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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you Should Know from House Stuff Works

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Speaker 1: dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark,

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Speaker 1: and there's Charles W. Chuck Bryant and Jerry and uh,

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Speaker 1: it's Stuff you Should Know the Rodeo. Yeah. Ironically, I

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Speaker 1: asked if we've done a podcast on memory and either

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Speaker 1: one of us could remember, And I'm looking it up

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Speaker 1: on our site and I don't see it anywhere. I

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Speaker 1: gotta feel like it doesn't necessarily mean it doesn't any

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Speaker 1: It's tough now with six and thirty forty plus. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean, we'll like delve into a subject, but it's

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Speaker 1: not necessarily what the whole podcast is about. And every

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Speaker 1: once while we come up with one of the stupid

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Speaker 1: non how X works titles, so that just throws it

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Speaker 1: off even further. Like we may have like named it

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Speaker 1: like a a podcast to remember boom boom mnemonic device bitching. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we totally did one on memory. Wow, good job, that

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Speaker 1: was real time. I just worked it out, all right. Well,

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Speaker 1: we're definitely gonna go over memory some because you can't

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Speaker 1: talk about amnesia without talking about memory, so we'll just

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Speaker 1: you know, reinforce that knowledge. I'm excited about this one.

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Speaker 1: I thought it was pretty good. Amnesia's uh sometimes it's

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Speaker 1: like TV and movies, but not usually. Uh it can

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Speaker 1: be yeah, but yeah, that's a very rare case. So

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Speaker 1: rare that, um, whoever has that kind of amnesia it

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Speaker 1: gets to be the intro for our podcasts. Who a

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Speaker 1: guy named Clive Wearing? Yeah? Man, this dude, Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: feel sorry for him. Did you see the cover of

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Speaker 1: the book. He has this look at his face like

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Speaker 1: what are you doing? That's because he wakes up again

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Speaker 1: every twenty seconds and goes, what just happened? Yeah, there's

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Speaker 1: a poor man named Clive Wearing here. He's a music

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Speaker 1: Asian and a musicologist, and he is the He is

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Speaker 1: the man with the world's poorest memory, which means Oliver

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Speaker 1: Sacks sleeps on his couch yeah you know, um, and

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Speaker 1: he has a memory that refreshes itself every few seconds.

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Speaker 1: He comes out and goes, who's that guy on my couch? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and he goes, I'm Oliver Sacks. And he goes, oh, hey, Oliver,

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Speaker 1: tattooed on your forearm? And then he goes, Oliver, what

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Speaker 1: are you doing here? That's how it is. But it

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Speaker 1: refreshes like that, so um, this guy. Uh, there was

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Speaker 1: a New Yorker profile in him. That conger who wrote

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Speaker 1: this article um cites saying that eating an apple is

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Speaker 1: kind of like a magic trick to this guy. Like

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Speaker 1: one second, like he's got the apple in his hand

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Speaker 1: and it's intact, and then he'll look down again and

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Speaker 1: it's just the core. A few seconds later. He has

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Speaker 1: no memory whatsoever of eating the apple. Um, he may

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Speaker 1: not even he probably he doesn't remember getting the apple, right.

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Speaker 1: He just knows there's an apple core in his hand now. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so he must have eaten it. Yeah, his uh. And

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Speaker 1: we'll go over this later. He has a journaling system

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Speaker 1: because you kind of have to. Um, like in the

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Speaker 1: movie Memento, Uh, and it had some excerpts and it

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Speaker 1: was literally like nine o five woke up, feeling refreshed,

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Speaker 1: nine oh eight, completely awake, now feeling really good. Nine

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Speaker 1: tin I am fully awake at this point. And he

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Speaker 1: scratches through previous entries just to to keep track on

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Speaker 1: where he is in the day. And then it takes

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Speaker 1: like a really jarring turn once a while, I'll be

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Speaker 1: like I no longer trust my wife. Yeah, there's some

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Speaker 1: weird guy on my couch. She's out to get me.

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Speaker 1: She could really mess with this guy. Yeah, you know,

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Speaker 1: she could be like Joey Pants and Memento. Yeah. I mean,

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Speaker 1: how many times in an argument do I say I

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Speaker 1: don't know what you're talking about? That would be so

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Speaker 1: great if that was actually affecting. I mean, an argument

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Speaker 1: would just stop after a few seconds, would be like,

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Speaker 1: but that would be one of the horrible side effects

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Speaker 1: of having amnesia, like Clive Wearing has. Um, imagine coming

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Speaker 1: to and you're a general is still pumping and you

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Speaker 1: feel the sensation of anger. You have no idea why. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that that is what happens to this guy. Yeah, so

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Speaker 1: we should say that. Um, he's not just like a

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Speaker 1: a walking noodle. Like he does have some memories. He

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Speaker 1: has Uh. He has the ability to still play the piano,

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Speaker 1: which is amazing. He was an accomplished piano player. Um,

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Speaker 1: but he can. He can play the piano if you

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Speaker 1: ask him to, and he'll play it well. But then

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Speaker 1: when he finishes, you can say, oh, what is that piece?

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Speaker 1: And he will say what piece? And that's that. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: He he has both retrograde and in tyro grade amnesia,

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Speaker 1: which is pretty rare to have both of those at once, um,

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Speaker 1: and what we'll get to what all that means. But uh,

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Speaker 1: and we'll get to why as well that he and

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Speaker 1: go make a cup of coffee. We're going to get

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Speaker 1: to it. You know, we already have. Oh that's a

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Speaker 1: nice tease. Yeah, he Uh, he remembers his wife, which

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Speaker 1: is good. Apparently one of the symptoms that he first

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Speaker 1: exhibited was he couldn't remember his daughter's name though really

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Speaker 1: one of his earliest symptoms it was a headache, and

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Speaker 1: then all of a sudden, He's like, what's your name kid? Right?

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Speaker 1: And then he thought, maybe something's not right here. Well,

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Speaker 1: and this is one of the things about amnesia that

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Speaker 1: it's different for everyone, and it's all dependent on uh,

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Speaker 1: what happened to you and the extent of whatever damage

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Speaker 1: you may have suffered. Right, And even two people who

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Speaker 1: have identical types of amnesia, it's going to be different

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Speaker 1: for them. And here's why memory is different for everybody. Exactly,

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Speaker 1: we all four memories following similar um constructs. But for

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Speaker 1: each individual person, what we remember, what makes us remember something, um,

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Speaker 1: all of that is highly individualized, highly personalized, so much

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Speaker 1: so that, Chuck, have you ever wondered if we all

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Speaker 1: see the color green the same. No, you've never wondered.

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Speaker 1: Now I've never wondered that, but now I am, and

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Speaker 1: it's fascinating. You haven't never wondered that really? Oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: like if like our visual cues are subjective, well, I mean,

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Speaker 1: like I see green and you see green and it's similar.

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Speaker 1: But haven't you ever wondered if like the shade is

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Speaker 1: slightly different or I never wondered that just because of

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Speaker 1: our the information coming to our optic terms, our eyes

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Speaker 1: are slightly different, like all of those little nuances, like

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Speaker 1: what's green to me? It's not necessarily green to you,

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Speaker 1: even though it really is because we both say light's green. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but there, if you think about there will be no

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Speaker 1: way to really describe that because if it's all subjective,

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Speaker 1: what do you say green is like a combination of

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Speaker 1: these two colors? Like, but what are those two colors? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's easier to just pointing and be like that screen

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Speaker 1: you go, now it's not green. Yeah, we should do

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Speaker 1: one on color blindness. I have it on the list,

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Speaker 1: but it's um pretty tough, believe it or not. I did, Uh,

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Speaker 1: don't be dumb on color blindness. Dogs being color blind

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Speaker 1: they're not. They're not. No, No, they see how you

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Speaker 1: prove that they see a spectrum. I can't remember. You'll

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Speaker 1: have to watch. They don't be dumb on it. Um. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So let's talk about the memory process that humans typically follow,

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Speaker 1: even though it is highly individualized. Yeah, there's a couple

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Speaker 1: of types of memory we all know and love as

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Speaker 1: short term and long term. Um. If you long short

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Speaker 1: term is good because you remember what you want and

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Speaker 1: you get rid of what you don't if you if

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Speaker 1: you didn't, you would be like Mary leu Henner from Taxi.

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Speaker 1: Oh did she have like an amazing memory? She has

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Speaker 1: a condition that only another dozen people have in the

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Speaker 1: US called h SAM highly superior autobiographical memory. And they

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Speaker 1: just discovered it in two thousand six period, not just

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Speaker 1: in her. And it's only biographical though, but for these people,

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Speaker 1: you say June one, n six and merely lou Hennerck

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Speaker 1: can go, oh, well that was an off day for taxi.

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Speaker 1: We weren't shooting, and I went shopping at Sacks and

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Speaker 1: bought the scarf and had a cops salad. And uh,

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Speaker 1: like I said, though it's only autobiographical, they can't necessarily

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Speaker 1: remember like everything just about details of their life. But

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Speaker 1: it's just nuts, Like she literally remembers everything that's ever

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Speaker 1: happened to her. So that's cool. Yeah, that she remembers

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Speaker 1: that cops salad because it was probably pretty good to

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Speaker 1: screw up a cops salad. Uh sacks trip. That's fun. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So that's good. But if she were if she had

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Speaker 1: um a low Laighton inhibition, where all of the things

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Speaker 1: like the click of of UM, a light bulb turning on,

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Speaker 1: the buzzing from somebody's electric razor next door, the sound

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Speaker 1: of water ushing, the look of everything, the feel of everything,

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Speaker 1: all of the information was coming in and flooding her

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Speaker 1: memory and asking for her attention to crazy. Yeah. So

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Speaker 1: one of the roles of short term memory, specifically the hippocampus,

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Speaker 1: is to say keep that, keep that, throw that away,

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Speaker 1: throw that away, throw that away. This one seems kind

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Speaker 1: of important. Oh, this one has an emotion attached. We

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Speaker 1: definitely need to keep that. That's what's going on with

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Speaker 1: short term memory. Apparently we keep about seven pieces of

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Speaker 1: information up to thirty seconds, which sounds to me like

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Speaker 1: a statement that is going to be utterly debunked as

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Speaker 1: ridiculous in ten years. We understand memory more for the

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Speaker 1: time being. That's our concept of short term memory. It

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Speaker 1: does seem sort of like a stab yeah at something.

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Speaker 1: It's overly concise. Yeah, you know, I agreed. So that's

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Speaker 1: short term memory and short term memories basically just holding

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Speaker 1: immediate information in the front of your mind um figure

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Speaker 1: tatively in literally uh. And and if it's sorted, it's

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Speaker 1: sorted into long term memory. That's right. How we store memories,

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Speaker 1: how we make memories. The first thing that happens is

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Speaker 1: we have something called sensory memories. So you see a uh,

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Speaker 1: you hear josh past gas, and you hear a sound.

