WEBVTT - Welch’s Fruit Snacks Get a MAHA-Friendly Makeover 0:00:02.800 --> 0:00:10.400 Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News. The other day, our 0:00:10.440 --> 0:00:14.000 producer Julia Press pulled me into the studio with a 0:00:14.320 --> 0:00:15.960 sweeter than usual assignment. 0:00:16.600 --> 0:00:19.239 I have treats brought back from my tour of the 0:00:19.239 --> 0:00:23.759 Welchi's Fruit Snacks factory. I brought two types of fruit 0:00:23.760 --> 0:00:26.360 snacks for you to try. This old type that they're 0:00:26.400 --> 0:00:29.200 phasing out and the new type that they're rolling out. 0:00:29.760 --> 0:00:33.360 And there's one key difference. The old type included a 0:00:33.400 --> 0:00:38.000 little bit of artificial dyes added in for color. The 0:00:38.040 --> 0:00:42.440 new type only gets their dies from natural sources fruits 0:00:42.440 --> 0:00:43.160 and vegetables. 0:00:43.840 --> 0:00:46.560 This switch has been a long time in the making. 0:00:47.120 --> 0:00:50.320 Welch's has been on a decade long odyssey to swap 0:00:50.360 --> 0:00:54.320 out artificial flavors for natural ones. But it's now something 0:00:54.320 --> 0:00:57.840 the Trump administration wants all companies to do as part 0:00:57.840 --> 0:01:01.520 of its crusade to quote make America healthy again. 0:01:02.400 --> 0:01:05.560 Okay, dump them out. How did they look to you? 0:01:06.000 --> 0:01:10.240 So they look exactly the same, you think? Okay, let's 0:01:10.240 --> 0:01:12.880 do a side by side comparison. Let's start with raspberry. 0:01:13.120 --> 0:01:16.640 All right, old kind, a little more clear, a little 0:01:16.680 --> 0:01:23.720 more vibrant. New kind, firmer, skinnier, and a little more muted, 0:01:23.920 --> 0:01:25.440 but only slightly. 0:01:25.520 --> 0:01:27.240 They do look pretty much identical. 0:01:27.319 --> 0:01:28.679 They look pretty much identical. 0:01:28.880 --> 0:01:31.360 Okay, let's do a taste test. Close your eyes. 0:01:32.520 --> 0:01:37.119 Number one, I'm really getting taken back to middle school here. 0:01:37.600 --> 0:01:38.800 You look blissed out. 0:01:38.920 --> 0:01:40.240 It tastes so good. 0:01:40.800 --> 0:01:41.119 Okay. 0:01:41.200 --> 0:01:45.920 Number two, spoiler alert, I couldn't tell the difference. Well, 0:01:46.080 --> 0:01:49.200 I just had two delicious fruit snacks that tasted exactly 0:01:49.240 --> 0:01:51.680 the same. Really, if you had to guess, was the 0:01:51.720 --> 0:01:53.520 first one the old kind and the second one the 0:01:53.520 --> 0:01:54.200 new kind? 0:01:54.560 --> 0:01:54.760 No? 0:01:55.080 --> 0:01:56.360 Oh, the opposit. 0:01:57.320 --> 0:02:02.000 Making a near replica of this popular product was time consuming, costly, 0:02:02.280 --> 0:02:05.720 and complicated, and as other companies try to pull this off, 0:02:05.920 --> 0:02:09.399 Welch's case study could reveal a lot about the challenges 0:02:09.440 --> 0:02:14.960 that lie ahead for the American food industry. I'm Sarah Holder, 0:02:15.080 --> 0:02:18.079 and this is the big take from Bloomberg News today. 0:02:18.080 --> 0:02:22.080 On the show, as the Trump Administration's MAHA movement encourages 0:02:22.120 --> 0:02:25.480 more and more food and drink companies to rework their formulas, 0:02:25.960 --> 0:02:28.720 we visit one company that's done it to see what 0:02:28.800 --> 0:02:39.079 it takes. What's the first thing you think of when 0:02:39.080 --> 0:02:41.839 you think of Welch's fruit snacks. 0:02:42.760 --> 0:02:46.000 I think of vending machines like soccer practice, where like 0:02:46.040 --> 0:02:47.720 you're you know, deciding. 0:02:47.560 --> 0:02:49.000 You know, how you're going to spend your two dollars 0:02:49.000 --> 0:02:50.560 and fifty cents that you've scrowned up. 0:02:50.680 --> 0:02:52.799 Yes, they were in my middle school vending machine too. 0:02:52.880 --> 0:02:54.040 Yeah, yeah, and we would. 