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Speaker 1: The Book of Joe Podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: Hey Daron, Welcome back to the Book of Joe Podcast

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Speaker 1: with me, Tom Barducci, and of course Joe Madden. Joe,

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Speaker 1: we get a lot to get to. We're going to

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Speaker 1: talk about the Red Sox and what's going on with

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Speaker 1: their acquisitions. We got Derek Schooble's record arbitration, hearing some

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Speaker 1: icons in the world of sports that we lost. But

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Speaker 1: of course we have to start with the Super Bowl, right,

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Speaker 1: I mean, Joe, I think like the Super Bowl is

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Speaker 1: like it's a mirror on our society at a moment

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Speaker 1: in time, and everybody watches it, either the game end

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Speaker 1: or the commercials. So I'm going to my go to

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Speaker 1: football expert, the former Lafayette quarterback Broadway Joe Madden. Give

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Speaker 1: me your impressions either the game, the commercials, the whole

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Speaker 1: Night of Americana.

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Speaker 2: Broad Street show actually up Broadway that was all about well,

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Speaker 2: I mean it's all about that. For me, it's about

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Speaker 2: the game, and even going into that game, I just

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Speaker 2: I always bet on quarterbacks and I love defenses too,

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Speaker 2: So of course I'm not just saying I really thought

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Speaker 2: the Seahawks had a much better chance to win that game.

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Speaker 2: I was never a Sam Darnal fan coming out of us. See,

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Speaker 2: I just wasn't. So I'm with the Jets. I thought

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Speaker 2: I may have been right, but I don't know what happened.

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Speaker 2: And somewhere like you have to be the second or

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Speaker 2: third team even sometimes to get a baseball player to

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Speaker 2: blossom into the player that you think he can be,

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Speaker 2: and it's certainly has happened with him. He really has

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Speaker 2: been impressive this year, the last couple of years actually,

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Speaker 2: So I was been on the quarterback right there, and

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Speaker 2: the other kid's good.

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Speaker 3: Don't get me wrong.

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Speaker 2: I like him a lot, and probably in a couple

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Speaker 2: of years from now is going to play on a

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Speaker 2: team in a game like like Darnold just did. But

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Speaker 2: that's where I was at with this whole thing. And

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Speaker 2: then the Seattle defense extraordinary. I mean I watched them

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Speaker 2: several times this year, so just from a purely talent perspective,

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Speaker 2: and again I watched New England some, but I just thought,

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Speaker 2: you know, Seattle had this dominant way about them, and

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Speaker 2: of course they have to play in a division with

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Speaker 2: the forty nine ers in the Rams. Mike Cardinals weren't

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Speaker 2: as good but I mean, all the factors for me

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Speaker 2: pointed in that direction, and so it wasn't surprised it.

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Speaker 2: It was rather, I think, kind of like an anti climatic,

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Speaker 2: kind of a boring game overall, I thought, But I

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Speaker 2: guess when you're playing dominant defense and somehow it's like

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Speaker 2: like a one nothing or two to one game in

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Speaker 2: baseball where the pitching and defense dominate, dominate.

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Speaker 3: So I was not surprised.

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Speaker 2: And congratulations to Sam because I don't know him, but

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Speaker 2: I'm really impressed by him and how he's turned his

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Speaker 2: entire career around on the major league level, doesn't have

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Speaker 2: the benefit of going back to the minor leagues, et cetera.

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Speaker 2: Regarding the commercials, I was in a real loud, noisy

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Speaker 2: place watching the game at somebody's house, so I didn't

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Speaker 2: really get to bear down on him so much. But

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Speaker 2: I did like the Goodwill Duncan commercial. I don't know

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Speaker 2: how they pull that off, of course, with the mater

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Speaker 2: technology whatever, but I thought that was rather entertaining. I

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Speaker 2: didn't really have a chance to break it all down.

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Speaker 2: And of course the controversial halftime performances, whatever side you're

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Speaker 2: on for that, I'm good with. Controversy and anytime you

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Speaker 2: want to create some discussion, that's not a bad thing.

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Speaker 2: So not a big fan of it overall. However, I'm

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Speaker 2: not saying it was a bad thing. It's just something

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Speaker 2: that creates controversy and discussion, which again I think is healthy.

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Speaker 3: So great day overall.

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Speaker 2: Like I said, anti climatic in a sense, but I

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Speaker 2: thought the better team did win, and it's always I

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Speaker 2: guess it's always good when that happens. However, when you

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Speaker 2: pull off the fset that's kind of interesting too.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, when you look up at the scoreboard of a

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Speaker 1: football game after three quarters and I think it was

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Speaker 1: twelve to nothing. Yeah, you're like, what's going on here? Right?

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Speaker 3: You don't want the.

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Speaker 1: Kickers to be the highlight of the super Bowl, and

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Speaker 1: they were for most of the game. You know, I

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Speaker 1: mentioned it's kind of a reflection on Americana specifically. Obviously

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Speaker 1: people it's like a holiday, right, families gatherings, You're at

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Speaker 1: a big place. So I look at the commercials as

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Speaker 1: really the mirror, and man, it was just full of

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Speaker 1: crypto AI and gambling and celebrities, Like I mean, what

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Speaker 1: happened to Wit? What happened to something that you know,

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Speaker 1: just involved either a character or a well written storyline

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Speaker 1: or something. Right, just throw a celebrity out there and

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Speaker 1: use the AI trickery. Now, maybe we're going to look

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Speaker 1: back on these are early days of AI obviously, kind

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Speaker 1: of like the Shark and Jaws, and like, man, it

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Speaker 1: doesn't look that impressive. At the time though, it was

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Speaker 1: like wow, that just scared you from going to the beach.

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Speaker 1: It was so cool. But man, just throwing something out

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Speaker 1: there because you have a celebrity in it, or just

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Speaker 1: because it's AI, that's not good enough, folks. And I

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Speaker 1: just saw that time after time after time, we are

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Speaker 1: obsessed with celebrities. Man, just throw them out there. You're like, wow,

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Speaker 1: that's a celebrity, and half of them you can't recognize anymore.

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Speaker 2: I guess i'd been on the Duncan commercial, huh, because

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Speaker 2: I did.

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Speaker 3: For years. I was a Duncan family.

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Speaker 2: I still like Dunkin Donuts coffee absolutely, and I was

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Speaker 2: a big part of my formative years. Then I did

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Speaker 2: get into the Starbucks world.

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Speaker 3: And.

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Speaker 2: Given given my druthers right now, I hate to admit

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Speaker 2: that I will stop at Starbucks before Duncan, but I

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Speaker 2: do understand the Duncan side just talking about like putting

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Speaker 2: together just kind of even though they were star stud

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Speaker 2: at the concept behind that commercial I thought was kind

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Speaker 2: of entertaining too.

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Speaker 3: But again, you're you're right.

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Speaker 2: I guess glitter Roddy sells these days everybody, whether it's

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Speaker 2: the music and the personification of wealth. And I just

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Speaker 2: saw somebody, the owner of the Jacksonville Jaguars.

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Speaker 3: I just saw his.

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Speaker 2: Yacht on on on a line on one of the platforms.

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Speaker 2: I don't know which one it was exactly, but my god,

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Speaker 2: four hundred foot yacht. I think I read that properly. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: that's football field plus. So that's that's where we're at.

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Speaker 2: That sometimes disappointing. However, again it's no different whenever your

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Speaker 2: sensibilities and your methods aren't met in regards to what

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Speaker 2: you're watching. Sometimes you want to take the anti stance immediately,

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Speaker 2: which is really.

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Speaker 3: Going to be about my thought of the day, quote

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Speaker 3: of the day at the very end.

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Speaker 2: Actually, but I try to I'm really trying hard to

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Speaker 2: refrain from just creating judgments based on, you know, the

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Speaker 2: opposite side of my sensibilities and where my belief systems are.

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Speaker 2: I just want to try to take it all in

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Speaker 2: and see if at some point I could be swayed

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Speaker 2: in a sense or convicted in another way based on

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Speaker 2: a good argument. A good argument, and you know, glitterati

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Speaker 2: is not a good argument for me. You know, style

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Speaker 2: without substance is not a good argument for me. So

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Speaker 2: that's that's where I get conflicted when I watch these

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Speaker 2: things because I think, for my since i've been able

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Speaker 2: to actually think in a coherent way, I've always been

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Speaker 2: over substance over style.

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Speaker 3: So I think we're just caught into that.

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Speaker 2: We're caught in that genre right now, that method of

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Speaker 2: living that you know. The younger generations I think are

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Speaker 2: really caught into that, caught up in that. So that's

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Speaker 2: where I get disappointed. But again I got to keep

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Speaker 2: an open mind about.

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Speaker 1: It, aim into that and I can't wait now for

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Speaker 1: the thought of the day. That was a great tease, Joe.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to get back to what you mentioned about

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Speaker 1: the quarterbacks and as it relates to baseball, especially with

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Speaker 1: a guy like Sam Darnold. And as far as Drake may,

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Speaker 1: you know he did have an injection before the game.

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Speaker 1: I just think he was compromised a little bit there. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Seattle got in his face a lot, and it'll compromise

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Speaker 1: any young quarterback. I get that. But there were a

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Speaker 1: couple of throws there, and you know this, Joe's a

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Speaker 1: former quarterback that he wasn't stepping into that. The ball

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Speaker 1: just didn't have to me, It's like watching a pitcher right.

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Speaker 1: Didn't have the command, it didn't have the right spin

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Speaker 1: on his throws. I mean, a couple of throws where

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Speaker 1: people wide open, besides the inners that were just like,

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Speaker 1: where is he going here with this? Just didn't look

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Speaker 1: right to me. And I'll give Seattle a ton of

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Speaker 1: credit for that, but wouldn't be surprised if that shoulder

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Speaker 1: maybe he was barking a little more than we thought.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, when when you're seeing that with a quarterback, I

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Speaker 2: mean normally and again I didn't play at a very

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Speaker 2: high level, but I played.

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Speaker 3: And when you're when you're.

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Speaker 2: Seeing the field, well, you're seeing the field and you're

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Speaker 2: not seeing people right in front of you. And I

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Speaker 2: think when when the rush gets heavy like that and

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Speaker 2: you start getting a little bit jittery about it, you

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Speaker 2: start seeing people in front of you as opposed to

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Speaker 2: keeping your eyes down field looking for your spots. Whether

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Speaker 2: it's you know, gaps and lanes and zones, or if

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Speaker 2: it's man and man which you loved, you try to

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Speaker 2: take advantage of that with when you have an exceptional receiver,

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Speaker 2: especially a tall one. So it's almost like the focus

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Speaker 2: for him was in the wrong spot. I mean, and

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Speaker 2: of course he was on his back a lot.

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Speaker 3: Uh.

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Speaker 2: Seattle really plays magnificent defense, they really do. I I mean,

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Speaker 2: that's that's almost like steel curtain stuff that I've been

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Speaker 2: watching this year, So I can understand a young quarterback

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Speaker 2: like that in a moment like that, and he's coming

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Speaker 2: off at tough games. They won that game in Denver,

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Speaker 2: but the weather was horrible, and I don't know how

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Speaker 2: much of I was wondering about that, how much of

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Speaker 2: his psyche might have been impacted by that. You know,

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Speaker 2: they couldn't move the ball. They eventually won the game.

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Speaker 2: He actually did a better job of running it than

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Speaker 2: throwing it at that point. So I think for a

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Speaker 2: lot of different reasons, his eyes weren't downfield, and you know,

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Speaker 2: when you get an injection, absolutely there could have been

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Speaker 2: in the back of his mind, and who knows, when

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Speaker 2: you get to that point where wherever you get to

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Speaker 2: that moment, whether it's your arm, your leg, whatever, your hamstring, whatever.

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Speaker 3: That you you.

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Speaker 2: You know that if I push it farther than that,

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Speaker 2: it's gonna hurt again. You got to get to the

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Speaker 2: point where you just you're able to be unconsciously competent,

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Speaker 2: where you're just seeing it, doing it, throwing it whatever,

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Speaker 2: running it, and when you have an injury like that,

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Speaker 2: it just it serves as a governor and it just

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Speaker 2: keeps in the back of your mind until you become

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Speaker 2: free of it. So I would say that his eyes

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Speaker 2: were not focused downfielding up, and a lot of that

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Speaker 2: was the se responsibility.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it wasn't a way of throwback game. Right. We're

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Speaker 1: so used to the big name, big money quarterbacks and

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Speaker 1: that's where the NFL is predicated on, both in terms

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Speaker 1: of interest and really winning football for a long time.

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Speaker 1: Not the case with either one of these guys. I mean,

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Speaker 1: very good quarterbacks, but you wouldn't call them elite quarterbacks,

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Speaker 1: certainly not in the top echelon of salaries as it were.

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Speaker 1: And you had a running back be the MVP of

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Speaker 1: the game of the Super Bowl for the first time

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Speaker 1: in twenty eight years. You mentioned the defense. You know,

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Speaker 1: I thought the Seattle defense was not just great, but

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Speaker 1: their their scheme was amazing. Like Drake may never saw

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Speaker 1: Witherspoon coming on those blitzes. They disguised them so well,

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Speaker 1: didn't walk them up to the line, but had them

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Speaker 1: coming well off the line and just time them perfectly.

