1 00:00:11,360 --> 00:00:15,560 Speaker 1: Jackie Dorman is a former TV executive turned relationship expert, 2 00:00:15,640 --> 00:00:19,960 Speaker 1: matchmaker and coach who's helped create over sixteen hundred engagements 3 00:00:19,960 --> 00:00:23,160 Speaker 1: and marriages in just the past few years. She is 4 00:00:23,200 --> 00:00:25,799 Speaker 1: also the best selling author of Married in Twelve Months 5 00:00:25,920 --> 00:00:28,800 Speaker 1: or Less and the upcoming guide to Reclaiming your Love 6 00:00:28,840 --> 00:00:33,000 Speaker 1: Life Modern Dating Sucks. What makes her perspective different is 7 00:00:33,040 --> 00:00:37,320 Speaker 1: that she understands both sides of this conversation, how relationships 8 00:00:37,400 --> 00:00:40,880 Speaker 1: actually work, and then how media shapes what we think 9 00:00:41,040 --> 00:00:46,239 Speaker 1: relationships should look like. So, Hi, Jackie, Hi, how are you. 10 00:00:46,560 --> 00:00:48,360 Speaker 1: I'm good, how are you? Thank you so much for 11 00:00:48,400 --> 00:00:48,960 Speaker 1: being here. 12 00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:51,280 Speaker 2: I'm excited. I'm excited to be here. 13 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:55,000 Speaker 1: We are having such an interesting moment in our culture 14 00:00:55,080 --> 00:00:58,680 Speaker 1: right now, and my listeners are used to this because 15 00:00:58,680 --> 00:01:01,240 Speaker 1: a couple of weeks ago, we had another their therapist 16 00:01:01,320 --> 00:01:04,200 Speaker 1: on that talks. We used the Love Is Blind reunion 17 00:01:04,280 --> 00:01:08,080 Speaker 1: as a way to really analyze relationships, and when your 18 00:01:08,080 --> 00:01:10,600 Speaker 1: publicist reached out to me, she was like, Jackie has 19 00:01:10,640 --> 00:01:13,720 Speaker 1: a lot to say about this bachelorette situation with Taylor 20 00:01:13,760 --> 00:01:17,080 Speaker 1: Frankie Paul and just how that's connected to modern dating 21 00:01:17,120 --> 00:01:18,919 Speaker 1: and what we're seeing in the dating world. 22 00:01:19,400 --> 00:01:19,960 Speaker 2: As a whole. 23 00:01:20,360 --> 00:01:23,639 Speaker 1: So I wanted to start with that because, as we mentioned, 24 00:01:23,680 --> 00:01:25,600 Speaker 1: you were a TV executive as well, so you have 25 00:01:25,840 --> 00:01:28,840 Speaker 1: a kind of interesting combination of working in the TV 26 00:01:28,959 --> 00:01:32,640 Speaker 1: world and now working in the relationship world. And this 27 00:01:32,840 --> 00:01:36,240 Speaker 1: was such a bizarre situation. So can you tell us 28 00:01:36,280 --> 00:01:39,480 Speaker 1: from your perspective, what did you initially think when you 29 00:01:39,560 --> 00:01:42,679 Speaker 1: saw the Bachelorette canceling this season? 30 00:01:43,360 --> 00:01:46,280 Speaker 2: Well, first of all, someone lost their job, probably more 31 00:01:46,319 --> 00:01:50,600 Speaker 2: than one person, right, Yes, they knew that. First of all, 32 00:01:50,680 --> 00:01:54,080 Speaker 2: if you've ever seen the Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, 33 00:01:54,120 --> 00:01:56,520 Speaker 2: that you already know that Taylor is a little unhinged, 34 00:01:56,640 --> 00:01:59,640 Speaker 2: right sure, yeah, you know, she's really unpredictable. And for 35 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:03,600 Speaker 2: reality TV, that's good TV nowadays. That's the formula. The 36 00:02:03,640 --> 00:02:06,920 Speaker 2: formula is, you know, taking unpredictable people and then giving 37 00:02:06,960 --> 00:02:08,840 Speaker 2: them a lot of alcohol and then turning on the 38 00:02:08,880 --> 00:02:11,760 Speaker 2: cameras and let's see what happens. And so that's what 39 00:02:11,919 --> 00:02:14,520 Speaker 2: happened here. But they did not predict it to go 40 00:02:14,639 --> 00:02:17,160 Speaker 2: to that level, to obviously where they're going to have 41 00:02:17,200 --> 00:02:20,399 Speaker 2: to cancel an entire season so that they don't lose 42 00:02:20,440 --> 00:02:24,200 Speaker 2: even bigger sponsorships and bigger advertisers right, because remember this 43 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:27,120 Speaker 2: is Disney that we're talking about. Whatever that means anymore, 44 00:02:27,160 --> 00:02:30,520 Speaker 2: whatever that means anymore. But uh so they didn't expect 45 00:02:30,560 --> 00:02:33,600 Speaker 2: it to, you know, for it to be that unhinged, 46 00:02:33,680 --> 00:02:36,799 Speaker 2: not that the actual Bachelorette season that we'll never see 47 00:02:36,919 --> 00:02:40,400 Speaker 2: was unhinged, but for her reputation to kind of go 48 00:02:40,480 --> 00:02:44,280 Speaker 2: to that level before, right before the premiere. And so 49 00:02:44,760 --> 00:02:47,240 Speaker 2: it's but you know it, we need to stop making 50 00:02:47,400 --> 00:02:52,160 Speaker 2: unhealthy people famous. We really need to stop, remember Jersey Shore, 51 00:02:52,320 --> 00:02:55,880 Speaker 2: We need to start making unhealthy people famous for ratings 52 00:02:55,880 --> 00:02:58,600 Speaker 2: because what's happening here. This is a real woman, This 53 00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:02,000 Speaker 2: is a real mother. She loves the camera, she loves 54 00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:04,440 Speaker 2: the fame, probably, but at the same at the same time, 55 00:03:04,480 --> 00:03:06,880 Speaker 2: she can't handle it. She can't handle it. Her life 56 00:03:06,919 --> 00:03:09,280 Speaker 2: already couldn't handle it, and now it's even worse for her. 57 00:03:09,680 --> 00:03:11,800 Speaker 2: And so is she the villain? I don't think that 58 00:03:11,840 --> 00:03:14,200 Speaker 2: she's the villain. I think that she's an unhealthy woman 59 00:03:14,320 --> 00:03:17,000 Speaker 2: who's been through a lot of trauma who now needs 60 00:03:17,040 --> 00:03:19,800 Speaker 2: a lot of therapy. Right, And so we're and so 61 00:03:19,880 --> 00:03:22,959 Speaker 2: at her expense, we're like having all of this fun 62 00:03:23,000 --> 00:03:24,720 Speaker 2: at her expense. And you know, it's really wrong. 63 00:03:24,760 --> 00:03:28,400 Speaker 1: Honestly, I totally agree. I could not agree more. And 64 00:03:28,440 --> 00:03:31,080 Speaker 1: I'm hoping that that some of these things falling apart 65 00:03:31,200 --> 00:03:33,240 Speaker 1: is actually going to bring that to the forefront of 66 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:37,120 Speaker 1: the conversation. But when you're seeing these dating shows in general, 67 00:03:37,680 --> 00:03:40,800 Speaker 1: you know, like I could watch The Bachelorette even now 68 00:03:40,840 --> 00:03:44,760 Speaker 1: without this Taylor Frankie Paul situation and go, are any 69 00:03:44,800 --> 00:03:47,160 Speaker 1: of these people actually in the place where they're looking 70 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:51,000 Speaker 1: for true love? They're ready for true love, They're in 71 00:03:51,040 --> 00:03:53,680 Speaker 1: a healthy place for that. Like, what is a person 72 00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:56,760 Speaker 1: like you observe when you're watching a dating show in 73 00:03:56,800 --> 00:03:57,600 Speaker 1: this day and age. 74 00:03:58,440 --> 00:04:01,480 Speaker 2: Well, I talk about non negotiables my new book Modernating Sucks, 75 00:04:01,480 --> 00:04:03,720 Speaker 2: and what you need to be looking for in a partner. 76 00:04:04,000 --> 00:04:06,800 Speaker 2: But even if they have qualities that are really good, 77 00:04:06,840 --> 00:04:09,080 Speaker 2: it doesn't mean that they're ready for marriage. So you're 78 00:04:09,120 --> 00:04:12,040 Speaker 2: making a good point. Even if they have the you know, 79 00:04:12,080 --> 00:04:16,440 Speaker 2: the qualities or the ingredients for someone who would someday 80 00:04:16,600 --> 00:04:18,760 Speaker 2: make a good husband and wife, it doesn't mean that 81 00:04:18,800 --> 00:04:21,240 Speaker 2: they're in that season. Now. I do think that these 82 00:04:21,320 --> 00:04:24,320 Speaker 2: casting calls bring in marriage minded people that are actually 83 00:04:24,360 --> 00:04:26,800 Speaker 2: marriage ready, as we can see with Christine and Vick 84 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:30,240 Speaker 2: from Love is Blind, but not the majority, because I 85 00:04:30,279 --> 00:04:32,360 Speaker 2: don't think that they're casting the majority. I think they're 86 00:04:32,400 --> 00:04:35,080 Speaker 2: purposely casting people that are going to make good television 87 00:04:35,640 --> 00:04:37,840 Speaker 2: and those that formula doesn't work, people that are going 88 00:04:37,880 --> 00:04:42,599 Speaker 2: to make good, salacious television, good you know, binge worthy TV, 89 00:04:43,160 --> 00:04:45,960 Speaker 2: and then you know, also be marriage minded. Those two 90 00:04:45,960 --> 00:04:47,880 Speaker 2: things don't go together. You can see that with Christine 91 00:04:47,880 --> 00:04:50,520 Speaker 2: and Vick not even getting any screen time because it 92 00:04:50,560 --> 00:04:53,360 Speaker 2: was boring. It was boring to what people were expecting, right, 93 00:04:53,440 --> 00:04:55,080 Speaker 2: But it was and a lot of times, And this 94 00:04:55,160 --> 00:04:58,080 Speaker 2: is a good point to make. Healthy is boring, and 95 00:04:58,120 --> 00:05:00,840 Speaker 2: it's important that people understand that healthy is a little 96 00:05:00,880 --> 00:05:05,039 Speaker 2: bit boring to watch. A healthy relationship wouldn't make really 97 00:05:05,080 --> 00:05:07,120 Speaker 2: exciting television, right. 