1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:04,600 Speaker 1: Hey everyone, quick disclaimer before we dive into today's episode, 2 00:00:04,640 --> 00:00:08,639 Speaker 1: which we hope you enjoy. We were recording with a 3 00:00:08,720 --> 00:00:11,680 Speaker 1: couple of technical glitches while we were on the road, 4 00:00:11,800 --> 00:00:15,480 Speaker 1: so you're going to hear my mic sounding just a 5 00:00:15,520 --> 00:00:20,759 Speaker 1: bit strange for today's show hopefully. However, the content is 6 00:00:20,880 --> 00:00:24,919 Speaker 1: solid and can speak for itself. We can't wait to 7 00:00:25,160 --> 00:00:28,040 Speaker 1: share the story of Project as Ore in with you, 8 00:00:28,240 --> 00:00:31,440 Speaker 1: so check it out, and as always, thank you for 9 00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:36,840 Speaker 1: tuning in. From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies, 10 00:00:36,960 --> 00:00:40,800 Speaker 1: history is riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back 11 00:00:40,840 --> 00:00:44,000 Speaker 1: now or learn the stuff they don't want you to know. 12 00:00:44,880 --> 00:00:58,200 Speaker 1: A production of My Heart Breeding. Hello, and welcome back 13 00:00:58,240 --> 00:01:01,200 Speaker 1: to the show. My name is Noel. Our compatriot Matt 14 00:01:01,400 --> 00:01:04,440 Speaker 1: is under the weather, but since his regards and we'll 15 00:01:04,480 --> 00:01:08,680 Speaker 1: be returning soon, so give him some internet love. They 16 00:01:08,720 --> 00:01:11,240 Speaker 1: call me Ben. We're joined as always with our super 17 00:01:11,280 --> 00:01:15,800 Speaker 1: producer Paul Mission Control dec Indo. Most importantly, you are you, 18 00:01:15,800 --> 00:01:19,080 Speaker 1: You are here, and that makes this the stuff they 19 00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:22,160 Speaker 1: don't want you to know. Whether it's your first time 20 00:01:22,160 --> 00:01:24,560 Speaker 1: tuning into this show or whether you are a long 21 00:01:24,680 --> 00:01:28,000 Speaker 1: time listener, Welcome and I think we can all admit 22 00:01:28,760 --> 00:01:31,800 Speaker 1: that world governments get up to shady business. It's just 23 00:01:31,959 --> 00:01:34,880 Speaker 1: part of the job. Governments are always on the up 24 00:01:34,920 --> 00:01:38,280 Speaker 1: and up right, Well, you know that's that's their official 25 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:42,199 Speaker 1: story that other people, most of the vote in public 26 00:01:42,240 --> 00:01:45,679 Speaker 1: would say. Being sketchy and secretive is just an inherent 27 00:01:45,760 --> 00:01:49,280 Speaker 1: part of being a government. And it's not always it's 28 00:01:49,320 --> 00:01:53,080 Speaker 1: not always necessarily evil. It's just that in some cases 29 00:01:53,320 --> 00:01:55,720 Speaker 1: you have to have secrecy. And in some of those 30 00:01:55,760 --> 00:02:00,400 Speaker 1: cases these secrets are fully or partially exposed over time, 31 00:02:00,480 --> 00:02:03,080 Speaker 1: and stuff that was called a conspiracy theory turns out 32 00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:07,320 Speaker 1: to be true, and then also the true story might 33 00:02:07,880 --> 00:02:11,959 Speaker 1: remain hidden forever. That's what we're talking about today. Well, 34 00:02:12,040 --> 00:02:15,800 Speaker 1: it's a real life conspiracy straight from the freezing heart 35 00:02:15,840 --> 00:02:18,760 Speaker 1: of the Cold War. It's a tail, according to Uncle Sam, 36 00:02:19,280 --> 00:02:22,360 Speaker 1: that is now fully out in the open. But as 37 00:02:22,400 --> 00:02:25,600 Speaker 1: you will find, we are not sure that's the case. 38 00:02:25,720 --> 00:02:28,320 Speaker 1: We'll see why in a minute. But without further ado, 39 00:02:28,440 --> 00:02:32,120 Speaker 1: this is the story of a little something called Project Azorean. 40 00:02:32,720 --> 00:02:37,240 Speaker 1: Here are the facts. Ah, let's go back to the sixties, 41 00:02:37,320 --> 00:02:41,160 Speaker 1: nineteen sixties. Cool daddy O that? And then how they 42 00:02:41,200 --> 00:02:43,160 Speaker 1: talked in the sixties or is that more the fifties. 43 00:02:44,600 --> 00:02:46,800 Speaker 1: You know what I feel like, there were probably people 44 00:02:46,919 --> 00:02:49,640 Speaker 1: saying cool daddy O. They were probably that was a 45 00:02:49,680 --> 00:02:52,040 Speaker 1: hold over. It's kind of like, you know, nineteen seventy 46 00:02:52,120 --> 00:02:55,240 Speaker 1: nine versus nineteen eighty. It didn't immediately become the eighties. 47 00:02:55,400 --> 00:02:57,840 Speaker 1: There was some hold over, you know, seventies lingo that 48 00:02:57,880 --> 00:03:00,800 Speaker 1: stuck around. Um, but yeah, we're in the sixties, swinging 49 00:03:01,160 --> 00:03:04,919 Speaker 1: things are happening. Submarines kind of a big deal. The 50 00:03:04,919 --> 00:03:08,760 Speaker 1: height of military attech would allow you to evade tons 51 00:03:08,960 --> 00:03:11,799 Speaker 1: of you know, what are called countermeasures in terms of 52 00:03:11,840 --> 00:03:15,120 Speaker 1: being detected, in terms of being you know, eliminated by 53 00:03:15,160 --> 00:03:17,960 Speaker 1: the enemy, and sneaking you know, into enemy lines to 54 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:21,560 Speaker 1: do surveillance, all kinds of things. Submarines were your best bet. 55 00:03:21,600 --> 00:03:26,720 Speaker 1: You could observe things without the usual intervention and of 56 00:03:26,960 --> 00:03:30,160 Speaker 1: pesky land or air forces. You know, none of those 57 00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:33,239 Speaker 1: under the sea, right, just little crabs and sea creatures, 58 00:03:33,320 --> 00:03:36,160 Speaker 1: you know, playing on a jazz band right under the 59 00:03:36,640 --> 00:03:41,400 Speaker 1: calypso right that it's better. Yeah, now that's a very 60 00:03:41,400 --> 00:03:44,040 Speaker 1: good point. But this is not to say that submarines 61 00:03:44,120 --> 00:03:47,720 Speaker 1: were by any means perfect. Any number of things could 62 00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:51,440 Speaker 1: result in their detection or their destruction, and as of 63 00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:55,800 Speaker 1: now it is impossible to know just how many people 64 00:03:55,960 --> 00:04:01,160 Speaker 1: have met their deaths entombed in the watery graves sunken submarines, 65 00:04:01,440 --> 00:04:03,840 Speaker 1: which is a terrible way to go, especially if you 66 00:04:03,840 --> 00:04:07,920 Speaker 1: have claustrophobia and a fear of drowning. This is the 67 00:04:07,960 --> 00:04:12,920 Speaker 1: world into which the K one to nine emerges. It's 68 00:04:12,960 --> 00:04:15,360 Speaker 1: a submarine. The K one to nine is part of 69 00:04:15,400 --> 00:04:19,520 Speaker 1: what NATO calls the Gulf To class. It's a ballistic 70 00:04:19,600 --> 00:04:23,839 Speaker 1: missile sub with a diesel electric power system. There's important 71 00:04:23,880 --> 00:04:27,360 Speaker 1: distinction here because if you hear about this story, you'll 72 00:04:27,400 --> 00:04:31,520 Speaker 1: often hear K one to nine described as a nuclear sub, 73 00:04:31,760 --> 00:04:34,679 Speaker 1: but it is not nuclear power. It is a diesel 74 00:04:34,880 --> 00:04:39,760 Speaker 1: electric vehicle. Or it was capable of carrying nuclear weapons. 75 00:04:40,120 --> 00:04:43,440 Speaker 1: Not the same thing, but still very very dangerous. Completed 76 00:04:43,560 --> 00:04:47,240 Speaker 1: in nineteen fifty nine, and it was patrolling the seas 77 00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:51,880 Speaker 1: successfully on a routine basis until March of nineteen sixty eight, 78 00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:59,440 Speaker 1: and that's when Soviet naval officials concluded something had gone sideways. 79 00:05:01,120 --> 00:05:06,359 Speaker 1: Sideways like that wine movie, you know that one. You 80 00:05:06,360 --> 00:05:08,840 Speaker 1: don't like it, I really like it. It's I mean, 81 00:05:08,880 --> 00:05:12,640 Speaker 1: it's they're very unpleasant characters. There's no question being that 82 00:05:13,000 --> 00:05:16,120 Speaker 1: none of them have particularly redeeming qualities. But I always did. 83 00:05:16,240 --> 00:05:19,440 Speaker 1: I enjoyed that filmmaker Alexander Paine either way. But yeah, 84 00:05:19,520 --> 00:05:21,200 Speaker 1: you're right, they're all a bunch of bunch of movie 85 00:05:21,200 --> 00:05:24,640 Speaker 1: about a bunch of wine jerks, is what sideways is. Um. 86 00:05:24,680 --> 00:05:26,479 Speaker 1: But that's not what we're talking about today. We're talking 87 00:05:26,560 --> 00:05:31,159 Speaker 1: about a real debacle at sea. Like any other deployed vessel, 88 00:05:31,240 --> 00:05:35,320 Speaker 1: the Kine had a regular schedule of checkens UM. So 89 00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:38,760 Speaker 1: it was about mid March of ight win K one 90 00:05:39,279 --> 00:05:43,479 Speaker 1: nine missed not one but two of these scheduled radio 91 00:05:44,160 --> 00:05:47,599 Speaker 1: check ins you know with commanding officers or you know, 92 00:05:47,760 --> 00:05:51,200 Speaker 1: HQ or whatever you wanna call it. UM time went on, 93 00:05:51,720 --> 00:05:56,840 Speaker 1: the urgency of the communications to K one nineteen increased significantly, 94 00:05:57,120 --> 00:06:00,640 Speaker 1: including like straight up orders you know, command ends to 95 00:06:00,800 --> 00:06:05,440 Speaker 1: break radio silence that went on acknowledged UM after nearly 96 00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:08,679 Speaker 1: two months of silence. So by the third week of March, 97 00:06:09,240 --> 00:06:13,440 Speaker 1: Sovia government considered K one twenty nine to be missing, 98 00:06:13,600 --> 00:06:16,880 Speaker 1: maybe not fully lost yet because they know they first 99 00:06:16,880 --> 00:06:20,680 Speaker 1: have to launch a large scale search and rescue mission 100 00:06:20,760 --> 00:06:24,200 Speaker 1: in the North Pacific from kemp Chotka and ladava stock 101 00:06:24,800 --> 00:06:27,360 Speaker 1: the kind of thing that you really can't cover up 102 00:06:27,360 --> 00:06:32,040 Speaker 1: for too long, right, not the search effort, because the 103 00:06:32,080 --> 00:06:35,719 Speaker 1: streets are in this case, the seas are watching streets watching, 104 00:06:35,839 --> 00:06:40,159 Speaker 1: So Uncle Sam has eyes on this and instantly knows 105 00:06:40,279 --> 00:06:44,000 Speaker 1: something is up. Because both sides of the Cold War 106 00:06:44,320 --> 00:06:50,040 Speaker 1: are like recently, are like x Is who have recently split, 107 00:06:50,160 --> 00:06:54,240 Speaker 1: their obsessively tracking each other. And it didn't take long 108 00:06:54,400 --> 00:06:59,360 Speaker 1: for U. S Intelligence to say, hey, wait, these ships 109 00:06:59,400 --> 00:07:04,320 Speaker 1: and these are deviating from their normal patterns of patrol. 