1 00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:16,000 Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace. Beautiful glossy hair, high heels, 2 00:00:16,560 --> 00:00:22,520 Speaker 1: cashmere outfit. What does that say to me? Gillaine Maxwell's 3 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:36,480 Speaker 1: trial has commenced crime stories with Nancy Grace. Let's think 4 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:40,800 Speaker 1: that through for a moment. Glossy hair, ladies out there, 5 00:00:41,000 --> 00:00:43,160 Speaker 1: you know what that means. You have one of those 6 00:00:43,200 --> 00:00:45,960 Speaker 1: treatments that makes your hair shine like it did when 7 00:00:46,000 --> 00:00:48,760 Speaker 1: you were a little girl, or you have what is 8 00:00:48,800 --> 00:00:53,280 Speaker 1: that Jackie has some kind of glycerins? What keratin? She says, 9 00:00:53,320 --> 00:00:57,280 Speaker 1: kraton spray on your hair, some kind of treatment. Okay, 10 00:00:57,760 --> 00:01:02,560 Speaker 1: that gets you ready for trial? High heels, gotta have heels, right, 11 00:01:02,760 --> 00:01:07,280 Speaker 1: gotta have on a very expensive cashmere outfit. This kind 12 00:01:07,319 --> 00:01:11,880 Speaker 1: of reminds me of, in a much lesser extent, to 13 00:01:12,480 --> 00:01:18,960 Speaker 1: cult mom Laurie Valo, who made lip gloss and blush 14 00:01:19,000 --> 00:01:23,399 Speaker 1: and for a court appearance and had her hair and 15 00:01:23,560 --> 00:01:29,840 Speaker 1: mermaid waves down her shoulders and had on bright blue 16 00:01:30,080 --> 00:01:33,560 Speaker 1: I think it was a blue toenail and fingernail polish 17 00:01:33,640 --> 00:01:38,919 Speaker 1: for court. And I remember Jodi Arius, who could forget 18 00:01:38,959 --> 00:01:42,759 Speaker 1: her she murdered her lover, Travis Alexander. I was more 19 00:01:42,760 --> 00:01:45,520 Speaker 1: worried about the twenty nine stabs and the cap to 20 00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:49,160 Speaker 1: the head. She was more worried about applying powder and 21 00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:52,080 Speaker 1: makeup for cameras. She also shot a bird at me 22 00:01:52,120 --> 00:01:54,800 Speaker 1: in the courtroom. Let's don't forget about that. That said, 23 00:01:55,480 --> 00:01:59,040 Speaker 1: I guess Elaine Maxwell is ready for battle with her 24 00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:04,600 Speaker 1: glossy hair, heels, Kashmier outfit, giggling, laughing and hugs with 25 00:02:04,720 --> 00:02:09,720 Speaker 1: her lawyers. But what's really going on in the Galaene 26 00:02:09,720 --> 00:02:12,919 Speaker 1: Maxwell trial. I want you to think back to when 27 00:02:12,960 --> 00:02:18,040 Speaker 1: you were thirteen, fourteen years old. I knew nothing. When 28 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:20,400 Speaker 1: somebody first told me about a period, I thought they 29 00:02:20,400 --> 00:02:22,679 Speaker 1: were making it up. I'm like, that can't be real. 30 00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:30,600 Speaker 1: I knew absolutely nothing. These girls were sex trafficked, according 31 00:02:30,639 --> 00:02:37,040 Speaker 1: to them, so a billionaire pedophile could have sex with 32 00:02:37,160 --> 00:02:43,600 Speaker 1: them as they were giving him massages. Let that sink 33 00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:49,200 Speaker 1: in fourteen fourteen years old. To top it all off, 34 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:54,440 Speaker 1: some of these girls, well all of them were underprivileged. 35 00:02:54,919 --> 00:02:57,240 Speaker 1: And I don't necessarily mean they didn't have enough to 36 00:02:57,280 --> 00:03:00,280 Speaker 1: eat or they didn't have a home. They were latch 37 00:03:00,360 --> 00:03:05,440 Speaker 1: key kids like I was. Many single parents had single 38 00:03:05,480 --> 00:03:09,680 Speaker 1: parents that worked during the day to support them. That 39 00:03:09,880 --> 00:03:14,000 Speaker 1: didn't know that instead of being at home after school 40 00:03:14,160 --> 00:03:22,720 Speaker 1: they were at Jeffrey Epstein's mansion getting raped. That's who 41 00:03:22,760 --> 00:03:27,519 Speaker 1: we're talking about. Just let that soak in for a moment. 42 00:03:28,120 --> 00:03:34,320 Speaker 1: And according to witnesses, Guillaine Maxwell, the millionaire socialite from 43 00:03:34,360 --> 00:03:38,560 Speaker 1: Great Britain with the beautiful accent, was the ring leader, 44 00:03:39,120 --> 00:03:43,720 Speaker 1: the one that organized it all at Jeffrey Epstein. That 45 00:03:43,920 --> 00:03:45,800 Speaker 1: is what this is about. It is not about the 46 00:03:45,800 --> 00:03:49,720 Speaker 1: glossy hair and the high heels and the cashmere outfit 47 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:54,000 Speaker 1: which you know, setting her back a thousand bucks. That's 48 00:03:54,000 --> 00:03:58,040 Speaker 1: what this is about. Let's just don't forget that again. 49 00:03:58,080 --> 00:04:00,480 Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us. You know, at times 50 00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:07,280 Speaker 1: in court it ain't pretty. It's upsetting, and you don't 51 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:10,400 Speaker 1: want to think about it in your spare time. But 52 00:04:10,480 --> 00:04:14,720 Speaker 1: it is our duty to think about it and to 53 00:04:14,840 --> 00:04:22,200 Speaker 1: wrestle with the facts until we know the truth. I 54 00:04:22,279 --> 00:04:24,800 Speaker 1: want to go straight to Charlie Links to joining me. 55 00:04:25,520 --> 00:04:30,640 Speaker 1: She is the feemale editor for Dailymail dot Com. She's 56 00:04:30,680 --> 00:04:34,960 Speaker 1: been on the story from the very beginning. She has 57 00:04:35,000 --> 00:04:40,200 Speaker 1: been with me throughout our Guilene Maxwell special investigations, which 58 00:04:40,200 --> 00:04:45,320 Speaker 1: you can find at Fox Nation. Charlie, tell me what's 59 00:04:45,360 --> 00:04:48,160 Speaker 1: happening in court first, I want to get to Gilene 60 00:04:48,200 --> 00:04:54,840 Speaker 1: Maxwell and her appearance that she is so carefully orchestrated 61 00:04:55,240 --> 00:04:58,719 Speaker 1: in the courtroom. Tell me, well, it's very interesting to 62 00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:02,480 Speaker 1: me because in the lead up to her trial, Gelayne 63 00:05:02,600 --> 00:05:06,320 Speaker 1: was complaining that she was being assaulted and abused in jail. 64 00:05:06,880 --> 00:05:09,640 Speaker 1: She shared an image of herself with a bruise on 65 00:05:09,680 --> 00:05:12,000 Speaker 1: her face that she said she had been subjected to 66 00:05:12,160 --> 00:05:15,640 Speaker 1: while in prison. So it's very strange to me that 67 00:05:15,680 --> 00:05:18,880 Speaker 1: she would kind of put out this story about the 68 00:05:18,920 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 1: abuse that she was suffering in prison, but then turn 69 00:05:22,040 --> 00:05:26,280 Speaker 1: up to the court looking like a glossy heiress. Additionally, 70 00:05:26,480 --> 00:05:30,600 Speaker 1: her defense lawyers urged the jurors not to see her 71 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:33,440 Speaker 1: wealth and her privilege as a crime. They said that 72 00:05:33,480 --> 00:05:36,680 Speaker 1: the jurors needed to put her privileged background out of 73 00:05:36,720 --> 00:05:39,200 Speaker 1: their minds. So for Gilaine to turn up with the 74 00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:42,560 Speaker 1: glossy hair, the high heels, the cashmere is a very 75 00:05:42,600 --> 00:05:45,719 Speaker 1: strange tactic to me, because surely the only thing that 76 00:05:45,760 --> 00:05:48,000 Speaker 1: the jurors are going to be thinking of is here's 77 00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:51,880 Speaker 1: this incredibly wealthy, put together lady who absolutely does not 78 00:05:51,960 --> 00:05:56,440 Speaker 1: look like someone who's being abused in prison. Charlie Langston, 79 00:05:56,680 --> 00:05:58,760 Speaker 1: you know how I respect everything that you say, and 80 00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:01,480 Speaker 1: I think a lot of you and daily mil of course, 81 00:06:01,880 --> 00:06:04,120 Speaker 1: So please don't take this the wrong way. Could you 82 00:06:04,160 --> 00:06:10,120 Speaker 1: just say Kashmir again, Kashmir cash when you say it 83 00:06:10,160 --> 00:06:14,560 Speaker 1: sounds even better than it really is. My daughter asked 84 00:06:14,600 --> 00:06:16,520 Speaker 1: me the other day, Mom, what's Kashmi. I'm like, don't 85 00:06:16,520 --> 00:06:19,280 Speaker 1: think about it. It costing, I just don't think about 86 00:06:19,400 --> 00:06:21,600 Speaker 1: enjoy your card and sweater and say no more. But 87 00:06:22,279 --> 00:06:25,400 Speaker 1: that's the thing, you know, I would think that if 88 00:06:25,800 --> 00:06:29,279 Speaker 1: one of her defense tactics is to try and stop 89 00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:32,719 Speaker 1: the jury from thinking of her as this privileged, wealthy woman, 90 00:06:33,320 --> 00:06:36,320 Speaker 1: they would have thought a little bit more clearly about 91 00:06:36,360 --> 00:06:38,719 Speaker 1: the image that she's going to put across in court. 