1 00:00:05,240 --> 00:00:07,520 Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha, and I'll go to 2 00:00:07,560 --> 00:00:09,479 Speaker 1: stuff I've never told to your protection of I heart Radio. 3 00:00:18,560 --> 00:00:23,160 Speaker 1: So Samantha, today, we wanted to bring a classic back 4 00:00:23,720 --> 00:00:28,160 Speaker 1: on Judy Bloom, and we were talking about this before. 5 00:00:28,480 --> 00:00:30,760 Speaker 1: And I don't have much experience with Judy Bloom as 6 00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:32,400 Speaker 1: far as I know, I might, I might be wrong, 7 00:00:32,440 --> 00:00:35,280 Speaker 1: and I'm just not remembering all of her her books 8 00:00:35,280 --> 00:00:40,160 Speaker 1: that she's written. But you do correct, yes, So I 9 00:00:40,200 --> 00:00:43,159 Speaker 1: grew up reading a lot of Judy Bloom books, but 10 00:00:43,320 --> 00:00:46,680 Speaker 1: my all time favorite was just as long as We're together. 11 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:49,040 Speaker 1: And we've talked about it before, and I've talked about 12 00:00:49,040 --> 00:00:51,199 Speaker 1: it with Nicole Chong, who came on when we were 13 00:00:51,200 --> 00:00:53,880 Speaker 1: talking about transracial adoption. And the reason I loved this 14 00:00:54,000 --> 00:00:56,880 Speaker 1: book so much, it's because there is an actual trains 15 00:00:57,000 --> 00:01:00,800 Speaker 1: racial adopted character. Uh steph me all has been with 16 00:01:00,840 --> 00:01:04,160 Speaker 1: minutes I read this book and it just spoke to 17 00:01:04,280 --> 00:01:08,160 Speaker 1: me so hard to see that being represented anything. But 18 00:01:08,240 --> 00:01:11,680 Speaker 1: it's a coming of age story of three best friends, 19 00:01:11,720 --> 00:01:16,119 Speaker 1: three girls, getting their periods, getting boyfriends, and just finding 20 00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:18,520 Speaker 1: where they belong essentially, and there is a companion book 21 00:01:18,520 --> 00:01:21,600 Speaker 1: apparently here see Rachel Robinson and I haven't read that yet, 22 00:01:21,840 --> 00:01:25,000 Speaker 1: but she also did are you there, God, It's me Margaret. 23 00:01:25,040 --> 00:01:27,360 Speaker 1: Really Yeah, I don't know if you read that book. 24 00:01:27,640 --> 00:01:31,120 Speaker 1: She did several others. Yeah, she did Super Fudge Tells 25 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:33,760 Speaker 1: of the fourth Grade Nothing And these are giant books 26 00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:36,560 Speaker 1: that I loved growing up together, and she did a 27 00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:39,480 Speaker 1: really good job in asking certain questions and you know, 28 00:01:39,560 --> 00:01:42,200 Speaker 1: he's like, who am I? What am I doing here? Essentially, 29 00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:44,600 Speaker 1: and just what it feels like to grow up. But yeah, 30 00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:47,960 Speaker 1: my love forever will be just as long as we're together, 31 00:01:48,320 --> 00:01:50,520 Speaker 1: and I have I think I actually bought a new 32 00:01:50,520 --> 00:01:54,559 Speaker 1: copy of it because my other one burned. But it's 33 00:01:54,600 --> 00:01:57,640 Speaker 1: really close to my heart. I loved it. Those books 34 00:01:57,640 --> 00:02:03,280 Speaker 1: are powerful and when you're young and you're confused about yeah, 35 00:02:03,360 --> 00:02:05,440 Speaker 1: coming of age in your place in the world and 36 00:02:05,680 --> 00:02:09,799 Speaker 1: having these questions and books like that just leave an impact. 37 00:02:10,280 --> 00:02:13,680 Speaker 1: And this was on our mind because recently Beverly Cleary 38 00:02:13,919 --> 00:02:16,799 Speaker 1: passed away and I did read Beverly Cleary books. I'm 39 00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:18,880 Speaker 1: pretty convinced I read Judy Blue books. I'm just not 40 00:02:19,560 --> 00:02:23,160 Speaker 1: remembering that she wrote them. Um, but I did read 41 00:02:23,840 --> 00:02:26,320 Speaker 1: Beverly Cleary books and I had to steal them from 42 00:02:26,320 --> 00:02:28,519 Speaker 1: my older brother because for some reason we were very 43 00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:34,480 Speaker 1: like not great sharers my family. You know. The one 44 00:02:34,520 --> 00:02:36,880 Speaker 1: thing that we was recently talked about is that they 45 00:02:36,960 --> 00:02:40,160 Speaker 1: never met and in our heads, everyone I think was 46 00:02:40,200 --> 00:02:43,040 Speaker 1: surprised by those because they're, like you weren't best friends, 47 00:02:43,200 --> 00:02:46,400 Speaker 1: because people, they're somewhat interchangeable, because they were around the 48 00:02:46,440 --> 00:02:49,120 Speaker 1: same time frame and they both had a really good 49 00:02:49,320 --> 00:02:55,560 Speaker 1: process of telling coming of the stories. Yes, they did well. Listeners, 50 00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:58,760 Speaker 1: we'd hope you enjoy this classic episode on Judy Blue. 51 00:03:02,200 --> 00:03:05,240 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff Mom Never Told You from how stup 52 00:03:05,240 --> 00:03:13,079 Speaker 1: Works Dot. Come hello, and welcome to the podcast. I'm 53 00:03:13,160 --> 00:03:17,480 Speaker 1: Kristen and I'm Caroline. And today on the show we 54 00:03:17,520 --> 00:03:21,600 Speaker 1: are talking about Judy Bloom. That's right. I mean I 55 00:03:21,960 --> 00:03:23,919 Speaker 1: can hear the screaming. I know. I feel like we 56 00:03:23,960 --> 00:03:29,560 Speaker 1: should just pause for listeners to jump up and down, 57 00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:34,520 Speaker 1: crazy applause, clap their hands, dance maybe yeah, maybe dance, 58 00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:39,440 Speaker 1: perhaps a little dance, grab their copy of Forever and 59 00:03:39,440 --> 00:03:42,440 Speaker 1: and just start rereading it and forget it. Yeah, forget 60 00:03:42,480 --> 00:03:46,080 Speaker 1: there listening to a podcast. Um So, when we announced 61 00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:48,560 Speaker 1: on Facebook that we were going to talk about Judy 62 00:03:48,600 --> 00:03:52,800 Speaker 1: Bloom and we're asking for listeners, favorite Judy Bloom titles. 63 00:03:54,240 --> 00:03:57,600 Speaker 1: People erupted in the comments in the best possible kind 64 00:03:57,640 --> 00:03:59,920 Speaker 1: of way. Yeah, I mean, I don't know, we've all 65 00:04:00,360 --> 00:04:02,440 Speaker 1: I feel like we've only received feedback like that on 66 00:04:02,480 --> 00:04:06,520 Speaker 1: a couple of very specific topics. Judy Bloom is obviously 67 00:04:07,080 --> 00:04:10,800 Speaker 1: obviously very close to people's hearts and and for good reason. 68 00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:14,200 Speaker 1: This is a woman who has written or or did 69 00:04:14,280 --> 00:04:16,960 Speaker 1: right in the seventies and still now is writing about 70 00:04:16,960 --> 00:04:20,159 Speaker 1: things that other people just don't She's she's being so 71 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:23,039 Speaker 1: honest with her readers about a lot of stuff that 72 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:26,000 Speaker 1: maybe sometimes your parents didn't even talk to you about. 73 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:30,320 Speaker 1: Maybe it is stuff that your mom never even told you. 74 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:34,479 Speaker 1: We just brought a full circle, Caroline, we can in 75 00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:37,159 Speaker 1: the podcast That's fine stuff mon never told you the 76 00:04:37,240 --> 00:04:42,320 Speaker 1: Judy Bloom of podcasts. Right. New tagline Judy Blooms Lawyers 77 00:04:42,520 --> 00:04:47,359 Speaker 1: might come after us. Um. I loved this quote though, 78 00:04:47,520 --> 00:04:50,880 Speaker 1: from Ellen Barry at The Boston Phoenix, who called Judy 79 00:04:50,880 --> 00:04:56,440 Speaker 1: Bloom the woman who invented American adolescents. And this would 80 00:04:56,480 --> 00:04:59,280 Speaker 1: also be a good time to note that she just 81 00:04:59,480 --> 00:05:03,120 Speaker 1: came out with a new book, Yeah, and everybody's writing 82 00:05:03,160 --> 00:05:06,200 Speaker 1: about it by calling it an adult book, not that 83 00:05:06,279 --> 00:05:08,320 Speaker 1: it's not not that it's not for grown ups. But 84 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:10,960 Speaker 1: Judy Bloom herself has talked a lot about how you 85 00:05:10,960 --> 00:05:14,960 Speaker 1: shouldn't limit yourself, that her books that people call young 86 00:05:14,960 --> 00:05:17,880 Speaker 1: adult books can be for anyone, and and same with this, 87 00:05:18,120 --> 00:05:23,040 Speaker 1: because all of her themes are universal and I think 88 00:05:23,120 --> 00:05:25,040 Speaker 1: hit home for a lot of people. Yeah, I mean, 89 00:05:25,160 --> 00:05:29,560 Speaker 1: she doesn't even like being called a young adult author. 90 00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:32,320 Speaker 1: She was like, I wasn't writing for young adults. I 91 00:05:32,400 --> 00:05:35,720 Speaker 1: was just writing, Yeah, exactly, why do we need these boxes? 92 00:05:36,360 --> 00:05:39,159 Speaker 1: Judy Bloom doesn't care for boxes, but she does care 93 00:05:39,920 --> 00:05:43,479 Speaker 1: for leather and denim jackets. Yes. I love this conversation 94 00:05:43,520 --> 00:05:46,560 Speaker 1: that Judy Bloom had with Chloe seventy. They were talking 95 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:51,039 Speaker 1: about Judy's books and her character's fashion, which I think 96 00:05:51,080 --> 00:05:55,279 Speaker 1: is a really fascinating conversation and so adorable and informative 97 00:05:55,320 --> 00:05:57,960 Speaker 1: because you know, in Judy Bloom's books, she always seems 98 00:05:58,000 --> 00:06:00,760 Speaker 1: to mention sweaters a lot, and so many sweaters, many sweaters. 