WEBVTT - #thisleague UNCUT: The legendary Hannah Storm! 0:00:00.160 --> 0:00:04.160 Welcome to this League uncut in the rule. 0:00:04.000 --> 0:00:05.480 Of twenty four hour NBA News. 0:00:05.680 --> 0:00:11.960 This is you, Chris Haynes. It's time, work's time, it's 0:00:11.960 --> 0:00:19.840 some time. This League uncut is underway in on fire. 0:00:21.480 --> 0:00:24.079 This should be a good one. 0:00:24.920 --> 0:00:30.000 Welcome in everyone to the latest edition of this League Uncut, 0:00:30.040 --> 0:00:34.239 A very special edition of this League Uncut. I have 0:00:34.320 --> 0:00:37.440 to say from the jump, Chris Haynes is not here 0:00:37.600 --> 0:00:41.560 for this recording. We are doing this on a Thursday afternoon. 0:00:41.640 --> 0:00:45.000 Later tonight, Chris will be on the sidelines in Sacramento. 0:00:45.520 --> 0:00:50.280 But don't worry because I am joined by Absolute NBA 0:00:50.479 --> 0:00:54.360 Broadcasting Royalty. In our midst we were colleagues together at 0:00:54.600 --> 0:00:59.320 ESPN for several years. We covered some Olympic basketball together 0:00:59.440 --> 0:01:04.560 in Rio in twenty sixteen. But basketball fans, real hoopeeds. 0:01:05.880 --> 0:01:09.720 You know her as one of the faces of NBC's 0:01:10.040 --> 0:01:14.440 wonderful coverage of the NBA in the nineties, throughout the 0:01:14.520 --> 0:01:18.080 last dance glory days of the Chicago Bulls, and her 0:01:18.120 --> 0:01:22.120 basketball journey actually stretches much farther back than that, all 0:01:22.160 --> 0:01:23.920 the way back to the Red, White. 0:01:23.640 --> 0:01:26.640 And Blue ABA. She's going to cover it all. 0:01:28.080 --> 0:01:31.399 From the time that there were two professional basketball leagues 0:01:31.400 --> 0:01:34.120 in this country to the modern day. It is all 0:01:34.200 --> 0:01:39.319 found in her new long form podcast series, NBA DNA, 0:01:39.360 --> 0:01:42.639 produced by iHeart all Right, I have babbled on long enough. 0:01:42.840 --> 0:01:46.399 Let's just welcome her in, Hannah Storm. So great to 0:01:46.440 --> 0:01:48.559 be with you again after a long long time. 0:01:48.760 --> 0:01:51.680 I know, Mark, it's so great because I follow you 0:01:51.760 --> 0:01:55.160 from Afar, but we haven't seen each other in person 0:01:55.280 --> 0:01:59.000 for a while. But it's awesome to be chatting with 0:01:59.080 --> 0:02:01.559 you again. We did have a lot of fun back 0:02:01.600 --> 0:02:05.160 in the day at ESPN covering some of the same 0:02:05.240 --> 0:02:09.040 events and you know, run it in all those same 0:02:09.080 --> 0:02:10.160 basketball circles. 0:02:10.320 --> 0:02:13.040 Thanks for having me, except now I think this interaction 0:02:13.160 --> 0:02:14.840 might be the first where I am the one who 0:02:14.919 --> 0:02:15.960 has to ask the questions. 0:02:16.000 --> 0:02:18.840 So I know, I hope I am to the task. 0:02:19.080 --> 0:02:21.680 But look, I have to say first, congratulations on this 0:02:21.720 --> 0:02:25.120 podcast series, because you are doing something I hope to 0:02:25.160 --> 0:02:28.560 do someday. I would love to do a long form 0:02:28.760 --> 0:02:33.239 series that traces history. I love basketball history, and you're 0:02:33.280 --> 0:02:37.160 taking it even farther back than my experience because you know, 0:02:37.240 --> 0:02:40.360 I don't have any ABA stories to tell, so just 0:02:40.480 --> 0:02:41.320 share with us. 0:02:41.200 --> 0:02:44.560 Like what was the genesis behind even doing. 