WEBVTT - Sturgill Simpson 0:00:08.320 --> 0:00:17.640 Pushkin. Kentucky singer songwriter Sturgil Simpson is used to doing 0:00:17.680 --> 0:00:21.000 what he wants one he wants, at least until contracting 0:00:21.000 --> 0:00:24.600 COVID in early March sidelined him. After a rough month 0:00:24.720 --> 0:00:27.680 long battle with the virus, Sturgil was itching to get 0:00:27.720 --> 0:00:30.760 back into the studio, so in October he released a 0:00:30.800 --> 0:00:35.520 surprise bluegrass album that masterfully reworks his back catalog, called 0:00:35.800 --> 0:00:39.159 Cut and Grass Volume One. Sturgel was in his mid 0:00:39.240 --> 0:00:41.880 thirties when he found fame as a country artist in Nashville. 0:00:42.440 --> 0:00:45.160 He had already lived at full life, including the stint 0:00:45.159 --> 0:00:47.599 in the Navy and years spent working in Salt Lake 0:00:47.680 --> 0:00:51.839 City rail yards. His outsider status in Nashville only boosted 0:00:51.840 --> 0:00:55.520 his outlaw peel, but as time passed, Sturgil began to 0:00:55.560 --> 0:00:59.360 despise the relentless expectations of the major label system. So 0:00:59.480 --> 0:01:03.120 in true fashion, Sturgil has now taken back control of 0:01:03.160 --> 0:01:07.240 his career and returned to his independent roots. In this 0:01:07.319 --> 0:01:10.639 interview with Rick Rubin, Sturgel explains why is bluegrass album 0:01:10.880 --> 0:01:13.839 is the purest expression of his work, why it bothers 0:01:13.920 --> 0:01:16.240 him that people often overlook the stories and the songs, 0:01:16.600 --> 0:01:19.240 and why being classified as a country star has been 0:01:19.280 --> 0:01:26.360 perhaps the biggest detriment to his career. This is broken 0:01:26.360 --> 0:01:29.760 record liner notes for the digital age. I'm justin Richmondon. 0:01:34.520 --> 0:01:38.320 Here's Rick Rubin and Sturgill Simpson. What's happening in Maine? 0:01:38.720 --> 0:01:42.640 Oh no much man. Sunday morning is a donut day 0:01:42.880 --> 0:01:45.600 around these parts. So for the kids, So let's my 0:01:45.880 --> 0:01:48.080 daddy's day to get up early and go handle breakfast 0:01:48.120 --> 0:01:51.680 and all that from is donuts only on Sundays. Oh yeah, 0:01:51.720 --> 0:01:53.520 only on Sundays and only for the kids. I don't 0:01:53.560 --> 0:01:56.760 I don't touch those shit. So what's your what's your diet? Like? Overall? 0:01:57.240 --> 0:01:59.720 Mostly I just try to monitor blood pressure. Ever since 0:01:59.760 --> 0:02:02.040 the it's nothing that's gonna like cause a lot of 0:02:02.080 --> 0:02:05.080 cholesterol and things like that. Blood pressure or blood oxygen. 0:02:05.800 --> 0:02:10.640 Blood pressure? Really, how did COVID affect your blood pressure? Uh? 0:02:11.200 --> 0:02:14.440 The early onset, everything was just insanely high. When I 0:02:14.440 --> 0:02:18.560 went to the hospital. My initial reading when I checked 0:02:18.560 --> 0:02:20.480 into that R was like one eighty seven over one 0:02:20.680 --> 0:02:23.440 sixty four, about to stroke out like an old man. 0:02:23.560 --> 0:02:26.200 So is that a normal COVID? I hadn't heard that 0:02:26.240 --> 0:02:30.720 one before, you know, I'm not sure. I Honestly, I 0:02:30.760 --> 0:02:32.840 was pretty obsessive about it for a couple of months 0:02:32.840 --> 0:02:34.320 after I had it, and then now I feel like 0:02:34.360 --> 0:02:37.520 I have superpowers, but so I've gotten kind of lazy. 0:02:37.520 --> 0:02:39.760 I don't know where the preliminary studies are coming out, 0:02:39.880 --> 0:02:42.160 but I mean, septems are sort of all over the place. 