1
00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:04,680
Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is

2
00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:09,080
Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

3
00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,079
Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A

4
00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:25,920
Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radio. Hello, welcome back to the show.

5
00:00:26,160 --> 00:00:28,720
Speaker 1: My name is Matt, my name is Noah. They call

6
00:00:28,800 --> 00:00:32,000
Speaker 1: me Ben. We're joined as always with our super producer

7
00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:36,120
Speaker 1: Paul Mission controlled decades. Most importantly, you are you, You

8
00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:39,720
Speaker 1: are here, and that makes this stuff they don't want

9
00:00:39,760 --> 00:00:44,159
Speaker 1: you to know. Today's episode is about a disappearance, and

10
00:00:44,400 --> 00:00:47,760
Speaker 1: it's a It's a disappearance that you may or may

11
00:00:47,800 --> 00:00:50,599
Speaker 1: not have heard of before. We learned about it through

12
00:00:50,600 --> 00:00:53,519
Speaker 1: an early edition of Listener Mail, and as you know,

13
00:00:53,640 --> 00:00:59,240
Speaker 1: we flag some of these topics when they warrant further investigation.

14
00:01:00,120 --> 00:01:03,560
Speaker 1: The thing about disappearances is that they happen around the

15
00:01:03,560 --> 00:01:06,960
Speaker 1: world all the time, every single day. There are probably,

16
00:01:07,160 --> 00:01:09,480
Speaker 1: if you look at the entire human population, there are

17
00:01:09,480 --> 00:01:12,080
Speaker 1: a couple of people that are disappearing in the time

18
00:01:12,120 --> 00:01:15,960
Speaker 1: it takes you to listen to this episode. And the

19
00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:21,920
Speaker 1: thing is, while these tragic, unexplained disappearances aren't uncommon, the

20
00:01:22,080 --> 00:01:25,759
Speaker 1: question changes depending on the context. Like it's pretty easy

21
00:01:25,880 --> 00:01:29,480
Speaker 1: even in the age of cell phones and surveillance, It's

22
00:01:29,520 --> 00:01:32,760
Speaker 1: it's alarmingly easy to disappear for a little while in

23
00:01:32,800 --> 00:01:37,479
Speaker 1: the US. But how do people disappear when they're on

24
00:01:37,520 --> 00:01:44,199
Speaker 1: a heavily populated, isolated, continually monitored thing like a cruise ship.

25
00:01:44,880 --> 00:01:47,880
Speaker 1: How do people disappear on cruise ships? Why does so

26
00:01:47,880 --> 00:01:50,680
Speaker 1: many of these cases remain unsolved. We'll get to those

27
00:01:50,720 --> 00:01:54,880
Speaker 1: answers in part in today's investigation of the disappearance of

28
00:01:55,200 --> 00:01:59,680
Speaker 1: Rebecca Quarium. Here are the facts. Yeah, So, who is

29
00:02:00,040 --> 00:02:03,480
Speaker 1: Becca kore um Uh. She was born on March eleventh,

30
00:02:03,680 --> 00:02:08,360
Speaker 1: nineteen seven, in Chester, England. Um had a pretty you know,

31
00:02:08,560 --> 00:02:13,320
Speaker 1: unremarkable for for the purposes of this story childhood. Her parents,

32
00:02:13,440 --> 00:02:17,240
Speaker 1: Mike and Anne Marie, who was known as Anne, raised

33
00:02:17,240 --> 00:02:22,239
Speaker 1: Rebecca with her biological sister Rachel and two foster brothers. Yes,

34
00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:24,640
Speaker 1: and like a lot of the other kids who grew

35
00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:27,560
Speaker 1: up in that area in Chester, she worked at the

36
00:02:27,720 --> 00:02:31,320
Speaker 1: local zoo. What how cool would that be to work

37
00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:33,160
Speaker 1: at a zoo? And she at least worked there for

38
00:02:33,240 --> 00:02:36,080
Speaker 1: a time that we're aware of. When she was you know,

39
00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:39,480
Speaker 1: in her teenage years, she joined up with the British

40
00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:42,600
Speaker 1: Army Cadets it's kind of like the r OTC or

41
00:02:42,639 --> 00:02:46,440
Speaker 1: the junior r OTC here in at least the US.

42
00:02:46,639 --> 00:02:48,840
Speaker 1: And then after high school she went to a place

43
00:02:48,840 --> 00:02:53,480
Speaker 1: called Plymouth University. She was studying sports science, and this

44
00:02:53,520 --> 00:02:55,360
Speaker 1: was this is something she was very much interested in.

45
00:02:55,440 --> 00:02:58,480
Speaker 1: She was good at athletics and interested in athletics. She

46
00:02:58,560 --> 00:03:02,240
Speaker 1: studied that further at of her Pool Hope University, and

47
00:03:02,320 --> 00:03:05,880
Speaker 1: she ended up teaching sports abroad in Maine in the

48
00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:10,600
Speaker 1: United States, And eventually she graduated at a different university,

49
00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:14,560
Speaker 1: Exeter University, with a degree in sports science. So she

50
00:03:14,680 --> 00:03:17,360
Speaker 1: clearly had a track that she was going down. Wouldn't

51
00:03:17,360 --> 00:03:19,120
Speaker 1: sports science be the equivalent of that we would call

52
00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:23,600
Speaker 1: sports medicine here, like um, you know, kinesiology or something

53
00:03:23,639 --> 00:03:26,000
Speaker 1: like that, or you know, to be like a sports

54
00:03:26,480 --> 00:03:29,440
Speaker 1: massage therapist or in some way like a medic or

55
00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:34,800
Speaker 1: what the physical education's right, Yeah, because their sports education

56
00:03:34,880 --> 00:03:39,360
Speaker 1: might be another equivalent. It's almost like this reminds me

57
00:03:39,600 --> 00:03:43,000
Speaker 1: a lot of the careers of pe teachers we call

58
00:03:43,080 --> 00:03:46,600
Speaker 1: them here in the US. So shout out to any

59
00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:50,160
Speaker 1: of any teachers of hours listening to the show. I

60
00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:52,960
Speaker 1: can't believe he's stuck with us through grade school, so

61
00:03:56,600 --> 00:04:02,840
Speaker 1: um so. In two thousand and ten, Rebecca Quarium takes

62
00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:08,320
Speaker 1: an opportunity that comes along every so often. Disney Cruise

63
00:04:08,560 --> 00:04:13,720
Speaker 1: is interviewing people, and they're interviewing hundreds of people. Quarium

64
00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:18,279
Speaker 1: is hired. She's got the bona fides and the experience

65
00:04:18,320 --> 00:04:24,880
Speaker 1: they're looking for in the position of youth entertainment, someone

66
00:04:24,920 --> 00:04:27,800
Speaker 1: who kind of is on the cruise ship taking care

67
00:04:27,880 --> 00:04:30,800
Speaker 1: of the kids and engaging with them so the parents

68
00:04:31,320 --> 00:04:34,599
Speaker 1: can go to the bar, you know, whatever they're doing. Yeah,

69
00:04:34,640 --> 00:04:36,560
Speaker 1: it's kind of a glorified babysitter, but I've heard it

70
00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:39,240
Speaker 1: referred to as almost like a counselor situation, where there's

71
00:04:39,279 --> 00:04:42,680
Speaker 1: like activities and crafts and things like that. And apparently

72
00:04:42,800 --> 00:04:47,039
Speaker 1: this was Rebecca's dream job. She was a big Disney

73
00:04:47,040 --> 00:04:49,360
Speaker 1: fan and love working with kids, and you know, her

74
00:04:49,360 --> 00:04:51,920
Speaker 1: parents have said that she was thrilled to to land

75
00:04:51,960 --> 00:04:54,880
Speaker 1: this gig and and just to put it out there,

76
00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:58,960
Speaker 1: that position also requires a good amount of performance ability

77
00:04:59,120 --> 00:05:03,039
Speaker 1: to to enter tame the kids, to keep them, you know, excited,

78
00:05:03,160 --> 00:05:05,800
Speaker 1: because the one of the main things about Disney cruise

79
00:05:05,800 --> 00:05:08,880
Speaker 1: ships is to keep kids in that magical spirit at

80
00:05:09,040 --> 00:05:12,400
Speaker 1: at all and adults, but just to keep that flowing

81
00:05:12,440 --> 00:05:14,479
Speaker 1: at all times. Yeah, that's a good point. You have

82
00:05:14,520 --> 00:05:16,800
Speaker 1: to always be on This is a demanding job. I

83
00:05:17,120 --> 00:05:22,400
Speaker 1: wouldn't I would not call it, uh remotely like glorified

84
00:05:22,440 --> 00:05:25,520
Speaker 1: babysitting because they're just like I don't think they can

85
00:05:25,560 --> 00:05:28,279
Speaker 1: just turn on a movie and and leave the kids

86
00:05:28,279 --> 00:05:31,800
Speaker 1: with some snacks. But rights spoke there, that's what that's

87
00:05:31,839 --> 00:05:35,200
Speaker 1: what this guy is doing right now. I and I

88
00:05:35,279 --> 00:05:37,480
Speaker 1: say that having never worked on a cruise ship. So

89
00:05:38,120 --> 00:05:41,599
Speaker 1: this this is like you said, no, it's her dream job.

90
00:05:41,680 --> 00:05:44,760
Speaker 1: And right when she's hired, she is flown out to

91
00:05:45,440 --> 00:05:49,679
Speaker 1: the headquarters to Florida and she's there for four days

92
00:05:49,800 --> 00:05:54,520
Speaker 1: for her intro onboarding training, and then she's off to

93
00:05:55,200 --> 00:05:57,760
Speaker 1: the Disney wonder. There are a couple notes we need

94
00:05:57,800 --> 00:06:00,920
Speaker 1: to make here, as we've established in of your episodes,

95
00:06:01,200 --> 00:06:03,359
Speaker 1: after hearing from a lot of people working in the

96
00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:06,080
Speaker 1: cruise industry, life on a cruise ship could be a

97
00:06:06,080 --> 00:06:09,600
Speaker 1: little bit debaucherous, it could be a little bit spicy,

98
00:06:09,720 --> 00:06:13,400
Speaker 1: which will will we will definitely be important later. Hold on,

99
00:06:13,520 --> 00:06:16,599
Speaker 1: Ben Ben put a link into the outline here, So

100
00:06:16,680 --> 00:06:19,920
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna go ahead and take a moment. Oh

101
00:06:18,920 --> 00:06:26,120
Speaker 1: oh oh, okay, that's how you're supposed to hear spicy.

102
00:06:26,200 --> 00:06:31,039
Speaker 1: It's a it's a clip from Stefan I believe from

103
00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:34,760
Speaker 1: SNL Okay, we'll continue, Okay, So this this will be

104
00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:39,679
Speaker 1: important later, the to the duality of the two lives,

105
00:06:39,880 --> 00:06:42,480
Speaker 1: that every crew member is living the life as as

106
00:06:42,480 --> 00:06:45,880
Speaker 1: you guys said, the life in front of the the passengers,

107
00:06:46,120 --> 00:06:48,920
Speaker 1: and then the life below deck or on the crew pool,

108
00:06:49,279 --> 00:06:52,360
Speaker 1: which is the only place that could really hang out unobserved. Yeah,

109
00:06:52,400 --> 00:06:54,880
Speaker 1: and then that just that is not to describe every

110
00:06:54,920 --> 00:06:58,279
Speaker 1: crew member's experience. That is just something that we have noticed,

111
00:06:58,680 --> 00:07:03,000
Speaker 1: right right exactly. So, after she works for four months

112
00:07:03,600 --> 00:07:07,719
Speaker 1: on cruises throughout the Bahamas, she goes back to the

113
00:07:07,800 --> 00:07:11,200
Speaker 1: United Kingdom for two months off, catches up with friends,

114
00:07:11,240 --> 00:07:13,800
Speaker 1: catches up with her family. She's very close to her family,

115
00:07:13,840 --> 00:07:18,280
Speaker 1: talks to them regularly through the phone and electronic means uh.

116
00:07:18,320 --> 00:07:21,480
Speaker 1: And then when she comes back, she's on board the

117
00:07:21,680 --> 00:07:26,960
Speaker 1: Disney Wonder and it's based in Los Angeles when she embarks.

118
00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:29,720
Speaker 1: Correct and while she was working on the ship, she

119
00:07:30,440 --> 00:07:35,440
Speaker 1: would often sail in the Mexican Riviera, which passes through

120
00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:38,559
Speaker 1: the Panama Canal. And when her father passed away, quoi

121
00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:41,600
Speaker 1: um came back to Chester for two weeks. Uh and

122
00:07:41,720 --> 00:07:45,200
Speaker 1: that would be the last time that anyone in her

123
00:07:45,240 --> 00:07:49,240
Speaker 1: family ever saw her alive, imperson at least right correct.

124
00:07:49,560 --> 00:07:51,840
Speaker 1: Uh So, let's talk a little bit about the cruise

125
00:07:51,840 --> 00:07:55,480
Speaker 1: ship in question. Um. You know, we've we've talked about

126
00:07:55,520 --> 00:07:59,040
Speaker 1: some Disney conspiracies and the idea that you know, no

127
00:07:59,080 --> 00:08:01,640
Speaker 1: one can actually be declared dead at Disney World, or

128
00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:04,480
Speaker 1: that's not true. But there's a lot of interesting things

129
00:08:04,520 --> 00:08:08,480
Speaker 1: that this company goes to great lengths to maintain a

130
00:08:08,480 --> 00:08:11,760
Speaker 1: squeaky clean image. Is very important to Disney, especially when

131
00:08:11,800 --> 00:08:13,920
Speaker 1: it comes to their theme parks. The idea that no

132
00:08:14,040 --> 00:08:16,600
Speaker 1: cast member can ever be seen without their head on,

133
00:08:16,680 --> 00:08:19,040
Speaker 1: their costume on or whatever, because it would disrupt the

134
00:08:19,080 --> 00:08:23,280
Speaker 1: illusion and um could potentially traumatize kids. Uh So, let's

135
00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:26,200
Speaker 1: talk a little bit about the Disney Wonder. This is huge.

