Speaker 1: you don't want to don't want to be acting like 739 00:39:57,800 --> 00:39:59,560 Speaker 1: a fucking piece of ship in front of your grandma, 740 00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:03,000 Speaker 1: like grandma, you know what I'm saying. Yeah, straighten up, 741 00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:06,080 Speaker 1: fly right, Grandma come around the corner, you know, So 742 00:40:06,160 --> 00:40:08,080 Speaker 1: I did. Yeah, that's that's the prince. So I just 743 00:40:08,160 --> 00:40:12,680 Speaker 1: I've never understood how the boss and I mean I 744 00:40:12,719 --> 00:40:15,200 Speaker 1: got I got like an assistant and you know, management 745 00:40:15,200 --> 00:40:17,000 Speaker 1: and stuff like. That's always people on my pay roll, 746 00:40:17,040 --> 00:40:22,040 Speaker 1: and I just never like, why would they work? Why 747 00:40:22,040 --> 00:40:26,880 Speaker 1: would I who want to work for somebody they don't like? Yeah, 748 00:40:27,080 --> 00:40:28,799 Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. Like, so if you just 749 00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:31,240 Speaker 1: if you run things like I just it just seems 750 00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:36,319 Speaker 1: so logical to me that you it's like to for 751 00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:39,040 Speaker 1: bag security purpose. Even if I'm just go that like 752 00:40:39,080 --> 00:40:41,759 Speaker 1: I'm just trying to secure this bag. I feel like 753 00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:48,279 Speaker 1: my employees should feel like I like them. Yeah. Maybe 754 00:40:48,280 --> 00:40:50,960 Speaker 1: that's why I'm not a kajillionaire because yeah, there's something 755 00:40:51,040 --> 00:40:54,080 Speaker 1: I don't get caring about what people think. Yeah, man, 756 00:40:54,120 --> 00:40:58,719 Speaker 1: I'll never account being accountable to feeling like I don't 757 00:40:58,800 --> 00:41:00,520 Speaker 1: have to be the smartest guy in the room all 758 00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:02,759 Speaker 1: the time. That's why I hired an accountant, because you 759 00:41:02,840 --> 00:41:05,840 Speaker 1: better need this. Yes, shout off with my accountant to 760 00:41:06,440 --> 00:41:11,320 Speaker 1: thank you, Sean. So right, yeah again, so riot police 761 00:41:11,360 --> 00:41:13,480 Speaker 1: kind of get started to break up these fucking um 762 00:41:13,520 --> 00:41:17,719 Speaker 1: these these what are essentially strikes are definitely strikes. Um. 763 00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:19,960 Speaker 1: And you know, this was a really good deal for 764 00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:23,000 Speaker 1: the owners of businesses because since the police departments were 765 00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:25,560 Speaker 1: now funded by the state, they got to break up 766 00:41:25,600 --> 00:41:28,600 Speaker 1: strikes against their businesses without spending you know, their own 767 00:41:28,600 --> 00:41:31,480 Speaker 1: money to do it. And as Dr Potter notes, the 768 00:41:31,560 --> 00:41:35,000 Speaker 1: use of delegated visual anties to break up strikes confused 769 00:41:35,040 --> 00:41:37,680 Speaker 1: the issue of workers rights with the issue of crime. 770 00:41:38,200 --> 00:41:41,200 Speaker 1: So people might be sympathetic towards workers who are striking 771 00:41:41,239 --> 00:41:44,320 Speaker 1: for a better deal, but they're not sympathetic towards criminals 772 00:41:44,320 --> 00:41:48,720 Speaker 1: who are rioting. So you frame a strike as a riot, 773 00:41:49,000 --> 00:41:50,680 Speaker 1: then you have a freer hand and just beat the 774 00:41:50,680 --> 00:41:54,720 Speaker 1: ship out of everybody involved. All these things. They're just thugs. 775 00:41:55,040 --> 00:42:00,080 Speaker 1: They had drugs on them. Yeah, yeah, definitely got it. 776 00:42:00,680 --> 00:42:02,920 Speaker 1: So early police broke up strikes in the same way 777 00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:06,920 Speaker 1: we're familiar with riot cops breaking at protests today unspeakable violence. 778 00:42:06,960 --> 00:42:09,560 Speaker 1: But they also had subtler methods of achieving the same end, 779 00:42:09,920 --> 00:42:13,800 Speaker 1: public order arrests, which were essentially police declaring someone's behavior 780 00:42:13,840 --> 00:42:16,560 Speaker 1: a crime for a non specific reason and then arresting them. 781 00:42:16,880 --> 00:42:19,320 Speaker 1: These gave police a way to break up union meetings 782 00:42:19,360 --> 00:42:22,320 Speaker 1: and gatherings before they could turn into strikes. In Chicago 783 00:42:22,480 --> 00:42:26,120 Speaker 1: during this period, eight percent of all arrests were public 784 00:42:26,239 --> 00:42:33,600 Speaker 1: order arrests of workers. Yeah. Yeah, so the infraction is 785 00:42:33,719 --> 00:42:37,399 Speaker 1: y'all standing around. Yeah, yeah, exactly, that's that's the that's 786 00:42:37,400 --> 00:42:40,680 Speaker 1: the okay, Yeah you're loitering. Yeah, you just know you're 787 00:42:40,719 --> 00:42:44,360 Speaker 1: going to jail. Yeah, yea allowed to stand here. Yeah. Again, 788 00:42:44,880 --> 00:42:47,960 Speaker 1: you can make some comparisons to all the states that 789 00:42:48,000 --> 00:42:50,400 Speaker 1: put in curfews and then suddenly said now it's illegal 790 00:42:50,400 --> 00:42:52,319 Speaker 1: to be out after five. So if you're out after five, 791 00:42:52,400 --> 00:42:54,600 Speaker 1: we can funk you up. Did you see it once? 792 00:42:54,640 --> 00:42:55,960 Speaker 1: I forget. I think there was a few of them 793 00:42:55,960 --> 00:42:57,600 Speaker 1: out here in California. One of the one of the 794 00:42:57,719 --> 00:43:01,760 Speaker 1: cities was like things you and do after the curfew, 795 00:43:02,320 --> 00:43:05,279 Speaker 1: go to the store, go to the groceries, pick up 796 00:43:05,280 --> 00:43:08,359 Speaker 1: your children being stuck in traffic. Things you can't do 797 00:43:08,440 --> 00:43:12,680 Speaker 1: after after curfew. Gather in large groups in front of 798 00:43:12,719 --> 00:43:15,560 Speaker 1: city hall. Yeah. I was just like, oh, work, okay, 799 00:43:15,600 --> 00:43:20,080 Speaker 1: So yeah, really like, oh we're okay, too much free 800 00:43:20,080 --> 00:43:22,440 Speaker 1: speech going on here. You gotta stop that ship. Yeah, 801 00:43:22,719 --> 00:43:28,000 Speaker 1: carry cardboard signs you can't do after got it? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, 802 00:43:28,440 --> 00:43:32,040 Speaker 1: great first amendment we have. So between eighteen seventy and 803 00:43:32,120 --> 00:43:35,560 Speaker 1: nineteen hundred, nearly a million workers were jailed for public 804 00:43:35,680 --> 00:43:39,360 Speaker 1: order offenses. And just Chicago. Now, a lot of cities 805 00:43:39,440 --> 00:43:42,239 Speaker 1: also made use of what we're called tramp acts. These 806 00:43:42,280 --> 00:43:45,279 Speaker 1: criminalized traveling without having a visible means of support. So 807 00:43:45,320 --> 00:43:47,520 Speaker 1: if you were moving around in the city or the 808 00:43:47,560 --> 00:43:51,200 Speaker 1: world and you didn't weren't you didn't have money, clearly 809 00:43:51,280 --> 00:43:54,279 Speaker 1: like you didn't clearly have a job, um, you were 810 00:43:54,320 --> 00:43:56,720 Speaker 1: committing a crime. So in other words, it was illegal 811 00:43:56,800 --> 00:43:59,040 Speaker 1: in a lot of cities to be an unemployed, poor 812 00:43:59,080 --> 00:44:02,080 Speaker 1: person who left their home. So when workers would go 813 00:44:02,120 --> 00:44:04,840 Speaker 1: on strike and would lose their jobs for going on strike, 814 00:44:05,160 --> 00:44:07,680 Speaker 1: they were then breaking the law because they were outside 815 00:44:07,719 --> 00:44:10,120 Speaker 1: in the city and doing something besides looking for a 816 00:44:10,160 --> 00:44:15,440 Speaker 1: new job. What the I know, right, Land of the Free, 817 00:44:15,680 --> 00:44:25,120 Speaker 1: Like maybe serious? How good? Lord? Pretty good? Pretty good? Yeah? 818 00:44:25,200 --> 00:44:28,880 Speaker 1: And again like the arrests are of these people. So 819 00:44:28,920 --> 00:44:31,520 Speaker 1: if you're talking about like the police protecting people, who 820 00:44:31,520 --> 00:44:34,440 Speaker 1: are they protecting? Who are they serving? It's not most 821 00:44:34,480 --> 00:44:38,520 Speaker 1: of the people. Yeah anyway, yeah, yeah. Tramp acts were 822 00:44:38,520 --> 00:44:40,960 Speaker 1: of course not applied to members of the middle class 823 00:44:41,040 --> 00:44:43,839 Speaker 1: or wealthy individuals. It was only illegal to be out 824 00:44:43,880 --> 00:44:45,480 Speaker 1: and not laboring if you were a member of the 825 00:44:45,640 --> 00:44:51,080 Speaker 1: dangerous classes. Meanwhile, good citizens, respectable citizens, these were all 826 00:44:51,080 --> 00:44:53,120 Speaker 1: regular terms used, which again we're all kind of terms 827 00:44:53,160 --> 00:44:57,200 Speaker 1: for fully white citizens with money and property. Yeah, these 828 00:44:57,200 --> 00:45:00,400 Speaker 1: people were increasingly able rather than being increasingly pressed by 829 00:45:00,400 --> 00:45:03,440 Speaker 1: the police, those folks were increasingly able to call on 830 00:45:03,520 --> 00:45:06,799 Speaker 1: the police when they felt uncomfortable or afraid. The very 831 00:45:06,840 --> 00:45:09,560 Speaker 1: first alarm boxes were set up in major cities during 832 00:45:09,600 --> 00:45:11,719 Speaker 1: this period of time. And these were similar to the 833 00:45:11,719 --> 00:45:13,560 Speaker 1: dedicate you know in like on a college campus there 834 00:45:13,560 --> 00:45:15,880 Speaker 1: will be like very well lit like police phones that 835 00:45:15,920 --> 00:45:18,200 Speaker 1: like you presumably if you're getting sexually assault or something, 836 00:45:18,200 --> 00:45:20,440 Speaker 1: you'd like run over to it and call the cops. Um. 837 00:45:20,880 --> 00:45:23,520 Speaker 1: This this was the same basic idea, um, And they 838 00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:25,640 Speaker 1: were set up started being set it up in cities 839 00:45:25,680 --> 00:45:27,759 Speaker 1: in this area, particularly in like parts of cities where 840 00:45:27,760 --> 00:45:30,320 Speaker 1: they were like businesses and you know, upper upper income 841 00:45:30,400 --> 00:45:33,319 Speaker 1: housing and stuff. Um. And but they were locked, so 842 00:45:33,400 --> 00:45:36,720 Speaker 1: you couldn't most people couldn't actually use the alarm boxes, 843 00:45:36,960 --> 00:45:40,200 Speaker 1: but local businessmen and wealthy people were all given keys 844 00:45:40,640 --> 00:45:45,200 Speaker 1: because the police existed to be their on call personal security. 