WEBVTT - ICYMI: The Race to Roll Out Solid-State Batteries

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<v Speaker 1>Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News.

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<v Speaker 2>You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and

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<v Speaker 2>Tim Steneveek on Bloomberg Radio. Well, speaking of technology, I

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<v Speaker 2>want to bring in ci Uog. She's founder in CEO

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<v Speaker 2>of Factorial Energy. She's been on our program before. Factorial

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<v Speaker 2>is a company that's working on solid state batteries. It's

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<v Speaker 2>partnered with automotive manufacturers including Mercedes, Benz, Delantis, Hyundai and more.

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<v Speaker 2>She joins us once again from Massachusetts. See you good,

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<v Speaker 2>have you back with us. We're going to get to

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<v Speaker 2>what you're doing at the firm and how these batteries

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<v Speaker 2>are different at Factorial Energy in just a minute. But

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<v Speaker 2>I do want you to weigh in on this evolved

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<v Speaker 2>industrial policy, if we can even call it that, that

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<v Speaker 2>we're seeing from this administration. It comes after the Department

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<v Speaker 2>of Defenses promised four hundred million dollars to MP Materials,

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<v Speaker 2>the supplier of and processor of rare Earth Materials. We

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<v Speaker 2>spoke to Jim Litinski, the CEO of that company. It

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<v Speaker 2>comes after the news this week of AMD and in

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<v Speaker 2>Nvidia sharing some of their Chinese revenue with the US government.

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<v Speaker 2>It comes after the Golden Shared deal for US Steel.

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<v Speaker 2>How do you think about this as the founder of

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<v Speaker 2>a tech firm.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I think the global competition on technology is precedented

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<v Speaker 1>and this is a really good time for technology development,

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<v Speaker 1>but also we have to be aware of the geopolitical

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<v Speaker 1>tensions around it. And as factorial, I think we have

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<v Speaker 1>been later focused on our key customers as you just

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<v Speaker 1>mentioned mer Cities, Slantists, Hyunda, Nikiya, and those are global

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<v Speaker 1>partners for US spent across multiple continents, and of course

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<v Speaker 1>you have a great presence in the US as well.

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<v Speaker 1>For US, I think our focus is not only about

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<v Speaker 1>our diversified global customer portfolio, but also diversified supply chain,

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<v Speaker 1>which is critical here today. And we're excited to hear

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<v Speaker 1>that you actually announced the program yesterday about supporting battery

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<v Speaker 1>related material as well as battery manufacturing as well.

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<v Speaker 2>It's been quite a while since we had you on

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<v Speaker 2>the program. It was before I believe we heard a

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<v Speaker 2>lot about what the Trump administration's plans were for industrial

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<v Speaker 2>policy and the way that the administration is thinking about EVS,

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<v Speaker 2>the way it's thinking about batteries, its relationship and deterioration there.

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<v Speaker 2>So with Elon Musk and it's also before tariffs, and

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<v Speaker 2>I'm wondering from a supply chain perspective, given what goes

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<v Speaker 2>into solid state batteries, how your supply chain has been

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<v Speaker 2>affected by tariff policy.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so I would say there has been a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of discussions about the rare earth metals recently how US

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<v Speaker 1>is securing that. Fortunately, battery doesn't really have Those were

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<v Speaker 1>earth metals and between lithium, cobalt, and nicole those are

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<v Speaker 1>critical for LIMI batteries, but they're actually transition metals, and

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<v Speaker 1>especially for victorial we're not using LLLP, which is also

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<v Speaker 1>a critical material that has been quite constrained from the

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<v Speaker 1>China market, and also we don't use that as well.

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<v Speaker 1>So I think to that extent we have been very

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<v Speaker 1>well protected from the global supply chain constraints, but also

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<v Speaker 1>we also want to be aware of the potential threats

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<v Speaker 1>coming up right now. We actually have been actively working

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<v Speaker 1>on not only just to work with direct suppliers and

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<v Speaker 1>building the supply chain coalition, but also working with recycling partners.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, recently we announced this partnership with a Korean

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<v Speaker 1>conglomerate called some Guilt, and they're one of the largest

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<v Speaker 1>recyclers recyclers in the space, not only for the M batteries,

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<v Speaker 1>but they have done a lot for solide battery as well.

