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Speaker 1: Hey everyone, it's Sophia. Welcome to Work in Progress. Hi friends, today,

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Speaker 1: I'm so excited to bring you a special talk that

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Speaker 1: I got to be a part of recently at the

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Speaker 1: Ford Foundation. The Ford Foundation recently worked with the UN

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Speaker 1: Trust on a huge global gathering in New York City.

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Speaker 1: It happened on September seventeenth, right before the UN General

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Speaker 1: Assembly began, and it was called Free Future. The event

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Speaker 1: focused on working against gender violence around the world. So

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Speaker 1: many people who I admire were there from all over

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Speaker 1: the globe, including the founder of Me Too Toronto Burke,

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Speaker 1: the women who run the Media, which is an incredible

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Speaker 1: company that focuses on making sure we all have education

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Speaker 1: and resources about our issues in the world, and the

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Speaker 1: incomparable Chase Strangio, the Deputy director for Transgender Justice with

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Speaker 1: the ACLUS LGBT and HIV Project and a nationally recognized

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Speaker 1: expert on transgender rights. During Free Future, Chase and I

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Speaker 1: got to sit down to talk about his work, which

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Speaker 1: includes impact litigation as well as legislative and administrative advocacy

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Speaker 1: on behalf of LGBTQ plus people around the United States.

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Speaker 1: Chase is actually about to argue in front of the

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Speaker 1: Supreme Court on behalf of the families of trans children

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Speaker 1: in Tennessee in a landmark case that could absolutely set

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Speaker 1: precedent for how trans children and trans people are cared

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Speaker 1: for and included in our society. It was a really

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Speaker 1: impactful conversation and today I'm thrilled to be able to

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Speaker 1: bring you live into our panel. Enjoy it. Well, Hello everyone,

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Speaker 1: It's an honor to be in the room with you all,

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Speaker 1: and especially for me to be here with my friend Chase.

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Speaker 1: How are you.

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Speaker 2: I'm good.

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Speaker 3: I'm very happy to be here with all of you,

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Speaker 3: to be in conversation with you.

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Speaker 2: Sophia, so happy to be here.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and thank everyone. I'd like to thank everyone if

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Speaker 1: I could get that sentence out clearly for showing up

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Speaker 1: for a day of conversation like this. I know we're

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Speaker 1: running a bit behind, so I'm going to get right

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Speaker 1: to it. In June, the Human Rights Campaign, which I

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Speaker 1: now probably stood on the C four board of which

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Speaker 1: feels extra cool, we had to do something that we've

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Speaker 1: never done before in the forty year legacy of the organization.

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Speaker 1: We declared a national state of emergency for LGBTQ plus

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Speaker 1: people in the US and the HRC did so because

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Speaker 1: of more than five hundred anti LGBTQ plus bills which

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Speaker 1: were introduced in state legislatures this year. At least eighty four.

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Speaker 2: Of them have booked law.

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Speaker 1: And part of this state of emergency declaration was because

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Speaker 1: of the rising crimes against people in our community across

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Speaker 1: the country. So I want to be clear that it's

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Speaker 1: impossible to talk about gender violence without talking about violence

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Speaker 1: against the queer community. In twenty twenty four, I'm wondering

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Speaker 1: if you, as the exceptional you know, fighter, advocate and

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Speaker 1: communicator that you are, could help us understand in the

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Speaker 1: way that you so eloquently do online. If you don't

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Speaker 1: follow Chase, this is your moment you go from courts

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Speaker 1: to culture. We like to say, and we all hear

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Speaker 1: about these laws, you know, we read the numbers. We

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Speaker 1: hear more than five hundred. We know their anti trans

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Speaker 1: we know their anti LGBTQ. But how do we humanize

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Speaker 1: what five hundred plus laws look like? How how do

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Speaker 1: we personalize the impact of these kinds of policy threats

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Speaker 1: across the country.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, so I want to get at the

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Speaker 3: first the structural realities of what this looks like, and

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Speaker 3: then get into the human and material consequences of it,

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Speaker 3: and of course, this absolutely catastrophic state of conditions that

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Speaker 3: we are currently facing in the LGBTQ communities, of course

