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Speaker 1: Hey, there are folks. What do Clueless nine O two

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Speaker 1: one ohero.

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Speaker 2: And true crime have in common?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we weren't quite clear either until we got our

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Speaker 1: new best friend in the room with us. Welcome to

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Speaker 1: this episode of Amy and TJ. Yes you hear that

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Speaker 1: cacklin background. That is not Amy Robock. This time we

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Speaker 1: had Robes. This is I say new best friend. I

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Speaker 1: know people use that loosely oftentimes, but we have now

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Speaker 1: had an experience with someone that I think robes. This

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Speaker 1: is you go through things with people sometimes you got

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Speaker 1: that person's gonna be with me for life exactly. So

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Speaker 1: when you go through LA traffic with somebody to the

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Speaker 1: point that you have to get out and walk, you

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Speaker 1: might be bonded for.

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Speaker 3: Life exactly because you have that shared experience, you know it.

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Speaker 3: Alisa Donovan is with us, and we're so excited because

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Speaker 3: we are teaming up with Alisa on our our other podcast.

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Speaker 3: I guess are we are we amassing a podcast network now, yes,

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Speaker 3: that's the goal. But on Amy and TJ Present, we

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Speaker 3: now have Alisa Donovan working with us and she is

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Speaker 3: our true crime partner. Uh, because we are launching together

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Speaker 3: this new series where Alisa is going to be talking with,

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Speaker 3: among many other subjects, but actors who portray some of

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Speaker 3: the worst of the worst, the most evil folks, true crime,

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Speaker 3: and what that's like as an actor to go through

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Speaker 3: and become someone who is hated, who is evil really

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Speaker 3: for lack of a better term, But Alisa, I'm sorry.

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Speaker 3: When I think of you, I don't think of evil.

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Speaker 3: I don't think of true crime.

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Speaker 2: I'm so glad. I'm so happy I heard.

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Speaker 3: That like someone I love to watch. I mean, we're

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Speaker 3: all products of the nineties, and.

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Speaker 1: Well I thought her character one of she was kind

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Speaker 1: of bitchy.

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Speaker 2: Not niceeople, but in such a fun way, like you

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Speaker 2: love to hate your characters. Yes, right, Yeah, how would you.

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Speaker 3: Describe Ginger from nine o two one out? I mean,

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Speaker 3: Ginger was probably some bad things.

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Speaker 4: I don't know if she's capable of necessarily killing anyone,

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Speaker 4: but I think she'd she'd do what she had to

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Speaker 4: do to survive, that's for sure.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, she made sure she took care of herself. A

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Speaker 2: couple of hard seasons, maybe she'd get there.

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Speaker 1: But you know, have you ever thought, I think we

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Speaker 1: were talking to you earlier, you haven't played a real

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Speaker 1: life person right before in terms of a killer type

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Speaker 1: of thing. You think you could do you think that,

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Speaker 1: or like you would have to go to a I

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Speaker 1: think I could.

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Speaker 2: I think yes, I think you know, it's what we

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Speaker 2: were saying.

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Speaker 4: We all have all the parts in us, and I

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Speaker 4: think it's a you know, a mistake to think that

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Speaker 4: we don't. And people get pushed places. And you know,

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Speaker 4: I've played plenty of people that are nothing like who

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Speaker 4: I am, and so you just have to you dive

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Speaker 4: into it, and you find you always have to find

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Speaker 4: the to me, you have to find the humanity. You

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Speaker 4: have to find the the the lightness. And then if

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Speaker 4: you're conversely, if you're playing a really happy, you know,

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Speaker 4: beautiful person, you should look for a little bit of

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Speaker 4: the dark side so that you can make them a

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Speaker 4: full human being, because we are all we are full people,

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Speaker 4: right And people would always say to me, oh, how

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Speaker 4: come you always play these you know or kids, especially

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Speaker 4: like when we were shooting Clueless and doing the series

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Speaker 4: or so bringing the Teenage Witch. I also played the

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Speaker 4: kind of like spice and the soup like not green.

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Speaker 4: All kids would always come up to me and they

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Speaker 4: would almost be they'd come to set and visit and

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Speaker 4: they would almost be disappointed.

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Speaker 2: That I would. I would say we're nice.

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Speaker 4: And they're like, oh, I'm so soly they're just surprised.