136
00:08:26,280 --> 00:08:29,040
Speaker 1: It's a massive, massive cruise ship. She was one of

137
00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:32,920
Speaker 1: about nine hundred and fifty crew members on this ship

138
00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:36,920
Speaker 1: and that's just you know, a portion of the twenty

139
00:08:36,960 --> 00:08:40,600
Speaker 1: four hundred passengers that it can carry all told. Um,

140
00:08:40,640 --> 00:08:44,119
Speaker 1: the ship's n six four feet long and has eleven

141
00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:46,920
Speaker 1: public decks with you know, all the all the bells

142
00:08:46,960 --> 00:08:49,400
Speaker 1: and whistles that you would expect on a cruise ship,

143
00:08:49,400 --> 00:08:51,000
Speaker 1: because the idea of a cruise ship is just supposed

144
00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:54,520
Speaker 1: to be able to unplug completely. Everything is taken care of,

145
00:08:55,000 --> 00:09:00,000
Speaker 1: no expenses spared, it's all inclusive, as people like to say. Um.

146
00:09:00,280 --> 00:09:06,240
Speaker 1: And the ship began service in August of nine, so

147
00:09:06,640 --> 00:09:09,920
Speaker 1: it already, you know, put in some some miles on

148
00:09:09,960 --> 00:09:13,040
Speaker 1: the high seas when Koreum started her her tenure there.

149
00:09:13,280 --> 00:09:18,160
Speaker 1: And like many of the younger people who were working

150
00:09:18,320 --> 00:09:20,599
Speaker 1: in the cruise line industry, we got to keep in

151
00:09:20,640 --> 00:09:23,920
Speaker 1: mind Chorium was only twenty four at this point in

152
00:09:23,960 --> 00:09:28,960
Speaker 1: your life. She found romance. You know, you're you're working

153
00:09:29,040 --> 00:09:32,040
Speaker 1: these crazy hours. I mean, the folks and these crews

154
00:09:32,080 --> 00:09:35,200
Speaker 1: are working seven days a week and it doesn't matter

155
00:09:35,240 --> 00:09:39,479
Speaker 1: if you're off your shift or whatever. If a passenger

156
00:09:39,600 --> 00:09:43,640
Speaker 1: sees you, you're back on immediately. So it's stressful and

157
00:09:43,679 --> 00:09:46,880
Speaker 1: you form close bonds with your colleagues. She found romance

158
00:09:47,360 --> 00:09:53,079
Speaker 1: beginning a relationship with colleague named Tracy Medley. Tracy Medley

159
00:09:53,360 --> 00:09:58,440
Speaker 1: was US resident who was also working on the Disney Wonder.

160
00:09:59,040 --> 00:10:03,520
Speaker 1: Medley will later become the one of the last known

161
00:10:03,640 --> 00:10:09,280
Speaker 1: people to see Rebecca Quarium alive. This is this is

162
00:10:09,320 --> 00:10:11,480
Speaker 1: a little dark, but we're not at the crazy part yet,

163
00:10:11,520 --> 00:10:17,160
Speaker 1: so stick with us. Six weeks after returning to the Wonder,

164
00:10:17,720 --> 00:10:21,200
Speaker 1: Quoium sends a message to her parents via Facebook, and

165
00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:24,679
Speaker 1: this is on March two thousand eleven, and she says,

166
00:10:24,760 --> 00:10:26,600
Speaker 1: you know the stuff you say to your parents when

167
00:10:26,640 --> 00:10:29,160
Speaker 1: you're far away. I love you, I hope you're okay.

168
00:10:29,200 --> 00:10:33,160
Speaker 1: I'm going to call you tomorrow. On March, the Wonder

169
00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:37,280
Speaker 1: was off the coast of Mexico and was heading toward

170
00:10:37,480 --> 00:10:42,840
Speaker 1: Puerto Vieta and Cabo Son Lucas. Quoium misses the start

171
00:10:42,960 --> 00:10:47,440
Speaker 1: of her shift, so people start searching for She's not

172
00:10:47,520 --> 00:10:52,080
Speaker 1: in her cabin, she's not anywhere. She doesn't respond to calls,

173
00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:57,480
Speaker 1: and the ship's p A system and people start to

174
00:10:57,679 --> 00:11:00,520
Speaker 1: escalate the search, right because like you, like you guys said,

175
00:11:00,520 --> 00:11:03,880
Speaker 1: the Wonder is a world class ship, and part of

176
00:11:03,920 --> 00:11:06,480
Speaker 1: being world class means you have a lot of security. Right,

177
00:11:07,480 --> 00:11:10,440
Speaker 1: So they start scanning the CCTV so they can see

178
00:11:10,440 --> 00:11:12,000
Speaker 1: if they can get a b on her whereabouts, and

179
00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:15,320
Speaker 1: they find something pretty troubling. Yes, they caught her on

180
00:11:15,440 --> 00:11:19,680
Speaker 1: camera at five in the morning, so this is actually

181
00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:24,120
Speaker 1: March two, not March one, I guess chronologically. If you're

182
00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:27,200
Speaker 1: looking at the time stamp and it's in the morning,

183
00:11:27,280 --> 00:11:29,640
Speaker 1: it's very early. And in the video you can see

184
00:11:29,640 --> 00:11:33,840
Speaker 1: her on the phone, and you know, this is only

185
00:11:33,880 --> 00:11:37,040
Speaker 1: gleaned from body language that you can see in the video.

186
00:11:37,120 --> 00:11:40,080
Speaker 1: It's not gleaned from audio, but it appears that her

187
00:11:40,120 --> 00:11:44,120
Speaker 1: body language it would show that she's upset for some reason,

188
00:11:44,240 --> 00:11:47,120
Speaker 1: or she's a little out of sorts. There's a young

189
00:11:47,200 --> 00:11:49,800
Speaker 1: man that can be seen on this video that approaches

190
00:11:49,840 --> 00:11:53,200
Speaker 1: her and he appears to ask her a question of

191
00:11:53,240 --> 00:11:56,559
Speaker 1: some sort. It seems like he's he's asking about how

192
00:11:56,559 --> 00:11:59,840
Speaker 1: she's doing, like whether or not she's okay. And again

193
00:12:00,200 --> 00:12:02,360
Speaker 1: no audio, so we don't we don't know exactly what

194
00:12:02,400 --> 00:12:05,400
Speaker 1: he said. Um. She then appears to just give the

195
00:12:05,400 --> 00:12:09,960
Speaker 1: affirmative like I'm fine, everything's okay, then hangs up the

196
00:12:09,960 --> 00:12:13,360
Speaker 1: phone and walks out of frame. Two things, though we

197
00:12:13,400 --> 00:12:16,840
Speaker 1: can see her face visibly when she says yeah fine,

198
00:12:17,000 --> 00:12:19,280
Speaker 1: so you can you can. Lip readers have looked at

199
00:12:19,280 --> 00:12:21,480
Speaker 1: this and they know we know what she said. And

200
00:12:21,520 --> 00:12:25,120
Speaker 1: she's also dressed in baggy clothes that look like a

201
00:12:25,240 --> 00:12:27,920
Speaker 1: dude's clothes, maybe not what she would normally wear. Yeah,

202
00:12:27,920 --> 00:12:30,440
Speaker 1: there's a still frame in an article that I am

203
00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:33,120
Speaker 1: looking at that is she's kind of got her head

204
00:12:33,160 --> 00:12:37,160
Speaker 1: in her hands, like very distraught looking. She pulls her

205
00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:41,200
Speaker 1: Her parents have identified the two two physical things that

206
00:12:41,320 --> 00:12:43,280
Speaker 1: she does after the call, which is to pull her

207
00:12:43,320 --> 00:12:45,679
Speaker 1: hair back and put her hands in her back pockets.

208
00:12:46,160 --> 00:12:50,199
Speaker 1: That is something that that's something that she does often.

209
00:12:50,440 --> 00:12:55,160
Speaker 1: So it's definitely her. And she does appear, as you said, Matt,

210
00:12:55,280 --> 00:12:58,040
Speaker 1: she appears to be agitated. And but when they find

211
00:12:58,040 --> 00:13:02,439
Speaker 1: that tape, let's be clear, that's all they find. Uh,

212
00:13:02,559 --> 00:13:05,880
Speaker 1: according to the official story, A court, Yeah, there it is.

213
00:13:06,000 --> 00:13:08,440
Speaker 1: According to the official story, there's also a pair of

214
00:13:08,559 --> 00:13:13,720
Speaker 1: flip flops found and then later moved back to her

215
00:13:13,800 --> 00:13:18,000
Speaker 1: room by Disney. But the search intensifies. Disney does the

216
00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:22,160
Speaker 1: you know, the right chain of escalation. They contact the U. S.

217
00:13:22,160 --> 00:13:25,560
Speaker 1: Coast Guard, They contact the Mexican Navy. They say, hey,

218
00:13:25,640 --> 00:13:29,000
Speaker 1: we were at international waters, these coordinates where we're heading.

219
00:13:29,280 --> 00:13:33,400
Speaker 1: And so these two organizations searched the path of the

220
00:13:33,440 --> 00:13:36,560
Speaker 1: wonder and just in case there would be a trace

221
00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:39,920
Speaker 1: of as horrible as it is to think of it.

222
00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:43,240
Speaker 1: There might be a trace of someone going overboard, and

223
00:13:43,280 --> 00:13:47,880
Speaker 1: they also don't find anything. That alone is troubling just

224
00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:50,800
Speaker 1: thinking that anyone could fall off of a cruise ship

225
00:13:51,400 --> 00:13:55,360
Speaker 1: and the crew of the ship would be unaware, the

226
00:13:55,400 --> 00:13:58,120
Speaker 1: people who are monitoring cameras, the people who are you know,

227
00:13:58,320 --> 00:14:01,320
Speaker 1: running the ship. It's if she did in fact fall

228
00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:04,600
Speaker 1: off in that moment, just that nobody saw it, nobody

229
00:14:04,640 --> 00:14:07,720
Speaker 1: heard anything. It just happened and she was gone. If

230
00:14:07,760 --> 00:14:11,640
Speaker 1: that's what occurred, that's pretty terrifying in itself. But then

231
00:14:12,400 --> 00:14:15,360
Speaker 1: it gets even weirder as you go deeper into this thing,

232
00:14:15,600 --> 00:14:19,160
Speaker 1: because then you look at what kind of investigation can

233
00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:23,400
Speaker 1: occur when something happens on international waters and who gets jurisdiction.

234
00:14:24,040 --> 00:14:26,720
Speaker 1: Is there some kind of special police force that looks at,

235
00:14:27,080 --> 00:14:38,120
Speaker 1: you know, matters of disappearances on international waters? Police? God, No,

236
00:14:38,320 --> 00:14:42,440
Speaker 1: they don't, um the Yeah, I don't. I don't know.

237
00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:45,440
Speaker 1: Maybe the aquanauts could come out and help. And it

238
00:14:45,480 --> 00:14:47,600
Speaker 1: makes me think of that story we I think we

239
00:14:47,680 --> 00:14:49,280
Speaker 1: covered it on this show. At some point of the

240
00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:54,080
Speaker 1: scientists at the research stations and Antarctica um and there

241
00:14:54,160 --> 00:14:57,000
Speaker 1: was like a murder or a death, and and there

242
00:14:57,080 --> 00:15:00,280
Speaker 1: was this huge kerfuffle as to who had jurisdic action

243
00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:04,080
Speaker 1: over that because it was like between two scientists from

244
00:15:04,160 --> 00:15:08,320
Speaker 1: different international research stations. Um. And this is not exactly

245
00:15:08,320 --> 00:15:10,880
Speaker 1: the same, but it's it's similar in that it's a

246
00:15:10,960 --> 00:15:14,320
Speaker 1: super sticky question as to you know, where the jurisdiction

247
00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:17,840
Speaker 1: lies when you're international waters, because who knows when the

248
00:15:17,880 --> 00:15:21,320
Speaker 1: actual event happened, and maybe that jurisdiction could shift since

249
00:15:21,360 --> 00:15:25,520
Speaker 1: you're in motion, right and you're traveling through different jurisdictions.

250
00:15:25,600 --> 00:15:28,400
Speaker 1: And the case has been made often by you know,

251
00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:33,280
Speaker 1: folks who claimed that cruise ships are a really great

252
00:15:33,280 --> 00:15:35,960
Speaker 1: place to commit the perfect crime. That this is exactly

253
00:15:35,960 --> 00:15:38,880
Speaker 1: why that's the case. The problem is complicated to in

254
00:15:38,880 --> 00:15:42,400
Speaker 1: a way that might seem counterintuitive. Despite the fact that

255
00:15:42,440 --> 00:15:47,200
Speaker 1: Disney is a US company, This boat is registered in

256
00:15:47,240 --> 00:15:50,920
Speaker 1: the Bahamas under something that's called flags of Convenience. It's

257
00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:54,200
Speaker 1: kind of a thing for tax purposes. Uh, and it's

258
00:15:54,320 --> 00:15:59,120
Speaker 1: very common. But this this complicates the investigation immediately and

259
00:15:59,120 --> 00:16:01,960
Speaker 1: it goes directly to that jurisdiction question. And just really

260
00:16:02,000 --> 00:16:04,160
Speaker 1: quickly last thing to your point, the whole flags of

261
00:16:04,200 --> 00:16:06,440
Speaker 1: convenience I hadn't heard that term. But it's the same

262
00:16:06,720 --> 00:16:09,880
Speaker 1: argument that came up when the cruise industry just took

263
00:16:09,920 --> 00:16:14,200
Speaker 1: an absolute nose dive when COVID hit UM. The argument

264
00:16:14,200 --> 00:16:18,080
Speaker 1: that they shouldn't be given bailout money because they don't

265
00:16:18,080 --> 00:16:22,080
Speaker 1: pay taxes to the United States. Well there you go

266
00:16:22,800 --> 00:16:25,720
Speaker 1: something to think about. Well, in in the in the

267
00:16:25,760 --> 00:16:28,760
Speaker 1: case of the wonder, it is, like we said, registered

268
00:16:28,800 --> 00:16:31,440
Speaker 1: in the Bahamas. So a detective from the Royal Bahamas

269
00:16:31,440 --> 00:16:34,080
Speaker 1: Police Force, a man named Paul roll r O l

270
00:16:34,280 --> 00:16:36,680
Speaker 1: l E. Flew all the way from the Bahamas over

271
00:16:36,720 --> 00:16:40,440
Speaker 1: to Los Angeles to investigate once the ship arrived at

272
00:16:40,440 --> 00:16:43,920
Speaker 1: port there, because that's where that's where it came back to. UH.

