1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:02,120 Speaker 1: And at that time, man was just so. 2 00:00:03,760 --> 00:00:07,000 Speaker 2: Just to think back, like every that that was everybody 3 00:00:07,080 --> 00:00:14,520 Speaker 2: was scared. It was always be careful, you know, everywhere 4 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:17,760 Speaker 2: y'all go go in groups, you know what I'm saying. 5 00:00:17,800 --> 00:00:20,680 Speaker 2: It was like everybody was scared, and definitely the people 6 00:00:20,680 --> 00:00:22,160 Speaker 2: from where we grew up, like like. 7 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:24,599 Speaker 1: Around from where we were from. Everybody over there. 8 00:00:24,560 --> 00:00:27,720 Speaker 2: Scared because that's where they was getting the kids from. 9 00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:30,720 Speaker 2: It it was crazy, man Like at that time, it 10 00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:37,200 Speaker 2: was like the Boogerman he because it's literally somebody going 11 00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:41,840 Speaker 2: around taking kids and they will finding them and telling 12 00:00:41,880 --> 00:00:43,960 Speaker 2: who they were, following them behind buildings. 13 00:00:44,360 --> 00:00:48,280 Speaker 3: That was just our life. When you're living through something 14 00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:53,040 Speaker 3: like that, it's kind of like different. It was just 15 00:00:53,080 --> 00:00:57,520 Speaker 3: something we had to deal with. Watch for the Boogerman. 16 00:00:59,400 --> 00:01:02,640 Speaker 4: My name is Camera. We are in the atl Atlanta, 17 00:01:02,720 --> 00:01:05,400 Speaker 4: Georgia and I'm from Atlanta, Georgia born and Brett. 18 00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:07,560 Speaker 2: And I'm Eric Cameron and I'm from Atlanta, Georgia, also 19 00:01:07,840 --> 00:01:10,360 Speaker 2: West Side to be exact. Yep, he's the big brother, 20 00:01:10,520 --> 00:01:13,000 Speaker 2: that's the little brother. The area we're from is while 21 00:01:13,040 --> 00:01:14,920 Speaker 2: the kids most of the kids were getting missing from 22 00:01:15,040 --> 00:01:17,039 Speaker 2: So the area we're from the West side of Atlanta, like, 23 00:01:17,319 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 2: so it was almost like you gotta be real, real careful, 24 00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:24,320 Speaker 2: like can stay out, you always be with somebody. I 25 00:01:24,360 --> 00:01:26,000 Speaker 2: was real, real little so most times I was with 26 00:01:26,080 --> 00:01:28,200 Speaker 2: him anyway, my big brother. But man, that was that 27 00:01:28,319 --> 00:01:31,559 Speaker 2: was a real trying time because we couldn't hang out, 28 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:33,800 Speaker 2: like I mean, it's a lot different now, man, times 29 00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:34,200 Speaker 2: are different. 30 00:01:34,240 --> 00:01:37,240 Speaker 1: Like back then everything was about going outside. 31 00:01:38,160 --> 00:01:42,320 Speaker 2: Everything was about going outside, like I mean, now everything's 32 00:01:42,319 --> 00:01:45,600 Speaker 2: about being inside playing on computers and games or whatever. 33 00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:47,240 Speaker 1: But it was just a different time. 34 00:01:47,800 --> 00:01:51,280 Speaker 2: They snatching kids, somebody somebody getting kids, so you stand 35 00:01:51,320 --> 00:01:54,040 Speaker 2: a better chance or not getting snatched if it's more. 36 00:01:53,880 --> 00:01:56,160 Speaker 1: Than one, Like if you're with somebody, it was just 37 00:01:56,200 --> 00:01:58,920 Speaker 1: like unthinkable, like who could who? Who could do this? 38 00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:07,800 Speaker 5: It's ten pm? 39 00:02:07,920 --> 00:02:09,560 Speaker 6: Do you know where your children are? 40 00:02:14,880 --> 00:02:16,160 Speaker 7: It's ten pm? 41 00:02:16,400 --> 00:02:21,079 Speaker 1: Do you know where your children are? I still remember that, 42 00:02:21,320 --> 00:02:23,239 Speaker 1: like literally remember that. 43 00:02:26,560 --> 00:02:29,600 Speaker 2: Talking about keeping your kids safe and what other things 44 00:02:29,600 --> 00:02:32,000 Speaker 2: you could do to keep them safe. And I still 45 00:02:32,040 --> 00:02:34,440 Speaker 2: remember that. 46 00:02:34,440 --> 00:02:35,960 Speaker 1: That was that, you know, that was I wasn't at 47 00:02:36,000 --> 00:02:36,519 Speaker 1: Channel two. 48 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:40,160 Speaker 2: What time that was Monica Copper I think it was 49 00:02:40,200 --> 00:02:42,240 Speaker 2: on Channel two, and they would say that you know 50 00:02:42,280 --> 00:02:43,720 Speaker 2: where are your kids? 51 00:02:44,080 --> 00:02:46,520 Speaker 8: It's ten o'clock, do you know where your children are? 52 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:53,320 Speaker 8: That statement became a nightly statement. I was Monica Kaufman. 53 00:02:53,360 --> 00:02:56,800 Speaker 8: I'm now Monica Kaufman Pierson. I anchored the five to six, 54 00:02:56,919 --> 00:03:00,560 Speaker 8: the eleven, and the four o'clock news at Channel two WSTV. 55 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:02,960 Speaker 6: It's the city's oldest television station. 56 00:03:04,040 --> 00:03:07,560 Speaker 8: People needed to know that they needed to keep an 57 00:03:07,680 --> 00:03:12,519 Speaker 8: eye on their boys, in particular because boys were being 58 00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:18,399 Speaker 8: literally picked up off the streets. So there was this 59 00:03:18,639 --> 00:03:23,840 Speaker 8: fear that unless you reminded people to ask, where's your child? 60 00:03:23,919 --> 00:03:26,000 Speaker 8: Do you know where your child is at this time? 61 00:03:26,160 --> 00:03:28,600 Speaker 8: At ten o'clock? Your child should be in your house. 62 00:03:29,600 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 8: That people needed to be reminded. There was a monster 63 00:03:33,200 --> 00:03:35,440 Speaker 8: on the prial in Metro Atlanta. 64 00:03:36,000 --> 00:03:38,920 Speaker 6: It was scary. It was very scary. 65 00:03:39,920 --> 00:03:49,080 Speaker 5: Ten nine, eight, seven, six, five, four, three two one, 66 00:03:49,240 --> 00:03:59,200 Speaker 5: and I happy in nineteen seventy nine. 67 00:04:01,720 --> 00:04:05,440 Speaker 9: The year is nineteen seventy nine. Jimmy Carter is our president. 68 00:04:06,040 --> 00:04:09,280 Speaker 9: The Vietnam War ended just four years ago, and it's 69 00:04:09,320 --> 00:04:11,760 Speaker 9: been barely over a decade since the Civil Rights movement. 70 00:04:14,840 --> 00:04:18,400 Speaker 9: My name is Payne Lindsay. I'm a documentary filmmaker. I 71 00:04:18,520 --> 00:04:20,880 Speaker 9: was born in nineteen eighty seven, and I'm from a 72 00:04:20,880 --> 00:04:26,360 Speaker 9: small town called Kinnessaul, northwest of Atlanta. In twenty sixteen, 73 00:04:26,680 --> 00:04:29,400 Speaker 9: I made a podcast called Up and Vanished, where I 74 00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:33,000 Speaker 9: spent nearly two years investigating an unsolved disappearance of a 75 00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:35,920 Speaker 9: high school teacher and beauty queen from South Georgia named 76 00:04:35,960 --> 00:04:39,200 Speaker 9: Tara Grinstead. Tara vanished from her home in two thousand 77 00:04:39,240 --> 00:04:41,720 Speaker 9: and five, and the case remained ice cold for more 78 00:04:41,760 --> 00:04:44,360 Speaker 9: than a decade. But six months after I started making 79 00:04:44,360 --> 00:04:49,000 Speaker 9: the podcast, something crazy happened. The police arrested two suspects 80 00:04:49,120 --> 00:04:52,200 Speaker 9: in connection with TERA's murder, and for the first time 81 00:04:52,240 --> 00:04:56,360 Speaker 9: in nearly twelve years, this small town community had some answers. 82 00:04:57,600 --> 00:05:00,320 Speaker 10: Since then, I've been looking into other cold cases. 83 00:05:00,720 --> 00:05:03,440 Speaker 9: What began as just an idea became something more like 84 00:05:03,480 --> 00:05:06,200 Speaker 9: an obsession. A few months ago, I was in my 85 00:05:06,240 --> 00:05:09,040 Speaker 9: office and my business partner Donald mentioned the case. 86 00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:12,880 Speaker 10: I'd never heard of, the case of Atlanta's missing children. 87 00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:16,359 Speaker 9: I started doing some research on my own time, reading 88 00:05:16,360 --> 00:05:20,719 Speaker 9: old articles and watching news clips, and what I found 89 00:05:21,120 --> 00:05:25,920 Speaker 9: was captivating, a twisted tale that's haunted Atlanta. 