WEBVTT - Monday’s Mixed Grille 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:03.880 This is the Buck Sexton Show, where the mission or 0:00:03.960 --> 0:00:08.120 mission is to decode what really matters with actionable intelligence. 0:00:10.320 --> 0:00:13.680 Make no Mistake America, Bring You're a great American Again. 0:00:13.800 --> 0:00:20.600 The Buck Sexton Show begins analysts, He's a great guyon 0:00:21.200 --> 0:00:25.200 no Welcome to the Buck Sexton Show. Michael Pelka sitting 0:00:25.200 --> 0:00:27.440 in for my friend Buck Sexton. We are going to 0:00:27.520 --> 0:00:30.520 try and get to everything today. Yes, there's news about 0:00:30.560 --> 0:00:34.160 the bill, about the stimulus, about the relief, about all 0:00:34.200 --> 0:00:36.559 of it. But I am focused on a couple of 0:00:36.640 --> 0:00:40.639 very special issues like the vaccine and the virus. And 0:00:40.760 --> 0:00:45.279 I'm focused on next week and the electoral certification, and 0:00:45.320 --> 0:00:48.120 I'm focused on China and what the heck is going 0:00:48.200 --> 0:00:52.159 on with China, because China senses weakness, at least I 0:00:52.200 --> 0:00:55.360 think they do. So I've reached out to our buddy, 0:00:55.600 --> 0:00:59.520 Gordon Chang, my go to on all things China, to 0:00:59.560 --> 0:01:02.040 find out what the heck we should be paying attention 0:01:02.080 --> 0:01:06.080 to and what if anything, Donald Trump can do or 0:01:06.240 --> 0:01:10.959 should do in the remaining four weeks before January twentieth. 0:01:11.360 --> 0:01:14.440 So he is here with us and we appreciate it. 0:01:14.760 --> 0:01:18.320 Gordon Chang, my friend. Welcome back to the Buck Sexton Show, 0:01:18.520 --> 0:01:21.240 and I hope you had to marry Christmas. Oh well, 0:01:21.280 --> 0:01:24.480 thank you so much, Mike, and merry Christmas and everything 0:01:24.600 --> 0:01:27.960 to you and your listeners. Thank you, thank you, thank you. Now, 0:01:28.000 --> 0:01:30.880 if you guys are not following Gordon Chang on Twitter, 0:01:31.160 --> 0:01:33.120 I don't know what's wrong with you. It's Gordon G. 0:01:33.680 --> 0:01:37.479 Chang on Twitter. Gordon G. Chang. It is just one 0:01:37.520 --> 0:01:41.320 of the best feeds in terms of volume and importance, 0:01:41.560 --> 0:01:45.160 in terms of impact and information, especially as it relates 0:01:45.200 --> 0:01:49.720 to things going on in China and the entire Asian peninsula. Gordon. 0:01:49.880 --> 0:01:54.800 I am hyper focused on China because I'm nervous about 0:01:54.880 --> 0:01:59.320 what could happen with a coming Biden administration, and so 0:01:59.360 --> 0:02:03.080 I'm wondering if we have four weeks left or four 0:02:03.160 --> 0:02:06.400 years left, if there's a miracle for Trump. Do you 0:02:06.520 --> 0:02:08.839 have a list of priorities you would like to see 0:02:08.880 --> 0:02:13.880 addressed with US and China? Oh, I mean, it's just everything. 0:02:14.240 --> 0:02:17.079 The most important thing, Mike is at the United States 0:02:17.840 --> 0:02:24.520 cut contacts with China, trade, investment, diplomatic contacts, technology sharing, 0:02:24.880 --> 0:02:29.120 cultural exchanges. And the reason is that Beijing exploits all 0:02:29.120 --> 0:02:33.080 of those to overthrow our society, and so we have 0:02:33.200 --> 0:02:36.920 not been able to manage that, so we have no 0:02:37.040 --> 0:02:40.560 choice if we want to remain sovereign and free to 0:02:40.639 --> 0:02:44.800 basically get China's regime out of our country. That's going 0:02:44.840 --> 0:02:47.440 to be difficult. I understand a lot of people won't 0:02:47.480 --> 0:02:50.440 agree to that, but we have not been able to 0:02:50.919 --> 0:02:55.440 manage the China relationship on any satisfactory basis, So there's 0:02:55.480 --> 0:03:00.640 no alternative. So you're an advocate of a pretty extreme answer, 0:03:00.680 --> 0:03:06.720 and that is just cut the chord completely with China, trade, manufacturing, everything, 0:03:07.160 --> 0:03:11.240 and that would be a gigantic, multi billion dollars deal. 0:03:11.800 --> 0:03:14.200 It would mean a lot of businesses, a lot of 0:03:14.280 --> 