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Speaker 1: You might smell something you would not hear that. That's

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Speaker 1: true you're an sp D guy. Or let's say you

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Speaker 1: see a strawberry and you taste the strawberry and you

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Speaker 1: see what it looks like, that it's red, and you

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Speaker 1: taste it and you know it's tart. Those are sensory memories,

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Speaker 1: and our nerve cells detect that. They send that as

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Speaker 1: an electrical electrical impulse along to the end of a

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Speaker 1: nerve um. It turns on the little neurotransmitter, which sends

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Speaker 1: a chemical message that hops. We've talked about synapses, those

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Speaker 1: gaps between nerve cells. The neurotransmitter sends it across that

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Speaker 1: little great divide to the neuron, which is your brain cell,

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Speaker 1: and immediately your brain registers that as a short term memory.

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Speaker 1: Uh And whether or not it becomes a long term

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Speaker 1: memory is whether or not you need to remember that

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Speaker 1: and encode it, right, And that encoding process is what

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Speaker 1: moves it to the deep freeze. You know what I'm

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Speaker 1: curious about. I wish I thought to look this up.

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Speaker 1: How does science quantify the present? Like? Can you as

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Speaker 1: the present? You know? Point eight nanoseconds? Is it the

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Speaker 1: thirty seconds that you're you're working memories, chewing on something?

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Speaker 1: I mean, how quickly does a sensation or an experience

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Speaker 1: become the past? That's nano second after it happens, I guess.

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Speaker 1: But why a nano second? Why not a micro second?

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Speaker 1: Why not five seconds? Whatever? The smallest amount of time

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Speaker 1: is technically probably I guess. So that's pretty deep sought

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Speaker 1: though after that green, it's like I took acid earlier? Sweet?

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Speaker 1: Uh so um encoding for long term memories? Where we

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Speaker 1: were right, All of this stuff is coming to the

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Speaker 1: hippocampus and the hippocampus works in concert with some other

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Speaker 1: parts of the brain, the amygdala, the thalamus. The amygdella

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Speaker 1: is big on emotion, the thalamus is big on um

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Speaker 1: routing sensory stuff impairing it with emotion. Emotions play a

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Speaker 1: big role in memory, Yes, because if you pair an

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Speaker 1: experience with an emotion, it's going to have that much

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Speaker 1: more of a an impact on our neural pathways that

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Speaker 1: are formed. Yeah, that's what encoding is. Like the things

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Speaker 1: you remember most, you're you're you're basically leaving a trail

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Speaker 1: of bread crumbs along this pathway. If you want to

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Speaker 1: retrieve a memory, and the stronger, like you said, if

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Speaker 1: it's tied to emotion, it might be stronger and more reinforced.

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Speaker 1: Or if it's something you have to remember a lot,

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Speaker 1: that bread crumb trail is gonna be with larger pieces

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Speaker 1: of bread. Yeah, the more spot the more times it's traversed,

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Speaker 1: the the more well worn the path grows, the stronger

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Speaker 1: that memory is UM. And that's that's a UM A

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Speaker 1: mechanism called long term potential ation where an initial sensory

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Speaker 1: experience becomes a hard encoded memory in our long term memory.

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Speaker 1: And you could crack open like one of our brains

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Speaker 1: and say, see this this neural circuit right here, that's

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Speaker 1: my memory of my last birthday. See that donut that's

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Speaker 1: just there. It just started growing a few years ago.

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Speaker 1: I'm waiting for it to fully mature before I harvest it.

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Speaker 1: That was always a one of the early Simpsons had that.

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Speaker 1: I think it showed people's like thought bubbles at point

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Speaker 1: and Homer's is just a donut. Yeah, that was pretty good.

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Speaker 1: I can see that. Uh So, like you said this,

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Speaker 1: this is all part of the limbic system. I don't

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Speaker 1: think we said that. No we didn't, which which is, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know your reward system. You experience emotions through it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: learning memory all that is tied to the limbic system.

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Speaker 1: And um, are our thoughts are being stored in the

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Speaker 1: crebral cortex? Are i should say, are episode or is

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Speaker 1: it our episodic well short term that's in this in

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Speaker 1: the cerebral cortex. Yeah, okay, um so if a yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's right. Because if you take a specific type of memory,

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Speaker 1: which we'll get to in a second, it usually gets

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Speaker 1: stored in the region that's responsible for processing it as

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Speaker 1: it happens in the first place. So like broke A's

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Speaker 1: area responsible for processing language. There's also your your language

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Speaker 1: related memories are stored there. You know that time that

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Speaker 1: guy shouted at you in Spanish you didn't know what

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Speaker 1: he was saying. You can crack open the Broker's area

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Speaker 1: and there it is. Yeah. So the cortex is where

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Speaker 1: you temporarily put it. It works with the hippocampus to

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Speaker 1: send it to Like you said, whatever part of the brain.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know that. That's interesting though, it lives where

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Speaker 1: it was originated. Total sense. Yeah again, I really just

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Speaker 1: I have a feeling that are understanding of memory is

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Speaker 1: tenuous enough that like a lot of this stuff is

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Speaker 1: going to change in ten years, five years, fifteen years,

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Speaker 1: But for the time being, this is our understanding. Well,

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Speaker 1: like with anything in the brain, it's just like there's

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Speaker 1: still so much mystery, you know, shrouded in it the

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Speaker 1: gray area. Uh. All right, So there's many types of

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Speaker 1: long term memory. Uh. They are as follows, and these

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Speaker 1: will come up throughout the show. Your explicit or episodic

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Speaker 1: memory is what we do when we study for a podcast. Basically,

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Speaker 1: it's like facts and information specific stuff, right, we read it,

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Speaker 1: we learn it, we know it. Yeah, cramming for an exam.

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Speaker 1: That's how you do it. You've got procedural or implicit Uh,

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Speaker 1: these are sensory and motor memories. That's how you know

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Speaker 1: how to make a cup of coffee. And it's it's

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Speaker 1: like muscle memory. Yeah, it becomes less of memory and

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Speaker 1: more something that you've done by repetition over and over.

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Speaker 1: That's why, uh, Clive make that cup of coffee, or

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Speaker 1: can play the piano. Still, Yeah, he doesn't remember how

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Speaker 1: to play the piano fingers, just do it from muscle memory. Right,

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Speaker 1: he doesn't consciously remember. He does have procedural memories exactly. Um,

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Speaker 1: you've got semantic memory, which is organized and categorized memories.

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Speaker 1: So it's kind of like a meta version of type

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Speaker 1: of memory. Right where like you, um, if you're thinking

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Speaker 1: about what your favorite bands are, something, you have a

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Speaker 1: file of all the bands you ever listened to that

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Speaker 1: maybe there's a subfolder in that file of the ones

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Speaker 1: that you've ever heard that you like, right, and all

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Speaker 1: of those are based on your experiences of listening to

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Speaker 1: led Zeppelin or you know, um Boogie Down Productions or

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Speaker 1: the Carpenters. I can go on. So when someone asks

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Speaker 1: you what your favorite band is you're scrolling through that folder, right,

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Speaker 1: and what you're doing is accessing your semantic memory, right,

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Speaker 1: Or you could just you could be like, look at

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Speaker 1: the T shirt, but you just default and say Pavement,

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Speaker 1: then you're good to go. Pixies for you probably how

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Speaker 1: uh Yeah, I would say these days, I would go

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Speaker 1: more with Morrissey. Oh yeah, yeah, whoa. Oh He's always

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Speaker 1: been up there, yeah, nipping at the Pixies heels. But

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Speaker 1: I would say Morrissey may have taken the lead recently. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I remember we're hearing the Smiths for the first time

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Speaker 1: in like ninth grade. I was like, man, who are

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Speaker 1: these guys? They still hold up? But if you and

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Speaker 1: if you listen though, it's like, well, no, you mean

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Speaker 1: the Smiths. No, I love the Smiths. But if you

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Speaker 1: listen to Morrissey's career, like all it was was the

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Speaker 1: evolution of Morrisey started with the Smiths, and he just

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Speaker 1: kept going and he just hit his stride even more

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Speaker 1: after the Smiths. I like Morrissey even more than the Smiths.

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Speaker 1: Man all right, and I felt good to get off

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Speaker 1: my chest. You won't find me dissing Mars under any circumstances.

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Speaker 1: He's the man. So you've got emotional long term memory

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Speaker 1: that those are um well, emotional like superintense memories about

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Speaker 1: something that may have happened to you. Uh, and then

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Speaker 1: spatial which are just the spacing of an area. I

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Speaker 1: remember that in the dark when I go to the

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Speaker 1: bathroom that I have to walk around my nightstand. Oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's a good one. Running right into it. Man, that

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Speaker 1: will break your toe. Although that happens, and I kind

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Speaker 1: of I don't necessarily take issue with emotional memories being

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Speaker 1: broken out as their own thing, But it seems like

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Speaker 1: emotion is one of the drivers of memory formation, even

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Speaker 1: if it's just the slightest feeling. It seems like emotions

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Speaker 1: attached to all memories. Like it's a it's a signal

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Speaker 1: like remember this, and it's also a way it's it's

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Speaker 1: an aspect of memory as well, like when you recall

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Speaker 1: a memory strawberry. Um, if you have your first strawberry

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Speaker 1: after somebody mashes it in your face and like twist

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Speaker 1: your nipples and walks away, right, you're probably going to

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Speaker 1: associate that bad feeling with strawberries for a while. There's

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Speaker 1: nothing worse than strawberry. So so all all memories have

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Speaker 1: some amount of emotion to him, which means all memories

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Speaker 1: are emotional. But Chuck, that doesn't mean that for the

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Speaker 1: rest of your life you're gonna have kind of a

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Speaker 1: sour taste in your mouth when you're eating a sweet

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Speaker 1: strawberry because of that initial experience, because memories are subject

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Speaker 1: to change because of neural plasticity. That's right, although you

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Speaker 1: may as well like you might remember it, but I'll

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Speaker 1: bet you don't have the emotional experience of it over

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Speaker 1: and over again if you eat enough strawberries and experience

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Speaker 1: them in different situations and settings. Right, I guess you're right. Like,

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Speaker 1: if something has made me sick in the past, I

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Speaker 1: have an aversion to it, but but I don't power

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Speaker 1: through it, Like I just leave it there. I won't

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Speaker 1: drink Milwaukee's best beer anymore. Really get sick off that

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Speaker 1: man like years ago, and just the smell of it

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Speaker 1: now immediately, I'm just like, that's funny. Um, if you

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Speaker 1: wanted to, you could power through it and after enough times,

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Speaker 1: what you would be doing is activating that neural circuit,

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Speaker 1: that long term potential action and refreshing it a little bit,

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Speaker 1: changing your idea of what Milwaukee's Best is all about.

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Speaker 1: That's a commercial. They should send us some beer and

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Speaker 1: I'll get over it. There you, but I won't get

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Speaker 1: so drunk that I passed out and forget because we'll

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Speaker 1: get to that. That's a real thing. Yeah, that's a

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Speaker 1: kind of amnesia. It is literally, you can get amnesia

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Speaker 1: tonight if you want, no thanks, I'm going to see

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Speaker 1: Stephen Mountains tonight. Full circle. You want to remember that.

