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Speaker 1: It truly makes a difference that I speak out about

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Speaker 1: mental health, about infidelity, about motherhood, about postpartum, all of

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Speaker 1: these things.

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Speaker 2: And that's what I'm like.

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Speaker 1: Whatever show may be in my future next, you will

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Speaker 1: continue to hear my story because I got a lot

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Speaker 1: to say and I'm not going anywhere.

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Speaker 3: Welcome to off the cup, my anti anxiety antidote.

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Speaker 4: This is gonna be a good one. Guys. You know

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Speaker 4: I love I love reality television.

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Speaker 3: Especially Bravo, and we've had great Bravo folks on the pod,

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Speaker 3: from Shep Rose to Carl Radkey to Andy Cohn himself,

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Speaker 3: and for me, Bravo is a fun escape from my

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Speaker 3: real life. It's a break from the news, it's a

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Speaker 3: break from politics and everything else that gives me anxiety.

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Speaker 3: It's actually a very important part of my anti anxiety systems.

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Speaker 4: It's important to me. And a thing I love.

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Speaker 3: The most is when Bravo leberties who millions and millions

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Speaker 3: of people watch and feel like they know, come out

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Speaker 3: and talk openly about a struggle. It's so impactful when

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Speaker 3: they do. When Carl talks about being an alcoholic and

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Speaker 3: a drug addict, when Jackie Goldschneider from New Jersey talks

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Speaker 3: about her eating disorder. It's incredibly powerful because we feel

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Speaker 3: like we're friends with these people. We get to watch

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Speaker 3: their lives, and when they tell us they're struggling, it

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Speaker 3: makes us feel even closer and like we're not alone

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Speaker 3: in our own struggles. My next guest is someone I've

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Speaker 3: become friends with in real life, first because Bravo put

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Speaker 3: us on Watch What Happens Live Together years ago. But

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Speaker 3: since then, I've interviewed her, She's had me on her pod,

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Speaker 3: We've hung out in LA. She's just the best, and

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Speaker 3: she's also been really open about her struggles with anxiety.

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Speaker 3: And she and I have talked a lot about our

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Speaker 3: common issues as moms, as working moms. And I've been

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Speaker 3: telling her for years she's a star. You just want

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Speaker 3: to watch her. And she's such a hustler too. She's

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Speaker 3: always chasing a new dream, a new goal, a new opportunity,

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Speaker 3: the next thing, and it's been really fun to watch.

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Speaker 3: And now drum roll, she's a New York Times best

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Speaker 3: selling author.

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Speaker 4: I'm so proud of her. Welcome tof the cop Sheena

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Speaker 4: shee yay.

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Speaker 2: Thank you for having me girl.

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Speaker 3: I feel like I was on the phone with you

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Speaker 3: and your publishers as they are telling you for a zoom.

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Speaker 4: You are number six on the New York Times bestseller list.

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Speaker 2: Yes, hi insane, I know.

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Speaker 1: And I just found out I made the Canadian bestsellers

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Speaker 1: list too, I'm number five.

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Speaker 3: This is not only the reach and power of Bravo

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Speaker 3: and how much we love hearing from you guys watching,

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Speaker 3: but you.

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Speaker 4: You are the hustler that went after this.

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Speaker 3: You were the person who decided, yeah, I'm gonna do

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Speaker 3: this really hard thing and share a lot of my

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Speaker 3: life that you don't even know about. Yeah, it's gonna

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Speaker 3: be hard, because I've written books, I'm writing one now

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Speaker 3: it's hard. You decided to do this. It's a testament

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Speaker 3: to you and how much people want to know about you.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it feels really good to know that this.

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Speaker 1: Many people have read the book have resonated with my story.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's just been truly incredible and a dream

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Speaker 1: come true.

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Speaker 3: Honestly, it's my true I also effort to be a

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Speaker 3: New York Times bestseller one day I've not been. I'm

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Speaker 3: just so happy for you. The book is my good side,

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Speaker 3: and it's full of great stories, especially if you were

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Speaker 3: a vander Pompoules fan, but it's also just a good

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Speaker 3: read about a woman who survived the ups and downs

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Speaker 3: of fame, relationships, motherhood, and mental health. I got to ask,

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Speaker 3: was there anything you decided I'm not putting this in here?

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Speaker 5: No?

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Speaker 1: Actually, there are things that after I've been doing my

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Speaker 1: book tour and live shows and stuff, I'm like, oh, shoot,

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Speaker 1: I didn't put that in, Like things I just forgot about.

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Speaker 1: And that's why, you know, we have podcasts and what

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Speaker 1: not to just expand on the stories and tell more.

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Speaker 1: But no, I really put it all in. Everything that

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Speaker 1: I could recall is in the book. Chapter sixteen was

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Speaker 1: the one that we went back and forth with are

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Speaker 1: we going to put it in?

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Speaker 2: Are we not?

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Speaker 1: The book sold without them knowing anything about the situation.

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Speaker 1: It just had a very vague description of what chapter

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Speaker 1: sixteen could look like, hadn't been written it all yet,

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Speaker 1: and the book sold, so I'm like, huh.

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Speaker 2: Maybe we don't need to put it in.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's clearly a good enough story without chapter sixteen.

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Speaker 1: But then the more we thought about it, I was

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Speaker 1: just like, you know, what, if I'm writing a memoir,

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Speaker 1: this is one of the most devastating things personally.

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Speaker 2: I've ever gone through, and I was able to.

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Speaker 1: Overcome it work towards the path of forgiveness, which I think,

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Speaker 1: you know, took a lot of strength. And so I decided,

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Speaker 1: you know, with my husband as well, that we are

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Speaker 1: going to put it in the book. We're going to

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Speaker 1: put as many details as we can recall from that

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Speaker 1: time in the book because we need to tell the

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Speaker 1: whole story. I felt like the book as a whole

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Speaker 1: would be inauthentic if I didn't do that, and it

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Speaker 1: wouldn't be something I was completely proud of.

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Speaker 3: Well, so people know, what you're talking about is your

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Speaker 3: confession that your husband brought had cheated on you while

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Speaker 3: you were pregnant.

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Speaker 4: Mm hmm, it's a big That's a big one.

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Speaker 3: Any mother wife, I think, swallows real hard when they

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Speaker 3: hear that.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, talk about.

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Speaker 3: The kind of conversations you had with Rock about sharing that,

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Speaker 3: because obviously you protected.

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Speaker 4: It in the moment, and I don't want to ask

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Speaker 4: you about why you did that.

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Speaker 3: But when you decide I'm going to put this in

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Speaker 3: the book, what was that conversation with him?

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Speaker 4: Like?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, No, you can ask about anything.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I protected it in the moment because I

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Speaker 1: was still processing it. I wasn't ready to face it,

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Speaker 1: and I don't think our marriage would have survived it

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Speaker 1: had we filmed about it season eleven. I think that

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Speaker 1: having the focus on that was just not the place

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Speaker 1: or time. And you know, we were going to talk

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Speaker 1: about it season twelve of vander Pump Rules. Then that

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Speaker 1: didn't happen, and now it's rebooted and whatnot. So knowing

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Speaker 1: that we needed some time to process it, if it

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Speaker 1: was going to go on season twelve, that would have

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Speaker 1: been airing by now. So why would I not put

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Speaker 1: it in the book if we it just needed to

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Speaker 1: go in the book. So I had a first draft

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Speaker 1: of it that I read Brock last summer and he

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Speaker 1: was just like, absolutely not, that's not going.

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Speaker 2: In the book.

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Speaker 1: And why that We all back and forth conversations because

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Speaker 1: he said, if you're going to put it in the book,

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Speaker 1: don't be vague.

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Speaker 2: Put it all in.

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Speaker 1: And I was like, oh, because I was trying when

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Speaker 1: I was writing it, I was trying to like kind

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Speaker 1: of skate around what actually happened how many times and

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Speaker 1: just be extremely.

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Speaker 2: Vague, and he was like, yeah, no, exactly.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So then I added a lot more detail. Rewrote the

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Speaker 1: chapter and he didn't read it until the hardcover book.

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Speaker 2: Came in the mail.

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Speaker 1: Whoa I offered to him before the day it was due.

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Speaker 1: I said, honey, this is my last day. I have

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Speaker 1: to make any changes. Would you like to read this chapter?

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Speaker 1: And he said, no, it's your story. I don't want

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Speaker 1: to have any input. You tell your story how you

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Speaker 1: want to tell it. I said, okay, And then he

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Speaker 1: gets the book and reads it and he goes, oh, wow,

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Speaker 1: you did not hold back, and I'm like, you said,

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Speaker 1: if I'm going to say it all. So I think

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Speaker 1: he just didn't understand, because, you know, it has been

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Speaker 1: a couple of years since I found out, two and

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Speaker 1: a half years since I found out. Now the magnitude

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Speaker 1: of how much it did affect me and how devastating

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Speaker 1: it was. Because I was just putting on a happy

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Speaker 1: face as much as I could in front of him

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Speaker 1: and our daughter.

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Speaker 2: You know, I didn't want her to see me sad.

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Speaker 1: Every day I would take my moments to go to

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Speaker 1: the bathroom and cry, or cry in the car or whatever.

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Speaker 1: So I don't think he understood how much heartache I

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Speaker 1: was truly going through at the time. So it was

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Speaker 1: a really hard read for him, but he understood why

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Speaker 1: I needed to put it in the book. And the

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Speaker 1: response in person has been amazing, everyone just saying how

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Speaker 1: much they resonate with so many different parts of my story,

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Speaker 1: that being one of them.

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Speaker 2: And that's why I wanted to put it in the book, because.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's easy to say if I ever got

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Speaker 1: cheated on, I would leave, but you don't know until

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Speaker 1: you're truly in that situation.

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Speaker 2: I always said that, and.

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Speaker 1: For some people you do have to leave, and that

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Speaker 1: too takes strength. You know, it's not necessarily the easier decision,

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Speaker 1: but when you have a kid, it's so many.

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Speaker 2: Other factors and rules exactly.

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Speaker 1: And so I did everything I could to see if

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Speaker 1: I am a strong enough person to forgive and to

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Speaker 1: stay and keep our family together. And I didn't know

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Speaker 1: if I was going to be able to do that,

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Speaker 1: but I know that if I talked about this on

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Speaker 1: season eleven, too much hurt was happening in the mind.

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Speaker 2: There was so much.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, there was so much hatred I had in my

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Speaker 1: heart for not just my husband but also Tom Sandival,

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Speaker 1: and clearly I projected that all under Tom Sandoval, which

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Speaker 1: I mean, well deserved, but it was misdirected anger. But

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Speaker 1: it was also I was angry at him too, So

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Speaker 1: as hard as it was, I just knew that I

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Speaker 1: needed more time to process what I was actually going

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Speaker 1: through and doing that while filming a reality show is

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Speaker 1: not the time or place we needed to get into

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Speaker 1: couples therapy.

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Speaker 4: We needed to.

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Speaker 2: Really talk about this.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, do get handled your therapy around it, and just

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Speaker 1: you know, kind of see where we were at before

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Speaker 1: I told my mom, my, sister, my best friends.

