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Speaker 1: Get text with technology with tech Stuff Stuff, be there

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Speaker 1: and welcome to tech Stuff. I'm Jonathan Strickland, and today

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Speaker 1: I want to bring to you a classic episode of

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Speaker 1: tech Stuff. It's been a while since I've dug into

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Speaker 1: the archives and brought up something what was recorded before,

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Speaker 1: and I tend to avoid that if I can. But

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Speaker 1: we've got a lot going on at how Stuff works.

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Speaker 1: As I record this, the entire editorial team is all

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Speaker 1: a buzz about our presence at south By Southwest. By

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Speaker 1: the time you hear this, we will have gone and returned.

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Speaker 1: But uh I in order to get everything done, I

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Speaker 1: needed to do a quick rerun, and that's why I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna look at this classic episode tech Stuff looks at

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Speaker 1: industrial light and magic. That means you're going to hear

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Speaker 1: the one and only Chris Palette, my former co host,

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Speaker 1: who uh phenomenal guy, great co So if you haven't

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Speaker 1: heard any classic episodes, prepared to be amazed at his

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Speaker 1: wit and humor. Also, I just want to give you

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Speaker 1: a quick update to the story, so I'll do that

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Speaker 1: when we get back at the end of the episode.

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Speaker 1: So please enjoy this classic episode. I'll rejoin you at

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Speaker 1: the end. See you in a bit. So, Yeah, we

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Speaker 1: wanted to talk today about a special visual effects studio

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Speaker 1: named Industrial Light and Magic. And the reason why we

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Speaker 1: decided to cover this particular topic is that, well, Industrial

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Speaker 1: Light and Magic is part of well, it's one of

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Speaker 1: the many things that George Lucas created, including things like

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Speaker 1: Lucas Film, And that's been the news recently, because that's

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Speaker 1: the recording of this podcast. It has not been that

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Speaker 1: long since Disney announced its intention to acquire Lucas Film

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Speaker 1: for the Parents Lee some of four point zero five

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Speaker 1: billion with a B dollars, mostly all of which apparently

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Speaker 1: will be donated to George Lucas's educational charity. Right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's pretty phenomenal. George Lucas back in twos ten pledged

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Speaker 1: that he was going to dedicate his wealth to philanthropic endeavors,

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Speaker 1: mostly due uh to um more, mostly towards education, which

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Speaker 1: kind of it's nice and it shows that he's following

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Speaker 1: in the same sort of vein as other notable rich

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Speaker 1: people and philanthropists like Bill Gates. Yeah, and that's not

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Speaker 1: really what the the podcast is about. We're not talking

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Speaker 1: about George and and things, but I did want to

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Speaker 1: throw that in there simply because that was a pretty

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Speaker 1: amazing thing to do. Everyone would do that very cool

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Speaker 1: thing to do. Uh. It almost makes me not want

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Speaker 1: to criticize him for some of the decisions he's made. Well,

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Speaker 1: I think it gives us a picture of who he

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Speaker 1: is as a person us and although he does see himself,

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Speaker 1: I think as a as someone who uh is empowered

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Speaker 1: to revise things that were previously released and then that

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Speaker 1: that does infuriate a lot of people, among other things

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Speaker 1: that he's done. But you know, I get the sense

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Speaker 1: to that, Hey, he's not a bad guy. Of course,

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Speaker 1: that's what he wants us to think. But come on,

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Speaker 1: come on, how who's going to go to the extent

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Speaker 1: of of donating the majority of their wealth to education

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Speaker 1: in order to convince the world they're not a bad guy.

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Speaker 1: He's clearly a good guy. Yeah, I would say so,

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Speaker 1: so he's a better guy than I am. So so

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Speaker 1: well well done, Mr Lucas. But but yeah, I mean

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Speaker 1: he's he's also the same kind of person that is

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Speaker 1: driven creatively. He's he's willing to come up with complete

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Speaker 1: new uh businesses to support his creative habits. We we

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Speaker 1: might say, even though we may not necessarily agree with them,

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Speaker 1: I would argue, I would say personally for me that

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Speaker 1: you know, his heart's in the right place. He's trying

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Speaker 1: to create a good story and it doesn't always pan out.

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Speaker 1: You gotta sounds like you gotta remember back, all right.

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Speaker 1: So he founded Industrial Light and Magic. Yes in Yes. Now,

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Speaker 1: that's two years before the release of Star Wars A

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Speaker 1: New Hope, one of the best documentaries ever to be made. Well,

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Speaker 1: he um as a filmmaker and his his filmmaking career

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Speaker 1: began before that. Um but he you know, American Graffiti

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Speaker 1: wasn't exactly um A, it wasn't as it wasn't a

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Speaker 1: positive experience, wasn't It wasn't a special effects driven masterpiece.

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Speaker 1: You know, it was a very good film. I liked it,

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Speaker 1: but um you know, it wasn't It wasn't the kind

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Speaker 1: of film that that George Lucas has come to be

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Speaker 1: known for. He mega super effects blockbuster, which uh many

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Speaker 1: would argue that he is responsible for and in part

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Speaker 1: due to Industrial Light and Magic. Really, the the two

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Speaker 1: people I think who are responsible for the blockbuster special

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Speaker 1: effects extravaganza are Lucas and Spielberg, And of course Spielberg

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Speaker 1: has had quite a bit of involvement in uh several

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Speaker 1: of Lucas's endeavors. But anyway, yeah, he so he founded

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Speaker 1: this visual effects company and it was probably because Lucas

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Speaker 1: uh he he knew he wanted to do things a

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Speaker 1: certain way, and in order to do that, he wanted

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Speaker 1: to limit his dependence upon other companies as much as possible.

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Speaker 1: So he started to make stuff. He said, well, there's

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Speaker 1: no visual effects company out there that that is going

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Speaker 1: to do the stuff I need to have done, so

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna make it myself. And uh so he's kind

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Speaker 1: of a hacker. Yeah, it really is a lot of ways,

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Speaker 1: and and this was all due to necessity. You know,

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Speaker 1: he wanted to have as much control over the project

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Speaker 1: as possible in order to do that, and then that

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Speaker 1: he had to build all this stuff, and so he

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Speaker 1: set out to do it, and that's exactly what he did.

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Speaker 1: It's kind of amazing. Well, there's a you know, the

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Speaker 1: industrial line. Magic has been responsible for many different advances

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Speaker 1: in movie making technology over the years. Back in one

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Speaker 1: of the first things they developed was the Dixtra flex

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Speaker 1: camera system that's named after John Distra, who was actually

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Speaker 1: the lead designer on this camera design. Uh, and it's

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Speaker 1: it was made because if you've if well it's kind

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Speaker 1: of hard to say, like if you if you saw

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Speaker 1: the Star Wars and New Hope back in its cinematic

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Speaker 1: release version, this is pre special addition, all the effects

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Speaker 1: there for things like the ship battles and stuff, all

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Speaker 1: the all the ships, all the the Death Star stuff,

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Speaker 1: all that was made with practical effects, practical miniature models

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Speaker 1: that so, so the X Wings going through the trench

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Speaker 1: and Death Star that was all done with managers. So

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Speaker 1: this is pre computer generated special effects in that sense. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And the sound to the the orchestra. Uh, would you

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Speaker 1: know they would put these models on the dolly and

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Speaker 1: then the orchestra will be on a dolly behind them

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Speaker 1: playing the music. No, let's go a little too far there, Chris,

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Speaker 1: But but this long way to go for a bad joke. This,

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Speaker 1: this camera, this camera was was special because in order

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Speaker 1: to get the effect that Lucas wanted, he wanted the

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Speaker 1: spaceship seems to look like uh, like dog fights, like

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Speaker 1: airplane dog fights from World War two movies. Yeah. And

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Speaker 1: and the reason that those uh that that film, uh,

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Speaker 1: and we're talking about existing film. The reason that that

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Speaker 1: film is so effective. I think is because it's been

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Speaker 1: It was shot by another airplane in the air at

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Speaker 1: the same time as a dog fight. And this this

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Speaker 1: motion control photography that I LM developed for this um used. Uh, basically,

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Speaker 1: we're using cameras that moved in with the spaceship models,

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Speaker 1: so it appeared that you were flying in the in

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Speaker 1: the dog fights between the different fighters or the Millennium

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Speaker 1: Falcon and the Tie fighters. Yea, so it was there

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Speaker 1: was a real sense of movement right right. The camera

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Speaker 1: was mounted on a crane, and the crane was mounted

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Speaker 1: on a Dolly track, so they don't do a Hello

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Speaker 1: Dolly joke, I didn't say, okay, so anyway, so the

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Speaker 1: crane could move back and forth along this track, the

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Speaker 1: camera could could move in various ways to adjust the

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Speaker 1: the pitch or the tilt of the of the camera's angle,

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Speaker 1: so it could follow the motions of the miniature and

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Speaker 1: make it you have this this really swoopy effect where

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Speaker 1: like Chris was saying, you're following the action very closely,

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Speaker 1: and uh, it was a necessity for him to achieve

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Speaker 1: the effect he wanted. So he builds this Actually he

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Speaker 1: puts John Dixtra in charge of it, and John and

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Speaker 1: his team built it. I call him John Smart. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And they shoot the movie, and in nineteen seventy seven,

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Speaker 1: Star Wars New Hope hits theaters and becomes an amazing success.