0:02:42.480 --> 0:02:44.400 For me, it was just this really intense frontal lobe 0:02:44.400 --> 0:02:48.360 headache and some severe chest tightness, which is what led 0:02:48.360 --> 0:02:51.000 me to have her take me in. Yeah, did you 0:02:51.160 --> 0:02:54.760 did you know people who had it before you had it? No? Man. 0:02:54.880 --> 0:02:57.240 We we played the last show of our tour on 0:02:57.360 --> 0:03:02.080 March tenth and Charleston, South Carolina, and it was only 0:03:02.200 --> 0:03:06.799 that day that there was any type of mainstream media awareness, 0:03:06.880 --> 0:03:09.440 where like when all the panic buttons started going off 0:03:09.440 --> 0:03:11.000 and we were all just sort of like, WHOA, there's 0:03:11.040 --> 0:03:13.440 a lot of people back here, you know. So the 0:03:13.560 --> 0:03:16.000 next day we had off. We're supposed to be heading 0:03:16.040 --> 0:03:18.720 to I think Virginia or Philly for some shows that weekend, 0:03:19.560 --> 0:03:21.760 and my wife and I were still in Charleston. I 0:03:21.800 --> 0:03:23.440 was just like, man, I don't feel right, Like I 0:03:23.480 --> 0:03:26.079 was just physically just I don't know how to even 0:03:26.120 --> 0:03:29.799 describe it. Man, it was so the most intense fatigue 0:03:29.840 --> 0:03:33.080 I felt in a long time. And you know this job, 0:03:33.320 --> 0:03:36.440 if there's one thing that you become accustomed to, it's fatigue. 0:03:36.440 --> 0:03:39.400 But this was something different. So and then that that 0:03:39.520 --> 0:03:41.000 day I just told her. I was like, I don't think. 0:03:41.160 --> 0:03:42.840 I think I need to go home and rest, like 0:03:42.920 --> 0:03:48.160 something's not right. I can't breathe, and all the inner 0:03:49.120 --> 0:03:51.520 voices like I probably got this shit in Europe, like 0:03:51.600 --> 0:03:54.040 here we go. And then the next morning I was 0:03:54.040 --> 0:03:56.720 in the hospital, so wow, and how long we in 0:03:56.720 --> 0:03:58.720 the hospital for? Oh? I was just there for about 0:03:58.760 --> 0:04:01.680 six or seven hours. They would and well, they wouldn't 0:04:01.680 --> 0:04:03.840 even test me. And then the doctors spent about forty 0:04:03.840 --> 0:04:07.360 minutes sitting on my bed with his mask off, telling 0:04:07.360 --> 0:04:09.560 me all the reasons why I couldn't possibly have contracted 0:04:09.560 --> 0:04:11.280 and it wasn't Europe at that time, and it was 0:04:11.320 --> 0:04:13.840 so rare and all the stuff we now know to 0:04:13.960 --> 0:04:16.240 be completely false, and not to complain, there's a whole 0:04:16.240 --> 0:04:17.400 lot of people in a hell of a lot worse 0:04:17.400 --> 0:04:19.800 shape than I was. But so how did you know 0:04:19.880 --> 0:04:22.320 you had it if they wouldn't test you? Just what 0:04:22.440 --> 0:04:25.440 they were saying about symptoms, And it felt like I 0:04:25.440 --> 0:04:28.520 had a ratchet strap going on around my chest, and 0:04:28.839 --> 0:04:31.760 my wife had been really fatigued and tired too, And 0:04:32.600 --> 0:04:36.200 that initial onset only lasted for a couple of days. 0:04:36.360 --> 0:04:39.800 Those those symptoms all sort of evaporated as fast as 0:04:39.800 --> 0:04:41.599 they came on, and then I was just really tired 0:04:41.640 --> 0:04:43.960 for about two or three weeks. I felt just you know, 0:04:44.040 --> 0:04:46.440 took like two naps a day, which is very unlike me. 0:04:46.960 --> 0:04:52.039 What made it better? Because you didn't take any therapeutic drugs? Actually, yeah, 0:04:52.080 --> 0:04:55.520 my booking agent JL brought me a big old cornucopia 0:04:55.640 --> 0:05:00.680 basket of like holistic medicines and vitamins and a lot 0:05:00.720 --> 0:05:03.200 of a lot of you know, detoxifants and stuff. I 0:05:03.240 --> 0:05:05.679 was just drinking tea, a lot, a lot of water, 0:05:05.720 --> 0:05:08.760 and plus we live out we're pretty secluded. I probably 0:05:08.760 --> 0:05:12.240 overshot it on the solution, to be honest, and so 0:05:12.400 --> 0:05:15.599 just to eating a lot of vegetables and trying to 0:05:15.680 --> 0:05:18.280 be healthier and going for walks and uh. And then 0:05:18.320 --> 0:05:22.080 I think it was around March twelfth or thirteenth thousand 0:05:22.120 --> 0:05:24.960 in hospital and we didn't actually get tested until the first, 0:05:25.360 --> 0:05:28.080 very very early April, and I was still still detected 0:05:28.080 --> 0:05:31.640 like positive. Wow result so I must have had a 0:05:31.640 --> 0:05:34.240 really large viral load or exposure. I guess for it too. 0:05:34.320 --> 0:05:36.039 I'll stick around that long. I don't know. And do 0:05:36.040 --> 0:05:38.479 you have any um, like, do you have asthma or 0:05:38.520 --> 0:05:42.920 any Uh? No, no, allergic to anything. No, my lungs 0:05:42.920 --> 0:05:46.120 are huge, man, I got like big fat swimmer lungs. 