90 00:05:25,560 --> 00:05:26,640 Speaker 10: For over three decades. 91 00:05:27,520 --> 00:05:28,120 Speaker 1: As far as the. 92 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:31,600 Speaker 9: Documentary goes, I didn't really have a plan but I 93 00:05:31,640 --> 00:05:33,919 Speaker 9: just started talking to people and I made sure I 94 00:05:34,000 --> 00:05:39,120 Speaker 9: recorded everything. Okay, let's go back to nineteen seventy nine. 95 00:05:40,160 --> 00:05:45,080 Speaker 11: So you think about the late seventies, it's post nineteen 96 00:05:45,200 --> 00:05:48,720 Speaker 11: sixties soul and stacks and all that stuff. Now you're 97 00:05:48,760 --> 00:06:00,279 Speaker 11: sliding into the disco era. This is an era where 98 00:06:00,360 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 11: cable is a new idea. Ted Turner hasn't even really 99 00:06:04,160 --> 00:06:06,800 Speaker 11: done his thing with CNN, That's what we're talking about. 100 00:06:06,839 --> 00:06:09,640 Speaker 11: There was no twenty four hour news network or news 101 00:06:09,640 --> 00:06:12,960 Speaker 11: cycle at the beginning of this. 102 00:06:12,960 --> 00:06:15,880 Speaker 9: This is nearly forty years ago now, so needless to say, 103 00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:18,920 Speaker 9: in many ways things are very different. The first thing 104 00:06:18,960 --> 00:06:20,720 Speaker 9: I did was trying to soak in as much as 105 00:06:20,720 --> 00:06:22,480 Speaker 9: possible about this time period. 106 00:06:22,720 --> 00:06:26,279 Speaker 11: This is Colinda Lee. I'm the vice president for Historical 107 00:06:26,320 --> 00:06:30,480 Speaker 11: Interpretation and Community Partnerships at the Atlanta History Center. So 108 00:06:30,520 --> 00:06:33,720 Speaker 11: certainly what you're looking at by the late seventies early 109 00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:37,640 Speaker 11: eighties is that first generation of African Americans who had 110 00:06:37,680 --> 00:06:43,240 Speaker 11: actually benefited from school desegregation, for example, at both a 111 00:06:43,360 --> 00:06:46,760 Speaker 11: secondary and collegiate level by then, right, So people who 112 00:06:46,760 --> 00:06:50,279 Speaker 11: were segregated maybe primary schools and still had those memories, 113 00:06:50,560 --> 00:06:56,320 Speaker 11: but were professionals by the early eighties, African Americans are 114 00:06:57,040 --> 00:07:00,960 Speaker 11: prospering to some degree, still definitely hard hit by the recession, 115 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:02,680 Speaker 11: but compared to the ways in which they had been 116 00:07:02,720 --> 00:07:09,840 Speaker 11: disadvantaged before, prospering to some degree, largely as a byproduct 117 00:07:09,880 --> 00:07:11,040 Speaker 11: of affirmative action. 118 00:07:11,880 --> 00:07:15,880 Speaker 9: Calinda described a time of fear and helplessness. All around 119 00:07:15,880 --> 00:07:19,160 Speaker 9: her kids were gradually going missing one by one. To 120 00:07:19,240 --> 00:07:21,440 Speaker 9: kids her age, there was this idea there was a 121 00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:24,000 Speaker 9: real life boogeyman out there, in a sense that no 122 00:07:24,080 --> 00:07:26,240 Speaker 9: one was really trying to protect them. 123 00:07:26,760 --> 00:07:30,440 Speaker 11: I was a child in Atlanta during that time. I 124 00:07:30,560 --> 00:07:34,200 Speaker 11: was a nine year old living in Atlanta in the 125 00:07:34,200 --> 00:07:36,720 Speaker 11: Fourth Ward, which was one of the areas from which 126 00:07:36,840 --> 00:07:41,800 Speaker 11: children were taken, and I remember as a child the 127 00:07:42,120 --> 00:07:46,360 Speaker 11: whispers and chatter among children. If you can imagine this 128 00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:51,200 Speaker 11: real life boogeyman is actually out there, this is really happening. 129 00:07:51,240 --> 00:07:53,800 Speaker 11: There was a child who went to summer camp with 130 00:07:53,840 --> 00:07:55,880 Speaker 11: me who was one of the children who was abducted. 131 00:07:56,440 --> 00:08:01,240 Speaker 11: And there wasn't a sense that anything very serious was 132 00:08:01,320 --> 00:08:06,080 Speaker 11: happening to protect us. There wasn't a sense that anything 133 00:08:06,120 --> 00:08:09,720 Speaker 11: about our daily lives was really changing much except that 134 00:08:09,760 --> 00:08:12,960 Speaker 11: we were very afraid, and our parents were very angry. 135 00:08:13,560 --> 00:08:16,280 Speaker 11: Every single one of them was not only black, they 136 00:08:16,320 --> 00:08:20,240 Speaker 11: were also poor. The neighborhoods from which they were taken 137 00:08:20,680 --> 00:08:28,160 Speaker 11: were the most vulnerable, most impoverished within the city. Many 138 00:08:28,200 --> 00:08:32,679 Speaker 11: of them came from public housing projects, and so all 139 00:08:32,760 --> 00:08:38,920 Speaker 11: of that definitely conspired to make folks feel like this 140 00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:42,320 Speaker 11: is something that is happening to the least of us, 141 00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:49,440 Speaker 11: and nobody cares. Atlanta is ashamed of this, I think 142 00:08:49,480 --> 00:08:50,920 Speaker 11: continues to be ashamed of this. 143 00:08:51,080 --> 00:08:51,920 Speaker 1: It is not. 144 00:08:52,040 --> 00:08:57,280 Speaker 11: Something that people really candidly talk about in the open 145 00:08:57,520 --> 00:08:59,920 Speaker 11: very much. I think that it's interesting that there's a 146 00:09:00,120 --> 00:09:03,640 Speaker 11: way in which I think Atlanta remains ashamed of the 147 00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:07,800 Speaker 11: racial bifurcation. That this really shows up when you talk 148 00:09:07,880 --> 00:09:10,800 Speaker 11: to people about their memories of this time. There's a 149 00:09:10,920 --> 00:09:14,760 Speaker 11: really distinct gap. I do a lot of oral history. 150 00:09:15,000 --> 00:09:18,640 Speaker 11: There's a really distinct gap between white at Lantin's and 151 00:09:18,679 --> 00:09:22,560 Speaker 11: Black at Lantins. I think that it's about a sense, 152 00:09:22,640 --> 00:09:28,720 Speaker 11: a profound sense of separate realities and separate societies. It's 153 00:09:28,840 --> 00:09:32,839 Speaker 11: startling to me, as a person who again as a child, 154 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:36,840 Speaker 11: lived here, to talk to people who are my contemporaries 155 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:42,800 Speaker 11: who were living in other neighborhoods living in majority neighborhoods, 156 00:09:43,480 --> 00:09:49,040 Speaker 11: who didn't have a sense of that urgency at all, 157 00:09:49,160 --> 00:09:51,680 Speaker 11: who didn't have a sense of that vulnerability at all, 158 00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:57,599 Speaker 11: who didn't even know that it was happening at all. 159 00:09:57,679 --> 00:10:01,640 Speaker 11: I think it's impossible to dissi entangle the race and 160 00:10:01,760 --> 00:10:03,319 Speaker 11: class issues. 161 00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:10,720 Speaker 12: I think if the world was designed with all blacks, 162 00:10:11,480 --> 00:10:14,400 Speaker 12: we might be pressud of the one that's too short, 163 00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:16,640 Speaker 12: the one that might be too tall, the one that's 164 00:10:17,360 --> 00:10:19,880 Speaker 12: ball And I think the same difference if it was 165 00:10:19,920 --> 00:10:23,880 Speaker 12: all whites would be the same thing. I think it's 166 00:10:23,920 --> 00:10:29,440 Speaker 12: just a human illness that we have, and we as 167 00:10:29,440 --> 00:10:33,600 Speaker 12: a people never learned to solve it. It's crazy. Even 168 00:10:33,640 --> 00:10:35,120 Speaker 12: in Vietnam it was the same thing. 169 00:10:38,480 --> 00:10:39,679 Speaker 10: This is Russell Boltazar. 170 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:44,040 Speaker 9: He's sixty nine years old currently living in Baton Rouge, Louisiana. 