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Speaker 1: Hey there, folks. It is Monday, October thirteenth, and last

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Speaker 1: tonight was the season premiere of the hit show Mattlock.

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Speaker 1: It's back for a second season, just days after one

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Speaker 1: of its stars was fired. Welcome everybody to this episode

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Speaker 1: of Amy and TJ. Talking here about a story that's

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Speaker 1: still developing, still confusing, quite frankly for it was. But

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Speaker 1: one of the lead ensemble actors in this show is

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Speaker 1: out over what appears to be sexual harassment or sexual assault.

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Speaker 2: Claims. Yes, David del Rio. He's thirty eight years old.

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Speaker 2: He plays Billy Martinez on Mattlock. A big part of

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Speaker 2: the show actually, and part of the show coming from

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Speaker 2: season one into season two was a cliffhanger with one

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Speaker 2: of his love interests and a baby. And so yes,

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Speaker 2: he's been a central part of this highly successful series

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Speaker 2: on CBS. And to hear a word late last week

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Speaker 2: that he was fired and escorted off the set the

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Speaker 2: same day his co star made allegations of a sexual assault.

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Speaker 2: She claims happened a few days prior.

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Speaker 1: So, And you were just speaking on him being central

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Speaker 1: to this cast and central to the plot, and yeah,

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Speaker 1: sure enough, I mean that just happened to be the case,

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Speaker 1: but he did. That storyline you talk about continued yesterday

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Speaker 1: in the season premiere of this show. So the word

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Speaker 1: had gotten out, of course, had spread that he had

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Speaker 1: been fired and what it was about. And then to

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Speaker 1: have this hit show and it is, folks, a hit

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Speaker 1: over there at CBS. To have it on the air

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Speaker 1: just days after and him playing a central role, and

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Speaker 1: we're having to focus on the person that who is

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Speaker 1: being accused of only at this point something along the

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Speaker 1: lines of sexual assault. It was just the weird and

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Speaker 1: the timing was weird.

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Speaker 2: It is bizarre, and I have not seen and we

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Speaker 2: did a little bit of extra research on this, but

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Speaker 2: I have not seen any indication or any talk about

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Speaker 2: criminal charges in this. This was solely a situation that

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Speaker 2: the CBS studios made their call pretty quickly. That's the

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Speaker 2: thing that I think has thrown a lot of folks

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Speaker 2: reading this is that this has been a This was

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Speaker 2: a quick decision. There wasn't time for They said there

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Speaker 2: was an investigation, but I don't know how long that

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Speaker 2: investigation could have or would have gone on. We don't

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Speaker 2: have any official word from CBS regarding this instance. We've

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Speaker 2: actually seen a lot of it unfortunately play it on

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Speaker 2: social media, and so that's how people are connecting a

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Speaker 2: lot of these dots.

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Speaker 1: So the dots, and I don't think we've said who

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Speaker 1: we're talking about here yet, but she has been identified

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Speaker 1: some and again this is a weird part of the

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Speaker 1: story for me, at least, both self identified if you will,

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Speaker 1: affirmed if you will, in a post. But a co

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Speaker 1: star on the show is the one who is now

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Speaker 1: allegedly accused him of some kind of sexual.

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Speaker 2: Misconduct, twenty eight year old Leah Lewis. She did put

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Speaker 2: something out on social media that basically named herself as

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Speaker 2: the alleged victim in this, and so yes, so many

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Speaker 2: news outlets that would not have ever reported her name,

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Speaker 2: including us, said okay, hey, we're gonna say who it is,

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Speaker 2: because she basically put her name out there and her

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Speaker 2: face out there in a post that she put out

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Speaker 2: there alongside her mother saying mom is here.

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Speaker 3: Things are. We can get into that in just a bit.

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Speaker 2: But she claims, at least from what we've gathered, that

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Speaker 2: there was an alleged sexual assault.

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Speaker 3: Near David del Rio's trailer.

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Speaker 2: This is according to her, and she claims this allegedly

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Speaker 2: happened on September twenty sixth, and we just found out

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Speaker 2: about it late last week.

