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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls podcast, a weekly

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Speaker 1: conversation about mental health, personal development, and all the small

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Speaker 1: decisions we can make to become the best possible versions

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Speaker 1: of ourselves. I'm your host, Dr Joy hard and Bradford,

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Speaker 1: a licensed psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia. For more information or

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Speaker 1: to find a therapist, visit our website at Therapy for

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Speaker 1: Black Girls dot com. And while I hope you love

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Speaker 1: listening to and learning from the podcast, it is not

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Speaker 1: meant to be a substitute for a relationship with a

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Speaker 1: licensed mental health professional. Hey, y'all, thanks so much for

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Speaker 1: joining me for session nine of the Therapy for Black

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Speaker 1: Girls podcasts. In the past few months, there has been

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Speaker 1: lots of talk about toxic masculinity, and I think it's

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Speaker 1: important to recognize that men are the only ones who

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Speaker 1: buy into this system. There's a lot for all of

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Speaker 1: us to unpack to make sure we're doing our part

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Speaker 1: to break down a system that is often limiting and dangerous.

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Speaker 1: What kinds of ways do we need to kind of

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Speaker 1: reframe our thoughts about parenting to make sure that we

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Speaker 1: are raising a healthier generation of boys, Like, Yeah, you know,

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Speaker 1: I think first it's called emotion coaching. We have to

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Speaker 1: teach our boys how to express emotion. But before we

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Speaker 1: jump into today's conversation, I want to share some information

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Speaker 1: When I tell y'all that the moment I started to

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Speaker 1: day dot com. Now, let's get back to our conversation.

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Speaker 1: For this conversation unpacking toxic masculinity, I was joined by

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Speaker 1: Dr Aldawan Tart. Doctor Tart is a psychologist, minister, husband

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Speaker 1: and father of two girls who has twenty years of

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Speaker 1: experience and empowering moms to raise boys into strong men.

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Speaker 1: Dr Tart also specializes in working with couples to have

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Speaker 1: stronger marriages and develop healthy family cultures. He currently consults

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Speaker 1: with the NBA, CNN, h L, d N and appears

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Speaker 1: frequently on Ricky Smiley Radio as the resident psychology expert

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Speaker 1: around relationships and family. Dr Tart and I discussed what

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Speaker 1: is meant by the term toxic masculinity, how it shows

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Speaker 1: up in our lives, and how we can stop perpetuating it,

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Speaker 1: especially in raising our sons. If you hear something that

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Speaker 1: really resonates with you while listening, please be sure to

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Speaker 1: share it with us on social media using the hashtag

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Speaker 1: TBG in session, and don't forget to share your takeaways

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Speaker 1: from the episode with us in your I G stories

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Speaker 1: are on Twitter. Here's our conversation. Well, thank you so

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Speaker 1: much for joining us today, Dr Tart, Hey, I appreciate

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Speaker 1: Dr Joe. You know, I've and I've been begging for

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Speaker 1: this for a long time, even Destiny, So I'm excited.

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Speaker 1: I was playing about about the begging car. You know

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Speaker 1: that I hit you up. I cain't looking for you. Well, No,

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Speaker 1: I'm honored to have you here because I feel like

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Speaker 1: you were one of the first psychologists I saw doing

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Speaker 1: therapy differently, you know, giving psychologists a space to kind

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Speaker 1: of be in the media and you know, talking to

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Speaker 1: people even outside of the office. So I'm just thinkful

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Speaker 1: that you kind of set this path for us. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I'm glad that you upgraded it. We all have

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Speaker 1: our work to do, right, That's right, That's right. I

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Speaker 1: appreciate it. Yeah, So I'm happy that you're here to

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Speaker 1: chat with us today. I know a lot of your

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Speaker 1: work is with moms, helping moms and families raised boys,

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Speaker 1: and so there has been a lot of conversation, particularly

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Speaker 1: in the media, around like masculinity and this whole idea

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Speaker 1: of toxic masculinity. The APIA recently came out with guidelines

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Speaker 1: for treating men and boys. Then we saw this Gillette

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Speaker 1: commercial that talked about you know, is this the best

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Speaker 1: of man? Can really be. So I'm curious just to

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Speaker 1: hear your thoughts about why this has become such a

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Speaker 1: hot topic right now. I mean, I think we saw

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Speaker 1: it open up with Pastor John Gray when he talked about,

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Speaker 1: you know, expectations he had of his wife to kind

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Speaker 1: of raise him. That's the first time I saw it

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Speaker 1: really being you know, opened up, you know, the last

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Speaker 1: couple of months about you know, what a woman's role

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Speaker 1: is as far as being a male. I think that

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Speaker 1: was the first thing. And then you know the R

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Speaker 1: Kelly of the r Kelly scandal, Charlemagne, the guy coming

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Speaker 1: out talking about the fact that he has opened about

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Speaker 1: having an anxiety disorder. I think all three of those

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Speaker 1: conversations kind of laid the framework for us to be

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Speaker 1: able to talk about what is manhood, what is healthy

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Speaker 1: versus what is unhealthy? Got it? And so you know

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Speaker 1: the term that has kind of been thrown around a

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Speaker 1: lot too, is this whole idea of toxic masculinity right

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Speaker 1: any more? About what that is? What do people mean

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Speaker 1: when they use that term, Well, when you identify with

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Speaker 1: the parts of being a man and it actually hurts people,

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Speaker 1: So your masculinity actually hurts other people. So we when

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Speaker 1: we look at most of the homicides I believe I

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Speaker 1: read close those are done by men. If we're in

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Speaker 1: a relationship and I don't believe that it's manly to

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Speaker 1: express my emotions while being an emotional relationship with my wife,

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Speaker 1: that's toxic masculinity because the things that limit me as

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Speaker 1: a man now limit the relationship. You know, If I

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Speaker 1: believe that it's not manly enough for me to allow

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Speaker 1: my wife to to take the lead, even though she's

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Speaker 1: more talented, and I oppress her, our attempt to oppress

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Speaker 1: her in our relationship are in business, that is toxic masculinity.