110 00:07:05,120 --> 00:07:07,960 Speaker 1: Why what are why? What's what gives? What are they doing? 111 00:07:08,279 --> 00:07:13,360 Speaker 1: And eventually they concluded, hey, this is exactly what we 112 00:07:13,440 --> 00:07:17,280 Speaker 1: would do if we lost the submarine somewhere. So let's 113 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:19,480 Speaker 1: get the boffins and the eggheads on it. And they 114 00:07:19,520 --> 00:07:24,560 Speaker 1: would yeah, like, I'm watching a lot of British stuff, 115 00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:31,480 Speaker 1: love it. Boffins are the are like the the nerds 116 00:07:32,400 --> 00:07:41,400 Speaker 1: perhaps perhaps want adjacent and your ragheads just so got it. Yes, yeah, 117 00:07:41,560 --> 00:07:45,480 Speaker 1: And so they said, okay, let's let's go back to 118 00:07:45,680 --> 00:07:49,880 Speaker 1: our scientists, our researchers, and let's see what sigans they 119 00:07:49,920 --> 00:07:53,320 Speaker 1: have or signals intelligence. At the time and even now, 120 00:07:53,680 --> 00:08:00,000 Speaker 1: the US had what's called a hydrophone network underwater surveillance 121 00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:04,960 Speaker 1: that is meant to detect noises and irregularities across the globe, 122 00:08:04,960 --> 00:08:08,560 Speaker 1: whether those are whale songs, whether they're sonar, whether they're 123 00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:13,640 Speaker 1: underwater explosions. And they said, okay, Offens, go back through 124 00:08:13,640 --> 00:08:18,080 Speaker 1: your records around this time and see if there's anything 125 00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:21,440 Speaker 1: out of the ordinary that kind of correlates with the 126 00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:27,680 Speaker 1: deviation in Soviet patrol patterns. And they found it. They 127 00:08:27,720 --> 00:08:31,800 Speaker 1: review the recordings and they based on the guesswork of 128 00:08:31,800 --> 00:08:35,480 Speaker 1: those intelligence experts watching the change in naval patterns, and 129 00:08:35,480 --> 00:08:40,640 Speaker 1: they found a record of a mysterious underwater implosion on 130 00:08:40,920 --> 00:08:45,240 Speaker 1: March eighth, nineteen sixty eight, and they were even able 131 00:08:45,280 --> 00:08:48,480 Speaker 1: to isolate it to an area of just like about 132 00:08:48,559 --> 00:08:53,400 Speaker 1: five nautical miles. I think every time we talk about 133 00:08:53,760 --> 00:08:59,440 Speaker 1: underwater naval implosions or explosions, I always recommend the Ridiculous 134 00:08:59,440 --> 00:09:03,320 Speaker 1: History episod that we did um about the Huntley with 135 00:09:03,480 --> 00:09:06,240 Speaker 1: Rachel Lance, who is like not only an expert in 136 00:09:06,360 --> 00:09:11,120 Speaker 1: underwater implosions and explosions, she is like the world's most 137 00:09:11,200 --> 00:09:15,320 Speaker 1: specific nerd in that department. Yes, I love it. She's incredible. 138 00:09:15,360 --> 00:09:16,960 Speaker 1: She wrote a book about it and actually made it 139 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:19,160 Speaker 1: really exciting. The Huntley is is uh, you know, it 140 00:09:19,200 --> 00:09:21,040 Speaker 1: was like, what was it a Civil war submarine and 141 00:09:21,200 --> 00:09:23,360 Speaker 1: I had like flint Stone's pedals kind of. It was 142 00:09:23,559 --> 00:09:26,080 Speaker 1: definitely not the level of tech that we're talking about today. 143 00:09:26,240 --> 00:09:29,160 Speaker 1: But she goes into some great detail about what an 144 00:09:29,240 --> 00:09:33,480 Speaker 1: underwater implosion does to like this erah, you know, and 145 00:09:33,559 --> 00:09:38,480 Speaker 1: like the body it's hellish. It's hellish. Also shout out 146 00:09:38,559 --> 00:09:42,959 Speaker 1: to Rachel for uh for busting one of the biggest 147 00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:47,080 Speaker 1: myths and action movies. If you are in an explosion 148 00:09:47,440 --> 00:09:50,120 Speaker 1: that is powerful enough to knock you in the air 149 00:09:50,280 --> 00:09:53,360 Speaker 1: and back, you don't get up and say I'm getting 150 00:09:53,400 --> 00:09:57,360 Speaker 1: too old for this. You are you are food bar. 151 00:09:57,920 --> 00:10:01,280 Speaker 1: So the US discovers the US and if we go 152 00:10:01,400 --> 00:10:04,280 Speaker 1: with the earlier thesis, noal that governments are always on 153 00:10:04,320 --> 00:10:07,160 Speaker 1: the up and up. They would have told the Soviets, hey, 154 00:10:07,280 --> 00:10:09,960 Speaker 1: we think we found your sub Of course they didn't 155 00:10:09,960 --> 00:10:13,520 Speaker 1: do that. They quietly waited for the Soviet navy to 156 00:10:13,880 --> 00:10:17,120 Speaker 1: give up searching. The Soviets were also, by the way, 157 00:10:17,160 --> 00:10:20,920 Speaker 1: searching in the wrong spot, as will come to find. 158 00:10:21,240 --> 00:10:25,840 Speaker 1: So the Soviet forces instead, after a long, harrowing search, 159 00:10:26,160 --> 00:10:28,960 Speaker 1: instead of finding anything. They quietly said, the K one 160 00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:34,400 Speaker 1: to nine is lost, along with all souls aboard. And 161 00:10:35,880 --> 00:10:40,400 Speaker 1: this was delightful to the US. They were already just 162 00:10:40,559 --> 00:10:45,199 Speaker 1: as quietly working on something else, a grand conspiracy at sea, 163 00:10:45,360 --> 00:10:49,319 Speaker 1: unlike anything that it ever happened before. They wanted to 164 00:10:49,480 --> 00:10:54,280 Speaker 1: steal an entire submarine from the depths of the ocean 165 00:10:54,600 --> 00:10:59,360 Speaker 1: without letting anyone, including the American public, know a thing 166 00:11:00,080 --> 00:11:07,280 Speaker 1: about it. Slide bastards, you sly American dogs away, that's us. Um. Yeah, 167 00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:10,800 Speaker 1: I mean it's it's an opportunity, that's for sure. Yeah. 168 00:11:10,880 --> 00:11:14,920 Speaker 1: And it's also not just slide, but it's ambitious. So 169 00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:21,000 Speaker 1: this is where the conspiracy begins. Here's where it gets crazy. 170 00:11:21,200 --> 00:11:24,040 Speaker 1: What we should say is this is where the conspiracy 171 00:11:24,120 --> 00:11:29,920 Speaker 1: we know about begins. Because the CIA was acutely aware 172 00:11:30,640 --> 00:11:34,520 Speaker 1: of the treasure trove under those frigid waters in the 173 00:11:34,559 --> 00:11:37,160 Speaker 1: middle of the Pacific, and as far as they were concerned, 174 00:11:37,200 --> 00:11:42,079 Speaker 1: at first, price was no object. But there were problems, 175 00:11:42,480 --> 00:11:48,000 Speaker 1: like according to their calculations, the sub sank at a 176 00:11:48,080 --> 00:11:52,600 Speaker 1: forty point one degrees north latitude hundred and seventy nine 177 00:11:52,640 --> 00:11:56,679 Speaker 1: point nine degrees east longitude. If you pull that up 178 00:11:56,720 --> 00:11:59,280 Speaker 1: on like Google Earth or Google Maps or whatever you're 179 00:11:59,320 --> 00:12:01,800 Speaker 1: going to see. It is in the middle of nowhere 180 00:12:01,960 --> 00:12:06,479 Speaker 1: in the North Pacific. It's like Cathulu Country. It's the closest. 181 00:12:06,600 --> 00:12:10,400 Speaker 1: Like for reference, if you look at Hawaii, it's about 182 00:12:10,840 --> 00:12:16,600 Speaker 1: one thousand five nautical miles northwest of Hawaii, and nautical 183 00:12:16,640 --> 00:12:20,320 Speaker 1: miles are not quite the same as a mile for 184 00:12:20,559 --> 00:12:25,000 Speaker 1: land lovers. As the crow flies, it's it's you know, 185 00:12:25,320 --> 00:12:27,920 Speaker 1: let's say, as the crow swims, and I'm sure crow 186 00:12:27,960 --> 00:12:30,800 Speaker 1: would be pissed if they had to swim, but it's 187 00:12:30,960 --> 00:12:34,240 Speaker 1: it's like a good go of it, you know them, Yeah, 188 00:12:34,280 --> 00:12:36,800 Speaker 1: they tried. It's smart enough maybe that they would eventually 189 00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:40,880 Speaker 1: build a boat. Who knows they would. Uh, if you 190 00:12:40,920 --> 00:12:43,840 Speaker 1: were a crow in a boat and you were looking 191 00:12:43,960 --> 00:12:47,240 Speaker 1: at a nautical mile, it's a little more than a 192 00:12:47,600 --> 00:12:53,240 Speaker 1: regular mile because it's based on the longitude of latitude coordinates. Um, 193 00:12:53,960 --> 00:12:56,920 Speaker 1: so it's a slightly different calculations. One point one five 194 00:12:58,040 --> 00:13:01,360 Speaker 1: land miles. Anyway, point is in the middle of nowhere. 