92 00:06:38,960 --> 00:06:41,640 Speaker 1: But what this says to me is that she couldn't 93 00:06:41,680 --> 00:06:45,359 Speaker 1: wait to get rid of her prison outfit and put 94 00:06:45,400 --> 00:06:48,440 Speaker 1: on the wealthy clothes that she's so used to wearing. 95 00:06:48,880 --> 00:06:50,720 Speaker 1: You know, I was thinking about it in a completely 96 00:06:50,760 --> 00:06:56,960 Speaker 1: different way, Charlie Langston, and what you're saying entirely makes sense. 97 00:06:57,000 --> 00:07:01,640 Speaker 1: I was thinking about how people are many people are 98 00:07:01,680 --> 00:07:05,240 Speaker 1: obsessed with their looks when they should be focused on 99 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:09,280 Speaker 1: something very very different. But you're making me see this 100 00:07:09,320 --> 00:07:12,280 Speaker 1: in a different way, and I think we're both correct 101 00:07:13,320 --> 00:07:17,120 Speaker 1: that this is the wrong image and compared to what 102 00:07:17,200 --> 00:07:19,640 Speaker 1: she claims she was going through in court, I find 103 00:07:19,720 --> 00:07:24,960 Speaker 1: that to be impossible because it's not showing at all 104 00:07:25,360 --> 00:07:28,280 Speaker 1: a shower and a hairdo. It's not going to fix 105 00:07:29,520 --> 00:07:33,960 Speaker 1: months and months of deprivation, which tells me months and 106 00:07:34,000 --> 00:07:37,559 Speaker 1: months of deprivation did not happen, and that was all 107 00:07:37,600 --> 00:07:41,240 Speaker 1: a lie to get out of jail, so she could 108 00:07:41,240 --> 00:07:46,120 Speaker 1: probably abscond. Guys, take a listen to our friend Martha 109 00:07:46,280 --> 00:07:51,080 Speaker 1: Kellner at Sky News. Our cut eight from dawn break 110 00:07:51,160 --> 00:07:53,840 Speaker 1: in New York. The queue two enter the Good Martial 111 00:07:53,920 --> 00:07:57,800 Speaker 1: Court House kept growing. There's only one case. They're interested 112 00:07:57,840 --> 00:08:02,320 Speaker 1: in the trial of Gillwell. To secure a seat inside, 113 00:08:02,360 --> 00:08:06,160 Speaker 1: they waited ours, the alleged victims of Jeffrey Epstein have 114 00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:09,600 Speaker 1: waited far longer than that. Mom, How are you feeling so? 115 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:13,080 Speaker 1: Sarah Ransom says she never thought this day would come. 116 00:08:13,480 --> 00:08:16,320 Speaker 1: She claims Glenn Maxwell was the nuts and bolts of 117 00:08:16,360 --> 00:08:20,240 Speaker 1: a sex trafficking operation. It's here in New York where 118 00:08:20,280 --> 00:08:24,000 Speaker 1: Maxwell used her friendship with Prince Andrew to access America's 119 00:08:24,080 --> 00:08:28,400 Speaker 1: high society. It's here where her relationship with billionaire Epstein 120 00:08:28,480 --> 00:08:33,120 Speaker 1: began and it's here where she will face her alleged victims. Wow, 121 00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:35,959 Speaker 1: that really put it in a nutshell, so big, thank 122 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:39,160 Speaker 1: you in Martha Kellner at Sky. But now take a 123 00:08:39,240 --> 00:08:43,319 Speaker 1: listen to ark at seven. This is Valerie Castro at CNBC. 124 00:08:44,160 --> 00:08:46,760 Speaker 1: Glenn Maxwell was present in the courtroom and walked in 125 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:50,160 Speaker 1: without handcuffs, but was escorted by two marshals. Also in 126 00:08:50,160 --> 00:08:53,000 Speaker 1: the courtroom her sister Isabel, who came to show her support, 127 00:08:53,280 --> 00:08:56,599 Speaker 1: quickly making her way into the courthouse and ignoring any questions. 128 00:08:56,920 --> 00:08:59,760 Speaker 1: A woman named Sarah Ransom also arrived this morning for 129 00:08:59,800 --> 00:09:01,840 Speaker 1: the trial. She claims to be one of Epstein and 130 00:09:01,880 --> 00:09:05,319 Speaker 1: Maxwell's victims and is set to release a memoir entitled 131 00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:08,680 Speaker 1: Silence No More Surviving My Journey to Hell and Back. 132 00:09:09,440 --> 00:09:13,000 Speaker 1: She is not expected to testify. The first witness to 133 00:09:13,000 --> 00:09:16,240 Speaker 1: take the stand this afternoon was a pilot who testified 134 00:09:16,280 --> 00:09:18,960 Speaker 1: he was hired by Jeffrey Epstein to fly private planes. 135 00:09:19,320 --> 00:09:23,079 Speaker 1: His testimony is expected to continue tomorrow. This trial is 136 00:09:23,120 --> 00:09:26,200 Speaker 1: expected to last about six weeks, and it's still unclear 137 00:09:26,280 --> 00:09:29,240 Speaker 1: if Gallaine herself will take the stand in her own defense. 138 00:09:29,559 --> 00:09:31,880 Speaker 1: She has pleaded not guilty to all of the charges 139 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:34,560 Speaker 1: in this case, but she does face life in prison 140 00:09:34,640 --> 00:09:54,280 Speaker 1: if convicted. Crime stories with Nancy Grace, well, so many 141 00:09:54,400 --> 00:09:57,040 Speaker 1: issues are scrolling right now that as a trial lawyer, 142 00:09:57,080 --> 00:09:59,720 Speaker 1: I'm just ticking off in my head. Number one, what 143 00:10:00,040 --> 00:10:02,920 Speaker 1: Charlie Linkston brought up and we all knew earlier. Let 144 00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:07,480 Speaker 1: me jog your memory. As part of the Girard questionnaires, girars, yes, 145 00:10:07,600 --> 00:10:10,880 Speaker 1: fill out questionnaires in certain jurisdictions before they get to 146 00:10:10,920 --> 00:10:14,959 Speaker 1: the big panel, the panel of sixty to one hundred people. 147 00:10:15,280 --> 00:10:18,840 Speaker 1: From that is called down to twelve plus usually six alternates. 148 00:10:19,679 --> 00:10:21,840 Speaker 1: Would you hold it against they defendant if they have 149 00:10:21,880 --> 00:10:24,760 Speaker 1: an extravagant wealthy lifestyle. I don't know that I would 150 00:10:24,760 --> 00:10:28,320 Speaker 1: have asked that question, but they did, and now that's 151 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:33,120 Speaker 1: in the girar's minds that she's walking around without handcuffs. 152 00:10:33,520 --> 00:10:37,520 Speaker 1: What that means is that, as our Constitution has been 153 00:10:37,559 --> 00:10:41,920 Speaker 1: interpreted by case law, a defendant is to be kept 154 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:48,280 Speaker 1: from being seen by a jury in jailhouse clothes or shackled. 155 00:10:48,800 --> 00:10:50,400 Speaker 1: What did that mean to me? A lot of times 156 00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:52,240 Speaker 1: I would have defendants jump up on the morning and 157 00:10:52,360 --> 00:10:54,400 Speaker 1: trial and go, I don't have any clothes. I would 158 00:10:54,480 --> 00:10:58,240 Speaker 1: keep clothes in my office hanging there for a man 159 00:10:58,360 --> 00:11:01,199 Speaker 1: and a woman defendant in case they didn't have clothes, 160 00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:02,880 Speaker 1: and I just don't bring him down to the courtroom 161 00:11:03,080 --> 00:11:05,040 Speaker 1: and say, may not fit that great, but put it on. 162 00:11:05,080 --> 00:11:08,680 Speaker 1: We're going to trial. Also, will she or will she 163 00:11:08,840 --> 00:11:12,240 Speaker 1: not take the stand? Defendants always talk a big game 164 00:11:12,320 --> 00:11:14,560 Speaker 1: before the trial starts it they're going to take the stand. 