99 00:06:00,800 --> 00:06:04,880 Speaker 1: But but Bloom ends up talking about how one of 100 00:06:04,880 --> 00:06:08,479 Speaker 1: her favorite periods in fashion was very specific. It was 101 00:06:08,600 --> 00:06:12,120 Speaker 1: Santa fe fashion in the seventies because she got to 102 00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:14,800 Speaker 1: wear a lot of leather jackets and kind of prairie 103 00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:18,760 Speaker 1: skirts over boots, and I just imagine how fabulous that 104 00:06:18,760 --> 00:06:21,240 Speaker 1: would be. I mean, I love it. What's not to 105 00:06:21,279 --> 00:06:23,960 Speaker 1: love about all that? And of course kloy seventy would 106 00:06:24,000 --> 00:06:28,040 Speaker 1: ask about about passion right um. And she also mentioned 107 00:06:28,360 --> 00:06:34,839 Speaker 1: side note listeners that she especially identified with Deanie because 108 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:39,360 Speaker 1: she also had scoliosis. It's like, here's someone going through 109 00:06:39,360 --> 00:06:44,080 Speaker 1: what I'm going through, which really encompasses why Judy Bloom 110 00:06:44,279 --> 00:06:48,120 Speaker 1: is so beloved and we can even quantify just how 111 00:06:48,480 --> 00:06:52,360 Speaker 1: beloved him an author she is because Caroline Judy Bloom 112 00:06:52,400 --> 00:06:57,400 Speaker 1: has sold eighty two million books that'll buy you a 113 00:06:57,400 --> 00:07:01,880 Speaker 1: lot of leather jackets, so many other jackets. But what 114 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:06,320 Speaker 1: comes along with her readers identifying with her honest writing 115 00:07:06,520 --> 00:07:09,720 Speaker 1: so much is the flip side of that, which is 116 00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:11,880 Speaker 1: the fact that five of her books are on the 117 00:07:11,880 --> 00:07:16,680 Speaker 1: American Library Association's one hundred most Frequently Challenged Books from 118 00:07:16,680 --> 00:07:20,400 Speaker 1: the period between nineteen and nine and still even today 119 00:07:20,400 --> 00:07:24,560 Speaker 1: in she is super challenge. That doesn't mean the books 120 00:07:24,560 --> 00:07:27,040 Speaker 1: have been banned yet. Challenge just means that people have 121 00:07:27,320 --> 00:07:30,240 Speaker 1: brought eh challenge saying that the book is inappropriate for 122 00:07:30,280 --> 00:07:34,720 Speaker 1: certain readers, but they have been actually banned not only 123 00:07:34,880 --> 00:07:38,640 Speaker 1: in school libraries but also in at home libraries like 124 00:07:38,760 --> 00:07:44,280 Speaker 1: my home library growing up, which we'll talk about later. Um. 125 00:07:44,320 --> 00:07:46,760 Speaker 1: But before she got to where she is now with 126 00:07:46,800 --> 00:07:51,160 Speaker 1: a two million books sold, in nineteen sixty nine, she 127 00:07:51,280 --> 00:07:54,280 Speaker 1: published her first book, The One in the Middle is 128 00:07:54,320 --> 00:07:59,320 Speaker 1: the Green Kangaroo, when the title is fantastic. She's written 129 00:07:59,360 --> 00:08:02,480 Speaker 1: thirty two books, and she swears up and down that 130 00:08:02,600 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 1: her most recent novel, in The Unlikely Event, will be 131 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:08,720 Speaker 1: her last. Yeah, and it's it's kind of great to 132 00:08:08,720 --> 00:08:11,120 Speaker 1: read interviews where she's talking about it because she's not 133 00:08:11,200 --> 00:08:13,960 Speaker 1: at all She's not at all sad. She's very much 134 00:08:14,040 --> 00:08:17,400 Speaker 1: optimistic about Hey, you know what, like that's kind of 135 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:20,240 Speaker 1: behind me, that whole stressful working a million hours a 136 00:08:20,320 --> 00:08:23,200 Speaker 1: day every single day for months. I just kind of 137 00:08:23,200 --> 00:08:25,119 Speaker 1: want to put that to the side and enjoy life 138 00:08:25,120 --> 00:08:28,000 Speaker 1: with my husband George, who again she talks about him 139 00:08:28,000 --> 00:08:29,760 Speaker 1: in such an amazing way too. I'm just sort of 140 00:08:29,880 --> 00:08:33,120 Speaker 1: I'm sort of fangroling out over Judy Bloom's whole life, really, 141 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:37,840 Speaker 1: the Jackets, the romantic relationship with her husband, the fact 142 00:08:37,920 --> 00:08:39,800 Speaker 1: that she's like, I'm just gonna go on trips and 143 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:44,600 Speaker 1: enjoy life. But the thing is, though Caroline, it hasn't 144 00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:46,719 Speaker 1: always been so sunny for Judy Bloom. She went through 145 00:08:46,760 --> 00:08:50,400 Speaker 1: some tough times even while she was at her most 146 00:08:50,600 --> 00:08:55,040 Speaker 1: prolific in the seventies. So for for a brief Judy 147 00:08:55,080 --> 00:08:59,960 Speaker 1: Bloom bio. She was born in in Elizabeth, New Jersey, 148 00:09:00,280 --> 00:09:03,400 Speaker 1: where her most recent book is set, which she's talked 149 00:09:03,440 --> 00:09:07,400 Speaker 1: a lot about how she finally, after so many books, 150 00:09:07,520 --> 00:09:11,920 Speaker 1: is coming back home for it. And she got married 151 00:09:12,040 --> 00:09:16,080 Speaker 1: the first time at twenty one to John M. Bloom. 152 00:09:16,600 --> 00:09:20,760 Speaker 1: He of her last name Bloom, of course, yeah. And 153 00:09:20,800 --> 00:09:22,720 Speaker 1: so by the time she was twenty five, she already 154 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:25,840 Speaker 1: had two kids, and she talks a lot about She's 155 00:09:25,880 --> 00:09:28,240 Speaker 1: very open with the fact that, yes, she is friends 156 00:09:28,280 --> 00:09:31,440 Speaker 1: now with her first husband, but back then it was 157 00:09:31,720 --> 00:09:35,240 Speaker 1: really difficult because she she talks about, how, you know, 158 00:09:35,360 --> 00:09:37,920 Speaker 1: that's such a young age to get married, you barely 159 00:09:37,960 --> 00:09:40,839 Speaker 1: even know yourself at one, as grown up as you 160 00:09:40,920 --> 00:09:42,840 Speaker 1: might feel, and as common as it was at the 161 00:09:42,880 --> 00:09:45,320 Speaker 1: time for people to be married by twenty one, My 162 00:09:45,400 --> 00:09:50,800 Speaker 1: mom was married by yeah, but she she talks about how, uh, 163 00:09:50,840 --> 00:09:54,840 Speaker 1: you know, she was missing that creative energy and creative 164 00:09:54,840 --> 00:09:57,280 Speaker 1: outlets that she had as a child, and she's so 165 00:09:57,800 --> 00:10:01,600 Speaker 1: clearly and in such a chris stillized fashion, remembers what 166 00:10:01,679 --> 00:10:03,640 Speaker 1: it was like to be a kid and to run 167 00:10:03,640 --> 00:10:06,920 Speaker 1: around and be creative and not be basically tied down 168 00:10:06,920 --> 00:10:11,280 Speaker 1: by life. And so um, she around this time starts 169 00:10:11,720 --> 00:10:16,000 Speaker 1: writing and talks about how that saved her life. Yeah, 170 00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:18,000 Speaker 1: I mean, and we should know that she had gone 171 00:10:18,000 --> 00:10:20,920 Speaker 1: to college, she got her degree in education, but then 172 00:10:21,000 --> 00:10:24,240 Speaker 1: realized that writing was the thing that was really in 173 00:10:24,280 --> 00:10:28,400 Speaker 1: her blood. And she started by just making up rhyming 174 00:10:28,520 --> 00:10:31,920 Speaker 1: stories while doing the dishes at night, and and she 175 00:10:31,920 --> 00:10:34,720 Speaker 1: would add little illustrations to them, package them up and 176 00:10:34,760 --> 00:10:38,679 Speaker 1: send them off to publishers. And as her interest grew, 177 00:10:39,280 --> 00:10:42,160 Speaker 1: she started to think, you know, I think I want 178 00:10:42,200 --> 00:10:46,880 Speaker 1: to tackle novels. So she takes a writing course at 179 00:10:46,960 --> 00:10:49,240 Speaker 1: n y U. And honestly, even still, I mean, I 180 00:10:49,280 --> 00:10:51,240 Speaker 1: know that it was not simple at this time for 181 00:10:51,280 --> 00:10:54,920 Speaker 1: her to be a mother of two and you know, 182 00:10:55,040 --> 00:10:57,320 Speaker 1: like writing these stories in her spare time, but she 183 00:10:57,360 --> 00:11:00,360 Speaker 1: still makes it sound so easy. I took a writing 184 00:11:00,400 --> 00:11:04,880 Speaker 1: course and then the rest is history, right, Well, not yet. 185 00:11:04,920 --> 00:11:09,040 Speaker 1: There was actually a lot of rejection in the beginning. Yeah, 186 00:11:09,080 --> 00:11:12,240 Speaker 1: according to her biography. Ever, at the Jewish Women's Archive, 187 00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:15,720 Speaker 1: Judy Bloom received I keep calling her Judy Bloom because 188 00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:17,120 Speaker 1: I want to call her Judy, And then I worried 189 00:11:17,160 --> 00:11:19,679 Speaker 1: that that's disrespectful. But I feel like we would call 190 00:11:19,720 --> 00:11:22,720 Speaker 1: each other by our first names if we hung out, Yeah, 191 00:11:23,040 --> 00:11:25,200 Speaker 1: or would you try to go for a nickname like 192 00:11:25,320 --> 00:11:29,760 Speaker 1: j B J Blue? J Blue whoa well so old? 193 00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:33,559 Speaker 1: J Blue received about six or even more rejection slips 194 00:11:33,600 --> 00:11:38,040 Speaker 1: every week for two and a half years before the 195 00:11:38,080 --> 00:11:40,160 Speaker 1: book The One in the Middle of the Green Kangaroo 196 00:11:40,360 --> 00:11:45,360 Speaker 1: was finally accepted, So keep that in mind aspiring creatives, 197 00:11:45,360 --> 00:11:49,840 Speaker 1: that rejection is part of the process. Um. And after 198 00:11:49,880 --> 00:11:52,160 Speaker 1: that publication of The One in the Middle of the 199 00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:57,080 Speaker 1: Green Kangaroo, her first novel, Iggy's House, was published, and 200 00:11:57,160 --> 00:12:00,920 Speaker 1: The Guardian describes Iggy's House as the story of Winnie, 201 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:04,920 Speaker 1: a girl who's quintessentially white suburban American street gets its 202 00:12:04,960 --> 00:12:10,559 Speaker 1: first black family and who is confronted with and confronts racism. 