195 00:13:01,400 --> 00:13:04,079 Speaker 1: This substincts in the middle of nowhere, and they know 196 00:13:04,320 --> 00:13:08,600 Speaker 1: that it sinks deep. We say deep, we mean very deep. 197 00:13:08,840 --> 00:13:13,680 Speaker 1: Four thousand, eight d eight meters or sixteen thousand feet 198 00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:19,520 Speaker 1: into the depths. This thing is lost, So they decide 199 00:13:20,280 --> 00:13:23,200 Speaker 1: that they be in the US decide that since it's 200 00:13:23,200 --> 00:13:29,680 Speaker 1: obvious the Russians don't know where this sub is, they 201 00:13:29,679 --> 00:13:32,280 Speaker 1: can be first to the gate, they can try to 202 00:13:32,320 --> 00:13:35,600 Speaker 1: find it. So they send out another submarine, right, one 203 00:13:35,600 --> 00:13:39,120 Speaker 1: of their own. Yeah, just for the hell of it. Um, 204 00:13:39,240 --> 00:13:41,120 Speaker 1: they sent out the U S S. Hal But I'm sorry, 205 00:13:41,160 --> 00:13:42,920 Speaker 1: I every time I see that word, I have to 206 00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:45,160 Speaker 1: say that joke. I did, I think so too. I 207 00:13:45,200 --> 00:13:48,760 Speaker 1: did a back in boy Scouts. We used to do 208 00:13:49,920 --> 00:13:53,319 Speaker 1: a night of plays which just descended into pun based 209 00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:56,560 Speaker 1: sketch comedy and Uh. We got in trouble one time 210 00:13:56,600 --> 00:13:59,640 Speaker 1: because we wrote a sketch about a a serial killer 211 00:13:59,679 --> 00:14:04,120 Speaker 1: who up calling over people from like a fish delivery service, 212 00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:08,240 Speaker 1: uh and murdering them. And the punchline is, you know 213 00:14:08,320 --> 00:14:11,199 Speaker 1: one the last guy at the fish places like, wait, 214 00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:14,320 Speaker 1: you killed everyone who worked? Why? And the guys shrugs 215 00:14:14,360 --> 00:14:19,400 Speaker 1: and says for the halibit our adults, it's it's classic. 216 00:14:19,400 --> 00:14:21,240 Speaker 1: They'll never never get all. I do have to say 217 00:14:21,280 --> 00:14:25,200 Speaker 1: that it seems like a really wimpy name for a submarine. 218 00:14:25,360 --> 00:14:27,440 Speaker 1: I find the Halibit to be like one of the 219 00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:30,560 Speaker 1: more bland and innocuous fishes of the sea. Why not 220 00:14:30,600 --> 00:14:32,880 Speaker 1: like the U S. S. Tiger shark or something that 221 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:35,480 Speaker 1: UYS has. Halibit does. I don't really fear the USS 222 00:14:35,520 --> 00:14:38,800 Speaker 1: halibit Um. But it was deployed from Pearl Harbor, yes, 223 00:14:38,840 --> 00:14:42,160 Speaker 1: that Pearl Harbor in Hawaii to where they believed the 224 00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:46,320 Speaker 1: sub wreckage would be found uh and this operation was 225 00:14:46,400 --> 00:14:49,560 Speaker 1: dubbed sand Dog, And after three weeks of searching, the 226 00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:54,000 Speaker 1: halib did in fact find uh that wreckage and took 227 00:14:54,120 --> 00:14:57,520 Speaker 1: a lot of photographs of the k one, which is 228 00:14:57,520 --> 00:15:01,440 Speaker 1: what convinced Nixon and his staff have to take to 229 00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:05,920 Speaker 1: the high seas pirate style, you know, rattling their sabers, 230 00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:09,840 Speaker 1: and they all donned eye patches and uh striped shirts 231 00:15:10,400 --> 00:15:14,160 Speaker 1: chest yo ho ho. Indeed, so this is you know, 232 00:15:14,200 --> 00:15:17,280 Speaker 1: I love that we're pointing this out. Halib does seem 233 00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:19,960 Speaker 1: to be an innocuous name. And there there are a 234 00:15:19,960 --> 00:15:23,400 Speaker 1: couple of reasons. Maybe maybe the person who got to 235 00:15:23,520 --> 00:15:27,080 Speaker 1: name this sub was like the halibit is a is 236 00:15:27,120 --> 00:15:32,520 Speaker 1: a proud, noble fish. But but there's also a compelling 237 00:15:32,600 --> 00:15:38,600 Speaker 1: argument that this submarine was partially chosen because it did 238 00:15:38,640 --> 00:15:41,560 Speaker 1: sound like an ordinary run of the mill thing. We'll 239 00:15:41,560 --> 00:15:45,160 Speaker 1: see why that support later, But yes, piracy on the 240 00:15:45,280 --> 00:15:50,120 Speaker 1: high seas and the president of the country turns into 241 00:15:50,240 --> 00:15:53,480 Speaker 1: a pirate at the behest, and the urging of two 242 00:15:53,560 --> 00:15:57,640 Speaker 1: guys who work closely with a Melvin Laird and Henry 243 00:15:57,720 --> 00:16:01,880 Speaker 1: Kissinger you know him, you know uh. They were the 244 00:16:02,040 --> 00:16:05,120 Speaker 1: two big champions of this idea, and I just picture 245 00:16:05,160 --> 00:16:09,960 Speaker 1: them pitching a sub heist to President Nixon. Somehow it 246 00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:13,000 Speaker 1: worked in the US starts brainstorming and they say, Okay, 247 00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:15,600 Speaker 1: here's what we're gonna do. We're gotta recover all the 248 00:16:15,600 --> 00:16:18,080 Speaker 1: wreckage from the sub and we're going to learn more 249 00:16:18,080 --> 00:16:22,840 Speaker 1: about Soviet nuclear missile technology. But just as importantly, we're 250 00:16:22,880 --> 00:16:25,120 Speaker 1: gonna learn about how they get away with all the 251 00:16:25,320 --> 00:16:29,680 Speaker 1: sneaky codes they wanted, the cryptography they wanted, the code 252 00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:34,360 Speaker 1: books that Soviet Soviet officials in the HQ you mentioned 253 00:16:34,800 --> 00:16:39,200 Speaker 1: used to communicate with Soviet submarines, and for waxing poetic 254 00:16:39,480 --> 00:16:43,920 Speaker 1: Uncle Sam said, this is an opportunity to steal the arms, 255 00:16:44,160 --> 00:16:49,120 Speaker 1: the ears, and the tongue of our adversary. Growth Yeah, gross, 256 00:16:49,160 --> 00:16:52,200 Speaker 1: but that's war. It's true, and I don't know I 257 00:16:52,200 --> 00:16:56,360 Speaker 1: don't whatever I read about these kind of Soviet US 258 00:16:56,800 --> 00:16:59,680 Speaker 1: tit for tat kind of operations. I can't not think 259 00:16:59,720 --> 00:17:03,000 Speaker 1: of doctor Strange Love and all of those incredible conversations 260 00:17:03,040 --> 00:17:05,280 Speaker 1: in the war room. There's no fighting in the war room. 261 00:17:05,680 --> 00:17:08,399 Speaker 1: And when he keeps the President Merkin muffily in the 262 00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:12,240 Speaker 1: most amazing satirical character name of all time, um is 263 00:17:12,240 --> 00:17:14,679 Speaker 1: talking to the I guess the Prime Minister of Russia. 264 00:17:14,840 --> 00:17:19,919 Speaker 1: Kids like Dmitri. Oh, Dmitri, calmed down, Dmitri, Everything is fine. 265 00:17:20,480 --> 00:17:23,120 Speaker 1: I really it's so good. As rewatched it. It's it's 266 00:17:23,119 --> 00:17:26,120 Speaker 1: fresh in my memory through it so holds up wonderful. 267 00:17:26,320 --> 00:17:29,280 Speaker 1: It's yeah, it's fantastic. Where you say that, I rewatched 268 00:17:29,359 --> 00:17:32,800 Speaker 1: that as well, almost whenever we're doing an episode like this. 269 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:36,960 Speaker 1: But here's the think. Those two goals we just named 270 00:17:37,119 --> 00:17:41,040 Speaker 1: were maybe the primary goals again according to the official story, 271 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:43,960 Speaker 1: but they certainly weren't the only ones. We're gonna pause 272 00:17:44,080 --> 00:17:46,359 Speaker 1: for a moment for a word from our sponsor, and 273 00:17:46,400 --> 00:17:52,560 Speaker 1: then we'll dive deep uh into dolphins. Other ideas I 274 00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:55,600 Speaker 1: wish I could make a dolphins sound is that it 275 00:17:55,760 --> 00:18:00,199 Speaker 1: is that okay, just too low, so you know it 276 00:18:01,119 --> 00:18:10,440 Speaker 1: I did my level best and we have returned. So 277 00:18:10,520 --> 00:18:14,320 Speaker 1: there are goals within goals, there are wheels within wheels. 278 00:18:15,560 --> 00:18:19,840 Speaker 1: The American forces knew that they could learn more about 279 00:18:20,000 --> 00:18:24,479 Speaker 1: the Soviet sonar system and the ways that Soviet subs 280 00:18:24,520 --> 00:18:29,040 Speaker 1: were able to often avoid detection from other navies. This 281 00:18:29,119 --> 00:18:33,760 Speaker 1: is this is on the level of Pakistan stealing the 282 00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:38,000 Speaker 1: stealth helicopter in the Osama Bin Laden raid and then 283 00:18:38,320 --> 00:18:41,119 Speaker 1: selling it to someone else who very much wanted to 284 00:18:41,760 --> 00:18:45,119 Speaker 1: learn the mechanisms of the magic tricks. So the US 285 00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:47,879 Speaker 1: starts weighing pros and cons. This is very much a 286 00:18:47,960 --> 00:18:52,040 Speaker 1: Doctor Strange love situation, and they were like, pro, we're 287 00:18:52,040 --> 00:18:56,359 Speaker 1: gonna learn more than ever about these Soviet subs. They're 288 00:18:56,520 --> 00:19:01,480 Speaker 1: very dangerous because, like we said, they can move around undetected. 289 00:19:01,520 --> 00:19:04,560 Speaker 1: They can carry nuclear weapons, so we could have nukes 290 00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:08,400 Speaker 1: popping off the coast of California. So now we can 291 00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:12,800 Speaker 1: know how to stop them. Con this is an active piracy. Uh, 292 00:19:12,840 --> 00:19:15,879 Speaker 1: this could trigger World War three. Okay, everybody in the 293 00:19:15,960 --> 00:19:19,000 Speaker 1: room has dealt with that. And even if we're not caught, 294 00:19:19,440 --> 00:19:23,119 Speaker 1: this might get kind of expensive. It might you know, 295 00:19:23,119 --> 00:19:25,560 Speaker 1: it might be pricey. But we know the K one 296 00:19:25,640 --> 00:19:28,399 Speaker 1: to nine is definitely there. All we have to do 297 00:19:28,760 --> 00:19:32,160 Speaker 1: is figure out how to snag it without getting busted. 298 00:19:32,720 --> 00:19:38,919 Speaker 1: So ultimately, whatever the minutia of their conversation was, they decided, 299 00:19:39,600 --> 00:19:43,160 Speaker 1: well it hold my beer, let's go get this sub. 300 00:19:44,640 --> 00:19:48,000 Speaker 1: That's that's a verbatim quote right from Kissings like those 301 00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:52,120 Speaker 1: are some foul mouth bureaucrats there in Washington. They don't 302 00:19:52,119 --> 00:19:57,360 Speaker 1: mince words, we tell you, and so in utter secrecy. 