Speaker 1: My next guest is a veteran music and pop culture
Speaker 1: journalist who hosts the popular Torrey Show. He's back to
Speaker 1: discuss the case of Luigi Mangioni, the alleged killer of
Speaker 1: United Healthcare CEO Brian Thompson. We're also gonna touch on
Speaker 1: Sean Dinny Combs just the second as well. You know
Speaker 1: how that involves, whether or not that involves rapper jay Z.
Speaker 1: We'll get into all of that. The one and only
Speaker 1: Torrey is here with me right now. What's going on, man?
Speaker 1: How are you? How's everything?
Speaker 2: I'm good? Tell him about my show Rap Latte on YouTube.
Speaker 2: We talk about hip hop every day. We keep it
Speaker 2: real Rap Latte. I mean that's right, every day, right?
Speaker 2: Is it five days week?
Speaker 3: Well, we're gonna we're ramping up to five days a week,
Speaker 3: but we're we're on like four days now.
Speaker 2: But it's you know, business, we're doing it out here.
Speaker 2: That's right. You deserve it.
Speaker 1: You deserve it. But that's not what you're here to
Speaker 1: talk about today. Because I'm here thinking there's a lot
Speaker 1: of things you could have talked to me about. I
Speaker 1: couldn't believe when my staff reached out to me and
Speaker 1: said Torre wants to come back on the show because
Speaker 1: I had the audacity, to unmitigated goal to call this
Speaker 1: good Luis g man GIONI.
Speaker 2: I said, if that.
Speaker 1: Is him, he is guilty of cold blooded murder, shooting
Speaker 1: Brian Thompson, a former CEO of United Healthcare. I mean
Speaker 1: shooting him in the back, murdering him. This is not
Speaker 1: somebody that should be celebrated. And I'm hearing for that reason,
Speaker 1: Torrey wanted to come on the shore.
Speaker 2: And talk to me about it. What could the possibility
Speaker 2: I talk about? I felt like you were.
Speaker 3: Kind of scolding us the masses for seeing value in
Speaker 3: Luigi and what he did. I felt like, not only you,
Speaker 3: but there was a lot of high level media people,
Speaker 3: Chris Cuomo, actually Banfield, Sarah Haynes of The View, I
Speaker 3: could go on and on, Gail King, who were scolding us,
Speaker 3: saying we should not root for this person, we should
Speaker 3: not respect this person.
Speaker 2: He's like you already think what's wrong with that blooded murderer?
Speaker 2: He's a cold blood furderer, is he not.
Speaker 3: I think that that is accurate, But I also think
Speaker 3: that we have to We cannot have a conversation about
Speaker 3: Louis without talking about what Brian Thompson and United health
Speaker 3: Hair kept doing and the murder's plural that they have
Speaker 3: been responsible for for many, many years.
Speaker 2: And I'm not even talk about the uninsured.
Speaker 3: I'm talking about the insured who they turn their back on,
Speaker 3: they betray, and I also deny claims from a third
Speaker 3: of their claims.
Speaker 2: Right, So we're talking about.
Speaker 3: People who are getting who need life saving help, and
Speaker 3: United health Care is not there for them, saying like, well,
Speaker 3: you know that person has cancer. If we don't give
Speaker 3: them help, they're gonna die and then we won't have
Speaker 3: to pay their bills.
Speaker 2: This is a large part of how they make their money.
Speaker 3: So we cannot have any conversation about Luigi unless we're
Speaker 3: also talking about the thousands and thousands of deaths that
Speaker 3: Brian and United Healthcare are on the hook for. So
Speaker 3: now from that perspective, things are a lot different, Right.
Speaker 3: It's not just one person committed cold blooded murder, which
Speaker 3: he did. He laid he laid in wait for him,
Speaker 3: he decided to kill it me clear. I mean it's
Speaker 3: a political murder, right, He's trying to make a political
Speaker 3: statement about this company. Come off harmful, Come on to American.
Speaker 1: Come on to our rant. You gotta be kid, you
Speaker 1: got it? What are you gonna really say that?
Speaker 2: Listen? Listen.
Speaker 1: First of all, let me say this.
Speaker 2: I saw D L.
Speaker 1: Hughgley on social media talking about this, and I took
Speaker 1: it and I reposted it because I wanted everybody to
Speaker 1: see what he had to say. Under no circumstances. Am
Speaker 1: I absolving any healthcare CEO who has engaged.