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Speaker 3: something that many people in the community have faced for

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Speaker 3: years and years. And obviously legal protections alone don't create

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Speaker 3: material conditions that people need to survive, and so this

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Speaker 3: is only one piece of a much larger story. But

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Speaker 3: over the last five years, in particular, there has been

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Speaker 3: just an escalation of attacks on LGBTQ people legislatively at

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Speaker 3: the state level in particular, and a lot of those

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Speaker 3: have focused on the trans community and trans young people

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Speaker 3: in particular, And just to sort of quantify it, in

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Speaker 3: twenty twenty zero states banned trans girls from sports, zero

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Speaker 3: states band evidence based medicine for trans adolescents. Z euro

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Speaker 3: States banned trans students from using the restroom that they

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Speaker 3: need to use at school now.

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Speaker 2: In twenty twenty four, twenty four states.

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Speaker 3: Ban medical care for trans adolescents, twenty five states banned

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Speaker 3: trans girls from sports, and an increasing number close to

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Speaker 3: ten baned trans kids from the restroom at school. That is,

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Speaker 3: this catastrophic change in the legal realities over the course

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Speaker 3: of five years, which has meant that not only in

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Speaker 3: those nearly half the states in the country have people

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Speaker 3: lost access to the healthcare that they rely on. Have

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Speaker 3: they lost the ability to play sports with their friends,

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Speaker 3: to go to school at all because they can't use

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Speaker 3: the restroom, but also that we've created conditions with bills

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Speaker 3: being introduced where people don't feel like they can stay

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Speaker 3: in their homes, where families are, where they can, which

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Speaker 3: is of course not the truth for many people being

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Speaker 3: forced out of the states where they live in into

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Speaker 3: other states where the burden on the health system is

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Speaker 3: already so great. And so we're talking about healthcare that's

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Speaker 3: already in accessible to so many people then becoming increasingly inaccessible.

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Speaker 2: And people are absolutely.

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Speaker 3: Facing this distress of the possibility of the loss of care,

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Speaker 3: distress that the loss of their ability to play sports

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Speaker 3: with their friends, to go to school. But then the

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Speaker 3: material realities of what happens when you just continue to

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Speaker 3: face this legislative onslaught is that you have increased poor

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Speaker 3: mental health outcomes, You have the possibility that you aren't

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Speaker 3: going to be able to stay with your families. You

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Speaker 3: have we have I mean, I have many clients where

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Speaker 3: a mom and a kid leave the state and a

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Speaker 3: you know, a second parent and the siblings stay, and

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Speaker 3: so you're dividing families or dividing communities, and it's only

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Speaker 3: getting worse.

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Speaker 1: Something that feels incredibly important to point out, at least

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Speaker 1: for me, you know, when we talk about coalition building

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Speaker 1: and when we talk about, you know, at a summit

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Speaker 1: on gender based violence, the way that we need to

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Speaker 1: as groups of women and gender expressive folks stand up

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Speaker 1: for one another. It's not lost on me that a

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Speaker 1: lot of cisgendered women like myself, who look like myself

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Speaker 1: are beginning to vote more in rank with those of

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Speaker 1: us who would call ourselves progressive. Right, we are seeing

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Speaker 1: that bodily autonomy reproductive freedom is becoming a single issue

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Speaker 1: even for previously Republican identified women voters.

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Speaker 2: And we can't act as though.

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Speaker 1: Because more straight, cisgendered white women are voting for abortion,

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Speaker 1: that the attacks on the queer community and the attacks

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Speaker 1: on trans folks in particular are not just baseline continued

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Speaker 1: attacks on bodily autonomy. Because if they're not going to

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Speaker 1: win on abortion, they're going to try to win this way.