171 00:10:44,920 --> 00:10:47,720 Speaker 9: As a young adult in the late seventies, Russell remembers 172 00:10:47,760 --> 00:10:49,200 Speaker 9: this time period all too well. 173 00:10:51,240 --> 00:10:53,200 Speaker 12: When I left for the Marine Corps, I was seventeen 174 00:10:53,240 --> 00:10:57,000 Speaker 12: years old. They had to flies out secretly in the 175 00:10:57,040 --> 00:10:59,439 Speaker 12: middle of the morning and flies back in the middle 176 00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:04,000 Speaker 12: of the night. Yeah, that's how we used to leave 177 00:11:04,080 --> 00:11:06,480 Speaker 12: here at night. So most of the protesters wouldn't see 178 00:11:06,559 --> 00:11:15,320 Speaker 12: us leaving. We were so close together as a team, 179 00:11:15,360 --> 00:11:20,920 Speaker 12: and what we were fought, we were bled red. We 180 00:11:21,080 --> 00:11:24,160 Speaker 12: ate together, slept together the whole nine yard. It did 181 00:11:24,280 --> 00:11:25,840 Speaker 12: make a difference. But when we flew back to the 182 00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:29,560 Speaker 12: state side and landed on the tarmac, we went back 183 00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:42,520 Speaker 12: all separate ways again. I was active duty in the 184 00:11:42,559 --> 00:11:45,760 Speaker 12: Marine Corps at the time, stationed at Campbell's Ure in 185 00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:52,559 Speaker 12: North Carolina. My father was living in Atlanta. Patrick, Diane, 186 00:11:53,320 --> 00:11:57,800 Speaker 12: and Jacqueline are my three youngest brothers and sisters. They 187 00:11:58,040 --> 00:12:03,440 Speaker 12: got invited there doing this to Atlanta. They decided to 188 00:12:03,840 --> 00:12:05,520 Speaker 12: enroll in school there. 189 00:12:06,720 --> 00:12:09,760 Speaker 9: Even all the way in North Carolina, Russell remembers seeing 190 00:12:09,760 --> 00:12:13,200 Speaker 9: and hearing the news stories about Atlanta's missing children. With 191 00:12:13,280 --> 00:12:16,400 Speaker 9: his younger siblings having just moved to Atlanta, Russell fulk 192 00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:17,480 Speaker 9: concerned for their safety. 193 00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:19,439 Speaker 10: So one day he called his father. 194 00:12:20,679 --> 00:12:24,360 Speaker 12: I asked him, do you think that it's wise that 195 00:12:24,440 --> 00:12:27,160 Speaker 12: those kids should be there? Maybe they need to be 196 00:12:27,800 --> 00:12:33,160 Speaker 12: back in Louisiana. And so he said, well, everything is 197 00:12:33,160 --> 00:12:36,640 Speaker 12: going to be okay. And you know, they were gonna 198 00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:39,920 Speaker 12: go ahead and put him in school and they're going 199 00:12:39,960 --> 00:12:44,160 Speaker 12: to be safe. I says well, I don't have a 200 00:12:44,200 --> 00:12:47,240 Speaker 12: good feeling about it, but you go ahead and hamle it. 201 00:12:49,240 --> 00:12:51,480 Speaker 10: A few months later, his father called him out of 202 00:12:51,480 --> 00:12:51,760 Speaker 10: the blue. 203 00:12:51,760 --> 00:12:52,160 Speaker 1: One day. 204 00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:56,959 Speaker 12: He called me and he asked me, have you seen Patrick? 205 00:12:59,200 --> 00:13:02,080 Speaker 12: What do you mean? Have I seen Patrick? He's in 206 00:13:02,120 --> 00:13:05,400 Speaker 12: Atlanta and I'm in campus. You're in North Carolina and 207 00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:08,240 Speaker 12: he's eleven years old. I think he was just reaching 208 00:13:08,400 --> 00:13:11,520 Speaker 12: for straws, because now all of a sudden he's word, well, 209 00:13:11,559 --> 00:13:14,480 Speaker 12: you know, Patrick thinks a lot of you, and it 210 00:13:14,600 --> 00:13:17,720 Speaker 12: is a possibility maybe got a ticket, caught the bus 211 00:13:17,880 --> 00:13:19,640 Speaker 12: and went up there to see us. Says no, Dad, 212 00:13:19,679 --> 00:13:22,280 Speaker 12: I don't think that would have happened. That's kind of 213 00:13:22,280 --> 00:13:24,920 Speaker 12: odd for you to say that Patrick, young as he is, 214 00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:27,440 Speaker 12: will to try to find me in North Carolina, had 215 00:13:27,520 --> 00:13:30,000 Speaker 12: never been there before, to the base at all. I 216 00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:34,600 Speaker 12: was trying to locate me. I just felt that that 217 00:13:34,800 --> 00:13:38,520 Speaker 12: was something for eleven year old. The way we were raised, 218 00:13:39,520 --> 00:13:47,760 Speaker 12: that Patrick was just I said, I got a bad 219 00:13:47,800 --> 00:13:53,280 Speaker 12: feeling you're not gonna find Patrick alive. And I made 220 00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:57,560 Speaker 12: him anger when I said that I have that feeling 221 00:13:57,600 --> 00:14:08,240 Speaker 12: that you're not gonna find me. A week later, the 222 00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:13,760 Speaker 12: following Friday, that's when we got a phone call that 223 00:14:13,800 --> 00:14:17,360 Speaker 12: they found him. 224 00:14:17,360 --> 00:14:19,520 Speaker 10: Who called you, my dad? 225 00:14:20,520 --> 00:14:21,240 Speaker 7: What do he said? 226 00:14:21,640 --> 00:14:27,200 Speaker 12: Said that they found him your brother dead. He was 227 00:14:27,560 --> 00:14:31,480 Speaker 12: stabbed several times. They claimed that he got beat with 228 00:14:31,600 --> 00:14:40,760 Speaker 12: a round object and strangled. And I told him, I says, well, 229 00:14:42,840 --> 00:14:44,720 Speaker 12: I'm going to talk to my company commander and see 230 00:14:44,720 --> 00:14:46,240 Speaker 12: if I can come out there to be with you. 231 00:14:46,880 --> 00:14:47,800 Speaker 1: And that's what I did. 232 00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:07,480 Speaker 13: Saint Anthony's church was crowded with Patrick Baldassar's family, his friends, 233 00:15:07,480 --> 00:15:10,240 Speaker 13: and classmates. The shock of his disappearance ten days ago 234 00:15:10,320 --> 00:15:12,320 Speaker 13: had barely sunk in when they learned Friday that his 235 00:15:12,400 --> 00:15:17,359 Speaker 13: body had been found. Patrick's fellow fifth grader sat quietly, attentively, 236 00:15:17,720 --> 00:15:20,440 Speaker 13: wondering why their friend had been taken from them. It 237 00:15:20,520 --> 00:15:23,640 Speaker 13: was to these youngsters that Father Patrick Bishop directed his remarks. 238 00:15:23,720 --> 00:15:25,960 Speaker 13: He spoke of a good fear that teaches children to 239 00:15:26,000 --> 00:15:28,920 Speaker 13: avoid danger, and he spoke of a bad fear, terror 240 00:15:29,160 --> 00:15:30,320 Speaker 13: but can't be understood. 241 00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:31,600 Speaker 1: And he made a plea. 242 00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:35,160 Speaker 14: There are things in this life that are dangerous, things 243 00:15:35,200 --> 00:15:39,240 Speaker 14: that we need to protect ourselves from. You can't let 244 00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:42,880 Speaker 14: it change your way of believing about people. 245 00:15:44,360 --> 00:15:46,960 Speaker 13: After the mass, Father John Adamski read a poem. Written 246 00:15:46,960 --> 00:15:50,400 Speaker 13: by Patrick's classmates. It ended with these words, there was. 247 00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:54,000 Speaker 15: Not a word about how you died. It is no 248 00:15:54,160 --> 00:16:00,440 Speaker 15: wonder that we all cried, Patrick, we miss you and 249 00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:06,000 Speaker 15: wish you knew how much your schoolmates agreed for you. 250 00:16:30,680 --> 00:16:33,400 Speaker 12: My mom's and daddy is from the little town of 251 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:41,320 Speaker 12: Broughbridge and Cecilia, Louisiana, And this one particular gravesite has 252 00:16:42,200 --> 00:16:46,680 Speaker 12: my grandmother and my aunts and brothers, and the majority 253 00:16:46,680 --> 00:16:49,840 Speaker 12: of the family, my mother and the past, all of 254 00:16:49,920 --> 00:16:53,880 Speaker 12: us has always made a point whenever one of us 255 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:56,720 Speaker 12: past made sure we went back to that same graveyard. 256 00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:03,480 Speaker 12: When I drove back to Atlanta to pick up his body, 257 00:17:03,720 --> 00:17:05,880 Speaker 12: I stayed there till the wake was over, what they 258 00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:10,080 Speaker 12: called as a memorial. Basically, once they closed the coffin, 259 00:17:10,200 --> 00:17:14,440 Speaker 12: I talked to arrangement with the funeral director and they 260 00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:18,840 Speaker 12: flew the body here. I drove here and waited till 261 00:17:18,880 --> 00:17:22,040 Speaker 12: this body showed help. I made arrangement one of the 262 00:17:22,080 --> 00:17:25,959 Speaker 12: funeral directors here in a little town of Broughbridge. We 263 00:17:26,080 --> 00:17:30,679 Speaker 12: did the funeral services there and buried him there. I'm 264 00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:33,720 Speaker 12: gonna tell you a little something about that. Okay, during 265 00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:37,760 Speaker 12: that era, now we're still talking about the segregation, integration 266 00:17:37,920 --> 00:17:40,240 Speaker 12: going on, and everybody trying to get us to merge 267 00:17:40,240 --> 00:17:42,960 Speaker 12: together as black and white. Well, there in that town, 268 00:17:43,200 --> 00:17:47,800 Speaker 12: being in the South, there were two churches. These two churches. 