0:02:44.360 --> 0:02:48.200 This, well, for years, I have wanted to tell the 0:02:48.280 --> 0:02:51.160 story of the ABA. My dad was the fifth commissioner 0:02:51.360 --> 0:02:53.760 of the ABA, and he always used to tell us 0:02:53.760 --> 0:02:56.600 all these stories growing up. He'd well, we were at 0:02:56.600 --> 0:02:58.919 basketball games for as long as I can remember, when 0:02:58.919 --> 0:03:02.000 it wasn't a school night. And that's why I actually 0:03:02.520 --> 0:03:05.960 at a time when women were not sportscasters, it really 0:03:06.000 --> 0:03:09.240 was not a career option. I was determined to do 0:03:09.280 --> 0:03:11.480 sports because I had grown up around it. I just 0:03:11.639 --> 0:03:15.240 associated sports with it was really fun, right, and I 0:03:15.320 --> 0:03:18.200 was super, super comfortable with it, and it's something that 0:03:18.240 --> 0:03:21.360 my dad and I always shared. And I was like 0:03:21.480 --> 0:03:23.240 a lot of the people that were involved in the 0:03:23.280 --> 0:03:28.200 ABA were getting older, and as I went on and 0:03:28.440 --> 0:03:32.200 covered the NBA and of course understood at a very 0:03:32.280 --> 0:03:36.320 visceral level everything in the NBA that's derivative of the 0:03:36.360 --> 0:03:39.280 old ABA, I just really wanted to tell that story. 0:03:39.280 --> 0:03:42.760 And I've done a lot of documentaries, I've directed and 0:03:42.840 --> 0:03:46.000 so forth over the course of the last fifteen years. 0:03:46.960 --> 0:03:50.040 And so when I brought this story to the NBA, 0:03:50.840 --> 0:03:54.000 they said, can you just write us an essay about 0:03:54.000 --> 0:03:56.800 your life in basketball, not just the ABA, but everything 0:03:56.800 --> 0:03:58.680 that happened after that, and I said sure, so I 0:03:58.760 --> 0:04:02.160 like banged out this essay and they said this is 0:04:02.360 --> 0:04:07.600 really interesting and unusual and this could make a great podcast, 0:04:08.280 --> 0:04:11.880 and so I partnered with them. And it's it's twelve parts, 0:04:12.000 --> 0:04:14.840 probably could be a lot more than that. So it's 0:04:14.920 --> 0:04:18.560 kind of like different, right because it's through my lens 0:04:18.640 --> 0:04:23.080 and the things that I did. So there are teams, 0:04:23.240 --> 0:04:26.600 like my first big full time job was Sean Hornet's 0:04:26.920 --> 0:04:30.080 right their first year in existence, So we talked to 0:04:30.160 --> 0:04:32.479 Rex Chapman and Del Curry like things that you don't 0:04:32.520 --> 0:04:37.600 necessarily expect, you know, I just did a dream Team episode, right. 0:04:37.720 --> 0:04:40.960 I came to NBC in ninety two to cover the Olympics. 0:04:41.000 --> 0:04:45.000 That was my first big assignment then, so really fun. 0:04:45.040 --> 0:04:47.320 But going all the way back to my childhood and 0:04:47.360 --> 0:04:47.800 the ABA. 0:04:48.800 --> 0:04:50.440 Yeah, and look, I don't want to ask you to 0:04:50.480 --> 0:04:52.880 give away a bunch of secrets from the podcast, because. 0:04:52.640 --> 0:04:54.040 I correct, I want people. 0:04:53.839 --> 0:04:55.159 To listen to the podcast. 0:04:55.200 --> 0:04:58.480 But it's commissioners commissioner's daughter. I don't know that I've 0:04:58.520 --> 0:05:01.560 ever met a commissioner's dog. So and again, like I said, 0:05:01.600 --> 0:05:06.039 my my basketball fandom started right right like the season 0:05:06.080 --> 0:05:09.600 before the merger, so I I wish I had seen. 0:05:09.920 --> 0:05:12.960 The ABA, but I genuinely only know what I've read. 0:05:13.000 --> 0:05:15.919 And that's one thing in basketball, we've done such a 0:05:16.080 --> 0:05:19.680 poor job preserving history. And it's it really, you know, 0:05:19.720 --> 0:05:22.960 the seventies, like there's just so you know, I always 0:05:23.000 --> 0:05:25.800 complain that, you know, George Gervin and David Thompson had 0:05:25.800 --> 0:05:28.200 the incredible scoring duel at the end of the seventy 0:05:28.279 --> 0:05:31.479 seven seventy eight season, and there isn't one stitch of 0:05:31.520 --> 0:05:34.800 footage of that, so ABA, it's even harder to touch 0:05:35.120 --> 0:05:35.640 that history. 