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Speaker 1: So well coached, well schemed defensive unit rules the day,

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Speaker 1: even in this in this era of a passing game

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Speaker 1: with the NFL is But getting back to Darnald, Joe,

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Speaker 1: I think this is a fifth team, and I just

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Speaker 1: wonder if you've had any players like this that have

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Speaker 1: come along that you know, let's face it, he had

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Speaker 1: a high ceiling coming out of college right drafted very high.

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Speaker 1: It didn't work out for a while, had to go

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Speaker 1: many different places, many different coordinators. You know, in baseball

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Speaker 1: we've seen this, especially with pitchers, and we're seeing a

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Speaker 1: lot of this now where especially with technology, he can

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Speaker 1: bring out the best. But from the coaching side, Joe,

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Speaker 1: we've if you've got a guy, a pitcher or even

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Speaker 1: a position player on his fourth fifth team, he's late twenties,

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Speaker 1: he's getting to that point where he should be the

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Speaker 1: prime of his career. How do you explain someone finally

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Speaker 1: blossoming like that.

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Speaker 2: For me, a lot of times it's it's wow, things

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Speaker 2: just slow down, They just slow down and all of

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Speaker 2: a sudden, I think like twenty seven, twenty six, twenty

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Speaker 2: six to twenty eight is like the prime spot to

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Speaker 2: get somebody that's always had a high ceiling or considered

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Speaker 2: a great prospect but has failed to that point. But

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Speaker 2: when you get him there, I mean they've been throw

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Speaker 2: through failure to the point where they don't overthink it anymore.

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Speaker 2: They just go out there and read and react, they play,

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Speaker 2: and for whatever reason, their confidence just comes on. I

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Speaker 2: think Carlos Painion for me when you said that really

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Speaker 2: sticks out going into the with the Rays. That was

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Speaker 2: it seven or eight that we got him, I can't remember,

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Speaker 2: but he was a big part of all of that.

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Speaker 2: Los had been with the the Taggers. I think Oakland also.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if there was another team involved, but

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Speaker 2: I remember the conversation specifically with Andrews and living in Brea, California.

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Speaker 2: Your phone rings were talking and he asked me what

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Speaker 2: I thought about Carlos Painion. I said, Man, I really

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Speaker 2: got to love this guy when he when he really catches,

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Speaker 2: when the ball goes far.

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Speaker 3: I thought he was.

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Speaker 2: He wasn't fast by any means, but I thought he

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Speaker 2: was a good bass runner.

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Speaker 3: He played the first base.

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Speaker 2: Grade and then then you get to know him and

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Speaker 2: the guy's kind of on the really bright side. So

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Speaker 2: like Los really represents that to me, you know, the

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Speaker 2: guy that you got to really read through and and

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Speaker 2: and stay with. I mean Ben Zoebras to a certain extent,

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Speaker 2: you know, the way we got him in a minor

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Speaker 2: league deal. She was a major league deal, but he

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Speaker 2: really beat it around a little bit before he became

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Speaker 2: Zoe Cyrilla and became the super I thought he's like

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Speaker 2: really one of the first super U guys that even

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Speaker 2: when I had him on the All Star Team in

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Speaker 2: two thousand and nine after winning Are Going to the

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Speaker 2: Series in two thousand and eight, I really was pushing

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Speaker 2: for a super utility position on the All Star team

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Speaker 2: because that's what he was.

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Speaker 3: And he was a late bloomer too.

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Speaker 2: I think there's a lot of especially relief pitchers, I

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Speaker 2: think that you see blossom in that particular agent. I'm

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Speaker 2: just going to go to the two thousand and two

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Speaker 2: Angels when we had Ben Weber, Brendon Donnelly as a

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Speaker 2: two great examples of guys that were huge in that

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Speaker 2: team winning the World Series. Kind of I don't want

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Speaker 2: to say cast offs, but not the main players with

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Speaker 2: the organization they had been before. Tough guys. I mean,

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Speaker 2: these guys were unflappable. They you know, they'd have a

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Speaker 2: bad night and they'd come back to the next day like

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Speaker 2: it never happened. I think that was the gift of

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Speaker 2: experience right there. So if I really thought about it,

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Speaker 2: there's absolutely Kyle Farnsworth and we had him with the Rays.

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Speaker 2: Had done some successfully that's been successful I think with the.

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Speaker 3: Tigers and some other cubs.

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Speaker 2: But when he came to us and became a closer,

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Speaker 2: just came off a really good season and with the

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Speaker 2: braz and I remember the slider. All of a sudden,

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Speaker 2: I kept hearing about a slider slider slider and how

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Speaker 2: he really developed something with that. And then he came

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Speaker 2: to the Rays and turned into a really good, reliable closer.

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Speaker 3: So there's there's that sweet spot. Man.

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Speaker 2: If I'm looking, you know, if I'm looking to acquire

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Speaker 2: in the off season right now, I'd go for that.

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Speaker 2: I almost look at birth certificates for bullpen. Guys that

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Speaker 2: have really never reached their potential, have several, like maybe

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Speaker 2: three years of experience in the major leagues quite haven't

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Speaker 2: reached there in that sweet spot of the age group.

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Speaker 3: Those are guys that really bear down on Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I love the Carlos Pena comp there. I mean, Low's

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Speaker 1: had pitched played with what Texas, Boston, Detroit, Oakland by

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Speaker 1: the time he got to you and Tampa Bay and

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Speaker 1: really blossomed into not just a really good player, but

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Speaker 1: I'm sure one of your team leaders as well, Joe,

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Speaker 1: So there was certainly a comfort level that he got to.

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Speaker 1: I remember when he was a young player with Texas.

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Speaker 1: I remember Alex Rodriguez before he signed with Texas, wanted

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Speaker 1: a presentation of their minor league system and who was

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Speaker 1: coming up, and that was the big name there. You

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Speaker 1: get to play with this kid coming out, Carlos Pena,

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Speaker 1: And it took a while, but it did happen for him.

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Speaker 1: Great calling relief pitchers as well. I'm a big believer

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Speaker 1: in that as well. It usually takes a while for

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Speaker 1: those guys to find their niche to bounce around a lot.

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Speaker 1: By the way, Seattle became the first team to win

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Speaker 1: the Super Bowl with zero turnovers in the postseason. So

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Speaker 1: I think that's what Sam Darnold did especially well, right,

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Speaker 1: knowing that you got a defense that can win games

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Speaker 1: for you, not everybody does protect the football play field position,

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Speaker 1: and that's exactly what he did. On the other side,

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Speaker 1: New England turned the ball over three times, allowed six sacks.

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Speaker 1: Just not going to win any game, especially the Super

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Speaker 1: Bowl with those kind of numbers. Hey, Joe, I want

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Speaker 1: to ask you about Tarek Schooble's arbitration here and where

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00:16:09,318 --> 00:16:12,438
Speaker 1: did the Tigers go from here? We'll talk about that

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00:16:12,558 --> 00:16:26,918
Speaker 1: right after this on the Book of Joe. So Trek

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00:16:26,998 --> 00:16:30,078
Speaker 1: Scooble goes to arbitration, Joe, And you know, I've had

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Speaker 1: some front office guys and some agents wondering when this

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00:16:32,838 --> 00:16:35,598
Speaker 1: was going to happen, because it's pretty much cut and

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00:16:35,638 --> 00:16:38,598
Speaker 1: pace when it comes to arbitration. You compare yourself to

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Speaker 1: other players in your service time class. They have a

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Speaker 1: bunch of numbers that they have at the hearing. You

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Speaker 1: can't bring in any things that are not public, no

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Speaker 1: proprietary numbers. You can't bring any statcast numbers. It's pretty

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Speaker 1: darn simple. But in the case when the players like

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Speaker 1: Trek schoolb will get to their platform season five years

347
00:16:57,918 --> 00:17:00,558
Speaker 1: the year before free agency. They can then compare themselves

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00:17:00,558 --> 00:17:03,718
Speaker 1: to anybody regardless of service time, which means he can

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00:17:03,918 --> 00:17:06,318
Speaker 1: talk into that hearing and compare himself to people like

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Speaker 1: Blake Snell and Zach Wheeler and these guys making thirty

351
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Speaker 1: five forty million dollars per year. So he went in

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Speaker 1: and asked for more than thirty million, and the Tigers

353
00:17:16,198 --> 00:17:20,398
Speaker 1: were at nineteen million. I got what the Tigers were doing, Joe.

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Speaker 1: They were looking at the history of arbitration, saying, you know,

355
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Speaker 1: the biggest raise goes back to David Price in arbitration

356
00:17:26,318 --> 00:17:30,878
Speaker 1: that was eleven years ago at nineteen point something million dollars.

357
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Speaker 1: So they came in at nineteen Well, that was eleven

358
00:17:33,758 --> 00:17:36,638
Speaker 1: years ago, and that money, if you factor in inflation,

359
00:17:37,278 --> 00:17:39,878
Speaker 1: is about twenty seven million dollars. So I thought going

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Speaker 1: in the Tigers were going to lose this arbitration hearing.

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00:17:43,918 --> 00:17:46,718
Speaker 1: But good on Scott Boris and Trek Schooboll for going

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Speaker 1: there and basically taking a swing for a home run

363
00:17:50,238 --> 00:17:53,398
Speaker 1: and comparing themselves to the top free agents, because that

364
00:17:53,478 --> 00:17:56,238
Speaker 1: hasn't really hadn't happened much at all, if ever, in

365
00:17:56,278 --> 00:17:59,958
Speaker 1: spring training, and now it's record setting because now Paul Skins,

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00:17:59,998 --> 00:18:02,038
Speaker 1: when he's a five year player, can go into his

367
00:18:02,158 --> 00:18:06,278
Speaker 1: arbitration and compare him off to not just Tarrek scooball

368
00:18:06,318 --> 00:18:08,798
Speaker 1: in this hearing, but whatever Tarrek Schooble signs for as

369
00:18:08,838 --> 00:18:10,358
Speaker 1: a free agent at the end of this year, and

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00:18:10,398 --> 00:18:13,078
Speaker 1: it's going to start with at least a four, so

371
00:18:13,678 --> 00:18:15,558
Speaker 1: we don't see it happen often. This was the right

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00:18:15,598 --> 00:18:18,198
Speaker 1: guy to do it. Two straight Cy Young Award for

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00:18:19,238 --> 00:18:22,718
Speaker 1: Cy Young Award wins for Schooble, and he's not being traded.

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00:18:22,798 --> 00:18:24,638
Speaker 1: The Tigers have a team that can win the American

375
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Speaker 1: League and go to the World Series. There's no reason

376
00:18:26,918 --> 00:18:28,958
Speaker 1: to break it up and say, you know, we'll try

377
00:18:28,998 --> 00:18:31,518
Speaker 1: to make a Wan Soto type deal, move him in

378
00:18:31,518 --> 00:18:34,318
Speaker 1: his fifth year. That's not happening. Run it out, play

379
00:18:34,358 --> 00:18:38,318
Speaker 1: it out with Trek Scuoble. You know, I thought they

380
00:18:38,318 --> 00:18:41,478
Speaker 1: were going to lose. I understood their strategy. I think

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Speaker 1: there's more about school ball taking a stand here.

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00:18:44,558 --> 00:18:48,958
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, so, explain this to me, though, What

383
00:18:49,078 --> 00:18:51,238
Speaker 2: was the purpose behind the Tigers.

384
00:18:50,918 --> 00:18:52,758
Speaker 3: Money to low ball it so much?

385
00:18:52,798 --> 00:18:56,358
Speaker 2: Are they concerned about Schooble's future in regards to staying healthy.

386
00:18:56,998 --> 00:18:59,518
Speaker 1: I don't think so. I think listening there were some

387
00:18:59,598 --> 00:19:02,878
Speaker 1: talks about an extension that was never going to happen. Right,

388
00:19:03,118 --> 00:19:06,878
Speaker 1: he's got too much value to sign an extension. To

389
00:19:07,238 --> 00:19:09,238
Speaker 1: get your true value as a player, right, you know this,

390
00:19:09,358 --> 00:19:11,358
Speaker 1: you have to be a basically a free agent, put

391
00:19:11,358 --> 00:19:13,158
Speaker 1: yourself up forbidding, and that's going to happen at the

392
00:19:13,198 --> 00:19:16,318
Speaker 1: end of the year. So they tried briefly to sign

393
00:19:16,398 --> 00:19:19,038
Speaker 1: the extension. Didn't happen. So now it's a matter of

394
00:19:19,758 --> 00:19:21,958
Speaker 1: can they come in with a number that's high enough

395
00:19:21,998 --> 00:19:24,678
Speaker 1: where they can settle, And I think in this case

396
00:19:24,718 --> 00:19:28,718
Speaker 1: they came in with a low number that assured a hearing.

397
00:19:29,438 --> 00:19:32,758
Speaker 1: But again, you know they're working in you know, in

398
00:19:32,838 --> 00:19:35,838
Speaker 1: concert with past history of arbitration what the numbers were,

399
00:19:35,878 --> 00:19:37,718
Speaker 1: and they're looking at what Jacob de Grom got and

400
00:19:37,838 --> 00:19:42,318
Speaker 1: arbitration with David Price got in arbitration. But you know

401
00:19:42,358 --> 00:19:45,598
Speaker 1: the free agent contracts for top pictures of what changed things.