0:03:18.440 high profile businesses like sports like the NBA. How likely 0:03:18.560 --> 0:03:22.480 is that to happen? Gordon? Well, right now it's not. 0:03:22.800 --> 0:03:26.959 But if China were to do something tragic, then yes, 0:03:27.120 --> 0:03:30.360 it would happen almost immediately. You know, we have seen 0:03:30.560 --> 0:03:33.800 China's dangerous intercepts of the US Navy and Air Force 0:03:33.919 --> 0:03:36.960 in the global comments, and we've been very fortunate that 0:03:37.040 --> 0:03:40.600 we haven't lost anybody. But we know that China is 0:03:40.640 --> 0:03:44.840 continuing to provoke US, and we have seen these attempts, 0:03:44.840 --> 0:03:49.880 for instance, to injure our diplomats with OO sonic attacks 0:03:50.000 --> 0:03:54.120 that happened in twenty eighteen in Guangzo, southern China. But 0:03:54.280 --> 0:03:59.360 also remember, China deliberately took steps to spread the coronavirus 0:03:59.400 --> 0:04:03.400 beyond its borders, which means that we have what three 0:04:03.480 --> 0:04:07.160 hundred thirty thousand Americans have died from a disease that 0:04:07.600 --> 0:04:13.440 China maliciously made sure came to America. And you're a 0:04:13.480 --> 0:04:16.839 believer that China has already got a vaccine for the 0:04:16.880 --> 0:04:20.360 coronavirus that they have developed and are giving to their 0:04:20.400 --> 0:04:25.800 own people. Well, China is administering a vaccine, but the 0:04:25.920 --> 0:04:29.520 vaccine has not completed phase three trials, and there are 0:04:29.560 --> 0:04:32.640 some indications that it might not be as effective as 0:04:32.680 --> 0:04:37.080 Beijing says. Chinese propaganda says that there are absolutely no 0:04:37.640 --> 0:04:41.480 instances of side effects, but that's really difficult to believe. 0:04:42.080 --> 0:04:46.479 And this really shows you know, Biden, for instance, has 0:04:46.560 --> 0:04:50.719 said recently that the United States has no leverage over China, 0:04:50.800 --> 0:04:53.400 or insufficient leverage. But let's just take a look at 0:04:53.440 --> 0:04:56.200 this question of a vaccine. China had a head start 0:04:56.240 --> 0:04:59.400 on developing a vaccine and it is nowhere near the 0:04:59.520 --> 0:05:05.159 United State. We've got two very sophisticated vaccines Fiser in Maderna. 0:05:05.400 --> 0:05:09.120 China is way behind us on this. Well, I'm with 0:05:09.200 --> 0:05:13.279 you on that. I think our example is easy to see. 0:05:13.480 --> 0:05:17.880 I'm just curious about China and what their next move is. 0:05:17.960 --> 0:05:21.840 I know Xi Xing Ping has been saying that their 0:05:22.000 --> 0:05:25.719 ultimate goal is to be the dominant economy in the world, 0:05:26.480 --> 0:05:30.040 and it seems like they would need the West and 0:05:30.120 --> 0:05:33.400 the West to be complicit for that to happen. Why 0:05:33.440 --> 0:05:37.080 don't we get some sort of coalition going together, Gordon? 0:05:37.160 --> 0:05:41.120 Why hasn't the United States said to other nations, the 0:05:41.320 --> 0:05:45.200 friendly nations that we do serious business with, Hey, we 0:05:45.240 --> 0:05:48.800 all need to cut the chord with China. Well, I 0:05:48.839 --> 0:05:52.520 think it's because there's Wall Street and very powerful interests 0:05:52.520 --> 0:05:55.960 in the United States that maintain that we should cooperate 0:05:56.000 --> 0:06:00.880 with China, and so that has worked, i think, to 0:06:01.160 --> 0:06:04.640 maintain relations. But we have seen, actually the Trump administration 0:06:04.880 --> 0:06:10.440 makes some significant advances in developing cooperative relationships with allies, 0:06:10.560 --> 0:06:14.159 partners and friends. So, for instance, there's the Quad, which 0:06:14.240 --> 0:06:18.560 is the United States along with Japan, Australia, and India. 