303 00:19:57,600 --> 00:20:00,159 Speaker 1: By the way, no one knows about this because ever 304 00:20:00,240 --> 00:20:03,280 Speaker 1: a very small group of people the company begins working 305 00:20:03,320 --> 00:20:08,040 Speaker 1: on something they call Project Azorian. No one has ever 306 00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:11,840 Speaker 1: at this point accomplished something like this before, much less 307 00:20:12,480 --> 00:20:15,440 Speaker 1: in a top secret manner. So they have to get 308 00:20:15,480 --> 00:20:17,560 Speaker 1: the CIA involved, right, and they have to have c 309 00:20:17,720 --> 00:20:20,800 Speaker 1: I A level secrecy. They thought of all kinds of 310 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:25,680 Speaker 1: weird stuff before they ultimately landed on their plan. And 311 00:20:26,119 --> 00:20:29,159 Speaker 1: just so the plan doesn't sound too too crazy, I 312 00:20:29,200 --> 00:20:31,440 Speaker 1: think maybe no, we need to talk a little bit 313 00:20:31,480 --> 00:20:35,760 Speaker 1: about there are other ideas. Yeah. Yeah, they had some 314 00:20:35,760 --> 00:20:40,920 Speaker 1: some doozies, uh, like making a gigantic gas bubble large 315 00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:44,440 Speaker 1: enough to lift the entire sub to the surface, at 316 00:20:44,440 --> 00:20:49,840 Speaker 1: which point they could then you know, retrieve its power. Yeah, man, 317 00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:52,919 Speaker 1: I don't know. It just sounds to me. It sounds 318 00:20:52,960 --> 00:20:55,280 Speaker 1: like magic, like something you've see in a Disney movie 319 00:20:55,320 --> 00:20:59,080 Speaker 1: when some ancient treasure is like levitated using like you know, 320 00:20:59,400 --> 00:21:02,480 Speaker 1: ocean ma check or whatever. I understand how that would work. 321 00:21:02,880 --> 00:21:05,120 Speaker 1: Maybe maybe there's a I don't know, maybe it's a thing. 322 00:21:05,160 --> 00:21:07,520 Speaker 1: It's certainly seems pretty pine in this guy and they 323 00:21:07,600 --> 00:21:10,159 Speaker 1: laundry listed a bunch of other bonker's ideas before they 324 00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:14,840 Speaker 1: landed on the least bonkers ish idea, which is, you know, 325 00:21:14,920 --> 00:21:18,160 Speaker 1: building a giant mechanical claw. Who doesn't love a giant 326 00:21:18,160 --> 00:21:20,959 Speaker 1: mechanical claw? Ben is this like sort of like well, 327 00:21:21,000 --> 00:21:23,840 Speaker 1: like a claw machine, one of those rigged claw machines 328 00:21:23,880 --> 00:21:25,479 Speaker 1: you'd see it in an arcade, but like, you know, 329 00:21:25,880 --> 00:21:30,120 Speaker 1: scale pretty much exactly whatever other ideas they went through, 330 00:21:30,560 --> 00:21:32,880 Speaker 1: at some point they said, why don't we just sort 331 00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:38,200 Speaker 1: of build a claw and yoink this submarine to the surface. 332 00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:43,000 Speaker 1: That's that was their idea. It's exactly like a it's 333 00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:47,000 Speaker 1: exactly like one of those hanging claw games that are yeah, 334 00:21:47,080 --> 00:21:50,720 Speaker 1: in my opinion, rake two. Uh So, Nixon approves this 335 00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:53,960 Speaker 1: plan sometime in the early seventies, and the timeline is 336 00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:59,679 Speaker 1: important because the ocean is a hungry, hungry hippo or 337 00:21:59,800 --> 00:22:03,480 Speaker 1: hung very hungry place. It eats manmade things, it degrades them, 338 00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:06,560 Speaker 1: and there's a clock ticking. So this means with each 339 00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:10,480 Speaker 1: passing year, the integrity of that submarine is degrading. The 340 00:22:10,560 --> 00:22:15,159 Speaker 1: stakes are impossibly high. They're trying to steal an entire 341 00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:19,360 Speaker 1: submarine and they have to build the technology to do it, 342 00:22:19,440 --> 00:22:23,520 Speaker 1: because the technology to do this doesn't exist yet. Furthermore, 343 00:22:24,040 --> 00:22:26,160 Speaker 1: and I thought, I thought you really enjoyed this part. 344 00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:30,119 Speaker 1: They need a plausible cover story to explain why a U. 345 00:22:30,280 --> 00:22:33,199 Speaker 1: S ship is out diddling around in the middle of 346 00:22:33,320 --> 00:22:38,400 Speaker 1: nautical nowhere. They needed help. Luckily they had some powerful friends, 347 00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:43,800 Speaker 1: so they contact get this eccentric billionaire, real life Tony 348 00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:47,320 Speaker 1: Stark of the time, Howard Hughes, And they say, hey, 349 00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:50,399 Speaker 1: how he can do us a solid here? Can you 350 00:22:50,480 --> 00:22:53,840 Speaker 1: tell everybody in America and therefore the world that like 351 00:22:54,280 --> 00:22:59,600 Speaker 1: you're doing this hand the handwashing enthusiasts Howard Hughes, Uh, 352 00:23:00,520 --> 00:23:07,000 Speaker 1: Mason jar urinator, hater of nail clippers. Yeah, he's he's 353 00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:09,080 Speaker 1: he's a character. You know, I've never seen the aviator. 354 00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:12,280 Speaker 1: Is there any good? Um? I saw it years ago. 355 00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:16,480 Speaker 1: I remember seeing it. Paul, what do you think. You 356 00:23:16,560 --> 00:23:20,879 Speaker 1: think it's great? Paul thinks it's great. Definitely worth the rewatch. Um. 357 00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:23,359 Speaker 1: I've never seen it at all, so I would definitely 358 00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:28,560 Speaker 1: watch it. Also uses such a fascinating character. You know, 359 00:23:28,680 --> 00:23:31,200 Speaker 1: he did so much in the world of entertainment and 360 00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:35,920 Speaker 1: aviation and so on and Buce Goose right. Yep. The 361 00:23:36,040 --> 00:23:39,080 Speaker 1: end of his life was tragic, but he already had 362 00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:42,920 Speaker 1: an established relationship with the US government. You can't be 363 00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:47,000 Speaker 1: a billionaire in the United States and not already have 364 00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:50,800 Speaker 1: a deep relationship with the government. Called me cynical, but 365 00:23:51,400 --> 00:23:56,080 Speaker 1: don't that's that's absolutely realistic. We don't make the rules 366 00:23:56,560 --> 00:24:00,080 Speaker 1: because we are not billionaires. But here's what he it. 367 00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:02,639 Speaker 1: He went to the public. He said, Okay, I'll do 368 00:24:02,840 --> 00:24:05,320 Speaker 1: this for you. C I a uh, and you just 369 00:24:05,440 --> 00:24:08,200 Speaker 1: told me a favor in the future. He went to 370 00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:14,639 Speaker 1: the public and he made this weird declaration. He said, Oh, America, 371 00:24:14,800 --> 00:24:17,840 Speaker 1: I am going to start mining the bottom of the 372 00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:23,320 Speaker 1: ocean floor for manganese new duels. Uh. They are little 373 00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:27,000 Speaker 1: little mineral rich rock collections that are found on the 374 00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:29,040 Speaker 1: on the floor of the ocean. And the thing is 375 00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:34,719 Speaker 1: everybody believed him. They bought it hook line, subclaw and sinker. 376 00:24:34,840 --> 00:24:38,480 Speaker 1: Howard Hughes was already we have to remember very well known. 377 00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:42,240 Speaker 1: Dare I say infamous for saying very wild stuff, like 378 00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:45,240 Speaker 1: I said Tony Stark earlier. But think of ya, think 379 00:24:45,280 --> 00:24:48,600 Speaker 1: of Kanye West. He's like Yea and La Musk and 380 00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:52,080 Speaker 1: Tony Stark combined. I refuse to call him. Yeah, I 381 00:24:52,160 --> 00:24:54,520 Speaker 1: won't do it. I just won't do it. Okay, Well 382 00:24:54,640 --> 00:24:57,520 Speaker 1: you gotta. I guess man's gotta have a code. I'm 383 00:24:57,560 --> 00:24:59,359 Speaker 1: just going with ye because that's what he wants to 384 00:24:59,440 --> 00:25:01,840 Speaker 1: be called. Give you you know, in all fairness, if 385 00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:04,639 Speaker 1: you or mad or Mission Control said I want to 386 00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:08,639 Speaker 1: go by a crazy name, I would back it up. 387 00:25:08,720 --> 00:25:11,520 Speaker 1: If like if you, if you texted me one morning 388 00:25:11,520 --> 00:25:13,320 Speaker 1: and you're like, Ben, a lot of stuff happened last 389 00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:17,360 Speaker 1: night of going by snake bite from now on? Are 390 00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:19,600 Speaker 1: you sure? And if you're sure, then I got your back. 391 00:25:19,800 --> 00:25:22,119 Speaker 1: You've given me a lot to think about them. Um. 392 00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:26,160 Speaker 1: But yeah, it's definitely true. It's definitely a fair comparison. 