WEBVTT - How Dynamic Ads Work in Podcasts 0:00:04.400 --> 0:00:07.800 Welcome to tech Stuff, a production from my Heart Radio. 0:00:11.800 --> 0:00:15.000 Be there and welcome to tech Stuff. I'm your host, 0:00:15.160 --> 0:00:18.919 Jonathan Strickland. I'm an executive producer with iHeart Radio and 0:00:19.000 --> 0:00:21.919 how the tech are you. I recently got a note 0:00:21.960 --> 0:00:26.880 from my editor that my rushed intro is starting to 0:00:26.920 --> 0:00:30.560 slurn together to the point where it's completely incomprehensible, so 0:00:30.640 --> 0:00:34.440 I'm working to reverse that. You can thank TORII. She's 0:00:34.479 --> 0:00:38.120 the reason why uh I I have I have been 0:00:38.200 --> 0:00:44.080 curbed of my chaotic behavior. Anyway, Twitter user Ryan Barrier 0:00:44.320 --> 0:00:48.400 sent me a message that read quote, Hey, Jonathan, I'd 0:00:48.400 --> 0:00:51.879 love to hear about how podcast advertising works. Early on 0:00:51.920 --> 0:00:55.720 in your show, I remember hearing the same ad for years. 0:00:55.760 --> 0:00:59.120 Toyota Camera not currently a sponsor of this episode. That's 0:00:59.160 --> 0:01:04.080 just metorializing. Then it seems they became more dynamic. Now 0:01:04.120 --> 0:01:08.600 even old episodes have current ads. Thanks end quote. Well, 0:01:08.640 --> 0:01:12.720 thank you, Ryan Barrier. And yes, our podcasts have ads 0:01:12.800 --> 0:01:16.240 that stay current. Even if you were to go back 0:01:16.240 --> 0:01:19.120 and download a very old episode of tech Stuff, you 0:01:19.120 --> 0:01:22.920 would hear current ads in the ad breaks. And as 0:01:23.000 --> 0:01:27.080 you say, the ads are dynamic, we call them dynamic 0:01:27.200 --> 0:01:31.039 ads are really dynamic ad insertions. But let's start off 0:01:31.440 --> 0:01:34.000 with the different kinds of ads that you can encounter 0:01:34.160 --> 0:01:39.000 with podcasts, because it's good to know how advertisers think, 0:01:39.360 --> 0:01:44.680 how content creators think, and the frankly difficult path of 0:01:44.720 --> 0:01:48.520 balancing commerce and art, or in the case of tech stuff, 0:01:48.520 --> 0:01:53.640 commerce and the technology podcast made by a twit. Now, 0:01:53.680 --> 0:01:57.720 this stuff is not going to relate to ads initially. 0:01:57.760 --> 0:02:00.520 I'm going to give a little bit more background, but 0:02:00.760 --> 0:02:02.760 it is important to understand to kind of get a 0:02:02.760 --> 0:02:06.400 grasp on the evolution of podcasting and then the subsequent 0:02:06.520 --> 0:02:12.800 incorporation of ads. Now, in the old old days, most 0:02:12.880 --> 0:02:18.080 podcasts were not really monetized, at least not through advertising. 0:02:18.600 --> 0:02:21.360 It was a brand new medium, and so typically a 0:02:21.400 --> 0:02:25.080 podcast came out of either someone's hobby, so it was 0:02:25.120 --> 0:02:28.800 being done just for fun zies, with no expectation that 0:02:28.880 --> 0:02:31.839 it was going to generate revenue. In fact, more than 0:02:31.919 --> 0:02:34.800 likely it was costing the person who was making the 0:02:34.840 --> 0:02:38.680 podcast money, or it was going to be used as 0:02:38.760 --> 0:02:43.639 an extension of some other media companies output. There were 0:02:43.680 --> 0:02:47.839 a few exceptions. A couple of podcasts set up subscription 0:02:47.919 --> 0:02:51.120 models pretty early on, so they were kind of like 0:02:51.160 --> 0:02:55.280 an audio magazine. Listeners could pay to download episodes month 0:02:55.320 --> 0:02:58.839 to month. So there were some early versions of podcasts 0:02:58.880 --> 0:03:01.760 that were supported directly by listeners, and obviously that model 0:03:01.800 --> 0:03:06.600 still exists today. There are subscription based podcasts out there 0:03:06.600 --> 0:03:11.600 that are behind a paywall in other words, but ads 0:03:11.880 --> 0:03:15.160 really would come a bit later for podcasts. So even 0:03:15.160 --> 0:03:19.840 though there were some early paywall podcasting, there weren't a 0:03:19.840 --> 0:03:23.400 whole lot of podcasts that contain ads early early on. 0:03:24.080 --> 0:03:26.800 Let me give you an example of a podcast that 0:03:26.880 --> 0:03:30.679 was used for brand extension. Uh, there was a podcast 0:03:30.680 --> 0:03:32.880 I used to listen to. It no longer exists. I 0:03:32.919 --> 0:03:35.480 mean you can find old episodes, I imagine, but it's 0:03:35.520 --> 0:03:39.720 no longer produced. And this was way back in like 0:03:39.800 --> 0:03:42.960 the mid two thousand's, before I was ever a podcaster myself. 