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Speaker 2: I did not want one opinion of.

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Speaker 1: You should stay or you should leave, and everyone would

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Speaker 1: have had opinions.

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Speaker 4: What do you say to people who say, like, in

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Speaker 4: the moment.

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Speaker 3: You protected Shay when he was going through what he

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Speaker 3: was going through, and then again you protected Brock eventually

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Speaker 3: told you told these stories. So I don't even buy

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Speaker 3: that as like an an argument, because you do share

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Speaker 3: this stuff, but in the moment you what do you

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Speaker 3: say to someone who's said you were just trying to

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Speaker 3: protect your image around that.

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Speaker 1: In the first instance with Shay, I agree, that was

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Speaker 1: me protecting out of ego, and this time it was

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Speaker 1: me protecting my daughter, and that was it. That's all

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Speaker 1: I cared about, so it is completely different. But also

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Speaker 1: the way I feel is with reality TV, we do show,

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Speaker 1: we do agree to share one hundred percent of our lives,

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Speaker 1: to show up and put it all out there. However,

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Speaker 1: I don't think that that has to be on someone

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Speaker 1: else's timeline. Just because you told me something yesterday doesn't

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Speaker 1: mean I have to tell you tomorrow. If it doesn't

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Speaker 1: get told until next season, so be it. It's not

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Speaker 1: me hiding it necessarily, it's me putting it out on

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Speaker 1: my own timeline when I'm ready. Every story that I

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Speaker 1: have been through has come out now. There's not anything

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Speaker 1: I could think of that isn't out, but it's been

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Speaker 1: on my timeline, and I think that's okay. It's like

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Speaker 1: people saying, well, you're a hypocrite. That's not being authentic.

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Speaker 1: You're this, you're hiding that. I wasn't ready to talk

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Speaker 1: about it because I had a tiny human to think

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Speaker 1: about more than a reality show.

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Speaker 3: No, and the stakes are higher than when when you're

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Speaker 3: twenty and a server at a restaurant. The stakes are

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Speaker 3: higher for sharing your life.

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Speaker 4: Like, the stories are different. There's more to lose.

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Speaker 3: I mean, to me, it makes total sense that you'd

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Speaker 3: want to like work through it privately, get a handle

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Speaker 3: on it before you share it with the world. You know,

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Speaker 3: you shouldn't have to share at the expense of your

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Speaker 3: mental health, your family exactly, and all of that stuff

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Speaker 3: that all has to come first.

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Speaker 1: I saw an interview Alex Baskin did recently and he's like, well,

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Speaker 1: of course, you know, we would have loved to have

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Speaker 1: told that story and followed it. I'm like, of course,

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Speaker 1: of course there any but yeah, exactly. But I'm like,

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Speaker 1: and you know, maybe we do on a different show, Like,

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Speaker 1: You're still gonna see my story being told on reality

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Speaker 1: TV for as long as I am hired, you know, Like.

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Speaker 2: I genuinely in joy doing this.

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Speaker 1: It is stressful at times, Yeah, but going out on

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Speaker 1: book tour, meeting hundreds and hundreds of I mean thousands

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Speaker 1: of people by the time book tour is done, it

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Speaker 1: truly makes a difference that I speak out about mental health,

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Speaker 1: about infidelity, about motherhood, about postpartum, all of these things.

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Speaker 1: And that's what I'm like, whatever show may be in

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Speaker 1: my future next, you will continue to hear my story

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Speaker 1: because I got a lot to say and I'm not

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Speaker 1: going anywhere.

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Speaker 3: Before we get into more stuff with the book and

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Speaker 3: the future. I always like to go back and ask

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Speaker 3: what were you like as a child, And there's a

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Speaker 3: lot of that in the book, but I want to

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Speaker 3: hear from you specifically, and you.

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Speaker 4: Kind of just got to this.

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Speaker 3: I recently had Ricky Lake on the podcast and she says, when.

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Speaker 2: She was a very young girl iconic, she knew she.

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Speaker 3: Wanted to be famous, and I like that she said

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Speaker 3: that because it's honest and there's nothing wrong with it.

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Speaker 3: Is it safe to say you wanted to be famous

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Speaker 3: from a young age?

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Speaker 2: Absolutely?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, And I think that comes across in the book.

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Speaker 1: But that was something for as long as I could remember.

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Speaker 1: You know, I was in dance recitals as a toddler,

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Speaker 1: and then I was in every school play that I

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Speaker 1: could be in. Being on stage. I loved being the

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Speaker 1: center of attention. And I'm not afraid to say it.

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Speaker 1: I loved to perform for people, just that positive reinforcement,

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Speaker 1: you know, making people laugh on stage. I'm getting that

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Speaker 1: at book tour right now. And when a joke doesn't land,

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Speaker 1: I point out that the joke didn't land, and then

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Speaker 1: usually they laugh. But it is something I've always wanted

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Speaker 1: to do I always have wanted to be in the

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Speaker 1: entertainment industry.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean you can tell, and it would be

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Speaker 3: weird in and authentic if you were like I never

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Speaker 3: really wanted to be famous. This will just happened to me.

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Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, good, What what did you think you

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Speaker 3: would do for a career. Did you think you'd be

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Speaker 3: an actress?

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Speaker 2: Yes?

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Speaker 1: I really wanted to do acting more than anything as

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Speaker 1: a kid, and then as I got a little older,

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Speaker 1: like in high school, I remember really wanting to be

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Speaker 1: an MTV VJ.

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Speaker 2: I was was her.

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Speaker 3: Career for like five minutes, and yeah, every girl kind

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Speaker 3: of wanted it.

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Speaker 1: Oh my god, totally like I mean now Vanessa Lea Shay, but.

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Speaker 4: Like Hilary Burton.

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Speaker 1: I was obsessed with those girls. So that was something

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Speaker 1: I was like, Oh, Maria Manunos, she was like my

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Speaker 1: biggest inspiration. And so I started studying broadcast journalism in college.

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Speaker 1: I still took theater and whatnot, but I'm like, you

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Speaker 1: know what, maybe I don't do acting, maybe I do hosting,

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Speaker 1: And so I knew regardless, I always wanted to do

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Speaker 1: something on camera in the entertainment industry. I've even considered

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Speaker 1: being like a news host.

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Speaker 2: I don't.

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Speaker 1: I'm not, as you know, because we've done political games together.

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Speaker 2: I'm watching up inside.

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Speaker 1: I'm not the most newsy person where.

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Speaker 2: You don't know anything but you don't have exactly okay, But.

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Speaker 1: The fact that in like high school, I was like,

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Speaker 1: or maybe I could just be like a Jillian Barbery

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Speaker 1: and like do the weather and do the morning news

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Speaker 1: good to la Like yeah, even And I'm not a

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Speaker 1: morning person. So I don't know why I thought that

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Speaker 1: I would want to be a news anchor, but I

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Speaker 1: was like, whatever gets.

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Speaker 2: Me on TV, I'll do it.

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Speaker 1: And now I've had a little bit of all of it,

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Speaker 1: so I love it.

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Speaker 3: There's a story in the book that I didn't know,

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Speaker 3: and I'm so sorry this happened to you.

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Speaker 4: Can you talk about Hooters?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that was actually a story that I had completely

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Speaker 1: compartmentalized for so many years. My agents, Yeah, my agents

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Speaker 1: came to me a couple years ago and were telling

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Speaker 1: me about a potential documentary around Hooters that I could

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Speaker 1: either host, produce, And it was like early stages. But

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Speaker 1: so I started to meet with some people who were

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Speaker 1: working on this documentary and as I started recounting the

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Speaker 1: story and what happened to me. It was like, oh

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Speaker 1: my god, I forgot about this, Like.

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Speaker 2: It was I was eighteen years old.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm forty and they came to me two years ago,

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Speaker 1: So this is literally twenty years later that it was

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Speaker 1: just something I almost forgot happened to me.

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Speaker 4: I had buried it, trauma and buried it. Yeah, yeah, completely.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And then thinking back, I was like, wow, I

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00:16:23,720 --> 00:16:27,520
Speaker 1: was eighteen, nineteen years old on this press tour across

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Speaker 1: the country doing Donny Deutsch, Maury Povich, the CBS Early

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Speaker 1: Show with Hannah Storm and like all of these huge

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Speaker 1: news outlets speaking out after each day in court, I

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Speaker 1: would go up on take the not like the literal

350
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Speaker 1: stand in the courtroom, but after when you have the

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Speaker 1: news set up and whatnot outside of the courtroom, doing

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Speaker 1: that and speaking for all of these women, And it

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Speaker 1: was just so crazy that I had compartmentalized this whole,

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Speaker 1: like year, two years of my life.

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Speaker 4: Tell people what happened. What happened.

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Speaker 1: So I had applied for a job at a Hooters

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Speaker 1: in Westcovina. It was under construction, it wasn't open yet,

358
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Speaker 1: and the manager, Juana Ponte, was taking meetings in this

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00:17:09,960 --> 00:17:13,800
Speaker 1: trailer that was set up on site around like construction

360
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Speaker 1: and whatnot. I didn't think there was anything shady about

361
00:17:16,960 --> 00:17:19,640
Speaker 1: going into this trailer because the restaurant wasn't open yet.

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Speaker 2: Made sense to me.

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Speaker 1: He had a digital camera in the trailer that he

364
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Speaker 1: took a photo of us after for our profile or whatever.

365
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Speaker 1: He also took a polaroid. And this was two thousand

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Speaker 1: and three. Okay, so this is like to paint the

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Speaker 1: picture two thousand and three, two thousand and four. There's

368
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Speaker 1: no camera phones, there's nothing like this. Digital cameras are

369
00:17:42,720 --> 00:17:45,560
Speaker 1: still pretty new, and the one that I had only

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00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:48,560
Speaker 1: took photo. I didn't even know that digital cameras could

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Speaker 1: record video back then. So turns out that one of

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Speaker 1: the other girls who was so sorry to back it up,

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Speaker 1: he told all of us to change into the uniform

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Speaker 1: to make sure we were comfortable in it, and he

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00:18:01,840 --> 00:18:05,040
Speaker 1: would take a polaroid and a digital camera photo for

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Speaker 1: our profile. Doesn't want to have you one hundred girls

377
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Speaker 1: working at this new restaurant and all of a sudden

378
00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:11,720
Speaker 1: they're like, oh, I'm not comfortable in this.

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Speaker 2: It's too skimpy. I don't want to work in this.

380
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Speaker 1: So made complete sense to me, but as he stepped out,

381
00:18:18,960 --> 00:18:24,000
Speaker 1: obviously to have us change. That camera was recording our

382
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Speaker 1: every move. I had no idea. I did see it

383
00:18:27,720 --> 00:18:30,320
Speaker 1: sitting there, but I didn't think that they were capable

384
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Speaker 1: of recording. One of the other girls noticed told her mom,

385
00:18:34,560 --> 00:18:38,520
Speaker 1: who obviously called the cops, and once they did an investigation,

386
00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:43,320
Speaker 1: there were over one hundred videos. I forget exactly the

387
00:18:43,400 --> 00:18:46,560
Speaker 1: details are in the book, but there were over one

388
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Speaker 1: hundred women and some of them were sixteen years old

389
00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:52,840
Speaker 1: applying to be a hostess. And if you had a

390
00:18:52,880 --> 00:18:55,639
Speaker 1: black bra or black underwear on, he told you to

391
00:18:55,640 --> 00:18:57,919
Speaker 1: take it off completely so it didn't show through the

392
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Speaker 1: white tank top and the little short and whatnot.