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Speaker 1: The two movies that that really launched the era of

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Speaker 1: blockbuster summer hits were Jaws and Star Wars. Yeah. Um

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Speaker 1: and uh. You know what you get when you come

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Speaker 1: up with a new kind of special effects technology an

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Speaker 1: Academy Award. Yes, they won that for Vision visual Effects

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Speaker 1: in nineteen seventy seven. John Steers, I think of him

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Speaker 1: as Dikest, John Dikester, Richard Grant, M Grant mckeun, and

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Speaker 1: Robert Blaock. I can't can't say any of their names.

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Speaker 1: I'm just gonna call him the guys. They're all John. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's a matter of fact. They also got a Special

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Speaker 1: Achievement Award in nineteen eighty visual Effects. Right. But before

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Speaker 1: we get to nineteen eight, something happens in nineteen seventy

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Speaker 1: nine that I want to talk about something something special.

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Speaker 1: There was a special division formed in nineteen seventy nine

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Speaker 1: and Industrial Light and Magic. That division was called the

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Speaker 1: Graphics Group, Uh, specializing in Computer Animation and effects. Wait,

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Speaker 1: I feel like I should know who these guys are.

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Speaker 1: When we get to nineteen eight six, it all become clear.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, in nineteen seventy nine, the division, the Graphics

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Speaker 1: Group forms an Industrial Light and Magic. That division will

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Speaker 1: become incredibly important and influential and but oddly enough, their

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Speaker 1: most influential days will be after they leave Lucas Film

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Speaker 1: and Industrial Line Magic. So moving on, UH nineteen eighty

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Speaker 1: that's when Empire Strikes Back, the second greatest documentary. Actually,

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Speaker 1: I think that people would argue that's better than Star

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Speaker 1: Wars most people, And you know, I actually prefer a

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Speaker 1: New Hope to Empire, but I really love Empire too.

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Speaker 1: It's just one of those things where you know, New

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Speaker 1: Hope really resonates with me, but Empire is great. So

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Speaker 1: Empire Strikes Back comes out. They do win the Special

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Speaker 1: Achievement Academy Award for Visual Effects for that. The Indiana

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Speaker 1: Jones and Raiders The Last Start comes out. Now, that

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Speaker 1: was another UH the project that UH had Spielberg's involvement,

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Speaker 1: and they won the Academy Award for Visual Effects for that.

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Speaker 1: They also made a movie, Did you ever see Dragon Slayer? Okay,

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Speaker 1: So I saw Dragon Slayer back when I was a kid.

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Speaker 1: Dragon Slayers a fantasy film, and it's pretty much what

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Speaker 1: you would think it is. It's a story about a

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Speaker 1: young hero who uh sets out to slay a dragon.

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Speaker 1: It's a little more complicated and that, but that's just yea.

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Speaker 1: So they designed a new kind of filmmaking for this

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Speaker 1: as well. They decided that there's a problem with working

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Speaker 1: with practical effects for monsters that are um the go beyond,

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Speaker 1: like some think someone in just a suit right, because

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Speaker 1: one of the things you could do is you could

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Speaker 1: do stop motion animation to create a monster effect, because

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Speaker 1: it's it's hard to build a giant monster so and

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Speaker 1: it it really it's hard to make it look right too.

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Speaker 1: It takes a lot of work. If I've shown my

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Speaker 1: kids older monster movie bits, and it's kind of easy

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Speaker 1: to on the one hand, when you grew up with

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Speaker 1: pre I l M movies and technology and and Jonathan

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Speaker 1: and I probably barely qualify into that. But you know,

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Speaker 1: you look at at some of the old monster movies

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Speaker 1: and you could see the zipper marks in the costumes

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Speaker 1: and the older stuff. You don't you're not freaked out

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Speaker 1: by that. Anymore. But you know, the practical effects um

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Speaker 1: could be done very very well, and even when they're

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Speaker 1: done very very well, it still doesn't have the same

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Speaker 1: effect that the newer ones do, and just it's it's

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Speaker 1: just weird to think about now. But yeah, I mean,

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Speaker 1: looking at the new stuff, it looks so very very real. Yeah, well,

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Speaker 1: back then, you know, with the practical effects, that's pretty

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Speaker 1: much all they had at their their disposal at this point.

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Speaker 1: Back they developed something called go Motion and Go Motion. Uh.

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Speaker 1: The way that they explain it on the Industrial Light

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Speaker 1: and Magic website is that it worked by fusing quote,

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Speaker 1: both electronic and mechanical components into a device that could

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Speaker 1: record the dragon in Dragon Slayers movements based on an

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Speaker 1: animator's design and play them back so the camera could

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Speaker 1: capture them as they occurred. So the reason for this

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Speaker 1: is because if they if they were to do it

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Speaker 1: in traditional stop motion, there'd be no motion blur when

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Speaker 1: something moves quickly, because because all you're doing is just

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Speaker 1: taking a bunch of individual photographs really of objects that

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Speaker 1: are not in motion, and then you're playing them back

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Speaker 1: to make it look like the object was in motion

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Speaker 1: to get motion blur. The thing actually needs to be moving.

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Speaker 1: It helps, but that's not how stop motion works because

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Speaker 1: the name stop Anyway, it was an interesting development. It

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Speaker 1: was something that they had, um uh created two again

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Speaker 1: to meet the needs of the project that without having

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Speaker 1: to you know, completely reinvent everything. Two They they got

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Speaker 1: another Academy award. Um I'm not gonna go through every

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Speaker 1: Academy award Industrial Line Magic has won because that would

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Speaker 1: be ridiculous. But they got it for one of my

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Speaker 1: favorite films as a kid growing up, which was ET

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Speaker 1: the Extraterrestrial. Yes, I loved this movie as a kid.

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Speaker 1: I think I must have seen it three or four

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Speaker 1: times the summer that it came out, and I probably

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Speaker 1: cried my eyes out every single time I watched it

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Speaker 1: because I'm a SAP. I've been a sap all my life.

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Speaker 1: I still am a SAP. I probably could watch ET

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Speaker 1: without crying now, but back as a kid, there was

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Speaker 1: just no hope. Um But anyway, that that was another

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Speaker 1: very popular film made by h. Lucas and Spielberg. So

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Speaker 1: uh And of course we should point out uh Lucas's

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Speaker 1: involvement in some of these films is more of a

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Speaker 1: kind of advisory sort of role. Industrial line, Magic worked

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Speaker 1: on lots of projects, not just lucasfilm projects, which is

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Speaker 1: why you know et is an Amblin project, not lucasfilm. Well.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to point that out too, that it would

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Speaker 1: have been easy for George Lucas to restrict Industrial Light

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Speaker 1: and Magic to working on his films. Yeah, but then

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Speaker 1: we would have hardly any of them because he didn't

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Speaker 1: do very many. Well, I mean, that's that's part of it.

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Speaker 1: But I mean he could have. He could have done say, uh,

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Speaker 1: the Indiana Jones films and the Star Wars film stuff

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Speaker 1: that he was intimately more intimately involved with, um, you know,

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Speaker 1: the projects that he and Spielberg worked on together in

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Speaker 1: some capacity. But he you know, they decided to spend

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Speaker 1: this off into its own company, and in doing so

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Speaker 1: they made I would argue that they made film richer

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Speaker 1: for it. I mean you could say that, you know,

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Speaker 1: working on on Star Trek too, um, you know, and

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Speaker 1: one of the greatest documentaries ever made ever boy. Um,

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Speaker 1: so you might say, well, you know, Star there there's

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Speaker 1: this whole Star Wars versus Star Trek, which I think

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Speaker 1: is silly anyway, um personally, but you know, they you

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Speaker 1: might say, well, you wouldn't necessarily you might want Star

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Speaker 1: Wars to be the dominant uh science fiction space franchise.