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Speaker 1: And then the third type of memory is where you

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Speaker 1: combine short term memory with long term memory and you

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Speaker 1: come up with working memory. UM. One example I saw

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Speaker 1: during research is when you're looking at a menu. You're

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Speaker 1: going down a menu to decide what you want to eat.

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Speaker 1: You're taking in that information from that menu, UM, and

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Speaker 1: you're creating a little bit of an episodic stimulus in

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Speaker 1: your short term memory and then your acts seeing your

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Speaker 1: long term memories, maybe from having pork chops before, um,

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Speaker 1: and you're comparing the two. That's your working memory. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So that's a that's a huge aspect of memory as well.

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Speaker 1: And they think as it stands right now, that it's

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Speaker 1: basically a combination of short term memory and long term memory,

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Speaker 1: mixing them together. And there you have your menu choice.

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Speaker 1: And that's just your day to day kind of deciding things.

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Speaker 1: That's what your working memory is. That's a very dumb

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Speaker 1: way to say it, but you know what I mean,

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Speaker 1: your day to day all right, So I guess we

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Speaker 1: can talk about an amnesia a little bit now, right. Uh,

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Speaker 1: forgetfulness is good, it's not a bad thing to forget. Um,

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Speaker 1: you should remember the important things. But like we said,

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Speaker 1: it frees up your brain of the the stuff we

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Speaker 1: don't need. And amnigia is nothing more than a really

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Speaker 1: bad case of the forgets brought on by It can

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Speaker 1: be brought on by a lot of things, but a

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Speaker 1: lot of time it's literally an injury to your brain. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: well that's neurological amnesia, which is the first kind that

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Speaker 1: we're talking about here. It can come on from a stroke. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it can come on from your you're just not having

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Speaker 1: enough oxygen for a little while. Drugs. Drugs can bring

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Speaker 1: it on. Drugs can bring in alcohol. Yeah. What else? Uh?

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Speaker 1: Any like blunt force trauma, electro convulsive therapy. That was

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Speaker 1: another good episode we did. Yeah. In the case of

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Speaker 1: Clyde Wearing, he had a he had herpes and cephalitis,

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Speaker 1: a viral infection that can do it. It It destroyed his

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Speaker 1: basically cut the cord of the hippocampus and the cortex.

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Speaker 1: Well give him that analogy. That's a great analogy, the

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Speaker 1: telephone cord. Uh yeah, then this is thanks to Kristen

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Speaker 1: Kongner who wrote this. I don't know if we mentioned that. Um,

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Speaker 1: if your memories a telephone, the hippocampus is the phone

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Speaker 1: cord and the synapsis that we talked about are the

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Speaker 1: in the cortex. Those are the voicemail messages. So in

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Speaker 1: his case, he had damaged to his cortex I believe,

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Speaker 1: and the hippocampus, right, Yeah, he has one of the

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Speaker 1: more severe versions of amnesia. So because the phone cord

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Speaker 1: was cut in the hippocampus, that's why he has no

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Speaker 1: ability to form any long term memory because there's just

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Speaker 1: no pathway and the voice messages are erased essentially because

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Speaker 1: of the damage to the cortex, and there's no way

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Speaker 1: that they may be there still, but there's no way

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Speaker 1: for him to access his voicemail account any longer. So

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Speaker 1: he is a really bad case of neurological amnesia. And analogy.

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Speaker 1: I had Mr Telephone Man in my head that new

402
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Speaker 1: Addistance song. Oh yeah is to go listen to it.

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Speaker 1: It worked too. So when you die your baby's number

404
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Speaker 1: and you get a click every time, Mr Telephone Man song,

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Speaker 1: it is a good song. Was pretty good. Yeah, And

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Speaker 1: well we gone over Bill Bidevo. Well, I've dropped a

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Speaker 1: couple of references over the years that very few people notice.

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Speaker 1: Were you a Bell Bio fan? Okay a little bit?

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Speaker 1: I mean you know that wasn't really my music, but

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Speaker 1: I'm a new addition man myself. That was a big

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Speaker 1: Bobby Brown guy. So, um, with this, with neurological amnesia,

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Speaker 1: there is damage to the structure. Um, and it just

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Speaker 1: shuts down the whole system. Ry cuts that chord and

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Speaker 1: um we talked about all of the different ways you

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Speaker 1: can you can get that yeah, and it can be,

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Speaker 1: like we said, depending on how severe the injuries are.

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Speaker 1: It's not always completely cut, but it just may be damaged.

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Speaker 1: So you may have either really bad amnesia like live wearing,

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Speaker 1: or maybe not so bad right and um. Neurological amnesia

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Speaker 1: is very often permanent, but it's also very often stable

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Speaker 1: unless it's associated with the degenerative brain disease. It's usually

422
00:24:53,680 --> 00:24:58,400
Speaker 1: like after whatever event happened to you, whatever you come

423
00:24:58,480 --> 00:25:02,600
Speaker 1: to remembering or maybe after you fully recover, um, after

424
00:25:02,640 --> 00:25:04,919
Speaker 1: you hit that point where you're like, I don't remember

425
00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:07,720
Speaker 1: anything else or I can't form new memories after X

426
00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:11,720
Speaker 1: number of minutes or seconds or whatever. Um, it's gonna

427
00:25:11,760 --> 00:25:13,919
Speaker 1: stay like that. And we'll talk about how people with

428
00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:18,360
Speaker 1: amnesia navigate life in a little bit, and we'll talk

429
00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:22,840
Speaker 1: about the other type of amnesia, UM, the associative amnesia

430
00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:29,680
Speaker 1: right after this message. So, Chuck, we're talking about neurological amnesia.

431
00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:33,520
Speaker 1: That's one type and uh the other type, and there's

432
00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:35,960
Speaker 1: different ways to break them out. But the other main

433
00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:38,880
Speaker 1: type is the dissociative amnesia, which is brought on by

434
00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:43,879
Speaker 1: intense amounts of stress. Yeah, it's UM, it can be

435
00:25:43,880 --> 00:25:47,280
Speaker 1: a trauma. The good news is it's usually temporary and

436
00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:50,119
Speaker 1: it can associate. Uh, it can come to light in

437
00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:52,840
Speaker 1: a couple of different ways. UM. Let's say you had

438
00:25:52,840 --> 00:25:59,760
Speaker 1: some super traumatic event that can either damage your memory

439
00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:05,160
Speaker 1: as a whole because of massive amounts of cortisol from stress,

440
00:26:05,680 --> 00:26:07,920
Speaker 1: or it could just be the one event that you

441
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:12,359
Speaker 1: blocked out, like a really bad mugging that scared you,

442
00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:14,399
Speaker 1: or a car accident or something you might not have

443
00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:17,880
Speaker 1: any memory just of that, right. That's actually how they

444
00:26:18,160 --> 00:26:24,000
Speaker 1: divide um or subdivide dissociative amnesia. There's a global dissociative amnesia,

445
00:26:24,040 --> 00:26:26,919
Speaker 1: which is autobiographical, which is like, who am I? What

446
00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:31,680
Speaker 1: happened after witnessing your family be murdered or something horrific

447
00:26:31,760 --> 00:26:35,800
Speaker 1: like that? You don't remember anything about anything? Um. The

448
00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:39,440
Speaker 1: other type of situational dissociative amnesia, where you remember yourself,

449
00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:42,440
Speaker 1: you remember who you are, your address out, everything except

450
00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:44,840
Speaker 1: that that murder that you witnessed. Yeah, which can be

451
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:47,320
Speaker 1: a good thing. Yeah, it can be get rid of

452
00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:50,119
Speaker 1: that memory. You know. You could definitely interpret it as

453
00:26:50,200 --> 00:26:55,760
Speaker 1: like a safeguard by the brain, you know. Yeah. Um.

454
00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:59,360
Speaker 1: Either way, though, what's happened is, like you said, cortisol

455
00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:02,520
Speaker 1: has been released, which has been shown to affect the

456
00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:08,040
Speaker 1: hippocampus uh, and it also affects the brain's plasticity, or

457
00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:11,840
Speaker 1: its ability to form new memories. So basically, one way

458
00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:15,600
Speaker 1: to put it, especially with situational dissociative amnesia, is the

459
00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:19,760
Speaker 1: brain says, this is so stressful, yeah that I'm overwhelmed

460
00:27:19,800 --> 00:27:22,159
Speaker 1: with cortisol and I can't form new memories right now,

461
00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:25,000
Speaker 1: therefore this never happened. Yeah. You know one thing that

462
00:27:25,480 --> 00:27:29,520
Speaker 1: was interesting is hippopotamus is um. I saw this on

463
00:27:29,600 --> 00:27:35,199
Speaker 1: Animal Planet the other day. They are so stressed out, um,

464
00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:39,520
Speaker 1: especially sadly little babies that are orphaned because of poaching

465
00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:43,639
Speaker 1: for rhino horns. Did I say hippopotamus rhinoceros. Yeah, they

466
00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:48,040
Speaker 1: they they feel for the rhinoceros, the rhinoceros. I was

467
00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:52,240
Speaker 1: thinking hippocampus. I think, yeah, um, they can die from

468
00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:56,359
Speaker 1: too much cortisol from being stressed, like a little baby

469
00:27:56,440 --> 00:28:00,600
Speaker 1: rhino might die because their parents died just from cortisil,

470
00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:03,200
Speaker 1: like massive amounts of cortisil. We have to update or

471
00:28:03,280 --> 00:28:05,919
Speaker 1: can you die of a broken heart episode? Then I

472
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:09,360
Speaker 1: think we just did. Okay, we can check that off

473
00:28:09,359 --> 00:28:13,480
Speaker 1: the list. That's right, Okay. Yes, stressed is a killer,

474
00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:18,160
Speaker 1: you know this literally um. And it can cause amnesia

475
00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:21,480
Speaker 1: and this is not um. I think a lot of people,

476
00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:25,879
Speaker 1: uh suspect that when it's not neurological, when there's not

477
00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:31,280
Speaker 1: an organic cause like a brain injury for amnesia, that

478
00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:35,919
Speaker 1: it's possibly somebody faking or something like that. No. There there,

479
00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:39,480
Speaker 1: they are so stressed out that the chemicals, the chemical

480
00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:43,000
Speaker 1: composition in their brain has prevented new memories from forming.

481
00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:47,800
Speaker 1: Not plastic anymore. No, Uh. The thing is is that

482
00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:53,080
Speaker 1: that the dissociative amnesia is very frequently temporary. Um. There

483
00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:55,800
Speaker 1: might be something that triggers a memory that leads to

484
00:28:55,800 --> 00:29:00,440
Speaker 1: a cascade of memories that restores the person's memory fully. Um.