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Speaker 4: And I think there's something to it that maybe I

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Speaker 4: can play those people because I am. I feel like

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Speaker 4: I'm a nice person, you are person, and I think

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Speaker 4: it helps. It just helps somehow, like so that the

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Speaker 4: underbelly you're like.

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Speaker 2: I can't hate her that much.

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Speaker 3: Maybe is it fun to play someone I won't say evil,

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Speaker 3: but devious like fun? I would Yeah, it's more fun,

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Speaker 3: definitely to play the spicy for sure or not so

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Speaker 3: nice person versus the you know, the ingenueind to everyone, which.

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Speaker 2: Does not really even exist in the world, right.

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Speaker 4: I mean really, and it's always more fun to play

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Speaker 4: the bad guy girl.

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Speaker 3: What and what do you think it is about human nature?

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Speaker 3: We've experienced this. I think anyone to a certain degree

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Speaker 3: his experience. We all want to put people in a

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Speaker 3: role in real life, not just actors on a stage.

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Speaker 3: We want you're bad, you're good. It's no one likes

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Speaker 3: the gray area.

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Speaker 4: We all want somehow it makes I think it makes

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Speaker 4: us feel in control, and then it makes us feel safe.

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Speaker 4: Do you want to be in control so that you

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Speaker 4: can feel safe or you know, a hierarchical situation where

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Speaker 4: you can feel superior to people or something.

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Speaker 2: I think that's so true, so I didn't mention.

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Speaker 3: By the way, so this news series on Amy and

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Speaker 3: TJ Presents is called Killer Thriller, and I love the name.

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Speaker 2: It's a way why do you think?

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Speaker 3: And we're all in the same group, and I think

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Speaker 3: maybe a lot of people listening, if you are admitting it,

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Speaker 3: we're all kind of into I don't want to say voyeurism,

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Speaker 3: but we're all watching this. We're fascinated. We don't want

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Speaker 3: to be associated with it. Why do you think we

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Speaker 3: all get such a like maybe even a dopamine hit

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Speaker 3: or some sort of a charge from watching these true

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Speaker 3: crime stories, either in real time in court trials or

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Speaker 3: portrayed in some sort of a series.

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Speaker 4: Because we are fascinated by human nature and by the

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Speaker 4: how diverse we are as human beings, and how can

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Speaker 4: someone do such a thing like we we need to

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Speaker 4: try to understand it because it feels so and and

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Speaker 4: to your point, I don't know why it feels so foreign, like, oh,

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Speaker 4: I can't imagine that that would be. But the reality is,

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Speaker 4: these things happen often and humanity is not you know,

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Speaker 4: I had a therapist wants to say to me, well,

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Speaker 4: you know, humanity is not inherently kind, and I was

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Speaker 4: like really, and then I went, well, she's not wrong.

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Speaker 2: She's not wrong, right right at all costs, And I mean,

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Speaker 2: it kind of is.

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Speaker 4: But then that's also sort of you know, what's our

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Speaker 4: this this human experience that we were talking about earlier,

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Speaker 4: you know, what's what? What is our purpose as a

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Speaker 4: human being? And it's I believe it's too. We have

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Speaker 4: to there's some things we have to go through and

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Speaker 4: that we were supposed to work through in this human life.

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Speaker 2: And you know, there's there's.

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Speaker 4: Work to do and that's not and that that to

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Speaker 4: me is sort of very hopeful because that sort of

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Speaker 4: makes me feel like, oh, it's it's a it's almost

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Speaker 4: an even playing field, right because you look at it

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Speaker 4: like what you have to go through is what you

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Speaker 4: have to you have to go.

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Speaker 2: Through, is that you do what I do.

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Speaker 4: Sometimes it'll cross, sometimes it won't, but then I can't

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Speaker 4: really I can't judge you for what your choices are

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Speaker 4: or I can't, but you know, of course we do.

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Speaker 2: We do.

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Speaker 1: We talk about this a lot. That that's so much.

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Speaker 1: And doctor Gardier, right, it talked about people are projecting,

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Speaker 1: like people watch these things that go okay, at least

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Speaker 1: I'm not that bad at my life, not that facked up.

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Speaker 2: And like, I feel pretty good about my life.

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Speaker 1: How that do you think feeds into this fascination because

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Speaker 1: so much of it I think partly partly, how much apart.

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Speaker 4: I will say this is a little dark, but it's

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Speaker 4: not too dark because my mom is alive. But my

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Speaker 4: mom was having surgery for cancer. She said cancer twice.

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Speaker 2: I was.

