1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:04,720 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,800 --> 00:00:09,119 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,240 --> 00:00:24,560 Speaker 1: learn this stuff they don't want you to know. M Hello, 4 00:00:24,640 --> 00:00:26,720 Speaker 1: welcome back to the show. I'm an expression of the 5 00:00:26,760 --> 00:00:30,560 Speaker 1: infinite one creator in sixth density. Do you do you 6 00:00:30,640 --> 00:00:34,280 Speaker 1: have a name? That's it? Oh? Yeah, I felt like 7 00:00:34,280 --> 00:00:36,400 Speaker 1: you left off with Ellipsy's like you're gonna give me more, 8 00:00:36,440 --> 00:00:41,519 Speaker 1: like some sort of celestial title introducing myself? Do you 9 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:44,159 Speaker 1: want to be the movement formerly known as Matt or 10 00:00:44,159 --> 00:00:47,239 Speaker 1: the vibration formally known as Matt. I am an expression 11 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:49,639 Speaker 1: of the Infinite one Creator in sixth density. Okay, I'll 12 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:52,720 Speaker 1: take it. I'm still Noel, I'm non Shabbai. Folks they 13 00:00:52,760 --> 00:00:54,800 Speaker 1: call me Ben. You or you were joined with our 14 00:00:54,840 --> 00:00:57,400 Speaker 1: super producer Paul Deck, and that makes this stuff they 15 00:00:57,400 --> 00:01:00,319 Speaker 1: don't want you to know. Welcome to the show. As 16 00:01:00,360 --> 00:01:04,000 Speaker 1: you can tell, uh, since we last all got together, 17 00:01:04,080 --> 00:01:09,560 Speaker 1: there have been a few changes, spiritual changes, vibrational changes. Yeah, 18 00:01:09,600 --> 00:01:13,280 Speaker 1: Matt is basically just this kind of like neutron cloud 19 00:01:13,800 --> 00:01:16,920 Speaker 1: that's just slowly filling up the studio. And he does 20 00:01:16,959 --> 00:01:20,880 Speaker 1: still have a mouth, thankfully. So I'm an expression of infinity. 21 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:23,760 Speaker 1: So you know right now what he's reminding me of, 22 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:28,560 Speaker 1: Noel is the the gaseous creature in that Rick and 23 00:01:28,600 --> 00:01:32,240 Speaker 1: Morty episode called Fart, voiced by Fly to the Concords 24 00:01:32,240 --> 00:01:37,959 Speaker 1: actor similar similar, Well, thank you for coalescing into a 25 00:01:38,040 --> 00:01:41,759 Speaker 1: physical ish form. Somebody open a window. I don't want 26 00:01:41,760 --> 00:01:45,480 Speaker 1: to lose him. I'll be here for as long as 27 00:01:45,560 --> 00:01:50,000 Speaker 1: the podcast is. What is time. Hopefully we have a 28 00:01:50,200 --> 00:01:54,560 Speaker 1: enough time before you ascend to higher planes, Matt to 29 00:01:55,280 --> 00:01:59,840 Speaker 1: journey into a very interesting rabbit hole, which Noel, you 30 00:02:00,240 --> 00:02:02,800 Speaker 1: were the one who showed us, introduced us to this 31 00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:07,080 Speaker 1: guy off air when we first learned about this fairly recently, 32 00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:09,600 Speaker 1: right a few weeks ago. Yeah, there was a media 33 00:02:09,680 --> 00:02:12,000 Speaker 1: article that was making the rounds online and a friend 34 00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:14,560 Speaker 1: of mine actually sent it to me um as a 35 00:02:14,560 --> 00:02:18,120 Speaker 1: potential topic for the show. And more so than talking 36 00:02:18,160 --> 00:02:20,720 Speaker 1: specifically about this one individual who we will get to, 37 00:02:21,240 --> 00:02:22,880 Speaker 1: it kind of opened the door to talk a little 38 00:02:22,919 --> 00:02:27,480 Speaker 1: bit more about cults in the digital age, right exactly. 39 00:02:27,639 --> 00:02:30,960 Speaker 1: We have talked about cults before, both in these broad 40 00:02:31,400 --> 00:02:35,480 Speaker 1: structural terms and through more specific examples such as the 41 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:41,120 Speaker 1: ants in the Czech Republic, uh, the Jonestown Massacre with 42 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:44,560 Speaker 1: Jim Jones and many more. And although it's a little 43 00:02:44,639 --> 00:02:48,880 Speaker 1: by the book, let's start with the biggest, most obvious question, 44 00:02:49,160 --> 00:02:53,240 Speaker 1: how do we define cult? And for that we head 45 00:02:53,240 --> 00:02:56,160 Speaker 1: on over to Miriam Webster, which defines this cult as 46 00:02:56,400 --> 00:03:01,200 Speaker 1: a religion regarded as unorthodox or spurious. It's also it's 47 00:03:01,200 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 1: referring to the body of adherence to said movement, and 48 00:03:05,200 --> 00:03:08,200 Speaker 1: it also defines it as great devotion to a person, 49 00:03:08,520 --> 00:03:12,240 Speaker 1: idea object, movement, or work such as a film or 50 00:03:12,280 --> 00:03:15,720 Speaker 1: a book, like a cult film, cult classic being something 51 00:03:15,760 --> 00:03:19,000 Speaker 1: that has a small but incredibly loyal following, often for 52 00:03:19,120 --> 00:03:23,120 Speaker 1: being trash um or a cult of personality, you know, 53 00:03:23,200 --> 00:03:26,240 Speaker 1: which can also refer to a cult leader. My problem 54 00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:28,639 Speaker 1: with these definitions, you guys, though, is that to me, 55 00:03:29,200 --> 00:03:31,679 Speaker 1: this is what religion is, right like, it's it's a 56 00:03:31,919 --> 00:03:36,040 Speaker 1: it's some one person's unorthodox belief is another person's face. 57 00:03:36,480 --> 00:03:40,160 Speaker 1: So where's the distinction, right right? So, for instance, to 58 00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:46,360 Speaker 1: the Pope, while many other religions would have value, they 59 00:03:46,440 --> 00:03:50,920 Speaker 1: all are unorthodox or at the very least erroneous if 60 00:03:50,960 --> 00:03:55,440 Speaker 1: they are not Catholicism as practiced by the Catholic Church. 61 00:03:55,560 --> 00:04:00,200 Speaker 1: And if you're an orthodox Jew. Everyone else is completely unorthodox, right, right, 62 00:04:00,480 --> 00:04:03,839 Speaker 1: and maybe just has a short attention span. Right. That's 63 00:04:03,880 --> 00:04:07,040 Speaker 1: how one rabbi explained it to me. We see two 64 00:04:07,080 --> 00:04:10,600 Speaker 1: different approaches here in the definitions, with some overlap between them, 65 00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:14,080 Speaker 1: and I appreciate you raising the point that we wanted 66 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:19,680 Speaker 1: to make here about cult. The idea of what makes 67 00:04:19,680 --> 00:04:22,280 Speaker 1: a cult is the idea of what makes something beautiful 68 00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:24,440 Speaker 1: or it's very similar. It's in the eye of beholder, 69 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:28,320 Speaker 1: and it's a subjective thing. At the very most basic, 70 00:04:29,240 --> 00:04:32,600 Speaker 1: first density level, a cult is just a group of 71 00:04:32,640 --> 00:04:37,479 Speaker 1: people worshiping something, and they almost never outside of pop culture, 72 00:04:37,800 --> 00:04:42,200 Speaker 1: describe themselves as a cult. It's a tricky term. It's 73 00:04:42,240 --> 00:04:45,880 Speaker 1: usually regarded as an insult. If our super producer Paul 74 00:04:45,920 --> 00:04:49,120 Speaker 1: Decont started what he felt was a religious movement and 75 00:04:49,120 --> 00:04:52,200 Speaker 1: we started referring to it as Paul's cult, Paul and 76 00:04:52,400 --> 00:04:58,200 Speaker 1: his followers would be probably offended. Well, Paul's nodding in 77 00:04:58,240 --> 00:05:00,000 Speaker 1: a way that makes me think I may have already 78 00:05:00,040 --> 00:05:03,880 Speaker 1: cross the line. Well, yeah, because Paul's journey is the way, 79 00:05:03,920 --> 00:05:06,280 Speaker 1: the light and the truth. For me, as a follower 80 00:05:06,440 --> 00:05:08,479 Speaker 1: of Paul's journey, how many cults are you in bro 81 00:05:08,720 --> 00:05:11,919 Speaker 1: all of them? Uh? Yeah, funny story. We Matt and I. 82 00:05:12,160 --> 00:05:18,520 Speaker 1: In an earlier video audio series, we delineated the commonalities 83 00:05:18,600 --> 00:05:21,600 Speaker 1: between cults and the ways in which these things function 84 00:05:21,720 --> 00:05:25,080 Speaker 1: if you think of them as an engine, and we 85 00:05:25,080 --> 00:05:27,239 Speaker 1: we taught people how to start one. We taught people 86 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:29,800 Speaker 1: how to start one. It was a little controversial. That 87 00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:32,320 Speaker 1: was in the same era when we had a video 88 00:05:32,839 --> 00:05:36,559 Speaker 1: describing how people get away with murder, which is still 89 00:05:36,680 --> 00:05:39,839 Speaker 1: up if you see it. We should probably we should 90 00:05:39,839 --> 00:05:42,039 Speaker 1: probably take a look at that again. But despite the 91 00:05:42,080 --> 00:05:45,040 Speaker 1: slippery slopiness of that word cult, we are making a 92 00:05:45,440 --> 00:05:48,680 Speaker 1: conscious choice and editorial choice to use that word today, 93 00:05:48,760 --> 00:05:52,480 Speaker 1: right then, Yeah, exactly, for the purposes of today's episode, 94 00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:55,400 Speaker 1: we are going to use the word cult, and we're 95 00:05:55,440 --> 00:05:58,839 Speaker 1: going to use it to describe organizations that share some 96 00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:01,560 Speaker 1: of these commonalities for more earlier videos and some will 97 00:06:01,560 --> 00:06:06,279 Speaker 1: explore today. And we're also using it more as shorthand 98 00:06:06,440 --> 00:06:09,800 Speaker 1: rather than an insult, because it goes back to that 99 00:06:10,080 --> 00:06:14,720 Speaker 1: that point where underlining here we're emphasizing one person's cult 100 00:06:15,200 --> 00:06:18,000 Speaker 1: is another person's real religion. And the point of this 101 00:06:18,040 --> 00:06:20,480 Speaker 1: show has never been to tell people what to believe, 102 00:06:21,000 --> 00:06:24,119 Speaker 1: but The reason we're choosing to use the word cult 103 00:06:24,480 --> 00:06:29,200 Speaker 1: is because today's overall question is how do cults exist 104 00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:34,000 Speaker 1: in the digital world. Are these organizations, these movements adapting, 105 00:06:34,320 --> 00:06:41,279 Speaker 1: Are the lines between a fandom and legit actual cult blurring? 106 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:45,000 Speaker 1: And if so, how? First we have to look at 107 00:06:45,040 --> 00:06:49,440 Speaker 1: the facts. The world is chock full of self described movements, 108 00:06:49,480 --> 00:06:53,520 Speaker 1: intentional community, spiritual institutions, and on and on and on, 109 00:06:53,880 --> 00:07:00,599 Speaker 1: and often mainstream culture, culture interesting etymology. There allly hears 110 00:07:00,640 --> 00:07:04,679 Speaker 1: of these fringe movements when something goes horrifically catastrophically wrong, 111 00:07:05,120 --> 00:07:09,400 Speaker 1: such as the destruction of the Branch Davidian compound in Waco, Texas, 112 00:07:09,680 --> 00:07:13,560 Speaker 1: the alm Shinriko terrorism in Japan, or of course, the 113 00:07:13,680 --> 00:07:18,640 Speaker 1: Jonestown massacre. But as we know, you know, the the 114 00:07:18,680 --> 00:07:22,120 Speaker 1: bloody headlines sell the best, right, and there's a motivation 115 00:07:22,560 --> 00:07:25,760 Speaker 1: in most media to only show you the bad news. 116 00:07:26,600 --> 00:07:30,120 Speaker 1: This does not jibe with the reality of the situation, 117 00:07:30,200 --> 00:07:34,400 Speaker 1: which is this around the planet, probably in your home country, 118 00:07:34,640 --> 00:07:37,120 Speaker 1: maybe even in your own neighborhood. As we record this, 119 00:07:37,440 --> 00:07:40,800 Speaker 1: these sorts of movements are much less uncommon than you 120 00:07:40,880 --> 00:07:44,760 Speaker 1: might think. Maybe not cartoonishly common or ubiquitous, but they're 121 00:07:44,760 --> 00:07:49,400 Speaker 1: definitely out there, and often they're harmless. There group of 122 00:07:49,400 --> 00:07:53,400 Speaker 1: people who have all decided to get severely on the 123 00:07:53,440 --> 00:07:57,800 Speaker 1: same page about something, whether it's a diet, right, we 124 00:07:57,880 --> 00:07:59,880 Speaker 1: see a lot of we see a lot of people 125 00:08:00,200 --> 00:08:04,800 Speaker 1: organized by their diet or by their environmental beliefs. Right. 126 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:09,640 Speaker 1: You'll even see the C word applied to certain workout 127 00:08:09,680 --> 00:08:13,680 Speaker 1: regimens and groups getting together having you know, working out 128 00:08:13,720 --> 00:08:16,880 Speaker 1: at a gym. Uh, You'll see it applied to a 129 00:08:16,880 --> 00:08:19,520 Speaker 1: lot of different things. Somebody said, how can we be 130 00:08:19,640 --> 00:08:26,400 Speaker 1: both fit and cross? So in the in the days 131 00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:30,160 Speaker 1: before the digital era, and as as we have examined before, 132 00:08:30,760 --> 00:08:35,520 Speaker 1: these groups would typically be isolated, They would tend to 133 00:08:35,559 --> 00:08:38,880 Speaker 1: self isolate. They would be isolated by a leader who sought, 134 00:08:39,040 --> 00:08:43,400 Speaker 1: unfortunately and often inevitably, to gain complete control of the 135 00:08:43,440 --> 00:08:48,599 Speaker 1: group or community by eliminating any other source of information. 