98 00:05:07,279 --> 00:05:09,000 Speaker 1: I'm just I feel like you're in my brain. That's 99 00:05:09,000 --> 00:05:11,080 Speaker 1: why I started laughing, because these are the things that 100 00:05:11,120 --> 00:05:13,640 Speaker 1: I say all the time. I was on a reality 101 00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:17,800 Speaker 1: show temporarily for a couple of years, and I was 102 00:05:17,880 --> 00:05:21,160 Speaker 1: also called one of the most boring reality TV characters in. 103 00:05:21,080 --> 00:05:23,240 Speaker 2: The entire that's a compliment. 104 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:25,800 Speaker 1: I think of it that way now, but at the time, 105 00:05:25,839 --> 00:05:27,520 Speaker 1: I was like, wait, why am I so boring? But 106 00:05:27,600 --> 00:05:30,360 Speaker 1: it's because I wasn't doing the unhinged things that we're 107 00:05:30,360 --> 00:05:32,960 Speaker 1: so used to seeing on shows like this, and then 108 00:05:33,600 --> 00:05:35,839 Speaker 1: when things did come up for me, I wanted to 109 00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:38,800 Speaker 1: make real repair. I wanted to do things that I 110 00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:41,680 Speaker 1: had learned in therapy over the years and part of 111 00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:44,680 Speaker 1: my healing process and things like that. And that does 112 00:05:44,720 --> 00:05:47,159 Speaker 1: not make for good TV in the way that we're 113 00:05:47,600 --> 00:05:50,920 Speaker 1: used to it, to your point, And so we're casting 114 00:05:50,960 --> 00:05:56,920 Speaker 1: these people who have super serious relationship issues, massive unresolved trauma. 115 00:05:57,000 --> 00:05:59,440 Speaker 1: That's the thing I see over and over and over, 116 00:06:00,640 --> 00:06:05,760 Speaker 1: and we're watching their kind of like downfall for entertainment. 117 00:06:05,839 --> 00:06:07,880 Speaker 1: And it's the most bizarre thing to me that we're 118 00:06:07,920 --> 00:06:11,479 Speaker 1: watching people and actually so much pain and like taking 119 00:06:11,520 --> 00:06:13,920 Speaker 1: out the popcorn, as if that should be fun to watch. 120 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:16,320 Speaker 2: And I think people are forgetting that these people are 121 00:06:16,320 --> 00:06:19,480 Speaker 2: in pain, right, And of course the edit's not helping 122 00:06:19,640 --> 00:06:22,360 Speaker 2: the edits making things look even worse than they really are, 123 00:06:22,400 --> 00:06:25,680 Speaker 2: because obviously you want the edit to be the thing 124 00:06:25,720 --> 00:06:28,520 Speaker 2: that keeps people watching the next episode. But I think 125 00:06:28,560 --> 00:06:32,920 Speaker 2: that we have become so used to like highly produced 126 00:06:33,080 --> 00:06:35,719 Speaker 2: things that we forget that we're watching real lives and 127 00:06:35,720 --> 00:06:37,960 Speaker 2: real people. I think that we were there for the 128 00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:41,520 Speaker 2: entertainment value, and we at some level think it's fake. Yeah, 129 00:06:41,520 --> 00:06:44,440 Speaker 2: but it isn't. And what the danger of is. What 130 00:06:44,520 --> 00:06:46,599 Speaker 2: the danger I see as a dating coach and a 131 00:06:46,640 --> 00:06:50,480 Speaker 2: matchmaker of what's happening here is that we are seeing 132 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:53,760 Speaker 2: so much of what people are afraid of in relationship, 133 00:06:54,160 --> 00:06:56,599 Speaker 2: and even if it's entertaining them in the moment, it's 134 00:06:56,640 --> 00:06:59,559 Speaker 2: also still programming them to believe that there's just nothing 135 00:06:59,640 --> 00:07:00,799 Speaker 2: real life out there anymore. 136 00:07:01,440 --> 00:07:04,560 Speaker 1: That is an interesting point. So, yeah, we're watching it 137 00:07:04,600 --> 00:07:07,880 Speaker 1: subconsciously taking in all of these things, thinking this is 138 00:07:07,920 --> 00:07:10,840 Speaker 1: all that's out there right right, Yeah, And. 139 00:07:11,200 --> 00:07:14,560 Speaker 2: They're casting let's take the guys for example, they're casting 140 00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:19,800 Speaker 2: the worst case scenario. They're casting the guys that women 141 00:07:19,920 --> 00:07:22,120 Speaker 2: post on these girl run and are we dating the 142 00:07:22,120 --> 00:07:25,680 Speaker 2: same guy pages they're posting those, They're casting these type 143 00:07:25,720 --> 00:07:29,600 Speaker 2: of guys, and it is just reinforcing what women are 144 00:07:29,640 --> 00:07:32,600 Speaker 2: believing in that is all matter trash, Yeah right, this 145 00:07:32,720 --> 00:07:35,440 Speaker 2: is what they're beginning to believe, and they're reinforcing that 146 00:07:35,800 --> 00:07:38,960 Speaker 2: through these dating shows. These guys that only want sex, 147 00:07:39,000 --> 00:07:42,720 Speaker 2: these guys that have avoidant attachment, They can't stay committed 148 00:07:42,760 --> 00:07:45,000 Speaker 2: for even five seconds. Are already looking at someone else, 149 00:07:45,040 --> 00:07:47,560 Speaker 2: already interested some interested in someone else. As soon as 150 00:07:47,800 --> 00:07:51,240 Speaker 2: commitment topic comes up, they're pulling away. They're you know, 151 00:07:51,320 --> 00:07:54,880 Speaker 2: pushing and pulling and breadcrumbing all the things right there 152 00:07:54,920 --> 00:07:56,000 Speaker 2: for your viewing pleasure. 153 00:07:56,480 --> 00:07:59,280 Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, you know what's interesting is I started watching 154 00:07:59,400 --> 00:08:02,920 Speaker 1: I watched Love is Blind, Love Island. I don't really 155 00:08:02,960 --> 00:08:05,920 Speaker 1: watch The Bachelorette anymore because it did become so overproduced. 156 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:09,200 Speaker 1: But I find those shows to be such a fascinating 157 00:08:09,280 --> 00:08:12,120 Speaker 1: case study in human behavior, and that's what draws me in, 158 00:08:12,280 --> 00:08:15,800 Speaker 1: Like it's like literally looking at Okay, well, that's anxious 159 00:08:15,840 --> 00:08:19,400 Speaker 1: attachment that I mean, you can diagnose just by observing, 160 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:22,600 Speaker 1: And for me, that's an interesting learning experience and also 161 00:08:22,680 --> 00:08:25,160 Speaker 1: kind of opening my eyes up to the fact that 162 00:08:25,680 --> 00:08:28,400 Speaker 1: the majority of our population seems like it does not 163 00:08:28,600 --> 00:08:32,400 Speaker 1: know how to be in relationship. So from a perspective 164 00:08:32,440 --> 00:08:37,839 Speaker 1: of like a dating coach and a relationship expert, the 165 00:08:37,880 --> 00:08:41,079 Speaker 1: toxicity we're seeing on TV is that what you find 166 00:08:41,120 --> 00:08:43,160 Speaker 1: when your clients are coming to you, like, is that 167 00:08:43,200 --> 00:08:45,920 Speaker 1: the majority or is this just like what we're observing 168 00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:46,800 Speaker 1: on reality TV? 169 00:08:47,800 --> 00:08:50,760 Speaker 2: I unfortunately think that it's more and more people and 170 00:08:50,880 --> 00:08:53,120 Speaker 2: you know, you're able to look at those shows objectively 171 00:08:53,320 --> 00:08:56,840 Speaker 2: and see the why behind the what. But a lot 172 00:08:56,880 --> 00:08:58,760 Speaker 2: of people aren't. A lot of people will look at 173 00:08:58,760 --> 00:09:01,280 Speaker 2: those shows and they'll just this is how all women are, 174 00:09:01,440 --> 00:09:04,800 Speaker 2: this is how all men are. And that's the danger, honestly, 175 00:09:04,880 --> 00:09:07,120 Speaker 2: because we're not looking at it objectively. We don't know 