0:05:46.160 --> 0:05:48.760 So the whole tour, you know, we played nine or 0:05:48.800 --> 0:05:51.680 ten shows I can't remember, and like something wasn't right. 0:05:51.760 --> 0:05:56.040 I remember vividly knowing I just couldn't get a real 0:05:56.080 --> 0:05:58.919 deep inhale on stage. And I've lost like twenty pounds 0:05:58.920 --> 0:06:00.800 before the tour. I was really making a conscious of 0:06:00.920 --> 0:06:02.640 it to be healthy, and I was living cleaner. I 0:06:02.760 --> 0:06:05.960 stopped smoking pot and all that shit, you know, and 0:06:05.960 --> 0:06:08.080 and just every night I was like, what is it? God, 0:06:08.120 --> 0:06:10.760 I'm old, Like this is middle age. It's here now. 0:06:10.800 --> 0:06:14.520 You know something's going on. But I guess it was 0:06:14.560 --> 0:06:19.440 just slowly metabolizing through my system. But you you essentially 0:06:19.440 --> 0:06:23.040 beat it with no Western medicine. You're saying, yeah, I'm 0:06:23.080 --> 0:06:25.080 just healthy. It was, you know, I mean it sucked. 0:06:25.120 --> 0:06:27.839 I've definitely never woken up in my entire life and 0:06:27.839 --> 0:06:30.000 said I need to go to the emergency room. Yeah, 0:06:30.040 --> 0:06:34.040 and this was like something's very not right here, and yeah, 0:06:34.440 --> 0:06:36.760 and then it went away. And then you know, some 0:06:36.920 --> 0:06:41.120 friends like Prime passed away that was pretty close after. 0:06:41.520 --> 0:06:43.400 I don't know, man, It's it's so funny to me 0:06:43.480 --> 0:06:48.320 that you see all the denial and people just falling 0:06:48.360 --> 0:06:50.520 at fear, moo, hungering or whatever. We were here renting 0:06:50.520 --> 0:06:53.840 a house on the East coast, and the guy we 0:06:53.839 --> 0:06:55.760 were renting from he got it, was in the hospital 0:06:55.800 --> 0:06:58.560 for a while, like the handyman who I would constantly 0:06:58.560 --> 0:07:00.440 have to ask him to mask up, tell me come 0:07:00.480 --> 0:07:02.080 over in the lard. We kind of look at me laugh. 0:07:02.160 --> 0:07:04.960 He was in the hospital for two weeks just recently, 0:07:05.000 --> 0:07:07.480 so you know he's not laughing now. But it's it's 0:07:07.480 --> 0:07:11.600 some real shit, man. Absolutely, Man, I'm so glad you're 0:07:11.760 --> 0:07:14.480 I'm so glad you're over it. It's like I said, now, 0:07:14.520 --> 0:07:17.880 it's I feel strangely sort of rejuvenated. I haven't felt 0:07:17.880 --> 0:07:20.320 I'm probably just from being off and having rest for 0:07:20.360 --> 0:07:22.320 the first time eight years, but I feel pretty great 0:07:22.400 --> 0:07:25.760 right now. Yeah, tell me about Kentucky. You grew up 0:07:25.800 --> 0:07:28.960 in Kentucky. What's it like growing up there? And again, 0:07:29.000 --> 0:07:31.200 I'm really asking how to ignorance. I know very little. 0:07:31.400 --> 0:07:34.440 In some ways not at all what most people probably think, 0:07:34.480 --> 0:07:37.720 and in a lot of ways exactly like that. Kentucky's 0:07:37.720 --> 0:07:41.360 a weird state. Depending on what corner or region you're in, 0:07:41.520 --> 0:07:44.320 you might as well be in different worlds. I'm originally 0:07:44.360 --> 0:07:48.760 from southeastern Kentucky or the Appalachian region, so um, you know, 0:07:49.080 --> 0:07:52.960 we used to be coal mining, strip mining country, bluegrass country. 