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Speaker 1: It's where your masculinity becomes something that actually hurts other people.

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Speaker 1: And so what are some of the characteristics of that

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Speaker 1: What are some of the qualities you think of masculinity

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Speaker 1: that that can be toxic? Oh, my goodness, I can

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Speaker 1: give you a whole laundry list, all right. So one,

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Speaker 1: men don't show pain. That basically means we're a lamp. Oh,

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Speaker 1: we're a couch. We have we have no feelings. But

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Speaker 1: when we teach our sons, hey don't show any pain,

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Speaker 1: you know, don't cry, you know, after the death of

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Speaker 1: someone we love, or after being disappointed. I mean that

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Speaker 1: basically says stop stop being human. I think that is toxic.

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Speaker 1: An example of toxic masculinity. Another example of toxic masculinity

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Speaker 1: is where a male feels like, just by privilege, he

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Speaker 1: should be the leader. So he doesn't look and see

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Speaker 1: who's the most talented in the work group. He just

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Speaker 1: feels that by his natural right of being a male,

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Speaker 1: and he showing us to society that he should be

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Speaker 1: the leader. That actually is a bad decision making process

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Speaker 1: because you're not looking at talent and what's best for

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Speaker 1: the business. You're just looking at who's male versus female.

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Speaker 1: That is oppressive, and it's also bad business because you're

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Speaker 1: squelching your talent because we know some talent is gonna

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Speaker 1: be males, and talent is gonna be female. It's gonna

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Speaker 1: be diverse. Talent is talent. Think. Another example of toxic

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Speaker 1: masculinity is where you feel it's not it's not manly

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Speaker 1: for you to go to counseling. That's a big one.

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Speaker 1: I know you deal with that. It's not manly for

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Speaker 1: you to admit that you need wise counsel when it

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Speaker 1: comes to your marriage, your relationship, dealing with stress, dealing

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Speaker 1: with anxiety, dealing with anger. That is another idea of

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Speaker 1: toxic masculinity, because typically that man is attached to some

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Speaker 1: type of family or some type of group. And if

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Speaker 1: you don't deal with your stuff, then you put your

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Speaker 1: stuff on the people you say you care about and love.

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Speaker 1: So all of this is making perfect sense. Of course,

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Speaker 1: when you say, a doctor tard like it sounds like

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Speaker 1: why would anybody fight against all of the things that

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Speaker 1: you just said? Well, what do you think is the

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Speaker 1: disconnect for people? Like what what do you feel like

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Speaker 1: people are still holding onto when they want to hold

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Speaker 1: onto these traditional ideas about masculinity. I mean, you know,

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Speaker 1: Dr Jorge, that's a great question. I think one is

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Speaker 1: what a man is, and so it's it's holding onto

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Speaker 1: toxic tradition. So men don't go to counseling. My granddaddy

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Speaker 1: never went to counseling. Never mind, you're grand that he

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Speaker 1: drank himself to death. You see what I'm saying, went

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Speaker 1: through three or four marriages. So I think a lot

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Speaker 1: of it is tradition. And then I think that we

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Speaker 1: just are resistant to change, We don't like change, and

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Speaker 1: think about and think about what that means. You know

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Speaker 1: for a man that I have to redefine manhood, which

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Speaker 1: means that the things that I thought were central and

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Speaker 1: agreed upon as a man, I now see as a weakness.

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Speaker 1: So my refusal to go to counseling is now a weakness.

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Speaker 1: My refusal to let another person guide me financially to

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Speaker 1: get a financial plan of versus me having pride said

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Speaker 1: I'm going to figure it out. That is hurting me.

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Speaker 1: My refusal to connect emotionally with my children versus just providing.

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Speaker 1: Now you see how that makes me have to downgrade myself.

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Speaker 1: A lot of men that felt like, hey, I'm a

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Speaker 1: manly man. I'm an alpha male. You know I trust

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Speaker 1: no woman. I know I don't have feelings that way.

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Speaker 1: I can never be hurt. You know, it makes you

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Speaker 1: change your schema, It makes you change man. Who am

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Speaker 1: I really? And so I think that is the resistance

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Speaker 1: that we just don't like to change. But here's the

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Speaker 1: real thing. If you're not changing and making adjustments, you

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Speaker 1: are no longer deemed the strongest male possible. And a

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Speaker 1: great example for me, and i'd love to get your

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Speaker 1: thoughts is former President Barack Obama. You know when people

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Speaker 1: see him, they see him as an alpha male, as

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Speaker 1: a leader, but they also see him as compassionate. They

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Speaker 1: see him as a faithful husband, they see him as

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Speaker 1: a compassionate father, They see him as someone who is

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Speaker 1: manly and enough to cry when there's been a school shooting.