176 00:09:07,160 --> 00:09:09,719 Speaker 2: what this person's life has been like, what their childhood 177 00:09:09,800 --> 00:09:12,320 Speaker 2: was like. You know, we're not their therapist, and so 178 00:09:12,440 --> 00:09:15,840 Speaker 2: we're just judging them based on some hot takes sure 179 00:09:15,960 --> 00:09:18,559 Speaker 2: that we're seeing in reality television and the edit. We're 180 00:09:18,600 --> 00:09:20,640 Speaker 2: judging them based on the edit. So it's the worst 181 00:09:20,640 --> 00:09:23,240 Speaker 2: of the worst, right, and so it's important that we 182 00:09:23,320 --> 00:09:27,600 Speaker 2: remember that. But I am seeing art imitating life for sure. 183 00:09:28,040 --> 00:09:30,439 Speaker 2: I am seeing a lot of people showing up having 184 00:09:30,480 --> 00:09:33,280 Speaker 2: not done the work, you know, not taking time to 185 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:36,120 Speaker 2: really get self aware or introspective about what they need 186 00:09:36,160 --> 00:09:38,160 Speaker 2: to do owning their side of the street, and still 187 00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:41,720 Speaker 2: just want to hop in a relationship. I'm seeing a 188 00:09:41,720 --> 00:09:43,960 Speaker 2: lot of that. I'm seeing people that are just not 189 00:09:44,320 --> 00:09:47,640 Speaker 2: even a little bit willing to take a look in 190 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:48,040 Speaker 2: the mirror. 191 00:09:48,559 --> 00:09:50,160 Speaker 1: Wow, that's scary to me. 192 00:09:52,360 --> 00:09:54,520 Speaker 2: Well, if you're not in the dating streets, maybe stay 193 00:09:54,559 --> 00:09:55,560 Speaker 2: out of them right now? 194 00:09:56,880 --> 00:09:58,720 Speaker 1: Thankfully? 195 00:09:58,800 --> 00:09:59,959 Speaker 2: Great. Yeah. 196 00:10:00,400 --> 00:10:02,080 Speaker 1: I know in your work and in the new book, 197 00:10:02,120 --> 00:10:05,160 Speaker 1: you talk a lot about how past toxic relationships shape 198 00:10:05,160 --> 00:10:07,920 Speaker 1: your current patterns. So can you talk a little bit 199 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:10,720 Speaker 1: about that and what are you seeing when people are 200 00:10:10,720 --> 00:10:13,880 Speaker 1: coming to you They have a lot of toxic relationship 201 00:10:13,960 --> 00:10:17,600 Speaker 1: past and how is that showing up in their current 202 00:10:17,720 --> 00:10:20,320 Speaker 1: dating life, especially obviously if they have not done any 203 00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:20,920 Speaker 1: work around that. 204 00:10:21,520 --> 00:10:23,480 Speaker 2: You know, here's the thing, I think more people think 205 00:10:23,480 --> 00:10:26,080 Speaker 2: that they're doing more work than they've ever done. The 206 00:10:26,160 --> 00:10:28,520 Speaker 2: problem is is that we're just getting a lot of 207 00:10:28,559 --> 00:10:32,920 Speaker 2: therapy language. That's what's happening. People are talking about boundaries, right, 208 00:10:32,960 --> 00:10:35,360 Speaker 2: They're talking about things that are good, but they're not 209 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:38,240 Speaker 2: actually employing those things. They don't know what that looks 210 00:10:38,280 --> 00:10:41,280 Speaker 2: like in real life, and so they know the language, 211 00:10:41,400 --> 00:10:44,000 Speaker 2: they know what things are supposed to look like, but 212 00:10:44,240 --> 00:10:47,480 Speaker 2: theoretically but not in practice. And I'm seeing this a 213 00:10:47,520 --> 00:10:50,160 Speaker 2: lot with the people that continue to latherans repeat the 214 00:10:50,160 --> 00:10:53,280 Speaker 2: same relationships, because you have to feel the fields to 215 00:10:53,360 --> 00:10:55,360 Speaker 2: heal the fields, and a lot of people really aren't 216 00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:59,079 Speaker 2: willing to sit in that for a little while. They 217 00:10:59,120 --> 00:11:00,920 Speaker 2: just want to say, Okay, hey, well, I learned about 218 00:11:00,920 --> 00:11:02,520 Speaker 2: this and now I'm going to go out and practice 219 00:11:02,520 --> 00:11:05,320 Speaker 2: it in real life. And that just isn't working because 220 00:11:05,360 --> 00:11:07,760 Speaker 2: you have to take some time with yourself. Everyone needs 221 00:11:07,760 --> 00:11:10,000 Speaker 2: a healing season, and I think a lot of people 222 00:11:10,280 --> 00:11:13,240 Speaker 2: are not willing to take that healing season, or the 223 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:15,760 Speaker 2: antithesis of that is that they stay in the healing 224 00:11:15,800 --> 00:11:19,719 Speaker 2: season forever. Yeah, and they're always I'm not ready, I'm 225 00:11:19,760 --> 00:11:22,080 Speaker 2: not ready. I'm not ready. Well, you're never gonna know 226 00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:25,760 Speaker 2: if you're ready until you put yourself in a situation 227 00:11:25,920 --> 00:11:28,560 Speaker 2: that's going to see what triggers are still coming up 228 00:11:28,559 --> 00:11:30,839 Speaker 2: in the art. So we need to see and we're 229 00:11:30,880 --> 00:11:32,680 Speaker 2: not going to see if you're not willing to try 230 00:11:32,679 --> 00:11:43,000 Speaker 2: that out. Relationship help do. 231 00:11:43,160 --> 00:11:46,520 Speaker 1: Our past relationships impact our current situations. 232 00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:49,400 Speaker 2: I think that they impact us greatly if we allow 233 00:11:49,480 --> 00:11:52,240 Speaker 2: them to, if we haven't unpacked them. So we have 234 00:11:52,360 --> 00:11:54,800 Speaker 2: to take a look at our childhood. People will be like, oh, 235 00:11:54,840 --> 00:11:57,560 Speaker 2: well I had great parents. Sure, it's not about having 236 00:11:57,679 --> 00:12:00,920 Speaker 2: terrible parents or a beautiful parents. And the people that 237 00:12:01,120 --> 00:12:04,320 Speaker 2: know that they've come from an abusive environment are more 238 00:12:04,520 --> 00:12:06,640 Speaker 2: willing to look than the people that came from a 239 00:12:06,679 --> 00:12:12,040 Speaker 2: good environment that still was unhealthy, still had unhealthy dynamics, 240 00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:16,679 Speaker 2: really still had some attachments, tiles, some codependency, possibly some 241 00:12:17,360 --> 00:12:20,839 Speaker 2: covert passive aggressive control. It's important to take a look 242 00:12:20,880 --> 00:12:23,360 Speaker 2: at that because you're almost always going to play that 243 00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:28,400 Speaker 2: out in your adult relationships. It's okay to look at 244 00:12:28,440 --> 00:12:30,640 Speaker 2: it without saying, oh, it was it was bad. I 245 00:12:30,640 --> 00:12:33,000 Speaker 2: think a lot of people think that if they look 246 00:12:33,000 --> 00:12:37,079 Speaker 2: at their childhood, they're somehow disrespecting or dishonoring their family, 247 00:12:37,120 --> 00:12:38,079 Speaker 2: and that's just not true. 248 00:12:39,360 --> 00:12:42,080 Speaker 1: One of the things I often hear, and obviously this 249 00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:43,599 Speaker 1: is amongst my friend groups, so it's a lot of 250 00:12:43,640 --> 00:12:45,800 Speaker 1: women saying this, But when they're talking about the current 251 00:12:45,880 --> 00:12:48,560 Speaker 1: dating situations and being on apps and things like that, 252 00:12:49,000 --> 00:12:50,920 Speaker 1: a lot of it goes to ugh, like there's no 253 00:12:51,080 --> 00:12:53,760 Speaker 1: good guys out there. So what do you say when 254 00:12:53,840 --> 00:12:55,760 Speaker 1: someone comes to you and they say, well, it's just 255 00:12:55,800 --> 00:12:58,839 Speaker 1: because dating sucks. This is why I'm having bad luck. 256 00:12:58,880 --> 00:13:01,480 Speaker 1: It's because dating sucks. There's no good people out there. 