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Speaker 4: So some girls are naked, yeah, and some.

394
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Speaker 2: Girls are underage.

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Speaker 1: So once that became an investigation, my uncle had heard

396
00:19:12,840 --> 00:19:15,800
Speaker 1: that Gloria Allread was taking on a class action lawsuit,

397
00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:19,080
Speaker 1: and I was like, oh my god, Gloria Allread, like

398
00:19:19,160 --> 00:19:24,040
Speaker 1: the Gloria Allread was serious, iconic, And so I called

399
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Speaker 1: her office and I was like, hey, you know, I

400
00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:29,119
Speaker 1: was a part of this as well. And after a

401
00:19:29,160 --> 00:19:32,119
Speaker 1: conversation with her, they said they were holding a press

402
00:19:32,119 --> 00:19:35,119
Speaker 1: conference like the next day or the following day, she

403
00:19:35,240 --> 00:19:37,199
Speaker 1: really liked the way that I spoke on the phone

404
00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:40,159
Speaker 1: and asked if I would be willing to be a

405
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Speaker 1: part of that press conference and speak on behalf of

406
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Speaker 1: the women. So before I know it, I'm in Gloria

407
00:19:46,400 --> 00:19:51,400
Speaker 1: Alread's office, signing papers, taking a press conference and.

408
00:19:51,359 --> 00:19:55,040
Speaker 3: Then wants to be by the way, woman, it's not

409
00:19:55,119 --> 00:19:57,080
Speaker 3: about Gloria, it's you don't ever want to be in

410
00:19:57,119 --> 00:19:59,960
Speaker 3: a position to need Gloria oul Read exactly.

411
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Speaker 1: Yeah, but she was and is the best of the best,

412
00:20:04,040 --> 00:20:06,159
Speaker 1: and she was the best person for us. You know,

413
00:20:06,240 --> 00:20:09,239
Speaker 1: we were able to get justice with that situation, and

414
00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:13,679
Speaker 1: so many people are not able to and so the

415
00:20:13,800 --> 00:20:17,120
Speaker 1: fact that we were able to you know, put him

416
00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:21,280
Speaker 1: in jail where he belonged, it was a win. But

417
00:20:21,480 --> 00:20:24,240
Speaker 1: also it was a traumatic thing that so many of

418
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Speaker 1: us went through. And this is this person Wan, he

419
00:20:28,560 --> 00:20:31,720
Speaker 1: was married, he was a father, he had daughters. Like

420
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Speaker 1: the fact that this person was violating so many young women,

421
00:20:39,200 --> 00:20:41,879
Speaker 1: it was just, you know, such an invasion of privacy

422
00:20:42,359 --> 00:20:42,960
Speaker 1: at the least.

423
00:20:43,040 --> 00:20:44,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, and you never think you're going to end up

424
00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:49,320
Speaker 3: in that situation, and no, it can really happen to anyone. Okay,

425
00:20:49,359 --> 00:20:52,600
Speaker 3: So yeah, thanks for sharing that eventually you get a

426
00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:55,080
Speaker 3: bunch of acting gigs. But did you have some hesitation

427
00:20:56,160 --> 00:20:59,240
Speaker 3: then going into reality TV where you'd be putting now

428
00:20:59,240 --> 00:21:01,560
Speaker 3: your real life out there and maybe even jeopardizing the

429
00:21:01,640 --> 00:21:05,080
Speaker 3: future and acting, because that can happen sometimes with reality

430
00:21:05,080 --> 00:21:07,840
Speaker 3: it can derail, you know, a different kind of career.

431
00:21:08,359 --> 00:21:09,280
Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely.

432
00:21:09,320 --> 00:21:11,679
Speaker 1: It was a reason why I did not want to

433
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Speaker 1: do the show at first when they asked me to,

434
00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:18,160
Speaker 1: because I had just started booking consistent co star, guest star,

435
00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:21,399
Speaker 1: recurring roles and whatnot. So I was like, you know,

436
00:21:21,560 --> 00:21:23,199
Speaker 1: I don't know that I want to do a reality

437
00:21:23,240 --> 00:21:26,119
Speaker 1: show because then when I start going to auditions, do

438
00:21:26,160 --> 00:21:28,320
Speaker 1: you want Seena from vander Pump Rules or you know,

439
00:21:28,400 --> 00:21:30,840
Speaker 1: I'm not just Seena Marie an actress with all of

440
00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:34,720
Speaker 1: these other girls auditioning anymore. And I did notice the

441
00:21:34,760 --> 00:21:37,240
Speaker 1: first couple seasons after they had aired, and I would

442
00:21:37,240 --> 00:21:39,560
Speaker 1: still be going to auditions. You know, you see people

443
00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:42,919
Speaker 1: whispering or there's a note that the casting director asks,

444
00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:44,680
Speaker 1: and I'm like, great, I'm not going to get this one.

445
00:21:44,720 --> 00:21:47,280
Speaker 1: And eventually I just stopped auditioning all together. I'm like,

446
00:21:47,640 --> 00:21:49,879
Speaker 1: I guess if someone wants Gheena from vander Pump Rules

447
00:21:49,920 --> 00:21:54,200
Speaker 1: you can call my agent, you know. But when I

448
00:21:54,240 --> 00:21:58,399
Speaker 1: first took the meetings with Alex Baskin to discuss the show,

449
00:21:58,480 --> 00:22:00,560
Speaker 1: they had said that this show was really going to

450
00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:04,359
Speaker 1: be about people in the service industry trying to make

451
00:22:04,400 --> 00:22:06,480
Speaker 1: it an entertainment and if they could follow us on

452
00:22:06,520 --> 00:22:10,719
Speaker 1: auditions or acting class whatever it was. Yeah, that was

453
00:22:10,840 --> 00:22:13,119
Speaker 1: kind of the goal of the show outside of the restaurant.

454
00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:15,400
Speaker 2: So I was like, oh, then, I guess.

455
00:22:15,240 --> 00:22:18,159
Speaker 1: That gives a platform, you know, if they're going to

456
00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:20,880
Speaker 1: show like she's not just a reality star, she's someone

457
00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:24,480
Speaker 1: who is an actress and whatnot. That definitely seemed of

458
00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:26,879
Speaker 1: interest to me. They did that a little bit in

459
00:22:26,920 --> 00:22:30,159
Speaker 1: the beginning, you know, and the whole singing like I

460
00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:32,919
Speaker 1: was never truly trying to be a pop star. That

461
00:22:33,119 --> 00:22:36,679
Speaker 1: was a fun hobby that it just but then it

462
00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:39,679
Speaker 1: was kind of like I'm pigeonholed into, Oh, she is

463
00:22:39,680 --> 00:22:43,400
Speaker 1: the pop star, this person's the actor, this person's the musician,

464
00:22:43,840 --> 00:22:46,040
Speaker 1: and I'm like, no, no, I don't want to do that,

465
00:22:46,160 --> 00:22:48,639
Speaker 1: like I want to be the actress. And then you know,

466
00:22:48,800 --> 00:22:52,679
Speaker 1: fast forward after season six, I book a show, I

467
00:22:52,800 --> 00:22:57,080
Speaker 1: audition on tape. I book a role for a headlining

468
00:22:57,119 --> 00:23:00,399
Speaker 1: show in Las Vegas six nights a week, eight shows

469
00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:02,199
Speaker 1: a week for six months.

470
00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:03,640
Speaker 2: I'm acting.

471
00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:08,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, never shown doesn't exist, right, I'm like, this is

472
00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:09,520
Speaker 1: literally the premise.

473
00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:11,200
Speaker 4: They really dropped that pretty quick.

474
00:23:11,240 --> 00:23:15,520
Speaker 3: I remember, like when Laura Ley comes around and we're like, oh, oh,

475
00:23:15,680 --> 00:23:17,960
Speaker 3: suddenly we're interested in the you know, the part she

476
00:23:18,040 --> 00:23:21,680
Speaker 3: might get. Right, So do you look back with any

477
00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:26,359
Speaker 3: regrets then about the acting career you might have had.

478
00:23:27,560 --> 00:23:31,120
Speaker 1: I don't want to say regrets. I do think obviously

479
00:23:31,160 --> 00:23:35,560
Speaker 1: the trajectory and the path of my career would have

480
00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:38,119
Speaker 1: been very different had I not done vander pump roles.

481
00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:39,960
Speaker 1: Would it have been better, would it have been worse,

482
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:40,960
Speaker 1: Would it have been the same.

483
00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:43,320
Speaker 2: No one could tell, you know. I don't know.

484
00:23:44,000 --> 00:23:46,720
Speaker 1: However, as much as I did, still want to continue

485
00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:48,760
Speaker 1: in acting, and I do still want to and I've

486
00:23:49,040 --> 00:23:51,600
Speaker 1: just got to do a sitcomt at Lopez Versus Lopez

487
00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:54,119
Speaker 1: last year, which was so fun. I am still going

488
00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:56,760
Speaker 1: to be doing acting. That's something that is a focus

489
00:23:56,760 --> 00:24:01,639
Speaker 1: of mine as well. But I I am so thankful

490
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:05,320
Speaker 1: that I've had the platform of reality TV to share

491
00:24:05,359 --> 00:24:09,000
Speaker 1: my personal story, because that's not something you get with acting.

492
00:24:09,359 --> 00:24:12,960
Speaker 1: You know, unless you're playing a character who experiences help

493
00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:17,240
Speaker 1: syndrome or postpartum or whatnot, you're not able to relate

494
00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:20,119
Speaker 1: to people like you are on reality TV. And I

495
00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:24,600
Speaker 1: am so thankful for podcasts and reality shows for exactly that.

496
00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:26,680
Speaker 1: You know, it's not always a pretty picture we're painting.

497
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:29,960
Speaker 1: But when you meet people and they say that they've

498
00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:32,240
Speaker 1: resonated with a part of your story, your mental health

499
00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:35,840
Speaker 1: journey or whatever it may be, I'm like, this was

500
00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:38,879
Speaker 1: the path I was supposed to work on. Yeah, absolutely

501
00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:39,680
Speaker 1: worth it totally.

502
00:24:39,680 --> 00:24:41,760
Speaker 3: I feel the same way when I share it, which

503
00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:43,960
Speaker 3: is not, you know, part of my job.

504
00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:46,679
Speaker 4: It's something I do for me and other people.

505
00:24:47,480 --> 00:24:51,240
Speaker 3: It's so gratifying to hear people say this really really

506
00:24:51,280 --> 00:24:53,760
Speaker 3: made me feel less alone, or you know, you said

507
00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:55,960
Speaker 3: something that really made me think about what I was

508
00:24:56,000 --> 00:24:59,200
Speaker 3: going through. It's really rewarding. It's why I keep doing

509
00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:02,240
Speaker 3: it and why on this podcast. My mantra is when

510
00:25:02,280 --> 00:25:04,879
Speaker 3: you talk about mental health, it makes it easier to

511
00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:07,000
Speaker 3: talk about mental health exactly.