485
00:29:00,600 --> 00:29:02,600
Speaker 1: You see that in movies too. That's a big popular

486
00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:05,560
Speaker 1: one for fiction. Yeah, it's crazy that there's like, I mean,

487
00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:10,360
Speaker 1: it's in movies that happens far more frequently, um than

488
00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:15,280
Speaker 1: in real life. But it's not terribly far off, not

489
00:29:15,360 --> 00:29:17,920
Speaker 1: because the movies are really kind of keeping it close

490
00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:22,720
Speaker 1: to reality. Just that amnesia is like, can be that crazy? Right, right, Yeah,

491
00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:24,840
Speaker 1: you can kind of do anything, and someone's probably had

492
00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:30,680
Speaker 1: that kind So he mentioned weaving, um Wearing. Clive Wearing

493
00:29:30,840 --> 00:29:35,760
Speaker 1: has both retrograde and antiro grade, and that is a

494
00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 1: couple of other ways that that doctors can um categorize

495
00:29:40,040 --> 00:29:42,480
Speaker 1: It is by the type of memory he has. Both

496
00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:47,360
Speaker 1: retrograde means you can't remember the past and a taro

497
00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:50,440
Speaker 1: grade means you can't make the new memories. And since

498
00:29:50,480 --> 00:29:54,480
Speaker 1: he has both, he's in big trouble. H intro Grade

499
00:29:54,520 --> 00:29:58,680
Speaker 1: is a little more like the movie Memento when every

500
00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:02,640
Speaker 1: thirty or forty seconds you're weren't a new but even still, Uh,

501
00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:05,160
Speaker 1: if you haven't seen Memento, just go ahead and fast

502
00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:10,920
Speaker 1: forward to this part. Yeah. Um, but he wrongly remembers

503
00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:16,000
Speaker 1: his own past, which is a symptom of um retrograde

504
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:22,160
Speaker 1: amnesia that you confabulate. You basically come up with imaginary

505
00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:25,320
Speaker 1: things your mind us to fill in the gaps, and

506
00:30:25,360 --> 00:30:28,000
Speaker 1: you believe them to be real, but they're not real.

507
00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:31,400
Speaker 1: It's imagined. Remember that's how he turned out at the end.

508
00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:34,680
Speaker 1: Like he wasn't the insurance adjuster. That wasn't a case,

509
00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:39,680
Speaker 1: like that was his life. Yeah. And also very especially

510
00:30:39,680 --> 00:30:43,120
Speaker 1: in that movie, very easily to be taken advantage of

511
00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:45,320
Speaker 1: the one scene with his when he was paying rent,

512
00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:47,640
Speaker 1: when he kept paying rent, like I was like, hey,

513
00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:51,240
Speaker 1: your rents do and yeah, I think it was a jerk.

514
00:30:51,760 --> 00:30:53,720
Speaker 1: But he has a system. We'll talk about that coming

515
00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:56,680
Speaker 1: up too. So let's let's talk about in taro grade.

516
00:30:56,760 --> 00:31:01,800
Speaker 1: And taro grade is the inability to form new memories. Uh,

517
00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:05,080
Speaker 1: And it's pretty simple. Basically, there's something wrong with the

518
00:31:05,160 --> 00:31:08,920
Speaker 1: hippocampus right then, could be permanent in which case you

519
00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:12,120
Speaker 1: end up like Clive Wearing and you can't form new memories,

520
00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:15,720
Speaker 1: or it could be temporary, could be drunk. That is

521
00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:20,600
Speaker 1: why UH and terograde amnesia is far more common than retrograde.

522
00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:25,680
Speaker 1: It's one reason we can easily assault our hippocampus through booze.

523
00:31:26,000 --> 00:31:31,080
Speaker 1: And as an example of how procedural memory still stays intact.

524
00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:34,480
Speaker 1: You can walk and talk and move around and everything,

525
00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:36,200
Speaker 1: and then wake up the next morning be like, how

526
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:39,400
Speaker 1: did I get here? And no matter how hard you try,

527
00:31:39,560 --> 00:31:43,240
Speaker 1: you're not going to remember specific details if you fully

528
00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:45,520
Speaker 1: blacked out, because when you were fully blacked out, your

529
00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:49,240
Speaker 1: hippocampus was no longer taking all this information and forming memories,

530
00:31:49,760 --> 00:31:53,960
Speaker 1: like they just don't exist. And that's in terograde amnesia.

531
00:31:54,080 --> 00:31:56,600
Speaker 1: And it depends on who you are. Some people like

532
00:31:56,640 --> 00:31:59,120
Speaker 1: you might have an alcohol blackout way easier than others.

533
00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:01,960
Speaker 1: But that if you're blacking out from alcohol, you're drinking

534
00:32:01,960 --> 00:32:05,520
Speaker 1: too much, you know. Yeah, even if you're someone with

535
00:32:05,560 --> 00:32:08,120
Speaker 1: a super low tolerance and blacks out really easily. Yeah,

536
00:32:08,280 --> 00:32:10,920
Speaker 1: blacking out, it's blacking out. It's the line for everyone.

537
00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:14,520
Speaker 1: That doesn't mean you're passing out. You're still doing stuff, right,

538
00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:17,400
Speaker 1: and saying stuff, you're blacked out, You're blacked out. But um,

539
00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:19,600
Speaker 1: it can be kind of tricky because if you think

540
00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:21,920
Speaker 1: about it, you wake up the next morning and you're like,

541
00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:24,680
Speaker 1: how did I get here? What happened? And by that

542
00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:28,360
Speaker 1: time last night was the past, which makes you think, oh,

543
00:32:28,360 --> 00:32:33,160
Speaker 1: that's retrograde amnesia. Know that amnesia is related to your

544
00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:36,240
Speaker 1: ability to form memories or access old memories. So with

545
00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:39,920
Speaker 1: antaro grade, your ability to form new memories in the present,

546
00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:42,880
Speaker 1: which was while you were drunk and blacked out, that

547
00:32:42,920 --> 00:32:46,479
Speaker 1: was antaro grade amnesia. That's right. Retrograde amnesia is totally

548
00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:50,760
Speaker 1: different because it is the destruction of those voicemail messages

549
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:53,840
Speaker 1: of your past, yes, which is super sad. Um Yeah,

550
00:32:53,920 --> 00:32:56,440
Speaker 1: because what's life of It's not a collection of memories

551
00:32:56,840 --> 00:32:59,880
Speaker 1: you know and hope for the future. Look at you

552
00:33:00,160 --> 00:33:05,400
Speaker 1: and this micro second right now. Uh. With retrograde, it's um.

553
00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:08,680
Speaker 1: If it's severe, basically, your new memory or your most

554
00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:11,800
Speaker 1: recent memories, which aren't as strong and reinforced yet, are

555
00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:14,280
Speaker 1: the ones to go first. And then depending on how

556
00:33:14,320 --> 00:33:17,720
Speaker 1: severe your retrograde amnesias, it will go further and further

557
00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:21,800
Speaker 1: back in your little memory file and start destroying them.

558
00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:24,760
Speaker 1: Or if you're the case of wearing, if you have

559
00:33:24,800 --> 00:33:28,160
Speaker 1: a super bad you might not remember your past at all. Right,

560
00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:31,280
Speaker 1: but you guys remember his wife. He does remember his wife.

561
00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:35,080
Speaker 1: And that theory um or that it's called, is that

562
00:33:35,200 --> 00:33:38,960
Speaker 1: Ribot's law. Alright, bot I would say, ribo rebo. It

563
00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:41,640
Speaker 1: looks pretty French. It does look French. Uh. That is

564
00:33:42,520 --> 00:33:45,560
Speaker 1: that that pattern of destroying those newer memories first and

565
00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:48,040
Speaker 1: then going back and back depending on how severe it is.

566
00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:51,160
Speaker 1: And there's a there's a reasoning to it behind the

567
00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:54,560
Speaker 1: whole thing. It's that you're your more recent memories haven't

568
00:33:54,600 --> 00:33:59,120
Speaker 1: had years to potentiate and become these well worn paths,

569
00:33:59,560 --> 00:34:02,920
Speaker 1: so they're easier to wipe out than your longer term ones.

570
00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:08,759
Speaker 1: But it's totally different retrograde amnesia because it it can

571
00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:14,040
Speaker 1: attack those parts of your brain where um, those memories

572
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:16,880
Speaker 1: are stored, So it might not have anything to do

573
00:34:17,000 --> 00:34:20,399
Speaker 1: with any kind of damage to your hippocampus. It can say,

574
00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:24,160
Speaker 1: attack the part of your brain where um again, the

575
00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:27,960
Speaker 1: language memories are stored in your broker's area. Yeah, Like

576
00:34:28,040 --> 00:34:31,080
Speaker 1: if you have a stroke, you might not remember how

577
00:34:31,080 --> 00:34:34,359
Speaker 1: to speak, and that means that broke a's area has

578
00:34:34,400 --> 00:34:37,799
Speaker 1: been damaged via lack of blood flow and oxygen. That

579
00:34:37,880 --> 00:34:40,359
Speaker 1: might be different. That might be like your you lose

580
00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:42,719
Speaker 1: your ability to speak. I wonder if it does have

581
00:34:42,840 --> 00:34:45,200
Speaker 1: to do with memory, though, now that you mention it,

582
00:34:45,640 --> 00:34:48,640
Speaker 1: I don't know, huh. Like when my grandfather had a stroke,

583
00:34:48,680 --> 00:34:51,960
Speaker 1: he still talked, but they weren't words, but he thought

584
00:34:52,000 --> 00:34:54,920
Speaker 1: he was talking, Like in his head he was saying,

585
00:34:55,320 --> 00:34:57,080
Speaker 1: now you turn left up here to go to the

586
00:34:57,080 --> 00:34:59,000
Speaker 1: gas station to his wife, but it came out as

587
00:34:59,280 --> 00:35:01,280
Speaker 1: walking walking You can balk and b super bark and barking.

588
00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:05,520
Speaker 1: But that was unsettling. It was sad and unsettling. How

589
00:35:05,880 --> 00:35:08,160
Speaker 1: how long did he lives? Like the frustration too? Because

590
00:35:08,160 --> 00:35:10,080
Speaker 1: in his head he was saying the right words, But

591
00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:12,120
Speaker 1: could he hear himself, like what was coming out of

592
00:35:12,120 --> 00:35:14,600
Speaker 1: his I don't know, because he couldn't tell us or

593
00:35:14,640 --> 00:35:16,840
Speaker 1: he could see on your faces that he wasn't saying

594
00:35:16,840 --> 00:35:19,480
Speaker 1: what he was saying. I don't. I mean I was

595
00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:21,359
Speaker 1: pretty young, so this is all kind of distant. But

596
00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:24,439
Speaker 1: how long did he live like that? Um? I feel

597
00:35:24,480 --> 00:35:27,279
Speaker 1: like a few years? Yeah? Did he could he? Right?

598
00:35:28,440 --> 00:35:31,680
Speaker 1: I don't remember that usually that's separate. Oh, yeah, so

599
00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:34,480
Speaker 1: but he could write still you should find out. I'm curious. Yeah,

600
00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:36,200
Speaker 1: I should ask my mom. Was he a good guy?