0:02:53.880 --> 0:02:55.720 Like get them during lunch and kind of like swap 0:02:55.919 --> 0:02:57.320 colors and things like that. 0:02:57.440 --> 0:02:59.440 Yeah, personally avoiding the orange one. 0:03:00.080 --> 0:03:03.600 That's Bloomberg reporter Will Kobzanski. He recently went with our 0:03:03.600 --> 0:03:07.560 producer Julia to tour A. Welch's Fruits next production plant 0:03:07.720 --> 0:03:09.559 in New Jersey because. 0:03:09.280 --> 0:03:12.959 They have begun rolling out products without any synthetic food dies. 0:03:13.040 --> 0:03:16.120 So that's you know, Red forty blue number one, and 0:03:16.560 --> 0:03:19.359 you know, they had just started making this transition on 0:03:19.480 --> 0:03:22.079 its flagship product, the mixed fruit variety. 0:03:23.360 --> 0:03:25.920 Food dyes are in the headlines a lot these days. 0:03:26.480 --> 0:03:28.600 Four years from now, we're going to have most of 0:03:28.639 --> 0:03:32.040 these products off the market, or you will know about 0:03:32.080 --> 0:03:32.440 them when. 0:03:32.360 --> 0:03:35.000 You They've been thrust into the spotlight by Trump's Secretary 0:03:35.040 --> 0:03:38.720 of Health and Human Services, Robert F. Kennedy Junior. We 0:03:38.840 --> 0:03:41.600 have them on the run now and we are going 0:03:41.680 --> 0:03:45.480 to win this battle. That battle he's talking about is 0:03:45.520 --> 0:03:50.480 the war on ultra processed foods, specifically the artificial dyes 0:03:50.520 --> 0:03:54.080 that are often in those ultra processed foods, like petroleum 0:03:54.160 --> 0:03:57.520 based red forty. So far, it's been more of a 0:03:57.560 --> 0:04:01.280 pressure campaign than an all out war. The FDA hasn't 0:04:01.320 --> 0:04:05.840 banned these dies outright, but RFK has encouraged companies to 0:04:05.920 --> 0:04:07.680 drop them by the end of next year. 0:04:08.280 --> 0:04:10.640 There's lots of other things he cares about, seed oils, 0:04:10.680 --> 0:04:13.720 He talks a lot about ultra processed foods. Synthetic dies, though, 0:04:13.760 --> 0:04:16.760 are the area where we've seen the most change, the fastest, 0:04:16.920 --> 0:04:19.880 and the most response from companies that are subject to 0:04:19.920 --> 0:04:21.000 his regulations. 0:04:21.760 --> 0:04:25.000 What does the research say, What kind of health effects 0:04:25.080 --> 0:04:29.200 do synthetic dies and artificial dies actually have on consumers? 0:04:29.360 --> 0:04:32.120 So there's no like slam dunk piece of evidence that 0:04:32.160 --> 0:04:34.800 sort of says one way or the other synthetic food 0:04:34.800 --> 0:04:37.719 dies are really good or really bad. The FDA considers 0:04:37.760 --> 0:04:40.680 them safe, and the FDA has not revoked the regulation 0:04:40.839 --> 0:04:43.200 authorizing the use of synthetic food dies. If you want to, 0:04:43.320 --> 0:04:45.440 you could still put red forty in your product right now. 0:04:45.560 --> 0:04:49.000 There's some state laws you'd have to navigate in the 0:04:49.120 --> 0:04:52.240 late two thousands, there is a UK study that showed 0:04:52.240 --> 0:04:57.320 that there's some association with hyperactivity in children from synthetic dies. 0:04:57.800 --> 0:05:00.120 In twenty ten, the EU said we're going to put 0:05:00.160 --> 0:05:03.040 a warning label on anything that has a synthetic food 0:05:03.080 --> 0:05:06.039 die in it. In twenty eleven, the USFDA did a 0:05:06.080 --> 0:05:09.400 similar review. They said, we don't see any causal effect 0:05:09.640 --> 0:05:14.080 between adverse behaviors and food dies. We don't see the 0:05:14.120 --> 0:05:16.080 need to put a warning label on Although that was 0:05:16.120 --> 0:05:19.240 like a little more closely contested. About a decade later, 0:05:19.440 --> 0:05:23.480 California reviewed the evidence and said, actually, we do think 0:05:23.520 --> 0:05:25.720 there's a link, and that evidence sort of got passed 0:05:25.720 --> 0:05:27.640 along the chain, and a couple of years later, Gavin 0:05:27.680 --> 0:05:31.000 Newsom signed a bill that prohibits the use of synthetic 0:05:31.040 --> 0:05:33.520 food dies in schools. Beginning in twenty twenty eight. 