269 00:17:48,640 --> 00:17:52,720 Speaker 12: One of the churches it is white. The other church 270 00:17:53,400 --> 00:18:01,320 Speaker 12: it's black, same denomination of church. In between the two churches, 271 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:05,639 Speaker 12: it is a cemetery, white Saberita to the front and 272 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:08,440 Speaker 12: black Sabit to the black. The cemetery has always been 273 00:18:08,480 --> 00:18:11,600 Speaker 12: set up like that. When the hears showed up, it 274 00:18:11,720 --> 00:18:14,720 Speaker 12: showed up in the front door of the white church. 275 00:18:15,320 --> 00:18:20,000 Speaker 12: I'm standing at that particular church to me, church's church, 276 00:18:20,200 --> 00:18:23,920 Speaker 12: and no problem. They met us outside of that church 277 00:18:23,960 --> 00:18:26,520 Speaker 12: and told us that they couldn't do it. They couldn't 278 00:18:26,520 --> 00:18:29,440 Speaker 12: do his services in that church. And I went over 279 00:18:29,520 --> 00:18:32,400 Speaker 12: and talked to the minister about it. You will have 280 00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:36,280 Speaker 12: his funeral in that church. And this guy that was 281 00:18:36,400 --> 00:18:39,280 Speaker 12: driving the hearse got so angry because it was he 282 00:18:39,359 --> 00:18:42,600 Speaker 12: was a white driver. I think the rule was that 283 00:18:42,640 --> 00:18:45,359 Speaker 12: you do not take blacks in that church, and they 284 00:18:45,359 --> 00:18:47,720 Speaker 12: were and he was trying to hold faster. That didn't 285 00:18:47,760 --> 00:18:49,960 Speaker 12: want to bring him over to the white church to 286 00:18:50,040 --> 00:18:53,560 Speaker 12: get buried to do his service, and he was upset 287 00:18:53,600 --> 00:18:55,840 Speaker 12: because I was demanding for it to happen that way, 288 00:18:56,560 --> 00:18:59,720 Speaker 12: and he mashed on the gas, was kicking rocks, spinning 289 00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:04,120 Speaker 12: in a parking lot. If Patrick bought in the back 290 00:19:04,160 --> 00:19:07,639 Speaker 12: of the hurts, I was trying, I wouldn't trying to 291 00:19:07,680 --> 00:19:12,200 Speaker 12: make any problems for anybody. You told me no, why not, Well, 292 00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:14,680 Speaker 12: you couldn't tell me why you're gonna do a service here? 293 00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:17,560 Speaker 12: I might here raising hell for Patrick to get him 294 00:19:18,200 --> 00:19:22,320 Speaker 12: to be buried. They did his service in the church. 295 00:19:22,359 --> 00:19:25,280 Speaker 12: He's one of the first black kids that ever went 296 00:19:25,640 --> 00:19:27,119 Speaker 12: had a funeral in that church. 297 00:19:33,560 --> 00:19:37,120 Speaker 16: It has proved to be the police department's most baffling problem. 298 00:19:37,359 --> 00:19:40,560 Speaker 16: Eight children kidnapped or killed in the last year. There 299 00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:43,840 Speaker 16: have been massive searches. Civic groups have tried to help out. 300 00:19:44,119 --> 00:19:46,399 Speaker 16: Parents of the children have gotten together to see what 301 00:19:46,440 --> 00:19:49,840 Speaker 16: they could do. Former police officers have donated their time 302 00:19:49,920 --> 00:19:52,439 Speaker 16: to the investigation. But still nothing. 303 00:19:54,560 --> 00:19:58,600 Speaker 11: And I remember I still remember parents organizing to stand 304 00:19:58,640 --> 00:20:01,439 Speaker 11: at the bus stop with the kids and wait for 305 00:20:01,480 --> 00:20:03,560 Speaker 11: them to safely be on the bus and that kind 306 00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:07,760 Speaker 11: so the anxiety that that produced. And remember this is 307 00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:10,119 Speaker 11: a time when we were we were free ranged children. 308 00:20:11,520 --> 00:20:13,879 Speaker 11: We were come home when the street lights came on children, 309 00:20:14,080 --> 00:20:15,680 Speaker 11: so that was a very big deal. 310 00:20:19,040 --> 00:20:20,960 Speaker 17: I am so sorry that what happened to my child 311 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:24,480 Speaker 17: and what happened to these other ladies' children happen. But 312 00:20:25,320 --> 00:20:27,639 Speaker 17: what I want you to do is to hang in 313 00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:30,800 Speaker 17: there and try your best to see to it that 314 00:20:30,840 --> 00:20:32,320 Speaker 17: it doesn't happen to yours. 315 00:20:34,040 --> 00:20:37,959 Speaker 11: The mothers of missing and murdered children sat in at 316 00:20:38,040 --> 00:20:41,639 Speaker 11: city Hall to demand that a full investigation be launched. 317 00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:44,760 Speaker 11: So imagine the grief not just of losing your children, 318 00:20:44,760 --> 00:20:47,240 Speaker 11: but then having to demand that there be full attention 319 00:20:47,359 --> 00:20:47,680 Speaker 11: to this. 320 00:20:48,320 --> 00:20:52,080 Speaker 17: We are paying people to maintain the safety of the 321 00:20:52,119 --> 00:20:55,000 Speaker 17: streets of the city of Atlanta. If the safety of 322 00:20:55,040 --> 00:20:58,000 Speaker 17: the city of Atlanta is not maintained, then the people 323 00:20:58,080 --> 00:21:01,119 Speaker 17: that we are hiring to do that job need to 324 00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:03,800 Speaker 17: be looked at carefully. If that job is not done, 325 00:21:03,840 --> 00:21:06,560 Speaker 17: then we need to look towards why we are paying 326 00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:08,400 Speaker 17: people not to do a job. 327 00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:15,600 Speaker 18: Part of this crowd agreed that some of the criticism 328 00:21:15,680 --> 00:21:17,960 Speaker 18: of the police was accurate. Tell them, explained there was 329 00:21:17,960 --> 00:21:20,560 Speaker 18: no attempt to show the city as insensitive. Just to 330 00:21:20,600 --> 00:21:23,160 Speaker 18: show how long it took Atlanta and the city administration 331 00:21:23,280 --> 00:21:25,080 Speaker 18: to become outraged. 332 00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:31,000 Speaker 11: That fracture I don't think was ever fully healed within 333 00:21:31,040 --> 00:21:34,480 Speaker 11: the Atlanta community. There was a sense that maybe, you know, 334 00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:39,119 Speaker 11: some folks felt safe or felt safe enough based on 335 00:21:39,480 --> 00:21:43,760 Speaker 11: a degree of economic privilege, and again that these folks 336 00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:47,240 Speaker 11: who were most marginalized already anyway, just were kind of 337 00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:50,600 Speaker 11: left to fit for themselves. If you look at these 338 00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:54,640 Speaker 11: profiles of the children who were victimized, many of them 339 00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:59,679 Speaker 11: were in foster care situations. Many of them had, you know, 340 00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:03,399 Speaker 11: very difficult and unstable home lives, be it because of 341 00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:06,479 Speaker 11: a parental failing or not because of poverty. You know, 342 00:22:06,560 --> 00:22:09,879 Speaker 11: some of them went missing doing things like you know, 343 00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:13,440 Speaker 11: being ten years old and out bagging groceries to try 344 00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:16,080 Speaker 11: to get a little bit of change to help their families. 345 00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:19,880 Speaker 11: So you really get this really palpable in my mind, 346 00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:24,159 Speaker 11: still a very painful portrait of these kids who are 347 00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:28,640 Speaker 11: incredibly vulnerable, who were then taken up in this way 348 00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:34,120 Speaker 11: and go missing and then found in these gruesome circumstances. 