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Speaker 1: At the same time, they respect his power. And so

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Speaker 1: if we don't evolve into a man that is able

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Speaker 1: to meet the needs of his family, being tune with

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Speaker 1: his emotions, be able to to have more emotions than

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Speaker 1: just anger, than we are going to be left behind

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Speaker 1: and we were gonna be deemed a weaker male. That's

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Speaker 1: a great point, Dr Tory, and I appreciate that. So

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Speaker 1: I hadn't even thought about the whole John Gray conversation

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Speaker 1: when we started talking, but I'm glad you brought that up,

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Speaker 1: because I do think that was an important kind of

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Speaker 1: zeitgeist moment that has happened recently. I mean talking about

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Speaker 1: like a woman's responsibility of raising so to speak, her partner.

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Speaker 1: And I would love to hear your thoughts about that,

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Speaker 1: because I know you also have the faith background, and

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Speaker 1: so I think that could add it interesting like piece

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Speaker 1: of this conversation, like your thoughts about what that means

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Speaker 1: and what that looks like in relationships. Yeah, well we

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Speaker 1: now know based on his recent revelations that was kind

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Speaker 1: a loaded situation of him trying to, you know, celebrate

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Speaker 1: his wife and also kind of a mini confession. I

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Speaker 1: think when we look at it, husband and wife, even

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Speaker 1: if you're dating, I do think you have to have

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Speaker 1: the michael Angelo effect. That was in psychology today this

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Speaker 1: month about having the michael Angelo fact are phenomena on

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Speaker 1: your partner, which basically means that you make each other

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Speaker 1: more beautiful. So because I'm your husband, you make me

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Speaker 1: more beautiful. Because I'm your husband, I make you more beautiful.

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Speaker 1: We come together to make each other better people. I

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Speaker 1: think that's the goal of relationships. Where I think a

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Speaker 1: lot of women took offense, and quite naturally so justified,

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Speaker 1: was that it's not a woman's job to raise her man.

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Speaker 1: It's her job to support her man, correct her man,

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Speaker 1: encourage her man, but not to raise him, because what

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Speaker 1: does she get out of that? So I'm raising you,

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Speaker 1: what do I get? You know what I mean? So

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Speaker 1: I think that there's kind of expectation in the African

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Speaker 1: American culture sometimes that we expect our wives to also

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Speaker 1: be our mother's especially if we didn't have that strong

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Speaker 1: maternal bond and we had some type of trauma. And

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Speaker 1: I think that women are kind of just fed up

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Speaker 1: with being short changed in relationships, you know. So I

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Speaker 1: think that as men, we have to evolve, we have

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Speaker 1: to grow, We have to seek out male mentors. I

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Speaker 1: have a mentor, Dr Joy, I can give zero percent

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Speaker 1: advice to all Right, Yeah, he's so much smarter than

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Speaker 1: I am, and I just enjoy being able to learn

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Speaker 1: from him about how to have a strong godly marriage,

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Speaker 1: how to keep your children because we both have daughters

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Speaker 1: from having sex, How do you get them to want

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Speaker 1: to be abstinent without it being forced? How do you

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Speaker 1: grow financially without sacrifice and quality time with your family?

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Speaker 1: I mean those are the kind of questions I can

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Speaker 1: sit down and talk with him about. And so I

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Speaker 1: think as men, we don't need to depend upon, you know,

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Speaker 1: our our girlfriends, our fiances, our wives to raise us.

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Speaker 1: Men need to seek other men. We need to be

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Speaker 1: proactive in seeking male mentors to make sure that we

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Speaker 1: are growing and developing so that we can lead in

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Speaker 1: our marriage. And I don't mean lead from an oppressive standpoint.

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Speaker 1: I mean lead as far as doing the things that

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Speaker 1: we're called to do as husband and fathers. Got you so,

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Speaker 1: like I said, I know you do a lot of

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Speaker 1: work with like parents, and so toxic masculinity isn't I

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Speaker 1: think something that only men buy into, Like I think

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Speaker 1: because we live in a patriarchical society, you know, like

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Speaker 1: you mentioned chauvinistic, Like, there are lots I think that

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Speaker 1: we have fed into even as women and kind of

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Speaker 1: continuing to perpetuate this cycle. And I think a lot

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Speaker 1: of it starts with parenting, right, And so when we're

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Speaker 1: talking about parenting boys, what kinds of things do we

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Speaker 1: need to be paying attention to, what kind of ways

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Speaker 1: that we need to kind of reframe our thoughts about

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Speaker 1: parenting to make sure that we are raising a healthier

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Speaker 1: generation of boys, Like, yeah, you know, I think first

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Speaker 1: it's called emotion coaching. We have to teach our boys

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Speaker 1: how to express emotion. We have to show them how

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Speaker 1: you have. I feel frustrated, I feel sad, I feel insecure,

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Speaker 1: I feel overwhelmed, I feel anxious, I feel unmotivated. If

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Speaker 1: we can give our boys the language of emotion, we

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Speaker 1: are doing them a huge favor because we're helping them

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Speaker 1: to be better communicators in their romantic lives. We're helping

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Speaker 1: them to be better communicators when it comes to leaderships.

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Speaker 1: That's the first thing is that we have to teach

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Speaker 1: our boys how to communicate in the language of emotion.

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Speaker 1: Number two, we have to teach our sons how to

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Speaker 1: define themselves outside of their sexuality, you know, and so

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Speaker 1: that starts early on. Your definition of who you are

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Speaker 1: has to be based upon your competencies, some of your likes,

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Speaker 1: some of the things that you feel, not just sexuality.

