1 00:00:06,240 --> 00:00:09,240 Speaker 1: Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. Today is Saturday, 2 00:00:09,280 --> 00:00:11,600 Speaker 1: so we have another vault episode for you. This is 3 00:00:11,640 --> 00:00:14,240 Speaker 1: going to be Hunters of the Dark Ocean, Part two 4 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:21,200 Speaker 1: of four. Originally published three twenty five, twenty twenty five. Yes, sorry, 5 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:23,320 Speaker 1: there was an error in my numbers here. I did 6 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:25,360 Speaker 1: not have the final number of the year, but had 7 00:00:25,360 --> 00:00:27,159 Speaker 1: to be twenty twenty five, right, I think that's what 8 00:00:27,200 --> 00:00:29,760 Speaker 1: I said last time. At any rate, let's get deep, 9 00:00:29,800 --> 00:00:33,600 Speaker 1: let's get weird. This is a fun one. 10 00:00:34,960 --> 00:00:41,760 Speaker 2: Welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind, production of iHeartRadio. 11 00:00:44,800 --> 00:00:47,000 Speaker 1: Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind. My name 12 00:00:47,040 --> 00:00:48,040 Speaker 1: is Robert Lamb. 13 00:00:48,120 --> 00:00:50,840 Speaker 3: And I am Joe McCormick, and we're back with part 14 00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:54,360 Speaker 3: two in a series we are calling Hunters of the 15 00:00:54,480 --> 00:00:59,600 Speaker 3: Dark Ocean, focusing on predators that operate in deep marine 16 00:01:00,160 --> 00:01:04,280 Speaker 3: environments and folks. Full disclosure, if we sound like we're 17 00:01:04,319 --> 00:01:07,000 Speaker 3: broadcasting from the bottom of the sea ourselves today, I 18 00:01:07,000 --> 00:01:09,560 Speaker 3: think Rob and I are both maybe operating at lower 19 00:01:09,560 --> 00:01:12,560 Speaker 3: power than usual. I don't know. Do do you have 20 00:01:12,600 --> 00:01:13,360 Speaker 3: a story here. 21 00:01:13,280 --> 00:01:16,679 Speaker 1: Rob, Oh, just that I'm battling a cold and as 22 00:01:16,720 --> 00:01:19,480 Speaker 1: of right now, all the cold medicine is like firing 23 00:01:19,760 --> 00:01:20,880 Speaker 1: at full throttle. 24 00:01:21,160 --> 00:01:23,319 Speaker 3: Oh nice, So we timed it just right. 25 00:01:23,720 --> 00:01:26,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, time to just write. It may wear off halfway through, 26 00:01:26,680 --> 00:01:29,600 Speaker 1: and you need the listener and to get to appreciate, 27 00:01:29,680 --> 00:01:33,560 Speaker 1: like a slightly gravelly sexier voice from me as we 28 00:01:33,680 --> 00:01:36,720 Speaker 1: discuss various slimy creatures that live in the depths. 29 00:01:37,000 --> 00:01:40,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, so I was up a lot last night. It's 30 00:01:41,040 --> 00:01:46,480 Speaker 3: just childcare related lack of sleep. But hey, here we are. 31 00:01:46,600 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 3: We're coming to you once again, folks. So brief recap 32 00:01:50,440 --> 00:01:54,280 Speaker 3: on part one of this series. In the last episode, 33 00:01:54,640 --> 00:01:58,880 Speaker 3: we kicked things off talking about the science news story 34 00:01:58,920 --> 00:02:01,520 Speaker 3: that originally inspired to look at this topic of deep 35 00:02:01,600 --> 00:02:06,160 Speaker 3: ocean predators. That was a paper published last November in 36 00:02:06,200 --> 00:02:10,480 Speaker 3: the journal Systematics and Biodiversity by Weston at All documenting 37 00:02:10,520 --> 00:02:15,919 Speaker 3: a newly discovered genus and species of predatory crustation which 38 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:20,000 Speaker 3: is found in the Atacama Trench in the southeastern Pacific. 39 00:02:20,480 --> 00:02:23,639 Speaker 3: The species was given the name del Sabella common chaka 40 00:02:23,960 --> 00:02:27,079 Speaker 3: the Sugary Darkness. As we talked about and oh boy, 41 00:02:27,160 --> 00:02:30,200 Speaker 3: that really sent us down a rabbit hole of scrutinizing 42 00:02:30,280 --> 00:02:34,400 Speaker 3: bizarre deep sea amphipod body forms. It was a good time. Yes, 43 00:02:35,040 --> 00:02:39,359 Speaker 3: we also talked a bit about the general challenges facing organisms, 44 00:02:39,400 --> 00:02:42,560 Speaker 3: including predators that live in the deepest parts of the ocean, 45 00:02:43,000 --> 00:02:48,239 Speaker 3: not just pressure, darkness, and cold, but also unique resource challenges. 46 00:02:48,560 --> 00:02:51,280 Speaker 3: Since sunlight doesn't reach the bottom of the ocean, it 47 00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:56,160 Speaker 3: is generally devoid of the primary photosynthetic organisms that form 48 00:02:56,240 --> 00:02:59,440 Speaker 3: the base of the food chain at the surface. Instead, 49 00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:02,480 Speaker 3: the deep ocean food chain tends to build off of 50 00:03:02,520 --> 00:03:07,320 Speaker 3: a couple of things. First, chemosynthetic organisms like bacteria and 51 00:03:07,480 --> 00:03:11,639 Speaker 3: archia that feed off of hydrogen, sulfide and other compounds 52 00:03:11,639 --> 00:03:16,079 Speaker 3: from geological sources like hydrothermal vents. And then second, dead 53 00:03:16,360 --> 00:03:20,520 Speaker 3: organic material and detritus that rains down from the sun 54 00:03:20,560 --> 00:03:25,400 Speaker 3: touched ocean above. This is sometimes called marine snow. It 55 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:30,280 Speaker 3: includes everything from fecal matter and tiny dead organisms sinking down, 56 00:03:30,680 --> 00:03:33,560 Speaker 3: things sinking down of every shape and size. And we 57 00:03:33,600 --> 00:03:38,280 Speaker 3: also talked about the fascinating temporary ecosystems that spring up 58 00:03:38,360 --> 00:03:41,680 Speaker 3: around a big payload that falls from above like a 59 00:03:41,720 --> 00:03:44,560 Speaker 3: whale carcass when it hits the bottom and the abyssle 60 00:03:44,640 --> 00:03:45,560 Speaker 3: or hatal zone. 61 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:48,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, and one of the things too, that we're driving 62 00:03:48,360 --> 00:03:49,880 Speaker 1: home in that episode, and we're going to continue to 63 00:03:49,880 --> 00:03:56,160 Speaker 1: stress here and subsequent episodes, is that there is a 64 00:03:56,160 --> 00:04:01,760 Speaker 1: great deal of biodiversity in these depths. It basically runs 65 00:04:01,920 --> 00:04:05,640 Speaker 1: opposite of what the prevailing theory was at one point 66 00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:09,040 Speaker 1: that you would just see a steady decline in biodiversity 67 00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:11,880 Speaker 1: down to nothing and there would just be no life 68 00:04:11,920 --> 00:04:14,640 Speaker 1: in the ocean past certain depths. And we know that's 69 00:04:14,640 --> 00:04:17,159 Speaker 1: not the case now, in part due to things like 70 00:04:17,240 --> 00:04:22,480 Speaker 1: the marine snow, the whale falls, and those hydrothermal environments 71 00:04:22,520 --> 00:04:25,600 Speaker 1: as well, but also just in general creatures that have 72 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:30,599 Speaker 1: evolved to thrive at depths that we used to think 73 00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:32,440 Speaker 1: we're maybe just not possible. 74 00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:36,320 Speaker 3: But anyway, back to recapping part one. After we talked 75 00:04:36,360 --> 00:04:39,520 Speaker 3: about those general issues and talked about the predatory amphipod, 76 00:04:40,080 --> 00:04:43,240 Speaker 3: we looked at a totally different order of oceanic predators 77 00:04:43,360 --> 00:04:48,680 Speaker 3: known as sciphonophores, and we discussed the fascinating way that 78 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:52,640 Speaker 3: their bodies are put together, the versions of these organisms 79 00:04:52,680 --> 00:04:54,720 Speaker 3: that are as long as a whale as thin as 80 00:04:54,720 --> 00:04:58,159 Speaker 3: a rail, catching prey in a sort of net made 81 00:04:58,240 --> 00:05:01,479 Speaker 3: from their own bodies. And then we discussed how despite 82 00:05:01,720 --> 00:05:06,320 Speaker 3: most sightings of siphonophores occurring at less extreme depths, rob 83 00:05:06,360 --> 00:05:09,919 Speaker 3: you turned up some research that included probable sightings of 84 00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:14,600 Speaker 3: predatory ciphonophores at Haitel depths down within the Mariana Trench. 