512
00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:08,439
Speaker 4: That's the whole point.

513
00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:10,240
Speaker 3: So the more you talk, the more I talk, we'll

514
00:25:10,240 --> 00:25:27,119
Speaker 3: get there. You are such a survivor, and I think

515
00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:30,879
Speaker 3: a lot of people if they've been if they had

516
00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:32,679
Speaker 3: been the girl who had had an affair with a

517
00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:35,520
Speaker 3: married man and you didn't know that Eddie Cibrian was

518
00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:38,240
Speaker 3: married to Brandy Glanville at the time, but it all

519
00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:40,919
Speaker 3: played out on television. A lot of people would go

520
00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:46,479
Speaker 3: into hiding, and you got mercilessly bullied by the girls

521
00:25:46,480 --> 00:25:47,600
Speaker 3: in your first seasons.

522
00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:49,160
Speaker 4: Then there was your divorce from Shay.

523
00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:53,920
Speaker 3: Not everyone, Seena can just pick themselves up and move

524
00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:56,880
Speaker 3: on after these things, and you did it all on camera.

525
00:25:57,720 --> 00:26:03,040
Speaker 3: Where do you get this string to keep going and

526
00:26:03,080 --> 00:26:04,880
Speaker 3: putting yourself out there through all of this.

527
00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:08,600
Speaker 1: I definitely think I get my strength from my mom.

528
00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:11,439
Speaker 1: She has been through so much in her life and

529
00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:14,600
Speaker 1: she is one of the strongest people I know, so

530
00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:17,680
Speaker 1: I know that that is just in me from her.

531
00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:23,520
Speaker 1: But the positive reinforcement I get from the fans, from

532
00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:27,760
Speaker 1: you know, the podcast listeners, the audience from now the readers,

533
00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:30,640
Speaker 1: that makes it easy to.

534
00:26:30,680 --> 00:26:33,200
Speaker 4: Get back up again because because they want you to.

535
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:36,240
Speaker 1: Exactly and each time I go through something, they're going

536
00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:41,040
Speaker 1: through it with me. So it definitely helps my strength

537
00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:43,239
Speaker 1: to know that I am on the right path. And

538
00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:46,959
Speaker 1: you know, we all have hard days, and I believe

539
00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:49,560
Speaker 1: everyone should be in therapy. I think it's one of

540
00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:51,040
Speaker 1: those things you know when you work out and it

541
00:26:51,080 --> 00:26:53,080
Speaker 1: releases endorphins and you feel better, and.

542
00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:54,240
Speaker 2: It's like therapy.

543
00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:57,639
Speaker 1: I think totally that there is something that you know

544
00:26:57,720 --> 00:27:01,600
Speaker 1: you release when you whether it's crying in a therapy

545
00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:05,359
Speaker 1: session or just being able to talk about it, to

546
00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:08,879
Speaker 1: go through EMDR. All of these things have helped me

547
00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:12,639
Speaker 1: so much that now when I am talking about past

548
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:16,120
Speaker 1: trauma and things that I've been through, I'm not sobbing.

549
00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:18,840
Speaker 2: I am also medicated now, which that helps as well.

550
00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:21,320
Speaker 4: Same girl, Same but I.

551
00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:23,439
Speaker 1: Was like, wow, sometimes I feel like I'm like, oh

552
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:25,119
Speaker 1: my god, am I like a cold hearted bitch that

553
00:27:25,160 --> 00:27:26,880
Speaker 1: I'm talking about this and not crying?

554
00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:30,400
Speaker 2: No, your he I've done the worst, your hells, you're heel.

555
00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:32,040
Speaker 4: That's how you can talk about it.

556
00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:35,120
Speaker 3: Yet's talk about the anxiety, because we've talked about this personally.

557
00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:36,760
Speaker 4: You talk about it in the book.

558
00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:41,000
Speaker 3: After you have Summer Moon, you struggle with severe postpartum

559
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:44,959
Speaker 3: anxiety and OCD. For listeners who don't know what that's like,

560
00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:47,840
Speaker 3: for people who haven't read your book yet, talk about

561
00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:50,119
Speaker 3: how dark a time that was.

562
00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:53,760
Speaker 1: I mean, I just worried, like every second of every

563
00:27:53,840 --> 00:27:56,639
Speaker 1: day that something was going to happen to her. I

564
00:27:56,680 --> 00:28:00,919
Speaker 1: had a miscarriage before her, and then my entire higher pregnancy,

565
00:28:01,040 --> 00:28:03,159
Speaker 1: I was just worried something was going to happen. I

566
00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:05,840
Speaker 1: didn't feel her move until she was until I was

567
00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:08,800
Speaker 1: twenty two weeks five days, and then even after that,

568
00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:11,280
Speaker 1: it was like I have to eat some candy or

569
00:28:11,359 --> 00:28:13,400
Speaker 1: drink something to like just make or move makes okay,

570
00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:16,439
Speaker 1: you're awake, okay, Like yeah, it was so scary. I

571
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:20,320
Speaker 1: had the fetal doppler, but then people are like, no, the.

572
00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:23,639
Speaker 2: The ultrasonic ultrasound, yes, like whatever, so they're like, no, you.

573
00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:25,640
Speaker 1: Shouldn't use that, and I'm just like, but I need

574
00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:29,399
Speaker 1: to know that she's alive in there. And then going

575
00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:32,920
Speaker 1: through the labor that I went through. At about fifteen

576
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:35,919
Speaker 1: hours into labor, they told me I had preoclamsia and

577
00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:37,840
Speaker 1: I'm like, no, I don't. I was at my forty

578
00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:40,200
Speaker 1: week appointment yesterday and they didn't tell me that, so

579
00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:43,160
Speaker 1: like that's crazy, and they were like, okay, well, the

580
00:28:43,160 --> 00:28:46,360
Speaker 1: baby's heart rate is dropping, your blood pressure is raising,

581
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:49,240
Speaker 1: and I could have had a stroke if I didn't

582
00:28:49,240 --> 00:28:50,880
Speaker 1: get put on this magnesium drip.

583
00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:52,040
Speaker 2: Immediately.

584
00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:54,200
Speaker 1: They told me it was going to make me feel

585
00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:55,800
Speaker 1: extremely flu like, and I'm.

586
00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:58,760
Speaker 2: Like, that's for pussies. I got this, like I'm fine.

587
00:28:59,160 --> 00:28:59,680
Speaker 4: Yeah, oh no.

588
00:28:59,800 --> 00:29:02,280
Speaker 1: They were not joking, because then all of a sudden,

589
00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:05,480
Speaker 1: I'm like shaking uncontrollably on the table. I feel like

590
00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:08,000
Speaker 1: I'm having seizures. I'm just like, what is happening. They're

591
00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:11,480
Speaker 1: still having me push. I don't know how they did

592
00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:14,200
Speaker 1: not do an emergency C section, but I guess I

593
00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:17,920
Speaker 1: was clearly okay to keep pushing, and I only pushed

594
00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:21,280
Speaker 1: for about forty minutes, So like after twenty four hours

595
00:29:21,280 --> 00:29:23,160
Speaker 1: of you know, now I'm on a magnesium drip, this

596
00:29:23,240 --> 00:29:27,320
Speaker 1: and that. Finally after those forty minutes, she came out.

597
00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:31,720
Speaker 1: But then she's limp, she's blue, she's not crying, and

598
00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:35,160
Speaker 1: I'm terrified. I think I just gave birth to a

599
00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:37,959
Speaker 1: stillborn and how am I going to be It's just

600
00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:41,160
Speaker 1: the most terrifying minute of my entire life. And they're like,

601
00:29:41,360 --> 00:29:43,760
Speaker 1: she's fine, she's fine. My mom's like she's so pretty,

602
00:29:43,760 --> 00:29:46,560
Speaker 1: and I'm like, no, she's not. It was a full,

603
00:29:46,760 --> 00:29:51,080
Speaker 1: full panic attack, and then finally she made a sound

604
00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:54,240
Speaker 1: and just the best sound in the world. But it

605
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:59,280
Speaker 1: was so, so scary because no one warned me that

606
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:02,520
Speaker 1: when you're on a magnesium drip, the babies they call

607
00:30:02,560 --> 00:30:05,560
Speaker 1: them mag babies, they come out limp and blue and

608
00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:08,680
Speaker 1: sleepy because they get pumped with no So they didn't

609
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:10,680
Speaker 1: tell me, Hey, just so you know, expect when she

610
00:30:10,760 --> 00:30:11,120
Speaker 1: comes out.

611
00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:12,200
Speaker 2: It's not like the movies.

612
00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:15,120
Speaker 1: She's not gonna cry the second she enters this world.

613
00:30:15,640 --> 00:30:19,160
Speaker 1: I don't know any of this, and so it was

614
00:30:19,280 --> 00:30:21,760
Speaker 1: terrifying because as my doctor's telling me she's okay, and

615
00:30:21,760 --> 00:30:23,640
Speaker 1: he has her and he's like pushing on her back,

616
00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:25,120
Speaker 1: they're sucking it and everything, and.

617
00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:26,400
Speaker 2: I'm like, no, she's not.

618
00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:31,160
Speaker 1: She's not okay. But thankfully that is common. And you know,

619
00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:35,920
Speaker 1: they've pumped me with fetanyl, which sounded terrifying. I'm like,

620
00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:38,080
Speaker 1: what do you mean fetanyl like that kills people, and

621
00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:40,120
Speaker 1: they're like, oh, this is the painkiller, and then we

622
00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:42,160
Speaker 1: have to put this and I'm just like, I don't

623
00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:44,360
Speaker 1: want all of this stuff in my body. But it was,

624
00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:47,560
Speaker 1: you know, something I needed to get her out safely,

625
00:30:47,840 --> 00:30:52,440
Speaker 1: and so it was a very traumatizing experience. I went

626
00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:55,000
Speaker 1: from fifteen hours into labor, being like, honey, you want

627
00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:57,000
Speaker 1: to go back to back, like, let's do this again.

628
00:30:57,120 --> 00:30:59,640
Speaker 1: This is a walk in the park, you know. I

629
00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:02,400
Speaker 1: felt like it was such an easy labor until it

630
00:31:02,440 --> 00:31:07,560
Speaker 1: went so south that now I'm forty, the chance of

631
00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:11,479
Speaker 1: miscarriage preoclamsia help syndrome. I was already high risk at

632
00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:15,040
Speaker 1: thirty five. Now at forty, I wouldn't even chance it.

633
00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:19,400
Speaker 1: So thankfully, thirty three year old Shena was thinking about

634
00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:22,920
Speaker 1: forty year old Shena being single and alone and wanting,

635
00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:24,600
Speaker 1: you know, a sperm donor in a baby one day.

636
00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:26,040
Speaker 2: But I'm so thankful that I.