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Speaker 1: You know, why would you let him work on Star Trek. Well,

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Speaker 1: I think, like I said, it really populated film with

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Speaker 1: the DNA of Industrial LIGHTE and Magic and made them

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Speaker 1: the powerhouse that they are now. Um and yeah, I

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Speaker 1: mean they got a nomination for that too. Um. They

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Speaker 1: did other work for other are of the Star Wars

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Speaker 1: and Star Trek films and going through you could see

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Speaker 1: this in their the timeline on the Industrial LIGHTE and

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Speaker 1: Magic website. Um. But yeah, they really and they got

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Speaker 1: involved in stuff. Now you would say, also, these films

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Speaker 1: are going to be heavily dependent on uh, special effects,

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Speaker 1: and you would expect that to be so. But um

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Speaker 1: on other stuff like um, you know you would see

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Speaker 1: it too for things like Back to the Future, the

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Speaker 1: Back to the Future franchise, But they also worked on

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Speaker 1: the Industrial line. Magic also worked on stuff like Out

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Speaker 1: of Africa and Young Sherlock Holmes, uh, stuff that had

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Speaker 1: special effects. But some of this stuff is less special

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Speaker 1: effect driven. The special effect the special and special effects

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Speaker 1: in this case is making it look photo realistic rather

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Speaker 1: than looking fantastic. Yeah, UM, yeah, I agree. The uh

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Speaker 1: and and you know there are other analogs we can

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Speaker 1: compare this to, like the wet A Workshop, which did

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Speaker 1: all the work for the Lord of the Rings movies,

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Speaker 1: and the Hobbit has also done work for other other

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Speaker 1: production companies. That's so they have done designed for lots

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Speaker 1: of stuff, not just the Peter Jackson productions, So there

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Speaker 1: are other similarities there. I'm glad you mentioned Young Sherlock Holmes.

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Speaker 1: In five I lm achieved something no one had done before.

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Speaker 1: They created the first computer generated character in a film,

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Speaker 1: fully computer generated character. Uh, Sam glassmates Stained Glass Man

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Speaker 1: from Young Sherlock Holmes. Uh. In this case, what's happening

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Speaker 1: for those of you who have not seen Young Sherlock Holmes,

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Speaker 1: which is a pretty good movie that's slowly paced, but

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Speaker 1: it's I enjoyed it. Uh. It's It's got a lot

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Speaker 1: of cute references in it that clue you into the

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Speaker 1: man that Holmes will become and actually the man that

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Speaker 1: Watson will become as well, though it really messes up

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Speaker 1: their ages anyway. Uh. There's there's this The plot involves

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Speaker 1: this stuff, this substance that causes people to hallucinate and

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Speaker 1: they hallucinate these terrifying visions that drive them to essentially suicide.

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Speaker 1: And in this particular case, it's a character who is

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Speaker 1: looking he's in a building with stained glass windows, and

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Speaker 1: one of the stained glass figures comes to life, jumping

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Speaker 1: out of the window, and it's a night that is

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Speaker 1: made out of stained glass that stalks the guy. So

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Speaker 1: that's the scene, and that was the first use of

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Speaker 1: a computer a fully computer generated character in the film

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Speaker 1: Who's Stalking Nice. So in nine six here's where the

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Speaker 1: spinoff happens. That um that I mentioned. So back in

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Speaker 1: seventy nine they had the Graphics Group Division, and eight

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Speaker 1: six Lucasfilm spins off the Graphics Group Division as its

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Speaker 1: own company with a healthy dose of funding from a

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Speaker 1: certain Mr. Steve Jobs who had kind of lost his job.

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Speaker 1: Yeah he was he had a gig and then they

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Speaker 1: cut him loose. Yeah, he he just founded Apple and

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Speaker 1: then got pushed off to the very edges of that

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Speaker 1: company and essentially they kind of fired him without saying

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Speaker 1: he's fired. And then he said, all right, I guess

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Speaker 1: I'm going and he left. And then but yeah, he

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Speaker 1: poured in a great deal of money to the Graphics

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Speaker 1: Group which became Pixar. So Pixar at this time was

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Speaker 1: again really kind of pioneering computer graphics, computer animation. It

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Speaker 1: would of course be several years before um Pixar would

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Speaker 1: enter in it's uh, it's long and fruitful relationship with Disney. Yes, so,

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Speaker 1: but that that did have its you know, start way

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Speaker 1: back then. And yeah, they were um of course they

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Speaker 1: weren't what they are now. But you know, and you

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Speaker 1: might say, I can't believe that George Lucas allowed this

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Speaker 1: to happen, but at the time it probably wasn't so

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Speaker 1: clear cut. It was very expensive to do what they

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Speaker 1: were doing, and there there were there were no clear

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Speaker 1: indicators at that time. I mean, computer hardware wasn't what

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Speaker 1: it is now either. It would be a good long

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Speaker 1: decade before you start to see this really kind of payoff,

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Speaker 1: but boy did it. So Industrial Line Magic entered in

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Speaker 1: with a partnership with a little company called Kodak, which, uh,

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Speaker 1: of course has seen some hard times recently. But Kodak

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Speaker 1: and I LM produced the first high resolution film input scanner.

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Speaker 1: Now this was important because what I could let you

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Speaker 1: do is digitally scan film. Then you could edit it

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Speaker 1: with a computer and then you would print it back

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Speaker 1: out onto film, and uh, you wouldn't have to do

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Speaker 1: all those edits manually using the traditional methods of of

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Speaker 1: cutting film and editing that way, So it gave a

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Speaker 1: lot more versatility to the editing process. And you guys

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Speaker 1: may not be aware of this, but it really is

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Speaker 1: true that films are made in the editing booth. That

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Speaker 1: you can shoot hours and hours and hours of footage

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Speaker 1: of actors doing lines and and uh and running around

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Speaker 1: and explosions and whatever. But until you get into the

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Speaker 1: editing booth and put it all together, you do not

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Speaker 1: have a movie. And in fact, I have seen evidence

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Speaker 1: of amazing films coming from what you would imagine to

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Speaker 1: be um worthless footage, and it's all due to a

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Speaker 1: really creative editor finding ways to make something interesting when before,

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Speaker 1: like you might watch a sequence that originally was twelve

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Speaker 1: minutes long and you think, wow, this is unusable, and

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Speaker 1: then an editor gets ahold of it and cuts it

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Speaker 1: down to like seven and a half minutes, and suddenly

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Speaker 1: it's phenomenal. And so uh, this is one of those

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Speaker 1: important developments in the industry. Now, granted, this is only

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Speaker 1: important as long as film remains a factor, and of

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Speaker 1: course that doesn't always hold true. We've done a lot

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Speaker 1: of digital productions out there. In fact, almost everything is

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Speaker 1: digital now yeah and now of course, uh thanks to

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Speaker 1: who was that anyway? Um foreshadowing? Uh yeah, although this

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Speaker 1: device used charged couple device, uh image sensor, it was

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Speaker 1: not a digital camera in the way that we think

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Speaker 1: of now. You know, this was a scanner, so it

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Speaker 1: was you know, you you you, you did use a

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Speaker 1: film camera first and then use the scanner and then

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Speaker 1: it would again put film out, so that you know,

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Speaker 1: the projectors, the projectors we use were film projectors. They

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Speaker 1: weren't digital yet, so uh yeah, going fully digital was

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Speaker 1: not a viable option at this point. Um nine nine.

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Speaker 1: They created the first computer generated three dimensional fluid based character.

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Speaker 1: And boy, how many fluid base characters I have loved

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Speaker 1: in the cinema over the years. I can't think of

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Speaker 1: any right now, apart from the alien water creature from

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Speaker 1: the Abyss, which is what this is talking about. Yes, now,

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Speaker 1: I saw, well, I don't know if you if you

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Speaker 1: argue that the terminators being sort of liquid and we'll

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Speaker 1: get to the terminators as well, but yeah, I guess so.

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Speaker 1: So the T one thousands that's really higher a liquid metal,

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Speaker 1: you know, No, it was. I remember I saw the

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Speaker 1: Abyss in the theater, and I remember not thinking as

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Speaker 1: much of the plot as I would have liked to have.

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Speaker 1: But the effects were amazing. The effects were amazing, And

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Speaker 1: I still remember watching, Um, well, I shouldn't I suppose

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Speaker 1: I shouldn't give away one spoiler, but the pseudopod actually

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Speaker 1: gets um it's it's a movie that came out in Okay,

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Speaker 1: spoilers don't apply anymore. When the door shuts and cuts

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00:24:55,880 --> 00:24:59,600
Speaker 1: the Pseudopod's got at that point. Yet, I I just

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Speaker 1: got the why where the doors open and the pseudopods

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Speaker 1: right there and it's friends and I thought they were

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Speaker 1: all gonna have a picnic. And so when it gets cut,

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00:25:08,320 --> 00:25:12,600
Speaker 1: turns into real water and lash four four. Um, just

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Speaker 1: it was amazing, It was fantastic. Well, yeah, and that

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Speaker 1: that was one of those challenges. I mean, there are

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Speaker 1: several things that have been challenges for computer graphics artists

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Speaker 1: to recreate in a photo realistic way. Water was one

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Speaker 1: of them. Fire is another one. Hair is a big one.

