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Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,

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Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of

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Speaker 1: today's best minds, and Michelle Obama says Donald Trump is

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Speaker 1: in clear mental decline.

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Speaker 2: She's not wrong.

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Speaker 1: We have the greatest show ever for you today, the

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Speaker 1: Lincoln Projects. Rick Wilson joins us to discuss early voting

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Speaker 1: and why we should be optimistic. Then we'll talk to

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Speaker 1: New Mexico's own Attorney General, Raoul Torres about his lawsuit

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Speaker 1: against Meta.

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Speaker 2: But first the news.

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Speaker 3: So Bally, we're going to start off today by torturing

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Speaker 3: the audience by making the listen to Joe Rogan. And

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Speaker 3: I will not be shocked if this is our lowest

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Speaker 3: traded episode ever for doing.

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Speaker 4: That to them.

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Speaker 2: Quid pro Oh, no, let's go.

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Speaker 3: This is Donald Trump who appeared on Joe Rogan. For

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Speaker 3: people who do not know, I'll say so.

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Speaker 5: There was a congressman years before I ran, and I

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Speaker 5: was very close to him, and I need did a

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Speaker 5: license on something, and he was very important in getting

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Speaker 5: a license. But it was a little bit controversial it

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Speaker 5: the license this particular thing that was being licensed. But

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Speaker 5: I was close to this guy and helped him and

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Speaker 5: everything else, and I went to him. I said, I'd

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Speaker 5: like to have your help, and he said, let me

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Speaker 5: take a look at it.

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Speaker 6: I said, oh, that's not too good.

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Speaker 5: But I really hope you did have anyway, he tapped

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Speaker 5: me along for a long period of time and ultimately

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Speaker 5: didn't do it. And I said, you are a stiff.

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Speaker 5: You could have done this thing so easy, et cetera.

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Speaker 5: But it was controversial. He was in cump me.

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Speaker 1: So I don't know, I mean, whatever the fuck that means. Look,

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Speaker 1: donald Trump quit pro quote, he got impeached.

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Speaker 2: For it once.

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Speaker 1: I don't know he wanted a congressman to do that.

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Speaker 1: By the way, whoever that congressman is, I mean, luckily

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump can't remember what.

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Speaker 6: The speculation is.

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Speaker 3: It's former Congressman Trolie Ragul, who was known as one

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Speaker 3: of the most corrupt congressmen.

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Speaker 1: It is time there, well within the range of possibility.

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Speaker 1: But at least Charlie wasn't corrupt enough to do what

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump wanted, and for that we must be grateful.

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Speaker 1: There were a number of things that in those three

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Speaker 1: hours with Joe Rogan where Donald Trump be clowned himself.

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Speaker 2: Let's get to the.

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Speaker 1: Tape of Donald Trump amusing about having been on.

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Speaker 6: Oprah oprah show, she was encouraging you.

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Speaker 5: Last week I did one of her last shows. I

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Speaker 5: think maybe Thursday or there was a big deal being

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Speaker 5: on Oprah's show, the last one, and I was like

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Speaker 5: one of the last shows in that final week.

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Speaker 1: Oprah's last show was May twenty fifth, two thousand and eleven,

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Speaker 1: not last week.

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Speaker 3: About Thursday or Friday, which also he taped this on

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Speaker 3: a Saturday, so that would have been the day before

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Speaker 3: or the day before that.

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Speaker 2: Yes, that was not Oprah's last show.

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Speaker 1: Interesting still though, Donald Trump again Joe Rogan tried to

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Speaker 1: get Donald Trump to say that he wouldn't use the

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Speaker 1: military against other Americans. He continued to decline. He drove

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Speaker 1: it home that ultimately his whole goal is to, you know,

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Speaker 1: deport huge quantities of people because illegal aliens are the

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Speaker 1: problem this country has. Well you know what, Jesse, what

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Speaker 1: there's some illegal aliens who are causing problems.

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Speaker 3: Will you discuss the calls are coming from inside the house,

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Speaker 3: one might say that.

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Speaker 2: Or inside the Twitter, as the case may be.

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Speaker 3: There is a new report out about Elon Musk and

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Speaker 3: his brother being illegal in this country for a period.

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Speaker 6: What did you see it to here?

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Speaker 1: Molly watching post which everyone is mad at right now,

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Speaker 1: reports that Elon Musk briefly worked illegally in the nineteen

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Speaker 1: nineties in the United States. He denied the report because

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Speaker 1: he's Elon. He said he was on a J one visa,

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Speaker 1: which transitioned into an H one B visa. But you know,

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Speaker 1: Elon Musk is known for not being, you know, a

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Speaker 1: totally straight shooter, so who the fuck knows. But the

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Speaker 1: irony here is pretty rich.

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Speaker 3: Somalia, I know, I'm really pushing our listeners today. After

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Speaker 3: playing Joe Rogan, I'm now going to read a David

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Speaker 3: Sachs tweet.

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Speaker 2: David Sachs, for those of you who don't know, is.

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Speaker 1: A South African billionaire, not to be confused with Elon Musk,

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Speaker 1: also very far right and has very little to recommend

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Speaker 1: him except he's very.

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Speaker 3: Very rich host of a terrible podcast, we might add.

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Speaker 3: Here's what Sachs had to say. The major broadcast networks ABC, CBS,

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Speaker 3: NBC operate on free licenses of public spectrum in exchange

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Speaker 3: for requirements to serve the public interest. They no longer do,

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Speaker 3: and this is an obsolete model anyway. The spectrum should

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Speaker 3: be auctioned off, with the proceeds used to pay down

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Speaker 3: the national debt. Of course, the networks can bid on

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Speaker 3: the spectrum, and they will win if broadcast networks are

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Speaker 3: still the most highly valued use. What's more likely to

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Speaker 3: happen is that valuable spectrum will be reapportioned to the

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Speaker 3: next generation of wireless applications, unleashing many more interesting options

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Speaker 3: for consumers and business. The networks could continue to operate

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Speaker 3: on cable like one hundred some other redundant chills.

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Speaker 2: Whatever, it doesn't matter.

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Speaker 1: These dumb fucking immigrants ruining our country.

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Speaker 6: You mus quote treated this and said, great idea.

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Speaker 1: So David Zax wants to make it so that cable

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Speaker 1: companies can't broadcast because they hate free speech. It turns

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Speaker 1: out these fucking guys hate free speech. Two aliens, I guess,

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Speaker 1: neither illegal anymore, both billionaires Elon's made tons of money

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Speaker 1: on government subsidies. Both of them would like to end

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Speaker 1: free speech. Elect Donald Trump and deport millions and millions

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Speaker 1: of people. Are we surprised? Maybe not so. Jesse and

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Speaker 1: I decided to do a little quick segment after Donald

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Speaker 1: Trump's German American Madison Square Garden German influenced German American

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Speaker 1: Bund influence Madison Square Garden rally a mirror eighty three

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Speaker 1: years later. The characters are different, but the rhetoric remains

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Speaker 1: very similar.

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Speaker 3: Like always, he's just repeating his father's best traits.

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Speaker 1: So my hottest take is that. And I don't know

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Speaker 1: if this was a plan or not, but Stephen Miller

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Speaker 1: had a line that came directly from the KKK And

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Speaker 1: actually I looked it up afterwards and it's the name

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Speaker 1: make America America again is actually the name of a

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Speaker 1: KKK pamphlet. It's called America for Americans KKK on the

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Speaker 1: cover and has a clansman. So Stephen Miller is Jewish,

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Speaker 1: so there were the clan were not fans of the Jews.

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Speaker 1: But he did in fact say that he wanted that

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Speaker 1: America was for Americans only, America for Americans and Americans only,

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Speaker 1: which is also derivative of the German slogan only for

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Speaker 1: German which Germans, which was used during World War Two

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Speaker 1: against people like Steven Miller.

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Speaker 2: Make it make sense him.

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Speaker 3: Being influenced by pamphlets like that is not a shocking revelation.

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Speaker 2: We're in a moment here where so.

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Speaker 3: Joe Rogan affiliated comedian Tony Hinchcliff, He's one of his buddies,

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Speaker 3: was the opener, and he did a lot of what

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Speaker 3: one might call humor if one didn't know what humor was,

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Speaker 3: where he said such things as.

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Speaker 1: Well, he said that you don't even need to hear it.

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Speaker 1: It's some fucking guy that no one's ever heard of.

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Speaker 6: Or I guess you've heard that. If you're into comedy,

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Speaker 6: you've heard of Tony Hinchcliff.

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Speaker 2: Okay, well I've never heard of him.

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Speaker 1: But if you're into Joe Rogan, you've heard of Tony Hinchcliff.

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Speaker 1: So that fucking guy said that Puerto Rico is an

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Speaker 1: island of garbage.

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Speaker 3: So this led to Bad Buddy endorsing Kamala Harris, which

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Speaker 3: I know a lot of our listeners will not be

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Speaker 3: familiar with the reggaeton artists Bad Buddy, but Bad Bunny is.

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Speaker 2: He's pretty famous.

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Speaker 3: He's well, what's more interesting is he is always in

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Speaker 3: the top ten of biggest musicians worldwide. And the other

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Speaker 3: thing is is he is very beloved for being altruistic

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Speaker 3: in Puerto Rico.

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Speaker 6: And like many people said, like the Taylor swift. They

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Speaker 6: very big.

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Speaker 3: This for a culture of people that maybe some of

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Speaker 3: our listeners are not around. This is a very huge

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Speaker 3: cultural moment because he really is seen as a virtuous person.

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Speaker 1: And also after that, Jlo and Ricky Martin immediately endorsed

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Speaker 1: Harris too. I want to just for a second read

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Speaker 1: the statistics of Puerto Ricans by state in this country.