349 00:22:34,160 --> 00:22:45,159 Speaker 11: If at all, as we finally got the kind of 350 00:22:45,240 --> 00:22:49,920 Speaker 11: attention that parents were lobbying for for children, it only 351 00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:54,040 Speaker 11: really escalated the fear. There wasn't a real sense of 352 00:22:54,080 --> 00:22:57,560 Speaker 11: reassurance because nobody was being captured, and the ways that 353 00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:00,760 Speaker 11: policies were instated to deal with them, like the fact 354 00:23:00,760 --> 00:23:04,960 Speaker 11: that one of the first official actions that was taken 355 00:23:05,080 --> 00:23:08,720 Speaker 11: was to institute a curfew, which would in many ways 356 00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:12,080 Speaker 11: and for many people, suggest that the people who are 357 00:23:12,400 --> 00:23:16,879 Speaker 11: in the communities that are most victimized by this have 358 00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:20,800 Speaker 11: somehow engaged in some wrongdoing. Right, so you have to 359 00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:23,080 Speaker 11: get home early or you're going to get picked up 360 00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:24,600 Speaker 11: and taken to a detention center. 361 00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:28,879 Speaker 19: The curfew took effect at eleven o'clock last night and 362 00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:31,200 Speaker 19: will be in effect every night for the next ninety 363 00:23:31,280 --> 00:23:33,280 Speaker 19: days from eleven pm until six am. 364 00:23:33,600 --> 00:23:36,160 Speaker 20: People are afraid to let that children go out to play. 365 00:23:36,280 --> 00:23:38,520 Speaker 20: People are afraid to send their children to the store. 366 00:23:38,800 --> 00:23:40,959 Speaker 20: They're afraid to let the children go down to the 367 00:23:41,040 --> 00:23:45,000 Speaker 20: community playgrounds and play in the afternoons and evenings. 368 00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:46,600 Speaker 1: So I think now. 369 00:23:46,400 --> 00:23:48,760 Speaker 20: We will get the support because there are number of 370 00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:52,280 Speaker 20: parents that need to take more time out with their 371 00:23:52,359 --> 00:23:56,280 Speaker 20: children and keep up with our children. So if parents 372 00:23:56,280 --> 00:23:58,960 Speaker 20: won't do it, we some of us have to try 373 00:23:58,960 --> 00:24:02,240 Speaker 20: to enforce some type of curfew so the children will 374 00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:04,000 Speaker 20: be off the streets by eleven pm. 375 00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:07,000 Speaker 19: Police have been instructed to explain the conditions of the 376 00:24:07,000 --> 00:24:10,560 Speaker 19: curfew before enforcing it. However, when police get the word 377 00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:13,720 Speaker 19: to go ahead, they will first take the child home. 378 00:24:13,960 --> 00:24:16,600 Speaker 19: If the parents are home, then they will be cited. 379 00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:19,160 Speaker 19: If the parents are not home, or if the child 380 00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:21,400 Speaker 19: does not give a home address, then he or she 381 00:24:21,440 --> 00:24:23,520 Speaker 19: will be taken to a juvenile detention center. 382 00:24:24,480 --> 00:24:27,240 Speaker 9: I asked Eric Cameron how he felt about the curfew 383 00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:29,120 Speaker 9: as a kid, Like the. 384 00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:32,720 Speaker 2: Curfew came and right in the mix, so the kids 385 00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:35,360 Speaker 2: gein't killed like it was a curfew, Like we had 386 00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:38,080 Speaker 2: to be in at seven o'clock, six o'clock, I'm crazy 387 00:24:38,119 --> 00:24:41,240 Speaker 2: like that that came along right in the midst of it. 388 00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:43,879 Speaker 2: You know, we understood that it was something going on, 389 00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:47,520 Speaker 2: kids getting missing, and I can distinctly remember walking as 390 00:24:47,560 --> 00:24:50,680 Speaker 2: groups and we will see calls the lights of cause 391 00:24:51,320 --> 00:24:53,199 Speaker 2: and we would literally just take off, you know, just 392 00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:54,680 Speaker 2: like somebody coming to get you. 393 00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:59,040 Speaker 11: We always felt like that there's not a sense of support. 394 00:24:59,160 --> 00:25:04,199 Speaker 11: So people were wounded and then kind of rewounded. And 395 00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:06,240 Speaker 11: then in the midst of all of this, there's a 396 00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:11,080 Speaker 11: sense of from some folks, a sense that part of 397 00:25:11,119 --> 00:25:16,320 Speaker 11: what having racial solidarity means, because race relations were still 398 00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:18,800 Speaker 11: very fraught was that you have to support the African 399 00:25:18,800 --> 00:25:22,240 Speaker 11: American mayor, you have to support the African American chief 400 00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:26,280 Speaker 11: of police, and so you shouldn't be out here protesting 401 00:25:26,320 --> 00:25:29,040 Speaker 11: and saying that you know, the city is not supporting 402 00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:34,159 Speaker 11: you well enough. So it's really really fraught, difficult, contentious moment. 403 00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:42,200 Speaker 11: They're also, I think was a really significant habit during 404 00:25:42,240 --> 00:25:47,480 Speaker 11: that time of holding back information in investigations that looks 405 00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:49,560 Speaker 11: very different than what we have now. Right, So some 406 00:25:49,600 --> 00:25:53,520 Speaker 11: of that is probably you know, true crime investigative stuff, 407 00:25:53,560 --> 00:25:55,159 Speaker 11: like you don't want to tell all the details of 408 00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:56,960 Speaker 11: how this body is found because if you find the 409 00:25:57,040 --> 00:25:59,600 Speaker 11: right person kill and then only the killer knows that, right. 410 00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:03,080 Speaker 11: But so and you know, and we're in this moment 411 00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:06,439 Speaker 11: where everybody wants to know every salacious detail right this moment. 412 00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:10,159 Speaker 11: But there was definitely some significant holding back of information, 413 00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:16,639 Speaker 11: and so that only opened the door wider for people 414 00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:20,199 Speaker 11: to kind of reach into their imaginations and also for 415 00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:22,600 Speaker 11: a rumor mil to flourish. And so there were a 416 00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:25,199 Speaker 11: lot of theories, right that people developed that because they 417 00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:29,040 Speaker 11: were all black, because they were mostly male, this is 418 00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:31,919 Speaker 11: you know, this was a KKK conspiracy, or this was 419 00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:36,040 Speaker 11: a racially motivated. These were racially motivated attacks, and that 420 00:26:36,119 --> 00:26:40,399 Speaker 11: kind of thing, and a sense that as Atlanta was 421 00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:44,480 Speaker 11: trying to affirm its reputation and continue to get business 422 00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:47,399 Speaker 11: and tourism and all those things under the moniker of 423 00:26:47,400 --> 00:26:50,840 Speaker 11: the city too busy to hate, that the people who 424 00:26:50,840 --> 00:26:55,120 Speaker 11: were prospering