136 00:08:48,640 --> 00:08:52,520 Speaker 1: It's one of the most common things about cults. And 137 00:08:52,559 --> 00:08:55,959 Speaker 1: we can talk a little bit about some of these commonalities. Well, yeah, 138 00:08:55,960 --> 00:08:58,000 Speaker 1: you can imagine it, especially if you go back just 139 00:08:58,120 --> 00:09:00,720 Speaker 1: before the advent of the internet, if you didn't have 140 00:09:00,760 --> 00:09:03,000 Speaker 1: a machine that you could access in your home that 141 00:09:03,080 --> 00:09:05,320 Speaker 1: had all of the information out there, and you only 142 00:09:05,320 --> 00:09:07,959 Speaker 1: had the books, the physical books that are available, the 143 00:09:08,040 --> 00:09:10,640 Speaker 1: telephone that you can make a you know, a call, 144 00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:13,440 Speaker 1: and the only one person can really use a phone 145 00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:17,560 Speaker 1: at a time. In that way, Um, you realize how 146 00:09:17,640 --> 00:09:20,440 Speaker 1: much information control existed. And we do know that the 147 00:09:20,559 --> 00:09:24,600 Speaker 1: cognitive an emotional isolation of followers is very important to 148 00:09:25,040 --> 00:09:28,559 Speaker 1: starting and maintaining a cult. Um Like, if you're in one, 149 00:09:28,600 --> 00:09:32,800 Speaker 1: you can't read unapproved books. Um, you can't watch unapproved shows. 150 00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:36,000 Speaker 1: You can't really communicate much with your family because maybe 151 00:09:36,000 --> 00:09:38,880 Speaker 1: your family is encouraging you to not be in this 152 00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:42,319 Speaker 1: cult anymore. Um, you can't speak with those relatives, and 153 00:09:42,400 --> 00:09:44,000 Speaker 1: you know, it just moves on and on and on. 154 00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:46,720 Speaker 1: And that's one of the primary goals of a cult leader. 155 00:09:47,240 --> 00:09:52,640 Speaker 1: It's it's to isolate, not only isolate, but break people 156 00:09:52,800 --> 00:09:57,000 Speaker 1: down psychologically by instilling in them this notion that nothing 157 00:09:57,000 --> 00:10:00,320 Speaker 1: they do is good enough or they can't act shually 158 00:10:00,800 --> 00:10:05,199 Speaker 1: you know better themselves without the direct input and influence 159 00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:08,520 Speaker 1: of the person that is kind of setting themselves up 160 00:10:08,520 --> 00:10:12,160 Speaker 1: as being the cult leader. And then you have sexual 161 00:10:12,200 --> 00:10:17,040 Speaker 1: control as well. Yeah. Typically this and this is common, 162 00:10:17,280 --> 00:10:20,400 Speaker 1: the cult leader will eventually have some sort of divine 163 00:10:20,480 --> 00:10:25,000 Speaker 1: revelation whether they see themselves that divinity or see themselves 164 00:10:25,000 --> 00:10:28,080 Speaker 1: as a messenger of that divinity, and the realization will 165 00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:31,400 Speaker 1: be that either no one can have sex, that he 166 00:10:31,559 --> 00:10:34,640 Speaker 1: or she the cult leader can be the only person 167 00:10:34,880 --> 00:10:39,040 Speaker 1: who has sex with anyone, or that the followers must 168 00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:42,520 Speaker 1: obey the sexual dictates of the leader. That's where you 169 00:10:42,559 --> 00:10:46,600 Speaker 1: hear about someone saying it has come to me through 170 00:10:46,679 --> 00:10:52,520 Speaker 1: whatever my brand name of God is that person A 171 00:10:52,960 --> 00:10:56,280 Speaker 1: is the spiritual spouse of person B, and that's the 172 00:10:56,280 --> 00:10:58,840 Speaker 1: only people that these are the only people they can 173 00:10:58,880 --> 00:11:03,520 Speaker 1: fool around now with David Koresh, for example, he received visions, 174 00:11:04,320 --> 00:11:07,280 Speaker 1: one of which told him that the sister of one 175 00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:09,920 Speaker 1: of his wives was to be his new wife, and 176 00:11:10,080 --> 00:11:14,280 Speaker 1: everyone else, the males in that cult were celibate. Yeah, 177 00:11:14,520 --> 00:11:18,160 Speaker 1: and it never really starts that way. No, No, I mean, 178 00:11:18,240 --> 00:11:21,800 Speaker 1: that's it's salesmanship. One oh one. You get your foot 179 00:11:21,840 --> 00:11:24,720 Speaker 1: in the door, and what what happens with this? I 180 00:11:24,760 --> 00:11:29,440 Speaker 1: know it's lurid and it seems it's incredibly gross. I 181 00:11:29,520 --> 00:11:33,600 Speaker 1: really appreciate no, you mentioning that David Koresh example, because 182 00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:36,920 Speaker 1: I believe that sister may have been under age at 183 00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:39,160 Speaker 1: the time. Is that correct? I do believe so, yes, 184 00:11:39,480 --> 00:11:46,160 Speaker 1: So in Koresh's Bible studies, which were these ten hour, 185 00:11:46,679 --> 00:11:51,960 Speaker 1: ten to sixteen hour performances of him just yelling at 186 00:11:52,040 --> 00:11:56,960 Speaker 1: people in those things, he would he would constantly and 187 00:11:56,960 --> 00:12:00,760 Speaker 1: and increasingly make them of a sex will nature and 188 00:12:00,880 --> 00:12:05,440 Speaker 1: find Bible versus where he would interpret this as you know, 189 00:12:05,559 --> 00:12:08,800 Speaker 1: this passage of the Bible says this, what's he really saying? 190 00:12:09,000 --> 00:12:12,080 Speaker 1: He's saying that the women want dicks? And pardon the 191 00:12:12,120 --> 00:12:14,640 Speaker 1: crudeness here, this is a quote. He would say, what 192 00:12:14,640 --> 00:12:17,920 Speaker 1: what does this Bible verse mean? It means they want 193 00:12:18,040 --> 00:12:21,520 Speaker 1: big dicks? Everybody say it, and he would make people 194 00:12:21,559 --> 00:12:24,719 Speaker 1: say it. And to us on the outside that sounds insane, 195 00:12:24,760 --> 00:12:27,480 Speaker 1: But this is after, this is after how many days 196 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:31,040 Speaker 1: of how many solid hours have been yelled at. Having 197 00:12:31,040 --> 00:12:34,240 Speaker 1: your personal life controlled, having and this is one of 198 00:12:34,240 --> 00:12:38,280 Speaker 1: the most important parts, having your ego erase, the obliteration 199 00:12:38,800 --> 00:12:42,680 Speaker 1: of the eye. And this this occurs in a lot 200 00:12:42,720 --> 00:12:47,080 Speaker 1: of organizations, military's attempt to erase the ego. And you'll 201 00:12:47,120 --> 00:12:49,760 Speaker 1: hear people say sometimes that they had a friend who 202 00:12:49,880 --> 00:12:53,800 Speaker 1: entered into a very intense branch of the military or something, 203 00:12:54,080 --> 00:12:56,880 Speaker 1: and that they came out changed, maybe for the better, 204 00:12:57,240 --> 00:13:02,040 Speaker 1: maybe for the worst, maybe just different. And cults actively 205 00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:05,040 Speaker 1: blake in our earlier stuff with the Charles Manson family. 206 00:13:05,400 --> 00:13:11,480 Speaker 1: Cults actively obliterate the agency of the followers, which is 207 00:13:11,480 --> 00:13:14,400 Speaker 1: why it is so important to us. Occult Is a 208 00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:16,760 Speaker 1: podcast is not and should not be a cult. But 209 00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:21,079 Speaker 1: that's why it's so important to us that you listening. Specifically, 210 00:13:21,160 --> 00:13:25,200 Speaker 1: you still get to be yourself and make your own decisions. 211 00:13:25,679 --> 00:13:29,400 Speaker 1: We're not gonna yell at you. Yeah, yeah, you be you. 212 00:13:30,800 --> 00:13:33,280 Speaker 1: Don't don't listen to what we're saying, don't follow every 213 00:13:33,280 --> 00:13:41,120 Speaker 1: word says the cloud to doubt your credibility. But let's 214 00:13:41,160 --> 00:13:44,600 Speaker 1: just rattle off a few other destructive patterns that cults 215 00:13:44,760 --> 00:13:47,720 Speaker 1: um operate under so we can get into the juice 216 00:13:47,800 --> 00:13:50,720 Speaker 1: of today's episode. Yeah, let's do a worst case scenario. Yeah, 217 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:54,800 Speaker 1: so that we've got leaders who emotionally exploit the vulnerable, 218 00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:57,640 Speaker 1: and oftentimes the folks that flock to these types of 219 00:13:57,720 --> 00:14:03,679 Speaker 1: leaders are very vulnerable there seeking answers, and often they 220 00:14:03,720 --> 00:14:09,480 Speaker 1: are attracted to strong personalities who called leaders typically are um. Eventually, 221 00:14:09,559 --> 00:14:12,360 Speaker 1: as Ben said, things change and take it can take 222 00:14:12,360 --> 00:14:15,760 Speaker 1: a dark turn as that exploitation goes from emotional to 223 00:14:15,960 --> 00:14:19,120 Speaker 1: physical uh. And then we have leaders who start to 224 00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:23,920 Speaker 1: obliterate the ego, like Ben said, through social pressure uh, 225 00:14:23,960 --> 00:14:28,240 Speaker 1: physical abuse, shaming people putting their business out in public, 226 00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:32,240 Speaker 1: having people judge them completely, wearing them down to the 227 00:14:32,240 --> 00:14:35,320 Speaker 1: point where they can be molded in the image or 228 00:14:35,360 --> 00:14:38,440 Speaker 1: in you know, at the discretion of the leader. And 229 00:14:38,480 --> 00:14:41,760 Speaker 1: then the next one is important for today's discussion, the 230 00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:46,560 Speaker 1: leaders rambling word salad becomes the primary narrative of the group, 231 00:14:47,080 --> 00:14:51,040 Speaker 1: and then the group's narrative. After all, this rambling starts 232 00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:55,120 Speaker 1: to turn dark, sometimes violent, and often often self destructive, 233 00:14:55,480 --> 00:14:59,120 Speaker 1: as this leader is seeking to increasingly say things that 234 00:14:59,160 --> 00:15:01,960 Speaker 1: are shocking or something that it will be new and 235 00:15:02,040 --> 00:15:06,400 Speaker 1: incredible for their followers to grasp onto things to do 236 00:15:06,560 --> 00:15:11,200 Speaker 1: even um. And they need to maintain this this unpredictability 237 00:15:11,320 --> 00:15:15,080 Speaker 1: or or be viewed as unpredictable, and maintain control of 238 00:15:15,080 --> 00:15:19,000 Speaker 1: all these people listening. Yes, that's important because you have 239 00:15:19,120 --> 00:15:22,800 Speaker 1: to be providing revelations right and no one can ever 240 00:15:22,840 --> 00:15:27,920 Speaker 1: be good enough. Your authority cannot be challenged. So this unpredictability, 241 00:15:28,040 --> 00:15:33,120 Speaker 1: this increasing escalation of shocking behavior is an important tool, 242 00:15:33,200 --> 00:15:36,200 Speaker 1: a crucial tool for maintaining control. And that's when again, 243 00:15:37,160 --> 00:15:42,880 Speaker 1: in the worst case scenarios, we see situations involving suicides 244 00:15:43,080 --> 00:15:47,960 Speaker 1: or murders or other horrendous crimes. Now we enter the 245 00:15:48,080 --> 00:15:52,920 Speaker 1: digital age. If isolation is a key to the formation, growth, 246 00:15:52,960 --> 00:15:56,000 Speaker 1: and ultimate de cave of cults, surely the glut of 247 00:15:56,080 --> 00:16:00,320 Speaker 1: information available via phone or text or tablet or social 248 00:16:00,440 --> 00:16:04,240 Speaker 1: media would reduce cults. You're always in contact with someone, right, 249 00:16:05,400 --> 00:16:08,360 Speaker 1: you'd think, but it might not be. Let's hear a 250 00:16:08,400 --> 00:16:18,280 Speaker 1: word from our sponsor. Here's where it gets crazy. There 251 00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:25,160 Speaker 1: are digitally powered movements for me today and growing successfully 252 00:16:25,200 --> 00:16:29,200 Speaker 1: that fit, according to their critics, a lot of the 253 00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:34,800 Speaker 1: definitions of occult. And this is where we arrive at 254 00:16:35,320 --> 00:16:38,520 Speaker 1: the story that you know your friend introduced us to 255 00:16:39,040 --> 00:16:42,640 Speaker 1: a character named Bentinho Massorrow. You may have also heard 256 00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:45,520 Speaker 1: him called Bentino. Yeah, so I was turned onto an 257 00:16:45,600 --> 00:16:49,040 Speaker 1: article um on medium that came out in December of 258 00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:53,440 Speaker 1: last year by a writer by the name of B. B. E. 259 00:16:53,720 --> 00:16:59,160 Speaker 1: Scofield Um who alleges that Massorrow is a cult leader 260 00:16:59,480 --> 00:17:06,960 Speaker 1: empower hard by the ever evolving nature of digital communications. 