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Speaker 1: And it's ugly and it's obvious, and I think it's

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Speaker 1: incredibly important that those of us who you know, don't

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Speaker 1: identify as billionaire, elder cisgendered white guys get in line

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Speaker 1: and figure out how to advocate for each other more quickly,

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Speaker 1: because what you're talking about, you know, these outcomes, these

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Speaker 1: family separations. We're also talking about the risk of additional

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Speaker 1: loss of life of our young people and the idea

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Speaker 1: that elected officials are willing to put targets on the

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Speaker 1: most vulnerable folks in our society. And by the way,

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Speaker 1: the people in the trans community who are killed at

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Speaker 1: the highest rate, or black trans women, so let's not

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Speaker 1: also a race the ties between racism and sexism here,

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Speaker 1: it's alarming to see how far they're willing to go.

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Speaker 1: And I know that when everything sort of feels like

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Speaker 1: it's on fire in these ways. You know, in every

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Speaker 1: state there's horrible bills. You just said, in nearly half

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Speaker 1: the states in the country, people can't access life saving healthcare.

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Speaker 1: I know, I get very angry. Obviously no one in

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Speaker 1: this room is shocked, but I also get overwhelmed. I

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Speaker 1: often turn to you when I feel overwhelmed, because you

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Speaker 1: are literally out arguing the law. And this fall, perhaps winter,

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Speaker 1: we don't know yet, correct, you'll be arguing in front

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Speaker 1: of the Supreme Court. Can can you tell us about

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Speaker 1: what that might look like, what sort of overview you

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Speaker 1: might be able to give us lay people who don't

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Speaker 1: have law degrees.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well so I will try, and I do want

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Speaker 3: to also, just something you said feels really important, which

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Speaker 3: is conversations about gender based violence, you know, have to

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Speaker 3: encompass these anti trans laws because at the end of

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Speaker 3: the day, the nature of this entire legal movement that

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Speaker 3: we're up against is one that is trying to use

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Speaker 3: the power of the government to define through force, many times,

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Speaker 3: the contours of what it means to be the right

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Speaker 3: kind of man and the right kind of woman, and

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Speaker 3: then use those structures in order to punish those who

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Speaker 3: deviate from those expectations of you know, womanhood and manhood.

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Speaker 3: And that is very much what is going on with

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Speaker 3: all of these laws. And because of the stakes of

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Speaker 3: these bands on healthcare for trans people, in the actual

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Speaker 3: loss of life sustaining healthcare for so many people in

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Speaker 3: our community, we were losing cases in such a catastrophic

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Speaker 3: way with appeals, courts and essence saying government discrimination against

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Speaker 3: trans people does not warrant judicial oversight and essence, and

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Speaker 3: also really suggesting that there are exceptions to equal protection

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Speaker 3: rights in the context of sex discrimination that would open

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Speaker 3: the door to erosions of bodily autonomy for everyone. This

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Speaker 3: is always about using the vulnerability of trans people to

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Speaker 3: get broad legal rulings that can then be leveraged on

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Speaker 3: and upon the bodies of everyone, in particular CIS women

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Speaker 3: who you know who, especially white CIS women who are

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Speaker 3: situated with war power. But through these attacks on trans

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Speaker 3: people in the courts, we can see how this is

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Speaker 3: part of a larger effort to expand to continue to.

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Speaker 2: Erode bodily autonomy.

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Speaker 3: And these losses were so catastrophic that we went we

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Speaker 3: actually are going to the United States Supreme Court thinking

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Speaker 3: it's going to be.

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Speaker 2: Less bad there.

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Speaker 3: So just to give you a sense of like if

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Speaker 3: you're going to the US Supreme Court because it's going

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Speaker 3: to get better there, like that is the state of

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Speaker 3: play that we were up against. And that's how serious

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Speaker 3: this is. Because now we're at the US Supreme Court

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Speaker 3: and we're arguing to try to reverse these lower court

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Speaker 3: decisions which greenlit this discrimination under the Constitution, and we

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Speaker 3: are briefing the case. Now, it's initially a challenge to

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Speaker 3: Tennessees ban on gender affirming medical care for trans adolescence,

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Speaker 3: but the ultimate contours of the Court's ruling will impact

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Speaker 3: you know, constitutional rights in much, you know, likely broader ways,

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Speaker 3: and we expect that the argument will be scheduled, probably

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Speaker 3: for December. But as Sophie and I were talking about

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Speaker 3: it with the Court, it's it's really at at their

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Speaker 3: discretion to.