637
00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:29,000
Speaker 1: Thought about my future and I froze my eggs, so

638
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:33,959
Speaker 1: we do have the opportunity, hopefully once we fertilize the eggs,

639
00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:37,160
Speaker 1: to get a surrogate and go that route, because I

640
00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:41,160
Speaker 1: will not take the chance getting pregnant naturally, especially with

641
00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:43,760
Speaker 1: the forty year old egg when I have thirty three

642
00:31:43,840 --> 00:31:45,440
Speaker 1: year old ones. But I'm not going to put myself

643
00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:49,400
Speaker 1: through IVF and all of that just to get pre aclamsia,

644
00:31:49,480 --> 00:31:51,640
Speaker 1: to get help syndrome, to have to deliver early, to

645
00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:54,480
Speaker 1: have to have a C section, and then go to

646
00:31:54,520 --> 00:31:56,800
Speaker 1: the Niku. The baby's lungs aren't developed. There's just so

647
00:31:56,840 --> 00:31:59,840
Speaker 1: many things that could go wrong. I will not take

648
00:31:59,840 --> 00:32:02,840
Speaker 1: that chance. Summer Moon needs her mommy more than she

649
00:32:02,880 --> 00:32:06,080
Speaker 1: needs a sibling. Yeah, So if someone else can give

650
00:32:06,160 --> 00:32:09,520
Speaker 1: us that gift one day, that's definitely something we've been

651
00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:10,880
Speaker 1: discussing and considering.

652
00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:15,760
Speaker 3: You write when you're talking about your struggles as a

653
00:32:15,760 --> 00:32:17,880
Speaker 3: new mom, trying not to be so anxious, trying not

654
00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:21,360
Speaker 3: to be so helicoptery. You wrote something that really really

655
00:32:21,880 --> 00:32:24,720
Speaker 3: resonated with me because I was the same you write.

656
00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:27,640
Speaker 3: Once I was able to relax a little, I also

657
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:30,000
Speaker 3: felt compelled to open up to my therapist about how

658
00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:32,520
Speaker 3: far apart Lala and I were as moms. I thought,

659
00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:35,200
Speaker 3: how can I be more like her? When I'm envisioning

660
00:32:35,320 --> 00:32:38,440
Speaker 3: worst case scenarios in my head? She I mean, this

661
00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:42,960
Speaker 3: was my anxiety, the constant catastrophizing the worst thing's going

662
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:46,880
Speaker 3: to happen to him, my son, and I've had so

663
00:32:46,920 --> 00:32:50,320
Speaker 3: many moments like this. I was living in DC where

664
00:32:50,400 --> 00:32:53,800
Speaker 3: Jack was born. He was new, he was young. My

665
00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:56,960
Speaker 3: husband and I went out to a function and left

666
00:32:57,000 --> 00:32:59,880
Speaker 3: him with the nanny. I was already in a state

667
00:33:00,560 --> 00:33:03,400
Speaker 3: about that, and then my nanny calls and says, the

668
00:33:03,440 --> 00:33:06,000
Speaker 3: power went out and it was a hot summer night,

669
00:33:06,800 --> 00:33:08,800
Speaker 3: and I start panicking.

670
00:33:09,560 --> 00:33:11,640
Speaker 4: And this woman who's a friend of mine.

671
00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:15,840
Speaker 3: Who has a kid about Jack's age, says, he's fine.

672
00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:20,160
Speaker 3: Women have been raising kids in the desert in huts

673
00:33:20,200 --> 00:33:24,600
Speaker 3: for centuries. He'll be fine. And I thought, man, can

674
00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:26,320
Speaker 3: I have what is she smoking?

675
00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:29,280
Speaker 4: I want some? Because I was the opposite. And it

676
00:33:29,640 --> 00:33:30,400
Speaker 4: happens all the time.

677
00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:33,320
Speaker 3: I have a friend now here in Connecticut who's got

678
00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:36,120
Speaker 3: kids older than Jack. I was telling her out how

679
00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:38,720
Speaker 3: anxious I am all the time about him, and she goes,

680
00:33:38,760 --> 00:33:41,000
Speaker 3: you know, you send him out in the world and

681
00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:41,800
Speaker 3: hope for the best.

682
00:33:42,400 --> 00:33:44,040
Speaker 4: Yes, what the fuck is like?

683
00:33:44,400 --> 00:33:46,680
Speaker 2: If I could be like this, I would be what

684
00:33:46,760 --> 00:33:47,840
Speaker 2: does that feel like?

685
00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:50,240
Speaker 4: That sounds awesome?

686
00:33:50,520 --> 00:33:52,200
Speaker 2: I mean, and that's how my husband is.

687
00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:55,400
Speaker 1: I'm like, wait, so you don't have like thoughts of

688
00:33:55,440 --> 00:33:57,400
Speaker 1: like death all day every day?

689
00:33:57,440 --> 00:33:58,360
Speaker 2: What is that like?

690
00:33:58,840 --> 00:34:02,160
Speaker 3: And we compare ourselves to our mom friends. Yes, and

691
00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:04,240
Speaker 3: we say what I should be like that. I do

692
00:34:04,360 --> 00:34:07,000
Speaker 3: this too in my career, Like I'll look at a

693
00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:10,240
Speaker 3: colleague of mine and be like, why isn't he taking

694
00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:11,480
Speaker 3: the news home every night?

695
00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:14,560
Speaker 4: And like really really dealing with it.

696
00:34:14,600 --> 00:34:17,080
Speaker 3: And I have to remind myself like maybe he is

697
00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:20,440
Speaker 3: you don't know, maybe he's a therapy but it sums

698
00:34:20,520 --> 00:34:23,600
Speaker 3: home and he medicates with a bottle of vodka, or

699
00:34:23,640 --> 00:34:25,279
Speaker 3: maybe he goes home he takes it down on his

700
00:34:25,320 --> 00:34:25,839
Speaker 3: wife and kid.

701
00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:29,360
Speaker 4: You don't know what other people are going through.

702
00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:32,240
Speaker 3: And so I've given myself permission to stop comparing myself

703
00:34:32,560 --> 00:34:34,120
Speaker 3: to other people because it's a waste of time.

704
00:34:34,200 --> 00:34:35,080
Speaker 2: It's the devil.

705
00:34:35,400 --> 00:34:41,759
Speaker 1: Literally, there was a book that I read by Gabby Bernstein.

706
00:34:42,160 --> 00:34:43,719
Speaker 1: I got to get you the title of it, but

707
00:34:43,760 --> 00:34:47,719
Speaker 1: there is a chapter that is about comparison and just

708
00:34:47,760 --> 00:34:50,879
Speaker 1: how that is the devil. And it's something that I mean,

709
00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:54,520
Speaker 1: especially in like reality TV, it is so easy to

710
00:34:54,600 --> 00:34:57,839
Speaker 1: compare on a work side, you know, like oh this

711
00:34:57,880 --> 00:35:00,920
Speaker 1: person's getting this, this person has more this, blah blah blah.

712
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:03,880
Speaker 1: But when it came to me being a mom and

713
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:08,399
Speaker 1: watching Laala and Brittany just so gracefully, just the way

714
00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:11,520
Speaker 1: they pick them up and did this and change the diaper,

715
00:35:11,560 --> 00:35:13,960
Speaker 1: and I'm like, okay, be very careful. And it was

716
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:17,360
Speaker 1: like I had the breathewear on her until she was

717
00:35:17,640 --> 00:35:20,719
Speaker 1: over two years old. I literally had my aunt, who

718
00:35:20,840 --> 00:35:24,840
Speaker 1: was a seamstress, expand the breathewear and add more velcrow

719
00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:26,400
Speaker 1: so I could keep it on her longer.

720
00:35:26,719 --> 00:35:26,919
Speaker 4: Yep.

721
00:35:27,040 --> 00:35:29,520
Speaker 1: And then once we started, it was like safe, you know,

722
00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:31,920
Speaker 1: once they're a little older, to give them a blanket

723
00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:33,520
Speaker 1: in the crib, because I mean, she laid there.

724
00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:34,680
Speaker 2: It was a little prison.

725
00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:37,880
Speaker 1: There was a sheet and nothing else, not even the

726
00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:41,480
Speaker 1: tiniest little stuffy anything in my mind was going to

727
00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:45,240
Speaker 1: suffocate her. And so once you know it's like, okay,

728
00:35:45,719 --> 00:35:48,640
Speaker 1: she's two two and a half, it's like you got

729
00:35:48,640 --> 00:35:50,880
Speaker 1: to give the kid a blanket and you gotta just

730
00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:53,520
Speaker 1: take the breathe where out She's gonna be okay.

731
00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:55,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, But I mean it took me a.

732
00:35:55,520 --> 00:35:58,200
Speaker 1: Couple years and I just see Laala and Brittainy and

733
00:35:58,200 --> 00:35:59,520
Speaker 1: they're like, she'll be fine.

734
00:36:00,000 --> 00:36:02,880
Speaker 3: Well, And the danger is you tell yourself they're braver

735
00:36:03,040 --> 00:36:06,160
Speaker 3: than I am, they're more conaigious than I am. No,

736
00:36:06,840 --> 00:36:08,960
Speaker 3: and you've got to like let yourself off the hook

737
00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:11,160
Speaker 3: for that. And like I said, you don't know what

738
00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:11,880
Speaker 3: they're going through.

739
00:36:12,160 --> 00:36:12,279
Speaker 2: No.

740
00:36:12,440 --> 00:36:14,440
Speaker 1: But also I don't even think Laala had a camera

741
00:36:14,640 --> 00:36:15,880
Speaker 1: when Ocean was a baby.

742
00:36:15,880 --> 00:36:17,920
Speaker 2: It was just like she's fine. I'll hear her.

743
00:36:18,080 --> 00:36:20,080
Speaker 3: I had a monitor in my son's room until like

744
00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:22,520
Speaker 3: he was eight Okay, I'll.

745
00:36:22,080 --> 00:36:26,440
Speaker 1: Have one until she's eighteen, until you move out and

746
00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:27,160
Speaker 1: go to college.

747
00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:28,719
Speaker 2: I will be keeping an eye on you.

748
00:36:29,160 --> 00:36:30,600
Speaker 4: I know, I know.

749
00:36:31,040 --> 00:36:33,520
Speaker 3: But the thing is, we need to stop comparing ourselves

750
00:36:33,560 --> 00:36:35,400
Speaker 3: to other moms, I know, and we just have to

751
00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:38,480
Speaker 3: focus on what do I need to Because also, let's

752
00:36:38,520 --> 00:36:43,160
Speaker 3: pretend I got one hundred percent better from all of

753
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:45,360
Speaker 3: my anxiety issues. And I'm not there yet, but I'm

754
00:36:45,400 --> 00:36:47,799
Speaker 3: doing great. Yeah, let's pretend I got one hundred percent better.

755
00:36:47,920 --> 00:36:51,680
Speaker 3: It still wouldn't be my personality to be like, they're fine,

756
00:36:51,880 --> 00:36:54,399
Speaker 3: He's fine, Everything's going to be fine all the time.

757
00:36:54,440 --> 00:36:56,520
Speaker 4: You just can't worry about anything that.