261 00:17:07,040 --> 00:17:10,520 Speaker 1: In fact, the headline of the article is the very 262 00:17:10,600 --> 00:17:16,600 Speaker 1: salacious tech bro guru inside the Sedona cult of Benteno 263 00:17:16,800 --> 00:17:20,040 Speaker 1: massorrow and and the top of it is is emblazoned 264 00:17:20,040 --> 00:17:23,320 Speaker 1: with some pictures from this man's Instagram account. One where 265 00:17:23,359 --> 00:17:26,480 Speaker 1: he's dressed up as Hugh Hefner with like a captain's 266 00:17:26,480 --> 00:17:30,800 Speaker 1: hat on, surrounded by scantily clad playboy bunny esque women. 267 00:17:30,880 --> 00:17:34,240 Speaker 1: And there's one where he's like the real bad joker 268 00:17:34,320 --> 00:17:38,760 Speaker 1: from the latest Batman movie with what's his face suicide 269 00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:41,920 Speaker 1: squad doing doing a mirror selfie. And then there's one 270 00:17:41,920 --> 00:17:44,399 Speaker 1: where he's uh, got a cigar in his mouth. In 271 00:17:44,440 --> 00:17:47,680 Speaker 1: the background you see some real, real fancy scotches. Um. 272 00:17:47,920 --> 00:17:50,199 Speaker 1: Who is this guy? And then what's he after? What 273 00:17:50,240 --> 00:17:53,760 Speaker 1: does it mean to be a tech bro cult leader? Well, uh, 274 00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:56,160 Speaker 1: he started well, at least from what we can tell, 275 00:17:56,359 --> 00:17:59,600 Speaker 1: he started posting on a YouTube channel in two thousand ten. 276 00:18:00,280 --> 00:18:03,840 Speaker 1: And uh, this is just what we know from the surface, 277 00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:06,880 Speaker 1: and we'll get into what we know after some research 278 00:18:07,200 --> 00:18:12,399 Speaker 1: on the surface. First video understanding life is impossible and 279 00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:15,520 Speaker 1: h here here's just some ideas from that video. We 280 00:18:15,720 --> 00:18:19,560 Speaker 1: as human beings, every situation we encounter, we constantly try 281 00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:24,119 Speaker 1: to analyze, We constantly try to understand everything in reality. 282 00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:27,919 Speaker 1: The life that's just here. It cannot be understood. We 283 00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:31,920 Speaker 1: have to stop trying to understand everything. Life wasn't meant 284 00:18:32,000 --> 00:18:35,399 Speaker 1: to be understood. It's the embrace of the mystery that 285 00:18:35,520 --> 00:18:39,639 Speaker 1: instantaneously reveals the beauty of what's right here. The funny 286 00:18:39,640 --> 00:18:42,440 Speaker 1: thing is when we stop trying to understand what we perceive, 287 00:18:42,880 --> 00:18:46,800 Speaker 1: we naturally understand in here. At that point, he points 288 00:18:46,800 --> 00:18:51,119 Speaker 1: at his chest, thinking, is just another aspect of reality 289 00:18:51,560 --> 00:18:55,800 Speaker 1: and it cannot understand itself. Life doesn't care why it's here. 290 00:18:56,119 --> 00:19:00,359 Speaker 1: It's simply here. I mean overall, that's how it's like. 291 00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:03,040 Speaker 1: First off, a restatement of things that have been said 292 00:19:03,080 --> 00:19:10,720 Speaker 1: pretty often. And uh, do people understand life? I mean 293 00:19:10,760 --> 00:19:14,000 Speaker 1: it's a it's a fair question. And just to say 294 00:19:14,040 --> 00:19:16,480 Speaker 1: in the video he appears to be a young man. 295 00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:19,280 Speaker 1: I mean, you know, is it around seven eight years ago? 296 00:19:19,359 --> 00:19:22,600 Speaker 1: He said? Yeah, two, Um, you know, just a young 297 00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:25,879 Speaker 1: man giving his beliefs into a laptop computer sort of 298 00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:30,880 Speaker 1: a manifesto, right, And these, these uh selfie manifestos are 299 00:19:31,240 --> 00:19:35,400 Speaker 1: super common on YouTube. Literally, anyone with an Internet connection 300 00:19:35,560 --> 00:19:38,359 Speaker 1: and a camera can make a YouTube account or make 301 00:19:38,359 --> 00:19:41,680 Speaker 1: a Google account and post them. Personal spirituality is nothing 302 00:19:41,720 --> 00:19:45,760 Speaker 1: new to YouTube, and you might not be familiar with 303 00:19:45,800 --> 00:19:49,639 Speaker 1: this guy. Although he is a YouTube sensation, he's built 304 00:19:49,720 --> 00:19:54,640 Speaker 1: a massive following since that video in two thousand and ten. 305 00:19:55,240 --> 00:19:58,400 Speaker 1: We have stats for you. His Facebook page has over 306 00:19:58,520 --> 00:20:02,400 Speaker 1: three hundred thousand people on it, his Instagram is over 307 00:20:02,480 --> 00:20:06,399 Speaker 1: twenty thousand. They've got Facebook groups that follow him. His 308 00:20:06,760 --> 00:20:11,800 Speaker 1: YouTube videos have over two million views. I think that's total, 309 00:20:12,280 --> 00:20:15,639 Speaker 1: not per video for sure. I mean his videos of individually, 310 00:20:15,640 --> 00:20:17,280 Speaker 1: and he's got a ton of them there in the 311 00:20:17,320 --> 00:20:20,879 Speaker 1: thirty to forty views a piece, And I would argue 312 00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:24,800 Speaker 1: these numbers are not earth shattering by any means. But 313 00:20:24,840 --> 00:20:26,680 Speaker 1: where it gets interesting is when you start to see 314 00:20:26,680 --> 00:20:28,880 Speaker 1: the kind of money he's able to bring in with 315 00:20:28,920 --> 00:20:32,680 Speaker 1: this semi modest following. Right, he has an organization called 316 00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:36,080 Speaker 1: the Trinfinity Academy. It's a website UM sort of a 317 00:20:36,160 --> 00:20:39,679 Speaker 1: self help kind of guru type website, and on it 318 00:20:39,800 --> 00:20:42,480 Speaker 1: you can read these courses that he has laid out, 319 00:20:42,960 --> 00:20:45,280 Speaker 1: and it's got kind of like a radiohead pay what 320 00:20:45,359 --> 00:20:50,240 Speaker 1: you will model. But apparently, according to um the media article, 321 00:20:50,280 --> 00:20:53,080 Speaker 1: he brings in around sixty thou dollars a month, which 322 00:20:53,080 --> 00:20:56,200 Speaker 1: is more than enough to cover the fourteen thousand dollar 323 00:20:56,280 --> 00:21:01,120 Speaker 1: a month rent for his lavish offices in Sedona, uh Arizona, 324 00:21:01,200 --> 00:21:05,000 Speaker 1: which is is home base. UM and Ben you said 325 00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:09,000 Speaker 1: earlier you felt like that sixty thou wasn't all donations 326 00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:12,840 Speaker 1: that could account for UM people that are paying to 327 00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:16,160 Speaker 1: come to his seminars. Well, you know, no, they do. 328 00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:18,640 Speaker 1: They suggest at the very bottom, on the left hand 329 00:21:18,680 --> 00:21:20,880 Speaker 1: side of the page, they suggest that if you're going 330 00:21:20,960 --> 00:21:23,920 Speaker 1: to take one of their uh one of their courses 331 00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:27,400 Speaker 1: on their website, they suggest a hundred to a three 332 00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:30,960 Speaker 1: d donation per per one that you're going to read. 333 00:21:32,280 --> 00:21:33,760 Speaker 1: I mean, you know that would that's sort of like 334 00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:36,439 Speaker 1: a what's the honor system kind of situation. It's like 335 00:21:36,480 --> 00:21:38,480 Speaker 1: when you go to the Met Museum in New York 336 00:21:38,520 --> 00:21:42,880 Speaker 1: and they say recommended donation of of thirty dollars. You know, 337 00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:45,720 Speaker 1: I usually give ten, but I'm a cheap skate. Is 338 00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:49,080 Speaker 1: it thirty? I thought it was twenty? I think? Okay, Well, 339 00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:51,000 Speaker 1: I know they're actually not to get to op topic, 340 00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:53,119 Speaker 1: but the Met is actually going to start imposing an 341 00:21:53,119 --> 00:21:55,560 Speaker 1: actual ticket price very soon, so probably a good idea 342 00:21:55,560 --> 00:21:57,399 Speaker 1: get in there while you can. Yeah. Well, and but 343 00:21:57,520 --> 00:22:03,240 Speaker 1: this isn't their only source of income, these online courses, right, Yeah. 344 00:22:03,480 --> 00:22:08,840 Speaker 1: Massarrow also has in person retreats that gather crowds of 345 00:22:09,080 --> 00:22:12,880 Speaker 1: up to hundreds, and when we were talking off air, 346 00:22:13,560 --> 00:22:17,159 Speaker 1: that was that was one of the things that perked 347 00:22:17,200 --> 00:22:20,280 Speaker 1: our collective ears up, because it seems like, if you're 348 00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:24,560 Speaker 1: going on on our system of suggested donation, sixty a 349 00:22:24,920 --> 00:22:28,199 Speaker 1: month seems like a really tall milkshake for that. But 350 00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:31,239 Speaker 1: if people are booking the seminars through that does that 351 00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:33,760 Speaker 1: count the income as well? And we also have to 352 00:22:33,800 --> 00:22:36,880 Speaker 1: ask when we will ask later just to be fair, uh, 353 00:22:36,920 --> 00:22:40,560 Speaker 1: the motivations of the scoffold the writer who did a 354 00:22:40,560 --> 00:22:45,000 Speaker 1: fantastic job with this article. By the way, So back 355 00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:49,120 Speaker 1: to the digital age, Massarrow is effectively used things like 356 00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:53,639 Speaker 1: WhatsApp or Facebook Live to to reach new followers. And 357 00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:57,720 Speaker 1: although you know, although as Noel pointed out, these are 358 00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:02,520 Speaker 1: not especially earth shattering numbers, it's not like the you know, 359 00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:06,520 Speaker 1: a musician with billions of views or something doing this. 360 00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:10,800 Speaker 1: Reaching this level of success independently is pretty impressive. It's 361 00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:15,120 Speaker 1: still small time in comparison to some other spiritual movements. 362 00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:18,760 Speaker 1: And again, let's keep in mind spiritual movement describes everything 363 00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:23,040 Speaker 1: from uh closely held personal belief you've never told anyone 364 00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:26,120 Speaker 1: to things like Buddhism or the Catholic Church. There's a 365 00:23:26,119 --> 00:23:31,520 Speaker 1: wide range of things here, but still it is there, 366 00:23:31,640 --> 00:23:34,680 Speaker 1: and it's and it's present. So now we have to 367 00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:41,840 Speaker 1: ask ourselves what exactly is heat teaching from From the article, 368 00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:46,760 Speaker 1: h Schofield describes it thus Lee a mashup of ad Veta, 369 00:23:47,040 --> 00:23:51,399 Speaker 1: Vedanta and the law of attraction. Other influences include O 370 00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:54,639 Speaker 1: show Bashar, the law of one channel by raw and 371 00:23:54,680 --> 00:23:58,560 Speaker 1: this Gadata Maharaj and some Yogic text as well. So 372 00:23:58,640 --> 00:24:00,760 Speaker 1: there's a lot of stuff in the mix. Yeah, yeah, 373 00:24:00,760 --> 00:24:06,200 Speaker 1: and the Advita. The danta Um school is a particular 374 00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:11,320 Speaker 1: type of Hindu philosophy and a path to spiritual realization 375 00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:15,960 Speaker 1: and focuses on um the teachings of the Upanishads and 376 00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:23,639 Speaker 1: finding basically the highest levels of metaphysical reality brahmin or 377 00:24:23,800 --> 00:24:28,960 Speaker 1: sort of something like achieving nirvana um. And more interestingly 378 00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:32,440 Speaker 1: to me is this idea of the law of one, 379 00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:35,719 Speaker 1: which is something I've never heard before. And I found 380 00:24:35,800 --> 00:24:39,720 Speaker 1: a page Law of one dot info that goes through 381 00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:43,000 Speaker 1: the different levels of enlightenment than one can achieve by 382 00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:46,040 Speaker 1: following this path. Uh, I'm gonna read a little bit 383 00:24:46,040 --> 00:24:48,280 Speaker 1: from that. Um The Law of One states that there 384 00:24:48,320 --> 00:24:51,080 Speaker 1: is only one and that one is the infinite creator. 385 00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:55,439 Speaker 1: It also invokes the name of raw Uh, the Egyptian 386 00:24:55,760 --> 00:25:01,200 Speaker 1: god Um. Raw also calls infinite intelligence and in intelligent infinity. 