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Speaker 1: So there are a lot of fire, a lot of

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Speaker 1: challenges that that that various people working on computer graphics.

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Speaker 1: I've had to try and find a way of of

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Speaker 1: designing so that it has that realistic feel on camera.

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Speaker 1: And of course Pixar was doing a lot of this

419
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Speaker 1: too around the same time. So in ninety one they

420
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Speaker 1: created the first computer graphics main character. This is the

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Speaker 1: one you were referring to, the T one. Yes, that

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Speaker 1: was in ninety one and in Terminator two Judgment Day,

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Speaker 1: which I remember. I liked it a lot when it

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Speaker 1: came out, and as the years go on, I start

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Speaker 1: to change my opinion on that, mainly because of my

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Speaker 1: love for the first film, even as schlocky and goofy

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Speaker 1: as it is, because they kind of totally changed the

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Speaker 1: Tea character terminated character in that one. Anyway, now you two.

429
00:26:20,520 --> 00:26:25,480
Speaker 1: They won their twelve Academy Award for Computer Graphics Work,

430
00:26:25,960 --> 00:26:30,000
Speaker 1: which is pretty amazing. They also had the first time

431
00:26:30,160 --> 00:26:35,359
Speaker 1: they with human skin texture computer generated human skin texture.

432
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:38,359
Speaker 1: This was for the movie Death Becomes Her. Did you

433
00:26:38,359 --> 00:26:43,560
Speaker 1: see that one? No? I haven't. I have great effects

434
00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:46,879
Speaker 1: and it's an interesting concept, but I don't know, I

435
00:26:47,040 --> 00:26:50,400
Speaker 1: just did not click with me. But but again, people,

436
00:26:50,440 --> 00:26:54,639
Speaker 1: the effects were amazing, so that's undeniable. The actual film however,

437
00:26:55,119 --> 00:27:01,520
Speaker 1: left me a little cold. Death becomes her. It's been stiff. Yeah,

438
00:27:01,520 --> 00:27:03,880
Speaker 1: there wasn't. That was a short time later when they

439
00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:09,120
Speaker 1: actually created a character that seemed to breathe with skin,

440
00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:13,600
Speaker 1: muscles and texture. This is a Jurassic Park. Now. Jurassic

441
00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:15,800
Speaker 1: Park was one of those movies again that when it

442
00:27:15,840 --> 00:27:19,959
Speaker 1: first came out, I remember that people were just completely

443
00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:24,320
Speaker 1: stunned with the quality of the of the digital dinosaurs,

444
00:27:24,400 --> 00:27:28,600
Speaker 1: and that those movies you would watch scenes and you'd think, okay,

445
00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:31,760
Speaker 1: that had to be practical. They must have built a

446
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:35,879
Speaker 1: giant robot dinosaur for this scene. And then most times

447
00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:39,520
Speaker 1: that was not the case. It was all computer generated. Uh.

448
00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:41,919
Speaker 1: From today's standards. If you were to go back and

449
00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:45,760
Speaker 1: watch Jurassic Park, I say, it largely holds up. But

450
00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:48,840
Speaker 1: there are definitely bits where you'll think, Okay, I can

451
00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:51,800
Speaker 1: kind of tell that's computer generated. Apart from the fact that, yes,

452
00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:55,320
Speaker 1: we know that dinosaurs aren't walking around right now, beyond that,

453
00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:58,439
Speaker 1: I can tell its computer generated. Uh. And there are

454
00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:02,000
Speaker 1: a couple of scenes that are more obvious than others.

455
00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:05,199
Speaker 1: But you gotta thank you know, for nine it was

456
00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:08,400
Speaker 1: a pretty phenomenal achievement. And like I said it more.

457
00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:13,000
Speaker 1: It holds up more than it doesn't. Right now, again,

458
00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:17,280
Speaker 1: another short jump to a film where they did their

459
00:28:17,320 --> 00:28:24,640
Speaker 1: first computer graphic photo realistic hair and fur. Yeah, and uh,

460
00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:27,680
Speaker 1: it's interesting because they had a great model to work

461
00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:31,240
Speaker 1: from with Robin Williams, who is probably the hairyest, furiest

462
00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:35,080
Speaker 1: man on the planet. You're looking at me, funny, Uh,

463
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:37,879
Speaker 1: that was a that was a joke. That was a joke.

464
00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:40,760
Speaker 1: He was a hairy man. But does a joke make

465
00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:44,800
Speaker 1: jokes about that? They created the effects for all these

466
00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:48,080
Speaker 1: computer generated animals, and these animals were supposed to look

467
00:28:48,920 --> 00:28:53,680
Speaker 1: not They're supposed to like almost a slight fantasy version

468
00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:55,760
Speaker 1: of the real animal, because the idea was these were

469
00:28:55,800 --> 00:29:00,400
Speaker 1: all generated from this magical board game and so it wasn't.

470
00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:04,080
Speaker 1: They didn't need to look exactly like the real world

471
00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:06,479
Speaker 1: version of those animals. They need to look a little

472
00:29:06,560 --> 00:29:10,160
Speaker 1: hyper realistic, but not so much as to be distracting.

473
00:29:10,280 --> 00:29:13,840
Speaker 1: So that was the goal they had for that film. Um.

474
00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:19,200
Speaker 1: They also created, uh, the first synthetic speaking character with

475
00:29:19,320 --> 00:29:22,840
Speaker 1: distinct personality, so how they word it on their timeline,

476
00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:26,880
Speaker 1: That would be Casper from Casper the Ghost which uh

477
00:29:27,400 --> 00:29:31,760
Speaker 1: ghosts I did not watch. But now these were This

478
00:29:31,800 --> 00:29:33,680
Speaker 1: was a case where you're talking about a computer generated

479
00:29:33,760 --> 00:29:37,479
Speaker 1: character that not only appears on screen, but has a

480
00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:40,800
Speaker 1: large an important presence in the film and has to

481
00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:45,120
Speaker 1: be able to convey emotion and meeting and motive. Uh.

482
00:29:45,200 --> 00:29:49,120
Speaker 1: And so that's, you know, that's more challenging than creating

483
00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:51,400
Speaker 1: something that looks real. You have to have something that's

484
00:29:51,520 --> 00:29:54,640
Speaker 1: behaving in a realistic way and a believable way so

485
00:29:54,720 --> 00:29:58,200
Speaker 1: that the audience has an emotional connection with that character,

486
00:29:58,800 --> 00:30:01,560
Speaker 1: and that that it's not easy to do. I mean,

487
00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:05,840
Speaker 1: computer animators and animators in general will tell you, you know,

488
00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:08,280
Speaker 1: once you develop that kind of style where you can

489
00:30:08,320 --> 00:30:12,960
Speaker 1: create that on a reliable basis, it's an amazingly effective

490
00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:15,840
Speaker 1: and useful tool. And before you get there, it is

491
00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:20,719
Speaker 1: just a painstaking process thinking, well, you know, I created

492
00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:23,120
Speaker 1: this character and the sad thing happens to this character,

493
00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:25,560
Speaker 1: but no one seems to care. It's I mean, it's

494
00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:28,920
Speaker 1: a tricky thing to to be able to invoke empathy

495
00:30:29,080 --> 00:30:35,080
Speaker 1: in your audience. Ninety eight they were awarded to I

496
00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:37,960
Speaker 1: l M was awarded two patents for some techniques. One

497
00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:42,040
Speaker 1: was for hair, fur and feathers. Uh. In this case,

498
00:30:42,440 --> 00:30:45,280
Speaker 1: it was the hair, fur and feathers effects they made

499
00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:48,200
Speaker 1: for another movie, Mighty Joe Young, which was a remake.

500
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:52,800
Speaker 1: I saw the original Mighty Joe Young way back when

501
00:30:52,840 --> 00:30:56,240
Speaker 1: I didn't see the remake. Um, this one was hair raising,

502
00:30:56,520 --> 00:30:58,080
Speaker 1: I'm sure it was. And the other one was for

503
00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:03,520
Speaker 1: facial animation, which was again created originally for the film Casper,

504
00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:07,120
Speaker 1: but was also used on other movies like Men in Black.

505
00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:14,320
Speaker 1: They created the most realistic digital human character ever seen

506
00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:20,480
Speaker 1: in film, which was not the Daddy. It was the Mummy.