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Speaker 1: Four hundred and fifty k. That's almost half a million

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Speaker 1: Puerto Ricans in the state of Pennsylvania. North Carolina has

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Speaker 1: one hundred thousand Puerto Ricans, Wisconsin sixty five thousand, Michigan

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Speaker 1: fifty thousand, Florida one point one million, and New York

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Speaker 1: one million Puerto Ricans.

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Speaker 2: Not an insignificant number of people.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and they are trying to pretend, oh, it was

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Speaker 3: just a joke. But Trump Junior, one of the policy guys,

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Speaker 3: a the Trump kip, he of course, retweeted it like

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Speaker 3: it was awesome.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Donald Trump Junior, you may remember him from being

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Speaker 1: an abject more on. But there was also another line too,

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Speaker 1: where one of them said, Latinos love making babies.

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Speaker 2: It was a lot of vitriol. Also, someone said.

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Speaker 1: One of those speakers said that Hillary Clinton was the

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Speaker 1: sixth son of a bitch and the whole fucking party

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Speaker 1: a bunch of degenerate low lives to.

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Speaker 2: Haters and lowlives every one of them.

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Speaker 1: So a lot of pretty awful rhetoric. And of course

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Speaker 1: USA today, Trump sticks to economy, immigration and closing pitch

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Speaker 1: in Addison Square.

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Speaker 6: Message always be seene washing, so not.

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Speaker 2: Surprising, but he is upsetting. That's it for this episode

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Speaker 2: of Fast Politics.

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Speaker 1: Tune in every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday and Saturday to hear

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Speaker 1: the best minds and politics make sense of all this chaos.

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Speaker 1: If you enjoy this podcast, please send it to a

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Speaker 1: friend and keep the conversation going.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for listening.

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Speaker 1: Rick Wilson is the founder of the Lincoln Project and

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Speaker 1: the host of The Enemies List.

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Speaker 2: Welcome back, Rick Wilson.

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Speaker 4: Hey Bali junk Fast Back as always for more hygiens

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Speaker 4: and frivolity.

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Speaker 1: Nine days, nine days, so it'll be eight when people

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Speaker 1: are listening to this. So where are you? Where am I?

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Speaker 1: Where are any of us today?

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Speaker 4: Look, we are at this moment very close to a scenario.

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Speaker 4: I know people are going to yell at me for

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Speaker 4: saying this, but I'm beginning to think we're going to

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Speaker 4: have a bigger win than not legitimately beginning to believe

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Speaker 4: that the overarching chaos around Trump has reduced a lot

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Speaker 4: of the viability that he had. I don't think he's

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Speaker 4: improved a situation at all, and I'm here for that.

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Speaker 2: So explain to me what is making you think that.

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Speaker 4: Again, as we talked about last time, I am watching

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Speaker 4: these early voting numbers, and the more of these early

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Speaker 4: voting waves that are showing up in the reporting from

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Speaker 4: early votes, the more women we see turning out to

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Speaker 4: vote early, the more expansive the lead becomes. I mean,

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Speaker 4: we're at a point now where Donald Trump is going

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Speaker 4: to have to pull off a massive, massive election day

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Speaker 4: male vote that has thus far not been out there

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Speaker 4: at the scale he's going to need. And those low

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Speaker 4: propensity voters that he relies on, those ones and twos

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Speaker 4: he relies on, we're not in that world right now.

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Speaker 4: They're not the ones and twos are not driving so

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Speaker 4: far from what we're able to see in the in

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Speaker 4: the turnout equation.

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Speaker 2: How do you see that? Can you explain it a

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Speaker 2: little more?

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Speaker 4: I think that there's a part of the universe of

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Speaker 4: Trump that they are trying to bullshit Democrats into panicking.

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Speaker 4: It's working, by the way.

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Speaker 2: You know me, I'm always panicking.

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Speaker 4: You do like a good fret as they say, yes.

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Speaker 1: Yes, yes is word ju is. I mean, this is

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Speaker 1: what we do. This is our eighties.

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Speaker 2: I do, I do it.

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Speaker 4: But I'm telling you we're not right now in the

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Speaker 4: same world that we were in. I still go back

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Speaker 4: to this, these early numbers, as Stuart steven says, he goes,

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Speaker 4: you know, all the polling is based on modeling of

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Speaker 4: prior elections.

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Speaker 2: That is true, right for sure.

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Speaker 4: But early voting numbers are empirical. They are not backward

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Speaker 4: looking models. They are not speculative. They are empirical. I

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Speaker 4: look at the way that the early vote is turning

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Speaker 4: so far, and I am fine with it. Would I

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Speaker 4: like everything to be perfect all the time? Sure? Would

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Speaker 4: I like her to be twelve points ahead? Absolutely? Do

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Speaker 4: I need her to be twelve points ahead? I do not.

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Speaker 1: And Republicans are early voting, which they didn't. You know,

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Speaker 1: it's a sort of different elector and showing up right

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Speaker 1: now to early voting.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean the twenty twenty election, because of COVID

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Speaker 4: was a truly distorted early voting model. We will never

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Speaker 4: have that model again, you know, God.

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Speaker 2: Willing right, hopefully.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, but as we look at where we're standing today again,

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Speaker 4: I'd much rather be in our shoes than theirs. I'd

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Speaker 4: much rather be a campaign that has all the resources

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Speaker 4: it needs to.

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Speaker 2: Spend billion dollars.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, and right now that is not the Trump campaign.

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Speaker 4: I'd might s rather have a campaign that has a

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Speaker 4: field program run by trained professionals rather than Elon Musk.

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Speaker 2: And also that long haired guy, the walk Away guy.

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Speaker 4: Oh yes, Brandon Struka.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that guy seems great.

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Speaker 4: Oh yeah, he's a deeply experienced campaign pro. I mean,

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Speaker 4: everybody wakes up in the morning and goes, hey, you

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Speaker 4: know who we need in this campaign is Brandon Straka.

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Speaker 1: And what about Charlie Kirk? Can we have a minute

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Speaker 1: for Charlie Kirk, the guy whose entire career is based

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Speaker 1: on the fact that he didn't get into college.

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Speaker 4: Charlie Kirk and the Turning Point USA program, what they've

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Speaker 4: done is they've become a conduit for a bunch of

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Speaker 4: dark money from a bunch of Republican billionaires. Blah blah blah.

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Speaker 4: You heard the story. And Charlie Kirk, as we all know,

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Speaker 4: He is not a bright man, right, He's not even

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Speaker 4: a moderately smart man. He is profoundly and relentlessly stupid.

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Speaker 4: And because of that relentless stupidity, you know this group

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Speaker 4: that he's built, which basically, by the way, let's all

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Speaker 4: understand what Turning Point really is. Charlie Kirk could not

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Speaker 4: get laid in a tie whorehouse with just full of hundreds,

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Speaker 4: so he built this organization because he wanted to pussy.

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Speaker 1: Oh Jesus Christ, I even correct.

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Speaker 2: I'd love to you. You are wrong.

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Speaker 1: He didn't get into college, so he got so mad

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Speaker 1: that he started a conservative organization to try to protect

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Speaker 1: mediocre white guys who can't go to get into college.

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Speaker 2: I'm not sure this is about sex.

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Speaker 4: No, it's it's listen, everything's about sex.

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Speaker 3: The alternate theory is, you remember when he went to

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Speaker 3: the hospital, he's always surrounded by teenage boys just saying,

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Speaker 3: oh my.

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Speaker 2: God, the two of you.

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Speaker 6: I mean, there's a lot of evidence.

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Speaker 4: I'm not saying. The original name of Turning Point USA

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Speaker 4: was how Swatt.

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Speaker 1: No, I don't want to go to jail for either

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Speaker 1: of you. Listen to me, You're going to go two

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Speaker 1: point five million early votes cast so far in seven

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Speaker 1: sweating states, nine hundred and fifty two thousand more women

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Speaker 1: voted than men.

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Speaker 4: What's being challenged here right now is a fundamental reality, okay,

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Speaker 4: and that reality is the impiriculator from the early turnout

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Speaker 4: is very very favorable to Kamala Harris. Okay, very very

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Speaker 4: very favorable. You've got I think in the polling you've

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Speaker 4: seen a high overscoring of Republicans. In the turnout you're seeing,

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Speaker 4: I think something that's going to be much more reflective

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Speaker 4: of election day. There used to be this conception that

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Speaker 4: early voters were a different creature than election day voters.

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Speaker 4: I don't think that's the case anymore. I don't think

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Speaker 4: that works the same way anymore on election day. In

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Speaker 4: my view, if women haven't come out to vote early,

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Speaker 4: they're going to flood the zone on election day. And

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Speaker 4: it is going I am beginning to God, I'm going

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Speaker 4: to jinx myself saying this, I am beginning to feel

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Speaker 4: like that of the three scenarios, right, of the three scenarios,

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Speaker 4: narrow Harris win, narrow Trump win, Harris blowout, there is

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Speaker 4: no Trump blowout scenario right now in the numbers.

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Speaker 2: Okay, and there never has been right. He can't. He's

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Speaker 2: not a blowout. He is a ceiling.

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Speaker 4: If it happens, it is not based on any kind

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Speaker 4: of math that we're seeing. If I'm wrong about it,

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Speaker 4: I'm not going to feel bad for being wrong, because

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Speaker 4: it will be something such a it would be such

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Speaker 4: a weird externality that no one can spot. And look,

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Speaker 4: I am a reasonably smart.

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Speaker 2: Dog, many people are saying, and I have and I.

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Speaker 4: Have a lot of but I have a lot of

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Speaker 4: people who are smarter than me by an order of magnitude.