0:05:35.640 --> 0:05:37.400 So just tell us what's. 0:05:36.960 --> 0:05:40.960 Like to be, you know, in your formative years around 0:05:40.960 --> 0:05:42.400 the ABA all the time. 0:05:42.800 --> 0:05:45.039 First of all, you are you are so right, which 0:05:45.080 --> 0:05:46.960 is why it's perfect for a podcast because we do 0:05:47.000 --> 0:05:50.760 have radio calls and such, including a very young Bob 0:05:50.839 --> 0:05:54.240 Costas who was the left college to call games for 0:05:54.320 --> 0:05:58.880 Saint Louis. But it's the stuff kind of of legend 0:05:58.960 --> 0:06:01.839 and lore because they didn't have a television contract, so 0:06:01.839 --> 0:06:04.120 it's the stuff that people didn't see. It really is 0:06:04.240 --> 0:06:07.320 stories that were passed down and what it was was 0:06:07.760 --> 0:06:12.160 incredibly free wheeling basketball and the players could do a 0:06:12.160 --> 0:06:16.160 lot of things that were not allowed in the NBA, 0:06:16.279 --> 0:06:19.760 like dunking the basketball, which was also not allowed in college, 0:06:20.040 --> 0:06:23.480 or things that were not a part of the NBA. 0:06:23.600 --> 0:06:26.760 Believe it or not, three pointers were not a part 0:06:26.760 --> 0:06:29.280 of the game. It was much more like the kind 0:06:29.320 --> 0:06:31.800 of basketball that you would see at Rutger Park or 0:06:31.839 --> 0:06:35.600 that you would see, you know, quote unquote street basketball. 0:06:36.560 --> 0:06:41.320 Very freewheeling, very entertaining, and the ABA didn't have money 0:06:41.360 --> 0:06:43.760 from a television contract, so they had to make the 0:06:43.839 --> 0:06:47.000 game itself entertaining. And they also brought in a lot 0:06:47.000 --> 0:06:50.440 of players who weren't eligible for the NBA for some reason. 0:06:50.880 --> 0:06:53.000 My dad was one of the architects of the quote 0:06:53.040 --> 0:06:55.920 unquote hardship rule, which allowed players they did not have to. 0:06:55.880 --> 0:06:59.440 Finish college to be able to go into the ABA. 0:06:59.680 --> 0:07:00.400 You know, I e. 0:07:00.640 --> 0:07:10.680 Doctor J So really fun, very loose, very wild, very 0:07:10.720 --> 0:07:14.080 pushing the envelope from the halftime shows and cheerleaders and 0:07:14.160 --> 0:07:17.640 all of that was derivative of the ABA to the Red, 0:07:17.640 --> 0:07:22.440 white and Blue basketball. Just really free wheeling and you know, 0:07:22.600 --> 0:07:23.480 kind of renegade. 0:07:23.640 --> 0:07:27.400 Honestly. I mean, they wanted to merge with the. 0:07:27.400 --> 0:07:29.360 NBA at some point, and they wanted to prove that 0:07:29.400 --> 0:07:32.640 their players were as good as the NBA players, and 0:07:32.680 --> 0:07:35.720 they went after like all the NBA refs at the time, 0:07:35.880 --> 0:07:39.120 and they they battled them toe to toe for some players. 0:07:39.880 --> 0:07:41.880 But I mean, it was just a bunch. 0:07:41.760 --> 0:07:44.440 Of guys who were like, Hey, let's go for it 0:07:44.480 --> 0:07:46.000 and maybe maybe someday. 0:07:45.680 --> 0:07:46.960 We'll get to merge with. 0:07:47.000 --> 0:07:49.360 The with the NBA, and let's have a good time 0:07:49.400 --> 0:07:51.480 and entertain people in the process. 