0:03:43.000 --> 0:03:46.320 It was called buzz out Loud and it came from 0:03:46.480 --> 0:03:50.920 c Net. Tom Merritt and Molly Wood were the the 0:03:50.960 --> 0:03:55.240 anchors of that show, with other hosts and producers also contributing. 0:03:56.040 --> 0:03:59.360 The Buzz out Loud show covered tech news and was 0:03:59.440 --> 0:04:03.440 part of a c net brand, but it wasn't necessarily 0:04:03.560 --> 0:04:08.440 a revenue generating show on its own, at least not 0:04:08.520 --> 0:04:11.560 most of the time. Rather, it was helping you know, 0:04:11.920 --> 0:04:15.640 introduced the brand of c net to new audiences, and 0:04:15.680 --> 0:04:18.480 the hope was that these audiences would then find their 0:04:18.520 --> 0:04:23.039 way to c net dot com, where traffic was monetized 0:04:23.360 --> 0:04:26.120 through various means like web page ads and whatnot, you know, 0:04:26.160 --> 0:04:31.400 all the regular web advertising strategies. Maybe that visitor would 0:04:31.440 --> 0:04:35.080 then become a regular at c net, which means they 0:04:35.120 --> 0:04:39.160 would also be a regular source of revenue, or rather, 0:04:39.960 --> 0:04:42.680 their traffic would be a regular source of revenue. It 0:04:42.720 --> 0:04:45.400 all gets a bit wibbly wobbly when we talk about 0:04:45.400 --> 0:04:49.559 this stuff. Really, whenever you talk about advertising, there's there's 0:04:49.560 --> 0:04:53.640 a level of kind of vague uncertainty in the mix. 0:04:54.600 --> 0:04:57.599 When I started podcasting, which was back in the summer 0:04:57.640 --> 0:05:00.680 of two thousand eight, it was much the same for 0:05:00.800 --> 0:05:04.520 us over at what was then how stuff Works dot Com. 0:05:04.560 --> 0:05:06.880 To be clear, how stuff Works dot Com still exists, 0:05:07.600 --> 0:05:11.920 but my part in How Stuff Works split off several 0:05:12.000 --> 0:05:16.280 years ago and we haven't had any real contact since then. 0:05:17.200 --> 0:05:19.480 But back in two thousand and eight, I was a 0:05:19.520 --> 0:05:22.159 writer for how stuff Works dot com and I focused 0:05:22.200 --> 0:05:27.200 primarily on tech articles. Big surprise there, and our buss 0:05:27.480 --> 0:05:30.080 a guy named Conal Burne who has actually been our 0:05:30.160 --> 0:05:32.960 boss on and off a few times over the years. 0:05:33.000 --> 0:05:35.640 It kind of feels like we would go our separate 0:05:35.680 --> 0:05:38.800 ways and then come back and then do it again. Um. 0:05:38.839 --> 0:05:41.600 He decided in two thousand and eight that podcasting would 0:05:41.600 --> 0:05:44.240 be a good way to extend brand awareness of how 0:05:44.320 --> 0:05:48.240 stuff Works dot com. Uh. The first of those podcasts, 0:05:48.320 --> 0:05:50.839 technically the first, I believe was brain Stuff, which was 0:05:50.880 --> 0:05:54.480 Marshall brains podcast. He was the founder of how stuff 0:05:54.480 --> 0:05:57.840 Works dot com, and then later on that podcast would 0:05:57.839 --> 0:06:00.880 pass to other hands. But the first big one to 0:06:00.960 --> 0:06:04.200 come out that really was the flagship was Stuff You 0:06:04.200 --> 0:06:09.719 Should Know Now. It was important to try and extend 0:06:10.120 --> 0:06:14.200 the brand of how stuff Works dot com because most 0:06:14.279 --> 0:06:18.480 of the traffic coming into the website was from web searches, 0:06:18.760 --> 0:06:22.400 primarily Google. So, in other words, most people who are 0:06:22.440 --> 0:06:25.159 going to how stuff Works dot com, we're not going 0:06:25.200 --> 0:06:29.839 there just to browse articles. Most visitors were not fans 0:06:29.880 --> 0:06:32.120 of