387 00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:06,880 Speaker 1: It's impossible to describe the one undifferentiated, intelligent infinity, unpolarized, 388 00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:10,040 Speaker 1: full and whole, but it can be activated or potentiated. 389 00:25:10,119 --> 00:25:14,760 Speaker 1: Each portion of the creation contains paradoxically the whole. It 390 00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:18,679 Speaker 1: is like an ocean. Well it's it's hologrammatic thinking as well. 391 00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:22,480 Speaker 1: And there's a book called The Raw Material Uh. An 392 00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:25,840 Speaker 1: ancient astronaut speaks uh. The Law of One by a 393 00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:28,080 Speaker 1: man by the name of Don Elkins, and the um 394 00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:31,840 Speaker 1: synopsister that on Amazon is pretty interesting. Poses a few questions. 395 00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:34,800 Speaker 1: What are the ancient astronauts? Why did they first come 396 00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:37,520 Speaker 1: to Earth? Why are they returning now? What part did 397 00:25:37,520 --> 00:25:40,520 Speaker 1: they play in building the great monuments of antiquity? What 398 00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:43,119 Speaker 1: part did they play in the formation of present and 399 00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:48,080 Speaker 1: earlier civilizations? With? What other beings do we share our universe? 400 00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:51,080 Speaker 1: And where does the Earth fit into the cosmic scheme 401 00:25:51,119 --> 00:25:54,639 Speaker 1: of things. Almost twenty years of experimental work with telepathy 402 00:25:54,760 --> 00:25:57,840 Speaker 1: led to the breakthrough contact recorded in this book, the 403 00:25:57,960 --> 00:26:00,639 Speaker 1: raw material as an account not me for the events 404 00:26:00,760 --> 00:26:03,600 Speaker 1: leading up to this contact, but of over two hundred 405 00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:08,920 Speaker 1: pages of verbatim transcripts of each and every conversation. Two 406 00:26:08,960 --> 00:26:14,159 Speaker 1: things real quick, No, I swear you have heard this 407 00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:19,159 Speaker 1: concept before, but it was packaged very differently. You're a 408 00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:23,000 Speaker 1: Bill Hicks fan, right, Bill Hicks talks about this sort 409 00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:26,479 Speaker 1: of thing. He probably got it from a very similar um. 410 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:29,960 Speaker 1: He probably got it from his very similar source, maybe 411 00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:34,600 Speaker 1: even the apponishads. He was a constant reader. It's interesting. 412 00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:37,320 Speaker 1: The second thing that's really interesting about this is what 413 00:26:37,440 --> 00:26:42,680 Speaker 1: we're seeing is syncretism, combining of aspects from different religions, 414 00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:46,440 Speaker 1: and the Danta itself is kind of syncretic. So we're 415 00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:49,760 Speaker 1: seeing a and I don't want to say a mixtape 416 00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:52,080 Speaker 1: of a mixtape because I don't want to be dismissive, 417 00:26:52,400 --> 00:26:57,400 Speaker 1: but we're seeing like combinations of combinations coming through, which 418 00:26:58,359 --> 00:27:01,960 Speaker 1: honestly I applaud if we're talking about spirituality, I really 419 00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:06,159 Speaker 1: feel like you should find what works for you. A 420 00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:09,760 Speaker 1: little later, we're gonna get into a direct message from 421 00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:13,399 Speaker 1: Benino Massorrow and it says that very thing that you're 422 00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:16,840 Speaker 1: talking about ben where his teachings over time, he says, 423 00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:20,920 Speaker 1: have been a collection of different teachings and different movements 424 00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:24,119 Speaker 1: and all these paradoxical even at times things it seems 425 00:27:24,160 --> 00:27:26,119 Speaker 1: less about worshiping a god too, as much as it 426 00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:29,400 Speaker 1: is kind of treating yourself as a god or an 427 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:32,360 Speaker 1: extension of the universe. And it's interesting because the law 428 00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:36,560 Speaker 1: of One has these these layers, almost scientology esque layers. 429 00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:40,280 Speaker 1: They're called densities, and at first through eighth density, and 430 00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:44,360 Speaker 1: it's something that Massorrow touches a lot in the teachings. Absolutely, 431 00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:45,920 Speaker 1: he definitely talks about it, and it's it's it's a 432 00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:47,800 Speaker 1: little hard to wrap your head around. And I think 433 00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:49,920 Speaker 1: for good reason, just to read a couple of these, 434 00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:52,080 Speaker 1: I'll do the first and the last. The first density 435 00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:54,480 Speaker 1: is the density of awareness in which the planet moves 436 00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:57,960 Speaker 1: out of the timeless state into physical manifestation. It's elements 437 00:27:57,960 --> 00:28:00,680 Speaker 1: are earth, air, water, and fire. On Earth, after matter 438 00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:03,880 Speaker 1: had coalesced in spacetime had begun to quote unroll its 439 00:28:03,880 --> 00:28:07,440 Speaker 1: scroll of livingness, first density took about two billion years. 440 00:28:07,640 --> 00:28:10,240 Speaker 1: Then eighth density is also the beginning of the first 441 00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:13,159 Speaker 1: density of the next creation. It is both omega and alpha. 442 00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:16,240 Speaker 1: The spiritual mass of the infinite universe is becoming one 443 00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:19,760 Speaker 1: central son or creator once again. Then is born a 444 00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:23,440 Speaker 1: new universe, a new infinity, a new logos, which incorporates 445 00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:27,080 Speaker 1: all that the Creator has experienced of itself. So what 446 00:28:27,200 --> 00:28:30,320 Speaker 1: this sounds like to me is essentially the Big Bang 447 00:28:30,359 --> 00:28:33,359 Speaker 1: they're describing in the first density, right after after the 448 00:28:33,359 --> 00:28:36,240 Speaker 1: Big Bang has occurred, and now we actually have an Earth, 449 00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:39,800 Speaker 1: we have a place where consciousness can exist. Then going 450 00:28:39,840 --> 00:28:42,160 Speaker 1: through all these other densities through here to getting to 451 00:28:42,200 --> 00:28:45,920 Speaker 1: the eighth density is when it's snapped back together. Essentially, 452 00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:49,080 Speaker 1: if you look at UM, some of the their infinite 453 00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:53,480 Speaker 1: universe models that believe big bangs occur as expansion, and 454 00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:56,920 Speaker 1: then there's a collapsing back down into essentially one singularity, 455 00:28:57,000 --> 00:28:59,520 Speaker 1: and then another expansion, and then it just continues on 456 00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:04,120 Speaker 1: this cycle cycle of contraction and expansion. And that's one model. 457 00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:06,400 Speaker 1: And then also this has a lot in common with 458 00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:12,040 Speaker 1: the views of alchemical experts, right, alchemical scholars and the 459 00:29:12,120 --> 00:29:15,200 Speaker 1: great work. This is not the I think the point 460 00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:18,480 Speaker 1: we're making is this is not, by any means a 461 00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:23,800 Speaker 1: new idea. But also i'm Sorrow's defense, he's not really 462 00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:27,560 Speaker 1: saying it's a new idea either right, and it would 463 00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:29,600 Speaker 1: be it would be unfair of us to say that 464 00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:33,160 Speaker 1: he thinks he discovery. He does believe that he put 465 00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:36,080 Speaker 1: it all together in the right way, but he doesn't 466 00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:40,440 Speaker 1: claim that he did everything. Another another interesting part about 467 00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:42,800 Speaker 1: this in the digital age is that a lot of 468 00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:46,920 Speaker 1: his teachings or courses or videos or lessons or talks 469 00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:53,320 Speaker 1: have um a quantifiable aspect to them. It's not just 470 00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:57,200 Speaker 1: reach level, you know, reach this density, density x or whatever. 471 00:29:57,640 --> 00:30:01,040 Speaker 1: It's how to reach it in X amount of steps, 472 00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:05,000 Speaker 1: how to understand concept a in why amount of time? 473 00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:09,000 Speaker 1: And this clicks with a lot of people in today's 474 00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:12,440 Speaker 1: age where we want to we have so many things 475 00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:15,080 Speaker 1: to pay attention to or spend time on that we 476 00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:18,080 Speaker 1: want to know about how long it's going to take, 477 00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:22,080 Speaker 1: or how to measure our steps to success. As appealing 478 00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:24,960 Speaker 1: as sitting under a tree for an indeterminate length of 479 00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:29,440 Speaker 1: time to reach enlightenment may sound in theory, very few 480 00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:32,680 Speaker 1: people are doing it in practice or fewer now. You 481 00:30:32,680 --> 00:30:34,960 Speaker 1: can even see it in the furniture A lot of 482 00:30:35,040 --> 00:30:38,200 Speaker 1: us choose to purchase. If you if you imagine like 483 00:30:38,360 --> 00:30:41,560 Speaker 1: getting just some wood and making a table or you 484 00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:44,880 Speaker 1: could get the ikea one that has a list of 485 00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:47,600 Speaker 1: steps to follow, and then you've got yourself a table man. 486 00:30:47,840 --> 00:30:51,080 Speaker 1: And this kind of results based, quick, results based attitude 487 00:30:51,080 --> 00:30:54,200 Speaker 1: really plays into that kind of uh, you know, lightning 488 00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:57,560 Speaker 1: fast communication. Everyone's attention span is shorter than it's ever been. 489 00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:00,480 Speaker 1: We want everything in blurbs and nuge it's and like 490 00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:03,000 Speaker 1: give it to us quick. Even his videos, He's got 491 00:31:03,040 --> 00:31:05,880 Speaker 1: longer videos, but a lot of them are distilled down 492 00:31:05,960 --> 00:31:08,200 Speaker 1: until like ten or twelve minutes, a little sound bites 493 00:31:08,240 --> 00:31:11,120 Speaker 1: that are easier to digest for folks. So he's very 494 00:31:11,200 --> 00:31:13,640 Speaker 1: much aware of his audience. I would say, uh, they 495 00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:16,360 Speaker 1: are not easy to understand, at least as a layperson 496 00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:18,920 Speaker 1: who has not taken all the courses yet. I've attempted 497 00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:23,000 Speaker 1: to watch six videos today again like rewatching videos to 498 00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:26,560 Speaker 1: just understand some of the density stuff to understand, uh, 499 00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:31,560 Speaker 1: taking two to five seconds out of every like x seconds, 500 00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:35,400 Speaker 1: and the I don't understand a lot of the messages 501 00:31:35,720 --> 00:31:38,400 Speaker 1: will let me rephrase I I don't either. I guess 502 00:31:38,400 --> 00:31:40,720 Speaker 1: all I'm saying is that I'm at least able to 503 00:31:40,760 --> 00:31:44,680 Speaker 1: watch uh ten minutes of this stuff rather than you know, 504 00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:48,640 Speaker 1: two hours. And it's interesting because Massarrow's followers themselves, a 505 00:31:48,680 --> 00:31:51,120 Speaker 1: lot of them. We found some. There's a SoundCloud page 506 00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:55,000 Speaker 1: from bat Girl that interviews some folks from some of 507 00:31:55,040 --> 00:31:59,080 Speaker 1: these conferences. Um, they say that it's totally fine, did 508 00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:02,120 Speaker 1: not understand what the hell he's talking about. The message, 509 00:32:02,160 --> 00:32:06,000 Speaker 1: they say, is between the words, and that's another thing 510 00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:11,120 Speaker 1: you see with gurus or light masters throughout human history. 