402
00:19:45,598 --> 00:19:48,078
Speaker 1: So they looked at the universe from an arbitration world,

403
00:19:48,158 --> 00:19:51,438
Speaker 1: because people hadn't pushed the envelope by comparing themselves to

404
00:19:51,478 --> 00:19:54,438
Speaker 1: free agents. My guess is, Joe, I guess they didn't

405
00:19:54,478 --> 00:19:56,878
Speaker 1: think that Derek was going to come in as high

406
00:19:56,878 --> 00:19:57,278
Speaker 1: as he did.

407
00:19:57,358 --> 00:19:59,478
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean down the road.

408
00:19:59,598 --> 00:20:01,718
Speaker 2: I guess what I'm I guess what I'm trying to

409
00:20:01,798 --> 00:20:03,558
Speaker 2: understand is they down the road, don't they want to

410
00:20:03,598 --> 00:20:05,998
Speaker 2: keep this sky? I mean, this sky is so good?

411
00:20:06,038 --> 00:20:07,598
Speaker 2: Who are you going to get better than that? And

412
00:20:08,278 --> 00:20:10,878
Speaker 2: although maybe they're not willing to pay that price, that's

413
00:20:10,878 --> 00:20:13,678
Speaker 2: going to begin with the four next year. Maybe that's

414
00:20:13,958 --> 00:20:15,878
Speaker 2: the overarching point. So then of course you're going to

415
00:20:15,918 --> 00:20:17,798
Speaker 2: come in as low as you possibly can right now

416
00:20:17,838 --> 00:20:19,278
Speaker 2: and try to you know.

417
00:20:19,198 --> 00:20:21,438
Speaker 3: Whatever, whatever, whatever, however it shakes.

418
00:20:21,078 --> 00:20:25,118
Speaker 2: Out, will take that knowing that they're knocking to put

419
00:20:25,118 --> 00:20:27,958
Speaker 2: their best foot forward next year, because would you want to,

420
00:20:29,518 --> 00:20:33,198
Speaker 2: you know, create even greater warmth and stability with this guy?

421
00:20:33,278 --> 00:20:35,718
Speaker 2: You're he's so good. I mean, you're never going to

422
00:20:35,798 --> 00:20:39,238
Speaker 2: find that again, so you have to that guy. He

423
00:20:39,278 --> 00:20:43,038
Speaker 2: comes along very infrequently, Schooble does. So it's got to

424
00:20:43,078 --> 00:20:45,278
Speaker 2: go deeper than that. I mean, what they really envision

425
00:20:45,358 --> 00:20:48,918
Speaker 2: down the road, what their comfort zone is spending next year?

426
00:20:48,958 --> 00:20:51,638
Speaker 2: Because they just signed Valdez, right, Framber Valdez is he

427
00:20:51,678 --> 00:20:55,838
Speaker 2: supposed to be in waiting, kind of a schoolbl guy.

428
00:20:55,878 --> 00:20:57,878
Speaker 2: If they lose Schooble, this is like the next best

429
00:20:57,918 --> 00:21:00,918
Speaker 2: thing to have. I mean, wouldn't it be wonderful if

430
00:21:00,918 --> 00:21:02,998
Speaker 2: you're going to compete on an annual basis with both

431
00:21:03,038 --> 00:21:06,078
Speaker 2: these guys being helped what they could potentially do. So again,

432
00:21:06,358 --> 00:21:10,798
Speaker 2: it's just another business over baseball decision. You know, if

433
00:21:10,838 --> 00:21:13,078
Speaker 2: you in a perfect world, you'd run both of these

434
00:21:13,118 --> 00:21:15,798
Speaker 2: guys for the next at least I'd say three four years.

435
00:21:15,838 --> 00:21:18,918
Speaker 2: At least I would say four max. You like to

436
00:21:18,918 --> 00:21:21,038
Speaker 2: have these guys on your team. And then again, it's

437
00:21:21,118 --> 00:21:24,238
Speaker 2: not my money. I get that, but I would I

438
00:21:24,238 --> 00:21:26,718
Speaker 2: would think you'd want to really court Schooble in a

439
00:21:26,758 --> 00:21:29,518
Speaker 2: way that he just wants to remain at Taggers as

440
00:21:29,558 --> 00:21:33,798
Speaker 2: long as you as possible, because this is a this

441
00:21:33,918 --> 00:21:37,118
Speaker 2: is an animal that just doesn't or hardly exists anymore.

442
00:21:37,478 --> 00:21:39,398
Speaker 2: When you get a guy like that, he could take

443
00:21:39,438 --> 00:21:41,078
Speaker 2: you to the Promised Land or at least close on

444
00:21:41,118 --> 00:21:44,758
Speaker 2: an annual basis. So I don't know, I know it's

445
00:21:44,798 --> 00:21:49,638
Speaker 2: about money, however, gosh, I would just think you'd want

446
00:21:49,638 --> 00:21:51,038
Speaker 2: to treat this guy a little bit differently.

447
00:21:51,878 --> 00:21:53,918
Speaker 1: Well, I'm with you on schoolbl I mean he is,

448
00:21:54,518 --> 00:21:58,158
Speaker 1: he's an outlier. He's such a competitor. Besides having just

449
00:21:58,278 --> 00:22:01,958
Speaker 1: outstanding stuff and control. You know, he's a stuff guy

450
00:22:02,078 --> 00:22:06,358
Speaker 1: who actually has great control. I'm with you. He's a

451
00:22:06,398 --> 00:22:10,398
Speaker 1: game changer, There's no question about it. I also think

452
00:22:10,438 --> 00:22:12,038
Speaker 1: Joe he's the kind of guy where this is not

453
00:22:12,078 --> 00:22:14,638
Speaker 1: going to bother him. You know, you walk into a

454
00:22:14,678 --> 00:22:17,438
Speaker 1: hearing and a team argues against your value, that's never good.

455
00:22:18,118 --> 00:22:20,038
Speaker 1: Not going to matter with Trek Scooble. I mean, he

456
00:22:20,118 --> 00:22:22,398
Speaker 1: only knows one way to play. He's a thick skinned guy.

457
00:22:23,038 --> 00:22:25,758
Speaker 1: I just think Detroit thinks that their chances of signing

458
00:22:25,878 --> 00:22:28,038
Speaker 1: him to extension are not good, that they're not going

459
00:22:28,078 --> 00:22:31,318
Speaker 1: to go to this record number for a picture and

460
00:22:31,358 --> 00:22:33,718
Speaker 1: it's going to be extended years as well. So it

461
00:22:33,838 --> 00:22:36,078
Speaker 1: was a bad look. I will say the optics were

462
00:22:36,118 --> 00:22:39,678
Speaker 1: bad Joe when they turn around and immediately basically at

463
00:22:39,678 --> 00:22:42,998
Speaker 1: the same time give from Bervaldez almost twice as much

464
00:22:43,118 --> 00:22:47,278
Speaker 1: money on an average annual value, right, I mean you're

465
00:22:47,318 --> 00:22:50,878
Speaker 1: basically admitting that the number was too low for a

466
00:22:50,878 --> 00:22:53,598
Speaker 1: guy who could compare himself to free agent pictures. I

467
00:22:53,638 --> 00:22:56,958
Speaker 1: like fran Ervaldez. Don't get me wrong, He's not Tarek Scuoble.

468
00:22:57,718 --> 00:23:01,118
Speaker 1: So listen, they wound up with both of these guys,

469
00:23:01,158 --> 00:23:02,758
Speaker 1: and that's why I say they're not trading a school.

470
00:23:02,878 --> 00:23:04,318
Speaker 1: They're going to run it out with those two guys

471
00:23:04,318 --> 00:23:06,438
Speaker 1: at the top of the rotation and wow, and if

472
00:23:06,478 --> 00:23:10,078
Speaker 1: they get Framburg Valdez right, look out when you face

473
00:23:10,158 --> 00:23:12,758
Speaker 1: that team of the postseason. I mean, Valdez is a

474
00:23:12,878 --> 00:23:15,958
Speaker 1: premier ground ball guy. He just cannot throw a ball straight.

475
00:23:16,118 --> 00:23:20,038
Speaker 1: I mean it's crazy movement. Now, he does have some meltdowns.

476
00:23:20,078 --> 00:23:23,118
Speaker 1: He from time to time he'll lose his focus. He

477
00:23:23,158 --> 00:23:25,918
Speaker 1: did not pitch well down the stretch last year for Uston,

478
00:23:25,998 --> 00:23:28,758
Speaker 1: lost a little bit of velocity. And John, I want

479
00:23:28,798 --> 00:23:30,678
Speaker 1: to get your take on the incident that got a

480
00:23:30,718 --> 00:23:34,118
Speaker 1: lot of attention where he basically crossed up his catcher.

481
00:23:34,158 --> 00:23:38,318
Speaker 1: Most people thought on purpose, on frustration. And the worst

482
00:23:38,358 --> 00:23:42,038
Speaker 1: thing was after he did do that, he basically walked

483
00:23:42,038 --> 00:23:44,838
Speaker 1: away from the mountain without showing any concern for his catcher.

484
00:23:45,318 --> 00:23:47,558
Speaker 1: You think your first reaction there is, oh my goodness,

485
00:23:47,638 --> 00:23:51,438
Speaker 1: that's my guy. And the fact is he is very

486
00:23:51,438 --> 00:23:54,758
Speaker 1: friendly with the catcher. But if you watch Fromberg when

487
00:23:54,758 --> 00:23:58,678
Speaker 1: he pitches Joe. He is a habit of basically walking

488
00:23:58,678 --> 00:24:00,758
Speaker 1: off the mountain when things are not right, and he

489
00:24:00,798 --> 00:24:03,638
Speaker 1: will milk that pitch timer as well. It's just his

490
00:24:03,918 --> 00:24:07,198
Speaker 1: pH language was not good. I think things had freyed

491
00:24:07,198 --> 00:24:10,918
Speaker 1: with the Astros where there were no talks about an extension. Uh,

492
00:24:10,998 --> 00:24:13,838
Speaker 1: they sort of lost the player and at that point, again,

493
00:24:13,958 --> 00:24:17,398
Speaker 1: he's a voladle guy anyway. You know, we've seen him

494
00:24:17,438 --> 00:24:19,918
Speaker 1: lose command and lose composure on the mound from time

495
00:24:19,958 --> 00:24:23,958
Speaker 1: to time. It looked terrible. Won't get me wrong, but

496
00:24:24,238 --> 00:24:27,038
Speaker 1: I give credit to the Tigers and especially AJ Hinch,

497
00:24:27,078 --> 00:24:29,918
Speaker 1: the manager who obviously had Frombert with Houston as a

498
00:24:29,918 --> 00:24:32,798
Speaker 1: young player, and AJ sat down with him. I'm sure

499
00:24:32,838 --> 00:24:35,078
Speaker 1: they went through it chapter and verse and was convinced

500
00:24:35,078 --> 00:24:37,718
Speaker 1: that this was a moment of frustration that you don't

501
00:24:37,758 --> 00:24:41,598
Speaker 1: necessarily like but understand. And the fact is there were

502
00:24:41,758 --> 00:24:44,478
Speaker 1: two other teams in it at the same level of salary,

503
00:24:44,558 --> 00:24:46,398
Speaker 1: so it wasn't like the Tigers were out there on

504
00:24:46,438 --> 00:24:49,158
Speaker 1: their on their own making a commitment to from bar Valdez.

505
00:24:49,878 --> 00:24:52,638
Speaker 1: I think you're going to see a motivated pitcher pitching

506
00:24:52,678 --> 00:24:56,478
Speaker 1: for a manager who already knows him very well and

507
00:24:56,558 --> 00:24:58,638
Speaker 1: how to handle him. I think that's really important hit

508
00:24:58,678 --> 00:25:01,758
Speaker 1: the ground running in Detroit. And I like the fact

509
00:25:01,838 --> 00:25:04,638
Speaker 1: that Detroit Joe really trusted their manager this time and

510
00:25:04,678 --> 00:25:07,358
Speaker 1: what his opinion was from a player, that he really knew.

511
00:25:07,238 --> 00:25:08,438
Speaker 3: That Trump's everything right there.

512
00:25:08,438 --> 00:25:11,718
Speaker 2: I think that was the obviously the biggest reason why Listen,

513
00:25:11,798 --> 00:25:13,958
Speaker 2: the guy's good. I mean, he may have his shortcomings,

514
00:25:13,998 --> 00:25:15,998
Speaker 2: but the guy is really good. I've seen it firsthand.

515
00:25:16,678 --> 00:25:19,318
Speaker 2: But I think for the Detroit's comfort zone right there,

516
00:25:19,398 --> 00:25:23,558
Speaker 2: it's because of AJ having had this time with Framburgh

517
00:25:23,558 --> 00:25:27,078
Speaker 2: and like you said, sat down and discussed it in depth,

518
00:25:27,718 --> 00:25:30,758
Speaker 2: and I could just see the honeymoon period is on

519
00:25:30,878 --> 00:25:34,718
Speaker 2: right now, so that is very understandable. On the other side,

520
00:25:35,198 --> 00:25:38,878
Speaker 2: what he did more than you know, the little temper tantrums,

521
00:25:38,918 --> 00:25:41,838
Speaker 2: I learned to not really pay attention to that stuff.

522
00:25:41,838 --> 00:25:45,518
Speaker 2: Bobb Aloo, Bob Clear taught me that years ago. Body language.