0:05:33.640 --> 0:05:37.000 About a fifth of products on American grocery store shelves 0:05:37.040 --> 0:05:40.640 contain synthetic food dies in twenty twenty. That's according to 0:05:40.680 --> 0:05:43.880 a study published by the Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics 0:05:43.920 --> 0:05:44.360 this year. 0:05:44.760 --> 0:05:47.640 That number's probably gone down since twenty twenty because companies 0:05:47.680 --> 0:05:49.599 have like sort of started to since where the wind 0:05:49.680 --> 0:05:51.200 is blowing and they've been trying to get rid of 0:05:51.200 --> 0:05:54.560 them in their new products. But where they found them 0:05:54.560 --> 0:05:59.680 most often sugary beverages, sugary treats, things often marketed at kids. 0:06:00.000 --> 0:06:00.719 You can do the math right. 0:06:00.720 --> 0:06:03.279 If something looks good, if something looks bright and exciting 0:06:03.320 --> 0:06:05.720 and colorful, you're going to be more likely to want 0:06:05.720 --> 0:06:07.039 to eat it, especially if you're like, you know, a 0:06:07.040 --> 0:06:09.080 six year old at the Walmart with your dad looking 0:06:09.120 --> 0:06:09.919 at the cereal aisle. 0:06:11.120 --> 0:06:14.440 That brings us back to Welches. Since two thousand and one, 0:06:14.680 --> 0:06:17.719 a company called pim Brands has been making these fruit 0:06:17.760 --> 0:06:20.760 snacks and licensing the Welsh name from the juice and 0:06:20.839 --> 0:06:26.159 jelly maker. Historically, the company's formula contains some artificial dyes 0:06:26.279 --> 0:06:28.839 in addition to the natural color that comes from the 0:06:28.880 --> 0:06:33.640 fruit purese inside, but in twenty fifteen it started experimenting 0:06:33.680 --> 0:06:37.839 with reducing its dependency on synthetic dies, and last month 0:06:38.000 --> 0:06:40.760 it announced they'd be fully phased out of all its 0:06:40.800 --> 0:06:43.279 fruit snack products by early twenty twenty six. 0:06:44.480 --> 0:06:50.000 We are outside the pim Brands factory in Somerset, New Jersey, 0:06:50.000 --> 0:06:51.359 where they make Welsish fruit snacks. 0:06:51.720 --> 0:06:56.480 We have nearly a million square feet dedicated to manufacturing, packaging, 0:06:56.640 --> 0:07:01.080 and distributing Welsis fruit snacks, which go across North America. 0:07:01.240 --> 0:07:03.080 Actually from this facility we also saw. 0:07:03.120 --> 0:07:07.960 That's Michael Rosenberg, Pinbrands CEO who showed Will and Julia around. 0:07:08.640 --> 0:07:11.800 It felt closer to like the Model T production line 0:07:11.800 --> 0:07:14.160 than it did Willy Wonka. It's one of these office 0:07:14.160 --> 0:07:16.720 parks that's sort of like you wouldn't know it exists 0:07:16.760 --> 0:07:19.240 unless you had a reason to go to it. And 0:07:19.320 --> 0:07:22.000 you walk into this factory, it just sort of smells 0:07:22.080 --> 0:07:24.960 like warm fruit. It smells like a. 0:07:24.960 --> 0:07:25.760 Fruit snack in here. 0:07:26.080 --> 0:07:28.400 Isn't like a like a pie, like a fruit pie. 0:07:28.480 --> 0:07:29.960 Like I'm trying to figure out what this reminds me of. 0:07:30.120 --> 0:07:32.920 Well, so, because of the number of fruits in our product, 0:07:33.160 --> 0:07:35.800 you don't smell any particular fruit. You just get this 0:07:36.240 --> 0:07:40.320 incredibly fruit smelling aroma. 