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Speaker 4: About the math and the numbers and the polling. They

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Speaker 4: are pretty sanguine right now that the blowout number may

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Speaker 4: be increasing in probability. That doesn't mean it's a That

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Speaker 4: doesn't mean it's going to happen. That doesn't mean it's

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Speaker 4: it's the highest likelihood of happening. But there are a

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Speaker 4: lot of models right now that show the margins for

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Speaker 4: Harris opening up because of the voter data we're looking

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Speaker 4: at coming out of early voting and ballot requests. It's

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Speaker 4: a sign of two things. A sign she has a

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Speaker 4: field program for one that's doing the work okay. And

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Speaker 4: there's a sign that the averages you're seeing on five

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Speaker 4: point thirty eight and real clear and.

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Speaker 2: Are have been juiced by GEOP pollsters.

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Speaker 4: Right, yeah, right, other polling aggregators are now going to

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Speaker 4: diverge more and more from the data we're seeing come

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Speaker 4: out of the early vote. Those models are not set

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Speaker 4: to include the early voting data. They don't model that.

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Speaker 4: They model polls only. They don't have and they model

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Speaker 4: prior election data only. They don't have this data as

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Speaker 4: part of their model. The bullshit markets poly market and

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Speaker 4: clock Calshee and all that, it's all garbage. Ignore it,

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Speaker 4: ignore it, ignore it. But look, I don't think you're

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Speaker 4: going to see as many split ticket voters as were

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Speaker 4: previously modeled. The split ticket theories say that three times fast.

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Speaker 4: I think it's kind of falling apart a little bit.

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Speaker 4: You're seeing that there aren't going to be a lot

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Speaker 4: of people who vote for Mark Robinson in North Carolina.

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Speaker 4: It's going to drag him down. He's down forty four

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Speaker 4: points among women at my last point, forty four points

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Speaker 4: among women. How are you going to do that? Market?

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Speaker 4: I think he's going to lose by eighteen to twenty points,

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Speaker 4: maybe a little more.

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Speaker 2: Is it bragging?

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Speaker 1: About maybe sleeping with your wife's sister that is not

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Speaker 1: appealing to women voters, or is it something else.

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Speaker 4: I don't know. Calling yourself black Hitler might have had

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Speaker 4: a part of it. Women don't really love Hitler either,

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Speaker 4: but I think that's that's a part of it. Yeah,

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Speaker 4: I had to introduced the words dookie, shoot to our.

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Speaker 1: Let the record show I am making a disgusted face.

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Speaker 1: With as little movement as my face has, it's still

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Speaker 1: able to be horrified by that.

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Speaker 4: So here's the other thing I think is happening here

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Speaker 4: right now, and again, this is the toughest unicorn to

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Speaker 4: hunt in the forest. I think right now we are

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Speaker 4: seeing undecided voters right now. I'm going to make a

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Speaker 4: quick prediction. If they're an undecided voter right now, about

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Speaker 4: sixty five percent of them are going to split to

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Speaker 4: Kamala Harris.

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Speaker 2: Okay, so Donald Trump.

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Speaker 4: It's the Hitler stupid.

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Speaker 1: As J Carver would say, Donald Trump did ten thousand

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Speaker 1: hours with the Joe Rogan in which they discussed My

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Speaker 1: favorite thing about that interview is that Joe Rogan did

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Speaker 1: the same thing that John Hannity did, the same thing

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Speaker 1: that any interviewer who wants Trump to be less disinh

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Speaker 1: inhibited than he is. He said, you don't really want

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Speaker 1: to jail Nancy Pelosi.

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Speaker 2: And Donald Trump said.

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Speaker 4: There are many people who have been very mean to me. No,

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Speaker 4: he said, you know, Donald, you didn't really they didn't

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Speaker 4: really steal the election from you. It was that's not real,

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Speaker 4: is it? And of course Trump couldn't fucking help himself.

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Speaker 4: And that is something that we know in some of

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Speaker 4: this some of the stuff of these softer Republican voters,

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Speaker 4: they're like, Okay, I'm sick of the I'm sick of

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Speaker 4: the bullshit. He lost the election January sixth. They don't

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Speaker 4: like it. But you know, Joe Rogan is supposed to

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Speaker 4: appeal to young men. Yeah, he's supposed to appeal to

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Speaker 4: young men. And yes, young men may well vote for

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Speaker 4: Donald Trump. That's okay. You know, eighteen to thirty men

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Speaker 4: are gonna are going to probably give Trump a fifty

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Speaker 4: five percent.

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Speaker 1: Split the nine of them. It's not a huge voting book.

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Speaker 4: But young women eighteen to thirty are going to give

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Speaker 4: Harris like an eighty twenty split. And look an independent voters.

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Speaker 4: We're starting to see independent voters in the early states. Okay,

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Speaker 4: they have shifted toward Harris. Some states a little bit,

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Speaker 4: some states a lot, some states demnimous, but they are

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Speaker 4: shifting toward Harris. I mean, look, and I'll just give

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Speaker 4: you one example. Independence in Arizona in twenty twenty eleven

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Speaker 4: it was an eleven point difference between Biden and Trump.

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Speaker 4: Right now, Independence in Arizona are pulling at about what

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Speaker 4: our number is about a seventeen point difference between between

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Speaker 4: Harris and Trump. Really, if Independence end up popping over

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Speaker 4: at those scales and those numbers are much smaller in

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Speaker 4: other states, that's just one that I happened.

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Speaker 2: That's hug. Those are huge numbers, those.

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Speaker 4: Trend lines with independence, If they break with those proportions,

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Speaker 4: we're gonna have a much more interesting race. I will

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Speaker 4: tell you. I heard from a Florida polster on Friday

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Speaker 4: night who said to me, he goes. A month ago,

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Speaker 4: I would have told you Trump would blow the state

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Speaker 4: out with ten points. Now I think he wins by

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Speaker 4: three or four. Look, I don't think we have enough

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Speaker 4: time for that trend line to hit zero for Trump.

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Speaker 4: But look, no campaign is ever going to wake up

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Speaker 4: in the morning and go, hey, we're bullshitting you. We're losing.

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Speaker 4: Trump is outstanding, okay at bullshitting people that he's winning,

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Speaker 4: and his people are going to believe it.

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Speaker 1: And it's better for him to say he's winning, because

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Speaker 1: he's going to say it was rigged.

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Speaker 2: Either way, that's correct.

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Speaker 4: He is here to tell you it was stolen, it

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Speaker 4: was rigged, it was this, it was that. And nothing

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Speaker 4: will change Donald Trump's insistence on playing the game. That

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Speaker 4: will lead to violence, and that will lead to misery

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Speaker 4: in this country in ways to quote Donald Trump that

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Speaker 4: we've never seen before.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I think if we're going to take something

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Speaker 1: to be worried about from this conversation, and everyone needs

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Speaker 1: to vote, and everyone needs to canvas. And I saw

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Speaker 1: Dan Nathan. I was on TV with Dan Nathan the

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Speaker 1: other day, and he's going to Pennsylvania.

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Speaker 2: You know the.

442
00:22:50,320 --> 00:22:53,760
Speaker 1: Number of affluent New Yorkers who are in Pennsylvania. There's

443
00:22:53,840 --> 00:22:56,520
Speaker 1: more of them in Pennsylvania than there are people in

444
00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:57,760
Speaker 1: Pennsylvania at this point.

445
00:22:57,920 --> 00:23:00,359
Speaker 4: The number of people who have flooded the zone, including

446
00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:02,560
Speaker 4: a lot of the young staff at Lincoln are over

447
00:23:02,680 --> 00:23:05,600
Speaker 4: in Pennsylvania. Dock in doors this weekend because look, a

448
00:23:05,600 --> 00:23:08,000
Speaker 4: lot of our work is done at this point. Our

449
00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:10,280
Speaker 4: missiles are in the silos, they're ready to launch. We've

450
00:23:10,280 --> 00:23:13,480
Speaker 4: got the ads are pretty much done. The fundraising expressional yeah,

451
00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:16,240
Speaker 4: politically right. No, I actually have nuclear weapons in mind.

452
00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:18,040
Speaker 4: I tell you I want you to be the first

453
00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:20,440
Speaker 4: to know that my nuclear weapons pro does that long

454
00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:21,480
Speaker 4: last come to fruition?

455
00:23:22,240 --> 00:23:22,520
Speaker 2: Yes?

456
00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:26,360
Speaker 4: But look, and I also am watching the favorability as

457
00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:30,679
Speaker 4: we always talk about. She is more favorable than Donald Trump.

458
00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:33,560
Speaker 4: That's just it. She has higher faves than Donald Trump,

459
00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:37,119
Speaker 4: and those higher faves are going to be something that

460
00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:40,640
Speaker 4: saves the day. Look, her faves in Florida now are

461
00:23:40,720 --> 00:23:43,000
Speaker 4: tied with Trump. Same person told me that that there

462
00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:44,720
Speaker 4: faves in Florida are now tied.

463
00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:47,119
Speaker 2: Phrase that is in now.

464
00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:49,400
Speaker 4: That doesn't mean she's going to win. It just means

465
00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:50,600
Speaker 4: that their faves are tied.

466
00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:52,960
Speaker 2: Right. I think that that's a really good point.

467
00:23:53,000 --> 00:23:54,760
Speaker 1: I would love you to just for two seconds talk

468
00:23:54,800 --> 00:23:59,760
Speaker 1: about North Carolina because a member the Freedom Caucus said, oh, yes,

469
00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:02,240
Speaker 1: can you talk us through that? Because I feel like

470
00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:03,880
Speaker 1: that's something voters hate.

471
00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:09,480
Speaker 4: Voters are not fans of preemptive declarations of victory by

472
00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:10,680
Speaker 4: either party and.

473
00:24:10,760 --> 00:24:12,720
Speaker 2: Also disenfranchising them.