165 00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:17,920 Speaker 1: Very rarely do they actually do it. With me and 166 00:11:18,160 --> 00:11:21,320 Speaker 1: All Star Panel. In addition to Charlie Langston from Dailymail 167 00:11:21,360 --> 00:11:25,280 Speaker 1: dot com, Jessica Pride is with a sex assault attorney 168 00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:28,120 Speaker 1: with the Pride Law Firm. You can find her at 169 00:11:28,200 --> 00:11:33,600 Speaker 1: Victim Lawyer dot com. Doctor Teresa Gill, PhD, Professors psychology 170 00:11:33,600 --> 00:11:38,360 Speaker 1: and psychotherapist, twenty five years working with abuse and trauma 171 00:11:38,480 --> 00:11:42,680 Speaker 1: victims and author of Women Who Were Sex Abused as Children, 172 00:11:43,000 --> 00:11:48,640 Speaker 1: Mothering Resilience, Protecting the Next Generation. Joseph Scott Morgan, Professor Forensics, 173 00:11:48,679 --> 00:11:52,439 Speaker 1: Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on 174 00:11:52,520 --> 00:11:56,160 Speaker 1: Amazon and host of another brand new hit series on 175 00:11:56,320 --> 00:12:00,719 Speaker 1: iHeart Body Bags with Joe Scott Morgan. I want to 176 00:12:00,760 --> 00:12:03,280 Speaker 1: go to you, Jessica Pride, on the issues that we're 177 00:12:03,360 --> 00:12:08,840 Speaker 1: just bringing up her being escorted around the courthouse with guards, 178 00:12:09,000 --> 00:12:14,040 Speaker 1: but with no shackles, with no jailhouse outfit. What she 179 00:12:14,240 --> 00:12:18,040 Speaker 1: chose to wear. It's not a fashion question. It's an 180 00:12:18,080 --> 00:12:22,680 Speaker 1: impression that's being made on this jury. They are seeing 181 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:24,400 Speaker 1: her for the first time. They saw her during for 182 00:12:24,480 --> 00:12:29,520 Speaker 1: a dire jury selection, which coincidentally is French for to 183 00:12:29,559 --> 00:12:33,800 Speaker 1: speak the truth. Now they're seeing her in court, and 184 00:12:33,920 --> 00:12:37,280 Speaker 1: this is the impression that she is making on them. 185 00:12:37,440 --> 00:12:41,839 Speaker 1: What about it, Jessica Pride, Well, it's interesting, irrespected what 186 00:12:41,840 --> 00:12:45,080 Speaker 1: we think about her guilt. We have to remember that 187 00:12:45,400 --> 00:12:49,000 Speaker 1: our judicial system is built on the principle of innocent 188 00:12:49,080 --> 00:12:52,600 Speaker 1: until proven guilty, and so that's the reason why she's 189 00:12:52,640 --> 00:12:56,800 Speaker 1: not walking around with handcuffs. They have to allow her 190 00:12:56,960 --> 00:13:00,120 Speaker 1: her opportunity, and in in dating court, the prosecutor house through 191 00:13:00,200 --> 00:13:03,280 Speaker 1: beyond a reasonable doubt that she's guilty, and so until 192 00:13:03,360 --> 00:13:06,400 Speaker 1: then she gets to be in the courtroom without handcuffs. 193 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:08,960 Speaker 1: We hope at the end she'll be leaving in handcuffs, 194 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:12,160 Speaker 1: but until then her wrists are clean. Sort of any 195 00:13:12,640 --> 00:13:16,160 Speaker 1: Bengals or fancy outfit she feels she wants to wear. 196 00:13:16,720 --> 00:13:19,640 Speaker 1: I don't think it was a smart decision. For her 197 00:13:19,760 --> 00:13:23,880 Speaker 1: counsel to put her in lavish clothing because I agree 198 00:13:23,920 --> 00:13:26,400 Speaker 1: with what you were talking about earlier. It goes against 199 00:13:26,400 --> 00:13:29,840 Speaker 1: this whole We should feel sorry for her. She's the 200 00:13:29,960 --> 00:13:33,000 Speaker 1: victim in this because the truth of what they're trying 201 00:13:33,040 --> 00:13:37,000 Speaker 1: to paint is that she's a scapegoat. She's not really 202 00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:41,520 Speaker 1: the perpetrator here with all Epstein, and everyone's just trying 203 00:13:41,520 --> 00:13:46,160 Speaker 1: to pin it on her because Epstein's dead. And I 204 00:13:46,200 --> 00:13:50,920 Speaker 1: don't think putting her out and fancy stuff takes away 205 00:13:50,920 --> 00:13:53,080 Speaker 1: from that attention or makes you feel sorry for her. 206 00:13:53,440 --> 00:13:56,320 Speaker 1: You know, I I was just drinking in everything that you said, 207 00:13:56,320 --> 00:13:58,880 Speaker 1: and I agree with everything that you said, and I 208 00:13:58,960 --> 00:14:02,720 Speaker 1: want to point out to everybody, I, of all people, 209 00:14:03,240 --> 00:14:07,880 Speaker 1: am not interested in fashion. Can we agree with that? Okay, 210 00:14:08,040 --> 00:14:11,959 Speaker 1: So that's not what we're talking about here. We are taught. 211 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:17,040 Speaker 1: We're talking about trial strategy, which I care very deeply 212 00:14:17,080 --> 00:14:24,200 Speaker 1: about trial strategy and technique. Think about the Menendez brothers, 213 00:14:25,400 --> 00:14:29,320 Speaker 1: their thugs, But what do they wear in court? They 214 00:14:29,360 --> 00:14:32,440 Speaker 1: looked like they were one else at Harvard Law School. 215 00:14:33,200 --> 00:14:37,800 Speaker 1: Really they would address in this preppy outfit. Their lawyer, 216 00:14:37,840 --> 00:14:40,320 Speaker 1: who was a very good defense attorney at the time, 217 00:14:40,680 --> 00:14:44,160 Speaker 1: would preen on them and pet them, and rub their 218 00:14:44,200 --> 00:14:47,680 Speaker 1: bakes and pick lint off them and smooth their hair 219 00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:50,840 Speaker 1: in court to humanize them. It was all an act, 220 00:14:51,520 --> 00:14:54,840 Speaker 1: their outfit. It was a stage. The courtroom was a 221 00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:59,200 Speaker 1: stage and is a stage. And everything you say, everything 222 00:14:59,240 --> 00:15:02,600 Speaker 1: you do, how you look, how you stand, what you 223 00:15:02,640 --> 00:15:08,480 Speaker 1: wear matters in a court of law. Why because, whether 224 00:15:08,520 --> 00:15:12,800 Speaker 1: they realize it or not, jurars are drinking you in 225 00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:16,440 Speaker 1: and are forming opinions about you. They may not even 226 00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:21,240 Speaker 1: realize they're forming. Let me go to an expert in 227 00:15:21,280 --> 00:15:27,080 Speaker 1: this is doctor Teresa gil PhD, psychotherapist and professor of psychology. 228 00:15:28,560 --> 00:15:30,720 Speaker 1: Somebody and I'm going to remember who it was in 229 00:15:30,760 --> 00:15:33,200 Speaker 1: a minute said the first thing they noticed about a 230 00:15:33,240 --> 00:15:36,040 Speaker 1: person is their shoes. Okay, I never look at anybody's shoes, 231 00:15:36,320 --> 00:15:39,560 Speaker 1: but they say, if their shoes are well shined and 232 00:15:39,640 --> 00:15:42,680 Speaker 1: taken care of, then that says something about the person. 233 00:15:42,720 --> 00:15:44,640 Speaker 1: I would never dream to look down at somebody's shoes. 234 00:15:45,560 --> 00:15:49,920 Speaker 1: But the point I'm making is everything you do, whether 235 00:15:49,960 --> 00:15:52,040 Speaker 1: you look at the jury, whether you look down the 236 00:15:52,040 --> 00:15:55,960 Speaker 1: whole time, whether you laugh, whether you cry, they see 237 00:15:56,040 --> 00:16:02,800 Speaker 1: all that, and they unconscious I think, subconsciously form an opinion, 238 00:16:02,880 --> 00:16:07,440 Speaker 1: Doctor Gil. That's true. They say within fifteen seconds people 239 00:16:07,560 --> 00:16:11,000 Speaker 1: can sum you up. But I also think in relationship 240 00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:14,320 Speaker 1: to what she chose to wear, her entire life has 241 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:20,400 Speaker 1: been based on creating a persona of being affluent and 242 00:16:20,680 --> 00:16:23,760 Speaker 1: being seen and being visible. She was born to a 243 00:16:23,760 --> 00:16:27,080 Speaker 1: billionaire father, and some of her friends have said that 244 00:16:27,080 --> 00:16:30,080 Speaker 1: when her father passed and left no money, that that's 245 00:16:30,080 --> 00:16:33,480 Speaker 1: why she got involved with Epstein because he was another 246 00:16:33,520 --> 00:16:36,920 Speaker 1: billionaire that would be able to provide that lifestyle for her. 247 00:16:37,120 --> 00:16:39,760 Speaker 1: And I could actually see her lawyers saying, don't dress 248 00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:43,520 Speaker 1: like that, and her just refusing. Because how she presents 249 00:16:43,520 --> 00:16:46,360 Speaker 1: herself to the world I think is an intricate part 250 00:16:46,480 --> 00:16:50,200 Speaker 1: of who she is and that she's making a decision 251 00:16:50,560 --> 00:16:53,160 Speaker 1: even if it may not work for her. Who on 252 00:16:53,200 --> 00:16:55,920 Speaker 1: the panel remembers the minute? I agree with you, doctor Gil. 253 00:16:56,280 --> 00:17:01,880 Speaker 1: Who on the panel or in this room? Remember Lemnendez trial? 254 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:06,520 Speaker 1: Both Kara and Jock, Yeah, I remember it. Do you 255 00:17:06,520 --> 00:17:09,239 Speaker 1: remember Joe Scott? Do you remember how they dressed? And 256 00:17:09,240 --> 00:17:11,080 Speaker 1: I'm going to get off the closure just a moment, 257 00:17:12,040 --> 00:17:15,480 Speaker 1: but you know, everything matters in court. Do you remember 258 00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:18,520 Speaker 1: that Joe Scott Morgan? Yeah? I remember one in particular, 259 00:17:19,080 --> 00:17:22,240 Speaker 1: had an affinity for crewneck sweaters in particular, and the 260 00:17:22,320 --> 00:17:25,960 Speaker 1: hair all trimmed up and finally polished an appearance, and 261 00:17:26,040 --> 00:17:28,439 Speaker 1: you know he met that appearance that you have, that 262 00:17:28,520 --> 00:17:32,119 Speaker 1: expectation that people that live out there would bring to bear. 263 00:17:32,640 --> 00:17:34,439 Speaker 1: I just thought of something. I can't believe one of 264 00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:36,040 Speaker 1: you didn't knock me over the head of this. I 265 00:17:36,080 --> 00:17:38,639 Speaker 1: even said the name Jodi Arius. Do you remember she 266 00:17:38,640 --> 00:17:41,240 Speaker 1: had always been a bottle blonde, not judging, not a 267 00:17:41,320 --> 00:17:45,560 Speaker 1: leg to stand on there, and very made up and 268 00:17:45,720 --> 00:17:52,000 Speaker 1: very sexy when she was dating Travis Alexander. Do you remember, guys, 269 00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:55,160 Speaker 1: anybody jumping If you do, remember that she actually had 270 00:17:55,200 --> 00:18:02,240 Speaker 1: her hair totally dark brown in a very dowdy ponytail, 271 00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:07,359 Speaker 1: and she dressed like a seventy year old librarian for trial. 