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Speaker 1: And so if we don't tell our boys that, and

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Speaker 1: you know, kind of aligns to what we're talking about before,

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Speaker 1: then they begin to learn toxic masculinity from hip hop,

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Speaker 1: from images in the media. And so they say, well,

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Speaker 1: since I was never taught how to define myself, then

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Speaker 1: I'm going to follow what I see appears popular in

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Speaker 1: the media. And so I think that's those two things

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Speaker 1: are very important and raising suns. In addition to, you know,

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Speaker 1: one more thing is walking the fine line between providing

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Speaker 1: appropriate structure for our sons but also allowing them to

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Speaker 1: be independent of us, and that means be able to

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Speaker 1: figure some things out on their own, be able to

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Speaker 1: struggle on their own, be able to be resourceful and

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Speaker 1: resilient and gritty. All those things you would want in

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Speaker 1: a hush has been all those things you would want

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Speaker 1: in a father is allowing them to do that without

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Speaker 1: fixing it for them. And that's that. It pertains to

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Speaker 1: both moms and dad's. So what do you think happens after?

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Speaker 1: Because this reminds me of the old kind of saying.

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Speaker 1: But I don't know if this is a universal saying

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Speaker 1: or if this is something kind of in the black community,

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Speaker 1: the idea of raising your daughters but kind of coddling

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Speaker 1: your sons. Oh man, So what do you where do

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Speaker 1: you think that comes from? It's just the saying. It's

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Speaker 1: just the saying. And you know the power of words

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Speaker 1: like Trump, he was a huge and being. He just

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Speaker 1: that on purpose to convey how big he is to

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Speaker 1: intimidate others. We say in church, the Lord won't put

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Speaker 1: more on you than you can bear. Yes he will.

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Speaker 1: We just say it. How do you feel blessed and

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Speaker 1: holly favor? You don't always feel blessed and holly favorite.

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Speaker 1: We just say that. So I think they're these sayings,

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Speaker 1: and we take these sayings and we make them law

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Speaker 1: when we know from the psychology is that we follow

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Speaker 1: our rules, but some of the rules we make don't

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Speaker 1: make sense. And so when we start talking about we

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Speaker 1: raise our daughters, but we coddle our sons, why would

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Speaker 1: we do that? First of all, why would we coddle

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Speaker 1: our sons. That's not complementary. That means we baby our sons.

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Speaker 1: That means we prepare our sons to be perpetual babies.

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Speaker 1: We prepare our sons to be treated differently than their

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Speaker 1: female counterparts. We raise our daughters, but then we don't

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Speaker 1: prepare our sons to be leaders. That makes no sense

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Speaker 1: to me, you know. So I think that's one of

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Speaker 1: the things that when it comes to redefining uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: manhood and culture and parenting, that we have to do

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Speaker 1: a better job as psychologists and do a better job

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Speaker 1: in the media showing people how it is really done.

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Speaker 1: And I think that that is best done in my opinion.

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Speaker 1: You know, in the media, what we see is what

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Speaker 1: will be. And so if we can show characters that

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Speaker 1: have of different multiple maculinity ees, they can be tough

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Speaker 1: and defend their family, and they also can sit down

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Speaker 1: and have a tea party with their five year old daughter,

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Speaker 1: I think so many men need to see that so

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Speaker 1: that they have an image, an ideal to live up

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Speaker 1: to that allows them to embrace multiple parts of their masculinity. So,

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Speaker 1: you know, something else I think that complicates this issue

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Speaker 1: dr toward is, of course, you know, all of the

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Speaker 1: things that we see in the media in terms of

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Speaker 1: you know, these black children on both boys and girls,

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Speaker 1: but it does seem like it's more boys, you know,

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Speaker 1: either being killed by police officers or rogued neighborhood watch people.

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Speaker 1: And so I feel like some of that also feeds

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Speaker 1: into this idea of like really wanting to be super

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Speaker 1: protective of boys, and so some of it comes, I

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Speaker 1: think from a good place, but but like you said,

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Speaker 1: can sometimes go too far where we are kind of

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Speaker 1: doing them more harm than good. Yeah, it's it's a

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Speaker 1: fine line. I think that's a fine and I think

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Speaker 1: it's that natural balance. You don't want to go so

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Speaker 1: far as to not be in tune with your child's emotions,

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Speaker 1: you know, So you want to definitely be in tune

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Speaker 1: with where your son's emotions are. It is okay for

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Speaker 1: him to feel dejected, to feel like he doesn't measure up.

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Speaker 1: That's that's normal human emotion. At the same time with

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Speaker 1: me being a man, I know in my family, I'm

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Speaker 1: looked too as the lead. I have to protect the house,

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Speaker 1: I have to make sure that my wife is taken

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Speaker 1: care of. I have to make sure that both my

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Speaker 1: daughters are taken care of. I can't look to my

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Speaker 1: wife to lead my family. Not at the same time.

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Speaker 1: You know, since a girl is bad, I mean she

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Speaker 1: is a phenomenal woman, there areas in which he's far superior.

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Speaker 1: And I passed the baton, you know, and I play

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Speaker 1: background like she's glad at night. I'm the pips. So

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Speaker 1: but but just when men are in a room, you know,

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Speaker 1: we have to look in the mirror and said, I

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Speaker 1: have to make it happen for my family. I have

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Speaker 1: to make it. And so we have to teach our

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Speaker 1: boys how to be resilient, how to be dependent upon God,

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Speaker 1: how to rely on others, how to admit when you're

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Speaker 1: stressed out, how to go get wise counsel, how to

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Speaker 1: express your emotions and compromise. All those soft skills are needed.

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Speaker 1: We have to show them how to lead and be

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Speaker 1: vulnerable and be strong at the same time. So I

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Speaker 1: think all of that is great, Dr Hart, But I

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Speaker 1: also am aware that you know, a lot of us

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Speaker 1: as adults have not even developed these skills, right, and

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Speaker 1: so it will be hard I think to kind of

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Speaker 1: model that and teach that to children if we have

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Speaker 1: not learned that for ourselves. I mean, it's a tough lesson.

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Speaker 1: It's a tough lesson. I mean. One of the things

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Speaker 1: that I'm doing two thousand and nineteen is for the

402
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Speaker 1: first time, I am building a team. I have done

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Speaker 1: so many things by myself because you know, you farm

404
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Speaker 1: it out, trust other people, and kind of one of

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Speaker 1: the I think bad habits we have because we deem

406
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Speaker 1: ourselves to be intelligent, is that people don't do it

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Speaker 1: to our standards. We feel like we need to go

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Speaker 1: do it ourselves, you know, versus just allowing people to

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Speaker 1: grow and finding the right fit. So, you know, as

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Speaker 1: a man, I said, look, I can't be effective. I

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Speaker 1: can't be efficient. I can't be present at home if

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Speaker 1: I'm trying to grow from a business standpoint and I'm

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Speaker 1: working from sun of the sundown. So right, you have

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Speaker 1: to practice what you preach. You have to teach delegation,

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Speaker 1: you have to teach that listen. But no amount of

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Speaker 1: business success is worth personal failure at home. And if

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Speaker 1: I believe that that means that I'm present, I'm able

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Speaker 1: to build a team, I'm able to work through my

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Speaker 1: own trust issues, my own past hurts with trusting people

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Speaker 1: with things and managing my brand, and you know how

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Speaker 1: it goes. I have to get over that because I

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Speaker 1: have to find the right formula so that my daughters

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Speaker 1: don't look at me and say I was never there,

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Speaker 1: regardless of what was going on. I was always present

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Speaker 1: in their life as well as the life of my wife.

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Speaker 1: So I know. Also in your work, DOCTORR. Tart, you

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Speaker 1: talk a lot about maverick moms. Um, so what are

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Speaker 1: some descriptors of these maverick moms and what can we

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Speaker 1: learn from them? Yeah, you know, a lot of times

430
00:24:01,960 --> 00:24:04,159
Speaker 1: they say, you know what you mean, a man, It

431
00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:06,040
Speaker 1: takes a man to show a man how to be

432
00:24:06,080 --> 00:24:09,840
Speaker 1: a man. And I'm a man disagreeing with that. It's

433
00:24:09,920 --> 00:24:13,639
Speaker 1: just not true. Now, do you need some male influence?

434
00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:16,800
Speaker 1: You do, But there are a number of maverick moms

435
00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:20,640
Speaker 1: that have raised some of the strongest men in history.

436
00:24:21,080 --> 00:24:24,240
Speaker 1: We can start with former President Barack Obama. We can

437
00:24:24,280 --> 00:24:28,000
Speaker 1: go with Les Brown, who was raised by his grandma.

438
00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:32,119
Speaker 1: We can look at Lebron James, Kevin Durant, you can

439
00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:35,320
Speaker 1: look at Tyler Perry. When you start looking at some

440
00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:38,879
Speaker 1: of these men that we really really respect, a former

441
00:24:38,920 --> 00:24:42,080
Speaker 1: President Bill Clinton, they are a record that their moms

442
00:24:42,119 --> 00:24:45,720
Speaker 1: played a predominant role in their life. Add me to

443
00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:48,800
Speaker 1: that mix. My father mom isd have been married forever.

444
00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:52,919
Speaker 1: But when we talk about having the dominant influence on

445
00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:56,440
Speaker 1: me early in my life, it was it was my mom.

446
00:24:56,640 --> 00:24:59,680
Speaker 1: My mom was the trailblazer. My mom was the one

447
00:24:59,760 --> 00:25:02,160
Speaker 1: that took risk. My mom was the one that started

448
00:25:02,640 --> 00:25:05,800
Speaker 1: new schools and old schools were failing. And I identified

449
00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:09,960
Speaker 1: what her personality. As I get older, I identify, uh,

450
00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:12,399
Speaker 1: you know, if my dad would being able to you know,

451
00:25:12,520 --> 00:25:15,400
Speaker 1: keep my mom calm. You know, I've had to develop

452
00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:17,919
Speaker 1: that as a skills I get as I get older.

453
00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:21,520
Speaker 1: And I just think that it's important that as as men,

454
00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:24,439
Speaker 1: we just you know, continue to redefine, you know, who

455
00:25:24,520 --> 00:25:27,760
Speaker 1: we are involved. So, Maverick, moms are the moms that

456
00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:30,920
Speaker 1: you're talking about that can really, you know, still teach

457
00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:34,320
Speaker 1: a boy how to be successful and healthy, even though

458
00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:36,720
Speaker 1: there may not be a man in the home. Still

459
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:39,200
Speaker 1: with male influence. Yeah, So when we look at schools.

460
00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:41,880
Speaker 1: I mean you look at principles. I mean kids respect

461
00:25:41,920 --> 00:25:45,200
Speaker 1: the strongest principle, the one that's fair and firm, has

462
00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:47,320
Speaker 1: nothing to do with gender. You can put a mail

463
00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:49,280
Speaker 1: in that role, but if they don't respect that male,

464
00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:52,879
Speaker 1: they don't trump over him. You know, they expect if

465
00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:56,119
Speaker 1: they respect the principle, and she happens to be a woman,

466
00:25:56,119 --> 00:25:58,520
Speaker 1: they're gonna respect her because she demands respect. And so

467
00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:01,480
Speaker 1: when we start talking about the research, when it comes

468
00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:05,200
Speaker 1: to Maverick moms, you know, it's not it's not having

469
00:26:05,280 --> 00:26:08,240
Speaker 1: the presence of a male in the home. It's whether

470
00:26:08,359 --> 00:26:11,159
Speaker 1: he respects his mom is a discipinarian but also feels

471
00:26:11,160 --> 00:26:16,000
Speaker 1: emotionally connected. And that's why you see so many successful men.