0:06:19.080 --> 0:06:22.000 Because we all feel threatened by China. We're starting to 0:06:22.040 --> 0:06:27.320 operationalize that grouping and we're working very closely, so we 0:06:27.360 --> 0:06:30.719 are moving forward on that. Also, in the Middle East, 0:06:31.240 --> 0:06:34.680 effectively you've got well you have the Abraham Accords, and 0:06:34.760 --> 0:06:42.200 that's effectively a coalition against Iran and by implication, against 0:06:42.680 --> 0:06:45.839 China as well. So the Trump administration has done a 0:06:45.880 --> 0:06:48.440 lot in this regard, but obviously we need to do 0:06:48.480 --> 0:06:51.040 a lot more. Yeah, and we only have four weeks 0:06:51.160 --> 0:06:55.000 left on the short end of the Trump administration unless 0:06:55.040 --> 0:06:59.479 some sort of miracle happens on January sixth, which is 0:06:59.640 --> 0:07:04.960 a very very slim possibility. So in four weeks, what 0:07:05.080 --> 0:07:10.119 would you tell Donald Trump to really focus on. I 0:07:10.160 --> 0:07:12.960 think he should focus on Huawei Technologies, which is the 0:07:13.040 --> 0:07:16.320 Chinese telecom equipment manufacturer. They've done a lot in the 0:07:16.400 --> 0:07:20.000 last couple of weeks on making sure that US chip 0:07:20.040 --> 0:07:23.280 technology does not get to China. We should be doing 0:07:23.360 --> 0:07:27.080 even more. We should be making more vigorous efforts to 0:07:27.080 --> 0:07:30.720 get Chinese apps out of our society, like TikTok for instance, 0:07:31.080 --> 0:07:35.680 which I think Beijing is used to inflame violent protests 0:07:35.720 --> 0:07:39.720 in the US. But in any event, China doesn't allow 0:07:39.760 --> 0:07:42.640 our apps in China, so why do we allow Chinese 0:07:42.640 --> 0:07:45.280 apps in our society? This seems to me to be 0:07:45.400 --> 0:07:49.440 fundamentally wrong on so many different levels. And I think 0:07:49.480 --> 0:07:53.120 that President Trump should acknowledge that the Phase one trade deal, 0:07:53.160 --> 0:07:57.000 which was signed on January fifteenth, was a mistake. China 0:07:57.080 --> 0:08:00.000 has not been living up to its commitments to buy 0:08:00.320 --> 0:08:03.360 US goods and services. So I think that President Trump 0:08:03.440 --> 0:08:07.680 should just cancel the deal and further impose more tariffs 0:08:07.720 --> 0:08:10.160 Undersection three or one of the Trade Act of nineteen 0:08:10.200 --> 0:08:13.720 seventy four. There are so many other things that Trump 0:08:13.800 --> 0:08:16.120 can do in those four weeks. Four weeks, there's a 0:08:16.200 --> 0:08:19.320 lot of time, especially because the administration has been thinking 0:08:19.360 --> 0:08:22.960 about these things for months and months and months, So 0:08:23.000 --> 0:08:25.600 they can do this if they want to. Yeah, well 0:08:25.640 --> 0:08:30.640 I hope they would want to because time. Time is 0:08:30.680 --> 0:08:34.280 moving pretty darn quickly, Gordon, and we're not seeing any 0:08:34.360 --> 0:08:37.800 real bending from China. China seems to be very patient, 0:08:38.160 --> 0:08:40.520 and that always seems to be what we've been told. 0:08:40.559 --> 0:08:42.760 They're willing to wait us out because we look for 0:08:42.880 --> 0:08:46.959 instant gratification in the West, but China is very comfortable 0:08:47.040 --> 0:08:50.960 with a slow, patient turn. So how do you deal 0:08:51.000 --> 0:08:55.680 with someone who's patient. Well, there's a number of ways 0:08:55.679 --> 0:08:59.160 to deal with China, because it is extraordinarily dependent on 0:08:59.240 --> 0:09:02.720 the US, and so we need to take advantage of 0:09:02.720 --> 0:09:06.960 that leverage. You know, there's one other thing. Just a 0:09:06.960 --> 0:09:11.920 few hours ago, China sentenced a citizen journalist for four 0:09:12.000 --> 0:09:16.599 years in prison, John John, which shows that China fews 0:09:16.760 --> 0:09:20.079 fears that the truth about the coronavirus epidemic is a 0:09:20.120 --> 0:09:23.280 mortal threat to communist rule. Well, we should be taking 0:09:23.320 --> 0:09:25.800 advantage of that. We should be talking about this in 0:09:25.840 --> 0:09:29.160 a much more vigorous way. We should be demanding independent 0:09:29.200 --> 0:09:33.560 investigations of the source of the coronavirus. Some of the 0:09:33.600 --> 0:09:37.240 steam is going out of that effort. So these are 0:09:37.280 --> 0:09:40.680 things that the Trump administration can do to make a 0:09:40.760 --> 0:09:44.280 fundamental difference in a very short period of time, I hope. 0:09:44.320 --> 0:09:47.360 So we're talking with Gordon Chang. Follow him on Twitter, 0:09:47.520 --> 0:09:51.040 Gordon g Chang, Gordon, I have one last question that's 0:09:51.040 --> 0:09:53.839 been bugging me. A couple of weeks ago, there was 0:09:53.880 --> 0:09:58.760 a breaking news report overnight that there were something like 0:09:58.880 --> 0:10:04.920 one point seven million Chinese spies deployed in various locations 0:10:04.960 --> 0:10:09.240 in the West, in companies and in governments. And this 0:10:09.360 --> 0:10:13.000 was on the heels of the Eric Swalwell's story about 0:10:13.040 --> 0:10:19.520 the honeypot that he had an alleged relationship with. We've 0:10:19.559 --> 0:10:22.760 heard nothing about that list of one point seven million 0:10:22.880 --> 0:10:28.760 Chinese spies. Did that thing just get shredded? Well, yeah, 0:10:28.840 --> 0:10:32.160 that was interesting because that was a list of Communist 0:10:32.160 --> 0:10:35.520 Party members one point nine five million, which was and 0:10:36.320 --> 0:10:39.760 what we learned was that we have Communist Party members 0:10:39.800 --> 0:10:43.040 not only in companies, which we knew because Beijing insists 0:10:43.040 --> 0:10:47.520 on Communist Party seals in large foreign businesses, but also 0:10:47.679 --> 0:10:55.240 in ten consulates in Shanghai, including hours, including Britain's, including Australia's, 0:10:55.840 --> 0:10:59.120 including New Zealand's. That's four of the Five Eyes. The 0:10:59.160 --> 0:11:03.400 five Eyes is the Intelligence Sharing Consortium. So yeah, this 0:11:03.559 --> 0:11:06.079 was quite stunning, and as you say, it came right 0:11:06.120 --> 0:11:10.760 on the heels of the Eric Swalwell revelations, which that 0:11:10.880 --> 0:11:13.520 has yet to be resolved because Swalwell has yet to 0:11:13.559 --> 0:11:16.760 say in public whether he had a personal relationship with 0:11:17.320 --> 0:11:21.120 a suspected Ministry of State Security agent, Christine fog So 0:11:21.160 --> 0:11:23.200 there's a lot more that needs to be done on this. 0:11:23.200 --> 0:11:26.760 This is slow, patient work and it has to be 0:11:27.160 --> 0:11:29.600 you know, the Trump administration is working on it. It 0:11:29.679 --> 0:11:31.800 has to be continued by the Biden team, which I'm 0:11:31.840 --> 0:11:35.400 sure they will because this is so fundamental. I hope 0:11:35.400 --> 0:11:40.360 so from your lips to the next administrations ears, whether 0:11:40.360 --> 0:11:44.200 it's Secretary of State or the intelligence community, I hope 0:11:44.200 --> 0:11:48.000 they all keep pushing on this, and we'll keep pushing 0:11:48.360 --> 0:11:50.920 as well. Gordon Chang is his name. He is might 0:11:50.960 --> 0:11:54.600 go to source on everything it relates to China and 0:11:54.640 --> 0:11:57.800 the Asian Peninsula. He's just a good guy. Follow him 0:11:57.800 --> 0:12:02.280 at Gordon g. Chang on Twitter. Thank you my friend. Well, 0:12:02.320 --> 0:12:04.400 thank you so much, Mike, and have a happy and 0:12:04.440 --> 0:12:07.120 healthy New Year. Thank you Gordon. And there he goes, 0:12:07.320 --> 0:12:10.000 and here I go. Michael Pelka sitting in for my 0:12:10.080 --> 0:12:15.640 friend Buck Sexton on The Buck Sexton Show. You're in 0:12:15.679 --> 0:12:19.280 the Freedom Hunt. This is the Buck Sexton Show podcast. 0:12:23.000 --> 0:12:25.880 Welcome back to the Buck Sexton Show. Michael Pelka sitting 0:12:25.920 --> 0:12:29.080 in for my friend Buck Sexton. Appreciate the opportunity to 0:12:29.160 --> 0:12:31.920 be here. You can follow what I'm up to on 0:12:32.080 --> 0:12:36.040 social media at stunt Brain is my Twitter handle, or 0:12:36.080 --> 0:12:39.360 just look up Michael Pelka. It'll turn up there and 0:12:39.840 --> 0:12:44.160 we can exchange thoughts on many topics. I am not 0:12:44.320 --> 0:12:49.360 saying the name of the bomber from Nashville. The Christmas day, Bomber. 