393 00:25:26,600 --> 00:25:29,119 Speaker 1: So he's the perfect kind of subterfuge for all this 394 00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:33,800 Speaker 1: middle of nowhere nautical diddling that you described earlier ben Um. 395 00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:37,520 Speaker 1: He launched a company, or at least the line's share 396 00:25:37,680 --> 00:25:41,359 Speaker 1: of the actual work building this vessel came from a 397 00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:43,840 Speaker 1: group called Global Marine Development, and I'm sorry that was 398 00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:45,520 Speaker 1: a real company, had nothing to do with Hughes. The 399 00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:48,240 Speaker 1: company was given the job of building this vessel called 400 00:25:48,320 --> 00:25:52,440 Speaker 1: the Huge Glomar Explorer. What's a glomar? That sounds like 401 00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:54,159 Speaker 1: that's some sort of it makes me think of like 402 00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:57,240 Speaker 1: luminous rocks and like legend of Zelda Breath of the Wild. 403 00:25:57,320 --> 00:26:02,000 Speaker 1: What is a glomar? Yeah, glomer is I wish it were. Uh, 404 00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:04,919 Speaker 1: I wish it was based on what you were describing, 405 00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:08,479 Speaker 1: but instead it's just sort of a portmanteau of Global Marine, 406 00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:17,520 Speaker 1: like Globo Cam. Yeah, so Glomar, the hues Glomar Explorer 407 00:26:18,359 --> 00:26:22,159 Speaker 1: is weird because remember how he said the Halibut feels 408 00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:25,160 Speaker 1: like sort of a pedestrian name for a powerful submarine 409 00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:27,639 Speaker 1: and something you could underestimate. That's what they want to 410 00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:32,520 Speaker 1: do with the Glomar Explorer. It's built to look like 411 00:26:33,080 --> 00:26:37,399 Speaker 1: kind of average for a state of the art system. Uh, 412 00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:41,480 Speaker 1: It's supposed to look like a mining vessel while secretly 413 00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:45,480 Speaker 1: being a submarine retrieval vessel. And this made me think 414 00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:50,119 Speaker 1: of do you remember those old masked toys, you know 415 00:26:50,200 --> 00:26:54,800 Speaker 1: I'm talking about, like like the future Cops. Well, they 416 00:26:54,880 --> 00:26:58,520 Speaker 1: looked like uh, they were sold as like these vehicles 417 00:26:58,560 --> 00:27:02,040 Speaker 1: that would look like regular toys if you just search masks, 418 00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:04,439 Speaker 1: but they were like they were sort of like cops. 419 00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:06,280 Speaker 1: They were sort of like, well, there's also a cartoon 420 00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:08,800 Speaker 1: in that same era called Cops that was like an 421 00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:11,520 Speaker 1: acronym and they were like future weird cyber cops. But 422 00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:15,480 Speaker 1: if I'm not mistaken, mask was some sort of paramilitary 423 00:27:15,640 --> 00:27:20,240 Speaker 1: crime fighting force and it was very Transformers adjacent. It was. 424 00:27:20,280 --> 00:27:23,880 Speaker 1: It was kind of like Poe Transformers, right, yeah, yeah, yeah, 425 00:27:23,960 --> 00:27:26,800 Speaker 1: this was the era of this is the era of 426 00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:30,960 Speaker 1: those eighties nineties toys that we're all weirdly militarized. You know, 427 00:27:31,280 --> 00:27:36,280 Speaker 1: you had cops, you had and they all had like acronyms. 428 00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:39,040 Speaker 1: Sometimes there was G. I. Joe of course, which is 429 00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:42,760 Speaker 1: much older, and masks. So look up masked toys if 430 00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:44,480 Speaker 1: you want to get a sense of the idea of 431 00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:49,120 Speaker 1: this subterfuge. Man, I wish I still had those. Let's 432 00:27:49,119 --> 00:27:52,040 Speaker 1: talk about this glomar thing. So it sets sail in 433 00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:57,399 Speaker 1: June four, and it carries this claw that has two names. 434 00:27:57,480 --> 00:28:00,560 Speaker 1: Its official name or this series of claws. Their official 435 00:28:00,680 --> 00:28:04,840 Speaker 1: name is Capture Vehicle. But the crew of the project officials, 436 00:28:06,119 --> 00:28:08,920 Speaker 1: they call it Clementine. I would have called it maybe 437 00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:14,280 Speaker 1: doctor Claw for sticking with like that Saturday Morning cartoon theme. Yeah, 438 00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:18,800 Speaker 1: we're just funny here though. Does cute though? If it's 439 00:28:18,840 --> 00:28:23,240 Speaker 1: a cute name for a big scary claw. Uh so, 440 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:26,280 Speaker 1: I I get it. I get it. Yeah. And here's 441 00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:29,399 Speaker 1: the idea. So, just as Kissinger and Layard and Nixon 442 00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:34,080 Speaker 1: had decided this series of clauses, Claude mechanism would dive 443 00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:36,960 Speaker 1: down and it would pick up the sub and it 444 00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:41,240 Speaker 1: would take it into what's called a moon pool. This 445 00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:47,400 Speaker 1: is a submerged area within the glomar that would allow 446 00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:50,959 Speaker 1: them to just bring the sub directly inside the vessel 447 00:28:51,680 --> 00:28:54,520 Speaker 1: and the entire thing would take place underwater, so you 448 00:28:54,640 --> 00:28:57,960 Speaker 1: couldn't see what was happening from say a satellite or 449 00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:01,320 Speaker 1: a spy plane. And they would you something that oil 450 00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:04,840 Speaker 1: drilling rigs will do. It's a technique or a thing 451 00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:07,360 Speaker 1: called a pipe string. So you've got a bunch of 452 00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:10,880 Speaker 1: segments of long pipe. In this case, they're made out 453 00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:14,200 Speaker 1: something called marriaging steel M A R A G I 454 00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:16,960 Speaker 1: N G. And that will be important later. So you 455 00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:20,160 Speaker 1: take these pipes, you would attach these light claw segments 456 00:29:20,280 --> 00:29:22,840 Speaker 1: the very end. You would feed them down this hole 457 00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:25,440 Speaker 1: in the center of the ship, and then you would 458 00:29:25,560 --> 00:29:28,840 Speaker 1: attach another length of pipe, and another, and another and 459 00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:31,160 Speaker 1: another until you got down to where the ship was. 460 00:29:31,800 --> 00:29:36,240 Speaker 1: You would clamp on like clementine claw the sub and 461 00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:38,080 Speaker 1: then you would pull it up, and as you would 462 00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:41,080 Speaker 1: pull it up, you would disassemble these sections of the pipe. 463 00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:46,520 Speaker 1: It's pretty ingenious. It's a cool idea. It's called Project Azorean. 464 00:29:48,280 --> 00:29:51,600 Speaker 1: We got there, We got there. S Can I add, 465 00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:54,360 Speaker 1: just really quickly another name for a moon pool that 466 00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:57,600 Speaker 1: I love the moon pool idea is a wet porch. 467 00:29:58,800 --> 00:30:04,480 Speaker 1: Wet porch porch. Love it. I love it so wet porch, 468 00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:09,960 Speaker 1: the mud room of the sea. Yeah. So this Operation 469 00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:15,120 Speaker 1: azuri in starts in nine four four. It takes about 470 00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:18,480 Speaker 1: it takes a little over a month, and to this 471 00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:20,960 Speaker 1: day a lot of it is still classified. So we 472 00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:25,400 Speaker 1: don't know a ton about this heist, about the details, 473 00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:30,440 Speaker 1: but we do know. And as Fellows centophiles, I thought, no, 474 00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:34,680 Speaker 1: you and Paul would really enjoy this. This feels cinematic 475 00:30:34,760 --> 00:30:39,920 Speaker 1: to me. During this project, during this month plus project 476 00:30:40,360 --> 00:30:46,640 Speaker 1: to Soviet chips actually happened across the globe. Are they 477 00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:50,400 Speaker 1: visit it and they don't know that they're missing submarine 478 00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:53,120 Speaker 1: which has been missing for years now is right under 479 00:30:53,200 --> 00:30:57,640 Speaker 1: their nose? Or do they? Because after the Soviet Union falls, 480 00:30:58,040 --> 00:31:02,680 Speaker 1: the public learns that Sophie intelligence officials had received a 481 00:31:02,840 --> 00:31:07,080 Speaker 1: tip off someone probably on the U S side, had 482 00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:11,240 Speaker 1: leaked to the information out out of the boat of 483 00:31:11,320 --> 00:31:15,280 Speaker 1: secrecy and said, hey, there's a salvage operation going on. 484 00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:17,680 Speaker 1: You guys might be interested in. But this might have 485 00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:21,280 Speaker 1: been dismissed as noise or just rumors, or even like 486 00:31:21,520 --> 00:31:25,680 Speaker 1: false intel, because everybody up to this point had thought 487 00:31:26,360 --> 00:31:30,680 Speaker 1: that was impossible to get a sub from these depths. 