85 00:05:15,040 --> 00:05:17,840 Speaker 3: That's right, and so today we're back to discuss more. 86 00:05:18,080 --> 00:05:20,560 Speaker 1: Now before we jump back in with the predators, though, 87 00:05:20,600 --> 00:05:24,200 Speaker 1: I want to just quickly discuss an example of a 88 00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:28,680 Speaker 1: scavenging organism in the mid depths, a polychet worm called 89 00:05:29,839 --> 00:05:35,159 Speaker 1: pobious messeis, or simply the balloon worm is. It's more practical, 90 00:05:35,480 --> 00:05:38,239 Speaker 1: it's more common name because it does look like a balloon. 91 00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:41,440 Speaker 1: It has a small body, it's like one point five 92 00:05:41,480 --> 00:05:44,680 Speaker 1: inches or thirty six millimeters long, and it kind of 93 00:05:44,720 --> 00:05:47,640 Speaker 1: looks like I've seen it described as like a plastic bag, 94 00:05:48,080 --> 00:05:52,600 Speaker 1: like a plastic bag that is filled with fluid. It's 95 00:05:52,680 --> 00:05:57,880 Speaker 1: very translucent looking, and basically that marine snow. All of 96 00:05:57,920 --> 00:06:01,560 Speaker 1: those bits of flesh, fish poop, and other organic detritus 97 00:06:01,640 --> 00:06:05,560 Speaker 1: that just drifts down from the depths above. That's literally 98 00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:09,120 Speaker 1: all this thing eats. And these things are quite abundant, 99 00:06:09,160 --> 00:06:11,920 Speaker 1: according to the Monterey Bay Aquarium Research Institute. They play 100 00:06:11,960 --> 00:06:15,560 Speaker 1: a key role in cycling nutrients like carbon from the 101 00:06:15,600 --> 00:06:19,760 Speaker 1: ocean's surface down into its depths, and also no doubt, 102 00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:23,640 Speaker 1: these are the prey animals for various predators and the 103 00:06:23,680 --> 00:06:24,360 Speaker 1: depths as well. 104 00:06:25,560 --> 00:06:27,599 Speaker 3: Yeah, and that lines up with something we talked about 105 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:31,160 Speaker 3: in Part one, where in these deep habitats a lot 106 00:06:31,200 --> 00:06:34,960 Speaker 3: of the main prey species being scavengers. So again we 107 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:38,680 Speaker 3: got this, you know, the kind of marine debris, organic 108 00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:41,840 Speaker 3: debris of various kinds raining down from above. Then you've 109 00:06:41,839 --> 00:06:45,000 Speaker 3: got the animals that scavenge off of that dead material, 110 00:06:45,080 --> 00:06:48,160 Speaker 3: and then you've got the predators that come and eat 111 00:06:48,200 --> 00:06:51,839 Speaker 3: those scavengers. And then perhaps also you may have predators 112 00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:54,919 Speaker 3: that eat those predators, but certainly you have lots of 113 00:06:54,920 --> 00:06:58,400 Speaker 3: predators that eat the scavenging things, scavenging things like amphipods 114 00:06:58,400 --> 00:07:01,840 Speaker 3: that we talked about last time. So there is an 115 00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:04,159 Speaker 3: animal that I want to bring up, a deep sea 116 00:07:04,200 --> 00:07:07,440 Speaker 3: predator that I came across just kind of randomly, that 117 00:07:07,839 --> 00:07:10,200 Speaker 3: I wanted to focus on for a bit because yes, 118 00:07:10,280 --> 00:07:12,559 Speaker 3: it looks weird, but it looks weird in a way 119 00:07:12,920 --> 00:07:16,240 Speaker 3: that is biologically connected to some themes we've been exploring 120 00:07:16,280 --> 00:07:19,720 Speaker 3: and will continue to explore some more. And that is 121 00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:25,240 Speaker 3: an abyssle predator known as Ipknop's mede or the gridi fish. 122 00:07:25,280 --> 00:07:29,480 Speaker 3: So that genus and species is spelled ip and ops 123 00:07:29,680 --> 00:07:33,560 Speaker 3: and the species is Miadi. I want to give a 124 00:07:33,560 --> 00:07:36,240 Speaker 3: shout out to the place where I learned about this fish. 125 00:07:36,840 --> 00:07:40,640 Speaker 3: It was in a mission log hosted on the NAA 126 00:07:40,960 --> 00:07:46,040 Speaker 3: Ocean Exploration Hub from May twenty seventeen by an oceanographer 127 00:07:46,200 --> 00:07:50,160 Speaker 3: named Astroid Lightner at the time of the University of 128 00:07:50,160 --> 00:07:52,440 Speaker 3: Hawaii at Manoa. I looked her up, and I believe 129 00:07:52,480 --> 00:07:56,680 Speaker 3: she's now affiliated with Oregon State University. But in this post, 130 00:07:56,840 --> 00:07:59,760 Speaker 3: Lightner is talking about what she and a group of 131 00:07:59,800 --> 00:08:04,840 Speaker 3: call colleagues found during one particular exploration dive in the 132 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:11,360 Speaker 3: Central Pacific Basin, specifically a soft sedimented abyssle plane around 133 00:08:11,400 --> 00:08:14,720 Speaker 3: what's called the Clipperton Fracture Zone at a depth of 134 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:18,400 Speaker 3: about forty four hundred meters. And just want to note 135 00:08:18,400 --> 00:08:21,960 Speaker 3: that the overall expedition here, so this was one dive 136 00:08:22,040 --> 00:08:25,240 Speaker 3: on a larger expedition. The overall expedition was called Mountains 137 00:08:25,240 --> 00:08:29,640 Speaker 3: in the Deep Exploring the Central Pacific Basin. And one 138 00:08:29,920 --> 00:08:33,040 Speaker 3: cool connection here is that she's mentioning some of the 139 00:08:33,080 --> 00:08:35,880 Speaker 3: other scientists involved in this dive, and one of them 140 00:08:35,960 --> 00:08:39,080 Speaker 3: is a previous stuff to blow your mind guest Diva Aimon, 141 00:08:39,240 --> 00:08:41,800 Speaker 3: who Yeah, if you want to check out an interview 142 00:08:42,160 --> 00:08:44,560 Speaker 3: that we did with a marine biologist who studies the 143 00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:46,959 Speaker 3: deep sea, you should look up our episode with her 144 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:50,440 Speaker 3: in the back catalog. It's got to be well, probably 145 00:08:50,640 --> 00:08:55,200 Speaker 3: five or six years ago now. But yeah, Diva Amon spelled. Amn. 146 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:58,439 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, she was great. The only guest we've had 147 00:08:58,480 --> 00:09:01,280 Speaker 1: on the show. I think that has actually personally been 148 00:09:01,440 --> 00:09:03,520 Speaker 1: personally bend down into the deep ocean. 149 00:09:04,240 --> 00:09:06,760 Speaker 3: I remember that being a good episode. I enjoyed talking 150 00:09:06,800 --> 00:09:09,520 Speaker 3: to her. But anyway, in this post talking about this 151 00:09:09,559 --> 00:09:13,200 Speaker 3: dive in the Pacific, Lightner is describing a survey of 152 00:09:13,280 --> 00:09:16,880 Speaker 3: organisms that these researchers did over this kind of vast, 153 00:09:17,080 --> 00:09:22,800 Speaker 3: relatively flat, sedimented patch of seafloor. Now, in the last episode, 154 00:09:23,200 --> 00:09:25,880 Speaker 3: we were talking a good bit about the Hadel zone, 155 00:09:25,920 --> 00:09:29,960 Speaker 3: like the deepest forty five percent or so of the 156 00:09:30,000 --> 00:09:33,160 Speaker 3: ocean by depth if you're just looking vertically. Of course, 157 00:09:33,200 --> 00:09:36,880 Speaker 3: the Hadel zone is limited to ocean trenches, so that's 158 00:09:37,400 --> 00:09:41,240 Speaker 3: a small minority of the ocean's horizontal surface. Most of 159 00:09:41,280 --> 00:09:45,959 Speaker 3: the ocean floor is not nearly that deep, and it's 160 00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:48,200 Speaker 3: what we would normally call the abyssal zone. That's what 161 00:09:48,200 --> 00:09:50,080 Speaker 3: we're looking at. Here is the abyssal zone, so not 162 00:09:50,280 --> 00:09:53,080 Speaker 3: deep deep in the trenches, but still very deep. It's 163 00:09:53,160 --> 00:09:56,000 Speaker 3: just the floor of most of the regular part of 164 00:09:56,040 --> 00:09:59,560 Speaker 3: the ocean. And talking about this abyssal plane, Lightner says 165 00:09:59,559 --> 00:10:03,120 Speaker 3: that these have bats have long been assumed to be 166 00:10:03,320 --> 00:10:07,320 Speaker 3: what she calls biologically monotonous. I interpret that to mean 167 00:10:08,000 --> 00:10:10,920 Speaker 3: you would expect to find roughly the same distribution of 168 00:10:10,960 --> 00:10:14,280 Speaker 3: species all across them. But then she