472
00:26:16,119 --> 00:26:18,600
Speaker 1: And I want, I want women are listening right now,

473
00:26:18,640 --> 00:26:21,399
Speaker 1: the moms that are listening right now to understand that

474
00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:28,040
Speaker 1: your impact on your son is phenomenal. Don't say I

475
00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:32,320
Speaker 1: can't show him how to be a man. You absolutely can.

476
00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:35,359
Speaker 1: You can be in charge of it. You can take

477
00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:39,280
Speaker 1: him to the men's cloth here and allow them to

478
00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:43,040
Speaker 1: show him how to tie a tie. You can teach

479
00:26:43,080 --> 00:26:46,160
Speaker 1: your son directly how to be assertive. You can teach

480
00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:49,359
Speaker 1: your son directly, how to have work ethic. You can

481
00:26:49,400 --> 00:26:55,000
Speaker 1: teach your son directly, how to pray over his future wife.

482
00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:57,400
Speaker 1: There's so many things that you can teach your son.

483
00:26:57,800 --> 00:27:00,840
Speaker 1: We go a little bit too far with was saying

484
00:27:00,840 --> 00:27:03,760
Speaker 1: with Dad's not there that we are ill equipped or

485
00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:07,080
Speaker 1: you're ill equipped as a mom to raise your son

486
00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:13,119
Speaker 1: into a powerful young man. Great information. Dr Tytt. You

487
00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:15,440
Speaker 1: talked a little bit about the media. Do you think

488
00:27:15,480 --> 00:27:19,600
Speaker 1: that there are any like TV shows or music, like

489
00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:22,359
Speaker 1: are there things that you feel like are setting good

490
00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:26,360
Speaker 1: examples about like healthy masculinity that you point to often? Yeah?

491
00:27:26,520 --> 00:27:28,879
Speaker 1: I think I think. So. There was a show No

492
00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:30,760
Speaker 1: one saw this because this was in a study. It

493
00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:33,719
Speaker 1: was called Soul City. It aired in Africa, and and

494
00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:37,280
Speaker 1: the goal was they wanted to change the community's view

495
00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:41,840
Speaker 1: on domestic violence, because there's a culture uh in certain

496
00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:44,720
Speaker 1: parts of Africa that if you see domestic violence, you

497
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:47,720
Speaker 1: don't mention it, you don't getting other people's business, even

498
00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:51,080
Speaker 1: if you see oppression and danger and domestic violence. So

499
00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:53,879
Speaker 1: they took this figure and then and and he was

500
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:57,800
Speaker 1: super mancho But then they introduced intentionally his family and

501
00:27:57,880 --> 00:28:00,840
Speaker 1: made you start liking his children, like his wife and

502
00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:04,240
Speaker 1: then there was a scene where he actually was physical

503
00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:07,080
Speaker 1: with his wife and the next door neighbors came by

504
00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:10,640
Speaker 1: and started beating on pots and pants to express disapproval.

505
00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:14,040
Speaker 1: And they did that intentionally. This was a funded actual

506
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:17,280
Speaker 1: show because they wanted to see if they could change

507
00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:23,080
Speaker 1: public views on rules like don't getting other people's business

508
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:25,120
Speaker 1: even though you see a woman being hurt and it's

509
00:28:25,119 --> 00:28:28,240
Speaker 1: it's affecting the family. And it worked. They found more

510
00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:31,359
Speaker 1: men calling the domestic violence hotline because they had identified

511
00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:34,359
Speaker 1: with the supernational and male and then identified with his

512
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:36,879
Speaker 1: wife and then found somewhere in the middle of the show,

513
00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:40,080
Speaker 1: Dr Joy that that man is me and that I

514
00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:42,320
Speaker 1: now see that he is hurting his wife, he is

515
00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:46,680
Speaker 1: hurting his children. So the media, I believe, I believe

516
00:28:47,000 --> 00:28:51,400
Speaker 1: should be on the forefront of that initiative. So I

517
00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:56,800
Speaker 1: think that that Soul City has positively done that. Another

518
00:28:56,840 --> 00:29:00,320
Speaker 1: one is I saw red Table talk. Have you seen

519
00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:05,960
Speaker 1: that with Willy on Jada Pinkett show, because it's her

520
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:09,360
Speaker 1: and he talked about not knowing how to communicate with

521
00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:12,840
Speaker 1: her and he said, listen, I don't want to be

522
00:29:12,920 --> 00:29:14,560
Speaker 1: my dad. I don't want to put hands on you,

523
00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:16,520
Speaker 1: and you cursed me, and I hate you with the

524
00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:19,400
Speaker 1: towel that made me feel uncomfortable. So let's go to

525
00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:22,240
Speaker 1: communication classes because I don't know how to communicate with

526
00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:25,000
Speaker 1: you when I'm upset. All I know how to do

527
00:29:25,040 --> 00:29:27,320
Speaker 1: is get mad and shut down. And I think that

528
00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:31,000
Speaker 1: Will Smith being open and frank about that was a

529
00:29:31,040 --> 00:29:33,760
Speaker 1: great example of Hey, it's okay not to know what

530
00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:36,520
Speaker 1: you're doing in a relationship, but it's not okay you're

531
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:39,200
Speaker 1: not to go figure it out. Another example, the NBA

532
00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:42,760
Speaker 1: launched the campaign where they had a number of athletes

533
00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:47,000
Speaker 1: come out and talk about mental mental illness dealing with it.