the site who just wanted to learn about all 0:06:32.160 --> 0:06:34.839 sorts of stuff, from tech to history to culture to food. 0:06:34.839 --> 0:06:37.560 By the way, how stupp works dot Com still a 0:06:37.600 --> 0:06:43.600 fantastic website with amazing, well written, researched articles, and I 0:06:43.720 --> 0:06:46.160 highly recommend checking it out if you're of a curious 0:06:46.200 --> 0:06:49.400 nature and you want to just learn stuff. But now 0:06:49.560 --> 0:06:51.719 most of the people coming to the website had a 0:06:51.760 --> 0:06:55.120 specific question that they wanted to answer, like how does 0:06:55.160 --> 0:06:58.760 a steam engine work, for example, and they used a 0:06:58.760 --> 0:07:01.039 search engine, our site would pop up and they would 0:07:01.080 --> 0:07:03.760 come into the site to get their answer from one 0:07:03.800 --> 0:07:07.320 of these well written, well researched articles, and then once 0:07:07.320 --> 0:07:10.480 they got their answer, they would bounce. Well, while we 0:07:10.600 --> 0:07:13.040 loved all the traffic coming into the site through search, 0:07:13.480 --> 0:07:15.840 there was no denying that it sure would be nice 0:07:15.880 --> 0:07:18.440 to have folks stick around a bit more and brows 0:07:18.560 --> 0:07:22.400 and become regular visitors. Also, this is a good time 0:07:22.440 --> 0:07:25.800 to mention that search engines change over time. Right. The 0:07:25.840 --> 0:07:29.440 Google search algorithm has changed many times over the years, 0:07:29.840 --> 0:07:32.600 and whenever there's a change in the algorithm, there's a 0:07:32.680 --> 0:07:36.280 change in page rankings, which means you might at one 0:07:36.320 --> 0:07:41.400 point have been the dominant player in search results for 0:07:41.520 --> 0:07:45.920 various topics, and then once there's a change in the algorithm, 0:07:45.920 --> 0:07:48.640 maybe your results appeared lower down on the page or 0:07:48.840 --> 0:07:52.520 or worst case scenario, off of page one. Because hardly 0:07:52.560 --> 0:07:55.280 anyone goes beyond page one of search results. Hardly anyone 0:07:55.320 --> 0:07:59.720 goes below the fold. So not being highly ranked in 0:07:59.760 --> 0:08:03.360 SIR could be a death sentence if you were depending 0:08:03.360 --> 0:08:08.240 heavily upon traffic coming from search engines. So again a 0:08:08.360 --> 0:08:12.160 strong incentive to find a way to bring people over 0:08:12.240 --> 0:08:17.800 to the website beyond just searching for a specific answer. Right. So, 0:08:18.800 --> 0:08:25.040 the podcasts, while not initially monetize herble directly themselves, we're 0:08:25.040 --> 0:08:29.440 seeing almost like an advertising tool for the website. In fact, 0:08:29.720 --> 0:08:34.319 when we first launched the podcasts, we had a rule 0:08:35.120 --> 0:08:39.600 every episode needed to relate to a specific article on 0:08:39.640 --> 0:08:43.400 the website, and we would refer listeners to go and 0:08:43.480 --> 0:08:46.200 read those articles in the hopes that they actually would 0:08:46.440 --> 0:08:49.480 go check those articles out and then maybe branch out 0:08:49.520 --> 0:08:52.400 from there and explore the site. We were trying to 0:08:52.480 --> 0:08:56.920 make How Stuff Works a destination site. UH that had 0:08:57.160 --> 0:08:59.560 limited success as far as I'm aware. I mean I 0:08:59.600 --> 0:09:03.400 wasn't and analytics, so I couldn't really see what, if 0:09:03.440 --> 0:09:07.880 any effect this had. However, we did not too long 0:09:07.920 --> 0:09:12.680 after that mandate dropped the requirements so that different podcasts 0:09:12.760 --> 0:09:18.000 could actually do UH topics that were not directly related 0:09:18.080 --> 0:09:21.320 to an article on the site, And we dropped it 0:09:21.480 --> 0:09:23.960 immediately over at tech Stuff because a lot of the 0:09:24.040 --> 0:09:28.720 articles that were on the site that we're relating to technology, 0:09:29.280 --> 0:09:32.280 Obviously they would get out of date very quickly because 0:09:32.280 --> 0:09:35.400 technology evolved so fast, and so we would have