under that just could not afford for that 425 00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:58,240 Speaker 11: thing to be true, even if it were true. 426 00:26:58,359 --> 00:27:01,080 Speaker 9: In a time were societal in agration between blacks and 427 00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:04,439 Speaker 9: whites was really just beginning. The missing and murdered children 428 00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:07,719 Speaker 9: in Atlanta created a new tension, reopening wounds that had 429 00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:10,960 Speaker 9: never fully healed. In many ways, it was dividing the city. 430 00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:13,600 Speaker 9: From the beginning. There was a struggle to give these 431 00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:18,040 Speaker 9: children equal news coverage and even thorough police investigations. Parents 432 00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:21,040 Speaker 9: of the victims joined together pleading for answers from the city. 433 00:27:21,520 --> 00:27:24,560 Speaker 9: The number of missing children was growing, and eventually the 434 00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:27,800 Speaker 9: story gained national news coverage. In the Atlanta police department 435 00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:30,080 Speaker 9: found themselves in the hunt for a killer. 436 00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:35,479 Speaker 13: Fifty seven percent of the blacks responding to the survey 437 00:27:35,480 --> 00:27:37,280 Speaker 13: said they think the killings are part of a larger 438 00:27:37,320 --> 00:27:40,560 Speaker 13: conspiracy against blacks. The same percentage of whites feel the 439 00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:43,600 Speaker 13: killings are criminal acts with no connection to racial issues. 440 00:27:44,359 --> 00:27:47,200 Speaker 13: The survey polls the question did police treat blacks as 441 00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:50,000 Speaker 13: fairly as they treat whites? The majority of the blacks 442 00:27:50,040 --> 00:27:52,800 Speaker 13: said no. Most of the white respondents said the treatment 443 00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:55,440 Speaker 13: from police's And. 444 00:27:55,400 --> 00:27:57,240 Speaker 8: There are all kind of rumors going on back there. 445 00:27:57,280 --> 00:28:00,359 Speaker 8: I can remember some people in the black communit he 446 00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:03,400 Speaker 8: thought it was a ku Klux klan that was grabbing 447 00:28:03,440 --> 00:28:04,399 Speaker 8: these black boys. 448 00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:07,320 Speaker 6: Other people thought, you know, it's some kind of. 449 00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:11,280 Speaker 8: Weird sexual deviant who's grabbing these boys. And there was 450 00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:16,840 Speaker 8: all this conjecture, but no one ever really knew who 451 00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:21,040 Speaker 8: it was, what was the pattern. I can remember the 452 00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:24,919 Speaker 8: mothers pleading for help. I can remember the white community 453 00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:28,600 Speaker 8: coming together and putting up money to find the person 454 00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:29,639 Speaker 8: who was doing this. 455 00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:32,119 Speaker 6: We were almost paralyzed. 456 00:28:32,200 --> 00:28:34,520 Speaker 8: I hate to put it that way, but the freedom 457 00:28:34,600 --> 00:28:39,320 Speaker 8: of Friday night football wasn't there anymore. Going to basketball 458 00:28:39,400 --> 00:28:44,280 Speaker 8: games for kids wasn't there anymore unless you had an 459 00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:48,600 Speaker 8: adult with you all the time. You know, kids today 460 00:28:48,720 --> 00:28:51,200 Speaker 8: have their freedoms, they go here, they do anything they 461 00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:54,920 Speaker 8: want to do. But during that time period, it was 462 00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:57,760 Speaker 8: a matter of knowing where your child was and keeping 463 00:28:57,800 --> 00:29:01,200 Speaker 8: that child as close to you as possible, particularly if 464 00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:05,320 Speaker 8: it was a black male child. They were young black males, 465 00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:08,360 Speaker 8: and they were poor, young black males. 466 00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:11,160 Speaker 6: It was almost as if it was like. 467 00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:15,840 Speaker 8: A Jack the Ripper character, picking the least served in 468 00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:19,480 Speaker 8: the community and taking advantage of them by taking away 469 00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:20,280 Speaker 8: their children. 470 00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:22,520 Speaker 6: Very vulnerable kids. 471 00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:26,320 Speaker 8: Who would at the drop of the hat because they 472 00:29:26,360 --> 00:29:30,880 Speaker 8: are poor, you offer them something, and they trust. 473 00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:32,920 Speaker 6: That trust was. 474 00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:36,800 Speaker 8: Betrayed by someone who really wanted to kill them. Many 475 00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:41,600 Speaker 8: felt that the police department wasn't doing all it could 476 00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:46,080 Speaker 8: do to find who was committing these crimes, who was 477 00:29:46,080 --> 00:29:48,479 Speaker 8: picking up these children and killing them and then dumping 478 00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:51,560 Speaker 8: them like trash. You know, at first it was one child, 479 00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:54,560 Speaker 8: then it was two, and then you kind of went, okay, 480 00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:57,440 Speaker 8: we actually have a serial killer out there now. 481 00:29:57,880 --> 00:30:00,000 Speaker 6: And that's when the community really did. 482 00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:03,400 Speaker 8: They did come together in jail as a force to 483 00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:06,760 Speaker 8: try to protect the children, to push the police department 484 00:30:06,960 --> 00:30:10,960 Speaker 8: to do even more in trying to find who did this. 485 00:30:13,440 --> 00:30:16,560 Speaker 21: What frustrates police here most is they are convinced someone 486 00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:18,960 Speaker 21: out in the community has enough information to help them 487 00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:22,280 Speaker 21: crack these cases. The problem is so far, at least 488 00:30:22,480 --> 00:30:24,280 Speaker 21: whoever does know isn't talking. 489 00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:27,320 Speaker 22: It's I believe that there's some kids out here that 490 00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:30,280 Speaker 22: have the answers. There's a few kids who may know 491 00:30:30,360 --> 00:30:32,560 Speaker 22: a little bit, but they don't know who to tell, 492 00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:35,920 Speaker 22: or possibly no one will listen to them. What they 493 00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:38,760 Speaker 22: think it's just a child's nonsense. There may be a 494 00:30:38,840 --> 00:30:41,840 Speaker 22: kid out here that has a complete description of everything. 495 00:30:41,520 --> 00:30:42,120 Speaker 1: We want to know. 496 00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:50,160 Speaker 19: More than four hundred police officers and firefighters, beginning Monday, 497 00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:52,880 Speaker 19: will knock on doors from nine in the morning until 498 00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:55,440 Speaker 19: nine at night. They will canvas seven days a week 499 00:30:55,680 --> 00:30:57,800 Speaker 19: until they hit every door in the city. 500 00:30:58,040 --> 00:30:59,960 Speaker 12: You don't have to have all the information. 