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Speaker 2: Do what they want when they want.

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Speaker 3: But we're but we're fighting this fight because it is

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Speaker 3: life for death, and it's not that we think that

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Speaker 3: liberation will come through the courts. We're not going to

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Speaker 3: win our bodily autonomy at the Supreme Court. We're not

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Speaker 3: going to be seen in expansive, in liberatory ways at

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Speaker 3: the Supreme Court. But it's a mechanism to hold back

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Speaker 3: the violence of the states so that we can continue

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Speaker 3: to organize, so that we can continue to make sure

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Speaker 3: that people have access to gender affirming medical care youth

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Speaker 3: and adults alike, so that people can have access to

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Speaker 3: abortion and contraception and IVF. Because you know, don't get

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Speaker 3: it twisted, it's all on the line in these fights,

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Speaker 3: and that is what is at stake in this next

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Speaker 3: case before the Supreme Court. But unlike Dobbs, unlike the

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Speaker 3: Mifby case, unlike the Mtala case, if we're not going

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Speaker 3: to get the type of news coverage and national mobilization

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Speaker 3: for trans people, people aren't going to be, you know,

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Speaker 3: writing articles every day that talk about the grave consequences

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Speaker 3: of our loss of healthcare. Instead, we get, you know what,

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Speaker 3: ten thousand pages in the New York Times every other

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Speaker 3: month about whether or not our healthcare is really necessary.

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Speaker 2: But that so called debate that's.

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Speaker 3: Playing out in left leaning publications is going to be

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Speaker 3: the very mechanism by which all people continue to have

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Speaker 3: their bodily autonomy eroded. And this Supreme Court case is

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Speaker 3: going to be the first real test of the reach

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Speaker 3: of Dobbs in a substantive way, the first real test

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Speaker 3: of the constitutional protections that trans people do or do

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Speaker 3: not enjoy for generations, and also a harbinger of what's

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Speaker 3: to come with respect to bodily autonomy for all of us.

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Speaker 1: I think making sure that people understand how much our

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Speaker 1: liberation is tied together in these ways is incredibly crucial,

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Speaker 1: because again, they're not picking on our smallest and most

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Speaker 1: at risk population by accident, and they like to use

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Speaker 1: a lot of sort of boogeyman terms. You know, what

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Speaker 1: if a kid changes their minds? What if as though

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Speaker 1: children don't know themselves best, women don't know themselves best,

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Speaker 1: you know, regardless of what age we are, as if

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Speaker 1: families don't know themselves best. And I would just love

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Speaker 1: to say, because someone in my industry is not particularly

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Speaker 1: helpful to this argument that more people and this is

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Speaker 1: actually a data proven fact, not just a suggestion, more

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Speaker 1: people do regret their Harry Potter tattoos than transitioning. So

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Speaker 1: take that little nugget home with you today. Just gonna

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Speaker 1: get it in any way I can. But the way

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Speaker 1: we tell these stories and the way people use their

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Speaker 1: platforms sometimes to create empathy for each other and sometimes

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Speaker 1: as bully pulpits, I think can't be overstated, you know,

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Speaker 1: in its ability to free or include or to harm.

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Speaker 1: And when we think about who we want to include,

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Speaker 1: the legal landscape is so important. But I'm wondering again

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Speaker 1: just if we can personalize it a bit. You're talking

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Speaker 1: about these families in Tennessee. Is there something you've heard

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Speaker 1: from a kid who's just fighting to survive or something

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Speaker 1: you've heard, perhaps from one of their parents, that, in

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Speaker 1: addition to my dunk on JK. Rowling, feels like something

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Speaker 1: that we want to send the audience home with today,

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Speaker 1: just to remember that these are real people's stories and

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Speaker 1: real people's lives at stake.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, so, I mean, there's just endless stories,

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Speaker 3: and I think part of it is just tapping into

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Speaker 3: our shared, you know, experience of being human beings in

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Speaker 3: the world, like any parent knows, as you know, I'm

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Speaker 3: a parent, and I think about, well, when something is

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Speaker 3: hurting your child, you are hurting, and when you know

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Speaker 3: your kid is sick, you're like, oh God, Like I'm

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Speaker 3: just going.