0:07:41.160 --> 0:07:44.000 Just like a remarkable amount of movement in the factory. 0:07:44.040 --> 0:07:46.280 I found. The fruit snacks themselves are going into the molds, 0:07:46.280 --> 0:07:49.200 they're being shaken out, they're being transported across the factory 0:07:49.320 --> 0:07:54.960 and like a conveyor belt set up. You know, massive 0:07:55.080 --> 0:07:58.520 facility people you know, wearing their safety equipment, fruit snacks 0:07:58.560 --> 0:08:01.040 going on all kinds of conveyor else enough little fruit 0:08:01.080 --> 0:08:08.280 snack elevators and machines doling out packages and pouches. How much, 0:08:08.400 --> 0:08:11.160 generally speaking does it cost to build a facility like this? 0:08:11.640 --> 0:08:15.080 Each production line costs between fifteen and twenty million dollars. 0:08:15.640 --> 0:08:17.680 We have six production lines, and then of course you 0:08:17.680 --> 0:08:21.040 have all the packaging part. So there's a fortune in 0:08:21.080 --> 0:08:21.640 this building. 0:08:23.720 --> 0:08:26.920 The factory can turn out over ten billion pouches of 0:08:26.960 --> 0:08:30.000 fruit snacks a year. Will and Julia sat down with 0:08:30.040 --> 0:08:33.240 the team responsible for Welch's fruit snacks pivot to natural 0:08:33.360 --> 0:08:37.440 dies and they told them it's been a long road. 0:08:38.320 --> 0:08:41.520 So this process, according to them, started in twenty fifteen, 0:08:41.679 --> 0:08:44.480 so a decade ago. They're chief officer of R and D. 0:08:45.120 --> 0:08:48.720 She won noticed the products are made with real fruit. 0:08:48.800 --> 0:08:51.480 So you know, part of the Welchi's fruit snacks, like 0:08:51.760 --> 0:08:54.199 the stick is you know, a strawberry fruit snack is 0:08:54.200 --> 0:08:56.200 made with real strawberry pure So there's already a little 0:08:56.200 --> 0:08:57.640 color from those fruits in there. 0:08:57.800 --> 0:09:02.040 It inheritently comes with some natural color. And we were 0:09:02.080 --> 0:09:05.480 adding so many school amounts, so I was thinking, if 0:09:05.480 --> 0:09:07.840 he can introduce that, why not. 0:09:08.800 --> 0:09:12.520 Bavna Romani that R and D director also noticed that 0:09:12.559 --> 0:09:18.240 synthetic dyes were starting to lose favor internationally, so Bavna 0:09:18.280 --> 0:09:21.720 and her team started tinkering. They took it one color 0:09:21.760 --> 0:09:25.600 at a time. First up yellow, the low hanging fruit, 0:09:25.679 --> 0:09:28.720 so to speak. She said, yellow was easier to swap 0:09:28.760 --> 0:09:31.040 out because there are lots of natural sources of the 0:09:31.080 --> 0:09:34.320 color and enough supply of those substitutes in the market. 0:09:34.880 --> 0:09:38.320 They're replaced some with turmeric and anato, and it was 0:09:38.360 --> 0:09:42.400 a relatively easy switch. Kraft mac and Cheese made a 0:09:42.480 --> 0:09:44.280 very similar switch around that time. 0:09:44.880 --> 0:09:47.400 Nato is a yellow coloring made from a tree seed, 0:09:48.040 --> 0:09:51.880 but other colors were harder to match. Here's Bavna. 0:09:52.080 --> 0:09:56.679 Unfortunately, there was no true replacement for the blue because 0:09:57.000 --> 0:10:00.240 there are not too many blue fruits for vegetable, because 0:10:00.280 --> 0:10:03.600 all natural colors are derived from real fruits and vegetable 0:10:04.040 --> 0:10:06.280 and in reality, if you go to the supermarket, it's 0:10:06.320 --> 0:10:07.440 not too many choices. 0:10:07.480 --> 0:10:08.160 Don't replace that. 0:10:08.880 --> 0:10:11.160 It's not just can we match the exact shade, it's 0:10:11.480 --> 0:10:15.720 can the shade last over time? Is the pH imbalance 0:10:15.760 --> 0:10:18.079 between the dye and the fruit period that's already in there. 