an 0:09:35.480 --> 0:09:38.400 article of and the examples in an article might be 0:09:38.440 --> 0:09:42.240 really kind of embarrassing in in retrospect, Like if you're 0:09:42.640 --> 0:09:47.160 doing an article or a podcast about CPUs and the 0:09:47.320 --> 0:09:52.000 article is talking about pentium processors, that's kind of embarrassing 0:09:52.040 --> 0:09:57.400 because those are dinosaurs. Right. So anyway, we switched over, 0:09:57.840 --> 0:10:01.920 and you know, it also turned out that it's it's 0:10:01.960 --> 0:10:04.960 a difficult cell to convince someone who's listening to a 0:10:04.960 --> 0:10:08.880 podcast to then go to a specific U r L right, 0:10:09.000 --> 0:10:12.000 because it all depends on how they're listening. If they're 0:10:12.200 --> 0:10:14.319 jogging and they're listening on headphones, they're not going to 0:10:14.440 --> 0:10:17.920 stop and pull out their phone and navigate to the website. 0:10:18.440 --> 0:10:21.720 If they're driving, I sure as heck hope they aren't 0:10:21.720 --> 0:10:25.040 going to stop, uh paying attention to the road and 0:10:25.080 --> 0:10:27.760 then try and navigate to this website to read an 0:10:27.840 --> 0:10:32.280 article while they're driving. So yeah, it was tough to 0:10:32.400 --> 0:10:35.440 use podcasts in this way. And honestly, there could have 0:10:35.559 --> 0:10:38.960 been the chance for podcasts at how Stuff works to 0:10:39.040 --> 0:10:45.960 just go away because the limited return on investment, But 0:10:46.040 --> 0:10:50.000 we stuck with it and we grew, and that would 0:10:50.120 --> 0:10:55.520 end up paying off because eventually, not immediately, but over time, 0:10:55.679 --> 0:11:01.760 podcasting would become a relevant way of generating revenue all 0:11:01.800 --> 0:11:06.160 on its own thanks to advertising. Okay, now, before we 0:11:06.200 --> 0:11:09.360 get into that, it's time to have an example. We're 0:11:09.360 --> 0:11:12.079 going to actually take an ad break right now. We'll 0:11:12.120 --> 0:11:25.480 be right back. Okay. So podcasts when they start off 0:11:25.640 --> 0:11:29.680 aren't really monetized beyond being behind a paywall in some 0:11:30.000 --> 0:11:36.200 rare instances, but let's skip ahead. Gradually, some brands, particularly 0:11:36.240 --> 0:11:40.160 of smaller companies, started seeing the possibility of reaching customers 0:11:40.360 --> 0:11:45.560 through podcasts, and that opened up some opportunities on all sides. 0:11:45.960 --> 0:11:49.440 One opportunity was to have an ad baked into a podcast. 0:11:49.720 --> 0:11:53.120 Another opportunity was to pay for a fully sponsored and 0:11:53.240 --> 0:11:58.320 possibly themed episode. That second option is more expensive, and 0:11:58.400 --> 0:12:01.760 it also means that a single advertiser pretty much has 0:12:01.880 --> 0:12:04.840 domain over the whole episode, so in other words, you 0:12:04.880 --> 0:12:08.760 won't hear ads from other brands appear in that episode. 0:12:09.520 --> 0:12:14.000 But let's talk about baked in ads or burned in ads, 0:12:14.040 --> 0:12:17.360 depending upon whom you're talking to. Now, back in the 0:12:17.400 --> 0:12:23.840 old days, there really wasn't any sophisticated content management system 0:12:24.080 --> 0:12:27.440 for podcasts. So the way it worked was you would 0:12:27.480 --> 0:12:31.600 record your audio, maybe you edit it, you might add 0:12:31.640 --> 0:12:34.439 in some music and some other stuff, maybe other effects. 0:12:34.559 --> 0:12:39.120 Then you would publish this finished audio file on a 0:12:39.200 --> 0:12:44.920 publication platform. That platform would then push the podcasts RSS 0:12:45.000 --> 0:12:50.520 feed to the various podcatching services out there, most notably iTunes. 0:12:50.760 --> 0:12:55.679 Back in the day, iTunes was the dominant source for podcasts. 