534
00:29:47,120 --> 00:29:51,120
Speaker 1: Shane Larkin came out, talked about dealing with obsessive compulsive disorder,

535
00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:55,600
Speaker 1: The Morris Twins came out, talked about PTSD, Kevin Love

536
00:29:55,680 --> 00:29:59,320
Speaker 1: came out and talked about anxiety. Paul Pierce, Mr Celtic

537
00:29:59,640 --> 00:30:02,760
Speaker 1: came out and talked about having a panic attack after

538
00:30:02,800 --> 00:30:07,840
Speaker 1: being stabbed. And so these very very manly men who

539
00:30:07,960 --> 00:30:12,920
Speaker 1: we really respect coming out and talking about, hey, I

540
00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:16,440
Speaker 1: had to go get help. I think that that it

541
00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:19,000
Speaker 1: sets a great example for us, and as men, gives

542
00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:24,560
Speaker 1: us permission to be manly and still seek help. Those

543
00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:26,640
Speaker 1: sound great bat tried. I hadn't seen all of those

544
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:28,880
Speaker 1: that I definitely will look those up now. But yeah,

545
00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:31,280
Speaker 1: they're being they're being intentional. You know. Like one of

546
00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:33,800
Speaker 1: my contracts each year is I work with one six

547
00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:36,160
Speaker 1: And this is good for the public to know, is

548
00:30:36,160 --> 00:30:39,720
Speaker 1: that the NBA brings in psychologists like myself, usually as

549
00:30:39,760 --> 00:30:42,720
Speaker 1: a team of five or six to work with the

550
00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:47,080
Speaker 1: NBA rookies uh doing what's called Rookie Transition Program, And

551
00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:49,800
Speaker 1: our goal is to get them to open up about

552
00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:52,880
Speaker 1: their anxieties, open up about their fears, talk to them

553
00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:57,160
Speaker 1: about being head of household financially insecurities about you know,

554
00:30:57,320 --> 00:31:00,400
Speaker 1: playing against Lebron James, you know what it means to

555
00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:03,080
Speaker 1: move away from your family, all those things, so that

556
00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:06,680
Speaker 1: they can get used to communicating their feelings because they

557
00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:09,720
Speaker 1: know what they don't talk about is going to hurt

558
00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:13,800
Speaker 1: the athletes, the team, and on financial standpoint. To be honest,

559
00:31:14,080 --> 00:31:18,800
Speaker 1: the brand of the NBA. When you have athletes in fighting, drinking, smoking,

560
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:21,320
Speaker 1: domestic violence, they're trying to avoid that and so they

561
00:31:21,320 --> 00:31:27,280
Speaker 1: are ushering and guiding and promoting healthy mental health, healthy

562
00:31:27,320 --> 00:31:30,200
Speaker 1: mental health. So every every team has someone like me.

563
00:31:30,440 --> 00:31:32,520
Speaker 1: I used to do it for the thunder someone like

564
00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:35,280
Speaker 1: me that they have to talk to a doctor. Joy.

565
00:31:35,280 --> 00:31:38,120
Speaker 1: A lot of them are women because they're very receptive

566
00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:40,360
Speaker 1: to women because they're used to their moms, and so

567
00:31:40,440 --> 00:31:45,320
Speaker 1: a lot of teams have female psychologists who work with

568
00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:47,600
Speaker 1: their players to help them to deal with the stress

569
00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:51,640
Speaker 1: of NBA life. Oh well, that's good to know. So,

570
00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:54,040
Speaker 1: and that's that's NFL teams as well. NFL is not

571
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:56,480
Speaker 1: I'm biased because of course I work for the NBA.

572
00:31:56,640 --> 00:31:59,960
Speaker 1: NFL is getting there, but the NBA has long said

573
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:04,040
Speaker 1: that then the gold standard when it comes to we

574
00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:07,479
Speaker 1: need to make sure that we have our players both

575
00:32:07,880 --> 00:32:11,200
Speaker 1: from the G League, the NBA and the w n

576
00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:12,640
Speaker 1: b A. We want to make sure that we have

577
00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:15,920
Speaker 1: our players talking to someone about their feelings. We want

578
00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:18,640
Speaker 1: to care about the whole player, the whole person, not

579
00:32:18,760 --> 00:32:22,160
Speaker 1: just the player. Got you, so, do you have any

580
00:32:22,200 --> 00:32:25,720
Speaker 1: other favorite resources that you find yourself frequently recommending? Any

581
00:32:26,360 --> 00:32:29,040
Speaker 1: books and stuff that you share a lot. But regarding

582
00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:32,920
Speaker 1: I'm an avid book readers, regard to which subjects mostly

583
00:32:32,960 --> 00:32:36,560
Speaker 1: about like masculinity and raising boys. There's a book called

584
00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:40,160
Speaker 1: Maverick Moms. That's where I got the turn from. And

585
00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:43,920
Speaker 1: they profiled Barack Obama's mom and other moms that were

586
00:32:43,960 --> 00:32:48,960
Speaker 1: able to raise, you know, their sons and very challenging circumstances.