0:07:52.040 --> 0:07:52.200 You know. 0:07:52.240 --> 0:07:55.080 At ESPN, I got to work with Chris Ramsey, who 0:07:56.080 --> 0:07:59.040 son of the legendary doctor Jack Ramsey, and I was 0:07:59.080 --> 0:08:02.440 a Buffalo Braves so doctor Jack having coach in Buffalo, 0:08:02.520 --> 0:08:05.120 I used to always hit Chris up for stories. And 0:08:05.200 --> 0:08:08.360 Chris once told me that as a kid, when Doctor 0:08:08.440 --> 0:08:11.360 Jack was in Philadelphia, he had actually heard some trade 0:08:11.400 --> 0:08:14.840 discussion at the house, revealed it to his school friend 0:08:14.960 --> 0:08:17.000 and it actually got out from there. And this is 0:08:17.000 --> 0:08:20.680 in the six lower Twitter or anything like that. So 0:08:20.720 --> 0:08:22.480 I have to ask you, was there any were there 0:08:22.520 --> 0:08:27.520 any ABA secrets you heard at home that you maybe 0:08:27.560 --> 0:08:30.000 shared that you weren't supposed to share. How good were 0:08:30.080 --> 0:08:32.600 you at secret keeping when you when you heard some 0:08:32.720 --> 0:08:33.680 of the league gossip. 0:08:34.400 --> 0:08:36.720 I was a little kid for a lot of it. 0:08:37.040 --> 0:08:39.720 But I'll tell you one thing that stuck with me, 0:08:39.880 --> 0:08:42.080 and that is what it is like when not only 0:08:42.120 --> 0:08:44.440 when you win, but how painful it is when you 0:08:44.520 --> 0:08:46.160 lose or when your. 0:08:46.120 --> 0:08:49.360 Dad is run out of town. You know that happened. 0:08:49.360 --> 0:08:52.600 If people are holding up signs and I tell you what, Mark, 0:08:52.720 --> 0:08:59.080 I have such an empathy slash appreciation slash understanding what 0:08:59.120 --> 0:09:01.920 it takes to run about football franchise or any franchise. 0:09:02.320 --> 0:09:04.760 And we are so critical. 0:09:05.840 --> 0:09:09.000 Of people and and sometimes even in the media, we like, 0:09:09.400 --> 0:09:11.840 you know, we this guy should be fired and blah 0:09:11.840 --> 0:09:13.120 blah blah blah blah. 0:09:13.240 --> 0:09:13.600 I don't know. 0:09:13.640 --> 0:09:15.480 I think it gave me a really well rounded view 0:09:15.520 --> 0:09:17.240 of the business. But one of the things that my 0:09:17.360 --> 0:09:21.040 dad always used to talk about was Operation Kingfish, which 0:09:21.320 --> 0:09:24.800 is always a secret operation that they had to try 0:09:24.840 --> 0:09:29.640 to lure Louel Cinder. Obviously later kareemail dul Jabbar try 0:09:29.679 --> 0:09:32.640 to lure him too, the AVA and so there is 0:09:32.800 --> 0:09:35.760 like this like secret document that my dad kept in 0:09:35.800 --> 0:09:39.560 his desk and it had everything that they were going 0:09:39.640 --> 0:09:44.319 to do and as legend, they did a psychological profile 0:09:44.400 --> 0:09:46.200 of him. You know, they were going to go meet 0:09:46.200 --> 0:09:48.400 with Leuel Cinder. What is it going to take to 0:09:48.880 --> 0:09:50.800 get him to come to our league? You know what 0:09:51.200 --> 0:09:55.280 is what resonates with him and George Miken had a 0:09:55.320 --> 0:09:58.320 million dollars in a suitcase, but he left the meeting 0:09:58.440 --> 0:10:01.560 so convinced that Leuwell's was coming to the ABA that 0:10:01.640 --> 0:10:04.079 he never gave him the money. And then somebody from 0:10:04.120 --> 0:10:06.200 the NBA gave him a million dollars and he went there, 0:10:06.280 --> 0:10:10.320 you know, stuff like that. But like my dad, so 0:10:10.400 --> 0:10:13.520 we had this document, this Operation Kingfish document which I've 0:10:13.520 --> 0:10:16.680 actually seen, which he kept in his desk. But you 0:10:16.800 --> 0:10:22.240 mentioned leaks, so somebody had gotten somebody was looking at 0:10:22.280 --> 0:10:25.760 the document. He knew somebody, somebody had kind of seen 0:10:25.840 --> 0:10:28.240 it or seen what was in it, right, so he 0:10:28.559 --> 0:10:30.400 changed the document. 