says, you know, 169 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:16,480 Speaker 3: really that was just sort of a guess. There were 170 00:10:16,520 --> 00:10:20,440 Speaker 3: not enough observations of these habitats to know what life 171 00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:23,480 Speaker 3: forms were there and if there were major variations in 172 00:10:23,520 --> 00:10:27,839 Speaker 3: species throughout the space. So Lightner says that during this 173 00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:31,120 Speaker 3: one dive that she's talking about the most abundant fishes 174 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:35,080 Speaker 3: they found on the seafloor. Here were the fish that 175 00:10:35,160 --> 00:10:38,120 Speaker 3: I mentioned at the top of this segment, Ipnop's Medee 176 00:10:38,400 --> 00:10:41,960 Speaker 3: or the Gridye fish. This was named after a twentieth 177 00:10:41,960 --> 00:10:46,520 Speaker 3: century American ichthyologist and named Giles Mead. And she says 178 00:10:46,559 --> 00:10:50,360 Speaker 3: that they cataloged seven of these fish during one dive 179 00:10:50,480 --> 00:10:54,679 Speaker 3: exploring the soft sediment, and that they're actually pretty easy 180 00:10:54,720 --> 00:10:59,400 Speaker 3: to spot because of their huge highly reflective eyes. Now 181 00:11:00,040 --> 00:11:02,479 Speaker 3: might be trying to picture them in your head. How reflective? 182 00:11:02,559 --> 00:11:05,200 Speaker 3: How easy would these things be to spot? Well, Rob, 183 00:11:05,520 --> 00:11:07,400 Speaker 3: I want you to weigh in here after looking at 184 00:11:07,400 --> 00:11:09,079 Speaker 3: a picture in the outline. 185 00:11:09,559 --> 00:11:12,440 Speaker 1: Oh wow, yes, that's rather distinctive. 186 00:11:13,840 --> 00:11:17,120 Speaker 3: So the fish's body is long and tube like with 187 00:11:17,480 --> 00:11:21,760 Speaker 3: dark pigmentation. It appears to be gliding along the ocean 188 00:11:21,760 --> 00:11:25,080 Speaker 3: floor right over the top of the sediment, but on 189 00:11:25,480 --> 00:11:28,480 Speaker 3: the top of its head, so not really the front. 190 00:11:28,520 --> 00:11:31,280 Speaker 3: It's like right down on the top. It looks like 191 00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:36,959 Speaker 3: somebody has scooped out two little lima bean shaped depressions 192 00:11:37,160 --> 00:11:41,160 Speaker 3: in the fish's skull. Uh. And then so if you 193 00:11:41,200 --> 00:11:44,160 Speaker 3: imagine them together, like the flat sides of the lima 194 00:11:44,240 --> 00:11:47,320 Speaker 3: bean shapes are facing inward, touching one another. So like 195 00:11:47,400 --> 00:11:49,480 Speaker 3: put two lima beans right next to each other with 196 00:11:49,520 --> 00:11:53,480 Speaker 3: the flat sides together, and you scoop out that volume 197 00:11:53,600 --> 00:11:57,320 Speaker 3: from the skull, and then you paint in the two 198 00:11:57,440 --> 00:12:01,480 Speaker 3: scooped out regions with neon yellow glow in the dark paint. 199 00:12:01,840 --> 00:12:04,120 Speaker 3: So it really does look like those toys I had 200 00:12:04,120 --> 00:12:06,000 Speaker 3: when I was a kid, a little monster where you 201 00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:07,400 Speaker 3: hold it up to the light bulb and then you 202 00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:11,959 Speaker 3: turn the light off and it glows looks exactly like that. Now, 203 00:12:12,120 --> 00:12:15,400 Speaker 3: this little guy might not look especially threatening given the 204 00:12:15,440 --> 00:12:18,240 Speaker 3: Lisa Frank eyes, or I don't know, maybe it does 205 00:12:18,320 --> 00:12:20,880 Speaker 3: look more threatenings. I'm sort of reminded of some kind 206 00:12:20,880 --> 00:12:23,200 Speaker 3: of movie poster. I can't remember exactly what it is, 207 00:12:23,240 --> 00:12:25,920 Speaker 3: but there's a monster that has eyes like this, just big, 208 00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:30,360 Speaker 3: you know, undifferentiated neon yellow spots. But whether or not 209 00:12:30,400 --> 00:12:33,880 Speaker 3: it looks threatening to you, this actually is a predator 210 00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:38,760 Speaker 3: eating small abyssle crustaceans. And while I think its biology 211 00:12:38,840 --> 00:12:42,600 Speaker 3: is not fully understood, it seems that these bony plate 212 00:12:42,840 --> 00:12:47,400 Speaker 3: like neon bean cup eyes lack a lens and thus 213 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:51,520 Speaker 3: cannot resolve images. So it is seeing in a way, 214 00:12:51,559 --> 00:12:55,679 Speaker 3: but it's probably not seeing images. Instead, these things are 215 00:12:55,720 --> 00:12:59,000 Speaker 3: thought to only detect the presence or absence of light. 216 00:12:59,000 --> 00:13:03,280 Speaker 3: They're more like lights spots, and thus are probably designed 217 00:13:03,320 --> 00:13:09,800 Speaker 3: by evolution to sense bioluminescence from nearby prey. And I 218 00:13:09,880 --> 00:13:12,600 Speaker 3: was thinking about this, and I think it's just so interesting. 219 00:13:13,320 --> 00:13:17,319 Speaker 3: The different way is that light as just a type 220 00:13:17,320 --> 00:13:21,880 Speaker 3: of energy features throughout the trophic relationships. At the surface, 221 00:13:21,920 --> 00:13:25,120 Speaker 3: where there's plenty of sunlight, versus at the bottom of 222 00:13:25,120 --> 00:13:28,800 Speaker 3: the sea. Light plays a role in the food chain 223 00:13:28,920 --> 00:13:32,160 Speaker 3: in both places, but those roles are so different. So 224 00:13:32,320 --> 00:13:36,640 Speaker 3: the surface light plays the primary energy role at the 225 00:13:36,640 --> 00:13:39,840 Speaker 3: base of the food chain. Light from the sun powers 226 00:13:39,880 --> 00:13:44,000 Speaker 3: photosynthesis and plants and other autotrophs, and that sets off 227 00:13:44,080 --> 00:13:46,280 Speaker 3: the chain of eating that goes all the way up 228 00:13:46,280 --> 00:13:49,640 Speaker 3: to the top predators. And then, in addition to its 229 00:13:49,720 --> 00:13:52,960 Speaker 3: role as the base energy input on the whole system, 230 00:13:53,280 --> 00:13:57,880 Speaker 3: it also provides probably the most important type of information 231 00:13:58,640 --> 00:14:03,199 Speaker 3: that fast moving animal used to survive and negotiate predation 232 00:14:03,360 --> 00:14:06,560 Speaker 3: relationships from either side of the predator prey relationship. So 233 00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:09,800 Speaker 3: whether you're a predator or a prey animal in the surface, 234 00:14:10,200 --> 00:14:13,960 Speaker 3: one of your main jobs is seeing other animals and 235 00:14:14,040 --> 00:14:17,720 Speaker 3: in some cases avoiding being seen. It's all an information 236 00:14:17,880 --> 00:14:21,520 Speaker 3: game based on reflected light from the sun deep at 237 00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:23,880 Speaker 3: the bottom of the ocean. It seems that light is 238 00:14:24,040 --> 00:14:27,440 Speaker 3: still a major energy input on the food chain because 239 00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:29,920 Speaker 3: of course it powers the food chain up above at 240 00:14:29,920 --> 00:14:33,680 Speaker 3: the surface, which then at some point rains down as 241 00:14:33,720 --> 00:14:36,720 Speaker 3: the marine snow or the whalefall for the scavengers at 242 00:14:36,760 --> 00:14:39,520 Speaker 3: the bottom of the ocean. But there is also at 243 00:14:39,560 --> 00:14:41,920 Speaker 3: the bottom of the ocean a different energy input. You 244 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:45,480 Speaker 3: got the energy input from chemosynthetic organisms around like seafloor 245 00:14:45,560 --> 00:14:49,760 Speaker 3: vents and things, and then also down in the abyssle 246 00:14:49,880 --> 00:14:53,920 Speaker 3: or the hatl darkness. Light plays an important relationship in 247 00:14:54,040 --> 00:14:58,560 Speaker 3: this information competition between predators and prey, but it's not 248 00:14:58,880 --> 00:15:02,160 Speaker 3: reflected light from the sun that plays that role. It 249 00:15:02,200 --> 00:15:06,720 Speaker 3: seems to be primarily bioluminescent light. And the way that 250 00:15:06,800 --> 00:15:11,040 Speaker 3: it contributes to that struggle for information advantage between predators 251 00:15:11,040 --> 00:15:12,680 Speaker 3: and prey is a bit different. 