Speaker 2: In such practices of they all have, which they are.
Speaker 2: That's that's where I was going with this.
Speaker 1: They all have because we live in a capitalistic society
Speaker 1: and people trying to get as much money as they can,
Speaker 1: so they're trying to get as much as your money
Speaker 1: and give you the least in return. We lament that
Speaker 1: with every practically every business right now. I think that's right.
Speaker 2: But I don't think anybody. I don't think anybody anything different.
Speaker 3: But it's different when Coca Cola is watering down the
Speaker 3: Coca Cola little bit to give you ninety five percent
Speaker 3: Coca Cola instead of one hundred, versus a healthcare company
Speaker 3: say we're going to deny your claims so that we
Speaker 3: can make more money.
Speaker 1: I t I totally, But listen to what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: I get that, But my point to you is this,
Speaker 1: this was some middle class dude or well to do
Speaker 1: who who wasn't from Who wasn't some impoveriaged dude, some
Speaker 1: member of a disadvantised community.
Speaker 3: I know.
Speaker 2: Matter.
Speaker 1: Here my point, Here my point, and then I'll give
Speaker 1: you an opportunity to respond. My point is he wasn't
Speaker 1: that dude. So when he's speaking to such things, we
Speaker 1: don't know how much how close he is to a
Speaker 1: situation like this. How does this hit him home. I'm
Speaker 1: saying there are some people out there who just want
Speaker 1: to murder and find any excuse that they could get
Speaker 1: away with Torrey to do it.
Speaker 2: That's the point that I made.
Speaker 3: Do you do you do you think that white people
Speaker 3: had no place during slavery to be abolitionists even though
Speaker 3: they were not slaves?
Speaker 2: Of course not.
Speaker 3: Do you think that men don't have a to argue
Speaker 3: for women to have the right to choose what they
Speaker 3: do with their bodies?
Speaker 2: Of course right?
Speaker 3: I mean like you don't have to be you don't
Speaker 3: have to be specifically within the group to fight for
Speaker 3: the political rights of that To say that said Luigi
Speaker 3: came from money, so he can't have no we have
Speaker 3: no idea what he went through. His back surgery and
Speaker 3: his back issues were clearly a very deep part of
Speaker 3: his identity. He had a photograph of his X ray
Speaker 3: of his back on his Instagram page right right on.
Speaker 3: That's one of his bio photographs. So that is clearly
Speaker 3: a huge part of his identity and how he sees himself.
Speaker 3: He went through an insane personal situation that we don't
Speaker 3: even know the depths of with his back and his
Speaker 3: back surgery and clearly dealing with insurance companies as part
Speaker 3: of this. This is a class warfare issue, but it's
Speaker 3: not the rich against the poor. It's the people against
Speaker 3: the corporations that damage our lives. And even though he
Speaker 3: even though he has money, he still is dealing with
Speaker 3: a situation from the healthcare people that he's so enraged
Speaker 3: that he does something. Most of us look at that
Speaker 3: and say, I wouldn't have done it, but I understand,
Speaker 3: and that's the core of the issue.
Speaker 2: He is but a player in this.
Speaker 3: When you see the country respond over forty percent supportively
Speaker 3: to what he did, what we have to say is
Speaker 3: not you shouldn't feel that way, but why does everyone
Speaker 3: agree with what he did.
Speaker 2: Well, time out, time out.
Speaker 1: First of all, forty one percent, ain't everybody that's number one,
Speaker 1: number two.
Speaker 2: No, that's forty one.
Speaker 3: Now, that's forty one percent of under thirtyty Okay, that's
Speaker 3: forty one percent.
Speaker 2: You're right, forty one tremendous about him.
Speaker 1: Agreement totally set total seventeen percent forty one percent under
Speaker 1: the age of thirty thirty to thirty nine yearld that
Speaker 1: apply for.
Speaker 2: Twenty not seventeen. It's not seventeen. I'll tell you that
Speaker 2: right now in the real world. It's not seventeen per Well,
Speaker 2: that's what they put out there. They more than that.
Speaker 2: That's what they put out there. But I got it.