0:10:30.520 --> 0:10:33.480 He falsified the document to. 0:10:33.520 --> 0:10:38.240 Say that secretly the ABA had already signed lou Al 0:10:38.360 --> 0:10:42.360 Sinder and so it got out through whatever that leak 0:10:42.720 --> 0:10:44.960 was that they had actually signed it, when of course 0:10:45.000 --> 0:10:49.440 they didn't. But like crazy story, like no, no, no, 0:10:49.480 --> 0:10:50.320 I was not the leak. 0:10:50.400 --> 0:10:50.880 It was not me. 0:10:51.120 --> 0:10:53.640 But like I do remember sitting at the kitchen table 0:10:53.679 --> 0:10:56.439 and like drawing up the pacers logo, Like how crazy 0:10:56.520 --> 0:10:59.200 is that? And it's still the same logo, and I remember, 0:10:59.679 --> 0:11:03.079 you know, all these guys would come over like Thanksgiving or. 0:11:03.120 --> 0:11:04.319 Yeah, they had nowhere to go. 0:11:04.400 --> 0:11:08.400 They were hanging out at the house, Christmas party, stuff 0:11:08.440 --> 0:11:10.840 like that. It was really fun. But it kind of 0:11:10.840 --> 0:11:14.200 normalized athletes for me. So I was never at any 0:11:14.200 --> 0:11:16.880 point in my career. I was never like starstruck really, 0:11:17.080 --> 0:11:20.960 you know, being around athletes. They just felt like you know, 0:11:21.240 --> 0:11:23.440 people that were at the house. 0:11:24.520 --> 0:11:28.320 Well, that was the foundation for an absolutely incredible career. 0:11:28.400 --> 0:11:33.360 You have literally covered everything, and I saw it just 0:11:33.400 --> 0:11:35.559 came out today you're doing the Boston Marathon. Like I 0:11:36.320 --> 0:11:38.560 don't know what major event there is that you have 0:11:38.760 --> 0:11:40.160 not done, and like. 0:11:40.320 --> 0:11:41.440 I have not done that one. 0:11:41.840 --> 0:11:45.960 Speaking for myself, like, you know, the era of specialization 0:11:46.240 --> 0:11:51.160 really served me well because I'm like, you know, basketball, soccer, tennis, 0:11:51.200 --> 0:11:52.720 a little bit of hockey and that's it. Like you, 0:11:52.920 --> 0:11:55.640 but you've done like twenty sports. I remember running into 0:11:55.679 --> 0:11:56.600 you at the US Open. 0:11:56.679 --> 0:11:57.520 You're doing tennis. 0:11:58.080 --> 0:12:01.480 Yeah, But as you've said in many interviews, I know 0:12:02.000 --> 0:12:05.440 the broadcasting world was not exactly teeming with opportunities for 0:12:05.559 --> 0:12:08.200 women as you're making your way through the rank. So 0:12:08.240 --> 0:12:10.760 at what point did it become real to you, when 0:12:10.760 --> 0:12:13.120 did you see that this was actually possible. 0:12:13.760 --> 0:12:16.680 I mean I always saw that it was possible. 0:12:17.960 --> 0:12:21.840 I just couldn't get other people to see it the 0:12:21.880 --> 0:12:25.120 same way. And my dad always told me, he said, 0:12:25.240 --> 0:12:28.240 because I back in the day, I sent out hundreds 0:12:28.240 --> 0:12:31.200 of tapes and resumes and all of that, and you know, 0:12:31.240 --> 0:12:33.160 you just could get rejection letters in the mail. 0:12:33.240 --> 0:12:34.040 I mean that was what you did. 0:12:34.040 --> 0:12:34.079 It. 0:12:34.120 --> 0:12:37.640 You're answering one ads, you're sending stuff out, and I 0:12:37.679 --> 0:12:41.480 was just getting, like, I mean, dozens and dozens and 0:12:41.520 --> 0:12:44.360 dozens of rejection letters and people saying, you know, you 0:12:44.360 --> 0:12:46.920 should just be a feature reporter or something like that. 0:12:47.000 --> 0:12:49.200 And my audience won't accept a woman, and my sports 0:12:49.240 --> 0:12:51.200 director doesn't want to work with a woman. And you know, 0:12:51.240 --> 0:12:53.959 nobody was very politically correct back then, so they just 0:12:54.160 --> 0:12:56.320 they just said it like it was. But my dad 0:12:56.400 --> 0:12:59.000 was like, you only need one yes, like you literally 0:12:59.400 --> 0:13:01.760 only need one single person. So if you look at 0:13:01.760 --> 0:13:04.440 the odds that way, somebody, there's gonna be one person 0:13:04.480 --> 0:13:06.920 along the way. And I got my first full time 0:13:07.000 --> 0:13:09.360 job in Charlotte, and I kind of got hired as 0:13:09.360 --> 0:13:11.520 a gimmick because it was a new station and they 0:13:11.559 --> 0:13:13.640 were trying all these crazy things, and they were like, wow, 0:13:13.679 --> 0:13:16.480 what if we had a woman sportscaster. And I was like, 0:13:16.559 --> 0:13:18.680 I'm there, awesome, I'm want me to learn NASCAR. 