507
00:31:23,240 --> 00:31:26,640
Speaker 1: Chris is not having a great morning right now. Hey,

508
00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:29,880
Speaker 1: I just listened by the way slight tangent. I just

509
00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:34,400
Speaker 1: listened to one of our older episodes, and uh, and

510
00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:39,400
Speaker 1: you ground my my will to live into the dirt

511
00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:41,800
Speaker 1: with your puns. So you're gonna sit here and you're gonna,

512
00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:47,160
Speaker 1: you're gonna, you're gonna endure this, alright. Two thousand Um.

513
00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:50,720
Speaker 1: That was with the the real time on character motion

514
00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:53,920
Speaker 1: capture system developed for Star Wars episode one. So this

515
00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:57,320
Speaker 1: is this is where they have someone's favorite movie of all,

516
00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:02,320
Speaker 1: Thank you, Yeah. Star Wars episode one. The phenominis which

517
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:08,280
Speaker 1: I'll say this, I think it's the best of the prequels. Alright,

518
00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:11,840
Speaker 1: that's as much praise as I can give it. But anyway,

519
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:16,000
Speaker 1: also it has jar Jar, so do the other two prequels.

520
00:32:16,280 --> 00:32:19,200
Speaker 1: It also has Darth Vader saying yippie. And I still

521
00:32:19,240 --> 00:32:22,680
Speaker 1: say it's better than the other two. Um, But that's

522
00:32:22,720 --> 00:32:25,360
Speaker 1: neither here nor there. What they developed was this motion

523
00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:27,760
Speaker 1: capture system that worked in real time. Now, this is

524
00:32:27,800 --> 00:32:32,160
Speaker 1: really useful, and that you could get an actor wearing

525
00:32:32,160 --> 00:32:34,560
Speaker 1: a special suit that would have sensors on our or

526
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:37,080
Speaker 1: really it's not even sensors, it's just points of reference,

527
00:32:37,120 --> 00:32:40,000
Speaker 1: so for a camera to pick up um and then

528
00:32:40,040 --> 00:32:45,080
Speaker 1: the actor could physically portray a performance within a space.

529
00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:48,640
Speaker 1: And then they take that information that the actor has

530
00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:51,959
Speaker 1: created by moving through the space and the camera picks up.

531
00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:55,480
Speaker 1: They feed it through software and that becomes the guideline

532
00:32:55,760 --> 00:32:58,880
Speaker 1: for the computer generated character that will replace the physical

533
00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:01,920
Speaker 1: actor who was moving through there. Jar Jar is an

534
00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:06,520
Speaker 1: example of that. That was one of the characters that

535
00:33:06,520 --> 00:33:13,240
Speaker 1: that used this um this technology to create the performance. Now,

536
00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:15,400
Speaker 1: while I do not much care for the character of

537
00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:18,960
Speaker 1: jar Jar, I do admit that it was an interesting

538
00:33:19,440 --> 00:33:22,760
Speaker 1: use of technology to be able to give a computer

539
00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:27,880
Speaker 1: generated character more of a physical performance by actually mapping

540
00:33:27,880 --> 00:33:31,560
Speaker 1: it to someone's real movements, because otherwise you've got animators

541
00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:34,959
Speaker 1: trying to simulate real movements as best they can. And

542
00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:37,760
Speaker 1: sometimes it works great and you watch it and you think, oh, well,

543
00:33:37,760 --> 00:33:40,320
Speaker 1: that looks real, and sometimes you're like, huh, that doesn't

544
00:33:40,320 --> 00:33:42,560
Speaker 1: look right at all. Yeah, they're going to use this

545
00:33:42,640 --> 00:33:44,520
Speaker 1: technique again, and some of the movies that are coming

546
00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:49,400
Speaker 1: up to to pardon my pun, great effect, um, some

547
00:33:49,480 --> 00:33:53,160
Speaker 1: of my my favorite recent more recent movies. Yep. They

548
00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:56,160
Speaker 1: also began to develop other stuff. In two thousand and one,

549
00:33:56,160 --> 00:34:01,440
Speaker 1: they developed ambient occlusion. Yeah that's uh, that's just what

550
00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:05,720
Speaker 1: it sounds like. Yeah, which, there you go. They actually

551
00:34:05,800 --> 00:34:07,800
Speaker 1: used this in the movie Pearl Harbor. Like it's just

552
00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:11,200
Speaker 1: what it sounds like. I have no idea what you mean. Basically,

553
00:34:11,200 --> 00:34:15,000
Speaker 1: they were using a combination of light and shadows that

554
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:20,759
Speaker 1: made the lighting appear realistic through the use of computer graphics.

555
00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:24,840
Speaker 1: And they really it really showed uh showed up for

556
00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:27,920
Speaker 1: the first time in Pearl Harbor, the movie, not not

557
00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:31,000
Speaker 1: the actual actual Pearl Harbor, not the place nor the

558
00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:34,200
Speaker 1: historical event. Yes, but they yeah, I mean with the

559
00:34:34,200 --> 00:34:37,240
Speaker 1: the planes in the attack on the the American fleet

560
00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:40,600
Speaker 1: and that you know in the early morning hours. Um,

561
00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:43,680
Speaker 1: you know it required a lot of clever lighting. Yeah.

562
00:34:43,680 --> 00:34:46,120
Speaker 1: And shadows. Yeah, you're talking about explosions, You're talking about

563
00:34:46,120 --> 00:34:49,040
Speaker 1: shadows being cast by lots of different objects. You're talking

564
00:34:49,120 --> 00:34:51,279
Speaker 1: about smoke. I mean, there's there are a lot of

565
00:34:51,320 --> 00:34:54,440
Speaker 1: effects here that we kind of you know, you take

566
00:34:54,480 --> 00:34:56,279
Speaker 1: for granted when you watch it on a film, but

567
00:34:56,400 --> 00:34:59,400
Speaker 1: to be able to recreate it realistically in a computer

568
00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:03,160
Speaker 1: environment is not easy, and that that's why a lot

569
00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:05,640
Speaker 1: of this technology went toward. That same year, they also

570
00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:12,279
Speaker 1: created on set visualization processes that would allow a filmmaker

571
00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:16,640
Speaker 1: to put actors into an environment, let's say, like a

572
00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:20,680
Speaker 1: big green screen environment, and look at the virtual sets

573
00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:26,480
Speaker 1: around the real actors, complete with the actual camera motions. Um.

574
00:35:26,719 --> 00:35:29,400
Speaker 1: This was This is useful when you're making a movie

575
00:35:29,480 --> 00:35:33,680
Speaker 1: where a lot of the backgrounds you create are digitally inserted.

576
00:35:33,760 --> 00:35:36,399
Speaker 1: It's not it's not a computer animated film. It's still

577
00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:41,040
Speaker 1: a live action film. But the uh, the the sets

578
00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:43,319
Speaker 1: might be virtual. And we saw this in a lot

579
00:35:43,360 --> 00:35:45,160
Speaker 1: of the movies, like a lot of the Star Wars

580
00:35:45,160 --> 00:35:48,640
Speaker 1: prequels had it. The example they give specifically within the

581
00:35:48,640 --> 00:35:55,600
Speaker 1: Island Timeline is with Steven Spielberg's movie AI Artificial Intelligence. Uh,

582
00:35:55,719 --> 00:35:58,920
Speaker 1: there's another let down. A lot of movies here that

583
00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:02,120
Speaker 1: I didn't really care so much. Yeah, but back to

584
00:36:02,120 --> 00:36:05,000
Speaker 1: the Future I loved. So there's there's that in Dressed Park.

585
00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:07,759
Speaker 1: I love that too. So it's okay, I'll just keep

586
00:36:07,800 --> 00:36:11,279
Speaker 1: doing all right, two thousand three or do we were

587
00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:12,719
Speaker 1: about to say something? I'm sorry, Well, I was going

588
00:36:12,760 --> 00:36:16,920
Speaker 1: to point out that the uh for the ambient occlusion thing.

589
00:36:17,320 --> 00:36:20,160
Speaker 1: They do point out that. Um a few years later

590
00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:24,120
Speaker 1: in the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences gave

591
00:36:24,160 --> 00:36:27,760
Speaker 1: them a cy Tech Award for the ways in which

592
00:36:27,840 --> 00:36:33,279
Speaker 1: ambient inclusion helped advance computer graphics in the motion picture industry. So,

593
00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:35,840
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, looking at it in retrospect, it

594
00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:38,080
Speaker 1: may not have seemed like a big deal at the time.