0:07:53.160 --> 0:07:56.200 And then my dad had a he was a state trooper, 0:07:56.920 --> 0:07:58.960 kind of ran the gamut of that career, and I 0:07:58.960 --> 0:08:01.760 think when when I was young, he was doing some 0:08:01.800 --> 0:08:05.440 more sketchy kind of work that put a lot of 0:08:05.440 --> 0:08:08.120 stress on my mom in their marriage when I was 0:08:08.120 --> 0:08:09.840 a young kid. So I think we ended up moving. 0:08:10.520 --> 0:08:12.760 He took a transfer and got out of doing that stuff, 0:08:12.960 --> 0:08:17.280 and we ended it moving up to central Kentucky, eventually 0:08:17.320 --> 0:08:21.320 settling in a little town, Versailles, the locals called Sales. 0:08:22.720 --> 0:08:24.680 I remember, you know, it's a good place to grow up. 0:08:24.720 --> 0:08:29.800 But I do remember always feeling the wanderlust, you know, 0:08:30.160 --> 0:08:33.040 So I left. I left for boot camp and the Navy. 0:08:33.080 --> 0:08:34.720 I don't a week and a half, two weeks after 0:08:34.760 --> 0:08:37.760 I graduated high school, just ready to go and get out, 0:08:37.800 --> 0:08:40.640 you know, Yeah, what was the music in the house 0:08:40.679 --> 0:08:43.640 that he grew up in, Like in the house I 0:08:43.679 --> 0:08:45.560 grew up, and my mom would listen to a lot 0:08:45.600 --> 0:08:49.200 of motown like Rod Stewart and stuff like that. And 0:08:49.200 --> 0:08:51.400 then she had she still had her old forty five 0:08:51.880 --> 0:08:54.240 when she was a teenager. And then my grandmother had 0:08:54.480 --> 0:08:56.920 she had one of those old you know, the furniture 0:08:56.960 --> 0:08:59.400 type record players had the built in speakers and he'd 0:08:59.440 --> 0:09:01.120 flip the list, had to reach down in and my 0:09:01.160 --> 0:09:04.480 grandmother just had a ton of old soul music and 0:09:04.480 --> 0:09:06.480 that's what she listened to. So those were probably the 0:09:06.559 --> 0:09:10.480 first records I was exposed to. And then CCR and 0:09:11.559 --> 0:09:13.120 I think the first song I learned how to play 0:09:13.200 --> 0:09:16.200 on guitar was probably Sunshine of Your Love. How old 0:09:16.200 --> 0:09:21.040 were you then? Probably was second grade? So I got 0:09:21.080 --> 0:09:24.240 my first guitar around second or third grade. And I 0:09:24.280 --> 0:09:27.240 remember why, I was like Nickelodeon was really big back then, 0:09:27.280 --> 0:09:29.200 you know, so I remember I was I watched the 0:09:29.280 --> 0:09:32.480 Monkeys when I was a little kid on TV. So honestly, 0:09:32.559 --> 0:09:35.000 those songs I had all those records, those songs which 0:09:35.040 --> 0:09:38.280 we now know were like Nielsen and Neil Neil Diamond Tunes, 0:09:39.040 --> 0:09:41.720 so you know, they're getting that melodic chop burned into 0:09:41.720 --> 0:09:44.559 your brain at a young age. And then an older 0:09:44.559 --> 0:09:47.440 cousin and also older next to her neighbor. Both of 0:09:47.440 --> 0:09:50.200 them were teenagers when I was in like i'd say, 0:09:50.240 --> 0:09:53.560 fifth grade, and they both corrupted me pretty good and proper. 0:09:53.600 --> 0:09:56.840 I mean, I was exposed to Appetite for Destruction and 0:09:57.320 --> 0:10:00.320 I don't know Man Hendricks and the whole Zeppelin box 0:10:00.360 --> 0:10:03.200 that found it all like probably I used to stay 0:10:03.240 --> 0:10:05.880 way too young, but now, I mean I responded immediately, 0:10:05.960 --> 0:10:07.720 so I guess it was right on time. You know, 0:10:08.160 --> 0:10:11.520 when you were a kid and you'd hear Jimmy Hendrix 0:10:11.559 --> 0:10:14.720 and you'd hear Appetite for Destruction, did it all seemed 0:10:14.760 --> 0:10:17.920 like it was music from the past? Or was it 0:10:18.120 --> 0:10:20.840 clear when something was more current and something was from 0:10:20.880 --> 0:10:24.959 the more distant past. I definitely think it was clear 0:10:25.000 --> 0:10:27.960 when things were more from a different era or just 0:10:28.000 --> 0:10:30.600 the