511 00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:15,680 Speaker 1: There's this idea that the leader functions as sort of 512 00:32:15,680 --> 00:32:20,280 Speaker 1: an antagonistic ror schack ink blot. You see what you 513 00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:23,160 Speaker 1: want to see and hear what you want to hear, 514 00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:28,880 Speaker 1: and you're always bad. You're always wrong, unless you're no 515 00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:32,560 Speaker 1: longer you. We'll be back after a word from our sponsor. 516 00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:43,480 Speaker 1: So Massorrow speaks often about interpreting vibrations, what he would 517 00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:47,240 Speaker 1: term his vibrations. His followers claim to be able to 518 00:32:47,440 --> 00:32:52,120 Speaker 1: interpret and internalize the vibrations he puts out, and they 519 00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:55,280 Speaker 1: feel that a lot of the content, or the message 520 00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:59,480 Speaker 1: or the enlightenment that he is conveying comes from these 521 00:32:59,560 --> 00:33:04,600 Speaker 1: vibrations more so than maybe the actual words. And this 522 00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:07,560 Speaker 1: quote should be on the jacket of of his first book. 523 00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:10,600 Speaker 1: It is you are a vibrator, and you are a 524 00:33:10,680 --> 00:33:14,560 Speaker 1: vibrator and you're vibrate. Okay, no, that is that is 525 00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:17,440 Speaker 1: a verbatim quote there, but he said that to me, 526 00:33:17,520 --> 00:33:20,680 Speaker 1: I'd slug him. Well in a way. He's kind of right, guys, 527 00:33:21,280 --> 00:33:24,520 Speaker 1: all of our energy just it's just vibrating. It's true, 528 00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:28,760 Speaker 1: physical matter is relatively illusory. Can we talk a little 529 00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:32,320 Speaker 1: about Sedona and just the scene in Sedona, like, not 530 00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:35,200 Speaker 1: with too much detail, but just in case anyone's not familiar. 531 00:33:35,200 --> 00:33:36,600 Speaker 1: And I really wish I had a chance to talk 532 00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:39,320 Speaker 1: to our coworker Julie Douglas, who just did kind of 533 00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:42,160 Speaker 1: a tour of that part of the country. But Sedona, 534 00:33:42,280 --> 00:33:45,320 Speaker 1: Arizona is kind of ground zero for a lot of 535 00:33:45,320 --> 00:33:50,320 Speaker 1: this New age teachings and self betterment through self actualization 536 00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:52,880 Speaker 1: and yoga, and they are all of these different retreats 537 00:33:53,160 --> 00:33:57,680 Speaker 1: and it is a really rife with these kinds of gurus. 538 00:33:57,880 --> 00:33:59,480 Speaker 1: And what makes it interesting to us is that it 539 00:33:59,760 --> 00:34:06,320 Speaker 1: feels like um a new approach to this kind of thinking, 540 00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:10,640 Speaker 1: or that this kind of recruitment or and it's a 541 00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:13,880 Speaker 1: it's an amalgamation of startup culture, which leads to that 542 00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:17,920 Speaker 1: other thing, right, is what's the difference between startup culture. 543 00:34:17,960 --> 00:34:21,920 Speaker 1: And what's the difference between you know, an old school cult, 544 00:34:22,080 --> 00:34:25,640 Speaker 1: because we do have in startup cultures. We see this 545 00:34:25,760 --> 00:34:29,040 Speaker 1: sent up in so many satirical pieces like Silicon Valley 546 00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:32,440 Speaker 1: or something. Uh. We see these commonalities. There is a 547 00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:37,680 Speaker 1: cult of personality, right, and there is a there is 548 00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:42,720 Speaker 1: a drive to dedicate oneself entirely to a cause, whether 549 00:34:42,760 --> 00:34:46,200 Speaker 1: it's making the you know, newest app to hand deliver 550 00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:50,400 Speaker 1: bags of artisanal badgers to people or you know, or 551 00:34:50,400 --> 00:34:52,320 Speaker 1: whether it's to figure out a way to have a 552 00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:57,319 Speaker 1: drone that will I don't know, bring you shoes and 553 00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:00,759 Speaker 1: pizza and pizza, you know, shoes and and like the 554 00:35:00,800 --> 00:35:05,040 Speaker 1: best startups, they begin with a product that that's kind 555 00:35:05,040 --> 00:35:08,560 Speaker 1: of tangible you can get, like Ben Bentino's teachings and 556 00:35:08,640 --> 00:35:12,400 Speaker 1: the videos. But then there's this much larger goal, Like 557 00:35:12,440 --> 00:35:14,880 Speaker 1: you said, Ben, it's down the road. Oh, I'm so 558 00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:19,040 Speaker 1: glad you mentioned this. Yes, because Massarrow's trinfinity, which which 559 00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:23,960 Speaker 1: Noel introduced earlier, is a step in a larger plan, 560 00:35:24,200 --> 00:35:27,160 Speaker 1: and his seminars and his speeches are part of a 561 00:35:27,239 --> 00:35:31,040 Speaker 1: much larger goal, a four phase plan to create an 562 00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:35,040 Speaker 1: enlightened society by twenty thirty five. So not that far 563 00:35:35,160 --> 00:35:41,279 Speaker 1: down enlightened, right, Let's hear from the man himself with 564 00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:43,480 Speaker 1: the work that I'm doing. What I'm trying to achieve, 565 00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:48,560 Speaker 1: quite frankly, as to have a one enlightened civilization by 566 00:35:48,640 --> 00:35:53,120 Speaker 1: two thousand five, to make it specific, so that gives 567 00:35:53,200 --> 00:35:57,120 Speaker 1: us twenty years to to share this message and in 568 00:35:57,160 --> 00:35:59,719 Speaker 1: many different kinds of ways, not just educational ways, but 569 00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:05,160 Speaker 1: also though in terms of products, inventions, technology, and education obviously, 570 00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:08,000 Speaker 1: so that everyone can start to act on their inspiration 571 00:36:08,560 --> 00:36:11,799 Speaker 1: and be guided by that higher intelligence which picks in 572 00:36:11,800 --> 00:36:15,080 Speaker 1: our heart in the sense of passion and excitement and inspiration. 573 00:36:15,440 --> 00:36:18,680 Speaker 1: When the whole world starts to listen to that impulse 574 00:36:18,960 --> 00:36:21,680 Speaker 1: and be aware of the fact that they are already 575 00:36:21,760 --> 00:36:27,400 Speaker 1: free beings, that they're already awake, powerful beings, then the 576 00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:31,600 Speaker 1: world would be amazing place to be. So steps along 577 00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:35,320 Speaker 1: the way in this plan include the creation of apps, film, 578 00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:43,480 Speaker 1: TV and record studios, VR technology and astral projection inducer. Yeah, 579 00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:46,040 Speaker 1: a couple of labs, and you know you could you 580 00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:50,600 Speaker 1: could ask yourself, is that astral projection inducer encouraging lucid dreams? 581 00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:54,600 Speaker 1: Or is it real remote viewing? The US government did 582 00:36:54,680 --> 00:36:58,040 Speaker 1: work on remote viewing for a long time. That is true, 583 00:36:58,600 --> 00:37:02,359 Speaker 1: uh publishing reliable, none love. You know, we have an 584 00:37:02,360 --> 00:37:05,320 Speaker 1: episode on it. I think that we want to interview 585 00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:07,520 Speaker 1: one of those guys one day. So if you're listening, 586 00:37:08,640 --> 00:37:10,319 Speaker 1: hit us up or you might be in the room now. 587 00:37:11,320 --> 00:37:16,080 Speaker 1: But they also have, interestingly, a system to foster open 588 00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:19,480 Speaker 1: contact with aliens. This all culminates in the construction of 589 00:37:19,560 --> 00:37:23,880 Speaker 1: something called Trinfinity City, a metropolis built in hopes of 590 00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:28,279 Speaker 1: being prepared for open interstellar contact, in contrast to the 591 00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:32,600 Speaker 1: clandestine contact that Massarrow believes has occurred in the past. 592 00:37:32,719 --> 00:37:35,880 Speaker 1: That might sound controversial, but he has plenty of beliefs 593 00:37:35,920 --> 00:37:39,839 Speaker 1: that might seem controversial to the mainstream. I wonder if 594 00:37:39,880 --> 00:37:43,279 Speaker 1: he and Stephen Greer have ever gotten together, because you know, 595 00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:46,080 Speaker 1: Stephen Greer's The Encounter of the Fifth Kind is all 596 00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:50,560 Speaker 1: about contacting aliens through meditation. It's also about you know, 597 00:37:51,480 --> 00:37:54,640 Speaker 1: getting gullible rich people to drop mad cash to go 598 00:37:54,719 --> 00:37:58,680 Speaker 1: on these excursions. Burn You have to wonder though, you 599 00:37:58,719 --> 00:38:02,680 Speaker 1: know from from what we hear, uh Mas Sorrow has 600 00:38:02,719 --> 00:38:08,840 Speaker 1: been controversial with other teachers other like other spiritual teachers. 601 00:38:09,360 --> 00:38:11,839 Speaker 1: We have examples of that, so I could see him 602 00:38:11,840 --> 00:38:17,480 Speaker 1: also being controversial with other secular leaders of movements as well. 603 00:38:17,640 --> 00:38:20,000 Speaker 1: And we have to give serious credit to be Scofield 604 00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:22,640 Speaker 1: again for this media article. It is very, very in depth, 605 00:38:22,840 --> 00:38:25,080 Speaker 1: UM and I recommend you guys seeking it out. Their clips, 606 00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:28,200 Speaker 1: their videos, their audio samples, all kinds of stuff. Because 607 00:38:28,239 --> 00:38:31,879 Speaker 1: she actually embedded herself in one of his groups under 608 00:38:31,880 --> 00:38:35,080 Speaker 1: an assumed name. UM. And you know we'll get to 609 00:38:35,120 --> 00:38:38,200 Speaker 1: this a little later, but the Trinfinity folks in Manteno 610 00:38:38,719 --> 00:38:43,720 Speaker 1: uh did publish a response UM to this article. UM. 611 00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:47,000 Speaker 1: But in the article she talks about the fact that 612 00:38:47,440 --> 00:38:50,040 Speaker 1: in his early days, he was invited to be part 613 00:38:50,400 --> 00:38:55,960 Speaker 1: of a collection of speakers UM by a group called 614 00:38:56,560 --> 00:38:59,560 Speaker 1: Sounds True, which I think is a really funny name 615 00:38:59,800 --> 00:39:03,640 Speaker 1: for organizations like this, Like, Wow, it sounds true. I 616 00:39:03,640 --> 00:39:06,920 Speaker 1: guess that it must be true. It's like a spiritual symposium. 