595
00:36:38,120 --> 00:36:40,120
Speaker 1: It may have seemed all that that movie is lit

596
00:36:40,160 --> 00:36:43,720
Speaker 1: and you know, shadowed very well, but it has played

597
00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:46,319
Speaker 1: a significant role in many, many other films since then.

598
00:36:46,400 --> 00:36:49,760
Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, I mean that's before we went too far. Sure,

599
00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:53,799
Speaker 1: these these developments they're making are things that are are

600
00:36:53,840 --> 00:36:57,360
Speaker 1: pushing forward the filmmaking industry across the entire industry, not

601
00:36:57,520 --> 00:37:01,200
Speaker 1: just for a single movie. Uh, it really I l

602
00:37:01,360 --> 00:37:04,920
Speaker 1: M has done a lot to shape the way movies

603
00:37:05,160 --> 00:37:09,279
Speaker 1: are today. Uh. Without their influence, I would say that

604
00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:13,279
Speaker 1: we'd be we'd have very different films right now if

605
00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:16,520
Speaker 1: it were not for industrial line magic. Doesn't necessarily mean

606
00:37:16,520 --> 00:37:18,240
Speaker 1: that they would be better or worse, but they would

607
00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:22,319
Speaker 1: certainly be different. It went so, Yeah, you mentioned the

608
00:37:22,360 --> 00:37:24,960
Speaker 1: two thousand three or you mentioned the awards. They also

609
00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:28,320
Speaker 1: got an award for the way that they found to

610
00:37:28,560 --> 00:37:34,399
Speaker 1: render skin or translucent materials, uh, from the the good

611
00:37:34,400 --> 00:37:36,799
Speaker 1: old cy Tech Award. They also in two thousand four

612
00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:42,600
Speaker 1: created a digital baby for a lemony snicket. It's a

613
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:47,000
Speaker 1: series of unfortunate events and it was this marked, according

614
00:37:47,040 --> 00:37:49,399
Speaker 1: to I l M, the first time that you had

615
00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:54,120
Speaker 1: a computer generated human character shown an extreme close up.

616
00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:59,280
Speaker 1: So we're getting to the point now where photo realistic

617
00:37:59,320 --> 00:38:04,640
Speaker 1: computer generated characters are within the realm of possibility for

618
00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:08,399
Speaker 1: a serious filmmaker. Um to the to the point where

619
00:38:08,400 --> 00:38:11,120
Speaker 1: it's not necessarily going to be distracting when you watch

620
00:38:11,160 --> 00:38:13,000
Speaker 1: it and you think, wow, that does not look real.

621
00:38:13,520 --> 00:38:16,799
Speaker 1: Doesn't mean that everyone pulls it off successfully these days,

622
00:38:16,840 --> 00:38:19,959
Speaker 1: but at least it's much more possible. Two thousand six,

623
00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:24,120
Speaker 1: they developed imo cap, which was an image based performance

624
00:38:24,160 --> 00:38:27,000
Speaker 1: capture system, and this was for one of the Pirates

625
00:38:27,000 --> 00:38:30,760
Speaker 1: of the Caribbean movies. And that same year, two thousand six,

626
00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:37,920
Speaker 1: was when Disney made an acquisition. Disney purchased Pixar. So

627
00:38:37,960 --> 00:38:41,520
Speaker 1: you remember back in that's when Pixar struck out on

628
00:38:41,560 --> 00:38:43,799
Speaker 1: its own, not not struck out in the baseball sense,

629
00:38:43,840 --> 00:38:48,880
Speaker 1: but set out as its own company under the the

630
00:38:48,880 --> 00:38:52,160
Speaker 1: the financial support of Steve Jobs. Well, two thousand six,

631
00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:57,120
Speaker 1: Disney makes a move to acquire that company, Pixar. Disney

632
00:38:57,120 --> 00:39:00,120
Speaker 1: and Pixar had already been making several movies together for

633
00:39:00,440 --> 00:39:04,120
Speaker 1: several years, and uh it was it was a strategic

634
00:39:04,200 --> 00:39:09,640
Speaker 1: move to guarantee that Pixar would remain under the Disney family.

635
00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:13,040
Speaker 1: And that also it was kind of a talent grab

636
00:39:13,600 --> 00:39:16,160
Speaker 1: because John Lasseter, who was the head of Pixar at

637
00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:19,520
Speaker 1: the time, would become the creative head of Walt Disney

638
00:39:19,600 --> 00:39:24,959
Speaker 1: Animation as well as a imagineering So um that that

639
00:39:25,320 --> 00:39:30,440
Speaker 1: little acquisition was made for seven point four billion dollars

640
00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:34,160
Speaker 1: in stocks and other assets. So that made Steve Jobs

641
00:39:34,239 --> 00:39:38,279
Speaker 1: the largest shareholder in Disney at that time and put

642
00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:42,080
Speaker 1: him on the Border Directors to seven point four billion. Now,

643
00:39:42,120 --> 00:39:44,799
Speaker 1: that to me is interesting because we already mentioned, you know,

644
00:39:44,840 --> 00:39:47,640
Speaker 1: Disney's buying or trying to buy Lucasfilm. As of the

645
00:39:47,680 --> 00:39:50,200
Speaker 1: recording of this podcast, the deal has not been approved,

646
00:39:50,680 --> 00:39:53,680
Speaker 1: but a Disney would be purchasing them for four point

647
00:39:53,680 --> 00:39:56,560
Speaker 1: oh five billions. So you've got a division, a former

648
00:39:56,680 --> 00:40:02,359
Speaker 1: division of Lucasfilm sold for uh, not quite twice as

649
00:40:02,440 --> 00:40:07,920
Speaker 1: much as what the parent company sold for. That's interesting.

650
00:40:08,280 --> 00:40:14,240
Speaker 1: So two thousand seven, Uh, at this point, I LM

651
00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:20,760
Speaker 1: is working on creating a system to simulate fluid motion.

652
00:40:21,360 --> 00:40:23,520
Speaker 1: And this again is tricky. You know, we talked about

653
00:40:23,560 --> 00:40:28,120
Speaker 1: getting a water effect is challenging, and that's true. It's

654
00:40:28,160 --> 00:40:33,000
Speaker 1: also challenging to simulate fluid mechanics, especially you're talking about

655
00:40:33,040 --> 00:40:35,759
Speaker 1: huge quantities. You know, with with the Pirates of the

656
00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:37,880
Speaker 1: Caribbean movies, you're talking about ships on the ocean, So

657
00:40:37,920 --> 00:40:40,360
Speaker 1: you need to be able to simulate the way the

658
00:40:40,400 --> 00:40:44,120
Speaker 1: ocean really moves and the way that objects floating or

659
00:40:44,760 --> 00:40:47,479
Speaker 1: otherwise you know, somehow in the water, how they would

660
00:40:47,480 --> 00:40:52,000
Speaker 1: move as well. So they did a lot of work

661
00:40:52,040 --> 00:40:55,080
Speaker 1: in two thousand seven to perfect that technique. Yeah, they

662
00:40:55,080 --> 00:40:59,319
Speaker 1: actually used a particular system that they called Zeno and

663
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:05,600
Speaker 1: an engine, a graphics engine called fiz bam UM. And this, uh,

664
00:41:05,600 --> 00:41:08,640
Speaker 1: this was the series I was mentioning a few minutes ago,

665
00:41:08,719 --> 00:41:12,480
Speaker 1: because they they modeled these effects within what they were

666
00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:16,080
Speaker 1: calling a virtual water tank. But of course in the

667
00:41:16,239 --> 00:41:18,759
Speaker 1: in the last in the second and third movies, in

668
00:41:18,800 --> 00:41:23,040
Speaker 1: the installment, UM, there were lots of appearances by Davy

669
00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:30,360
Speaker 1: Jones and his UH daydream believers, UH, his crew, which

670
00:41:30,640 --> 00:41:35,520
Speaker 1: were who had taken on aspects of sea life as

671
00:41:35,560 --> 00:41:40,000
Speaker 1: they lived underwater. UM. And they there's a really cool

672
00:41:40,040 --> 00:41:44,160
Speaker 1: picture out there where they show the uh motion capture

673
00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:48,280
Speaker 1: UM sticker things that they put on that the actors

674
00:41:48,880 --> 00:41:51,920
Speaker 1: to uh while they are you know, pretending to be

675
00:41:52,040 --> 00:41:54,359
Speaker 1: or they're acting as the crew, and it's it's kind

676
00:41:54,400 --> 00:41:56,399
Speaker 1: of cool because they can't get weight, they don't have

677
00:41:56,960 --> 00:42:01,359
Speaker 1: giant fish heads on, UH, but that's you know how

678
00:42:01,400 --> 00:42:04,840
Speaker 1: they did that. And the amazing sea battle effects and

679
00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:09,960
Speaker 1: all the things, the giant maelstrom UM, just amazing stuff.