Speaker 1: Just for the purposes of this discussion, we'll go with
Speaker 1: that for the moment. All I'm trying to say to
Speaker 1: you is this, I don't disagree with your premis. I'm
Speaker 1: I'm for that, But in the same breath, what I'm
Speaker 1: saying is, considering the time, in the visit of times
Speaker 1: that we live in, you don't think it's dangerous for
Speaker 1: people to be out there applauding somebody being murdered. Now,
Speaker 1: I understand that you're saying that they're not necessarily applauding
Speaker 1: that it's the system taking advantage of the little guy.
Speaker 1: You're a health insurance agency, your corporate America, and you're
Speaker 1: abusing the American citizen.
Speaker 2: I got that part.
Speaker 1: Shit, I'm one of them.
Speaker 2: My point to you is this.
Speaker 1: I still can't sit up there when I see a
Speaker 1: man get shot in the back, gunned down and gunned
Speaker 1: down in the streets, shot in the back, murdered, wife's
Speaker 1: a widower, children, no longer a father, and think that
Speaker 1: that's a course for celebration. I'm saying, is there not
Speaker 1: something to be concerned about that in our society?
Speaker 3: I think that you are not yet understanding the moral
Speaker 3: stakes that were actually seeing. Let's say you saw somebody
Speaker 3: murder a serial killer, would you say, oh my god,
Speaker 3: he was a son and a father. No, thank god,
Speaker 3: somebody took him off the earth.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 3: There is no serial killer that you could name who
Speaker 3: is responsible for more deaths than United Healthcare. So now
Speaker 3: Luigi took it on himself to bring pain to the
Speaker 3: head of United Healthcare because he saw them as serial killers.
Speaker 3: And if you see them as legalized serial killers, which
Speaker 3: they are allowed to betray their customers to make a buck.
Speaker 2: Well, then the moral stakes are completely different. He didn't
Speaker 2: just murder a person walking down the street.
Speaker 3: He murdered the tip of the spear to send a
Speaker 3: message to the entire industry.
Speaker 1: And so you're okay with that? What if the mindset
Speaker 1: is that's just the first one. What about the people
Speaker 1: that had you know, posts out there with the faces
Speaker 1: and names of other healthcare CEOs and they had Brian
Speaker 1: Thompson's face when they with an X over it like
Speaker 1: one down and these others to go? Is that okay?
Speaker 3: What's not okay is for the conversation to become about
Speaker 3: the rage that we have towards CEOs, as if that
Speaker 3: is the central part of the conversation. The central part
Speaker 3: of the conversation is how the healthcare industry is allowed
Speaker 3: to betray its customers and allow them to die and
Speaker 3: be in pain and be sick so that they can
Speaker 3: make a buck. We need far greater regulation on the
Speaker 3: healthcare system. That is the core issue in this conversation.
Speaker 3: And if we miss that, then we miss an opportunity
Speaker 3: to make change in an incredibly important industry in our country.
Speaker 1: Well, first of all, let me say this, I completely
Speaker 1: agree with you that's an issue that we shouldn't miss.
Speaker 1: I'm not arguing with that. I'm just talking about the
Speaker 1: danger that exists from the other side. Because listen, healthcare
Speaker 1: is one issue. There's plenty of things that we can
Speaker 1: look at in the system that exists within the United
Speaker 1: States where regulations need to be altered to some degree,
Speaker 1: things need to be addressed. The system continuously takes it
Speaker 1: vantage of the American citizen, et cetera, et cetera. There's
Speaker 1: an abundance of things that we can look at. But
Speaker 1: our answer to it, if it's going to be violent,
Speaker 1: and that's okay, what kind of society is let's say that.
Speaker 1: Does it say that we have laying down the pipe
Speaker 1: for us?
Speaker 3: What we're not saying that we live in a civilized
Speaker 3: or a peaceful American society?
Speaker 2: Right? We are a wash in guns and violence.
Speaker 3: We just add a female school shooter like we're breaking
Speaker 3: new grounds. We have DEI and school shooting now, like
Speaker 3: we have school shooters that are constant.
Speaker 2: We have all kinds of violence.
Speaker 3: Don't get me even started on state sponsored violence, the
Speaker 3: police and the military and the sort of things that
Speaker 3: we're allowed. I mean, we are constantly dealing with things
Speaker 3: in a violent way. So we are not a peaceful
Speaker 3: or civilized society by any stretch. Obviously, I do not
Speaker 3: think that everybody should handle their disagreement with the healthcare
Speaker 3: industry in this way. But this conversation cannot evolve into
Speaker 3: that young man should not have killed somebody. Obviously he
Speaker 3: should not have killed somebody. But even more important, the
Speaker 3: health care industry must be rained in and the way
Speaker 3: that it is allowed to behave legally in a completely
Speaker 3: immoral way.