501 00:31:00,760 --> 00:31:04,200 Speaker 22: Give us what information you think you have or that 502 00:31:04,240 --> 00:31:07,400 Speaker 22: you may have. You don't have to tell nobody your name. 503 00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:10,520 Speaker 22: Just tell your teacher, she'll get the information to us. 504 00:31:10,840 --> 00:31:15,080 Speaker 22: Tell your parents, or if you can find no one 505 00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:17,680 Speaker 22: else to talk to, you call the police department. 506 00:31:19,360 --> 00:31:22,240 Speaker 9: The police department thought the key might be a child 507 00:31:22,280 --> 00:31:25,120 Speaker 9: coming forward as a witness to an abduction or at 508 00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:29,880 Speaker 9: least an attempted one. This is Mickey Lloyd, former APD. 509 00:31:30,360 --> 00:31:34,000 Speaker 23: I was in the homicide unit during that time period 510 00:31:34,680 --> 00:31:37,080 Speaker 23: with the Atlanta Police Department. I got the call on 511 00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:40,600 Speaker 23: the first two bodies. They were on Niskey Lake Road 512 00:31:41,840 --> 00:31:45,720 Speaker 23: in Atlanta, southwest Atlanta at that time. It was a 513 00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:50,280 Speaker 23: dirt road with woods on both sides, and the two 514 00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:55,920 Speaker 23: victims were Edward Smith and Alfred Evans. They were both 515 00:31:56,520 --> 00:32:01,400 Speaker 23: young black kids. Children, but we got to call first on. 516 00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:06,200 Speaker 23: It was Alfred Evans and he was off on a 517 00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:10,400 Speaker 23: hill in the woods, about twenty feet off the road, 518 00:32:11,440 --> 00:32:13,440 Speaker 23: and he had been he'd been dead a while. He 519 00:32:13,520 --> 00:32:14,240 Speaker 23: was mummified. 520 00:32:14,960 --> 00:32:16,680 Speaker 1: If you know what mummified is. 521 00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:20,680 Speaker 23: A term where the skin is dried and it's not decaying, 522 00:32:20,720 --> 00:32:23,080 Speaker 23: but it just mummified. That's from being in the sun 523 00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:25,880 Speaker 23: and the shade. And uh, while we were working that 524 00:32:26,040 --> 00:32:30,920 Speaker 23: crime scene, I kept smelling something like something dead, and 525 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:34,840 Speaker 23: I got upwind of him and I still smelled it. 526 00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:38,200 Speaker 23: So I sent a patrol alture up through the woods, 527 00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:42,520 Speaker 23: uh Misky Lake, and he found the body of Edward 528 00:32:42,520 --> 00:32:45,560 Speaker 23: Smith and it was down in a dish and it 529 00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:47,840 Speaker 23: was a matter of fact, he was so decomposed he 530 00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:52,920 Speaker 23: was almost liquified. And then as it went on, we 531 00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:57,560 Speaker 23: started getting more young blackmails murdered in different areas of 532 00:32:57,600 --> 00:33:00,760 Speaker 23: the city. And we would meet once a month and 533 00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:04,840 Speaker 23: talk about crime. You know, anything that may be in 534 00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:08,160 Speaker 23: common and I think we had one of those meetings 535 00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:12,160 Speaker 23: and I think we had about six kids dead by then, 536 00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:16,480 Speaker 23: and I got up and made a statement that we 537 00:33:16,560 --> 00:33:21,000 Speaker 23: got a problem somebody killing young blackmails in Atlanta. Next 538 00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:23,240 Speaker 23: thing I know, I'm standing tall in the Chief's office 539 00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:27,120 Speaker 23: wanting to know what I'm basing that on because of 540 00:33:27,320 --> 00:33:30,200 Speaker 23: some media picked up on it, so I guess I'm 541 00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:31,000 Speaker 23: want to spill the. 542 00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:31,680 Speaker 1: Beans on that. 543 00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:35,680 Speaker 23: And uh, I really didn't have anything to be based 544 00:33:35,800 --> 00:33:39,960 Speaker 23: on other than just common sense and working working cases. 545 00:33:40,560 --> 00:33:42,719 Speaker 23: They didn't want to hear it, you know, the community, 546 00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:44,760 Speaker 23: we didn't want to hear it. The police command didn't 547 00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:46,800 Speaker 23: want to hear nobody. Nobody wanted to hear I didn't 548 00:33:46,800 --> 00:33:48,640 Speaker 23: want to say it, and I don't know what made 549 00:33:48,680 --> 00:33:50,840 Speaker 23: me say it, but I just thought we need to 550 00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:53,480 Speaker 23: do something is try to connect these cases, because to me, 551 00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:54,560 Speaker 23: they seem related. 552 00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:14,560 Speaker 9: The first two victims were Edward Smith and Alfred Evans. 553 00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:20,800 Speaker 9: Boths went missing in July nineteen seventy nine. In September 554 00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:25,160 Speaker 9: that year, fourteen year old Milton Harvey went missing, followed 555 00:34:25,160 --> 00:34:29,360 Speaker 9: by nine year old Yusef Bell in October. By the 556 00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:33,120 Speaker 9: end of nineteen eighty, seventeen children had gone missing in Atlanta, 557 00:34:34,160 --> 00:34:40,040 Speaker 9: and by May nineteen eighty one, the number was thirty. 558 00:34:40,760 --> 00:34:50,000 Speaker 9: Edward Hope Smith, Alfred Evans, Milton Harvey, Yusef Bell, Jeffrey Mathis, 559 00:34:51,120 --> 00:35:02,400 Speaker 9: Angel Lanier, Eric Middlebrooks, Christopher Richardson, Latanya Wilson, Aaron Anthony Carter, 560 00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:12,960 Speaker 9: Earl Terrell, Clifford Jones, Darren Glass, Charles Stevens, Aaron Jackson, 561 00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:22,880 Speaker 9: Patrick Rogers, Louby Jeter, Terry Pew, Patrick Baltazar, Curtis Walker, 562 00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:33,720 Speaker 9: Joseph Bell, Timothy Hill, Eddie Duncan, Larry Rodgers, Michael McIntosh, 563 00:35:34,120 --> 00:35:40,319 Speaker 9: Jimmy Ray Payne, John Porter, William Barrett, and Nathaniel Cater. 564 00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:45,840 Speaker 9: Just to be clear, these are not the only African 565 00:35:45,880 --> 00:35:48,440 Speaker 9: American kids that went missing or were murder between the 566 00:35:48,440 --> 00:35:50,279 Speaker 9: summers of seventy nine and eighty one. 567 00:35:51,239 --> 00:35:53,360 Speaker 10: These are only the names that made the list. 568 00:36:11,440 --> 00:36:14,759 Speaker 23: It got so big that I think it got kind 569 00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:18,680 Speaker 23: of convoluted. There was just too many, too many hands 570 00:36:18,680 --> 00:36:22,160 Speaker 23: in the pie. Then the FBI got involved in it. 571 00:36:22,520 --> 00:36:25,560 Speaker 23: They were leading, but we were doing what we were told. 572 00:36:37,520 --> 00:36:40,440 Speaker 24: Your call has been forwarded to an automated voice messaging 573 00:36:40,480 --> 00:36:45,760 Speaker 24: system is not available at the tone. Please record your message. 574 00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:48,360 Speaker 24: When you finished recording, you may hang up or press 575 00:36:48,440 --> 00:36:49,640 Speaker 24: one for more options. 576 00:36:52,680 --> 00:36:55,480 Speaker 25: He my name is Payne Lindsay. I'm currently doing a 577 00:36:55,520 --> 00:36:58,680 Speaker 25: documentary project about the Atlanta child murders that happened in 578 00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:01,920 Speaker 25: the early eighties. I'm looking for the Mike mccombis that 579 00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:04,520 Speaker 25: was working for the FBI at the time on the case. 580 00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:07,080 Speaker 25: If you could give me a callback, I'd love to 581 00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:09,400 Speaker 25: ask you a few questions about it, if you didn't mind. 582 00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:12,719 Speaker 25: My number is three one zero seven nine. 583 00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:26,920 Speaker 7: Telling you this two year story would be a little 584 00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:31,439 Speaker 7: not It wouldn't be in a chronological order, I don't think. 