257 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:04,040 Speaker 1: It must just be like I have bad luck. 258 00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:06,920 Speaker 2: Well, the very first thing that I'll tell them is, 259 00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:09,080 Speaker 2: you know, and we hear this a lot and people 260 00:13:09,080 --> 00:13:11,359 Speaker 2: are sick of hearing it, but you're the common denominator 261 00:13:11,360 --> 00:13:13,600 Speaker 2: and all your experiences, right, So you got to take 262 00:13:13,600 --> 00:13:16,319 Speaker 2: a look at yourself, right, because you are the only 263 00:13:16,400 --> 00:13:18,760 Speaker 2: thing that is the same in each one of your 264 00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:21,760 Speaker 2: dating experiences. And the other thing that we need to 265 00:13:21,760 --> 00:13:24,160 Speaker 2: remember is we only need one We only need one 266 00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:26,520 Speaker 2: healthy person. We only need one person that's willing to 267 00:13:26,520 --> 00:13:29,880 Speaker 2: do the work with us, because relationship is work. You know, 268 00:13:29,960 --> 00:13:34,120 Speaker 2: you asked how you pass relationships affect our current relationships, Well, 269 00:13:34,160 --> 00:13:36,839 Speaker 2: they do affect it, but even relationships that we were 270 00:13:36,880 --> 00:13:40,559 Speaker 2: never in affect our current relationships, meaning all of the 271 00:13:40,600 --> 00:13:43,600 Speaker 2: stuff that we grew up watching on TV, all of 272 00:13:43,600 --> 00:13:47,760 Speaker 2: the movies, all of the music, because that really it 273 00:13:47,800 --> 00:13:50,600 Speaker 2: painted a picture of what we think love is supposed 274 00:13:50,640 --> 00:13:53,240 Speaker 2: to look and feel like. And nobody takes a minute 275 00:13:53,240 --> 00:13:57,040 Speaker 2: to sit down and ask themselves, where did I learn 276 00:13:57,280 --> 00:13:59,320 Speaker 2: what love is supposed to feel and look like? That 277 00:13:59,440 --> 00:14:02,680 Speaker 2: is such an important question because if you play the 278 00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:05,720 Speaker 2: tapes back and you retrace it, you're going to find 279 00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:07,960 Speaker 2: out that a lot of things that you believe about 280 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:10,440 Speaker 2: it are not good and they're not leading you to 281 00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:11,480 Speaker 2: a good place. 282 00:14:11,679 --> 00:14:14,160 Speaker 1: And they're driving your decisions, right, I think that's what 283 00:14:14,280 --> 00:14:16,720 Speaker 1: they are. Next, we think we can just think something 284 00:14:16,840 --> 00:14:18,960 Speaker 1: or have come from something, but oh blah blah blah, 285 00:14:18,960 --> 00:14:22,480 Speaker 1: that was in the past. But yeah, consciously, it's the picker, 286 00:14:22,640 --> 00:14:24,960 Speaker 1: right that we hear about. That's what you're picking from. 287 00:14:25,520 --> 00:14:27,880 Speaker 2: Behavior follows identity, and if you're not willing to do 288 00:14:27,960 --> 00:14:31,200 Speaker 2: identity work, then your behavior is going to be on autopilot. Yeah, 289 00:14:31,240 --> 00:14:33,480 Speaker 2: eighty percent of what you do is unconscious. So if 290 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:36,520 Speaker 2: you're not willing to look at the unconscious belief systems 291 00:14:36,520 --> 00:14:40,160 Speaker 2: that are driving behavior, you're going to stay stuck. I 292 00:14:40,160 --> 00:14:42,400 Speaker 2: always say you're stuck on the inside, not the outside, 293 00:14:42,400 --> 00:14:43,480 Speaker 2: because it just is true. 294 00:14:43,920 --> 00:14:45,680 Speaker 1: What do you mean by that, You're. 295 00:14:45,560 --> 00:14:47,800 Speaker 2: Stuck on the inside, Like we think that if we 296 00:14:47,920 --> 00:14:49,920 Speaker 2: change all this stuff on the outside, this is where 297 00:14:49,920 --> 00:14:52,240 Speaker 2: we're stuck. This is and let's not even take it 298 00:14:52,280 --> 00:14:54,720 Speaker 2: into romance, like, oh, I want to lose weight, I'm 299 00:14:54,720 --> 00:14:56,440 Speaker 2: stuck because I don't go to the gym. If I 300 00:14:56,480 --> 00:14:58,120 Speaker 2: go to the gym, then I'm going to get on stock. 301 00:14:58,400 --> 00:15:00,280 Speaker 2: If I stop using my credit card, I'm to get 302 00:15:00,280 --> 00:15:02,400 Speaker 2: out of debt. Like we think we're stuck on the outside, 303 00:15:02,800 --> 00:15:05,440 Speaker 2: but we're really stuck inside in a belief system that's 304 00:15:05,520 --> 00:15:07,040 Speaker 2: driving that outward behavior. 305 00:15:07,600 --> 00:15:10,080 Speaker 1: So instead of saying it's the gym's fault, It's like, well, 306 00:15:10,120 --> 00:15:12,440 Speaker 1: why do I stop myself from going to the gym 307 00:15:12,720 --> 00:15:14,200 Speaker 1: or asking the deeper questions? 308 00:15:14,600 --> 00:15:17,400 Speaker 2: The chances of it not being fat and really being 309 00:15:17,480 --> 00:15:20,960 Speaker 2: hurt are really high. Ah, that is not fat, It's 310 00:15:21,040 --> 00:15:22,680 Speaker 2: hurt probably somehow. 311 00:15:23,400 --> 00:15:25,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, let's talk about red flags, and I think we 312 00:15:25,880 --> 00:15:28,760 Speaker 1: can circle back to Taylor on this part of the conversation, 313 00:15:28,960 --> 00:15:31,400 Speaker 1: but we go back to the things we know, right, 314 00:15:31,440 --> 00:15:33,480 Speaker 1: and you will see the red flags. And I've been 315 00:15:33,480 --> 00:15:35,720 Speaker 1: in situations like this in my past. I know the 316 00:15:35,760 --> 00:15:38,600 Speaker 1: red flags, and I still will get back into relationship 317 00:15:38,640 --> 00:15:41,880 Speaker 1: with this person, which we've seen Taylor do multiple times 318 00:15:41,960 --> 00:15:45,440 Speaker 1: with this Dakota guy. And before if you again watch 319 00:15:45,480 --> 00:15:48,160 Speaker 1: Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, before she left for the bachelorette, 320 00:15:48,280 --> 00:15:51,120 Speaker 1: the pattern was repeating. Then we heard it happened after, 321 00:15:51,280 --> 00:15:54,000 Speaker 1: and that was a part of why all this domestic 322 00:15:54,040 --> 00:15:58,640 Speaker 1: violent stuff got brought to the forefront again. Obviously, I 323 00:15:58,640 --> 00:16:02,120 Speaker 1: think Dakota is also as toxic, if not more whatever, 324 00:16:02,200 --> 00:16:05,360 Speaker 1: But let's talk a little bit about red flags. Why 325 00:16:05,400 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 1: do we continue to just keep repeating patterns like that 326 00:16:08,640 --> 00:16:11,560 Speaker 1: like we see with Taylor in the coda, because. 327 00:16:11,240 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 2: We like them. I mean, just that's a short answer. 328 00:16:13,840 --> 00:16:17,120 Speaker 2: The short answer is that we like them. It's not 329 00:16:17,200 --> 00:16:19,200 Speaker 2: that there are no good guys left. It's like we 330 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:22,560 Speaker 2: don't like the good guys, right, because those those don't 331 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:26,040 Speaker 2: ignite our nervous system. You know, all red flags are 332 00:16:26,320 --> 00:16:30,000 Speaker 2: is just a covert language for something that you know 333 00:16:30,040 --> 00:16:33,400 Speaker 2: gets your adrenaline going, that gets your dopamine going. And 334 00:16:33,640 --> 00:16:35,480 Speaker 2: this is what happens a lot of people don't know 335 00:16:35,520 --> 00:16:39,120 Speaker 2: how to tell the difference between excitement and anxiety. You know, 336 00:16:39,120 --> 00:16:42,640 Speaker 2: they're very, very similar feelings, and we are attracted to 337 00:16:42,640 --> 00:16:45,160 Speaker 2: the red flags. Let's talk about Taylor for a second. 338 00:16:45,280 --> 00:16:48,760 Speaker 2: I think that a healthy man would be extremely boring 339 00:16:48,800 --> 00:16:52,680 Speaker 2: for her. I think that she lives in the excitement, 340 00:16:52,800 --> 00:16:55,840 Speaker 2: in the adrenaline. I think she definitely does, and that's 341 00:16:55,880 --> 00:16:58,080 Speaker 2: something that she'll need to take a really deep look at. 342 00:16:58,400 --> 00:17:02,160 Speaker 2: But so many people are like this. I can't even 343 00:17:02,200 --> 00:17:04,919 Speaker 2: tell you how many clients or students I have that 344 00:17:05,000 --> 00:17:07,840 Speaker 2: will come back from a date and I will check 345 00:17:07,880 --> 00:17:12,040 Speaker 2: in and they will say, yeah, they were great, it 346 00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:16,240 Speaker 2: was nice, But I didn't feel a spark or I 347 00:17:16,280 --> 00:17:19,359 Speaker 2: didn't feel any romantic feelings. Well, first of all, you 348 00:17:19,359 --> 00:17:21,200 Speaker 2: don't even know them, so you don't have to feel 349 00:17:21,200 --> 00:17:24,960 Speaker 2: anything romantic on day one, and a lot of times 350 00:17:24,960 --> 00:17:27,439 Speaker 2: people won't even give that a chance because we believe. 