0:13:18.920 --> 0:13:19.400 Let's go. 0:13:19.880 --> 0:13:22.480 And it was the first year of the Charlotte Hornets 0:13:23.160 --> 0:13:26.000 and that was a pretty cool year because the NBA 0:13:26.080 --> 0:13:29.480 came to town and I had covered in radio. You know, 0:13:29.520 --> 0:13:31.840 I'd covered the Rockets and stuff like that in Houston. 0:13:31.840 --> 0:13:34.120 I used to host the Rockets. I think when I 0:13:34.440 --> 0:13:37.120 got a job part time in Houston hosting the Rockets 0:13:37.120 --> 0:13:40.320 pregames and halftimes, and the same station carried the Astros 0:13:41.040 --> 0:13:43.880 and you know that being in the mid eighties, and 0:13:43.920 --> 0:13:47.040 those teams were really good. You know, they didn't win titles, 0:13:47.080 --> 0:13:49.920 but they got close. I think then it became for me, 0:13:50.480 --> 0:13:53.040 like I would say, Houston days really solidified. And then 0:13:53.040 --> 0:13:55.240 when I got my first full time job in Charlotte, 0:13:55.320 --> 0:13:56.840 and I was only there like a year and a half, 0:13:56.880 --> 0:13:59.280 and then I got hired by CNN, and then that 0:13:59.480 --> 0:14:02.920 was was really you know, the big leap was doing 0:14:03.000 --> 0:14:06.079 late nights at CNN. And then at the time CNN 0:14:06.240 --> 0:14:08.920 was like a viable like it was it was ESPN 0:14:09.080 --> 0:14:10.000 versus CNN. 0:14:10.120 --> 0:14:14.559 Like I became I mean that I first became aware 0:14:14.559 --> 0:14:16.320 of you. I was in college, and I mean yeah, 0:14:16.400 --> 0:14:21.080 every night, I mean every night late night like ESPN, 0:14:21.160 --> 0:14:24.680 you know ESPN and CNN, Like we lived for those shows. 0:14:24.720 --> 0:14:25.600 I mean those shows. 0:14:26.200 --> 0:14:29.360 Now now an amazing play happens in the NBA and 0:14:29.440 --> 0:14:32.960 it circulates literally within seconds to millions of social media. 0:14:33.320 --> 0:14:37.400 But for our generation, like ESPN and CNN at night 0:14:37.440 --> 0:14:40.840 are gonna have highlights from calves hornets. It was just 0:14:40.960 --> 0:14:43.160 it was unbetable, you know, it was it was It 0:14:43.240 --> 0:14:44.880 was such a game changer. 0:14:44.920 --> 0:14:47.520 Man, And we did highlights from every single game every 0:14:47.560 --> 0:14:51.920 single night. And then, I mean obviously then NBC got 0:14:52.080 --> 0:14:55.800 so many properties. NBC got the Olympics, and they got 0:14:56.040 --> 0:14:59.800 they got the NBA, they had the NFL, and NBC 0:15:00.080 --> 0:15:02.040 need all of a sudden found itself like there was 0:15:02.080 --> 0:15:04.440 like a triple cast for the Olympics. Like we need talent, 0:15:04.560 --> 0:15:06.800 like we need it like it was nineteen ninety two, 0:15:07.080 --> 0:15:10.840 Like we have all this stuff going on. And Dick Eversall, 0:15:10.880 --> 0:15:14.760 who ran NBC Sports was he didn't sleep. He never slept, 0:15:14.960 --> 0:15:17.600 so he watched late night television all the time. 0:15:17.720 --> 0:15:18.600 Who was on late night? 0:15:19.280 --> 0:15:21.000 I was on late night and so it was my 0:15:21.080 --> 0:15:23.800 husband Dan Hicks at the time obviously not my husband. 