523
00:25:46,758 --> 00:25:49,078
Speaker 2: You know, there's there's certain guys that just demonstrate in

524
00:25:49,118 --> 00:25:52,998
Speaker 2: different ways, and you know it's a conversation. You try

525
00:25:52,998 --> 00:25:55,358
Speaker 2: to get him back in, but that's just part of

526
00:25:55,398 --> 00:25:57,918
Speaker 2: their makeup. I don't like the thing with the catcher.

527
00:25:58,038 --> 00:25:59,998
Speaker 2: I don't like the cross up. I don't like that

528
00:26:00,078 --> 00:26:02,998
Speaker 2: even a little bit. And we talked about this before,

529
00:26:03,038 --> 00:26:05,678
Speaker 2: and I thought that that could have easily resulted in

530
00:26:05,718 --> 00:26:08,158
Speaker 2: an actual fight, which would have been justified from the

531
00:26:08,198 --> 00:26:14,398
Speaker 2: catcher's perspective. So that that part, that's that's things for

532
00:26:14,518 --> 00:26:16,598
Speaker 2: a while. I don't even know if I could really

533
00:26:16,678 --> 00:26:20,198
Speaker 2: drop that that's always within his abilities or makeup. So

534
00:26:20,558 --> 00:26:23,318
Speaker 2: I think I think it's an aftermath of the petulant

535
00:26:23,358 --> 00:26:27,558
Speaker 2: behavior regarding just the little blow ups that he may

536
00:26:27,598 --> 00:26:30,438
Speaker 2: have when things aren't going his way, which is it's annoying,

537
00:26:30,518 --> 00:26:34,478
Speaker 2: it's annoying, and it's just part of who he is. However,

538
00:26:34,518 --> 00:26:37,278
Speaker 2: you got to look past that. You do or you

539
00:26:37,558 --> 00:26:39,118
Speaker 2: or you don't. But if you do, I mean, the

540
00:26:39,118 --> 00:26:40,918
Speaker 2: guy's still going to pitch. Well, he's going to give

541
00:26:40,918 --> 00:26:43,118
Speaker 2: you this number of being's going to be this successful.

542
00:26:43,478 --> 00:26:44,878
Speaker 2: He's going to help you get to wherever you want

543
00:26:44,878 --> 00:26:47,998
Speaker 2: to be, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. But when

544
00:26:48,038 --> 00:26:51,678
Speaker 2: you start messing and and yeah, the cross up really

545
00:26:51,838 --> 00:26:54,878
Speaker 2: would upset me a lot. So I think Detroit right now,

546
00:26:54,918 --> 00:26:58,798
Speaker 2: honeymoon phrase, AJ, we got this straightened out and it's

547
00:26:58,838 --> 00:27:01,198
Speaker 2: going to be fine. A couple of years from now

548
00:27:01,238 --> 00:27:02,998
Speaker 2: will be the tail of the tape. Whether or not

549
00:27:03,038 --> 00:27:06,838
Speaker 2: this really sticks and he adheres to this conversation, Who knows,

550
00:27:08,118 --> 00:27:11,478
Speaker 2: But I do like Valdez as a pitcher. The little

551
00:27:11,598 --> 00:27:13,678
Speaker 2: tantrums on the field, you never want to see them,

552
00:27:13,678 --> 00:27:17,478
Speaker 2: but they can be controlled. But to intentionally cross up

553
00:27:17,478 --> 00:27:20,558
Speaker 2: a catch you without any remorse, that would bother me

554
00:27:20,918 --> 00:27:21,238
Speaker 2: a lot.

555
00:27:21,278 --> 00:27:23,918
Speaker 1: Actually, that is a loaded staff they have right now.

556
00:27:24,398 --> 00:27:27,998
Speaker 1: I mean even a kid like Troy Milton, who really

557
00:27:28,358 --> 00:27:32,718
Speaker 1: blossomed in the postseason where you saw the upper nineties velocity,

558
00:27:32,878 --> 00:27:35,838
Speaker 1: the mound presence. Kid's got a big arm. You've got

559
00:27:35,918 --> 00:27:38,958
Speaker 1: Jack Flaherty now in the five spot in that rotation.

560
00:27:40,118 --> 00:27:42,638
Speaker 1: Detroit is loaded when it comes to their pitching. Not

561
00:27:42,678 --> 00:27:45,838
Speaker 1: sure about their offense and how good that's going to be.

562
00:27:46,158 --> 00:27:49,558
Speaker 1: Wasn't great last year, but they are a factor in

563
00:27:49,558 --> 00:27:52,078
Speaker 1: the American League, as are the Boston Red Sox. I

564
00:27:52,118 --> 00:27:54,998
Speaker 1: have a hard time, Joe deciding what the Boston Red

565
00:27:54,998 --> 00:27:59,558
Speaker 1: Sox are these days. A lot of changes they're going back.

566
00:27:59,678 --> 00:28:01,958
Speaker 1: Really it goes back to the Raffeld Devers trade last

567
00:28:01,998 --> 00:28:05,638
Speaker 1: year and losing Alex Bregman as well. They bring in

568
00:28:05,758 --> 00:28:10,398
Speaker 1: William Contreras, now they just traded for Caleb Durban, interesting

569
00:28:10,598 --> 00:28:14,398
Speaker 1: six player deal with the Milwaukee Brewers. I'm not sure

570
00:28:14,438 --> 00:28:17,718
Speaker 1: where he's going to play. My guess is Marcelo Mayer

571
00:28:17,798 --> 00:28:20,678
Speaker 1: is the primary third baseman in Durban place second base.

572
00:28:21,318 --> 00:28:23,278
Speaker 1: But let me tell you all the infielders the Red

573
00:28:23,318 --> 00:28:27,278
Speaker 1: Sox have right now, Caleb Durban Andrew Montasterio, who's also

574
00:28:27,278 --> 00:28:30,798
Speaker 1: picked up in that deal, Isaiah Kiner Felefo signed it

575
00:28:30,838 --> 00:28:34,798
Speaker 1: to free agent Brendan Rodgers. Marcello Mayer mentioned him, Romey Gonzalez,

576
00:28:34,838 --> 00:28:36,558
Speaker 1: who has a little bit of a shoulder injury that

577
00:28:36,638 --> 00:28:42,678
Speaker 1: needs to be healed. Christian Campbell, Nate Eaton, Nick Soguard,

578
00:28:43,198 --> 00:28:46,918
Speaker 1: Anthony Siegler, forgot about Tristan Cassis the first baseman. What

579
00:28:47,158 --> 00:28:50,478
Speaker 1: is Alex Core going to do with this group? I mean,

580
00:28:51,278 --> 00:28:53,998
Speaker 1: you're a little bit unset. I get it. Story is

581
00:28:54,038 --> 00:28:58,478
Speaker 1: your shortstop. Contreras is your first baseman. But there's other

582
00:28:58,518 --> 00:29:01,878
Speaker 1: two positions. Man, they got about eight players for two spots.

583
00:29:02,198 --> 00:29:04,678
Speaker 1: Do you like that going into spring training?

584
00:29:05,278 --> 00:29:07,598
Speaker 3: Well, what I'm hearing, I think is.

585
00:29:09,238 --> 00:29:12,198
Speaker 2: The Red Sox maybe stepping outside of their comfort zone

586
00:29:12,678 --> 00:29:16,638
Speaker 2: being so data and analytically driven. They're going for makeup

587
00:29:16,678 --> 00:29:20,758
Speaker 2: baseball players over data, and they're looking for the platoon advantage,

588
00:29:21,238 --> 00:29:24,558
Speaker 2: so that if they can't find Bregman, if they can't

589
00:29:24,598 --> 00:29:27,758
Speaker 2: find a guy to play against both sides, rightings and

590
00:29:27,838 --> 00:29:31,038
Speaker 2: lefties and feel as though he can play productively on

591
00:29:31,078 --> 00:29:33,798
Speaker 2: a daily basis, let's do this in another way.

592
00:29:33,838 --> 00:29:35,038
Speaker 3: That's what it sounds like to me.

593
00:29:35,678 --> 00:29:38,438
Speaker 2: I don't know the makeup of these other guys regarding

594
00:29:38,598 --> 00:29:41,758
Speaker 2: versus rightings, versus lefties, et cetera, but they have two

595
00:29:41,838 --> 00:29:44,878
Speaker 2: stalwarts now at two particular positions. So I think that's

596
00:29:44,958 --> 00:29:48,158
Speaker 2: that's what it sounds like. And really it's interesting to

597
00:29:48,198 --> 00:29:50,678
Speaker 2: me because Durbin, like, you're talking about guys with like

598
00:29:50,918 --> 00:29:54,398
Speaker 2: real makeup guys, hard playing guys, baseball guys kind of Felifa.

599
00:29:54,718 --> 00:29:57,598
Speaker 2: All these guys are like baseball more baseball guys than

600
00:29:57,638 --> 00:30:00,238
Speaker 2: they are analytical Maven's, you know.

601
00:30:00,318 --> 00:30:02,038
Speaker 3: So that's interesting to me.

602
00:30:02,478 --> 00:30:05,878
Speaker 2: I think maybe Bregman prove that to them that it

603
00:30:05,918 --> 00:30:10,838
Speaker 2: goes beyond just baseball talent alone, data analytical talent alone.

604
00:30:10,838 --> 00:30:13,958
Speaker 2: We have to have baseball players, good guys in the clubhouse,

605
00:30:14,038 --> 00:30:16,238
Speaker 2: guys with good makeup, guys that spread the good word

606
00:30:16,278 --> 00:30:18,238
Speaker 2: on a daily basis, they know to expect when they

607
00:30:18,278 --> 00:30:21,718
Speaker 2: show up. So that's what I'm reading out of those names.

608
00:30:21,958 --> 00:30:24,478
Speaker 2: We go up with makeup baseball guys over data, and

609
00:30:24,518 --> 00:30:26,158
Speaker 2: we're looking for a platoon advantage.

610
00:30:26,398 --> 00:30:28,518
Speaker 1: Reminds me of the twenty twenty five to around a

611
00:30:28,518 --> 00:30:32,958
Speaker 1: Blue Jays right there, you, I mean the way they

612
00:30:32,998 --> 00:30:35,598
Speaker 1: played offense. The way they played baseball was put the

613
00:30:35,598 --> 00:30:38,638
Speaker 1: ball in play, a lot of interchangeable parts, platoon advantages

614
00:30:38,678 --> 00:30:42,838
Speaker 1: for John Schneider to take advantage of. And maybe Boston

615
00:30:42,918 --> 00:30:46,398
Speaker 1: is building that kind of offense that doesn't necessarily have

616
00:30:46,478 --> 00:30:50,598
Speaker 1: a lot of big boppers, but can just wear you down.

617
00:30:50,918 --> 00:30:53,438
Speaker 1: And even look at the outfield for Alex Corey here,

618
00:30:53,558 --> 00:30:55,918
Speaker 1: I mean Roman Anthony to me has to play every

619
00:30:55,998 --> 00:30:58,758
Speaker 1: day right right to me, he's my everyday love fielder.

620
00:30:59,558 --> 00:31:01,718
Speaker 1: I know he's a young kid, just twenty one years old,

621
00:31:01,798 --> 00:31:03,638
Speaker 1: but I don't think he needs to be protected. I

622
00:31:03,638 --> 00:31:06,598
Speaker 1: think just let him run. You've got Saddan Raffaela in

623
00:31:06,638 --> 00:31:09,438
Speaker 1: center field, who is almost as good as just about

624
00:31:09,438 --> 00:31:12,878
Speaker 1: anybody defensively in centerfield. I think he's your primary center fielder.

625
00:31:12,878 --> 00:31:15,558
Speaker 1: But then you still have Jared Duran, You've got William

626
00:31:15,638 --> 00:31:20,158
Speaker 1: or Bray you you've got Matsataka Yoshida. I mean, do

627
00:31:20,198 --> 00:31:22,798
Speaker 1: you like these issues? If you're Alex Kora Joe, I mean,

628
00:31:22,918 --> 00:31:25,078
Speaker 1: are you with me on Roman Anthony that there's no

629
00:31:25,158 --> 00:31:28,358
Speaker 1: reason to protect him against lefties, that that he's the

630
00:31:28,398 --> 00:31:30,438
Speaker 1: way he controls the strike zone as a young player,

631
00:31:30,758 --> 00:31:32,038
Speaker 1: He's just plug and play for me.