272 00:18:07,560 --> 00:18:10,359 Speaker 1: And I'm like, who's that? In defense table? Who that? 273 00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:13,359 Speaker 1: Who's that? Of course I knew it was Jodi Aris, 274 00:18:13,840 --> 00:18:21,360 Speaker 1: complete different look. It's like she transformed Kafka esque into 275 00:18:21,520 --> 00:18:27,000 Speaker 1: something completely different. And I'm talking, of course about metamorphosis, 276 00:18:27,000 --> 00:18:29,320 Speaker 1: where a guy turns into a roach, a giant roach. 277 00:18:41,760 --> 00:18:45,439 Speaker 1: Prime Stories with Nancy Grace, What exactly is happening in 278 00:18:45,480 --> 00:18:48,040 Speaker 1: the courtroom. Let's say Elisa cut six, this is a 279 00:18:48,119 --> 00:18:52,280 Speaker 1: Valerie Castro CNBC. After a morning of finalizing the jury, 280 00:18:52,359 --> 00:18:56,120 Speaker 1: the opening statements began this afternoon. The prosecution began by 281 00:18:56,119 --> 00:18:58,520 Speaker 1: telling the jury about one of the alleged victims in 282 00:18:58,560 --> 00:19:01,560 Speaker 1: this case, saying that she met Maxwell and Epstein at 283 00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:04,720 Speaker 1: a summer camp, calling the pair predators, and going on 284 00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:08,560 Speaker 1: to say, quote, this defendant was trafficking kids for sex. 285 00:19:08,760 --> 00:19:11,520 Speaker 1: That is what this trial is all about. The attorney 286 00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:13,560 Speaker 1: went on to outline the claims and told the jury 287 00:19:13,600 --> 00:19:15,960 Speaker 1: they will hear from the alleged victims as well as 288 00:19:15,960 --> 00:19:19,280 Speaker 1: see photos of massage tables where the alleged abuse took place, 289 00:19:19,560 --> 00:19:22,359 Speaker 1: as well as flight logs from private planes to prove 290 00:19:22,400 --> 00:19:25,840 Speaker 1: the girls were traffic to various locations. The defense started 291 00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:28,359 Speaker 1: out with a reference to Eve tempting Adam with an 292 00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:31,639 Speaker 1: apple and saying that ever since, women have been blamed 293 00:19:31,680 --> 00:19:35,600 Speaker 1: for things men have done. Maxwell's attorney went on to say, quote, 294 00:19:35,680 --> 00:19:38,600 Speaker 1: she is not Jeffrey Epstein. She is not anything like 295 00:19:38,680 --> 00:19:44,000 Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein. Epstein is not on trial. Well, somebody niece 296 00:19:44,080 --> 00:19:49,200 Speaker 1: Gary Genesis again, because Eve also bit the apple. Wasn't 297 00:19:49,240 --> 00:19:52,840 Speaker 1: just Adam? So here we go. We're seeing what's happening 298 00:19:52,840 --> 00:19:55,880 Speaker 1: in court. Did I hear that correctly, Charlie Lankston, that 299 00:19:56,880 --> 00:20:00,920 Speaker 1: Gilline Maxwell actually met one of the alleged victims at 300 00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:04,520 Speaker 1: summer camp. Yes, so what they are saying is that 301 00:20:04,600 --> 00:20:08,639 Speaker 1: she and a gentleman turned up at this summer camp, 302 00:20:09,359 --> 00:20:12,400 Speaker 1: supposedly saying that they were there to donate money, and 303 00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:15,879 Speaker 1: that they then met this young girl. They're using the 304 00:20:15,880 --> 00:20:20,640 Speaker 1: pseudonym Jane in court because this victim wishes to remain unidentified. 305 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:25,879 Speaker 1: And that was how Gelaine first formed a relationship with 306 00:20:25,920 --> 00:20:29,280 Speaker 1: this girl, and that was how she then allegedly introduced 307 00:20:29,280 --> 00:20:31,919 Speaker 1: her to Jeffrey Epstein, who is said to have been 308 00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:35,680 Speaker 1: groomed and molested this young girl. I need to take 309 00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:37,680 Speaker 1: in everything you said, because you got me drinking on 310 00:20:37,800 --> 00:20:41,920 Speaker 1: the fire hydrant too much, too fast. You know, I've 311 00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:46,200 Speaker 1: researched this case. I've spoken to many of the victims 312 00:20:46,600 --> 00:20:53,240 Speaker 1: past present that were not necessarily witnesses at this trial. 313 00:20:54,280 --> 00:20:58,600 Speaker 1: But this is the first time hearing that Gilaine Maxwell 314 00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:02,359 Speaker 1: actually met one of the victims at summer camp. Could 315 00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:06,879 Speaker 1: you tell me more about that scenario, like what summer camp, 316 00:21:07,080 --> 00:21:09,520 Speaker 1: how old was the victim. I know they were there 317 00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:13,320 Speaker 1: under the guys of donating money, but do you know 318 00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:16,639 Speaker 1: anything else? Well. In order to protect the anonymity of 319 00:21:16,720 --> 00:21:22,560 Speaker 1: this victim, they haven't yet revealed specific details about it. 320 00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:25,320 Speaker 1: But what the prosecution is saying, and the reason that 321 00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:28,240 Speaker 1: they are using this story is because they are trying 322 00:21:28,280 --> 00:21:33,320 Speaker 1: to prove that Gilaine not only was there when Epstein 323 00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:37,600 Speaker 1: was abusing these young women, but she went out and 324 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:41,320 Speaker 1: recruited them. She went to all kinds of different locations 325 00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:46,159 Speaker 1: and targeted specific young girls who, as you said, often 326 00:21:46,240 --> 00:21:50,040 Speaker 1: came from very underprivileged backgrounds. The prosecution also says that 327 00:21:50,080 --> 00:21:53,520 Speaker 1: she would target the daughters of single mothers who were 328 00:21:53,560 --> 00:21:57,600 Speaker 1: therefore looking for a father figure in their lives. They 329 00:21:57,600 --> 00:22:01,320 Speaker 1: were missing a parent for whatever reason, and therefore, you know, 330 00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:03,720 Speaker 1: kind of we're yearning for a strong male figure in 331 00:22:03,760 --> 00:22:06,720 Speaker 1: their life. And that Gelayne was the one who was 332 00:22:07,000 --> 00:22:10,480 Speaker 1: sourcing these young women and then luring them in with 333 00:22:10,680 --> 00:22:15,119 Speaker 1: promises of money, of comfort, of family, of anything that 334 00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:18,840 Speaker 1: she thought would make them more eager to get to 335 00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:21,880 Speaker 1: know her and therefore get to know Epstein. So are 336 00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:26,800 Speaker 1: we going to have this victim understand the one that 337 00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:30,919 Speaker 1: Glayne Maxwell met at summer Camp. Yes, but three of 338 00:22:30,920 --> 00:22:34,280 Speaker 1: the four victims who will testify during the trial will 339 00:22:34,359 --> 00:22:38,400 Speaker 1: remain anonymous, so it's unlikely that we will really ever 340 00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:42,080 Speaker 1: know who exactly they are unless they choose to name themselves. 