0:15:24.520 --> 0:15:26.840 So Dick eversall saw me. 0:15:27.160 --> 0:15:31.440 Like all the time and also saw Dan and he's 0:15:31.480 --> 0:15:33.920 a guy who always thought out of the box. And 0:15:34.160 --> 0:15:39.320 we separately got hired by NBC to do different things, 0:15:39.920 --> 0:15:43.440 and hilariously, secretly we were like dating. No one knew 0:15:43.480 --> 0:15:45.600 about it, and we both ended up going to NBC, 0:15:45.760 --> 0:15:48.520 which was pretty cool. But it really was the NBA 0:15:48.840 --> 0:15:51.920 on NBC where you know, everything came full circle. You 0:15:52.000 --> 0:15:56.240 mentioned how different it was back then. We had five 0:15:56.280 --> 0:15:59.360 games on a weekend when things got really really busy, 0:15:59.520 --> 0:16:02.880 right the playoffs, we would do a doubleheader one day 0:16:03.280 --> 0:16:05.680 and a triple header the next day, and that was it. 0:16:05.960 --> 0:16:07.720 That was the only place you'd go watch the NBA. 0:16:08.440 --> 0:16:10.840 And that was the Jordan years. 0:16:11.440 --> 0:16:15.600 So this is literally the glory days of basketball. 0:16:16.280 --> 0:16:18.360 And I was hosting. 0:16:18.520 --> 0:16:21.920 I was either hosting games or Bob was hosting games, 0:16:22.080 --> 0:16:24.680 and if I wasn't, I was on the sidelines like 0:16:24.720 --> 0:16:26.840 for all the great moments, like all the great games, 0:16:26.920 --> 0:16:30.120 and it was just, yeah, talk about shit getting real. 0:16:30.440 --> 0:16:32.560 Yeah, that's when it got really really real. 0:16:32.880 --> 0:16:34.800 And I would see all these people who knew my dad. 0:16:34.880 --> 0:16:36.840 I mean, it was just like unbelievable. It was just 0:16:36.880 --> 0:16:38.520 like I just felt so at home. 0:16:38.920 --> 0:16:41.000 Because you've been now with the ESPN for more than 0:16:41.000 --> 0:16:44.000 fifteen years, so I'm guessing probably the longest stop of 0:16:44.040 --> 0:16:47.160 your career. But it is those NBC years have to 0:16:47.200 --> 0:16:50.400 be incredibly meaningful because it was, Yeah, it was such 0:16:50.720 --> 0:16:54.320 it was such a seminal time. Yeah, for the fans, 0:16:54.480 --> 0:16:56.640 for fans of the game, and I think people look 0:16:56.720 --> 0:17:00.000 back on NBC's coverage with huge funness. 0:17:00.200 --> 0:17:02.200 Now there's just a lot of nostalgia about it. 0:17:02.880 --> 0:17:05.600 Yeah, I mean, you know, you look back at obviously 0:17:05.640 --> 0:17:09.639 the Last Dance was incredibly successful because of Michael and 0:17:09.680 --> 0:17:12.760 the Bulls, but we were the network that documented all 0:17:12.840 --> 0:17:16.159 of that. And then obviously for me kind of really 0:17:16.440 --> 0:17:19.199 being usedon kind of being my adopt at hometown and 0:17:19.240 --> 0:17:21.879 then the Rockets winning back to back titles was incredible, 0:17:22.800 --> 0:17:26.399 and I just think that obviously, when Magic and Bird 0:17:26.400 --> 0:17:29.520 came into the NBA, that took the NBA to one level, 0:17:30.200 --> 0:17:34.159 and then you know, Michael and I think you know 0:17:34.960 --> 0:17:39.600 the Dream Team Barcelona that was just that was just 0:17:39.680 --> 0:17:42.840 such a I mean there had never been anything like that. 0:17:42.880 --> 0:17:44.080 There never will be again. 0:17:44.320 --> 0:17:48.440 But when you look at the audience that watches the Olympics, right, 0:17:48.760 --> 0:17:52.959 because those are a lot of your non traditional sports fans, 0:17:53.200 --> 0:17:55.440 and you look at what the Olympics and the kind 0:17:55.440 --> 0:17:58.560 of ratings that those got back in the day, and 0:17:59.359 --> 0:18:01.520 so all those guys who would later go on to 0:18:01.800 --> 0:18:04.480 battle it out in all those years following, you know, 0:18:04.480 --> 0:18:06.159 because you had Stockton. 