474
00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:16,200
Speaker 1: So this North Carolina Republican from the Freedo chair of

475
00:24:16,200 --> 00:24:19,639
Speaker 1: the Freedom Caucus said, because of the hurricane, they should

476
00:24:19,680 --> 00:24:22,639
Speaker 1: just award all the electoral votes to Donald Trump. It

477
00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:27,000
Speaker 1: reminds me of the situation in Nebraska, Nebraska's second district,

478
00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:32,080
Speaker 1: where Republicans decided to steal their electoral vote and now

479
00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:34,800
Speaker 1: they are fucking pissed.

480
00:24:35,040 --> 00:24:35,639
Speaker 2: Continue.

481
00:24:35,960 --> 00:24:39,000
Speaker 4: First off, the Freedom Caucus is a caucus, but has

482
00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:42,600
Speaker 4: nothing to do with freedom. They are the authoritarian wing

483
00:24:42,920 --> 00:24:46,879
Speaker 4: of the authoritarian Party, the militant wing of the authoritarian Party.

484
00:24:46,960 --> 00:24:50,160
Speaker 4: And the fact that they're out claiming that anything should

485
00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:53,000
Speaker 4: just be preemptively handed to Donald Trump. That's the fucking

486
00:24:53,040 --> 00:24:58,600
Speaker 4: Bath Party in Iraq, right, That's not any party in America.

487
00:24:59,119 --> 00:25:01,879
Speaker 4: So dom has won with a one and fourteen percent mudgin.

488
00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:03,760
Speaker 4: Oh okay, I.

489
00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:06,000
Speaker 2: Haven't thought of the Bath Party in like a decade.

490
00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:07,200
Speaker 2: That's so weird.

491
00:25:07,320 --> 00:25:09,800
Speaker 1: Yes, okay, go on, thank you for that blast from

492
00:25:09,800 --> 00:25:10,360
Speaker 1: the past.

493
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:14,760
Speaker 4: You're very welcome the idea that you preemptively award a

494
00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:20,240
Speaker 4: state to Donald Trump for any purpose whatsoever. I promise you.

495
00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:22,679
Speaker 4: If let's just say this, if Gavin Newsom came out

496
00:25:22,720 --> 00:25:25,679
Speaker 4: and said, well, California's an inevitability, we know what's going

497
00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:27,480
Speaker 4: to happen here, so we're just gonna go ahead and

498
00:25:27,680 --> 00:25:31,080
Speaker 4: preemptively declare that Trump cannot win our state. Fox would

499
00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:35,879
Speaker 4: be mobilizing every goddamn reporter in America for communism twenty

500
00:25:35,920 --> 00:25:40,440
Speaker 4: twenty four, the California Republic of Communists, bla blah. We're

501
00:25:40,440 --> 00:25:44,280
Speaker 4: not in a country, thankfully yet, where this sort of

502
00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:47,240
Speaker 4: thing is acceptable where voters go, oh yeah, well, that's

503
00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 4: exactly how it works. Is some dipshit neck beard from

504
00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:54,920
Speaker 4: North Carolina goes out of Claire's that the world is

505
00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:58,480
Speaker 4: Trump's all, praise the great leader. That's not how it works.

506
00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:01,400
Speaker 4: She is, I think petitive in North Carolina. I still

507
00:26:01,440 --> 00:26:04,800
Speaker 4: believe that the western North Carolina, the devastation out there,

508
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:07,560
Speaker 4: is going to drive down Republican turnout. We've got a

509
00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:10,760
Speaker 4: campaign nationally, it's got about a four point advantage for

510
00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:13,280
Speaker 4: her right now. She's ahead on a couple of big

511
00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:16,720
Speaker 4: issues that I watch and care about in national polling,

512
00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:20,399
Speaker 4: looking out for the middle class and protecting democracy. I

513
00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:24,280
Speaker 4: think those underpin the groups she needs to win, like

514
00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:28,200
Speaker 4: she needs to win these Cheney Republicans, these Haley Republicans,

515
00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:31,720
Speaker 4: these Lincoln Project Republicans. She needs to win those people,

516
00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:35,480
Speaker 4: and by being stronger on democracy, that's a real plus

517
00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:38,399
Speaker 4: for her. Trump's even only ahead, by the way on crime.

518
00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:42,240
Speaker 4: Depending on the poll you're looking at between two and

519
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:43,960
Speaker 4: seven percent on crime.

520
00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:45,840
Speaker 2: Well, he did a lot of crime.

521
00:26:46,000 --> 00:26:52,280
Speaker 1: Two things, One is that watching Biden apologize to Indigenous

522
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:57,879
Speaker 1: people feels like a meaningful and important because Indigenous people

523
00:26:57,920 --> 00:27:01,800
Speaker 1: have been so mistreated by this country, and be also

524
00:27:01,840 --> 00:27:05,560
Speaker 1: perhaps thoughtful and political.

525
00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:10,359
Speaker 4: The in number of Indigenous people nationally is not something

526
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:12,400
Speaker 4: you look at, go okay, the election's going to rise

527
00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:15,399
Speaker 4: or fall on this. However, the in number of Indigenous

528
00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:19,760
Speaker 4: people in Nevada and in Arizona, and in Nebraska, and

529
00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:24,119
Speaker 4: in Wisconsin and in Michigan is not trivial. This, I

530
00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:26,399
Speaker 4: think is an example of the right politics and the

531
00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:29,320
Speaker 4: right policy coming together at one moment. Actually, I haven't

532
00:27:29,359 --> 00:27:31,640
Speaker 4: polled Native Americans at all. I just haven't.

533
00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:34,320
Speaker 2: It's very hard to do right too well.

534
00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:36,440
Speaker 4: Right, it's every saying we've had an hour package because

535
00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:38,760
Speaker 4: they're not the demo that we're trying to move, and

536
00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:43,560
Speaker 4: they have traditionally been more democratic but less interested in

537
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:45,240
Speaker 4: the last couple of cycles.

538
00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:47,480
Speaker 2: Though they were meaningful in twenty twenty.

539
00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:49,040
Speaker 4: Right, But I was just gonna say, but I do

540
00:27:49,119 --> 00:27:51,080
Speaker 4: want to point out that in twenty twenty they made

541
00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:53,920
Speaker 4: a difference. So we've got a lot of politics inside

542
00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:57,720
Speaker 4: the politics right now. Harris's campaign I think is running

543
00:27:57,960 --> 00:28:01,359
Speaker 4: very very well. I think it's a strikingly stronger campaign

544
00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:06,440
Speaker 4: than it's democratic skeptics in the beginning have figured out.

545
00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:10,240
Speaker 4: And I'm happy about that in one way because specifically

546
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:13,359
Speaker 4: because I look at the mechanics of the campaigns, I

547
00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:17,360
Speaker 4: look at the abilities of the campaigns. Right now, Donald

548
00:28:17,400 --> 00:28:21,880
Speaker 4: Trump is you know, he's doing three thousand person arenas,

549
00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:25,199
Speaker 4: five thousand person arenas. She's doing twenty five thousand person arenas.

550
00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:28,720
Speaker 4: He's getting guys who actually had their songs on k

551
00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:32,400
Speaker 4: Tel records. Great as it's in nineteen eighty nine. Meant

552
00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:34,840
Speaker 4: she's getting Beyonce. So a lot of these things I

553
00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:38,480
Speaker 4: think are really meaningful. That how the campaigns are running

554
00:28:38,600 --> 00:28:42,000
Speaker 4: and being run, to me, that's a big deal. That's

555
00:28:42,000 --> 00:28:44,880
Speaker 4: important to me. How those things are functioning. And her

556
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:48,040
Speaker 4: campaign is functioning at a very high level. His campaign

557
00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:51,760
Speaker 4: is not functioning at any level. You know, but look

558
00:28:51,800 --> 00:28:55,040
Speaker 4: Trump Trump's superpower is he never needed a real campaign

559
00:28:55,360 --> 00:28:57,520
Speaker 4: when Hillary was sort of off the radar for the

560
00:28:57,600 --> 00:29:01,040
Speaker 4: last two weeks of the campaign and getting by Jim Comey,

561
00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:03,400
Speaker 4: and he didn't think he needed a real campaign against

562
00:29:03,480 --> 00:29:06,120
Speaker 4: Joe Biden. They thought this would be a race where

563
00:29:06,120 --> 00:29:08,440
Speaker 4: it was only going to be Joe Biden is too

564
00:29:08,480 --> 00:29:11,120
Speaker 4: old and also elderly and also ancient, and that that

565
00:29:11,280 --> 00:29:13,200
Speaker 4: was going to give him some sort of, you know,

566
00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:17,160
Speaker 4: clean shot at an easy win. Well, that is not

567
00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:20,120
Speaker 4: the campaign we're in now. And then the fact that

568
00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:23,000
Speaker 4: Chris Losovita got paid twenty two million dollars to do

569
00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:27,360
Speaker 4: this job, which is the greatest scam anybody's ever pulled

570
00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:31,040
Speaker 4: on Donald Trump by far by order of magnitude. It's amazing,

571
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:33,640
Speaker 4: and their campaign is in chaos.

572
00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:36,360
Speaker 2: Rick Wilson, Molly Jong.

573
00:29:36,240 --> 00:29:37,400
Speaker 4: Fast, That's always a pleasure.

574
00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:37,960
Speaker 2: Thank you.