758
00:36:56,400 --> 00:37:00,760
Speaker 3: Will never be me and I have to stop toggling

759
00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:05,400
Speaker 3: between these extremes of my crazy anxiety, which is unhealthy

760
00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:08,359
Speaker 3: for me and everyone around me, and this laissez fair

761
00:37:09,160 --> 00:37:12,640
Speaker 3: who cares about anything that's never gonna be There's a

762
00:37:12,719 --> 00:37:15,680
Speaker 3: middle ground here, Yeah, And that's what I work on

763
00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:17,440
Speaker 3: in therapy, finding that middle ground.

764
00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:19,960
Speaker 1: Same, and that's one of the things I do that's

765
00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:23,000
Speaker 1: like a big exposure therapy for me. Especially now that

766
00:37:23,120 --> 00:37:27,239
Speaker 1: summer is in school and there are other moms in

767
00:37:27,320 --> 00:37:31,400
Speaker 1: our group who also struggle with OCD and anxiety and whatnot.

768
00:37:31,440 --> 00:37:33,240
Speaker 1: So it's so great that we have such a supportive

769
00:37:33,239 --> 00:37:36,400
Speaker 1: group of moms and like we get it. And I've

770
00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:38,880
Speaker 1: even been able to help one of the other moms.

771
00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:42,600
Speaker 1: She didn't know what exposure therapy was and so our kids.

772
00:37:42,760 --> 00:37:46,160
Speaker 1: For example, we're in a jiu jitsu class and she

773
00:37:46,320 --> 00:37:50,279
Speaker 1: was just like and I was like, she's gonna be fine.

774
00:37:50,320 --> 00:37:52,000
Speaker 2: She was like, how are you so calm right now?

775
00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:54,120
Speaker 1: I go because I tell myself I have to be

776
00:37:54,200 --> 00:37:59,120
Speaker 1: calm and she's going to be okay. Am I spiraling inside? Absolutely,

777
00:37:59,400 --> 00:38:01,280
Speaker 1: But I'm not going to show all these other parents.

778
00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:03,279
Speaker 3: Yeah, but she was thinking, oh, I wish I could

779
00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:05,080
Speaker 3: be so calm and cool like sheena.

780
00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:07,200
Speaker 2: Yes, And I'm like, no, no, it's up here, ye.

781
00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:10,600
Speaker 1: But I'm just I'm telling myself, she's gonna be okay.

782
00:38:10,680 --> 00:38:13,560
Speaker 1: If that little boy takes her out in the on

783
00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:15,319
Speaker 1: the next round, she's gonna take him out.

784
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:16,000
Speaker 2: And she does.

785
00:38:16,840 --> 00:38:21,960
Speaker 1: But it is forcing myself to constantly have my kid

786
00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:25,239
Speaker 1: not in dangerous situations, the situations that make me a

787
00:38:25,280 --> 00:38:27,640
Speaker 1: little uncomfortable swimming in the pool.

788
00:38:28,000 --> 00:38:29,160
Speaker 2: She's a great swimmer.

789
00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:31,920
Speaker 1: I still think every time she goes underwater, she's not

790
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:33,600
Speaker 1: going to come back up. But I have to remind

791
00:38:33,600 --> 00:38:36,919
Speaker 1: myself she's been in lessons for three years. She knows

792
00:38:36,960 --> 00:38:41,920
Speaker 1: how to swim. It's just a constant reminder. And you know,

793
00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:46,320
Speaker 1: I still have a life back everywhere. But I actually

794
00:38:46,400 --> 00:38:49,640
Speaker 1: I always keep one in my car and then I'm like, wait,

795
00:38:49,800 --> 00:38:51,279
Speaker 1: is it in my car in Palm Springs or is

796
00:38:51,320 --> 00:38:53,120
Speaker 1: it in my car in LA I don't know, But

797
00:38:53,160 --> 00:38:55,520
Speaker 1: I'm proud of myself for just being like, Yep, it

798
00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:57,200
Speaker 1: might be in the other car, but like we're gonna

799
00:38:57,200 --> 00:38:57,560
Speaker 1: be Okay.

800
00:38:58,120 --> 00:38:58,919
Speaker 4: I'm a r camp.

801
00:38:59,320 --> 00:39:01,800
Speaker 3: I don't live in a town where fentanyl is a problem.

802
00:39:01,880 --> 00:39:03,200
Speaker 3: I have it because I'm allowed to have it.

803
00:39:14,800 --> 00:39:16,880
Speaker 2: Oh and that book was called super Attractor.

804
00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:19,920
Speaker 6: I just from a Superattractor Okay by Gali Berenstein.

805
00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:20,440
Speaker 2: Yeah.

806
00:39:20,640 --> 00:39:23,200
Speaker 3: Oh what my therapist sid that really helped me around

807
00:39:23,239 --> 00:39:28,080
Speaker 3: these issues. She said, what kind of safety nets have

808
00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:29,799
Speaker 3: you put in place for Jack? Well, you moved to

809
00:39:29,880 --> 00:39:32,799
Speaker 3: a really good town, safe town. You got a great

810
00:39:32,880 --> 00:39:35,600
Speaker 3: nanny that you trust, He's in a great school where

811
00:39:35,600 --> 00:39:38,680
Speaker 3: he has you know, teams, people that look out for him,

812
00:39:39,040 --> 00:39:42,239
Speaker 3: your parents, help you married the right guy, you know

813
00:39:42,280 --> 00:39:44,799
Speaker 3: who you can trust, who's a great dad. Put all

814
00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:48,480
Speaker 3: these teams in place in these systems. Yet you're acting

815
00:39:48,719 --> 00:39:51,640
Speaker 3: like you haven't done any of that. You're acting like

816
00:39:51,719 --> 00:39:54,160
Speaker 3: you live in a war zone and you send your

817
00:39:54,200 --> 00:39:56,879
Speaker 3: son out to a serial killer at the school every day.

818
00:39:56,960 --> 00:39:58,320
Speaker 4: Like that's how you're acting.

819
00:39:59,080 --> 00:40:01,839
Speaker 3: What's the point of doing all the safety nets if

820
00:40:01,880 --> 00:40:05,319
Speaker 3: you're not going to trust them and feel safer with

821
00:40:05,360 --> 00:40:06,880
Speaker 3: them totally?

822
00:40:07,520 --> 00:40:09,120
Speaker 4: I mean, it can just mess with you.

823
00:40:09,239 --> 00:40:10,799
Speaker 3: But yeah, those are the things I have to keep

824
00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:13,440
Speaker 3: reminding myself, like, yeah, he is safe.

825
00:40:13,719 --> 00:40:16,560
Speaker 4: You've made him safe, You've given him all the tools

826
00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:20,920
Speaker 4: to be safe. Yeah, act like it exactly. It's hard. Yeah,

827
00:40:21,320 --> 00:40:21,719
Speaker 4: it's hard.

828
00:40:21,800 --> 00:40:24,600
Speaker 1: I know, even just being on book tour right now,

829
00:40:24,719 --> 00:40:27,719
Speaker 1: Like without her, Rock is amazing with Summery, but it

830
00:40:28,040 --> 00:40:30,400
Speaker 1: is hard to be away from her. And I'm just like,

831
00:40:30,440 --> 00:40:32,440
Speaker 1: you know what, Yeah, she's gonna go to school, her

832
00:40:32,440 --> 00:40:33,960
Speaker 1: hair's gonna be messy, you probably won't have.

833
00:40:33,960 --> 00:40:35,960
Speaker 2: A bow in it, but she'll be fine. Killer, She'll

834
00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:36,400
Speaker 2: be fine.

835
00:40:36,600 --> 00:40:37,359
Speaker 4: It's gonna be okay.

836
00:40:37,440 --> 00:40:37,640
Speaker 3: You know.

837
00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:40,160
Speaker 2: It's just like the things that I used to stress over.

838
00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:43,680
Speaker 1: Now I'm just trying to just be a little more

839
00:40:43,680 --> 00:40:45,800
Speaker 1: easy going because I'm like, it's not the end of

840
00:40:45,840 --> 00:40:46,280
Speaker 1: the world.

841
00:40:46,480 --> 00:40:48,960
Speaker 2: If you know, her hair isn't like good perspective.

842
00:40:49,000 --> 00:40:51,279
Speaker 1: When I'm in town, it will be and you knows that,

843
00:40:52,520 --> 00:40:53,759
Speaker 1: but it's my perspective.

844
00:40:53,880 --> 00:40:57,919
Speaker 3: Yeah, And listen, you're gonna You're ambitious, so you're gonna work,

845
00:40:57,960 --> 00:41:01,240
Speaker 3: You're gonna be traveling. I spent six months of last

846
00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:06,440
Speaker 3: year in Philadelphia covering the presidential election, living in another city. Okay,

847
00:41:06,760 --> 00:41:09,840
Speaker 3: I'd come home on weekends, but this was hard. But

848
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:11,600
Speaker 3: I would tell myself, well, this is good for him

849
00:41:11,880 --> 00:41:14,040
Speaker 3: to spend some more time with dad. Yeah, not have

850
00:41:14,120 --> 00:41:17,480
Speaker 3: mom helicopter ink, Yeah, this is good for me. You

851
00:41:17,719 --> 00:41:21,919
Speaker 3: just gotta flip everything around sometimes and try to tell

852
00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:24,720
Speaker 3: yourself there are good things in this thing that feels

853
00:41:24,760 --> 00:41:27,080
Speaker 3: really scary for me, and like, I'm going to focus

854
00:41:27,080 --> 00:41:27,680
Speaker 3: on those.

855
00:41:27,640 --> 00:41:28,560
Speaker 2: One hundred percent.

856
00:41:28,680 --> 00:41:31,399
Speaker 1: And that's what I'm so thankful that I do have

857
00:41:31,840 --> 00:41:33,960
Speaker 1: Brock as a co parent, because.

858
00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:37,080
Speaker 2: Your mom's around, We're the total opposite. Like I mean,

859
00:41:37,200 --> 00:41:38,960
Speaker 2: I was raised an only.

860
00:41:38,840 --> 00:41:41,759
Speaker 1: Child for twelve years just outside of Los Angeles. He

861
00:41:41,840 --> 00:41:44,960
Speaker 1: was the youngest of five on a farm in New Zealand,

862
00:41:45,480 --> 00:41:47,640
Speaker 1: and it just like, I mean, we could not have

863
00:41:47,760 --> 00:41:51,640
Speaker 1: had more different upbringings and we could not be more

864
00:41:51,640 --> 00:41:53,320
Speaker 1: different in our parenting styles.

865
00:41:53,640 --> 00:41:57,279
Speaker 2: But having that balance it's great for her.

866
00:41:57,440 --> 00:42:00,360
Speaker 1: Like in the morning for school, I'm on, I'm like,

867
00:42:00,360 --> 00:42:01,040
Speaker 1: come on, honey, we.

868
00:42:01,040 --> 00:42:02,680
Speaker 2: Gotta leave, we gotta go. We don't want to be late.

869
00:42:02,719 --> 00:42:04,480
Speaker 2: And he's just like, she's four.