601
00:35:36,520 --> 00:35:39,440
Speaker 1: I used the best? Yeah. Well, I'm sorry, Chuck. That's right,

602
00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:41,560
Speaker 1: it happens. It's in my blood line too, so I'm

603
00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:43,960
Speaker 1: sure the same thing will happen to me. Is it really? Well,

604
00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:45,920
Speaker 1: I will prop you up in front of the microphone

605
00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:48,760
Speaker 1: and we'll do a podcast like that. Neil just translate

606
00:35:48,760 --> 00:35:50,560
Speaker 1: for me. Yeah, that's very enough to be like I

607
00:35:50,560 --> 00:35:54,839
Speaker 1: think he's saying he likes paid me. Uh, you could

608
00:35:54,880 --> 00:35:57,239
Speaker 1: just default to that and I'd always be sort of happy,

609
00:35:57,280 --> 00:35:59,920
Speaker 1: And that's I was really saying. I was hungry, but

610
00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:04,319
Speaker 1: you go yeah. Um. It was weird though, Like his

611
00:36:04,400 --> 00:36:07,440
Speaker 1: language was very consistent. It had that saying the familiar,

612
00:36:07,520 --> 00:36:10,440
Speaker 1: like there's a lot of walking walking like that sound

613
00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:14,000
Speaker 1: like he had made up his own language. It's really

614
00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:16,359
Speaker 1: interest man, that's interesting. And the thing is that's how

615
00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:19,480
Speaker 1: they figured out that different parts of the brain are

616
00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:24,920
Speaker 1: responsible for different Um, I guess different aspects of our

617
00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:29,080
Speaker 1: personality your life, Like speaking is different than hearing, yeah,

618
00:36:29,120 --> 00:36:32,400
Speaker 1: and writing, right, And it's like if you're just because

619
00:36:32,400 --> 00:36:34,560
Speaker 1: you can't talk and form words, doesn't mean you can't

620
00:36:34,640 --> 00:36:37,759
Speaker 1: hear and understand words, or write words right, or think

621
00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:40,680
Speaker 1: in your head the right words even whether they're not

622
00:36:40,680 --> 00:36:44,120
Speaker 1: coming out right. Uh So, with both of these kinds

623
00:36:44,160 --> 00:36:48,560
Speaker 1: of amnesia, uh we should point out that your explicit

624
00:36:48,719 --> 00:36:52,520
Speaker 1: or episodic memory is what you're losing, but you're implicit

625
00:36:52,640 --> 00:36:55,480
Speaker 1: or procedural memory is usually still intact as long as

626
00:36:55,520 --> 00:36:58,200
Speaker 1: you're cerebellum is good. That's why you might be able

627
00:36:58,239 --> 00:36:59,879
Speaker 1: to make the cup of coffee or ride a bike,

628
00:37:01,120 --> 00:37:03,920
Speaker 1: these things that are just ingrained in your in your brain. Right,

629
00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:06,160
Speaker 1: And that's why clid Waren can play the piano, but

630
00:37:06,239 --> 00:37:11,040
Speaker 1: he can't remember who his favorite composer is. So wearing

631
00:37:11,160 --> 00:37:14,160
Speaker 1: is a really good example of how somebody can live

632
00:37:14,160 --> 00:37:17,920
Speaker 1: with amnesia. Number One, he has an amazing caretaker, his wife,

633
00:37:18,680 --> 00:37:21,960
Speaker 1: who you know, basically she takes care of him. Yeah,

634
00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:24,680
Speaker 1: I bet she does little things though, like just where

635
00:37:24,719 --> 00:37:26,680
Speaker 1: she wants to eat that night? Right now, we ate

636
00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:28,879
Speaker 1: there last night. I'm not going there again, right, he's

637
00:37:28,880 --> 00:37:30,920
Speaker 1: like we did, or she can really get him going

638
00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:32,919
Speaker 1: where every time he looks like he's like her, she's

639
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:38,520
Speaker 1: kiss right, you know, just to just to delight him

640
00:37:38,520 --> 00:37:42,040
Speaker 1: a little bit. It would be fun to do that exactly. Um.

641
00:37:42,120 --> 00:37:46,200
Speaker 1: But yes, he has a good caretaker, which is important. Yes,

642
00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:52,200
Speaker 1: because there's no treatment for amnesia. There's no right. They

643
00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:53,839
Speaker 1: can't inject you with something all of a sudden your

644
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:58,759
Speaker 1: memories come back. So most um, most treatments for amnesia

645
00:37:59,080 --> 00:38:02,839
Speaker 1: deal with figuring out how to navigate life under this

646
00:38:03,080 --> 00:38:07,040
Speaker 1: the new change to the way you remember things. Yeah,

647
00:38:07,040 --> 00:38:09,160
Speaker 1: it's all about systems. You have to have a system

648
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:13,000
Speaker 1: in place that you don't deviate from. UM. In Clive's case,

649
00:38:13,080 --> 00:38:15,719
Speaker 1: in the case of a minto, he's tattoos and polaroids

650
00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:18,920
Speaker 1: and notes for himself. Yeah, sticky notes, And that's what

651
00:38:18,960 --> 00:38:21,600
Speaker 1: weiring does. Basically keeps a journal and like I said,

652
00:38:21,640 --> 00:38:23,640
Speaker 1: he crosses things out as it goes, so he knows

653
00:38:24,680 --> 00:38:28,239
Speaker 1: where he is in the day. Right. He also can

654
00:38:28,239 --> 00:38:29,960
Speaker 1: look at his journal and says, now, I woke up

655
00:38:30,040 --> 00:38:35,000
Speaker 1: three times already, I don't need to um. He Also,

656
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:39,880
Speaker 1: the other aspect of UM forming routines is that they

657
00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:44,400
Speaker 1: involve habits, and the habits member your procedural memory still intact,

658
00:38:44,880 --> 00:38:48,120
Speaker 1: so you end up like just knowing. How does he

659
00:38:48,200 --> 00:38:50,399
Speaker 1: know to get up and go to the journal if

660
00:38:50,440 --> 00:38:53,480
Speaker 1: his memory refreshes every few minutes for every few seconds.

661
00:38:53,719 --> 00:38:56,680
Speaker 1: It's because he's formed a habit, a procedural memory of

662
00:38:57,080 --> 00:38:59,719
Speaker 1: there's a journal and you should go to it. So

663
00:38:59,800 --> 00:39:02,880
Speaker 1: he knows what we would call instinctively um. Through his

664
00:39:02,920 --> 00:39:05,560
Speaker 1: procedural memory of using the journal over and over again.

665
00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:08,800
Speaker 1: He's formed to have it. So that helps big time. Also,

666
00:39:08,920 --> 00:39:12,200
Speaker 1: smartphones help big time too, because he can access all

667
00:39:12,200 --> 00:39:16,160
Speaker 1: sorts of stuff, set reminders. He's got a calendar right there,

668
00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:20,120
Speaker 1: basically what most of us do, except taken to the

669
00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:22,520
Speaker 1: inth degree. You know, like I rely. I have a

670
00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:24,759
Speaker 1: terrible memory. You know this, So I rely heavily on

671
00:39:25,320 --> 00:39:28,719
Speaker 1: calendars and notes and reminders. Um. And I don't even

672
00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:30,840
Speaker 1: have amnesia as far as I know. Can't you imagine

673
00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:33,960
Speaker 1: like every time he pulls his iPhone and he's like, wow, right,

674
00:39:34,280 --> 00:39:37,319
Speaker 1: look at this thing. You know, it's reminding me and

675
00:39:37,360 --> 00:39:40,479
Speaker 1: it's a computer in my hand. Yeah, the future is here.

676
00:39:41,239 --> 00:39:43,000
Speaker 1: His wife is so sick of hearing him say the

677
00:39:43,040 --> 00:39:48,480
Speaker 1: future is here. We really poked fund of this guy

678
00:39:48,480 --> 00:39:50,440
Speaker 1: a lot. Yeah. I hope he's not listening to this

679
00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:57,279
Speaker 1: so he won't remember anyway. Oh there it was, Uh,

680
00:39:57,480 --> 00:40:00,959
Speaker 1: psychotherapy if you have dis associate of amnesia can help out.

681
00:40:01,400 --> 00:40:04,480
Speaker 1: I imagine that's a tough case to tackle, because not

682
00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:06,640
Speaker 1: only do you have to get to the root of this,

683
00:40:07,719 --> 00:40:11,120
Speaker 1: like you have to, you have to figure out everything

684
00:40:11,120 --> 00:40:14,239
Speaker 1: else first, you know, and then then then sort through

685
00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:19,040
Speaker 1: this lost You have to regenerate the bio autobiographical information

686
00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:21,080
Speaker 1: and then figure out which part of it is the

687
00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:24,440
Speaker 1: real problem. So it's like this huge, massive layer on

688
00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:29,080
Speaker 1: top of a normal case that's already a very pronounced

689
00:40:29,080 --> 00:40:32,640
Speaker 1: one because the stressful event was so bad that it

690
00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:35,600
Speaker 1: wiped out their ability to form memories. That's a good point,

691
00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:38,680
Speaker 1: that's gotta be. I'm sure not every psychiatrist can handle that.

692
00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:40,560
Speaker 1: I would say you'd go to a specialist or something

693
00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:43,799
Speaker 1: like that, an amnesia specialist. Uh do you think there

694
00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:46,239
Speaker 1: are those? Sure? Well, I'd like to hear from you

695
00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:49,520
Speaker 1: if you listen to the podcast and early shout out

696
00:40:50,560 --> 00:40:55,120
Speaker 1: if you have anesia from drinking too much, uh, Corsicov syndrome,

697
00:40:55,680 --> 00:40:58,880
Speaker 1: you should quit drinking so much and maybe take some

698
00:40:58,960 --> 00:41:04,080
Speaker 1: B one because because what's it called thiamine deficiency? Yeah,

699
00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:08,200
Speaker 1: that's all it is, is is vitamin B. Don't you remember

700
00:41:09,360 --> 00:41:13,000
Speaker 1: you said that? Um? I can't remember which episode it was,

701
00:41:13,040 --> 00:41:19,560
Speaker 1: but we were talking about hardcore alcoholics degenerate basically physically mentally. Yeah,

702
00:41:19,840 --> 00:41:23,200
Speaker 1: that's that. And part of it is a thiamine deficiency

703
00:41:23,719 --> 00:41:26,520
Speaker 1: which leads to amnesia, which can be treated by laying

704
00:41:26,560 --> 00:41:28,640
Speaker 1: off the sauce and taking b one. It's so sad.