632
00:31:32,718 --> 00:31:36,718
Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely, But once again, I think they're setting themselves

633
00:31:36,758 --> 00:31:39,718
Speaker 2: up to move people around. When you don't want to

634
00:31:39,758 --> 00:31:41,638
Speaker 2: spend a ton of dough on one guy, then you

635
00:31:41,758 --> 00:31:44,838
Speaker 2: have to, you know, build this whole thing around several

636
00:31:45,518 --> 00:31:47,238
Speaker 2: and it just seems like they won't with the ying

637
00:31:47,278 --> 00:31:49,998
Speaker 2: and the yang of everybody, or there's just really complimentary

638
00:31:50,078 --> 00:31:52,638
Speaker 2: kind of stuff all around the DIAMONDA. Yeah, I would

639
00:31:52,638 --> 00:31:55,438
Speaker 2: think Alex kind of digs on this again when you

640
00:31:55,678 --> 00:31:59,398
Speaker 2: I don't know if I've had real to a certain extent, Nah,

641
00:31:59,478 --> 00:32:01,758
Speaker 2: maybe a little bit in Chicago. But plug and play,

642
00:32:02,998 --> 00:32:06,038
Speaker 2: that's nice, And that's when you're able to spend enough

643
00:32:06,118 --> 00:32:09,078
Speaker 2: dough that you get guys a positions that are able

644
00:32:09,118 --> 00:32:13,638
Speaker 2: to do well well against both rightis and lefties. They

645
00:32:13,638 --> 00:32:16,358
Speaker 2: have the makeup and the stability, their bodies don't break

646
00:32:16,438 --> 00:32:18,918
Speaker 2: down to play every day kind of like what the

647
00:32:18,918 --> 00:32:22,038
Speaker 2: Braves have kind of sought for years. But when you

648
00:32:22,078 --> 00:32:25,038
Speaker 2: don't want to go that route and you have to

649
00:32:25,078 --> 00:32:28,238
Speaker 2: be more creative, and I think the analytics and analytical

650
00:32:28,278 --> 00:32:29,878
Speaker 2: departments in general like that.

651
00:32:30,478 --> 00:32:32,358
Speaker 3: They want that because.

652
00:32:32,038 --> 00:32:35,638
Speaker 2: They they feel more comfortable about that. Again, if they're

653
00:32:35,638 --> 00:32:37,758
Speaker 2: not going to spend that kind of dough, it really

654
00:32:37,798 --> 00:32:41,118
Speaker 2: permits them to quite frankly, tinker a little bit more So.

655
00:32:41,278 --> 00:32:44,798
Speaker 2: I think that's attractive to a lot of departments in

656
00:32:44,838 --> 00:32:47,598
Speaker 2: baseball to be able to quote unquote use.

657
00:32:47,518 --> 00:32:48,638
Speaker 3: The platoon advantages.

658
00:32:49,478 --> 00:32:54,238
Speaker 2: And I think that the overarching sensibilities of analytical departments

659
00:32:54,278 --> 00:32:57,158
Speaker 2: would be that we can match up in bullpens, we

660
00:32:57,158 --> 00:33:00,758
Speaker 2: can match up on offense, you really you know, defensive

661
00:33:00,758 --> 00:33:02,958
Speaker 2: replacements later in the game for those that are inefficient.

662
00:33:03,358 --> 00:33:05,798
Speaker 2: Those are the kind of things that really stir it

663
00:33:05,878 --> 00:33:08,438
Speaker 2: up with different groups in regards to preparation.

664
00:33:08,998 --> 00:33:11,278
Speaker 1: Here's the other question I want to ask you, Joe,

665
00:33:11,838 --> 00:33:15,198
Speaker 1: when it comes to the ABS challenge system, right, because

666
00:33:15,358 --> 00:33:17,478
Speaker 1: the first year we're going to have this system, it's

667
00:33:17,518 --> 00:33:19,878
Speaker 1: been in a place in the minor leagues where the hitter,

668
00:33:20,158 --> 00:33:23,038
Speaker 1: the catcher, the pitcher could challenge a ball strike call

669
00:33:23,198 --> 00:33:25,918
Speaker 1: by an umpire limited basis, it's not every single pitch.

670
00:33:26,838 --> 00:33:30,838
Speaker 1: I wonder if this is going to change how the

671
00:33:30,918 --> 00:33:33,998
Speaker 1: game is played. In other words, even though there's a

672
00:33:34,038 --> 00:33:36,918
Speaker 1: limited number of challenges, you're obviously going to use them

673
00:33:36,958 --> 00:33:39,518
Speaker 1: on very key at bets where you can swing your

674
00:33:40,078 --> 00:33:42,638
Speaker 1: you know, the expected outcome based on getting a call

675
00:33:42,718 --> 00:33:45,878
Speaker 1: reversed and the control of the strikes on which you

676
00:33:45,958 --> 00:33:48,758
Speaker 1: know has always been important as a hitter and as

677
00:33:48,798 --> 00:33:53,238
Speaker 1: a pitcher. Does that become even more important and does

678
00:33:53,318 --> 00:33:55,598
Speaker 1: that help you, at least in the back of your

679
00:33:55,638 --> 00:33:58,958
Speaker 1: mind in the building of a team that it's even

680
00:33:59,038 --> 00:34:03,078
Speaker 1: more important to have players hitters and pitchers and even

681
00:34:03,118 --> 00:34:07,398
Speaker 1: a catcher who have understandings and control of the strike zone.

682
00:34:07,598 --> 00:34:11,438
Speaker 2: Great topic, I would think on the surface, yes, but

683
00:34:11,718 --> 00:34:15,518
Speaker 2: I would think it's as a as a hitters concern,

684
00:34:16,838 --> 00:34:18,758
Speaker 2: this is just stin slicing it. I think that they

685
00:34:18,798 --> 00:34:21,198
Speaker 2: really want those hitters that are able to control it.

686
00:34:21,238 --> 00:34:23,558
Speaker 2: I think from a pitcher's perspective, they still want swing

687
00:34:23,598 --> 00:34:27,118
Speaker 2: and miss, and I think they're I don't think that

688
00:34:27,198 --> 00:34:31,158
Speaker 2: they're going to in their version digress regarding just seeking

689
00:34:31,278 --> 00:34:35,478
Speaker 2: velocity and again the ability to have a hitter miss

690
00:34:35,598 --> 00:34:40,598
Speaker 2: a pitch which would back off velocity a little different

691
00:34:40,638 --> 00:34:44,798
Speaker 2: training methods, et cetera. So I think from hitter's perspective, yeah,

692
00:34:44,838 --> 00:34:46,758
Speaker 2: I think the hitter really wants to fine tune that's

693
00:34:46,798 --> 00:34:48,798
Speaker 2: rich zone. But I think the pitcher's still going to

694
00:34:48,838 --> 00:34:51,078
Speaker 2: rely on hitter's chasing. I don't know if that makes

695
00:34:51,118 --> 00:34:54,318
Speaker 2: any sense. So if I'm building, I think I really

696
00:34:54,358 --> 00:34:56,958
Speaker 2: want offensive players that are going to stay within the zone.

697
00:34:57,798 --> 00:35:00,838
Speaker 2: The pitching side of things that's so built and predicated

698
00:35:00,878 --> 00:35:02,758
Speaker 2: on swing and miss one of the you know, the

699
00:35:02,798 --> 00:35:06,798
Speaker 2: true outcomes that I think is going to still see

700
00:35:06,638 --> 00:35:10,278
Speaker 2: the offensive side being a little bit more contained, whereas

701
00:35:10,278 --> 00:35:14,238
Speaker 2: the pitching side, Man, it's just such.

702
00:35:13,998 --> 00:35:15,558
Speaker 3: A big part of the fabric right now.

703
00:35:15,558 --> 00:35:17,078
Speaker 2: To have a hitter swing and missed that I don't

704
00:35:17,118 --> 00:35:20,318
Speaker 2: know that they're going to be as concerned about the

705
00:35:20,358 --> 00:35:22,358
Speaker 2: ability to stay in his own because that would really

706
00:35:22,878 --> 00:35:23,958
Speaker 2: alter training methods.

707
00:35:23,998 --> 00:35:27,158
Speaker 1: I think, yes, I agree with that. On the pitching side,

708
00:35:27,198 --> 00:35:31,278
Speaker 1: I do think the majority of this responsibility, let's call it,

709
00:35:31,318 --> 00:35:33,518
Speaker 1: will be in the hands of catchers. I think having

710
00:35:33,598 --> 00:35:36,398
Speaker 1: a catcher who has an understanding of what the strike

711
00:35:36,518 --> 00:35:40,318
Speaker 1: zone is is end game situation as well. Man, that's

712
00:35:40,358 --> 00:35:43,278
Speaker 1: going to be a skill that's almost as important as framing.

713
00:35:43,638 --> 00:35:43,798
Speaker 3: Right.

714
00:35:43,838 --> 00:35:46,118
Speaker 1: We've talked a lot for years about catchers to the

715
00:35:46,158 --> 00:35:49,038
Speaker 1: presentation of the baseball, and yes it does matter in

716
00:35:49,078 --> 00:35:52,118
Speaker 1: some cases, it does get overrated. But in this case,

717
00:35:52,158 --> 00:35:54,878
Speaker 1: I think having a catcher back there, and I don't

718
00:35:54,918 --> 00:35:57,318
Speaker 1: think it's necessarily an experienced one, but maybe even a

719
00:35:57,318 --> 00:35:59,718
Speaker 1: guy who came up in the minor leagues using this system,

720
00:36:00,358 --> 00:36:03,438
Speaker 1: but knowing when to pull the trigger on those challenges,

721
00:36:04,158 --> 00:36:07,478
Speaker 1: that's going to be huge because I think very few

722
00:36:07,518 --> 00:36:09,598
Speaker 1: pitchers are going to challenge the calls and be in

723
00:36:09,598 --> 00:36:12,158
Speaker 1: the hands of the catcher, and I think the catcher

724
00:36:12,198 --> 00:36:14,718
Speaker 1: has the best view of anybody, even better than the hitter.

725
00:36:15,278 --> 00:36:17,838
Speaker 1: So I think a lot of responsibility is going to

726
00:36:17,838 --> 00:36:20,518
Speaker 1: be in the in the mind and hands of the

727
00:36:20,558 --> 00:36:24,078
Speaker 1: catcher when to challenge these pitches and how to swing

728
00:36:24,238 --> 00:36:29,318
Speaker 1: perhaps a game at least account or a situation. Just

729
00:36:29,358 --> 00:36:30,678
Speaker 1: more stuff for the catchers to do.

730
00:36:30,798 --> 00:36:32,758
Speaker 3: Joe, that's a good point. Wow.

731
00:36:33,158 --> 00:36:38,318
Speaker 2: I've had catchers that I felt big too much, and

732
00:36:39,438 --> 00:36:42,438
Speaker 2: you have certain catchers that if they tell you something,

733
00:36:42,518 --> 00:36:45,918
Speaker 2: you really did believe them. So it's almost like there

734
00:36:45,998 --> 00:36:48,358
Speaker 2: was the catcher that was always crying for something I

735
00:36:48,398 --> 00:36:51,718
Speaker 2: didn't necessarily believe him. And then the guy that was,

736
00:36:52,198 --> 00:36:55,358
Speaker 2: you know, pretty pragmatic and only pop popped off ers

737
00:36:55,398 --> 00:36:56,758
Speaker 2: said something on occasion.

738
00:36:56,758 --> 00:36:57,998
Speaker 3: He's the guy that'd be more believable.

739
00:36:58,038 --> 00:37:03,158
Speaker 2: So then again, managerial discussion, pitching coach discussion, whomever, bullpen

740
00:37:03,278 --> 00:37:06,318
Speaker 2: coach discussion with Ketcher before the game, probably a little

741
00:37:06,318 --> 00:37:09,358
Speaker 2: bit more video study involved in this regarding and I

742
00:37:09,358 --> 00:37:15,438
Speaker 2: wouldn't be opposed to that the next day replaying close

743
00:37:15,478 --> 00:37:18,198
Speaker 2: calls or even going back to like just say umpires,

744
00:37:18,238 --> 00:37:20,038
Speaker 2: I mean, maybe it might be even more important to

745
00:37:21,358 --> 00:37:23,598
Speaker 2: although it's not going to matter because it's an automatic

746
00:37:23,598 --> 00:37:27,878
Speaker 2: strike zone, but you really, guys, you just got to

747
00:37:27,918 --> 00:37:34,598
Speaker 2: ask these guys that really understand and not be allowing

748
00:37:34,638 --> 00:37:38,438
Speaker 2: their own bias to enter into this thing. It's tough, man,

749
00:37:38,478 --> 00:37:40,158
Speaker 2: I mean I know that. As when I used to

750
00:37:40,358 --> 00:37:43,318
Speaker 2: really work with Ketcher's back when and I was a catcher,

751
00:37:43,918 --> 00:37:46,998
Speaker 2: I was really big on telling my guys, listen, if

752
00:37:47,038 --> 00:37:49,038
Speaker 2: the umpire made a good call and it was a ball,

753
00:37:49,198 --> 00:37:52,238
Speaker 2: let them know about it. So you maintain this integrity

754
00:37:52,238 --> 00:37:54,798
Speaker 2: with the umpire. And then and then if you really

755
00:37:54,798 --> 00:37:57,558
Speaker 2: needed or wanted to pitch and you did say something

756
00:37:57,598 --> 00:37:59,398
Speaker 2: to the other side list and man, we got to

757
00:37:59,438 --> 00:38:02,918
Speaker 2: have that that the Empire might pay more attention to you. Now,

758
00:38:02,918 --> 00:38:05,078
Speaker 2: I'm not again with the ABS system, that's going to

759
00:38:05,078 --> 00:38:07,758
Speaker 2: be moot because it's going to be controlled in another way.