585 00:37:31,560 --> 00:37:33,040 Speaker 7: Because there was so much went. 586 00:37:32,880 --> 00:37:35,640 Speaker 9: On, I got different bullet points I want to hit 587 00:37:35,800 --> 00:37:37,000 Speaker 9: with you, Okay. 588 00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:44,760 Speaker 10: I guess for starters. How big was this case compared 589 00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:45,720 Speaker 10: to others in the FBI. 590 00:37:46,960 --> 00:37:50,040 Speaker 7: We had at least one volume for every victim, and 591 00:37:50,080 --> 00:37:53,399 Speaker 7: that's a lot of volumes. Yea big. There's so many 592 00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:56,040 Speaker 7: files involved. This is seeing the bureau. They have what 593 00:37:56,080 --> 00:37:58,680 Speaker 7: they call major cases, and this was this was major 594 00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:01,960 Speaker 7: case Major case number seven. It was code named AT 595 00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:05,200 Speaker 7: KID A T K I d AT is abbreviation of 596 00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:09,520 Speaker 7: Girlfriend Atlanta and Kid was the kids were missing at kid. Now, 597 00:38:09,560 --> 00:38:12,200 Speaker 7: every case doesn't get a name, No, just the major case. 598 00:38:12,520 --> 00:38:15,560 Speaker 7: You've got one hundred different investigators. You've got GBI, you've 599 00:38:15,560 --> 00:38:20,080 Speaker 7: got the FBI, You've got Atlanta City, you've got the county, 600 00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:22,359 Speaker 7: you've got the Cab County to Cab City. And then 601 00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:24,640 Speaker 7: you know, there was no moss grown under our feet. 602 00:38:24,840 --> 00:38:26,680 Speaker 7: I can tell you that we were. We were humping, 603 00:38:26,680 --> 00:38:29,279 Speaker 7: and we were staying really busy, and it was taking 604 00:38:29,320 --> 00:38:31,359 Speaker 7: its toll on a lot of people too. You just, 605 00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:33,440 Speaker 7: you know, you just can only pick up so many 606 00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:36,279 Speaker 7: dead children off the street before it starts affecting you 607 00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:39,200 Speaker 7: a little bit. You know, these kids came from different 608 00:38:39,200 --> 00:38:42,600 Speaker 7: walks of life, you know, socioeconomically. I think they were 609 00:38:42,640 --> 00:38:46,800 Speaker 7: on the lower scale. It doesn't make them bad kids, 610 00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:48,839 Speaker 7: you know they were. They were good kids. They were 611 00:38:48,840 --> 00:38:54,200 Speaker 7: just street kids. There were night kids less than sufficiently supervised, 612 00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:58,200 Speaker 7: would be my opinion. FBI got involved in this investigation. 613 00:38:58,440 --> 00:39:01,640 Speaker 7: What they did was is they I signed two agents 614 00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:05,160 Speaker 7: to every child that was that was on the list. 615 00:39:06,120 --> 00:39:08,640 Speaker 9: What would you say is your first lead that ever 616 00:39:08,920 --> 00:39:10,040 Speaker 9: amounted to anything. 617 00:39:10,800 --> 00:39:13,640 Speaker 7: There was one kid that came in to the office 618 00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:17,239 Speaker 7: one day and he goes, hey, I was approached by 619 00:39:18,160 --> 00:39:21,000 Speaker 7: a black guy. I got in a car with him 620 00:39:21,440 --> 00:39:24,480 Speaker 7: and something went sideways with it. I'm not really sure 621 00:39:24,480 --> 00:39:27,319 Speaker 7: what happened. There was some type of scuffle. He said 622 00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:30,600 Speaker 7: that the driver tried to push him down in the 623 00:39:30,680 --> 00:39:36,719 Speaker 7: floorboard and he had a partial tag and he gave 624 00:39:36,800 --> 00:39:38,400 Speaker 7: us a composite sketch. 625 00:39:39,719 --> 00:39:42,480 Speaker 1: And at another bonder was discovered from day but twenty 626 00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:44,880 Speaker 1: third at Police Task Force headquarters. 627 00:39:44,920 --> 00:39:48,080 Speaker 22: There are twenty seven faces on the wall, twenty six murdered, 628 00:39:48,239 --> 00:39:48,880 Speaker 22: one missing. 629 00:39:49,040 --> 00:39:51,800 Speaker 1: We do not know the person or persons that are responsible. Therefore, 630 00:39:51,800 --> 00:39:53,040 Speaker 1: we do not have the money. 631 00:39:53,000 --> 00:39:56,239 Speaker 10: From tenderfoot TV in house to forks in Atlanta. 632 00:39:56,360 --> 00:39:59,800 Speaker 20: Like eleven other recent victrums in Atlanta, rogers are currently wasn't. 633 00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:03,560 Speaker 25: Fixing Atlanta was unlikely to catch the killer unless he 634 00:40:03,800 --> 00:40:04,800 Speaker 25: keeps on killing. 635 00:40:05,520 --> 00:40:18,720 Speaker 10: This is Atlanta Monster next time on Atlanta Monster. 636 00:40:20,760 --> 00:40:23,400 Speaker 26: Sketching back then wasn't what it is today. I mean, 637 00:40:23,480 --> 00:40:26,480 Speaker 26: some of these sketches they come out with better than photographs. 638 00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:29,520 Speaker 26: Back then, you know, you worked with what he had 639 00:40:29,560 --> 00:40:31,000 Speaker 26: and it was a pretty good sketch. 640 00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:34,000 Speaker 9: What it looked like to you, remember, well, it. 641 00:40:33,960 --> 00:40:37,000 Speaker 26: Was a blackmail with pushy hair. I remember the composite 642 00:40:37,040 --> 00:40:37,959 Speaker 26: sketch very well. 643 00:40:39,640 --> 00:40:42,120 Speaker 27: He knows in the daytime what he's dealing, but at 644 00:40:42,239 --> 00:40:46,200 Speaker 27: night he's not really sure, so he kind of stays 645 00:40:46,200 --> 00:40:48,920 Speaker 27: to himself in his apartment. He has a television set. 646 00:40:49,120 --> 00:40:53,959 Speaker 27: There's no guns up there, no nothing. He's shrewd, he's methodical. 647 00:40:54,239 --> 00:40:55,800 Speaker 27: You're not dealing with a guy with one hundred and 648 00:40:55,840 --> 00:40:59,960 Speaker 27: sixty four IQ. He's clean, he's neat, he's above suspicion. 649 00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:02,840 Speaker 27: I cannot stop him. I don't have the authority or 650 00:41:02,840 --> 00:41:03,320 Speaker 27: the power. 651 00:41:14,360 --> 00:41:17,799 Speaker 9: Atlanta Monster is an investigative podcast told week by week, 652 00:41:18,200 --> 00:41:21,440 Speaker 9: with new episodes every Friday, A joint production between How 653 00:41:21,520 --> 00:41:26,160 Speaker 9: Stuff Works and Tenderfoot TV. Original music is by Makeup 654 00:41:26,160 --> 00:41:30,719 Speaker 9: and Vanity Set. Audio archives courtesy of WSB News Film 655 00:41:30,719 --> 00:41:35,480 Speaker 9: and Videotape Collection, Brown Media Archives, University of Georgia Libraries. 656 00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:40,040 Speaker 9: For the latest updates, please visit Atlantamonster dot com or 657 00:41:40,080 --> 00:41:55,840 Speaker 9: follow us on social media. 658 00:42:04,320 --> 00:42:05,640 Speaker 10: Described Atlanta to me. 659 00:42:05,719 --> 00:42:07,680 Speaker 4: In growing up here, man, you know what, a Atlanta 660 00:42:07,800 --> 00:42:09,839 Speaker 4: is a very special special place, and you don't even 661 00:42:09,880 --> 00:42:12,200 Speaker 4: realize how special it is until you get outside of here. 662 00:42:12,600 --> 00:42:14,799 Speaker 4: It's really a place of peace and love to be 663 00:42:14,800 --> 00:42:16,239 Speaker 4: one hundred, which you mean. You know, Martin Luther King 664 00:42:16,239 --> 00:42:18,040 Speaker 4: from here. So it's it's like a gotta it got 665 00:42:18,080 --> 00:42:19,879 Speaker 4: a spiritual thing with it, you know what I'm saying. 666 00:42:19,880 --> 00:42:22,160 Speaker 4: It's a blessed place. I believe no matter how street 667 00:42:22,200 --> 00:42:23,640 Speaker 4: you are, you got a spiritual side here