203 00:12:10,640 --> 00:12:16,120 Speaker 1: So right out of the gate, Judy Bloom is tackling issues. Yeah, 204 00:12:16,320 --> 00:12:19,920 Speaker 1: And and during this period from nineteen seventy ninety seven, 205 00:12:20,400 --> 00:12:24,079 Speaker 1: she hits this creative birth. So she finally gets her 206 00:12:24,240 --> 00:12:28,160 Speaker 1: books accepted and they're published, and those were the famous 207 00:12:28,280 --> 00:12:32,160 Speaker 1: years when her books Blubber Tales of a fourth Grade Nothing, 208 00:12:32,480 --> 00:12:35,079 Speaker 1: Sally J. Friedman and are You There, God, It's Me 209 00:12:35,280 --> 00:12:38,679 Speaker 1: Margaret came out, which I'm a thirty one year old 210 00:12:38,679 --> 00:12:41,360 Speaker 1: woman and I just read are You There, God, It's 211 00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:44,040 Speaker 1: Me Margaret for the first time last week, and we're 212 00:12:44,040 --> 00:12:47,760 Speaker 1: going to talk all about that the podcast, because I 213 00:12:47,800 --> 00:12:50,079 Speaker 1: wanted to hear all your thoughts. Caroline and I haven't 214 00:12:50,080 --> 00:12:52,559 Speaker 1: really discussed our feelings about are You There, God, It's 215 00:12:52,559 --> 00:12:55,120 Speaker 1: Me Margaret, which I recently read for the first time 216 00:12:55,640 --> 00:12:59,560 Speaker 1: as well, So I'm very excited to get to that point. 217 00:13:00,320 --> 00:13:03,480 Speaker 1: And speaking though of are You There, God, It's Me Margaret, 218 00:13:03,559 --> 00:13:06,880 Speaker 1: which came out in nineteen seventy, I believe, she says, 219 00:13:06,960 --> 00:13:11,280 Speaker 1: that's a real turning point for her to start developing 220 00:13:11,440 --> 00:13:17,360 Speaker 1: this honest style that is really what so many adolescents 221 00:13:17,440 --> 00:13:19,600 Speaker 1: and kids and even teens or even thirty year old 222 00:13:19,640 --> 00:13:24,800 Speaker 1: women have gravitated to over the years. But in the background, 223 00:13:25,320 --> 00:13:30,720 Speaker 1: as she is really getting her first taste of literary success, 224 00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:33,959 Speaker 1: it's it's not all roses on the home front. In 225 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:38,439 Speaker 1: ninety five, she divorces John M. Bloom and for a 226 00:13:38,520 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 1: snapshot of what life was like when you got divorced. 227 00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:46,480 Speaker 1: In nineteen seventy five, Judy Bloom told makers that the 228 00:13:46,600 --> 00:13:50,559 Speaker 1: first thing her mother said was, well, how could you 229 00:13:50,640 --> 00:13:57,520 Speaker 1: possibly leave such a beautiful house? Yeah, uh, I don't know. 230 00:13:57,559 --> 00:14:00,559 Speaker 1: I feel like that's something my mother would say. But 231 00:14:00,640 --> 00:14:03,760 Speaker 1: there were so few choices. Yeah, exactly, you know, but 232 00:14:03,920 --> 00:14:07,439 Speaker 1: women's women's liberation was in full swing, and Judy Bloom J. 233 00:14:07,600 --> 00:14:10,800 Speaker 1: Bloom was on board for it well. In nineteen seventies six, 234 00:14:10,840 --> 00:14:13,840 Speaker 1: she was also on board for marrying Thomas A. Kitchens 235 00:14:13,920 --> 00:14:15,960 Speaker 1: and moving to New Mexico. And that's when she gets 236 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:18,760 Speaker 1: into all the leather jackets and she talks about how 237 00:14:19,080 --> 00:14:21,480 Speaker 1: to Chloe seventy. In that same interview, which I'm obviously 238 00:14:21,520 --> 00:14:23,480 Speaker 1: obsessed with. I just didn't realize that until right now, 239 00:14:24,080 --> 00:14:27,320 Speaker 1: talks about how her children went to school with Tom Ford, 240 00:14:27,840 --> 00:14:30,040 Speaker 1: I know, And yeah, don't you wish I could have 241 00:14:30,080 --> 00:14:32,520 Speaker 1: been like a three way conference call. We could have 242 00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:35,120 Speaker 1: just we could have just hopped on with both of them. Yeah. 243 00:14:35,160 --> 00:14:37,400 Speaker 1: I wouldn't even have to have asked any questions or 244 00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:40,120 Speaker 1: talked silent like those calls in middle school, Like when 245 00:14:40,120 --> 00:14:41,480 Speaker 1: you do the three way call to figure out if 246 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:44,640 Speaker 1: a boy liked your friend or whatever. Maybe like um, 247 00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:47,600 Speaker 1: Judy asked Chloe if she likes us, and they'd be like, 248 00:14:47,680 --> 00:14:50,920 Speaker 1: who is this? How did you hack this line? Judy 249 00:14:50,920 --> 00:14:56,120 Speaker 1: gets Margaret that I don't want to freak Judy out 250 00:14:56,160 --> 00:14:59,800 Speaker 1: though um J Blue J Blue yah r J bloom 251 00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:04,320 Speaker 1: J Blue. Well. Three years later, she and Thomas divorce 252 00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:07,400 Speaker 1: and she moved to New York and in nineteen eight 253 00:15:07,640 --> 00:15:10,560 Speaker 1: seven she meet Well. I don't know when she met him, 254 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:14,240 Speaker 1: but she marries her beloved George Cooper. Again. I love 255 00:15:14,720 --> 00:15:17,880 Speaker 1: hearing her talk about George. Oh. She she's just over 256 00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:21,560 Speaker 1: the moon about George. Still is. And there's this fantastic 257 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 1: quote from Harper's Bazaar that makes me really look forward 258 00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:26,560 Speaker 1: to my forties, although it won't be taking place in 259 00:15:26,560 --> 00:15:29,440 Speaker 1: the nineteen seventies. She said, quote, I was at my 260 00:15:29,520 --> 00:15:32,920 Speaker 1: best in the seventies. I turned forty, and that's when 261 00:15:32,960 --> 00:15:36,640 Speaker 1: I met George, so it seems like a romantic, sexy 262 00:15:36,800 --> 00:15:40,080 Speaker 1: time to me. He remembers the night of our first date. 263 00:15:40,200 --> 00:15:42,200 Speaker 1: It was winter and I took off my boots and 264 00:15:42,280 --> 00:15:44,320 Speaker 1: I didn't have any socks on, and he thought that 265 00:15:44,400 --> 00:15:47,400 Speaker 1: was the most amazing thing he'd ever seen. Girl takes 266 00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:52,880 Speaker 1: off boots, no socks. Wow, that was something. Yeah, I 267 00:15:52,960 --> 00:15:55,280 Speaker 1: love it. I love picturing like there by a roaring 268 00:15:55,400 --> 00:15:57,960 Speaker 1: fire in my mind. I feel like if that had 269 00:15:58,000 --> 00:15:59,960 Speaker 1: been me, though, and I had taken off my boot 270 00:16:00,200 --> 00:16:05,040 Speaker 1: and no socks, yes, gentlemen would have said, wow, please 271 00:16:05,080 --> 00:16:08,080 Speaker 1: put your boots back on. Yeah, Wow, you're just going 272 00:16:08,120 --> 00:16:10,760 Speaker 1: to do that hump that's just happening. Wow, that is 273 00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:19,280 Speaker 1: a stinge. Yeah, I feel like romance cannot overcome foot smell. Well, 274 00:16:19,320 --> 00:16:21,000 Speaker 1: I mean, you got to be really in love. Maybe 275 00:16:21,080 --> 00:16:23,720 Speaker 1: true love with the test perhaps, but not early romance. 276 00:16:23,800 --> 00:16:27,480 Speaker 1: I mean, that's proof that it was love at first. 277 00:16:27,520 --> 00:16:30,920 Speaker 1: Boot love it first, foot leart of it first, but 278 00:16:31,840 --> 00:16:37,120 Speaker 1: vergeford um. And Another refreshing thing about Jade Bloom, which 279 00:16:37,200 --> 00:16:40,320 Speaker 1: is also not surprising honestly, is that she does not 280 00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:43,600 Speaker 1: hesitate to call herself a feminist and answer in the 281 00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:47,160 Speaker 1: affirmative when asked whether she is one, and yeah, she 282 00:16:47,280 --> 00:16:50,000 Speaker 1: was telling makers quote. I don't understand why some young 283 00:16:50,080 --> 00:16:52,600 Speaker 1: people think feminism is a bad word. Maybe they just 284 00:16:52,680 --> 00:16:54,680 Speaker 1: don't know what it was like to worry all the 285 00:16:54,760 --> 00:16:57,920 Speaker 1: time about getting pregnant and to be terrified even within 286 00:16:58,320 --> 00:17:01,120 Speaker 1: our marriages. And she goes on to say that the 287 00:17:01,160 --> 00:17:05,120 Speaker 1: women's movement gave her courage, and like you said, it's 288 00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:09,720 Speaker 1: not surprising that she identifies as a feminist because she 289 00:17:09,920 --> 00:17:13,560 Speaker 1: was a twice divorced working mom in the seventies writing 290 00:17:13,560 --> 00:17:20,200 Speaker 1: about girls having sex and not being punished for it. Yeah. 291 00:17:20,280 --> 00:17:23,320 Speaker 1: She talks about her book Forever, which is a huge 292 00:17:23,560 --> 00:17:25,639 Speaker 1: book for so many people, in which I still have 293 00:17:25,840 --> 00:17:31,200 Speaker 1: to read. Um. But her daughter Randy actually requested the book. Um. 294 00:17:31,880 --> 00:17:35,040 Speaker 1: She was sick of reading stories about young people who 295 00:17:35,480 --> 00:17:37,920 Speaker 1: made the decision to have sex or be intimate in 296 00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:40,480 Speaker 1: one way or another and then end up plot wise 297 00:17:40,520 --> 00:17:42,320 Speaker 1: getting punished for it in some way, you know, like 298 00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:45,760 Speaker 1: the Young Person book. We're at the end, evil is 299 00:17:45,880 --> 00:17:49,159 Speaker 1: punished and bad actions are punished and all of this 300 00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:51,879 Speaker 1: stuff and that all included sex or any type of 301 00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:55,240 Speaker 1: sexual activity. And so Judy Bloom takes up the mantle 302 00:17:55,840 --> 00:17:58,960 Speaker 1: of safe young person responsible sex and says, I have 303 00:17:59,080 --> 00:18:02,600 Speaker 1: to write this book, and I I loved finding out 304 00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:08,840 Speaker 1: about how different books intersected with her real life. So 305 00:18:09,040 --> 00:18:12,000 Speaker 1: how Forever was written for Randy and how Tiger Eyes 306 00:18:12,200 --> 00:18:16,440 Speaker 1: was inspired by the difficulties that her son encountered with 307 00:18:16,560 --> 00:18:19,879 Speaker 1: that move to New Mexico after she got married for 308 00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:22,480 Speaker 1: the second time and sort of uprooted the family a 309 00:18:22,560 --> 00:18:26,239 Speaker 1: little bit. And she she admits openly that there were 310 00:18:26,359 --> 00:18:29,680 Speaker 1: times when her personal life was a mess, but she 311 00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:33,000 Speaker 1: was still writing these books and trying to figure it out. 312 00:18:33,080 --> 00:18:34,680 Speaker 1: And then she met George and took off her boots 313 00:18:34,720 --> 00:18:41,040 Speaker 1: and everything everything got so much better, except for when 314 00:18:42,040 --> 00:18:50,080 Speaker 1: n hits and censorship really starts to come down on Bloom. Yeah, 315 00:18:50,119 --> 00:18:53,639 Speaker 1: and we're not talking about people focusing solely on Judy 316 00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:56,840 Speaker 1: Blim's book. It was more of a cultural movement going on, 317 00:18:57,080 --> 00:19:00,920 Speaker 1: and her books being published really coincided with sharp rise 318 00:19:01,000 --> 00:19:03,680 Speaker 1: and attempted books censorship here in the US in the 319 00:19:03,760 --> 00:19:07,680 Speaker 1: nineteen seventies and eighties, and writing specifically about Jitty Bloom 320 00:19:07,720 --> 00:19:10,560 Speaker 1: and censorship in the neo Neo American is that was 321 00:19:10,600 --> 00:19:13,720 Speaker 1: hard to say. Mallory z Amanski talks about how in 322 00:19:13,800 --> 00:19:17,200 Speaker 1: the early to late nineteen seventies, So I guess I 323 00:19:17,280 --> 00:19:21,240 Speaker 1: could just say the nineteen seventies challenges of books made 324 00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:25,080 Speaker 1: to the American Library Association or pretty low. They were. 325 00:19:25,160 --> 00:19:27,719 Speaker 1: They were increasing, but they were still pretty low. They 326 00:19:27,760 --> 00:19:30,280 Speaker 1: were about three hundred per year by the late seventies, 327 00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:34,520 Speaker 1: but in n one, nearly a thousand challenges were reported. 328 00:19:34,560 --> 00:19:37,400 Speaker 1: And so Judy Bloom's books, which we've said a couple 329 00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:40,120 Speaker 1: of times now, we're just very honest and very open 330 00:19:40,200 --> 00:19:44,359 Speaker 1: with themes like sexuality and religion. That was part of 331 00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:48,119 Speaker 1: that wave. Yeah, she talks about how puberty was a 332 00:19:48,240 --> 00:19:52,639 Speaker 1: dirty word at the time, and it's understandable that this 333 00:19:52,800 --> 00:19:55,480 Speaker 1: was happening in the nineteen eighties because you have the 334 00:19:55,600 --> 00:20:00,320 Speaker 1: Reagan administration and this rise of conservatism at the time. 335 00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:04,760 Speaker 1: So censorship kind of goes into overdrive and it and 336 00:20:04,840 --> 00:20:10,600 Speaker 1: it turned her into an anti censorship activists of sorts. 337 00:20:10,680 --> 00:20:13,760 Speaker 1: As she writes about this on her website, quote, I 338 00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:16,600 Speaker 1: believe that censorship grows out of fear, and because fear 339 00:20:16,680 --> 00:20:21,240 Speaker 1: is contagious, some parents are easily swayed. Book banning satisfies 340 00:20:21,280 --> 00:20:24,040 Speaker 1: their need to feel in control of their children's lives, 341 00:20:24,520 --> 00:20:27,760 Speaker 1: and the spear is often disguised as moral outrage. They 342 00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:30,720 Speaker 1: want to believe that their children don't read about it, 343 00:20:31,040 --> 00:20:33,560 Speaker 1: their children won't know about it, and if they don't 344 00:20:33,680 --> 00:20:39,280 Speaker 1: know about it, it won't happen, which in my experience 345 00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:43,600 Speaker 1: growing up in a household where Judy Bloom books were 346 00:20:43,680 --> 00:20:51,960 Speaker 1: intentionally not allowed because of how they discussed things like religion, puberty, sexuality, 347 00:20:52,080 --> 00:20:56,399 Speaker 1: and children just generally having opinions that that's not the 348 00:20:56,480 --> 00:20:59,760 Speaker 1: case at all, obviously, And Judy Bloom knew that if 349 00:20:59,800 --> 00:21:03,320 Speaker 1: you already what's going to happen to me? And and 350 00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:07,000 Speaker 1: and encounters with sexuality, We're going to happen to me 351 00:21:07,960 --> 00:21:12,320 Speaker 1: regardless of whether I read Judy Bloom or not, right, 352 00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:14,800 Speaker 1: And I mean, this whole thing is it's the same 353 00:21:14,840 --> 00:21:18,040 Speaker 1: conversation that surrounds sex aid in this country in terms 354 00:21:18,119 --> 00:21:20,639 Speaker 1: of like believing that if you just don't say s 355 00:21:20,680 --> 00:21:23,240 Speaker 1: e X two kids, they'll never figure it out and 356 00:21:23,280 --> 00:21:25,119 Speaker 1: no one will ever get pregnant, no one will ever 357 00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:29,200 Speaker 1: have an STD, where in reality, Judy Bloom kind of 358 00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:32,800 Speaker 1: knew better than that, and knew because she literally was 359 00:21:32,960 --> 00:21:40,560 Speaker 1: receiving letters from scared, sad, confused, lonely, unsure children. Her 360 00:21:40,640 --> 00:21:44,080 Speaker 1: readers were writing her things, writing her letters just saying, 361 00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:46,680 Speaker 1: you know, am I normal? You know people are starting 362 00:21:46,760 --> 00:21:49,399 Speaker 1: rumors about me at school, I'm getting bullied. When am 363 00:21:49,440 --> 00:21:51,200 Speaker 1: I going to get my period? All of the things 364 00:21:51,280 --> 00:21:54,720 Speaker 1: that her characters like Margaret and are you there? God, 365 00:21:54,760 --> 00:21:58,080 Speaker 1: it to me Margaret struggle with Well, I mean, it's 366 00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:02,080 Speaker 1: it's the fact that she wrote about kids as people 367 00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:05,680 Speaker 1: and not just these these kids with who need to 368 00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:12,399 Speaker 1: be protected or shushed. Yeah, exactly. And amid the Harry 369 00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:15,879 Speaker 1: Potter panic and all the censorship going on around that, 370 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:19,960 Speaker 1: she wrote an op ed of The New York Times saying, quote, 371 00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:24,000 Speaker 1: the real danger is not the books, but in laughing 372 00:22:24,160 --> 00:22:27,360 Speaker 1: off those who would ban them. Because she takes censorship 373 00:22:27,680 --> 00:22:30,159 Speaker 1: very seriously, and not just because it might hurt her 374 00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:35,000 Speaker 1: book sales. Yeah, she's she's a super active voice in 375 00:22:35,200 --> 00:22:38,159 Speaker 1: the anti censorship community because she basically says, you know, 376 00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:41,440 Speaker 1: if we keep letting people ban books that they disagree 377 00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:44,119 Speaker 1: with for their own personal reasons, then what's going to 378 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:47,440 Speaker 1: be left on the library shelves? How will kids ever 379 00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:50,040 Speaker 1: learn anything? And she she made a point in one 380 00:22:50,080 --> 00:22:52,359 Speaker 1: of the sources we read where she was talking about 381 00:22:52,400 --> 00:22:56,680 Speaker 1: censorship that you know, in my books, kids tend to 382 00:22:57,240 --> 00:22:59,119 Speaker 1: and and and in really any book, kids tend to 383 00:22:59,320 --> 00:23:01,639 Speaker 1: skip over and just sort of gloss over and gloss 384 00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:05,639 Speaker 1: past things and concepts they don't understand. So it's not 385 00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:08,640 Speaker 1: like they're getting spoiled by certain concepts that she writes 386 00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:12,920 Speaker 1: about in her books. But she did say that, Okay, 387 00:23:13,000 --> 00:23:15,800 Speaker 1: if they do read or pick up on a concept 388 00:23:15,840 --> 00:23:18,159 Speaker 1: in my book that maybe they're not sure about or 389 00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:20,360 Speaker 1: they can't tell what it means or if it's wrong, 390 00:23:20,560 --> 00:23:22,359 Speaker 1: or what it has to do with their bodies or whatever, 391 00:23:23,119 --> 00:23:25,080 Speaker 1: then maybe they'll actually get to take it to their 392 00:23:25,119 --> 00:23:27,159 Speaker 1: parents and say, could we talk about this? Could you 393 00:23:27,240 --> 00:23:29,320 Speaker 1: help explain it? And then it's sort of up to 394 00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:34,040 Speaker 1: the parents to parents and either talk about it or say, 395 00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:36,320 Speaker 1: you know, make a decision about the book at that point. 