273
00:16:43,960 --> 00:16:48,480
Speaker 1: And this was three days after the initial disappearance. And

274
00:16:48,520 --> 00:16:51,960
Speaker 1: presumably it's not like they moored the ship instantly after

275
00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:57,240
Speaker 1: finding that she had disappeared. Now they kept on keeping

276
00:16:57,320 --> 00:17:01,400
Speaker 1: on UM. And also korey ms parents also flew out

277
00:17:01,400 --> 00:17:03,680
Speaker 1: to l A and I saw an interview with them.

278
00:17:03,720 --> 00:17:05,960
Speaker 1: I'm sure you guys caught this one too. Is the

279
00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:11,080
Speaker 1: dateline episode UH British Dateline UM where her parents are

280
00:17:11,080 --> 00:17:14,080
Speaker 1: interviewed extensively and they said they were shocked to find

281
00:17:14,119 --> 00:17:16,520
Speaker 1: out that the FBI would not be involved, and that

282
00:17:16,600 --> 00:17:21,080
Speaker 1: this uh detective from the Bahamas was flown far out

283
00:17:21,080 --> 00:17:24,520
Speaker 1: of his jurisdiction to quote unquote investigate and to interview

284
00:17:24,560 --> 00:17:27,880
Speaker 1: people on the ship. Apparently he just spent a day

285
00:17:28,000 --> 00:17:31,080
Speaker 1: on the ship interviewing a handful of people, like the

286
00:17:31,240 --> 00:17:35,840
Speaker 1: very definition of you know, phoning it in. Yeah, no, uh,

287
00:17:35,920 --> 00:17:41,119
Speaker 1: no forensic evidence collection. He interviewed six crew members again,

288
00:17:41,280 --> 00:17:44,720
Speaker 1: the approximately nine and fifty or nine hundred and forty

289
00:17:44,800 --> 00:17:49,679
Speaker 1: nine if you want to be brutally accurate, and he

290
00:17:49,720 --> 00:17:54,640
Speaker 1: didn't interview any passengers at all whatsoever. Uh. The parents

291
00:17:54,760 --> 00:18:00,400
Speaker 1: also started taking issue with some of Disney's act shifts.

292
00:18:00,680 --> 00:18:03,920
Speaker 1: And this this is not us accusing Disney of anything yet,

293
00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:06,600
Speaker 1: this is what the parents said. They said they were

294
00:18:06,680 --> 00:18:09,800
Speaker 1: kept in a car with all blacked out windows, and

295
00:18:09,840 --> 00:18:13,399
Speaker 1: they wanted to go and talk to passengers, right, and

296
00:18:13,440 --> 00:18:16,120
Speaker 1: they had wanted to talk to crew members, but they

297
00:18:16,119 --> 00:18:20,160
Speaker 1: were not admitted to this ship until all the passengers

298
00:18:20,240 --> 00:18:23,200
Speaker 1: from that cruise had disembarked and left, and then they

299
00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:27,320
Speaker 1: were kind of ushered in through a little used side entrance.

300
00:18:27,880 --> 00:18:29,960
Speaker 1: They met with the detective, They met with Paul, and

301
00:18:29,960 --> 00:18:35,360
Speaker 1: they met with the captain. The captain expressed his profound condolences,

302
00:18:35,359 --> 00:18:38,200
Speaker 1: and then the captain is the first one who floats

303
00:18:38,200 --> 00:18:41,440
Speaker 1: the theory. And this is before the investigator does anything,

304
00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:44,480
Speaker 1: because the investigator has to, you know, finish a report

305
00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:48,280
Speaker 1: and make conclusions. But the captain says something along the

306
00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:51,800
Speaker 1: lines of, you know, I it's heartbreaking to say it,

307
00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:54,240
Speaker 1: but I've been thinking of this and the only thing

308
00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:57,879
Speaker 1: that could have happened was that your daughter, Rebecca Quarium,

309
00:18:58,280 --> 00:19:02,800
Speaker 1: was washed overboard by a high wave while she was

310
00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:06,639
Speaker 1: out by the crew pool on deck five. As I

311
00:19:06,720 --> 00:19:09,520
Speaker 1: mentioned earlier, the crew pool, and you can see pictures

312
00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:13,440
Speaker 1: of this. The crew pool is isolated from the rest

313
00:19:13,440 --> 00:19:17,040
Speaker 1: of the public decks and it's, uh, it's one of

314
00:19:17,080 --> 00:19:20,720
Speaker 1: the only spacious places where the crew can hang out

315
00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:24,560
Speaker 1: without being at work, you know. So that's a place

316
00:19:24,560 --> 00:19:26,639
Speaker 1: where a lot of people spend their free time. And

317
00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:29,159
Speaker 1: this is a thing, I mean, it's called a rogue wave.

318
00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:34,760
Speaker 1: It's this idea of a very very um large wave

319
00:19:34,840 --> 00:19:37,160
Speaker 1: that picks up momentum you know, on the open sea

320
00:19:37,720 --> 00:19:40,919
Speaker 1: um and can be really really dangerous even for large

321
00:19:41,000 --> 00:19:45,480
Speaker 1: fortified cruise liners like this. But it would I would

322
00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:49,040
Speaker 1: think it would register on some instruments, or there would

323
00:19:49,080 --> 00:19:51,760
Speaker 1: be proof that such a thing happened, or it would

324
00:19:51,760 --> 00:19:54,720
Speaker 1: be you know, on the surveillance tape. We see her

325
00:19:55,040 --> 00:19:57,719
Speaker 1: on the surveillance tape shortly before disappearance. You would think

326
00:19:57,720 --> 00:19:59,720
Speaker 1: if such a wave happened, they would have footage of

327
00:19:59,760 --> 00:20:01,560
Speaker 1: that too, or it would you know, make a real

328
00:20:01,640 --> 00:20:08,240
Speaker 1: mess on the deck. Yeah, veries two interesting points. This

329
00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:12,439
Speaker 1: didn't seem plausible to the Quarium family. They noted they

330
00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:14,800
Speaker 1: were physically at the area. They noted that the pool

331
00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:19,000
Speaker 1: was surrounded by high walls over six ft tall, so

332
00:20:19,320 --> 00:20:23,840
Speaker 1: they had questions, and these questions just became more profound

333
00:20:24,359 --> 00:20:28,560
Speaker 1: as time went on. The number one question was and

334
00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:33,840
Speaker 1: is what happened to Rebecca. Quarium will explore this after

335
00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:43,600
Speaker 1: a word from our sponsor. Here's where it gets crazy,

336
00:20:44,200 --> 00:20:49,959
Speaker 1: the theories about Okay, the official investigation concluded the same

337
00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:53,320
Speaker 1: thing that the captain said to the parents. The official

338
00:20:53,320 --> 00:20:57,000
Speaker 1: investigation by the police in the Bahamas said that quarium

339
00:20:57,080 --> 00:21:01,720
Speaker 1: went overboard accidentally, possibly due to a rogue wave, sometime

340
00:21:01,800 --> 00:21:04,680
Speaker 1: between the hours of six and nine am on March

341
00:21:05,880 --> 00:21:09,119
Speaker 1: But the quariums and their legal team and the private

342
00:21:09,119 --> 00:21:13,600
Speaker 1: investigators that they worked with later never received a copy

343
00:21:13,880 --> 00:21:17,080
Speaker 1: of this final report, despite the fact that that detective

344
00:21:17,160 --> 00:21:21,080
Speaker 1: did promise them what British detectives received a copy of

345
00:21:21,080 --> 00:21:24,880
Speaker 1: this report, but they said it's horrible. They said it's botched.

346
00:21:25,400 --> 00:21:28,399
Speaker 1: It's not like, it's not meeting the bare minimum of

347
00:21:28,440 --> 00:21:32,600
Speaker 1: detective work. And furthermore, they said they couldn't release it

348
00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:37,040
Speaker 1: to the quariums because it contained restricted personal information about

349
00:21:38,920 --> 00:21:41,480
Speaker 1: that's personal. I guess you just to add on to this.

350
00:21:41,640 --> 00:21:45,320
Speaker 1: We're talking about the possibility that Rebecca Quarium went overboard

351
00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:47,879
Speaker 1: sometimes between the hours of six and nine am on

352
00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:51,800
Speaker 1: that day, right. Uh, they last saw her just before that,

353
00:21:53,280 --> 00:21:55,840
Speaker 1: then it seems that that's when she would have gone.

354
00:21:56,200 --> 00:21:58,040
Speaker 1: I just want to talk about the speed of the

355
00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:00,640
Speaker 1: Disney wonder when you're just imagine this in your head.

356
00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:03,400
Speaker 1: You've got a cruise ship traveling along, perhaps a wave

357
00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:05,879
Speaker 1: comes up and wash somebody in, Like how far away

358
00:22:05,880 --> 00:22:08,480
Speaker 1: do you get? How how quickly is that cruise ship

359
00:22:08,520 --> 00:22:12,720
Speaker 1: moving away from a person that is then in the water. Uh,

360
00:22:12,800 --> 00:22:16,920
Speaker 1: The the operating speed, the service speed is what is

361
00:22:16,960 --> 00:22:19,560
Speaker 1: known as is around twenty one and a half knots,

362
00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:23,720
Speaker 1: which is about twenty five miles per hour, or about

363
00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:27,680
Speaker 1: forty kilometers per hour. So that's how quickly this massive

364
00:22:27,680 --> 00:22:30,199
Speaker 1: ship is moving away from you. If you happen to

365
00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:33,080
Speaker 1: fall into the water, you can't swim to that. You

366
00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:35,800
Speaker 1: cannot swim to that. And also they would be they

367
00:22:35,800 --> 00:22:39,639
Speaker 1: would be gone rather quickly. Well, and that also means

368
00:22:39,680 --> 00:22:43,399
Speaker 1: that this would have to be the most monster of

369
00:22:43,560 --> 00:22:45,879
Speaker 1: rogue waves ever for it to not just kind of

370
00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:49,600
Speaker 1: pass it by, right like if you're moving at and

371
00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:51,399
Speaker 1: this massive weight like it's it's I don't know, like

372
00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:57,360
Speaker 1: it's just waves crash pretty slowly, you know what I mean, Like,

373
00:22:57,920 --> 00:23:00,000
Speaker 1: I don't know. It would have to be it would

374
00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:01,520
Speaker 1: have to be big, and I mean it would just

375
00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:02,960
Speaker 1: have to be huge to the point where there would

376
00:23:02,960 --> 00:23:05,080
Speaker 1: have to be video evidence of it. If if you know,

377
00:23:05,119 --> 00:23:07,840
Speaker 1: all of these cameras were in service, which they appeared

378
00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:11,439
Speaker 1: to have been, that's a that's another question. We're getting

379
00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:15,200
Speaker 1: to it right right now. At least one British politician

380
00:23:16,080 --> 00:23:21,080
Speaker 1: takes explicit issue with the official story and has gone

381
00:23:21,119 --> 00:23:25,600
Speaker 1: on record against the official explanation. Labor MP Chris Matheson,

382
00:23:25,960 --> 00:23:30,240
Speaker 1: who since has represented the city of Chester. Oh we

383
00:23:30,280 --> 00:23:32,720
Speaker 1: didn't mention that Chester for New one is not familiar.

384
00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:36,000
Speaker 1: It's like a little bit south of Liverpool, so that's

385
00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:41,199
Speaker 1: where it's located. He believes that Quarium did not go

386
00:23:41,280 --> 00:23:44,040
Speaker 1: overboard and accident. He believes that she was a victim

387
00:23:44,119 --> 00:23:48,560
Speaker 1: of crime and possibly assaulted or murdered, and said, the

388
00:23:48,680 --> 00:23:51,399
Speaker 1: more you look into this, the more it smells rotten,

389
00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:54,479
Speaker 1: the more it smells like a crime has taken place.

390
00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:58,160
Speaker 1: And those kind of statements or these sentiments rather were

391
00:23:58,200 --> 00:24:00,919
Speaker 1: shared by many people. That's why the quariums hire a

392
00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:04,960
Speaker 1: private investigator named Roy Ram, which is a great name. Uh.

393
00:24:05,400 --> 00:24:08,840
Speaker 1: He's a former specialist of Scotland yard. He knows, he

394
00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:12,680
Speaker 1: knows his way around. And they also sought the aid

395
00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:15,679
Speaker 1: of that MP Matheson. They also sought the aid of

396
00:24:15,720 --> 00:24:21,080
Speaker 1: the former Deputy Prime Minister, Lord Prescott and rams investigation

397
00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:28,040
Speaker 1: reveals several key pieces of information that don't They don't

398
00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:34,320
Speaker 1: conclusively prove what happened to Quarium, but they do, and

399
00:24:34,560 --> 00:24:38,000
Speaker 1: I tried to put this very diplomatically, they do challenge

400
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:42,400
Speaker 1: the official explanation from both the Bahamas and from Disney

401
00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:47,199
Speaker 1: the mouse. So first that rogue wave question, here's the answer.

402
00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:52,520
Speaker 1: Any wave capable of washing a person of quarium's size

403
00:24:52,560 --> 00:24:55,840
Speaker 1: and think of her as like average person size overboard

404
00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:59,520
Speaker 1: from that that deck five pool. That wave would have

405
00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:03,359
Speaker 1: to be at least a hundred feet high, you would

406
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:07,960
Speaker 1: notice when it hit. Uh. Secondly, the weather and sea

407
00:25:08,040 --> 00:25:10,800
Speaker 1: conditions in this part of the ocean where they're at

408
00:25:10,840 --> 00:25:13,840
Speaker 1: at the time. If you look at all the monitoring

409
00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:18,320
Speaker 1: done by various agencies, it there wasn't a storm, like

410
00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:21,040
Speaker 1: what what would have made this wave of cur a

411
00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:25,880
Speaker 1: wave of this size? Yeah. And you know, perhaps even

412
00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:29,639
Speaker 1: more damning, in my opinion at least, is that the

413
00:25:29,640 --> 00:25:34,240
Speaker 1: CCTV footage that was accessible to both the investigation from

414
00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:36,720
Speaker 1: our our friend there from the Bahamas, as well as

415
00:25:37,160 --> 00:25:40,480
Speaker 1: what was known to be aware to the family, it

416
00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:43,959
Speaker 1: seems to have been cropped to obscure the time stamp

417
00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:47,480
Speaker 1: UH and the location and some of the information that

418
00:25:47,480 --> 00:25:53,600
Speaker 1: would actually be embedded into that footage. That is, that's weird.