488 00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:33,960 Speaker 1: Whatever the case may be. However, much of the Soviets 489 00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:38,320 Speaker 1: knew the operation did meet a speed bump, a sub bump, 490 00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:41,440 Speaker 1: because for the people who thought it was impossible to 491 00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:45,440 Speaker 1: do this on the Soviet side, kind of turns out 492 00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:49,440 Speaker 1: they were right. Yeah. According to some eyewitnesses um that 493 00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:54,360 Speaker 1: were interviewed later, several of the clause fractured after they 494 00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:59,040 Speaker 1: grabbed the K one, meaning that the sub itself was 495 00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:02,640 Speaker 1: actually all hanged up. About two thirds of it fell 496 00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:05,880 Speaker 1: back into the sea, so they didn't get the whole 497 00:32:05,880 --> 00:32:08,840 Speaker 1: They didn't even get the whole thing. Um. Experts believe 498 00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:11,719 Speaker 1: that the clause may have broken because of the steel 499 00:32:11,800 --> 00:32:14,400 Speaker 1: they were made from. What was that steel called at adamantium. 500 00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:18,560 Speaker 1: Now it wasn't that one marriaging steel. Okay, I don't know. 501 00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:22,280 Speaker 1: Something about marriaging just doesn't doesn't fill me with confidence. 502 00:32:22,320 --> 00:32:23,680 Speaker 1: I don't know why I should have gone with like 503 00:32:23,800 --> 00:32:25,840 Speaker 1: a should have gone with like a more sci fi 504 00:32:25,920 --> 00:32:31,200 Speaker 1: grade steel. Um, But there's a reason marriaging steel. It 505 00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:38,080 Speaker 1: is strong, but it's not super flexible and ductile. So therefore, um, 506 00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:43,280 Speaker 1: if it's weight is exceeded or if it's trained too 507 00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:48,840 Speaker 1: much certain current, yep, it breaks. Yeah. So they end 508 00:32:48,920 --> 00:32:52,240 Speaker 1: up with about a third of the sub. And this 509 00:32:52,480 --> 00:32:58,040 Speaker 1: is for for a day to day life comparison. Something 510 00:32:58,160 --> 00:33:00,760 Speaker 1: like this has happened to a lot of people in 511 00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:04,960 Speaker 1: the audience today. You know, imagine you're you're slicing a 512 00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:08,560 Speaker 1: cake and you've got a little triangle instrument that people 513 00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:11,440 Speaker 1: used to lift a slice of cake, and you lift 514 00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:13,880 Speaker 1: an extra big slice of cake and then part of 515 00:33:13,920 --> 00:33:17,480 Speaker 1: it starts to fall and boom. It's I thinking it 516 00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:21,320 Speaker 1: cakes because even though the spelling is different, marriaging steel 517 00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:25,040 Speaker 1: makes you think of weddings. So this third of the 518 00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:28,600 Speaker 1: sub that they do get, it's about twelve meters long, 519 00:33:28,880 --> 00:33:32,640 Speaker 1: a little bit less than forty ft here in the US. Uh, 520 00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:36,920 Speaker 1: it's believed that this part did actually contain what the 521 00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:38,760 Speaker 1: U S and the c I A. We're looking for 522 00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:43,760 Speaker 1: nuclear weapons and maybe some Soviet codebooks. And you know 523 00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:46,800 Speaker 1: this is maybe obvious, but I just wanted to backtrack 524 00:33:46,800 --> 00:33:48,239 Speaker 1: a little bit to what you said earlier. I mean, 525 00:33:48,480 --> 00:33:52,280 Speaker 1: the US is doing this under the nose of the Soviet. 526 00:33:52,360 --> 00:33:55,800 Speaker 1: The Soviets have declared the ship lost uh, and they're 527 00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:57,360 Speaker 1: you know, for on intent. The purpose is not looking 528 00:33:57,400 --> 00:33:59,720 Speaker 1: for it anymore. So if they had any inkling that 529 00:33:59,800 --> 00:34:02,080 Speaker 1: the asked was anywhere close to finding any of their 530 00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:04,640 Speaker 1: secret codes or what have you, they would just change them, 531 00:34:04,640 --> 00:34:06,800 Speaker 1: all right, I mean it would be a lost cause. 532 00:34:06,920 --> 00:34:10,080 Speaker 1: So it was very crucial that the level of secrecy remain. 533 00:34:10,239 --> 00:34:12,759 Speaker 1: Hence all the cloak and dagger and cover story and 534 00:34:12,880 --> 00:34:15,759 Speaker 1: how are hughes of it all right? Yes, yeah, exactly, 535 00:34:16,520 --> 00:34:19,200 Speaker 1: And and we're going to run into some questions with 536 00:34:19,360 --> 00:34:23,600 Speaker 1: that stuff too. Towards the end here, uh, this wasn't 537 00:34:23,680 --> 00:34:26,200 Speaker 1: the only thing they found. There was something else, very 538 00:34:26,280 --> 00:34:29,760 Speaker 1: grisly and tragic that they found, and they were prepared 539 00:34:29,880 --> 00:34:34,400 Speaker 1: for it. Officially, the story goes along with those weapons, 540 00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:40,640 Speaker 1: along with those possible code books, they recovered the cadavers 541 00:34:40,719 --> 00:34:46,120 Speaker 1: the bodies of six Soviet Navy members and these these 542 00:34:46,160 --> 00:34:49,800 Speaker 1: individuals were buried at sea in a memorial during a 543 00:34:49,880 --> 00:34:53,760 Speaker 1: memorial service, and they were buried in metal coffins because 544 00:34:54,280 --> 00:34:59,400 Speaker 1: the Americans were worried that there would be possible radioactive contamination. 545 00:34:59,680 --> 00:35:04,840 Speaker 1: And you can actually see the service that they conducted online. 546 00:35:05,239 --> 00:35:09,200 Speaker 1: They have both countries anthems played. They did the memorial 547 00:35:09,360 --> 00:35:15,160 Speaker 1: service in both Russian and English, um and and And 548 00:35:15,440 --> 00:35:17,840 Speaker 1: the reason that footage is there is because it turns 549 00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:21,280 Speaker 1: out that the entirety of Project as Orient was filmed 550 00:35:21,360 --> 00:35:24,240 Speaker 1: by the CIA. Most of the majority of that footage 551 00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:28,520 Speaker 1: is classified today. But after the fall of the USSR, 552 00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:33,160 Speaker 1: the Americans sent the clip of that memorial service to 553 00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:36,680 Speaker 1: the Russians who eventually related to the families and the 554 00:35:36,760 --> 00:35:40,719 Speaker 1: surviving relatives of those people who passed away. So all 555 00:35:40,800 --> 00:35:45,000 Speaker 1: of this actually happened, But how do we know about 556 00:35:45,040 --> 00:35:49,359 Speaker 1: it today? How do we being people without high level 557 00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:52,279 Speaker 1: security clearance, people who aren't in the company right now, 558 00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:55,279 Speaker 1: how do we know we know about it because a 559 00:35:55,320 --> 00:35:58,360 Speaker 1: good journalist. That's right, we almost didn't know about the 560 00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:01,880 Speaker 1: government stopped, as it can from time to time do 561 00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:05,960 Speaker 1: the New York Times from reporting on the subject. But 562 00:36:06,080 --> 00:36:09,440 Speaker 1: the l A. Times um decided to, you know, just 563 00:36:09,719 --> 00:36:13,400 Speaker 1: go for it, and they went public. The Soviet Union 564 00:36:14,040 --> 00:36:16,279 Speaker 1: um actually do not make an official response at all, 565 00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:18,719 Speaker 1: and I can see why. It's sort of embarrassing, right 566 00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:23,359 Speaker 1: for there, Yeah, no kidding, especially since they sent those 567 00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:26,279 Speaker 1: two other ships over. And I love the point made there, no, 568 00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:30,319 Speaker 1: because it's something we need to acknowledge more openly. Uh. 569 00:36:30,520 --> 00:36:36,719 Speaker 1: The US government can exert control over media, and they 570 00:36:36,840 --> 00:36:40,280 Speaker 1: did so in this case, and the l A. Times 571 00:36:40,840 --> 00:36:44,920 Speaker 1: uh deserves a lot of kudos for bucking that trend. 572 00:36:45,440 --> 00:36:47,960 Speaker 1: But it's also with the Soviet response, you know, we 573 00:36:48,040 --> 00:36:50,400 Speaker 1: can only imagine what went on behind the scenes, like 574 00:36:50,480 --> 00:36:53,160 Speaker 1: how many people were fired, how many people got shipped 575 00:36:53,160 --> 00:36:58,120 Speaker 1: off somewhere. That's one of my questions. And then now 576 00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:01,680 Speaker 1: we're getting two questions, So lay your examinations a project, 577 00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:06,080 Speaker 1: as orient have called aspects of this story into question. 578 00:37:06,520 --> 00:37:11,600 Speaker 1: That's right, folks, there are conspiracy theories about this proven conspiracy. 