760
00:38:07,758 --> 00:38:10,078
Speaker 2: But the point was just trying to get the catchers

761
00:38:10,078 --> 00:38:13,198
Speaker 2: to understand the integrity what you're doing back there in

762
00:38:13,238 --> 00:38:15,758
Speaker 2: regards to when to challenge something with the Empire verbally

763
00:38:15,878 --> 00:38:18,758
Speaker 2: or not. And I'm just gonna have to really know

764
00:38:18,878 --> 00:38:22,038
Speaker 2: my catchers at this point. And I guess the point

765
00:38:22,078 --> 00:38:24,318
Speaker 2: you're making AND's but still throwing is going to be

766
00:38:24,358 --> 00:38:26,038
Speaker 2: a part of this, isn't it. I mean the ability

767
00:38:26,078 --> 00:38:28,958
Speaker 2: to catch and throw throughout runners. I mean, with the

768
00:38:29,718 --> 00:38:33,398
Speaker 2: lacks ability for pitchers being able to hold runners in

769
00:38:33,438 --> 00:38:36,198
Speaker 2: the more prolific running games that are occurring, guys have

770
00:38:36,238 --> 00:38:40,438
Speaker 2: to have decent throwing arms that would believe so great point, Tommy,

771
00:38:40,518 --> 00:38:42,678
Speaker 2: I don't really have a strong answer to that, but

772
00:38:43,198 --> 00:38:45,358
Speaker 2: I do like you have to be able to read

773
00:38:45,398 --> 00:38:48,278
Speaker 2: your personnel in regards to giving them the latitude that

774
00:38:48,318 --> 00:38:49,038
Speaker 2: you're looking for.

775
00:38:49,638 --> 00:38:51,638
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's going to be exciting. I think

776
00:38:51,678 --> 00:38:53,038
Speaker 1: the fans are going to love it. I love the

777
00:38:53,078 --> 00:38:54,918
Speaker 1: fact that it is in the hands of the players.

778
00:38:54,958 --> 00:38:57,158
Speaker 1: You know, nobody's looking at the guy in the replay

779
00:38:57,238 --> 00:38:59,918
Speaker 1: room to decide what to do right. This is going

780
00:38:59,918 --> 00:39:01,758
Speaker 1: to be part of the skill set for a catcher,

781
00:39:02,238 --> 00:39:06,438
Speaker 1: especially some hitters as well. Obviously, guy like Alex Bregman

782
00:39:06,718 --> 00:39:09,238
Speaker 1: is famous for knowing the strikes on better than a

783
00:39:09,238 --> 00:39:12,398
Speaker 1: lot of umpires. We'll see how that plays out, but

784
00:39:12,438 --> 00:39:14,758
Speaker 1: I think fans on the whole are really going to

785
00:39:14,798 --> 00:39:17,158
Speaker 1: love this, and you will see some games that swing

786
00:39:17,918 --> 00:39:20,438
Speaker 1: on these challenges one way or the other. Hey, I

787
00:39:20,478 --> 00:39:23,078
Speaker 1: mentioned earlier on Joe he lost some really giants in

788
00:39:23,118 --> 00:39:24,718
Speaker 1: the world of sports. We're going to get to that

789
00:39:24,838 --> 00:39:26,638
Speaker 1: and our thought of the day from Joe coming up

790
00:39:26,718 --> 00:39:41,198
Speaker 1: right after this on the Book of Joe. Welcome back

791
00:39:41,238 --> 00:39:44,278
Speaker 1: to the Book of Joe. Going back to our football

792
00:39:44,358 --> 00:39:46,718
Speaker 1: team we started with Joe. You probably saw this. John

793
00:39:46,758 --> 00:39:51,438
Speaker 1: Brody and Sonny Jurgensen, two unbelievable quarterbacks. We lost them.

794
00:39:51,518 --> 00:39:55,158
Speaker 1: How about John Brodie's career, He was a league MVP,

795
00:39:55,518 --> 00:39:59,038
Speaker 1: played for seventeen years, He became the number one analyst

796
00:39:59,078 --> 00:40:01,838
Speaker 1: for NBC and oh, by the way, played on this

797
00:40:01,958 --> 00:40:04,798
Speaker 1: Senior Tour. Not only played in this Senior Tour, but

798
00:40:05,038 --> 00:40:08,838
Speaker 1: one on the senior Tour. What an amazing career from

799
00:40:08,838 --> 00:40:11,318
Speaker 1: the former great from the forty nine ers, John Brody.

800
00:40:11,798 --> 00:40:14,758
Speaker 2: I was a big fan Keysar Stadium in the mud,

801
00:40:15,238 --> 00:40:16,718
Speaker 2: number twelve, singing and around.

802
00:40:16,798 --> 00:40:16,998
Speaker 3: Man.

803
00:40:17,118 --> 00:40:19,638
Speaker 2: I knew nothing about him really other than the fact

804
00:40:19,638 --> 00:40:21,958
Speaker 2: that I loved John Brody and the way he played

805
00:40:21,958 --> 00:40:26,998
Speaker 2: football as a passer, very accurate, great touch. There was

806
00:40:27,038 --> 00:40:29,638
Speaker 2: just something about him and that those forty nine er teams.

807
00:40:29,638 --> 00:40:32,078
Speaker 2: I wasn't a fan of them in a sense, but

808
00:40:32,478 --> 00:40:36,278
Speaker 2: there was something mentally mystical about them playing at this

809
00:40:36,358 --> 00:40:39,438
Speaker 2: Keysar Stadium in San Francisco a lot of times in

810
00:40:39,478 --> 00:40:42,238
Speaker 2: clement looking weather, and they were good.

811
00:40:42,638 --> 00:40:44,998
Speaker 3: Was Hugh Mcaleney one of his running backs at that time?

812
00:40:45,198 --> 00:40:45,918
Speaker 3: Was he before that?

813
00:40:45,998 --> 00:40:48,758
Speaker 2: I don't know, but a lot of fun stuff about them,

814
00:40:48,998 --> 00:40:52,558
Speaker 2: and I'd read.

815
00:40:52,478 --> 00:40:53,318
Speaker 3: That I was upset.

816
00:40:53,358 --> 00:40:55,958
Speaker 2: It's kind of a marker in time for me as

817
00:40:56,038 --> 00:40:58,758
Speaker 2: a when I was a young football player and some

818
00:40:58,838 --> 00:41:01,838
Speaker 2: of my quarterback favorites and he was definitely one of them.

819
00:41:02,278 --> 00:41:03,758
Speaker 2: So yeah, and the fact that he was such a

820
00:41:03,758 --> 00:41:07,198
Speaker 2: good golf for which I'm not but to be able

821
00:41:07,238 --> 00:41:09,798
Speaker 2: to do that, play that well there and then actually

822
00:41:10,798 --> 00:41:13,878
Speaker 2: be on a Tour, like that's that's really impressive.

823
00:41:14,238 --> 00:41:16,438
Speaker 1: I mean he was when he retired, he had the

824
00:41:16,478 --> 00:41:19,638
Speaker 1: third most passing yards in NFL history, and then goes

825
00:41:19,678 --> 00:41:22,758
Speaker 1: out and wins on the Senior Tour. Just crazy it is.

826
00:41:22,798 --> 00:41:25,038
Speaker 1: And then there is Sonny Jurgensen from the same era,

827
00:41:25,758 --> 00:41:29,318
Speaker 1: a real slinger of the football, Number nine, Sonny Jurgensen.

828
00:41:31,198 --> 00:41:33,198
Speaker 1: I thought he was fun to watch Joe because he

829
00:41:34,398 --> 00:41:38,358
Speaker 1: had a great passing arm. He just threw a great ball,

830
00:41:38,438 --> 00:41:40,438
Speaker 1: or something about the way he delivered the ball to

831
00:41:41,158 --> 00:41:43,678
Speaker 1: his receivers and the fact that he looked like every

832
00:41:43,718 --> 00:41:46,518
Speaker 1: man out there, the single bar face mask, you know,

833
00:41:46,678 --> 00:41:50,478
Speaker 1: the paunch hanging over the pants. He was every man

834
00:41:50,558 --> 00:41:54,918
Speaker 1: out there, slinging it left and right. And Vince Lombardi

835
00:41:55,438 --> 00:41:59,198
Speaker 1: was his last quarterback. Nineteen sixty nine Redskins had Sonny

836
00:41:59,238 --> 00:42:02,278
Speaker 1: Jurgensen as their quarterback, Vince Lombardi as coach, and Lombardi

837
00:42:02,398 --> 00:42:04,838
Speaker 1: basically said he was the best quarter you ever had.

838
00:42:05,398 --> 00:42:08,398
Speaker 1: So Sonny Jurgenson, yeah, you must have some memories of him,

839
00:42:08,478 --> 00:42:11,158
Speaker 1: Joe as a guy growing up and watching John Brody,

840
00:42:11,238 --> 00:42:13,558
Speaker 1: but also Sonny Jurgensen and the way he just slung

841
00:42:13,598 --> 00:42:14,118
Speaker 1: the football.

842
00:42:14,598 --> 00:42:16,718
Speaker 2: I loved the low release point. I loved the way

843
00:42:16,758 --> 00:42:18,718
Speaker 2: it came out of his hand. It was just so

844
00:42:18,958 --> 00:42:22,958
Speaker 2: incredibly crisp and sharp. Like you're talking about. The phrase

845
00:42:22,998 --> 00:42:24,758
Speaker 2: they used a lot today is that he could really

846
00:42:24,798 --> 00:42:27,438
Speaker 2: spin a ball. Yeah, and you're right down to the

847
00:42:27,478 --> 00:42:32,638
Speaker 2: physical description. Michael Leddy was a broadcaster in Carlisle and

848
00:42:32,678 --> 00:42:35,478
Speaker 2: that's where the Redskins used to have spring training for them,

849
00:42:35,598 --> 00:42:38,158
Speaker 2: or autumn training whatever. And I glad he used to

850
00:42:39,038 --> 00:42:41,838
Speaker 2: actually knew Sonny Jurgenson from that time down there. And

851
00:42:42,718 --> 00:42:44,998
Speaker 2: you know, of course he was legendary off the field too,

852
00:42:45,718 --> 00:42:47,638
Speaker 2: which always was kind of attractive.

853
00:42:48,238 --> 00:42:52,358
Speaker 1: Yeah, he said when he got traded from Philadelphia to Washington,

854
00:42:52,878 --> 00:42:56,678
Speaker 1: he said, the bartenders in Philadelphia are wearing black armbands today.

855
00:42:56,958 --> 00:42:59,118
Speaker 3: Okay, that that sums it up right there.

856
00:42:59,398 --> 00:43:00,998
Speaker 2: You know, as a young man growing up in the

857
00:43:01,078 --> 00:43:04,758
Speaker 2: seventies and these quarterbacks, you know, I like, I liked that.

858
00:43:04,878 --> 00:43:09,998
Speaker 2: I liked the fact that these quarterbacks were bold, aggressive,

859
00:43:10,278 --> 00:43:14,158
Speaker 2: kind of risk takers heard a different beat, whether it

860
00:43:14,198 --> 00:43:17,398
Speaker 2: was Jurgensen, name it of course, et cetera. And then

861
00:43:17,398 --> 00:43:20,238
Speaker 2: my dad loved Bart's starr because it was the antithesis

862
00:43:20,278 --> 00:43:23,918
Speaker 2: of all this. But for Lombardi to say that because

863
00:43:23,958 --> 00:43:25,638
Speaker 2: I just thought he had Bart Starr and that was

864
00:43:25,678 --> 00:43:29,198
Speaker 2: pretty good too, is impressive, but the way he delivered

865
00:43:29,198 --> 00:43:35,438
Speaker 2: a football Jurgensen uniquely done and it was just like

866
00:43:35,558 --> 00:43:37,558
Speaker 2: slinging is the right, I guess, you know, we heard

867
00:43:37,598 --> 00:43:40,958
Speaker 2: of slinging Sammy Bob, but Sunny Jurgensen had this unique

868
00:43:41,038 --> 00:43:43,918
Speaker 2: method of delivering the football and gosh, it just it

869
00:43:43,958 --> 00:43:46,238
Speaker 2: looked like it was high velocity, It spun great and

870
00:43:46,398 --> 00:43:49,638
Speaker 2: was very accurate. So I read that in ninety two

871
00:43:49,718 --> 00:43:52,398
Speaker 2: ninety three, I think he was upset me again again

872
00:43:52,438 --> 00:43:56,158
Speaker 2: a marker. Remember the football cards were watching him on television.

873
00:43:56,798 --> 00:44:01,118
Speaker 2: It was always he was entertaining, man, charismatic, the kind

874
00:44:01,158 --> 00:44:03,838
Speaker 2: of athlete that you could identify with as a kid,

875
00:44:03,918 --> 00:44:06,078
Speaker 2: and then you know you wanted to be like that eventually.

876
00:44:06,118 --> 00:44:09,398
Speaker 2: And so yeah, it's a marker in time. And it's

877
00:44:09,438 --> 00:44:11,678
Speaker 2: sad for both of these guys to be gone because

878
00:44:12,038 --> 00:44:14,558
Speaker 2: as a kid growing up, I did really I don't

879
00:44:14,558 --> 00:44:16,718
Speaker 2: know if I idolized them, but I really paid attention

880
00:44:16,758 --> 00:44:18,438
Speaker 2: to them a lot because I thought they were that good.

881
00:44:18,678 --> 00:44:22,038
Speaker 1: Yeah, guys like Brody Jurgensen, Nymith. You mentioned they actually

882
00:44:22,038 --> 00:44:24,318
Speaker 1: threw a lot of interceptions compared to the game today,

883
00:44:24,398 --> 00:44:26,998
Speaker 1: they're willing to take more chances. So you're dead on

884
00:44:27,118 --> 00:44:30,238
Speaker 1: with that. And from the baseball world, I have to

885
00:44:30,278 --> 00:44:34,438
Speaker 1: note the passing of the great Mark Marquis, the great

886
00:44:34,438 --> 00:44:37,878
Speaker 1: coach at Stanford, went back to back national titles there.