419
00:25:54,040 --> 00:25:57,000
Speaker 1: That shouldn't happen. There should be a raw file that is,

420
00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:00,240
Speaker 1: you know, given to any investigator looking. Yes, I mean

421
00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:02,520
Speaker 1: even knowing what we noticed about Like the way video

422
00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:06,040
Speaker 1: recording works, it's like you you it's either it's either

423
00:26:06,520 --> 00:26:09,720
Speaker 1: gone or it's like it's supposed to be like this

424
00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:12,800
Speaker 1: detail is very troubling, like someone and it's also odd,

425
00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:15,280
Speaker 1: like a weird way of trying to obscure something to

426
00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:17,840
Speaker 1: go in and crop the footage as opposed to just

427
00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:19,639
Speaker 1: getting rid of it and blaming it on a glitch.

428
00:26:19,920 --> 00:26:21,920
Speaker 1: You know what I mean. It's very strange, very unusual.

429
00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:25,040
Speaker 1: And also you know, I was trying to think through

430
00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:29,199
Speaker 1: the possibilities, just like chain of chain of custody for

431
00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:34,080
Speaker 1: this footage. Did Ram get this directly from Disney or

432
00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:38,320
Speaker 1: did he get it directly from the detective in the Bahamas,

433
00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:40,760
Speaker 1: or did he get it from British law enforcement? And

434
00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:44,800
Speaker 1: depending on where the what the providence of it was,

435
00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:51,840
Speaker 1: it is possible it is possible that somebody between Disney

436
00:26:51,880 --> 00:26:56,119
Speaker 1: and this p I had done something with the tape,

437
00:26:56,119 --> 00:27:03,159
Speaker 1: but Disney would like twenty Around this time, it was

438
00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:06,120
Speaker 1: a little more difficult than it is now to just

439
00:27:06,440 --> 00:27:09,000
Speaker 1: bring in a piece of video to an editing software

440
00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:11,920
Speaker 1: or export a piece of video and do it correctly

441
00:27:12,040 --> 00:27:14,800
Speaker 1: without messing something up. When it turns to aspect ratio,

442
00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:17,200
Speaker 1: I'm serious, Like, no, you're totally right. No, yeah, man,

443
00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:19,080
Speaker 1: I was there with you when you were doing this stuff.

444
00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:22,080
Speaker 1: I just mean especially if you're not a power user.

445
00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:26,280
Speaker 1: It's it's more difficult to get it completely correct. So

446
00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:29,600
Speaker 1: that is a possibility. So we're being overly fair. That

447
00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:35,919
Speaker 1: is a possibility, but Disney's story makes it suspicious. First,

448
00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:38,800
Speaker 1: I want to describe a little bit about these cameras

449
00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:43,680
Speaker 1: and we'll we'll get we'll get further into this, but uh,

450
00:27:43,720 --> 00:27:48,320
Speaker 1: these cameras are disguised so that the passenger, like everything

451
00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:53,399
Speaker 1: is about maintaining that magic feeling of the magic kingdom

452
00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:57,520
Speaker 1: on the deep blue sea. So the closed circuit TV

453
00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:00,840
Speaker 1: cameras are hidden in things. It's like they're hidden in

454
00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:05,080
Speaker 1: these long tubes on deck five. But they also they

455
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:08,679
Speaker 1: blend in with the outdoor nautical and safety equipment. You

456
00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:11,400
Speaker 1: have to be purposely looking for them to find them.

457
00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:15,679
Speaker 1: And this so Disney says, Okay, this footage. We have

458
00:28:16,200 --> 00:28:19,680
Speaker 1: the screenshot we've described in that phone conversation that happened

459
00:28:19,680 --> 00:28:24,600
Speaker 1: inside or on deck five, but Rob and other investigators

460
00:28:24,920 --> 00:28:27,600
Speaker 1: now believe it was shot on deck one, which is

461
00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:31,679
Speaker 1: nowhere close to deck five. The family has been denied

462
00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:34,240
Speaker 1: access to copies of the video as well as the

463
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:38,520
Speaker 1: final report. They saw the footage, they were not allowed

464
00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:41,560
Speaker 1: to have a copy of it. Got it? Got it? Okay, okay,

465
00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:48,120
Speaker 1: So there's a bit of a almost a Cinderella trope

466
00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:51,520
Speaker 1: here to there are they're forgotten shoes or in this

467
00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:54,480
Speaker 1: case sandals, flip flops might call them, depend on what

468
00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:58,240
Speaker 1: part of the world you live in. This was allegedly

469
00:28:58,320 --> 00:29:05,520
Speaker 1: discovered on deck five, and officially the ship's management concluded

470
00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:08,720
Speaker 1: that this sandal belonged to Rebecca Quarium. However, it had

471
00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:11,640
Speaker 1: the name and cabin number of a different person, and

472
00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:14,440
Speaker 1: both the Quarium family and members of the crew who

473
00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:17,840
Speaker 1: were friends with Rebecca said the sandal was first off,

474
00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:20,440
Speaker 1: not her style at all, not her vibe, not something

475
00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:23,320
Speaker 1: she would wear. And then secondly, it was the wrong size.

476
00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:26,680
Speaker 1: They got the wrong shoe. Because again there's not any

477
00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:31,320
Speaker 1: investigation of the disappearance until at least three days afterwards.

478
00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:36,040
Speaker 1: The sandal gets moved by The sandal gets moved by

479
00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:40,640
Speaker 1: management of the ship, and they return it with the

480
00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:44,080
Speaker 1: rest of Rebecca's things to her cabin and her family.

481
00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:46,800
Speaker 1: Like when her family gets there, one of the things

482
00:29:46,800 --> 00:29:50,040
Speaker 1: they do is collect her stuff from the cabin. Can

483
00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:52,920
Speaker 1: I I just point this out? That is something that

484
00:29:52,960 --> 00:29:56,720
Speaker 1: goes down on a lot of cruise ships, even if

485
00:29:56,760 --> 00:30:00,200
Speaker 1: a person hasn't officially disappeared or anything like that, if

486
00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:03,760
Speaker 1: there are any personal personal effects that are anywhere else

487
00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:05,840
Speaker 1: on the ship, especially if they are a crew members

488
00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:09,280
Speaker 1: and they are specifically UM marked as so, they will

489
00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:13,520
Speaker 1: be returned to the cabin of that crew member UM,

490
00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:17,040
Speaker 1: which can make it very difficult to trace things when

491
00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:19,760
Speaker 1: an investigation needs to occur about a person who in

492
00:30:19,800 --> 00:30:24,200
Speaker 1: fact has gone missing. Yeah, and this so these answers

493
00:30:24,200 --> 00:30:28,360
Speaker 1: are already UM They're not proof of a cover up,

494
00:30:28,520 --> 00:30:33,960
Speaker 1: to be clear, but they're they're disturbing, and this prompts,

495
00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:37,360
Speaker 1: this prompts a flurry of speculation and prompts some some

496
00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:41,280
Speaker 1: really great investigative journalism, which especially like to shout out

497
00:30:41,640 --> 00:30:45,880
Speaker 1: John Ronson over at The Guardian. He sailed aboard the

498
00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:51,200
Speaker 1: Wonder as a civilian about seven months, I want to say,

499
00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:55,720
Speaker 1: after Quarium's disappearance. Yeah, and while he was on this,

500
00:30:56,320 --> 00:30:59,280
Speaker 1: while he's on the cruise, he started, you know, quietly

501
00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:03,320
Speaker 1: befriending and talking to the crew about this. And this

502
00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:06,080
Speaker 1: is when he hits a little bit of a stone

503
00:31:06,120 --> 00:31:09,360
Speaker 1: wall with some chinks in it. We do also want

504
00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:11,920
Speaker 1: to want to shout out Ronson in particular. He's done

505
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:15,320
Speaker 1: some great work with the Builderberg Group as well, and

506
00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:19,760
Speaker 1: he appears on one of our peer podcasts that that

507
00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:23,240
Speaker 1: just came out called Labyrinths, made by a friend of

508
00:31:23,280 --> 00:31:25,640
Speaker 1: the show, Chandler Mays. Did you guys check this out?

509
00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:28,960
Speaker 1: The sound design is top notch. It's excellent. Yeah. I

510
00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:32,480
Speaker 1: actually had the fortune of working with Chandler to make it.

511
00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:35,320
Speaker 1: Kind of early nineties hip hop sounding track that was

512
00:31:35,440 --> 00:31:37,760
Speaker 1: used in an episode of the show. Um, but it's

513
00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:42,000
Speaker 1: top notch stuff Amanda Knox and her partner investigating kind

514
00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:45,000
Speaker 1: of stories of people getting lost and found. Um and

515
00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:47,480
Speaker 1: Ronson also was the guy who wrote The Men Who

516
00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:50,960
Speaker 1: Stare At Goats If you remember that film with George

517
00:31:51,000 --> 00:31:53,160
Speaker 1: Clooney about kind of like this almost a remote viewing

518
00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:55,800
Speaker 1: type program that was in the military, the one that

519
00:31:55,840 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 1: we've spoken about many a time on this show Stargate.

520
00:31:58,320 --> 00:32:02,680
Speaker 1: I believe, well, we should speak about that more again.

521
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:04,200
Speaker 1: You know what we should do. We should get a

522
00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:06,320
Speaker 1: goat and stare at it. We always talk about it,

523
00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:08,120
Speaker 1: but we never get together and do it. We got

524
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:13,040
Speaker 1: to just put our money where are But but you're right,

525
00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:15,800
Speaker 1: you're right. Uh, we we like labyrinths and there's a

526
00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:21,200
Speaker 1: great interview with Ronson about his surreal experiences, uh investigating

527
00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:24,440
Speaker 1: the Builderberg Group, wherein he interviews one of the co

528
00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:28,200
Speaker 1: founders too in that process. So do check that out.

529
00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:32,960
Speaker 1: That's out now, you can check that out now. Yeah, listeners, first,

530
00:32:32,960 --> 00:32:35,320
Speaker 1: but how interesting is it that Amanda Knox is a

531
00:32:35,360 --> 00:32:38,000
Speaker 1: host of a show we we've we've spoken about her,

532
00:32:38,080 --> 00:32:40,400
Speaker 1: I believe once or twice on this show, just with

533
00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:44,680
Speaker 1: her ordeal that she went through. Um makes sense story

534
00:32:44,840 --> 00:32:48,640
Speaker 1: of like you know, kind of people going through transformative

535
00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:51,600
Speaker 1: events and perhaps uh coming coming back out on the

536
00:32:51,640 --> 00:32:53,960
Speaker 1: other side, which definitely happened with her. So we just

537
00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:57,160
Speaker 1: wanted to let you know Ronson has his bona fides. Yeah,

538
00:32:57,200 --> 00:32:59,680
Speaker 1: he's not just some guy who is like, what's an

539
00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:02,600
Speaker 1: interest theme thing I can do on this cruise. He

540
00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:04,320
Speaker 1: was there on a mission for a reason. He had

541
00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:08,800
Speaker 1: a motive. So there's this. You can read the article

542
00:33:08,840 --> 00:33:12,280
Speaker 1: in full. We wouldn't give you some some of the

543
00:33:12,320 --> 00:33:18,040
Speaker 1: pivotal moments of his investigation. So he's talking to a

544
00:33:18,200 --> 00:33:22,880
Speaker 1: bartender I believe it was a crew member, and he asked, hey,

545
00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:27,480
Speaker 1: what about that quarium disappearance? And this person ends up

546
00:33:27,520 --> 00:33:33,080
Speaker 1: saying at first they say, oh, it didn't happen. Sorry,

547
00:33:33,120 --> 00:33:35,520
Speaker 1: you know, that's what I have to say. And so

548
00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:37,360
Speaker 1: he doesn't have luck with that person. He goes to

549
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:40,000
Speaker 1: another crew member and one crew member is talking to

550
00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:43,400
Speaker 1: him about that phone call. Right, the phone call is

551
00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:45,600
Speaker 1: a big mystery or was for a time. And this

552
00:33:45,640 --> 00:33:50,240
Speaker 1: crew member says, Disney knows exactly what happened that phone

553
00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:54,000
Speaker 1: call she had. It was taped. Everything here is taped.

554
00:33:54,160 --> 00:34:02,400
Speaker 1: There's CCTV everywhere. Disney has the tape. Yikes. You can imagine, right,

555
00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:05,360
Speaker 1: you'd think that a company like Disney operating a cruise

556
00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:09,480
Speaker 1: ship would want to have, you know, evidence of everything

557
00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:11,920
Speaker 1: just in case they're going to get sued for one

558
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:14,399
Speaker 1: reason or another. You you've got it on tape, You've

559
00:34:14,440 --> 00:34:18,560
Speaker 1: trained your employees there. You know you're probably not going

560
00:34:18,640 --> 00:34:20,560
Speaker 1: to get into an issue with an employee, you hope

561
00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:23,120
Speaker 1: or you believe, right, if something goes wrong on your

562
00:34:23,120 --> 00:34:26,759
Speaker 1: ship that costs millions of dollars to operate, um that

563
00:34:26,800 --> 00:34:29,200
Speaker 1: you've got so much investment in of your image and everything,

564
00:34:29,480 --> 00:34:32,680
Speaker 1: you'd want to be able to prove that the the

565
00:34:33,520 --> 00:34:35,560
Speaker 1: person who was on your ship, who paid to be there,

566
00:34:35,600 --> 00:34:37,960
Speaker 1: did something wrong and it wasn't your employee or something

567
00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:41,440
Speaker 1: to that effect, right, just to cover yourself. Yea, it

568
00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:46,440
Speaker 1: makes sense. So logically you'd think, just like this person

569
00:34:46,520 --> 00:34:49,359
Speaker 1: is saying that there would be CCTV of every inch

570
00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:52,040
Speaker 1: of that place. Yeah, of course, I mean, can you

571
00:34:52,120 --> 00:34:57,080
Speaker 1: imagine the liability alone, like this can end a cruise

572
00:34:57,080 --> 00:35:00,480
Speaker 1: ship if the wrong thing happens and it's not our noval,

573
00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:03,520
Speaker 1: so it can it can end up company. I mean

574
00:35:04,560 --> 00:35:09,760
Speaker 1: if it's well, okay, fair enough. Fans of the HBO

575
00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:13,880
Speaker 1: series Succession might remember a plot line, and that's about

576
00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:17,040
Speaker 1: a giant company that's sort of a multi lateral company

577
00:35:17,040 --> 00:35:21,120
Speaker 1: that has theme parks and obviously big television and film

578
00:35:21,120 --> 00:35:23,880
Speaker 1: interest and also a cruise line. Um and there's a

579
00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:28,600
Speaker 1: story about kind of a cover up involving a sexual

580
00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:32,440
Speaker 1: assaults and falling overboard of a passenger. Um and and

581
00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:34,600
Speaker 1: in the show, this is not a spoiler really, um

582
00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:37,319
Speaker 1: if it is, maybe fast forward ten seconds. They have

583
00:35:38,120 --> 00:35:41,480
Speaker 1: copious evidence of all of these things that they do keep. Yeah,

584
00:35:41,640 --> 00:35:45,520
Speaker 1: and this and there's no reason that fiction, uh that

585
00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:49,440
Speaker 1: that uh fiction show might not have at least partial

586
00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:56,600
Speaker 1: basis in real events. So Ronson reaches out to Disney directly, uh.