0:12:55.679 --> 0:12:58.600 In fact that we call them podcasts because of the iPod. 0:12:58.760 --> 0:13:02.600 So Apple, while it had not invented either the MP 0:13:02.720 --> 0:13:06.360 three player or the podcast, was kind of the the 0:13:06.559 --> 0:13:10.199 nexus of all things podcast in the early days. Now 0:13:10.240 --> 0:13:12.520 to this day, iTunes is still a really important piece 0:13:12.559 --> 0:13:15.720 of the puzzle. Interestingly, a lot of the tech stuff 0:13:15.760 --> 0:13:19.000 listeners out there are getting this show through other podcatching 0:13:19.040 --> 0:13:21.840 services because I can see that a ton of y'all 0:13:21.880 --> 0:13:24.720 are listening on Android devices, which is, you know, awesome, 0:13:24.840 --> 0:13:28.960 and I also listen on an Android device. So yeah, 0:13:29.000 --> 0:13:31.559 we're kind of an outlier because a lot of podcasts 0:13:31.640 --> 0:13:35.240 still get the majority of their traffic through iTunes. All right, 0:13:35.720 --> 0:13:39.840 So originally most of the companies that would actually purchase 0:13:39.920 --> 0:13:44.360 advertising on podcasts were these smaller companies that could not 0:13:44.520 --> 0:13:49.600 necessarily afford a big national campaign on you know, traditional 0:13:49.640 --> 0:13:55.800 media like TV and radio, but podcasts also have national 0:13:56.120 --> 0:14:01.079 or global reach, and podcasts were not nearly as expensive 0:14:01.120 --> 0:14:04.800 to use for advertising. Heck, there were podcasts out there 0:14:05.200 --> 0:14:09.240 that had no idea what ad rates to charge or 0:14:09.240 --> 0:14:12.320 what metrics to use in order to guide negotiations. It 0:14:12.400 --> 0:14:16.320 was really messy and chaotic. Now it would all more 0:14:16.440 --> 0:14:18.920 or less get worked out over time, but in those 0:14:18.960 --> 0:14:23.000 early days it was It was just confusing because no 0:14:23.040 --> 0:14:28.600 one really had any way of of quantifying what add 0:14:28.720 --> 0:14:33.040 time on a podcast was worth. Anyway, a baked in 0:14:33.320 --> 0:14:37.440 AD is one that's recorded right inside of a show itself. 0:14:37.920 --> 0:14:41.200 It is part of the audio file. So you might 0:14:41.200 --> 0:14:45.600 be talking about like a transponder one moment. Then you 0:14:45.680 --> 0:14:48.560 might say in the podcast, before we go any further, 0:14:48.720 --> 0:14:51.880 let's talk about our sponsor blah blah blah, and then 0:14:51.920 --> 0:14:55.000 you might transition right into an AD, and it's all 0:14:55.040 --> 0:14:57.480 part of the same recording session. It's all part of 0:14:57.480 --> 0:15:00.400 the same file. And most of the ads back in 0:15:00.400 --> 0:15:05.600 those days were what we would call direct response advertising. Now, 0:15:05.640 --> 0:15:08.480 this is a kind of ad that asks the listener 0:15:08.640 --> 0:15:13.880 to take some sort of immediate action, such as purchasing 0:15:13.880 --> 0:15:18.280 a product or service, and there's typically a code associated 0:15:18.600 --> 0:15:23.040 with whichever podcast has the ad in it. And when 0:15:23.080 --> 0:15:25.560 you hear me in an ad say something like use 0:15:25.640 --> 0:15:29.600 promo code stuff or something like that, that is a 0:15:29.640 --> 0:15:34.760 direct response ad. The ads efficacy is largely measured by 0:15:34.800 --> 0:15:37.440 how many folks actually went to the trouble of going 0:15:37.680 --> 0:15:40.880 to the site and using that promo code. Now, in 0:15:40.880 --> 0:15:42.760 the old days, you'd hear a lot of the same 0:15:42.800 --> 0:15:48.520 companies advertising across different shows, like Casper Mattresses and Meanis 0:15:48.640 --> 0:15:53.040 and Dollar Shave Club and stitch Fix. These are all 0:15:53.520 --> 0:15:56.120 great companies. By the way, I actually really liked working 0:15:56.400 --> 0:15:59.840 with all of these brands. They were great, and it 0:16:00.080 --> 0:16:02.400 was it was kind of a rising tide lifts all 0:16:02.520 --> 0:16:08.200 ships because I really believed in the products. So listeners, 0:16:08.280 --> 0:16:11.560 if they were using the the code, we're getting products 0:16:11.600 --> 0:16:14.280 that I believed in. They were getting a discount, so 0:16:14.400 --> 0:16:17.160 that was the benefit to the listeners, and the brands 0:16:17.240 --> 0:16:22.840 were getting broader reach across and more