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Speaker 4: I stayed overnight in the night of the surgery in

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Speaker 4: North Carolina. I During that time, I was reading The Goldfinch.

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Speaker 2: Do you remember this? Yes, this is a dark book.

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Speaker 2: This is not a happy book. No, right, it's not.

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Speaker 4: And I was like, at least I am not living Goldfinch.

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Speaker 2: We all do that. Though.

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Speaker 4: In the hallway, I've got like my little portable wine

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Speaker 4: leaving her room, like I'm just gonna drink wine in

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Speaker 4: a stairwell for a minute, come back into the room

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Speaker 4: and like deal. But I was like, you know what,

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Speaker 4: I have a lovely family. I have a mom who

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Speaker 4: loves me.

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Speaker 2: She is ill.

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Speaker 4: People get ill like this happens, you know what I mean.

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Speaker 4: It was sort of like an equalizer. So yeah, I

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Speaker 4: do think that's part of it is.

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Speaker 2: It's so funny.

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Speaker 3: Because you mentioned cancer when I was going through my

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Speaker 3: own cancer. I remember the lightest moment, one of the

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Speaker 3: happiest rays of just relief I had. I came back

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Speaker 3: from the hospital and my brother, who loves horror movies

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Speaker 3: like I do, surprise me.

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Speaker 2: And what did we do.

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Speaker 3: We sat down and we watched it was streaming for

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Speaker 3: the first time, the Conjuring, and it was such a

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Speaker 3: relief for me. I was like, this is so at

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Speaker 3: least I'm not being at least I don't.

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Speaker 5: I'm not.

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Speaker 2: I'm not. I don't have a demon inside right, Like.

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Speaker 3: I don't know.

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Speaker 5: It was funny almost it is almost a different escape

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Speaker 5: like people would say, oh, romantic comedy is it's escapism,

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Speaker 5: which it is to a degree, But then sometimes that

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Speaker 5: could be really depressing, yeah, because.

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Speaker 2: You're like, God, I didn't it didn't work out that

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Speaker 2: way for I don't feel like nothing right now.

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Speaker 3: But if I'm watching you now, who is yeah being

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Speaker 3: terrorized by some evil entity?

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Speaker 2: I feel like at least I'm.

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Speaker 3: At a better place, right Yes, and I can actually

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Speaker 3: feel sorry for you and not think.

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Speaker 2: About how sad my situation is. In a way, it's

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Speaker 2: like deflecting.

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Speaker 3: No.

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Speaker 2: Now I'm saying back in the day, back in the day, no.

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Speaker 2: But it is funny.

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Speaker 3: Horror movies have been a source of comfort in a

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Speaker 3: lot of ways. I know that sounds silly maybe to

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Speaker 3: a lot of folks, but that is just the truth

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Speaker 3: knows it.

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Speaker 2: And true crime.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it is one of those interesting things. And I

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Speaker 3: do think as an actor that would be one of

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Speaker 3: the really fascinating fun roles to play because hopefully it's

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Speaker 3: a departure.

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Speaker 2: Hopefully you're not drawing on life experiences.

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Speaker 4: Actors have different processes, right, so some people you can't.

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Speaker 4: They go deep method and they don't want to there

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Speaker 4: that person all the time. I you know, that would

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Speaker 4: seem to be dicey if you're playing someone like uh

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Speaker 4: Ed Gain. You know that you got John John Gay,

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Speaker 4: you know. So I'm curious about all of that too.

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Speaker 1: Do you have somebody you want to play?

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Speaker 5: Do you?

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Speaker 2: That's such a good question. Figure Yes, Rita Hayworth. Who

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Speaker 2: Rita hayw She was.

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Speaker 4: Half Spanish, so she would really be right for me

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Speaker 4: to play Rita Hayworth.

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Speaker 2: Just just an old school.

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Speaker 4: Yes, Hollywood dancer, an actress. She is an incredible story

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Speaker 4: but she is half Spanish, so it probably wouldn't really

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Speaker 4: be right, It wouldn't work.

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Speaker 1: Who else I think about historical character, like.

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Speaker 2: Like like Loz Bordon didn't murder anybody?

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Speaker 3: You know, we want to know what evil person you

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Speaker 3: would like to play?

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Speaker 1: Evil person woman if even if it was a snap

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Speaker 1: episod o you saw what have you seen? That was

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Speaker 1: that ship nuts that did something crazy that you would like, Wow,

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Speaker 1: I would love.