579 00:37:11,719 --> 00:37:16,600 Speaker 1: So picture exhibit saying I heard you like conspiracies, so 580 00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:19,719 Speaker 1: we put some conspiracies in your conspiracies. What are we 581 00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:30,560 Speaker 1: talking about. We'll tell you after a word from our sponsor. Oh, 582 00:37:31,560 --> 00:37:37,880 Speaker 1: conspiracies abound they met. Yeah, that's right. There are conspiracies 583 00:37:37,920 --> 00:37:42,239 Speaker 1: about this conspiracy or conspiracy theories about this conspiracy K 584 00:37:42,520 --> 00:37:45,000 Speaker 1: one to nine, and it is very interesting to me. 585 00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:50,600 Speaker 1: K one to nine was only one victim of a 586 00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:56,759 Speaker 1: submarine massacre that occurred all at all in night. They 587 00:37:56,800 --> 00:38:01,879 Speaker 1: were not one, but four different submarine means that disappeared 588 00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:04,600 Speaker 1: in one year. There was the I N S D 589 00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:08,799 Speaker 1: car In, which was an Israeli sub, the Minerve, which 590 00:38:08,960 --> 00:38:11,520 Speaker 1: was a French sub in, the USS Scorpion, which was 591 00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:14,120 Speaker 1: a U. S sub. At the very least, I don't 592 00:38:14,120 --> 00:38:15,880 Speaker 1: know what this means. I'm not saying they're all related, 593 00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:18,040 Speaker 1: but it was at the very least a terrible year 594 00:38:18,200 --> 00:38:21,600 Speaker 1: to serve on a submarine. And like you and I 595 00:38:21,680 --> 00:38:25,520 Speaker 1: have been alluding to gently over the course of this episode, 596 00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:30,080 Speaker 1: not everyone believes the official version of the conspiracy surrounding 597 00:38:30,200 --> 00:38:34,880 Speaker 1: the K one to nine. In fact, folks think that 598 00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:38,600 Speaker 1: the Americans were after something else, not just nuclear weapons, 599 00:38:38,719 --> 00:38:41,319 Speaker 1: not just codes. But what what would they be doing 600 00:38:41,400 --> 00:38:44,239 Speaker 1: down there? Well that was the big question, and it 601 00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:47,520 Speaker 1: was big enough that it actually went to court. Military court. 602 00:38:47,640 --> 00:38:52,480 Speaker 1: The Military Audit Project led a lawsuit suggesting that the 603 00:38:52,640 --> 00:38:56,160 Speaker 1: mission to steal a Soviet sub was in fact a 604 00:38:56,280 --> 00:39:00,880 Speaker 1: cover story for another even more secretive this and it 605 00:39:00,920 --> 00:39:03,120 Speaker 1: seems like a strategy. Isn't the secretive enough? Do we 606 00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:07,200 Speaker 1: really need another layer to these Russian nesting dolls of 607 00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:10,560 Speaker 1: of conspiracy? I just come on, can't you just be 608 00:39:10,719 --> 00:39:15,080 Speaker 1: satisfied conspiracy people? Would they have done? And I mean 609 00:39:15,320 --> 00:39:20,000 Speaker 1: it's already secretive enough, right, it's already doubly weirdly extra, 610 00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:24,120 Speaker 1: you know, double plus secret um. I just don't know 611 00:39:24,160 --> 00:39:26,520 Speaker 1: what it could have possibly been. But yeah, well, some 612 00:39:26,719 --> 00:39:32,719 Speaker 1: of the some of the proposed true goals were things like, oh, 613 00:39:32,920 --> 00:39:37,359 Speaker 1: they're not really recovering the submarine at all. Instead, they're 614 00:39:37,360 --> 00:39:41,360 Speaker 1: tapping undersea communication lines, which is a real thing that happens. 615 00:39:41,680 --> 00:39:45,880 Speaker 1: There was Operation Ivy Bells I believe it's called everything 616 00:39:46,480 --> 00:39:50,200 Speaker 1: that they were making a pact with Cathulhu. Ah, yes, 617 00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:52,960 Speaker 1: so I put the Cathulhu in there because I let's 618 00:39:52,960 --> 00:39:54,759 Speaker 1: say get a step further. What I like is the 619 00:39:54,880 --> 00:40:00,160 Speaker 1: idea that maybe some love crafty and eldritch mons stir 620 00:40:00,360 --> 00:40:03,360 Speaker 1: from the deep didn't all the way wake up, but 621 00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:07,399 Speaker 1: like rolled over and its sleep. And for those four 622 00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:10,680 Speaker 1: subs that disappeared, we're trying to fight it, and maybe 623 00:40:10,719 --> 00:40:12,560 Speaker 1: they put it back to sleep. Maybe there was a 624 00:40:12,680 --> 00:40:16,359 Speaker 1: nuclear incident. Um. I think our theory is pretty cool. 625 00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:22,040 Speaker 1: But other other theories include the idea that the US 626 00:40:22,120 --> 00:40:28,040 Speaker 1: government was installing underwater missile silos or repairing parts of 627 00:40:28,120 --> 00:40:31,759 Speaker 1: that oceanic surveillance system, the hydrophone. And just to be fair, 628 00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:34,880 Speaker 1: I mean, underwater missile silos are a thing that's not 629 00:40:35,040 --> 00:40:38,359 Speaker 1: just the stuff of bond films. Right. Well, that's that's 630 00:40:38,400 --> 00:40:42,480 Speaker 1: a question. You know. So there are a lot of 631 00:40:43,280 --> 00:40:49,839 Speaker 1: underground missile silos, but they're decommissioned. I don't know if 632 00:40:49,960 --> 00:40:58,839 Speaker 1: there if there were purposely built undersea missile silos. Yeah, 633 00:40:59,120 --> 00:41:02,440 Speaker 1: well that's just from from a cursory google. Uh. It 634 00:41:02,560 --> 00:41:04,839 Speaker 1: is even like the first the first headline is why 635 00:41:04,920 --> 00:41:08,560 Speaker 1: doesn't the US build missile silos underwater? I mean, what 636 00:41:08,719 --> 00:41:10,640 Speaker 1: they need to ask. I don't know. I just I 637 00:41:10,880 --> 00:41:14,120 Speaker 1: for some reason in my mind picturing some moment from 638 00:41:14,200 --> 00:41:19,200 Speaker 1: some movie where rockets emerge from under the sea. Well, 639 00:41:19,239 --> 00:41:22,319 Speaker 1: couldn't that come from a submarine though, because those are 640 00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:25,719 Speaker 1: like movable underwater missile silence A good point. It's a 641 00:41:25,719 --> 00:41:29,000 Speaker 1: good point. Why lock yourself down in one location makes 642 00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:31,600 Speaker 1: it a lot more easy to find and destroy your infrastructure? 643 00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:34,600 Speaker 1: Right by the end, Maybe I'm a free spirit, you know. 644 00:41:35,560 --> 00:41:39,480 Speaker 1: But the uh, maybe the juiciest theory is this, And 645 00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:42,640 Speaker 1: this has like shades of Hunt for Red October. It's 646 00:41:42,719 --> 00:41:46,239 Speaker 1: the idea that the K one to nine was a 647 00:41:46,440 --> 00:41:50,480 Speaker 1: victim of mutiny. Uh. And here's the pitch. So rogue 648 00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:56,080 Speaker 1: KGP agents try to take over the sub and disguise 649 00:41:56,200 --> 00:42:00,880 Speaker 1: themselves as a Chinese navy vessel. They launched nuclear weapons 650 00:42:01,040 --> 00:42:04,160 Speaker 1: in hope of sparking a war between China and the 651 00:42:04,280 --> 00:42:08,200 Speaker 1: United States. This sounds a little Rube Goldberg esque, but 652 00:42:08,360 --> 00:42:10,759 Speaker 1: it's you know, false flag thing. This comes from a 653 00:42:10,960 --> 00:42:14,279 Speaker 1: book in two thousand five called Red Star Rogue by 654 00:42:14,440 --> 00:42:18,759 Speaker 1: Kenneth Sewell and Clint Richmond. That's like a fiction book, right, ben. No, 655 00:42:19,000 --> 00:42:21,880 Speaker 1: they think it actually happened that's their argument, but it 656 00:42:22,560 --> 00:42:26,040 Speaker 1: doesn't seem to hold much water in my opinion. It's good, 657 00:42:26,200 --> 00:42:31,279 Speaker 1: good nautical, but um, so, what what would you do 658 00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:34,000 Speaker 1: to disguise yourself as a Chinese navy vessel? I mean, 659 00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:37,320 Speaker 1: didn't they have different types of crafts? Would it be 660 00:42:37,320 --> 00:42:41,000 Speaker 1: as simple as just like flying a Chinese flag? I don't. Yeah, 661 00:42:41,880 --> 00:42:46,040 Speaker 1: the details on that are scant um. I believe that 662 00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:50,640 Speaker 1: they have. They have what they feels back in evidence 663 00:42:50,880 --> 00:42:54,520 Speaker 1: in Red Star rogue. Um. But there are a couple 664 00:42:54,560 --> 00:42:58,359 Speaker 1: of signals you could change or call signs, or if 665 00:42:58,400 --> 00:43:02,000 Speaker 1: you had access to code that you knew the US 666 00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:05,560 Speaker 1: or Chinese intelligence forces knew, then you could try to 667 00:43:06,440 --> 00:43:08,200 Speaker 1: you know, you could try to pull the old Star 668 00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:11,120 Speaker 1: Wars thing like it's an old code but it checks 669 00:43:11,160 --> 00:43:14,759 Speaker 1: out kind of move. Uh. To be fair, we've talked 670 00:43:14,760 --> 00:43:16,879 Speaker 1: a lot about the US perspective. We haven't talked about 671 00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:21,080 Speaker 1: the Russian perspective. Russian historians don't agree with these ideas. 