680
00:42:10,000 --> 00:42:13,080
Speaker 1: And then of course you know the YEP. And in

681
00:42:13,120 --> 00:42:16,560
Speaker 1: two thousand and eight they began to work on FEZ

682
00:42:16,680 --> 00:42:20,200
Speaker 1: because fezes are cool. They are according to a doctor

683
00:42:20,239 --> 00:42:25,640
Speaker 1: I know yes, but no Fez was the name of

684
00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:30,279
Speaker 1: a facial animation system that they had been working on.

685
00:42:30,320 --> 00:42:33,960
Speaker 1: And again this is to refine that that ability to

686
00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:37,400
Speaker 1: capture an actor's performance to translate it to a computer

687
00:42:37,480 --> 00:42:40,840
Speaker 1: generated character. This is one of those things that really

688
00:42:41,040 --> 00:42:45,480
Speaker 1: is problematic. It's interest. It's an interesting question to ask

689
00:42:45,960 --> 00:42:52,680
Speaker 1: who is ultimately responsible for a computer generated character's performance? Um,

690
00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:55,600
Speaker 1: Because if you have a performance within a film that

691
00:42:55,800 --> 00:42:59,719
Speaker 1: is award worthy, but it's a computer generated character, who

692
00:42:59,719 --> 00:43:02,160
Speaker 1: do you give the award to? Do you give it

693
00:43:02,200 --> 00:43:06,200
Speaker 1: to the animator who built or the people who built

694
00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:09,840
Speaker 1: the textures and rendered everything and made it now that

695
00:43:09,960 --> 00:43:12,040
Speaker 1: made sure they made all the tweaks to make the

696
00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:14,520
Speaker 1: character look exactly the way the character looks. Do you

697
00:43:14,560 --> 00:43:18,920
Speaker 1: give it to the actor who physically portrayed that character

698
00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:22,480
Speaker 1: and it's that actor's movements that you are watching, even

699
00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:27,279
Speaker 1: though it's a different, uh, computer generated body that's doing

700
00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:30,279
Speaker 1: the motions. Ultimately it was an actor who went through

701
00:43:30,320 --> 00:43:32,879
Speaker 1: those motions. Uh. Is it the voice actor who may

702
00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:35,279
Speaker 1: or may not be the same person who did the

703
00:43:35,320 --> 00:43:39,000
Speaker 1: physical motions. It's a it's a complicated question because the

704
00:43:39,160 --> 00:43:42,520
Speaker 1: performance comes from so many different people working together to

705
00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:45,799
Speaker 1: create this thing you're watching. And I know that that

706
00:43:45,880 --> 00:43:47,960
Speaker 1: was one of those questions that came up during the

707
00:43:47,960 --> 00:43:50,399
Speaker 1: Lord of the Rings movies because there were people who

708
00:43:50,400 --> 00:43:54,960
Speaker 1: were saying that Andy Serkis should be nominated for his

709
00:43:55,040 --> 00:44:00,360
Speaker 1: performance as Gollum in those movies. But how much of

710
00:44:00,400 --> 00:44:04,200
Speaker 1: that performance would you say, is his versus the animators

711
00:44:04,239 --> 00:44:08,560
Speaker 1: who created the Uh, I hesitate to use the word physical,

712
00:44:08,640 --> 00:44:10,840
Speaker 1: but the the visual version of the character that you

713
00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:13,560
Speaker 1: see on the screen. And it's I don't think there's

714
00:44:13,600 --> 00:44:15,399
Speaker 1: an easy answer to that question. It may very well

715
00:44:15,440 --> 00:44:18,680
Speaker 1: mean that one day we'll see a new category of

716
00:44:19,000 --> 00:44:22,960
Speaker 1: award come up where it's best performance of some sort

717
00:44:23,200 --> 00:44:26,000
Speaker 1: as opposed to just best Actor or Best Supporting Actor

718
00:44:25,800 --> 00:44:31,239
Speaker 1: or actress. Yes, wow, you waited all that time just

719
00:44:31,320 --> 00:44:34,120
Speaker 1: to do that, all right? Two thousand nine, Uh, we

720
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:40,080
Speaker 1: had the very GPU engine which was designed to create firestorms.

721
00:44:40,400 --> 00:44:42,960
Speaker 1: So again you know, looking at the stuff that's hard

722
00:44:43,000 --> 00:44:47,480
Speaker 1: to make look real on computer graphics. You know, fire

723
00:44:47,520 --> 00:44:49,600
Speaker 1: and water, those are big and for those are the

724
00:44:49,600 --> 00:44:53,360
Speaker 1: big ones. Well, they they're working on the Harry Potter

725
00:44:53,400 --> 00:44:56,839
Speaker 1: series of movies and they for the sixth film, they

726
00:44:56,960 --> 00:44:59,919
Speaker 1: really needed to be able to have realistic fire eff

727
00:45:00,960 --> 00:45:03,719
Speaker 1: So you know, it's it's the I l M way

728
00:45:03,719 --> 00:45:05,800
Speaker 1: when if you don't have a system that already doesn't,

729
00:45:05,840 --> 00:45:09,920
Speaker 1: go build one and they and so this kind of

730
00:45:10,440 --> 00:45:13,600
Speaker 1: wraps up where they are today. I mean I l

731
00:45:13,800 --> 00:45:17,000
Speaker 1: M is not the only property outside of Lucasfilm that

732
00:45:17,640 --> 00:45:20,000
Speaker 1: will be acquired by Disney if this deal goes through.

733
00:45:20,000 --> 00:45:24,640
Speaker 1: Skywalker's sound is also in there. And you know, Lucas has,

734
00:45:25,080 --> 00:45:28,200
Speaker 1: like we said, he's had a huge influence on the

735
00:45:28,280 --> 00:45:32,759
Speaker 1: way movies are shown today. I mean th h X

736
00:45:32,880 --> 00:45:37,160
Speaker 1: is another example, uh, which Disney I was also going

737
00:45:37,200 --> 00:45:41,239
Speaker 1: to get. So really, when it comes down to the

738
00:45:41,239 --> 00:45:47,680
Speaker 1: the technology behind filmmaking and film projection, film screening, Disney

739
00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:51,160
Speaker 1: is making a huge move here and and some people

740
00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:52,919
Speaker 1: are a little nervous about it. I've got friends who

741
00:45:52,920 --> 00:45:56,880
Speaker 1: work in effects. They work for for effect houses that

742
00:45:57,600 --> 00:46:01,600
Speaker 1: often will get contracted to work on companies um, and

743
00:46:01,920 --> 00:46:04,200
Speaker 1: some of these friends of mine are a little nervous

744
00:46:04,239 --> 00:46:07,960
Speaker 1: because this is sort of showing a consolidation of effects

745
00:46:08,000 --> 00:46:13,600
Speaker 1: houses and that could mean less competition and fewer opportunities

746
00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:17,080
Speaker 1: for these artists. So there are things to worry about

747
00:46:18,120 --> 00:46:22,080
Speaker 1: depending upon what field you are in. Yeah, but nonetheless,

748
00:46:22,120 --> 00:46:24,600
Speaker 1: I still think it will be interesting to see and

749
00:46:24,680 --> 00:46:29,359
Speaker 1: if some of the people leave, um, you know, they

750
00:46:29,360 --> 00:46:33,400
Speaker 1: may very well take the ability to uh do these

751
00:46:33,440 --> 00:46:35,719
Speaker 1: complex the knowledge that it takes to to build these

752
00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:41,640
Speaker 1: complex effects with them, making the acquisition less valuable. There's

753
00:46:41,680 --> 00:46:44,200
Speaker 1: always a chance that people could strike out and create

754
00:46:44,239 --> 00:46:48,200
Speaker 1: their own uh companies as well and start competing with

755
00:46:48,320 --> 00:46:50,440
Speaker 1: their old company. I mean that's happened several times in

756
00:46:50,480 --> 00:46:53,319
Speaker 1: the past as well, so it's too early to say.

757
00:46:53,400 --> 00:46:56,879
Speaker 1: But some of the movies Alam has worked on we've

758
00:46:56,880 --> 00:47:00,680
Speaker 1: talked about, of course, the Star Wars series all the

759
00:47:00,719 --> 00:47:05,719
Speaker 1: way from episode four through six and then one through three. Uh,

760
00:47:05,800 --> 00:47:09,959
Speaker 1: the several Star Trek films generations first contact on Star

761
00:47:09,960 --> 00:47:12,640
Speaker 1: Wars are Star Trek Wrath of con which is my

762
00:47:12,719 --> 00:47:14,680
Speaker 1: favorite of all of the Star Trek films because it's

763
00:47:14,800 --> 00:47:20,840
Speaker 1: very cold. It's space. Yes, it is fine Corinthian leather. Yeah.