0:10:18.200 --> 0:10:20.559 Is that going to make the fruit snack turned brown 0:10:20.559 --> 0:10:21.080 over time. 0:10:21.760 --> 0:10:24.920 For the blue color, they settled on spirillina, a type 0:10:24.960 --> 0:10:28.160 of algae, and a fruit called tueto found in South 0:10:28.200 --> 0:10:31.880 and Central America. Getting a new raspberry gummy to look 0:10:31.880 --> 0:10:34.719 and taste just like the old gummy so that unsuspecting 0:10:34.800 --> 0:10:37.640 eaters like me can't tell the difference took the R 0:10:37.640 --> 0:10:41.319 and D team close to fifty different trials to replace 0:10:41.400 --> 0:10:45.240 red forty. They used ingredients like purple carrot and red grape, 0:10:45.679 --> 0:10:48.600 and once they figured out the right combination of ingredients, 0:10:48.840 --> 0:10:51.559 they had to find a way to make the colors consistent. 0:10:52.120 --> 0:10:55.800 Fruit grow in North America versus South America, it has 0:10:55.840 --> 0:10:57.560 a different taste, different color. 0:10:58.240 --> 0:11:01.439 They needed to find the suppliers natural eyes work with 0:11:01.480 --> 0:11:03.760 the suppliers to make sure that when the food die 0:11:04.080 --> 0:11:07.480 is transported, like it's not getting any adverse impacts from 0:11:07.520 --> 0:11:10.400 temperature changes in the supply chain. They needed to work 0:11:10.400 --> 0:11:14.480 with them to stabilize the acidity of the food dies 0:11:14.520 --> 0:11:16.599 because it was interacting with the fruit that was in 0:11:16.640 --> 0:11:18.720 their fruit snacks, and like, you need to make sure 0:11:18.720 --> 0:11:21.360 it doesn't just turn round in like three months, six months, 0:11:21.440 --> 0:11:22.880 nine months, a year over the course of the full 0:11:22.920 --> 0:11:23.400 shelf life. 0:11:23.440 --> 0:11:24.040 Of the product. 0:11:24.120 --> 0:11:25.480 You have to do R and D, you have to 0:11:25.480 --> 0:11:27.160 find the right people, you need to do the testing. 0:11:27.280 --> 0:11:29.640 Things that cost money, and. 0:11:29.920 --> 0:11:33.400 It comes with risk, not just financial risk, but the 0:11:33.480 --> 0:11:37.319 risk of alienating customers. We get into that and how 0:11:37.360 --> 0:11:48.920 other companies are trying to make similar changes after the break. 0:11:52.640 --> 0:11:56.080 When it comes to swapping out synthetic dyes with natural dyes, 0:11:56.559 --> 0:11:59.360 wel Jess Fruit Snacks was a little earlier to the party, 0:12:00.080 --> 0:12:03.520 but now many other companies are starting to follow suit. 0:12:04.120 --> 0:12:07.640 PepsiCo is the latest company to jump on the Maha bandwagon, 0:12:07.679 --> 0:12:11.000 announcing plans to remove artificial colors and flavors. Craft is 0:12:11.040 --> 0:12:13.920 announcing they will no longer be launching any products that 0:12:14.040 --> 0:12:17.080 have artificial die in the general mills, announcing it will 0:12:17.120 --> 0:12:20.880 remove artificial colors from its US cereals n K through 0:12:20.880 --> 0:12:23.320 twelfth school Foods by next summer. 0:12:24.000 --> 0:12:26.400 A lot of what we've seen so far are commitments 0:12:26.600 --> 0:12:27.160 to do it. 0:12:27.960 --> 0:12:31.440 Let's talk about some of those commitments. How quickly are 0:12:32.000 --> 0:12:33.920 these companies saying that they'll do this. 0:12:34.400 --> 0:12:37.560 So the timeline that most companies have given is by 0:12:37.559 --> 0:12:40.000 the end of twenty twenty seven beginning of twenty twenty eight. 0:12:40.200 --> 0:12:44.000 That's a specific date because beginning on January first, twenty 0:12:44.040 --> 0:12:46.280 twenty eight, if you want to sell your product in 0:12:46.280 --> 0:12:49.560 West Virginia, you can't have synthetic dies in it. There 0:12:49.600 --> 0:12:54.600 are similar laws going into affecting the California schools Texas. 