575
00:29:38,840 --> 00:29:41,640
Speaker 1: Are you concerned about Project twenty twenty five and how

576
00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:45,360
Speaker 1: awful Trump's second term could be, Well, so are we,

577
00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:47,880
Speaker 1: which is why we teamed up with iHeart to make

578
00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:51,560
Speaker 1: a limited series with the experts on what a disaster

579
00:29:52,040 --> 00:29:55,760
Speaker 1: Project twenty twenty five would be for America's future. Right now,

580
00:29:55,760 --> 00:29:59,080
Speaker 1: we have just released the final episode of this five

581
00:29:59,160 --> 00:30:03,160
Speaker 1: episode series. They're all available by looking up Molly Jong

582
00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:06,800
Speaker 1: Fast Project twenty twenty five on YouTube, and if you

583
00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:10,480
Speaker 1: are more of a podcast person and not say a YouTuber,

584
00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:13,280
Speaker 1: you can hit play and put your phone in the

585
00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:16,360
Speaker 1: lock screen and it will play back just like a broadcast.

586
00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:20,040
Speaker 1: All five episodes are online. Now we need to educate

587
00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:23,720
Speaker 1: Americans on what Trump's second term would or could do

588
00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:25,080
Speaker 1: to this country, So.

589
00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:26,680
Speaker 2: Please watch it and spread the word.

590
00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:33,000
Speaker 1: Raoul Torres is the Attorney General of New Mexico.

591
00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:37,560
Speaker 2: Welcome to Fast Politics.

592
00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:38,240
Speaker 1: A G.

593
00:30:38,520 --> 00:30:41,560
Speaker 2: Torres, thanks for having me. You are in New Mexico.

594
00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:43,160
Speaker 4: I am you.

595
00:30:43,240 --> 00:30:44,800
Speaker 2: Are the attorney's general.

596
00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:49,240
Speaker 1: We are ten days from perhaps the most important election

597
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:52,920
Speaker 1: of our lifetime. I feel like Republicans have used attorneys

598
00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:57,720
Speaker 1: generals in crazy ways over the last decade.

599
00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:00,920
Speaker 2: How do you sort of make it sense to us?

600
00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:05,280
Speaker 7: The attorneys general serve as the chief legal officer for

601
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:09,480
Speaker 7: the respective states that they serve in, and for the

602
00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:14,640
Speaker 7: majority of American history they played a pretty limited role

603
00:31:15,200 --> 00:31:19,920
Speaker 7: in both representing state agencies or filing actions on behalf

604
00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:21,320
Speaker 7: of the state civil actions.

605
00:31:21,560 --> 00:31:22,280
Speaker 2: Some of us.

606
00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:26,520
Speaker 7: Also have concurrent criminal jurisdiction. I'm formerly the elected district

607
00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:29,200
Speaker 7: attorney here in Albuquerque, so I come from that background

608
00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:32,680
Speaker 7: as a prosecutor, but we don't have direct criminal jurisdiction.

609
00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:34,000
Speaker 4: But over the last ten.

610
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:39,480
Speaker 7: Or fifteen years, ags have evolved to take on increasingly,

611
00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:45,160
Speaker 7: i would say, impactful roles in shaping national policy through litigation.

612
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:49,320
Speaker 7: You've seen it in the Republican side when they file

613
00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:53,160
Speaker 7: actions to oppose various things that have been undertaken by

614
00:31:53,160 --> 00:31:56,440
Speaker 7: the Biden administration or the Obama administration. The same is

615
00:31:56,480 --> 00:32:00,360
Speaker 7: also true for the Democratic Attorneys general. Was it in

616
00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:02,360
Speaker 7: this role at this time at that time, but my

617
00:32:02,520 --> 00:32:07,040
Speaker 7: colleagues who were serving during the first Trump administration filed

618
00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:10,640
Speaker 7: a number of actions to protect voting rights, environmental rights,

619
00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:16,200
Speaker 7: access to reproductive healthcare, in engaging important sort of domestic

620
00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:20,360
Speaker 7: and international policy issues. And so these offices have increasingly

621
00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:24,960
Speaker 7: become a place where national policy gets filtered through the courtrooms.

622
00:32:25,240 --> 00:32:28,640
Speaker 7: And what you've seen is that while we live in

623
00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:32,080
Speaker 7: this sort of polarized world where Congress is sort of

624
00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:36,880
Speaker 7: stuck in place and very little of real significance, seems

625
00:32:36,920 --> 00:32:39,360
Speaker 7: to be able to move as quickly through that through

626
00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:43,160
Speaker 7: the legislative process as it used to. A lot of

627
00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:46,320
Speaker 7: the change that you see on both sides of the

628
00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:51,120
Speaker 7: equation and to originate oftentimes in ag offices around the country.

629
00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:54,320
Speaker 1: So talk to me about forever chemicals, because that's one

630
00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:57,560
Speaker 1: of the ways in which you're doing so. I mean,

631
00:32:57,600 --> 00:33:04,200
Speaker 1: if you think about like the Texas Age is doing freeziness, here,

632
00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:07,760
Speaker 1: you guys on the left are doing something that's actually useful.

633
00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:09,000
Speaker 2: So talk us through that.

634
00:33:09,760 --> 00:33:12,640
Speaker 7: A lot of ags from around the country, including I

635
00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:15,800
Speaker 7: think some of my Republican counterparts, but definitely a lot

636
00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:21,040
Speaker 7: of my Democratic counterparts, we have filed actions against the

637
00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:25,120
Speaker 7: manufacturers of PFASs or what are commonly referred to as

638
00:33:25,200 --> 00:33:28,320
Speaker 7: forever chemicals for people who don't really know what that is.

639
00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:31,640
Speaker 7: It's a unique kind of chemical compound that has been

640
00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:36,920
Speaker 7: used in consumer products on everything from the grease resistant

641
00:33:37,000 --> 00:33:41,360
Speaker 7: lining of pizza boxes, in Hamburger wrapping all the way

642
00:33:41,440 --> 00:33:43,080
Speaker 7: to carpets and everything else.

643
00:33:43,520 --> 00:33:45,280
Speaker 2: Well, lo and behold.

644
00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:48,680
Speaker 7: These corporations have known four years and years that many

645
00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:53,520
Speaker 7: of these compounds are cancer causing. They have really serious

646
00:33:53,520 --> 00:33:57,880
Speaker 7: side effects. They have been included in firefighting foam. We've

647
00:33:57,880 --> 00:34:02,720
Speaker 7: had real horrific disclosure of firefighters, first responders and others

648
00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:06,239
Speaker 7: who've been exposed to that foam, who've been armed and

649
00:34:06,320 --> 00:34:10,520
Speaker 7: so we have filed an action against the manufacturers, and

650
00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:13,840
Speaker 7: we have been joined by different ages from across the

651
00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:16,359
Speaker 7: country that are doing the same. But it's the kind

652
00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:19,120
Speaker 7: of thing that we as AGS have been engaging for

653
00:34:19,200 --> 00:34:23,000
Speaker 7: quite some time. AGS first started to really litigate in

654
00:34:23,040 --> 00:34:26,520
Speaker 7: this space in the era of big tobacco, and it

655
00:34:26,680 --> 00:34:30,960
Speaker 7: was concerted and at that time by partisan effort on

656
00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:35,200
Speaker 7: the part of Attorney's General to get the big tobacco

657
00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:37,880
Speaker 7: companies to own up to what they had done in

658
00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:41,520
Speaker 7: terms of marketing and known dangerous and addictive substance, and

659
00:34:41,560 --> 00:34:43,480
Speaker 7: to start paying for the harm that they had costed

660
00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:44,320
Speaker 7: the American people.

661
00:34:44,800 --> 00:34:48,080
Speaker 1: These are really important lawsuits, and for me, you know,

662
00:34:48,200 --> 00:34:51,880
Speaker 1: as the cover job done with environmental stuff, one of

663
00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:54,520
Speaker 1: the really things that have made me so has made

664
00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:57,440
Speaker 1: me so despondent, is the way the federal government has

665
00:34:57,560 --> 00:35:02,799
Speaker 1: refused to regulate every thing from food to fuel. I

666
00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:07,160
Speaker 1: mean just really given up on even trying to hold

667
00:35:07,200 --> 00:35:11,799
Speaker 1: big companies accountable. And one of the most infuriating is

668
00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:16,160
Speaker 1: their inability or total disinterest in regulating technology.

669
00:35:16,440 --> 00:35:19,239
Speaker 2: You filed the case against Meta talk us through that.

670
00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:22,759
Speaker 7: Yes, so we've actually filed two pretty significant lawsuits. We

671
00:35:22,840 --> 00:35:26,400
Speaker 7: filed an action against Meta last year, focusing in on

672
00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:31,680
Speaker 7: both Facebook and Instagram for doing two things. Basically, The

673
00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:37,239
Speaker 7: first is marketing a product and building and delivering a

674
00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:41,080
Speaker 7: product that they know is harmful to the psychological health

675
00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:46,080
Speaker 7: and mental health of young people. We have growing awareness

676
00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:51,319
Speaker 7: about the impact of excessive social media use on anxiety, depression,

677
00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:57,160
Speaker 7: the ways in which it leads to self image issues,

678
00:35:57,160 --> 00:36:02,759
Speaker 7: particularly for young women and girls, and increase in team suicide,

679
00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:06,239
Speaker 7: and those other issues. About forty three or forty four

680
00:36:06,320 --> 00:36:09,720
Speaker 7: other attorneys general across the country filed and action focused

681
00:36:09,719 --> 00:36:15,040
Speaker 7: almost exclusively on those psychological harms. We included in our

682
00:36:15,080 --> 00:36:18,880
Speaker 7: complaint allegations of that same kind of behavior, but in

683
00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:21,600
Speaker 7: part because of my background as a child abuse prosecutor

684
00:36:21,600 --> 00:36:25,279
Speaker 7: and an Internet crimes prosecutor, we were acutely focused on

685
00:36:25,480 --> 00:36:29,520
Speaker 7: predation and the way in which these platforms not just

686
00:36:30,040 --> 00:36:35,120
Speaker 7: allow for predators to identify, groom and target children online,