0:12:49.760 --> 0:12:54.440 I will not give any kind of publicity to people 0:12:54.520 --> 0:12:58.720 like that. So, while I am very pleased that the 0:12:58.760 --> 0:13:02.000 men and women of Lawnment were able to put this 0:13:02.200 --> 0:13:07.120 exploded puzzle together in under forty eight hours, figure out 0:13:07.200 --> 0:13:12.120 who this guy was, where he lived, etc. I'm not 0:13:12.200 --> 0:13:15.160 going to say this guy's name. I will salute the 0:13:15.200 --> 0:13:18.040 men and win a law enforcement, especially those who were 0:13:18.120 --> 0:13:23.960 working on Christmas Day, because you know, if you're working 0:13:23.960 --> 0:13:27.320 on Christmas Day, guess what you're low man on the 0:13:27.360 --> 0:13:32.360 totem poll. You are the person who newest to the staff. 0:13:32.480 --> 0:13:35.600 Let's just say so, those cops who were there, the 0:13:35.640 --> 0:13:38.600 men and women who were on the scene in Nashville 0:13:38.640 --> 0:13:43.040 and bravely, bravely dealt with that situation, they deserve all 0:13:43.040 --> 0:13:47.079 the thanks we can possibly give them, so brilliant Good 0:13:47.120 --> 0:13:52.280 for you, Bomber. While I'm kind of glad we saved 0:13:52.280 --> 0:13:55.160 the money, you know, we won't have to have a trial, 0:13:55.760 --> 0:13:58.560 we won't have to incarcerate this person, we won't have 0:13:58.640 --> 0:14:01.439 to pay for them. And God knows that this person 0:14:01.559 --> 0:14:05.520 could have easily said, well, I suddenly feel like I'm 0:14:05.559 --> 0:14:07.960 not a man, I'm a woman. I would like gender 0:14:08.000 --> 0:14:11.600 reassignment surgery, and some judge would allow it to happen. 0:14:12.000 --> 0:14:14.960 So I'm glad that didn't have to happen. And to 0:14:15.160 --> 0:14:21.000 the jack Wagon, the copycat idiot in the box truck 0:14:21.400 --> 0:14:25.720 who was driving around Nashville twenty four hours later playing 0:14:25.760 --> 0:14:29.560 the same kind of message, Yeah, I'm glad you're going 0:14:29.640 --> 0:14:33.160 to have a hard time too. I'm really happy about that. 0:14:33.440 --> 0:14:36.120 These are the kind of people who deserve extra time 0:14:36.120 --> 0:14:40.120 in prison, copycat idiots who think it's funny to drive 0:14:40.160 --> 0:14:43.240 a box truck playing the same kind of message on 0:14:43.360 --> 0:14:48.520 the streets and causing shutdowns of highways, etc. While the 0:14:48.720 --> 0:14:53.840 entire town is on edge. So to that idiot, enjoy 0:14:53.880 --> 0:14:56.800 your time behind bars. Now someone's going to say, no, 0:14:56.840 --> 0:14:59.560 we can't lock them up. Yes you can, and you should. 0:15:01.240 --> 0:15:05.160 I'm just hoping there are no other foolish people out there. 0:15:05.560 --> 0:15:10.160 I did like the fact that the mainstream media actually 0:15:10.280 --> 0:15:14.240 kept its powder dry, and yes, I'm using specifically that 0:15:14.320 --> 0:15:19.560 Analogy kept its powder dry the hours after this explosion 0:15:19.680 --> 0:15:23.520 happened and didn't start placing blame. Maybe we all learned 0:15:23.520 --> 0:15:27.400 our lesson from Richard Jewell, but they weren't looking to 0:15:27.440 --> 0:15:31.920 put this on a Trump supporter. They weren't leaping to conclusions. 0:15:32.360 --> 0:15:36.080 It was all very good. So good job, mainstream media. 0:15:36.480 --> 0:15:38.800 Maybe you got one right. We have a lot of 0:15:38.840 --> 0:15:41.520 other things to cover from the mainstream media tonight, a 0:15:41.600 --> 0:15:45.640 lot of stories to get to, not just the Nashville story, 0:15:46.000 --> 0:15:50.000 but we will have to get to the vaccine and 0:15:50.080 --> 0:15:52.760 the virus. And I'm going to track down my buddy 0:15:53.240 --> 0:15:56.560 from the Cleveland Clinic, doctor Michael Royson, will talk to 0:15:56.640 --> 0:15:59.840 him about what he sees in the world of health. 0:16:00.320 --> 0:16:02.200 I know there are a lot of people are questioning 0:16:02.200 --> 0:16:05.080 the vaccine, and there are a lot of people who 0:16:05.040 --> 0:16:07.840 are saying, oh, I just want to wait until a 0:16:07.920 --> 0:16:11.000 couple hundred million people have taken it. I don't know 0:16:11.080 --> 0:16:14.040 if you're going to have that option. I really don't know. 0:16:14.720 --> 0:16:18.680 We'll also get a hold of Eddie Scary from the 0:16:18.760 --> 0:16:22.120 Washington Examiner. Eddie's a friend of mine. I worked with 0:16:22.240 --> 0:16:27.120 Eddie at the Blaze Full Disclosure and Eddie Wright's opinion columns. 