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<v Speaker 3>So I think that's actually.

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<v Speaker 1>Going to be deeply protect us with a closed loop

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<v Speaker 1>supply chain in the future, especially when the company is

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<v Speaker 1>at scale.

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<v Speaker 4>Forgive me, So let's stay batteries. What exactly are they?

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<v Speaker 4>I feel like we so often talk about ev batteries

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<v Speaker 4>and what's going on. We throw terms around, but what

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<v Speaker 4>exactly is a solid state battery? Which is your bread

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<v Speaker 4>and butter?

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<v Speaker 1>Correct, Yes, yes, exactly, Carol, and I would say solid

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<v Speaker 1>sea battery is like a traditional battery, but instead of

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<v Speaker 1>using a liquid electroly like, it is a solid or

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<v Speaker 1>quasi solid stained material, which means you combine a little

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<v Speaker 1>bit of solid and a little bit liquid together, but

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<v Speaker 1>the solid content will stabilize sou dramatically, and this makes

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<v Speaker 1>a battery safer, longer lasting, and more powerful because it

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<v Speaker 1>has dorm more energy and it's less likely to leak

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<v Speaker 1>or catch on fire. And as you know, like the

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<v Speaker 1>biggest market for a battery is on transportation, but actually

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<v Speaker 1>battery is not only limited to transportation.

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<v Speaker 3>It is in the.

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<v Speaker 1>Air, it's on the water, it's in robotics, and it's

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<v Speaker 1>also everywhare of energy storage for homes and businesses. So

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<v Speaker 1>it's fundamentally in infrastructure, technology and product rather than something

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<v Speaker 1>very like narrowly scopting a very specific application.

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<v Speaker 4>And we mentioned that as Tim said earlier, that you

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<v Speaker 4>partnered with automotive manufacturers including Mercedes, Benz, Stilantis, Hyundai. I'm

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<v Speaker 4>just curious, so you guys are working together, is there

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<v Speaker 4>actually products on the market. Give us an idea of

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<v Speaker 4>kind of where you guys are in this process.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, that's a great question.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, we started the collaboration with those companies many

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<v Speaker 1>years ago, and Kilonda and Kia were our first investor

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<v Speaker 1>in the company and Mercedes A. Stalentists led our two

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<v Speaker 1>hundred million around in twenty twenty two, and since then

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<v Speaker 1>the company has gone a long way for product development.

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<v Speaker 3>We launched the first one hundred powered solid.

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<v Speaker 1>State battery with Stalentists in CES under the keynote speech.

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<v Speaker 3>It was very well received.

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<v Speaker 1>Since then, we have shipped thousands of batteries to our

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<v Speaker 1>global partners. As of mid of last year, we launched

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<v Speaker 1>the first B sample to Mercedes, which also marked the

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<v Speaker 1>first B sample shipment to a global automotive globally for

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<v Speaker 1>a solid state battery company, which is quite a breakthrough.

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<v Speaker 1>And with that b sample, we actually were able to

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<v Speaker 1>build the first vehicle together with Mercedes earlier this year

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<v Speaker 1>and has the first vehicle rolling on the street in

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<v Speaker 1>Scude Guard and that also marked the first electric vehicle

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<v Speaker 1>that's been built by a solid state battery. And it's

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<v Speaker 1>not only the first application a debut for a solid

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<v Speaker 1>battery in the vehicle, but it's also in the broader

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<v Speaker 1>immobility sector as well. And what is even more exciting

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<v Speaker 1>is that recently, not only with the automotives, but we

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<v Speaker 1>also a major breakthrough with the first shipment to a

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<v Speaker 1>droll maker in North America. So that's going to be

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<v Speaker 1>a very important near term application for the technology at

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<v Speaker 1>a small scale.