764
00:47:21,000 --> 00:47:24,240
Speaker 1: The Jurassic Park movies. Uh, you know, had the mask

765
00:47:24,640 --> 00:47:28,759
Speaker 1: Forrest Gump, Twister. Never had I felt that a cow

766
00:47:28,880 --> 00:47:33,279
Speaker 1: really did fly past someone's windshield until I saw Twister. Uh,

767
00:47:33,400 --> 00:47:38,080
Speaker 1: Mission impossible. Three. They They've worked on many, many, many movies.

768
00:47:38,120 --> 00:47:40,680
Speaker 1: I mean, if you if you watch any film that

769
00:47:40,680 --> 00:47:42,600
Speaker 1: has a lot of special effects in it, and you

770
00:47:42,640 --> 00:47:45,759
Speaker 1: wait to the end. Uh, it's amazing how many of

771
00:47:45,760 --> 00:47:48,160
Speaker 1: them have Industrial Light and Magic listed as at least

772
00:47:48,200 --> 00:47:50,920
Speaker 1: part of the team that worked on the effects. Also,

773
00:47:51,080 --> 00:47:55,600
Speaker 1: it's it's interesting to realize how many films you may

774
00:47:55,640 --> 00:47:57,960
Speaker 1: not have realized have a lot of special effects in

775
00:47:58,040 --> 00:48:01,080
Speaker 1: them because the special effects are to make the film

776
00:48:01,120 --> 00:48:04,799
Speaker 1: look more like real life. Uh, Forrestcump is a good one,

777
00:48:04,800 --> 00:48:08,360
Speaker 1: although you could argue that no, no, that's clear because

778
00:48:08,360 --> 00:48:10,560
Speaker 1: you know, Tom Hanks never actually shook hands with that

779
00:48:10,600 --> 00:48:15,200
Speaker 1: many presidents still. But but even so, that's that's one

780
00:48:15,200 --> 00:48:17,600
Speaker 1: of those where the special effects are there to create

781
00:48:17,600 --> 00:48:21,480
Speaker 1: the story, but they're not you know, it's not spectacle

782
00:48:21,600 --> 00:48:23,560
Speaker 1: the way it would be in a big science fiction

783
00:48:23,640 --> 00:48:27,120
Speaker 1: film or something. Right. So, yeah, they have had a

784
00:48:27,160 --> 00:48:31,000
Speaker 1: monumental effect on the movie industry, definitely, and uh, I'm

785
00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:34,240
Speaker 1: sure they will continue to do so even whether whether

786
00:48:34,320 --> 00:48:37,200
Speaker 1: Disney's deal goes through or not. I'm sure it will

787
00:48:37,280 --> 00:48:49,520
Speaker 1: remain a big player in the the effects industry. All Right,

788
00:48:49,560 --> 00:48:52,080
Speaker 1: we're back, and I wanted to just say that. Of course,

789
00:48:52,400 --> 00:48:55,520
Speaker 1: as we know, Disney did in fact purchase Industrial Light

790
00:48:55,560 --> 00:48:59,000
Speaker 1: and Magic. It amazes me that that happened back in

791
00:48:59,040 --> 00:49:03,440
Speaker 1: two thousand and twelve, because I'm really bad at ordering

792
00:49:04,080 --> 00:49:07,680
Speaker 1: big events in chronological order in my mind. In my mind,

793
00:49:07,840 --> 00:49:10,920
Speaker 1: Chris had already left as co host and the and

794
00:49:11,000 --> 00:49:15,040
Speaker 1: Disney had not even thought about buying Lucasfilm at that time.

795
00:49:15,200 --> 00:49:17,480
Speaker 1: Obviously that's not the case, but that's not how I remember.

796
00:49:17,520 --> 00:49:20,600
Speaker 1: It just shows me that my memory is faulty. Also,

797
00:49:21,040 --> 00:49:23,040
Speaker 1: I wanted to mention, of course, I made a joke

798
00:49:23,120 --> 00:49:26,160
Speaker 1: about Robin Williams in this episode, and I miss Robin

799
00:49:26,239 --> 00:49:29,160
Speaker 1: Williams very much. I even thought about leaving in a

800
00:49:29,239 --> 00:49:31,719
Speaker 1: note to say, cut the joke about Robin Williams. But

801
00:49:31,800 --> 00:49:35,560
Speaker 1: I think, considering who Robin Williams was and his sort

802
00:49:35,600 --> 00:49:38,520
Speaker 1: of irreverence since the humor, that it's more of a

803
00:49:38,600 --> 00:49:40,919
Speaker 1: nice tribute to leave it in than to cut it out.

804
00:49:41,080 --> 00:49:43,640
Speaker 1: So that's why I did not cut out that joke.

805
00:49:44,480 --> 00:49:46,160
Speaker 1: I also wanted to talk about some of the movies

806
00:49:46,840 --> 00:49:49,640
Speaker 1: Industrial Light and Magic has worked on since we published

807
00:49:49,640 --> 00:49:52,239
Speaker 1: that episode, and this is not an exhaustive list, but

808
00:49:52,360 --> 00:49:53,840
Speaker 1: just a few to give you an idea of some

809
00:49:53,880 --> 00:49:57,279
Speaker 1: of the stuff they've worked on. They did effects for

810
00:49:57,360 --> 00:50:01,760
Speaker 1: Star Trek Into Darkness, Pacific Rim, Captain America, The Winter Soldier,

811
00:50:01,840 --> 00:50:04,200
Speaker 1: which is my favorite of the Marvel movie so far,

812
00:50:04,560 --> 00:50:09,839
Speaker 1: Teenage Mutant, Ninja Turtles, Avengers, Age of Ultron, Jurassic World,

813
00:50:10,040 --> 00:50:12,959
Speaker 1: Aunt Man, The Martian, which is great. If you haven't

814
00:50:12,960 --> 00:50:16,920
Speaker 1: seen The Martian or read the book, go do one

815
00:50:17,120 --> 00:50:20,080
Speaker 1: or both of those things. It's a great fun story.

816
00:50:21,120 --> 00:50:24,440
Speaker 1: And Star Wars The Force Awakens. Of course they did

817
00:50:24,480 --> 00:50:27,400
Speaker 1: the effects for that when Star Wars came back. I

818
00:50:27,440 --> 00:50:31,200
Speaker 1: hope you guys enjoyed it. I thought it was okay.

819
00:50:31,920 --> 00:50:34,000
Speaker 1: There are other movies that they're working on right now,

820
00:50:34,040 --> 00:50:36,200
Speaker 1: Captain America Civil War being one of them, the next

821
00:50:36,239 --> 00:50:40,040
Speaker 1: Star Wars movie, the next couple of Star Wars movies another,

822
00:50:40,480 --> 00:50:43,320
Speaker 1: and obviously lots of other stuff. So Industrial Light and

823
00:50:43,360 --> 00:50:48,040
Speaker 1: Magic still going strong under the command of Disney. They've

824
00:50:48,040 --> 00:50:51,760
Speaker 1: even opened up a new studio in Soho in London,

825
00:50:52,040 --> 00:50:55,960
Speaker 1: so that's pretty exciting too. Anyway, thank you for joining

826
00:50:55,960 --> 00:50:58,560
Speaker 1: me on this classic episode of tech stuff. I hope

827
00:50:58,560 --> 00:51:01,480
Speaker 1: you enjoyed this look back, and I'll be back with

828
00:51:01,640 --> 00:51:04,080
Speaker 1: new episodes really soon. If you guys want to get

829
00:51:04,080 --> 00:51:06,720
Speaker 1: in touch with me, give me suggestions for future topics

830
00:51:07,120 --> 00:51:09,560
Speaker 1: or guests I should have on the show, interviews, that

831
00:51:09,640 --> 00:51:12,480
Speaker 1: kind of stuff. Let me know the email addresses tech

832
00:51:12,520 --> 00:51:15,719
Speaker 1: Stuff at how stuff works dot com, or drop me

833
00:51:15,719 --> 00:51:18,960
Speaker 1: a line on Facebook or Twitter. At Facebook and Twitter,

834
00:51:19,160 --> 00:51:21,759
Speaker 1: I am tech Stuff H s W. And I'll talk

835
00:51:21,760 --> 00:51:28,520
Speaker 1: to you again. Really since for more on this and

836
00:51:28,560 --> 00:51:31,080
Speaker 1: thousands of other topics. Is it how stuff works dot

837
00:51:31,160 --> 00:51:41,160
Speaker 1: com