887
00:44:39,238 --> 00:44:41,718
Speaker 1: Basically he spent a half century at Stanford, starting as

888
00:44:41,718 --> 00:44:43,878
Speaker 1: a player, came back as an assistant coach, and then

889
00:44:43,878 --> 00:44:46,918
Speaker 1: of course a head coach for forty one seasons. Old

890
00:44:46,918 --> 00:44:50,078
Speaker 1: school joe, I mean you know that he was a

891
00:44:50,118 --> 00:44:52,718
Speaker 1: guy who he would have his players practice, had a

892
00:44:52,758 --> 00:44:55,438
Speaker 1: stand for the national anthem. He would always talk to

893
00:44:55,518 --> 00:44:58,358
Speaker 1: them coffee and red meat. Coffee and red meat. That

894
00:44:58,518 --> 00:45:01,078
Speaker 1: was the way to live your life. He made sure

895
00:45:01,118 --> 00:45:03,318
Speaker 1: his players took their hat off when they came indoors,

896
00:45:03,318 --> 00:45:06,198
Speaker 1: no hats, and he was a stickler. He was a

897
00:45:06,198 --> 00:45:09,998
Speaker 1: guy who believed in Lombardi time. If you know practice

898
00:45:10,078 --> 00:45:12,358
Speaker 1: is at one o'clock, he might actually start it at

899
00:45:12,398 --> 00:45:14,838
Speaker 1: twelve fifty five, and if you weren't there, you were late.

900
00:45:15,198 --> 00:45:17,838
Speaker 1: So if you weren't early, you were late. That's the

901
00:45:17,878 --> 00:45:19,718
Speaker 1: way he ran things. I'm not sure if you could

902
00:45:19,798 --> 00:45:24,118
Speaker 1: do that today, but he did that successfully into five

903
00:45:24,198 --> 00:45:25,518
Speaker 1: decades at Stanford.

904
00:45:25,678 --> 00:45:31,198
Speaker 2: Actually played with Mark in Boulder, Colorado. He was high energy,

905
00:45:31,478 --> 00:45:34,158
Speaker 2: clean cut, played it hard. This is I think it

906
00:45:34,158 --> 00:45:36,598
Speaker 2: was the seventy five Boulder Collegiates. We won the national

907
00:45:36,678 --> 00:45:41,318
Speaker 2: championship him in Baldy, Baldy MUSCHEDI Baldy loved Mark and

908
00:45:41,358 --> 00:45:42,518
Speaker 2: that's where I got to know him.

909
00:45:42,798 --> 00:45:43,438
Speaker 3: We were friendly.

910
00:45:43,478 --> 00:45:46,918
Speaker 2: We were friends even when he went out to Stanford,

911
00:45:47,278 --> 00:45:48,798
Speaker 2: met up with them a couple of times, or saw

912
00:45:48,838 --> 00:45:51,038
Speaker 2: him at different places. I think actually like texted with

913
00:45:51,118 --> 00:45:54,038
Speaker 2: him and called him and stayed in touch, but he was.

914
00:45:54,238 --> 00:45:54,838
Speaker 3: In and out.

915
00:45:55,238 --> 00:46:00,918
Speaker 2: He's the libby breathed, live die baseball guy. He had

916
00:46:00,958 --> 00:46:04,238
Speaker 2: his methods, his sensibilities, the way he lived than it

917
00:46:04,278 --> 00:46:07,238
Speaker 2: was not going to be compromising. Not I love the

918
00:46:07,238 --> 00:46:10,518
Speaker 2: fact that they called him nine because I've I've Ruben

919
00:46:10,558 --> 00:46:11,478
Speaker 2: Tomorrow played there.

920
00:46:11,558 --> 00:46:13,318
Speaker 3: Doc Davis played there.

921
00:46:13,958 --> 00:46:15,758
Speaker 2: A bunch of guys that I've had in the past

922
00:46:15,838 --> 00:46:18,358
Speaker 2: have played for him at Stanford also, and they would

923
00:46:18,358 --> 00:46:20,798
Speaker 2: tell me stories about it. I would just giggle. But

924
00:46:20,918 --> 00:46:26,918
Speaker 2: I see a real crew cut, square, jod hard playing,

925
00:46:27,998 --> 00:46:31,998
Speaker 2: smiled easily guy that I played with in Boulder, Colorado

926
00:46:32,278 --> 00:46:34,798
Speaker 2: back in the day. So that again, that that bummed

927
00:46:34,838 --> 00:46:36,798
Speaker 2: me out when I saw that I had a look

928
00:46:36,838 --> 00:46:37,318
Speaker 2: at his age.

929
00:46:37,358 --> 00:46:38,238
Speaker 3: I didn't really know.

930
00:46:38,398 --> 00:46:41,678
Speaker 2: I can't couldn't remember specifically, wasn't much older than me eight,

931
00:46:41,758 --> 00:46:43,278
Speaker 2: So yeah, that's quite a loss.

932
00:46:43,558 --> 00:46:44,758
Speaker 3: Yeah too young man.

933
00:46:44,838 --> 00:46:48,638
Speaker 2: And he was he was a hard playing baseball guy

934
00:46:48,718 --> 00:46:50,878
Speaker 2: that then he then he coached it the same way

935
00:46:50,878 --> 00:46:51,358
Speaker 2: he played it.

936
00:46:52,038 --> 00:46:55,358
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is another era the multi sport player. He

937
00:46:55,398 --> 00:46:58,878
Speaker 1: actually went to Stanford and played both football and baseball

938
00:46:58,958 --> 00:47:01,958
Speaker 1: and always was partial to those type of athletes at Stanford,

939
00:47:01,958 --> 00:47:05,878
Speaker 1: including guys like John Elway and John Lynch. He got

940
00:47:05,958 --> 00:47:08,758
Speaker 1: to Stamford in sixty five. He was a political science

941
00:47:08,838 --> 00:47:12,678
Speaker 1: major and his roommate was Mitt Romney, and in the

942
00:47:12,718 --> 00:47:16,598
Speaker 1: football team he was the backup to Jim Plunkett, future

943
00:47:16,678 --> 00:47:20,598
Speaker 1: Heisman Trophy winner with Stanford. So he did play four

944
00:47:20,638 --> 00:47:23,038
Speaker 1: seasons of baseball in the minor leagues with the Chicago

945
00:47:23,078 --> 00:47:27,038
Speaker 1: White Sox, but after that really just established his career,

946
00:47:28,238 --> 00:47:31,678
Speaker 1: you know, not just coaching, but being a mentor to

947
00:47:31,798 --> 00:47:34,438
Speaker 1: so many people. I think it was more than two

948
00:47:34,518 --> 00:47:37,078
Speaker 1: hundred players of his and his time there were drafted

949
00:47:37,118 --> 00:47:40,518
Speaker 1: by the major leagues. One of his biggest highlights, he said,

950
00:47:40,678 --> 00:47:43,678
Speaker 1: was late in his career they brought back more than

951
00:47:43,678 --> 00:47:46,438
Speaker 1: one hundred players came back to Stamford to honor him.

952
00:47:46,798 --> 00:47:48,958
Speaker 1: And seeing those guys care enough to come back to

953
00:47:49,038 --> 00:47:52,358
Speaker 1: campus and across so many different ages all those years,

954
00:47:53,678 --> 00:47:55,478
Speaker 1: that to him was even better than winning the back

955
00:47:55,518 --> 00:47:57,678
Speaker 1: to back championships in eighty seven and eighty eight.

956
00:47:58,198 --> 00:48:00,638
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was a perfect place in time for him

957
00:48:00,718 --> 00:48:05,078
Speaker 2: to be. Like I said, just a straight forward, straight up.

958
00:48:05,198 --> 00:48:08,238
Speaker 2: There was nothing hidden there. This is what I'm about.

959
00:48:08,918 --> 00:48:12,798
Speaker 2: The hats off, I get that one hundred percent button down,

960
00:48:13,478 --> 00:48:15,478
Speaker 2: eyes forward, all that kind of good stuff.

961
00:48:16,278 --> 00:48:18,598
Speaker 3: But I do remember a guy that smiled easily.

962
00:48:18,678 --> 00:48:21,958
Speaker 2: He was a great teammate, and I enjoyed the opportunity

963
00:48:22,038 --> 00:48:22,598
Speaker 2: to play with him.

964
00:48:22,598 --> 00:48:25,798
Speaker 3: At that point. I was really happy for his success.

965
00:48:25,878 --> 00:48:27,638
Speaker 2: I don't even know if I was surprised by it

966
00:48:27,678 --> 00:48:29,878
Speaker 2: a little bit, only because I didn't know him deeply enough.

967
00:48:29,918 --> 00:48:33,278
Speaker 2: I didn't know that was part of his potential future

968
00:48:33,318 --> 00:48:36,838
Speaker 2: is something that he really wanted to do. But definitely

969
00:48:38,278 --> 00:48:41,118
Speaker 2: knew what he knew. This is who I am, This

970
00:48:41,158 --> 00:48:43,318
Speaker 2: is how I think. I'm not going to apologize for it.

971
00:48:43,358 --> 00:48:46,158
Speaker 2: I'm not going to I'm not going to compromise for this.

972
00:48:46,158 --> 00:48:48,518
Speaker 2: This is how I think things should be done and

973
00:48:48,558 --> 00:48:51,358
Speaker 2: of course turned it into a magnificent career at Stanford.

974
00:48:51,758 --> 00:48:54,598
Speaker 1: I love the line from Aj Hinch, who played for

975
00:48:54,678 --> 00:48:57,358
Speaker 1: him at Stanford. Of course a guy who was that

976
00:48:57,598 --> 00:49:00,558
Speaker 1: tough and really a disciplinarian, right, oh yeah, But as

977
00:49:00,598 --> 00:49:04,398
Speaker 1: Aj put it, you did not want to let him down.

978
00:49:05,158 --> 00:49:07,158
Speaker 1: That to me, Joe is one of the markers of

979
00:49:07,238 --> 00:49:14,238
Speaker 1: a great coach, manager, leader, whatever it may be. Where

980
00:49:14,918 --> 00:49:16,678
Speaker 1: you know, I think it was Eisenhower who once said

981
00:49:16,678 --> 00:49:18,358
Speaker 1: the key to leadership is to get people to do

982
00:49:18,438 --> 00:49:21,158
Speaker 1: things they normally wouldn't do but for the sake of

983
00:49:21,278 --> 00:49:23,838
Speaker 1: the group. In this case, I think the fact that

984
00:49:23,878 --> 00:49:27,758
Speaker 1: you don't want to let your coach down really speaks

985
00:49:27,798 --> 00:49:33,198
Speaker 1: to that connection between the leader and the player. And

986
00:49:33,238 --> 00:49:36,078
Speaker 1: it certainly sounds like Mark Marquis was one of those leaders.

987
00:49:36,438 --> 00:49:38,718
Speaker 2: It's almost like you knew he was a better person

988
00:49:38,758 --> 00:49:42,238
Speaker 2: than you were. You know, he just he was beyond reproach.

989
00:49:42,358 --> 00:49:46,158
Speaker 2: He was almost again it was almost like perfect in

990
00:49:46,198 --> 00:49:48,998
Speaker 2: a sense. And you're going to disagree with some of

991
00:49:49,038 --> 00:49:52,678
Speaker 2: this stuff just because he is so straight laced and

992
00:49:52,758 --> 00:49:58,078
Speaker 2: like I said, button down whatever. So you bought in,

993
00:49:58,278 --> 00:50:01,918
Speaker 2: you know, you bought into all this again the beginning.

994
00:50:01,918 --> 00:50:04,238
Speaker 2: It might be difficult or some things you don't agree

995
00:50:04,238 --> 00:50:07,198
Speaker 2: with necessarily because just because of where you come from,

996
00:50:07,238 --> 00:50:11,638
Speaker 2: and maybe just you were a little bit more lenient

997
00:50:11,758 --> 00:50:14,598
Speaker 2: in your behavior as he was uncompromising. So I think

998
00:50:14,678 --> 00:50:18,318
Speaker 2: that eventually the guys would realize that, and then at

999
00:50:18,358 --> 00:50:21,038
Speaker 2: some point, maybe not in that immediate moment, but at

1000
00:50:21,038 --> 00:50:23,438
Speaker 2: some point you would realize he did all of this

1001
00:50:23,718 --> 00:50:27,598
Speaker 2: for my betterment, and thank god I ran across him

1002
00:50:27,638 --> 00:50:29,278
Speaker 2: because he did make a difference in my life.

1003
00:50:29,798 --> 00:50:32,518
Speaker 1: Good stuff, Joe, and I know we end each episode

1004
00:50:32,558 --> 00:50:34,878
Speaker 1: with their thought of the day you teased it earlier.

1005
00:50:34,918 --> 00:50:36,318
Speaker 1: What do you have for us this time on the

1006
00:50:36,318 --> 00:50:36,958
Speaker 1: Book of Joe.

1007
00:50:37,438 --> 00:50:38,718
Speaker 3: Well, this is a little bit longer.