0:16:27.400 --> 0:16:29.440 And it's a pretty good one out that relates to 0:16:30.360 --> 0:16:32.880 whether or not we'll ever go back to working in 0:16:32.960 --> 0:16:38.480 an office. There are some people who say we shouldn't. 0:16:38.800 --> 0:16:42.080 And even if your company allows you to go back 0:16:42.120 --> 0:16:46.360 to work in an office that if people show up 0:16:46.400 --> 0:16:52.160 every day, they have an unfair advantage. I love these 0:16:52.200 --> 0:16:55.120 people who think, well, they're the office Karen's, aren't they. 0:16:55.600 --> 0:16:57.320 So we'll get into that and some of the other 0:16:57.440 --> 0:17:02.600 unfolding stories. Plus I'm obset asked with January sixth, what 0:17:02.800 --> 0:17:06.440 is going to happen in the joint session of Congress 0:17:06.600 --> 0:17:09.960 on January sixth? So I'll tell you what. Why don't 0:17:10.040 --> 0:17:13.919 Why don't we get Fred Lucas from the Daily Signal 0:17:14.040 --> 0:17:16.720 on the phone when we get back, we will break 0:17:16.800 --> 0:17:23.000 down what is going to happen? What might happen in Washington, DC? 0:17:23.280 --> 0:17:28.080 Could Donald Trump pull off the ultimate Hail Mary play? 0:17:28.200 --> 0:17:33.439 Can the contesting of the electors actually make headway? I 0:17:33.480 --> 0:17:37.600 don't know, but it's already built into the constitution for 0:17:37.640 --> 0:17:40.520 people to protest it, and we'll get Fred Lucas to 0:17:40.560 --> 0:17:43.320 break it down for us. That's just around the corner 0:17:43.560 --> 0:17:46.920 on The Buck Sexton Show with me Michael Pelkins sitting 0:17:46.960 --> 0:17:50.520 in for my friend Buck Sexton. Thanks for listening to 0:17:50.520 --> 0:17:54.840 The bus Eston Show podcasts. Remember to subscribe on Apple podcasts, 0:17:55.040 --> 0:17:59.960 the iHeartRadio app, or wherever you get your podcasts. Michael 0:18:00.040 --> 0:18:02.920 Helca sitting it for Buck Sexton on the Buck Sexton Show. 0:18:02.960 --> 0:18:05.640 Glad to be here, And as I mentioned, January sixth 0:18:05.760 --> 0:18:08.360 is going to be an interesting day. It's the day 0:18:08.400 --> 0:18:13.320 that the Electoral College votes are certified in the Joint 0:18:13.359 --> 0:18:19.280 Session of Congress, and something weird, amazing, crazy could happen. 0:18:20.240 --> 0:18:23.199 And so in order to understand what weird, crazy and 0:18:23.240 --> 0:18:26.200 amazing things could happen, I brought in a guy who 0:18:26.240 --> 0:18:31.360 I think understands it all. Fred Lucas from the Daily Signal, 0:18:31.400 --> 0:18:35.000 the chief national correspondent. This guy's an expert on crazy 0:18:35.000 --> 0:18:38.600 stuff happening in elections. His book Taken by suspicion As 0:18:39.119 --> 0:18:42.680 details all of the madness from the past. Fred, I'm 0:18:42.720 --> 0:18:46.120 glad you're here to help us out. Welcome back, my friend. Yeah, 0:18:46.200 --> 0:18:49.000 thanks for having me on. I'm glad you're here because 0:18:49.200 --> 0:18:52.800 everything in my world is pointing for me to get 0:18:52.840 --> 0:18:58.280 my tale to Washington, d C. On January sixth because 0:18:58.359 --> 0:19:03.080 of all of the the anticipation of what's going to 0:19:03.160 --> 0:19:08.880 happen around the certification of the Electoral College count. Um, am, 0:19:08.960 --> 0:19:11.280 I right to be there. Do you think is there 0:19:11.280 --> 0:19:15.120 really going to be some fireworks possibly happening? Well? Well, 0:19:15.119 --> 0:19:21.080 there will be fireworks. UM. Historically this has been a 0:19:21.160 --> 0:19:26.400 sort of a very procedural situation in which the Congress 0:19:26.480 --> 0:19:31.400 simply certifies what the Electoral College already did UM, going 0:19:31.440 --> 0:19:36.639 back to basically an eighteen eighties a law that establishes 0:19:36.680 --> 0:19:42.640 how to do this. However, there have been it's very typical. 