587
00:35:56,640 --> 00:36:01,239
Speaker 1: And it's in a conversation with a spokesperson for the corporation,

588
00:36:01,840 --> 00:36:06,279
Speaker 1: and when Ronson asked the spokesperson whether or not that

589
00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:09,560
Speaker 1: telephone call is taped, he gets he gets a very

590
00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:14,600
Speaker 1: weird reply. They say that pertains to specific details about

591
00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:17,520
Speaker 1: the investigation, and so it's not appropriate for us to

592
00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:20,880
Speaker 1: share that kind of information, which is a matrix dodge.

593
00:36:21,160 --> 00:36:24,319
Speaker 1: That's not that's not even that's like, I can't that's

594
00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:27,120
Speaker 1: not even a question that can exist in this conversation.

595
00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:34,240
Speaker 1: Maybe yes, that's not yes. But then the spokesperson adds,

596
00:36:35,120 --> 00:36:38,080
Speaker 1: we wish we knew what happened as much as anyone.

597
00:36:38,680 --> 00:36:43,200
Speaker 1: So there the implication there, or the way you're supposed

598
00:36:43,239 --> 00:36:47,120
Speaker 1: to feel from that statement, is that, uh, Disney is

599
00:36:47,200 --> 00:36:50,040
Speaker 1: on board with learning the truth. They just they can't.

600
00:36:50,080 --> 00:36:52,799
Speaker 1: Their hands are tied, is what they're arguing, which is

601
00:36:52,880 --> 00:36:57,320
Speaker 1: maybe not completely accurate. So they He also found Disney

602
00:36:57,360 --> 00:37:01,759
Speaker 1: claims to have no footage of quarium go overboard, and

603
00:37:02,760 --> 00:37:07,560
Speaker 1: while they admit they have cc TV right, they refused

604
00:37:07,560 --> 00:37:11,960
Speaker 1: to disclose the number of cameras or their locations anywhere

605
00:37:11,960 --> 00:37:16,200
Speaker 1: on the ship for security reasons, which I understand. I

606
00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:19,160
Speaker 1: understand that's something you don't want people to find with

607
00:37:19,200 --> 00:37:22,160
Speaker 1: a quick Internet search or whatever, but you would think

608
00:37:22,239 --> 00:37:26,120
Speaker 1: law enforcement should be able to get that information, right. Yeah,

609
00:37:26,200 --> 00:37:28,600
Speaker 1: you know what you would do. I mean you would

610
00:37:28,680 --> 00:37:32,799
Speaker 1: have you would have Disney Wonder export every moment of

611
00:37:32,880 --> 00:37:37,080
Speaker 1: CCTV footage from every camera on the ship and from

612
00:37:37,120 --> 00:37:41,760
Speaker 1: the hours of five thirty am, maybe even five am,

613
00:37:41,960 --> 00:37:45,080
Speaker 1: until the moment that she was found to not be

614
00:37:45,160 --> 00:37:47,920
Speaker 1: on the ship. That's what you would do, and you

615
00:37:47,960 --> 00:37:50,399
Speaker 1: could you could comb through every moment of it as

616
00:37:50,440 --> 00:37:53,040
Speaker 1: a you know, a third party investigator, and you could

617
00:37:53,040 --> 00:37:56,200
Speaker 1: find out what happened to her in all likelihood. I mean,

618
00:37:56,239 --> 00:37:58,720
Speaker 1: that's all it would take. I think. Yeah. And maybe

619
00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:01,680
Speaker 1: I mean maybe it's the thing where they feel they

620
00:38:01,680 --> 00:38:04,279
Speaker 1: should have more cameras and don't want people to know

621
00:38:04,320 --> 00:38:08,000
Speaker 1: how few they actually have. I'm not sure, but Ronson's

622
00:38:08,040 --> 00:38:12,440
Speaker 1: conclusion is that the only way quarium could have fallen

623
00:38:12,680 --> 00:38:17,359
Speaker 1: is from a jogging track the deck below on deck four. Uh.

624
00:38:17,600 --> 00:38:20,360
Speaker 1: He said that the railings everywhere else, just like the

625
00:38:20,400 --> 00:38:23,400
Speaker 1: quarium's parents pointed out, the railings everywhere else are just

626
00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:26,920
Speaker 1: too high, and he says maybe after this early morning

627
00:38:27,000 --> 00:38:30,480
Speaker 1: phone call, Uh, quarium went on a jog, which checks out.

628
00:38:30,560 --> 00:38:35,440
Speaker 1: She's an athletic person, and maybe she slipped and somehow

629
00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:40,080
Speaker 1: fell overboard. While he was on the Disney wonder he

630
00:38:40,160 --> 00:38:44,680
Speaker 1: explored deck four and he found four different CCTV cameras,

631
00:38:44,680 --> 00:38:49,200
Speaker 1: two on the port side, too on starboard, and so

632
00:38:49,360 --> 00:38:52,560
Speaker 1: he thinks there was something. But every time he asked

633
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:55,680
Speaker 1: crew members about the disappearance, he received some version of

634
00:38:55,719 --> 00:38:59,120
Speaker 1: the same answer. She fell overboard from deck five at

635
00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:02,560
Speaker 1: the crew pool. There's nothing darker, sinister, they say, not

636
00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:06,280
Speaker 1: here at Disney. But what else did the crew say,

637
00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:08,879
Speaker 1: you know, when they got comfortable, I'll tell you after

638
00:39:08,920 --> 00:39:18,839
Speaker 1: a word from our sponsor, and we're back. Before we left,

639
00:39:18,840 --> 00:39:22,120
Speaker 1: we were discussing just the fact that the crew told

640
00:39:22,200 --> 00:39:25,879
Speaker 1: John Ronson that the same story right, that she fell

641
00:39:26,080 --> 00:39:30,560
Speaker 1: somehow overboard and on that deck five by the crew pool.

642
00:39:31,360 --> 00:39:35,600
Speaker 1: That is again, if you believe that the only way

643
00:39:35,640 --> 00:39:38,400
Speaker 1: that she got off of the ship was by her

644
00:39:38,440 --> 00:39:41,960
Speaker 1: own volition, by falling off or jumping off, rather than

645
00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:47,279
Speaker 1: being pushed or you know, someone forcing her off um

646
00:39:47,400 --> 00:39:51,040
Speaker 1: or even as dark as it is, her body maybe

647
00:39:51,200 --> 00:39:53,640
Speaker 1: was thrown off. That's a possibility. We have to keep

648
00:39:53,680 --> 00:39:56,800
Speaker 1: all of these things as possibilities as we go on.

649
00:39:57,400 --> 00:40:00,680
Speaker 1: So let's get into some of the other crew speculation

650
00:40:00,920 --> 00:40:04,120
Speaker 1: that Ben alluded to. Right before we left, there was

651
00:40:04,719 --> 00:40:08,080
Speaker 1: a single crew member, one of Koreum's friends, who says

652
00:40:08,239 --> 00:40:11,280
Speaker 1: that Koreum was having a fight with her romantic partner.

653
00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:14,400
Speaker 1: That person that we mentioned earlier, Um, I believe it

654
00:40:14,440 --> 00:40:18,720
Speaker 1: is MS Medley. There's another crew member that disputed this claim.

655
00:40:19,640 --> 00:40:21,920
Speaker 1: Uh this this other person was saying that Coreyum was

656
00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:25,359
Speaker 1: on the phone with a mutual friend of Quarium and

657
00:40:25,800 --> 00:40:30,279
Speaker 1: Melodies and not not Melody herself. But again, that's kind

658
00:40:30,320 --> 00:40:33,440
Speaker 1: of a one person said. The other person said, so

659
00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:37,759
Speaker 1: it's difficult to know what to believe there. But there's

660
00:40:37,760 --> 00:40:41,200
Speaker 1: another another crew member that stated that after this phone call,

661
00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:44,160
Speaker 1: Choreum may have taken a walk. Well, we'll get into

662
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:46,879
Speaker 1: a little further about why this person believes that maybe

663
00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:49,000
Speaker 1: she had taken a walk. And at this point, this

664
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:52,440
Speaker 1: person says, perhaps she wasn't pushed over or or swept

665
00:40:52,480 --> 00:40:57,280
Speaker 1: away by some wave, but by the wind. A possibility.

666
00:40:57,320 --> 00:41:01,200
Speaker 1: But again, it just it's tough to belief, but it's

667
00:41:01,200 --> 00:41:03,399
Speaker 1: at all that's excuse in the book, it was only

668
00:41:03,440 --> 00:41:07,480
Speaker 1: the wind, you know, yeah, and they have a they

669
00:41:08,040 --> 00:41:10,600
Speaker 1: you know, you can you can read in full their quote,

670
00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:15,399
Speaker 1: but there they're saying that they know the deck by

671
00:41:15,400 --> 00:41:19,520
Speaker 1: the crew pool specifically was very windy and slippery, and

672
00:41:19,800 --> 00:41:24,120
Speaker 1: that management had called everybody to get inside and not

673
00:41:24,239 --> 00:41:27,480
Speaker 1: be on deck, and that Disney took this very seriously.

674
00:41:27,600 --> 00:41:31,200
Speaker 1: One guy violated that and he got sent home. So

675
00:41:31,840 --> 00:41:34,960
Speaker 1: that's that's their argument that there was something to the wind,

676
00:41:35,400 --> 00:41:39,120
Speaker 1: But many crew members believe the company is not sharing

677
00:41:39,200 --> 00:41:42,879
Speaker 1: everything it knows and may also be actively covering something up.

678
00:41:42,920 --> 00:41:46,880
Speaker 1: At this point, we have to say rumors abound in

679
00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:49,359
Speaker 1: this kind of work environment, you know what I mean,

680
00:41:49,360 --> 00:41:51,840
Speaker 1: There's there's a lot of drama. There's a lot of

681
00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:57,200
Speaker 1: intrigue going on, uh, from everything from like preferential treatment

682
00:41:57,320 --> 00:42:01,600
Speaker 1: to who is party and too hard to who hooks

683
00:42:01,680 --> 00:42:05,120
Speaker 1: up with whom? You know. So it's not at all

684
00:42:05,200 --> 00:42:08,719
Speaker 1: strange that something we might call a conspiracy theory could

685
00:42:08,760 --> 00:42:13,000
Speaker 1: arise or Germany in this soil. Anyhow, outside of the crew,

686
00:42:14,440 --> 00:42:18,960
Speaker 1: people like Stephen Moseley, another MP over in Britain, also

687
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:23,000
Speaker 1: came out and said that they had problems with the investigation.

688
00:42:23,080 --> 00:42:26,800
Speaker 1: Mostly said specifically that Disney seemed more interested in getting

689
00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:29,520
Speaker 1: the ship back to sea than in the case of

690
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:33,160
Speaker 1: a missing crew member, and also noted it is appalling

691
00:42:33,600 --> 00:42:39,160
Speaker 1: that only one policeman from the Bahamas and authority internationally

692
00:42:39,200 --> 00:42:42,520
Speaker 1: recognized these are his words, not ours, as almost toothless

693
00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:47,719
Speaker 1: was called to investigate this crime. And it is it

694
00:42:47,880 --> 00:42:50,960
Speaker 1: is weird to your to our earlier point, there was

695
00:42:51,000 --> 00:42:56,399
Speaker 1: a law passed after the passage of Rebecca Aquarium that

696
00:42:56,520 --> 00:43:01,919
Speaker 1: gives the FBI jurisdiction for cruise ship investigations if it's

697
00:43:01,920 --> 00:43:05,080
Speaker 1: a US resident who has gone missing, her murdered. So

698
00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:08,360
Speaker 1: that's some kind of progress, But the flag of the

699
00:43:08,400 --> 00:43:11,800
Speaker 1: convenience countries, you know, the odds are stacked in favor

700
00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:15,120
Speaker 1: of the cruise line in this case. You know, the

701
00:43:15,239 --> 00:43:23,240
Speaker 1: lawyers that they have and the interlinking jurisdictional territorial things. Matt,

702
00:43:23,280 --> 00:43:28,239
Speaker 1: you mentioned the you mentioned the girlfriend. We mentioned the

703
00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:33,240
Speaker 1: romantic partner a couple of times, but she was silent

704
00:43:33,480 --> 00:43:36,840
Speaker 1: about this for about six years, and then she came

705
00:43:36,920 --> 00:43:41,920
Speaker 1: forward and shared some new information that cast the disappearance

706
00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:44,200
Speaker 1: in a bit of a different light. Yes, her name

707
00:43:44,239 --> 00:43:47,400
Speaker 1: is Tracy Medley. That's a romantic partner of Choreum. She stated,

708
00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:52,919
Speaker 1: that she and Korium had apparently had a threesome with

709
00:43:53,080 --> 00:43:56,080
Speaker 1: another person working on the ship, another crew member, a

710
00:43:56,120 --> 00:44:01,600
Speaker 1: man named Devin Hyde. And there you know through these

711
00:44:01,600 --> 00:44:06,360
Speaker 1: private investigations that that happened after the disappearance. They claimed

712
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:10,480
Speaker 1: that this alleged threesome took place um in this man

713
00:44:10,640 --> 00:44:13,560
Speaker 1: Devin Hides Cabin, who by the way, was a married

714
00:44:14,200 --> 00:44:18,120
Speaker 1: a father and a married man. Um And this was

715
00:44:18,239 --> 00:44:21,719
Speaker 1: quote the first time Miss Quarium had had sexual relations

716
00:44:21,800 --> 00:44:26,479
Speaker 1: with a man, which apparently, according to this investigation, left

717
00:44:26,520 --> 00:44:31,320
Speaker 1: her quote distraught and traumatized. This certainly is a wrinkle

718
00:44:32,040 --> 00:44:34,239
Speaker 1: in something like this. And we know that crimes of

719
00:44:34,320 --> 00:44:38,480
Speaker 1: passion a lot of times, you know, occur quickly. And

720
00:44:38,680 --> 00:44:40,600
Speaker 1: you know, we've talked about this many times in the past.