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Speaker 2: To first try to be like do we really have

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Speaker 2: to go to the doctor? Do we really have? You know,

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Speaker 2: You're just we live in a horrible health system.

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Speaker 3: So the idea that parents are like yay, can't wait

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Speaker 3: to see that specialist, and then they get into the

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Speaker 3: specialist like five minutes later, not five months to a

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Speaker 3: year later, this is not an accurate picture of what

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Speaker 3: we all know to be true about healthcare in this country.

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Speaker 3: And so I do just want to say, like we

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Speaker 3: need to challenge these ridiculous narratives of trans care and

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Speaker 3: use our critical thinking skills in order to disrupt them,

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Speaker 3: because at the end of the day, I think about

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Speaker 3: all of these young people who are literally just trying

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Speaker 3: to wake up, go to school, feel comfortable in their bodies,

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Speaker 3: experience the world in a holistic and hopeful way. And

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Speaker 3: I remember we went and we had a full trial

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Speaker 3: in Arkansas. Arkansas was the first date to ban ender

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Speaker 3: affirming medical care for adolescents in twenty twenty one. We

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Speaker 3: went to trial. We had one of our clients testify

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Speaker 3: and he was the last witness on our side, and

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Speaker 3: you know, he's this young man and he had gone

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Speaker 3: from this really just scared kid to a powerful advocate.

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Speaker 3: And I put him on in the courtroom, so, you know,

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Speaker 3: me as a trans lawyer putting on the last witness,

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Speaker 3: this young transman. And the last question I asked him

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Speaker 3: before we closed our case was you know what if

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Speaker 3: in one word, you know, what does this mean to you?

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Speaker 3: And he just said, hope, And it is what I

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Speaker 3: think about my own child, my own child. And I

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Speaker 3: had no hope. I had no sense of a promise

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Speaker 3: of the future. And if the next generation of young

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Speaker 3: people has been given access to this treatment, that allows

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Speaker 3: them to have hope for the future, and what we're

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Speaker 3: doing is taking.

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Speaker 2: That away from them.

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Speaker 3: We're taking away their hope, We're taking away their sense

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Speaker 3: of possibility in a time when it's a scarce resource.

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Speaker 2: But I believe in fighting for it.

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Speaker 3: I believe in fighting for our people and continuing to

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Speaker 3: disrupt these harmful narratives, because at the end of the day,

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Speaker 3: the justices, those nine individuals who control so much of

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Speaker 3: our lives, make their decisions based on the world that

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Speaker 3: they see around them, the world we all share, and

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Speaker 3: so our ability to change the conditions of that decision

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Speaker 3: making process is on all of us, and so we

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Speaker 3: all have a role to play.

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Speaker 1: That's beautiful. Thank you for folks who are here today

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Speaker 1: who might not know where to turn next, what organizations

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Speaker 1: in addition to the Human Rights Campaign to support where

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Speaker 1: to go for more information, perhaps to learn some of

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Speaker 1: the answers to questions they may have, in order to

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Speaker 1: be better advocates across community lines. Where would you point

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Speaker 1: people for that sort of hope and action combined.

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Speaker 3: I'm so bad at the organization question, but I would say,

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Speaker 3: you know, at the ACLU will give information about the case,

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Speaker 3: and I do really want to urge people to stay engaged,

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Speaker 3: as called the United States for Scrimmetti, show up at

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Speaker 3: the court, organize with us. But at the end of

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Speaker 3: the day, I feel that my call for right now

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Speaker 3: is to just make art, tell stories, and be creative,

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Speaker 3: because that is what we need to sustain each other,

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Speaker 3: to sustain our communities, and to continue to change the narratives,

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Speaker 3: the images and everything else that we're seeing.

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Speaker 1: And if I may, I would really love to encourage

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Speaker 1: any parents in the audience, if you've got kids, particularly

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Speaker 1: in elementary school, it doesn't hurt to call your school

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Speaker 1: and say, let all kids play sports.

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Speaker 2: They deserve it. Yeah, do that, Thank you, Thank you,