0:18:05.680 --> 0:18:09.240 And Malone, and you had you Ing, and you had. 0:18:09.080 --> 0:18:12.240 David Robinson, and you know, you had all those guys 0:18:12.280 --> 0:18:12.840 like on that. 0:18:12.880 --> 0:18:13.760 Dream team too. 0:18:13.880 --> 0:18:16.439 So I think that also just kind of like pushed 0:18:16.440 --> 0:18:17.280 it along. 0:18:28.320 --> 0:18:28.919 Selfishly. 0:18:28.960 --> 0:18:31.480 I have to ask you this because you worked with 0:18:31.520 --> 0:18:36.240 some real heavyweights at NBC, just legendary former players and coaches. 0:18:36.320 --> 0:18:38.840 But I mean, you know what I do for a living, 0:18:38.880 --> 0:18:42.240 so naturally my focus was the reporting of mister Vessi, 0:18:42.720 --> 0:18:46.240 who is a one kind character in this league and 0:18:46.640 --> 0:18:50.280 someone who has been a tremendous mentor to me. But 0:18:50.400 --> 0:18:52.760 just I gotta ask, give me a tail or two 0:18:52.920 --> 0:18:56.600 of Peter Vessi muckraking and causing some trouble with him. 0:18:56.640 --> 0:18:57.840 I mean, his reporting was. 0:18:58.880 --> 0:19:02.520 Okay, real Mark Peter Vessi is in the first three 0:19:02.560 --> 0:19:06.879 episodes of this series. You know, one of my first 0:19:06.920 --> 0:19:12.159 calls was Peter Vessi. Peter Vessi was so he was 0:19:12.160 --> 0:19:15.439 in love with my mother. He liked my dad, He 0:19:15.560 --> 0:19:20.600 covered my dad. But my mom was extremely She was, 0:19:21.440 --> 0:19:24.800 you know, so glamorous. She always you know, dressed to 0:19:24.840 --> 0:19:27.960 the nines for the game, She had her wigs, she 0:19:28.240 --> 0:19:31.520 was just you know, she was a beauty. And so 0:19:31.640 --> 0:19:35.880 Peter Vessi obviously never let me forget that my mother 0:19:36.080 --> 0:19:38.080 was really the reason why he talked to my father 0:19:38.240 --> 0:19:43.879 all the time. But you know, I mean, Peter's so 0:19:44.000 --> 0:19:46.560 good in this series, Like he talks about coaching doctor 0:19:46.640 --> 0:19:49.800 j at Rucker Park, like the Rucker Park days, which 0:19:49.840 --> 0:19:52.479 are really cool, which everyone should know about. I mean, 0:19:52.480 --> 0:19:55.240 talk about legendary stuff that wasn't you know, isn't on 0:19:55.359 --> 0:19:58.840 video anywhere, right, And you know he was part of 0:19:58.840 --> 0:20:02.840 the you know, so Peter and and you know Bob Costas, 0:20:02.880 --> 0:20:05.160 I mean those guys who covered the ABA. I mean 0:20:05.200 --> 0:20:08.440 they would go out with the players afterwards. I mean, 0:20:08.480 --> 0:20:11.560 this wasn't and they would. They're they're flying commercial, they're 0:20:11.560 --> 0:20:15.080 flying early flight, they're flying the cheapest flights possible, you know, 0:20:15.160 --> 0:20:18.800 and Peter talks about like sleeping in. You know, whatever 0:20:18.880 --> 0:20:21.240 clothes you were gonna wear on that plane the next day, 0:20:21.520 --> 0:20:24.159 that's what you went out with the night before because 0:20:24.200 --> 0:20:26.240 you were gonna have time. You know, you were never 0:20:26.280 --> 0:20:28.120 gonna go to bed, you were never gonna be able 0:20:28.160 --> 0:20:29.120 to change your clothes. 0:20:29.480 --> 0:20:31.800 And he was a good time and we had a 0:20:31.800 --> 0:20:32.760 great time on NBC. 0:20:32.920 --> 0:20:35.680 He called me Hannah. He never called me Hannah, hannaer 0:20:37.119 --> 0:20:39.160 And people just give me grief about it all the time. 0:20:39.200 --> 0:20:42.880 And then Peter always had these sly, sarcastic one liners 0:20:42.880 --> 0:20:46.400 that worked great in print, and then he would say 0:20:46.440 --> 0:20:49.040 them on the air and then we would all like laugh, 0:20:49.119 --> 0:20:50.960 but we knew the one liner was coming at the 0:20:51.040 --> 0:20:52.240