396 00:23:36,720 --> 00:23:40,080 Speaker 1: And that honesty that we have emphasized over and over 397 00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:44,959 Speaker 1: again already is certainly a cornerstone of why Judy Bloom 398 00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:49,200 Speaker 1: has been so beloved by readers of all ages for 399 00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:51,800 Speaker 1: so long. And now we're going to get a little 400 00:23:51,800 --> 00:23:56,439 Speaker 1: bit more into the individual books themselves and the impacts 401 00:23:56,560 --> 00:24:00,399 Speaker 1: that they have had not only on us, but also 402 00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:04,600 Speaker 1: famous authors who've probably heard of and even some stuff 403 00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:07,639 Speaker 1: Mom never told you listeners. So we'll get into that 404 00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:18,359 Speaker 1: when we come right back from a quick break. Now, 405 00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:20,639 Speaker 1: even though we've already touched on it a little bit, 406 00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:23,200 Speaker 1: we're really going to take this half of the podcast 407 00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:27,080 Speaker 1: who dig into the specifics of why Judy Bloom is 408 00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:30,440 Speaker 1: so beloved, and really it comes down to the exact 409 00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:35,200 Speaker 1: same reasons that she's so relentlessly censored, because she is 410 00:24:35,440 --> 00:24:42,480 Speaker 1: unafraid of writing, frankly about boys, girls, socialization, changing bodies, 411 00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:47,560 Speaker 1: all of these things that in our own adolescent minds 412 00:24:47,800 --> 00:24:50,320 Speaker 1: kind of get us spinning and worried and concerned, and 413 00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:53,840 Speaker 1: even more so probably for parents and adults who want 414 00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:57,560 Speaker 1: to shelter us from all of those more prurient things 415 00:24:57,680 --> 00:25:05,240 Speaker 1: like bodies and puberty and relationships. Yeah, whereas, hey, wouldn't 416 00:25:05,280 --> 00:25:06,840 Speaker 1: that just be easier to just give me a Judy 417 00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:09,399 Speaker 1: Blom book, then let me learn about the facts of life. 418 00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:12,680 Speaker 1: Although I was never given any Judy Bloom books, I 419 00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:14,760 Speaker 1: don't think they were censored in my house. I don't 420 00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:17,800 Speaker 1: think my mom was purposely trying to keep them out. 421 00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:21,399 Speaker 1: I just don't remember even really being aware of them 422 00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:23,919 Speaker 1: when I was growing up. You never got secretly past 423 00:25:24,280 --> 00:25:28,480 Speaker 1: a Warren copy of Forever I was Kristen, You and 424 00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:31,720 Speaker 1: I have talked about this. I was reading romance novels like, 425 00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:35,240 Speaker 1: oh yeah, you were past Judy Bloom. Caroline really didn't 426 00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:38,720 Speaker 1: need early, didn't need Bools time. I was like early puberty. 427 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:41,280 Speaker 1: I was reading romance novels that my mom had left 428 00:25:41,280 --> 00:25:43,680 Speaker 1: around the house. So yeah, I guess I did skip 429 00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:47,560 Speaker 1: over the but argue there, God, it's me Margaret stage. 430 00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:50,800 Speaker 1: I went right for the bodice ripping. I love that 431 00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:53,399 Speaker 1: you and I are both now circling back to the 432 00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:58,280 Speaker 1: age appropriate literature of our early youths. Yeah, I picked 433 00:25:58,280 --> 00:26:00,440 Speaker 1: it up. You know. Kristen and I the sided to 434 00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:03,440 Speaker 1: do this episode because it harkens back to the the 435 00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:07,760 Speaker 1: young adult summer reading episode we did last last year 436 00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:10,840 Speaker 1: last summer, and we're talking about how neither one of 437 00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:12,840 Speaker 1: us had read a Judy Bloom And so when I 438 00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:14,639 Speaker 1: read are you there, God, it's me Margaret, I was 439 00:26:14,680 --> 00:26:17,920 Speaker 1: pretty much smiling throughout the whole thing because I think 440 00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:22,320 Speaker 1: it's I think it's adorable, and I think her writing 441 00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:26,480 Speaker 1: is so important, and I loved reading, even though obviously 442 00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:29,240 Speaker 1: I'm so far past all that stuff. It was so 443 00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:34,520 Speaker 1: great and refreshing to read someone talking about puberty in 444 00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:36,639 Speaker 1: that way and the way that girls can be in 445 00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:38,880 Speaker 1: the way that it's like you just feel like you're 446 00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:41,800 Speaker 1: the only weirdo on the planet sometimes when you're growing up. 447 00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:45,679 Speaker 1: I mean, I still you know, chant my must increase 448 00:26:45,760 --> 00:26:50,280 Speaker 1: my bust ritual every night. Yeah, and because one day 449 00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:55,640 Speaker 1: it might take Caroline Um I had the same experience 450 00:26:56,000 --> 00:26:58,800 Speaker 1: reading are you there, God, it's me Margaret finding It 451 00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:02,840 Speaker 1: Hilary Us and also just basically enjoying as a writer 452 00:27:03,520 --> 00:27:09,920 Speaker 1: her the spare style of how she uses language so 453 00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:17,840 Speaker 1: economically to communicate like a kid's brain. So well, yeah, 454 00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:21,159 Speaker 1: well that was also refreshing. And Leada Dunham has a 455 00:27:21,240 --> 00:27:24,159 Speaker 1: quote about this too, about loving Judy Bloom for the 456 00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:27,879 Speaker 1: way she writes kids. She says Judy is one of 457 00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:30,920 Speaker 1: the only authors who, at the time she started writing, 458 00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:34,920 Speaker 1: acknowledge that kids have a fully formed consciousness and questions 459 00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:37,520 Speaker 1: that aren't innocent, and a sense of what's happening in 460 00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:40,200 Speaker 1: the adult world around them. I mean, you know, it 461 00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:42,560 Speaker 1: was so great when you were a kid to encounter 462 00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:45,879 Speaker 1: a grown up who talked to you, who indulged you 463 00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:48,359 Speaker 1: enough to talk to you like a grown up and 464 00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:50,720 Speaker 1: to treat you like you did have a brain and 465 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:53,440 Speaker 1: you did have opinions, even if your opinions were ridiculous 466 00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:55,720 Speaker 1: and very you know, appropriate to whatever age you were. 467 00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:57,960 Speaker 1: You know, a nine year old doesn't know much about 468 00:27:58,080 --> 00:28:04,480 Speaker 1: Israeli politics or anything like that. But well, speak for yourself, Carolin, Well, um, 469 00:28:04,760 --> 00:28:09,080 Speaker 1: so yeah, so, so I also appreciated reading a character 470 00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:13,479 Speaker 1: written like that. Well, and even though we're reading these books, 471 00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:19,520 Speaker 1: what forty years after they were originally written, she's still 472 00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:24,920 Speaker 1: touching on timeless issues. Yeah, I mean, and that's that 473 00:28:25,000 --> 00:28:27,359 Speaker 1: seems like that's such an inappropriate word for it. That 474 00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:31,920 Speaker 1: it's just like basic like dynamics of adolescents in terms 475 00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:35,720 Speaker 1: of girl friendships and how do you deal with that 476 00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:39,120 Speaker 1: girls developing bodies, I mean, in a little bit of 477 00:28:39,400 --> 00:28:42,360 Speaker 1: select shaming that happened among some of the girls and 478 00:28:42,440 --> 00:28:44,840 Speaker 1: are you there God as me Margaret, and just crushes 479 00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:48,280 Speaker 1: like how you feel when you see a boy or 480 00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:51,680 Speaker 1: a girl and your semit kind of erupts. Yeah, I know. 481 00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:55,520 Speaker 1: And a lot of people ask Judy Bloom if she 482 00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:59,120 Speaker 1: was trying to write these books as lessons, as teaching tools, 483 00:28:59,320 --> 00:29:02,760 Speaker 1: as a political coal tool, and she's very adamant that, No, 484 00:29:03,040 --> 00:29:05,240 Speaker 1: these were not, and this wasn't any of that stuff. 