252 00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:16,840 Speaker 1: That's right, Yeah, it is. It's not a realm where 253 00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:19,400 Speaker 1: there is no light, but the sort of like the 254 00:15:19,480 --> 00:15:23,080 Speaker 1: rules of light have changed, the importance of light has changed, 255 00:15:33,040 --> 00:15:34,480 Speaker 1: and so I guess you could look at the grid 256 00:15:34,520 --> 00:15:37,080 Speaker 1: eye fish here as being an example of a case 257 00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:40,520 Speaker 1: where evolution has just decided, you know, we can scale 258 00:15:40,560 --> 00:15:43,240 Speaker 1: back on the eyes a little bit. We still need them, 259 00:15:43,280 --> 00:15:47,120 Speaker 1: but we need them for just specific things. And the 260 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:49,840 Speaker 1: next example we're going to discuss is one that kind 261 00:15:49,840 --> 00:15:53,440 Speaker 1: of goes in a different direction entirely with the eyes. 262 00:15:55,040 --> 00:15:58,080 Speaker 1: It really feels more like a scaling up but also 263 00:15:58,160 --> 00:16:04,200 Speaker 1: a hyper specialization of its ocular equipment. M tell me 264 00:16:04,240 --> 00:16:07,640 Speaker 1: more so I'm going to warn you that this creature's 265 00:16:07,640 --> 00:16:10,400 Speaker 1: common name does sound a bit ridiculous and it may 266 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:14,360 Speaker 1: earworm you with a Beatles song. But we're talking about 267 00:16:14,440 --> 00:16:19,240 Speaker 1: strawberry squid here. Strawberry squids forever so called for their 268 00:16:19,360 --> 00:16:22,800 Speaker 1: red coloration as well as the little marks on their 269 00:16:22,840 --> 00:16:26,040 Speaker 1: skin that really do look like the seeds of a strawberry. 270 00:16:26,320 --> 00:16:28,560 Speaker 3: Oh, they so do. I mean, if you zoom in 271 00:16:28,640 --> 00:16:31,360 Speaker 3: on the skin of this thing, it's uncanny how much 272 00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:32,520 Speaker 3: it looks like a strawberry. 273 00:16:32,800 --> 00:16:35,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, because sometimes you know, the naming of these creatures 274 00:16:35,520 --> 00:16:37,200 Speaker 1: that it can be a bit off and just you 275 00:16:37,320 --> 00:16:39,800 Speaker 1: kind of have to squint a little bit to see 276 00:16:39,800 --> 00:16:43,200 Speaker 1: it for yourself. But here's pretty spot on. Its scientific 277 00:16:43,280 --> 00:16:48,480 Speaker 1: name is histiotoothis heteropsis, and the heteropsis gets more to 278 00:16:48,520 --> 00:16:51,720 Speaker 1: the point here as it translates to different sight or 279 00:16:51,840 --> 00:16:52,680 Speaker 1: different eye. 280 00:16:53,160 --> 00:16:57,280 Speaker 3: Oh yes, okay, so this is the squid. If people 281 00:16:57,320 --> 00:16:59,400 Speaker 3: have seen a picture of this before and the thing 282 00:16:59,440 --> 00:17:02,080 Speaker 3: you didn't notice about it was the strawberry texture of 283 00:17:02,120 --> 00:17:06,359 Speaker 3: the skin, you may have noticed the two wildly different 284 00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:07,080 Speaker 3: looking eyes. 285 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:10,240 Speaker 1: That's right. Almost kind of am reminded of the whole 286 00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:13,720 Speaker 1: sleep with one eye open thing. But yeah, it has 287 00:17:13,840 --> 00:17:16,600 Speaker 1: like but they're both open, but they're just different sizes 288 00:17:16,680 --> 00:17:20,880 Speaker 1: and they see in different ways. It's pretty amazing. 289 00:17:21,320 --> 00:17:23,080 Speaker 3: It's like the christ pantocrat. 290 00:17:25,240 --> 00:17:28,520 Speaker 1: So according to the Monterey Bay Aquarium Research Institute, our 291 00:17:28,560 --> 00:17:32,159 Speaker 1: strawberry squid here reaches a maximum mantle length of thirteen 292 00:17:32,240 --> 00:17:35,840 Speaker 1: centimeters or five inches, and its habitat is the midwater 293 00:17:35,920 --> 00:17:40,280 Speaker 1: region of the twilight or mesopelagic zone. So we're talking 294 00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:43,439 Speaker 1: the upper portions of the aphotic zone, the dark ocean, 295 00:17:43,480 --> 00:17:47,200 Speaker 1: but the dark ocean nonetheless, however, the strawberry squid may 296 00:17:47,240 --> 00:17:50,200 Speaker 1: reach depths of three thy three hundred feet during the day, 297 00:17:50,560 --> 00:17:53,200 Speaker 1: but then migrates to shallower waters at night. 298 00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:56,720 Speaker 3: Okay, And so we've talked about organisms like this before. 299 00:17:56,760 --> 00:17:59,720 Speaker 3: I mean, one great example being the sperm whale that 300 00:17:59,760 --> 00:18:03,760 Speaker 3: our rates at in radically different light regimes at different 301 00:18:03,800 --> 00:18:07,359 Speaker 3: parts of it of its sort of feeding cycle, Like 302 00:18:07,400 --> 00:18:09,480 Speaker 3: it might come up shallow to shallow waters. Of course 303 00:18:09,480 --> 00:18:11,040 Speaker 3: the whale would have to come up to the surface 304 00:18:11,080 --> 00:18:13,680 Speaker 3: to breathe, but then it dives very deep into the 305 00:18:13,760 --> 00:18:16,480 Speaker 3: dark in order to feed. And this would be another 306 00:18:16,520 --> 00:18:19,480 Speaker 3: type of organism that goes a little bit more up 307 00:18:19,520 --> 00:18:22,960 Speaker 3: into the light zone. And then down into the darker zone. 308 00:18:22,880 --> 00:18:25,600 Speaker 1: Right right. But of course, unlike the sperm whale, and 309 00:18:25,720 --> 00:18:28,280 Speaker 1: the sperm whale does that different phases of its life 310 00:18:28,320 --> 00:18:31,919 Speaker 1: have to deal with predation. But this critter is is 311 00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:34,359 Speaker 1: more like your common house cat, being both predator and 312 00:18:35,080 --> 00:18:38,119 Speaker 1: prey at all times, you know, not so much in 313 00:18:38,119 --> 00:18:40,119 Speaker 1: the confines of your house, but in the confines of 314 00:18:40,119 --> 00:18:43,480 Speaker 1: the natural world. So there are two properties that are 315 00:18:43,560 --> 00:18:48,280 Speaker 1: especially revealing here with this organism regarding life in the deep. First, 316 00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:49,760 Speaker 1: I want to talk about a little bit about its 317 00:18:49,760 --> 00:18:56,240 Speaker 1: strawberry coloration and as well as the seeds. So again 318 00:18:56,280 --> 00:18:59,000 Speaker 1: those are not seeds obviously, those little marks on its 319 00:18:59,040 --> 00:19:03,080 Speaker 1: red flesh are by luminescent of photophores. Those are light 320 00:19:03,119 --> 00:19:08,280 Speaker 1: emitting organs. Now, in general, cephalopods use photophores for different 321 00:19:08,520 --> 00:19:12,439 Speaker 1: forms of camouflage and antipredation, and they can pop up 322 00:19:12,440 --> 00:19:16,159 Speaker 1: in various locations on the cephalopod body plan. But for 323 00:19:16,240 --> 00:19:19,000 Speaker 1: the strawberry squid here, they're on the outer skin, and 324 00:19:19,040 --> 00:19:22,640 Speaker 1: the purpose here does qualify as anti predation. 325 00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:26,080 Speaker 3: Okay, So that's kind of hard to understand because you 326 00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:29,239 Speaker 3: would think that you would think that lighting up your 327 00:19:29,280 --> 00:19:32,000 Speaker 3: body would attract predators not repel them. So how does 328 00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:32,520 Speaker 3: this work? 329 00:19:32,840 --> 00:19:35,199 Speaker 1: That's right, Well, we have to remember that this is 330 00:19:35,240 --> 00:19:39,159 Speaker 1: the twilight zone. Some light does make it down this 331 00:19:39,320 --> 00:19:42,239 Speaker 1: far during the day, and if something is looking up 332 00:19:42,240 --> 00:19:45,720 Speaker 1: at you from beneath, it will see your outline against 333 00:19:45,720 --> 00:19:49,480 Speaker 1: that filtered light. If you put in like sci fi 334 00:19:49,960 --> 00:19:55,360 Speaker 1: film setting, imagine a starship, large starship powered down. It's 335 00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:58,080 Speaker 1: just a dark form, but it's moving against the stars, 336 00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:02,280 Speaker 1: and with a keen eye you might notice that when 337 00:20:02,520 --> 00:20:04,880 Speaker 1: you might think, well, if you wanted to disguise your 338 00:20:05,280 --> 00:20:07,760 Speaker 1: power down vessel, if you were to cover it with 339 00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:13,040 Speaker 1: little shiny stars, well that might help mask your appearance. 