way I remember like the sound of it, you know, 0:10:30.600 --> 0:10:35.680 it just sounded lived in and cooler. And but now, 0:10:36.120 --> 0:10:40.320 you know, appetite even that sonically to a fourth or 0:10:40.320 --> 0:10:43.520 fifth grader because at the time MTV was probably playing 0:10:43.960 --> 0:10:48.079 god knows what Poison and def Leopard videos add nauseum 0:10:48.080 --> 0:10:51.400 over and over. But I remember vividly seeing that video 0:10:51.480 --> 0:10:53.920 for Welcome to the Jungle come on because we were 0:10:53.960 --> 0:10:56.240 living in this apartment one summer and I couldn't go 0:10:56.240 --> 0:10:57.960 outside a mom and dad worked all day. I had 0:10:57.960 --> 0:11:01.200 to stay inside, and uh, I was so young, I 0:11:01.200 --> 0:11:02.760 couldn't really do much. So I was just sitting watch 0:11:02.920 --> 0:11:05.040 MTV all day and that video came on, man, and 0:11:05.120 --> 0:11:07.520 it was like you could just feel the danger, you 0:11:07.559 --> 0:11:09.120 know what I mean. I was just like, oh shit, 0:11:09.280 --> 0:11:12.480 this is this is something entirely different, like this is real, 0:11:12.760 --> 0:11:15.559 you know. I remember, I remember that being so clear, 0:11:15.679 --> 0:11:19.240 like I gotta know everything about this, you know. And 0:11:19.240 --> 0:11:22.200 and then later on that year, I guess I hadn't 0:11:22.200 --> 0:11:24.240 really heard the record yet. And we had an older 0:11:24.800 --> 0:11:27.040 My next door neighbor was this older kid, Michael, and 0:11:27.040 --> 0:11:29.319 he had a navy blue Chevy Nova, and he'd like 0:11:29.400 --> 0:11:31.400 used to run away from home all the time, and shit, 0:11:31.559 --> 0:11:34.480 you know, he's a bad kid, and uh he was. 0:11:34.559 --> 0:11:38.360 He was basically woodson from from days and confused, and 0:11:38.520 --> 0:11:42.640 uh he pulled up one day just cranking that record 0:11:43.040 --> 0:11:44.880 in his car, and I was out. I was outside. 0:11:44.920 --> 0:11:46.400 I don't even know what I was doing, probably sitting 0:11:46.400 --> 0:11:47.880 on my button in grass and I heard it. I 0:11:47.920 --> 0:11:49.880 was just like, what is that man? And he and 0:11:49.920 --> 0:11:51.840 he was such a dick. He was just like, fuck, 0:11:51.880 --> 0:11:54.000 you've been kid in the caves, guns and roses man. 0:11:54.200 --> 0:11:57.600 And he gave me the cassette tape like he gave 0:11:57.600 --> 0:11:59.439 me the cassette and it still had had the original 0:11:59.520 --> 0:12:01.320 artwork in the middle with the robot jump in the 0:12:01.360 --> 0:12:03.839 fence and all that shit and men. I wore it out. 0:12:03.920 --> 0:12:06.199 My mom found it threw it away because she saw that, 0:12:06.360 --> 0:12:08.600 she saw the artwork and everything. I think I ended 0:12:08.679 --> 0:12:11.400 up buying like two more copies that ended up getting trashed. 0:12:11.679 --> 0:12:14.160 But that that record was a huge, a huge bomb 0:12:14.160 --> 0:12:18.800 going off for me. And then yeah, Cream Hendricks and 0:12:18.840 --> 0:12:21.080 then I had a big Clapton phase for a while. 0:12:21.080 --> 0:12:24.400 I got real into Clapton. I just like reading everything 0:12:24.440 --> 0:12:26.520 I could find about him, and then that takes you 0:12:26.559 --> 0:12:29.680 down these holes to you know, guys like Peter Green 0:12:29.800 --> 0:12:32.880 and all the John Male stuff, which which takes you 0:12:32.960 --> 0:12:36.840 back to the Chicago and Delta, and it was just 0:12:36.840 --> 0:12:38.920 this rabbit hole. Man. I was like a weird sixteen 0:12:38.960 --> 0:12:41.640 year old into a lot of shit that you know, 0:12:41.880 --> 0:12:44.160 it was probably nerdy, I guess looking back on it. 0:12:45.040 --> 0:12:47.240 Did you have many experiences of your mom taking away 0:12:47.280 --> 0:12:50.720 stuff and throwing it away? That record and the other 0:12:50.720 --> 0:12:52.800 one she pulled, she popped out of the tape