341 00:22:42,200 --> 00:22:45,840 Speaker 1: But this victim will likely go into much more detail 342 00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:49,680 Speaker 1: about how Gelayne approached her and how it went from 343 00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:52,880 Speaker 1: that first meeting at summer Camp to her being molested 344 00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:56,959 Speaker 1: by Epstein. Oh, I just feel sick about it, Jessica 345 00:22:57,000 --> 00:23:00,639 Speaker 1: Pride meeting a child victim at summer camp. And you know, 346 00:23:00,760 --> 00:23:05,040 Speaker 1: Gillaine Maxwell was trolling because if Epstein or whoever she 347 00:23:05,160 --> 00:23:07,880 Speaker 1: was with wanted to donate money, why does she need 348 00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:10,680 Speaker 1: to go meet the girls, the little girls that turned 349 00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:13,440 Speaker 1: into sex victims of Epstein's There's no reason. I mean, 350 00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:15,439 Speaker 1: I don't go and check the plumbing at the church 351 00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:19,320 Speaker 1: before I write a check. Okay. Why that had to 352 00:23:19,359 --> 00:23:22,159 Speaker 1: be the reason that she was there, Jessica, to troll 353 00:23:22,240 --> 00:23:27,720 Speaker 1: for victims. Sick. She was already starting the grooming process. 354 00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:31,600 Speaker 1: And when you're looking for victims, predators often looks for 355 00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:37,639 Speaker 1: vulnerable victims, and the grooming process in itself is a 356 00:23:37,720 --> 00:23:42,480 Speaker 1: process by which a predator pushes the boundaries of a 357 00:23:42,560 --> 00:23:46,520 Speaker 1: victim and test for their vulnerabilities. And so by finding 358 00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:50,520 Speaker 1: kids who didn't have parents or needed money or things 359 00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:53,440 Speaker 1: like that, she was seeing which she could get away with, 360 00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:57,119 Speaker 1: and she was climbing them for him. It's going to 361 00:23:57,200 --> 00:24:00,760 Speaker 1: be really interesting in this trial because the decis lost 362 00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:04,840 Speaker 1: part of their motion regarding the expert Lisa Rostio, who 363 00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:07,960 Speaker 1: is a grooming expert, and I'm really interested in to 364 00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:11,560 Speaker 1: see her tape to stand because she can talk about 365 00:24:11,600 --> 00:24:14,800 Speaker 1: what grooming is. However, what the judge isn't gonna let 366 00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:18,400 Speaker 1: her talk about, which I wish he would, is grooming 367 00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:22,960 Speaker 1: by proxy, because grooming by proxy is essentially grooming by 368 00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:26,359 Speaker 1: a third party, and that's exactly what Jaslan did. She 369 00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:31,199 Speaker 1: groomed these girls for epsteins to prey upon, you know. 370 00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:37,520 Speaker 1: And I find it, as a trial issue almost impossible 371 00:24:37,560 --> 00:24:42,000 Speaker 1: to believe that all of these then young girls have 372 00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:46,560 Speaker 1: the same general story about the same emo, motus operandi 373 00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:52,080 Speaker 1: method of operation, that the same trajectory of their assault, 374 00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:55,399 Speaker 1: and these girls are separated by time and space, didn't 375 00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:59,359 Speaker 1: know each other. It's impossible in my mind that they're 376 00:24:59,440 --> 00:25:07,919 Speaker 1: all lying. Statistically astronomically impossible. Guys, take a listen to 377 00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:13,800 Speaker 1: our cut one our France at Reuter's inside a Manhattan 378 00:25:13,840 --> 00:25:18,399 Speaker 1: federal courthouse closed off to video cameras. Jurors on Monday 379 00:25:18,520 --> 00:25:22,119 Speaker 1: heard opening statements in the criminal trial of Gillen Maxwell, 380 00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:27,560 Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein's former employee, one time romantic partner, and alleged 381 00:25:27,680 --> 00:25:31,320 Speaker 1: sex crimes co conspirator, in the latest chapter in a 382 00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:35,080 Speaker 1: closely watched case that has captured the imaginations of people 383 00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:38,280 Speaker 1: around the world about the exploits of the rich and powerful, 384 00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:41,720 Speaker 1: and has at the same time inspired victims of sexual 385 00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:44,800 Speaker 1: abuse to speak out. On day one of the trial, 386 00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:48,040 Speaker 1: the prosecution told the jury that Maxwell and Epstein were 387 00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:52,520 Speaker 1: partners in crime, saying she quote prayed on vulnerable young girls, 388 00:25:52,640 --> 00:25:56,680 Speaker 1: manipulated them, and served them up to be sexually abused 389 00:25:56,720 --> 00:26:00,800 Speaker 1: by the now deceased financier, which involved erotic massages that 390 00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:04,120 Speaker 1: the prosecutor said Maxwell was sometimes even in the room 391 00:26:04,160 --> 00:26:07,720 Speaker 1: for Maxwell's lawyers said the sex abuse charges against her 392 00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:10,800 Speaker 1: were for things Epstein did, and that the memories of 393 00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:14,760 Speaker 1: the accusers had been manipulated by lawyers who encouraged them 394 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:18,760 Speaker 1: to sue for damages. Okay, I want you to hear this. 395 00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:22,600 Speaker 1: This really rubbed made the wrong way. Take a listen 396 00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:26,080 Speaker 1: to our cut for this is Alice Gaynor at CBS 397 00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:30,720 Speaker 1: two New York and that's not her delivery. It's what 398 00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:33,679 Speaker 1: she's saying and what it conjures up and what it 399 00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:37,560 Speaker 1: stands for. Listen. They likened him to a mysterious twenty 400 00:26:37,560 --> 00:26:40,760 Speaker 1: first century James Bond, with no wife, no children, and 401 00:26:40,840 --> 00:26:43,880 Speaker 1: no boss, a man who did not share all aspects 402 00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:46,399 Speaker 1: of his life and claim many people of all ages 403 00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:49,359 Speaker 1: used his private jets like a Hampton Jitney in the 404 00:26:49,400 --> 00:26:52,520 Speaker 1: air to go to places other than his properties. At trial, 405 00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:55,840 Speaker 1: we are expected to hear from four alleged victims, their relatives, 406 00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:59,280 Speaker 1: staff from his properties, including his private pilots, and also 407 00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:02,880 Speaker 1: law enforced witnesses to searches. The defense says they plan 408 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:07,639 Speaker 1: to show the accusers memories were corrupted and manipulated by lawyers, media, 409 00:27:07,800 --> 00:27:10,280 Speaker 1: and money. Fifty nine year old Maxwell could be seen 410 00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:13,640 Speaker 1: whispering to her lawyers and taking and passing notes. She's 411 00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:16,200 Speaker 1: pleaded not guilty and has been in a Brooklyn jail 412 00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:19,600 Speaker 1: since her arrest in July twenty twenty. Oh Boo who 413 00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:24,440 Speaker 1: Charlie Lankson, who compared Epstein to a modern day James Bond. 414 00:27:24,800 --> 00:27:28,520 Speaker 1: It was someone on Gielane Maxwell's defense team who came 415 00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:32,639 Speaker 1: up with that ludicrous comparison. And to be completely honest, 416 00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:36,000 Speaker 1: I don't really understand what they're trying to do with it. 417 00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:38,399 Speaker 1: It doesn't make any sense in my opinion, and it 418 00:27:38,480 --> 00:27:43,160 Speaker 1: also doesn't really play into anything that's going on here. 419 00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:48,600 Speaker 1: You know what, it's interesting that the defense sees Epstein 420 00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:52,880 Speaker 1: as a James Bond figure. I'm sure Daniel Craig will 421 00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:56,040 Speaker 1: be so happy to hear. He's been playing the part 422 00:27:56,160 --> 00:28:01,160 Speaker 1: of a billionaire pedophile all these years. But that's glamorizing 423 00:28:02,280 --> 00:28:07,439 Speaker 1: child rape. It's child rape the way we say assault. 