Speaker 2: That is the core of this conversation.
Speaker 1: Completely in moral way. So, in other words, in the
Speaker 1: society that we're living in right now, when you're trying
Speaker 1: to listen, I agree with you, and the way you
Speaker 1: broke it down, I agree with you. There's no disagreement here.
Speaker 1: I'm just making the argument that could be an issue.
Speaker 1: No matter where you turn to, you're isolating the issue
Speaker 1: of health care, because obviously that's.
Speaker 2: A very profound thing.
Speaker 1: Once health obviously, your livelihood, your quality of life, et cetera,
Speaker 1: et cetera. It's all affected.
Speaker 2: By your health.
Speaker 1: I don't give it damn how much money you have.
Speaker 1: If your health ain't good, you ain't good. You can't
Speaker 1: enjoy the fruits of your labor. I understand that part,
Speaker 1: but other people with that mindset it might translate to
Speaker 1: anything far removed from health care. Just because they feel
Speaker 1: like they're getting taken advantage of by the system, that
Speaker 1: may be a for them to engage in such heinous acts.
Speaker 1: And we can't ignore that either.
Speaker 3: Don't focus in this conversation. Don't just focus on Luigi
Speaker 3: did x. Oh my god, what does that mean to society? Okay,
Speaker 3: there is a reason why he engaged in that. And
Speaker 3: when you see millions of people across the country celebrating
Speaker 3: somebody for bringing pain like that to the healthcare industry,
Speaker 3: you have to say, why is it that so many
Speaker 3: people agree with his action and are cheering on his action.
Speaker 3: That's where I am That's what I am motivated by.
Speaker 3: Why are people feeling that way? Rather than telling them
Speaker 3: they shouldn't feel that way. I think media has a
Speaker 3: responsibility to report the truth and to speak truth to power.
Speaker 3: And when we are reporting the truth, we have to say,
Speaker 3: why are all these people so happy that this happened?
Speaker 3: We cannot say you guys should not feel that way.
Speaker 3: And like when you we wag our finger at the
Speaker 3: people and say you should not feel that way. We
Speaker 3: are completely missing what is really going on.
Speaker 1: I don't think we're missing what's going on. I get
Speaker 1: your point, and I think it's valid. I just think
Speaker 1: that you're pointing people like myself, Gail King and others
Speaker 1: were pointing to the celebration or the I'm going to say,
Speaker 1: the celebration, that kind of vibe that was out there
Speaker 1: when a person was murdered, and I think that ultimately
Speaker 1: that's the scary part because it provides justification for such
Speaker 1: a haintous act. I get what you're saying. Though you're
Speaker 1: not wrong. I'm not trying to say that you're wrong,
Speaker 1: and you are right. As media members, we do need
Speaker 1: to look into why people feeling that way. That is
Speaker 1: just as important as what happened. But I also think
Speaker 1: that we can't minimize the word celebration in terms of
Speaker 1: how it came across in the eyes of some people
Speaker 1: that were disseminating that kind of message to the masters.
Speaker 2: I'm happy it happened. I don't care that this guy
Speaker 2: was murdered.
Speaker 1: This is what United Healthcare CEO was doing. Guess what
Speaker 1: if it happens to somebody, Oh's good. That was the attitude,
Speaker 1: and I don't know if that's good for our society, bro,
Speaker 1: I just don't.
Speaker 3: I mean, there's there is an anti corporate mood in
Speaker 3: the country for a reason, because our country is shaped
Speaker 3: by what the wealthy and what the corporations want. There's
Speaker 3: a very low correlation between what the masses want and
Speaker 3: what d C does, and a very high correlation because
Speaker 3: what the corporations want and what right and what the
Speaker 3: court what DC does. People are angry about that. People
Speaker 3: are angry about this massive wealth gap that we have.
Speaker 2: People are completely.
Speaker 3: Missing the point when they say, Brian Tubson came from
Speaker 3: humble background, which he did public school, Iowa farmer father.