customers, so everybody 0:16:22.880 --> 0:16:25.800 was winning. So it was kind of like a a 0:16:25.880 --> 0:16:29.720 bootstrap approach to business, you know. These were companies that 0:16:29.760 --> 0:16:36.120 again probably would have had trouble accessing traditional media on 0:16:36.160 --> 0:16:38.960 a national level, and here they were being able to 0:16:39.000 --> 0:16:42.440 tap into something that was having an incredible impact. Like 0:16:42.520 --> 0:16:46.480 the podcasting experience is a very intimate one. It has 0:16:46.520 --> 0:16:50.360 this relationship between host and listener, and especially a host 0:16:50.400 --> 0:16:54.840 red ad can have a huge impact on listeners, particularly 0:16:54.920 --> 0:16:57.920 the host is being sincere about it. So yeah, it 0:16:58.000 --> 0:17:02.160 was this kind of magical com nation right now. Podcasting 0:17:02.920 --> 0:17:06.280 was growing in popularity in general. I mean you kept 0:17:06.320 --> 0:17:11.760 on seeing news about podcasting his back or the podcasting renaissance, 0:17:11.800 --> 0:17:13.960 and you would have people who have been podcasting that 0:17:14.040 --> 0:17:16.840 whole time saying, don't call to come back, I've been 0:17:16.880 --> 0:17:21.280 here for years. Shout out the Scott Johnson um and 0:17:21.359 --> 0:17:25.240 some podcasts were doing really, really well, right Some would 0:17:25.280 --> 0:17:29.919 go on to be like the superstars of the medium. Like, 0:17:30.240 --> 0:17:34.760 you know, I'm not a fan of his his beliefs 0:17:34.960 --> 0:17:40.520 or his delivery, but there's no denying Joe Rogan hit 0:17:40.600 --> 0:17:44.240 the stratosphere as far as podcasting is concerned, and he 0:17:44.320 --> 0:17:46.800 launched that show I think in two thousand nine. So 0:17:47.600 --> 0:17:49.840 this was that's an example of a show the win 0:17:49.920 --> 0:17:52.879 to the stratosphere. Here at at I Heart and actually 0:17:52.880 --> 0:17:55.960 previously at How Stuff Works. Our big flagship show was 0:17:56.119 --> 0:17:58.919 Stuff you Should Know. I'll mention them again in a 0:17:58.920 --> 0:18:02.600 little bit. So this opened up the opportunity to do 0:18:02.840 --> 0:18:06.879 sponsored and themed episodes because the shows were getting to 0:18:06.920 --> 0:18:10.000 a point where if you were an advertiser, and you 0:18:10.040 --> 0:18:13.160 are an advertising client maybe who had the money, then 0:18:13.280 --> 0:18:16.720 getting a sponsored show could be really attractive because of 0:18:16.760 --> 0:18:20.320 the reach of these podcasts. But this is where things 0:18:20.320 --> 0:18:25.760 get really tricky, um because this is where you've got 0:18:25.800 --> 0:18:31.240 increased overlap between advertising and editorial content, and that can 0:18:31.320 --> 0:18:37.840 produce like advertorial content is one of the phrases for it. 0:18:37.840 --> 0:18:40.520 It's one I hate, but it is what it's often 0:18:40.680 --> 0:18:44.880 used to describe a show that is supposed to combine 0:18:45.600 --> 0:18:51.480 the promotion of a sponsor with the content itself. Now, ideally, 0:18:52.160 --> 0:18:57.199 a themed podcast, a themed sponsored podcast should appeal to 0:18:57.320 --> 0:19:01.640 regular listeners, even if it was themed to promote whatever 0:19:01.720 --> 0:19:05.640 sponsor was sponsoring the episode. If it is done poorly, 0:19:06.119 --> 0:19:08.080 then the episode is going to come across as a 0:19:08.200 --> 0:19:12.600 very long advertisement for the respective sponsor. And ain't no 0:19:12.640 --> 0:19:16.160 one out there who loves that. Apart from advertising executives, 0:19:16.200 --> 0:19:18.800 who seem to think it's a win, even though that 0:19:18.880 --> 0:19:22.880 kind of content almost never performs well once it's released. Now, 0:19:22.880 --> 0:19:26.840 there are ways to do a themed sponsored episode well, 0:19:27.359 --> 0:19:30.120 but that approach is delicate and needs a really good 0:19:30.200 --> 0:19:34.560 level of understanding between the content creators, the advertising reps, 0:19:34.760 --> 0:19:37.640 and the sponsor itself in order to make it happen. 