340 00:20:13,040 --> 00:20:16,040 Speaker 1: That might allow you to blend in to the starfield. 341 00:20:16,240 --> 00:20:18,040 Speaker 1: And that's sort of what's going on with the strawberry 342 00:20:18,040 --> 00:20:24,160 Speaker 1: squid here. It uses its bioluminescence to mask itself against 343 00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:27,520 Speaker 1: to blend in with the filtered down light from above 344 00:20:27,960 --> 00:20:31,960 Speaker 1: against predators below. I have a quote here that explains 345 00:20:32,000 --> 00:20:36,920 Speaker 1: this general adaptation. This is from a nineteen eighty three 346 00:20:37,920 --> 00:20:42,440 Speaker 1: text by Richard Edward Young titled Oceanic Bioluminescence and Overview 347 00:20:42,480 --> 00:20:47,000 Speaker 1: of General Functions. He writes, quote, this function is the 348 00:20:47,040 --> 00:20:50,639 Speaker 1: only one for which we have substantial experimental data. The 349 00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:55,160 Speaker 1: hypothesis is an old and simple one. Dahlgren nineteen sixteen 350 00:20:55,240 --> 00:20:58,720 Speaker 1: suggested that blue light from the ventral photophores and squids 351 00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:01,840 Speaker 1: would cause these andmals in deep water to blend with 352 00:21:01,920 --> 00:21:05,320 Speaker 1: the sunlight when viewed from below. The process that allows 353 00:21:05,680 --> 00:21:09,359 Speaker 1: a mesopolagic animal to eliminate its silhouette with bioluminescence and 354 00:21:09,359 --> 00:21:13,240 Speaker 1: thereby conceal itself requires a very sophisticated mechanism In the 355 00:21:13,280 --> 00:21:17,480 Speaker 1: animals that utilize it well. For maximum effectiveness, they must 356 00:21:17,480 --> 00:21:22,320 Speaker 1: precisely match their luminescence to the intensity, angular distribution, and 357 00:21:22,440 --> 00:21:26,480 Speaker 1: color of the down welling light. For those that counter 358 00:21:26,560 --> 00:21:29,960 Speaker 1: illuminate in near surface waters at night, where the flight 359 00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:32,840 Speaker 1: field is much more variable than in deep water, the 360 00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:35,399 Speaker 1: mechanism must be especially complex. 361 00:21:35,960 --> 00:21:37,879 Speaker 3: Wow, So it's almost like what we see in the 362 00:21:37,920 --> 00:21:41,840 Speaker 3: movie Predator in a way where you know the predator's 363 00:21:41,880 --> 00:21:45,720 Speaker 3: invisibility cloak seems to be a way of kind of 364 00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:49,480 Speaker 3: projecting an image of the light patterns from behind the 365 00:21:49,920 --> 00:21:52,800 Speaker 3: alien onto the front facing side of it, so that 366 00:21:53,160 --> 00:21:55,679 Speaker 3: when you're looking at it, it's like a movie screen 367 00:21:55,760 --> 00:21:58,000 Speaker 3: showing you what you would expect to see. If the 368 00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:01,159 Speaker 3: thing were not there from the back side, it might 369 00:22:01,200 --> 00:22:03,880 Speaker 3: not have to be that exact with with like outlines 370 00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:05,800 Speaker 3: and images in the case of the squid, but it 371 00:22:05,840 --> 00:22:10,199 Speaker 3: does need to very closely match the light intensity and 372 00:22:10,240 --> 00:22:14,119 Speaker 3: the color patterns and angular distribution of the light that 373 00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:16,399 Speaker 3: would be coming down from above. Otherwise. 374 00:22:16,960 --> 00:22:21,399 Speaker 1: Yeah, so to humanize this sort of light show, it 375 00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:25,320 Speaker 1: may not be as as impressive as watching say a 376 00:22:25,359 --> 00:22:28,680 Speaker 1: cuttlefish or some other you know, an or or some 377 00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:31,720 Speaker 1: sort of you know, shallow water octopus blending in with 378 00:22:31,800 --> 00:22:37,800 Speaker 1: its environment with its camouflage. But it is a complex act, nonetheless, 379 00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:40,840 Speaker 1: So it isn't just a matter of like, let's just 380 00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:43,359 Speaker 1: throw some stars up there on your hide so that 381 00:22:43,760 --> 00:22:46,280 Speaker 1: whatever's below can't can't make you out. 382 00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:46,480 Speaker 2: Like. 383 00:22:46,520 --> 00:22:49,880 Speaker 1: It's more nuanced and it's about hitting the right light 384 00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:55,040 Speaker 1: intensity at all times. Now, that strawberry red coloration, that's 385 00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:57,520 Speaker 1: a little bit more straightforward, but it reveals another curious 386 00:22:57,520 --> 00:23:00,280 Speaker 1: relationship with light in the deep. This is what we've 387 00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:03,840 Speaker 1: touched on before in the past, and it is red. 388 00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:06,520 Speaker 1: The color red maybe the color of caution and notice 389 00:23:06,560 --> 00:23:08,720 Speaker 1: on the surface, you know, it is the color you 390 00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:12,879 Speaker 1: might wear to a wedding if you want to attract attention, 391 00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:16,720 Speaker 1: that sort of thing. It is the color of it's 392 00:23:16,720 --> 00:23:18,879 Speaker 1: a flashy color, it's a sports car color, right, But 393 00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:21,800 Speaker 1: in the depths it's a stealth color. And that's because 394 00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:24,560 Speaker 1: red light doesn't filter this far deep, and so red 395 00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:28,879 Speaker 1: organisms appear quite black in the natural illumination i e. 396 00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:34,919 Speaker 1: Not like submarine illumination, thus further cloaking the organism here 397 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:37,560 Speaker 1: in question from predators, but in a more passive way. 398 00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:41,119 Speaker 3: I see so like it's because the longer wavelengths of 399 00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:43,280 Speaker 3: visible light don't make it as deep in the water, 400 00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:46,120 Speaker 3: so the red, the more red colors just don't really 401 00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:48,639 Speaker 3: get reflected. Everything's kind of blue shifted down there. 402 00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:51,640 Speaker 1: Yeah. But finally we have to talk about the strawberry 403 00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:54,800 Speaker 1: squid's eyes and greater depth here. It does have very 404 00:23:54,800 --> 00:24:01,200 Speaker 1: weird eyes again, different sizes, one big tubular and yellow lensed, 405 00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:05,359 Speaker 1: and this is to keep an eye out above for 406 00:24:05,440 --> 00:24:09,560 Speaker 1: the shadows of prey moving through dim waters, and then 407 00:24:09,760 --> 00:24:12,400 Speaker 1: there's this much smaller specialized eye to keep an eye 408 00:24:12,440 --> 00:24:16,560 Speaker 1: out below for bioluminescence of potential predators. 409 00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:21,240 Speaker 3: So it's looking for shadows that it wants to eat 410 00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:23,400 Speaker 3: and glowing things that want to eat. 411 00:24:23,280 --> 00:24:26,760 Speaker 1: It, Yes, exactly, And it's I mean, it's really hard 412 00:24:26,800 --> 00:24:30,480 Speaker 1: to think about this in terms of like the human perspective, 413 00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:33,879 Speaker 1: because I mean you might imagine, like what if I 414 00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:35,560 Speaker 1: had one eye to see really well in the day 415 00:24:35,600 --> 00:24:37,800 Speaker 1: and one eye that would see really well in the night, 416 00:24:38,320 --> 00:24:42,399 Speaker 1: well sort of. And in fact, there were older theories 417 00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:45,080 Speaker 1: that that's what was going on here, that this squid 418 00:24:45,119 --> 00:24:48,159 Speaker 1: had two different eyes, one for when it was at 419 00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:50,520 Speaker 1: lower depths than one when it was at greater depths. 