Speaker 3: But he became part of the extreme wealth class. And
Speaker 3: did he remember that he came from a working class
Speaker 3: or a lower middle class background when he became extremely wealthy,
Speaker 3: did he did he think about that when people had
Speaker 3: claims and couldn't pay them and he and IT couldn't
Speaker 3: pay for their health care and he refused their claims,
Speaker 3: did he think about that? I mean, he's not. The
Speaker 3: New York Times tried to call him a working class hero.
Speaker 3: He is a working class trader. Like we need to
Speaker 3: talk about that.
Speaker 1: I don't recall anybody calling him a working class hero.
Speaker 1: That's news to me.
Speaker 2: I missed the Brett the New York Times.
Speaker 3: I missed that one, Brett Stevens, Brett Stevens, New York Times.
Speaker 1: All right, that's one individual of the New York Times.
Speaker 1: Everybody's got their opinion. I get that part, Tore. I
Speaker 1: appreciate it, man, I can't.
Speaker 2: I listen.
Speaker 1: I can't argue your point. You're absolutely right, especially me
Speaker 1: being in the media along with the rest of us.
Speaker 1: You are absolutely right that there should be a spotlight
Speaker 1: placed on the dissent that people feel, to discuss that
Speaker 1: people feel as to why this stuff happened, getting to
Speaker 1: the biggest issue about really really being against corporate America
Speaker 1: and what it's done to the American citizens, particularly with
Speaker 1: the new administration coming in the office of what people
Speaker 1: are anticipating may happen for those, you know, for the
Speaker 1: wealthy amongst them. Absolutely right, There's no doubt about that,
Speaker 1: So I can't knock it. I was just saying, look,
Speaker 1: you're out in the streets. You know a dude got murdered. Now,
Speaker 1: that ain't a reason to celebrate. That's all I was
Speaker 1: trying to see but I got your point. I got
Speaker 1: your point. And I've been in a situation as you have,
Speaker 1: where most of our life, he found a situation where
Speaker 1: corporate America hasn't been there for us at all. We
Speaker 1: didn't go out and shoot anybody. That's all I'm saying.
Speaker 1: That's all I'm saying. I get your point. You're not wrong,
Speaker 1: You're not wrong. I'm just saying, we didn't go out
Speaker 1: there and shoot somebody in the back and gun him down.
Speaker 2: That's not you know.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 2: I don't know where you got in the back. I
Speaker 2: haven't seen the full footage. I don't think it was
Speaker 2: in the back. I don't know why. I don't know
Speaker 2: why we keep going back to the well. I guess
Speaker 2: I guess that's where he was when he got shut.
Speaker 1: I'm I'm only assuming that because I saw him point
Speaker 1: in the gun, and then while the guy was walking
Speaker 1: and his back was turned, and I saw a report
Speaker 1: that said.
Speaker 2: No, I don't, but I don't. I don't.
Speaker 3: I don't think that that batters as far as the
Speaker 3: relationship to it doesn't. The healthcare industry and the way
Speaker 3: that all these people feel, I've never seen in my
Speaker 3: life such a stark divide between the way the media
Speaker 3: class is discussing something and the way the people feel.
Speaker 3: And we saw such a stark divide that I felt
Speaker 3: I had to speak about it on social media, and
Speaker 3: you know, with folks like you to be like, you know, y'all, y'all,
Speaker 3: y'all need to understand because when it was Maga, when
Speaker 3: Maga rose up, media said we need to understand who
Speaker 3: these people are, right, we also wagged our finger at them,
Speaker 3: but we went to their coffee shops to try to
Speaker 3: figure out who they are.
Speaker 2: And right now, as millions of people are cheering Luigi on, we.
Speaker 3: Need to go into their coffee shops it is and
Speaker 3: figure out who they are, why they feel that way.
Speaker 1: So let the audience know where you're gonna be talking
Speaker 1: about this further, because I know you ain't gonna get
Speaker 1: off this subject.
Speaker 3: I mean, you know you can catch be on rapt
Speaker 3: on YouTube. I'm on my TikTok Toret show. Uh, We're
Speaker 3: gonna talk about on my podcast Tore Show, and you
Speaker 3: know I'll be back here with Steven A.
Speaker 2: Smith next week.
Speaker 1: I appreciate you man, Thanks a lot, bro, thanks a lot,
Speaker 1: so much. Appreciate the education thanks a lot, all right.
Speaker 2: Man, thank you. M m mmmmmmmmm
Speaker 3: Hmm