687
00:36:35,160 --> 00:36:38,280
Speaker 7: but the algorithms and the structure of the platforms actually

688
00:36:38,320 --> 00:36:42,440
Speaker 7: facilitates and amplifies the ability of these platforms to connect

689
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:46,600
Speaker 7: children and young users that the companies know and have

690
00:36:46,840 --> 00:36:49,759
Speaker 7: and actually count on being on these platforms Because there

691
00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:52,960
Speaker 7: is a market incentive there is a financial incentive for

692
00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:56,920
Speaker 7: them to get young users hooked on these platforms so

693
00:36:56,960 --> 00:37:00,680
Speaker 7: that they can market, you know, consumer goods and use

694
00:37:01,360 --> 00:37:04,960
Speaker 7: that revenue to build and expand the company. But what

695
00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:10,200
Speaker 7: has been I think sort of underreported and certainly largely

696
00:37:10,280 --> 00:37:14,440
Speaker 7: unrecognized by parents and policymakers is the way in which

697
00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:19,280
Speaker 7: the algorithm itself and the platform itself will connect people

698
00:37:19,360 --> 00:37:22,360
Speaker 7: with their particular interests. And so what that means is

699
00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:25,920
Speaker 7: every company builds a digital profile of every user on

700
00:37:25,960 --> 00:37:28,399
Speaker 7: the platform. The more you use it, then the more

701
00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:32,440
Speaker 7: they understand what your preferences are. For ninety nine percent

702
00:37:32,560 --> 00:37:35,279
Speaker 7: of the users, that means understanding their preferences for a

703
00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:38,320
Speaker 7: sneeker or for going on a particular type of vacation,

704
00:37:38,480 --> 00:37:41,840
Speaker 7: or reading a particular type of book. That's the business

705
00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:45,680
Speaker 7: model that sits behind what is a free downloadable app

706
00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:49,640
Speaker 7: on the phone. The value proposition is in connecting people

707
00:37:50,040 --> 00:37:53,759
Speaker 7: with their unique interests, but the problem lies in the

708
00:37:53,800 --> 00:37:56,520
Speaker 7: fact that it will also connect people who have a

709
00:37:56,600 --> 00:38:00,200
Speaker 7: sexual interest in children with children that they know or

710
00:38:00,200 --> 00:38:03,840
Speaker 7: on the platform. It is the scale of the harm

711
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:07,279
Speaker 7: that has been known to these companies for years that

712
00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:11,160
Speaker 7: is truly astonishing. So what we did is we actually

713
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:15,560
Speaker 7: created a decoy account using artificial intelligence. We had an

714
00:38:15,640 --> 00:38:19,480
Speaker 7: undercover agent who's actually a middle aged man, who presented

715
00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:23,760
Speaker 7: an account that looked like an underage girl and created

716
00:38:23,760 --> 00:38:27,719
Speaker 7: a profile on the platform, and that account was immediately

717
00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:34,320
Speaker 7: inundated with solicitations for sex, graphic child sexual abuse material.

718
00:38:35,600 --> 00:38:39,000
Speaker 7: And what it did is it proved what the company

719
00:38:39,040 --> 00:38:42,160
Speaker 7: has known for years that something on the order of

720
00:38:42,160 --> 00:38:47,200
Speaker 7: one hundred thousand children every single day on the platform

721
00:38:47,600 --> 00:38:51,440
Speaker 7: either received sexually explicit material or solicited online for sex.

722
00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:56,080
Speaker 7: And so we have pulled the curtain back on internal

723
00:38:56,080 --> 00:38:59,920
Speaker 7: communications between trust and safety officials and experts who have

724
00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:04,800
Speaker 7: been warning the most senior executives, including Mark Zuckerberg, about

725
00:39:04,840 --> 00:39:09,799
Speaker 7: this harm and the fact that they're specific features that

726
00:39:10,080 --> 00:39:14,879
Speaker 7: could actually facilitate this interaction, and they have repeatedly sort

727
00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:20,200
Speaker 7: of looked at changing the system and usually deferred to

728
00:39:21,560 --> 00:39:26,640
Speaker 7: anything that continues to promote engagement and use and basically

729
00:39:26,640 --> 00:39:30,520
Speaker 7: prioritize profit over public safety and the safety of the

730
00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:33,759
Speaker 7: most vulnerable users on the platform. And so we filed that.

731
00:39:33,719 --> 00:39:34,640
Speaker 6: Action last year.

732
00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:38,440
Speaker 7: We followed it up with an undercover operation called Operation Metaphile,

733
00:39:38,880 --> 00:39:43,399
Speaker 7: where we again created accounts, and we arrested three men

734
00:39:43,440 --> 00:39:46,600
Speaker 7: who showed up at a hotel at a motel here

735
00:39:46,640 --> 00:39:49,160
Speaker 7: in New Mexico thinking that they were going to be

736
00:39:49,160 --> 00:39:51,480
Speaker 7: meeting up with an underage girl to have sex, and

737
00:39:51,520 --> 00:39:54,000
Speaker 7: they actually were taking to custody. What we were trying

738
00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:57,320
Speaker 7: to do, though, with that parallel criminal investigation is demonstrate

739
00:39:57,360 --> 00:40:00,640
Speaker 7: to policymakers into parents that the farm where I identifying

740
00:40:00,719 --> 00:40:05,040
Speaker 7: isn't just virtual, It isn't this digital experience. It is

741
00:40:05,239 --> 00:40:09,200
Speaker 7: paper thin in terms of the separation between the types

742
00:40:09,239 --> 00:40:11,719
Speaker 7: of experience they're having on their phones and on the

743
00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:16,520
Speaker 7: platforms and the possibility of real victimization in the real world.

744
00:40:16,680 --> 00:40:20,440
Speaker 7: We followed that up with a separate lawsuit against Snap

745
00:40:20,840 --> 00:40:25,200
Speaker 7: because Snap has marketed itself primarily on the benefits of

746
00:40:25,239 --> 00:40:28,160
Speaker 7: what's known as ephemeral content. This idea that you can

747
00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:31,279
Speaker 7: picture an image or video, send it to somebody else,

748
00:40:31,400 --> 00:40:33,920
Speaker 7: and it goes away. The truth is, though it doesn't

749
00:40:33,920 --> 00:40:37,080
Speaker 7: go away, it's easily captured, and which means it is

750
00:40:37,480 --> 00:40:41,600
Speaker 7: a prime channel by which people can engage in sextortion.

751
00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:45,120
Speaker 7: And sextortion is when they trick a young person into

752
00:40:45,200 --> 00:40:49,320
Speaker 7: sending a sexually explicit image of themselves and then immediately

753
00:40:49,320 --> 00:40:52,800
Speaker 7: turn around and extort them, saying, turn over this amount

754
00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:55,200
Speaker 7: of crypto, this amount of money, and if you don't,

755
00:40:55,360 --> 00:41:00,120
Speaker 7: we will send these images to your school, to your parents,

756
00:41:00,120 --> 00:41:04,720
Speaker 7: your community. And we have seen teen suicide all over

757
00:41:04,880 --> 00:41:07,640
Speaker 7: the country, all over the world by a lot of

758
00:41:07,680 --> 00:41:10,640
Speaker 7: young people, interestingly, a lot of young men who are

759
00:41:10,680 --> 00:41:14,160
Speaker 7: tricked into sending these images, young young boys. And I've

760
00:41:14,160 --> 00:41:17,880
Speaker 7: met parents from all over America who who have lost,

761
00:41:18,480 --> 00:41:22,040
Speaker 7: you know, their thirteen, fourteen, fifteen year old son to

762
00:41:22,280 --> 00:41:26,000
Speaker 7: suicide because they have been tricked into sending this material

763
00:41:26,080 --> 00:41:28,560
Speaker 7: to somebody that then turns around and extorts them. All

764
00:41:28,640 --> 00:41:32,560
Speaker 7: of this though, all of this conduct has been known

765
00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:35,720
Speaker 7: to the leaders and executives inside these companies for years,

766
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:39,800
Speaker 7: and Congress has just failed to act, failed to regulate,

767
00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:42,880
Speaker 7: and so now it's falling to us. But there's a

768
00:41:43,000 --> 00:41:47,879
Speaker 7: unique parallel here because not unlike big tobacco, it's a

769
00:41:47,920 --> 00:41:55,160
Speaker 7: big global corporate behemoth that is knowingly marketing addictive, dangerous

770
00:41:55,200 --> 00:42:00,400
Speaker 7: products to young people without due respect for the ultimate

771
00:42:00,440 --> 00:42:03,879
Speaker 7: harm that they could be causing, without telling people about it,

772
00:42:03,960 --> 00:42:07,759
Speaker 7: without providing warnings about what could be there, and ultimately

773
00:42:07,800 --> 00:42:10,080
Speaker 7: they have been able to do that because back in

774
00:42:10,120 --> 00:42:14,719
Speaker 7: the late nineties, Congress granted them broad immunity from liability

775
00:42:14,719 --> 00:42:17,800
Speaker 7: for this action. In the earliest days of the Internet,

776
00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:21,440
Speaker 7: in the passage of the Communications Decency Acts Section two thirty,

777
00:42:21,840 --> 00:42:25,680
Speaker 7: we were trying to facilitate this burgeoning Internet economy and

778
00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:27,719
Speaker 7: that but this was back in the days when we

779
00:42:27,719 --> 00:42:29,400
Speaker 7: were all waiting for a dial up tone to get

780
00:42:29,440 --> 00:42:33,120
Speaker 7: on the Internet, were looking at all of this material

781
00:42:33,200 --> 00:42:36,000
Speaker 7: sort of on a laptop, and we're thinking about message boards.