420 00:24:51,440 --> 00:24:54,440 Speaker 1: But this would only work, this human example would only 421 00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:57,080 Speaker 1: work if you were living in the sort of environment 422 00:24:57,080 --> 00:24:59,679 Speaker 1: that this creature lives in, in which you were on 423 00:24:59,760 --> 00:25:02,959 Speaker 1: the threshold of darkness and light pretty much at all times. 424 00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:05,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, in a way, we do have eyes 425 00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:08,720 Speaker 3: that can function in high and low light conditions because 426 00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:12,240 Speaker 3: we have adjustable size, Like we can adjust the aperture 427 00:25:12,840 --> 00:25:15,040 Speaker 3: of the pupil, so you know, they can tract in 428 00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:17,360 Speaker 3: when there's a lot of light and dilate when there's 429 00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:20,919 Speaker 3: less light. But this is fit, Yeah, this is squid 430 00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:22,920 Speaker 3: is in a different situation than we are, because we 431 00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:26,040 Speaker 3: are almost never in a situation where we need to 432 00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:29,159 Speaker 3: be looking in one direction where there's more light and 433 00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:31,480 Speaker 3: in another direction where there's less light. Also, we have 434 00:25:31,560 --> 00:25:35,400 Speaker 3: binocular visions, so we're generally we're looking in the same 435 00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:37,680 Speaker 3: direction with both of our eyes to get a perception 436 00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:42,879 Speaker 3: of depth. Instead, the squid really has eyes on the 437 00:25:42,920 --> 00:25:45,480 Speaker 3: back of its head whichever way you look from, and 438 00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:47,600 Speaker 3: one way needs to be looking toward the sky and 439 00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:49,560 Speaker 3: the other eye needs to be looking away. 440 00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:53,199 Speaker 1: Yeah. Another imperfect way of thinking about this would be 441 00:25:53,320 --> 00:25:55,840 Speaker 1: like if you had a human with one normal eye 442 00:25:55,920 --> 00:25:58,720 Speaker 1: and then one eye that was essentially blind but saw 443 00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:02,640 Speaker 1: really well into the astral plane, ever on the lookout 444 00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:05,479 Speaker 1: for astro zombies that are coming to try and kill you. 445 00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:10,199 Speaker 1: So these eyes apparently differentiate as the squid enters adulthood, 446 00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:13,480 Speaker 1: distorting the shape of the head to accommodate the larger 447 00:26:13,600 --> 00:26:17,119 Speaker 1: upward gazing eye. And the dimorphism is because it's a 448 00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:19,640 Speaker 1: creature again with an eye in two realms of light 449 00:26:19,680 --> 00:26:22,920 Speaker 1: at the same time. And I was reading a bit 450 00:26:22,920 --> 00:26:28,240 Speaker 1: more about this. Thompson, Robinson, and Johnson explored the creature's 451 00:26:28,280 --> 00:26:32,800 Speaker 1: asymmetric vision in a twenty seventeen paper published in Philosophical 452 00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:36,280 Speaker 1: Transactions with the Royal Society b. They point out that 453 00:26:36,359 --> 00:26:39,480 Speaker 1: the dim to dark. Mesopolagic region of the deep sea 454 00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:42,760 Speaker 1: boasts the highest diversity of visual adaptations in the sea. 455 00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:46,440 Speaker 1: A lot of evolutionary energy has to go into scraping 456 00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:51,360 Speaker 1: out a survival story in this region, dealing with bioluminescence 457 00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:54,800 Speaker 1: below and filtered sunlight above. But it is quote a 458 00:26:54,840 --> 00:26:58,680 Speaker 1: fertile environment for eye evolution. Now, we mentioned that that 459 00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:02,920 Speaker 1: upward gazing eye has a yellow linb and they point 460 00:27:02,920 --> 00:27:04,760 Speaker 1: out that this may be used to break up the 461 00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:10,080 Speaker 1: counter illumination camouflage of their prey. They found it in 462 00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:12,720 Speaker 1: sixty five percent of the specimens that they looked at. 463 00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:16,680 Speaker 1: Yellow lenses are apparently common in upward looking deep sea 464 00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:20,440 Speaker 1: organisms as well and like in fish, because they're thought 465 00:27:20,480 --> 00:27:25,400 Speaker 1: to quote break counter illumination camouflage by enhancing spectral differences 466 00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:30,199 Speaker 1: between down welling sunlight and bioluminescent camouflage. So it's geared 467 00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:35,399 Speaker 1: at deciphering the very sort of counter illumination CAMO camouflage 468 00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:36,639 Speaker 1: that it itself uses. 469 00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:41,760 Speaker 3: Hmm, okay, So it's like it simultaneously is wearing a 470 00:27:41,960 --> 00:27:45,360 Speaker 3: kind of lead shielding and X ray glasses. Yeah. 471 00:27:45,560 --> 00:27:47,639 Speaker 1: They point out that body posture is also key. They 472 00:27:47,720 --> 00:27:51,080 Speaker 1: position themselves with their head and arms downward with the 473 00:27:51,119 --> 00:27:54,560 Speaker 1: posterior mantle pointed upward in a vertical posture, and this 474 00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:58,800 Speaker 1: ensures that they're pointing their photophores downward again to cast 475 00:27:58,840 --> 00:28:03,440 Speaker 1: that that to counter illumination spell. And I think it's 476 00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:05,879 Speaker 1: just such a fascinating example of a form that has 477 00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:08,720 Speaker 1: evolved to thrive in a delicate environment. So their predators 478 00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:11,880 Speaker 1: include various sharks and also in even whales. And as 479 00:28:11,880 --> 00:28:15,600 Speaker 1: for what they themselves prey upon, stomach contents suggest a 480 00:28:15,640 --> 00:28:19,760 Speaker 1: mix of fish, other squid as well as crustaceans strawberry 481 00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:20,640 Speaker 1: squids forever. 482 00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:22,080 Speaker 3: Let me take you. 483 00:28:22,119 --> 00:28:33,240 Speaker 4: Down all right now. 484 00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:36,240 Speaker 1: The next deep sea organism I want to talk about 485 00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:42,920 Speaker 1: is the fin deep sea octopuses of the genus grimpo Toothus, 486 00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:47,640 Speaker 1: commonly referred to as Dumbo octopuses because I mean, well, 487 00:28:47,840 --> 00:28:50,040 Speaker 1: just look at them. Included a couple of images here 488 00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:54,840 Speaker 1: for you, Joe. They're adorable and they boast earl like 489 00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:58,160 Speaker 1: fins that remind many of Dumbo the flying elephant. 