705
00:41:28,719 --> 00:41:31,799
Speaker 1: Have you ever known someone that was truly like pickled themselves? No,

706
00:41:32,960 --> 00:41:36,840
Speaker 1: it's sad, especially when you know it's from drinking. You know,

707
00:41:37,520 --> 00:41:39,960
Speaker 1: it's a it's like a form of dementia really yea

708
00:41:41,080 --> 00:41:47,239
Speaker 1: from booze. And I like to drink, you know, I'm

709
00:41:47,239 --> 00:41:49,960
Speaker 1: not like poopling the whole thing, but like when you're

710
00:41:49,960 --> 00:41:53,279
Speaker 1: blacking out and forgetting things and getting the d t s. Yeah,

711
00:41:53,320 --> 00:41:55,600
Speaker 1: that's like, that's bad. I know that's obvious, but we

712
00:41:55,640 --> 00:41:57,359
Speaker 1: should point that out because we have kids that listen

713
00:41:57,400 --> 00:42:01,280
Speaker 1: to this. It's true, you know, all right, So chuck habits.

714
00:42:02,640 --> 00:42:05,680
Speaker 1: Oh I wrote another one. I wrote a review of

715
00:42:05,719 --> 00:42:11,520
Speaker 1: a woman who who wrote a memoir and she had amnesia, huge,

716
00:42:11,560 --> 00:42:15,279
Speaker 1: big time amnesia. Was it short? Um? No? But her

717
00:42:15,360 --> 00:42:17,759
Speaker 1: the first line is something like everything you're about to read,

718
00:42:17,960 --> 00:42:20,719
Speaker 1: I don't remember. It was told to me. She was

719
00:42:20,760 --> 00:42:23,960
Speaker 1: playing with her kid and the kid. She was spinning

720
00:42:24,040 --> 00:42:26,080
Speaker 1: him around, and I guess he knocked the ceiling fan

721
00:42:26,200 --> 00:42:29,160
Speaker 1: loose and it was like poorly installed, and it came

722
00:42:29,200 --> 00:42:32,400
Speaker 1: down on her head and it was like Gilligan's Island

723
00:42:32,680 --> 00:42:38,799
Speaker 1: level amnesia and forgets things everything. Yes, she has like

724
00:42:39,080 --> 00:42:43,320
Speaker 1: world class amnesia, almost on a Clive Wearing level. Um.

725
00:42:43,760 --> 00:42:47,359
Speaker 1: And she wrote this, this memoir, and in it she's

726
00:42:47,400 --> 00:42:50,360
Speaker 1: basically saying, like, how she navigates through life with amnesia,

727
00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:54,680
Speaker 1: and a lot of it is just faking it. Yeah,

728
00:42:54,680 --> 00:42:56,920
Speaker 1: she didn't lose her ability to pick up on social cues,

729
00:42:56,920 --> 00:42:59,399
Speaker 1: so she can pick up on what's expected of her,

730
00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:04,080
Speaker 1: and she can kind of guess, um, probably. Yeah. She

731
00:43:04,120 --> 00:43:07,239
Speaker 1: says she has no idea why people celebrate birthdays or

732
00:43:07,239 --> 00:43:09,360
Speaker 1: holidays or anything, but she still does it because she

733
00:43:09,400 --> 00:43:13,160
Speaker 1: realizes she's expected to. So she's no, it's not with her,

734
00:43:13,400 --> 00:43:17,840
Speaker 1: surely they probably is confabulation. She doesn't believe what she's imagining.

735
00:43:17,960 --> 00:43:21,400
Speaker 1: She's faking it, and apparently she's so good at it

736
00:43:21,400 --> 00:43:25,040
Speaker 1: that people forget she has amnesia. Um. But she's saying like, no,

737
00:43:25,239 --> 00:43:28,000
Speaker 1: I I really genuinely don't remember. I'm just good at

738
00:43:28,080 --> 00:43:30,120
Speaker 1: making it seem like I do. So I can fit

739
00:43:30,160 --> 00:43:33,879
Speaker 1: in must be so weird and frustrating. It sounds pretty weird,

740
00:43:34,000 --> 00:43:35,920
Speaker 1: like if to have to sing Happy Birthday at a

741
00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:39,400
Speaker 1: birthday party and she's like, n singing this song. I

742
00:43:39,440 --> 00:43:42,799
Speaker 1: know I'm supposed to do it, but I don't know why,

743
00:43:42,600 --> 00:43:46,040
Speaker 1: why these people do this? Yeah? Wow, alright, So Chuck,

744
00:43:46,200 --> 00:43:50,759
Speaker 1: you want to talk about amnesia detection, which seems like, oh,

745
00:43:50,800 --> 00:43:53,319
Speaker 1: that person can't remember anything, they have amnesia, or they

746
00:43:53,400 --> 00:43:55,680
Speaker 1: just got hit on the head with a coconut right,

747
00:43:56,440 --> 00:43:59,200
Speaker 1: well for wearing. Uh, he had a headache. That was

748
00:43:59,200 --> 00:44:02,000
Speaker 1: the first thing that happened. The next thing that happened

749
00:44:02,040 --> 00:44:03,719
Speaker 1: a couple of days later, Like you said earlier, he

750
00:44:03,719 --> 00:44:06,839
Speaker 1: could remember his daughter's name. So warning signs flashing at

751
00:44:06,880 --> 00:44:10,600
Speaker 1: that point, and it really spiraled out of control from

752
00:44:10,600 --> 00:44:15,280
Speaker 1: there in his case. Uh. Sometimes just super obvious. Um,

753
00:44:15,400 --> 00:44:17,520
Speaker 1: like you said, if you injure your head and you

754
00:44:17,560 --> 00:44:21,880
Speaker 1: can't remember things, then you've got some form of amnesia. Um.

755
00:44:22,000 --> 00:44:26,719
Speaker 1: Can you recall your past events? Uh? Do you confabulate?

756
00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:30,160
Speaker 1: Do you confabulate? And the difference between a confabulation and alive,

757
00:44:30,239 --> 00:44:33,560
Speaker 1: by the way, is there's intent with a lie. Right

758
00:44:33,640 --> 00:44:37,760
Speaker 1: this person, it doesn't realize they're filling in the gaps

759
00:44:37,760 --> 00:44:40,960
Speaker 1: with imagined stuff, or if they do, they don't want

760
00:44:41,000 --> 00:44:43,320
Speaker 1: to think about it. There. Yeah, there's no malice involved.

761
00:44:43,360 --> 00:44:46,880
Speaker 1: They're just trying to be normal. Uh. You might have

762
00:44:47,000 --> 00:44:52,120
Speaker 1: tremors or be uncoordinated, You might be confused and disoriented,

763
00:44:52,280 --> 00:44:54,600
Speaker 1: could be in a feug state, which is where you're

764
00:44:54,600 --> 00:44:58,080
Speaker 1: wandering around. Yeah, that's with the disassociated identity that can

765
00:44:58,120 --> 00:45:01,080
Speaker 1: be present for sure. You remember and John McCain entered

766
00:45:01,120 --> 00:45:03,280
Speaker 1: that fugue state in the two thousand and eight debate

767
00:45:03,320 --> 00:45:07,800
Speaker 1: against Obama. Did you see that? Yeah? Man, I couldn't

768
00:45:07,800 --> 00:45:10,279
Speaker 1: believe it. Even Obama was like, what is this guy doing?

769
00:45:10,760 --> 00:45:12,400
Speaker 1: He even he made that face and I think he

770
00:45:12,520 --> 00:45:14,279
Speaker 1: pointed his thumb off to this thing. He went to

771
00:45:14,280 --> 00:45:18,160
Speaker 1: a different place. Brief fuge state. Uh. One thing you

772
00:45:18,200 --> 00:45:19,920
Speaker 1: want to do is get a cat scan or an

773
00:45:20,040 --> 00:45:23,719
Speaker 1: m r I or both and see a doctor immediately,

774
00:45:23,719 --> 00:45:26,920
Speaker 1: you know, and find out what the heck is going on. Yeah, Like,

775
00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:29,839
Speaker 1: don't don't. If you can't remember things that you usually can,

776
00:45:30,200 --> 00:45:32,800
Speaker 1: don't mess around. It could be a sign of early

777
00:45:32,840 --> 00:45:38,360
Speaker 1: Alzheimer's UM it could be a sign of mild cognitive impairment.

778
00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:40,840
Speaker 1: They're both kinds of dementia, Yeah, which I want to

779
00:45:40,840 --> 00:45:43,400
Speaker 1: mess around with that. You can get amnesia from those,

780
00:45:43,520 --> 00:45:46,600
Speaker 1: or it can be a symptom of dementia. But um,

781
00:45:46,800 --> 00:45:50,600
Speaker 1: dementia and amnesia are not one and the same. Um,

782
00:45:51,040 --> 00:45:55,040
Speaker 1: So chuck, why don't you see people wearing like, uh,

783
00:45:55,320 --> 00:45:58,200
Speaker 1: prevent amnesia t shirts on like a five k run

784
00:45:58,280 --> 00:46:02,080
Speaker 1: walk to fight amnesia? I don't know, because there's no

785
00:46:02,120 --> 00:46:04,640
Speaker 1: way to prevent it, aside from maybe wearing a helmet

786
00:46:04,680 --> 00:46:09,360
Speaker 1: when you're riding a bike, avoiding trees with loose coconuts. Um,

787
00:46:09,400 --> 00:46:12,000
Speaker 1: doing what you can to prevent a stroke or cut

788
00:46:12,040 --> 00:46:15,680
Speaker 1: down on your risk of stroke, uh, and steering clear

789
00:46:15,719 --> 00:46:19,319
Speaker 1: of highly stressful events. Apparently, there's really not a lot

790
00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:22,960
Speaker 1: you can do with amnesia. It's bad luck. Is something

791
00:46:23,080 --> 00:46:25,520
Speaker 1: pretty much something that happens to you that causes it,

792
00:46:25,560 --> 00:46:31,000
Speaker 1: that's right, UM. But again, there are possible they're working

793
00:46:31,040 --> 00:46:33,960
Speaker 1: on some treatments. There's no pill now, but they're working

794
00:46:34,000 --> 00:46:38,520
Speaker 1: on treatments in the the cutting edge field that's starting

795
00:46:38,560 --> 00:46:42,840
Speaker 1: the yield possibly results that could be used to treat amnesia.

796
00:46:43,120 --> 00:46:47,919
Speaker 1: Are UM are studying fear extinction the opposite, they're trying

797
00:46:47,960 --> 00:46:52,120
Speaker 1: to induce amnesia. And PTSD patients, which I think we

798
00:46:52,200 --> 00:46:54,960
Speaker 1: talked about this in our PTSD episodes. I think so

799
00:46:55,080 --> 00:46:58,279
Speaker 1: if you've ever seen the movie Eternal Sunshine The Spotless Mind,

800
00:46:58,400 --> 00:47:01,759
Speaker 1: that was one of the greatest that on no and

801
00:47:01,800 --> 00:47:04,040
Speaker 1: I actually had people say, how was that not on there?