0:12:54.880 --> 0:12:56.480 The feasibility is another question. 0:12:57.600 --> 0:13:01.840 Remember, for Welch's the changeover took a decade. It took 0:13:01.840 --> 0:13:04.280 a full year just to test that the new colors 0:13:04.280 --> 0:13:07.079 wouldn't fade over the course of the product's shelf life. 0:13:07.559 --> 0:13:09.520 But does that mean it will take a decade for 0:13:09.600 --> 0:13:13.839 everyone else to do it too. Maybe not Welches. 0:13:14.320 --> 0:13:16.480 They have a more complex product than like a Scale 0:13:16.640 --> 0:13:19.040 or a Starburst. There's the fruit in there, vitamins and 0:13:19.080 --> 0:13:21.880 minerals and things like that. And also, you know, compared 0:13:21.920 --> 0:13:25.240 to Mars or Hershey or Mandalize or a smaller company. Right, 0:13:25.400 --> 0:13:27.120 no one is explicitly said as much to me, but 0:13:27.240 --> 0:13:30.560 like they don't have the same leverage that you know, 0:13:30.679 --> 0:13:34.280 a massive multinational might have to secure these food dies. 0:13:34.559 --> 0:13:36.120 On the other hand, they've been working on this for 0:13:36.120 --> 0:13:38.199 ten years, they've been thinking about it for a long time. 0:13:38.520 --> 0:13:40.000 The question is matching the shades. 0:13:40.440 --> 0:13:43.120 Customers, you know, when they open a box of Welch's 0:13:43.120 --> 0:13:45.360 fruit snacks or a box of M and ms or 0:13:45.559 --> 0:13:49.400 you know, their cereal. They want to recognize the product 0:13:49.440 --> 0:13:49.880 that they know. 0:13:51.120 --> 0:13:53.400 There's a lot at stake when you start tinkering with 0:13:53.480 --> 0:13:56.920 a classic recipe. General Mills learn that the hard way 0:13:57.080 --> 0:14:00.559 when it tried this with Trick Cereal back in twenty sixteen, and. 0:14:00.520 --> 0:14:02.280 Then the American consumer was appalled. 0:14:02.600 --> 0:14:04.240 The tricks did not look like the tricks that they 0:14:04.240 --> 0:14:07.520 had grown to love, and they very quickly made the switchback. 0:14:07.559 --> 0:14:11.280 Ten years later, the American consumer might be more comfortable 0:14:11.360 --> 0:14:14.240 with this kind of change, and if they aren't already, 0:14:14.640 --> 0:14:16.320 they could just get used to it. 0:14:16.720 --> 0:14:19.240 I talked with someone who runs one of these natural 0:14:19.280 --> 0:14:23.320 eye companies, and something funny he said was Europeans when 0:14:23.320 --> 0:14:27.280 they see that like bright synthetic red forty shade, they're like, 0:14:27.320 --> 0:14:29.600 oh my god, there must be like something wrong with it. 0:14:29.600 --> 0:14:31.600 It looks like it was made in a chemical plant. 0:14:32.120 --> 0:14:35.280 There are other reasons a larger corporation could have an 0:14:35.360 --> 0:14:38.840 easier time than PIM did. Those companies may operate in 0:14:38.920 --> 0:14:41.960 countries where they're already asked to put warning labels on 0:14:42.040 --> 0:14:45.680 duyed products, or were they're not allowed to use synthetic dyes, 0:14:46.000 --> 0:14:49.080 so they may have a head start on the replacement process. 0:14:49.760 --> 0:14:53.120 How much of the motivation of these companies to rework 0:14:53.160 --> 0:14:56.080 these formulas is part of kind of making the current 0:14:56.320 --> 0:15:01.160 administration happy versus these broader globe forces. 