782
00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:39,040
Speaker 7: So there was no smartphones, there was no social media applications,

783
00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:43,560
Speaker 7: and there certainly weren't the kinds of big global corporations

784
00:42:43,600 --> 00:42:47,640
Speaker 7: that we have now and we have watched for the

785
00:42:47,719 --> 00:42:53,960
Speaker 7: last ten years Congress just completely unable to carve back

786
00:42:54,160 --> 00:42:57,759
Speaker 7: or eliminate that that immunity that has been granted to

787
00:42:58,160 --> 00:43:02,799
Speaker 7: these companies. And so we have to from a legal perspective,

788
00:43:02,880 --> 00:43:06,200
Speaker 7: file these cases very much in the same way that

789
00:43:06,280 --> 00:43:09,160
Speaker 7: you file a product liability case, because Section two thirty

790
00:43:09,239 --> 00:43:13,160
Speaker 7: says these companies aren't liable for the third party content

791
00:43:13,200 --> 00:43:16,520
Speaker 7: put out there by someone else, but they are liable

792
00:43:16,920 --> 00:43:19,640
Speaker 7: for the decisions they make about the features that are

793
00:43:19,640 --> 00:43:22,480
Speaker 7: included in their products. And so that's how we're going about,

794
00:43:22,920 --> 00:43:26,000
Speaker 7: you know, bringing these lawsuits. We've been we're one of

795
00:43:26,080 --> 00:43:28,960
Speaker 7: the first states in the country to focus on sexual

796
00:43:28,960 --> 00:43:32,040
Speaker 7: predation and one of the first states in the country

797
00:43:32,120 --> 00:43:35,680
Speaker 7: to actually survive a challenge under Section two thirty. And

798
00:43:35,920 --> 00:43:37,560
Speaker 7: it looks like we're going to be able to present

799
00:43:37,600 --> 00:43:40,080
Speaker 7: our case to a jury here in New Mexico and

800
00:43:40,160 --> 00:43:45,480
Speaker 7: ultimately hopefully not only recover damages for children who have

801
00:43:45,520 --> 00:43:48,480
Speaker 7: been harmed by these products, but ultimately get injunctive relief

802
00:43:48,800 --> 00:43:51,200
Speaker 7: to change the way these corporations do business. It is

803
00:43:51,280 --> 00:43:56,319
Speaker 7: no coincidence that you have seen update and press releases

804
00:43:56,560 --> 00:44:01,239
Speaker 7: and publications of all of these new safety features, so

805
00:44:01,360 --> 00:44:06,760
Speaker 7: called sactors in so called sort of safety modifications since

806
00:44:07,320 --> 00:44:10,719
Speaker 7: these lawsuits have been filed. And from my perspective, it's

807
00:44:10,760 --> 00:44:16,080
Speaker 7: a cynical attempt to avoid and held account or what

808
00:44:16,120 --> 00:44:20,240
Speaker 7: they have done way that they have prioritized profit over safety.

809
00:44:20,600 --> 00:44:24,000
Speaker 7: And when this comes up, you know, we get asked routinely,

810
00:44:24,120 --> 00:44:26,000
Speaker 7: well what do you think about the latest update of

811
00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:28,399
Speaker 7: the newest feature? And what I tell them is, look,

812
00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:31,279
Speaker 7: if these companies, Meta and Zuckerberg and these guys were

813
00:44:31,640 --> 00:44:36,280
Speaker 7: spent as much time focusing on actually making these products safe,

814
00:44:36,600 --> 00:44:40,040
Speaker 7: and if they dedicated the resources that they currently expand

815
00:44:40,120 --> 00:44:46,640
Speaker 7: on lobbyists, lawyers, publicists and marketing firms on just listening

816
00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:49,640
Speaker 7: to their own trust in safety people and redesigning the platforms,

817
00:44:49,960 --> 00:44:52,960
Speaker 7: we wouldn't be in this situation. But you know, this

818
00:44:53,040 --> 00:44:56,560
Speaker 7: is sort of the standard corporate playbook where people get

819
00:44:56,600 --> 00:45:02,760
Speaker 7: called out, people start fearing, shareholders, directors and others start

820
00:45:02,800 --> 00:45:05,239
Speaker 7: thinking about the bottom line, and they think, oh god,

821
00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:09,799
Speaker 7: this is serious. We better start doing something. But you know,

822
00:45:09,840 --> 00:45:12,799
Speaker 7: the steps that they're taking, these are things that could

823
00:45:12,800 --> 00:45:15,919
Speaker 7: have been done years ago. Because they have known about

824
00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:18,680
Speaker 7: these problems for years. They didn't do it until they

825
00:45:18,719 --> 00:45:20,920
Speaker 7: really thought there was a chance that it was going

826
00:45:20,960 --> 00:45:22,240
Speaker 7: to impact the bottom line.

827
00:45:22,480 --> 00:45:25,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm not surprised at all.

828
00:45:25,719 --> 00:45:29,040
Speaker 1: But it does show that the only way any of

829
00:45:29,080 --> 00:45:32,200
Speaker 1: these tech companies are going to behave in a responsible

830
00:45:32,239 --> 00:45:34,440
Speaker 1: way is if they're legally held accountable.

831
00:45:34,600 --> 00:45:37,759
Speaker 7: Right, that's right, But it also shows something else that's

832
00:45:37,880 --> 00:45:41,319
Speaker 7: really really important. It is the disparity that you have

833
00:45:41,480 --> 00:45:45,160
Speaker 7: between the pace of change in legal institutions and the

834
00:45:45,200 --> 00:45:48,840
Speaker 7: pace of change in technology. Right, they're able to operate

835
00:45:49,320 --> 00:45:54,200
Speaker 7: now with technology under a legal framework that was created

836
00:45:54,239 --> 00:45:58,120
Speaker 7: for a totally different world, and the lesson for us

837
00:45:58,200 --> 00:46:01,319
Speaker 7: as a country is that we need to be able

838
00:46:01,360 --> 00:46:05,640
Speaker 7: to close the gap between our ability to adapt to

839
00:46:05,840 --> 00:46:09,480
Speaker 7: a changing technological environment, because what we usually end up

840
00:46:09,520 --> 00:46:13,799
Speaker 7: doing is by the time we've identified a harm, corrected

841
00:46:13,840 --> 00:46:16,719
Speaker 7: for it, come up with a new legislative solution, the

842
00:46:16,760 --> 00:46:20,200
Speaker 7: technology has leapt forward. And what I worry about now

843
00:46:20,320 --> 00:46:22,720
Speaker 7: is that we're going to be having a conversation about

844
00:46:22,760 --> 00:46:26,160
Speaker 7: fixing the problems with social media applications, and by the

845
00:46:26,239 --> 00:46:28,960
Speaker 7: time we correct that, the genie is out of the

846
00:46:28,960 --> 00:46:32,759
Speaker 7: bottle on artificial intelligence and we are once again trying

847
00:46:32,800 --> 00:46:36,560
Speaker 7: to play catch up from a legal standpoint. And I

848
00:46:36,920 --> 00:46:39,440
Speaker 7: think one of the real challenges that we're going to

849
00:46:39,480 --> 00:46:42,920
Speaker 7: face in the next five, ten, fifteen years is to

850
00:46:43,040 --> 00:46:47,319
Speaker 7: see if we can update our institutions to respond more

851
00:46:47,360 --> 00:46:53,600
Speaker 7: effectively and more quickly to a rapidly evolving technological landscape, which,

852
00:46:53,600 --> 00:46:57,400
Speaker 7: as we have seen, can bring great benefits to people,

853
00:46:57,600 --> 00:47:02,239
Speaker 7: to businesses, to productivity, to human connections, to sharing of information.

854
00:47:02,880 --> 00:47:05,960
Speaker 7: But there is always a downside to technology. There's always

855
00:47:06,160 --> 00:47:08,920
Speaker 7: a side of the technology that can be used or

856
00:47:08,960 --> 00:47:12,160
Speaker 7: exploited to horn people, and we have to be mindful

857
00:47:12,200 --> 00:47:15,080
Speaker 7: of that, We've gone through this process too many times

858
00:47:15,320 --> 00:47:19,360
Speaker 7: for us to really think that these companies can be

859
00:47:19,360 --> 00:47:22,880
Speaker 7: trusted to regulate themselves. And there's another really dangerous and

860
00:47:22,960 --> 00:47:25,920
Speaker 7: important element which is hard for people to understand who

861
00:47:25,960 --> 00:47:28,200
Speaker 7: are lawyers and aren't thinking about this, But one of

862
00:47:28,239 --> 00:47:31,080
Speaker 7: the most consequential Supreme Court decisions that we had recently

863
00:47:31,760 --> 00:47:34,799
Speaker 7: was a decision by the Supreme Court to eliminate what's

864
00:47:34,800 --> 00:47:39,320
Speaker 7: called Chevron deference. What that did is the best chance

865
00:47:39,360 --> 00:47:42,200
Speaker 7: that we had as a from an institutional standpoint to

866
00:47:42,280 --> 00:47:46,800
Speaker 7: continue to adapt quickly to emerging threats or emerging potential

867
00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:51,839
Speaker 7: harms was to empower executive agencies to address things that

868
00:47:51,880 --> 00:47:55,360
Speaker 7: a legislative body just doesn't have the technical expertise or

869
00:47:55,400 --> 00:47:58,960
Speaker 7: the understanding to get in front of. By striking that down,

870
00:47:59,360 --> 00:48:02,440
Speaker 7: the Supreme Court has basically placed the burden back on

871
00:48:02,520 --> 00:48:05,640
Speaker 7: Congress to continue updating the legal framework that we have

872
00:48:05,680 --> 00:48:07,560
Speaker 7: in the legal tools that we have to hold people.