0:19:42.840 --> 0:19:46.200 What is very difficult about this year is that, UM, 0:19:47.480 --> 0:19:50.880 there have always every time, I should say every time 0:19:50.960 --> 0:19:56.720 a Republican wins, practically democratic lawmakers and make objections during 0:19:56.800 --> 0:20:00.760 the during the proceedings, and during these certification of the 0:20:00.760 --> 0:20:07.960 electoral college vote usually goes nowhere. However, they usually need 0:20:08.040 --> 0:20:11.120 a Senate sponsor or. They didn't get a Senate sponsor. Notably, 0:20:11.320 --> 0:20:17.200 last time there were a number of members that made 0:20:17.800 --> 0:20:22.200 believe eleven members who made objections to certifying Trump's electoral 0:20:22.240 --> 0:20:25.040 college win. In two thousand and there were I think 0:20:25.080 --> 0:20:29.760 something like twenty objections from House Democrats, and in those 0:20:29.800 --> 0:20:34.320 cases none had a Senate sponsor. So UM. In two 0:20:34.400 --> 0:20:36.720 thousand and five, actually or January two thousand and five, 0:20:36.840 --> 0:20:41.000 there were objections to Bush's victory in Ohio, which is 0:20:41.000 --> 0:20:46.639 what led to defeating John Kerry. That year, there was 0:20:46.800 --> 0:20:50.920 Barbara Boxer. She was kind of not the brightest bulb 0:20:50.960 --> 0:20:53.080 in the Senate, but but she did step forward to 0:20:53.400 --> 0:20:57.760 um to make a sponsor of that objection, and they 0:20:57.800 --> 0:21:00.919 forced a vote on that debate and a vote on 0:21:00.960 --> 0:21:03.600 that that was just simply one state. So it is 0:21:03.600 --> 0:21:08.320 going to it's while it's it's not unprecedented by any means. 0:21:08.359 --> 0:21:11.680 This has happened before, this type of thing. This year, 0:21:11.720 --> 0:21:14.200 it's going to be a lot different than previous years. 0:21:14.600 --> 0:21:18.440 I think you're going to see at least one Senator 0:21:19.440 --> 0:21:25.240 join in sponsoring an objection from probably several House members. Okay, 0:21:25.240 --> 0:21:28.320 and I think you're going to see maybe I am 0:21:29.240 --> 0:21:33.480 two hours debate on each of the six states in 0:21:33.560 --> 0:21:36.920 question here. So we've got a joint session the House 0:21:36.960 --> 0:21:40.359 and the Senator gathered. The Vice President at the time, 0:21:40.400 --> 0:21:43.800 Mike Pencil, will be there, and what they normally would 0:21:43.840 --> 0:21:49.600 do was a ceremonial certification of the Electoral College vote. However, 0:21:50.040 --> 0:21:53.359 in instances in the past, as you mentioned, we have 0:21:53.520 --> 0:21:58.080 seen people stand up and say I object, I protest, 0:21:58.520 --> 0:22:01.320 and if it's a House member who protests, they need 0:22:01.359 --> 0:22:04.760 a member of the Senate to kind of co sign 0:22:04.920 --> 0:22:08.520 their their stuff, right right, right, right, yeah, Yeah, has 0:22:09.160 --> 0:22:12.480 one member from each House, at least one member from 0:22:12.480 --> 0:22:15.920 each hour co sponsor in this and then then if 0:22:15.960 --> 0:22:19.080 that's the case, at that point, it would go to 0:22:19.640 --> 0:22:23.639 both the joint session adjourns. The House goes in the session, 0:22:23.680 --> 0:22:26.920 the Senate goes in the session to debate that objection. 0:22:27.200 --> 0:22:29.879 And is that debate a minimum of two hours or 0:22:29.920 --> 0:22:32.280 a maximum of two hours? Oh, it's it's a maximum 0:22:32.320 --> 0:22:34.400 of two hours. Okay, so they could which is odd 0:22:34.400 --> 0:22:35.840 in Washington. I wish we could do more of that 0:22:35.880 --> 0:22:38.920 in Washington. Yeah, that's a great point, Fred Lucas, that 0:22:39.119 --> 0:22:42.639 is an excellent point. So as somebody stands up, they're 0:22:42.720 --> 0:22:46.919 they're trying to certify the electors from one state, and 0:22:47.040 --> 0:22:49.280 a member of the House stands up and says I 0:22:49.880 --> 0:22:53.359 object to this, and then a senator stands up and 0:22:53.400 --> 0:22:57.840 says I'll second that, and they break and they go 0:22:57.920 --> 0:23:01.880 to their various chambers they were cospective