424 00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:14,560 Speaker 1: It's child rape. A child the age of fourteen, fifteen, sixteen, 425 00:28:14,600 --> 00:28:18,280 Speaker 1: in many jurisdictions does not have the ability to consent. 426 00:28:18,760 --> 00:28:23,320 Speaker 1: We don't let children by cars, enter into contracts, work 427 00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:28,520 Speaker 1: under our labor laws, by alcohol, by cigarettes, gamble for 428 00:28:28,560 --> 00:28:34,399 Speaker 1: a reason, because they do not have the maturity, the 429 00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:39,280 Speaker 1: mental wherewithal to make that decision, much less to agree 430 00:28:39,400 --> 00:28:44,920 Speaker 1: to have sex with some old perv. No. So it 431 00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:50,080 Speaker 1: is under the law rape, it is child rape. And 432 00:28:50,160 --> 00:28:56,000 Speaker 1: to compare him to James Bond, this glamorous figure who 433 00:28:56,280 --> 00:29:00,520 Speaker 1: is idolized who was put upon a pedestal, sends all 434 00:29:00,600 --> 00:29:05,080 Speaker 1: the wrong messages. Help me out, doctor gil I think 435 00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:09,560 Speaker 1: the message is purposeful because it helps to deny that 436 00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:13,880 Speaker 1: he was a perpetrator and a child molester. And James 437 00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:17,160 Speaker 1: Bond is kind of revered across the world as a movie, 438 00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:21,440 Speaker 1: you know, in the movies for decades, and it kind 439 00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:25,000 Speaker 1: of helps to bring Epstein up and diminish what happened 440 00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:29,320 Speaker 1: to these children. I guess it's miss Gilay Maxwell a 441 00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:33,880 Speaker 1: bond girl. Charlie Langston, she's a bond girl, right, but 442 00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:38,040 Speaker 1: it definitely Marry knows this well. But once again, it's 443 00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:41,400 Speaker 1: a very confusing tactic to me from the defense, because 444 00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:45,160 Speaker 1: if you're telling the jury that you don't want them to, 445 00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:49,040 Speaker 1: you know, see the glamorous side of delay and Maxwell's life, 446 00:29:49,120 --> 00:29:52,200 Speaker 1: that you don't want her to be connected to the 447 00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:56,640 Speaker 1: wealth and mystery, as they're saying of Jeffrey Epstein, then 448 00:29:56,680 --> 00:29:59,880 Speaker 1: why on earth would you use a character who is 449 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:04,720 Speaker 1: so well known for his glamorized image, which, as you said, 450 00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:08,479 Speaker 1: immediately conjures up the illusion that Geilayne Maxwell was some 451 00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:10,640 Speaker 1: kind of Bond girl. I mean, I think the truth 452 00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:13,000 Speaker 1: to me is that as soon as I hear the 453 00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:16,000 Speaker 1: James Bond comparison, I think of a James Bond villain, 454 00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:19,120 Speaker 1: and I think of Geilne Maxwell as being the sidekick, 455 00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:24,520 Speaker 1: right hand woman to that villainy images in my mind. 456 00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:27,600 Speaker 1: Do you remember the Bond girl? Was that ursula andres 457 00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:30,400 Speaker 1: that came out of the water and she had that Okay, 458 00:30:30,480 --> 00:30:34,240 Speaker 1: Jackie's saying, yes, she had the dagger on her side. Okay, 459 00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:36,160 Speaker 1: that image is up here. I can never get rid 460 00:30:36,200 --> 00:30:38,680 Speaker 1: of it. And when you say villain, I naturally think, 461 00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:42,200 Speaker 1: do you remember the really tall guy named Jaws? And 462 00:30:42,320 --> 00:30:46,320 Speaker 1: in Bond he had the metal teeth? I guess that. Okay, 463 00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:49,600 Speaker 1: you know we're going way into James bondlore right now 464 00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:52,720 Speaker 1: when I should be focused on what's happening in court. 465 00:30:53,360 --> 00:30:56,080 Speaker 1: Take a listen to Uric at five, This is our friend, 466 00:30:56,120 --> 00:31:00,800 Speaker 1: Mola Lenji at CBS, prosecutors portrayed GLA Maxwell as a 467 00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:05,080 Speaker 1: sexual predator who enticed teenage girls first by befriending them, 468 00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:08,800 Speaker 1: then serving them up to Jeffrey Epstein to be sexually abused, 469 00:31:09,160 --> 00:31:12,880 Speaker 1: labeling Maxwell as Epstein's partner in crime. In her opening statement, 470 00:31:13,080 --> 00:31:15,760 Speaker 1: the prosecutor said, in at least one instance, they were 471 00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:18,680 Speaker 1: each more than double the age of their victim. The 472 00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:23,560 Speaker 1: government alleges Maxwell, now fifty nine, assisted, facilitated, and contributed 473 00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:27,040 Speaker 1: to crimes by Epstein by helping him recruit, groom and 474 00:31:27,080 --> 00:31:30,400 Speaker 1: abuse girls as young as fourteen. Today in court, the 475 00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:33,760 Speaker 1: prosecutor charged that Maxwell traded on the trust she earned 476 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:36,320 Speaker 1: from the girls, even being in the room when Epstein 477 00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:39,800 Speaker 1: abused them, but defense attorney Bobby Sternham questioned the memories 478 00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:43,360 Speaker 1: of Maxwell's accusers, portraying Maxwell as a government's scapegoat for 479 00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:47,120 Speaker 1: the real criminal, Epstein himself, and telling the jury Maxwell 480 00:31:47,240 --> 00:31:49,600 Speaker 1: is a convenient stand in for the man who cannot 481 00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:53,600 Speaker 1: be here. Did you hear that Dwayne Maxwell actually in 482 00:31:53,760 --> 00:32:00,360 Speaker 1: the room standing by while her boyfriend Jeffrey EPs sane 483 00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:04,800 Speaker 1: sex molested these little girls? I think I hear Dodtor Guil? 484 00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:07,880 Speaker 1: What Dodor Guil? I think the same. I've been doing 485 00:32:07,880 --> 00:32:11,760 Speaker 1: this for over thirty years and working with victims. Nothing 486 00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:16,680 Speaker 1: really gets me frazzled or angry. But when I heard 487 00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:20,280 Speaker 1: how our lawyers were going to manage this in terms 488 00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:24,480 Speaker 1: of telling that the victims stories are false memories and 489 00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:27,680 Speaker 1: that it's been too much time and because of media 490 00:32:27,800 --> 00:32:31,560 Speaker 1: reports and because of social media, that their memories have 491 00:32:31,680 --> 00:32:36,080 Speaker 1: been contaminated and swayed, and also then blaming the victims 492 00:32:36,120 --> 00:32:38,760 Speaker 1: saying that they would drug users, that they're doing this 493 00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:43,160 Speaker 1: for money, that they have histories of child sexual abuse 494 00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:46,880 Speaker 1: and prostitution. It's the reason why there are hundreds of 495 00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:52,560 Speaker 1: victims related to Maxwell and Epstein and only a handful 496 00:32:52,680 --> 00:32:55,720 Speaker 1: have come out, because what happens is the courts take 497 00:32:55,840 --> 00:32:59,960 Speaker 1: this and make the victim the perpetrator and the manipulation, 498 00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:07,640 Speaker 1: and that's how they're handling the defense of Maxwell Nancy. 