721
00:44:41,040 --> 00:44:45,680
Speaker 1: Um when there when there is a sexual relationship involved

722
00:44:45,680 --> 00:44:49,960
Speaker 1: in any form, it increases the chances that that person

723
00:44:50,360 --> 00:44:53,799
Speaker 1: perhaps is involved in a disappearance. When you know, when

724
00:44:53,840 --> 00:44:58,200
Speaker 1: disappearances occur, you very often the romantic partners are looked

725
00:44:58,200 --> 00:45:04,160
Speaker 1: at as the prime suspect. It's that it's always the husband, yeah,

726
00:45:04,200 --> 00:45:07,600
Speaker 1: and sometimes the wife or the you know, whoever else

727
00:45:08,400 --> 00:45:11,000
Speaker 1: it's it's gonna be, it's gonna be someone who knows

728
00:45:11,080 --> 00:45:15,920
Speaker 1: you statistically. But the other wrinkles that this kind of

729
00:45:15,920 --> 00:45:20,920
Speaker 1: puts in the in the story is that Um Medley

730
00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:25,400
Speaker 1: has come out and spoken relatively recently on on the matter.

731
00:45:25,800 --> 00:45:28,880
Speaker 1: And Um, she's now married and uh and and it

732
00:45:29,000 --> 00:45:32,040
Speaker 1: has a child. And she denies that she had anything

733
00:45:32,080 --> 00:45:35,000
Speaker 1: to do with the disappearance and believes that Rebecca was

734
00:45:35,040 --> 00:45:38,239
Speaker 1: actually like depressed and was taking drugs and was suicidal

735
00:45:38,520 --> 00:45:41,680
Speaker 1: and had made claims or threatened to to jump off

736
00:45:41,719 --> 00:45:44,200
Speaker 1: the side of the ship, which would hold up given

737
00:45:44,400 --> 00:45:47,560
Speaker 1: how much effort it would have taken to to do that,

738
00:45:47,640 --> 00:45:50,160
Speaker 1: you know, knowing how high those walls were, and how

739
00:45:50,280 --> 00:45:53,600
Speaker 1: it's absolutely unpractical. It seems for like a wave to

740
00:45:53,640 --> 00:45:55,680
Speaker 1: have lifted somebody up, or the wind or whatever. So

741
00:45:55,760 --> 00:45:59,160
Speaker 1: this this definitely tracks. And she believes this because the

742
00:45:59,239 --> 00:46:01,800
Speaker 1: night that she and miss saying chore, Um was incredibly

743
00:46:01,880 --> 00:46:04,319
Speaker 1: upset with Tracy, was drinking heavily and was telling her

744
00:46:04,320 --> 00:46:07,239
Speaker 1: girlfriend that she quote felt like a failure because she

745
00:46:07,320 --> 00:46:12,120
Speaker 1: wasn't brave enough to jump off the ship. Um and

746
00:46:12,360 --> 00:46:17,359
Speaker 1: you know after the threesome. Um, and I'm not being

747
00:46:17,400 --> 00:46:21,480
Speaker 1: flipped here, but threesomes are complicated too, Uh, they're very complicated,

748
00:46:21,480 --> 00:46:24,080
Speaker 1: and if they if there are already emotions at play,

749
00:46:24,160 --> 00:46:26,600
Speaker 1: and you do it, maybe because you think it will

750
00:46:26,600 --> 00:46:28,880
Speaker 1: make someone like you better or you feel put on

751
00:46:28,880 --> 00:46:30,680
Speaker 1: the spot, and then you do it, and then there's

752
00:46:30,719 --> 00:46:33,279
Speaker 1: a shame factor. I'm not speaking from personal experience. That

753
00:46:33,360 --> 00:46:37,879
Speaker 1: just it makes sense, you know, but it's true, like

754
00:46:38,000 --> 00:46:40,000
Speaker 1: it's a thing where all of a sudden, now you've

755
00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:46,760
Speaker 1: compounded your insecurity and you've complicated the matter even further emotionally. Yeah,

756
00:46:46,920 --> 00:46:50,080
Speaker 1: that's that's part of the issues. So the implication here

757
00:46:50,480 --> 00:46:54,360
Speaker 1: is that Medley and chore Um had a bit of

758
00:46:54,400 --> 00:46:59,920
Speaker 1: inequality in what they wanted from their relationship. Tracy met

759
00:47:00,080 --> 00:47:04,560
Speaker 1: Lee was being casual, you know what I mean, why

760
00:47:04,680 --> 00:47:07,520
Speaker 1: be constrained. I want to be free, which is a

761
00:47:07,640 --> 00:47:11,880
Speaker 1: very understandable thing. Uh. And she had a relationship with

762
00:47:11,920 --> 00:47:14,759
Speaker 1: his fellow David Hyde, who was a married father by

763
00:47:14,760 --> 00:47:18,320
Speaker 1: the way, She had a relationship with him before things

764
00:47:18,400 --> 00:47:22,960
Speaker 1: got romantic with Rebecca Aquarium. And while Hide is on

765
00:47:23,080 --> 00:47:28,800
Speaker 1: shore leave, this romance kind of sparks, right, and Rebecca

766
00:47:28,800 --> 00:47:30,640
Speaker 1: Aquarium is saying, you know, I want to take this

767
00:47:30,719 --> 00:47:33,319
Speaker 1: the next level. I wanna let's let's commit to each other,

768
00:47:33,360 --> 00:47:36,799
Speaker 1: and Tracy Medley saying, hey, let's not put chains on

769
00:47:36,800 --> 00:47:40,960
Speaker 1: ourselves if we don't have to. Essentially, and when Devon

770
00:47:41,080 --> 00:47:45,399
Speaker 1: Hyde returns, I may have said David earlier, but it's

771
00:47:45,400 --> 00:47:49,200
Speaker 1: definitely Devon Hyde. When Devin Hyde returns h to work

772
00:47:49,239 --> 00:47:52,440
Speaker 1: as a bartender on the ship, Tracy says, Okay, this

773
00:47:52,520 --> 00:47:54,319
Speaker 1: is the guy I was dating, and he's back, so

774
00:47:54,320 --> 00:47:57,920
Speaker 1: I'm gonna keep doing this. And uh, there's a strong

775
00:47:58,000 --> 00:48:02,520
Speaker 1: implication that Quarium felt as you as you alluded to

776
00:48:02,560 --> 00:48:06,880
Speaker 1: an old Quarium felt somehow pressured into this sexual act

777
00:48:07,160 --> 00:48:09,120
Speaker 1: because she thought it was the only way she could

778
00:48:09,160 --> 00:48:15,280
Speaker 1: continue a romantic relationship with Medley. Uh. And so after

779
00:48:15,480 --> 00:48:18,959
Speaker 1: You're right, the night before the disappearance, she did say

780
00:48:19,000 --> 00:48:20,839
Speaker 1: that she felt like a failure because she wasn't brave

781
00:48:20,960 --> 00:48:26,960
Speaker 1: enough to jump. When the Wendy threesome occurs the next evening,

782
00:48:27,920 --> 00:48:31,360
Speaker 1: Quarium asked Tracy, Hey, I'm will you go out a

783
00:48:31,360 --> 00:48:33,839
Speaker 1: walk with me? And Tracy declines, but she says, hey,

784
00:48:33,840 --> 00:48:37,320
Speaker 1: you're coming back, right, And Devin gives Quarium clothing to wear,

785
00:48:37,400 --> 00:48:40,160
Speaker 1: some of his clothes. That's what she's wearing in the

786
00:48:40,239 --> 00:48:43,920
Speaker 1: CCTV footage of that phone call. And they leave the

787
00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:47,080
Speaker 1: door unlocked in case, you know, Quarium wants to come

788
00:48:47,120 --> 00:48:50,239
Speaker 1: back to that cabin after she takes a walk, but

789
00:48:50,400 --> 00:48:55,080
Speaker 1: instead she goes, makes a phone call, walks away, and

790
00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:59,560
Speaker 1: disappears from history. There's a big question, though, who was

791
00:48:59,600 --> 00:49:01,840
Speaker 1: she talking to on the phone, Matt you mentioned earlier.

792
00:49:02,040 --> 00:49:06,000
Speaker 1: One of the crew members said it was Tracy Medley,

793
00:49:06,040 --> 00:49:09,799
Speaker 1: but that doesn't make sense necessarily. I mean, it's an

794
00:49:09,800 --> 00:49:15,879
Speaker 1: internal phone system, right, so maybe, but it's somebody else.

795
00:49:15,960 --> 00:49:20,719
Speaker 1: Came forward one Tracy O'Brien from Liverpool, and she said

796
00:49:20,760 --> 00:49:24,480
Speaker 1: that Quarium was calling her, and furthermore that Quarium kind

797
00:49:24,480 --> 00:49:27,560
Speaker 1: of always called her in these situations. Yeah, she was

798
00:49:27,600 --> 00:49:32,040
Speaker 1: almost the go between um And this is what Ms

799
00:49:32,080 --> 00:49:37,000
Speaker 1: O'Brien told investigators. She said she called me crying. She

800
00:49:37,040 --> 00:49:39,560
Speaker 1: said they'd asked her to do a threesome. I told

801
00:49:39,600 --> 00:49:41,520
Speaker 1: her not to go back to them and to go

802
00:49:41,600 --> 00:49:46,279
Speaker 1: to bed O'Brien and continued saying she stopped crying. I

803
00:49:46,360 --> 00:49:48,080
Speaker 1: told her I had talked to Tracy about it in

804
00:49:48,080 --> 00:49:50,759
Speaker 1: the morning, as I always had to talk to her

805
00:49:50,760 --> 00:49:54,520
Speaker 1: when they were arguing with each other. So essentially just

806
00:49:54,600 --> 00:49:57,160
Speaker 1: acting as a friend as you would if you're supporting

807
00:49:57,920 --> 00:50:02,799
Speaker 1: Rebecca Quarium there and also supporting Tracy and just being

808
00:50:02,840 --> 00:50:05,839
Speaker 1: a go between. Um. It's really interesting to me that

809
00:50:06,840 --> 00:50:09,200
Speaker 1: a lot of this information, or some of this information

810
00:50:09,239 --> 00:50:13,240
Speaker 1: at least comes from a man named Mark Rotheram, who

811
00:50:13,400 --> 00:50:16,680
Speaker 1: was the I think head of security on on Disney

812
00:50:16,719 --> 00:50:19,360
Speaker 1: Wonder at the time, I think at the time. But

813
00:50:19,520 --> 00:50:22,440
Speaker 1: he he is the one who is giving that, you know,

814
00:50:22,719 --> 00:50:26,799
Speaker 1: or is giving us that quote of Quarium. The only

815
00:50:26,880 --> 00:50:28,520
Speaker 1: way the Choreum was to be able to be with

816
00:50:28,560 --> 00:50:30,880
Speaker 1: her girlfriend was to have a threesome with Mr Hyde,

817
00:50:31,200 --> 00:50:33,080
Speaker 1: and that she was very uncomfortable with it, but she

818
00:50:33,120 --> 00:50:35,160
Speaker 1: did it anyway. I think this is her first time

819
00:50:35,200 --> 00:50:38,880
Speaker 1: sleeping with a man. It's interesting to have that person

820
00:50:39,080 --> 00:50:42,120
Speaker 1: whose security on the ship giving us that information through

821
00:50:42,160 --> 00:50:44,600
Speaker 1: this investigation. I mean, I guess he'd be the right

822
00:50:44,640 --> 00:50:47,520
Speaker 1: person to do it, but that feels like that feels

823
00:50:47,560 --> 00:50:52,760
Speaker 1: like a very important piece of information to have, and

824
00:50:53,080 --> 00:50:55,479
Speaker 1: you know, it feels like something you would continue to

825
00:50:55,520 --> 00:50:59,040
Speaker 1: dig into a little bit further, maybe rather than taking

826
00:50:59,040 --> 00:51:01,680
Speaker 1: it a face value. But well, there's so many things

827
00:51:01,719 --> 00:51:04,040
Speaker 1: that should have been dug into further rather than taking

828
00:51:04,080 --> 00:51:06,480
Speaker 1: it face value. In this story. I think that's the

829
00:51:06,560 --> 00:51:10,560
Speaker 1: biggest uh trouble with the whole thing, and it just

830
00:51:10,680 --> 00:51:14,160
Speaker 1: seems like Disney was not being above board. And let's

831
00:51:14,200 --> 00:51:18,719
Speaker 1: pivot back to the parents perspective, um, because you gotta think,

832
00:51:18,760 --> 00:51:22,319
Speaker 1: I mean, it's just like your child is vanished, Uh,

833
00:51:22,480 --> 00:51:26,400
Speaker 1: you know, promising young woman you know who had, like

834
00:51:26,440 --> 00:51:27,719
Speaker 1: you said at the top of the show, Matt had

835
00:51:27,760 --> 00:51:31,520
Speaker 1: a real career path and goal oriented and all that stuff.