deck 0:12:52.800 --> 0:12:55.079 and tossed out the car window. Once was Stepping Wolf 0:12:55.080 --> 0:12:58.400 when the Pusher came on, she was just like, no, sir, 0:12:59.000 --> 0:13:03.080 you know anything talking about pimping and pushing hose and 0:13:03.440 --> 0:13:05.839 selling drugs was probably nothing your mom. My mom once 0:13:05.880 --> 0:13:08.079 they're nine year old bumping too. My dad was a 0:13:08.120 --> 0:13:11.040 steak cop too, and he was probably the biggest supporter 0:13:11.080 --> 0:13:14.080 of it. He bought my first guitar and what was 0:13:14.200 --> 0:13:18.200 what was your dad's tasted music like rock and roll? Yeah, yeah, 0:13:18.200 --> 0:13:20.120 he took me. He took me to see Van Halen 0:13:20.440 --> 0:13:22.440 in like fourth or fifth grades, so it was always, 0:13:22.840 --> 0:13:25.240 you know, he liked a party. Do you ever go 0:13:25.280 --> 0:13:27.800 down rabbit holes of different kinds of music that you 0:13:27.840 --> 0:13:30.880 haven't listened to before? Absolutely? Yeah, I mean I think 0:13:30.920 --> 0:13:36.000 that's important. One year, one year to Blonde come out, 0:13:36.000 --> 0:13:40.120 that Frank Ocean record sixteen, maybe when Sailor's got I 0:13:40.120 --> 0:13:41.760 think it was around the same time A Sailors guy 0:13:41.880 --> 0:13:44.520 came out, and I was just I wanted to listen 0:13:44.559 --> 0:13:47.280 to something like so far away from anything that I 0:13:47.320 --> 0:13:50.400 did or understood. And I heard a song. A friend 0:13:50.440 --> 0:13:52.320 of mine play was listening to that and heard a 0:13:52.360 --> 0:13:54.920 song and I was just like, I remember being struck 0:13:55.040 --> 0:14:00.400 by the production values and the sounds, and I just 0:14:00.400 --> 0:14:02.440 was like, I have no idea what he's doing or 0:14:02.440 --> 0:14:05.880 how he made these noises, and that it really fascinated 0:14:05.960 --> 0:14:08.240 me to just stick my head in something that was 0:14:08.280 --> 0:14:11.920 so different than the tools that we use, you know. 0:14:12.440 --> 0:14:14.720 And I listened to that record for about a month straight. 0:14:15.000 --> 0:14:18.600 Must have been but yeah, a lot of hip hop, weirdly, 0:14:19.800 --> 0:14:23.160 maybe not. I don't know. One thing I never really 0:14:23.200 --> 0:14:26.600 got into, I guess was jazz other than the basics. 0:14:26.680 --> 0:14:30.880 You know. Yeah, I predict you will maybe it's coming. 0:14:31.160 --> 0:14:34.680 Yeah he'll billy jazz. But let's talk about bluegrass a 0:14:34.720 --> 0:14:38.120 little bit in general. I know almost nothing about it. 0:14:38.520 --> 0:14:41.000 Tell me about what do you know about bluegrass? You 0:14:41.040 --> 0:14:44.240 could start from the beginning. Well, okay, I got out 0:14:44.280 --> 0:14:48.240 of the navy. I know, I know more now, I've 0:14:48.280 --> 0:14:51.320 forgotten a lot. In my twenties, I was obsessed, like 0:14:51.680 --> 0:14:54.120 scoured the earth kind of shit. And when I was younger, 0:14:54.240 --> 0:14:56.440 my grandfather I wrote this little letter sent out with 0:14:56.440 --> 0:14:59.680 the record. He my paternal grandfather, was obsessed with it. 0:14:59.680 --> 0:15:03.680 It's he thought about, spent his entire later years going 0:15:03.720 --> 0:15:07.280 to festivals and it's always listened to. Oh to the 0:15:07.280 --> 0:15:09.560 point it would drive my mom crazy, and he would 0:15:09.560 --> 0:15:11.440 always trying to push it on me, you know, even 0:15:11.520 --> 0:15:14.240 like a real young age. But my palette wasn't ready, man, 0:15:14.280 --> 0:15:17.880 because it's it's very complex music. You know, it's always 0:15:17.920 --> 0:15:21.200 recorded or would you see people play it live? Mostly 0:15:21.280 --> 0:15:23.640 field recordings. And then he took me to a festival 0:15:23.640 --> 0:15:26.320 one year out the horse Park and it was like 0:15:26.360 --> 0:15:28.640 that was that I do remember vividly feeling