845 00:45:46,360 --> 00:45:53,120 Speaker 1: She oh my gosh, like just all allowed in the open. Yeah. Yeah, 846 00:45:53,160 --> 00:45:54,920 Speaker 1: there's not a lot of not a lot of I 847 00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:58,759 Speaker 1: don't know, masks on it and stuff. So it doesn't 848 00:45:58,760 --> 00:46:01,799 Speaker 1: even seem convenient. Like if I'm not, if I'm rich 849 00:46:01,800 --> 00:46:03,759 Speaker 1: and I'm being robbed, you think I got time to 850 00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:06,759 Speaker 1: like figure out which key to this is. Yeah, And 851 00:46:06,960 --> 00:46:08,680 Speaker 1: I don't think it was mostly them being robbed. I 852 00:46:08,680 --> 00:46:10,520 Speaker 1: think they would see like, oh, there's a bunch of 853 00:46:10,640 --> 00:46:12,880 Speaker 1: fucking Italians hanging out in this corner. I'd better get 854 00:46:12,920 --> 00:46:14,799 Speaker 1: the cops over here to kick their asses, Like I don't. 855 00:46:14,800 --> 00:46:16,719 Speaker 1: I don't want Italians on my street corner, and like 856 00:46:17,080 --> 00:46:19,719 Speaker 1: they're carrying ing you know, yeah, yeah, yeah, they're all 857 00:46:19,760 --> 00:46:22,200 Speaker 1: there's more than one of them. A gang must be 858 00:46:22,239 --> 00:46:26,600 Speaker 1: a gang. So yeah. Thanks to the advances of technology 859 00:46:26,640 --> 00:46:29,919 Speaker 1: that allowed alarm boxes to exist, property owners were able 860 00:46:29,960 --> 00:46:32,359 Speaker 1: to call on the police department, which was funded by 861 00:46:32,400 --> 00:46:36,120 Speaker 1: everyone's taxes, in order to protect their private wealth and increasingly, 862 00:46:36,160 --> 00:46:39,000 Speaker 1: just to kind of protect their sense of comfort. So 863 00:46:39,120 --> 00:46:41,800 Speaker 1: policing tools developed. With the need to break up strikes 864 00:46:41,800 --> 00:46:44,719 Speaker 1: and riots, patrol wagons began taking to the streets. This 865 00:46:44,800 --> 00:46:47,720 Speaker 1: allowed police to easily travel in large groups and easily 866 00:46:47,800 --> 00:46:51,080 Speaker 1: arrest large groups of people. Police on horseback also started 867 00:46:51,120 --> 00:46:53,840 Speaker 1: to appear, because horses were seen as the most effective 868 00:46:53,880 --> 00:46:56,840 Speaker 1: way to break up a group of protesters. Officers began 869 00:46:56,920 --> 00:47:00,520 Speaker 1: carrying long night sticks because breaking an activists skulls was 870 00:47:00,560 --> 00:47:04,200 Speaker 1: an increasing part of their job. Yeah. Throughout the later 871 00:47:04,280 --> 00:47:07,080 Speaker 1: half of the eighteen hundreds, early police departments were faced 872 00:47:07,080 --> 00:47:09,640 Speaker 1: with the question of whether or not officers should be 873 00:47:09,760 --> 00:47:13,719 Speaker 1: uniformed and given firearms. Sir Peel, the father of police work, 874 00:47:13,719 --> 00:47:16,160 Speaker 1: the guy who created the London Metropolitan Police, was pretty 875 00:47:16,200 --> 00:47:20,560 Speaker 1: stringently against cops packing heat. American police, though, began carrying 876 00:47:20,600 --> 00:47:24,279 Speaker 1: guns independently by virtue of arming themselves years before such 877 00:47:24,280 --> 00:47:27,680 Speaker 1: equipment became standard. So decades really before police departments are 878 00:47:27,680 --> 00:47:29,600 Speaker 1: giving everyone a gun. Cops are just kind of buying 879 00:47:29,640 --> 00:47:35,600 Speaker 1: their own guns because it is America. Yeah, and you 880 00:47:35,640 --> 00:47:38,319 Speaker 1: know what, you're right, it's effective if it's just like 881 00:47:38,440 --> 00:47:41,000 Speaker 1: it's like drinking again, it's like drinking bleach y. Yeah, 882 00:47:41,400 --> 00:47:44,000 Speaker 1: I mean it'll cure. I mean I'm pretty sure it'll 883 00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:49,200 Speaker 1: You won't. Yeah, you won't die from coronavirus. You if 884 00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:52,439 Speaker 1: you drink enough bleach. If you drink enough bleach, just like, 885 00:47:52,680 --> 00:47:55,279 Speaker 1: you know what, if you really want to send everybody home, 886 00:47:55,440 --> 00:47:57,880 Speaker 1: you know what, you're right, beat the ship at them 887 00:47:57,880 --> 00:48:00,120 Speaker 1: with billy clubs and guns. You're right, that will in 888 00:48:00,560 --> 00:48:04,160 Speaker 1: the protest. So the US police departments first started a 889 00:48:04,239 --> 00:48:06,400 Speaker 1: kind of like in an organized way, issuing arms to 890 00:48:06,440 --> 00:48:09,560 Speaker 1: police in like the eighteen forties, um. And when this 891 00:48:09,600 --> 00:48:12,800 Speaker 1: started to happen, the American public was extremely skeptical of 892 00:48:12,840 --> 00:48:16,200 Speaker 1: the idea because again, we are a freedom loving people, 893 00:48:16,560 --> 00:48:18,360 Speaker 1: and the idea that police would be allowed to deploy 894 00:48:18,440 --> 00:48:22,640 Speaker 1: deadly force at will against citizens was extremely unpopular. At first. 895 00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:25,280 Speaker 1: People are like, what the funk are you talking about? You? Like, again, 896 00:48:25,400 --> 00:48:27,799 Speaker 1: these people, we all understand, these people are basically the 897 00:48:27,840 --> 00:48:29,759 Speaker 1: same as thugs. And you want to you want to pay, 898 00:48:29,880 --> 00:48:32,080 Speaker 1: have the state pay for them to have guns. Now, Like, 899 00:48:32,160 --> 00:48:36,560 Speaker 1: that's not a great idea. Yeah, yeah, But as Dr 900 00:48:36,600 --> 00:48:40,520 Speaker 1: Gary Potter writes, quote, the value of armed paramilitary presence 901 00:48:40,560 --> 00:48:44,279 Speaker 1: authorized to use indeed deadly force served the interests of 902 00:48:44,360 --> 00:48:48,000 Speaker 1: local economic elites who had wanted organized police departments in 903 00:48:48,040 --> 00:48:51,320 Speaker 1: the first place. The presence of a paramilitary force occupying 904 00:48:51,320 --> 00:48:55,719 Speaker 1: the streets was regarded as essential because such organizations intervened 905 00:48:55,760 --> 00:48:58,880 Speaker 1: between the property and elites and property less masses who 906 00:48:58,960 --> 00:49:03,279 Speaker 1: were regarded as politically dangerous as a class. Now, these 907 00:49:03,320 --> 00:49:06,759 Speaker 1: propertied classes also considered it essential that police be uniformed 908 00:49:06,800 --> 00:49:10,040 Speaker 1: so that respectable citizens could identify them when they needed help, 909 00:49:10,320 --> 00:49:12,960 Speaker 1: and so that they would create an obvious, visible presence 910 00:49:12,960 --> 00:49:17,160 Speaker 1: to clamp down on unrest by the dangerous classes. Now, again, 911 00:49:17,360 --> 00:49:20,640 Speaker 1: uniforms would appear kind of scatter shot in different police departments, 912 00:49:20,640 --> 00:49:22,759 Speaker 1: and not for never for all of the police, but 913 00:49:22,800 --> 00:49:24,880 Speaker 1: for like some units and stuff would be uniformed for 914 00:49:24,920 --> 00:49:28,680 Speaker 1: a period of time. Many officers resisted uniforms because again 915 00:49:29,000 --> 00:49:31,600 Speaker 1: they're basically criminals, and it made them into a target. 916 00:49:31,960 --> 00:49:36,840 Speaker 1: The very first like uniformly uniformed, like everybody wears a uniform, 917 00:49:36,840 --> 00:49:39,040 Speaker 1: and that's that's part of the definition of what this 918 00:49:39,040 --> 00:49:41,560 Speaker 1: this group is. The very first police force for that 919 00:49:41,640 --> 00:49:45,000 Speaker 1: to be standard in was the Pennsylvania State Police. This 920 00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:46,680 Speaker 1: is in the United States at least, so the Pennsylvania 921 00:49:46,680 --> 00:49:52,120 Speaker 1: State Police the first explicitly fully uniformed police force we 922 00:49:52,239 --> 00:49:55,960 Speaker 1: have in this country. Now. The Pennsylvania State Police were 923 00:49:55,960 --> 00:49:57,920 Speaker 1: formed in nineteen o three in the wake of the 924 00:49:57,960 --> 00:50:01,640 Speaker 1: Great Anthracite Coal Strike of ninete you know too. For reference, 925 00:50:01,760 --> 00:50:05,480 Speaker 1: the strikers were fighting for a pay increase, a reduction 926 00:50:05,600 --> 00:50:07,600 Speaker 1: from ten to eight hours a day in their work day, 927 00:50:07,800 --> 00:50:11,000 Speaker 1: and a fairer system for weighing coal. This strike caused 928 00:50:11,040 --> 00:50:13,400 Speaker 1: the price of coal to skyrocket right as winter hit, 929 00:50:13,440 --> 00:50:15,600 Speaker 1: which put enormous pressure on the state government and on 930 00:50:15,640 --> 00:50:18,160 Speaker 1: the federal government to put Pennsylvania's minds back to work, 931 00:50:18,200 --> 00:50:22,560 Speaker 1: because Pennsylvania's like the fucking the coal basket. Um. Yeah, 932 00:50:22,840 --> 00:50:25,759 Speaker 1: So the Great Anthracite Coal Strikers were opposed by a 933 00:50:25,800 --> 00:50:28,759 Speaker 1: mix of Pinkerton's who were essentially a mercenary police force. 934 00:50:28,760 --> 00:50:30,680 Speaker 1: We'll talk more about him a bit later, and the 935 00:50:30,840 --> 00:50:34,480 Speaker 1: Coal and Iron Police. Now, the Coal and Iron Police 936 00:50:34,560 --> 00:50:37,040 Speaker 1: was a five thousand man army run by the coal 937 00:50:37,080 --> 00:50:40,359 Speaker 1: companies in Pennsylvania but empowered and funded by the State 938 00:50:40,360 --> 00:50:42,799 Speaker 1: of Pennsylvania to basically do whatever they had to do 939 00:50:42,880 --> 00:50:46,000 Speaker 1: to break strikes. This generally involved terrific violence, and over 940 00:50:46,000 --> 00:50:49,280 Speaker 1: the course of the Great Anthracite Coal Strike, the Coal 941 00:50:49,320 --> 00:50:52,600 Speaker 1: and Iron Police gunned several people down. But the strikers 942 00:50:52,600 --> 00:50:54,719 Speaker 1: were able to put pressure on mine owners for a 943 00:50:54,760 --> 00:50:57,840 Speaker 1: hundred and sixty three straight days, and they eventually gained 944 00:50:57,960 --> 00:51:01,000 Speaker 1: You know, modest concessions and they didn't get a raise 945 00:51:01,040 --> 00:51:02,440 Speaker 1: in an eight hour work day, but they got a 946 00:51:02,440 --> 00:51:04,759 Speaker 1: ten percent raise in a nine hour work day, so 947 00:51:04,840 --> 00:51:08,200 Speaker 1: you know, take what you can. Yeah, oh this was okay. No, 948 00:51:08,800 --> 00:51:11,480 Speaker 1: I was gonna ask the question, but I answered it myself. 949 00:51:11,600 --> 00:51:14,200 Speaker 1: I mixed it with like I thought, maybe that was 950 00:51:14,239 --> 00:51:17,000 Speaker 1: like the railway company guy that like started a city 951 00:51:17,320 --> 00:51:19,799 Speaker 1: and had a Yeah, that's something else. Okay, never mind 952 00:51:19,840 --> 00:51:21,680 Speaker 1: that is happening during this period, you know you're having 953 00:51:21,760 --> 00:51:23,320 Speaker 1: and that the coal and iron police are kind of 954 00:51:23,320 --> 00:51:26,080 Speaker 1: the same thing, Like they're these communities are all miners 955 00:51:26,440 --> 00:51:29,800 Speaker 1: and using state partially ely state funds, the mine companies 956 00:51:30,600 --> 00:51:33,879 Speaker 1: establish a police department to keep their minds in order 957 00:51:33,920 --> 00:51:36,799 Speaker 1: and really to keep their workers from striking. So the 958 00:51:36,800 --> 00:51:40,160 Speaker 1: Pennsylvania State Police was established after the Great Anthracite Coal 959 00:51:40,239 --> 00:51:43,480 Speaker 1: Strike or Anthracite Strike whatever, because the state was governed 960 00:51:43,560 --> 00:51:45,799 Speaker 1: by mine owners and their friends and the state wanted 961 00:51:45,840 --> 00:51:49,160 Speaker 1: a dedicated paramilitary unit to violently suppress future strikes. The 962 00:51:49,160 --> 00:51:51,200 Speaker 1: coal and iron police weren't good enough at their jobs. 963 00:51:51,520 --> 00:51:54,880 Speaker 1: So this is where we get the first uniformed police 964 00:51:54,880 --> 00:51:57,839 Speaker 1: department in US history. Is specifically, like we didn't kill 965 00:51:57,920 --> 00:52:00,160 Speaker 1: enough people last time. We needed like a four that 966 00:52:00,200 --> 00:52:03,319 Speaker 1: can really funk with people who go on strike. So 967 00:52:03,600 --> 00:52:05,800 Speaker 1: in our last episode we discussed the fact that police 968 00:52:05,840 --> 00:52:08,320 Speaker 1: departments in the American South evolved out of slave patrols, 969 00:52:08,320 --> 00:52:12,160 Speaker 1: which were essentially a counter insurgency force. That similar evolution 970 00:52:12,200 --> 00:52:14,680 Speaker 1: at least occurred elsewhere in the United States, even outside 971 00:52:14,680 --> 00:52:17,720 Speaker 1: of the South. In eighteen ninety eight, the United States 972 00:52:17,719 --> 00:52:20,600 Speaker 1: went to war with Spain, one of the least justified 973 00:52:20,600 --> 00:52:24,320 Speaker 1: wars in our long history of unjustified wars. But because 974 00:52:24,360 --> 00:52:27,520 Speaker 1: Spain was at the time also a terrible colonialist empire, 975 00:52:27,800 --> 00:52:30,400 Speaker 1: the US wound up fighting them for control of the Philippines. 