0:19:38.160 --> 0:19:41.359 And frankly, it always surprises me when I encounter folks 0:19:41.400 --> 0:19:45.639 pushing to make a show more explicitly an ad for 0:19:45.720 --> 0:19:49.520 a company or its products and services or whatever, because 0:19:49.560 --> 0:19:53.679 I maintain audiences are really smart. I mean, we all 0:19:53.720 --> 0:19:57.080 know how to spot and add. We've been encountering ads 0:19:57.160 --> 0:20:01.120 our entire lives, so of course we know an ad 0:20:01.359 --> 0:20:04.480 right away. And if we suspect someone is trying to 0:20:04.520 --> 0:20:08.919 pass off and add as quote unquote real content, we 0:20:09.040 --> 0:20:12.520 get irritated about it because we feel like the content 0:20:12.560 --> 0:20:17.240 creator doesn't respect our intelligence. Right It's like the content 0:20:17.280 --> 0:20:21.440 creator is trying to pass off this advertisement as if 0:20:22.000 --> 0:20:26.800 it is otherwise content and they would have created anyway, 0:20:26.920 --> 0:20:30.760 And the disingenuous nature of that offends a lot of people, 0:20:30.800 --> 0:20:33.760 including me. I mean, I I'm likely to bounce off 0:20:33.800 --> 0:20:37.040 a video or a podcast if I sense that it's 0:20:37.119 --> 0:20:40.480 not a genuine piece of work and is instead an 0:20:40.480 --> 0:20:44.320 add masquerading as an episode. Now, all that being said, 0:20:44.640 --> 0:20:48.040 some of the best episodes of some podcasts have come 0:20:48.080 --> 0:20:51.760 from sponsored and themed episodes. It can be done. It 0:20:51.840 --> 0:20:54.800 just takes a real collaborative effort of all the parties 0:20:54.840 --> 0:20:57.720 involved and an understanding on the part of the sponsor 0:20:57.760 --> 0:21:01.879 and the ad reps that pushing their narrative too hard 0:21:02.520 --> 0:21:06.040 is going to have the opposite effect that they want. Now, 0:21:06.119 --> 0:21:12.080 let's move on to dynamic ad insertion, which actually I 0:21:12.119 --> 0:21:15.439 guess I'll get to after we take this break for 0:21:15.520 --> 0:21:29.240 a couple more ads. Okay, dynamic ad insertion. As podcasting 0:21:29.280 --> 0:21:33.520 grew in popularity, you had companies that were creating more 0:21:33.560 --> 0:21:38.359 sophisticated tools for publishing and hosting podcasts, Like there was 0:21:38.400 --> 0:21:41.760 an industry there, so there was an incentive to innovate 0:21:41.880 --> 0:21:46.040 in the space. And one tool, one that was already 0:21:46.040 --> 0:21:50.280 in use on the Worldwide Web, was dynamic ad insertion, 0:21:50.800 --> 0:21:53.520 and it does exactly what it says on the ten. 0:21:54.560 --> 0:21:58.680 Dynamic ad insertion is the practice of inserting ads at 0:21:58.720 --> 0:22:04.040 the time someone encounters the content. So when someone downloads 0:22:04.040 --> 0:22:07.400 a podcast or when they stream an episode, that's when 0:22:07.400 --> 0:22:10.159 the AD gets inserted. So instead of having a baked 0:22:10.200 --> 0:22:12.919 in AD that was recorded at the time that the 0:22:12.960 --> 0:22:17.440 podcast itself was recorded, the dynamic ad insertion tool plops 0:22:17.480 --> 0:22:21.399 a current AD into the ad breaks. That means, if 0:22:21.400 --> 0:22:25.320 you download an episode today and someone you know downloads 0:22:25.400 --> 0:22:28.919 the same episode a year later, the two of you 0:22:28.960 --> 0:22:31.600 are going to encounter different ads at the time that 0:22:31.680 --> 0:22:34.320 you listen to the show when you hit those AD breaks. 0:22:34.760 --> 0:22:37.679 And the way this works from our side is pretty simple. 