485 00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:07,480 Speaker 1: I wasn't trying to teach people something or teach people 486 00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:09,840 Speaker 1: a lesson. I just had these stories and I had 487 00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:11,960 Speaker 1: to write them. But it just so happened that my 488 00:29:12,200 --> 00:29:15,920 Speaker 1: voice was sort of alone in in in that in 489 00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:18,240 Speaker 1: the way that I ended up writing, and she says, 490 00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:21,200 Speaker 1: maybe I'm trying to illuminate. I've always felt that my 491 00:29:21,280 --> 00:29:24,120 Speaker 1: responsibility as a writer is to be honest. When I 492 00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:26,760 Speaker 1: first started writing, I felt that adults hadn't ever been 493 00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:30,080 Speaker 1: honest with me or my generation. Our parents loved us, 494 00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:32,360 Speaker 1: but their way of loving was to never tell us 495 00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:34,920 Speaker 1: the truth about anything, and to protect us from what 496 00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:37,520 Speaker 1: they thought we shouldn't know or the things they felt 497 00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:41,240 Speaker 1: uncomfortable discussing. So I wanted to be honest for kids 498 00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:43,440 Speaker 1: in my books the way I wanted adults to be 499 00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:46,800 Speaker 1: honest with me when I was growing up and growing 500 00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:50,840 Speaker 1: up in that post World War Two era of so 501 00:29:51,520 --> 00:29:55,000 Speaker 1: much silence like that. I mean, it must have had 502 00:29:55,440 --> 00:29:59,880 Speaker 1: such a big impact because like kids today, thanks to 503 00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:03,760 Speaker 1: the Internet, will will probably never grow up in as 504 00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:08,680 Speaker 1: culturally sheltered as you know baby boomer children did. And 505 00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:14,400 Speaker 1: probably because she was starting so genuinely from from almost 506 00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:21,160 Speaker 1: that just blank canvas, it sort of shaped the entire 507 00:30:21,800 --> 00:30:26,080 Speaker 1: just like it gave her that need for honesty that 508 00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:29,719 Speaker 1: she wouldn't have had otherwise if she were growing up 509 00:30:29,800 --> 00:30:32,360 Speaker 1: with a little more knowledge about how things are or 510 00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:36,000 Speaker 1: a little more access to information about how things work. 511 00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:39,120 Speaker 1: And I mean she's very clearly upfront with a lot 512 00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:42,480 Speaker 1: of teen and purity related issues and a lot of 513 00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:45,640 Speaker 1: her books, and that includes the book Deanie with the 514 00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:48,800 Speaker 1: famous or infamous depending on how you look at it 515 00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:52,400 Speaker 1: and maybe whether you're a school principle, uh, the scene 516 00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:56,680 Speaker 1: that features masturbation and Deanie. Deanie has scoliosis, and that's 517 00:30:56,720 --> 00:30:58,760 Speaker 1: the focus of the book. But a lot of people 518 00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:01,360 Speaker 1: do focus in er in on the fact that she's 519 00:31:01,360 --> 00:31:05,200 Speaker 1: sort of discovering her body. You know, she's experiencing scoliosa. 520 00:31:05,360 --> 00:31:07,840 Speaker 1: She's this pretty young girl. She has to wear an 521 00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:10,760 Speaker 1: embarrassing back brace and deal with what that means and 522 00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:13,680 Speaker 1: what people think about her. But it also focuses on 523 00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:16,680 Speaker 1: just being a young girl and discovering your body and 524 00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:20,360 Speaker 1: your physicality and what feels good. Yeah, And I mean, 525 00:31:20,520 --> 00:31:23,360 Speaker 1: speaking as a woman who was once a young girl, 526 00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:26,600 Speaker 1: that would have helpful thing for me to have and 527 00:31:26,800 --> 00:31:30,760 Speaker 1: read to be like, oh well and yeah, especially since 528 00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:34,000 Speaker 1: in the book the gym teacher is also very I 529 00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:35,800 Speaker 1: don't want to say sex positive, I don't want to 530 00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:38,760 Speaker 1: go that far, but it's also very like, no, you're 531 00:31:38,800 --> 00:31:42,000 Speaker 1: you're touching yourself. This is masturbation, it's normal, it's goodly 532 00:31:42,120 --> 00:31:44,120 Speaker 1: sex positive. Well yeah, but I mean I don't know 533 00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:47,560 Speaker 1: if Judy Bloom would use the word sex positis, right, 534 00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:50,479 Speaker 1: she hates labels. Um. When I was reading about how 535 00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:53,880 Speaker 1: basically positive and supportive the gym coach was, my mind 536 00:31:54,080 --> 00:31:57,360 Speaker 1: was blown. I mean my face was just like, oh really, 537 00:31:57,600 --> 00:32:00,959 Speaker 1: because I don't I never read anything like that at 538 00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:03,000 Speaker 1: all when I was growing up. And so to have 539 00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:07,760 Speaker 1: to have not only a book like Forever where sex 540 00:32:07,880 --> 00:32:11,040 Speaker 1: between teens is written as something that is done between 541 00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:15,600 Speaker 1: responsible young adults who've made a decision and practice safe sex, 542 00:32:15,960 --> 00:32:18,560 Speaker 1: do not only have that, but then to have sort 543 00:32:18,560 --> 00:32:21,800 Speaker 1: of this ancillary character who's like, no, you're okay, You're 544 00:32:21,840 --> 00:32:23,920 Speaker 1: okay in your body and you're doing something normal and 545 00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:27,680 Speaker 1: it's not wrong. You're all right. It's just even now 546 00:32:27,760 --> 00:32:32,239 Speaker 1: in it's mind blowing. Well, it's also revealing getting her 547 00:32:32,320 --> 00:32:36,720 Speaker 1: insight on Sally J. Friedman starring Herself, which Judy Bloom 548 00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:41,560 Speaker 1: has said is her most autobiographical novel, and um in 549 00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:46,040 Speaker 1: an epilogue to a later edition of the book, she wrote, quote, 550 00:32:46,080 --> 00:32:50,120 Speaker 1: when I was ten, I was a lot like Sally, curious, imaginative, 551 00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:53,640 Speaker 1: a warrior, and my stories, which I never wrote down 552 00:32:53,840 --> 00:32:56,480 Speaker 1: or shared, I was brave and strong. I let a 553 00:32:56,520 --> 00:32:59,640 Speaker 1: life of drama, adventure in fame. I think the character 554 00:32:59,760 --> 00:33:04,160 Speaker 1: of Sally explains how and why I became a writer, 555 00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:10,480 Speaker 1: and that to me says so much and makes so 556 00:33:10,720 --> 00:33:17,120 Speaker 1: plain why her books are as forthright as they are. Well, 557 00:33:17,240 --> 00:33:20,120 Speaker 1: not only that, but I think it illustrates why she's 558 00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:25,400 Speaker 1: such a passionate advocate for basically allowing children to read 559 00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:28,640 Speaker 1: what they want to read, to fight censorship, because she 560 00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:30,560 Speaker 1: talks about how, you know, when I was a kid, 561 00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:33,480 Speaker 1: I was reading these these books with adventure and fantasy 562 00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:35,480 Speaker 1: in them, and you know what, it made me want 563 00:33:35,480 --> 00:33:39,320 Speaker 1: to go out and do fly. She writes about how 564 00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:42,480 Speaker 1: it just these things they're not meant to convince children 565 00:33:42,560 --> 00:33:45,000 Speaker 1: like Harry Potter. They're not meant to convince children that 566 00:33:45,520 --> 00:33:48,440 Speaker 1: you know, magic is a thing, and that religion is 567 00:33:48,520 --> 00:33:50,920 Speaker 1: bad and that wizards are going to rule the world. 568 00:33:51,280 --> 00:33:55,000 Speaker 1: It's more about letting children imagine and fantasize and and 569 00:33:55,600 --> 00:33:59,120 Speaker 1: delve into that world of imagination where they can be 570 00:33:59,280 --> 00:34:02,040 Speaker 1: anyone and do anything, and how powerful that can be 571 00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:05,720 Speaker 1: on a child's own sense of creativity. I was a 572 00:34:05,960 --> 00:34:09,120 Speaker 1: super obsessive, constant reader growing up, and I also love 573 00:34:09,200 --> 00:34:11,839 Speaker 1: to write. No, I didn't write anything amazing or great. 574 00:34:11,960 --> 00:34:13,680 Speaker 1: You know, I wasn't like Penning the Great of this 575 00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:17,600 Speaker 1: podcast studio. Then that wasn't Penning the Great American Novel 576 00:34:17,640 --> 00:34:23,120 Speaker 1: at seven. But in reading wonderful stories of adventure and fantasy, 577 00:34:23,200 --> 00:34:28,120 Speaker 1: and or novels about friendship or or teamwork, like it 578 00:34:28,320 --> 00:34:31,160 Speaker 1: makes you realize that the world is bigger and it 579 00:34:31,239 --> 00:34:34,800 Speaker 1: can be a wonderful place. Yeah. And it's also to 580 00:34:35,440 --> 00:34:39,360 Speaker 1: giving kids that sense of normalcy, which is so important. 581 00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:42,880 Speaker 1: And this is something that's emphasized over and over again 582 00:34:43,000 --> 00:34:46,680 Speaker 1: in Letters to Judy What Kids Wish They Could tell You, 583 00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:53,320 Speaker 1: which is a collection of letters from readers to Judy 584 00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:57,720 Speaker 1: bloom Um that includes things like letters from a Fern 585 00:34:58,080 --> 00:35:00,840 Speaker 1: girl named Fern, nine years old, who says, dear Judy, 586 00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:03,759 Speaker 1: please tell me the facts of life in numbered order. 