617 00:39:06,920 --> 00:39:08,719 Speaker 1: Spiritual symposium, but I just feel like it's a it's 618 00:39:08,719 --> 00:39:11,319 Speaker 1: a little bit the name is is almost sounds sounds 619 00:39:11,320 --> 00:39:14,840 Speaker 1: a little jokey to me. But um he some of 620 00:39:14,840 --> 00:39:16,840 Speaker 1: the other speakers you might have heard of, Eckhart Totley, 621 00:39:17,239 --> 00:39:20,560 Speaker 1: who is much beloved, and I know people who I 622 00:39:20,600 --> 00:39:24,479 Speaker 1: find completely rational, intelligent people that are really into his stuff. Um, 623 00:39:24,520 --> 00:39:27,200 Speaker 1: but he kind of wanted to distance himself from these 624 00:39:27,239 --> 00:39:29,319 Speaker 1: types of folks and just sort of talked a lot 625 00:39:29,360 --> 00:39:32,400 Speaker 1: of trash and really did not want to be associated 626 00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:35,799 Speaker 1: with them anymore after this first UH symposium that he 627 00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:37,360 Speaker 1: was a part of, and wanted to kind of go 628 00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:39,160 Speaker 1: out on his own and make it all about him 629 00:39:39,160 --> 00:39:41,319 Speaker 1: and his specific teachings and not have to answer to 630 00:39:41,320 --> 00:39:44,840 Speaker 1: anyone else's world view and has a little cult leaders 631 00:39:44,920 --> 00:39:48,840 Speaker 1: to me, Yeah, well maybe it's just the question is 632 00:39:48,880 --> 00:39:53,520 Speaker 1: always do these people genuinely believe this stuff or is 633 00:39:53,600 --> 00:39:57,520 Speaker 1: it sort of a flame flam show are they Are 634 00:39:57,560 --> 00:40:03,200 Speaker 1: they objecting to the views of another spiritual leader because 635 00:40:03,680 --> 00:40:07,600 Speaker 1: they feel that those views are business competition, or they 636 00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:11,279 Speaker 1: objecting because they honestly believe it's wrong, you know, And 637 00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:14,799 Speaker 1: that's a question that's tough to answer. But we we 638 00:40:14,920 --> 00:40:18,120 Speaker 1: do know that we do know that he has several 639 00:40:18,160 --> 00:40:23,040 Speaker 1: beliefs that would be considered controversial, not just not just 640 00:40:23,160 --> 00:40:26,880 Speaker 1: controversial amongst spiritual peers, which of course he and his 641 00:40:26,880 --> 00:40:30,440 Speaker 1: followers believe he has none, but not just in the 642 00:40:30,560 --> 00:40:33,480 Speaker 1: sphere of the spiritual, but in the secular sphere as well. 643 00:40:33,760 --> 00:40:37,000 Speaker 1: One of the big ones is suppressed technology, which, for 644 00:40:37,160 --> 00:40:39,319 Speaker 1: the record, I'm not that. I'm not going out of 645 00:40:39,320 --> 00:40:42,799 Speaker 1: my way to unfairly defends someone that I've never met. 646 00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:47,799 Speaker 1: We do know suppress technology exists. We just now we're 647 00:40:47,840 --> 00:40:52,080 Speaker 1: just as a species arguing about the degree of suppression. Yeah, 648 00:40:52,280 --> 00:40:58,600 Speaker 1: Inventino's mind, we're decades, if not centuries behind with the 649 00:40:58,600 --> 00:41:02,080 Speaker 1: the known technology to the average consumer. Let's let's read 650 00:41:02,120 --> 00:41:05,759 Speaker 1: a quote here. We have bases on the Moon, a 651 00:41:05,760 --> 00:41:08,480 Speaker 1: bunch of slave colonies on Mars that have been mining 652 00:41:08,520 --> 00:41:11,920 Speaker 1: the asteroid belt. We have been colonizing galaxies of our 653 00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:15,280 Speaker 1: solar system. We haven't needed fossil fuels for the last 654 00:41:15,320 --> 00:41:20,080 Speaker 1: eighty years because we have anti graphic mechanisms. The Nazis 655 00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:23,000 Speaker 1: won the war. The U. S. Government gave up their control, 656 00:41:23,080 --> 00:41:25,919 Speaker 1: their governance, so we would not be exposed to free 657 00:41:26,000 --> 00:41:29,600 Speaker 1: energy devices. If free energy gets released and we're working 658 00:41:29,640 --> 00:41:32,160 Speaker 1: on it, and he's referring to tri Infinity Corps, it 659 00:41:32,320 --> 00:41:37,080 Speaker 1: changes everything. We've had free energy for eighty in years. 660 00:41:37,719 --> 00:41:42,120 Speaker 1: That is a direct quote. Also, mis Sorrow absolutely believes 661 00:41:42,160 --> 00:41:46,279 Speaker 1: in aliens, by which we mean extraterrestrials. Another quote would be, 662 00:41:46,480 --> 00:41:48,799 Speaker 1: don't be surprised that the aliens will meet and we 663 00:41:48,880 --> 00:41:51,240 Speaker 1: will meet them. Look like the things you see in movies. 664 00:41:51,560 --> 00:41:55,440 Speaker 1: Don't be like, oh, this story of this guy's nonsense, 665 00:41:55,480 --> 00:41:57,560 Speaker 1: because I've seen that in the movies. He just got 666 00:41:57,600 --> 00:41:59,520 Speaker 1: it from the movies. Well did he get it from 667 00:41:59,520 --> 00:42:02,720 Speaker 1: the movie or did the movies get it from then? 668 00:42:03,120 --> 00:42:06,680 Speaker 1: And this ties into belief that we've we've touched on 669 00:42:06,760 --> 00:42:11,000 Speaker 1: in the past where you'll see people arguing that there 670 00:42:11,200 --> 00:42:15,320 Speaker 1: is a large and largely hidden movement in pop culture 671 00:42:15,719 --> 00:42:20,840 Speaker 1: to acclimatize the general public with the idea of extraterrestrials 672 00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:23,880 Speaker 1: by making them a familiar trope in fiction. But the 673 00:42:23,920 --> 00:42:26,880 Speaker 1: issue for for me here is there's no evidence. This 674 00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:30,400 Speaker 1: isn't evidence based claims at all. It's it's just stuff 675 00:42:30,480 --> 00:42:34,960 Speaker 1: that that he says, taking it face value. UM. And 676 00:42:35,120 --> 00:42:37,560 Speaker 1: you know it goes so far as to say things 677 00:42:37,560 --> 00:42:41,480 Speaker 1: we talked about those density levels UM. Apparently UM. He 678 00:42:41,600 --> 00:42:44,080 Speaker 1: and his followers and he also has a very close 679 00:42:44,120 --> 00:42:47,560 Speaker 1: team that he keeps around him. UM talk about folks 680 00:42:47,600 --> 00:42:52,680 Speaker 1: like Buddha and Jesus being sixth maybe seventh density UM. 681 00:42:52,680 --> 00:42:55,080 Speaker 1: And againists from the medium articles and that's the density 682 00:42:55,120 --> 00:42:57,719 Speaker 1: of unity. But didn't see of unity exactly, but that 683 00:42:57,840 --> 00:43:01,160 Speaker 1: Benteno is at a if he just blows all of 684 00:43:01,160 --> 00:43:03,680 Speaker 1: those other spiritual leaders out of the water, that's not 685 00:43:03,719 --> 00:43:08,160 Speaker 1: even on the thing. It is the new Coming, It's 686 00:43:08,239 --> 00:43:10,719 Speaker 1: it's him and that that's one of the one of 687 00:43:10,760 --> 00:43:16,080 Speaker 1: the errors that Massorrow points out about Jesus Christ is 688 00:43:16,120 --> 00:43:18,919 Speaker 1: that Jesus, he says, it is pretty much well and good, 689 00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:21,680 Speaker 1: did some good stuff. I think he called him a 690 00:43:21,680 --> 00:43:26,239 Speaker 1: fabulous person, but he claimed he was the son of 691 00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:30,520 Speaker 1: God and not a God. So it's a differentiation there. 692 00:43:30,600 --> 00:43:35,680 Speaker 1: And the density stuff that Tranfinity ascribes to as an 693 00:43:35,760 --> 00:43:39,000 Speaker 1: organization does have, you know, the one to seven deputies, 694 00:43:39,120 --> 00:43:43,839 Speaker 1: with the eighth density being, as Matt said, forthcoming. You're 695 00:43:43,840 --> 00:43:48,120 Speaker 1: probably wondering how far this goes, folks. There are claims 696 00:43:48,239 --> 00:43:52,200 Speaker 1: of extraordinary powers as well, and several of his videos 697 00:43:52,520 --> 00:43:56,080 Speaker 1: Massorrow claims have supernatural powers that have come easily to him, 698 00:43:56,800 --> 00:44:00,480 Speaker 1: but there are reasons why he doesn't use them all 699 00:44:00,520 --> 00:44:03,839 Speaker 1: the time. He says, it's not more important that I'm 700 00:44:03,880 --> 00:44:06,680 Speaker 1: able to teleport and by locate and levitate and move 701 00:44:06,760 --> 00:44:09,600 Speaker 1: mountains at will. That's not what's most important to me, 702 00:44:09,719 --> 00:44:12,640 Speaker 1: because my soul knows that's easy it's not hard at all, 703 00:44:12,760 --> 00:44:15,960 Speaker 1: It's absolutely easy. So one of these powers would be 704 00:44:16,239 --> 00:44:19,680 Speaker 1: weather controls. Several of his followers claim he has the 705 00:44:19,680 --> 00:44:23,960 Speaker 1: ability to control weather to a degree, specifically UH stories 706 00:44:23,960 --> 00:44:28,760 Speaker 1: about dispersing clouds before they cause UH inclement weather or storms, 707 00:44:28,840 --> 00:44:34,040 Speaker 1: similar to UM William Reich attempting to bust clouds with 708 00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:39,239 Speaker 1: wargo and energy, but without the mechanisms or the artifacts 709 00:44:39,280 --> 00:44:42,319 Speaker 1: that Reich built. Is a quote from one of his 710 00:44:42,360 --> 00:44:45,480 Speaker 1: followers that we found that says, I've watched him control 711 00:44:45,520 --> 00:44:47,040 Speaker 1: the weather a lot of times. We'll be at a 712 00:44:47,080 --> 00:44:50,160 Speaker 1: party and I'll be like Nino, these clouds are not good. 713 00:44:50,200 --> 00:44:52,480 Speaker 1: It looks like rain. Within ten minutes they're gone. He 714 00:44:52,480 --> 00:44:54,920 Speaker 1: does it all the time. I've watched him move objects 715 00:44:54,920 --> 00:44:59,120 Speaker 1: on tables. I've seen him multiple times change whether or 716 00:44:59,320 --> 00:45:03,000 Speaker 1: move cloud. Of course, it's telekinesis also in their the 717 00:45:03,080 --> 00:45:07,440 Speaker 1: ability to move objects, specifically at a table, without physically 718 00:45:07,520 --> 00:45:12,640 Speaker 1: touching them. Um, magicians and skeptics in the crowd, I 719 00:45:12,680 --> 00:45:17,520 Speaker 1: am sure that you know the numerous ways in which 720 00:45:17,680 --> 00:45:21,360 Speaker 1: people can create things that appear to be that effect. 721 00:45:21,800 --> 00:45:25,960 Speaker 1: I'm not saying that MS sorrow is purpose. Again, I'm 722 00:45:26,000 --> 00:45:30,920 Speaker 1: not saying massarrows purposely misleading people. But I'm saying between 723 00:45:32,160 --> 00:45:39,400 Speaker 1: between physical manipulation and between credulous observers, it's very possible 724 00:45:39,480 --> 00:45:42,400 Speaker 1: for somebody to mistake something kind of mundane for something 725 00:45:42,400 --> 00:45:45,240 Speaker 1: like telekinesis. I think the next two are really interesting 726 00:45:45,280 --> 00:45:50,120 Speaker 1: because they are attributes often ascribed in Catholic doctrine to 727 00:45:50,400 --> 00:45:54,879 Speaker 1: saints and religious figures. So we've got something called by 728 00:45:55,000 --> 00:45:59,279 Speaker 1: location um, and what that is is the supposed phenomenon 729 00:45:59,360 --> 00:46:01,640 Speaker 1: of an individual dual being able to be in two 730 00:46:01,680 --> 00:46:05,200 Speaker 1: physical locations at the same time. Um. You, it's kind 731 00:46:05,239 --> 00:46:06,799 Speaker 1: of this isn't exactly the same thing, but it's kind 732 00:46:06,800 --> 00:46:11,080 Speaker 1: of like in the Catholic eucharist Um the concept of transubstantiation, 733 00:46:11,200 --> 00:46:14,680 Speaker 1: where supposedly the bread and the wine that you take 734 00:46:14,760 --> 00:46:18,279 Speaker 1: of actually transforms physically into the flesh and blood of 735 00:46:18,360 --> 00:46:21,360 Speaker 1: Jesus Christ. But more specifically, a really interesting example of 736 00:46:21,400 --> 00:46:24,839 Speaker 1: this is from a man by the name of Padre Pio, 737 00:46:24,920 --> 00:46:28,120 Speaker 1: who lived from eighteen eighty seven to nineteen sixty eight, 738 00:46:28,280 --> 00:46:31,560 Speaker 1: was an Italian friar, a cup Pushian priest um. He 739 00:46:31,719 --> 00:46:36,359 Speaker 1: suffered from stigmata wounds, and he was ultimately made a 740 00:46:36,400 --> 00:46:39,080 Speaker 1: saint and was said to possess the power of by 741 00:46:39,160 --> 00:46:42,760 Speaker 1: location to tell his quick story UM as a seminary student, 742 00:46:42,840 --> 00:46:46,279 Speaker 1: he claims to have teleported during prayer to the home 743 00:46:46,400 --> 00:46:49,080 Speaker 1: of a wealthy couple, where he witnessed a woman giving 744 00:46:49,120 --> 00:46:52,760 Speaker 1: birth to a child, a daughter Um, all the while 745 00:46:52,840 --> 00:46:56,480 Speaker 1: her husband lay dying. He claims the virgin Mary appeared 746 00:46:56,520 --> 00:46:58,879 Speaker 1: to him, told him she was entrusting this newborn child 747 00:46:58,960 --> 00:47:01,040 Speaker 1: to him and that he should take care of her. 748 00:47:01,400 --> 00:47:04,040 Speaker 1: PO asked how he would know her, and was told 749 00:47:04,040 --> 00:47:07,480 Speaker 1: that she'd find him first and they'd meet in Rome. Um. 750 00:47:07,520 --> 00:47:10,719 Speaker 1: Then it said the mother saw him leaving the room. 751 00:47:10,760 --> 00:47:14,160 Speaker 1: So supposedly the daughter gave confession to Po seventeen years 752 00:47:14,239 --> 00:47:17,839 Speaker 1: later in St. Peter's Basilica in Rome, and that he 753 00:47:17,880 --> 00:47:21,120 Speaker 1: took her in and took care of her physically and spiritually. 754 00:47:21,320 --> 00:47:26,279 Speaker 1: A year later, seventeen year old girl. Often conflated with, 755 00:47:26,560 --> 00:47:30,319 Speaker 1: or closely related with, the concept of clara voyance, which 756 00:47:30,360 --> 00:47:34,480 Speaker 1: is not telling the future. It's realizing events that have 757 00:47:34,560 --> 00:47:38,759 Speaker 1: transpired in a way that would not normally be observable, 758 00:47:39,160 --> 00:47:42,000 Speaker 1: So it's sort of sending your mind or your awareness 759 00:47:42,040 --> 00:47:46,719 Speaker 1: to something. By location is different. By location is appearing right. 