490 00:28:58,320 --> 00:29:02,440 Speaker 3: They look tremendously like, yes, extremely cute and with big 491 00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:07,240 Speaker 3: floppy ears and almost yeah, I kind of elephantine shape 492 00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:08,920 Speaker 3: to their their lumpy head body. 493 00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:09,640 Speaker 4: Mm hmm. 494 00:29:10,120 --> 00:29:14,400 Speaker 1: Sometimes the position of their arms also kind of reminds 495 00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:16,520 Speaker 1: one of a trunk or trunks, like it's some sort 496 00:29:16,520 --> 00:29:19,680 Speaker 1: of weird multi trunk elephant that sort of thing. So 497 00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:22,560 Speaker 1: the dumbo octopus is they're members of the Serena suborder 498 00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:26,720 Speaker 1: of octopods, who are notable for having evolved away from 499 00:29:26,800 --> 00:29:30,240 Speaker 1: jet propulsion in favor of thin propulsion. So if you've 500 00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:34,240 Speaker 1: ever consumed, you know, any cephalopod a media, or you know, 501 00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:36,560 Speaker 1: learned about them in the past, you know that. I 502 00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:39,719 Speaker 1: think squid are some of the more fabulous examples of this. 503 00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:43,160 Speaker 1: They use jet propulsion. They take they take in a 504 00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:46,960 Speaker 1: bunch of water and then they jet it out to 505 00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:49,960 Speaker 1: push them along through the water, often at you know, 506 00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:54,800 Speaker 1: nice high speeds. Well marine rockets, yeah, little marine rockets. 507 00:29:55,360 --> 00:29:59,400 Speaker 1: These octopods, however, have jettison back. They also tend to 508 00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:03,680 Speaker 1: lack a flaps and ink sacs, so they can't jet ink, 509 00:30:04,680 --> 00:30:11,120 Speaker 1: which is another common self defense mechanism of cephalopods being 510 00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:13,120 Speaker 1: able to just squirt out that cloud of ink and 511 00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:14,120 Speaker 1: make a quick escape. 512 00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:17,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's like the it's like the Batman, you know, 513 00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:18,840 Speaker 3: smoke escape pom right. 514 00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:24,080 Speaker 1: And they also lack chromatophores, So they can't adjust their coloration. 515 00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:27,440 Speaker 1: They can't do any kind of blending in with their 516 00:30:27,560 --> 00:30:31,680 Speaker 1: environment other than what their their their natural coloration is 517 00:30:31,720 --> 00:30:36,040 Speaker 1: already providing. Okay, their arms are web together, which also 518 00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:38,920 Speaker 1: earns them the informal name of umbrella octopuses. 519 00:30:39,400 --> 00:30:41,160 Speaker 3: Oh well, that's just adorable. 520 00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:45,400 Speaker 1: So what we have then is as a bunch of 521 00:30:45,440 --> 00:30:48,840 Speaker 1: creatures that seem to have just abandoned most of like 522 00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:54,440 Speaker 1: the really expensive, evolutionarily speaking, self defense mechanisms that their 523 00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:58,000 Speaker 1: can have evolved in favor of a more just sort 524 00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:04,000 Speaker 1: of drifting lead usually existence. Now why would that be, Well, 525 00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:07,800 Speaker 1: it has everything to do with how deep they actually reside. 526 00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:12,360 Speaker 1: They reside at extreme depths of at least thirteen one 527 00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:15,320 Speaker 1: hundred feet or four thousand meters, putting them squarely in 528 00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:18,480 Speaker 1: the abyssopallegic zone, so way down there, not quite into 529 00:31:18,480 --> 00:31:22,040 Speaker 1: the Hadel but still pretty turned deep like way like 530 00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:24,239 Speaker 1: in a way, we keep mentioning the Hadel zone as 531 00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:26,520 Speaker 1: being like, this is the extreme, this is where the 532 00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:28,960 Speaker 1: real depth happens. But no, the Hadel zone is just 533 00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:35,160 Speaker 1: that extra topping on the inverted cake here and everything 534 00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:39,200 Speaker 1: is already just crushingly deep before we reach that threshold. 535 00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:42,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, us talking about the ocean trenches was not to 536 00:31:42,360 --> 00:31:45,920 Speaker 3: suggest that the horizontal surface of most of the bottom 537 00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:48,520 Speaker 3: of the ocean is not that deep. It is the 538 00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:50,080 Speaker 3: regular abyssle zone is deep. 539 00:31:50,440 --> 00:31:52,880 Speaker 1: So what are the dumbo octopuses eat? Well, first of all, 540 00:31:52,880 --> 00:31:54,880 Speaker 1: they're not that big, eight to twelve inches in length, 541 00:31:55,400 --> 00:31:59,160 Speaker 1: and here in the depths they forage for pelegic invertebrates, 542 00:31:59,560 --> 00:32:02,680 Speaker 1: generally close to the seafloor in the area that they're 543 00:32:02,720 --> 00:32:06,280 Speaker 1: they're thriving. But they don't. It's it's important to note 544 00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:11,560 Speaker 1: they don't like crawl around seemingly on the seafloor like 545 00:32:11,560 --> 00:32:14,480 Speaker 1: like like other octopods are observed to do. They're there, 546 00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:17,960 Speaker 1: they live, you know, in the water. They do go 547 00:32:18,120 --> 00:32:20,080 Speaker 1: down to the sea floor as well, though, to lay 548 00:32:20,080 --> 00:32:24,440 Speaker 1: their eggs, generally on deep water corals. But otherwise, yeah, 549 00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:28,200 Speaker 1: they're free swimming, dreamy floaters in the depths that have 550 00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:32,800 Speaker 1: you know, cast aside all of their evolved weaponry. And 551 00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:36,920 Speaker 1: it's because you know, they don't seem to have to 552 00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:40,840 Speaker 1: deal with that many predators. They do have predators, you know, 553 00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:45,480 Speaker 1: generally diving predators from above, but it seems that they 554 00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:48,840 Speaker 1: likely lost their various costly defense mechanisms because they thrive 555 00:32:48,920 --> 00:32:52,520 Speaker 1: in a rather depopulated region of the deep m okay. 556 00:32:52,880 --> 00:32:55,760 Speaker 3: And this is a type of adaptation that we've seen 557 00:32:55,760 --> 00:32:59,600 Speaker 3: in other animals and other ecosystems, where you know, you 558 00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:01,520 Speaker 3: can lose is a lot of your defenses if you 559 00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:04,200 Speaker 3: just adapt so that you are able to thrive in 560 00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:07,640 Speaker 3: a difficult environment where there are not a lot of predators. 