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Speaker 1: However, Yeah, they got their results, if you will, of

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Speaker 1: their investigation, and the show has been shooting. They had

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Speaker 1: been at work. They do have a break now, and

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Speaker 1: they will be on break from shooting at least the

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Speaker 1: rest of this month and the month of November that

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Speaker 1: was pre scheduled. That his pre plan has nothing to

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Speaker 1: do with this incident. But yeah, they were working and

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Speaker 1: whatever the results of this investigation showed, they made the

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Speaker 1: determination that they did not want him on the premises

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Speaker 1: a moment longer.

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Speaker 2: Wow. And so yes, we understand that David Del Rio's

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Speaker 2: character Billy will be written out of the show at

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Speaker 2: least yesterday's episode. Yes, he had a big life decision

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Speaker 2: to make who he was going to be with the

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Speaker 2: baby is on the way, So they'll have to figure

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Speaker 2: out a plot that doesn't involve him being a part

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Speaker 2: of it. Well, they'll just have to Maybe he is

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Speaker 2: he heads for the hills and leaves a note behind.

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Speaker 2: But short of that, I can't imagine what else other

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Speaker 2: than him dying. But then they'd have to show him

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Speaker 2: dying or so. This will be a little bit of

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Speaker 2: a pickle that these writers will have to write themselves

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Speaker 2: out of or into another version of a different storyline

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Speaker 2: where he just disappears.

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Speaker 1: I guess they have time now. I mean it's a

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Speaker 1: good thing they have the break that they do have. Again,

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Speaker 1: that's not first and foremost what happens to a show.

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Speaker 1: But I with the post from Leah were talking about

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Speaker 1: Leah Lewis, the posts that we are going to read

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Speaker 1: the entire text of there's someone else, not del Rio himself,

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Speaker 1: with someone else in his camp who's been speaking kind

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Speaker 1: of sorta on his behalf. And I was surprised by this.

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Speaker 1: I was confused by this, and I'm curious to hear

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Speaker 1: what you make of it. But his wife put out

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Speaker 1: some posts that can only be interpreted one way. She's

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Speaker 1: pissed at Leah Lewis.

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Speaker 2: Oh, outraged and yes, so what happened. Leah Lewis put

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Speaker 2: up an Instagram story which she didn't have to with

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Speaker 2: her mom. She and her mom smiling next to her,

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Speaker 2: saying mom is here. We're moving forward in love and strength.

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Speaker 2: I'm in good hands. Thank you to everybody for any

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Speaker 2: kind of support and care. Truly, we're moving forward in

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Speaker 2: strength keyword strength. Please let that be the takeaway now,

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Speaker 2: is that an.

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Speaker 1: I stopped immediately just reading. Is that enough that folks

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Speaker 1: know that she is identifying herself as.

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Speaker 2: The alleged that in addition to the people on the

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Speaker 2: set who were of course sources saying and talking about

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Speaker 2: what was going on. So certainly that was the confirmation

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Speaker 2: that news outlets needed to know that she, in fact

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Speaker 2: was the person who reported an alleged sexual assault. And

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Speaker 2: so yes, I think one hundred percent that was basically

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Speaker 2: the confirmation that folks needed to go ahead and go

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Speaker 2: forward with having her be the named alleged victim. But

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Speaker 2: then David del Rio's wife, Catherine del Rio, who was

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Speaker 2: also an actress and a chef, she pretty quickly then

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Speaker 2: took that Instagram story post by Leah, zoomed in on

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Speaker 2: Leah's face and put it on her story this is

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Speaker 2: the most disturbing human being I have ever met. She

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Speaker 2: deleted that one a short while later, but then put

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Speaker 2: up another picture, this time a photo of herself with

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Speaker 2: her her own mom, And then she used the same

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Speaker 2: words that were in Leah Lewis's post, and so she

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Speaker 2: just switched it up a little bit. She wrote, mom

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Speaker 2: is here we are moving forward in love and strength

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Speaker 2: after what Leah did.

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Speaker 3: To our family.