672 00:43:21,560 --> 00:43:26,840 Speaker 1: They have their own theory, which is um pretty widely 673 00:43:26,920 --> 00:43:30,120 Speaker 1: accepted in Russia. From what I understand, they say that 674 00:43:30,239 --> 00:43:34,440 Speaker 1: the K one to nine sank because another sub ran 675 00:43:34,560 --> 00:43:39,279 Speaker 1: into it, an American submarine called the USS sword fish, 676 00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:42,400 Speaker 1: which is better named than halibut. At least it's got 677 00:43:42,440 --> 00:43:45,840 Speaker 1: like a built at a weapon. Yeah, exactly exactly. The 678 00:43:46,040 --> 00:43:50,600 Speaker 1: US has never really acknowledged this theory, but if you 679 00:43:50,880 --> 00:43:53,719 Speaker 1: look at the accounts from the U. S. Navy from 680 00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:58,120 Speaker 1: the Swordfish, they do acknowledge that Swordfish took some damage 681 00:43:58,800 --> 00:44:01,680 Speaker 1: during the same time. They say it was damaged in 682 00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:05,400 Speaker 1: the Sea of Japan about two thousand miles away. The 683 00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:08,720 Speaker 1: Swordfish did have an internal explosion, but that wasn't until 684 00:44:08,800 --> 00:44:15,440 Speaker 1: October of So there are a couple there, varying groups 685 00:44:15,520 --> 00:44:20,080 Speaker 1: who have varying explanations for what actually happened, both when 686 00:44:20,239 --> 00:44:23,480 Speaker 1: the Soviet sub K one to nine wrecked and when 687 00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:26,840 Speaker 1: it was retrieved. But we wanted to end out of 688 00:44:26,960 --> 00:44:30,880 Speaker 1: fun fact. So my face, this is my favorite to Glomar, 689 00:44:31,040 --> 00:44:35,680 Speaker 1: not not the coolest name. But when this became public, 690 00:44:35,760 --> 00:44:37,919 Speaker 1: when the La Times brings the story out and people 691 00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:40,279 Speaker 1: are asking more and more questions in the press and 692 00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:43,080 Speaker 1: in you know what, they call it dinner tables across 693 00:44:43,440 --> 00:44:48,719 Speaker 1: across hometown America, Main Street America. The officials of the 694 00:44:48,840 --> 00:44:53,200 Speaker 1: time are in really dicey position because they're getting asked questions. 695 00:44:53,520 --> 00:44:56,400 Speaker 1: They literally can't answer because if they feel like if 696 00:44:56,440 --> 00:45:00,839 Speaker 1: they say anything about it, they're going to compromise themselves 697 00:45:01,400 --> 00:45:05,040 Speaker 1: or they might accidentally start World War three, which is 698 00:45:05,120 --> 00:45:08,120 Speaker 1: not a good look. So they came up with the 699 00:45:08,239 --> 00:45:16,920 Speaker 1: most matrix dodge beige non answer possible in the English language. 700 00:45:17,160 --> 00:45:19,960 Speaker 1: No what what do they say when someone's like, hey, 701 00:45:20,040 --> 00:45:21,480 Speaker 1: can you tell us about that time he stole a 702 00:45:21,560 --> 00:45:24,600 Speaker 1: sub I mean, it's sort of like the supercharged, like 703 00:45:25,080 --> 00:45:29,239 Speaker 1: you know, ultra version of no comment. It is we 704 00:45:29,400 --> 00:45:32,960 Speaker 1: can neither confirm nor deny. And I'm sure there's a 705 00:45:33,040 --> 00:45:37,239 Speaker 1: reason legally why that's somehow better than no comment. Um, 706 00:45:38,120 --> 00:45:43,439 Speaker 1: but it accomplishes about the same thing, right right, right? Yeah, 707 00:45:44,040 --> 00:45:46,839 Speaker 1: maybe maybe not. I don't know. Yeah, I know you are, 708 00:45:46,920 --> 00:45:49,080 Speaker 1: but what am I? I mean it's up there when 709 00:45:49,120 --> 00:45:53,520 Speaker 1: people tag just saying, I'm just saying yeah. But but 710 00:45:53,760 --> 00:45:56,640 Speaker 1: so this phrase we can neither confirm nor deny. For 711 00:45:56,719 --> 00:45:59,880 Speaker 1: those in the know, it is often called the Glomar 712 00:46:00,160 --> 00:46:04,640 Speaker 1: response because it came from this situation, and other intelligence 713 00:46:04,719 --> 00:46:07,400 Speaker 1: agencies picked up on this, not just in the US, 714 00:46:07,480 --> 00:46:09,719 Speaker 1: but across the world. Other governments picked up on this. 715 00:46:09,880 --> 00:46:12,520 Speaker 1: You could still hear it today and don't be afraid 716 00:46:12,600 --> 00:46:14,480 Speaker 1: to point it out when you do, because here's what 717 00:46:14,600 --> 00:46:18,400 Speaker 1: it means when someone says we can neither confirm nor deny, 718 00:46:19,080 --> 00:46:21,600 Speaker 1: what they're really saying is they do not want to 719 00:46:21,680 --> 00:46:25,080 Speaker 1: be quoted at all in in a substantive way. And 720 00:46:25,160 --> 00:46:28,440 Speaker 1: when they say that, they're usually not concerned about the 721 00:46:28,560 --> 00:46:31,000 Speaker 1: person asking the question. You know, whether it's from like 722 00:46:31,120 --> 00:46:36,480 Speaker 1: Al Jazeera or Fox or MSNBC or you know, CNN Singapore, whatever, 723 00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:41,759 Speaker 1: they're worried about who is listening in the shadows and 724 00:46:42,960 --> 00:46:47,080 Speaker 1: right and right now it's two and right now, no 725 00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:51,440 Speaker 1: one in the public sphere knows exactly what happened to 726 00:46:51,680 --> 00:46:55,200 Speaker 1: that one third of the ship that they picked up. Uh, 727 00:46:55,360 --> 00:46:57,920 Speaker 1: No one knows what happened to No one knows what 728 00:46:58,120 --> 00:47:00,160 Speaker 1: was in the two thirds of the ship that's tank 729 00:47:00,239 --> 00:47:06,399 Speaker 1: back down. Secret museum. Yeah, yeah, good call, good callback. Yeah, 730 00:47:06,560 --> 00:47:09,279 Speaker 1: I would love for it to be in a secret museum. Uh. 731 00:47:09,760 --> 00:47:13,400 Speaker 1: We also don't know what happened to the Soviet nukes 732 00:47:13,480 --> 00:47:16,800 Speaker 1: that were retrieved. That's crazy. There are a lot of 733 00:47:16,920 --> 00:47:22,680 Speaker 1: I answer questions conspiracies and conspiracies and conspiracies, and we 734 00:47:22,840 --> 00:47:27,120 Speaker 1: probably won't know the answers to these conclusively unless there 735 00:47:27,280 --> 00:47:30,880 Speaker 1: is a huge push towards transparency, but for now, I 736 00:47:30,960 --> 00:47:33,719 Speaker 1: mean low. We have to ask our fellow conspiracy realists, like, 737 00:47:33,800 --> 00:47:37,600 Speaker 1: what do you think, folks? Do you believe the official story? Uh? 738 00:47:38,040 --> 00:47:42,839 Speaker 1: What are other examples have covered up operations? What did 739 00:47:42,960 --> 00:47:45,759 Speaker 1: the CIA say to Howard Hughes to get him to 740 00:47:45,880 --> 00:47:48,879 Speaker 1: go along? Like to get him to be there? Sort 741 00:47:48,960 --> 00:47:52,239 Speaker 1: of pr puppet? You know what I mean? I I 742 00:47:52,360 --> 00:47:54,719 Speaker 1: don't know. What could you offer that guy? He's a billionaire. 743 00:47:54,800 --> 00:47:58,000 Speaker 1: What does he need? More Mason jars, more Mason jars, 744 00:47:58,160 --> 00:48:03,600 Speaker 1: fewer nail clippers in homes across America, bigger and bigger 745 00:48:03,680 --> 00:48:06,560 Speaker 1: and bigger planes. Well, let us know. We can't wait 746 00:48:06,600 --> 00:48:09,200 Speaker 1: to hear from you. We hope you enjoyed today's episode. 747 00:48:09,239 --> 00:48:11,400 Speaker 1: Think it's always for tuning in. We can't wait to 748 00:48:11,440 --> 00:48:14,719 Speaker 1: hear your take, folks, especially our veterans out there and 749 00:48:14,760 --> 00:48:18,640 Speaker 1: folks who have served on a submarine. Uh, tell us 750 00:48:18,680 --> 00:48:20,320 Speaker 1: what's on your mind? We try to be easy to 751 00:48:20,400 --> 00:48:23,600 Speaker 1: find online. Yeah, let us know. Have you ever casually dropped? 752 00:48:23,760 --> 00:48:26,839 Speaker 1: You can neither confirm nor deny something in conversation at 753 00:48:26,840 --> 00:48:29,520 Speaker 1: a party. As a serious power move, my friends, let 754 00:48:29,600 --> 00:48:31,359 Speaker 1: us know. We're all over the Internet. You can find 755 00:48:31,480 --> 00:48:36,080 Speaker 1: us on Twitter, Facebook, and YouTube under the handle conspiracy Stuff. 756 00:48:36,280 --> 00:48:40,160 Speaker 1: We're at conspiracy Stuff show on Instagram. Ben Where else 757 00:48:40,239 --> 00:48:43,800 Speaker 1: can they find us? Maybe outside of the weird, toxic 758 00:48:43,880 --> 00:48:47,120 Speaker 1: bubble that is the Internet. That's right. Yes, if you 759 00:48:47,560 --> 00:48:51,200 Speaker 1: have cut the cord of social media, you no longer 760 00:48:51,280 --> 00:48:53,600 Speaker 1: sip the social meds. But you have a story to 761 00:48:53,719 --> 00:48:56,080 Speaker 1: share with us, you can always call us. We have 762 00:48:56,239 --> 00:48:59,680 Speaker 1: a phone number. We are one eight three three st 763 00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:02,360 Speaker 1: d w y t K. If you'll get a message 764 00:49:02,400 --> 00:49:04,800 Speaker 1: telling you you're in the right place, you have three minutes. 765 00:49:04,880 --> 00:49:08,480 Speaker 1: Those three minutes are yours. Go nuts. Give us a 766 00:49:09,080 --> 00:49:11,840 Speaker 1: name that you want to go by, and it can 767 00:49:11,880 --> 00:49:13,520 Speaker 1: be a cool nickname. It doesn't have to be your 768 00:49:13,560 --> 00:49:15,520 Speaker 1: real name. Let us know what's on your mind. Second, 769 00:49:15,520 --> 00:49:17,560 Speaker 1: most importantly, let us know whether or not we can 770 00:49:17,719 --> 00:49:20,840 Speaker 1: use your name and or message on the air. Most importantly, 771 00:49:20,920 --> 00:49:24,000 Speaker 1: don't censor yourself. If you have a story that needs 772 00:49:24,080 --> 00:49:26,320 Speaker 1: more than three minutes. Don't feel like you have to 773 00:49:26,400 --> 00:49:29,600 Speaker 1: call ten times. All you need to do is right 774 00:49:29,680 --> 00:49:32,960 Speaker 1: it up, Send us and sillary links, send us pictures, 775 00:49:33,280 --> 00:49:36,840 Speaker 1: send us whatever is on your mind in text, and 776 00:49:37,160 --> 00:49:41,280 Speaker 1: we read every email we get. Just drop us a line. Folks, 777 00:49:41,680 --> 00:50:03,440 Speaker 1: we are conspiracy at iHeart radio dot com. Ye stuff 778 00:50:03,480 --> 00:50:05,320 Speaker 1: they don't want you to know. Is a production of 779 00:50:05,440 --> 00:50:08,400 Speaker 1: I heart Radio. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, 780 00:50:08,560 --> 00:50:11,320 Speaker 1: visit the i heart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever 781 00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:12,760 Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.