351 00:17:27,480 --> 00:17:29,879 Speaker 2: And let's go back once again to where did our 352 00:17:29,880 --> 00:17:33,160 Speaker 2: belief systems about love come from. We believe if it's 353 00:17:33,160 --> 00:17:36,280 Speaker 2: not a lightning bolt, if it's not instant, and then 354 00:17:36,320 --> 00:17:38,040 Speaker 2: it's not going to be powerful, it's not going to 355 00:17:38,040 --> 00:17:41,240 Speaker 2: be love. But it doesn't have to feel that way, 356 00:17:41,240 --> 00:17:43,840 Speaker 2: but so many people think it does. And Taylor obviously 357 00:17:43,920 --> 00:17:46,280 Speaker 2: is one of those people. She's in it for the passion, 358 00:17:46,359 --> 00:17:49,960 Speaker 2: she's in it for the roller coaster, and obviously getting 359 00:17:49,960 --> 00:17:51,760 Speaker 2: off that ride is going to be important for her 360 00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:55,640 Speaker 2: because now it's starting to affect her children, her mental health, 361 00:17:55,680 --> 00:17:58,719 Speaker 2: her physical health, and a lot of women, even if 362 00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:02,000 Speaker 2: they wouldn't admit it on television, they are to that 363 00:18:02,119 --> 00:18:05,159 Speaker 2: point too. They're to that point where they're starting to 364 00:18:05,200 --> 00:18:09,160 Speaker 2: have all kinds of physical and mental health issues because 365 00:18:09,200 --> 00:18:11,480 Speaker 2: of the guys that they've been dating, because of their 366 00:18:11,760 --> 00:18:14,760 Speaker 2: because of their romantic life and where it has been. 367 00:18:16,240 --> 00:18:20,280 Speaker 1: Let's connect the dots between our current dating situations and 368 00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:23,840 Speaker 1: childhood upbringing. And I'm gonna use Taylor again as an example. 369 00:18:23,880 --> 00:18:25,520 Speaker 1: But one of the things I don't know if you 370 00:18:25,560 --> 00:18:28,280 Speaker 1: actually watch Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, but I watch 371 00:18:28,400 --> 00:18:32,439 Speaker 1: the show and it's again, it's a fascinating case study 372 00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:35,280 Speaker 1: to me and those girls. I'm watching the show being like, Ooh, 373 00:18:35,320 --> 00:18:37,080 Speaker 1: they're going to regret putting that out there. Oh They're 374 00:18:37,080 --> 00:18:38,880 Speaker 1: going to regret, Like over and over. There's so many 375 00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:41,640 Speaker 1: of these over sharing moments that I know feel good 376 00:18:41,640 --> 00:18:43,800 Speaker 1: to them right now, but from experience, I'm like, oof, 377 00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:47,919 Speaker 1: this is bad. But with Taylor specifically, part of what 378 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:50,440 Speaker 1: I see with her in Dakota is that she'll start 379 00:18:50,520 --> 00:18:54,919 Speaker 1: crying and grieving of like wanting the family unit to 380 00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:57,679 Speaker 1: be together. Yeah, and then when you talk you look 381 00:18:57,720 --> 00:18:59,879 Speaker 1: at her conversations with her mom, and then you know, 382 00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:04,240 Speaker 1: obviously never knowing her biological father, I just wonder how 383 00:19:04,359 --> 00:19:07,320 Speaker 1: much of the grief is actually about that. And so 384 00:19:07,359 --> 00:19:10,680 Speaker 1: she's trying to Obviously she just got pregnant with Dakota, 385 00:19:10,800 --> 00:19:13,800 Speaker 1: so her nervous system is like hook to him, and 386 00:19:13,840 --> 00:19:17,560 Speaker 1: so she keeps trying to make that work, almost immbraining 387 00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:20,960 Speaker 1: to resolve what happened in her childhood? Is that is 388 00:19:21,000 --> 00:19:23,199 Speaker 1: there some truth there? What are you noticing with that, 389 00:19:23,320 --> 00:19:25,960 Speaker 1: and can you explain how that works to the listeners. 390 00:19:26,600 --> 00:19:29,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it definitely is something that people do. 391 00:19:29,359 --> 00:19:32,360 Speaker 2: They try to resolve things from their past and their 392 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:35,640 Speaker 2: current relationships. And so a lot of times when we're 393 00:19:35,640 --> 00:19:38,399 Speaker 2: attracted to someone, what we're really saying is they feel 394 00:19:38,520 --> 00:19:44,080 Speaker 2: they feel familiar. Something about the connection feels familiar, and 395 00:19:44,320 --> 00:19:47,439 Speaker 2: that's not always a good thing, like in Taylor's situation. So, 396 00:19:47,920 --> 00:19:50,080 Speaker 2: I mean, have you ever wondered why you walk into 397 00:19:50,240 --> 00:19:53,560 Speaker 2: a room, a bar, a restaurant, a party and there's 398 00:19:53,640 --> 00:19:56,639 Speaker 2: lots of people there, but you're attracted to this person. 399 00:19:57,480 --> 00:20:00,280 Speaker 1: Well, everyone thinks that's the spark you were talking about. 400 00:20:00,480 --> 00:20:03,520 Speaker 2: Exactly, But when you really think about it, you know 401 00:20:03,600 --> 00:20:07,280 Speaker 2: what's attracting you is there's a familiarity, there's a frequency 402 00:20:07,359 --> 00:20:10,120 Speaker 2: that's happened here. You don't even have to talk to them, 403 00:20:10,200 --> 00:20:13,480 Speaker 2: and that is your type and you just know it immediately. Now, 404 00:20:13,520 --> 00:20:15,240 Speaker 2: a lot of times people will say, well there isn't 405 00:20:15,280 --> 00:20:17,480 Speaker 2: any good people left, Well, there's probably a good person 406 00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:20,240 Speaker 2: standing next to that person, but you didn't notice them, 407 00:20:20,640 --> 00:20:23,439 Speaker 2: because once again, you're making a bee line. And I've 408 00:20:23,480 --> 00:20:26,680 Speaker 2: actually watched it. I've put together like in person events 409 00:20:27,119 --> 00:20:30,159 Speaker 2: and I've actually purposely invited people that I know are 410 00:20:30,160 --> 00:20:31,720 Speaker 2: going to make a bee line for each other for 411 00:20:31,760 --> 00:20:33,800 Speaker 2: these very reasons to just kind of watch it in 412 00:20:33,840 --> 00:20:36,439 Speaker 2: real time to see if it happens, to see if 413 00:20:36,480 --> 00:20:38,520 Speaker 2: it happened in their real time, you know, and it 414 00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:42,160 Speaker 2: always does. Those two people never heard of each other 415 00:20:42,200 --> 00:20:44,200 Speaker 2: in their lives, never met each other in their lives, 416 00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:47,520 Speaker 2: but because of what I know about their personalities, their types, 417 00:20:47,520 --> 00:20:50,239 Speaker 2: and even their trauma, I know that they're going to 418 00:20:50,280 --> 00:20:54,280 Speaker 2: immediately find each other. And they always do. They always do. 419 00:20:54,760 --> 00:20:56,680 Speaker 2: And so this is a you know, obviously a huge 420 00:20:56,720 --> 00:20:59,719 Speaker 2: advertisement for doing the heart work. But I think that 421 00:21:00,040 --> 00:21:03,560 Speaker 2: you know, we saw interactions with Taylor's mom and it 422 00:21:03,640 --> 00:21:06,679 Speaker 2: was really sad because remember it's about the edit, and 423 00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:08,679 Speaker 2: so they showed the worst of the worst. But at 424 00:21:08,680 --> 00:21:11,920 Speaker 2: the same time, you know, I have three adult children. 425 00:21:12,200 --> 00:21:14,800 Speaker 2: I could not imagine talking to them that way, telling 426 00:21:14,840 --> 00:21:17,959 Speaker 2: them that even if they had messed up, even if 427 00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:21,440 Speaker 2: they had destroyed their lives, saying to them like, you know, 428 00:21:21,720 --> 00:21:26,000 Speaker 2: I you know what was her wording? She was just like, 429 00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:29,720 Speaker 2: you know, she caught her dumb, but she said something 430 00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:31,720 Speaker 2: else like not I'm disappointed in you, but she said 431 00:21:31,760 --> 00:21:34,920 Speaker 2: something like, you know, you're an embarrassment kind of thing. 432 00:21:35,520 --> 00:21:37,840 Speaker 2: I couldn't even imagine saying that I don't care what 433 00:21:37,880 --> 00:21:40,359 Speaker 2: my kids have done. I couldn't imagine saying that to them. 434 00:21:41,040 --> 00:21:43,520 Speaker 2: That would break my heart to say that. So what 435 00:21:43,520 --> 00:21:48,000 Speaker 2: we're seeing is is we're probably seeing generational trauma repeating itself. 