836
00:51:31,560 --> 00:51:33,960
Speaker 1: And obviously just like the love of their life to

837
00:51:34,239 --> 00:51:37,279
Speaker 1: just be kind of strung along in the way they

838
00:51:37,320 --> 00:51:40,160
Speaker 1: seem to have been and not really given any answers

839
00:51:40,360 --> 00:51:41,880
Speaker 1: and for there to be all these loose ends, I

840
00:51:41,920 --> 00:51:45,040
Speaker 1: can't imagine. And in the uh dateline piece that I saw,

841
00:51:45,280 --> 00:51:49,399
Speaker 1: they said of this that it never gets easier. In fact,

842
00:51:49,440 --> 00:51:51,360
Speaker 1: the more time that goes by it they feel like

843
00:51:51,400 --> 00:51:54,279
Speaker 1: it gets harder because they just ruminate on all these

844
00:51:54,360 --> 00:51:57,120
Speaker 1: questions and this, this official story is just just doesn't

845
00:51:57,120 --> 00:52:00,080
Speaker 1: feel right. Yeah, it might be official, but it's does

846
00:52:00,080 --> 00:52:03,960
Speaker 1: and feel legitimate, does it? So Yeah, from the parents perspective,

847
00:52:04,920 --> 00:52:07,799
Speaker 1: there's I would say, there's one thing that we've been

848
00:52:07,880 --> 00:52:11,120
Speaker 1: alluding to, but we haven't we haven't called head on

849
00:52:11,320 --> 00:52:16,920
Speaker 1: into yet because it's very painful um an harrowing subject,

850
00:52:17,000 --> 00:52:18,800
Speaker 1: not just for this case, but for a lot of

851
00:52:18,880 --> 00:52:21,719
Speaker 1: us listening along at home, wherever home is. And that

852
00:52:21,880 --> 00:52:28,320
Speaker 1: is the question of suicide. Could it be possible that Aquarium, distressed, traumatized,

853
00:52:29,440 --> 00:52:32,760
Speaker 1: chose to take her own life in those early hours

854
00:52:32,800 --> 00:52:36,080
Speaker 1: of March twenty two. She's athletic enough, she's in good

855
00:52:36,160 --> 00:52:38,480
Speaker 1: enough shape that she would have been able to climb

856
00:52:38,640 --> 00:52:44,080
Speaker 1: over anything preventing someone from falling off the ship. But

857
00:52:44,239 --> 00:52:47,759
Speaker 1: her parents do not believe this is possible. To them,

858
00:52:47,960 --> 00:52:53,200
Speaker 1: their daughter always seemed upbeat, positive, very family oriented. She

859
00:52:53,360 --> 00:52:56,880
Speaker 1: had recently bought them tickets so they could all go

860
00:52:56,960 --> 00:53:01,360
Speaker 1: to Disneyland Paris together. When they take that as evidence

861
00:53:01,400 --> 00:53:04,560
Speaker 1: that you know, she was looking forward to the future

862
00:53:04,880 --> 00:53:08,160
Speaker 1: like she had she had plans. Uh. Some of the

863
00:53:08,200 --> 00:53:11,640
Speaker 1: crew members argue that the parents were not aware of

864
00:53:11,719 --> 00:53:16,040
Speaker 1: the extent, maybe of Quarium's partying, and said that you'll

865
00:53:16,080 --> 00:53:18,680
Speaker 1: see a quote often that says they felt she was

866
00:53:19,680 --> 00:53:24,840
Speaker 1: sunny and cheerful, but haunted by an underlying sadness. However,

867
00:53:24,960 --> 00:53:28,840
Speaker 1: I would I would argue the truth is this applies

868
00:53:28,880 --> 00:53:31,000
Speaker 1: to most people. The truth is that we are so

869
00:53:31,040 --> 00:53:35,240
Speaker 1: many different people at any given time you know the person,

870
00:53:35,360 --> 00:53:38,920
Speaker 1: the the you that your parents know is not the

871
00:53:38,960 --> 00:53:41,400
Speaker 1: you that your friends know. And there's a good argument

872
00:53:41,400 --> 00:53:44,719
Speaker 1: to be made that we are only stories we tell ourselves. Matt,

873
00:53:44,800 --> 00:53:48,760
Speaker 1: I think I'm plagiarizing my own story from thirteen days,

874
00:53:49,280 --> 00:53:52,360
Speaker 1: but it's true, it's true. I'll stop over using that line.

875
00:53:52,840 --> 00:53:58,920
Speaker 1: So after she went missing, something happens that further convinces

876
00:53:58,960 --> 00:54:02,480
Speaker 1: the quariums, to your Pointnell, further convinces them that something

877
00:54:02,760 --> 00:54:07,279
Speaker 1: is amiss here. Two of her friends that she was

878
00:54:07,320 --> 00:54:10,319
Speaker 1: hanging out with UH. When she went back to the

879
00:54:10,400 --> 00:54:12,799
Speaker 1: UK for a while, two of her friends visited the

880
00:54:12,880 --> 00:54:16,160
Speaker 1: quarium parents and they said while she was hanging out

881
00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:20,640
Speaker 1: with them, Rebecca had voiced fears of being UH assaulted,

882
00:54:20,719 --> 00:54:24,480
Speaker 1: sexually assaulted, or attacked while she was on the ship,

883
00:54:24,800 --> 00:54:29,920
Speaker 1: and that led the quariums now to their stances. They

884
00:54:30,000 --> 00:54:32,440
Speaker 1: well back when they could still talk about it. That's

885
00:54:32,480 --> 00:54:35,360
Speaker 1: the twist at the end here. UH. The quariums strongly

886
00:54:35,480 --> 00:54:38,960
Speaker 1: suspected that Rebecca was murdered following an attack of a

887
00:54:39,040 --> 00:54:43,480
Speaker 1: sexual nature. And this is something echoed by other professional

888
00:54:43,480 --> 00:54:47,000
Speaker 1: investigators like Bill Anderson. Yes, Bill Anderson is a thing

889
00:54:47,080 --> 00:54:50,680
Speaker 1: called a maritime investigation coordinator. But you'd think that would

890
00:54:50,719 --> 00:54:53,880
Speaker 1: be like the jurisdiction of a maritime investigation coordinator and

891
00:54:54,320 --> 00:54:57,959
Speaker 1: police boom exactly. Uh. And he is one of these

892
00:54:58,040 --> 00:55:02,560
Speaker 1: in the UK who has been assisting the kore Ums

893
00:55:02,680 --> 00:55:05,440
Speaker 1: in their case, in their in their search for for

894
00:55:05,520 --> 00:55:08,239
Speaker 1: the truth, and he says he is fully convinced that

895
00:55:08,280 --> 00:55:11,360
Speaker 1: a sexual assault took place and that they were aware

896
00:55:11,360 --> 00:55:15,840
Speaker 1: of it on board the vessel. Um. It's a heavy claim.

897
00:55:16,000 --> 00:55:18,200
Speaker 1: It's a heavy claim and it and it makes me again,

898
00:55:18,480 --> 00:55:21,239
Speaker 1: all this stuff is conjecture at this point. Um, well, well,

899
00:55:21,280 --> 00:55:24,080
Speaker 1: well we'll get to the next step. But I do

900
00:55:24,200 --> 00:55:28,359
Speaker 1: feel like the episode or the theme in um Uh

901
00:55:28,440 --> 00:55:32,000
Speaker 1: Succession was definitely based on this exact case because it's

902
00:55:32,000 --> 00:55:34,880
Speaker 1: a similar type of company to Disney the the Dynasty

903
00:55:35,200 --> 00:55:37,800
Speaker 1: represented in that show. Um. I would just say, no,

904
00:55:38,000 --> 00:55:42,400
Speaker 1: there are so many cases like this. No, it's true.

905
00:55:42,560 --> 00:55:44,720
Speaker 1: I think it's the Disney angle um and the type

906
00:55:44,719 --> 00:55:46,880
Speaker 1: of company that is in that show that makes me

907
00:55:46,960 --> 00:55:49,800
Speaker 1: kind of think that they're they're looking at this one. Um.

908
00:55:49,840 --> 00:55:52,400
Speaker 1: But there is a settlement. Yeah. I do want to

909
00:55:52,440 --> 00:55:55,160
Speaker 1: say it's like the SVU game. Prenny. Fans of Law

910
00:55:55,160 --> 00:55:58,719
Speaker 1: and Order SVU. I watch it. I'll admit it. There's

911
00:55:58,719 --> 00:56:02,480
Speaker 1: no shame in it. But uh, one of the games

912
00:56:02,480 --> 00:56:04,120
Speaker 1: you can play with s view as you watch the

913
00:56:04,160 --> 00:56:07,200
Speaker 1: episode and you think, Okay, what real world case is

914
00:56:07,239 --> 00:56:11,359
Speaker 1: this loosely based on? And it gets it gets increasingly

915
00:56:11,400 --> 00:56:15,040
Speaker 1: surreal as U s V. You gets more and more

916
00:56:15,160 --> 00:56:18,280
Speaker 1: on the nose with their responses or with their episodes.

917
00:56:18,320 --> 00:56:20,600
Speaker 1: But you're right, no, there is. This is what we're

918
00:56:20,640 --> 00:56:24,360
Speaker 1: talking about when we say the quariums had this view before,

919
00:56:24,640 --> 00:56:26,799
Speaker 1: back when they still could talk about it, because now

920
00:56:26,920 --> 00:56:33,040
Speaker 1: they can't. In twenty Disney and the Quariums settled out

921
00:56:33,040 --> 00:56:37,280
Speaker 1: of court were an undisclosed amount, and this settlement seems

922
00:56:37,280 --> 00:56:41,520
Speaker 1: to have ended any legal challenge in the US, but

923
00:56:41,719 --> 00:56:44,680
Speaker 1: there are you know, there are multiple countries involved, right,

924
00:56:44,760 --> 00:56:48,160
Speaker 1: so there could still be in question inquiries in the UK.

925
00:56:49,160 --> 00:56:52,879
Speaker 1: As a condition of this settlement, the quariums are prevented

926
00:56:53,239 --> 00:56:57,759
Speaker 1: from discussing the case. That's crazy, right, You can't talk

927
00:56:57,880 --> 00:57:02,439
Speaker 1: about your daughter's disappearance anymore because here's some money. Yeah,

928
00:57:02,480 --> 00:57:05,120
Speaker 1: and I mean to be Devil's advocate. They had to

929
00:57:05,160 --> 00:57:08,120
Speaker 1: agree to it. You know, they could have kept pressing

930
00:57:08,160 --> 00:57:11,920
Speaker 1: it and not received any money. But I mean, I guess,

931
00:57:12,160 --> 00:57:15,120
Speaker 1: I mean, money is no resolution, but it certainly makes it,

932
00:57:15,320 --> 00:57:16,800
Speaker 1: I guess easier to go on with. I don't I

933
00:57:16,840 --> 00:57:19,280
Speaker 1: would have a hard time if my this is Please

934
00:57:19,480 --> 00:57:22,880
Speaker 1: no shade or any judgment on on the Korean family.

935
00:57:22,920 --> 00:57:26,440
Speaker 1: But I think I feel like maybe if my child

936
00:57:26,560 --> 00:57:29,000
Speaker 1: went missing and then I accepted some money and it

937
00:57:29,080 --> 00:57:31,160
Speaker 1: changed my quality of life, I think I would always

938
00:57:31,240 --> 00:57:33,920
Speaker 1: kind of the back of my mind associated with this

939
00:57:34,040 --> 00:57:37,439
Speaker 1: horrible event. I was thinking about this too. It might

940
00:57:37,480 --> 00:57:39,640
Speaker 1: have been this is terrible, but it may have been

941
00:57:39,680 --> 00:57:43,320
Speaker 1: an economic necessity. Remember this is this is a family.

942
00:57:43,400 --> 00:57:47,280
Speaker 1: There's two people going up against one of the most

943
00:57:47,360 --> 00:57:49,920
Speaker 1: powerful corporations. That's a really good foe, which makes it

944
00:57:49,960 --> 00:57:53,160
Speaker 1: even more ikey, doesn't it at least four years after

945
00:57:53,440 --> 00:57:57,000
Speaker 1: they disappear. That's like we've bankrupted you and fighting us,

946
00:57:57,200 --> 00:57:58,880
Speaker 1: and now the only way you're going to be able

947
00:57:58,920 --> 00:58:01,160
Speaker 1: to call your way back is if you settle with us,

948
00:58:01,200 --> 00:58:03,880
Speaker 1: and then we make you sign a gag order. I'm

949
00:58:03,920 --> 00:58:05,640
Speaker 1: not saying that's what happened, no, but I think that's

950
00:58:05,680 --> 00:58:09,840
Speaker 1: really that's smart. Then I'm saying it's it's possible. We're

951
00:58:09,880 --> 00:58:12,000
Speaker 1: being very careful not to get the mouse on us.

952
00:58:12,640 --> 00:58:15,200
Speaker 1: Nobody wants the mouse after you. Nobody wants the mouse

953
00:58:17,280 --> 00:58:20,240
Speaker 1: he found us. Uh, Well, then let's get this through

954
00:58:20,280 --> 00:58:23,920
Speaker 1: before we have to before we end um and go

955
00:58:24,040 --> 00:58:27,840
Speaker 1: officially on the run from Disney. Uh, aquariums disappear. It

956
00:58:28,040 --> 00:58:31,560
Speaker 1: that that's where we're at now, there's been a settlement signed. Uh,

957
00:58:31,600 --> 00:58:35,600
Speaker 1: the official explanation is still washed overboard by a rogue

958
00:58:35,600 --> 00:58:39,720
Speaker 1: wave on deck five near the crew pool. That official explanation,

959
00:58:39,760 --> 00:58:42,800
Speaker 1: as I think we've proven, it doesn't add up for

960
00:58:42,840 --> 00:58:46,080
Speaker 1: a lot of people, but it also takes us to

961
00:58:47,200 --> 00:58:50,880
Speaker 1: a larger phenomenon. You see, the disappearance of Rebecca Quarium

962
00:58:51,000 --> 00:58:55,000
Speaker 1: is unfortunately far from the only example of people going

963
00:58:55,080 --> 00:58:58,760
Speaker 1: missing on cruise lines, passengers as well as crew members.