587
00:32:48,960 --> 00:32:51,880
Speaker 1: So I would look into a book called you Know

588
00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:56,000
Speaker 1: Maverick Maverick Mom. It's probably the top recommendation that I

589
00:32:56,040 --> 00:32:59,640
Speaker 1: would have when it comes to that. And where can

590
00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:02,400
Speaker 1: people find you online? Dr Tart? What is your website

591
00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:05,920
Speaker 1: as well as any social media handles you want to share? Okay, okay,

592
00:33:05,920 --> 00:33:07,560
Speaker 1: I'll give them to you all, you know, because I

593
00:33:07,600 --> 00:33:11,040
Speaker 1: believe that we you know, Dr Joe, We've allowed life coaches,

594
00:33:11,080 --> 00:33:14,640
Speaker 1: We've allowed pastors, We've allowed, you know, so many different

595
00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:17,360
Speaker 1: motivational speakers to kind of get into the lane of

596
00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:22,040
Speaker 1: doing therapy. And while I have a life coach, she

597
00:33:22,280 --> 00:33:25,600
Speaker 1: is phenomenal. I listened to motivational speakers. A lot of

598
00:33:25,640 --> 00:33:28,880
Speaker 1: them are my my friends, and they have taught me

599
00:33:28,920 --> 00:33:31,440
Speaker 1: how to speak better. But I think as psychologists we

600
00:33:31,480 --> 00:33:33,760
Speaker 1: have to become front and center in the media, even

601
00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:36,760
Speaker 1: though we're very uncomfortable with because we were trained just opposite,

602
00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:39,000
Speaker 1: so that we can fit into our lane and help

603
00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:43,800
Speaker 1: people with actual therapy. So you can get free relationship tips,

604
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:48,240
Speaker 1: marriage tips, parting tips simply by texting me texting tart.

605
00:33:48,440 --> 00:33:51,480
Speaker 1: That's t A r t T. Again, that's t a

606
00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:54,680
Speaker 1: r t T to the following number, which is two

607
00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:58,720
Speaker 1: to eight to eight, and that's texting tart to two

608
00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:01,760
Speaker 1: to eight to eight. You can also follow me on

609
00:34:01,800 --> 00:34:04,880
Speaker 1: Instagram at doctor chart. That's at d r t a

610
00:34:05,080 --> 00:34:08,919
Speaker 1: r t T. Same handle on Twitter, same handle on

611
00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:12,560
Speaker 1: LinkedIn Facebook. Find me a dr Aldawan Tart. My first

612
00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:14,600
Speaker 1: name is spelled A L d U a N. Last

613
00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:16,680
Speaker 1: named Tart t A r t T. I love to

614
00:34:16,680 --> 00:34:19,000
Speaker 1: connect with you any way we can make it happen,

615
00:34:19,080 --> 00:34:22,719
Speaker 1: as well as YouTube, and of course we will share

616
00:34:22,760 --> 00:34:25,040
Speaker 1: all of that in the show notes so that everybody

617
00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:28,839
Speaker 1: can find that easily. Definitely, definitely, you know. In another

618
00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:31,880
Speaker 1: resource I thought about, it's a book called The Fight

619
00:34:33,000 --> 00:34:36,360
Speaker 1: of Your Life. I do believe that we're on the

620
00:34:37,040 --> 00:34:39,719
Speaker 1: if it's not a crisis state right now with men

621
00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:43,719
Speaker 1: and unhealthy sexuality. There's a book out called The Fight

622
00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:46,400
Speaker 1: of Your Life that helps men out and helps teenage

623
00:34:46,400 --> 00:34:51,000
Speaker 1: boys out with dealing with pornography and unhealthy sexuality. It

624
00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:53,880
Speaker 1: gives them become a template. It's it's a book that

625
00:34:54,120 --> 00:34:59,680
Speaker 1: aligns scripture with actual application for how you have healthy sexuality.

626
00:34:59,719 --> 00:35:02,000
Speaker 1: I think that as a resource and a tool we

627
00:35:02,080 --> 00:35:05,680
Speaker 1: need to equip all of our sons, brothers, fathers, cousins

628
00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:11,600
Speaker 1: with so that we can have better relationships. Definitely sounds good. Well,

629
00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:13,400
Speaker 1: thank you so much for taking some time out of

630
00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:15,759
Speaker 1: your day, Doctor Hard to chat with us. I appreciate it.

631
00:35:16,239 --> 00:35:20,080
Speaker 1: Any time, any time. Thank you. I'm so thankful Dr

632
00:35:20,120 --> 00:35:23,120
Speaker 1: Tart was able to share his expertise with us today.

633
00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:26,320
Speaker 1: To find out more information about his practice, or to

634
00:35:26,440 --> 00:35:29,399
Speaker 1: check out the resources that he shared, visit the show

635
00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:32,400
Speaker 1: notes at Therapy for Black Girls dot com slash session,

636
00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:36,320
Speaker 1: and don't forget to show some support for our sponsor

637
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641
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642
00:35:57,280 --> 00:36:00,000
Speaker 1: for a therapist in your area, check out our direct

643
00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:03,560
Speaker 1: three at Therapy for Black Girls dot com slash directory,

644
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Speaker 1: and be sure to visit our online store at Therapy

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Speaker 1: for Black Girls dot Com slash shout, where you can

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Speaker 1: find our Guided Affirmation Track, break Up Journal, and your

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Speaker 1: Therapy for Black Girls sweatshirts and T shirts. Thank you'all

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Speaker 1: so much for joining me again this week. I look

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Speaker 1: forward to continuing this conversation with you all real soon.

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Speaker 1: Take it cares art often,