976 00:52:30,560 --> 00:52:33,360 Speaker 1: Now Spain had controlled that massive islands quite brutally, and 977 00:52:33,400 --> 00:52:36,160 Speaker 1: the US continued this tradition, murdering as many as two 978 00:52:36,560 --> 00:52:39,680 Speaker 1: thousand civilians battling the insurgency that followed our occupation of 979 00:52:39,680 --> 00:52:42,799 Speaker 1: the Philippines. Much of this murdering was done by the 980 00:52:42,800 --> 00:52:47,040 Speaker 1: Philippine Constabulary, the occupation force our government put in place 981 00:52:47,120 --> 00:52:50,120 Speaker 1: over those islands, and back in the United States, the 982 00:52:50,160 --> 00:52:53,960 Speaker 1: Pennsylvania State Police were formed directly an imitation of the 983 00:52:53,960 --> 00:52:57,640 Speaker 1: Philippine Constabulary. So yeah, the the and this is still 984 00:52:58,200 --> 00:53:00,879 Speaker 1: the state Police in Pennsylvania today. They started out as 985 00:53:01,120 --> 00:53:03,040 Speaker 1: people looking at Okay, you remember when we killed we 986 00:53:03,080 --> 00:53:05,799 Speaker 1: committed that quasi genocide in the Philippines. What if we 987 00:53:05,880 --> 00:53:08,799 Speaker 1: take all of that advice, use it to make the 988 00:53:08,800 --> 00:53:11,680 Speaker 1: Pennsylvania State Police and have them sunk up anyone who 989 00:53:11,680 --> 00:53:14,160 Speaker 1: goes on strike. That's where the Pennsylvania State Police come from. 990 00:53:14,440 --> 00:53:26,200 Speaker 1: What the okay god Like, oh yeah, so Pennsylvania residence. 991 00:53:26,560 --> 00:53:28,960 Speaker 1: The next time you see a Pennsylvania State Police car, 992 00:53:31,239 --> 00:53:36,120 Speaker 1: be like, hey, man, granddad's an asshole anyway. Yeah, yeah, 993 00:53:36,160 --> 00:53:38,960 Speaker 1: So the Pennsylvania State Police were formed as an all white, 994 00:53:39,040 --> 00:53:42,360 Speaker 1: all native meaning you know, born in the United States force. 995 00:53:42,719 --> 00:53:45,439 Speaker 1: So that's what you mean by native. Yeah, exactly, white 996 00:53:45,480 --> 00:53:47,399 Speaker 1: people born in the US, as opposed to white people 997 00:53:47,400 --> 00:53:52,680 Speaker 1: who immigrated here, right, Like that's what they mean. Yeah, okay, buddy, yea. 998 00:53:52,840 --> 00:53:56,360 Speaker 1: So the singular purpose of the Pennsylvania State Police was 999 00:53:56,440 --> 00:53:59,239 Speaker 1: to break the strikes that increasingly popped up in Pennsylvania's 1000 00:53:59,239 --> 00:54:01,760 Speaker 1: coal fields near the turn of the century. Mine workers 1001 00:54:01,760 --> 00:54:04,080 Speaker 1: tended to be a mix of Irish, German, and Eastern 1002 00:54:04,080 --> 00:54:06,160 Speaker 1: European immigrants. A lot of checks were in this kind 1003 00:54:06,160 --> 00:54:08,319 Speaker 1: of like mining population also a lot of Russians and 1004 00:54:08,400 --> 00:54:10,359 Speaker 1: kind of people we don't call Russians today, but we're 1005 00:54:10,400 --> 00:54:13,080 Speaker 1: Russians back then because Russian was bigger um and it 1006 00:54:13,120 --> 00:54:15,560 Speaker 1: was only logical to the rich white mine owners and 1007 00:54:15,560 --> 00:54:18,240 Speaker 1: their friends in government that the same tactics that worked 1008 00:54:18,280 --> 00:54:21,920 Speaker 1: on undesirable races in Southeast Asia would also work on 1009 00:54:22,000 --> 00:54:25,400 Speaker 1: undesirable races right here in the United States. It was 1010 00:54:25,400 --> 00:54:28,680 Speaker 1: seen as critically important than to stop the Pennsylvania State 1011 00:54:28,719 --> 00:54:31,240 Speaker 1: Police from developing any kind of rapport from the people 1012 00:54:31,280 --> 00:54:34,800 Speaker 1: they controlled. The state police lived in special barracks is 1013 00:54:34,920 --> 00:54:37,239 Speaker 1: outside of the mining towns, and this was done to 1014 00:54:37,280 --> 00:54:39,920 Speaker 1: avoid any kind of social intermingling. The only time these 1015 00:54:39,920 --> 00:54:41,680 Speaker 1: people should see the folks that were policing is when 1016 00:54:41,719 --> 00:54:44,440 Speaker 1: they were cracking their fucking skulls the road horses to 1017 00:54:44,480 --> 00:54:47,760 Speaker 1: allow them to more effectively trample strikers. In nineteen o six, 1018 00:54:48,000 --> 00:54:51,719 Speaker 1: five thousand Windburg, Pennsylvania miners went on strike against their employer, 1019 00:54:51,920 --> 00:54:55,840 Speaker 1: the Berwin White Coal Mining Company. Berwin White was anti union, 1020 00:54:55,880 --> 00:54:58,239 Speaker 1: and the largely Slovak miners of wind Burr wanted to 1021 00:54:58,320 --> 00:55:00,799 Speaker 1: join the United Mine Workers. Of a mayor account, the 1022 00:55:00,800 --> 00:55:04,600 Speaker 1: Pennsylvania Police responded by riding into town, murdering three adult 1023 00:55:05,160 --> 00:55:08,200 Speaker 1: miners and one young boy, by firing wildly into crowds 1024 00:55:08,200 --> 00:55:11,359 Speaker 1: and brutally trampling anyone who fell down and letters home 1025 00:55:11,400 --> 00:55:14,640 Speaker 1: to their families. The immigrant miners referred to the Pennsylvania 1026 00:55:14,680 --> 00:55:17,440 Speaker 1: State Police as Cossacks. Do you know what the Cossacks were? 1027 00:55:17,520 --> 00:55:21,359 Speaker 1: I mean, they're still around, Like, where have I heard 1028 00:55:21,400 --> 00:55:24,920 Speaker 1: that word? It's um, it's an ethnic group in Russia, 1029 00:55:24,960 --> 00:55:27,560 Speaker 1: but it was during the period of the Czar. These 1030 00:55:27,560 --> 00:55:29,800 Speaker 1: were like basically kind of like these tribes of horse 1031 00:55:30,000 --> 00:55:34,360 Speaker 1: mounted warriors who the Tsar used as his shock troopers. Primarily, 1032 00:55:34,360 --> 00:55:36,239 Speaker 1: like they fought in wars, but like their biggest job 1033 00:55:36,600 --> 00:55:40,680 Speaker 1: was fucking up riots and protests and comedics and genocide occasionally. Yeah. 1034 00:55:41,120 --> 00:55:43,479 Speaker 1: So these people who are like used to the Czar 1035 00:55:43,640 --> 00:55:46,200 Speaker 1: sending in his Cossacks when there's unrest to murder people. 1036 00:55:46,360 --> 00:55:48,440 Speaker 1: They come to the US and they see the Pennsylvania 1037 00:55:48,440 --> 00:55:50,520 Speaker 1: police murdering them and they're like, oh, these are like 1038 00:55:50,560 --> 00:55:54,400 Speaker 1: the same fucking things as the Czar's shock troopers. Yeah. Yeah, 1039 00:55:54,880 --> 00:55:59,160 Speaker 1: the risk you know, coming across the whole ocean before 1040 00:55:59,239 --> 00:56:03,600 Speaker 1: airplane just to get this, what are we even doing 1041 00:56:03,800 --> 00:56:07,239 Speaker 1: like it was different here. Yeah. Yeah, I'm like, Yo, 1042 00:56:07,360 --> 00:56:10,040 Speaker 1: this ain't like the five will American you know American 1043 00:56:10,080 --> 00:56:12,319 Speaker 1: tale story I thought was. I thought there was no 1044 00:56:12,440 --> 00:56:14,480 Speaker 1: cats in America. You know what I'm saying. This supposed 1045 00:56:14,480 --> 00:56:17,880 Speaker 1: to be better when we get here. Yeah, yeah, yeah, 1046 00:56:18,080 --> 00:56:20,319 Speaker 1: y'all came by choice. So that's the part where I'm 1047 00:56:20,360 --> 00:56:21,840 Speaker 1: just like, why didn't you all look at each other 1048 00:56:21,920 --> 00:56:25,239 Speaker 1: and be like, you know what, guys, this was a 1049 00:56:25,280 --> 00:56:32,399 Speaker 1: bad call. Beer's worse too, beers. So on a related note, 1050 00:56:32,440 --> 00:56:36,400 Speaker 1: while doing my research, I came across a January article 1051 00:56:36,400 --> 00:56:39,200 Speaker 1: in the Pittsburgh Post Gazette about Pennsylvania State Police. In 1052 00:56:39,239 --> 00:56:41,440 Speaker 1: case you're curious about how the Pennsylvania State Police is 1053 00:56:41,480 --> 00:56:43,640 Speaker 1: doing to day, this article points out that in two 1054 00:56:43,640 --> 00:56:46,400 Speaker 1: thousand two, following a New Jersey scandal overr state troopers 1055 00:56:46,400 --> 00:56:49,800 Speaker 1: engaging in racial profiling, the Pennsylvania State Police began collecting 1056 00:56:49,880 --> 00:56:52,080 Speaker 1: racial data on their traffic stops and sending it to 1057 00:56:52,120 --> 00:56:55,400 Speaker 1: the University of Cincinnati for analysis and to its credit. 1058 00:56:55,520 --> 00:56:58,319 Speaker 1: To their credit, the data revealed that the Pennsylvania State 1059 00:56:58,360 --> 00:57:00,960 Speaker 1: Police were not exhibiting in racial bias and who they 1060 00:57:01,040 --> 00:57:04,240 Speaker 1: pulled over. So that's nice. However, the data did show 1061 00:57:04,440 --> 00:57:06,680 Speaker 1: that they were exhibiting hell of bias when it came 1062 00:57:06,719 --> 00:57:09,720 Speaker 1: to who they searched. Troopers were two to three times 1063 00:57:09,719 --> 00:57:12,960 Speaker 1: as likely to search black or Hispanic drivers as white drivers, 1064 00:57:13,120 --> 00:57:16,320 Speaker 1: even though black and Hispanic drivers were vastly less likely 1065 00:57:16,400 --> 00:57:20,360 Speaker 1: to have contraband on their persons than white drivers. Now 1066 00:57:20,440 --> 00:57:22,240 Speaker 1: and again, this is pretty true across the nation, but 1067 00:57:22,280 --> 00:57:24,439 Speaker 1: it was specifically true for the Pennsylvania State Police. They're 1068 00:57:24,440 --> 00:57:26,360 Speaker 1: like three times as likely to search you if you're 1069 00:57:26,400 --> 00:57:29,400 Speaker 1: black or Hispanic, but white people are the ones actually 1070 00:57:29,400 --> 00:57:31,960 Speaker 1: bringing all the drugs in. So when this data was 1071 00:57:32,040 --> 00:57:35,520 Speaker 1: made public, the Pennsylvania State Police ended their relationship with 1072 00:57:35,560 --> 00:57:39,400 Speaker 1: the University of Cincinnati because the University of Cincinnati show 1073 00:57:39,440 --> 00:57:41,520 Speaker 1: that they were being racist as hell. Uh. And the 1074 00:57:41,560 --> 00:57:44,760 Speaker 1: Pennsylvania State Police is now the largest of only eleven 1075 00:57:44,880 --> 00:57:47,520 Speaker 1: statewide law enforcement agencies in the nation who do not 1076 00:57:47,640 --> 00:57:51,720 Speaker 1: collect racial data during stops. Wow, so that's good, good 1077 00:57:51,720 --> 00:57:55,200 Speaker 1: on you. Okay there it is Pennsylvania State Police. Yeah, 1078 00:57:55,520 --> 00:57:57,320 Speaker 1: if I can, if I can draw some logical like 1079 00:57:57,480 --> 00:58:00,479 Speaker 1: ties with this one, like you know why and brown 1080 00:58:00,560 --> 00:58:04,160 Speaker 1: people are less likely to have contraband on them is 1081 00:58:04,200 --> 00:58:07,440 Speaker 1: because we more likely to be searched. That's just as reels. 1082 00:58:07,480 --> 00:58:10,560 Speaker 1: It's real simple, you know, like you know, so we're 1083 00:58:10,560 --> 00:58:15,720 Speaker 1: not gonna have it on us, right also and and 1084 00:58:15,760 --> 00:58:18,600 Speaker 1: I a little a little tangent on this, but like 1085 00:58:20,880 --> 00:58:24,840 Speaker 1: your and it's so crazy that like it's it's all 1086 00:58:24,880 --> 00:58:29,400 Speaker 1: out of this fear of these you know, this dangerous class. 1087 00:58:29,960 --> 00:58:34,480 Speaker 1: But like the truth is, we're probably not gonna rob 1088 00:58:34,560 --> 00:58:40,480 Speaker 1: that Chad or Tyler or Hunter or Karen because the 1089 00:58:40,560 --> 00:58:45,560 Speaker 1: police will come if we rob you. So the truth 1090 00:58:45,680 --> 00:58:48,520 Speaker 1: is you're actually more safe than the rest of us 1091 00:58:48,920 --> 00:58:52,160 Speaker 1: because because if one of us die, if one of 1092 00:58:52,240 --> 00:58:54,960 Speaker 1: us get robbed, please don't care, you know what I'm saying. 