870
00:42:04,680 --> 00:42:06,840
Speaker 1: First of all, He's like, you put so much pressure

871
00:42:06,880 --> 00:42:08,400
Speaker 1: on being on time. I'm like, well, yeah, it's a

872
00:42:08,440 --> 00:42:11,800
Speaker 1: respect thing, respect other people's time. School starts at eight fifteen,

873
00:42:12,080 --> 00:42:14,080
Speaker 1: we leave out the door at eight. We get to

874
00:42:14,160 --> 00:42:18,080
Speaker 1: school on time. And so I know because I have

875
00:42:18,239 --> 00:42:21,160
Speaker 1: obviously there's cameras all over our house, so I get

876
00:42:21,160 --> 00:42:24,319
Speaker 1: a notification when the doorbell camera goes off, and so

877
00:42:24,440 --> 00:42:26,719
Speaker 1: I see what time he's been leaving for school every day.

878
00:42:27,520 --> 00:42:28,280
Speaker 2: Not eight o'clock.

879
00:42:28,280 --> 00:42:30,600
Speaker 1: I can tell you that, but he goes you know what,

880
00:42:30,719 --> 00:42:33,200
Speaker 1: He's like, we just got one of those giant like

881
00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:38,120
Speaker 1: skylight calendars, and so he has it set up where

882
00:42:38,120 --> 00:42:40,360
Speaker 1: summer she gets up on her stool and every morning

883
00:42:40,440 --> 00:42:43,120
Speaker 1: she checks off. Okay, I made my bed, I brushed

884
00:42:43,160 --> 00:42:45,600
Speaker 1: my teeth, I fed the cats, and he goes, I

885
00:42:45,640 --> 00:42:48,040
Speaker 1: think it's more important for her in the morning to

886
00:42:48,120 --> 00:42:51,600
Speaker 1: be doing her tasks and stuff instead of having an

887
00:42:51,640 --> 00:42:54,480
Speaker 1: extra twenty minutes at school to play. He goes, you know,

888
00:42:54,560 --> 00:42:56,560
Speaker 1: the first thirty minutes they're just playing.

889
00:42:56,680 --> 00:42:57,879
Speaker 4: He goes, so, and.

890
00:42:57,880 --> 00:43:00,839
Speaker 1: I'm like, Okay, I can't really argue with that, because

891
00:43:00,840 --> 00:43:01,879
Speaker 1: they do understand.

892
00:43:02,600 --> 00:43:03,799
Speaker 2: It's not on my watch.

893
00:43:03,840 --> 00:43:05,719
Speaker 1: I'm not getting her to school late, like we get

894
00:43:05,800 --> 00:43:09,720
Speaker 1: up earlier then to tick off the tasks. But I

895
00:43:09,760 --> 00:43:12,759
Speaker 1: appreciated what he was saying of why they've been late

896
00:43:13,000 --> 00:43:15,200
Speaker 1: every day because she's.

897
00:43:15,040 --> 00:43:16,160
Speaker 2: Getting her chores done.

898
00:43:16,520 --> 00:43:18,960
Speaker 1: I'm like, okay, and you know, I love that that

899
00:43:19,040 --> 00:43:21,680
Speaker 1: she's learning the responsibility of taking care of the cats

900
00:43:21,719 --> 00:43:22,760
Speaker 1: when mommy's out of town.

901
00:43:23,120 --> 00:43:25,239
Speaker 2: I was just like, but can we still try to

902
00:43:25,239 --> 00:43:26,000
Speaker 2: get her on time?

903
00:43:26,360 --> 00:43:27,040
Speaker 4: Can we do both?

904
00:43:27,560 --> 00:43:29,480
Speaker 1: Because I'm like, once she goes into kindergarten and once

905
00:43:29,520 --> 00:43:33,440
Speaker 1: there's a bell, there's no just like showing up thirty

906
00:43:33,480 --> 00:43:37,680
Speaker 1: she gets there right exactly, so you'll fink, I'm thankful

907
00:43:37,760 --> 00:43:40,600
Speaker 1: she has, you know, a chill parent and a helicopter parents.

908
00:43:40,920 --> 00:43:42,840
Speaker 2: I's the best of both worlds exactly.

909
00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:45,520
Speaker 3: That's what we have to you know, my husband's pretty

910
00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:49,200
Speaker 3: chill and I'm not. It is a nice balance for Jack.

911
00:43:49,760 --> 00:43:53,719
Speaker 3: Before we get to a lightning round, will you move

912
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:54,640
Speaker 3: over to.

913
00:43:54,640 --> 00:43:56,720
Speaker 4: The valley, we'll see.

914
00:43:57,040 --> 00:44:01,600
Speaker 3: Okay, I got it, got it, got it great, terrific. Okay,

915
00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:02,719
Speaker 3: let's do a lightning round.

916
00:44:02,880 --> 00:44:05,720
Speaker 2: Okay.

917
00:44:09,480 --> 00:44:12,360
Speaker 3: Is there a world in which you and Rachel become

918
00:44:12,400 --> 00:44:13,040
Speaker 3: friends again?

919
00:44:13,719 --> 00:44:13,959
Speaker 2: Ooh.

920
00:44:14,280 --> 00:44:16,640
Speaker 1: I don't know that we would ever be friends again,

921
00:44:16,880 --> 00:44:19,920
Speaker 1: but I would be open to a conversation.

922
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:23,320
Speaker 4: For your benefit or for her benefit.

923
00:44:24,960 --> 00:44:26,440
Speaker 2: Maybe for a little bit of both.

924
00:44:26,520 --> 00:44:29,720
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't think there's anything I need from her,

925
00:44:30,160 --> 00:44:32,239
Speaker 1: you know, but I do think that there is a

926
00:44:32,280 --> 00:44:36,440
Speaker 1: conversation that could still be had one day. From what

927
00:44:36,560 --> 00:44:39,080
Speaker 1: I've heard and seeing, you know, she's thriving, living her

928
00:44:39,080 --> 00:44:41,080
Speaker 1: best life, and I wish her nothing but the best.

929
00:44:41,640 --> 00:44:44,440
Speaker 1: I don't know that there is a need for that.

930
00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:46,800
Speaker 1: It's not like we need a closure conversation or anything

931
00:44:46,840 --> 00:44:49,440
Speaker 1: like that. But we do still have some mutual friends,

932
00:44:49,440 --> 00:44:51,880
Speaker 1: and if one day are paths crossed and she wanted

933
00:44:51,920 --> 00:44:54,160
Speaker 1: to talk, I would be open to that. But I'm

934
00:44:54,200 --> 00:44:57,040
Speaker 1: certainly not going to be the one reaching out. I'm

935
00:44:57,040 --> 00:45:00,600
Speaker 1: blocked on everything. So I think that says enough. But

936
00:45:01,600 --> 00:45:02,759
Speaker 1: we're you're the best.

937
00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:05,680
Speaker 3: What would you tell Tom Stanivill to do next with

938
00:45:05,760 --> 00:45:06,280
Speaker 3: his life?

939
00:45:07,320 --> 00:45:14,920
Speaker 1: Ooh, learn how to take accountability, you know, But I

940
00:45:14,920 --> 00:45:18,160
Speaker 1: mean keep doing what he's doing. You know, Tom Sandival

941
00:45:18,239 --> 00:45:21,280
Speaker 1: and the Most Extras. They're a very entertaining band to see.

942
00:45:21,320 --> 00:45:23,080
Speaker 1: I loved going to their shows back in the day.

943
00:45:23,680 --> 00:45:26,560
Speaker 1: So I guess they're on America's Got Talent now.

944
00:45:26,840 --> 00:45:29,160
Speaker 4: I saw that. Yeah, I saw that.

945
00:45:30,360 --> 00:45:33,480
Speaker 3: Who was a bad casting choice, not necessarily because they

946
00:45:33,480 --> 00:45:35,279
Speaker 3: were like a bad person, but just like not right

947
00:45:35,360 --> 00:45:36,360
Speaker 3: for vanderbum.

948
00:45:37,120 --> 00:45:39,320
Speaker 2: Charlie I made no sense.

949
00:45:39,640 --> 00:45:45,080
Speaker 1: She literally like auditioned and got hired through like her agent.

950
00:45:45,280 --> 00:45:47,719
Speaker 2: It was weird what they were trying to do with season.

951
00:45:47,440 --> 00:45:49,160
Speaker 4: Eight, but weird.

952
00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:54,520
Speaker 1: And yeah, her and Brett were both bad casting because

953
00:45:54,520 --> 00:45:58,440
Speaker 1: it literally was casting. They had zero connection. They didn't

954
00:45:58,440 --> 00:45:59,000
Speaker 1: work at the rest.

955
00:45:59,080 --> 00:46:01,040
Speaker 4: You could tell, you're like, why are these people here?

956
00:46:01,480 --> 00:46:05,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, Max and Dana made sense. There were natural connections

957
00:46:05,080 --> 00:46:08,880
Speaker 1: there that made sense. But Charlie and Brett that was terrible.

958
00:46:09,280 --> 00:46:12,759
Speaker 3: Yep, Jack's announced he's leaving the Valley. You spent a

959
00:46:12,760 --> 00:46:15,680
Speaker 3: lot of time with those guys. Is Jack's or Jesse worse?

960
00:46:15,719 --> 00:46:17,839
Speaker 3: Answer the question Everyone's asking right.

961
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:19,120
Speaker 2: Now, they both suck.

962
00:46:19,640 --> 00:46:21,920
Speaker 4: Okay, yeah, that's the right answer.

963
00:46:23,360 --> 00:46:23,560
Speaker 2: You know.

964
00:46:23,640 --> 00:46:26,319
Speaker 3: Help me understand the hate for Janet, because I don't

965
00:46:26,360 --> 00:46:29,319
Speaker 3: get it, and I love a Bravo villain and I

966
00:46:29,360 --> 00:46:30,680
Speaker 3: just don't think she is one.

967
00:46:30,800 --> 00:46:33,440
Speaker 4: And I'm I'm not sure what it is that has

968
00:46:33,920 --> 00:46:35,960
Speaker 4: people so enraged by her, do you.

969
00:46:35,920 --> 00:46:40,640
Speaker 1: Know, I don't understand it. It is so unwarranted. It's

970
00:46:40,760 --> 00:46:44,319
Speaker 1: crazy to me. I get it that people can be

971
00:46:44,360 --> 00:46:47,280
Speaker 1: annoyed by her because she doesn't let up on things,

972
00:46:47,360 --> 00:46:50,880
Speaker 1: and she you know, fights other people's battles, which is

973
00:46:50,960 --> 00:46:53,320
Speaker 1: one thing at times that I appreciate about her friendship.

974
00:46:53,719 --> 00:46:56,840
Speaker 1: So I can understand people being annoyed. People are annoyed

975
00:46:56,840 --> 00:46:57,839
Speaker 1: with me, I get it.

976
00:46:58,320 --> 00:47:05,319
Speaker 6: But the insane, yeah, I mean like death threat until shit,

977
00:47:05,480 --> 00:47:06,759
Speaker 6: Like I don't understand it.