436 00:21:48,520 --> 00:21:50,760 Speaker 2: Mom just didn't come up with those words on her own. 437 00:21:51,320 --> 00:21:53,919 Speaker 2: She heard those words from someone as well. And so 438 00:21:53,960 --> 00:21:56,560 Speaker 2: now we see that repeating itself, and we're seeing that 439 00:21:56,600 --> 00:22:00,320 Speaker 2: in Taylor's decisions. It's kind of like a self fulfilling prophecy. 440 00:22:00,440 --> 00:22:02,560 Speaker 2: People are telling you that you're an embarrassment, they're telling 441 00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:05,440 Speaker 2: you that you're dumb, they're telling you that whatever else 442 00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:07,280 Speaker 2: was being said, I can't remember right off the top 443 00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:09,000 Speaker 2: of my head. But then now you're playing it out 444 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:09,480 Speaker 2: in real. 445 00:22:09,359 --> 00:22:12,160 Speaker 1: Time, right, which is wild. So it's like you get 446 00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:15,280 Speaker 1: the shame that gets activated, and then you start making 447 00:22:15,320 --> 00:22:18,360 Speaker 1: that the reality because you're like, well, they said I'm 448 00:22:18,560 --> 00:22:21,119 Speaker 1: an embarrassment, I'm all these things, then I must be. 449 00:22:21,359 --> 00:22:23,880 Speaker 1: So you start believing that too and then acting as 450 00:22:23,920 --> 00:22:24,720 Speaker 1: if you are. 451 00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:29,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, because it becomes an identity. It's an identity situation. 452 00:22:29,640 --> 00:22:32,200 Speaker 2: It's not that I believe I've done something bad. It's 453 00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:35,359 Speaker 2: I believe I am bad and that is just what happens. 454 00:22:35,359 --> 00:22:37,679 Speaker 2: And what do bad teef people do. They do bad things, 455 00:22:38,600 --> 00:22:39,600 Speaker 2: make bad decisions. 456 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:51,000 Speaker 1: Right, So once we start doing the healing work, it's 457 00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:53,840 Speaker 1: people are listening and they're like, okay, well then how 458 00:22:53,880 --> 00:22:56,800 Speaker 1: would I know? Like I dive. I feel like I've 459 00:22:57,000 --> 00:22:59,399 Speaker 1: looked at my past. I feel like I'm doing this work. 460 00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:02,600 Speaker 1: When will I be ready to make a different decision 461 00:23:02,680 --> 00:23:04,760 Speaker 1: and not pick the red flag relationship? 462 00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:07,560 Speaker 2: I think that what people can do to see if 463 00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:10,199 Speaker 2: they really have done the work, done the work, is 464 00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:14,560 Speaker 2: that they can walk back words from the last situation, 465 00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:18,080 Speaker 2: from the last conversation, from the last talking stage, or 466 00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:22,120 Speaker 2: even relationship that went wrong. They can walk backwards, why 467 00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:24,399 Speaker 2: did I choose this person? Why did it come to this? 468 00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:28,200 Speaker 2: They can start walking backwards to the root belief system 469 00:23:28,480 --> 00:23:31,359 Speaker 2: of why they made those decisions in the first place. 470 00:23:31,560 --> 00:23:34,280 Speaker 2: We don't get what we expect until we get what 471 00:23:34,320 --> 00:23:37,200 Speaker 2: we inspect. We have to inspect what's happening. It's not 472 00:23:37,320 --> 00:23:40,200 Speaker 2: out just raising your expectations that there's someone out there 473 00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:41,920 Speaker 2: for me and I'm going to fall in love. You 474 00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:44,760 Speaker 2: got to inspect what you think that means, what you 475 00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:47,240 Speaker 2: believe about that, and what you think that that feels 476 00:23:47,320 --> 00:23:49,520 Speaker 2: like and looks like before you go back out there. 477 00:23:50,280 --> 00:23:52,920 Speaker 1: What are some signs that someone is dating from their 478 00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:56,679 Speaker 1: wounding still versus when they're dating from a grounded place. 479 00:23:57,480 --> 00:23:58,960 Speaker 2: It just keeps turning out badly. 480 00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:00,920 Speaker 1: I mean the results. 481 00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:04,000 Speaker 2: Its yeah, the results, I mean the product. And a 482 00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:06,520 Speaker 2: lot of people will try to fix it instead of 483 00:24:06,600 --> 00:24:09,399 Speaker 2: just calling it and saying, you know, I did it again, 484 00:24:09,600 --> 00:24:11,720 Speaker 2: They'll try to fix it. They'll start, they'll they'll be 485 00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:16,760 Speaker 2: in the relationship overfunctioning, trying to make it work. You 486 00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:19,160 Speaker 2: have no you have no idea how many women do this. 487 00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:21,399 Speaker 1: I don't see men because I was one of them. 488 00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:24,320 Speaker 2: Oh there you go. But I don't see men do 489 00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:27,040 Speaker 2: this as much. But women have a tendency to like, 490 00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:30,359 Speaker 2: oh crap, I picked the wrong guy again. Let me 491 00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:34,240 Speaker 2: let me make him the right guy. What can I 492 00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:35,880 Speaker 2: do to make him the right guy? 493 00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:38,840 Speaker 1: Because you saw that glimpse of one little bit of 494 00:24:38,920 --> 00:24:42,280 Speaker 1: potential and you're like, but I think it's there. You know, 495 00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:43,359 Speaker 1: we have a gift. 496 00:24:44,040 --> 00:24:46,760 Speaker 2: The femine has a gift to see potential. I have 497 00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:48,760 Speaker 2: a gift to see potential. We have a gift that 498 00:24:48,840 --> 00:24:50,479 Speaker 2: you know, we have the gift of nurture, And what 499 00:24:50,600 --> 00:24:53,879 Speaker 2: nurture really means is being able to see potential and 500 00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:56,440 Speaker 2: bring it out. And that's good for raising children, it's 501 00:24:56,480 --> 00:24:59,359 Speaker 2: not good for raising husbands. I always say, fixer uppers 502 00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:00,919 Speaker 2: are for house is not spouse's. 503 00:25:01,480 --> 00:25:04,960 Speaker 1: It's important good, it's so good. I always think it's 504 00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:06,840 Speaker 1: funny because I used to say, well, I don't think 505 00:25:06,880 --> 00:25:08,800 Speaker 1: I have a type. Like, none of the guys that 506 00:25:08,880 --> 00:25:11,840 Speaker 1: I dated looked at all alike, right, they would all 507 00:25:11,920 --> 00:25:14,080 Speaker 1: have such a different than that. Yeah, they would have 508 00:25:14,160 --> 00:25:18,000 Speaker 1: a different even lifestyle. But when I really look back now, 509 00:25:18,080 --> 00:25:20,639 Speaker 1: I'm like, oh no, no, there was a type. They 510 00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:24,560 Speaker 1: were all nine internally, there was some sort of similarity 511 00:25:24,560 --> 00:25:26,639 Speaker 1: that I was drawn to you because I hadn't done 512 00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:30,480 Speaker 1: like what we're talking about, fully processed stuff from my past. 513 00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:33,879 Speaker 2: And so also, and also a type for all the 514 00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:35,960 Speaker 2: people that are really hung up on that because they're 515 00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:39,520 Speaker 2: just they swear that everyone that they've ever dated and had, 516 00:25:39,840 --> 00:25:42,240 Speaker 2: you know, some kind of train wreck with, was not alike. 