802
00:47:04,120 --> 00:47:06,799
Speaker 1: That it was a good movie. We'll call it one

803
00:47:06,840 --> 00:47:11,520
Speaker 1: on one okay. UM. And in that movie, UH, people

804
00:47:11,560 --> 00:47:14,680
Speaker 1: would pay money to have certain in the in the

805
00:47:14,680 --> 00:47:17,000
Speaker 1: case of the movie, certain people remove from their mind,

806
00:47:17,520 --> 00:47:20,480
Speaker 1: like a former girlfriend that was so painful you just

807
00:47:20,880 --> 00:47:24,040
Speaker 1: wanted no trace over in your memory. UM. But they

808
00:47:24,040 --> 00:47:26,960
Speaker 1: are researching that at La Doo Laboratory at n y

809
00:47:27,080 --> 00:47:30,720
Speaker 1: U in New York. UH, they did an experiment where

810
00:47:31,680 --> 00:47:34,359
Speaker 1: with rats where they would associate a sound with them

811
00:47:34,360 --> 00:47:38,480
Speaker 1: being shocked, and they found that in adult rats, um

812
00:47:38,520 --> 00:47:40,479
Speaker 1: when they heard that sound, of course, they would freeze

813
00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:42,480
Speaker 1: up like they were gonna get shocked, but in baby

814
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:46,200
Speaker 1: rats they didn't UM. And what they learned was after

815
00:47:46,280 --> 00:47:50,719
Speaker 1: about three weeks of age, a sort of a molecular

816
00:47:50,800 --> 00:47:55,279
Speaker 1: sheath would form around the cells in the amygdala. So

817
00:47:55,640 --> 00:47:59,480
Speaker 1: they found a drug that would dissolve that sheath and

818
00:47:59,560 --> 00:48:06,360
Speaker 1: basically leave it prone to UH manipulation. Replasticization. Yeah, and

819
00:48:06,400 --> 00:48:08,640
Speaker 1: then they basically found that if that sheath has gone

820
00:48:08,640 --> 00:48:11,840
Speaker 1: and dissolved, that they could erase fear memories and the

821
00:48:11,880 --> 00:48:15,440
Speaker 1: adult rats were not affected any longer by that sound,

822
00:48:15,560 --> 00:48:19,279
Speaker 1: the buzzing sound. And they don't know about humans yet,

823
00:48:19,280 --> 00:48:22,319
Speaker 1: but there there, that's obviously why they're studying it. Well,

824
00:48:22,680 --> 00:48:24,600
Speaker 1: the there just don't want to learn about rats in

825
00:48:24,600 --> 00:48:28,760
Speaker 1: their memory. Um. And we we know a pretty decent

826
00:48:28,760 --> 00:48:32,880
Speaker 1: amount of human in memory formation um, thanks to a

827
00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:36,560
Speaker 1: specific patient named Well. For many many years until just

828
00:48:36,600 --> 00:48:38,680
Speaker 1: a couple of years ago, he was known only as

829
00:48:38,840 --> 00:48:42,040
Speaker 1: h M. And he was a man who now that

830
00:48:42,080 --> 00:48:45,800
Speaker 1: he's died, his identity has been revealed as Henry Mollison. Yeah.

831
00:48:46,080 --> 00:48:49,120
Speaker 1: He was a lot like Clive Wearing. His memory didn't

832
00:48:49,120 --> 00:48:53,320
Speaker 1: refresh quite as frequently. But um, he was the initial

833
00:48:54,320 --> 00:48:57,919
Speaker 1: memory patient. Yeah. He was had a bike wreck when

834
00:48:57,920 --> 00:49:00,840
Speaker 1: he was a kid and was leptic from then on

835
00:49:00,920 --> 00:49:05,440
Speaker 1: in those seizures. To relieve those seizures, they removed part

836
00:49:05,480 --> 00:49:09,360
Speaker 1: of his amigdala, I'm sorry, all of his amgdala and

837
00:49:09,400 --> 00:49:12,279
Speaker 1: most of his hippocampus and it stopped the seizures, which

838
00:49:12,320 --> 00:49:15,560
Speaker 1: is great. But then they found out, hey, we've got

839
00:49:15,560 --> 00:49:17,719
Speaker 1: a really good memory basient on our hands now, right,

840
00:49:17,800 --> 00:49:21,200
Speaker 1: because he just couldn't remember, and he was also a

841
00:49:21,280 --> 00:49:24,560
Speaker 1: very good, easy going guy. They studied him for life, yes,

842
00:49:24,840 --> 00:49:27,960
Speaker 1: from like nineteen fifty three on, I think in nineteen

843
00:49:28,000 --> 00:49:30,480
Speaker 1: fifty five on. Yeah, and by on we mean to

844
00:49:30,680 --> 00:49:33,480
Speaker 1: two thousand and eight. He just died semi recently and

845
00:49:33,520 --> 00:49:35,839
Speaker 1: they're still slicing his brain apart and sending it out

846
00:49:35,880 --> 00:49:39,680
Speaker 1: to people to study UM. And he also his brain,

847
00:49:39,880 --> 00:49:44,240
Speaker 1: I should say, proved that memory is not one long circuit.

848
00:49:44,360 --> 00:49:46,840
Speaker 1: The processes in one long circuit, where like with a

849
00:49:46,960 --> 00:49:49,400
Speaker 1: string of Christmas lightbulbs, if one bowl burns out, the

850
00:49:49,440 --> 00:49:52,640
Speaker 1: whole thing does. Because he could remember stuff from his

851
00:49:52,719 --> 00:49:55,880
Speaker 1: past up to the time when he got the surgery,

852
00:49:56,000 --> 00:49:58,279
Speaker 1: he just couldn't form new memories. So they figured out

853
00:49:58,320 --> 00:50:03,080
Speaker 1: that UM long term memory storage and retrieval was distinct

854
00:50:03,360 --> 00:50:07,080
Speaker 1: from new memory formation, which as we've seen you and

855
00:50:07,120 --> 00:50:10,799
Speaker 1: I explained fully. Yeah, they should do. I wish more

856
00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:15,640
Speaker 1: people like Henrietta Axe and and Hm were honored, like

857
00:50:15,719 --> 00:50:18,160
Speaker 1: these people should have like statues in front of hospitals,

858
00:50:18,760 --> 00:50:22,680
Speaker 1: these people who suffered for the greater good, you know,

859
00:50:22,719 --> 00:50:26,360
Speaker 1: as far as research and scientifics like those twins that

860
00:50:26,400 --> 00:50:31,759
Speaker 1: were separated by the New York Family Services for Twins Studies. Yeah, yeah,

861
00:50:31,760 --> 00:50:36,520
Speaker 1: those kids need some statues or on the box, the

862
00:50:36,520 --> 00:50:38,719
Speaker 1: big girl in the box. Now the awful the most

863
00:50:38,760 --> 00:50:42,120
Speaker 1: awful case ever be a Skinner's kid. Was that the

864
00:50:42,160 --> 00:50:45,840
Speaker 1: one that they basically tortured as a child very recently,

865
00:50:46,400 --> 00:50:49,480
Speaker 1: like she was recently discovered. I think it's a boy.

866
00:50:50,400 --> 00:50:52,040
Speaker 1: I heard about a girl who was kept in a

867
00:50:52,120 --> 00:50:55,680
Speaker 1: closet for her whole life and then in Texas and

868
00:50:55,719 --> 00:50:59,640
Speaker 1: I remember that too, Yeah, but not to study as abuse, right, yes,

869
00:50:59,800 --> 00:51:02,680
Speaker 1: to abuse. Now, there was some I know we've talked

870
00:51:02,680 --> 00:51:05,520
Speaker 1: about him before, some boy who was purposefully sort of

871
00:51:05,520 --> 00:51:09,319
Speaker 1: abuse for the purposes of research. Oh are you talking about?

872
00:51:09,760 --> 00:51:11,319
Speaker 1: Like they didn't have his real name and know who

873
00:51:11,320 --> 00:51:14,960
Speaker 1: it was? For me, little Albert, Little Albert where they

874
00:51:15,120 --> 00:51:18,560
Speaker 1: they studied fear extinction in him by making him scared

875
00:51:18,560 --> 00:51:21,600
Speaker 1: of things. Yeah, yeah, he definitely deserves a statue. See

876
00:51:21,640 --> 00:51:24,279
Speaker 1: you remember that and I didn't. So let's um, you

877
00:51:24,400 --> 00:51:26,880
Speaker 1: said something that that they couldn't remember his name I

878
00:51:26,880 --> 00:51:29,640
Speaker 1: think is what triggered it. Yeah, so uh and that

879
00:51:29,880 --> 00:51:33,319
Speaker 1: is uh, that's part of encoding. I encoded it it's

880
00:51:33,400 --> 00:51:36,640
Speaker 1: right with the idea little Albert. They didn't remember his

881
00:51:36,719 --> 00:51:39,400
Speaker 1: original name. Your trail of bread crumbs is more solid.

882
00:51:39,560 --> 00:51:43,000
Speaker 1: So let's talk pop culture real quick man. Good movies, Memento,

883
00:51:43,200 --> 00:51:46,200
Speaker 1: you mentioned Internal Sunshimes, follow us mine what else? Um?

884
00:51:46,320 --> 00:51:49,120
Speaker 1: One of my favorites is Mulholland Drive. I don't remember

885
00:51:49,160 --> 00:51:51,720
Speaker 1: amnis of being a part of that, but yeah, the

886
00:51:51,719 --> 00:51:54,879
Speaker 1: the one girl couldn't remember anything. Is it the main character? Yeah,

887
00:51:54,880 --> 00:51:59,319
Speaker 1: the burnette Vanilla Sky. Yeah. I did not care for

888
00:52:01,040 --> 00:52:03,040
Speaker 1: with it. I know everybody didn't like it. I didn't

889
00:52:03,080 --> 00:52:06,000
Speaker 1: like it. There was original Open my Eyes. I think

890
00:52:06,360 --> 00:52:08,959
Speaker 1: it was the original Spanish language film that was based

891
00:52:09,000 --> 00:52:13,360
Speaker 1: on it was really good. Cat. What else I don't know?

892
00:52:13,400 --> 00:52:16,920
Speaker 1: Oh well, Jason Bourne, Yeah he had amnesia. Yeah, um,

893
00:52:17,160 --> 00:52:19,920
Speaker 1: fifty first states. That was a cute one about amnesia.