like I 0:15:28.720 --> 0:15:31.760 was watching magic because these guys were like dancing around 0:15:31.760 --> 0:15:33.720 the mic. It was old school, you know, it's still 0:15:33.720 --> 0:15:37.080 early eighties. And then in Jackson, where I'm from, every 0:15:37.120 --> 0:15:39.240 Labor Day they had this a festival in the city 0:15:39.240 --> 0:15:42.480 called the Honey Festival, and on Friday nights, I think 0:15:42.520 --> 0:15:44.280 they have rock bands, and on Saturday night it was 0:15:44.320 --> 0:15:47.840 bluegrass and all the old timers. I mean, dude, it 0:15:47.920 --> 0:15:50.240 was like something right out of a time where these 0:15:50.240 --> 0:15:52.200 guys would come down from the Hollers and the Hills, 0:15:52.240 --> 0:15:54.360 like in their start shirts and overalls and dances this 0:15:54.440 --> 0:15:58.800 ship and it was like probably the last of that stuff, 0:15:59.000 --> 0:16:02.000 you know, time capsule kind of thing, but those images 0:16:02.000 --> 0:16:05.040 are burned into my head and so that was really 0:16:05.040 --> 0:16:07.960 the early exposure. But then it wasn't until I got 0:16:08.000 --> 0:16:12.160 out of the military. I'd gotten off some pretty pretty 0:16:12.200 --> 0:16:15.320 heavy drugs. I was kind of floating pretty hard for 0:16:15.320 --> 0:16:17.000 about a year and I got home. I was clean. 0:16:17.080 --> 0:16:20.000 I was just like dealing with all that, like the 0:16:20.080 --> 0:16:22.520 shame spiral and everything, and like trying to figure out 0:16:22.520 --> 0:16:27.800 my mom would remarried. Nothing, everything was just uplifted. You 0:16:27.840 --> 0:16:31.520 went into the military just to escape escape home, but well, yeah, 0:16:31.640 --> 0:16:34.720 escape home. And also I kind of got in some trouble. 0:16:34.880 --> 0:16:36.880 I got really lucky, but I got in some trouble 0:16:36.960 --> 0:16:39.600 my senior year of high school, just doing shit I 0:16:39.600 --> 0:16:41.680 shouldn't have been. And it was sort of like a 0:16:41.680 --> 0:16:45.360 wake up call. What was the experience? Your service experience? 0:16:45.440 --> 0:16:49.040 Like what it was peacetime for starters, And I was 0:16:49.080 --> 0:16:53.360 stationed overseas, the majority of it in Asia, Southeast Asia, 0:16:53.360 --> 0:16:55.880 and we'd go a lot of places I would have 0:16:55.920 --> 0:16:58.440 never seen otherwise. And it turned into some songs later 0:16:58.480 --> 0:17:00.720 on in life, thankfully. But you know, a lot of 0:17:00.800 --> 0:17:04.600 a lot of experiences that were eye opening, a lot 0:17:04.600 --> 0:17:08.159 of expensive experiences that were probably things I could have 0:17:08.240 --> 0:17:10.960 done without. Things I wish I hadn't seen older dudes 0:17:11.000 --> 0:17:13.520 I hadn't. I wish I hadn't been exposed to, you know, 0:17:13.640 --> 0:17:17.520 sailors in life. That comes with that, and you just 0:17:17.560 --> 0:17:20.240 hard to wash a lot of that shit off man um. 0:17:20.800 --> 0:17:23.879 But then a lot of a lot of most a 0:17:23.880 --> 0:17:26.479 lot of drinking and partying, to be honest with you, 0:17:26.560 --> 0:17:30.800 and and uh, a lot of girls. That kind of thing, 0:17:30.880 --> 0:17:33.760 like what you do when you're stuck in this like tyrannical, 0:17:33.840 --> 0:17:37.480 oppressive environment with lots of sharp corners and gray paint, 0:17:37.560 --> 0:17:39.119 you know what I mean. Like as an artist, it 0:17:39.240 --> 0:17:42.040 was like the fuck have I done? You know, and 0:17:42.119 --> 0:17:44.199 you're you're stuck. We'd go out to see sometimes like 0:17:44.320 --> 0:17:48.399 ninety one hundred and eight days, you know, so like 0:17:48.440 --> 0:17:51.480 it's basically prison. I mean, you're basically in prison eating 0:17:51.520 --> 0:17:54.600 better food maybe, I don't know. So I got out 0:17:54.640 --> 0:17:56.720 and I was just ready to I was ready to 0:17:56.760 --> 0:17:58.840 not be that anymore, and I went a