0:22:38.000 --> 0:22:41.040 We create AD breaks in our show now some folks 0:22:41.119 --> 0:22:44.960 like yours. Truly, We do that as we record, so 0:22:45.440 --> 0:22:47.480 you've heard it in this episode. I just keep an 0:22:47.520 --> 0:22:51.400 eye on the time, and when I hit certain time lines, 0:22:51.600 --> 0:22:53.600 I will pause to throw in an AD break. We 0:22:53.680 --> 0:22:59.320 have UH standards in our our company about how many 0:22:59.359 --> 0:23:02.000 AD breaks go into a show based upon how long 0:23:02.080 --> 0:23:05.399 the episode is. So if my episode is going to 0:23:05.440 --> 0:23:08.560 be longer than say twenty minutes, I know that I 0:23:08.600 --> 0:23:11.200 need to put an AD break in every ten minutes 0:23:11.280 --> 0:23:14.000 or so. If it's gonna be like five minutes, I 0:23:14.040 --> 0:23:17.040 can go to like fifteen minutes or so. It again 0:23:17.119 --> 0:23:19.800 depends upon the length of the episode, and I'm not 0:23:19.840 --> 0:23:22.240 going to give all the details about it, because one 0:23:22.480 --> 0:23:25.600 those change over time, so I can't guarantee that by 0:23:25.600 --> 0:23:27.440 the time you listen to this it will be the same. 0:23:27.480 --> 0:23:32.360 And too, it really doesn't matter. So I pause my episode, 0:23:32.400 --> 0:23:34.840 I'll throw in an ad break, and then my super 0:23:34.960 --> 0:23:39.679 editor Torii can, while editing, chop the episode there and 0:23:39.800 --> 0:23:43.480 insert a little digital marker, and that digital marker essentially 0:23:43.520 --> 0:23:47.400 tells our publication platform here is where you can put 0:23:47.440 --> 0:23:50.720 a mid role ad. Mid role is just a type 0:23:50.720 --> 0:23:52.720 of ad that appears in the middle of a show. 0:23:52.800 --> 0:23:55.600 You also have pre role obviously that happens before a 0:23:55.640 --> 0:23:59.000 show starts, and post roll those are ads that play 0:23:59.160 --> 0:24:04.000 after a show ends. Then I just picked back up 0:24:04.040 --> 0:24:06.280 and carry on until I hit the next benchmark, and 0:24:06.280 --> 0:24:10.200 then I insert a new ad break throw and Torii 0:24:10.400 --> 0:24:12.560 chops the show there when she's editing and puts in 0:24:12.560 --> 0:24:17.520 another digital marker. Now that little digital marker that TRY 0:24:17.640 --> 0:24:21.160 adds in is really the secret sauce, and we typically 0:24:21.160 --> 0:24:25.399 have parameters set for what our ads can be in 0:24:25.480 --> 0:24:30.520 our various positions, So mid role ads tend to be 0:24:30.680 --> 0:24:33.840 sixty seconds long each. Now once in a while we 0:24:33.920 --> 0:24:37.879 might have a longer ad depending upon the specific AD deal. 0:24:38.440 --> 0:24:41.480 Like you could have a two minute AD instead of 0:24:41.480 --> 0:24:43.719 a sixty second AD, but then that would essentially take 0:24:43.800 --> 0:24:47.080 up two slots in your AD break, Right, So each 0:24:47.119 --> 0:24:50.000 AD break allows a certain number of ads per break, 0:24:50.080 --> 0:24:54.240 or really a certain amount of AD time per break. Now, 0:24:55.359 --> 0:24:57.359 why would you want to use dynamic ads in the 0:24:57.359 --> 0:25:00.719 first place. Well, to understand that, it's helpful understand a 0:25:00.760 --> 0:25:05.720 little bit about AD deals themselves. Typically, an AD deal 0:25:05.880 --> 0:25:08.760 is made to either last a specific amount of time 0:25:09.240 --> 0:25:13.520 or more frequently, in order to reach a specific number 0:25:13.560 --> 0:25:17.840 of impressions. Now, impressions means the number of times that 0:25:17.880 --> 0:25:23.359 particular AD was downloaded or streamed. So let's say we 0:25:23.400 --> 0:25:28.160 strike a deal with I don't know, the ACME corporation 0:25:28.320 --> 0:25:31.320 from the old Warner Brothers cartoons, and we're trying to 0:25:31.320 --> 0:25:35.480 sell anvils. So our deal is to hit one thousand 0:25:35.520 --> 0:25:39.760 impressions with this hypothetical AD deal. So ACNE pays us 0:25:39.800 --> 0:25:43.399 whatever our AD rate is to reach that impression limit, 0:25:43.960 --> 0:25:47.480 and we get to work on delivering those impressions by 0:25:47.640 --> 0:25:52.399 getting people to download a hundred thousand episodes or stream 0:25:52.400 --> 0:25:55.239 a hundred thousand episodes that have or or you know, 0:25:55.359 --> 0:25:58.520 instances that have that AD in them. Now, if you 0:25:58.560 --> 0:26:02.000 have a baked in AD where you've actually recorded it 0:26:02.080 --> 0:26:04.879 within the body of the podcast and it's not something 0:26:04.920 --> 0:26:11.160