964
00:58:59,000 --> 00:59:02,000
Speaker 1: How many people did Superior and cruises? What happens out

965
00:59:02,000 --> 00:59:04,320
Speaker 1: there in the gray area, you know, not just the

966
00:59:04,760 --> 00:59:07,560
Speaker 1: gray area of the deep blue sea, but that legal

967
00:59:07,680 --> 00:59:12,360
Speaker 1: no man's land of international waters, flags of convenience, the

968
00:59:12,360 --> 00:59:16,520
Speaker 1: halls of corporate power. You know, it's bizarre. If you

969
00:59:16,560 --> 00:59:22,680
Speaker 1: go back to the Guardian article that was uh, that

970
00:59:22,760 --> 00:59:26,440
Speaker 1: was written by Mr John Ronson. Yeah, he mentions that

971
00:59:26,480 --> 00:59:30,840
Speaker 1: it was something like a hundred and seventy one disappearances

972
00:59:30,880 --> 00:59:35,400
Speaker 1: across all cruise lines from two thousand until two thousand

973
00:59:36,120 --> 00:59:39,960
Speaker 1: what eleven so eleven years a hundred and seventy one

974
00:59:41,360 --> 00:59:45,040
Speaker 1: roughly disappearances on all cruise lines. That's not a ton

975
00:59:45,200 --> 00:59:47,360
Speaker 1: if you think about the number of human beings that

976
00:59:47,440 --> 00:59:50,520
Speaker 1: are traveling on all of these ships. But it's way

977
00:59:50,560 --> 00:59:54,120
Speaker 1: more than zero. Yeah, and and of course you know,

978
00:59:54,160 --> 00:59:58,240
Speaker 1: we're not trying to vilify cruise lines because the open

979
00:59:58,280 --> 01:00:02,520
Speaker 1: ocean is a dangerous place, and a lot of times

980
01:00:02,880 --> 01:00:06,280
Speaker 1: people who are not familiar with the risk. Looking in

981
01:00:06,400 --> 01:00:09,120
Speaker 1: passengers who are not you know, who are maybe a

982
01:00:09,120 --> 01:00:13,040
Speaker 1: little too confident ignoring the rules that are there for

983
01:00:13,080 --> 01:00:16,720
Speaker 1: a reason, can land you in, uh, in a dangerous

984
01:00:16,760 --> 01:00:20,200
Speaker 1: situation very quickly. Or passengers who take advantage of the

985
01:00:20,320 --> 01:00:24,240
Speaker 1: now widely available packages where you can drink everything you

986
01:00:24,320 --> 01:00:27,520
Speaker 1: want on the ship. That's right, You just pay a

987
01:00:27,520 --> 01:00:29,560
Speaker 1: little fee there and you've got open bar while you're

988
01:00:29,560 --> 01:00:36,000
Speaker 1: at sea. Uh yikes. But also gay well I wanted

989
01:00:36,000 --> 01:00:37,640
Speaker 1: to say too, like, you know how the cruise ships

990
01:00:37,680 --> 01:00:40,600
Speaker 1: sort of gently trying to come back to life. I

991
01:00:40,640 --> 01:00:43,280
Speaker 1: saw a commercial for it that was very COVID center

992
01:00:43,400 --> 01:00:46,080
Speaker 1: without actually saying the word about how like everyone needs

993
01:00:46,120 --> 01:00:49,440
Speaker 1: an escape mall, that's like language. At the end they're

994
01:00:49,480 --> 01:00:51,200
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, I'm not laughing at the plight of of

995
01:00:51,400 --> 01:00:53,480
Speaker 1: a major industry. But at the end there was in

996
01:00:53,480 --> 01:00:57,800
Speaker 1: the fine print like free open bar for any ticket holders.

997
01:00:58,120 --> 01:01:00,240
Speaker 1: So they are really doubling down with the open bar

998
01:01:00,320 --> 01:01:02,680
Speaker 1: thing and trying to attract people back to cruise ships.

999
01:01:03,360 --> 01:01:07,120
Speaker 1: And perhaps we end on a note for the survivors

1000
01:01:07,480 --> 01:01:10,760
Speaker 1: of these tragedies, the quariums and all the other relatives

1001
01:01:10,760 --> 01:01:14,480
Speaker 1: and friends who have a who now have an absence

1002
01:01:14,520 --> 01:01:18,000
Speaker 1: in their life. Several relatives of people have gone missing

1003
01:01:18,240 --> 01:01:21,960
Speaker 1: from cruise ships have formed a loose community of sorts

1004
01:01:22,000 --> 01:01:27,760
Speaker 1: monitoring disappearances, pushing for investigations where they think the original

1005
01:01:27,760 --> 01:01:32,959
Speaker 1: investigation doesn't add up. But here we are now years later,

1006
01:01:33,120 --> 01:01:37,960
Speaker 1: and several cases, multiple cases like Rebecca Quariums, have official

1007
01:01:38,000 --> 01:01:44,320
Speaker 1: conclusions that don't seem to tell the whole story. We

1008
01:01:44,400 --> 01:01:48,160
Speaker 1: want to know what you think. Is there a cover

1009
01:01:48,280 --> 01:01:52,919
Speaker 1: up of foot If so, what and why? How did

1010
01:01:53,160 --> 01:01:58,280
Speaker 1: How does a place with with a lot of CCTV footage,

1011
01:01:58,040 --> 01:02:02,320
Speaker 1: how does it miss you know, footage of someone slipping overboard?

1012
01:02:02,800 --> 01:02:06,320
Speaker 1: How likely is a wave is it possible that someone

1013
01:02:06,440 --> 01:02:10,360
Speaker 1: knew where there were holes in the CCTV footage when

1014
01:02:10,440 --> 01:02:13,320
Speaker 1: something went downs putting out there. We've discussed that as

1015
01:02:13,360 --> 01:02:17,360
Speaker 1: a possibility in other cases where somebody was aware of

1016
01:02:17,360 --> 01:02:20,520
Speaker 1: of you know, cameras and where they were located. Is

1017
01:02:20,560 --> 01:02:24,640
Speaker 1: there a situation where the FBI could get involved or

1018
01:02:24,720 --> 01:02:27,040
Speaker 1: is that really kind of just the nature of the

1019
01:02:27,040 --> 01:02:31,640
Speaker 1: beast with this type of travel. Yeah, it can. Again

1020
01:02:31,760 --> 01:02:34,960
Speaker 1: to to reiterate, there was a law passed after the

1021
01:02:35,000 --> 01:02:40,120
Speaker 1: disappearance of Quarium that allows the FBI jurisdiction for investigations

1022
01:02:40,240 --> 01:02:43,440
Speaker 1: in these kind of disappearances so long as the person

1023
01:02:43,440 --> 01:02:46,760
Speaker 1: who disappeared is a US resident. But it so it

1024
01:02:46,760 --> 01:02:48,920
Speaker 1: wouldn't have helped in this case because this is a

1025
01:02:49,040 --> 01:02:51,520
Speaker 1: UK wrestle. That's true, but that's still a big step

1026
01:02:51,640 --> 01:02:54,200
Speaker 1: in the right direction. I've glossed over that entirely been

1027
01:02:54,280 --> 01:02:57,920
Speaker 1: Thanks for reiterating that. By the way, that we mentioned

1028
01:02:58,640 --> 01:03:01,480
Speaker 1: a group, you know, people have been affected by disappearances

1029
01:03:01,480 --> 01:03:04,120
Speaker 1: on cruise ships. We've gotten together. If you want to

1030
01:03:04,200 --> 01:03:08,480
Speaker 1: check out something called International Cruise Victims, we would recommend

1031
01:03:08,560 --> 01:03:12,200
Speaker 1: you do so. You can find it at International Cruise

1032
01:03:12,320 --> 01:03:16,880
Speaker 1: Victims dot Org. You can read there a lot of information.

1033
01:03:17,120 --> 01:03:20,280
Speaker 1: There are a lot of contacts and resources for you

1034
01:03:20,360 --> 01:03:23,360
Speaker 1: or anyone else there on that website. And while you're

1035
01:03:23,360 --> 01:03:25,240
Speaker 1: on the internet, if you would like to share your

1036
01:03:25,280 --> 01:03:28,960
Speaker 1: thoughts with us, as well as more importantly your fellow listeners,

1037
01:03:29,280 --> 01:03:31,040
Speaker 1: you can find us on Facebook, you can find us

1038
01:03:31,080 --> 01:03:33,600
Speaker 1: on Instagram, you can find us on Twitter. We like

1039
01:03:33,640 --> 01:03:36,240
Speaker 1: to recommend Here's where it gets crazy, some of the

1040
01:03:36,240 --> 01:03:39,560
Speaker 1: best mods in the business and some of the best

1041
01:03:39,720 --> 01:03:43,360
Speaker 1: memes on the net. Once again voted the best site

1042
01:03:43,400 --> 01:03:46,160
Speaker 1: on the Internet four times in a row, running now

1043
01:03:46,600 --> 01:03:49,880
Speaker 1: arbitrarily by us on this show the Yeah, the just

1044
01:03:49,960 --> 01:03:54,560
Speaker 1: Facebook you mean in general or on Facebook just that page.

1045
01:03:55,320 --> 01:04:01,440
Speaker 1: That page is keeping Zuckerberg in business. Sorry everyone, awesome.

1046
01:04:01,640 --> 01:04:04,080
Speaker 1: If you don't want to do that, head on over

1047
01:04:04,120 --> 01:04:08,520
Speaker 1: to YouTube find us. We are conspiracy stuff on that thing,

1048
01:04:08,880 --> 01:04:11,160
Speaker 1: and you can watch all kinds of videos that we've

1049
01:04:11,160 --> 01:04:13,760
Speaker 1: been making for a long time. You can see videos

1050
01:04:13,800 --> 01:04:18,560
Speaker 1: of these podcasts of our faces saying words, Yeah, you

1051
01:04:18,560 --> 01:04:22,680
Speaker 1: can you can see it. Do do I look like Noel?

1052
01:04:23,000 --> 01:04:26,000
Speaker 1: Does NOL look like Ben? Who knows? You'll never know

1053
01:04:26,080 --> 01:04:29,400
Speaker 1: unless you go to YouTube dot com slash conspiracy stuff.

1054
01:04:29,720 --> 01:04:31,280
Speaker 1: And while you're at it while you're on the internet,

1055
01:04:31,320 --> 01:04:33,080
Speaker 1: why not leave us tonight tunes review or what do

1056
01:04:33,120 --> 01:04:36,080
Speaker 1: they call it these days, Apple podcast? Super helpful uh,

1057
01:04:36,120 --> 01:04:38,000
Speaker 1: to help people find the show and to get it

1058
01:04:38,080 --> 01:04:39,360
Speaker 1: up in the rings. We've actually been up in the

1059
01:04:39,440 --> 01:04:41,920
Speaker 1: rankings at decent little bit lately. So perhaps these desperate

1060
01:04:41,920 --> 01:04:45,720
Speaker 1: please for reviews are working. Yeah, and so is the

1061
01:04:45,880 --> 01:04:49,720
Speaker 1: radio ye vast Radio network. Hey, and if you don't

1062
01:04:49,720 --> 01:04:52,600
Speaker 1: want to do that stuff, please leave us a voicemail.

1063
01:04:52,640 --> 01:04:55,600
Speaker 1: We have a number that's right bat. You can contact

1064
01:04:55,720 --> 01:04:58,760
Speaker 1: us any old time or any new time at one

1065
01:04:58,920 --> 01:05:02,360
Speaker 1: eight three three s t d W y t K

1066
01:05:03,080 --> 01:05:06,560
Speaker 1: three minutes. They're all yours. All that we ask is

1067
01:05:06,600 --> 01:05:09,840
Speaker 1: that you let us know if it's okay to use

1068
01:05:09,960 --> 01:05:14,600
Speaker 1: your name and or nickname uh and or voice on air.

1069
01:05:15,080 --> 01:05:17,160
Speaker 1: And if you hate doing that. If you just heard

1070
01:05:17,200 --> 01:05:19,960
Speaker 1: that and you thought what a terrible idea using a

1071
01:05:20,040 --> 01:05:24,880
Speaker 1: phone social media sheepers you guys, well, we do have

1072
01:05:24,960 --> 01:05:26,920
Speaker 1: good news for you. There's one other way you can

1073
01:05:26,960 --> 01:05:30,040
Speaker 1: always reach us. It's our good old fashioned email address.

1074
01:05:30,360 --> 01:05:34,320
Speaker 1: We are conspiracy at iHeart radio dot com. And it's

1075
01:05:34,320 --> 01:05:36,480
Speaker 1: weird that we don't mention this as often as we

1076
01:05:36,480 --> 01:05:39,160
Speaker 1: should we have T shirts? Is that crazy? We have?

1077
01:05:39,280 --> 01:05:42,920
Speaker 1: We have T shirts, We've got mugs. I should have

1078
01:05:43,000 --> 01:05:47,040
Speaker 1: one on air now and they're all on sale. That's right.

1079
01:05:47,160 --> 01:05:50,360
Speaker 1: T Public is having a holiday sale. All of the

1080
01:05:50,400 --> 01:05:52,000
Speaker 1: stuff that I want you to know to ag is

1081
01:05:52,040 --> 01:05:55,000
Speaker 1: thirty percent off. But act now because it's only for

1082
01:05:55,040 --> 01:05:59,480
Speaker 1: a limited time. That's right off until December sevent which

1083
01:05:59,560 --> 01:06:01,800
Speaker 1: is USTI around the corner. So get over to the

1084
01:06:01,840 --> 01:06:05,880
Speaker 1: store right now and get some cool stuff from stuff

1085
01:06:05,880 --> 01:06:08,720
Speaker 1: they don't want you to know before the holidays. Uh So,

1086
01:06:08,840 --> 01:06:12,640
Speaker 1: just head over to T Public that's T E E Public,

1087
01:06:12,800 --> 01:06:16,080
Speaker 1: p U B l I C and search for stuff

1088
01:06:16,120 --> 01:06:18,000
Speaker 1: they don't want you to know. You'll find it there.

1089
01:06:18,320 --> 01:06:20,320
Speaker 1: You can get all kinds of great things like the

1090
01:06:20,360 --> 01:06:24,760
Speaker 1: Doc Rendezvous T shirt or our official tinfoil T shirt. Yeah,

1091
01:06:24,880 --> 01:06:26,920
Speaker 1: you can even get a version of our logo with

1092
01:06:27,000 --> 01:06:30,040
Speaker 1: the hand that looks like a turkey, and we have

1093
01:06:30,240 --> 01:06:32,520
Speaker 1: more designs on the way, so do check it out.

1094
01:06:51,360 --> 01:06:53,440
Speaker 1: Stuff they Don't want you to Know is a production

1095
01:06:53,520 --> 01:06:56,600
Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio. For more podcasts from my Heart Radio,

1096
01:06:56,760 --> 01:06:59,600
Speaker 1: visit the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever

1097
01:06:59,640 --> 01:07:00,960
Speaker 1: you listen into your favorite shows