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Speaker 2: To go I love a go at that. I mean,

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Speaker 2: Aileen Werenos was pretty crazy. Who's last?

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Speaker 4: I mean it's sort of already been done because Charlie's

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Speaker 4: wanted to ask her for it.

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Speaker 2: Oh, yes, Lizzie Borden, Lizzie Bordon. That was a good one.

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Speaker 1: Yes, I mean what historic like women female is.

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Speaker 2: Here's the thing. Aren't too many? Are There aren't many?

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Speaker 2: You know what I was thinking? Like Salem witch trials,

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Speaker 2: but those weren't.

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Speaker 3: Those were just poor women who were being demail those women,

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Speaker 3: whatever reason they were. But there aren't that many female

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Speaker 3: serials there just aren't.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there aren't. It's predominantly men. I can't.

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Speaker 3: I was just trying to think of another like there's

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Speaker 3: black widow as he kind of women.

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Speaker 1: There was the woman in Flora that was a serial

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Speaker 1: killer and she right, we know these.

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Speaker 2: Nurses, nurses.

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Speaker 3: Has been.

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Speaker 2: Nothing against nurses.

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Speaker 3: But if you do watch Snapped or any of these

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Speaker 3: other real life drop like crime story, the women who

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Speaker 3: are murderers do tend to be like they're highly intelligent. Yes,

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Speaker 3: but they have access and they have medical knowledge which

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Speaker 3: allows them to almost get away with it.

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Speaker 1: However, or they have gambling problems for.

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Speaker 2: Credit card, they have credit card. Women.

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Speaker 1: Women don't kill from what we've seen. Why do women

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Speaker 1: kill you? All crimes of passion or debt or debt?

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Speaker 1: It seems that you're saying.

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Speaker 3: Why is it money and independence? It's money and independence.

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Speaker 3: They want to be free and free of whom ever,

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Speaker 3: and they will do what they need to do to

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Speaker 3: have their independence.

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Speaker 6: It's usually planned, right, overcome, methodical and very scary. We

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Speaker 6: have to be we have to be smarter, scared.

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Speaker 3: We don't want the physical dominance, so yes, we have

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Speaker 3: to use our brains.

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Speaker 2: That is what ends up happening.

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Speaker 1: Can we do it?

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Speaker 2: Also? We smile honestly do you love to watch the

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Speaker 2: ones where the women are the killers?

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Speaker 3: And that always makes me nervos because I'm always thinking,

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Speaker 3: do you sleep with one eye open?

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Speaker 2: Are you worried about me? Do you get this in

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Speaker 2: your head?

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Speaker 3: We were thinking if I piss Amy off enough, will

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Speaker 3: she head in this direction?

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Speaker 2: Way?

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Speaker 1: What always happened? You're usually asleep before I am, and

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Speaker 1: I am away.

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Speaker 2: Wake before reason why you're no dummy?

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Speaker 1: I am rarely.

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Speaker 2: Though, so you're lucky.

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Speaker 3: I do have a brother who's a doctor, so I

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Speaker 3: could have access to some sort of information, but I

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Speaker 3: needed to ask him for a friend about something. But yes,

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Speaker 3: you can rest assured. I know nothing and I hate needles.

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Speaker 1: Will you at least will you come home with us anytime?

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Speaker 2: You will any time? I Am not kidding.

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Speaker 4: I like what a happy I say happy accident that's

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Speaker 4: not the right word, but well the accident was being

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Speaker 4: in the car. Yes, but uh like I'm I am

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Speaker 4: thrilled too that I've connected so well with the two

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Speaker 4: of you, because.

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Speaker 3: You know, you never know, you never know, But I

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Speaker 3: do think we share the true crime. I do find

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Speaker 3: that when I meet somebody, and DJ and I had

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Speaker 3: this experience when I meet somebody who also shares my

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Speaker 3: passion for either horror movies or true crime.

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Speaker 2: It's like, we're going to get along. We're going to

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Speaker 2: get along. We have a similar.

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Speaker 3: Mindset and a similar way of looking at the world.

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Speaker 3: That just ends up making conversation easy and fun. I'm

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Speaker 3: curious if what you how you feel you're an actress,

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Speaker 3: you have had an amazing career, how you feel about podcasting,

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Speaker 3: like it's a.