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Speaker 2: So she outed her, she mocked her, and she let

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Speaker 2: everyone know that she dislikes her. Is the most disturbing

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Speaker 2: human being I have ever met. Look, these were all

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Speaker 2: people who knew each other, worked with each other. You

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Speaker 2: know how spouses are with folks on the set. So

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Speaker 2: there were also news outlets they always loved to report,

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Speaker 2: and people unfollow each other. They all unfollowed one another.

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Speaker 2: Leah apparently had put you know when they were kinder

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Speaker 2: better times, had left comments on her post.

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Speaker 3: Those all disappeared when she unfollowed her.

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Speaker 2: So clearly this all points to just a difficult situation

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Speaker 2: and people airing out their grievances or at least trying

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Speaker 2: to elicit support using social media.

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Speaker 1: How long before the police show up? I mean if

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Speaker 1: if what's being described, what being talked to them? Again,

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Speaker 1: it's being which word I want to get the right word?

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Speaker 1: Sexual misconduct, sexual assault? Sexual. It's not harassment. This was a.

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Speaker 3: Strong sexual assaults.

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Speaker 2: Assault is the absolute term that's being used, and that

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Speaker 2: is a very strong word.

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Speaker 1: Yes, that can mean a lot of things, but I

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Speaker 1: think any any phase of it, it's still a criminal act.

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Speaker 1: This is not just a you know, passing a note

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Speaker 1: or telling a dirty joke type of stuff in an

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Speaker 1: office that could get you reprimanded. This is criminal stuff

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Speaker 1: if we're talking about a sexual assault.

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Speaker 2: What I'm trying to figure out is, and I think

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Speaker 2: a lot of folks are doing the same thing.

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Speaker 3: For CBS to.

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Speaker 2: Be that sure within hours of Leah Lewis the actors

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Speaker 2: bringing this accusation to them, for them to be able

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Speaker 2: to say that they conducted an internal investigation and it

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Speaker 2: only took a couple of hours for them to then

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Speaker 2: fire and escort him off the lot. They say this

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Speaker 2: happened allegedly near his trailers, So were their cameras? Is

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Speaker 2: their surveillance video? Is there something irrefutable? Because so often

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Speaker 2: the most difficult crimes, one of the most difficult crimes

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Speaker 2: to actually bring charges on and actually convict someone of,

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Speaker 2: is that very thing, Because it's a he said, she

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Speaker 2: said thing. Usually there are only two people around and

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Speaker 2: both people say two different things. It's very hard to

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Speaker 2: prove something like this. So that's why I'm a little

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Speaker 2: shaken in a sense that this could be determined so

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Speaker 2: quickly that CBS would feel confident in their decision to

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Speaker 2: make this call.

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Speaker 1: I mean, they have a different standard than of course

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Speaker 1: criminal court. Right, they can do what they want to do,

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Speaker 1: but they also have to balance make sure they don't

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Speaker 1: get sued, I suppose. But could you get sued by

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Speaker 1: leaving somebody on the lot that others deem a danger

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Speaker 1: to his coworkers because you knew of a sexual AsSalt

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Speaker 1: allegation and you did nothing. I mean, it just it

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Speaker 1: happened so quickly. Look, the investigation, yes, took days, but

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Speaker 1: once they got it, it didn't seem like there was

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Speaker 1: much time for And I assume they had to have

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Speaker 1: talked to him as a part of the investigation.

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Speaker 2: Yes, I would think that he would have had to

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Speaker 2: have had his say. But the interesting thing is if

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Speaker 2: you start to look at these two they've been playing

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Speaker 2: opposite one another now for this full season, and up

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Speaker 2: until this moment, they spoke very highly about each other

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Speaker 2: on several occasions because their characters had a strong bond

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Speaker 2: on the show, which you'll see throughout I guess for

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Speaker 2: the rest of this season while they're still together. But

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Speaker 2: just listening and reading some of the things that Leah

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Speaker 2: Lewis has said about David del Rio recently David del Rio,

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Speaker 2: who plays Billy, who plays kind of like my counterpart.

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Speaker 2: I've learned so much about comedy from him, she said

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Speaker 2: in September of last year. He comes from a theater background,

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Speaker 2: so it's like we're always dancing and twinkling around this.