499 00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:11,920 Speaker 1: This is Jessica ride as a classics defense strategy that 500 00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:15,520 Speaker 1: they have been using it survivors for decades. It's blame 501 00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:18,800 Speaker 1: the victims. The victim is lying, the victim doesn't know 502 00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:23,440 Speaker 1: what they're talking about. But the statistics show that do 503 00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:26,520 Speaker 1: you know what the average age of a child sex 504 00:33:26,560 --> 00:33:29,320 Speaker 1: abuse survivor the age that they actually come forward and 505 00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:35,080 Speaker 1: report fifty two? Fifty two years old is the average 506 00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:39,000 Speaker 1: age that a victim finds the courage after years of 507 00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:41,160 Speaker 1: living with the abuse, that they are able to then 508 00:33:41,240 --> 00:33:45,320 Speaker 1: tell their story. We also know that statistics show that 509 00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:49,760 Speaker 1: the average for false reporting is two to five percent, 510 00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:51,960 Speaker 1: So depending on where you are at in the country 511 00:33:52,400 --> 00:33:55,920 Speaker 1: two to five percent. That means most survivors are telling 512 00:33:56,200 --> 00:33:59,000 Speaker 1: the truth. And there's no way that there's all these 513 00:33:59,120 --> 00:34:02,200 Speaker 1: victims around the country who don't know each other that 514 00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:06,720 Speaker 1: are all telling the same lie. They are telling the truth, 515 00:34:07,120 --> 00:34:09,320 Speaker 1: and their defense team is going to have a really 516 00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:14,120 Speaker 1: hard job of trying to turn people around and try 517 00:34:14,239 --> 00:34:16,800 Speaker 1: to see it their way, because they can answer hire 518 00:34:16,840 --> 00:34:20,919 Speaker 1: any fancy expert like Elizabeth Locus to try and come 519 00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:23,520 Speaker 1: in and say, oh, they have false memories. But what 520 00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:26,239 Speaker 1: we know from her track record is she lost it 521 00:34:26,280 --> 00:34:29,160 Speaker 1: in OJ's case, she lost it in Wayne Stein's case, 522 00:34:29,400 --> 00:34:31,360 Speaker 1: and we're hoping she does a bad job in this 523 00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:48,640 Speaker 1: case and that Maslows also convicted guilty time stories with 524 00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:53,800 Speaker 1: Nancy Grace. You know what, Joe Scott, it's very complicated 525 00:34:53,880 --> 00:34:59,640 Speaker 1: why people never mentioned that they were molested as a child. 526 00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:02,560 Speaker 1: I mean, in this room, I've got three women. You 527 00:35:02,560 --> 00:35:06,840 Speaker 1: don't have to say anything. But were you ever inappropriately 528 00:35:07,040 --> 00:35:10,920 Speaker 1: kissed or touched as a child? I was? I was. 529 00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:14,720 Speaker 1: And you know who saved me, my fifth grade teacher, 530 00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:21,719 Speaker 1: Katie Amison. Katie Amison, and it was right around Thanksgiving. 531 00:35:23,040 --> 00:35:27,080 Speaker 1: I'll never forget it. And I remember it like it 532 00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:35,239 Speaker 1: was yesterday, like it was yesterday, And I just have 533 00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:39,880 Speaker 1: a hard time believing that these now women can't remember 534 00:35:40,760 --> 00:35:45,360 Speaker 1: what happened to them. What were you saying, just Scott, Yeah, 535 00:35:45,400 --> 00:35:49,000 Speaker 1: the defense is doing this kind of shucking jive thing, 536 00:35:49,520 --> 00:35:51,960 Speaker 1: the ropea dope, if you will, where they're trying to 537 00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:54,160 Speaker 1: take their eyes off of what this really is. And 538 00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:56,880 Speaker 1: Maxwell is nothing more than a pimp. And you and 539 00:35:56,920 --> 00:35:59,719 Speaker 1: I have worked cases, Nancy, over the years that come 540 00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:03,279 Speaker 1: directly off of the streets. And what's really important to 541 00:36:03,280 --> 00:36:05,720 Speaker 1: me is this first witness that they've got on the stand, 542 00:36:05,800 --> 00:36:08,759 Speaker 1: Larry Weiskoch Skockey I think is his name, who is 543 00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:12,560 Speaker 1: a pilot. Yes, we should get to the witness, I guess. So. 544 00:36:12,600 --> 00:36:15,319 Speaker 1: Now we've talked about the clothing and well, we can 545 00:36:15,400 --> 00:36:17,840 Speaker 1: learn a lot about what the prosecution is going to do. 546 00:36:17,880 --> 00:36:20,600 Speaker 1: You simply based on this first witness, Nancy, think back 547 00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:23,080 Speaker 1: to every case that you and I have ever worked 548 00:36:23,160 --> 00:36:26,399 Speaker 1: relative to, say, for instance, a sexual assault case. If 549 00:36:26,440 --> 00:36:29,160 Speaker 1: an individual has been conveyed somewhere, I don't care if 550 00:36:29,160 --> 00:36:33,399 Speaker 1: it's a Gulf Stream jet or yellow cab. We get 551 00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:35,680 Speaker 1: to the cabby, we get to the person that's driving 552 00:36:35,680 --> 00:36:38,040 Speaker 1: that vehicle and say, okay, what were they doing when 553 00:36:38,080 --> 00:36:40,480 Speaker 1: they got in your cab? Who were they with, what 554 00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:43,319 Speaker 1: was their affect like, were they damaged in any way? 555 00:36:43,360 --> 00:36:45,879 Speaker 1: Were they in harm? Were they in fear or were 556 00:36:45,920 --> 00:36:49,799 Speaker 1: they happy when you last saw this guy that they've 557 00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:53,680 Speaker 1: got on the stand. He is the person that conveyed Maxwell, 558 00:36:53,719 --> 00:36:58,480 Speaker 1: who is the pimp, and Epstein, who was, you know, 559 00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:03,560 Speaker 1: the master of the universe for her. He conveyed them everywhere, Nancy. 560 00:37:03,600 --> 00:37:06,200 Speaker 1: He's already stated that they went to Paris, they went 561 00:37:06,200 --> 00:37:08,440 Speaker 1: to Great Britain. Of course, they went to the Virgin Islands, 562 00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:11,560 Speaker 1: and of course the mysterious ranch out in New Mexico. 563 00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:13,920 Speaker 1: He's flying all these people around and this is key 564 00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:16,759 Speaker 1: because he's going to talk about I think he's continuing 565 00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:19,040 Speaker 1: on with his testimony. He's going to talk about who 566 00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:22,239 Speaker 1: was on that plane and what their purpose was. You know, 567 00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:24,359 Speaker 1: this isn't a yellow cab, this is a plane. They 568 00:37:24,360 --> 00:37:26,839 Speaker 1: have to file flight logs, they have to talk about 569 00:37:26,840 --> 00:37:29,239 Speaker 1: where they're going, and they have to say who's on 570 00:37:29,280 --> 00:37:32,160 Speaker 1: the plane. And you're right, we're going to find out, 571 00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:37,839 Speaker 1: I believe. Charlie Langston, editor at dailymail dot Com, based 572 00:37:37,880 --> 00:37:41,440 Speaker 1: on the state's first witness, who was a pilot that 573 00:37:41,520 --> 00:37:45,200 Speaker 1: flew Epstein around. And again this is not about Epstein, 574 00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:49,439 Speaker 1: this is about Glenn Maxwell, who my understanding, Charlie will 575 00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:55,279 Speaker 1: testify that Galte Maxwell organized the trips, the flights where 576 00:37:55,480 --> 00:37:59,680 Speaker 1: from such as Titterborough and New York, the private airport 577 00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:03,239 Speaker 1: to where and who would be on the flies. So 578 00:38:03,360 --> 00:38:05,480 Speaker 1: for her to say, Wow, I didn't know there were 579 00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:08,520 Speaker 1: any little girls on the fly Epstein, It's totally impossible. 