little too 0:17:58.840 --> 0:18:02.440 buck wild. How long were you in for long enough 0:18:02.480 --> 0:18:06.240 about three years. Yeah, And it's like I said, I 0:18:06.400 --> 0:18:08.159 just sort of burned it at both ends. And I 0:18:08.200 --> 0:18:10.720 came home and I was really lost, man, I was 0:18:10.720 --> 0:18:14.320 really lost and probably severely depressed, and serotonin levels were 0:18:14.320 --> 0:18:16.280 still finding their way home and that kind of ship. 0:18:16.480 --> 0:18:18.840 And was driving down a row one day and I 0:18:18.960 --> 0:18:22.040 heard it was a Monroe Brothers song, and I want 0:18:22.080 --> 0:18:24.280 to I'm trying to remember what the song was. It 0:18:24.320 --> 0:18:27.160 wasn't something as easy as it was, like a deep cut, 0:18:27.240 --> 0:18:29.520 probably long journey home or something, man, and I had 0:18:29.520 --> 0:18:31.919 to pull the chuck over. I was just like the tears, 0:18:32.000 --> 0:18:35.520 just it just it slam me in the chest. But everything, 0:18:35.840 --> 0:18:41.439 like whatever it was, was extremely visceral connection, an emotional 0:18:41.960 --> 0:18:45.200 reaction to that music. And then for the next i'd 0:18:45.240 --> 0:18:47.680 say seven or eight years, I don't give a fuck 0:18:47.720 --> 0:18:51.159 about anything else. Was it in the song itself or 0:18:51.200 --> 0:18:54.040 were you reconnecting to something from childhood by hearing it. 0:18:54.040 --> 0:18:57.639 It was the inflection of their voices, It was the lyric, 0:18:57.720 --> 0:19:01.879 the underlying like there I say, religious themes with like 0:19:01.960 --> 0:19:04.399 pain and lament and sorrow. But mostly man, it was 0:19:04.440 --> 0:19:07.639 just the voice, the voices and the music and the 0:19:07.760 --> 0:19:11.520 notes it took me back to like just childhood memories 0:19:11.520 --> 0:19:14.320 and like funerals and these things that you can't really 0:19:14.359 --> 0:19:16.159 put a finger on, but I knew like this is, 0:19:16.240 --> 0:19:19.479 this is where I'm from. We'll be right back with 0:19:19.520 --> 0:19:27.040 more Rick's conversation with Sturgil After a quick break, we're 0:19:27.080 --> 0:19:30.720 back with Rick Rubin and Sturgil Simpson. Let's talk about 0:19:30.720 --> 0:19:34.400 the Sailor's album a little bit. It's it's very different 0:19:34.440 --> 0:19:37.840 than what came before. How about how does it happen? 0:19:38.560 --> 0:19:41.359 I mean that one, I think more than any record 0:19:41.400 --> 0:19:44.280 of me I probably heard in my head or in 0:19:44.359 --> 0:19:46.800 terms of the blueprint before we went in what I 0:19:46.840 --> 0:19:48.919 wanted to do and what I wanted to incorporate. I 0:19:48.960 --> 0:19:50.680 was listening to a lot of Marvin Gay, a lot 0:19:50.680 --> 0:19:54.840 of Memphis Elva stuff at the time and wanted to, 0:19:54.920 --> 0:19:57.480 you know, meta modern. Was just me and the three 0:19:57.480 --> 0:19:59.680 other guys in the room. Once we set the mics 0:19:59.760 --> 0:20:02.760 up record, we didn't really move or change anything. It 0:20:02.840 --> 0:20:05.520 was It wasn't so the songs has all kind of 0:20:05.520 --> 0:20:07.720 been carved out live on the road and this three 0:20:07.760 --> 0:20:10.600 month tour prior to us going in and banging that 0:20:10.680 --> 0:20:13.000 record out, and so I knew I didn't want to 0:20:13.000 --> 0:20:15.879 do something that stripped down and raw again for starters. 0:20:15.920 --> 0:20:20.000 And then two I was was my first label record, 0:20:20.040 --> 0:20:22.159 and the only reason I really signed with the label 0:20:22.280 --> 0:20:25.359 was for a larger recording budget. So I was like, well, 0:20:25.560 --> 0:20:27.640 you know, I don't really want to make a ten 0:20:27.680 --> 0:20:30.280 thousand dollar album because that's that's not what we're doing here. 0:20:30.359 --> 0:20:33.919 So and you have that toolbox now available and opened 0:20:34.000 --> 0:20:35.320