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Speaker 2: She said that he is one of the largest personalities

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Speaker 2: and skill sets that I've ever been able to work with,

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Speaker 2: So it's been playtime. So she talked about how much

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Speaker 2: fun they've had on the set together, and she said

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Speaker 2: that it's been incredible working with him the way that

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Speaker 2: he carries himself on set. So yeah, she said glowing

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Speaker 2: things about him. Just one year ago, leading up to

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Speaker 2: this first season, what in.

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Speaker 1: The world happened? And again, this is just an allegation

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Speaker 1: at this point, but CBS at least has taken it

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Speaker 1: seriously enough that they have taken pretty decisive action, so

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Speaker 1: robes that you have to take it at that point

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Speaker 1: being more than just a rumor more than there was

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Speaker 1: something that made them take off a central character on

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Speaker 1: what is a hit TV show, which are few and

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Speaker 1: far between these days.

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Speaker 3: That's right, they're.

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Speaker 1: Messing with some magic they have over there with folks

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Speaker 1: stay with us. Don't know if you've been watching Matt Locke,

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Speaker 1: but we're going to explain just how big of a

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Speaker 1: show show and big of a hit this show is

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Speaker 1: and has even made one of our favorite actresses a

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Speaker 1: record setter. All right, folks, we continue on this Monday,

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Speaker 1: October thirteenth. Got a bit of a mess going on

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Speaker 1: over there at CBS on one of their hit shows.

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Speaker 1: One of the stars of Matt Locke has been fired,

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Speaker 1: fired a few days ago after what is a sexual

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Speaker 1: assault allegation by a co star, Leah Lewis, who also

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Speaker 1: plays on the show. They both are they're the they're

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Speaker 1: the young kind of hotheads on the show. Yes, the

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Speaker 1: young first year.

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Speaker 2: First year associates, and they actually play best friends. So

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Speaker 2: the two of them have been starring opposite each other

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Speaker 2: two As you pointed out before we went to the break,

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Speaker 2: TV magic chemistry like that doesn't happen often, but when

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Speaker 2: it does, it's fun to watch. And so this show

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Speaker 2: has become a powerhouse, large part obviously because of Kathy Bates,

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Speaker 2: the amazing star of the show, but certainly the other

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Speaker 2: cast members have been a central part of making it

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Speaker 2: a hit success.

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Speaker 3: So this is a shocking, and.

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Speaker 2: I to say unpleasant headline is just an understatement because

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Speaker 2: it's actually so incredibly sad for the show, for the cast,

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Speaker 2: for I'm even thinking of del Rio's family. He just

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Speaker 2: welcomed a second baby, girl this past year, so he

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Speaker 2: and his wife have two young daughters. The ones a toddler,

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Speaker 2: one's an infant, and this is just gutting for him personally,

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Speaker 2: his career, and certainly for.

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Speaker 3: The young lady who spoke out.

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Speaker 2: I mean, everybody loses in a situation like this, and

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Speaker 2: it's without any real information. There's a big vacuum where

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Speaker 2: people are trying to guess what happened.

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Speaker 1: I mean, right at this point. We always we always

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Speaker 1: write robes. We have to air on the side of

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Speaker 1: believing the victim, the alleged victim. We are supposed to,

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Speaker 1: we are told to, and we have to do we

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Speaker 1: not have to do that. But then the butt comes

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Speaker 1: in because if we're not right, then this guy's been.

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Speaker 3: Destroyed, destroyed. Who's desroyed?

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Speaker 2: I was looking at his wife's Instagram and she actually

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Speaker 2: talked about postpartum depression in twenty twenty four. She's had

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Speaker 2: two babies right in a row, but saying the twenty

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Speaker 2: twenty four was the hardest year of her life. I

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Speaker 2: was reading this post where she talked about how her

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Speaker 2: husband David has been working fourteen hour days at Mattlock,

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Speaker 2: They've been a part. She's been struggling pregnant and with

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Speaker 2: a toddler and dealing with postpartum depression, and how she

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Speaker 2: was thinking folks in the industry for helping lift her

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Speaker 2: up and get her through this, And then I could

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Speaker 2: only imagine she thought twenty twenty four was the worst

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Speaker 2: year of her life. Now enter this moment now where

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Speaker 2: her husband's being accused of sexual assault by a fellow

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Speaker 2: cast member, and his career will likely be ruined if

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Speaker 2: any of that is true, or if any of it's

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Speaker 2: proven to be. And frankly, at this point, even with

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Speaker 2: a hint of something like that hanging over your head,

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Speaker 2: who's gonna touch you, who's gonna hire you? I mean,

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Speaker 2: this is this is an allegation now these days where

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Speaker 2: when you make it, it doesn't really ever go away,

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Speaker 2: does it.