1093 00:58:55,160 --> 00:59:02,160 Speaker 1: But but I know the police come in if if 1094 00:59:02,240 --> 00:59:05,160 Speaker 1: Karen has issues. So it's such a like this like 1095 00:59:06,240 --> 00:59:10,840 Speaker 1: this this bias that like is just a reality of 1096 00:59:10,840 --> 00:59:18,000 Speaker 1: our life, you know. In some ways, again, I get 1097 00:59:18,120 --> 00:59:26,080 Speaker 1: how it's worked. If we're talking sheer pragmatism in favor 1098 00:59:26,800 --> 00:59:30,240 Speaker 1: for this white ruling class, which is why we called 1099 00:59:30,240 --> 00:59:32,280 Speaker 1: it privilege. If you can't follow along, you know what 1100 00:59:32,280 --> 00:59:35,720 Speaker 1: I'm saying, Like it's but it's just it's but it's privileged, 1101 00:59:35,760 --> 00:59:39,920 Speaker 1: but not how you think it's. Like it's it's different. 1102 00:59:40,000 --> 00:59:43,520 Speaker 1: It's not it's not the way you set it up for. Yeah, yeah, 1103 00:59:43,520 --> 00:59:45,480 Speaker 1: it's this thing. It's like there was that video going 1104 00:59:45,480 --> 00:59:47,120 Speaker 1: around of I don't know a week or so ago 1105 00:59:47,200 --> 00:59:49,240 Speaker 1: and maybe a wee get into the protests when like 1106 00:59:49,360 --> 00:59:50,880 Speaker 1: those I think it was in l A. This like 1107 00:59:50,920 --> 00:59:53,000 Speaker 1: big group of like white people all like recited a 1108 00:59:53,040 --> 00:59:55,840 Speaker 1: thing renouncing their white privilege, and I'm like, it doesn't 1109 00:59:55,880 --> 01:00:01,280 Speaker 1: work like that. You can't just it's guys. Thanks, Like, yeah, 1110 01:00:01,400 --> 01:00:03,480 Speaker 1: I'm sure you feel good. But like now, if you 1111 01:00:03,520 --> 01:00:04,880 Speaker 1: were to get rid of the l A p D, 1112 01:00:05,200 --> 01:00:08,120 Speaker 1: then you actually have reduced your white privilege. That's that's 1113 01:00:08,120 --> 01:00:11,320 Speaker 1: a step then you have. Yeah, I'm like you could 1114 01:00:11,360 --> 01:00:14,640 Speaker 1: just like use it for good, you know. Like there's 1115 01:00:14,680 --> 01:00:18,280 Speaker 1: that I'm saying. Yeah, it's so funny. It's like we're 1116 01:00:18,440 --> 01:00:23,160 Speaker 1: like man, some some some somebody somebody's And it sucks 1117 01:00:23,160 --> 01:00:26,280 Speaker 1: to say it because I'm like, I am deeply and 1118 01:00:26,360 --> 01:00:32,800 Speaker 1: intimately involved with and love white progressive circles. I am involved, 1119 01:00:32,920 --> 01:00:34,640 Speaker 1: These are my friends, is in my family, you know 1120 01:00:34,640 --> 01:00:37,160 Speaker 1: what I'm saying. Um, But it's so funny to watch 1121 01:00:37,200 --> 01:00:43,360 Speaker 1: them like simultaneously do the most and nothing at all 1122 01:00:43,480 --> 01:00:45,600 Speaker 1: at the same time. You know what I'm saying, like 1123 01:00:45,680 --> 01:00:48,840 Speaker 1: that's such a such a grand statement to be like 1124 01:00:48,920 --> 01:00:52,680 Speaker 1: I'm denouncing my privilege, but that literally does nothing for me. 1125 01:00:53,840 --> 01:00:59,360 Speaker 1: So like it's like it's it's I can't It's like 1126 01:00:59,400 --> 01:01:03,320 Speaker 1: I don't know, I don't know what to tell you guys, 1127 01:01:03,600 --> 01:01:08,720 Speaker 1: Like I just just you know, treat us fairly and 1128 01:01:08,960 --> 01:01:11,360 Speaker 1: help us to fund the police. That's all. Like, you know, 1129 01:01:11,520 --> 01:01:14,000 Speaker 1: you ain't gotta what fun you what we wearing a 1130 01:01:14,040 --> 01:01:17,080 Speaker 1: kintake cloth for, Like, just make some good laws, makes 1131 01:01:17,120 --> 01:01:19,960 Speaker 1: some good laws. Just makes some good laws or remove 1132 01:01:20,080 --> 01:01:23,240 Speaker 1: bad ones either helps, just just one of in things. 1133 01:01:23,800 --> 01:01:28,600 Speaker 1: Thank you appreciate it. I see you're we're here, we're listening. 1134 01:01:29,000 --> 01:01:31,600 Speaker 1: I see it. Can you just like make some laws though, 1135 01:01:32,000 --> 01:01:35,680 Speaker 1: you know, unfuncked the fun a little bit. Yeah anyway, Yeah, 1136 01:01:35,720 --> 01:01:37,840 Speaker 1: that feels like a good note to take a break on. 1137 01:01:37,960 --> 01:01:41,080 Speaker 1: I'm just saying, speaking of unfucking the funcknus. You know 1138 01:01:41,120 --> 01:01:51,360 Speaker 1: what what fuck the funcknus? More is these product Executive 1139 01:01:51,400 --> 01:01:55,800 Speaker 1: producer Paris Hilton brings back the hit podcast How Men Think, 1140 01:01:56,240 --> 01:01:59,520 Speaker 1: And that's good news for anyone that is confused by men, 1141 01:01:59,800 --> 01:02:03,320 Speaker 1: which is basically everyone get an inside look at what 1142 01:02:03,400 --> 01:02:06,440 Speaker 1: goes on in the mind of men from the men themselves. 1143 01:02:06,680 --> 01:02:10,240 Speaker 1: It's real talk, straight from the source. How Men Think 1144 01:02:10,280 --> 01:02:12,919 Speaker 1: podcast is exactly what we need to figure them out. 1145 01:02:13,200 --> 01:02:16,160 Speaker 1: It's going to be fun and formative and probably a 1146 01:02:16,160 --> 01:02:19,520 Speaker 1: bit scary at times, because we're literally going inside the 1147 01:02:19,600 --> 01:02:22,240 Speaker 1: minds of men. As much as we like to think 1148 01:02:22,360 --> 01:02:26,600 Speaker 1: all men are the same, they're actually very different. Each week, 1149 01:02:26,720 --> 01:02:30,280 Speaker 1: a celebrity guest host provides honest advice in his area 1150 01:02:30,360 --> 01:02:33,200 Speaker 1: of expertise. When I agreed to do this reboot, I 1151 01:02:33,240 --> 01:02:37,600 Speaker 1: had a few conditions. No sugarcoating, no mind games, and 1152 01:02:37,680 --> 01:02:41,960 Speaker 1: absolutely no man splaining. Men are hard enough to understand 1153 01:02:41,960 --> 01:02:45,000 Speaker 1: without the mind games. Listen to How Men Think on 1154 01:02:45,040 --> 01:02:48,240 Speaker 1: the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you 1155 01:02:48,280 --> 01:02:51,600 Speaker 1: get your podcasts. I'm Tanya Sam, host of the Money 1156 01:02:51,640 --> 01:02:55,080 Speaker 1: Moves podcast powered by Greenwood. This daily podcast will help 1157 01:02:55,120 --> 01:02:57,760 Speaker 1: give you the keys to the Kingdom of financial stability, 1158 01:02:57,960 --> 01:03:01,880 Speaker 1: wealth and abundance. With celebrity like Rick Ross, Amanda Selle's 1159 01:03:01,920 --> 01:03:05,440 Speaker 1: Angela Ye, Roland Martin, JB. Smooth, and Terrell Owens. Tune 1160 01:03:05,480 --> 01:03:07,960 Speaker 1: in to learn how to turn liabilities into assets and 1161 01:03:08,000 --> 01:03:13,880 Speaker 1: make your money move Subscribe to the Money Moves podcast 1162 01:03:13,920 --> 01:03:16,160 Speaker 1: powered by Greenland on the I Heart Radio app or 1163 01:03:16,200 --> 01:03:19,000 Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts, and make sure you leave 1164 01:03:19,000 --> 01:03:24,240 Speaker 1: a review. I'm Jake Halbern, host of deep Cover. Our 1165 01:03:24,280 --> 01:03:26,920 Speaker 1: new season is about a lawyer who helped the mob 1166 01:03:27,120 --> 01:03:31,560 Speaker 1: run Chicago. We controlled the courts, We controlled absolutely everything. 1167 01:03:32,400 --> 01:03:35,160 Speaker 1: He bribed judges and even helped a hit man walk 1168 01:03:35,280 --> 01:03:38,400 Speaker 1: free until one day when he started talking with the 1169 01:03:38,480 --> 01:03:41,760 Speaker 1: FBI and promised that he could take the mob down. 1170 01:03:42,520 --> 01:03:44,680 Speaker 1: I've spent the past year trying to figure out why 1171 01:03:44,680 --> 01:03:48,040 Speaker 1: he flipped and what he was really after. From my perspective, 1172 01:03:48,200 --> 01:03:50,440 Speaker 1: Bob was too good to be true. There's gotta be 1173 01:03:50,520 --> 01:03:53,480 Speaker 1: something wrong with this. I wouldn't trust that guy. He 1174 01:03:53,560 --> 01:03:56,440 Speaker 1: looks like a little scum, big lawyer, stool bidging you 1175 01:03:56,480 --> 01:03:58,919 Speaker 1: looked like what he was or at. I can say 1176 01:03:58,960 --> 01:04:01,360 Speaker 1: with all certainty I think he's a hero because he 1177 01:04:01,400 --> 01:04:03,040 Speaker 1: didn't have to do what he did, and he did 1178 01:04:03,040 --> 01:04:05,400 Speaker 1: it anyway. The moment I put the wire around the 1179 01:04:05,520 --> 01:04:09,040 Speaker 1: first time, my life was over. If it ever got out, 1180 01:04:09,360 --> 01:04:12,360 Speaker 1: they would kill me in a heartbeat. Listen to deep 1181 01:04:12,400 --> 01:04:15,040 Speaker 1: Cover on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or 1182 01:04:15,080 --> 01:04:22,600 Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts. We're back and we're talking 1183 01:04:22,680 --> 01:04:26,520 Speaker 1: about for good. And one way you can use your 1184 01:04:26,520 --> 01:04:28,760 Speaker 1: privilege to good for good is I don't know, if 1185 01:04:28,760 --> 01:04:31,800 Speaker 1: you're listening and you happen to have purple heart plates 1186 01:04:31,960 --> 01:04:33,320 Speaker 1: and you have a bunch of friends who have to 1187 01:04:33,400 --> 01:04:36,160 Speaker 1: drive substances somewhere, maybe you ought to be the one 1188 01:04:36,240 --> 01:04:38,120 Speaker 1: driving the substances because the police aren't going to give 1189 01:04:38,120 --> 01:04:41,000 Speaker 1: a shit about you. That's what I'm saying. That's what 1190 01:04:41,040 --> 01:04:48,280 Speaker 1: I'm saying. Yeah, veterans for drug smuggling. Is that, yes, yes, 1191 01:04:49,480 --> 01:04:51,920 Speaker 1: record that. Like, I'm not trying to go hard. I'm 1192 01:04:51,920 --> 01:04:54,040 Speaker 1: not trying to go hard at my wife progressives like 1193 01:04:54,640 --> 01:04:57,120 Speaker 1: I appreciate all in the costs. It's just I just 1194 01:04:57,160 --> 01:05:00,960 Speaker 1: want to say that, Okay, this is fun day. So yeah, 1195 01:05:01,000 --> 01:05:03,560 Speaker 1: it's worth considering, within the broader context of the development 1196 01:05:03,600 --> 01:05:06,080 Speaker 1: of US law enforcement that the cops did not always 1197 01:05:06,120 --> 01:05:09,080 Speaker 1: site enthusiastically when cap with capital when it came to 1198 01:05:09,080 --> 01:05:12,160 Speaker 1: struggles over labor. We previously did a two part episode 1199 01:05:12,160 --> 01:05:14,120 Speaker 1: on the Battle of Blair Mountain, which was a massive 1200 01:05:14,160 --> 01:05:16,480 Speaker 1: coal strike that ended it in an enormous, pitched battle 1201 01:05:16,520 --> 01:05:20,000 Speaker 1: that included aerial bombardment, machine guns, and thousands of combatants 1202 01:05:20,040 --> 01:05:23,000 Speaker 1: on both sides. One of the great Union heroes of 1203 01:05:23,000 --> 01:05:25,680 Speaker 1: that whole mess was Sheriff sid Hatfield, who gunned down 1204 01:05:25,720 --> 01:05:29,760 Speaker 1: several mercenaries from the Baldwin Felts detective agencies. Many strikes 1205 01:05:29,800 --> 01:05:31,600 Speaker 1: did take place in small communities out in the middle 1206 01:05:31,600 --> 01:05:33,800 Speaker 1: of nowhere, and law enforcement in those places was much 1207 01:05:33,840 --> 01:05:36,400 Speaker 1: more kind of rooted in public spirit, these old attitudes 1208 01:05:36,400 --> 01:05:38,560 Speaker 1: of what law enforcement should be, than kind of the 1209 01:05:38,600 --> 01:05:42,000 Speaker 1: new attitudes about law enforcement. And in those cases, you know, 1210 01:05:42,080 --> 01:05:44,760 Speaker 1: cops who were sort of like elected or brought up 1211 01:05:44,760 --> 01:05:46,360 Speaker 1: within the community and felt like a part of it, 1212 01:05:46,360 --> 01:05:49,080 Speaker 1: and the community was all Union law enforcement would regularly 1213 01:05:49,120 --> 01:05:51,680 Speaker 1: side with the strikers in those situations, or it would 1214 01:05:51,680 --> 01:05:55,040 Speaker 1: at least feel too frightened of their neighbors to enthusiastically 1215 01:05:55,080 --> 01:05:57,959 Speaker 1: back the mind companies. And this was enough of a problem. 