873
00:48:07,360 --> 00:48:11,200
Speaker 1: Account right exactly. And I think that's a really such

874
00:48:11,239 --> 00:48:14,080
Speaker 1: an important point. Thank you so much for joining us.

875
00:48:14,080 --> 00:48:15,160
Speaker 1: I hope you wilcome back.

876
00:48:15,560 --> 00:48:19,680
Speaker 7: Yeah, I appreciate the opportunity.

877
00:48:19,920 --> 00:48:26,759
Speaker 1: No moment, Rick Wilson, Yes, our moment of fuckery today,

878
00:48:26,800 --> 00:48:29,839
Speaker 1: we're going to talk about everyone's favorite. By the way,

879
00:48:29,920 --> 00:48:33,120
Speaker 1: Donald Trump did say it might be smart to get

880
00:48:33,160 --> 00:48:37,680
Speaker 1: a vice president who's a zero well success Donald for

881
00:48:37,760 --> 00:48:41,120
Speaker 1: all right, I almost feel like, if we're going to

882
00:48:41,200 --> 00:48:44,360
Speaker 1: do our moment of fuckery about JD. Vans, we should

883
00:48:44,400 --> 00:48:49,400
Speaker 1: for a second have Jesse first play this video of

884
00:48:49,840 --> 00:48:53,759
Speaker 1: Donald Trump yesterday or two days ago.

885
00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:55,360
Speaker 2: It's a theory he has.

886
00:48:55,520 --> 00:48:58,960
Speaker 1: So Jesse's going to first play Donald Trump's theory of

887
00:48:59,080 --> 00:49:00,120
Speaker 1: vice presidents.

888
00:49:00,200 --> 00:49:01,840
Speaker 4: I love Trump having any kind of theory.

889
00:49:02,600 --> 00:49:04,439
Speaker 5: This guy, he's dumb as a rock.

890
00:49:05,520 --> 00:49:06,600
Speaker 6: Of course, you could make.

891
00:49:06,520 --> 00:49:09,480
Speaker 1: The case that, you know, there's a theory pick a

892
00:49:09,640 --> 00:49:11,320
Speaker 1: really bad vice president.

893
00:49:11,400 --> 00:49:13,320
Speaker 5: That way, they'd never get rid of you. So maybe

894
00:49:13,360 --> 00:49:17,160
Speaker 5: she did a very smart thing. Who does But we're

895
00:49:17,160 --> 00:49:20,080
Speaker 5: gonna say, kamala yaha.

896
00:49:20,520 --> 00:49:23,240
Speaker 2: So that's a theory. That's a theory.

897
00:49:24,080 --> 00:49:28,080
Speaker 1: And now, Jesse Cannon, we're going to talk about Donald

898
00:49:28,120 --> 00:49:33,600
Speaker 1: Trump's vice presidential nominee, who was today on CNN trying

899
00:49:33,640 --> 00:49:36,040
Speaker 1: to defend the indefense.

900
00:49:35,600 --> 00:49:38,080
Speaker 4: Ball thank you, So let me ask you.

901
00:49:38,120 --> 00:49:41,520
Speaker 8: Obviously, Trump's former chief of Staff, General John Kelly sure

902
00:49:42,320 --> 00:49:45,520
Speaker 8: was alarmed. He says by what he heard when Trump's

903
00:49:45,520 --> 00:49:48,080
Speaker 8: that he wanted to use the National Guard or the

904
00:49:48,080 --> 00:49:52,160
Speaker 8: Pentagon to go after the enemy within Americans with whom

905
00:49:52,200 --> 00:49:53,680
Speaker 8: he disagrees, including.

906
00:49:53,280 --> 00:49:54,600
Speaker 4: The pelosis Adam Schiff.

907
00:49:55,239 --> 00:49:57,080
Speaker 8: And then he gave an interview he said the Trump

908
00:49:57,200 --> 00:50:00,239
Speaker 8: quote certainly falls into the general definition of fascist that

909
00:50:00,280 --> 00:50:03,359
Speaker 8: he has quote. Certainly an authoritarian admirers people who are dictators.

910
00:50:04,040 --> 00:50:08,120
Speaker 8: You've called him a disgruntled former employee, But why shouldn't

911
00:50:08,719 --> 00:50:12,840
Speaker 8: Americans out there listen to somebody who worked closely with Trump,

912
00:50:13,760 --> 00:50:17,800
Speaker 8: worked with him longer than you've worked with him, retired

913
00:50:17,840 --> 00:50:23,040
Speaker 8: for star Marine general, serve his country honorably, who is conservative,

914
00:50:23,400 --> 00:50:26,319
Speaker 8: who says he agrees with Trump on most policies, but

915
00:50:26,480 --> 00:50:27,440
Speaker 8: is worried about this.

916
00:50:27,480 --> 00:50:28,360
Speaker 6: Aspect of Trump.

917
00:50:28,640 --> 00:50:30,520
Speaker 9: So let me just say two things in response. So,

918
00:50:30,560 --> 00:50:32,920
Speaker 9: first of all, a lot of what John Kelly pretty

919
00:50:32,960 --> 00:50:35,480
Speaker 9: much all of what John Kelly accuses Donald Trump of saying.

920
00:50:35,800 --> 00:50:38,359
Speaker 9: There were other people in the room, Mike Pence's former

921
00:50:38,400 --> 00:50:41,359
Speaker 9: chief of staff, for example, who've explicitly said Donald Trump

922
00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:44,000
Speaker 9: never said those things, right, So one on expansive, guy,

923
00:50:44,080 --> 00:50:46,880
Speaker 9: I'm not going to support Trump because Mike, Mike Pence's

924
00:50:46,920 --> 00:50:50,239
Speaker 9: former chief said that Donald Trump didn't say those things right,

925
00:50:50,320 --> 00:50:51,120
Speaker 9: So that's number one.

926
00:50:51,160 --> 00:50:51,640
Speaker 6: Number two.

927
00:50:51,960 --> 00:50:54,680
Speaker 9: I actually think there's an interesting conversation here to have, Jake,

928
00:50:54,760 --> 00:50:56,480
Speaker 9: which is, why does John Kelly.

929
00:50:56,239 --> 00:50:57,640
Speaker 6: Not support Donald Trump.

930
00:50:57,920 --> 00:51:00,560
Speaker 9: It's about policy, it's not about personality.

931
00:51:00,560 --> 00:51:01,760
Speaker 4: He says, he agrees with Trump.

932
00:51:01,600 --> 00:51:04,080
Speaker 6: On most policy. No, he agrees with Trump on most policy.

933
00:51:04,160 --> 00:51:07,719
Speaker 8: He disagrees with Trump on but how Trump views his

934
00:51:07,920 --> 00:51:10,520
Speaker 8: role and the fascism and the authoritari.

935
00:51:10,800 --> 00:51:11,640
Speaker 4: I don't buy that, Jake.

936
00:51:11,680 --> 00:51:13,480
Speaker 9: I don't buy that, because if you actually look at

937
00:51:13,520 --> 00:51:16,680
Speaker 9: John Kelly, at folks like Liz Cheney, the fundamental disagreement

938
00:51:16,719 --> 00:51:18,640
Speaker 9: they have with Donald Trump is even though they say

939
00:51:18,640 --> 00:51:21,520
Speaker 9: that they're conservative, they're conservative in the sense that they

940
00:51:21,560 --> 00:51:24,480
Speaker 9: want America to get involved in a ton of ridiculous

941
00:51:24,480 --> 00:51:25,560
Speaker 9: military conflicts.

942
00:51:25,680 --> 00:51:27,200
Speaker 2: Thank you, Rick Wilson.

943
00:51:27,920 --> 00:51:31,200
Speaker 4: You know, there's a reason why jd. Vance's favorability rating

944
00:51:31,239 --> 00:51:33,440
Speaker 4: is roughly half of Tim Walls is that.

945
00:51:33,400 --> 00:51:34,600
Speaker 6: He's a douchebag.

946
00:51:35,200 --> 00:51:39,319
Speaker 4: He's not just an asshole, he's like a legitimate douchebag.

947
00:51:39,680 --> 00:51:42,640
Speaker 4: This guy knows exactly what he's doing. He's besmirching the

948
00:51:42,680 --> 00:51:45,360
Speaker 4: reputation of a guy who gave forty years of his

949
00:51:45,400 --> 00:51:48,600
Speaker 4: life to our country. Whose son died in combat and JD.

950
00:51:48,719 --> 00:51:51,759
Speaker 4: Vance is thinking you're too dumb to realize what he's

951
00:51:51,840 --> 00:51:55,920
Speaker 4: trying to say. It is offensive, it is cheap, it

952
00:51:56,040 --> 00:51:59,360
Speaker 4: is stupid, and it relies on an audience that doesn't

953
00:51:59,480 --> 00:52:04,000
Speaker 4: understand and that just saying they're globalists. They what wars

954
00:52:04,719 --> 00:52:08,279
Speaker 4: is codeword for we think you're too stupid to understand it.

955
00:52:08,680 --> 00:52:11,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you, Rick Wilson.

956
00:52:11,040 --> 00:52:13,080
Speaker 4: You are welcome as always my friend. I'll talk to

957
00:52:13,080 --> 00:52:13,439
Speaker 4: you soon.

958
00:52:14,320 --> 00:52:18,680
Speaker 1: That's it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in

959
00:52:19,000 --> 00:52:24,440
Speaker 1: every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday and Saturday to hear the best

960
00:52:24,520 --> 00:52:28,799
Speaker 1: minds and politics make sense of all this chaos. If

961
00:52:28,840 --> 00:52:31,880
Speaker 1: you enjoy this podcast, please send it to a friend

962
00:52:32,320 --> 00:52:33,960
Speaker 1: and keep the conversation going.

963
00:52:34,400 --> 00:52:35,560
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening.