1 00:00:03,800 --> 00:00:06,680 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind from how Stuff 2 00:00:06,680 --> 00:00:14,360 Speaker 1: Works dot com. Hey, welcome to stuff to Blow your Mind. 3 00:00:14,440 --> 00:00:17,560 Speaker 1: I'm Robert Lamb and I'm Julie Douglas, and we are 4 00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:21,320 Speaker 1: speaking to you from the hermetically sealed podcast chamber here 5 00:00:21,320 --> 00:00:23,880 Speaker 1: at How Stuff Works. And uh, you know, we're just 6 00:00:23,920 --> 00:00:26,880 Speaker 1: talking the other day about one of my favorite characters 7 00:00:27,120 --> 00:00:30,080 Speaker 1: in uh in the history of science, and that is 8 00:00:30,160 --> 00:00:33,920 Speaker 1: one Tico brahy or um if you go with some 9 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:39,280 Speaker 1: pronunciations um tousha brahe, which which I'm not going to 10 00:00:39,400 --> 00:00:42,400 Speaker 1: use because then I would call him Tushy. I couldn't 11 00:00:42,400 --> 00:00:44,640 Speaker 1: help myself. Only close friends knew him. Is is uh 12 00:00:44,840 --> 00:00:46,800 Speaker 1: is Tushy. And I like Tico too because he sounds 13 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:50,680 Speaker 1: like he might have been one of the members of Minuto. Now, 14 00:00:51,479 --> 00:00:53,080 Speaker 1: just to put this in context, we're talking about a 15 00:00:53,080 --> 00:00:55,680 Speaker 1: guy who lived between fifty s and sixteen o one 16 00:00:56,400 --> 00:00:59,600 Speaker 1: and he's been called one of the greatest observational geniuses 17 00:00:59,600 --> 00:01:03,400 Speaker 1: of the age um. He made a number of just 18 00:01:03,560 --> 00:01:07,279 Speaker 1: really fascinating observations that really kicked science in the button 19 00:01:07,280 --> 00:01:09,600 Speaker 1: and kind of going in terms, especially in terms of 20 00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:15,000 Speaker 1: celestial mechanics, figuring out how the solar system is moving. Um. 21 00:01:15,040 --> 00:01:19,320 Speaker 1: And this is really because he had a crazy obsessive nature, yes, 22 00:01:19,520 --> 00:01:22,399 Speaker 1: create and and a little extra crazy too, which will 23 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:23,880 Speaker 1: get to in in a second. But just to run through 24 00:01:23,880 --> 00:01:27,040 Speaker 1: real quick the science stuff about this guy. I made 25 00:01:27,040 --> 00:01:30,560 Speaker 1: precise observations that with with the best instruments of the 26 00:01:30,600 --> 00:01:33,120 Speaker 1: time that had not been made before. But he invented 27 00:01:33,160 --> 00:01:36,840 Speaker 1: a lot of instruments to write um. Yeah. He was 28 00:01:36,880 --> 00:01:39,920 Speaker 1: particularly interested in the in the movements of Mars and uh. 29 00:01:40,080 --> 00:01:43,160 Speaker 1: He provided the crucial data that later astronomers like Johannes 30 00:01:43,280 --> 00:01:48,160 Speaker 1: Kepler would use to create their models of the solar system. Um. 31 00:01:48,200 --> 00:01:51,080 Speaker 1: And he uh, you know, he also made some observations 32 00:01:51,080 --> 00:01:56,280 Speaker 1: about comets, about supernova and just again just he applied 33 00:01:56,280 --> 00:02:00,360 Speaker 1: this obsessive view uh to the cosmos and made a 34 00:02:00,440 --> 00:02:03,480 Speaker 1: number of observations that were, you know, exceedingly helpful in 35 00:02:03,760 --> 00:02:05,760 Speaker 1: in figuring out how things are working. Yeah. And this 36 00:02:05,800 --> 00:02:09,320 Speaker 1: was during a time just for historical context, that people 37 00:02:09,360 --> 00:02:12,760 Speaker 1: thought that the cosmos were immutable, They were divine and 38 00:02:12,880 --> 00:02:16,200 Speaker 1: perfect and I guess an extension of God, right right, 39 00:02:16,919 --> 00:02:19,200 Speaker 1: And so they didn't think that there could be anything 40 00:02:19,800 --> 00:02:23,280 Speaker 1: moving out there. And so when he saw a supernova 41 00:02:23,360 --> 00:02:26,320 Speaker 1: and said whoa ho, that's actual. That's a new star 42 00:02:26,520 --> 00:02:29,359 Speaker 1: that that really actually turned everything on its head. Yeah, 43 00:02:29,400 --> 00:02:31,880 Speaker 1: because it's like, oh, the cosmos weren't just created at 44 00:02:31,880 --> 00:02:35,160 Speaker 1: the dawn of time, you know, perfectly situated like a 45 00:02:35,400 --> 00:02:37,160 Speaker 1: you know something he would put up on the on 46 00:02:37,200 --> 00:02:42,400 Speaker 1: the bookshelf. It just sent ripples through the religious world. Now, 47 00:02:43,360 --> 00:02:47,359 Speaker 1: the fun part is that he was also he also 48 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:51,160 Speaker 1: dabbled in alchemy, which was a popular pastime of of 49 00:02:51,200 --> 00:02:54,520 Speaker 1: the day. He lost his nose in a duel and 50 00:02:54,560 --> 00:02:58,959 Speaker 1: wore a copper prosthetic in its place. Pretty awesome. Yeah. 51 00:02:59,040 --> 00:03:02,280 Speaker 1: He had a pet moves sadly died when it drank 52 00:03:02,320 --> 00:03:05,600 Speaker 1: beer and fell down a flight of stairs. Yeah. And uh, 53 00:03:05,919 --> 00:03:08,720 Speaker 1: and of course he like as was the style in 54 00:03:08,760 --> 00:03:11,400 Speaker 1: those days as well. He also kept a clairvoyant dwarf 55 00:03:11,480 --> 00:03:15,040 Speaker 1: and a court jester. And I don't judge, because if 56 00:03:15,040 --> 00:03:17,560 Speaker 1: we've been living back in those times, we would be wishing, 57 00:03:17,639 --> 00:03:19,280 Speaker 1: you know, that we could have a court jester and 58 00:03:19,320 --> 00:03:21,560 Speaker 1: a clarevoyant dwarf. Right. But what I hate about that 59 00:03:21,639 --> 00:03:23,720 Speaker 1: is it wasn't the dwarf made to sit underneath the 60 00:03:23,720 --> 00:03:27,320 Speaker 1: dinner table. Yeah, I think so. It just seems little 61 00:03:27,800 --> 00:03:30,280 Speaker 1: well and unusual. It's it's cruel, but you know, you 62 00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:32,639 Speaker 1: look back, this was a time when if you were 63 00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:35,000 Speaker 1: a dwarf, I guess these were jobs that were available 64 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:37,560 Speaker 1: to you, you know, true, true, But I think what 65 00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:40,920 Speaker 1: it points to is that this guy was pretty eccentric. Yes, yeah, 66 00:03:40,960 --> 00:03:42,960 Speaker 1: he was. He was a little nutty, um. And he 67 00:03:43,040 --> 00:03:46,640 Speaker 1: also he also was quite a partier. Um. In fact, 68 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:48,200 Speaker 1: there are a couple of theories about his death. One 69 00:03:48,240 --> 00:03:50,400 Speaker 1: is that he and they're currently looking into this thing, 70 00:03:50,520 --> 00:03:53,120 Speaker 1: assumed his body, you know. Um. One idea is that 71 00:03:53,160 --> 00:03:57,800 Speaker 1: he was he was poisoned, h perhaps intentionally with mercury. 72 00:03:57,840 --> 00:03:59,640 Speaker 1: But then the other popular theory is that he was 73 00:03:59,720 --> 00:04:02,840 Speaker 1: just into partying and at the dinner table. You know, 74 00:04:02,880 --> 00:04:04,720 Speaker 1: this is a big banquet hall type of thing, you know, 75 00:04:04,720 --> 00:04:06,320 Speaker 1: where you're sitting at the head of the table just 76 00:04:06,400 --> 00:04:08,960 Speaker 1: drinking and eating until you're about to burst, and in 77 00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:13,200 Speaker 1: this case perhaps literally did burst when his his bladder 78 00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:14,880 Speaker 1: exploded because he didn't want to get up and go 79 00:04:15,160 --> 00:04:17,760 Speaker 1: use the john because he'd missed the party. Right, of course, 80 00:04:17,800 --> 00:04:20,839 Speaker 1: there's lots of beer to be had. But again, this 81 00:04:20,880 --> 00:04:25,080 Speaker 1: is a case where we had an obsessive, brilliant man 82 00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:30,039 Speaker 1: and h by virtue of that brilliance, you have a 83 00:04:30,040 --> 00:04:32,039 Speaker 1: lot of weird things sort of popping up in his life. 84 00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:34,919 Speaker 1: And and you know it's it's kind of like the 85 00:04:34,960 --> 00:04:40,000 Speaker 1: more complicated the mechanism, the more room for weirdness there 86 00:04:40,120 --> 00:04:42,880 Speaker 1: is with the human mind. You sort of see this 87 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:45,839 Speaker 1: as like great people, like really interesting people tend to 88 00:04:45,880 --> 00:04:49,240 Speaker 1: have like their more than their fair share of ecterricities, 89 00:04:49,279 --> 00:04:51,799 Speaker 1: you know, right, because and we talked about this before, 90 00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:54,680 Speaker 1: like the brain, someone said this, the brain plays with 91 00:04:54,720 --> 00:04:58,520 Speaker 1: what it loves. So you see this maybe played out 92 00:04:58,560 --> 00:05:01,080 Speaker 1: with someone like Chico is a pretty good example, but 93 00:05:01,200 --> 00:05:05,200 Speaker 1: he's obviously not the only scientists in the bunch who 94 00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:07,840 Speaker 1: has a couple of eccentric cities. Yeah, so we're gonna 95 00:05:07,839 --> 00:05:11,560 Speaker 1: look at at at a few particular scientists who on 96 00:05:12,040 --> 00:05:14,440 Speaker 1: when you when you first look at all their obsessions, 97 00:05:14,440 --> 00:05:16,320 Speaker 1: you might say, oh, this guy was a little nutty, 98 00:05:16,360 --> 00:05:18,920 Speaker 1: but when you when you take it apart, they may 99 00:05:19,000 --> 00:05:21,320 Speaker 1: or may not be that crazy, right, right, And I'm 100 00:05:21,400 --> 00:05:25,240 Speaker 1: thinking about Tesla too, right. I mean, this guy was 101 00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:29,000 Speaker 1: known as a manic genius who slept very little, who 102 00:05:29,040 --> 00:05:32,560 Speaker 1: was completely obsessed with his research, and in a very 103 00:05:32,640 --> 00:05:36,159 Speaker 1: barnum and Bailey sort of move decided to use his 104 00:05:36,200 --> 00:05:41,000 Speaker 1: own body to conduct electricity to show to audiences, which 105 00:05:41,040 --> 00:05:45,360 Speaker 1: is just nuts. You gotta love that. Yeah, So let's 106 00:05:45,400 --> 00:05:48,599 Speaker 1: let's kick it off by talking about one of the 107 00:05:48,760 --> 00:05:51,720 Speaker 1: greatest scientists of all time, often referred to as as 108 00:05:51,760 --> 00:05:54,640 Speaker 1: the father father of modern science, and that is Sir 109 00:05:54,680 --> 00:05:58,520 Speaker 1: Isaac Newton. So and and we all know that his 110 00:05:58,839 --> 00:06:03,560 Speaker 1: big discovery was the law of gravity. Yes, yeah, he had, 111 00:06:04,200 --> 00:06:05,640 Speaker 1: he had. He gave us a number of things. He 112 00:06:05,640 --> 00:06:08,120 Speaker 1: invented the reflecting telescope, gave us a new theory of 113 00:06:08,200 --> 00:06:11,039 Speaker 1: light and color. He um, he found himself, you know, 114 00:06:11,080 --> 00:06:13,520 Speaker 1: trying to figure out celestial mechanics. He needed a more 115 00:06:13,600 --> 00:06:16,840 Speaker 1: robust mathematics to make it work, so he invented calculus 116 00:06:17,000 --> 00:06:19,680 Speaker 1: or of course, and you know, and his three laws 117 00:06:19,680 --> 00:06:22,680 Speaker 1: of motion are pretty essential. And that's the law of acceleration, 118 00:06:22,760 --> 00:06:25,479 Speaker 1: the law of action and reaction, and and he also 119 00:06:25,520 --> 00:06:27,880 Speaker 1: devised the law of universal gravitation. We have a great 120 00:06:27,920 --> 00:06:30,320 Speaker 1: article about him on the site, by the way, just 121 00:06:30,560 --> 00:06:35,560 Speaker 1: search for Isaac Newton on how Stuff Works dot com. Um, 122 00:06:35,920 --> 00:06:38,040 Speaker 1: do it do it right now, then come back to 123 00:06:38,040 --> 00:06:40,240 Speaker 1: do it point you listen. He also made advancements in 124 00:06:40,279 --> 00:06:44,360 Speaker 1: chemistry and uh, and again just just you cannot underestimate 125 00:06:44,400 --> 00:06:47,000 Speaker 1: his value to the advancement of science, right. But I 126 00:06:47,000 --> 00:06:49,919 Speaker 1: think that's one little detail or a couple little details 127 00:06:50,480 --> 00:06:53,480 Speaker 1: that people sat on for hundreds of years because I 128 00:06:53,560 --> 00:06:55,400 Speaker 1: was like, hey, this guy is brilliant. He's done all 129 00:06:55,440 --> 00:06:59,159 Speaker 1: this stuff. And by the way, he also wrote one 130 00:06:59,200 --> 00:07:04,159 Speaker 1: million fish words on the Bible. Yeah. Yeah, as in fact, 131 00:07:04,360 --> 00:07:07,000 Speaker 1: spent a lot of his last fifty years. You know, 132 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:09,040 Speaker 1: he's working on other things too, but he spent a 133 00:07:09,080 --> 00:07:13,480 Speaker 1: lot of time, uh, working over theology and that complex 134 00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:16,640 Speaker 1: mel and of his Yeah, and particularly about the apocalypse 135 00:07:17,400 --> 00:07:20,320 Speaker 1: and there there are a lot of different passages and 136 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:22,560 Speaker 1: you can look this up. It's pretty cool. But a 137 00:07:22,560 --> 00:07:25,560 Speaker 1: lot of his notes are really cryptic and think, I mean, 138 00:07:25,760 --> 00:07:27,640 Speaker 1: you know, if if you're looking at a context too, 139 00:07:27,680 --> 00:07:29,760 Speaker 1: it's sort of like the ravings of a madman. Yeah. 140 00:07:29,840 --> 00:07:33,480 Speaker 1: I was particularly interested by by one of the things 141 00:07:33,480 --> 00:07:37,200 Speaker 1: that he tackled that he used again, obsessive intellect applied 142 00:07:37,240 --> 00:07:40,440 Speaker 1: to something like, you know, the Bible or in this case, uh, 143 00:07:41,080 --> 00:07:46,200 Speaker 1: the Book of Daniel Um, the Apocalypse, apocalyptic visions of 144 00:07:46,280 --> 00:07:49,880 Speaker 1: Daniel Um. He was able to to to to figure 145 00:07:49,920 --> 00:07:53,920 Speaker 1: out that the Catholic Church would fall between the years 146 00:07:53,960 --> 00:08:01,840 Speaker 1: of margin of error in there. Yeah. Yeah, so so 147 00:08:01,880 --> 00:08:04,640 Speaker 1: that's for the next Dan Brown book, I guess. Yeah, 148 00:08:04,680 --> 00:08:08,920 Speaker 1: and actually too that that was an astrological prediction, so 149 00:08:09,000 --> 00:08:12,440 Speaker 1: he dabbled in that as well. Yeah, which, of course, 150 00:08:12,560 --> 00:08:18,680 Speaker 1: you know, during that time, astrology was actually pretty the 151 00:08:18,760 --> 00:08:21,640 Speaker 1: pretty standard sort of thing to look into, and a 152 00:08:21,680 --> 00:08:24,240 Speaker 1: lot of people took it very seriously. Yeah. Yeah. And 153 00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:27,240 Speaker 1: in fact, doctors at the time used to bleed their 154 00:08:27,240 --> 00:08:31,640 Speaker 1: patients with leeches based on astrological happenings and also schedule 155 00:08:31,800 --> 00:08:36,400 Speaker 1: their surgeries. So again it's it's pretty well and meshed 156 00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:38,520 Speaker 1: in the in the culture at that time. Yeah, I 157 00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:41,440 Speaker 1: mean there was. It was also like astrology and um 158 00:08:41,480 --> 00:08:44,720 Speaker 1: as well discuss alchemy. These are both areas where I 159 00:08:44,760 --> 00:08:46,920 Speaker 1: like to kind of think of them as it's like science, 160 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:49,560 Speaker 1: as this creature emerging from the muck, you know, like 161 00:08:49,600 --> 00:08:52,920 Speaker 1: the fish learning to walk. But yeah, it's still but 162 00:08:52,920 --> 00:08:54,800 Speaker 1: he's still got a lot of slime clinging to it, 163 00:08:55,160 --> 00:08:57,400 Speaker 1: you know, So it's they're still going through the process 164 00:08:57,400 --> 00:09:01,120 Speaker 1: for a while of figuring out where the creature begins 165 00:09:01,120 --> 00:09:03,080 Speaker 1: and where the you know, the slime ends. So the 166 00:09:03,120 --> 00:09:06,120 Speaker 1: alchemy is the slime. Some aspects of the alchemy are 167 00:09:06,120 --> 00:09:08,200 Speaker 1: the slime that could one day become old. Yeah, and 168 00:09:08,200 --> 00:09:10,000 Speaker 1: if you take the water hose to the to the 169 00:09:10,120 --> 00:09:13,920 Speaker 1: slimy alchemy and hose it off vamp chemistry and metallurgy 170 00:09:14,120 --> 00:09:17,880 Speaker 1: right right, Honestly, I don't know a lot about alchemy, 171 00:09:17,920 --> 00:09:19,680 Speaker 1: but that's always what I think about. Is like someone 172 00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:23,280 Speaker 1: basically trying to spin butter into gold. Yeah. Well, a 173 00:09:23,320 --> 00:09:27,880 Speaker 1: lot of it apparently related to creating like costume jewelry, 174 00:09:27,920 --> 00:09:30,160 Speaker 1: like being able to figure out how to fake different metals, 175 00:09:30,640 --> 00:09:32,520 Speaker 1: and and again a lot a lot of it was metallurgy, 176 00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:34,640 Speaker 1: and chemistry was to create everything from like the creation 177 00:09:34,679 --> 00:09:38,120 Speaker 1: of pigments to uh to you know again making some 178 00:09:38,280 --> 00:09:41,280 Speaker 1: you know, fool's gold or something. So so people that 179 00:09:41,360 --> 00:09:44,720 Speaker 1: really ran with that, with the sort of counterfeiting aspect 180 00:09:44,720 --> 00:09:46,440 Speaker 1: of it. And today a lot of people, you know, 181 00:09:46,520 --> 00:09:48,920 Speaker 1: you mentioned alchemy and they're just it just you know, 182 00:09:49,120 --> 00:09:53,560 Speaker 1: rings of you know, just bad not even bad science, 183 00:09:53,559 --> 00:09:57,760 Speaker 1: but just like the just the opposite of science. Um. 184 00:09:57,880 --> 00:09:59,680 Speaker 1: But but but at the time, like there were a 185 00:09:59,679 --> 00:10:02,559 Speaker 1: lot of a lot of there's a lot of chemistry, 186 00:10:02,559 --> 00:10:05,360 Speaker 1: a lot of metallurgy, to the practice. The only thing 187 00:10:05,400 --> 00:10:09,080 Speaker 1: is that it was tied up with some loopy or 188 00:10:09,200 --> 00:10:14,920 Speaker 1: you know, or unexplored, unproven the metaphysical anto and philosophy. 189 00:10:15,040 --> 00:10:18,120 Speaker 1: Like in the Western world, alchemy was established as a 190 00:10:18,120 --> 00:10:22,880 Speaker 1: branch of science by by like the ancient Greeks, and 191 00:10:22,880 --> 00:10:25,040 Speaker 1: and and so a lot of and you really got 192 00:10:25,040 --> 00:10:27,760 Speaker 1: into a lot of like interpreting um the knowledge and 193 00:10:27,800 --> 00:10:31,760 Speaker 1: philosophical terms. So so you get into really murky waters 194 00:10:31,800 --> 00:10:33,800 Speaker 1: with all of that. But like I say, hose it down, 195 00:10:33,960 --> 00:10:36,520 Speaker 1: and you've got to do you you have some core chemistry 196 00:10:36,600 --> 00:10:39,720 Speaker 1: and metallurgy going on. So obviously it's gonna interest somebody. 197 00:10:40,120 --> 00:10:42,640 Speaker 1: I mean, this this was the again, if you wanted 198 00:10:42,679 --> 00:10:46,040 Speaker 1: to study those things, you ended up in this wheelhouse. Well, 199 00:10:46,080 --> 00:10:48,320 Speaker 1: and what I think is really interesting about that time 200 00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:52,800 Speaker 1: period is that you've got Newton, You've got kepler Um 201 00:10:52,840 --> 00:10:58,960 Speaker 1: all messing with alchemy and in this presumably probably not 202 00:10:59,080 --> 00:11:03,480 Speaker 1: well mental added rooms inhaling lead and mercury and playing 203 00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:07,280 Speaker 1: in touching mercury um and what are those sort of effects. 204 00:11:07,280 --> 00:11:10,760 Speaker 1: And and it's interesting that Newton they some people think, 205 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:13,760 Speaker 1: some scholars think he actually suffered from lead and mercury 206 00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:18,320 Speaker 1: poisoning and the same thing with Tycho is that you know, 207 00:11:19,360 --> 00:11:23,480 Speaker 1: it may have been that his downfall wasn't necessarily as bladder, 208 00:11:23,520 --> 00:11:26,880 Speaker 1: but he had you know, pretty high concentrations of mercury 209 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:31,360 Speaker 1: in some of the the his beard hair, I believe. Yeah, 210 00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:34,400 Speaker 1: of course, which banking that was. He just like like 211 00:11:34,480 --> 00:11:37,960 Speaker 1: he had like a phony beer with mercury on the top. Yeah, exactly. 212 00:11:37,960 --> 00:11:39,959 Speaker 1: And I'm actually thinking about this mustache that one of 213 00:11:40,280 --> 00:11:44,640 Speaker 1: the portraits has, like this very serious mustache that must 214 00:11:44,640 --> 00:11:46,640 Speaker 1: extend down like a foot, so you've got to think 215 00:11:46,679 --> 00:11:49,920 Speaker 1: that it probably dipped into the mercury there at some point. Yeah, 216 00:11:50,320 --> 00:11:52,720 Speaker 1: someone really needs to make like and maybe they do, uh, 217 00:11:53,000 --> 00:11:55,120 Speaker 1: let us know if they do, because I would like 218 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:57,160 Speaker 1: one they need to make like a fake nose that 219 00:11:57,200 --> 00:11:59,800 Speaker 1: you can wear over your real nose that's shiny and 220 00:12:00,040 --> 00:12:03,440 Speaker 1: ass and has the big giant tico mustache on it, 221 00:12:04,160 --> 00:12:05,840 Speaker 1: like you know, you know, sort of like a you know, 222 00:12:05,880 --> 00:12:08,400 Speaker 1: fake mustache and glasses kind of deal. I think I 223 00:12:08,400 --> 00:12:11,280 Speaker 1: know what you're going to be for Halloween next year. Interestingly, 224 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:14,760 Speaker 1: I was already thinking about being um, like the white 225 00:12:14,800 --> 00:12:17,440 Speaker 1: Humpty Hump for Halloween next year. So it's pretty much 226 00:12:17,440 --> 00:12:20,120 Speaker 1: the same concept. Like Tico Bray was basically humpty hump 227 00:12:20,160 --> 00:12:23,719 Speaker 1: before um, you know, all their ground even existed. Yes, 228 00:12:24,880 --> 00:12:27,439 Speaker 1: maybe you could mesh the two. But back to Newton 229 00:12:27,440 --> 00:12:29,800 Speaker 1: for a second. There's a Newton biographer by the name 230 00:12:29,800 --> 00:12:32,560 Speaker 1: of Jed buck Wald, and he makes the case that 231 00:12:33,040 --> 00:12:36,520 Speaker 1: like the Newton's obsession with with everything from you know, 232 00:12:36,600 --> 00:12:39,560 Speaker 1: from the movements of the stars to uh to you know, 233 00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:43,320 Speaker 1: the apocalypse of Daniel, these were all uh, these were 234 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:46,320 Speaker 1: all interlinked in a very complex fashion. It wasn't like, 235 00:12:46,440 --> 00:12:48,000 Speaker 1: you know, he was gonna be like, all right, I'm 236 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:49,800 Speaker 1: gonna work on the stars until three and then oh 237 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:52,720 Speaker 1: I think I'll look at this, you know. Um that 238 00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:57,000 Speaker 1: it was. It was. It was all linked together. Um. 239 00:12:57,080 --> 00:12:59,839 Speaker 1: And and again it's like he approached gravity, uh you 240 00:13:00,120 --> 00:13:02,520 Speaker 1: with with this enthusiasm, but he also approached the religious 241 00:13:02,520 --> 00:13:05,400 Speaker 1: text his He had this, you know, just really deep faith, 242 00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:08,720 Speaker 1: just an all encompassing faith, and he believed the universe 243 00:13:08,760 --> 00:13:11,520 Speaker 1: with the creation of a rational God. So he thought 244 00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:15,520 Speaker 1: he sought the same the same rationality in apocalyptic prophecy 245 00:13:15,600 --> 00:13:19,439 Speaker 1: that he saught in the movement of the spheres. Um. 246 00:13:19,480 --> 00:13:22,320 Speaker 1: But but it's it's important to to mention though that 247 00:13:22,360 --> 00:13:26,160 Speaker 1: he wasn't. He wasn't like necessarily bringing all this theology 248 00:13:26,240 --> 00:13:29,720 Speaker 1: into trying to understand the movement of the spheres. Again, 249 00:13:29,720 --> 00:13:32,000 Speaker 1: he thought that this was a rational universe created by 250 00:13:32,040 --> 00:13:35,960 Speaker 1: irrational God, and therefore he could rationally analyze the creation, 251 00:13:36,520 --> 00:13:39,160 Speaker 1: used in other words, us science to understand that creation. 252 00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:41,400 Speaker 1: So there was nothing none of this, Like, you know, 253 00:13:41,440 --> 00:13:44,640 Speaker 1: he wasn't gonna he's he wasn't using one to justify 254 00:13:44,679 --> 00:13:46,439 Speaker 1: the other, right, right, He wasn't gonna say like, oh, 255 00:13:46,559 --> 00:13:48,880 Speaker 1: why is this the way it is? I guess it's 256 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:50,600 Speaker 1: just because that's the way God made it. Case closed, 257 00:13:50,640 --> 00:13:53,240 Speaker 1: you know, like he was. This was a very scientific 258 00:13:53,280 --> 00:13:59,160 Speaker 1: mind that that applied the same rationality other less scientific areas. 259 00:13:59,280 --> 00:14:02,920 Speaker 1: Like you're saying that same compulsion that drove him to 260 00:14:02,920 --> 00:14:06,680 Speaker 1: to look at science was in the works with religion 261 00:14:06,760 --> 00:14:10,320 Speaker 1: and alchemy, and so of course you couldn't separate that 262 00:14:10,480 --> 00:14:14,800 Speaker 1: from those two or three things. Now from that man, 263 00:14:15,320 --> 00:14:19,720 Speaker 1: he was going to cover it all regardless. Yeah, So anyway, 264 00:14:19,760 --> 00:14:21,720 Speaker 1: fascinating guy. I can only imagine he would be into 265 00:14:21,720 --> 00:14:24,680 Speaker 1: fantasy football if you were alive today. Oh of course 266 00:14:24,760 --> 00:14:28,480 Speaker 1: our baseball stats, Yeah, you know, the brackets too, old 267 00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:35,320 Speaker 1: Martin but okay, so Kepler, who was Tycho's assistant, right, 268 00:14:35,880 --> 00:14:40,200 Speaker 1: and again this is a man who lived fifte to right, 269 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:42,240 Speaker 1: and do you want to talk a little bit about 270 00:14:42,400 --> 00:14:45,400 Speaker 1: what the sort of things that he did for astronomy 271 00:14:46,240 --> 00:14:49,320 Speaker 1: alight his standing at that time. Yeah, Johannes Kepler was 272 00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:51,680 Speaker 1: basically he's basically a herald is the father of celestial 273 00:14:51,720 --> 00:14:55,640 Speaker 1: mechanics and U. And he was also a pretty religious 274 00:14:55,680 --> 00:14:59,360 Speaker 1: due to believed that the language of God was geometry. 275 00:14:59,480 --> 00:15:01,040 Speaker 1: So you know, have as Kepler is pretty much here 276 00:15:01,040 --> 00:15:04,520 Speaker 1: old is the father of celestial mechanics um. He was 277 00:15:04,560 --> 00:15:07,880 Speaker 1: responsible for such breakthroughs as figuring out the planets orbits 278 00:15:07,920 --> 00:15:10,960 Speaker 1: were elliptical and not perfect circles um, which was you know, 279 00:15:11,000 --> 00:15:13,600 Speaker 1: pretty big because the circle is this perfect geometic and 280 00:15:13,640 --> 00:15:16,440 Speaker 1: geometrical shape than before you know, a creation of God, 281 00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:18,440 Speaker 1: as you know, he's gonna work with perfect shapes, right, 282 00:15:18,480 --> 00:15:20,560 Speaker 1: So so that was a little a little bit of 283 00:15:20,760 --> 00:15:22,880 Speaker 1: a blow. And he did that using a lot of 284 00:15:22,880 --> 00:15:25,000 Speaker 1: the data that was collected at the research center that 285 00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:28,240 Speaker 1: Tycho started, right, So without that obsessive like looking at 286 00:15:28,240 --> 00:15:31,560 Speaker 1: this guy every night before you had a telescope. By 287 00:15:31,560 --> 00:15:35,400 Speaker 1: the way, you wouldn't have that data to work off of. Yeah. 288 00:15:35,400 --> 00:15:37,800 Speaker 1: He also figured out that the speed of anything orbiting 289 00:15:37,840 --> 00:15:41,200 Speaker 1: the Sun changes predictably according to the distance from the Sun. 290 00:15:41,720 --> 00:15:46,000 Speaker 1: The closer the faster, um So, so he ended up 291 00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:49,880 Speaker 1: getting Kepler's laws and and uh and he created all 292 00:15:49,920 --> 00:15:52,680 Speaker 1: these charts that were ten times more accurate than those 293 00:15:52,720 --> 00:15:55,920 Speaker 1: of Copernicus. So, I mean, he's an extremely important guy 294 00:15:55,960 --> 00:16:00,160 Speaker 1: in understanding how our solar system moves and and and 295 00:16:00,200 --> 00:16:03,000 Speaker 1: what laws are involved in these movements. Right lest he 296 00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:06,160 Speaker 1: was the authority at the time, So it makes sense 297 00:16:06,200 --> 00:16:08,680 Speaker 1: that you would have the Pope coming to him and saying, hey, 298 00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:11,520 Speaker 1: can you draft up an astrological chart for me and 299 00:16:12,040 --> 00:16:14,040 Speaker 1: let me know what's going to go down here? Yeah 300 00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:19,400 Speaker 1: he um um. Specifically, he served Holy Roman Emperor Rudolph 301 00:16:19,400 --> 00:16:22,360 Speaker 1: the Second as the Imperial Mathematician, And this was a 302 00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:25,520 Speaker 1: job that seems to have frequently involved such tasks as, say, 303 00:16:25,560 --> 00:16:29,040 Speaker 1: determining the planetary alignment at the births of Caesar and Muhammad, 304 00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:33,040 Speaker 1: or you know, astro astrological predictions for the future, the 305 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:37,920 Speaker 1: meaning quote unquote of supernova sixteen O four, which came 306 00:16:37,960 --> 00:16:41,680 Speaker 1: to be known as Kepler supernova. Uh So, yeah, this 307 00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:45,560 Speaker 1: guy was was a practicing astrologer as well as, uh 308 00:16:45,880 --> 00:16:48,440 Speaker 1: the father celestial mechanics. Yeah and so and and I 309 00:16:48,480 --> 00:16:51,480 Speaker 1: think to sort of give some context there about being 310 00:16:51,520 --> 00:16:56,120 Speaker 1: like the mathematician capital the the if you look at 311 00:16:56,120 --> 00:16:59,480 Speaker 1: Tycho again, his duel was over who was the best 312 00:16:59,520 --> 00:17:02,840 Speaker 1: mathematics as and right when he was in school it 313 00:17:02,920 --> 00:17:05,840 Speaker 1: was with another student. So, I mean the weight of that. 314 00:17:05,960 --> 00:17:09,000 Speaker 1: Can you imagine kepler Is is given this title of 315 00:17:09,160 --> 00:17:15,520 Speaker 1: like you were the head wizard mathematician. Yeah. It on 316 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:17,360 Speaker 1: the surface, it's it's interesting to look at and you're 317 00:17:17,400 --> 00:17:19,720 Speaker 1: you're like like, oh, well wait, he was you know, 318 00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:23,600 Speaker 1: this gifted you know, um mathematician. And you know, he 319 00:17:23,600 --> 00:17:25,560 Speaker 1: had totally understood what was or he had a better 320 00:17:25,640 --> 00:17:29,119 Speaker 1: understanding of how the planets were moving and what the 321 00:17:29,119 --> 00:17:31,399 Speaker 1: stars meant than anybody alive. But yet he was also 322 00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:33,720 Speaker 1: more than willing to say, yeah, I'll look at the 323 00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:35,280 Speaker 1: stars and tell you what the future is going to be. 324 00:17:35,840 --> 00:17:38,920 Speaker 1: It's it seems a little it seems a little weird, 325 00:17:38,920 --> 00:17:41,000 Speaker 1: but that's part of it. It's like Johannes Kepler, I 326 00:17:41,000 --> 00:17:45,280 Speaker 1: gotta eat right. So, and especially if you're benefactor is 327 00:17:45,320 --> 00:17:47,800 Speaker 1: one of the most powerful you know men in the 328 00:17:47,840 --> 00:17:49,840 Speaker 1: Western world, you know, and he comes to and you 329 00:17:49,880 --> 00:17:53,800 Speaker 1: asked for something like this, yeah, you do it, of course. Yeah. 330 00:17:53,880 --> 00:17:57,840 Speaker 1: And I think that what Um really distinguished him as 331 00:17:57,880 --> 00:18:01,320 Speaker 1: an astrologer during that time is that one of his 332 00:18:01,720 --> 00:18:06,080 Speaker 1: first predictions was basically saying, Okay, we're going to have 333 00:18:06,160 --> 00:18:08,680 Speaker 1: extreme cold and there's going to be a Turkish invasion, 334 00:18:09,240 --> 00:18:12,000 Speaker 1: and all those things came true. And of course when 335 00:18:12,000 --> 00:18:13,479 Speaker 1: you look at it now and you're like, well, of 336 00:18:13,520 --> 00:18:15,399 Speaker 1: course there's extreme cold. I mean you could. I mean 337 00:18:15,400 --> 00:18:18,280 Speaker 1: the Old Farmers Almanac is basically the same thing, and 338 00:18:18,320 --> 00:18:21,440 Speaker 1: predicting when you're gonna have cold spells and all sorts 339 00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:25,160 Speaker 1: of weather patterns and then Turkish invasion, well maybe maybe 340 00:18:25,160 --> 00:18:26,560 Speaker 1: just have to be in the know about what's going 341 00:18:26,600 --> 00:18:28,800 Speaker 1: on in the world labels and are able to say, 342 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:30,040 Speaker 1: oh yeah, and by the way, I think this is 343 00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:32,760 Speaker 1: gonna they're going to be a conflict. So it's not 344 00:18:32,840 --> 00:18:35,480 Speaker 1: too crazy, right, I mean, we're not saying that he 345 00:18:35,560 --> 00:18:38,960 Speaker 1: had precognition or that the stars were telling him that. 346 00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:42,120 Speaker 1: I mean, you can certainly look at patterns and predict things, right, 347 00:18:42,359 --> 00:18:43,920 Speaker 1: and he probably had a lot of really cool looking 348 00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:45,640 Speaker 1: charts to back it up because he did. He create 349 00:18:45,720 --> 00:18:47,960 Speaker 1: a lot of charts. Um. I mean, it would be 350 00:18:47,960 --> 00:18:51,320 Speaker 1: like the fanciest power point presentation of the right exactly. 351 00:18:52,080 --> 00:18:54,720 Speaker 1: It's um. I do love the idea that like a 352 00:18:54,760 --> 00:18:57,840 Speaker 1: medieval monastery where instead of like you know, illuminators working 353 00:18:57,880 --> 00:19:00,160 Speaker 1: in the the scriptorium you have, they'd be working at our 354 00:19:00,200 --> 00:19:03,480 Speaker 1: point presidentations. But but again think of the think of 355 00:19:03,480 --> 00:19:06,000 Speaker 1: the the the analogy I made earlier about the creature 356 00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:09,320 Speaker 1: emerging from the muck's that's kind of the relationship between 357 00:19:09,359 --> 00:19:12,800 Speaker 1: astronomy and astrology. There was still a lot of astrological 358 00:19:12,840 --> 00:19:18,040 Speaker 1: astrological slime clinging to to the beast of astronomy. So 359 00:19:18,200 --> 00:19:21,000 Speaker 1: if you're working in the in the field of astronomy, 360 00:19:21,000 --> 00:19:23,959 Speaker 1: and even if you're a really serious astronomer like Kepler, 361 00:19:24,240 --> 00:19:26,119 Speaker 1: you're gonna have to dabble with some of the slime. 362 00:19:26,880 --> 00:19:29,800 Speaker 1: So um. And also, and I think there's also a 363 00:19:29,880 --> 00:19:33,200 Speaker 1: sense I'm kind of going off here, but I can't 364 00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:34,920 Speaker 1: help but think it's like you're you're a guy that's 365 00:19:34,920 --> 00:19:37,560 Speaker 1: really gifted, like Kepler, and you probably have a significant 366 00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:41,240 Speaker 1: amount of intellectual pride, and there's gonna be a certain 367 00:19:41,240 --> 00:19:43,600 Speaker 1: expectation from a lot of people, it's like, hey, you 368 00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:46,640 Speaker 1: only know how planets work, so do you mind telling 369 00:19:46,640 --> 00:19:48,560 Speaker 1: me what the future is going to be? And you know, 370 00:19:48,600 --> 00:19:51,080 Speaker 1: you can't say, well, yeah, you can't say, well, actually, 371 00:19:51,200 --> 00:19:54,720 Speaker 1: I'm a serious astronomer and uh, you can't actually tell 372 00:19:54,720 --> 00:19:56,280 Speaker 1: what the future is going to be based on the stars. 373 00:19:56,280 --> 00:19:57,960 Speaker 1: They'd be like, what this guy didn't know what he's 374 00:19:57,960 --> 00:19:59,919 Speaker 1: talking about. I'm gonna go ask Joe down here, who 375 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:03,120 Speaker 1: runs the local astrology center, and he's gonna he's gonna 376 00:20:03,119 --> 00:20:05,880 Speaker 1: totally straighten me out. And in meanwhile, Joe like knows 377 00:20:05,920 --> 00:20:12,119 Speaker 1: nothing about um the shape of a planetary glory. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, 378 00:20:12,280 --> 00:20:20,680 Speaker 1: Now you're right. I don't think that his ego could resist. Yeah. 379 00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:24,520 Speaker 1: This presentation is brought to you by Intel Sponsors of tomorrow. 380 00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:31,840 Speaker 1: So when you look at at johannest Kepler and take 381 00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:36,919 Speaker 1: the seemingly crazy uh stuff about astrology and you and 382 00:20:36,960 --> 00:20:40,720 Speaker 1: you compare it with his his actual scientific achievements, I 383 00:20:40,720 --> 00:20:44,040 Speaker 1: think it all weighs out. Uh Like. The crazy stuff 384 00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:46,280 Speaker 1: was more due to the time in which he was 385 00:20:46,359 --> 00:20:51,159 Speaker 1: living and the reality of his h his obligations to 386 00:20:51,680 --> 00:20:55,360 Speaker 1: his benefactors. So he was an obsessive opportunist Yeah, yes, 387 00:20:55,680 --> 00:20:57,360 Speaker 1: you can see that. I imagine he really got into 388 00:20:57,359 --> 00:21:00,320 Speaker 1: the astrology stuff too. I mean he he kind of 389 00:21:00,320 --> 00:21:03,320 Speaker 1: downplayed it, but but I imagine he had some fun 390 00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:08,919 Speaker 1: with it. Yeah, I see that. Um, so I don't know, 391 00:21:09,040 --> 00:21:12,040 Speaker 1: let's let's propel a little bit more in the future. Yeah, 392 00:21:12,080 --> 00:21:15,400 Speaker 1: and about like I don't know. Yeah, and we're we're 393 00:21:15,440 --> 00:21:18,080 Speaker 1: also this this the next scientist is not quite on 394 00:21:18,119 --> 00:21:21,520 Speaker 1: the same level that should be said that he's he's 395 00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:26,400 Speaker 1: in he's in Terence McKenna territory. So while the while 396 00:21:26,440 --> 00:21:29,719 Speaker 1: Newton and Kepler and Antico are all examples of guys who, 397 00:21:30,040 --> 00:21:33,280 Speaker 1: despite any seeming crazy uh that they had going on, 398 00:21:33,640 --> 00:21:37,560 Speaker 1: they still made huge important contributions to science, and there 399 00:21:37,840 --> 00:21:40,440 Speaker 1: and and and again. Their contributions are just above reproach, 400 00:21:40,520 --> 00:21:43,520 Speaker 1: there's no questioning them. But when you start talking about 401 00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:46,520 Speaker 1: John C. Lily, who was born in nineteen fifteen and 402 00:21:46,560 --> 00:21:49,359 Speaker 1: died in two thousand and one, Um, you see a 403 00:21:49,400 --> 00:21:52,600 Speaker 1: case where the scientific research kind of goes off the 404 00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:56,040 Speaker 1: road quite a bit, or falls back into the muck 405 00:21:56,080 --> 00:21:59,920 Speaker 1: and covers itself with slide. It's maybe a little strong. 406 00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:03,360 Speaker 1: The road to Hell is covered in primordial slime, Yeah, 407 00:22:03,680 --> 00:22:07,199 Speaker 1: or something like that or good intentions. This is the 408 00:22:07,280 --> 00:22:11,400 Speaker 1: guy who was really interested in inner species language, right, 409 00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:15,600 Speaker 1: so he in particular dolphins and communicating with dolphins. And 410 00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:18,359 Speaker 1: this was before too we had such an understanding of 411 00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:21,119 Speaker 1: how complex dolphins are in terms of their brain function 412 00:22:21,359 --> 00:22:22,840 Speaker 1: and their communication. Like if you go back to the 413 00:22:22,880 --> 00:22:26,080 Speaker 1: nineteen fifties, UM, there wasn't a lot of talk about, oh, 414 00:22:26,119 --> 00:22:29,399 Speaker 1: dolphins are smart and peaceful, you know, or or or 415 00:22:29,440 --> 00:22:31,840 Speaker 1: even like the you know, different headlines about oh, dolphins 416 00:22:31,880 --> 00:22:34,120 Speaker 1: are kind of perverted, um, because you know that you've 417 00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:37,000 Speaker 1: heard about the thing where they like we went into 418 00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:40,600 Speaker 1: this into a previous podcast UM called are You Smarter 419 00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:43,920 Speaker 1: than a Dolphin? Um? Should this available on iTunes? And 420 00:22:44,600 --> 00:22:47,400 Speaker 1: they will occasionally look in on people on there. There's 421 00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:49,960 Speaker 1: a certain segment of the population that has so much 422 00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:52,200 Speaker 1: money that they can afford a private submarine with a 423 00:22:52,240 --> 00:22:56,679 Speaker 1: window on the side. Okay, well they will take if 424 00:22:56,720 --> 00:22:58,800 Speaker 1: you're this type of person, you know, the first thing 425 00:22:58,800 --> 00:23:00,360 Speaker 1: you're gonna do is you're gonna go to and you're 426 00:23:00,359 --> 00:23:02,800 Speaker 1: wanna make love in front of that window of course, right, 427 00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:05,640 Speaker 1: and uh, these people were quickly finding that dolphins will 428 00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:08,240 Speaker 1: come and watch. You know, I'm kind of making the 429 00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:10,440 Speaker 1: yucky face just because because of what we're about to 430 00:23:10,440 --> 00:23:13,479 Speaker 1: talk about. So so anyway, but at this time, nobody 431 00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:17,160 Speaker 1: really thought about it. But then May John C. Lily 432 00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:21,639 Speaker 1: presents a paper before the American Psychiatric Association, and he 433 00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:26,080 Speaker 1: made some really dramatic claims about their intelligence, about their 434 00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:33,160 Speaker 1: linguistic abilities. Uh. And the evidence wasn't particularly strong scientifically speaking, 435 00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:34,920 Speaker 1: but it but it wasn't like crazy, Like he wasn't 436 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:37,280 Speaker 1: just completely going off off the deep end either, right, 437 00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:39,800 Speaker 1: And they couldn't exactly recreate this data right when they 438 00:23:39,840 --> 00:23:42,119 Speaker 1: tried to replicate studies on But it's like, you know, 439 00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:43,639 Speaker 1: you see this a lot with stuff, Like suddenly there 440 00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:48,080 Speaker 1: is study and it's really huge, and the newspapers across 441 00:23:48,160 --> 00:23:50,160 Speaker 1: the US just ran with it. They were like, whoa, 442 00:23:50,240 --> 00:23:53,400 Speaker 1: dolphins are super smart and uh and and it really 443 00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:56,000 Speaker 1: kicked off. There was just kind of a dolphin craze 444 00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:59,080 Speaker 1: like uh that would that would kick off after this, 445 00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:03,000 Speaker 1: I mean for starters. Suddenly Lily gets like just a 446 00:24:03,040 --> 00:24:07,280 Speaker 1: string of like crazy grants, like federal research grants. Okay, 447 00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:11,480 Speaker 1: so he's he's got a ton of money. Yeah, and 448 00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:14,159 Speaker 1: he like sets up a laboratory and on St. Thomas 449 00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:16,159 Speaker 1: in the US Virgin Islands. I mean, so far this 450 00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:18,840 Speaker 1: is sounding fine. Yeah, And they say, at his peak, 451 00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:21,680 Speaker 1: Lily was receiving upwards of half a million dollars a 452 00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:23,399 Speaker 1: year in grant money. And this is like, you know, 453 00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:27,120 Speaker 1: this is again, this is like late fifties, early sixties. Uh. 454 00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:29,000 Speaker 1: And in sixty one he followed it up with his 455 00:24:29,040 --> 00:24:32,760 Speaker 1: book Man and Dolphin, which got a little crazier, um, 456 00:24:32,800 --> 00:24:35,679 Speaker 1: but but also like but but not so crazy that 457 00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:37,760 Speaker 1: it was completely turning people off, like like here's a 458 00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:41,800 Speaker 1: quote from it. Eventually it may be possible for humans 459 00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:44,280 Speaker 1: to speak with other species. I have come to this 460 00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:47,520 Speaker 1: conclusion after careful consideration of evidence game through my research 461 00:24:47,560 --> 00:24:51,040 Speaker 1: experiments with dolphins. If new scientific developments are to be 462 00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:53,639 Speaker 1: made in this direction, however, certain changes in our basic 463 00:24:53,680 --> 00:24:58,200 Speaker 1: orientation and philosophy will be necessary. Okay again, which is 464 00:24:58,280 --> 00:25:00,879 Speaker 1: kind of foreshadowing for crazy, but at right, you know 465 00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:04,040 Speaker 1: it sounds it still sounds okay to me. It's like, okay, 466 00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:06,679 Speaker 1: I'm with you. You're you're in the Virgin Islands. You're 467 00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:10,240 Speaker 1: gonna be conducting some experiments, and in fact, one of 468 00:25:10,240 --> 00:25:14,160 Speaker 1: your experiments is going to be based on what they 469 00:25:14,160 --> 00:25:16,720 Speaker 1: thought at the time was the basis for language, that 470 00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:20,359 Speaker 1: children learn language from a close relationship with their mother 471 00:25:20,440 --> 00:25:27,439 Speaker 1: and being around their mother. Right, enter Margaret how research assistant. Uh, 472 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:31,480 Speaker 1: you could say unsung hero of the story or victim 473 00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:33,720 Speaker 1: of the story. I don't know. I don't want to 474 00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:36,080 Speaker 1: think of it as a victim. Now, okay, all right, 475 00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:41,359 Speaker 1: So unsung hero. She lives with a dolphin. And how 476 00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:43,600 Speaker 1: would you live in a dolphin. You would probably submerge 477 00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:46,240 Speaker 1: a two bedroom house. Right, that's the best method. With 478 00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:48,399 Speaker 1: all that grant money you've got, Yeah, you've got, you know, 479 00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:50,639 Speaker 1: half a million dollars rolling around. Why not make a 480 00:25:50,640 --> 00:25:53,719 Speaker 1: bed out of sea um water, salt water so that 481 00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:56,320 Speaker 1: the dolphin could always come and cuddle up to you 482 00:25:56,840 --> 00:25:58,800 Speaker 1: while you were in repose. I should I should mentioned that. 483 00:25:58,840 --> 00:26:01,159 Speaker 1: At the same time, while this is beginning to happen, 484 00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:04,960 Speaker 1: other researchers are looking into the into the dolphin complaion 485 00:26:05,000 --> 00:26:07,800 Speaker 1: thing like crazy. So like like about a half a 486 00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:10,000 Speaker 1: dozen other researchers, the U. S. Navy is looking into 487 00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:16,080 Speaker 1: possibilities um and and uh and then like nine flipper 488 00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:18,639 Speaker 1: hits the air. So like dolphin mania is running wild. 489 00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:21,280 Speaker 1: People were looking into it. The navy is looking into it. 490 00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:25,520 Speaker 1: Now back to the submerged to bedroom house. Okay, so 491 00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:29,640 Speaker 1: if we haven't piqued your interests enough, here we go. 492 00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:33,320 Speaker 1: So I've already mentioned that there's a water soaked bed 493 00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:35,800 Speaker 1: and and there's a lot of play between Margaret and 494 00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:39,199 Speaker 1: the dolphin Peter, and they spend a tremendous amount of 495 00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:42,919 Speaker 1: time together playing ball and trying to do language lessons 496 00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:46,280 Speaker 1: with Peter. Peter is not so responsive though, and it 497 00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:48,479 Speaker 1: turns out that he's not really interested in her as 498 00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:53,200 Speaker 1: a mother figure, but more as a partner, and begins 499 00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:57,040 Speaker 1: nudging her and nozzling and to the point where she 500 00:26:57,040 --> 00:27:00,280 Speaker 1: has to start wearing boots galoshes so she could doesn't 501 00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:02,840 Speaker 1: get bruise, and she carries around a broomstick to fight 502 00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:06,120 Speaker 1: off his advances. And so they're a little bit concerned, 503 00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:07,760 Speaker 1: and they say, okay, you know, maybe we should just 504 00:27:07,840 --> 00:27:10,600 Speaker 1: let him out and he can have conjugal visits with 505 00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:13,560 Speaker 1: other dolphins and he can get out of the system. 506 00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:17,320 Speaker 1: They do that, he comes back, but no, he still 507 00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:23,520 Speaker 1: is interested in her as as his lady friend and uh, 508 00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:26,800 Speaker 1: and he actually changed his tactic for wooing her and 509 00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:33,920 Speaker 1: begins to show his Genitalia to her. Yeah, so that's 510 00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:35,840 Speaker 1: not the end of the story, though, I mean, you 511 00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:39,480 Speaker 1: wish it were, right, shaun Cy Lily says, you know what, 512 00:27:39,880 --> 00:27:44,080 Speaker 1: maybe we should just see if he's more cooperative, if 513 00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:46,560 Speaker 1: if perhaps Peter can get to third base with Margaret. 514 00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:48,320 Speaker 1: How Yeah, and uh, you know, we're not going to 515 00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:49,760 Speaker 1: go into a lot of detail on this, but but 516 00:27:49,880 --> 00:27:52,600 Speaker 1: what ends up happening is something that actually happens at 517 00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:57,720 Speaker 1: farms across America between um, between between a farmer and 518 00:27:57,800 --> 00:28:03,399 Speaker 1: his livestock and a perfectly acceptable enter. So, um, but 519 00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:06,480 Speaker 1: I guess I guess if you I mean, it happens right, 520 00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:10,760 Speaker 1: And uh, the thing here is that John C. Lily thinks, well, 521 00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:14,080 Speaker 1: if I could just have another year doing this, I 522 00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:16,520 Speaker 1: could really make some progress. But he runs out of 523 00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:19,040 Speaker 1: funding at that point. Yeah. Well, also, you're probably people 524 00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:20,919 Speaker 1: maybe think, well, here's literally in all this he's not. Well, 525 00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:25,639 Speaker 1: I'll tell you where Lily is. He's in his isolation chamber, which, 526 00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:28,800 Speaker 1: if if you've ever seen the movie Altered States, that's 527 00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:31,520 Speaker 1: roughly based on the kind of stuff that that Lily 528 00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:33,439 Speaker 1: was was up to at the time, which is like 529 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:37,000 Speaker 1: this this like water fill like chamber lightless that you 530 00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:41,560 Speaker 1: just isolate yourself in and then deprivation, sensory deprivation. And 531 00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:44,360 Speaker 1: then he would take like a ridiculous amount of LSD 532 00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:48,720 Speaker 1: and use this as a way to try and commune 533 00:28:48,920 --> 00:28:52,400 Speaker 1: with like the dolphin mind. And weirdly enough, all of 534 00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:56,600 Speaker 1: his funding was pulled. Yeah. Uh. He During this time 535 00:28:56,640 --> 00:28:59,720 Speaker 1: he also approached NASA, suggesting that he had a breakthrough. 536 00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:02,520 Speaker 1: Uh that was also going to be be useful when 537 00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:06,320 Speaker 1: we started encountering aliens um. But yeah, he lost his funding. 538 00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:10,120 Speaker 1: He evidently kept doing ls D a lot um. I 539 00:29:10,160 --> 00:29:14,960 Speaker 1: don't think it's it's uh, it's difficult to judge, uh 540 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:18,680 Speaker 1: in saying that he probably did too much LSD and 541 00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:21,360 Speaker 1: uh and yeah, and then finally he just released the 542 00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:23,480 Speaker 1: dolphins into the wild and claimed that they had quote 543 00:29:23,600 --> 00:29:28,440 Speaker 1: finished reprogramming him and uh and basically, but you lived 544 00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:31,680 Speaker 1: out the rest of his life, yeah, sort of going 545 00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:35,880 Speaker 1: after other dolphin kind of crazy dolphin related ideas, publishing 546 00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:39,960 Speaker 1: things on his website about it, and just kind of 547 00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:42,000 Speaker 1: a crazy crazy man. Yeah. I mean I kind of 548 00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:45,760 Speaker 1: think that the Ignoble awards should just retroactively, Yeah, the 549 00:29:46,240 --> 00:29:49,160 Speaker 1: Noble Prizes, Yeah, he I think he deserves one. If 550 00:29:49,160 --> 00:29:50,960 Speaker 1: he has not, he may have received one. They've they've 551 00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:52,360 Speaker 1: been around for a number of years, and I can't 552 00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:56,080 Speaker 1: bring all of their winners to mind right off the bat. 553 00:29:56,160 --> 00:29:59,800 Speaker 1: But but but really is such an interesting case in 554 00:29:59,840 --> 00:30:02,000 Speaker 1: the you look early on, you can see it. This 555 00:30:02,040 --> 00:30:03,960 Speaker 1: is hey, this is a man that was obsessed. Like 556 00:30:04,040 --> 00:30:06,280 Speaker 1: all the cases we've looked at, this man was obsessed. 557 00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:10,320 Speaker 1: And and early on you see a man that that 558 00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:13,680 Speaker 1: probably had a lot of potential and a lot of promise, 559 00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:17,600 Speaker 1: and it just the the the vessel kind of slowly 560 00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:21,200 Speaker 1: goes off the road. And it started with the money. Yeah, 561 00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:25,600 Speaker 1: the money, the corruption. It's like a rock and roll 562 00:30:25,960 --> 00:30:31,120 Speaker 1: saga right here. Dolphins. Now at the same time, he 563 00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:36,040 Speaker 1: can be credited, you know, it's scientifically fallible. Was is 564 00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:39,120 Speaker 1: that first paper? It seems to have been he did 565 00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:42,840 Speaker 1: set off a trend that led to tow that that 566 00:30:42,920 --> 00:30:45,640 Speaker 1: really led to our current understanding of dolphin intellect. You know, 567 00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:48,360 Speaker 1: I mean he he kind of set the fire and 568 00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:50,400 Speaker 1: then other people had to sort of, you know, control 569 00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:54,960 Speaker 1: the fire. But but the fruits of that first paper 570 00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:57,800 Speaker 1: are still evident in dolphin reasons. Yeah, I mean, there's 571 00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:00,920 Speaker 1: a lot to be explored there for sure, not in 572 00:31:01,000 --> 00:31:03,600 Speaker 1: the manner he did. But I was thinking that you're 573 00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:05,000 Speaker 1: going to say the trend that he started with, like 574 00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:09,440 Speaker 1: airbrushing dolphins like onto vans or something I can only 575 00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:11,040 Speaker 1: imagine has something to do with it. There is there 576 00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:14,960 Speaker 1: does seem to be this interesting like hippie dolphin. I mean, 577 00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:18,880 Speaker 1: because the idea that dolphins are so intelligent. I mean, 578 00:31:18,880 --> 00:31:21,360 Speaker 1: it really is this sort of like connection with nature 579 00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:24,000 Speaker 1: type of deal, because you can suddenly realize, well, this 580 00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:28,280 Speaker 1: is a really intelligent being and uh, and and it 581 00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:31,959 Speaker 1: kind of turns your typical perception about man and nature 582 00:31:32,040 --> 00:31:34,400 Speaker 1: on its head. Yeah, and there are a lot of 583 00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:38,000 Speaker 1: myths out there about dolphins and and and actually like 584 00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:42,800 Speaker 1: there's some evolutionary interesting stories out there with dolphins. But yeah, people, 585 00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:45,640 Speaker 1: humans are gogga for dolphins. But at the same time, 586 00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:48,720 Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure that you can't take a boatload of 587 00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:53,040 Speaker 1: LSD and talk to one. I tried. It hasn't happened. 588 00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:55,680 Speaker 1: I'm kidding. I have never tried. Yeah, Like the I 589 00:31:55,720 --> 00:31:58,200 Speaker 1: told you that that the Navy looked into this and 590 00:31:58,880 --> 00:32:02,600 Speaker 1: based on on this, on one particular study, they found 591 00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:05,120 Speaker 1: that you could train them to a certain extent, but 592 00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:07,040 Speaker 1: I mean they were trying to teach them to talk 593 00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:11,080 Speaker 1: as well, because they don't have vocal chords folks. Yeah, well, 594 00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:12,600 Speaker 1: you know, they were like trying to say, Okay, this 595 00:32:12,640 --> 00:32:14,920 Speaker 1: sound could be this letter, and it just they didn't 596 00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:17,520 Speaker 1: work out. They're very bright creatures, but but it kind 597 00:32:17,520 --> 00:32:21,120 Speaker 1: of underlies the basic anthromomorphic trap of trying to look 598 00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:23,640 Speaker 1: at any animals intelligence, right, And I think that I 599 00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:25,680 Speaker 1: think you're right that they when they first were looking 600 00:32:25,680 --> 00:32:27,480 Speaker 1: at them, they thought, oh, well, they've got very large 601 00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:30,440 Speaker 1: brains like ours. Well, now we know they don't have 602 00:32:30,600 --> 00:32:34,120 Speaker 1: as as many cells as we do. And that's not 603 00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:36,360 Speaker 1: to say that they're not incredibly intelligent, it's just that 604 00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:39,480 Speaker 1: their their brains aren't like ours, you know, right, Like 605 00:32:39,520 --> 00:32:41,560 Speaker 1: we tend to view everything, it's kind of like we're 606 00:32:41,600 --> 00:32:44,600 Speaker 1: the high school seniors, and then every everything else in 607 00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:47,240 Speaker 1: the animal kingdom is like in a different grade, descending down, 608 00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:49,600 Speaker 1: and then it's kind of like we're we're at the top, 609 00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:51,720 Speaker 1: and we're like, hey, dolphins, what's what's up when you're 610 00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:53,959 Speaker 1: gonna graduate? Yeah, when you're gonna hanging out with us 611 00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:55,880 Speaker 1: and our click and talking to us. But it's it's 612 00:32:55,920 --> 00:32:57,959 Speaker 1: not like that at all like the dolphin is an 613 00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:01,400 Speaker 1: incredibly smart creature filling the nitcho the it feels we're, 614 00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:05,400 Speaker 1: you know, well a reasonably creature filling the niche that 615 00:33:05,400 --> 00:33:08,600 Speaker 1: that we feel, you know, so it's um, you just 616 00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:11,320 Speaker 1: can't look at it like this, uh this stairway to 617 00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:17,040 Speaker 1: to anthromomorphic heaven. You know, it's it's entirely different, different setup. 