517 00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:46,120 Speaker 2: It also can go back to your type is what 518 00:25:46,200 --> 00:25:49,360 Speaker 2: you feel like with someone at the very beginning so 519 00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:51,880 Speaker 2: your type is someone who makes you feel a very 520 00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:55,199 Speaker 2: specific way and the very beginning of the relationship, and 521 00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:55,840 Speaker 2: that's your type. 522 00:25:56,320 --> 00:25:59,320 Speaker 1: H Okay, So let's use that as an example and 523 00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:02,880 Speaker 1: say if someone is like they think they've done the work, 524 00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:04,719 Speaker 1: they're in a good place, they want to inter they 525 00:26:04,720 --> 00:26:06,800 Speaker 1: feel like they've integrated, they want to start dating again. 526 00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:10,840 Speaker 1: Then they start dating and they're dating a couple of people, 527 00:26:10,840 --> 00:26:13,240 Speaker 1: but the one they're really drone to feels like that 528 00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:17,280 Speaker 1: excitement or whatever. How do you make a different decision, Like, 529 00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:19,199 Speaker 1: what do you do if you start to recognize that 530 00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:20,560 Speaker 1: within yourself. 531 00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:22,800 Speaker 2: You have to be willing to audit you have to 532 00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:25,520 Speaker 2: be willing to audit yourself, and that you usually can't 533 00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:27,000 Speaker 2: do that alone. And so this is where we have 534 00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:29,160 Speaker 2: to bring back the village. You know, I'm a big 535 00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:31,080 Speaker 2: I'm big about I don't know if my publicists told 536 00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:34,359 Speaker 2: you about bringing back the village. Community based matchmaking is 537 00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:36,760 Speaker 2: what I do and what I'm trying to implement back. 538 00:26:37,119 --> 00:26:39,240 Speaker 2: And so we used to have a village. We used 539 00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:42,040 Speaker 2: to have a group of people around us that we trusted, 540 00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:44,680 Speaker 2: that had our best interests at heart. Now we're dating 541 00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:47,040 Speaker 2: in secret. In fact, we even like, look at all 542 00:26:47,080 --> 00:26:49,560 Speaker 2: the look at all the trends, soft launching all this stuff. 543 00:26:49,560 --> 00:26:51,679 Speaker 2: We're dating a secret we don't even want anyone to know. 544 00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:54,680 Speaker 2: Somewhere along the line, we started believing that your love 545 00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:59,000 Speaker 2: life was private. Was private, right, it was something that 546 00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:01,720 Speaker 2: you didn't share. Maybe with a girlfriend when you're ranting 547 00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:04,520 Speaker 2: and bitching about it, but you didn't really share it. 548 00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:06,840 Speaker 2: And a lot of times the person that you're ranting 549 00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:10,119 Speaker 2: to they have the same problems. Because we don't just 550 00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:13,200 Speaker 2: have types in boyfriends. We have types and friends, right, 551 00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:15,760 Speaker 2: So it's important for us to remember that as well. 552 00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:19,320 Speaker 2: But having a group of people around you like bringing 553 00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:22,560 Speaker 2: back the village where you can say, hey, this is 554 00:27:22,600 --> 00:27:24,440 Speaker 2: what's happening, what do you see? 555 00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:29,000 Speaker 1: Where do you think people most avoid accountability in relationships? 556 00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:33,720 Speaker 2: I think that a lot of times people avoid accountability 557 00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:37,520 Speaker 2: for their own feelings. Sometimes, you know, they put their 558 00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:40,080 Speaker 2: feelings on other people. They're like, you made me feel 559 00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:42,119 Speaker 2: this way, or if I got away from you, I 560 00:27:42,119 --> 00:27:45,120 Speaker 2: would stop feeling this way, instead of understanding that this 561 00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:48,920 Speaker 2: is something that's coming out because of something that's getting triggered. 562 00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:51,439 Speaker 2: That regardless of whether you're with this person or not, 563 00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:52,360 Speaker 2: it's still. 564 00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:55,719 Speaker 1: There, right, and for a reason. 565 00:27:56,480 --> 00:27:59,400 Speaker 2: You know, the trigger is your signed that it's there. 566 00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:03,040 Speaker 2: It's like, why I'm here, pay attention to me, heal me, 567 00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:03,600 Speaker 2: let's go. 568 00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:07,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, we talk a lot about the mirror concept, like, 569 00:28:07,359 --> 00:28:09,440 Speaker 1: you know, relationships are here to mirror the stuff that's 570 00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:12,399 Speaker 1: happening inside of us. And so always I'm trying to 571 00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:16,399 Speaker 1: remind the listeners or you know, myself, if something is 572 00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:19,760 Speaker 1: coming up it's a good sign, like, pay attention to it. 573 00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:23,520 Speaker 1: It's showing you something, it's a clue, it's a it's 574 00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:25,920 Speaker 1: ready to be healed, even you know. And I think 575 00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:28,520 Speaker 1: so often we just want to look away or try 576 00:28:28,560 --> 00:28:30,800 Speaker 1: to fix the external thing like you were talking about, 577 00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:31,960 Speaker 1: or just. 578 00:28:31,920 --> 00:28:33,520 Speaker 2: You know, Yeah, a lot of people they feel a 579 00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:35,520 Speaker 2: lot of shame when their stuff comes to the surface. 580 00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:38,120 Speaker 2: They want to shove it back down because once again, 581 00:28:38,800 --> 00:28:43,000 Speaker 2: we believe going back to belief systems somewhere for people 582 00:28:43,040 --> 00:28:46,520 Speaker 2: that are like that, somewhere you got the idea that 583 00:28:46,800 --> 00:28:49,720 Speaker 2: you weren't worthy of love unless you were perfect. You 584 00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:52,800 Speaker 2: got the idea that you weren't allowed to be broken, 585 00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:55,920 Speaker 2: that you had to be you know xyz. And so 586 00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:57,840 Speaker 2: it's important that we take a deep look at that 587 00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:00,280 Speaker 2: you don't have to shove your you know, demons in 588 00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:03,520 Speaker 2: the box. You need to let them out. Yeah, put 589 00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:06,160 Speaker 2: your skeletons on parade, open the closet, let's go. 590 00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:09,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, well, let's put your TV back on. On a 591 00:29:09,920 --> 00:29:13,320 Speaker 1: bigger scale, what do you think the responsibility of these 592 00:29:13,480 --> 00:29:18,840 Speaker 1: networks and these shows really is to the dating world 593 00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:22,120 Speaker 1: and what we're seeing in relationship out there? Like do 594 00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:25,520 Speaker 1: they actually hold responsibility or is their only responsibility that 595 00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:28,480 Speaker 1: they're making good TV? And it's up to us as 596 00:29:28,480 --> 00:29:30,160 Speaker 1: people to really know the difference. 