760 00:47:47,200 --> 00:47:51,080 Speaker 1: Either appearing in some sort of intangible but visible form 761 00:47:51,400 --> 00:47:57,279 Speaker 1: or appearing in a legitimate physical substance. So Massaris says 762 00:47:57,000 --> 00:48:00,680 Speaker 1: he can do this, but says it is not really 763 00:48:00,840 --> 00:48:04,840 Speaker 1: the point of his mission or his existence here on 764 00:48:04,920 --> 00:48:08,080 Speaker 1: this plane. He also says it's easy. It's so easy, 765 00:48:08,239 --> 00:48:11,320 Speaker 1: I could buy locate. Well, he doesn't. From his perspective, 766 00:48:11,360 --> 00:48:15,040 Speaker 1: he doesn't want it to distract from his actual calling, 767 00:48:15,239 --> 00:48:18,440 Speaker 1: sort of the same way that Anthony Hopkins doesn't want 768 00:48:19,080 --> 00:48:21,840 Speaker 1: you know, like Anthony Hopkins is acting and he's an 769 00:48:21,840 --> 00:48:24,520 Speaker 1: amazing actor, but his first love as piano, and that's 770 00:48:24,520 --> 00:48:27,120 Speaker 1: why he feels like he's here on earth. Massaro actually 771 00:48:27,120 --> 00:48:31,000 Speaker 1: claims to be purposely blocking these abilities because they are 772 00:48:31,040 --> 00:48:33,160 Speaker 1: not what he wants to be known for. And his 773 00:48:33,239 --> 00:48:36,319 Speaker 1: followers often say that, like with that quote, that they 774 00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:38,400 Speaker 1: have seen him do some of these I'm gonna call 775 00:48:38,440 --> 00:48:41,840 Speaker 1: him miracles, um, but never does he offer to demonstrate 776 00:48:41,840 --> 00:48:44,600 Speaker 1: them in any of his dozens and dozens of YouTube videos. Well, 777 00:48:44,640 --> 00:48:47,880 Speaker 1: you know, if they're really on that plan to buy 778 00:48:47,920 --> 00:48:51,440 Speaker 1: five have lightened society, what's going to have to happen 779 00:48:51,520 --> 00:48:54,040 Speaker 1: is Ventino is going to have to teleport, which is 780 00:48:54,080 --> 00:48:55,960 Speaker 1: the next thing we're gonna talk about in one of 781 00:48:56,000 --> 00:48:59,520 Speaker 1: his YouTube videos somehow or in public somewhere where people 782 00:48:59,560 --> 00:49:02,720 Speaker 1: have cameras on him, and then that's when he starts 783 00:49:02,719 --> 00:49:07,920 Speaker 1: getting three million followers, four million followers, then he can 784 00:49:07,960 --> 00:49:10,680 Speaker 1: really start changing society. So at this point, what we 785 00:49:10,760 --> 00:49:15,040 Speaker 1: have described are the aims of the organization, a brief 786 00:49:15,080 --> 00:49:17,960 Speaker 1: description of Massar himself, and we didn't We didn't talk 787 00:49:17,960 --> 00:49:20,319 Speaker 1: about his childhood. We didn't talk about some of the 788 00:49:20,400 --> 00:49:24,000 Speaker 1: criticisms of his personality that you could you could read 789 00:49:24,040 --> 00:49:26,080 Speaker 1: at length, and please, you know, read them with a 790 00:49:26,080 --> 00:49:29,920 Speaker 1: grain of salt, because we have to winner with the motivations. 791 00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:33,480 Speaker 1: The people might be sure that's that's being fair, but 792 00:49:33,560 --> 00:49:37,440 Speaker 1: we do know that former core staff members have talked 793 00:49:37,440 --> 00:49:40,960 Speaker 1: about darker sides of this. One said, I feel he 794 00:49:41,000 --> 00:49:44,200 Speaker 1: is setting people up for mass suicide. He talked about 795 00:49:44,280 --> 00:49:48,480 Speaker 1: the harvest. I always had a weird feeling about this, 796 00:49:48,760 --> 00:49:55,200 Speaker 1: And on the Somber nine, I want to say twenty seventeen, 797 00:49:55,880 --> 00:50:01,360 Speaker 1: one of Massarrow's longtime devoted students, a fellow named Brent Wilkins, 798 00:50:01,680 --> 00:50:05,720 Speaker 1: committed suicide by jumping off a cliff near the Midley 799 00:50:05,880 --> 00:50:09,000 Speaker 1: Bridge in Sedona, Arizona. And you can see news stories 800 00:50:09,040 --> 00:50:12,120 Speaker 1: about it. You can see some I don't know, some 801 00:50:12,560 --> 00:50:19,080 Speaker 1: different media mentions. But the thing is that for people 802 00:50:19,080 --> 00:50:22,440 Speaker 1: who opponents of this guy or this this movement, this 803 00:50:22,600 --> 00:50:27,440 Speaker 1: budding movement, this is taken to be a sign that 804 00:50:27,600 --> 00:50:31,360 Speaker 1: something is woefully rotten in the town of Sedona. However, 805 00:50:32,440 --> 00:50:36,880 Speaker 1: to be fair, it is, you know, it's it's difficult 806 00:50:36,920 --> 00:50:40,799 Speaker 1: to ascribe the exact cause for that suicide without more information. 807 00:50:40,880 --> 00:50:43,919 Speaker 1: Every suicide is a tragedy, and it may be that 808 00:50:44,120 --> 00:50:48,279 Speaker 1: Mr Wilkins was troubled for other reasons unrelated to his 809 00:50:48,400 --> 00:50:52,000 Speaker 1: involvement in the movement. But the reason this thing becomes 810 00:50:52,000 --> 00:50:57,880 Speaker 1: disturbing to people, whether they consider themselves neutral observers or 811 00:50:57,920 --> 00:51:04,680 Speaker 1: whether they consider themselves already prejudiced observers. The troubling thing 812 00:51:04,760 --> 00:51:08,600 Speaker 1: with this is that if is that we have seen 813 00:51:08,680 --> 00:51:13,520 Speaker 1: presidents before in the United States. The United States is 814 00:51:14,640 --> 00:51:19,720 Speaker 1: a hotbed of movements that, for one reason or another 815 00:51:20,360 --> 00:51:25,080 Speaker 1: got sour. I personally do not think it is fair, 816 00:51:25,200 --> 00:51:29,840 Speaker 1: nor do I think it is productive to call a 817 00:51:30,000 --> 00:51:33,520 Speaker 1: leader of a YouTube movement a new Jim Jones or 818 00:51:33,640 --> 00:51:36,640 Speaker 1: new David Koresh or new Charles Manson, because at this point, 819 00:51:36,680 --> 00:51:42,480 Speaker 1: thank god, no one has been murdered, right, But we 820 00:51:42,560 --> 00:51:44,960 Speaker 1: would be remiss if we did not mention that that 821 00:51:45,080 --> 00:51:48,839 Speaker 1: suicide occurred. And we would also be remiss if we 822 00:51:49,080 --> 00:51:52,640 Speaker 1: did mention this harvest concept And what what is it? 823 00:51:52,719 --> 00:51:57,040 Speaker 1: Is it a is it supposed to be a massive 824 00:51:57,080 --> 00:52:02,319 Speaker 1: spiritual awakening and ascension of the group. Yeah, it's weird 825 00:52:02,360 --> 00:52:05,960 Speaker 1: when you when you put whatever concept the harvest is 826 00:52:06,120 --> 00:52:09,399 Speaker 1: and you winded up with that enlightened society by goal, 827 00:52:09,880 --> 00:52:11,960 Speaker 1: like what is that? What is that? What the harvest 828 00:52:12,080 --> 00:52:16,880 Speaker 1: is like by harvesting all of the egos maybe so 829 00:52:16,920 --> 00:52:19,240 Speaker 1: that we're all enlightened. Maybe that's what he's talking about, 830 00:52:19,320 --> 00:52:21,640 Speaker 1: but that's just me thinking on the top of my head. 831 00:52:21,760 --> 00:52:24,000 Speaker 1: He did post on his Instagram page and exert from 832 00:52:24,000 --> 00:52:27,040 Speaker 1: a book about a yogi by the name of Sara 833 00:52:27,120 --> 00:52:30,440 Speaker 1: dama Um and in it it says, whatever the guru 834 00:52:30,520 --> 00:52:32,680 Speaker 1: does is correct. The guru is the self and he 835 00:52:32,719 --> 00:52:35,360 Speaker 1: cannot do wrong, even though his actions may well appear 836 00:52:35,400 --> 00:52:37,399 Speaker 1: to be wrong in the side of the world. If 837 00:52:37,400 --> 00:52:40,160 Speaker 1: it devotee sees the guru's actions is bad and thinks 838 00:52:40,239 --> 00:52:43,560 Speaker 1: badly of the Guru, bad power will come to the devotee. 839 00:52:43,840 --> 00:52:45,960 Speaker 1: If you think that whatever the guru does is correct, 840 00:52:46,239 --> 00:52:49,840 Speaker 1: then good power will come. So this is almost Nietzschean 841 00:52:49,960 --> 00:52:54,080 Speaker 1: and it's beyond good and evil idea. There's also there's 842 00:52:54,120 --> 00:52:57,240 Speaker 1: there's also a quote from an ex member named Gabby Petris, 843 00:52:57,280 --> 00:52:59,759 Speaker 1: who is able to go on record or with their name. 844 00:53:00,600 --> 00:53:03,640 Speaker 1: According to Petris, Massora predicts planet Earth is at the 845 00:53:03,640 --> 00:53:07,440 Speaker 1: crossroads of splitting into two planes of existence, high vibration 846 00:53:07,440 --> 00:53:11,040 Speaker 1: and fourth dimensional beings who embodied love, as do his students, 847 00:53:11,360 --> 00:53:15,520 Speaker 1: will ascend to a less physical realm featuring telepathic group consciousness, 848 00:53:16,040 --> 00:53:20,200 Speaker 1: low vibration, third dimensional beings that's you, me and Paul. 849 00:53:20,520 --> 00:53:24,799 Speaker 1: Now the massive cloud load vibration third dimensional beings who 850 00:53:24,840 --> 00:53:28,600 Speaker 1: embodied negativity are on a quote ship going down. So 851 00:53:29,160 --> 00:53:33,799 Speaker 1: there's nothing specific or physical here, right, I think that's 852 00:53:33,920 --> 00:53:41,240 Speaker 1: very important. There's no prediction of an imminent physical apocalyptic events. However, 853 00:53:41,719 --> 00:53:46,560 Speaker 1: for people who again are reading into this, there seems 854 00:53:46,640 --> 00:53:50,400 Speaker 1: to be a dark disturbance. And this is so new 855 00:53:50,960 --> 00:53:56,799 Speaker 1: that we you know, we're we're reporting on something that 856 00:53:56,920 --> 00:53:59,480 Speaker 1: is happening now. It's quite possible that it changes in 857 00:53:59,520 --> 00:54:02,839 Speaker 1: the future and we have to update it. For me, though, 858 00:54:02,880 --> 00:54:06,360 Speaker 1: the thing that's that's striking about this this guy is. 859 00:54:06,440 --> 00:54:10,719 Speaker 1: You know, when you think of a true guru or 860 00:54:10,760 --> 00:54:15,200 Speaker 1: a true leader, often they isshoe material things. But if 861 00:54:15,200 --> 00:54:18,520 Speaker 1: you check out this guy's Instagram, he is a big 862 00:54:18,560 --> 00:54:22,320 Speaker 1: time all about material things. He has you know, rented 863 00:54:22,600 --> 00:54:27,719 Speaker 1: million dollar mansions, and is you know, constantly taking selfies, 864 00:54:27,800 --> 00:54:32,319 Speaker 1: smoking fine cigars and posing shirtless in the mirror. I mean, 865 00:54:32,320 --> 00:54:35,560 Speaker 1: he is clearly quite into himself, and not to say 866 00:54:35,560 --> 00:54:37,239 Speaker 1: there's anything wrong with that, and in fact, part of 867 00:54:37,280 --> 00:54:39,719 Speaker 1: his rhetoric is that that is okay, and that that's 868 00:54:39,719 --> 00:54:41,680 Speaker 1: a part of it. You are a god, you know, 869 00:54:41,840 --> 00:54:45,960 Speaker 1: you are the best version of yourself. You should be 870 00:54:46,200 --> 00:54:49,680 Speaker 1: this kind of hedonism the idea of sort of pursuing 871 00:54:49,760 --> 00:54:52,719 Speaker 1: your bliss, I guess, but it doesn't quite jive with 872 00:54:52,880 --> 00:54:58,120 Speaker 1: his you know, sort of self actualization kind of. But 873 00:54:58,680 --> 00:55:02,759 Speaker 1: it actually, actually it gives perfectly. And I'll tell you why. 874 00:55:02,800 --> 00:55:06,320 Speaker 1: There's a video on their on the Trnfinity page called 875 00:55:06,719 --> 00:55:10,759 Speaker 1: Meet Bentino mas Sorrow, a Spiritual Teacher for the Next Generation. 876 00:55:11,480 --> 00:55:14,080 Speaker 1: Here is a quote from that video and it's Bentino 877 00:55:14,200 --> 00:55:17,880 Speaker 1: talking after after it has him like a set up 878 00:55:17,920 --> 00:55:20,560 Speaker 1: to the video. Then it has a long montage of 879 00:55:20,600 --> 00:55:23,920 Speaker 1: like uh a dance party, rave kind of thing in 880 00:55:23,960 --> 00:55:26,200 Speaker 1: the middle of wherever it is that they're having this 881 00:55:26,320 --> 00:55:29,480 Speaker 1: talk along like slow motion dance party. Then it cuts 882 00:55:29,480 --> 00:55:34,160 Speaker 1: back to Bentino and he says this technically, feeling good 883 00:55:34,200 --> 00:55:37,040 Speaker 1: is your only job because when you feel good, literally 884 00:55:37,160 --> 00:55:40,160 Speaker 1: everything else takes care of itself. Now, this doesn't mean 885 00:55:40,160 --> 00:55:42,920 Speaker 1: that we don't take action, we don't act on our visions. 