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<v Speaker 4>A couple of quick questions, so go back to and

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<v Speaker 4>I think you talked about this in terms of, you know,

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<v Speaker 4>batteries part of the problems. I mean, evs yay like,

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<v Speaker 4>people like them, but then there's the batteries, right that

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<v Speaker 4>you know, the waste and what happens with batteries because

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<v Speaker 4>you kind of can't do much with them. So I'm

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<v Speaker 4>just curious about what happens with these batteries if they

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<v Speaker 4>after they don't work. What's the kind of I don't

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<v Speaker 4>know recycling abilities or capabilities. Just give us an update

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<v Speaker 4>on that.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, recycling is definitely a very important party close the loop,

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<v Speaker 1>and not only just from the circular economy perspective, but

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<v Speaker 1>it's important for the cost and supply chain resilience in

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<v Speaker 1>the future. And I think in the near term what

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<v Speaker 1>we see is that a lot of the battery recycling

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<v Speaker 1>is coming to two pieces. One is for the scrapping

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<v Speaker 1>of the battery and the vehicle as a whole and

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<v Speaker 1>number party numbers. Two is about using those scrap materials

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<v Speaker 1>to turn that into a black math, and from the

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<v Speaker 1>black math to refine that into the raw materials and

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<v Speaker 1>turning back to the battery again. So that's the recycling

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<v Speaker 1>process that most of the recyclers have been adopting globally,

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<v Speaker 1>and that's why we've been very aggressively working with actually

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<v Speaker 1>two Korean recyclers right now, and both have a strong

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<v Speaker 1>presence in the US, like you and Young Poo. That's

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<v Speaker 1>the one we had actually announced last year in front

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<v Speaker 1>of Sun Gil. What is more important that I think

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<v Speaker 1>we also need more presence in the US for sali

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<v Speaker 1>C battery recycling in the future, which will become a

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<v Speaker 1>mainstream for our any storage and immobility. So yeah, we're

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<v Speaker 1>actually working very closely with one of the US recyclers

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<v Speaker 1>today to increase and enhance our recycling capabilities in the US.

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<v Speaker 2>We're speaking with ci Wong. She's founder and CEO of Factorial.

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<v Speaker 2>She has a PhD in chemistry. But I'm still trying

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<v Speaker 2>to understand what how to build a battery myself. She

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<v Speaker 2>knows how to do it well.

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<v Speaker 4>What's interesting is you sound like you're making progress and

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<v Speaker 4>you talk about the first vehicle with Mercedes and the

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<v Speaker 4>first chipment to I think it was a drill company

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<v Speaker 4>I think in the US. Forgive me if I didn't

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<v Speaker 4>hear it correctly.

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<v Speaker 3>A good company. So that will probably be the first application.

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<v Speaker 1>It's actually not only for commercial but also defense applications

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<v Speaker 1>for batteries.

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<v Speaker 3>So how do you ramp up?

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<v Speaker 4>When do you ramp up? So it sounds like you're

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<v Speaker 4>still kind of finding your way forward. So when when

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<v Speaker 4>is there a mass production point that makes you a

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<v Speaker 4>viable financially viable company going forward.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so we are actually having another fleet coming.

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<v Speaker 3>Up from the first vehicle.

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<v Speaker 1>So as we announced with more cities for the first

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<v Speaker 1>vehicle this year, which we built and delivered already, and

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<v Speaker 1>we're actually announcing with the fleet coming up in twenty

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<v Speaker 1>twenty six with Stalantists. We just announced a major milestone

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<v Speaker 1>that both companies achieved last month to deliver this twenty

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<v Speaker 1>twenty six fleet that's led by Dodge Charger Daytona, and

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<v Speaker 1>it's not only just for Dodge, but it's also spent

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<v Speaker 1>across the still a large platform which including g Chrysler

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<v Speaker 1>of Romeo and the Maserati. And so with the fleeting

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<v Speaker 1>twenty six, we're looking at twenty seven for the first

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<v Speaker 1>commercial deployment and as early as twenty eight or twenty

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<v Speaker 1>nine that we can see the scale coming up for

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<v Speaker 1>this market. But even before that we may say, like

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<v Speaker 1>Jove market and some of the defense applications may come

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<v Speaker 1>even ahead of twenty twenty seven.

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<v Speaker 4>All Right, we're gonna leave it on that note. Listen,

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<v Speaker 4>so good to check in with you, and here are

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<v Speaker 4>some of the progress that you've may look forward to

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<v Speaker 4>hearing more in the future. Si Yongwang she is founder

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<v Speaker 4>in CEO Factorial Energy, joining us from Massachusetts