597 00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:34,560 Speaker 2: I've talked to some really big producers that were behind 598 00:29:34,680 --> 00:29:39,360 Speaker 2: some of the biggest reality shows that have this formula. 599 00:29:39,560 --> 00:29:42,120 Speaker 2: Take unhealthy people, give them a bunch of alcohol, and 600 00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:45,240 Speaker 2: turn the cameras on, and they really regret, They really 601 00:29:45,280 --> 00:29:47,160 Speaker 2: regret being part of that process. So I think it's 602 00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:49,240 Speaker 2: going to come down to the ethics and morals of 603 00:29:49,280 --> 00:29:52,080 Speaker 2: the individual people. I think that that type of TV 604 00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:54,080 Speaker 2: is always going to exist. Look at it all started 605 00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:57,320 Speaker 2: back and Talk TV with Jerry Springer and all, you know, 606 00:29:57,400 --> 00:30:01,520 Speaker 2: more Povitch and all that stuff, and people, for whatever reason, 607 00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:05,480 Speaker 2: even with true crime stuff, people for some reason like 608 00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:09,280 Speaker 2: to sit in front of something that's shocking and unbelievable 609 00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:13,440 Speaker 2: and you know, crazy and unhinged, because maybe it makes 610 00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:15,680 Speaker 2: us feel better about our own lives, like, oh, well, 611 00:30:15,680 --> 00:30:18,320 Speaker 2: at least I'm not like that. Yeah, you know, maybe 612 00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:20,239 Speaker 2: it makes us feel better about our own lives at 613 00:30:20,280 --> 00:30:23,560 Speaker 2: some level. But you've seen the contracts. I'm sure they 614 00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:25,360 Speaker 2: make you sign your life away when you go on 615 00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:28,240 Speaker 2: these shows, saying that you can never sue, it doesn't 616 00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:30,800 Speaker 2: matter how bad the edit makes you look. And so 617 00:30:31,000 --> 00:30:34,080 Speaker 2: they're definitely covering their bases. But whether or not they're 618 00:30:34,120 --> 00:30:37,840 Speaker 2: going to have a moral awakening, I don't know. I 619 00:30:37,840 --> 00:30:41,560 Speaker 2: think that. I think we're on a bad path for sure. 620 00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:44,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, I totally agree, just a bad path. 621 00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:46,800 Speaker 2: And you know, and that brings up really something important 622 00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:49,680 Speaker 2: that I definitely want to have your listeners here, is 623 00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:52,480 Speaker 2: that you're not just showing up to these dates. You know, 624 00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:55,320 Speaker 2: your nervous system is also showing up to these dates. 625 00:30:55,320 --> 00:30:57,440 Speaker 2: Your cortisol is showing up to these dates. And if 626 00:30:57,480 --> 00:30:59,600 Speaker 2: all you do is watch this type of TV or 627 00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:02,040 Speaker 2: even the news, I mean, I feel like every time 628 00:31:02,080 --> 00:31:04,160 Speaker 2: I turn on any type of media, it's just full 629 00:31:04,760 --> 00:31:10,120 Speaker 2: of scary, terrible, worst case scenario for people. Things happening 630 00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:13,200 Speaker 2: that is going to be a real indicator of whether 631 00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:15,960 Speaker 2: or not you're able to ever step into trust with someone. 632 00:31:16,480 --> 00:31:18,880 Speaker 2: I really always tell people when you're in a dating 633 00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:21,680 Speaker 2: season and you really want to meet someone your marriage minded, 634 00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:24,280 Speaker 2: let's take a little bit of a reset. Come away 635 00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:28,040 Speaker 2: from media, come away from scrolling, especially doom scrolling, and 636 00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:32,160 Speaker 2: just exhale so that you can bring back some stability 637 00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:34,040 Speaker 2: to your nervous system before dating. 638 00:31:35,560 --> 00:31:39,040 Speaker 1: Well. The new book is called Modern Dating Sucks. You 639 00:31:39,080 --> 00:31:41,200 Speaker 1: tell the listeners a little bit about the book. 640 00:31:41,760 --> 00:31:44,240 Speaker 2: I love this book. I've written two books before this 641 00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:46,720 Speaker 2: book that I equally love. Like writing a book is 642 00:31:46,760 --> 00:31:49,400 Speaker 2: like giving birth to a child. For sure, it's a 643 00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:51,840 Speaker 2: labor of love. But I love this book because it 644 00:31:52,080 --> 00:31:54,200 Speaker 2: meets people where they are in modern dating, and it 645 00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:56,160 Speaker 2: also tells us how we got here. The very first 646 00:31:56,240 --> 00:31:58,760 Speaker 2: chapter is a history of dating. A lot of people 647 00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:01,440 Speaker 2: don't even know where dating came from, and the way 648 00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:04,000 Speaker 2: that we date is just barely one hundred years old, 649 00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:07,560 Speaker 2: and so understanding how we got here and where it's 650 00:32:07,680 --> 00:32:11,200 Speaker 2: headed if we don't change it is important. And then 651 00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:15,240 Speaker 2: it leads the reader into getting rid of a disgruntled 652 00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:20,000 Speaker 2: dating mindset and actually taking on a matchmaker mindset, how 653 00:32:20,040 --> 00:32:22,760 Speaker 2: to become your own matchmaker in a swipe left world, 654 00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:24,840 Speaker 2: and it really is going to help a lot of people. 655 00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:28,720 Speaker 1: Very interesting. I had the one hundred years that's wild. 656 00:32:29,400 --> 00:32:32,520 Speaker 2: I know your grandparents were probably the very first people 657 00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:34,880 Speaker 2: that dated in any way like what we do now. 658 00:32:35,320 --> 00:32:38,280 Speaker 1: Wow. Well, I'm going to put that a link to 659 00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:41,800 Speaker 1: the new book the old books. And also where should 660 00:32:41,800 --> 00:32:43,120 Speaker 1: people follow you and find you? 661 00:32:43,760 --> 00:32:46,760 Speaker 2: I'm easy, right, I'm gen X, So I'm on Instagram. 662 00:32:46,920 --> 00:32:49,320 Speaker 2: You can find me there Jackie Dorman Official, and you 663 00:32:49,360 --> 00:32:51,720 Speaker 2: can find me at my website Jackiedorman dot com. 664 00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:53,560 Speaker 1: Amazing, And like I said, I'll put all of that 665 00:32:53,600 --> 00:32:55,840 Speaker 1: in a description of this podcast for you guys. Jackie, 666 00:32:55,840 --> 00:32:57,840 Speaker 1: thank you so much. I love chatting with you about this. 667 00:32:58,480 --> 00:32:59,640 Speaker 2: Yes, thank you for having me