1216 01:05:58,000 --> 01:05:59,800 Speaker 1: This wasn't everywhere, but it was enough of a problem. 1217 01:05:59,800 --> 01:06:03,440 Speaker 1: That's Starting in the eighteen seventies, capitalists also began using 1218 01:06:03,480 --> 01:06:07,360 Speaker 1: private police as strikebreakers with increasing frequency, and no private 1219 01:06:07,400 --> 01:06:11,040 Speaker 1: police agency did a better job of this than the Pinkerton's. 1220 01:06:11,480 --> 01:06:13,560 Speaker 1: You know about the Pinkerton's. We're talking some Pinkerton's now 1221 01:06:13,560 --> 01:06:15,400 Speaker 1: I do know about the Pinkers. Yeah, we're talking about 1222 01:06:15,400 --> 01:06:18,280 Speaker 1: some motherfucking Pinkerton's. She's yeah, we're gonna have to do 1223 01:06:18,280 --> 01:06:20,640 Speaker 1: a whole two partner probably in the Pinkerton's at some point. 1224 01:06:20,680 --> 01:06:23,160 Speaker 1: But but you can't talk about the history of US 1225 01:06:23,240 --> 01:06:26,880 Speaker 1: law enforcement talking about some motherfucking Pinkerton's. Yes, yeah, the 1226 01:06:26,920 --> 01:06:31,960 Speaker 1: cock sucking Pinkerton's to pull pull from fucking deadwood. Yum, 1227 01:06:32,000 --> 01:06:35,480 Speaker 1: So here it goes. Allan Pinkerton was born in Glasgow, Scotland, 1228 01:06:35,560 --> 01:06:38,520 Speaker 1: in eighteen nineteen. His father was a policeman of the 1229 01:06:38,600 --> 01:06:41,520 Speaker 1: for profit freelance Variety and he was killed on the job. 1230 01:06:41,680 --> 01:06:44,080 Speaker 1: So Alan grew up dirt poor, laboring from an early 1231 01:06:44,120 --> 01:06:46,400 Speaker 1: age to help keep his family fed. He became an 1232 01:06:46,400 --> 01:06:50,040 Speaker 1: activist in his youth, agitating for democratic reform in Great Britain, 1233 01:06:50,200 --> 01:06:52,320 Speaker 1: and he was violenced by the state for speaking out 1234 01:06:52,360 --> 01:06:54,840 Speaker 1: against it. By eighteen forty two, he had been forced 1235 01:06:54,880 --> 01:06:57,400 Speaker 1: to flee the country with his wife. The pair wound 1236 01:06:57,440 --> 01:07:00,400 Speaker 1: up living in Dundee, Illinois, and Allan set up barrel 1237 01:07:00,440 --> 01:07:04,360 Speaker 1: making business. In eighteen forty seven, year old Allan Pinkerton 1238 01:07:04,440 --> 01:07:07,200 Speaker 1: traveled out to an uninhabited island to look for wood 1239 01:07:07,200 --> 01:07:09,040 Speaker 1: that he could make into more barrels, because that was 1240 01:07:09,040 --> 01:07:11,520 Speaker 1: his thing. He found a campsite there, and the camp 1241 01:07:11,560 --> 01:07:14,600 Speaker 1: site was abandoned but clearly fresh. And because he was 1242 01:07:14,640 --> 01:07:16,480 Speaker 1: a born and bred cop, this guy was like kind 1243 01:07:16,520 --> 01:07:19,600 Speaker 1: of in his fucking bones a cop. H Allen decided 1244 01:07:19,640 --> 01:07:22,000 Speaker 1: not to mind his own damn business. He returned to 1245 01:07:22,040 --> 01:07:24,600 Speaker 1: that night and hid nearby until the camp's occupants, a 1246 01:07:24,600 --> 01:07:28,200 Speaker 1: group of counterfeiters, returned. Alan instantly went to the sheriff 1247 01:07:28,240 --> 01:07:31,560 Speaker 1: and reported them, and the gang was arrested. So not 1248 01:07:31,720 --> 01:07:34,320 Speaker 1: my kind of dude, but like fundamentally a cop, like 1249 01:07:34,360 --> 01:07:38,320 Speaker 1: emotionally a cop. So counterfeiting was a massive problem for 1250 01:07:38,360 --> 01:07:40,760 Speaker 1: business owners in the yearly United States, and the local 1251 01:07:40,800 --> 01:07:43,640 Speaker 1: merchants made Pinkerton into a hero for busting this group. 1252 01:07:43,960 --> 01:07:46,640 Speaker 1: He started getting offers to investigate other crimes, and very 1253 01:07:46,680 --> 01:07:49,240 Speaker 1: quickly Allan Pinkerton had become the go to man for 1254 01:07:49,280 --> 01:07:53,200 Speaker 1: busting counterfeit coin operations in Illinois. He was soon deputized 1255 01:07:53,200 --> 01:07:55,600 Speaker 1: by the sheriff of Kane County, Illinois, and in eighteen 1256 01:07:55,680 --> 01:07:58,120 Speaker 1: forty nine he became the city of Chicago's first full 1257 01:07:58,160 --> 01:08:02,520 Speaker 1: time detective. By eighteen fifth, Alan founded Pinkerton's Detective Agency. 1258 01:08:02,800 --> 01:08:05,400 Speaker 1: In less than twenty years, it had expanded to include 1259 01:08:05,400 --> 01:08:09,280 Speaker 1: branches in New York and Philadelphia. Allen quickly expanded outside 1260 01:08:09,280 --> 01:08:12,920 Speaker 1: of just detective work. He created Pinkerton's Protective Police Patrol, 1261 01:08:13,240 --> 01:08:16,680 Speaker 1: a group of uniformed night watchmen that local businesses could 1262 01:08:16,720 --> 01:08:19,680 Speaker 1: hire to protect their shops. Pinkerton men, some of whom 1263 01:08:19,720 --> 01:08:23,639 Speaker 1: were women, also acted as undercover cops, often feeding information 1264 01:08:23,680 --> 01:08:27,400 Speaker 1: on criminal syndicates directly to regular police. The Pinkerton's grew 1265 01:08:27,400 --> 01:08:30,519 Speaker 1: to become a legendary force in the Old West, helping 1266 01:08:30,520 --> 01:08:33,840 Speaker 1: to hunt down criminals like Jesse James, and there is 1267 01:08:33,840 --> 01:08:36,439 Speaker 1: some moral complexity years This isn't an easy story because 1268 01:08:36,479 --> 01:08:39,360 Speaker 1: while Alan Pinkerton was absolutely just a total fucking cop, 1269 01:08:39,560 --> 01:08:42,880 Speaker 1: he was also a really staunch and consistent abolitionist. Part 1270 01:08:42,960 --> 01:08:45,040 Speaker 1: of what drew him to hunt down Jesse James was 1271 01:08:45,080 --> 01:08:49,719 Speaker 1: the fact that James had been an enthusiastic Confederate soldier. Pinkerton, meanwhile, 1272 01:08:49,760 --> 01:08:52,320 Speaker 1: had worked for the Underground Railroad and had helped to 1273 01:08:52,320 --> 01:08:55,880 Speaker 1: guard Abraham Lincoln. But even when pinkerton targets were clearly 1274 01:08:55,880 --> 01:08:59,639 Speaker 1: bad people like James, their methods were often still unaccountably brutal. 1275 01:09:00,160 --> 01:09:03,080 Speaker 1: The Pinkerton Agency actually rated Jesse James's house. It was 1276 01:09:03,120 --> 01:09:05,400 Speaker 1: basically like a no knock raid that they carried out, 1277 01:09:05,600 --> 01:09:07,760 Speaker 1: and they fucked up and attacked during a time when 1278 01:09:07,840 --> 01:09:10,760 Speaker 1: James was not present, and instead, during the raid they 1279 01:09:10,760 --> 01:09:13,080 Speaker 1: blew off his mother's arm and murdered his eight and 1280 01:09:13,080 --> 01:09:16,679 Speaker 1: a half year old younger brother. Um like, yeah, this, this, 1281 01:09:16,680 --> 01:09:19,599 Speaker 1: this is a fucking no knock right, yeah, so again, 1282 01:09:19,800 --> 01:09:22,280 Speaker 1: even when they picked the right bad guys, they wound 1283 01:09:22,360 --> 01:09:26,679 Speaker 1: up murdering an eight year old. She's not great. Not great. 1284 01:09:27,479 --> 01:09:30,439 Speaker 1: So later in life, Allan Pinkerton hit upon the brilliant 1285 01:09:30,439 --> 01:09:33,639 Speaker 1: idea of writing semi fictionalized accounts of the most famous 1286 01:09:33,640 --> 01:09:36,559 Speaker 1: detective cases in Pinkerton history, and these books became some 1287 01:09:36,600 --> 01:09:39,200 Speaker 1: of the very first true crime stories in the history 1288 01:09:39,200 --> 01:09:42,160 Speaker 1: of literature. But while the agency was famous for tales 1289 01:09:42,200 --> 01:09:45,120 Speaker 1: of sleuthing and daring do while confronting bandits and bank robbers, 1290 01:09:45,400 --> 01:09:48,760 Speaker 1: the bulk of the Pinkerton Agency's business came from protecting 1291 01:09:48,800 --> 01:09:52,920 Speaker 1: capital by fighting labor. The first Pinkerton strike breakers were 1292 01:09:52,960 --> 01:09:55,800 Speaker 1: hired in eighteen sixty six when miners in Illinois went 1293 01:09:55,800 --> 01:09:58,639 Speaker 1: on strike and the mining company needed protection for their scabs, 1294 01:09:58,640 --> 01:10:00,439 Speaker 1: which are the people like the company rings in to 1295 01:10:00,479 --> 01:10:04,320 Speaker 1: work the minds when the workers refuse. Now, over the years, 1296 01:10:04,360 --> 01:10:06,800 Speaker 1: the Pickerton has developed a standard set of procedures, with 1297 01:10:06,920 --> 01:10:10,200 Speaker 1: armed men escorting scabs into factories and mines while Pinkerton 1298 01:10:10,280 --> 01:10:13,040 Speaker 1: guards and towers aimed machine guns at strikers to keep 1299 01:10:13,080 --> 01:10:16,320 Speaker 1: them away. Alan Pinkerton died in eighteen eighty four, and 1300 01:10:16,320 --> 01:10:18,519 Speaker 1: his son took over the agency and doubled down on 1301 01:10:18,560 --> 01:10:21,559 Speaker 1: strike breaking. By eighteen nine two, the Pinkerton's had helped 1302 01:10:21,560 --> 01:10:26,120 Speaker 1: to break seventy seven strikes. Now, after eighteen nine two, 1303 01:10:26,120 --> 01:10:29,360 Speaker 1: though the agency really stopped doing as much over at 1304 01:10:29,400 --> 01:10:32,720 Speaker 1: strike breaking. They shifted more into industrial espionage and infiltrating 1305 01:10:32,800 --> 01:10:35,320 Speaker 1: labor movements rather than confronting them with guns. And the 1306 01:10:35,400 --> 01:10:38,400 Speaker 1: reason for this was because of a vicious battle that 1307 01:10:38,479 --> 01:10:42,720 Speaker 1: took place in the town of Homestead, Pennsylvania. Here we go, Yeah, 1308 01:10:42,800 --> 01:10:46,120 Speaker 1: the Homestead strike, So we go. Homestead was a steel 1309 01:10:46,240 --> 01:10:49,400 Speaker 1: town built around and for a huge steel plant owned 1310 01:10:49,400 --> 01:10:52,160 Speaker 1: by the Carnegie Steel Company. You know, you've all we 1311 01:10:52,200 --> 01:10:54,720 Speaker 1: all here know the Carnegie Foundation. We hear about them 1312 01:10:54,720 --> 01:10:57,000 Speaker 1: in like PBS and ship. Yeah, this is where that 1313 01:10:57,080 --> 01:11:00,639 Speaker 1: money comes from. So in eighteen ninety there of rolled 1314 01:11:00,720 --> 01:11:03,080 Speaker 1: steel products that started to fall and the manager of 1315 01:11:03,080 --> 01:11:05,880 Speaker 1: the Homestead plant, a dude named Henry Frick, decided to 1316 01:11:05,920 --> 01:11:09,320 Speaker 1: cut wages. Neither his wages nor his boss are Andrew 1317 01:11:09,360 --> 01:11:11,960 Speaker 1: Carnegie's wages were to be cut, of course, and in fact, 1318 01:11:12,080 --> 01:11:15,040 Speaker 1: to maintain their wages, they had to take the company 1319 01:11:15,080 --> 01:11:17,680 Speaker 1: losses out of their workers pockets, and they decided the 1320 01:11:17,720 --> 01:11:20,040 Speaker 1: best way to do that was to destroy the Amalgamated 1321 01:11:20,080 --> 01:11:22,559 Speaker 1: Association of Iron and Steel Workers, which was at the 1322 01:11:22,600 --> 01:11:26,240 Speaker 1: time the nation's largest craft union. Now here's where it 1323 01:11:26,240 --> 01:11:28,920 Speaker 1: gets interesting, because Andrew Carnegie was, you know, one of 1324 01:11:28,960 --> 01:11:31,240 Speaker 1: the good ones if we're talking about millionaires, Like that's 1325 01:11:31,240 --> 01:11:32,599 Speaker 1: how a lot of people would have viewed him at 1326 01:11:32,600 --> 01:11:35,479 Speaker 1: the time. Um, he was vocally pro labor, Like he 1327 01:11:35,600 --> 01:11:38,160 Speaker 1: made public statements in favor of labor and saying that 1328 01:11:38,280 --> 01:11:40,479 Speaker 1: unions had a reason to exist. And this was in 1329 01:11:40,640 --> 01:11:42,920 Speaker 1: keeping with his reputation as a philanthropist, you know, a 1330 01:11:42,960 --> 01:11:45,720 Speaker 1: millionaire you could trust. But of course, the instant his 1331 01:11:45,800 --> 01:11:48,599 Speaker 1: profits were threatened, Carnegie had no time for the union 1332 01:11:48,600 --> 01:11:53,000 Speaker 1: anymore and resisted, uh like efforts, Yeah exactly. So like 1333 01:11:53,439 --> 01:11:55,519 Speaker 1: he's he's like, yeah, unions are fine when the money 1334 01:11:55,640 --> 01:11:58,880 Speaker 1: is good, but when his money has threatened, unions gotta go. 1335 01:11:59,160 --> 01:12:03,200 Speaker 1: That's Andrew carneg Yeah, it sounds about right, sounds about right. 