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Speaker 4: Whole other is so we were I've obviously spoken with

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Speaker 4: the two of you about this, and a couple of

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Speaker 4: other people like Danielle Fischel, Will Friedel and like about

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Speaker 4: how and because I notice what it is that makes

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Speaker 4: things successful and it sounds simple, but I know it's not.

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Speaker 4: It's that you really have to have one. You have

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Speaker 4: to like to talk to people. You have to actually

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Speaker 4: be interested in having a conversation like in exchange as

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Speaker 4: opposed to a you ask a question and I answer it.

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Speaker 4: You know, it actually is a is a discussion, right

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Speaker 4: and so, and then it has to be authentic. But

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Speaker 4: then you also have to, like, you know, get stuff done.

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Speaker 4: You got to like answer some questions, like you got

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Speaker 4: to get somewhere. But like those other two pieces are

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Speaker 4: the key pieces, I think, and I love it so

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Speaker 4: much because I love I am genuinely curious about humanity

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Speaker 4: and people, and I love connecting with people in an

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Speaker 4: authentic way. So we don't always, you know, as an actor,

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Speaker 4: you don't always get to do that. It's it's a

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Speaker 4: totally which sounds maybe that sounds odd, but it's true,

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Speaker 4: you know, depending on what the circumstances are. Sometimes it's

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Speaker 4: things are going very fast, you've got a time issue,

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Speaker 4: there's a lot of things, you know, like you just

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Speaker 4: it's it's a different experience. So this is like, it

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Speaker 4: excites me, It interests me because you don't quite.

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Speaker 7: Know where you're going to go, you know, but you're

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Speaker 7: leading the way. But you are the one who is

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Speaker 7: asking the questions. You are producing basically your own show.

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Speaker 7: So this is very exciting. We're so excited to.

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Speaker 2: Have you on board, super excited.

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Speaker 4: I'm so excited to see where it goes and to

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Speaker 4: be you know, that thing of actually getting to know

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Speaker 4: someone and being there is some spontaneity to it, like

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Speaker 4: that you have to do the prep and know what

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Speaker 4: you're talking about and who you're speaking to, but everybody

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Speaker 4: is going to be different and that that excites me.

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Speaker 1: Well, folks, look forward every week we'll have new, fresh

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Speaker 1: updates from Elisa Donovan on Amy and TJ Presents on

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Speaker 1: that feed. We will absolutely be calling on you. This

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Speaker 1: wasn't a part of the plan and the deal, but

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Speaker 1: I hope we can call on you to come chat

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Speaker 1: with us whatever.

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Speaker 4: I am all in, I would love it anytime. Maybe

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Speaker 4: we should start another podcast in the car like the

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Speaker 4: tax you want, you know, just like in the car,

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Speaker 4: bring people in the car chat how you get out.

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Speaker 3: Parents of daughters, parents of daughters, because we had a.

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Speaker 2: Lot of conversations about parents daughter. It's the best, it's

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Speaker 2: the best. It's a lot, it's.

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Speaker 1: At least it's an absolute pleasure. We're just getting started.

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Speaker 1: But we can't say enough. Genuinely. We wouldn't. We don't

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Speaker 1: have to. Look, we were used to bullshit and we

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Speaker 1: can we can just take it here we have to,

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Speaker 1: but this is not one of those cases. It is

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Speaker 1: genuinely treat and a pleasure and an honor to be

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Speaker 1: able to spend the time we've had and we've only

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Speaker 1: had about two hours with you. Now we're looking forward

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Speaker 1: to and thank you for being willing to come on

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Speaker 1: board and work with us. So thank you, thank you,

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Speaker 1: thank you, and folk. I am thrilled, killer, thriller, thrill, it's.

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Speaker 2: Killer, thriller.

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Speaker 3: I can see how that Amy and presents kill her

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Speaker 3: thriller with Alisa.

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Speaker 1: Thriller, killer doesn't make sense. Killer thriller, thriller, killer, I'm thriller.

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Speaker 1: I'm in a Michael Jackson movie. That's not right.

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Speaker 2: Don't get out of people's heads. Thriller, killer, No, it's killer, thriller, thriller. No,

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Speaker 2: it's killer. You will do this song, you'll do the

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Speaker 2: song you do.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, he's a donovant.

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Speaker 5: Everybody.

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Speaker 1: We love you. Think you think you. Thank you, folks,

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Speaker 1: We appreciate you as always spending some time with us.

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Speaker 1: For my dear lovely Amy Robot, I'm t J. Holmes.

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Speaker 1: We will talk to y'all soon