chambers, and they 0:23:01.920 --> 0:23:06.320 have then up to two hours to debate this, right right, yeah, 0:23:06.359 --> 0:23:10.040 and it'll be um, it'll be open debate. So c 0:23:10.240 --> 0:23:13.280 SPAN will probably be an interesting network that day. Um 0:23:14.760 --> 0:23:17.600 yea that they will be uh yeah, they'll be debating, uh, 0:23:18.160 --> 0:23:21.240 I believe that they will be debating each state separately, 0:23:21.600 --> 0:23:24.080 so this can go on for a long time, UM 0:23:25.320 --> 0:23:28.440 debate if they this to the twelve states, so this 0:23:28.480 --> 0:23:32.520 could go past the actual day, This might bleed over 0:23:32.640 --> 0:23:37.040 into the seventh Yeah, yeah, quite likely, am I or 0:23:37.320 --> 0:23:40.080 end of the wee hours? Yes, yeah, maybe midnight that 0:23:40.240 --> 0:23:43.919 they'll make a decision. Now in your article, I noticed 0:23:44.080 --> 0:23:48.280 I know Mo Brooks, Senator Mo Brooks or Congressman Mo 0:23:48.520 --> 0:23:51.639 Books has has been one of the people who stepped forward. 0:23:52.440 --> 0:23:55.680 Are there a number of senators who've actually said I'll 0:23:55.760 --> 0:24:01.479 raise my hand and support any of these objects? Well? Uh, 0:24:02.240 --> 0:24:08.120 Tommy Tuberville, the senator elect from Alabama, which is also 0:24:08.119 --> 0:24:11.560 where whole Books is from, has recently like gave the 0:24:11.640 --> 0:24:15.160 strongest indication that he's going to do it. That would 0:24:15.160 --> 0:24:17.600 probably be one of his first acts as a senator. 0:24:18.400 --> 0:24:22.200 M rand Paul out of Kentucky. UM. I'll get to 0:24:22.240 --> 0:24:24.640 why that's interesting in a minute, but rand Paul says 0:24:24.800 --> 0:24:28.800 he he's open to h sponsoring a challenge. Also, Ron 0:24:28.920 --> 0:24:33.359 Johnson out of Wisconsin UH is also open to sponsoring 0:24:33.359 --> 0:24:38.840 a challenge. Rand Paul is interesting because being from Kentucky, 0:24:39.760 --> 0:24:43.399 that's the same state as Cinemajority leader Mitch McConnell. Mitch 0:24:43.480 --> 0:24:48.000 McConnell is doing all he can to avoid this. He 0:24:48.080 --> 0:24:53.720 doesn't want any of his members sponsoring uh this. He 0:24:53.760 --> 0:24:57.240 would rather this, you know. He he's an old school guy. 0:24:57.440 --> 0:25:00.600 He would rather listen to just kind of formula league 0:25:00.680 --> 0:25:05.639 go on through um um. So, well, we'll see how 0:25:05.640 --> 0:25:07.680 that works. I mean, we've seen Rand Paul and Mitch 0:25:07.720 --> 0:25:10.800 McConnell split on some things in the past. There they're 0:25:10.840 --> 0:25:15.440 pretty different types of Republicans, those two. But I yeah, 0:25:15.480 --> 0:25:20.119 I mean that that's going to be a maybe a 0:25:20.200 --> 0:25:25.000 problem between the leader and some of his troops on that. Okay, 0:25:25.040 --> 0:25:28.720 so we've got these states, possibly six states, seven states, 0:25:28.720 --> 0:25:31.600 I don't know how many states who could have a challenge. 0:25:31.600 --> 0:25:37.040 If any challenge is then debated and supported, what happens 0:25:37.080 --> 0:25:39.440 when they come back from the debate. Do they vote 0:25:39.480 --> 0:25:41.880 on whether or not to accept the challenge? And does 0:25:41.960 --> 0:25:48.159 that then negate those electors? Well, yeah, the most that 0:25:48.200 --> 0:25:53.000 could happen here is that a being of course unlikely, 0:25:54.160 --> 0:25:56.359 But the most that could happen would be that the 0:25:57.280 --> 0:26:01.679 Senate and the House, the poland controlled Senate, the democratically 0:26:01.720 --> 0:26:08.280 controlled House, would determine that certain state or states the 0:26:08.280 --> 0:26:12.639 third electoral votes don't count. What would happen then is 0:26:12.680 --> 0:26:16.320 that it would go to the House of Representatives to 0:26:16.359 --> 0:26:19.800 decide who the president is, because that would that would 0:26:19.880 --> 0:26:23.840 mean neither Biden nor Trump had a majority of Electoral 0:26:24.080 --> 0:26:27.119 College votes of two seventy So that would go to 0:26:27.160 --> 0:26:31.600