561 00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:11,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, it reminds me in an imperfect way, I'm sure 562 00:33:12,240 --> 00:33:13,560 Speaker 1: of when I was a kid, I would look at 563 00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:17,959 Speaker 1: all these airplane illustrations and sketches, you know, and like 564 00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:22,880 Speaker 1: the higher some of your higher altitude planes they often 565 00:33:22,960 --> 00:33:25,120 Speaker 1: had like really like cool looks, you know, like the 566 00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:29,280 Speaker 1: SR seventy one Blackbird or you know, various strategic bombers 567 00:33:29,280 --> 00:33:30,640 Speaker 1: and all. But then when you get to the U two, 568 00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:32,800 Speaker 1: which is a very high it was you know, a 569 00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:36,640 Speaker 1: very high altitude spyplane. You know, it looks looks a 570 00:33:36,640 --> 00:33:40,400 Speaker 1: little dumb, and it just has really long wings. But 571 00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:43,680 Speaker 1: it's you know, it's it's altitude was its defense. And 572 00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:45,360 Speaker 1: in a sense, this is this is kind of like 573 00:33:45,400 --> 00:33:47,680 Speaker 1: the inversion of that, like its depth is its defense, 574 00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:52,120 Speaker 1: and therefore it doesn't need, you know, to look crazy. 575 00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:54,880 Speaker 1: It doesn't need to you know, have a bunch of 576 00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:57,000 Speaker 1: guns on it, or in this case, you know, it's 577 00:33:57,080 --> 00:34:02,240 Speaker 1: various octopied defense mechanisms. Now, their reproductive systems also speak 578 00:34:02,280 --> 00:34:05,680 Speaker 1: to their isolation, and we see this in other organisms. 579 00:34:05,720 --> 00:34:07,480 Speaker 1: We're going to discuss another one, I think in the 580 00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:12,160 Speaker 1: next episode. If you're thriving in an area where there's 581 00:34:12,160 --> 00:34:15,600 Speaker 1: just you're basically in a desert, well you're not going 582 00:34:15,680 --> 00:34:18,840 Speaker 1: to run into potential mates as much either. I mean, 583 00:34:18,880 --> 00:34:20,399 Speaker 1: you're not going to run into foes, but you're also 584 00:34:20,400 --> 00:34:23,680 Speaker 1: not going to run into potential friends. So a female 585 00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:26,960 Speaker 1: keeps multiple eggs in various states of development inside of 586 00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:29,920 Speaker 1: her body, and she can also store sperm for extended 587 00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:32,799 Speaker 1: periods of time as well, thus making the most out 588 00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:37,400 Speaker 1: of these infrequent encounters with the opposite sex. Furthermore, the 589 00:34:37,840 --> 00:34:41,720 Speaker 1: mother doesn't stay with the eggs once they've been laid. 590 00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:44,600 Speaker 1: According to a twenty eighteen article by shay at All 591 00:34:44,719 --> 00:34:49,320 Speaker 1: in Current Biology, the young here hatch as fully confident juveniles, 592 00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:55,040 Speaker 1: so a newly hatched dumbo octopod can immediately begin carrying on, 593 00:34:55,440 --> 00:35:00,879 Speaker 1: feeding and so forth like any adult born Ready. Yeah, 594 00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:03,720 Speaker 1: So I love these guys. I mean, they're they're weird looking, 595 00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:06,400 Speaker 1: They're definitely weird, But their weirdness is one of isolation 596 00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:11,640 Speaker 1: and a casting off of defensive adaptation speed ink camouflage, 597 00:35:11,920 --> 00:35:14,799 Speaker 1: because they've adapted to live so deep, not so deep 598 00:35:14,840 --> 00:35:18,000 Speaker 1: that they can't be found by predators. But seemingly such 599 00:35:18,040 --> 00:35:22,240 Speaker 1: predation is just far less common. However, it is stressed 600 00:35:22,280 --> 00:35:24,399 Speaker 1: in some of the literatures looking at that they they 601 00:35:24,440 --> 00:35:28,440 Speaker 1: do deter predators by ballooning up. That's one thing that 602 00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:30,759 Speaker 1: they kept, like they can balloon up their bodies and 603 00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:35,400 Speaker 1: their umbrella like arms to appear larger than they actually are. This, 604 00:35:35,480 --> 00:35:38,160 Speaker 1: of course, is a common anti predation feature, and so 605 00:35:38,200 --> 00:35:40,279 Speaker 1: they've they've held onto that one. That's one that they 606 00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:43,880 Speaker 1: I guess it's not too costly from an evolutionary standpoint, 607 00:35:43,880 --> 00:35:45,760 Speaker 1: and they can keep that one for when. 608 00:35:45,640 --> 00:35:46,239 Speaker 4: They need it. 609 00:35:46,280 --> 00:35:49,399 Speaker 3: But in the case of this animal, that just sounds adorable. Look, 610 00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:51,920 Speaker 3: I'm big and scary. 611 00:35:52,040 --> 00:35:55,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, indeed, how big and scary could they could they 612 00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:58,200 Speaker 1: end up looking? Yeah, it seems like that's you know, 613 00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:01,799 Speaker 1: kind of like a last bitch defense mechanism. But for 614 00:36:01,840 --> 00:36:03,920 Speaker 1: the for the most part, it's just I'm so deep 615 00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:06,520 Speaker 1: you're probably not gonna find me. The odds are with 616 00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:09,920 Speaker 1: me that you can't find and eating all right, where 617 00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:12,040 Speaker 1: we're gonna go ahead and close out this episode of 618 00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:13,759 Speaker 1: Stuff to Blow Your Mind, but we're going to be back. 619 00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:17,680 Speaker 1: We have more to discuss in our look at dark 620 00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:20,960 Speaker 1: ocean predators, you know we have. We're going to get 621 00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:23,680 Speaker 1: back to a creature we mentioned in passing in the 622 00:36:23,719 --> 00:36:27,400 Speaker 1: first episode, and I believe next episode is also going 623 00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:30,520 Speaker 1: to be the one where I get to discuss one 624 00:36:30,520 --> 00:36:32,279 Speaker 1: of the deep sea predators that a number of you've 625 00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:34,399 Speaker 1: probably thought up, like when are they going to talk 626 00:36:34,400 --> 00:36:38,360 Speaker 1: about this one? Well, the next episode is probably the episode. 627 00:36:39,200 --> 00:36:41,560 Speaker 1: In the meantime, Yeah, write in, we'd love to hear 628 00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:43,359 Speaker 1: from you. Just a reminder that the Stuff to Blow 629 00:36:43,400 --> 00:36:45,960 Speaker 1: Your Mind is primarily a science and culture episode, with 630 00:36:46,120 --> 00:36:49,000 Speaker 1: core episodes in Tuesdays and Thursdays, short form episodes on 631 00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:52,160 Speaker 1: Wednesdays and on Fridays. We set aside most serious concerns 632 00:36:52,400 --> 00:36:55,239 Speaker 1: to just talk about a weird film on Weird House Cinema. 633 00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:59,320 Speaker 3: Huge thanks as always to our excellent audio producer JJ Posway. 634 00:36:59,600 --> 00:37:01,080 Speaker 3: If you were like to get in touch with us 635 00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:03,560 Speaker 3: with feedback, on this episode or any other. To suggest 636 00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:05,600 Speaker 3: a topic for the future, or just to say hello, 637 00:37:05,719 --> 00:37:08,560 Speaker 3: you can email us at contact stuff to Blow your 638 00:37:08,600 --> 00:37:16,960 Speaker 3: Mind dot com. 639 00:37:17,000 --> 00:37:19,960 Speaker 2: Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For 640 00:37:20,040 --> 00:37:22,799 Speaker 2: more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, 641 00:37:22,960 --> 00:37:39,520 Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you're listening to your favorite shows.