618 00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:18,479 Speaker 1: I like it. I like the way you did that, 619 00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:21,760 Speaker 1: like like it's one one I think actually is Ricky 620 00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:24,360 Speaker 1: Gervais that pointed out that the slug, the garden slug, 621 00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:29,440 Speaker 1: as grotesque as it is, is perfect like nature has 622 00:33:29,680 --> 00:33:32,120 Speaker 1: has an an evolution has led up to that. This 623 00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:35,320 Speaker 1: is the culmination right here. And it may not seem pretty, 624 00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:37,840 Speaker 1: and it sure as heck may not may it may 625 00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:42,160 Speaker 1: not have an intelligence on par with human intelligence, but 626 00:33:42,280 --> 00:33:45,440 Speaker 1: it's it's perfectly filling that niche and it's and you know, 627 00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:47,760 Speaker 1: give it, give it some credit. It's not screwing up 628 00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:50,240 Speaker 1: other creatures niche. Right, So let a dolphin be a 629 00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:55,400 Speaker 1: dolphin and quit trying to ride the dolphin. Well, yes, yeah, 630 00:33:55,560 --> 00:33:57,880 Speaker 1: just what the dolphin be a dolphin? So I don't know, 631 00:33:57,920 --> 00:33:59,400 Speaker 1: I think I think we've covered that. I think we've 632 00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:02,479 Speaker 1: covered the the obsessive nature of scientists. I mean there 633 00:34:02,520 --> 00:34:06,400 Speaker 1: are so many more examples, um, which we make it 634 00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:09,280 Speaker 1: too in future podcast. Yeah. I mean there's god Tycho. 635 00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:12,000 Speaker 1: I mean that's he's he could have his own podcast 636 00:34:12,680 --> 00:34:15,239 Speaker 1: and does actually the stuff you missed in the History 637 00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:19,080 Speaker 1: Class podcast. That's right. Yeah, they should have one out now. Yeah, 638 00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:21,520 Speaker 1: you guys should check that out. Um. But I'm also 639 00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:25,400 Speaker 1: even thinking about the Manhattan Project physicist Richard Feynman, who 640 00:34:25,480 --> 00:34:29,080 Speaker 1: decoded mine hieroglyphics and picklocks in his spare time. I 641 00:34:29,080 --> 00:34:31,360 Speaker 1: mean again, there's just there's like a million examples of 642 00:34:31,360 --> 00:34:34,920 Speaker 1: this obsessive nature. And thank goodness because I mean so 643 00:34:34,960 --> 00:34:38,200 Speaker 1: many of the discoveries that we get to enjoy now 644 00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:40,520 Speaker 1: wouldn't have happened if if you didn't have that kind 645 00:34:40,560 --> 00:34:44,400 Speaker 1: of mind working on the problem exactly. Yeah. And speaking 646 00:34:44,440 --> 00:34:48,640 Speaker 1: of that, what's going on with the listener email? Oh yes, 647 00:34:48,680 --> 00:34:51,520 Speaker 1: we do have some listener email here. You know, we 648 00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:54,000 Speaker 1: have a couple of comments here from readers on our 649 00:34:54,040 --> 00:34:58,480 Speaker 1: Facebook page, um, Lisette points out, and these are both 650 00:34:58,560 --> 00:35:02,560 Speaker 1: in response to our inside Out podcast version. The version yeah, 651 00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:05,160 Speaker 1: she said, quote, uh, this is a little behind, but 652 00:35:05,239 --> 00:35:07,960 Speaker 1: the info gleaned about aversion from your podcast made for 653 00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:10,960 Speaker 1: a very funny dinner date with my man. Way to 654 00:35:11,040 --> 00:35:13,640 Speaker 1: keep the spark in my relationship, which is great. That 655 00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:16,640 Speaker 1: was a sexy, sexy podcast. It was Yeah. I mean 656 00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:19,480 Speaker 1: that that's what we were going for, so that that's cool. 657 00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:25,600 Speaker 1: Um and then um Cynthy responded to our discussion about 658 00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:28,640 Speaker 1: the sea cucumber, and she says, quote, I just listen 659 00:35:28,680 --> 00:35:31,279 Speaker 1: to your podcast regarding things that turn inside out. I 660 00:35:31,320 --> 00:35:33,520 Speaker 1: just wanted you to know that I believe sea cucumbers 661 00:35:33,560 --> 00:35:36,080 Speaker 1: an acquired taste. My sister doesn't like it, and every 662 00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:38,240 Speaker 1: time I go to a Chinese restaurant with my family, 663 00:35:38,440 --> 00:35:40,840 Speaker 1: my mom always orders the cea cucumber dish because she 664 00:35:40,880 --> 00:35:45,319 Speaker 1: knows I love them. They taste very good, so you know, 665 00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:47,719 Speaker 1: I have to take her on that. And I mean, 666 00:35:48,320 --> 00:35:51,200 Speaker 1: you've got an entire culture that, like we said, has 667 00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:55,280 Speaker 1: dedicated a thousand high coup because the humble sea cucumber, 668 00:35:55,560 --> 00:35:58,160 Speaker 1: so we can only assume that they are absolutely delicious. 669 00:35:58,320 --> 00:35:59,800 Speaker 1: I need to try it the next time at a 670 00:36:00,000 --> 00:36:04,440 Speaker 1: strong I wish I weren't a vegetarian. I'd join you. 671 00:36:04,719 --> 00:36:06,440 Speaker 1: So if you want to learn more about these topics, 672 00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:09,160 Speaker 1: be sure and check out Well, first of all, we 673 00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:11,600 Speaker 1: do you have the podcasts Are You Smarter than a Dolphin? 674 00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:15,719 Speaker 1: And uh? Jessica Toothman wrote an excellent article titled our 675 00:36:15,840 --> 00:36:18,399 Speaker 1: Humans the Smartest Animal, which is a nice look at 676 00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:22,319 Speaker 1: human intellect compared to others and U. And then also 677 00:36:22,440 --> 00:36:24,279 Speaker 1: there's If you want to have learned a little more 678 00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:28,359 Speaker 1: about the rise of science and guys like Kepler, then 679 00:36:28,440 --> 00:36:31,839 Speaker 1: check out How the Enlightenment Worked by Christen Conger. And 680 00:36:32,000 --> 00:36:34,680 Speaker 1: if you want to learn more about John C. Lily 681 00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:38,040 Speaker 1: and Margaret how check out the Mental Plus article called 682 00:36:38,160 --> 00:36:41,759 Speaker 1: four experiments that should never be recreated right. And also 683 00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:44,360 Speaker 1: John C. Lily's website is still up. It was the 684 00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:46,520 Speaker 1: website that he that was maintained during while he was 685 00:36:46,520 --> 00:36:49,480 Speaker 1: still alive and has continued to remain online since his 686 00:36:49,560 --> 00:36:52,440 Speaker 1: death in two thousand one. It is awesome. It's a 687 00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:56,400 Speaker 1: maze of of of of interesting content, including this this 688 00:36:56,520 --> 00:36:59,680 Speaker 1: really cool gift image where it's like Lily, um, you know, 689 00:37:00,719 --> 00:37:03,920 Speaker 1: like older, older white dude, white hair, and he has 690 00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:07,040 Speaker 1: this like some sort of like psychedelic squirrel going on 691 00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:09,279 Speaker 1: in his forehead and then there's like a dolphin on 692 00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:11,760 Speaker 1: each side of him. It's it's great entering the portal 693 00:37:12,080 --> 00:37:15,200 Speaker 1: into his brain exactly, and be sure to check out 694 00:37:15,400 --> 00:37:18,400 Speaker 1: again Facebook and Twitter. We are blow the mind on 695 00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:21,120 Speaker 1: both of those. We keep that updated with all sorts 696 00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:24,960 Speaker 1: of cool how stuff works article links, uh blog links, 697 00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:27,400 Speaker 1: as as well as links to other interesting things on 698 00:37:27,440 --> 00:37:30,239 Speaker 1: the web that we just happened across every day. And 699 00:37:30,360 --> 00:37:32,759 Speaker 1: drop us a line at blow the mind at how 700 00:37:32,800 --> 00:37:35,799 Speaker 1: stuff works dot com. Yeah, tell us what blows your mind? 701 00:37:35,800 --> 00:37:37,600 Speaker 1: Do you find some sort of you know, cool bit 702 00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:40,040 Speaker 1: of science that you run across on the web or 703 00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:42,080 Speaker 1: in your research, you know, especially if you're like a 704 00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:44,640 Speaker 1: professional scigns, let us know, because you know, this is 705 00:37:44,680 --> 00:37:46,560 Speaker 1: not just what blows our minds, what blows your so 706 00:37:47,520 --> 00:37:49,799 Speaker 1: clue us in all right, yep, blow the mind at 707 00:37:49,840 --> 00:37:55,920 Speaker 1: how stuff works dot com. For more on this and 708 00:37:56,000 --> 00:37:58,640 Speaker 1: thousands of other topics, visit how stuff works dot com. 709 00:37:58,920 --> 00:38:01,040 Speaker 1: To learn more about the pie Cast, click on the 710 00:38:01,040 --> 00:38:03,880 Speaker 1: podcast icon in the upper right corner of our homepage. 711 00:38:04,640 --> 00:38:07,240 Speaker 1: The House stuff Works iPhone app has a ride. Download 712 00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:08,680 Speaker 1: it today on iTunes