587 00:35:04,120 --> 00:35:07,600 Speaker 1: I love that so much. I am also a very 588 00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:10,520 Speaker 1: uh like rigid. I like things in order and in 589 00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:13,239 Speaker 1: lists and to do lists and schedules, and so I 590 00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:16,040 Speaker 1: I identify with nine year old Fern well and in 591 00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:19,719 Speaker 1: nine year old Fern and all these other kids writing like, ultimately, 592 00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:23,120 Speaker 1: what they really want is to just know, like, am 593 00:35:23,200 --> 00:35:25,879 Speaker 1: I okay? Am I normal? Is what I'm going through? 594 00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:30,640 Speaker 1: Like right? And will I fit in? You know? All 595 00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:33,800 Speaker 1: all of those, you know, just kind of vexing questions 596 00:35:33,840 --> 00:35:38,040 Speaker 1: that certainly don't evaporate once you get out of adolescents. Yeah, 597 00:35:38,200 --> 00:35:40,880 Speaker 1: and I mean sure, well, when you grow up, it 598 00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:43,879 Speaker 1: starts you start to realize that, like, hey, maybe being 599 00:35:43,960 --> 00:35:45,960 Speaker 1: like everyone else isn't all it's cracked up to be. 600 00:35:46,360 --> 00:35:48,680 Speaker 1: But when you're going through puberty, or when you're about 601 00:35:48,719 --> 00:35:52,000 Speaker 1: to hit puberty, and maybe you you haven't had any 602 00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:54,080 Speaker 1: sort of talk with your parents or any sort of 603 00:35:54,239 --> 00:35:58,200 Speaker 1: education about your body, when things start changing, that's that 604 00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:01,399 Speaker 1: can be really scary and stress well, and so you're 605 00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:03,160 Speaker 1: sure not going to talk about it with friends if 606 00:36:03,200 --> 00:36:06,600 Speaker 1: you're really embarrassed by it. So to have somebody like 607 00:36:06,719 --> 00:36:09,160 Speaker 1: Judy Bloom to let you know, she's like almost like 608 00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:13,040 Speaker 1: the goddess of adolescence, Yeah, I mean her books have 609 00:36:13,120 --> 00:36:16,800 Speaker 1: served as such a companion. This was something that Samantha 610 00:36:16,880 --> 00:36:20,439 Speaker 1: b from the Daily Show and her forthcoming solo show, 611 00:36:20,960 --> 00:36:23,480 Speaker 1: talked about to The New York Times and how she 612 00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:27,800 Speaker 1: saw herself reflected in the lead character in Blubber And 613 00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:30,360 Speaker 1: she says not from the bullying point of view, but 614 00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:32,239 Speaker 1: from the point of view of a kid who's trying 615 00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:36,040 Speaker 1: to fit in a striver I recognized in myself that 616 00:36:36,239 --> 00:36:38,400 Speaker 1: feeling of oh, you've got to work hard to belong, 617 00:36:38,480 --> 00:36:42,880 Speaker 1: You've got to figure it out. And that is so 618 00:36:43,400 --> 00:36:45,839 Speaker 1: I mean, I I have felt that same thing when 619 00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:49,560 Speaker 1: I was a kid reading Beverly Cleary books because you know, 620 00:36:49,719 --> 00:36:52,840 Speaker 1: Ramona resonated so much with me, because I saw myself 621 00:36:52,920 --> 00:36:56,080 Speaker 1: on the page. And that's such an empowering thing for 622 00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:59,759 Speaker 1: a kid to feel that you are represented and the just. 623 00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:02,640 Speaker 1: But he gets it. Yeah, Yeah, and that makes you 624 00:37:03,120 --> 00:37:06,000 Speaker 1: and that makes you okay, and that gives you, you know, 625 00:37:06,840 --> 00:37:10,279 Speaker 1: a little bit of a boost to muddle through all 626 00:37:10,360 --> 00:37:13,160 Speaker 1: of the adult things that might not make any sense 627 00:37:13,200 --> 00:37:16,640 Speaker 1: that you might not have any control over whatsoever. Yeah, 628 00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:19,200 Speaker 1: And like you know, reading are you there, God, it's me, 629 00:37:19,360 --> 00:37:23,160 Speaker 1: Margaret Um. She's dealing with parents who are of a 630 00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:27,480 Speaker 1: different religion. She's dealing with, you know, her grandparents who 631 00:37:27,520 --> 00:37:30,480 Speaker 1: were radically different from one another. She's dealing with a 632 00:37:30,600 --> 00:37:34,399 Speaker 1: new school, new friends, a best friend, who's a little 633 00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:39,279 Speaker 1: bit bossy, a little bit Nancy Wheeler, a lot of bit, 634 00:37:39,800 --> 00:37:43,040 Speaker 1: a lot of bit, and also having a secret crush 635 00:37:43,120 --> 00:37:45,520 Speaker 1: on a boy that you know, maybe you're not supposed 636 00:37:45,560 --> 00:37:47,480 Speaker 1: to have a crush on, but you just can't help it. 637 00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:50,480 Speaker 1: He looks so good mo in the lawn, I mean. 638 00:37:50,600 --> 00:37:52,840 Speaker 1: And also, haven't we all had to deal with a 639 00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:55,920 Speaker 1: Nancy Wheeler at some point? Even as I was reading 640 00:37:56,000 --> 00:38:01,400 Speaker 1: that book at thirty, I was like, oh, oh, Nancy, Nancy. 641 00:38:01,520 --> 00:38:04,560 Speaker 1: But I've been both of them. I've been Nancy, and 642 00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:07,520 Speaker 1: I've been Margaret, and you've been the crush mowing the lawn. 643 00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:11,080 Speaker 1: I have never mowed a lawn. That's something. Okay, So wait, 644 00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:14,239 Speaker 1: thirty one is the year that I finally read are 645 00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:15,799 Speaker 1: you there? God, it's me Margaret. Maybe it's the year 646 00:38:15,840 --> 00:38:18,759 Speaker 1: I'll finally mow a lawn. You know, I've mowed a 647 00:38:18,920 --> 00:38:21,880 Speaker 1: number of lawns in my day. That is not a euphemism. 648 00:38:23,600 --> 00:38:28,239 Speaker 1: And I'll tell you what. It's not bucket list worth it. 649 00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:30,440 Speaker 1: It's not yet. It's not cracked up. What all is 650 00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:34,279 Speaker 1: cracked up to be? Not all it's cracked up to be. Um. Well, 651 00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:40,400 Speaker 1: we've talked a lot about parents, adults, these generic stagy 652 00:38:41,120 --> 00:38:45,120 Speaker 1: humans who don't want to inform younger kids about the 653 00:38:45,200 --> 00:38:48,120 Speaker 1: facts of life, and that was something to point it out. 654 00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:52,239 Speaker 1: In a New Yorker piece by Anna Holmes on why 655 00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:56,000 Speaker 1: Judy bloom books means so much to her and to 656 00:38:56,800 --> 00:39:01,040 Speaker 1: other girls in particular, and she talks about how the 657 00:39:01,160 --> 00:39:03,719 Speaker 1: depiction of adult women in the books a lot of 658 00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:07,480 Speaker 1: times are as she describes it, highly anxious, easily upset, 659 00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:14,040 Speaker 1: overly protective, and obsessed with outward appearances, and she notes 660 00:39:14,200 --> 00:39:19,799 Speaker 1: that perhaps Judy Bloom is also in that process, really 661 00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:24,160 Speaker 1: emphasizing this contrast between these earlier times in our lives 662 00:39:24,560 --> 00:39:28,680 Speaker 1: that we should appreciate when what's going on inside of 663 00:39:28,719 --> 00:39:31,680 Speaker 1: our heads feels like everything and we have so many 664 00:39:31,800 --> 00:39:34,000 Speaker 1: feelings and we're trying to sort it out and every 665 00:39:34,120 --> 00:39:37,799 Speaker 1: moment is the best or the worst. Before you kind 666 00:39:37,800 --> 00:39:42,560 Speaker 1: of transition into this time when there is so much 667 00:39:43,480 --> 00:39:49,840 Speaker 1: body focus and anxiety and just general womanhood. Yeah, you know, 668 00:39:50,040 --> 00:39:53,480 Speaker 1: there's so much more. There is such a sense of 669 00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:58,000 Speaker 1: freedom um in a lot of her characters. I think, well, yeah, 670 00:39:58,000 --> 00:40:01,600 Speaker 1: and then the fact that, like, while everything seems so 671 00:40:01,840 --> 00:40:05,920 Speaker 1: big and heavy when it comes to worrying about your period, 672 00:40:06,120 --> 00:40:09,399 Speaker 1: worrying about you are you going to grow boobs? Finally? Um, 673 00:40:09,880 --> 00:40:11,960 Speaker 1: But then they get to go run outside in the sprinkler, 674 00:40:12,480 --> 00:40:14,360 Speaker 1: and so I think there's something I just I just 675 00:40:14,520 --> 00:40:17,800 Speaker 1: really loved reading about these kids who like, uh, you 676 00:40:17,840 --> 00:40:20,360 Speaker 1: don't have to worry about taxes yet you just have 677 00:40:20,440 --> 00:40:22,880 Speaker 1: to worry about filling out your bra and running through 678 00:40:22,880 --> 00:40:26,960 Speaker 1: a sprinkler. I miss that. I miss it. And you 679 00:40:27,080 --> 00:40:31,160 Speaker 1: know what I was so jealous of was how she 680 00:40:31,360 --> 00:40:34,560 Speaker 1: was able to just walk over to Nancy Wheeler's house. 