894
00:52:20,200 --> 00:52:23,279
Speaker 1: It's a cute movie. I didn't see it. And if

895
00:52:23,320 --> 00:52:26,719
Speaker 1: you ice to see it, okay, um, And if you

896
00:52:26,800 --> 00:52:31,640
Speaker 1: reverse your perspective a little bit Groundhog Day where Bill

897
00:52:31,760 --> 00:52:35,600
Speaker 1: Murray has a tremendously excellent memory and everyone else has

898
00:52:35,600 --> 00:52:38,840
Speaker 1: amnesia day, And I think this is a great time

899
00:52:38,920 --> 00:52:43,960
Speaker 1: to acknowledge the great, great Harold Ramos of Groundhog Day

900
00:52:44,080 --> 00:52:49,040
Speaker 1: and Stripes and Animal House and Caddyshack and Ghostbusters and Ghostbusters. Yeah,

901
00:52:49,400 --> 00:52:53,359
Speaker 1: what a loss. He defined comedy for our generation. He

902
00:52:53,400 --> 00:52:57,000
Speaker 1: died at sixty nine, which is so young, so young. Yeah,

903
00:52:57,080 --> 00:52:59,280
Speaker 1: and checked, there's no way we could do an amnesia

904
00:52:59,360 --> 00:53:03,160
Speaker 1: episode without mentioned Benjamin Kyle. You remember him. He was

905
00:53:03,200 --> 00:53:06,040
Speaker 1: found in two thousand four in a dumpster, naked and

906
00:53:06,120 --> 00:53:09,759
Speaker 1: unconscious in Richmond Hill, Georgia, and he came. We've talked

907
00:53:09,760 --> 00:53:11,800
Speaker 1: about him before and like one of those one minute

908
00:53:11,880 --> 00:53:16,799
Speaker 1: b s things, um, and he cannot remember anything. He

909
00:53:16,840 --> 00:53:25,200
Speaker 1: has complete autobiographical episodic amnesia, retrograde amnesia, and nothing is helping.

910
00:53:25,680 --> 00:53:28,440
Speaker 1: They've put him on NPR, they put him on CNN,

911
00:53:28,480 --> 00:53:31,640
Speaker 1: they put him on ABC, They've put him on News Channel.

912
00:53:31,640 --> 00:53:34,520
Speaker 1: They've done stories on him around the world. He has

913
00:53:34,560 --> 00:53:37,600
Speaker 1: a website called Finding Benjamin b E N J A

914
00:53:38,080 --> 00:53:40,880
Speaker 1: M A n dot com and they want to figure

915
00:53:40,880 --> 00:53:42,600
Speaker 1: out who this guy is. He wants to know who

916
00:53:42,640 --> 00:53:45,400
Speaker 1: he is. They have not figured it out. The case

917
00:53:45,480 --> 00:53:49,799
Speaker 1: is still cold, so he's not faking it. No, if

918
00:53:49,840 --> 00:53:52,719
Speaker 1: he's faking it, he has totally given himself over the

919
00:53:52,760 --> 00:53:54,520
Speaker 1: idea that he will never be found out. Because he

920
00:53:54,560 --> 00:53:57,359
Speaker 1: has put himself out there. He lives in a bureaucratic

921
00:53:57,400 --> 00:54:00,080
Speaker 1: limbo because he doesn't have a Social Security number. He

922
00:54:00,080 --> 00:54:02,880
Speaker 1: can't get a new one because he's he's like sixty

923
00:54:02,960 --> 00:54:05,120
Speaker 1: years old, and the Feds are like, what do you

924
00:54:05,160 --> 00:54:07,120
Speaker 1: need a new use your old one. We gave you

925
00:54:07,160 --> 00:54:10,719
Speaker 1: one before. Um. And he has no idea there's a

926
00:54:10,760 --> 00:54:13,120
Speaker 1: documentary that's coming out about him, or that might be

927
00:54:13,239 --> 00:54:17,120
Speaker 1: out now. Um. But yeah, it's totally legitimate case of

928
00:54:17,239 --> 00:54:21,680
Speaker 1: full retrograde amnesia waking up in a dumpster naked in Georgia.

929
00:54:22,719 --> 00:54:25,080
Speaker 1: And the reason he's called Benjamin Kyle is because he's

930
00:54:25,120 --> 00:54:28,359
Speaker 1: pretty sure his first name was Benjamin. But um, when

931
00:54:28,400 --> 00:54:30,759
Speaker 1: he was taken to the hospital, there was already a

932
00:54:30,840 --> 00:54:33,800
Speaker 1: John Doe there, so they called him b K because

933
00:54:33,840 --> 00:54:36,799
Speaker 1: they was found behind a Burger King, So he took

934
00:54:36,840 --> 00:54:39,279
Speaker 1: the name Benjamin Kyle. It's his name, could have been

935
00:54:39,320 --> 00:54:42,520
Speaker 1: Mickey d could be anything. Wow, Well, faking it is

936
00:54:42,560 --> 00:54:47,120
Speaker 1: a thing, I think, Um. I think Hess, Rudolph Hess,

937
00:54:47,560 --> 00:54:50,160
Speaker 1: the Nazi. I didn't look this up, but I think

938
00:54:50,200 --> 00:54:54,239
Speaker 1: I remember somewhere that he faked amnesia to get out

939
00:54:54,280 --> 00:54:57,640
Speaker 1: of his war crimes. I believe it that guy was

940
00:54:58,000 --> 00:55:01,920
Speaker 1: s ob all around. Yeah, here's a Nazi. I know.

941
00:55:01,960 --> 00:55:03,560
Speaker 1: I think he did fake amnesian. I think he even

942
00:55:03,560 --> 00:55:05,880
Speaker 1: fooled his doctors for a time, but then later admitted

943
00:55:06,160 --> 00:55:08,800
Speaker 1: that he had faked it. I might be wrong, did generate.

944
00:55:08,880 --> 00:55:11,120
Speaker 1: I didn't do specific research on that, so we'll see.

945
00:55:11,280 --> 00:55:13,800
Speaker 1: He was a black shirt though, No way, he was

946
00:55:13,840 --> 00:55:16,880
Speaker 1: a brown shirt. I got it wrong again. Brown shirts

947
00:55:16,880 --> 00:55:21,280
Speaker 1: with the German black shirts were Italian. All right. Uh,

948
00:55:21,280 --> 00:55:24,640
Speaker 1: well that's amnisia. You got anything else, man? If you

949
00:55:24,680 --> 00:55:27,000
Speaker 1: want to read more about it, you should type amnesia

950
00:55:27,040 --> 00:55:29,600
Speaker 1: into the search bar at how stuff works dot com

951
00:55:29,640 --> 00:55:31,680
Speaker 1: and it will bring up this article. Since I said

952
00:55:31,680 --> 00:55:35,400
Speaker 1: search parts, time for a listener mail. Uh. This is

953
00:55:35,440 --> 00:55:38,600
Speaker 1: from a termite expert. He was a pest control operator

954
00:55:38,640 --> 00:55:40,439
Speaker 1: for seven and a half years and on the board

955
00:55:40,440 --> 00:55:44,879
Speaker 1: of the New York State Pest Management Association. Let's tie up. Hey, guys,

956
00:55:44,920 --> 00:55:48,360
Speaker 1: when you talked about a termidicide treatment, you stated it

957
00:55:48,440 --> 00:55:51,399
Speaker 1: is injected into the colony. Uh. This isn't quite right.

958
00:55:51,600 --> 00:55:54,880
Speaker 1: Could be misleading to the average homeowner. Uh, it makes

959
00:55:55,719 --> 00:55:58,120
Speaker 1: them think that the colony will be killed off. What

960
00:55:58,280 --> 00:56:02,239
Speaker 1: really happens is that termida side is injected to form

961
00:56:02,320 --> 00:56:05,399
Speaker 1: a barrier on a few inches of treated soil around

962
00:56:05,400 --> 00:56:07,880
Speaker 1: the foundation of the house. When termites come into contact

963
00:56:07,920 --> 00:56:10,799
Speaker 1: with it, they shortly die. Eventually, the colony realizes something

964
00:56:10,880 --> 00:56:14,200
Speaker 1: is wrong and send out alarm pheromones to uh for

965
00:56:14,280 --> 00:56:17,400
Speaker 1: the others to avoid it. As to the bait, you'd stated,

966
00:56:17,440 --> 00:56:19,680
Speaker 1: it might leach into the soil, this makes for good

967
00:56:19,800 --> 00:56:25,600
Speaker 1: radio or podcasting. But again it's an alarm to the homeowner. Uh,

968
00:56:25,800 --> 00:56:28,880
Speaker 1: that's not necessarily true. Bait is solid and small and

969
00:56:28,880 --> 00:56:33,799
Speaker 1: it will not leach, but it will explode. When I

970
00:56:33,840 --> 00:56:35,359
Speaker 1: was in the business, there were two types of bait.

971
00:56:35,400 --> 00:56:37,239
Speaker 1: The first was a poison like bait for mice you

972
00:56:37,280 --> 00:56:40,239
Speaker 1: put in your home. We didn't use that, but it

973
00:56:40,360 --> 00:56:43,960
Speaker 1: is a but that's about it and simple to understand. Uh.

974
00:56:44,000 --> 00:56:46,080
Speaker 1: The idea is hopefully they will realize something is wrong

975
00:56:46,120 --> 00:56:48,279
Speaker 1: and not come back. The second type of bait, which

976
00:56:48,280 --> 00:56:51,800
Speaker 1: we used, interfered with the molting process. You could actually

977
00:56:51,800 --> 00:56:55,239
Speaker 1: see them turn a milky white. As young termites could

978
00:56:55,280 --> 00:56:58,200
Speaker 1: not grow. The colony died as a nation would die

979
00:56:58,480 --> 00:57:01,400
Speaker 1: if no new children were born, Like the movie Children

980
00:57:01,400 --> 00:57:04,160
Speaker 1: of Men. That's a good movie. This program was the

981
00:57:04,160 --> 00:57:06,360
Speaker 1: only one at the time that would eliminate a colony.

982
00:57:06,880 --> 00:57:08,719
Speaker 1: I hate to nitpick. You guys run a good show,

983
00:57:09,280 --> 00:57:11,360
Speaker 1: and I just want to see it done right. And

984
00:57:11,400 --> 00:57:15,840
Speaker 1: that is from Sean Duffy Pittsburgh, a term my expert

985
00:57:15,880 --> 00:57:21,240
Speaker 1: who likes to pick nits. Hey, thanks Sean, right, Yeah, uh,

986
00:57:21,320 --> 00:57:24,640
Speaker 1: we appreciate that. Actually, I'm just teasing. Uh. If you

987
00:57:25,720 --> 00:57:28,720
Speaker 1: want to tell us something we misstated, slightly or otherwise,

988
00:57:28,760 --> 00:57:31,640
Speaker 1: you can let us know. Join us on Twitter at

989
00:57:31,760 --> 00:57:34,000
Speaker 1: s y s K podcast is our handle. Join us

990
00:57:34,000 --> 00:57:36,360
Speaker 1: on Facebook dot com, slash Stuff you Should Know, Send

991
00:57:36,400 --> 00:57:38,720
Speaker 1: us an email The Stuff Podcast at Discovery dot com.

992
00:57:39,040 --> 00:57:41,760
Speaker 1: Check out our YouTube channel just search Josh and Chuck,

993
00:57:42,240 --> 00:57:45,160
Speaker 1: and as always, join us at our home on the web,

994
00:57:45,240 --> 00:57:54,080
Speaker 1: the Luxurious State Stuff you Should Know dot com for

995
00:57:54,200 --> 00:57:56,520
Speaker 1: more on this and thousands of other topics. Does it

996
00:57:56,600 --> 00:58:04,480
Speaker 1: how Stuff Works dot com