1336 01:12:03,280 --> 01:12:07,080 Speaker 1: So in the in the spring of eight two, Carnegie 1337 01:12:07,160 --> 01:12:10,360 Speaker 1: instructed Frick to push company workers to make as much 1338 01:12:10,400 --> 01:12:13,559 Speaker 1: steel as possible before the union contract expired that June, 1339 01:12:13,560 --> 01:12:15,479 Speaker 1: because the union contract expired and then they were gonna 1340 01:12:15,479 --> 01:12:17,800 Speaker 1: have to negotiate a new one, and the union didn't 1341 01:12:17,840 --> 01:12:20,160 Speaker 1: want to make less money, but Carnegie wanted to pay 1342 01:12:20,200 --> 01:12:22,599 Speaker 1: them less. So if the union had failed to accept 1343 01:12:22,640 --> 01:12:25,280 Speaker 1: the new terms that Carnegie and Frick offered, Andrew was 1344 01:12:25,320 --> 01:12:27,439 Speaker 1: just going to have the plant managers shut the factory 1345 01:12:27,439 --> 01:12:30,360 Speaker 1: down until the laborers were lented. He wrote to Frick, 1346 01:12:30,479 --> 01:12:32,680 Speaker 1: we approve of every anything you do. We are with 1347 01:12:32,720 --> 01:12:35,719 Speaker 1: you to the end. Now Carnegie wasn't physically with Frick, 1348 01:12:35,760 --> 01:12:37,320 Speaker 1: how of course, he was off at one of his 1349 01:12:37,360 --> 01:12:39,920 Speaker 1: many palaces. This one was in Scotland, just kind of 1350 01:12:40,000 --> 01:12:42,439 Speaker 1: chilling um. So Frick was left to figure out how 1351 01:12:42,479 --> 01:12:45,000 Speaker 1: to confront labor on his own. And I'm going to 1352 01:12:45,040 --> 01:12:46,600 Speaker 1: quote now from a write up on the strike and 1353 01:12:46,640 --> 01:12:51,800 Speaker 1: PBSS American Experience Series with Carnegie's carte blaunch support, Frick 1354 01:12:52,000 --> 01:12:54,880 Speaker 1: moved to slash wages. Plant workers were responded by hanging 1355 01:12:54,880 --> 01:12:57,479 Speaker 1: freaking effigy. The union fought not just for better wages, 1356 01:12:57,520 --> 01:13:00,000 Speaker 1: but also for a say in America's new industrial order. 1357 01:13:00,400 --> 01:13:02,599 Speaker 1: Though Carnegie and Frick had brought unions to heal at 1358 01:13:02,600 --> 01:13:06,280 Speaker 1: their other mills, Homestead remained untamed. Workers believe that because 1359 01:13:06,280 --> 01:13:08,000 Speaker 1: they had worked in the mill, they had mixed their 1360 01:13:08,080 --> 01:13:11,600 Speaker 1: labor with the property of the mill. Explains historian Paul Krauss. 1361 01:13:11,640 --> 01:13:14,479 Speaker 1: They believed that in some way the property had become theirs, 1362 01:13:14,800 --> 01:13:17,240 Speaker 1: not that it wasn't Andrew Carnegie's, not that they were 1363 01:13:17,240 --> 01:13:19,599 Speaker 1: the sole proprietors of the mill, but that they had 1364 01:13:19,640 --> 01:13:22,000 Speaker 1: an entitlement to the mill. And I think, in a 1365 01:13:22,000 --> 01:13:25,120 Speaker 1: fundamental way, the conflict at Homestead in two was about 1366 01:13:25,160 --> 01:13:29,719 Speaker 1: these two conflicting ideas of property. Now, on June, Freak 1367 01:13:29,720 --> 01:13:32,120 Speaker 1: announced that he would no longer negotiate with the union. 1368 01:13:32,320 --> 01:13:35,120 Speaker 1: Now he would only deal with the workers individually. Leaders 1369 01:13:35,120 --> 01:13:38,040 Speaker 1: had amalgamated were willing to concede on almost every level 1370 01:13:38,080 --> 01:13:41,519 Speaker 1: except the dissolution of their union. On June, despite the 1371 01:13:41,560 --> 01:13:44,599 Speaker 1: union's willingness to negotiate, Frick closed down his open hearth 1372 01:13:44,600 --> 01:13:47,400 Speaker 1: and armor plate mills, locking out thirty eight hundred men. 1373 01:13:48,120 --> 01:13:50,200 Speaker 1: So there's a lot that's interesting here. One of them 1374 01:13:50,240 --> 01:13:52,640 Speaker 1: is that like a lot of these guys, you know, 1375 01:13:52,680 --> 01:13:55,040 Speaker 1: these guys aren't super educated, they haven't read you know, 1376 01:13:55,120 --> 01:13:57,240 Speaker 1: their marks or whatever, but they kind of recognized this 1377 01:13:57,320 --> 01:14:00,760 Speaker 1: idea of like, oh, you know, not that worker. They 1378 01:14:00,760 --> 01:14:03,080 Speaker 1: weren't like workers should own the means of production, but 1379 01:14:03,120 --> 01:14:07,360 Speaker 1: they were like workers should co own the means of production. Yeahatly, 1380 01:14:07,439 --> 01:14:09,000 Speaker 1: that's kind of the idea. These guys kind of come 1381 01:14:09,040 --> 01:14:12,880 Speaker 1: to of their own accord. Now, the union men desperately 1382 01:14:12,920 --> 01:14:16,240 Speaker 1: tried to contact Andrew Carnegie once a Frick closed the plant, 1383 01:14:16,280 --> 01:14:18,240 Speaker 1: because again they thought he was a good guy, like 1384 01:14:18,320 --> 01:14:20,200 Speaker 1: he'd said that unions were okay. They thought that he 1385 01:14:20,240 --> 01:14:22,479 Speaker 1: just didn't understand what was really happening because he was 1386 01:14:22,520 --> 01:14:24,519 Speaker 1: so distant, and if they if they could let him 1387 01:14:24,560 --> 01:14:26,800 Speaker 1: know how bad things for the were for them and 1388 01:14:26,800 --> 01:14:29,679 Speaker 1: how bad Frick was treating them, then he would back them. 1389 01:14:29,880 --> 01:14:31,920 Speaker 1: But of course Andrew Carnegie didn't give a shit about 1390 01:14:31,920 --> 01:14:33,880 Speaker 1: these people. He was on vacation and he had no 1391 01:14:34,000 --> 01:14:36,160 Speaker 1: time for them. He did, however, have time for Frick. 1392 01:14:36,560 --> 01:14:38,960 Speaker 1: He advised Frick that now was their time to destroy 1393 01:14:39,000 --> 01:14:41,280 Speaker 1: the union, believing that his workers would surely give it 1394 01:14:41,360 --> 01:14:44,440 Speaker 1: up if it meant keeping their jobs, even it reduced salary. 1395 01:14:44,640 --> 01:14:48,000 Speaker 1: His workers disagreed. Only seven hundred and fifty homestead men 1396 01:14:48,040 --> 01:14:50,360 Speaker 1: had belonged to the union before all this happened, but 1397 01:14:50,520 --> 01:14:53,280 Speaker 1: three thousand of the plants thirty eight hundred workers agreed 1398 01:14:53,320 --> 01:14:56,840 Speaker 1: to strike once Frick closed the doors. Now to combat them, 1399 01:14:56,920 --> 01:14:59,200 Speaker 1: Frick built a fortress to keep them out, including a 1400 01:14:59,200 --> 01:15:02,280 Speaker 1: twelve foot high, three mile long fence topped with barbed wire. 1401 01:15:02,720 --> 01:15:06,200 Speaker 1: Deputy sheriffs were sworn in to man the fence with rifles. 1402 01:15:06,200 --> 01:15:08,920 Speaker 1: But those sheriffs and their families lived in Homestead, and 1403 01:15:08,960 --> 01:15:11,719 Speaker 1: when three thousands of their neighbors marched on Fort Frick, 1404 01:15:11,840 --> 01:15:14,439 Speaker 1: as it was known, all these deputy sheriffs were like, 1405 01:15:14,600 --> 01:15:16,800 Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not gonna kill all these people I 1406 01:15:16,840 --> 01:15:19,040 Speaker 1: live with. Like, that's that seems like a bad call. 1407 01:15:19,320 --> 01:15:22,200 Speaker 1: So they laid down their arms and left. Now workers 1408 01:15:22,200 --> 01:15:25,320 Speaker 1: then occupied the plant and effectively took over the entire 1409 01:15:25,400 --> 01:15:28,559 Speaker 1: town of Homestead for the very first time in American history. 1410 01:15:28,840 --> 01:15:32,840 Speaker 1: Laborers had quite literally seized the means of production. Now 1411 01:15:33,680 --> 01:15:36,040 Speaker 1: Andrew Carnegie was not a fan of this. He didn't 1412 01:15:36,080 --> 01:15:38,719 Speaker 1: take it lying down. Well, he actually probably was lying 1413 01:15:38,720 --> 01:15:40,880 Speaker 1: down in Scotland, but he hired a bunch of armed 1414 01:15:40,880 --> 01:15:45,840 Speaker 1: Pinkerton's to not take it lying down. For so, the 1415 01:15:45,880 --> 01:15:48,439 Speaker 1: Pinkerton's three d and some out of them got on 1416 01:15:48,479 --> 01:15:50,439 Speaker 1: a bunch of a couple of barges and attempted an 1417 01:15:50,439 --> 01:15:54,120 Speaker 1: aquatic landing at Homestead, essentially a sort of capitalist Normandy, 1418 01:15:54,240 --> 01:15:58,280 Speaker 1: or more accurately Gliboli. The heavily armed Pinkerton's expected this 1419 01:15:58,320 --> 01:15:59,960 Speaker 1: to be like any of the other dozens of strike 1420 01:16:00,080 --> 01:16:01,559 Speaker 1: they broken. You know, they might have to gun down 1421 01:16:01,600 --> 01:16:04,400 Speaker 1: a few people, but these dirt poor factory serfs surely 1422 01:16:04,400 --> 01:16:07,120 Speaker 1: would not be able to compete with their modern Winchester rifles. 1423 01:16:07,520 --> 01:16:10,280 Speaker 1: Three mercenaries with modern guns were sure to be enough 1424 01:16:10,320 --> 01:16:13,840 Speaker 1: to break Homesteads resistance. And again Carnegie and Frick had 1425 01:16:13,920 --> 01:16:17,200 Speaker 1: underestimated the men of Homestead, as one leader recalled to 1426 01:16:17,280 --> 01:16:19,720 Speaker 1: be confronted with a gang of loafers and cutthroats from 1427 01:16:19,760 --> 01:16:22,160 Speaker 1: all over the country coming here there as they thought 1428 01:16:22,200 --> 01:16:24,720 Speaker 1: to take their jobs. Why they naturally wanted to go 1429 01:16:24,800 --> 01:16:26,720 Speaker 1: down and defend their homes and their property with their 1430 01:16:26,760 --> 01:16:30,240 Speaker 1: lives with force if necessary. Course, yeah, and defend their 1431 01:16:30,240 --> 01:16:33,000 Speaker 1: lives the men of Homestead did. When the Pinkerton's landed, 1432 01:16:33,040 --> 01:16:35,400 Speaker 1: they were warned not to step off their barge. When 1433 01:16:35,439 --> 01:16:38,400 Speaker 1: they ignored that warning, people started fucking shooting at them, 1434 01:16:38,400 --> 01:16:42,840 Speaker 1: and a huge gun battle began. And yeah, yeah, yeah 1435 01:16:43,240 --> 01:16:45,600 Speaker 1: that movie. Where's that movie? I know there might be 1436 01:16:45,600 --> 01:16:48,280 Speaker 1: a movie about it. They probably there should be. More so, 1437 01:16:48,320 --> 01:16:51,559 Speaker 1: the Pinkerton's used their steel barges as floating bunkers, firing 1438 01:16:51,560 --> 01:16:54,599 Speaker 1: out at a crowd of Homestead citizenry. The homesteaders had 1439 01:16:54,600 --> 01:16:56,920 Speaker 1: shipped for guns, mostly a handful of hunting rifles and 1440 01:16:56,960 --> 01:16:58,880 Speaker 1: old muskets, but they had a lot of those, and 1441 01:16:58,880 --> 01:17:01,080 Speaker 1: they also had a twenty ound cannon that they got 1442 01:17:01,120 --> 01:17:04,280 Speaker 1: from somewhere. They had dynamite, which they tossed like grenades. 