978
00:47:06,920 --> 00:47:10,800
Speaker 1: For her, No, it is next level. It's scandal all level,

979
00:47:10,880 --> 00:47:14,360
Speaker 1: and it's so unwarranted. Like, I don't understand it, because

980
00:47:14,600 --> 00:47:18,359
Speaker 1: when you saw that episode, Dave Embuster's Janet, that is

981
00:47:18,440 --> 00:47:22,760
Speaker 1: Janet all of the time. But that's Janet around people

982
00:47:22,760 --> 00:47:24,840
Speaker 1: who bring that out of her, and when she's in

983
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:27,560
Speaker 1: her element, when you're on a show with women who

984
00:47:27,560 --> 00:47:29,120
Speaker 1: don't bring that out of you, or men who don't

985
00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:30,920
Speaker 1: bring that out of you. You're not going to see

986
00:47:30,960 --> 00:47:33,200
Speaker 1: the best sides of you. And that was a problem

987
00:47:33,200 --> 00:47:35,840
Speaker 1: that I had in reality TV. Is I'm on a

988
00:47:35,880 --> 00:47:38,319
Speaker 1: show with three girls who hate me and don't want

989
00:47:38,320 --> 00:47:40,239
Speaker 1: me on their show. You're not going to see fun,

990
00:47:40,360 --> 00:47:42,879
Speaker 1: lighthearted Shina that like my best friend see.

991
00:47:44,120 --> 00:47:46,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, but like, I mean, we don't have to keep

992
00:47:46,239 --> 00:47:49,480
Speaker 3: beating this. But like, I just don't like, she wasn't

993
00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:53,080
Speaker 3: a Teresa. I mean, she wasn't like, I don't know,

994
00:47:53,160 --> 00:47:58,280
Speaker 3: the level did not match, you know, she wasn't just drying.

995
00:47:59,160 --> 00:48:03,280
Speaker 3: I know, I don't understand it, And I wish Bravo

996
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:07,319
Speaker 3: fans sometimes chilled the fuck out because at the end

997
00:48:07,320 --> 00:48:11,239
Speaker 3: of the day, this is entertainment and part two you

998
00:48:11,280 --> 00:48:12,120
Speaker 3: are real people.

999
00:48:12,520 --> 00:48:13,520
Speaker 4: You are real people.

1000
00:48:13,360 --> 00:48:16,520
Speaker 3: With real families and lives and like to get this

1001
00:48:16,719 --> 00:48:17,359
Speaker 3: worked up.

1002
00:48:17,800 --> 00:48:20,720
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean it's like politics level works out, Like why.

1003
00:48:20,640 --> 00:48:21,600
Speaker 4: Is this the same? Yeah?

1004
00:48:21,680 --> 00:48:24,279
Speaker 1: Okay, right, every night at my live shows, I've been

1005
00:48:24,320 --> 00:48:26,200
Speaker 1: doing a PSA for what an amazing person?

1006
00:48:26,320 --> 00:48:29,839
Speaker 2: Jan It is good good because.

1007
00:48:29,880 --> 00:48:32,200
Speaker 3: Whether you like her or not, or you find her

1008
00:48:32,239 --> 00:48:35,600
Speaker 3: annoying or not, it is not at the level that

1009
00:48:35,719 --> 00:48:40,560
Speaker 3: she is getting a wild Okay, what's your favorite mental

1010
00:48:40,560 --> 00:48:41,320
Speaker 3: health tip?

1011
00:48:42,000 --> 00:48:43,520
Speaker 2: You were just exposure therapy.

1012
00:48:43,800 --> 00:48:49,080
Speaker 1: Honestly, exposure therapy has been life changing for me because

1013
00:48:49,120 --> 00:48:51,680
Speaker 1: once you expose yourself to something and you get through it,

1014
00:48:51,760 --> 00:48:54,200
Speaker 1: you understand, oh, this isn't as scary as I thought

1015
00:48:54,239 --> 00:48:58,400
Speaker 1: it was. That is my biggest tip. EMDR and exposure

1016
00:48:58,440 --> 00:48:59,800
Speaker 1: therapy excellent.

1017
00:49:00,760 --> 00:49:01,720
Speaker 4: Where is she Nache?

1018
00:49:02,160 --> 00:49:08,120
Speaker 3: In ten years you'll be you'll be fifty.

1019
00:49:06,280 --> 00:49:07,959
Speaker 2: I know, in a facelift chair.

1020
00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:10,439
Speaker 4: Yeah, right right, same girl.

1021
00:49:11,160 --> 00:49:14,200
Speaker 1: I couldn't tell you where I would be in ten months,

1022
00:49:14,480 --> 00:49:17,160
Speaker 1: so I have no idea. That is the one thing

1023
00:49:17,200 --> 00:49:20,520
Speaker 1: that I do thank my OCD for is I am

1024
00:49:20,560 --> 00:49:23,279
Speaker 1: incapable of looking that far into the future, because when

1025
00:49:23,320 --> 00:49:25,080
Speaker 1: I do, I'm like, well, am I going to be alive?

1026
00:49:25,160 --> 00:49:26,080
Speaker 2: Is my daughter going to be alive?

1027
00:49:26,719 --> 00:49:28,600
Speaker 1: To be It's just I just think about death when

1028
00:49:28,600 --> 00:49:31,640
Speaker 1: I think about the future. So, couldn't tell you, but

1029
00:49:32,520 --> 00:49:34,440
Speaker 1: probably due for a facelift by then.

1030
00:49:35,400 --> 00:49:37,840
Speaker 4: We all will be Maybe they'll have some great for me.

1031
00:49:37,920 --> 00:49:39,680
Speaker 4: It's not that far away. It's like four or five

1032
00:49:39,760 --> 00:49:40,239
Speaker 4: years away.

1033
00:49:40,280 --> 00:49:43,320
Speaker 3: But maybe they'll have some great new technology exactly.

1034
00:49:43,560 --> 00:49:45,080
Speaker 4: Yeah, but we don't even know about yet.

1035
00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:47,600
Speaker 2: Like just a little. Just give me the Lindsay Lohan.

1036
00:49:49,239 --> 00:49:51,759
Speaker 4: Just what has she is?

1037
00:49:51,840 --> 00:49:55,040
Speaker 1: She looking amazing, incredible, best she's ever looked. She like

1038
00:49:55,040 --> 00:49:56,640
Speaker 1: took ten years off. I'm like, how'd you do that?

1039
00:49:57,239 --> 00:49:59,520
Speaker 4: But I think she's the prettiest she's ever looked. She

1040
00:49:59,560 --> 00:50:01,920
Speaker 4: looks healthy and she looks incredible.

1041
00:50:02,120 --> 00:50:05,080
Speaker 3: Okay, this is the last question. Okay, most important one

1042
00:50:05,120 --> 00:50:10,040
Speaker 3: to me spiritually culturally. When is it iced coffee season?

1043
00:50:11,400 --> 00:50:17,200
Speaker 1: Ooh see, in this household, we're a hot coffee every

1044
00:50:17,280 --> 00:50:22,640
Speaker 1: season person. So I know that's against popular opinion, but.

1045
00:50:22,920 --> 00:50:24,400
Speaker 4: Long answer, but I love you anyway.

1046
00:50:24,600 --> 00:50:25,680
Speaker 2: I know that's the thing.

1047
00:50:25,719 --> 00:50:28,040
Speaker 1: It's August first, and I had a hot chi latte

1048
00:50:28,080 --> 00:50:31,720
Speaker 1: for breakfast, so I like, I had an iced macha.

1049
00:50:32,040 --> 00:50:33,440
Speaker 4: I'm the exact opposite.

1050
00:50:33,600 --> 00:50:37,839
Speaker 3: I it's twenty five degrees in winter in Connecticut. I'm

1051
00:50:37,880 --> 00:50:40,960
Speaker 3: outside with an iced coffee. It's the only way I

1052
00:50:41,000 --> 00:50:42,359
Speaker 3: ever want my coffee is iced.

1053
00:50:42,880 --> 00:50:44,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, it just depends what I'm in the mood for.

1054
00:50:45,080 --> 00:50:48,040
Speaker 1: But I love hot coffee.

1055
00:50:48,239 --> 00:50:50,160
Speaker 3: You're entitled and that's the way it was meant to

1056
00:50:50,160 --> 00:50:51,560
Speaker 3: be to be enjoyed.

1057
00:50:51,840 --> 00:50:55,080
Speaker 4: I just am from Boston. We do a different I

1058
00:50:55,120 --> 00:50:55,560
Speaker 4: love it.

1059
00:50:56,200 --> 00:50:56,520
Speaker 2: Thank you.

1060
00:50:56,600 --> 00:50:56,920
Speaker 4: Sheena.

1061
00:50:56,960 --> 00:50:59,480
Speaker 3: The book is my good side of memoir and everyone

1062
00:50:59,520 --> 00:51:01,480
Speaker 3: needs to go. It's a great book. And I'm just

1063
00:51:02,040 --> 00:51:04,240
Speaker 3: I'm endlessly proud of you. And I hope that doesn't

1064
00:51:04,239 --> 00:51:06,920
Speaker 3: sound condescending, but I am proud of you. I love you,

1065
00:51:07,080 --> 00:51:09,120
Speaker 3: thank you, and I adore you, and I love that

1066
00:51:09,200 --> 00:51:11,640
Speaker 3: you share so much because honestly, a lot of us

1067
00:51:11,719 --> 00:51:13,399
Speaker 3: learn a lot yeah when you do.

1068
00:51:13,640 --> 00:51:16,520
Speaker 1: So thanks well, thank you, thanks for coming so fun,

1069
00:51:16,760 --> 00:51:18,520
Speaker 1: thank you for having me always.

1070
00:51:20,920 --> 00:51:23,040
Speaker 3: Coming up next week on Off the Cup, I talked

1071
00:51:23,040 --> 00:51:24,120
Speaker 3: to James Vanderbeek.

1072
00:51:24,719 --> 00:51:30,680
Speaker 5: What I had really come to define myself as was father, provider, husband, athletic,

1073
00:51:30,880 --> 00:51:34,600
Speaker 5: guy who can do all these things. And what I

1074
00:51:34,680 --> 00:51:37,200
Speaker 5: realized I was at a point where I was none

1075
00:51:37,239 --> 00:51:38,120
Speaker 5: of those things.

1076
00:51:39,280 --> 00:51:41,719
Speaker 3: Off the Cup is a production of iHeart Podcasts as

1077
00:51:41,760 --> 00:51:43,240
Speaker 3: part of the Reason Choice Network.

1078
00:51:43,480 --> 00:51:44,879
Speaker 4: If you want more, check out the.

1079
00:51:44,840 --> 00:51:49,000
Speaker 3: Other Reason Choice podcasts, Politics with Jamel Hill and Native

1080
00:51:49,080 --> 00:51:52,080
Speaker 3: Land pod. For Off the Cop, I'm your host, Si Cup.

1081
00:51:52,320 --> 00:51:55,759
Speaker 3: Editing and sound design by Derek Clements. Our executive producers

1082
00:51:55,800 --> 00:51:59,680
Speaker 3: are me Sie Cop, Lauren Hanson, and Lindsay Hoffman. Rate

1083
00:51:59,719 --> 00:52:02,600
Speaker 3: and review you wherever you get your podcasts, Follow or

1084
00:52:02,680 --> 00:52:05,320
Speaker 3: subscribe for new episodes every Wednesday.