0:15:01.800 --> 0:15:06.760 It's a good question putting aside RFK, MAHA and sort 0:15:06.800 --> 0:15:09.160 of the cultural lane it tapped into, Like there are 0:15:09.160 --> 0:15:11.000 people who are interested in this, there are people who 0:15:11.040 --> 0:15:13.800 don't want their kids to consume synthetic dies. What I 0:15:13.800 --> 0:15:16.200 would say is that RFK is making a lot of 0:15:16.240 --> 0:15:20.120 other asks right. There are seed oils, which are you know, 0:15:20.160 --> 0:15:22.920 canola sun flower seed oil, things like that. He wants 0:15:22.920 --> 0:15:26.360 those removed from the food supply. He would like things 0:15:26.360 --> 0:15:28.240 to the effect of limits on how much sugar we 0:15:28.280 --> 0:15:32.560 consume and the ultra process foods we consume. I can't 0:15:32.600 --> 0:15:34.680 read the mind of these CEOs and the folks who 0:15:34.720 --> 0:15:39.120 are doing their public affairs. But objectively changing one or 0:15:39.160 --> 0:15:42.200 two ingredients where there's an existing replacement and in fact 0:15:42.240 --> 0:15:46.040 it's already used internationally feels like a lighter lift than 0:15:46.080 --> 0:15:50.120 making these more fundamental changes to how you fry your product, 0:15:50.320 --> 0:15:52.960 how you consider your product process or ultra process, to 0:15:53.000 --> 0:15:54.360 the amount of sugar in there right. 0:15:54.400 --> 0:15:57.640 Well, that brings us to sort of a broader final question, 0:15:57.960 --> 0:15:59.880 which is that the stated goal of these changes per 0:16:00.040 --> 0:16:04.200 R is to make Americans healthier. Is there a significant 0:16:04.240 --> 0:16:08.160 health benefit here or are these mostly aesthetic changes that 0:16:08.240 --> 0:16:09.600 are easier to achieve. 0:16:10.600 --> 0:16:13.440 It's a question I don't have a complete answer. 0:16:13.520 --> 0:16:16.560 Yeah too, Yeah, there's some discourse on this because RFKS 0:16:16.640 --> 0:16:19.920 took something of a victory lap when Kellogg's cut its. 0:16:19.760 --> 0:16:20.600 Synthetic food dies. 0:16:20.640 --> 0:16:23.000 Anytime a company cuts its synthetic food dies, he'll put 0:16:23.000 --> 0:16:25.520 out a tweet and he'll say it's a MAHA win. 0:16:25.640 --> 0:16:27.440 And the Kellogg's wone got picked up and. 0:16:27.400 --> 0:16:31.600 It kind of sparked this broader conversation about you know, 0:16:31.680 --> 0:16:33.360 if you're eating the French fries but they're made with 0:16:33.400 --> 0:16:35.680 beef tallow instead of being friend to seed oil, and 0:16:35.720 --> 0:16:37.720 you're having the fruit loop still and they're still full 0:16:37.720 --> 0:16:40.200 of sugar, but like they don't have the red forty 0:16:40.200 --> 0:16:42.920 in them, the question sort of becomes like how much 0:16:42.920 --> 0:16:44.800 of an impact is this happening versus like how much 0:16:44.840 --> 0:16:46.840 does this just sort of Maha being able to take 0:16:46.880 --> 0:16:50.880 the win. The administration would contend that this is the 0:16:50.880 --> 0:16:53.760 first change of many to come. They want to fundamentally 0:16:54.080 --> 0:16:55.880 change the way we eat in this country. They're going 0:16:55.920 --> 0:16:58.120 to try and make some pretty big changes to the 0:16:58.120 --> 0:17:00.160 dietary guidelines that are coming out later this summer. Where 0:17:00.720 --> 0:17:05.000 the alternative take is the companies saw an easy place 0:17:05.080 --> 0:17:08.639 to score some points, and we'll see what happens with 0:17:08.680 --> 0:17:09.520 the rest of the changes. 0:17:14.000 --> 0:17:16.879 This is The Big Take from Bloomberg News. I'm Sarah Holder. 0:17:17.200 --> 0:17:19.800 To get more from The Big Take and unlimited access 0:17:19.840 --> 0:17:23.560 to all of Bloomberg dot com, subscribe today at Bloomberg 0:17:23.600 --> 0:17:27.400 dot com slash podcast offer. If you liked this episode, 0:17:27.480 --> 0:17:29.840 make sure to follow and review The Big Take wherever 0:17:29.880 --> 0:17:32.560 you listen to podcasts. It helps people find the show. 0:17:33.040 --> 0:17:36.800 Thanks for listening. We'll be back tomorrow.