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Speaker 1: Then? How do you, ever, how can we ever presume

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Speaker 1: innocence in this case? By presuming innocence of this man,

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Speaker 1: we are casting doubt on how much we believe this woman.

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Speaker 1: Isn't that just naturally what you do in something like this,

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Speaker 1: If we are reserving judgment of this man, that means

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Speaker 1: we are reserving judgment of her story, and I guess

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Speaker 1: we do. We just let it play out, and I

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Speaker 1: guess that's what we should do. But the nature of

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Speaker 1: sexual assault allegations, it's just different, and so many women

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Speaker 1: are not and have been have not been believed to

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Speaker 1: where I don't know these are These are when it's

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Speaker 1: something like this, when something in his name being out

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Speaker 1: there now and this could be one hundred percent t.

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Speaker 2: Be true, but it's also a man with, like I said,

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Speaker 2: two young girls, a wife who vehemently is defending him,

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Speaker 2: and you know absolutely you can tell by her tone

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Speaker 2: and her choices on social media that she is on

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Speaker 2: his side in every way, shape or form. But yes,

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Speaker 2: it's now this incredibly divisive situation where yes, just the

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Speaker 2: mention of something like this, because this wasn't Leah Lewis

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Speaker 2: saying that it was an unwanted sexual advance.

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Speaker 3: It wasn't that this was unwanted sexual.

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Speaker 2: Pressure or some sort of flirtation that she didn't want.

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Speaker 2: She the actual phrase is sexual assault. Now that's like

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Speaker 2: you're imagining this happening on set outside of a trailer.

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Speaker 3: What would how could that possibly happen?

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Speaker 2: But people will probably tell you I've never been on

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Speaker 2: a set that this is commonplace. I don't know, but

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Speaker 2: certainly a lot of questions. And as you pointed out

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Speaker 2: before we went to the break, this is a hit

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Speaker 2: show at a time where you don't have a lot

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Speaker 2: of hit shows. TV and hit shows aren't going hand

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Speaker 2: in hand in the same sentence.

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Speaker 1: Oh, this is a powerhouse. To hear that the show

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Speaker 1: was averaging sixteen million viewers per episode last season. Now

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Speaker 1: that's across television and streaming, but sixteen million viewers per

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Speaker 1: anybody would take those numbers?

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Speaker 3: Oh my goodness.

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Speaker 1: Yes, So it was the number one new show on

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Speaker 1: TV last year, and I think it ended up ranking

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Speaker 1: I think number two or number three overall. It is

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Speaker 1: a powerhouse, of course, behind Kathy.

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Speaker 2: Bits, Kathy Bates and so Yes, the second season has

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Speaker 2: been highly anticipated, highly regarded. Yes, she got an Emmy

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Speaker 2: nomination for her role in this. So look, on one hand,

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Speaker 2: I imagine they probably had a lot more eyes on

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Speaker 2: their show than maybe even before. This might have been

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Speaker 2: a record breaker for their brand new season two. I mean,

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Speaker 2: imagine all of this is happening just as the first

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Speaker 2: episode of this second season aired on Sunday night. This

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Speaker 2: all hit Thursday of last week. It's not the kind

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Speaker 2: of publicity you want. It's certainly not the kind of

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Speaker 2: attention you want. But I imagine more eyes than ever before.

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Speaker 2: We're on that show last night.

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Speaker 1: And what the And for both of them, they're young

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Speaker 1: actors and this is the biggest role they've had in

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Speaker 1: their career. This is their big career moment, and this

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Speaker 1: is happening here now. Again. It's just these are very,

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Speaker 1: very difficult stories. And if Leah lewis I mean thoughts

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Speaker 1: with her for whatever may have happened, But I mean

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Speaker 1: she has to be don't we have to start there?