1443 01:17:04,680 --> 01:17:07,439 Speaker 1: A local hardware merchant donated all of the ammunition in 1444 01:17:07,479 --> 01:17:09,600 Speaker 1: his store to the crowd, and for twelve hours the 1445 01:17:09,600 --> 01:17:12,320 Speaker 1: gun battle raged on. By six am the next day, 1446 01:17:12,360 --> 01:17:14,960 Speaker 1: more than five thousand spectators from Pittsburgh had shown up 1447 01:17:15,000 --> 01:17:18,320 Speaker 1: to watch from the river banks. At eight am, Yes, 1448 01:17:19,040 --> 01:17:22,400 Speaker 1: like a live movie. Yeah, we gotta go see the war. 1449 01:17:22,560 --> 01:17:26,120 Speaker 1: There's a war going on. Next. All, Yeah, I guess 1450 01:17:26,120 --> 01:17:29,280 Speaker 1: I'll take a look. Yeah. By eight am, the Pinkerton's 1451 01:17:29,280 --> 01:17:31,920 Speaker 1: had tried to land again. Workers fired their cannon and 1452 01:17:31,960 --> 01:17:34,519 Speaker 1: attempted to scuttle the barges by ramming them with both 1453 01:17:34,520 --> 01:17:37,840 Speaker 1: a burning raft and a burning railroad car. None of 1454 01:17:37,880 --> 01:17:40,360 Speaker 1: this quite worked. Yeah, they were. They were really given 1455 01:17:40,360 --> 01:17:48,200 Speaker 1: it a shot. They committed just like, look, look, yeah, 1456 01:17:48,400 --> 01:17:50,639 Speaker 1: we can't shoot through these barges, but we can throw 1457 01:17:50,800 --> 01:17:54,000 Speaker 1: giant flaming things at the barges and that'll probably funk 1458 01:17:54,040 --> 01:17:59,200 Speaker 1: them up a bit. Now. None of this sunk the barges, 1459 01:17:59,240 --> 01:18:02,400 Speaker 1: but the sheer of fire from the crowd was terrifying 1460 01:18:02,439 --> 01:18:06,000 Speaker 1: to the Pinkerton's who cowered inside. One recalled the noise 1461 01:18:06,040 --> 01:18:07,600 Speaker 1: that they made on the shore was awful, and it 1462 01:18:07,640 --> 01:18:09,599 Speaker 1: made us shake in our boots. We were pinned in 1463 01:18:09,720 --> 01:18:12,120 Speaker 1: like rats, and we went at the fighting like desperate 1464 01:18:12,120 --> 01:18:14,439 Speaker 1: wild men. All of the men were under the beds 1465 01:18:14,439 --> 01:18:18,320 Speaker 1: and bunks, crying and trembling. Another Pinkertons werecalled. It was 1466 01:18:18,360 --> 01:18:21,040 Speaker 1: a place of torment. When men were lying around, wounded 1467 01:18:21,040 --> 01:18:23,240 Speaker 1: and bleeding and piteously begging someone to give them a 1468 01:18:23,320 --> 01:18:25,360 Speaker 1: drink of water, but no one dared to get a drop, 1469 01:18:25,400 --> 01:18:27,799 Speaker 1: although water was all around us. It was a wonder 1470 01:18:27,840 --> 01:18:31,040 Speaker 1: we did not all go crazy or commit suicide. The 1471 01:18:31,080 --> 01:18:34,280 Speaker 1: Pinkerton's tried to surrender four times, and each white flag 1472 01:18:34,320 --> 01:18:36,400 Speaker 1: they rose up was shot down by a sniper on 1473 01:18:36,479 --> 01:18:44,080 Speaker 1: the board, Like we're not done shooting it, you guys yet, friendship. Yeah. Eventually, 1474 01:18:44,080 --> 01:18:47,439 Speaker 1: though the crowd did except the Pinkerton's surrender. The mercenary 1475 01:18:47,479 --> 01:18:49,960 Speaker 1: cops were led onto the shore, beaten and clubbed and 1476 01:18:50,000 --> 01:18:52,040 Speaker 1: pelted with stones as they were taken to the local 1477 01:18:52,160 --> 01:18:55,240 Speaker 1: jail and eventually sent out of town by train. Three 1478 01:18:55,240 --> 01:18:57,800 Speaker 1: to eight Pinkerton's were killed, along with a similar number 1479 01:18:57,800 --> 01:19:00,000 Speaker 1: of strikers, and dozens and dozens of people were wounded. 1480 01:19:00,560 --> 01:19:02,920 Speaker 1: It was a victory for the laboring folks of Homestead, 1481 01:19:03,200 --> 01:19:06,200 Speaker 1: but sadly, not one that lasted. Frick next asked the 1482 01:19:06,240 --> 01:19:08,439 Speaker 1: governor to send in the militia, and since the state 1483 01:19:08,479 --> 01:19:11,120 Speaker 1: government basically existed to serve the desires of wealthy mine 1484 01:19:11,120 --> 01:19:14,040 Speaker 1: owners and the like, the government said yes. The strikers 1485 01:19:14,120 --> 01:19:15,640 Speaker 1: knew better than to try to do battle with the 1486 01:19:15,680 --> 01:19:19,720 Speaker 1: militia who had machine guns, and so they surrendered. Yeah. Yeah. 1487 01:19:19,720 --> 01:19:22,280 Speaker 1: Homestead was put under martial law Carnegie was able to 1488 01:19:22,280 --> 01:19:24,519 Speaker 1: move in his scab workers. And of course this is 1489 01:19:24,520 --> 01:19:27,679 Speaker 1: where things get morally complex again because the scab workers 1490 01:19:27,680 --> 01:19:30,600 Speaker 1: Carnegie picks were a lot of them were black, UM 1491 01:19:30,680 --> 01:19:32,679 Speaker 1: and in fact these were like the very first black 1492 01:19:32,800 --> 01:19:35,840 Speaker 1: steel workers in the state. UM. And this led to 1493 01:19:35,920 --> 01:19:38,720 Speaker 1: a horrible race riot, as two thousand white union men 1494 01:19:38,760 --> 01:19:41,800 Speaker 1: assaulted fifty black families and a number of people were 1495 01:19:41,840 --> 01:19:44,000 Speaker 1: badly injured in the resulting gun battle. And this is 1496 01:19:44,160 --> 01:19:46,680 Speaker 1: a regular story throughout the labor movement, is like, our 1497 01:19:46,720 --> 01:19:50,280 Speaker 1: workers are on strike, black people, we can bring them in, 1498 01:19:50,400 --> 01:19:53,759 Speaker 1: we can pay them less, um and like it'll it'll 1499 01:19:53,880 --> 01:19:56,240 Speaker 1: like they don't like there's not a solidarity between these 1500 01:19:56,240 --> 01:19:59,479 Speaker 1: poor black and these poor white people, UM for obvious reasons, 1501 01:19:59,479 --> 01:20:01,880 Speaker 1: because poor people real shitty to poor black people. But 1502 01:20:01,960 --> 01:20:05,920 Speaker 1: like it provided an opportunity for people at Carnegie. Yeah, yeah, 1503 01:20:05,920 --> 01:20:11,559 Speaker 1: who desperately needed work. And yeah, yep, yep, not great. 1504 01:20:11,840 --> 01:20:16,760 Speaker 1: It's complicated, complicated history here. By November of eight two, 1505 01:20:16,840 --> 01:20:19,760 Speaker 1: the Amalgamated Union was finished. Strike leaders were charged with 1506 01:20:19,840 --> 01:20:21,920 Speaker 1: murder and a hundred and sixty union men were charged 1507 01:20:21,920 --> 01:20:24,839 Speaker 1: with lesser crimes. Now, local juries did refuse to convict 1508 01:20:24,840 --> 01:20:26,360 Speaker 1: them because again the juries were made up of the 1509 01:20:26,360 --> 01:20:28,559 Speaker 1: people who had taken part in this uprising. But this 1510 01:20:28,680 --> 01:20:31,200 Speaker 1: was the end of unionization in Homestead for a while. 1511 01:20:31,439 --> 01:20:34,760 Speaker 1: Once victory was well and truly achieved, Carnegie cabled Frick 1512 01:20:35,080 --> 01:20:39,080 Speaker 1: Life worth living again, first happy morning since July. To celebrate, 1513 01:20:39,160 --> 01:20:42,200 Speaker 1: he immediately cut wages, expanded the workday a twelve hours, 1514 01:20:42,280 --> 01:20:47,400 Speaker 1: and fired five hundred people. Good stuff. Good stuff. But 1515 01:20:47,600 --> 01:20:50,519 Speaker 1: after Homestead, the Pinkerton's were never quite the same, and 1516 01:20:50,560 --> 01:20:52,400 Speaker 1: it would be fair to say that the whole experience 1517 01:20:52,400 --> 01:20:55,000 Speaker 1: made the agency a lot less willing to go engage 1518 01:20:55,000 --> 01:20:58,240 Speaker 1: in physical aggression. But the agency still exists to this 1519 01:20:58,320 --> 01:21:00,560 Speaker 1: day and still works as a private least force for 1520 01:21:00,600 --> 01:21:03,000 Speaker 1: the rich and powerful. In two thousand and eighteen, when 1521 01:21:03,000 --> 01:21:06,160 Speaker 1: workers for Frontier Communications went on striking West Virginia and 1522 01:21:06,200 --> 01:21:10,479 Speaker 1: Normal Virginia, the company hired the Pinkerton Agency, now part 1523 01:21:10,520 --> 01:21:14,599 Speaker 1: of Securitas, a massive Swedish corporation. Pinkerton basically acts as 1524 01:21:14,600 --> 01:21:17,919 Speaker 1: a rentable FBI for mega corporations dealing with labor disputes. 1525 01:21:18,000 --> 01:21:19,519 Speaker 1: I'm gonna quote now from a write up in The 1526 01:21:19,520 --> 01:21:22,720 Speaker 1: New Republic. Okay, wait before you quote this, Yeah, yeah, yeah, 1527 01:21:22,920 --> 01:21:25,599 Speaker 1: did you say, West Virginia and regular Virginia. I sure 1528 01:21:25,640 --> 01:21:36,960 Speaker 1: did that? Is I say this as a statement of fact. 1529 01:21:37,479 --> 01:21:40,599 Speaker 1: I attribute no value, good or bad to this statement. 1530 01:21:41,040 --> 01:21:49,160 Speaker 1: But West Virginia is a time warp. I'm like, West 1531 01:21:49,240 --> 01:21:53,879 Speaker 1: Virginia is currently a hundred years ago. Yeah, it's certainly 1532 01:21:53,880 --> 01:21:57,439 Speaker 1: not regular Virginia. Yes, So when you said that, and 1533 01:21:57,479 --> 01:21:59,680 Speaker 1: it's something that you know, I'm gonna group text with 1534 01:21:59,760 --> 01:22:01,880 Speaker 1: a tow different touring artists, like we're all just homies, 1535 01:22:01,920 --> 01:22:04,000 Speaker 1: but we all talked about like yo, I feel like 1536 01:22:04,479 --> 01:22:07,240 Speaker 1: West Virginia is back to the future, Like it's the 1537 01:22:07,280 --> 01:22:09,800 Speaker 1: Internet hasn't been invented in West Virginia, Like we don't 1538 01:22:09,840 --> 01:22:16,320 Speaker 1: what why is this state forty years ago? Yeah? Yeah, 1539 01:22:16,360 --> 01:22:19,320 Speaker 1: it's a trip to me anyway. So West Virginia and 1540 01:22:19,360 --> 01:22:23,400 Speaker 1: regular Virginia. Just I I almost feel vindicated that I'm 1541 01:22:23,439 --> 01:22:25,400 Speaker 1: not I'm not the only person me and my eight 1542 01:22:25,439 --> 01:22:27,840 Speaker 1: friends and the only people that feel like, yeah, I 1543 01:22:27,960 --> 01:22:30,439 Speaker 1: understand what's happening in West Virginia right now. Like I 1544 01:22:30,479 --> 01:22:34,920 Speaker 1: feel like everyone who has driven from regular Virginia to 1545 01:22:34,920 --> 01:22:37,439 Speaker 1: Western Virginia immediately had the realization like, oh, I'm not 1546 01:22:37,479 --> 01:22:40,120 Speaker 1: in regular Virginia any This isn't Virginia anymore. I don't 1547 01:22:40,120 --> 01:22:43,400 Speaker 1: even know why it's both called. Yeah, should change our 1548 01:22:43,479 --> 01:22:46,599 Speaker 1: name because this is this is not the same North Carolina, 1549 01:22:46,640 --> 01:22:51,919 Speaker 1: South Carolina. A few differences Carolinas, but you're Carolinas, Virginia, 1550 01:22:51,960 --> 01:22:55,200 Speaker 1: West Virginia. That's a different planet. I mean, I'll say 1551 01:22:55,280 --> 01:22:58,320 Speaker 1: there's a big South Dakota North Dakota split. But also 1552 01:22:58,800 --> 01:23:01,799 Speaker 1: why the two there's like nine people in both states? 1553 01:23:01,880 --> 01:23:08,400 Speaker 1: Come poppy seeds? Is nine people poppy seeds in Dakotas? Yes, 1554 01:23:08,479 --> 01:23:11,800 Speaker 1: all right, we've anyway, I just read the quote. I 1555 01:23:11,880 --> 01:23:16,679 Speaker 1: just had to acknowledge regular Virginia. That's how I feel. 1556 01:23:17,120 --> 01:23:19,559 Speaker 1: That's how I feel. Yeah. So, in the modern day, 1557 01:23:19,640 --> 01:23:22,800 Speaker 1: the Pinkerton Agency, basically and it's just called Pinkerton, now 1558 01:23:23,200 --> 01:23:27,000 Speaker 1: acts as a rentable FBI for megacorporations fucking over their workers. 