580 00:38:08,600 --> 00:38:11,680 Speaker 1: And is that the gist of the first witness, Charlie, Yes, 581 00:38:11,760 --> 00:38:15,640 Speaker 1: because you know, as we've said, this man flew Epstein. 582 00:38:15,719 --> 00:38:18,279 Speaker 1: He said he would fly him every four days or so. 583 00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:21,719 Speaker 1: This Epstein was on the plane which was nicknamed the 584 00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:25,959 Speaker 1: Lolita Express because it was said to have been used 585 00:38:25,960 --> 00:38:30,160 Speaker 1: to transport young women so frequently. If this pilot can 586 00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:34,120 Speaker 1: kick off the prosecution's case by saying I was on 587 00:38:34,160 --> 00:38:38,719 Speaker 1: a plane with Geilaane Maxwell, Epstein and a young girl 588 00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:41,880 Speaker 1: or several young girls who were brought onto the plane 589 00:38:41,880 --> 00:38:47,080 Speaker 1: by Maxwell, that immediately shows a connection not only between 590 00:38:47,280 --> 00:38:50,640 Speaker 1: Guilaye Epstein and these young women, but also that Guilaine 591 00:38:50,719 --> 00:38:53,320 Speaker 1: was the one who was organizing for these young victims 592 00:38:53,320 --> 00:38:56,200 Speaker 1: to be on the plane with Epstein. You know, how 593 00:38:56,280 --> 00:39:00,200 Speaker 1: can you load up a plane with your boyfriend, a 594 00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:03,360 Speaker 1: private plane and a bunch of little girls. And I 595 00:39:03,640 --> 00:39:08,279 Speaker 1: think something is way wrong with this picture. I mean, 596 00:39:08,440 --> 00:39:12,520 Speaker 1: how could she do that and yet claim she didn't 597 00:39:12,560 --> 00:39:16,520 Speaker 1: know what was going on? What about it, doctor Gil Well, 598 00:39:16,600 --> 00:39:18,960 Speaker 1: she didn't know what was going on. In fact, her 599 00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:22,920 Speaker 1: victims say she was the mastermind of it all. I 600 00:39:22,960 --> 00:39:26,160 Speaker 1: think what's also interesting about taking the victims to different 601 00:39:26,160 --> 00:39:29,719 Speaker 1: parts of the country. One of the victims was sixteen, 602 00:39:30,160 --> 00:39:33,000 Speaker 1: and because it was the abuse occurred in New Mexico, 603 00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:36,680 Speaker 1: sixteen was a legal age and hussing might be thrown 604 00:39:36,719 --> 00:39:40,560 Speaker 1: out because of that. Another girl was seventeen, and because 605 00:39:40,600 --> 00:39:43,920 Speaker 1: in New York seventeen was a legal age, it means 606 00:39:44,000 --> 00:39:48,719 Speaker 1: that it wasn't sexual saut You're right, You're absolutely right. 607 00:39:48,760 --> 00:39:52,080 Speaker 1: What about it, Charlie Likeston, I mean, in my mind, 608 00:39:52,120 --> 00:39:55,360 Speaker 1: I think you know, Virginia Roberts said it from the 609 00:39:55,400 --> 00:39:58,040 Speaker 1: get go. She will not be testifying during this trial, 610 00:39:58,200 --> 00:40:02,839 Speaker 1: but she said original that Jeffrey Epstein may have been 611 00:40:03,360 --> 00:40:08,200 Speaker 1: the pedophile, but Gelaye Maxwell was the mastermind behind everything 612 00:40:08,239 --> 00:40:11,319 Speaker 1: that he did. And I think if the prosecution can 613 00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:14,839 Speaker 1: get the pilot to say from the off that they 614 00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:18,839 Speaker 1: have evidence of that, you know, kind of masterminding going on, 615 00:40:19,200 --> 00:40:21,799 Speaker 1: then I really don't know how Gilayne's defense will have 616 00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:24,520 Speaker 1: a leg to stand on, because even if they try 617 00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:28,000 Speaker 1: and prove that these victims memories are false or warped 618 00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:30,640 Speaker 1: or whatever they're going to try and say, if we 619 00:40:30,800 --> 00:40:33,880 Speaker 1: have someone on the stand saying, well, I saw Gilaine 620 00:40:33,920 --> 00:40:36,880 Speaker 1: bringing these young women onto the plane where we know 621 00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:40,560 Speaker 1: Epstein abused them, then it doesn't really matter if they 622 00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:43,239 Speaker 1: prove that the victims memories are false, because you have 623 00:40:43,280 --> 00:40:46,319 Speaker 1: someone else who was of age at the time who 624 00:40:46,360 --> 00:40:51,680 Speaker 1: remembers it very clearly. Well, you're brilliant at yeah. I 625 00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:54,560 Speaker 1: think one more salient point here is that these state 626 00:40:54,640 --> 00:40:57,439 Speaker 1: statutes are not going to apply. This is a federal case. 627 00:40:57,920 --> 00:41:01,319 Speaker 1: They're prosecuting this under the manner which you know, it 628 00:41:01,480 --> 00:41:06,280 Speaker 1: states that you cannot transport a woman across state lines 629 00:41:06,680 --> 00:41:09,799 Speaker 1: for the purposes of sexual activity, and that's what he 630 00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:12,600 Speaker 1: was engaged in. Now, he may have procured them in 631 00:41:12,640 --> 00:41:16,520 Speaker 1: some place, say where abusing a sixteen year old is 632 00:41:16,560 --> 00:41:19,640 Speaker 1: against the law, but he's transporting her to another place 633 00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:23,920 Speaker 1: where it's not. That's immaterial here because the purpose is 634 00:41:23,960 --> 00:41:27,480 Speaker 1: to get them there in order to facilitate this. The 635 00:41:27,560 --> 00:41:29,759 Speaker 1: federal law is going to trump any kind of state 636 00:41:29,800 --> 00:41:32,200 Speaker 1: statute in my opinion. Of course, I'm not an attorney. 637 00:41:32,239 --> 00:41:34,560 Speaker 1: You are, but that's why this is being prosecuted in 638 00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:36,879 Speaker 1: federal court. Guys, take a listen to our cut two. 639 00:41:37,320 --> 00:41:41,640 Speaker 1: This is not a topic from our colleagues at the BBC. 640 00:41:42,400 --> 00:41:44,600 Speaker 1: Over the next few weeks, what plays out in this 641 00:41:44,680 --> 00:41:46,920 Speaker 1: New York court house will be a crucial chapter in 642 00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:50,640 Speaker 1: the twisted saga of Jeffrey Epstein's sex trafficking ring and 643 00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:56,120 Speaker 1: Galene Maxwell's alleged role in it. As her highly awaited 644 00:41:56,120 --> 00:41:58,759 Speaker 1: trial began, the world's eyes were trained on what the 645 00:41:58,800 --> 00:42:03,359 Speaker 1: evidence presented here would reveal, and so too were Epstein's accusers. 646 00:42:03,719 --> 00:42:07,600 Speaker 1: Some arrived to show solidarity with the alleged victims. In 647 00:42:07,719 --> 00:42:11,040 Speaker 1: opening statements, the government said Glen Maxwell was a dangerous 648 00:42:11,080 --> 00:42:15,640 Speaker 1: predator who provided a cover of respectability for Epstein. Prosecutors 649 00:42:15,680 --> 00:42:18,360 Speaker 1: said she lured victims with a promise of a bright future, 650 00:42:18,680 --> 00:42:22,000 Speaker 1: only to sexually abuse them. Her defense attorney told the 651 00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:24,680 Speaker 1: jury she was a convenient stand in for Epstein and 652 00:42:24,719 --> 00:42:27,240 Speaker 1: that the government would not be able to prove their case. 653 00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:30,880 Speaker 1: He said the accusers memories were corrupted and influenced by 654 00:42:30,880 --> 00:42:36,680 Speaker 1: a desire for a big jackpot of money. Do you 655 00:42:36,800 --> 00:42:40,600 Speaker 1: think the jury is going to buy that? The victims 656 00:42:40,600 --> 00:42:43,000 Speaker 1: are only saying this so they can get a payoff 657 00:42:43,040 --> 00:42:47,400 Speaker 1: of some sort. This is Jessica. I've represented hundreds and 658 00:42:47,600 --> 00:42:51,319 Speaker 1: hundreds of survivors over the last fifteen years, and the 659 00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:55,480 Speaker 1: one constant between all survivors is it's not about the 660 00:42:55,560 --> 00:43:01,160 Speaker 1: money for them, It's about justice. It's about being heard. 661 00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:07,520 Speaker 1: We wait as just as sun falls, Nancy Grace comes story, 662 00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:09,280 Speaker 1: signing off goodbye friend.