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Speaker 1: Is that that simple? Just she has to be believed?

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Speaker 1: Do you just have to start there? Do we always

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Speaker 1: start there? It's just we have to we have to.

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Speaker 1: And I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I struggle with that premise because I don't think that

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Speaker 2: look obvious.

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Speaker 3: As a woman.

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Speaker 2: I've got two daughters, You've got daughters, like we understand,

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Speaker 2: and I've been in the entertainment business, and you want

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Speaker 2: to make sure that we give women and men who

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Speaker 2: accuse anyone of any sort of misconduct a platform. We

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Speaker 2: want to give them an opportunity to be believed. But

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Speaker 2: I don't think you can just say that you have

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Speaker 2: to believe everybody if they make an accusation. I think

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Speaker 2: there are plenty of unfortunate situations.

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Speaker 3: Where there are ulterior motives.

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Speaker 2: I'm not saying that that is the case in this one,

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Speaker 2: but I don't think I'm not somebody who believes that

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Speaker 2: we automatically have to believe everybody who accuses somebody of

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Speaker 2: something like this. I understand it's gone on for too

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Speaker 2: long that women have been completely dismissed and completely disregarded

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Speaker 2: and never believed. Now that's not okay either, But I

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Speaker 2: don't think you can go to the overcorrection mode of

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Speaker 2: always believing the women and always assuming the worst of

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Speaker 2: the man. I just I don't think you can can

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Speaker 2: go to that extreme either.

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Speaker 1: Okay, maybe I'm saying the wrong. We just have I

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Speaker 1: guess maybe we're open to stories of women coming forward,

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Speaker 1: and that's a big part of it. You have to

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Speaker 1: be open to those stories and because too often I

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Speaker 1: guess it was dismissed and not listen to at all,

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Speaker 1: and the folks just sided with the man, and that

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Speaker 1: was in the story.

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Speaker 3: Okay, so you don't want an overcorrection.

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Speaker 2: We don't want to go back to those days either

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Speaker 2: where women are afraid to speak up or afraid of

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Speaker 2: not just losing it. For a lot of women who

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Speaker 2: have been in this position, it's not even about losing

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Speaker 2: your credibility or losing the job you have. It's about

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Speaker 2: losing your career for being that woman, for being that

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Speaker 2: woman who points the finger at someone else, who's difficult

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Speaker 2: to work with, who can't take a joke, like all

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Speaker 2: of those things, I understand are a part of the

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Speaker 2: reason why we need to give women a safer space

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Speaker 2: to speak up and to know that she can be

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Speaker 2: believed and if she's telling the truth, will be believed.

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Speaker 3: But I don't think we can go.

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Speaker 2: So far as to say, let's automatically give her the

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Speaker 2: benefit of the doubt.

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Speaker 3: I don't think we can do that.

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Speaker 2: I think about her, and I feel for her, but

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Speaker 2: I also think about him, and again, his wife and

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Speaker 2: his daughters, and just his opportunity to say something. He

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Speaker 2: has not spoken at all, nor has anyone officially on

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Speaker 2: his behalf. We've just obviously seen the I would say,

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Speaker 2: rage coming from his wife, which I can understand on

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Speaker 2: a personal level. But she did take both of those

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Speaker 2: posts down. They no longer are up. But it doesn't

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Speaker 2: matter these days. If you head it up for thirty

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Speaker 2: seconds or thirty minutes, someone's going to screen grab it

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Speaker 2: and get it and.

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Speaker 3: Report on it.

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Speaker 2: And so we know that back and forth has happened,

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Speaker 2: and hopefully we'll get some more information in the days

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Speaker 2: to come, but in the meantime, we just wanted to

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Speaker 2: jump on and talk about this unfolding situation with a major,

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Speaker 2: major television show these days. Metlock premiere on Sunday night.

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Speaker 2: We'll see what happens as that plot thickens off camera

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Speaker 2: and in front of it. I made me Roebuck alongside TJ.

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Speaker 3: Holmes. Thanks for being with us, everybody,