886 00:55:43,200 --> 00:55:46,160 Speaker 1: It simply means that without feeling good first, you're not 887 00:55:46,200 --> 00:55:49,480 Speaker 1: even in the same wave wavelength as inspiration. You cannot 888 00:55:49,520 --> 00:55:53,200 Speaker 1: get access to thoughts that offer solutions instead of problems, 889 00:55:53,480 --> 00:55:56,320 Speaker 1: joy instead of depression. So in order to be in 890 00:55:56,400 --> 00:55:59,440 Speaker 1: the proper state, all you have to do is be 891 00:55:59,560 --> 00:56:04,279 Speaker 1: in the moment, tune into yourself, and ask yourself intuitively, 892 00:56:05,040 --> 00:56:07,800 Speaker 1: what is the most exciting thing I could be thinking 893 00:56:07,840 --> 00:56:11,680 Speaker 1: of or doing right now? So I think for me, 894 00:56:11,800 --> 00:56:15,959 Speaker 1: that's that purposely perfectly embodies smoking a fine cigar, hanging 895 00:56:15,960 --> 00:56:17,960 Speaker 1: out in a mansion using the money that I got 896 00:56:18,000 --> 00:56:21,120 Speaker 1: from these donations, I'm doing what's making me happy right now. 897 00:56:21,200 --> 00:56:24,239 Speaker 1: And yet he pushes fasting on his followers, where he 898 00:56:24,360 --> 00:56:26,880 Speaker 1: says they can only drink grape juice and it shouldn't 899 00:56:26,880 --> 00:56:29,000 Speaker 1: need any food or water. It just it just kind 900 00:56:29,000 --> 00:56:31,080 Speaker 1: of feels like the rules don't apply to him. That's 901 00:56:31,080 --> 00:56:32,960 Speaker 1: all I'm saying. It's really important that I put this 902 00:56:33,040 --> 00:56:36,600 Speaker 1: in here, because gosh, those folks, as you're listening, you're 903 00:56:36,600 --> 00:56:39,480 Speaker 1: wondering why one of us doesn't say this. This is 904 00:56:39,600 --> 00:56:42,759 Speaker 1: spot on with l Ron Hubbard, a k a. The 905 00:56:42,840 --> 00:56:47,920 Speaker 1: commodore in scientology. This is spot on with the pigs 906 00:56:48,000 --> 00:56:52,879 Speaker 1: in animal farm. There is a very it's very there 907 00:56:52,960 --> 00:56:58,080 Speaker 1: is any convenience of equality, equality for me because I 908 00:56:58,120 --> 00:57:00,359 Speaker 1: get it, because I'm in on it. That's why I'm 909 00:57:00,360 --> 00:57:03,359 Speaker 1: in charge, right. And the people who are in the 910 00:57:03,440 --> 00:57:08,520 Speaker 1: fasting programs are not experiencing this kind of joy. What 911 00:57:08,560 --> 00:57:12,960 Speaker 1: they're experiencing our chronic health problems. Their teeth are falling out, 912 00:57:13,120 --> 00:57:16,040 Speaker 1: their hair is falling out. And this is similar to 913 00:57:16,280 --> 00:57:20,800 Speaker 1: things you'll hear like the Scientology's infamous niae in treatments. Yeah, 914 00:57:20,880 --> 00:57:26,120 Speaker 1: or the whole or the whole. Right, So we we 915 00:57:26,240 --> 00:57:29,000 Speaker 1: want to be I want to be as fair as 916 00:57:29,080 --> 00:57:32,280 Speaker 1: possible with this, but that is that is paradoxical, and 917 00:57:32,320 --> 00:57:34,480 Speaker 1: it does stick out and paradoxical as a word that 918 00:57:34,560 --> 00:57:39,720 Speaker 1: Mussorrow uses in his own defense because as we mentioned earlier, 919 00:57:39,720 --> 00:57:43,960 Speaker 1: at the top of the show. We we felt it 920 00:57:44,160 --> 00:57:49,880 Speaker 1: necessary to give you a couple of excerpts from Trinfiniti's 921 00:57:50,160 --> 00:57:54,400 Speaker 1: reply to this article. The blog post was called our 922 00:57:54,480 --> 00:57:58,040 Speaker 1: first official response to the cult accusations quote. At some 923 00:57:58,120 --> 00:58:00,760 Speaker 1: point something like this was gonna rise. It always does 924 00:58:00,840 --> 00:58:03,840 Speaker 1: for people in my community. I encourage you to exhibit 925 00:58:03,840 --> 00:58:07,080 Speaker 1: no anger or judgment towards the author. That's nice. You 926 00:58:07,080 --> 00:58:09,560 Speaker 1: could pick the most saintly figures in history, and if 927 00:58:09,560 --> 00:58:11,880 Speaker 1: you really wanted to, you could pick them apart and 928 00:58:11,920 --> 00:58:14,800 Speaker 1: reassemble them to meet any agenda you may have in 929 00:58:14,880 --> 00:58:17,760 Speaker 1: how you wish to think of them. There's an important 930 00:58:17,760 --> 00:58:19,640 Speaker 1: part there too, where they say the author of this 931 00:58:19,800 --> 00:58:22,800 Speaker 1: article was out to create a false sensationalist peace, and 932 00:58:22,880 --> 00:58:28,040 Speaker 1: my transparency and paradoxical but innocent expressions over the years 933 00:58:28,120 --> 00:58:31,439 Speaker 1: made this an easy picture for her to paint. It says, 934 00:58:31,600 --> 00:58:33,560 Speaker 1: I am not an abuser, and I am not out 935 00:58:33,600 --> 00:58:37,040 Speaker 1: to gain power over others. But decide for yourself if 936 00:58:37,040 --> 00:58:38,600 Speaker 1: I have any upset over this. It is for the 937 00:58:38,640 --> 00:58:41,120 Speaker 1: people who have put in tremendous effort and commitment to 938 00:58:41,160 --> 00:58:44,080 Speaker 1: applying the work and elevating their lives and are now 939 00:58:44,160 --> 00:58:46,680 Speaker 1: left represented as people who have no ability to discern 940 00:58:46,720 --> 00:58:49,240 Speaker 1: and are lost in their following of me. And then 941 00:58:49,280 --> 00:58:51,320 Speaker 1: he goes on to say that calling it a cult 942 00:58:51,480 --> 00:58:54,240 Speaker 1: is quite an assertion to make and honors no one. Uh. 943 00:58:54,240 --> 00:58:57,000 Speaker 1: There is ever so much more to an entity than 944 00:58:57,120 --> 00:58:59,880 Speaker 1: meets the eye. This is part of the message I 945 00:59:00,040 --> 00:59:03,440 Speaker 1: is to embody through my occasionally paradoxical appearances. Never judge 946 00:59:03,440 --> 00:59:07,440 Speaker 1: the surface of any situation, person or motivation. In fact, 947 00:59:07,520 --> 00:59:10,720 Speaker 1: never judge at all. See beyond the surface and be free, 948 00:59:11,400 --> 00:59:13,400 Speaker 1: be love. And I do want to say too that 949 00:59:13,480 --> 00:59:17,560 Speaker 1: in UM the SoundCloud page from that girl that you 950 00:59:17,600 --> 00:59:21,400 Speaker 1: can find UM, there's an interview with one of the 951 00:59:21,440 --> 00:59:25,240 Speaker 1: followers and the person very casually asks how they feel 952 00:59:25,240 --> 00:59:28,600 Speaker 1: about being referred to as a cult, and the person says, well, 953 00:59:28,920 --> 00:59:32,439 Speaker 1: it's a cult. That's a cult I want to be in. Yah. 954 00:59:32,760 --> 00:59:36,040 Speaker 1: You know there's that there's a lot of positivity that 955 00:59:36,080 --> 00:59:38,840 Speaker 1: you will see at least again, I'm not I'm trying 956 00:59:38,880 --> 00:59:40,760 Speaker 1: not to judge them on the surface, but on the 957 00:59:40,800 --> 00:59:44,280 Speaker 1: surface there seems to be a ton of positivity and 958 00:59:44,400 --> 00:59:47,400 Speaker 1: things that you would want to take away that feel good. 959 00:59:47,440 --> 00:59:50,120 Speaker 1: Like that when we were talking about you know, uh, 960 00:59:50,240 --> 00:59:53,520 Speaker 1: find joy and pursue joy and everything else is going 961 00:59:53,560 --> 00:59:57,040 Speaker 1: to fall into place. That sounds great, Yeah, but what 962 00:59:57,240 --> 00:59:59,880 Speaker 1: how do we define joy? A great deal of you 963 01:00:00,040 --> 01:00:03,360 Speaker 1: and tragedy is people selfishly pursuing something that brings joy 964 01:00:03,440 --> 01:00:07,360 Speaker 1: to them at the expense and the physical emotional danger 965 01:00:07,840 --> 01:00:11,480 Speaker 1: of others. People are selfish dicks, It's true. And this 966 01:00:11,560 --> 01:00:14,000 Speaker 1: leads us to some questions. Is it's a shame. There's 967 01:00:14,000 --> 01:00:15,880 Speaker 1: a lot of stuff we didn't get to today, folks, 968 01:00:16,360 --> 01:00:19,040 Speaker 1: but we're running a little long, so we may have 969 01:00:19,080 --> 01:00:21,640 Speaker 1: to come back for an update. As we said this, 970 01:00:21,640 --> 01:00:25,480 Speaker 1: this is developing. We hope that we have fairly represented 971 01:00:25,520 --> 01:00:30,600 Speaker 1: both the concerns and the claims in here. So as 972 01:00:30,680 --> 01:00:33,120 Speaker 1: Matt said, not to judge at the surface, but these 973 01:00:33,120 --> 01:00:39,880 Speaker 1: things sound inspiring, hopeful, and even attainable. And Matt, you, uh, 974 01:00:40,080 --> 01:00:41,920 Speaker 1: you dropped the quote here in their notes that I 975 01:00:42,000 --> 01:00:44,960 Speaker 1: want to give you the honor of Oh yeah. Well, basically, 976 01:00:44,960 --> 01:00:46,919 Speaker 1: what he's saying is let your passion guide you follow 977 01:00:46,960 --> 01:00:50,600 Speaker 1: your dreams, right. Uh. For some people, it means I'll 978 01:00:50,640 --> 01:00:53,080 Speaker 1: finally make that podcast about badger bags that I've been 979 01:00:53,120 --> 01:00:55,240 Speaker 1: talking about for the last two years. For others, it 980 01:00:55,280 --> 01:00:58,240 Speaker 1: means I will become the next top chef. I feel 981 01:00:58,280 --> 01:01:00,400 Speaker 1: like it you took an indirect shot at me there, 982 01:01:00,440 --> 01:01:04,360 Speaker 1: buddy the Badger Bags podcast. It's coming man, And I 983 01:01:04,400 --> 01:01:06,320 Speaker 1: think you can follow your passion one day and you're 984 01:01:06,320 --> 01:01:08,640 Speaker 1: gonna be able to do it. I believe both of you, 985 01:01:08,680 --> 01:01:11,320 Speaker 1: even you and your current gaseous state. Oh thank you 986 01:01:11,400 --> 01:01:13,680 Speaker 1: so much. But but the question I wanted to leave 987 01:01:13,720 --> 01:01:17,240 Speaker 1: here is with these kinds of teachings, they are very 988 01:01:17,240 --> 01:01:21,280 Speaker 1: positive for somebody who has an aspiration that is positive 989 01:01:21,320 --> 01:01:23,280 Speaker 1: for other people or even for themselves, but it's not 990 01:01:23,280 --> 01:01:26,720 Speaker 1: gonna harm anybody else. What if somebody's joy that they're 991 01:01:26,760 --> 01:01:28,840 Speaker 1: really following kind of the point that Ben made earlier, 992 01:01:29,560 --> 01:01:32,440 Speaker 1: What if their joy is harming other people? What if 993 01:01:32,440 --> 01:01:35,320 Speaker 1: they're the most exciting thing they could be doing right 994 01:01:35,360 --> 01:01:39,280 Speaker 1: now is a brutal crime. Have you guys heard of 995 01:01:39,400 --> 01:01:44,600 Speaker 1: McCamy manner no M A N O R Right. Yeah. 996 01:01:44,760 --> 01:01:47,520 Speaker 1: It's like an extreme haunted house that was in San 997 01:01:47,520 --> 01:01:50,240 Speaker 1: Diego for a long time where they like kidnap you 998 01:01:50,360 --> 01:01:54,160 Speaker 1: and and you and shave your head and force feeds 999 01:01:54,160 --> 01:01:56,680 Speaker 1: you horrible things. This is a really extreme example. But 1000 01:01:56,720 --> 01:01:59,280 Speaker 1: the guy that runs it, his last name is McCamy 1001 01:01:59,600 --> 01:02:03,240 Speaker 1: um he videos everything. Everyone that comes in there, they 1002 01:02:03,240 --> 01:02:07,800 Speaker 1: all come in there willingly waiver that that totally signs 1003 01:02:07,800 --> 01:02:10,400 Speaker 1: away all their rights to sue. There's no safe word. 1004 01:02:10,720 --> 01:02:13,720 Speaker 1: You're in there until he's done with you, and he's 1005 01:02:13,800 --> 01:02:16,200 Speaker 1: up in your face the whole time, you know, getting 1006 01:02:16,200 --> 01:02:19,040 Speaker 1: footage of you being brutalized and tortured. And some people 1007 01:02:19,080 --> 01:02:20,960 Speaker 1: sign up and come back and do it again. I'm 1008 01:02:21,000 --> 01:02:22,560 Speaker 1: not saying that its directly with This is Life, but 1009 01:02:22,560 --> 01:02:26,360 Speaker 1: it's sort of an extreme example that I think warrants 1010 01:02:26,360 --> 01:02:30,840 Speaker 1: comparison because, like you're saying, if people will willingly submit 1011 01:02:30,920 --> 01:02:33,960 Speaker 1: to something that is not ultimately good for them, right, 1012 01:02:34,880 --> 01:02:39,680 Speaker 1: and especially given the promise of uh, something new, you know, 1013 01:02:39,800 --> 01:02:44,280 Speaker 1: something different, something beyond, something beyond understandable, like the same 1014 01:02:44,280 --> 01:02:50,280 Speaker 1: reason people open the Limma Hunt configuration in hell Raiser exactly. 1015 01:02:50,360 --> 01:02:54,919 Speaker 1: Pushing yourself as far as possible, whether spiritually or physically. Yeah, 1016 01:02:55,080 --> 01:02:59,400 Speaker 1: quite possibly. I mean we know that for many people, 1017 01:03:01,400 --> 01:03:05,720 Speaker 1: many for many people, joy emotions in general are complex, 1018 01:03:05,840 --> 01:03:12,240 Speaker 1: often difficult to discern things. We have questions for you 1019 01:03:12,400 --> 01:03:14,640 Speaker 1: as well. We'd like to hear from you. Do you 1020 01:03:14,760 --> 01:03:19,360 Speaker 1: think what's your take on these sorts of movements and 1021 01:03:19,400 --> 01:03:23,720 Speaker 1: how they exist in the digital age? Are they harmless? 1022 01:03:23,760 --> 01:03:26,520 Speaker 1: New iteration of some tale as old as time? To 1023 01:03:26,800 --> 01:03:29,280 Speaker 1: steal the line from Beauty and the Beast. Is there's 1024 01:03:29,320 --> 01:03:34,280 Speaker 1: something new that's fundamentally changing them? And if so, how 1025 01:03:34,400 --> 01:03:36,040 Speaker 1: is it for the better? Is it for the worst? 1026 01:03:36,440 --> 01:03:40,280 Speaker 1: Is it dangerous? Do you consider this movement and things 1027 01:03:40,360 --> 01:03:44,400 Speaker 1: like it a cult as our author bestco Field clearly does, 1028 01:03:44,800 --> 01:03:47,120 Speaker 1: and this one I really want to know. Do you 1029 01:03:47,160 --> 01:03:51,160 Speaker 1: have any other examples for us? And also have you 1030 01:03:51,240 --> 01:03:54,600 Speaker 1: been to Mussarrow Retreat or maybe been to a talk 1031 01:03:55,200 --> 01:03:57,480 Speaker 1: or you know, and you feel like you've come out 1032 01:03:57,520 --> 01:04:01,200 Speaker 1: with something positive? And Europe? Hey with everything? Is the 1033 01:04:01,240 --> 01:04:04,880 Speaker 1: author being unfair? Yeah? Are we being unfair? Let us 1034 01:04:04,880 --> 01:04:08,320 Speaker 1: know righte to us on social media. We've got conspiracy 1035 01:04:08,400 --> 01:04:13,360 Speaker 1: stuff on Facebook and Twitter, conspiracy stuff show on Instagram, 1036 01:04:13,400 --> 01:04:15,000 Speaker 1: and um, if you don't want to do any of 1037 01:04:15,000 --> 01:04:17,200 Speaker 1: that stuff, just write to us the old fashioned way 1038 01:04:17,360 --> 01:04:21,200 Speaker 1: through an email. We are conspiracy at how stuff works 1039 01:04:21,320 --> 01:04:41,680 Speaker 1: dot com.