681 00:40:35,320 --> 00:40:37,480 Speaker 1: It was just like this. You know, neighborhoods were so 682 00:40:37,719 --> 00:40:40,920 Speaker 1: different back then. I mean, and we're talking about you know, 683 00:40:41,000 --> 00:40:44,279 Speaker 1: the New Jersey suburbs and you just let the kids 684 00:40:44,360 --> 00:40:46,759 Speaker 1: out and yeah, I just walk over to someone's house, 685 00:40:46,800 --> 00:40:50,320 Speaker 1: bike over to somebody's house. That was something that I 686 00:40:50,440 --> 00:40:52,520 Speaker 1: wish I had had more of as a kid. But 687 00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:54,320 Speaker 1: I also I read that in other books too, and 688 00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:56,560 Speaker 1: was always like, man, that'd be cool. I want a 689 00:40:56,600 --> 00:40:59,600 Speaker 1: neighborhood gang. Yeah. I was part of a neighborhood gang. 690 00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:02,800 Speaker 1: Of there were four or five of us. It was 691 00:41:02,880 --> 00:41:04,640 Speaker 1: I grip next door to two boys, and then my 692 00:41:04,840 --> 00:41:07,200 Speaker 1: my best friend Ali was down the street with her sister, 693 00:41:07,960 --> 00:41:09,520 Speaker 1: and so I was I was the only child that 694 00:41:09,600 --> 00:41:12,719 Speaker 1: sort of floated between siblings. And we'd wander the neighborhood 695 00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:16,840 Speaker 1: and would you bike around? We'd bike around. We'd I 696 00:41:17,200 --> 00:41:19,480 Speaker 1: get my dogs to pull me on the skateboard of 697 00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:22,320 Speaker 1: the boy next door. Yes, or we've talked about on 698 00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:26,160 Speaker 1: our skateboarding episode. Um yeah, and then play with makeup 699 00:41:26,200 --> 00:41:29,200 Speaker 1: and stuff with the girls. So yeah, I do. It 700 00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:30,919 Speaker 1: was it was nice to think back to that time 701 00:41:30,960 --> 00:41:34,239 Speaker 1: of like sweaty summers as a kid, roaming from house 702 00:41:34,320 --> 00:41:36,719 Speaker 1: to house and basically having your parents just in the 703 00:41:36,760 --> 00:41:41,279 Speaker 1: air conditioning inside, not worried about it. So, Caroline, what's 704 00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:45,200 Speaker 1: your next Judy Bloom reread going to be? Well? I 705 00:41:45,480 --> 00:41:48,920 Speaker 1: I have to buy Blubber and I have to buy Forever. 706 00:41:49,239 --> 00:41:51,600 Speaker 1: But literally, the next Judy Bloom book that is in 707 00:41:51,840 --> 00:41:55,200 Speaker 1: my bag right now is super Fudge. Oh yeah, and 708 00:41:55,360 --> 00:41:58,560 Speaker 1: which she said was based on her son's or her 709 00:41:58,600 --> 00:42:02,359 Speaker 1: son one of the too. Yes, super Fudge was one 710 00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:05,759 Speaker 1: I remember my mom's citing as a reason why no 711 00:42:06,600 --> 00:42:08,480 Speaker 1: not okay, Well then I can't wait to read it. 712 00:42:08,560 --> 00:42:14,239 Speaker 1: I know. Please please don't tell my mom. Uh, let 713 00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:17,080 Speaker 1: me just pass it. Pass it to me by under 714 00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:20,440 Speaker 1: the under the cubicle or something. Yeah, so so my 715 00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:23,959 Speaker 1: mom won't find out um the next book of hers. 716 00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:27,920 Speaker 1: I would like to read His Wife e Oh, one 717 00:42:27,960 --> 00:42:33,320 Speaker 1: of her more adult novels, partially because the title intrigues me, 718 00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:36,760 Speaker 1: and also partially because I love a good story about 719 00:42:36,800 --> 00:42:40,560 Speaker 1: repressed housewives. I'm not gonna lie. We we just need 720 00:42:40,600 --> 00:42:43,319 Speaker 1: to have sort of an ongoing Jitty Blim book club. 721 00:42:43,360 --> 00:42:46,319 Speaker 1: It sounds like it sounds like someone listening is going 722 00:42:46,360 --> 00:42:48,759 Speaker 1: to organize that. I know if somebody get on that, 723 00:42:48,840 --> 00:42:51,640 Speaker 1: I have a have a sminty fan book club going on. Well, 724 00:42:51,680 --> 00:42:54,680 Speaker 1: and speaking of listeners, of course, we want to hear 725 00:42:54,800 --> 00:42:57,320 Speaker 1: from you. We want all of your Judy Bloom thoughts. 726 00:42:58,000 --> 00:43:00,319 Speaker 1: Mom stuff at how stuff works dot com is our 727 00:43:00,360 --> 00:43:03,919 Speaker 1: email address. You can also tweet us your favorite Judy 728 00:43:03,960 --> 00:43:07,799 Speaker 1: Bloom titles hashtag Judy Bloom. You can also message us 729 00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:13,320 Speaker 1: on Facebook, and in lieu of our typical listener mail segment, 730 00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:17,920 Speaker 1: We're going to share some of your Facebook comments about 731 00:43:18,280 --> 00:43:23,600 Speaker 1: Judy Bloom because they're just too good and too excited 732 00:43:23,880 --> 00:43:33,239 Speaker 1: not to. So these are responses to the question what 733 00:43:33,520 --> 00:43:37,759 Speaker 1: is your favorite Judy Bloom book? Serta Combs candidate said, 734 00:43:38,280 --> 00:43:41,840 Speaker 1: o MG, starring Sally J. Freeman as herself is my 735 00:43:42,400 --> 00:43:46,360 Speaker 1: caps all time favorite book. Please please please read it. 736 00:43:46,760 --> 00:43:50,960 Speaker 1: You will freaking love it. And Serena, I'm so glad 737 00:43:51,000 --> 00:43:53,759 Speaker 1: to see your comment because I just realized that I 738 00:43:54,280 --> 00:43:57,960 Speaker 1: botched that title earlier in the podcast when I mentioned it. 739 00:43:58,200 --> 00:44:02,120 Speaker 1: So friends, please save yourself an email. The correct title, 740 00:44:02,280 --> 00:44:05,560 Speaker 1: I realized, I'm correcting myself now is starring Sally J. 741 00:44:05,680 --> 00:44:09,080 Speaker 1: Freedman as herself, not Sally J. Freedman starring herself. Well. 742 00:44:09,120 --> 00:44:12,840 Speaker 1: Speaking of Fudge and Forever, Jennifer writes, I remember really 743 00:44:13,120 --> 00:44:16,400 Speaker 1: enjoying the Fudge books in third grade. In high school, 744 00:44:16,640 --> 00:44:19,800 Speaker 1: I found my mom's old copy of Forever with sticky 745 00:44:19,880 --> 00:44:23,239 Speaker 1: notes marking certain pages. I mentioned them to her, and 746 00:44:23,320 --> 00:44:24,880 Speaker 1: then the next time I picked up the book to 747 00:44:24,960 --> 00:44:30,759 Speaker 1: keep reading, they had mysteriously vanished. Michelle's Serenity Salas said 748 00:44:31,080 --> 00:44:34,279 Speaker 1: Summer Sisters and Wifey read them both when I was 749 00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:38,200 Speaker 1: four eighteen, and I remember my lady parts feeling very 750 00:44:38,320 --> 00:44:43,560 Speaker 1: adult while reading these books in class. Amy Wheeler Colburn writes, 751 00:44:43,719 --> 00:44:46,799 Speaker 1: it's a tie between Tiger Eyes and Iggy's House. Those 752 00:44:46,840 --> 00:44:50,200 Speaker 1: books changed me so profoundly. I am positive. I still 753 00:44:50,280 --> 00:44:53,000 Speaker 1: have them packed away somewhere, and I'm inspired to go 754 00:44:53,120 --> 00:44:57,719 Speaker 1: pull them out. Alicia Adams commented, I love everything this 755 00:44:57,880 --> 00:45:00,360 Speaker 1: woman ever penned. Truly helped me through some of the 756 00:45:00,440 --> 00:45:03,640 Speaker 1: most difficult parts of my childhood. I can probably recite 757 00:45:03,680 --> 00:45:06,719 Speaker 1: at least the first chapter of Tales of fourth Grade 758 00:45:06,760 --> 00:45:10,600 Speaker 1: nothing from memory. Also, was I the only little black 759 00:45:10,680 --> 00:45:13,240 Speaker 1: kid who flipped when the show came out and Jimmy 760 00:45:13,280 --> 00:45:16,920 Speaker 1: Fargo was black. That made my entire week. Remember it 761 00:45:17,160 --> 00:45:22,080 Speaker 1: like it was yesterday. Kelsey and romanoff rights forever. It 762 00:45:22,239 --> 00:45:25,200 Speaker 1: taught me young relationships are hard for everyone and to 763 00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:28,759 Speaker 1: value myself. But it didn't have that don't have sex 764 00:45:28,880 --> 00:45:32,200 Speaker 1: or you will die vibe at least that I remember. No, Kelsey, 765 00:45:32,239 --> 00:45:36,680 Speaker 1: I think you're right. Bertha College said, it's somewhat ironic 766 00:45:36,760 --> 00:45:38,319 Speaker 1: that I'm at a loss for words when it comes 767 00:45:38,320 --> 00:45:40,600 Speaker 1: to Judy Bloom and what she meant to me when 768 00:45:40,640 --> 00:45:43,560 Speaker 1: I was a preteen and beyond God, I have tears 769 00:45:43,640 --> 00:45:45,560 Speaker 1: in my eyes even trying to think of what to 770 00:45:45,680 --> 00:45:48,359 Speaker 1: say right now. The only word that comes to mind 771 00:45:48,600 --> 00:45:53,640 Speaker 1: is gratitude. I'm so grateful for Judy Bloom. Marianne Boyer 772 00:45:53,719 --> 00:45:56,800 Speaker 1: hopping Rights Oh, I think I need to do some rereading. 773 00:45:57,160 --> 00:45:59,640 Speaker 1: Are you there? God? And Forever were faves of mine. 774 00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:02,600 Speaker 1: I remember being shocked that I was allowed to read 775 00:46:02,719 --> 00:46:05,480 Speaker 1: Forever and making sure my parents didn't find out what 776 00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:09,200 Speaker 1: was in it, and speaking of which Linda Allen commented 777 00:46:09,520 --> 00:46:15,120 Speaker 1: Forever my mom called it porn. Well, listeners, we can't 778 00:46:15,160 --> 00:46:17,840 Speaker 1: wait to hear more from you about Judy Bloom and 779 00:46:18,000 --> 00:46:21,120 Speaker 1: why you think she is so beloved mom. Stuff at 780 00:46:21,160 --> 00:46:23,400 Speaker 1: how stuff works dot com is our email address and 781 00:46:23,480 --> 00:46:26,200 Speaker 1: for links to all of our social media as well 782 00:46:26,280 --> 00:46:30,279 Speaker 1: as all of our blogs, videos, and podcasts, including this 783 00:46:30,520 --> 00:46:32,920 Speaker 1: one with links for our sources. So you can learn 784 00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:35,600 Speaker 1: more about the life of Judy Bloom, head on over 785 00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:42,040 Speaker 1: to stuff Mom Never Told You dot com. The more 786 00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:44,359 Speaker 1: on this and thousands of other topics is it how 787 00:46:44,440 --> 00:46:45,359 Speaker 1: stuff works dot com.