1008
00:50:38,718 --> 00:50:41,238
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, but I got this article from one of

1009
00:50:41,238 --> 00:50:44,598
Speaker 2: my former coaches yesterday and was on be a LinkedIn,

1010
00:50:44,678 --> 00:50:47,078
Speaker 2: but it was an article by you get the guy's

1011
00:50:47,158 --> 00:50:49,038
Speaker 2: name right here because I thought it was that good

1012
00:50:49,518 --> 00:50:50,318
Speaker 2: Owen Kelly.

1013
00:50:50,798 --> 00:50:51,278
Speaker 3: He's a.

1014
00:50:53,838 --> 00:50:56,278
Speaker 2: Scott with the Cincinnati Reds. And this is a data

1015
00:50:56,358 --> 00:51:01,398
Speaker 2: versus the heartbeat kind of an article. And I was

1016
00:51:01,398 --> 00:51:05,118
Speaker 2: talking just briefly in the beginning. This is never analytics

1017
00:51:05,158 --> 00:51:09,838
Speaker 2: didn't rise because scouting failed. Scouting has always been imperfect,

1018
00:51:09,838 --> 00:51:11,718
Speaker 2: So this is not a quote necessarily, but maybe like

1019
00:51:11,758 --> 00:51:17,358
Speaker 2: a little bit of a commentary. Scouting has always been imperfect,

1020
00:51:17,878 --> 00:51:20,958
Speaker 2: but so as every other evaluation system in baseball history.

1021
00:51:20,998 --> 00:51:25,278
Speaker 2: Analytics rose because it offered something ownership in front offices wanted.

1022
00:51:26,198 --> 00:51:30,038
Speaker 2: They wanted defensible decisions, and we've talked about it as

1023
00:51:31,158 --> 00:51:33,638
Speaker 2: analytics providing a safety net for decision making.

1024
00:51:34,478 --> 00:51:36,038
Speaker 3: I mean, this guy had me at that.

1025
00:51:36,398 --> 00:51:39,358
Speaker 2: That was like the third paragraph into this article, and

1026
00:51:39,398 --> 00:51:43,278
Speaker 2: I thought, wow, this is really on point in regards

1027
00:51:43,278 --> 00:51:46,918
Speaker 2: to which going on his belief is risky. Models are

1028
00:51:47,038 --> 00:51:53,238
Speaker 2: safer because these scouts offer convictions, dashboards, models and probabilities

1029
00:51:53,278 --> 00:51:55,358
Speaker 2: make it easier to explain why a player was taken

1030
00:51:55,438 --> 00:52:00,398
Speaker 2: or passed on. So the reality that's what created the

1031
00:52:00,478 --> 00:52:02,918
Speaker 2: power shift in the game, where belief of the scout

1032
00:52:02,998 --> 00:52:06,198
Speaker 2: is risky, where the models are safer, because if you're

1033
00:52:06,238 --> 00:52:09,118
Speaker 2: an owner and you have all this money invested, you

1034
00:52:09,198 --> 00:52:13,198
Speaker 2: want something that you can understand more easily and you're

1035
00:52:13,198 --> 00:52:16,798
Speaker 2: not just going to rely on the belief system.

1036
00:52:16,198 --> 00:52:17,318
Speaker 3: Of a scout.

1037
00:52:17,558 --> 00:52:19,998
Speaker 2: The next page is to stay with me because I

1038
00:52:20,038 --> 00:52:24,558
Speaker 2: thought this was outstanding too. What analytics can't measure, analytics

1039
00:52:24,598 --> 00:52:25,438
Speaker 2: does valuable work.

1040
00:52:25,478 --> 00:52:26,438
Speaker 3: There's no denying that.

1041
00:52:26,478 --> 00:52:29,558
Speaker 2: But baseball made a critical mistake when it began confusing

1042
00:52:30,078 --> 00:52:33,758
Speaker 2: what can be measured and what matters most. I mean,

1043
00:52:33,918 --> 00:52:36,078
Speaker 2: this guy did a great job of sitting down to

1044
00:52:36,078 --> 00:52:40,318
Speaker 2: putting this together. Analytics can measure exit velocity, spin rate,

1045
00:52:40,398 --> 00:52:46,358
Speaker 2: launch angle, chase rate, batspeed, no argument. Scouting evaluates make

1046
00:52:46,398 --> 00:52:51,598
Speaker 2: a baseball IQ competitiveness, poised, adaptability, leadership, how a player

1047
00:52:51,958 --> 00:52:57,078
Speaker 2: handles failure and pressure. A scout can explain a player

1048
00:52:57,158 --> 00:52:59,438
Speaker 2: swing path, how the barre ementhers his zone, where it

1049
00:52:59,478 --> 00:53:02,798
Speaker 2: stays long, whether it will survive elite velocity while the

1050
00:53:02,838 --> 00:53:06,958
Speaker 2: analytics guy is getting lunched. One evaluation happens in real time,

1051
00:53:07,198 --> 00:53:10,478
Speaker 2: with context and instinct. The other comes later once the

1052
00:53:10,638 --> 00:53:15,038
Speaker 2: data is processed and framed. Our cover baseball is and

1053
00:53:15,118 --> 00:53:18,038
Speaker 2: one by dashboards. It's one by players who don't flinch.

1054
00:53:19,358 --> 00:53:22,238
Speaker 2: So I again, I'm just what motivated this for me

1055
00:53:22,438 --> 00:53:24,478
Speaker 2: was the beginning of the baseball season and what we're

1056
00:53:24,518 --> 00:53:28,918
Speaker 2: witnessing right now. I just thought that this guy explained

1057
00:53:28,918 --> 00:53:33,718
Speaker 2: it so well, and the last point was I'm just

1058
00:53:33,838 --> 00:53:37,878
Speaker 2: jumping through this. But numbers explain what already happened. Scouts

1059
00:53:37,918 --> 00:53:42,318
Speaker 2: tell you what's about to happen. And again it really

1060
00:53:42,318 --> 00:53:45,718
Speaker 2: comes down to being able to understand and how to

1061
00:53:45,758 --> 00:53:49,118
Speaker 2: balance both of these sectors, utilizing them both in your

1062
00:53:49,118 --> 00:53:52,918
Speaker 2: evaluation process within your organization to get to that point

1063
00:53:52,998 --> 00:53:56,958
Speaker 2: where your balance is achieved and you're getting you know,

1064
00:53:57,198 --> 00:54:00,158
Speaker 2: you know, you kind of unearthed and expose what you

1065
00:54:00,238 --> 00:54:03,918
Speaker 2: might like data driven, But then you have to really

1066
00:54:04,038 --> 00:54:05,318
Speaker 2: understand who am I buying right here?

1067
00:54:05,398 --> 00:54:06,518
Speaker 3: What am I really getting into?

1068
00:54:06,958 --> 00:54:09,998
Speaker 2: Do all these other components that the real scout has

1069
00:54:10,038 --> 00:54:12,638
Speaker 2: focused on for years to make up the IQ, the

1070
00:54:12,638 --> 00:54:17,638
Speaker 2: competitives to poise that's not evaluated numerically, that has to

1071
00:54:17,638 --> 00:54:21,038
Speaker 2: be that's the human element that has to be watched

1072
00:54:21,038 --> 00:54:23,798
Speaker 2: and understood, and that comes from years of experience.

1073
00:54:23,838 --> 00:54:25,318
Speaker 3: So anyway, great article.

1074
00:54:25,398 --> 00:54:28,438
Speaker 2: The guy's name once again a former scout with the

1075
00:54:28,478 --> 00:54:31,958
Speaker 2: Cincinnati Reds, would I say, Owen Kelly, Owen Kelly, And

1076
00:54:32,038 --> 00:54:33,718
Speaker 2: I thought, yeah, Owen Kelly.

1077
00:54:33,718 --> 00:54:35,078
Speaker 3: I thought was really well written.

1078
00:54:35,638 --> 00:54:39,158
Speaker 2: And the motivation was here comes the baseball season, Here

1079
00:54:39,158 --> 00:54:42,798
Speaker 2: comes spring training, which was my favorite, almost my favorite

1080
00:54:42,838 --> 00:54:46,038
Speaker 2: time of the baseball year. Was so pure, and you

1081
00:54:46,118 --> 00:54:49,958
Speaker 2: play the games just to see what's going on player evaluation,

1082
00:54:50,238 --> 00:54:52,678
Speaker 2: getting your points across, getting the methods involved.

1083
00:54:53,198 --> 00:54:53,838
Speaker 3: So cool.

1084
00:54:54,398 --> 00:55:00,438
Speaker 2: And so that's why when this coach sent this to me,

1085
00:55:01,158 --> 00:55:04,638
Speaker 2: I really said, Wow, this is well written, all thought out,

1086
00:55:04,958 --> 00:55:08,518
Speaker 2: and I thought it was germane appropriate to the time.

1087
00:55:08,318 --> 00:55:08,718
Speaker 3: Of the year.

1088
00:55:09,038 --> 00:55:11,278
Speaker 1: Absolutely, he just brought me all the way back to

1089
00:55:11,318 --> 00:55:13,438
Speaker 1: the Super Bowl and the commercials that we talked about.

1090
00:55:13,558 --> 00:55:15,878
Speaker 1: In fact, there is a commercial I'm not sure if

1091
00:55:15,878 --> 00:55:20,318
Speaker 1: you've caught it watching it of football scouts essentially picking

1092
00:55:20,358 --> 00:55:23,918
Speaker 1: the player yes from analytics off the laptop. You basically

1093
00:55:23,958 --> 00:55:27,638
Speaker 1: didn't even need to be there. Anybody could have done

1094
00:55:27,638 --> 00:55:30,798
Speaker 1: it because they're so happy with themselves because the AI

1095
00:55:30,878 --> 00:55:34,678
Speaker 1: system is telling him who to draft based entirely on numbers.

1096
00:55:35,118 --> 00:55:39,318
Speaker 1: And we saw other commercials where AI is literally taking

1097
00:55:39,398 --> 00:55:42,478
Speaker 1: work away from people and that's supposed to be a

1098
00:55:42,478 --> 00:55:46,438
Speaker 1: good thing. Things are happening at warp speed now, Joe,

1099
00:55:46,598 --> 00:55:49,718
Speaker 1: and like it or not, AI has breached the moat

1100
00:55:50,078 --> 00:55:52,158
Speaker 1: and it is in the castle and it's up to

1101
00:55:52,198 --> 00:55:53,798
Speaker 1: decide whether this is friend or folk.

1102
00:55:54,158 --> 00:55:57,558
Speaker 2: Yeah, and again it's also we need to get Laura

1103
00:55:57,638 --> 00:55:59,638
Speaker 2: Wong on one of these shows, the lady that I

1104
00:55:59,678 --> 00:56:02,958
Speaker 2: know that wrote the book you already know, professor at

1105
00:56:02,998 --> 00:56:09,398
Speaker 2: Northeastern Universe City, and she's talking about how intuition, got feeling, wisdom, intelligence,

1106
00:56:09,438 --> 00:56:13,118
Speaker 2: all those things based on experience is so vital to

1107
00:56:13,598 --> 00:56:18,678
Speaker 2: CEO coos people making huge decisions for different corporations and

1108
00:56:18,798 --> 00:56:24,758
Speaker 2: industry that they walk away from the numb driven defensible

1109
00:56:24,838 --> 00:56:32,678
Speaker 2: decisions and rely more on the scouting decisions where you're

1110
00:56:32,718 --> 00:56:36,598
Speaker 2: working on poise and intelligence and feel and things that

1111
00:56:36,678 --> 00:56:38,998
Speaker 2: you can only extract from a conversation you have from

1112
00:56:39,038 --> 00:56:43,758
Speaker 2: a person. So again, it's a slippery slope, man. There's

1113
00:56:43,758 --> 00:56:46,838
Speaker 2: so much value to be derived from all the AI stuff.

1114
00:56:46,878 --> 00:56:49,998
Speaker 2: And then again, it's no different than the telephone and

1115
00:56:50,038 --> 00:56:53,878
Speaker 2: the social media in general. On the surface, looks like

1116
00:56:53,918 --> 00:56:57,278
Speaker 2: such a great idea to implementation occurs and all the

1117
00:56:57,478 --> 00:57:00,718
Speaker 2: pitfalls are exposed. And that's where that's the slope we're

1118
00:57:00,758 --> 00:57:01,758
Speaker 2: sliding down right now.

1119
00:57:02,158 --> 00:57:05,238
Speaker 1: Well, you called it. Joe Springtran is here. The next

1120
00:57:05,278 --> 00:57:07,918
Speaker 1: time we talk, we'll be talking about three of the

1121
00:57:07,918 --> 00:57:11,158
Speaker 1: best words in baseball this time of year, pitchers and catchers.

1122
00:57:11,958 --> 00:57:16,078
Speaker 1: We have arrived finally after a long cold winter. Can't

1123
00:57:16,078 --> 00:57:18,118
Speaker 1: wait to talk to next time as camps open up.

1124
00:57:18,198 --> 00:57:18,398
Speaker 3: Joe.

1125
00:57:18,598 --> 00:57:27,798
Speaker 2: Thanks Tommy, good job, buddy.

1126
00:57:28,118 --> 00:57:31,318
Speaker 1: The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio

1127
00:57:31,558 --> 00:57:36,438
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1128
00:57:36,678 --> 00:57:38,438
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