1559 01:23:27,160 --> 01:23:28,680 Speaker 1: And I'm gonna quote now from a write up in 1560 01:23:28,680 --> 01:23:31,680 Speaker 1: The New Republic. Pinkerton is hardly the only firm to 1561 01:23:31,680 --> 01:23:34,240 Speaker 1: advertise such services, but its history sets it apart, and 1562 01:23:34,280 --> 01:23:37,240 Speaker 1: the company embraces its legacy with one called to Pinkerton, 1563 01:23:37,360 --> 01:23:40,400 Speaker 1: you gain access to our global networker resources, providing boots 1564 01:23:40,439 --> 01:23:42,519 Speaker 1: on the ground when and where you need them. It 1565 01:23:42,640 --> 01:23:46,760 Speaker 1: promises a securitis aid for the firm, lists labor demonstrations 1566 01:23:46,840 --> 01:23:50,120 Speaker 1: as among the risks it can monitor. Trouble can happen 1567 01:23:50,200 --> 01:23:55,599 Speaker 1: anytime anywhere. A narrator in tones tones tone is just 1568 01:23:55,800 --> 01:23:58,280 Speaker 1: so treating and I had a physical response to that, 1569 01:23:58,360 --> 01:24:02,519 Speaker 1: like any Uh. The Pinkerton promise is attractive to some 1570 01:24:02,600 --> 01:24:05,680 Speaker 1: Silicon Valley firms. The Guardian reported on March sixteenth that 1571 01:24:05,760 --> 01:24:08,799 Speaker 1: Facebook and Google have both retained Pinkerton to monitor staff 1572 01:24:08,880 --> 01:24:13,080 Speaker 1: for leaks. Among other services, Pinkerton offers to send investigators 1573 01:24:13,120 --> 01:24:15,720 Speaker 1: to coffee shops or restaurants near a company's campus to 1574 01:24:15,800 --> 01:24:21,120 Speaker 1: eavesdrop on employee conversations. Olivia Salon reported, Pinkerton's still out there, 1575 01:24:21,200 --> 01:24:26,439 Speaker 1: still fucking with labor. Yeah, just just rich boy hall monitors. Yeah, 1576 01:24:27,040 --> 01:24:30,680 Speaker 1: what if they relaxed, bro? Yeah, you know how you 1577 01:24:30,680 --> 01:24:34,160 Speaker 1: know how little accountability the FBI has currently? What if 1578 01:24:34,160 --> 01:24:39,080 Speaker 1: it just had none? Okay, guys, stay with me here, 1579 01:24:40,160 --> 01:24:47,040 Speaker 1: FBI that we could pay to do whatever we want. Yeah. Yeah, 1580 01:24:47,280 --> 01:24:49,200 Speaker 1: Like you know how that FBI agent who was doing 1581 01:24:49,200 --> 01:24:51,200 Speaker 1: a backflip at a club and accidentally shot that guy 1582 01:24:51,200 --> 01:24:52,519 Speaker 1: when his gun fall out. You know who he got 1583 01:24:52,600 --> 01:24:55,400 Speaker 1: in trouble. What if there was even less accountability than that. 1584 01:24:57,120 --> 01:25:00,320 Speaker 1: I almost I almost forgot that happened. Yeah, oh my 1585 01:25:00,479 --> 01:25:07,200 Speaker 1: wild that happened. Yes, good lord. Wow. So Prop, we're 1586 01:25:07,240 --> 01:25:10,800 Speaker 1: at the end of another episode, another chapter in police history. 1587 01:25:11,080 --> 01:25:14,879 Speaker 1: UM I haven't as of yet finished writing the third episode. 1588 01:25:14,880 --> 01:25:17,400 Speaker 1: But we're gonna talk something about the KKK. We're gonna 1589 01:25:17,600 --> 01:25:19,920 Speaker 1: talk some about lynchings. We're gonna talk some about how 1590 01:25:19,960 --> 01:25:23,280 Speaker 1: the police departments stopped lynchings by just deciding to torture 1591 01:25:23,320 --> 01:25:28,200 Speaker 1: black people instead. It's not gonna be it's not pretty good. Yeah, 1592 01:25:28,800 --> 01:25:33,200 Speaker 1: talking about l APD recruiting Southern people from post gym. Yeah, 1593 01:25:33,200 --> 01:25:35,840 Speaker 1: we're gonna have to talk about that something. Yeah. We 1594 01:25:35,880 --> 01:25:38,719 Speaker 1: have a lot more to talk about, but for now, 1595 01:25:39,000 --> 01:25:43,639 Speaker 1: what we should talk about is your plug doubles. Yes, uh, 1596 01:25:43,760 --> 01:25:48,760 Speaker 1: PROP hip hop dot com. Uh, that's all the poetry 1597 01:25:48,840 --> 01:25:51,280 Speaker 1: in the in the music and the art and the 1598 01:25:51,439 --> 01:25:58,960 Speaker 1: uh the coffee paraphernalia and the podcasts um hood politics 1599 01:25:59,280 --> 01:26:02,800 Speaker 1: and the red ouchpod couches me and my wife hood 1600 01:26:02,840 --> 01:26:05,439 Speaker 1: politics exactly what it sounds like. I'm basically taking all 1601 01:26:05,479 --> 01:26:07,800 Speaker 1: that you know about politics and just explaining them in 1602 01:26:08,240 --> 01:26:12,360 Speaker 1: street terms. Um. As to a lot of ways. I 1603 01:26:12,400 --> 01:26:17,200 Speaker 1: just I really just want people to like realize your 1604 01:26:17,240 --> 01:26:21,160 Speaker 1: politicians aren't smarter than you. You just you you think 1605 01:26:21,160 --> 01:26:23,080 Speaker 1: you're you think you don't belong at the table. But 1606 01:26:23,120 --> 01:26:25,639 Speaker 1: what I'm trying to tell you is what this whole 1607 01:26:25,680 --> 01:26:28,920 Speaker 1: episode in series has proven. They just people and they 1608 01:26:29,000 --> 01:26:32,880 Speaker 1: just gang banging. They're just gang bang it. So if 1609 01:26:32,880 --> 01:26:36,840 Speaker 1: you understand, if you accept that your politicians are gangbangers 1610 01:26:37,439 --> 01:26:40,400 Speaker 1: in all, this is just gang life, you can understand politics. 1611 01:26:40,840 --> 01:26:44,679 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, that's the thing. Like that Nobody 1612 01:26:44,800 --> 01:26:47,080 Speaker 1: Speak video that like it did real well, it's like, 1613 01:26:47,800 --> 01:26:49,760 Speaker 1: you know, this is like all these people, these are 1614 01:26:49,800 --> 01:26:52,840 Speaker 1: just different gangs, and we decide this gang gets all 1615 01:26:52,880 --> 01:26:56,920 Speaker 1: the respect. This is basically it. You know, when when okay, 1616 01:26:56,960 --> 01:27:01,719 Speaker 1: so when we all know, I mean, I like, really 1617 01:27:01,800 --> 01:27:04,880 Speaker 1: name a Republican politician that actually likes Donald Trump? Like 1618 01:27:05,560 --> 01:27:09,000 Speaker 1: y'all don't like him, but I get it. He's from 1619 01:27:09,040 --> 01:27:12,599 Speaker 1: your hood. So since he's from your hood, you keep 1620 01:27:12,640 --> 01:27:16,080 Speaker 1: your mouth shut in public. That's just that's why nobody's talking. 1621 01:27:16,080 --> 01:27:18,000 Speaker 1: That's why he told the lines like from my hood. 1622 01:27:18,040 --> 01:27:20,120 Speaker 1: I can't. I mean, he's eat from my hood. I 1623 01:27:20,160 --> 01:27:22,559 Speaker 1: get it. Yeah, don't you don't you sell a shirt 1624 01:27:22,600 --> 01:27:27,000 Speaker 1: that says, uh, yes, you ever a shirt that politics 1625 01:27:27,040 --> 01:27:29,799 Speaker 1: is just gang banging or something like that. Yeah, politics 1626 01:27:29,920 --> 01:27:33,519 Speaker 1: is gangbanging in nice suits. Yeah, that's the T shirt. 1627 01:27:34,200 --> 01:27:36,120 Speaker 1: Oh and I actually I'm gonna help your plug. I 1628 01:27:36,240 --> 01:27:39,320 Speaker 1: ordered the worst year ever T shirt. It's not here 1629 01:27:39,400 --> 01:27:44,559 Speaker 1: yet store, and they'll get it at that Synergy. I 1630 01:27:44,600 --> 01:27:46,760 Speaker 1: like the one. Here's a shirt that store that says 1631 01:27:46,880 --> 01:27:50,840 Speaker 1: Republican Democrat. I'll awake. I was like, okay, I need that. 1632 01:27:50,880 --> 01:27:55,400 Speaker 1: I need that immediately. I do want to what we're 1633 01:27:55,439 --> 01:27:59,840 Speaker 1: talking about gangs and what they are in reality. I 1634 01:28:00,000 --> 01:28:02,080 Speaker 1: wanted to have you ever heard of Smedley Butler? Prop 1635 01:28:02,160 --> 01:28:03,920 Speaker 1: I want to talk about Smedley Butler for just a second. 1636 01:28:03,920 --> 01:28:07,839 Speaker 1: Before he put down put Smedley Butler was a major general. 1637 01:28:07,880 --> 01:28:10,360 Speaker 1: He's one of the highest decorated soldiers in US history. 1638 01:28:10,479 --> 01:28:13,920 Speaker 1: Home did one two Medals of honor Um for gallantry 1639 01:28:13,960 --> 01:28:19,439 Speaker 1: under fire, and became a hardcore anti capitalist in in 1640 01:28:19,560 --> 01:28:21,320 Speaker 1: his his later days. I want to quote from like 1641 01:28:21,560 --> 01:28:24,720 Speaker 1: two different speeches of his. I spent thirty three years 1642 01:28:24,760 --> 01:28:26,920 Speaker 1: and four months in active military service as a member 1643 01:28:26,920 --> 01:28:29,400 Speaker 1: of this country's most agile military force, the Marine Corps. 1644 01:28:29,479 --> 01:28:31,640 Speaker 1: I served in all commissioned ranks, from second lieutenant to 1645 01:28:31,680 --> 01:28:33,920 Speaker 1: major general, and during that period I spent most of 1646 01:28:33,920 --> 01:28:36,719 Speaker 1: my time being a high class muscle man for big business, 1647 01:28:36,840 --> 01:28:39,280 Speaker 1: for Wall Street and for the bankers. In short, I 1648 01:28:39,360 --> 01:28:45,719 Speaker 1: was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism. She's yeah, She's yeah, 1649 01:28:45,800 --> 01:28:48,880 Speaker 1: Smedley Butler, Smedley Butler, you said you said that, you 1650 01:28:48,920 --> 01:28:51,439 Speaker 1: said the quiet thing out loud. Yeah, and it's and 1651 01:28:51,520 --> 01:28:58,280 Speaker 1: it's like and it's the obvious. Yeah. Day, alright, alright, dude, 1652 01:28:58,479 --> 01:29:00,360 Speaker 1: we got some Smedley in here. We'll can be back 1653 01:29:00,360 --> 01:29:02,599 Speaker 1: to cops in part three. Have a great one, everybody, 1654 01:29:02,640 --> 01:29:05,320 Speaker 1: Thank you again, prop and thank you. See you all 1655 01:29:05,400 --> 01:29:09,479 Speaker 1: next week with more of the Police. Not the Band, 1656 01:29:09,680 --> 01:29:14,600 Speaker 1: Not the Band Behind the Police is a production of 1657 01:29:14,640 --> 01:29:17,200 Speaker 1: I Heart Radio. For more podcast from my Heart Radio, 1658 01:29:17,560 --> 01:29:20,599 Speaker 1: visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever 1659 01:29:20,720 --> 01:29:24,679 Speaker 1: you get your podcasts. Hello, and welcome to our show. 1660 01:29:24,800 --> 01:29:26,960 Speaker 1: I'm Zoe de Chanelle and I'm so excited to be 1661 01:29:27,040 --> 01:29:29,640 Speaker 1: joined by my friends and cast Meats Hannah Simone and 1662 01:29:29,720 --> 01:29:33,439 Speaker 1: Lamar and Morris to recap our hit television series New Girl. 1663 01:29:33,720 --> 01:29:36,840 Speaker 1: Join us every Monday on the Welcome to Our Show podcast, 1664 01:29:36,920 --> 01:29:39,280 Speaker 1: where we'll share behind the scenes stories of your favorite 1665 01:29:39,320 --> 01:29:42,040 Speaker 1: New Girl episodes. Each week, we answer all your burning 1666 01:29:42,120 --> 01:29:45,120 Speaker 1: questions like is there really a bear in every episode 1667 01:29:45,120 --> 01:29:48,080 Speaker 1: of New Girl. Plus, you'll hear hilarious stories like this 1668 01:29:48,479 --> 01:29:52,920 Speaker 1: that was one of years. Thank you from Yahause professional 1669 01:29:53,040 --> 01:29:59,519 Speaker 1: passtball players. Yeah Yeah. Listen to the Welcome to Our 1670 01:29:59,560 --> 01:30:02,920 Speaker 1: Show Pie cast on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, 1671 01:30:03,080 --> 01:30:07,160 Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Tanya Sam, host 1672 01:30:07,200 --> 01:30:10,240 Speaker 1: of the Money Moves Podcast powered by Greenwood. This daily 1673 01:30:10,280 --> 01:30:12,679 Speaker 1: podcast will help give you the keys to the Kingdom 1674 01:30:12,680 --> 01:30:16,360 Speaker 1: of financial stability, wealth and abundance with celebrity guests like 1675 01:30:16,479 --> 01:30:20,200 Speaker 1: Rick Ross, Amanda Sells, Angela Ye, Roland Martin, JB. Smooth, 1676 01:30:20,200 --> 01:30:22,439 Speaker 1: and Terrell Owens. Tune in to learn how to turn 1677 01:30:22,520 --> 01:30:26,639 Speaker 1: liabilities into assets and make your Money Moves a good boy. 1678 01:30:28,200 --> 01:30:30,960 Speaker 1: Subscribe to The Money Moves Podcast powered by Greenland on 1679 01:30:31,000 --> 01:30:33,880 Speaker 1: the I Heart Radio app or wherever you get your podcasts, 1680 01:30:34,160 --> 01:30:36,720 Speaker 1: and make sure you leave a review. Raffie is the 1681 01:30:36,840 --> 01:30:40,040 Speaker 1: voice of some of the happiest songs of our generation, 1682 01:30:40,439 --> 01:30:46,400 Speaker 1: Baby So who is the man behind Baby Bluga? Every 1683 01:30:46,479 --> 01:30:50,720 Speaker 1: human beings wants to feel respected when we start with 1684 01:30:52,240 --> 01:30:55,960 Speaker 1: all good things can grow from there. I'm Chris Garcia, Comedian, 1685 01:30:56,120 --> 01:30:59,120 Speaker 1: new dad and host of Finding Raffie, a new podcast 1686 01:30:59,160 --> 01:31:02,400 Speaker 1: from My Heart Radio and Fatherly. Listen every Tuesday on 1687 01:31:02,479 --> 01:31:05,400 Speaker 1: the I Heart Radio app or wherever you get your podcasts.